From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Fri Aug 1 15:08:30 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2008 14:38:30 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] CJ's visit to Karachi - Day 2 30.07.08 In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0807310202u2670907ej24dc435532b509bd@mail.gmail.com> References: <5af37bb0807310157p54ea5e74y5837a6ec7bc65523@mail.gmail.com> <5af37bb0807310202u2670907ej24dc435532b509bd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Yasir, perhaps the words of Winston Churchill were apt when he said that these men of straw do not value their freedom.? Just as in Pakistan, judiciary is also failing the system with handpicked men and women filling the chair, to be politically correct, judicially incorrect in most of the judgements like in recently decided case of child abuse in Bombay High court where prosecution was not vehement enough in view of the high profile lawyers for defence of the pheadophiles, judges seem to be easily swayed to overlook the evidence for reasons best known to them, and any comment would easily be hit back with contempt cases. A society where moral and ethical standards are touching new low, none can expect judges to be of higher calibre than the individuals in the society in discharge of the duties in the system. Favouritism in postings of positions in posts like Director of CBi for extraneous reasons, CBI being autonomous premier investigation agency, judges elevated to higher court for favourable judgements in political and sensitive cases without impartial approach has become a point to air concern that afterall, sub continent has only "men of straw" who can sell their mothers for a right amount of material wealth.! Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: yasir ~يا سر Date: Thursday, July 31, 2008 2:33 pm Subject: [Reader-list] CJ's visit to Karachi - Day 2 30.07.08 To: sarai list > decimation of judiciary ... > > Deposed judges won't let nation down: Iftikhar > http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=16329 > > Independence of judiciary key to economic progress: Iftikhar > http://www.dawn.com/2008/07/31/top7.htm > > Naek plan fizzles out as SHC judges stay united > http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=16337 > > Aitzaz links survival of parliament to independent judiciary > http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=16338 > > mention of People's Resistance in Jang 30.07.08 (attached image) > > y > From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Fri Aug 1 15:20:44 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 02:50:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Of art, morality, etc. In-Reply-To: <33bc2ee60807302307y1080cac4kdea43cd55dd22ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <446266.6655.qm@web54202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> > The last part of your mail in response to mine is > where the crux of the matter lies though. I may be old fashioned, but I > don't think the existence of self-contradictory truths are possible. ~its not about self contradictory truths. its about truths sprining from different worldviews. in this case, one view is that what the tata's are doing in singur is WRONG. therefore any association with them (as an artist) is morally indefensible. another view, as pranesh has, is that wherever the money comes from, as long as it is being used for good,it is ok. yet another view is that the farmers' grouse is with the government, and not with the tata's, etc etc. as worldviews change, one's perceptions of truth (in most but the real basic basics) change. > And what is art without humanity? What validity does my art have, no > matter what its apparent merit, if I am a mediocrite of the mind, > if I turn a blind eye to the sources of my funding - where the funds are > coming from and at what cost (ask the family of tapasi malik the answer > to that), functioning in my own little bubble? ~ while (again) i agree with your position personally, what extent can one take this 'evil by association' thought? do i stop buying tata salt? refuse to sit in a taxi that is an indica? refuse to answer calls from tata phones? all of these are the sources of the funding! i did not mean to accuse you of imposition, just meant to point out that imposition was a bad thing. :) ~regards, baruk http://bottlebroke.blogspot.com From taraprakash at gmail.com Fri Aug 1 18:44:43 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 09:14:43 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects Message-ID: <038a01c8f3d8$92cc30c0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects Praveen Swami Gujarat has been targeted by jihadists half-a-dozen times since 2002 in a little-understood war. One still afternoon in March 2002, Feroze Abdul Latif Ghaswala watched 40 victims of the anti-Muslim pogrom being buried near his aunt’s home in Ahmedabad.Back home in Mumbai, the automobile mechanic saw a printout of a Lashkar-e-Taiba pamphlet, which purported to show a riot victim begging for his life:“Do you think he should have a gun,” it asked. In September 2003, Ghaswala volunteered for training in Pakistan with a group led by the 2006 Mumbai serial bombing architect, Rahil Abdul Rehman Sheikh.When the Delhi police caught up with him in the summer of 2006, Ghaswala, along with computer engineer Ali Mohammad Cheepa, had just received a consignmentof military-grade explosives from the Lashkar for a major bombing in Ahmedabad Ever since last week’s bombings in Ahmedabad — one among half-a-dozen major plots targeting Gujarat that the Indian police and intelligence services didnot succeed in interdicting — the media have not tired of informing us that jihadist terrorism has taken a dramatic new turn. Instead of Pakistan-basedterrorists, it is claimed, a new generation of Indian jihadists is spearheading the attacks. On point of fact, the claim is nonsensical: not one single Islamist urban terror cell since 1993 has not involved a preponderance of Indian nationals. Butthe claim does show how little Islamist terror groups, and the politics that have driven their growth, are understood in India. Politics isn’t welcome at the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad’s Kaulpur area. Its students learn the six principles of Islam as enunciated by the founderof the Tablighi Jamaat, Mohammad Illyas, and are exhorted to give up frivolities like television and cinema. Maulana Sufiyan Patangia, who ran the seminary,often travelled to Saudi Arabia, seeking support for his students. After the January 26, 2001 Gujarat earthquake, the cleric put these networks to useto raise funds for relief work. It was his first foray into the secular world. The al-Qaeda’s bombing of New York and Washington D.C. gave Patangia a new cause. In the wake of the United States-led war on the Taliban, he declared thatIslam was in danger. He set up a study group, Idara-e-Fadlullah-ul-Muslimeen (Institution of Charity for Muslims), to educate his earthquake volunteers.The IFM members monitored events in Afghanistan on the Internet, and listened to tapes of Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Mohammad Masood Azhar’s speeches. Patangia used to be jokingly called ‘Mullah Omar,’ after the Taliban leader. His second-in-command Suhail Khan adopted an Osama bin-Laden-style headgear,acquiring the nickname ‘Chhota Osama,’ or Little Osama. In February 2002, when the communal pogrom in Gujarat began, Patangia was in Saudi Arabia on hisannual pilgrimage. He turned to the South Asian Islamist there for help to defend his community — and to exact revenge. Abdul Bari, a one-time Hyderabadresident who is among the Lashkar’s top financiers, put up Rs.3,75,000. Two Saudi-based JeM fundraisers of Hyderabad origin, Farhatullah Ghauri and AbdulRehman, threw in another Rs.5,00,000. Most important, though, Patangia made contact with Rasool Khan ‘Party’ — nicknamed with the Ahmedabad argot for ‘contractor’ because of his work for topGujarat mafioso Abdul Latif Sheikh and his Pakistan-based boss, Dawood Ibrahim Kaksar. In May 2002, Khan and his brother Idris met Patangia in Mumbai todiscuss just how vengeance might be planned. Late in May 2002, five bombs went off on buses in Ahmedabad, injuring 26 people. It was the first act of violence by Gujarat-based jihadists. In December,Khan arranged for eight of Patangia’s volunteers to travel to Pakistan for training. Along with other groups of young people from Hyderabad, Mumbai andBangalore, the Ahmedabad jihadists flew to Pakistan through Dhaka, Kathmandu, Dubai and Bangkok. Soon, the vengeance they sought was delivered. Gujarat’s Home Minister, Haren Pandya, who had led some of the most murderous mobs in Ahmedabad during thepogrom, was shot just 13 months later, by when he ceased to be Home Minister. Central Bureau of Investigation detectives later determined that he was killedby a hit-team directed by Patangia. Nine of the 12 assassins received life terms last year. Despite the CBI’s successes, plans for large-scale reprisal attacks in Gujarat continued apace. The LeT and the Maharashtra-based Students Islamic Movementof India operatives took the lead — helped by a steady flow of funds. In June 2004, the LeT despatched two Pakistani nationals from Jammu and Kashmir to execute a fidayeen attack in Gujarat. Jishan Johar of Gujranwala in Pakistanand Amjad Ali Rana, who hailed form Sargodha, were killed in a controversial encounter in Ahmedabad along with SIMI activist Javed Sheikh and his friend,Ishrat Jehan Raza. The Maharashtra-based SIMI bomb-maker Zulfikar Fayyaz Kagzi built a sophisticated suitcase bomb that was planted on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad Express train inFebruary 2006. An error in the timer circuit resulted in the bomb exploding 12 hours after the scheduled detonation time, by when the cleaning staff haddeposited the suitcase in an empty corner of the Ahmedabad station. And in May 2006, the Intelligence Bureau prevented a potentially catastrophic bombingin Gujarat, penetrating an Aurangabad-based SIMI unit, which was in an advanced stage of preparation for serial bomb strikes. Intellectual infrastructure Has the vengeance the jihadists sought been delivered? Not quite. Minutes before the latest bombing, the Indian Mujahideen — a Lashkar-SIMI front organisationwhich also took responsibility for the earlier bombings in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh — sent out a manifesto explaining just what it now seeks. According to the manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen is “raising the illustrious banner of Jihad against the Hindus and all those who fight and resist us,and here we begin our revenge with the help and Permission of Allah — a terrifying revenge of our blood, our lives and our honour that will Insha-Allahterminate your survival on this land.” The manifesto calls on Hindus to “realise that the falsehood of your 33 crore dirty mud idols and the blasphemy of your deaf, dumb mute and naked idolsof ram, krishna and hanuman [sic; capitalisation as in original throughout] are not at all going to save your necks from being slaughtered by our hands.”It demands that Hindus change their attitudes, lest “another Ghauri shakes your foundations, and lest another Ghaznavi massacres you, proving your bloodto be the cheapest of all mankind.” No great effort is needed to locate the intellectual genesis of this body of ideas: it draws heavily on long-standing LeT polemic. Indeed, the manifesto’splea that the LeT not take responsibility for the attacks is something of a giveaway, since the terror group has never owned up to actions targeting civilians.In 2003, for example, the LeT argued on its website that violence against Muslims in India was an outcome of the core character of Hindus, who “have nocompassion in their religion.” It was the duty of Muslims to wage a jihad against “Hindu oppressors,” and it was “the Hindu who is a terrorist.” Lashkar chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed also said, “the Hindu is a mean enemy and the proper way to deal with him is the one adopted by our forefathers [who]crushed them by force.” He made clear — just as the Indian Mujahideen has — that the objective of the jihad was extending Muslim control over what it sawas Muslim land. At a November 1999 rally, he promised that he would “not rest until the whole of India is dissolved into Pakistan.” All those who participatedin this project were promised “huge places in Paradise.” SIMI, like the Indian Mujahideen, also invoked medieval conquerors in its literature. In the wake of the demolition of the Babri Masjid, SIMI called forMuslims to avenge the act by following in the steps of the 11th century conqueror, Mahmud Ghaznavi. SIMI posters appealed to god to send another Ghaznavi,and thus avenge attacks on Muslims and their mosques by attacking temples. Local influences Local religious influences are also evident. In its manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen describes itself as “terrorist,” an apparently odd usage. However,it suggests that the author followed the neoconservative television evangelist Zakir Naik — just as several past Mumbai-based Lashkar operatives like RahilSheikh and Feroze Deshmukh did. In a controversial speech on al-Qaeda chief Osama bin-Laden, Naik proclaimed, “If he is fighting the enemies of Islam, I am for him. If he is terrorisingAmerica the terrorist — the biggest terrorist — I am with him.” “Every Muslim should be a terrorist,” Naik concluded. “The thing is, if he is terrorisinga terrorist, he is following Islam.” Most Indian Muslims would dispute the proposition: it is not for nothing, after all, that the Indian Mujahideen manifesto devotes considerable space torailing against clerics who oppose its jihadism. But the fact remains that some numbers of young Muslims — angered by discrimination, enraged by pogroms— see jihadism as the sole option available to them. As the work of scholar Ashutosh Varshney points out, the roots of this tragedy lie in the breakdownof inter-communal institutions: in a creeping religious apartheid that enveloped Gujarat in the second half of the last century, decades before the pogrom. In the weeks to come, the police and intelligence investigators will have to find out the perpetrators of the bombings. Politicians, however, have a farmore important task: to ensure that justice and equity are placed at centre stage of civic life in Gujarat, and India as a whole. No other way exists tobring down the intellectual infrastructure of hate, on which the jihadist campaign rests. From parthaekka at gmail.com Fri Aug 1 18:54:58 2008 From: parthaekka at gmail.com (Partha Dasgupta) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 18:54:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects In-Reply-To: <038a01c8f3d8$92cc30c0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> References: <038a01c8f3d8$92cc30c0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> Message-ID: <32144e990808010624x3c8b5895te0fcd0e6ad6e8079@mail.gmail.com> Hi, Don't know were you sourced this from, but this large continuous block of text with punctuation missing is unreadable. Rgds, Partha ............................... On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 6:44 PM, TaraPrakash wrote: > Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects > Praveen Swami Gujarat has been targeted by jihadists half-a-dozen times > since 2002 in a little-understood war. One still afternoon in March 2002, > Feroze Abdul Latif Ghaswala watched 40 victims of the anti-Muslim pogrom > being buried near his aunt's home in Ahmedabad.Back home in Mumbai, the > automobile mechanic saw a printout of a Lashkar-e-Taiba pamphlet, which > purported to show a riot victim begging for his life:"Do you think he should > have a gun," it asked. In September 2003, Ghaswala volunteered for training > in Pakistan with a group led by the 2006 Mumbai serial bombing architect, > Rahil Abdul Rehman Sheikh.When the Delhi police caught up with him in the > summer of 2006, Ghaswala, along with computer engineer Ali Mohammad Cheepa, > had just received a consignmentof military-grade explosives from the Lashkar > for a major bombing in Ahmedabad Ever since last week's bombings in > Ahmedabad — one among half-a-dozen major plots targeting Gujarat that the > Indian police and intelligence services didnot succeed in interdicting — the > media have not tired of informing us that jihadist terrorism has taken a > dramatic new turn. Instead of Pakistan-basedterrorists, it is claimed, a new > generation of Indian jihadists is spearheading the attacks. On point of > fact, the claim is nonsensical: not one single Islamist urban terror cell > since 1993 has not involved a preponderance of Indian nationals. Butthe > claim does show how little Islamist terror groups, and the politics that > have driven their growth, are understood in India. Politics isn't welcome at > the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad's Kaulpur area. Its students learn the > six principles of Islam as enunciated by the founderof the Tablighi Jamaat, > Mohammad Illyas, and are exhorted to give up frivolities like television and > cinema. Maulana Sufiyan Patangia, who ran the seminary,often travelled to > Saudi Arabia, seeking support for his students. After the January 26, 2001 > Gujarat earthquake, the cleric put these networks to useto raise funds for > relief work. It was his first foray into the secular world. The al-Qaeda's > bombing of New York and Washington D.C. gave Patangia a new cause. In the > wake of the United States-led war on the Taliban, he declared thatIslam was > in danger. He set up a study group, Idara-e-Fadlullah-ul-Muslimeen > (Institution of Charity for Muslims), to educate his earthquake > volunteers.The IFM members monitored events in Afghanistan on the Internet, > and listened to tapes of Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Mohammad Masood Azhar's > speeches. Patangia used to be jokingly called 'Mullah Omar,' after the > Taliban leader. His second-in-command Suhail Khan adopted an Osama > bin-Laden-style headgear,acquiring the nickname 'Chhota Osama,' or Little > Osama. In February 2002, when the communal pogrom in Gujarat began, Patangia > was in Saudi Arabia on hisannual pilgrimage. He turned to the South Asian > Islamist there for help to defend his community — and to exact revenge. > Abdul Bari, a one-time Hyderabadresident who is among the Lashkar's top > financiers, put up Rs.3,75,000. Two Saudi-based JeM fundraisers of Hyderabad > origin, Farhatullah Ghauri and AbdulRehman, threw in another Rs.5,00,000. > Most important, though, Patangia made contact with Rasool Khan 'Party' — > nicknamed with the Ahmedabad argot for 'contractor' because of his work for > topGujarat mafioso Abdul Latif Sheikh and his Pakistan-based boss, Dawood > Ibrahim Kaksar. In May 2002, Khan and his brother Idris met Patangia in > Mumbai todiscuss just how vengeance might be planned. Late in May 2002, > five bombs went off on buses in Ahmedabad, injuring 26 people. It was the > first act of violence by Gujarat-based jihadists. In December,Khan arranged > for eight of Patangia's volunteers to travel to Pakistan for training. Along > with other groups of young people from Hyderabad, Mumbai andBangalore, the > Ahmedabad jihadists flew to Pakistan through Dhaka, Kathmandu, Dubai and > Bangkok. Soon, the vengeance they sought was delivered. Gujarat's Home > Minister, Haren Pandya, who had led some of the most murderous mobs in > Ahmedabad during thepogrom, was shot just 13 months later, by when he ceased > to be Home Minister. Central Bureau of Investigation detectives later > determined that he was killedby a hit-team directed by Patangia. Nine of the > 12 assassins received life terms last year. Despite the CBI's successes, > plans for large-scale reprisal attacks in Gujarat continued apace. The LeT > and the Maharashtra-based Students Islamic Movementof India operatives took > the lead — helped by a steady flow of funds. In June 2004, the LeT > despatched two Pakistani nationals from Jammu and Kashmir to execute a > fidayeen attack in Gujarat. Jishan Johar of Gujranwala in Pakistanand Amjad > Ali Rana, who hailed form Sargodha, were killed in a controversial encounter > in Ahmedabad along with SIMI activist Javed Sheikh and his friend,Ishrat > Jehan Raza. The Maharashtra-based SIMI bomb-maker Zulfikar Fayyaz Kagzi > built a sophisticated suitcase bomb that was planted on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad > Express train inFebruary 2006. An error in the timer circuit resulted in the > bomb exploding 12 hours after the scheduled detonation time, by when the > cleaning staff haddeposited the suitcase in an empty corner of the Ahmedabad > station. And in May 2006, the Intelligence Bureau prevented a potentially > catastrophic bombingin Gujarat, penetrating an Aurangabad-based SIMI unit, > which was in an advanced stage of preparation for serial bomb strikes. > Intellectual infrastructure Has the vengeance the jihadists sought been > delivered? Not quite. Minutes before the latest bombing, the Indian > Mujahideen — a Lashkar-SIMI front organisationwhich also took responsibility > for the earlier bombings in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh — sent out a > manifesto explaining just what it now seeks. According to the manifesto, the > Indian Mujahideen is "raising the illustrious banner of Jihad against the > Hindus and all those who fight and resist us,and here we begin our revenge > with the help and Permission of Allah — a terrifying revenge of our blood, > our lives and our honour that will Insha-Allahterminate your survival on > this land." The manifesto calls on Hindus to "realise that the falsehood of > your 33 crore dirty mud idols and the blasphemy of your deaf, dumb mute and > naked idolsof ram, krishna and hanuman [sic; capitalisation as in original > throughout] are not at all going to save your necks from being slaughtered > by our hands."It demands that Hindus change their attitudes, lest "another > Ghauri shakes your foundations, and lest another Ghaznavi massacres you, > proving your bloodto be the cheapest of all mankind." No great effort is > needed to locate the intellectual genesis of this body of ideas: it draws > heavily on long-standing LeT polemic. Indeed, the manifesto'splea that the > LeT not take responsibility for the attacks is something of a giveaway, > since the terror group has never owned up to actions targeting civilians.In > 2003, for example, the LeT argued on its website that violence against > Muslims in India was an outcome of the core character of Hindus, who "have > nocompassion in their religion." It was the duty of Muslims to wage a jihad > against "Hindu oppressors," and it was "the Hindu who is a terrorist." > Lashkar chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed also said, "the Hindu is a mean enemy and > the proper way to deal with him is the one adopted by our forefathers > [who]crushed them by force." He made clear — just as the Indian Mujahideen > has — that the objective of the jihad was extending Muslim control over what > it sawas Muslim land. At a November 1999 rally, he promised that he would > "not rest until the whole of India is dissolved into Pakistan." All those > who participatedin this project were promised "huge places in Paradise." > SIMI, like the Indian Mujahideen, also invoked medieval conquerors in its > literature. In the wake of the demolition of the Babri Masjid, SIMI called > forMuslims to avenge the act by following in the steps of the 11th century > conqueror, Mahmud Ghaznavi. SIMI posters appealed to god to send another > Ghaznavi,and thus avenge attacks on Muslims and their mosques by attacking > temples. Local influences Local religious influences are also evident. In > its manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen describes itself as "terrorist," an > apparently odd usage. However,it suggests that the author followed the > neoconservative television evangelist Zakir Naik — just as several past > Mumbai-based Lashkar operatives like RahilSheikh and Feroze Deshmukh did. > In a controversial speech on al-Qaeda chief Osama bin-Laden, Naik > proclaimed, "If he is fighting the enemies of Islam, I am for him. If he is > terrorisingAmerica the terrorist — the biggest terrorist — I am with him." > "Every Muslim should be a terrorist," Naik concluded. "The thing is, if he > is terrorisinga terrorist, he is following Islam." Most Indian Muslims would > dispute the proposition: it is not for nothing, after all, that the Indian > Mujahideen manifesto devotes considerable space torailing against clerics > who oppose its jihadism. But the fact remains that some numbers of young > Muslims — angered by discrimination, enraged by pogroms— see jihadism as the > sole option available to them. As the work of scholar Ashutosh Varshney > points out, the roots of this tragedy lie in the breakdownof inter-communal > institutions: in a creeping religious apartheid that enveloped Gujarat in > the second half of the last century, decades before the pogrom. In the weeks > to come, the police and intelligence investigators will have to find out the > perpetrators of the bombings. Politicians, however, have a farmore important > task: to ensure that justice and equity are placed at centre stage of civic > life in Gujarat, and India as a whole. No other way exists tobring down the > intellectual infrastructure of hate, on which the jihadist campaign rests. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Partha Dasgupta +919811047132 From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 1 19:00:05 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 19:00:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects In-Reply-To: <32144e990808010624x3c8b5895te0fcd0e6ad6e8079@mail.gmail.com> References: <038a01c8f3d8$92cc30c0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> <32144e990808010624x3c8b5895te0fcd0e6ad6e8079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808010630m5e726924n18a8e573ce14cdb1@mail.gmail.com> Yaha sab shanti hai, yeh public hai sab jaanti hai hah! http://ia.rediff.com/news/2008/aug/01ahd3.htm On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Partha Dasgupta wrote: > > Hi, > > Don't know were you sourced this from, but this large continuous block of > text with punctuation missing is unreadable. > > Rgds, Partha > ............................... > > On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 6:44 PM, TaraPrakash wrote: > > > Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects > > Praveen Swami Gujarat has been targeted by jihadists half-a-dozen times > > since 2002 in a little-understood war. One still afternoon in March 2002, > > Feroze Abdul Latif Ghaswala watched 40 victims of the anti-Muslim pogrom > > being buried near his aunt's home in Ahmedabad.Back home in Mumbai, the > > automobile mechanic saw a printout of a Lashkar-e-Taiba pamphlet, which > > purported to show a riot victim begging for his life:"Do you think he should > > have a gun," it asked. In September 2003, Ghaswala volunteered for training > > in Pakistan with a group led by the 2006 Mumbai serial bombing architect, > > Rahil Abdul Rehman Sheikh.When the Delhi police caught up with him in the > > summer of 2006, Ghaswala, along with computer engineer Ali Mohammad Cheepa, > > had just received a consignmentof military-grade explosives from the Lashkar > > for a major bombing in Ahmedabad Ever since last week's bombings in > > Ahmedabad — one among half-a-dozen major plots targeting Gujarat that the > > Indian police and intelligence services didnot succeed in interdicting — the > > media have not tired of informing us that jihadist terrorism has taken a > > dramatic new turn. Instead of Pakistan-basedterrorists, it is claimed, a new > > generation of Indian jihadists is spearheading the attacks. On point of > > fact, the claim is nonsensical: not one single Islamist urban terror cell > > since 1993 has not involved a preponderance of Indian nationals. Butthe > > claim does show how little Islamist terror groups, and the politics that > > have driven their growth, are understood in India. Politics isn't welcome at > > the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad's Kaulpur area. Its students learn the > > six principles of Islam as enunciated by the founderof the Tablighi Jamaat, > > Mohammad Illyas, and are exhorted to give up frivolities like television and > > cinema. Maulana Sufiyan Patangia, who ran the seminary,often travelled to > > Saudi Arabia, seeking support for his students. After the January 26, 2001 > > Gujarat earthquake, the cleric put these networks to useto raise funds for > > relief work. It was his first foray into the secular world. The al-Qaeda's > > bombing of New York and Washington D.C. gave Patangia a new cause. In the > > wake of the United States-led war on the Taliban, he declared thatIslam was > > in danger. He set up a study group, Idara-e-Fadlullah-ul-Muslimeen > > (Institution of Charity for Muslims), to educate his earthquake > > volunteers.The IFM members monitored events in Afghanistan on the Internet, > > and listened to tapes of Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Mohammad Masood Azhar's > > speeches. Patangia used to be jokingly called 'Mullah Omar,' after the > > Taliban leader. His second-in-command Suhail Khan adopted an Osama > > bin-Laden-style headgear,acquiring the nickname 'Chhota Osama,' or Little > > Osama. In February 2002, when the communal pogrom in Gujarat began, Patangia > > was in Saudi Arabia on hisannual pilgrimage. He turned to the South Asian > > Islamist there for help to defend his community — and to exact revenge. > > Abdul Bari, a one-time Hyderabadresident who is among the Lashkar's top > > financiers, put up Rs.3,75,000. Two Saudi-based JeM fundraisers of Hyderabad > > origin, Farhatullah Ghauri and AbdulRehman, threw in another Rs.5,00,000. > > Most important, though, Patangia made contact with Rasool Khan 'Party' — > > nicknamed with the Ahmedabad argot for 'contractor' because of his work for > > topGujarat mafioso Abdul Latif Sheikh and his Pakistan-based boss, Dawood > > Ibrahim Kaksar. In May 2002, Khan and his brother Idris met Patangia in > > Mumbai todiscuss just how vengeance might be planned. Late in May 2002, > > five bombs went off on buses in Ahmedabad, injuring 26 people. It was the > > first act of violence by Gujarat-based jihadists. In December,Khan arranged > > for eight of Patangia's volunteers to travel to Pakistan for training. Along > > with other groups of young people from Hyderabad, Mumbai andBangalore, the > > Ahmedabad jihadists flew to Pakistan through Dhaka, Kathmandu, Dubai and > > Bangkok. Soon, the vengeance they sought was delivered. Gujarat's Home > > Minister, Haren Pandya, who had led some of the most murderous mobs in > > Ahmedabad during thepogrom, was shot just 13 months later, by when he ceased > > to be Home Minister. Central Bureau of Investigation detectives later > > determined that he was killedby a hit-team directed by Patangia. Nine of the > > 12 assassins received life terms last year. Despite the CBI's successes, > > plans for large-scale reprisal attacks in Gujarat continued apace. The LeT > > and the Maharashtra-based Students Islamic Movementof India operatives took > > the lead — helped by a steady flow of funds. In June 2004, the LeT > > despatched two Pakistani nationals from Jammu and Kashmir to execute a > > fidayeen attack in Gujarat. Jishan Johar of Gujranwala in Pakistanand Amjad > > Ali Rana, who hailed form Sargodha, were killed in a controversial encounter > > in Ahmedabad along with SIMI activist Javed Sheikh and his friend,Ishrat > > Jehan Raza. The Maharashtra-based SIMI bomb-maker Zulfikar Fayyaz Kagzi > > built a sophisticated suitcase bomb that was planted on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad > > Express train inFebruary 2006. An error in the timer circuit resulted in the > > bomb exploding 12 hours after the scheduled detonation time, by when the > > cleaning staff haddeposited the suitcase in an empty corner of the Ahmedabad > > station. And in May 2006, the Intelligence Bureau prevented a potentially > > catastrophic bombingin Gujarat, penetrating an Aurangabad-based SIMI unit, > > which was in an advanced stage of preparation for serial bomb strikes. > > Intellectual infrastructure Has the vengeance the jihadists sought been > > delivered? Not quite. Minutes before the latest bombing, the Indian > > Mujahideen — a Lashkar-SIMI front organisationwhich also took responsibility > > for the earlier bombings in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh — sent out a > > manifesto explaining just what it now seeks. According to the manifesto, the > > Indian Mujahideen is "raising the illustrious banner of Jihad against the > > Hindus and all those who fight and resist us,and here we begin our revenge > > with the help and Permission of Allah — a terrifying revenge of our blood, > > our lives and our honour that will Insha-Allahterminate your survival on > > this land." The manifesto calls on Hindus to "realise that the falsehood of > > your 33 crore dirty mud idols and the blasphemy of your deaf, dumb mute and > > naked idolsof ram, krishna and hanuman [sic; capitalisation as in original > > throughout] are not at all going to save your necks from being slaughtered > > by our hands."It demands that Hindus change their attitudes, lest "another > > Ghauri shakes your foundations, and lest another Ghaznavi massacres you, > > proving your bloodto be the cheapest of all mankind." No great effort is > > needed to locate the intellectual genesis of this body of ideas: it draws > > heavily on long-standing LeT polemic. Indeed, the manifesto'splea that the > > LeT not take responsibility for the attacks is something of a giveaway, > > since the terror group has never owned up to actions targeting civilians.In > > 2003, for example, the LeT argued on its website that violence against > > Muslims in India was an outcome of the core character of Hindus, who "have > > nocompassion in their religion." It was the duty of Muslims to wage a jihad > > against "Hindu oppressors," and it was "the Hindu who is a terrorist." > > Lashkar chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed also said, "the Hindu is a mean enemy and > > the proper way to deal with him is the one adopted by our forefathers > > [who]crushed them by force." He made clear — just as the Indian Mujahideen > > has — that the objective of the jihad was extending Muslim control over what > > it sawas Muslim land. At a November 1999 rally, he promised that he would > > "not rest until the whole of India is dissolved into Pakistan." All those > > who participatedin this project were promised "huge places in Paradise." > > SIMI, like the Indian Mujahideen, also invoked medieval conquerors in its > > literature. In the wake of the demolition of the Babri Masjid, SIMI called > > forMuslims to avenge the act by following in the steps of the 11th century > > conqueror, Mahmud Ghaznavi. SIMI posters appealed to god to send another > > Ghaznavi,and thus avenge attacks on Muslims and their mosques by attacking > > temples. Local influences Local religious influences are also evident. In > > its manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen describes itself as "terrorist," an > > apparently odd usage. However,it suggests that the author followed the > > neoconservative television evangelist Zakir Naik — just as several past > > Mumbai-based Lashkar operatives like RahilSheikh and Feroze Deshmukh did. > > In a controversial speech on al-Qaeda chief Osama bin-Laden, Naik > > proclaimed, "If he is fighting the enemies of Islam, I am for him. If he is > > terrorisingAmerica the terrorist — the biggest terrorist — I am with him." > > "Every Muslim should be a terrorist," Naik concluded. "The thing is, if he > > is terrorisinga terrorist, he is following Islam." Most Indian Muslims would > > dispute the proposition: it is not for nothing, after all, that the Indian > > Mujahideen manifesto devotes considerable space torailing against clerics > > who oppose its jihadism. But the fact remains that some numbers of young > > Muslims — angered by discrimination, enraged by pogroms— see jihadism as the > > sole option available to them. As the work of scholar Ashutosh Varshney > > points out, the roots of this tragedy lie in the breakdownof inter-communal > > institutions: in a creeping religious apartheid that enveloped Gujarat in > > the second half of the last century, decades before the pogrom. In the weeks > > to come, the police and intelligence investigators will have to find out the > > perpetrators of the bombings. Politicians, however, have a farmore important > > task: to ensure that justice and equity are placed at centre stage of civic > > life in Gujarat, and India as a whole. No other way exists tobring down the > > intellectual infrastructure of hate, on which the jihadist campaign rests. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > -- > Partha Dasgupta > +919811047132 > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- /National Highway/ http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 1 19:12:58 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 19:12:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808010630m5e726924n18a8e573ce14cdb1@mail.gmail.com> References: <038a01c8f3d8$92cc30c0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> <32144e990808010624x3c8b5895te0fcd0e6ad6e8079@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808010630m5e726924n18a8e573ce14cdb1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808010642n1b688908u8925e47bb5399733@mail.gmail.com> ignoring facts to satisfy personal addictions. On 8/1/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > Yaha sab shanti hai, yeh public hai sab jaanti hai > hah! > http://ia.rediff.com/news/2008/aug/01ahd3.htm > > > > On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Partha Dasgupta > wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > Don't know were you sourced this from, but this large continuous block of > > text with punctuation missing is unreadable. > > > > Rgds, Partha > > ............................... > > > > On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 6:44 PM, TaraPrakash > wrote: > > > > > Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects > > > Praveen Swami Gujarat has been targeted by jihadists half-a-dozen > times > > > since 2002 in a little-understood war. One still afternoon in March > 2002, > > > Feroze Abdul Latif Ghaswala watched 40 victims of the anti-Muslim > pogrom > > > being buried near his aunt's home in Ahmedabad.Back home in Mumbai, the > > > automobile mechanic saw a printout of a Lashkar-e-Taiba pamphlet, which > > > purported to show a riot victim begging for his life:"Do you think he > should > > > have a gun," it asked. In September 2003, Ghaswala volunteered for > training > > > in Pakistan with a group led by the 2006 Mumbai serial bombing > architect, > > > Rahil Abdul Rehman Sheikh.When the Delhi police caught up with him in > the > > > summer of 2006, Ghaswala, along with computer engineer Ali Mohammad > Cheepa, > > > had just received a consignmentof military-grade explosives from the > Lashkar > > > for a major bombing in Ahmedabad Ever since last week's bombings in > > > Ahmedabad — one among half-a-dozen major plots targeting Gujarat that > the > > > Indian police and intelligence services didnot succeed in interdicting > — the > > > media have not tired of informing us that jihadist terrorism has taken > a > > > dramatic new turn. Instead of Pakistan-basedterrorists, it is claimed, > a new > > > generation of Indian jihadists is spearheading the attacks. On point > of > > > fact, the claim is nonsensical: not one single Islamist urban terror > cell > > > since 1993 has not involved a preponderance of Indian nationals. Butthe > > > claim does show how little Islamist terror groups, and the politics > that > > > have driven their growth, are understood in India. Politics isn't > welcome at > > > the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad's Kaulpur area. Its students learn > the > > > six principles of Islam as enunciated by the founderof the Tablighi > Jamaat, > > > Mohammad Illyas, and are exhorted to give up frivolities like > television and > > > cinema. Maulana Sufiyan Patangia, who ran the seminary,often travelled > to > > > Saudi Arabia, seeking support for his students. After the January 26, > 2001 > > > Gujarat earthquake, the cleric put these networks to useto raise funds > for > > > relief work. It was his first foray into the secular world. The > al-Qaeda's > > > bombing of New York and Washington D.C. gave Patangia a new cause. In > the > > > wake of the United States-led war on the Taliban, he declared thatIslam > was > > > in danger. He set up a study group, Idara-e-Fadlullah-ul-Muslimeen > > > (Institution of Charity for Muslims), to educate his earthquake > > > volunteers.The IFM members monitored events in Afghanistan on the > Internet, > > > and listened to tapes of Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Mohammad Masood Azhar's > > > speeches. Patangia used to be jokingly called 'Mullah Omar,' after the > > > Taliban leader. His second-in-command Suhail Khan adopted an Osama > > > bin-Laden-style headgear,acquiring the nickname 'Chhota Osama,' or > Little > > > Osama. In February 2002, when the communal pogrom in Gujarat began, > Patangia > > > was in Saudi Arabia on hisannual pilgrimage. He turned to the South > Asian > > > Islamist there for help to defend his community — and to exact revenge. > > > Abdul Bari, a one-time Hyderabadresident who is among the Lashkar's top > > > financiers, put up Rs.3,75,000. Two Saudi-based JeM fundraisers of > Hyderabad > > > origin, Farhatullah Ghauri and AbdulRehman, threw in another > Rs.5,00,000. > > > Most important, though, Patangia made contact with Rasool Khan 'Party' > — > > > nicknamed with the Ahmedabad argot for 'contractor' because of his work > for > > > topGujarat mafioso Abdul Latif Sheikh and his Pakistan-based boss, > Dawood > > > Ibrahim Kaksar. In May 2002, Khan and his brother Idris met Patangia in > > > Mumbai todiscuss just how vengeance might be planned. Late in May > 2002, > > > five bombs went off on buses in Ahmedabad, injuring 26 people. It was > the > > > first act of violence by Gujarat-based jihadists. In December,Khan > arranged > > > for eight of Patangia's volunteers to travel to Pakistan for training. > Along > > > with other groups of young people from Hyderabad, Mumbai andBangalore, > the > > > Ahmedabad jihadists flew to Pakistan through Dhaka, Kathmandu, Dubai > and > > > Bangkok. Soon, the vengeance they sought was delivered. Gujarat's Home > > > Minister, Haren Pandya, who had led some of the most murderous mobs in > > > Ahmedabad during thepogrom, was shot just 13 months later, by when he > ceased > > > to be Home Minister. Central Bureau of Investigation detectives later > > > determined that he was killedby a hit-team directed by Patangia. Nine > of the > > > 12 assassins received life terms last year. Despite the CBI's > successes, > > > plans for large-scale reprisal attacks in Gujarat continued apace. The > LeT > > > and the Maharashtra-based Students Islamic Movementof India operatives > took > > > the lead — helped by a steady flow of funds. In June 2004, the LeT > > > despatched two Pakistani nationals from Jammu and Kashmir to execute a > > > fidayeen attack in Gujarat. Jishan Johar of Gujranwala in Pakistanand > Amjad > > > Ali Rana, who hailed form Sargodha, were killed in a controversial > encounter > > > in Ahmedabad along with SIMI activist Javed Sheikh and his > friend,Ishrat > > > Jehan Raza. The Maharashtra-based SIMI bomb-maker Zulfikar Fayyaz > Kagzi > > > built a sophisticated suitcase bomb that was planted on the > Mumbai-Ahmedabad > > > Express train inFebruary 2006. An error in the timer circuit resulted > in the > > > bomb exploding 12 hours after the scheduled detonation time, by when > the > > > cleaning staff haddeposited the suitcase in an empty corner of the > Ahmedabad > > > station. And in May 2006, the Intelligence Bureau prevented a > potentially > > > catastrophic bombingin Gujarat, penetrating an Aurangabad-based SIMI > unit, > > > which was in an advanced stage of preparation for serial bomb strikes. > > > Intellectual infrastructure Has the vengeance the jihadists sought > been > > > delivered? Not quite. Minutes before the latest bombing, the Indian > > > Mujahideen — a Lashkar-SIMI front organisationwhich also took > responsibility > > > for the earlier bombings in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh — sent out a > > > manifesto explaining just what it now seeks. According to the > manifesto, the > > > Indian Mujahideen is "raising the illustrious banner of Jihad against > the > > > Hindus and all those who fight and resist us,and here we begin our > revenge > > > with the help and Permission of Allah — a terrifying revenge of our > blood, > > > our lives and our honour that will Insha-Allahterminate your survival > on > > > this land." The manifesto calls on Hindus to "realise that the > falsehood of > > > your 33 crore dirty mud idols and the blasphemy of your deaf, dumb mute > and > > > naked idolsof ram, krishna and hanuman [sic; capitalisation as in > original > > > throughout] are not at all going to save your necks from being > slaughtered > > > by our hands."It demands that Hindus change their attitudes, lest > "another > > > Ghauri shakes your foundations, and lest another Ghaznavi massacres > you, > > > proving your bloodto be the cheapest of all mankind." No great effort > is > > > needed to locate the intellectual genesis of this body of ideas: it > draws > > > heavily on long-standing LeT polemic. Indeed, the manifesto'splea that > the > > > LeT not take responsibility for the attacks is something of a giveaway, > > > since the terror group has never owned up to actions targeting > civilians.In > > > 2003, for example, the LeT argued on its website that violence against > > > Muslims in India was an outcome of the core character of Hindus, who > "have > > > nocompassion in their religion." It was the duty of Muslims to wage a > jihad > > > against "Hindu oppressors," and it was "the Hindu who is a terrorist." > > > Lashkar chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed also said, "the Hindu is a mean > enemy and > > > the proper way to deal with him is the one adopted by our forefathers > > > [who]crushed them by force." He made clear — just as the Indian > Mujahideen > > > has — that the objective of the jihad was extending Muslim control over > what > > > it sawas Muslim land. At a November 1999 rally, he promised that he > would > > > "not rest until the whole of India is dissolved into Pakistan." All > those > > > who participatedin this project were promised "huge places in > Paradise." > > > SIMI, like the Indian Mujahideen, also invoked medieval conquerors in > its > > > literature. In the wake of the demolition of the Babri Masjid, SIMI > called > > > forMuslims to avenge the act by following in the steps of the 11th > century > > > conqueror, Mahmud Ghaznavi. SIMI posters appealed to god to send > another > > > Ghaznavi,and thus avenge attacks on Muslims and their mosques by > attacking > > > temples. Local influences Local religious influences are also evident. > In > > > its manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen describes itself as "terrorist," > an > > > apparently odd usage. However,it suggests that the author followed the > > > neoconservative television evangelist Zakir Naik — just as several past > > > Mumbai-based Lashkar operatives like RahilSheikh and Feroze Deshmukh > did. > > > In a controversial speech on al-Qaeda chief Osama bin-Laden, Naik > > > proclaimed, "If he is fighting the enemies of Islam, I am for him. If > he is > > > terrorisingAmerica the terrorist — the biggest terrorist — I am with > him." > > > "Every Muslim should be a terrorist," Naik concluded. "The thing is, if > he > > > is terrorisinga terrorist, he is following Islam." Most Indian Muslims > would > > > dispute the proposition: it is not for nothing, after all, that the > Indian > > > Mujahideen manifesto devotes considerable space torailing against > clerics > > > who oppose its jihadism. But the fact remains that some numbers of > young > > > Muslims — angered by discrimination, enraged by pogroms— see jihadism > as the > > > sole option available to them. As the work of scholar Ashutosh Varshney > > > points out, the roots of this tragedy lie in the breakdownof > inter-communal > > > institutions: in a creeping religious apartheid that enveloped Gujarat > in > > > the second half of the last century, decades before the pogrom. In the > weeks > > > to come, the police and intelligence investigators will have to find > out the > > > perpetrators of the bombings. Politicians, however, have a farmore > important > > > task: to ensure that justice and equity are placed at centre stage of > civic > > > life in Gujarat, and India as a whole. No other way exists tobring down > the > > > intellectual infrastructure of hate, on which the jihadist campaign > rests. > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Partha Dasgupta > > +919811047132 > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > -- > /National Highway/ http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 1 19:27:24 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 19:27:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'The Rest of Now' at Manifesta 7 Message-ID: <87AC0B36-E535-40DA-8B6D-4EAC698E8BFD@sarai.net> Dear All, (Apologies for cross posting to readers at Nettime, Spectre, Fibreculture, Crumb, Kafila and the Sarai Reader List) This is to share with you news of 'The Rest of Now' an exhibition curated by us, the Raqs Media Collective (Jeebesh Bagchi, Monica Narula and Shuddhabrata Sengupta), at the ex-Alumix factory in Bolzano / Bozen, for the seventh edition of Manifesta: The European Biennale of Contemporary Art, which opened in the Trentino-South Tyrol region of Italy on the 19th of July. The exhibition will stay open till the 2nd of November, 2008. Manifesta is an itinerant biennial that changes location every two years. The artistic strategies of Manifesta 7 take the landscape, history, industrial heritage and socio-cultural environment of the Trentino-South Tyrol region as their points of departure. The five different venues: - the fortress in Fortezza / Franzensfeste, the Manifattura Tabacchi in Rovereto; the Ex-Peterlini factory and the railway station in Rovereto, the Ex-Alumix factory in Bolzano / Bozen and the former Central Post Office in Trento - will all be open to the public for the first time in their new incarnations as spaces for the exhibition of contemporary art. The artistic content of each Manifesta is conceived and developed by a new team of international curators. This edition of Manifesta is curated by Adam Budak (Graz / Krakow), Anselm Franke (Berlin / Antwerp) / Hila Peleg (Berlin / Tel Aviv) and Raqs Media Collective (New Delhi). Adam Budak curates an exhibition titled 'Principle: Hope' in Rovereto, Anselm Franke & Hila Peleg curate an exhbition titled 'The Soul' in Trento and the Raqs Media Collective curate 'The Rest of Now' in Bolzano / Bozen. The three curatorial teams collaborate to curate 'Scenarios' at Fortezza / Franzensfeste. The curators of Manifesta 7 have invited more than 180 participants from many different parts of the world, with a strong focus on today's diverse Europe, to present their work in Trentino-South Tyrol. The curators have invited the artists to respond to the key curatorial concepts of Manifesta 7, which are inspired by the region's intricate web of history, modernity and contemporaneity. To find out more about Manifesta 7, see - http://www.manifesta7.it/ To find out more about the different exhibitions, locations and artists lists, see - http://www.manifesta7.it/locations/show/ To find out more about the curators, see - http://www.manifesta7.it/ pages/657763594 We enclose below, our curatorial essay for The Rest of Now. We look forward to responses, to the essay, and for those of you who have been, or are planning to travel to Manifesta 7, to the exhibition itself. This essay has been published in 'The Index' to Manifesta 7, by Silvana Editoriale, Milan, 2008 regards Shuddhabrata, Monica and Jeebesh (Raqs Media Collective) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -------------------------------------------------------- The Rest of Now Raqs Media Collective 1. A hundred years ago, Filippo Tommaso Marinetti, artist, poet and high priest of a muscular industrial aesthetic, was seriously injured in an automobile accident on the outskirts of Milan. During his convalescence, he wrote a passionate paean to speed, the very force that had so recently threatened his life. His words, clad in the brash cadence of the first Futurist Manifesto, ring out as a fanfare to the velocity of the twentieth century. "We declare that the splendor of the world has been enriched by a new beauty: the beauty of speed... We are on the extreme promontory of the centuries! What is the use of looking behind at the moment when we must open the mysterious shutters of the impossible? Time and Space died yesterday. We are already living in the absolute, since we have already created eternal, omnipresent speed..." A hundred years later, standing inside the disused Alumix factory in Bolzano/Bozen, which for five decades had been dedicated to the production of Marinetti's beloved aluminium, hindsight suggests that we consider a different rhythm. Not the speeding regularity of architettura razionale, but the soft, syncopation of desuetude. Let us rest for now, between an odd and an even beat, and consider what remains from a century devoted to the breathless pursuit of tomorrow’s promised riches. An empty factory, which once produced aluminium – the substance of bombs, aeroplanes and coffee percolators, the metal of speed, death and light – is the stage and provocation for us to invoke that which is left behind when value is extracted from life, time and labour. Aluminium, which as tinfoil and scaffolding is used for the cladding of everything from sandwiches to building sites, is also what is thrown away the moment the sandwich is eaten and the building finished. Mountains are flattened to mine bauxite, the main aluminium ore. Mountains of aluminium waste may eventually take their place. The Alumix factory, like its counterparts all over the world, is a monument to its own residue. Turbines, transformers, motors, smelters, furnaces, production targets and megawatts of electrical power have long since vacated this building. Marinetti’s “great agitation of work” has departed to other continents, making room for dust, fungi, and the anticipation of resurrection. Manifesta 7 enters the building in this moment of pause, stealing in between the downtime of industrial abandonment in the core of Europe and the overture of global capital’s next move. The “rest of now” is the residue that lies at the heart of contemporaneity. It is what persists from moments of transformation, and what falls through the cracks of time. It is history’s obstinate remainder, haunting each addition and subtraction with arithmetic persistence, endlessly carrying over what cannot be accounted for. The rest of now is the excess, which pushes us towards respite, memory and slowing things down. Remembering what has departed, recognizing what is left behind and preparing for what is yet to arrive means making sense of the relationship between living and having lived. It means reading the things that almost happened, or didn’t quite happen, or that were simply desired, against the grain of that which is occurring or has taken place. Residue is a space of open, uncharted, alterity. The residual and the imminent share a paradoxical working solidarity. In “Lance,” a short story about time and space travel, Vladimir Nabokov wrote, “the future is but the obsolete in reverse,” suggesting that even the impulse to hurtle into futurity is always, already, shadowed by its own imminent obsolescence. The Alumix factory, like so much of the twentieth century’s heroic and tragic dalliance with the future is now a repository of the residual. What better place can there be for the rest of now? 2. An exhibition is a design in space. “The Rest of Now” is also a figure in time. In Bolzano/Bozen, the ex-Alumix factory sits nestled between the elevations of the Dolomite mountains, whose every fold is a reminder of the fact that industrial time is only a faint ripple on the surface of geological time. To draw a figure in time is to inscribe a mark on a difficult and slippery surface. As time passes, the reasons to remember grow stronger, but the ability to recall is weakened. Memory straddles this paradox. We could say that the ethics of memory have something to do with the urgent negotiation between having to remember (which sometimes includes the obligation to mourn), and the requirement to move on (which sometimes includes the necessity to forget). Both are necessary, and each is notionally contingent on the abdication of the other, but life is not led to the easy rhythm of regularly alternating episodes of memory and forgetting that cancel each other out in a neat equation that resolves to zero. Residue is the fulcrum on which the delicate negotiation between memory and forgetting is undertaken, because it is the unresolved, lingering aftertaste of an event that triggers the task of retrieving and dealing with the difficult of its recollection. The question of what is to be done with residue – should it be burned, buried, frozen, embalmed, mourned, celebrated, commemorated, carried over, forgotten or remembered – haunts us all the time. It haunts us in our personal lives as much as it haunts the larger histories we participate in and draw from. To draw a figure in time is necessarily to encounter and reflect on the difficulty of the residual. There are no easy answers to the questions posed by residue. Images are not always the most reliable allies against forgetfulness; words play tricks with memory. Oblivion is easily accomplished, especially with the aid of what is usually called restoration, which makes it possible to ignore or cosmetically invert the action of time on a physical surface. Monuments, contrary to the stated intentions of their construction, abet forgetfulness. Sometimes the work of art can be a matter of ensuring that the time it takes to think and recall difficult questions be given its due; that instead of purchasing the processed and instant sense of time mined from a monument we explore the option of accessing the potential of even a modest memento to destabilize the certitude of the present. How can images and objects be brought together in a manner that helps etch a lingering doubt onto the heart of amnesia? How can concepts and experiences that sustain an attitude of vigilance against the impulse of erasure be expressed as tools to think and feel with, to work with in the present? How can we remember and reconsider the world without getting lost in reverie? How can a meditation on history avoid the stupor of nostalgia? What work must memory be put to, in order to ensure that we erect, not memorials that close the roads to further inquiry, but signposts that ask for more journeys to be undertaken? “The Rest of Now” is an occasion for the asking of these questions. It offers both the building blocks of an argument and a disposition to be alert to the material, cognitive and emotional consequences of temporal processes. Underlying the argument and the disposition is a hunch that the after-image of residue may be a critique and an antidote to the narrative conceit of progress. We can move on only if we understand that the debts we owe to the past are a long way from being settled, and that we are required to carry them with us into the future. We can move on only if we understand that the future is constituted by the debts we incur in the present. Residue is an unlikely, but effective, engine. The artists we have invited to “The Rest of Now” have responded in a variety of ways to our proposition. Coded within their responses are entire archives of forgotten, retrieved and imagined worlds, exemplars of practices of persistence and refusal, instances of play, investigation, questioning and speculation. Looking out with them, out of the factory, towards the mountains, this exhibition layers, leaches, and addles time. It arrests and thickens time, sows time’s seeds in a garden, bores time’s holes in masonry, scrapes time’s dust off a wall, build’s time’s bridge to nowhere, measures time in terms of detritus, tells stories about the stubborn persistence of things, people and ways of life that refuse to admit that either their time is over or that it hasn't yet come. This exhibition takes time, and lays it across a long table, makes it climb a high tower, skip a heartbeat in a tap dance, rise like mist and fall like sunlight, run like an engine and dance like a worker, sleep like a hill and wake like a factory, shine, escape and elude capture like the enigmatic memory of a dead grandmother. 3. [The extraction of value from any material, place, thing or person, involves a process of refinement. During this process, the object in question will undergo a change in state, separating into at least two substances: an extract and a residue. With respect to residue: it may be said it is that which never finds its way into the manifest narrative of how something (an object, a person, a state, or a state of being) is produced, or comes into existence. It is the accumulation of all that is left behind, when value is extracted...There are no histories of residue, no atlases of abandonment, no memoirs of what a person was but could not be.] “With Respect to Residue,” Raqs Media Collective, 2005 When faced with any apparently “abandoned” situation, it quickly becomes clear that a lot remains. Even the walls of a shut-down factory teem with life forms, only some of which are visible to the eye. To recognize this is to encounter the fecundity of residue. In 1855, the English botanist Richard Deacon published a botanical study of the ruins of the Flavian amphitheatre in Rome, “The Flora of the Colosseum.” His meticulous and monumental account catalogues the 420 species of vegetation growing in the six acres of the ruined edifice. These included several species so rare in Europe at that time that Deacon speculated that they must have been transported as seeds in the guts of the animals and slaves imported into Rome from Africa and Asia for the staging of gladiatorial spectacles. Deacon speaks of these rare plants with affection and awe, saying that they “form a link in the memory, and teach us hopeful and soothing lessons, amid the sadness of bygone ages: and cold indeed must be the heart that does not respond to their silent appeal; for though without speech, they tell us of the regenerating power which animates the dust of mouldering greatness.” By 1870, the Colosseum in Rome had experienced the first of several modern attempts at “restoration,” and the ancient cosmopolitan exuberance of vegetation that had been the botanist’s consolation had begun to give way to naked stone. The vocabulary of contests and gladiatorials has not changed much in the last two millennia. Speed and prowess matter as much as they did when prisoners, slaves and beasts fought it out in the Colosseum’s arena. If anything, the Olympic virtues, “citius, altius, fortius” (faster, higher, stronger) have become the governing maxims of the contemporary world – the pace of life and labour gets faster, profits and prices rise higher and armies get stronger. Our societies are Colosseums reborn. We are spectators, gladiators and beasts. The late Alexander Langer, autonomist activist, thinker, maverick European Green politician, and native of South Tyrol, with his interest in the residual and his ecological emphasis on slowness, provides us with an interesting late twentieth century counterpoint to Marinetti’s cult of speed and the gladiatorial imperative. He proposed a challenge to the “citius, altius, fortius” maxim with a call to consider an alternative trinity of virtues – “lentius, suavius, profundius” (slower, softer, deeper). For quite some time now, the Olympic virtues have been defended with armed police pickets all over the world. It becomes necessary, at times like this to consider a few good reasons and methods to slow things down, to reclaim the stone with wild seeds. -------------------- Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From taraprakash at gmail.com Fri Aug 1 19:36:45 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2008 10:06:45 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects References: <038a01c8f3d8$92cc30c0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> <32144e990808010624x3c8b5895te0fcd0e6ad6e8079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <093001c8f3df$d598b2f0$a7ffbd48@taraprakash> Sorry Partha. The source is The Hindu. Let me try it again. Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects Praveen Swami Gujarat has been targeted by jihadists half-a-dozen times since 2002 in a little-understood war. One still afternoon in March 2002, Feroze Abdul Latif Ghaswala watched 40 victims of the anti-Muslim pogrom being buried near his aunt’s home in Ahmedabad.Back home in Mumbai, the automobile mechanic saw a printout of a Lashkar-e-Taiba pamphlet, which purported to show a riot victim begging for his life:“Do you think he should have a gun,” it asked. In September 2003, Ghaswala volunteered for training in Pakistan with a group led by the 2006 Mumbai serial bombing architect, Rahil Abdul Rehman Sheikh.When the Delhi police caught up with him in the summer of 2006, Ghaswala, along with computer engineer Ali Mohammad Cheepa, had just received a consignmentof military-grade explosives from the Lashkar for a major bombing in Ahmedabad Ever since last week’s bombings in Ahmedabad — one among half-a-dozen major plots targeting Gujarat that the Indian police and intelligence services didnot succeed in interdicting — the media have not tired of informing us that jihadist terrorism has taken a dramatic new turn. Instead of Pakistan-basedterrorists, it is claimed, a new generation of Indian jihadists is spearheading the attacks. On point of fact, the claim is nonsensical: not one single Islamist urban terror cell since 1993 has not involved a preponderance of Indian nationals. Butthe claim does show how little Islamist terror groups, and the politics that have driven their growth, are understood in India. Politics isn’t welcome at the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad’s Kaulpur area. Its students learn the six principles of Islam as enunciated by the founderof the Tablighi Jamaat, Mohammad Illyas, and are exhorted to give up frivolities like television and cinema. Maulana Sufiyan Patangia, who ran the seminary,often travelled to Saudi Arabia, seeking support for his students. After the January 26, 2001 Gujarat earthquake, the cleric put these networks to useto raise funds for relief work. It was his first foray into the secular world. The al-Qaeda’s bombing of New York and Washington D.C. gave Patangia a new cause. In the wake of the United States-led war on the Taliban, he declared thatIslam was in danger. He set up a study group, Idara-e-Fadlullah-ul-Muslimeen (Institution of Charity for Muslims), to educate his earthquake volunteers.The IFM members monitored events in Afghanistan on the Internet, and listened to tapes of Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Mohammad Masood Azhar’s speeches. Patangia used to be jokingly called ‘Mullah Omar,’ after the Taliban leader. His second-in-command Suhail Khan adopted an Osama bin-Laden-style headgear,acquiring the nickname ‘Chhota Osama,’ or Little Osama. In February 2002, when the communal pogrom in Gujarat began, Patangia was in Saudi Arabia on hisannual pilgrimage. He turned to the South Asian Islamist there for help to defend his community — and to exact revenge. Abdul Bari, a one-time Hyderabadresident who is among the Lashkar’s top financiers, put up Rs.3,75,000. Two Saudi-based JeM fundraisers of Hyderabad origin, Farhatullah Ghauri and AbdulRehman, threw in another Rs.5,00,000. Most important, though, Patangia made contact with Rasool Khan ‘Party’ — nicknamed with the Ahmedabad argot for ‘contractor’ because of his work for topGujarat mafioso Abdul Latif Sheikh and his Pakistan-based boss, Dawood Ibrahim Kaksar. In May 2002, Khan and his brother Idris met Patangia in Mumbai todiscuss just how vengeance might be planned. Late in May 2002, five bombs went off on buses in Ahmedabad, injuring 26 people. It was the first act of violence by Gujarat-based jihadists. In December,Khan arranged for eight of Patangia’s volunteers to travel to Pakistan for training. Along with other groups of young people from Hyderabad, Mumbai andBangalore, the Ahmedabad jihadists flew to Pakistan through Dhaka, Kathmandu, Dubai and Bangkok. Soon, the vengeance they sought was delivered. Gujarat’s Home Minister, Haren Pandya, who had led some of the most murderous mobs in Ahmedabad during thepogrom, was shot just 13 months later, by when he ceased to be Home Minister. Central Bureau of Investigation detectives later determined that he was killedby a hit-team directed by Patangia. Nine of the 12 assassins received life terms last year. Despite the CBI’s successes, plans for large-scale reprisal attacks in Gujarat continued apace. The LeT and the Maharashtra-based Students Islamic Movementof India operatives took the lead — helped by a steady flow of funds. In June 2004, the LeT despatched two Pakistani nationals from Jammu and Kashmir to execute a fidayeen attack in Gujarat. Jishan Johar of Gujranwala in Pakistanand Amjad Ali Rana, who hailed form Sargodha, were killed in a controversial encounter in Ahmedabad along with SIMI activist Javed Sheikh and his friend,Ishrat Jehan Raza. The Maharashtra-based SIMI bomb-maker Zulfikar Fayyaz Kagzi built a sophisticated suitcase bomb that was planted on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad Express train inFebruary 2006. An error in the timer circuit resulted in the bomb exploding 12 hours after the scheduled detonation time, by when the cleaning staff haddeposited the suitcase in an empty corner of the Ahmedabad station. And in May 2006, the Intelligence Bureau prevented a potentially catastrophic bombingin Gujarat, penetrating an Aurangabad-based SIMI unit, which was in an advanced stage of preparation for serial bomb strikes. Intellectual infrastructure Has the vengeance the jihadists sought been delivered? Not quite. Minutes before the latest bombing, the Indian Mujahideen — a Lashkar-SIMI front organisationwhich also took responsibility for the earlier bombings in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh — sent out a manifesto explaining just what it now seeks. According to the manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen is “raising the illustrious banner of Jihad against the Hindus and all those who fight and resist us,and here we begin our revenge with the help and Permission of Allah — a terrifying revenge of our blood, our lives and our honour that will Insha-Allahterminate your survival on this land.” The manifesto calls on Hindus to “realise that the falsehood of your 33 crore dirty mud idols and the blasphemy of your deaf, dumb mute and naked idolsof ram, krishna and hanuman [sic; capitalisation as in original throughout] are not at all going to save your necks from being slaughtered by our hands.”It demands that Hindus change their attitudes, lest “another Ghauri shakes your foundations, and lest another Ghaznavi massacres you, proving your bloodto be the cheapest of all mankind.” No great effort is needed to locate the intellectual genesis of this body of ideas: it draws heavily on long-standing LeT polemic. Indeed, the manifesto’splea that the LeT not take responsibility for the attacks is something of a giveaway, since the terror group has never owned up to actions targeting civilians.In 2003, for example, the LeT argued on its website that violence against Muslims in India was an outcome of the core character of Hindus, who “have nocompassion in their religion.” It was the duty of Muslims to wage a jihad against “Hindu oppressors,” and it was “the Hindu who is a terrorist.” Lashkar chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed also said, “the Hindu is a mean enemy and the proper way to deal with him is the one adopted by our forefathers [who]crushed them by force.” He made clear — just as the Indian Mujahideen has — that the objective of the jihad was extending Muslim control over what it sawas Muslim land. At a November 1999 rally, he promised that he would “not rest until the whole of India is dissolved into Pakistan.” All those who participatedin this project were promised “huge places in Paradise.” SIMI, like the Indian Mujahideen, also invoked medieval conquerors in its literature. In the wake of the demolition of the Babri Masjid, SIMI called forMuslims to avenge the act by following in the steps of the 11th century conqueror, Mahmud Ghaznavi. SIMI posters appealed to god to send another Ghaznavi,and thus avenge attacks on Muslims and their mosques by attacking temples. Local influences Local religious influences are also evident. In its manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen describes itself as “terrorist,” an apparently odd usage. However,it suggests that the author followed the neoconservative television evangelist Zakir Naik — just as several past Mumbai-based Lashkar operatives like RahilSheikh and Feroze Deshmukh did. In a controversial speech on al-Qaeda chief Osama bin-Laden, Naik proclaimed, “If he is fighting the enemies of Islam, I am for him. If he is terrorisingAmerica the terrorist — the biggest terrorist — I am with him.” “Every Muslim should be a terrorist,” Naik concluded. “The thing is, if he is terrorisinga terrorist, he is following Islam.” Most Indian Muslims would dispute the proposition: it is not for nothing, after all, that the Indian Mujahideen manifesto devotes considerable space torailing against clerics who oppose its jihadism. But the fact remains that some numbers of young Muslims — angered by discrimination, enraged by pogroms— see jihadism as the sole option available to them. As the work of scholar Ashutosh Varshney points out, the roots of this tragedy lie in the breakdownof inter-communal institutions: in a creeping religious apartheid that enveloped Gujarat in the second half of the last century, decades before the pogrom. In the weeks to come, the police and intelligence investigators will have to find out the perpetrators of the bombings. Politicians, however, have a farmore important task: to ensure that justice and equity are placed at centre stage of civic life in Gujarat, and India as a whole. No other way exists tobring down the intellectual infrastructure of hate, on which the jihadist campaign rests. ----- Original Message ----- From: Partha Dasgupta To: TaraPrakash Cc: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects Hi, Don't know were you sourced this from, but this large continuous block of text with punctuation missing is unreadable. Rgds, Partha ............................... On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 6:44 PM, TaraPrakash wrote: Ahmedabad blasts: the usual suspects Praveen Swami Gujarat has been targeted by jihadists half-a-dozen times since 2002 in a little-understood war. One still afternoon in March 2002, Feroze Abdul Latif Ghaswala watched 40 victims of the anti-Muslim pogrom being buried near his aunt's home in Ahmedabad.Back home in Mumbai, the automobile mechanic saw a printout of a Lashkar-e-Taiba pamphlet, which purported to show a riot victim begging for his life:"Do you think he should have a gun," it asked. In September 2003, Ghaswala volunteered for training in Pakistan with a group led by the 2006 Mumbai serial bombing architect, Rahil Abdul Rehman Sheikh.When the Delhi police caught up with him in the summer of 2006, Ghaswala, along with computer engineer Ali Mohammad Cheepa, had just received a consignmentof military-grade explosives from the Lashkar for a major bombing in Ahmedabad Ever since last week's bombings in Ahmedabad — one among half-a-dozen major plots targeting Gujarat that the Indian police and intelligence services didnot succeed in interdicting — the media have not tired of informing us that jihadist terrorism has taken a dramatic new turn. Instead of Pakistan-basedterrorists, it is claimed, a new generation of Indian jihadists is spearheading the attacks. On point of fact, the claim is nonsensical: not one single Islamist urban terror cell since 1993 has not involved a preponderance of Indian nationals. Butthe claim does show how little Islamist terror groups, and the politics that have driven their growth, are understood in India. Politics isn't welcome at the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad's Kaulpur area. Its students learn the six principles of Islam as enunciated by the founderof the Tablighi Jamaat, Mohammad Illyas, and are exhorted to give up frivolities like television and cinema. Maulana Sufiyan Patangia, who ran the seminary,often travelled to Saudi Arabia, seeking support for his students. After the January 26, 2001 Gujarat earthquake, the cleric put these networks to useto raise funds for relief work. It was his first foray into the secular world. The al-Qaeda's bombing of New York and Washington D.C. gave Patangia a new cause. In the wake of the United States-led war on the Taliban, he declared thatIslam was in danger. He set up a study group, Idara-e-Fadlullah-ul-Muslimeen (Institution of Charity for Muslims), to educate his earthquake volunteers.The IFM members monitored events in Afghanistan on the Internet, and listened to tapes of Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Mohammad Masood Azhar's speeches. Patangia used to be jokingly called 'Mullah Omar,' after the Taliban leader. His second-in-command Suhail Khan adopted an Osama bin-Laden-style headgear,acquiring the nickname 'Chhota Osama,' or Little Osama. In February 2002, when the communal pogrom in Gujarat began, Patangia was in Saudi Arabia on hisannual pilgrimage. He turned to the South Asian Islamist there for help to defend his community — and to exact revenge. Abdul Bari, a one-time Hyderabadresident who is among the Lashkar's top financiers, put up Rs.3,75,000. Two Saudi-based JeM fundraisers of Hyderabad origin, Farhatullah Ghauri and AbdulRehman, threw in another Rs.5,00,000. Most important, though, Patangia made contact with Rasool Khan 'Party' — nicknamed with the Ahmedabad argot for 'contractor' because of his work for topGujarat mafioso Abdul Latif Sheikh and his Pakistan-based boss, Dawood Ibrahim Kaksar. In May 2002, Khan and his brother Idris met Patangia in Mumbai todiscuss just how vengeance might be planned. Late in May 2002, five bombs went off on buses in Ahmedabad, injuring 26 people. It was the first act of violence by Gujarat-based jihadists. In December,Khan arranged for eight of Patangia's volunteers to travel to Pakistan for training. Along with other groups of young people from Hyderabad, Mumbai andBangalore, the Ahmedabad jihadists flew to Pakistan through Dhaka, Kathmandu, Dubai and Bangkok. Soon, the vengeance they sought was delivered. Gujarat's Home Minister, Haren Pandya, who had led some of the most murderous mobs in Ahmedabad during thepogrom, was shot just 13 months later, by when he ceased to be Home Minister. Central Bureau of Investigation detectives later determined that he was killedby a hit-team directed by Patangia. Nine of the 12 assassins received life terms last year. Despite the CBI's successes, plans for large-scale reprisal attacks in Gujarat continued apace. The LeT and the Maharashtra-based Students Islamic Movementof India operatives took the lead — helped by a steady flow of funds. In June 2004, the LeT despatched two Pakistani nationals from Jammu and Kashmir to execute a fidayeen attack in Gujarat. Jishan Johar of Gujranwala in Pakistanand Amjad Ali Rana, who hailed form Sargodha, were killed in a controversial encounter in Ahmedabad along with SIMI activist Javed Sheikh and his friend,Ishrat Jehan Raza. The Maharashtra-based SIMI bomb-maker Zulfikar Fayyaz Kagzi built a sophisticated suitcase bomb that was planted on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad Express train inFebruary 2006. An error in the timer circuit resulted in the bomb exploding 12 hours after the scheduled detonation time, by when the cleaning staff haddeposited the suitcase in an empty corner of the Ahmedabad station. And in May 2006, the Intelligence Bureau prevented a potentially catastrophic bombingin Gujarat, penetrating an Aurangabad-based SIMI unit, which was in an advanced stage of preparation for serial bomb strikes. Intellectual infrastructure Has the vengeance the jihadists sought been delivered? Not quite. Minutes before the latest bombing, the Indian Mujahideen — a Lashkar-SIMI front organisationwhich also took responsibility for the earlier bombings in Rajasthan and Uttar Pradesh — sent out a manifesto explaining just what it now seeks. According to the manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen is "raising the illustrious banner of Jihad against the Hindus and all those who fight and resist us,and here we begin our revenge with the help and Permission of Allah — a terrifying revenge of our blood, our lives and our honour that will Insha-Allahterminate your survival on this land." The manifesto calls on Hindus to "realise that the falsehood of your 33 crore dirty mud idols and the blasphemy of your deaf, dumb mute and naked idolsof ram, krishna and hanuman [sic; capitalisation as in original throughout] are not at all going to save your necks from being slaughtered by our hands."It demands that Hindus change their attitudes, lest "another Ghauri shakes your foundations, and lest another Ghaznavi massacres you, proving your bloodto be the cheapest of all mankind." No great effort is needed to locate the intellectual genesis of this body of ideas: it draws heavily on long-standing LeT polemic. Indeed, the manifesto'splea that the LeT not take responsibility for the attacks is something of a giveaway, since the terror group has never owned up to actions targeting civilians.In 2003, for example, the LeT argued on its website that violence against Muslims in India was an outcome of the core character of Hindus, who "have nocompassion in their religion." It was the duty of Muslims to wage a jihad against "Hindu oppressors," and it was "the Hindu who is a terrorist." Lashkar chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed also said, "the Hindu is a mean enemy and the proper way to deal with him is the one adopted by our forefathers [who]crushed them by force." He made clear — just as the Indian Mujahideen has — that the objective of the jihad was extending Muslim control over what it sawas Muslim land. At a November 1999 rally, he promised that he would "not rest until the whole of India is dissolved into Pakistan." All those who participatedin this project were promised "huge places in Paradise." SIMI, like the Indian Mujahideen, also invoked medieval conquerors in its literature. In the wake of the demolition of the Babri Masjid, SIMI called forMuslims to avenge the act by following in the steps of the 11th century conqueror, Mahmud Ghaznavi. SIMI posters appealed to god to send another Ghaznavi,and thus avenge attacks on Muslims and their mosques by attacking temples. Local influences Local religious influences are also evident. In its manifesto, the Indian Mujahideen describes itself as "terrorist," an apparently odd usage. However,it suggests that the author followed the neoconservative television evangelist Zakir Naik — just as several past Mumbai-based Lashkar operatives like RahilSheikh and Feroze Deshmukh did. In a controversial speech on al-Qaeda chief Osama bin-Laden, Naik proclaimed, "If he is fighting the enemies of Islam, I am for him. If he is terrorisingAmerica the terrorist — the biggest terrorist — I am with him." "Every Muslim should be a terrorist," Naik concluded. "The thing is, if he is terrorisinga terrorist, he is following Islam." Most Indian Muslims would dispute the proposition: it is not for nothing, after all, that the Indian Mujahideen manifesto devotes considerable space torailing against clerics who oppose its jihadism. But the fact remains that some numbers of young Muslims — angered by discrimination, enraged by pogroms— see jihadism as the sole option available to them. As the work of scholar Ashutosh Varshney points out, the roots of this tragedy lie in the breakdownof inter-communal institutions: in a creeping religious apartheid that enveloped Gujarat in the second half of the last century, decades before the pogrom. In the weeks to come, the police and intelligence investigators will have to find out the perpetrators of the bombings. Politicians, however, have a farmore important task: to ensure that justice and equity are placed at centre stage of civic life in Gujarat, and India as a whole. No other way exists tobring down the intellectual infrastructure of hate, on which the jihadist campaign rests. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Partha Dasgupta +919811047132 From brosius at sai.uni-heidelberg.de Sat Aug 2 02:16:32 2008 From: brosius at sai.uni-heidelberg.de (Christiane Brosius) Date: Fri, 01 Aug 2008 22:46:32 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] scholarships phd students heidelberg university In-Reply-To: <446266.6655.qm@web54202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <446266.6655.qm@web54202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48937628.3020300@sai.uni-heidelberg.de> This might be of interest to a few subscribers to the list. best, christiane brosius heidelberg, germany +++ The Graduate Programme for Transcultural Studies (GPTS) is part of the Cluster of Excellence "Asia and Europe in a Global Context: Shifting Asymmetries in Cultural Flows" at the University of Heidelberg (http://www.vjc.uni-hd.de/). The objective of the Cluster is to examine processes of cultural exchange with a strong focus on interdisciplinary research. The Cluster challenges the master narrative of asymmetrical Western domination along with its historical explanation, its methodology and the resulting structures of humanities and social science research. For the winter term 2008/2009 the GPTS offers 3 short-term (3 month) scholarships for Asian PhD/Doctoral students The GPTS is looking for applicants with an excellent academic background. Selected students will take part in the regular programme of the GPTS and contribute actively to it. The scholarships are awarded for 3 months. Scholarship holders are expected to be in Heidelberg between October 2008 and February 2009. The short-term scholarship includes travel expenses to Heidelberg and back home, and a monthly stipend of 1000,- €. Currently contributors to the Cluster work in the fields of Anthropology, Archeology, Art History, South and East Asian Studies, Assyriology, Cultural Studies, English Philology, Ethnology, Geography, History, Indology, Islamic Studies, Musicology, Philosophy, Political Science, Public Health, Religious Studies, Sinology, Sociology and others. Reflecting the interdisciplinary approach of the Cluster, the GSTS invites Asian doctoral students from these as well as other disciplines from the humanities and social sciences to apply. Candidates submit their applications including a letter of intention (400 words maximum), a CV, and a project proposal (1000 words) related to the major themes and topics of the Cluster (http://www.vjc.uni-hd.de/) to the online application system. Electronic submission of the application is mandatory. Deadline for application is August 31st, 2008. For further details of the GPTS see http://www.vjc.uni-hd.de/graduate.htm. From gautam.bhan at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 14:04:11 2008 From: gautam.bhan at gmail.com (gautam bhan) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 14:04:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Welcome to the Nigah QueerFest '08! In-Reply-To: <1cc7ed890808020131x41a9cfecu2fc9404bab1a1751@mail.gmail.com> References: <1cc7ed890808020131x41a9cfecu2fc9404bab1a1751@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: fyi ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Nigah Date: Aug 2, 2008 2:01 PM Subject: Welcome to the Nigah QueerFest '08! To: gautam bhan You've made it happen once again! Your support, contributions and goodwill have ensured that The Nigah QueerFest is back in 2008. We are delighted and proud to invite you to the inauguration of the festival, and to announce the launch of the full schedule on our website online. Inauguration: Friday, August 8, 2008 7.00 pm Siddhartha Hall, Max Muller Bhavan, Kasturba Gandhi Marg, New Delhi (Nearest Metro: Rajiv Chowk) Join us as we fashion a new language of queerness through an exhibition of portraits of queer families, while Sumathi Murthy, a Hindustani classical vocalist and composer from Bangalore will delight us with a queer rendition of a classical genre. Join us as we begin another ten days of queering Delhi! ****Check our complete festival schedule online at: http://www.thequeerfest.com**** - -- The Nigah QueerFest '08 8th to 17th August 2008 in New Delhi http://www.thequeerfest.com - -- ___________ I write at: www.kafila.org. From mail at shivamvij.com Sat Aug 2 15:11:29 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 15:11:29 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] KPs and facts Message-ID: <9c06aab30808020241n4078c7a1pf5fc2ebda46eaff0@mail.gmail.com> Divided House, Delayed Return Deep fissures in the Kashmiri Pandit community stand in the way of government efforts to rehabilitate them, reports PEERZADA ARSHAD HAMID http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp SANJAY TIKOO, a Kashmiri Pandit living in Barbar Shah, Srinagar, braved all odds and remained in the valley when thousands of Pandits left their motherland. It was 1990 and the armed insurgency in Kashmir had begun, followed by press releases in newspapers ordering Hindus to leave. No one home Most of the high-security government flats built exclusively for returning Pandits have found no takers Photo:Javed Dar The Tikoo family were defiant and resolute. They would not migrate. They weathered the pressure and fear and lived on in their ancestral home. Eighteen years later, those days remain vivid for Sanjay. He clearly remembers the prolonged strike calls, the curfews and, above all, the migration of fellow Pandits from the valley. Sanjay credits his mother for the decision. "I thank the women of my house and, particularly, my mother, who gave her steadfast support to our decision. If either she or my sister had shown even the slightest weakness, we too would have fled, forced to uproot ourselves," muses Sanjay. The Tikoos were soon singled out. A threatening letter was nailed to the entrance of their house. Sanjay clearly remembers that fateful day. "It was July 16, 1990. I had gone to the top floor of my house to smoke a cigarette. While pacing up and down, I saw a group of people reading something on our gate. I rushed down and brought the message in," recalls Sanjay. At about the same time, posters purportedly written by militants became ubiquitous. Along with threats such as the one Sanjay's family received, they contained strike calls and reports of militant activities. Disturbed, Sanjay discussed the letter with his family and then approached a local Urdu newspaper, which published the letter along with his family's decision: they would not leave the valley and were willing to face the consequences. Thereafter, a group of militants belonging to the Al-Umar Commandos approached the family and denied having issued the letter. This increased the confidence of the family and encouraged them to stay back. The relief department of the state government estimates that 56,148 families, including a few Muslim families — approximately 2.5 lakh people — migrated from their homes following the armed insurgency during the period 1989- 92. Of this, 34,690 families went to Jammu and 19,338 to New Delhi. While police records say 209 Pandits were killed in Kashmir in the past 18 years, Pandit organisations put the figure at about 1,100. An estimated 20,000 Pandit families, however, preferred to stay. These people occupied scattered pockets in urban and rural areas, detached from each other. This forsaken community faced difficulties in their social life that were felt acutely during marriages, religious functions and, most of all, when performing the last rites for their dead. "During the initial years, finding brides for our sons was difficult as few migrants were ready to send their daughters back to the valley. There were no priests to perform prayers. However, the situation is now improving and people don't consider marriages to families in the valley that dangerous," Tikoo says. Sanjay initiated efforts to unite Pandit families and strengthen their interaction. He and his friends founded the Kashmiri Pandit Sangharsh Samiti (KPSS), which is undertaking a census of Pandits in the valley. They advocate the safe return of Pandits and oppose government plans to give Pandits high-security residential flats. "The government has constructed separate buildings and has given CRPF security to them. However, this is an effort to create a Palestine- Israel type divide in Kashmir," asserts Tikoo. The KPSS is also critical of hard-line Pandit organisations like Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir, because of their demand for a separate homeland in Kashmir, northeast of the Jhelum. The KPSS considers Kashmir a political problem and a dispute between India and Pakistan. Panun Kashmir believes that the insurgency was a communal riot engineered by Islamic fundamentalists to drive the minority Hindus from the valley. They accuse Muslims of ethnic cleansing. Panun Kashmir has demanded land along the Jhelum in south Kashmir to be secured to build colonies for Pandits. The group also wants this zone to be made a Union Territory. "Our community has suffered badly. We have been uprooted from our homeland and unless adequate arrangements are made, we won't go back and will continue our fight for our rights. Residential flats are not the solution — that's just moving us from one camp to another. Our return to our motherland should be final and secure, so that we will not be forced to leave again," asserts Ajay Chrangoo, Chairman, Panun Kashmir. Chrangoo has been living in Jammu since his migration and strongly advocates a separate homeland. Chrangoo refers to flats constructed at Mattan in South Kashmir and at Sheikhpora on the outskirts of Srinagar that the state government has spent crores on, in order to coax Pandits to return. No Jammu Pandits were ready to return here, and most flats remain locked. Another voice representing the migrant community is the All India Kashmiri Samaj. Headed by Ram Krishan Bhat, it works to keep the Kashmiri sentiment alive among Pandit youth. Though he praises the Pandits who remained in the valley and calls them "daring", he says their continued presence in the valley is not enough to convince other Pandits to return. Chrangoo disagrees. "There is nothing special in some Pandits staying back. While some members of the community stay behind in conflict zones where there is a mass exodus, this can't obscure the bigger picture — the fact that most Pandits have fled. Moreover, those who remain, remain in fear," he adds. THE LARGE numbers of Pandit groups — representing migrants and non-migrants — claiming to fight for the rights of Pandits have confused people both in India and abroad. The clamour of voices has added to the complexity of the issue. While all groups claim to represent the aspirations of Kashmiri Pandits, all of them differ on when, where and how Pandits should return. "Pandits are as divided as the Muslims are," quips Sanjay Tikoo. Sanjay Saraf, a migrant politician, adds another dimension to the debate. Saraf plans to contest the coming assembly elections and is state president of the Lok Jan Shakti Party. Recently, national and regional parties from outside the state have started making inroads here. The elections will see candidates from the SP and the BSP, who have held rallies in Srinagar. Saraf, however, relies more on Muslim votes than on Pandit ones. Though he is a migrant, he has been visiting the valley regularly for the past seven years for party meetings and constituency visits. He is critical of Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir that are headquartered outside Kashmir and describes them as stooges of fundamentalist forces. "They are dancing to the tune of the BJP and the VHP and are trying to create a communal wedge," Saraf alleges. The divide among Pandits deepened during the recent crisis over land for the Amarnath shrine board. While most Pandit organisations based in Jammu and New Delhi favoured the transfer of land to the board, the valley-based KPSS stood alone in its demand for the pilgrimage to be placed under resident Kashmiri Pandit organisations. Saraf supported this demand from the beginning. "Pandits cannot remain outside the valley and pay mere lip service to the cause. We have to be here to say we belong to the land. Raising a hue and cry while staying outside hardly matters," avers Sanjay Saraf, while acknowledging KPSS' efforts. Ideological differences have increased the divide between migrant Pandits and those who stayed back. Eighteen years after Pandits fled the valley, various groups continue to pursue their own agendas and a consensus remains elusive. WRITER'S E-MAIL peerzadaarshad at gmail.com From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 31, Dated Aug 09, 2008 From ravikant at sarai.net Sat Aug 2 17:43:06 2008 From: ravikant at sarai.net (Ravikant) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 17:43:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Talk at Sarai-CSDS Message-ID: <200808021743.06802.ravikant@sarai.net> You are all invited to an illustrated talk by Dr. Krishnendu Ray at Sarai-CSDS on 8th August, Friday, 3.30 PM. Please read on for details: --- Making the Edible Legible: American Restaurants in Print, 1830-2006 Cuisine happens when cooking leaves the kitchen, in the first instance when it escapes the domestic kitchen, and in the second instance, when it spreads onto the print media to give durability to the talk about taste. Based on detailed archival work and quantitative data this presentation seeks to measure the talk about restaurants in American newspapers from its first appearance in 1830 to the present. The restaurant kitchen is trhe space of mongrel borderland – an orality of Hispanidad, Bengali, Cantonese, and Hakka – and the dining room a pedigreed and printed Anglophone parlor with Francophile accents. This work looks at taste and toil as a dynamic, dialogic relationship between producers and consumers of commodified cuisine. Krishnendu Ray is Assistant Professor of Nutrition, Food Studies and Public Health at New York University. He is the author of The Migrants' Table (Temple Univ Press, 2004), and has taught for a decade at the Culinary Institute of America. --- regards ravikant From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 17:59:36 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 17:59:36 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu Communalists ! and Jammu keeps Burning Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808020529y11a55b3ud27e08d781af6e9a@mail.gmail.com> *KASHMIR IMAGES, August 2, 2009* *Good you talked about Hindu communalists of India, why not about Muslim fundamentalists of Kashmir?* *By Vimal Sumbly* Dear Omar, please accept my heartiest congratulations for an impassionate speech you delivered in the parliament on July 22. It would be remembered as one of the best speeches ever delivered in the parliament. I have always felt proud about your secular and nationalistic credentials. Unlike most other politicians in Kashmir, you and your illustrious father Dr Farooq Abdullah have the distinction of never playing with the secessionist sentiments of people in Kashmir. As you began your speech in the parliament that you are a Muslim and you are an Indian and there was no difference between the two, you were speaking straight from your heart. In fact you never needed to say that, you have always proved it indeed. However I beg to differ with the widespread public opinion generated by your "extempore speech". For the speech was not at all addressed to the parliament, nor to the billion Indians who were watching you live on the television. It was aimed at the select "secular Muslims of Kashmir" whom you are going to ask for their vote very soon. I salute you for the courage to call a spade a spade. You rightly criticized the Bharitya Janata Party for its communal agenda. I believe your regret and apologies were obviously aimed at the Kashmiri Muslims. You rightly criticized the Communists for being self proclaimed guardians of the Indian secularism, while not minding to side with the "communal BJP" in toppling the government. Dear Omar, I know and you know that you paid a heavy price in 2002 assembly elections in Kashmir for not having resigned on the Gujarat riots. You and your party were defeated in the elections, mainly because you were blamed for sharing power with the "communal BJP" at the centre. That ghost might be still haunting you. But you showed enough moral courage to apologize to the Kashmiri Muslims. You berated the BJP to the maximum possible extent. That is for you and the BJP to decide. Your speech was rated among the best by various television channels. Taking it on the face value everybody would like it. Because, it was rhetoric at its best. Particularly when you had chosen the two best targets, the Communists and the BJP, who were obviously not liked by many across the country for their opportunistic "understanding" to topple the government for entirely different reasons. I wish you gathered the same moral courage, which you showed in the parliament to denounce the Hindu communalists, to condemn the Muslim communalists in Kashmir. I feel sorry the way you defended the anti Amarnath land transfer agitation in the parliament. And hats off to you that you presented it to be a "secular" agitation for the land. Let you tell me and the whole of nation who was going to take away the land from you. Had LK Advani been allotted the land to settle down his "communal brigade" there? It was just a temporary transfer to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board to facilitate the pilgrimage of lakhs of pilgrims coming from across the country. And is the Shrine Board an outside agency? Isn't it just a state agency controlled by the state government itself? The matter of the fact is that you joined the course of competitive communalism that was initiated by your rivals, the People's Democratic Party and hijacked by secessionists like Sayeed Ali Shah Geelani. And how brilliantly you presented it in "secular colours". What if the Hindus outside Kashmir rebel in the same way and seek vacation of Haj houses? That has never been done and it will never be done. Not everybody across the country knows that the grave of your grandfather, Sher-i-Kashmir, Sheikh Mohammad Abdullah still needs a heavy posse of cops and mostly drawn from central paramilitary forces to be defended against the same "secular" Muslims of Kashmir. And we all know Sheikh Sahib was a true secular leader who opted for secular India against an Islamic Pakistan. Had it not been for him, Kashmir would not have been with India. So, who is wrong your grandfather or the "secular" Kashmiri Muslims, whom you defended with such a strong conviction? Like you apologized to the Kashmiri Muslims for "sleeping with the communal BJP", you should also apologize to the people of Jammu whom you accused of being communal. This was too hurting. Let you not forget that you still feel safer in Jammu than in Kashmir and there has not been a selective communal killing in Jammu despite so much provocation in Kashmir valley. You certainly owe an apology to the people of Jammu also and the current phase of violence was provoked by "the best" speech you delivered in the parliament. And please don't mislead the county that no Amarnath pilgrim was ever attacked. There have been scores of attacks resulting in scores of deaths during the past two decades on the pilgrims. And also let the record be straightened that the Amarnath cave was not discovered by a Muslim about 150 years ago. Its mention is in Neelamat Puran as well. Besides, when the Kashmiri Pandits were subjected to atrocities during the regime of Aurangzeb, they (the Kashmiri Pandits) had gone to Amaranth to seek divine intervention. It is here that they decided to approach Guru Tegh Bahadur in Anandpur Sahib and that is over 300 years ago. I am sure, you are an honest and a well meaning person. I not only see a bright future for Kashmir in you, but for the entire country. We need leaders like you, passionate, forthright, honest, brilliant and daring. To conclude I tell, rather I request you one small thing. This is too personal. That I am myself a Kashmiri like you. I am thorough Kashmiri in language, in culture, in life and in everything. I have been thrown out of my Kashmir 18 years ago. Even remaining away, I have maintained my language, my culture and my lifestyle as a true Kashmir. You will say that, I was not thrown out as it was Jagmohan who prompted me to move out. Presuming that I went out at Jagmohan's behest, but can you help me now to return my piece of land, less than half an acre, no big deal. It has been occupied by one of my "secular Muslim" classmates with whom I used to go to school for twelve long years. He knows I cannot do anything. You said, you will fight for the rights of your land. Will you help me to return my land, like you pleaded the cause of other fellow Muslim Kashmiris. I am also your fellow Kashmiri who still cherishes the memories of his home. Don't disappoint me. Because I think you are not only brave but bold as well. Have courage to speak for me. Whether I get my land back or not, would not bother me, but I would feel consoled that a fellow Kashmiri stood for me, like he stood for other fellow Kashmiris. I understand that writing to you this way is enough to get me pronounced as communal and an activist of RSS and Shiv Sena. But let me put it on record that ours was among a few exceptional Pandit families that always voted for the National Conference and not the Congress. You can verify it from my same friend who has grabbed my land. We used to participate together in National Conference processions. And I still believe that the National Conference is the best bet for the people of Jammu and Kashmir, particularly under the dynamic leadership of a young, brilliant, brave and daring leader like you. My sincere apologies if I have been harsh to you, I never wanted to cloud the glory of your speech in parliament, I only wanted to set the record straight. Because truth must be told howsoever bitter it may be. From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 18:03:17 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 18:03:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808020533t68c13f36ufe52b34d00db1199@mail.gmail.com> Let us all condemn this act. http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/uncategorized/unannounced-curbs-on-media-in-jammu_10079039.html Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu Jammu, Aug 2 (IANS) "Sorry! Press is not allowed," that is the curt answer to the pleas of journalists who want to move in Jammu city to cover the ongoing riots over the Amarnath land row. Any other person with an identity card or a curfew pass is signaled to move on. But reporters are told: "Hurry up, turn or you will face the consequences." A group of reporters and cameramen trying to enter the walled city were stopped at Bikram Chowk Saturday and told to "go back". "These are the orders from the higher authorities, we cannot do anything," a police official on duty at the spot told the scribes. Journalists at many places like Rehari, Shakti Nagar, Parade, Pacca Danga and Link Road areas were not allowed to step out of their houses. There was no official word as to why the curbs were imposed on media. No official was available for comments and the phone calls went unanswered. From mail at shivamvij.com Sat Aug 2 21:04:00 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 21:04:00 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808020533t68c13f36ufe52b34d00db1199@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808020533t68c13f36ufe52b34d00db1199@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808020834m6b1381acg5037010f687e5e2d@mail.gmail.com> Dear Pawan, On 7 July I had posted a similar news article about an attack on journalists in Srinagar. See http://readerlist.freeflux.net/blog/archive/2008/07/07/reader-list-crpf-attacks-journalists-in-srinagar.html This one that you post about Jammu claims that journalists have been threatened ("Hurry up, turn or you will face the consequences"). But in that case journalists were beaten up. I had in my post even pointed out that such an attack in any other state capital would have received attention in the national/Delhi media, over which my friend Aditya Raj Kaul certainly has more influence than Syed Ali Shah Geelani. You had replied that post of mine, thus: "Article 370......they live with it ...they should die with it ...their prefrence ....they have a separate constitution ,.....let them appeal under RPC acts......." Now I would have liked to respond to that, but I didn't because you had made a grave personal accusation which caused some self-doubt. You had written, "Your obsession is just too compulsive." I thought, perhaps Pawan has a point after all - not about the Ranbir Penal Code but about my being unable to see out of my box because of being obsessed with it. But now, you post an article about threats and "unannounced curbs" on the media in another part of the state, Jammu, which is also governed by the Ranbir rather than the Indian Penal Code. You not only *condemn* an attack on journalists in Jammu despite Jammu also being governed by the RPC, but also you go on to call upon *all* members of this list in joining you in the act of condemnation of this reported act of reporters being prevented from doing their job under duress. Now I think that the Hindi press in Jammu is unabashedly communal, its front-page headlines are more interested in stoking passions rather than disseminating news. What else could you expect from papers like Dainik Jagran, which have a documented record of causing deaths in communal conflicts and aligning itself with the anti-Muslim RSS ( http://www.thehoot.org/web/home/searchdetail.php?sid=559&bg=1 ). Now, despite this background, I join you in condemning these unannounced curbs on the media in Jammu, if the report is true, no matter what the magnitude of this exercise of conflict-related censorship is. In other words, I am saying that I condemn this even if the security personnel were instructed to do so only to prevent the press from stoking further passions, causing more deaths and 'unrest'. I condemn the act for the following reasons: Firstly, I am against censorship unless it is being used to prevent very imminent, direct violence. In this case I think what is required is better regulatory mechanism than a toothless Press Council of India to prevent papers like Dainik Jagran from stoking communal passions. Secondly, even if I feel relieved that the police is preventing the journalists with an honourable intention, I can't support the act for reasons of consistency. For I can then not argue against censorship in Srinagar by the CRPF, using actual violence to prevent publication of reports about the protest outside the Hazratbal shrine. The Indian state can justly claim that it was doing so because the journalists and protesters were seeking/promoting secession. To cut a long story short, would you please explain why you want us to join you in condemning censorship and harassment of journalists in Jammu even though you refused, on 7 July, to condemn the beating up of journalists in Srinagar with lathis just because the state does not follow the Indian Penal Code? I mean, why shouldn't we wait for India establish "full flow of the Indian constitution" in Jammu *&* Kashmir before we can condemn the violation of that Constitution - as is your argument for Srinagar? Every Kashmir-related post on this list that you find uncomfortable, you either ignore it or just say, "You don't know the facts." You don't by extension state what the alleged lie is and what the facts are. But the least one expects is consistency from you. This discrepancy amounts to intellectual dishonesty. It forces me to conclude that you don't care if Muslim journalists are beaten to death but you have every concern for Hindu journalists. Such blatantly communal sentiments are not expected from someone who constantly reminds us of having been on the receiving end of Kashmiri Muslim communalism. However, perhaps you have an explanation, and perhaps I am over-reaction. I look forward to your response. warmly, shivam On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 6:03 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Let us all condemn this act. > http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/uncategorized/unannounced-curbs-on-media-in-jammu_10079039.html > > Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu > > Jammu, Aug 2 (IANS) "Sorry! Press is not allowed," that is the curt answer > to the pleas of journalists who want to move in Jammu city to cover the > ongoing riots over the Amarnath land row. Any other person with an identity > card or a curfew pass is signaled to move on. But reporters are told: "Hurry > up, turn or you will face the consequences." > > A group of reporters and cameramen trying to enter the walled city were > stopped at Bikram Chowk Saturday and told to "go back". > > "These are the orders from the higher authorities, we cannot do anything," a > police official on duty at the spot told the scribes. > > Journalists at many places like Rehari, Shakti Nagar, Parade, Pacca Danga > and Link Road areas were not allowed to step out of their houses. > > There was no official word as to why the curbs were imposed on media. > > No official was available for comments and the phone calls went unanswered. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- /National Highway/ http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 2 23:53:08 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 23:53:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808020834m6b1381acg5037010f687e5e2d@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808020533t68c13f36ufe52b34d00db1199@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808020834m6b1381acg5037010f687e5e2d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808021123x11b13027o215c4a9372903cc0@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shivam, I would still say that you are too obsessed with anti Indian and anti Kashmiri Pandit stand,inspite of you being a friend. I wanted to reply to your post where you wanted the readers to read the following story [ http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp ] I wrote a reply and chose not to post it for i did not want to to give importance your OBSESSION. Your problem with Jammu struggle goes deep into your love for anti establishment . When Kashmiri muslims were agitating against providing decent facilities to Amarnath , you want ahead and posted an article with subject Amarnath row: Azadi sentiment gets a fillip [ http://shivamvij.com/2008/07/09/amarnath-row-azadi-sentiment-gets-a-fillip/] What has escaped you is almost 3 weeks of curfew in jammu , shoot at sight orders and atrocities committed on hindu population of Jammu by muslim police. Why Shivam ? What are you made of ? If you recollect the time when you were with tehelka and it's summit I asked Mehbooba a question about Kashmiri Hindus, she said that Kashmiri hindus were welcome in Kashmir as visitors and tourists , i wonder why havent that thing hit you term her as communal . And neither have you evercalled Geelani , Yasin and Mirwaiz as one ? As a Jouro, i know where you stand for truth. Pawan www.thekashmir.wordpress.com On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 9:04 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Dear Pawan, > > On 7 July I had posted a similar news article about an attack on > journalists in Srinagar. See > > http://readerlist.freeflux.net/blog/archive/2008/07/07/reader-list-crpf-attacks-journalists-in-srinagar.html > > This one that you post about Jammu claims that journalists have been > threatened ("Hurry up, turn or you will face the consequences"). But > in that case journalists were beaten up. I had in my post even pointed > out that such an attack in any other state capital would have received > attention in the national/Delhi media, over which my friend Aditya Raj > Kaul certainly has more influence than Syed Ali Shah Geelani. > > You had replied that post of mine, thus: "Article 370......they live > with it ...they should die with it ...their > prefrence ....they have a separate constitution ,.....let them appeal under > RPC acts......." > > Now I would have liked to respond to that, but I didn't because you > had made a grave personal accusation which caused some self-doubt. You > had written, "Your obsession is just too compulsive." I thought, > perhaps Pawan has a point after all - not about the Ranbir Penal Code > but about my being unable to see out of my box because of being > obsessed with it. > > But now, you post an article about threats and "unannounced curbs" on > the media in another part of the state, Jammu, which is also governed > by the Ranbir rather than the Indian Penal Code. You not only > *condemn* an attack on journalists in Jammu despite Jammu also being > governed by the RPC, but also you go on to call upon *all* members of > this list in joining you in the act of condemnation of this reported > act of reporters being prevented from doing their job under duress. > > Now I think that the Hindi press in Jammu is unabashedly communal, its > front-page headlines are more interested in stoking passions rather > than disseminating news. What else could you expect from papers like > Dainik Jagran, which have a documented record of causing deaths in > communal conflicts and aligning itself with the anti-Muslim RSS ( > http://www.thehoot.org/web/home/searchdetail.php?sid=559&bg=1 ). > > Now, despite this background, I join you in condemning these > unannounced curbs on the media in Jammu, if the report is true, no > matter what the magnitude of this exercise of conflict-related > censorship is. In other words, I am saying that I condemn this even if > the security personnel were instructed to do so only to prevent the > press from stoking further passions, causing more deaths and 'unrest'. > > I condemn the act for the following reasons: > > Firstly, I am against censorship unless it is being used to prevent > very imminent, direct violence. In this case I think what is required > is better regulatory mechanism than a toothless Press Council of India > to prevent papers like Dainik Jagran from stoking communal passions. > > Secondly, even if I feel relieved that the police is preventing the > journalists with an honourable intention, I can't support the act for > reasons of consistency. For I can then not argue against censorship in > Srinagar by the CRPF, using actual violence to prevent publication of > reports about the protest outside the Hazratbal shrine. The Indian > state can justly claim that it was doing so because the journalists > and protesters were seeking/promoting secession. > > To cut a long story short, would you please explain why you want us to > join you in condemning censorship and harassment of journalists in > Jammu even though you refused, on 7 July, to condemn the beating up of > journalists in Srinagar with lathis just because the state does not > follow the Indian Penal Code? I mean, why shouldn't we wait for India > establish "full flow of the Indian constitution" in Jammu *&* Kashmir > before we can condemn the violation of that Constitution - as is your > argument for Srinagar? > > Every Kashmir-related post on this list that you find uncomfortable, > you either ignore it or just say, "You don't know the facts." You > don't by extension state what the alleged lie is and what the facts > are. But the least one expects is consistency from you. This > discrepancy amounts to intellectual dishonesty. It forces me to > conclude that you don't care if Muslim journalists are beaten to death > but you have every concern for Hindu journalists. Such blatantly > communal sentiments are not expected from someone who constantly > reminds us of having been on the receiving end of Kashmiri Muslim > communalism. > > However, perhaps you have an explanation, and perhaps I am > over-reaction. I look forward to your response. > > warmly, > shivam > > > > > > > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 6:03 PM, Pawan Durani > wrote: > > Let us all condemn this act. > > > http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/uncategorized/unannounced-curbs-on-media-in-jammu_10079039.html > > > > Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu > > > > Jammu, Aug 2 (IANS) "Sorry! Press is not allowed," that is the curt > answer > > to the pleas of journalists who want to move in Jammu city to cover the > > ongoing riots over the Amarnath land row. Any other person with an > identity > > card or a curfew pass is signaled to move on. But reporters are told: > "Hurry > > up, turn or you will face the consequences." > > > > A group of reporters and cameramen trying to enter the walled city were > > stopped at Bikram Chowk Saturday and told to "go back". > > > > "These are the orders from the higher authorities, we cannot do > anything," a > > police official on duty at the spot told the scribes. > > > > Journalists at many places like Rehari, Shakti Nagar, Parade, Pacca Danga > > and Link Road areas were not allowed to step out of their houses. > > > > There was no official word as to why the curbs were imposed on media. > > > > No official was available for comments and the phone calls went > unanswered. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > /National Highway/ http://shivamvij.com/ > From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 00:30:33 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 00:30:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808021123x11b13027o215c4a9372903cc0@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808020533t68c13f36ufe52b34d00db1199@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808020834m6b1381acg5037010f687e5e2d@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808021123x11b13027o215c4a9372903cc0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808021200w4c5e3960ofe97f449fe774fd1@mail.gmail.com> Shivamji, In Kashmir, Protests were organised by Huriyat, JKLF, NC, PDP etc. In Jammu, Protests are being organised by the common people and just supported by BJP, VHP, RSS. Hope you understand the difference. If you still don't then you better catch the next flight to Jammu and be there among the people. *P.S.* - "The Hindu" newspaper which has a history of giving coverage to almost all sections; today didn't even mention about the 2 deaths in Jammu or protests. On the other hand, JKLF Terrorist Yasin Malik organised press conf. in an Hotel in Kashmir was given wide coverage in Media. He said Pandits are "FANATICS" and "COMMUNAL". I wonder if he has a mirror at home; or else he is turning blind on both eyes. God Bless you Journalist. Regards Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/2/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > Dear Shivam, > I would still say that you are too obsessed with anti Indian and anti > Kashmiri Pandit stand,inspite of you being a friend. > > I wanted to reply to your post where you wanted the readers to read the > following story [ > http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp > ] > > I wrote a reply and chose not to post it for i did not want to to give > importance your OBSESSION. > > Your problem with Jammu struggle goes deep into your love for anti > establishment . When Kashmiri muslims were agitating against providing > decent facilities to Amarnath , you want ahead and posted an article with > subject Amarnath row: Azadi sentiment gets a fillip [ > http://shivamvij.com/2008/07/09/amarnath-row-azadi-sentiment-gets-a-fillip/ > ] > > What has escaped you is almost 3 weeks of curfew in jammu , shoot at sight > orders and atrocities committed on hindu population of Jammu by muslim > police. > > Why Shivam ? What are you made of ? > > If you recollect the time when you were with tehelka and it's summit I > asked > Mehbooba a question about Kashmiri Hindus, she said that Kashmiri hindus > were welcome in Kashmir as visitors and tourists , i wonder why havent that > thing hit you term her as communal . > > And neither have you evercalled Geelani , Yasin and Mirwaiz as one ? > > As a Jouro, i know where you stand for truth. > > Pawan > www.thekashmir.wordpress.com > > > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 9:04 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >wrote: > > > Dear Pawan, > > > > On 7 July I had posted a similar news article about an attack on > > journalists in Srinagar. See > > > > > http://readerlist.freeflux.net/blog/archive/2008/07/07/reader-list-crpf-attacks-journalists-in-srinagar.html > > > > This one that you post about Jammu claims that journalists have been > > threatened ("Hurry up, turn or you will face the consequences"). But > > in that case journalists were beaten up. I had in my post even pointed > > out that such an attack in any other state capital would have received > > attention in the national/Delhi media, over which my friend Aditya Raj > > Kaul certainly has more influence than Syed Ali Shah Geelani. > > > > You had replied that post of mine, thus: "Article 370......they live > > with it ...they should die with it ...their > > prefrence ....they have a separate constitution ,.....let them appeal > under > > RPC acts......." > > > > Now I would have liked to respond to that, but I didn't because you > > had made a grave personal accusation which caused some self-doubt. You > > had written, "Your obsession is just too compulsive." I thought, > > perhaps Pawan has a point after all - not about the Ranbir Penal Code > > but about my being unable to see out of my box because of being > > obsessed with it. > > > > But now, you post an article about threats and "unannounced curbs" on > > the media in another part of the state, Jammu, which is also governed > > by the Ranbir rather than the Indian Penal Code. You not only > > *condemn* an attack on journalists in Jammu despite Jammu also being > > governed by the RPC, but also you go on to call upon *all* members of > > this list in joining you in the act of condemnation of this reported > > act of reporters being prevented from doing their job under duress. > > > > Now I think that the Hindi press in Jammu is unabashedly communal, its > > front-page headlines are more interested in stoking passions rather > > than disseminating news. What else could you expect from papers like > > Dainik Jagran, which have a documented record of causing deaths in > > communal conflicts and aligning itself with the anti-Muslim RSS ( > > http://www.thehoot.org/web/home/searchdetail.php?sid=559&bg=1 ). > > > > Now, despite this background, I join you in condemning these > > unannounced curbs on the media in Jammu, if the report is true, no > > matter what the magnitude of this exercise of conflict-related > > censorship is. In other words, I am saying that I condemn this even if > > the security personnel were instructed to do so only to prevent the > > press from stoking further passions, causing more deaths and 'unrest'. > > > > I condemn the act for the following reasons: > > > > Firstly, I am against censorship unless it is being used to prevent > > very imminent, direct violence. In this case I think what is required > > is better regulatory mechanism than a toothless Press Council of India > > to prevent papers like Dainik Jagran from stoking communal passions. > > > > Secondly, even if I feel relieved that the police is preventing the > > journalists with an honourable intention, I can't support the act for > > reasons of consistency. For I can then not argue against censorship in > > Srinagar by the CRPF, using actual violence to prevent publication of > > reports about the protest outside the Hazratbal shrine. The Indian > > state can justly claim that it was doing so because the journalists > > and protesters were seeking/promoting secession. > > > > To cut a long story short, would you please explain why you want us to > > join you in condemning censorship and harassment of journalists in > > Jammu even though you refused, on 7 July, to condemn the beating up of > > journalists in Srinagar with lathis just because the state does not > > follow the Indian Penal Code? I mean, why shouldn't we wait for India > > establish "full flow of the Indian constitution" in Jammu *&* Kashmir > > before we can condemn the violation of that Constitution - as is your > > argument for Srinagar? > > > > Every Kashmir-related post on this list that you find uncomfortable, > > you either ignore it or just say, "You don't know the facts." You > > don't by extension state what the alleged lie is and what the facts > > are. But the least one expects is consistency from you. This > > discrepancy amounts to intellectual dishonesty. It forces me to > > conclude that you don't care if Muslim journalists are beaten to death > > but you have every concern for Hindu journalists. Such blatantly > > communal sentiments are not expected from someone who constantly > > reminds us of having been on the receiving end of Kashmiri Muslim > > communalism. > > > > However, perhaps you have an explanation, and perhaps I am > > over-reaction. I look forward to your response. > > > > warmly, > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 6:03 PM, Pawan Durani > > wrote: > > > Let us all condemn this act. > > > > > > http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/uncategorized/unannounced-curbs-on-media-in-jammu_10079039.html > > > > > > Unannounced curbs on media in Jammu > > > > > > Jammu, Aug 2 (IANS) "Sorry! Press is not allowed," that is the curt > > answer > > > to the pleas of journalists who want to move in Jammu city to cover the > > > ongoing riots over the Amarnath land row. Any other person with an > > identity > > > card or a curfew pass is signaled to move on. But reporters are told: > > "Hurry > > > up, turn or you will face the consequences." > > > > > > A group of reporters and cameramen trying to enter the walled city were > > > stopped at Bikram Chowk Saturday and told to "go back". > > > > > > "These are the orders from the higher authorities, we cannot do > > anything," a > > > police official on duty at the spot told the scribes. > > > > > > Journalists at many places like Rehari, Shakti Nagar, Parade, Pacca > Danga > > > and Link Road areas were not allowed to step out of their houses. > > > > > > There was no official word as to why the curbs were imposed on media. > > > > > > No official was available for comments and the phone calls went > > unanswered. > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > -- > > /National Highway/ http://shivamvij.com/ > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 01:27:08 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 01:27:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Restrictions on media, shoot at sight in Jammu Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808021257p182e42ebpe579fbadfb1468ec@mail.gmail.com> http://india.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=138721 Why this deafning silence from regular writers like Shuddha, Inder Salim , Aarti et ell. ???????????? From elkamath at yahoo.com Sun Aug 3 09:49:27 2008 From: elkamath at yahoo.com (lalitha kamath) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 21:19:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: 5th Global Labour University Conference-- Call for Papers Message-ID: <934137.92627.qm@web53610.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Decent Work Social Justice Fair Globalization _______________________ Call for Papers 5. Global Labour University Conference Tata Institute for Social Sciences Mumbai, India, 22-24 February 2009 Financialization of Capital – Deterioration of Working Conditions Submission of proposal for papers until 1 November 2008 Papers are invited that: a. Discuss trade unions’ innovative approaches and best practices of organizing workers in informal and precarious employment. b. Assess policies and organizing campaigns of trade unions to improve legal regulations, labour market institutions and social protection coverage to secure that all workers can effectively exercise their workplace and social rights. c. Analyse trade union research, policy, organizing and collective bargaining strategies which respond to the aggressive business strategies of global companies and financial institutions. Format The workshop will bring together an international group of scholars and trade unionists. It will feature working groups, paper presentations, and panel discussions involving both academics and trade unionists. Papers will be presented mainly in small interactive working groups to allow for in-depth discussion and development of ideas for possible future research and cooperation. A selected number of papers will be published in the 2009 GLU Yearbook The proposal should be a two to three page abstract that 1) states the name, address and institutional affiliation of the author/s; 2) outlines the main ideas; and 3) indicates what methodology will be used. Proposals for papers should be sent in electronic format by 1 November 2008 to: Dr. Sharit K. Bhowmik Centre for Labour Studies School of Management and Labour Studies Tata Institute of Social Sciences Deonar Mumbai, India 400 088 e-mail: glu.india at tiss.edu Internet: www.global-labour-university.org From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 09:53:16 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 09:53:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] PK Reply to Mufti Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808022123m23bc89f3n68419344e3970d9d@mail.gmail.com> Panun Kashmir calls upon all citizens of India not to take the statement of PDP patron Mufti Mohd Sayyad at its face value but to thoroughly analyse it and read what is behind the words and between the lines. Panun Kashmir outrightly rejects the contention of the PDP patron that the agitation in Jammu region is motivated by hatred, parochialism and an intention to damage the amiable ethos in the state. Panun Kashmir views the agitation in Jammu region as an assertion against culture of intolerance and mindset of exclusivism which PDP and its ilk in the state have perpetuated. The state has reached a stage where even providing temporary facilities for conduct of a Hindu pilgrimage to Amarnath shrine is considered as an affront to the sensibilities of people who identify with political ideology as practiced by PDP. The entire campaign which was started by PDP to scuttle the yatra and deny the transfer of land to build facilities for Hindu pilgrims is an expression of hatered and xenophobia. People of Jammu including the displaced Hindus from Kashmirhave risen against this brazen intolerance. They have risen to raise their voice against the campaign of religious cleansing which started with the forced expulsion of the entire population of Hindus from Kashmir valley , destruction of Hindu habitat there which includes hundreds of temples and shrines and is now seeking to disrupt the centuries old pilgrimage to Amarnath cave. The people of Jammu have risen against a mindset that treats the Province of Jammu as a colony of Kashmiri Muslim hegemony. The people of Jammu have risen to call a halt to an era of discrimination, exploittion and subjugation at all levels and in all spheres of life. Nobody believes in the subterfuges which PDP patron has put forward to hide his communal and fundamentalist agenda in the state. Everybody knows now that PDP has exerted all its energies to suck the people of Kashmir valley into the whirlpool of competitive communalism and secessionism. PDP is not a messiah of peace in the state but a vicious force which is relentlessly wrecking the chances of peace. PDP has day in and day out sought to legitimize terrorism and subvert the war against terrorism. The Self-Rule proposal which guides the politics of PDP at present only aims at dividing Jammu Kashmir into Hindu and Muslim political domains to destroy the secular fabric and unleash forces of balkanization in rest of India. PDP overtly and covertly has sought to undermine the historical identity of Kashmir so that the religion based identity politics in Kashmir integrates easily with pan-islamist imperatives. PDP policies have sought to give premium to Islamist terrorism and remove all moral censors against talibinisation of Kashmir. To any discerning students of politics and history of the state, PDP will appear to be the frontline instrument of Jamat-i-Islami. Panun Kashmir would like all peace loving citizens of India to recognize the regressive and bigoted ideograph of PDP. A party which seeks inspiration from such periods in the history of Kashmir like the Chak rule when the blood of Kashmiris was spilled both in the name of religion and sectarianism, can only breed hatred. The party which advocates development and progress based on religious identity can never nourish brotherhood amongst the citizens. The party which under one pretext or the other seeks the state to subsidize terrorism will only contribute to the thriving of terrorism. The PDP patron is on record to have eulogized organizations like Hamas and has asked people of Kashmir to emulate it. The leaders of PDP have described terrorists as freedom fighters and martyrs. He mischievously equates Kashmir with the Palestinian issue. He forgets that the Palestinians are the dispossessed people, as are the displaced Hindus of Kashmir. He gloats over the fact that Kashmir is over-empovered in all spheres reducing the other regions of the state into subject territories. The movement which PDP wants the world to recognize as a freedom movement, is primarily a movement for the destruction of the basic freedoms of the humankind and its first expression was the genocide of Kashmiri Hindus. Panun Kashmir condemns the statement of Mufti Mohd Sayad in its entire content and context. Panun Kashmir once again reiterates that the agitation in Jammu is an agitation against the forces of intolerance and communalism who have transformed J&K State as a prison house for the Hindus of the state and all other diversities that do not subscribe to the politics of exclusivism. __._,_.___ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 09:56:55 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 09:56:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu intifada Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808022126y6882961ep1c5e1256f1b9f2c4@mail.gmail.com> Images can have a profound impact and make a lasting impression even on the most cynical among us. They can also act as a force multiplier in a conflict zone. Recall the photographs and television footage of teenaged Palestinian boys in Gaza and the West Bank confronting Israeli tanks armed with no more than shepherd's slings; of young men, their faces half-covered with handkerchiefs and kafiyeh, racing through billowing clouds of tear gas to hurl stones at soldiers armed with assault rifles; of middle-aged and old women violating police pickets and defying curfew. That was the first time we heard of a little-used Arabic word, intifada, which literally means to shake off but in recent times has come to mean a rebellion premised on the Biblical tale of David vanquishing Goliath, a relentless mass protest born of festering anger, deep-seated grievance and overwhelming, uncontrollable rage. We are witnessing a similar intifada in Jammu province where young and old, men and women, are locked in an unequal battle with the police — and, since Friday, the Army — demanding the immediate revocation of the Government order cancelling the transfer of 800 kanals of land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board. The land was meant for creating temporary facilities for pilgrims who trek to the Amarnath shrine every year, braving inclement weather and jihadi attacks. This time, it's a Hindu intifada, an outpouring of pent-up anger which has brought life in Jammu and other towns and villages in the province to a standstill. It's been more than a month that the Hindus of Jammu have taken to the streets, burning tyres, taunting policemen, braving tear gas and real bullets, violating curfew and blockading the highway to Srinagar. The images emanating from Jammu are eerily similar to those that emanated from Gaza and the West Bank during the Palestinian intifada. More tellingly, the tactics that have been adopted by the protesters are those that have often brought Kashmir Valley to a standstill. If you look at the photographs of the Hindu intifada, you will get a sense of how Jammu has decided to give Kashmir a taste of its own medicine — in this case it is Dum Dum dawai. Read complete article at http://kanchangupta.blogspot.com/2008/08/jammu-erupts-in-rage.html From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 12:42:32 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 12:42:32 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Cable TV & SMS services stopped in Jammu Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808030012i63c1b538n726c6419ca6062d@mail.gmail.com> http://naknews.co.in/newsdet.aspx?q=15659 From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 3 21:29:06 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 08:59:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Release of My Book Message-ID: <227519.9779.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear All, You will be happy to learn that my book of collection of poems is being relesed at 5.30 pm on 9th August'2008 at Speaker Hall, Constitution Club,Rafi Marg,New Delhi.You are cordially invited to grace the occasion. With warm regards, Prabhakar Cell : +91-9818059776 Phone : +91-11-26112626 Address : K-6-3,M.S.Flats,Sector : 13,                R.K.Puram,New Delhi - 110066 Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From yasir.media at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 00:55:08 2008 From: yasir.media at gmail.com (=?WINDOWS-1256?Q?yasir_~=ED=C7_=D3=D1?=) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 12:25:08 -0700 Subject: [Reader-list] well... In-Reply-To: <5af37bb0808031224t36355d03nc6d879b2a5bb2803@mail.gmail.com> References: <5af37bb0808031202t53bdfe45xfe37d042923e1654@mail.gmail.com> <5af37bb0808031224t36355d03nc6d879b2a5bb2803@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5af37bb0808031225j7ccded47p1a2430bd7fdd04a9@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 12:02 PM, yasir ~يا سر wrote: > Unusual as this declaration seems at first sight, by the end of this > book I found myself wondering whether it was not perhaps insisted upon > by the lawyers, as a kind of indemnity clause. In Defense of Lost > Causes is mostly concerned with a critical diagnosis of the current > progressive political climate. According to Žižek, the contemporary > left is in a bad way, weakened by an enervating cocktail of Western > Buddhism, jogging, bodybuilding, "hedonist permissivity" and > multicultural orgies. But this immoral and decadent situation is > temporary. "The time is coming," he says, "for the Left to > (re)appropriate discipline and the spirit of sacrifice: there is > nothing inherently 'fascist' about these values." Not even pausing to > invent a marching song, Žižek goes on to propose that the left take > over the Catholic cult of martyrdom and canonize Che Guevara--as if > the millions of Che posters and postcards plastered all over > university student dorm rooms (I myself used to own one, before moving > on to a shelf full of Žižek books) haven't already secured him pop > sainthood enough. Žižek's search for redemptive change also leads him > to the Nazi party for inspiration. "There is a lesson," he writes, "to > be learned from Hermann Goering's reply, in the early 1940s, to a > fanatical Nazi who asked him why he protected a well-known Jew from > deportation: 'In this city, I decide who is a Jew!'... In this city, > it is we who decide what is left." The term 'counter-intuitive' is > often pinned to Žižek's chest like a medal. In this case I propose > either a Grand Cross of the Iron Cross, or else a Purple Heart. > http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080721/miller > > > > > This is the update from Naveena Textile Mills, Thokar Niaz Beg, > Lahore. Following is a detailed account from Comrade Taimur: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Taimur Rahman > Date: Aug 2, 2008 9:11 PM > Subject: [cmkp] An account of a strike and our arrest > > Defense Road which is on the outskirts of Lahore is a massive > industrial area where thousands of workers are employed. Since it is a > long way from the city, it is a lawless area where the police and > local administration is often in collusion with local gangsters, > capitalists and landlords. Poor people have little or no rights in the > area. The working class in this area is almost completely > non-unionized (in fact most don't know what a union is). Most workers > in the area are first generation workers that have arrived from > various villages all over the Punjab and live together in small > cramped quarters. They send money back to their families in villages > and try to eke out a meagre existence in the cities. > > The CMKP has been working in this area for the last 12 years. We have > seen the area change slowly. We have seen the roads develop. Farm land > change into estates for the wealthy. Massive schemes that have robbed > people of land in order to feed the land mafia. A flyover is now being > constructed over the area. When we started work in the area more than > a decade ago, it was nearly impossible to form any sort of collective > action. Workers were illiterate and most believed that there was no > possibility of standing up to the ruling class, police, or local > badmash. > > We continued our work patiently and with great persistence. Gradually > our organization began to expand from a handful of individuals to a > group of workers. We endlessly leafleted the area. Hundreds of > thousands of left-wing leaflets have been distributed in the area on > workers problems. We performed plays in the area. We performed musical > programs in the area. We organized left-wing mushairas (poetry > recitals) in the area. We lobbied the labour courts on specific > issues. We distributed left-wing photocopied books in the area. We > have had an endless number of study circles, corner meetings, hotel > meetings, quarter meetings, house to house visits, and so on in the > area. We participated in election campaigns in the area. Gradually we > became strong enough to even build a worker financed party office. > Today we are proud to say that we have members and sympathizers in the > entire area. Our supporters run in thousands and we have built a > left-wing working class > constituency. > > The comrades of the All Pakistan Trade Union Federation, Working > Women's Organization, and Communist Mazdoor Kissan Party, who enjoy a > very close working relationship under the banner of the Mazdoor Action > Committee, decided to launch a concerted campaign on the issue of the > provision of minimum wages. The minimum wage of Rs. 6000 is rarely > paid in the area. > > Workers at Naveena textiles (a very large company that exports shirts) > were being laid off without proper notification. Moreover, minimum > wages were not being paid to workers at this factory. The workers > demanded that all their dues, including both wages and gratuity, be > cleared on the basis of the recently announced minimum wages (i.e. Rs. > 6000). > > As a result on the 28th of July we helped to organize a strike. The > response by the mill administration was that the local police was > called out and workers were beaten black and blue. Warning shots were > fired at the feet of the workers. It was more than obvious that the > police was totally partial to the mill owners. > > We helped organize a second strike on the 31st of July. However, this > time the police had been called at 6 am in the morning and had > completely occupied the entire building. The buses of workers were > moved into the gates and under police supervision inside the factory > they were made to work. Workers that had been illegally laid off > assembled outside the premises and were beaten brutally. Four workers > were taken into custody. > > CMKP comrades called the press. My wife and I arrived minutes before > the press and we were greeted some distance from the factory by > workers with a roar of approval, handshakes, hugs, smiles, tears, > followed by militant slogans. After the arrival of the press, we > decided to go back to the factory gate. The police did not dare attack > in the presence of the press. We stood at the gate raising slogans, > clapping, and chanting in rhythm. We could see from the factory gate > that police men with guns were stationed on the roof top of the > factory. Police also cordoned the smaller gate (the larger gate was > shut tight). And police also stood behind us and to our sides. But we > were not afraid. > > Then a new sight gripped our attention. Workers from inside the > factory, having heard the commotion outside, left work and all came to > the roof. We shouted out to them, if you are with us raise your hands, > raise slogans with us. To our utter delight every single one of them > raised their hands. The entire roof was now full of hundreds of > workers and hundreds were outside with us. Waving to each other. But > they could not come down because a heavy police presence was inside > the factory. > > The managers of the factory came out and said "this is all a giant > misunderstanding". But workers would have none of their sweet talk. > Workers demanded that their comrades beaten and arrested that morning > be released before any negotiations. Management tried to talk but they > were drowned out by slogans. After some time management relented and > released the workers to the roaring crowd. Management then invited the > press inside the building. Some CMKP members and later the main labour > leaders accompanied them to the office. Inside, the press grilled them > with questions. One manager said that this was all the work of > sharpasand elements (subversives). Another began to accuse the press > of being biased (interestingly he is the father of a colleague of mine > from the university where I am a faculty member (LUMS) -- it was Moin > Cheema's father). The press demanded a tour of the premises. They > argued that workers had signed a contract but they had to relent when > we pointed out that their contract violated the labour laws of the > country that guaranteed a minimum wage of Rs. 6000. They could not > concede in front of all those cameras that they were willing to > violate labour laws. Finally, they stated that they accepted the > demands of the workers and informed us that they would speak to the > owners and announce the date of the clearance. We were suspicious but > decided to allow them time to talk to the owner. > > We came back outside and saw that comrades of the All Pakistan Trade > Union Federation had also arrived. They gave us very sound advice. > They said that we must immediately register the union and that we must > request a labour court officer to come immediately to the factory. > They called the labour court people and we announced this news to the > workers. > > By now we were standing around in small dispersed groups in front of > the factory gate (no one was even close to the road). Speeches and > slogans had all come to an end. We were waiting for the factory > management to announce the date of clearance. The press had gone away. > We saw the police filing out of the gate. I thought that they were > going back to the station since the matter had been settled. As a > precaution I asked our main labour leader Azam Naqvi to come stand > next to me and to not be alone at any moment. Suddenly and without > warning the police charged at Azam. I instinctively jumped between him > and the police and he grabbed onto me from behind for protection. > Workers had formed a right group behind us to protect Azam and we were > not letting go of each other. I protested vehemently. A rain of > lathis, kicks, and slaps came towards me. > > Since I was in the front and was extremely vocal, I was getting the > vast majority of them. The SHO Farooq Awam (a huge fat but strong man) > let down a lathi squarely on my head. I don't exaggerate when I say > that it only felt like I had been brushed with a straw. I was so angry > and incensed at that point that I couldn't feel anything. I let out a > few explicative and started fighting his subsequent strokes. Ali Jan, > Rafaqat, and others jumped into the lathis to try and protect us. From > behind I released that plain clothes police men were inside our group > trying to separate our group. I grabbed one of them, he punched me in > the face. Didn't hurt. Just made me even more angry. At one point I > grabbed a lathi from one end but couldn't hold on to it as I need my > arms to ward off the other lathis. From behind me I heard a sharp loud > explosion. It was shots being fired into the ground. From the corner > of my eye I thought I saw some smoke and workers running helter > skelter. It took me a few minutes to realize that shots had been fired > to disperse the crowds. > > By now our outnumbered (but unbroken) group was being pushed towards > the police car (we were still being hit from all sides but it didn't > hurt). By the time we reached the police car, both the police and our > group were gasping for air. I thought to myself, I need to pace my > stamina, and exhaust these people (funny how one thinks these strange > things in the middle of such situations). By now we were at back of > the police van. I looked inside to see Ali Jan had already been > arrested. I grabbed the railing of the van and resolved to not let go. > The police pushed and pushed but could not budge us. Then one police > officer cracked down on my left hand with his lathi. I got so angry I > held out my hand and said "x,y,z phir mar, ley mera haath phir mar". > He did not hit me again (in fact later he became quite sympathetic to > us). Several policemen grabbed my arms and tried to lift us again. > They forgot my feet. I hooked my feet at the bottom of the van and > they failed to lift > us yet again. Finally, they grabbed my legs and arms and lifted me > clear off the ground. This time we were overpowered (as I think back, > it must have been that our small linked group must have been broken > from the back in order for them to be able to do that. My shoe came > off. As they threw me into the van, I said "give me back my shoe" (as > I think back I laugh at my own funny reactions and thoughts). > > Five of us had now been hauled into the van (Ali Jan, Rafaqat, Azam, > Bilal, myself). Bilal was bleed from the ear. Azam's jeans were > totally torn from the back. Ali Jan and myself held their hands and > said "don't be afraid, we are with you". The van was moving and > Rafaqat started raising slogans, we all joined him. The super cool Ali > Jan started an entire speech in the van. He berated the police for > their class biases. He started an entire CMKP study circle in the dam > van. An argument broke out between the police and ourselves. We > appealed to their working class roots and for them to realize that > they were doing the wrong thing. On the one hand I was participating > in the debate and on the other I was looking at and massaging my > swollen left hand index finger thinking "I better get my guitar > playing hand fixed for Laal, otherwise I won't be able to finish the > recording" (incredibly stupid I know but such are the joys of being > arrested, it takes a while to > come to put things in perspective). > > When we got to the station the SHO (the man with whom I was in direct > confrontation at the factory gate) turned to me and said "tera tay > main hunain hi chitrol karan ga". My instinctive reaction was to say > "x,y,z hunay kar" but I realized that would be pretty stupid. So I > blurted "kis bunyad par konsa qanoon torra hai hum nay". He turned to > one of the bulky police men and said "chitrol kar ida". He replied > "nahin sir". "Ki matlab". He didn't explain just repeated "nahin sar" > again (I assume the implication was that 'these are influential people > it would not be a wise move'). He turned to Azam and said "jagga nahin > lain diyan ga main tenu". Ali Jan said "Jagga kon sa ji, qanooni > haqooq mangay hain". After a short argument they marched us to a small > room. As I was walking I got a text from my wife "I love you, please > don't fight them". It made me realize that she was safe and it gave me > strength. > > Very soon comrade Ilyas of the All Pakistan Trade Union Federation > also joined us. He had been kidnapped by the security guards of the > factory. Taken inside. Beaten up, slapped around. And then they had > dropped him to the police in their private car. When he came into the > cell he said in his characteristically calm tone "at least I came in > an AC car". We burst out laughing. Other prisoners were amazed that we > were joking around. > > They came to take down our names. I was still so angry that when they > asked me for my quom (caste) I replied I had none and that I did not > believe in such things. When they asked me again Ali Jan responded > "likh dain insaaniyat". Then they came to take our mobile phones. At > first I resisted but then I realized that it was pointless (I didn't > have any credit in it anyway and our comrades knew where we were and > must be working for our release). So I gave in when they came back a > second time for it. > > To boost our morale we started singing songs and reciting poetry. It > is difficult to remember the words to songs when one is in such > situations. Even tunes get jumbled up. But they immediately brought a > calm to our nerves and lifted our spirit. From our small window we > heard a policemen remark "aye qaidi bathain nay?". We laughed and said > "aye labour leader bathain nay". > > I looked out the window and saw a black car. I said "its 's car" > (although I wasn't 100% sure). We called out from the window. Maana > radical saw us. The other prisoners said don't let them know that you > have communicated, stay quiet. In a little while we saw Farooq Tariq > walk in. This lifted our spirits even more. We knew that news was out > and it would be impossible now for them to beat us. M. managed to get > some GEO and other media people into the cell. By now we were fully > relaxed. I jokingly remarked "I hope they haven't told my mother, unho > nain police ko bhi tun daina hai aur humain bhi". We all laughed. > > A young policeman came and sat with us and we had a long discussion > with him on politics and the police. He was defending his actions > against workers and abusing the rich, defending torture in police > custody and speaking about his own misfortunes at the hands of > stronger men, defending the Taliban and the attack on Laal Masjid, > defending the Saudi monarchy and Musharraf, waving the nationalist > flag and cursing the country. All contradictory positions that he kept > in stead to pick and choose from depending on what his superiors > decided. All these positions were, nonetheless, supporting one or > another form of authoritarianism. He pointed to one of the four people > that was in the cell and told us proudly that he had tortured one > person to confess his crime. Their crimes were having stolen some > goats two years ago. One boy from Multan had come from work. The hotel > he worked at said that he had to give Rs 500 security to work. So he > made an attempt to steal > something from a factory but failed. The tortured boy submissively > responded to the policeman's humiliating questions in a self-effacing > manner that was difficult for me to absorb. But as soon as the > policeman turned he murmured a punjabi gali under his breadth. His > spirit was not broken and I could feel his hatred exuding from his > eyes. We offered them drinks that our comrades had brought for us, Ali > Jan sat on the floor with them (the rest of us were sitting on a bed > and some broken chairs). Rafaqat said "agli dafa factory tu chori na > karo, munazam ho jao, factory hi tuwadi ho jai gi". > > Then the door opened and in stepped my mother looking like she could > eat up any policeman that so much as looked at her. She came and sat > down and said in a loud voice "han ji kiya tamasha banaya hua hai > yehan". The policeman responded "madam mujhay tu kuch maloom nahin". > She said "tu phir mera waqt kyun zaya kar rahay ho, jao us khotay ko > lay kar aao jis ko maloom hai". They went running and produced the > second in command Ghumman. He said "ji baji aap kyun ayeen hain > yehan". She said "yeh main aap ko batao, aap mujhay batai keh main > kyun aye hun yehan. Kidhar hay SHO?" "Vo ji baji round par gaye hain" > he very meekly responded. One of the workers said "Naveena factory > wapis gaye hai". My mother forcefully said "Paisay khain hain tum sab > logon nay malikon say, ghareeb logon ko haqooq nahin daitay ho, hum > sab jantay hain, daikhna tum logon ko mun ke khani parrhay gi, hum > kais karray gay, tum daikhtay raho". > > Then she left to meet the investigating officer. We could hear the > shouts in our cell. Investigating officer ki tu vo ke that even Farooq > Tariq came to our cell (I assume because he couldn't contain his > smile). He expressed solidarity and said with a smile "aap ki walda > bhi larr rahin hain". We laughed and said "han ji, aasarat yehan tak > puhanch rahay hain". Farooq was on the phone constantly ringing up the > DSP, the SP and all his contacts (including AMP contacts). Brigadier > Rao Abid of the HRCP called and took the whole report. > > By now they released us from the little room and allowed us roam > around in the courtyard. Ali and I were limping from a knee and ankle > sprain but we were happy to be sitting with our comrades U., Maana, > M.. The other four needed to go to the toilet. The toilet was in the > hawalat (jail). When they went inside the policemen shut them inside > (they forced Ilyas into the hawalat). Ali and I discovered after a few > minutes what had happened and it made us very tense. We knew then that > the plan of the police was to separate us from the workers and to > later beat the workers. > > In a little while my father, Gulzar Chaudhry of the All Pakistan Trade > Union Federation, more media people, and the SHO all arrived. Gulzar > sahib said to me "chalo acha hua Taimur tum pakrray gaiy, is tarrha > mulakat tu ho gaye. Fiqr na karo, if they don't release you by tonight > hum pooray union ka zor lagain gay." > > Negotiations began. The police said "take one person you consider most > important, take Taimur, but we cannot go of the rest." My father said > "you mean you think my son is a bhagorra? Do you think he will go or > we will ask him to do that? We support him 100%. He has raised the > voice of the oppressed." When the DSP said the same thing to my mother > she responded "aap ka khiyal hai main nay chuya pala hai, vo > principles ki larray larr raha hai, aur yeh na samjhain kay hum us kay > saath nahin hain, hum bhi us kay saath hain." The SHO said "daikhain > ji main tu kuch nahin kar sakta main tu aik SHO hun, officer kahin tu > SHO phook say urrh jata hai". My father responded very calmly (Al > Pachino style) "phoonk say hi tu bachanay aye hain hum". I swear I > have never been more proud of my parents in my entire life. > > I had another altercation with the SHO when we discussing the > conditions of the release. He said "Taimur sahib yeh criminal elements > aap ko shield bana kar use kar rahay hain. Aap putli banay huay hain". > I responded "SHO sahib, aik baat main aap ko bata dun, chahay aap ko > achi lagay ya burri, putli main nahin, aap banay huay hain" and I > walked out of his office. (Qasam say I should sell my dialogue to a > hindu movie). > > Finally, after many phone calls from various government offices > (including the CM), they decided that they will let us go for the > night but only on the condition that we come back to the police > station in the morning and surrender to the magistrate. > > They had cut an FIR against us for four charges (one of which it turns > out has been repealed anyway). These included blocking the road, > beating up a police officer in a pathrao, burning tyres on the road > (all lies). They led us to believe that they will drop the case. But > they were tricking us yet again. They were trying to negotiate the > pressure from both sides. Obviously they had been taking a lot of > money from Naveena textiles. Nonetheless, they released us at night > and we came home to sleep. > > In the morning we went back to the station. However, when it came time > to go to the court they placed us in handcuffs. They said "oh this is > a formality, we have to follow court procedures". We didn't know that > the crimes we had been charged with were minor crimes that did not > require handcuffs. They did this to humiliate us. But at that moment, > we unaware of their intention and were joking around. Taking pictures > and in high spirits. In the van, we sang revolutionary songs (we sang > them completely out of tune but it didn't matter at all, the louder > the better). At this time the sangli of the handcuff was in our own > hands. We were buffed in pairs (Ali and myself, Rafakat and Billal, > Azam and Ilyas). > > When we were herded in to the magistrate office, one of the HRCP > lawyers Asad was outraged. He said "how dare you handcuff these > people. None of the crimes registered against them are serious > offenses. This is totally ridiculous. Remove the handcuffs." The > police refused. It was then that we realized that this was not a > formality but a deliberate intent to humiliate us (little did they > know that we wore those handcuffs with pride). DAWN news was present. > We went to the camera and said "We asked for minimum wage, and this is > what we got" (we raised our handcuffs). Then we burst out into > revolutionary slogans, songs, and poetry. The courtyard rang out with > socialist slogans. > > Meanwhile six lawyers argued our case voluntarily. Asad, Azeem > Daniyal, Rabea Bajwa (and two others whose names I cannot remember). > Interestingly, the case against us was cut by the police (i.e. the > police was the complainant). Yet the lawyers that appeared in court > against us were from Naveena textile. In fact, they were accompanied > by the factory manager (hence the need for handcuffs on us, to > humiliate us and show that their money was getting its worth). This > demonstrates who was behind the entire police violence. It > demonstrates that the local police has completely sold out to the mill > owners. Naveena's lawyers argued that we had a lethal weapon in our > possession during the strike and hence we should not be given bail but > should be put in jail. The magistrate (Aasha Tariq) did not agree and > the bail was set at Rs. 40,000 per person. The lawyers said "take our > high court bar license as zamanat". They got us our bail without any > difficulty. The court > had now adjourned for the day. When our lawyers asked the police to > open the cuffs. They at first delayed. There was a sharp altercation. > Finally, they opened my cuffs but they would not open Azam's cuff. > They said that there was yet another FIR against Azam hence he had to > remain in custody. We were about to lose our cool when Azeem Dainyal > saved the day. He said "produce the FIR, we will get the bail right > now". He went inside the chamber and asked the magistrate to come out > again (Magistrate Aasha Tariq). She immediately issued another bail > and said to the police "release him at once". We were much relieved. > The intention of the police was to get rid of the five of us but take > Azam back to the station in order to beat up. But they failed and we > are free once again. > > The case will go on and the struggle will also go on. Please do not > think that the worst is over. Support our struggle for minimum wages. > > I also want to thank a number of people that had been working day and > night to get us out. I want to thank as many people as possible by > name for helping us get out of police custody. I want to thank > > The workers of Naveena who went back to the factory gate and continued > to protest after the police arrested us. And are still struggling. > > Our ja nasheen comrades of the All Pakistan Trade Union Federation and > Working Women's Organization that were not only working for our > release but were in jail with us every step of the way. > > Asma Jehangir, Brig. Rao Abid and the HRCP that kicked into high gear > and sent a team of lawyers for our defense. > > Our superb legal team, including Azeem Daniyal, Asad Jamal, Rabea > Bajwa, Chaudhry Nawaz and one other whose name has slipped my mind. > They were as amazing as we were clueless. Were it not for them, Azam > would have been back in police custody recovering from torture. For > them and others we raised the slogan "mazdoor wukla ittehad, > zindabad". > > Afzal Khamosh of the Mazdoor Kissan Party, with whom we split in 2003 > and have been at loggerheads since then, held a press conference the > very next day for our release. This act means a huge thing to us. > > Farooq Tariq who was present in the thana as soon as he heard about > the incident and was with us for nearly the whole day. Furthermore, > LPP that mobilized for our support in Karachi and other areas. > > Dr. Riaz and International Socialists, whom we have berated endlessly > on our email list, demonstrated the very next day in Karachi. > > Somia Sadiq, who is no longer with our party, but was in constant > contact with us, offering us help, support and solidarity. > > Nusrat Jamil, Jeelo Jamil, and Tehmina Durrani who moved the CM and > the governors office to put pressure on the police from above. Ahmed > Rashid, Samina Rahman, Zaki Rahman, Women's Action Forum, PILER, > Anjuman Muzareen Punjab all issued statements or called us in > solidarity. > > Last but not least, my parents who fought with us like Bolshevik > agitators. Their fearlessness gave me even more courage and I have > never been more proud of them in my entire life. My wife Mahvash who > saw the entire episode of violence but refused to be intimidated. > > Finally my party comrades (too many to name) from all over Pakistan > and internationally that rose up to defend us against state > oppression. Although they would consider it somewhat of an offense if > we thanked them "leh shuriya kis cheez ka, aren't we party members, > this is our duty" they have all said to me. Nonetheless, thank you > comrades. Without your support we could not have fought this struggle. > > In solidarity > Taimur Rahman > > ------------------------------------ > > fwd end/// > From rashneek at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 09:35:07 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 09:35:07 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] KPs and facts In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808020241n4078c7a1pf5fc2ebda46eaff0@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808020241n4078c7a1pf5fc2ebda46eaff0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808032105u11c7a77fib2818c7606e1e30b@mail.gmail.com> Just goes on to show that Pandits are not a monolith and thanfully each one reatins his/her individuality as a thinking being. On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 3:11 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Divided House, Delayed Return > > Deep fissures in the Kashmiri Pandit community stand in the way of > government efforts to rehabilitate them, reports PEERZADA ARSHAD HAMID > > http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp > > SANJAY TIKOO, a Kashmiri Pandit living in Barbar Shah, Srinagar, > braved all odds and remained in the valley when thousands of Pandits > left their motherland. It was 1990 and the armed insurgency in Kashmir > had begun, followed by press releases in newspapers ordering Hindus to > leave. > No one home Most of the high-security government flats built > exclusively for returning Pandits have found no takers Photo:Javed Dar > > The Tikoo family were defiant and resolute. They would not migrate. > They weathered the pressure and fear and lived on in their ancestral > home. Eighteen years later, those days remain vivid for Sanjay. He > clearly remembers the prolonged strike calls, the curfews and, above > all, the migration of fellow Pandits from the valley. > > Sanjay credits his mother for the decision. "I thank the women of my > house and, particularly, my mother, who gave her steadfast support to > our decision. If either she or my sister had shown even the slightest > weakness, we too would have fled, forced to uproot ourselves," muses > Sanjay. > > The Tikoos were soon singled out. A threatening letter was nailed to > the entrance of their house. Sanjay clearly remembers that fateful > day. > > "It was July 16, 1990. I had gone to the top floor of my house to > smoke a cigarette. While pacing up and down, I saw a group of people > reading something on our gate. I rushed down and brought the message > in," recalls Sanjay. > > At about the same time, posters purportedly written by militants > became ubiquitous. Along with threats such as the one Sanjay's family > received, they contained strike calls and reports of militant > activities. Disturbed, Sanjay discussed the letter with his family and > then approached a local Urdu newspaper, which published the letter > along with his family's decision: they would not leave the valley and > were willing to face the consequences. Thereafter, a group of > militants belonging to the Al-Umar Commandos approached the family and > denied having issued the letter. This increased the confidence of the > family and encouraged them to stay back. > > The relief department of the state government estimates that 56,148 > families, including a few Muslim families — approximately 2.5 lakh > people — migrated from their homes following the armed insurgency > during the period 1989- 92. Of this, 34,690 families went to Jammu and > 19,338 to New Delhi. While police records say 209 Pandits were killed > in Kashmir in the past 18 years, Pandit organisations put the figure > at about 1,100. An estimated 20,000 Pandit families, however, > preferred to stay. > > These people occupied scattered pockets in urban and rural areas, > detached from each other. This forsaken community faced difficulties > in their social life that were felt acutely during marriages, > religious functions and, most of all, when performing the last rites > for their dead. > > "During the initial years, finding brides for our sons was difficult > as few migrants were ready to send their daughters back to the valley. > There were no priests to perform prayers. However, the situation is > now improving and people don't consider marriages to families in the > valley that dangerous," Tikoo says. > > Sanjay initiated efforts to unite Pandit families and strengthen their > interaction. He and his friends founded the Kashmiri Pandit Sangharsh > Samiti (KPSS), which is undertaking a census of Pandits in the valley. > They advocate the safe return of Pandits and oppose government plans > to give Pandits high-security residential flats. > > "The government has constructed separate buildings and has given CRPF > security to them. However, this is an effort to create a Palestine- > Israel type divide in Kashmir," asserts Tikoo. > > The KPSS is also critical of hard-line Pandit organisations like Panun > Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir, because of their demand for a separate > homeland in Kashmir, northeast of the Jhelum. The KPSS considers > Kashmir a political problem and a dispute between India and Pakistan. > > Panun Kashmir believes that the insurgency was a communal riot > engineered by Islamic fundamentalists to drive the minority Hindus > from the valley. They accuse Muslims of ethnic cleansing. Panun > Kashmir has demanded land along the Jhelum in south Kashmir to be > secured to build colonies for Pandits. The group also wants this zone > to be made a Union Territory. > > "Our community has suffered badly. We have been uprooted from our > homeland and unless adequate arrangements are made, we won't go back > and will continue our fight for our rights. Residential flats are not > the solution — that's just moving us from one camp to another. Our > return to our motherland should be final and secure, so that we will > not be forced to leave again," asserts Ajay Chrangoo, Chairman, Panun > Kashmir. Chrangoo has been living in Jammu since his migration and > strongly advocates a separate homeland. > > Chrangoo refers to flats constructed at Mattan in South Kashmir and at > Sheikhpora on the outskirts of Srinagar that the state government has > spent crores on, in order to coax Pandits to return. No Jammu Pandits > were ready to return here, and most flats remain locked. > > Another voice representing the migrant community is the All India > Kashmiri Samaj. Headed by Ram Krishan Bhat, it works to keep the > Kashmiri sentiment alive among Pandit youth. Though he praises the > Pandits who remained in the valley and calls them "daring", he says > their continued presence in the valley is not enough to convince other > Pandits to return. > > Chrangoo disagrees. "There is nothing special in some Pandits staying > back. While some members of the community stay behind in conflict > zones where there is a mass exodus, this can't obscure the bigger > picture — the fact that most Pandits have fled. Moreover, those who > remain, remain in fear," he adds. > > > THE LARGE numbers of Pandit groups — representing migrants and > non-migrants — claiming to fight for the rights of Pandits have > confused people both in India and abroad. The clamour of voices has > added to the complexity of the issue. While all groups claim to > represent the aspirations of Kashmiri Pandits, all of them differ on > when, where and how Pandits should return. "Pandits are as divided as > the Muslims are," quips Sanjay Tikoo. > > Sanjay Saraf, a migrant politician, adds another dimension to the > debate. Saraf plans to contest the coming assembly elections and is > state president of the Lok Jan Shakti Party. > > Recently, national and regional parties from outside the state have > started making inroads here. The elections will see candidates from > the SP and the BSP, who have held rallies in Srinagar. > > Saraf, however, relies more on Muslim votes than on Pandit ones. > Though he is a migrant, he has been visiting the valley regularly for > the past seven years for party meetings and constituency visits. He is > critical of Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir that are headquartered > outside Kashmir and describes them as stooges of fundamentalist > forces. "They are dancing to the tune of the BJP and the VHP and are > trying to create a communal wedge," Saraf alleges. > > The divide among Pandits deepened during the recent crisis over land > for the Amarnath shrine board. While most Pandit organisations based > in Jammu and New Delhi favoured the transfer of land to the board, the > valley-based KPSS stood alone in its demand for the pilgrimage to be > placed under resident Kashmiri Pandit organisations. Saraf supported > this demand from the beginning. "Pandits cannot remain outside the > valley and pay mere lip service to the cause. We have to be here to > say we belong to the land. Raising a hue and cry while staying outside > hardly matters," avers Sanjay Saraf, while acknowledging KPSS' > efforts. > > Ideological differences have increased the divide between migrant > Pandits and those who stayed back. Eighteen years after Pandits fled > the valley, various groups continue to pursue their own agendas and a > consensus remains elusive. > > WRITER'S E-MAIL > peerzadaarshad at gmail.com > From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 31, Dated Aug 09, 2008 > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From rashneek at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 09:44:55 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 09:44:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph Message-ID: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> Stay away, Pandits told OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has announced his return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the exiled Kashmiri Pandit community not to return home. A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media agencies in Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the Valley unless New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to return to the Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' return, leave Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by Syed Salahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the name of Muslim Mujahideen. He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending several years behind bars. "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again and, if the reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after around a decade," a police official said. Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then declared the Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area of south Kashmir. "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it does not revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore will be resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist leaders who are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the return of Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package estimated at Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 3 13:02:24 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 13:02:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Internal emergency in Jammu! In-Reply-To: <20080803072026.18231.qmail@f4mail-235-135.rediffmail.com> References: <20080803072026.18231.qmail@f4mail-235-135.rediffmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808030032p70fcf001r16233a65ae0ce68e@mail.gmail.com> Leaders under house arrest . Most of them are likely to be arrested today. Cable TV services blocked in Jammu. SMS services snapped. Jammu Under EMERGENCY rule.! ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Ashwani Kumar Date: Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 12:50 PM Subject: Internal emergency in Jammu! > Dear friends, You are requested to float the news across about the latest developments as on date about Jammu. There is already curfew in Jammu, hundreds have been injured, some arrests have been made, leaders are under house arrest, media channels have been taken over by the police, pressmen have been manhandled and no free movement is allowed. We are expecting the administration to go to any extent. -Ashwani, Jammu 3rd August 2008, 12.45 PM From blueskyandus at rediffmail.com Sun Aug 3 15:42:09 2008 From: blueskyandus at rediffmail.com (tangella madhavi) Date: 3 Aug 2008 10:12:09 -0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Screening of my documentary film Message-ID: <20080803101209.7812.qmail@f5mail-236-228.rediffmail.com> Hi! My film Listen Little Man will be screened on DD News on 9th August at 10.30pm. Please do watch it and let others know. Regards Tangella Madhavi Listen Little Man 28mins, 2007 Listen Little Man explores the tradition of ragging through the experiences of those students have protested against it. What unfolds is a connection between ragging and larger forms of violence in society emerging from following orders without questioning them. Direction Location Sound: Tangella Madhavi Camera: Pankaj Rishi Kumar Sound Mixing: Pritam Das Editing: Pankaj Rishi Kumar Research Production: Priyanka Desai Producer: PSBT From elkamath at yahoo.com Sun Aug 3 09:49:27 2008 From: elkamath at yahoo.com (lalitha kamath) Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2008 21:19:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Fwd: 5th Global Labour University Conference-- Call for Papers Message-ID: <934137.92627.qm@web53610.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Decent Work Social Justice Fair Globalization _______________________ Call for Papers 5. Global Labour University Conference Tata Institute for Social Sciences Mumbai, India, 22-24 February 2009 Financialization of Capital – Deterioration of Working Conditions Submission of proposal for papers until 1 November 2008 Papers are invited that: a. Discuss trade unions’ innovative approaches and best practices of organizing workers in informal and precarious employment. b. Assess policies and organizing campaigns of trade unions to improve legal regulations, labour market institutions and social protection coverage to secure that all workers can effectively exercise their workplace and social rights. c. Analyse trade union research, policy, organizing and collective bargaining strategies which respond to the aggressive business strategies of global companies and financial institutions. Format The workshop will bring together an international group of scholars and trade unionists. It will feature working groups, paper presentations, and panel discussions involving both academics and trade unionists. Papers will be presented mainly in small interactive working groups to allow for in-depth discussion and development of ideas for possible future research and cooperation. A selected number of papers will be published in the 2009 GLU Yearbook The proposal should be a two to three page abstract that 1) states the name, address and institutional affiliation of the author/s; 2) outlines the main ideas; and 3) indicates what methodology will be used. Proposals for papers should be sent in electronic format by 1 November 2008 to: Dr. Sharit K. Bhowmik Centre for Labour Studies School of Management and Labour Studies Tata Institute of Social Sciences Deonar Mumbai, India 400 088 e-mail: glu.india at tiss.edu Internet: www.global-labour-university.org -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From iram at sarai.net Mon Aug 4 13:12:38 2008 From: iram at sarai.net (Iram Ghufran) Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2008 13:12:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: [Announcements]Video Journalism Awards call for entries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4896B2EE.5040309@sarai.net> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: > [Announcements]Video Journalism Awards call for entries > From: > "Video Journalism Awards" > Date: > Tue, 15 Jul 2008 13:13:03 -0000 > To: > infosouth at yahoogroups.com > > To: > infosouth at yahoogroups.com > > > > > deutscher Text unterhalb > > Please forward to people who are interested in video journalism. > Thank you! > > 4th International Video Journalism Awards, Mainz, Germany: > "Unlimited access" > > CALL FOR ENTRIES Deadline 15th of October 2008 > http://www.vjawards.com > > Go out - find a story – publish it: > The „4th International Video Journalism Awards" is calling for entries! > > The Video Journalism Awards is looking for non-fiction videos from > single authors, the so called videojournalists (short VJs). A VJ is > responsible for the whole creative process starting from research and > shooting as well as covering the whole process of editing and > sometimes even the publication of the film. > A small camcorder and a laptop are the tools of the VJ, which is > comparable to the pen and paper a newspaper journalist uses. > > The final deadline for entering films for the 4th International Video > Journalism Awards is the 15th of October 2008. The awards are produced > by vjawards.com , the host is ZDF German Television in Mainz. > > The internet is converging all kinds of media, which is reflected by > this year's theme "unlimited access". The awards try to cover all > known fields of video journalism: films from TV-stations and > publishing companies and productions from an independent background > are awarded with a total of 12.000 € of prize money going to the > seperated categories "independent and online" and "TV production". > Recent developements that influence the VJ-scene and future > perspectives are discussed in the supporting programme of the 4th > International Video Journalism Awards. > > INTERNATIONAL VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > a) TV production – broadcast reports (2000 €) > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters, > and which has already been broadcast. > > b) independent or online video (2000 €) > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters, > but which has not necessarily been broadcast. > > GERMAN VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > a) TV production - broadcast reports (2000 €) > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters and > which has been aired by a German-language television channel (please > indicate the station and broadcast date). All genres. > > b) Independent or online video (2000 €) > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters, > but which has not necessarily been broadcast. > > REPORTAGE AWARD (2500 €) > A feature report in the German language with a minimum duration of 15 > minutes and a maximum duration of 29 minutes, produced by one or more > video journalists/video reporters, but which has not necessarily been > broadcast. > > NEWCOMER VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD (1000 €) > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters. > The applicants must be under 30 years of age or currently enrolled in > an institution of higher education. Those productions will be > considered for awards whose appeal lies in a unique style of content > or cinematography and indicate a great potential of the applicant. > > Online- audience prize (500 €) > A specially developed open online voting system will allow the users > to cast votes for their favorite entries. > > Special mentioning of the jury > The jury nominates a film, that impressed them, and that might expand > the term video journalism. > > Further information is provided on our website: > http://www.vjawards.com > > We look forward to your submissions > > Regards from all of us, > VJAwards.com > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > English version above > > Bitte weiterleiten an Personen die Interesse am Videojournalismus > haben. Danke! > > 4th International Video Journalism Awards, Mainz: > "Unlimited access" > > AUSSCHREIBUNG Deadline 15. Oktober 2008 > http://www.vjawards.com > > Go out - find a story – publish it: > Die „4th International Video Journalism Awards" rufen zur Teilnahme auf! > > Wir suchen dokumentarische Videos von einzeln arbeitenden > Autorenfilmern und Videojournalisten (kurz VJ). Idee, Dreh und Schnitt > liegen in der Verantwortung einer Person. Ein kompakter Camcorder und > ein Laptop sind für den VJ das, was für den Printjournalisten Stift > und Block ist. > Bis zum 15. Oktober können Beiträge zu den 4th International Video > Journalism Awards eingereicht werden. Ausrichter des Filmfestivals ist > vjawards.com . Als Gastgeber fungiert dieses Jahr das ZDF in Mainz. > > Das Motto dieser Awards lautet „Unlimited access". Der Award zeigt, > wo VJs zu finden sind: Filme von Fernsehsendern und Verlagen werden > zusammen mit Videos aus der freien Szene gezeigt und messen sich in > getrennten Wettbewerben um die attraktiven Geldpreise von insgesamt > 12000€. Damit findet das stark formatierte Tagesgeschäft der > Nachrichtensender in dem Wettbewerb ebenso seinen Platz, wie > Grenzen-überschreitende Beiträge von Journalisten. Diese einzigartige > Mischung verspricht ein spannendes Publikum und ein kontrastreiches > Filmprogramm. > Aktuelle inhaltliche und technische Entwicklungen, die die > Medienszenze bewegen und den Videojournalismus der Zukunft > beeinflussen- für diese und andere Diskurse bieten die 4th > International Video Journalism Awards ein umfassendes Rahmenprogramm. > > Die Preise für die eingereichten Filme werden in den Bereichen > „Independent und Online" und „TV-Produktion" vergeben. Dabei > bezeichnet „Independent und Online " freie Produktionen und > Auftragsproduktionen für das Internet. „TV-Produktion" sind Filme, die > als Auftragsproduktion von Sendeanstalten entstanden sind. > > Die Preise werden nach folgenden Gesichtspunkten vergeben: > > INTERNATIONAL VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > a) TV-Produktion – ausgestrahlte Beiträge (2000 €) > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert worden ist und bereits > ausgestrahlt wurde. > > b) Independent Film und Online (2000 €) > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert worden ist. Beitrag muss > nicht ausgestrahlt, kann aber für das Internet produziert worden sein. > > GERMAN VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > a) TV-Produktion – ausgestrahlte Beiträge (2000 €) > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert und von einem > deutschsprachigen Fernsehsender ausgestrahlt wurde (bitte Sender und > Ausstrahlungsdatum angeben!). Alle Genres sind zulässig. > > b) Independent Film und Online (2000 €) > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert wurde. Beitrag muss nicht > ausgestrahlt, kann aber für das Internet produziert worden sein. > > REPORTAGE AWARD (2500 €) > Deutschsprachige Reportage von mindestens 15 Minuten, höchstens 29 > Minuten Länge, die von einem oder mehreren Videojournalisten > produziert wurde. Die Reportage muss nicht ausgestrahlt worden sein. > > NEWCOMER VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD (1000 €) > Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert wurde. Die Bewerber müssen > unter 30 Jahre alt oder an einer Hochschule eingeschrieben sein. > Prämiert werden Arbeiten, die durch eine eigenständige inhaltliche > oder filmische Handschrift überzeugen und ein großes Potenzial des > Bewerbers erkennen lassen. > > Online- Zuschauerpreis (500 €) > Auf der Festivalseite www.vjawards.com können interessierte Zuschauer > ihren Lieblingsfilm mit einer guten Bewertung belohnen. > > Spezialpreis der Jury > Die Jury vergibt einen Spezialpreis für einen Film, der sie > beeindruckt, und unter Umständen sehr frei mit der Produktionsart > Videojournalismus umgeht. > > Alle weiteren Informationen finden Sie auf unserer Wettbewerbsseite. > http://www.vjawards.com > > Wir sind schon sehr gespannt auf Ihre VJ-Filme, > > Ihr > Video Journalism Awards Team > > _ > __,_._,___ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > announcements mailing list > announcements at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements > From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Mon Aug 4 13:15:29 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2008 12:45:29 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: [Announcements]Video Journalism Awards call forentries In-Reply-To: <4896B2EE.5040309@sarai.net> References: <4896B2EE.5040309@sarai.net> Message-ID: My nomination would go to that video journalist, who did a sting for CNNIBN about cash for votes, the channel which aimed at discrediting the BJP got stung, developed cold feet and handed over the tapes to Speaker of parliament after doctoring the tapes to save the political secretary Ahmed patel and amar Singh. After the Padmashri awards to Rajdeep the channel seems to be in pay back mode to Congress and using the best parliamentarian award winner Somnathda as a tool who has had no qualm in crossing over as speaker negating the national interest.? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Iram Ghufran Date: Monday, August 4, 2008 1:07 pm Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: [Announcements]Video Journalism Awards call forentries To: reader-list at sarai.net > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > > > Subject: > > [Announcements]Video Journalism Awards call for entries > > From: > > "Video Journalism Awards" > > Date: > > Tue, 15 Jul 2008 13:13:03 -0000 > > To: > > infosouth at yahoogroups.com > > > > To: > > infosouth at yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > > > deutscher Text unterhalb > > > > Please forward to people who are interested in video journalism. > > Thank you! > > > > 4th International Video Journalism Awards, Mainz, Germany: > > "Unlimited access" > > > > CALL FOR ENTRIES Deadline 15th of October 2008 > > http://www.vjawards.com > > > > Go out - find a story – publish it: > > The „4th International Video Journalism Awards" is calling for > entries!> > > The Video Journalism Awards is looking for non-fiction videos from > > single authors, the so called videojournalists (short VJs). A VJ is > > responsible for the whole creative process starting from > research and > > shooting as well as covering the whole process of editing and > > sometimes even the publication of the film. > > A small camcorder and a laptop are the tools of the VJ, which is > > comparable to the pen and paper a newspaper journalist uses. > > > > The final deadline for entering films for the 4th International > Video> Journalism Awards is the 15th of October 2008. The awards > are produced > > by vjawards.com , the host is ZDF German Television in Mainz. > > > > The internet is converging all kinds of media, which is > reflected by > > this year's theme "unlimited access". The awards try to cover all > > known fields of video journalism: films from TV-stations and > > publishing companies and productions from an independent background > > are awarded with a total of 12.000 € of prize money going to the > > seperated categories "independent and online" and "TV production". > > Recent developements that influence the VJ-scene and future > > perspectives are discussed in the supporting programme of the 4th > > International Video Journalism Awards. > > > > INTERNATIONAL VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > > > a) TV production – broadcast reports (2000 €) > > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters, > > and which has already been broadcast. > > > > b) independent or online video (2000 €) > > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters, > > but which has not necessarily been broadcast. > > > > GERMAN VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > > > a) TV production - broadcast reports (2000 €) > > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video > reporters and > > which has been aired by a German-language television channel (please > > indicate the station and broadcast date). All genres. > > > > b) Independent or online video (2000 €) > > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters, > > but which has not necessarily been broadcast. > > > > REPORTAGE AWARD (2500 €) > > A feature report in the German language with a minimum duration > of 15 > > minutes and a maximum duration of 29 minutes, produced by one or > more> video journalists/video reporters, but which has not > necessarily been > > broadcast. > > > > NEWCOMER VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD (1000 €) > > A journalistic or documentary report with a maximum duration of 15 > > minutes, produced by one or more video journalists/video reporters. > > The applicants must be under 30 years of age or currently > enrolled in > > an institution of higher education. Those productions will be > > considered for awards whose appeal lies in a unique style of content > > or cinematography and indicate a great potential of the applicant. > > > > Online- audience prize (500 €) > > A specially developed open online voting system will allow the users > > to cast votes for their favorite entries. > > > > Special mentioning of the jury > > The jury nominates a film, that impressed them, and that might > expand> the term video journalism. > > > > Further information is provided on our website: > > http://www.vjawards.com > > > > We look forward to your submissions > > > > Regards from all of us, > > VJAwards.com > > > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > > English version above > > > > Bitte weiterleiten an Personen die Interesse am Videojournalismus > > haben. Danke! > > > > 4th International Video Journalism Awards, Mainz: > > "Unlimited access" > > > > AUSSCHREIBUNG Deadline 15. Oktober 2008 > > http://www.vjawards.com > > > > Go out - find a story – publish it: > > Die „4th International Video Journalism Awards" rufen zur > Teilnahme auf! > > > > Wir suchen dokumentarische Videos von einzeln arbeitenden > > Autorenfilmern und Videojournalisten (kurz VJ). Idee, Dreh und > Schnitt> liegen in der Verantwortung einer Person. Ein kompakter > Camcorder und > > ein Laptop sind für den VJ das, was für den Printjournalisten Stift > > und Block ist. > > Bis zum 15. Oktober können Beiträge zu den 4th International Video > > Journalism Awards eingereicht werden. Ausrichter des > Filmfestivals ist > > vjawards.com . Als Gastgeber fungiert dieses Jahr das ZDF in Mainz. > > > > Das Motto dieser Awards lautet „Unlimited access". Der Award zeigt, > > wo VJs zu finden sind: Filme von Fernsehsendern und Verlagen werden > > zusammen mit Videos aus der freien Szene gezeigt und messen sich in > > getrennten Wettbewerben um die attraktiven Geldpreise von insgesamt > > 12000€. Damit findet das stark formatierte Tagesgeschäft der > > Nachrichtensender in dem Wettbewerb ebenso seinen Platz, wie > > Grenzen-überschreitende Beiträge von Journalisten. Diese > einzigartige> Mischung verspricht ein spannendes Publikum und ein > kontrastreiches> Filmprogramm. > > Aktuelle inhaltliche und technische Entwicklungen, die die > > Medienszenze bewegen und den Videojournalismus der Zukunft > > beeinflussen- für diese und andere Diskurse bieten die 4th > > International Video Journalism Awards ein umfassendes > Rahmenprogramm.> > > Die Preise für die eingereichten Filme werden in den Bereichen > > „Independent und Online" und „TV-Produktion" vergeben. Dabei > > bezeichnet „Independent und Online " freie Produktionen und > > Auftragsproduktionen für das Internet. „TV-Produktion" sind > Filme, die > > als Auftragsproduktion von Sendeanstalten entstanden sind. > > > > Die Preise werden nach folgenden Gesichtspunkten vergeben: > > > > INTERNATIONAL VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > > > a) TV-Produktion – ausgestrahlte Beiträge (2000 €) > > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert worden ist und bereits > > ausgestrahlt wurde. > > > > b) Independent Film und Online (2000 €) > > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert worden ist. Beitrag muss > > nicht ausgestrahlt, kann aber für das Internet produziert worden > sein.> > > GERMAN VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD > > > > a) TV-Produktion – ausgestrahlte Beiträge (2000 €) > > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert und von einem > > deutschsprachigen Fernsehsender ausgestrahlt wurde (bitte Sender und > > Ausstrahlungsdatum angeben!). Alle Genres sind zulässig. > > > > b) Independent Film und Online (2000 €) > > Journalistischer bzw. dokumentarischer Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 > > Minuten Länge, der von einem oder mehreren > > Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert wurde. Beitrag muss > nicht> ausgestrahlt, kann aber für das Internet produziert worden > sein.> > > REPORTAGE AWARD (2500 €) > > Deutschsprachige Reportage von mindestens 15 Minuten, höchstens 29 > > Minuten Länge, die von einem oder mehreren Videojournalisten > > produziert wurde. Die Reportage muss nicht ausgestrahlt worden sein. > > > > NEWCOMER VIDEO JOURNALISM AWARD (1000 €) > > Filmbeitrag von maximal 15 Minuten Länge, der von einem oder > mehreren> Videojournalisten/Videoreportern produziert wurde. Die > Bewerber müssen > > unter 30 Jahre alt oder an einer Hochschule eingeschrieben sein. > > Prämiert werden Arbeiten, die durch eine eigenständige inhaltliche > > oder filmische Handschrift überzeugen und ein großes Potenzial des > > Bewerbers erkennen lassen. > > > > Online- Zuschauerpreis (500 €) > > Auf der Festivalseite www.vjawards.com können interessierte > Zuschauer> ihren Lieblingsfilm mit einer guten Bewertung belohnen. > > > > Spezialpreis der Jury > > Die Jury vergibt einen Spezialpreis für einen Film, der sie > > beeindruckt, und unter Umständen sehr frei mit der Produktionsart > > Videojournalismus umgeht. > > > > Alle weiteren Informationen finden Sie auf unserer Wettbewerbsseite. > > http://www.vjawards.com > > > > Wir sind schon sehr gespannt auf Ihre VJ-Filme, > > > > Ihr > > Video Journalism Awards Team > > > > _ > > __,_._,___ > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > announcements mailing list > > announcements at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Mon Aug 4 13:18:34 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2008 12:48:34 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: And we have a" journalist" in Shivam who talks of secular India.! ----- Original Message ----- From: rashneek kher Date: Monday, August 4, 2008 9:45 am Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph To: sarai list > Stay away, Pandits told > OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT > > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp > > *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has > announced his > return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the > exiledKashmiri Pandit community not to return home. > > A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media > agencies in > Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the > Valley unless > New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. > > "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to > return to the > Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' > return, leave > Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. > > Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by > SyedSalahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the > name of Muslim > Mujahideen. > > He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending > several years > behind bars. > > "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again > and, if the > reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after > around a decade," a police official said. > > Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then > declared the > Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed > Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area > of south > Kashmir. > > "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it > does not > revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants > living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore > will be > resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. > > This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist > leaders who > are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. > > Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the > return of > Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package > estimated at > Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, > identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 4 15:05:00 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 15:05:00 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808040235q560bdd25pa48f6d36849c9303@mail.gmail.com> This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:44 AM, rashneek kher wrote: > Stay away, Pandits told > OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT > > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp > > *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has announced his > return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the exiled > Kashmiri Pandit community not to return home. > > A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media agencies in > Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the Valley unless > New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. > > "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to return to the > Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' return, leave > Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. > > Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by Syed > Salahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the name of Muslim > Mujahideen. > > He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending several years > behind bars. > > "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again and, if the > reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after > around a decade," a police official said. > > Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then declared the > Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed > Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area of south > Kashmir. > > "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it does not > revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants > living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore will be > resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. > > This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist leaders who > are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. > > Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the return of > Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package estimated at > Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, > identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 4 15:07:27 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 15:07:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Internal emergency in Jammu! In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808030032p70fcf001r16233a65ae0ce68e@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080803072026.18231.qmail@f4mail-235-135.rediffmail.com> <6b79f1a70808030032p70fcf001r16233a65ae0ce68e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808040237k10df40dbtfd2c07f380ef2872@mail.gmail.com> Strike cripples life in Kashmir valley http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/002200808041321.htm Srinagar (PTI): The strike called by hardline faction of Hurriyat Conference to express solidarity with Muslims of Jammu region on Monday crippled life in the Kashmir valley. All shops, business establishments, schools and higher educational institutions remained closed due to the strike led by Syed Ali Shah Geelani, official sources said here. While public transport remained off roads on all routes of the valley, some light motor vehicles were plying in the city, they said. Security forces have been deployed at sensitive areas like Maisuma and Nowhatta. So far, the strike has been peaceful. There were no reports of any untoward incident from anywhere in the valley. o o o Jammu strife muffles Valley business Nazir Masoodi Monday, August 04, 2008, (Baramulla) http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/story.aspx?id=NEWEN20080059965 It seems that the biggest victims of the unrest in Jammu are the small business owners and daily workers. One of them are the Valley's fruit growers, who say that their livelihood has been severely affected by the ongoing strife in Jammu and desperate attempts are now being made to bring back some profits. It has been a long wait for Ghulam Mohammad to take his pear-laden truck to Delhi's Azadpur Mandi. Supporters of the Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti have imposed an economic blockade targeting any truck carrying goods into or out of Kashmir. And fearing a backlash, Police are preventing trucks from moving forward. "The police are saying that Kashmiri truckers wouldn't be allowed to proceed because they are being beaten along the highway. So I had to return from Lower Monda," said Ghulam Mohammad, driver. Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only road link that connects Kashmir with the rest of India but after right wing political parties in Jammu declared a boycott of Kashmiri goods and began to enforce the economic blockade. Fruit growers in the Valley are now looking to take the Srinagar-Muzafarabad road to reach other places in India. "We are compelled to take this step. But since fruits are perishable we will take it via Jhelum Valley road," Ghulam Rasool, fruitseller. As the markets and the rout have succumbed to strife in Jammu, the Valley's fruit growers say they have been pushed to the wall and forced to use the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road to reach out to the market. On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 1:02 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Leaders under house arrest . Most of them are likely to be arrested today. > Cable TV services blocked in Jammu. SMS services snapped. > Jammu Under EMERGENCY rule.! > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Ashwani Kumar > Date: Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 12:50 PM > Subject: Internal emergency in Jammu! >> > > > Dear friends, > > > You are requested to float the news across about the > latest developments as on date about Jammu. There is already curfew in > Jammu, hundreds have been injured, some arrests have been made, leaders are > under house arrest, media channels have been taken over by the police, > pressmen have been manhandled and no free movement is allowed. We are > expecting the administration to go to any extent. > > > -Ashwani, > Jammu > 3rd August 2008, 12.45 PM > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 4 15:41:53 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 15:41:53 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] KPs and facts In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808032105u11c7a77fib2818c7606e1e30b@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808020241n4078c7a1pf5fc2ebda46eaff0@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808032105u11c7a77fib2818c7606e1e30b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808040311x4bc5904eye4de26fa7ae9fae8@mail.gmail.com> Yes, thanksfully indeed. Though I don't know if Kshmendra, Aditya Raj Kaul and Pawan D agree with you on this, but then, they don't have to... On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:35 AM, rashneek kher wrote: > Just goes on to show that Pandits are not a monolith and thanfully each one > reatins his/her individuality as a thinking being. > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 3:11 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: >> >> Divided House, Delayed Return >> >> Deep fissures in the Kashmiri Pandit community stand in the way of >> government efforts to rehabilitate them, reports PEERZADA ARSHAD HAMID >> >> http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp >> >> SANJAY TIKOO, a Kashmiri Pandit living in Barbar Shah, Srinagar, >> braved all odds and remained in the valley when thousands of Pandits >> left their motherland. It was 1990 and the armed insurgency in Kashmir >> had begun, followed by press releases in newspapers ordering Hindus to >> leave. >> No one home Most of the high-security government flats built >> exclusively for returning Pandits have found no takers Photo:Javed Dar >> >> The Tikoo family were defiant and resolute. They would not migrate. >> They weathered the pressure and fear and lived on in their ancestral >> home. Eighteen years later, those days remain vivid for Sanjay. He >> clearly remembers the prolonged strike calls, the curfews and, above >> all, the migration of fellow Pandits from the valley. >> >> Sanjay credits his mother for the decision. "I thank the women of my >> house and, particularly, my mother, who gave her steadfast support to >> our decision. If either she or my sister had shown even the slightest >> weakness, we too would have fled, forced to uproot ourselves," muses >> Sanjay. >> >> The Tikoos were soon singled out. A threatening letter was nailed to >> the entrance of their house. Sanjay clearly remembers that fateful >> day. >> >> "It was July 16, 1990. I had gone to the top floor of my house to >> smoke a cigarette. While pacing up and down, I saw a group of people >> reading something on our gate. I rushed down and brought the message >> in," recalls Sanjay. >> >> At about the same time, posters purportedly written by militants >> became ubiquitous. Along with threats such as the one Sanjay's family >> received, they contained strike calls and reports of militant >> activities. Disturbed, Sanjay discussed the letter with his family and >> then approached a local Urdu newspaper, which published the letter >> along with his family's decision: they would not leave the valley and >> were willing to face the consequences. Thereafter, a group of >> militants belonging to the Al-Umar Commandos approached the family and >> denied having issued the letter. This increased the confidence of the >> family and encouraged them to stay back. >> >> The relief department of the state government estimates that 56,148 >> families, including a few Muslim families — approximately 2.5 lakh >> people — migrated from their homes following the armed insurgency >> during the period 1989- 92. Of this, 34,690 families went to Jammu and >> 19,338 to New Delhi. While police records say 209 Pandits were killed >> in Kashmir in the past 18 years, Pandit organisations put the figure >> at about 1,100. An estimated 20,000 Pandit families, however, >> preferred to stay. >> >> These people occupied scattered pockets in urban and rural areas, >> detached from each other. This forsaken community faced difficulties >> in their social life that were felt acutely during marriages, >> religious functions and, most of all, when performing the last rites >> for their dead. >> >> "During the initial years, finding brides for our sons was difficult >> as few migrants were ready to send their daughters back to the valley. >> There were no priests to perform prayers. However, the situation is >> now improving and people don't consider marriages to families in the >> valley that dangerous," Tikoo says. >> >> Sanjay initiated efforts to unite Pandit families and strengthen their >> interaction. He and his friends founded the Kashmiri Pandit Sangharsh >> Samiti (KPSS), which is undertaking a census of Pandits in the valley. >> They advocate the safe return of Pandits and oppose government plans >> to give Pandits high-security residential flats. >> >> "The government has constructed separate buildings and has given CRPF >> security to them. However, this is an effort to create a Palestine- >> Israel type divide in Kashmir," asserts Tikoo. >> >> The KPSS is also critical of hard-line Pandit organisations like Panun >> Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir, because of their demand for a separate >> homeland in Kashmir, northeast of the Jhelum. The KPSS considers >> Kashmir a political problem and a dispute between India and Pakistan. >> >> Panun Kashmir believes that the insurgency was a communal riot >> engineered by Islamic fundamentalists to drive the minority Hindus >> from the valley. They accuse Muslims of ethnic cleansing. Panun >> Kashmir has demanded land along the Jhelum in south Kashmir to be >> secured to build colonies for Pandits. The group also wants this zone >> to be made a Union Territory. >> >> "Our community has suffered badly. We have been uprooted from our >> homeland and unless adequate arrangements are made, we won't go back >> and will continue our fight for our rights. Residential flats are not >> the solution — that's just moving us from one camp to another. Our >> return to our motherland should be final and secure, so that we will >> not be forced to leave again," asserts Ajay Chrangoo, Chairman, Panun >> Kashmir. Chrangoo has been living in Jammu since his migration and >> strongly advocates a separate homeland. >> >> Chrangoo refers to flats constructed at Mattan in South Kashmir and at >> Sheikhpora on the outskirts of Srinagar that the state government has >> spent crores on, in order to coax Pandits to return. No Jammu Pandits >> were ready to return here, and most flats remain locked. >> >> Another voice representing the migrant community is the All India >> Kashmiri Samaj. Headed by Ram Krishan Bhat, it works to keep the >> Kashmiri sentiment alive among Pandit youth. Though he praises the >> Pandits who remained in the valley and calls them "daring", he says >> their continued presence in the valley is not enough to convince other >> Pandits to return. >> >> Chrangoo disagrees. "There is nothing special in some Pandits staying >> back. While some members of the community stay behind in conflict >> zones where there is a mass exodus, this can't obscure the bigger >> picture — the fact that most Pandits have fled. Moreover, those who >> remain, remain in fear," he adds. >> >> >> THE LARGE numbers of Pandit groups — representing migrants and >> non-migrants — claiming to fight for the rights of Pandits have >> confused people both in India and abroad. The clamour of voices has >> added to the complexity of the issue. While all groups claim to >> represent the aspirations of Kashmiri Pandits, all of them differ on >> when, where and how Pandits should return. "Pandits are as divided as >> the Muslims are," quips Sanjay Tikoo. >> >> Sanjay Saraf, a migrant politician, adds another dimension to the >> debate. Saraf plans to contest the coming assembly elections and is >> state president of the Lok Jan Shakti Party. >> >> Recently, national and regional parties from outside the state have >> started making inroads here. The elections will see candidates from >> the SP and the BSP, who have held rallies in Srinagar. >> >> Saraf, however, relies more on Muslim votes than on Pandit ones. >> Though he is a migrant, he has been visiting the valley regularly for >> the past seven years for party meetings and constituency visits. He is >> critical of Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir that are headquartered >> outside Kashmir and describes them as stooges of fundamentalist >> forces. "They are dancing to the tune of the BJP and the VHP and are >> trying to create a communal wedge," Saraf alleges. >> >> The divide among Pandits deepened during the recent crisis over land >> for the Amarnath shrine board. While most Pandit organisations based >> in Jammu and New Delhi favoured the transfer of land to the board, the >> valley-based KPSS stood alone in its demand for the pilgrimage to be >> placed under resident Kashmiri Pandit organisations. Saraf supported >> this demand from the beginning. "Pandits cannot remain outside the >> valley and pay mere lip service to the cause. We have to be here to >> say we belong to the land. Raising a hue and cry while staying outside >> hardly matters," avers Sanjay Saraf, while acknowledging KPSS' >> efforts. >> >> Ideological differences have increased the divide between migrant >> Pandits and those who stayed back. Eighteen years after Pandits fled >> the valley, various groups continue to pursue their own agendas and a >> consensus remains elusive. >> >> WRITER'S E-MAIL >> peerzadaarshad at gmail.com >> From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 31, Dated Aug 09, 2008 >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > -- National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ From rashneek at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 16:28:12 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 16:28:12 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] KPs and facts In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040311x4bc5904eye4de26fa7ae9fae8@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808020241n4078c7a1pf5fc2ebda46eaff0@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808032105u11c7a77fib2818c7606e1e30b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040311x4bc5904eye4de26fa7ae9fae8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808040358l1eaaebcfi1be043fc9fc95b09@mail.gmail.com> Yes they dont have to...... On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 3:41 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Yes, thanksfully indeed. Though I don't know if Kshmendra, Aditya Raj > Kaul and Pawan D agree with you on this, but then, they don't have > to... > > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:35 AM, rashneek kher wrote: > > Just goes on to show that Pandits are not a monolith and thanfully each > one > > reatins his/her individuality as a thinking being. > > > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 3:11 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > wrote: > >> > >> Divided House, Delayed Return > >> > >> Deep fissures in the Kashmiri Pandit community stand in the way of > >> government efforts to rehabilitate them, reports PEERZADA ARSHAD HAMID > >> > >> http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp > >> > >> SANJAY TIKOO, a Kashmiri Pandit living in Barbar Shah, Srinagar, > >> braved all odds and remained in the valley when thousands of Pandits > >> left their motherland. It was 1990 and the armed insurgency in Kashmir > >> had begun, followed by press releases in newspapers ordering Hindus to > >> leave. > >> No one home Most of the high-security government flats built > >> exclusively for returning Pandits have found no takers Photo:Javed Dar > >> > >> The Tikoo family were defiant and resolute. They would not migrate. > >> They weathered the pressure and fear and lived on in their ancestral > >> home. Eighteen years later, those days remain vivid for Sanjay. He > >> clearly remembers the prolonged strike calls, the curfews and, above > >> all, the migration of fellow Pandits from the valley. > >> > >> Sanjay credits his mother for the decision. "I thank the women of my > >> house and, particularly, my mother, who gave her steadfast support to > >> our decision. If either she or my sister had shown even the slightest > >> weakness, we too would have fled, forced to uproot ourselves," muses > >> Sanjay. > >> > >> The Tikoos were soon singled out. A threatening letter was nailed to > >> the entrance of their house. Sanjay clearly remembers that fateful > >> day. > >> > >> "It was July 16, 1990. I had gone to the top floor of my house to > >> smoke a cigarette. While pacing up and down, I saw a group of people > >> reading something on our gate. I rushed down and brought the message > >> in," recalls Sanjay. > >> > >> At about the same time, posters purportedly written by militants > >> became ubiquitous. Along with threats such as the one Sanjay's family > >> received, they contained strike calls and reports of militant > >> activities. Disturbed, Sanjay discussed the letter with his family and > >> then approached a local Urdu newspaper, which published the letter > >> along with his family's decision: they would not leave the valley and > >> were willing to face the consequences. Thereafter, a group of > >> militants belonging to the Al-Umar Commandos approached the family and > >> denied having issued the letter. This increased the confidence of the > >> family and encouraged them to stay back. > >> > >> The relief department of the state government estimates that 56,148 > >> families, including a few Muslim families — approximately 2.5 lakh > >> people — migrated from their homes following the armed insurgency > >> during the period 1989- 92. Of this, 34,690 families went to Jammu and > >> 19,338 to New Delhi. While police records say 209 Pandits were killed > >> in Kashmir in the past 18 years, Pandit organisations put the figure > >> at about 1,100. An estimated 20,000 Pandit families, however, > >> preferred to stay. > >> > >> These people occupied scattered pockets in urban and rural areas, > >> detached from each other. This forsaken community faced difficulties > >> in their social life that were felt acutely during marriages, > >> religious functions and, most of all, when performing the last rites > >> for their dead. > >> > >> "During the initial years, finding brides for our sons was difficult > >> as few migrants were ready to send their daughters back to the valley. > >> There were no priests to perform prayers. However, the situation is > >> now improving and people don't consider marriages to families in the > >> valley that dangerous," Tikoo says. > >> > >> Sanjay initiated efforts to unite Pandit families and strengthen their > >> interaction. He and his friends founded the Kashmiri Pandit Sangharsh > >> Samiti (KPSS), which is undertaking a census of Pandits in the valley. > >> They advocate the safe return of Pandits and oppose government plans > >> to give Pandits high-security residential flats. > >> > >> "The government has constructed separate buildings and has given CRPF > >> security to them. However, this is an effort to create a Palestine- > >> Israel type divide in Kashmir," asserts Tikoo. > >> > >> The KPSS is also critical of hard-line Pandit organisations like Panun > >> Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir, because of their demand for a separate > >> homeland in Kashmir, northeast of the Jhelum. The KPSS considers > >> Kashmir a political problem and a dispute between India and Pakistan. > >> > >> Panun Kashmir believes that the insurgency was a communal riot > >> engineered by Islamic fundamentalists to drive the minority Hindus > >> from the valley. They accuse Muslims of ethnic cleansing. Panun > >> Kashmir has demanded land along the Jhelum in south Kashmir to be > >> secured to build colonies for Pandits. The group also wants this zone > >> to be made a Union Territory. > >> > >> "Our community has suffered badly. We have been uprooted from our > >> homeland and unless adequate arrangements are made, we won't go back > >> and will continue our fight for our rights. Residential flats are not > >> the solution — that's just moving us from one camp to another. Our > >> return to our motherland should be final and secure, so that we will > >> not be forced to leave again," asserts Ajay Chrangoo, Chairman, Panun > >> Kashmir. Chrangoo has been living in Jammu since his migration and > >> strongly advocates a separate homeland. > >> > >> Chrangoo refers to flats constructed at Mattan in South Kashmir and at > >> Sheikhpora on the outskirts of Srinagar that the state government has > >> spent crores on, in order to coax Pandits to return. No Jammu Pandits > >> were ready to return here, and most flats remain locked. > >> > >> Another voice representing the migrant community is the All India > >> Kashmiri Samaj. Headed by Ram Krishan Bhat, it works to keep the > >> Kashmiri sentiment alive among Pandit youth. Though he praises the > >> Pandits who remained in the valley and calls them "daring", he says > >> their continued presence in the valley is not enough to convince other > >> Pandits to return. > >> > >> Chrangoo disagrees. "There is nothing special in some Pandits staying > >> back. While some members of the community stay behind in conflict > >> zones where there is a mass exodus, this can't obscure the bigger > >> picture — the fact that most Pandits have fled. Moreover, those who > >> remain, remain in fear," he adds. > >> > >> > >> THE LARGE numbers of Pandit groups — representing migrants and > >> non-migrants — claiming to fight for the rights of Pandits have > >> confused people both in India and abroad. The clamour of voices has > >> added to the complexity of the issue. While all groups claim to > >> represent the aspirations of Kashmiri Pandits, all of them differ on > >> when, where and how Pandits should return. "Pandits are as divided as > >> the Muslims are," quips Sanjay Tikoo. > >> > >> Sanjay Saraf, a migrant politician, adds another dimension to the > >> debate. Saraf plans to contest the coming assembly elections and is > >> state president of the Lok Jan Shakti Party. > >> > >> Recently, national and regional parties from outside the state have > >> started making inroads here. The elections will see candidates from > >> the SP and the BSP, who have held rallies in Srinagar. > >> > >> Saraf, however, relies more on Muslim votes than on Pandit ones. > >> Though he is a migrant, he has been visiting the valley regularly for > >> the past seven years for party meetings and constituency visits. He is > >> critical of Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir that are headquartered > >> outside Kashmir and describes them as stooges of fundamentalist > >> forces. "They are dancing to the tune of the BJP and the VHP and are > >> trying to create a communal wedge," Saraf alleges. > >> > >> The divide among Pandits deepened during the recent crisis over land > >> for the Amarnath shrine board. While most Pandit organisations based > >> in Jammu and New Delhi favoured the transfer of land to the board, the > >> valley-based KPSS stood alone in its demand for the pilgrimage to be > >> placed under resident Kashmiri Pandit organisations. Saraf supported > >> this demand from the beginning. "Pandits cannot remain outside the > >> valley and pay mere lip service to the cause. We have to be here to > >> say we belong to the land. Raising a hue and cry while staying outside > >> hardly matters," avers Sanjay Saraf, while acknowledging KPSS' > >> efforts. > >> > >> Ideological differences have increased the divide between migrant > >> Pandits and those who stayed back. Eighteen years after Pandits fled > >> the valley, various groups continue to pursue their own agendas and a > >> consensus remains elusive. > >> > >> WRITER'S E-MAIL > >> peerzadaarshad at gmail.com > >> From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 31, Dated Aug 09, 2008 > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > -- > > Rashneek Kher > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > > > > > -- > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From cubbykabi at yahoo.com Mon Aug 4 18:05:01 2008 From: cubbykabi at yahoo.com (kabi cubby sherman) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 18:05:01 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Fw: [faowindia] The Queer Azadi March Message-ID: <463493.28059.qm@web94704.mail.in2.yahoo.com> come join the march and celebrate kabi Meter Down - kaali-peeli ki kahaani podcast: http://feeds.feedburner.com/meterdown blog: http://meterdown.wordpress.com From: cs lists To: streesangam at googlegroups.com Cc: faow yahoogroup Sent: Monday, 4 August, 2008 3:57:49 PM Subject: [faowindia] The Queer Azadi March QUEER AZADI MUMBAI 2008 16th August The march will start at August Kranti Maidan and end at Girgaum Chowpatty Organised by: Aanchal Trust, Astitva, Dai Welfare Society, GayBombay, Humsaaya, Humsafar Trust, INFOSEM, Lesbians and Bisexuals in Action, Queer Media Collective, Rainbow Pride Connexion, Sakhi Char Chowghi, Salvation Star, Sarathi, Symphony in Pink We will gather at August Kranti Maidan 3:30 pm onwards. QUEER AZADI MUMBAI 2008 Who is ‘queer’?Queer was originally used as a put-down, but the word was reclaimed as a positive marker of identity by those of us whom society considered odd, strange or abnormal. We use the word to refer to all people marginalisedby a society that is narrowly defined by hetero-normativity and by the male-female gender binary. Lesbian, gay, bisexual, hijra, transgender, kothi, panthi, intersex… all who identify with words like these have gathered here today under the umbrella of the “queer” community. What’s the slogan “queer azadi” about?This country achieved Independence on 15th August, 1947, but its countless queer citizens are still not free. We have no rights, and no place in a society that refuses to accept us for who we are.. And that is why we’ve chosen 16th August as Queer Azadi Diwas, so that we may be seen and heard, and in order to bring to the notice of both our society and our government some issues that concern us: * Under Sec. 377 of the Indian Penal Code our desires and relationships are considered to be criminal acts. We want this regressive law read down. * Every individual is under tremendous pressure to marry a person of the opposite sex, as marriage is seen as a must in our society. We are launching a campaign against all such forced marriages. * The Constitution must include provisions to deal with all discrimination on the grounds of sexuality or gender. * We call for an end to homophobia and transphobia — an end to violence and hate within families, in educational institutions, at places of work and in public spaces. Today’s event is not just for the queer communities.Many others are here to encourage and support us — family members, friends, colleagues; NGOs, women’s groups, human rights organizations, and trade unionists; educational institutions and their students. We invite you to join us on our march as well and to raise your voice along with ours. __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Database | Polls | Members | Calendar Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Visit Your Group Yahoo! News Odd News You won't believe it, but it's true Search Ads Get new customers. List your web site in Yahoo! Search. Yahoo! Groups Everyday Wellness Zone Check out featured healthy living groups. . __,_._,___ Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ DEFANGED.74738> ----- Forwarded Message ---- From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 4 19:49:50 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 19:49:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu Communalists ! and Jammu keeps Burning In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808020529y11a55b3ud27e08d781af6e9a@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808020529y11a55b3ud27e08d781af6e9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808040719v1370c8e5p454a7a7caa5aa16d@mail.gmail.com> The Economic and Political Weekly July 26, 2008 STATE CULTIVATION OF THE AMARNATH YATRA by Gautam Navlakha The origins of the conflagration in June in Kashmir on forest land allocation for construction of facilities for the Amarnath yatra lie in open state promotion of the pilgrimage. The yatra has caused considerable damage to the economy and ecology of the area. The high-handed actions of the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board only aggravated the situation. The Amarnath pilgrimage erupted into a major controversy last month entirely on account of the actions of the state. The Act setting up the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board (SASB) was passed by the National Conference government in 2001. On January 1, 2008, the SASB informed the legislature of Jammu and Kashmir, through a letter to the deputy chief minister, that "(t)he Governor is sovereign ex-officio holder of the power... who acts on his own personal satisfaction and not on the aid and advice of the council of ministers...the member (of the legislative council) may be explained that he does not enjoy the powers to question the decisions of the body" (Greater Kashmir, June 12, 2008). Disconcertingly, the SASB, when presided over by S K Sinha when he was governor, has been engaged in some controversial transactions. The chief executive officer (CEO) of the SASB is the principal secretary to the governor. The CEO's wife, in her capacity as principal secretary of the forest department, granted permission to the SASB on May 29, 2005 to use forest land for the pilgrimage. Because this action was not in accordance with the provision of the J&K Forest Conservation Act of 1997, the state government withdrew the order. However, a division bench of the J&K High Court stayed the withdrawal of permission to occupy forest land. But when in mid-2008, the state cabinet gave its approval to "divert" 40 ha of forest land for the yatra the issue erupted into widescale public protests. The deputy chief minister, belonging to the Progressive Democratic Party (PDP) went so far as to claim that Congress ministers "black- mailed" them into giving this approval (Indian Express, June 16, 2008). The Indian state has often used the yatra to promote a certain kind of nationalism. During the Kargil war, in 1999, the Press Information Bureau put out a press re- lease stating: "(the) yearning for moksha (salvation) can move the devotees to the challenging heights of Kashmir and will be a fitting gesture of solidarity with our valiant soldiers who have been fighting the enemy to defend our borders" (pib.nic.in/ feature/feo799/f1507992 html). A Little Known Shrine Thus, what is otherwise a religious pilgrimage of the shaivite Hindus has been elevated to represent a patriotic enterprise. What is interesting is that the translator of Rajtarangini, Aurel Stein, found no reference in 1888 in either the Rajtarangini or the Nilmata Purana to the Amarnath cave. For Kashmiri Hindus the holiest site was the Haramukuta (Shiva's Diadem) and Haramukh-Gangabal pilgrimage (see M Ashraf, 'Aggression At Its Worst', Greater Kashmir, June 20, 2008). The cave was in fact discovered in the 18th century and a Gujjar family and its descendants who found it were given the right to a share of the offering as a consequence. Even until the 1980s, this pilgrimage was not well known and in 1989, only 12,000 pilgrims visited the cave in a fortnight of pilgrimage. It is only after 1996 that the Amarnath cave acquired its prominence when militancy in Kashmir was at its peak. The SASB is headed by the governor (until recently S K Sinha, a former lt general in the army) and his principal secretary, from the Indian Administrative Service, is the CEO of the SASB. Thus when the SASB pushes for movement of a larger and larger number of pilgrims and rejects the right of the legislators to even raise a question regarding the functioning of the SASB, the Indian state is sending a simple message. Imagine if a Muslim governor of Rajasthan were to ask to set up an independent Ajmer Sharief Dargah development authority, with say, control over a large part of Ajmer city. What would be the response of Rajasthan's BJP government or the right wing Hindutva rabble-rousers? Ironically, it is the deposed custodian of the shrine Deependra Giri who has been crying hoarse over SASB's promotion of pilgrimage as tourism, flouting the principle of penance inherent in such pilgrim ages as laid down in the Hindu scriptures! The point is this promotion of Amarnath can be faulted on temporal, religious and secular grounds. In other words it is downright duplicitous when the Indian state promotes religious tourism (tourism in any event) in the guise of the welfare of Hindu pilgrims. This is an extension and/or part of the process of acquisition of a huge mass of land (orchard and cultivable fields, including the precious saffron fields of Pampore) by Indian security forces and water management and control through the National Hydro Power Corporation. Implications The implications are far-reaching. The SASB runs a virtually parallel admini- stration and acts as a "sovereign body" promoting Hindu interests, increasing the number of pilgrims from 12,000 in 1989 to over 4,00,000 in 2007 and ex- tending the period of the pilgrimage from 15 days to two and half months (the first fortnight is meant for families of service personnel). The SASB has virtually taken over the functioning of the Pahalgam De- velopment Authority, laying claims to forest lands and constructing shelters and structures even on the Pahalgam Golf Course! As part of the latest instances of land grab the SASB received the approval of the state government on June 3, 2008 to transfer 800 kanals of forest land. And it wanted another 3,200 kanals. The SASB has also staked claims to set up an "independent" Amarnath Development Authority between Nunwan, Pahalgam, and Baltal (ahead of Sonmarg). It is true that the state government shot down this proposal and has publicly claimed that only temporary structures can be set up in the 800 kanals, but two things should be kept in mind. Firstly, the brazen manner in which the SASB has gone about staking its claims. Secondly, but for public anger it is doubtful if the state government would have found the courage to oppose the demands of the SASB. It has not done anything to prevent or rollback the annexation of parts of Pahalgam Golf Course in order to provide security for pilgrims. If it were not for the widespread protests in Kashmir and the PDP's withdrawal from the government, the new governor of Jammu and Kashmir would not have been compelled to revoke his predecessor's order. Environmental Damage Be that as it may, probably the most damning evidence against the SASB and its dangerous exclusivist policy is the dam- age being caused to the environment in and around Pahalgam. A noted environmentalist told Greater Kashmir (June 10, 2008) that "The yatris during their Amarnath yatra do not only defecate on the banks of the Lidder river but throw tonnes of non-degradable items like polythene, plastic items directly into the river. This has resulted in the deterioration of its water quality." One expert, M R D Kundangar, told Greater Kashmir that "(t)he chemical oxygen demand of the Lidder has been recorded between 17 and 92 mg/l which is beyond the permissible level. Such enriched waters with hazardous chemicals ranges can no way be recommended for potable purposes. It has crossed all permissible limits due to flow of sewage and open defecation. Lidder has been turned into a cesspool." It has been estimated that every day during the pilgrimage 55,000 kg of waste is generated. Apart from this waste, the degradation caused by buses and vehicles carrying pilgrims, trucks carrying provisions and massive deployment of security forces contributes further to air pollution. Another fallout is the threat posed to local inhabitants from crowding of the ecologically fragile area where they have to compete to retain their access and rights to re- sources, both water and land. Indeed such was the arrogance and clout of the previous governor that he sent an ordinance to the state government to establish Shardapeeth University in Baghat Kanipora in Srinagar. Prominent jurist A G Noorani was constrained to point out to Greater Kashmir (June 9, 2008) that this move of the governor was "unheard of in parliamentary democracy". General Sinha would have gotten away with this had it not been for the fact that state coalition government did not have enough time to promulgate this while he was still the governor. The same governor, who also headed the Shri Vaishno Devi Shrine Board, had also created a special facility for rich Hindu pilgrims visiting Vaishno Devi by paying an additional Rs 200-500. Had it not been for the strike by residents and ordinary pilgrims in Katra this decision would not have been withdrawn. The special time allocated for the pilgrimage to the armed forces personnel, the acquisition of land, introduction of helicopter services (which causes its own attendant problems), crowding of the area and slowly pushing out local people from these locations because of the environmental degradation or because their livelihood is adversely affected (for example consider the protests by the Pahalgam- based tourism industry for squeezing them out), all pose a huge challenge. Limits in Gangotri Significantly, even the Bharatiya Janata Party in Uttarakhand on May 1, 2008 limited the number of pilgrims visiting Gangotri and Goumukh to 150 persons per day so as to protect the fragile ecology of the area. Yet, in the case of Amarnath, and despite overwhelming evidence of environmental degradation posed by the huge increase in the number of pilgrims and large number of security forces deployed for protection of such pilgrims, there is no one who dares challenge the SASB's stubborn extension of the yatra. Indeed if the CEO of SASB is to be believed since "the population of India will increase we will have to consider further extension of the yatra period". Arguably, when the yatra was halted between 1991 and 1996 due to the threat by a section of the militants it played into the hands of the extreme right wing elements in Indian society who have since then played an integral role in mobilising large numbers of pilgrims. However, it is equally important to note that earlier, school- children and college youth used to act as volunteers and provide assistance to the yatris. Even when this was discontinued after 1996, the main indigenous militant organisation the Hizbul Mujahideen and Muslim Janbaz Force always supported the yatra and consistently demonstrated its opposition towards those who tried to dis- rupt it. And even today there is no section of people who opposes the yatra. What they resent is the horrendously jingoistic turn that it has taken under the SASB. Verily the more things change more they remain the same. On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > *KASHMIR IMAGES, August 2, 2009* > > *Good you talked about Hindu communalists of India, why not about Muslim > fundamentalists of Kashmir?* > > *By Vimal Sumbly* > > Dear Omar, > > please accept my heartiest congratulations for an impassionate speech you > delivered in the parliament on July 22. > It would be remembered as one of the best speeches ever delivered in the > parliament. I have always felt proud about your secular and nationalistic > credentials. Unlike most other politicians in Kashmir, you and your > illustrious father Dr Farooq Abdullah have the distinction of never playing > with the secessionist sentiments of people in Kashmir. As you began your > speech in the parliament that you are a Muslim and you are an Indian and > there was no difference between the two, you were speaking straight from > your heart. In fact you never needed to say that, you have always proved it > indeed. > However I beg to differ with the widespread public opinion generated by your > "extempore speech". For the speech was not at all addressed to the > parliament, nor to the billion Indians who were watching you live on the > television. It was aimed at the select "secular Muslims of Kashmir" whom you > are going to ask for their vote very soon. I salute you for the courage to > call a spade a spade. You rightly criticized the Bharitya Janata Party for > its communal agenda. I believe your regret and apologies were obviously > aimed at the Kashmiri Muslims. You rightly criticized the Communists for > being self proclaimed guardians of the Indian secularism, while not minding > to side with the "communal BJP" in toppling the government. > > Dear Omar, I know and you know that you paid a heavy price in 2002 assembly > elections in Kashmir for not having resigned on the Gujarat riots. You and > your party were defeated in the elections, mainly because you were blamed > for sharing power with the "communal BJP" at the centre. That ghost might be > still haunting you. But you showed enough moral courage to apologize to the > Kashmiri Muslims. You berated the BJP to the maximum possible extent. That > is for you and the BJP to decide. Your speech was rated among the best by > various television channels. Taking it on the face value everybody would > like it. Because, it was rhetoric at its best. Particularly when you had > chosen the two best targets, the Communists and the BJP, who were obviously > not liked by many across the country for their opportunistic "understanding" > to topple the government for entirely different reasons. > > I wish you gathered the same moral courage, which you showed in the > parliament to denounce the Hindu communalists, to condemn the Muslim > communalists in Kashmir. I feel sorry the way you defended the anti Amarnath > land transfer agitation in the parliament. And hats off to you that you > presented it to be a "secular" agitation for the land. Let you tell me and > the whole of nation who was going to take away the land from you. Had LK > Advani been allotted the land to settle down his "communal brigade" there? > It was just a temporary transfer to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board to > facilitate the pilgrimage of lakhs of pilgrims coming from across the > country. And is the Shrine Board an outside agency? Isn't it just a state > agency controlled by the state government itself? The matter of the fact is > that you joined the course of competitive communalism that was initiated by > your rivals, the People's Democratic Party and hijacked by secessionists > like Sayeed Ali Shah Geelani. And how brilliantly you presented it in > "secular colours". What if the Hindus outside Kashmir rebel in the same way > and seek vacation of Haj houses? That has never been done and it will never > be done. > Not everybody across the country knows that the grave of your grandfather, > Sher-i-Kashmir, Sheikh Mohammad Abdullah still needs a heavy posse of cops > and mostly drawn from central paramilitary forces to be defended against the > same "secular" Muslims of Kashmir. And we all know Sheikh Sahib was a true > secular leader who opted for secular India against an Islamic Pakistan. Had > it not been for him, Kashmir would not have been with India. So, who is > wrong your grandfather or the "secular" Kashmiri Muslims, whom you defended > with such a strong conviction? Like you apologized to the Kashmiri Muslims > for "sleeping with the communal BJP", you should also apologize to the > people of Jammu whom you accused of being communal. This was too hurting. > Let you not forget that you still feel safer in Jammu than in Kashmir and > there has not been a selective communal killing in Jammu despite so much > provocation in Kashmir valley. You certainly owe an apology to the people of > Jammu also and the current phase of violence was provoked by "the best" > speech you delivered in the parliament. > > And please don't mislead the county that no Amarnath pilgrim was ever > attacked. There have been scores of attacks resulting in scores of deaths > during the past two decades on the pilgrims. And also let the record be > straightened that the Amarnath cave was not discovered by a Muslim about 150 > years ago. Its mention is in Neelamat Puran as well. Besides, when the > Kashmiri Pandits were subjected to atrocities during the regime of > Aurangzeb, they (the Kashmiri Pandits) had gone to Amaranth to seek divine > intervention. It is here that they decided to approach Guru Tegh Bahadur in > Anandpur Sahib and that is over 300 years ago. > > I am sure, you are an honest and a well meaning person. I not only see a > bright future for Kashmir in you, but for the entire country. We need > leaders like you, passionate, forthright, honest, brilliant and daring. To > conclude I tell, rather I request you one small thing. This is too personal. > That I am myself a Kashmiri like you. I am thorough Kashmiri in language, in > culture, in life and in everything. I have been thrown out of my Kashmir 18 > years ago. Even remaining away, I have maintained my language, my culture > and my lifestyle as a true Kashmir. You will say that, I was not thrown out > as it was Jagmohan who prompted me to move out. Presuming that I went out at > Jagmohan's behest, but can you help me now to return my piece of land, less > than half an acre, no big deal. It has been occupied by one of my "secular > Muslim" classmates with whom I used to go to school for twelve long years. > He knows I cannot do anything. You said, you will fight for the rights of > your land. Will you help me to return my land, like you pleaded the cause of > other fellow Muslim Kashmiris. I am also your fellow Kashmiri who still > cherishes the memories of his home. Don't disappoint me. Because I think you > are not only brave but bold as well. Have courage to speak for me. Whether I > get my land back or not, would not bother me, but I would feel consoled that > a fellow Kashmiri stood for me, like he stood for other fellow Kashmiris. > I understand that writing to you this way is enough to get me pronounced as > communal and an activist of RSS and Shiv Sena. But let me put it on record > that ours was among a few exceptional Pandit families that always voted for > the National Conference and not the Congress. You can verify it from my same > friend who has grabbed my land. We used to participate together in National > Conference processions. And I still believe that the National Conference is > the best bet for the people of Jammu and Kashmir, particularly under the > dynamic leadership of a young, brilliant, brave and daring leader like you. > My sincere apologies if I have been harsh to you, I never wanted to cloud > the glory of your speech in parliament, I only wanted to set the record > straight. Because truth must be told howsoever bitter it may be. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 21:57:47 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 21:57:47 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040235q560bdd25pa48f6d36849c9303@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040235q560bdd25pa48f6d36849c9303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808040927n7b7ea59fi1d6a1829ad3a27c5@mail.gmail.com> Yeah; because SHIVAM says so..... On 8/4/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any > presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously > > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:44 AM, rashneek kher wrote: > > Stay away, Pandits told > > OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT > > > > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp > > > > *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has announced > his > > return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the exiled > > Kashmiri Pandit community not to return home. > > > > A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media agencies > in > > Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the Valley > unless > > New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. > > > > "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to return to > the > > Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' return, > leave > > Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. > > > > Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by Syed > > Salahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the name of > Muslim > > Mujahideen. > > > > He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending several > years > > behind bars. > > > > "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again and, if > the > > reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after > > around a decade," a police official said. > > > > Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then declared the > > Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed > > Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area of > south > > Kashmir. > > > > "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it does > not > > revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants > > living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore will be > > resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. > > > > This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist leaders > who > > are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. > > > > Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the return of > > Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package estimated > at > > Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, > > identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. > > > > > > -- > > Rashneek Kher > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 4 22:00:14 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 22:00:14 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <6353c690808040927n7b7ea59fi1d6a1829ad3a27c5@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040235q560bdd25pa48f6d36849c9303@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808040927n7b7ea59fi1d6a1829ad3a27c5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808040930v102ccccbnae7ea9f2e82df720@mail.gmail.com> My claims certainly pale beyond yours, I humbly submit On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Yeah; because SHIVAM says so..... > On 8/4/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > > This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any > > presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously > > > > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:44 AM, rashneek kher > wrote: > > > Stay away, Pandits told > > > OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT > > > > > > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp > > > > > > *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has announced > > his > > > return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the > exiled > > > Kashmiri Pandit community not to return home. > > > > > > A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media agencies > > in > > > Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the Valley > > unless > > > New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. > > > > > > "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to return to > > the > > > Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' return, > > leave > > > Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. > > > > > > Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by Syed > > > Salahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the name of > > Muslim > > > Mujahideen. > > > > > > He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending several > > years > > > behind bars. > > > > > > "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again and, if > > the > > > reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after > > > around a decade," a police official said. > > > > > > Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then declared > the > > > Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed > > > Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area of > > south > > > Kashmir. > > > > > > "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it does > > not > > > revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants > > > living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore will > be > > > resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. > > > > > > This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist leaders > > who > > > are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. > > > > > > Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the return of > > > Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package > estimated > > at > > > Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, > > > identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Rashneek Kher > > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- Every story has two sides. You can't take both. National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 22:09:25 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 22:09:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040930v102ccccbnae7ea9f2e82df720@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040235q560bdd25pa48f6d36849c9303@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808040927n7b7ea59fi1d6a1829ad3a27c5@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040930v102ccccbnae7ea9f2e82df720@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808040939o3fc8553dr19513963248d1cd7@mail.gmail.com> Certainly not beyond the four walls of Sarai. On 8/4/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > My claims certainly pale beyond yours, I humbly submit > > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > >> Yeah; because SHIVAM says so..... >> On 8/4/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >> >> > This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any >> > presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously >> > >> > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:44 AM, rashneek kher >> wrote: >> > > Stay away, Pandits told >> > > OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT >> > > >> > > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp >> > > >> > > *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has announced >> > his >> > > return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the >> exiled >> > > Kashmiri Pandit community not to return home. >> > > >> > > A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media >> agencies >> > in >> > > Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the Valley >> > unless >> > > New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. >> > > >> > > "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to return >> to >> > the >> > > Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' return, >> > leave >> > > Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. >> > > >> > > Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by >> Syed >> > > Salahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the name of >> > Muslim >> > > Mujahideen. >> > > >> > > He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending several >> > years >> > > behind bars. >> > > >> > > "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again and, >> if >> > the >> > > reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after >> > > around a decade," a police official said. >> > > >> > > Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then declared >> the >> > > Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed >> > > Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area of >> > south >> > > Kashmir. >> > > >> > > "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it does >> > not >> > > revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants >> > > living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore will >> be >> > > resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. >> > > >> > > This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist >> leaders >> > who >> > > are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. >> > > >> > > Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the return of >> > > Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package >> estimated >> > at >> > > Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, >> > > identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. >> > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > Rashneek Kher >> > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy >> > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com >> > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com >> > > _________________________________________ >> > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > > > -- > Every story has two sides. > You can't take both. > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From pawan.durani at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 22:55:33 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 22:55:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu Communalists ! and Jammu keeps Burning In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040719v1370c8e5p454a7a7caa5aa16d@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808020529y11a55b3ud27e08d781af6e9a@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040719v1370c8e5p454a7a7caa5aa16d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808041025r2618bcbfqd8da0bb0e4e52f6a@mail.gmail.com> Amarnath - Fact sheets available for download at http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/the-truth-behind-holy-amarnath/ On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 7:49 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > The Economic and Political Weekly > July 26, 2008 > > STATE CULTIVATION OF THE AMARNATH YATRA > > by Gautam Navlakha > > The origins of the conflagration in June in > Kashmir on forest land allocation for > construction of facilities for the Amarnath yatra > lie in open state promotion of the pilgrimage. > The yatra has caused considerable damage to the > economy and ecology of the area. The high-handed > actions of the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board only > aggravated the situation. > > The Amarnath pilgrimage erupted into a major > controversy last month entirely on account of the > actions of the state. The Act setting up the > Shri Amarnath Shrine Board (SASB) was passed by > the National Conference government in 2001. On > January 1, 2008, the SASB informed the > legislature of Jammu and Kashmir, through a > letter to the deputy chief minister, that "(t)he > Governor is sovereign ex-officio holder of the > power... who acts on his own personal > satisfaction and not on the aid and advice of the > council of ministers...the member (of the > legislative council) may be explained that he > does not enjoy the powers to question the > decisions of the body" (Greater Kashmir, June 12, > 2008). > > Disconcertingly, the SASB, when presided over by > S K Sinha when he was governor, has been engaged > in some controversial transactions. The chief > executive officer (CEO) of the SASB is the > principal secretary to the governor. The CEO's > wife, in her capacity as principal secretary of > the forest department, granted permission to the > SASB on May 29, 2005 to use forest land for the > pilgrimage. Because this action was not in > accordance with the provision of the J&K Forest > Conservation Act of 1997, the state government > withdrew the order. However, a division bench of > the J&K High Court stayed the withdrawal of > permission to occupy forest land. But when in > mid-2008, the state cabinet gave its approval to > "divert" 40 ha of forest land for the yatra the > issue erupted into widescale public protests. The > deputy chief minister, belonging to the > Progressive Democratic Party (PDP) went so far as > to claim that Congress ministers "black- mailed" > them into giving this approval (Indian Express, > June 16, 2008). The Indian state has often used > the yatra to promote a certain kind of > nationalism. During the Kargil war, in 1999, the > Press Information Bureau put out a press re- > lease stating: "(the) yearning for moksha > (salvation) can move the devotees to the > challenging heights of Kashmir and will be a > fitting gesture of solidarity with our valiant > soldiers who have been fighting the enemy to > defend our borders" (pib.nic.in/ > feature/feo799/f1507992 html). > > A Little Known Shrine > > Thus, what is otherwise a religious pilgrimage of > the shaivite Hindus has been elevated to > represent a patriotic enterprise. What is > interesting is that the translator of > Rajtarangini, Aurel Stein, found no reference in > 1888 in either the Rajtarangini or the Nilmata > Purana to the Amarnath cave. For Kashmiri Hindus > the holiest site was the Haramukuta (Shiva's > Diadem) and Haramukh-Gangabal pilgrimage (see M > Ashraf, 'Aggression At Its Worst', Greater > Kashmir, June 20, 2008). The cave was in fact > discovered in the 18th century and a Gujjar > family and its descendants who found it were > given the right to a share of the offering as a > consequence. Even until the 1980s, this > pilgrimage was not well known and in 1989, only > 12,000 pilgrims visited the cave in a fortnight > of pilgrimage. It is only after 1996 that the > Amarnath cave acquired its prominence when > militancy in Kashmir was at its peak. The SASB > is headed by the governor (until recently S K > Sinha, a former lt general in the army) and his > principal secretary, from the Indian > Administrative Service, is the CEO of the SASB. > Thus when the SASB pushes for movement of a > larger and larger number of pilgrims and rejects > the right of the legislators to even raise a > question regarding the functioning of the SASB, > the Indian state is sending a simple message. > > Imagine if a Muslim governor of Rajasthan were > to ask to set up an independent Ajmer Sharief > Dargah development authority, with say, control > over a large part of Ajmer city. What would be > the response of Rajasthan's BJP government or > the right wing Hindutva rabble-rousers? > > Ironically, it is the deposed custodian of the > shrine Deependra Giri who has been crying hoarse > over SASB's promotion of pilgrimage as tourism, > flouting the principle of penance inherent in > such pilgrim ages as laid down in the Hindu > scriptures! The point is this promotion > > of Amarnath can be faulted on temporal, religious > and secular grounds. In other words it is > downright duplicitous when the Indian state > promotes religious tourism (tourism in any event) > in the guise of the welfare of Hindu pilgrims. > This is an extension and/or part of the process > of acquisition of a huge mass of land (orchard > and cultivable fields, including the precious > saffron fields of Pampore) by Indian security > forces and water management and control through > the National Hydro Power Corporation. > > Implications > > The implications are far-reaching. The SASB runs > a virtually parallel admini- stration and acts as > a "sovereign body" promoting Hindu interests, > increasing the number of pilgrims from 12,000 in > 1989 to over 4,00,000 in 2007 and ex- tending the > period of the pilgrimage from 15 days to two and > half months (the first fortnight is meant for > families of service personnel). The SASB has > virtually taken over the functioning of the > Pahalgam De- velopment Authority, laying claims > to forest lands and constructing shelters and > structures even on the Pahalgam Golf Course! > > As part of the latest instances of land grab the > SASB received the approval of the state > government on June 3, 2008 to transfer 800 kanals > of forest land. And it wanted another 3,200 > kanals. The SASB has also staked claims to set > up an "independent" Amarnath Development > Authority between Nunwan, Pahalgam, and Baltal > (ahead of Sonmarg). It is true that the state > government shot down this proposal and has > publicly claimed that only temporary structures > can be set up in the 800 kanals, but two things > should be kept in mind. Firstly, the brazen > manner in which the SASB has gone about staking > its claims. Secondly, but for public anger it is > doubtful if the state government would have found > the courage to oppose the demands of the SASB. It > has not done anything to prevent or rollback the > annexation of parts of Pahalgam Golf Course in > order to provide security for pilgrims. If it > were not for the widespread protests in Kashmir > and the PDP's withdrawal from the government, the > new governor of Jammu and Kashmir would not have > been compelled to revoke his predecessor's order. > > Environmental Damage > > Be that as it may, probably the most damning > evidence against the SASB and its dangerous > exclusivist policy is the dam- age being caused > to the environment in and around Pahalgam. A > noted environmentalist told Greater Kashmir (June > 10, 2008) that "The yatris during their Amarnath > yatra do not only defecate on the banks of the > Lidder river but throw tonnes of non-degradable > items like polythene, plastic items directly into > the river. This has resulted in the deterioration > of its water quality." One expert, M R D > Kundangar, told Greater Kashmir that "(t)he > chemical oxygen demand of the Lidder has been > recorded between 17 and 92 mg/l which is beyond > the permissible level. Such enriched waters with > hazardous chemicals ranges can no way be > recommended for potable purposes. It has crossed > all permissible limits due to flow of sewage and > open defecation. Lidder has been turned into a > cesspool." It has been estimated that every day > during the pilgrimage 55,000 kg of waste is > generated. Apart from this waste, the degradation > caused by buses and vehicles carrying pilgrims, > trucks carrying provisions and massive deployment > of security forces contributes further to air > pollution. Another fallout is the threat posed > to local inhabitants from crowding of the > ecologically fragile area where they have to > compete to retain their access and rights to re- > sources, both water and land. Indeed such was > the arrogance and clout of the previous governor > that he sent an ordinance to the state > government to establish Shardapeeth University in > Baghat Kanipora in Srinagar. Prominent jurist A > G Noorani was constrained to point out to Greater > Kashmir (June 9, 2008) that this move of the > governor was "unheard of in parliamentary > democracy". General Sinha would have gotten away > with this had it not been for the fact that state > coalition government did not have enough time to > promulgate this while he was still the governor. > The same governor, who also headed the Shri > Vaishno Devi Shrine Board, had also created a > special facility for rich Hindu pilgrims visiting > Vaishno Devi by paying an additional Rs 200-500. > Had it not been for the strike by residents and > ordinary pilgrims in Katra this decision would > not have been withdrawn. > > The special time allocated for the pilgrimage to > the armed forces personnel, the acquisition of > land, introduction of helicopter services (which > causes its own attendant problems), crowding of > the area and slowly pushing out local people from > these locations because of the environmental > degradation or because their livelihood is > adversely affected (for example consider the > protests by the Pahalgam- based tourism industry > for squeezing them out), all pose a huge > challenge. > > Limits in Gangotri > > Significantly, even the Bharatiya Janata Party in > Uttarakhand on May 1, 2008 limited the number of > pilgrims visiting Gangotri and Goumukh to 150 > persons per day so as to protect the fragile > ecology of the area. Yet, in the case of > Amarnath, and despite overwhelming evidence of > environmental degradation posed by the huge > increase in the number of pilgrims and large > number of security forces deployed for > protection of such pilgrims, there is no one who > dares challenge the SASB's stubborn extension of > the yatra. Indeed if the CEO of SASB is to be > believed since "the population of India will > increase we will have to consider further > extension of the yatra period". > > Arguably, when the yatra was halted between 1991 > and 1996 due to the threat by a section of the > militants it played into the hands of the extreme > right wing elements in Indian society who have > since then played an integral role in mobilising > large numbers of pilgrims. > > However, it is equally important to note that > earlier, school- children and college youth used > to act as volunteers and provide assistance to > the yatris. Even when this was discontinued after > 1996, the main indigenous militant organisation > the Hizbul Mujahideen and Muslim Janbaz Force > always supported the yatra and consistently > demonstrated its opposition towards those who > tried to dis- rupt it. And even today there is no > section of people who opposes the yatra. What > they resent is the horrendously jingoistic turn > that it has taken under the SASB. Verily the > more things change more they remain the same. > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Pawan Durani > wrote: > > *KASHMIR IMAGES, August 2, 2009* > > > > *Good you talked about Hindu communalists of India, why not about Muslim > > fundamentalists of Kashmir?* > > > > *By Vimal Sumbly* > > > > Dear Omar, > > > > please accept my heartiest congratulations for an impassionate speech you > > delivered in the parliament on July 22. > > It would be remembered as one of the best speeches ever delivered in the > > parliament. I have always felt proud about your secular and nationalistic > > credentials. Unlike most other politicians in Kashmir, you and your > > illustrious father Dr Farooq Abdullah have the distinction of never > playing > > with the secessionist sentiments of people in Kashmir. As you began your > > speech in the parliament that you are a Muslim and you are an Indian and > > there was no difference between the two, you were speaking straight from > > your heart. In fact you never needed to say that, you have always proved > it > > indeed. > > However I beg to differ with the widespread public opinion generated by > your > > "extempore speech". For the speech was not at all addressed to the > > parliament, nor to the billion Indians who were watching you live on the > > television. It was aimed at the select "secular Muslims of Kashmir" whom > you > > are going to ask for their vote very soon. I salute you for the courage > to > > call a spade a spade. You rightly criticized the Bharitya Janata Party > for > > its communal agenda. I believe your regret and apologies were obviously > > aimed at the Kashmiri Muslims. You rightly criticized the Communists for > > being self proclaimed guardians of the Indian secularism, while not > minding > > to side with the "communal BJP" in toppling the government. > > > > Dear Omar, I know and you know that you paid a heavy price in 2002 > assembly > > elections in Kashmir for not having resigned on the Gujarat riots. You > and > > your party were defeated in the elections, mainly because you were blamed > > for sharing power with the "communal BJP" at the centre. That ghost might > be > > still haunting you. But you showed enough moral courage to apologize to > the > > Kashmiri Muslims. You berated the BJP to the maximum possible extent. > That > > is for you and the BJP to decide. Your speech was rated among the best by > > various television channels. Taking it on the face value everybody would > > like it. Because, it was rhetoric at its best. Particularly when you had > > chosen the two best targets, the Communists and the BJP, who were > obviously > > not liked by many across the country for their opportunistic > "understanding" > > to topple the government for entirely different reasons. > > > > I wish you gathered the same moral courage, which you showed in the > > parliament to denounce the Hindu communalists, to condemn the Muslim > > communalists in Kashmir. I feel sorry the way you defended the anti > Amarnath > > land transfer agitation in the parliament. And hats off to you that you > > presented it to be a "secular" agitation for the land. Let you tell me > and > > the whole of nation who was going to take away the land from you. Had LK > > Advani been allotted the land to settle down his "communal brigade" > there? > > It was just a temporary transfer to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board to > > facilitate the pilgrimage of lakhs of pilgrims coming from across the > > country. And is the Shrine Board an outside agency? Isn't it just a state > > agency controlled by the state government itself? The matter of the fact > is > > that you joined the course of competitive communalism that was initiated > by > > your rivals, the People's Democratic Party and hijacked by secessionists > > like Sayeed Ali Shah Geelani. And how brilliantly you presented it in > > "secular colours". What if the Hindus outside Kashmir rebel in the same > way > > and seek vacation of Haj houses? That has never been done and it will > never > > be done. > > Not everybody across the country knows that the grave of your > grandfather, > > Sher-i-Kashmir, Sheikh Mohammad Abdullah still needs a heavy posse of > cops > > and mostly drawn from central paramilitary forces to be defended against > the > > same "secular" Muslims of Kashmir. And we all know Sheikh Sahib was a > true > > secular leader who opted for secular India against an Islamic Pakistan. > Had > > it not been for him, Kashmir would not have been with India. So, who is > > wrong your grandfather or the "secular" Kashmiri Muslims, whom you > defended > > with such a strong conviction? Like you apologized to the Kashmiri > Muslims > > for "sleeping with the communal BJP", you should also apologize to the > > people of Jammu whom you accused of being communal. This was too hurting. > > Let you not forget that you still feel safer in Jammu than in Kashmir and > > there has not been a selective communal killing in Jammu despite so much > > provocation in Kashmir valley. You certainly owe an apology to the people > of > > Jammu also and the current phase of violence was provoked by "the best" > > speech you delivered in the parliament. > > > > And please don't mislead the county that no Amarnath pilgrim was ever > > attacked. There have been scores of attacks resulting in scores of deaths > > during the past two decades on the pilgrims. And also let the record be > > straightened that the Amarnath cave was not discovered by a Muslim about > 150 > > years ago. Its mention is in Neelamat Puran as well. Besides, when the > > Kashmiri Pandits were subjected to atrocities during the regime of > > Aurangzeb, they (the Kashmiri Pandits) had gone to Amaranth to seek > divine > > intervention. It is here that they decided to approach Guru Tegh Bahadur > in > > Anandpur Sahib and that is over 300 years ago. > > > > I am sure, you are an honest and a well meaning person. I not only see a > > bright future for Kashmir in you, but for the entire country. We need > > leaders like you, passionate, forthright, honest, brilliant and daring. > To > > conclude I tell, rather I request you one small thing. This is too > personal. > > That I am myself a Kashmiri like you. I am thorough Kashmiri in language, > in > > culture, in life and in everything. I have been thrown out of my Kashmir > 18 > > years ago. Even remaining away, I have maintained my language, my culture > > and my lifestyle as a true Kashmir. You will say that, I was not thrown > out > > as it was Jagmohan who prompted me to move out. Presuming that I went out > at > > Jagmohan's behest, but can you help me now to return my piece of land, > less > > than half an acre, no big deal. It has been occupied by one of my > "secular > > Muslim" classmates with whom I used to go to school for twelve long > years. > > He knows I cannot do anything. You said, you will fight for the rights of > > your land. Will you help me to return my land, like you pleaded the cause > of > > other fellow Muslim Kashmiris. I am also your fellow Kashmiri who still > > cherishes the memories of his home. Don't disappoint me. Because I think > you > > are not only brave but bold as well. Have courage to speak for me. > Whether I > > get my land back or not, would not bother me, but I would feel consoled > that > > a fellow Kashmiri stood for me, like he stood for other fellow Kashmiris. > > I understand that writing to you this way is enough to get me pronounced > as > > communal and an activist of RSS and Shiv Sena. But let me put it on > record > > that ours was among a few exceptional Pandit families that always voted > for > > the National Conference and not the Congress. You can verify it from my > same > > friend who has grabbed my land. We used to participate together in > National > > Conference processions. And I still believe that the National Conference > is > > the best bet for the people of Jammu and Kashmir, particularly under the > > dynamic leadership of a young, brilliant, brave and daring leader like > you. > > My sincere apologies if I have been harsh to you, I never wanted to > cloud > > the glory of your speech in parliament, I only wanted to set the record > > straight. Because truth must be told howsoever bitter it may be. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > From pawan.durani at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 23:01:22 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 23:01:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Internal emergency in Jammu! In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040237k10df40dbtfd2c07f380ef2872@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080803072026.18231.qmail@f4mail-235-135.rediffmail.com> <6b79f1a70808030032p70fcf001r16233a65ae0ce68e@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040237k10df40dbtfd2c07f380ef2872@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808041031t27cfed1an9a1ad311a00e2b99@mail.gmail.com> 33 days, Jammu still burns http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?id=40e8aa4a-ba98-404c-9bb9-763759f1a609&ParentID=5b69ad64-dbe5-4ad2-99c6-bc44c4f33059&&Headline=33+days%2c+Jammu+still+burns On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 3:07 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Strike cripples life in Kashmir valley > > http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/002200808041321.htm > > Srinagar (PTI): The strike called by hardline faction of Hurriyat > Conference to express solidarity with Muslims of Jammu region on > Monday crippled life in the Kashmir valley. > > All shops, business establishments, schools and higher educational > institutions remained closed due to the strike led by Syed Ali Shah > Geelani, official sources said here. > > While public transport remained off roads on all routes of the valley, > some light motor vehicles were plying in the city, they said. > > Security forces have been deployed at sensitive areas like Maisuma and > Nowhatta. So far, the strike has been peaceful. There were no reports > of any untoward incident from anywhere in the valley. > > o o o > > Jammu strife muffles Valley business > > Nazir Masoodi > Monday, August 04, 2008, (Baramulla) > http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/story.aspx?id=NEWEN20080059965 > > > It seems that the biggest victims of the unrest in Jammu are the small > business owners and daily workers. > > One of them are the Valley's fruit growers, who say that their > livelihood has been severely affected by the ongoing strife in Jammu > and desperate attempts are now being made to bring back some profits. > > It has been a long wait for Ghulam Mohammad to take his pear-laden > truck to Delhi's Azadpur Mandi. > > Supporters of the Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti have imposed an economic > blockade targeting any truck carrying goods into or out of Kashmir. > And fearing a backlash, Police are preventing trucks from moving > forward. > > "The police are saying that Kashmiri truckers wouldn't be allowed to > proceed because they are being beaten along the highway. So I had to > return from Lower Monda," said Ghulam Mohammad, driver. > > Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only road link that connects Kashmir > with the rest of India but after right wing political parties in Jammu > declared a boycott of Kashmiri goods and began to enforce the economic > blockade. Fruit growers in the Valley are now looking to take the > Srinagar-Muzafarabad road to reach other places in India. > > "We are compelled to take this step. But since fruits are perishable > we will take it via Jhelum Valley road," Ghulam Rasool, fruitseller. > > As the markets and the rout have succumbed to strife in Jammu, the > Valley's fruit growers say they have been pushed to the wall and > forced to use the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road to reach out to the > market. > > On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 1:02 PM, Pawan Durani > wrote: > > Leaders under house arrest . Most of them are likely to be arrested > today. > > Cable TV services blocked in Jammu. SMS services snapped. > > Jammu Under EMERGENCY rule.! > > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > From: Ashwani Kumar > > Date: Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 12:50 PM > > Subject: Internal emergency in Jammu! > >> > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > You are requested to float the news across about the > > latest developments as on date about Jammu. There is already curfew in > > Jammu, hundreds have been injured, some arrests have been made, leaders > are > > under house arrest, media channels have been taken over by the police, > > pressmen have been manhandled and no free movement is allowed. We are > > expecting the administration to go to any extent. > > > > > > -Ashwani, > > Jammu > > 3rd August 2008, 12.45 PM > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > From pawan.durani at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 23:03:30 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 23:03:30 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] KPs and facts In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808040358l1eaaebcfi1be043fc9fc95b09@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808020241n4078c7a1pf5fc2ebda46eaff0@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808032105u11c7a77fib2818c7606e1e30b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040311x4bc5904eye4de26fa7ae9fae8@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808040358l1eaaebcfi1be043fc9fc95b09@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808041033m1cd7b55g853d8b8a86d54415@mail.gmail.com> Shee Vaham , You just know everthing . Guni & Gyani PD On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 4:28 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > Yes they dont have to...... > > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 3:41 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >wrote: > > > Yes, thanksfully indeed. Though I don't know if Kshmendra, Aditya Raj > > Kaul and Pawan D agree with you on this, but then, they don't have > > to... > > > > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 9:35 AM, rashneek kher > wrote: > > > Just goes on to show that Pandits are not a monolith and thanfully each > > one > > > reatins his/her individuality as a thinking being. > > > > > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 3:11 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > > mail at shivamvij.com> > > > wrote: > > >> > > >> Divided House, Delayed Return > > >> > > >> Deep fissures in the Kashmiri Pandit community stand in the way of > > >> government efforts to rehabilitate them, reports PEERZADA ARSHAD HAMID > > >> > > >> > http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808divided_house.asp > > >> > > >> SANJAY TIKOO, a Kashmiri Pandit living in Barbar Shah, Srinagar, > > >> braved all odds and remained in the valley when thousands of Pandits > > >> left their motherland. It was 1990 and the armed insurgency in Kashmir > > >> had begun, followed by press releases in newspapers ordering Hindus to > > >> leave. > > >> No one home Most of the high-security government flats built > > >> exclusively for returning Pandits have found no takers Photo:Javed Dar > > >> > > >> The Tikoo family were defiant and resolute. They would not migrate. > > >> They weathered the pressure and fear and lived on in their ancestral > > >> home. Eighteen years later, those days remain vivid for Sanjay. He > > >> clearly remembers the prolonged strike calls, the curfews and, above > > >> all, the migration of fellow Pandits from the valley. > > >> > > >> Sanjay credits his mother for the decision. "I thank the women of my > > >> house and, particularly, my mother, who gave her steadfast support to > > >> our decision. If either she or my sister had shown even the slightest > > >> weakness, we too would have fled, forced to uproot ourselves," muses > > >> Sanjay. > > >> > > >> The Tikoos were soon singled out. A threatening letter was nailed to > > >> the entrance of their house. Sanjay clearly remembers that fateful > > >> day. > > >> > > >> "It was July 16, 1990. I had gone to the top floor of my house to > > >> smoke a cigarette. While pacing up and down, I saw a group of people > > >> reading something on our gate. I rushed down and brought the message > > >> in," recalls Sanjay. > > >> > > >> At about the same time, posters purportedly written by militants > > >> became ubiquitous. Along with threats such as the one Sanjay's family > > >> received, they contained strike calls and reports of militant > > >> activities. Disturbed, Sanjay discussed the letter with his family and > > >> then approached a local Urdu newspaper, which published the letter > > >> along with his family's decision: they would not leave the valley and > > >> were willing to face the consequences. Thereafter, a group of > > >> militants belonging to the Al-Umar Commandos approached the family and > > >> denied having issued the letter. This increased the confidence of the > > >> family and encouraged them to stay back. > > >> > > >> The relief department of the state government estimates that 56,148 > > >> families, including a few Muslim families — approximately 2.5 lakh > > >> people — migrated from their homes following the armed insurgency > > >> during the period 1989- 92. Of this, 34,690 families went to Jammu and > > >> 19,338 to New Delhi. While police records say 209 Pandits were killed > > >> in Kashmir in the past 18 years, Pandit organisations put the figure > > >> at about 1,100. An estimated 20,000 Pandit families, however, > > >> preferred to stay. > > >> > > >> These people occupied scattered pockets in urban and rural areas, > > >> detached from each other. This forsaken community faced difficulties > > >> in their social life that were felt acutely during marriages, > > >> religious functions and, most of all, when performing the last rites > > >> for their dead. > > >> > > >> "During the initial years, finding brides for our sons was difficult > > >> as few migrants were ready to send their daughters back to the valley. > > >> There were no priests to perform prayers. However, the situation is > > >> now improving and people don't consider marriages to families in the > > >> valley that dangerous," Tikoo says. > > >> > > >> Sanjay initiated efforts to unite Pandit families and strengthen their > > >> interaction. He and his friends founded the Kashmiri Pandit Sangharsh > > >> Samiti (KPSS), which is undertaking a census of Pandits in the valley. > > >> They advocate the safe return of Pandits and oppose government plans > > >> to give Pandits high-security residential flats. > > >> > > >> "The government has constructed separate buildings and has given CRPF > > >> security to them. However, this is an effort to create a Palestine- > > >> Israel type divide in Kashmir," asserts Tikoo. > > >> > > >> The KPSS is also critical of hard-line Pandit organisations like Panun > > >> Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir, because of their demand for a separate > > >> homeland in Kashmir, northeast of the Jhelum. The KPSS considers > > >> Kashmir a political problem and a dispute between India and Pakistan. > > >> > > >> Panun Kashmir believes that the insurgency was a communal riot > > >> engineered by Islamic fundamentalists to drive the minority Hindus > > >> from the valley. They accuse Muslims of ethnic cleansing. Panun > > >> Kashmir has demanded land along the Jhelum in south Kashmir to be > > >> secured to build colonies for Pandits. The group also wants this zone > > >> to be made a Union Territory. > > >> > > >> "Our community has suffered badly. We have been uprooted from our > > >> homeland and unless adequate arrangements are made, we won't go back > > >> and will continue our fight for our rights. Residential flats are not > > >> the solution — that's just moving us from one camp to another. Our > > >> return to our motherland should be final and secure, so that we will > > >> not be forced to leave again," asserts Ajay Chrangoo, Chairman, Panun > > >> Kashmir. Chrangoo has been living in Jammu since his migration and > > >> strongly advocates a separate homeland. > > >> > > >> Chrangoo refers to flats constructed at Mattan in South Kashmir and at > > >> Sheikhpora on the outskirts of Srinagar that the state government has > > >> spent crores on, in order to coax Pandits to return. No Jammu Pandits > > >> were ready to return here, and most flats remain locked. > > >> > > >> Another voice representing the migrant community is the All India > > >> Kashmiri Samaj. Headed by Ram Krishan Bhat, it works to keep the > > >> Kashmiri sentiment alive among Pandit youth. Though he praises the > > >> Pandits who remained in the valley and calls them "daring", he says > > >> their continued presence in the valley is not enough to convince other > > >> Pandits to return. > > >> > > >> Chrangoo disagrees. "There is nothing special in some Pandits staying > > >> back. While some members of the community stay behind in conflict > > >> zones where there is a mass exodus, this can't obscure the bigger > > >> picture — the fact that most Pandits have fled. Moreover, those who > > >> remain, remain in fear," he adds. > > >> > > >> > > >> THE LARGE numbers of Pandit groups — representing migrants and > > >> non-migrants — claiming to fight for the rights of Pandits have > > >> confused people both in India and abroad. The clamour of voices has > > >> added to the complexity of the issue. While all groups claim to > > >> represent the aspirations of Kashmiri Pandits, all of them differ on > > >> when, where and how Pandits should return. "Pandits are as divided as > > >> the Muslims are," quips Sanjay Tikoo. > > >> > > >> Sanjay Saraf, a migrant politician, adds another dimension to the > > >> debate. Saraf plans to contest the coming assembly elections and is > > >> state president of the Lok Jan Shakti Party. > > >> > > >> Recently, national and regional parties from outside the state have > > >> started making inroads here. The elections will see candidates from > > >> the SP and the BSP, who have held rallies in Srinagar. > > >> > > >> Saraf, however, relies more on Muslim votes than on Pandit ones. > > >> Though he is a migrant, he has been visiting the valley regularly for > > >> the past seven years for party meetings and constituency visits. He is > > >> critical of Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir that are headquartered > > >> outside Kashmir and describes them as stooges of fundamentalist > > >> forces. "They are dancing to the tune of the BJP and the VHP and are > > >> trying to create a communal wedge," Saraf alleges. > > >> > > >> The divide among Pandits deepened during the recent crisis over land > > >> for the Amarnath shrine board. While most Pandit organisations based > > >> in Jammu and New Delhi favoured the transfer of land to the board, the > > >> valley-based KPSS stood alone in its demand for the pilgrimage to be > > >> placed under resident Kashmiri Pandit organisations. Saraf supported > > >> this demand from the beginning. "Pandits cannot remain outside the > > >> valley and pay mere lip service to the cause. We have to be here to > > >> say we belong to the land. Raising a hue and cry while staying outside > > >> hardly matters," avers Sanjay Saraf, while acknowledging KPSS' > > >> efforts. > > >> > > >> Ideological differences have increased the divide between migrant > > >> Pandits and those who stayed back. Eighteen years after Pandits fled > > >> the valley, various groups continue to pursue their own agendas and a > > >> consensus remains elusive. > > >> > > >> WRITER'S E-MAIL > > >> peerzadaarshad at gmail.com > > >> From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 31, Dated Aug 09, 2008 > > >> _________________________________________ > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > >> Critiques & Collaborations > > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > >> subscribe in the subject header. > > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Rashneek Kher > > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From rashneek at gmail.com Tue Aug 5 09:34:25 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 09:34:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu Communalists ! and Jammu keeps Burning In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040719v1370c8e5p454a7a7caa5aa16d@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808020529y11a55b3ud27e08d781af6e9a@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808040719v1370c8e5p454a7a7caa5aa16d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808042104x56b66db9t56edee7f2a9dd82a@mail.gmail.com> Shivam.... Gautam Navlakha is either unlettered or so blind by his neo-convert status that he seems to have missed what Rajatarangni and Nilamata write about Amarnath or Amreshwar as it was called then.Shivam...please send this to your comrade Gautam Navlakha... Let him lick it...or tell him to read both texts again.I suggest you too to inform and educate yourself a little better to carry out any meaningful deabte on Kashmir. Neem hakeem khatray jehan suits people like you and Navlakha.You and Navlakha are more separtist than the separatists becuase while they know truth and twist it...you ,like blind men simply follow the twist and f**K the truth. *There is ample and conclusive historical evidence, on the other hand, to prove that the holy cave and the ice lingam were known to the people since very ancient times and have been continuously and regularly visited by pilgrims not only from Kashmir but also from different parts of India. While the earliest reference to Amarnath can be seen in the Nilamata Purana (v.1324), a 6th century Sanskrit text which depicts the religious and cultural life of early Kashmiris and gives Kashmir's own creation myth, the pilgrimage to the holy cave has been described with full topographical details in the Bhringish Samhita and the Amarnatha Mahatmya, both ancient texts said to have been composed even earlier. References to Amarnath, known have also been made in historical chronicles like the Rajatarangini and its sequels and several Western travellers' accounts also leaving no doubt about the fact that the holy cave has been known to people for centuries. The original name of the tirtha, as given in the ancient texts, is of course Amareshwara, Amarnath being a name given later to it. Giving the legend of the Naga Sushruvas, who in his fury burnt to ashes the kingdom of King Nara when he tried to abduct his daughter already married to a Brahmin youth, and after the carnage took his abode in the lake now known as Sheshnag (Kashmiri Sushramnag), Kalahana writes: "The lake of dazzling whiteness [resembling] a sea of milk (Sheshnag), which he created [for himself as residence] on a far off mountain, is to the present day seen by the people on the pilgrimage to Amareshwara."(Rajatarangini, Book I v. 267.Translation: M. A. Stein). This makes it very clear that pilgrims continued to visit the holy Amarnath cave in the 12th century, for Kalhana wrote his chronicle in the years1148-49. At another place in the Rajatarangini (Book II v. 138), Kalhana says that King Samdhimat Aryaraja (34 BCE-17CE) used to spend "the most delightful Kashmir summer" in worshiping a linga formed of snow "in the regions above the forests". This too appears to be a reference to the ice linga at Amarnath. There is yet another reference to Amareshwara or Amarnath in the Rajatarangini (Book VII v.183). According to Kalhana, Queen Suryamati, the wife of King Ananta (1028-1063), "granted under her husband's name agraharas at Amareshwara, and arranged for the consecration of trishulas, banalingas and other [sacred emblems]". In his Chronicle of Kashmir, a sequel to Kalhana's Rajatarangini, Jonaraja relates that that Sultan Zainu'l-abidin (1420-1470) paid a visit to the sacred tirtha of Amarnath while constructing a canal on the left bank of the river Lidder (vv.1232-1234). The canal is now known as Shah Kol. In the Fourth Chronicle named Rajavalipataka, which was begun by Prjayabhatta and completed by Shuka, there is a clear and detailed reference to the pilgrimage to the sacred site (v.841,vv. 847-849). According to it, in a reply to Akbar's query about Kashmir Yusuf Khan, the Mughal governor of Kashmir at that time, described among other things the Amarnath Yatra in full detail. His description shows that the not only was the pilgrimage in vogue in Akbar's time - Akbar annexed Kashmir in 1586 - but the phenomenon of waxing and waning of the ice linga was also well known. Amareshwar (Amarnath) was a famous pilgrimage place in the time of the Mughal emperor Shah Jahan also. In his eulogy of Shah Jahan's father-in-law Asif Khan, titled "Asaf Vilas", the famous Sanskrit scholar and aesthete Panditraj Jagannath makes clear mention of Amareshwara (Amarnath) while describing the Mughal garden Nishat laid out by Asif Khan. The King of gods Indra himself, he says, comes here to pay obeisance to Lord Shiva". As we well know Francois Bernier, a French physician accompanied Emperor Aurangzeb during his visit to Kashmir in 1663. In his book "Travels in Mughal Empire" he writes while giving an account the places he visited in Kashmir that he was "pursuing journey to a grotto full of wonderful congelations, two days journey from Sangsafed" when he "received intelligence that my Nawab felt very impatient and uneasy on account of my long absence". The "grotto" he refers to is obviously the Amarnath cave as the editor of the second edition of the English translation of the book, Vincient A. Smith makes clear in his introduction. He writes: "The grotto full of wonderful congelations is the Amarnath cave, where blocks of ice, stalagmites formed by dripping water from the roof are worshipped by many Hindus who resort here as images of Shiva….." Another traveler, Vigne, in his book "Travels in Kashmir, Ladakh and Iskardu" writes about the pilgrimage to the sacred spot in detail, clearly mentioning that "the ceremony at the cave of Amarnath takes place on the 15th of the Hindoo month of Sawan" and that "not only Hindoos of every rank and caste can be seen collecting together and traveling up the valley of Liddar towards the celebrated cave……" Vigne visited Kashmir after his return from Ladakh in 1840-41 and published his book in 1842. His book makes it very clear that the Amarnath Yatra drew pilgrims from the whole of India in his time and was undertaken with great enthusiasm.[image: Justify Full] Again, the great Sikh Guru Arjan Dev is said to have granted land in Amritsar for the ceremonial departure of Chari, the holy mace of Lord Shiva which marks the beginning of the Yatra to the Holy Cave. In 1819, the year in which the Afghan rule came to an end in Kashmir, Pandit Hardas Tiku "founded the Chhawni Anmarnath at Ram Bagh in Srinagar where the Sadhus from the plains assembled and where he gave them free rations for the journey, both ways from his own private resources", as the noted Kashmiri naturalist Pandit Samsar Chand Kaul has pointed out in his booklet titled "The Mysterious cave of Amarnath". Not only this, Amarnath is deeply enshrined in the Kashmiri folklore also as stories like that of Soda Wony clearly show. One can, therefore, conclude without any doubt that the Amaranth Yatra has been going on continuously for centuries along the traditional route of the Lidder valley and not a century and a half affair. May be during the Afghan rule when religious persecution of the Kashmiri Hindus was at its height and they were not allowed to visit their places of worship the pilgrimage was discontinued for about fifty or sixty years and during this period the flock of some shepherd may have strayed into the holy cave, but that in no way makes it of a recent origin or a show window of so-called Kashmiriat. * On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 7:49 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > The Economic and Political Weekly > July 26, 2008 > > STATE CULTIVATION OF THE AMARNATH YATRA > > by Gautam Navlakha > > The origins of the conflagration in June in > Kashmir on forest land allocation for > construction of facilities for the Amarnath yatra > lie in open state promotion of the pilgrimage. > The yatra has caused considerable damage to the > economy and ecology of the area. The high-handed > actions of the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board only > aggravated the situation. > > The Amarnath pilgrimage erupted into a major > controversy last month entirely on account of the > actions of the state. The Act setting up the > Shri Amarnath Shrine Board (SASB) was passed by > the National Conference government in 2001. On > January 1, 2008, the SASB informed the > legislature of Jammu and Kashmir, through a > letter to the deputy chief minister, that "(t)he > Governor is sovereign ex-officio holder of the > power... who acts on his own personal > satisfaction and not on the aid and advice of the > council of ministers...the member (of the > legislative council) may be explained that he > does not enjoy the powers to question the > decisions of the body" (Greater Kashmir, June 12, > 2008). > > Disconcertingly, the SASB, when presided over by > S K Sinha when he was governor, has been engaged > in some controversial transactions. The chief > executive officer (CEO) of the SASB is the > principal secretary to the governor. The CEO's > wife, in her capacity as principal secretary of > the forest department, granted permission to the > SASB on May 29, 2005 to use forest land for the > pilgrimage. Because this action was not in > accordance with the provision of the J&K Forest > Conservation Act of 1997, the state government > withdrew the order. However, a division bench of > the J&K High Court stayed the withdrawal of > permission to occupy forest land. But when in > mid-2008, the state cabinet gave its approval to > "divert" 40 ha of forest land for the yatra the > issue erupted into widescale public protests. The > deputy chief minister, belonging to the > Progressive Democratic Party (PDP) went so far as > to claim that Congress ministers "black- mailed" > them into giving this approval (Indian Express, > June 16, 2008). The Indian state has often used > the yatra to promote a certain kind of > nationalism. During the Kargil war, in 1999, the > Press Information Bureau put out a press re- > lease stating: "(the) yearning for moksha > (salvation) can move the devotees to the > challenging heights of Kashmir and will be a > fitting gesture of solidarity with our valiant > soldiers who have been fighting the enemy to > defend our borders" (pib.nic.in/ > feature/feo799/f1507992 html). > > A Little Known Shrine > > Thus, what is otherwise a religious pilgrimage of > the shaivite Hindus has been elevated to > represent a patriotic enterprise. What is > interesting is that the translator of > Rajtarangini, Aurel Stein, found no reference in > 1888 in either the Rajtarangini or the Nilmata > Purana to the Amarnath cave. For Kashmiri Hindus > the holiest site was the Haramukuta (Shiva's > Diadem) and Haramukh-Gangabal pilgrimage (see M > Ashraf, 'Aggression At Its Worst', Greater > Kashmir, June 20, 2008). The cave was in fact > discovered in the 18th century and a Gujjar > family and its descendants who found it were > given the right to a share of the offering as a > consequence. Even until the 1980s, this > pilgrimage was not well known and in 1989, only > 12,000 pilgrims visited the cave in a fortnight > of pilgrimage. It is only after 1996 that the > Amarnath cave acquired its prominence when > militancy in Kashmir was at its peak. The SASB > is headed by the governor (until recently S K > Sinha, a former lt general in the army) and his > principal secretary, from the Indian > Administrative Service, is the CEO of the SASB. > Thus when the SASB pushes for movement of a > larger and larger number of pilgrims and rejects > the right of the legislators to even raise a > question regarding the functioning of the SASB, > the Indian state is sending a simple message. > > Imagine if a Muslim governor of Rajasthan were > to ask to set up an independent Ajmer Sharief > Dargah development authority, with say, control > over a large part of Ajmer city. What would be > the response of Rajasthan's BJP government or > the right wing Hindutva rabble-rousers? > > Ironically, it is the deposed custodian of the > shrine Deependra Giri who has been crying hoarse > over SASB's promotion of pilgrimage as tourism, > flouting the principle of penance inherent in > such pilgrim ages as laid down in the Hindu > scriptures! The point is this promotion > > of Amarnath can be faulted on temporal, religious > and secular grounds. In other words it is > downright duplicitous when the Indian state > promotes religious tourism (tourism in any event) > in the guise of the welfare of Hindu pilgrims. > This is an extension and/or part of the process > of acquisition of a huge mass of land (orchard > and cultivable fields, including the precious > saffron fields of Pampore) by Indian security > forces and water management and control through > the National Hydro Power Corporation. > > Implications > > The implications are far-reaching. The SASB runs > a virtually parallel admini- stration and acts as > a "sovereign body" promoting Hindu interests, > increasing the number of pilgrims from 12,000 in > 1989 to over 4,00,000 in 2007 and ex- tending the > period of the pilgrimage from 15 days to two and > half months (the first fortnight is meant for > families of service personnel). The SASB has > virtually taken over the functioning of the > Pahalgam De- velopment Authority, laying claims > to forest lands and constructing shelters and > structures even on the Pahalgam Golf Course! > > As part of the latest instances of land grab the > SASB received the approval of the state > government on June 3, 2008 to transfer 800 kanals > of forest land. And it wanted another 3,200 > kanals. The SASB has also staked claims to set > up an "independent" Amarnath Development > Authority between Nunwan, Pahalgam, and Baltal > (ahead of Sonmarg). It is true that the state > government shot down this proposal and has > publicly claimed that only temporary structures > can be set up in the 800 kanals, but two things > should be kept in mind. Firstly, the brazen > manner in which the SASB has gone about staking > its claims. Secondly, but for public anger it is > doubtful if the state government would have found > the courage to oppose the demands of the SASB. It > has not done anything to prevent or rollback the > annexation of parts of Pahalgam Golf Course in > order to provide security for pilgrims. If it > were not for the widespread protests in Kashmir > and the PDP's withdrawal from the government, the > new governor of Jammu and Kashmir would not have > been compelled to revoke his predecessor's order. > > Environmental Damage > > Be that as it may, probably the most damning > evidence against the SASB and its dangerous > exclusivist policy is the dam- age being caused > to the environment in and around Pahalgam. A > noted environmentalist told Greater Kashmir (June > 10, 2008) that "The yatris during their Amarnath > yatra do not only defecate on the banks of the > Lidder river but throw tonnes of non-degradable > items like polythene, plastic items directly into > the river. This has resulted in the deterioration > of its water quality." One expert, M R D > Kundangar, told Greater Kashmir that "(t)he > chemical oxygen demand of the Lidder has been > recorded between 17 and 92 mg/l which is beyond > the permissible level. Such enriched waters with > hazardous chemicals ranges can no way be > recommended for potable purposes. It has crossed > all permissible limits due to flow of sewage and > open defecation. Lidder has been turned into a > cesspool." It has been estimated that every day > during the pilgrimage 55,000 kg of waste is > generated. Apart from this waste, the degradation > caused by buses and vehicles carrying pilgrims, > trucks carrying provisions and massive deployment > of security forces contributes further to air > pollution. Another fallout is the threat posed > to local inhabitants from crowding of the > ecologically fragile area where they have to > compete to retain their access and rights to re- > sources, both water and land. Indeed such was > the arrogance and clout of the previous governor > that he sent an ordinance to the state > government to establish Shardapeeth University in > Baghat Kanipora in Srinagar. Prominent jurist A > G Noorani was constrained to point out to Greater > Kashmir (June 9, 2008) that this move of the > governor was "unheard of in parliamentary > democracy". General Sinha would have gotten away > with this had it not been for the fact that state > coalition government did not have enough time to > promulgate this while he was still the governor. > The same governor, who also headed the Shri > Vaishno Devi Shrine Board, had also created a > special facility for rich Hindu pilgrims visiting > Vaishno Devi by paying an additional Rs 200-500. > Had it not been for the strike by residents and > ordinary pilgrims in Katra this decision would > not have been withdrawn. > > The special time allocated for the pilgrimage to > the armed forces personnel, the acquisition of > land, introduction of helicopter services (which > causes its own attendant problems), crowding of > the area and slowly pushing out local people from > these locations because of the environmental > degradation or because their livelihood is > adversely affected (for example consider the > protests by the Pahalgam- based tourism industry > for squeezing them out), all pose a huge > challenge. > > Limits in Gangotri > > Significantly, even the Bharatiya Janata Party in > Uttarakhand on May 1, 2008 limited the number of > pilgrims visiting Gangotri and Goumukh to 150 > persons per day so as to protect the fragile > ecology of the area. Yet, in the case of > Amarnath, and despite overwhelming evidence of > environmental degradation posed by the huge > increase in the number of pilgrims and large > number of security forces deployed for > protection of such pilgrims, there is no one who > dares challenge the SASB's stubborn extension of > the yatra. Indeed if the CEO of SASB is to be > believed since "the population of India will > increase we will have to consider further > extension of the yatra period". > > Arguably, when the yatra was halted between 1991 > and 1996 due to the threat by a section of the > militants it played into the hands of the extreme > right wing elements in Indian society who have > since then played an integral role in mobilising > large numbers of pilgrims. > > However, it is equally important to note that > earlier, school- children and college youth used > to act as volunteers and provide assistance to > the yatris. Even when this was discontinued after > 1996, the main indigenous militant organisation > the Hizbul Mujahideen and Muslim Janbaz Force > always supported the yatra and consistently > demonstrated its opposition towards those who > tried to dis- rupt it. And even today there is no > section of people who opposes the yatra. What > they resent is the horrendously jingoistic turn > that it has taken under the SASB. Verily the > more things change more they remain the same. > > On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Pawan Durani > wrote: > > *KASHMIR IMAGES, August 2, 2009* > > > > *Good you talked about Hindu communalists of India, why not about Muslim > > fundamentalists of Kashmir?* > > > > *By Vimal Sumbly* > > > > Dear Omar, > > > > please accept my heartiest congratulations for an impassionate speech you > > delivered in the parliament on July 22. > > It would be remembered as one of the best speeches ever delivered in the > > parliament. I have always felt proud about your secular and nationalistic > > credentials. Unlike most other politicians in Kashmir, you and your > > illustrious father Dr Farooq Abdullah have the distinction of never > playing > > with the secessionist sentiments of people in Kashmir. As you began your > > speech in the parliament that you are a Muslim and you are an Indian and > > there was no difference between the two, you were speaking straight from > > your heart. In fact you never needed to say that, you have always proved > it > > indeed. > > However I beg to differ with the widespread public opinion generated by > your > > "extempore speech". For the speech was not at all addressed to the > > parliament, nor to the billion Indians who were watching you live on the > > television. It was aimed at the select "secular Muslims of Kashmir" whom > you > > are going to ask for their vote very soon. I salute you for the courage > to > > call a spade a spade. You rightly criticized the Bharitya Janata Party > for > > its communal agenda. I believe your regret and apologies were obviously > > aimed at the Kashmiri Muslims. You rightly criticized the Communists for > > being self proclaimed guardians of the Indian secularism, while not > minding > > to side with the "communal BJP" in toppling the government. > > > > Dear Omar, I know and you know that you paid a heavy price in 2002 > assembly > > elections in Kashmir for not having resigned on the Gujarat riots. You > and > > your party were defeated in the elections, mainly because you were blamed > > for sharing power with the "communal BJP" at the centre. That ghost might > be > > still haunting you. But you showed enough moral courage to apologize to > the > > Kashmiri Muslims. You berated the BJP to the maximum possible extent. > That > > is for you and the BJP to decide. Your speech was rated among the best by > > various television channels. Taking it on the face value everybody would > > like it. Because, it was rhetoric at its best. Particularly when you had > > chosen the two best targets, the Communists and the BJP, who were > obviously > > not liked by many across the country for their opportunistic > "understanding" > > to topple the government for entirely different reasons. > > > > I wish you gathered the same moral courage, which you showed in the > > parliament to denounce the Hindu communalists, to condemn the Muslim > > communalists in Kashmir. I feel sorry the way you defended the anti > Amarnath > > land transfer agitation in the parliament. And hats off to you that you > > presented it to be a "secular" agitation for the land. Let you tell me > and > > the whole of nation who was going to take away the land from you. Had LK > > Advani been allotted the land to settle down his "communal brigade" > there? > > It was just a temporary transfer to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board to > > facilitate the pilgrimage of lakhs of pilgrims coming from across the > > country. And is the Shrine Board an outside agency? Isn't it just a state > > agency controlled by the state government itself? The matter of the fact > is > > that you joined the course of competitive communalism that was initiated > by > > your rivals, the People's Democratic Party and hijacked by secessionists > > like Sayeed Ali Shah Geelani. And how brilliantly you presented it in > > "secular colours". What if the Hindus outside Kashmir rebel in the same > way > > and seek vacation of Haj houses? That has never been done and it will > never > > be done. > > Not everybody across the country knows that the grave of your > grandfather, > > Sher-i-Kashmir, Sheikh Mohammad Abdullah still needs a heavy posse of > cops > > and mostly drawn from central paramilitary forces to be defended against > the > > same "secular" Muslims of Kashmir. And we all know Sheikh Sahib was a > true > > secular leader who opted for secular India against an Islamic Pakistan. > Had > > it not been for him, Kashmir would not have been with India. So, who is > > wrong your grandfather or the "secular" Kashmiri Muslims, whom you > defended > > with such a strong conviction? Like you apologized to the Kashmiri > Muslims > > for "sleeping with the communal BJP", you should also apologize to the > > people of Jammu whom you accused of being communal. This was too hurting. > > Let you not forget that you still feel safer in Jammu than in Kashmir and > > there has not been a selective communal killing in Jammu despite so much > > provocation in Kashmir valley. You certainly owe an apology to the people > of > > Jammu also and the current phase of violence was provoked by "the best" > > speech you delivered in the parliament. > > > > And please don't mislead the county that no Amarnath pilgrim was ever > > attacked. There have been scores of attacks resulting in scores of deaths > > during the past two decades on the pilgrims. And also let the record be > > straightened that the Amarnath cave was not discovered by a Muslim about > 150 > > years ago. Its mention is in Neelamat Puran as well. Besides, when the > > Kashmiri Pandits were subjected to atrocities during the regime of > > Aurangzeb, they (the Kashmiri Pandits) had gone to Amaranth to seek > divine > > intervention. It is here that they decided to approach Guru Tegh Bahadur > in > > Anandpur Sahib and that is over 300 years ago. > > > > I am sure, you are an honest and a well meaning person. I not only see a > > bright future for Kashmir in you, but for the entire country. We need > > leaders like you, passionate, forthright, honest, brilliant and daring. > To > > conclude I tell, rather I request you one small thing. This is too > personal. > > That I am myself a Kashmiri like you. I am thorough Kashmiri in language, > in > > culture, in life and in everything. I have been thrown out of my Kashmir > 18 > > years ago. Even remaining away, I have maintained my language, my culture > > and my lifestyle as a true Kashmir. You will say that, I was not thrown > out > > as it was Jagmohan who prompted me to move out. Presuming that I went out > at > > Jagmohan's behest, but can you help me now to return my piece of land, > less > > than half an acre, no big deal. It has been occupied by one of my > "secular > > Muslim" classmates with whom I used to go to school for twelve long > years. > > He knows I cannot do anything. You said, you will fight for the rights of > > your land. Will you help me to return my land, like you pleaded the cause > of > > other fellow Muslim Kashmiris. I am also your fellow Kashmiri who still > > cherishes the memories of his home. Don't disappoint me. Because I think > you > > are not only brave but bold as well. Have courage to speak for me. > Whether I > > get my land back or not, would not bother me, but I would feel consoled > that > > a fellow Kashmiri stood for me, like he stood for other fellow Kashmiris. > > I understand that writing to you this way is enough to get me pronounced > as > > communal and an activist of RSS and Shiv Sena. But let me put it on > record > > that ours was among a few exceptional Pandit families that always voted > for > > the National Conference and not the Congress. You can verify it from my > same > > friend who has grabbed my land. We used to participate together in > National > > Conference processions. And I still believe that the National Conference > is > > the best bet for the people of Jammu and Kashmir, particularly under the > > dynamic leadership of a young, brilliant, brave and daring leader like > you. > > My sincere apologies if I have been harsh to you, I never wanted to > cloud > > the glory of your speech in parliament, I only wanted to set the record > > straight. Because truth must be told howsoever bitter it may be. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > National Highway http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From rohitism at gmail.com Tue Aug 5 10:48:03 2008 From: rohitism at gmail.com (Rohit Shetti) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 10:48:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: Hiroshima Peace Day In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: John Devaraj Date: Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 9:10 AM Subject: Hiroshima Peace Day Dear friend please come and forward this invitation for Peace john *Hiroshima** peace day* *6th August 2008, 11 am Balbhavan, Cubbon Park Bangalore* It was on 6th August 1945, that the first atom bomb was dropped on Hiroshima. Three days later on 9th August, Nagasaki was atom bombed. The two bombs killed 350 000 people leaving behind today 250 000 traumatized survivors who recall the pain and tragedy. *Mahatma Gandhi called it an empty victory, a crime against humanity.* The dropping of the atom bomb its impact shocked the world. Nations after nations, peoples after peoples resolved never to produce or use the bomb, But today 10 nations of the world USA, UK, France, Israel, Iran, North Korea, China, Pakistan and India posses together 30 000 nuclear war heads capable of destroying the world 350 000 times. Japan abolished its army and maintains only a self defense force. 24 nations in the world have no armies. In a nuclear war there are no winners. We cannot let a third atom bomb to fall on this blessed earth *The Bornfree Art School* along with Hiroshima peace memorial Museum proposes to affirm this with the celebration of Hiroshima Day from 6th to 9 th August 2008 in Bangalore. This event envisages *A * Dialogue between survivors of Hiroshima and peace lovers of Bangalore through a video conferencing. at Balbhavan, Cubbon Park, Bangalore on the 6 th August at 11am *B Performance of Peace ballet Shiroi Hana {White flowers*} by the Bornfree Art School, to be watched by the people in Bangalore and Hiroshima. *C* An Art exhibition on the issues of War and peace *D* *Beating swords into plough shares*. Making of a peace monument from collected symbols of violence, aggression, like blades, knives, swords to be set up as a public monument in the contemporary sculpture park in Ravindra Kalakshetra.. Weapons will be collected at Balbhavan from 10am during the event and at Ravindra Kalakshetra from the 7th August to 9th August 2008.9am to 6pm where the sculpture is being made. *E* Photography exhibition on the impact of an A-bomb on Bangalore, *F* Exhibition of Posters and Photographs on the Bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. *G* Presentation of the History of Article 9 by 12 Japanese students from 6 Universities who participate as delegates. The Bornfree Art School two years ago wrote the *World's Largest Love Letter * to children of Pakistan which read "Dear Children of Pakistan let us join our hearts in friendship to create a new world" Over a million Indian and Pakistani children signed it and was hand carried to Pakistan We invite people to participate in this program.. *We invite you to the event and participate in the peace processes.* Mioi Nakayama 9886011830 www.bornfreeart.org John Devaraj 9886306366 mioinakayama at gmail.com bornfreeart at gmail.com johndevaraj at gmail.com 21~ 2nd cross ~GH layout~ 3rd Block East~ Jayanagar~ Bangalore 560011~ India - -- Imagination is more important than knowledge. http://artistsunited.blogspot.com/ www.bornfreeart.org. tel 0091 9886306366 From yashwantdelhi at gmail.com Mon Aug 4 16:58:58 2008 From: yashwantdelhi at gmail.com (Yashwant Singh) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 16:58:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Media ka Baap Kaun??? Message-ID: <81ce8ab00808040428r4f85b5d0t37e9c782c06d28a3@mail.gmail.com> Aadarniy *Dosto / Dushmano / Seniyaro / Juniyaro.....* Abhee tak jo kuchh samaz me galat hota hai, wo media batata-dikhata hai. Par jo media galat karegaa, Media ke andar jo kuchh hoga.... usko kaun batayega-dikhayega-sunayega...? esi ke liye... ab aa gaya..... Media ka Baap...... aur wo hai..... www.bhadas4media.com *No.1 Hindi Media News Portal* Waise aapko hum ek positive approach se media ki jani-mani hastiyon se mukhatib bhee karwaa rahe hain, har saptaah. Aap sabhi ke sahyog ke bina ye kaam sambhav nahi hai. plzz isko safal banane ke liye aage aayen. Dekhna hum esko kahan pahuchayenge. if u want to help us...... *Pls forward this mail to ur friends.* ** *for more detail....pls contact * Yashwant Singh CEO & Editor *Bhadas4Media* *No.1 Hindi Media News Portal* 09999330099 yashwant at bhadas4media.com From phadkeshilpa at gmail.com Tue Aug 5 15:31:19 2008 From: phadkeshilpa at gmail.com (Shilpa Phadke) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 15:31:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: The Queer Azadi March In-Reply-To: References: <001f01c8f61c$8c994030$6400a8c0@chayshalhome> Message-ID: Pls fwd widely. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: cs lists Date: 4 Aug 2008 15:56 Subject: [voicesagainst377] The Queer Azadi March To: voicesagainst377 at yahoogroups.com QUEER AZADI MUMBAI 2008 16th August The march will start at August Kranti Maidan and end at Girgaum Chowpatty *Organised by:* * * Aanchal Trust, Astitva, Dai Welfare Society, GayBombay, Humsaaya, Humsafar Trust, INFOSEM, Lesbians and Bisexuals in Action, Queer Media Collective, Rainbow Pride Connexion, Sakhi Char Chowghi, Salvation Star, Sarathi, Symphony in Pink * * *We will gather at August Kranti Maidan 3:30 pm onwards.* QUEER AZADI MUMBAI 2008 *Who is 'queer'?* Queer was originally used as a put-down, but the word was reclaimed as a positive marker of identity by those of us whom society considered odd, strange or abnormal. We use the word to refer to all people marginalised by a society that is narrowly defined by hetero-normativity and by the male-female gender binary. Lesbian, gay, bisexual, hijra, transgender, kothi, panthi, intersex… all who identify with words like these have gathered here today under the umbrella of the "queer" community. *What's the slogan "queer azadi" about?* This country achieved Independence on 15th August, 1947, but its countless queer citizens are still not free. We have no rights, and no place in a society that refuses to accept us for who we are. And that is why we've chosen 16th August as Queer Azadi Diwas, so that we may be seen and heard, and in order to bring to the notice of both our society and our government some issues that concern us: - Under Sec. 377 of the Indian Penal Code our desires and relationships are considered to be criminal acts. We want this regressive law read down. - Every individual is under tremendous pressure to marry a person of the opposite sex, as marriage is seen as a must in our society. We are launching a campaign against all such forced marriages. - The Constitution must include provisions to deal with all discrimination on the grounds of sexuality or gender. - We call for an end to homophobia and transphobia — an end to violence and hate within families, in educational institutions, at places of work and in public spaces. *Today's event is not just for the queer communities.* Many others are here to encourage and support us — family members, friends, colleagues; NGOs, women's groups, human rights organizations, and trade unionists; educational institutions and their students. *We invite you to join us on our march as well and to raise your voice along with ours.* __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages| Files| Photos| Links| Database| Polls| Members| Calendar [image: Yahoo! Groups] Change settings via the Web(Yahoo! 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Groups. . __,_._,___ From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Tue Aug 5 16:40:32 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2008 16:10:32 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808032114y799401b6o1d276d06e518fec4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: A miscalculated move by the CM of J & K to appease hindus in India in view of the general elections which are few months away, by "giving" land to Amarnath Shrine Board, then underestimating the ruthless nature of soft face of Hizb, the muftis, Sayeed and his daughter, Mehbooba, a nominated Home minister of centre, Shivraj Patil, a nominated Defence Minister AK Antony and a nominated PM, Manmohan Singh who are far removed from the aspirations of aam admi, all have contributed to this game of divisive politics. Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: rashneek kher Date: Monday, August 4, 2008 9:45 am Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph To: sarai list > Stay away, Pandits told > OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT > > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080804/jsp/nation/story_9643825.jsp > > *Srinagar, Aug. 3:* Hizb-ul Mujahideen founder Ahsan Dar has > announced his > return from Muzaffarabad to join the jihad, with a warning to the > exiledKashmiri Pandit community not to return home. > > A CD containing his statement was distributed among some media > agencies in > Kashmir. In it, he has asked the Pandits not to return to the > Valley unless > New Delhi solves the Kashmir issue. > > "I will advise Kashmiri Pandits not to take a foolish step to > return to the > Valley. And those leaders who have sympathy with the Pandits' > return, leave > Kashmir and stay with them in Jammu," Dar said. > > Dar had founded the Hizb in 1989 but was dislodged a year later by > SyedSalahuddin and forced to set up a new militant group by the > name of Muslim > Mujahideen. > > He was arrested in the early 1990s and released after spending > several years > behind bars. > > "In the late 1990s, he left for Pakistan-occupied Kashmir again > and, if the > reports about his return are true, then he is back in the Valley after > around a decade," a police official said. > > Dar had differences with the Jamat-e-Islami, which had then > declared the > Hizb its militant wing. This led to his ouster and replacement by Syed > Salahuddin. A teacher by profession, he belongs to the Pattan area > of south > Kashmir. > > "The Kashmir issue concerns 1.2 crore Muslims of the state and it > does not > revolve around Kashmiri Pandits alone. Nobody talks of Muslim migrants > living in Azad Kashmir and we believe when the issue of 1.2 crore > will be > resolved, we can then think about Kashmiri Pandits," Dar said. > > This is in marked contrast to the statement of other separatist > leaders who > are encouraging Kashmiri Pandits to return. > > Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in April set the stage for the > return of > Kashmiri migrant Pandits to their homes and announced a package > estimated at > Rs 1,600 crore, which included Rs 7.5 lakh for rebuilding houses, > identifying land and providing the unemployed Pandit youths with jobs. > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From thvishnu_viva at yahoo.com Tue Aug 5 23:58:03 2008 From: thvishnu_viva at yahoo.com (VISHNU VARDHAN) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 23:58:03 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Launch of the Theatre Infrastructure Cell Message-ID: <485189.3148.qm@web94910.mail.in2.yahoo.com> Dear Friends and Colleagues, The Arts and Culture team of the Sir Ratan Tata Trust and Allied Trusts invites you to the launch of Theatre Infrastructure Cell funded by the Lady Navjbai Ratan Tata Trust and set up in collaboration with India Foundation for the Arts (IFA), Bangalore.  Please find the invite below. Warmly, Vishnu India Foundation for the Arts invites you to the launch of the Theatre Infrastructure Cell   A joint initiative with the Navajbai Ratan Tata Trust   Venue:   United Theological College, Miller's Road, Bangalore Telephone: 080 23333438 Date:   Friday August 8th, 2008 Time:   5.00 pm RSVP: Vindya – vindya at indiaifa.org Tele / Fax: 91 80 23414681 / 82 The launch event, apart from presenting the work and objectives of the TIC, will also feature an open-house discussion involving performing artists, production designers, and architects. Kindly share this invitation with others who may be interested in knowing more about this initiative   Background The Navajbai Ratan Tata Trust (NRTT) and India Foundation for the Arts (IFA) have jointly set up the Theatre Infrastructure Cell (TIC), which aims to work towards strengthening infrastructure in the field of performing arts. The Cell will look at infrastructure issues holistically and lend advisory support as well as monetary support to projects on a case-by-case basis. An Advisory Panel consisting of eminent architects, theatre directors and designers has been set up to guide and strengthen TIC's work. The panel consists of Bansi Kaul (Theatre Director), Himanshu Burte (Architect), Jagan Shah (Architect), Naveen Kishore (Publisher and Lighting Designer), Sunil Shanbag (Theatre Director), and Vivek Patankar (Architect and Acoustics Expert).   The  NRTT is an allied trust of the Sir Ratan Tata Trust (SRTT) and is one of the leading funding organisations of Arts and Culture in India. The Tata Trusts' Arts and Culture portfolio is committed to strengthening and developing the field of arts through its diverse programmatic interventions of funding art institutions, arts initiatives, research in arts, advanced learning in the arts and collaborative field interventions.   IFA is an independent, nationwide philanthropy, professionally managed, and dedicated to strengthening the arts in India.  IFA has funded more than 225 projects over the last 14 years. It supports research and practice leading to films, books, artworks, archives, exhibitions and performances. The IFA also helps bring the arts into the classroom while funding the preservation and transmission of valuable cultural knowledge. Another area of its work is to offer advice, information and expertise related to the Indian arts. Theatre Infrastructure Cell India Foundation for the Arts Bangalore (080) 23414681/23414682 Please visit our website www.indiaifa.org  T. Vishnu Vardhan (Ph.D)University of Ulster UK - CSCS Bangalore Consultant, Arts and Culture Programme, Sir Ratan Tata Trust. #466, 9th Cross, I Block Jayanagar, Bangalore - 11. Tel: +91 80 26562986 Mobile: +91 9845207308 Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From rashneek at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 09:43:04 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 09:43:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] PDP now opposes the transfer, but records show how it said the opposite(The Indian Express) Message-ID: <13df7c120808052113i203ff9d4k630f6a8db84fd8a1@mail.gmail.com> *ON THE RECORD-Indian Express *February 26, 2008: 'The proprietary status of forest land shall remain unchanged' *PDP now opposes the transfer, but records show how it said the opposite* ** *As the PM holds an all-party meeting in Jammu and Kashmir, we reproduce the key documents around the Amarnath land-transfer **Memorandum for Submission to the Cabinet * *Government of Jammu and Kashmir Civil Sectt: Forest Department Subject:- Use of Forest Land for non-forestry purpose 1. The Forest Department has received requisitions from various Agencies/Departments for diversion of forest land for non forestry purposes. The Memorandum deals with the cases which were cleared by the Advisory Committee constituted under J&K Forest Conservation Act, 1997 in its 39th Meeting held on July 12, 2007 under the Chairmanship of the Chief Secretary. These cases were placed before the Cabinet in its meeting on February 26, 2008. The item was "deferred" since some clarifications were necessary about the wildlife perspective in respect of the proposal of Amarnathji Shrine Board (discussed as case 4 of this Memorandum). Pursuant to the above, a Committee of officers was constituted vide Government Order No. 108-Fst of 2008 dated March 17, 2008 to look into that proposal. The report of the Committee has since been received and is attached as Annexure to this Memorandum. Case No.4 12. Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board (SASB) has made a requisition for diversion of forest land measuring 39.88 hectares falling under Compartment No. 63a/Sindh in Block Kullan, Range Sindh, Sindh Forest Division for construction/provision of buildings/hutments and other infrastructure for visiting Yatries of Amarnath Ji Yatra at Baltal and Domail. 13. Regarding the Wildlife aspect of proposal, Pr. CCF has submitted in the agenda as under:- (a) Forms part of National Park, Wildlife Sanctuary, Natural Reservoir, Biosphere Reservoir etc. Proposed area is adjacent to Thajwas sanctuary. The uncontrolled flow of yatris will cause pollution... 14. The recorded decision of the Advisory Committee is reproduced as under:- "The Advisory Committee discussed this case in depth. The Chief Wildlife Warden apprised the Committee that he has already submitted his report under No. WLP/Tech/1971/07 dated 11.06.2007 after spot inspection on 27.5.2007, which is reproduced as under:- It was noticed that the proposed site for construction of Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board Complex, falling in the compartment 63(s)/Sindh/Kullan, is located on the right side of Sindh rivulet. The proposed complex does not seem to have any significant impact on the ecology of Thajwas Wildlife Sanctuary. The apprehensions of DFO Sindh and Wildlife Warden,Central that the said complex may have adverse impact on the Wildlife Sanctuary appear to be "over cautious" and an environmentally conservative approach. It is also given to understand that Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board is using pre-fabricated structures, as such likely pollution due to discharge of muck and garbage etc should not be significant . It is presumed that Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board will take necessary environmental safeguards as applicable for such development projects. In view of the above report, the Advisory Committee cleared the diversion of the above Forest land to Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board (SASB), on the following terms and conditions:- i) The proprietary status of forest land shall remain unchanged. ii) The forest land so diverted shall be utilised only for the purpose for which it has been diverted. It shall not be transferred to any other agency without approval of the Forest Department. iii) The forest land so diverted shall not be mortgaged, re-assigned or sub-leased by user agency in any manner what so ever to any other agency. (For the rest, see adjacent document) 15. As mentioned above, following the deferment of these cases in the Cabinet meeting on February 26,2008 a Committee under the Chairmanship of Chief Wildlife Warden was constituted vide Govt.order No. 108-FST of 2008 dated March 17,2008 to examine the feasibility of diversion of forest land vis-a-vis Wildlife Perspective for various developmental activities including construction of roads in Baltal-Ranga-Domail area of Ganderbal District as requested by Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board. The Committee has submitted its report vide letter dated May 7, 2008 (Annexure-A). The relevant extracts of the Committee's report are reproduced as under:- "That the proposed camping sites of Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board (SASB) complex comprising 39.88 hectares of forest land (30.88 Ha. At Baltal and 9.00 Ha at Domail) fall in the Forest Compartment No.63/Sindh of Sindh Forest Division, Forest Department. Theses proposed camping sites do not involve any area of Thajwas Wildlife Sanctuary, which is located on the left side of river Sindh... 17. The case for diversion of Forest Land for non-forestry purpose are required to be submitted to the Cabinet as per the provisions of the Jammu and Kashmir Forest (Conservation) Act after clearance by the Advisory Committee. However, Hon'ble Supreme Court of India passed directions in W.P. (c) No. 202/1995 in the case titled T.N. Godavarman V/S Union of India & others on 27.04.2007 as under: "...In the circumstances,we hereby give the following directions, pending our decision on the larger question indicated herein above: a) The FAC as it stands today will give priority to Projects which need immediate clearances. In this regard, it may be stated that fresh cases may be cleared project-wise by the FAC and thereafter such clearances shall be placed before this court for approval. We make it clear that pending the decision of the larger question, all clearances by the FAC of fresh cases shall be subject to approval by this Court. Before giving approval, we would like to have responses from the CEC in respect of each clearance. In order to avoid delay, we direct the concerned Ministry to give a copy of the clearance to the CEC so that the CEC would give its response expeditiously. We will examine each clearance and decide whether to grant or not to grant the approval thereto. Once the approval is granted by this Court, the matter may be placed before the central government for disposal in accordance with law..." 18. The above said order was sent to the Law Department for giving its opinion as to whether the same is applicable to J&K State. The Law Department has opined as under: "The order of the Hon'ble Supreme Court dated 27.04.2007 is with regard to the Forest Conservation (Central)Act, and rules framed thereunder. The said Act is not applicable to the State as forests continue to be in the state list. Earlier a similar case was examined and vide UO No. LD(Opn) 2006/77-Fst dated 06.03.2007 the department was advised to move an application before the Hon'ble Court to the effect that the Forest Conservation Act, 1990 (Central Act) is not applicable to the State. The State has its own Forest Act as well as Forest Conservation Act, 1997 and seeks clarification from the Hon'ble Court. The Department is advised to pursue the said matter vigorously with the Hon'ble Supreme Cour and awaits clarification in the matter." 19. In the meanwhile the PCCF vide communication NO. PCCF/FC/Gen./5/106 dated 21.07.2007 approached the Central Empowered Committee constituted by the Hon'ble Supreme Court... The CEC opined under: " The non-forest use of the forest land falling within the State of Jammu and Kashmir is governed by the provisions of the Jammu and Kashmir Forest (Conservation) Act, 1990 and not by the Forest (Conservation) Act, 1980. In view of the above, the CEC is of the view that the Hon'ble Supreme Court's order dated 27.04.2007 regarding the functioning of the Forest Advisory Committee constituted under Section 3 of the Forest (Conservation) Act, is not applicable in respect of the proposals examined by the State Level Advisory Committee constituted under the Jammu and Kashmir Forest (Conservation) Act, 1990 as amended from time time." 20. Advice of the Law Department was sought on the opinion of the CEC and the Law Department said as under: "The views of the CEC regarding the applicability of the orders of the Hon'ble Supreme Court is their opinion. The said opinion confirms the views of this Department. However, it would be safe, as advised earlier, to bring the legal position in the notice of the Hon'ble Supreme Court and seek their clarification as the State has its own Forest Conservation Act of 1990." 21. Subsequently, the matter was referred to the Ld. Advocate General for advice who said as under: "The Forests continue to be a subject with respect to which the state government has the power to make laws and not the Union. The Jammu and Kashmir Forest (Conservation) Act of 1997 is applicable to the state of J&K and the Rules have also been framed under the said Act. The J&K State Forest (Conservation) Rules provide for the constitution of a Forest Advisory Committee and it is within the jurisdiction of the said Forest Advisory Committee under the J&K State Forest (Conservation) Act to give clearance of projects for the purpose of non forestry purpose. So far as the rest of the States are concerned, the Forest (Conservation) Act 1980 is applicable to them. Under the aforesaid Forest (Conservation) Act Forest (Conservation) Rules 1981 had been framed. Under rule 4 of the Forest (Conservation) Rules of 1981 it is provided that the Forest Advisory Committee has to be constituted and the said Forest Advisory Committee shall have the jurisdiction to clear the projects where forest land is required for non forestry purposes. It appears that the Hon'ble Supreme Court in WP (C) 202/1995 titled T.N. Godavarman versus Union of India had stayed the working of the Forest Advisory Committee in terms of the Forest (Conservation) Rules of 1981. Subsequently vide order dated 27.04.2007 the Hon'ble Supreme Court had modified the order and had directed that the Forest Advisory Committee constituted under the Forest Conservation Rules of 2003 as it stands will give clearance of the projects where forest land is required for non forestry purposes and the project would be sent to a Central Empowered Committee, which would give its response expeditiously. I have gone through the order dated 27.04.2007 passed by the Hon'ble Supreme Court. Since neither the Forest (Conservation) Act of 1980 nor Forest (Conservation) Rules made there under are applicable to the State of J&K. The state is governed by the J&K Forest (Conservation) Act 1997 and Forest (Conservation) Rules, 2000. The Forest Advisory Committee has been constituted under the aforesaid Forest (Conservation) Rules, therefore, the order dated 27.04.2007 does not have any applicability with respect to the State of Jammu and Kashmir in as much as since the Forest (Conservation) Act of 1980 and the rules made thereunder are not applicable to the State of J&K. Moreso, a communication issued by the CEC on 27.07.2007 which is on file had clarified that the order of the Hon'ble Supreme Court dated 27.04.2007 regarding the functioning of the Forest Advisory Committee under section 3 of the Forest (Conservation) Act is not applicable in respect to the proposals examined by the State Level Advisory Committee constituted under the J&K Forest (Conservation) Act 1997. It is as such advised that the order dated 27.04.2007 does not pertain to the J&K State and proposals in J&K have to be examined by the Forest Advisory Committee constituted under the J&K Forest (Conservation) Act of 1997 and rules made thereunder." 22. Thereafter, GAD advised the Department to place the matter before the Hon'ble Dy. Chief Minister (Minister I/C Law) in view of two different opinions given by the Law Department and Ld. Advocated General. Accordingly, the matter was placed before the Hon'ble Dy. Chief Minister (Minister I/C Law) who opined as under: " There is no material difference between the opinion of Ld. Advocate General and that of the Law Department. The Law Department, by way of abundant caution, seeks to obtain the clarification of the Supreme Court. I concur with the view of the Central Empowered Committee and the Ld. Advocate General." 23. In view of the clarification given by the CEC constituted by the Hon'ble Supreme Court, Ld. Advocate General, Hon'ble Dy. Chief Minister (Minister I/C Law), the Principal Secretary to the Government Forest Department with the approval of the Hon'ble Minister for Forests, submits the above mentioned cases to the cabinet for taking a view and according approval for the use of forest land for non-forestry purposes, in favour of the above said organisations, on the terms and conditions recommended by the Advisory Committee in its 39th meeting, which have been reproduced in this memorandum, together with the recommendation made at para 16 of the memorandum in respect of case no. 4. Madhav Lal Principal Secretary to the Government of J&KDepartment of Forests * -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From iram at sarai.net Wed Aug 6 10:30:12 2008 From: iram at sarai.net (Iram Ghufran) Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2008 10:30:12 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: August 2008 for you (at Kriti) Message-ID: <48992FDC.5030003@sarai.net> ================================= Subject: August 2008 for you! From:"Kriti Team" Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 11:42:41 +0530 To: <"Undisclosed-Recipient:;"@artoflinux.org> ================================= Dear Friends A month of remembrance and freedom, we mark this August 2008 with the following days on our calenders: 6 Hiroshima day 9 Nagasaki/ International Day of the World’s Indigenous People 15 Indian Independence Day 30 International Day for Disappeared Persons We invite you for a play titled ‘Traitors’ on 8th August, 7.30 pm at the India Islamic Cultural Centre, Lodi Road, New Delhi; presented by Sangat, produced by Hungry Heart Festival with coordination support by the Kriti team. For invitations and tickets please call or write to us. We also invite you to come watch and discuss documentary films on 9th August at an event titled ‘A Deal for Life and Freedom’; organised by the Kriti Film Club, in collaboration with Delhi Solidarity Group and supported by Sangat.Starts 10 am and continues until 8 pm at the WorldWide Fund for Nature (WWF) Auditorium, Lodi Road, New Delhi. Entry to this event is free. Finally, an opportunity for us to share a selected list of books and films available for you to access from the Kriti DOCUSHOP. Several other titles available for reference and purchase as well. Do visit or write to us for details. Please check http://krititeam.blogspot.com for details! We hope to connect with you in August! In solidarity, Kriti Team Books Voices of Sanity- Reaching out for Peace By Kamba Bhasin, Smite Kothari, Bindia Thapar/ Lokayan & Rainbow/ New Delhi/ 2001 Contribution: Rs.125.00 Defeated Innocence By Rahul Ramagundam/ Grass Roots India Publications/ New Delhi/ 2001 Contribution: Rs.299.00 Gift for India By Sahmat/ New Delhi/ 1997 Contribution: Rs.500.00 Indian People in the Struggle for Freedom By Sahmat/ New Delhi/ 1998 Contribution: Rs. 70.00 Duniya Sabki (Hindi) Poems by Safdar Hashmi/ Safdar Hashmi Memorial Trust /New Delhi/ 2006 Contribution: Rs. 50.00 Nationalism without a Nation in By Aloysius/ Oxford University Press/ New Delhi/ 2008 Contribution: Rs. 295.00 Symposium on the Unification of NAGA Areas A report by NPMHR/ New Delhi/ 2005 Contribution: Rs. 30.00 Documentary Films Ek Khubusarat Jahaz By Gauhar Raza/ 19 Min/ Eng Contributions (VCD): Students – Rs. 60.00 Indivs/ Orgns – Rs. 60.00 Living in fear By K.P. Sasi/ 34 mins/ English Contribution (VCD): Indivs – Rs.250.00 Orgns – Rs.500.00 Buddha Weeps in Jadugoda By Shri Prakash/ 55 mins/ English Contribution (VCD): Rs. 1000.00 Gadia Lohar By Meenakshi Vinay Rai/ 25 mins/ English Contribution (VCD): Rs.500.00 The Bitter Drink By Saratchandran/ 31mins / English Contribution: VCD – Students: Rs.200.00 Indivs: Rs.300.00 Orgns: Rs.500.00 DVD – Students: Rs.500.00 Indivs: Rs.600.00 Orgns: Rs.1000.00 The Lake of Despair By Snehasis Das/ 31 mins/ English Contribution: DVD – Indivs: Rs.500.00 Orgns: Rs.1000.00 Kanavu Malayi Lekha (To the Dream Mountain) By M S Sasi/ 45 mins/ Local Language with English Subtitles Contribution: VCD – Students/Indivs: Rs.250.00 Orgns: Rs.250.00 DVD – Students: Rs.500.00 Indivs: Rs.600.00 Orgns: Rs.1000.00 In The Forest Hangs a Bridge By Sanjay Kak/ 40min 2sec/ English/ 1999 Contribution -: VCD – Indivs: Rs.400.00 Orgns: Rs.700.00 DVD – Indivs: Rs.500.00 Orgns: Rs.750.00 Jashne Azadi By Sanjay kak/ 138 mins/ Kashmiri, Urdu, English (with English subtitles) Contribution: DVD - Indivs: Rs. 500.00 Orgns: Rs. 1200.00 Waiting… By Shabnam Ara and Sushil Kumar / 39.39 mins/ Hindi/ Kashmiri with English subtitles Contribution: VCD – Indivs: Rs. 250.00 Orgns: Rs. 250.0 A Time to Rise By Anand Patwardhan/ 40 mins/ English Contribution: DVD - Indivs: Rs. 400.00 Orgns: Rs. 1200.00 Bhopa By Meenakshi Vinay Rai/ 31mins/ English Contribution: VCD - Rs. 500.00 Indigenous People Shot Dead for Development By Sarasi Das, Surya Shankar Dash/ 1 minute/English Contribution available on request The Lament of Niyamraja - a dongria kond song By Surya Shankar Dash/ 13 min Contribution available on request Niyamgiri - The Mountain of Law By Samadrusti TV and Surya Shankar Dash/ 100 min Contribution available on request Our Contact Info: 011-26027845/ 26033088 space.kriti(at)gmail.com http://krititeam.blogspot.com From ravikant at sarai.net Wed Aug 6 11:41:08 2008 From: ravikant at sarai.net (Ravikant) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 11:41:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: scholarship announcement Message-ID: <200808061141.08261.ravikant@sarai.net> Subject: Plz passs this information.. Date: मंगलवार 05 अगस्त 2008 20:50 From: "prabhat kumar" To: Hello. If anybody is interested in doing research on Marathi or Gujrati language satire in Heidelberg University with good scholarship there is still one seat vacant...Please contact Prof, Hans Harder.. H.Harder at uni-heidelberg.de.. *Scholarship Announcement * * * *Joint Project on Asian Satire in the Heidelberg „Cluster of Excellence"* * * The joint project "Gauging Cultural Asymmetries: Asian Satire and the Search for Identity in the Era of Colonialism and Imperialism" forms part of the Heidelberg Cluster of Excellence on „Asia and Europe: Shifting Asymmetries in Cultural Flows". In close cooperation with six disciplines, comprising Japanese Studies (Arokay), Chinese Studies (Mittler), Modern Indology (Harder), History of South Asia (Dharampal-Frick), Islamic Studies (Ursinus) and Arabic Studies (Enderwitz), a group of researchers (primarily PhD students) will study how various Asian traditions used satire in their engagement with Europe and Europeans. The project will begin in July 2008. Scholarships ranging from €1000 to €1400 per month (depending on academic and family status), will be granted for two years with an option of one additional year. Applicants should hold an excellent MA or (South Asian) MPhil degree, be ready to enrol at Heidelberg University and actively participate in all curricular activities pertaining to the project. Applications for the project is to be sent to: Prof. Hans Harder, Deptt. of Modern Indologie, South Asia Institute, University of Heidelberg, Germany. H.Harder at uni-heidelberg.de * * * * For details about the Heidelberg Cluster of Excellence, please consult www.vjc.uni-hd.de, and a short summary of the satire project can be had by writing to the e-mail address given above. Along with the usual application documents, please send a sample of academic work (e.g. 10 pages of an MA/MPhil thesis) and a short exposé explaining how the dissertation topic would be tackled (max. 1000 words, with explicit reference to primary and secondary sources). ------------------------------------------------------- From mailponni at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 12:44:19 2008 From: mailponni at gmail.com (ponni arasu) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 12:44:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: Keep saturday evening free - come to see a Play at JNU In-Reply-To: <1DA2E9F8-1980-46B5-8A69-032DBBC4E639@gmail.com> References: <765a15040808010324o2ac21cc5jbd467612b089b3ec@mail.gmail.com> <1DA2E9F8-1980-46B5-8A69-032DBBC4E639@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20d6b7240808060014l122cbbf5p72fd904a7e4b802@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Janaki Abraham Date: Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 10:09 PM Subject: Keep saturday evening free - come to see a Play at JNU To: ponni arasu , Padma Venkataraman < aramangai at gmail.com>, Geetha V Women's Studies Programme and Centre for Historical Studies, JNU Invites you to a Play KALAKKANAVU OR A DREAM OF TIME A FEMINIST DOCUDRAMA IN TAMIL WITH TRANSLATION Written by V. Geetha and Directed by Mangai SATURDAY, 9th AUGUST, 6:30 PM School of Arts and Aesthetics, JNU Kalakkanavu is a feminist docudrama that maps a women's history of almost a 100 years from the mid 19th to the mid 20th century and is pieced together from Tamil women's writings, speeches, songs and stage performances. All are welcome PLEASE DO COME! - -- Calvin: I wonder if you can refuse to inherit the world... Hobbes: I think if your born its too late. From anansi1 at earthlink.net Wed Aug 6 13:33:35 2008 From: anansi1 at earthlink.net (Paul Miller) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 04:03:35 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Art for Obama References: <732f71-3449-48949d56@web01.moveon.org> Message-ID: <15A6A191-F986-43B7-84C1-738541EA4DFF@earthlink.net> Hey you all - I thought some of the people on the list would be into this. It's event I'm doing with Shep Fairey (you know "Andre the Giant Has a Posse" stickers and the Obama Hope poster etc) - he's an old friend from college. We're presenting an art event with moveon.org around the theme of hope: the judges for the contest are, me, Ross Bleckner, Eric Fischl, Moby, Thurston Moore from Sonic Youth, Cydney Payton, Executive Director and Chief Curator Museum of Modern Art, Denver, and Nancy Spector - Guggenheim Museum Curator of Contemporary Art. Brief description: http://www.artinfo.com/news/story/28236/groups-unite-to-bring-pro-obama-art-to-convention/ Details: > The "Yes We Can" video by will.i.am. The 1000+ positive Obama ads > created by MoveOn members. The iconic Obama "HOPE" poster created by > artist Shepard Fairey. > > Barack Obama's historic candidacy has sparked an unprecedented > artistic outpouring. Now, in partnership with Shepard Fairey and his > Obey Giant collective, we're offering a new way for artists—anyone > with a pen and paper qualifies—to share their talents and help elect > Barack Obama at the same time. > > It's called Manifest Hope, and it's a new Obama art contest for 2D > and 3D art, from painting to photography to sculpture. The winners > will be shown at the Manifest Hope Gallery online and in Denver > during the Democratic convention alongside works from dozens of > established and influential artists. > > If you think you might want to enter, or want updates on the > contest, please let us know here: > > http://pol.moveon.org/mh/signup/?id=13385-7548785-WyC03wx&t=3 > > If not, can you pass this on to friends of yours who might be > interested? > > Anyone can enter. You don't have to be Picasso, you just need to be > inspired by Barack Obama and willing to donate your creativity and > time to the cause. > > But you need to get started soon. The final submissions deadline is > August 18th at 11:59 a.m. ET. That's not much time to conceive and > create a piece of art, so get started today. > > All submissions will be judged by a distinguished panel of judges— > artists from Obey Giant, contemporary art curators, and multi- > talented musicians. Finalists will be asked to auction off their > pieces, and donate the proceeds to progressive organizations. > > Denver will be buzzing during the convention, but this gallery is > going to be one of the coolest places to visit there. Plus, the > gallery's going to have an amazing party with live performances by > Death Cab For Cutie, Moby, and Clap Your Hands Say Yeah. > > We're not going to send any more emails to the full MoveOn list > before the submission deadline. So if there's any chance you might > be interested, you have to sign up for contest updates now: > > http://pol.moveon.org/mh/signup/?id=13385-7548785-WyC03wx&t=4 > > Thanks for all you do. > > –Peter, Karin, Laura, Ilyse and the rest of the team > > P.S. It's okay to enter a piece of art you've already created, as > long as you're willing to offer it up for auction if it becomes a > finalist. If you're ready to enter right now, you can upload your > entry here: > > http://pol.moveon.org/mh/enter/?id=13385-7548785-WyC03wx&t=5 > > Want to support our work? We're entirely funded by our 3.2 million > members—no corporate contributions, no big checks from CEOs. And our > tiny staff ensures that small contributions go a long way. From peter.ksmtf at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 13:44:04 2008 From: peter.ksmtf at gmail.com (T Peter) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 13:44:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] CZM notification: role of NGO flayed Message-ID: <3457ce860808060114l74a6ec67se23a0aa217a7bf52@mail.gmail.com> CZM notification: role of NGO flayed Date:06/08/2008 URL: http://www.thehindu.com/2008/08/06/stories/2008080650190200.htm Special Correspondent Thiruvananthapuram: The Kerala Swatantra Matsya Thozhilali Federation (KSMTF) has expressed concern over the role of a Non-Governmental Organisation called Centre for Environment and Education (CEE) in the public consultation on the controversial Coastal Zone Management (CZM) notification issued by the Union Ministry of Environment and Forests (MoEF). A pressnote quoting T. Peter, KSMTF president, here on Tuesday feared that the real sentiments of the people would not be taken into consideration by the NGO during the consultation. The website of the NGO states that it was working in tandem with the Ministry to create awareness on the CZM notification. This, he said, revealed the real agenda of the NGO. Mr. Peter said the CZM notification was severely opposed by the fishing community all over the country right from the time it was suggested by Dr. M.S. Swaminathan on the grounds that the CZM would legitimise the establishment of hazardous industries in the coastal belt, threatening the lives of fishing community and their rights over the coastal land." The CEE, Mr. Peter said, was a 'Centre of Excellence' supported by the Ministry and two members of its governing council were nominees from the MoEF. The pressnote said the attempt of the Ministry to use an NGO to generate legitimacy was highly questionable. It added that the KSMTF would launch an agitation unless the Ministry called off its efforts to implement the CZM notification. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Wed Aug 6 17:34:36 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 05:04:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] "India: Band-Aid for cancer" by M J Akbar Message-ID: <147173.20174.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> QUOTE FROM THE ARTICLE   The innocents have been killed and maimed by terrorists who have Osama Bin Laden as their inspiration. I could produce a spread of direct and indirect evidence,......................The hate literature spawned by the Indian terrorist groups are full of the anti-Hindu venom that is encouraged by organizations like Lashkar-e-Taiba, with its haven in Pakistan.   Common sense would suggest that those Indian politicians who claim to have some sympathy for Indian Muslims would seek, in their speeches, to create a distance between this deadly extreme fringe and the broad mass of the community, not only because this was wise but primarily because this was true. Instead, such of their ilk who are in the present government in Delhi have indulged in a curious, and inexplicable, dichotomy.   UNQUOTE     http://arabnews.com/?page=7§ion=0&article=112356&d=3&m=8&y=2008&pix=opinion.jpg&category=Opinion%22   India: Band-Aid for cancer M.J. Akbar    In the general elections of 2004 the irrepressible and sometimes irresponsible Lalu Prasad Yadav used to tow around a maulvi when in campaign mode. Nothing particularly wrong with that. Politicians have this tendency to turn mullahs into best friends at election time. What was the particular competence of this maulvi that attracted Lalu Yadav? Was he a great alim, or scholar, erudite in the finer points of Shariah? Was he a fine economist with specialized knowledge in the intricate problems of rural Bihar?   The reason was less subtle. He was a lookalike of Osama Bin Laden. He even handed out autographs signed “Osama”.   Lalu Yadav sent out two unmissable signals with his thoughtless pandering. He told non-Muslims that the true role model of all Bihar Muslims, irrespective of what they said in their politically-correct avatar, was a person whose name had become synonymous with terrorism. And he told Muslims, particularly their impressionable young, that Osama was a legitimate role model.   Did Sonia Gandhi, an ally of Lalu Yadav, question him or even raise the subject? Not a word. Votes were more important, even if they came in the name of Osama Bin Laden. Did the subject arise when Sonia Gandhi offered Lalu Yadav a prominent place in Manmohan Singh’s Cabinet? No. To be fair to Lalu, this traveling Osama was not by his side in the assembly elections that soon followed the general elections. He had switched over — or, to be more precise, had been purchased by Ram Vilas Paswan. Did the Congress ask questions this time around? Not a chance. Votes, votes, votes: That was the only morality. It was all dismissed as a joke, and the laughter was doubtless very hearty in the comfortable drawing rooms of Lutyens’ Delhi. The joke has soured on the killing fields of Malegaon, Hyderabad, Jaipur, Bangalore, Ahmedabad and a roster of cities that could enter the list of dread. The dead do not laugh even when there is a comedian as rich in range as Lalu Yadav.   The innocents have been killed and maimed by terrorists who have Osama Bin Laden as their inspiration. I could produce a spread of direct and indirect evidence, from the manifesto of Indian Mujahedeen to the taped speeches of Mohammad Masood Azhar (released by the BJP during the bargain over the hijacked Indian Airlines) to the honorifics used by “commanders” of the terror groups. Maulana Sufiyan Patanigia, once head of the Lal Masjid seminary in Ahmedabad, and now on a revenge mission after the Gujarat carnage of 2002, is known as the Indian Mullah Omar, while his deputy Suhail Khan delights in the nickname “Chhota Osama”. The hate literature spawned by the Indian terrorist groups are full of the anti-Hindu venom that is encouraged by organizations like Lashkar-e-Taiba, with its haven in Pakistan.   Common sense would suggest that those Indian politicians who claim to have some sympathy for Indian Muslims would seek, in their speeches, to create a distance between this deadly extreme fringe and the broad mass of the community, not only because this was wise but primarily because this was true. Instead, such of their ilk who are in the present government in Delhi have indulged in a curious, and inexplicable, dichotomy. On the one side the Lalu Yadavs tout an Osama to fuel the worst kind of sentiment. And, on the other, there is what amounts to a complete denial that is inconsistent with facts. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh seems to subsist on comfort food, perhaps because the truth is politically indigestible. The most serious instance of comfort food was the formulation he offered to his good friend George W. Bush during the latter’s official visit to India. He said that no Indian Muslim was involved in terrorism, and offered as evidence that you could not find any Indian Muslim in Osama’s Al-Qaeda. President Bush, in his wisdom, picked this up as proof of his theory that democracy was a panacea for all ills. Not only did democracies never go to war against one another, but they also managed to secure Indian Muslims from the temptations of terrorism.   Manmohan had clearly not consulted his intelligence agencies when he came to such a conclusion. Even a check with the Mumbai courts might have persuaded him otherwise. Indian nationals have been involved in terrorist conspiracies at least since 1993, after the trauma of the demolition of the Babri Mosque and the Congress government’s startling indifference to both its loss and the communal havoc that ensued. It is possible that Manmohan meant well. But self-delusion is not diagnosis. It is perhaps such a frame of mind that takes the government toward a soft view of the guilt of Afzal Guru. Guru has been convicted for possibly the most outrageous attack on the Indian state. His conviction has been confirmed by the Supreme Court. There are no more legal avenues to traverse.   Look at this situation from the point of view of the veteran or the prospective terrorist. To start with, he knows that in India there is a lot of crime and very little punishment. If the guilty do get caught, it is often fortuitously. For lesser crimes, corruption is the sanctioned solution. For unforgivable crimes like terrorism, there is a pattern. An incident occurs, and lights flare in media. Worthy dignitaries visit the site and trot off to hospital. The home minister of India repeats the same inane things he has been saying for four years. And then everyone retreats into the default mode of complacency. What is there to worry about? And when an Afzal Guru is caught and convicted, the state dithers. Perhaps this is why the Indian Mujahedeen had the belligerence to taunt the government, through an e-mail (sent before the timers wreaked their damage) that they were Indians and that there was little use in explaining this away with alibis.   The most interesting characteristic about homegrown terrorism is the degree of sophistication it has acquired. The Ahmedabad bombings began with an automobile theft in Navi Mumbai; the cars traveled to Surat and Vadodara to pick up their arsenals before reaching Ahmedabad. The detonators were timed to inflict maximum damage on innocents, with a first, second and third tier of victims. This is a large operation from mastermind to foot soldiers, with a foreign connection but an Indian network. If our police cannot fold in a net, then policing has lost all meaning.   The battle is in India. India is being poisoned with a cancer. And all the government has as an answer is Band Aid. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Wed Aug 6 18:49:29 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 06:19:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808040235q560bdd25pa48f6d36849c9303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <148810.19675.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> " This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously"   This comment could have been made only by someone who:   (a.) has very little idea of the realities of Kashmir    OR   (b.) acts (knowingly or unknowingly) as a mouthpiece for the separatists in Kashmir and in that role regurgitates from publications like 'Greater Kashmir', promoting thereby the separatist agenda      OR   (c.) is a complete idiot   Shivam Vij certainly qualifies for (a.) and (b.). No wonder he made that comment.     Kshmendra   --- On Mon, 8/4/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph To: "rashneek kher" Cc: "sarai list" Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 3:05 PM This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Wed Aug 6 20:07:22 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 14:37:22 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph In-Reply-To: <148810.19675.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <841872.64068.qm@web27805.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Well! Ahsan Dar does not belong to Hizb and therefore his is definitely a view from fringe or not even that. Hizbul Mujahideen is still present in Kashmir and the only indigenous Kashmiri resistance. Dar left Hizb in early 1991 and formed his own group known as Muslim Mujahideen that later became second counter insurgent group in Kashmir after Ikhwan. whatever is the case - Dar's statement should be condemned with full force. I remember meeting Dar sahib umpteen times when he was the most wanted man and even doing his first ever interview for the Indian press in early 1991. As Hizb chief he allegedly issued a press statement that time on behalf of Hizb asking Pandits to leave the Valley which added to the fear among the minority. Many years later, when he was chief of Muslim Mujahideen and was living freely in Srinagar, I asked him about his role in that press release - he feigned ignorance accusing the indian intelligence for issuing it. Strangely it is widely believed that Muslim Mujahideen was formed by the Indian agencies and Dar was fully being supported by the Indian security - an allegation that can be corroborated with much circumstantial evidence. Muslim Mujahideen was later completely taken over the Indian Army. But now that Dar Sahib has come back from Pakistan after a long hiatus, one wonders whose side is he on? Loyalties in Kashmir often shift faster than wind.   Murtaza   ---- Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffairs.org --- On Wed, 6/8/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: From: Kshmendra Kaul Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph To: "sarai list" <> Date: Wednesday, 6 August, 2008, 2:19 PM " This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously"   This comment could have been made only by someone who:   (a.) has very little idea of the realities of Kashmir    OR   (b.) acts (knowingly or unknowingly) as a mouthpiece for the separatists in Kashmir and in that role regurgitates from publications like 'Greater Kashmir', promoting thereby the separatist agenda      OR   (c.) is a complete idiot   Shivam Vij certainly qualifies for (a.) and (b.). No wonder he made that comment.     Kshmendra   --- On Mon, 8/4/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Stay Away,Pandits Told-Telegraph To: "rashneek kher" Cc: "sarai list" Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 3:05 PM This is clearly a fringe view in the Valley. The Hizb hardly has any presence left for its warnings to be taken seriously _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> __________________________________________________________ Not happy with your email address?. Get the one you really want - millions of new email addresses available now at Yahoo! http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/ymail/new.html From nc-agricowi at netcologne.de Wed Aug 6 13:49:59 2008 From: nc-agricowi at netcologne.de (artNET) Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2008 10:19:59 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BAnnouncements=5D_Call_for_entries?= =?iso-8859-1?q?=3A_CologneOFF_IV_-_Here_We_Are!?= Message-ID: <20080806101959.67F6DBBE.2718C6BB@192.168.0.3> Call for entries: deadline: Monday, 1 September 2008 --------------------------- CologneOFF IV - 4th edition of Cologne Online Film Festival http://coff.newmediafest.org is planned to be launched in November 2008 under the festival theme: Here We Are! - "memory" and "identity" in an experimental context ---------------------------------------------------- Entry ---------------------------------------------------- VideoChannel - video project environments http://videochannel.newmediafest.org invites artists and directors for submitting videos/films, i.e. narratives and documentations (max 15 min.) experimenting with new concepts of transforming artistic contents into moving images, new forms of representing und new technologies deadline: 1 September 2008 All entry details and the submission form can be found on netEX - networked experience http://www.nmartproject.net/netex/?p=238 ---------------------------------------------------- About CologneOFF ---------------------------------------------------- CologneOFF - Cologne Online Film Festival http://coff.newmediafest.org, founded in 2006 as a new type of mobile film & video festival taking place simultaneously online and in physical space in cooperation with partner festivals, is directed by Wilfried Agricola de Cologne The first 3 festival editions CologneOFF I - "Identityscapes" - 2006 CologneOFF II - "Image vs Music" - 2006 CologneOFF III - "Toon! Toon! - art cartoons and animates narriatives" - 2007 were presented between 2006 and 2008 in cooperation with festivals in India, The Netherlands, Venezuela, Argentina, France Serbia, Spain, Poland, Belgium, Turkey, Greece, Mexico, Bosnia-Hercegovia and others More info on http://coff.newmediafest.org ------------------------------------------- This call is released by netEX - networked experience http://www.nmartproject.net/netex/ info (at) nmartproject.net _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From logos.theword at gmail.com Thu Aug 7 12:30:23 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 12:30:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 14 In-Reply-To: <33bc2ee60808062341gf219918n4fb3c2bd6ebde0d8@mail.gmail.com> References: <33bc2ee60808062341gf219918n4fb3c2bd6ebde0d8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808070000t7a5e7d56hb562fdda433cdcd1@mail.gmail.com> Dear Vishnu, Isn't an 'independent' entity supported by corporate money (especially a rogue outfit like the Tatas) a bit of an oxymoron? Ah well, one more step in the corporate (mis) appropriation and institutioanlization of art. Then again, I don't expect you to respond to this - obviously you've first had to firmly plant your head in the sand of apathy in order to get your monthly dole from Mr. Tata's minions. I wonder if there are going to be 'artistic' endeavours extolling the great, new people's car, made possible by the TIA? Lastly, a plea to all those on this list who still are artists, in the real sense - if the Tatas and their puppets like the IFA represent 'art' in this country, let's form an India Foundation for the non-Arts, shall we? Our theatre, after all, has stayed in the holiness and filth of streets, the breath of the great unwashed - let's relcaim 'theatre' from the venal casuistry of these foundations and take it back where it belongs! Meanwhile, the pyre of Tapashi Malik still burns. Warm regards, Arka On 07/08/2008, Logos Theatre wrote: > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 23:58:03 +0530 (IST) > From: VISHNU VARDHAN > Subject: [Reader-list] Launch of the Theatre Infrastructure Cell > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <485189.3148.qm at web94910.mail.in2.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Dear Friends and Colleagues, > > The > Arts and Culture team of the Sir Ratan Tata Trust and Allied Trusts > invites you to the launch of Theatre Infrastructure Cell funded by the > Lady Navjbai Ratan Tata Trust and set up in collaboration with India > Foundation for the Arts (IFA), Bangalore. Please find the invite below. > > > > Warmly, > Vishnu > > > India Foundation for the > Arts > invites you to the launch of > the > Theatre Infrastructure Cell > > A joint initiative with the Navajbai Ratan Tata > Trust > > Venue: United > Theological > College, Miller's Road, Bangalore > > > > > > Telephone: 080 > 23333438 > Date: > Friday August 8th, > 2008 > Time: > 5.00 pm > RSVP: Vindya – > vindya at indiaifa.org > Tele / Fax: 91 80 23414681 / > 82 > > The launch event, apart from presenting the work and > objectives of the TIC, will also feature an open-house discussion involving > performing artists, production designers, and architects. > > Kindly share this invitation with others who may be > interested in knowing more about this initiative > > Background > > > > > > The Navajbai Ratan Tata Trust (NRTT) and > India Foundation for the Arts (IFA) have jointly set up the Theatre > Infrastructure Cell (TIC), which aims to work towards strengthening > infrastructure in the field of performing arts. The Cell will look at > infrastructure issues holistically and lend advisory support as well as > monetary > support to projects on a case-by-case basis. An Advisory Panel consisting > of > eminent architects, theatre directors and designers has been set up to > guide and > strengthen TIC's work. The panel consists of Bansi Kaul (Theatre Director), > Himanshu Burte (Architect), Jagan Shah (Architect), Naveen Kishore > (Publisher > and Lighting Designer), Sunil Shanbag (Theatre Director), and Vivek > Patankar > (Architect and Acoustics Expert). > > The NRTT is an allied trust of the > Sir Ratan Tata Trust (SRTT) and is one of the leading funding organisations > of > Arts and Culture in India. The Tata Trusts' Arts and > Culture portfolio is committed to strengthening and developing the field of > arts > through its diverse programmatic interventions of funding art institutions, > arts > initiatives, research in arts, advanced learning in the arts and > collaborative > field interventions. > > > > > > > IFA is an independent, nationwide > philanthropy, professionally managed, and dedicated to strengthening the > arts in > India. IFA has funded more > than 225 projects over the last 14 years. It supports research and practice > leading to films, books, artworks, archives, exhibitions and performances. > The > IFA also helps bring the arts into the classroom while funding the > preservation > and transmission of valuable cultural knowledge. Another area of its work > is to > offer advice, information and expertise related to the Indian > arts. > > Theatre Infrastructure > Cell > India Foundation for the Arts > Bangalore > (080) > 23414681/23414682 > Please visit our website www.indiaifa.org > > > > T. Vishnu Vardhan > > (Ph.D)University of Ulster UK - CSCS Bangalore > > Consultant, Arts and Culture Programme, > > Sir Ratan Tata Trust. > > > > #466, 9th Cross, I Block > > Jayanagar, Bangalore - 11. > > Tel: +91 80 26562986 > > Mobile: +91 9845207308 > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > ------------------------------ > -- > Logos Theatre > In the beginning was the word > No. 126, > 3rd Main Road, > Jayamahal Extension, > Bangalore 560046 > -------------------------------------------------------- > If it be now, 'tis not to come; > if it be not to come, it will be now; > if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. > Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? > Let be. -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Thu Aug 7 13:22:18 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 12:52:18 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] "India: Band-Aid for cancer" by M J Akbar In-Reply-To: <147173.20174.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <147173.20174.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It is well known fact that the politicians like lalu, Mulayam and Sonia with their psuedo secular facade really do not care or are concerned about welfare of muslims or to that matter any citizens of any community. All these "leaders" aspire is their own safety and comforts in power, at any cost. It is to be noted that muslims in general do not want a state of unsafe and terrorised living in the nation. Their leaders have time and again failed them by use of fear psychosis against BJP and propaganda that "secular" parties are not communal in their vote bank politics and thus put the muslims in ghetto mentality. Laalu and Mulayam can talk about and against BJP only on three issues, -- the demolition of a old dilapidated building known as babri masjid, Bangaru in the sting by tehelka seen taking a lakh of rupee for "the new year party" being given by pimps and prostitutes of tehelka in neo sting operation of journalism, and ofccourse about gujarath riots where both hindus and muslim rioters were shot for the riot acts with these leaders having soft corner for muslim rioters. ! The very fact that the home ministry and its officials could not put up facts about SIMI and its acts of terror by proper documentation tells citizens a bigger story just as the few channels are on over drive with huge adrevenue about "dreams " of delhi, released to certain channels only at crores of adrevenue to these favourite channels for whatever it takes. A home minister, who is as a speaker supposed to be above party politics, Shivaraj patil, now Home minister talking politics on national security is a national shame, as he has nothing to loose as he has lost credibility with loss in elections , now nominated to rajyasabha, thanks to his Madam. PM who is again, a nominated PM, with defence minister again nominated, madam on sojourn to Beijing, who is interested in national interests and security of citizens. ? ----- Original Message ----- From: Kshmendra Kaul Date: Wednesday, August 6, 2008 5:36 pm Subject: [Reader-list] "India: Band-Aid for cancer" by M J Akbar To: sarai list > QUOTE FROM THE ARTICLE >   > The innocents have been killed and maimed by terrorists who have > Osama Bin Laden as their inspiration. I could produce a spread of > direct and indirect evidence,......................The hate > literature spawned by the Indian terrorist groups are full of the > anti-Hindu venom that is encouraged by organizations like Lashkar- > e-Taiba, with its haven in Pakistan. >   > Common sense would suggest that those Indian politicians who claim > to have some sympathy for Indian Muslims would seek, in their > speeches, to create a distance between this deadly extreme fringe > and the broad mass of the community, not only because this was > wise but primarily because this was true. Instead, such of their > ilk who are in the present government in Delhi have indulged in a > curious, and inexplicable, dichotomy. >   > UNQUOTE >   >   > http://arabnews.com/?page=7§ion=0&article=112356&d=3&m=8&y=2008&pix=opinion.jpg&category=Opinion%22 >   > > > > > India: Band-Aid for cancer > M.J. Akbar  > >   > > > In the general elections of 2004 the irrepressible and sometimes > irresponsible Lalu Prasad Yadav used to tow around a maulvi when > in campaign mode. Nothing particularly wrong with that. > Politicians have this tendency to turn mullahs into best friends > at election time. What was the particular competence of this > maulvi that attracted Lalu Yadav? Was he a great alim, or scholar, > erudite in the finer points of Shariah? Was he a fine economist > with specialized knowledge in the intricate problems of rural Bihar? >   > The reason was less subtle. He was a lookalike of Osama Bin Laden. > He even handed out autographs signed “Osama”. >   > Lalu Yadav sent out two unmissable signals with his thoughtless > pandering. He told non-Muslims that the true role model of all > Bihar Muslims, irrespective of what they said in their politically- > correct avatar, was a person whose name had become synonymous with > terrorism. And he told Muslims, particularly their impressionable > young, that Osama was a legitimate role model. >   > Did Sonia Gandhi, an ally of Lalu Yadav, question him or even > raise the subject? Not a word. Votes were more important, even if > they came in the name of Osama Bin Laden. Did the subject arise > when Sonia Gandhi offered Lalu Yadav a prominent place in Manmohan > Singh’s Cabinet? No. > To be fair to Lalu, this traveling Osama was not by his side in > the assembly elections that soon followed the general elections. > He had switched over — or, to be more precise, had been purchased > by Ram Vilas Paswan. Did the Congress ask questions this time > around? Not a chance. Votes, votes, votes: That was the only > morality. It was all dismissed as a joke, and the laughter was > doubtless very hearty in the comfortable drawing rooms of Lutyens’ > Delhi. The joke has soured on the killing fields of Malegaon, > Hyderabad, Jaipur, Bangalore, Ahmedabad and a roster of cities > that could enter the list of dread. The dead do not laugh even > when there is a comedian as rich in range as Lalu Yadav. >   > The innocents have been killed and maimed by terrorists who have > Osama Bin Laden as their inspiration. I could produce a spread of > direct and indirect evidence, from the manifesto of Indian > Mujahedeen to the taped speeches of Mohammad Masood Azhar > (released by the BJP during the bargain over the hijacked Indian > Airlines) to the honorifics used by “commanders” of the terror > groups. Maulana Sufiyan Patanigia, once head of the Lal Masjid > seminary in Ahmedabad, and now on a revenge mission after the > Gujarat carnage of 2002, is known as the Indian Mullah Omar, while > his deputy Suhail Khan delights in the nickname “Chhota Osama”. > The hate literature spawned by the Indian terrorist groups are > full of the anti-Hindu venom that is encouraged by organizations > like Lashkar-e-Taiba, with its haven in Pakistan. >   > Common sense would suggest that those Indian politicians who claim > to have some sympathy for Indian Muslims would seek, in their > speeches, to create a distance between this deadly extreme fringe > and the broad mass of the community, not only because this was > wise but primarily because this was true. Instead, such of their > ilk who are in the present government in Delhi have indulged in a > curious, and inexplicable, dichotomy. On the one side the Lalu > Yadavs tout an Osama to fuel the worst kind of sentiment. And, on > the other, there is what amounts to a complete denial that is > inconsistent with facts. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh seems to > subsist on comfort food, perhaps because the truth is politically > indigestible. The most serious instance of comfort food was the > formulation he offered to his good friend George W. Bush during > the latter’s official visit to India. He said that no Indian > Muslim was involved in terrorism, and offered as evidence that you > could not find any Indian Muslim in Osama’s Al-Qaeda. President > Bush, in his wisdom, picked this up as proof of his theory that > democracy was a panacea for all ills. Not only did democracies > never go to war against one another, but they also managed to > secure Indian Muslims from the temptations of terrorism. >   > Manmohan had clearly not consulted his intelligence agencies when > he came to such a conclusion. Even a check with the Mumbai courts > might have persuaded him otherwise. Indian nationals have been > involved in terrorist conspiracies at least since 1993, after the > trauma of the demolition of the Babri Mosque and the Congress > government’s startling indifference to both its loss and the > communal havoc that ensued. It is possible that Manmohan meant > well. But self-delusion is not diagnosis. It is perhaps such a > frame of mind that takes the government toward a soft view of the > guilt of Afzal Guru. Guru has been convicted for possibly the most > outrageous attack on the Indian state. His conviction has been > confirmed by the Supreme Court. There are no more legal avenues to > traverse.  > Look at this situation from the point of view of the veteran or > the prospective terrorist. To start with, he knows that in India > there is a lot of crime and very little punishment. If the guilty > do get caught, it is often fortuitously. For lesser crimes, > corruption is the sanctioned solution. For unforgivable crimes > like terrorism, there is a pattern. An incident occurs, and lights > flare in media. Worthy dignitaries visit the site and trot off to > hospital. The home minister of India repeats the same inane things > he has been saying for four years. And then everyone retreats into > the default mode of complacency. What is there to worry about? And > when an Afzal Guru is caught and convicted, the state dithers. > Perhaps this is why the Indian Mujahedeen had the belligerence to > taunt the government, through an e-mail (sent before the timers > wreaked their damage) that they were Indians and that there was > little use in explaining this away with alibis. >   > The most interesting characteristic about homegrown terrorism is > the degree of sophistication it has acquired. The Ahmedabad > bombings began with an automobile theft in Navi Mumbai; the cars > traveled to Surat and Vadodara to pick up their arsenals before > reaching Ahmedabad. The detonators were timed to inflict maximum > damage on innocents, with a first, second and third tier of > victims. This is a large operation from mastermind to foot > soldiers, with a foreign connection but an Indian network. If our > police cannot fold in a net, then policing has lost all meaning. >   > The battle is in India. India is being poisoned with a cancer. And > all the government has as an answer is Band Aid. > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From mailponni at gmail.com Thu Aug 7 14:20:00 2008 From: mailponni at gmail.com (ponni arasu) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 14:20:00 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: 'Researching Gender: Women and History': A Discussion with V Geetha In-Reply-To: <6ca6ba0f0808061026x60c15fbdn2cf23425423fe583@mail.gmail.com> References: <6ca6ba0f0808061026x60c15fbdn2cf23425423fe583@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20d6b7240808070150s6cfa764dy3a618fbf4b04a0c5@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: History Association Date: Wed, Aug 6, 2008 at 10:56 PM Subject: 'Researching Gender: Women and History': A Discussion with V Geetha To: Yogesh Sharma , yengkhom at gmail.com, vishamenon at gmail.com, vijukrishnan at gmail.com, vaidik at yahoo.com, umesh.kadampanad at gmail.com, toatulonly at gmail.com, tanvy-k at yahoo.com, tanu9verma at yahoo.co.in, susmita19 at gmail.com, susantajnu at rediffmail.com, surbhim20 at yahoo.com, Supriya Varma , sumitsarkar_2001 at yahoo.co.in, sukanya.mitra at gmail.com, Sucheta Mahajan < mahajan_sucheta at yahoo.com>, subir_dey16 at yahoo.com, srupakheti at history.rutgers.edu, srinivasdusi at yahoo.com, snigdha_vk at hotmail.com, snajafhaider at yahoo.co.in, siva.kavita at gmail.com, singhdhrubkumar at rediffmail.com, shynithandasseriyil at yahoo.com, shubhrachakrabarti at yahoo.com, shreya_c10 at hotmail.com, shravan_narayan at rediffmail.com, shonaleeka.kaul at yale.edu, shijusam at gmail.com, shalini64_shah at rediffmail.com, shailka_16 at yahoo.co.in, sguha at history.rutgers.edu, sarojbangaru at yahoo.co.in, sanjukta.sunderason at gmail.com, sanahal_169 at yahoo.co.in, samira.jnu at gmail.com, saher.mahmood at gmail.com, saagartewari at gmail.com, Saagarika Dadu < saagaryka at gmail.com>, roopalprakash at yahoo.co.in, rochisha_n at yahoo.com, ritupangoswami at gmail.com, rinkupegu at rediffmail.com, richasinhblue at yahoo.co.in, resis2imp at yahoo.co.in, Ranabir Chakravarty < ranabirchsjnu at gmail.com>, ramanb at umich.edu, rajni.du at rediffmail.com, rajatdatta at mail.jnu.ac.in, rahulishwar at yahoo.com, radhikagovindrajan at gmail.com, radhika_singha at yahoo.co.in, r_itupan at yahoo.co.uk, queeny.singh at gmail.com, qajnu at yahoo.com, psamarendra at hotmail.com, progarbage at yahoo.com, pravat_g at rediffmail.com, prathamabanerjee at gmail.com, prabodhanpol at rediffmail.com, prabhuayan at gmail.com, postlipok at rediffmail.com, postbodhi at yahoo.co.in, pkdatta at cssscal.org, pkbasant at rediffmail.com, persaudk at gmail.com, paulamigb at rediffmail.com, parthodatta at gmail.com, parth shil < parthoshil at gmail.com>, ostbodhi at yahoo.co.in, nut_ta_nan at yahoo.com, noopurhoney at gmail.com, nilendrabardiar at gmail.com, neeladri1 at gmail.com, narayanigupta at rediffmail.com, Nandita P Sahay , nandinisundar at yahoo.com, mudit.trivedi at gmail.com, msgunarathne at yahoo.com, mridulaaditya at gmail.com, mohiyarmoon at gmail.com, milianand5 at rediffmail.com, mekhola.gomes at gmail.com, Meha Mathur , meghna.chowdhuri at gmail.com, megha24shukla at yahoo.com, meetnandi at hotmail.com, meeravis at gmail.com, medhasaxena at gmail.com, mario.dpenha at gmail.com, mandakini_devasher at hotmail.com, malekandathil at yahoo.co.in, mailponni at gmail.com, mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com, Mahalakshmi < mahaarakesh at gmail.com>, m_sharma13 at hotmail.com, lohiajs at yahoo.com, lakshmi_arya at mail.com, kumkumr at yahoo.com, kumargagan at yahoo.com, khannameenakshi at gmail.com, jyoti_kumari123 at yahoo.co.in, Jyoti Atwal < Jyoti_atwal at mail.jnu.ac.in>, justinjnu at gmail.com, jpachuau at 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googlemail.com, bham17mj at gmail.com, Bhagwan Josh , bev.b66 at gmail.com, benaseer at gmail.com, bdchattopadhyaya at googlemail.com, bandanirban at gmail.com, astral.sonam at gmail.com, arvindsinha4 at yahoo.uk, Arvind Sinha < arvindsinha4 at yahoo.co.uk>, archieprasad at gmail.com, aparna_balachandran at yahoo.com, anya at bgl.vsnl.net.in, anna_t_257 at yahoo.com, anish.vanaik at gmail.com, anirbanghoshpresi at gmail.com, anandaroop_sen at hotmail.com, amiyasen at hotmail.com, aminshahid at gmail.com, aks850 at hotmail.com, aks_mishy at yahoo.com, ajita2001in at yahoo.co.in, ahmnash at gmail.com, adityapant at gmail.com, aditya_goenka at hotmail.com, adipant at yahoo.co.in, addyjam at gmail.com, Abhimanyu_Arha at yahoo.com, ab1232 at columbia.edu * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *THE HISTORY ASSOCIATION* *CENTRE FOR HISTORICAL STUDIES* * * INVITES YOU FOR A DISCUSSION ON *RESEARCHING GENDER:* *WOMEN AND HISTORY* with V. Geetha 3.00 pm 8 Aug.'08 Room No. 001 CHS Committee Room School Of Social Sciences-I * * *__________________________* *V. Geetha* is a writer, translator, social historian, activist and a freelance editor with a number of small research journals. A leading intellectual from Tamil Nadu, she has been active in the Indian women's movement since 1988, organising workshops and conferences. V. Geetha has written widely, both in Tamil and English, on gender, popular culture, caste, and politics of Tamil Nadu. * * - -- Calvin: I wonder if you can refuse to inherit the world... Hobbes: I think if your born its too late. From arundhatighosh at indiaifa.org Thu Aug 7 15:27:53 2008 From: arundhatighosh at indiaifa.org (Arundhati) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 15:27:53 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A suggestion for Arka Message-ID: <00f701c8f874$123d9660$fa01a8c0@Arundhati> Arka, I have been reading some of the stuff that you have been writing on the Sarai list - your opinions about the Tatas and IFA - which is supported in its various programmes by institutions like the Tata Trusts, the Ford Foundation and many other organisations and individuals who find IFA's work worth supporting. You have suggested to artists not to accept funds from organisations that are supported with money 'tainted' because of its source ( which makes almost all money tainted if you really look hard and find the 'source' where it originally came from one way or the other). I recall that you have received an award of Rs 25,000 (Rupees Twenty five Thousand) from Toto Funds the Arts (TFA), for creative writing in Feb 2008. TFA is an organisation that is mainly funded by individuals like me, Mr Suresh Kumar, and many others who believe that TFA is doing great work supporting young artists. Both Suresh and me work for IFA, an organisation supported by the Tata Trusts thus our source of money that we donate to TFA is tainted as well according to your logic. As a donor to TFA, I would suggest to you to return the award to TFA if you want to really walk your talk. While you may find it more convenient to sit in Bangalore and 'email' protest campaigns against the Tatas and not really go down to Singur and Nandigram with hundreds of young people in Kolkata who are really trying to understand and engage with the issues there, the least you can do is practice what you preach. Arundhati (works at IFA, supported by the Tata Trusts among many, donates to TFA) From southasiannews11 at gmail.com Thu Aug 7 11:04:56 2008 From: southasiannews11 at gmail.com (Fosaactv ) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 01:34:56 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Circus of SAARC : why it is a total failure Message-ID: From kj.impulse at gmail.com Wed Aug 6 19:28:56 2008 From: kj.impulse at gmail.com (Kavita Joshi) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 19:28:56 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] [DFA NewsLetter] Fwd: a deal for life & freedom - invite to the film screening and photo exhibition on 9 august 2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <821019d70808060658x3ef4e414u74d2050180b985e4@mail.gmail.com> Dear friends, August is a month for remembrance and celebration. 6th marks Hiroshima; 9th marks Nagasaki and the International Day for World's Indigenous People; 15th is India's Independence Day; and 30th is the International Day for World's Disappeared Persons. We invite you for a day long Kriti Film Club screenings organised in collaboration with Delhi Solidarity Group (DSG) and Sangat. The detailed programme is pasted below. We hope you can make it! Please circulate this widely. In solidarity, Mamata A Deal for Life and Freedom - screenings by Kriti Film Club organised by Kriti team in collaboration with Delhi Solidarity Group supported by Sangat on 9th of August 2008, 10.00 am onwards at WWF Auditorium, Lodi Estate, New Delhi 10.00 - 10.30 am: Welcome and Programme for the day Films Session 1: Remembering Hiroshima-Nagasaki 10.30 - 11.00 am Ek Khubsurat Jahaz Gauhar Raza/ 19 Min/ Hindi with Eng sub-titles Why Are Nuclear Weapons Important? Miranda Haley/ 10 mins/ Eng America America K.P. Sasi/ 4 mins/ Music video/English 11.00 am – 12.45 pm Hiroshima Paul Wilmshurst & George Anton/ 1 Hour 32 Minutes/ Eng Ribbons for Peace Anand Patwardhan/ 4 mins/ Hindi 12.45 – 1.00 pm: Discussion 1.00 – 2.00 pm: Break Films Session 2: Solidarity with Ajay TG 2.00 – 2.45 pm: Films and Discussion New State; Old problems Ajay TG/ 10mins 43sec / English narration Anjam Ajay TG/ 20 mins 41 sec / English The Other Side of the Mirror Ajay TG/ 7mins 26sec Films Session 3: Solidarity with the Burmese and Tibetan People 2.45 – 3.45 pm: The Face Amar Kanwar/ 9 mins/ English Military Rule, People's Aspirations and Human Rights in Burma 30 mins/ English Bullets and Butterflies Sushmit Ghosh/ 15 mins/ English 3.45 – 4.00 pm: Discussion 4.00 – 4.15 pm: Break Films Session 4: Indigenous People's Struggles 4.15 pm – 4.30 pm: Shot Dead for Development Sarasi Das & Surya Shankar Dash/ 1 minute/ Animation The Lament of Niyamraja - a dongria kond song Surya Shankar Dash/ 13 min/ Kui 4.30 – 6.15 pm: Niyamgiri-The Mountain of Law Samadrusti TV and Surya Shankar Dash/ 100 min/ Local language with English sub-titles 6.15 – 6.30 pm: Discussion 6.30 – 7.30 pm: Chengara: slums to agri-land Samkutty pattomkary/ 54 mins/ Local language with English sub-titles 7.30 – 8.00 pm: Discussion and Closure On the side ¥ Niyamgiri tribals Photo exhibition ¥ Burmese people's struggle exhibition ¥ Stalls of participating groups with materials related to theme Kriti Film Club is an independent documentary viewing and sharing initiative of Kriti team, which works as a support group on development and human rights. Such screenings are organised in solidarity and support to the issues and movements in question. Sangat, created in 1998 is a South Asian feminist network of like minded women working for sustainable livelihoods, gender equality, human rights, peace, secularism and democracy. Delhi Solidarity Group is an informal formation of several movement support groups and individuals based in New Delhi. Thanks to the Release Ajay TG campaign, the Burmese and Niyamgiri support groups and other film makers whose films are part of this programme. Contact: Aanchal Kapur/ Mamata Dash Phone: +91-11-2602 7845/ 2603 3088/ 9868259836 Email: space.kriti at gmail.com Web access - http://krititeam.blogspot.com --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Please DO NOT REPLY to the sender. To contact the MODERATOR: delhifilmarchive [at] gmail.com To UNSUBSCRIBE: send an email to delhifilmarchive-unsubscribe at googlegroups.com More OPTIONS are on the web: http://groups.google.com/group/delhifilmarchive Our WEBSITE: www.delhifilmarchive.org -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From mitoo at sarai.net Thu Aug 7 12:48:33 2008 From: mitoo at sarai.net (Mitoo Das) Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 12:48:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] REMINDER- Talk @ Sarai by Krishnendu Ray Message-ID: <489AA1C9.90200@sarai.net> Hi all, This is a reminder for the talk we have tomorrow afternoon by Krishnendu Ray. The details for the talk are given below. Best, Mitoo. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Making the Edible Legible: American Restaurants in Print, 1830-2006 Talk by: Dr. Krishnendu Ray Venue: Seminar Room, Sarai-CSDS Date: 8th August Time: 3:30 pm Cuisine happens when cooking leaves the kitchen, in the first instance when it escapes the domestic kitchen, and in the second instance, when it spreads onto the print media to give durability to the talk about taste. Based on detailed archival work and quantitative data this presentation seeks to measure the talk about restaurants in American newspapers from its first appearance in 1830 to the present. The restaurant kitchen is the space of mongrel borderland – an orality of Hispanidad, Bengali, Cantonese, and Hakka – and the dining room a pedigreed and printed Anglophone parlor with Francophile accents. This work looks at taste and toil as a dynamic, dialogic relationship between producers and consumers of commodified cuisine. Krishnendu Ray is Assistant Professor of Nutrition, Food Studies and Public Health at New York University. He is the author of The Migrants' Table (Temple Univ Press, 2004), and has taught for a decade at the Culinary Institute of America. _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From surabhip at himalmag.com Thu Aug 7 11:48:22 2008 From: surabhip at himalmag.com (Surabhi) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 12:03:22 +0545 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] HIMAL SOUTHASIAN CARTOON COMPETITION - DEADLINE APPROACHING Message-ID: <005c01c8f855$70ed7d20$8300a8c0@surabhip> FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE 06 August 2008 HIMAL SOUTHASIAN CARTOON COMPETITION DEADLINE APPROACHING Hurry! The countdown begins. Only twenty-four days remaining. The deadline for the Southasian Cartoon Competition organised by Himal Southasian, the only regional magazine, published from Kathmandu, is approaching. In every country, state, province, city, village and society as well as across Southasia, there is a dramatically growing divide. To explore the various aspects of this gulf, Himal invites cartoonists to submit works on the subject Dramatic Divide: The distance between the powerful and the powerless. Established artists, wannabe cartoonists, new entrants and freelancers are all welcome, as long as the topic is relevant to Southasia. A cash prize of USD 1000 will be awarded to the winning entrant, with USD 500 for the first runner-up, as well as publication of cartoons in Himal. All short-listed candidates will receive citations. Winning candidates will also be flown to Kathmandu for the Southasian Cartoon Congress in November, where the prize will be announced. The closing date for submission is Monday, 1 September. Visit www.himalmag.com for full details and regular updates on the competition. Please contact surabhip at himalmag.com for queries. -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From pratilipi.in at gmail.com Fri Aug 8 10:21:46 2008 From: pratilipi.in at gmail.com (Pratilipi) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 10:21:46 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] The August 2008 issue of Pratilipi is now online. In-Reply-To: <435290ba0808070928t61c4799bqe0d30e94d74eb20b@mail.gmail.com> References: <5cc6bcd80808070528o7732014h1bb63e7b6cd3373e@mail.gmail.com> <5cc6bcd80808070851h403adba1t9011b81d5da9883@mail.gmail.com> <435290ba0808070928t61c4799bqe0d30e94d74eb20b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <435290ba0808072151n4269b5d7p78ede4d569289897@mail.gmail.com> प्रतिलिपि का तीसरा अंक अब ऑनलाइन है. The third issue of Pratilipi is now online. http://pratilipi.in शीर्ष आलेख / LEAD ARTICLE - History, Literature, Beliefs: Sudhir Chandra / इतिहास, साहित्य, आस्थाएं: सुधीर चंद्र [link ] फीचर्स / FEATURES - Reading Olav Hauge: Rustam (Singh) / हाउगे को पढ़ते हुए: रुस्तम (सिंह) [link ] - परिवार पुराण: मिथिलेश मुकर्जी / Parivaar Puraan: Mithilesh Mukerjee [ link ] - Gesture Projects: Michael Buckley / जेस्चर और सिनेमा पर माइकल बकले [ link ] - सोनमछरी मेँ सखामण्डल: वागीश शुक्ल / *Sonmachhari mein Sakhamandal*: Excerpts from Wagish Shukla's novel. [link ] - To be Regardful of the Earth: Rustam (Singh) / रूस्तम (सिंह) का दार्शनिक आलेख [link ] - Wall Paintings by Meena Women: Madan Meena / मीणा स्त्रियों की चित्रकला: मदन मीणा [link ] कथा / FICTION - सुमना रॉय / Sumana Roy [link ] - मालचन्द तिवाड़ी / Malchand Tiwari [link ] - मीना अरोड़ा नायक / Meena Arora Nayak [link ] - पीयूष दईया / Piyush Daiya [link ] - कुंवर नारायण / Kunwar Narain [link ] कथेत्तर / NON-FICTION - वार्ताकार की वाणीः हकु शाह और पीयूष दईया / Piyush Daiya in conversation with Haku Shah [link ] - A Necessary Poem: Teji Grover / अनिवार्य कविता: तेजी ग्रोवर [link ] - An Initiation to Sexuality in Almodovar's Films: Sameer Rawal / आल्मोदोवार के सिनेमा पर समीर रावल [link ] - '१८५७ - सामान की तलाश' की एक पढ़त: राजेश कुमार शर्मा / A Reading of "1857: Saamaan ki Talaash": Rajesh Kumar Sharma [link ] - A Preface to Mourning: Chandra Prakash Deval / किस्सा कोताह यह कि: चंद्रप्रकाश देवल [link ] कविता / *POETRY* - शुन्तारो तानीकावा / Shuntaro Tanikawa [link ] - नंदकिशोर आचार्य / Nandkishore Acharya [link ] - सुकृता पाल कुमार / Sukrita Paul Kumar [link ] - अंजुम हसन / Anjum Hasan [link ] - मीना कंदसामी / Meena Kandasamy [link ] - शैलेन्द्र दुबे / Shailendra Dubey [link ] - श्रीदला स्वामी / Sridala Swami [link ] - अदिति मचाडो / Aditi Machado [link ] - आरुणी कश्यप / Aruni Kashyap [link ] - ऊलाव हाउगे / Olav Hauge [link ] - असद ज़ैदी / Asad Zaidi [link ] - चंद्र प्रकाश देवल / Chandra Prakash Deval [link ] Regards, Giriraj Kiradoo and Rahul Soni (Editors) Shiv Kumar Gandhi (Art Editor) From blueskyandus at rediffmail.com Fri Aug 8 10:19:28 2008 From: blueskyandus at rediffmail.com (tangella madhavi) Date: 8 Aug 2008 04:49:28 -0000 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] RAGGING film--change in telecast time Message-ID: <20080808044928.1424.qmail@f5mail-236-230.rediffmail.com> Hi! Doordarshan has postponed the telecast of Listen Little Man It will now be screened on DD News on 16th August at 10.30pm. Please do watch it and let others know. Sorry for the inconvenience. Regards Tangella Madhavi Listen Little Man explores the tradition of ragging through the experiences of those students have protested against it. What unfolds is a connection between ragging and larger forms of violence in society emerging from following orders without questioning them. Listen Little Man (28mins, 2007) Direction n Location Sound: Tangella Madhavi Camera, Editing: Pankaj Rishi Kumar Sound Mixing: Pritam Das Research n Production: Priyanka Desai Producer: PSBT -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From logos.theword at gmail.com Fri Aug 8 12:33:17 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 12:33:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A suggestion for Arka Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808080003q136ae9d4t2694b993b67fcf83@mail.gmail.com> > > Dear Arundhati, Thank you for your retort, which proves that even the mighty IFA (in the person of you, its deputy director), needs to bestir itself to quell voices of dissent that challenge its monopoly as the high priest of high art in this country. Interesting, how the high and mighty tend to be also mightily thin - skinned. You also sent me the same mail to my private ID. I have told you in my reply there that as far as TFA is concerned, you have brought something intensely personal into a very public space, and I shall not stoop to the bait of responding to that here. If that gives you a sense of triumph, so be it. There are other parts of your mail which, however, I will respond to. So here goes: *Arka, > > I have been reading some of the stuff that you have been writing on the > Sarai list - your opinions about the Tatas and IFA - which is supported in > its various programmes by institutions like the Tata Trusts, the Ford > Foundation and many other organisations and individuals who find IFA's work > worth supporting.* You start off by being an apologist for the Tatas. Good! The basic message of my tirade is not about the quality of IFA's work and whether it's worth supporting - as I have said here on an earlier occasion, that's worth another debate by itself. But while on that, yes, I do think IFA on the whole funds ivory tower art that has no locus of significance outside its incestuous little circle of mutual back-patting. Further, it renders a disservice to the cause of true artistic enquiry by imposing a hierarchy of academic elitism, thereby snuffing out the voices of true practitioners who are not interested in spewing academic gobbledygook. Which is not to say that it has not funded genuninely invigorating artistic endeavours - it has. About Ram by Katkatha immediately comes to mind. But for the most part, it perpetuates dinosaurs and living fossils and turns a deaf ear to younger, emergent voices, unless such voices have the appropriate 'brand tags'. So yes, on the whole IFA promotes art that is spurious and dishonest. And this is not my viewpoint alone, but something shared by many, many practitioners who are in touch with the grassroots. As examples of people who by dint of their work should, by any system of logic, have got artistic funding; Parnab Mukherjee, Pritam Koilpillai and Abhishek Majumdar spring readily to mind. However, my basic point was that art cannot exist in a moral vaccum. Art that is created with dirty money is, I'm sorry to say, not art. If today you turn a blind eye to the Tatas' misdeeds (Ford of course is no shining exemplar of ethics either), will you turn an equally blind eye to Dow Chemicals if they offer you a juicy little dole tomorrow? Going by your stance, I suppose the answer is quite evident. My respect for IFA would have been immense if, in the wake of Singur, you guys had renounced their money. But of course, what matter where my money comes from, as long as it does come, right? *You have suggested to artists not to accept funds from organisations that > are supported with money 'tainted' because of its source ( which makes > almost all money tainted if you really look hard and find the 'source' where > it originally came from one way or the other).* Once again, your capacity for deluding yourself is astounding. There are always degrees of association, and while one might carp on the 'money is the root of all evil' line, the fact is that a direct line of credit from an unethical corporate entity is an altogether different matter from money which, at some level, has passed through tainted hands. Once again, my appeal was to fellow artists to reject money that directly comes from the Tatas. And I might as well say, I did not make that appeal with any real hope that people would respond to it. It was more to expose the abysmal levels of hypocrisy and apathy the contemporary 'artiste' has sunk to, content to sit in his/her guilded cage, as long as the grants, residencies and funding keep coming. Of course, there are other artists, those without the 'e' at the end, who are not written about, do not perform in glitzy venues in European cities at sundry bienalles and festivals, but whose art has not lost the smell of the soil. These do not depend on handouts from morally bankrupt entities to create their art - their art comes from their blood. *I recall that you have received an award of Rs 25,000 (Rupees Twenty five > Thousand) from Toto Funds the Arts (TFA), for creative writing in Feb 2008. > TFA is an organisation that is mainly funded by individuals like me, Mr > Suresh Kumar, and many others who believe that TFA is doing great work > supporting young artists. Both Suresh and me work for IFA, an organisation > supported by the Tata Trusts thus our source of money that we donate to TFA > is tainted as well according to your logic. As a donor to TFA, I would > suggest to you to return the award to TFA if you want to really walk your > talk.* This paragraph, really, is the Kafkaesque pinnacle of your missive. At one level, I'm sure you know fully well the logical fallacy of comparing what you do with your money as an individual, and institutional support from the Tatas. The same applies to Mr Suresh Kumar, whoever that worthy is. This also is the paragraph where, as I said in the beginning, you have brought into the public space a very personal relationship that (I thought) I share with the organization you have mentioned. I have responded to you in private and will not repeat that here. Let me just say this - if you read through what you yourself have written, without your IFA blinkers on, you'll probably realize that it is more Orwellian than anything Orwell himself could have ever written or said. So, according to you, ( and I will say according to 'you' because I continue to have the deepest respect for the person who runs TFA and the reason for its establishment and functioning), the support of TFA amounts to this - that the young artist will be rewarded for his work as long as he stays safely in line. The moment he criticizes the mighty hand that feeds; and speaks uncomfortable truths, he is then one of the damned and must return the award? So much for artistic freedom, so much for the conviction of the artist, so much for freedom of speech. I think the RSS would be queueing up to 'support' the IFA now, given the apparent tenor of your ideologies. However, I shall not do what you have commanded - I shall not renounce the award, because that would amount to insulting the founder of the trust which, as I've said above, I'll never do; and more importantly, because then I'll have to return the money. I shall not return the money. Instead, I am hereby making a very public declaration. For the next five years, I shall give out Rs. 5,000/- (Rupees Five Thousand) annually, to any individual or organization that is working to discredit the Tatas in any way whatsoever, or to rehabilitate their victims, through art or community work. If indeed the money came from the Tatas, I see no better way to atone for it than to turn it against them. I know that compared to the half-a-million grants that the IFA gives out, this amount is laughably small, but that is about as much as a starving artist (without the 'e') can do. So I hereby announce the formation of the Rat N. Tatta (please read the word in Hindi) Foundation for the Promotion of Anarchic Arts and Fighting Tata Terrorism. I hope other artists who still have a conscience left will add to the corpus and turn it into something meaningful. Please write to contact at logostheatreindia.org for more details. So well, I have put my money where my mouth is - I am not sophisticated enough to walk the talk, as you call it. *While you may find it more convenient to sit in Bangalore and 'email' > protest campaigns against the Tatas * Well, one can at least do what is within one's abilities. One can take a principled stand, and that is what I have done. For the record, my services were recently used by one of the artists in residence at a residency promoted by your organization in Bangalore recently, and I refused to take any payment for it, asking her instead to give it to charity or to any cause opposed to the Tatas. At least, I am not traipsing about Washington DC and Krakow on Tata money while turning up fashionably attired in protest marches for Nandigram, am I? *and not really go down to Singur and Nandigram with hundreds of young > people in Kolkata * ** Nor am I appearing on page 3 of Bangalore Times, as you so regularly do. Oh, and I forgot, you were a "Lead India" contestant - our great beacon of hope! *are really trying to understand and engage with the issues there,* Such shining bureaucrat/ academic speak - the chief minister of West Bengal couldn't have done it better. There is only one issue understand and engage with there - the Tatas are displacing people for a corporate project that is entirely unethical, and the WB govt. is killing/ raping in order to remove obstacles on their way. Again, remember Tapashi Malik and look into the mirror. * the least you can do is practice what you preach.* I try to. At least I don't delude myself. *Arundhati > (works at IFA, supported by the Tata Trusts among many, donates to TFA)* Arka (work in theatre, is not supported by anyone, and does not publicly declaim where he donates to) -- > Logos Theatre > In the beginning was the word > No. 126, > 3rd Main Road, > Jayamahal Extension, > Bangalore 560046 > -------------------------------------------------------- > If it be now, 'tis not to come; > if it be not to come, it will be now; > if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. > Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? > Let be. From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Fri Aug 8 14:37:09 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2008 14:07:09 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] A suggestion for Arka In-Reply-To: <00f701c8f874$123d9660$fa01a8c0@Arundhati> References: <00f701c8f874$123d9660$fa01a8c0@Arundhati> Message-ID: Snobbery at its best, ? Come on, all can not go to Singur or nandigram to protest and make lives of these villagers a life full of misery, as it is they are suffering enough of rape and ravages.More over it is well known how medha wants her air fare borne by some one if she has to come to bangalore for your type of protests, stop being such a hypocrate.! Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Arundhati Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008 3:28 pm Subject: [Reader-list] A suggestion for Arka To: reader-list at sarai.net > Arka, > > I have been reading some of the stuff that you have been writing > on the Sarai list - your opinions about the Tatas and IFA - which > is supported in its various programmes by institutions like the > Tata Trusts, the Ford Foundation and many other organisations and > individuals who find IFA's work worth supporting. > > You have suggested to artists not to accept funds from > organisations that are supported with money 'tainted' because of > its source ( which makes almost all money tainted if you really > look hard and find the 'source' where it originally came from one > way or the other). > > I recall that you have received an award of Rs 25,000 (Rupees > Twenty five Thousand) from Toto Funds the Arts (TFA), for creative > writing in Feb 2008. TFA is an organisation that is mainly funded > by individuals like me, Mr Suresh Kumar, and many others who > believe that TFA is doing great work supporting young artists. > Both Suresh and me work for IFA, an organisation supported by the > Tata Trusts thus our source of money that we donate to TFA is > tainted as well according to your logic. As a donor to TFA, I > would suggest to you to return the award to TFA if you want to > really walk your talk. > > While you may find it more convenient to sit in Bangalore and > 'email' protest campaigns against the Tatas and not really go down > to Singur and Nandigram with hundreds of young people in Kolkata > who are really trying to understand and engage with the issues > there, the least you can do is practice what you preach. > > Arundhati > (works at IFA, supported by the Tata Trusts among many, donates to > TFA) > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Fri Aug 8 18:52:12 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 18:52:12 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism Message-ID: <912366.64692.qm@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> All The Wrong Men A cleric’s dubious arrest over the Ahmedabad blasts is just the tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT SAHI exposes the random targeting of Muslims by the police (Tehelka: http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp) AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two decades, Maulana Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to speak to the faithful on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the soft-spoken, revered aalim, or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of Muslims in the hour-long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one of Ahmedabad’s Muslim localities where the preacher and many in his congregation live. His sermon this afternoon was on a Muslim’s duty towards his neighbours. “You cannot fill your stomach if your neighbour is hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried tone. “You cannot discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim neighbours.” Thirty hours later, within minutes of the serial blasts that killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, policemen stormed Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque and dragged him away as his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, as a local magistrate gave the Crime Branch his custody for two weeks, police claimed Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday blasts and that grilling him would unravel the execution of and the conspiracy behind the terror act. In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, justifiably, wants answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge then is not to reach for the quick routes, the easy demonisations. Unfortunately, the Indian State has not quite met that challenge. Over the years, for instance, SIMI has come to be a dread acronym for most Indians — Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a hotbed of terrorism, a lethal and shadowy organisation intent on destroying the nation. Quick on the back of every horrific blast, that name is thrust upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo — stretching outwards to embrace the entire community. But how true are these allegations? In the struggle for a just and safe society, it is crucial to find real perpetrators and correct answers; crucial to cleave doggedly to the idea of fair play and rule of law; crucial not to fall prey to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit of this, in an attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA conducted an investigation across India over three months and 12 cities. Serialised here, starting this week, the disturbing investigation found that an overwhelming majority of terrorism cases — especially those related to the outlawed SIMI — are based on either non-existent or fraudulent evidence and are an affront to both law and common sense. The investigation found that entrenched prejudices in the executive and the judiciary, an abject lack of political will against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news media that demands instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly copy-pastes every unproven police and intelligence story on terrorist networks has morphed into a tragic persecution of hundreds of people falsely accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these are Muslim; nearly all of these are poor. “We will rise to the challenge and I am confident we will be able to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said as he walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s civil hospital, where two blasts had inflicted the worst casualties. He urged political parties and police and intelligence agencies to work together against efforts aimed at “destroying our social fabric, undermining communal harmony.” Unfortunately, given their staggering record of false cases against innocent people, it appears that incompetent police and intelligence agencies are doing exactly the opposite. Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled below, is a searing example why. SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the stenographic news media, police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI member linked with Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. Gujarat government’s lawyer told the remand magistrate that Haleem sent Muslim youth from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as terrorists to avenge the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the state. He said they planned, among others, to assassinate BJP leader LK Advani and Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police have said Haleem was absconding since he was named an accused in this case in 2002. TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad following the cleric’s arrest has thrown up strong evidence, documentary and circumstantial, that far from absconding, Haleem has lived at his house — which is less than a km from the local police station — for years and led a public life within his community. The charge against him that he sent Muslims to train as terrorists is highly dubious based as it is on just one letter from Haleem whose contents don’t remotely reflect a link with terrorism. And until Saturday’s bomb blasts, Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a SIMI member. If anything, Haleem’s family and followers say police have harassed him for years for his role in helping victims of the 2002 anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, an inspector from the police station sent Haleem a onepage handwritten notice in Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz Ahle-Hadis [the Islamic sect to which Haleem and his followers belong] Trust has been opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping Centre. You are its head… Many members have been appointed in it. You are directed to submit a list of their names, addresses and phone numbers.” Apart from the gross illegality of such a demand on a trust constituted as per law with no criminal charge against it, the letter proves the police knew Haleem’s whereabouts and were in touch with him as late as two months ago. Indeed, the notice mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi Park Society, near Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has proof that the police received his reply the next day. A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed telegrams to Gujarat’s director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s police commissioner claiming that the police forcibly entered his house that day and harassed his wife and children in his absence. “We are peace-loving and law-abiding citizens and have never been part of any illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the telegram in Hindi. “The police are unlawfully harassing me and my family without appropriate cause. This is aviolation of our civil rights.” Predictably, he didn’t hear from either officer. In April, when a local outfit called Social Unity & Peace Forum, which has both Muslims and Hindus as its members, organised a socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the police seeking permission to use loudspeakers. That application clearly mentioned that Haleem would be the main speaker at the event. Haleem’s family also offers his driving licence, renewed by the Ahmedabad transport office on December 28, 2006, as proof that he led a normal life all along. Three years ago, in July 2005, the Gujarati newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published Haleem’s picture with a statement he released at a press conference giving his views on a raging controversy over the alleged rape of a woman, Imrana, by her father-in-law in a village in Uttar Pradesh. “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana Haleem’s innocence,” says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has appealed to the Gujarat governor to secure the cleric’s release. Adds Nazir, in whose house Haleem has lived with his family as tenant: “I have known Maulana most closely. He is a man of religion and has never indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s wife Noor Saba: “I swear by my children that my husband is not a terrorist. He is being framed.” Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the cleric’s neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped hundreds in their daily lives by imparting them the skills of patience and fortitude,” says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old embroiderer. Haq fishes out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama the Maulana signed after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to show that Haleem wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered a sermon to the guests at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that Haq had installed — with police permission. Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, hails from Uttar Pradesh and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is a preacher with a puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis that began on the subcontinent some 180 years ago and has survived a frowning Sunni orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the Hadis — the oral narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — as a guiding principle for Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news media have long parroted the police’s insinuation that Ahle-Hadis is a terrorist outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The police claim its members include many terror accused such as those of the July 2006 Mumbai train blasts. The sect, with a claimed membership of 30 million in India, denies the charge. It points out that Union Home Minister Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its national symposium two years ago at New Delhi. In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle Hadis followers for 14 years, resigning three years ago to minister a small mosque so he could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a regular income to feed his wife and seven children, the oldest two of whom study at a madarsa in Delhi. HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the 2002 anti-Muslim violence in Gujarat as he involved himself in relief work at the camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. An Ahmedabad native named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and was visiting his home, came to meet Haleem with two other Muslims. One of them was from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also lived in Kuwait. The other was a small-time trader from Moradabad. The three wanted to help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 violence by bringing them free education and care, so Haleem took them to four refugee camps. A week later, one camp responded saying it had found 34 children for such care. Haleem phoned the Kuwait expatriate, who was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him about the offer. But getting no response, the plan died and, importantly, no children were ever sent. Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi Police arrested Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait allegedly with 4.5 kg of the explosive material, RDX. The Moradabad trader was also arrested from his hometown. All three were charged under the Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring to carry out terrorist acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter (about the camp’s offer of the orphan children) with the expatriate from Kuwait. As both Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, police there were informed. Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG Vanzara called in Haleem and detained him — illegally — for five days. (Vanzara is now in jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman Sohrabuddin in cold blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as a terrorist.) Haleem’s family frantically filed a petition with the Gujarat High Court to secure his release. “The judge ordered the police to bring Haleem to the court in two hours,” recalls the family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The police instantly released Haleem who rushed to the court where his statement on his illegal detention was duly recorded and is part of official documents. Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX case’ against the two expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the Moradabad trader, police in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against the same individuals for “luring Muslim youth to train as terrorists in Moradabad”. This is the case the police and the media have referred since Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb blasts to argue that the cleric was involved in “sending Muslim youth to train as terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer was openly lying on Monday when he told the magistrate that Haleem had sent “30 youth” to Moradabad for training as terrorists. The charge-sheet in the case clearly admits that the so-called conspiracy had remained on paper and no children ever travelled from Ahmedabad to Moradabad. While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem a witness, Ahmedabad’s ‘terrorist training case’ named him an accused and said he was absconding. The law says the police have to follow due legal process before declaring an accused as absconding. This includes searches at his house and workplace in view of independent witnesses, and recording statements from neighbours to establish that the accused has not been seen for a long time. The Ahmedabad police did not bother with this exercise. The entire case against Haleem is based on a letter he wrote to the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad Ali. Dated August 7, 2002, the letter makes no reference to terrorist training or any other unlawful activity. It simply said: “You had come [to Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ (important goal).” With a giant leap of imagination, the police claim that the words “ahem maqsad” can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist training. Haleem wrote that six of the children were orphans and the rest poor. He concluded the letter saying: “I believe that by god’s grace you will certainly help me in this educational and constructive mission to propagate Islam.” In his deposition before a Delhi court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he was told the children will get “a good education and decent living” in Moradabad, and had no clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train the children as terrorists. Last year, the Delhi judge hearing the ‘RDX case’ found Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven years in jail. The court accepted the police version even though the only witnesses to the alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. Ahmad Ali had claimed that he was arrested at the airport as he was to board a flight to Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. The judge ignored that. Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the Delhi High Court against their conviction. Here is an incredible twister: while they got bail from the Delhi High Court despite being convicted by the lower court, they were denied bail by the Gujarat High Court in the ‘terrorist training case’ although no guilt has yet been established in that case and the Gujarat crime branch admits their crime never went beyond hatching the alleged conspiracy. That’s not all. The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old man named Hafiz Mohammad Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. He proved doubly lucky when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail in the ‘terrorist training case’ in June 2004. In its eye-opening bail order, the judge said: “… All that remains against the present applicant [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had visited camps to identify the children so that they can be better looked after. That by itself cannot be considered an offence.” Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of exactly the same crime, the argument should be valid for them, too. Yet, another Gujarat High Court judge denied them bail and both continue to languish in jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to Ahmedabad because the Gujarat High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must report to the Crime Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On Sunday, July 27, the morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the crime branch office with trepidation. “They grilled me four hours on the blasts,” Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they let me go.” The hearing in the ‘terrorist training case’ is nearly over. It is to be seen if a separate trial will be called against Haleem, since he is no more “absconding”. Meanwhile, Haleem’s family is worried stiff over the next meal and the next month’s house rent of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no savings. His lone employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run Haleem’s scrap shop. SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is anything but rare. One glaring case concerns a “family of terrorists”. On July 15, a posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old Mohammad Muqeemuddin Yasir as he returned home at night from his father’s workshop in Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb blasts rocked Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, Hyderabad Police Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan Times newspaper that, during interrogation, Yasir had confessed that before his arrest, he had taken terror “operatives” to Karnataka and “arranged safe houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies the confession. “I haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told his mother, Tasleem Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on July 29. “The police are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son was tortured during what the police commissioner calls “interrogation”. “He was hung upside down and beaten,” she said. Apart from the fact that a confession made to the police is inadmissible as evidence before a judge (never mind that the news media accept confessions as gospel), Yasir’s alleged confession, if true, should be a slap on the face of the Hyderabad Police. After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose father and one brother are jailed on charges of terrorism. Yasir’s father, 56-yearold Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a wellrespected cleric who has now incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad for nearly four years and has been denied bail all the way up to the Supreme Court. Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, is jailed in Karnataka’s Belgaum district since he was arrested in January. With his brother and father suspected as dreaded terrorists, the Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on Yasir all the time and instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. That the police didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe houses” for terrorists in Karnataka is because he probably never did any such thing. This reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a month before his arrest, on his birthday on June 12, at an engineering workshop that his father had set up three decades ago with borrowed money and skills picked up as an assistant to a roadside mechanic. In the din of machines, Yasir was happily engaged in managing customers crowding the small front office. “My father and brother have been framed,” he forcefully told TEHELKA. A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir seems a victim of patently bogus cases against him. He was a member of SIMI when it was banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. (Given the relentless government propaganda against SIMI, the reader might find it hard to believe that no court in India has yet upheld the charge of terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) Yasir echoed dozens others interviewed by this reporter across India in saying that SIMI was a platform for “deep religious training and self-purification”, and not for acts of terrorism or anti-India conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of atrocities on Muslims from Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It never gave up the issue of the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of us.” ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the police arrested Yasir and booked him with the other two SIMI representatives in Hyderabad under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act. A magistrate gave them bail the next day. A day later, the police slapped another case against the three, alleging that one of them was arrested making a speech against the government. The other two, including Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went back to the court and were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days before securing bail. Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to begin. Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a firebrand cleric who never held his tongue in public speeches against the government, especially on issues such as the Babri Masjid demolition and the 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. Embroiled in cooked-up cases, in several of which he was subsequently acquitted, Maulana Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police to report at their office regularly. On one such day in October 2004, when Maulana Nasiruddin reached the police station, he was arrested by a police team from Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a terror conspiracy in Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of former Gujarat Home Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence against Maulana Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a letter to the court, he has denied making.) Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana to the police station began protesting as he was led out. At this, Gujarat police officer Narendra Amin took out his service revolver and shot dead one protestor. All hell broke loose. Nasiruddin’s supporters refused to move the dead protestor’s body unless the police filed an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad police filed two cases back to back: One, their own, against the protestors for blocking the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under pressure, against Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch in four years. The Hyderabad police ought to have seized his revolver and sent it for a forensic examination, along with the bullet recovered from the dead protestor’s body. They should have arrested and produced Amin before a magistrate. This is an open-and-shut case if there ever was one: with the weapon of homicide matching the bullet, and dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of this happened. Amin proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana Nasiruddin in his custody. The FIR against him has become a dead letter. Amin is the same police officer who was subsequently accused of killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat businessman Sohrabuddin who was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 (as mentioned above in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, too, is now in jail. MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main complainant against Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is none other than 20-year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s youngest son and Yasir’s youngest brother. On January 11 this year, Nasir was arrested by police in Karnataka with another person and was accused of stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly riding. Claiming a knife was found on the two, the police slapped charges such as ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and his co-accused. Amazingly, the police filed seven confessions from the two accused over the next 18 days. Not one showed them saying they were SIMI members. Police then filed their eighth confessions in which they allegedly accepted being SIMI members and the attendant terror charges. Ninety days later, when the police failed to file a charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the magistrate’s house who then had no option but to grant bail as per law. But by this time, the police had implicated Nasir in another case of conspiracy, so he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has retracted his confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has little hope against biases in the judicial system. Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two accused to police custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the following in an interview: “Even as I was signing the necessary papers remanding them to judicial custody, Asadullah [the other accused] stepped forward requesting to speak with me. He told me that the police denied them food and water and subjected them to repeated beatings. He proceeded to show me the bruises on Nasir’s body. The two repeatedly made a reference to human rights violation by the police and demanded medical attention. “I was very surprised by three things: they were talking of their fundamental rights in an authoritative manner, they spoke English and, further, they readily admitted that they had stolen the bike, something most thieves never do in my experience.” When a police sub-inspector phoned the magistrate “warning” that the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial custody, the magistrate asked the evidence to be brought to this house. “The materials produced before me included duplicate identity cards, a fancy dagger, a map of South India with red marks against Udupi and Goa, an American dollar, two pieces of paper with www.com written on one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on another. “When I looked at these materials in their entirety, I felt that these were definitely not just bike thieves. Why would bike thieves carry around duplicate identity cards and a map of South India? The fact that they had an American dollar seemed to suggest they had international links. The paper with www.com indicated to me that they were tech-savvy. The other piece of paper had a message that seemed to be a sort of code that I could not immediately decipher. Also, when I examined the South India map, Udupi had a sort of indication with a red marker against it. Perhaps they were planning to strike at the place during a religious function. “All these suggested that there were definitely enough grounds in my opinion to grant the police custody of Nasir and Asadullah to facilitate further investigations.” Go figure. So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, Muqeemuddin Yasir, Maulana Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ mother doesn’t think so. “Why don’t the police put us all together in jail,” she told TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. “Then they can shoot all of us dead.” • Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From peter.ksmtf at gmail.com Sat Aug 9 06:20:52 2008 From: peter.ksmtf at gmail.com (T Peter) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 06:20:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'CZM norms will affect fishermen' Message-ID: <3457ce860808081750vcb900a3y2724d7315a58fbc3@mail.gmail.com> 'CZM norms will affect fishermen' Date:09/08/2008 URL: http://www.thehindu.com/2008/08/09/stories/2008080954040400.htm Special Correspondent THIRUVANANTHAPURAM: The government would not approve the coastal zone management norms that go against the interests of traditional fishermen and do not protect their livelihood, Minister for Fisheries S. Sarma said here on Friday. Inaugurating a seminar on 'Coastal zone management norms' organised by the Centre for Environment Education (CEE), Mr. Sarma said that the influence of globalisation was quite obvious in the draft CZM norms. Development should not be at the cost of the life of the fisherfolk. Those in power may be guided by the Constitution, but the poor are governed not by rules, but by the problems of life. They will not accept rules that entail displacement or harm their existence. Similarly, development and environment should be complementary. Environmental concerns should be addressed while taking up development ventures, but it should not be shelved in the name of environmental protection, he said. If displaced from the coastal area, the fisherfolk would be deprived of their livelihood. The draft regulations help unrestricted capital investment in the coastal areas. The State government will encourage development of tourism, but it should not be at the expense of the culture and tradition, he said. CEE programme coordinator G. Padma presided. George Mercier, MLA, Vicar-General of Trivandrum diocese Eugene Perieira and others spoke. From tapasrayx at gmail.com Sat Aug 9 17:15:46 2008 From: tapasrayx at gmail.com (Tapas Ray) Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2008 07:45:46 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Sad day for India In-Reply-To: <912366.64692.qm@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <912366.64692.qm@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <489D836A.5090107@gmail.com> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7548953.stm India court okays mining projects India's Supreme Court has said two huge and controversial mining projects can proceed in the eastern state of Orissa. From atreyee.m at gmail.com Sat Aug 9 17:32:48 2008 From: atreyee.m at gmail.com (atreyee majumder) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 17:32:48 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] from Trideep Pais about SIMI In-Reply-To: <397674d10808090421r33215604wb66dbee54c00ee8c@mail.gmail.com> References: <397674d10808090421r33215604wb66dbee54c00ee8c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1944bc230808090502p1586d669t77f52f740b7229cf@mail.gmail.com> On 8/9/08, Vivekananda N wrote: > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Trideep Pais > Date: Sat, Aug 9, 2008 at 4:45 PM > Subject: SIMI > To: Vivekananda N > > > It will take a lot of clarifications in the media over a period of time to > remove the negative bias that SIMI has faced thanks to the sustained > propaganda against them since 2001 (which I also beleived for the want of > any alternate point of view until I was hired to fight there case in 2006). > This is one story where till the recent judgment all (media, bureaucracy, > police, intelligence, prosecution, counsel for state and judiciary) were > compromised. As the reporter of the story in this link will tell you, > between September 2001 and now very few mainstream news papers and magazines > and TV channels have bothered to even listen to the point of view of the > erstwhile SIMI (now banned) let alone publish/ braodcast them. During the > 2006 tribunal when I had the occassion to represent this group, I tried very > hard to reach out to the media to put across the other side of the story > however no one was willing to listen. I sent letters and emails to > mainstream news papers and TV channels about the inaccuracy of their > reporting nad requested them to issue clarifications and all of it fell to > deaf ears. My clients found my efforts hilarious as they had suffered this > bias for 6 years by then and had got used to it and they knew there was no > point in it. BUT, everyone likes a winner and after the news of the > judgement of Justice Gita Mittal was out and till the Supreme Court > stay, for the brief period between the night of the 5th of August 2008 and > afternoon of the 6th of August 2008 several unknown persons like me received > calls for a comment or a bite on what 'SIMI' is about or what I thought of > the judgement etc. What persons like me told them was completely > unpalatable to the media. The NDTV anchor told me "you know you 're > representing the the wrong guys right? just doing it as a part of your job > eh?". I had to remind him that I had sent his organisation an email in feb > 2008 bringing to thier notice the gross inaccuracies in thier report on > SIMI. This just did not interest him. He did not even wait for my answer > before going on to read the preprepared text that his ticker required him to > read out. However for the right reasons SIMI is in the news and I would > think that the developments of the last week have made at least 2 % of its > detractors think that there may be something wrong in the Government > Version. This is a very well researched story by a journalist who has spent > 3 months chasing up Jawahar Raja and the tribunal and the victims. I would > request you to read it. I dont want you to agree with him. Just hear the > other side of the story. Just like Justice Mittal's Judgement, such stories > are also rare. > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808thekafka_project.asp > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808ajudge_stirs.asp > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808thesupremecourt's.asp > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808terrorhas_twofaces.asp > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808simihere_simithere.asp > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808thehaunt_ofour.asp > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808thecry_ofthe.asp > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808adoubtful_crime.asp > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808theyjustwant.asp > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne160808insidethe_whale.asp > > > -- > Trideep Pais > L - 1/16, Hauz Khas Enclave > New Delhi - 110 016 > Tel: + 91 11 41656033 > + 91 11 41656034 > Fax + 91 11 42654952 > Mob + 91 9810273032 > em at il trideeppais at gmail.com > > > -- > Trideep Pais > L - 1/16, Hauz Khas Enclave > New Delhi - 110 016 > Tel: + 91 11 41656033 > + 91 11 41656034 > Fax + 91 11 42654952 > Mob + 91 9810273032 > em at il trideeppais at gmail.com > > From aashu.gupta20 at gmail.com Sat Aug 9 17:41:34 2008 From: aashu.gupta20 at gmail.com (Aashish Gupta) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 17:41:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Sad day for India In-Reply-To: <489D836A.5090107@gmail.com> References: <912366.64692.qm@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> <489D836A.5090107@gmail.com> Message-ID: That too on the day when Gandhi launched the Quit India Movement. Aashish From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sat Aug 9 18:25:05 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2008 17:55:05 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism In-Reply-To: <912366.64692.qm@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <912366.64692.qm@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: All muslims are not terrorists, but all those terrorists who are caught with acts of terrorism are muslims. When the community of muslims forgot their solemn oath to father of the nation, mahatma that they will stay back in India as brothers with their hindu community, many were sceptical, for one, as the population increases the muslim community along with other segments of sovciety also did not get their due in good governance, thanks to the politics of votebanks, society was further divided in linguistic , caste and faith segments, the national exchequer never reached the grass root level of the populace and citizens in sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good governance without bias , without fear or favour. The muslim community in general had lower percentage of educated men and women, who instead of having concern for their community, is seen more in nesting their own homes than the society. The unaccounted cash transactions, unwillingness to be accountable to society, wherever the muslims are majority, trying to impose their rules on society are all the reasons along with political appeasements and false promises and gestures of patronising the mullas for votes left a common muslim wondering where he belonged to. ! The subsequent generations of muslims, particularly youth started to vent their anger, demanding more say in the governance along with dalits and other suppressed and oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for breeding of terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing the issues used their friday prayers only to arouse the passions on some danish cartoons and percieved and imagined dangers from "communal " parties totally loosing sight of communalism played by so called secular parties.! In the entire process, the muslim youth who is found wanting a job is easy prey for those elements in society who do not risk themselves of being seen as terorists, use the youth to terrorise the society. Only solution to terror is handle the elements who organise the youth to terrorise the society, terrorise them and democratic rule of laws should handle the deviant behaviour of the culprits without fear or favour of vote banks. regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: "S.Fatima" Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism To: sarai > All The Wrong Men > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the Ahmedabad blasts is just the > tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT SAHI exposes the random > targeting of Muslims by the police > (Tehelka: > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp) > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two decades, Maulana > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to speak to the faithful > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the soft-spoken, revered aalim, > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of Muslims in the hour- > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one of Ahmedabad’s Muslim > localities where the preacher and many in his congregation live. > His sermon this afternoon was on a Muslim’s duty towards his > neighbours. “You cannot fill your stomach if your neighbour is > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried tone. “You cannot > discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim neighbours.” > Thirty hours later, within minutes of the serial blasts that > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, policemen stormed > Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque and dragged him away as > his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, as a local magistrate > gave the Crime Branch his custody for two weeks, police claimed > Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday blasts and that grilling > him would unravel the execution of and the conspiracy behind the > terror act. > In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, justifiably, wants > answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge then is not to reach > for the quick routes, the easy demonisations. Unfortunately, the > Indian State has not quite met that challenge. Over the years, for > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread acronym for most Indians — > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a hotbed of terrorism, a > lethal and shadowy organisation intent on destroying the nation. > Quick on the back of every horrific blast, that name is thrust > upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo — stretching outwards > to embrace the entire community. But how true are these allegations? > In the struggle for a just and safe society, it is crucial to find > real perpetrators and correct answers; crucial to cleave doggedly > to the idea of fair play and rule of law; crucial not to fall prey > to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit of this, in an > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA conducted an > investigation across India over three months and 12 cities. > Serialised here, starting this week, the disturbing investigation > found that an overwhelming majority of terrorism cases — > especially those related to the outlawed SIMI — are based on > either non-existent or fraudulent evidence and are an affront to > both law and common sense. > The investigation found that entrenched prejudices in the > executive and the judiciary, an abject lack of political will > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news media that demands > instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly copy-pastes every > unproven police and intelligence story on terrorist networks has > morphed into a tragic persecution of hundreds of people falsely > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these are Muslim; nearly all > of these are poor. > “We will rise to the challenge and I am confident we will be able > to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said as he > walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s civil hospital, where > two blasts had inflicted the worst casualties. He urged political > parties and police and intelligence agencies to work together > against efforts aimed at “destroying our social fabric, > undermining communal harmony.” Unfortunately, given their > staggering record of false cases against innocent people, it > appears that incompetent police and intelligence agencies are > doing exactly the opposite. > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled below, is a searing > example why. > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the stenographic news media, > police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI member linked with > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. Gujarat government’s > lawyer told the remand magistrate that Haleem sent Muslim youth > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as terrorists to avenge > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the state. He said they > planned, among others, to assassinate BJP leader LK Advani and > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police have said Haleem was > absconding since he was named an accused in this case in 2002. > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad following the cleric’s arrest > has thrown up strong evidence, documentary and circumstantial, > that far from absconding, Haleem has lived at his house — which is > less than a km from the local police station — for years and led a > public life within his community. The charge against him that he > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is highly dubious based as it > is on just one letter from Haleem whose contents don’t remotely > reflect a link with terrorism. And until Saturday’s bomb blasts, > Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a SIMI member. > If anything, Haleem’s family and followers say police have > harassed him for years for his role in helping victims of the 2002 > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, an inspector from the > police station sent Haleem a onepage handwritten notice in > Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz Ahle-Hadis [the Islamic > sect to which Haleem and his followers belong] Trust has been > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping Centre. You are its > head… Many members have been appointed in it. You are directed to > submit a list of their names, addresses and phone numbers.” > Apart from the gross illegality of such a demand on a trust > constituted as per law with no criminal charge against it, the > letter proves the police knew Haleem’s whereabouts and were in > touch with him as late as two months ago. Indeed, the notice > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi Park Society, near > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has proof that the police > received his reply the next day. > A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed telegrams to Gujarat’s > director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s police commissioner > claiming that the police forcibly entered his house that day and > harassed his wife and children in his absence. “We are peace- > loving and law-abiding citizens and have never been part of any > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the telegram in Hindi. “The police > are unlawfully harassing me and my family without appropriate > cause. This is aviolation of our civil rights.” Predictably, he > didn’t hear from either officer. > In April, when a local outfit called Social Unity & Peace Forum, > which has both Muslims and Hindus as its members, organised a > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the police seeking permission > to use loudspeakers. That application clearly mentioned that > Haleem would be the main speaker at the event. Haleem’s family > also offers his driving licence, renewed by the Ahmedabad > transport office on December 28, 2006, as proof that he led a > normal life all along. Three years ago, in July 2005, the Gujarati > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published Haleem’s picture with a > statement he released at a press conference giving his views on a > raging controversy over the alleged rape of a woman, Imrana, by > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar Pradesh. > “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana Haleem’s innocence,” > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has appealed to the Gujarat > governor to secure the cleric’s release. Adds Nazir, in whose > house Haleem has lived with his family as tenant: “I have known > Maulana most closely. He is a man of religion and has never > indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s wife Noor Saba: “I swear by > my children that my husband is not a terrorist. He is being framed.” > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the cleric’s > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped hundreds in their daily > lives by imparting them the skills of patience and fortitude,” > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old embroiderer. Haq fishes > out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama the Maulana signed > after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to show that Haleem > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered a sermon to the guests > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that Haq had installed — with > police permission. > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, hails from Uttar Pradesh > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is a preacher with a > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis that began on the > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has survived a frowning Sunni > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the Hadis — the oral > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — as a guiding principle for > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news media have long > parroted the police’s insinuation that Ahle-Hadis is a terrorist > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The police claim its members > include many terror accused such as those of the July 2006 Mumbai > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed membership of 30 million in > India, denies the charge. It points out that Union Home Minister > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its national symposium two > years ago at New Delhi. > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle Hadis followers for 14 > years, resigning three years ago to minister a small mosque so he > could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a regular income to > feed his wife and seven children, the oldest two of whom study at > a madarsa in Delhi. > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the 2002 anti-Muslim > violence in Gujarat as he involved himself in relief work at the > camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. An Ahmedabad native > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and was visiting his > home, came to meet Haleem with two other Muslims. One of them was > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also lived in Kuwait. The > other was a small-time trader from Moradabad. The three wanted to > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 violence by bringing > them free education and care, so Haleem took them to four refugee > camps. A week later, one camp responded saying it had found 34 > children for such care. Haleem phoned the Kuwait expatriate, who > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him about the offer. But > getting no response, the plan died and, importantly, no children > were ever sent. > Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi Police arrested Shahid > Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait allegedly with 4.5 kg > of the explosive material, RDX. The Moradabad trader was also > arrested from his hometown. All three were charged under the > Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring to carry out terrorist > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter (about the camp’s offer > of the orphan children) with the expatriate from Kuwait. As both > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, police there were informed. > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG Vanzara called in Haleem > and detained him — illegally — for five days. (Vanzara is now in > jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman Sohrabuddin in cold > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as a terrorist.) Haleem’s > family frantically filed a petition with the Gujarat High Court to > secure his release. “The judge ordered the police to bring Haleem > to the court in two hours,” recalls the > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The police instantly released > Haleem who rushed to the court where his statement on his illegal > detention was duly recorded and is part of official documents. > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX case’ against the two > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the Moradabad trader, police > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against the same individuals > for “luring Muslim youth to train as terrorists in Moradabad”. > This is the case the police and the media have referred since > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb blasts to argue that the > cleric was involved in “sending Muslim youth to train as > terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer was openly lying on > Monday when he told the magistrate that Haleem had sent “30 youth” > to Moradabad for training as terrorists. The charge-sheet in the > case clearly admits that the so-called conspiracy had remained on > paper and no children ever travelled from Ahmedabad to Moradabad. > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem a witness, Ahmedabad’s > ‘terrorist training case’ named him an accused and said he was > absconding. The law says the police have to follow due legal > process before declaring an accused as absconding. This includes > searches at his house and workplace in view of independent > witnesses, and recording statements from neighbours to establish > that the accused has not been seen for a long time. The Ahmedabad > police did not bother with this exercise. > The entire case against Haleem is based on a letter he wrote to > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad Ali. Dated August 7, > 2002, the letter makes no reference to terrorist training or any > other unlawful activity. It simply said: “You had come [to > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ (important goal).” With a giant > leap of imagination, the police claim that the words “ahem maqsad” > can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist training. Haleem wrote > that six of the children were orphans and the rest poor. He > concluded the letter saying: “I believe that by god’s grace you > will certainly help me in this educational and constructive > mission to propagate Islam.” In his deposition before a Delhi > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he was told the children will > get “a good education and decent living” in Moradabad, and had no > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train the children as > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge hearing the ‘RDX case’ found > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven years in jail. The court > accepted the police version even though the only witnesses to the > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. Ahmad Ali had claimed that > he was arrested at the airport as he was to board a flight to > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. The judge ignored that. > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the Delhi High Court against > their conviction. Here is an incredible twister: while they got > bail from the Delhi High Court despite being convicted by the > lower court, they were denied bail by the Gujarat High Court in > the ‘terrorist training case’ although no guilt has yet been > established in that case and the Gujarat crime branch admits their > crime never went beyond hatching the alleged conspiracy. That’s > not all. > The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old man named Hafiz Mohammad > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. He proved doubly lucky > when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail in the ‘terrorist > training case’ in June 2004. In its eye-opening bail order, the > judge said: “… All that remains against the present applicant > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had visited camps to > identify the children so that they can be better looked after. > That by itself cannot be considered an offence.” > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of exactly the same crime, > the argument should be valid for them, too. Yet, another Gujarat > High Court judge denied them bail and both continue to languish in > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to Ahmedabad because the Gujarat > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must report to the Crime > Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On Sunday, July 27, the > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the crime branch office > with trepidation. “They grilled me four hours on the blasts,” > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they let me go.” > The hearing in the ‘terrorist training case’ is nearly over. It is > to be seen if a separate trial will be called against Haleem, > since he is no more “absconding”. Meanwhile, Haleem’s family is > worried stiff over the next meal and the next month’s house rent > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no savings. His lone > employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run Haleem’s scrap shop. > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is anything but rare. One > glaring case concerns a “family of terrorists”. On July 15, a > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old Mohammad Muqeemuddin Yasir > as he returned home at night from his father’s workshop in > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb blasts rocked > Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, Hyderabad Police > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan Times newspaper that, > during interrogation, Yasir had confessed that before his arrest, > he had taken terror “operatives” to Karnataka and “arranged safe > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies the confession. “I > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told his mother, Tasleem > Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on July 29. “The police > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son was tortured during what > the police commissioner calls “interrogation”. “He was hung upside > down and beaten,” she said. > Apart from the fact that a confession made to the police is > inadmissible as evidence before a judge (never mind that the news > media accept confessions as gospel), Yasir’s alleged confession, > if true, should be a slap on the face of the Hyderabad Police. > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose father and one brother > are jailed on charges of terrorism. Yasir’s father, 56-yearold > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a wellrespected cleric who has now > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad for nearly four years > and has been denied bail all the way up to the Supreme Court. > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, is jailed in Karnataka’s > Belgaum district since he was arrested in January. > With his brother and father suspected as dreaded terrorists, the > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on Yasir all the time and > instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. That the police > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe houses” for terrorists in > Karnataka is because he probably never did any such thing. This > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a month before his arrest, > on his birthday on June 12, at an engineering workshop that his > father had set up three decades ago with borrowed money and skills > picked up as an assistant to a roadside mechanic. In the din of > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in managing customers crowding > the small front office. “My father and brother have been framed,” > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir seems a victim of patently > bogus cases against him. He was a member of SIMI when it was > banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. (Given the relentless > government propaganda against SIMI, the reader might find it hard > to believe that no court in India has yet upheld the charge of > terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) Yasir echoed dozens > others interviewed by this reporter across India in saying that > SIMI was a platform for “deep religious training and self- > purification”, and not for acts of terrorism or anti-India > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of atrocities on Muslims from > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It never gave up the issue of > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of us.” > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the police arrested Yasir and > booked him with the other two SIMI representatives in Hyderabad > under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act. A magistrate gave > them bail the next day. A day later, the police slapped another > case against the three, alleging that one of them was arrested > making a speech against the government. The other two, including > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went back to the court and > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days before securing bail. > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to begin. > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a firebrand cleric who never > held his tongue in public speeches against the government, > especially on issues such as the Babri Masjid demolition and the > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. Embroiled in cooked-up > cases, in several of which he was subsequently acquitted, Maulana > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police to report at their > office regularly. > On one such day in October 2004, when Maulana Nasiruddin reached > the police station, he was arrested by a police team from > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a terror conspiracy in > Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of former Gujarat Home > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence against Maulana > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a letter to the court, he > has denied making.) > Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana to the police station > began protesting as he was led out. At this, Gujarat police > officer Narendra Amin took out his service revolver and shot dead > one protestor. All hell broke loose. Nasiruddin’s supporters > refused to move the dead protestor’s body unless the police filed > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad police filed two cases > back to back: One, their own, against the protestors for blocking > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under pressure, against > Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch in four years. The > Hyderabad police ought to have seized his revolver and sent it for > a forensic examination, along with the bullet recovered from the > dead protestor’s body. They should have arrested and produced Amin > before a magistrate. This is an open-and-shut case if there ever > was one: with the weapon of homicide matching the bullet, and > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of this happened. Amin > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana Nasiruddin in his custody. The > FIR against him has become a dead letter. > Amin is the same police officer who was subsequently accused of > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat businessman Sohrabuddin who > was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 (as mentioned above > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, too, is now in jail. > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main complainant against > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is none other than 20- > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s youngest son and Yasir’s > youngest brother. On January 11 this year, Nasir was arrested by > police in Karnataka with another person and was accused of > stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly riding. Claiming a > knife was found on the two, the police slapped charges such as > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and his co-accused. > Amazingly, the police filed seven confessions from the two accused > over the next 18 days. Not one showed them saying they were SIMI > members. Police then filed their eighth confessions in which they > allegedly accepted being SIMI members and the attendant terror > charges. Ninety days later, when the police failed to file a > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the magistrate’s house who > then had no option but to grant bail as per law. But by this time, > the police had implicated Nasir in another case of conspiracy, so > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has retracted his > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has little hope against > biases in the judicial system. > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two accused to police > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the following in an interview: > “Even as I was signing the necessary papers remanding them to > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other accused] stepped forward > requesting to speak with me. He told me that the police denied > them food and water and subjected them to repeated beatings. He > proceeded to show me the bruises on Nasir’s body. The two > repeatedly made a reference to human rights violation by the > police and demanded medical attention. > “I was very surprised by three things: they were talking of their > fundamental rights in an authoritative manner, they spoke English > and, further, they readily admitted that they had stolen the bike, > something most thieves never do in my experience.” > When a police sub-inspector phoned the magistrate “warning” that > the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial custody, the magistrate > asked the evidence to be brought to this house. “The materials > produced before me included duplicate identity cards, a fancy > dagger, a map of South India with red marks against Udupi and Goa, > an American dollar, two pieces of paper with www.com written on > one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on another. > “When I looked at these materials in their entirety, I felt that > these were definitely not just bike thieves. Why would bike > thieves carry around duplicate identity cards and a map of South > India? The fact that they had an American dollar seemed to suggest > they had international links. The paper with www.com indicated to > me that they were tech-savvy. The other piece of paper had a > message that seemed to be a sort of code that I could not > immediately decipher. Also, when I examined the South India map, > Udupi had a sort of indication with a red marker against it. > Perhaps they were planning to strike at theplace during a > religious function. > “All these suggested that there were definitely enough grounds in > my opinion to grant the police custody of Nasir and Asadullah to > facilitate further investigations.” Go figure. > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, Muqeemuddin Yasir, Maulana > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ mother doesn’t think so. > “Why don’t the police put us all together in jail,” she told > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. “Then they can shoot all of > us dead.” • > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Sat Aug 9 20:54:19 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 20:54:19 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <829146.13398.qm@web8407.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Radhika "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father of the nation, mahatma that they will stay back in India as brothers with their hindu community" Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath to live as brothers? Isn't that oath required by others as well? --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > Cc: "sarai" > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > All muslims are not terrorists, but all those terrorists who > are caught with acts of terrorism are muslims. > > When the community of muslims forgot their solemn oath > to father of the nation, mahatma that they will stay back in > India as brothers with their hindu community, many were > sceptical, for one, as the population increases the muslim > community along with other segments of sovciety also did > not get their due in good governance, thanks to the politics > of votebanks, society was further divided in linguistic , > caste and faith segments, the national exchequer never > reached the grass root level of the populace and citizens in > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good governance > without bias , without fear or favour. > > The muslim community in general had lower percentage of > educated men and women, who instead of having concern for > their community, is seen more in nesting their own homes > than the society. The unaccounted cash transactions, > unwillingness to be accountable to society, wherever the > muslims are majority, trying to impose their rules on > society are all the reasons along with political > appeasements and false promises and gestures of patronising > the mullas for votes left a common muslim wondering where he > belonged to. ! > > The subsequent generations of muslims, particularly > youth started to vent their anger, demanding more say in the > governance along with dalits and other suppressed and > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for breeding of > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing the issues used > their friday prayers only to arouse the passions on some > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined dangers from > "communal " parties totally loosing sight of > communalism played by so called secular parties.! > > In the entire process, the muslim youth who is found > wanting a job is easy prey for those elements in society who > do not risk themselves of being seen as terorists, use the > youth to terrorise the society. > > Only solution to terror is handle the elements who > organise the youth to terrorise the society, terrorise them > and democratic rule of laws should handle the deviant > behaviour of the culprits without fear or favour of vote > banks. > > regards. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "S.Fatima" > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > fighting terrorism > To: sarai > > > All The Wrong Men > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the Ahmedabad blasts > is just the > > tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT SAHI exposes > the random > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > (Tehelka: > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp) > > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > decades, Maulana > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to speak to > the faithful > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the soft-spoken, > revered aalim, > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of Muslims in > the hour- > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one of > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > localities where the preacher and many in his > congregation live. > > His sermon this afternoon was on a Muslim’s duty > towards his > > neighbours. “You cannot fill your stomach if your > neighbour is > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried tone. “You > cannot > > discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim > neighbours.” > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of the serial > blasts that > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, policemen > stormed > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque and > dragged him away as > > his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, as a local > magistrate > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for two weeks, > police claimed > > Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday blasts and > that grilling > > him would unravel the execution of and the conspiracy > behind the > > terror act. > > In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, > justifiably, wants > > answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge then is > not to reach > > for the quick routes, the easy demonisations. > Unfortunately, the > > Indian State has not quite met that challenge. Over > the years, for > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread acronym for most > Indians — > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a hotbed of > terrorism, a > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent on destroying > the nation. > > Quick on the back of every horrific blast, that name > is thrust > > upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo — > stretching outwards > > to embrace the entire community. But how true are > these allegations? > > In the struggle for a just and safe society, it is > crucial to find > > real perpetrators and correct answers; crucial to > cleave doggedly > > to the idea of fair play and rule of law; crucial not > to fall prey > > to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit of this, > in an > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA conducted > an > > investigation across India over three months and 12 > cities. > > Serialised here, starting this week, the disturbing > investigation > > found that an overwhelming majority of terrorism cases > — > > especially those related to the outlawed SIMI — are > based on > > either non-existent or fraudulent evidence and are an > affront to > > both law and common sense. > > The investigation found that entrenched prejudices in > the > > executive and the judiciary, an abject lack of > political will > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news media that > demands > > instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly > copy-pastes every > > unproven police and intelligence story on terrorist > networks has > > morphed into a tragic persecution of hundreds of > people falsely > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these are Muslim; > nearly all > > of these are poor. > > “We will rise to the challenge and I am confident we > will be able > > to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister Manmohan > Singh said as he > > walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s civil > hospital, where > > two blasts had inflicted the worst casualties. He > urged political > > parties and police and intelligence agencies to work > together > > against efforts aimed at “destroying our social > fabric, > > undermining communal harmony.” Unfortunately, given > their > > staggering record of false cases against innocent > people, it > > appears that incompetent police and intelligence > agencies are > > doing exactly the opposite. > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled below, is a > searing > > example why. > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the stenographic > news media, > > police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI member > linked with > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. Gujarat > government’s > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that Haleem sent > Muslim youth > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as terrorists > to avenge > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the state. He > said they > > planned, among others, to assassinate BJP leader LK > Advani and > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police have said > Haleem was > > absconding since he was named an accused in this case > in 2002. > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad following the > cleric’s arrest > > has thrown up strong evidence, documentary and > circumstantial, > > that far from absconding, Haleem has lived at his > house — which is > > less than a km from the local police station — for > years and led a > > public life within his community. The charge against > him that he > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is highly dubious > based as it > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose contents > don’t remotely > > reflect a link with terrorism. And until Saturday’s > bomb blasts, > > Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a SIMI > member. > > If anything, Haleem’s family and followers say > police have > > harassed him for years for his role in helping victims > of the 2002 > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, an > inspector from the > > police station sent Haleem a onepage handwritten > notice in > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz Ahle-Hadis > [the Islamic > > sect to which Haleem and his followers belong] Trust > has been > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping Centre. > You are its > > head… Many members have been appointed in it. You > are directed to > > submit a list of their names, addresses and phone > numbers.” > > Apart from the gross illegality of such a demand on a > trust > > constituted as per law with no criminal charge against > it, the > > letter proves the police knew Haleem’s whereabouts > and were in > > touch with him as late as two months ago. Indeed, the > notice > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi Park > Society, near > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has proof that > the police > > received his reply the next day. > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed telegrams to > Gujarat’s > > director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s police > commissioner > > claiming that the police forcibly entered his house > that day and > > harassed his wife and children in his absence. “We > are peace- > > loving and law-abiding citizens and have never been > part of any > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the telegram in > Hindi. “The police > > are unlawfully harassing me and my family without > appropriate > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil rights.” > Predictably, he > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > In April, when a local outfit called Social Unity > & Peace Forum, > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as its members, > organised a > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the police > seeking permission > > to use loudspeakers. That application clearly > mentioned that > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the event. > Haleem’s family > > also offers his driving licence, renewed by the > Ahmedabad > > transport office on December 28, 2006, as proof that > he led a > > normal life all along. Three years ago, in July 2005, > the Gujarati > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published Haleem’s > picture with a > > statement he released at a press conference giving his > views on a > > raging controversy over the alleged rape of a woman, > Imrana, by > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar Pradesh. > > “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana > Haleem’s innocence,” > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has appealed to the > Gujarat > > governor to secure the cleric’s release. Adds Nazir, > in whose > > house Haleem has lived with his family as tenant: “I > have known > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of religion and has > never > > indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s wife Noor > Saba: “I swear by > > my children that my husband is not a terrorist. He is > being framed.” > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the > cleric’s > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped hundreds > in their daily > > lives by imparting them the skills of patience and > fortitude,” > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old embroiderer. > Haq fishes > > out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama the > Maulana signed > > after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to show that > Haleem > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered a sermon > to the guests > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that Haq had > installed — with > > police permission. > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, hails from > Uttar Pradesh > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is a preacher > with a > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis that began > on the > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has survived a > frowning Sunni > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the Hadis — > the oral > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — as a > guiding principle for > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news media have > long > > parroted the police’s insinuation that Ahle-Hadis is > a terrorist > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The police claim > its members > > include many terror accused such as those of the July > 2006 Mumbai > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed membership of > 30 million in > > India, denies the charge. It points out that Union > Home Minister > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its national > symposium two > > years ago at New Delhi. > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle Hadis > followers for 14 > > years, resigning three years ago to minister a small > mosque so he > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a regular > income to > > feed his wife and seven children, the oldest two of > whom study at > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the 2002 > anti-Muslim > > violence in Gujarat as he involved himself in relief > work at the > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. An > Ahmedabad native > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and was > visiting his > > home, came to meet Haleem with two other Muslims. One > of them was > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also lived in > Kuwait. The > > other was a small-time trader from Moradabad. The > three wanted to > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 violence > by bringing > > them free education and care, so Haleem took them to > four refugee > > camps. A week later, one camp responded saying it had > found 34 > > children for such care. Haleem phoned the Kuwait > expatriate, who > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him about the > offer. But > > getting no response, the plan died and, importantly, > no children > > were ever sent. > > Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi Police > arrested Shahid > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait allegedly > with 4.5 kg > > of the explosive material, RDX. The Moradabad trader > was also > > arrested from his hometown. All three were charged > under the > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring to carry > out terrorist > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter (about the > camp’s offer > > of the orphan children) with the expatriate from > Kuwait. As both > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, police there > were informed. > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG Vanzara > called in Haleem > > and detained him — illegally — for five days. > (Vanzara is now in > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman > Sohrabuddin in cold > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as a > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > family frantically filed a petition with the Gujarat > High Court to > > secure his release. “The judge ordered the police to > bring Haleem > > to the court in two hours,” recalls the > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The police > instantly released > > Haleem who rushed to the court where his statement on > his illegal > > detention was duly recorded and is part of official > documents. > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX case’ > against the two > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the Moradabad > trader, police > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against the same > individuals > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as terrorists in > Moradabad”. > > This is the case the police and the media have > referred since > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb blasts to argue > that the > > cleric was involved in “sending Muslim youth to > train as > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer was > openly lying on > > Monday when he told the magistrate that Haleem had > sent “30 youth” > > to Moradabad for training as terrorists. The > charge-sheet in the > > case clearly admits that the so-called conspiracy had > remained on > > paper and no children ever travelled from Ahmedabad to > Moradabad. > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem a witness, > Ahmedabad’s > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him an accused and > said he was > > absconding. The law says the police have to follow due > legal > > process before declaring an accused as absconding. > This includes > > searches at his house and workplace in view of > independent > > witnesses, and recording statements from neighbours to > establish > > that the accused has not been seen for a long time. > The Ahmedabad > > police did not bother with this exercise. > > The entire case against Haleem is based on a letter he > wrote to > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad Ali. Dated > August 7, > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to terrorist > training or any > > other unlawful activity. It simply said: “You had > come [to > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ (important > goal).” With a giant > > leap of imagination, the police claim that the words > “ahem maqsad” > > can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist training. > Haleem wrote > > that six of the children were orphans and the rest > poor. He > > concluded the letter saying: “I believe that by > god’s grace you > > will certainly help me in this educational and > constructive > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his deposition > before a Delhi > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he was told > the children will > > get “a good education and decent living” in > Moradabad, and had no > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train the > children as > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge hearing the > ‘RDX case’ found > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait, > Farhan Ahmad > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven years in jail. > The court > > accepted the police version even though the only > witnesses to the > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. Ahmad Ali had > claimed that > > he was arrested at the airport as he was to board a > flight to > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. The judge > ignored that. > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the Delhi High > Court against > > their conviction. Here is an incredible twister: while > they got > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite being convicted > by the > > lower court, they were denied bail by the Gujarat High > Court in > > the ‘terrorist training case’ although no guilt > has yet been > > established in that case and the Gujarat crime branch > admits their > > crime never went beyond hatching the alleged > conspiracy. That’s > > not all. > > The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old man named > Hafiz Mohammad > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. He proved > doubly lucky > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail in the > ‘terrorist > > training case’ in June 2004. In its eye-opening bail > order, the > > judge said: “… All that remains against the > present applicant > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had visited > camps to > > identify the children so that they can be better > looked after. > > That by itself cannot be considered an offence.” > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of exactly the > same crime, > > the argument should be valid for them, too. Yet, > another Gujarat > > High Court judge denied them bail and both continue to > languish in > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to Ahmedabad because > the Gujarat > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must report to > the Crime > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On Sunday, > July 27, the > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the crime > branch office > > with trepidation. “They grilled me four hours on the > blasts,” > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they let me > go.” > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist training case’ is > nearly over. It is > > to be seen if a separate trial will be called against > Haleem, > > since he is no more “absconding”. Meanwhile, > Haleem’s family is > > worried stiff over the next meal and the next > month’s house rent > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no savings. > His lone > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is anything but > rare. One > > glaring case concerns a “family of terrorists”. On > July 15, a > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old Mohammad > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > as he returned home at night from his father’s > workshop in > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb blasts > rocked > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, Hyderabad > Police > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan Times > newspaper that, > > during interrogation, Yasir had confessed that before > his arrest, > > he had taken terror “operatives” to Karnataka and > “arranged safe > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies the > confession. “I > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told his > mother, Tasleem > > Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on July 29. > “The police > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son was tortured > during what > > the police commissioner calls “interrogation”. > “He was hung upside > > down and beaten,” she said. > > Apart from the fact that a confession made to the > police is > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge (never mind > that the news > > media accept confessions as gospel), Yasir’s alleged > confession, > > if true, should be a slap on the face of the Hyderabad > Police. > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose father and > one brother > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. Yasir’s father, > 56-yearold > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a wellrespected cleric > who has now > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad for nearly > four years > > and has been denied bail all the way up to the Supreme > Court. > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, is jailed > in Karnataka’s > > Belgaum district since he was arrested in January. > > With his brother and father suspected as dreaded > terrorists, the > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on Yasir all > the time and > > instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. That the > police > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe houses” for > terrorists in > > Karnataka is because he probably never did any such > thing. This > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a month before > his arrest, > > on his birthday on June 12, at an engineering workshop > that his > > father had set up three decades ago with borrowed > money and skills > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside mechanic. In > the din of > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in managing > customers crowding > > the small front office. “My father and brother have > been framed,” > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir seems a victim > of patently > > bogus cases against him. He was a member of SIMI when > it was > > banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. (Given the > relentless > > government propaganda against SIMI, the reader might > find it hard > > to believe that no court in India has yet upheld the > charge of > > terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) Yasir > echoed dozens > > others interviewed by this reporter across India in > saying that > > SIMI was a platform for “deep religious training and > self- > > purification”, and not for acts of terrorism or > anti-India > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of atrocities on > Muslims from > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It never gave > up the issue of > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of us.” > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the police > arrested Yasir and > > booked him with the other two SIMI representatives in > Hyderabad > > under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act. A > magistrate gave > > them bail the next day. A day later, the police > slapped another > > case against the three, alleging that one of them was > arrested > > making a speech against the government. The other two, > including > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went back to the > court and > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days before > securing bail. > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to begin. > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a firebrand > cleric who never > > held his tongue in public speeches against the > government, > > especially on issues such as the Babri Masjid > demolition and the > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. Embroiled in > cooked-up > > cases, in several of which he was subsequently > acquitted, Maulana > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police to report > at their > > office regularly. > > On one such day in October 2004, when Maulana > Nasiruddin reached > > the police station, he was arrested by a police team > from > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a terror > conspiracy in > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of former > Gujarat Home > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence against > Maulana > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a letter to > the court, he > > has denied making.) > > Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana to the > police station > > began protesting as he was led out. At this, Gujarat > police > > officer Narendra Amin took out his service revolver > and shot dead > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. Nasiruddin’s > supporters > > refused to move the dead protestor’s body unless the > police filed > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad police filed > two cases > > back to back: One, their own, against the protestors > for blocking > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under pressure, > against > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch in four > years. The > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized his revolver and > sent it for > > a forensic examination, along with the bullet > recovered from the > > dead protestor’s body. They should have arrested and > produced Amin > > before a magistrate. This is an open-and-shut case if > there ever > > was one: with the weapon of homicide matching the > bullet, and > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of this > happened. Amin > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana Nasiruddin in his > custody. The > > FIR against him has become a dead letter. > > Amin is the same police officer who was subsequently > accused of > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat businessman > Sohrabuddin who > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 (as > mentioned above > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, too, is now > in jail. > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main complainant > against > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is none > other than 20- > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s youngest son > and Yasir’s > > youngest brother. On January 11 this year, Nasir was > arrested by > > police in Karnataka with another person and was > accused of > > stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly riding. > Claiming a > > knife was found on the two, the police slapped charges > such as > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and his > co-accused. > > Amazingly, the police filed seven confessions from the > two accused > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed them saying they > were SIMI > > members. Police then filed their eighth confessions in > which they > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members and the > attendant terror > > charges. Ninety days later, when the police failed to > file a > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the > magistrate’s house who > > then had no option but to grant bail as per law. But > by this time, > > the police had implicated Nasir in another case of > conspiracy, so > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has retracted > his > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has little hope > against > > biases in the judicial system. > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two accused to > police > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the following > in an interview: > > “Even as I was signing the necessary papers > remanding them to > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other accused] > stepped forward > > requesting to speak with me. He told me that the > police denied > > them food and water and subjected them to repeated > beatings. He > > proceeded to show me the bruises on Nasir’s body. > The two > > repeatedly made a reference to human rights violation > by the > > police and demanded medical attention. > > “I was very surprised by three things: they were > talking of their > > fundamental rights in an authoritative manner, they > spoke English > > and, further, they readily admitted that they had > stolenthe bike, > > something most thieves never do in my experience.” > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the magistrate > “warning” that > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial custody, > the magistrate > > asked the evidence to be brought to this house. “The > materials > > produced before me included duplicate identity cards, > a fancy > > dagger, a map of South India with red marks against > Udupi and Goa, > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper with www.com > written on > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on another. > > “When I looked at these materials in their entirety, > I felt that > > these were definitely not just bike thieves. Why would > bike > > thieves carry around duplicate identity cards and a > map of South > > India? The fact that they had an American dollar > seemed to suggest > > they had international links. The paper with www.com > indicated to > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other piece of paper > had a > > message that seemed to be a sort of code that I could > not > > immediately decipher. Also, when I examined the South > India map, > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a red marker > against it. > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at the place > during a > > religious function. > > “All these suggested that there were definitely > enough grounds in > > my opinion to grant the police custody of Nasir and > Asadullah to > > facilitate further investigations.” Go figure. > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, Muqeemuddin > Yasir, Maulana > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ mother > doesn’t think so. > > “Why don’t the police put us all together in > jail,” she told > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. “Then they can > shoot all of > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, > on > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > list > > List archive: > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Sat Aug 9 20:56:28 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 20:56:28 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] =?utf-8?q?=E2=80=98They_just_want_Muslim_boys_to_al?= =?utf-8?q?ways_be_in_jail=E2=80=99?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <431521.59046.qm@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> ‘They just want Muslim boys to always be in jail’ Moutasim Billah has been a police scapegoat for seven years, even though they acknowledge they have nothing on him. AN ENGINEERING student forced to give up studies because of cases of sedition and terrorism against him, 22-year-old Moutasim Billah of Hyderabad would do a lawyer proud with the way he reels out sections of the Indian Penal Code. Sadly, Billah is familiar with these sections only because he has suffered them for seven years. Billah was arrested on March 5, 2008, after his name came up in alleged confessions of other young Muslims randomly arrested and tortured with electric shocks by the police during investigations of last year’s bomb blasts in Hyderabad. Nine people were killed in the May 2007 blast outside a mosque called Mecca Masjid near the Charminar. Forty more were killed in two simultaneous blasts at a snack shop and in a park in August. When the police found no grounds to implicate Billah in the two blasts, they slapped a patently bogus case on him, saying he and the other men secretly met at a cemetery to hatch a terrorist conspiracy and incite Hindu-Muslim violence. The police claim to have raided the meeting and arrested seven persons, but say Billah absconded — until his arrest in March. He was in prison for 90 days until the High Court gave him bail. The only evidence cited against him were some “inflammatory” CDs allegedly found in the cemetry. “The police want Muslims boys to always stay in jail on some pretext or the other,” Billah told TEHELKA in an interview on June 12, 2008 at his home in Hyderabad, just hours after he was released. Billah’s narrative is a good primer on how the Indian police trap innocent people and makes their lives a living hell. His story began when as a 15- year-old, Billah joined demonstrations in Hyderabad called by local Muslims in 2001 to protest US President George Bush’s decision to invade Afghanistan. For some reason, police decided this was a crime in India. They registered cases against scores of protestors, including Billah. Despite there being no independent witnesses or evidence, the case has dragged on for seven years, during which Billah has attended more than 50 hearings. In 2002, he joined another protest, bringing on another FIR that is still a live grenade. In 2004, a tragic event occurred. Billah was its victim, but the police made him an accused and slapped serious charges on him. Readers will recall that last week TEHELKA exposed the police lies against Maulana Nasiruddin of Hyderabad and two of his sons, all of whom are in jails in different states. Billah’s family and Maulana Nasiruddin are neighbours in the Muslim neighbourhood of Saidabad in Hyderabad. To recap: in October 2004, Nasiruddin went to the local police station for a routine attendance in an earlier case when policemen from Gujarat waiting there arrested him on a charge of conspiracy to enact terror in that state, including the murder of its former home minister, Haren Pandya. When a few Muslims who had accompanied Nasiruddin to the police station protested, a Gujarat police officer fired at them, instantly killing one protestor. That protestor was Billah’s older and only brother. Forget about getting justice for his brother’s death, Billah was made an accused in the criminal case filed against the protestors, charging them with the very serious crime of obstructing police officers from doing their duty: in this case, taking custody of Nasiruddin. The protestors forced the police to file a case against the Gujarat officer. Billah is listed as an eyewitness in that case. TEHELKA’s investigation reveals that across India, police repeatedly and deliberately list some accused as “absconding”, so that they can be easily picked up when the heat is on the police for some case. That’s what was said about Billah in myriad cases since 2001. But Billah was no absconder. Until 2004, he was studying BE in civil engineering at the local Deccan Engineering College, when he dropped out in the third year. He regularly participated in community events. He regularly used a mobile phone, the recordings of which could easily prove his whereabouts. ANOTHER TACTIC the police regularly use against SIMI activists is to implicate them in older cases with retrospective effect. The day after Maulana Nasiruddin’s arrest in 2004, angry Muslims had pelted stones at the police as Billah’s brother’s coffin had wound its way to the cemetery. The police had promptly registered another case. Billah wasn’t an accused in that case for over three years. But after his arrest on March 5, 2008, police included his name in that case as well. When he was produced in court, Billah told the judge that he had made no confessions to the police and was forced to sign a blank paper by them. But his prospects look grim: his “confession” submitted by the police says he was networked with the alleged SIMI leader, Safdar Nagori, who was dramatically arrested in Indore on March 26, 2008 and is the police’s latest fall guy, vilified in the media as a big terror mastermind though his trial is yet to even begin. Curiously, none of the police cases against Billah ever claimed he is a SIMI member, saying only that he was the brother of a SIMI member (which too both the family and SIMI deny), or that he was a “sympathiser” of SIMI or “associated” with SIMI members. But one of Hyderabad’s senior IPS officers, Amit Garg, categorically asserted before the tribunal (assessing the ban) that Billah was a SIMI member. This reflects either Garg’s prejudice or a deliberate attempt on his part to mislead the tribunal. As the point person of the Andhra Pradesh police for all SIMI cases before the tribunal, Garg swore an oath that he had no, repeat no, personal knowledge of the cases and was deposing entirely from documents given him by various investigating officers. Yet, none of the documents except his says Billah is a SIMI member. All the allegations against Billah seem to flow from prejudice. The police have been smarting since 2006 when Billah mocked them with his bold decision to assist SIMI’s legal team in hearings by the previous tribunal. “Policemen came to me and said, ‘Why the hell have you come here if you are not with SIMI?�99” Billah recalls. “They said I was making a terrible mistake.” • >From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 32, Dated Aug 16, 2008 Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From phadkeshilpa at gmail.com Sat Aug 9 23:06:26 2008 From: phadkeshilpa at gmail.com (Shilpa Phadke) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 23:06:26 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] MONDAY: Talk at CMCS by Malathi de Alwis In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The Centre for Media & Cultural Studies, TISS would like to invite you to a talk: ** ** *Tracing the 'Disappeared': Political Community in the Wake of Atrocity* **** Speaker: Malathi de Alwis Date: 11 August 2008, Monday Time: 4 pm – 6 pm Place: Classroom: IV, TISS Old Campus, Deonar, Mumbai *Abstract:* Forced disappearance is one of the most insidious forms of violence as it seeks to obliterate the body and indefinitely extends and exacerbates the grief of those left behind. In this paper, I consider how such chronic mourners 'reinhabit the world' in the face of continuously deferring loss, and seek to theorise what might be its political outcome(s). Arguing that this re-inhabiting is a constant tracing of traces given the ambiguous nature of the disappeared's status of absence, and thus presence, I explore a particular 'identification with suffering' that is embraced and embodied by Sinhala women whose children were 'disappeared' during the second People's Liberation Front (JVP) uprising (1988-1993). In such a context, visual and tactile objects such as photographs and clothing, I suggest, become especially meaningful by reasserting the presence of the disappeared. In conclusion, I engage Judith Butler's contention that grief is a tie that binds and thus enables the imagining of alternative political communities to reflect on how such a conceptualization might be helpful to re-invigorate political communities in Sri Lanka. *About the Speaker:* Malathi de Alwis is a Senior Research Fellow at the International Centre for Ethnic Studies, Colombo, Sri Lanka and also teaches in the Faculty of Graduate Studies, University of Colombo. She is the co-editor, with Kumari Jayawardena, of Embodied Violence: Communalising Women's Sexuality in South Asia (1996) and of Feminists under Fire: Exchanges Across War Zones (2003), with Wenona Giles et al. Her current work explores how people re-inhabit their worlds in the wake of extraordinary violence and devastating loss. From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sun Aug 10 14:09:14 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 13:39:14 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism In-Reply-To: <829146.13398.qm@web8407.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <829146.13398.qm@web8407.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Sadia, your query looks absurd on the face of it because hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 years, always tolerent of the invaders be it the moghuls or later christian missionaries converting to increase the numerical strength of the "community. Muslims demanded a land and nation for themselves, a islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, but majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , free india, secular nation, not a hindu nation, showcasing the tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to blame games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their promise when they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to stay back. Next, as a community, why muslims are not identifying the "fasaadis" in their community who are terming themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in to fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not tolerate, ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try to legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of islam, thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let the muslim community take steps to identify the terrorsists or fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of rule will take care of such deviant fasaadis. In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" lawyers defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no way connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a jihaadi by default.! regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: "S.Fatima" Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net Cc: sarai > Dear Radhika > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father of the nation, mahatma > that they will stay back in India as brothers with their hindu > community" > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath to live as > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others as well? > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > wrote: > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > fighting terrorism > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > Cc: "sarai" > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all those terrorists who > > are caught with acts of terrorism are muslims. > > > > When the community of muslims forgot their solemn oath > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they will stay back in > > India as brothers with their hindu community, many were > > sceptical, for one, as the population increases the muslim > > community along with other segments of sovciety also did > > not get their due in good governance, thanks to the politics > > of votebanks, society was further divided in linguistic , > > caste and faith segments, the national exchequer never > > reached the grass root level of the populace and citizens in > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good governance > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > The muslim community in general had lower percentage of > > educated men and women, who instead of having concern for > > their community, is seen more in nesting their own homes > > than the society. The unaccounted cash transactions, > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, wherever the > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their rules on > > society are all the reasons along with political > > appeasements and false promises and gestures of patronising > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim wondering where he > > belonged to. ! > > > > The subsequent generations of muslims, particularly > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding more say in the > > governance along with dalits and other suppressed and > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for breeding of > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing the issues used > > their friday prayers only to arouse the passions on some > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined dangers from > > "communal " parties totally loosing sight of > > communalism played by so called secular parties.! > > > > In the entire process, the muslim youth who is found > > wanting a job is easy prey for those elements in society who > > do not risk themselves of being seen as terorists, use the > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > Only solution to terror is handle the elements who > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, terrorise them > > and democratic rule of laws should handle the deviant > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or favour of vote > > banks. > > > > regards. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "S.Fatima" > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > > fighting terrorism > > To: sarai > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the Ahmedabad blasts > > is just the > > > tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT SAHI exposes > > the random > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)> > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > decades, Maulana > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to speak to > > the faithful > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the soft-spoken, > > revered aalim, > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of Muslims in > > the hour- > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one of > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > localities where the preacher and many in his > > congregation live. > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a Muslim’s duty > > towards his > > > neighbours.“You cannot fill your stomach if your > > neighbour is > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried tone. “You > > cannot > > > discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim > > neighbours.” > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of the serial > > blasts that > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, policemen > > stormed > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque and > > dragged him away as > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, as a local > > magistrate > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for two weeks, > > police claimed > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday blasts and > > that grilling > > > him would unravel the execution of and the conspiracy > > behind the > > > terror act. > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, > > justifiably, wants > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge then is > > not to reach > > > for the quick routes, the easy demonisations. > > Unfortunately, the > > > Indian State has not quite met that challenge. Over > > the years, for > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread acronym for most > > Indians — > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a hotbed of > > terrorism, a > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent on destroying > > the nation. > > > Quick on the back of every horrific blast, that name > > is thrust > > > upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo — > > stretching outwards > > > to embrace the entire community. But how true are > > these allegations? > > > In the struggle for a just and safe society, it is > > crucial to find > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; crucial to > > cleave doggedly > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of law; crucial not > > to fall prey > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit of this, > > in an > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA conducted > > an > > > investigation across India over three months and 12 > > cities. > > > Serialised here, starting this week, the disturbing > > investigation > > > found that an overwhelming majority of terrorism cases > > — > > > especially those related to the outlawed SIMI — are > > based on > > > either non-existent or fraudulent evidence and are an > > affront to > > > both law and common sense. > > > The investigation found that entrenched prejudices in > > the > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject lack of > > political will > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news media that > > demands > > > instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly > > copy-pastes every > > > unproven police and intelligence story on terrorist > > networks has > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of hundreds of > > people falsely > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these are Muslim; > > nearly all > > > of these are poor. > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I am confident we > > will be able > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister Manmohan > > Singh said as he > > > walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s civil > > hospital, where > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst casualties. He > > urged political > > > parties and police and intelligence agencies to work > > together > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying our social > > fabric, > > > undermining communal harmony.” Unfortunately, given > > their > > > staggering record of false cases against innocent > > people, it > > > appears that incompetent police and intelligence > > agencies are > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled below, is a > > searing > > > example why. > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the stenographic > > news media, > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI member > > linked with > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. Gujarat > > government’s > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that Haleem sent > > Muslim youth > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as terrorists > > to avenge > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the state. He > > said they > > > planned, among others, to assassinate BJP leader LK > > Advani and > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police have said > > Haleem was > > > absconding since he was named an accused in this case > > in 2002. > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad following the > > cleric’s arrest > > > has thrown up strong evidence, documentary and > > circumstantial, > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has lived at his > > house — which is > > > less than a km from the local police station — for > > years and led a > > > public life within his community. The charge against > > him that he > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is highly dubious > > based as it > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose contents > > don’t remotely > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And until Saturday’s > > bomb blasts, > > > Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a SIMI > > member. > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and followers say > > police have > > > harassed him for years for his role in helping victims > > of the 2002 > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, an > > inspector from the > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage handwritten > > notice in > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz Ahle-Hadis > > [the Islamic > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers belong] Trust > > has been > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping Centre. > > You are its > > > head… Many members have been appointed in it. You > > are directed to > > > submit a list of their names, addresses and phone > > numbers.” > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such a demand on a > > trust > > > constituted as per law with no criminal charge against > > it, the > > > letter proves the police knew Haleem’s whereabouts > > and were in > > > touch with him as late as two months ago. Indeed, the > > notice > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi Park > > Society, near > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has proof that > > the police > > > received his reply the next day. > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed telegrams to > > Gujarat’s > > > director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s police > > commissioner > > > claiming that the police forcibly entered his house > > that day and > > > harassed his wife and children in his absence. “We > > are peace- > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and have never been > > part of any > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the telegram in > > Hindi. “The police > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my family without > > appropriate > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil rights.” > > Predictably, he > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > In April, when a local outfit called Social Unity > > & Peace Forum, > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as its members, > > organised a > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the police > > seeking permission > > > to use loudspeakers. That application clearly > > mentioned that > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the event. > > Haleem’s family > > > also offers his driving licence, renewed by the > > Ahmedabad > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, as proof that > > he led a > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, in July 2005, > > the Gujarati > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published Haleem’s > > picture with a > > > statement he released at a press conference giving his > > views on a > > > raging controversy over the alleged rape of a woman, > > Imrana, by > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar Pradesh. > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has appealed to the > > Gujarat > > > governor to secure the cleric’s release. Adds Nazir, > > in whose > > > house Haleem has lived with his family as tenant: “I > > have known > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of religion and has > > never > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s wife Noor > > Saba: “I swear by > > > my children that my husband is not a terrorist. He is > > being framed.” > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the > > cleric’s > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped hundreds > > in their daily > > > lives by imparting them the skills of patience and > > fortitude,” > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old embroiderer. > > Haq fishes > > > out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama the > > Maulana signed > > > after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to show that > > Haleem > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered a sermon > > to the guests > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that Haq had > > installed — with > > > police permission. > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, hails from > > Uttar Pradesh > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is a preacher > > with a > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis that began > > on the > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has survived a > > frowning Sunni > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the Hadis — > > the oral > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — as a > > guiding principle for > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news media have > > long > > > parroted the police’s insinuation that Ahle-Hadis is > > a terrorist > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The police claim > > its members > > > include many terror accused such as those of the July > > 2006 Mumbai > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed membership of > > 30 million in > > > India, denies the charge. It points out that Union > > Home Minister > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its national > > symposium two > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle Hadis > > followers for 14 > > > years, resigning three years ago to minister a small > > mosque so he > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a regular > > income to > > > feed his wife and seven children, the oldest two of > > whom study at > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the 2002 > > anti-Muslim > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved himself in relief > > work at the > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. An > > Ahmedabad native > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and was > > visiting his > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two other Muslims. One > > of them was > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also lived in > > Kuwait. The > > > other was a small-time trader from Moradabad. The > > three wanted to > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 violence > > by bringing > > > them free education and care, so Haleem took them to > > four refugee > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded saying it had > > found 34 > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned the Kuwait > > expatriate, who > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him about the > > offer. But > > > getting no response, the plan died and, importantly, > > no children > > > were ever sent. > > > Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi Police > > arrested Shahid > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait allegedly > > with 4.5 kg > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The Moradabad trader > > was also > > > arrested from his hometown. All three were charged > > under the > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring to carry > > out terrorist > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter (about the > > camp’s offer > > > of the orphan children) with the expatriate from > > Kuwait. As both > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, police there > > were informed. > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG Vanzara > > called in Haleem > > > and detained him — illegally — for five days. > > (Vanzara is now in > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as a > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > family frantically filed a petition with the Gujarat > > High Court to > > > secure his release. “The judge ordered the police to > > bring Haleem > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls the > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The police > > instantly released > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where his statement on > > his illegal > > > detention was duly recorded and is part of official > > documents. > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX case’ > > against the two > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the Moradabad > > trader, police > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against the same > > individuals > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as terrorists in > > Moradabad”. > > > This is the case the police and the media have > > referred since > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb blasts to argue > > that the > > > cleric was involved in “sending Muslim youth to > > train as > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer was > > openly lying on > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that Haleem had > > sent “30 youth” > > > to Moradabad for training as terrorists. The > > charge-sheet in the > > > case clearly admits that the so-called conspiracy had > > remained on > > > paper and no children ever travelled from Ahmedabad to > > Moradabad. > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem a witness, > > Ahmedabad’s > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him an accused and > > said he was > > > absconding. The law says the police have to follow due > > legal > > > process before declaring an accused as absconding. > > This includes > > > searches at his house and workplace in view of > > independent > > > witnesses, and recording statements from neighbours to > > establish > > > that the accused has not been seen for a long time. > > The Ahmedabad > > > police did not bother with this exercise. > > > The entire case against Haleem is based on a letter he > > wrote to > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad Ali. Dated > > August 7, > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to terrorist > > training or any > > > other unlawful activity. It simply said: “You had > > come [to > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ (important > > goal).” With a giant > > > leap of imagination, the police claim that the words > > “ahem maqsad” > > > can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist training. > > Haleem wrote > > > that six of the children were orphans and the rest > > poor. He > > > concluded the letter saying: “I believe that by > > god’s grace you > > > will certainly help me in this educational and > > constructive > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his deposition > > before a Delhi > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he was told > > the children will > > > get “a good education and decent living” in > > Moradabad, and had no > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train the > > children as > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge hearing the > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait, > > Farhan Ahmad > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven years in jail. > > The court > > > accepted the police version even though the only > > witnesses to the > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. Ahmad Ali had > > claimed that > > > he was arrested at the airport as he was to board a > > flight to > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. The judge > > ignored that. > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the Delhi High > > Court against > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible twister: while > > they got > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite being convicted > > by the > > > lower court, they were denied bail by the Gujarat High > > Court in > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ although no guilt > > has yet been > > > established in that case and the Gujarat crime branch > > admits their > > > crime never went beyond hatching the alleged > > conspiracy. That’s > > > not all. > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old man named > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. He proved > > doubly lucky > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail in the > > ‘terrorist > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its eye-opening bail > > order, the > > > judge said: “… All that remains against the > > present applicant > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had visited > > camps to > > > identify the children so that they can be better > > looked after. > > > That by itself cannot be considered an offence.” > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of exactly the > > same crime, > > > the argument should be valid for them, too. Yet, > > another Gujarat > > > High Court judge denied them bail and both continue to > > languish in > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to Ahmedabad because > > the Gujarat > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must report to > > the Crime > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On Sunday, > > July 27, the > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the crime > > branch office > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me four hours on the > > blasts,” > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they let me > > go.” > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist training case’ is > > nearly over. It is > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be called against > > Haleem, > > > since he is no more “absconding”. Meanwhile, > > Haleem’s family is > > > worried stiff over the next meal and the next > > month’s house rent > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no savings. > > His lone > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is anything but > > rare. One > > > glaring case concerns a “family of terrorists”. On > > July 15, a > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old Mohammad > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > as he returned home at night from his father’s > > workshop in > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb blasts > > rocked > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, Hyderabad > > Police > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan Times > > newspaper that, > > > during interrogation, Yasir had confessed that before > > his arrest, > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to Karnataka and > > “arranged safe > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies the > > confession. “I > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told his > > mother, Tasleem > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on July 29. > > “The police > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son was tortured > > during what > > > the police commissioner calls “interrogation”. > > “He was hung upside > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > Apart from the fact that a confession made to the > > police is > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge (never mind > > that the news > > > media accept confessions as gospel), Yasir’s alleged > > confession, > > > if true, should be a slap on the face of the Hyderabad > > Police. > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose father and > > one brother > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. Yasir’s father, > > 56-yearold > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a wellrespected cleric > > who has now > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad for nearly > > four years > > > and has been denied bail all the way up to the Supreme > > Court. > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, is jailed > > in Karnataka’s > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested in January. > > > With his brother and father suspected as dreaded > > terrorists, the > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on Yasir all > > the time and > > > instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. That the > > police > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe houses” for > > terrorists in > > > Karnataka is because he probably never did any such > > thing. This > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a month before > > his arrest, > > > on his birthday on June 12, at an engineering workshop > > that his > > > father had set up three decades ago with borrowed > > money and skills > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside mechanic. In > > the din of > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in managing > > customers crowding > > > the small front office. “My father and brother have > > been framed,” > > > he forcefully toldTEHELKA. > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir seems a victim > > of patently > > > bogus cases against him. He was a member of SIMI when > > it was > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. (Given the > > relentless > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the reader might > > find it hard > > > to believe that no court in India has yet upheld the > > charge of > > > terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) Yasir > > echoed dozens > > > others interviewed by this reporter across India in > > saying that > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep religious training and > > self- > > > purification”, and not for acts of terrorism or > > anti-India > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of atrocities on > > Muslims from > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It never gave > > up the issue of > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of us.” > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the police > > arrested Yasir and > > > booked him with the other two SIMI representatives in > > Hyderabad > > > under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act. A > > magistrate gave > > > them bail the next day. A day later, the police > > slapped another > > > case against the three, alleging that one of them was > > arrested > > > making a speech against the government. The other two, > > including > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went back to the > > court and > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days before > > securing bail. > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to begin. > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a firebrand > > cleric who never > > > held his tongue in public speeches against the > > government, > > > especially on issues such as the Babri Masjid > > demolition and the > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. Embroiled in > > cooked-up > > > cases, in several of which he was subsequently > > acquitted, Maulana > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police to report > > at their > > > office regularly. > > > On one such day in October 2004, when Maulana > > Nasiruddin reached > > > the police station, he was arrested by a police team > > from > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a terror > > conspiracy in > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of former > > Gujarat Home > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence against > > Maulana > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a letter to > > the court, he > > > has denied making.) > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana to the > > police station > > > began protesting as he was led out. At this, Gujarat > > police > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his service revolver > > and shot dead > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. Nasiruddin’s > > supporters > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s body unless the > > police filed > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad police filed > > two cases > > > back to back: One, their own, against the protestors > > for blocking > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under pressure, > > against > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch in four > > years. The > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized his revolver and > > sent it for > > > a forensic examination, along with the bullet > > recovered from the > > > dead protestor’s body. They should have arrested and > > produced Amin > > > before a magistrate. This is an open-and-shut case if > > there ever > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide matching the > > bullet, and > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of this > > happened. Amin > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana Nasiruddin in his > > custody. The > > > FIR against him has become a dead letter. > > > Amin is the same police officer who was subsequently > > accused of > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat businessman > > Sohrabuddin who > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 (as > > mentioned above > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, too, is now > > in jail. > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main complainant > > against > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is none > > other than 20- > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s youngest son > > and Yasir’s > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this year, Nasir was > > arrested by > > > police in Karnataka with another person and was > > accused of > > > stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly riding. > > Claiming a > > > knife was found on the two, the police slapped charges > > such as > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and his > > co-accused. > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven confessions from the > > two accused > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed them saying they > > were SIMI > > > members. Police then filed their eighth confessions in > > which they > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members and the > > attendant terror > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the police failed to > > file a > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the > > magistrate’s house who > > > then had no option but to grant bail as per law. But > > by this time, > > > the police had implicated Nasir in another case of > > conspiracy, so > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has retracted > > his > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has little hope > > against > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two accused to > > police > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the following > > in an interview: > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary papers > > remanding them to > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other accused] > > stepped forward > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me that the > > police denied > > > them food and water and subjected them to repeated > > beatings. He > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on Nasir’s body. > > The two > > > repeatedly made a reference to human rights violation > > by the > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > “I was very surprised by three things: they were > > talking of their > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative manner, they > > spoke English > > > and, further, they readily admitted that they had > > stolen the bike, > > > something most thieves never do in my experience.” > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the magistrate > > “warning” that > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial custody, > > the magistrate > > > asked the evidence to be brought to this house. “The > > materials > > > produced before me included duplicate identity cards, > > a fancy > > > dagger, a map of South India with red marks against > > Udupi and Goa, > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper with www.com > > written on > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on another. > > > “When I looked at these materials in their entirety, > > I felt that > > > these were definitely not just bike thieves. Why would > > bike > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity cards and a > > map of South > > > India? The fact that they had an American dollar > > seemed to suggest > > > they had international links. The paper with www.com > > indicated to > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other piece of paper > > had a > > > message that seemed to be a sort of code that I could > > not > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I examined the South > > India map, > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a red marker > > against it. > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at the place > > during a > > > religious function. > > > “All these suggested that there were definitely > > enough grounds in > > > my opinion to grant the police custody of Nasir and > > Asadullah to > > > facilitate further investigations.” Go figure. > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, Muqeemuddin > > Yasir, Maulana > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ mother > > doesn’t think so. > > > “Why don’t the police put us all together in > > jail,” she told > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. “Then they can > > shoot all of > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, > > on > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > list > > > List archive: > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading messenger. Go > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 10 14:52:17 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 02:22:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism Message-ID: <76327.82512.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I fully agree with you,Radhika.Muslims as a community should give a serious thought to it in larger interest of the nation rather than reacting emotionally and having any semblance of soft corner to such criminal activities. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: "radhikarajen at vsnl.net" To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Cc: sarai Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 1:39:14 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism Dear Sadia,     your query looks absurd on the face of it because hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 years, always tolerent of the invaders be it  the moghuls or later christian missionaries converting to increase the numerical strength of the "community.   Muslims demanded a land and nation for themselves, a islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, but majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , free india,  secular nation, not a hindu nation, showcasing the tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to blame games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their promise when they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to stay back. Next, as a community, why muslims are not identifying the "fasaadis" in their community who are terming themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in to fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not tolerate, ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try to legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of islam, thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let the muslim community take steps to identify the terrorsists or fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of rule will take care of such deviant fasaadis. In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" lawyers defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no way connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a jihaadi by default.!   regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: "S.Fatima" Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting    terrorism To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net Cc: sarai > Dear Radhika > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father of the nation, mahatma > that they will stay back in India as brothers with their hindu > community" > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath to live as > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others as well? > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > wrote: > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > fighting terrorism > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > Cc: "sarai" > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all those terrorists who > > are caught with acts of terrorism are muslims. > > > >      When the community of muslims forgot their solemn oath > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they will stay back in > > India as brothers with their hindu community, many were > > sceptical, for one, as the population increases the muslim > > community  along with other segments of sovciety also did > > not get their due in good governance, thanks to the politics > > of votebanks, society was further divided in linguistic , > > caste and faith segments, the national exchequer never > > reached the grass root level of the populace and citizens in > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good governance > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > >    The muslim community in general had lower percentage of > > educated men and women, who instead of having concern for > > their community, is seen more in nesting their own homes > > than the society. The unaccounted cash transactions, > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, wherever the > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their rules on > > society are all the reasons along with political > > appeasements and false promises and gestures of patronising > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim wondering where he > > belonged to. ! > > > >    The subsequent generations of muslims, particularly > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding more say in the > > governance along with dalits and other suppressed and > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for breeding of > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing the issues used > > their friday prayers only to arouse the passions on some > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined dangers from > > "communal  "  parties totally loosing sight of > > communalism played by so called secular parties.! > > > >    In the entire process, the muslim youth who is found > > wanting a job is easy prey for those elements in society who > > do not risk themselves of being seen as terorists, use the > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > >  Only solution to terror is handle the elements who > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, terrorise them > > and democratic rule of laws should handle the deviant > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or favour of vote > > banks. > > > >  regards. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "S.Fatima" > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > > fighting terrorism > > To: sarai > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the Ahmedabad blasts > > is just the > > > tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT SAHI exposes > > the random > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)> > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > decades, Maulana > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to speak to > > the faithful > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the soft-spoken, > > revered aalim, > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of Muslims in > > the hour- > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one of > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > localities where the preacher and many in his > > congregation live. > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a Muslim’s duty > > towards his > > > neighbours.“You cannot fill your stomach if your > > neighbour is > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried tone. “You > > cannot > > > discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim > > neighbours.” > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of the serial > > blasts that > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, policemen > > stormed > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque and > > dragged him away as > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, as a local > > magistrate > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for two weeks, > > police claimed > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday blasts and > > that grilling > > > him would unravel the execution of and the conspiracy > > behind the > > > terror act. > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, > > justifiably, wants > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge then is > > not to reach > > > for the quick routes, the easy demonisations. > > Unfortunately, the > > > Indian State has not quite met that challenge. Over > > the years, for > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread acronym for most > > Indians — > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a hotbed of > > terrorism, a > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent on destroying > > the nation. > > > Quick on the back of every horrific blast, that name > > is thrust > > > upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo — > > stretching outwards > > > to embrace the entire community. But how true are > > these allegations? > > > In the struggle for a just and safe society, it is > > crucial to find > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; crucial to > > cleave doggedly > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of law; crucial not > > to fall prey > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit of this, > > in an > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA conducted > > an > > > investigation across India over three months and 12 > > cities. > > > Serialised here, starting this week, the disturbing > > investigation > > > found that an overwhelming majority of terrorism cases > > — > > > especially those related to the outlawed SIMI — are > > based on > > > either non-existent or fraudulent evidence and are an > > affront to > > > both law and common sense. > > > The investigation found that entrenched prejudices in > > the > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject lack of > > political will > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news media that > > demands > > > instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly > > copy-pastes every > > > unproven police and intelligence story on terrorist > > networks has > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of hundreds of > > people falsely > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these are Muslim; > > nearly all > > > of these are poor. > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I am confident we > > will be able > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister Manmohan > > Singh said as he > > > walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s civil > > hospital, where > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst casualties. He > > urged political > > > parties and police and intelligence agencies to work > > together > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying our social > > fabric, > > > undermining communal harmony.” Unfortunately, given > > their > > > staggering record of false cases against innocent > > people, it > > > appears that incompetent police and intelligence > > agencies are > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled below, is a > > searing > > > example why. > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the stenographic > > news media, > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI member > > linked with > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. Gujarat > > government’s > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that Haleem sent > > Muslim youth > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as terrorists > > to avenge > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the state. He > > said they > > > planned, among others, to assassinate BJP leader LK > > Advani and > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police have said > > Haleem was > > > absconding since he was named an accused in this case > > in 2002. > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad following the > > cleric’s arrest > > > has thrown up strong evidence, documentary and > > circumstantial, > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has lived at his > > house — which is > > > less than a km from the local police station — for > > years and led a > > > public life within his community. The charge against > > him that he > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is highly dubious > > based as it > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose contents > > don’t remotely > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And until Saturday’s > > bomb blasts, > > > Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a SIMI > > member. > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and followers say > > police have > > > harassed him for years for his role in helping victims > > of the 2002 > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, an > > inspector from the > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage handwritten > > notice in > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz Ahle-Hadis > > [the Islamic > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers belong] Trust > > has been > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping Centre. > > You are its > > > head… Many members have been appointed in it. You > > are directed to > > > submit a list of their names, addresses and phone > > numbers.” > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such a demand on a > > trust > > > constituted as per law with no criminal charge against > > it, the > > > letter proves the police knew Haleem’s whereabouts > > and were in > > > touch with him as late as two months ago. Indeed, the > > notice > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi Park > > Society, near > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has proof that > > the police > > > received his reply the next day. > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed telegrams to > > Gujarat’s > > > director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s police > > commissioner > > > claiming that the police forcibly entered his house > > that day and > > > harassed his wife and children in his absence. “We > > are peace- > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and have never been > > part of any > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the telegram in > > Hindi. “The police > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my family without > > appropriate > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil rights.” > > Predictably, he > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > In April, when a local outfit called Social Unity > > & Peace Forum, > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as its members, > > organised a > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the police > > seeking permission > > > to use loudspeakers. That application clearly > > mentioned that > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the event. > > Haleem’s family > > > also offers his driving licence, renewed by the > > Ahmedabad > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, as proof that > > he led a > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, in July 2005, > > the Gujarati > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published Haleem’s > > picture with a > > > statement he released at a press conference giving his > > views on a > > > raging controversy over the alleged rape of a woman, > > Imrana, by > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar Pradesh. > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has appealed to the > > Gujarat > > > governor to secure the cleric’s release. Adds Nazir, > > in whose > > > house Haleem has lived with his family as tenant: “I > > have known > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of religion and has > > never > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s wife Noor > > Saba: “I swear by > > > my children that my husband is not a terrorist. He is > > being framed.” > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the > > cleric’s > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped hundreds > > in their daily > > > lives by imparting them the skills of patience and > > fortitude,” > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old embroiderer. > > Haq fishes > > > out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama the > > Maulana signed > > > after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to show that > > Haleem > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered a sermon > > to the guests > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that Haq had > > installed — with > > > police permission. > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, hails from > > Uttar Pradesh > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is a preacher > > with a > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis that began > > on the > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has survived a > > frowning Sunni > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the Hadis — > > the oral > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — as a > > guiding principle for > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news media have > > long > > > parroted the police’s insinuation that Ahle-Hadis is > > a terrorist > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The police claim > > its members > > > include many terror accused such as those of the July > > 2006 Mumbai > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed membership of > > 30 million in > > > India, denies the charge. It points out that Union > > Home Minister > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its national > > symposium two > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle Hadis > > followers for 14 > > > years, resigning three years ago to minister a small > > mosque so he > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a regular > > income to > > > feed his wife and seven children, the oldest two of > > whom study at > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the 2002 > > anti-Muslim > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved himself in relief > > work at the > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. An > > Ahmedabad native > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and was > > visiting his > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two other Muslims. One > > of them was > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also lived in > > Kuwait. The > > > other was a small-time trader from Moradabad. The > > three wanted to > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 violence > > by bringing > > > them free education and care, so Haleem took them to > > four refugee > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded saying it had > > found 34 > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned the Kuwait > > expatriate, who > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him about the > > offer. But > > > getting no response, the plan died and, importantly, > > no children > > > were ever sent. > > > Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi Police > > arrested Shahid > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait allegedly > > with 4.5 kg > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The Moradabad trader > > was also > > > arrested from his hometown. All three were charged > > under the > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring to carry > > out terrorist > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter (about the > > camp’s offer > > > of the orphan children) with the expatriate from > > Kuwait. As both > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, police there > > were informed. > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG Vanzara > > called in Haleem > > > and detained him — illegally — for five days. > > (Vanzara is now in > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as a > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > family frantically filed a petition with the Gujarat > > High Court to > > > secure his release. “The judge ordered the police to > > bring Haleem > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls the > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The police > > instantly released > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where his statement on > > his illegal > > > detention was duly recorded and is part of official > > documents. > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX case’ > > against the two > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the Moradabad > > trader, police > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against the same > > individuals > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as terrorists in > > Moradabad”. > > > This is the case the police and the media have > > referred since > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb blasts to argue > > that the > > > cleric was involved in “sending Muslim youth to > > train as > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer was > > openly lying on > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that Haleem had > > sent “30 youth” > > > to Moradabad for training as terrorists. The > > charge-sheet in the > > > case clearly admits that the so-called conspiracy had > > remained on > > > paper and no children ever travelled from Ahmedabad to > > Moradabad. > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem a witness, > > Ahmedabad’s > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him an accused and > > said he was > > > absconding. The law says the police have to follow due > > legal > > > process before declaring an accused as absconding. > > This includes > > > searches at his house and workplace in view of > > independent > > > witnesses, and recording statements from neighbours to > > establish > > > that the accused has not been seen for a long time. > > The Ahmedabad > > > police did not bother with this exercise. > > > The entire case against Haleem is based on a letter he > > wrote to > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad Ali. Dated > > August 7, > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to terrorist > > training or any > > > other unlawful activity. It simply said: “You had > > come [to > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ (important > > goal).” With a giant > > > leap of imagination, thepolice claim that the words > > “ahem maqsad” > > > can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist training. > > Haleem wrote > > > that six of the children were orphans and the rest > > poor. He > > > concluded the letter saying: “I believe that by > > god’s grace you > > > will certainly help me in this educational and > > constructive > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his deposition > > before a Delhi > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he was told > > the children will > > > get “a good education and decent living” in > > Moradabad, and had no > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train the > > children as > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge hearing the > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait, > > Farhan Ahmad > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven years in jail. > > The court > > > accepted the police version even though the only > > witnesses to the > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. Ahmad Ali had > > claimed that > > > he was arrested at the airport as he was to board a > > flight to > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. The judge > > ignored that. > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the Delhi High > > Court against > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible twister: while > > they got > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite being convicted > > by the > > > lower court, they were denied bail by the Gujarat High > > Court in > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ although no guilt > > has yet been > > > established in that case and the Gujarat crime branch > > admits their > > > crime never went beyond hatching the alleged > > conspiracy. That’s > > > not all. > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old man named > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. He proved > > doubly lucky > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail in the > > ‘terrorist > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its eye-opening bail > > order, the > > > judge said: “… All that remains against the > > present applicant > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had visited > > camps to > > > identify the children so that they can be better > > looked after. > > > That by itself cannot be considered an offence.” > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of exactly the > > same crime, > > > the argument should be valid for them, too. Yet, > > another Gujarat > > > High Court judge denied them bail and both continue to > > languish in > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to Ahmedabad because > > the Gujarat > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must report to > > the Crime > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On Sunday, > > July 27, the > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the crime > > branch office > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me four hours on the > > blasts,” > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they let me > > go.” > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist training case’ is > > nearly over. It is > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be called against > > Haleem, > > > since he is no more “absconding”. Meanwhile, > > Haleem’s family is > > > worried stiff over the next meal and the next > > month’s house rent > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no savings. > > His lone > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is anything but > > rare. One > > > glaring case concerns a “family of terrorists”. On > > July 15, a > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old Mohammad > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > as he returned home at night from his father’s > > workshop in > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb blasts > > rocked > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, Hyderabad > > Police > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan Times > > newspaper that, > > > during interrogation, Yasir had confessed that before > > his arrest, > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to Karnataka and > > “arranged safe > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies the > > confession. “I > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told his > > mother, Tasleem > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on July 29. > > “The police > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son was tortured > > during what > > > the police commissioner calls “interrogation”. > > “He was hung upside > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > Apart from the fact that a confession made to the > > police is > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge (never mind > > that the news > > > media accept confessions as gospel), Yasir’s alleged > > confession, > > > if true, should be a slap on the face of the Hyderabad > > Police. > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose father and > > one brother > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. Yasir’s father, > > 56-yearold > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a wellrespected cleric > > who has now > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad for nearly > > four years > > > and has been denied bail all the way up to the Supreme > > Court. > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, is jailed > > in Karnataka’s > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested in January. > > > With his brother and father suspected as dreaded > > terrorists, the > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on Yasir all > > the time and > > > instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. That the > > police > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe houses” for > > terrorists in > > > Karnataka is because he probably never did any such > > thing. This > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a month before > > his arrest, > > > on his birthday on June 12, at an engineering workshop > > that his > > > father had set up three decades ago with borrowed > > money and skills > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside mechanic. In > > the din of > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in managing > > customers crowding > > > the small front office. “My father and brother have > > been framed,” > > > he forcefully toldTEHELKA. > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir seems a victim > > of patently > > > bogus cases against him. He was a member of SIMI when > > it was > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. (Given the > > relentless > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the reader might > > find it hard > > > to believe that no court in India has yet upheld the > > charge of > > > terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) Yasir > > echoed dozens > > > others interviewed by this reporter across India in > > saying that > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep religious training and > > self- > > > purification”, and not for acts of terrorism or > > anti-India > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of atrocities on > > Muslims from > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It never gave > > up the issue of > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of us.” > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the police > > arrested Yasir and > > > booked him with the other two SIMI representatives in > > Hyderabad > > > under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act. A > > magistrate gave > > > them bail the next day. A day later, the police > > slapped another > > > case against the three, alleging that one of them was > > arrested > > > making a speech against the government. The other two, > > including > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went back to the > > court and > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days before > > securing bail. > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to begin. > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a firebrand > > cleric who never > > > held his tongue in public speeches against the > > government, > > > especially on issues such as the Babri Masjid > > demolition and the > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. Embroiled in > > cooked-up > > > cases, in several of which he was subsequently > > acquitted, Maulana > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police to report > > at their > > > office regularly. > > > On one such day in October 2004, when Maulana > > Nasiruddin reached > > > the police station, he was arrested by a police team > > from > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a terror > > conspiracy in > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of former > > Gujarat Home > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence against > > Maulana > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a letter to > > the court, he > > > has denied making.) > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana to the > > police station > > > began protesting as he was led out. At this, Gujarat > > police > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his service revolver > > and shot dead > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. Nasiruddin’s > > supporters > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s body unless the > > police filed > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad police filed > > two cases > > > back to back: One, their own, against the protestors > > for blocking > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under pressure, > > against > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch in four > > years. The > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized his revolver and > > sent it for > > > a forensic examination, along with the bullet > > recovered from the > > > dead protestor’s body. They should have arrested and > > produced Amin > > > before a magistrate. This is an open-and-shut case if > > there ever > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide matching the > > bullet, and > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of this > > happened. Amin > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana Nasiruddin in his > > custody. The > > > FIR against him has become a dead letter. > > > Amin is the same police officer who was subsequently > > accused of > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat businessman > > Sohrabuddin who > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 (as > > mentioned above > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, too, is now > > in jail. > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main complainant > > against > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is none > > other than 20- > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s youngest son > > and Yasir’s > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this year, Nasir was > > arrested by > > > police in Karnataka with another person and was > > accused of > > > stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly riding. > > Claiming a > > > knife was found on the two, the police slapped charges > > such as > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and his > > co-accused. > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven confessions from the > > two accused > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed them saying they > > were SIMI > > > members. Police then filed their eighth confessions in > > which they > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members and the > > attendant terror > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the police failed to > > file a > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the > > magistrate’s house who > > > then had no option but to grant bail as per law. But > > by this time, > > > the police had implicated Nasir in another case of > > conspiracy, so > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has retracted > > his > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has little hope > > against > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two accused to > > police > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the following > > in an interview: > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary papers > > remanding them to > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other accused] > > stepped forward > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me that the > > police denied > > > them food and water and subjected them to repeated > > beatings. He > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on Nasir’s body. > > The two > > > repeatedly made a reference to human rights violation > > by the > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > “I was very surprised by three things: they were > > talking of their > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative manner, they > > spoke English > > > and, further, they readily admitted that they had > > stolen the bike, > > > something most thieves never do in my experience.” > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the magistrate > > “warning” that > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial custody, > > the magistrate > > > asked the evidence to be brought to this house. “The > > materials > > > produced before me included duplicate identity cards, > > a fancy > > > dagger, a map of South India with red marks against > > Udupi and Goa, > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper with www.com > > written on > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on another. > > > “When I looked at these materials in their entirety, > > I felt that > > > these were definitely not just bike thieves. Why would > > bike > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity cards and a > > map of South > > > India? The fact that they had an American dollar > > seemed to suggest > > > they had international links. The paper with www.com > > indicated to > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other piece of paper > > had a > > > message that seemed to be a sort of code that I could > > not > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I examined the South > > India map, > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a red marker > > against it. > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at the place > > during a > > > religious function. > > > “All these suggested that there were definitely > > enough grounds in > > > my opinion to grant the police custody of Nasir and > > Asadullah to > > > facilitate further investigations.” Go figure. > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, Muqeemuddin > > Yasir, Maulana > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ mother > > doesn’t think so. > > > “Why don’t the police put us all together in > > jail,” she told > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. “Then they can > > shoot all of > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > >      Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, > > on > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > list > > > List archive: > > > > >      Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading messenger. Go > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Sun Aug 10 14:54:56 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 14:54:56 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <986748.49245.qm@web8407.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Radhika I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the mainstream media. They keep inventing new terms everyday. So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely more than defending. That's planned genocide of a community. Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > Cc: "sarai" > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > Dear Sadia, > > your query looks absurd on the face of it because > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 years, > always tolerent of the invaders be it the moghuls or later > christian missionaries converting to increase the numerical > strength of the "community. > > Muslims demanded a land and nation for themselves, a > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, but > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , free > india, secular nation, not a hindu nation, showcasing the > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to blame > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their promise when > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to stay > back. > > Next, as a community, why muslims are not identifying the > "fasaadis" in their community who are terming > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in to > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not tolerate, > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try to > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of islam, > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let the > muslim community take steps to identify the terrorsists or > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of rule > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > > In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" lawyers > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no way > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > jihaadi by default.! > > regards. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "S.Fatima" > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > fighting terrorism > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Cc: sarai > > > Dear Radhika > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father of > the nation, mahatma > > that they will stay back in India as brothers with > their hindu > > community" > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath to > live as > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others as > well? > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > wrote: > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > the name of > > fighting terrorism > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all those > terrorists who > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are muslims. > > > > > > When the community of muslims forgot their > solemn oath > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they will > stay back in > > > India as brothers with their hindu community, > many were > > > sceptical, for one, as the population increases > the muslim > > > community along with other segments of sovciety > also did > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks to > the politics > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > linguistic , > > > caste and faith segments, the national exchequer > never > > > reached the grass root level of the populace and > citizens in > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > governance > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > > The muslim community in general had lower > percentage of > > > educated men and women, who instead of having > concern for > > > their community, is seen more in nesting their > own homes > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > transactions, > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > wherever the > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > rules on > > > society are all the reasons along with political > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures of > patronising > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > wondering where he > > > belonged to. ! > > > > > > The subsequent generations of muslims, > particularly > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding more > say in the > > > governance along with dalits and other suppressed > and > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > breeding of > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing the > issues used > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the passions > on some > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > dangers from > > > "communal " parties totally loosing > sight of > > > communalism played by so called secular parties.! > > > > > > In the entire process, the muslim youth who is > found > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those elements in > society who > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > terorists, use the > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > > Only solution to terror is handle the elements > who > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > terrorise them > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle the > deviant > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or favour > of vote > > > banks. > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > name of > > > fighting terrorism > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the > Ahmedabad blasts > > > is just the > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT > SAHI exposes > > > the random > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)> > > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > decades, Maulana > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to > speak to > > > the faithful > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > soft-spoken, > > > revered aalim, > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of > Muslims in > > > the hour- > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one > of > > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > > localities where the preacher and many in > his > > > congregation live. > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > Muslim’s duty > > > towards his > > > > neighbours. “You cannot fill your stomach > if your > > > neighbour is > > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried > tone. “You > > > cannot > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim > > > neighbours.” > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of the > serial > > > blasts that > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, > policemen > > > stormed > > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque > and > > > dragged him away as > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, > as a local > > > magistrate > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for two > weeks, > > > police claimed > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday > blasts and > > > that grilling > > > > him would unravel the execution of and the > conspiracy > > > behind the > > > > terror act. > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, > > > justifiably, wants > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge > then is > > > not to reach > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > demonisations. > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > challenge. Over > > > the years, for > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > acronym for most > > > Indians — > > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a > hotbed of > > > terrorism, a > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent on > destroying > > > the nation. > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific blast, > that name > > > is thrust > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo > — > > > stretching outwards > > > > to embrace the entire community. But how > true are > > > these allegations? > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe society, > it is > > > crucial to find > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > crucial to > > > cleave doggedly > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of law; > crucial not > > > to fall prey > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit > of this, > > > in an > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA > conducted > > > an > > > > investigation across India over three months > and 12 > > > cities. > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, the > disturbing > > > investigation > > > > found that an overwhelming majority of > terrorism cases > > > — > > > > especially those related to the outlawed > SIMI — are > > > based on > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent evidence > and are an > > > affront to > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > prejudices in > > > the > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject lack > of > > > political will > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news > media that > > > demands > > > > instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly > > > copy-pastes every > > > > unproven police and intelligence story on > terrorist > > > networks has > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > hundreds of > > > people falsely > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these > are Muslim; > > > nearly all > > > > of these are poor. > > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I am > confident we > > > will be able > > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister > Manmohan > > > Singh said as he > > > > walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s > civil > > > hospital, where > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > casualties. He > > > urged political > > > > parties and police and intelligence agencies > to work > > > together > > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying our > social > > > fabric, > > > > undermining communal harmony.” > Unfortunately, given > > > their > > > > staggering record of false cases against > innocent > > > people, it > > > > appears that incompetent police and > intelligence > > > agencies are > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled > below, is a > > > searing > > > > example why. > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the > stenographic > > > news media, > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI > member > > > linked with > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. > Gujarat > > > government’s > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > Haleem sent > > > Muslim youth > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as > terrorists > > > to avenge > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the > state. He > > > said they > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate BJP > leader LK > > > Advani and > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police > have said > > > Haleem was > > > > absconding since he was named an accused in > this case > > > in 2002. > > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad > following the > > > cleric’s arrest > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, documentary > and > > > circumstantial, > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has lived > at his > > > house — which is > > > > less than a km from the local police station > — for > > > years and led a > > > > public life within his community. The charge > against > > > him that he > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > highly dubious > > > based as it > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > contents > > > don’t remotely > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And until > Saturday’s > > > bomb blasts, > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a > SIMI > > > member. > > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and followers > say > > > police have > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > helping victims > > > of the 2002 > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, > an > > > inspector from the > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > handwritten > > > notice in > > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz > Ahle-Hadis > > > [the Islamic > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > belong] Trust > > > has been > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping > Centre. > > > You are its > > > > head… Many members have been appointed in > it. You > > > are directed to > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses and > phone > > > numbers.” > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such a > demand on a > > > trust > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > charge against > > > it, the > > > > letter proves the police knew Haleem’s > whereabouts > > > and were in > > > > touch with him as late as two months ago. > Indeed, the > > > notice > > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi > Park > > > Society, near > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has > proof that > > > the police > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed > telegrams to > > > Gujarat’s > > > > director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s > police > > > commissioner > > > > claiming that the police forcibly entered > his house > > > that day and > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > absence. “We > > > are peace- > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and have > never been > > > part of any > > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the > telegram in > > > Hindi. “The police > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my family > without > > > appropriate > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > rights.” > > > Predictably, he > > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > > In April, when a local outfit called Social > Unity > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as its > members, > > > organised a > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the > police > > > seeking permission > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > clearly > > > mentioned that > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > event. > > > Haleem’s family > > > > also offers his driving licence, renewed by > the > > > Ahmedabad > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, as > proof that > > > he led a > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, in > July 2005, > > > the Gujarati > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > Haleem’s > > > picture with a > > > > statement he released at a press conference > giving his > > > views on a > > > > raging controversy over the alleged rape of > a woman, > > > Imrana, by > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > Pradesh. > > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana > > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > appealed to the > > > Gujarat > > > > governor to secure the cleric’s release. > Adds Nazir, > > > in whose > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family as > tenant: “I > > > have known > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > religion and has > > > never > > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s > wife Noor > > > Saba: “I swear by > > > > my children that my husband is not a > terrorist. He is > > > being framed.” > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the > > > cleric’s > > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped > hundreds > > > in their daily > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > patience and > > > fortitude,” > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old > embroiderer. > > > Haq fishes > > > > out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama > the > > > Maulana signed > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to > show that > > > Haleem > > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered > a sermon > > > to the guests > > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that > Haq had > > > installed — with > > > > police permission. > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > hails from > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is > a preacher > > > with a > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis > that began > > > on the > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > survived a > > > frowning Sunni > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the > Hadis — > > > the oral > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — > as a > > > guiding principle for > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news > media have > > > long > > > > parroted the police’s insinuation that > Ahle-Hadis is > > > a terrorist > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The > police claim > > > its members > > > > include many terror accused such as those of > the July > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > membership of > > > 30 million in > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out that > Union > > > Home Minister > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its > national > > > symposium two > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle > Hadis > > > followers for 14 > > > > years, resigning three years ago to minister > a small > > > mosque so he > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a > regular > > > income to > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the oldest > two of > > > whom study at > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the > 2002 > > > anti-Muslim > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved himself > in relief > > > work at the > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. > An > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and > was > > > visiting his > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two other > Muslims. One > > > of them was > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also > lived in > > > Kuwait. The > > > > other was a small-time trader from > Moradabad. The > > > three wanted to > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 > violence > > > by bringing > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem took > them to > > > four refugee > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > saying it had > > > found 34 > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned the > Kuwait > > > expatriate, who > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him > about the > > > offer. But > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > importantly, > > > no children > > > > were ever sent. > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi > Police > > > arrested Shahid > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait > allegedly > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > Moradabad trader > > > was also > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three were > charged > > > under the > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring > to carry > > > out terrorist > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter > (about the > > > camp’s offer > > > > of the orphan children) with the expatriate > from > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > police there > > > were informed. > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG > Vanzara > > > called in Haleem > > > > and detained him — illegally — for five > days. > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as > a > > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > > family frantically filed a petition with the > Gujarat > > > High Court to > > > > secure his release. “The judge ordered the > police to > > > bring Haleem > > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls the > > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > police > > > instantly released > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where his > statement on > > > his illegal > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part of > official > > > documents. > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX > case’ > > > against the two > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the > Moradabad > > > trader, police > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against > the same > > > individuals > > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as > terrorists in > > > Moradabad”. > > > > This is the case the police and the media > have > > > referred since > > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb > blasts to argue > > > that the > > > > cleric was involved in “sending Muslim > youth to > > > train as > > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer > was > > > openly lying on > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > Haleem had > > > sent “30 youth” > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. The > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > conspiracy had > > > remained on > > > > paper and no children ever travelled from > Ahmedabad to > > > Moradabad. > > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem > a witness, > > > Ahmedabad’s > > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him an > accused and > > > said he was > > > > absconding. The law says the police have to > follow due > > > legal > > > > process before declaring an accused as > absconding. > > > This includes > > > > searches at his house and workplace in view > of > > > independent > > > > witnesses, and recording statements from > neighbours to > > > establish > > > > that the accused has not been seen for a > long time. > > > The Ahmedabad > > > > police did not bother with this exercise. > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based on a > letter he > > > wrote to > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad > Ali. Dated > > > August 7, > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > terrorist > > > training or any > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply said: > “You had > > > come [to > > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ > (important > > > goal).” With a giant > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim that > the words > > > “ahem maqsad” > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist > training. > > > Haleem wrote > > > > that six of the children were orphans and > the rest > > > poor. He > > > > concluded the letter saying: “I believe > that by > > > god’s grace you > > > > will certainly help me in this educational > and > > > constructive > > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his > deposition > > > before a Delhi > > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he > was told > > > the children will > > > > get “a good education and decent living” > in > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train > the > > > children as > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > hearing the > > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from > Kuwait, > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > years in jail. > > > The court > > > > accepted the police version even though the > only > > > witnesses to the > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > Ahmad Ali had > > > claimed that > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he was to > board a > > > flight to > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. > The judge > > > ignored that. > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the > Delhi High > > > Court against > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > twister: while > > > they got > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite being > convicted > > > by the > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by the > Gujarat High > > > Court in > > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ although > no guilt > > > has yet been > > > > established in that case and the Gujarat > crime branch > > > admits their > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the alleged > > > conspiracy. That’s > > > > not all. > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old > man named > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. > He proved > > > doubly lucky > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail > in the > > > ‘terrorist > > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its > eye-opening bail > > > order, the > > > > judge said: “… All that remains against > the > > > present applicant > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had > visited > > > camps to > > > > identify the children so that they can be > better > > > looked after. > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > offence.” > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of > exactly the > > > same crime, > > > > the argument should be valid for them, too. > Yet, > > > another Gujarat > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and both > continue to > > > languish in > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > Ahmedabad because > > > the Gujarat > > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must > report to > > > the Crime > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On > Sunday, > > > July 27, the > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the > crime > > > branch office > > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me four > hours on the > > > blasts,” > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they > let me > > > go.” > > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist training > case’ is > > > nearly over. It is > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > called against > > > Haleem, > > > > since he is no more “absconding”. > Meanwhile, > > > Haleem’s family is > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and the > next > > > month’s house rent > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no > savings. > > > His lone > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run > > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is > anything but > > > rare. One > > > > glaring case concerns a “family of > terrorists”. On > > > July 15, a > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > Mohammad > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > as he returned home at night from his > father’s > > > workshop in > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb > blasts > > > rocked > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, > Hyderabad > > > Police > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan > Times > > > newspaper that, > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had confessed > that before > > > his arrest, > > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to > Karnataka and > > > “arranged safe > > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies > the > > > confession. “I > > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told > his > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on > July 29. > > > “The police > > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son > was tortured > > > during what > > > > the police commissioner calls > “interrogation”. > > > “He was hung upside > > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession made > to the > > > police is > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > (never mind > > > that the news > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > Yasir’s alleged > > > confession, > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face of the > Hyderabad > > > Police. > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose > father and > > > one brother > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > Yasir’s father, > > > 56-yearold > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > wellrespected cleric > > > who has now > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad > for nearly > > > four years > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up to > the Supreme > > > Court. > > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, > is jailed > > > in Karnataka’s > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested in > January. > > > > With his brother and father suspected as > dreaded > > > terrorists, the > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on > Yasir all > > > the time and > > > > instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. > That the > > > police > > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe > houses” for > > > terrorists in > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never did > any such > > > thing. This > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a > month before > > > his arrest, >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > engineering workshop > > > that his > > > > father had set up three decades ago with > borrowed > > > money and skills > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > mechanic. In > > > the din of > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > managing > > > customers crowding > > > > the small front office. “My father and > brother have > > > been framed,” > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > seems a victim > > > of patently > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a member of > SIMI when > > > it was > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. > (Given the > > > relentless > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > reader might > > > find it hard > > > > to believe that no court in India has yet > upheld the > > > charge of > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) > Yasir > > > echoed dozens > > > > others interviewed by this reporter across > India in > > > saying that > > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep religious > training and > > > self- > > > > purification”, and not for acts of > terrorism or > > > anti-India > > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of > atrocities on > > > Muslims from > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It > never gave > > > up the issue of > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of > us.” > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the > police > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > representatives in > > > Hyderabad > > > > under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) > Act. A > > > magistrate gave > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, the > police > > > slapped another > > > > case against the three, alleging that one of > them was > > > arrested > > > > making a speech against the government. The > other two, > > > including > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went > back to the > > > court and > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days > before > > > securing bail. > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to > begin. > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a > firebrand > > > cleric who never > > > > held his tongue in public speeches against > the > > > government, > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > Masjid > > > demolition and the > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > Embroiled in > > > cooked-up > > > > cases, in several of which he was > subsequently > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police > to report > > > at their > > > > office regularly. > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > Maulana > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > the police station, he was arrested by a > police team > > > from > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a > terror > > > conspiracy in > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of > former > > > Gujarat Home > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence > against > > > Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a > letter to > > > the court, he > > > > has denied making.) > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana > to the > > > police station > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At this, > Gujarat > > > police > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his service > revolver > > > and shot dead > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > Nasiruddin’s > > > supporters > > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s body > unless the > > > police filed > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > police filed > > > two cases > > > > back to back: One, their own, against the > protestors > > > for blocking > > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under > pressure, > > > against > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. > > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch > in four > > > years. The > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized his > revolver and > > > sent it for > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > bullet > > > recovered from the > > > > dead protestor’s body. They should have > arrested and > > > produced Amin > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > open-and-shut case if > > > there ever > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > matching the > > > bullet, and > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of > this > > > happened. Amin > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > Nasiruddin in his > > > custody. The > > > > FIR against him has become a dead letter. > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > subsequently > > > accused of > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > businessman > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 > (as > > > mentioned above > > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, > too, is now > > > in jail. > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main > complainant > > > against > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is > none > > > other than 20- > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s > youngest son > > > and Yasir’s > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this year, > Nasir was > > > arrested by > > > > police in Karnataka with another person and > was > > > accused of > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly > riding. > > > Claiming a > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > slapped charges > > > such as > > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and > his > > > co-accused. > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > confessions from the > > > two accused > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed them > saying they > > > were SIMI > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > confessions in > > > which they > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members and > the > > > attendant terror > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the police > failed to > > > file a > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the > > > magistrate’s house who > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as per > law. But > > > by this time, > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in another > case of > > > conspiracy, so > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has > retracted > > > his > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has > little hope > > > against > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two > accused to > > > police > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the > following > > > in an interview: > > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary > papers > > > remanding them to > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > accused] > > > stepped forward > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me that > the > > > police denied > > > > them food and water and subjected them to > repeated > > > beatings. He > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > Nasir’s body. > > > The two > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human rights > violation > > > by the > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > “I was very surprised by three things: > they were > > > talking of their > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > manner, they > > > spoke English > > > > and, further, they readily admitted that > they had > > > stolen the bike, > > > > something most thieves never do in my > experience.” > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > magistrate > > > “warning” that > > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial > custody, > > > the magistrate > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to this > house. “The > > > materials > > > > produced before me included duplicate > identity cards, > > > a fancy > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red marks > against > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper with > www.com > > > written on > > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on > another. > > > > “When I looked at these materials in their > entirety, > > > I felt that > > > > these were definitely not just bike thieves. > Why would > > > bike > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > cards and a > > > map of South > > > > India? The fact that they had an American > dollar > > > seemed to suggest > > > > they had international links. The paper with > www.com > > > indicated to > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > piece of paper > > > had a > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of code > that I could > > > not > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I examined > the South > > > India map, > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a red > marker > > > against it. > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at the > place > > > during a > > > > religious function. > > > > “All these suggested that there were > definitely > > > enough grounds in > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody of > Nasir and > > > Asadullah to > > > > facilitate further investigations.” Go > figure. > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > Muqeemuddin > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ > mother > > > doesn’t think so. > > > > “Why don’t the police put us all > together in > > > jail,” she told > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > “Then they can > > > shoot all of > > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. > Get it now, > > > on > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the > > > city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > messenger. Go > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 10 15:07:52 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 02:37:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... Message-ID: <651051.87288.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If India as a country is so bad why do we choose to live here at all? We don't deserve to be called Indians if we are not proud of our nation.We should try to make improvemet rather than codemning our own motherland.Freedom of expression does not mean that one can insult our nation like this.Such outrageous comments should not be allowed.The moderator of the forum needs to explain this now. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: S.Fatima To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net Cc: sarai Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 2:24:56 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... Dear Radhika I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the mainstream media. They keep inventing new terms everyday. So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely more than defending. That's planned genocide of a community. Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of fighting terrorism > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > Cc: "sarai" > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > Dear Sadia, > >    your query looks absurd on the face of it because > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 years, > always tolerent of the invaders be it  the moghuls or later > christian missionaries converting to increase the numerical > strength of the "community. > >    Muslims demanded a land and nation for themselves, a > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, but > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , free > india,  secular nation, not a hindu nation, showcasing the > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to blame > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their promise when > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to stay > back. > >  Next, as a community, why muslims are not identifying the > "fasaadis" in their community who are terming > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in to > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not tolerate, > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try to > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of islam, > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let the > muslim community take steps to identify the terrorsists or > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of rule > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > >  In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" lawyers > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no way > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > jihaadi by default.! > >  regards. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "S.Fatima" > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > fighting    terrorism > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Cc: sarai > > > Dear Radhika > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father of > the nation, mahatma > > that they will stay back in India as brothers with > their hindu > > community" > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath to > live as > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others as > well? > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > wrote: > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > the name of > > fighting terrorism > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all those > terrorists who > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are muslims. > > > > > >      When the community of muslims forgot their > solemn oath > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they will > stay back in > > > India as brothers with their hindu community, > many were > > > sceptical, for one, as the population increases > the muslim > > > community  along with other segments of sovciety > also did > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks to > the politics > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > linguistic , > > > caste and faith segments, the national exchequer > never > > > reached the grass root level of the populace and > citizens in > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > governance > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > >    The muslim community in general had lower > percentage of > > > educated men and women, who instead of having > concern for > > > their community, is seen more in nesting their > own homes > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > transactions, > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > wherever the > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > rules on > > > society are all the reasons along with political > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures of > patronising > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > wondering where he > > >belonged to. ! > > > > > >    The subsequent generations of muslims, > particularly > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding more > say in the > > > governance along with dalits and other suppressed > and > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > breeding of > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing the > issues used > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the passions > on some > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > dangers from > > > "communal  "  parties totally loosing > sight of > > > communalism played by so called secular parties.! > > > > > >    In the entire process, the muslim youth who is > found > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those elements in > society who > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > terorists, use the > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > >  Only solution to terror is handle the elements > who > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > terrorise them > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle the > deviant > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or favour > of vote > > > banks. > > > > > >  regards. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > name of > > > fighting terrorism > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the > Ahmedabad blasts > > > is just the > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by AJIT > SAHI exposes > > > the random > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)> > > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > decades, Maulana > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and began to > speak to > > > the faithful > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > soft-spoken, > > > revered aalim, > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores of > Muslims in > > > the hour- > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque in one > of > > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > > localities where the preacher and many in > his > > > congregation live. > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > Muslim’s duty > > > towards his > > > > neighbours. “You cannot fill your stomach > if your > > > neighbour is > > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his unhurried > tone. “You > > > cannot > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and Muslim > > > neighbours.” > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of the > serial > > > blasts that > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on Saturday, > policemen > > > stormed > > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the mosque > and > > > dragged him away as > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On Monday, > as a local > > > magistrate > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for two > weeks, > > > police claimed > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the Saturday > blasts and > > > that grilling > > > > him would unravel the execution of and the > conspiracy > > > behind the > > > > terror act. > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, everybody, > > > justifiably, wants > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The challenge > then is > > > not to reach > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > demonisations. > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > challenge. Over > > > the years, for > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > acronym for most > > > Indians — > > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, a > hotbed of > > > terrorism, a > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent on > destroying > > > the nation. > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific blast, > that name > > > is thrust > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly innuendo > — > > > stretching outwards > > > > to embrace the entire community. But how > true are > > > these allegations? > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe society, > it is > > > crucial to find > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > crucial to > > > cleave doggedly > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of law; > crucial not > > > to fall prey > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In pursuit > of this, > > > in an > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, TEHELKA > conducted > > > an > > > > investigation across India over three months > and 12 > > > cities. > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, the > disturbing > > > investigation > > > > found that an overwhelming majority of > terrorism cases > > > — > > > > especially those related to the outlawed > SIMI — are > > > based on > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent evidence > and are an > > > affront to > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > prejudices in > > > the > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject lack > of > > > political will > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 news > media that > > > demands > > > > instant whodunit answers and unquestioningly > > > copy-pastes every > > > > unproven police and intelligence story on > terrorist > > > networks has > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > hundreds of > > > people falsely > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of these > are Muslim; > > > nearly all > > > > of these are poor. > > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I am > confident we > > > will be able > > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime Minister > Manmohan > > > Singh said as he > > > > walked about in the debris at Ahmedabad’s > civil > > > hospital, where > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > casualties. He > > > urged political > > > > parties and police and intelligence agencies > to work > > > together > > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying our > social > > > fabric, > > > > undermining communal harmony.” > Unfortunately, given > > > their > > > > staggering record of false cases against > innocent > > > people, it > > > > appears that incompetent police and > intelligence > > > agencies are > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, chronicled > below, is a > > > searing > > > > example why. > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in the > stenographic > > > news media, > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a SIMI > member > > > linked with > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased terrorists. > Gujarat > > > government’s > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > Haleem sent > > > Muslim youth > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to train as > terrorists > > > to avenge > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in the > state. He > > > said they > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate BJP > leader LK > > > Advani and > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. Police > have said > > > Haleem was > > > > absconding since he was named an accused in > this case > > > in 2002. > > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad > following the > > > cleric’s arrest > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, documentary > and > > > circumstantial, > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has lived > at his > > > house — which is > > > > less than a km from the local police station > — for > > > years and led a > > > > public life within his community. The charge > against > > > him that he > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > highly dubious > > > based as it > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > contents > > > don’t remotely > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And until > Saturday’s > > > bomb blasts, > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called Haleem a > SIMI > > > member. > > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and followers > say > > > police have > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > helping victims > > > of the 2002 > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May 27, > an > > > inspector from the > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > handwritten > > > notice in > > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of Markaz > Ahle-Hadis > > > [the Islamic > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > belong] Trust > > > has been > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan Shopping > Centre. > > > You are its > > > > head… Many members have been appointed in > it. You > > > are directed to > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses and > phone > > > numbers.” > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such a > demand on a > > > trust > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > charge against > > > it, the > > > > letter proves the police knew Haleem’s > whereabouts > > > and were in > > > > touch with him as late as two months ago. > Indeed, the > > > notice > > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, Devi > Park > > > Society, near > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family has > proof that > > > the police > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem rushed > telegrams to > > > Gujarat’s > > > > director-general of police and Ahmedabad’s > police > > > commissioner > > > > claiming that the police forcibly entered > his house > > > that day and > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > absence. “We > > > are peace- > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and have > never been > > > part of any > > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the > telegram in > > > Hindi. “The police > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my family > without > > > appropriate > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > rights.” > > > Predictably, he > > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > > In April, when a local outfit called Social > Unity > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as its > members, > > > organised a > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to the > police > > > seeking permission > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > clearly > > > mentioned that > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > event. > > > Haleem’s family > > > > also offers his driving licence, renewed by > the > > > Ahmedabad > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, as > proof that > > > he led a > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, in > July 2005, > > > the Gujarati > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > Haleem’s > > > picture with a > > > > statement he released at a press conference > giving his > > > views on a > > > > raging controversy over the alleged rape of > a woman, > > > Imrana, by > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > Pradesh. > > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove Maulana > > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > appealed to the > > > Gujarat > > > > governor to secure the cleric’s release. > Adds Nazir, > > > in whose > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family as > tenant: “I > > > have known > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > religion and has > > > never > > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says Haleem’s > wife Noor > > > Saba: “I swear by > > > > my children that my husband is not a > terrorist. He is > > > being framed.” > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable in the > > > cleric’s > > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has helped > hundreds > > > in their daily > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > patience and > > > fortitude,” > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a 27-year-old > embroiderer. > > > Haq fishes > > > > out his marriage certificate, the nikaahnama > the > > > Maulana signed > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June 1, to > show that > > > Haleem > > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had delivered > a sermon > > > to the guests > > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers that > Haq had > > > installed — with > > > > police permission. > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > hails from > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. He is > a preacher > > > with a > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle Hadis > that began > > > on the > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > survived a > > > frowning Sunni > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by the > Hadis — > > > the oral > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life — > as a > > > guiding principle for > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The news > media have > > > long > > > > parroted the police’s insinuation that > Ahle-Hadis is > > > a terrorist > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. The > police claim > > > its members > > > > include many terror accused such as those of > the July > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > membership of > > > 30 million in > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out that > Union > > > Home Minister > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at its > national > > > symposium two > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd Ahle > Hadis > > > followers for 14 > > > > years, resigning three years ago to minister > a small > > > mosque so he > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to earn a > regular > > > income to > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the oldest > two of > > > whom study at > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon after the > 2002 > > > anti-Muslim > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved himself > in relief > > > work at the > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim refugees. > An > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in Kuwait and > was > > > visiting his > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two other > Muslims. One > > > of them was > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who also > lived in > > > Kuwait. The > > > > other was a small-time trader from > Moradabad. The > > > three wanted to > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the 2002 > violence > > > by bringing > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem took > them to > > > four refugee > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > saying it had > > > found 34 > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned the > Kuwait > > > expatriate, who > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote to him > about the > > > offer. But > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > importantly, > > > no children > > > > were ever sent. > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, Delhi > Police > > > arrested Shahid > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from Kuwait > allegedly > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > Moradabad trader > > > was also > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three were > charged > > > under the > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for conspiring > to carry > > > out terrorist > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s letter > (about the > > > camp’s offer > > > > of the orphan children) with the expatriate > from > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > police there > > > were informed. > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer DG > Vanzara > > > called in Haleem > > > > and detained him — illegally — for five > days. > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat businessman > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him off as > a > > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > > family frantically filed a petition with the > Gujarat > > > High Court to > > > > secure his release. “The judge ordered the > police to > > > bring Haleem > > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls the > > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > police > > > instantly released > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where his > statement on > > > his illegal > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part of > official > > > documents. > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX > case’ > > > against the two > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and the > Moradabad > > > trader, police > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case against > the same > > > individuals > > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as > terrorists in > > > Moradabad”. > > > > This is the case the police and the media > have > > > referred since > > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb > blasts to argue > > > that the > > > > cleric was involved in “sending Muslim > youth to > > > train as > > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government lawyer > was > > > openly lying on > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > Haleem had > > > sent “30 youth” > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. The > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > conspiracy had > > > remained on > > > > paper and no children ever travelled from > Ahmedabad to > > > Moradabad. > > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named Haleem > a witness, > > > Ahmedabad’s > > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him an > accused and > > > said he was > > > > absconding. The law says the police have to > follow due > > > legal > > > > process before declaring an accused as > absconding. > > > This includes > > > > searches at his house and workplace in view > of > > > independent > > > > witnesses, and recording statements from > neighbours to > > > establish > > > > that the accused has not been seen for a > long time. > > > The Ahmedabad > > > > police did not bother with this exercise. > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based on a > letter he > > > wrote to > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan Ahmad > Ali. Dated > > > August 7, > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > terrorist > > > training or any > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply said: > “You had > > > come [to > > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ > (important > > > goal).” With a giant > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim that > the words > > > “ahem maqsad” > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for terrorist > training. > > > Haleem wrote > > > > that six of the children were orphans and > the rest > > > poor. He > > > > concluded the letter saying: “I believe > that by > > > god’s grace you > > > > will certainly help me in this educational > and > > > constructive > > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his > deposition > > > before a Delhi > > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem said he > was told > > > the children will > > > > get “a good education and decent living” > in > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to train > the > > > children as > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > hearing the > > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate from > Kuwait, > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > years in jail. > > > The court > > > > accepted the police version even though the > only > > > witnesses to the > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > Ahmad Ali had > > > claimed that > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he was to > board a > > > flight to > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as proof. > The judge > > > ignored that. > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at the > Delhi High > > > Court against > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > twister: while > > > they got > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite being > convicted > > > by the > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by the > Gujarat High > > > Court in > > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ although > no guilt > > > has yet been > > > > established in that case and the Gujarat > crime branch > > > admits their > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the alleged > > > conspiracy. That’s > > > > not all. > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail 56-year-old > man named > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX case’. > He proved > > > doubly lucky > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him bail > in the > > > ‘terrorist > > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its > eye-opening bail > > > order, the > > > > judge said: “… All that remains against > the > > > present applicant > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad and had > visited > > > camps to > > > > identify the children so that they can be > better > > > looked after. > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > offence.” > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused of > exactly the > > > same crime, > > > > the argument should be valid for them, too. > Yet, > > > another Gujarat > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and both > continue to > > > languish in > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > Ahmedabad because > > > the Gujarat > > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he must > report to > > > the Crime > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every Sunday. On > Sunday, > > > July 27, the > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited the > crime > > > branch office > > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me four > hours on the > > > blasts,” > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when they > let me > > > go.” > > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist training > case’ is > > > nearly over. It is > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > called against > > > Haleem, > > > > since he is no more “absconding”. > Meanwhile, > > > Haleem’s family is > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and the > next > > > month’s house rent > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she has no > savings. > > > His lone > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying to run > > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story is > anything but > > > rare. One > > > > glaring case concerns a “family of > terrorists”. On > > > July 15, a > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > Mohammad > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > as he returned home at night from his > father’s > > > workshop in > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial bomb > blasts > > > rocked > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two people, > Hyderabad > > > Police > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the Hindustan > Times > > > newspaper that, > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had confessed > that before > > > his arrest, > > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to > Karnataka and > > > “arranged safe > > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir denies > the > > > confession. “I > > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir told > his > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the jail on > July 29. > > > “The police > > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her son > was tortured > > > during what > > > > the police commissioner calls > “interrogation”. > > > “He was hung upside > > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession made > to the > > > police is > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > (never mind > > > that the news > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > Yasir’s alleged > > > confession, > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face of the > Hyderabad > > > Police. > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member whose > father and > > > one brother > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > Yasir’s father, > > > 56-yearold > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > wellrespected cleric > > > who has now > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in Ahmedabad > for nearly > > > four years > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up to > the Supreme > > > Court. > > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin Nasir, > is jailed > > > in Karnataka’s > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested in > January. > > > > With his brother and father suspected as > dreaded > > > terrorists, the > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs on > Yasir all > > > the time and > > > > instantly known if he was aiding terrorists. > That the > > > police > > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe > houses” for > > > terrorists in > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never did > any such > > > thing. This > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad a > month before > > > his arrest, >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > engineering workshop > > > that his > > > > father had set up three decades ago with > borrowed > > > money and skills > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > mechanic. In > > > the din of > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > managing > > > customers crowding > > > > the small front office. “My father and > brother have > > > been framed,” > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > seems a victim > > > of patently > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a member of > SIMI when > > > it was > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, 2001. > (Given the > > > relentless > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > reader might > > > find it hard > > > > to believe that no court in India has yet > upheld the > > > charge of > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an organisation.) > Yasir > > > echoed dozens > > > > others interviewed by this reporter across > India in > > > saying that > > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep religious > training and > > > self- > > > > purification”, and not for acts of > terrorism or > > > anti-India > > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of > atrocities on > > > Muslims from > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. “It > never gave > > > up the issue of > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted many of > us.” > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, the > police > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > representatives in > > > Hyderabad > > > > under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) > Act. A > > > magistrate gave > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, the > police > > > slapped another > > > > case against the three, alleging that one of > them was > > > arrested > > > > making a speech against the government. The > other two, > > > including > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They went > back to the > > > court and > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 days > before > > > securing bail. > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet to > begin. > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, a > firebrand > > > cleric who never > > > > held his tongue in public speeches against > the > > > government, > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > Masjid > > > demolition and the > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > Embroiled in > > > cooked-up > > > > cases, in several of which he was > subsequently > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad Police > to report > > > at their > > > > office regularly. > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > Maulana > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > the police station, he was arrested by a > police team > > > from > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement in a > terror > > > conspiracy in > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 murder of > former > > > Gujarat Home > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only evidence > against > > > Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in a > letter to > > > the court, he > > > > has denied making.) > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the Maulana > to the > > > police station > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At this, > Gujarat > > > police > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his service > revolver > > > and shot dead > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > Nasiruddin’s > > > supporters > > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s body > unless the > > > police filed > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > police filed > > > two cases > > > > back to back: One, their own, against the > protestors > > > for blocking > > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, under > pressure, > > > against > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the protestor. > > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an inch > in four > > > years. The > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized his > revolver and > > > sent it for > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > bullet > > > recovered from the > > > > dead protestor’s body. They should have > arrested and > > > produced Amin > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > open-and-shut case if > > > there ever > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > matching the > > > bullet, and > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none of > this > > > happened. Amin > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > Nasiruddin in his > > > custody. The > > > > FIR against him has become a dead letter. > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > subsequently > > > accused of > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > businessman > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in 2005 > (as > > > mentioned above > > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, Amin, > too, is now > > > in jail. > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the main > complainant > > > against > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. This is > none > > > other than 20- > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s > youngest son > > > and Yasir’s > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this year, > Nasir was > > > arrested by > > > > police in Karnataka with another person and > was > > > accused of > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were allegedly > riding. > > > Claiming a > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > slapped charges > > > such as > > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir and > his > > > co-accused. > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > confessions from the > > > two accused > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed them > saying they > > > were SIMI > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > confessions in > > > which they > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members and > the > > > attendant terror > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the police > failed to > > > file a > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed at the > > > magistrate’s house who > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as per > law. But > > > by this time, > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in another > case of > > > conspiracy, so > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir has > retracted > > > his > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he has > little hope > > > against > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the two > accused to > > > police > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana the > following > > > in an interview: > > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary > papers > > > remanding them to > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > accused] > > > stepped forward > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me that > the > > > police denied > > > > them food and water and subjected them to > repeated > > > beatings. He > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > Nasir’s body. > > > The two > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human rights > violation > > > by the > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > “I was very surprised by three things: > they were > > > talking of their > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > manner, they > > > spoke English > > > > and, further, they readily admitted that > they had > > > stolen the bike, > > > > something most thieves never do in my > experience.” > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > magistrate > > > “warning” that > > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to judicial > custody, > > > the magistrate > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to this > house. “The > > > materials > > > > produced before me included duplicate > identity cards, > > > a fancy > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red marks > against > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper with > www.com > > > written on > > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back me’ on > another. > > > > “When I looked at these materials in their > entirety, > > > I felt that > > > > these were definitely not just bike thieves. > Why would > > > bike > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > cards and a > > > map of South > > > > India? The fact that they had an American > dollar > > > seemed to suggest > > > > they had international links. The paper with > www.com > > > indicated to > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > piece of paper > > > had a > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of code > that I could > > > not > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I examined > the South > > > India map, > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a red > marker > > > against it. > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at the > place > > > during a > > > > religious function. > > > > “All these suggested that there were > definitely > > > enough grounds in > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody of > Nasir and > > > Asadullah to > > > > facilitate further investigations.” Go > figure. > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > Muqeemuddin > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The boys’ > mother > > > doesn’t think so. > > > > “Why don’t the police put us all > together in > > > jail,” she told > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > “Then they can > > > shoot all of > > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >      Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. > Get it now, > > > on > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the > > > city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > >      Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > messenger. Go > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > >       Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ From image.science at donau-uni.ac.at Sun Aug 10 18:13:12 2008 From: image.science at donau-uni.ac.at (Image Science) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 14:43:12 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] Call for Papers - MEDIA ART HISTORY 09 - Re:live Message-ID: <489EFE80.4147.007D.0@donau-uni.ac.at> MEDIA ART HISTORY 09 Re:live Third International Conference on the Histories of Media Art, Science and Technology Melbourne 26-29 November 2009 Call For Papers - Deadline 19th December 2008 http://www.mediaarthistory.org Sponsored by Leonardo and the Victorian College of the Arts (University of Melbourne) Following the success of Media Art History 05 Re:fresh in Banff and Media Art History 07 Re:place in Berlin, Media Art History 09 Re:live in Melbourne will host three days of keynotes, panels and poster sessions Media Art History 09 - Re:live, a refereed conference, is calling for papers, panels and posters on the histories of digital, electronic and technological media arts. With the theme of Re:live we are especially interested in expanding the range of topics to include sustainability, live arts and the technological arts of life, both organic and non-organic. How do the media arts change? Through innovation, accident, discovery, mutation or crisis? How did contemporary media arts come to look and sound like they do? What options and potentialities and eccentricities in the history of media have been lost or overlooked or suppressed? What hopes have been realized and which dashed? What is the history of speculation on alternate histories, and how have they altered the course of media art history? Participants are asked to address at least one the following areas in their abstract: - histories of the art-science-technology connection in particular works, careers, exhibitions and institutions, especially in national and regional perspective - histories of biology, the life sciences and bioart in relation to media arts - histories of the environment, environmental sciences, ideas of sustainability and ecology in the discourses and practices of media arts - histories of liveness and performance in relation to media arts theory and practice, including network performance, multimedia performance and the relation of media to the histories of theater - histories of the life of machines, cyborgs, virtual communities and the arts of transmission - histories of the liveness of real-time arts and art-science-technology collaborations in such areas as earth sciences, meteorology and astronomy - histories of innovation, accident, discovery, and speculation on alternative futures in media arts We particularly wish to encourage presentations from and about these histories in the Asia-Pacific region. Proposals are welcomed from artists, curators, arts organizers and researchers in media, art history, performance studies, literature, film, and science and technology studies. Selected papers from the conference will be published in Leonardo (MIT Press). We are negotiating with academic presses for one or two anthologies from the conference. Submissions: A dedicated website with updates and online paper submission system is available at http://www.mediaarthistory.org. Abstracts of proposals, panel presentations and posters should be submitted in either text, RTF, PDF or Word formats Deadline for 200 word abstracts: 19th December 2008. Please submit proposals at http://moodle.donau-uni.ac.at/relive/openconf.php Sean Cubitt and Paul Thomas, conference co-chairs. forwarded by Re:live partner: Database of Virtual Art Danube University Krems www.donau-uni.ac.at/mediaarthistories From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Sun Aug 10 18:51:58 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 06:21:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Civil Society Responds to Present Crisis Message-ID: <917867.63840.qm@web31809.mail.mud.yahoo.com> FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Srinagar, Sunday 10th August 2008   Today, on the initiative of Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), a wide spectrum of civil society actors participated in an urgent meeting to discuss the Present Crisis and the Role of Civil Society. The meeting besides the members of JKCCS was attended by the members of Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir (CCIK), Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owners Federation (KHAROF), Trade Union Centre, Kashmiri Pandit Sangarsh Samiti, Dr. Altaf Hussain, Dr. Mubarik Ahmed, Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Valley Citizens Council), Prof. A.G. Madhosh (Educationist), Shujaat Bukhari (Senior Journalist), Riaz Masroor (Executive Editor – Rising Kashmir), Noor Ahmed Baba (Faculty of Political Science, University of Kashmir), Dr. Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), Qazi Mohammad Amin (Retired IAS Officer), Kumar Ji Wanchoo (Social Activist), Anwar Ashai (Businessman), Dr. Abdul Ahad (Retired Commissioner Secretary), Noorul Hassan (Retired Chief Conservator Forests), Dr. Rafi Punjabi (Social Activist) and students from Kashmir University. After deliberations the participants agreed to adopt the following resolution.   RESOLUTION   We, the members of civil society, view the current situation obtaining in the Indian occupied state of Jammu & Kashmir with grave concern. We, unequivocally, condemn the riots against the Muslims of Jammu province being engineered by the fanatical and extremist elements. We view with horror the threat to the lives, honor and property of Muslims of Jammu province. We condemn the Gujarat type administration of Jammu unreservedly. We express our total solidarity with the Muslims of Jammu and assure them that all the Kashmiris share their pain and anguish in this grave hour.             This meeting also condemns the economic blockade of the Kashmir valley, Doda, Poonch and Rajouri, resorted to by the Hindu extremist organizations and supported by Congress and other Jammu based political and non political formations. This meeting wonders as how the blockaders would succeed without the active connivance of the Indian State with the presence of 7 lakh (700,000) occupational forces in the state of Jammu & Kashmir, one wonders how Jammu-Srinagar highway can be blocked by a few hundred miscreants without the encouragement of the occupational forces. The economic blockade of the valley, Doda, Poonch and Rajouri has created an unprecedented situation whereby there is acute shortage of essential goods, particularly life saving drugs. Our fruit and other exports are blocked, resulting in enormous losses of our economy. We acknowledge with deep satisfaction, indeed pride, the economic assistance rendered by ordinary Muslims of Kashmir to the Yatris going to Amarnath Cave.             We also place on record the age-old harmony, tolerance and brotherhood shown by the Muslims of Kashmir in spite of grave provocations emanating from the communalist organizations and parties of India.             This meeting reiterates to resolve of all Kashmiris to continue to be hospitable to yatris in consonance with our centuries old traditions. However, the participants agreed that the number of visitors to the Cave be regulated as guided by the relevant International environmental laws, and the carrying capacity of this region.             The meeting strongly condemns the attack on the office of the Greater Kashmir in Jammu by the hooligans and the seizure of the newspapers of the Daily Etalaat by State agencies.             This meeting invites the urgent attention of International community to the grave human rights situation in Jammu & Kashmir whereby lives, honor and property of Muslims are in serious jeopardy. The International community should take urgent and serious notice of consequence of economic blockade of the Muslim regions of the Jammu and Kashmir State. We urge the United Nations, the UN Environment Programme, Green Peace, European Union, Common Wealth and SAARC countries to intervene in the matter and allow historical and natural routes for people and goods to flow to and fro from Jammu & Kashmir. This needs to be addressed urgently if a great humanitarian and environmental tragedy is to be averted. The international humanitarian agencies also need to focus their attention on Kashmir and ensure adequate supply of drugs, particularly life saving drugs to Kashmir. We demand the government to allow international organizations be to respond to the need of the medical supplies particularly the drugs needed for diabetes, anti-depressants, cardiac drugs and life saving drugs for cancer patients. The participants resolved to send a fact-finding mission to riot affected Jammu province to record the truth and disseminate it. Another fact-finding mission should go to Baltal and study the legal and environmental issues concerning the land issue. The participants unanimously supported the call for Muzaffarabad March of 11th August.   From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Sun Aug 10 20:04:05 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 20:04:05 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... In-Reply-To: <651051.87288.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <356330.8327.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Prabhakar Singh I am not sure if I am proud of my motherland, but I certainly try to make improvements by paying my taxes, not bribing the traffic cop, not dirtying the roads, and not participating in any kind of hate-mongering or violence. Why should one leave one's homeland. How can one make improvements in one's country if one is not allowed to criticize it. I don't think being proud of one's motherland is a pre-requisit of being a citizen of a country. --- On Sun, 10/8/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > From: Prabhakar Singh > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Cc: "sarai" > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 3:07 PM > If India as a country is so bad why do we choose to live > here at all? We don't deserve to be called Indians if we > are not proud of our nation.We should try to make improvemet > rather than codemning our own motherland.Freedom of > expression does not mean that one can insult our nation like > this.Such outrageous comments should not be allowed.The > moderator of the forum needs to explain this now. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: S.Fatima > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Cc: sarai > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 2:24:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > ... > > Dear Radhika > I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but > the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and > more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror > for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the > mainstream media. They keep inventing new terms everyday. > So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your > rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI > editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If > common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of > RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror > during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their > subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would > be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you > must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims > in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely > more than defending. That's planned genocide of a > community. > > Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of > India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all > humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is > invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say > of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India > whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and > MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > wrote: > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > name of fighting terrorism > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > Cc: "sarai" > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > > Dear Sadia, > > > > your query looks absurd on the face of it because > > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 > years, > > always tolerent of the invaders be it the moghuls or > later > > christian missionaries converting to increase the > numerical > > strength of the "community. > > > > Muslims demanded a land and nation for > themselves, a > > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, > but > > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , > free > > india, secular nation, not a hindu nation, > showcasing the > > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to > blame > > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their > promise when > > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to > stay > > back. > > > > Next, as a community, why muslims are not > identifying the > > "fasaadis" in their community who are > terming > > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in > to > > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not > tolerate, > > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try > to > > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of > islam, > > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let > the > > muslim community take steps to identify the > terrorsists or > > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of > rule > > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > > > > In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" > lawyers > > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no > way > > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > > jihaadi by default.! > > > > regards. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > name of > > fighting terrorism > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Cc: sarai > > > > > Dear Radhika > > > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father > of > > the nation, mahatma > > > that they will stay back in India as brothers > with > > their hindu > > > community" > > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath > to > > live as > > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others > as > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > wrote: > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims > in > > the name of > > > fighting terrorism > > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all > those > > terrorists who > > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are > muslims. > > > > > > > > When the community of muslims forgot > their > > solemn oath > > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they > will > > stay back in > > > > India as brothers with their hindu > community, > > many were > > > > sceptical, for one, as the population > increases > > the muslim > > > > community along with other segments of > sovciety > > also did > > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks > to > > the politics > > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > > linguistic , > > > > caste and faith segments, the national > exchequer > > never > > > > reached the grass root level of the populace > and > > citizens in > > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > > governance > > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > > > > The muslim community in general had > lower > > percentage of > > > > educated men and women, who instead of > having > > concern for > > > > their community, is seen more in nesting > their > > own homes > > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > > transactions, > > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > > wherever the > > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > > rules on > > > > society are all the reasons along with > political > > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures > of > > patronising > > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > > wondering where he > > > > belonged to. ! > > > > > > > > The subsequent generations of muslims, > > particularly > > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding > more > > say in the > > > > governance along with dalits and other > suppressed > > and > > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > > breeding of > > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing > the > > issues used > > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the > passions > > on some > > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > > dangers from > > > > "communal " parties totally > loosing > > sight of > > > > communalism played by so called secular > parties.! > > > > > > > > In the entire process, the muslim youth > who is > > found > > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those > elements in > > society who > > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > > terorists, use the > > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > > > > Only solution to terror is handle the > elements > > who > > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > > terrorise them > > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle > the > > deviant > > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or > favour > > of vote > > > > banks. > > > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > the > > name of > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the > > Ahmedabad blasts > > > > is just the > > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by > AJIT > > SAHI exposes > > > > the random > > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)> > > > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > > decades, Maulana > > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and > began to > > speak to > > > > the faithful > > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > > soft-spoken, > > > > revered aalim, > > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores > of > > Muslims in > > > > the hour- > > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque > in one > > of > > > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > > > localities where the preacher and many > in > > his > > > > congregation live. > > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > > Muslim’s duty > > > > towards his > > > > > neighbours. “You cannot fill your > stomach > > if your > > > > neighbour is > > > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his > unhurried > > tone. “You > > > > cannot > > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and > Muslim > > > > neighbours.” > > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of > the > > serial > > > > blasts that > > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on > Saturday, > > policemen > > > > stormed > > > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the > mosque > > and > > > > dragged him away as > > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On > Monday, > > as a local > > > > magistrate > > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for > two > > weeks, > > > > police claimed > > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the > Saturday > > blasts and > > > > that grilling > > > > > him would unravel the execution of and > the > > conspiracy > > > > behind the > > > > > terror act. > > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, > everybody, > > > > justifiably, wants > > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The > challenge > > then is > > > > not to reach > > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > > demonisations. > > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > > challenge. Over > > > > the years, for > > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > > acronym for most > > > > Indians — > > > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, > a > > hotbed of > > > > terrorism, a > > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent > on > > destroying > > > > the nation. > > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific > blast, > > that name > > > > is thrust > > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly > innuendo > > — > > > > stretching outwards > > > > > to embrace the entire community. But > how > > true are > > > > these allegations? > > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe > society, > > it is > > > > crucial to find > > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > > crucial to > > > > cleave doggedly > > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of > law; > > crucial not > > > > to fall prey > > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In > pursuit > > of this, > > > > in an > > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, > TEHELKA > > conducted > > > > an > > > > > investigation across India over three > months > > and 12 > > > > cities. > > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, > the > > disturbing > > > > investigation > > > > > found that an overwhelming majority of > > terrorism cases > > > > — > > > > > especially those related to the > outlawed > > SIMI — are > > > > based on > > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent > evidence > > and are an > > > > affront to > > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > > prejudices in > > > > the > > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject > lack > > of > > > > political will > > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 > news > > media that > > > > demands > > > > > instant whodunit answers and > unquestioningly > > > > copy-pastes every > > > > > unproven police and intelligence story > on > > terrorist > > > > networks has > > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > > hundreds of > > > > people falsely > > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of > these > > are Muslim; > > > > nearly all > > > > > of these are poor. > > > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I > am > > confident we > > > > will be able > > > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime > Minister > > Manmohan > > > > Singh said as he > > > > > walked about in the debris at > Ahmedabad’s > > civil > > > > hospital, where > > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > > casualties. He > > > > urged political > > > > > parties and police and intelligence > agencies > > to work > > > > together > > > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying > our > > social > > > > fabric, > > > > > undermining communal harmony.” > > Unfortunately, given > > > > their > > > > > staggering record of false cases > against > > innocent > > > > people, it > > > > > appears that incompetent police and > > intelligence > > > > agencies are > > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, > chronicled > > below, is a > > > > searing > > > > > example why. > > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in > the > > stenographic > > > > news media, > > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a > SIMI > > member > > > > linked with > > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased > terrorists. > > Gujarat > > > > government’s > > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > > Haleem sent > > > > Muslim youth > > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to > train as > > terrorists > > > > to avenge > > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in > the > > state. He > > > > said they > > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate > BJP > > leader LK > > > > Advani and > > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. > Police > > have said > > > > Haleem was > > > > > absconding since he was named an > accused in > > this case > > > > in 2002. > > > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad > > following the > > > > cleric’s arrest > > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, > documentary > > and > > > > circumstantial, > > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has > lived > > at his > > > > house — which is > > > > > less than a km from the local police > station > > — for > > > > years and led a > > > > > public life within his community. The > charge > > against > > > > him that he > > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > > highly dubious > > > > based as it > > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > > contents > > > > don’t remotely > > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And > until > > Saturday’s > > > > bomb blasts, > > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called > Haleem a > > SIMI > > > > member. > > > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and > followers > > say > > > > police have > > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > > helping victims > > > > of the 2002 > > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May > 27, > > an > > > > inspector from the > > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > > handwritten > > > > notice in > > > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of > Markaz > > Ahle-Hadis > > > > [the Islamic > > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > > belong] Trust > > > > has been > > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan > Shopping > > Centre. > > > > You are its > > > > > head… Many members have been > appointed in > > it. You > > > > are directed to > > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses > and > > phone > > > > numbers.” > > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such > a > > demand on a > > > > trust > > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > > charge against > > > > it, the > > > > > letter proves the police knew > Haleem’s > > whereabouts > > > > and were in > > > > > touch with him as late as two months > ago. > > Indeed, the > > > > notice > > > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, > Devi > > Park > > > > Society, near > > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family > has > > proof that > > > > the police > > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem > rushed > > telegrams to > > > > Gujarat’s > > > > > director-general of police and > Ahmedabad’s > > police > > > > commissioner > > > > > claiming that the police forcibly > entered > > his house > > > > that day and > > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > > absence. “We > > > > are peace- > > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and > have > > never been > > > > part of any > > > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the > > telegram in > > > > Hindi. “The police > > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my > family > > without > > > > appropriate > > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > > rights.” > > > > Predictably, he > > > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > > > In April, when a local outfit called > Social > > Unity > > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as > its > > members, > > > > organised a > > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to > the > > police > > > > seeking permission > > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > > clearly > > > > mentioned that > > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > > event. > > > > Haleem’s family > > > > > also offers his driving licence, > renewed by > > the > > > > Ahmedabad > > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, > as > > proof that > > > > he led a > > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, > in > > July 2005, > > > > the Gujarati > > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > > Haleem’s > > > > picture with a > > > > > statement he released at a press > conference > > giving his > > > > views on a > > > > > raging controversy over the alleged > rape of > > a woman, > > > > Imrana, by > > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > > Pradesh. > > > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove > Maulana > > > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > > appealed to the > > > > Gujarat > > > > > governor to secure the cleric’s > release. > > Adds Nazir, > > > > in whose > > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family > as > > tenant: “I > > > > have known > > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > > religion and has > > > > never > > > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says > Haleem’s > > wife Noor > > > > Saba: “I swear by > > > > > my children that my husband is not a > > terrorist. He is > > > > being framed.” > > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable > in the > > > > cleric’s > > > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has > helped > > hundreds > > > > in their daily > > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > > patience and > > > > fortitude,” > > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a > 27-year-old > > embroiderer. > > > > Haq fishes > > > > > out his marriage certificate, the > nikaahnama > > the > > > > Maulana signed > > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June > 1, to > > show that > > > > Haleem > > > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had > delivered > > a sermon > > > > to the guests > > > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers > that > > Haq had > > > > installed — with > > > > > police permission. > > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > > hails from > > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. > He is > > a preacher > > > > with a > > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle > Hadis > > that began > > > > on the > > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > > survived a > > > > frowning Sunni > > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by > the > > Hadis — > > > > the oral > > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life > — > > as a > > > > guiding principle for > > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The > news > > media have > > > > long > > > > > parroted the police’s insinuation > that > > Ahle-Hadis is > > > > a terrorist > > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. > The > > police claim > > > > its members > > > > > include many terror accused such as > those of > > the July > > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > > membership of > > > > 30 million in > > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out > that > > Union > > > > Home Minister > > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at > its > > national > > > > symposium two > > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd > Ahle > > Hadis > > > > followers for 14 > > > > > years, resigning three years ago to > minister > > a small > > > > mosque so he > > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to > earn a > > regular > > > > income to > > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the > oldest > > two of > > > > whom study at > > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon > after the > > 2002 > > > > anti-Muslim > > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved > himself > > in relief > > > > work at the > > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim > refugees. > > An > > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in > Kuwait and > > was > > > > visiting his > > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two > other > > Muslims. One > > > > of them was > > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who > also > > lived in > > > > Kuwait. The > > > > > other was a small-time trader from > > Moradabad. The > > > > three wanted to > > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the > 2002 > > violence > > > > by bringing > > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem > took > > them to > > > > four refugee > > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > > saying it had > > > > found 34 > > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned > the > > Kuwait > > > > expatriate, who > > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote > to him > > about the > > > > offer. But > > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > > importantly, > > > > no children > > > > > were ever sent. > > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, > Delhi > > Police > > > > arrested Shahid > > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from > Kuwait > > allegedly > > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > > Moradabad trader > > > > was also > > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three > were > > charged > > > > under the > > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for > conspiring > > to carry > > > > out terrorist > > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s > letter > > (about the > > > > camp’s offer > > > > > of the orphan children) with the > expatriate > > from > > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > > police there > > > > were informed. > > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer > DG > > Vanzara > > > > called in Haleem > > > > > and detained him — illegally — for > five > > days. > > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat > businessman > > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him > off as > > a > > > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > > > family frantically filed a petition > with the > > Gujarat > > > > High Court to > > > > > secure his release. “The judge > ordered the > > police to > > > > bring Haleem > > > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls > the > > > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > > police > > > > instantly released > > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where > his > > statement on > > > > his illegal > > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part > of > > official > > > > documents. > > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX > > case’ > > > > against the two > > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and > the > > Moradabad > > > > trader, police > > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case > against > > the same > > > > individuals > > > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as > > terrorists in > > > > Moradabad”. > > > > > This is the case the police and the > media > > have > > > > referred since > > > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb > > blasts to argue > > > > that the > > > > > cleric was involved in “sending > Muslim > > youth to > > > > train as > > > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government > lawyer > > was > > > > openly lying on > > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > > Haleem had > > > > sent “30 youth” > > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. > The > > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > > conspiracy had > > > > remained on > > > > > paper and no children ever travelled > from > > Ahmedabad to > > > > Moradabad. > > > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named > Haleem > > a witness, > > > > Ahmedabad’s > > > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him > an > > accused and > > > > said he was > > > > > absconding. The law says the police > have to > > follow due > > > > legal > > > > > process before declaring an accused as > > absconding. > > > > This includes > > > > > searches at his house and workplace in > view > > of > > > > independent > > > > > witnesses, and recording statements > from > > neighbours to > > > > establish > > > > > that the accused has not been seen for > a > > long time. > > > > The Ahmedabad > > > > > police did not bother with this > exercise. > > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based > on a > > letter he > > > > wrote to > > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan > Ahmad > > Ali. Dated > > > > August 7, > > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > > terrorist > > > > training or any > > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply > said: > > “You had > > > > come [to > > > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ > > (important > > > > goal).” With a giant > > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim > that > > the words > > > > “ahem maqsad” > > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for > terrorist > > training. > > > > Haleem wrote > > > > > that six of the children were orphans > and > > the rest > > > > poor. He > > > > > concluded the letter saying: “I > believe > > that by > > > > god’s grace you > > > > > will certainly help me in this > educational > > and > > > > constructive > > > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his > > deposition > > > > before a Delhi > > > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem > said he > > was told > > > > the children will > > > > > get “a good education and decent > living” > > in > > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to > train > > the > > > > children as > > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > > hearing the > > > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate > from > > Kuwait, > > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > > years in jail. > > > > The court > > > > > accepted the police version even though > the > > only > > > > witnesses to the > > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > > Ahmad Ali had > > > > claimed that > > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he > was to > > board a > > > > flight to > > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as > proof. > > The judge > > > > ignored that. > > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at > the > > Delhi High > > > > Court against > > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > > twister: while > > > > they got > > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite > being > > convicted > > > > by the > > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by > the > > Gujarat High > > > > Court in > > > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ > although > > no guilt > > > > has yet been > > > > > established in that case and the > Gujarat > > crime branch > > > > admits their > > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the > alleged > > > > conspiracy. That’s > > > > > not all. > > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail > 56-year-old > > man named > > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX > case’. > > He proved > > > > doubly lucky > > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him > bail > > in the > > > > ‘terrorist > > > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its > > eye-opening bail > > > > order, the > > > > > judge said: “… All that remains > against > > the > > > > present applicant > > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad > and had > > visited > > > > camps to > > > > > identify the children so that they can > be > > better > > > > looked after. > > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > > offence.” > > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused > of > > exactly the > > > > same crime, > > > > > the argument should be valid for them, > too. > > Yet, > > > > another Gujarat > > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and > both > > continue to > > > > languish in > > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > > Ahmedabad because > > > >the Gujarat > > > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he > must > > report to > > > > the Crime > > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every > Sunday. On > > Sunday, > > > > July 27, the > > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited > the > > crime > > > > branch office > > > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me > four > > hours on the > > > > blasts,” > > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when > they > > let me > > > > go.” > > > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist > training > > case’ is > > > > nearly over. It is > > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > > called against > > > > Haleem, > > > > > since he is no more “absconding”. > > Meanwhile, > > > > Haleem’s family is > > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and > the > > next > > > > month’s house rent > > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she > has no > > savings. > > > > His lone > > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying > to run > > > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story > is > > anything but > > > > rare. One > > > > > glaring case concerns a “family of > > terrorists”. On > > > > July 15, a > > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > > Mohammad > > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > > as he returned home at night from his > > father’s > > > > workshop in > > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial > bomb > > blasts > > > > rocked > > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two > people, > > Hyderabad > > > > Police > > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the > Hindustan > > Times > > > > newspaper that, > > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had > confessed > > that before > > > > his arrest, > > > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to > > Karnataka and > > > > “arranged safe > > > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir > denies > > the > > > > confession. “I > > > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir > told > > his > > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the > jail on > > July 29. > > > > “The police > > > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her > son > > was tortured > > > > during what > > > > > the police commissioner calls > > “interrogation”. > > > > “He was hung upside > > > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession > made > > to the > > > > police is > > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > > (never mind > > > > that the news > > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > > Yasir’s alleged > > > > confession, > > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face > of the > > Hyderabad > > > > Police. > > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member > whose > > father and > > > > one brother > > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > > Yasir’s father, > > > > 56-yearold > > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > > wellrespected cleric > > > > who has now > > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in > Ahmedabad > > for nearly > > > > four years > > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up > to > > the Supreme > > > > Court. > > > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin > Nasir, > > is jailed > > > > in Karnataka’s > > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested > in > > January. > > > > > With his brother and father suspected > as > > dreaded > > > > terrorists, the > > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs > on > > Yasir all > > > > the time and > > > > > instantly known if he was aiding > terrorists. > > That the > > > > police > > > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe > > houses” for > > > > terrorists in > > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never > did > > any such > > > > thing. This > > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad > a > > month before > > > > his arrest, > >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > > engineering workshop > > > > that his > > > > > father had set up three decades ago > with > > borrowed > > > > money and skills > > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > > mechanic. In > > > > the din of > > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > > managing > > > > customers crowding > > > > > the small front office. “My father > and > > brother have > > > > been framed,” > > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > > seems a victim > > > > of patently > > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a > member of > > SIMI when > > > > it was > > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, > 2001. > > (Given the > > > > relentless > > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > > reader might > > > > find it hard > > > > > to believe that no court in India has > yet > > upheld the > > > > charge of > > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an > organisation.) > > Yasir > > > > echoed dozens > > > > > others interviewed by this reporter > across > > India in > > > > saying that > > > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep > religious > > training and > > > > self- > > > > > purification”, and not for acts of > > terrorism or > > > > anti-India > > > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of > > atrocities on > > > > Muslims from > > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. > “It > > never gave > > > > up the issue of > > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted > many of > > us.” > > > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, > the > > police > > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > > representatives in > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > under the Unlawful Activities > (Prevention) > > Act. A > > > > magistrate gave > > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, > the > > police > > > > slapped another > > > > > case against the three, alleging that > one of > > them was > > > > arrested > > > > > making a speech against the government. > The > > other two, > > > > including > > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They > went > > back to the > > > > court and > > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 > days > > before > > > > securing bail. > > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet > to > > begin. > > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, > a > > firebrand > > > > cleric who never > > > > > held his tongue in public speeches > against > > the > > > > government, > > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > > Masjid > > > > demolition and the > > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > > Embroiled in > > > > cooked-up > > > > > cases, in several of which he was > > subsequently > > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad > Police > > to report > > > > at their > > > > > office regularly. > > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > > Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > > the police station, he was arrested by > a > > police team > > > > from > > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement > in a > > terror > > > > conspiracy in > > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 > murder of > > former > > > > Gujarat Home > > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only > evidence > > against > > > > Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in > a > > letter to > > > > the court, he > > > > > has denied making.) > > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the > Maulana > > to the > > > > police station > > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At > this, > > Gujarat > > > > police > > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his > service > > revolver > > > > and shot dead > > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > > Nasiruddin’s > > > > supporters > > > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s > body > > unless the > > > > police filed > > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > > police filed > >> > two cases > > > > > back to back: One, their own, against > the > > protestors > > > > for blocking > > > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, > under > > pressure, > > > > against > > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the > protestor. > > > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an > inch > > in four > > > > years. The > > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized > his > > revolver and > > > > sent it for > > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > > bullet > > > > recovered from the > > > > > dead protestor’s body. They should > have > > arrested and > > > > produced Amin > > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > > open-and-shut case if > > > > there ever > > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > > matching the > > > > bullet, and > > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none > of > > this > > > > happened. Amin > > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > > Nasiruddin in his > > > > custody. The > > > > > FIR against him has become a dead > letter. > > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > > subsequently > > > > accused of > > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > > businessman > > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in > 2005 > > (as > > > > mentioned above > > > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, > Amin, > > too, is now > > > > in jail. > > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the > main > > complainant > > > > against > > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. > This is > > none > > > > other than 20- > > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s > > youngest son > > > > and Yasir’s > > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this > year, > > Nasir was > > > > arrested by > > > > > police in Karnataka with another person > and > > was > > > > accused of > > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were > allegedly > > riding. > > > > Claiming a > > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > > slapped charges > > > > such as > > > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir > and > > his > > > > co-accused. > > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > > confessions from the > > > > two accused > > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed > them > > saying they > > > > were SIMI > > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > > confessions in > > > > which they > > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members > and > > the > > > > attendant terror > > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the > police > > failed to > > > > file a > > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed > at the > > > > magistrate’s house who > > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as > per > > law. But > > > > by this time, > > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in > another > > case of > > > > conspiracy, so > > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir > has > > retracted > > > > his > > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he > has > > little hope > > > > against > > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the > two > > accused to > > > > police > > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana > the > > following > > > > in an interview: > > > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary > > papers > > > > remanding them to > > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > > accused] > > > > stepped forward > > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me > that > > the > > > > police denied > > > > > them food and water and subjected them > to > > repeated > > > > beatings. He > > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > > Nasir’s body. > > > > The two > > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human > rights > > violation > > > > by the > > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > > “I was very surprised by three > things: > > they were > > > > talking of their > > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > > manner, they > > > > spoke English > > > > > and, further, they readily admitted > that > > they had > > > > stolen the bike, > > > > > something most thieves never do in my > > experience.” > > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > > magistrate > > > > “warning” that > > > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to > judicial > > custody, > > > > the magistrate > > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to > this > > house. “The > > > > materials > > > > > produced before me included duplicate > > identity cards, > > > > a fancy > > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red > marks > > against > > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper > with > > www.com > > > > written on > > > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back > me’ on > > another. > > > > > “When I looked at these materials in > their > > entirety, > > > > I felt that > > > > > these were definitely not just bike > thieves. > > Why would > > > > bike > > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > > cards and a > > > > map of South > > > > > India? The fact that they had an > American > > dollar > > > > seemed to suggest > > > > > they had international links. The paper > with > > www.com > > > > indicated to > > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > > piece of paper > > > > had a > > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of > code > > that I could > > > > not > > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I > examined > > the South > > > > India map, > > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a > red > > marker > > > > against it. > > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at > the > > place > > > > during a > > > > > religious function. > > > > > “All these suggested that there were > > definitely > > > > enough grounds in > > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody > of > > Nasir and > > > > Asadullah to > > > > > facilitate further investigations.” > Go > > figure. > > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > > Muqeemuddin > > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The > boys’ > > mother > > > > doesn’t think so. > > > > > “Why don’t the police put us all > > together in > > > > jail,” she told > > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > > “Then they can > > > > shoot all of > > > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited > storage. > > Get it now, > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > > media and the > > > > city. > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > > list > > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without > downloading > > messenger. Go > > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 10 22:24:45 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 09:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... Message-ID: <603270.13637.qm@web31503.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Let us not mix things like this and confuse the basic issue.Making improvement and insulting motherland are two different issues.It needs no further discussion. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: S.Fatima To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net; Prabhakar Singh Cc: sarai Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 7:34:05 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... Dear Prabhakar Singh I am not sure if I am proud of my motherland, but I certainly try to make improvements by paying my taxes, not bribing the traffic cop, not dirtying the roads, and not participating in any kind of hate-mongering or violence. Why should one leave one's homeland. How can one make improvements in one's country if one is not allowed to criticize it. I don't think being proud of one's motherland is a pre-requisit of being a citizen of a country. --- On Sun, 10/8/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > From: Prabhakar Singh > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Cc: "sarai" > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 3:07 PM > If India as a country is so bad why do we choose to live > here at all? We don't deserve to be called Indians if we > are not proud of our nation.We should try to make improvemet > rather than codemning our own motherland.Freedom of > expression does not mean that one can insult our nation like > this.Such outrageous comments should not be allowed.The > moderator of the forum needs to explain this now. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: S.Fatima > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Cc: sarai > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 2:24:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > ... > > Dear Radhika > I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but > the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and > more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror > for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the > mainstream media. They keep inventing new terms everyday. > So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your > rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI > editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If > common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of > RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror > during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their > subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would > be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you > must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims > in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely > more than defending. That's planned genocide of a > community. > > Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of > India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all > humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is > invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say > of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India > whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and > MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > wrote: > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > name of fighting terrorism > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > Cc: "sarai" > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > > Dear Sadia, > > > >    your query looks absurd on the face of it because > > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 > years, > > always tolerent of the invaders be it  the moghuls or > later > > christian missionaries converting to increase the > numerical > > strength of the "community. > > > >    Muslims demanded a land and nation for > themselves, a > > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, > but > > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , > free > > india,  secular nation, not a hindu nation, > showcasing the > > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to > blame > > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their > promise when > > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to > stay > > back. > > > >  Next, as a community, why muslims are not > identifying the > > "fasaadis" in their community who are > terming > > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in > to > > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not > tolerate, > > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try > to > > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of > islam, > > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let > the > > muslim community take steps to identify the > terrorsists or > > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of > rule > > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > > > >  In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" > lawyers > > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no > way > > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > > jihaadi by default.! > > > >  regards. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > name of > > fighting    terrorism > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Cc: sarai > > > > > Dear Radhika > > > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father > of > > the nation, mahatma > > > that they will stay back in India as brothers > with > > their hindu > > > community" > > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath > to > > live as > > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others > as > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > wrote: > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims > in > > the name of > > > fighting terrorism > > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all > those > > terrorists who > > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are > muslims. > > > > > > > >      When the community of muslims forgot > their > > solemn oath > > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they > will > > stay back in > > > > India as brothers with their hindu > community, > > many were > > > > sceptical, for one, as the population > increases > > the muslim > > > > community  along with other segments of > sovciety > > also did > > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks > to > > the politics > > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > > linguistic , > > > > caste and faith segments, the national > exchequer > > never > > > > reached the grass root level of the populace > and > > citizens in > > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > > governance > > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > > > >    The muslim community in general had > lower > > percentage of > > > > educated men and women, who instead of > having > > concern for > > > > their community, is seen more in nesting > their > > own homes > > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > > transactions, > > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > > wherever the > > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > > rules on > > > > society are all the reasons along with > political > > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures > of > > patronising > > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > > wondering where he > > > > belonged to. ! > > > > > > > >    The subsequent generations of muslims, > > particularly > > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding > more > > say in the > > > > governance along with dalits and other > suppressed > > and > > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > > breeding of > > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing > the > > issues used > > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the > passions > > on some > > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > > dangers from > > > > "communal  "  parties totally > loosing > > sight of > > > > communalism played by so called secular > parties.! > > > > > > > >    In the entire process, the muslim youth > who is > > found > > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those > elements in > > society who > > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > > terorists, use the > > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > > > >  Only solution to terror is handle the > elements > > who > > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > > terrorise them > > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle > the > > deviant > > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or > favour > > of vote > > > > banks. > > > > > > > >  regards. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > the > > name of > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the > > Ahmedabad blasts > > > > is just the > > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by > AJIT > > SAHI exposes > > > > the random > > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)> > > > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > > decades, Maulana > > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and > began to > > speak to > > > > the faithful > > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > > soft-spoken, > > > > revered aalim, > > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores > of > > Muslims in > > > > the hour- > > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque > in one > > of > > > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > > > localities where the preacher and many > in > > his > > > > congregation live. > > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > > Muslim’s duty > > > > towards his > > > > > neighbours. “You cannot fill your > stomach > > if your > > > > neighbour is > > > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his > unhurried > > tone. “You > > > > cannot > > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and > Muslim > > > > neighbours.” > > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of > the > > serial > > > > blasts that > > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on > Saturday, > > policemen > > > > stormed > > > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the > mosque > > and > > > > dragged him away as > > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On > Monday, > > as a local > > > > magistrate > > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for > two > > weeks, > > > > police claimed > > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the > Saturday > > blasts and > > > > that grilling > > > > > him would unravel the execution of and > the > > conspiracy > > > > behind the > > > > > terror act. > > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, > everybody, > > > > justifiably, wants > > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The > challenge > > then is > > > > not to reach > > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > > demonisations. > > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > > challenge. Over > > > > the years, for > > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > > acronym for most > > > > Indians — > > > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, > a > > hotbed of > > > > terrorism, a > > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent > on > > destroying > > > > the nation. > > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific > blast, > > that name > > > > is thrust > > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly > innuendo > > — > > > > stretching outwards > > > > > to embrace the entire community. But > how > > true are > > > > these allegations? > > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe > society, > > it is > > > > crucial to find > > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > > crucial to > > > > cleave doggedly > > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of > law; > > crucial not > > > > to fall prey > > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In > pursuit > > of this, > > > > in an > > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, > TEHELKA > > conducted > > > > an > > > > > investigation across India over three > months > > and 12 > > > > cities. > > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, > the > > disturbing > > > > investigation > > > > > found that an overwhelming majority of > > terrorism cases > > > > — > > > > > especially those related to the > outlawed > > SIMI — are > > > > based on > > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent > evidence > > and are an > > > > affront to > > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > > prejudices in > > > > the > > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject > lack > > of > > > > political will > > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 > news > > media that > > > > demands > > > > > instant whodunit answers and > unquestioningly > > > > copy-pastes every > > > > > unproven police and intelligence story > on > > terrorist > > > > networks has > > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > > hundreds of > > > > people falsely > > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of > these > > are Muslim; > > > > nearly all > > > > > of these are poor. > > > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I > am > > confident we > > > > will be able > > > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime > Minister > > Manmohan > > > > Singh said as he > > > > > walked about in the debris at > Ahmedabad’s > > civil > > > > hospital, where > > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > > casualties. He > > > > urged political > > > > > parties and police and intelligence > agencies > > to work > > > > together > > > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying > our > > social > > > > fabric, > > > > > undermining communal harmony.” > > Unfortunately, given > > > > their > > > > > staggering record of false cases > against > > innocent > > > > people, it > > > > > appears that incompetent police and > > intelligence > > > > agencies are > > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, > chronicled > > below, is a > > > > searing > > > > > example why. > > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in > the > > stenographic > > > > news media, > > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a > SIMI > > member > > > > linked with > > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased > terrorists. > > Gujarat > > > > government’s > > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > > Haleem sent > > > > Muslim youth > > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to > train as > > terrorists > > > > to avenge > > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in > the > > state. He > > > > said they > > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate > BJP > > leader LK > > > > Advani and > > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. > Police > > have said > > > > Haleem was > > > > > absconding since he was named an > accused in > > this case > > > > in 2002. > > > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad > > following the > > > > cleric’s arrest > > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, > documentary > > and > > > > circumstantial, > > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has > lived > > at his > > > > house — which is > > > > > less than a km from the local police > station > > — for > > > > years and led a > > > > > public life within his community. The > charge > > against > > > > him that he > > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > > highly dubious > > > > based as it > > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > > contents > > > > don’t remotely > > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And > until > > Saturday’s > > > > bomb blasts, > > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called > Haleem a > > SIMI > > > > member. > > > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and > followers > > say > > > > police have > > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > > helping victims > > > > of the 2002 > > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May > 27, > > an > > > > inspector from the > > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > > handwritten > > > > notice in > > > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of > Markaz > > Ahle-Hadis > > > > [the Islamic > > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > > belong] Trust > > > > has been > > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan > Shopping > > Centre. > > > > You are its > > > > > head… Many members have been > appointed in > > it. You > > > > are directed to > > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses > and > > phone > > > > numbers.” > > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such > a > > demand on a > > > > trust > > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > > charge against > > > > it, the > > > > > letter proves the police knew > Haleem’s > > whereabouts > > > > and were in > > > > > touch with him as late as two months > ago. > > Indeed, the > > > > notice > > > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, > Devi > > Park > > > > Society, near > > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family > has > > proof that > > > > the police > > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem > rushed > > telegrams to > > > > Gujarat’s > > > > > director-general of police and > Ahmedabad’s > > police > > > > commissioner > > > > > claiming that the police forcibly > entered > > his house > > > > that day and > > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > > absence. “We > > > > are peace- > > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and > have > > never been > > > > part of any > > > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the > > telegram in > > > > Hindi. “The police > > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my > family > > without > > > > appropriate > > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > > rights.” > > > > Predictably, he > > > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > > > In April, when a local outfit called > Social > > Unity > > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as > its > > members, > > > > organised a > > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to > the > > police > > > > seeking permission > > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > > clearly > > > > mentioned that > > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > > event. > > > > Haleem’s family > > > > > also offers his driving licence, > renewed by > > the > > > > Ahmedabad > > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, > as > > proof that > > > > he led a > > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, > in > > July 2005, > > > > the Gujarati > > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > > Haleem’s > > > > picture with a > > > > > statement he released at a press > conference > > giving his > > > > views on a > > > > > raging controversy over the alleged > rape of > > a woman, > > > > Imrana, by > > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > > Pradesh. > > > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove > Maulana > > > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > > appealed to the > > > > Gujarat > > > > > governor to secure the cleric’s > release. > > Adds Nazir, > > > > in whose > > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family > as > > tenant: “I > > > > have known > > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > > religion and has > > > > never > > > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says > Haleem’s > > wife Noor > > > > Saba: “I swear by > > > > > my children that my husband is not a > > terrorist. He is > > > > being framed.” > > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable > in the > > > > cleric’s > > > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has > helped > > hundreds > > > > in their daily > > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > > patience and > > > > fortitude,” > > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a > 27-year-old > > embroiderer. > > > > Haq fishes > > > > > out his marriage certificate, the > nikaahnama > > the > > > > Maulana signed > > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June > 1, to > > show that > > > > Haleem > > > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had > delivered > > a sermon > > > > to the guests > > > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers > that > > Haq had > > > > installed — with > > > > > police permission. > > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > > hails from > > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. > He is > > a preacher > > > > with a > > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle > Hadis > > that began > > > > on the > > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > > survived a > > > > frowning Sunni > > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by > the > > Hadis — > > > > the oral > > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life > — > > as a > > > > guiding principle for > > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The > news > > media have > > > > long > > > > > parroted the police’s insinuation > that > > Ahle-Hadis is > > > > a terrorist > > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. > The > > police claim > > > > its members > > > > > include many terror accused such as > those of > > the July > > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > > membership of > > > > 30 million in > > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out > that > > Union > > > > Home Minister > > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at > its > > national > > > > symposium two > > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd > Ahle > > Hadis > > > > followers for 14 > > > > > years, resigning three years ago to > minister > > a small > > > > mosque so he > > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to > earn a > > regular > > > > income to > > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the > oldest > > two of > > > > whom study at > > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon > after the > > 2002 > > > > anti-Muslim > > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved > himself > > in relief > > > > work at the > > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim > refugees. > > An > > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in > Kuwait and > > was > > > > visiting his > > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two > other > > Muslims. One > > > > of them was > > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who > also > > lived in > > > > Kuwait. The > > > > > other was a small-time trader from > > Moradabad. The > > > > three wanted to > > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the > 2002 > > violence > > > > by bringing > > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem > took > > them to > > > > four refugee > > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > > saying it had > > > > found 34 > > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned > the > > Kuwait > > > > expatriate, who > > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote > to him > > about the > > > > offer. But > > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > > importantly, > > > > no children > > > > > were ever sent. > > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, > Delhi > > Police > > > > arrested Shahid > > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from > Kuwait > > allegedly > > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > > Moradabad trader > > > > was also > > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three > were > > charged > > > > under the > > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for > conspiring > > to carry > > > > out terrorist > > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s > letter > > (about the > > > > camp’s offer > > > > > of the orphan children) with the > expatriate > > from > > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > > police there > > > > were informed. > > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer > DG > > Vanzara > > > > called in Haleem > > > > > and detained him — illegally — for > five > > days. > > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat > businessman > > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him > off as > > a > > > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > > > family frantically filed a petition > with the > > Gujarat > > > > High Court to > > > > > secure his release. “The judge > ordered the > > police to > > > > bring Haleem > > > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls > the > > > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > > police > > > > instantly released > > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where > his > > statement on > > > > his illegal > > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part > of > > official > > > > documents. > > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX > > case’ > > > > against the two > > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and > the > > Moradabad > > > > trader, police > > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case > against > > the same > > > > individuals > > > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as > > terrorists in > > > > Moradabad”. > > > > > This is the case the police and the > media > > have > > > > referred since > > > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb > > blasts to argue > > > > that the > > > > > cleric was involved in “sending > Muslim > > youth to > > > > train as > > > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government > lawyer > > was > > > > openly lying on > > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > > Haleem had > > > > sent “30 youth” > > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. > The > > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > > conspiracy had > > > > remained on > > > > > paper and no children ever travelled > from > > Ahmedabad to > > > > Moradabad. > > > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named > Haleem > > a witness, > > > > Ahmedabad’s > > > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him > an > > accused and > > > > said he was > > > > > absconding. The law says the police > have to > > follow due > > > > legal > > > > > process before declaring an accused as > > absconding. > > > > This includes > > > > > searches at his house and workplace in > view > > of > > > > independent > > > > > witnesses, and recording statements > from > > neighbours to > > > > establish > > > > > that the accused has not been seen for > a > > long time. > > > > The Ahmedabad > > > > > police did not bother with this > exercise. > > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based > on a > > letter he > > > > wrote to > > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan > Ahmad > > Ali. Dated > > > > August 7, > > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > > terrorist > > > > training or any > > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply > said: > > “You had > > > > come [to > > > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ > > (important > > > > goal).” With a giant > > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim > that > > the words > > > > “ahem maqsad” > > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for > terrorist > > training. > > > > Haleem wrote > > > > > that six of the children were orphans > and > > the rest > > > > poor. He > > > > > concluded the letter saying: “I > believe > > that by > > >> god’s grace you > > > > > will certainly help me in this > educational > > and > > > > constructive > > > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his > > deposition > > > > before a Delhi > > > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem > said he > > was told > > > > the children will > > > > > get “a good education and decent > living” > > in > > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to > train > > the > > > > children as > > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > > hearing the > > > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate > from > > Kuwait, > > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > > years in jail. > > > > The court > > > > > accepted the police version even though > the > > only > > > > witnesses to the > > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > > Ahmad Ali had > > > > claimed that > > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he > was to > > board a > > > > flight to > > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as > proof. > > The judge > > > > ignored that. > > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at > the > > Delhi High > > > > Court against > > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > > twister: while > > > > they got > > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite > being > > convicted > > > > by the > > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by > the > > Gujarat High > > > > Court in > > > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ > although > > no guilt > > > > has yet been > > > > > established in that case and the > Gujarat > > crime branch > > > > admits their > > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the > alleged > > > > conspiracy. That’s > > > > > not all. > > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail > 56-year-old > > man named > > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX > case’. > > He proved > > > > doubly lucky > > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him > bail > > in the > > > > ‘terrorist > > > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its > > eye-opening bail > > > > order, the > > > > > judge said: “… All that remains > against > > the > > > > present applicant > > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad > and had > > visited > > > > camps to > > > > > identify the children so that they can > be > > better > > > > looked after. > > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > > offence.” > > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused > of > > exactly the > > > > same crime, > > > > > the argument should be valid for them, > too. > > Yet, > > > > another Gujarat > > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and > both > > continue to > > > > languish in > > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > > Ahmedabad because > > > > the Gujarat > > > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he > must > > report to > > > > the Crime > > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every > Sunday. On > > Sunday, > > > > July 27, the > > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited > the > > crime > > > > branch office > > > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me > four > > hours on the > > > > blasts,” > > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when > they > > let me > > > > go.” > > > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist > training > > case’ is > > > > nearly over. It is > > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > > called against > > > > Haleem, > > > > > since he is no more “absconding”. > > Meanwhile, > > > > Haleem’s family is > > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and > the > > next > > > > month’s house rent > > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she > has no > > savings. > > > > His lone > > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying > to run > > > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story > is > > anything but > > > > rare. One > > > > > glaring case concerns a “family of > > terrorists”. On > > > > July 15, a > > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > > Mohammad > > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > > as he returned home at night from his > > father’s > > > > workshop in > > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial > bomb > > blasts > > > > rocked > > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two > people, > > Hyderabad > > > > Police > > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the > Hindustan > > Times > > > > newspaper that, > > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had > confessed > > that before > > > > his arrest, > > > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to > > Karnataka and > > > > “arranged safe > > > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir > denies > > the > > > > confession. “I > > > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir > told > > his > > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the > jail on > > July 29. > > > > “The police > > > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her > son > > was tortured > > > > during what > > > > > the police commissioner calls > > “interrogation”. > > > > “He was hung upside > > > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession > made > > to the > > > > police is > > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > > (never mind > > > > that the news > > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > > Yasir’s alleged > > > > confession, > > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face > of the > > Hyderabad > > > > Police. > > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member > whose > > father and > > > > one brother > > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > > Yasir’s father, > > > > 56-yearold > > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > > wellrespected cleric > > > > who has now > > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in > Ahmedabad > > for nearly > > > > four years > > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up > to > > the Supreme > > > > Court. > > > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin > Nasir, > > is jailed > > > > in Karnataka’s > > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested > in > > January. > > > > > With his brother and father suspected > as > > dreaded > > > > terrorists, the > > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs > on > > Yasir all > > > > the time and > > > > > instantly known if he was aiding > terrorists. > > That the > > > > police > > > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe > > houses” for > > > > terrorists in > > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never > did > > any such > > > > thing. This > > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad > a > > month before > > > > his arrest, > >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > > engineering workshop > > > > that his > > > > > father had set up three decades ago > with > > borrowed > > > > money and skills > > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > > mechanic. In > > > > the din of > > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > > managing > > > > customers crowding > > > > > the small front office. “My father > and > > brother have > > > > been framed,” > > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > > seems a victim > > > > of patently > > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a > member of > > SIMI when > > > > it was > > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, > 2001. > > (Given the > > > > relentless > > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > > reader might > > > > find it hard > > > > > to believe that no court in India has > yet > > upheld the > > > > charge of > > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an > organisation.) > > Yasir > > > > echoed dozens > > > > > others interviewed by this reporter > across > > India in > > > > saying that > > > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep > religious > > training and > > > > self- > > > > > purification”, and not for acts of > > terrorism or > > > > anti-India > > > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of > > atrocities on > > > > Muslims from > > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. > “It > > never gave > > > > up the issue of > > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted > many of > > us.” > > > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, > the > > police > > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > > representatives in > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > under the Unlawful Activities > (Prevention) > > Act. A > > > > magistrate gave > > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, > the > > police > > > > slapped another > > > > > case against the three, alleging that > one of > > them was > > > > arrested > > > > > making a speech against the government. > The > > other two, > > > > including > > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They > went > > back to the > > > > court and > > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 > days > > before > > > > securing bail. > > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet > to > > begin. > > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, > a > > firebrand > > > > cleric who never > > > > > held his tongue in public speeches > against > > the > > > > government, > > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > > Masjid > > > > demolition and the > > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > > Embroiled in > > > > cooked-up > > > > > cases, in several of which he was > > subsequently > > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad > Police > > to report > > > > at their > > > > > office regularly. > > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > > Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > > the police station, he was arrested by > a > > police team > > > > from > > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement > in a > > terror > > > > conspiracy in > > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 > murder of > > former > > > > Gujarat Home > > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only > evidence > > against > > > > Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in > a > > letter to > > > > the court, he > > > > > has denied making.) > > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the > Maulana > > to the > > > > police station > > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At > this, > > Gujarat > > > > police > > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his > service > > revolver > > > > and shot dead > > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > > Nasiruddin’s > > > > supporters > > > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s > body > > unless the > > > > police filed > > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > > police filed > > > > two cases > > > > > back to back: One, their own, against > the > > protestors > > > > for blocking > > > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, > under > > pressure, > > > > against > > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the > protestor. > > > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an > inch > > in four > > > > years. The > > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized > his > > revolver and > > > > sent it for > > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > > bullet > > > > recovered from the > > > > > dead protestor’s body. They should > have > > arrested and > > > > produced Amin > > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > > open-and-shut case if > > > > there ever > > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > > matching the > > > > bullet, and > > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none > of > > this > > > > happened. Amin > > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > > Nasiruddin in his > > > > custody. The > > > > > FIR against him has become a dead > letter. > > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > > subsequently > > > > accused of > > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > > businessman > > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in > 2005 > > (as > > > > mentioned above > > > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, > Amin, > > too, is now > > > > in jail. > > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the > main > > complainant > > > > against > > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. > This is > > none > > > > other than 20- > > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s > > youngest son > > > > and Yasir’s > > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this > year, > > Nasir was > > > > arrested by > > > > > police in Karnataka with another person > and > > was > > > > accused of > > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were > allegedly > > riding. > > > > Claiming a > > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > > slapped charges > > > > such as > > > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir > and > > his > > > > co-accused. > > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > > confessions from the > > > > two accused > > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed > them > > saying they > > > > were SIMI > > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > > confessions in > > > > which they > > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members > and > > the > > > > attendant terror > > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the > police > > failed to > > > > file a > > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed > at the > > > > magistrate’s house who > > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as > per > > law. But > > > > by this time, > > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in > another > > case of > > > > conspiracy, so > > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir > has > > retracted > > > > his > > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he > has > > little hope > > > > against > > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the > two > > accused to > > > > police > > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana > the > > following > > > > in an interview: > > > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary > > papers > > > > remanding them to > > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > > accused] > > > > stepped forward > > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me > that > > the > > > > police denied > > > > > them food and water and subjected them > to > > repeated > > > > beatings. He > > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > > Nasir’s body. > > > > The two > > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human > rights > > violation > > > > by the > > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > > “I was very surprised by three > things: > > they were > > > > talking of their > > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > > manner, they > > > > spoke English > > > > > and, further, they readily admitted > that > > they had > > > > stolen the bike, > > > > > something most thieves never do in my > > experience.” > > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > > magistrate > > > > “warning” that > > > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to > judicial > > custody, > > > > the magistrate > > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to > this > > house. “The > > > > materials > > > > > produced before me included duplicate > > identity cards, > > > > a fancy > > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red > marks > > against > > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper > with > > www.com > > > > written on > > > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back > me’ on > > another. > > > > > “When I looked at these materials in > their > > entirety, > > > > I felt that > > > > > these were definitely not just bike > thieves. > > Why would > > > > bike > > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > > cards and a > > > > map of South > > > > > India? The fact that they had an > American > > dollar > > > > seemed to suggest > > > > > they had international links. The paper > with > > www.com > > > > indicated to > > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > > piece of paper > > > > had a > > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of > code > > that I could > > > > not > > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I > examined > > the South > > > > India map, > > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a > red > > marker > > > > against it. > > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at > the > > place > > > > during a > > > > > religious function. > > > > > “All these suggested that there were > > definitely > > > > enough grounds in > > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody > of > > Nasir and > > > > Asadullah to > > > > > facilitate further investigations.” > Go > > figure. > > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > > Muqeemuddin > > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The > boys’ > > mother > > > > doesn’t think so. > > > > > “Why don’t the police put us all > > together in > > > > jail,” she told > > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > > “Then they can > > > > shoot all of > > > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >      Unlimited freedom, unlimited > storage. > > Get it now, > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > > media and the > > > > city. > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > > list > > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >      Did you know? You can CHAT without > downloading > > messenger. Go > > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > > > > >      Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > >      Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/       Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ Check out the all-new face of Yahoo! India. Go to http://in.yahoo.com/ From parthaekka at gmail.com Mon Aug 11 09:06:00 2008 From: parthaekka at gmail.com (Partha Dasgupta) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 09:06:00 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... In-Reply-To: <603270.13637.qm@web31503.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <603270.13637.qm@web31503.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <32144e990808102036n7652639bx98edfaac4dc63af6@mail.gmail.com> Hi, 1. Some basics are expected by every 'citizen' - including the right to freedom of expression, religion, basic amenties, etc. 2. It is common knowledge that these are not available. 3. How is it that if a Muslim laments his / her state in life or state or clustering as a terrorist because one member of the religion commits an act considered as terrorism is justified - WHEN we refuse to attach the same label to those who killed Muslims in Gujarat, or even close our eyes to the LTTE? 4. Would also like to know which statement has been construed as "insulting motherland" If you still feel that this will "confuse the basic issue" do let me know. Will be glad to clarify further. Rgds, Partha ....................... On Sun, Aug 10, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > Let us not mix things like this and confuse the basic issue.Making > improvement and insulting motherland are two different issues.It needs no > further discussion. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: S.Fatima > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net; Prabhakar Singh > Cc: sarai > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 7:34:05 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > > Dear Prabhakar Singh > I am not sure if I am proud of my motherland, but I certainly try to make > improvements by paying my taxes, not bribing the traffic cop, not dirtying > the roads, and not participating in any kind of hate-mongering or violence. > Why should one leave one's homeland. How can one make improvements in one's > country if one is not allowed to criticize it. > > I don't think being proud of one's motherland is a pre-requisit of being a > citizen of a country. > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > > From: Prabhakar Singh > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Cc: "sarai" > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 3:07 PM > > If India as a country is so bad why do we choose to live > > here at all? We don't deserve to be called Indians if we > > are not proud of our nation.We should try to make improvemet > > rather than codemning our own motherland.Freedom of > > expression does not mean that one can insult our nation like > > this.Such outrageous comments should not be allowed.The > > moderator of the forum needs to explain this now. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: S.Fatima > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Cc: sarai > > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 2:24:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > > ... > > > > Dear Radhika > > I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but > > the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and > > more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror > > for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the > > mainstream media. They keep inventing new terms everyday. > > So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your > > rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI > > editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If > > common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of > > RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror > > during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their > > subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would > > be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you > > must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims > > in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely > > more than defending. That's planned genocide of a > > community. > > > > Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of > > India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all > > humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is > > invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say > > of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India > > whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and > > MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. > > > > > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > wrote: > > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > > name of fighting terrorism > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > > > Dear Sadia, > > > > > > your query looks absurd on the face of it because > > > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > > > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 > > years, > > > always tolerent of the invaders be it the moghuls or > > later > > > christian missionaries converting to increase the > > numerical > > > strength of the "community. > > > > > > Muslims demanded a land and nation for > > themselves, a > > > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, > > but > > > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , > > free > > > india, secular nation, not a hindu nation, > > showcasing the > > > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to > > blame > > > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their > > promise when > > > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to > > stay > > > back. > > > > > > Next, as a community, why muslims are not > > identifying the > > > "fasaadis" in their community who are > > terming > > > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in > > to > > > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not > > tolerate, > > > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try > > to > > > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of > > islam, > > > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let > > the > > > muslim community take steps to identify the > > terrorsists or > > > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of > > rule > > > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > > > > > > In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > > > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" > > lawyers > > > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no > > way > > > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > > > jihaadi by default.! > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > > name of > > > fighting terrorism > > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Cc: sarai > > > > > > > Dear Radhika > > > > > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father > > of > > > the nation, mahatma > > > > that they will stay back in India as brothers > > with > > > their hindu > > > > community" > > > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath > > to > > > live as > > > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others > > as > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims > > in > > > the name of > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all > > those > > > terrorists who > > > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are > > muslims. > > > > > > > > > > When the community of muslims forgot > > their > > > solemn oath > > > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they > > will > > > stay back in > > > > > India as brothers with their hindu > > community, > > > many were > > > > > sceptical, for one, as the population > > increases > > > the muslim > > > > > community along with other segments of > > sovciety > > > also did > > > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks > > to > > > the politics > > > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > > > linguistic , > > > > > caste and faith segments, the national > > exchequer > > > never > > > > > reached the grass root level of the populace > > and > > > citizens in > > > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > > > governance > > > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > > > > > > The muslim community in general had > > lower > > > percentage of > > > > > educated men and women, who instead of > > having > > > concern for > > > > > their community, is seen more in nesting > > their > > > own homes > > > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > > > transactions, > > > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > > > wherever the > > > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > > > rules on > > > > > society are all the reasons along with > > political > > > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures > > of > > > patronising > > > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > > > wondering where he > > > > > belonged to. ! > > > > > > > > > > The subsequent generations of muslims, > > > particularly > > > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding > > more > > > say in the > > > > > governance along with dalits and other > > suppressed > > > and > > > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > > > breeding of > > > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing > > the > > > issues used > > > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the > > passions > > > on some > > > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > > > dangers from > > > > > "communal " parties totally > > loosing > > > sight of > > > > > communalism played by so called secular > > parties.! > > > > > > > > > > In the entire process, the muslim youth > > who is > > > found > > > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those > > elements in > > > society who > > > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > > > terorists, use the > > > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > > > > > > Only solution to terror is handle the > > elements > > > who > > > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > > > terrorise them > > > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle > > the > > > deviant > > > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or > > favour > > > of vote > > > > > banks. > > > > > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > > the > > > name of > > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > > > A cleric's dubious arrest over the > > > Ahmedabad blasts > > > > > is just the > > > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by > > AJIT > > > SAHI exposes > > > > > the random > > > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp > )> > > > > AS HE'D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > > > decades, Maulana > > > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and > > began to > > > speak to > > > > > the faithful > > > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > > > soft-spoken, > > > > > revered aalim, > > > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores > > of > > > Muslims in > > > > > the hour- > > > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque > > in one > > > of > > > > > Ahmedabad's Muslim > > > > > > localities where the preacher and many > > in > > > his > > > > > congregation live. > > > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > > > Muslim's duty > > > > > towards his > > > > > > neighbours. "You cannot fill your > > stomach > > > if your > > > > > neighbour is > > > > > > hungry," Haleem spoke in his > > unhurried > > > tone. "You > > > > > cannot > > > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and > > Muslim > > > > > neighbours." > > > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of > > the > > > serial > > > > > blasts that > > > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on > > Saturday, > > > policemen > > > > > stormed > > > > > > Haleem's house barely a km from the > > mosque > > > and > > > > > dragged him away as > > > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On > > Monday, > > > as a local > > > > > magistrate > > > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for > > two > > > weeks, > > > > > police claimed > > > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the > > Saturday > > > blasts and > > > > > that grilling > > > > > > him would unravel the execution of and > > the > > > conspiracy > > > > > behind the > > > > > > terror act. > > > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, > > everybody, > > > > > justifiably, wants > > > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The > > challenge > > > then is > > > > > not to reach > > > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > > > demonisations. > > > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > > > challenge. Over > > > > > the years, for > > > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > > > acronym for most > > > > > Indians — > > > > > > Students' Islamic Movement of India, > > a > > > hotbed of > > > > > terrorism, a > > > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent > > on > > > destroying > > > > > the nation. > > > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific > > blast, > > > that name > > > > > is thrust > > > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly > > innuendo > > > — > > > > > stretching outwards > > > > > > to embrace the entire community. But > > how > > > true are > > > > > these allegations? > > > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe > > society, > > > it is > > > > > crucial to find > > > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > > > crucial to > > > > > cleave doggedly > > > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of > > law; > > > crucial not > > > > > to fall prey > > > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In > > pursuit > > > of this, > > > > > in an > > > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, > > TEHELKA > > > conducted > > > > > an > > > > > > investigation across India over three > > months > > > and 12 > > > > > cities. > > > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, > > the > > > disturbing > > > > > investigation > > > > > > found that an overwhelming majority of > > > terrorism cases > > > > > — > > > > > > especially those related to the > > outlawed > > > SIMI — are > > > > > based on > > > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent > > evidence > > > and are an > > > > > affront to > > > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > > > prejudices in > > > > > the > > > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject > > lack > > > of > > > > > political will > > > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 > > news > > > media that > > > > > demands > > > > > > instant whodunit answers and > > unquestioningly > > > > > copy-pastes every > > > > > > unproven police and intelligence story > > on > > > terrorist > > > > > networks has > > > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > > > hundreds of > > > > > people falsely > > > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of > > these > > > are Muslim; > > > > > nearly all > > > > > > of these are poor. > > > > > > "We will rise to the challenge and I > > am > > > confident we > > > > > will be able > > > > > > to defeat these forces," Prime > > Minister > > > Manmohan > > > > > Singh said as he > > > > > > walked about in the debris at > > Ahmedabad's > > > civil > > > > > hospital, where > > > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > > > casualties. He > > > > > urged political > > > > > > parties and police and intelligence > > agencies > > > to work > > > > > together > > > > > > against efforts aimed at "destroying > > our > > > social > > > > > fabric, > > > > > > undermining communal harmony." > > > Unfortunately, given > > > > > their > > > > > > staggering record of false cases > > against > > > innocent > > > > > people, it > > > > > > appears that incompetent police and > > > intelligence > > > > > agencies are > > > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem's story, > > chronicled > > > below, is a > > > > > searing > > > > > > example why. > > > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in > > the > > > stenographic > > > > > news media, > > > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a > > SIMI > > > member > > > > > linked with > > > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased > > terrorists. > > > Gujarat > > > > > government's > > > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > > > Haleem sent > > > > > Muslim youth > > > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to > > train as > > > terrorists > > > > > to avenge > > > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in > > the > > > state. He > > > > > said they > > > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate > > BJP > > > leader LK > > > > > Advani and > > > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. > > Police > > > have said > > > > > Haleem was > > > > > > absconding since he was named an > > accused in > > > this case > > > > > in 2002. > > > > > > TEHELKA's investigation in Ahmedabad > > > following the > > > > > cleric's arrest > > > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, > > documentary > > > and > > > > > circumstantial, > > > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has > > lived > > > at his > > > > > house — which is > > > > > > less than a km from the local police > > station > > > — for > > > > > years and led a > > > > > > public life within his community. The > > charge > > > against > > > > > him that he > > > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > > > highly dubious > > > > > based as it > > > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > > > contents > > > > > don't remotely > > > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And > > until > > > Saturday's > > > > > bomb blasts, > > > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called > > Haleem a > > > SIMI > > > > > member. > > > > > > If anything, Haleem's family and > > followers > > > say > > > > > police have > > > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > > > helping victims > > > > > of the 2002 > > > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May > > 27, > > > an > > > > > inspector from the > > > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > > > handwritten > > > > > notice in > > > > > > Gujarati. It said: "An office of > > Markaz > > > Ahle-Hadis > > > > > [the Islamic > > > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > > > belong] Trust > > > > > has been > > > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan > > Shopping > > > Centre. > > > > > You are its > > > > > > head… Many members have been > > appointed in > > > it. You > > > > > are directed to > > > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses > > and > > > phone > > > > > numbers." > > > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such > > a > > > demand on a > > > > > trust > > > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > > > charge against > > > > > it, the > > > > > > letter proves the police knew > > Haleem's > > > whereabouts > > > > > and were in > > > > > > touch with him as late as two months > > ago. > > > Indeed, the > > > > > notice > > > > > > mentions Haleem's home address: 2, > > Devi > > > Park > > > > > Society, near > > > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem's family > > has > > > proof that > > > > > the police > > > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem > > rushed > > > telegrams to > > > > > Gujarat's > > > > > > director-general of police and > > Ahmedabad's > > > police > > > > > commissioner > > > > > > claiming that the police forcibly > > entered > > > his house > > > > > that day and > > > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > > > absence. "We > > > > > are peace- > > > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and > > have > > > never been > > > > > part of any > > > > > > illegal activity," Haleem wrote the > > > telegram in > > > > > Hindi. "The police > > > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my > > family > > > without > > > > > appropriate > > > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > > > rights." > > > > > Predictably, he > > > > > > didn't hear from either officer. > > > > > > In April, when a local outfit called > > Social > > > Unity > > > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as > > its > > > members, > > > > > organised a > > > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to > > the > > > police > > > > > seeking permission > > > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > > > clearly > > > > > mentioned that > > > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > > > event. > > > > > Haleem's family > > > > > > also offers his driving licence, > > renewed by > > > the > > > > > Ahmedabad > > > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, > > as > > > proof that > > > > > he led a > > > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, > > in > > > July 2005, > > > > > the Gujarati > > > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > > > Haleem's > > > > > picture with a > > > > > > statement he released at a press > > conference > > > giving his > > > > > views on a > > > > > > raging controversy over the alleged > > rape of > > > a woman, > > > > > Imrana, by > > > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > > > Pradesh. > > > > > > "It is crazy that we have to prove > > Maulana > > > > > Haleem's innocence," > > > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > > > appealed to the > > > > > Gujarat > > > > > > governor to secure the cleric's > > release. > > > Adds Nazir, > > > > > in whose > > > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family > > as > > > tenant: "I > > > > > have known > > > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > > > religion and has > > > > > never > > > > > > indulged in terrorism." Says > > Haleem's > > > wife Noor > > > > > Saba: "I swear by > > > > > > my children that my husband is not a > > > terrorist. He is > > > > > being framed." > > > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable > > in the > > > > > cleric's > > > > > > neighbourhood. "Maulana Haleem has > > helped > > > hundreds > > > > > in their daily > > > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > > > patience and > > > > > fortitude," > > > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a > > 27-year-old > > > embroiderer. > > > > > Haq fishes > > > > > > out his marriage certificate, the > > nikaahnama > > > the > > > > > Maulana signed > > > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June > > 1, to > > > show that > > > > > Haleem > > > > > > wasn't any absconder. Haleem had > > delivered > > > a sermon > > > > > to the guests > > > > > > at Haq's wedding over loudspeakers > > that > > > Haq had > > > > > installed — with > > > > > > police permission. > > > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > > > hails from > > > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. > > He is > > > a preacher > > > > > with a > > > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle > > Hadis > > > that began > > > > > on the > > > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > > > survived a > > > > > frowning Sunni > > > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by > > the > > > Hadis — > > > > > the oral > > > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad's life > > — > > > as a > > > > > guiding principle for > > > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The > > news > > > media have > > > > > long > > > > > > parroted the police's insinuation > > that > > > Ahle-Hadis is > > > > > a terrorist > > > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. > > The > > > police claim > > > > > its members > > > > > > include many terror accused such as > > those of > > > the July > > > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > > > membership of > > > > > 30 million in > > > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out > > that > > > Union > > > > > Home Minister > > > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at > > its > > > national > > > > > symposium two > > > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd > > Ahle > > > Hadis > > > > > followers for 14 > > > > > > years, resigning three years ago to > > minister > > > a small > > > > > mosque so he > > > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to > > earn a > > > regular > > > > > income to > > > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the > > oldest > > > two of > > > > > whom study at > > > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > > > HALEEM'S TROUBLES had begun soon > > after the > > > 2002 > > > > > anti-Muslim > > > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved > > himself > > > in relief > > > > > work at the > > > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim > > refugees. > > > An > > > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in > > Kuwait and > > > was > > > > > visiting his > > > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two > > other > > > Muslims. One > > > > > of them was > > > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who > > also > > > lived in > > > > > Kuwait. The > > > > > > other was a small-time trader from > > > Moradabad. The > > > > > three wanted to > > > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the > > 2002 > > > violence > > > > > by bringing > > > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem > > took > > > them to > > > > > four refugee > > > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > > > saying it had > > > > > found 34 > > > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned > > the > > > Kuwait > > > > > expatriate, who > > > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote > > to him > > > about the > > > > > offer. But > > > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > > > importantly, > > > > > no children > > > > > > were ever sent. > > > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, > > Delhi > > > Police > > > > > arrested Shahid > > > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from > > Kuwait > > > allegedly > > > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > > > Moradabad trader > > > > > was also > > > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three > > were > > > charged > > > > > under the > > > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for > > conspiring > > > to carry > > > > > out terrorist > > > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem's > > letter > > > (about the > > > > > camp's offer > > > > > > of the orphan children) with the > > expatriate > > > from > > > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > > > police there > > > > > were informed. > > > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer > > DG > > > Vanzara > > > > > called in Haleem > > > > > > and detained him — illegally — for > > five > > > days. > > > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat > > businessman > > > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him > > off as > > > a > > > > > terrorist.) Haleem's > > > > > > family frantically filed a petition > > with the > > > Gujarat > > > > > High Court to > > > > > > secure his release. "The judge > > ordered the > > > police to > > > > > bring Haleem > > > > > > to the court in two hours," recalls > > the > > > > > > family's lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > > > police > > > > > instantly released > > > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where > > his > > > statement on > > > > > his illegal > > > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part > > of > > > official > > > > > documents. > > > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the 'RDX > > > case' > > > > > against the two > > > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and > > the > > > Moradabad > > > > > trader, police > > > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case > > against > > > the same > > > > > individuals > > > > > > for "luring Muslim youth to train as > > > terrorists in > > > > > Moradabad". > > > > > > This is the case the police and the > > media > > > have > > > > > referred since > > > > > > Haleem's arrest for the July 26 bomb > > > blasts to argue > > > > > that the > > > > > > cleric was involved in "sending > > Muslim > > > youth to > > > > > train as > > > > > > terrorists". The Gujarat government > > lawyer > > > was > > > > > openly lying on > > > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > > > Haleem had > > > > > sent "30 youth" > > > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. > > The > > > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > > > conspiracy had > > > > > remained on > > > > > > paper and no children ever travelled > > from > > > Ahmedabad to > > > > > Moradabad. > > > > > > While Delhi's 'RDX case' named > > Haleem > > > a witness, > > > > > Ahmedabad's > > > > > > 'terrorist training case' named him > > an > > > accused and > > > > > said he was > > > > > > absconding. The law says the police > > have to > > > follow due > > > > > legal > > > > > > process before declaring an accused as > > > absconding. > > > > > This includes > > > > > > searches at his house and workplace in > > view > > > of > > > > > independent > > > > > > witnesses, and recording statements > > from > > > neighbours to > > > > > establish > > > > > > that the accused has not been seen for > > a > > > long time. > > > > > The Ahmedabad > > > > > > police did not bother with this > > exercise. > > > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based > > on a > > > letter he > > > > > wrote to > > > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan > > Ahmad > > > Ali. Dated > > > > > August 7, > > > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > > > terrorist > > > > > training or any > > > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply > > said: > > > "You had > > > > > come [to > > > > > > Ahmedabad] with an 'ahem maqsad' > > > (important > > > > > goal)." With a giant > > > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim > > that > > > the words > > > > > "ahem maqsad" > > > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for > > terrorist > > > training. > > > > > Haleem wrote > > > > > > that six of the children were orphans > > and > > > the rest > > > > > poor. He > > > > > > concluded the letter saying: "I > > believe > > > that by > > > >> god's grace you > > > > > > will certainly help me in this > > educational > > > and > > > > > constructive > > > > > > mission to propagate Islam." In his > > > deposition > > > > > before a Delhi > > > > > > court in the 'RDX case', Haleem > > said he > > > was told > > > > > the children will > > > > > > get "a good education and decent > > living" > > > in > > > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to > > train > > > the > > > > > children as > > > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > > > hearing the > > > > > 'RDX case' found > > > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate > > from > > > Kuwait, > > > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > > > years in jail. > > > > > The court > > > > > > accepted the police version even though > > the > > > only > > > > > witnesses to the > > > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > > > Ahmad Ali had > > > > > claimed that > > > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he > > was to > > > board a > > > > > flight to > > > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as > > proof. > > > The judge > > > > > ignored that. > > > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at > > the > > > Delhi High > > > > > Court against > > > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > > > twister: while > > > > > they got > > > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite > > being > > > convicted > > > > > by the > > > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by > > the > > > Gujarat High > > > > > Court in > > > > > > the 'terrorist training case' > > although > > > no guilt > > > > > has yet been > > > > > > established in that case and the > > Gujarat > > > crime branch > > > > > admits their > > > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the > > alleged > > > > > conspiracy. That's > > > > > > not all. > > > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail > > 56-year-old > > > man named > > > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the 'RDX > > case'. > > > He proved > > > > > doubly lucky > > > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him > > bail > > > in the > > > > > 'terrorist > > > > > > training case' in June 2004. In its > > > eye-opening bail > > > > > order, the > > > > > > judge said: "… All that remains > > against > > > the > > > > > present applicant > > > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad > > and had > > > visited > > > > > camps to > > > > > > identify the children so that they can > > be > > > better > > > > > looked after. > > > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > > > offence." > > > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused > > of > > > exactly the > > > > > same crime, > > > > > > the argument should be valid for them, > > too. > > > Yet, > > > > > another Gujarat > > > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and > > both > > > continue to > > > > > languish in > > > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > > > Ahmedabad because > > > > > the Gujarat > > > > > > High Court's 2004 bail order said he > > must > > > report to > > > > > the Crime > > > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every > > Sunday. On > > > Sunday, > > > > > July 27, the > > > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited > > the > > > crime > > > > > branch office > > > > > > with trepidation. "They grilled me > > four > > > hours on the > > > > > blasts," > > > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. "I was glad when > > they > > > let me > > > > > go." > > > > > > The hearing in the 'terrorist > > training > > > case' is > > > > > nearly over. It is > > > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > > > called against > > > > > Haleem, > > > > > > since he is no more "absconding". > > > Meanwhile, > > > > > Haleem's family is > > > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and > > the > > > next > > > > > month's house rent > > > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem's wife says she > > has no > > > savings. > > > > > His lone > > > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying > > to run > > > > > Haleem's scrap shop. > > > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem's story > > is > > > anything but > > > > > rare. One > > > > > > glaring case concerns a "family of > > > terrorists". On > > > > > July 15, a > > > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > > > Mohammad > > > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > > > as he returned home at night from his > > > father's > > > > > workshop in > > > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial > > bomb > > > blasts > > > > > rocked > > > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two > > people, > > > Hyderabad > > > > > Police > > > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the > > Hindustan > > > Times > > > > > newspaper that, > > > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had > > confessed > > > that before > > > > > his arrest, > > > > > > he had taken terror "operatives" to > > > Karnataka and > > > > > "arranged safe > > > > > > houses" for them. Of course, Yasir > > denies > > > the > > > > > confession. "I > > > > > > haven't told them anything," Yasir > > told > > > his > > > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the > > jail on > > > July 29. > > > > > "The police > > > > > > are lying." Fatima told TEHELKA her > > son > > > was tortured > > > > > during what > > > > > > the police commissioner calls > > > "interrogation". > > > > > "He was hung upside > > > > > > down and beaten," she said. > > > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession > > made > > > to the > > > > > police is > > > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > > > (never mind > > > > > that the news > > > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > > > Yasir's alleged > > > > > confession, > > > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face > > of the > > > Hyderabad > > > > > Police. > > > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member > > whose > > > father and > > > > > one brother > > > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > > > Yasir's father, > > > > > 56-yearold > > > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > > > wellrespected cleric > > > > > who has now > > > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in > > Ahmedabad > > > for nearly > > > > > four years > > > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up > > to > > > the Supreme > > > > > Court. > > > > > > Yasir's younger brother, Riasuddin > > Nasir, > > > is jailed > > > > > in Karnataka's > > > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested > > in > > > January. > > > > > > With his brother and father suspected > > as > > > dreaded > > > > > terrorists, the > > > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs > > on > > > Yasir all > > > > > the time and > > > > > > instantly known if he was aiding > > terrorists. > > > That the > > > > > police > > > > > > didn't catch Yasir "arranging safe > > > houses" for > > > > > terrorists in > > > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never > > did > > > any such > > > > > thing. This > > > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad > > a > > > month before > > > > > his arrest, > > >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > > > engineering workshop > > > > > that his > > > > > > father had set up three decades ago > > with > > > borrowed > > > > > money and skills > > > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > > > mechanic. In > > > > > the din of > > > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > > > managing > > > > > customers crowding > > > > > > the small front office. "My father > > and > > > brother have > > > > > been framed," > > > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > > > seems a victim > > > > > of patently > > > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a > > member of > > > SIMI when > > > > > it was > > > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, > > 2001. > > > (Given the > > > > > relentless > > > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > > > reader might > > > > > find it hard > > > > > > to believe that no court in India has > > yet > > > upheld the > > > > > charge of > > > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an > > organisation.) > > > Yasir > > > > > echoed dozens > > > > > > others interviewed by this reporter > > across > > > India in > > > > > saying that > > > > > > SIMI was a platform for "deep > > religious > > > training and > > > > > self- > > > > > > purification", and not for acts of > > > terrorism or > > > > > anti-India > > > > > > conspiracies. "SIMI took up issues of > > > atrocities on > > > > > Muslims from > > > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir," Yasir said. > > "It > > > never gave > > > > > up the issue of > > > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted > > many of > > > us." > > > > > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, > > the > > > police > > > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > > > representatives in > > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > > under the Unlawful Activities > > (Prevention) > > > Act. A > > > > > magistrate gave > > > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, > > the > > > police > > > > > slapped another > > > > > > case against the three, alleging that > > one of > > > them was > > > > > arrested > > > > > > making a speech against the government. > > The > > > other two, > > > > > including > > > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They > > went > > > back to the > > > > > court and > > > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 > > days > > > before > > > > > securing bail. > > > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet > > to > > > begin. > > > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir's father, > > a > > > firebrand > > > > > cleric who never > > > > > > held his tongue in public speeches > > against > > > the > > > > > government, > > > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > > > Masjid > > > > > demolition and the > > > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > > > Embroiled in > > > > > cooked-up > > > > > > cases, in several of which he was > > > subsequently > > > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad > > Police > > > to report > > > > > at their > > > > > > office regularly. > > > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > > > Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > > > the police station, he was arrested by > > a > > > police team > > > > > from > > > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement > > in a > > > terror > > > > > conspiracy in > > > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 > > murder of > > > former > > > > > Gujarat Home > > > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only > > evidence > > > against > > > > > Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in > > a > > > letter to > > > > > the court, he > > > > > > has denied making.) > > > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the > > Maulana > > > to the > > > > > police station > > > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At > > this, > > > Gujarat > > > > > police > > > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his > > service > > > revolver > > > > > and shot dead > > > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > > > Nasiruddin's > > > > > supporters > > > > > > refused to move the dead protestor's > > body > > > unless the > > > > > police filed > > > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > > > police filed > > > > > two cases > > > > > > back to back: One, their own, against > > the > > > protestors > > > > > for blocking > > > > > > the Maulana's arrest; and the other, > > under > > > pressure, > > > > > against > > > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the > > protestor. > > > > > > The case against Amin hasn't moved an > > inch > > > in four > > > > > years. The > > > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized > > his > > > revolver and > > > > > sent it for > > > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > > > bullet > > > > > recovered from the > > > > > > dead protestor's body. They should > > have > > > arrested and > > > > > produced Amin > > > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > > > open-and-shut case if > > > > > there ever > > > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > > > matching the > > > > > bullet, and > > > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none > > of > > > this > > > > > happened. Amin > > > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > > > Nasiruddin in his > > > > > custody. The > > > > > > FIR against him has become a dead > > letter. > > > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > > > subsequently > > > > > accused of > > > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > > > businessman > > > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in > > 2005 > > > (as > > > > > mentioned above > > > > > > in Haleem's story). Like Vanzara, > > Amin, > > > too, is now > > > > > in jail. > > > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the > > main > > > complainant > > > > > against > > > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. > > This is > > > none > > > > > other than 20- > > > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin's > > > youngest son > > > > > and Yasir's > > > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this > > year, > > > Nasir was > > > > > arrested by > > > > > > police in Karnataka with another person > > and > > > was > > > > > accused of > > > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were > > allegedly > > > riding. > > > > > Claiming a > > > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > > > slapped charges > > > > > such as > > > > > > 'waging war against State' on Nasir > > and > > > his > > > > > co-accused. > > > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > > > confessions from the > > > > > two accused > > > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed > > them > > > saying they > > > > > were SIMI > > > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > > > confessions in > > > > > which they > > > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members > > and > > > the > > > > > attendant terror > > > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the > > police > > > failed to > > > > > file a > > > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir's lawyer landed > > at the > > > > > magistrate's house who > > > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as > > per > > > law. But > > > > > by this time, > > > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in > > another > > > case of > > > > > conspiracy, so > > > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir > > has > > > retracted > > > > > his > > > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he > > has > > > little hope > > > > > against > > > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the > > two > > > accused to > > > > > police > > > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana > > the > > > following > > > > > in an interview: > > > > > > "Even as I was signing the necessary > > > papers > > > > > remanding them to > > > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > > > accused] > > > > > stepped forward > > > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me > > that > > > the > > > > > police denied > > > > > > them food and water and subjected them > > to > > > repeated > > > > > beatings. He > > > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > > > Nasir's body. > > > > > The two > > > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human > > rights > > > violation > > > > > by the > > > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > > > "I was very surprised by three > > things: > > > they were > > > > > talking of their > > > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > > > manner, they > > > > > spoke English > > > > > > and, further, they readily admitted > > that > > > they had > > > > > stolen the bike, > > > > > > something most thieves never do in my > > > experience." > > > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > > > magistrate > > > > > "warning" that > > > > > > the accused shouldn't be sent to > > judicial > > > custody, > > > > > the magistrate > > > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to > > this > > > house. "The > > > > > materials > > > > > > produced before me included duplicate > > > identity cards, > > > > > a fancy > > > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red > > marks > > > against > > > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper > > with > > > www.com > > > > > written on > > > > > > one and 'Jungle King behind back > > me' on > > > another. > > > > > > "When I looked at these materials in > > their > > > entirety, > > > > > I felt that > > > > > > these were definitely not just bike > > thieves. > > > Why would > > > > > bike > > > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > > > cards and a > > > > > map of South > > > > > > India? The fact that they had an > > American > > > dollar > > > > > seemed to suggest > > > > > > they had international links. The paper > > with > > > www.com > > > > > indicated to > > > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > > > piece of paper > > > > > had a > > > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of > > code > > > that I could > > > > > not > > > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I > > examined > > > the South > > > > > India map, > > > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a > > red > > > marker > > > > > against it. > > > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at > > the > > > place > > > > > during a > > > > > > religious function. > > > > > > "All these suggested that there were > > > definitely > > > > > enough grounds in > > > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody > > of > > > Nasir and > > > > > Asadullah to > > > > > > facilitate further investigations." > > Go > > > figure. > > > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > > > Muqeemuddin > > > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The > > boys' > > > mother > > > > > doesn't think so. > > > > > > "Why don't the police put us all > > > together in > > > > > jail," she told > > > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > > > "Then they can > > > > > shoot all of > > > > > > us dead." • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited > > storage. > > > Get it now, > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > > > media and the > > > > > city. > > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > > > list > > > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without > > downloading > > > messenger. Go > > > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > > messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > > header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > Check out the all-new face of Yahoo! India. Go to > http://in.yahoo.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > -- Partha Dasgupta +919811047132 From machleetank at gmail.com Sun Aug 10 06:03:41 2008 From: machleetank at gmail.com (Jasmeen Patheja) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2008 02:33:41 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Blank Noise Spectators Special: deadline Message-ID: Hello, A quick reminder- the deadline for your submission for Blank Noise Spectators Special is Aug 15th. http://blog.blanknoise.org/2008/07/blank-noise-spectators-special-until.html By this we mean you have to write either to a spectator of street sexual harassment or about being a spectator to street sexual harassment and email it to us. All contributions will be shared at http://blanknoisespectators.blogspot.com/ Looking forward to hearing from you soon. Best wishes, Blank Noise Team -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Mon Aug 11 13:11:39 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 07:41:39 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Book Review: Lentha - Mujahid Ki Dairy (Urdu) In-Reply-To: <32144e990808102036n7652639bx98edfaac4dc63af6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <455282.93546.qm@web27806.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Lentha: Mujahid ki Diary (Urdu) By Lt. Colonel Mohammad Abdul Haq Mirza Sher Jang Compiled by Anwar Ayub Raja Bradford: The Book Centre, 2004 Review by Murtaza Shibli 10 August 2008 A story of love, betrayal, emotion, intrigues and misfortune, this is a diary of a dejected and displaced Kashmiri who is thrown into the thick of action due to the love of his motherland. He is an embodiment of the festering wound that Kashmir has become. It offers a rare opportunity to reflect upon the political uncertainty and servitude that have become the collective experience of Kashmiris.  http://www.kashmiraffairs.org/lentha_shibli.html __________________________________________________________ Not happy with your email address?. Get the one you really want - millions of new email addresses available now at Yahoo! http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/ymail/new.html From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Mon Aug 11 15:36:20 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 15:06:20 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... In-Reply-To: <356330.8327.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <651051.87288.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <356330.8327.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Sadia, One can be proud of their mother and father, their place of birth and their nation or leave without any of that feel for the same, that is the freedom, but to say that I am not sure to be proud of the nation is like ostrich hiding its head in sand and refusing to see the reality. In any nation, there are good and bad issues to be sorted out and solved , atleast efforts to solve them, as citizens of the nation. It is not my purpose or intention to debate, but only exchange of thoughts with the readers on the list. Why is it that common muslim not averse to identify, isolate the trouble-makers in their own community.? VHP and Bhajrang dal are reactions to actions of fanatic actions, which are bound to be there, because, in 1947 when hindus were raped, attacked and chased out of kashmir to get majority for muslims, it was not taken seriously by the hindu society, at that time it was "pandits" but with vote bank politics of communities playing major role, with caste vote banks having a say in governance, hindu society has realised that united as they stand, they gain respect, so today attack on any hindu from any caste is attack on hindu. Hence the reaction of retaliation as violence begets only more of it. Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: "S.Fatima" Date: Sunday, August 10, 2008 8:04 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net, Prabhakar Singh Cc: sarai > Dear Prabhakar Singh > I am not sure if I am proud of my motherland, but I certainly try > to make improvements by paying my taxes, not bribing the traffic > cop, not dirtying the roads, and not participating in any kind of > hate-mongering or violence. Why should one leave one's homeland. > How can one make improvements in one's country if one is not > allowed to criticize it. > > I don't think being proud of one's motherland is a pre-requisit of > being a citizen of a country. > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > > From: Prabhakar Singh > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Cc: "sarai" > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 3:07 PM > > If India as a country is so bad why do we choose to live > > here at all? We don't deserve to be called Indians if we > > are not proud of our nation.We should try to make improvemet > > rather than codemning our own motherland.Freedom of > > expression does not mean that one can insult our nation like > > this.Such outrageous comments should not be allowed.The > > moderator of the forum needs to explain this now. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: S.Fatima > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > Cc: sarai > > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 2:24:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > > ... > > > > Dear Radhika > > I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but > > the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and > > more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror > > for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the > > mainstream media. They keep inventing new terms everyday. > > So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your > > rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI > > editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If > > common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of > > RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror > > during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their > > subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would > > be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you > > must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims > > in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely > > more than defending. That's planned genocide of a > > community. > > > > Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of > > India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all > > humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is > > invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say > > of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India > > whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and > > MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. > > > > > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > wrote: > > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > > name of fighting terrorism > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > > > Dear Sadia, > > > > > > your query looks absurd on the face of it because > > > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > > > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 > > years, > > > always tolerent of the invaders be it the moghuls or > > later > > > christian missionaries converting to increase the > > numerical > > > strength of the "community. > > > > > > Muslims demanded a land and nation for > > themselves, a > > > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, > > but > > > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , > > free > > > india, secular nation, not a hindu nation, > > showcasing the > > > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to > > blame > > > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their > > promise when > > > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to > > stay > > > back. > > > > > > Next=2C as a community, why muslims are not > > identifying the > > > "fasaadis" in their community who are > > terming > > > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in > > to > > > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not > > tolerate, > > > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try > > to > > > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of > > islam, > > > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let > > the > > > muslim community take steps to identify the > > terrorsists or > > > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of > > rule > > > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > > > > > > In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > > > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" > > lawyers > > > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no > > way > > > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > > > jihaadi by default.! > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > > name of > > > fighting terrorism > > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Cc: sarai > > > > > > > Dear Radhika > > > > > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father > > of > > > the nation, mahatma > > > > that they will stay back in India as brothers > > with > > > their hindu > > > > community" > > > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath > > to > > > live as > > > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others > > as > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims > > in > > > the name of > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all > > those > > > terrorists who > > > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are > > muslims. > > > > > > > > > > When the community of muslims forgot > > their > > > solemn oath > > > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they > > will > > > stay back in > > > > > India as brothers with their hindu > > community, > > > many were > > > > > sceptical, for one, as the population > > increases > > > the muslim > > > > > community along with other segments of > > sovciety > > > also did > > > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks > > to > > > the politics > > > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > > > linguistic , > > > > > caste and faith segments, the national > > exchequer > > > never > > > > > reached the grass root level of the populace > > and > > > citizens in > > > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > > > governance > > > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > > > > > > The muslim community in general had > > lower > > > percentage of > > > > > educated men and women, who instead of > > having > > > concern for > > > > > their community, is seen more in nesting > > their > > > own homes > > > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > > > transactions, > > > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > > > wherever the > > > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > > > rules on > > > > > society are all the reasons along with > > political > > > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures > > of > > > patronising > > > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > > > wondering where he > > > > > belonged to. ! > > > > > > > > > > The subsequent generations of muslims, > > > particularly > > > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding > > more > > > say in the > > > > > governance along with dalits and other > > suppressed > > > and > > > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > > > breeding of > > > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing > > the > > > issues used > > > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the > > passions > > > on some > > > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > > > dangers from > > > > > "communal " parties totally > > loosing > > > sight of > > > > > communalism played by so called secular > > parties.! > > > > > > > > > > In the entire process, the muslim youth > > who is > > > found > > > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those > > elements in > > > society who > > > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > > > terorists, use the > > > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > > > > > > Only solution to terror is handle the > > elements > > > who > > > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > > > terrorise them > > > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle > > the > > > deviant > > > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or > > favour > > > of vote > > > > > banks. > > > > > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > > the > > > name of > > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > > > A cleric’s dubious arrest over the > > > Ahmedabad blasts > > > > > is just the > > > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by > > AJIT > > > SAHI exposes > > > > > the random > > > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp)>> > > AS HE’D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > > > decades, Maulana > > > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and > > began to > > > speak to > > > > > the faithful > > > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > > > soft-spoken, > > > > > revered aalim, > > > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores > > of > > > Muslims in > > > > > the hour- > > > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque > > in one > > > of =3E > > > > Ahmedabad’s Muslim > > > > > > localities where the preacher and many > > in > > > his > > > > > congregation live. > > > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > > > Muslim’s duty > > > > > towards his > > > > > > neighbours. “You cannot fill your > > stomach > > > if your > > > > > neighbour is > > > > > > hungry,” Haleem spoke in his > > unhurried > > > tone. “You > > > > > cannot > > > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and > > Muslim > > > > > neighbours.” > > > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of > > the > > > serial > > > > > blasts that > > > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on > > Saturday, > > > policemen > > > > > stormed > > > > > > Haleem’s house barely a km from the > > mosque > > > and > > > > > dragged him away as > > > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On > > Monday, > > > as a local > > > > > magistrate > > > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for > > two > > > weeks, > > > > > police claimed > > > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the > > Saturday > > > blasts and > > > > > that grilling > > > > > > him would unravel the execution of and > > the > > > conspiracy > > > > > behind the > > > > > > terror act. > > > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, > > everybody, > > > > > justifiably, wants > > > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The > > challenge > > > then is > > > > > not to reach > > > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > > > demonisations. > > > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > > > challenge. Over > > > > > the years, for > > > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > > > acronym for most > > > > > Indians — > > > > > > Students’ Islamic Movement of India, > > a > > > hotbed of > > > > > terrorism, a > > > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent > > on > > > destroying > > > > > the nation. > > > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific > > blast, > > > that name > > > > > is thrust > > > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly > > innuendo > > > — > > > > > stretching outwards > > > > > > to embrace the entire community. But > > how > > > true are > > > > > these allegations? > > > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe > > society, > > > it is > > > > > crucial to find > > > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > > > crucial to > > > > > cleave doggedly > > > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of > > law; > > > crucial not > > > > > to fall prey > > > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In > > pursuit > > > of this, > > > > > in an > > > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, > > TEHELKA > > > conducted > > > > > an > > > > > > investigation across India over three > > months > > > and 12 > > > > > cities. > > > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, > > the > > > disturbing > > > > > investigation > > > > > > found that an overwhelming majority of > > > terrorism cases > > > > > — > > > > > > especially those related to the > > outlawed > > > SIMI — are > > > > > based on > > > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent > > evidence > > > and are an > > > > > affront to > > > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > > > prejudices in > > > > > the > > > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject > > lack > > > of > > > > > political will > > > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 > > news > > > media that > > > > > demands > > > > > > instant whodunit answers and > > unquestioningly > > > > > copy-pastes every > > > > > > unproven police and intelligence story > > on > > > terrorist > > > > > networks has > > > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > > > hundreds of > > > > > people falsely > > > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of > > these > > > are Muslim; > > > > > nearly all > > > > > > of these are poor. > > > > > > “We will rise to the challenge and I > > am > > > confident we > > > > > will be able > > > > > > to defeat these forces,” Prime > > Minister > > > Manmohan > > > > > Singh said as he > > > > > > walked about in the debris at > > Ahmedabad’s > > > civil > > > > > hospital, where > > > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > > > casualties. He > > > > > urged political > > > > > > parties and police and intelligence > > agencies > > > to work > > > > > together > > > > > > against efforts aimed at “destroying > > our > > > social > > > > > fabric, > > > > > > undermining communal harmony.” > > > Unfortunately, given > > > > > their > > > > > > staggering record of false cases > > against > > > innocent > > > > > people, it > > > > > > appears that incompetent police and > > > intelligence > > > > > agencies are > > > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem’s story, > > chronicled > > > below, is a > > > > > searing > > > > > > example why. > > > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in > > the > > > stenographic > > > > > news media, > > > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a > > SIMI > > > member > > > > > linked with > > > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased > > terrorists. > > > Gujarat > > > > > government’s > > > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > > > Haleem sent > > > > > Muslim youth > > > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to > > train as > > > terrorists > > > > > to avenge > > > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in > > the > > > state. He > > > > > said they > > > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate > > BJP > > > leader LK > > > > > Advani and > > > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. > > Police > > > have said > > > > > Haleem was > > > > > > absconding since he was named an > > accused in > > > this case > > > > > in 2002. > > > > > > TEHELKA’s investigation in Ahmedabad > > > following the > > > > > cleric’s arrest > > > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, > > documentary > > > and > > > > > circumstantial, > > > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has > > lived > > > at his =3E > > > > house — which is > > > > > > less than a km from the local police > > station > > > — for > > > > > years and led a > > > > > > public life within his community. The > > charge > > > against > > > > > him that he > > > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > > > highly dubious > > > > > based as it > > > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > > > contents > > > > > don’t remotely > > > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And > > until > > > Saturday’s > > > > > bomb blasts, > > > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called > > Haleem a > > > SIMI > > > > > member. > > > > > > If anything, Haleem’s family and > > followers > > > say > > > > > police have > > > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > > > helping victims > > > > > of the 2002 > > > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May > > 27, > > > an > > > > > inspector from the > > > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > > > handwritten > > > > > notice in > > > > > > Gujarati. It said: “An office of > > Markaz > > > Ahle-Hadis > > > > > [the Islamic > > > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > > > belong] Trust > > > > > has been > > > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan > > Shopping > > > Centre. > > > > > You are its > > > > > > head… Many members have been > > appointed in > > > it. You > > > > > are directed to > > > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses > > and > > > phone > > > > > numbers.” > > > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such > > a > > > demand on a > > > > > trust > > > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > > > charge against > > > > > it, the > > > > > > letter proves the police knew > > Haleem’s > > > whereabouts > > > > > and were in > > > > > > touch with him as late as two months > > ago. > > > Indeed, the > > > > > notice > > > > > > mentions Haleem’s home address: 2, > > Devi > > > Park > > > > > Society, near > > > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem’s family > > has > > > proof that > > > > > the police > > > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem > > rushed > > > telegrams to > > > > > Gujarat’s > > > > > > director-general of police and > > Ahmedabad’s > > > police > > > > > commissioner > > > > > > claiming that the police forcibly > > entered > > > his house > > > > > that day and > > > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > > > absence. “We > > > > > are peace- > > > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and > > have > > > never been > > > > > part of any > > > > > > illegal activity,” Haleem wrote the > > > telegram in > > > > > Hindi. “The police > > > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my > > family > > > without > > > > > appropriate > > > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > > > rights.” > > > > > Predictably, he > > > > > > didn’t hear from either officer. > > > > > > In April, when a local outfit called > > Social > > > Unity > > > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as > > its > > > members, > > > > > organised a > > > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to > > the > > > police > > > > > seeking permission > > > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > > > clearly > > > > > mentioned that > > > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > > > event. > > > > > Haleem’s family > > > > > > also offers his driving licence, > > renewed by > > > the > > > > > Ahmedabad > > > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, > > as > > > proof that > > > > > he led a > > > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, > > in > > > July 2005, > > > > > the Gujarati > > > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > > > Haleem’s > > > > > picture with a > > > > > > statement he released at a press > > conference > > > giving his > > > > > views on a > > > > > > raging controversy over the alleged > > rape of > > > a woman, > > > > > Imrana, by > > > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > > > Pradesh. > > > > > > “It is crazy that we have to prove > > Maulana > > > > > Haleem’s innocence,” > > > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > > > appealed to the > > > > > Gujarat > > > > > > governor to secure the cleric’s > > release. > > > Adds Nazir, > > > > > in whose > > > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family > > as > > > tenant: “I > > > > > have known > > > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > > > religion and has > > > > > never > > > > > > indulged in terrorism.” Says > > Haleem’s > > > wife Noor > > > > > Saba: “I swear by > > > > > > my children that my husband is not a > > > terrorist. He is > > > > > being framed.” > > > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable > > in the > > > > > cleric’s > > > > > > neighbourhood. “Maulana Haleem has > > helped > > > hundreds > > > > > in their daily > > > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > > > patience and > > > > > fortitude,” > > > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a > > 27-year-old > > > embroiderer. > > > > > Haq fishes > > > > > > out his marriage certificate, the > > nikaahnama > > > the > > > > > Maulana signed > > > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June > > 1, to > > > show that > > > > > Haleem > > > > > > wasn’t any absconder. Haleem had > > delivered > > > a sermon > > > > > to the guests > > > > > > at Haq’s wedding over loudspeakers > > that > > > Haq had > > > > > installed — with > > > > > > police permission. > > > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > > > hails from > > > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. > > He is > > > a preacher > > > > > with a > > > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle > > Hadis > > > that began > > > > > on the > > > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > > > survived a > > > > > frowning Sunni > > > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by > > the > > > Hadis — > > > > > the oral > > > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad’s life > > — > > > as a > > > > > guiding principle for > > > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The > > news > > > media have > > > > > long > > > > > > parroted the police’s insinuation > > that > > > Ahle-Hadis is > > > > > a terrorist > > > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. > > The > > > police claim > > > > > its members > > > > > > include many terror accused such as > > those of > > > the July > > > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > > > membership of > > > > > 30 million in > > > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out > > that > > > Union > > > > > Home Minister > > > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at > > its > > > national > > > > > symposium two > > > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd > > Ahle > > > Hadis > > > > > followers for 14 > > > > > > years, resigning three years ago to > > minister > > > a small > > > > > mosque so he > > > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to > > earn a > > > regular > > > > > income to > > > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the > > oldest > > > two of > > > > > whom study at > > > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > > > HALEEM’S TROUBLES had begun soon > > after the > > > 2002 > > > > > anti-Muslim > > > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved > > himself > > > in relief > > > > > work at the > > > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim > > refugees. > > > An > > > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in > > Kuwait and > > > was > > > > > visiting his > > > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two > > other > > > Muslims. One > > > > > of them was > > > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who > > also > > > lived in > > > > > Kuwait. The > > > > > > other was a small-time trader from > > > Moradabad. The > > > > > three wanted to > > > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the > > 2002 > > > violence > > > > > by bringing > > > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem > > took > > > them to > > > > > four refugee > > > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > > > saying it had > > > > > found 34 > > > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned > > the > > > Kuwait > > > > > expatriate, who > > > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote > > to him > > > about the > > > > > offer. But > > > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > > > importantly, > > > > > no children > > > > > > were ever sent. > > > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, > > Delhi > > > Police > > > > > arrested Shahid > > > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from > > Kuwait > > > allegedly > > > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > > > Moradabad trader > > > > > was also > > > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three > > were > > > charged > > > > > under the > > > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for > > conspiring > > > to carry > > > > > out terrorist > > > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem’s > > letter > > > (about the > > > > > camp’s offer > > > > > > of the orphan children) with the > > expatriate > > > from > > > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > > > police there > > > > > were informed. > > > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer > > DG > > > Vanzara > > > > > called in Haleem > > > > > > and detained him — illegally — for > > five > > > days. > > > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat > > businessman > > > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him > > off as > > > a > > > > > terrorist.) Haleem’s > > > > > > family frantically filed a petition > > with the > > > Gujarat > > > > > High Court to > > > > > > secure his release. “The judge > > ordered the > > > police to > > > > > bring Haleem > > > > > > to the court in two hours,” recalls > > the > > > > > > family’s lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > > > police > > > > > instantly released > > > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where > > his > > > statement on > > > > > his illegal > > > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part > > of > > > official > > > > > documents. > > > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the ‘RDX > > > case’ > > > > > against the two > > > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and > > the > > > Moradabad > > > > > trader, police > > > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case > > against > > > the same > > > > > individuals > > > > > > for “luring Muslim youth to train as > > > terrorists in > > > > > Moradabad”. > > > > > > This is the case the police and the > > media > > > have > > > > > referred since > > > > > > Haleem’s arrest for the July 26 bomb > > > blasts to argue > > > > > that the > > > > > > cleric was involved in “sending > > Muslim > > > youth to > > > > > train as > > > > > > terrorists”. The Gujarat government > > lawyer > > > was > > > > > openly lying on > > > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > > > Haleem had > > > > > sent “30 youth” > > > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. > > The > > > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > > > conspiracy had > > > > > remained on > > > > > > paper and no children ever travelled > > from > > > Ahmedabad to > > > > > Moradabad. > > > > > > While Delhi’s ‘RDX case’ named > > Haleem > > > a witness, > > > > > Ahmedabad’s > > > > > > ‘terrorist training case’ named him > > an > > > accused and > > > > > said he was > > > > > > absconding. The law says the police > > have to > > > follow due > > > > > legal > > > > > > process before declaring an accused as > > > absconding. > > > > > This includes > > > > > > searches at his house and workplace in > > view > > > of > > > > > independent > > > > > > witnesses, and recording statements > > from > > > neighbours to > > > > > establish > > > > > > that the accused has not been seen for > > a > > > long time. > > > > > The Ahmedabad >> > > > > police did not bother with this > > exercise. > > > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based > > on a > > > letter he > > > > > wrote to > > > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan > > Ahmad > > > Ali. Dated > > > > > August 7, > > > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > > > terrorist > > > > > training or any > > > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply > > said: > > > “You had > > > > > come [to > > > > > > Ahmedabad] with an ‘ahem maqsad’ > > > (important > > > > > goal).” With a giant > > > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim > > that > > > the words > > > > > “ahem maqsad” > > > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for > > terrorist > > > training. > > > > > Haleem wrote > > > > > > that six of the children were orphans > > and > > > the rest > > > > > poor. He > > > > > > concluded the letter saying: “I > > believe > > > that by > > > > > god’s grace you > > > > > > will certainly help me in this > > educational > > > and > > > > > constructive > > > > > > mission to propagate Islam.” In his > > > deposition > > > > > before a Delhi > > > > > > court in the ‘RDX case’, Haleem > > said he > > > was told > > > > > the children will > > > > > > get “a good education and decent > > living” > > > in > > > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to > > train > > > the > > > > > children as > > > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > > > hearing the > > > > > ‘RDX case’ found > > > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate > > from > > > Kuwait, > > > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > > > years in jail. > > > > > The court > > > > > > accepted the police version even though > > the > > > only > > > > > witnesses to the > > > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > > > Ahmad Ali had > > > > > claimed that > > > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he > > was to > > > board a > > > > > flight to > > > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as > > proof. > > > The judge > > > > > ignored that. > > > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at > > the > > > Delhi High > > > > > Court against > > > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > > > twister: while > > > > > they got > > > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite > > being > > > convicted > > > > > by the > > > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by > > the > > > Gujarat High > > > > > Court in > > > > > > the ‘terrorist training case’ > > although > > > no guilt > > > > > has yet been > > > > > > established in that case and the > > Gujarat > > > crime branch > > > > > admits their > > > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the > > alleged > > > > > conspiracy. That’s > > > > > > not all. > > > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail > > 56-year-old > > > man named > > > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the ‘RDX > > case’. > > > He proved > > > > > doubly lucky > > > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him > > bail > > > in the > > > > > ‘terrorist > > > > > > training case’ in June 2004. In its > > > eye-opening bail > > > > > order, the > > > > > > judge said: “… All that remains > > against > > > the > > > > > present applicant > > > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad > > and had > > > visited > > > > > camps to > > > > > > identify the children so that they can > > be > > > better > > > > > looked after. > > > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > > > offence.” > > > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused > > of > > > exactly the > > > > > same crime, > > > > > > the argument should be valid for them, > > too. > > > Yet, > > > > > another Gujarat > > > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and > > both > > > continue to > > > > > languish in > > > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > > > Ahmedabad because > > > > > the Gujarat > > > > > > High Court’s 2004 bail order said he > > must > > > report to > > > > > the Crime > > > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every > > Sunday. On > > > Sunday, > > > > > July 27, the > > > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited > > the > > > crime > > > > > branch office > > > > > > with trepidation. “They grilled me > > four > > > hours on the > > > > > blasts,” > > > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. “I was glad when > > they > > > let me > > > > > go.” > > > > > > The hearing in the ‘terrorist > > training > > > case’ is > > > > > nearly over. It is > > > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > > > called against > > > > > Haleem, > > > > > > since he is no more “absconding”. > > > Meanwhile, > > > > > Haleem’s family is > > > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and > > the > > > next > > > > > month’s house rent > > > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem’s wife says she > > has no > > > savings. > > > > > His lone > > > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying > > to run > > > > > Haleem’s scrap shop. > > > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem’s story > > is > > > anything but > > > > > rare. One > > > > > > glaring case concerns a “family of > > > terrorists”. On > > > > > July 15, a > > > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > > > Mohammad > > > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > > > as he returned home at night from his > > > father’s > > > > > workshop in > > > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial > > bomb > > > blasts > > > > > rocked > > > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two > > people, > > > Hyderabad > > > > > Police > > > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the > > Hindustan > > > Times > > > > > newspaper that, > > > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had > > confessed > > > that before > > > > > his arrest, > > > > > > he had taken terror “operatives” to > > > Karnataka and > > > > > “arranged safe > > > > > > houses” for them. Of course, Yasir > > denies > > > the > > > > > confession. “I > > > > > > haven’t told them anything,” Yasir =3E > told > > > his > > > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the > > jail on > > > July 29. > > > > > “The police > > > > > > are lying.” Fatima told TEHELKA her > > son > > > was tortured > > > > > during what > > > > > > the police commissioner calls > > > “interrogation”. > > > > > “He was hung upside > > > > > > down and beaten,” she said. > > > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession > > made > > > to the > > > > > police is > > > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > > > (never mind > > > > > that the news > > > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > > > Yasir’s alleged > > > > > confession, > > > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face > > of the > > > Hyderabad > > > > > Police. > > > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member > > whose > > > father and > > > > > one brother > > > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > > > Yasir’s father, > > > > > 56-yearold > > > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > > > wellrespected cleric > > > > > who has now > > > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in > > Ahmedabad > > > for nearly > > > > > four years > > > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up > > to > > > the Supreme > > > > > Court. > > > > > > Yasir’s younger brother, Riasuddin > > Nasir, > > > is jailed > > > > > in Karnataka’s > > > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested > > in > > > January. > > > > > > With his brother and father suspected > > as > > > dreaded > > > > > terrorists, the > > > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs > > on > > > Yasir all > > > > > the time and > > > > > > instantly known if he was aiding > > terrorists. > > > That the > > > > > police > > > > > > didn’t catch Yasir “arranging safe > > > houses” for > > > > > terrorists in > > > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never > > did > > > any such > > > > > thing. This > > > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad > > a > > > month before > > > > > his arrest, > > >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > > > engineering workshop > > > > > that his > > > > > > father had set up three decades ago > > with > > > borrowed > > > > > money and skills > > > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > > > mechanic. In > > > > > the din of > > > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > > > managing > > > > > customers crowding > > > > > > the small front office. “My father > > and > > > brother have > > > > > been framed,” > > > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > > > seems a victim > > > > > of patently > > > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a > > member of > > > SIMI when > > > > > it was > > > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, > > 2001. > > > (Given the > > > > > relentless > > > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > > > reader might > > > > > find it hard > > > > > > to believe that no court in India has > > yet > > > upheld the > > > > > charge of > > > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an > > organisation.) > > > Yasir > > > > > echoed dozens > > > > > > others interviewed by this reporter > > across > > > India in > > > > > saying that > > > > > > SIMI was a platform for “deep > > religious > > > training and > > > > > self- > > > > > > purification”, and not for acts of > > > terrorism or > > > > > anti-India > > > > > > conspiracies. “SIMI took up issues of > > > atrocities on > > > > > Muslims from > > > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir,” Yasir said. > > “It > > > never gave > > > > > up the issue of > > > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted > > many of > > > us.” > > > > > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, > > the > > > police > > > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > > > representatives in > > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > > under the Unlawful Activities > > (Prevention) > > > Act. A > > > > > magistrate gave > > > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, > > the > > > police > > > > > slapped another > > > > > > case against the three, alleging that > > one of > > > them was > > > > > arrested > > > > > > making a speech against the government. > > The > > > other two, > > > > > including > > > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They > > went > > > back to the > > > > > court and > > > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 > > days > > > before > > > > > securing bail. > > > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet > > to > > > begin. > > > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir’s father, > > a > > > firebrand > > > > > cleric who never > > > > > > held his tongue in public speeches > > against > > > the > > > > > government, > > > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > > > Masjid > > > > > demolition and the > > > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > > > Embroiled in > > > > > cooked-up > > > > > > cases, in several of which he was > > > subsequently > > > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad > > Police > > > to report > > > > > at their > > > > > > office regularly. > > > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > > > Maulana > > > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > > > the police station, he was arrested by > > a > > > police team > > > > > from > > > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement > > in a > > > terror > > > > > conspiracy in > > > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 > > murder of > > > former > > > > > Gujarat Home > > > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only > > evidence > > > against > > > > > Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in > > a > > > letter to > > > > > the court, he > > > > > > has denied making.) > > > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the > > Maulana > > > to the > > > > > police station > > > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At > > this, > > > Gujarat > > > > > police > > > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his > > service > > > revolver > > > >> and shot dead > > > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > > > Nasiruddin’s > > > > > supporters > > > > > > refused to move the dead protestor’s > > body > > > unless the > > > > > police filed > > > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > > > police filed > > > > > two cases > > > > > > back to back: One, their own, against > > the > > > protestors > > > > > for blocking > > > > > > the Maulana’s arrest; and the other, > > under > > > pressure, > > > > > against > > > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the > > protestor. > > > > > > The case against Amin hasn’t moved an > > inch > > > in four > > > > > years. The > > > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized > > his > > > revolver and > > > > > sent it for > > > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > > > bullet > > > > > recovered from the > > > > > > dead protestor’s body. They should > > have > > > arrested and > > > > > produced Amin > > > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > > > open-and-shut case if > > > > > there ever > > > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > > > matching the > > > > > bullet, and > > > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none > > of > > > this > > > > > happened. Amin > > > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > > > Nasiruddin in his > > > > > custody. The > > > > > > FIR against him has become a dead > > letter. > > > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > > > subsequently > > > > > accused of > > > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > > > businessman > > > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in > > 2005 > > > (as > > > > > mentioned above > > > > > > in Haleem’s story). Like Vanzara, > > Amin, > > > too, is now > > > > > in jail. > > > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the > > main > > > complainant > > > > > against > > > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. > > This is > > > none > > > > > other than 20- > > > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin’s > > > youngest son > > > > > and Yasir’s > > > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this > > year, > > > Nasir was > > > > > arrested by > > > > > > police in Karnataka with another person > > and > > > was > > > > > accused of > > > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were > > allegedly > > > riding. > > > > > Claiming a > > > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > > > slapped charges > > > > > such as > > > > > > ‘waging war against State’ on Nasir > > and > > > his > > > > > co-accused. > > > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > > > confessions from the > > > > > two accused > > > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed > > them > > > saying they > > > > > were SIMI > > > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > > > confessions in > > > > > which they > > > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members > > and > > > the > > > > > attendant terror > > > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the > > police > > > failed to > > > > > file a > > > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir’s lawyer landed > > at the > > > > > magistrate’s house who > > > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as > > per > > > law. But > > > > > by this time, > > > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in > > another > > > case of > > > > > conspiracy, so > > > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir > > has > > > retracted > > > > > his > > > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he > > has > > > little hope > > > > > against > > > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the > > two > > > accused to > > > > > police > > > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana > > the > > > following > > > > > in an interview: > > > > > > “Even as I was signing the necessary > > > papers > > > > > remanding them to > > > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > > > accused] > > > > > stepped forward > > > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me > > that > > > the > > > > > police denied > > > > > > them food and water and subjected them > > to > > > repeated > > > > > beatings. He > > > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > > > Nasir’s body. > > > > > The two > > > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human > > rights > > > violation > > > > > by the > > > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > > > “I was very surprised by three > > things: > > > they were > > > > > talking of their > > > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > > > manner, they > > > > > spoke English > > > > > > and, further, they readily admitted > > that > > > they had > > > > > stolen the bike, > > > > > > something most thieves never do in my > > > experience.” > > > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > > > magistrate > > > > > “warning” that > > > > > > the accused shouldn’t be sent to > > judicial > > > custody, > > > > > the magistrate > > > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to > > this > > > house. “The > > > > > materials > > > > > > produced before me included duplicate > > > identity cards, > > > > > a fancy > > > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red > > marks > > > against > > > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper > > with > > > www.com > > > > > written on > > > > > > one and ‘Jungle King behind back > > me’ on > > > another. > > > > > > “When I looked at these materials in > > their > > > entirety, > > > > > I felt that > > > > > > these were definitely not just bike > > thieves. > > > Why would > > > > > bike > > > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > > > cards and a > > > > > map of South > > > > > > India? The fact that they had an > > American > > > dollar > > > > > seemed to suggest > > > > > > they had international links. The paper > > with > > > www.com > > > > > indicated to > > > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > > > piece of paper > > > > > had a > > > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of > > code > > > that I could > > > =3E > not > > > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I > > examined > > > the South > > > > > India map, > > > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a > > red > > > marker > > > > > against it. > > > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at > > the > > > place > > > > > during a > > > > > > religious function. > > > > > > “All these suggested that there were > > > definitely > > > > > enough grounds in > > > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody > > of > > > Nasir and > > > > > Asadullah to > > > > > > facilitate further investigations.” > > Go > > > figure. > > > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > > > Muqeemuddin > > > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The > > boys’ > > > mother > > > > > doesn’t think so. > > > > > > “Why don’t the police put us all > > > together in > > > > > jail,” she told > > > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > > > “Then they can > > > > > shoot all of > > > > > > us dead.” • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited > > storage. > > > Get it now, > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > > > media and the > > > > > city. > > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > > > list > > > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without > > downloading > > > messenger. Go > > > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > > messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > > header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Mon Aug 11 15:49:44 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 15:19:44 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... In-Reply-To: <32144e990808102036n7652639bx98edfaac4dc63af6@mail.gmail.com> References: <603270.13637.qm@web31503.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <32144e990808102036n7652639bx98edfaac4dc63af6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Partha, basic presumption here is that violence begets more of it. As to your thoughts of basics, freedom of expression, religion and basic amenities, are you not mixing the comic mix of all things into one of governance. ? In good governance the religion or faith has no role at all in democratic society, as every citizen irrespective of his caste, faith or religion must get good governance in democratic rule of laws. but right from 1947 in free india, reservations meant for the down-trodden and oppressed was for ten years, but later misused by fuedal lords to corner it for the powerful OTHER bACKWARD CASTES, and dalits and the downtrodeen could hardly get any of the benefits and the yadavs, jats and gowdas and reddys , thevars and goundars who practise the untouchabilty kept blaming the meekest brahmins as they can not, do not retaliate with latis as these do.? Muslims had leaders who indulged only in their welfare ignoring the poverty, education of all muslims, thus the common muslim became slave of these leaders. Gulmohar bldg MP who lost his elections, along with Mp of bangalore jaffer Sharief are no more respected by the muslim community as they have seen and felt that these leaders are of no use for the welfare of the community. So is the case of lalu and Mulayam who are on the verge of loosing the credibilty of being caste leaders. In this scenario, the good governance which has to address all citizens with basic amenities , facilitate the education, vocation for all irrespective of their caste or faith, in "secular" governance has only neglected the governance with creation of vote banks., based on caste and faith. All that is expected now of all citizens is to identify, isolate and let the laws of the land take care of the deviant behaviour of these trouble makers irrespective of the faith. Is it too much to expect./ let the muslims dis-associate themselves from the fassaadis elements in their community, only then the other fringe groups of all faiths who use violence will also get isoalted in society., as they have nothing to defend. regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Partha Dasgupta Date: Monday, August 11, 2008 11:46 am Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... To: Prabhakar Singh Cc: sarai > Hi, > > 1. Some basics are expected by every 'citizen' - including the > right to > freedom of > expression, religion, basic amenties, etc. > > 2. It is common knowledge that these are not available. > > 3. How is it that if a Muslim laments his / her state in life or > state or > clustering as > a terrorist because one member of the religion commits an act > considered as > terrorism is justified - WHEN we refuse to attach the same > label to > those who > killed Muslims in Gujarat, or even close our eyes to the LTTE? > > 4. Would also like to know which statement has been construed as > "insultingmotherland" > > If you still feel that this will "confuse the basic issue" do let > me know. > Will be glad to clarify further. > > Rgds, Partha > ....................... > > On Sun, Aug 10, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Prabhakar Singh > wrote: > > > Let us not mix things like this and confuse the basic issue.Making > > improvement and insulting motherland are two different issues.It > needs no > > further discussion. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: S.Fatima > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net; Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: sarai > > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 7:34:05 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > > > > Dear Prabhakar Singh > > I am not sure if I am proud of my motherland, but I certainly > try to make > > improvements by paying my taxes, not bribing the traffic cop, > not dirtying > > the roads, and not participating in any kind of hate-mongering > or violence. > > Why should one leave one's homeland. How can one make > improvements in one's > > country if one is not allowed to criticize it. > > > > I don't think being proud of one's motherland is a pre-requisit > of being a > > citizen of a country. > > > > > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, Prabhakar Singh > wrote:> > > > From: Prabhakar Singh > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of ... > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 3:07 PM > > > If India as a country is so bad why do we choose to live > > > here at all? We don't deserve to be called Indians if we > > > are not proud of our nation.We should try to make improvemet > > > rather than codemning our own motherland.Freedom of > > > expression does not mean that one can insult our nation like > > > this.Such outrageous comments should not be allowed.The > > > moderator of the forum needs to explain this now. > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: S.Fatima > > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Cc: sarai > > > Sent: Sunday, 10 August, 2008 2:24:56 AM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the name of > > > ... > > > > > > Dear Radhika > > > I don't wish to enter a unending debate with you, but > > > the fact is (which you will never acknowledge) that more and > > > more sincere people are realizing that this image of terror > > > for Muslims and Islam has mostly been fabricated by the > > > mainstream media. They keepinventing new terms everyday. > > > So, now the word "fasadi" has entered your > > > rhetoric today - probably learnt it from a recent TOI > > > editorial? Do you even know what the word fasadi means. If > > > common muslims are fasadis then who are the activists of > > > RSS, Shiva Sena, Bajrang Dal and VHP who spread terror > > > during the fasads. Are they not trained for all their > > > subversive activities. I know your immediate answer would > > > be: "they are defending themselves". Fine, you > > > must defend against the armed mob. But killing 5900 Muslims > > > in Gujarat in retaliation of 59 Hindus in Godhra is surely > > > more than defending. That's planned genocide of a > > > community. > > > > > > Look, these debates will never end. And your notions of > > > India never having invaded anyone for 5000 years is all > > > humbug (earlier, someone said, 10,000 years!) India is > > > invading the lives of its own people everyday - what to say > > > of the outside world. Go and ask a tribal in eastern India > > > whose livelihood will be crushed soon to provide us (and > > > MNCs) luxurious minerals. That's fassadi. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Sun, 10/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > wrote: > > > > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > > > name of fighting terrorism > > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > Date: Sunday, 10 August, 2008, 2:09 PM > > > > Dear Sadia, > > > > > > > > your query looks absurd on the face of it because > > > > hindus have been always tolerent, never once went on > > > > offensive in their civilised history of over 5000 > > > years, > > > > always tolerent of the invaders be it the moghuls or > > > later > > > > christian missionaries converting to increase the > > > numerical > > > > strength of the "community. > > > > > > > > Muslims demanded a land and nation for > > > themselves, a > > > > islamic nation, birth of Pakistan was exactly that, > > > but > > > > majority of muslims did stay back, thus making India , > > > free > > > > india, secular nation, not a hindu nation, > > > showcasing the > > > > tolerence of hindu society. So, without resorting to > > > blame > > > > games , the onus is on muslims to keep up their > > > promise when > > > > they stayed back in a nation which gave them space to > > > stay > > > > back. > > > > > > > > Next, as a community, why muslims are not > > > identifying the > > > > "fasaadis" in their community who are > > > terming > > > > themselves as jihaadis when in actual fact they are in > > > to > > > > fassaad of killing innocents which islam does not > > > tolerate, > > > > ? Let them come out, identify these fasaadis who try > > > to > > > > legitimise their acts of violence using the faith of > > > islam, > > > > thus actually giving bad name to a good religion.? let > > > the > > > > muslim community take steps to identify the > > > terrorsists or > > > > fasaadis in their midst, isolate them and then law of > > > rule > > > > will take care of such deviant fasaadis. > > > > > > > > In society, it is sad to see that such fassaadis are > > > > sheltored by communal NGOs, "criminal" > > > lawyers > > > > defending them for bigger fee and muslim who is in no > > > way > > > > connected to these fassadis is also the sufferer of a > > > > jihaadi by default.! > > > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > > > Date: Saturday, August 9, 2008 8:54 pm > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in the > > > name of > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > Cc: sarai > > > > > > > > > Dear Radhika > > > > > > > > > > "muslims forgot their solemn oath to father > > > of > > > > the nation, mahatma > > > > > that they will stay back in India as brothers > > > with > > > > their hindu > > > > > community" > > > > > Why should only Muslim need to take a solemn oath > > > to > > > > live as > > > > > brothers? Isn't that oath required by others > > > as > > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 9/8/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims > > > in > > > > the name of > > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > > > To: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > > > > Cc: "sarai" > > > > > > > > > > Date: Saturday, 9 August, 2008, 6:25 PM > > > > > > All muslims are not terrorists, but all > > > those > > > > terrorists who > > > > > > are caught with acts of terrorism are > > > muslims. > > > > > > > > > > > > When the community of muslims forgot > > > their > > > > solemn oath > > > > > > to father of the nation, mahatma that they > > > will > > > > stay back in > > > > > > India as brothers with their hindu > > > community, > > > > many were > > > > > > sceptical, for one, as the population > > > increases > > > > the muslim > > > > > > community along with other segments of > > > sovciety > > > > also did > > > > > > not get their due in good governance, thanks > > > to > > > > the politics > > > > > > of votebanks, society was further divided in > > > > linguistic , > > > > > > caste and faith segments, the national > > > exchequer > > > > never > > > > > > reached the grass root level of the populace > > > and > > > > citizens in > > > > > > sixty years of freedom kept gasping for good > > > > governance > > > > > > without bias , without fear or favour. > > > > > > > > > > > > The muslim community in general had > > > lower > > > > percentage of > > > > > > educated men and women, who instead of > > > having > > > > concern for > > > > > > their community, is seen more in nesting > > > their > > > > own homes > > > > > > than the society. The unaccounted cash > > > > transactions, > > > > > > unwillingness to be accountable to society, > > > > wherever the > > > > > > muslims are majority, trying to impose their > > > > rules on > > > > > > society are all the reasons along with > > > political > > > > > > appeasements and false promises and gestures > > > of > > > > patronising > > > > > > the mullas for votes left a common muslim > > > > wondering where he > > > > > > belonged to. ! > > > > > > > > > > > > The subsequent generations of muslims, > > > > particularly > > > > > > youth started to vent their anger, demanding > > > more > > > > say in the > > > > > > governance along with dalits and other > > > suppressed > > > > and > > > > > > oppressed castes, thus a fertile ground for > > > > breeding of > > > > > > terrorism. the mullas instead of addressing > > > the > > > > issues used > > > > > > their friday prayers only to arouse the > > > passions > > > > on some > > > > > > danish cartoons and percieved and imagined > > > > dangers from > > > > > > "communal " parties totally > > > loosing > > > > sight of > > > > > > communalism played by so called secular > > > parties.! > > > > > > > > > > > > In the entire process, the muslim youth > > > who is > > > > found > > > > > > wanting a job is easy prey for those > > > elements in > > > > society who > > > > > > do not risk themselves of being seen as > > > > terorists, use the > > > > > > youth to terrorise the society. > > > > > > > > > > > > Only solution to terror is handle the > > > elements > > > > who > > > > > > organise the youth to terrorise the society, > > > > terrorise them > > > > > > and democratic rule of laws should handle > > > the > > > > deviant > > > > > > behaviour of the culprits without fear or > > > favour > > > > of vote > > > > > > banks. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "S.Fatima" > > > > > > > > > > Date: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:54 pm > > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hounding Muslims in > > > the > > > > name of > > > > > > fighting terrorism > > > > > > To: sarai > > > > > > > > > > > > > All The Wrong Men > > > > > > > A cleric's dubious arrest over the > > > > Ahmedabad blasts > > > > > > is just the > > > > > > > tip. A three-month investigation by > > > AJIT > > > > SAHI exposes > > > > > > the random > > > > > > > targeting of Muslims by the police > > > > > > > (Tehelka: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808coverstory.asp> )> > > > > > AS HE'D done unfailingly every Friday for two > > > > > > decades, Maulana > > > > > > > Abdul Haleem cleared his throat and > > > began to > > > > speak to > > > > > > the faithful > > > > > > > on July 25. It was near 2 pm, and the > > > > soft-spoken, > > > > > > revered aalim, > > > > > > > or Islamic scholar, had just led scores > > > of > > > > Muslims in > > > > > > the hour- > > > > > > > long juma namaaz at his packed mosque > > > in one > > > > of > > > > > > Ahmedabad's Muslim > > > > > > > localities where the preacher and many > > > in > > > > his > > > > > > congregation live. > > > > > > > His sermon this afternoon was on a > > > > Muslim's duty > > > > > > towards his > > > > > > > neighbours. "You cannot fill your > > > stomach > > > > if your > > > > > > neighbour is > > > > > > > hungry," Haleem spoke in his > > > unhurried > > > > tone. "You > > > > > > cannot > > > > > > > discriminate between your Hindu and > > > Muslim > > > > > > neighbours." > > > > > > > Thirty hours later, within minutes of > > > the > > > > serial > > > > > > blasts that > > > > > > > killed 53 people in Ahmedabad on > > > Saturday, > > > > policemen > > > > > > stormed > > > > > > > Haleem's house barely a km from the > > > mosque > > > > and > > > > > > dragged him away as > > > > > > > his stunned neighbours watched. On > > > Monday, > > > > as a local > > > > > > magistrate > > > > > > > gave the Crime Branch his custody for > > > two > > > > weeks, > > > > > > police claimed > > > > > > > Haleem is a crucial link in the > > > Saturday > > > > blasts and > > > > > > that grilling > > > > > > > him would unravel the execution of and > > > the > > > > conspiracy > > > > > > behind the > > > > > > > terror act. > > > > > > > In a time of tragedy and terror, > > > everybody, > > > > > > justifiably, wants > > > > > > > answers, culprits, punishment. The > > > challenge > > > > then is > > > > > > not to reach > > > > > > > for the quick routes, the easy > > > > demonisations. > > > > > > Unfortunately, the > > > > > > > Indian State has not quite met that > > > > challenge. Over > > > > > > the years, for > > > > > > > instance, SIMI has come to be a dread > > > > acronym for most > > > > > > Indians — > > > > > > > Students' Islamic Movement of India, > > > a > > > > hotbed of > > > > > > terrorism, a > > > > > > > lethal and shadowy organisation intent > > > on > > > > destroying > > > > > > the nation. > > > > > > > Quick on the back of every horrific > > > blast, > > > > that name > > > > > > is thrust > > > > > > > upon the public mind like a deadly > > > innuendo > > > > — > > > > > > stretching outwards > > > > > > > to embrace the entire community. But > > > how > > > > true are > > > > > > these allegations? > > > > > > > In the struggle for a just and safe > > > society, > > > > it is > > > > > > crucial to find > > > > > > > real perpetrators and correct answers; > > > > crucial to > > > > > > cleave doggedly > > > > > > > to the idea of fair play and rule of > > > law; > > > > crucial not > > > > > > to fall prey > > > > > > > to overblown and false psychoses. In > > > pursuit > > > > of this, > > > > > > in an > > > > > > > attempt to sift fact from prejudice, > > > TEHELKA > > > > conducted > > > > > > an > > > > > > > investigation across India over three > > > months > > > > and 12 > > > > > > cities. > > > > > > > Serialised here, starting this week, > > > the > > > > disturbing > > > > > > investigation > > > > > > > found thatan overwhelming majority of > > > > terrorism cases > > > > > > — > > > > > > > especially those related to the > > > outlawed > > > > SIMI — are > > > > > > based on > > > > > > > either non-existent or fraudulent > > > evidence > > > > and are an > > > > > > affront to > > > > > > > both law and common sense. > > > > > > > The investigation found that entrenched > > > > prejudices in > > > > > > the > > > > > > > executive and the judiciary, an abject > > > lack > > > > of > > > > > > political will > > > > > > > against framing scapegoats, and a 24x7 > > > news > > > > media that > > > > > > demands > > > > > > > instant whodunit answers and > > > unquestioningly > > > > > > copy-pastes every > > > > > > > unproven police and intelligence story > > > on > > > > terrorist > > > > > > networks has > > > > > > > morphed into a tragic persecution of > > > > hundreds of > > > > > > people falsely > > > > > > > accused of terrorism. Nearly all of > > > these > > > > are Muslim; > > > > > > nearly all > > > > > > > of these are poor. > > > > > > > "We will rise to the challenge and I > > > am > > > > confident we > > > > > > will be able > > > > > > > to defeat these forces," Prime > > > Minister > > > > Manmohan > > > > > > Singh said as he > > > > > > > walked about in the debris at > > > Ahmedabad's > > > > civil > > > > > > hospital, where > > > > > > > two blasts had inflicted the worst > > > > casualties. He > > > > > > urged political > > > > > > > parties and police and intelligence > > > agencies > > > > to work > > > > > > together > > > > > > > against efforts aimed at "destroying > > > our > > > > social > > > > > > fabric, > > > > > > > undermining communal harmony." > > > > Unfortunately, given > > > > > > their > > > > > > > staggering record of false cases > > > against > > > > innocent > > > > > > people, it > > > > > > > appears that incompetent police and > > > > intelligence > > > > > > agencies are > > > > > > > doing exactly the opposite. > > > > > > > Maulana Abdul Haleem's story, > > > chronicled > > > > below, is a > > > > > > searing > > > > > > > example why. > > > > > > > SINCE SUNDAY, in anonymous plants in > > > the > > > > stenographic > > > > > > news media, > > > > > > > police have claimed that Haleem is a > > > SIMI > > > > member > > > > > > linked with > > > > > > > Pakistan- and Bangladeshbased > > > terrorists. > > > > Gujarat > > > > > > government's > > > > > > > lawyer told the remand magistrate that > > > > Haleem sent > > > > > > Muslim youth > > > > > > > from Ahmedabad to Uttar Pradesh to > > > train as > > > > terrorists > > > > > > to avenge > > > > > > > the 2002 mass killings of Muslims in > > > the > > > > state. He > > > > > > said they > > > > > > > planned, among others, to assassinate > > > BJP > > > > leader LK > > > > > > Advani and > > > > > > > Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. > > > Police > > > > have said > > > > > > Haleem was > > > > > > > absconding since he was named an > > > accused in > > > > this case > > > > > > in 2002. > > > > > > > TEHELKA's investigation in Ahmedabad > > > > following the > > > > > > cleric's arrest > > > > > > > has thrown up strong evidence, > > > documentary > > > > and > > > > > > circumstantial, > > > > > > > that far from absconding, Haleem has > > > lived > > > > at his > > > > > > house — which is > > > > > > > less than a km from the local police > > > station > > > > — for > > > > > > years and led a > > > > > > > public life within his community. The > > > charge > > > > against > > > > > > him that he > > > > > > > sent Muslims to train as terrorists is > > > > highly dubious > > > > > > based as it > > > > > > > is on just one letter from Haleem whose > > > > contents > > > > > > don't remotely > > > > > > > reflect a link with terrorism. And > > > until > > > > Saturday's > > > > > > bomb blasts, > > > > > > > Ahmedabad police had never called > > > Haleem a > > > > SIMI > > > > > > member. > > > > > > > If anything, Haleem's family and > > > followers > > > > say > > > > > > police have > > > > > > > harassed him for years for his role in > > > > helping victims > > > > > > of the 2002 > > > > > > > anti-Muslim violence. This year, on May > > > 27, > > > > an > > > > > > inspector from the > > > > > > > police station sent Haleem a onepage > > > > handwritten > > > > > > notice in > > > > > > > Gujarati. It said: "An office of > > > Markaz > > > > Ahle-Hadis > > > > > > [the Islamic > > > > > > > sect to which Haleem and his followers > > > > belong] Trust > > > > > > has been > > > > > > > opened in Shop no. 4 in the Alishan > > > Shopping > > > > Centre. > > > > > > You are its > > > > > > > head… Many members have been > > > appointed in > > > > it. You > > > > > > are directed to > > > > > > > submit a list of their names, addresses > > > and > > > > phone > > > > > > numbers." > > > > > > > Apart from the gross illegality of such > > > a > > > > demand on a > > > > > > trust > > > > > > > constituted as per law with no criminal > > > > charge against > > > > > > it, the > > > > > > > letter proves the police knew > > > Haleem's > > > > whereabouts > > > > > > and were in > > > > > > > touch with him as late as two months > > > ago. > > > > Indeed, the > > > > > > notice > > > > > > > mentions Haleem's home address: 2, > > > Devi > > > > Park > > > > > > Society, near > > > > > > > Baikunth Dham Temple. Haleem's family > > > has > > > > proof that > > > > > > the police > > > > > > > received his reply the next day. > > > > > > > A month later, on June 29, Haleem > > > rushed > > > > telegrams to > > > > > > Gujarat's > > > > > > > director-general of police and > > > Ahmedabad's > > > > police > > > > > > commissioner > > > > > > > claiming that the police forcibly > > > entered > > > > his house > > > > > > that day and > > > > > > > harassed his wife and children in his > > > > absence. "We > > > > > > are peace- > > > > > > > loving and law-abiding citizens and > > > have > > > > never been > > > > > > part of any > > > > > > > illegal activity," Haleem wrote the > > > > telegram in > > > > > > Hindi. "The police > > > > > > > are unlawfully harassing me and my > > > family > > > > without > > > > > > appropriate > > > > > > > cause. This is aviolation of our civil > > > > rights." > > > > > > Predictably, he > > > > > > > didn't hear from either officer. > > > > > > > In April, when a local outfit called > > > Social > > > > Unity > > > > > > & Peace Forum, > > > > > > > which has both Muslims and Hindus as > > > its > > > > members, > > > > > > organised a > > > > > > > socio-religious meeting, it wrote to > > > the > > > > police > > > > > > seeking permission > > > > > > > to use loudspeakers. That application > > > > clearly > > > > > > mentioned that > > > > > > > Haleem would be the main speaker at the > > > > event. > > > > > > Haleem's family > > > > > > > also offers his driving licence, > > > renewed by > > > > the > > > > > > Ahmedabad > > > > > > > transport office on December 28, 2006, > > > as > > > > proof that > > > > > > he led a > > > > > > > normal life all along. Three years ago, > > > in > > > > July 2005, > > > > > > the Gujarati > > > > > > > newspaper Divya Bhaskar had published > > > > Haleem's > > > > > > picture with a > > > > > > > statement he released at a press > > > conference > > > > giving his > > > > > > views on a > > > > > > > raging controversy over the alleged > > > rape of > > > > a woman, > > > > > > Imrana, by > > > > > > > her father-in-law in a village in Uttar > > > > Pradesh. > > > > > > > "It is crazy that we have to prove > > > Maulana > > > > > > Haleem's innocence," > > > > > > > says his friend Haneef Shaikh, who has > > > > appealed to the > > > > > > Gujarat > > > > > > > governor to secure the cleric's > > > release. > > > > Adds Nazir, > > > > > > in whose > > > > > > > house Haleem has lived with his family > > > as > > > > tenant: "I > > > > > > have known > > > > > > > Maulana most closely. He is a man of > > > > religion and has > > > > > > never > > > > > > > indulged in terrorism." Says > > > Haleem's > > > > wife Noor > > > > > > Saba: "I swear by > > > > > > > my children that my husband is not a > > > > terrorist. He is > > > > > > being framed." > > > > > > > Outrage and disbelief is unmistakable > > > in the > > > > > > cleric's > > > > > > > neighbourhood. "Maulana Haleem has > > > helped > > > > hundreds > > > > > > in their daily > > > > > > > lives by imparting them the skills of > > > > patience and > > > > > > fortitude," > > > > > > > says a shaken Ehsanul Haq, a > > > 27-year-old > > > > embroiderer. > > > > > > Haq fishes > > > > > > > out his marriage certificate, the > > > nikaahnama > > > > the > > > > > > Maulana signed > > > > > > > after presiding at his wedding on June > > > 1, to > > > > show that > > > > > > Haleem > > > > > > > wasn't any absconder. Haleem had > > > delivered > > > > a sermon > > > > > > to the guests > > > > > > > at Haq's wedding over loudspeakers > > > that > > > > Haq had > > > > > > installed — with > > > > > > > police permission. > > > > > > > Abdul Haleem, who turned 43 on July 13, > > > > hails from > > > > > > Uttar Pradesh > > > > > > > and has lived in Ahmedabad from 1988. > > > He is > > > > a preacher > > > > > > with a > > > > > > > puritanical Islamic sect called Ahle > > > Hadis > > > > that began > > > > > > on the > > > > > > > subcontinent some 180 years ago and has > > > > survived a > > > > > > frowning Sunni > > > > > > > orthodoxy. The sect lays its store by > > > the > > > > Hadis — > > > > > > the oral > > > > > > > narrative of Prophet Mohammad's life > > > — > > > > as a > > > > > > guiding principle for > > > > > > > Muslims in addition to the Quran. The > > > news > > > > media have > > > > > > long > > > > > > > parroted the police's insinuation > > > that > > > > Ahle-Hadis is > > > > > > a terrorist > > > > > > > outfit linked with Lashkar-e-Tayaba. > > > The > > > > police claim > > > > > > its members > > > > > > > include many terror accused such as > > > those of > > > > the July > > > > > > 2006 Mumbai > > > > > > > train blasts. The sect, with a claimed > > > > membership of > > > > > > 30 million in > > > > > > > India, denies the charge. It points out > > > that > > > > Union > > > > > > Home Minister > > > > > > > Shivraj Patil was the chief guest at > > > its > > > > national > > > > > > symposium two > > > > > > > years ago at New Delhi. > > > > > > > In Ahmedabad, Haleem led the 5,000-odd > > > Ahle > > > > Hadis > > > > > > followers for 14 > > > > > > > years, resigning three years ago to > > > minister > > > > a small > > > > > > mosque so he > > > > > > > could begin life as a scrap dealer to > > > earn a > > > > regular > > > > > > income to > > > > > > > feed his wife and seven children, the > > > oldest > > > > two of > > > > > > whom study at > > > > > > > a madarsa in Delhi. > > > > > > > HALEEM'S TROUBLES had begun soon > > > after the > > > > 2002 > > > > > > anti-Muslim > > > > > > > violence in Gujarat as he involved > > > himself > > > > in relief > > > > > > work at the > > > > > > > camps housing hundreds of Muslim > > > refugees. > > > > An > > > > > > Ahmedabad native > > > > > > > named Shahid Bakshi, who lived in > > > Kuwait and > > > > was > > > > > > visiting his > > > > > > > home, came to meet Haleem with two > > > other > > > > Muslims. One > > > > > > of them was > > > > > > > from Moradabad in Uttar Pradesh who > > > also > > > > lived in > > > > > > Kuwait. The > > > > > > > other was a small-time trader from > > > > Moradabad. The > > > > > > three wanted to > > > > > > > help 10-year-old Muslim orphans of the > > > 2002 > > > > violence > > > > > > by bringing > > > > > > > them free education and care, so Haleem > > > took > > > > them to > > > > > > four refugee > > > > > > > camps. A week later, one camp responded > > > > saying it had > > > > > > found 34 > > > > > > > children for such care. Haleem phoned > > > the > > > > Kuwait > > > > > > expatriate, who > > > > > > > was then in Moradabad, and also wrote > > > to him > > > > about the > > > > > > offer. But > > > > > > > getting no response, the plan died and, > > > > importantly, > > > > > > no children > > > > > > > were ever sent. > > > > > > > Three months later, in August 2002, > > > Delhi > > > > Police > > > > > > arrested Shahid > > > > > > > Bakshi and the other expatriate from > > > Kuwait > > > > allegedly > > > > > > with 4.5 kg > > > > > > > of the explosive material, RDX. The > > > > Moradabad trader > > > > > > was also > > > > > > > arrested from his hometown. All three > > > were > > > > charged > > > > > > under the > > > > > > > Prevention of Terrorism Act for > > > conspiring > > > > to carry > > > > > > out terrorist > > > > > > > acts. Delhi Police found Haleem's > > > letter > > > > (about the > > > > > > camp's offer > > > > > > > of the orphan children) with the > > > expatriate > > > > from > > > > > > Kuwait. As both > > > > > > > Bakshi and Haleem were from Ahmedabad, > > > > police there > > > > > > were informed. > > > > > > > Immediately, Ahmedabad police officer > > > DG > > > > Vanzara > > > > > > called in Haleem > > > > > > > and detained him — illegally — for > > > five > > > > days. > > > > > > (Vanzara is now in > > > > > > > jail, accused of killing Gujarat > > > businessman > > > > > > Sohrabuddin in cold > > > > > > > blood in 2005 and trying to pass him > > > off as > > > > a > > > > > > terrorist.) Haleem's > > > > > > > family frantically filed a petition > > > with the > > > > Gujarat > > > > > > High Court to > > > > > > > secure his release. "The judge > > > ordered the > > > > police to > > > > > > bring Haleem > > > > > > > to the court in two hours," recalls > > > the > > > > > > > family's lawyer, Hashim Qureshi. The > > > > police > > > > > > instantly released > > > > > > > Haleem who rushed to the court where > > > his > > > > statement on > > > > > > his illegal > > > > > > > detention was duly recorded and is part > > > of > > > > official > > > > > > documents. > > > > > > > Even as Delhi Police created the 'RDX > > > > case' > > > > > > against the two > > > > > > > expatriates visiting from Kuwait and > > > the > > > > Moradabad > > > > > > trader, police > > > > > > > in Ahmedabad created a parallel case > > > against > > > > the same > > > > > > individuals > > > > > > > for "luring Muslim youth to train as > > > > terrorists in > > > > > > Moradabad". > > > > > > > This is the case the police and the > > > media > > > > have > > > > > > referred since > > > > > > > Haleem's arrest for the July 26 bomb > > > > blasts to argue > > > > > > that the > > > > > > > cleric was involved in "sending > > > Muslim > > > > youth to > > > > > > train as > > > > > > > terrorists". The Gujarat government > > > lawyer > > > > was > > > > > > openly lying on > > > > > > > Monday when he told the magistrate that > > > > Haleem had > > > > > > sent "30 youth" > > > > > > > toMoradabad for training as terrorists. > > > The > > > > > > charge-sheet in the > > > > > > > case clearly admits that the so-called > > > > conspiracy had > > > > > > remained on > > > > > > > paper and no children ever travelled > > > from > > > > Ahmedabad to > > > > > > Moradabad. > > > > > > > While Delhi's 'RDX case' named > > > Haleem > > > > a witness, > > > > > > Ahmedabad's > > > > > > > 'terrorist training case' named him > > > an > > > > accused and > > > > > > said he was > > > > > > > absconding. The law says the police > > > have to > > > > follow due > > > > > > legal > > > > > > > process before declaring an accused as > > > > absconding. > > > > > > This includes > > > > > > > searches at his house and workplace in > > > view > > > > of > > > > > > independent > > > > > > > witnesses, and recording statements > > > from > > > > neighbours to > > > > > > establish > > > > > > > that the accused has not been seen for > > > a > > > > long time. > > > > > > The Ahmedabad > > > > > > > police did not bother with this > > > exercise. > > > > > > > The entire case against Haleem is based > > > on a > > > > letter he > > > > > > wrote to > > > > > > > the expatriate from Kuwait, Farhan > > > Ahmad > > > > Ali. Dated > > > > > > August 7, > > > > > > > 2002, the letter makes no reference to > > > > terrorist > > > > > > training or any > > > > > > > other unlawful activity. It simply > > > said: > > > > "You had > > > > > > come [to > > > > > > > Ahmedabad] with an 'ahem maqsad' > > > > (important > > > > > > goal)." With a giant > > > > > > > leap of imagination, the police claim > > > that > > > > the words > > > > > > "ahem maqsad" > > > > > > > can only mean a conspiracy for > > > terrorist > > > > training. > > > > > > Haleem wrote > > > > > > > that six of the children were orphans > > > and > > > > the rest > > > > > > poor. He > > > > > > > concluded the letter saying: "I > > > believe > > > > that by > > > > >> god's grace you > > > > > > > will certainly help me in this > > > educational > > > > and > > > > > > constructive > > > > > > > mission to propagate Islam." In his > > > > deposition > > > > > > before a Delhi > > > > > > > court in the 'RDX case', Haleem > > > said he > > > > was told > > > > > > the children will > > > > > > > get "a good education and decent > > > living" > > > > in > > > > > > Moradabad, and had no > > > > > > > clue if Bakshi and the others aimed to > > > train > > > > the > > > > > > children as > > > > > > > terrorists.Last year, the Delhi judge > > > > hearing the > > > > > > 'RDX case' found > > > > > > > Shahid Bakshi and the other expatriate > > > from > > > > Kuwait, > > > > > > Farhan Ahmad > > > > > > > Ali, guilty and sentenced each to seven > > > > years in jail. > > > > > > The court > > > > > > > accepted the police version even though > > > the > > > > only > > > > > > witnesses to the > > > > > > > alleged recovery of RDX were policemen. > > > > Ahmad Ali had > > > > > > claimed that > > > > > > > he was arrested at the airport as he > > > was to > > > > board a > > > > > > flight to > > > > > > > Kuwait, and said he had tickets as > > > proof. > > > > The judge > > > > > > ignored that. > > > > > > > Both Bakshi and Ahmad Ali appealed at > > > the > > > > Delhi High > > > > > > Court against > > > > > > > their conviction. Here is an incredible > > > > twister: while > > > > > > they got > > > > > > > bail from the Delhi High Court despite > > > being > > > > convicted > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > lower court, they were denied bail by > > > the > > > > Gujarat High > > > > > > Court in > > > > > > > the 'terrorist training case' > > > although > > > > no guilt > > > > > > has yet been > > > > > > > established in that case and the > > > Gujarat > > > > crime branch > > > > > > admits their > > > > > > > crime never went beyond hatching the > > > alleged > > > > > > conspiracy. That's > > > > > > > not all. > > > > > > > The Moradabad trader, a frail > > > 56-year-old > > > > man named > > > > > > Hafiz Mohammad > > > > > > > Tahir, was acquitted in the 'RDX > > > case'. > > > > He proved > > > > > > doubly lucky > > > > > > > when the Gujarat High Court granted him > > > bail > > > > in the > > > > > > 'terrorist > > > > > > > training case' in June 2004. In its > > > > eye-opening bail > > > > > > order, the > > > > > > > judge said: "… All that remains > > > against > > > > the > > > > > > present applicant > > > > > > > [Tahir] is that he visited Ahmedabad > > > and had > > > > visited > > > > > > camps to > > > > > > > identify the children so that they can > > > be > > > > better > > > > > > looked after. > > > > > > > That by itself cannot be considered an > > > > offence." > > > > > > > Since Bakshi and Ahmad Ali are accused > > > of > > > > exactly the > > > > > > same crime, > > > > > > > the argument should be valid for them, > > > too. > > > > Yet, > > > > > > another Gujarat > > > > > > > High Court judge denied them bail and > > > both > > > > continue to > > > > > > languish in > > > > > > > jail. Tahir has, meanwhile, moved to > > > > Ahmedabad because > > > > > > the Gujarat > > > > > > > High Court's 2004 bail order said he > > > must > > > > report to > > > > > > the Crime > > > > > > > Branch office in Ahmedabad every > > > Sunday. On > > > > Sunday, > > > > > > July 27, the > > > > > > > morning after the blasts, Tahir visited > > > the > > > > crime > > > > > > branch office > > > > > > > with trepidation. "They grilled me > > > four > > > > hours on the > > > > > > blasts," > > > > > > > Tahir told TEHELKA. "I was glad when > > > they > > > > let me > > > > > > go." > > > > > > > The hearing in the 'terrorist > > > training > > > > case' is > > > > > > nearly over. It is > > > > > > > to be seen if a separate trial will be > > > > called against > > > > > > Haleem, > > > > > > > since he is no more "absconding". > > > > Meanwhile, > > > > > > Haleem's family is > > > > > > > worried stiff over the next meal and > > > the > > > > next > > > > > > month's house rent > > > > > > > of Rs 2,500. Haleem's wife says she > > > has no > > > > savings. > > > > > > His lone > > > > > > > employee, a daily labourer, is trying > > > to run > > > > > > Haleem's scrap shop. > > > > > > > SADLY, MAULANA Abdul Haleem's story > > > is > > > > anything but > > > > > > rare. One > > > > > > > glaring case concerns a "family of > > > > terrorists". On > > > > > > July 15, a > > > > > > > posse of policemen arrested 28-year-old > > > > Mohammad > > > > > > Muqeemuddin Yasir > > > > > > > as he returned home at night from his > > > > father's > > > > > > workshop in > > > > > > > Hyderabad. Ten days later, when serial > > > bomb > > > > blasts > > > > > > rocked > > > > > > > Bangalore on July 25 killing two > > > people, > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > > Police > > > > > > > Commissioner Prasanna Rao told the > > > Hindustan > > > > Times > > > > > > newspaper that, > > > > > > > during interrogation, Yasir had > > > confessed > > > > that before > > > > > > his arrest, > > > > > > > he had taken terror "operatives" to > > > > Karnataka and > > > > > > "arranged safe > > > > > > > houses" for them. Of course, Yasir > > > denies > > > > the > > > > > > confession. "I > > > > > > > haven't told them anything," Yasir > > > told > > > > his > > > > > > mother, Tasleem > > > > > > > Fatima, when she visited him at the > > > jail on > > > > July 29. > > > > > > "The police > > > > > > > are lying." Fatima told TEHELKA her > > > son > > > > was tortured > > > > > > during what > > > > > > > the police commissioner calls > > > > "interrogation". > > > > > > "He was hung upside > > > > > > > down and beaten," she said. > > > > > > > Apart from the fact that a confession > > > made > > > > to the > > > > > > police is > > > > > > > inadmissible as evidence before a judge > > > > (never mind > > > > > > that the news > > > > > > > media accept confessions as gospel), > > > > Yasir's alleged > > > > > > confession, > > > > > > > if true, should be a slap on the face > > > of the > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > > Police. > > > > > > > After all, Yasir is an ex-SIMI member > > > whose > > > > father and > > > > > > one brother >> > > > > > are jailed on charges of terrorism. > > > > Yasir's father, > > > > > > 56-yearold > > > > > > > Maulana Mohammad Nasiruddin, is a > > > > wellrespected cleric > > > > > > who has now > > > > > > > incarcerated in Sabarmati jail in > > > Ahmedabad > > > > for nearly > > > > > > four years > > > > > > > and has been denied bail all the way up > > > to > > > > the Supreme > > > > > > Court. > > > > > > > Yasir's younger brother, Riasuddin > > > Nasir, > > > > is jailed > > > > > > in Karnataka's > > > > > > > Belgaum district since he was arrested > > > in > > > > January. > > > > > > > With his brother and father suspected > > > as > > > > dreaded > > > > > > terrorists, the > > > > > > > Hyderabad Police should have kept tabs > > > on > > > > Yasir all > > > > > > the time and > > > > > > > instantly known if he was aiding > > > terrorists. > > > > That the > > > > > > police > > > > > > > didn't catch Yasir "arranging safe > > > > houses" for > > > > > > terrorists in > > > > > > > Karnataka is because he probably never > > > did > > > > any such > > > > > > thing. This > > > > > > > reporter interviewed Yasir in Hyderabad > > > a > > > > month before > > > > > > his arrest, > > > >> > > on his birthday on June 12, at an > > > > engineering workshop > > > > > > that his > > > > > > > father had set up three decades ago > > > with > > > > borrowed > > > > > > money and skills > > > > > > > picked up as an assistant to a roadside > > > > mechanic. In > > > > > > the din of > > > > > > > machines, Yasir was happily engaged in > > > > managing > > > > > > customers crowding > > > > > > > the small front office. "My father > > > and > > > > brother have > > > > > > been framed," > > > > > > > he forcefully told TEHELKA. > > > > > > > A shy man with a Boy Scout smile, Yasir > > > > seems a victim > > > > > > of patently > > > > > > > bogus cases against him. He was a > > > member of > > > > SIMI when > > > > > > it was > > > > > > > banned by the Centre on September 27, > > > 2001. > > > > (Given the > > > > > > relentless > > > > > > > government propaganda against SIMI, the > > > > reader might > > > > > > find it hard > > > > > > > to believe that no court in India has > > > yet > > > > upheld the > > > > > > charge of > > > > > > > terrorism against SIMI as an > > > organisation.) > > > > Yasir > > > > > > echoed dozens > > > > > > > others interviewed by this reporter > > > across > > > > India in > > > > > > saying that > > > > > > > SIMI was a platform for "deep > > > religious > > > > training and > > > > > > self- > > > > > > > purification", and not for acts of > > > > terrorism or > > > > > > anti-India > > > > > > > conspiracies. "SIMI took up issues of > > > > atrocities on > > > > > > Muslims from > > > > > > > Chechnya to Kashmir," Yasir said. > > > "It > > > > never gave > > > > > > up the issue of > > > > > > > the Babri Masjid, and this attracted > > > many of > > > > us." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ON THE night before SIMI was banned, > > > the > > > > police > > > > > > arrested Yasir and > > > > > > > booked him with the other two SIMI > > > > representatives in > > > > > > Hyderabad > > > > > > > under the Unlawful Activities > > > (Prevention) > > > > Act. A > > > > > > magistrate gave > > > > > > > them bail the next day. A day later, > > > the > > > > police > > > > > > slapped another > > > > > > > case against the three, alleging that > > > one of > > > > them was > > > > > > arrested > > > > > > > making a speech against the government. > > > The > > > > other two, > > > > > > including > > > > > > > Yasir, were shown as absconding. They > > > went > > > > back to the > > > > > > court and > > > > > > > were sent to jail, where Yasir spent 29 > > > days > > > > before > > > > > > securing bail. > > > > > > > Seven years have gone by. Trial is yet > > > to > > > > begin. > > > > > > > Worse is the fate of Yasir's father, > > > a > > > > firebrand > > > > > > cleric who never > > > > > > > held his tongue in public speeches > > > against > > > > the > > > > > > government, > > > > > > > especially on issues such as the Babri > > > > Masjid > > > > > > demolition and the > > > > > > > 2002 anti-Muslim violence of Gujarat. > > > > Embroiled in > > > > > > cooked-up > > > > > > > cases, in several of which he was > > > > subsequently > > > > > > acquitted, Maulana > > > > > > > Nasiruddin was asked by the Hyderabad > > > Police > > > > to report > > > > > > at their > > > > > > > office regularly. > > > > > > > On one such day in October 2004, when > > > > Maulana > > > > > > Nasiruddin reached > > > > > > > the police station, he was arrested by > > > a > > > > police team > > > > > > from > > > > > > > Ahmedabad for his alleged involvement > > > in a > > > > terror > > > > > > conspiracy in > > > > > > > Gujarat, including the March 2003 > > > murder of > > > > former > > > > > > Gujarat Home > > > > > > > Minister, Haren Pandya. (The only > > > evidence > > > > against > > > > > > Maulana > > > > > > > Nasiruddin is his confession, which, in > > > a > > > > letter to > > > > > > the court, he > > > > > > > has denied making.) > > > > > > > Local Muslims who had gone with the > > > Maulana > > > > to the > > > > > > police station > > > > > > > began protesting as he was led out. At > > > this, > > > > Gujarat > > > > > > police > > > > > > > officer Narendra Amin took out his > > > service > > > > revolver > > > > > > and shot dead > > > > > > > one protestor. All hell broke loose. > > > > Nasiruddin's > > > > > > supporters > > > > > > > refused to move the dead protestor's > > > body > > > > unless the > > > > > > police filed > > > > > > > an FIR against Amin. Finally, Hyderabad > > > > police filed > > > > > > two cases > > > > > > > back to back: One, their own, against > > > the > > > > protestors > > > > > > for blocking > > > > > > > the Maulana's arrest; and the other, > > > under > > > > pressure, > > > > > > against > > > > > > > Narendra Amin, for shooting the > > > protestor. > > > > > > > The case against Amin hasn't moved an > > > inch > > > > in four > > > > > > years. The > > > > > > > Hyderabad police ought to have seized > > > his > > > > revolver and > > > > > > sent it for > > > > > > > a forensic examination, along with the > > > > bullet > > > > > > recovered from the > > > > > > > dead protestor's body. They should > > > have > > > > arrested and > > > > > > produced Amin > > > > > > > before a magistrate. This is an > > > > open-and-shut case if > > > > > > there ever > > > > > > > was one: with the weapon of homicide > > > > matching the > > > > > > bullet, and > > > > > > > dozens of eyewitnesses. Of course, none > > > of > > > > this > > > > > > happened. Amin > > > > > > > proceeded to Ahmedabad with Maulana > > > > Nasiruddin in his > > > > > > custody. The > > > > > > > FIR against him has become a dead > > > letter. > > > > > > > Amin is the same police officer who was > > > > subsequently > > > > > > accused of > > > > > > > killing Kausar Bi, the wife of Gujarat > > > > businessman > > > > > > Sohrabuddin who > > > > > > > was killed by police officer Vanzara in > > > 2005 > > > > (as > > > > > > mentioned above > > > > > > > in Haleem's story). Like Vanzara, > > > Amin, > > > > too, is now > > > > > > in jail. > > > > > > > MEANWHILE, A tragedy has befallen the > > > main > > > > complainant > > > > > > against > > > > > > > Amin in the Hyderabad shootout case. > > > This is > > > > none > > > > > > other than 20- > > > > > > > year-old Nasir, Maulana Nasiruddin's > > > > youngest son > > > > > > and Yasir's > > > > > > > youngest brother. On January 11 this > > > year, > > > > Nasir was > > > > > > arrested by > > > > > > > police in Karnataka with another person > > > and > > > > was > > > > > > accused of > > > > > > > stealing the motorcycle they were > > > allegedly > > > > riding. > > > > > > Claiming a > > > > > > > knife was found on the two, the police > > > > slapped charges > > > > > > such as > > > > > > > 'waging war against State' on Nasir > > > and > > > > his > > > > > > co-accused. > > > > > > > Amazingly, the police filed seven > > > > confessions from the > > > > > > two accused > > > > > > > over the next 18 days. Not one showed > > > them > > > > saying they > > > > > > were SIMI > > > > > > > members. Police then filed their eighth > > > > confessions in > > > > > > which they > > > > > > > allegedly accepted being SIMI members > > > and > > > > the > > > > > > attendant terror > > > > > > > charges. Ninety days later, when the > > > police > > > > failed to > > > > > > file a > > > > > > > charge-sheet, Nasir's lawyer landed > > > at the > > > > > > magistrate's house who > > > > > > > then had no option but to grant bail as > > > per > > > > law. But > > > > > > by this time, > > > > > > > the police had implicated Nasir in > > > another > > > > case of > > > > > > conspiracy, so > > > > > > > he continues in jail. Of course, Nasir > > > has > > > > retracted > > > > > > his > > > > > > > confessions alleging torture. Yet, he > > > has > > > > little hope > > > > > > against > > > > > > > biases in the judicial system. > > > > > > > Magistrate B. Jinaralkar, who sent the > > > two > > > > accused to > > > > > > police > > > > > > > custody, told TEHELKA reporter Sanjana > > > the > > > > following > > > > > > in an interview: > > > > > > > "Even as I was signing the necessary > > > > papers > > > > > > remanding them to > > > > > > > judicial custody, Asadullah [the other > > > > accused] > > > > > > stepped forward > > > > > > > requesting to speak with me. He told me > > > that > > > > the > > > > > > police denied > > > > > > > them food and water and subjected them > > > to > > > > repeated > > > > > > beatings. He > > > > > > > proceeded to show me the bruises on > > > > Nasir's body. > > > > > > The two > > > > > > > repeatedly made a reference to human > > > rights > > > > violation > > > > > > by the > > > > > > > police and demanded medical attention. > > > > > > > "I was very surprised by three > > > things: > > > > they were > > > > > > talking of their > > > > > > > fundamental rights in an authoritative > > > > manner, they > > > > > > spoke English > > > > > > > and, further, they readily admitted > > > that > > > > they had > > > > > > stolen the bike, > > > > > > > something most thieves never do in my > > > > experience." > > > > > > > When a police sub-inspector phoned the > > > > magistrate > > > > > > "warning" that > > > > > > > the accused shouldn't be sent to > > > judicial > > > > custody, > > > > > > the magistrate > > > > > > > asked the evidence to be brought to > > > this > > > > house. "The > > > > > > materials > > > > > > > produced before me included duplicate > > > > identity cards, > > > > > > a fancy > > > > > > > dagger, a map of South India with red > > > marks > > > > against > > > > > > Udupi and Goa, > > > > > > > an American dollar, two pieces of paper > > > with > > > > www.com > > > > > > written on > > > > > > > one and 'Jungle King behind back > > > me' on > > > > another. > > > > > > > "When I looked at these materials in > > > their > > > > entirety, > > > > > > I felt that > > > > > > > these were definitely not just bike > > > thieves. > > > > Why would > > > > > > bike > > > > > > > thieves carry around duplicate identity > > > > cards and a > > > > > > map of South > > > > > > > India? The fact that they had an > > > American > > > > dollar > > > > > > seemed to suggest > > > > > > > they had international links. The paper > > > with > > > > www.com > > > > > > indicated to > > > > > > > me that they were tech-savvy. The other > > > > piece of paper > > > > > > had a > > > > > > > message that seemed to be a sort of > > > code > > > > that I could > > > > > > not > > > > > > > immediately decipher. Also, when I > > > examined > > > > the South > > > > > > India map, > > > > > > > Udupi had a sort of indication with a > > > red > > > > marker > > > > > > against it. > > > > > > > Perhaps they were planning to strike at > > > the > > > > place > > > > > > during a > > > > > > > religious function. > > > > > > > "All these suggested that there were > > > > definitely > > > > > > enough grounds in > > > > > > > my opinion to grant the police custody > > > of > > > > Nasir and > > > > > > Asadullah to > > > > > > > facilitate further investigations." > > > Go > > > > figure. > > > > > > > So is there hope for Maulana Haleem, > > > > Muqeemuddin > > > > > > Yasir, Maulana > > > > > > > Nasiruddin and Riasuddin Nasir? The > > > boys' > > > > mother > > > > > > doesn't think so. > > > > > > > "Why don't the police put us all > > > > together in > > > > > > jail," she told > > > > > > > TEHELKA, her voice shaking with rage. > > > > "Then they can > > > > > > shoot all of > > > > > > > us dead." • > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited > > > storage. > > > > Get it now, > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools- > 08.html/> > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > > > > media and the > > > > > > city. > > > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > > > > > list > > > > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without > > > downloading > > > > messenger. Go > > > > > to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did you know? You can CHAT without downloading > > > messenger. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > > > header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > > > > > Check out the all-new face of Yahoo! India. Go to > > http://in.yahoo.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > -- > Partha Dasgupta > +919811047132 > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Mon Aug 11 23:49:13 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 18:19:13 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Profile: Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Kashmiri leader Killed in police firing in Srinagar In-Reply-To: <841872.64068.qm@web27805.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <845426.66990.qm@web27804.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Profile Sheikh Abdul Aziz (1952-2008) Chairman Jammu Kashmir People’s League By Murtaza Shibli One of the prominent leaders of the Kashmiri resistance movement, 55 year old Sheikh Abdul Aziz was killed by the bullets of Indian paramilitary forces on 11th August 2008 while leading a peaceful public demonstration against the ‘economic blockade’ of the Kashmiri Muslims being enforced by militant Indian Hindu groups allegedly with the tacit support of the Indian government. He was born in 1952 in Namblabal, Pampore close to the capital city Srinagar but in Pulwama district. Soon after passing his 10th grade from a local school, Aziz joined his father’s agriculture business including growing high yield saffron, for which Pampore Township is famous throughout the Kashmir valley. http://www.kashmiraffairs.org/sheik_aziz_profile.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From cubbykabi at yahoo.com Mon Aug 11 23:49:37 2008 From: cubbykabi at yahoo.com (kabi cubby sherman) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 23:49:37 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Fw: Queer Azadi March (Please circulate widely and do join us) Message-ID: <660809.44026.qm@web94710.mail.in2.yahoo.com> Meter Down - kaali-peeli ki kahaani podcast: http://feeds.feedburner.com/meterdown blog: http://meterdown.wordpress.com From: labia india To: labia gmail Sent: Monday, 11 August, 2008 11:26:38 PM Subject: Queer Azadi March (Please circulate widely and do join us) Queer Azadi March August Kranti Maidan to Girgaum Chowpatty 16th August 2008 Who is ‘queer’?Queer was originally used as a put-down, but the word was reclaimed as a positive marker of identity by those of us whom society considered odd, strange or abnormal. We use the word to refer to all people marginalisedby a society that is narrowly defined by hetero-normativity and by the male-female gender binary. Lesbian, gay, bisexual, hijra, transgender, kothi, panthi, intersex… all who identify with words like these have gathered here today under the umbrella of the “queer” community. What’s the slogan “queer azadi” about?This country achieved Independence on 15th August, 1947, but its countless queer citizens are still not free. We have no rights, and no place in a society that refuses to accept us for who we are. And that is why we’ve chosen 16th August as Queer Azadi Diwas, so that we may be seen and heard, and in order to bring to the notice of both our society and our government some issues that concern us This event is not just for the queer communities.Many others will be there to encourage and support us — family members, friends, colleagues; NGOs, women’s groups, human rights organizations, and trade unionists; educational institutions and their students. We invite you to join us on our march as well and to raise your voice along with ours. We will gather at August Kranti Maidan 2:30 pm onwards. Organised by: Aanchal Trust, Astitva, Dai Welfare Society, GayBombay, Humsaaya, Humsafar Trust, INFOSEM, Lesbians and Bisexuals in Action, Queer Media Collective, Rainbow Pride Connexion,Sakhi Char Chowghi, Salvation Star, Sarathi, Symphony in Pink LESBIANS ON THE LINE 9833278171 Mondays, Wednesdays and Saturdays (5pm - 8pm) You can also reach us at: LABIA/ Stree Sangam P.O. Box 16613 Mumbai 400 019. Connect with friends all over the world. Get Yahoo! India Messenger at http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/?wm=n/ DEFANGED.5240> ----- Forwarded Message ---- From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 00:15:34 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 00:15:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Profile: Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Kashmiri leader Killed in police firing in Srinagar In-Reply-To: <845426.66990.qm@web27804.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <841872.64068.qm@web27805.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <845426.66990.qm@web27804.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808111145g2b2d4d00m280d6dc25dc00a43@mail.gmail.com> The Economic Blockade is merely "A Myth" created to divert attention from real issue of Amarnath. Its the biggest example of religious and cultural intollerance shown by Kashmiri Muslims and their so called leaders... And, militant Indian Hindu groups....LOL I wonder what Murtaza means. Sheikh Abdul Aziz was earlier a terrorist who later turned into a Hurriyat Propagandist. On 8/11/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > Profile > > Sheikh Abdul Aziz (1952-2008) > Chairman Jammu Kashmir People's League > By Murtaza Shibli > One of the prominent leaders of the Kashmiri resistance movement, 55 year > old Sheikh Abdul Aziz was killed by the bullets of Indian paramilitary > forces on 11th August 2008 while leading a peaceful public demonstration > against the 'economic blockade' of the Kashmiri Muslims being enforced by > militant Indian Hindu groups allegedly with the tacit support of the Indian > government. He was born in 1952 in Namblabal, Pampore close to the capital > city Srinagar but in Pulwama district. Soon after passing his 10th grade > from a local school, Aziz joined his father's agriculture business including > growing high yield saffron, for which Pampore Township is famous throughout > the Kashmir valley. > http://www.kashmiraffairs.org/sheik_aziz_profile.html > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From taraprakash at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 00:41:15 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 15:11:15 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Profile: Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Kashmiri leader Killed in police firing in Srinagar References: <841872.64068.qm@web27805.mail.ukl.yahoo.com><845426.66990.qm@web27804.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <6353c690808111145g2b2d4d00m280d6dc25dc00a43@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001c01c8fbe6$0f993d90$6500a8c0@taraprakash> "And, militant Indian Hindu groups....LOL I wonder what Murtaza means." Perhaps those groups in India who speak for Hinduism and are based in India? I agree that it is a callous usage. It is not fair to bring in entire community just because some people belonging to it have formed some groups which turn militant at the slightest opportunity. Looking it from a different perspective, Hinduism supposedly teaches tolerance. The groups who could not tolerate a small chunk of land not being given to the Amarnath shrine board, cannot/should not be considered Hindu. So Murtaza's use of adjective Hindu is not correct. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aditya Raj Kaul" To: Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 2:45 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Profile: Sheikh Abdul Aziz,Kashmiri leader Killed in police firing in Srinagar > The Economic Blockade is merely "A Myth" created to divert attention from > real issue of Amarnath. Its the biggest example of religious and cultural > intollerance shown by Kashmiri Muslims and their so called leaders... > > And, militant Indian Hindu groups....LOL I wonder what Murtaza means. > > Sheikh Abdul Aziz was earlier a terrorist who later turned into a Hurriyat > Propagandist. > > > > > On 8/11/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: >> >> Profile >> >> Sheikh Abdul Aziz (1952-2008) >> Chairman Jammu Kashmir People's League >> By Murtaza Shibli >> One of the prominent leaders of the Kashmiri resistance movement, 55 year >> old Sheikh Abdul Aziz was killed by the bullets of Indian paramilitary >> forces on 11th August 2008 while leading a peaceful public demonstration >> against the 'economic blockade' of the Kashmiri Muslims being enforced by >> militant Indian Hindu groups allegedly with the tacit support of the >> Indian >> government. He was born in 1952 in Namblabal, Pampore close to the >> capital >> city Srinagar but in Pulwama district. Soon after passing his 10th grade >> from a local school, Aziz joined his father's agriculture business >> including >> growing high yield saffron, for which Pampore Township is famous >> throughout >> the Kashmir valley. >> http://www.kashmiraffairs.org/sheik_aziz_profile.html >> >> Send instant messages to your online friends >> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From nc-agricowi at netcologne.de Mon Aug 11 15:27:45 2008 From: nc-agricowi at netcologne.de (artNET) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 11:57:45 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BAnnouncements=5D_Call_for_entries?= =?iso-8859-1?q?=3A_VideoChannel=3A_=22MOTHER=22?= Message-ID: <20080811115745.1289C35D.705D48D6@192.168.0.2> Call for entries Deadline 1 September 2008 VideoChannel - video project environments http://videochannel.newmediafest.org launched a new videoart project, entitled "MOTHER" and invites video and film creators for participating and contributing. --->imagine, your mother is dying and you face her death coming closer and the radical definitiveness, eventually she died already and the processes of memory find slowly their shape, or you have found already the balance of memory telling, for you, she will never be dead and live in your heart as long as you live, eventually you left your familiy and are living far away from your mother, but eventually you live close to your mother, but the course of life events is blocking any contacting.....<---- . --->VideoChannel always tried to bring a very personal note into the otherwise anonymous online enviroment via its videoart projects related to "memory & identity", and the subject of "Mother" is particularly intimate and personal <----- "Mother" as a theme refers in first place to everybody's mother or grandmother, the relation of a mother and their children or child, and how people, in general, or the creator in particular deal with the loss of a mother. Every human being is a child of a mother, without the mother, there is no family , no tribe, no people, no society, no social future, but "mother" can be interpreted also in different ways, the language uses "mother" in electronics for instance in "motherboard", or in a figurative sense as the roots or basics of being. Please find the regulations and entry form on http://www.nmartproject.net/netex/?p=292 ----------------------------------------- VideoChannel - video project environments http://videochannel.newmediafest.org is a corporate part of [NewMediaArtProjectNetwork]:||cologne http://www.nmartproject.net _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From logos.theword at gmail.com Mon Aug 11 17:35:02 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 17:35:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Selves, Masks, Performance - A Theatre Workshop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808110505p6bd6b0bagc367d6839be0b71b@mail.gmail.com> Maya Gallery of Contemporary Art and Logos Theatre present 'Selves, Masks, Performance' - an introductory workshop on theatre. The focus of the workshop is two-fold - to learn the basics of performing on stage by building the essential resources of an actor such as breathing techniques, voice, physical skills, improvization, etc.; and also to learn from theatre, i.e. to work on communication and expression skills, conflict resolution, etc., by using theatre techniques. The workshop focuses on contemporary experimental and alternative theatre techniques and emphasizes imaginative use of space, body and movement. It will also be interdisciplinary in nature and will cover aspects of devising a performance through the usage of forms like poetry, music, literature, visual arts, as well as personal life experiences. It will culminate with a staged rehearsal of work-in-progress, created during the workshop. It will be facilitated by Arka Mukhopadhyay, who is the founder and aristic director of Logos Theatre. He is a director, poet, and performer who works with theatre, performance poetry, storytelling and performance art. The topics include: - Breath and voice - Physical preparation, movement and self awareness - Working with space - Emoting - Improvizations - Images and sculpts - An interdisciplinary approach to performance - using music, visual arts, poetry, etc. Venue: Maya Gallery of Contemporary Art, # 59, Nandidurga Road (Behind the Airtel office and Elements restaurant) Dates: August 25th onwards Time: 19:00 - 21:00 Fees: 3,000/- (2,500/- for full time students with valid ID cards) Registration forms are available at the gallery. Registration deadline: August 21st. For further details, e - mail: contact at logostheatreindia.org Call: 9880966313 -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 India www.logostheatreindia.org google group: http://groups.google.com/group/logostheatre (to subscribe by e-mail: logostheatre-subscribe at googlegroups.com) -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From anansi1 at earthlink.net Tue Aug 12 18:08:29 2008 From: anansi1 at earthlink.net (Paul Miller) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 08:38:29 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] South Asia for Barack Obama on 8/12 with Kal Penn, Mira Nair & others References: <411B2BFA4AE64942BDB5808D21039E62@shrus.onsus.win2003.hostway> Message-ID: <7A66FA89-7D43-4D9B-9F96-FD18C3C9F113@earthlink.net> just thought I'd forward this to the list. Yes, it's New York centric, but there'll be alot of progressives from different scenes. gasp - multi-culturalism... Paul Begin forwarded message: > From: > Date: August 12, 2008 8:10:20 AM EDT > To: > Subject: Support Barack Obama on 8/12 with Kal Penn, Mira Nair & > others > > > Alright guys its crunch time!!! We are looking great but we need to > keep pushing. If you have not bought your ticket yet, please buy it > today! I know you are doing the best you can but many of your > friends have yet to purchase tickets, so please reach out to them. > Tickets will be $125 dollars at the door, no exceptions. So folks > you have until 3 o clock tomorrow. We are really trying to avoid a > massive rush of people buying tickets at the door to prevent a last > minute nightmare - and we want to start on time! > > Please also tell your friends to get there at 7:30 sharp. > > Again, thanks for all of your help- this event is going to be a huge > success because of your support. > > Warm regards, aroon > > The Asian American Finance Committee > South Asians for Obama * DNC South Asian American Leadership Council > Generation Obama * DNC Trailblazers Council > with > MADHUR JAFFREY & SARITA CHOUDHURY > > Cordially invite you to join > > KAL PENN * MIRA NAIR > MAULIK PANCHOLY * AASIF MANDVI > with > Karsh Kale, DJ Rekha, & Falu > Trendroid, Bollygirl v. Dimm, DJ BunnyLove, DJ Nihal & others > > In Support of Senator Barack Obama > and Obama Victory Fund > > Tuesday, August 12, 2008 > Doors open at 7:00 PM > VIP Reception at 6:30 PM > > Hiro Ballroom & Lounge > At the Maritime Hotel > 363 W 16th St, NY, NY > > Guest - $100 > > VIP Guest - $250 > Sponsor - $2,500 (write/raise) > Event Host - $5,000 > > RSVP online: http://my.barackobama.com/nycSA > > For more information or to be a Sponsor or Host, please contact > Gautam Raghavan at 202-427-1392 or > RaghavanG at dnc.org > > > Send this to a friend > Unable to read this email: click here > Click here to unsubscribe > From logos.theword at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 18:23:10 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 18:23:10 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A question for Arka In-Reply-To: <56866.10991.qm@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <33bc2ee60808090143l4631ab71u36b6f2ba70b88479@mail.gmail.com> <56866.10991.qm@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808120553j1d3d70f4j73dd231b5d8cf55d@mail.gmail.com> Dear Arnab, Thanks for the question(s). While it is a very legitimate question, I can't quite see how it's a logical dilemma. Surely, it is a matter of choice? Because, contrary to arundhati's fulminations, of course i am not obligated to return the money. i am however, doing this as a matter of principle and a fitting reply. therefore, the choice of how i disburse the money is surely mine. but more to the point, i am spreading it over five years to encourage multiple people to speak out against the tatas over a period of time. as i said in the earlier post, five grand is a pittance, compared to IFa's .5 million grants to the artistic equivalents of white elephants, but it is still something. and for people with genuine ideas and fire in the belly, it can be more than enough. besides, as i also mentioned earlier, this is the catalyst so that others, those who still have a backbone left, pitch in and increase the endowment, in the spirit of true art. i am not looking at institutionalizing it, but rather creating a loose community for which this could be the spark off point, in the footsteps of dada. as for the second part of your question - no the maoists do not qualify because i have never said i'll give it out for anything that is illegal. that raises many thorny questions, about how oppressive laws themselves are invalid in the first place. of course they are, and i'd protest against them myself, and against the persecution of innocent people - just about everybody who dares to raise a voice, branding them maoists. however, i personally do not endorse armed, violent activism, and since this is my money, well... so to answer you - i have very clearly stated i am looking at two things - artistic endeavours, and people/organizations working for/with victims of the tatas. please wait for a formal announcement on this and other lists about this. so if your friends pissing/ masturbating is done in a way that qualifies as performance art (in my book - again because it's my money we are talking about), then yes, they'd be eligible. but not merely for saying they want to do it - for actually doing it. lastly, it turns out that my mentioning of dow in the original post wasn't far off the mark - ratan tata happens to be the leader of a consortium that wants the government to drop cases against dow in return for a one time dole. and we still continue to have our heads in the sand. warm regards, arka On 10/08/2008, ARNAB CHATTERJEE wrote: > > > > > -- > >The question and the dilemma is, Arka, why aren't > > u awarding the full > > 25000/- for anti tata work ( affiliated t> The o > your > declared Trust)instead of > > > only 5000/-? Secondly, what would be the distinctively > > anti TATA activity? > > > For instance I might conjecture the maoists are surely > > working not only > > > against the TATA's but also the BATA's and so > > on and at a threateningly > > > higher level -this applies to Nandigram too.So who > > would win your award and > > > why? Any singular individual, visible and legal, would > > surely be defeated by > > > the maoists entering the competition; please keep > > them out. Wouldn't you? > > > The question is , how do you resolve these, plz let me > > know since I know > > > some who would like to apply. Though I am far from approving or > endorsing them, One of them says s/he pisses on any TATA's photo, another > says s/he masturbates. Who would win ? I'm really anxious. This is becoming > really serious eh.... > > > thank you > > > arnab > > > > > > > > > --- On Fri, 8/8/08, Logos Theatre > > wrote: > > > > > >> From: Logos Theatre > > > > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] A suggestion for Arka > > >> To: reader-list at sarai.net > > >> Date: Friday, 8 August, 2008, 12:33 PM > > >> > > > >> > Dear Arundhati, > > >> > > >> Thank you for your retort, which proves > > that > > >> even the mighty IFA > > >> (in the person of you, its deputy director), needs > > to > > >> bestir itself to quell > > >> voices of dissent that challenge its monopoly as > > the high > > >> priest of high art > > >> in this country. Interesting, how the high and > > mighty tend > > >> to be also > > >> mightily thin - skinned. You also sent me the same > > mail to > > >> my private ID. I > > >> have told you in my reply there that as far as TFA > > is > > >> concerned, you have > > >> brought something intensely personal into a very > > public > > >> space, and I shall > > >> not stoop to the bait of responding to that here. > > If that > > >> gives you a sense > > >> of triumph, so be it. There are other parts of > > your mail > > >> which, however, I > > >> will respond to. So here goes: > > >> > > >> > > >> *Arka, > > >> > > > >> > I have been reading some of the stuff that > > you have > > >> been writing on the > > >> > Sarai list - your opinions about the Tatas > > and IFA - > > >> which is supported in > > >> > its various programmes by institutions like > > the Tata > > >> Trusts, the Ford > > >> > Foundation and many other organisations and > > >> individuals who find IFA's work > > >> > worth supporting.* > > >> > > >> > > >> You start off by being an apologist > > for the > > >> Tatas. Good! The > > >> basic message of my tirade is not about the > > quality of > > >> IFA's work and > > >> whether it's worth supporting - as I have said > > here on > > >> an earlier occasion, > > >> that's worth another debate by itself. But > > while on > > >> that, yes, I do think > > >> IFA on the whole funds ivory tower art that has no > > locus of > > >> significance > > >> outside its incestuous little circle of mutual > > >> back-patting. Further, it > > >> renders a disservice to the cause of true artistic > > enquiry > > >> by imposing a > > >> hierarchy of academic elitism, thereby snuffing > > out the > > >> voices of true > > >> practitioners who are not interested in spewing > > academic > > >> gobbledygook. Which > > >> is not to say that it has not funded genuninely > > >> invigorating artistic > > >> endeavours - it has. About Ram by Katkatha > > immediately > > >> comes to mind. But > > >> for the most part, it perpetuates dinosaurs and > > living > > >> fossils and turns a > > >> deaf ear to younger, emergent voices, unless such > > voices > > >> have the > > >> appropriate 'brand tags'. So yes, on the > > whole IFA > > >> promotes art that is > > >> spurious and dishonest. And this is not my > > viewpoint alone, > > >> but something > > >> shared by many, many practitioners who are in > > touch with > > >> the grassroots. As > > >> examples of people who by dint of their work > > should, by any > > >> system of logic, > > >> have got artistic funding; Parnab Mukherjee, > > Pritam > > >> Koilpillai and Abhishek > > >> Majumdar spring readily to mind. > > >> However, my basic point was that > > art > > >> cannot exist in a > > >> moral vaccum. Art that is created with dirty money > > is, > > >> I'm sorry to say, not > > >> art. If today you turn a blind eye to the > > Tatas' > > >> misdeeds (Ford of course is > > >> no shining exemplar of ethics either), will you > > turn an > > >> equally blind eye to > > >> Dow Chemicals if they offer you a juicy little > > dole > > >> tomorrow? Going by your > > >> stance, I suppose the answer is quite evident. My > > respect > > >> for IFA would have > > >> been immense if, in the wake of Singur, you guys > > had > > >> renounced their money. > > >> But of course, what matter where my money comes > > from, as > > >> long as it does > > >> come, right? > > >> > > >> *You have suggested to artists not to accept funds > > from > > >> organisations that > > >> > are supported with money 'tainted' > > because of > > >> its source ( which makes > > >> > almost all money tainted if you really look > > hard and > > >> find the 'source' where > > >> > it originally came from one way or the > > other).* > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Once again, your capacity for deluding yourself is > > >> astounding. There are > > >> always degrees of association, and while one might > > carp on > > >> the 'money is the > > >> root of all evil' line, the fact is that a > > direct line > > >> of credit from an > > >> unethical corporate entity is an altogether > > different > > >> matter from money > > >> which, at some level, has passed through tainted > > hands. > > >> Once again, my > > >> appeal was to fellow artists to reject money that > > directly > > >> comes from the > > >> Tatas. And I might as well say, I did not make > > that appeal > > >> with any real > > >> hope that people would respond to it. It was more > > to expose > > >> the abysmal > > >> levels of hypocrisy and apathy the contemporary > > >> 'artiste' has sunk to, > > >> content to sit in his/her guilded cage, as long as > > the > > >> grants, residencies > > >> and funding keep coming. Of course, there are > > other > > >> artists, those without > > >> the 'e' at the end, who are not written > > about, do > > >> not perform in glitzy > > >> venues in European cities at sundry bienalles and > > >> festivals, but whose art > > >> has not lost the smell of the soil. These do not > > depend on > > >> handouts from > > >> morally bankrupt entities to create their art - > > their art > > >> comes from their > > >> blood. > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> *I recall that you have received an award of Rs > > 25,000 > > >> (Rupees Twenty five > > >> > Thousand) from Toto Funds the Arts (TFA), for > > creative > > >> writing in Feb 2008. > > >> > TFA is an organisation that is mainly funded > > by > > >> individuals like me, Mr > > >> > Suresh Kumar, and many others who believe > > that TFA is > > >> doing great work > > >> > supporting young artists. Both Suresh and me > > work for > > >> IFA, an organisation > > >> > supported by the Tata Trusts thus our source > > of money > > >> that we donate to TFA > > >> > is tainted as well according to your logic. > > As a donor > > >> to TFA, I would > > >> > suggest to you to return the award to TFA if > > you want > > >> to really walk your > > >> > talk.* > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> This paragraph, really, is the Kafkaesque pinnacle > > of your > > >> missive. At one > > >> level, I'm sure you know fully well the > > logical fallacy > > >> of comparing what > > >> you do with your money as an individual, and > > institutional > > >> support from the > > >> Tatas. The same applies to Mr Suresh Kumar, > > whoever that > > >> worthy is. This > > >> also is the paragraph where, as I said in the > > beginning, > > >> you have brought > > >> into the public space a very personal relationship > > that (I > > >> thought) I share > > >> with the organization you have mentioned. I have > > responded > > >> to you in private > > >> and will not repeat that here. Let me just say > > this - if > > >> you read through > > >> what you yourself have written, without your IFA > > blinkers > > >> on, you'll > > >> probably realize that it is more Orwellian than > > anything > > >> Orwell himself > > >> could have ever written or said. So, according to > > you, ( > > >> and I will say > > >> according to 'you' because I continue to > > have the > > >> deepest respect for the > > >> person who runs TFA and the reason for its > > establishment > > >> and functioning), > > >> the support of TFA amounts to this - that the > > young artist > > >> will be rewarded > > >> for his work as long as he stays safely in line. > > The moment > > >> he criticizes > > >> the mighty hand that feeds; and speaks > > uncomfortable > > >> truths, he is then one > > >> of the damned and must return the award? So much > > for > > >> artistic freedom, so > > >> much for the conviction of the artist, so much for > > freedom > > >> of speech. I > > >> think the RSS would be queueing up to > > 'support' the > > >> IFA now, given the > > >> apparent tenor of your ideologies. However, I > > shall not do > > >> what you have > > >> commanded - I shall not renounce the award, > > because that > > >> would amount to > > >> insulting the founder of the trust which, as > > I've said > > >> above, I'll never do; > > >> and more importantly, because then I'll have > > to return > > >> the money. I shall > > >> not return the money. Instead, I am hereby making > > a very > > >> public declaration. > > >> For the next five years, I shall give out Rs. > > 5,000/- > > >> (Rupees Five Thousand) > > >> annually, to any individual or organization that > > is working > > >> to discredit the > > >> Tatas in any way whatsoever, or to rehabilitate > > their > > >> victims, through art > > >> or community work. If indeed the money came from > > the Tatas, > > >> I see no better > > >> way to atone for it than to turn it against them. > > I know > > >> that compared to > > >> the half-a-million grants that the IFA gives out, > > this > > >> amount is laughably > > >> small, but that is about as much as a starving > > artist > > >> (without the 'e') can > > >> do. So I hereby announce the formation of the Rat > > N. Tatta > > >> (please read the > > >> word in Hindi) Foundation for the Promotion of > > Anarchic > > >> Arts and Fighting > > >> Tata Terrorism. I hope other artists who still > > have a > > >> conscience left will > > >> add to the corpus and turn it into something > > meaningful. > > >> Please write to > > >> contact at logostheatreindia.org for more details. So > > well, I > > >> have put my money > > >> where my mouth is - I am not sophisticated enough > > to walk > > >> the talk, as you > > >> call it. > > >> > > >> > > >> *While you may find it more convenient to sit in > > Bangalore > > >> and 'email' > > >> > protest campaigns against the Tatas * > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Well, one can at least do what is within one's > > >> abilities. One can take a > > >> principled stand, and that is what I have done. > > For the > > >> record, my services > > >> were recently used by one of the artists in > > residence at a > > >> residency > > >> promoted by your organization in Bangalore > > recently, and I > > >> refused to take > > >> any payment for it, asking her instead to give it > > to > > >> charity or to any cause > > >> opposed to the Tatas. At least, I am not traipsing > > about > > >> Washington DC and > > >> Krakow on Tata money while turning up fashionably > > attired > > >> in protest marches > > >> for Nandigram, am I? > > >> > > >> *and not really go down to Singur and Nandigram > > with > > >> hundreds of young > > >> > people in Kolkata * > > >> > > >> ** > > >> Nor am I appearing on page 3 of Bangalore Times, > > as you so > > >> regularly do. Oh, > > >> and I forgot, you were a "Lead India" > > contestant > > >> - our great beacon of hope! > > >> > > >> > > >> *are really trying to understand and engage with > > the issues > > >> there,* > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Such shining bureaucrat/ academic speak - the > > chief > > >> minister of West Bengal > > >> couldn't have done it better. There is only > > one issue > > >> understand and engage > > >> with there - the Tatas are displacing people for a > > >> corporate project that is > > >> entirely unethical, and the WB govt. is killing/ > > raping in > > >> order to remove > > >> obstacles on their way. Again, remember Tapashi > > Malik and > > >> look into the > > >> mirror. > > >> > > >> * the least you can do is practice what you > > preach.* > > >> > > >> > > >> I try to. At least I don't delude myself. > > >> > > >> *Arundhati > > >> > (works at IFA, supported by the Tata Trusts > > among > > >> many, donates to TFA)* > > >> > > >> > > >> Arka > > >> (work in theatre, is not supported by anyone, and > > does not > > >> publicly declaim > > >> where he donates to) > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> > Logos Theatre > > >> > In the beginning was the word > > >> > No. 126, > > >> > 3rd Main Road, > > >> > Jayamahal Extension, > > >> > Bangalore 560046 > > >> > > > >> > > -------------------------------------------------------- > > >> > If it be now, 'tis not to come; > > >> > if it be not to come, it will be now; > > >> > if it be not now, yet it will come: the > > readiness is > > >> all. > > >> > Since no man has aught of what he leaves, > > what > > >> is't to leave betimes? > > >> > Let be. > > >> _________________________________________ > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and > > the city. > > >> Critiques & Collaborations > > >> To subscribe: send an email to > > >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > > the subject > > >> header. > > >> To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > >> List archive: > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > > yourname at rocketmail.com. > > > Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > > > > > -- > > Logos Theatre > > In the beginning was the word > > No. 126, > > 3rd Main Road, > > Jayamahal Extension, > > Bangalore 560046 > > -------------------------------------------------------- > > If it be now, 'tis not to come; > > if it be not to come, it will be now; > > if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. > > Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to > > leave betimes? > > Let be. > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 12 20:32:53 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 08:02:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Profile: Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Kashmiri leader Killed in police firing in Srinagar In-Reply-To: <845426.66990.qm@web27804.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <972709.8362.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Murtaza Shibli   Did not expect such misrepresentations and gross inaccuracies from you.   1. Sheikh Abdul Aziz leading a march that threatens to breach a border between India and Pakistan with stated intention of going to Muzaffarabad  cannot be termed as "leading a peaceful public demonstration".     2. I will not argue about the attempts at (and success or failure of) " the ‘economic blockade’ of the Kashmiri Muslims being enforced by militant Indian Hindu groups" but your suggestion that such attempts had "the tacit support of the Indian government" is plain mischief-mongering even if you used the word "allegedly". It only shows you as one more propagandist for the separatists under the pretense of being a serious analyst.    3. If Abdul Aziz was born in 1952, he could not have watched the "Moe-e-Muqqadas movement" as a teenager. The theft of the Holy Relic (believed by some Muslims to be a strand of hair from the head or beard of Mohammed) was discovered on Dec 26, 1963. It was recovered on Jan 3, 1964. The hue and cry ('the movement') continued for a month or so. Abdul Aziz was not a teenager. He became a teenager in 1965.   4. You have stated very slyly "...it is generally believed that the then Indian Prime Minister Jawahar Lal Nehru, himself a Kashmiri Pandit was behind the conspiracy to unseat the local Kashmiri Prime Minister".   Was Nehru planning to bring in a non-local or a non-Kashmiri Prime Minister?   The then ruling Prime Minister was Khwaja Shamsuddin. He stayed on till Feb 64. He was succeeded by Ghulam Mohammed Sadiq, who was, surprise surprise, also a "local Kashmiri Prime Minister".   Kshmendra   PS. The general tone of and terminology used by you in this "Profile" helps in confirming a 'fix' on you as being a propagandist for the separatists.   --- On Mon, 8/11/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] Profile: Sheikh Abdul Aziz, Kashmiri leader Killed in police firing in Srinagar To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Monday, August 11, 2008, 11:49 PM Profile Sheikh Abdul Aziz (1952-2008) Chairman Jammu Kashmir People’s League By Murtaza Shibli One of the prominent leaders of the Kashmiri resistance movement, 55 year old Sheikh Abdul Aziz was killed by the bullets of Indian paramilitary forces on 11th August 2008 while leading a peaceful public demonstration against the ‘economic blockade’ of the Kashmiri Muslims being enforced by militant Indian Hindu groups allegedly with the tacit support of the Indian government. He was born in 1952 in Namblabal, Pampore close to the capital city Srinagar but in Pulwama district. Soon after passing his 10th grade from a local school, Aziz joined his father’s agriculture business including growing high yield saffron, for which Pampore Township is famous throughout the Kashmir valley. http://www.kashmiraffairs.org/sheik_aziz_profile.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From christy.carmel at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 21:24:55 2008 From: christy.carmel at gmail.com (carmel christy) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 21:24:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Meet on Chengara In-Reply-To: <4e4d9fc30808112320t463a73f6g82ef6f430c89fd16@mail.gmail.com> References: <4e4d9fc30808112320t463a73f6g82ef6f430c89fd16@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4e4d9fc30808120854u3826c21aobbfc1eda301b7bb5@mail.gmail.com> SUPPORT CHENGARA LAND STRUGGLE! Dear all, The hilly terrains of Chengara in Pathanamthitta district, Kerala is witnessing a historic land struggle by more than 5000 families comprising of all sections of landless people majority of them being Dalits and Adivasis. This includes landless caste Hindus, Christians and Muslims. The CPI (M) led Left Democratic Front Government has taken an anti-people stand and vehemently opposed the ownership of land by the landless, eventually compelling the people to take possession of the Harrison estate, the lease period of which was over years ago. The peaceful struggle which began on 4th August 2007 has completed more than a year. CPI (M) cadres and the goons of Harrison Malayalam, a business giant, have blocked the road to Chengara land struggle area thereby denying supply of food and medicines to the people. Moreover, they detain the struggling men and women activists and torture them for days together. The civil society members were prevented from entering the area by the goons pretending as workers. This happened in front of Police and other Government officials indicate the direct involvement of the State in forcing the people to starve and die. Indian Vision, a Malayalam TV Channel has reported the abduction and torture of four women activists. The silence of majority of mainstream media and the leftist "cultural leaders" has been instrumental in aggravating the situation. We are afraid that yet another Nandigram kind of situation prevails in Chengara and it is time for us to form solidarity at the national level to prevent it. WE URGE ALL THOSE WHO ARE CONCERNED TO COME FORWARD IN SOLIDARITY TO THE CHENGARA LAND STRUGGLE AND TO PLAN SOLIDARITY STRATEGIES. DISCUSSION AND DOCUMENTARY SCREENING ON CHENGARA LAND STRUGGLE (KERALA) Date and Time: 13th August 2008 5pm Venue: Indian Social Institute, Lodhi Road, New Delhi INSIGHT FOUNDATION NEW DELHI -- Carmel Christy -- Carmel Christy From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Tue Aug 12 21:54:18 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 16:24:18 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir Message-ID: <66204.28725.qm@web27808.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights United Nations Palais des Nations CH-1211 Geneva 10 Switzerland Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir August 12, 2008 Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: We write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and infrastructure are severely disrupted. The situation in Jammu, where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: "The situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." On August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as curfew conditions prevail. The Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; www.etalaat.com/english/. About 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, which meet the definition under international law of crimes against humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the last straw. We urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations. Recommendations: 1. The Government of India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that goods and services, including emergency medical and food supplies, can move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. 2. The Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. 4. Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister and expected of democratic governments. 5. Take steps for a long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. 6. Take steps to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and Conventions. We, the undersigned, are academics, social activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further use. Contact persons: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: duschins at ohio.edu. Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. Yours Sincerely, Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey Dr. Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women’s Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and CODEPINK Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana University Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State University Fullerton Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster Interfaith Services Dr. Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian Studies, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of History, State University of New York Oswego Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, University of California, Los Angeles Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, University of Oregon-Eugene Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York University Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar College Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, Berkeley Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, Berkeley Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American Studies, University of California, Davis Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University California, Berkeley Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, Graduate School of Education, Portland State University Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and Religious Studies, University of San Francisco Annie Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Minnesota Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network Dr. Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale University Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of English, Hofstra University Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and Literatures, University of Minnesota Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, Boston College Professor Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, University of California, Davis Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute of Global Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public Communications, Syracuse University Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian Studies, Bowdoin College Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, University of California, Berkeley Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell University Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist Pei Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Cc: Ms. Helene Flautre, Member, European Parliament Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights Mr. Geoffrey Harris Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State Mr. David J. Kramer Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor United States Department of State Ms. Felice D. Gaer Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From nc-agricowi at netcologne.de Tue Aug 12 15:03:47 2008 From: nc-agricowi at netcologne.de (SoundLAB) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 11:33:47 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BAnnouncements=5D_call=3A_soundart?= =?iso-8859-1?q?_for_SoundLAB_VI?= Message-ID: <20080812113347.CA37E6B.DFC1281C@192.168.0.3> SoundLAB - sonic art project environments http://soundlab.newmediafest.org informs: 1. Call for soundart for SoundLAB VI Deadline: 30 November 2008 2. SoundLAB V on FILE Hipersonica 2008 ---------------------------------------------- 1. Call for entries: SoundLAB VI - "soundPOOL" - sound compositions - a challenge for imagination - SoundLAB is looking for its 6th edition to be launched in March 2009, sound compositions which represent a real challenge for human imagination All details, the complete call, the regulations and entry form can be found here http://www.nmartproject.net/netex/?p=242 ---------------------------------------------- 2. SoundLAB V - "soundSTORY - sound as a tool for storytelling" - launched in 2007 http://soundlab.newmediafest.org/blog/?page_id=135 incorporating also soundart contributions from Spain curated by Ruben Garcia and South Africa curated by Julian Jonker is presented on FILE Hipersonica 2008 http://www.file.org.br/file2008press/eng/sao/hiper_participantes.html FILE Electronic Language Festival Sao Paulo/Brazil 05-31 August 2008 http://www.file.org.br ------------------------------------------------ SoundLAB - sonic art project environments http://soundlab.newmediafest.org corporate part of [NewMediaArtProjectNetwork]:||cologne www.nmartproject.net directed by Wilfried Agricola de Cologne Visit also SoundLAB I -V on - http://soundlab.newmediafest.org ----------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From logos.theword at gmail.com Tue Aug 12 21:05:11 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 21:05:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Street Smart - A Bangalore Based Initiative for Street Children In-Reply-To: <33bc2ee60808120737md8b2af3l7d1eb772fa2e88be@mail.gmail.com> References: <33bc2ee60808120737md8b2af3l7d1eb772fa2e88be@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808120835s6062d2a8x1a9bcfa5b2df1174@mail.gmail.com> Street Smart is a newly launched initiative for street children in Bangalore. It has been initiated by a group of artists who want to use their time, skills and finances to make a positive difference. It is right now in a nascent stage, and can do with all the help it can get, in material and non-material terms. Please mail Roshini Davidson, the founder, on 9986652996 or barefoottraveller at gmail.com for more details. Those of you who are on the social networking site facebook can also check out the group page on: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=27420076413&ref=nf -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 India www.logostheatreindia.org google group: http://groups.google.com/group/logostheatre (to subscribe by e-mail: logostheatre-subscribe at googlegroups.com) -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com Wed Aug 13 12:33:40 2008 From: mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com (mahmood farooqui) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:33:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures Message-ID: Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because of the police firing. Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan Times, there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a Kashmiri. There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the police. The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the police firing. Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? Is the poser itself simplistic? From asitredsalute at gmail.com Wed Aug 13 15:15:07 2008 From: asitredsalute at gmail.com (Asit asitreds) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 15:15:07 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement of Concern on Niyamgiri issue for endorsement Message-ID: Dear Friends, Please endorse the statement and if possible please forward it to other concerned organisations and individuals. With Regards Asit *STATEMENT OF CONCERN ON NIYAMGIRI* We the undersigned are deeply concerned over the recent order of the Supreme Court in T.N. Godavaraman Thirumulpad vs. Union of India and Others in the matter of M/s Sterlite Industries (India) Ltd. This Order will pave the way for forcible displacement of thousands of *adivasis *for the mining of bauxite by Sterlite Industries Ltd., a frontal company of the notorious Vedanta Alimunium Industries, which is already tainted with its corporate malpractices. We note with deep anxiety that most of the inhabitants here are Dongria Kondhs who are classified as Primitive Tribes (which itself is a colonial construct) who know no other way of life hence need to be dealt with due sensitivity and precaution and who will be uprooted and marginalized once they are removed from their natural habitat. Today, where the UN bodies, all the governments, international and national civil societies including the progressive and democratic organisations world over are worried and deliberating on global warming and the impending ecological disaster and death of the planet. The issue raised by this judgement has become of crucial importance. The Dongria Kondhs who live a harmonious and symbiotic relationship with their environment show the way to mankind on how to lead a sustainable, meaningful and egalitarian life. It is also to be noted that the present order of the Supreme Court contradicts the 89th Amendment of the Constitution which clearly stipulates that no industry, mines or townships or any other construction activity can be undertaken without the consent of the Gram Sabhas of *adivasis *residing in the areas demarcated under the Fifth Schedule of the Constitution. This order will also nullify the implementation of the recently passed *Forest Rights Act*, under which the *adivasis *tilling forestland should get the ownership of the land they have been tilling since years. We are also deeply concerned that mining in Niyamgiri area will seriously upset the ecological equilibrium; this area is very rich in bio diversity including rare flora and fauna and many species of rare medicinal herbs. Niyamgiri hills are also the source of important rivers like Nagavali, Vansdhara, which caters to the need of many districts in Orissa including the southern coastal districts. The mining in that area will contravene the provisions of the Environmental Protection Act 1986 because it will seriously violate the letter and spirit of the Act. We urge the political parties especially the three most important pillars of our democracy i.e. the Executive, Judiciary and the Legislature to take cognisance of the aspirations of innumerable anti-displacement movements and progressive and democratic organisations in the country and scrap the draconian and colonial land acquisition act of 1894. Thus we call upon the Supreme Court, Government of India and Orissa to reconsider the case of mining in the Niyamgiri Hills and rescind the permission given to Sterlite Industries for mining in Niyamgiri. Professor Arun Kumar Centre for Study of Economic and Social Planning, School of Social Science, JNU Vijay Pratap Convenor, Lokayan Babulal Sharma Convenor, Global Gandhi Forum Rakesh Bhatt Coordinator, SADED/CSDS Faisal Khan Asha Parivar, NAPM, New Delhi Anil Thakur Vasudhaiva Kutumbakam, New Delhi Chandrasekhar Hota Research Scholar, Centre for Political Studies, School of Social Science, JNU Jeet Bhattacharya Research Scholar, Film Studies, School of Art and Aesthetics, JNU Peeyush Pant Editor, Lok Samvad, New Delhi Sayantoni Datta SADED/CSDS Asit Social Activist-Researcher, New Delhi Kumar Sameer Social Activist, New Delhi From vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com Wed Aug 13 17:41:40 2008 From: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com (Vedavati Jogi) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 05:11:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir In-Reply-To: <66204.28725.qm@web27808.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <682940.4653.qm@web57714.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Champions of Human Rights,   I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our dear muslim terrorist brothers and then only you publish such type of calls.   Vedavati --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights United Nations Palais des Nations CH-1211 Geneva 10 Switzerland Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir August 12, 2008 Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: We write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and infrastructure are severely disrupted. The situation in Jammu, where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: "The situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." On August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as curfew conditions prevail. The Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; www.etalaat.com/english/. About 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, which meet the definition under international law of crimes against humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the last straw. We urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations. Recommendations: 1. The Government of India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that goods and services, including emergency medical and food supplies, can move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. 2. The Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. 4. Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister and expected of democratic governments. 5. Take steps for a long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. 6. Take steps to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and Conventions. We, the undersigned, are academics, social activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further use. Contact persons: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: duschins at ohio.edu. Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. Yours Sincerely, Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey Dr. Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women’s Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and CODEPINK Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana University Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State University Fullerton Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster Interfaith Services Dr. Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian Studies, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of History, State University of New York Oswego Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, University of California, Los Angeles Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, University of Oregon-Eugene Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York University Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar College Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, Berkeley Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, Berkeley Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American Studies, University of California, Davis Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University California, Berkeley Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, Graduate School of Education, Portland State University Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and Religious Studies, University of San Francisco Annie Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Minnesota Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network Dr. Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale University Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of English, Hofstra University Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and Literatures, University of Minnesota Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, Boston College Professor Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, University of California, Davis Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute of Global Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public Communications, Syracuse University Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian Studies, Bowdoin College Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, University of California, Berkeley Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell University Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist Pei Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Cc: Ms. Helene Flautre, Member, European Parliament Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights Mr. Geoffrey Harris Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State Mr. David J. Kramer Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor United States Department of State Ms. Felice D. Gaer Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From phadkeshilpa at gmail.com Wed Aug 13 18:07:11 2008 From: phadkeshilpa at gmail.com (Shilpa Phadke) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 18:07:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Performance Invitation: Fat Feminist and Free in Mumbai, 23 August 2008 Message-ID: Please forward widely. Culture Café, Centre for Media and Cultural Studies, TISS presents *"Fat, Feminist and Free" * by Pramada Menon DATE: 23 August 2008 TIME: 5.30 pm. VENUE::Convention Centre, Naoroji Campus, Deonar Farm Road, Tata Institute of Social Sciences, Mumbai. Entry Free Fat, Feminist and Free This stand up performance is based on Pramada's encounters with many different people and some crazy situations. Some were funny and seemed impossible and yet they happened and some were not so funny. This performance strings together issues of identity, sexuality, body image and takes a tongue in cheek look at the world we all inhabit. Pramada Menon is an independent consultant working on issues of gender, sexuality, sexual rights, women's human rights and issues of leadership and organizational development. She is the co-founder of CREA (www.creaworld.org), an organization working on issues of women's human rights and was the Director Programs at CREA until March 2008. She has spent the last two decades of her professional life questioning, challenging and seeking answers on issues of women's human rights. Her primary interest lies in working with people and she has facilitated learning processes with a number of people on a range of issues related to gender, sexuality and leadership. Pramada would like to develop new ways of learning and teaching and is currently exploring ways in which humor can be injected into the world of social change. For more information please see: www.cmcs.tiss.edu From oishiksircar at gmail.com Wed Aug 13 18:14:05 2008 From: oishiksircar at gmail.com (OISHIK SIRCAR) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 18:14:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] InfoChange Agenda: On the Move In-Reply-To: <62cba67a0808130535u601a77e3w9fb1c3645c2d3e8f@mail.gmail.com> References: <62cba67a0808130511tc641f4fy9c5479301ac7dfbf@mail.gmail.com> <62cba67a0808130535u601a77e3w9fb1c3645c2d3e8f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <62cba67a0808130544t6ca45643q4031f856aa012d4e@mail.gmail.com> The *InfoChange Agenda* issue on Migration and Displacement titled 'On the Move' is finally out -- after a long long wait. For those interested, you'll find the online edition at http://infochangeindia.org/Agenda/On-the-move/Please note that the online edition has more number of articles than the print edition. If you need print copies of the journal write to InfoChange directly. *ON THE MOVE -- study of moving populations in the Indian sub-continent—the displaced, dispossessed, exiled and evicted* *I**ntroduction: On the move* More... *The Mavlas of Mulshi: Displacement's earliest victims* *Anosh Malekar* In June 1919, the farmers of Mulshi near Pune, Maharashtra, were served notices for the acquisition of their lands to construct a dam. A satyagraha led by Senapati Bapat was launched. Close on a century later, the descendants of what is arguably the oldest development-displaced community in India are still hoping for compensation More... *Paying the price for someone else's displacement* *By Walter Fernandes* Rough estimates point to 60 million displaced persons and project-affected persons in India. That's four times the estimated 15 million refugees exchanged between India and the two wings of Pakistan at the time of Partition. The majority of the development-displaced are tribals and landless dalits who live on or off common property resources. And scarcely 20% have been rehabilitated More... *In Gujarat's ghettos* *By Deepa A* Around 250,000 people were estimated to have been displaced by the Gujarat riots of 2002. Six years later, 4,500 families are still living in 81 relief colonies. They know they cannot return to the villages where they had homes, farms or shops. They are struggling to survive in areas often lacking even basic amenities. There is at least a framework for those displaced by development projects. There is no policy and no framework of entitlements for those displaced by sectarian or communal violence More... *Return from exile* *By Rashme Sehgal* Thirty-one Kashmiri Pandit families recently returned to the Kashmir valley after more than a decade in exile in Jammu's camps. Forty thousand Pandit families still live in those camps. But even the lucky few who have been provided government accommodation feel they have returned to a new Kashmir, one that has lost its Kashmiriyat, where Muslim and Hindu view each other with suspicion. A special report from Jammu and Kashmir More... *The original migrants * *By Anosh Malekar* The first migrations from Bihar date back to 1834. Every second family in the state today is sustained by migrant workers who form the backbone of the country's workforce. But in 2008, thousands of Biharis found themselves forced to return from Maharashtra following the Maharashtra Navnirman Sena's sons-of-the-soil campaign. After decades selling bhelpuri on Mumbai's Chowpatty or working as construction labour, Bihar's migrants were shocked to find themselves treated like outsiders in their own land More... *Migrate--or starve* *By Aditya Malaviya and Sushmita Malaviya* Tikamgarh, in Madhya Pradesh, has been experiencing its third successive year of drought. Migration and contract labour is the only option. Some travel to Delhi or Jammu with only the phone number of a contractor looking for labour. Others don't have even that, and simply camp outside urban railway stations until a contractor picks them up. Only the old and the very young are left in the deserted villages More... *The dark side of Brand Bangalore* *By Sanjana* LR Nagar is only one of Bangalore's estimated 778 slums. But it is located just a few metres from Koramangala, the posh residential address of Bangalore's IT employees. The disparity in living conditions, of course, metaphorically separates the two localities by hundreds of kilometres. And it is this unequal access to Bangalore's infrastructure, space, government spending budgets etc that epitomises the problem of urban spaces More... *The whitewash of Delhi: Where have all the poor gone?* *By Gautam Bhan* Around 35,000 families have lived in Yamuna Pushta in Delhi for decades. Now they are being evicted to make way for a riverside promenade. Some who can prove their residency are being "voluntarily resettled" in Bawana, 50 km away. But a study of nearly 3,000 households in Bawana finds that there has been a systemic and clear impoverishment of those who have been displaced from Pushta to Bawana. It's not a 'shock' impoverishment that the residents will be able to overcome; it's a 'permanent poverty' that a whole generation will be unable to overcome More... *Unequal burden * *By Malavika Vartak* Children are amongst the worst sufferers when entire communities are evicted from their homes and lands. Surveys of 299 families living in New Harsud after displacement by the Narmada project, showed that 25% of children had dropped out of school after displacement More... *Life at Mumbai's nakas* *By Svati P Shah* Thousands of migrants come to Mumbai every year. Most end up working in the city's informal sector, seeking daily wage labour at the many nakas, or street corners, that function as public labour markets every morning. Women at the Malad naka say that when they cannot find construction or other work they solicit paid sex. But can migration, human trafficking and prostitution be conflated in the bodies of poor female migrants? More... *Rehabilitation before displacement* *By Priyanca Mathur Velath* Although the 2007 National Policy for Rehabilitation and Resettlement lays down the principle of 'minimising displacement' there have been no visible attempts to implement it. The policy fails to examine the process of displacement, which is taken for granted. The draft makes no attempt to question the need for displacement in the first place, or to seek out and actively promote non-displacing or least-displacing alternatives More... *Beyond the Sphere standards* *By Bikram Jeet Batra* There are international guidelines for emergency relief measures, such as the Sphere standards. But there are no internationally-accepted guidelines for longer-term resettlement and rehabilitation. This often leads to what one disaster expert calls paternalistic programmes that end up serving the needs of the donors and agencies rather than the victims More... *Shadow diaspora* *By Sharika Thiranagama* For many northern and eastern Sri Lankan Tamils, Colombo is a transient city, a place where Tamils wait to find a way out of the country. But some have been waiting for over 10 years. They are the unacknowledged part of the Sri Lankan Tamil diaspora, the shadow diaspora who cannot leave Sri Lanka but whose dreams of migrating to a better life remain as potent as those of the people who do manage to leave More... *'For us, only the camp is home'* *By Vineetha Mokkil* Sixty years after Partition, 40% of the refugees who fled Pakistan Occupied Kashmir continue to live in camps scattered across Jammu. Entire generations have grown up here on ad hoc relief packages, minus quality education and employment. Lacking the official status of refugees because PoK is not considered foreign soil, they have been deprived of compensation and all the benefits accorded to refugees under national and international law More... * Born in exile * *By Rashme Sehgal* There are around 300,000 Tibetan refugees in India, some of whom came in the initial exodus of 1959, and many second- and third-generation Tibetans born in India. Refugee status allows Tibetans to live, be employed and travel across India and abroad. But they are still between countries, denied citizenship and the right to vote or own property in India, and dreaming of a homeland many have never seen More... *Lhotshampas: Evicted from Bhutan* *By Jenelle Eli* Over 100,000 ethnic Nepalese, who had settled in Bhutan since the 19th century, were evicted from Bhutan in the 1990s, following a movement to protect the Bhutanese cultural identity. They now live in seven refugee camps in Nepal. Seventeen years of poverty and statelessness have given way to violence and hopelessness, and youth are increasingly joining violent political movements More... *The Muhajirs in the promised land* *By Vikhar Ahmed Sayeed* The Muhajirs of Pakistan were the Muslims who migrated to Pakistan after Partition. They were going not as refugees but as citizens of a promised homeland – a country for Muslims where they would not face political or religious discrimination. How then did the Muhajirs of Pakistan, four decades later, find themselves moved from the core to the periphery, marginalised and divided by ethnic conflict? More... *Partitions of the mind* *By Priyanka Nandy, Garga Chatterjee and Somnath Mukherji* More than 60 years after Partition, and close on a century after East Bengalis first began to migrate to West Bengal, the gulf between the displaced Bangals and the local Ghoti Bengalis in Kolkata has not been bridged. Bracketed together within the collective ethnic identity of 'Bengali', the 'provincial' Bangals and the 'urbane' Ghotis retain fiercely the markers of their identity -- in terms of language, culture and cuisine. These are three narratives of the deep and cryptic traumas that accompany displacement More... *UNHCR's role in refugee protection in India* *By Ipshita Sengupta* Although India is not a party to the 1951 UN Convention on Refugees, asylum-seekers who are not offered direct protection by the Indian government can get refugee status from the UNHCR in a de facto system of refugee protection in India. But in the recent past, refugees under UNHCR protection have begun losing faith in a system plagued by insensitivity and inefficiency More... -- OISHIK SIRCAR Scholar in Women's Rights Faculty of Law, University of Toronto oishiksircar at gmail.com oishik.sircar at utoronto.ca -- OISHIK SIRCAR Scholar in Women's Rights Faculty of Law, University of Toronto oishiksircar at gmail.com oishik.sircar at utoronto.ca -- OISHIK SIRCAR Scholar in Women's Rights Faculty of Law, University of Toronto oishiksircar at gmail.com oishik.sircar at utoronto.ca From appu.es at gmail.com Wed Aug 13 18:23:07 2008 From: appu.es at gmail.com (Appu Esthose Suresh) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 18:23:07 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir In-Reply-To: <682940.4653.qm@web57714.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <66204.28725.qm@web27808.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <682940.4653.qm@web57714.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4b1e36590808130553q533584cbq72d6acc2a9c6df35@mail.gmail.com> Dear Vedavati, Your response badly tempted me to give you a crash course in "meaning of terrorism"...Courtesy to Oxford English Dictionary. *Terrorism*- *The unofficial or unauthorized use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims* ** *Terrorist*-*A person who uses terrorism in the pursuit of political aims*. With this defintition anybody who indulge in terrorizing is fit to be refferred as terrorist, that very well include shiv sena goons to VHP-Bajrangal Dal activist who roamed freely killing and raping in Gujarat. But, they are terrorist; neither Hindu's, muslims, sikhs nor human being. Terrorist have one religion ie their political agenda. So, why, "Muslim Terrorist Brothers". If doubt still persist, please recall that some years ago a few hindus were also caught for being associated with Kashmir based terrorist organization. Or did you imply everyone in Kashmir is terrorist? Being dominated by muslims at any point in history since 12 AD, your refernce "muslim terrorist brothers" tends to suggest that everyone at present in Kashmir is terrorist. Still you insist in believing so , you got a friend in US, Mr.Bush. A joint effort in Kashmir could find a permanent settlement. As it is he seems to be very bored without any military adventure. All these show-downs are only helping in increasing TRP of channels. Champions of all causes, invariably both sides, I doubt, have been to these places even once and listened to people. If a few thousands who are in streets are formulating your opinion in glass houses, please.......Shut Up! It is easy to throw stones from forts. Appu Esthose Suresh On 8/13/08, Vedavati Jogi wrote: > > Dear Champions of Human Rights, > > I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our > dear muslim terrorist brothers and then only you publish such type of calls. > > Vedavati > > --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > From: Kashmir Affairs > Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in > Jammu and Kashmir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM > > Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner > Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner > Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues > Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights > United Nations > Palais des Nations > CH-1211 Geneva 10 > Switzerland > > Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir > > August 12, 2008 > > > Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: > > We > write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis > continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the > Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This > has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and > other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and > essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short > supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and > infrastructure are severely disrupted. > > The situation in Jammu, > where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be > described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and > the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable > and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the > blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, > military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on > counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A > communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: > > "The > situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started > getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its > verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same > continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the > people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the > mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national > highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army > to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return > handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims > and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come > to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite > evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., > are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was > done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being > repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed > about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." > > On > August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit > growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the > Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with > gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and > Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot > dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three > others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems > already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many > as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early > evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as > twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired > on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, > students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil > disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as > curfew conditions prevail. > > The > Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir > Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as > for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief > products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can > be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at > www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; > www.etalaat.com/english/. > > About > 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims > are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of > increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since > 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian > Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to > prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and > culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed > pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and > non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency > operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, > economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, > which meet the definition under international law of crimes against > humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of > armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the > last straw. > > We > urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance > with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of > the United Nations. > > Recommendations: > 1. The Government of > India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that > goods and services, including emergency medical and food supplies, can > move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. > 2. The > Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a > promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and > Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current > crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step > forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. > 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against > the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. > 4. > Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and > pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister > and expected of democratic governments. > 5. Take steps for a > long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all > sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. > 6. Take steps > to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established > by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the > Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and > Conventions. > > We, the undersigned, are academics, social > activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned > citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its > people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to > contact us if we may be of further use. > > Contact persons: > Dr. Angana Chatterji, > Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, > California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, > Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. > Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and > Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: > duschins at ohio.edu. > Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, > Richard > Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: > Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. > > > Yours Sincerely, > Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: > > Dr. > Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and > Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San > Francisco > > Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and > Anthropology, Ohio University > > Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, > Richard > Stockton College of New Jersey > > Dr. > Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's > Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of > California, Berkeley > > Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's > Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky > > Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and > CODEPINK > > Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana > University > > Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State > University Fullerton > > Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster > Interfaith > Services > > Dr. > Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and > Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton > > Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian > Studies, > University of California, Berkeley > > Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of > History, > State University of New York Oswego > > Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association > > Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, > University of California, Los Angeles > > Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, > University of > Oregon-Eugene > > Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York > University > > Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology > > Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles > > Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles > > Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar > College > > Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, > Berkeley > > Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, > Berkeley > > Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American > Studies, > University of California, Davis > > Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research > Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago > > Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University > California, Berkeley > > Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, > Graduate School of Education, Portland State University > > Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality > Studies, > University of Minnesota > > Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and > Religious > Studies, University of San Francisco > > Annie > Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural > Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco > > Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of > Minnesota > > Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network > > Dr. > Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and > Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale > University > > Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, > International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of > International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle > > Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of > English, Hofstra University > > Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and > Literatures, University of Minnesota > > Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, > Boston > College > > Professor > Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, > California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco > > Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London > > Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, > University > of California, Davis > > Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of > California, Berkeley > > Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute > of > Global Studies, University of Minnesota > > Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public > Communications, Syracuse University > > Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian > Studies, Bowdoin College > > Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, > University of California, Berkeley > > Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) > > Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell > University > > Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist > > David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist > > Pei > Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, > California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco > > > > Cc: > > Ms. Helene Flautre, > Member, European Parliament > Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights > > Mr. Geoffrey Harris > Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament > > Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary > Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk > Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State > > Mr. David J. > Kramer > Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor > United States Department of State > > Ms. Felice D. Gaer > Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Wed Aug 13 18:33:18 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 06:03:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir In-Reply-To: <66204.28725.qm@web27808.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <613189.14551.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> It is amazing how seemingly not-dumb minds could become signatories to the very many misrepresentations and lies contained in this "International Call".   BUT, THAT SAID   It is pure undiluted idiocy for anyone to have given or to give any call for an 'economic blockade' or any kind of a call that would intensify and/or increase the alienation felt by the people of Kashmir.   Only someone who is an enemy of India would give any such call. Such dimwits should realise that they would only be strengthening the 'cause' promoted by the separatists.   Kshmendra   --- On Tue, 8/12/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Tuesday, August 12, 2008, 9:54 PM Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights United Nations Palais des Nations CH-1211 Geneva 10 Switzerland Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir August 12, 2008 Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: We write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and infrastructure are severely disrupted. The situation in Jammu, where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: "The situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." On August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as curfew conditions prevail. The Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; www.etalaat.com/english/. About 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, which meet the definition under international law of crimes against humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the last straw. We urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations. Recommendations: 1. The Government of India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that goods and services, including emergency medical and food supplies, can move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. 2. The Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. 4. Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister and expected of democratic governments. 5. Take steps for a long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. 6. Take steps to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and Conventions. We, the undersigned, are academics, social activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further use. Contact persons: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: duschins at ohio.edu. Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. Yours Sincerely, Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey Dr. Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women’s Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and CODEPINK Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana University Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State University Fullerton Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster Interfaith Services Dr. Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian Studies, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of History, State University of New York Oswego Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, University of California, Los Angeles Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, University of Oregon-Eugene Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York University Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar College Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, Berkeley Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, Berkeley Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American Studies, University of California, Davis Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University California, Berkeley Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, Graduate School of Education, Portland State University Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and Religious Studies, University of San Francisco Annie Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Minnesota Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network Dr. Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale University Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of English, Hofstra University Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and Literatures, University of Minnesota Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, Boston College Professor Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, University of California, Davis Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute of Global Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public Communications, Syracuse University Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian Studies, Bowdoin College Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, University of California, Berkeley Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell University Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist Pei Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Cc: Ms. Helene Flautre, Member, European Parliament Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights Mr. Geoffrey Harris Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State Mr. David J. Kramer Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor United States Department of State Ms. Felice D. Gaer Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From iram at sarai.net Wed Aug 13 18:52:37 2008 From: iram at sarai.net (Iram Ghufran) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 18:52:37 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Fwd: Toto Awards 2009 (photography + creative writing) Message-ID: <48A2E01D.3030805@sarai.net> FWD: ==================== TOTO AWARDS 2009 PHOTOGRAPHY TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA), in association with TASVEER, invites entries for its second annual TOTO awards for young Indian photographers. Two cash awards of Rs. 25,000 each will be given in January, 2009. The spirit of the Toto Awards is to identify promise and encourage young talent. THEREFORE, entries are only invited from young people -- over the age of 18, and who will not have celebrated their 30th birthday before January 1, 2009. The submissions should comprise a minimum of 12 and a maximum of 36 photographs, either in colour or black and white, or a mix of the two. The photographs should comprise still images. Video photography will not be accepted. They should be high resolution (print quality): 350-600 dpi. The submission should be made on CD (three copies) along with hard copies of five photographs of your choice. These should be in reasonable size, i.e. easily visible, but not larger than A-4. The photographs could be on one theme or an assortment of themes. Your choice. Submitted material will not be returned. Entries should reach TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) by 4 October, 2008 at the latest. TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) H 301 Adarsh Gardens, 8th Block, 47th Cross, Jayanagar, Bangalore 560 082 Phone: 080-26990549 If you have any further queries, please write to totofundsthearts at yahoo.com THE FINE PRINT: Entries must be accompanied by a signed statement confirming the applicant's date of birth, whether the applicant's work has been published in print (give details), and also affirming that the submitted work is original. Please ensure that the submitted CDs and prints do not carry your name on them. Submitted entries will be given code numbers to protect applicants' identities from the jury during the judging process. Submitted material will not be returned. The decision of the TFA jury is final and cannot be contested in any forum. Please note: We reserve the right to use your photographs (if necessary) to publicise the awards and in any in-house materials such as a newsletter. Otherwise, the copyright rests with the photographer and your submission will be put to no other use without your express permission. TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) is a not-for-profit public trust set up in memory of Angirus 'Toto' Vellani, who was intensely passionate about music, literature and films. Tasveer is an organisation committed to showcasing the finest in photography. ********************************************** TOTO AWARDS 2009 CREATIVE WRITING CALL FOR ENTRIES TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) invites entries for its fourth annual TOTO awards for Indian creative writers in English. Two cash awards of Rs. 25,000 each will be given in January, 2009. BUT: Entries are only invited from young people -- over the age of 18, and who have not celebrated their 30th birthday before January 1, 2009. ALSO: The spirit of the Toto Awards is to identify promise and encourage young talent. Therefore, do not submit an entry if you are already an established writer. TFA is looking for entries in three genres –– short plays, short stories and poetry. The submissions should not exceed 7,500 words. You can submit any combination of your writing in the above genres, as long as the entire submission is within the stipulated word limit. Entries should reach TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) by 4 October, 2008 at the latest. There will be no extension of the submission date. TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) H 301 Adarsh Gardens, 8th Block, 47th Cross, Jayanagar, Bangalore 560 082 Phone: 080-26990549 Entries should be sent in soft e-mail copy to totofundsthearts at yahoo.com as well in hard copy form to the above address. Please address queries to the same e-mail ID. THE FINE PRINT: Entries must be accompanied by a signed statement confirming the applicant's date of birth, whether the applicant's work has been published in print (give details), and also affirming that the submitted work is original. Please ensure that the hard copy does not carry your name on it. Submitted entries will be given code numbers to protect applicants' identities from the jury during the judging process. Submitted material will not be returned. The decision of the TFA jury is final and cannot be contested in any forum. TOTO FUNDS THE ARTS (TFA) is a not-for-profit public trust set up in memory of Angirus 'Toto' Vellani, who was intensely passionate about music, literature and films. _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Wed Aug 13 19:56:34 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 07:26:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir Message-ID: <320454.44820.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> It is a hoax. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Kshmendra Kaul To: reader-list at sarai.net; kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sent: Wednesday, 13 August, 2008 6:03:18 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir It is amazing how seemingly not-dumb minds could become signatories to the very many misrepresentations and lies contained in this "International Call".   BUT, THAT SAID   It is pure undiluted idiocy for anyone to have given or to give any call for an 'economic blockade' or any kind of a call that would intensify and/or increase the alienation felt by the people of Kashmir.   Only someone who is an enemy of India would give any such call. Such dimwits should realise that they would only be strengthening the 'cause' promoted by the separatists.   Kshmendra   --- On Tue, 8/12/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Tuesday, August 12, 2008, 9:54 PM Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights United Nations Palais des Nations CH-1211 Geneva 10 Switzerland Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir August 12, 2008 Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: We write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and infrastructure are severely disrupted. The situation in Jammu, where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: "The situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." On August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as curfew conditions prevail. The Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; www.etalaat.com/english/. About 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, which meet the definition under international law of crimes against humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the last straw. We urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations. Recommendations: 1. The Government of India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that goods and services, including emergency medical and food supplies, can move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. 2. The Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. 4. Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister and expected of democratic governments. 5. Take steps for a long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. 6. Take steps to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and Conventions. We, the undersigned, are academics, social activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further use. Contact persons: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: duschins at ohio.edu. Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. Yours Sincerely, Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey Dr. Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women’s Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and CODEPINK Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana University Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State University Fullerton Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster Interfaith Services Dr. Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian Studies, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of History, State University of New York Oswego Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, University of California, Los Angeles Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, University of Oregon-Eugene Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York University Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar College Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, Berkeley Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, Berkeley Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American Studies, University of California, Davis Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University California, Berkeley Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, Graduate School of Education, Portland State University Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and Religious Studies, University of San Francisco Annie Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Minnesota Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network Dr. Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale University Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of English, Hofstra University Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and Literatures, University of Minnesota Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, Boston College Professor Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, University of California, Davis Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute of Global Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public Communications, Syracuse University Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian Studies, Bowdoin College Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, University of California, Berkeley Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell University Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist Pei Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Cc: Ms. Helene Flautre, Member, European Parliament Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights Mr. Geoffrey Harris Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State Mr. David J. Kramer Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor United States Department of State Ms. Felice D. Gaer Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>   _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Wed Aug 13 20:01:31 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 07:31:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir Message-ID: <390527.47100.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> These terrorists have a very wide support base. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Vedavati Jogi To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Cc: achatterji at ciis.edu; reader-list at sarai.net; Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu Sent: Wednesday, 13 August, 2008 5:11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir Dear Champions of Human Rights,   I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our dear muslim terrorist brothers and then only you publish such type of calls.   Vedavati --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights United Nations Palais des Nations CH-1211 Geneva 10 Switzerland Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir August 12, 2008 Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: We write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and infrastructure are severely disrupted. The situation in Jammu, where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: "The situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." On August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as curfew conditions prevail. The Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; www.etalaat.com/english/. About 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, which meet the definition under international law of crimes against humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the last straw. We urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations. Recommendations: 1. The Government of India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that goods and services, including emergency medicaland food supplies, can move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. 2. The Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. 4. Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister and expected of democratic governments. 5. Take steps for a long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. 6. Take steps to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and Conventions. We, the undersigned, are academics, social activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further use. Contact persons: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: duschins at ohio.edu. Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. Yours Sincerely, Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey Dr. Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women’s Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and CODEPINK Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana University Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State University Fullerton Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster Interfaith Services Dr. Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian Studies, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of History, State University of New York Oswego Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, University of California, Los Angeles Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, University of Oregon-Eugene Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York University Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar College Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, Berkeley Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, Berkeley Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American Studies, University of California, Davis Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University California, Berkeley Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, Graduate School of Education, Portland State University Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and Religious Studies, University of San Francisco Annie Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Minnesota Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network Dr. Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale University Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of English, Hofstra University Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and Literatures, University of Minnesota Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, Boston College Professor Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, University of California, Davis Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute of Global Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public Communications, Syracuse University Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian Studies, Bowdoin College Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, University of California, Berkeley Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell University Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist Pei Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Cc: Ms. Helene Flautre, Member, European Parliament Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights Mr. Geoffrey Harris Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State Mr. David J. Kramer Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor United States Department of State Ms. Felice D. Gaer Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>   _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 13 21:36:33 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 21:36:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir In-Reply-To: <390527.47100.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <390527.47100.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808130906x44a3ae15y46779e11b7c2baa1@mail.gmail.com> And, They can do just anything for PR... On 8/13/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > These terrorists have a very wide support base. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Vedavati Jogi > To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk > Cc: achatterji at ciis.edu; reader-list at sarai.net; Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu > Sent: Wednesday, 13 August, 2008 5:11:40 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in > Jammu and Kashmir > > Dear Champions of Human Rights, > > I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our > dear muslim terrorist brothers and then only you publish such type of calls. > > Vedavati > > --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > From: Kashmir Affairs > Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in > Jammu and Kashmir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM > > Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner > Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner > Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues > Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights > United Nations > Palais des Nations > CH-1211 Geneva 10 > Switzerland > > Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir > > August 12, 2008 > > > Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: > > We > write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis > continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the > Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This > has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and > other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and > essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short > supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and > infrastructure are severely disrupted. > > The situation in Jammu, > where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be > described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and > the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable > and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the > blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, > military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on > counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A > communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: > > "The > situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started > getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its > verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same > continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the > people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the > mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national > highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army > to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return > handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims > and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come > to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite > evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., > are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was > done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being > repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed > about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." > > On > August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit > growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the > Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with > gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and > Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot > dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three > others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems > already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many > as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early > evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as > twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired > on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, > students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil > disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as > curfew conditions prevail. > > The > Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir > Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as > for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief > products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can > be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at > www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; > www.etalaat.com/english/. > > About > 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims > are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of > increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since > 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian > Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to > prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and > culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed > pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and > non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency > operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, > economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, > which meet the definition under international law of crimes against > humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of > armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the > last straw. > > We > urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance > with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of > the United Nations. > > Recommendations: > 1. The Government of > India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that > goods and services, including emergency medicaland food supplies, can > move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. > 2. The > Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a > promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and > Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current > crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step > forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. > 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against > the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. > 4. > Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and > pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister > and expected of democratic governments. > 5. Take steps for a > long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all > sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. > 6. Take steps > to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established > by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the > Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and > Conventions. > > We, the undersigned, are academics, social > activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned > citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its > people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to > contact us if we may be of further use. > > Contact persons: > Dr. Angana Chatterji, > Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, > California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, > Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. > Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and > Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: > duschins at ohio.edu. > Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, > Richard > Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: > Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. > > > Yours Sincerely, > Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: > > Dr. > Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and > Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San > Francisco > > Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and > Anthropology, Ohio University > > Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, > Richard > Stockton College of New Jersey > > Dr. > Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's > Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of > California, Berkeley > > Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's > Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky > > Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and > CODEPINK > > Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana > University > > Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State > University Fullerton > > Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster > Interfaith > Services > > Dr. > Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and > Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton > > Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian > Studies, > University of California, Berkeley > > Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of > History, > State University of New York Oswego > > Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association > > Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, > University of California, Los Angeles > > Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, > University of > Oregon-Eugene > > Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York > University > > Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology > > Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles > > Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles > > Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar > College > > Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, > Berkeley > > Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, > Berkeley > > Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American > Studies, > University of California, Davis > > Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research > Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago > > Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University > California, Berkeley > > Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, > Graduate School of Education, Portland State University > > Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality > Studies, > University of Minnesota > > Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and > Religious > Studies, University of San Francisco > > Annie > Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural > Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco > > Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of > Minnesota > > Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network > > Dr. > Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and > Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale > University > > Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, > International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of > International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle > > Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of > English, Hofstra University > > Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and > Literatures, University of Minnesota > > Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, > Boston > College > > Professor > Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, > California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco > > Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London > > Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, > University > of California, Davis > > Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of > California, Berkeley > > Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute > of > Global Studies, University of Minnesota > > Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public > Communications, Syracuse University > > Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian > Studies, Bowdoin College > > Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, > University of California, Berkeley > > Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) > > Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell > University > > Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist > > David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist > > Pei > Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, > California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco > > > > Cc: > > Ms. Helene Flautre, > Member, European Parliament > Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights > > Mr. Geoffrey Harris > Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament > > Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary > Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk > Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State > > Mr. David J. > Kramer > Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor > United States Department of State > > Ms. Felice D. Gaer > Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From space.cotoners8 at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 00:14:04 2008 From: space.cotoners8 at gmail.com (Space Cotoners8) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 20:44:04 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] inauguration exposition (Barcelona) Message-ID: <2ad987420808131144w50fbaf46hb164da27584d34c8@mail.gmail.com> 'El Escaparate :: espacio para el arte actual' Barcelona www.c8artwindow.com JUAN GARCÍA GÁMEZ Vernissage: 21th at 8 p.m Tres Almas' (Three Souls) is a small part of a larger sculptural project titled 'Lo intangible, el individuo y la libertad emocional' (The intangible, the individual and emotional freedom), where Juan García reflects 'souls', some with a bodily form as representations of the soul, others simply large-scale heads, small groups of sculptures that show the spectator abstract values silvering the importance that these have in our lives. Specifically, 'Tres Almas' to the political group, to the big powers of the United States, China and Japan. The reflection, however, goes one step further, trying to show how the fact of being born in a specific place influences the human being to behave in a particular way. This project becomes a great visual lure for the spectator, due not only to the size and colour of the works, but also for the easy recognition of the forms and colours reflected. From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Thu Aug 14 01:24:12 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 19:54:12 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] End Economic Blokade of Kashmir Valley - CPI (ML) In-Reply-To: <6353c690808130906x44a3ae15y46779e11b7c2baa1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <530338.30326.qm@web27802.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> End Economic Blockade of Kashmir Valley New Delhi, August 13, 2008.  Delhi Committee of CPI(ML) New Democracy organized a program at Jantar Mantar from 1130 onwards to demand that the blockade of Kashmir be lifted forthwith, curfew be lifted and firing and repression by armed forces in J&K on common people be stopped immediately. Condemning the communal conspiracies of rulers and ruling class parties against the people of Jammu and Kashmir the party demanded that ex-CM Azad, Mufti and ex-Governor Sinha be prosecuted. Students, working class leaders, youth and several intellectuals took part in the protest. The protestors held posters displaying their demands. Speakers condemned the rulers of J&K –the trimuverate of Azad, Mufti and Sinha- for blatantly and insensitively creating a situation where the people of Kashmir feel threatened over their right to their own land. As it is, the ruling classes of India have trampled underfoot the democratic aspirations of the people of Kashmir and subjected them to severe repression and blatant violations of democratic rights. Now, after literally forcing the Kashmiri people to take to the streets to defend their rights to their land, the ruling class parties have pitted the people of Jammu against them in a bid to fan communal divisions among the people. People in all parts of the state are bearing the brunt of armed forces repression, especially the people of the Kashmir Valley. The issue, which has baselessly been projected at being at stake, is the Amarnath Yatra which has been on for over a century, with arrangements being made by the Government of Kashmir and local Kashmiri Muslims aiding the pilgrims. People of the entire country know this to be the fact which is why it makes no sense for any organisation in Jammu to  say they are fighting for the rights of Hindu pilgrims-it is crystal clear that leaders of Congress and BJP are fanning and leading the so called reaction in Jammu. To add fuel to the fire, the government of India is busy denying the fact of economic blockade of Kashmir, even as it’s Defence Minister offers assurances that fruits will be purchased and consumed by ‘school children and CRPF’! – where is there need of such steps if no blockade exists? In fact, an all out attempt is on by the government to alienate and isolate the people of the Valley, further curb their democratic space and communalize the entire situation-in which it is being ably assisted by the BJP. Com. Aparna (Delhi Party Secretary), Dr. Mrigank (Pres. Naujawan Bharat Sabha), Ms. Poonam Kaushik (Gen Secy. Pragatisheel Mahila Sanghatan), Dr.Animesh Das (President IFTU, Delhi) and known intellectuals like, Ish Mishra, Tapan Bose, Gautam Navlakha and Mir Imtiaz addressed the gathering. CPI(ML) New Democracy demands the immediate lifting of economic blockade of Kashmir, lifting of curfew and stop to repression of people of J&K and prosecution of Azad-Mufti and Sinha. (Ends) APARNA Secy. Delhi Committee Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Thu Aug 14 01:25:02 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 19:55:02 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu flare-up and the ideology of hate (Tehran Times) Message-ID: <11938.42741.qm@web27806.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Date: Wednesday, 13 August, 2008, 8:21 PM   (Aug. 14 Tehran Times Opinion Column, by Syed Ali Safvi) http://www.mehrnews .com/en/newsdeta il.aspx?NewsID= 732743    By Syed Ali Safvi Jammu flare-up and the ideology of hate TEHRAN, Aug. 13 (MNA) -- The land row and subsequent political and economic crisis have raised many a question and exploded many a myth. It has also exonerated Mohammad Ali Jinnah’s demand for a separate nation for Muslims. The father of the Indian nation, Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi, once said that India would be known by the way it treats its minorities.   If Gandhi were alive today, he certainly would have hung his head in shame after seeing his dream of Hindu-Muslim- Sikh unity being tethered by some Hindu fanatics who are hellbent on spreading communal animosity.   It has been proven time and again that the Indian state has failed to protect its minorities. The West Bengal riots, the Delhi riots, the 1984 Sikh riots, the Babri Masjid demolition, the Baghalpur riots, the Gujarat pogrom, and hundreds and thousands of such communal riots in a span of less than 60 years have exposed the underbelly of Indian secularism. Now, the Jammu region is in the throes of a communal flare-up, and if effective measures are not taken to douse the flames, the conflagration will engulf all of India , with disastrous consequences.   Protestors in Jammu have been given a free hand, as Jammu Kashmir Liberation Front (JKLF) Chairman Yaseen Malik aptly put it, “Protestors are playing a friendly match with the police.” The attack on the Greater Kashmir (GK) Jammu office at Gandhi Nagar has underlined and attested to the truth in Malik’s proclamation. On the contrary, police are manhandling the protestors in the Kashmir Valley and resorting to extreme measures to quell their protests.   According to a report, police in Srinagar have been using a “sophisticated and dangerous weapon” called Rudra -– which is only allowed to be used in military operations -- on the unarmed peaceful protestors. This shows that the police and paramilitary forces have been using different modus operandi in the two regions.   India boasts about its tenets of secularism and democratic values, but it is just empty rhetoric that is not reflected in the realities on the ground. The world has seen how secularism and the “age-old history” of religious tolerance were trampled upon in Gujarat by the successors of Vinayak Damodar Savarkar’s ‘ideology of hate’. The seeds of communal hatred were sown by the members of the Hindu Mahasabha long ago, even before the very idea of Pakistan came into being.   Contrary to the common belief that Jinnah originated the two-nation theory, actually it was Savarkar who propounded the theory years before the Muslim League embraced the idea. Savarkar had commanded all the Muslims to leave ‘Bharat’ to pave the way for the establishment of Hindu Rashtra. When Jinnah introduced his two-nation theory, Savarkar announced, “I have no quarrel with Mr. Jinnah’s two-nation theory… It is a historical fact that Hindus and Muslims are two nations.”   “His (Savarkar’s) doctrine was Hindutva, the doctrine of Hindu racial supremacy, and his dream was of rebuilding a great Hindu empire from the sources of the Indus to those of the Brahmaputra . He hated Muslims. There was no place for them in the Hindu society he envisioned.” (Freedom at Midnight, by Dominique Lapierre and Larry Collins).   So the hate campaign against Muslims was well in place even before the partition of erstwhile British India . This and many other significant factors forced Jinnah to demand a separate nation for Muslims as he believed that Muslims would not be safe in India -- a prophetic declaration indeed! There is no denying the fact that Jinnah was secular to the marrow and would never have wished to cut ties with India , but circumstances compelled him to do so. However, he had not harbored grudges against India or its leaders. He had kept his house on Malabar Hill, thinking he could weekend there, while running his country from Karachi on weekdays, but destiny had something else in store for the estranged neighbors of the Asia Partition.   When Nathuram Godse pumped three bullets into Gandhi, a section of the Hindu community compared him with Judas. The writing was on the wall. The divide was evident. In some areas people mourned the death of Gandhi, and in other areas they distributed sweets, held celebrations, and demanded the release of Godse. Gandhi’s crime was that he had demanded security for Muslims.   The seeds of partition were actually sown by the stalwarts of Hindu Mahasabha, primarily the quartet of Savarkar, Gawarikar, Apte, and Nathuram Godse. Independent India’s history is testimony to the fact that in a conflict between the forces of secular nationalism and religious communalism, the latter has always ruled the roost. Secular forces have more often than not ended up playing into the hands of communal forces. Such has been the history of independent India , and it is again on display in Jammu .   Jammu has always been a communally sensitive region compared to the Kashmir Valley . Muslims of Jammu have borne the brunt of communal hatred before when Maharaja Hari Singh, with the help of the armed bands of the extremist militant Hindu party Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS), slew thousands of Muslims and forced the exodus of over 100,000 Muslims from Poonch. Interestingly, while the government is making every effort to facilitate the return of Kashmiri Pandits back to Kashmir, nothing has been done to bring back the refugees of the Jammu exodus.   The authorities have miserably failed to protect the hapless Muslims in Jammu . The protestors are doing things at will, even when the so-called curfew is in place. The Hindu fanatics have wreaked havoc in Akhnur Tehsil (50 kilometers from Jammu ) and the authorities are haplessly watching as mute spectators.   The State of Jammu and Kashmir has reached a stage where the integrity of the state is threatened.   The economic blockade imposed on the Kashmir Valley by Hindu fanatic forces has intensified the crisis. The Kashmir leadership is now exploring trade options via Muzaffarabad, something that should have been done long ago. Anyway, “deer ayad durust ayad” (better late than never). In the wake of the road blockade, it becomes imperative for Kashmir to explore alternative road links instead of being dependent on the current insufficient linkages. Through the Jhelum Valley road, Kashmir can restore its ties with China , Pakistan , Afghanistan , and Central Asia . And there is one more benefit. It is the only route that is free of snow in winter owing to its low elevation. Therefore, it will ensure an uninterrupted flow of traffic year-round.   This route has historical significance, too.   “The Jhelum Valley route was, until the partition, the easiest route from the Punjab to Kashmir . It was also convenient for those who wished to proceed towards Attock and Peshawar from Kashmir . It also must have been used for Kashmir’s trade with Persia and western Turkistan . Hiuen Tsiang and Ou-K’ong entered Kashmir from the west by this route, and it is by this route that many learned scholars and Sufis from Persia and Turkistan came to the valley.” (Kashmir under the Sultans by Mohibbul Hasan)   There are also reports in the media that in Uri protestors have threatened to cut power exports to counter the economic blockade (GK, August 9). If political parties in New Delhi , irrespective of their political ideology, do not immediately intervene and make efforts to pacify the agitators in Jammu , the State of Jammu and Kashmir could very well be divided along religious lines. Here, the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) is seeking to play a major role. In the run-up to Assembly and Lok Sabha elections, the party is trying to get political mileage out of the land row, but its members must make sure that the situation does not get out of control. If that happens, as one of my friends said, “We would see the Red Army in Ladakh, the Green Army in the Valley, and the Saffron Army in Jammu .” Are we ready for that?   For the saner elements in the Kashmir Valley and Jammu , it is time to show resilience and commitment to religious tolerance. They should not succumb to the pressure and most importantly they must not play into the hands of divisive forces which are hellbent on dividing the state along religious lines. For the authorities, it is like one of those bad dreams where you leave the house and discover you’re not dressed properly. Nonetheless, it is high time they pull up their socks and do what is required.   The writer is a Kashmir-based journalist.   (Aug. 14 Tehran Times Opinion Column, by Syed Ali Safvi) __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Polls | Members Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Visit Your Group Y! Messenger Quick file sharing Send up to 1GB of files in an IM. Popular Y! Groups Is your group one? Check it out and see. Yahoo! Groups Familyographer Zone Join a group and share your pictures. . __,_._,___ Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From taraprakash at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 02:19:35 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 16:49:35 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu flare-up and the ideology of hate (Tehran Times) References: <11938.42741.qm@web27806.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <006201c8fd86$19279a90$6500a8c0@taraprakash> "It has also exonerated Mohammad Ali Jinnah’s demand for a separate nation for Muslims." Not really. Not that easily unless one is bound to exonerate him. Jinna would also hung his head several times in shame if he were to survive these 60 years of independence. That Muslim is a monolithic community has been proved to be a myth several times already. The world should be ready to see Jinna's head hung in shame and guilt once more when the fight between MQM and Al Qaeda network comes to the limelight. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kashmir Affairs" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 3:55 PM Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu flare-up and the ideology of hate (Tehran Times) > Date: Wednesday, 13 August, 2008, 8:21 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > (Aug. 14 Tehran Times Opinion Column, by Syed Ali Safvi) > http://www.mehrnews .com/en/newsdeta il.aspx?NewsID= 732743 > > > > > > By Syed Ali Safvi > > Jammu flare-up and the ideology of hate > > TEHRAN, Aug. 13 (MNA) -- The land row and subsequent political and > economic crisis have raised many a question and exploded many a myth. > > > It has also exonerated Mohammad Ali Jinnah’s demand for a separate nation > for Muslims. The father of the Indian nation, Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi, > once said that India would be known by the way it treats its minorities. > > If Gandhi were alive today, he certainly would have hung his head in shame > after seeing his dream of Hindu-Muslim- Sikh unity being tethered by some > Hindu fanatics who are hellbent on spreading communal animosity. > > It has been proven time and again that the Indian state has failed to > protect its minorities. The West Bengal riots, the Delhi riots, the 1984 > Sikh riots, the Babri Masjid demolition, the Baghalpur riots, the Gujarat > pogrom, and hundreds and thousands of such communal riots in a span of > less than 60 years have exposed the underbelly of Indian secularism. Now, > the Jammu region is in the throes of a communal flare-up, and if effective > measures are not taken to douse the flames, the conflagration will engulf > all of India , with disastrous consequences. > > Protestors in Jammu have been given a free hand, as Jammu Kashmir > Liberation Front (JKLF) Chairman Yaseen Malik aptly put it, “Protestors > are playing a friendly match with the police.” The attack on the Greater > Kashmir (GK) Jammu office at Gandhi Nagar has underlined and attested to > the truth in Malik’s proclamation. On the contrary, police are manhandling > the protestors in the Kashmir Valley and resorting to extreme measures to > quell their protests. > > According to a report, police in Srinagar have been using a “sophisticated > and dangerous weapon” called Rudra -– which is only allowed to be used in > military operations -- on the unarmed peaceful protestors. This shows that > the police and paramilitary forces have been using different modus > operandi in the two regions. > > India boasts about its tenets of secularism and democratic values, but it > is just empty rhetoric that is not reflected in the realities on the > ground. The world has seen how secularism and the “age-old history” of > religious tolerance were trampled upon in Gujarat by the successors of > Vinayak Damodar Savarkar’s ‘ideology of hate’. The seeds of communal > hatred were sown by the members of the Hindu Mahasabha long ago, even > before the very idea of Pakistan came into being. > > Contrary to the common belief that Jinnah originated the two-nation > theory, actually it was Savarkar who propounded the theory years before > the Muslim League embraced the idea. Savarkar had commanded all the > Muslims to leave ‘Bharat’ to pave the way for the establishment of Hindu > Rashtra. When Jinnah introduced his two-nation theory, Savarkar announced, > “I have no quarrel with Mr. Jinnah’s two-nation theory… It is a historical > fact that Hindus and Muslims are two nations.” > > “His (Savarkar’s) doctrine was Hindutva, the doctrine of Hindu racial > supremacy, and his dream was of rebuilding a great Hindu empire from the > sources of the Indus to those of the Brahmaputra . He hated Muslims. There > was no place for them in the Hindu society he envisioned.” (Freedom at > Midnight, by Dominique Lapierre and Larry Collins). > > So the hate campaign against Muslims was well in place even before the > partition of erstwhile British India . This and many other significant > factors forced Jinnah to demand a separate nation for Muslims as he > believed that Muslims would not be safe in India -- a prophetic > declaration indeed! There is no denying the fact that Jinnah was secular > to the marrow and would never have wished to cut ties with India , but > circumstances compelled him to do so. However, he had not harbored grudges > against India or its leaders. He had kept his house on Malabar Hill, > thinking he could weekend there, while running his country from Karachi on > weekdays, but destiny had something else in store for the estranged > neighbors of the Asia Partition. > > When Nathuram Godse pumped three bullets into Gandhi, a section of the > Hindu community compared him with Judas. The writing was on the wall. The > divide was evident. In some areas people mourned the death of Gandhi, and > in other areas they distributed sweets, held celebrations, and demanded > the release of Godse. Gandhi’s crime was that he had demanded security for > Muslims. > > The seeds of partition were actually sown by the stalwarts of Hindu > Mahasabha, primarily the quartet of Savarkar, Gawarikar, Apte, and > Nathuram Godse. Independent India’s history is testimony to the fact that > in a conflict between the forces of secular nationalism and religious > communalism, the latter has always ruled the roost. Secular forces have > more often than not ended up playing into the hands of communal forces. > Such has been the history of independent India , and it is again on > display in Jammu . > > Jammu has always been a communally sensitive region compared to the > Kashmir Valley . Muslims of Jammu have borne the brunt of communal hatred > before when Maharaja Hari Singh, with the help of the armed bands of the > extremist militant Hindu party Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS), slew > thousands of Muslims and forced the exodus of over 100,000 Muslims from > Poonch. Interestingly, while the government is making every effort to > facilitate the return of Kashmiri Pandits back to Kashmir, nothing has > been done to bring back the refugees of the Jammu exodus. > > The authorities have miserably failed to protect the hapless Muslims in > Jammu . The protestors are doing things at will, even when the so-called > curfew is in place. The Hindu fanatics have wreaked havoc in Akhnur Tehsil > (50 kilometers from Jammu ) and the authorities are haplessly watching as > mute spectators. > > The State of Jammu and Kashmir has reached a stage where the integrity of > the state is threatened. > > The economic blockade imposed on the Kashmir Valley by Hindu fanatic > forces has intensified the crisis. The Kashmir leadership is now exploring > trade options via Muzaffarabad, something that should have been done long > ago. Anyway, “deer ayad durust ayad” (better late than never). In the wake > of the road blockade, it becomes imperative for Kashmir to explore > alternative road links instead of being dependent on the current > insufficient linkages. Through the Jhelum Valley road, Kashmir can restore > its ties with China , > Pakistan , Afghanistan , and Central Asia . And there is one more benefit. > It is the only route that is free of snow in winter owing to its low > elevation. Therefore, it will ensure an uninterrupted flow of traffic > year-round. > > This route has historical significance, too. > > “The Jhelum Valley route was, until the partition, the easiest route from > the Punjab to Kashmir . It was also convenient for those who wished to > proceed towards Attock and Peshawar from Kashmir . It also must have been > used for Kashmir’s trade with Persia and western Turkistan . Hiuen Tsiang > and Ou-K’ong entered Kashmir from the west by this route, and it is by > this route that many learned scholars and Sufis from Persia and Turkistan > came to the valley.” (Kashmir under the Sultans by Mohibbul Hasan) > > There are also reports in the media that in Uri protestors have threatened > to cut power exports to counter the economic blockade (GK, August 9). If > political parties in New Delhi , irrespective of their political ideology, > do not immediately intervene and make efforts to pacify the agitators in > Jammu , the State of Jammu and Kashmir could very well be divided along > religious lines. Here, the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) is seeking to play > a major role. In the run-up to Assembly and Lok Sabha elections, the party > is trying to get political mileage out of the land row, but its members > must make sure that the situation does not get out of control. If that > happens, as one of my friends said, “We would see the Red > Army in Ladakh, the Green Army in the Valley, and the Saffron Army in > Jammu .” Are we ready for that? > > For the saner elements in the Kashmir Valley and Jammu , it is time to > show resilience and commitment to religious tolerance. They should not > succumb to the pressure and most importantly they must not play into the > hands of divisive forces which are hellbent on dividing the state along > religious lines. For the authorities, it is like one of those bad dreams > where you leave the house and discover you’re not dressed properly. > Nonetheless, it is high time they pull up their socks and do what is > required. > > The writer is a Kashmir-based journalist. > > (Aug. 14 Tehran Times Opinion Column, by Syed Ali Safvi) > > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > > > Messages in this topic (1) > > > > Reply (via web post) > | > > Start a new topic > > > > > Messages > > > > > | Polls > | Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) > > Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch > format to Traditional > > > > Visit Your Group > | > > Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | > > Unsubscribe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Visit Your Group > > > > > > Y! Messenger > Quick file sharing > Send up to 1GB of > files in an IM. > > Popular Y! Groups > Is your group one? > Check it out and > see. > > Yahoo! Groups > Familyographer Zone > Join a group and > share your pictures. > > > > . > > > > __,_._,___ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From sagnik.chakravartty at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 02:36:06 2008 From: sagnik.chakravartty at gmail.com (SAGNIK CHAKRAVARTTY) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 02:36:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Doordarshan in Arunachal Message-ID: Dear all, The autonomous public broadcaster of India, Prasar Bharati's television concern - Doordarshan is existent even in far-off remote Arunachal Pradesh. The Itanagar Kendra of Doordarshan has a brand new website - www.arunachaldd.com which has features like video gallery, programmes, organisation details.... Please visit the site and give your valuable feedback to the site administrator Somok Chakraverty at bitan2006 at gmail.com There is a disclaimer that the website is still under construction..... So friends, give your valuable feedback as how to improve the overall look and content of the website..... and make the site a dynamic one..... Bye and Cheers Sagnik Chakravartty Copy Editor (on Contract) Doordarshan News Prasar Bharati Broadcasting Corporation of India (An autonomous body established by the Parliament of India) Mobile 9868568921 From birdsonwirefilms at yahoo.com Thu Aug 14 03:38:39 2008 From: birdsonwirefilms at yahoo.com (radha indu rana) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 15:08:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] A new award for Rajendra Pachauri Message-ID: <737420.75261.qm@web53308.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Nobel Prize winner Rajendra Pachauri gets the 1st LNC Green Hypocrite prize. More info here- http://libertynewscentral.blogspot.com/2008/08/announcing-1st-lnc-green-hypocrite.html From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 09:00:32 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 09:00:32 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] J&K Economic Blockade - "Myth" Message-ID: <6353c690808132030v2fde35dbs55121c919b863f82@mail.gmail.com> This should be thrown on the face of whosoever talks about "Economic Blockade"..... Shame on these LIARS from the valley !!! Shame on Sajaad Lone, Omar Farooq, Mufti-duo, and all these sick politicians !! Shame on their blind Supporters..!! http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/JK_blockade_staged_by_ISI_to_help_Hurriyat/articleshow/3362369.cms ".....The home ministry on Wednesday released figures countering the claim of agitationists in the Valley about the economic blockade and arguing that truckers and unions of fruit growers openly aligned with Hurriyat were also engaged in myth-making about the blockade...... Referring to the stranded trucks in the Valley, an official said a fleet of them actually belonged to one individual known for his close affiliation with Hurriyat. The transporter refused to move his vehicles towards Jammu despite the promise of full security cover along the route.................. Thanks Aditya Raj kaul Campaign Blog - www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com/ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 09:03:20 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 09:03:20 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] End Economic Blokade of Kashmir Valley - CPI (ML) In-Reply-To: <530338.30326.qm@web27802.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <6353c690808130906x44a3ae15y46779e11b7c2baa1@mail.gmail.com> <530338.30326.qm@web27802.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808132033qf442c14t61645477d587863e@mail.gmail.com> Another PR Exercise to spread and further justify lies. Unfortunate.. On 8/14/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > End Economic Blockade of Kashmir Valley > > > > New Delhi, August 13, 2008. Delhi Committee of CPI(ML) New Democracy > > organized a program at Jantar Mantar from 1130 onwards to demand that the > > blockade of Kashmir be lifted forthwith, curfew be lifted and firing and > > repression by armed forces in J&K on common people be stopped immediately. > > Condemning the communal conspiracies of rulers and ruling class parties > > against the people of Jammu and Kashmir the party demanded that ex-CM > > Azad, Mufti and ex-Governor Sinha be prosecuted. > > > > Students, working class leaders, youth and several intellectuals took part > > in the protest. The protestors held posters displaying their demands. > > > > Speakers condemned the rulers of J&K –the trimuverate of Azad, Mufti and > > Sinha- for blatantly and insensitively creating a situation where the > > people of Kashmir feel threatened over their right to their own land. As > > it is, the ruling classes of India have trampled underfoot the democratic > > aspirations of the people of Kashmir and subjected them to severe > > repression and blatant violations of democratic rights. Now, after > > literally forcing the Kashmiri people to take to the streets to defend > > their rights to their land, the ruling class parties have pitted the > > people of Jammu against them in a bid to fan communal divisions among the > > people. People in all parts of the state are bearing the brunt of armed > > forces repression, especially the people of the Kashmir Valley. > > > > The issue, which has baselessly been projected at being at stake, is the > > Amarnath Yatra which has been on for over a century, with arrangements > > being made by the Government of Kashmir and local Kashmiri Muslims aiding > > the pilgrims. People of the entire country know this to be the fact which > > is why it makes no sense for any organisation in Jammu to say they are > > fighting for the rights of Hindu pilgrims-it is crystal clear that leaders > > of Congress and BJP are fanning and leading the so called reaction in > > Jammu. > > > > To add fuel to the fire, the government of India is busy denying the fact > > of economic blockade of Kashmir, even as it's Defence Minister offers > > assurances that fruits will be purchased and consumed by 'school children > > and CRPF'! – where is there need of such steps if no blockade exists? In > > fact, an all out attempt is on by the government to alienate and isolate > > the people of the Valley, further curb their democratic space and > > communalize the entire situation-in which it is being ably assisted by the > > BJP. > > > > Com. Aparna (Delhi Party Secretary), Dr. Mrigank (Pres. Naujawan Bharat > > Sabha), Ms. Poonam Kaushik (Gen Secy. Pragatisheel Mahila Sanghatan), > > Dr.Animesh Das (President IFTU, Delhi) and known intellectuals like, Ish > > Mishra, Tapan Bose, Gautam Navlakha and Mir Imtiaz addressed the > > gathering. > > > > CPI(ML) New Democracy demands the immediate lifting of economic blockade > > of Kashmir, lifting of curfew and stop to repression of people of J&K and > > prosecution of Azad-Mufti and Sinha. (Ends) > > > > APARNA > > Secy. Delhi Committee > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 09:07:06 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 09:07:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please sign this petition on Chengara and circulate it widely Message-ID: <48A3A862.1040503@gmail.com> *Apologies for cross posting* ** Dear Friends As most of you are aware, around 5000 families protesting in Chengara are facing violence and are completely cut off even from basic necessities like food and medicine by a bunch of goons with the connivance of the Government of Kerala. There are several activities taking place on the ground to provide some relief to the protestors. In addition, we thought it is important to show solidarity in the form of a petition addressed to Constitutional authorities in this country, to put pressure on the Government of Kerala to act immediately and secure justice for the peaceful protestors. Please do sign this petition and circulate it widely amongst your contacts. The petition can be found at http://www.petitiononline.com/ chengara/petition.html From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Thu Aug 14 10:22:07 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 21:52:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir Message-ID: <996006.11686.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Let us not go into History to solve current problem. Because history is black. What happened in 1947 was not the start of history. The history that resulted in 1947 was started more than a thousand years ago when Muslims invaded India. They looted, massacred and raped Indians (Hindus) in the name of Infidels. Captured all our temples and palaces including Taj Mahal and declared that it is their property. This I am not saying. Muslims boasts on this even today. Read Baburnama, Akburnama, Shahnama, etc and you come to know all this by them only. When the fight of Independence took place, the world knows that Muslims did not cooperate. It was a failure of Mahatma Gandhi in making an agreement for Non-Cooperation movement in exchange to support Khilafat movement. What resulted was killing of HIndus in thousands by Muslims, particularly at Malabar, what is called as Mopla Rebellion. Thus, Muslims didn't play a part in freedom movement as they believed that India belonged to them. 1947 was simply a separation that took place and Hindus died in a greater number in comparision to Muslims. 1971-1974: More than 3 lakhs Hindus were massacred in Bangladesh and Pakistan... And since then, Kashmiri pandits were being massacred, their women raped and young girls thrown into Harem as per Koranic sarriah.. Though this is still happening in small scale even in other parts of the country and news sometime flash out... But the main problem in Kashmir valley is that all the Muslims there (and most of them even in India - I say most of them and not all) are anti-Hindustan.. their sole goal is to Islamize this country and kill all the 60 million Hindus (Pagans of Infidels as declared in their Koran)... We can easily see from news channel that Kashmiris host Pakistan's flag and piss on Indian flag... Where was the human rights when village after village used to be massacred in Kashmir in the name of religion... Most of the houses in which Muslims live in Kashmir belong to Hindus... Why don't the Kashmiri Muslim make a call to Hindus of this nation to go and live there... What is wrong in giving the forest department's land to HIndus in Amarnath... Why the wrong message that Amarnath was discovered by a Muslim, when in reality the place was well known even before birth of Islam in the name of Amareshwar... This is expected out of Islam.. because Koran teaches it.. If their GOD (Allah) himself is fill with hatred and Allah himself has prepared Fire of Hell for non-believers, just because they do not believe in Allah, then what to say about their people... Muslims have got certificate from GOD to kill non-Muslims and particularly Hindus.. and if HIndus retaliate, it is human rights violation.... Thanks to the Hindus of Kashmir.. at least Amarnath land is one point which has united Hindus back... Hindus are the symbols of peace on this earth... India is secular as long as we have majority of Hindus.. the day Hindu goes to minority, Kashmir will evolve.. and Hindus have realized that if they are killed and massacred, they have no room to escape... Kashmiri pandits have taken refuge in their own motherland as there was room for Hindus left... but if there would be all Kashmir where will the HIndus go.. all border countries are Muslims ready to kill them... Let India be a pure HIndu country again... For Muslims or Christians - all are safe in the hand of Hindus only... And the incidences that are quoted by Muslims are simply retaliations of HIndus, not their attack... Bloody Kashmiris - Khaate Hindustan ke hain, aur gaate Pakistan ke hain... BAM BAM BHOLE... Movement is on... I am not the lone one... hundreds and thousands of Hindus are now awake... we will save this nation... ----- Original Message ---- From: Vedavati Jogi To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Cc: achatterji at ciis.edu; reader-list at sarai.net; Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 5:41:40 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir Dear Champions of Human Rights,   I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our dear muslim terrorist brothers and then only you publish such type of calls.   Vedavati --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM Justice Navanethem Pillay, High Commissioner Dr. Kyung-wha Kang, Deputy High Commissioner Ms. Gay McDougall, Independent Expert on minority issues Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights United Nations Palais des Nations CH-1211 Geneva 10 Switzerland Subject: Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir August 12, 2008 Dear Justice Pillay, Dr. Kang, Ms. McDougall: We write to bring to your attention the profound humanitarian crisis continuing in the Kashmir Valley due to the ongoing blockade of the Srinagar-Jammu highway by religious nationalist groups from India. This has resulted in severe shortages in the Kashmir Valley of food and other vital provisions. We are reliably informed that petrol and essential medical rations, including blood, are in critically short supply, as well as newsprint, and that communication services and infrastructure are severely disrupted. The situation in Jammu, where the Muslim minority is facing violence on a scale that can be described as ethnic cleansing, is alarming. The Government of India and the military and paramilitary forces have shown themselves unable and/or unwilling to take any effective action, either to end the blockade or to stop the violence against Muslims in Jammu. Meanwhile, military and paramilitary forces have opened fire on counter-demonstrators in Kashmir, using live bullets and mortar. A communiqué from the Kashmir Valley states that: "The situation here on ground is that essential commodities have started getting dried up, diesel is already out of stock and petrol at its verge of end. The people here are very much concerned as if the same continues for next few days there will be nothing left to eat with the people of Kashmir. And on the other side the Army is supporting the mobs who have allegedly beaten up the drivers stranded on the national highway. The drivers who were beaten up reported that they asked Army to help them but all went in despair and the Army people in return handed them over to the mobs. The target is only the Kashmiri Muslims and some sources from Jammu say that it is the outsiders who have come to Jammu and are doing such attacks on the Muslims and it is quite evident that the Hindu fundamentalist groups viz. BJP, RSS VHP, etc., are all sponsoring the planned attacks onto the Kashmiris like it was done in Gujarat. Here in Kashmir we feel the history seems to be being repeated by the Hindu fundamentalists who had earlier in 1947 killed about 250,000 Muslims in Jammu." On August 11, 2008, approximately 100,000 Kashmiris, including fruit growers and others gravely affected by the blockade, marched toward the Line of Control toward Pakistan markets in protest. They were met with gunfire and tear gas from the military and paramilitary forces, and Sheik Abdul Aziz, an All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader, was shot dead, intensifying the situation. Police reports stated that three others were killed and over 200 injured, enervating health systems already low on supplies. Other sources we contacted stated that as many as 18 others may have been killed in Kashmir on August 11. By early evening of August 12, as we write you, reports stated that as many as twelve persons were killed in Kashmir on that day as armed forces fired on demonstrators. Other reports stated that civil society groups, students, and labor unions participating in non-violent civil disobedience and peaceful protests are being targeted by the forces, as curfew conditions prevail. The Srinagar-Jammu highway is the only land route linking the Kashmir Valley to India and the sole conduit for essential supplies as well as for exporting horticultural goods, which are among the Valley's chief products. News updates on the state of the blockade and situation can be found from leading Kashmiri newspapers, which are online at www.greaterkashmir.com; www.kashmirtimes.com; www.risingkashmir.com; www.etalaat.com/english/. About 95-97 percent of the population of the Valley is Muslim, while Muslims are a minority in India. This has made Kashmir the target of increasingly aggressive campaigns by Hindu nationalist groups since 1947, despite guarantees of autonomy written into the Indian Constitution. The Government of India has failed to take measures to prevent these campaigns, consisting of marches and demonstrations, and culminating in the current blockade. Since 1989 there has been an armed pro-independence struggle in Kashmir, together with other and non-violent movements for self-determination. Indian counterinsurgency operations have resulted in grave abuses of human rights with social, economic, psychological, political, and environmental consequences, which meet the definition under international law of crimes against humanity. To a population suffering the effects of nineteen years of armed conflict, the economic crisis caused by the blockade comes as the last straw. We urge that you respond expeditiously to this situation in accordance with the mandate to uphold human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations. Recommendations: 1. The Government of India should immediately end the economic blockade and ensure that goods and services, including emergency medical and food supplies, can move in both directions along the Srinagar-Jammu border. 2. The Government of India should open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road, a promise repeatedly reiterated by successive governments of India and Pakistan, though never implemented. This would ensure that the current crisis situation is not repeated as well as mark a concrete step forward in addressing injustices and the peace process. 3. Take immediate action to stop the violence against the Muslim minority in Jammu and bring those responsible to justice. 4. Put an end to ongoing human rights abuses by Indian forces and pro-India militias as repeatedly promised by the Indian Prime Minister and expected of democratic governments. 5. Take steps for a long-term resolution of the conflict by beginning talks with all sections of the Kashmiri leadership and civil society. 6. Take steps to hold the Indian state accountable under the provisions established by the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir, Constitution of India, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and International Laws and Conventions. We, the undersigned, are academics, social activists, writers, filmmakers, artists, lawyers, and concerned citizens. Our work and conscience connects us to Kashmir and its people. We hold no political affiliations. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further use. Contact persons: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, Office: 001-415.575.6119, Mobile: 001-415.640.4013, E-mail: achatterji at ciis.edu. Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University, Office: 001-740.593.0823, E-mail: duschins at ohio.edu. Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey, Office: 001-347.404.2238, E-mail: Shubh.Mathur at stockton.edu. Yours Sincerely, Signed [Institutional information noted for affiliation purposes only]: Dr. Angana Chatterji, Associate Professor, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. Haley Duschinski, Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Ohio University Dr. Shubh Mathur, Visiting Assistant Professor, Department of History, Richard Stockton College of New Jersey Dr. Paola Bacchetta, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women's Studies, and Director, Beatrice Bain Research Group, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Srimati Basu, Associate Professor, Department of Gender and Women’s Studies (and Anthropology), University of Kentucky Medea Benjamin, Cofounder, Global Exchange, San Francisco, and CODEPINK Dr. Purnima Bose, Associate Professor, Department of English, Indiana University Dr. Jeff Brody, Professor, College of Communications, California State University Fullerton Adem Carroll, Chair, Muslim Consultative Network, New York Disaster Interfaith Services Dr. Lubna Nazir Chaudhry, Assistant Professor, School of Education and Human Development, State University of New York, Binghamton Huma Dar, Doctoral student, Department of South and South East Asian Studies, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Geraldine Forbes, Distinguished Teaching Professor, Department of History, State University of New York Oswego Dr. Sidney L. Greenblatt, President, Central New York Fulbright Association Dr. Sondra Hale, Professor, Department of Anthropology and Women's Studies, University of California, Los Angeles Dr. Lamia Karim, Assistant Professor, Department of Anthropology, University of Oregon-Eugene Professor Ali Kazimi, Department of Film, Faculty of Fine Arts, York University Dr. Omar Khalidi, Aga Khan Program, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Rafique A. Khan, Community Development Planner, CRA, City of Los Angeles Tasneem F. Khan, Kashmir Relief, Los Angeles Dr. Amitava Kumar, Writer and Professor, Department of English, Vassar College Rabbi Michael Lerner, Chair, The Network of Spiritual Progressives, Berkeley Barbara Lubin, Executive Director, Middle East Children's Alliance, Berkeley Dr. Sunaina Maira, Associate Professor, Department of Asian American Studies, University of California, Davis Dr. Lise McKean, Senior Research Specialist, Learning Sciences Research Institute, University of Illinois at Chicago Dr. Abdul R. JanMohamed, Professor, Department of English, University California, Berkeley Dr. Swapna Mukhopadhyay, Associate Professor, Graduate School of Education, Portland State University Dr. Richa Nagar, Professor, Department of Gender, Women, and Sexuality Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Vijaya Nagarajan, Associate Professor, Department of Theology and Religious Studies, University of San Francisco Annie Paradise, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Dr. David Naguib Pellow, Professor, Department of Sociology, University of Minnesota Faisal Qadri, Human Rights Law Network Dr. Mridu Rai, Associate Professor, Department of History and Whitney and Betty MacMillan Center for International and Area Studies, Yale University Dr. Cabeiri Robinson, Assistant Professor, International Studies & South Asian Studies, Jackson School of International Studies, University of Washington, Seattle Dr. Sabina Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of English, Hofstra University Dr. Simona Sawhney, Associate Professor, Department of Asian Languages and Literatures, University of Minnesota Dr. Kalpana Rahita Seshadri, Associate Professor, Department of English, Boston College Professor Richard Shapiro, Chair, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Murtaza Shibli, Editor, Kashmir Affairs, London Dr. Magid Shihade, Visiting Scholar, Middle East/South Asia Studies, University of California, Davis Snehal Shingavi, Doctoral student, Department of English, University of California, Berkeley Dr. Ajay Skaria, Associate Professor, Department of History and Institute of Global Studies, University of Minnesota Dr. Nancy Snow, Associate Professor, S. I. Newhouse School of Public Communications, Syracuse University Dr. Rachel Sturman, Assistant Professor, Department of History & Asian Studies, Bowdoin College Dr. Fouzieyha Towghi, Visiting Professor, Department of Ethnic Studies, University of California, Berkeley Sandeep Vaidya, India Solidarity Group (Ireland) Saiba Varma, Doctoral student, Department of Anthropology, Cornell University Feroz Ahmed Wani, Social activist David Wolfe, Human security and conflict resolution specialist Pei Wu, Doctoral student, Department of Social and Cultural Anthropology, California Institute of Integral Studies, San Francisco Cc: Ms. Helene Flautre, Member, European Parliament Chair of the European Parliament's Sub-committee on Human Rights Mr. Geoffrey Harris Head of Human Rights Unit, European Parliament Ambassador Richard A. Boucher, Assistant Secretary Timothy Fitzgibbons, India Desk Bureau of South and Central Asian Affairs United States Department of State Mr. David J. Kramer Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor United States Department of State Ms. Felice D. Gaer Chair, United States Commission on International Religious Freedom Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>   _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From rahul_capri at yahoo.com Thu Aug 14 10:58:26 2008 From: rahul_capri at yahoo.com (Rahul Asthana) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <136236.36769.qm@web53604.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Are we,as a society,communal? Depending on that answer,I don't see why we cant make the same assumption about press etc.Though it may manifest itself in different and ostensibly more sophisticated ways,it shouldn't be surprising if the subset reflects the same quality as the superset. --- On Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: > From: mahmood farooqui > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > To: "sarai list" , "Aamir Bashir" > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the > valley because of the > police firing. > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and > Hindustan Times, > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked > by a Kashmiri. > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or > attacked by the police. > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured > by the police > firing. > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 11:01:41 2008 From: shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com (Shambhu Rahmat) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 11:31:41 +0600 Subject: [Reader-list] BANGLADESH: Generals, it's time you were gone Message-ID: To see the images and related URLs, go to the blog: http://www.drishtipat.org/blog/2008/08/14/its-time-you-were-gone/ Else, read it below. BANGLADESH Generals, It's time you were gone Posted by khujeci_tomai under Democracy(edit this) "It's time — it's time you were gone" - Anton Chekhov [Agafya] Dhaka Gridlock Sitting in traffic today and calculating how long it would take my 10 minute ride to mutate into 1 hour, I thought about traffic as a metaphor for the country. Then I cracked open the newspaper and found I was not the only one. H Khondker calls it Spaces of Despair, although his recommendations (headlights on rickshaws, teach rickshaw pullers the rules) smell like naive bhodrolok/army politics (danda mere thanda, and yes joto dosh the subaltern) that landed us in this Army/CareTakerGovernment mess. Putting hard facts to the exploding traffic crisis, Kailash Sarkar informs us that a 10 km ride (Bangla Motor-Bangla College) is now a 3.5 hour 'odyssey'. People are using apocalyptic language: "Commuters say the entire city traffic system has collapsed". 1 lakh vehicles out of 6 lakh were withdrawn by CTG after 1/11, but all those vehicles have returned. 175 community policemen were deployed by CTG, all of whom have no reporting to police and are totally ineffective. DCC has licensed 87,000 rickshaw, but there are 5 lakh rickshaws now in Dhaka with another 1 lakh expected before Eid. As I ditched my transport and walked (something I do almost every morning now so as to get to work on time) I kept thinking of traffic as a metaphor. I thought of those vehicles that the CTG boldly banished, which are all now back. Actually, everything is back! Everyone is back! And in all this I see again something I have been feeling for months now. No one is running the country. Weekly Shaptahik put it best after the latest round of bails to top tier politicians: "Special Special Bail and 2 Years of System Loss". System Loss It sounds like a cruel joke. The CTG has collapsed and all that remains is one giant human-spirit/life-electricity siphoning system loss? Some hoped against experience that something good would come out of 1/11. Actually many did. Even AL/BNP grassroots workers were heard saying, the rot at the top will be removed, and we will rise in the ranks. But ekhon? Jaha bahanno, taha teppano. In August 2008, what are the CTG achievements? Jailing the bigwigs? Reforming the parties? Checking the Islamists? Creating a third force? Yunus? Ferdaus Quraishi? General Ibrahim? Anti Corruption Commission? Truth & Reconciliation Commission? Independent Election Commission? Rangs Building? Rule of law? RAB of law? Due Process? Walking through Dhanmondi Rd 32, I saw huge gates at front, with giant pictures of Sheikh Mujib. Giant shamianas outside Mujib's house. Energized AL leaders are going to Tungipara today. CTG's announcement of Aug 15th as national mourning day again is probably insurance for a possible AL landslide (unless Barisal style DGFI cooking happens again). 15th August will be interesting. I predict AL will flex their muscle. Army will get the shudders. 15th August, 1975 is the first confrontation between the Bangladesh Army and Civilian Democracy. August 2008 is the umpteenth such confrontation. It all shows no sign of ending. Upazila election hobe. Na hobe na. Emergency rule election. EU says it won't certify that. Khaleda "aj raat" e ber hobe. No no, more negotiations. Koko says from Bangkok bed "I don't understand politics." Tarek er spine er 50th exam er jonno arekta medical board. Ey oy omuk tomuk eta sheta koto ki jhalmuri. Shesh hoiyyao hoi na shesh bhai. Chere de ma, kede bachi ebar. Oh and Ramadan is coming, so politics on hold. Again! Doesn't this all start sounding way too much like December 2006? All the CTG maneuvering now is to ensure they get National Security Council. That is the only remaining pound of flesh to extract. Ar news pora o jai na, shonao jai na. As Faruk Wasif said, "I bathed in ambrosia/but it turned to poison" The country is a patient, sliced open on the operating table. But the medicine is killing the patient. And the longer it stays open, the more infections spread. The gangrene has reached all the way to the head. There was a time when I cursed our dysfunctional democracy nonstop. Kintu trump card shob play kora hoye geche. It seems this dysfunctional democracy is all we have, and we have to fix it through democracy. There are no short cuts left. It's time you were gone. From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 12:00:23 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:00:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gautam Navlakha , how does the Hurriyat coffee smell ? Message-ID: <6353c690808132330w23e7047bpe7ea1bec997f87c@mail.gmail.com> Gautam Navlakha , how does the Hurriyat coffee smell ? from - http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/ Psuedo secular and anti hindu activist Gautam Navlakha , as expected was furios on national TV (NDTV) yesterday and asked why the killings of Kashmii Hindus are being discussed every-time the Kashmir issue is being discussed. Guatam Navlakha further said that as appeared in some news media that only 209 Kashmiri hindus were killed in Kashmir ,though the news was never backed up by any official , Gautam Navlakha prefers to hang out to this news to rescue the communal and separatist who have been resonsible for crimes against the minorty. *Check more on* - http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/08/10/gautam-navlakha-how-does-the-hurriyat-coffee-smell/ From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Thu Aug 14 15:45:40 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 10:15:40 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] AIMMM expresses concern over brutalities in Jammu and Kashmir In-Reply-To: <6353c690808132330w23e7047bpe7ea1bec997f87c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <472155.45837.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> AIMMM expresses concern over brutalities in J&K KT NEWS SERVICE New Delhi, Aug 13: The All India Muslim Majlis-e Mushawarat (AIMMM) President Dr Zafarul-Islam Khan expressed deep anguish over the spiralling violence against Muslims in Jammu and Kashmir. The head of AIMMM, the umbrella body of Indian Muslim organisations, condemned the carnage committed by the armed forces against peaceful and unarmed processions and demanded the prosecution of the officers and soldiers responsible for the bloodbath, a release today said. ÿHe observed that security forces under the protection of the questionable Armed Forces Special Powers Act (AFPSA) have run riot against the Muslims of the Valley while same forces act as mute spectators in the face of continuing defiance of curfew in Jammu and fail to move in front of attacks against Muslims in Jammu. Now even anti-Muslim riots are breaking out in Jammu where Muslim houses were burnt down on Tuesdayafter the police itself had killed one person and injured 50 when Muslims were protesting. Communal forces, running riot in Jammu for over a month, are now trying to transfer their hate campaign to the whole country, he said, adding that the communal forces spearheading the agitation are receiving unashamed RSS and BJP support. Dr Khan said that both the central and state governments have failed to offer a solution to a problem created in the first place by these very forces. Refusal to involve Valley politicians and Hurriyat leaders in the discussions only complicates issues as no solution is possible without taking their views and sensibilities into consideration. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Thu Aug 14 17:14:14 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 16:44:14 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] AIMMM expresses concern over brutalities in Jammu andKashmir In-Reply-To: <472155.45837.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <6353c690808132330w23e7047bpe7ea1bec997f87c@mail.gmail.com> <472155.45837.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: No democratic rule in any part of the planet will tolerate the violence that is practised by the "protestors" irrespective of their faith. You mean to say that if the protesters are from a particular faith, destroy public property, kill innocents because they are from different faith, they should be garlanded and honoured.? Mufti and his daugther Mehbooba can as well go to saudi where the other daughter is settled, being the holy place for all their rhetorics if they can not be honouring their duties in the secular democratic nation as we are sure, they are not welcome along with Hurriath in pakistan for permanent stay, as pakistan wants them only to serve its interest of keeping the kasmir issue boiling.? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Kashmir Affairs Date: Thursday, August 14, 2008 3:46 pm Subject: [Reader-list] AIMMM expresses concern over brutalities in Jammu andKashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net, kashmir-global-network at yahoogroups.com > AIMMM expresses concern over brutalities in J&K > > KT NEWS SERVICE > > New Delhi, Aug 13: The All India Muslim Majlis-e Mushawarat (AIMMM) > President Dr Zafarul-Islam Khan expressed deep anguish over the > spiralling violence against Muslims in Jammu and Kashmir. > > The head of AIMMM, the umbrella body of Indian Muslim organisations, > condemned the carnage committed by the armed forces against peaceful > and unarmed processions and demanded the prosecution of the officers > and soldiers responsible for the bloodbath, a release today said. > > ÿHe observed that security forces under the protection of the > questionable Armed Forces Special Powers Act (AFPSA) have run riot > against the Muslims of the Valley while same forces act as mute > spectators in the face of continuing defiance of curfew in Jammu and > fail to move in front of attacks against Muslims in Jammu. Now even > anti-Muslim riots are breaking out in Jammu where Muslim houses were > burnt down on Tuesdayafter the police itself had killed one person and > injured 50 when Muslims were protesting. > Communal forces, running riot in Jammu for over a month, are now > trying to transfer their hate campaign to the whole country, he said, > adding that the communal forces spearheading the agitation are > receiving unashamed RSS and BJP support. > > Dr Khan said that both the central and state governments have failed > to offer a solution to a problem created in the first place by these > very forces. Refusal to involve Valley politicians and Hurriyat > leadersin the discussions only complicates issues as no solution > is possible > without taking their views and sensibilities into consideration. > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com_________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Thu Aug 14 18:10:27 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:40:27 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Indian paramilitary forces fire to Kill Kashmiris - Greater Kashmir In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <279717.50089.qm@web27806.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Bullets Hit Protestors’ Chest, Head, Abdomen, Heart NASEER A GANAI Srinagar, Aug 13: Doctors in different hospitals say causalities due to bullet injuries were higher as bullets have been fired at upper parts of the body including chest, heart and head. They say the troops and police resorted to target killing of protestors.  “Yesterday, we operated upon a number of persons having received bullet injuries. We also operated upon 15 seriously wounded, among them several died. I tell you most people have been shot at from very close range and above the waist causing maximum causalities,” said a consultant at SMHS Hospital.  “I can understand what would have happened outside. Inside the hospital, in the causality ward police fired teargas shells,” said Dr Idrees. Six persons who were brought dead to the hospital including Imtiyaz Ahmad Bhat of Lasjan, Imran Qayoom Wani of Baghi Mehtab, Qamran Mehboob, Faisal Showkat and others had been shot at upper parts including neck and chest.  Reports said 29 people have been killed in past two days. Doctors describe the shooting above waist as “target killing.”  Bullet injuries in chest, neck and head could not be described as firing in self-defence, said a doctor working in Soura Medical Institute. He said most of the people who were in critical condition have been hit at neck, chest and head. He said a person brought from Bemina this morning had been hit in head.   A senior official of the Medical Institute Soura said 50 persons who have received bullets have undergone major surgeries in past two days. The official said most of the patients who have been operated upon were in critical condition. “This is grim situation. I should tell you frankly that half of the people who have gone through major surgeries are in extremely critical condition. Some are on ventilators. We should pray for their survival,” said a doctor working in the Institute.  Doctors in valley hospitals have cancelled their leaves and are in hospitals for past four days continuously looking after the injured. Eight persons have died in past two days in the Medical Institute. “Among the eight, some were brought dead and some died after operation,” officials said.  Doctors said had troops and police fired below the waist the causalities would have been far less. “In that case it causes less damage than target killing,” doctors say.   Rouf Majeed, presently admitted in the SMHS hospital, has been shot in his shoulder. Doctors looking after him said that he has been shot with pistol. “I was in a protest when army’s JAKLI troops fired at us. I received a bullet and I was brought to hospital by people,” he said. He said three other persons have received serious injuries in their chest and head and they have been shifted to SKIMS.  Nazir Ahmad of Sumbal had received a bullet in the abdomen. Apart from bullets, tear gas shells have been fired directly at people. Rouf Majeed admitted in the SMHS has been hit at chest with a tear gas shell. “Had it been hit at heart, it would have been fatal,” doctors attending him said. Another person, Gowhar Bhat of Dalgate, admitted in the SMHS, has been hit at private parts with tear gas shell.  Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 14 18:17:44 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 05:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Gujjar Muslim Lady and her Burnt House (Kashmir Pictures) Message-ID: <153507.20037.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Go to : http://www.expressindia.com/gallery/picture_gallery.html?sec=96   Click on : SLIDE No. 3   It shows a lady sitting on a filled sack and in front of a hut. The hut has a thatched roof and mud walls held together by sticks.   If this hut had to catch fire, it would look obviously burnt and certainly not retain it's thatched roof. No it is not burnt.   The Indian Express caption for the photograph reads:    " A gujjar muslim lady sitting before her burnt house in Jourian, Akhnoor."   Is Indian Express communal? Well in this case it certainly seems to be intent on provoking communal trouble. Transparently so and rather stupidly.   Kshmendra From asitredsalute at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 18:17:52 2008 From: asitredsalute at gmail.com (Asit asitreds) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:17:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Niyamgiri Judjement with Updated Signatures Message-ID: Dear Friends Here is the statement on the recent supremecourt order on Niyamgiri Bauxite Mining Please endorse it and if possible please forward it to other activists groups and individuals. *With Regards * *Asit* *STATEMENT OF CONCERN ON NIYAMGIRI* We the undersigned are deeply concerned over the recent order of the Supreme Court in T.N. Godavaraman Thirumulpad vs. Union of India and Others in the matter of M/s Sterlite Industries (India) Ltd. This Order will pave the way for forcible displacement of thousands of *adivasis *for the mining of bauxite by Sterlite Industries Ltd., a frontal company of the notorious Vedanta Alimunium Industries, which is already tainted with its corporate malpractices. We note with deep anxiety that most of the inhabitants here are Dongria Kondhs who are classified as Primitive Tribes (which itself is a colonial construct) who know no other way of life hence need to be dealt with due sensitivity and precaution and who will be uprooted and marginalized once they are removed from their natural habitat. Today, where the UN bodies, all the governments, international and national civil societies including the progressive and democratic organisations world over are worried and deliberating on global warming and the impending ecological disaster and death of the planet. The issue raised by this judgement has become of crucial importance. The Dongria Kondhs who live a harmonious and symbiotic relationship with their environment show the way to mankind on how to lead a sustainable, meaningful and egalitarian life. It is also to be noted that the present order of the Supreme Court contradicts the 89th Amendment of the Constitution which clearly stipulates that no industry, mines or townships or any other construction activity can be undertaken without the consent of the Gram Sabhas of *adivasis *residing in the areas demarcated under the Fifth Schedule of the Constitution. This order will also nullify the implementation of the recently passed *Forest Rights Act*, under which the *adivasis *tilling forestland should get the ownership of the land they have been tilling since years. We are also deeply concerned that mining in Niyamgiri area will seriously upset the ecological equilibrium; this area is very rich in bio diversity including rare flora and fauna and many species of rare medicinal herbs. Niyamgiri hills are also the source of important rivers like Nagavali, Vansdhara, which caters to the need of many districts in Orissa including the southern coastal districts. The mining in that area will contravene the provisions of the Environmental Protection Act 1986 because it will seriously violate the letter and spirit of the Act. We urge the political parties especially the three most important pillars of our democracy i.e. the Executive, Judiciary and the Legislature to take cognisance of the aspirations of innumerable anti-displacement movements and progressive and democratic organisations in the country and scrap the draconian and colonial land acquisition act of 1894. Thus we call upon the Supreme Court, Government of India and Orissa to reconsider the case of mining in the Niyamgiri Hills and rescind the permission given to Sterlite Industries for mining in Niyamgiri. Kamal Mitra Chenoy School of International Study,JNU Thomas kochery World Forum of Fisher People ,Special Invitee,NAPM,NFF,NCI Professor Arun Kumar Centre for Study of Economic and Social Planning, School of Social Science, JNU Vijay Pratap Convenor, Lokayan Babulal Sharma Convenor, Global Gandhi Forum Rakesh Bhatt Coordinator, SADED/CSDS Faisal Khan Asha Parivar, NAPM, New Delhi Anil Thakur Vasudhaiva Kutumbakam, New Delhi Chandrasekhar Hota Research Scholar, Centre for Political Studies, School of Social Science, JNU Jeet Bhattacharya Research Scholar, Film Studies, School of Art and Aesthetics, JNU Peeyush Pant Editor, Lok Samvad, New Delhi Sayantoni Datta SADED/CSDS Asit Social Activist-Researcher, New Delhi Kumar Sameer Social Activist, New Delhi Shabnam Hashmi Anhad, New Delhi Kavita Krishnan Editor, Liberation Kiran Shaheen Media and Social activist, New Delhi Kundan Kumar Activist,Researcher,Orissa Felix Padel Anthropologist,U.K. Subrat Kumar Sahu film Maker and Freelance Writer, New Delhi Mamta Dash Social activist and researcher, New Delhi Prof Manidra Nath Thakur Centre for Political Studies ,SSS,JNU Prof Vivek Kumar Centre for Study of Social System, SSS, JNU Prof Rohan D'Souza Centre for Study of Science Policy, SSS ,JNU Prof Mohan Rao Centre for Social Medicine and community health, JNU Prof Janaki Abraham Women's Study Programme, SSS, JNU Prof Vanitha Damodarah University of Sussex, Sussex, U.K. Prof Asha Sarangi Centre for Political Studies,JNU Prithpal Singh randhawa Research Scholar, Instutute of Development Studies,Sussex, U.K. Rana Wilson Research Scholar, New Delhi Sunil Kumar Social Activist, New Delhi G.N. Trivedi Lecturer, Moti lal Nehru College, Delhi University Amit Student, CESP/SSS, JNU Sumandro Research Scholar, JNU Debolina Biswas Student, CESP/SSS,JNU From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 14 19:13:30 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 06:43:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <313018.45033.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Mahmood   Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. You are trying to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant.   Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum attacking a policeman.   Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. If this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured by police firing.   What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal.   There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums in Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal?   Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, one where law enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one where law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers.   Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the photographs, one could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' tinge   Kshmendra         --- On Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: From: mahmood farooqui Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures To: "sarai list" , "Aamir Bashir" Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because of the police firing. Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan Times, there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a Kashmiri. There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the police. The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the police firing. Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? Is the poser itself simplistic? _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 19:57:59 2008 From: mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com (mahmood farooqui) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:57:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: References: <313018.45033.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: mahmood farooqui Date: 2008/8/14 Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the responses are making me think. Best, Mahmood 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul Dear Mahmood > > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. You are trying > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. > > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum > attacking a policeman. > > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. If > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured by > police firing. > > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal. > > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums in > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? > > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, one where law > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one where > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. > > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the photographs, one > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' tinge > > Kshmendra > > > > > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui *wrote: > > From: mahmood farooqui > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > To: "sarai list" , "Aamir Bashir" < > unattore1 at gmail.com> > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because of the > police firing. > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan Times, > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a Kashmiri. > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the police. > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the police > firing. > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 21:30:30 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 21:30:30 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Causeless Journo/s (CJs)? Fourth Estate In The Age Of Social Movements Message-ID: <35f96d470808140900l6f06116cvd5bc8db0f5f5ee91@mail.gmail.com> An Interesting article by TT Sreekumar >From Countercurrents http://www.countercurrents.org/sreekumar140808.htm *Causeless Journo/s (CJs)? Fourth Estate In The Age Of Social Movements* *By Dr. T T Sreekumar* 14 August, 2008 *Countercurrents.org* *T*he rise of social movements in the political horizon of neoliberal India heralds a transformation in the modes of reflexive social praxis involving a rupture with the overly familiar cultural nationalist and class based movements in the country. Beginning with the peasant movements in the 1980s, the appearance of what could be collectively called new social movements began to take concrete political forms. The feminist movement and the ecology movement have been particularly active in articulating a complex set of new themes and notions, which were strikingly dissimilar to the major concerns of the hegemonic political ideologies. These movements have been largely territorial and often, in a political sense, marginal. What is significant is that despite the peripheral character of their existence, they have been able to influence political agenda and state policies, acting together as allies to a limited extent. Moreover, despite their reliance on spontaneity and crystallization of issues emerging at the provincial level, they exhibit a tremendous capacity for social survival. Gail Omvedt has identified the dalit and anti-caste movements, women's movements, environmental movements, and farmer's movement fighting against hegemonic market production issues as the major new social movements in India. Conceding that the implications of the role of social movements in recent historical events depend on the definition and characterization of the movements, Omvedt seemed to reject the idea that new movements have been of negligible consequences compared to the class-based struggles. According to her, this is true only if the dalit movement is obliterated and farmer's movement is disregarded as a new social movement. She provided a strong case for including farmer's movement within any possible categorization of new social movements in India. The trajectory of the farmer's movement has been brought to spotlight following the repression of farmers in Nandigram and Singoor in West Bengal and Chengara in Kerala. Despite the massive surge in spontaneous grassroots movements that changed the social space of resistance and survival in India, the Media has been as a rule reluctant to come to terms with this emerging political reality. One of the reasons for this indifference was ideological. It has missed Media's notice that the fact that new social movements are ideologically different from the old national and political movements. They are less hierarchical, following non conventional resource mobilization strategies and organically disinclined to stake claims to State power. The old movements comprised of political parties, organized trade unions or frontal mass organizations owing allegiances to central political formations. The issues that they took up A theoretical functionalism that underlie media practices in India failed to accept the transience, and evanescent nature of new social movements. They seem to be perplexed by the fact that movements arise without programmatic causes to uphold till dooms day. Multiplicity of temporally and spatially bounded causes upheld by varied social movements rather than a familiar practice of swearing by a single cause of usurping state power, has been particularly inconvenient to journalists who remain loyal to their Stalinist or cultural fascist roots. Besides the exemplary examples of Sainath and a few others, scribes in the main stream media mostly present themselves as "causeless journo/s" (CJs) with pretensions of neutrality and a derision for those who stand up for the causes of the marginalized. The disdain probably arise from their own kinship ties or alliances with corrupt politicians or past association with Stalinist or cultural fascist media organizations. It seems to be the dictum that in the absence of a Supreme cause like class struggle or Hindu India, you should remain causeless as an indication of your neutrality and non-partisanship. This phenomenon is becoming increasingly visible in Kerala's political scenario. Social movements in Kerala are confronting an unprecedented and thoroughly hostile Stalinist and Savarna fascist repression. The ruling Stalinists in Kerala has unleashed an unprecedented spate of rhetorical and physical violence against people's movements and activists probably in an effort to distract attention from a series of governmental and administrative failures and inner party squabbles. The mainstream media has been ignominiously indifferent to the excesses against marginalized communities, particularly dalits while devouring CPI (M)'s internal dissentions. "Classlessness" is perhaps a gripping contemporary politico-philosophical problem. The first in the new series of salvos was gunned by a causeless rhetorician and columnist of the CPI (M) daily Deshabhimani ('Patriot' in Malayalam) Sukumar Azhikode. When Mahaswetha Devi visited Kerala to protest the forceful eviction of scores of households for the Vallarpadam road project in Moolampally, Sukumar reportedly called her "an insult to the nation". Sukumar's puerile outburst against Mahaswatha Devi was not an isolated incident. Overwhelming support for the intensifying land struggle in the Chengara plantation where landless dalits and adivasis have raised the demand for redistribution of agricultural land exposing the hollowness of widely trumpeted land reforms implemented by the CPI-Congress coalition in the early 70s with CPI (M) in the opposition, has been a major cause of infuriated assaults on social activists and progressive writers in the State. The neo-liberal revisionists in CPI (M) in Kerala have apparently taken a position that land redistribution is no longer a substantive political agenda. One of the most hilarious yet disturbing manifestations of the harm that "causelessness" of CJs could engender was the virulent attack of the official ruling party media on a group of young activists who observed a Night Vigil in front of the State secretariat in support of the Chengara land struggle. Their hidden camera caught a husband and wife sitting close to each other in the Night Vigil and repeatedly flashed it as an example of "sexual anarchy" of social movement activists in Kerala. Interestingly, a Nietzscheian shock greeted the Stalinist media the next day when the participants held a press conference to declare that they believed in public expressions of love and affection and the hideous spying was perhaps a cultural proclivity that only the Stalinist 'parivar' shared. The apathy of CJs in Kerala's mainstream media has made the Stalinists bolder and at times Fourth Estate itself at the receiving end. Sumantha Banerjee has recently written in Economic and Political Weekly that the media photographer who photographed an SFI march in which they attacked a Youth Congress leader was assaulted to prevent him from "reporting and photographing their misdeed" resulting in "serious injuries to three journalists". What is described as "petulant exhibitions of reprisal and violent intimidation against the media" Banerjee feels that "CPI-M is fast resembling the Right-wing parties like the Shiv Sena, and the chauvinist regional outfits like the United Liberation Front of Asom (ULFA)". While the attack on media should be seen as part of the larger tactics of intimidation and violence unleashed against activists and social workers, the complacence of CJs of Kerala Media can be interpreted as tantamount to complicity in this criminal outburst. With civil society emerging as the last bastion of resistance to neo liberalism in India, the causeless journo perhaps has a final cause to destroy it. (E-mail: *sreekumartt at gmail.com* ) -- Anivar From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 22:44:55 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 22:44:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] NCM recommends Kashmiri Pandits be treated as minorities Message-ID: <6353c690808141014w4339f251sea6a44b32f054be5@mail.gmail.com> *NCM recommends Kashmiri Pandits be treated as minorities* London (PTI): The National Commission for Minorities (NCM) has recommended that lakhs of Kashmiri Pandits, forced to flee from Jammu and Kashmir, be treated as minorities and facilitated to get employment in Delhi and other places, a member of the Commission said on Thursday. "We recommended to the Government of India that Kashmiri Pandits should be treated as Minorities and extended all facilities applicable to such groups," Harcharan Singh Josh, Member of the Commission told newsmen at Kingsway Lodge in Hounslow shortly before leaving for Delhi after a week-long visit to the UK. In Delhi alone about 800 families of the Pandits were rehabilitated and a number of girls from the Pandit families were provided jobs in government schools as teachers, Josh said. During his visit here, Josh, also led a delegation of leading NRIs here to the High Commissioner of India to the UK, Shiv Shankar Mukherjee and raised complaints from members of the Sikh community about delay in getting visas. Mukherjee assured them that the visa facilities were now outsourced but if there were any specific cases he would look into them and take remedial measures. Josh was accompanied by Councillors Darshan Singh Garewal, Pritam Singh Garewal, Gopal Singh Dhillon, Jagdish Sharma, leading NRI hotelier Amrao Atwal and NRI entrepreneur Sunil Chopra. Josh also visited Gurudwaras and Temples in Southall and Leeds and met representatives of minority communities and listened to their problems. From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 22:50:28 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 22:50:28 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 __._,_.___ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 22:53:01 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 22:53:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A million identities now - DNA Message-ID: <6353c690808141023i4278fe22vcea3fe3dafaba933@mail.gmail.com> *A million identities now* Sidharth Bhatia, DNA Thursday, August 14, 2008 22:20 IST *While India has grown as a nation-state, forms of tribalism continue to flourish* For the past few weeks, we have seen the gradual escalation of violence in Jammu and Kashmir, where a kind of peace had begun to prevail. In the last three or four years, 'normalcy' of sorts had come to the state and especially the Valley, which meant that violence had come down and economic activity had started to increase. Correspondingly, secessionist elements, who did badly in the last elections, had gone quiet, finding little support from locals. Now, as tempers have risen, cries of 'azadi' are once again being heard in Kashmir. The Hurriyat has come out of its low profile and with the deaths, in police firing, of some of the marchers, has assumed some importance too. Meanwhile in Jammu, which has resented the importance given to the Valley, a new kind of protest has emerged. It is fast taking the hues of a Hindu-Muslim conflict though it did not begin in that way. An innocuous looking circular, under which the state sought to appropriate land for the temporary use of Hindu pilgrims going to the Amarnath shrine, has brought out latent hostilities that are now in the open. Each political party is playing it their way — the Congress, after having tried to please one side and then capitulating when the other protested, seems completely caught out, unable to move to stop this explosion of anger. The PDP, till recently part of the government, has immediately distanced itself from it, and the other Kashmiri party, the National Conference, wants to make sure that the PDP does not walk off with all the credit. The Bharatiya Janata Party, looking for a cause, any cause that will give it a platform to stand on, has jumped into the fray in Jammu. Somewhere at the heart of it all is the special status that Kashmir enjoys. This status makes Kashmir a part of India and yet not of it — elections are held here like anywhere else but an Indian cannot buy land in the state. For Kashmiris, the expanse that stretches below is 'India', an alien and even hostile land that they are not sure they want to be part of. Violence has pushed away the Hindu Kashmiris who were more inclined to join India, but all Kashmiris are agreed that they have a special brand of 'Kashmiriyat' that any influx of outsiders would destroy. This has for long angered many, especially the BJP, which promised to rescind Article 370, that confers special status when it came to power; as is well known, it didn't. But Indians are within their rights to ask — why should Kashmiris enjoy this status and why can't non-Kashmiris buy land there? This discriminatory provision is not limited to Kashmir — a non-Himachali cannot buy land in Himachal Pradesh either. They too do not want 'outsiders'. Given half a chance, Goans would pass such a provision too — they too hate the idea of their languid land being gobbled up by Punjabi fat cats and Mumbai businessmen. And while Raj Thackeray has not yet dreamt up a demand to debar non-Maharashtrians from buying land in Mumbai, he too is up in arms against the dreaded outsider. In their own way, the Himachalis, Goans and Maharashtrians are echoing the idea of 'Kashmiriyat', a kind of cultural exceptionalism that makes them unique and different from others. It is no secret that many Goans think of India as the usurper of their state; Portuguese rule, they say was far better. Such feelings are not new, but what has changed over the years is the means of expressing them. Barely a decade after independence, Jawaharlal Nehru had to succumb to the demand of states based on linguistic commonality; the republican in him could not come to terms with the idea of community identities. The Indian federal state, built on the notion of unity in diversity, where the unity counted for much more, faced many a challenge in all these years to its bedrock values. Kashmir under Sheikh Abdullah, the agitations in the North East (always called insurgencies), Punjab through the 1980s — all were confronted and dealt with, either by co-option or by force. Everyone was an Indian first — cultural uniqueness would be allowed and celebrated, but not at the cost of separation. But 60-odd years after Independence, the challenges of identity politics have only grown. They are not always violent, but let that not fool us. The tribalist idea lives on, even though the nation-state has advanced in many ways. A tribe always values the collective over the individual, which goes against the republican idea. We need a strong centre to suppress such heresy; as we all can see, that is one thing that is missing in this equation. Email: sidharth01 at dnaindia.net From indersalim at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 23:48:50 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 23:48:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] in kashmir Co2 emission as metaphor Message-ID: <47e122a70808141118y2ba4d136s344cb1ba89b6c2b@mail.gmail.com> "The odd and widely ignored truth is that routine radioactive discharges from coal-burning are greater than those produced by nuclear plants. Coal contains trace amounts of uranium and thorium. Though these are present at much lower levels than in nuclear fuel, a lot more coal is burned, which means that total emissions are greater." This is from the article written by George Monbiot in response to Arthur Scargill's pro-coal energy debate against nuclear energy. George Monbiot further clarifies, " I feel I need to point out that I have not become an advocate for nuclear power. My position is that environmentalists should stop trying to pick technologies for electricity generation. Instead we should demand a maximum level for the corbon dioxide produced per megawatt-hour, impose a number of other public safety measures, of delivering it. Otherwise we are in danger of backing the solutions we find aesthetically appealing and delaying the massive carbon cuts that need to be made. I proposed last week, we should no longer oppose it- though there remains a big if. This is too subtle a point for Arthur and other commentators, who are shrieking that Monbiot has gone nuclear " If you allow me to apply this above to our present J&K crises, what I see is that the emission of corbon dioxide is 'the hate' which we need to check for public safety. Those who generate it even can not say it so publicly, and therefore we all need to say YES to the control of 'hate' emission in J&K. On the list we often go through reflections which often tends to point out repeatedly that our Muslim terrorism in Kashmir is the most dangerous thing in India, which is like saying blind YES to popularly debated Nuclear Energy programme. But the odd and widely ignored truth is that the routine radioactive discharges from the most ancient practice of producing carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is done by Hindus in India and therefore, as George Monbiot pointed out is much 'greater' in comparison to nuclear emission. This is too subtle a point for BJP and other commentators, who are shrieking that secularist have gone pro-terrorism. Already there is ample evidence of huge lot of pseudo-secularist in Congress party, other parties and Left even, who are cleverly supporting hate programmes in their own unique polished styles . I am not talking about that kind of secularism. I am interested in something which might link issues, somehow, even absurdly. Now, we all are interested in Kashmir, like 'energy', but we quickly take positions like pro-coal energy versus pro-nuclear thing. But, for example, I have recently seen too bad movies done by kashmiris movie makers. One on Habba Khatoon and other on Krishan Joo Razdan. It is obvious why the directors go terribly wrong while dealing with sensitive biographies of poets. Our politics is full of such bad directors, who are either a Hindu or a Muslim with a secular book in their hands. Speaking in general, Secularism is like music which is essential for making a good movie, but see what these directors do, they do it but hardly they realize that the image which they provide is not in sync with the music they usually borrow, buy or appropriate from our stock of ancient virtues. What are virtues ? Ancient kashmir and India is full of such thoughts, but we hardly get inspired by that. One should have a glimpse of a muslim art in V&A and British museum in London to see how Aesthetic were Arabs in the past. Not for nothing was their art and craft so breathtaking, which gives us an insight why the Arabic script is so' 'musical' in form; but at the best, in the hands of a modern Muslim calligraphist, it can be plagiarism in disguise. So has it happened to a Hindu architect, even, just see how fake Akshardam Temple in Delhi looks. Here, I am talking about form, not about the land grabbers which is a unique feature of both Temple and Mosque makers in India and Kashmir. Since, both art and aesthetic and life has changed, perhaps because of global crises like energy, and my gut feeling is that Monbiot is too keen to ensure human continuity on this planet, but right now he has not language to say that both the forms of energy are basically not good for human beings in the first place. After all, he is one amongst 6 billion people on earth who need it somehow. Presently, a veritable demand for reduction of Co2 will lead us to invent some human friendly form of energy or will compel us to lead a simple life. I don't know. In Jammu and Kashmir too, we need both the forms of energies ( Hindu and Muslim ) but how to limit the emission of its radio-active emission and carbon di-oxide. A veritable demand for reduction of 'hate' will finally lead us to invent some human friendly neo sufi-bhakti movement or will compel us to lead a simple life...i repeat SIMPLE LIFE Till then best With love Inder salim From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 00:29:14 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 00:29:14 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Indian paramilitary forces fire to Kill Kashmiris - Greater Kashmir In-Reply-To: <279717.50089.qm@web27806.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <279717.50089.qm@web27806.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808141159w18f26a57n1668f9d0202af160@mail.gmail.com> In Jammu...It was only head... On 8/14/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > Bullets Hit Protestors' Chest, Head, Abdomen, Heart > > NASEER A GANAI > > Srinagar, > Aug 13: Doctors in different hospitals say causalities due to bullet > injuries were higher as bullets have been fired at upper parts of the > body including chest, heart and head. They say the troops and police > resorted to target killing of protestors. > "Yesterday, we operated > upon a number of persons having received bullet injuries. We also > operated upon 15 seriously wounded, among them several died. I tell you > most people have been shot at from very close range and above the waist > causing maximum causalities," said a consultant at SMHS Hospital. > "I > can understand what would have happened outside. Inside the hospital, > in the causality ward police fired teargas shells," said Dr Idrees. Six > persons who were brought dead to the hospital including Imtiyaz Ahmad > Bhat of Lasjan, Imran Qayoom Wani of Baghi Mehtab, Qamran Mehboob, > Faisal Showkat and others had been shot at upper parts including neck > and chest. > Reports said 29 people have been killed in past two > days. Doctors describe the shooting above waist as "target killing." > Bullet injuries in chest, neck and head could not be described as > firing in self-defence, said a doctor working in Soura Medical > Institute. He said most of the people who were in critical condition > have been hit at neck, chest and head. He said a person brought from > Bemina this morning had been hit in head. > A senior official of > the Medical Institute Soura said 50 persons who have received bullets > have undergone major surgeries in past two days. The official said most > of the patients who have been operated upon were in critical condition. > "This is grim situation. I should tell you frankly that half of the > people who have gone through major surgeries are in extremely critical > condition. Some are on ventilators. We should pray for their survival," > said a doctor working in the Institute. > Doctors in valley > hospitals have cancelled their leaves and are in hospitals for past > four days continuously looking after the injured. Eight persons have > died in past two days in the Medical Institute. "Among the eight, some > were brought dead and some died after operation," officials said. > Doctors > said had troops and police fired below the waist the causalities would > have been far less. "In that case it causes less damage than target > killing," doctors say. > Rouf Majeed, presently admitted in the > SMHS hospital, has been shot in his shoulder. Doctors looking after him > said that he has been shot with pistol. "I was in a protest when army's > JAKLI troops fired at us. I received a bullet and I was brought to > hospital by people," he said. He said three other persons have received > serious injuries in their chest and head and they have been shifted to > SKIMS. > Nazir Ahmad of Sumbal had received a bullet in the > abdomen. Apart from bullets, tear gas shells have been fired directly > at people. Rouf Majeed admitted in the SMHS has been hit at chest with > a tear gas shell. "Had it been hit at heart, it would have been fatal," > doctors attending him said. Another person, Gowhar Bhat of Dalgate, > admitted in the SMHS, has been hit at private parts with tear gas > shell. > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 01:03:44 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 01:03:44 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev Message-ID: <6353c690808141233w45066ff9n807dea527f060531@mail.gmail.com> *Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev* *New Delhi, Aug 14 (IANS)* Yoga Guru Ramdev Thursday called for an end to the row over transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board that has claimed at least 40 lives, but maintained that the Jammu and Kashmir government should allot the land to the temple trust. "The Amarnath Shrine Board must be allotted land to erect temporary structures for pilgrims. This is our country and the land belongs to us. Why should we be scared to acquire it from the Jammu and Kashmir government?" Ramdev told a packed a media conference here. "It is a shame that the government cannot allot its own land to the temple and its own people," the spiritual leader and Vedic healer said on his return from the US, where he had been for the past one-and-half months. Ramdev has been campaigning for transfer of land to the shrine board. He said the remarks by a section of people that India was trying to create an Israel-like situation in Kashmir and comparing the state to Palestine, were a threat to the country's communal mosaic. The Amarnath Yatra is an important annual pilgrimage for Hindus across the world. Land was allotted to the Amarnath Shrine Board, which manages the temple, to build temporary shelters for pilgrims. But the order had to be revoked following violent protests in the Muslim-dominated Kashmir valley, triggering a backlash in Jammu, which has a dominant Hindu population. The guru also linked the issue of the "resettlement" of the Kashmiri Hindu oustees, who were forced to leave the state when insurgency in the state peaked during the 1990s, to his Amarnath crusade. He said the displaced Kashmiri Hindu Pandit community should be re-settled in Kashmir. "Along with the land for the Amarnath Shrine Board, land should also be earmarked for the displaced Hindu Kashmiri Pandits in the Valley so that they can have a homeland. Their security can be handed over to the Indian Army," Ramdev said. Speaking about his mission in the US, Ramdev said his yoga foundation, the Patanjali Yog Peeth, was building a sprawling Vedic yoga and traditional Indian therapy centre on 94 acres of land in Houston, Texas. "For the first time, the Patanjali Yog Peeth is also setting up limited liability companies attached to the facilities abroad to patent and trademark its ayurvedic products so that they are not hijacked by foreigners," the guru told IANS. From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 15 02:51:02 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 02:51:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 Message-ID: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> Dear all, (apologies for cross posting on Kafila) Anniversaries are good opportunities for reflection. I write this the early hours of 15th August, 2008, the 61st anniversary of Indian independence. The events of the past few months, and the past few days, in the Indian adminsitered state of Jammu and Kashmir have demonstrated how well and how equally (or not) the police, paramilitaries and armed forces of the Indian Republic treat different kinds of protesting crowds. The facts that I am about to discuss are good measures with which to think about the relationship between acts of power, different kinds of people, sovereignty, life and death in the Indian nation state as it has evolved over the past 61 years. The region of Jammu in the province of Jammu and Kashmir has been caught in the grip of a fierce agitation against the revocation of the land transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board. We have all seen footage of angry SASS (Shri Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti) activists brandishing trishuls, setting up roadblocks and burning tyres, the agitation has spread to different parts of India As of August 10, the following has taken place (in Jammu) "...* 18 cases have been registered in connection with communal violence in which 20 persons were injured, 72 Kulas (hutments) of Gujjars were burnt down, 22 vehicles damaged and several trucks carrying supplies looted. “These are only reported incidents. Many such incidents have taken place, which have not been reported so far,” the officers told the team. * 117 police personnel and 78 civilians were injured including two policemen who were lynched and are “battling for life” in PGI Chandigarh while six civilians were killed, including three in police and Army action. * 129 cases were registered against the rioters. A total of 1171 arrests were made but most of them are now out on bail. * 10, 513 protest demonstrations and 359 serious incidents of violence have taken place across Jammu in which 28 government buildings, 15 police vehicles and 118 private vehicles have been damaged..." The information given above is quoted from - "Dangerous divide: Jammu officials put it in black and white" by Muzamil Jaleel, Indian Express, August 10, 2008. Muzamil Jaleel culled this information from a briefing delivered by government officials in the Jammu region to a visiting 'all party delegation' http://www.indianexpress.com/story/346889.html As is clear, of the 6 reported deaths in the Jammu region, two are of policemen, who were attacked by the pro Amarnath Land Transfer agitationists. Two of these are suicides, both of whom have been hailed as 'martyrs' by the Shree Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti activists. Only two out of six deaths, in the past twenty or so days of relentless and violent agitation, which included intimidation of truckers on the Jammu Srinagar highway can be attributed to police or paramilitary action. Each of these deaths is unfortunate and deserves to be condemned. In two further and separate incidents, the VHP, BJP, Shiv Sena and Sangh Parivar and allied organizations 'Chakka Jam' that paralysed roads in major cities yesterday, two more people died, because they could not reach hospitals on time. These two people were the 'collateral damage' of the upsurge of patriotic sentiment displayed by activists sympathetic to the SASS agitation in Jammu. On the other hand, in the part of the Kashmir valley administered and occupied by India, in the past few days alone, in several instances of firing on unarmed mobs, have led to the deaths of 29 people. Many of these deaths occured when unarmed crowds tried to accompany trucks carrying fruit (which had earlier been prevented from proceeding towards markets on the Srinagar Jammu highway) towards Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. Fruit growers in Indian administered Kashmir were at the forefront of attempting to salvage precious stocks of produce by taking to the 'Muzafarabad Road'. Apart from the 29 confirmed dead, several more are in hospitals, injured in critical conditions, and there lives are endangered by the fact that life saving medicines are in short supply due to the economic blockade of the Kashmir valley. trying to reach across the line of control to Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. The difference in treatment of two different kinds of crowds is easy to see. In one instance, more than twenty days of continuing, violent agitation result in two deaths by police firing. In another instance, less than a week's agitation results in 29 deaths. Clearly, the loss of lives in the Kashmir valley does not amount to much in the calculus of power. A rough arithmetic of sorts would indicate that a comparison of two casualties (in Jammu) to twenty nine casualties (in Kashmir) means that agitating Kashmiri lives are approximately fiteen times less significant (or more expendable) than agitating Jammu lives. The agitation in Jammu has harped often on how it is discriminated against in comparison to Kashmir. In one sense at least there is some truth in this charge. In the matter of the expenditure of bullets by the Indian state, there is no comparison at all between Jammu and Kashmir. When it comes to ammunition, way more bullets are spent in Kashmir than is the case in Jammu. It is clear, that the Indian state's armed might does not confront rampaging Jammu mobs if they hold the tricolour and shout nationalist slogans, or slogans in favour of the Amarnath Shrine Board's desire for land in the Kashmir Valley, even if they sometimes lynch policemen. On the other hand, unarmed fruit growers and ordinary people on the streets of the Kashmir valley are sitting targets for trigger happy police, paramilitary and army personnel. Guns can be, and are being aimed at their heads.Unlike Jammu, no policemen or armed forces personnel have been killed, at least until now, in the course of the fruit growers agitation in the Kashmir valley. As, independence day dawns, a clear pattern emerges. When push comes to shove, the Indian state has no hesitation in expending its bullets in some cases, and in showing exemplary restraint in others. Mowing down crowds that hold the tricolour flag aloft doesn't look good on TV. But, obviously, a little bloodletting in the streets of Srinagar on the eve of Independence day is good for 'national' morale. Now, if, you were one of those who happens to be the kind of person who the state seems to be willing to favour with a shower of bullets at any given opportunity, would you be celebrating 'Independence Day'? What would you be celebrating, - your freedom to fall to a policeman's gun? No wonder they play national anthems with gun salutes. A hail of bullets makes for the most fitting percussive accompaniment to poignant displays of national pride in India today. Shuddhabrata Sengupta From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 10:20:47 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 10:20:47 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> Message-ID: <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shuddha, Your post only reflects how wrong you are in your entire assessment of the grave situation in Jammu & Kashmir. I wonder why you could only see it from one perspective and rather chose to go with the direction of the wind. It shows your unfortunate tilt and inclination towards the anti-national and anti-India forces. You know what I mean. You obviously should have this understanding that things have been blown out of proportion in some cases. Muzamel Jaleel covers Express from Srinagar; I wonder how he knows so intricate details about Jammu. Surely, I cannot trust his sources. His reporting in Express shows again his tilt towards state bashing and support to the fanatic separatists in Kashmir. He forgot that it was a journalistic piece or news item and not his column where he could go on with the same rhetoric. You really need to brush up with reading your daily Indian Express complete. Maybe, the following few reports help you understand it better: 1. *Jammu Muslims back stir, but fear clashes* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345557.html 2. *Two more die in firing, Jammu simmers* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/344765.html 3. *In some areas, Army faces 'Gandhigiri' from protestors* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345595.html 4. *One killed as Army fires at protestors, curfew defied* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345556.html 5. *Recall Vohra: Karan Singh* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345182.html 6. *PDP now opposes the transfer, but records show how it said the opposite* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345063.html 7. *Jammu fires spread, Cong reaches out to BJP: help us defuse crisis* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/344371.html 8. *Centre stays away* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/tsearch/search.php?pg=9 9. *Amarnath row: 13 injured, Army called in* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/343923.html 10. *Jammu burning* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/343523.html 11. *Blast targets migrants, 5 of a family die in J-K* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/340194.html 12. *Bid to attack Amarnath yatris foiled, 3 militants killed: police* Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/338647.html I just hope you read these news items too and not just your favourite Muzamel Jalil. It was a planned move to raise an issue such as "Economic Blockade" by the separatists and hardline groups from the valley. I see a pattern here. As reports say, it was even backed by ISI. We all know, very well now that there was NO economic blockade. It was just to gain publicity and to distract attention from the real issue of Amarnath Land. Shuddha, You have a great ability to play with words. Though your crafty language won't gain much sympathy as it shows no logic. Food, Oil, Water, Baby Milk, medicine etc etc all are in good supply to th valley and valley itself has great amount of stock to last almost 3 months. If there has been urgency for some material; it has been airlifted; as on previous occassions. Your comments are sick and can only make things worse. I don't undertsnad what your intentions are. You surely don't understand PEACE !!!! It was people in Jammu who were shot on head. See pictures for urself at www.thekashmir.wordpress.com/ While on the other hand, your Sheikh Abdul Aziz a former Terrorist and now with Hurriyat was hit on the leg and he lost his life due to blood loss. This disinformation campaign launched by Kashmir based sepratists, fanatics, and 3 hardline funded newspapers and then supported by secular apologists based in Delhi and elsewhere only make matters worse. The so called movement in Kashmir in complete fake and does not have mandate of the people. By mere brainwashing people and instigating communal passions; one cannot achiece any goal. Moreover, a movement which began with targetting the minority Hindu community, killing them and with communal slogans; cannot land up anywhere. As India celebrates 61 years of Independence, Kashmiri Hindus complete yet another year in forced exile. Its been more than 18 years now. The night of 19th Jan. 1990; still haunts in the minds of the victims. 50,000 thousand of whom are still languishing in refugee camps in Jammu and its outskirts. And, then these limousine Communists say these protests in Jammu are by RSS/BJP/VHP. I wonder if they have travelled to Jammu themselves and seen the amount of anger in people. Do that and you will know what a people's movement is !!! Sitting in Ac rooms, dictating lectures on sarai, and sticking your finger to the latest laptop won't tell you much about the situation in Jammu. And, these are our modern communists.... The transfer of the 40 hectares of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board was the most logical, legal and ethical decision taken by the cabinet. Why does this disturb the few sepratist elements in Kashmir who are hell bent to communalise the situation ? It onlt goes on to show the religious and cultural intolerance in so called Kashmiri Muslim leaders. This Amarnath Land Row was as well a sinster game plan of the PDP; that is evident from the above Indian Express reports which quotes all official documents. It was clear cut vote bank politics and to divide the communities in this state of India. Omar Abdullah on the other hand gave a highly inflamatory statement in the Parliament; not realising its consequenes. He did it without thinking too much, and just to attract attention of the media. Let me tell him, that its not only the land of Kashmiri Muslims, its equally of Kashmiri Pandits. And, we will fight till the very end to have it.... Its unfortunate that holding the Indian Flag high in Jammu is a crime to some here while holding a Pakistani Flag in Kashmir seems to be some kind of symbol and some great work. I pity those people. Hope some sense prevails upon those minds who support these communal forces in the valley without a second thought. They have sold their conscience. Are you guys so cheap ? Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > Dear all, > > (apologies for cross posting on Kafila) > > Anniversaries are good opportunities for reflection. I write this the > early hours of 15th August, 2008, the 61st anniversary of Indian > independence. > > The events of the past few months, and the past few days, in the > Indian adminsitered state of Jammu and Kashmir have demonstrated how > well and how equally (or not) the police, paramilitaries and armed > forces of the Indian Republic treat different kinds of protesting > crowds. The facts that I am about to discuss are good measures with > which to think about the relationship between acts of power, > different kinds of people, sovereignty, life and death in the Indian > nation state as it has evolved over the past 61 years. > > The region of Jammu in the province of Jammu and Kashmir has been > caught in the grip of a fierce agitation against the revocation of > the land transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board. We have all seen > footage of angry SASS (Shri Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti) activists > brandishing trishuls, setting up roadblocks and burning tyres, the > agitation has spread to different parts of India > > As of August 10, the following has taken place (in Jammu) > > "...* 18 cases have been registered in connection with communal > violence in which 20 persons were injured, 72 Kulas (hutments) of > Gujjars were burnt down, 22 vehicles damaged and several trucks > carrying supplies looted. "These are only reported incidents. Many > such incidents have taken place, which have not been reported so > far," the officers told the team. > > * 117 police personnel and 78 civilians were injured including two > policemen who were lynched and are "battling for life" in PGI > Chandigarh while six civilians were killed, including three in police > and Army action. > > * 129 cases were registered against the rioters. A total of 1171 > arrests were made but most of them are now out on bail. > > * 10, 513 protest demonstrations and 359 serious incidents of > violence have taken place across Jammu in which 28 government > buildings, 15 police vehicles and 118 private vehicles have been > damaged..." > > The information given above is quoted from - "Dangerous divide: Jammu > officials put it in black and white" > by Muzamil Jaleel, Indian Express, August 10, 2008. Muzamil Jaleel > culled this information from a briefing delivered by government > officials in the Jammu region to a visiting 'all party delegation' > http://www.indianexpress.com/story/346889.html > > As is clear, of the 6 reported deaths in the Jammu region, two are of > policemen, who were attacked by the pro Amarnath Land Transfer > agitationists. Two of these are suicides, both of whom have been > hailed as 'martyrs' by the Shree Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti activists. > Only two out of six deaths, in the past twenty or so days of > relentless and violent agitation, which included intimidation of > truckers on the Jammu Srinagar highway can be attributed to police or > paramilitary action. Each of these deaths is unfortunate and deserves > to be condemned. > > In two further and separate incidents, the VHP, BJP, Shiv Sena and > Sangh Parivar and allied organizations 'Chakka Jam' that paralysed > roads in major cities yesterday, two more people died, because they > could not reach hospitals on time. These two people were the > 'collateral damage' of the upsurge of patriotic sentiment displayed > by activists sympathetic to the SASS agitation in Jammu. > > On the other hand, in the part of the Kashmir valley administered and > occupied by India, in the past few days alone, in several instances > of firing on unarmed mobs, have led to the deaths of 29 people. Many > of these deaths occured when unarmed crowds tried to accompany trucks > carrying fruit (which had earlier been prevented from proceeding > towards markets on the Srinagar Jammu highway) towards Pakistan > Occupied Kashmir. Fruit growers in Indian administered Kashmir were > at the forefront of attempting to salvage precious stocks of produce > by taking to the 'Muzafarabad Road'. Apart from the 29 confirmed > dead, several more are in hospitals, injured in critical conditions, > and there lives are endangered by the fact that life saving medicines > are in short supply due to the economic blockade of the Kashmir > valley. trying to reach across the line of control to Pakistan > Occupied Kashmir. > > The difference in treatment of two different kinds of crowds is easy > to see. In one instance, more than twenty days of continuing, violent > agitation result in two deaths by police firing. In another instance, > less than a week's agitation results in 29 deaths. Clearly, the loss > of lives in the Kashmir valley does not amount to much in the > calculus of power. A rough arithmetic of sorts would indicate that a > comparison of two casualties (in Jammu) to twenty nine casualties (in > Kashmir) means that agitating Kashmiri lives are approximately fiteen > times less significant (or more expendable) than agitating Jammu > lives. The agitation in Jammu has harped often on how it is > discriminated against in comparison to Kashmir. In one sense at least > there is some truth in this charge. In the matter of the expenditure > of bullets by the Indian state, there is no comparison at all between > Jammu and Kashmir. When it comes to ammunition, way more bullets are > spent in Kashmir than is the case in Jammu. > > It is clear, that the Indian state's armed might does not confront > rampaging Jammu mobs if they hold the tricolour and shout nationalist > slogans, or slogans in favour of the Amarnath Shrine Board's desire > for land in the Kashmir Valley, even if they sometimes lynch > policemen. On the other hand, unarmed fruit growers and ordinary > people on the streets of the Kashmir valley are sitting targets for > trigger happy police, paramilitary and army personnel. Guns can be, > and are being aimed at their heads.Unlike Jammu, no policemen or > armed forces personnel have been killed, at least until now, in the > course of the fruit growers agitation in the Kashmir valley. > > As, independence day dawns, a clear pattern emerges. When push comes > to shove, the Indian state has no hesitation in expending its bullets > in some cases, and in showing exemplary restraint in others. Mowing > down crowds that hold the tricolour flag aloft doesn't look good on > TV. But, obviously, a little bloodletting in the streets of Srinagar > on the eve of Independence day is good for 'national' morale. > > Now, if, you were one of those who happens to be the kind of person > who the state seems to be willing to favour with a shower of bullets > at any given opportunity, would you be celebrating 'Independence > Day'? What would you be celebrating, - your freedom to fall to a > policeman's gun? > > No wonder they play national anthems with gun salutes. A hail of > bullets makes for the most fitting percussive accompaniment to > poignant displays of national pride in India today. > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From indersalim at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 10:42:22 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 10:42:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev In-Reply-To: <6353c690808141233w45066ff9n807dea527f060531@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141233w45066ff9n807dea527f060531@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808142212p71440c5dscfa2da5b92c390ef@mail.gmail.com> this he said in case BJP comes to power, enabling him to demand a cabinet berth; such is the tradition of BJP and other right wingers On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 1:03 AM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > *Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev* > > > *New Delhi, Aug 14 (IANS)* Yoga Guru Ramdev Thursday called for an end to > the row over transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board that has claimed > at least 40 lives, but maintained that the Jammu and Kashmir government > should allot the land to the temple trust. "The Amarnath Shrine Board must > be allotted land to erect temporary structures for pilgrims. This is our > country and the land belongs to us. Why should we be scared to acquire it > from the Jammu and Kashmir government?" Ramdev told a packed a media > conference here. > > "It is a shame that the government cannot allot its own land to the temple > and its own people," the spiritual leader and Vedic healer said on his > return from the US, where he had been for the past one-and-half months. > Ramdev has been campaigning for transfer of land to the shrine board. > > He said the remarks by a section of people that India was trying to create > an Israel-like situation in Kashmir and comparing the state to Palestine, > were a threat to the country's communal mosaic. > > The Amarnath Yatra is an important annual pilgrimage for Hindus across the > world. > > Land was allotted to the Amarnath Shrine Board, which manages the temple, to > build temporary shelters for pilgrims. But the order had to be revoked > following violent protests in the Muslim-dominated Kashmir valley, > triggering a backlash in Jammu, which has a dominant Hindu population. > > The guru also linked the issue of the "resettlement" of the Kashmiri Hindu > oustees, who were forced to leave the state when insurgency in the state > peaked during the 1990s, to his Amarnath crusade. > > He said the displaced Kashmiri Hindu Pandit community should be re-settled > in Kashmir. > > "Along with the land for the Amarnath Shrine Board, land should also be > earmarked for the displaced Hindu Kashmiri Pandits in the Valley so that > they can have a homeland. Their security can be handed over to the Indian > Army," Ramdev said. > > Speaking about his mission in the US, Ramdev said his yoga foundation, the > Patanjali Yog Peeth, was building a sprawling Vedic yoga and traditional > Indian therapy centre on 94 acres of land in Houston, Texas. > > "For the first time, the Patanjali Yog Peeth is also setting up limited > liability companies attached to the facilities abroad to patent and > trademark its ayurvedic products so that they are not hijacked by > foreigners," the guru told IANS. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 10:57:50 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 10:57:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Dark side of freedom Message-ID: <6353c690808142227i1d2d4e4bn6573a6bc76a812f9@mail.gmail.com> *Dark side of freedom* ** *Ashok Pandit* ** * http://www.dailypioneer.com/indexn12.asp?main_variable=OPED&file_name=opd1%2Etxt&counter_img=1 It is really sad to see separatists blackmailing the nation that they will march to Muzaffarabad to weaken India. The very people who control the levers of our democratic machinery in the Kashmir Valley are those rampaging on the streets* As Independence Day dawns on us, one wonders whether our country of more than one billion people is really independent. Though our nation has had many successes in the last 61 years, somewhere within a question arises on the hullabaloo that is created over Independence Day year after year. Parliament is the political shrine of the country. But the events during the recent confidence vote have made me lose confidence in the political leadership, which claims to rule -- rather than serve -- the country. The body language of our leaders is more that of dictatorial rulers rather than elected representatives of the people working for their welfare. During the confidence vote, I was in the US, giving lectures at universities on the world's largest democracy. But in the night, while watching the news on CNN, I saw democracy in our nation being auctioned by the political leaders. This *tamasha* made one thing clear: Political parties in our country do not stand for national interest. Members of Parliament were escorted from jails to the cast their vote. People were almost dragged from their deathbed to try and win the power game. It appeared every seat in Parliament had a price tag. Corruption had become a lifestyle. The country watched while its leaders went on the rampage. Nothing could be done about it as the entire nation helplessly watched the degeneration of independent India. The truth of economic independence is slowly emerging in India. Though the list of India's billionaires has been expanding, a recent Government report makes the glow of these mega claims fade away. The report reiterates that India is primarily an agrarian country and in the last six years more than 1,00,000 farmers have committed suicide to escape indebtedness. The Agriculture Ministry was indifferent for the first two years of the suicides. The man who stands in Parliament talking about the plight of India's farmers is actually responsible for that plight. Our Agriculture Minister is more interested in the glamour of cricket than in the problems of debt-ridden farmers. Although he claims to be a 'farmer', there is no semblance between him and impoverished farmers who cannot afford one square meal a day and commit suicide in despair. Today the situation is worse than ever before because the celebrations on August 15 every year appear futile and contrived. At least during the British Raj we knew who were our enemies. Today our enemy is disguised as our own man. Using religion to divide the nation is no new ploy for the people of this country. Earlier the British would use this ploy for their benefit; today our politicians are taking recourse to it for their benefit. Our intelligentsia is no different from that of Pakistan's intelligentsia. The Jammu & Kashmir issue is the life line of our intellectuals. Their entire existence will cease the day this issue is resolved. To ensure their survival, it is essential that this issue remains alive in all forms. Cross-border terrorism no more garners TRPs for these people. So, it is very important for them to create a new issue that will again make the country burn and generate a sense of unrest. The biggest hypocrisy of our politicians is the secularism they preach. When a so-called 'communal' party talks about Hindus, it is castigated. But what about a ruling party whose trump card is to be seen as a sympathiser of the minorities? The country needs to realise that the majority community cannot build a palace on the pyre of a minority community; the same is true *vice-versa*. After more than six decades of independence and co-existence, the minority communities of this country must stop feeling victimised for no rhyme or reason. The entire Amarnath Yatra land fiasco has been blown out of proportion. That a land deal can become so explosive is beyond imagination. The issue stems from demands to create temporary structures for the Amarnath Yatris. This minor issue has been politicised and the politicians of Kashmir have made it a life-and-death issue. Please mark my words -- I say *politicians of Kashmir* and not Jammu & Kashmir, because here too they have sown the seeds of another division: 'Hindu' Jammu and 'Muslim' Kashmir. Statements are being made by Ms Mehbooba Mufti and Mr Sajjad Lone that they do not mind hosting the Amarnath Yatris as they are their 'guests'. We need to tell the separatists that pilgrims are Indians and they cannot be treated as guests in their own homeland. The agitation in the Valley is being created by political brokers for whom every person killed is a vote earned. Why else would a senior leader like Omar Abdullah declare, "*Hum jaan de denge lekin zameen nahi denge*" (We will give our lives but not our land). This man does not mind putting the lives of thousands of people on the line of fire for a piece of land smaller than a football field. The mathematicians of vote-bank politics should get their calculations right when they behave like the *masiahs* of the minority community. In the Kashmir Valley it is the Hindus who are in a minority; history is witness to the ethnic cleansing of the Hindus from the Valley by the majority community. Yet, today they proudly declare themselves as 'secular' and messengers of 'peace' between communities. The Valley has been a victim of separatist violence for years and has sacrificed many of its children to the horrors of terrorism which is sponsored by Pakistan. It is really sad to see separatists blackmailing the nation that they will march into Pakistan-occupied Kashmir to weaken India. In other words, the very people who control the levers of our democratic machinery are those rampaging on the streets. Today, as we, a proud and rapidly developing nation, celebrate our Independence day and watch the Prime Minister addressing the country from behind bullet-proof glass in fear of his own people, we should ask ourselves whether as a nation we are really independent. Happy Independence day. -- *The writer is a film-maker and social activist.* From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 11:24:04 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 11:24:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808142212p71440c5dscfa2da5b92c390ef@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141233w45066ff9n807dea527f060531@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808142212p71440c5dscfa2da5b92c390ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808142254h2621c39k96a3ad73f78525f5@mail.gmail.com> Maybe Inder should demand that land should be given to the Waqf ? On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 10:42 AM, inder salim wrote: > this he said in case BJP comes to power, enabling him to demand a > cabinet berth; such is the tradition of BJP and other right wingers > > On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 1:03 AM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > *Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev* > > > > > > *New Delhi, Aug 14 (IANS)* Yoga Guru Ramdev Thursday called for an end to > > the row over transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board that has > claimed > > at least 40 lives, but maintained that the Jammu and Kashmir government > > should allot the land to the temple trust. "The Amarnath Shrine Board > must > > be allotted land to erect temporary structures for pilgrims. This is our > > country and the land belongs to us. Why should we be scared to acquire it > > from the Jammu and Kashmir government?" Ramdev told a packed a media > > conference here. > > > > "It is a shame that the government cannot allot its own land to the > temple > > and its own people," the spiritual leader and Vedic healer said on his > > return from the US, where he had been for the past one-and-half months. > > Ramdev has been campaigning for transfer of land to the shrine board. > > > > He said the remarks by a section of people that India was trying to > create > > an Israel-like situation in Kashmir and comparing the state to Palestine, > > were a threat to the country's communal mosaic. > > > > The Amarnath Yatra is an important annual pilgrimage for Hindus across > the > > world. > > > > Land was allotted to the Amarnath Shrine Board, which manages the temple, > to > > build temporary shelters for pilgrims. But the order had to be revoked > > following violent protests in the Muslim-dominated Kashmir valley, > > triggering a backlash in Jammu, which has a dominant Hindu population. > > > > The guru also linked the issue of the "resettlement" of the Kashmiri > Hindu > > oustees, who were forced to leave the state when insurgency in the state > > peaked during the 1990s, to his Amarnath crusade. > > > > He said the displaced Kashmiri Hindu Pandit community should be > re-settled > > in Kashmir. > > > > "Along with the land for the Amarnath Shrine Board, land should also be > > earmarked for the displaced Hindu Kashmiri Pandits in the Valley so that > > they can have a homeland. Their security can be handed over to the Indian > > Army," Ramdev said. > > > > Speaking about his mission in the US, Ramdev said his yoga foundation, > the > > Patanjali Yog Peeth, was building a sprawling Vedic yoga and traditional > > Indian therapy centre on 94 acres of land in Houston, Texas. > > > > "For the first time, the Patanjali Yog Peeth is also setting up limited > > liability companies attached to the facilities abroad to patent and > > trademark its ayurvedic products so that they are not hijacked by > > foreigners," the guru told IANS. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 12:17:24 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 12:17:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Protest in Delhi University for land transfer to SASB In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808132344x3efce3e6ye068d1302fd0508c@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808132344x3efce3e6ye068d1302fd0508c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808142347w3fe62fa4k3da895a304e9d20d@mail.gmail.com> *Protest in Delhi University for land transfer to SASB* Excelsior Correspondent *NEW DELHI, Aug 13: *Displaying solidarity with the ongoing agitation for land transfer to Shri Amarnath Shrine Board (SASB), the students and teachers of Delhi University (DU) today held protest demonstration in the university campus here. The protest was organized by Akhil Bharatiya Vidyarthi Parishad (ABVP) along with the Amarnath Action Group (AAG) of Delhi comprising of Kashmiri Hindu refugees and Dogra community members of Jammu at Arts Faculty of DU. The agitators expressed anguish over the repeated claims made by the valley based vested interests that the pilgrimage was just 150 years old. They mentioned that the holy shrine of Amarnath has been a centre of pilgrimage for thousands of years, as mentioned in Nilmatapurana and Rajatarangni, the two treatises on History of Kashmir. The agitators also raised slogans against National Conference, PDP and all pan-Islamic separatist organizations for opposing land transfer to Shrine Board and held their leaders responsible for fomenting trouble in Jammu and Kashmir. Aditya Raj Koul, co-founder of Roots in Kashmir (Kashmiri Hindu Youth body) and a member of AAG, in his statement, said "The movement initiated in Jammu has reached every nook and corner of India and will only intensify in the coming days." Nupur Sharma, an activist of ABVP, while reiterating support to mass movement in Jammu, exuded confidence that the movement will soon meet success. *DU students protest for restoration of land to SASB * ** *Staff Reporter , The Hindu* Photo: Sushil Kumar Verma *Teachers and Students of Delhi University holding a protest march in New Delhi on Wednesday. * NEW DELHI: A number of students and some teachers of the Delhi University staged a protest at the Arts Faculty on the North Campus on Wednesday to support the movement for restoration of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board. The protest was organised by the Akhil Bhartiya Vidyarthi Parishad along with the Amarnath Action Group of Delhi comprising Kashmiri Hindu refugees and the Dogra community members of Jammu. The activists then staged a march till Kranti Chowk. The protestors raised slogans against the National Conference, the People's Democratic Party and all pan-Islamic separatist organisations for fomenting the present turmoil. "The movement, which was initiated in Jammu, has reached every nook and cranny of the country and will only intensify in the coming days if the government continues to remain silent," said Aditya Raj Kaul, co-founder of "Roots in Kashmir." Students, teachers protest Amarnath land revocation *13 Aug, 2008, 1836 hrs IST, PTI* *NEW DELHI:* Over 300 students, most of them Akhil Bharatiya Vidyarthi Parishad members, and teachers held a demonstration Wednesday at the Delhi University (DU) to protest the cancellation of land transfer to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board (SASB). The agitating students shouted slogans and said the issue should not be given a communal colour. Aditya Raj Kaul, one of the organisers of the protest march and a member of the Amarnath Action Group (AAG), told IANS: "There have been attempts to communalise the Amarnath land row. Young minds are being brainwashed against other religious communities. The issue is beyond religious boundaries. It's about human sentiments. It's an issue of injustice meted out to Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs, people of all communities living in Jammu." For the last two months, Jammu and Kashmir has witnessed unparalleled strife along communal lines over the allotment of 40 hectares of land in north Kashmir to the Amarnath shrine board, which manages the pilgrimage to the cave shrine dedicated to Lord Shiva. The allotment was revoked due to protests in the Muslim-majority Kashmir valley, which incensed people in the Hindu-majority Jammu region. The protest in the varsity coincided with the nation-wide protest called by the Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP). "We have nothing to do with the VHP. We were planning on this protest for weeks now and the Akhil Bharatiya Vidyarthi Parishad (ABVP) helped us in organising it," Kaul said. The student protesters also burned the effigy of the Union Home Minister Shivraj Patil and raised slogans against the Indian government for failing to resolve the issue. Vikas Dahiya of ABVP said this was just a token protest and if nothing is done soon, then the agitation will intensify. * DU students, teachers express solidarity with * * Sangarsh Samiti; come on streets. 'Condemn provocative statements of Mehbooba, Omar'* 8/13/2008 10:35:17 PM*Early Times, Jammu* New Delhi | Aug 13 In a remarkable display of solidarity with the ongoing agitation over the issue of Amarnath land transfer, students and teachers of Delhi University (DU) today came out on street to support the entire movement for the restoration of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board. The protest at Delhi University's Arts Faculty was organized by the Akhil Bhartiya Vidyarthi Parishad (ABVP) along with the Amarnath Action Group (AAG) of Delhi comprising of Kashmiri Hindu refugees and Dogra community members of Jammu. The group has been spearheading the agitation in New Delhi for last almost 45 days. The agitators were angry over the repeated claims by the vested interests that the pilgrimage was just 100-150 years old and maintained that the 'The Holy Shrine of Amarnath has been a pilgrimage centre for thousands of years as is clear from the historical references of Nilmatapurana and Rajatarangni, the two treatises on History of Kashmir." "Since the separatists and their supporters like the PDP and National Conference see the Holy Shrine as one of the last vestiges of the glorious syncretism of Kashmir, they wish to erase this so as to complete the process of religious as well as ethnic cleansing" said Vikas Dahiya, National Executive member and Joint Secretary of Delhi State ABVP. "How long will we suffer at the hands of the Kashmiri separatist mindset?" he asked. Slogans were raised against National Conference, PDP, Hurriyat, and all pan-Islamic separatist organizations. There is a well-planned move to suppress the voice of the nationalists in Jammu. The protesters condemned Mehbooba Mufti and Omar Abdullah and other Kashmiri Muslim separatists for fomenting the present turmoil by their anti-Hindu, Anti-Jammu and anti-national outrageous statements, Vikas added. "The movement which was initiated in Jammu has reached every nook and corner of India and will only intensify in the coming days; if the Government continues to remain silent. The revoking of the land transfer order has hurt the sentiments of the nationalists of J&K State and it is being seen as a planned assault on the cherished beliefs and holy places." said Aditya Raj Kaul, Co-founder Roots in Kashmir; a Worldwide Kashmiri Hindu Youth Initiative and member of Amarnath Action Group (AAG). "We reiterate our full support to the peaceful mass movement in Jammu under the leadership of Shri Amarnath Yatra Sangharsh Samiti. It is a people's movement which will soon meet success." said Nupur Sharma, an activist of the ABVP. The hundreds of protesters assembled at the Arts Faculty and then moved towards Kranti Chowk. In the coming days, students plan to initiate an awareness campaign on the holy Shrine of Amarnath in various colleges. DU students slam intolerance over Amarnath issue *merinews.com* IN A remarkable display of solidarity with the ongoing agitation over the issue of Amarnath land transfer, students and teachers of Delhi University today (August 13) came out to support restoration of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board (SASB). The protest at Delhi University's arts faculty was organised by the Akhil Bhartiya Vidyarthi Parishad (ABVP) along with the Amarnath Action Group (AAG) of Delhi comprising Kashmiri refugees and Dogra community members of Jammu. The group has been spearheading the agitation in New Delhi for the last 45 days. The agitators were angry over the repeated claims by vested interests that the pilgrimage was just 100-150 years old. It may be noted they informed, "The holy shrine of Amarnath has been a pilgrimage for thousands of years as is clear from the historical references of Nilmatapurana and Rajatarangni, the two treatises on history of Kashmir." "Since the separatists and their supporters like the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) and National Conference (NC) see the holy shrine as one of the last vestiges of the glorious syncretism of Kashmir, they wish to erase this so as to complete the process of religious as well as ethnic cleansing", said Vikas Dahiya, national executive member and joint secretary of Delhi state ABVP. "How long will we suffer at the hands of the Kashmiri separatist mindset?", he added. Slogans were raised against National Conference, PDP, Hurriyat, and all pan-Islamic separatist organisations. Protesters alleged that there is a well-planned move to suppress the voice of the nationalists in Jammu. They condemned Mehbooba Mufti and Omar Abdullah and other Kashmiri Muslim separatists for fomenting the present turmoil by their anti-Hindu, anti-Jammu and anti-national outrageous statements. "We reiterate our full support to the peaceful mass movement in Jammu under the leadership of Shri Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti. It is a people's movement, which will soon meet success," said Nupur Sharma, an activist of the ABVP. From logos.theword at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 14:00:19 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:00:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A Suggestion for Arundhati Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808150130l2c43e835ldc42120760811602@mail.gmail.com> Dear Arundhati, As expected, you haven't responded to my mail in response to yours. Perhaps you are too busy helping the arts by attending Bangalore Times Page Three parties. Anyway, since you came forward to gave me some unsolicited suggestions, I will take this opportunity to return the favour. Here is a list of companies I have drawn up, that the IFA can approach for funding so that it can keep up its exemplary service to the arts: 1. Dow Chemicals 2. Vedanta Aluminium (they'll perhaps fund an interesting academic initiative to 'document' tribal practices, especially of the Dongria Kondhs) 3. Exxon 4. The Salim Group, Indonesia (I'm sure they'll give you money to try and engage with the 'real' issues in Nandigram.) 5. POSCO 6. Enron 7. Sardar Sarovar Narmada Nigam Limited 8. GCM Resources (google phoolbari) I'm sure the money you manage to get from these corporations (who, doubtless, will have faith in the work that IFA is doing for the arts) will help you fund many, many more projects that 'study systemic issues' in this or that branch of art and send big-brand name artists on their way to ever more first world destinations. Much more importantly, it will keep those international flight tickets flowing in for the selfless IFA employees who subject themselves to the unspeakable horrors of visiting far-flung places like Japan, Brazil, Moscow, Vienna, Washington, London and where not, all for the sake of the arts in India. Warm regards, Arka -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Fri Aug 15 14:57:48 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:27:48 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808142212p71440c5dscfa2da5b92c390ef@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141233w45066ff9n807dea527f060531@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808142212p71440c5dscfa2da5b92c390ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dont tell us that you are above all the greed and power and all this propaganda that you are indulging only out of love.? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: inder salim Date: Friday, August 15, 2008 10:42 am Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev To: reader-list at sarai.net > this he said in case BJP comes to power, enabling him to demand a > cabinet berth; such is the tradition of BJP and other right wingers > > On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 1:03 AM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > *Land should be given to Amarnath Shrine Board: Ramdev* > > > > > > *New Delhi, Aug 14 (IANS)* Yoga Guru Ramdev Thursday called for > an end to > > the row over transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board that > has claimed > > at least 40 lives, but maintained that the Jammu and Kashmir > government> should allot the land to the temple trust. "The > Amarnath Shrine Board must > > be allotted land to erect temporary structures for pilgrims. > This is our > > country and the land belongs to us. Why should we be scared to > acquire it > > from the Jammu and Kashmir government?" Ramdev told a packed a media > > conference here. > > > > "It is a shame that the government cannot allot its own land to > the temple > > and its own people," the spiritual leader and Vedic healer said > on his > > return from the US, where he had been for the past one-and-half > months.> Ramdev has been campaigning for transfer of land to the > shrine board. > > > > He said the remarks by a section of people that India was trying > to create > > an Israel-like situation in Kashmir and comparing the state to > Palestine,> were a threat to the country's communal mosaic. > > > > The Amarnath Yatra is an important annual pilgrimage for Hindus > across the > > world. > > > > Land was allotted to the Amarnath Shrine Board, which manages > the temple, to > > build temporary shelters for pilgrims. But the order had to be > revoked> following violent protests in the Muslim-dominated > Kashmir valley, > > triggering a backlash in Jammu, which has a dominant Hindu > population.> > > The guru also linked the issue of the "resettlement" of the > Kashmiri Hindu > > oustees, who were forced to leave the state when insurgency in > the state > > peaked during the 1990s, to his Amarnath crusade. > > > > He said the displaced Kashmiri Hindu Pandit community should be > re-settled > > in Kashmir. > > > > "Along with the land for the Amarnath Shrine Board, land should > also be > > earmarked for the displaced Hindu Kashmiri Pandits in the Valley > so that > > they can have a homeland. Their security can be handed over to > the Indian > > Army," Ramdev said. > > > > Speaking about his mission in the US, Ramdev said his yoga > foundation, the > > Patanjali Yog Peeth, was building a sprawling Vedic yoga and > traditional> Indian therapy centre on 94 acres of land in Houston, > Texas.> > > "For the first time, the Patanjali Yog Peeth is also setting up > limited> liability companies attached to the facilities abroad to > patent and > > trademark its ayurvedic products so that they are not hijacked by > > foreigners," the guru told IANS. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From parthaekka at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 16:00:11 2008 From: parthaekka at gmail.com (Partha Dasgupta) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 16:00:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A Suggestion for Arundhati In-Reply-To: <33bc2ee60808150130l2c43e835ldc42120760811602@mail.gmail.com> References: <33bc2ee60808150130l2c43e835ldc42120760811602@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <32144e990808150330q5c97b43h77b4ff62dde16447@mail.gmail.com> Dear Arka, This mail reeks more of anger than of logic, and just as you choose whom to take or not take funds from, IFA too has the right to choose. In any case, let put that aside and look at reality. Let's look at someone in a dusty kurta pajama walking into a corporate office and asking for funding. He probably won't make it past the guard at the entrance. Getting funds needs both presentation and articulation - whether in 'page 3' parties or otherwise. Besides, where else would you find the people to put in the money? As for "big-brand name artists" - well, if I buy clothes, not really into brands. However, when I buy medicines, or consumer items, am very careful of the brand and the guarantee. That's a vital purchase and I'd like to be sure of what i'm investing. Don't have the money to dabble in arts - but if I did, would rather put it on a 'safe bet'. That aside, whether the Tata's or the Sardar Sarovar Narmada Nigam Limited, there are two sides to every coin. Just as in all of us, some things we do are good, and some downright selfish - that is the nature of the beast called mankind. We can either focus all our energies on one view - or open both our eyes. Rgds, Partha .................................... On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 2:00 PM, Logos Theatre wrote: > Dear Arundhati, > As expected, you haven't responded to my mail in response to yours. > Perhaps you are too busy helping the arts by attending Bangalore Times Page > Three parties. Anyway, since you came forward to gave me some unsolicited > suggestions, I will take this opportunity to return the favour. Here is a > list of companies I have drawn up, that the IFA can approach for funding so > that it can keep up its exemplary service to the arts: > > > 1. Dow Chemicals > 2. Vedanta Aluminium (they'll perhaps fund an interesting academic > initiative to 'document' tribal practices, especially of the Dongria > Kondhs) > 3. Exxon > 4. The Salim Group, Indonesia (I'm sure they'll give you money to try and > engage with the 'real' issues in Nandigram.) > 5. POSCO > 6. Enron > 7. Sardar Sarovar Narmada Nigam Limited > 8. GCM Resources (google phoolbari) > > I'm sure the money you manage to get from these corporations (who, > doubtless, will have faith in the work that IFA is doing for the arts) will > help you fund many, many more projects that 'study systemic issues' in this > or that branch of art and send big-brand name artists on their way to ever > more first world destinations. Much more importantly, it will keep those > international flight tickets flowing in for the selfless IFA employees who > subject themselves to the unspeakable horrors of visiting far-flung places > like Japan, Brazil, Moscow, Vienna, Washington, London and where not, all > for the sake of the arts in India. > > Warm regards, > Arka > > > -- > Logos Theatre > In the beginning was the word > No. 126, > 3rd Main Road, > Jayamahal Extension, > Bangalore 560046 > -------------------------------------------------------- > If it be now, 'tis not to come; > if it be not to come, it will be now; > if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. > Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? > Let be. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Partha Dasgupta +919811047132 From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 16:52:40 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 16:52:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> Message-ID: Dear Shuddha, Four farmers who were protesting peacefully in Greater Noida the day before were killed by the police in a morning. What does the arithmetic work out to in this case? This had nothing to do with nationalism or religion, but land & resources & the State's response was brutal. While police brutality in India is a given and no government has had the vision or courage to actually institute much-needed police reforms ( which, besides better training also means better pay and working conditions) so that we can have effective policing without excessive force, what alarms me is the way 'the people' increasingly choose to express bigotry, anger and outrage in mobs that go about destroying property, looting shops, attacking whomever they consider the 'other'. I am not just referring to recent events in J&K, but also the so-called sex-scandal in Kashmir 2 years ago, the Gujjar agitation the last couple of years and the Gorkhaland agitation, both in the '80s and today. When political parties piggyback on 'causes' like Amarnath they encourage and legitimize this form of protest that only results in brinksmanship which is then extremely difficult to undo. I cannot call mobs that were lynching policemen, destroying property, attacking the media in Jammu & Kashmir peaceful just because they were not armed with guns & grenades. It is not for nothing that the Mirwaiz pulled the CRPF men protecting his house into the safety of his office. Left to the rampaging mobs they would have lynched them. Can one even begin to compare, say, the Narmada protestors, who for years have conducted themselves with restraint and dignity with the mobs that were baying for blood and marching towards the LoC? The agitation in Jammu over the revocation of the Amarnath land has been deplorable. What difference did it make if the land was not handed to the SASB? It is not as if the government is planning to renege on building the promised huts or infrastructure for the next season. It now turns out that the J&K Cabinet did not apply it's mind in the first instance of handing over the land to the SASB. Of the 100 acres in question, only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the rest is private property belonging to several locals. Even if there was a BJP government they could not 'hand over' this land to the SASB (of course the Communists could have managed something with the help of its cadres if it were to become an SEZ). Besides, is the SASB Jammu's private property that they are so incensed or is Sangharsh Samiti the sole custodian of the Amarnath cave and the sole custodians of Hindu interests? The Jammuites no longer know what it is that they are up in arms about. For some it is 'Bholey Nath ki zameen,' for others a move towards delimitation of electoral seats, and for the rest the simmering anger against real and perceived inequality between the two regions. You have pointed to the difference in attitude of the police to Jammu protestors and Kashmir protestors resulting in the far greater numbers being killed in Kashmir than in Jammu. While it is tempting to arrive at the same conclusion, I must point out that the J&K Police is not populated by Bihari Hindus bent on massacring Kashmiri Muslims, but largely, Kashmiri Muslims themselves. There is also the difference between the situations on the ground in Jammu and in Kashmir. At no point in Jammu did the police or paramilitary forces ever have to face mobs over a couple of thousand. On the day of the Muzaffarabad march the mobs swelled to over 100,000. While I do not condone excessive force, I can only imagine the terror of facing a huge, uncontrollable mob. It cannot be easy, and under the circumstances one can only be grateful that more people were not killed. There are guidelines set down for the police & paramilitary in these situations. They are supposed to be accompanied by a District Magistrate. The order to fire is supposed to be given in writing. If and when peace prevails it should be possible to ascertain why and under what circumstances firing on mobs was allowed. What however, must be unambiguously condemned are instances of gross vindictiveness where the CRPF stopped and attacked ambulances in clear violation of all humanitarian laws. As for the economic blockade it seems entirely mired in controversy. I'm still not clear how severe it really was and have been trying this whole week to get to the bottom of it. While it is undeniable that there have been shortages of certain items in the valley I wonder whether the call to Muzaffarabad was really necessary. Everyone seems to be harping on the only route to the valley being blocked by Jammu protestors, forgetting about the route via the Zoji La, Leh and Manali. This route has remained open the whole time. Ladakh, host to thousands of tourists in this season has remained unaffected through this entire period. It is still jam packed with tourists. It receives its supplies mainly from the Valley and friends tell me that apart from a very slight shortage of mineral water and chicken everything else has been absolutely normal with trucks plying the Srinagar-leh highway. The same goes for Kargil. Point is that supplies can only reach Kargil and Ladakh when there is a surplus in the Valley. My second point is that the Zoji La-Leh-Manali route, albeit longer, was available to the apple growers to transport their produce to the markets in Delhi. While the Srinagar-Del route via Jammu takes 3 days, the route via Leh would have added a maximum of 2-3 days. If the apple growers and the chambers of commerce had been serious they could have done this without fear of violence or of their produce rotting en route. The call 'Muzaffarabad chalo' is clearly a political one and I would not unsympathetic to it had it been called in circumstances that were not already so fraught. After all, before 1947 the Srinagar-Rawalpindi route was the easiest one to the Punjab, and there is no reason that the India-Pakistan détente could not have included trade and tourism between PAK and IAK as a priority. Unfortunately, the collapse in Pakistan over the last 3 years conspired with the normal reluctance of the bureaucracy of both countries to stay on track. New Delhi has even sent a list of goods to be traded between Srinagar and Muzaffarabad. Islamabad has not responded. The general feeling in Pakistan is that opening of the routes to trade and the uncontrolled movement of people would 'dilute' the 'Kashmir issue.' They are right. It is not for nothing that Manmohan Singh called for borders to become irrelevant. He was merely following what peace activists in India and Pakistan have been wanting and practicing for decades in their people-to-people meetings. The situation in Kashmir is extremely grim. Separatists have called for lakhs of people to march to Pampore tomorrow and to the UNMOGIP the day after. The CRPF has been demoralized with the transfer of the IGP and threatens to stand down. The Army has not been given any orders as yet to come out on the streets to control the mobs. If things continue in this manner and 500,000 people cross the LoC towards Muzaffarabad not the Indian Army nor the Pakistani Rangers (who incidentally foiled 3 marches from 1992-99 by Amanullah Khan and the JKLF by shooting & killing several activists)will be able to stop this rush. While some may rejoice prematurely and call this a victory of the people of Kashmir in their struggle against the Indian state, I see it as a pyrrhic one. When passions are enflamed the road ahead is blurred. I congratulated a Kashmiri friend this morning. I said what the guns couldn't get you for 18 years it looks like you will have managed through sheer mob frenzy. He laughed. But be careful, I said, you people better decide what this will mean, whether this Azadi from India will mean an independent Kashmir, which will be manipulated by the superpowers of the world or the accession to the tottering, violence-ridden, state of Pakistan increasingly under the control of mullahs and the military? Whatever it is it will be unlikely that there will be a unanimous decision and then a bloody civil war in Kashmir will ensue. My thoughts and fears are also for the Muslims in Jammu who will no doubt be subject to the worst kind of backlash. And indeed today as I write I find myself speaking from the place of an Indian Muslim, an identity which I have never wholly occupied because of my Indian-ness. I fear for the 133 million Muslims of India who will once again be blamed for the Partition of this country, for the action-reactions that will no doubt ensue and who will in the 61st year of our hard-won independence have nothing but another depressing 61 years of blame, guilt and suspicion to look forward to. sj On 8/15/08 2:51 AM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Dear all, (apologies for cross posting on Kafila) Anniversaries are good > opportunities for reflection. I write this the early hours of 15th August, > 2008, the 61st anniversary of Indian independence. The events of the past > few months, and the past few days, in the Indian adminsitered state of Jammu > and Kashmir have demonstrated how well and how equally (or not) the police, > paramilitaries and armed forces of the Indian Republic treat different kinds > of protesting crowds. The facts that I am about to discuss are good measures > with which to think about the relationship between acts of power, > different kinds of people, sovereignty, life and death in the Indian nation > state as it has evolved over the past 61 years. The region of Jammu in the > province of Jammu and Kashmir has been caught in the grip of a fierce > agitation against the revocation of the land transfer to the Amarnath Shrine > Board. We have all seen footage of angry SASS (Shri Amarnath Sangharsh > Samiti) activists brandishing trishuls, setting up roadblocks and burning > tyres, the agitation has spread to different parts of India As of August > 10, the following has taken place (in Jammu) "...* 18 cases have been > registered in connection with communal violence in which 20 persons were > injured, 72 Kulas (hutments) of Gujjars were burnt down, 22 vehicles damaged > and several trucks carrying supplies looted. ³These are only reported > incidents. Many such incidents have taken place, which have not been > reported so far,² the officers told the team. * 117 police personnel and 78 > civilians were injured including two policemen who were lynched and are > ³battling for life² in PGI Chandigarh while six civilians were killed, > including three in police and Army action. * 129 cases were registered > against the rioters. A total of 1171 arrests were made but most of them are > now out on bail. * 10, 513 protest demonstrations and 359 serious incidents > of violence have taken place across Jammu in which 28 government > buildings, 15 police vehicles and 118 private vehicles have been > damaged..." The information given above is quoted from - "Dangerous divide: > Jammu officials put it in black and white" by Muzamil Jaleel, Indian > Express, August 10, 2008. Muzamil Jaleel culled this information from a > briefing delivered by government officials in the Jammu region to a visiting > 'all party delegation' http://www.indianexpress.com/story/346889.html As is > clear, of the 6 reported deaths in the Jammu region, two are of policemen, > who were attacked by the pro Amarnath Land Transfer agitationists. Two of > these are suicides, both of whom have been hailed as 'martyrs' by the Shree > Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti activists. Only two out of six deaths, in the past > twenty or so days of relentless and violent agitation, which included > intimidation of truckers on the Jammu Srinagar highway can be attributed to > police or paramilitary action. Each of these deaths is unfortunate and > deserves to be condemned. In two further and separate incidents, the VHP, > BJP, Shiv Sena and Sangh Parivar and allied organizations 'Chakka Jam' that > paralysed roads in major cities yesterday, two more people died, because > they could not reach hospitals on time. These two people were the > 'collateral damage' of the upsurge of patriotic sentiment displayed by > activists sympathetic to the SASS agitation in Jammu. On the other hand, in > the part of the Kashmir valley administered and occupied by India, in the > past few days alone, in several instances of firing on unarmed mobs, have > led to the deaths of 29 people. Many of these deaths occured when unarmed > crowds tried to accompany trucks carrying fruit (which had earlier been > prevented from proceeding towards markets on the Srinagar Jammu highway) > towards Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. Fruit growers in Indian administered > Kashmir were at the forefront of attempting to salvage precious stocks of > produce by taking to the 'Muzafarabad Road'. Apart from the 29 confirmed > dead, several more are in hospitals, injured in critical conditions, and > there lives are endangered by the fact that life saving medicines are in > short supply due to the economic blockade of the Kashmir valley. trying to > reach across the line of control to Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. The > difference in treatment of two different kinds of crowds is easy to see. In > one instance, more than twenty days of continuing, violent agitation result > in two deaths by police firing. In another instance, less than a week's > agitation results in 29 deaths. Clearly, the loss of lives in the Kashmir > valley does not amount to much in the calculus of power. A rough arithmetic > of sorts would indicate that a comparison of two casualties (in Jammu) to > twentynine casualties (in Kashmir) means that agitating Kashmiri lives are > approximately fiteen times less significant (or more expendable) than > agitating Jammu lives. The agitation in Jammu has harped often on how it is > discriminated against in comparison to Kashmir. In one sense at least there > is some truth in this charge. In the matter of the expenditure of bullets by > the Indian state, there is no comparison at all between Jammu and Kashmir. > When it comes to ammunition, way more bullets are spent in Kashmir than is > the case in Jammu. It is clear, that the Indian state's armed might does not > confront rampaging Jammu mobs if they hold the tricolour and shout > nationalist slogans, or slogans in favour of the Amarnath Shrine Board's > desire for land in the Kashmir Valley, even if they sometimes lynch > policemen. On the other hand, unarmed fruit growers and ordinary people on > the streets of the Kashmir valley are sitting targets for trigger happy > police, paramilitary and army personnel. Guns can be, and are being aimed at > their heads.Unlike Jammu, no policemen or armed forces personnel have been > killed, at least until now, in the course of the fruit growers agitation in > the Kashmir valley. As, independence day dawns, a clear pattern emerges. When > push comes to shove, the Indian state has no hesitation in expending its > bullets in some cases, and in showing exemplary restraint in others. Mowing > down crowds that hold the tricolour flag aloft doesn't look good on TV. > But, obviously, a little bloodletting in the streets of Srinagar on the eve > of Independence day is good for 'national' morale. Now, if, you were one of > those who happens to be the kind of person who the state seems to be willing > to favour with a shower of bullets at any given opportunity, would you be > celebrating 'Independence Day'? What would you be celebrating, - your > freedom to fall to a policeman's gun? No wonder they play national anthems > with gun salutes. A hail of bullets makes for the most fitting percussive > accompaniment to poignant displays of national pride in India > today. Shuddhabrata > Sengupta _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From indersalim at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 16:53:45 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 16:53:45 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808150423h834dc96g1a009cbe6c825840@mail.gmail.com> Dear all "of the grave situation in Jammu & Kashmiri" yes, dear Aditya, the situation indeed is grave. it is unfortunate that killings happened in the drama of land-transfer-no-transfer . whether people have been hit above or below the belt, the no. of casualities is much higher in kashmir which has proved the point which dear Shuddha rasided today on 15th of august. why this happened ? Congress has always played games with vote bank politics. They have indeed sired communal parties in india. They shamelessly promoted dynasty rule as well. Narshimha Rao almost taught BJP them how to hold trishul in their hands. In kashmir they were worse than that : they jailed Sheik , Mohd. Abudllah, the most popular leader for no fault of his. Kashmir never never wanted to be part of India, and out of that Indian bully emerged article 370, which too was trampled time and again the past. Now donating land to Amar Nath Shrine Board, which has no kashmiri in it, would have equalled high way robbery. Now if jammu's hindu fails to see the reason, how we can blame valley muslims for defending what Indian constitution grants them in the first palce. I dont know if kashmiris want to be part of pakistan, but they certainly dont want Indian pass ports for any identiy. Simple Gujjars and Bakerwals and other poor people are too casual about the whole issue, but those who live in affulent areas ensure that they too are brought into such a mainstream. now every body knows what is 370. (trahath satath ) so they are uninimous in their right to defend the historical truth which has become their identity and fate even. Article 370 has also proved environmental friendly so far. Rich elites from india would have purchased lot many mountains in kashmir for their summer time holidays, and that has not happened, but it would be unfortunate if kashmiris themselves construct hotels in Baltal for greed. afterall shrine boards and other such boards make money for their own good. today, I think of Sanjay kak's jashn-e-azadi, and the reason why it was a sucess. For a long lasting peace in kashmir, india has to find a solution. rest of it is too fragile... till then best love is On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 10:20 AM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Dear Shuddha, > > Your post only reflects how wrong you are in your entire assessment r. I wonder why you could only see it from > one perspective and rather chose to go with the direction of the wind. It > shows your unfortunate tilt and inclination towards the anti-national and > anti-India forces. You know what I mean. > > You obviously should have this understanding that things have been blown out > of proportion in some cases. Muzamel Jaleel covers Express from Srinagar; I > wonder how he knows so intricate details about Jammu. Surely, I cannot trust > his sources. His reporting in Express shows again his tilt towards state > bashing and support to the fanatic separatists in Kashmir. He forgot that it > was a journalistic piece or news item and not his column where he could go > on with the same rhetoric. > > You really need to brush up with reading your daily Indian Express complete. > Maybe, the following few reports help you understand it better: > > 1. *Jammu Muslims back stir, but fear > clashes* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345557.html > > 2. *Two more die in firing, Jammu > simmers* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/344765.html > > 3. *In some areas, Army faces 'Gandhigiri' from > protestors* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345595.html > > 4. *One killed as Army fires at protestors, curfew > defied* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345556.html > > 5. *Recall Vohra: Karan Singh* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345182.html > > 6. *PDP now opposes the transfer, but records show how it said the > opposite* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345063.html > > 7. *Jammu fires spread, Cong reaches out to BJP: help us defuse > crisis* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/344371.html > > 8. *Centre stays away* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/tsearch/search.php?pg=9 > > 9. *Amarnath row: 13 injured, Army called > in* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/343923.html > > 10. *Jammu burning* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/343523.html > > 11. *Blast targets migrants, 5 of a family die in > J-K* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/340194.html > > 12. *Bid to attack Amarnath yatris foiled, 3 militants killed: > police* > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/338647.html > > I just hope you read these news items too and not just your favourite > Muzamel Jalil. > > It was a planned move to raise an issue such as "Economic Blockade" by the > separatists and hardline groups from the valley. I see a pattern here. As > reports say, it was even backed by ISI. > > We all know, very well now that there was NO economic blockade. It was just > to gain publicity and to distract attention from the real issue of Amarnath > Land. > > Shuddha, You have a great ability to play with words. Though your crafty > language won't gain much sympathy as it shows no logic. Food, Oil, Water, > Baby Milk, medicine etc etc all are in good supply to th valley and valley > itself has great amount of stock to last almost 3 months. If there has been > urgency for some material; it has been airlifted; as on previous occassions. > > > Your comments are sick and can only make things worse. I don't undertsnad > what your intentions are. You surely don't understand PEACE !!!! > > It was people in Jammu who were shot on head. See pictures for urself at > www.thekashmir.wordpress.com/ While on the other hand, your Sheikh Abdul > Aziz a former Terrorist and now with Hurriyat was hit on the leg and he lost > his life due to blood loss. > > This disinformation campaign launched by Kashmir based sepratists, fanatics, > and 3 hardline funded newspapers and then supported by secular apologists > based in Delhi and elsewhere only make matters worse. > > The so called movement in Kashmir in complete fake and does not have mandate > of the people. By mere brainwashing people and instigating communal > passions; one cannot achiece any goal. Moreover, a movement which began with > targetting the minority Hindu community, killing them and with communal > slogans; cannot land up anywhere. > > As India celebrates 61 years of Independence, Kashmiri Hindus complete yet > another year in forced exile. Its been more than 18 years now. The night of > 19th Jan. 1990; still haunts in the minds of the victims. 50,000 thousand of > whom are still languishing in refugee camps in Jammu and its outskirts. > > And, then these limousine Communists say these protests in Jammu are by > RSS/BJP/VHP. I wonder if they have travelled to Jammu themselves and seen > the amount of anger in people. Do that and you will know what a people's > movement is !!! Sitting in Ac rooms, dictating lectures on sarai, and > sticking your finger to the latest laptop won't tell you much about the > situation in Jammu. And, these are our modern communists.... > > The transfer of the 40 hectares of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board > was the most logical, legal and ethical decision taken by the cabinet. Why > does this disturb the few sepratist elements in Kashmir who are hell bent to > communalise the situation ? It onlt goes on to show the religious and > cultural intolerance in so called Kashmiri Muslim leaders. > > This Amarnath Land Row was as well a sinster game plan of the PDP; that is > evident from the above Indian Express reports which quotes all official > documents. It was clear cut vote bank politics and to divide the communities > in this state of India. > > Omar Abdullah on the other hand gave a highly inflamatory statement in the > Parliament; not realising its consequenes. He did it without thinking too > much, and just to attract attention of the media. Let me tell him, that its > not only the land of Kashmiri Muslims, its equally of Kashmiri Pandits. And, > we will fight till the very end to have it.... > > Its unfortunate that holding the Indian Flag high in Jammu is a crime to > some here while holding a Pakistani Flag in Kashmir seems to be some kind of > symbol and some great work. I pity those people. > > Hope some sense prevails upon those minds who support these communal forces > in the valley without a second thought. They have sold their conscience. Are > you guys so cheap ? > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: >> >> Dear all, >> >> (apologies for cross posting on Kafila) >> >> Anniversaries are good opportunities for reflection. I write this the >> early hours of 15th August, 2008, the 61st anniversary of Indian >> independence. >> >> The events of the past few months, and the past few days, in the >> Indian adminsitered state of Jammu and Kashmir have demonstrated how >> well and how equally (or not) the police, paramilitaries and armed >> forces of the Indian Republic treat different kinds of protesting >> crowds. The facts that I am about to discuss are good measures with >> which to think about the relationship between acts of power, >> different kinds of people, sovereignty, life and death in the Indian >> nation state as it has evolved over the past 61 years. >> >> The region of Jammu in the province of Jammu and Kashmir has been >> caught in the grip of a fierce agitation against the revocation of >> the land transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board. We have all seen >> footage of angry SASS (Shri Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti) activists >> brandishing trishuls, setting up roadblocks and burning tyres, the >> agitation has spread to different parts of India >> >> As of August 10, the following has taken place (in Jammu) >> >> "...* 18 cases have been registered in connection with communal >> violence in which 20 persons were injured, 72 Kulas (hutments) of >> Gujjars were burnt down, 22 vehicles damaged and several trucks >> carrying supplies looted. "These are only reported incidents. Many >> such incidents have taken place, which have not been reported so >> far," the officers told the team. >> >> * 117 police personnel and 78 civilians were injured including two >> policemen who were lynched and are "battling for life" in PGI >> Chandigarh while six civilians were killed, including three in police >> and Army action. >> >> * 129 cases were registered against the rioters. A total of 1171 >> arrests were made but most of them are now out on bail. >> >> * 10, 513 protest demonstrations and 359 serious incidents of >> violence have taken place across Jammu in which 28 government >> buildings, 15 police vehicles and 118 private vehicles have been >> damaged..." >> >> The information given above is quoted from - "Dangerous divide: Jammu >> officials put it in black and white" >> by Muzamil Jaleel, Indian Express, August 10, 2008. Muzamil Jaleel >> culled this information from a briefing delivered by government >> officials in the Jammu region to a visiting 'all party delegation' >> http://www.indianexpress.com/story/346889.html >> >> As is clear, of the 6 reported deaths in the Jammu region, two are of >> policemen, who were attacked by the pro Amarnath Land Transfer >> agitationists. Two of these are suicides, both of whom have been >> hailed as 'martyrs' by the Shree Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti activists. >> Only two out of six deaths, in the past twenty or so days of >> relentless and violent agitation, which included intimidation of >> truckers on the Jammu Srinagar highway can be attributed to police or >> paramilitary action. Each of these deaths is unfortunate and deserves >> to be condemned. >> >> In two further and separate incidents, the VHP, BJP, Shiv Sena and >> Sangh Parivar and allied organizations 'Chakka Jam' that paralysed >> roads in major cities yesterday, two more people died, because they >> could not reach hospitals on time. These two people were the >> 'collateral damage' of the upsurge of patriotic sentiment displayed >> by activists sympathetic to the SASS agitation in Jammu. >> >> On the other hand, in the part of the Kashmir valley administered and >> occupied by India, in the past few days alone, in several instances >> of firing on unarmed mobs, have led to the deaths of 29 people. Many >> of these deaths occured when unarmed crowds tried to accompany trucks >> carrying fruit (which had earlier been prevented from proceeding >> towards markets on the Srinagar Jammu highway) towards Pakistan >> Occupied Kashmir. Fruit growers in Indian administered Kashmir were >> at the forefront of attempting to salvage precious stocks of produce >> by taking to the 'Muzafarabad Road'. Apart from the 29 confirmed >> dead, several more are in hospitals, injured in critical conditions, >> and there lives are endangered by the fact that life saving medicines >> are in short supply due to the economic blockade of the Kashmir >> valley. trying to reach across the line of control to Pakistan >> Occupied Kashmir. >> >> The difference in treatment of two different kinds of crowds is easy >> to see. In one instance, more than twenty days of continuing, violent >> agitation result in two deaths by police firing. In another instance, >> less than a week's agitation results in 29 deaths. Clearly, the loss >> of lives in the Kashmir valley does not amount to much in the >> calculus of power. A rough arithmetic of sorts would indicate that a >> comparison of two casualties (in Jammu) to twenty nine casualties (in >> Kashmir) means that agitating Kashmiri lives are approximately fiteen >> times less significant (or more expendable) than agitating Jammu >> lives. The agitation in Jammu has harped often on how it is >> discriminated against in comparison to Kashmir. In one sense at least >> there is some truth in this charge. In the matter of the expenditure >> of bullets by the Indian state, there is no comparison at all between >> Jammu and Kashmir. When it comes to ammunition, way more bullets are >> spent in Kashmir than is the case in Jammu. >> >> It is clear, that the Indian state's armed might does not confront >> rampaging Jammu mobs if they hold the tricolour and shout nationalist >> slogans, or slogans in favour of the Amarnath Shrine Board's desire >> for land in the Kashmir Valley, even if they sometimes lynch >> policemen. On the other hand, unarmed fruit growers and ordinary >> people on the streets of the Kashmir valley are sitting targets for >> trigger happy police, paramilitary and army personnel. Guns can be, >> and are being aimed at their heads.Unlike Jammu, no policemen or >> armed forces personnel have been killed, at least until now, in the >> course of the fruit growers agitation in the Kashmir valley. >> >> As, independence day dawns, a clear pattern emerges. When push comes >> to shove, the Indian state has no hesitation in expending its bullets >> in some cases, and in showing exemplary restraint in others. Mowing >> down crowds that hold the tricolour flag aloft doesn't look good on >> TV. But, obviously, a little bloodletting in the streets of Srinagar >> on the eve of Independence day is good for 'national' morale. >> >> Now, if, you were one of those who happens to be the kind of person >> who the state seems to be willing to favour with a shower of bullets >> at any given opportunity, would you be celebrating 'Independence >> Day'? What would you be celebrating, - your freedom to fall to a >> policeman's gun? >> >> No wonder they play national anthems with gun salutes. A hail of >> bullets makes for the most fitting percussive accompaniment to >> poignant displays of national pride in India today. >> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 15 21:39:54 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:39:54 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar, Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And apologies in advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not interested in the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, (without making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your responses have given me an opportunity to make some necessary elaborations. First of all, let me categorically state that Sonia, by pointing towards the violence that farmers faced in Greater Noida yesterday, and by referring to the histories of the Narmada agitation, and the Nandigram issue has helped me clarify some of my own thinking. This process of clarification does not require me to revise what I had written in relation to the current climate in the state of Jammu & Kashmir, on the contrary, it actually allows me to extend and develop my argument. I will come to this later, but first, there are some other issues that I need to deal with. When I had referred to the two kinds of treatment meted out to two different kinds of protest, I had not in fact thought in 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' terms, and after reading Sonia's response, I re-read my post carefully to see if there was any suggestion that I was referring to a difference in the state's response that could be attributed to the religious composition of the two different protesting crowds. I did not find the words 'Hindu' or 'Muslim' anywhere in my post. And while I do agree with Soina that when Jammu and Kashmir Police personnel open fire on protesting crowds in the Kashmir valley, what we witness is nominally 'Muslim' policemen, firing on nominally 'Muslim' protesters. The same Jammu and Kashmir police personnel firing on protesters in Jammu are likely to be a mix of nominally 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' personnel firing on a similarly mixed crowd of protesters (if that is, we agree with the assertion that the SASS protests have featured the participation of 'Jammu Muslims'). This fact may or may not be true, but let us for the sake of the argument, assume that this is so. Similarly, the caste/identity composition of western UP policemen is not likely to be very different from crowds of protesting western UP farmers in the unhappy place that is Greater Noida. It is a well known fact that the most brutal torture in the detention centres and interrogation centres in the Kashmir valley is meted out by STF (Special Task Force) personnel attatched to the state police. Almost invariably, these enforcers of the sharp edge of the Indian states marks on Kashmiri bodies tend to be Kashmiri, and Muslim. One clarification here though, the bulk of firing in the Kashmir valley has been undertaken by CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force) personnel, and the bulk of public anger has been, in this case against, the CRPF bullets, and CRPF sticks that smashed so many windows last night in downtown Srinagar. Now, anyone who has been to Srinagar knows, that the scared and vulnerable and aggressive faces that man CRPF bunkers are not Kashmiri. Their bodies (more often than not) come from hotter places in the plains and plateaus of the Indian hearland. And I see their deplyoment in a war zone like Kashmir as unfortunate, as saddening Sonia has referred to Kashmiri protesting crowds 'baying for blood' during the last few days during the mass gatherings that took place on the road to Muzaffarabad, and in Srinagar and other towns. I have been speaking to friends in the Kashmir valley today, and they told me that the slogans that were raised during the protests on the road to Muzaffarabad were as follows (in order of frequency) 1. 'Hum Kya Chahtey, Azaadi' (What do we want, Freedom), The staple full throated cry that rings out, and has rung out in most protests in the Kashmir valley for the last two decades. 2. 'Fruit to bahaana hai, Muzaffarabad jaana hai' (Fruit is an excuse, we want to go to Muzaffarabad). This has been chanted, not by the truckers carrying fruit, but by the accompanying marchers. 3. 'Aadhi Roti Khayenge, Sar nahin Jhukayenge'. (We can eat half a piece of bread, but won't bow our heads') 3. 'Jeeve, Jeeve, Pakistan' (Long live, Long live, Pakistan) Now, whatever these slognas may or may not imply, none of these slogans, bayed for anyone's blood. Not only did the marchers refrain from raising any slogans that can be construed as calls to violence, the 'separatist' political leadership that had aligned itself with the mass protests also repeatedly called for peaceful protests, using all available channels, including those afforded to them by the mainstream media. I have seen the Mirwaiz calling repeatedly for protests to be peaceful. If this leadership had wanted to queer the pitch by asking for violence, I am sure it would have been heeded by some sections in a very angry crowd. No such call was made, and no policeman, or paramilitary force personnel were attacked. In some instances, CRPF bunkers were torn down (and this happenned after the incidents of firing) but the demobilization of offensive fortifications on the street can be hardly called a violent act. In my book, it is an act of disarming the infrastructure of occupation, without causing any injury or violence to the occupiers themselves. Once the bodies of people killed by the CRPF started to make themselves visible in funeral processions, many young people started shouting 'Khoon ke badle Khoon' (blood for blood). But this 'baying' if it can be called that, occurred once blood had been spilt, and not, as I may point out, by the bayers. On the contrary, I have seen Dr. Praveen Togadia (who has endorsed the SASS agitation in Jammu by calling mass protests in other cities in India) declare on television 'agar maange nahin poori ki gayi to sangharsh aur bhi ugra roop lega' ('if the demands are not met, the agitation will take on even more extreme forms'). We have heard crowds in Jammu chant, 'Jaan denge, par baba Amarnath ki Zamin vapas lenge' (we will give up our lives, but will not give up on Baba Amarnath's land) and variations thereof. In fact, two 'jaans/lives' have been tragically offered as suicides. For me, this is just as shocking, just as violent, as any other kind of call to violence. These crowds have set Gujjar huts on fire. And setting shepherds huts on fire is not exactly the same thing as tearing down the sandbags of a CRPF bunker. So any attempt at 'equating' the degree of violence in these two instances needs to be read as disingenuous. As for the fact that in one instance (in Jammu) the crowds carried the Indian flag, and shouted pro-India slogans, and that in the other instance (in Kashmir) the crowds carried Pakistani flags and that some (or many) shouted pro-Pakistan slogans does not say anything about the violent intentions or tenor of either of the two protesting crowds. As someone who carries no brief, for any form of nationalism, (Indian, Pakistani or Kashmiri) I am not willing to judge a crowd on the basis of which kind of nationalism they choose to profess. What interests me is the fact that given two crowds, with two different kinds of behaviour, one of which carries an Indian flag, and another which carries a Pakistani flag, black flags, or no flags at all - the Indian state chooses to fire on the second crowd, even though the second crowd, which may be greater in numbers, is not indicating that it is anything but a peaceful assembly of people intent on going from 'A' to 'B'. That they choose not to go to 'C' (the Srinagar-Leh- Manali road that Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on which we can evaluate the merits or demerits of the state's decision to fire into this amassed crowd. Notwithstanding the multitude of links supplied by Aditya Raj Kaul in his response to my posting. Facts, remain, facts. Three casualties of police firing in one instance (in a very militant protest in Jammu) and now thirty casualties (and likely to mount) in police and CRPF firing in the other instance (in Kashmir) including instances where CRPF personnel fired on ambulances ferrying the wounded to hospital, and inside hospitals. These instances of violence against ambulances, the injured and doctors and nurses attending to them must go down in the history of the Indian state as examples of the very worst forms of state brutality. For more details - see - This needs to be seen also in the context of the fact that the opening of the "Srinagar-Muzaffarabad' road is a long standing demand of several sections of political opinion (not all of them separatist) and that in fact predates the current troubles in the valley (from 1989) by several decades. It needs also to be seen in the light of the fact that what the people on the highways in the Kashmir valley were demanding had already been agreed to in principle by the governments of India and Pakistan. If anything, the current situation was an opportunity for the governments of the state of Jammu and Kashmir (currently represented by the Governor, a representative of the Union of India) and the Union of India to display a modicum of vision and sagacity by opening the line of control, especially when the people of the valley were voting with their feet, and their bodies for this to be done. Even those who wish the Indian state well in its continuing occupation of the Kashmir valley would no doubt see this turn of events as a tragically wasted opportunity. Let me now turn to the second important question that has arisen from this discussion. The question of what might enable us to think about the situations of the Greater Noida farmers and the protesting masses in the Kashmir valley (and elsewhere, in Nandigram, and in the Kashmir valley). Sonia has pointed out in her posting that as far as the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is concerned, "Of the 100 acres in question, only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the rest is private property belonging to several locals." If this is indeed the case, then the extent of the anger against the move to effect a transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is all the more understandable. (I do not doubt that it would be understandable even if this were not the case, but that is another matter. ) Land is a highly emotive issue in all parts of South Asia, and in many parts of the world where it is tied to livelihood and to survival. The desire to acquire land (usually with the mediation of the state) for purposes other than those relevant to the livelihood and survival of the customary owners, users and custodians of land is what gives the common sharp edge to the question of the arbitrary acquisition of land by state or state backed agencies, whether in Kashmir, or in the Narmada valley, or in Nandigram is what is clearly evident. In Kashmir, (in the absence of any other viable form of sustainable economic activity, barring tourism, land is all that people can fall back on. And we need to remember that some of the capital that the National Conference still falls back on when its naked collusion with the occupation comes to the fore, is the vivid, yet fading memory of land reforms in the early fifties. So, then, what is the story about land, in the Kashmir valley. "In 2003 Abdul Rashid, Member of Parliament was told in Rajya Sabha that the army and the Central Para-Military Forces (CPMFs) have 41,594.767 acres (332760 kanals) in J&K. This comes to about 170 sq kms for which records exist. But an equal amount, if not more, is under illegal occupation, according to The Economic Times [December 6, 2006]. The most recent figures being circulated suggests that 6,81,839 kanals are under the armed forces’ possession. Of this 3,10,184 kanals is unauthorized possession. In Srinagar officially, the defence establishment have 45,080 kanals of land located at Badamibagh, Rangreth, Danodhar Karewa, Sharifabad, Tatoo and Militia Grounds. In 2006, it has been reported that the Indian Army’s Northern Command has acquired 8000 kanals in Awantipora. There have also been reports of Indian Air Force wanting land for a new air base in Mansbal and in the same area 3Rashtriya Rifles (RR) has submitted a request to acquire nearly 1500 kanals adjoining its garrison. Manasbal also highlights another feature of this ‘land grab’. Villagers complain that since the irrigation canal passes through land which the 3RR wants, thousands of kanals of land would be denied irrigation. So widespread is the concern in J&K over land under security forces occupation that even the pro-Indian Peoples Democratic Party, led by Mufti Mohammed Saeed, in a resolution adopted on February 11, 2007 states “with distress… that over the last 15 years thousands of acres of orchards and agricultural land have been acquired in the state particularly in Kashmir Valley, districts of Rajouri, Poonch and Doda by the Armed Forces.” The resolution also says that “many institutional buildings including hospitals and schools have been occupied by the armed forces.” A conservative estimate suggests that 35,000 ha of such land is under the control of the Indian Army alone. Take deployment in just one tehsil; Pattan in Baramulla, to appreciate its significance. This tehsil has 92 villages. Amongst these 92 villages there are 4 army brigade headquarters and 12 checkposts. Pattan plus Babateng also hosts camps of Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), Border Security Force (BSF) and Special Operations Group (SOG). There are three police stations in the tehsil; at Pattan, Mirgund and Kreeri. Each check post has anywhere between 100-150 soldiers although there are few which have much larger numbers in excess of 300. Thus roughly a cluster of nine villages come under one check post. And one brigade is available for operations covering 23 villages whereas one police station caters to 30-31 villages. Thus all movement to and from the village to fields, market, town is monitored and accompanied by regular patrolling. Thus, the margin for normal human ‘errors’, such as stepping out for a smoke after dark, or a stroll can result in death. On top of this, the extent of deployment of troops and the land under their occupation acts as a brake on people’s own capacity to propel growth. It also results in difficulties in getting easy access to markets for commodity export because of delay in transportation due to security drills, slowdown on highways because of military convoys carrying troops, material and weaponry etc, and relatively higher fuel and labour costs due to all this." Were this land to be freed of occupation it would contribute immensely to increasing agricultural/fruit production and generation of revenue and cut back on net outflow from J&K. If this is true (and the statement recorded in the minutes of the Rajya Sabha do have official sanction) then, the armed forces and paramilitaries of the Indian state, together occupied 41,594.767 acres, and since the majority of force deployment in J&K is in the Kashmir valley, then the majority of this land would logically be seen to lie in the Kashmir valley. The net area under fruit cultivation in the State of J&K is 174,000 ha are under fresh fruits (orchards). 174,000 ha is equal to 4,29,963 acres. If we compare this figure against the reliable estimate of land under direct occupation my armed forces of the Indian state (41,594.767 acres) we get the following figures. The armed forces occupy land that is roughly equivalent to what would amount to 10 % of the land under fruit cultivation. In crude terms, one in every ten orchards is not an orchard, it is a fortress. All figures are sourced from the Fifth Economic Census [published by the Central Statistical Organisation together with Directorate of Economics and Statistics J&K, 2005] and Economic Survey 2006-07 for Jammu & Kashmir (ES 2006-07) [The Directorate of Economics and Statistics, Government of Jammu and Kashmir, 2007]as cited in 'Understanding the J&K Economy' by Gautam Navlakha, Kashmir Affairs, Volume 2, No.2, April-June 2007 http://www.kashmiraffairs.org Gautam_Navlakha_understanding_J&K_economy.html [And before anyone jumps on me for citing a source that comes by way of Gautam Navlakha, let me state that Navlakha may not have read the Rajtarangini with great care, but he certainly does take the time to read the Economic Survey 2006-2007 for J&K, and other official documents with a certain degree of care. And the figures under question here are not his opinions, but notes in these same official documents.] In a situation of direct occupation of a resource as precious as land in Kashmir, the arbitrary decision to appropriate even just 100 more acres of land by an unrepresentative body (the office of the governor) for whatever purpose cannot but be seen as a deliberate affront to a population stretched to the very limits of its patience by the violence of a continuing occupation. I fail to see, why the anger of fruit growers, denied markets, smarting under the knowledge that their orchards have in many cases been taken over by the Indian state, should look upon any act of land acquisition with kindness. Look for instance at a news item in the Kashmir Times of Friday, April 18, 2008 Rental hikes by Army may adversely affect fruit production in Jammu and kashmir With fruit production in Kashmir static, the Kashmiri growers have asked the state and central government not to acquire horticulture land for any official purposes. They are also not satisfied with recent rent hike by the defence ministry. The growers fear that acquiring of the horticulture land for official purposes will reduce the fruit production in the state. Jammu and Kashmir is the only state in India that has around 2.75 lakh hectares of land under the horticulture.The major portion of this land is used for the cultivation of fresh fruits especially apples. President, Kashmir Fruit Growers and Dealers Association, Ghulam Rasool Bhat told Kashmir Times that, "The government should come up with a law for banning the use of horticulture land for any official purpose." He said that in Western countries, the government has already banned use of horticulture land for any official purposes, he said, adding similar ban should be imposed in Jammu Kashmir as well. "If steps are not taken, time will come when we will lose major portion of our orchards." How deep this connection between orchards and armed bases runs is evident from another source, this time a more subjective account. Which bears being read through right to the end. There are no Djinns in Anantnag, they don't scare us anymore’ http://bluekashmir.blogspot.com/ Uzma Mohsin Originally published in the Personal Histories section of the Tehelka weekly; July 28, 2007 issue. I thank Uzma Mohsin for the sketch. "...Relations between the townspeople and the army were tense. Early each morning, as the town came alive with the azaans from its many mosques, the army would switch on huge loudspeakers on three sides of the hill, and Hindi songs and bhajans would blare out of them for hours on end. It was some kind of a unilateral, undeclared war; we all lived in terror of the day this war would come down the slopes in heavy muddy boots and trample on us like ants. It stopped only in the late 90s, when I left Kashmir at age 16. THE TOWN had become very gloomy — by six in the evening, the streets wore a deserted look. Lights were kept low, curtains were always drawn. People made guesses about the origins of distant gunshots. Scary stories for children no longer had any tasrupdars, djinns or haputs in them — there was no need for them, they didn’t scare us any more. Only the snow surprised us when, after a perfectly clear day, we would wake up to find bright snow covering everything open to the sky. In the distance, the snow-covered hill would merge with the whiteness of the surrounding town, and become almost invisible. These were perhaps the only happy moments for me at that time. One apple season, many years later, we found the courage to go up the hill to pick apples. A new, utterly strange city had sprung to life on the flat plateau. It was such a contrast to the choked, dying town below. There was an elaborate army infrastructure, with its own buildings, streets, armoured vehicles and helicopters. There were families living there, families of army men. There were many shops too. Not many people in the town knew what was going on here, for it was happening on the hill’s invisible side. To our dismay, we found many orchards had been torn down; our best apple trees were dying for want of care. The army, we heard, was planning to build an airstrip there. Years later, when I came to study in a northern Indian university, I realised that the army city on the hill that overlooked my town had a peculiarly North Indian town feel to it. I have been living away from home for the last nine years, as have so many of my other childhood friends. I hear stories from my parents about the killings and injuries of some friends who stayed behind..." I could go on. But this has been a long enough post already. In the end, we need to look a little less at questions of faith and a little more at questions of land, and here we need to look at the question of what happened to the land left behind by Kashmiri Pandits, just as much as anything else. Some of this land was of course appropriated by greedy neighbours, some of it is in the occupation of the armed forces, which pay paltry rent (if they pay) and some of it is cared for by diligent neigbours who wait for the return of those who left. We need to realize that when it comes to the alienation of land, we touch one of the most emotive chords there can be, and this is in the end about Kashmir, but it is about something much bigger than Kashmir. It is about connivance and corporate greed, wherever it occurs. In a recent report by Sravan Sukla from Kushinagar in Uttar Pradesh in the Tehelka of 9 August 2008, the correspondent draws a sadly familiar picture of arbitrary state action by the BSP government in Uttar Pradesh to arbitrarily grab land for a complex to host a grandiose statue of the Maitreya Buddha (the ostentation of which would have made the Buddha weep, not smile). Will Buddha Smile over Ryots Tears http://www.tehelka.org/story_main40.asp? filename=Ne090808willbuddha_smile.asp It is interesting to read a quote from this article - "Among others, around a hundred Dalit families have been affected by the land acquisition. Interestingly, a Dalit farmer is leading the agitation against Mayawati. Forty-five year old Govardhan Gond, a semi-literate Dalit farmer and president of the Bhoomi Bachao Sangharsh Samiti, says that “there is no question of surrendering our land so long as we are alive”. “I will slit their throats if they come to take possession of my land. It is my only source of livelihood,” declares Kamli Devi of Siswa village. A forty-year-old mother of six, she is leading a band of woman farmers against the acquisition to save her 50 bighas of land. Apart from the land, about 400 houses, half a dozen schools, including the area’s only graduate institution, the Radha Krishna Inter College, a canal and about a dozen link roads are also falling prey to the acquisition. “Where will our children study after these schools have been closed,” asks Dasai Gond of Dumri village. Significantly, a few Buddhist monks are also lending silent support to the farmers’ cause. “The government should try to refrain from displacing poor farmers for the project. Buddhism is based on non- violence and it does not allow causing pain to anyone. A project based on the woes of farmers will haunt us in future,” rues B. Gyaneshwar, the sangh nayak, or head, of the All-India Buddhist Monk Association." It would have been equally interesting had those who are leading the agitation for the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board and their sympathisers displayed even a fraction of the sensitivity that has been deplayed by the head of the All India Buddhist Monk Association when it comes to the acquisition of land for apparently religious purposes. Then, they (the partisans of the SASS agitation) would have matched the restraint and neighbourly feelings displayed by their Kashmiri counterparts towards the Amarnath pilgrims who have time and again stated that their fight is not against pilgrims or Hindus but against the move to acquire land. In fact, this year has had a record number of pilgrims travel to Amarnath, both by new and old routes, and the pilgrimage has continued, peacefully. Thank you all for the opportunity for this clarification, and apologies for what has been an overlong post, regards Shuddha From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 21:55:50 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:55:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> Message-ID: <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> Dear R.Chaudhuri, Thanks for your reply. I never told you to only read these old newspapers again (that is if you have really read them at the first place); I just asked all in a humble way to think with a different perspective for a change. I'll narrate something to you on this; which I got to know from someone on this episode. A few days back a senior official of Food Cooperation of India called up his J&K Counterpart to verify on this media hype of "Economic Blockade". The person from the other side said, "Yes sir, Economic Blockade hai". FCI official asked, "How come?". How can you say that?". The man further replied "Jenab, har kahin shor hai ki economic blockade hai" This is what has happened. It is a cry over something, which never really happened. Later, a journalist friend from Delhi called up many Traders in Delhi's Aazad Pur Mandi, asking about the same. The Traders said that all trucks were coming; and it was a season of brisk business. Army on the other hand has ensured that all trucks to Kashmir valley ply safely; but on the other hand Jammu city and neighboring areas have been totally cut off with supplies for almost 40 days. I bet you never had a thought about it. I request you to personally visit the Lakhanpur - Jammu - Srinagar Highway and see what the ground reality is. It is just too amusing to see posts and also those few people, screaming on news channels about unavailability of "Baby Milk, Food, etc etc". They have stooped really low this time around to gain publicity and world sympathy. A perfect PR Strategy. I can't believe that farmers + orchard owners in the valley are poor. Not only because I belong to the valley and know the worth of these multi-crore orchards; because I've interacted with few of them. On the second part of your post; let me tell you that the President of Jammu Resident Doctors Association is a Muslim named Dr. Arshad. And, he was the one who gave a call for full support to the Sanghash Samiti. Need I say more ? I'm sure even by mistake you must have caught images of people jumping into the Tawi river as a mark of protest (innovative indeed!). It wasn't just your RSS/BJP. Those people were led by Sikhs and majority of people were Gujjars+Muslims and of course Hindus; holding the tricolor high in the air; and also a symbol of Lord Shiva - The Trishul. Its again unfortunate for people who accuse Hindus of having arms (Trishuls). I think they high time need to study history of religions. Isn't AK47 which was used by Terrorist Yasin Malik to kill Hindus and of course even his own people; a weapon? Jammu has been the best example of Hindu-Muslim-Sikh unity in these 46 days of protest. Unfortunately, in Kashmir we see communal slogans; Hindu Truckers and at times even Amaranth Pilgrims being attacked. Not to say, disinformation campaign is in its peak. Now, people can better judge; who adds fuel into the fire.... Regards Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar, > > > Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And apologies in > advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not interested > in the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. > > > It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, > (without making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your responses have > given me an opportunity to make some necessary elaborations. > > > First of all, let me categorically state that Sonia, by pointing towards > the violence that farmers faced in Greater Noida yesterday, and by referring > to the histories of the Narmada agitation, and the Nandigram issue has > helped me clarify some of my own thinking. > > > This process of clarification does not require me to revise what I had > written in relation to the current climate in the state of Jammu & Kashmir, > on the contrary, it actually allows me to extend and develop my argument. I > will come to this later, but first, there are some other issues that I need > to deal with. > > > When I had referred to the two kinds of treatment meted out to two > different kinds of protest, I had not in fact thought in 'Hindu' and > 'Muslim' terms, and after reading Sonia's response, I re-read my post > carefully to see if there was any suggestion that I was referring to a > difference in the state's response that could be attributed to the religious > composition of the two different protesting crowds. I did not find the words > 'Hindu' or 'Muslim' anywhere in my post. And while I do agree with Soina > that when Jammu and Kashmir Police personnel open fire on protesting crowds > in the Kashmir valley, what we witness is nominally 'Muslim' policemen, > firing on nominally 'Muslim' protesters. The same Jammu and Kashmir police > personnel firing on protesters in Jammu are likely to be a mix of nominally > 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' personnel firing on a similarly mixed crowd of > protesters (if that is, we agree with the assertion that the SASS protests > have featured the participation of 'Jammu Muslims'). This fact may or may > not be true, but let us for the sake of the argument, assume that this is > so. > > > Similarly, the caste/identity composition of western UP policemen is not > likely to be very different from crowds of protesting western UP farmers in > the unhappy place that is Greater Noida. It is a well known fact that the > most brutal torture in the detention centres and interrogation centres in > the Kashmir valley is meted out by STF (Special Task Force) personnel > attatched to the state police. Almost invariably, these enforcers of the > sharp edge of the Indian states marks on Kashmiri bodies tend to be > Kashmiri, and Muslim. > > > One clarification here though, the bulk of firing in the Kashmir valley has > been undertaken by CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force) personnel, and the > bulk of public anger has been, in this case against, the CRPF bullets, and > CRPF sticks that smashed so many windows last night in downtown Srinagar. > Now, anyone who has been to Srinagar knows, that the scared and vulnerable > and aggressive faces that man CRPF bunkers are not Kashmiri. Their bodies > (more often than not) come from hotter places in the plains and plateaus of > the Indian hearland. And I see their deplyoment in a war zone like Kashmir > as unfortunate, as saddening > > > Sonia has referred to Kashmiri protesting crowds 'baying for blood' during > the last few days during the mass gatherings that took place on the road to > Muzaffarabad, and in Srinagar and other towns. I have been speaking to > friends in the Kashmir valley today, and they told me that the slogans that > were raised during the protests > > on the road to Muzaffarabad were as follows (in order of frequency) > > > 1. 'Hum Kya Chahtey, Azaadi' (What do we want, Freedom), The staple full > throated cry that rings out, and has rung out in most protests in the > Kashmir valley for the last two decades. > > > 2. 'Fruit to bahaana hai, Muzaffarabad jaana hai' (Fruit is an excuse, we > want to go to Muzaffarabad). This has been chanted, not by the truckers > carrying fruit, but by the accompanying marchers. > > > 3. 'Aadhi Roti Khayenge, Sar nahin Jhukayenge'. (We can eat half a piece of > bread, but won't bow our heads') > > > 3. 'Jeeve, Jeeve, Pakistan' (Long live, Long live, Pakistan) > > > Now, whatever these slognas may or may not imply, none of these slogans, > bayed for anyone's blood. Not only did the marchers refrain from raising any > slogans that can be construed as calls to violence, the 'separatist' > political leadership that had aligned itself with the mass protests also > repeatedly called for peaceful protests, using all available channels, > including those afforded to them by the mainstream media. I have seen the > Mirwaiz calling repeatedly for protests to be peaceful. If this leadership > had wanted to queer the pitch by asking for violence, I am sure it would > have been heeded by some sections in a very angry crowd. No such call was > made, and no policeman, or paramilitary force personnel were attacked. In > some instances, CRPF bunkers were torn down (and this happenned after the > incidents of firing) but the demobilization of offensive fortifications on > the street can be hardly called a violent act. In my book, it is an act of > disarming the infrastructure of occupation, without causing any injury or > violence to the occupiers themselves. > > > Once the bodies of people killed by the CRPF started to make themselves > visible in funeral processions, many young people started shouting 'Khoon ke > badle Khoon' (blood for blood). But this 'baying' if it can be called that, > occurred once blood had been spilt, and not, as I may point out, by the > bayers. > > > On the contrary, I have seen Dr. Praveen Togadia (who has endorsed the SASS > agitation in Jammu by calling mass protests in other cities in India) > declare on television 'agar maange nahin poori ki gayi to sangharsh aur bhi > ugra roop lega' ('if the demands are not met, the agitation will take on > even more extreme forms'). We have heard crowds in Jammu chant, 'Jaan denge, > par baba Amarnath ki Zamin vapas lenge' (we will give up our lives, but > will not give up on Baba Amarnath's land) and variations thereof. In fact, > two 'jaans/lives' have been tragically offered as suicides. For me, this is > just as shocking, just as violent, as any other kind of call to violence. > These crowds have set Gujjar huts on fire. And setting shepherds huts on > fire is not exactly the same thing as tearing down the sandbags of a CRPF > bunker. So any attempt at 'equating' the degree of violence in these two > instances needs to be read as disingenuous. > > > As for the fact that in one instance (in Jammu) the crowds carried the > Indian flag, and shouted pro-India slogans, and that in the other instance > (in Kashmir) the crowds carried Pakistani flags and that some (or many) > shouted pro-Pakistan slogans does not say anything about the violent > intentions or tenor of either of the two protesting crowds. > > > As someone who carries no brief, for any form of nationalism, (Indian, > Pakistani or Kashmiri) I am not willing to judge a crowd on the basis of > which kind of nationalism they choose to profess. What interests me is the > fact that given two crowds, with two different kinds of behaviour, one of > which carries an Indian flag, and another which carries a Pakistani flag, > black flags, or no flags at all - the Indian state chooses to fire on the > second crowd, even though the second crowd, which may be greater in numbers, > is not indicating that it is anything but a peaceful assembly of people > intent on going from 'A' to 'B'. That they choose not to go to 'C' (the > Srinagar-Leh-Manali road that Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on > which we can evaluate the merits or demerits of the state's decision to fire > into this amassed crowd. > > > Notwithstanding the multitude of links supplied by Aditya Raj Kaul in his > response to my posting. Facts, remain, facts. Three casualties of police > firing in one instance (in a very militant protest in Jammu) and now thirty > casualties (and likely to mount) in police and CRPF firing in the other > instance (in Kashmir) including instances where CRPF personnel fired on > ambulances ferrying the wounded to hospital, and inside hospitals. These > instances of violence against ambulances, the injured and doctors and nurses > attending to them must go down in the history of the Indian state as > examples of the very worst forms of state brutality. > > > For more details - see - > > > This needs to be seen also in the context of the fact that the opening of > the "Srinagar-Muzaffarabad' road is a long standing demand of several > sections of political opinion (not all of them separatist) and that in fact > predates the current troubles in the valley (from 1989) by several decades. > It needs also to be seen in the light of the fact that what the people on > the highways in the Kashmir valley were demanding had already been agreed to > in principle by the governments of India and Pakistan. If anything, the > current situation was an opportunity for the governments of the state of > Jammu and Kashmir (currently represented by the Governor, a representative > of the Union of India) and the Union of India to display a modicum of vision > and sagacity by opening the line of control, especially when the people of > the valley were voting with their feet, and their bodies for this to be > done. > > > Even those who wish the Indian state well in its continuing occupation of > the Kashmir valley would no doubt see this turn of events as a tragically > wasted opportunity. > > > Let me now turn to the second important question that has arisen from this > discussion. The question of what might enable us to think about the > situations of the Greater Noida farmers and the protesting masses in the > Kashmir valley (and elsewhere, in Nandigram, and in the Kashmir valley). > > > Sonia has pointed out in her posting that as far as the transfer of land > to the Amarnath Shrine Board is concerned, "Of the 100 acres in > > question, only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the rest is > > private property belonging to several locals." > > > If this is indeed the case, then the extent of the anger against the move > to effect a transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is all the more > understandable. (I do not doubt that it would be understandable even if this > were not the case, but that is another matter. ) > > > Land is a highly emotive issue in all parts of South Asia, and in many > parts of the world where it is tied to livelihood and to survival. The > desire to acquire land (usually with the mediation of the state) for > purposes other than those relevant to the livelihood and survival of the > customary owners, users and custodians of land is what gives the common > sharp edge to the question of the arbitrary acquisition of land by state or > state backed agencies, whether in Kashmir, or in the Narmada valley, or in > Nandigram is what is clearly evident. In Kashmir, (in the absence of any > other viable form of sustainable economic activity, barring tourism, land is > all that people can fall back on. And we need to remember that some of the > capital that the National Conference still falls back on when its naked > collusion with the occupation comes to the fore, is the vivid, yet fading > memory of land reforms in the early fifties. > > > So, then, what is the story about land, in the Kashmir valley. > > > "In 2003 Abdul Rashid, Member of Parliament was told in Rajya Sabha that > the army and the Central Para-Military Forces (CPMFs) have 41,594.767 acres > (332760 kanals) in J&K. This comes to about 170 sq kms for which records > exist. But an equal amount, if not more, is under illegal occupation, > according to The Economic Times [December 6, 2006]. The most recent figures > being circulated suggests that 6,81,839 kanals are under the armed forces' > possession. Of this 3,10,184 kanals is unauthorized possession. In Srinagar > officially, the defence establishment have 45,080 kanals of land located at > Badamibagh, Rangreth, Danodhar Karewa, Sharifabad, Tatoo and Militia > Grounds. In 2006, it has been reported that the Indian Army's Northern > Command has acquired 8000 kanals in Awantipora. There have also been reports > of Indian Air Force wanting land for a new air base in Mansbal and in the > same area 3Rashtriya Rifles (RR) has submitted a request to acquire nearly > 1500 kanals adjoining its garrison. Manasbal also highlights another feature > of this 'land grab'. Villagers complain that since the irrigation canal > passes through land which the 3RR wants, thousands of kanals of land would > be denied irrigation. So widespread is the concern in J&K over land under > security forces occupation that even the pro-Indian Peoples Democratic > Party, led by Mufti Mohammed Saeed, in a resolution adopted on February 11, > 2007 states "with distress… that over the last 15 years thousands of acres > of orchards and agricultural land have been acquired in the state > particularly in Kashmir Valley, districts of Rajouri, Poonch and Doda by the > Armed Forces." The resolution also says that "many institutional buildings > including hospitals and schools have been occupied by the armed forces." A > conservative estimate suggests that 35,000 ha of such land is under the > control of the Indian Army alone. > > > Take deployment in just one tehsil; Pattan in Baramulla, to appreciate its > significance. This tehsil has 92 villages. Amongst these 92 villages there > are 4 army brigade headquarters and 12 checkposts. Pattan plus Babateng also > hosts camps of Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), Border Security Force > (BSF) and Special Operations Group (SOG). There are three police stations > in the tehsil; at Pattan, Mirgund and Kreeri. Each check post has anywhere > between 100-150 soldiers although there are few which have much larger > numbers in excess of 300. Thus roughly a cluster of nine villages come under > one check post. And one brigade is available for operations covering 23 > villages whereas one police station caters to 30-31 villages. Thus all > movement to and from the village to fields, market, town is monitored and > accompanied by regular patrolling. Thus, the margin for normal human > 'errors', such as stepping out for a smoke after dark, or a stroll can > result in death. On top of this, the extent of deployment of troops and the > land under their occupation acts as a brake on people's own capacity to > propel growth. It also results in difficulties in getting easy access to > markets for commodity export because of delay in transportation due to > security drills, slowdown on highways because of military convoys carrying > troops, material and weaponry etc, and relatively higher fuel and labour > costs due to all this." > > > Were this land to be freed of occupation it would contribute immensely to > increasing agricultural/fruit production and generation of revenue and cut > back on net outflow from J&K. > > > If this is true (and the statement recorded in the minutes of the Rajya > Sabha do have official sanction) then, the armed forces and paramilitaries > of the Indian state, together occupied 41,594.767 acres, and since the > majority of force deployment in J&K is in the Kashmir valley, then the > majority of this land would logically be seen to lie in the Kashmir valley. > > > The net area under fruit cultivation in the State of J&K is 174,000 ha are > under fresh fruits (orchards). 174,000 ha is equal to 4,29,963 acres. If we > compare this figure against the reliable estimate of land under direct > occupation my armed forces of the Indian state (41,594.767 acres) we get the > following figures. The armed forces occupy land that is roughly equivalent > to what would amount to 10 % of the land under fruit cultivation. In crude > terms, one in every ten orchards is not an orchard, it is a fortress. > > > All figures are sourced from the Fifth Economic Census [published by the > Central Statistical Organisation together with Directorate of Economics and > Statistics J&K, 2005] and Economic Survey 2006-07 for Jammu & Kashmir (ES > 2006-07) [The Directorate of Economics and Statistics, Government of Jammu > and Kashmir, 2007]as cited in 'Understanding the J&K Economy' by Gautam > Navlakha, Kashmir Affairs, Volume 2, No.2, April-June 2007 > > http://www.kashmiraffairs.org > > Gautam_Navlakha_understanding_J&K_economy.html > > > [And before anyone jumps on me for citing a source that comes by way of > Gautam Navlakha, let me state that Navlakha may not have read the > Rajtarangini with great care, but he certainly does take the time to read > the Economic Survey 2006-2007 for J&K, and other official documents with a > certain degree of care. And the figures under question here are not his > opinions, but notes in these same official documents.] > > > In a situation of direct occupation of a resource as precious as land in > Kashmir, the arbitrary decision to appropriate even just 100 more acres of > land by an unrepresentative body (the office of the governor) for whatever > purpose cannot but be seen as a deliberate affront to a population stretched > to the very limits of its patience by the violence of a continuing > occupation. I fail to see, why the anger of fruit growers, denied markets, > smarting under the knowledge that their orchards have in many cases been > taken over by the Indian state, should look upon any act of land acquisition > with kindness. > > > Look for instance at a news item in the Kashmir Times of Friday, April 18, > 2008 > > > Rental hikes by Army may adversely affect fruit production in Jammu and > kashmir > > With fruit production in Kashmir static, the Kashmiri growers have asked > the state and central government not to acquire horticulture land for any > official purposes. They are also not satisfied with recent rent hike by the > defence ministry. > > > The growers fear that acquiring of the horticulture land for official > purposes will reduce the fruit production in the state. Jammu and Kashmir is > the only state in India that has around 2.75 lakh hectares of land under the > horticulture.The major portion of this land is used for the cultivation of > fresh fruits especially apples. > > > President, Kashmir Fruit Growers and Dealers Association, Ghulam Rasool > Bhat told Kashmir Times that, "The government should come up with a law for > banning the use of horticulture land for any official purpose." He said that > in Western countries, the government has already banned use of horticulture > land for any official purposes, he said, adding similar ban should be > imposed in Jammu Kashmir as well. "If steps are not taken, time will come > when we will lose major portion of our orchards." > > > How deep this connection between orchards and armed bases runs is evident > from another source, this time a more subjective account. Which bears being > read through right to the end. > > > There are no Djinns in Anantnag, they don't scare us anymore' > > http://bluekashmir.blogspot.com/ > > Uzma Mohsin > > Originally published in the Personal Histories section of the Tehelka > weekly; July 28, 2007 issue. I thank Uzma Mohsin for the sketch. > > > "...Relations between the townspeople and the army were tense. Early each > morning, as the town came alive with the azaans from its many mosques, the > army would switch on huge loudspeakers on three sides of the hill, and Hindi > songs and bhajans would blare out of them for hours on end. It was some kind > of a unilateral, undeclared war; we all lived in terror of the day this war > would come down the slopes in heavy muddy boots and trample on us like ants. > It stopped only in the late 90s, when I left Kashmir at age 16. > > > THE TOWN had become very gloomy — by six in the evening, the streets wore a > deserted look. Lights were kept low, curtains were always drawn. People made > guesses about the origins of distant gunshots. Scary stories for children no > longer had any tasrupdars, djinns or haputs in them — there was no need for > them, they didn't scare us any more. Only the snow surprised us when, after > a perfectly clear day, we would wake up to find bright snow covering > everything open to the sky. In the distance, the snow-covered hill would > merge with the whiteness of the surrounding town, and become almost > invisible. These were perhaps the only happy moments for me at that time. > > > One apple season, many years later, we found the courage to go up the hill > to pick apples. A new, utterly strange city had sprung to life on the flat > plateau. It was such a contrast to the choked, dying town below. There was > an elaborate army infrastructure, with its own buildings, streets, armoured > vehicles and helicopters. There were families living there, families of army > men. There were many shops too. Not many people in the town knew what was > going on here, for it was happening on the hill's invisible side. > > > To our dismay, we found many orchards had been torn down; our best apple > trees were dying for want of care. The army, we heard, was planning to build > an airstrip there. Years later, when I came to study in a northern Indian > university, I realised that the army city on the hill that overlooked my > town had a peculiarly North Indian town feel to it. I have been living away > from home for the last nine years, as have so many of my other childhood > friends. I hear stories from my parents about the killings and injuries of > some friends who stayed behind..." > > > I could go on. But this has been a long enough post already. In the end, we > need to look a little less at questions of faith and a little more at > questions of land, and here we need to look at the question of what happened > to the land left behind by Kashmiri Pandits, just as much as anything else. > Some of this land was of course appropriated by greedy neighbours, some of > it is in the occupation of the armed forces, which pay paltry rent (if they > pay) and some of it is cared for by diligent neigbours who wait for the > return of those who left. > > > We need to realize that when it comes to the alienation of land, we touch > one of the most emotive chords there can be, and this is in the end about > Kashmir, but it is about something much bigger than Kashmir. It is about > connivance and corporate greed, wherever it occurs. > > > In a recent report by Sravan Sukla from Kushinagar in Uttar Pradesh in the > Tehelka of 9 August 2008, the correspondent draws a sadly familiar picture > of arbitrary state action by the BSP government in Uttar Pradesh to > arbitrarily grab land for a complex to host a grandiose statue of the > Maitreya Buddha (the ostentation of which would have made the Buddha weep, > not smile). > > > Will Buddha Smile over Ryots Tears > > > http://www.tehelka.org/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808willbuddha_smile.asp > > > It is interesting to read a quote from this article - > > > "Among others, around a hundred Dalit families have been affected by the > land acquisition. Interestingly, a Dalit farmer is leading the agitation > against Mayawati. Forty-five year old Govardhan Gond, a semi-literate Dalit > farmer and president of the Bhoomi Bachao Sangharsh Samiti, says that "there > is no question of > > surrendering our land so long as we are alive". > > > "I will slit their throats if they come to take possession of my land. It > is my only source of livelihood," declares Kamli Devi of Siswa village. A > forty-year-old mother of six, she is leading a band of woman farmers against > the acquisition to save her 50 bighas of land. > > > Apart from the land, about 400 houses, half a dozen schools, including the > area's only graduate institution, the Radha Krishna Inter College, a canal > and about a dozen link roads are also falling prey to the acquisition. > "Where will our children study after these schools have been closed," asks > Dasai Gond of Dumri village. > > > Significantly, a few Buddhist monks are also lending silent support to the > farmers' cause. "The government should try to refrain from displacing poor > farmers for the project. Buddhism is based on non-violence and it does not > allow causing pain to anyone. A project based on the woes of farmers will > haunt us in future," rues B. Gyaneshwar, the sangh nayak, or head, of the > All-India Buddhist Monk Association." > > > It would have been equally interesting had those who are leading the > agitation for the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board and their > sympathisers displayed even a fraction of the sensitivity that has been > deplayed by the head of the All India Buddhist Monk Association when it > comes to the acquisition of land for apparently religious purposes. > > > Then, they (the partisans of the SASS agitation) would have matched the > restraint and neighbourly feelings displayed by their Kashmiri counterparts > towards the Amarnath pilgrims who have time and again stated that their > fight is not against pilgrims or Hindus but against the move to acquire > land. > > > In fact, this year has had a record number of pilgrims travel to Amarnath, > both by new and old routes, and the pilgrimage has continued, peacefully. > > > Thank you all for the opportunity for this clarification, and apologies for > what has been an overlong post, > > > regards > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 15 22:09:31 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 22:09:31 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <544ACA72-B0B1-4E70-AA07-2E7A548088F3@sarai.net> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Thanks again for what must be a super prompt response. If this was a buzzer round in a quiz show you would be a champion. :) By the way, I am curious, who is R. Chaudhuri? regards, I remain,( always ready to think with as many different perspectives as is necessary in a given situation) Shuddha On 15-Aug-08, at 9:55 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Dear R.Chaudhuri, > > > > Thanks for your reply. I never told you to only read these old > newspapers > again (that is if you have really read them at the first place); I > just > asked all in a humble way to think with a different perspective for a > change. > > > > I'll narrate something to you on this; which I got to know from > someone > on this episode. A few days back a senior official of Food > Cooperation of > India called up his J&K Counterpart to verify on this media hype of > "Economic Blockade". The person from the other side said, "Yes sir, > Economic > Blockade hai". FCI official asked, "How come?". How can you say > that?". The > man further replied "Jenab, har kahin shor hai ki economic blockade > hai" > > > > This is what has happened. It is a cry over something, which never > really happened. Later, a journalist friend from Delhi called up many > Traders in Delhi's Aazad Pur Mandi, asking about the same. The > Traders said > that all trucks were coming; and it was a season of brisk business. > > > > Army on the other hand has ensured that all trucks to Kashmir > valley ply > safely; but on the other hand Jammu city and neighboring areas have > been > totally cut off with supplies for almost 40 days. I bet you never > had a > thought about it. I request you to personally visit the Lakhanpur - > Jammu - > Srinagar Highway and see what the ground reality is. It is just too > amusing > to see posts and also those few people, screaming on news channels > about > unavailability of "Baby Milk, Food, etc etc". They have stooped > really low > this time around to gain publicity and world sympathy. A perfect PR > Strategy. > > > > I can't believe that farmers + orchard owners in the valley are > poor. Not > only because I belong to the valley and know the worth of these > multi-crore > orchards; because I've interacted with few of them. > > > > On the second part of your post; let me tell you that the President > of Jammu > Resident Doctors Association is a Muslim named Dr. Arshad. And, he > was the > one who gave a call for full support to the Sanghash Samiti. Need I > say more > ? > > > > I'm sure even by mistake you must have caught images of people > jumping into > the Tawi river as a mark of protest (innovative indeed!). It wasn't > just > your RSS/BJP. Those people were led by Sikhs and majority of people > were > Gujjars+Muslims and of course Hindus; holding the tricolor high in > the air; > and also a symbol of Lord Shiva - The Trishul. Its again > unfortunate for > people who accuse Hindus of having arms (Trishuls). I think they > high time > need to study history of religions. Isn't AK47 which was used by > Terrorist > Yasin Malik to kill Hindus and of course even his own people; a > weapon? > > > > Jammu has been the best example of Hindu-Muslim-Sikh unity in these > 46 days > of protest. Unfortunately, in Kashmir we see communal slogans; Hindu > Truckers and at times even Amaranth Pilgrims being attacked. Not to > say, > disinformation campaign is in its peak. > > > > Now, people can better judge; who adds fuel into the fire.... > > > > Regards > Aditya Raj Kaul > > On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: >> >> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar, >> >> >> Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And >> apologies in >> advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not >> interested >> in the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. >> >> >> It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, >> (without making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your >> responses have >> given me an opportunity to make some necessary elaborations. >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 22:13:06 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 22:13:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808150943h226f29c4lacd7c035ef1fced9@mail.gmail.com> I apologise. Mr. R. Chaudhri had written me a personal mail on this same post from Sarai; my response by mistake was posted into the group. Shuddha, Thanks. I don't want to be a buzzer round champ. But, if only you could try and understand and read more of Jammu perspective and for a minute forget RSS/BJP/VHP and at the same time forget your readings and quotes from the articles of Gautam Navlakha, Murtaza Shibli, Muzamil Jaleel and Umar. Just a small correction for you. There have been till now almost 10 deaths in Jammu and its outskirts. 2 of them have been suicides. Hundreds have been injured due to the firing and tear gas shells. Thanks Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, > > > Thanks again for what must be a super prompt response. If this was a buzzer > round in a quiz show you would be a champion. :) > > By the way, I am curious, who is R. Chaudhuri? > > > regards, I remain,( always ready to think with as many different > perspectives as is necessary in a given situation) > > > Shuddha > > > On 15-Aug-08, at 9:55 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > Dear R.Chaudhuri, > > > > > Thanks for your reply. I never told you to only read these old newspapers > > again (that is if you have really read them at the first place); I just > > asked all in a humble way to think with a different perspective for a > > change. > > > > > I'll narrate something to you on this; which I got to know from someone > > on this episode. A few days back a senior official of Food Cooperation of > > India called up his J&K Counterpart to verify on this media hype of > > "Economic Blockade". The person from the other side said, "Yes sir, > Economic > > Blockade hai". FCI official asked, "How come?". How can you say that?". The > > man further replied "Jenab, har kahin shor hai ki economic blockade hai" > > > > > This is what has happened. It is a cry over something, which never > > really happened. Later, a journalist friend from Delhi called up many > > Traders in Delhi's Aazad Pur Mandi, asking about the same. The Traders said > > that all trucks were coming; and it was a season of brisk business. > > > > > Army on the other hand has ensured that all trucks to Kashmir valley ply > > safely; but on the other hand Jammu city and neighboring areas have been > > totally cut off with supplies for almost 40 days. I bet you never had a > > thought about it. I request you to personally visit the Lakhanpur - Jammu - > > Srinagar Highway and see what the ground reality is. It is just too amusing > > to see posts and also those few people, screaming on news channels about > > unavailability of "Baby Milk, Food, etc etc". They have stooped really low > > this time around to gain publicity and world sympathy. A perfect PR > > Strategy. > > > > > I can't believe that farmers + orchard owners in the valley are poor. Not > > only because I belong to the valley and know the worth of these multi-crore > > orchards; because I've interacted with few of them. > > > > > On the second part of your post; let me tell you that the President of > Jammu > > Resident Doctors Association is a Muslim named Dr. Arshad. And, he was the > > one who gave a call for full support to the Sanghash Samiti. Need I say > more > > ? > > > > > I'm sure even by mistake you must have caught images of people jumping into > > the Tawi river as a mark of protest (innovative indeed!). It wasn't just > > your RSS/BJP. Those people were led by Sikhs and majority of people were > > Gujjars+Muslims and of course Hindus; holding the tricolor high in the air; > > and also a symbol of Lord Shiva - The Trishul. Its again unfortunate for > > people who accuse Hindus of having arms (Trishuls). I think they high time > > need to study history of religions. Isn't AK47 which was used by Terrorist > > Yasin Malik to kill Hindus and of course even his own people; a weapon? > > > > > Jammu has been the best example of Hindu-Muslim-Sikh unity in these 46 days > > of protest. Unfortunately, in Kashmir we see communal slogans; Hindu > > Truckers and at times even Amaranth Pilgrims being attacked. Not to say, > > disinformation campaign is in its peak. > > > > > Now, people can better judge; who adds fuel into the fire.... > > > > > Regards > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar, > > > > Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And apologies in > > advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not interested > > in the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. > > > > It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, > > (without making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your responses have > > given me an opportunity to make some necessary elaborations. > > > > First of all, let me categorically state that Sonia, by pointing towards > > the violence that farmers faced in Greater Noida yesterday, and by > referring > > to the histories of the Narmada agitation, and the Nandigram issue has > > helped me clarify some of my own thinking. > > > > This process of clarification does not require me to revise what I had > > written in relation to the current climate in the state of Jammu & Kashmir, > > on the contrary, it actually allows me to extend and develop my argument. I > > will come to this later, but first, there are some other issues that I need > > to deal with. > > > > When I had referred to the two kinds of treatment meted out to two > > different kinds of protest, I had not in fact thought in 'Hindu' and > > 'Muslim' terms, and after reading Sonia's response, I re-read my post > > carefully to see if there was any suggestion that I was referring to a > > difference in the state's response that could be attributed to the > religious > > composition of the two different protesting crowds. I did not find the > words > > 'Hindu' or 'Muslim' anywhere in my post. And while I do agree with Soina > > that when Jammu and Kashmir Police personnel open fire on protesting crowds > > in the Kashmir valley, what we witness is nominally 'Muslim' policemen, > > firing on nominally 'Muslim' protesters. The same Jammu and Kashmir police > > personnel firing on protesters in Jammu are likely to be a mix of nominally > > 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' personnel firing on a similarly mixed crowd of > > protesters (if that is, we agree with the assertion that the SASS protests > > have featured the participation of 'Jammu Muslims'). This fact may or may > > not be true, but let us for the sake of the argument, assume that this is > > so. > > > > Similarly, the caste/identity composition of western UP policemen is not > > likely to be very different from crowds of protesting western UP farmers in > > the unhappy place that is Greater Noida. It is a well known fact that the > > most brutal torture in the detention centres and interrogation centres in > > the Kashmir valley is meted out by STF (Special Task Force) personnel > > attatched to the state police. Almost invariably, these enforcers of the > > sharp edge of the Indian states marks on Kashmiri bodies tend to be > > Kashmiri, and Muslim. > > > > One clarification here though, the bulk of firing in the Kashmir valley has > > been undertaken by CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force) personnel, and the > > bulk of public anger has been, in this case against, the CRPF bullets, and > > CRPF sticks that smashed so many windows last night in downtown Srinagar. > > Now, anyone who has been to Srinagar knows, that the scared and vulnerable > > and aggressive faces that man CRPF bunkers are not Kashmiri. Their bodies > > (more often than not) come from hotter places in the plains and plateaus of > > the Indian hearland. And I see their deplyoment in a war zone like Kashmir > > as unfortunate, as saddening > > > > Sonia has referred to Kashmiri protesting crowds 'baying for blood' during > > the last few days during the mass gatherings that took place on the road to > > Muzaffarabad, and in Srinagar and other towns. I have been speaking to > > friends in the Kashmir valley today, and they told me that the slogans that > > were raised during the protests > > > on the road to Muzaffarabad were as follows (in order of frequency) > > > > 1. 'Hum Kya Chahtey, Azaadi' (What do we want, Freedom), The staple full > > throated cry that rings out, and has rung out in most protests in the > > Kashmir valley for the last two decades. > > > > 2. 'Fruit to bahaana hai, Muzaffarabad jaana hai' (Fruit is an excuse, we > > want to go to Muzaffarabad). This has been chanted, not by the truckers > > carrying fruit, but by the accompanying marchers. > > > > 3. 'Aadhi Roti Khayenge, Sar nahin Jhukayenge'. (We can eat half a piece of > > bread, but won't bow our heads') > > > > 3. 'Jeeve, Jeeve, Pakistan' (Long live, Long live, Pakistan) > > > > Now, whatever these slognas may or may not imply, none of these slogans, > > bayed for anyone's blood. Not only did the marchers refrain from raising > any > > slogans that can be construed as calls to violence, the 'separatist' > > political leadership that had aligned itself with the mass protests also > > repeatedly called for peaceful protests, using all available channels, > > including those afforded to them by the mainstream media. I have seen the > > Mirwaiz calling repeatedly for protests to be peaceful. If this leadership > > had wanted to queer the pitch by asking for violence, I am sure it would > > have been heeded by some sections in a very angry crowd. No such call was > > made, and no policeman, or paramilitary force personnel were attacked. In > > some instances, CRPF bunkers were torn down (and this happenned after the > > incidents of firing) but the demobilization of offensive fortifications on > > the street can be hardly called a violent act. In my book, it is an act of > > disarming the infrastructure of occupation, without causing any injury or > > violence to the occupiers themselves. > > > > Once the bodies of people killed by the CRPF started to make themselves > > visible in funeral processions, many young people started shouting 'Khoon > ke > > badle Khoon' (blood for blood). But this 'baying' if it can be called that, > > occurred once blood had been spilt, and not, as I may point out, by the > > bayers. > > > > On the contrary, I have seen Dr. Praveen Togadia (who has endorsed the SASS > > agitation in Jammu by calling mass protests in other cities in India) > > declare on television 'agar maange nahin poori ki gayi to sangharsh aur bhi > > ugra roop lega' ('if the demands are not met, the agitation will take on > > even more extreme forms'). We have heard crowds in Jammu chant, 'Jaan > denge, > > par baba Amarnath ki Zamin vapas lenge' (we will give up our lives, but > > will not give up on Baba Amarnath's land) and variations thereof. In fact, > > two 'jaans/lives' have been tragically offered as suicides. For me, this is > > just as shocking, just as violent, as any other kind of call to violence. > > These crowds have set Gujjar huts on fire. And setting shepherds huts on > > fire is not exactly the same thing as tearing down the sandbags of a CRPF > > bunker. So any attempt at 'equating' the degree of violence in these two > > instances needs to be read as disingenuous. > > > > As for the fact that in one instance (in Jammu) the crowds carried the > > Indian flag, and shouted pro-India slogans, and that in the other instance > > (in Kashmir) the crowds carried Pakistani flags and that some (or many) > > shouted pro-Pakistan slogans does not say anything about the violent > > intentions or tenor of either of the two protesting crowds. > > > > As someone who carries no brief, for any form of nationalism, (Indian, > > Pakistani or Kashmiri) I am not willing to judge a crowd on the basis of > > which kind of nationalism they choose to profess. What interests me is the > > fact that given two crowds, with two different kinds of behaviour, one of > > which carries an Indian flag, and another which carries a Pakistani flag, > > black flags, or no flags at all - the Indian state chooses to fire on the > > second crowd, even though the second crowd, which may be greater in > numbers, > > is not indicating that it is anything but a peaceful assembly of people > > intent on going from 'A' to 'B'. That they choose not to go to 'C' (the > > Srinagar-Leh-Manali road that Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on > > which we can evaluate the merits or demerits of the state's decision to > fire > > into this amassed crowd. > > > > Notwithstanding the multitude of links supplied by Aditya Raj Kaul in his > > response to my posting. Facts, remain, facts. Three casualties of police > > firing in one instance (in a very militant protest in Jammu) and now thirty > > casualties (and likely to mount) in police and CRPF firing in the other > > instance (in Kashmir) including instances where CRPF personnel fired on > > ambulances ferrying the wounded to hospital, and inside hospitals. These > > instances of violence against ambulances, the injured and doctors and > nurses > > attending to them must go down in the history of the Indian state as > > examples of the very worst forms of state brutality. > > > > For more details - see - > > > > This needs to be seen also in the context of the fact that the opening of > > the "Srinagar-Muzaffarabad' road is a long standing demand of several > > sections of political opinion (not all of them separatist) and that in fact > > predates the current troubles in the valley (from 1989) by several decades. > > It needs also to be seen in the light of the fact that what the people on > > the highways in the Kashmir valley were demanding had already been agreed > to > > in principle by the governments of India and Pakistan. If anything, the > > current situation was an opportunity for the governments of the state of > > Jammu and Kashmir (currently represented by the Governor, a representative > > of the Union of India) and the Union of India to display a modicum of > vision > > and sagacity by opening the line of control, especially when the people of > > the valley were voting with their feet, and their bodies for this to be > > done. > > > > Even those who wish the Indian state well in its continuing occupation of > > the Kashmir valley would no doubt see this turn of events as a tragically > > wasted opportunity. > > > > Let me now turn to the second important question that has arisen from this > > discussion. The question of what might enable us to think about the > > situations of the Greater Noida farmers and the protesting masses in the > > Kashmir valley (and elsewhere, in Nandigram, and in the Kashmir valley). > > > > Sonia has pointed out in her posting that as far as the transfer of land > > to the Amarnath Shrine Board is concerned, "Of the 100 acres in > > > question, only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the rest is > > > private property belonging to several locals." > > > > If this is indeed the case, then the extent of the anger against the move > > to effect a transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is all the more > > understandable. (I do not doubt that it would be understandable even if > this > > were not the case, but that is another matter. ) > > > > Land is a highly emotive issue in all parts of South Asia, and in many > > parts of the world where it is tied to livelihood and to survival. The > > desire to acquire land (usually with the mediation of the state) for > > purposes other than those relevant to the livelihood and survival of the > > customary owners, users and custodians of land is what gives the common > > sharp edge to the question of the arbitrary acquisition of land by state or > > state backed agencies, whether in Kashmir, or in the Narmada valley, or in > > Nandigram is what is clearly evident. In Kashmir, (in the absence of any > > other viable form of sustainable economic activity, barring tourism, land > is > > all that people can fall back on. And we need to remember that some of the > > capital that the National Conference still falls back on when its naked > > collusion with the occupation comes to the fore, is the vivid, yet fading > > memory of land reforms in the early fifties. > > > > So, then, what is the story about land, in the Kashmir valley. > > > > "In 2003 Abdul Rashid, Member of Parliament was told in Rajya Sabha that > > the army and the Central Para-Military Forces (CPMFs) have 41,594.767 acres > > (332760 kanals) in J&K. This comes to about 170 sq kms for which records > > exist. But an equal amount, if not more, is under illegal occupation, > > according to The Economic Times [December 6, 2006]. The most recent figures > > being circulated suggests that 6,81,839 kanals are under the armed forces' > > possession. Of this 3,10,184 kanals is unauthorized possession. In Srinagar > > officially, the defence establishment have 45,080 kanals of land located at > > Badamibagh, Rangreth, Danodhar Karewa, Sharifabad, Tatoo and Militia > > Grounds. In 2006, it has been reported that the Indian Army's Northern > > Command has acquired 8000 kanals in Awantipora. There have also been > reports > > of Indian Air Force wanting land for a new air base in Mansbal and in the > > same area 3Rashtriya Rifles (RR) has submitted a request to acquire nearly > > 1500 kanals adjoining its garrison. Manasbal also highlights another > feature > > of this 'land grab'. Villagers complain that since the irrigation canal > > passes through land which the 3RR wants, thousands of kanals of land would > > be denied irrigation. So widespread is the concern in J&K over land under > > security forces occupation that even the pro-Indian Peoples Democratic > > Party, led by Mufti Mohammed Saeed, in a resolution adopted on February 11, > > 2007 states "with distress… that over the last 15 years thousands of acres > > of orchards and agricultural land have been acquired in the state > > particularly in Kashmir Valley, districts of Rajouri, Poonch and Doda by > the > > Armed Forces." The resolution also says that "many institutional buildings > > including hospitals and schools have been occupied by the armed forces." A > > conservative estimate suggests that 35,000 ha of such land is under the > > control of the Indian Army alone. > > > > Take deployment in just one tehsil; Pattan in Baramulla, to appreciate its > > significance. This tehsil has 92 villages. Amongst these 92 villages there > > are 4 army brigade headquarters and 12 checkposts. Pattan plus Babateng > also > > hosts camps of Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), Border Security Force > > (BSF) and Special Operations Group (SOG). There are three police stations > > in the tehsil; at Pattan, Mirgund and Kreeri. Each check post has anywhere > > between 100-150 soldiers although there are few which have much larger > > numbers in excess of 300. Thus roughly a cluster of nine villages come > under > > one check post. And one brigade is available for operations covering 23 > > villages whereas one police station caters to 30-31 villages. Thus all > > movement to and from the village to fields, market, town is monitored and > > accompanied by regular patrolling. Thus, the margin for normal human > > 'errors', such as stepping out for a smoke after dark, or a stroll can > > result in death. On top of this, the extent of deployment of troops and the > > land under their occupation acts as a brake on people's own capacity to > > propel growth. It also results in difficulties in getting easy access to > > markets for commodity export because of delay in transportation due to > > security drills, slowdown on highways because of military convoys carrying > > troops, material and weaponry etc, and relatively higher fuel and labour > > costs due to all this." > > > > Were this land to be freed of occupation it would contribute immensely to > > increasing agricultural/fruit production and generation of revenue and cut > > back on net outflow from J&K. > > > > If this is true (and the statement recorded in the minutes of the Rajya > > Sabha do have official sanction) then, the armed forces and paramilitaries > > of the Indian state, together occupied 41,594.767 acres, and since the > > majority of force deployment in J&K is in the Kashmir valley, then the > > majority of this land would logically be seen to lie in the Kashmir valley. > > > > The net area under fruit cultivation in the State of J&K is 174,000 ha are > > under fresh fruits (orchards). 174,000 ha is equal to 4,29,963 acres. If we > > compare this figure against the reliable estimate of land under direct > > occupation my armed forces of the Indian state (41,594.767 acres) we get > the > > following figures. The armed forces occupy land that is roughly equivalent > > to what would amount to 10 % of the land under fruit cultivation. In crude > > terms, one in every ten orchards is not an orchard, it is a fortress. > > > > All figures are sourced from the Fifth Economic Census [published by the > > Central Statistical Organisation together with Directorate of Economics and > > Statistics J&K, 2005] and Economic Survey 2006-07 for Jammu & Kashmir (ES > > 2006-07) [The Directorate of Economics and Statistics, Government of Jammu > > and Kashmir, 2007]as cited in 'Understanding the J&K Economy' by Gautam > > Navlakha, Kashmir Affairs, Volume 2, No.2, April-June 2007 > > > http://www.kashmiraffairs.org > > > Gautam_Navlakha_understanding_J&K_economy.html > > > > [And before anyone jumps on me for citing a source that comes by way of > > Gautam Navlakha, let me state that Navlakha may not have read the > > Rajtarangini with great care, but he certainly does take the time to read > > the Economic Survey 2006-2007 for J&K, and other official documents with a > > certain degree of care. And the figures under question here are not his > > opinions, but notes in these same official documents.] > > > > In a situation of direct occupation of a resource as precious as land in > > Kashmir, the arbitrary decision to appropriate even just 100 more acres of > > land by an unrepresentative body (the office of the governor) for whatever > > purpose cannot but be seen as a deliberate affront to a population > stretched > > to the very limits of its patience by the violence of a continuing > > occupation. I fail to see, why the anger of fruit growers, denied markets, > > smarting under the knowledge that their orchards have in many cases been > > taken over by the Indian state, should look upon any act of land > acquisition > > with kindness. > > > > Look for instance at a news item in the Kashmir Times of Friday, April 18, > > 2008 > > > > Rental hikes by Army may adversely affect fruit production in Jammu and > > kashmir > > > With fruit production in Kashmir static, the Kashmiri growers have asked > > the state and central government not to acquire horticulture land for any > > official purposes. They are also not satisfied with recent rent hike by the > > defence ministry. > > > > The growers fear that acquiring of the horticulture land for official > > purposes will reduce the fruit production in the state. Jammu and Kashmir > is > > the only state in India that has around 2.75 lakh hectares of land under > the > > horticulture.The major portion of this land is used for the cultivation of > > fresh fruits especially apples. > > > > President, Kashmir Fruit Growers and Dealers Association, Ghulam Rasool > > Bhat told Kashmir Times that, "The government should come up with a law for > > banning the use of horticulture land for any official purpose." He said > that > > in Western countries, the government has already banned use of horticulture > > land for any official purposes, he said, adding similar ban should be > > imposed in Jammu Kashmir as well. "If steps are not taken, time will come > > when we will lose major portion of our orchards." > > > > How deep this connection between orchards and armed bases runs is evident > > from another source, this time a more subjective account. Which bears being > > read through right to the end. > > > > There are no Djinns in Anantnag, they don't scare us anymore' > > > http://bluekashmir.blogspot.com/ > > > Uzma Mohsin > > > Originally published in the Personal Histories section of the Tehelka > > weekly; July 28, 2007 issue. I thank Uzma Mohsin for the sketch. > > > > "...Relations between the townspeople and the army were tense. Early each > > morning, as the town came alive with the azaans from its many mosques, the > > army would switch on huge loudspeakers on three sides of the hill, and > Hindi > > songs and bhajans would blare out of them for hours on end. It was some > kind > > of a unilateral, undeclared war; we all lived in terror of the day this war > > would come down the slopes in heavy muddy boots and trample on us like > ants. > > It stopped only in the late 90s, when I left Kashmir at age 16. > > > > THE TOWN had become very gloomy — by six in the evening, the streets wore a > > deserted look. Lights were kept low, curtains were always drawn. People > made > > guesses about the origins of distant gunshots. Scary stories for children > no > > longer had any tasrupdars, djinns or haputs in them — there was no need for > > them, they didn't scare us any more. Only the snow surprised us when, after > > a perfectly clear day, we would wake up to find bright snow covering > > everything open to the sky. In the distance, the snow-covered hill would > > merge with the whiteness of the surrounding town, and become almost > > invisible. These were perhaps the only happy moments for me at that time. > > > > One apple season, many years later, we found the courage to go up the hill > > to pick apples. A new, utterly strange city had sprung to life on the flat > > plateau. It was such a contrast to the choked, dying town below. There was > > an elaborate army infrastructure, with its own buildings, streets, armoured > > vehicles and helicopters. There were families living there, families of > army > > men. There were many shops too. Not many people in the town knew what was > > going on here, for it was happening on the hill's invisible side. > > > > To our dismay, we found many orchards had been torn down; our best apple > > trees were dying for want of care. The army, we heard, was planning to > build > > an airstrip there. Years later, when I came to study in a northern Indian > > university, I realised that the army city on the hill that overlooked my > > town had a peculiarly North Indian town feel to it. I have been living away > > from home for the last nine years, as have so many of my other childhood > > friends. I hear stories from my parents about the killings and injuries of > > some friends who stayed behind..." > > > > I could go on. But this has been a long enough post already. In the end, we > > need to look a little less at questions of faith and a little more at > > questions of land, and here we need to look at the question of what > happened > > to the land left behind by Kashmiri Pandits, just as much as anything else. > > Some of this land was of course appropriated by greedy neighbours, some of > > it is in the occupation of the armed forces, which pay paltry rent (if they > > pay) and some of it is cared for by diligent neigbours who wait for the > > return of those who left. > > > > We need to realize that when it comes to the alienation of land, we touch > > one of the most emotive chords there can be, and this is in the end about > > Kashmir, but it is about something much bigger than Kashmir. It is about > > connivance and corporate greed, wherever it occurs. > > > > In a recent report by Sravan Sukla from Kushinagar in Uttar Pradesh in the > > Tehelka of 9 August 2008, the correspondent draws a sadly familiar picture > > of arbitrary state action by the BSP government in Uttar Pradesh to > > arbitrarily grab land for a complex to host a grandiose statue of the > > Maitreya Buddha (the ostentation of which would have made the Buddha weep, > > not smile). > > > > Will Buddha Smile over Ryots Tears > > > > > http://www.tehelka.org/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808willbuddha_smile.asp > > > > It is interesting to read a quote from this article - > > > > "Among others, around a hundred Dalit families have been affected by the > > land acquisition. Interestingly, a Dalit farmer is leading the agitation > > against Mayawati. Forty-five year old Govardhan Gond, a semi-literate Dalit > > farmer and president of the Bhoomi Bachao Sangharsh Samiti, says that > "there > > is no question of > > > surrendering our land so long as we are alive". > > > > "I will slit their throats if they come to take possession of my land. It > > is my only source of livelihood," declares Kamli Devi of Siswa village. A > > forty-year-old mother of six, she is leading a band of woman farmers > against > > the acquisition to save her 50 bighas of land. > > > > Apart from the land, about 400 houses, half a dozen schools, including the > > area's only graduate institution, the Radha Krishna Inter College, a canal > > and about a dozen link roads are also falling prey to the acquisition. > > "Where will our children study after these schools have been closed," asks > > Dasai Gond of Dumri village. > > > > Significantly, a few Buddhist monks are also lending silent support to the > > farmers' cause. "The government should try to refrain from displacing poor > > farmers for the project. Buddhism is based on non-violence and it does not > > allow causing pain to anyone. A project based on the woes of farmers will > > haunt us in future," rues B. Gyaneshwar, the sangh nayak, or head, of the > > All-India Buddhist Monk Association." > > > > It would have been equally interesting had those who are leading the > > agitation for the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board and their > > sympathisers displayed even a fraction of the sensitivity that has been > > deplayed by the head of the All India Buddhist Monk Association when it > > comes to the acquisition of land for apparently religious purposes. > > > > Then, they (the partisans of the SASS agitation) would have matched the > > restraint and neighbourly feelings displayed by their Kashmiri counterparts > > towards the Amarnath pilgrims who have time and again stated that their > > fight is not against pilgrims or Hindus but against the move to acquire > > land. > > > > In fact, this year has had a record number of pilgrims travel to Amarnath, > > both by new and old routes, and the pilgrimage has continued, peacefully. > > > > Thank you all for the opportunity for this clarification, and apologies for > > what has been an overlong post, > > > > regards > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > > ... > > [Message clipped] From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Fri Aug 15 22:32:25 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 17:02:25 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] The Reality of Economic Blocade in Kashmir In-Reply-To: <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <147494.42633.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Trucker belies Govt claim on blockade FAHEEM ASLAM Srinagar, Aug 14: Blasting the government claims that there was no blockade to the Valley as trucks were moving freely along the highway from Srinagar to Lakhanpur, a truck from Jalandhar reached Srinagar after spending 19 days on the highway due to the blockade.  Here is the story: The truck No. (PB08-0997) left Jalandhar on July 25 after it was loaded with medical supplies to the SMHS hospital here.  The truck driver, Avtar Singh, said as the truck reached Lakhanpur, police stopped him from proceeding toward Jammu citing “attack by mobs on the highway” as the reason. “I spent three days and two nights at Lakhanpur. On the fourth day, police asked me to proceed during the night,” Singh told Greater Kashmir while unloading the supplies at the SMHS hospital on Thursday.  The truck was loaded with medical supplies including some vital drugs and surgical essentials.  “After leaving Lakhanpur, I was stopped again on the Samba-Udhampur highway on the ground that mobs were throwing petrol bombs along the road,” the visibly fatigued Singh said. “At this spot, we spent six days.”  Singh said he had to again spend four days at different places along the Srinagar-Jammu highway after the authorities didn’t permit him to proceed. “When we crossed the Banihal tunnel after 12 days, the police and Army officials on duty barred us from proceeding toward Sriangar and asked us to move back,” Avtar Singh said. “We moved 12 kms back from the tunnel and spent four more days there. But we got a message to move to Srinagar as the SMHS authorities had called some higher ups to ensure free movement of our truck.”  The ordeal for Singh, however, didn’t end here. “We were promised adequate security up to Srinagar, but the police party escorting us left us at Qazigund. We stopped there for a night,” Avtar said. “In the morning on Wednesday, I saw the Army convoy heading for Srinagar. I managed to put my vehicle in between the convoy and reached Srinagar. But I will never forget the ordeal.”  Avtar asserted that five to six trucks carrying medical supplies are still stranded on the highway. “The trucks carry medical supplies for SKIMS and Children Hospital,” he said. “But they are not able to proceed as the authorities are not allowing their movement towards Srinagar.” http://www.greaterkashmir.com/full_story.asp?Date=15_8_2008&ItemID=28&cat=1 Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 23:03:21 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 23:03:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808150423h834dc96g1a009cbe6c825840@mail.gmail.com> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808150423h834dc96g1a009cbe6c825840@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808151033s75983d3aw10f8013650b8171a@mail.gmail.com> Dear Inder, You seem to be as confused as your name here. Writing half-truths and acting blind to facts won't solve any situation. I wonder what you meant about Trishuls. You proved you don't have a "Thokurkuth" (small temple found in each Kashmiri Pandit household) at home. Anyways, that is your personal choice. You again are mistajen when you say there were no Kashmiris in the Shrine Board. There were atleast two and both women from Kashmir. I suggest you read a bit more about Amarnath history and also the recent fuss being created on a normal land transfer. Mind you. That land was not donated; it was and remains a right of the pilgrims and also the Kashmiri Hindus and Dogras equally. It is no ancestrol property of Omar Abdullah; as he shamelessly claimed in the Indian Parliament or for that matter any particular community. Number of casualties have been higher in Kashmir. Agreed. But, who should be blamed for it ? The so called Kashmiri leaders (Sepratists and PDP, NC). For they were the ones to instigate communal passion in the youth against Hindus and entire India. You can't just walk to the LoC and cross it. Its amusing the way you write Inder. Kashmir has always been a part of India and will remain an integral part of India always. Now, if a few people are not happy about it and don't want to remain in India; they can well apply and live outside. They are welcome to move out. Then, be it Muzafarabad or Zaharbad. Its so touching to see Muslims, Gujjars and Sikhs come along with all Hindus of Jammu in this movement for Amarnath Land. And, I know; its very uncomfortable for some vested interests in Kashmir and New Delhi to dijest this fact. A few in this post chain would understand what I mean. The reality is Jammu has been discriminated upon for almost 60 years now. Be it in Government, administration, KAS, etc etc. And, all that anger comes out now along with this movement... Today even I think of Sanjay Kak's "Jashn-e-Azadi". It for sure for was a successful failure on part of the director. How true did he depict the communal leaders of the valley. Never did he realise; it no less then 2 years the people of his movie would again act the same in reality. And, for long lasting peace in Kashmir; separatists need to be handled tough with. There is a lot of freedom given to them and they have started to misuse it. Hope you sometimes even think as a Kashmiri Pandit who faced the brunt of a forced exodus at the hands of Islamic Terrorists. Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/15/08, inder salim wrote: > > Dear all > > "of the grave situation in Jammu & Kashmiri" yes, dear Aditya, > the situation indeed is grave. > > it is unfortunate that killings happened in the drama of > land-transfer-no-transfer . whether people have been hit above or > below the belt, the no. of casualities is much higher in kashmir which > has proved the point which dear Shuddha rasided today on 15th of > august. > > why this happened ? Congress has always played games with vote bank > politics. They have indeed sired communal parties > in india. They shamelessly promoted dynasty rule as well. Narshimha > Rao almost taught BJP them how to hold trishul in their hands. > > In kashmir they were worse than that : they jailed Sheik , Mohd. > Abudllah, the most popular leader for no fault of his. Kashmir never > never wanted to be part of India, and out of that Indian bully > emerged article 370, which too was trampled time and again the past. > Now donating land to Amar Nath Shrine Board, which has no kashmiri in > it, would have equalled high way robbery. Now if jammu's hindu fails > to see the reason, how we can blame valley muslims for defending what > Indian constitution grants them in the first palce. > > I dont know if kashmiris want to be part of pakistan, but they > certainly dont want Indian pass ports for any identiy. Simple Gujjars > and Bakerwals and other poor people are too casual about the whole > issue, but those who live in affulent areas ensure that they too are > brought into such a mainstream. > > now every body knows what is 370. (trahath satath ) so they are > uninimous in their right to defend the historical truth which has > become their identity and fate even. > > Article 370 has also proved environmental friendly so far. Rich elites > from india would have purchased lot many mountains in kashmir for > their summer time holidays, and that has not happened, but it would be > unfortunate if kashmiris themselves construct hotels in Baltal for > greed. afterall shrine boards and other such boards make money for > their own good. > > today, I think of Sanjay kak's jashn-e-azadi, and the reason why it > was a sucess. > > For a long lasting peace in kashmir, india has to find a solution. > rest of it is too fragile... > > till then best > love > is > > > > > On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 10:20 AM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > Dear Shuddha, > > > > Your post only reflects how wrong you are in your entire assessment > r. I wonder why you could only see it from > > one perspective and rather chose to go with the direction of the wind. It > > shows your unfortunate tilt and inclination towards the anti-national and > > anti-India forces. You know what I mean. > > > > You obviously should have this understanding that things have been blown > out > > of proportion in some cases. Muzamel Jaleel covers Express from Srinagar; > I > > wonder how he knows so intricate details about Jammu. Surely, I cannot > trust > > his sources. His reporting in Express shows again his tilt towards state > > bashing and support to the fanatic separatists in Kashmir. He forgot that > it > > was a journalistic piece or news item and not his column where he could > go > > on with the same rhetoric. > > > > You really need to brush up with reading your daily Indian Express > complete. > > Maybe, the following few reports help you understand it better: > > > > 1. *Jammu Muslims back stir, but fear > > clashes* > > > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345557.html > > > > 2. *Two more die in firing, Jammu > > simmers* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/344765.html > > > > 3. *In some areas, Army faces 'Gandhigiri' from > > protestors* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345595.html > > > > 4. *One killed as Army fires at protestors, curfew > > defied* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345556.html > > > > 5. *Recall Vohra: Karan Singh*< > http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345182.html> > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345182.html > > > > 6. *PDP now opposes the transfer, but records show how it said the > > opposite* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/345063.html > > > > 7. *Jammu fires spread, Cong reaches out to BJP: help us defuse > > crisis* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/344371.html > > > > 8. *Centre stays away* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/tsearch/search.php?pg=9 > > > > 9. *Amarnath row: 13 injured, Army called > > in* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/343923.html > > > > 10. *Jammu burning* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/343523.html > > > > 11. *Blast targets migrants, 5 of a family die in > > J-K* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/340194.html > > > > 12. *Bid to attack Amarnath yatris foiled, 3 militants killed: > > police* > > Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/338647.html > > > > I just hope you read these news items too and not just your favourite > > Muzamel Jalil. > > > > It was a planned move to raise an issue such as "Economic Blockade" by > the > > separatists and hardline groups from the valley. I see a pattern here. As > > reports say, it was even backed by ISI. > > > > We all know, very well now that there was NO economic blockade. It was > just > > to gain publicity and to distract attention from the real issue of > Amarnath > > Land. > > > > Shuddha, You have a great ability to play with words. Though your crafty > > language won't gain much sympathy as it shows no logic. Food, Oil, Water, > > Baby Milk, medicine etc etc all are in good supply to th valley and > valley > > itself has great amount of stock to last almost 3 months. If there has > been > > urgency for some material; it has been airlifted; as on previous > occassions. > > > > > > Your comments are sick and can only make things worse. I don't undertsnad > > what your intentions are. You surely don't understand PEACE !!!! > > > > It was people in Jammu who were shot on head. See pictures for urself at > > www.thekashmir.wordpress.com/ While on the other hand, your Sheikh > Abdul > > Aziz a former Terrorist and now with Hurriyat was hit on the leg and he > lost > > his life due to blood loss. > > > > This disinformation campaign launched by Kashmir based sepratists, > fanatics, > > and 3 hardline funded newspapers and then supported by secular > apologists > > based in Delhi and elsewhere only make matters worse. > > > > The so called movement in Kashmir in complete fake and does not have > mandate > > of the people. By mere brainwashing people and instigating communal > > passions; one cannot achiece any goal. Moreover, a movement which began > with > > targetting the minority Hindu community, killing them and with communal > > slogans; cannot land up anywhere. > > > > As India celebrates 61 years of Independence, Kashmiri Hindus complete > yet > > another year in forced exile. Its been more than 18 years now. The night > of > > 19th Jan. 1990; still haunts in the minds of the victims. 50,000 thousand > of > > whom are still languishing in refugee camps in Jammu and its outskirts. > > > > And, then these limousine Communists say these protests in Jammu are by > > RSS/BJP/VHP. I wonder if they have travelled to Jammu themselves and seen > > the amount of anger in people. Do that and you will know what a people's > > movement is !!! Sitting in Ac rooms, dictating lectures on sarai, and > > sticking your finger to the latest laptop won't tell you much about the > > situation in Jammu. And, these are our modern communists.... > > > > The transfer of the 40 hectares of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board > > was the most logical, legal and ethical decision taken by the cabinet. > Why > > does this disturb the few sepratist elements in Kashmir who are hell bent > to > > communalise the situation ? It onlt goes on to show the religious and > > cultural intolerance in so called Kashmiri Muslim leaders. > > > > This Amarnath Land Row was as well a sinster game plan of the PDP; that > is > > evident from the above Indian Express reports which quotes all official > > documents. It was clear cut vote bank politics and to divide the > communities > > in this state of India. > > > > Omar Abdullah on the other hand gave a highly inflamatory statement in > the > > Parliament; not realising its consequenes. He did it without thinking too > > much, and just to attract attention of the media. Let me tell him, that > its > > not only the land of Kashmiri Muslims, its equally of Kashmiri Pandits. > And, > > we will fight till the very end to have it.... > > > > Its unfortunate that holding the Indian Flag high in Jammu is a crime to > > some here while holding a Pakistani Flag in Kashmir seems to be some kind > of > > symbol and some great work. I pity those people. > > > > Hope some sense prevails upon those minds who support these communal > forces > > in the valley without a second thought. They have sold their conscience. > Are > > you guys so cheap ? > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > >> > >> Dear all, > >> > >> (apologies for cross posting on Kafila) > >> > >> Anniversaries are good opportunities for reflection. I write this the > >> early hours of 15th August, 2008, the 61st anniversary of Indian > >> independence. > >> > >> The events of the past few months, and the past few days, in the > >> Indian adminsitered state of Jammu and Kashmir have demonstrated how > >> well and how equally (or not) the police, paramilitaries and armed > >> forces of the Indian Republic treat different kinds of protesting > >> crowds. The facts that I am about to discuss are good measures with > >> which to think about the relationship between acts of power, > >> different kinds of people, sovereignty, life and death in the Indian > >> nation state as it has evolved over the past 61 years. > >> > >> The region of Jammu in the province of Jammu and Kashmir has been > >> caught in the grip of a fierce agitation against the revocation of > >> the land transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board. We have all seen > >> footage of angry SASS (Shri Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti) activists > >> brandishing trishuls, setting up roadblocks and burning tyres, the > >> agitation has spread to different parts of India > >> > >> As of August 10, the following has taken place (in Jammu) > >> > >> "...* 18 cases have been registered in connection with communal > >> violence in which 20 persons were injured, 72 Kulas (hutments) of > >> Gujjars were burnt down, 22 vehicles damaged and several trucks > >> carrying supplies looted. "These are only reported incidents. Many > >> such incidents have taken place, which have not been reported so > >> far," the officers told the team. > >> > >> * 117 police personnel and 78 civilians were injured including two > >> policemen who were lynched and are "battling for life" in PGI > >> Chandigarh while six civilians were killed, including three in police > >> and Army action. > >> > >> * 129 cases were registered against the rioters. A total of 1171 > >> arrests were made but most of them are now out on bail. > >> > >> * 10, 513 protest demonstrations and 359 serious incidents of > >> violence have taken place across Jammu in which 28 government > >> buildings, 15 police vehicles and 118 private vehicles have been > >> damaged..." > >> > >> The information given above is quoted from - "Dangerous divide: Jammu > >> officials put it in black and white" > >> by Muzamil Jaleel, Indian Express, August 10, 2008. Muzamil Jaleel > >> culled this information from a briefing delivered by government > >> officials in the Jammu region to a visiting 'all party delegation' > >> http://www.indianexpress.com/story/346889.html > >> > >> As is clear, of the 6 reported deaths in the Jammu region, two are of > >> policemen, who were attacked by the pro Amarnath Land Transfer > >> agitationists. Two of these are suicides, both of whom have been > >> hailed as 'martyrs' by the Shree Amarnath Sangharsh Samiti activists. > >> Only two out of six deaths, in the past twenty or so days of > >> relentless and violent agitation, which included intimidation of > >> truckers on the Jammu Srinagar highway can be attributed to police or > >> paramilitary action. Each of these deaths is unfortunate and deserves > >> to be condemned. > >> > >> In two further and separate incidents, the VHP, BJP, Shiv Sena and > >> Sangh Parivar and allied organizations 'Chakka Jam' that paralysed > >> roads in major cities yesterday, two more people died, because they > >> could not reach hospitals on time. These two people were the > >> 'collateral damage' of the upsurge of patriotic sentiment displayed > >> by activists sympathetic to the SASS agitation in Jammu. > >> > >> On the other hand, in the part of the Kashmir valley administered and > >> occupied by India, in the past few days alone, in several instances > >> of firing on unarmed mobs, have led to the deaths of 29 people. Many > >> of these deaths occured when unarmed crowds tried to accompany trucks > >> carrying fruit (which had earlier been prevented from proceeding > >> towards markets on the Srinagar Jammu highway) towards Pakistan > >> Occupied Kashmir. Fruit growers in Indian administered Kashmir were > >> at the forefront of attempting to salvage precious stocks of produce > >> by taking to the 'Muzafarabad Road'. Apart from the 29 confirmed > >> dead, several more are in hospitals, injured in critical conditions, > >> and there lives are endangered by the fact that life saving medicines > >> are in short supply due to the economic blockade of the Kashmir > >> valley. trying to reach across the line of control to Pakistan > >> Occupied Kashmir. > >> > >> The difference in treatment of two different kinds of crowds is easy > >> to see. In one instance, more than twenty days of continuing, violent > >> agitation result in two deaths by police firing. In another instance, > >> less than a week's agitation results in 29 deaths. Clearly, the loss > >> of lives in the Kashmir valley does not amount to much in the > >> calculus of power. A rough arithmetic of sorts would indicate that a > >> comparison of two casualties (in Jammu) to twenty nine casualties (in > >> Kashmir) means that agitating Kashmiri lives are approximately fiteen > >> times less significant (or more expendable) than agitating Jammu > >> lives. The agitation in Jammu has harped often on how it is > >> discriminated against in comparison to Kashmir. In one sense at least > >> there is some truth in this charge. In the matter of the expenditure > >> of bullets by the Indian state, there is no comparison at all between > >> Jammu and Kashmir. When it comes to ammunition, way more bullets are > >> spent in Kashmir than is the case in Jammu. > >> > >> It is clear, that the Indian state's armed might does not confront > >> rampaging Jammu mobs if they hold the tricolour and shout nationalist > >> slogans, or slogans in favour of the Amarnath Shrine Board's desire > >> for land in the Kashmir Valley, even if they sometimes lynch > >> policemen. On the other hand, unarmed fruit growers and ordinary > >> people on the streets of the Kashmir valley are sitting targets for > >> trigger happy police, paramilitary and army personnel. Guns can be, > >> and are being aimed at their heads.Unlike Jammu, no policemen or > >> armed forces personnel have been killed, at least until now, in the > >> course of the fruit growers agitation in the Kashmir valley. > >> > >> As, independence day dawns, a clear pattern emerges. When push comes > >> to shove, the Indian state has no hesitation in expending its bullets > >> in some cases, and in showing exemplary restraint in others. Mowing > >> down crowds that hold the tricolour flag aloft doesn't look good on > >> TV. But, obviously, a little bloodletting in the streets of Srinagar > >> on the eve of Independence day is good for 'national' morale. > >> > >> Now, if, you were one of those who happens to be the kind of person > >> who the state seems to be willing to favour with a shower of bullets > >> at any given opportunity, would you be celebrating 'Independence > >> Day'? What would you be celebrating, - your freedom to fall to a > >> policeman's gun? > >> > >> No wonder they play national anthems with gun salutes. A hail of > >> bullets makes for the most fitting percussive accompaniment to > >> poignant displays of national pride in India today. > >> > >> > >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 23:11:09 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 23:11:09 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] The Reality of Economic Blocade in Kashmir In-Reply-To: <147494.42633.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> <147494.42633.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808151041i62b35748r314a9beb535cb721@mail.gmail.com> http://www.newspostonline.com/national/truck-drivers-nullify-claims-of-kashmir-valley-economic-blockade-200808141637 Truck drivers have nullified claims of an economic blockade in the Kashmir Valley, saying that traffic is moving smoothly on the Lakhanpur-Jammu-Srinagar National Highway. Traffic is also moving smoothly on the Jammu-Srinagar National Highway. Supplies of essential commodities are getting normalised in Jammu and Kashmir. The movement of apples from the Kashmir Valley to various markets across the country is also picking up, official sources claimed. The Srinagar-Jammu- Lakhanpur National Highway has been fully sanitized and round the clock traffic movement is being ensured. According to official sources, for the past 12 days over 9,000 trucks carrying fruit, merchandised medicine, petroleum products, LPG cylinders and other essential commodities have been transported from both sides. The truck drivers said that with the army personnel deployed on the highway, they were plying their vehicles fearlessly. "Now it is all fine, there is no blockade, we are not facing any problem and the traffic is running smoothly. There are army personnel and police deployed everywhere, they are helping us out. The Government has made all arrangement to make the situation normal," said Kulwant Singh, a truck driver. Among 2600 trucks that had entered the state during past four days, 1137 have arrived in the Valley. "Our trucks are plying normally, the trucks are coming in and going out of the state, there is no problem now," said Khushwant Singh, another truck driver. The State Government has taken many steps to instill confidence among the truck drivers and the locals in an attempt to restore normalcy. Efforts are being made to bring back peace to the region. Authorities said the markets across the country are eagerly waiting for their stock of Kashmiri apples. Meanwhile, truck drivers in national capital's wholesale fruit and vegetable market, Azadpur Mandi, said that the market is abuzz with activity and the deployment of army along the strategic highway is helping them. "Army personnel are deployed there and they are helping us a lot, even the police force is helping us," said Raju Rai Singh, a truck driver. Supplies to and from the state, especially the Kashmir valley were affected due to the protests and violence in Jammu region after the State Government revoked its order to transfer forestland to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board. (ANI) From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 00:11:21 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 00:11:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] IAKF Condemns Politicization of Amarnath Land Transfer Message-ID: <6353c690808151141n4371df6dt47e707b671bccb00@mail.gmail.com> *Indo-American Kashmir Forum Condemns Politicization of Amarnath Land Transfer* *WASHINGTON, Aug. 14 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ --* Indo-American Kashmir Forum (IAKF, www.iakf.org) convened an emergency board meeting to discuss its position and response to the evolving Amarnath crisis in the Indian state of Jammu and Kashmir. The Board reviewed the situation following the issuance and retraction of the State Government Order authorizing temporary transfer of land to build comfort facilities for Amarnath pilgrims. Over 400,000 Hindu pilgrims trek during two months of every summer to the holy Amarnath shrine, situated at over 12,000 ft. elevation in the Himalayan Mountain range in the predominantly Muslim region of Kashmir. As described in Kashmir's historical text *Rajatarangni*, the centuries-old shrine forms an important part of Hindu religious heritage and culture. Over the past twelve years, hundreds of pilgrims have died from snowfall and other natural hazards as well as terrorist attacks along the route. The New York Times article dated June 28, 2008 [*Land Transfer to Hindu Site Inflames Kashmir**'**s Muslims*] stated "In previous years, the pilgrims made tempting targets for militant Islamist separatists." The Board expressed its deep shock and sorrow at the loss of life in Kashmir and Jammu regions of the state resulting from a series of poor administrative decisions executed by the State government. IAKF is distressed in the manner the Central Government in New Delhi at first ignored mob politics by separatists and so-called pro-India political parties in Kashmir valley and the resulting backlash in Jammu. The minority Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) state government, before stepping down and paving the way for the Governor's rule, exercised poor judgment in rescinding a lawful cabinet decision on the land transfer by giving in to mob violence and threats, even though the land transfer approval had taken nearly four years of due diligence, and survived numerous legal challenges and official departmental reviews. IAKF believes in people's right to democracy and the rule of law. In the case of pilgrim facilities for the Amarnath shrine, it means those illegal and unilateral actions taken by authorities on July 1, 2008 must be rescinded. Legal decisions on the land transfer taken by the State Cabinet on May 20, 2008 and the subsequent Government Order issued on May 26, 2008 must be restored, both being consistent with the J&K State Assembly Act of 2000 and the J&K High Court decision of 2005 related to the holy Amarnath shrine. It is unfortunate to note that for nearly 48 days -- from June 23, 2008, when Kashmiri separatists led by Mirwaiz Umar Farooq met with both the Pakistani Prime Minister, Yousaf Raza Gillani, and the supreme commander of the United Jihad Council (UJC), Syed Salahuddin, in Islamabad (Pakistan), marking the start of street demonstrations in Srinagar, until August 9, 2008, when the All Party Indian Parliament Team visited Jammu to initiate a dialogue with Jammu protestors -- the government in New Delhi was indifferent towards the people of Jammu. IAKF recently organized a rally in downtown Boston, Massachusetts (USA) to show support for the right of all pilgrims, regardless of their faith, to be provided with safe and clean facilities en route to their place of worship, including the Amarnath Shrine in Kashmir. Dozens of Americans of Kashmiri origin were joined by others affected by the distressful news from J&K, holding placards and attracting a large audience of onlookers. IAKF also condemned the role of certain Kashmiri separatist and pseudo-secularist politicians from the valley who have inflamed the public with rumors and misleading statements. IAKF believes the present situation would not be as grave had the J&K Government and the Central government in New Delhi acted with wisdom and foresight. IAKF was established in 1991 to inform the world community of the oppression against Kashmiri Pandits that led to their forced exile from Kashmir due to the influx of fundamentalist Islamic terrorism. IAKF wishes to raise awareness of the human rights violations suffered by the Pandit community, many of whom are still living in makeshift "refugee" camps in Jammu, India. The organization seeks the return of Kashmiri Pandits to the Kashmir valley with guaranteed security and freedom to exercise their religious faith and cultural way of life without fear or intrusion. IAKF provides reports to the U.S. Administration, U.S. Congress, and several of Washington D.C.'s policy think tanks. For more information, please visit www.iakf.org. Link - http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/indo-american-kashmir-forum-condemns-politicization-of-amarnath-land-transfer,506439.shtml From ambarien at gmail.com Thu Aug 14 16:12:42 2008 From: ambarien at gmail.com (ambarien al qadar) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 16:12:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Four Women and a Room: Telecast Message-ID: <5ea7953c0808140342o492edfc9o666aa1bab9f7dbdf@mail.gmail.com> Hi. (Apologies for cross posting) Please watch my film Four Women and a Room (28 min, 42 min, DVCAM, English, Hindi, India) on Saturday, August 16 at 9 am on DD-1. (The 42 min version of the film will premier shortly at The Open Frame Film Festival, New Delhi, September 12th-22nd.) Director: Ambarien Al Qadar Producer: The Public Service Broadcasting Trust Camera: Shakeb Ahmed Sound: Girjashanker Vohra Additional location sound: Balbir Singh Rawat Editing: Ambarien Al Qadar and Anil Jr. Executive Producer: Shakeb Ahmed About the film: Four Women and a Room is a film about the fragmented associations of four women with the Labour Room. Late into pregnancy, Mili is confounded with the unknown. Having gone through endless rituals of matchmaking, Latika is wondering about her desire to be a biological mother. The dreamscape of the filmmaker throws up images and associations of a hospital visited sometime back and reminds her of meeting the fourth woman; a fictitious character; who might have undergone a sex selective abortion. The film raises critical questions about debates around the falling sex ratios and biological motherhood while making a strong case for the agency of women. About the filmmaker: Ambarien has a degree in Mass Communication from The Anwar Jamal Kidwai Mass Communication Research Center. She has assisted on features and documentaries and worked in films like Khamosh Pani and The City Beautiful. Her first independent documentary, Elsewhere, won the Best Documentary Award at the 0110 Digital Film Festival, Mumbai 2005. Four Women and a Room is her second film. Currently, she teaches Video and TV Production at the A.J.K. Mass Communication Research Center, Jamia Millia Islamia. Contact info: ambarien at gmail.com, ambarien at yahoo.co.uk 9810946273. cheers Ambarien Al Qadar From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 15 22:03:26 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 22:03:26 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> References: <6D6F08A3-03BD-4A20-896D-D07BDDF29F8E@sarai.net> <6353c690808142150n5970c3ebr4cc3dfb5d6be8d57@mail.gmail.com> <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <6353c690808150925n6207e19bw89824d3dbbbc1251@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Thanks again for what must be a super prompt response. If this was a buzzer round in a quiz show you would be a champion. :) By the way, I am curious, who is R. Chaudhuri? regards, I remain,( always ready to think with as many different perspectives as is necessary in a given situation) Shuddha On 15-Aug-08, at 9:55 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Dear R.Chaudhuri, > > > > Thanks for your reply. I never told you to only read these old > newspapers > again (that is if you have really read them at the first place); I > just > asked all in a humble way to think with a different perspective for a > change. > > > > I'll narrate something to you on this; which I got to know from > someone > on this episode. A few days back a senior official of Food > Cooperation of > India called up his J&K Counterpart to verify on this media hype of > "Economic Blockade". The person from the other side said, "Yes sir, > Economic > Blockade hai". FCI official asked, "How come?". How can you say > that?". The > man further replied "Jenab, har kahin shor hai ki economic blockade > hai" > > > > This is what has happened. It is a cry over something, which never > really happened. Later, a journalist friend from Delhi called up many > Traders in Delhi's Aazad Pur Mandi, asking about the same. The > Traders said > that all trucks were coming; and it was a season of brisk business. > > > > Army on the other hand has ensured that all trucks to Kashmir > valley ply > safely; but on the other hand Jammu city and neighboring areas have > been > totally cut off with supplies for almost 40 days. I bet you never > had a > thought about it. I request you to personally visit the Lakhanpur - > Jammu - > Srinagar Highway and see what the ground reality is. It is just too > amusing > to see posts and also those few people, screaming on news channels > about > unavailability of "Baby Milk, Food, etc etc". They have stooped > really low > this time around to gain publicity and world sympathy. A perfect PR > Strategy. > > > > I can't believe that farmers + orchard owners in the valley are > poor. Not > only because I belong to the valley and know the worth of these > multi-crore > orchards; because I've interacted with few of them. > > > > On the second part of your post; let me tell you that the President > of Jammu > Resident Doctors Association is a Muslim named Dr. Arshad. And, he > was the > one who gave a call for full support to the Sanghash Samiti. Need I > say more > ? > > > > I'm sure even by mistake you must have caught images of people > jumping into > the Tawi river as a mark of protest (innovative indeed!). It wasn't > just > your RSS/BJP. Those people were led by Sikhs and majority of people > were > Gujjars+Muslims and of course Hindus; holding the tricolor high in > the air; > and also a symbol of Lord Shiva - The Trishul. Its again > unfortunate for > people who accuse Hindus of having arms (Trishuls). I think they > high time > need to study history of religions. Isn't AK47 which was used by > Terrorist > Yasin Malik to kill Hindus and of course even his own people; a > weapon? > > > > Jammu has been the best example of Hindu-Muslim-Sikh unity in these > 46 days > of protest. Unfortunately, in Kashmir we see communal slogans; Hindu > Truckers and at times even Amaranth Pilgrims being attacked. Not to > say, > disinformation campaign is in its peak. > > > > Now, people can better judge; who adds fuel into the fire.... > > > > Regards > Aditya Raj Kaul > > On 8/15/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: >> >> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar, >> >> >> Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And >> apologies in >> advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not >> interested >> in the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. >> >> >> It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, >> (without making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your >> responses have >> given me an opportunity to make some necessary elaborations. >> >> >> First of all, let me categorically state that Sonia, by pointing >> towards >> the violence that farmers faced in Greater Noida yesterday, and by >> referring >> to the histories of the Narmada agitation, and the Nandigram issue >> has >> helped me clarify some of my own thinking. >> >> >> This process of clarification does not require me to revise what I >> had >> written in relation to the current climate in the state of Jammu & >> Kashmir, >> on the contrary, it actually allows me to extend and develop my >> argument. I >> will come to this later, but first, there are some other issues >> that I need >> to deal with. >> >> >> When I had referred to the two kinds of treatment meted out to two >> different kinds of protest, I had not in fact thought in 'Hindu' and >> 'Muslim' terms, and after reading Sonia's response, I re-read my post >> carefully to see if there was any suggestion that I was referring >> to a >> difference in the state's response that could be attributed to the >> religious >> composition of the two different protesting crowds. I did not find >> the words >> 'Hindu' or 'Muslim' anywhere in my post. And while I do agree with >> Soina >> that when Jammu and Kashmir Police personnel open fire on >> protesting crowds >> in the Kashmir valley, what we witness is nominally 'Muslim' >> policemen, >> firing on nominally 'Muslim' protesters. The same Jammu and >> Kashmir police >> personnel firing on protesters in Jammu are likely to be a mix of >> nominally >> 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' personnel firing on a similarly mixed crowd of >> protesters (if that is, we agree with the assertion that the SASS >> protests >> have featured the participation of 'Jammu Muslims'). This fact may >> or may >> not be true, but let us for the sake of the argument, assume that >> this is >> so. >> >> >> Similarly, the caste/identity composition of western UP policemen >> is not >> likely to be very different from crowds of protesting western UP >> farmers in >> the unhappy place that is Greater Noida. It is a well known fact >> that the >> most brutal torture in the detention centres and interrogation >> centres in >> the Kashmir valley is meted out by STF (Special Task Force) personnel >> attatched to the state police. Almost invariably, these enforcers >> of the >> sharp edge of the Indian states marks on Kashmiri bodies tend to be >> Kashmiri, and Muslim. >> >> >> One clarification here though, the bulk of firing in the Kashmir >> valley has >> been undertaken by CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force) personnel, >> and the >> bulk of public anger has been, in this case against, the CRPF >> bullets, and >> CRPF sticks that smashed so many windows last night in downtown >> Srinagar. >> Now, anyone who has been to Srinagar knows, that the scared and >> vulnerable >> and aggressive faces that man CRPF bunkers are not Kashmiri. Their >> bodies >> (more often than not) come from hotter places in the plains and >> plateaus of >> the Indian hearland. And I see their deplyoment in a war zone like >> Kashmir >> as unfortunate, as saddening >> >> >> Sonia has referred to Kashmiri protesting crowds 'baying for >> blood' during >> the last few days during the mass gatherings that took place on >> the road to >> Muzaffarabad, and in Srinagar and other towns. I have been >> speaking to >> friends in the Kashmir valley today, and they told me that the >> slogans that >> were raised during the protests >> >> on the road to Muzaffarabad were as follows (in order of frequency) >> >> >> 1. 'Hum Kya Chahtey, Azaadi' (What do we want, Freedom), The >> staple full >> throated cry that rings out, and has rung out in most protests in the >> Kashmir valley for the last two decades. >> >> >> 2. 'Fruit to bahaana hai, Muzaffarabad jaana hai' (Fruit is an >> excuse, we >> want to go to Muzaffarabad). This has been chanted, not by the >> truckers >> carrying fruit, but by the accompanying marchers. >> >> >> 3. 'Aadhi Roti Khayenge, Sar nahin Jhukayenge'. (We can eat half a >> piece of >> bread, but won't bow our heads') >> >> >> 3. 'Jeeve, Jeeve, Pakistan' (Long live, Long live, Pakistan) >> >> >> Now, whatever these slognas may or may not imply, none of these >> slogans, >> bayed for anyone's blood. Not only did the marchers refrain from >> raising any >> slogans that can be construed as calls to violence, the 'separatist' >> political leadership that had aligned itself with the mass >> protests also >> repeatedly called for peaceful protests, using all available >> channels, >> including those afforded to them by the mainstream media. I have >> seen the >> Mirwaiz calling repeatedly for protests to be peaceful. If this >> leadership >> had wanted to queer the pitch by asking for violence, I am sure it >> would >> have been heeded by some sections in a very angry crowd. No such >> call was >> made, and no policeman, or paramilitary force personnel were >> attacked. In >> some instances, CRPF bunkers were torn down (and this happenned >> after the >> incidents of firing) but the demobilization of offensive >> fortifications on >> the street can be hardly called a violent act. In my book, it is >> an act of >> disarming the infrastructure of occupation, without causing any >> injury or >> violence to the occupiers themselves. >> >> >> Once the bodies of people killed by the CRPF started to make >> themselves >> visible in funeral processions, many young people started shouting >> 'Khoon ke >> badle Khoon' (blood for blood). But this 'baying' if it can be >> called that, >> occurred once blood had been spilt, and not, as I may point out, >> by the >> bayers. >> >> >> On the contrary, I have seen Dr. Praveen Togadia (who has endorsed >> the SASS >> agitation in Jammu by calling mass protests in other cities in India) >> declare on television 'agar maange nahin poori ki gayi to >> sangharsh aur bhi >> ugra roop lega' ('if the demands are not met, the agitation will >> take on >> even more extreme forms'). We have heard crowds in Jammu chant, >> 'Jaan denge, >> par baba Amarnath ki Zamin vapas lenge' (we will give up our >> lives, but >> will not give up on Baba Amarnath's land) and variations thereof. >> In fact, >> two 'jaans/lives' have been tragically offered as suicides. For >> me, this is >> just as shocking, just as violent, as any other kind of call to >> violence. >> These crowds have set Gujjar huts on fire. And setting shepherds >> huts on >> fire is not exactly the same thing as tearing down the sandbags of >> a CRPF >> bunker. So any attempt at 'equating' the degree of violence in >> these two >> instances needs to be read as disingenuous. >> >> >> As for the fact that in one instance (in Jammu) the crowds carried >> the >> Indian flag, and shouted pro-India slogans, and that in the other >> instance >> (in Kashmir) the crowds carried Pakistani flags and that some (or >> many) >> shouted pro-Pakistan slogans does not say anything about the violent >> intentions or tenor of either of the two protesting crowds. >> >> >> As someone who carries no brief, for any form of nationalism, >> (Indian, >> Pakistani or Kashmiri) I am not willing to judge a crowd on the >> basis of >> which kind of nationalism they choose to profess. What interests >> me is the >> fact that given two crowds, with two different kinds of behaviour, >> one of >> which carries an Indian flag, and another which carries a >> Pakistani flag, >> black flags, or no flags at all - the Indian state chooses to fire >> on the >> second crowd, even though the second crowd, which may be greater >> in numbers, >> is not indicating that it is anything but a peaceful assembly of >> people >> intent on going from 'A' to 'B'. That they choose not to go to >> 'C' (the >> Srinagar-Leh-Manali road that Sonia refers to) cannot be a >> criterion on >> which we can evaluate the merits or demerits of the state's >> decision to fire >> into this amassed crowd. >> >> >> Notwithstanding the multitude of links supplied by Aditya Raj Kaul >> in his >> response to my posting. Facts, remain, facts. Three casualties of >> police >> firing in one instance (in a very militant protest in Jammu) and >> now thirty >> casualties (and likely to mount) in police and CRPF firing in the >> other >> instance (in Kashmir) including instances where CRPF personnel >> fired on >> ambulances ferrying the wounded to hospital, and inside hospitals. >> These >> instances of violence against ambulances, the injured and doctors >> and nurses >> attending to them must go down in the history of the Indian state as >> examples of the very worst forms of state brutality. >> >> >> For more details - see - >> >> >> This needs to be seen also in the context of the fact that the >> opening of >> the "Srinagar-Muzaffarabad' road is a long standing demand of several >> sections of political opinion (not all of them separatist) and >> that in fact >> predates the current troubles in the valley (from 1989) by several >> decades. >> It needs also to be seen in the light of the fact that what the >> people on >> the highways in the Kashmir valley were demanding had already been >> agreed to >> in principle by the governments of India and Pakistan. If >> anything, the >> current situation was an opportunity for the governments of the >> state of >> Jammu and Kashmir (currently represented by the Governor, a >> representative >> of the Union of India) and the Union of India to display a modicum >> of vision >> and sagacity by opening the line of control, especially when the >> people of >> the valley were voting with their feet, and their bodies for this >> to be >> done. >> >> >> Even those who wish the Indian state well in its continuing >> occupation of >> the Kashmir valley would no doubt see this turn of events as a >> tragically >> wasted opportunity. >> >> >> Let me now turn to the second important question that has arisen >> from this >> discussion. The question of what might enable us to think about the >> situations of the Greater Noida farmers and the protesting masses >> in the >> Kashmir valley (and elsewhere, in Nandigram, and in the Kashmir >> valley). >> >> >> Sonia has pointed out in her posting that as far as the transfer >> of land >> to the Amarnath Shrine Board is concerned, "Of the 100 acres in >> >> question, only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the >> rest is >> >> private property belonging to several locals." >> >> >> If this is indeed the case, then the extent of the anger against >> the move >> to effect a transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is all >> the more >> understandable. (I do not doubt that it would be understandable >> even if this >> were not the case, but that is another matter. ) >> >> >> Land is a highly emotive issue in all parts of South Asia, and in >> many >> parts of the world where it is tied to livelihood and to survival. >> The >> desire to acquire land (usually with the mediation of the state) for >> purposes other than those relevant to the livelihood and survival >> of the >> customary owners, users and custodians of land is what gives the >> common >> sharp edge to the question of the arbitrary acquisition of land by >> state or >> state backed agencies, whether in Kashmir, or in the Narmada >> valley, or in >> Nandigram is what is clearly evident. In Kashmir, (in the absence >> of any >> other viable form of sustainable economic activity, barring >> tourism, land is >> all that people can fall back on. And we need to remember that >> some of the >> capital that the National Conference still falls back on when its >> naked >> collusion with the occupation comes to the fore, is the vivid, yet >> fading >> memory of land reforms in the early fifties. >> >> >> So, then, what is the story about land, in the Kashmir valley. >> >> >> "In 2003 Abdul Rashid, Member of Parliament was told in Rajya >> Sabha that >> the army and the Central Para-Military Forces (CPMFs) have >> 41,594.767 acres >> (332760 kanals) in J&K. This comes to about 170 sq kms for which >> records >> exist. But an equal amount, if not more, is under illegal occupation, >> according to The Economic Times [December 6, 2006]. The most >> recent figures >> being circulated suggests that 6,81,839 kanals are under the armed >> forces' >> possession. Of this 3,10,184 kanals is unauthorized possession. In >> Srinagar >> officially, the defence establishment have 45,080 kanals of land >> located at >> Badamibagh, Rangreth, Danodhar Karewa, Sharifabad, Tatoo and Militia >> Grounds. In 2006, it has been reported that the Indian Army's >> Northern >> Command has acquired 8000 kanals in Awantipora. There have also >> been reports >> of Indian Air Force wanting land for a new air base in Mansbal and >> in the >> same area 3Rashtriya Rifles (RR) has submitted a request to >> acquire nearly >> 1500 kanals adjoining its garrison. Manasbal also highlights >> another feature >> of this 'land grab'. Villagers complain that since the irrigation >> canal >> passes through land which the 3RR wants, thousands of kanals of >> land would >> be denied irrigation. So widespread is the concern in J&K over >> land under >> security forces occupation that even the pro-Indian Peoples >> Democratic >> Party, led by Mufti Mohammed Saeed, in a resolution adopted on >> February 11, >> 2007 states "with distress… that over the last 15 years thousands >> of acres >> of orchards and agricultural land have been acquired in the state >> particularly in Kashmir Valley, districts of Rajouri, Poonch and >> Doda by the >> Armed Forces." The resolution also says that "many institutional >> buildings >> including hospitals and schools have been occupied by the armed >> forces." A >> conservative estimate suggests that 35,000 ha of such land is >> under the >> control of the Indian Army alone. >> >> >> Take deployment in just one tehsil; Pattan in Baramulla, to >> appreciate its >> significance. This tehsil has 92 villages. Amongst these 92 >> villages there >> are 4 army brigade headquarters and 12 checkposts. Pattan plus >> Babateng also >> hosts camps of Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), Border >> Security Force >> (BSF) and Special Operations Group (SOG). There are three police >> stations >> in the tehsil; at Pattan, Mirgund and Kreeri. Each check post has >> anywhere >> between 100-150 soldiers although there are few which have much >> larger >> numbers in excess of 300. Thus roughly a cluster of nine villages >> come under >> one check post. And one brigade is available for operations >> covering 23 >> villages whereas one police station caters to 30-31 villages. Thus >> all >> movement to and from the village to fields, market, town is >> monitored and >> accompanied by regular patrolling. Thus, the margin for normal human >> 'errors', such as stepping out for a smoke after dark, or a stroll >> can >> result in death. On top of this, the extent of deployment of >> troops and the >> land under their occupation acts as a brake on people's own >> capacity to >> propel growth. It also results in difficulties in getting easy >> access to >> markets for commodity export because of delay in transportation >> due to >> security drills, slowdown on highways because of military convoys >> carrying >> troops, material and weaponry etc, and relatively higher fuel and >> labour >> costs due to all this." >> >> >> Were this land to be freed of occupation it would contribute >> immensely to >> increasing agricultural/fruit production and generation of revenue >> and cut >> back on net outflow from J&K. >> >> >> If this is true (and the statement recorded in the minutes of the >> Rajya >> Sabha do have official sanction) then, the armed forces and >> paramilitaries >> of the Indian state, together occupied 41,594.767 acres, and since >> the >> majority of force deployment in J&K is in the Kashmir valley, then >> the >> majority of this land would logically be seen to lie in the >> Kashmir valley. >> >> >> The net area under fruit cultivation in the State of J&K is >> 174,000 ha are >> under fresh fruits (orchards). 174,000 ha is equal to 4,29,963 >> acres. If we >> compare this figure against the reliable estimate of land under >> direct >> occupation my armed forces of the Indian state (41,594.767 acres) >> we get the >> following figures. The armed forces occupy land that is roughly >> equivalent >> to what would amount to 10 % of the land under fruit cultivation. >> In crude >> terms, one in every ten orchards is not an orchard, it is a fortress. >> >> >> All figures are sourced from the Fifth Economic Census [published >> by the >> Central Statistical Organisation together with Directorate of >> Economics and >> Statistics J&K, 2005] and Economic Survey 2006-07 for Jammu & >> Kashmir (ES >> 2006-07) [The Directorate of Economics and Statistics, Government >> of Jammu >> and Kashmir, 2007]as cited in 'Understanding the J&K Economy' by >> Gautam >> Navlakha, Kashmir Affairs, Volume 2, No.2, April-June 2007 >> >> http://www.kashmiraffairs.org >> >> Gautam_Navlakha_understanding_J&K_economy.html >> >> >> [And before anyone jumps on me for citing a source that comes by >> way of >> Gautam Navlakha, let me state that Navlakha may not have read the >> Rajtarangini with great care, but he certainly does take the time >> to read >> the Economic Survey 2006-2007 for J&K, and other official >> documents with a >> certain degree of care. And the figures under question here are >> not his >> opinions, but notes in these same official documents.] >> >> >> In a situation of direct occupation of a resource as precious as >> land in >> Kashmir, the arbitrary decision to appropriate even just 100 more >> acres of >> land by an unrepresentative body (the office of the governor) for >> whatever >> purpose cannot but be seen as a deliberate affront to a population >> stretched >> to the very limits of its patience by the violence of a continuing >> occupation. I fail to see, why the anger of fruit growers, denied >> markets, >> smarting under the knowledge that their orchards have in many >> cases been >> taken over by the Indian state, should look upon any act of land >> acquisition >> with kindness. >> >> >> Look for instance at a news item in the Kashmir Times of Friday, >> April 18, >> 2008 >> >> >> Rental hikes by Army may adversely affect fruit production in >> Jammu and >> kashmir >> >> With fruit production in Kashmir static, the Kashmiri growers have >> asked >> the state and central government not to acquire horticulture land >> for any >> official purposes. They are also not satisfied with recent rent >> hike by the >> defence ministry. >> >> >> The growers fear that acquiring of the horticulture land for official >> purposes will reduce the fruit production in the state. Jammu and >> Kashmir is >> the only state in India that has around 2.75 lakh hectares of land >> under the >> horticulture.The major portion of this land is used for the >> cultivation of >> fresh fruits especially apples. >> >> >> President, Kashmir Fruit Growers and Dealers Association, Ghulam >> Rasool >> Bhat told Kashmir Times that, "The government should come up with >> a law for >> banning the use of horticulture land for any official purpose." He >> said that >> in Western countries, the government has already banned use of >> horticulture >> land for any official purposes, he said, adding similar ban should be >> imposed in Jammu Kashmir as well. "If steps are not taken, time >> will come >> when we will lose major portion of our orchards." >> >> >> How deep this connection between orchards and armed bases runs is >> evident >> from another source, this time a more subjective account. Which >> bears being >> read through right to the end. >> >> >> There are no Djinns in Anantnag, they don't scare us anymore' >> >> http://bluekashmir.blogspot.com/ >> >> Uzma Mohsin >> >> Originally published in the Personal Histories section of the Tehelka >> weekly; July 28, 2007 issue. I thank Uzma Mohsin for the sketch. >> >> >> "...Relations between the townspeople and the army were tense. >> Early each >> morning, as the town came alive with the azaans from its many >> mosques, the >> army would switch on huge loudspeakers on three sides of the hill, >> and Hindi >> songs and bhajans would blare out of them for hours on end. It was >> some kind >> of a unilateral, undeclared war; we all lived in terror of the day >> this war >> would come down the slopes in heavy muddy boots and trample on us >> like ants. >> It stopped only in the late 90s, when I left Kashmir at age 16. >> >> >> THE TOWN had become very gloomy — by six in the evening, the >> streets wore a >> deserted look. Lights were kept low, curtains were always drawn. >> People made >> guesses about the origins of distant gunshots. Scary stories for >> children no >> longer had any tasrupdars, djinns or haputs in them — there was no >> need for >> them, they didn't scare us any more. Only the snow surprised us >> when, after >> a perfectly clear day, we would wake up to find bright snow covering >> everything open to the sky. In the distance, the snow-covered hill >> would >> merge with the whiteness of the surrounding town, and become almost >> invisible. These were perhaps the only happy moments for me at >> that time. >> >> >> One apple season, many years later, we found the courage to go up >> the hill >> to pick apples. A new, utterly strange city had sprung to life on >> the flat >> plateau. It was such a contrast to the choked, dying town below. >> There was >> an elaborate army infrastructure, with its own buildings, streets, >> armoured >> vehicles and helicopters. There were families living there, >> families of army >> men. There were many shops too. Not many people in the town knew >> what was >> going on here, for it was happening on the hill's invisible side. >> >> >> To our dismay, we found many orchards had been torn down; our best >> apple >> trees were dying for want of care. The army, we heard, was >> planning to build >> an airstrip there. Years later, when I came to study in a northern >> Indian >> university, I realised that the army city on the hill that >> overlooked my >> town had a peculiarly North Indian town feel to it. I have been >> living away >> from home for the last nine years, as have so many of my other >> childhood >> friends. I hear stories from my parents about the killings and >> injuries of >> some friends who stayed behind..." >> >> >> I could go on. But this has been a long enough post already. In >> the end, we >> need to look a little less at questions of faith and a little more at >> questions of land, and here we need to look at the question of >> what happened >> to the land left behind by Kashmiri Pandits, just as much as >> anything else. >> Some of this land was of course appropriated by greedy neighbours, >> some of >> it is in the occupation of the armed forces, which pay paltry rent >> (if they >> pay) and some of it is cared for by diligent neigbours who wait >> for the >> return of those who left. >> >> >> We need to realize that when it comes to the alienation of land, >> we touch >> one of the most emotive chords there can be, and this is in the >> end about >> Kashmir, but it is about something much bigger than Kashmir. It is >> about >> connivance and corporate greed, wherever it occurs. >> >> >> In a recent report by Sravan Sukla from Kushinagar in Uttar >> Pradesh in the >> Tehelka of 9 August 2008, the correspondent draws a sadly familiar >> picture >> of arbitrary state action by the BSP government in Uttar Pradesh to >> arbitrarily grab land for a complex to host a grandiose statue of the >> Maitreya Buddha (the ostentation of which would have made the >> Buddha weep, >> not smile). >> >> >> Will Buddha Smile over Ryots Tears >> >> >> http://www.tehelka.org/story_main40.asp? >> filename=Ne090808willbuddha_smile.asp >> >> >> It is interesting to read a quote from this article - >> >> >> "Among others, around a hundred Dalit families have been affected >> by the >> land acquisition. Interestingly, a Dalit farmer is leading the >> agitation >> against Mayawati. Forty-five year old Govardhan Gond, a semi- >> literate Dalit >> farmer and president of the Bhoomi Bachao Sangharsh Samiti, says >> that "there >> is no question of >> >> surrendering our land so long as we are alive". >> >> >> "I will slit their throats if they come to take possession of my >> land. It >> is my only source of livelihood," declares Kamli Devi of Siswa >> village. A >> forty-year-old mother of six, she is leading a band of woman >> farmers against >> the acquisition to save her 50 bighas of land. >> >> >> Apart from the land, about 400 houses, half a dozen schools, >> including the >> area's only graduate institution, the Radha Krishna Inter College, >> a canal >> and about a dozen link roads are also falling prey to the >> acquisition. >> "Where will our children study after these schools have been >> closed," asks >> Dasai Gond of Dumri village. >> >> >> Significantly, a few Buddhist monks are also lending silent >> support to the >> farmers' cause. "The government should try to refrain from >> displacing poor >> farmers for the project. Buddhism is based on non-violence and it >> does not >> allow causing pain to anyone. A project based on the woes of >> farmers will >> haunt us in future," rues B. Gyaneshwar, the sangh nayak, or head, >> of the >> All-India Buddhist Monk Association." >> >> >> It would have been equally interesting had those who are leading the >> agitation for the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board >> and their >> sympathisers displayed even a fraction of the sensitivity that has >> been >> deplayed by the head of the All India Buddhist Monk Association >> when it >> comes to the acquisition of land for apparently religious purposes. >> >> >> Then, they (the partisans of the SASS agitation) would have >> matched the >> restraint and neighbourly feelings displayed by their Kashmiri >> counterparts >> towards the Amarnath pilgrims who have time and again stated that >> their >> fight is not against pilgrims or Hindus but against the move to >> acquire >> land. >> >> >> In fact, this year has had a record number of pilgrims travel to >> Amarnath, >> both by new and old routes, and the pilgrimage has continued, >> peacefully. >> >> >> Thank you all for the opportunity for this clarification, and >> apologies for >> what has been an overlong post, >> >> >> regards >> >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From nc-agricowi at netcologne.de Thu Aug 14 13:58:57 2008 From: nc-agricowi at netcologne.de (JavaMuseum) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 10:28:57 +0200 Subject: [Reader-list] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BAnnouncements=5D_Call=3A_JavaMuse?= =?iso-8859-1?q?um__-_Netart_Features_2009?= Message-ID: <20080814102857.56C342CB.D6A17DFC@192.168.0.3> JavaMuseum - Forum for Internet Technology in Contemporary Art http://www.javamuseum.org ---------------------------------- 1 Call: Netart Features 2009 2. New interview on: JIP - JavaMuseum Interview Project ---------------------------------- ---------------------------------- 1. Call for entries: Netart Features 2009 Deadline: 31 October 2008 JavaMuseum founded in 2000 realized since 2001 more than 20 showcases of netart in a global context, and hosts a comprehensive collection of netart from the years 2000-2005. More http://www.javamuseum.org/blog/?page_id=6 Also in 2009, JavaMuseum will continue its netart features. Artists working on the field of Internet based art are invited to submit up to 5 works completed after1 January 2005. The complete call, including regulations and entry form can be found here---> http://www.nmartproject.net/netex/?p=329 ------------------------------------ 2. JavaMuseum is happy to publish a new interview on JIP - JavaMuseum Interview Project http://jip.javamuseum.org ---> G.H. Hovagimyan (USA) http://jip.javamuseum.org/jipblog/?page_id=101 ------------------------------------ JavaMuseum - Forum for Internet Technology in Contemporary Art http://www.javamuseum.org is a corporate part of [NewMediaArtProjectNetwork]:||cologne www.nmartproject.net - the experimental platform for art and new media from Cologne/Germany ------------------------------------ info (at) javamuseum.org _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From logos.theword at gmail.com Fri Aug 15 13:29:04 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 13:29:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Call for Applications from an Experimental Performance Repertory Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808150059q714d059g4748741478586083@mail.gmail.com> Logos Theatre, based in Bangalore, India, invites applications from actors, movement artists, martial artists, visual/installation/video/ media artists, musicians and sound artists and others to be part of its "performance foundry", both as company members as well as collaborators. The idea behind the foundry is to create a vigorous, multi-disciplinary space which works in a hands-on, rigorous way to explore and discover different performance making processes combining different art forms, both traditional and contemporary, trying to achieve an integrated, vertical idiom. The foundry has been envisioned and will be steered by Arka Mukhopadhyay, the artistic director of Logos Theatre. Logos Theatre is embarking on a process of establishing an experimental performance repertory comparable to any benchmark in the world, and the foundry is intended to serve as the basis out of which the repertory will emerge and performance material will be created. We are not looking at becoming yet another amateur English theatre group. We plan to start from scratch, and work with a group of people who bring with them enthusiasm and a clear commitment to exploring intense performance making processes. We do not have the financial muscle, at this point of time, to hire actors on a full-time basis, so what we propose to do is to start a process of training and exploration, which people can join up through auditions and personal discussions, and these people will become equal stakes members of the company. Our areas of focus will be: Physical preparation - breath, voice and speech. The realization of the performer's 'self'. Breath and voice as means of connecting to the inner universe and subsequently tools of outward expression. Breath as a basis for emoting for the actor. Speech rhythms and colours. Hymns and chants - vibrational energies. Finding the physical and psychological centre. The body and movement - Intensive physical work, using existing traditional and contemporary forms of dance and martial arts, as well as free explorations, 'doings' and 'actions'. This is intended to be intense, gruelling work, breaking down the performers outward psycho physical layers, rendering her/him spiritually 'naked', and then to work from that centre. Space - exploration space through movement, through the five senses, through text, and with objects. Improvisations - both in the sense of Improv, i.e. established short and longform improv techniques, as well as dipping into the chaos of the pre-expressive state that lies at the substratum of performance processes. Working with elements of Theatre of the Oppressed and ideas incorporated from Psychodrama, especially theatre as cathartic play. Exploring ritual, myth and magic in performance, by creating and enacting performative rituals, rites of passage, fertility, sacrifice and regeneration, resonant songs, universal and personal myths, etc. Exploring traditional forms of performance, such as oral narrative traditions, story cycles and methods of telling them, movement and improvization in ancient, tribal and folk cultures, such as theyyam, bhoota, mangalkabbyo, australian aboriginal performance traditions, etc.; to name a few Exploring text as an element of performance - Text for us is one of the many elements of performance, and not the central one. Hence, we will work both with and against the word. For now, we plan to stick to Shakespeare (especially Macbeth) as well as contemporary texts by Heiner Muller, Sarah Kane, Roland Schimmelpfennig, etc. While this is the basic outline of the intended programme, in terms of structure, it will aim at a holistic as well as vertical approach to performance. Hence, it will move beyond theatre in the usual sense and absorb elements of performance poetry, storytelling, installation and video art, and performance art. Hence, we are also looking at inviting, from time to time, artists from disciplines such as music, painting, sculpture, installation, movement, etc. to work with us. If this interests you, please consider getting in touch. Before you do that, however, please be clear on a few things: 1) As you might guess, we are not terribly interested in conventional fourth-wall realism, so if that's the kind of theatre that interests you, we might not be the right people for you. 2) We will expect a very strong sense of commitment. This does not mean you have to give us all your professional time as we are unable to pay a salary for now and the foreseeable future, though whatever money we make out of performances will of course be shared. So, you can definitely have a primary career, but we'll need clear commitments in terms of what kind of time you can give us. So if you are looking at pursuing theatre as a 'hobby', we may again be the wrong people to approach. We shall also not demand that you work exclusively with us, but first priority will need to be given to the group since we are going to work in a laboratory environment where we shall learn collaboratively. While we do not intend to charge for such training, we definitely expect commitment to the group. *3) While we do not intend to be theatre or art activists and intend to focus firmly on the aesthetic, art at the same time cannot exist without a political consciousness. To that end, we are opposed to art that is created with support from big corporate houses which make money through unethical and often undemocratic practises in collusion with the state; or art created with the support of so called arts foundations which, in turn, are supported by unethical corporate entities. There cannot be any compromise on this, and we intend to remain, as it were, 'un-founded'. Please consider this before approaching us.* If this sounds good to you, please call on 9880966313 or e-mail contact at logostheatreindia.org to set up an appointment, and we will take it from there. -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 India www.logostheatreindia.org google group: http://groups.google.com/group/logostheatre (to subscribe by e-mail: logostheatre-subscribe at googlegroups.com) -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From rahulpandita at yahoo.com Sat Aug 16 07:19:52 2008 From: rahulpandita at yahoo.com (Rahul Pandita) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:49:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <564710.38193.qm@web30504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Kshemendra I don't know who you are but I know who Mahmood is and what he stands for. The most unfortunate part of this whole debate is that people like you are resorting to personal attacks. For God sake, don't throw shit around. If Mahmood is communal like you have said, then I am Ariel Sharon. Let us put a stop to this madness. If you have to express your feelings, please do it in a decent way. Let us at least respect a platform like sarai. Passions are alright but let us not turn into Ashok Singhals and Ladens. Rahul Pandita --- On Thu, 14/8/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: > From: mahmood farooqui > Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: "sarai list" > Date: Thursday, 14 August, 2008, 7:57 PM > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: mahmood farooqui > Date: 2008/8/14 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > > > Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers > but the responses > are making me think. > > Best, > Mahmood > > 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul > > Dear Mahmood > > > > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you > certainly are. You are trying > > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a > communal slant. > > > > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph > of a hoodlum > > attacking a policeman. > > > > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by > police firing. If > > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break > the law and/or > > attacking the police, then the injured person was a > hoodlum injured by > > police firing. > > > > What is communal in all of this? You are the one > making it communal. > > > > There was confrontation between the police and law > breaking hoodlums in > > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation > communal? > > > > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds > of photographs, one where law > > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers > and another one where > > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law > enforcers. > > > > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying > the photographs, one > > could make a call on which newspaper showed a > 'communal' tinge > > > > Kshmendra > > > > > > > > > > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > *wrote: > > > > From: mahmood farooqui > > > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > > To: "sarai list" > , "Aamir Bashir" < > > unattore1 at gmail.com> > > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > > > > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the > valley because of the > > police firing. > > > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India > and Hindustan Times, > > there is an identical image of a policeman being > attacked by a Kashmiri. > > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or > attacked by the police. > > > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri > injured by the police > > firing. > > > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > > > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 16 09:55:35 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:25:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <564710.38193.qm@web30504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <892815.6955.qm@web57202.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Rahul Pandita   I do not know who Mahmood Farooqui is and I do not care. I do not know who Rahul Pandita is and again I do not care.   What Mahmood 'stands for' and how that "standing" finds expression in the private space in which you know him is a matter between you and Mahmood. I have commented on Mahmood's post in this public space SARAI.   Mahmood put a 'poser' in SARAI asking whether 'all press is communal'. He based that 'poser' on the basis of a rather strange interpretation of photographs in 3 Newspapers. I pointed out that 'strangeness' to him. I put counters "posers" to him, which he ignored.   To start with, no person of any serious intent would put the poser  whether 'all press is communal' on the basis of a single day photographic coverage of a single event from just 3 newspapers.   Whether you understand or do not understand the not so subtle differentiations, I stand by what I said. I interpret Mahmood's "poser" (with the background for that "poser") as being seemingly a reflection of his himself being communal and seemingly trying to instigate communal feelings.   Kshmendra Kaul     --- On Sat, 8/16/08, Rahul Pandita wrote: From: Rahul Pandita Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures To: "sarai list" , "mahmood farooqui" Cc: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Date: Saturday, August 16, 2008, 7:19 AM Kshemendra I don't know who you are but I know who Mahmood is and what he stands for. The most unfortunate part of this whole debate is that people like you are resorting to personal attacks. For God sake, don't throw shit around. If Mahmood is communal like you have said, then I am Ariel Sharon. Let us put a stop to this madness. If you have to express your feelings, please do it in a decent way. Let us at least respect a platform like sarai. Passions are alright but let us not turn into Ashok Singhals and Ladens. Rahul Pandita --- On Thu, 14/8/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: > From: mahmood farooqui > Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: "sarai list" > Date: Thursday, 14 August, 2008, 7:57 PM > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: mahmood farooqui > Date: 2008/8/14 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > > > Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers > but the responses > are making me think. > > Best, > Mahmood > > 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul > > Dear Mahmood > > > > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you > certainly are. You are trying > > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a > communal slant. > > > > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph > of a hoodlum > > attacking a policeman. > > > > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by > police firing. If > > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break > the law and/or > > attacking the police, then the injured person was a > hoodlum injured by > > police firing. > > > > What is communal in all of this? You are the one > making it communal. > > > > There was confrontation between the police and law > breaking hoodlums in > > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation > communal? > > > > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds > of photographs, one where law > > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers > and another one where > > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law > enforcers. > > > > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying > the photographs, one > > could make a call on which newspaper showed a > 'communal' tinge > > > > Kshmendra > > > > > > > > > > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > *wrote: > > > > From: mahmood farooqui > > > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > > To: "sarai list" > , "Aamir Bashir" < > > unattore1 at gmail.com> > > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > > > > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the > valley because of the > > police firing. > > > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India > and Hindustan Times, > > there is an identical image of a policeman being > attacked by a Kashmiri. > > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or > attacked by the police. > > > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri > injured by the police > > firing. > > > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > > > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 16 10:02:14 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:32:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Apology for Mahmood Farooqui In-Reply-To: <313018.45033.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <50665.24275.qm@web57201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Mahmood   I must apologise to you for the manner in which I had worded an earlier post.   Allow me to rephrase myself with the amendments placed in CAPITALS:   """""""" Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly SEEM TO BE. You are SEEMINGLY trying to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant.""""   Kshmendra   --- On Thu, 8/14/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: From: Kshmendra Kaul Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures To: "sarai list" , "mahmood farooqui" Date: Thursday, August 14, 2008, 7:13 PM Dear Mahmood   Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. You are trying to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant.   Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum attacking a policeman.   Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. If this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured by police firing.   What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal.   There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums in Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal?   Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, one where law enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one where law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers.   Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the photographs, one could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' tinge   Kshmendra         --- On Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: From: mahmood farooqui Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures To: "sarai list" , "Aamir Bashir" Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because of the police firing. Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan Times, there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a Kashmiri. There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the police. The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the police firing. Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? Is the poser itself simplistic? _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Sat Aug 16 11:18:42 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 11:18:42 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <892815.6955.qm@web57202.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <664432.54264.qm@web8403.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Kshmendra Not trying to enter your interaction with Mahmood, but when you say that "no person of any serious intent would put the poser whether 'all press is communal'", you may be far from the truth. I don't think Mahmood was reacting only to two photographs. One is witnessed to biased reporting and prejudiced image-making of particular communities in our mainstream media EVERY DAY. In most cases, people don't realize this because they don't belong to the community that is being victimized. And many a times, there are subtle things in a write-up or TV reporting that tell how prejudiced an editor or writer is. These subtleties also affect the common readers in an adverse way. Mahmood was probably reacting to a subtlety like that, but there was much past bitterness behind his reaction. I would like to invite you to see some of the following reports to say that media bias and prejudice exists. And I am not talking only about bias against Muslims. It could be for other minorities too - for tribals, for women, dalits... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_bias_in_South_Asia http://www.sabrang.com/gujarat/statement/report.htm http://indianmuslims.in/biased-media/ http://www.tribuneindia.com/2002/20020414/edit.htm http://indianmuslims.in/is-indias-english-media-communal/ http://www.indiauncut.com/iublog/article/singur-media-bias-or-media-ignorance/ http://mediaindiablindspot.blogspot.com/2008/01/racial-prejudice-against-north.html http://www.indiaprblog.com/2006/12/is-indian-media-biased-in-favour-of.html http://www.countercurrents.org/comm-sikand150906.htm http://muslimmedianetwork.com/mmn/?p=332 http://calamur.org/gargi/tag/media-bias/ http://www.thehoot.org/web/home/searchdetail.php?sid=88&bg=1 http://bocs.hu/india/taran-khan-disstn.htm --- On Sat, 16/8/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > From: Kshmendra Kaul > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: "sarai list" , "mahmood farooqui" , rahulpandita at yahoo.com > Date: Saturday, 16 August, 2008, 9:55 AM > Dear Rahul Pandita > > I do not know who Mahmood Farooqui is and I do not care. I > do not know who Rahul Pandita is and again I do not care. > > What Mahmood 'stands for' and how that > "standing" finds expression in the private space > in which you know him is a matter between you and Mahmood. I > have commented on Mahmood's post in this public space > SARAI. > > Mahmood put a 'poser' in SARAI asking whether > 'all press is communal'. He based that > 'poser' on the basis of a rather > strange interpretation of photographs in 3 Newspapers. I > pointed out that 'strangeness' to him. I put > counters "posers" to him, which he ignored. > > To start with, no person of any serious intent would put > the poser whether 'all press is communal' on the > basis of a single day photographic coverage of a single > event from just 3 newspapers. > > Whether you understand or do not understand the not so > subtle differentiations, I stand by what I said. I > interpret Mahmood's "poser" (with the > background for that "poser") as being seemingly a > reflection of his himself being communal and seemingly > trying to instigate communal feelings. > > Kshmendra Kaul > > > > --- On Sat, 8/16/08, Rahul Pandita > wrote: > > From: Rahul Pandita > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: "sarai list" , > "mahmood farooqui" > > Cc: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > Date: Saturday, August 16, 2008, 7:19 AM > > Kshemendra > > I don't know who you are but I know who Mahmood is and > what he stands for. > The most unfortunate part of this whole debate is that > people like you are > resorting to personal attacks. For God sake, don't > throw shit around. If > Mahmood is communal like you have said, then I am Ariel > Sharon. > > Let us put a stop to this madness. If you have to express > your feelings, please > do it in a decent way. Let us at least respect a platform > like sarai. Passions > are alright but let us not turn into Ashok Singhals and > Ladens. > > Rahul Pandita > > > --- On Thu, 14/8/08, mahmood farooqui > wrote: > > > From: mahmood farooqui > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > > To: "sarai list" > > > Date: Thursday, 14 August, 2008, 7:57 PM > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > From: mahmood farooqui > > > Date: 2008/8/14 > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > > > > > > Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the > answers > > but the responses > > are making me think. > > > > Best, > > Mahmood > > > > 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul > > > > > Dear Mahmood > > > > > > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, > you > > certainly are. You are trying > > > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a > > communal slant. > > > > > > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed > photograph > > of a hoodlum > > > attacking a policeman. > > > > > > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person > injured by > > police firing. If > > > this person was a part of the mob attempting to > break > > the law and/or > > > attacking the police, then the injured person was > a > > hoodlum injured by > > > police firing. > > > > > > What is communal in all of this? You are the one > > making it communal. > > > > > > There was confrontation between the police and > law > > breaking hoodlums in > > > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation > > communal? > > > > > > Which is the 'communal' one between two > kinds > > of photographs, one where law > > > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law > breakers > > and another one where > > > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law > > enforcers. > > > > > > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions > accompanying > > the photographs, one > > > could make a call on which newspaper showed a > > 'communal' tinge > > > > > > Kshmendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > > *wrote: > > > > > > From: mahmood farooqui > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > > > To: "sarai list" > > , "Aamir > Bashir" < > > > unattore1 at gmail.com> > > > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > > > > > > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed > in the > > valley because of the > > > police firing. > > > > > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of > India > > and Hindustan Times, > > > there is an identical image of a policeman being > > attacked by a Kashmiri. > > > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed > or > > attacked by the police. > > > > > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri > > injured by the police > > > firing. > > > > > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is > communal? > > > > > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and > the > > city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > > > the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the > subject > > header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From jammuwala at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 11:33:39 2008 From: jammuwala at gmail.com (jammu burning) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 11:33:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] hi Message-ID: From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 13:00:10 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 13:00:10 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> Message-ID: Hi Shuddha, A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have raised. You may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is very much about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim Kashmir than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion given India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to point out that in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously not to accuse you of communal thinking. I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during the protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really don¹t want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember 1989 and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative about taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand strong mob screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did in Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF culpability: ----------------------------------------------- THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming the main target of protesters. There have also been calls for their social boycott. The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct against their own people". State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests in Kashmir over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 injured. Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" marchers in Uri on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house officer of Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two others were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a target killing". Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and torched it. They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents have been reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a social boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj Bagh locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police "whether they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in stark contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen as "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. -------------------------------------- On the tearing down of bunkers etc., :you are right. These are visible symbols of oppression and one can even be indulgent when an impassioned mob tears them down, but where does one draw the line then? What when the same mob goes and torches a government building or a politician¹s house as has been the case? Even Moulvi Abbas Ansari, poor man, the Shi¹a leader in the Mirwaiz¹s Hurriyat Conference, had the honour of having his home ransacked by a mob a few days ago. Two years ago, during the so-called sex scandal, Œthe people¹ razed the home of Sabina, the sex-worker, to the ground. Does one extend the same understanding to these mobs, Œof disarming the infrastructure of oppression¹? I can only conjecture that some participants believed they were responding to historic wrongs of the Shi¹as, as others, in the case of Sabina, felt morally justified in taking the law into their hands against a woman they believed was the source of all corruption. I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œdisputed structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹ Do you remember Naipaul¹s defence of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but natural for a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years? The point I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to do as they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you have very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with politically do the same. That is why laws exist and ought to be followed. You argue: That they choose not to go to 'C' (the Srinagar-Leh-Manali road that Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on which we can evaluate the merits or demerits of the state's decision to fire into this amassed crowd.  You are right. I never did! It would have been absurd of me to suggest that we evaluate the police firing in the light of the decision not to take the Leh-Manali route. I was merely pointing out that the decision to march to Muzaffarabad need not have been taken, given an alternative existed. Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to light only about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and examined and was not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly. What did was the canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards Hindus settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have such a brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare-faced lie! The issue of agricultural land being occupied by the forces: absolutely right, they shouldn¹t be there and were not there before 1989. One can only urge all concerned to stay on track with the peace process between India & Pakistan so that agreements can be inked once and for all & that J&K can be dimilitarized. May peace prevail. Best sj On 8/15/08 9:39 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar,  > > > > Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And apologies in > advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not interested in > the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. > > > > It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, (without > making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your responses have given me an > opportunity to make some necessary elaborations.  > > > > First of all, let me categorically state that Sonia, by pointing towards the > violence that farmers faced in Greater Noida yesterday, and by referring to > the histories of the Narmada agitation, and the Nandigram issue has helped me > clarify some of my own thinking.  > > > > This process of clarification does not require me to revise what I had written > in relation to the current climate in the state of Jammu & Kashmir, on the > contrary, it actually allows me to extend and develop my argument. I will come > to this later, but first, there are some other issues that I need to deal > with. > > > > When I had referred to the two kinds of treatment meted out to two different > kinds of protest, I had not in fact thought in 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' terms, and > after reading Sonia's response, I re-read my post carefully to see if there > was any suggestion that I was referring to a difference in the state's > response that could be attributed to the religious composition of the two > different protesting crowds. I did not find the words 'Hindu' or 'Muslim' > anywhere in my post. And while I do agree with Soina that when Jammu and > Kashmir Police personnel open fire on protesting crowds in the Kashmir valley, > what we witness is nominally 'Muslim' policemen, firing on nominally 'Muslim' > protesters. The same Jammu and Kashmir police personnel firing on protesters > in Jammu are likely to be a mix of nominally 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' personnel > firing on a similarly mixed crowd of protesters (if that is, we agree with the > assertion that the SASS protests have featured the participation of 'Jammu > Muslims'). This fact may or may not be true, but let us for the sake of the > argument, assume that this is so. > > > > Similarly, the caste/identity composition of western UP policemen is not > likely to be very different from crowds of protesting western UP farmers in > the unhappy place that is Greater Noida. It is a well known fact that the most > brutal torture in the detention centres and interrogation centres in the > Kashmir valley is meted out by STF (Special Task Force) personnel attatched to > the state police. Almost invariably, these enforcers of the sharp edge of the > Indian states marks on Kashmiri bodies tend to be Kashmiri, and Muslim. > > > > One clarification here though, the bulk of firing in the Kashmir valley has > been undertaken by CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force) personnel, and the bulk > of public anger has been, in this case against, the CRPF bullets, and CRPF > sticks that smashed so many windows last night in downtown Srinagar. Now, > anyone who has been to Srinagar knows, that the scared and vulnerable and > aggressive faces that man CRPF bunkers are not Kashmiri. Their bodies (more > often than not) come from hotter places in the plains and plateaus of the > Indian hearland. And I see their deplyoment in a war zone like Kashmir as > unfortunate, as saddening > > > > Sonia has referred to Kashmiri protesting crowds 'baying for blood' during the > last few days during the mass gatherings that took place on the road to > Muzaffarabad, and in Srinagar and other towns. I have been speaking to friends > in the Kashmir valley today, and they told me that the slogans that were > raised during the protests  > > on the road to Muzaffarabad were as follows (in order of frequency) > > > > 1. 'Hum Kya Chahtey, Azaadi' (What do we want, Freedom), The staple full > throated cry that rings out, and has rung out in most protests in the Kashmir > valley for the last two decades. > > > > 2. 'Fruit to bahaana hai, Muzaffarabad jaana hai' (Fruit is an excuse, we want > to go to Muzaffarabad). This has been chanted, not by the truckers carrying > fruit, but by the accompanying marchers.  > > > > 3. 'Aadhi Roti Khayenge, Sar nahin Jhukayenge'. (We can eat half a piece of > bread, but won't bow our heads') > > > > 3. 'Jeeve, Jeeve, Pakistan' (Long live, Long live, Pakistan) > > > > Now, whatever these slognas may or may not imply, none of these slogans, bayed > for anyone's blood. Not only did the marchers refrain from raising any slogans > that can be construed as calls to violence, the 'separatist' political > leadership that had aligned itself with the mass protests also repeatedly > called for peaceful protests, using all available channels, including those > afforded to them by the mainstream media. I have seen the Mirwaiz calling > repeatedly for protests to be peaceful. If this leadership had wanted to queer > the pitch by asking for violence, I am sure it would have been heeded by some > sections in a very angry crowd. No such call was made, and no policeman, or > paramilitary force personnel were attacked. In some instances, CRPF bunkers > were torn down (and this happenned after the incidents of firing) but the > demobilization of offensive fortifications on the street can be hardly called > a violent act. In my book, it is an act of disarming the infrastructure of > occupation, without causing any injury or violence to the occupiers > themselves.  > > > > Once the bodies of people killed by the CRPF started to make themselves > visible in funeral processions, many young people started shouting 'Khoon ke > badle Khoon' (blood for blood). But this 'baying' if it can be called that, > occurred once blood had been spilt, and not, as I may point out, by the > bayers.  > > > > On the contrary, I have seen Dr. Praveen Togadia (who has endorsed the SASS > agitation in Jammu by calling mass protests in other cities in India) declare > on television 'agar maange nahin poori ki gayi to sangharsh aur bhi ugra roop > lega' ('if the demands are not met, the agitation will take on even more > extreme forms'). We have heard crowds in Jammu chant, 'Jaan denge, par baba > Amarnath ki Zamin vapas lenge'  (we will give up our lives, but will not give > up on  Baba Amarnath's land) and variations thereof. In fact, two > 'jaans/lives' have been tragically offered as suicides. For me, this is just > as shocking, just as violent, as any other kind of call to violence. These > crowds have set Gujjar huts on fire. And setting shepherds huts on fire is not > exactly the same thing as tearing down the sandbags of a CRPF bunker. So any > attempt at 'equating' the degree of violence in these two instances needs to > be read as disingenuous. > > > > As for the fact that in one instance (in Jammu) the crowds carried the Indian > flag, and shouted pro-India slogans, and that in the other instance (in > Kashmir) the crowds carried Pakistani flags and that some (or many) shouted > pro-Pakistan slogans does not say anything about the violent intentions or > tenor of either of the two protesting crowds.  > > > > As someone who carries no brief, for any form of nationalism, (Indian, > Pakistani or Kashmiri) I am not willing to judge a crowd on the basis of which > kind of nationalism they choose to profess. What interests me is the fact that > given two crowds, with two different kinds of behaviour, one of which carries > an Indian flag, and another which carries a Pakistani flag, black flags, or no > flags at all - the Indian state chooses to fire on the second crowd, even > though the second crowd, which may be greater in numbers, is not indicating > that it is anything but a peaceful assembly of people intent on going from 'A' > to 'B'. That they choose not to go to 'C' (the Srinagar-Leh-Manali road that > Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on which we can evaluate the merits or > demerits of the state's decision to fire into this amassed crowd.  > > > > Notwithstanding the multitude of links supplied by Aditya Raj Kaul in his > response to my posting. Facts, remain, facts. Three casualties of police > firing in one instance (in a very militant protest in Jammu) and now thirty > casualties (and likely to mount) in police and CRPF firing in the other > instance (in Kashmir) including instances where CRPF personnel fired on > ambulances ferrying the wounded to hospital, and inside hospitals. These > instances of violence against ambulances, the injured and doctors and nurses > attending to them must go down in the history of the Indian state as examples > of the very worst forms of state brutality.  > > > > For more details - see -  > > > > This needs to be seen also in the context of the fact that the opening of the > "Srinagar-Muzaffarabad' road is a long standing demand of several sections of > political opinion (not all of them separatist) and that in fact predates the > current troubles in the valley (from 1989) by several decades. It needs also > to be seen in the light of the fact that what the people on the highways in > the Kashmir valley were demanding had already been agreed to in principle by > the governments of India and Pakistan. If anything, the current situation was > an opportunity for the governments of the state of Jammu and Kashmir > (currently represented by the Governor, a representative of the Union of > India) and the Union of India to display a modicum of vision and sagacity by > opening the line of control, especially when the people of the valley were > voting with their feet, and their bodies for this to be done. > > > > Even those who wish the Indian state well in its continuing occupation of the > Kashmir valley would no doubt see this turn of events as a tragically wasted > opportunity.  > > > > Let me now turn to the second important question that has arisen from this > discussion. The question of what might enable us to think about the situations > of the Greater Noida farmers and the protesting masses in the Kashmir valley > (and elsewhere, in Nandigram, and in the Kashmir valley). > > > > Sonia has pointed out in her posting that  as far as the transfer of land to > the Amarnath Shrine Board is concerned, "Of the 100 acres in > > question,  only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the rest is > > private property belonging to several locals." > > > > If this is indeed the case, then the extent of the anger against the move to > effect a  transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is all the more > understandable. (I do not doubt that it would be understandable even if this > were not the case, but that is another matter. )  > > > > Land is a highly emotive issue in all parts of South Asia, and in many parts > of the world where it is tied to livelihood and to survival. The desire to > acquire land (usually with the mediation of the state) for purposes other than > those relevant to the livelihood and survival of the customary owners, users > and custodians of land is what gives the common sharp edge to the question of > the arbitrary acquisition of land by state or state backed agencies, whether > in Kashmir, or in the Narmada valley, or in Nandigram is what is clearly > evident. In Kashmir, (in the absence of any other viable form of sustainable > economic activity, barring tourism, land is all that people can fall back on. > And we need to remember that some of the capital that the National Conference > still falls back on when its naked collusion with the occupation comes to the > fore, is the vivid, yet fading memory of land reforms in the early fifties.  > > > > So, then, what is the story about land, in the Kashmir valley.   > > > > "In 2003 Abdul Rashid, Member of Parliament was told in Rajya Sabha that the > army and the Central Para-Military Forces (CPMFs) have 41,594.767 acres > (332760 kanals) in J&K. This comes to about 170 sq kms for which records > exist. But an equal amount, if not more, is under illegal occupation, > according to The Economic Times [December 6, 2006]. The most recent figures > being circulated suggests that 6,81,839 kanals are under the armed forces¹ > possession. Of this 3,10,184 kanals is unauthorized possession. In Srinagar > officially, the defence establishment have 45,080 kanals of land located at > Badamibagh, Rangreth, Danodhar Karewa, Sharifabad, Tatoo and Militia Grounds. > In 2006, it has been reported that the Indian Army¹s Northern Command has > acquired 8000 kanals in Awantipora. There have also been reports of Indian Air > Force wanting land for a new air base in Mansbal and in the same area > 3Rashtriya Rifles (RR) has submitted a request to acquire nearly 1500 kanals > adjoining its garrison. Manasbal also highlights another feature of this Œland > grab¹. Villagers complain that since the irrigation canal passes through land > which the 3RR wants, thousands of kanals of land would be denied irrigation. > So widespread is the concern in J&K over land under security forces occupation > that even the pro-Indian Peoples Democratic Party, led by Mufti Mohammed > Saeed, in a resolution adopted on February 11, 2007 states ³with distressŠ > that over the last 15 years thousands of acres of orchards and agricultural > land have been acquired in the state particularly in Kashmir Valley, districts > of Rajouri, Poonch and Doda by the Armed Forces.² The resolution also says > that ³many institutional buildings including hospitals and schools have been > occupied by the armed forces.² A conservative estimate suggests that 35,000 ha > of such land is under the control of the Indian Army alone. > > > > Take deployment in just one tehsil; Pattan in Baramulla, to appreciate its > significance. This tehsil has 92 villages. Amongst these 92 villages there are > 4 army brigade headquarters and 12 checkposts. Pattan plus Babateng also hosts > camps of Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), Border Security Force (BSF) and > Special Operations Group (SOG).  There are three police stations in the > tehsil; at Pattan, Mirgund and Kreeri. Each check post has anywhere between > 100-150 soldiers although there are few which have much larger numbers in > excess of 300. Thus roughly a cluster of nine villages come under one check > post. And one brigade is available for operations covering 23 villages whereas > one police station caters to 30-31 villages. Thus all movement to and from the > village to fields, market, town is monitored and accompanied by regular > patrolling. Thus, the margin for normal human Œerrors¹, such as stepping out > for a smoke after dark, or a stroll can result in death. On top of this, the > extent of deployment of troops and the land under their occupation acts as a > brake on people¹s own capacity to propel growth. It also results in > difficulties in getting easy access to markets for commodity export because of > delay in transportation due to security drills, slowdown on highways because > of military convoys carrying troops, material and weaponry etc, and relatively > higher fuel and labour costs due to all this." > > > > Were this land to be freed of occupation it would contribute immensely to > increasing agricultural/fruit production and generation of revenue and cut > back on net outflow from J&K.  > > > > If this is true (and the statement recorded in the minutes of the Rajya Sabha > do have official sanction) then, the armed forces and paramilitaries of the > Indian state, together occupied 41,594.767 acres, and since the majority of > force deployment in J&K is in the Kashmir valley, then the majority of this > land would logically be seen to lie in the Kashmir valley.  > > > > The net area under fruit cultivation in the State of J&K is  174,000 ha are > under fresh fruits (orchards). 174,000 ha is equal to 4,29,963 acres. If we > compare this figure against the reliable estimate of land under direct > occupation my armed forces of the Indian state (41,594.767 acres) we get the > following figures. The armed forces occupy land that is roughly equivalent to > what would amount to 10 % of the land under fruit cultivation. In crude terms, > one in every ten orchards is not an orchard, it is a fortress.  > > > > All figures are sourced from the Fifth Economic Census [published by the > Central Statistical Organisation together with Directorate of Economics and > Statistics J&K, 2005]  and  Economic Survey 2006-07 for Jammu & Kashmir (ES > 2006-07) [The Directorate of Economics and Statistics, Government of Jammu and > Kashmir, 2007]as cited in 'Understanding the J&K Economy' by Gautam Navlakha, > Kashmir Affairs, Volume 2, No.2, April-June 2007 > > http://www.kashmiraffairs.org > > Gautam_Navlakha_understanding_J&K_economy.html > > > > [And before anyone jumps on me for citing a source that comes by way of Gautam > Navlakha, let me state that Navlakha may not have read the Rajtarangini with > great care, but he certainly does take the time to read the Economic Survey > 2006-2007 for J&K, and other official documents with a certain degree of care. > And the figures under question here are not his opinions, but notes in these > same official documents.] > > > > In a situation of direct occupation of a resource as precious as land in > Kashmir, the arbitrary decision to appropriate even just 100 more acres of > land by an unrepresentative body (the office of the governor) for whatever > purpose cannot but be seen as a deliberate affront to a population stretched > to the very limits of its patience by the violence of a continuing occupation. > I fail to see, why the anger of fruit growers, denied markets, smarting under > the knowledge that their orchards have in many cases been taken over by the > Indian state, should look upon any act of land acquisition with kindness.  > > > > Look for instance at a news item in the Kashmir Times of Friday, April 18, > 2008 > > > > Rental hikes by Army may adversely affect fruit production in Jammu and > kashmir > > With fruit production in Kashmir static, the Kashmiri growers have asked the > state and central government not to acquire horticulture land for any official > purposes. They are also not satisfied with recent rent hike by the defence > ministry. > > > > The growers fear that acquiring of the horticulture land for official purposes > will reduce the fruit production in the state. Jammu and Kashmir is the only > state in India that has around 2.75 lakh hectares of land under the > horticulture.The major portion of this land is used for the cultivation of > fresh fruits especially apples. > > > > President, Kashmir Fruit Growers and Dealers Association, Ghulam Rasool Bhat > told Kashmir Times that, "The government should come up with a law for banning > the use of horticulture land for any official purpose." He said that in > Western countries, the government has already banned use of horticulture land > for any official purposes, he said, adding similar ban should be imposed in > Jammu Kashmir as well. "If steps are not taken, time will come when we will > lose major portion of our orchards." > > > > How deep this connection between orchards and armed bases runs is evident from > another source, this time a more subjective account. Which bears being read > through right to the end.  > > > > There are no Djinns in Anantnag, they don't scare us anymore¹  > > http://bluekashmir.blogspot.com/ > > Uzma Mohsin > > Originally published in the Personal Histories section of the Tehelka weekly; > July 28, 2007 issue. I thank Uzma Mohsin for the sketch. > > > > "...Relations between the townspeople and the army were tense. Early each > morning, as the town came alive with the azaans from its many mosques, the > army would switch on huge loudspeakers on three sides of the hill, and Hindi > songs and bhajans would blare out of them for hours on end. It was some kind > of a unilateral, undeclared war; we all lived in terror of the day this war > would come down the slopes in heavy muddy boots and trample on us like ants. > It stopped only in the late 90s, when I left Kashmir at age 16. > > > > THE TOWN had become very gloomy ‹ by six in the evening, the streets wore a > deserted look. Lights were kept low, curtains were always drawn. People made > guesses about the origins of distant gunshots. Scary stories for children no > longer had any tasrupdars, djinns or haputs in them ‹ there was no need for > them, they didn¹t scare us any more. Only the snow surprised us when, after a > perfectly clear day, we would wake up to find bright snow covering everything > open to the sky. In the distance, the snow-covered hill would merge with the > whiteness of the surrounding town, and become almost invisible. These were > perhaps the only happy moments for me at that time. > > > > One apple season, many years later, we found the courage to go up the hill to > pick apples. A new, utterly strange city had sprung to life on the flat > plateau. It was such a contrast to the choked, dying town below. There was an > elaborate army infrastructure, with its own buildings, streets, armoured > vehicles and helicopters. There were families living there, families of army > men. There were many shops too. Not many people in the town knew what was > going on here, for it was happening on the hill¹s invisible side. > > > > To our dismay, we found many orchards had been torn down; our best apple trees > were dying for want of care. The army, we heard, was planning to build an > airstrip there. Years later, when I came to study in a northern Indian > university, I realised that the army city on the hill that overlooked my town > had a peculiarly North Indian town feel to it. I have been living away from > home for the last nine years, as have so many of my other childhood friends. I > hear stories from my parents about the killings and injuries of some friends > who stayed behind..." > > > > I could go on. But this has been a long enough post already. In the end, we > need to look a little less at questions of faith and a little more at > questions of land, and here we need to look at the question of what happened > to the land left behind by Kashmiri Pandits, just as much as anything else. > Some of this land was of course appropriated by greedy neighbours, some of it > is in the occupation of the armed forces, which pay paltry rent (if they pay) > and some of it is cared for by diligent neigbours who wait for the return of > those who left.  > > > > We need to realize that when it comes to the alienation of land, we touch one > of the most emotive chords there can be, and this is in the end about Kashmir, > but it is about something much bigger than Kashmir. It is about connivance and > corporate greed, wherever it occurs.  > > > > In a recent report by Sravan Sukla from Kushinagar in Uttar Pradesh in the > Tehelka of 9 August 2008, the correspondent draws a sadly familiar picture of > arbitrary state action by the BSP government in Uttar Pradesh to arbitrarily > grab land for a complex to host a grandiose statue of the Maitreya Buddha (the > ostentation of which would have made the Buddha weep, not smile).  > > > > Will Buddha Smile over Ryots Tears > > http://www.tehelka.org/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808willbuddha_smile.asp > > > > It is interesting to read a quote from this article -  > > > > "Among others, around a hundred Dalit families have been affected by the land > acquisition. Interestingly, a Dalit farmer is leading the agitation against > Mayawati. Forty-five year old Govardhan Gond, a semi-literate Dalit farmer and > president of the Bhoomi Bachao Sangharsh Samiti, says that ³there is no > question of > > surrendering our land so long as we are alive². > > > > ³I will slit their throats if they come to take possession of my land. It is > my only source of livelihood,² declares Kamli Devi of Siswa village. A > forty-year-old mother of six, she is leading a band of woman farmers against > the acquisition to save her 50 bighas of land. > > > > Apart from the land, about 400 houses, half a dozen schools, including the > area¹s only graduate institution, the Radha Krishna Inter College, a canal and > about a dozen link roads are also falling prey to the acquisition. ³Where will > our children study after these schools have been closed,² asks Dasai Gond of > Dumri village. > > > > Significantly, a few Buddhist monks are also lending silent support to the > farmers¹ cause. ³The government should try to refrain from displacing poor > farmers for the project. Buddhism is based on non-violence and it does not > allow causing pain to anyone. A project based on the woes of farmers will > haunt us in future,² rues B. Gyaneshwar, the sangh nayak, or head, of the > All-India Buddhist Monk Association." > > > > It would have been equally interesting had those who are leading the agitation > for the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board and their sympathisers > displayed even a fraction of the sensitivity that has been deplayed by the > head of the All India Buddhist Monk Association when it comes to the > acquisition of land for apparently religious purposes.  > > > > Then, they (the partisans of the SASS agitation) would have matched the > restraint and neighbourly feelings displayed by their Kashmiri counterparts > towards the Amarnath pilgrims who have time and again stated that their fight > is not against pilgrims or Hindus but against the move to acquire land.  > > > > In fact, this year has had a record number of pilgrims travel to Amarnath, > both by new and old routes, and the pilgrimage has continued, peacefully.  > > > > Thank you all for the opportunity for this clarification, and apologies for > what has been an overlong post,  > > > > regards > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > From jammuwala at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 13:11:24 2008 From: jammuwala at gmail.com (jammu burning) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 13:11:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Biased media Message-ID: Times of India does it again The esteemed Times of India is continuing with it's anti-India propaganda and today a front page story screams Tri-colour at 8am, Separatist flags at 4pm, with huge photos of Lal Chowk showing Indian and Pak flags. As if he is a god, correspondent Avijit Ghosh claims as if the symbolism of spectacle tells the alienation Kashmir valley is complete. What kind of reporting is this, why was the Pakistan flag allowed to be hoisted in Lal Chowk. Are Indian forces impotent to stop this kind of behavior. Instead of asking searching questions, the reporter is telling India, look how brave the kashmiris are, they are burning Indian flag and hoisiting Pak flag. Is this a very tough task, any one even a kid can burn a Pakistani or an Indian flag. With Governor NN Vohra, asking the security men to go slow and be kind to the agitators, it is but natural that kashmiris will be allowed to indulge in such hooliganism. And if they think that doing this will win them freedom, let them have it. But atleast the TOI should restrain its correspondent and tell him not to suffer from Stockholm syndrome. Dear Ghosh Sahib you are a reporter and not a Public relations officer of the Hurriyat or Kashmiris. Behave like a mature journalist as it appears that this is your first assignment in this kind of surcharged situation. While TOI gives front page coverage to Pak flags, it doesnt care to get a story on how the National Flag is being hoisted by the people of Jammu. How thousand of people across the region hoisted the national flag in Jammu despite boycotting the state function. The Hindustan Times has been a little better compared to it's competitor and has atleast published two three stories from Jammu. Also Barkha Dutt on the edit page has written some sensible things and is good to read, when she suggests that people should come forward to find a solution and delves on the failure of UPA government. Indian express acts as a two way sword, it has allowed the usual anti-india propganda by Muzamil Jaleel, where he says covertly that the Jammu agitation is communal and speaking through governor NN Vohra's mouth-tells that Jammu is bigoted. However, express has published a small Jammu based piece from Neeraj Santoshi and a good picture by Yogesh Manhas, which speaks about the nationalism and patriotism of the people of Jammu. CNN-IBN does not allow comments if they are little bit unpalatable and wants everything sugar coated and sweet. From shuddha at sarai.net Sat Aug 16 15:00:20 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 15:00:20 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Sonia, Many thanks again for your responses and clarifications. There is one point on which I am totally in agreement with you. You said, > > Two years ago, during the so-called sex scandal, ‘the people’ razed > the home of Sabina, the sex-worker, to the ground. Does one extend > the same understanding to these mobs, ‘of disarming the > infrastructure of oppression’? I can only conjecture that some > participants believed they were responding to historic wrongs of > the Shi’as, as others, in the case of Sabina, felt morally > justified in taking the law into their hands against a woman they > believed was the source of all corruption. I think (in agreement with you) that this was totally wrong. I have always maintained that groups in opposition to the Indian state, no matter whether they be in Kashmir, or in the North East, or in Central India, often try and act as a very repressive moral police, in order to try and portray themselves as righteous defenders of what they see as 'civic virtue'. This makes their actions no different from fascism of the worst kind. In the specific case that you mention, there may have been a justified anger at the fact that minors may or may not have been trafficked, and that there may or may not have been coercion used. But the burning down of Sabina's house first of all, ended all possibilities of grounding these suspicions in evidence, (and so was totally counter-productive) and secondly, demonstrated the kind of puritanical moral outrage that I would oppose, as a matter of principle. I see nothing wrong in sex work (provided it does not involve coercion or minors), and I do not see why popular anger against state repression has to find such weak and irrelevant targets. Notwithstanding anything that I might say in opposition to the Indian state's brutality, in Kashmir, or elsewhere, I recognize the fact that the opposition to that brutality often ends up being the mirror image of the repressive apparatus it seeks to oppose. My disagreement with the cult of macho violence (or self-denying 'non- violence' of the repressive Gandian variety) as a tool for politics stems from the fact that it inevitably breeds a masculinist, elite section within the opposition that ultimately denies agency to acts and ways of being and relating to others, to the land, to identities, even to the concrete and banal realities of day to day living outside of the binary tropes of nationalities and fortified identities, of 'us' and 'them'. I find martyrs and martyrdom, for instance, particularly depressing. The nation, or 'community' in each instance, becomes a means by which the immense array of individual and interpersonal variations is flattened away. I wish every 'martyr' had betrayed the urge to seek death and had chosen life instead. Which is why, national liberation movements the world over, end up as oppressors, once they attain power. It is high time we all started looking, especially in Kashmir, and in relation to Kashmir (and no, I do not think that this is a luxury that can be afforded only once 'azaadi' is attained, by then it will be too late) for more imaginative methods and languages for political action than some of the tired and tested slogans and attitudes that have both fuelled and crippled the opposition in Kashmir. For instance, I find it tragic when people chant 'Pakistan Zindabad' in response to 'Hindustan ZIndabad', as if they were participating in some bizarre and macabre contest to see which flavour of repression tastes better on the tongue. For now, I maintain, that the actions of the Indian state in the past few days in the Kashmir valley, have been heinous. And I hope that everyone concerned acts in a manner that ensures that more lives are not lost, in Jammu and in Kashmir. I also agree with your desire for the de-militarization of Jammu and Kashmir, I think normal, everyday political and social processes can find life and vigour only when armies retreat. For this to happen, first of all the Indian and Pakistani military forces that are in occupation of different parts of the undivided state of Jammu and Kashmir must leave, and repressive laws such as the Armed Forces Special Powers Act must be repealed, prisoners and detainees held under repressive laws like the Public Safety Act must be released (and these acts, or variations of them are also in operation in Pak Occupied kashmir and in the Northern Areas ) correspondingly and simultaneously, all insurgent forces must de-commission and destroy weapons and disband militias, (similar processes have happened, for instance in Northern Ireland, and there is no reason why they cannot occur in Jammu and Kashmir). There has also, of necessity, to be liberty of movement for people in different parts of the region. People must be able to travel across the line of control and the international border in safety and without harrassment from armies and militias on either side. The liberty of movement necessarily requires that all people displaced against their will, be they Kashmiri Pandits, or others, have a 'right to return', and that there be guarantees in place to enable the peaceful exercise of this right. Further, the governments of India and Pakistan must provide guarantees, firstly, to the people of Jammu and Kashmir, India and Pakistan and then to the international community that they will ensure that all sections of the population of Jammu and Kashmir (including Ladakh and the Northern Areas, and displaced populations be they Kashmiri pandits or Kashmiri muslims, many of whom live in exile in POK) will be able (in an internationally monitored) series of exercises to choose their own destiny in a free, peaceful and a fair manner. First of all, this calls for the recognition of the fact that Jammu and Kashmir is not a 'bilateral' issue that can be decided between representatives of the governments of India and Pakistan. It means international recognition of the fact that the people of Jammu and Kashmir (and their freely chosen representatives) are parties to this dispute, and that any decisions that does not involve them as parties is unacceptable. It calls for multi-lateral talks without conditions such as the 'framework of the constitution of India' or the 'two nation theory' and for making arrangements for a plebiscite under international supervision - which has been a long-standing demand of a large section of the people of Jammu and Kashmir. What results from this exercise may be an arrangement between nation states, the emergence of a new nation state or new nation states, or the de facto emergence of territories that do not define themselves as nation states. The world will not come to and end if the political map of the northern part of South Asia changes shapes and colours in order to ensure peace, stability and prosperity of the people who happen to live in these territories. I do not think that these are unrealistic and utopian demands, some instances of arrangements of this nature have in fact been tried out between states and populations in other parts of the world, and there is no reason why they cannot be emulated in this case. What it requires is imagination and pragmatic intelligence The situation as it obtains on the ground today requires us all to think all these issues through with urgency, compassion, courage and intelligence . I hope that we can see this happen in our lifetime, and that Kashmir, instead of being a valley torn as it is today can become a bridgehead for peace and co-operation between the peoples of south and central asia. I hope to set foot in such a Kashmir one day. regards Shuddha > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta From shuddha at sarai.net Sat Aug 16 17:11:19 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:11:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5F7B69B6-1053-4869-A1AB-24D4A5D03866@sarai.net> Dear Sonia, Having spelt out what I agree with you on, in my previous post, let me, in all fairness, come to what I disagree with you on. Actually, disagreement, is not necessarily what I have in mind, what I mean is where I see things differently from you. I hope that in the course of reading this exchange, our young friend Aditya Raj Kaul will recognize that it is possible for people to see things differently, and even to disagree, without having to search for new ways of insulting each other. You said, I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used > during the > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really > don¹t > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you > remember 1989 > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > provocative about > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand > strong mob > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they > did in > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. The difference between Advani's justification of the Jai Shri Ram slogan in 1989 and what I am trying to point in relation to the events of the past few days in the Kashmir valley lies in the fact that the protestors on the roads and highways of Kashmir were not 'screaming God's name and marching towards (any particular community's) localities.' Had the march been to Jammu, or Amarnath, not Muzaffarabad, and had they been seeking a deliberate confrontation with the crowds rallying to the SASS slogans, or the pilgrims to Amarnath, then you would have been absolutely right. As it happens this did not occur. And as I have pointed out before, a record number of pilgrims travelled safely to Amarnath this year, in the yatra which has just concluded.In this case, the protestors in Kashmir were marching not with aggressive intent towards another community, but towards the LOC, demanding that the borders be opened. I think there is a world of a difference in these two trajectories. I think this does suggest that we could recognize that the articulation of anger in Kashmir today is more mature than it was even in '89. This is all the more evident when we realize that every single person in any role of leadership of consequence in the Kashmir valley has called for peaceful protest, and for the maintenance of communal harmony. > I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of > oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œ > disputed > structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹ Do you remember > Naipaul¹s defence > of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but > natural for > a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years? > The point > I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to > do as > they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, > you have > very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with > politically do the same. That is why laws exist and ought to be > followed. > Again, there is a difference, I think you will agree, between an attack on a 16th century mosque, and the disarming of a CRPF bunker. The mosque, can for the sake of an argument,(though I do not buy that argument) be seen by those who wanted to raze it to the ground as a 'sign' of perceived communitarian oppression. The bunker, is much more than a 'sign', it is the actual locus of oppression. It is a place that bullets are fired from. Again, had there been attacks on temples, or even on the homes left behind by the Pandits, or the schools and colleges that still bear names and signs of Pandit or Dogra presence, your argument would have had credence. From the reports that we have received, this did not happen. Signs and symbols were not touched, what was sought to be dismantled, was the 'infrastructure' of oppression itself, and this was done without a single policeman or CRPF person losing their life. As we all know, there are enough loose weapons and explosives in the valley. And it is not as if CRPF personnel or policemen have not been made targets before. They are sitting targets. Again, I would point out to you, two policemen have lost their lives in Jammu, no policeman, CRPF personnel, or jawan has lost their lives in the past few days in Kashmir. I hope that this continues to be the case. During the 'quit India' movement in 1942, there was a significant disruption caused to the 'infrastructure' of the colonial state. Police pickets, radio towers and wireless transmission systems, for instance were disabled, and care was taken to see that lives were not lost. The people who participated in these attacks did not see what they were doing as 'violent', indeed, some, if not the majority of them, were passionate advocates of 'non-violence'. For years, the insurgency in Kashmir has been attacked on the grounds that it was only the handwork of a handful of murderous 'terrorists' with no popular base. Now that the 'people' are out on the streets, not just in thousands, but in tens of thousands, and they are not wielding AK-47s, or assasinating anyone, they are being criticized as being present in threateningly large numbers. This seems disingenous to me, you can't malign a movement when the people are not on the streets on the grounds that it is not popular, and then, when the people turn up, criticize them for being so many. Further, I do not agree that laws ought to be followed because they exist. We must, in each case, ask, which law, to what purpose, and wielded by whom, against whom, for whom. In this case, there is a contradiction between the law that guarantees the right to free assembly, and the law that prohibits assembly. It could be argued that the people of Kashmir are following the spirit of the first law in order to violate the letter of the second law. And, we all know that patently bad laws exist in Kashmir. Laws such as the Armed Forces Special Powers Act. I think it is ethically wrong to obey such a law. The question to be asking then, is not, why are the people of Kashmir not following the law, but, why are soldiers in the Indian armed forces obeying an ethically wrong law. > > Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to > light only > about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and > examined and was > not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly. What did > was the > canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards > Hindus > settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic > change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not > justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have > such a > brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare- > faced lie! > I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. The protest in Kashmir has enough justification, in terms of an anger against the alienation of land and against the violence of the state, not to have to get bogged down in the chimera of confronting demographic change. I thank you again for this exchange, as I believe that it has led us all in the direction of expressing our thoughts without getting caught in the trap of abuse, and recrimination, which some people on the list seem unfortunately to have become habituated to. regards, Shuddha Shuddhabrata Sengupta From ysaeed7 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 16 17:23:59 2008 From: ysaeed7 at yahoo.com (Yousuf) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 04:53:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Invitation: Workshop on Hindustani Music and Partition Message-ID: <524756.24650.qm@web51412.mail.re2.yahoo.com> 2-day Workshop on Hindustani Music and Partition Edward Said Hall, Jamia Millia Islamia, New Delhi 22-23 August 2008 The Asian Scholarship Foundation, Bangkok, and the Academy of Third World Studies, Jamia Millia Islamia, New Delhi, cordially invite you to participate and contribute to a 2-day convention involving dialogues and music-making with eminent musicians and researchers from India, Pakistan and Bangladesh, on the theme of the impact of 1947 Partition on cultural practices, especially the art music, of South Asia. Some ideas for this workshop evolved out of a research carried out by the Delhi-based filmmaker and writer, Yousuf Saeed, who spent a few months in Pakistan in 2005 for a fellowship on the music of South Asia. His work culminated in a report as well as a feature-length documentary film, Khayal Darpan that has been widely screened, initiating a dialogue about concerns such as the survival of art music and national identity in South Asia. The present workshop is part of a series of such dialogues to be carried out in different parts of South Asia. We hope to bring together scholars, musicians, historians, and students of music and cultural studies in an informal setting to reflect upon various issues in the study of music emerging in the context of modernity. More information and theoretical background about the workshop and the theme of its different panels can be seen at the website: http://www.ektara.org Programme Venue: Edward Said Hall, Administrative Block, Jamia Millia Islamia, Jamia Nagar, New Delhi 110025 The following list outlines the schedule of the two days that are divided into morning sessions of paper reading and discussions, afternoon’s more informal sessions with talks that may have demos of music making, and finally the evening sessions with more music making by practitioners from South Asia. Day 1: 22 August, 2008, Friday 9:30 am: Welcome/Introduction by Yousuf Saeed 9:45 am: Opening comments by Prof. Mushirul Hasan, Vice Chancellor, Jamia Millia Islamia 10:00 am: Session 1: "Cultural Identity and the Making of Nations" • Lakshmi Subramaniam (JMI, New Delhi) Identity, Nationalism and the Making of classical traditions • Gregory Booth (Univ. of Auckland, New Zealand) "Is classical music dead?" – Musical and Cultural Change in South Asia • Vibodh Parthasarthi (CCMG, JMI, New Delhi) The marking of identity in the business of recorded music: Observations from the early 20th century 12:00 pm: discussion of panel 1 Discussant: Partha Dutta (Z.H.College, Delhi) 1:00 pm: lunch 2:00 pm: Session 2: "Partition and Gharana Narratives" (with music demos) • Naseeruddin Saami (Vocalist, Karachi, Pakistan) • Vidya Rao (Vocalist, Delhi) • Asit Kumar Dey (Vocalist, Dhaka, Bangladesh) 4:00pm: Discussion of panel 2 Discussant: Saleem Kidwai (Researcher, Lucknow) 5:00 pm: Screening of archival recordings/videos of past maestros by Yousuf Saeed 6:00 pm: Music-making session (same location): • Nafees Ahmed (Sitar, Karachi, Pakistan) • Aslam Khan (Classical Vocal, Mumbai) Day 2: 23 August, 2008, Saturday 10 am: Session 3: "Knowledge Transmission Affected by the Border" • Yousuf Saeed (Independent filmmaker, New Delhi) A Survey of Music Literature Produced in Pakistan • Subhendu Ghosh (Vocalist, New Delhi) Cultural Identity and Cross Border Musical Heritage: The Bengal Experience • Amlan Dasgupta (Researcher, Archivist, Kolkata) Music across Borders 12:00 pm: discussion of panel 3 Discussant: Atmaram B. (Independent researcher, Chandigarh) 1:00 pm: lunch 2:00 pm: Session 4: Between Popular and Elite: Music Adapting to the Changing Audience • Aslam Khan (Vocalist, Mumbai) • Jon Barlow (Musician, Instrument maker, Mumbai) • Raza Kazim (Researcher, Archivist, Lahore, Pakistan) 4:00: Discussion of panel 4 Discussant: S. Kalidas (Researcher, Delhi) 6:00 pm Music-making session (at Ansari Auditorium, Jamia Millia): • Asit Kumar Dey (Classical Vocal, Dhaka, Bangladesh) • Noor Zehra Zakim (Sagar Veena, Lahore, Pakistan) • Naseeruddin Saami (Classical Vocal, Karachi, Pakistan) The workshop is free and open to all. However, the seats are limited. To see the map and directions to Jamia Millia Islamia, kindly visit http://jmi.nic.in From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 17:34:31 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:34:31 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <5F7B69B6-1053-4869-A1AB-24D4A5D03866@sarai.net> Message-ID: Hey Shuddha, Thanks for the mails & sorry I haven¹t had the time to even read them properly let alone frame a response as I am leaving Delhi tomorrow night for a whole month & have a load of stuff to do. I promise I will try & do so in a few days. And yes, it is entirely possible to have disagreements without being disagreeable. Cheers! sj On 8/16/08 5:11 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Dear Sonia,  > > > > Having spelt out what I agree with you on, in my previous post, let me, in all > fairness, come to what I disagree with you on. Actually, disagreement, is not > necessarily what I have in mind, what I mean is where I see things differently > from you. I hope that in the course of reading this exchange, our young friend > Aditya Raj Kaul will recognize that it is possible for people to see things > differently, and even to disagree, without having to search for new ways of > insulting each other. > > > > You said,  > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, >> >> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during the >> >> protests.  It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really don¹t >> >> want to vitiate and already horrible situation.  I¹m sure you remember 1989 >> >> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹  Advani had used a similar argument when >> >> challenged.  He said something like, what is communal or provocative about >> >> taking God¹s name?  What, indeed, except when there is a thousand strong mob >> >> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did in >> >> Œ92 and Œ93.  I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > The difference between Advani's justification of the Jai Shri Ram slogan in > 1989 and what I am trying to point in relation to the events of the past few > days in the Kashmir valley lies in the fact that the protestors on the roads > and highways of Kashmir were not 'screaming God's name and marching towards > (any particular community's) localities.' Had the march been to Jammu, or > Amarnath, not Muzaffarabad, and had they been seeking a deliberate > confrontation with the crowds rallying to the SASS slogans, or the pilgrims to > Amarnath, then you would have been absolutely right. As it happens this did > not occur. And as I have pointed out before, a record number of pilgrims > travelled safely to Amarnath this year, in the yatra which has just > concluded.In this case, the protestors in Kashmir were marching not with > aggressive intent towards another community, but towards the LOC, demanding > that the borders be opened. I think there is a world of a difference in these > two trajectories. I think this does suggest that we could recognize that the > articulation of anger in Kashmir today is more mature than it was even in '89. > This is all the more evident when we realize that every single person in any > role of leadership of consequence in the Kashmir valley has called for > peaceful protest, and for the maintenance of communal harmony. > > > > >> >> I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of >> >> oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œdisputed >> >> structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹  Do you remember Naipaul¹s defence >> >> of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but natural for >> >> a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years?  The point >> >> I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to do as >> >> they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you have >> >> very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with >> >> politically do the same.  That is why laws exist and ought to be followed. >> >> > > > > Again, there is a difference, I think you will agree, between an attack on a > 16th century mosque, and the disarming of a CRPF bunker. The mosque, can for > the sake of an argument,(though I do not buy that argument) be seen by those > who wanted to raze it to the ground as a 'sign' of perceived communitarian > oppression. The bunker, is much more than a 'sign', it is the actual locus of > oppression. It is a place that bullets are fired from. Again, had there been > attacks on temples, or even on the homes left behind by the Pandits, or the > schools and colleges that still bear names and signs of Pandit or Dogra > presence, your argument would have had credence. From the reports that we have > received, this did not happen. Signs and symbols were not touched, what was > sought to be dismantled, was the 'infrastructure' of oppression itself, and > this was done without a single policeman or CRPF person losing their life. As > we all know, there are enough loose weapons and explosives in the valley. And > it is not as if CRPF personnel or policemen have not been made targets before. > They are sitting targets. Again, I would point out to you, two policemen have > lost their lives in Jammu, no policeman, CRPF personnel, or jawan has lost > their lives in the past few days in Kashmir. I hope that this continues to be > the case.  > > > > During the 'quit India' movement in 1942, there was a significant disruption > caused to the 'infrastructure' of the colonial state. Police pickets, radio > towers and wireless transmission systems, for instance were disabled, and care > was taken to see that lives were not lost. The people who participated in > these attacks did not see what they were doing as 'violent', indeed, some, if > not the majority of them, were passionate advocates of 'non-violence'. > > > > For years, the insurgency in Kashmir has been attacked on the grounds that it > was only the handwork of a handful of murderous 'terrorists' with no popular > base. Now that the 'people' are out on the streets, not just in thousands, but > in tens of thousands, and they are not wielding AK-47s, or assasinating > anyone, they are being criticized as being present in threateningly large > numbers. This seems disingenous to me, you can't malign a movement when the > people are not on the streets on the grounds that it is not popular, and then, > when the people turn up, criticize them for being so many. > > > > Further, I do not agree that laws ought to be followed because they exist. We > must, in each case, ask, which law, to what purpose, and wielded by whom, > against whom, for whom. In this case, there is a contradiction between the law > that guarantees the right to free assembly, and the law that prohibits > assembly. It could be argued that the people of Kashmir are following the > spirit of the first law in order to violate the letter of the second law. And, > we all know that patently bad laws exist in Kashmir. Laws such as the Armed > Forces Special Powers Act. I think it is ethically wrong to obey such a law. > The question to be asking then, is not, why are the people of Kashmir not > following the law, but, why are soldiers in the Indian armed forces obeying an > ethically wrong law.  > > >> >> >> >> Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to light only >> >> about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and examined and was >> >> not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly.  What did was the >> >> canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards Hindus >> >> settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic >> >> change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not >> >> justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have such a >> >> brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare-faced lie! >> >> > > > I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer of the > Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of > xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. And > everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of thought. >  When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, > they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, > especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic > change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. The protest in > Kashmir has enough justification, in terms of an anger against the alienation > of land and against the violence of the state, not to have to get bogged down > in the chimera of confronting demographic change.  > > > > I thank you again for this exchange, as I believe that it has led us all in > the direction of expressing our thoughts without getting caught in the trap of > abuse, and recrimination, which some people on the list seem unfortunately to > have become habituated to. > > > > regards,  > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > > From mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 18:58:05 2008 From: mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com (mahmood farooqui) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 18:58:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger Message-ID: I have been trying to understand the anger, rage, rather of the KPs. I understand a fair bit of it, I understand some of the pain of the displacement--second hand at least-, I understand the resentment at the disrespect and the neglect shown towards them by the intellectuals and the secularists, I understand something of those things. What I want to understand is why does everything turn, for a lot of their exponents here, on the love for the Indian nation, or rather, more appropriately, on the love for the Indian state. Why must the Indian state, and all its weaknesses, be worshipped to sanctify Kashmiri Pandit pain. How does humiliation turn into glorification for an entity that is actually complicit in their brutality? Is there no other way to make sense of this tragedy? From vikaskaul at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 20:28:56 2008 From: vikaskaul at gmail.com (Vikas Kaul) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 09:58:56 -0500 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger Message-ID: Before I make an attempt in trying to help you make sense out of your perceived conundrum, I was wondering if you could clarify one thing for me. You said: "I understand some of the pain of the displacement--second hand at least." What does "second hand at least" mean? From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 23:01:01 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 23:01:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808161031vd58fc0cx1134783fbf4c4816@mail.gmail.com> Dear Mahmood , I agree with you . While as we Kashmiri Pandit should not love India as a state as much , but the respect for the Indian nation should be there. I agree that along with terrorists , separatists the Indian Govt has been a complicit which resulted in the miseries of the Kashmiri pandits. I must admit that this mail of your has been the only understanding mail which I have received viz a viz our expression on this otherwise pseudo secular and leftist forum. Thanks for your understanding. Regards Pawan Durani On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 6:58 PM, mahmood farooqui < mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > I have been trying to understand the anger, rage, rather of the KPs. I > understand a fair bit of it, I understand some of the pain of the > displacement--second hand at least-, I understand the resentment at the > disrespect and the neglect shown towards them by the intellectuals and the > secularists, I understand something of those things. > > What I want to understand is why does everything turn, for a lot of their > exponents here, on the love for the Indian nation, or rather, more > appropriately, on the love for the Indian state. Why must the Indian state, > and all its weaknesses, be worshipped to sanctify Kashmiri Pandit pain. How > does humiliation turn into glorification for an entity that is actually > complicit in their brutality? > > Is there no other way to make sense of this tragedy? > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 23:19:31 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 23:19:31 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Land row conflict between nationalist and anti-national forces' Message-ID: <6353c690808161049o350b5119lb47801cf34e6f84a@mail.gmail.com> *'Land row conflict between nationalist and anti-national forces'* *New Delhi (PTI):* Accusing the PDP of misleading the people of Jammu and Kashmir, former state Governor S K Sinha on Saturday described the Amarnath land row as a conflict between nationalist and anti-national forces. "PDP is considered as pro-India party. But they lead march to Muzafarrabad. Despite knowing fully well about the Baltal land, they are busy misleading the people," Sinha said on the sidelines of a function here. He said the PDP ministers had given clearance for the transfer of land after proposals were made by the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board in 2005. "This proposal was considered by the government for three long years and finally cleared by two cabinet ministers belonging to PDP. Later, the PDP jumped on the bandwagon with extremists to fuel communal sentiments," he said delivering the first Field Marshal Manekshaw memorial lecture here. Claiming that the decision to revoke the order of land given to the Amarnath Shrine board by the government was "illegal and and violating Hight Court order", Sinha said, "it is opportunist politicians like Mufti Mohammad Sayed who hijacked attempts to promote liberal and modern outlook and cater to fanatic outlook". Terming the Amarnath land row as a "non-issue" picked up by the extremists, he said "the present conflict in Jammu and Kashmir is not between Hindus and Muslims as such, but between nationalist and anti-national forces". From indersalim at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 23:22:19 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 23:22:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808161031vd58fc0cx1134783fbf4c4816@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808161031vd58fc0cx1134783fbf4c4816@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808161052w2163b433lae93fdc08c49c16a@mail.gmail.com> kashmiri pandits do exist somewhere in the universe, but are not the centre of universe. this is what Dear mahmood said, at least i feel so. On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:01 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Dear Mahmood , > I agree with you . While as we Kashmiri Pandit should not love India as a > state as much , but the respect for the Indian nation should be there. > > I agree that along with terrorists , separatists the Indian Govt has been a > complicit which resulted in the miseries of the Kashmiri pandits. > > I must admit that this mail of your has been the only understanding mail > which I have received viz a viz our expression on this > otherwise pseudo secular and leftist forum. > Thanks for your understanding. > > Regards > > Pawan Durani > > On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 6:58 PM, mahmood farooqui < > mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > >> I have been trying to understand the anger, rage, rather of the KPs. I >> understand a fair bit of it, I understand some of the pain of the >> displacement--second hand at least-, I understand the resentment at the >> disrespect and the neglect shown towards them by the intellectuals and the >> secularists, I understand something of those things. >> >> What I want to understand is why does everything turn, for a lot of their >> exponents here, on the love for the Indian nation, or rather, more >> appropriately, on the love for the Indian state. Why must the Indian state, >> and all its weaknesses, be worshipped to sanctify Kashmiri Pandit pain. How >> does humiliation turn into glorification for an entity that is actually >> complicit in their brutality? >> >> Is there no other way to make sense of this tragedy? >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From amitabh at sarai.net Sat Aug 16 23:57:36 2008 From: amitabh at sarai.net (Amitabh Kumar) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 23:57:36 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Request from Samdhong Rinponche Message-ID: *A Personal Request* Dear all, You might have seen the Appeal issued by the Tibetan Solidarity Committee to request all the Tibetans, Tibet Support Groups and peace loving people of the world to observe 12-hour symbolic fasting and prayer on 30th August 2008, for world peace and, particularly, for the departed souls of the Tibetan people in recent months in Tibet. And re-commit ourselves to the path of non-violence. The objectives and how to observe the fasting are mentioned in detail in that Appeal. If you have not received the Appeal as yet, please visit our official website 'www.tibet.net' and 'www.stoptibetcrisis.org'. We consider this as extremely important non-violent action by Tibetans under the leadership of His Holiness the Dalai Lama in a very critical period inside Tibet, particularly the post Olympic period. I personally request you/your organization to kindly participate in this fasting and prayer and encourage many other people to join us in this effort to reduce our own defilements and to create wisdom and compassion in the minds of the oppressor. I believe you will cooperate us in this non-violent action. With my warm personal greetings, Yours sincerely, Samdhong Rinpoche KALON TRIPA -- www.amitabhkumar.blogspot.com From indersalim at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 01:17:42 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 01:17:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: <5F7B69B6-1053-4869-A1AB-24D4A5D03866@sarai.net> Message-ID: <47e122a70808161247o56974512mb598c87ea96a73e3@mail.gmail.com> SAY YES TO UTOPIA IN KASHMIR . I believe, following points emerged after going through an interesting exchange between Sonia and Shuddha, which can become part of further debate on Kashmir issue: 1. Kashmir is not a bilateral issue between Pakistan and India. People of Jammu and Kashmir have to be a part of any understanding on it. Representatives of Kashmir need to work out a clear policy. The present Hurriyat conference is a divided house. National Conference, Congress and PDP etc are/were always opportunistic in dealing the issue at the core, and therefore, there should be a clear scheme in sight on how to recognize a genuine representative body in Kashmir. 2. A Naya Free Kashmir ( new Kashmir ) may be a place where anybody can live freely, but should not be allowed to acquire land for greed. Government land should be allotted to landless families. Kashmiri families who want to return be included in allotment schemes. 3. Demilitarization of Kashmir should begin at the earliest. Those who demand it should also learn to live without a security cover. Representative bodies of Kashmir should guide people on how to deal with rogue militants. 4. To confront the law is reasonable when Law of the Occupied is in vogue. But, laws which are acceptable to people should be charted out. For example, Gandhi suggested people not to used British goods, and simultaneously suggested how to spun khadi. Millions of people followed him and something similar can happen in Kashmir, if there is a will to achieve something unique. 5. Supporters of a free Tibet are everywhere because of their inherent non-violent ways of dealing with the Chinese occupation. It was a British citizen who hoisted Tibet slogan/flag in Beijing Olympics. Something similar can happen if Kashmiris become creative in protests. The recent peaceful protest in the valley is a positive beginning. Gun culture should be abandoned completely, which has become an excuse for Indian security forces to stay there in large numbers. 6. I see nothing wrong in sex work (provided it does not involve coercion or minors), I too agree with Shuddha, but the new representatives for a free Kashmir need to include this in their agenda. Having said this, I believe the level of violence in Kashmir against women is quite less in comparison to violence in India or in Pakistan. But Kashmiri MALES need to provide spaces to women while electing new representatives for a free Kashmir. They need to have a scientific outlook while dealing with women's issues. 7. Environment is the new wave which can dismantle solid words like Freedom, Plebiscite, Rights, etc unless new ways are not discovered to understand new politics. Environmentally speaking , Kashmiris and all the people of the world are a tightly woven fabric, and we don't know how to cut it and where to stitch it for our day to day use. We are truly clueless with regard to energy requirements once the oil reserves begin to disappear. Human beings are growing at the expense of other species on this planet. We have to find an answer to all the environmental crises. That is too urgent. 8. A Naya free Kashmir must create a space for so called confused peoples, ( as Aditya Raj kaul found me ) because I believe, musicians, poets artists and performers are a confused lot in the first place, and therefore, must be seen as integral part of society. Too many journalists, advocates and the present lot of politicians in the new representative body will spoil the dream of a free Kashmir. 9. A new free Kashmir should not interfere in the religious matters at all. People should be advised/motivated not to donate money at shrines, or if they do so they money should be go social and cultural activists. 10. Recently I did a short opera on river in Kashmir, Te Vyeth Rooz Pakkan ( The river jehlum moves on ) in U.K. . This was arranged by Luton mela committee in Luton, which has a 25% population from Azad kashmir. Mr. Zulfikar Ahmed is the chairman of the committee, who invited us for a dinner next to a place which was occupied by Amman-Ula-khan for quite some time. Secretrary of J&K cultural academy Zaffar Iqbal khan Minhas was also there, but as it happens now, it happened there also; we talked on politics and nothing on the art and culture. Mr. Zulfikar regretted that the present Luton's A.Kashmir population is divided into Chaudhries, Rajas and Maliks, although they donate some pounds to sufi musicians from Pakistan as and when they sing a ghazal or so in their honour, but they are quite worried about the fate of their children who are neither Pakistanis, nor kashmiris nor Brits. The worst is that British public and police is a little uncomfortable with large muslim population there. Zulfikar is a worried person, who has clueless about future of these kashmiri children. Nobody speaks kashmiri language there, let alone going back to Azad Kashmir. At the moment, I think it is enough for a new free Kashmir, but suggestion and alteration are welcome. I know, it will be hazy in the end, but … With love and regards Inder salim On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 5:34 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > Hey Shuddha, > > Thanks for the mails & sorry I haven¹t had the time to even read them > properly let alone frame a response as I am leaving Delhi tomorrow night for > a whole month & have a load of stuff to do. > > I promise I will try & do so in a few days. And yes, it is entirely > possible to have disagreements without being disagreeable. > > Cheers! > sj > > > On 8/16/08 5:11 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > >> Dear Sonia, >> >> >> >> Having spelt out what I agree with you on, in my previous post, let me, in all >> fairness, come to what I disagree with you on. Actually, disagreement, is not >> necessarily what I have in mind, what I mean is where I see things differently >> from you. I hope that in the course of reading this exchange,our young friend >> Aditya Raj Kaul will recognize that it is possible for people to see things >> differently, and even to disagree, without having to search for new ways of >> insulting each other. >> >> >> >> You said, >> >> >> >> I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, >>> >>> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during the >>> >>> protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really don¹t >>> >>> want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember 1989 >>> >>> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when >>> >>> challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative about >>> >>> taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand strong mob >>> >>> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did in >>> >>> Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. >> >> >> The difference between Advani's justification of the Jai Shri Ram slogan in >> 1989 and what I am trying to point in relation to the events of the past few >> days in the Kashmir valley lies in the fact that the protestors on the roads >> and highways of Kashmir were not 'screaming God's name and marching towards >> (any particular community's) localities.' Had the march been to Jammu, or >> Amarnath, not Muzaffarabad, and had they been seeking a deliberate >> confrontation with the crowds rallying to the SASS slogans, or the pilgrims to >> Amarnath, then you would have been absolutely right. As it happens this did >> not occur. And as I have pointed out before, a record number of pilgrims >> travelled safely to Amarnath this year, in the yatra which has just >> concluded.In this case, the protestors in Kashmir were marching not with >> aggressive intent towards another community, but towards the LOC, demanding >> that the borders be opened. I think there is a world of a difference in these >> two trajectories. I think this does suggest that we could recognize that the >> articulation of anger in Kashmir today is more mature than it was even in '89. >> This is all the more evident when we realize that every single person in any >> role of leadership of consequence in the Kashmir valley has called for >> peaceful protest, and for the maintenance of communal harmony. >> >> >> >> >>> >>> I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of >>> >>> oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œdisputed >>> >>> structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹ Do you remember Naipaul¹s defence >>> >>> of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but natural for >>> >>> a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years? The point >>> >>> I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to do as >>> >>> they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you have >>> >>> very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with >>> >>> politically do the same. That is why laws exist and ought to be followed. >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Again, there is a difference, I think you will agree, between an attack on a >> 16th century mosque, and the disarming of a CRPF bunker. The mosque, can for >> the sake of an argument,(though I do not buy that argument) be seen by those >> who wanted to raze it to the ground as a 'sign' of perceived communitarian >> oppression. The bunker, is much more than a 'sign', it is the actual locus of >> oppression. It is a place that bullets are fired from. Again, had there been >> attacks on temples, or even on the homes left behind by the Pandits, or the >> schools and colleges that still bear names and signs of Pandit or Dogra >> presence, your argument would have had credence. From the reports that we have >> received, this did not happen. Signs and symbols were not touched, what was >> sought to be dismantled, was the 'infrastructure' of oppression itself, and >> this was done without a single policeman or CRPF person losing their life. As >> we all know, there are enough loose weapons and explosives in the valley. And >> it is not as if CRPF personnel or policemen have not been made targets before. >> They are sitting targets. Again, I would point out to you, two policemen have >> lost their lives in Jammu, no policeman, CRPF personnel, or jawan has lost >> their lives in the past few days in Kashmir. I hope that this continues to be >> the case. >> >> >> >> During the 'quit India' movement in 1942, there was a significant disruption >> caused to the 'infrastructure' of the colonial state. Police pickets, radio >> towers and wireless transmission systems, for instance were disabled, and care >> was taken to see that lives were not lost. The people who participated in >> these attacks did not see what they were doing as 'violent', indeed, some, if >> not the majority of them, were passionate advocates of 'non-violence'. >> >> >> >> For years, the insurgency in Kashmir has been attacked on the grounds that it >> was only the handwork of a handful of murderous 'terrorists' with no popular >> base. Now that the 'people' are out on the streets, not just in thousands, but >> in tens of thousands, and they are not wielding AK-47s, or assasinating >> anyone, they are being criticized as being present in threateningly large >> numbers. This seems disingenous to me, you can't malign a movement when the >> people are not on the streets on the grounds that it is not popular, and then, >> when the people turn up, criticize them for being so many. >> >> >> >> Further, I do not agree that laws ought to be followed because they exist. We >> must, in each case, ask, which law, to what purpose, and wielded by whom, >> against whom, for whom. In this case, there is a contradiction between the law >> that guarantees the right to free assembly, and the law that prohibits >> assembly. It could be argued that the people of Kashmir are following the >> spirit of the first law in order to violate the letter of the second law. And, >> we all know that patently bad laws exist in Kashmir. Laws such as the Armed >> Forces Special Powers Act. I think it is ethically wrong to obey such a law. >> The question to be asking then, is not, why are the people of Kashmir not >> following the law, but, why are soldiers in the Indian armed forces obeying an >> ethically wrong law. >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to light only >>> >>> about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and examined and was >>> >>> not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly. What did was the >>> >>> canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards Hindus >>> >>> settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic >>> >>> change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not >>> >>> justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have such a >>> >>> brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare-faced lie! >>> >>> >> >> >> I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer of the >> Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of >> xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. And >> everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of thought. >> When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, >> they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, >> especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic >> change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. The protest in >> Kashmir has enough justification, in terms of an anger against the alienation >> of land and against the violence of the state, not to have to get bogged down >> in the chimera of confronting demographic change. >> >> >> >> I thank you again for this exchange, as I believe that it has led us all in >> the direction of expressing our thoughts without getting caught in the trap of >> abuse, and recrimination, which some people on the list seem unfortunately to >> have become habituated to. >> >> >> >> regards, >> >> >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> >> >> >> >> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 02:08:23 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 02:08:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808161052w2163b433lae93fdc08c49c16a@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808161031vd58fc0cx1134783fbf4c4816@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808161052w2163b433lae93fdc08c49c16a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808161338p6da2cb9eu692083eb242f4fb6@mail.gmail.com> i think actually mahmood has raised a very pertinent and troubling question, and one that it would be worthwhile to discuss. And on this issue I think many of us who otherwise have disagreed vehemently with Aditya, Pawan and Kshamendra on this list might actually like to begin a discussion. Its a curious question, this. And this contradiction has surfaced over and over again in the discussions we have had on the list. So while on one hand there is a rage against what is seen as being a complicity of the state with the dispossesion of the KPs from their ancestral homes, there is a simultaneous genuflection to it. Let me hazard a few guesses: One, is a realisation of the immense power that the state wields. Two is a fear that if azadi were to come to Kashmir now, given what has occurred in the last 15 years, there is a sense that the terms of this azadi and self-determination will have no place for kashmiri pandits. Therefore if you cannot support a movement that is seen as being deterimental to your intrests then it makes sense to throw ones lot in with the state. Also I think there is a much more sinister politics at play in which lines have been drawn along religion so sharply that self-determiantion is seen as being a kashmiri muslim demand, and the state system is allied, in its current configuration, with the right. And the state is totally complicit in producing a situation in which the rights of the kashmiri pandits become allied to an idea of akand bharat, and therefore any opposition to akhand bharat is logically seen as detrimental to KP interests. And in all of this the state grins like the cheshire cat, now you see it now you dont. best A On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:22 PM, inder salim wrote: > kashmiri pandits do exist somewhere in the universe, but are not the > centre of universe. this is what Dear mahmood said, at least i feel > so. > > On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:01 PM, Pawan Durani > wrote: > > Dear Mahmood , > > I agree with you . While as we Kashmiri Pandit should not love India as a > > state as much , but the respect for the Indian nation should be there. > > > > I agree that along with terrorists , separatists the Indian Govt has been > a > > complicit which resulted in the miseries of the Kashmiri pandits. > > > > I must admit that this mail of your has been the only understanding mail > > which I have received viz a viz our expression on this > > otherwise pseudo secular and leftist forum. > > > Thanks for your understanding. > > > > Regards > > > > Pawan Durani > > > > On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 6:58 PM, mahmood farooqui < > > mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > > > >> I have been trying to understand the anger, rage, rather of the KPs. I > >> understand a fair bit of it, I understand some of the pain of the > >> displacement--second hand at least-, I understand the resentment at the > >> disrespect and the neglect shown towards them by the intellectuals and > the > >> secularists, I understand something of those things. > >> > >> What I want to understand is why does everything turn, for a lot of > their > >> exponents here, on the love for the Indian nation, or rather, more > >> appropriately, on the love for the Indian state. Why must the Indian > state, > >> and all its weaknesses, be worshipped to sanctify Kashmiri Pandit pain. > How > >> does humiliation turn into glorification for an entity that is actually > >> complicit in their brutality? > >> > >> Is there no other way to make sense of this tragedy? > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 02:20:23 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 02:20:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: References: <313018.45033.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808161350o17cc7a96l1ab8c304de7411f6@mail.gmail.com> Dear Kshmendra, I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a "law-breaker" who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening this sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its capacity for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. best A On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: mahmood farooqui > Date: 2008/8/14 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > > > Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the responses > are making me think. > > Best, > Mahmood > > 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul > > Dear Mahmood > > > > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. You are trying > > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. > > > > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum > > attacking a policeman. > > > > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. If > > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or > > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured by > > police firing. > > > > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal. > > > > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums in > > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? > > > > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, one where > law > > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one > where > > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. > > > > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the photographs, > one > > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' tinge > > > > Kshmendra > > > > > > > > > > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui >*wrote: > > > > From: mahmood farooqui > > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > > To: "sarai list" , "Aamir Bashir" < > > unattore1 at gmail.com> > > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > > > > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because of > the > > police firing. > > > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan Times, > > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a Kashmiri. > > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the > police. > > > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the police > > firing. > > > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > > > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sun Aug 17 02:41:26 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 21:11:26 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] The Real Face of Delhi - Pat Jammu, Kill Kashmir - by Ghulam Nabi Khayal In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808161350o17cc7a96l1ab8c304de7411f6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <176047.90387.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> The real face of Delhi Pat Jammu, Kill Kashmir THOUGHTFUL THOUGHT BY GHULAM NABI KHAYAL It is in Jammu, that every one has seen with open eyes how  the  Indian forces treated violent agitators as blue eyed boys whereas they were killed in scores in the streets of Kashmir valley. The number of civilians shot dead by the killer troopers across the Valley and also those injured out of barbaric beatings and thrashing are a gory witness to the bitter fact that Delhi has once again adopted double standards with regard to this suppressed Himalayan region.        It was in Jammu where anti-Muslim rowdy protesters of India’s fanatic outfits like BJP, Bajrang Dal, VHP, Shiv Sena and the like not only defied curfew with impunity and total violence but also indulged in worst type of hooliganism when they torched residential localities of the Muslims, burnt their mosques, attacked their marriage parties and asked them to leave Jammu which they thought still belonged to Gulab Singh Hari Singh.        These vagabonds went to the extent of blockade of Srinagar-Jammu highway so that eight million Kashmiri Muslims are starved to death with their forced closure of this only but a cursed supply line. Brandishing swords, tridents, petrol bombs and even country made pistols they held the entire Jammu as hostage for about two months but the law enforcing machinery remained mute spectator to this vandalism and lawlessness. Even those troopers who were attacked and beaten to pulp by rioters did not react and behaved as hopelessly as one would not imagine particularly in the background of their contrary way of dealing with people in Kashmir.        There are confirmed reports that curfew passes were issued to rioters and most of the peace loving citizens in Jammu were denied this facility. Unconfirmed reports, having come in from various reliable  sources in Jammu, have made this startling revelation that forces in Jammu were issued weapons with empty magazines and without  ammunition. It was in view of this deplorable bias of the guardians of law and order in favour of violent agitators of Jammu that one person was made to be eulogised as a martyr. The person in question had in fact taken a heavy loan from a bank and was not in a position to pay it back. He was therefore left with no option but to end his life and the Jammu rioters claimed that he was shot dead by the police. A fraudulent claim exposed by Dr Farooq Abdullah  publicly.        Two senior officers of the State government are reportedly responsible for ordering the troopers not to harm the Jammu agitators even if they cause damage to the public property. Having been let loose to play havoc with everything coming in their way, the rioters therefore felt comfortable to set fire to a police station, mosques and attack Muslims murderously  in Rajouri, Poonch and Kishtwar. The police and the CRPF watched this rape of humanity with a mischievous smile on their lips.  And it is here in Kashmir, that peaceful and unarmed people while trying to find out an alternate way to have medicines for their patients, milk for children and food for themselves, are treated as animals and killed in scores with impunity.  We may ask: how come that only a few persons were killed in the violent-agitation in Jammu which continued for about two months with unprecedented hooliganism. But here in Kashmir; more than 30 innocent civilians were shot dead only in two days, 11,12 August, by the Indian troopers. Even ambulances carrying dead bodies were not spared by the trigger-happy forces. Besides this massacre, the army and paramilitary forces set ablaze several houses, beat up   inmates and went to the extent of  brutality that  their own bamboo sticks were seen breaking into pieces while beating Muslim youth like barbarians. Live coverage of this brutality was repeatedly shown by local as well as embedded Indian private TV channels.  How and why was the Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Abdul Aziz martyred? Why he was not stopped on way to Muzaffarabad and taken into custody en route?           This carnage has taken a new turn, of course, not to console sufferers in any way, that Inspector general of police of Kashmir zone, S M Sahai has openly blamed army and CRPF saying, “those killed (Tuesday) had actually fallen to the bullets of army and CRPF.” He added that even a sub divisional police officer and special police officer were also wounded in this firing.  People of Kashmir, the Muslims in particular, are broadmindedly of a secular character. They have withstood onslaughts from time to time at the hands of usurpers of their basic rights and peaceful resolution of problems but have never  taken to communlise the situation even when extremist Hindus in India have inflicted deep wounds on their ethos and psyche.   In this context, they had almost forgotten how Jammu has been communally and fanatically behaving with them during the last 60 years and had forgiven them for their sins.  Kashmiris had forgotten how Gulab Singh would skin alive his Muslim subjects in Kashmir for their making genuine demands about a possible improvement in their miserable living.  People of Kashmir didn’t want to recall the bloody episode when Dogra soldiers pumped bullets into frail bodies of Kashmiris outside Central Jail in Srinagar 0n 13 July 1931 killing 23 citizens on spot.  They had forgotten how about 500,000 Jammu Muslims were butchered by Dogra killers and forces of Hari Singh in November 1947 when they were herded out for journey through  a train to Pakistan which never came. Instead, death came to them in a frightful way.  They had also forgotten that it was Prem Nath Dogra’s Jana Sangh which instigated an agitation against Kashmir government forcing Delhi to depose and arrest Prime Minister Sheikh Abdullah and his colleagues.  Since then, Jammu has been proving a political liability for Kashmir and its safe and secure political future.  Enough is enough. It is high time that a highly communalised Jammu finds its own way of existence of course outside the domain of Kashmir Valley. This may also culminate in a viable solution of a vexed Kashmir dispute the settlement of which is always hindered by Jammu on the pretext of having internal autonomy for it prior to a final decision taken about Kashmir tangle.  What Jammu is for Muslims, was again demonstrated on 9 August when hardliner elements of Jammu did not allow pro-India loyalists to participate in the meeting on Amar Nath row and shamelessly, they sat outside for hours like beggars at some shrine.  Let people of Kashmir not be swayed by hypocritical slogans raised in Kashmir in favour of so called unity of the State. This is a day-dream and most of the politicians have been dreaming it to carry on with their political gimmickry at the cost of eight million Kashmiri Muslims. (Feedback to: gulkhayal at yahoo.co.uk) Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sun Aug 17 03:48:17 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 22:18:17 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Think the unthinkable by Vir Sanghvi In-Reply-To: <176047.90387.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <502665.6017.qm@web27805.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Counterpoint | Vir SanghviEmail Author August 16, 2008First Published: 22:55 IST(16/8/2008)Last Updated: 23:15 IST(16/8/2008) addthis_pub = 'hindustantimes'; addthis_logo = 'http://www.hindustantimes.com/HomePage/images/ht_logo.png'; addthis_logo_background = 'EFEFFF'; addthis_logo_color = '666699'; addthis_brand = 'HindustanTimes.Com'; addthis_options = 'favorites, google, email, myweb, digg, delicious, myspace, facebook, live, more';  Have you been reading the news coming out of Kashmir with a mounting sense of despair?  I know I have. It’s clear now that the optimism of the last few months — all those articles telling us that normalcy had returned to Kashmir — was misplaced.  Nothing has really changed since the 1990s. A single spark — such as the dispute over Amarnath land —  can set the whole valley on fire, so deep is the resentment, anger and the extent of secessionist feeling. Indian forces are treated as an army of occupation. New Delhi is seen as the oppressor. There is no engagement with the Indian mainstream. And even the major political parties do not hesitate to play the Pakistan card — Mehbooba Mufti is quite willing to march to the Line of Control. At one level, the current crisis in Kashmir is a consequence of a series of actions by the Indian establishment. New Delhi let the situation fester until it was too late. The state administration veered between inaction and over-reaction. The Sangh Parivar played politics with Hindu sentiment in Jammu, raising the confrontation to a new level. But we need to look at the Kashmir situation in a deeper way. We can no longer treat it on a case-by-case basis: solve this crisis, and then wait and see how things turn out in the future. If the experience of the last two decades has taught us anything, it is that the situation never really returns to normal. Even when we see the outward symptoms of peace, we miss the alienation and resentment within.  No matter what we do, things never get better, for very long. It’s not as though the Indian state has no experience of dealing with secessionist movements. Almost from the time we became independent 61 years ago, we have been faced with calls for secession from nearly every corner of India:  from Nagaland, Assam and Mizoram, from Tamil Nadu, from Punjab etc. In every single case, democracy has provided the solution. We have followed a three-pronged approach: strong, almost brutal, police or army action against those engaging in violence, a call to the secessionist leaders to join the democratic process and then, generous central assistance for the rebuilding of the state. It is an approach that has worked brilliantly. Even in, say, Mizoram, where alienation was at its height in the 1970s, the new generation sees itself as Indian. The Nagas now concentrate their demands on a redrawing of state boundaries (to take in part of Manipur), not on a threat to the integrity of India. In Tamil Nadu, the Hindi agitation is forgotten and in Punjab, Khalistan is a distant memory. The exception to this trend has been Kashmir. Contrary to what many Kashmiris claim, we have tried everything. Even today, the state enjoys a special status. Under Article 370 of our Constitution, with the exception of defence, foreign policy, and communication, no law enacted by parliament has any legitimacy in Kashmir unless the state government gives its consent. The state is the only one in India to have its own Constitution and the President of India cannot issue directions to the state government in exercise of the executive power of the Union as he can in every other state. Kashmiri are Indian citizens but Indians are not necessarily Kashmiri citizens.  We cannot vote for elections to their assembly or own any property in Kashmir. Then, there is the money. Bihar gets per capita central assistance of Rs 876 per year. Kashmir gets over ten times more: Rs 9,754 per year. While in Bihar and other states, this assistance is mainly in the forms of loans to the state, in Kashmir 90 per cent is an outright grant. Kashmir’s entire Five Year Plan expenditure is met by the Indian taxpayer. In addition, New Delhi keeps throwing more and more money at the state: in 2004, the Prime Minister gave Kashmir another $ 5 billion for development. Kashmiris are happy to take the money and the special rights but they argue that India has been unfair to them because no free political process has developed. And, it is true that we have rigged elections in Kashmir.  But, it is now nearly a decade  since any rigging was alleged. Nobody disputes that the last election was fair. Moreover, even though the Congress got more seats than the PDP, the Chief Ministership went to Mufti Mohammad Sayeed as a gesture. Given that Kashmir has the best deal of any Indian state, is there anything more we can do? Kashmiris talk about more autonomy.  But I don’t see a) what more we can give them and b) how much difference it will make. If you step back and think about it, the real question is not “how do we solve this month’s crisis”?  It is: what does the Centre get in return for the special favours and the billions of dollars? The short answer is: damn all. As the current agitation demonstrates, far from gratitude, there is active hatred of India. Pakistan, a small, second-rate country that has been left far behind by India, suddenly acts as though it is on par with us, lecturing India in human rights and threatening to further internationalise the present crisis. The world looks at us with dismay. If we are the largest democracy on the planet then how can we hang on to a people who have no desire to be part of India? The other cost of Kashmir is military. Many terrorist acts, from the hijacking of IC 814 to the attack on parliament have Kashmir links. Our response to the parliament attack was Operation Parakram, which cost, in ten months, Rs 6,500 crore and 800 army lives? (Kargil cost us 474 lives.) Each day, our troops and paramilitary forces are subjected to terrorists’s attacks, stress, and ridicule. So, here’s my question: why are we still hanging on to Kashmir if the Kashmiris don’t want to have anything to do with us?  The answer is machismo. We have been conned into believing that it would diminish India if Kashmir seceded. And so, as we lose lives and billions of dollars, the Kashmiris revel in calling us names knowing that we will never have the guts to let them go. But would India really be diminished? One argument is that offering Kashmiris the right to self-determination would encourage every other secessionist group. But would it? Isn’t there already a sense in which we treat Kashmir as a special case? No other secessionist group gets Article 370 or so much extra consideration. Besides, if you take this line, then no solution (autonomy, soft borders etc.) is possible because you could argue that everybody else would want it too. A second objection is that Indian secularism would be damaged by the secession of Kashmir. This is clearly not true. As history has shown, Indian Muslims feel no special kinship with Kashmir. They would not feel less Indian if some Kashmiris departed. Moreover, too much is made of the size of Kashmir. Actually secessionist feeling is concentrated in the Valley, an area with a population of 4 million that is 98 per cent Muslim. (The Hindus either left or were driven out). Neither Jammu nor Ladakh want to secede. So, is the future of India to be held hostage to a population less than half the size of the population of Delhi? I reckon we should hold a referendum in the Valley. Let the Kashmiris determine their own destiny. If they want to stay in India, they are welcome. But if they don’t, then we have no moral right to force them to remain. If they vote for integration with Pakistan, all this will mean is that Azad Kashmir will gain a little more territory. If they opt for independence, they will last for about 15 minutes without the billions that India has showered on them. But it will be their decision. Whatever happens, how can India lose? If you believe in democracy, then giving Kashmiris the right to self-determination is the correct thing to do. And even if you don’t, surely we will be better off being rid of this constant, painful strain on our resources, our lives, and our honour as a nation? This is India’s century. We have the world to conquer — and the means to do it. Kashmir is a 20th century problem. We cannot let it drag us down and bleed us as we assume our rightful place in the world. It’s time to think the unthinkable. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 09:51:27 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 21:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: Terrorists continue attacks on Chengara protesters In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <107708b5-7475-40be-a238-f76107a612ab@1g2000pre.googlegroups.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Dileep Raj" Date: 17 Aug, 09:19 Subject: Terrorists continue attacks on Chengara protesters To: Green Youth Movement I am summarising two reports from today's newspapers. 1. fron Malayala Manorama: Health Camps won't be Allowed: Workers Athumbumkulam (Konni): Ther blockade by workers creates hindrance before the intended health camp at Chengara struggle site by health department.Yesterday,there were  heated arguments between health department officials and plantation workers. The officials went thier on district collector P.C.Sanalkumar's instruction. The state health department authorities were convinced on visiting the site that many protesters are undergoing severe health problems.They are using the water from river for coocking.Health department considers this as the major cause for health problems. The workers union leaders reiterates that they won't allow anybody from outside to visit struggle site. If this adament stand continues, health assistance will remain a mirage for  protesters. The health department authorities says that workers yesterday bahaved rudely to the officials. Their position is that no health camp will be allowed. 2. From Madhyamam Workers attack Chengara activists Pathanamthitta:Plantation workers beat up people coming out of Chengara struggle site on Friday. Bhavani ( Harisree, Mavelikkara,50),Dinesh ( PuthanVeettil, Kalayanad,24),Sujitha(18),Sosamma(madathara Road Puambokkil,48),Mani (Udayavilasam, Piravanthoor,55) and K.Ravi( RevathiBhavan,Venjarammood, 50) were admited to Pathanamthitta general hospital.They were undergoing health problems and came out seeking treatment, said Laha Gopalan,SadhuJanaSamyukthaVedi president. Even in the midst of blockade, food utensils are being smuggled into the struggle site. But it si not enough to distribute among all huts. many families are starving for days. . - -- Dileep R I thuravoor From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 09:51:27 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 21:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: Terrorists continue attacks on Chengara protesters In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <107708b5-7475-40be-a238-f76107a612ab@1g2000pre.googlegroups.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Dileep Raj" Date: 17 Aug, 09:19 Subject: Terrorists continue attacks on Chengara protesters To: Green Youth Movement I am summarising two reports from today's newspapers. 1. fron Malayala Manorama: Health Camps won't be Allowed: Workers Athumbumkulam (Konni): Ther blockade by workers creates hindrance before the intended health camp at Chengara struggle site by health department.Yesterday,there were  heated arguments between health department officials and plantation workers. The officials went thier on district collector P.C.Sanalkumar's instruction. The state health department authorities were convinced on visiting the site that many protesters are undergoing severe health problems.They are using the water from river for coocking.Health department considers this as the major cause for health problems. The workers union leaders reiterates that they won't allow anybody from outside to visit struggle site. If this adament stand continues, health assistance will remain a mirage for  protesters. The health department authorities says that workers yesterday bahaved rudely to the officials. Their position is that no health camp will be allowed. 2. From Madhyamam Workers attack Chengara activists Pathanamthitta:Plantation workers beat up people coming out of Chengara struggle site on Friday. Bhavani ( Harisree, Mavelikkara,50),Dinesh ( PuthanVeettil, Kalayanad,24),Sujitha(18),Sosamma(madathara Road Puambokkil,48),Mani (Udayavilasam, Piravanthoor,55) and K.Ravi( RevathiBhavan,Venjarammood, 50) were admited to Pathanamthitta general hospital.They were undergoing health problems and came out seeking treatment, said Laha Gopalan,SadhuJanaSamyukthaVedi president. Even in the midst of blockade, food utensils are being smuggled into the struggle site. But it si not enough to distribute among all huts. many families are starving for days. . - -- Dileep R I thuravoor From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 10:26:19 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 10:26:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808161247o56974512mb598c87ea96a73e3@mail.gmail.com> References: <5F7B69B6-1053-4869-A1AB-24D4A5D03866@sarai.net> <47e122a70808161247o56974512mb598c87ea96a73e3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808162156o3a1e1017ycfa1ba37bd6391bd@mail.gmail.com> Inder - And, here speaks yet another Kashmiri Politician...lol Whatever be the case, how so much you may try to deviate..but the main issue revolving Amarnath needs to be handles well. The first step needs to be allocating the said land for the period of two months to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board to make pre-fabricated temporary structures for the pilgrims. And, there should be no interference in the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board from the valley based bigots. N.N. Vohra - we have had enough of him. He needs to be packed off back to New Delhi. Maybe, he joins Guv Jagmohan and Guv Sinha and Guv Saxena at IIC. All party delegation having representation from PDP, NC, Congress, CPI etc etc. needs to visit valley again to let them know there was no economic blockade and merely a myth created by a few vested interests. The "full of freedom" separatists need to be handled tough, infact very tough. Its because of UPA's pampering that we are at this unfortunate stage today. Inder bhai, why do you want to go to Naya Kashmir or for that matter Purana Kashmir. You may well live in Panun Kashmir. We'll have no problems. I'll personally welcome you into it. The terrorists who initiated gun culture in the valley need to be convicted. Their free pass of becoming a leader in the valley needs to be cancelled. Enough of their Secular & Gandhian drama. And, those of Geelani's Shabir's, Sajad's, etc. who have been continuously instigating communal passion in innocent Kashmiri Muslims in the valley; need to be chanrged. They have lost many lives just because of brainwashing. And, one correction. I didn't find you confused Inder; but your name is what I meant. Now, if you take it that ways; its all upto you. Its not about you being a artist, a nude actor or anything.....its about your nature of appeasing Muslims and lick their feet while you play with words in mails... Hope you understand this time around.... Orzuv.... Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/17/08, inder salim wrote: > > SAY YES TO UTOPIA IN KASHMIR > . > > I believe, following points emerged after going through an interesting > exchange between Sonia and Shuddha, which can become part of further > debate on Kashmir issue: > > 1. Kashmir is not a bilateral issue between Pakistan and India. People > of Jammu and Kashmir have to be a part of any understanding on it. > Representatives of Kashmir need to work out a clear policy. The > present Hurriyat conference is a divided house. National Conference, > Congress and PDP etc are/were always opportunistic in dealing the > issue at the core, and therefore, there should be a clear scheme in > sight on how to recognize a genuine representative body in Kashmir. > > 2. A Naya Free Kashmir ( new Kashmir ) may be a place where anybody > can live freely, but should not be allowed to acquire land for greed. > Government land should be allotted to landless families. Kashmiri > families who want to return be included in allotment schemes. > > 3. Demilitarization of Kashmir should begin at the earliest. Those > who demand it should also learn to live without a security cover. > Representative bodies of Kashmir should guide people on how to deal > with rogue militants. > > 4. To confront the law is reasonable when Law of the Occupied is in > vogue. But, laws which are acceptable to people should be charted out. > For example, Gandhi suggested people not to used British goods, and > simultaneously suggested how to spun khadi. Millions of people > followed him and something similar can happen in Kashmir, if there is > a will to achieve something unique. > > 5. Supporters of a free Tibet are everywhere because of their inherent > non-violent ways of dealing with the Chinese occupation. It was a > British citizen who hoisted Tibet slogan/flag in Beijing Olympics. > Something similar can happen if Kashmiris become creative in protests. > The recent peaceful protest in the valley is a positive beginning. > Gun culture should be abandoned completely, which has become an excuse > for Indian security forces to stay there in large numbers. > > 6. I see nothing wrong in sex work (provided it does not involve > coercion or minors), I too agree with Shuddha, but the new > representatives for a free Kashmir need to include this in their > agenda. Having said this, I believe the level of violence in Kashmir > against women is quite less in comparison to violence in India or in > Pakistan. But Kashmiri MALES need to provide spaces to women while > electing new representatives for a free Kashmir. They need to have a > scientific outlook while dealing with women's issues. > > 7. Environment is the new wave which can dismantle solid words like > Freedom, Plebiscite, Rights, etc unless new ways are not discovered to > understand new politics. Environmentally speaking , Kashmiris and all > the people of the world are a tightly woven fabric, and we don't know > how to cut it and where to stitch it for our day to day use. We are > truly clueless with regard to energy requirements once the oil > reserves begin to disappear. Human beings are growing at the expense > of other species on this planet. We have to find an answer to all the > environmental crises. That is too urgent. > > 8. A Naya free Kashmir must create a space for so called confused > peoples, ( as Aditya Raj kaul found me ) because I believe, > musicians, poets artists and performers are a confused lot in the > first place, and therefore, must be seen as integral part of society. > Too many journalists, advocates and the present lot of politicians in > the new representative body will spoil the dream of a free Kashmir. > > 9. A new free Kashmir should not interfere in the religious matters > at all. People should be advised/motivated not to donate money at > shrines, or if they do so they money should be go social and cultural > activists. > > 10. Recently I did a short opera on river in Kashmir, Te Vyeth Rooz > Pakkan ( The river jehlum moves on ) in U.K. . This was arranged by > Luton mela committee in Luton, which has a 25% population from Azad > kashmir. Mr. Zulfikar Ahmed is the chairman of the committee, who > invited us for a dinner next to a place which was occupied by > Amman-Ula-khan for quite some time. Secretrary of J&K cultural > academy Zaffar Iqbal khan Minhas was also there, but as it happens > now, it happened there also; we talked on politics and nothing on the > art and culture. > > Mr. Zulfikar regretted that the present Luton's A.Kashmir population > is divided into Chaudhries, Rajas and Maliks, although they donate > some pounds to sufi musicians from Pakistan as and when they sing a > ghazal or so in their honour, but they are quite worried about the > fate of their children who are neither Pakistanis, nor kashmiris nor > Brits. The worst is that British public and police is a little > uncomfortable with large muslim population there. Zulfikar is a > worried person, who has clueless about future of these kashmiri > children. Nobody speaks kashmiri language there, let alone going back > to Azad Kashmir. > > At the moment, I think it is enough for a new free Kashmir, but > suggestion and alteration are welcome. I know, it will be hazy in the > end, but … > > With love and regards > Inder salim > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 5:34 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > > Hey Shuddha, > > > > Thanks for the mails & sorry I haven¹t had the time to even read them > > properly let alone frame a response as I am leaving Delhi tomorrow night > for > > a whole month & have a load of stuff to do. > > > > I promise I will try & do so in a few days. And yes, it is entirely > > possible to have disagreements without being disagreeable. > > > > Cheers! > > sj > > > > > > On 8/16/08 5:11 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > > > >> Dear Sonia, > >> > >> > >> > >> Having spelt out what I agree with you on, in my previous post, let me, > in all > >> fairness, come to what I disagree with you on. Actually, disagreement, > is not > >> necessarily what I have in mind, what I mean is where I see things > differently > >> from you. I hope that in the course of reading this exchange,our young > friend > >> Aditya Raj Kaul will recognize that it is possible for people to see > things > >> differently, and even to disagree, without having to search for new ways > of > >> insulting each other. > >> > >> > >> > >> You said, > >> > >> > >> > >> I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, > >>> > >>> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during > the > >>> > >>> protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really > don¹t > >>> > >>> want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember > 1989 > >>> > >>> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when > >>> > >>> challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative > about > >>> > >>> taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand > strong mob > >>> > >>> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did > in > >>> > >>> Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > >> > >> > >> The difference between Advani's justification of the Jai Shri Ram slogan > in > >> 1989 and what I am trying to point in relation to the events of the past > few > >> days in the Kashmir valley lies in the fact that the protestors on the > roads > >> and highways of Kashmir were not 'screaming God's name and marching > towards > >> (any particular community's) localities.' Had the march been to Jammu, > or > >> Amarnath, not Muzaffarabad, and had they been seeking a deliberate > >> confrontation with the crowds rallying to the SASS slogans, or the > pilgrims to > >> Amarnath, then you would have been absolutely right. As it happens this > did > >> not occur. And as I have pointed out before, a record number of pilgrims > >> travelled safely to Amarnath this year, in the yatra which has just > >> concluded.In this case, the protestors in Kashmir were marching not with > >> aggressive intent towards another community, but towards the LOC, > demanding > >> that the borders be opened. I think there is a world of a difference in > these > >> two trajectories. I think this does suggest that we could recognize that > the > >> articulation of anger in Kashmir today is more mature than it was even > in '89. > >> This is all the more evident when we realize that every single person in > any > >> role of leadership of consequence in the Kashmir valley has called for > >> peaceful protest, and for the maintenance of communal harmony. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> > >>> I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of > >>> > >>> oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œdisputed > >>> > >>> structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹ Do you remember Naipaul¹s > defence > >>> > >>> of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but > natural for > >>> > >>> a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years? The > point > >>> > >>> I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to do > as > >>> > >>> they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you > have > >>> > >>> very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with > >>> > >>> politically do the same. That is why laws exist and ought to be > followed. > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> Again, there is a difference, I think you will agree, between an attack > on a > >> 16th century mosque, and the disarming of a CRPF bunker. The mosque, can > for > >> the sake of an argument,(though I do not buy that argument) be seen by > those > >> who wanted to raze it to the ground as a 'sign' of perceived > communitarian > >> oppression. The bunker, is much more than a 'sign', it is the actual > locus of > >> oppression. It is a place that bullets are fired from. Again, had there > been > >> attacks on temples, or even on the homes left behind by the Pandits, or > the > >> schools and colleges that still bear names and signs of Pandit or Dogra > >> presence, your argument would have had credence. From the reports that > we have > >> received, this did not happen. Signs and symbols were not touched, what > was > >> sought to be dismantled, was the 'infrastructure' of oppression itself, > and > >> this was done without a single policeman or CRPF person losing their > life. As > >> we all know, there are enough loose weapons and explosives in the > valley. And > >> it is not as if CRPF personnel or policemen have not been made targets > before. > >> They are sitting targets. Again, I would point out to you, two policemen > have > >> lost their lives in Jammu, no policeman, CRPF personnel, or jawan has > lost > >> their lives in the past few days in Kashmir. I hope that this continues > to be > >> the case. > >> > >> > >> > >> During the 'quit India' movement in 1942, there was a significant > disruption > >> caused to the 'infrastructure' of the colonial state. Police pickets, > radio > >> towers and wireless transmission systems, for instance were disabled, > and care > >> was taken to see that lives were not lost. The people who participated > in > >> these attacks did not see what they were doing as 'violent', indeed, > some, if > >> not the majority of them, were passionate advocates of 'non-violence'. > >> > >> > >> > >> For years, the insurgency in Kashmir has been attacked on the grounds > that it > >> was only the handwork of a handful of murderous 'terrorists' with no > popular > >> base. Now that the 'people' are out on the streets, not just in > thousands, but > >> in tens of thousands, and they are not wielding AK-47s, or assasinating > >> anyone, they are being criticized as being present in threateningly > large > >> numbers. This seems disingenous to me, you can't malign a movement when > the > >> people are not on the streets on the grounds that it is not popular, and > then, > >> when the people turn up, criticize them for being so many. > >> > >> > >> > >> Further, I do not agree that laws ought to be followed because they > exist. We > >> must, in each case, ask, which law, to what purpose, and wielded by > whom, > >> against whom, for whom. In this case, there is a contradiction between > the law > >> that guarantees the right to free assembly, and the law that prohibits > >> assembly. It could be argued that the people of Kashmir are following > the > >> spirit of the first law in order to violate the letter of the second > law. And, > >> we all know that patently bad laws exist in Kashmir. Laws such as the > Armed > >> Forces Special Powers Act. I think it is ethically wrong to obey such a > law. > >> The question to be asking then, is not, why are the people of Kashmir > not > >> following the law, but, why are soldiers in the Indian armed forces > obeying an > >> ethically wrong law. > >> > >> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to light > only > >>> > >>> about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and examined > and was > >>> > >>> not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly. What did was > the > >>> > >>> canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards > Hindus > >>> > >>> settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic > >>> > >>> change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not > >>> > >>> justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have such > a > >>> > >>> brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare-faced > lie! > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer > of the > >> Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of > >> xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. > And > >> everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of > thought. > >> When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' > threats, > >> they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, > >> especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against > 'demographic > >> change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. The protest > in > >> Kashmir has enough justification, in terms of an anger against the > alienation > >> of land and against the violence of the state, not to have to get bogged > down > >> in the chimera of confronting demographic change. > >> > >> > >> > >> I thank you again for this exchange, as I believe that it has led us all > in > >> the direction of expressing our thoughts without getting caught in the > trap of > >> abuse, and recrimination, which some people on the list seem > unfortunately to > >> have become habituated to. > >> > >> > >> > >> regards, > >> > >> > >> > >> Shuddha > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 15:32:39 2008 From: mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com (mahmood farooqui) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 15:32:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger In-Reply-To: <9949efb0808161341y6d71ffao8984e604010bacb5@mail.gmail.com> References: <9949efb0808161341y6d71ffao8984e604010bacb5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Yes, Geetika, in the same way the Gujrat Muslim refugee camps often received help only from sections that were aligned with conservative or fundalentalist Muslim groups...like the way the underworld came to the aid of Mumbai Muslims in the 93 blasts... 2008/8/17 Gitika Talwar > Dear Mahmood, > > Thank you so much for saying this. I have often wanted to scream at emails > from Aditya et al, that stem apparently from pain but then continue to > perpetuate the same stereotyping and insensitivity that they say they have > been victims of. I have often wondered what to say or do that could help > contain the pain of displacement without validating the need for propaganda. > > > I visited the Pandit camps in Jammu in 2003 and I remember the sense of > helplessness I felt as an outsider and also the strong rage and sorrow that > many Pandit families spoke about. Despite that, I could not help but feel > terrified when a few men we spoke to said that the Shiv Sena had been the > only one to really care about their misery and Bal Thakerey was the only one > who demanded that Pandit students get a 2% reservation in engg colleges, > this was seen as a move towards healing. Though I agree that greater > attention must be paid to the needs of internally displaced refugees, I was > worried about who was helping fulfill these needs and what context this need > fulfillment was buried in. > > Thanks for beginning this conversation and attempting to replace anger and > propaganda with the desire to understand. > > ~ Gitika > > On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 9:28 AM, mahmood farooqui < > mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > >> I have been trying to understand the anger, rage, rather of the KPs. I >> understand a fair bit of it, I understand some of the pain of the >> displacement--second hand at least-, I understand the resentment at the >> disrespect and the neglect shown towards them by the intellectuals and the >> secularists, I understand something of those things. >> >> What I want to understand is why does everything turn, for a lot of their >> exponents here, on the love for the Indian nation, or rather, more >> appropriately, on the love for the Indian state. Why must the Indian >> state, >> and all its weaknesses, be worshipped to sanctify Kashmiri Pandit pain. >> How >> does humiliation turn into glorification for an entity that is actually >> complicit in their brutality? >> >> Is there no other way to make sense of this tragedy? >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > > > -- > we are realists, we dream the impossible - Che Guevera > From rahulpandita at yahoo.com Sun Aug 17 16:54:48 2008 From: rahulpandita at yahoo.com (Rahul Pandita) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 04:24:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Remembering Kashmir's Bombay Beauties shop Message-ID: <177051.71166.qm@web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In the modern-day Hastinapur, a few men sit these days, all of them carrying loaded dice in the pockets of their Khadi kurtas. They drink tea, perhaps nibble at digestive biscuits and, read out a few sentences in front of the television cameras. And then they go. In the lexicon of the Raisina hills, this is known as an all-party meeting. The dice never comes out of their pockets. And yet, the stakes are pronounced. The line between Kauravas and Pandavas has never been so blurred. There has been firing in Srinagar near what used to be my home. It happened on the road that leads to the Chrar-e-Sharif shrine. As kids, when we grabbed our share of history from inspid textbooks, we would call this road the Grand Trunk road. On this road also flourished the Bombay Beauties cosmetics shop. No matter what time you went to the shop, you could get to hear the best of Mohammed Rafi’s songs. The shop’s owner was a young man, Latif Lone. His two major occupations were: listen to Rafi sahab and delicately push colourful bangles into the wrists of shy girls. On Fridays and on the last day of July, the shop would be closed. Friday was for prayers and, on July 31, Mohammed Rafi had bid his goodbye to the world. We used to joke that even in his prayers Latif would be silently reciting Rafi’s songs. Latif bhaijaan, as we kids called him, was my cousin Ravi’s best friend. He would come to meet Ravi almost every day – Ravi’s house was next to ours. If he was in the bus and a lady from our family boarded it, Latif would make sure that she got a seat. In winters, when we had to spend a major portion of day indoors, the dull programmes on the Doordarshan would almost put us to sleep. Instead, we tuned our T.V. antennas to Pakistan and watched many interesting serials. In a month like December, however, the weather would play spoilsport, uprooting the antenna. In times like these, Latif Lone would be in demand. I still remember him appearing at Ravi’s gate, wearing Pheran over his faded blue jeans. He would climb atop the roof in a matter of few seconds while my mother prayed below for his safety. He would hold the antenna in his hands, look towards his right and then left, as if offering namaz, and then set the antenna in proper direction. Latif Lone was my hero. In 1988, I saw very little of Latif Lone. Ravi was pursuing a Ph.D at the Kashmir University, which kept him very busy. I would ask him about Latif and he just shrugged his shoulders. On July 31, 1988, on Rafi’s eighth death anniversary, two bombs exploded in Srinagar. A few days later I saw Latif Lone. His beard had grown thicker and with three other young men, he was collecting donations for the local mosque. At the provision store, on a small transistor, Rafi’s voice reverberated in the warm summer air. I looked at Latif. For the first time I saw that his lips were not moving along with Rafi’s song. In less than two years after that incident, we had turned into refugees, like thousands of other Kashmiri Hindu families. Leaving a house of 22 rooms, we took shelter in a 10 by 10 feet room in Jammu, which would be our home for many months. It was here in June 1990, on a particularly humid morning, that I read the headlines of a local English daily: Dreaded militant Latif Lone shot dead. For two days, afterwards, our hearth would remain cold. Mother refused to cook anything. She lay in one corner, crying silently. Life moved on like a silent movie. We gradually picked up the pieces of our lives. Ravi got married and became a father. In 1997, while going back, after summer vacations, to his school in Udamphur’s Gool area, where he worked as a lecturer, he was dragged out of the bus and shot dead along with his two other Hindu colleagues. My mother could not bear that shock. She suffered a stroke and gradually lost her voice and the ability to move. I kept on going to the valley from Delhi, where I am based now, kissing the Kashmiri soil, like Yasser Arafat, every time I landed at the Srinagar airport. In Delhi, I am always torn apart in a million pieces. In Kashmir, while breathing my own air, I become one. In twenty years we have shifted so many houses. But no dwelling has ever become my home. Despite being an affected party, I was willing to give peace a chance. I guess that is what reading too much of Majaz's poetry does to you. Every time I went to Srinagar, I would tell my friends that the time had come that we begin asking ourselves questions. It didn’t make sense any longer to blame Jagmohan or Pakistan. The time had come to sit and openly discuss, amongst young Kashmiris, what happened in Kashmir in 1989-90 – like South Africa had done a few years ago (by setting up the Truth and Reconciliation Commission). Before this could happen, the few men mentioned in the beginning, took a totally unnecessary call – they transferred land to the Amarnath Shrine Board. The truth is, as the senior police officer Aashiq Bukhari told me in Srinagar, hundreds of acres of land right from Pahalgam onwards has always been at the pilgrims’ disposal. “If this house of mine is at your disposal – you are free to use the bed, lay on the sofa, use the bathroom, cook food in the kitchen, play in the garden any time you like, then why should you press that this house be transferred in your name?” he explained. “I tell you, all our good work of twenty years has gone down the drain in one stroke,” lamented another police officer. The truth also is that, in 1996, outside the historical Raghunath temple in Jammu, a cup of tea was sold for fifty rupees to the Amarnath yatris who were stranded due to bad weather, by the same people who are now coming out on streets and chanting: Bam Bam Bole. In Srinagar, meanwhile, there is no space again for Rafi. It it is back to pro-Pakistan slogans. As the Line of Control has shifted to create a chasm between Srinagar and Jammu, the Dhritrashtras in New Delhi just kept silent, their one hand resting on another. In Kashmir’s Mahabharata, it’s the Shakunis who are having a field day. Rahul Pandita www.sanitysucks.blogspot.com Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From vikaskaul at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 17:18:26 2008 From: vikaskaul at gmail.com (Vikas Kaul) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 06:48:26 -0500 Subject: [Reader-list] On KP anger In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808161338p6da2cb9eu692083eb242f4fb6@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b79f1a70808161031vd58fc0cx1134783fbf4c4816@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808161052w2163b433lae93fdc08c49c16a@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808161338p6da2cb9eu692083eb242f4fb6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Short version of my response: If I am in love with someone, does it mean it is dubious of me to criticize my beloved? On the other hand, if I criticize a person, does it suggest I must have any less regard for him/her? Who says KPs must take a zero-sum approach? Who says KPs can not blame both the GoI as well as the Kashmiri Muslim leadership and yet, at the same time, choose to be governed under Indian constitution, be a part of the Indian nation with which they share values of non-violence, democracy, secular world view, equality, freedom, rule of law, culture, religion and history? Can someone provide me with an answer to that? Long version: You are welcome to think of this as yet another hateful propagandist message. But if you happen to be intellectual honest, you just might see the world in a new light. Before I begin, I must mention that I speak for myself, not for any community. And I welcome critique with reasoning. And my views have nothing to do with people; it's about the perception, ignorance and spinelessness. My critique below reflects my derision for the words such as "genuflection" and "state" among other presumptions. Obviously, I can not possibly deny some level of prejudice being a member of one of the communities involved in the epic saga (sadly). But I can make one promise to the conversationalists here, if you have air-tight logic, I just might be convinced. High-school, puppy-love, idealist "feelings" are not convincing enough for me. After giving a cursory look at Ms. Sethi's well articulated comments, I "felt" there just might be a whole lot of sense in it. Being an empiricist, I went against my professional code of conduct and chose to "feel" without enough evidence. The dualist in us takes over more often than it should, doesn't it? Gladly, the empiricist was back in business. After having read through the comments, I was forced to ask a friend: "Why am I so unfortunate?" Although I am still waiting on Mr. Farooqui's reply, let's get to the meat and bones of the "perceived conundrum." Children are born dualists and teleologists. Some of us never grow out of it and thanks to "discipline" in childhood, creeds and canons we are rendered even more vulnerable to the assignment of purpose (even inanimate objects) to everything. Say, for instance, moths committing "suicide" when it has nothing to do with our moral sense. It sure has a heck of a lot to do with the evolved nervous system and artificial light. Or, for that matter, "Jagmohan asked KPs to leave so Muslims could be wiped out." While the former example is slightly understandable showing ones ignorance, the latter is a sinister attempt at assigning purpose to something you create out of thin air. Such "contradiction" is an apparent lack of sharp vision in connivance with subservience to teleology and dualism. Forget that, it just shows lack of understanding of KPs. Ask yourself: "how many KP friends do I have?" Both examples underscore a subtly I hope you can appreciate. So, if you do not see (or assign) a purpose, then you have a conundrum. And, of course in the context of this thread, purpose must be assigned to a "group." Let's dig into this a little deeper. This is both funny and painful to me; I wish this weren't true. KPs are a disunited lot! What you learn about KPs can't simply be assumed to work with the majority, except, of course, when fundamentals are in the play. For instance, Kashmiri Muslims supported the displacement (another one of those words the UN comes up with reflecting its weakness) of KPs. Not one honest apology from their leadership in the last 17 years. Statements like these, in my opinion, will strike a cord among most KPs. In most other cases, in particular political, there is very little accord. Blame it on too much education and intellectuality. You can't be united unless there is some element of irrationality. You see why the Ummah, relatively, are a united lot? Now, allow me to analyze Ms. Sethi's words. 1) "One, is a realisation of the immense power that the state wields." Formulation of a correct sentence does not mean anything; it may not even deserve a response. Besides, stating the obvious doesn't add to the debate either. However, the proposition here might have been that "KPs" realized the Indian "state" can overpower the Kashmiri Muslim terrorists and their ideology. I have a rather fundamental question to ask: If KPs had a uniform thinking, why in the world would they be scattered all over the place? Why would they risk the survival of their language and culture? The point is: KPs are independent thinkers. Unfortunately for them, that has not played out all that great for them. So much for rationality! Note: I did not use words like militants, separatists, radical Islamists above. 2) This is an interesting point but also an ugly reminder of ignorance. The premise of the point is that "KPs" (as a community) might have actually thought about the ludicrous notion of "azadi." I do not think you will find a single KP who was so unhappy with the Indian state that (s)he wanted a separate land. Yet another presupposition is that Muslims and Hindus were living in peace and harmony. An ignoramus would pick a point in recent past and contrast it with pre-89 situation, use a variable like "number of deaths," and get a journal publication out of it. How cute! But, at the same time, how arrogantly preposterous! Muslims in Kashmir weren't betrayed during the Parmeshwari Handoo saga, were they? It wasn't KPs who assaulted Kapil Dev/Sunil Gavaskar when they came to Srinagar for a cricket match with the Pakistani team. KPs didn't use their temples to play tape recorders that ran for hours intimidating Muslims into packing their bags for Hindutva, not Nizam-e-Mustafa, would be the rule of land. They didn't cry out loud: "and forget to leave your women behind." Yes, blame the KP for not throwing in the towel with the terrorists. Blame the KP for not teaming up with the "militants" who in their Koranic quest for "jihad," raped their women and cut them into pieces. Do that. Blame him/her for not standing against a repressive Indian "empire" whose average tax-payers rupee took care of the roads (s)he walked on everyday, ensured there was no shortage of food, fuel, jobs, hospitals and schools. Blame the darned KP for supporting the army of the "empire" that saved him from Pakistani aggression so many times. Blame him for not lifting arms, making black lists and going postal on unarmed men, women and children. Yes Sir, Yaseen Malik is a Gandhian. But make sure you blame a KP for showing some dignity, class and integrity. How conveniently hypocritical! Can a KP not see the atrocities committed by the state? Of course, (s)he does. For instance, just look at the pathetic leadership of the NDA in the early stages of the ongoing Amarnath land crisis and Union Home Ministers' incompetence. However, let's not forget to blame the KP for being smart enough to realize that in a multi-party democratic system within a multi-ethnic environment of a country the size/history/socio-econo-political landscape as India, few Cabinets can perform better. Blame him/her for recognizing the fact that PDP did the first blood and Hurriyat sucked on it. Blame the smartest kid in the class for being smart. Way to go! 3) I have my own dilemma. What do I dislike the most: stupidity, ignorance or spinelessness? Ignorance takes the silver medal. Ignorance of the history and evolution of Islam in times like these ought to be a crime against intelligence. But then, if you are aware and act spineless, well, congratulations for bagging gold. If you read Quran and the history of Islam - say by Karen Armstrong or Reza Aslan or your favorite - you would have to work extremely hard not to appreciate that religious ideology and politics are intertwined in Islam. It's true for Christianity as well. I do not regurgitate what I hear from others; I have read Quran twice by two different widely regarded authors in the Islamic world (New Testament once). Finally, please do not waste time thinking of Shiv Sena/VHP/RSS et al. because that would make you look stupid; those are not religions. Let's start the blame game again. Blame the Dogras for not seeking separation from India. And why let the Ladhakhis off the hook? They too must have been oppressed, right? How about the folks in Rajouri and Udhampur? Oh, wait! They all just out of sheer serendipity happen to be non-Muslim majority regions. These Hindus, I tell you! Why must they all genuflect before the Indian state? I doubt if one has to be an Einstein to truly figure this one out. Ms. Sethi, whether you like it or not, admit it to yourself or not, religion is at the heart of the issue. Otherwise, more than a hundred Hindu temples in Kashmir wouldn't have been desecrated for the sake of fun or, as you like to call it: "self-determination." Finally, the idea of a "state" is yet another funny story keeping the context in mind. We are not talking about a communist or a socialist state where the ideological opinions in the higher echelons of the political/intellectual class percolate down to the districts and towns, if not neighborhoods. In conclusion, dear Ms. Sethi, please do not take my rather acerbic views and judgments personally. I tell it the way I see it. Geetika: Yes, Shiv Sena did provide help to KPs when no one else did in their time of dire need. But Shiv Sena/VHP etc. carry out actions and crimes that have no bounds. Period. I have as much scorn for them as I do for PDP/NC/Hurriyat etc. I think spreading hatred equally qualified me for being a secular chap. From indersalim at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 17:20:38 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 17:20:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808162156o3a1e1017ycfa1ba37bd6391bd@mail.gmail.com> References: <5F7B69B6-1053-4869-A1AB-24D4A5D03866@sarai.net> <47e122a70808161247o56974512mb598c87ea96a73e3@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808162156o3a1e1017ycfa1ba37bd6391bd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808170450w4cfffa12x4497feee569b0bb1@mail.gmail.com> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Your comment on my name reflects the sickness of our times; If you think my conceptual name is some CONFUSION then what about Ram Rahim? Is Lal Ded's ' mov zaan haund tai musalman' a confusion? If it is so then yes, inder salim is a confusion, and I am humbly content with that. Your comment on nudity is also alarming. Is nudity in Hinduism an act of obscenity? As a good Brahmin boy, you must know what 'vastra' means in Hindu thought. The body itself is the garment, and the depiction of it leads to some radicalization of thought. I don't know your belief system beyond the fact that you are quite angry with Muslims of valley, whom you think are all anti-national and therefore, need some doses of Indian nationalism, even at the point of a gun. Here, my thought is quite different. I believe, the more you pressurize your son to 'behave' the more he will rebel. Kashmiris have been repeatedly told to salute the Indian flag against their will. The irony is that Pt. Nehru himself granted a FLAG a Constitution, a President and a Prime Minister to J&K. Now what is Article 370, even if you forget Plebiscite. It is also interesting to note that Sheikh Mohd. Abdullah clandestinely bagged 73 out of 75 assembly seats in 1951. Nehru knew it all which perhaps gave birth to Jammu's Hindu Right wing. Of course, things have changed, but in what direction. India is not an ideal secular nation. It neither respects its huge poor and oppressed population, nor it has a will to counter its corrupt systems. Blind nationalism suits our selfish Elites and Corporates. Growing middle class is blindly imitating such a system which is either violent or breeds hate, corruption and indifference towards 'the other'. I have no choice but to live in that system which multiples sadness and pain. But I have a right to protest at every level of thought. Kashmir is one such bad example of state oppression which has given us thousands of dead, exodus of kashmiri pandits and possibility of a War. Indeed, what is interesting, which shall interest you as well, is that fact that there is hardly any difference between the average life style of a kashmiri family or a family living in Delhi. Modernity has played a leveller in many sense than one, but we unfortunately stuck to our religious identities fanatically. Now if you think that India is mainly Hindu majority area and an average Muslman is supposed to respect and believe in it as well, then how come he will abandon his Muslim identiy. So, as long as you are content as a member/sympathizer of a sang parivar, they too are happy with Jamat-i-islami kind of things. We have to be truly secular, which is not possible in India. All our defence system, all our offices and public places are full of Hindu icons, the worst is that Ayodhya mosque was demolished, Gujarat riots happened and kashmiri muslims continue to be easy target of Indian security forces. I know, Inder salim as name is not working anymore in India, let alone Pakistan. It might work in Kashmir, because of its strong sufi base. I have faith in that past, and if does not work there either, then I am not going to any kind of Kashmir. Be it IOK, POK or a New Free Kashmir. Inder salim is a dalit within the dalit in that sense, and I am content to live a CONFUSED life. Love and regards Inder salim p.s I talked about Modernity as a leveller, but the discourse on it has only begun. My idea of connecting issues is vital to the survival of our life on this earth. It is also interesting for me that neither you nor your strong opponents have reflected on the urgency of it as yet. Environment is not just a word, it is our future and our present. On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 10:26 AM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Inder - And, here speaks yet another Kashmiri Politician...lol > > Whatever be the case, how so much you may try to deviate..but the main issue > revolving Amarnath needs to be handles well. The first step needs to be > allocating the said land for the period of two months to the Shri Amarnath > Shrine Board to make pre-fabricated temporary structures for the pilgrims. > And, there should be no interference in the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board from > the valley based bigots. N.N. Vohra - we have had enough of him. He needs to > be packed off back to New Delhi. Maybe, he joins Guv Jagmohan and Guv Sinha > and Guv Saxena at IIC. > > All party delegation having representation from PDP, NC, Congress, CPI etc > etc. needs to visit valley again to let them know there was no economic > blockade and merely a myth created by a few vested interests. > > The "full of freedom" separatists need to be handled tough, infact very > tough. Its because of UPA's pampering that we are at this unfortunate stage > today. > > Inder bhai, why do you want to go to Naya Kashmir or for that matter Purana > Kashmir. You may well live in Panun Kashmir. We'll have no problems. I'll > personally welcome you into it. > > The terrorists who initiated gun culture in the valley need to be convicted. > Their free pass of becoming a leader in the valley needs to be cancelled. > Enough of their Secular & Gandhian drama. And, those of Geelani's Shabir's, > Sajad's, etc. who have been continuously instigating communal passion in > innocent Kashmiri Muslims in the valley; need to be chanrged. They have lost > many lives just because of brainwashing. > > And, one correction. I didn't find you confused Inder; but your name is what > I meant. Now, if you take it that ways; its all upto you. Its not about you > being a artist, a nude actor or anything.....its about your nature of > appeasing Muslims and lick their feet while you play with words in mails... > > Hope you understand this time around.... > > Orzuv.... > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > On 8/17/08, inder salim wrote: >> >> SAY YES TO UTOPIA IN KASHMIR >> . >> >> I believe, following points emerged after going through an interesting >> exchange between Sonia and Shuddha, which can become part of further >> debate on Kashmir issue: >> >> 1. Kashmir is not a bilateral issue between Pakistan and India. People >> of Jammu and Kashmir have to be a part of any understanding on it. >> Representatives of Kashmir need to work out a clear policy. The >> present Hurriyat conference is a divided house. National Conference, >> Congress and PDP etc are/were always opportunistic in dealing the >> issue at the core, and therefore, there should be a clear scheme in >> sight on how to recognize a genuine representative body in Kashmir. >> >> 2. A Naya Free Kashmir ( new Kashmir ) may be a place where anybody >> can live freely, but should not be allowed to acquire land for greed. >> Government land should be allotted to landless families. Kashmiri >> families who want to return be included in allotment schemes. >> >> 3. Demilitarization of Kashmir should begin at the earliest. Those >> who demand it should also learn to live without a security cover. >> Representative bodies of Kashmir should guide people on how to deal >> with rogue militants. >> >> 4. To confront the law is reasonable when Law of the Occupied is in >> vogue. But, laws which are acceptable to people should be charted out. >> For example, Gandhi suggested people not to used British goods, and >> simultaneously suggested how to spun khadi. Millions of people >> followed him and something similar can happen in Kashmir, if there is >> a will to achieve something unique. >> >> 5. Supporters of a free Tibet are everywhere because of their inherent >> non-violent ways of dealing with the Chinese occupation. It was a >> British citizen who hoisted Tibet slogan/flag in Beijing Olympics. >> Something similar can happen if Kashmiris become creative in protests. >> The recent peaceful protest in the valley is a positive beginning. >> Gun culture should be abandoned completely, which has become an excuse >> for Indian security forces to stay there in large numbers. >> >> 6. I see nothing wrong in sex work (provided it does not involve >> coercion or minors), I too agree with Shuddha, but the new >> representatives for a free Kashmir need to include this in their >> agenda. Having said this, I believe the level of violence in Kashmir >> against women is quite less in comparison to violence in India or in >> Pakistan. But Kashmiri MALES need to provide spaces to women while >> electing new representatives for a free Kashmir. They need to have a >> scientific outlook while dealing with women's issues. >> >> 7. Environment is the new wave which can dismantle solid words like >> Freedom, Plebiscite, Rights, etc unless new ways are not discovered to >> understand new politics. Environmentally speaking , Kashmiris and all >> the people of the world are a tightly woven fabric, and we don't know >> how to cut it and where to stitch it for our day to day use. We are >> truly clueless with regard to energy requirements once the oil >> reserves begin to disappear. Human beings are growing at the expense >> of other species on this planet. We have to find an answer to all the >> environmental crises. That is too urgent. >> >> 8. A Naya free Kashmir must create a space for so called confused >> peoples, ( as Aditya Raj kaul found me ) because I believe, >> musicians, poets artists and performers are a confused lot in the >> first place, and therefore, must be seen as integral part of society. >> Too many journalists, advocates and the present lot of politicians in >> the new representative body will spoil the dream of a free Kashmir. >> >> 9. A new free Kashmir should not interfere in the religious matters >> at all. People should be advised/motivated not to donate money at >> shrines, or if they do so they money should be go social and cultural >> activists. >> >> 10. Recently I did a short opera on river in Kashmir, Te Vyeth Rooz >> Pakkan ( The river jehlum moves on ) in U.K. . This was arranged by >> Luton mela committee in Luton, which has a 25% population from Azad >> kashmir. Mr. Zulfikar Ahmed is the chairman of the committee, who >> invited us for a dinner next to a place which was occupied by >> Amman-Ula-khan for quite some time. Secretrary of J&K cultural >> academy Zaffar Iqbal khan Minhas was also there, but as it happens >> now, it happened there also; we talked on politics and nothing on the >> art and culture. >> >> Mr. Zulfikar regretted that the present Luton's A.Kashmir population >> is divided into Chaudhries, Rajas and Maliks, although they donate >> some pounds to sufi musicians from Pakistan as and when they sing a >> ghazal or so in their honour, but they are quite worried about the >> fate of their children who are neither Pakistanis, nor kashmiris nor >> Brits. The worst is that British public and police is a little >> uncomfortable with large muslim population there. Zulfikar is a >> worried person, who has clueless about future of these kashmiri >> children. Nobody speaks kashmiri language there, let alone going back >> to Azad Kashmir. >> >> At the moment, I think it is enough for a new free Kashmir, but >> suggestion and alteration are welcome. I know, it will be hazy in the >> end, but … >> >> With love and regards >> Inder salim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 5:34 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: >> > Hey Shuddha, >> > >> > Thanks for the mails & sorry I haven¹t had the time to even read them >> > properly let alone frame a response as I am leaving Delhi tomorrow night >> for >> > a whole month & have a load of stuff to do. >> > >> > I promise I will try & do so in a few days. And yes, it is entirely >> > possible to have disagreements without being disagreeable. >> > >> > Cheers! >> > sj >> > >> > >> > On 8/16/08 5:11 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: >> > >> >> Dear Sonia, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Having spelt out what I agree with you on, in my previous post, let me, >> in all >> >> fairness, come to what I disagree with you on. Actually, disagreement, >> is not >> >> necessarily what I have in mind, what I mean is where I see things >> differently >> >> from you. I hope that in the course of reading this exchange,our young >> friend >> >> Aditya Raj Kaul will recognize that it is possible for people to see >> things >> >> differently, and even to disagree, without having to search for new ways >> of >> >> insulting each other. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> You said, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, >> >>> >> >>> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during >> the >> >>> >> >>> protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really >> don¹t >> >>> >> >>> want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember >> 1989 >> >>> >> >>> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when >> >>> >> >>> challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative >> about >> >>> >> >>> taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand >> strong mob >> >>> >> >>> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did >> in >> >>> >> >>> Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. >> >> >> >> >> >> The difference between Advani's justification of the Jai Shri Ram slogan >> in >> >> 1989 and what I am trying to point in relation to the events of the past >> few >> >> days in the Kashmir valley lies in the fact that the protestors on the >> roads >> >> and highways of Kashmir were not 'screaming God's name and marching >> towards >> >> (any particular community's) localities.' Had the march been to Jammu, >> or >> >> Amarnath, not Muzaffarabad, and had they been seeking a deliberate >> >> confrontation with the crowds rallying to the SASS slogans, or the >> pilgrims to >> >> Amarnath, then you would have been absolutely right. As it happens this >> did >> >> not occur. And as I have pointed out before, a record number of pilgrims >> >> travelled safely to Amarnath this year, in the yatra which has just >> >> concluded.In this case, the protestors in Kashmir were marching not with >> >> aggressive intent towards another community, but towards the LOC, >> demanding >> >> that the borders be opened. I think there is a world of a difference in >> these >> >> two trajectories. I think this does suggest that we could recognize that >> the >> >> articulation of anger in Kashmir today is more mature than it was even >> in '89. >> >> This is all the more evident when we realize that every single person in >> any >> >> role of leadership of consequence in the Kashmir valley has called for >> >> peaceful protest, and for the maintenance of communal harmony. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> >> >>> I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of >> >>> >> >>> oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œdisputed >> >>> >> >>> structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹ Do you remember Naipaul¹s >> defence >> >>> >> >>> of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but >> natural for >> >>> >> >>> a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years? The >> point >> >>> >> >>> I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to do >> as >> >>> >> >>> they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you >> have >> >>> >> >>> very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with >> >>> >> >>> politically do the same. That is why laws exist and ought to be >> followed. >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Again, there is a difference, I think you will agree, between an attack >> on a >> >> 16th century mosque, and the disarming of a CRPF bunker. The mosque, can >> for >> >> the sake of an argument,(though I do not buy that argument) be seen by >> those >> >> who wanted to raze it to the ground as a 'sign' of perceived >> communitarian >> >> oppression. The bunker, is much more than a 'sign', it is the actual >> locus of >> >> oppression. It is a place that bullets are fired from. Again, had there >> been >> >> attacks on temples, or even on the homes left behind by the Pandits, or >> the >> >> schools and colleges that still bear names and signs of Pandit or Dogra >> >> presence, your argument would have had credence. From the reports that >> we have >> >> received, this did not happen. Signs and symbols were not touched, what >> was >> >> sought to be dismantled, was the 'infrastructure' of oppression itself, >> and >> >> this was done without a single policeman or CRPF person losing their >> life. As >> >> we all know, there are enough loose weapons and explosives in the >> valley. And >> >> it is not as if CRPF personnel or policemen have not been made targets >> before. >> >> They are sitting targets. Again, I would point out to you, two policemen >> have >> >> lost their lives in Jammu, no policeman, CRPF personnel, or jawan has >> lost >> >> their lives in the past few days in Kashmir. I hope that this continues >> to be >> >> the case. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> During the 'quit India' movement in 1942, there was a significant >> disruption >> >> caused to the 'infrastructure' of the colonial state. Police pickets, >> radio >> >> towers and wireless transmission systems, for instance were disabled, >> and care >> >> was taken to see that lives were not lost. The people who participated >> in >> >> these attacks did not see what they were doing as 'violent', indeed, >> some, if >> >> not the majority of them, were passionate advocates of 'non-violence'. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> For years, the insurgency in Kashmir has been attacked on the grounds >> that it >> >> was only the handwork of a handful of murderous 'terrorists' with no >> popular >> >> base. Now that the 'people' are out on the streets, not just in >> thousands, but >> >> in tens of thousands, and they are not wielding AK-47s, or assasinating >> >> anyone, they are being criticized as being present in threateningly >> large >> >> numbers. This seems disingenous to me, you can't malign a movement when >> the >> >> people are not on the streets on the grounds that it is not popular, and >> then, >> >> when the people turn up, criticize them for being so many. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Further, I do not agree that laws ought to be followed because they >> exist. We >> >> must, in each case, ask, which law, to what purpose, and wielded by >> whom, >> >> against whom, for whom. In this case, there is a contradiction between >> the law >> >> that guarantees the right to free assembly, and the law that prohibits >> >> assembly. It could be argued that the people of Kashmir are following >> the >> >> spirit of the first law in order to violate the letter of the second >> law. And, >> >> we all know that patently bad laws exist in Kashmir. Laws such as the >> Armed >> >> Forces Special Powers Act. I think it is ethically wrong to obey such a >> law. >> >> The question to be asking then, is not, why are the people of Kashmir >> not >> >> following the law, but, why are soldiers in the Indian armed forces >> obeying an >> >> ethically wrong law. >> >> >> >> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to light >> only >> >>> >> >>> about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and examined >> and was >> >>> >> >>> not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly. What did was >> the >> >>> >> >>> canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards >> Hindus >> >>> >> >>> settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic >> >>> >> >>> change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not >> >>> >> >>> justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have such >> a >> >>> >> >>> brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare-faced >> lie! >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer >> of the >> >> Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of >> >> xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. >> And >> >> everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of >> thought. >> >> When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' >> threats, >> >> they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, >> >> especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against >> 'demographic >> >> change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. The protest >> in >> >> Kashmir has enough justification, in terms of an anger against the >> alienation >> >> of land and against the violence of the state, not to have to get bogged >> down >> >> in the chimera of confronting demographic change. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I thank you again for this exchange, as I believe that it has led us all >> in >> >> the direction of expressing our thoughts without getting caught in the >> trap of >> >> abuse, and recrimination, which some people on the list seem >> unfortunately to >> >> have become habituated to. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> regards, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> http://indersalim.livejournal.com >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 17:40:39 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 17:40:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindus asked to leave Valley Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170510x1d70626eo141b6c5c7b795bb2@mail.gmail.com> http://www.thestatesman.net/page.news.php?clid=2&theme=&usrsess=1&id=218537 Meanwhile, hundreds of Hindu employees working in the civil secretariat of the Jammu and Kashmir government have fled to Jammu fearing for their lives after Kashmiri protestors who took to the streets on the midnight of Pakistan's Independence Day on 14th August, raised slogans asking the Hindus to leave Kashmir valley immediately. Over 450 'Durbar Move' employees belonging to the Hindu minority community fled the Kashmir valley and reached Jammu late last evening, according to an estimate. From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Sun Aug 17 18:16:23 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 05:46:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Civil Society groups condemn state violence in Kashmir Message-ID: <415496.32396.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE 17th August 2008 Today, 17th of August 2008, on the initiative of Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society the second meeting of civil society organizations and individuals was convened to discuss the present scenario in Jammu and Kashmir and the way forward. The meeting besides the members of JKCCS was attended by representatives of Kashmiri Pandit Sangharsh Samiti, Gurudwara Prabandhak Committee, Sikh Coordination Committee, Trade Union Centre, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, Valley Citizens Council, People’s Development Trust, Ehsaas, Firdous Education Trust for Orphans, Himayat, and a galaxy of intellectuals, social activists, journalists including Dr. Altaf Hussain, Dr. Mubarik Ahmed, Arjimand Hussain Talib, Dr. Abdul Ahad, Dr. Zaffar Mehdi and others.  The meeting unanimously adopted a resolution upholding the right to self-determination of the people of Jammu and Kashmir as enshrined in article 1 of ICCPR and article 1 of ECOSOC.  The salient features of the resolution are as follows:  The participants condemned brute state force used against the peaceful and unarmed protesters, which claimed 34 lives and left more than 600 wounded in the last 7 days. The participants paid homage to the unarmed protesters killed by the Indian armed forces who are equipped with the impunity laws like AFSPA, Disturbed Areas Act etc. The participants unanimously emphasized that no vested interests shall be allowed to harm the traditions of communal harmony, and the majority community in Kashmir shall continue to work together with the minorities during these testing times. The participants stressed an immediate restoration of all the historical routes to ensure the political, psychological, economic, physical security of the besieged people of Jammu and Kashmir. As reported by Indian Express that more than 40 ambulances which were attacked by the Indian armed forces that even beat up the patients, with serious bullet wounds, across Kashmir in last 7 days, the participants condemned the phenomenon as it is in contravention to the Geneva Conventions. The participants condemned the unwarranted attacks on journalists, preventing them from performing their professional duties by both the protesters and the Indian armed forces and appealed that the media be allowed to work unhindered. The meeting also took the following decisions:  For ensuring a constant contact with the political leadership spearheading this movement to keep them abreast with the civil society initiatives and concerns, a committee was formed. A committee for apprising the international organizations, fellow civil society groups, and the diplomatic corps about the real contours of the people’s protest. A committee of medical professionals was set up to keep this forum informed about a medical emergency, depleting stocks of medicines and surgical disposables and other related issues, so that appropriate arrangements could be made. From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 17 18:22:15 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 05:52:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Hindus asked to leave Valley Message-ID: <12128.27333.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Enough is enough.The Government in the State and  the Center should own the responsibility in failing to maintain law and order and safety of people and resign immediately. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Pawan Durani To: sarai list Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 5:10:39 AM Subject: [Reader-list] Hindus asked to leave Valley http://www.thestatesman.net/page.news.php?clid=2&theme=&usrsess=1&id=218537 Meanwhile, hundreds of Hindu employees working in the civil secretariat of the Jammu and Kashmir government have fled to Jammu fearing for their lives after Kashmiri protestors who took to the streets on the midnight of Pakistan's Independence Day on 14th August, raised slogans asking the Hindus to leave Kashmir valley immediately. Over 450 'Durbar Move' employees belonging to the Hindu minority community fled the Kashmir valley and reached Jammu late last evening, according to an estimate. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From shuddha at sarai.net Sun Aug 17 18:42:39 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:42:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808170450w4cfffa12x4497feee569b0bb1@mail.gmail.com> References: <5F7B69B6-1053-4869-A1AB-24D4A5D03866@sarai.net> <47e122a70808161247o56974512mb598c87ea96a73e3@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808162156o3a1e1017ycfa1ba37bd6391bd@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808170450w4cfffa12x4497feee569b0bb1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, A passing thought in your response to Inder Salim's recent post intrigued me. You said, "I didn't find you confused Inder; but your name is what I meant. Now, if you take it that ways; its all upto you. Its not about you being a artist, a nude actor or anything.....its about your nature of appeasing Muslims and lick their feet while you play with words in mails..." I don't quite see why Inder's choice of a name for himself, the name Inder Salim, says anything about 'appeasing' and 'licking the feet of' Muslims. True, it is a common Muslim name, but then so is Iqbal, or Bahadur, or Shamsher, (all with respectable perso-arabic origins) names that are often used as a first name for devout Hindus and Sikhs. And frankly, what if it also happens to be a common Muslim name? And what exactly is the problem in 'confusing' two different kinds of identity within the framework of a name? How does that 'confusion' amount to 'appeasement' of anything other than a person's desire to choose how to represent themselves to the world? The word Salim, means 'peaceful' in Arabic, Persian and several other languages. its cognates are 'Salaam' in Arabic, and 'Shalom' and 'Shulamit' (a common girls name) in Hebrew, And, like Iqbal, comes originally from Arabic-Hebraic-Semitic roots. Inder, as we all know, is a variant on the name of Indr, the sky god of Rig-Vedic religion, who hurls thunderoblts, conquers and destroys cities. If through the act of naming himself, Inder Salim has transformed a warrior deity into a peaceful one, by making a name for himself (in more ways than one) then I don't quite see what objection there can be to that. All his name says to me is that he, this Inder, is at peace with himself, and that he is peaceful. Since, the word, 'Salim' has actually no necessary exclusively 'religious' connotation, and could for instance be a word like say - 'Shanti' (and I know several Bangladeshi and Indonesian people, who, though Muslim, carry high Sanskritic names like Pragya, Lavanya, Sukanta or Paramita), I do not quite see how carrying the name 'Salim' necessarily identifies one as a Hindu, a Muslim, as an agnostic or as a Seventh Day Adventist. My name, Shuddhabrata, is as Sanskritic as it can get, but does it really tell you anything about which kind of feet I lick, or if I lick feet at all? Is your problem merely the fact that the word has a semitic-perso- arabic-hebraic origin, and that any word of that nature is by association 'Muslim' then, (which of course, makes you so upset) then, I am afraid you will have to do a lot of name changing, even within the Kashmiri Pandit community, where traditional names like Toshkhani, Bakhtawar, Durrani, Iqbal, Zorawar, Saraf, (all words with respectably perso-arabic lineages) are fairly common first and second names, especially if you go back a generation. Of course, you would then, demand that Kashmir Muslims with fairly common second names like Dar, Butt, and even, Pandit, also drop those names, because they point to a Sanskritic, pre-Islamic lineage, which you no doubt would want them not to sully. That is a lot of work. Surely you could find more useful things with which to occupy your enthusiasm and your energy. And, by the way, do you have a problem with nudity? What exactly is wrong with the human body? Which part of the human body, which is a sheath for the human spirit, just as a name is a sheath for a person, needs to be excised or amputated, for you to be satisfied? regards Shuddha On 17-Aug-08, at 5:20 PM, inder salim wrote: > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, > > Your comment on my name reflects the sickness of our times; If you > think my conceptual name is some CONFUSION then what about Ram Rahim? > Is Lal Ded's ' mov zaan haund tai musalman' a confusion? If it is so > then yes, inder salim is a confusion, and I am humbly content with > that. > > Your comment on nudity is also alarming. Is nudity in Hinduism an act > of obscenity? As a good Brahmin boy, you must know what 'vastra' > means in Hindu thought. The body itself is the garment, and the > depiction of it leads to some radicalization of thought. > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:03:16 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:03:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> Dear Sonia, This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already laboured over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far with it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. While I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it was about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the majority demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? Warmly, Shivam On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > Hi Shuddha, > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have raised. You > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is very much > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim Kashmir > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion given > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to point out that > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously not to accuse > you of communal thinking. > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during the > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really don¹t > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember 1989 > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative about > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand strong mob > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did in > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF culpability: > ----------------------------------------------- > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming the main > target of protesters. > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct against their > own people". > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests in Kashmir > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 injured. > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" marchers in Uri > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house officer of > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two others > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a target > killing". > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and torched it. > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents have been > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a social > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj Bagh > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police "whether > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in stark > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen as > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > -------------------------------------- > > On the tearing down of bunkers etc., :you are right. These are visible > symbols of oppression and one can even be indulgent when an impassioned mob > tears them down, but where does one draw the line then? What when the same > mob goes and torches a government building or a politician¹s house as has > been the case? Even Moulvi Abbas Ansari, poor man, the Shi¹a leader in the > Mirwaiz¹s Hurriyat Conference, had the honour of having his home ransacked > by a mob a few days ago. Two years ago, during the so-called sex scandal, > Œthe people¹ razed the home of Sabina, the sex-worker, to the ground. Does > one extend the same understanding to these mobs, Œof disarming the > infrastructure of oppression¹? I can only conjecture that some participants > believed they were responding to historic wrongs of the Shi¹as, as others, > in the case of Sabina, felt morally justified in taking the law into their > hands against a woman they believed was the source of all corruption. > > I can¹t help hearing the ringing similarity between Œinfrastructure of > oppression¹ and the chilling phrase we used to hear pre-1992, Œdisputed > structure,¹ Œsymbol of Hindu oppression.¹ Do you remember Naipaul¹s defence > of Hindutva and why the tearing down of the Babri Masjid was but natural for > a people who had been oppressed by Muslim rulers for 500 years? The point > I¹m trying to make is that once you give a group a carte blanche to do as > they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you have > very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with > politically do the same. That is why laws exist and ought to be followed. > > You argue: That they choose not to go to 'C' (the Srinagar-Leh-Manali road > that Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on which we can evaluate the > merits or demerits of the state's decision to fire into this amassed crowd. > > You are right. I never did! It would have been absurd of me to suggest that > we evaluate the police firing in the light of the decision not to take the > Leh-Manali route. I was merely pointing out that the decision to march to > Muzaffarabad need not have been taken, given an alternative existed. > > Re. the 100 acres of land & its distribution: this fact came to light only > about 10 days ago when the land records were pulled out and examined and was > not the spark that lit the agitation in Kashmir, sadly. What did was the > canard that the SASB acquiring 100 acres was the first step towards Hindus > settling in the valley by a government that was intent on demographic > change. Communal? Maybe, maybe not. Xenophobic,yes. Justified, not > justified: I don¹t care. It¹s just plain silly and tragic to have such a > brouhaha with people being killed about something that¹s a bare-faced lie! > > The issue of agricultural land being occupied by the forces: absolutely > right, they shouldn¹t be there and were not there before 1989. One can only > urge all concerned to stay on track with the peace process between India & > Pakistan so that agreements can be inked once and for all & that J&K can be > dimilitarized. > > > May peace prevail. > > Best > sj > > > On 8/15/08 9:39 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > > > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, Dear Sonia Jabbar, > > > > > > > > Many thanks for your responses to my post earlier today. And apologies in > > advance for what is going to be a longish posting. So those not interested in > > the Amarnath row, or Jammu and Kashmir, may please skip this post. > > > > > > > > It is difficult to put all one's points across in a single posting, (without > > making it unwieldy) and so I am grateful that your responses have given me an > > opportunity to make some necessary elaborations. > > > > > > > > First of all, let me categorically state that Sonia, by pointing towards the > > violence that farmers faced in Greater Noida yesterday, and by referring to > > the histories of the Narmada agitation, and the Nandigram issue has helped me > > clarify some of my own thinking. > > > > > > > > This process of clarification does not require me to revise what I had written > > in relation to the current climate in the state of Jammu & Kashmir, on the > > contrary, it actually allows me to extend and develop my argument. I will come > > to this later, but first, there are some other issues that I need to deal > > with. > > > > > > > > When I had referred to the two kinds of treatment meted out to two different > > kinds of protest, I had not in fact thought in 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' terms, and > > after reading Sonia's response, I re-read my post carefully to see if there > > was any suggestion that I was referring to a difference in the state's > > response that could be attributed to the religious composition of the two > > different protesting crowds. I did not find the words 'Hindu' or 'Muslim' > > anywhere in my post. And while I do agree with Soina that when Jammu and > > Kashmir Police personnel open fire on protesting crowds in the Kashmir valley, > > what we witness is nominally 'Muslim' policemen, firing on nominally 'Muslim' > > protesters. The same Jammu and Kashmir police personnel firing on protesters > > in Jammu are likely to be a mix of nominally 'Hindu' and 'Muslim' personnel > > firing on a similarly mixed crowd of protesters (if that is, we agree with the > > assertion that the SASS protests have featured the participation of 'Jammu > > Muslims'). This fact may or may not be true, but let us for the sake of the > > argument, assume that this is so. > > > > > > > > Similarly, the caste/identity composition of western UP policemen is not > > likely to be very different from crowds of protesting western UP farmers in > > the unhappy place that is Greater Noida. It is a well known fact that the most > > brutal torture in the detention centres and interrogation centres in the > > Kashmir valley is meted out by STF (Special Task Force) personnel attatched to > > the state police. Almost invariably, these enforcers of the sharp edge of the > > Indian states marks on Kashmiri bodies tend to be Kashmiri, and Muslim. > > > > > > > > One clarification here though, the bulk of firing in the Kashmir valley has > > been undertaken by CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force) personnel, and the bulk > > of public anger has been, in this case against, the CRPF bullets, and CRPF > > sticks that smashed so many windows last night in downtown Srinagar. Now, > > anyone who has been to Srinagar knows, that the scared and vulnerable and > > aggressive faces that man CRPF bunkers are not Kashmiri. Their bodies (more > > often than not) come from hotter places in the plains and plateaus of the > > Indian hearland. And I see their deplyoment in a war zone like Kashmir as > > unfortunate, as saddening > > > > > > > > Sonia has referred to Kashmiri protesting crowds 'baying for blood' during the > > last few days during the mass gatherings that took place on the road to > > Muzaffarabad, and in Srinagar and other towns. I have been speaking to friends > > in the Kashmir valley today, and they told me that the slogans that were > > raised during the protests > > > > on the road to Muzaffarabad were as follows (in order of frequency) > > > > > > > > 1. 'Hum Kya Chahtey, Azaadi' (What do we want, Freedom), The staple full > > throated cry that rings out, and has rung out in most protests in the Kashmir > > valley for the last two decades. > > > > > > > > 2. 'Fruit to bahaana hai, Muzaffarabad jaana hai' (Fruit is an excuse, we want > > to go to Muzaffarabad). This has been chanted, not by the truckers carrying > > fruit, but by the accompanying marchers. > > > > > > > > 3. 'Aadhi Roti Khayenge, Sar nahin Jhukayenge'. (We can eat half a piece of > > bread, but won't bow our heads') > > > > > > > > 3. 'Jeeve, Jeeve, Pakistan' (Long live, Long live, Pakistan) > > > > > > > > Now, whatever these slognas may or may not imply, none of these slogans, bayed > > for anyone's blood. Not only did the marchers refrain from raising any slogans > > that can be construed as calls to violence, the 'separatist' political > > leadership that had aligned itself with the mass protests also repeatedly > > called for peaceful protests, using all available channels, including those > > afforded to them by the mainstream media. I have seen the Mirwaiz calling > > repeatedly for protests to be peaceful. If this leadership had wanted to queer > > the pitch by asking for violence, I am sure it would have been heeded by some > > sections in a very angry crowd. No such call was made, and no policeman, or > > paramilitary force personnel were attacked. In some instances, CRPF bunkers > > were torn down (and this happenned after the incidents of firing) but the > > demobilization of offensive fortifications on the street can be hardly called > > a violent act. In my book, it is an act of disarming the infrastructure of > > occupation, without causing any injury or violence to the occupiers > > themselves. > > > > > > > > Once the bodies of people killed by the CRPF started to make themselves > > visible in funeral processions, many young people started shouting 'Khoon ke > > badle Khoon' (blood for blood). But this 'baying' if it can be called that, > > occurred once blood had been spilt, and not, as I may point out, by the > > bayers. > > > > > > > > On the contrary, I have seen Dr. Praveen Togadia (who has endorsed the SASS > > agitation in Jammu by calling mass protests in other cities in India) declare > > on television 'agar maange nahin poori ki gayi to sangharsh aur bhi ugra roop > > lega' ('if the demands are not met, the agitation will take on even more > > extreme forms'). We have heard crowds in Jammu chant, 'Jaan denge, par baba > > Amarnath ki Zamin vapas lenge' (we will give up our lives, but will not give > > up on Baba Amarnath's land) and variations thereof. In fact, two > > 'jaans/lives' have been tragically offered as suicides. For me, this is just > > as shocking, just as violent, as any other kind of call to violence. These > > crowds have set Gujjar huts on fire. And setting shepherds huts on fire is not > > exactly the same thing as tearing down the sandbags of a CRPF bunker. So any > > attempt at 'equating' the degree of violence in these two instances needs to > > be read as disingenuous. > > > > > > > > As for the fact that in one instance (in Jammu) the crowds carried the Indian > > flag, and shouted pro-India slogans, and that in the other instance (in > > Kashmir) the crowds carried Pakistani flags and that some (or many) shouted > > pro-Pakistan slogans does not say anything about the violent intentions or > > tenor of either of the two protesting crowds. > > > > > > > > As someone who carries no brief, for any form of nationalism, (Indian, > > Pakistani or Kashmiri) I am not willing to judge a crowd on the basis of which > > kind of nationalism they choose to profess. What interests me is the fact that > > given two crowds, with two different kinds of behaviour, one of which carries > > an Indian flag, and another which carries a Pakistani flag, black flags, or no > > flags at all - the Indian state chooses to fire on the second crowd, even > > though the second crowd, which may be greater in numbers, is not indicating > > that it is anything but a peaceful assembly of people intent on going from 'A' > > to 'B'. That they choose not to go to 'C' (the Srinagar-Leh-Manali road that > > Sonia refers to) cannot be a criterion on which we can evaluate the merits or > > demerits of the state's decision to fire into this amassed crowd. > > > > > > > > Notwithstanding the multitude of links supplied by Aditya Raj Kaul in his > > response to my posting. Facts, remain, facts. Three casualties of police > > firing in one instance (in a very militant protest in Jammu) and now thirty > > casualties (and likely to mount) in police and CRPF firing in the other > > instance (in Kashmir) including instances where CRPF personnel fired on > > ambulances ferrying the wounded to hospital, and inside hospitals. These > > instances of violence against ambulances, the injured and doctors and nurses > > attending to them must go down in the history of the Indian state as examples > > of the very worst forms of state brutality. > > > > > > > > For more details - see - > > > > > > > > This needs to be seen also in the context of the fact that the opening of the > > "Srinagar-Muzaffarabad' road is a long standing demand of several sections of > > political opinion (not all of them separatist) and that in fact predates the > > current troubles in the valley (from 1989) by several decades. It needs also > > to be seen in the light of the fact that what the people on the highways in > > the Kashmir valley were demanding had already been agreed to in principle by > > the governments of India and Pakistan. If anything, the current situation was > > an opportunity for the governments of the state of Jammu and Kashmir > > (currently represented by the Governor, a representative of the Union of > > India) and the Union of India to display a modicum of vision and sagacity by > > opening the line of control, especially when the people of the valley were > > voting with their feet, and their bodies for this to be done. > > > > > > > > Even those who wish the Indian state well in its continuing occupation of the > > Kashmir valley would no doubt see this turn of events as a tragically wasted > > opportunity. > > > > > > > > Let me now turn to the second important question that has arisen from this > > discussion. The question of what might enable us to think about the situations > > of the Greater Noida farmers and the protesting masses in the Kashmir valley > > (and elsewhere, in Nandigram, and in the Kashmir valley). > > > > > > > > Sonia has pointed out in her posting that as far as the transfer of land to > > the Amarnath Shrine Board is concerned, "Of the 100 acres in > > > > question, only 5 acres belongs to the forest department and the rest is > > > > private property belonging to several locals." > > > > > > > > If this is indeed the case, then the extent of the anger against the move to > > effect a transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board is all the more > > understandable. (I do not doubt that it would be understandable even if this > > were not the case, but that is another matter. ) > > > > > > > > Land is a highly emotive issue in all parts of South Asia, and in many parts > > of the world where it is tied to livelihood and to survival. The desire to > > acquire land (usually with the mediation of the state) for purposes other than > > those relevant to the livelihood and survival of the customary owners, users > > and custodians of land is what gives the common sharp edge to the question of > > the arbitrary acquisition of land by state or state backed agencies, whether > > in Kashmir, or in the Narmada valley, or in Nandigram is what is clearly > > evident. In Kashmir, (in the absence of any other viable form of sustainable > > economic activity, barring tourism, land is all that people can fall back on. > > And we need to remember that some of the capital that the National Conference > > still falls back on when its naked collusion with the occupation comes to the > > fore, is the vivid, yet fading memory of land reforms in the early fifties. > > > > > > > > So, then, what is the story about land, in the Kashmir valley. > > > > > > > > "In 2003 Abdul Rashid, Member of Parliament was told in Rajya Sabha that the > > army and the Central Para-Military Forces (CPMFs) have 41,594.767 acres > > (332760 kanals) in J&K. This comes to about 170 sq kms for which records > > exist. But an equal amount, if not more, is under illegal occupation, > > according to The Economic Times [December 6, 2006]. The most recent figures > > being circulated suggests that 6,81,839 kanals are under the armed forces¹ > > possession. Of this 3,10,184 kanals is unauthorized possession. In Srinagar > > officially, the defence establishment have 45,080 kanals of land located at > > Badamibagh, Rangreth, Danodhar Karewa, Sharifabad, Tatoo and Militia Grounds. > > In 2006, it has been reported that the Indian Army¹s Northern Command has > > acquired 8000 kanals in Awantipora. There have also been reports of Indian Air > > Force wanting land for a new air base in Mansbal and in the same area > > 3Rashtriya Rifles (RR) has submitted a request to acquire nearly 1500 kanals > > adjoining its garrison. Manasbal also highlights another feature of this Œland > > grab¹. Villagers complain that since the irrigation canal passes through land > > which the 3RR wants, thousands of kanals of land would be denied irrigation. > > So widespread is the concern in J&K over land under security forces occupation > > that even the pro-Indian Peoples Democratic Party, led by Mufti Mohammed > > Saeed, in a resolution adopted on February 11, 2007 states ³with distressŠ > > that over the last 15 years thousands of acres of orchards and agricultural > > land have been acquired in the state particularly in Kashmir Valley, districts > > of Rajouri, Poonch and Doda by the Armed Forces.² The resolution also says > > that ³many institutional buildings including hospitals and schools have been > > occupied by the armed forces.² A conservative estimate suggests that 35,000 ha > > of such land is under the control of the Indian Army alone. > > > > > > > > Take deployment in just one tehsil; Pattan in Baramulla, to appreciate its > > significance. This tehsil has 92 villages. Amongst these 92 villages there are > > 4 army brigade headquarters and 12 checkposts. Pattan plus Babateng also hosts > > camps of Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF), Border Security Force (BSF) and > > Special Operations Group (SOG). There are three police stations in the > > tehsil; at Pattan, Mirgund and Kreeri. Each check post has anywhere between > > 100-150 soldiers although there are few which have much larger numbers in > > excess of 300. Thus roughly a cluster of nine villages come under one check > > post. And one brigade is available for operations covering 23 villages whereas > > one police station caters to 30-31 villages. Thus all movement to and from the > > village to fields, market, town is monitored and accompanied by regular > > patrolling. Thus, the margin for normal human Œerrors¹, such as stepping out > > for a smoke after dark, or a stroll can result in death. On top of this, the > > extent of deployment of troops and the land under their occupation acts as a > > brake on people¹s own capacity to propel growth. It also results in > > difficulties in getting easy access to markets for commodity export because of > > delay in transportation due to security drills, slowdown on highways because > > of military convoys carrying troops, material and weaponry etc, and relatively > > higher fuel and labour costs due to all this." > > > > > > > > Were this land to be freed of occupation it would contribute immensely to > > increasing agricultural/fruit production and generation of revenue and cut > > back on net outflow from J&K. > > > > > > > > If this is true (and the statement recorded in the minutes of the Rajya Sabha > > do have official sanction) then, the armed forces and paramilitaries of the > > Indian state, together occupied 41,594.767 acres, and since the majority of > > force deployment in J&K is in the Kashmir valley, then the majority of this > > land would logically be seen to lie in the Kashmir valley. > > > > > > > > The net area under fruit cultivation in the State of J&K is 174,000 ha are > > under fresh fruits (orchards). 174,000 ha is equal to 4,29,963 acres. If we > > compare this figure against the reliable estimate of land under direct > > occupation my armed forces of the Indian state (41,594.767 acres) we get the > > following figures. The armed forces occupy land that is roughly equivalent to > > what would amount to 10 % of the land under fruit cultivation. In crude terms, > > one in every ten orchards is not an orchard, it is a fortress. > > > > > > > > All figures are sourced from the Fifth Economic Census [published by the > > Central Statistical Organisation together with Directorate of Economics and > > Statistics J&K, 2005] and Economic Survey 2006-07 for Jammu & Kashmir (ES > > 2006-07) [The Directorate of Economics and Statistics, Government of Jammu and > > Kashmir, 2007]as cited in 'Understanding the J&K Economy' by Gautam Navlakha, > > Kashmir Affairs, Volume 2, No.2, April-June 2007 > > > > http://www.kashmiraffairs.org > > > > Gautam_Navlakha_understanding_J&K_economy.html > > > > > > > > [And before anyone jumps on me for citing a source that comes by way of Gautam > > Navlakha, let me state that Navlakha may not have read the Rajtarangini with > > great care, but he certainly does take the time to read the Economic Survey > > 2006-2007 for J&K, and other official documents with a certain degree of care. > > And the figures under question here are not his opinions, but notes in these > > same official documents.] > > > > > > > > In a situation of direct occupation of a resource as precious as land in > > Kashmir, the arbitrary decision to appropriate even just 100 more acres of > > land by an unrepresentative body (the office of the governor) for whatever > > purpose cannot but be seen as a deliberate affront to a population stretched > > to the very limits of its patience by the violence of a continuing occupation. > > I fail to see, why the anger of fruit growers, denied markets, smarting under > > the knowledge that their orchards have in many cases been taken over by the > > Indian state, should look upon any act of land acquisition with kindness. > > > > > > > > Look for instance at a news item in the Kashmir Times of Friday, April 18, > > 2008 > > > > > > > > Rental hikes by Army may adversely affect fruit production in Jammu and > > kashmir > > > > With fruit production in Kashmir static, the Kashmiri growers have asked the > > state and central government not to acquire horticulture land for any official > > purposes. They are also not satisfied with recent rent hike by the defence > > ministry. > > > > > > > > The growers fear that acquiring of the horticulture land for official purposes > > will reduce the fruit production in the state. Jammu and Kashmir is the only > > state in India that has around 2.75 lakh hectares of land under the > > horticulture.The major portion of this land is used for the cultivation of > > fresh fruits especially apples. > > > > > > > > President, Kashmir Fruit Growers and Dealers Association, Ghulam Rasool Bhat > > told Kashmir Times that, "The government should come up with a law for banning > > the use of horticulture land for any official purpose." He said that in > > Western countries, the government has already banned use of horticulture land > > for any official purposes, he said, adding similar ban should be imposed in > > Jammu Kashmir as well. "If steps are not taken, time will come when we will > > lose major portion of our orchards." > > > > > > > > How deep this connection between orchards and armed bases runs is evident from > > another source, this time a more subjective account. Which bears being read > > through right to the end. > > > > > > > > There are no Djinns in Anantnag, they don't scare us anymore¹ > > > > http://bluekashmir.blogspot.com/ > > > > Uzma Mohsin > > > > Originally published in the Personal Histories section of the Tehelka weekly; > > July 28, 2007 issue. I thank Uzma Mohsin for the sketch. > > > > > > > > "...Relations between the townspeople and the army were tense. Early each > > morning, as the town came alive with the azaans from its many mosques, the > > army would switch on huge loudspeakers on three sides of the hill, and Hindi > > songs and bhajans would blare out of them for hours on end. It was some kind > > of a unilateral, undeclared war; we all lived in terror of the day this war > > would come down the slopes in heavy muddy boots and trample on us like ants. > > It stopped only in the late 90s, when I left Kashmir at age 16. > > > > > > > > THE TOWN had become very gloomy ‹ by six in the evening, the streets wore a > > deserted look. Lights were kept low, curtains were always drawn. People made > > guesses about the origins of distant gunshots. Scary stories for children no > > longer had any tasrupdars, djinns or haputs in them ‹ there was no need for > > them, they didn¹t scare us any more. Only the snow surprised us when, after a > > perfectly clear day, we would wake up to find bright snow covering everything > > open to the sky. In the distance, the snow-covered hill would merge with the > > whiteness of the surrounding town, and become almost invisible. These were > > perhaps the only happy moments for me at that time. > > > > > > > > One apple season, many years later, we found the courage to go up the hill to > > pick apples. A new, utterly strange city had sprung to life on the flat > > plateau. It was such a contrast to the choked, dying town below. There was an > > elaborate army infrastructure, with its own buildings, streets, armoured > > vehicles and helicopters. There were families living there, families of army > > men. There were many shops too. Not many people in the town knew what was > > going on here, for it was happening on the hill¹s invisible side. > > > > > > > > To our dismay, we found many orchards had been torn down; our best apple trees > > were dying for want of care. The army, we heard, was planning to build an > > airstrip there. Years later, when I came to study in a northern Indian > > university, I realised that the army city on the hill that overlooked my town > > had a peculiarly North Indian town feel to it. I have been living away from > > home for the last nine years, as have so many of my other childhood friends. I > > hear stories from my parents about the killings and injuries of some friends > > who stayed behind..." > > > > > > > > I could go on. But this has been a long enough post already. In the end, we > > need to look a little less at questions of faith and a little more at > > questions of land, and here we need to look at the question of what happened > > to the land left behind by Kashmiri Pandits, just as much as anything else. > > Some of this land was of course appropriated by greedy neighbours, some of it > > is in the occupation of the armed forces, which pay paltry rent (if they pay) > > and some of it is cared for by diligent neigbours who wait for the return of > > those who left. > > > > > > > > We need to realize that when it comes to the alienation of land, we touch one > > of the most emotive chords there can be, and this is in the end about Kashmir, > > but it is about something much bigger than Kashmir. It is about connivance and > > corporate greed, wherever it occurs. > > > > > > > > In a recent report by Sravan Sukla from Kushinagar in Uttar Pradesh in the > > Tehelka of 9 August 2008, the correspondent draws a sadly familiar picture of > > arbitrary state action by the BSP government in Uttar Pradesh to arbitrarily > > grab land for a complex to host a grandiose statue of the Maitreya Buddha (the > > ostentation of which would have made the Buddha weep, not smile). > > > > > > > > Will Buddha Smile over Ryots Tears > > > > http://www.tehelka.org/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne090808willbuddha_smile.asp > > > > > > > > It is interesting to read a quote from this article - > > > > > > > > "Among others, around a hundred Dalit families have been affected by the land > > acquisition. Interestingly, a Dalit farmer is leading the agitation against > > Mayawati. Forty-five year old Govardhan Gond, a semi-literate Dalit farmer and > > president of the Bhoomi Bachao Sangharsh Samiti, says that ³there is no > > question of > > > > surrendering our land so long as we are alive². > > > > > > > > ³I will slit their throats if they come to take possession of my land. It is > > my only source of livelihood,² declares Kamli Devi of Siswa village. A > > forty-year-old mother of six, she is leading a band of woman farmers against > > the acquisition to save her 50 bighas of land. > > > > > > > > Apart from the land, about 400 houses, half a dozen schools, including the > > area¹s only graduate institution, the Radha Krishna Inter College, a canal and > > about a dozen link roads are also falling prey to the acquisition. ³Where will > > our children study after these schools have been closed,² asks Dasai Gond of > > Dumri village. > > > > > > > > Significantly, a few Buddhist monks are also lending silent support to the > > farmers¹ cause. ³The government should try to refrain from displacing poor > > farmers for the project. Buddhism is based on non-violence and it does not > > allow causing pain to anyone. A project based on the woes of farmers will > > haunt us in future,² rues B. Gyaneshwar, the sangh nayak, or head, of the > > All-India Buddhist Monk Association." > > > > > > > > It would have been equally interesting had those who are leading the agitation > > for the transfer of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board and their sympathisers > > displayed even a fraction of the sensitivity that has been deplayed by the > > head of the All India Buddhist Monk Association when it comes to the > > acquisition of land for apparently religious purposes. > > > > > > > > Then, they (the partisans of the SASS agitation) would have matched the > > restraint and neighbourly feelings displayed by their Kashmiri counterparts > > towards the Amarnath pilgrims who have time and again stated that their fight > > is not against pilgrims or Hindus but against the move to acquire land. > > > > > > > > In fact, this year has had a record number of pilgrims travel to Amarnath, > > both by new and old routes, and the pilgrimage has continued, peacefully. > > > > > > > > Thank you all for the opportunity for this clarification, and apologies for > > what has been an overlong post, > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Every story has two sides. You can't take both. National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 21:10:11 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:10:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> Shivam, Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less dangerous than an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and communal movement which has effected even the world super powers. For more info log on www.ikashmir.net Pawan On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Dear Sonia, > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already laboured > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far with > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. While > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it was > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the majority > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > Warmly, > Shivam > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have raised. > You > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is very much > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim Kashmir > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion given > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to point out > that > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously not to > accuse > > you of communal thinking. > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during the > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really don¹t > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember > 1989 > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative > about > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand strong > mob > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did > in > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > culpability: > > ----------------------------------------------- > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming the main > > target of protesters. > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct against > their > > own people". > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests in > Kashmir > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 injured. > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" marchers in > Uri > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house officer of > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two others > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a target > > killing". > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and torched > it. > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents have been > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a social > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj Bagh > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police > "whether > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in stark > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen as > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:16:06 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:16:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke violence between two communities, which this video almost does. It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the Kumbh mela? But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. best s On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > __._,_.___ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Every story has two sides. You can't take both. National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 21:20:10 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:20:10 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170850y26cb0874xb699c6b6a4503d72@mail.gmail.com> Shivam, Whatz wrong with you my brother ? If you have been ignorant, please dont justify it. Amarnath Yatra has been going for centuries ,even before Islam came into existence. I do not wish to slug it out again, but i request you to kindly read this link http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/amarnath/ Regards Pawan On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:16 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > Kumbh mela? > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > best > s > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > __._,_.___ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > -- > Every story has two sides. > You can't take both. > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:21:32 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:21:32 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the only leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone hem down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if you talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the Pakistan bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons most Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements but to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not getting into the chap act of body counts... best shivam On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > Shivam, > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less dangerous than > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and communal > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > Pawan > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > Dear Sonia, > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already laboured > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far with > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. While > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it was > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the majority > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > > > Warmly, > > Shivam > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have raised. > You > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is very much > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim Kashmir > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion given > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to point out > that > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously not to > accuse > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the phrase, > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during the > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really > don¹t > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you remember > 1989 > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument when > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative > about > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand strong > mob > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they did > in > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > culpability: > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming the main > > > target of protesters. > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct against > their > > > own people". > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests in > Kashmir > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 injured. > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" marchers in > Uri > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house officer of > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two others > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a target > > > killing". > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and torched > it. > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents have > been > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a social > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj Bagh > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police > "whether > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in stark > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen as > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:22:48 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:22:48 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808170850y26cb0874xb699c6b6a4503d72@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170850y26cb0874xb699c6b6a4503d72@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170852w6e12b2f6la3949a960dd48cdc@mail.gmail.com> It has, but not in such numbers as Haj or Kumbh. Even today Vaishnu Devi gets 25 times more visitors than Amarnath. best shivam On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > Shivam, > > Whatz wrong with you my brother ? > > If you have been ignorant, please dont justify it. > > Amarnath Yatra has been going for centuries ,even before Islam came into > existence. I do not wish to slug it out again, but i request you to kindly > read this link > > http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/amarnath/ > > Regards > > Pawan > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:16 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > > Kumbh mela? > > > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > > > best > > s > > > > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > -- > > Every story has two sides. > > You can't take both. > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 21:23:03 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:23:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the only > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone hem > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if you > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the Pakistan > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons most > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements but > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > best > shivam > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > Shivam, > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less dangerous > than > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and > communal > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > Pawan > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > wrote: > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already laboured > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far with > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. While > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it was > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the majority > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > > > > > Warmly, > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have > raised. > > You > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is very > much > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim > Kashmir > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion given > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to point > out > > that > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously not to > > accuse > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the > phrase, > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during > the > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really > > don¹t > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you > remember > > 1989 > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument > when > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative > > about > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand > strong > > mob > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they > did > > in > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > > culpability: > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming the > main > > > > target of protesters. > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct > against > > their > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests in > > Kashmir > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 injured. > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" marchers > in > > Uri > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house officer > of > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two > others > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a > target > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and > torched > > it. > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents have > > been > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a > social > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj Bagh > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police > > "whether > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in > stark > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen as > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:24:15 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:24:15 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A Different Jammu That I Know In-Reply-To: <361156.55493.qm@web65506.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <361156.55493.qm@web65506.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170854j12b9e5b6pa0c5024e58967f5e@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:25:47 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:25:47 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Rethinking Kashmir Politics In-Reply-To: <397552.50818.qm@web65516.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <397552.50818.qm@web65516.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170855t2b2b94cfn71256eef728c0cbd@mail.gmail.com> Rethinking Kashmir Politics Yoginder Sikand Many Kashmiri Muslims vociferously insist that the demand for independence of Kashmir has nothing to do with religion. Instead, they argue, that the conflict in and over of Kashmir is essentially 'political'. What is conveniently ignored by those who make this claim is that religion and politics, particularly in the case of the Kashmir dispute, involving as it does the rival claims of Muslim-majority Pakistan and Hindu-dominated India, can hardly be separated. As the current spate of violence in both the Hindi-dominated Jammu division and the Muslim-majority Kashmir Valley, triggered off by a controversial decision of the state government to allot a piece of land to a Hindu temple trust, so starkly indicates, religion and communal identities defined essentially in religious terms have everything to do with the basic issue of Jammu and Kashmir and its still unsettled political status. Kashmiri nationalists, in contrast to hardcore Islamists and the Hindutva brigade, quickly dismiss this point, finding it, perhaps, too embarrassing, afraid of being labeled as religious chauvinists or 'communal'. But, no longer, it seems, can the crucial role of religion in shaping the contours of the on-going conflict in and over Kashmir be denied. That the on-going BJP-inspired agitation in Jammu has marshaled considerable support among the Hindus of Jammu clearly indicates that the political project of Kashmiri nationalists—of a separate, independent state of Jammu and Kashmir—has absolutely no takers among the Hindus (and other non-Muslims) of the state. Kashmiri nationalists insist that in the independent Jammu and Kashmir of their dreams, religious minorities—Hindus, Sikhs and Buddhists—who would account for almost a fourth of the population, would have equal rights and no cause for complaint. Some even boast, without adducing any evidence, of commanding the support of the non-Muslims of the state for their project. At the same time as they roundly berate the Dogra Raj as a long spell of slavery for the state's Muslims, they insist that the boundaries of the state of Jammu and Kashmir, as constructed by the same Dogras, against the will of the Kashmiri Muslims, be considered as sacrosanct, as setting the borders of the independent country that they demand. If, as they argue, Dogra Raj was illegitimate, then surely there is nothing holy about the state boundaries as laid down by the Dogras, bringing Jammu and the vastly different Kashmir Valley in a forced union. If, as they rightly insist, Kashmir was conquered against its will by the Dogras of Jammu, there is no reason why the forced union of the two should continue in the independent Jammu and Kashmir that the Kashmiri nationalists dream of, particularly given the Jammu Hindus' resentment of alleged Kashmiri hegemony, a sentiment shared even by many Jammu Muslims. Kashmiri nationalists, however, would refuse to recognize this basic contradiction in their argument. The reason is obvious: To do so, to recognize that the Jammu's Hindus (and Leh's Buddhists) would resist, even to the point of violence, the agenda of an independent Jammu and Kashmir would clearly indicate the obvious, but embarrassing fact, that this agenda represents the aspirations and interests largely of Kashmiri Muslims, and is a means to legitimize Kashmir Muslim control over the rest of the state. The analogy with pre-Partition India is useful. The Muslim League insisted that because the Hindus of India were in a numerical majority, a united, independent India, no matter what safeguards it gave and promises of equality it made to the Muslims, would be dominated by the Hindus, and would, for all its secular and democratic claims, be untrammeled Hindu Raj. Hence their demand for a separate Pakistan. The Hindus of Jammu and the Buddhists of Leh find themselves in precisely the same position as did supporters of the Muslim League in pre-Partition India, only now the actors have reversed their roles. Kashmiri nationalists insist they want an independent, united Jammu and Kashmir, just as the Congress did when it talked of a united and free India. And, like the Congress did with the Muslims, they promise the non-Muslim minorities of Jammu and Leh that their rights would be fully protected in this state of their dreams. Yet, just as many Muslims refused to accept the promises of the Congress, fearing that they would never be honored, the non-Muslim minorities in Jammu and Kashmir refuse to buy the arguments of the Kashmiri nationalists, which they rightly see as a thinly-veiled guise to justify Kashmiri hegemony. I have heard Kashmiris, including some of my closest friends, come up with the most ingenious arguments to counter the above point. 'Kashmiriyat, the teachings of love and peace of our Sufis, unite us all and would ensure that non-Muslim minorities will be safe and protected in a free Jammu and Kashmir', some of them say. A laughable claim, unless all Kashmiris suddenly decide to shun the world and trod the mystical path, an unlikely prospect. Sufism is in a rapid state of decline in Kashmir and elsewhere, as is the case with all other forms of mysticism. Then there is another bizarre argument, which I heard, among others, from none less than Syed Ali Gilani, chief Islamist ideologue in Kashmir, and a fervent backer of Kashmir's accession to Pakistan, which runs like this: Islam lays down the rights of non-Muslims and insists that Muslims should respect them. The Prophet Muhammad himself did so. So, if Jammu and Kashmir gets freedom and becomes a truly Islamic state, the non-Muslim minorities will have full freedom and equality. The late Sadullah Tantrey, once head of the Jammu branch of the Jamaat-e Islami, even went on to insist, in all seriousness, that 'Indeed so happy will the non-Muslims of Jammu and Kashmir be in this independent Islamic state that even Hindus from India would line up to settle in the state.' I squirmed in my seat as he went on, stunned at his evident ignorance or hypocrisy or, as seemed more likely, both. I itched to tell him, as I sat before him in his house in Gath, up in the mountains of Doda, that the 'Islamic state' hardly outlived the Prophet Muhammad and has been completely extinct ever since; that the fate of minorities in scores of Muslim countries, even those like Saudi Arabia that claim to be 'Islamic', was deplorable, that even Jinnah had promised full equality to the non-Muslim citizens of Paksitan but that had not prevented them from being reduced to virtual second-class citizens, and that, simply put, he was lying or else living in a fool's paradise. I kept my mouth shut, however. After all, I was there to learn what his views were, not to convert him. Clearly, any forced union of the disparate nationalities in Jammu and Kashmir in the form of a separate, independent state that Kashmiri nationalists champion (as now do even some Kashmiri Islamists, former passionate advocates for union with Pakistan, who, flowing with the tide, have realized that their earlier stance has increasingly few takers among Kashmiris, given their mounting disenchantment with Pakistan) would be a sure recipe for civil war. The current agitation in Jammu is ample evidence of that. It is time, therefore, that pro-'Azadi' Kashmiri leaders admit this publicly. This is not, however, to plead the case for the division of the state, as the RSS has been advocating, for surely that would further harden communal boundaries and rivalries in just the same way as would the project of an independent Jammu and Kashmir. Rather, it is to recognize and publicly acknowledge the very plural character of Jammu and Kashmir, and the concerns and sensitivities of all its peoples, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and others. From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 21:25:50 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:25:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170852w6e12b2f6la3949a960dd48cdc@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170850y26cb0874xb699c6b6a4503d72@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170852w6e12b2f6la3949a960dd48cdc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170855l1fe46ed5gcb87a9ba3d933c3d@mail.gmail.com> Shivam, The treck to Amarnath used to be very dangerous . Every year many people died. I remember when my maternal uncle went to yatra in late 70's , my grandma had not eaten for days. As the facilities would improve, so would the pilgrims increase. Dont you think I would visit Kailash, if it become easier to travel and more affordable ? Pawan On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > It has, but not in such numbers as Haj or Kumbh. Even today Vaishnu > Devi gets 25 times more visitors than Amarnath. > > best > shivam > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > Shivam, > > > > Whatz wrong with you my brother ? > > > > If you have been ignorant, please dont justify it. > > > > Amarnath Yatra has been going for centuries ,even before Islam came into > > existence. I do not wish to slug it out again, but i request you to > kindly > > read this link > > > > http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/amarnath/ > > > > Regards > > > > Pawan > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:16 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > wrote: > > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > > > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > > > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > > > > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > > > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > > > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > > > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > > > > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > > > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > > > Kumbh mela? > > > > > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > > > > > best > > > s > > > > > > > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Every story has two sides. > > > You can't take both. > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:34:11 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:34:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808170855l1fe46ed5gcb87a9ba3d933c3d@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170850y26cb0874xb699c6b6a4503d72@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170852w6e12b2f6la3949a960dd48cdc@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170855l1fe46ed5gcb87a9ba3d933c3d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170904y64326f35g443e20c2a51e2794@mail.gmail.com> Oh yes certainly! Like you can take a helicopter to the cave from the Baltal land (the famous 800 kanals). Even the trek from there is half that of the Pahalgam route. Why then does the Baltal route still get less yatris than the Pahalgam route? A langarwala from Punjab explained that the Pahalgam route is the traditional route, he claimed it has mention in he scriptures. He said the idea of he Amarnath pilgrimage is the toil and hardship of walking up there - as in the case of Vaishnu Devi. The effort is part of the devotion. But these modern middle class pilgrims are not like the sadhus, the langarwala laghed and so did I. They want a helicopter to the lingam, don't care if the lingam melts, don't care if the hallowed shrine board doesn't allow agarbattis and diyas - point is to just go there, come back, shout bam bam bholay, wave the 'V' sign at army jawans, who shouts bum bum bholay in return, as the Kashmiri Muslim looks on, and then looks awa, lest he be called communal... Pawan my friend, if you are planning to go next year, let me tell you hat the helicopter sorties are available from 'Hindu' Jammu itself. And if you are going to wait for a few years, don't worry, I am sure the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board will ink a contract with Tata Sky or Dish TV or whoever the highest bidder is, to telecast live darshan... Bhum Bhum bholay! shivam On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > Shivam, > > The treck to Amarnath used to be very dangerous . Every year many people > died. I remember when my maternal uncle went to yatra in late 70's , my > grandma had not eaten for days. > > As the facilities would improve, so would the pilgrims increase. > > Dont you think I would visit Kailash, if it become easier to travel and more > affordable ? > > > Pawan > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > It has, but not in such numbers as Haj or Kumbh. Even today Vaishnu > > Devi gets 25 times more visitors than Amarnath. > > > > best > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Shivam, > > > > > > Whatz wrong with you my brother ? > > > > > > If you have been ignorant, please dont justify it. > > > > > > Amarnath Yatra has been going for centuries ,even before Islam came into > > > existence. I do not wish to slug it out again, but i request you to > kindly > > > read this link > > > > > > http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/amarnath/ > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:16 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > wrote: > > > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > > > > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > > > > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > > > > > > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > > > > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > > > > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > > > > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > > > > > > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > > > > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > > > > Kumbh mela? > > > > > > > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > > > > > > > best > > > > s > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > List archive: > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Every story has two sides. > > > > You can't take both. > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:35:23 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:35:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper and you know what you will hear? "We are al terorrists here." best shivam On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the only > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone hem > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if you > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the Pakistan > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons most > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements but > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > best > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Shivam, > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less dangerous > than > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and > communal > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > wrote: > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already laboured > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far with > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. While > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it was > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the majority > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have > raised. > > > You > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is very > much > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim > Kashmir > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion > given > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to point > out > > > that > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously not > to > > > accuse > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the > phrase, > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used during > the > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I really > > > don¹t > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you > remember > > > 1989 > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument > when > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or provocative > > > about > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand > strong > > > mob > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as they > did > > > in > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > > > culpability: > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming the > main > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct > against > > > their > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests in > > > Kashmir > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 injured. > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" marchers > in > > > Uri > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house > officer of > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two > others > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a > target > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and > torched > > > it. > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents have > > > been > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a > social > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj > Bagh > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police > > > "whether > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in > stark > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen as > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:38:05 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:38:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Land row conflict between nationalist and anti-national forces' In-Reply-To: <6353c690808161049o350b5119lb47801cf34e6f84a@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808161049o350b5119lb47801cf34e6f84a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170908v2c2658dbm596d07f12a809508@mail.gmail.com> The man who is to be blamed for all of this, the man who the "separatists" are thanking for infusing the azadi struggle with fresh life, is seeking to shift blme on a party which is seen in Kashmir as being closer to "Delhi" than even the NC. Sinha sa'ab, tussi great ho! On 8/16/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > *'Land row conflict between nationalist and anti-national forces'* > > *New Delhi (PTI):* Accusing the PDP of misleading the people of Jammu and > Kashmir, former state Governor S K Sinha on Saturday described the Amarnath > land row as a conflict between nationalist and anti-national forces. > > "PDP is considered as pro-India party. But they lead march to Muzafarrabad. > Despite knowing fully well about the Baltal land, they are busy misleading > the people," Sinha said on the sidelines of a function here. > > He said the PDP ministers had given clearance for the transfer of land after > proposals were made by the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board in 2005. > > "This proposal was considered by the government for three long years and > finally cleared by two cabinet ministers belonging to PDP. Later, the PDP > jumped on the bandwagon with extremists to fuel communal sentiments," he > said delivering the first Field Marshal Manekshaw memorial lecture here. > > Claiming that the decision to revoke the order of land given to the Amarnath > Shrine board by the government was "illegal and and violating Hight Court > order", Sinha said, "it is opportunist politicians like Mufti Mohammad Sayed > who hijacked attempts to promote liberal and modern outlook and cater to > fanatic outlook". > > Terming the Amarnath land row as a "non-issue" picked up by the extremists, > he said "the present conflict in Jammu and Kashmir is not between Hindus and > Muslims as such, but between nationalist and anti-national forces". > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 17 21:40:07 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 09:10:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath Message-ID: <667940.17780.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go if we aspire to survive at all. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् To: Aditya Raj Kaul Cc: sarai list Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke violence between two communities, which this video almost does. It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the Kumbh mela? But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. best s On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > __._,_.___ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Every story has two sides. You can't take both. National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 17 21:40:52 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 09:10:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath Message-ID: <743777.18135.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go if we aspire to survive at all. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् To: Aditya Raj Kaul Cc: sarai list Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke violence between two communities, which this video almost does. It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the Kumbh mela? But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. best s On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > __._,_.___ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Every story has two sides. You can't take both. National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 21:41:04 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:41:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170904y64326f35g443e20c2a51e2794@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808141020v170b8040g4c3e6232d949857c@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170846i7d2803a8l883c6a7ed9525646@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170850y26cb0874xb699c6b6a4503d72@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170852w6e12b2f6la3949a960dd48cdc@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170855l1fe46ed5gcb87a9ba3d933c3d@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170904y64326f35g443e20c2a51e2794@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170911h2c0052f6iaac30deb848efc28@mail.gmail.com> Shivam, We would be blessed if we are shown the live darshan of Amarnath. With my friends in media , i am sure I would try to have this facility next year itself. However , I disagree with other thing . My old grandmother may not be able to travel either through Baltal or Pahalgam. So if she can travel by a helicopter , she should . Times have changed. People used to go to haj barefooted , walking , then on camel backs and now travel by air. Why shouldn't they if the technology and facilities are available. Why deny it ? May Bham Bham Boley bless all of us Pawan On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:34 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Oh yes certainly! Like you can take a helicopter to the cave from the > Baltal land (the famous 800 kanals). Even the trek from there is half > that of the Pahalgam route. Why then does the Baltal route still get > less yatris than the Pahalgam route? A langarwala from Punjab > explained that the Pahalgam route is the traditional route, he claimed > it has mention in he scriptures. He said the idea of he Amarnath > pilgrimage is the toil and hardship of walking up there - as in the > case of Vaishnu Devi. The effort is part of the devotion. But these > modern middle class pilgrims are not like the sadhus, the langarwala > laghed and so did I. They want a helicopter to the lingam, don't care > if the lingam melts, don't care if the hallowed shrine board doesn't > allow agarbattis and diyas - point is to just go there, come back, > shout bam bam bholay, wave the 'V' sign at army jawans, who shouts bum > bum bholay in return, as the Kashmiri Muslim looks on, and then looks > awa, lest he be called communal... > > Pawan my friend, if you are planning to go next year, let me tell you > hat the helicopter sorties are available from 'Hindu' Jammu itself. > And if you are going to wait for a few years, don't worry, I am sure > the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board will ink a contract with Tata Sky or > Dish TV or whoever the highest bidder is, to telecast live darshan... > > Bhum Bhum bholay! > shivam > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > Shivam, > > > > The treck to Amarnath used to be very dangerous . Every year many people > > died. I remember when my maternal uncle went to yatra in late 70's , my > > grandma had not eaten for days. > > > > As the facilities would improve, so would the pilgrims increase. > > > > Dont you think I would visit Kailash, if it become easier to travel and > more > > affordable ? > > > > > > Pawan > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > wrote: > > > It has, but not in such numbers as Haj or Kumbh. Even today Vaishnu > > > Devi gets 25 times more visitors than Amarnath. > > > > > > best > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > Whatz wrong with you my brother ? > > > > > > > > If you have been ignorant, please dont justify it. > > > > > > > > Amarnath Yatra has been going for centuries ,even before Islam came > into > > > > existence. I do not wish to slug it out again, but i request you to > > kindly > > > > read this link > > > > > > > > http://thekashmir.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/amarnath/ > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:16 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > > > > > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t > provoke > > > > > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > > > > > > > > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has > existed > > > > > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been > gaining > > > > > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris > see > > > > > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > > > > > > > > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > > > > > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, > the > > > > > Kumbh mela? > > > > > > > > > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > > > > > > > > > best > > > > > s > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > > > > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.netwith > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > List archive: > > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Every story has two sides. > > > > > You can't take both. > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > List archive: > > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 21:41:46 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:41:46 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper > and you know what you will hear? > > "We are al terorrists here." > > best > shivam > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > wrote: > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the only > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone hem > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if you > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the Pakistan > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons most > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements but > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > > > best > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less dangerous > > than > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " > > > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and > > communal > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already > laboured > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far > with > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. > While > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it was > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the > majority > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have > > raised. > > > > You > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is > very > > much > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim > > Kashmir > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion > > given > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to > point > > out > > > > that > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously > not > > to > > > > accuse > > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the > > phrase, > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used > during > > the > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I > really > > > > don¹t > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you > > remember > > > > 1989 > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar argument > > when > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > provocative > > > > about > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a thousand > > strong > > > > mob > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as > they > > did > > > > in > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > > > > culpability: > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming > the > > main > > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct > > against > > > > their > > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush protests > in > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > injured. > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > marchers > > in > > > > Uri > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house > > officer of > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and two > > others > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a > > target > > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and > > torched > > > > it. > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents > have > > > > been > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a > > social > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj > > Bagh > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the police > > > > "whether > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in > > stark > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen > as > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:45:39 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:45:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow rhetoric... On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > :) > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > wrote: > > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper > > > and you know what you will hear? > > > > > > "We are all terorrists here." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > best > > > shivam > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > > > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the only > > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone hem > > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if you > > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the Pakistan > > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons most > > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > > > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > > > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements but > > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > > > > > > > best > > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less > > dangerous > > > > than > > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " > > > > > > > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and > > > > communal > > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already > > laboured > > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far > > with > > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. > > While > > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > > > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it > > was > > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the > > majority > > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have > > > > raised. > > > > > > You > > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is > > very > > > > much > > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion > > > > given > > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to > > point > > > > out > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously > > not > > > > to > > > > > > accuse > > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the > > > > phrase, > > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used > > during > > > > the > > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I > > really > > > > > > don¹t > > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you > > > > remember > > > > > > 1989 > > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar > > argument > > > > when > > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > > provocative > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a > > thousand > > > > strong > > > > > > mob > > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as > > they > > > > did > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > > > > > > culpability: > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming > > the > > > > main > > > > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct > > > > against > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush > > protests in > > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > > injured. > > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > > marchers > > > > in > > > > > > Uri > > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house > > > > officer of > > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and > > two > > > > others > > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a > > > > target > > > > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and > > > > torched > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents > > have > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a > > > > social > > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj > > > > Bagh > > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the > > police > > > > > > "whether > > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in > > > > stark > > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen > > as > > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 17 21:48:31 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 09:18:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath Message-ID: <186923.94317.qm@web31502.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I agree. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् To: Prabhakar Singh Cc: Aditya Raj Kaul ; sarai list Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 9:13:03 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath It is not the obsession with but 'extremism of religion and hatred' that 'has to go if we aspire to survive at all'. You might want to be the hange you want to see... On 8/17/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go if we aspire to survive at all. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > To: Aditya Raj Kaul > Cc: sarai list > Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > Kumbh mela? > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > best > s > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > __._,_.___ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > -- > Every story has two sides. > You can't take both. > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > >      Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From shuddha at sarai.net Sun Aug 17 21:55:55 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:55:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <186923.94317.qm@web31502.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <186923.94317.qm@web31502.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <83558738-82C0-49C5-92CB-688A99FA642C@sarai.net> Dear all, Can I please request everyone concerned not to shoot off one word, or one sentence mails. Please hit send only if you think you have a substantial contribution to make to the discussion and not to score points like in a Televised sepctacle. Every post occupies bandwidth, and takes energy to download and read. And once again, please try and refrain from attacking each other personally. Thanks and regards Shuddha On 17-Aug-08, at 9:48 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > I agree. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: Aditya Raj Kaul ; sarai list list at sarai.net> > Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 9:13:03 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > > It is not the obsession with but 'extremism of religion and hatred' > that 'has to go if we aspire to survive at all'. > > You might want to be the hange you want to see... > > > > On 8/17/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: >> We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This >> has to go if we aspire to survive at all. >> Prabhakar >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Shivam Vij शिवम् >> To: Aditya Raj Kaul >> Cc: sarai list >> Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath >> >> This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the >> Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke >> violence between two communities, which this video almost does. >> >> It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed >> for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining >> ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see >> the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. >> >> Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare >> goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, >> the >> Kumbh mela? >> >> But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. >> >> best >> s >> >> >> On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 >>> >>> __._,_.___ >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >> >> >> -- >> Every story has two sides. >> You can't take both. >> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >> >> >> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or >> yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/ >> address >> > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:43:03 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:43:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath In-Reply-To: <667940.17780.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <667940.17780.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170913l408098ffn178e44980d626e47@mail.gmail.com> It is not the obsession with but 'extremism of religion and hatred' that 'has to go if we aspire to survive at all'. You might want to be the hange you want to see... On 8/17/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go if we aspire to survive at all. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > To: Aditya Raj Kaul > Cc: sarai list > Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > Kumbh mela? > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > best > s > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > __._,_.___ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > -- > Every story has two sides. > You can't take both. > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 17 21:43:53 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:43:53 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> :) On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper > > and you know what you will hear? > > > > "We are all terorrists here." > > > > > > > > > > best > > shivam > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > wrote: > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the only > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone hem > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if you > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the Pakistan > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons most > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements but > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > > > > > best > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less > dangerous > > > than > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa " > > > > > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous and > > > communal > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi movement in > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already > laboured > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this is a > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so far > with > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire azadi > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim concerns. > While > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the Kashmiri > > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If it > was > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the > majority > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation-state? > > > > > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you have > > > raised. > > > > > You > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley is > very > > > much > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against Muslim > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this conclusion > > > given > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying to > point > > > out > > > > > that > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and obviously > not > > > to > > > > > accuse > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of the > > > phrase, > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans used > during > > > the > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but I > really > > > > > don¹t > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure you > > > remember > > > > > 1989 > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar > argument > > > when > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > provocative > > > > > about > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a > thousand > > > strong > > > > > mob > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities as > they > > > did > > > > > in > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. CRPF > > > > > culpability: > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police becoming > the > > > main > > > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal conduct > > > against > > > > > their > > > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush > protests in > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > injured. > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > marchers > > > in > > > > > Uri > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station house > > > officer of > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz and > two > > > others > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it was a > > > target > > > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah and > > > torched > > > > > it. > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such incidents > have > > > > > been > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called for a > > > social > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of Srinagar's Raj > > > Bagh > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the > police > > > > > "whether > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This is in > > > stark > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were seen > as > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined militancy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 22:50:49 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 22:50:49 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> An interesting thing just happened. I'm returning from a NDTV debate (If i can take the liberty to call it one) on the current developments in J&K. The Panelists included a wide range of opinions from valley, Jammu and also from here in New Delhi; among them Abhishek Manu Singhvi, Swapan Das Gupta, Muzafar Baig, Sajad Lone, Ashok Khajuria, Omar Abdulalh and my friend Sonia Jabbar were the few voices. It was as expected a very heated debate and matters became worse when Sajad Lone challenged Jammu Samiti and Kashmiri Pandits to claim their right on the Baltal Land. At almost the end of the show, BJP's voice from Jammu Ashok Khajuria rightly said, "Kashmiri Separatists and vested interests want to create a Nizam-e-Mustafa" in the valley. To which, the Kashmiri Muslims in the studio screamed, "Inshallah". Now, thats what speaks for their Secularism !!! An Islamic State.... On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you > know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow > rhetoric... > > On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > :) > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > > wrote: > > > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper > > > > and you know what you will hear? > > > > > > > > "We are all terorrists here." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > best > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > > > > > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the > only > > > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone > hem > > > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if > you > > > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the > Pakistan > > > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons > most > > > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > > > > > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements > but > > > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > > > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > > > > > > > > > best > > > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less > > > dangerous > > > > > than > > > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa > " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous > and > > > > > communal > > > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi > movement in > > > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already > > > laboured > > > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this > is a > > > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so > far > > > with > > > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire > azadi > > > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim > concerns. > > > While > > > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the > Kashmiri > > > > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If > it > > > was > > > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the > > > majority > > > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent > nation-state? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you > have > > > > > raised. > > > > > > > You > > > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley > is > > > very > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against > Muslim > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this > conclusion > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying > to > > > point > > > > > out > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and > obviously > > > not > > > > > to > > > > > > > accuse > > > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of > the > > > > > phrase, > > > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans > used > > > during > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but > I > > > really > > > > > > > don¹t > > > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure > you > > > > > remember > > > > > > > 1989 > > > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar > > > argument > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > > > provocative > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a > > > thousand > > > > > strong > > > > > > > mob > > > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities > as > > > they > > > > > did > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. > CRPF > > > > > > > culpability: > > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police > becoming > > > the > > > > > main > > > > > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal > conduct > > > > > against > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush > > > protests in > > > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > > > injured. > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > > > marchers > > > > > in > > > > > > > Uri > > > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station > house > > > > > officer of > > > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz > and > > > two > > > > > others > > > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it > was a > > > > > target > > > > > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah > and > > > > > torched > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such > incidents > > > have > > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called > for a > > > > > social > > > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of > Srinagar's Raj > > > > > Bagh > > > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the > > > police > > > > > > > "whether > > > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This > is in > > > > > stark > > > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were > seen > > > as > > > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined > militancy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chauhan.vijender at gmail.com Sun Aug 17 23:10:02 2008 From: chauhan.vijender at gmail.com (Vijender chauhan) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 23:10:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 59 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8bdde4540808171040i4dab85fvea618402d73c561e@mail.gmail.com> I agree with Shivam that video is definitely provocative to say the least, but that is most expected after the recent theatre in valley. I believe that ones who occupied secular space played dangerously and gave enough ground to these waiting fellow. I find this post by Abhay worth reading in this context. http://nirmal-anand.blogspot.com/2008/08/blog-post_16.html Vijender On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 10:03 PM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Gun Salutes for August 15 > ( Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् ) > 2. Re: Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath (Prabhakar Singh) > 3. Re: Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) > 4. Re: Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > ( Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् ) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > To: "Pawan Durani" > Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:45:39 +0530 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 > You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you > know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow > rhetoric... > > On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > :) > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com> > > > wrote: > > > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper > > > > and you know what you will hear? > > > > > > > > "We are all terorrists here." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > best > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > > > > > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the > only > > > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone > hem > > > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if > you > > > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the > Pakistan > > > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons > most > > > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > > > > > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements > but > > > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not > > > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > > > > > > > > > best > > > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less > > > dangerous > > > > > than > > > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa > " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous > and > > > > > communal > > > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi > movement in > > > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already > > > laboured > > > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this > is a > > > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so > far > > > with > > > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire > azadi > > > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim > concerns. > > > While > > > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the > Kashmiri > > > > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If > it > > > was > > > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the > > > majority > > > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent > nation-state? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you > have > > > > > raised. > > > > > > > You > > > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley > is > > > very > > > > > much > > > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against > Muslim > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this > conclusion > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying > to > > > point > > > > > out > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and > obviously > > > not > > > > > to > > > > > > > accuse > > > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of > the > > > > > phrase, > > > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans > used > > > during > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but > I > > > really > > > > > > > don¹t > > > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure > you > > > > > remember > > > > > > > 1989 > > > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar > > > argument > > > > > when > > > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > > > provocative > > > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a > > > thousand > > > > > strong > > > > > > > mob > > > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities > as > > > they > > > > > did > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. > CRPF > > > > > > > culpability: > > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police > becoming > > > the > > > > > main > > > > > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal > conduct > > > > > against > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush > > > protests in > > > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > > > injured. > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > > > marchers > > > > > in > > > > > > > Uri > > > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station > house > > > > > officer of > > > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz > and > > > two > > > > > others > > > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it > was a > > > > > target > > > > > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah > and > > > > > torched > > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such > incidents > > > have > > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called > for a > > > > > social > > > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of > Srinagar's Raj > > > > > Bagh > > > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the > > > police > > > > > > > "whether > > > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This > is in > > > > > stark > > > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were > seen > > > as > > > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined > militancy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Prabhakar Singh > To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 09:18:31 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > I agree. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: Aditya Raj Kaul ; sarai list < > reader-list at sarai.net> > Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 9:13:03 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > > It is not the obsession with but 'extremism of religion and hatred' > that 'has to go if we aspire to survive at all'. > > You might want to be the hange you want to see... > > > > On 8/17/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go > if we aspire to survive at all. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul > > Cc: sarai list > > Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > > > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > > Kumbh mela? > > > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > > > best > > s > > > > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > -- > > Every story has two sides. > > You can't take both. > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > To: Pawan Durani > Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:55:55 +0530 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > Dear all, > > Can I please request everyone concerned not to shoot off one word, or one > sentence mails. Please hit send only if you think you have a substantial > contribution to make to the discussion and not to score points like in a > Televised sepctacle. Every post occupies bandwidth, and takes energy to > download and read. > > And once again, please try and refrain from attacking each other > personally. > > Thanks and regards > > Shuddha > > On 17-Aug-08, at 9:48 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > I agree. >> Prabhakar >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Shivam Vij शिवम् >> To: Prabhakar Singh >> Cc: Aditya Raj Kaul ; sarai list > list at sarai.net> >> Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 9:13:03 AM >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath >> >> It is not the obsession with but 'extremism of religion and hatred' >> that 'has to go if we aspire to survive at all'. >> >> You might want to be the hange you want to see... >> >> >> >> On 8/17/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: >> >>> We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go >>> if we aspire to survive at all. >>> Prabhakar >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ---- >>> From: Shivam Vij शिवम् >>> To: Aditya Raj Kaul >>> Cc: sarai list >>> Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM >>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath >>> >>> This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the >>> Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke >>> violence between two communities, which this video almost does. >>> >>> It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed >>> for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining >>> ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see >>> the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. >>> >>> Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare >>> goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the >>> Kumbh mela? >>> >>> But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. >>> >>> best >>> s >>> >>> >>> On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: >>> >>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 >>>> >>>> __._,_.___ >>>> _________________________________________ >>>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>>> Critiques & Collaborations >>>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>>> subscribe in the subject header. >>>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>>> List archive: >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Every story has two sides. >>> You can't take both. >>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >>> >>> >>> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. >>> Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >>> >>> >> >> -- >> >> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> >> >> >> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. >> Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > To: "Prabhakar Singh" > Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:43:03 +0530 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > It is not the obsession with but 'extremism of religion and hatred' > that 'has to go if we aspire to survive at all'. > > You might want to be the hange you want to see... > > > > On 8/17/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > We are over-obsessed with extremism of religion and hatred.This has to go > if we aspire to survive at all. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul > > Cc: sarai list > > Sent: Sunday, 17 August, 2008 8:46:06 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Secular Haj Vs Communal Amarnath > > > > This is ridiculous, and worse, communally provocative. Under the > > Indian Constitution, free speech does not include the right t provoke > > violence between two communities, which this video almost does. > > > > It is ridiculous to compare Haj with Amarnath because Haj has existed > > for centuries whereas Amarnath yatra as an obsession has been gaining > > ground only since the late nineties - which is why many kashmiris see > > the brouhaha over Amarnath as a provocation. > > > > Scrap the Haj subsidy, i say, and scrap it now. but why not compare > > goverment spending and facilities on the Haj pilgrimage with, say, the > > Kumbh mela? > > > > But that wouldn't help spread lies, hatred, violence. > > > > best > > s > > > > > > On 8/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfN-rUlM8U8 > > > > > > __._,_.___ > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > -- > > Every story has two sides. > > You can't take both. > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > From shuddha at sarai.net Sun Aug 17 23:44:41 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 23:44:41 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <06C490A2-AACF-4AEB-B702-10D65E9A6AE7@sarai.net> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, I watched the debate, and it was carried live, and I did not hear anyone saying Inshallah, Surely if they had 'screamed' Inshallah, given that every other shouting voice was heard, we would have heard it. Since there were several Kashmiri muslims in the studio this evening, some of whom had lapel mikes, if they had all (or even several of them) screamed 'Inshallah.' surely, we would have heard. For instance, there was a young man, identified as Kashmiri muslim, who was sitting right next to you. I did not hear him say Inshallah, I did not hear Sajjad Lone, or Muzaffar Beig, say Inshallah. What I did hear was Mr. Khajuria saying that he would lead marchers towards Baltal, (now, after the pilgrimage period is over, so he would not be leading a party of pilgrims), which I surely consider provocative, and a deliberate raising of the pitch of tension. I do hope that no Kashmiri is misled by this provocation to try and confront this 'proposed' march. As that is the deliberate intention. It would be terrible if the peaceful nature of the protests in Kashmir were to be destroyed by provocative statements from a BJP politician. It should be ignored. We also heard (at the tail end of the programme) a man who had been a yatri, who has done seva at the Amarnath shrine, saying that he has had no problems. If Kashmiri muslims are (all, without exception) as communal as you seem to suggest, then surely, he would have faced some problems. We also heard a young Kashmiri pandit who lives in Srinagar, studies in Kashmir university, who expressed sentiments that did not align with yours, so clearly, neither Kashmiri Muslims, nor Kashmiri Pandits, speak in a set of binary voices without any internal variation. Incidentally, your contribution, though brief ( I sincerely hope it was not edited away, and it did not seem to be, as it was a live programme) had nothing of consequence to offer by way of a way forward, all you could speak of was the fact that Amarnath is the 'last Hindu structure in Kashmir' which is factually incorrect. The kheer bhawani temple ,and several others, continue to be active, and actually have been having pilgrims and worshippers coming to them. I think you should reflect on the fact that you went out on a major news channel, live and said something factually incorrect. I am willing to think that you might have said this in the heat of the moment, without thought or pause, but do consider the fact that it does go out as a significant distortion of the truth. regards Shuddha On 17-Aug-08, at 10:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > An interesting thing just happened. > > I'm returning from a NDTV debate (If i can take the liberty to call > it one) > on the current developments in J&K. The Panelists included a wide > range of > opinions from valley, Jammu and also from here in New Delhi; among > them > Abhishek Manu Singhvi, Swapan Das Gupta, Muzafar Baig, Sajad Lone, > Ashok > Khajuria, Omar Abdulalh and my friend Sonia Jabbar were the few > voices. > > It was as expected a very heated debate and matters became worse > when Sajad > Lone challenged Jammu Samiti and Kashmiri Pandits to claim their > right on > the Baltal Land. > > At almost the end of the show, BJP's voice from Jammu Ashok > Khajuria rightly > said, "Kashmiri Separatists and vested interests want to create a > Nizam-e-Mustafa" in the valley. To which, the Kashmiri Muslims in > the studio > screamed, "Inshallah". > > Now, thats what speaks for their Secularism !!! An Islamic State.... > > > On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: >> >> You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you >> know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow >> rhetoric... >> >> On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >> wrote: >>> :) >>> >>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>>> Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् >>>> विज् < >> mail at shivamvij.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>> Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a >>>>> shopkeeper >>>>> and you know what you will hear? >>>>> >>>>> "We are all terorrists here." >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> best >>>>> shivam >>>>> >>>>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>>>>> Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij >>>>>> शिवम् विज् >>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the >> only >>>>>>> leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone >> hem >>>>>>> down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. >>>>>>> And if >> you >>>>>>> talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the >> Pakistan >>>>>>> bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons >> most >>>>>>> Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal >>>>>>> elements >> but >>>>>>> to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am >>>>>>> not >>>>>>> getting into the chap act of body counts... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> best >>>>>>> shivam >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>>>>>>> Shivam, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less >>>> dangerous >>>>>> than >>>>>>>> an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa >> " >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous >> and >>>>>> communal >>>>>>>> movement which has effected even the world super powers. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For more info log on www.ikashmir.net >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Pawan >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij >>>>>>>> शिवम् विज् >>>>>> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Dear Sonia, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This is not the first time you are equating the azadi >> movement in >>>>>>>>> Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already >>>> laboured >>>>>>>>> over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this >> is a >>>>>>>>> dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so >> far >>>> with >>>>>>>>> it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire >> azadi >>>>>>>>> sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim >> concerns. >>>> While >>>>>>>>> I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the >> Kashmiri >>>>>>>>> Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If >> it >>>> was >>>>>>>>> about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the >>>> majority >>>>>>>>> demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent >> nation-state? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Warmly, >>>>>>>>> Shivam >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi Shuddha, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you >> have >>>>>> raised. >>>>>>>> You >>>>>>>>>> may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley >> is >>>> very >>>>>> much >>>>>>>>>> about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against >> Muslim >>>>>> Kashmir >>>>>>>>>> than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this >> conclusion >>>>>> given >>>>>>>>>> India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying >> to >>>> point >>>>>> out >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and >> obviously >>>> not >>>>>> to >>>>>>>> accuse >>>>>>>>>> you of communal thinking. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of >> the >>>>>> phrase, >>>>>>>>>> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans >> used >>>> during >>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but >> I >>>> really >>>>>>>> don¹t >>>>>>>>>> want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure >> you >>>>>> remember >>>>>>>> 1989 >>>>>>>>>> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar >>>> argument >>>>>> when >>>>>>>>>> challenged. He said something like, what is communal or >>>> provocative >>>>>>>> about >>>>>>>>>> taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a >>>> thousand >>>>>> strong >>>>>>>> mob >>>>>>>>>> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities >> as >>>> they >>>>>> did >>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. >> CRPF >>>>>>>> culpability: >>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police >> becoming >>>> the >>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>> target of protesters. >>>>>>>>>> There have also been calls for their social boycott. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The local population is angry for the police's "brutal >> conduct >>>>>> against >>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>> own people". >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush >>>> protests in >>>>>>>> Kashmir >>>>>>>>>> over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 >>>> injured. >>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" >>>> marchers >>>>>> in >>>>>>>> Uri >>>>>>>>>> on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station >> house >>>>>> officer of >>>>>>>>>> Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz >> and >>>> two >>>>>> others >>>>>>>>>> were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it >> was a >>>>>> target >>>>>>>>>> killing". >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah >> and >>>>>> torched >>>>>>>> it. >>>>>>>>>> They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such >> incidents >>>> have >>>>>>>> been >>>>>>>>>> reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called >> for a >>>>>> social >>>>>>>>>> boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of >> Srinagar's Raj >>>>>> Bagh >>>>>>>>>> locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the >>>> police >>>>>>>> "whether >>>>>>>>>> they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This >> is in >>>>>> stark >>>>>>>>>> contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were >> seen >>>> as >>>>>>>>>> "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined >> militancy. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> >> >> >> -- >> >> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From indersalim at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 00:12:21 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 00:12:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <9c06aab30808170833u58c8c142r73396c096d888712@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808171142p3176eec1xd7d732f13471fcb7@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shuddha, thanks for this long inspiring mail which eluciated upon Inder Salim sound and its intrepretation. your reflections are always scholarly and full of thought. i am likely to preseve this piece in my archives. good wishes to you. Dear Aditya Raj kaul On Edgware Road in London there is two big shops called Al Mustafa. All they sell is, Hukkas, beautiful Quranic verses in a decorative motifs and other kitchy items for drawing rooms. I asked the beautiful lady at the counter, how much is this item ( which had Allah written on it ) she said £5, and what about that ( which had Muhammad in it ) she replied £5. and i said if i will buy both of the them then how much it will cost me, she instantly replied £ 9 pounds; and you know, even a strong believer from valley who prays five times a days wont spend £ 9 for a 2 inch glassy items, let alone this 'confused ' man. that is how slogan Nizam-e-Mustafa also works in the valley. Once you go into real business, then it is entirely differnet. But if you go into the rehetoric then some Hindus also talk about R the valley.how much they drank it on the spont. i was eye witness to that. So dont worry about any Nizam-e-Mustafa. It does not exist in Pakisan either, it will not be there in the New Free Kashmir. am Rajya, and you know well how Narender Modi implemented it. and i remember when Jamat-e-Islami looted liquour shop in let lord Shiva bless you love is On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 10:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > An interesting thing just happened. > > I'm returning from a NDTV debate (If i can take the liberty to call it one) > on the current developments in J&K. The Panelists included a wide range of > opinions from valley, Jammu and also from here in New Delhi; among them > Abhishek Manu Singhvi, Swapan Das Gupta, Muzafar Baig, Sajad Lone, Ashok > Khajuria, Omar Abdulalh and my friend Sonia Jabbar were the few voices. > > It was as expected a very heated debate and matters became worse when Sajad > Lone challenged Jammu Samiti and Kashmiri Pandits to claim their right on > the Baltal Land. > > At almost the end of the show, BJP's voice from Jammu Ashok Khajuria rightly > said, "Kashmiri Separatists and vested interests want to create a > Nizam-e-Mustafa" in the valley. To which, the Kashmiri Muslims in the studio > screamed, "Inshallah". > > Now, thats what speaks for their Secularism !!! An Islamic State.... > > > On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >> >> You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you >> know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow >> rhetoric... >> >> On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >> > :) >> > >> > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >> > > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change >> > > >> > > >> > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < >> mail at shivamvij.com> >> > > wrote: >> > > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper >> > > > and you know what you will hear? >> > > > >> > > > "We are all terorrists here." >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > best >> > > > shivam >> > > > >> > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >> > > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >> > > >> > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the >> only >> > > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone >> hem >> > > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if >> you >> > > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the >> Pakistan >> > > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons >> most >> > > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. >> > > > > > >> > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? >> > > > > > >> > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements >> but >> > > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not >> > > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... >> > > > > > >> > > > > > best >> > > > > > shivam >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >> > > > > > > Shivam, >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less >> > > dangerous >> > > > > than >> > > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa >> " >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous >> and >> > > > > communal >> > > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Pawan >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >> > > > > >> > > > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > > > Dear Sonia, >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi >> movement in >> > > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already >> > > laboured >> > > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this >> is a >> > > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so >> far >> > > with >> > > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire >> azadi >> > > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim >> concerns. >> > > While >> > > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the >> Kashmiri >> > > > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If >> it >> > > was >> > > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the >> > > majority >> > > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent >> nation-state? >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Warmly, >> > > > > > > > Shivam >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >> > > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you >> have >> > > > > raised. >> > > > > > > You >> > > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley >> is >> > > very >> > > > > much >> > > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against >> Muslim >> > > > > Kashmir >> > > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this >> conclusion >> > > > > given >> > > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying >> to >> > > point >> > > > > out >> > > > > > > that >> > > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and >> obviously >> > > not >> > > > > to >> > > > > > > accuse >> > > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of >> the >> > > > > phrase, >> > > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans >> used >> > > during >> > > > > the >> > > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but >> I >> > > really >> > > > > > > don¹t >> > > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure >> you >> > > > > remember >> > > > > > > 1989 >> > > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar >> > > argument >> > > > > when >> > > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or >> > > provocative >> > > > > > > about >> > > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a >> > > thousand >> > > > > strong >> > > > > > > mob >> > > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities >> as >> > > they >> > > > > did >> > > > > > > in >> > > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. >> CRPF >> > > > > > > culpability: >> > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- >> > > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police >> becoming >> > > the >> > > > > main >> > > > > > > > > target of protesters. >> > > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal >> conduct >> > > > > against >> > > > > > > their >> > > > > > > > > own people". >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush >> > > protests in >> > > > > > > Kashmir >> > > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 >> > > injured. >> > > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" >> > > marchers >> > > > > in >> > > > > > > Uri >> > > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station >> house >> > > > > officer of >> > > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz >> and >> > > two >> > > > > others >> > > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it >> was a >> > > > > target >> > > > > > > > > killing". >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah >> and >> > > > > torched >> > > > > > > it. >> > > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such >> incidents >> > > have >> > > > > > > been >> > > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called >> for a >> > > > > social >> > > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of >> Srinagar's Raj >> > > > > Bagh >> > > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the >> > > police >> > > > > > > "whether >> > > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This >> is in >> > > > > stark >> > > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were >> seen >> > > as >> > > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined >> militancy. >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > -- >> > > > > > >> > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > -- >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> > >> >> >> -- >> >> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From indersalim at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 00:23:02 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 00:23:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808171142p3176eec1xd7d732f13471fcb7@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808171142p3176eec1xd7d732f13471fcb7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808171153j3d5765eeh42f7a5df526d8955@mail.gmail.com> Dear Aditya Raj Kaul > > On Edgware Road in London there is two big shops called Al Mustafa. > All they sell is, Hukkas, beautiful Quranic verses in a decorative > motifs and other kitchy items for drawing rooms. I asked the > beautiful lady at the counter, how much is this item ( which had Allah > written on it ) she said £5, and what about that ( which had Muhammad > in it ) she replied £5. and i said if i will buy both of the them > then how much it will cost me, she instantly replied £ 9 pounds; and > you know, even a strong believer from valley who prays five times a > days wont spend £ 9 for a 2 inch glassy items, let alone this > 'confused ' man. > > that is how slogan Nizam-e-Mustafa also works in the valley. Once you > go into real business, then it is entirely differnet. But if you go > into the rehetoric then some Hindus also talk about Ram Raj, and you know how Narender Modi implemented it and i rememvber, when Jamat-i-Islami looted liquour shops in the valley how much they drank it on the spot. I was eye witness to that in lal Chowk of Anantnag. . So dont > worry about any Nizam-e-Mustafa. It does not exist in Pakisan either, > it will not be there in the New Free Kashmir. > > May lord Shiva bless you > love > is > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 10:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: >> An interesting thing just happened. >> >> I'm returning from a NDTV debate (If i can take the liberty to call it one) >> on the current developments in J&K. The Panelists included a wide range of >> opinions from valley, Jammu and also from here in New Delhi; among them >> Abhishek Manu Singhvi, Swapan Das Gupta, Muzafar Baig, Sajad Lone, Ashok >> Khajuria, Omar Abdulalh and my friend Sonia Jabbar were the few voices. >> >> It was as expected a very heated debate and matters became worse when Sajad >> Lone challenged Jammu Samiti and Kashmiri Pandits to claim their right on >> the Baltal Land. >> >> At almost the end of the show, BJP's voice from Jammu Ashok Khajuria rightly >> said, "Kashmiri Separatists and vested interests want to create a >> Nizam-e-Mustafa" in the valley. To which, the Kashmiri Muslims in the studio >> screamed, "Inshallah". >> >> Now, thats what speaks for their Secularism !!! An Islamic State.... >> >> >> On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >>> >>> You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you >>> know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow >>> rhetoric... >>> >>> On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >>> > :) >>> > >>> > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>> > > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < >>> mail at shivamvij.com> >>> > > wrote: >>> > > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper >>> > > > and you know what you will hear? >>> > > > >>> > > > "We are all terorrists here." >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > best >>> > > > shivam >>> > > > >>> > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>> > > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >>> > > >>> > > > > wrote: >>> > > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the >>> only >>> > > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone >>> hem >>> > > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. And if >>> you >>> > > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the >>> Pakistan >>> > > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons >>> most >>> > > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal elements >>> but >>> > > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am not >>> > > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > best >>> > > > > > shivam >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>> > > > > > > Shivam, >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less >>> > > dangerous >>> > > > > than >>> > > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa >>> " >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous >>> and >>> > > > > communal >>> > > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Pawan >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >>> > > > > >>> > > > > > > wrote: >>> > > > > > > > Dear Sonia, >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi >>> movement in >>> > > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already >>> > > laboured >>> > > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this >>> is a >>> > > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so >>> far >>> > > with >>> > > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire >>> azadi >>> > > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim >>> concerns. >>> > > While >>> > > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the >>> Kashmiri >>> > > > > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If >>> it >>> > > was >>> > > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the >>> > > majority >>> > > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent >>> nation-state? >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > Warmly, >>> > > > > > > > Shivam >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >>> > > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you >>> have >>> > > > > raised. >>> > > > > > > You >>> > > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley >>> is >>> > > very >>> > > > > much >>> > > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against >>> Muslim >>> > > > > Kashmir >>> > > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this >>> conclusion >>> > > > > given >>> > > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying >>> to >>> > > point >>> > > > > out >>> > > > > > > that >>> > > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and >>> obviously >>> > > not >>> > > > > to >>> > > > > > > accuse >>> > > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of >>> the >>> > > > > phrase, >>> > > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans >>> used >>> > > during >>> > > > > the >>> > > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but >>> I >>> > > really >>> > > > > > > don¹t >>> > > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure >>> you >>> > > > > remember >>> > > > > > > 1989 >>> > > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar >>> > > argument >>> > > > > when >>> > > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or >>> > > provocative >>> > > > > > > about >>> > > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a >>> > > thousand >>> > > > > strong >>> > > > > > > mob >>> > > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities >>> as >>> > > they >>> > > > > did >>> > > > > > > in >>> > > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. >>> CRPF >>> > > > > > > culpability: >>> > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- >>> > > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police >>> becoming >>> > > the >>> > > > > main >>> > > > > > > > > target of protesters. >>> > > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal >>> conduct >>> > > > > against >>> > > > > > > their >>> > > > > > > > > own people". >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush >>> > > protests in >>> > > > > > > Kashmir >>> > > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 >>> > > injured. >>> > > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" >>> > > marchers >>> > > > > in >>> > > > > > > Uri >>> > > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station >>> house >>> > > > > officer of >>> > > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz >>> and >>> > > two >>> > > > > others >>> > > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it >>> was a >>> > > > > target >>> > > > > > > > > killing". >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah >>> and >>> > > > > torched >>> > > > > > > it. >>> > > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such >>> incidents >>> > > have >>> > > > > > > been >>> > > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called >>> for a >>> > > > > social >>> > > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of >>> Srinagar's Raj >>> > > > > Bagh >>> > > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the >>> > > police >>> > > > > > > "whether >>> > > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This >>> is in >>> > > > > stark >>> > > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were >>> seen >>> > > as >>> > > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined >>> militancy. >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > -- >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > -- >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> > > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > >>> > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> > >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From indersalim at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 00:57:18 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 00:57:18 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Rethinking Kashmir Politics In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808170855t2b2b94cfn71256eef728c0cbd@mail.gmail.com> References: <397552.50818.qm@web65516.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808170855t2b2b94cfn71256eef728c0cbd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808171227t5921fe8eh17aa38a7ba8d607e@mail.gmail.com> A very important point with regard to the future of kashmir. Religion is one way looking at it, but I will being with language : I think of Khalistan movement, which had a huge Hindu Sikh mix, and how unralisitic would have been to carve out a sikh state out of that mix. Fortunately that did not happen. Times proved that that was proveked by Sang parivar when they launched Hindi Version of punjab kesari , and next it was the same Congress party who played the dirty game of politics and are therefore, responsible for the thounsand of killings in punjab. But i think common language between the two played a great role in brining the two togeather. In J&K the situation is entirely different. Urdu is the main link language, but no one is really a original urdu speaker in J&K . I know Geelani sahib always brushes aside the imperative of kashmiri language as the basic sound of kashmiris, but he is an old man. After all this urdu thing did not work in Bangla desh even, i guess it does not work in Pakistan's punjab even let alone Karachi. Urdu is certainly a love child between two civilazation, which should not have been used for politics. but.... Lot of non-kashmiri muslims speak kashmiri in J&K but the valley-kashmiri certainly dominates. Even kashmiri in Srinagar is seen as superior form of the kashmiri anguage in comparison to Anathnag's kashmiri. Kupwara and Uri is really backward in that sense. I dont know many kashmiri speaking families are living in Muzaffarabad. so far Kashmiri politics has also worked its plans on these lines . So, Jammu which has not a single kashmiri speaking individual, if you exclude the recent Pandit settelments in the city, and geographically too it looks quite different, so it can not be part of a free J&K. Rajouri and Poonch too dont speak kashmiri language, so they too dont fit the united J&K. Buddhist Leh and Shia Kargil are already not a part of kashmir movment. So it is the valley and its nearby hilly areas which can be part of the independant kashmir, if kashmir chooses not to merge with pakistan. Hurriyat leaders know all this complexity, and that is why they cant talk about the division of state on the lines of religion. But the fact is that kashmir needs some more self confidence to declare that they want fFreedom without the non-kashmiri speaking people. the situation in that sense is quite complex. i would like to hear more from others on the list, love is On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:25 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Rethinking Kashmir Politics > > Yoginder Sikand > > Many Kashmiri Muslims vociferously insist that the demand for > independence of Kashmir has nothing to do with religion. Instead, they > argue, that the conflict in and over of Kashmir is essentially > 'political'. What is conveniently ignored by those who make this claim > is that religion and politics, particularly in the case of the Kashmir > dispute, involving as it does the rival claims of Muslim-majority > Pakistan and Hindu-dominated India, can hardly be separated. > > As the current spate of violence in both the Hindi-dominated Jammu > division and the Muslim-majority Kashmir Valley, triggered off by a > controversial decision of the state government to allot a piece of > land to a Hindu temple trust, so starkly indicates, religion and > communal identities defined essentially in religious terms have > everything to do with the basic issue of Jammu and Kashmir and its > still unsettled political status. Kashmiri nationalists, in contrast > to hardcore Islamists and the Hindutva brigade, quickly dismiss this > point, finding it, perhaps, too embarrassing, afraid of being labeled > as religious chauvinists or 'communal'. But, no longer, it seems, can > the crucial role of religion in shaping the contours of the on-going > conflict in and over Kashmir be denied. > > That the on-going BJP-inspired agitation in Jammu has marshaled > considerable support among the Hindus of Jammu clearly indicates that > the political project of Kashmiri nationalists—of a separate, > independent state of Jammu and Kashmir—has absolutely no takers among > the Hindus (and other non-Muslims) of the state. Kashmiri nationalists > insist that in the independent Jammu and Kashmir of their dreams, > religious minorities—Hindus, Sikhs and Buddhists—who would account for > almost a fourth of the population, would have equal rights and no > cause for complaint. Some even boast, without adducing any evidence, > of commanding the support of the non-Muslims of the state for their > project. At the same time as they roundly berate the Dogra Raj as a > long spell of slavery for the state's Muslims, they insist that the > boundaries of the state of Jammu and Kashmir, as constructed by the > same Dogras, against the will of the Kashmiri Muslims, be considered > as > sacrosanct, as setting the borders of the independent country that > they demand. If, as they argue, Dogra Raj was illegitimate, then > surely there is nothing holy about the state boundaries as laid down > by the Dogras, bringing Jammu and the vastly different Kashmir Valley > in a forced union. If, as they rightly insist, Kashmir was conquered > against its will by the Dogras of Jammu, there is no reason why the > forced union of the two should continue in the independent Jammu and > Kashmir that the Kashmiri nationalists dream of, particularly given > the Jammu Hindus' resentment of alleged Kashmiri hegemony, a sentiment > shared even by many Jammu Muslims. > > Kashmiri nationalists, however, would refuse to recognize this basic > contradiction in their argument. The reason is obvious: To do so, to > recognize that the Jammu's Hindus (and Leh's Buddhists) would resist, > even to the point of violence, the agenda of an independent Jammu and > Kashmir would clearly indicate the obvious, but embarrassing fact, > that this agenda represents the aspirations and interests largely of > Kashmiri Muslims, and is a means to legitimize Kashmir Muslim control > over the rest of the state. > > The analogy with pre-Partition India is useful. The Muslim League > insisted that because the Hindus of India were in a numerical > majority, a united, independent India, no matter what safeguards it > gave and promises of equality it made to the Muslims, would be > dominated by the Hindus, and would, for all its secular and democratic > claims, be untrammeled Hindu Raj. Hence their demand for a separate > Pakistan. The Hindus of Jammu and the Buddhists of Leh find themselves > in precisely the same position as did supporters of the Muslim League > in pre-Partition India, only now the actors have reversed their roles. > Kashmiri nationalists insist they want an independent, united Jammu > and Kashmir, just as the Congress did when it talked of a united and > free India. And, like the Congress did with the Muslims, they promise > the non-Muslim minorities of Jammu and Leh that their rights would be > fully protected in this state of their dreams. Yet, just as many > Muslims refused > to accept the promises of the Congress, fearing that they would never > be honored, the non-Muslim minorities in Jammu and Kashmir refuse to > buy the arguments of the Kashmiri nationalists, which they rightly see > as a thinly-veiled guise to justify Kashmiri hegemony. > > I have heard Kashmiris, including some of my closest friends, come up > with the most ingenious arguments to counter the above point. > 'Kashmiriyat, the teachings of love and peace of our Sufis, unite us > all and would ensure that non-Muslim minorities will be safe and > protected in a free Jammu and Kashmir', some of them say. A laughable > claim, unless all Kashmiris suddenly decide to shun the world and trod > the mystical path, an unlikely prospect. Sufism is in a rapid state of > decline in Kashmir and elsewhere, as is the case with all other forms > of mysticism. > > Then there is another bizarre argument, which I heard, among others, > from none less than Syed Ali Gilani, chief Islamist ideologue in > Kashmir, and a fervent backer of Kashmir's accession to Pakistan, > which runs like this: Islam lays down the rights of non-Muslims and > insists that Muslims should respect them. The Prophet Muhammad himself > did so. So, if Jammu and Kashmir gets freedom and becomes a truly > Islamic state, the non-Muslim minorities will have full freedom and > equality. The late Sadullah Tantrey, once head of the Jammu branch of > the Jamaat-e Islami, even went on to insist, in all seriousness, that > 'Indeed so happy will the non-Muslims of Jammu and Kashmir be in this > independent Islamic state that even Hindus from India would line up to > settle in the state.' I squirmed in my seat as he went on, stunned at > his evident ignorance or hypocrisy or, as seemed more likely, both. I > itched to tell him, as I sat before him in his house in Gath, up in > the mountains of Doda, that the 'Islamic state' hardly outlived the > Prophet Muhammad and has been completely extinct ever since; that the > fate of minorities in scores of Muslim countries, even those like > Saudi Arabia that claim to be 'Islamic', was deplorable, that even > Jinnah had promised full equality to the non-Muslim citizens of > Paksitan but that had not prevented them from being reduced to virtual > second-class citizens, and that, simply put, he was lying or else > living in a fool's paradise. I kept my mouth shut, however. After all, > I was there to learn what his views were, not to convert him. > > Clearly, any forced union of the disparate nationalities in Jammu and > Kashmir in the form of a separate, independent state that Kashmiri > nationalists champion (as now do even some Kashmiri Islamists, former > passionate advocates for union with Pakistan, who, flowing with the > tide, have realized that their earlier stance has increasingly few > takers among Kashmiris, given their mounting disenchantment with > Pakistan) would be a sure recipe for civil war. The current agitation > in Jammu is ample evidence of that. It is time, therefore, that > pro-'Azadi' Kashmiri leaders admit this publicly. > > This is not, however, to plead the case for the division of the state, > as the RSS has been advocating, for surely that would further harden > communal boundaries and rivalries in just the same way as would the > project of an independent Jammu and Kashmir. Rather, it is to > recognize and publicly acknowledge the very plural character of Jammu > and Kashmir, and the concerns and sensitivities of all its peoples, > Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and others. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 06:58:08 2008 From: shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com (Shambhu Rahmat) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 07:28:08 +0600 Subject: [Reader-list] Tariq Ali on Musharraf's Exit Message-ID: Musharraf will be gone in days The Pakistani president is likely to quit soon. But don't expect democracy to rush in: the military's habits die hard Tariq Ali Guardian Thursday August 14 2008 http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/aug/14/pakistan.usa There is never a dull moment in Pakistan. As the country moved from a moth-eaten dictatorship to a moth-eaten democracy the celebrations were muted. Many citizens wondered whether the change represented a forward movement. Five months later, the moral climate has deteriorated still further. All the ideals embraced by the hopeful youth and the poor of the country – political morality, legality, civic virtue, food subsidies, freedom and equality of opportunity – once again lie at their feet, broken and scattered. The widower Bhutto and his men are extremely unpopular. The worm-eaten tongues of chameleon politicians and resurrected civil servants are on daily display. Removing Musharraf, who is even more unpopular, might win the politicians badly-needed popular support, but not for long. As the country celebrated its 61st birthday today, its official president, ex-General Pervez Musharraf, was not allowed to take the salute at the official parade marking the event, while state television discussed plans to impeach him. Within a few days at most, Musharraf will resign and leave the country. Pakistan's venal politicians decided to move against him after the army chief, Ashfaq Kayani, let it be known that there would be no military action to defend his former boss. Washington followed suit. In Kayani they have a professional and loyal military leader, who they imagine will do their bidding. Earlier John Negroponte had wanted to retain Musharraf as long as Bush was in office, but they decided to let him go. Anne Patterson, the US ambassador, and a few British diplomats working under her, tried to negotiate a deal on behalf of Musharraf, but the politicians were no longer prepared to play ball. They insisted that he must leave the country. Sanctuaries in Manhattan, Texas and the Turkish island of Büyükada are being actively considered. The general would prefer a large estate in Pakistan, preferably near a golf course, but security considerations alone would make that unfeasible. There were three attempts on his life when he was in power and protecting him after he goes would require an expensive security presence. Had Musharraf departed peacefully when his constitutional term expired in November 2007 he would have won some respect. Instead he imposed a state of emergency and sacked the chief justice of the supreme court who was hearing a petition challenging Musharraf's position. Now he is going in disgrace, abandoned by most of his cronies who accumulated land and money during his term and are now moving towards the new powerbrokers. Amidst the hullabaloo there was one hugely diverting moment involving pots and kettles. Two days ago, Asif Zardari, the caretaker-leader of the People's party who runs the government and is the second richest man in the country (from funds he accrued when his late wife was prime minister) accused Musharraf of corruption and siphoning US funds to private bank accounts. Musharraf's departure will highlight the problems that confront the country, which is in the grip of a food and power crisis that is creating severe problems in every city. Inflation is out of control. The price of gas (used for cooking in many homes) has risen by 30%. Wheat, the staple diet of most people, has seen a 20% price hike since November 2007 and while the UN's Food and Agriculture Organisation admits that the world's food stocks are at record lows there is an additional problem in Pakistan. Too much wheat is being smuggled into Afghanistan to serve the needs of the Nato armies. The poor are the worst hit, but middle-class families are also affected and according to a June 2008 survey, 86% of Pakistanis find it increasingly difficult to afford flour on a daily basis, for which they blame their own new government. Other problems persist. The politicians remain divided on the restoration of the judges sacked by Musharraf. The chief justice, Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry, is the most respected person in the country. Zardari is reluctant to see him back at the head of the supreme court. A possible compromise might be to offer him the presidency. It would certainly unite the country for a short time. And there is the army. Last month, the country's powerless prime minister, Yousuf Gilani, went on a state visit to the US. On July 29 he was questioned by Richard Haass, president of Council on Foreign Relations: Haass: Let me ask the question a different way, then – (laughter) – beyond President Musharraf, which is whether you think now in the army there is a broader acceptance of a more limited role for the army. Do you think now the coming generation of army officers accepts the notion that their proper role is in the barracks rather than in politics? Gilani: Certainly, yes. Because of the February 18 election of this year, we have a mandate to the moderate forces, to the democratic forces in Pakistan. And the moderate forces and the democratic forces, they have formed the government. And therefore the people have voted against dictatorship and for democracy, and therefore, in future even the present of – the chief of the army staff is highly professional and is fully supporting the democracy. This is pure gibberish and convinces nobody. Over the last 50 years the US has worked mainly with the Pakistan army. This has been its preferred instrument. Nothing has changed. The question being asked now is how long it will be before the military is back at the helm. Tariq Ali's latest book, The Duel: Pakistan on the Flight Path of American Power will be published in September by Simon and Schuster From pawan.durani at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 10:37:27 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 10:37:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Mosque being constructed at Baltal Site Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808172207q3be269d4x7d28a76820cb90e@mail.gmail.com> http://dailyshadowonline.com/theshadow/artdet.aspx?q=877 Jammu, Aug 16: The controversy regarding the construction of concrete structures at Baltal by Shri Amarnath Shrine Board is all set to deepen further with the revelations that Muslim community of the area is constructing a huge Jamia Masjid exactly inside the camp site at Baltal prompting Hindus to ask whether only Hindu structures were a threat to ecology. In a press release Jammu and Kahsmir Peace Movement (JKPM) has expressed grave concern that while on the one hand Kashmiri Muslims say that construction of any kind at the place would be a biggest threat to ecology on the other hand they are in the process of constructing a huge Mosque exactly inside the Baltal Camp site where pilgrims stay. The place which has put the entire state on boil with twin regions burning for the past more than a month this new revelation is likely to add fuel to the already burning fire. The press note issued by Krishan Koul, Chairman of J&K Peace Movement has expressed his grave concern over the recent statements by some political forces of the state, adding that the construction of Jamia Masjid inside the camping site with the help of local contractor Shajan and his brother at Baltal was a ploy to create another controversy to damage the secular fabric of the state. Supporting his argument with recent photographs of the site Koul said that while interacting with the locals of the area one Mr. Bashir Ahmed told them that the construction of the Jamia Masjid would start once the yatra was over and lakhs of rupees have already been collected for the said construction. Koul has requested the administration to take strict note of this development to avoid another controversy which may lead to more problems for the administration. Decrying Peoples Democratic Party, NC and other political parties of the Valley for raking up controversies over the annual pilgrimage of Shri Amarnathji, Koul has said that pilgrimage poses no threat of any sort to the ecology of place and some political forces of the state are hell bent to politicize the issue for their personal gains. In the statement issued here on Saturday, Koul said that the Shrine Board (SASB) had taken all the precautions to preserve the ecology of the area but it were some political forces of the state who try to gain political mileage by raking up the issue time and again. He further said that the workers of his party visited the base camps at Baltal and observed that every precaution was taken to preserve the ecology of the area. He said that the concerned board has taken all the measures to maintain health and hygiene in the camping sites and en-route the Cave Shrine and present turmoil was only to hoodwink the nation. From mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 15:41:49 2008 From: mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com (mahmood farooqui) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 15:41:49 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: 21 August 'Partition: The Long Shadow' Closing Cultural Programme In-Reply-To: <20081408.121315.24097176@zubaanbooks.com> References: <20081408.121315.24097176@zubaanbooks.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: zubaanbooks.com Date: 2008/8/14 Subject: 21 August 'Partition: The Long Shadow' Closing Cultural Programme To: "mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com" *The Heinrich Boll Foundation, India Habitat Centre, Max Mueller Bhavan and Zubaan are pleased to invite you to an evening of song, poetry and performance--the closing event of the year-long series, Partition: The Long Shadow Thursday, 21 August 2008 7.00 pm Stein Auditorium India Habitat Centre Vardhaman Marg New Delhi 110003* (entry from gate no 3) The programme will feature: *Partition Dastans* by Anusha Rizvi, Danish Husain and Mahmood Farooqui Building upon previous Dastangoi presentations on Partition, the performers focus on the experiences of Indian Muslims to bring alive untold stories: of those who wished to return but could not, those who wanted to stay but were forced out, those who belong not to maps or boundaries but to South Asia as a whole. *Partition poetry* Brief readings by poets and writers. *Songs of Connectivity* Madan Gopal Singh and musicians. *All are welcome!* Please click hereto unsubscribe from the mailing list From lawrence at altlawforum.org Mon Aug 18 18:19:21 2008 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 18:19:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A Gold medal with Hints of Red Message-ID: Hi All In the midst of all the celebration of India's first gold medal, here is a piece by Vijaya Pushkarna on Bindra's initial target practice aka William Tell, who at least put his own son on the line Lawrence http://week.manoramaonline.com/cgi-bin/MMOnline.dll/portal/ep/theWeekContent.do?contentType=EDITORIAL§ionName=COVER%20STORY&programId=1073755753&BV_ID=@@@&contentId=4386948 Bang, on target - *From shooting balloons placed on his maid's head to winning the Olympic Gold…, the making of Bindra The Champ By Vijaya Pushkarna/Chandigarh Photo:Arun Sreedhar* A common sight in the Dehradun farmhouse of the Bindras was of a boy in shorts walking, running or cycling around, with a gun in hand, taking aim at birds, and lining up empty bottles for target practice. Abhinav Bindra's fancy for the gun began when he was barely three. One day his father, Dr Apjit Singh Bindra, was shocked to find his children's maid-Abhinav has a sister, Divya-drenched in red liquid from head to toe. He later learnt that Abhinav had been doing target practice with balloons filled with red-coloured water placed on the maid's head. The maid said he had been doing it for months. "Has he ever hurt you?" Bindra asked her. Just once, she said. That was when five-year-old Abhinav missed the target balloon and the pellet from his air gun hit the maid on her right cheekbone. Bindra, a food technologist-cum-businessman, decided to make a non-human target for his son. He assembled bamboos in a square formation, suspended a target in its centre and placed it in the backyard. It was Abhinav's first shooting range. When the Bindras moved into a rented house in Chandigarh, Bindra converted the lawn in the backyard into a full-fledged shooting range. "He started out in the backyard. See where he has come today," gushed Abhinav's mother, Bubli. Bindra is a proud man. "My Singh is king. The gods have been extremely kind to us," he said, as he popped open a champagne bottle at his palatial house, 20 km from Chandigarh, to celebrate his son's Olympic gold win in the 10m air rifle event in Beijing on August 11. Abhinav's Olympic gold was planned and, in a way, executed at home-for, hidden among the trees near the house and away from the view of visitors is a shooting range made to Olympics specifications. Next to it is a fitness centre. "At 9 a.m., Abhinav would go to the range and return for lunch. At 2.30 p.m., he would go again and return after four hours. I presume he would be going to the health centre from the range," said Surjit Singh Nalwa, Abhinav's maternal uncle. When Nalwa flew in four months ago and discussed shooting with his nephew, Abhinav said, "I would like my performance to speak. I am not going to talk about shooting now." Abhinav's paternal aunt Dolly Lamba used to address him 'champ' after he won his first gold at a shooting event in Rohtak. When she used the same endearment a few weeks ago, Abhinav said, "Kahaan bua, main to abhi champ bana hi nahin (No, I have not become a champion yet)." Finally, his gun did the talking. After winning the Olympic gold, he called up his parents. The cell phone passed from one family member to the other, each getting just half a minute. Dolly did not get to talk and sent him an sms: "U've bcom the champ of champions." When Abhinav went for the Athens Olympics, where he missed the gold, his family used to call him up and ask him to come for photo sessions with them and friends. "This time, we did not go to Beijing or call him or encourage him to keep his cell phone with him. We realised in Athens that we and these gadgets were a distraction," said Bindra, who has been Abhinav's manager, motivator and financer. "This time he went like an army man on a mission. It had to be only Abhinav and the target-Olympic gold." Bindra nurtured Abhinav's talent. A son's passion became his father's dream. "Cricket, tennis and golf are fashionable and lucrative sports. But in developed countries, you spot talent and train the sportsman. That is what I did," he said proudly. His son, at 17, was the youngest sportsman in the Sydney Olympics, and Australia released a postage stamp with Abhinav's face on it. Despite Bindra's wealth and contacts, making an Olympic gold medallist of the boy was not easy. Amid his hectic schedules, he set aside two hours every day for Abhinav's shooting and for planning his travel. "Nowadays, transferring money is easy. But when Abhinav was coming up, it was a problem. There were issues with the income tax department, who wanted to know why thousands of dollars were being spent on him," he said. "Shooting is an expensive sport. Abhinav's first gun, a Feinwerkbau, cost around Rs 4 lakh in 1997. Another problem was availability. We imported the guns and had hassles getting licences." About 10 years ago, Bindra's business was not doing very well. Animal rights activist Maneka Gandhi and the Hindu Mahasabha were demanding the closure of his Rs 300-crore meat-processing factory. Entangled in court cases, Bindra closed the unit for a couple of years, but he did not let Abhinav's training suffer. That was when a group of citizens of Chandigarh stepped in to encourage Abhinav. Advocate M.L. Sareen, income tax expert Chaman Sharma, businessman Amarjit Sethi and photographer Tejee formed the Abhinav Bindra Trust. "We did not provide financial support. We tried to change the Chandigarh administration's mindset with regard to licences, import duties and such things. We wanted this boy to move up to world-class shooting and the administration to realise that it was an international sport," said Sareen. Another person receiving congratulatory calls is Abhinav's coach Col. J.S. Dhillon. On July 13, 1995, Abhinav and his father visited Dhillon. Bindra wanted him to "teach Abhinav to shoot properly, as he is all over with his gun." The colonel asked what level of training he wanted. "What is the highest level of training?" Bindra asked. The Olympics. "We will aim for the Olympic gold," Bindra told his son and Dhillon. Then colonel said Abhinav would need German rifles, which were not available in India. Ten days later, Abhinav came with the Feinwerkbau 300 junior model rifle. "Abhinav could not carry the regular rifle. He was a little boy. He never missed a day and always came five minutes early. He used to come in a Mercedes with his driver and a servant. Born into luxury, lived in AC rooms, never seen flies and mosquitoes, but he was happy to sweat it out, literally," said Dhillon, adding that Abhinav never complained about wearing leather trousers and leather jacket in hot weather. The family got the makeshift range in the rented house air conditioned only before the Sydney Olympics. "Children from affluent homes cannot sweat it out. But here was young Abhinav, standing long hours, even for four hours, holding the rifle," said Dhillon. Bindra sent his son to a Colorado BBA school only because the city had an acclaimed training centre for shooting. Abhinav underwent commando training course in Germany and mental training regimen in South Africa. So was it training abroad that got him the Olympic gold? Said Bindra: "It is not national versus international training. It is thanks to God, the sportsman's own talent, and regimented training." Abhinav owes his composure to his mother, who gave him emotional support. The focus, aggressive pursuit of a goal, and the hardworking nature may have been acquired from his father. "He would come home disappointed when a bird he was chasing flew off. I would tell him there will be many more, and he would go off with his gun," said Bubli. Missing the medal in Athens was the lowest point in his career. "He would say he missed the chance of a lifetime. I would tell him that if he had got anything at all in Athens, it would have been a bronze. I kept telling him, 'You are destined to win a gold'," Bubli said. Abhinav was always the quiet, reserved, polite and shy type. Long spells of training left him with little time for friends. He was Mr Chocolate at a school competition, said Abhinav's classmate Deepinder Kaushal. Often, shooting would take him away from classes. "But Harold Carvar, principal of St Stephen's School in Chandigarh, made sure that he could pursue the sport. He even arranged for a special board exam as Abhinav was abroad during the ICSE exams," Bubli said. For Bindra, the joy goes beyond the medal. "A new chapter has started for India. Indians focus on cricket and golf. Now they know other forms of sports, too, can bring India glory," he told a dignitary who had called to congratulate him. The family is waiting for the return of their shooting star, to celebrate. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 18 19:19:31 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 06:49:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] The 'secular' Freedom Movement of Kashmir Message-ID: <25301.73407.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Excerpts from the News Report in Daily Excelsior of 17th Aug 2008 (dedicated weblink available only after archiving):   - Geelani said that the Kashmiris had launched a movement of ‘Azadi Bara-e-Islam’ (freedom for Islam)   - streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan and Islamic slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the familiar "Ham kya chahte: Azadi".   Kshmendra   FULL NEWS REPORT BELOW   Geelani asks pro-India leaders to resign or face ‘social boycott’ *At massive rally in Pampore, Hurriyat chief calls it ‘freedom for Islam’   >From Ahmed Ali Fayyaz   SRINAGAR, Aug 16: With the authorities losing control of the situation fast and a fresh phase of turbulence attaining all the trappings of a religious separatist movement, heads of both factions of the separatist Hurriyat Conference, Syed Ali Shah Geelani and Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, have asked Kashmir’s pro-India politicians to immediately resign or else face ‘social boycott’. Geelani has called this avatar of the separatist movement as "freedom for Islam" and warned Jammu & Kashmir Police to immediately "stop your shameful atrocities on the (Kashmiri) nation or face the social boycott".   While addressing a massive condolence meeting over the death of People’s League chairman Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others in different incidents of firing earlier this week, at Pampore today, Geelani said that the Kashmiris had launched a movement of ‘Azadi Bara-e-Islam’ (freedom for Islam), which, according to him, would be carried to its logical conclusion. He said that today’s mammoth rally would bring it home to all and sundry that the Kashmiris’ "freedom struggle" would continue unfazed inspite of "economic blockade and all other impediments".   While local cable television channels reported that six lakh people participated in today’s rally and the official figures vacillated between thirty and fifty thousand, independent watchers believe that over one Lakh Kashmiris, drawn from different parts of the Valley, participated in the remembrance meeting and listened to the senior separatist leaders. With a contrast to the dominance of pro-freedom slogans and flags in the last 15 years, streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan and Islamic slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the familiar "Ham kya chahte: Azadi".   While there were no flags of groups like Yasin Malik’s JKLF and Sajjad Gani Lone’s People’s Conference, which are dominated by red, white and blue colours, men in the rally today carried green colour flags emblazoned with "Allah-o-Akbar" (God is Great). Many of the participants also traveled to Pampore with black flags atop their vehicles, signifying mourning over the death of Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others killed in different incidents of firing in the last few days.   Director General of Police, Kuldeep Khoda, had announced overnight that Police or armed forces would not obstruct the rally if it passed off peacefully. His statement came hours after a green signal from another senior Police official who even said on local television channels that Sheikh Abdul Aziz’s "sacrifice" would augur well for restoration of peace in the State.   In his fiery speech, a visibly emboldened Geelani asked all leaders of the pro-India parties in J&K, including Members of Parliament, Ministers and others holding any positions in the Government, to immediately resign. "We’ll be otherwise forced to call for social boycott against them", Geelani said. He also shot a warning to J&K Police to "stop your shameful atrocities on the Kashmiri nation, or else face social boycott". Mirwaiz too advised the mainstream politicians to quit and join the "freedom struggle". He too said that the pro-India leaders would have to face "social boycott" if they failed to respond to the call. "There are unimaginable consequences for them ahead and that day is not far away", Mirwaiz warned.   Geelani advised his audiences against attacking armed forces "so that they don’t get an excuse to open fire". While taking an oral oath from the audiences, Geelani asserted that only a peaceful agitation would lead in the "desired direction". He claimed that intelligence agencies had cultivated as many as 44,000 agents, whose task, according to him, was to "sabotage our freedom movement and change its course with chaos and confusion". He said that "these paid agents" had a many times in the past succeeded in "changing the course of our freedom struggle in favour of India".   "This time around, however, it will be brought home to India that it has no room in Kashmir", Geelani said and described Pakistan as the "benefactor of the Kashmiri nation". He asked the Kashmiris to pursue the "one-point agenda of freedom for Islam". He, nevertheless, sought to assert that the Kashmiris’ war was strictly against the Government of India and her policies towards Kashmir and not against the people of the country.   Mirwaiz reiterated his fresh set of demands and asked New Delhi to withdraw armed forces from J&K, revoke Armed Forces Special Powers Act, release all political detenues from the State and throw Srinagar-Muzaffarabad Road open for "free trade and travel". In a significant development, Mirwaiz, who was otherwise perceived to be lukewarm to Geelani’s call of election boycott until yesterday, emphasized on "total boycott" to any elections to be held by India in Jammu & Kashmir. Speaking little about SASB land controversy and "economic blockade of Kashmiris", Mirwaiz asserted that the day of winning freedom from India was not far away.   On this occasion, JKLF chairman, Yasin Malik, too advised the Kashmiris against taking any step that could weaken "our freedom movement". He said that "sacrifices laid by Sheikh Aziz and others would not go waste as nobody would be allowed to exploit the same for vested interest". He said that the Kashmiris had invested their life and assets in the "freedom struggle" and it was now "time to harvest".   Sheikh Aziz’s s seniormost colleague in Peoples League, Shabir Ahmed Shah, stressed on the need of also opening Mughal Road which, he said, would join the people of Rajouri and Poonch districts of Jammu with Kashmir valley. He asked the people not to attack any mediaperson and expressed his shock over the fact that a number of newspersons and camera crews had been attacked by unruly crowds in the last few days.   Shah implored his audiences to respond to the call of Hurriyat Coordination Committee and make all of its programmes a big success. Sheikh’s longtime colleague, Nayeem Khan, and a number of other separatist leaders were also present. Mirwaiz disclosed that Hurriyat would hold an important meeting on Sunday to chalk out "further course of action" and asked his supporters to similarly gather for Hurriyat’s "UN Chalo" programme on Monday next.   While militants have significantly silenced their guns since last fortnight, thousands of people in the rallies, leading to Pampore today, chose to maintain peace inspite of shouting hardcore pro-Pakistan slogans. They raised the pitch of their "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan" when cavalcades of a senior CRPF officer and a Brigadier passed by but did not resort to stone pelting. Armed escorts observed restraint and wended their way towards a military formation.   Army’s and State Government’s helicopters maintained surveillance over the rally and captured its movement in video cameras, occasionally flying very low. Sources said that two senior officials of the state government were among those who watched the rally’s passage for several hours and reported it to Governor. Small groups of youth, carrying Islamic and black flags on their motorcycles and vehicles and shouting pro-Pakistan slogans, made repeated rounds in the so-called safe zones in Srinagar as if to establish that it was a liberated town. Police and CRPF watched them mutely for the day.   In minutes of the separatist leaders’ threats to mainstream politicians, hundreds of people launched an attack on the guarded house of the prominent counter-insurgent, Ghulam Mohammad Lone alias Papa Kishtwari, who has been in jail after contesting and losing several elections, at Pampore and razed it to rubble brick-by-brick. They also set a condemned vehicle on the premises on fire. Eyewitnesses said that an armed platoon of J&K Police, which had been guarding Kishtwari’s house since 1995, cleared out and took refuge in the Police Station.   Before the separatists’ rally returned, an old time colleague of Mirwaiz Umar, namely Mohammad Yaqoob Vakil, reportedly announced his resignation in Mehbooba Mufti’s People’s Democratic Party (PDP). Reports said that he was returning to the Hurriyat. Earlier this year, PDP had celebrated Vakil’s entry as "a remarkable achievement" for the party. After the current phase of the separatist movement has crippled the J&K Police, a number of mainstream political activists, as also the families of Police and civil officials, known for strengthening the Indian system in Kashmir, have reportedly migrated to safer places. From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 18 19:22:02 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:22:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] The 'secular' Freedom Movement of Kashmir In-Reply-To: <25301.73407.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <25301.73407.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808180652o9c675a3nfbf5789a566bf0c@mail.gmail.com> Dear Kshmendra, The opposite of secular is not 'communal'. The opposite of secular is religious. best shivam On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 7:19 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Excerpts from the News Report in Daily Excelsior of 17th Aug 2008 > (dedicated weblink available only after archiving): > > - Geelani said that the Kashmiris had launched a movement of 'Azadi > Bara-e-Islam' (freedom for Islam) > > - streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan and Islamic > slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", "Jeevay Jeevay > Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the familiar "Ham > kya chahte: Azadi". > > Kshmendra > > FULL NEWS REPORT BELOW > > Geelani asks pro-India leaders to resign or face 'social boycott' > > *At massive rally in Pampore, Hurriyat chief calls it 'freedom for Islam' > > From Ahmed Ali Fayyaz > > SRINAGAR, Aug 16: With the authorities losing control of the situation fast > and a fresh phase of turbulence attaining all the trappings of a religious > separatist movement, heads of both factions of the separatist Hurriyat > Conference, Syed Ali Shah Geelani and Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, have asked > Kashmir's pro-India politicians to immediately resign or else face 'social > boycott'. Geelani has called this avatar of the separatist movement as > "freedom for Islam" and warned Jammu & Kashmir Police to immediately "stop > your shameful atrocities on the (Kashmiri) nation or face the social > boycott". > > While addressing a massive condolence meeting over the death of People's > League chairman Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others in different incidents > of firing earlier this week, at Pampore today, Geelani said that the > Kashmiris had launched a movement of 'Azadi Bara-e-Islam' (freedom for > Islam), which, according to him, would be carried to its logical conclusion. > He said that today's mammoth rally would bring it home to all and sundry > that the Kashmiris' "freedom struggle" would continue unfazed inspite of > "economic blockade and all other impediments". > > While local cable television channels reported that six lakh people > participated in today's rally and the official figures vacillated between > thirty and fifty thousand, independent watchers believe that over one Lakh > Kashmiris, drawn from different parts of the Valley, participated in the > remembrance meeting and listened to the senior separatist leaders. > With a contrast to the dominance of pro-freedom slogans and flags in the > last 15 years, streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan > and Islamic slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", > "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the > familiar "Ham kya chahte: Azadi". > > While there were no flags of groups like Yasin Malik's JKLF and Sajjad Gani > Lone's People's Conference, which are dominated by red, white and blue > colours, men in the rally today carried green colour flags emblazoned with > "Allah-o-Akbar" (God is Great). Many of the participants also traveled to > Pampore with black flags atop their vehicles, signifying mourning over the > death of Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others killed in different incidents > of firing in the last few days. > > Director General of Police, Kuldeep Khoda, had announced overnight that > Police or armed forces would not obstruct the rally if it passed off > peacefully. His statement came hours after a green signal from another > senior Police official who even said on local television channels that > Sheikh Abdul Aziz's "sacrifice" would augur well for restoration of peace in > the State. > > In his fiery speech, a visibly emboldened Geelani asked all leaders of the > pro-India parties in J&K, including Members of Parliament, Ministers and > others holding any positions in the Government, to immediately resign. > "We'll be otherwise forced to call for social boycott against them", Geelani > said. He also shot a warning to J&K Police to "stop your shameful atrocities > on the Kashmiri nation, or else face social boycott". Mirwaiz too advised > the mainstream politicians to quit and join the "freedom struggle". He too > said that the pro-India leaders would have to face "social boycott" if they > failed to respond to the call. "There are unimaginable consequences for them > ahead and that day is not far away", Mirwaiz warned. > > Geelani advised his audiences against attacking armed forces "so that they > don't get an excuse to open fire". While taking an oral oath from the > audiences, Geelani asserted that only a peaceful agitation would lead in the > "desired direction". He claimed that intelligence agencies had cultivated as > many as 44,000 agents, whose task, according to him, was to "sabotage our > freedom movement and change its course with chaos and confusion". He said > that "these paid agents" had a many times in the past succeeded in "changing > the course of our freedom struggle in favour of India". > > "This time around, however, it will be brought home to India that it has no > room in Kashmir", Geelani said and described Pakistan as the "benefactor of > the Kashmiri nation". He asked the Kashmiris to pursue the "one-point agenda > of freedom for Islam". He, nevertheless, sought to assert that the > Kashmiris' war was strictly against the Government of India and her policies > towards Kashmir and not against the people of the country. > > > > > > > > > Mirwaiz reiterated his fresh set of demands and asked New Delhi to withdraw > armed forces from J&K, revoke Armed Forces Special Powers Act, release all > political detenues from the State and throw Srinagar-Muzaffarabad Road open > for "free trade and travel". In a significant development, Mirwaiz, who was > otherwise perceived to be lukewarm to Geelani's call of election boycott > until yesterday, emphasized on "total boycott" to any elections to be held > by India in Jammu & Kashmir. Speaking little about SASB land controversy and > "economic blockade of Kashmiris", Mirwaiz asserted that the day of winning > freedom from India was not far away. > > On this occasion, JKLF chairman, Yasin Malik, too advised the Kashmiris > against taking any step that could weaken "our freedom movement". He said > that "sacrifices laid by Sheikh Aziz and others would not go waste as nobody > would be allowed to exploit the same for vested interest". He said that the > Kashmiris had invested their life and assets in the "freedom struggle" and > it was now "time to harvest". > > Sheikh Aziz's s seniormost colleague in Peoples League, Shabir Ahmed Shah, > stressed on the need of also opening Mughal Road which, he said, would join > the people of Rajouri and Poonch districts of Jammu with Kashmir valley. He > asked the people not to attack any mediaperson and expressed his shock over > the fact that a number of newspersons and camera crews had been attacked by > unruly crowds in the last few days. > > Shah implored his audiences to respond to the call of Hurriyat Coordination > Committee and make all of its programmes a big success. Sheikh's longtime > colleague, Nayeem Khan, and a number of other separatist leaders were also > present. Mirwaiz disclosed that Hurriyat would hold an important meeting on > Sunday to chalk out "further course of action" and asked his supporters to > similarly gather for Hurriyat's "UN Chalo" programme on Monday next. > > While militants have significantly silenced their guns since last > fortnight, thousands of people in the rallies, leading to Pampore today, > chose to maintain peace inspite of shouting hardcore pro-Pakistan slogans. > They raised the pitch of their "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan" when cavalcades of a > senior CRPF officer and a Brigadier passed by but did not resort to stone > pelting. Armed escorts observed restraint and wended their way towards a > military formation. > > Army's and State Government's helicopters maintained surveillance over the > rally and captured its movement in video cameras, occasionally flying very > low. Sources said that two senior officials of the state government were > among those who watched the rally's passage for several hours and reported > it to Governor. Small groups of youth, carrying Islamic and black flags on > their motorcycles and vehicles and shouting pro-Pakistan slogans, made > repeated rounds in the so-called safe zones in Srinagar as if to establish > that it was a liberated town. Police and CRPF watched them mutely for the > day. > > In minutes of the separatist leaders' threats to mainstream politicians, > hundreds of people launched an attack on the guarded house of the prominent > counter-insurgent, Ghulam Mohammad Lone alias Papa Kishtwari, who has been > in jail after contesting and losing several elections, at Pampore and razed > it to rubble brick-by-brick. They also set a condemned vehicle on the > premises on fire. Eyewitnesses said that an armed platoon of J&K Police, > which had been guarding Kishtwari's house since 1995, cleared out and took > refuge in the Police Station. > > Before the separatists' rally returned, an old time colleague of Mirwaiz > Umar, namely Mohammad Yaqoob Vakil, reportedly announced his resignation in > Mehbooba Mufti's People's Democratic Party (PDP). Reports said that he was > returning to the Hurriyat. Earlier this year, PDP had celebrated Vakil's > entry as "a remarkable achievement" for the party. After the current phase > of the separatist movement has crippled the J&K Police, a number of > mainstream political activists, as also the families of Police and civil > officials, known for strengthening the Indian system in Kashmir, have > reportedly migrated to safer places. > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 18 19:28:32 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 06:58:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] The 'secular' Freedom Movement of Kashmir In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808180652o9c675a3nfbf5789a566bf0c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <348040.94613.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Shivam   Did you feel compelled to speak? Even if it was for the sake of making a meaningless comment?   Think before you write. Think about what you have written and ask yoiurself why you wrote it. Feel foolish if you have that grace.   Kshmendra --- On Mon, 8/18/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The 'secular' Freedom Movement of Kashmir To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Cc: "sarai list" Date: Monday, August 18, 2008, 7:22 PM Dear Kshmendra, The opposite of secular is not 'communal'. The opposite of secular is religious. best shivam On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 7:19 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: Excerpts from the News Report in Daily Excelsior of 17th Aug 2008 (dedicated weblink available only after archiving):   - Geelani said that the Kashmiris had launched a movement of 'Azadi Bara-e-Islam' (freedom for Islam)   - streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan and Islamic slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the familiar "Ham kya chahte: Azadi".   Kshmendra   FULL NEWS REPORT BELOW   Geelani asks pro-India leaders to resign or face 'social boycott' *At massive rally in Pampore, Hurriyat chief calls it 'freedom for Islam'   >From Ahmed Ali Fayyaz   SRINAGAR, Aug 16: With the authorities losing control of the situation fast and a fresh phase of turbulence attaining all the trappings of a religious separatist movement, heads of both factions of the separatist Hurriyat Conference, Syed Ali Shah Geelani and Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, have asked Kashmir's pro-India politicians to immediately resign or else face 'social boycott'. Geelani has called this avatar of the separatist movement as "freedom for Islam" and warned Jammu & Kashmir Police to immediately "stop your shameful atrocities on the (Kashmiri) nation or face the social boycott".   While addressing a massive condolence meeting over the death of People's League chairman Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others in different incidents of firing earlier this week, at Pampore today, Geelani said that the Kashmiris had launched a movement of 'Azadi Bara-e-Islam' (freedom for Islam), which, according to him, would be carried to its logical conclusion. He said that today's mammoth rally would bring it home to all and sundry that the Kashmiris' "freedom struggle" would continue unfazed inspite of "economic blockade and all other impediments".   While local cable television channels reported that six lakh people participated in today's rally and the official figures vacillated between thirty and fifty thousand, independent watchers believe that over one Lakh Kashmiris, drawn from different parts of the Valley, participated in the remembrance meeting and listened to the senior separatist leaders. With a contrast to the dominance of pro-freedom slogans and flags in the last 15 years, streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan and Islamic slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the familiar "Ham kya chahte: Azadi".   While there were no flags of groups like Yasin Malik's JKLF and Sajjad Gani Lone's People's Conference, which are dominated by red, white and blue colours, men in the rally today carried green colour flags emblazoned with "Allah-o-Akbar" (God is Great). Many of the participants also traveled to Pampore with black flags atop their vehicles, signifying mourning over the death of Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others killed in different incidents of firing in the last few days.   Director General of Police, Kuldeep Khoda, had announced overnight that Police or armed forces would not obstruct the rally if it passed off peacefully. His statement came hours after a green signal from another senior Police official who even said on local television channels that Sheikh Abdul Aziz's "sacrifice" would augur well for restoration of peace in the State.   In his fiery speech, a visibly emboldened Geelani asked all leaders of the pro-India parties in J&K, including Members of Parliament, Ministers and others holding any positions in the Government, to immediately resign. "We'll be otherwise forced to call for social boycott against them", Geelani said. He also shot a warning to J&K Police to "stop your shameful atrocities on the Kashmiri nation, or else face social boycott". Mirwaiz too advised the mainstream politicians to quit and join the "freedom struggle". He too said that the pro-India leaders would have to face "social boycott" if they failed to respond to the call. "There are unimaginable consequences for them ahead and that day is not far away", Mirwaiz warned.   Geelani advised his audiences against attacking armed forces "so that they don't get an excuse to open fire". While taking an oral oath from the audiences, Geelani asserted that only a peaceful agitation would lead in the "desired direction". He claimed that intelligence agencies had cultivated as many as 44,000 agents, whose task, according to him, was to "sabotage our freedom movement and change its course with chaos and confusion". He said that "these paid agents" had a many times in the past succeeded in "changing the course of our freedom struggle in favour of India".   "This time around, however, it will be brought home to India that it has no room in Kashmir", Geelani said and described Pakistan as the "benefactor of the Kashmiri nation". He asked the Kashmiris to pursue the "one-point agenda of freedom for Islam". He, nevertheless, sought to assert that the Kashmiris' war was strictly against the Government of India and her policies towards Kashmir and not against the people of the country.   Mirwaiz reiterated his fresh set of demands and asked New Delhi to withdraw armed forces from J&K, revoke Armed Forces Special Powers Act, release all political detenues from the State and throw Srinagar-Muzaffarabad Road open for "free trade and travel". In a significant development, Mirwaiz, who was otherwise perceived to be lukewarm to Geelani's call of election boycott until yesterday, emphasized on "total boycott" to any elections to be held by India in Jammu & Kashmir. Speaking little about SASB land controversy and "economic blockade of Kashmiris", Mirwaiz asserted that the day of winning freedom from India was not far away.   On this occasion, JKLF chairman, Yasin Malik, too advised the Kashmiris against taking any step that could weaken "our freedom movement". He said that "sacrifices laid by Sheikh Aziz and others would not go waste as nobody would be allowed to exploit the same for vested interest". He said that the Kashmiris had invested their life and assets in the "freedom struggle" and it was now "time to harvest".   Sheikh Aziz's s seniormost colleague in Peoples League, Shabir Ahmed Shah, stressed on the need of also opening Mughal Road which, he said, would join the people of Rajouri and Poonch districts of Jammu with Kashmir valley. He asked the people not to attack any mediaperson and expressed his shock over the fact that a number of newspersons and camera crews had been attacked by unruly crowds in the last few days.   Shah implored his audiences to respond to the call of Hurriyat Coordination Committee and make all of its programmes a big success. Sheikh's longtime colleague, Nayeem Khan, and a number of other separatist leaders were also present. Mirwaiz disclosed that Hurriyat would hold an important meeting on Sunday to chalk out "further course of action" and asked his supporters to similarly gather for Hurriyat's "UN Chalo" programme on Monday next.   While militants have significantly silenced their guns since last fortnight, thousands of people in the rallies, leading to Pampore today, chose to maintain peace inspite of shouting hardcore pro-Pakistan slogans. They raised the pitch of their "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan" when cavalcades of a senior CRPF officer and a Brigadier passed by but did not resort to stone pelting. Armed escorts observed restraint and wended their way towards a military formation.   Army's and State Government's helicopters maintained surveillance over the rally and captured its movement in video cameras, occasionally flying very low. Sources said that two senior officials of the state government were among those who watched the rally's passage for several hours and reported it to Governor. Small groups of youth, carrying Islamic and black flags on their motorcycles and vehicles and shouting pro-Pakistan slogans, made repeated rounds in the so-called safe zones in Srinagar as if to establish that it was a liberated town. Police and CRPF watched them mutely for the day.   In minutes of the separatist leaders' threats to mainstream politicians, hundreds of people launched an attack on the guarded house of the prominent counter-insurgent, Ghulam Mohammad Lone alias Papa Kishtwari, who has been in jail after contesting and losing several elections, at Pampore and razed it to rubble brick-by-brick. They also set a condemned vehicle on the premises on fire. Eyewitnesses said that an armed platoon of J&K Police, which had been guarding Kishtwari's house since 1995, cleared out and took refuge in the Police Station.   Before the separatists' rally returned, an old time colleague of Mirwaiz Umar, namely Mohammad Yaqoob Vakil, reportedly announced his resignation in Mehbooba Mufti's People's Democratic Party (PDP). Reports said that he was returning to the Hurriyat. Earlier this year, PDP had celebrated Vakil's entry as "a remarkable achievement" for the party. After the current phase of the separatist movement has crippled the J&K Police, a number of mainstream political activists, as also the families of Police and civil officials, known for strengthening the Indian system in Kashmir, have reportedly migrated to safer places. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Mon Aug 18 19:31:25 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:31:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] =?utf-8?q?=27=E2=80=98I_have_evidence_of_RSS_and_VH?= =?utf-8?b?UCBtYWtpbmcgYm9tYnPigJkn?= Message-ID: <9c06aab30808180701t4826636at25812d309516e06a@mail.gmail.com> 'I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs' Senior Congress leader Digvijay Singh attacks the BJP just like Sushma Swaraj attacked the Congress. 'Investigate the timings of the blasts', he tells NEHA DIXIT You have made a statement that serial blasts take place in the country only when the BJP is in trouble. What I have said is that the timing of the bomb blasts is quite uncanny. Why does it always happen when the BJP is in trouble? That needs investigation. I am not charging anyone. What do you mean when you say the BJP is in trouble? When the Tehelka issue was to be discussed in Parliament, the House was adjourned for three days. Then when the expose was to be discussed, the Parliament attack took place. When the Godhra incident took place, Congress was doing exceedingly well in the local body elections and Narendra Modi had won by only 6,000 votes as a chief minister and that too with great difficulty. During the recent Karnataka election, there was a bomb blast in Hubli on the very first day of polling. Similarly, two days before the polling in the second phase in Karnataka elections, there was a bomb blast in Jaipur. It really needs an investigation. Is your statement a response to Sushma Swaraj's accusation against the Centre? No, there is no question of that. I have been citing these instances about the blasts for a long time. But Sushma Swaraj was criticised by the Congress ... Sushma Swaraj alleged that the Congress is involved directly. I have not said that. And does she have any facts? I have facts of RSS, VHP making bombs. Do you have evidences to prove that BJP, VHP and RSS is involved in making bombs. Yes. In fact, in 1992 there was a bomb blast in the VHP office in Madhya Pradesh, where one VHP member died and two were injured while making bombs. Then in 2002, there was a bomb blast in a temple in Mhow. When the police arrested the VHP activists after investigation, they confessed that they were even given training to manufacture bombs. I have a videocassette of that confession. Again, in 2006, in Nanded, there was a bomb blast in the house of a RSS activist where two RSS activists died. After that in March 2008, there were bomb blasts at two places in Tamil Nadu. Then too VHP activists were arrested by the Tamil Nadu police who confessed that they were involved. And how did the Gujarat police suddenly find eighteen bombs planted on trees in Surat? So are you saying that the BJP is behind the recent serial blasts? No, I am not saying anything. All that I am saying is that the timing is uncanny. RSS, VHP activists have been caught making bombs, material for preparing bombs have been found at their office and there are three-four clear cases where they have been arrested and a case has been registered. Why isn't anyone looking into this?. Shouldn't all parties unite against terrorism? Absolutely, but when you target only Muslims, it's not correct. Then why is the blame-game still on? It is on because we have evidence to say that people who talk about nationalism and nationalist feelings should not be involved in making bombs. The BJP believes in divisive politics. They cannot survive without dividing Hindus and Muslims. Each time something happens, they come back to Hindutva. >From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 33, Dated Aug 23, 2008 http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne230808Incoldblood.asp From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 18 19:46:35 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 07:16:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] =?utf-8?q?=27=E2=80=98I_have_evidence_of_RSS_and_VH?= =?utf-8?b?UCBtYWtpbmcgYm9tYnPigJkn?= In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808180701t4826636at25812d309516e06a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <982015.68007.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> The 26 (was it 26?) Bombs in Surat and not one got triggered off.   Bombs (shown on TV) located at places where the one placing the bomb would be conspicuously visible as being upto 'something'.   All of this (to me) is highly suspicious.   Kshmendra --- On Mon, 8/18/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: [Reader-list] '‘I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs’' To: "sarai list" Date: Monday, August 18, 2008, 7:31 PM 'I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs' Senior Congress leader Digvijay Singh attacks the BJP just like Sushma Swaraj attacked the Congress. 'Investigate the timings of the blasts', he tells NEHA DIXIT You have made a statement that serial blasts take place in the country only when the BJP is in trouble. What I have said is that the timing of the bomb blasts is quite uncanny. Why does it always happen when the BJP is in trouble? That needs investigation. I am not charging anyone. What do you mean when you say the BJP is in trouble? When the Tehelka issue was to be discussed in Parliament, the House was adjourned for three days. Then when the expose was to be discussed, the Parliament attack took place. When the Godhra incident took place, Congress was doing exceedingly well in the local body elections and Narendra Modi had won by only 6,000 votes as a chief minister and that too with great difficulty. During the recent Karnataka election, there was a bomb blast in Hubli on the very first day of polling. Similarly, two days before the polling in the second phase in Karnataka elections, there was a bomb blast in Jaipur. It really needs an investigation. Is your statement a response to Sushma Swaraj's accusation against the Centre? No, there is no question of that. I have been citing these instances about the blasts for a long time. But Sushma Swaraj was criticised by the Congress ... Sushma Swaraj alleged that the Congress is involved directly. I have not said that. And does she have any facts? I have facts of RSS, VHP making bombs. Do you have evidences to prove that BJP, VHP and RSS is involved in making bombs. Yes. In fact, in 1992 there was a bomb blast in the VHP office in Madhya Pradesh, where one VHP member died and two were injured while making bombs. Then in 2002, there was a bomb blast in a temple in Mhow. When the police arrested the VHP activists after investigation, they confessed that they were even given training to manufacture bombs. I have a videocassette of that confession. Again, in 2006, in Nanded, there was a bomb blast in the house of a RSS activist where two RSS activists died. After that in March 2008, there were bomb blasts at two places in Tamil Nadu. Then too VHP activists were arrested by the Tamil Nadu police who confessed that they were involved. And how did the Gujarat police suddenly find eighteen bombs planted on trees in Surat? So are you saying that the BJP is behind the recent serial blasts? No, I am not saying anything. All that I am saying is that the timing is uncanny. RSS, VHP activists have been caught making bombs, material for preparing bombs have been found at their office and there are three-four clear cases where they have been arrested and a case has been registered. Why isn't anyone looking into this?. Shouldn't all parties unite against terrorism? Absolutely, but when you target only Muslims, it's not correct. Then why is the blame-game still on? It is on because we have evidence to say that people who talk about nationalism and nationalist feelings should not be involved in making bombs. The BJP believes in divisive politics. They cannot survive without dividing Hindus and Muslims. Each time something happens, they come back to Hindutva. >From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 33, Dated Aug 23, 2008 http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne230808Incoldblood.asp _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 21:31:24 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:31:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow Message-ID: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> *Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow* *Link - **http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660* THE TWO month long Amarnath agitation has not lost momentum in Jammu region and despite life remaining paralysed for the last 50 days, the enthusiasm and support to the agitation has not withered. Continuing their strong protests against the Amarnath land transfer order, around two-lakh people on Monday (August 18) responded to the *Jail Bharo* call of the Shree Amarnath Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS). People from all across the region came out of their homes in the morning in overwhelming numbers and courted arrest as a mark of protest against the land order. According to reports, large number of people gathered in Jammu city, Udhampur, Kathua, Hiranagar and Reasi and other major towns and villages on the call of the SAYSS, which is spearheading the agitation. In the morning today, around 10 000 people gathered at City Chowk in Jammu city and took out a procession. Chanting 'Bum Bum Bole' the protesters passed through main roads of the city and reached the city chowk police station and asked the cops to arrest them. This was carried out in all the 16 police stations of Jammu city, with thousands of protesters shouting slogans against the state administration and governor N N Vohra. The protesters were later taken to MAM stadium and other schools and colleges, which were turned into jails for the time being. Udhampur city witnessed a huge turnout and the situation turned violent after protesters clashed with security personnel. Police resorted to lathi charge and tear gas shells were fired to control the protesters, who were demanding the ouster of governor N N Vohra and return of the Amarnath land. A large turnout was also reported in Samba and Kathua districts, but the protests remained largely peaceful and there was no report of any untoward incident. Meanwhile, Shree Amarnath Sangarsh Samiti (SASS) termed the response to the *Jail Bharo* andolan as overwhelming and said it was a historic day for the people of Jammu. Brigadier Suchet Singh, speaking to *merinews*, claimed that more than three lakh people had participated in today's *Jail Bharo*andolan. Singh also criticised the state administration for failing to provide even basic facilities in the makeshift prisons. "The state did not even provide water to the agitating people," he said, adding that the people of Jammu have entered into a do or die mode and will not stop till their goal is achieved. This agitation has the support of the rich and poor and cuts across religious and regional lines, Singh asserted, "Abhi nahi to Kabhi nahi" this is the war cry of the people. Criticizing the Union government for its appeasement policy, Singh alleged that government is delaying a decision in the hope that this agitation will peter off. "This is a people's movement and will achieve its goal," he said. India is concerned only about the Hurriyat and Kashmiris and it will not be tolerated at any cost. Warning that the agitation could further intensify and mode of action could change, Singh asked the Union government to realise its mistakes and take corrective action otherwise there could be more unrest and trouble. The Samiti leaders also registered their strong resentment against certain sections of the national media, which they said were portraying the agitation as communal and sectarian. From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 18 21:59:54 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:59:54 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Four times more trucks plying on Jammu-Srinagar highway: Home Secretary In-Reply-To: <6353c690808180929w77791ea8n9698a2d01dc1199d@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808180929w77791ea8n9698a2d01dc1199d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808180929lb73c7es7dd2054d94319684@mail.gmail.com> *Four times more trucks plying on Jammu-Srinagar highway: Home Secretary* *By Naveen Kapoor - Asian News International* *New Delhi, Aug 18 (ANI):* As pitch of the separatist protests and sloganeering reaches feverish pitch in the Valley, Indian government today said that the situation is fast returning to normal and the so called economic blockade of highway to Srinagar which is the rallying point for the separatists protests in the valley is no more prevalent. In fact, the Government said that there were some obstructions initially but the number of trucks plying on the highway has risen manifold. Union Home secretary Madhukar Gupta told reporters that highway is moving "regularly and freely". Giving the number of trucks plying on the highway, Gupta said: From 8 p.m. on August17 to 8 a.m. on August 18, 480 trucks carrying various commodities like meat, LPG tankers and essential products traveled from Jammu to Srinagar. He added that 550 trucks plied from Srinagar to Jammu out of which 415 trucks were carrying fruits. On a normal day nearly 100-150 trucks ply on both of these busy routes and local authorities say that may be because of the backlog such heavy movement of trucks is witnessed. Meanwhile New Delhi has once again reiterated its willingness to open up the trade route between Srinagar and Muzaffarabad and Poonch-Ravlakote, which was taken by India in composite Dialogue with Pakistan in July 2005. India also blamed Pakistan for creating obstacles in opening of trade route by insisting on procedural issues. Reacting sharply on separatists march to the UN office in Srinagar today and Pakistans attempt to internationalise the issue, Gupta said: Jammu and Kashmir is not an international issue, it is an internal issue but unfortunately Pakistan and people with secessionist tendencies have unfortunately tried to internationalise this issue and there is no doubt that it is our internal issue. (ANI) From rahulroy63 at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 13:51:03 2008 From: rahulroy63 at gmail.com (Rahul Roy) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 13:51:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [DFA NewsLetter] Fwd: Calling from Dhaka for a Bangladeshi Film to be screened in Delhi Festival... In-Reply-To: <4a0aa1b2-5937-4324-ad09-1f9699de2057@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com> References: <4a0aa1b2-5937-4324-ad09-1f9699de2057@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Date: Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:46 AM Subject: Calling from Dhaka for a Bangladeshi Film to be screened in Delhi Festival... To: delhifilmarchive+owner at googlegroups.com Cc: sara at grameenphone.com Subject: Invitation on the occasion of a Bangladeshi film being screened in South Asian Film Festival, Delhi Dear Sir, We are very pleased to inform you that STORIES OF CHANGE, a documentary by us (Kamar Ahmad Simon & Sara Afreen) has been selected in this year's Jeevika: South Asia Livelihood Documentary Festival, due from 28th - 31st August 2008 at Indian Habitat Centre, Delhi. We would be very glad if you can attend & encourage us on the occasion along with your friends. With warm regards. Simon & Sara - -- Film Maker & Architect Cell: +88 01713200718, +88 01711081265 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- STORIES OF CHANGE, a documentary by Simon & Sara SYNOPSIS: A testament to the resilience of human spirit, STORIES OF CHANGE is a real life documentary about the lives of 5 women aging from 16 to 60, coming from different walks of life, from different profession, religion and regions of Bangladesh. Different yet common in their dreams, these women face life's challenges with confidence and belief in their dreams. Knitted in 5 small shorts, STORIES OF CHANGE takes us to a 6th story, unlike a cliché stereo-type, a distinct yet universal struggle of human existence. STORIES OF CHANGE travels through Bangladesh, through its hills, rivers and lanes, through generations, following the narratives of a 16-year-old cricketer to a 60-year-old activist. Together it attempts to portray a different picture of Bangladeshi women - of women who dare to dream! Please visit www.storiesofchange.net for more information about the film. We are also very glad to inform you that this year Jeevika received 101 entries from students and professional film makers from various countries including India, Pakistan, Nepal, Bangladesh, United States and Iran for the Jeevika. STORIES OF CHANGE is among the 17 shortlisted documentary to be screened at Jeevika 2008 Festival. To see the list of shortlisted films, please visit: www.jeevika.org - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Occassion: Jeevika: South Asia Livelihood Documentary Festival 2008 Film Title: STORIES OF CHANGE Genre: Documentary Length: 55 Minutes Time & Date: 17:20, 30th August 2008 Venue: Casuarina Hall, India Habitat Centre, Delhi - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Organizer: Centre for Civil Society Program Manager: Manoj Mathew (98 9930 7456) Program Assistant: Raunak Ahmad (9911795621) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- EXTERNAL LINKS Official Site: http://www.storiesofchange.net/ The Daily Star Review: http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27847 The New Age Review: http://www.newagebd.com/2008/mar/21/mar21/xtra_also1.html Adhunika, New York Show: http://adhunika.org/blog/ Stories of Change/ Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stories_of_Change Jeevika Short Listing 2008: http://www.jeevika.org/ - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (c) BEGINNING, All rights reserved. Beginning Production Ltd. 2001-2008. Dream Apartment, Flat B1, Plot 3G, Road 104, Gulshan 2, Dhaka 1212, Bangladesh Cell: +88 01713200718, Phone: +88 02 8817921, +88 02 8861055 www.beginningproduction.com, info at beginningproduction.com - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Please DO NOT REPLY to the sender. To contact the MODERATOR: delhifilmarchive [at] gmail.com To UNSUBSCRIBE: send an email to delhifilmarchive-unsubscribe at googlegroups.com More OPTIONS are on the web: http://groups.google.com/group/delhifilmarchive Our WEBSITE: www.delhifilmarchive.org -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 01:38:02 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 01:38:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A Gold medal with Hints of Red In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48c2916d0808181308s7a652e61gccaf24a625bdb4c1@mail.gmail.com> ah but Lawrence in a country where the story of Panna Bai is taught to every class five student as a great paen of love and devotion what can one expect.... On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 6:19 PM, Lawrence Liang wrote: > Hi All > > In the midst of all the celebration of India's first gold medal, here is a > piece by Vijaya Pushkarna on Bindra's initial target practice aka William > Tell, who at least put his own son on the line > > Lawrence > > > > > > http://week.manoramaonline.com/cgi-bin/MMOnline.dll/portal/ep/theWeekContent.do?contentType=EDITORIAL§ionName=COVER%20STORY&programId=1073755753&BV_ID=@@@&contentId=4386948 > > Bang, on target - > > *From shooting balloons placed on his maid's head to winning the Olympic > Gold…, the making of Bindra The Champ > By Vijaya Pushkarna/Chandigarh > Photo:Arun Sreedhar* > A common sight in the Dehradun farmhouse of the Bindras was of a boy in > shorts walking, running or cycling around, with a gun in hand, taking aim > at > birds, and lining up empty bottles for target practice. Abhinav Bindra's > fancy for the gun began when he was barely three. > One day his father, Dr Apjit Singh Bindra, was shocked to find his > children's maid-Abhinav has a sister, Divya-drenched in red liquid from > head > to toe. He later learnt that Abhinav had been doing target practice with > balloons filled with red-coloured water placed on the maid's head. The maid > said he had been doing it for months. > "Has he ever hurt you?" Bindra asked her. Just once, she said. That was > when > five-year-old Abhinav missed the target balloon and the pellet from his air > gun hit the maid on her right cheekbone. Bindra, a food > technologist-cum-businessman, decided to make a non-human target for his > son. He assembled bamboos in a square formation, suspended a target in its > centre and placed it in the backyard. It was Abhinav's first shooting > range. > > > When the Bindras moved into a rented house in Chandigarh, Bindra converted > the lawn in the backyard into a full-fledged shooting range. "He started > out > in the backyard. See where he has come today," gushed Abhinav's mother, > Bubli. > Bindra is a proud man. "My Singh is king. The gods have been extremely kind > to us," he said, as he popped open a champagne bottle at his palatial > house, > 20 km from Chandigarh, to celebrate his son's Olympic gold win in the 10m > air rifle event in Beijing on August 11. > > Abhinav's Olympic gold was planned and, in a way, executed at home-for, > hidden among the trees near the house and away from the view of visitors is > a shooting range made to Olympics specifications. Next to it is a fitness > centre. "At 9 a.m., Abhinav would go to the range and return for lunch. At > 2.30 p.m., he would go again and return after four hours. I presume he > would > be going to the health centre from the range," said Surjit Singh Nalwa, > Abhinav's maternal uncle. When Nalwa flew in four months ago and discussed > shooting with his nephew, Abhinav said, "I would like my performance to > speak. I am not going to talk about shooting now." > > Abhinav's paternal aunt Dolly Lamba used to address him 'champ' after he > won > his first gold at a shooting event in Rohtak. When she used the same > endearment a few weeks ago, Abhinav said, "Kahaan bua, main to abhi champ > bana hi nahin (No, I have not become a champion yet)." > > Finally, his gun did the talking. After winning the Olympic gold, he called > up his parents. The cell phone passed from one family member to the other, > each getting just half a minute. Dolly did not get to talk and sent him an > sms: "U've bcom the champ of champions." > > When Abhinav went for the Athens Olympics, where he missed the gold, his > family used to call him up and ask him to come for photo sessions with them > and friends. "This time, we did not go to Beijing or call him or encourage > him to keep his cell phone with him. We realised in Athens that we and > these > gadgets were a distraction," said Bindra, who has been Abhinav's manager, > motivator and financer. "This time he went like an army man on a mission. > It > had to be only Abhinav and the target-Olympic gold." > > Bindra nurtured Abhinav's talent. A son's passion became his father's > dream. > "Cricket, tennis and golf are fashionable and lucrative sports. But in > developed countries, you spot talent and train the sportsman. That is what > I > did," he said proudly. His son, at 17, was the youngest sportsman in the > Sydney Olympics, and Australia released a postage stamp with Abhinav's face > on it. > > Despite Bindra's wealth and contacts, making an Olympic gold medallist of > the boy was not easy. Amid his hectic schedules, he set aside two hours > every day for Abhinav's shooting and for planning his travel. "Nowadays, > transferring money is easy. But when Abhinav was coming up, it was a > problem. There were issues with the income tax department, who wanted to > know why thousands of dollars were being spent on him," he said. "Shooting > is an expensive sport. Abhinav's first gun, a Feinwerkbau, cost around Rs 4 > lakh in 1997. Another problem was availability. We imported the guns and > had > hassles getting licences." > > About 10 years ago, Bindra's business was not doing very well. Animal > rights > activist Maneka Gandhi and the Hindu Mahasabha were demanding the closure > of > his Rs 300-crore meat-processing factory. Entangled in court cases, Bindra > closed the unit for a couple of years, but he did not let Abhinav's > training > suffer. That was when a group of citizens of Chandigarh stepped in to > encourage Abhinav. Advocate M.L. Sareen, income tax expert Chaman Sharma, > businessman Amarjit Sethi and photographer Tejee formed the Abhinav Bindra > Trust. "We did not provide financial support. We tried to change the > Chandigarh administration's mindset with regard to licences, import duties > and such things. We wanted this boy to move up to world-class shooting and > the administration to realise that it was an international sport," said > Sareen. > > Another person receiving congratulatory calls is Abhinav's coach Col. J.S. > Dhillon. On July 13, 1995, Abhinav and his father visited Dhillon. Bindra > wanted him to "teach Abhinav to shoot properly, as he is all over with his > gun." The colonel asked what level of training he wanted. "What is the > highest level of training?" Bindra asked. The Olympics. "We will aim for > the > Olympic gold," Bindra told his son and Dhillon. > > Then colonel said Abhinav would need German rifles, which were not > available > in India. Ten days later, Abhinav came with the Feinwerkbau 300 junior > model > rifle. "Abhinav could not carry the regular rifle. He was a little boy. He > never missed a day and always came five minutes early. He used to come in a > Mercedes with his driver and a servant. Born into luxury, lived in AC > rooms, > never seen flies and mosquitoes, but he was happy to sweat it out, > literally," said Dhillon, adding that Abhinav never complained about > wearing > leather trousers and leather jacket in hot weather. The family got the > makeshift range in the rented house air conditioned only before the Sydney > Olympics. "Children from affluent homes cannot sweat it out. But here was > young Abhinav, standing long hours, even for four hours, holding the > rifle," > said Dhillon. > > Bindra sent his son to a Colorado BBA school only because the city had an > acclaimed training centre for shooting. Abhinav underwent commando training > course in Germany and mental training regimen in South Africa. So was it > training abroad that got him the Olympic gold? Said Bindra: "It is not > national versus international training. It is thanks to God, the > sportsman's > own talent, and regimented training." > > Abhinav owes his composure to his mother, who gave him emotional support. > The focus, aggressive pursuit of a goal, and the hardworking nature may > have > been acquired from his father. "He would come home disappointed when a bird > he was chasing flew off. I would tell him there will be many more, and he > would go off with his gun," said Bubli. Missing the medal in Athens was the > lowest point in his career. "He would say he missed the chance of a > lifetime. I would tell him that if he had got anything at all in Athens, it > would have been a bronze. I kept telling him, 'You are destined to win a > gold'," Bubli said. Abhinav was always the quiet, reserved, polite and shy > type. Long spells of training left him with little time for friends. He was > Mr Chocolate at a school competition, said Abhinav's classmate Deepinder > Kaushal. Often, shooting would take him away from classes. "But Harold > Carvar, principal of St Stephen's School in Chandigarh, made sure that he > could pursue the sport. He even arranged for a special board exam as > Abhinav > was abroad during the ICSE exams," Bubli said. > > For Bindra, the joy goes beyond the medal. "A new chapter has started for > India. Indians focus on cricket and golf. Now they know other forms of > sports, too, can bring India glory," he told a dignitary who had called to > congratulate him. The family is waiting for the return of their shooting > star, to celebrate. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 10:19:33 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 10:19:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <06C490A2-AACF-4AEB-B702-10D65E9A6AE7@sarai.net> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170853g4b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170913x6849bb18w6235b6fdb3349330@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170915mf706882x4adcc210a00d8786@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808171020i6bb975a6rfde562c5ec1da077@mail.gmail.com> <06C490A2-AACF-4AEB-B702-10D65E9A6AE7@sarai.net> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808182149q2e6254ecv1c7ab4628a1515d7@mail.gmail.com> Thank you Shuddha for pointing out that yet another temple "Khirbhawani" still exists.The rest hundreds of temples which have been either ransacked, destroyed or burnt should be forgotten for the sake of proving the "azaadi" movement is secular.. Thsnx for the enlightenment. Regards Pawan Durani On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 11:44 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, > > I watched the debate, and it was carried live, and I did not hear > anyone saying Inshallah, Surely if they had 'screamed' Inshallah, > given that every other shouting voice was heard, we would have heard it. > Since there were several Kashmiri muslims in the studio this evening, > some of whom had lapel mikes, if they had all (or even several of > them) screamed 'Inshallah.' surely, we would have heard. For > instance, there was a young man, identified as Kashmiri muslim, who > was sitting right next to you. I did not hear him say Inshallah, I > did not hear Sajjad Lone, or Muzaffar Beig, say Inshallah. What I did > hear was Mr. Khajuria saying that he would lead marchers towards > Baltal, (now, after the pilgrimage period is over, so he would not be > leading a party of pilgrims), which I surely consider provocative, > and a deliberate raising of the pitch of tension. I do hope that no > Kashmiri is misled by this provocation to try and confront this > 'proposed' march. As that is the deliberate intention. It would be > terrible if the peaceful nature of the protests in Kashmir were to be > destroyed by provocative statements from a BJP politician. It should > be ignored. > > We also heard (at the tail end of the programme) a man who had been > a yatri, who has done seva at the Amarnath shrine, saying that he has > had no problems. If Kashmiri muslims are (all, without exception) as > communal as you seem to suggest, then surely, he would have faced > some problems. We also heard a young Kashmiri pandit who lives in > Srinagar, studies in Kashmir university, who expressed sentiments > that did not align with yours, so clearly, neither Kashmiri Muslims, > nor Kashmiri Pandits, speak in a set of binary voices without any > internal variation. > > Incidentally, your contribution, though brief ( I sincerely hope it > was not edited away, and it did not seem to be, as it was a live > programme) had nothing of consequence to offer by way of a way > forward, all you could speak of was the fact that Amarnath is the > 'last Hindu structure in Kashmir' which is factually incorrect. The > kheer bhawani temple ,and several others, continue to be active, and > actually have been having pilgrims and worshippers coming to them. > > I think you should reflect on the fact that you went out on a major > news channel, live and said something factually incorrect. I am > willing to think that you might have said this in the heat of the > moment, without thought or pause, but do consider the fact that it > does go out as a significant distortion of the truth. > > regards > > Shuddha > > > > > > On 17-Aug-08, at 10:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > An interesting thing just happened. > > > > I'm returning from a NDTV debate (If i can take the liberty to call > > it one) > > on the current developments in J&K. The Panelists included a wide > > range of > > opinions from valley, Jammu and also from here in New Delhi; among > > them > > Abhishek Manu Singhvi, Swapan Das Gupta, Muzafar Baig, Sajad Lone, > > Ashok > > Khajuria, Omar Abdulalh and my friend Sonia Jabbar were the few > > voices. > > > > It was as expected a very heated debate and matters became worse > > when Sajad > > Lone challenged Jammu Samiti and Kashmiri Pandits to claim their > > right on > > the Baltal Land. > > > > At almost the end of the show, BJP's voice from Jammu Ashok > > Khajuria rightly > > said, "Kashmiri Separatists and vested interests want to create a > > Nizam-e-Mustafa" in the valley. To which, the Kashmiri Muslims in > > the studio > > screamed, "Inshallah". > > > > Now, thats what speaks for their Secularism !!! An Islamic State.... > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > wrote: > >> > >> You obviously understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you > >> know what it is trying to say. If only you could go past your ow > >> rhetoric... > >> > >> On 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > >> wrote: > >>> :) > >>> > >>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > >>>> Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् > >>>> विज् < > >> mail at shivamvij.com> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a > >>>>> shopkeeper > >>>>> and you know what you will hear? > >>>>> > >>>>> "We are all terorrists here." > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> best > >>>>> shivam > >>>>> > >>>>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > >>>>>> Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij > >>>>>> शिवम् विज् > >>>> > >>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>> Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not the > >> only > >>>>>>> leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to tone > >> hem > >>>>>>> down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. > >>>>>>> And if > >> you > >>>>>>> talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the > >> Pakistan > >>>>>>> bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various reasons > >> most > >>>>>>> Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal > >>>>>>> elements > >> but > >>>>>>> to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I am > >>>>>>> not > >>>>>>> getting into the chap act of body counts... > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> best > >>>>>>> shivam > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > >>>>>>>> Shivam, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less > >>>> dangerous > >>>>>> than > >>>>>>>> an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa > >> " > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous > >> and > >>>>>> communal > >>>>>>>> movement which has effected even the world super powers. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Pawan > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij > >>>>>>>> शिवम् विज् > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> Dear Sonia, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> This is not the first time you are equating the azadi > >> movement in > >>>>>>>>> Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has already > >>>> laboured > >>>>>>>>> over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that this > >> is a > >>>>>>>>> dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go only so > >> far > >>>> with > >>>>>>>>> it. This generalised comparison helps you label the entire > >> azadi > >>>>>>>>> sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim > >> concerns. > >>>> While > >>>>>>>>> I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the > >> Kashmiri > >>>>>>>>> Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? If > >> it > >>>> was > >>>>>>>>> about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, wouldn't the > >>>> majority > >>>>>>>>> demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent > >> nation-state? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Warmly, > >>>>>>>>> Shivam > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> Hi Shuddha, > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you > >> have > >>>>>> raised. > >>>>>>>> You > >>>>>>>>>> may not have named it as such but the feeling in the valley > >> is > >>>> very > >>>>>> much > >>>>>>>>>> about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence against > >> Muslim > >>>>>> Kashmir > >>>>>>>>>> than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this > >> conclusion > >>>>>> given > >>>>>>>>>> India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying > >> to > >>>> point > >>>>>> out > >>>>>>>> that > >>>>>>>>>> in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and > >> obviously > >>>> not > >>>>>> to > >>>>>>>> accuse > >>>>>>>>>> you of communal thinking. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> I read with some surprise your taking issue with my use of > >> the > >>>>>> phrase, > >>>>>>>>>> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans > >> used > >>>> during > >>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>> protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more but > >> I > >>>> really > >>>>>>>> don¹t > >>>>>>>>>> want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m sure > >> you > >>>>>> remember > >>>>>>>> 1989 > >>>>>>>>>> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar > >>>> argument > >>>>>> when > >>>>>>>>>> challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > >>>> provocative > >>>>>>>> about > >>>>>>>>>> taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is a > >>>> thousand > >>>>>> strong > >>>>>>>> mob > >>>>>>>>>> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities > >> as > >>>> they > >>>>>> did > >>>>>>>> in > >>>>>>>>>> Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police vs. > >> CRPF > >>>>>>>> culpability: > >>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>>> THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police > >> becoming > >>>> the > >>>>>> main > >>>>>>>>>> target of protesters. > >>>>>>>>>> There have also been calls for their social boycott. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> The local population is angry for the police's "brutal > >> conduct > >>>>>> against > >>>>>>>> their > >>>>>>>>>> own people". > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> State police has been active alongside the CRPF to crush > >>>> protests in > >>>>>>>> Kashmir > >>>>>>>>>> over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > >>>> injured. > >>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > >>>> marchers > >>>>>> in > >>>>>>>> Uri > >>>>>>>>>> on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station > >> house > >>>>>> officer of > >>>>>>>>>> Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh Aziz > >> and > >>>> two > >>>>>> others > >>>>>>>>>> were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it > >> was a > >>>>>> target > >>>>>>>>>> killing". > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in Baramullah > >> and > >>>>>> torched > >>>>>>>> it. > >>>>>>>>>> They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such > >> incidents > >>>> have > >>>>>>>> been > >>>>>>>>>> reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called > >> for a > >>>>>> social > >>>>>>>>>> boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of > >> Srinagar's Raj > >>>>>> Bagh > >>>>>>>>>> locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking the > >>>> police > >>>>>>>> "whether > >>>>>>>>>> they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". This > >> is in > >>>>>> stark > >>>>>>>>>> contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were > >> seen > >>>> as > >>>>>>>>>> "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined > >> militancy. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> > >>> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > >>> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> > >> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 19 14:12:01 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 01:42:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] =?utf-8?q?=27=E2=80=98I_have_evidence_of_RSS_and_VH?= =?utf-8?b?UCBtYWtpbmcgYm9tYnPigJkn?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <909267.33381.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Mahmood   1. I am taking the liberty of posting my response in SARAI. It includes your incoming to me   2. I do not know if you are being sarcastic. I will take your incredulity at face value.   Maybe I am simple minded but yes I am serious.   - Terrorists do not show 'kindness', that is why they are called 'terrorists'. It is beyond my credible belief that the 26 Bombs could have been designed to 'not explode' but were meant to serve just a warning by the 'terrorists'. One of  "see we can strike anywhere any time". You would not need '26' for that. Just a couple or another couple more would suffice. It would be absolute idiocy to plant '26' bombs and the run the extensive risk of being discovered as 'planting' the bomb just for the sake of a 'warning' being served   - The locations (up in a tree or hidden behind a shop hoarding for example)  where the '26' were discovered challenges belief that 'terrorists' would allow themselves to be so easily viewed as 'planting' the '26'.   - The ease with which the '26' were discovered within just 2 or 3 days was rather 'amazingly' efficient. The noses were obviously repeatedly and consistently on the right track each single time.   - Not one bomb exploded out of '26'. Hmmmmmmn. Some 'terrorists'. They need to go back to 'school for terrorists'   - The callousness and relaxed and smiling manner with which the 'defusers' were seen handling the bombs suggested that they already knew that the bomb would not explode.   Yes I am suspicious. But yes I am simple minded too.   Kshmendra     --- On Tue, 8/19/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: From: mahmood farooqui Subject: Re: [Reader-list] '‘I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs’' To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2008, 9:25 AM Are you serious. Do you really think so 2008/8/18 Kshmendra Kaul The 26 (was it 26?) Bombs in Surat and not one got triggered off.   Bombs (shown on TV) located at places where the one placing the bomb would be conspicuously visible as being upto 'something'.   All of this (to me) is highly suspicious.   Kshmendra --- On Mon, 8/18/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: [Reader-list] ''I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs'' To: "sarai list" Date: Monday, August 18, 2008, 7:31 PM 'I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs' Senior Congress leader Digvijay Singh attacks the BJP just like Sushma Swaraj attacked the Congress. 'Investigate the timings of the blasts', he tells NEHA DIXIT You have made a statement that serial blasts take place in the country only when the BJP is in trouble. What I have said is that the timing of the bomb blasts is quite uncanny. Why does it always happen when the BJP is in trouble? That needs investigation. I am not charging anyone. What do you mean when you say the BJP is in trouble? When the Tehelka issue was to be discussed in Parliament, the House was adjourned for three days. Then when the expose was to be discussed, the Parliament attack took place. When the Godhra incident took place, Congress was doing exceedingly well in the local body elections and Narendra Modi had won by only 6,000 votes as a chief minister and that too with great difficulty. During the recent Karnataka election, there was a bomb blast in Hubli on the very first day of polling. Similarly, two days before the polling in the second phase in Karnataka elections, there was a bomb blast in Jaipur. It really needs an investigation. Is your statement a response to Sushma Swaraj's accusation against the Centre? No, there is no question of that. I have been citing these instances about the blasts for a long time. But Sushma Swaraj was criticised by the Congress ... Sushma Swaraj alleged that the Congress is involved directly. I have not said that. And does she have any facts? I have facts of RSS, VHP making bombs. Do you have evidences to prove that BJP, VHP and RSS is involved in making bombs. Yes. In fact, in 1992 there was a bomb blast in the VHP office in Madhya Pradesh, where one VHP member died and two were injured while making bombs. Then in 2002, there was a bomb blast in a temple in Mhow. When the police arrested the VHP activists after investigation, they confessed that they were even given training to manufacture bombs. I have a videocassette of that confession. Again, in 2006, in Nanded, there was a bomb blast in the house of a RSS activist where two RSS activists died. After that in March 2008, there were bomb blasts at two places in Tamil Nadu. Then too VHP activists were arrested by the Tamil Nadu police who confessed that they were involved. And how did the Gujarat police suddenly find eighteen bombs planted on trees in Surat? So are you saying that the BJP is behind the recent serial blasts? No, I am not saying anything. All that I am saying is that the timing is uncanny. RSS, VHP activists have been caught making bombs, material for preparing bombs have been found at their office and there are three-four clear cases where they have been arrested and a case has been registered. Why isn't anyone looking into this?. Shouldn't all parties unite against terrorism? Absolutely, but when you target only Muslims, it's not correct. Then why is the blame-game still on? It is on because we have evidence to say that people who talk about nationalism and nationalist feelings should not be involved in making bombs. The BJP believes in divisive politics. They cannot survive without dividing Hindus and Muslims. Each time something happens, they come back to Hindutva. >From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 33, Dated Aug 23, 2008 http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne230808Incoldblood.asp _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 19 15:02:47 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 02:32:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Geelani demands merger of J&K with Pakistan Message-ID: <753715.30641.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Here is another one for those shameless Indians who have in the past and continue to support the separatists in Kashmir in their so called "Secular movement for Independence" of "Azadi", "Hurriyat", "Freedom".   Kshmendra       Geelani calls for Kashmir's merger with Pak Press Trust of India Monday, August 18, 2008 (Srinagar)    Hardline separatist leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani Monday demanded the merger of Jammu and Kashmir with Pakistan, as leaders of the moderate Hurriyat faction spoke about independence and a dialogue over the state, triggering a leadership and ideological clash in the Muslim-dominated valley. Tens of thousands of Muslim Kashmiris marched towards a United Nations office here amid heavy security arrangements, demanding UN intervention to solve the more than 60-year-old Kashmir dispute. Demonstrators shouting "We Want Freedom", "Aiy zaalimo, aiy kaafiro, Kashmir hamara chhod do" (Tyrants and oppressors, leave our Kashmir), as they marched past police barricades near the UN Military Observer Group in India and Pakistan (UNMOGIP) office in the summer capital Srinagar. Addressing the mammoth gathering at the Tourist Reception Centre here, octogenarian Geelani said there was "no solution to the Kashmir issue other than merger with Pakistan". "We are Pakistanis and Pakistan is us because we are tied with the country through Islam," he roared, as the crowd cheered and chanted along with him: "Hum Pakistani hain, Pakistan hamara hai" (We are Pakistanis, Pakistan is ours). Much to the "ugly surprise" of the moderate Hurriyat leaders, who were sharing the stage with him, Geelani said the leadership issue of the Kashmiri separatist movement was "solved today". "Do you have faith in my leadership? I will be faithful to you till my death and will carry everyone along," he said, as the crowd applauded him shouting in unison "zaroor" (certainly). Moderate Hurriyat leader Mirwaiz Umar Farooq in his speech earlier called for a trilateral dialogue over Jammu and Kashmir, whose ownership is disputed by India and Pakistan who claim the region in full but rule in parts. "We ask India to start a dialogue over Kashmir, open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road for trade and release all Kashmiris in Indian jails," he said. Muzaffarabad is the capital of Pakistan-administered Kashmir. Pro-independence leader Yasin Malik said that Kashmiris want "complete freedom" - implying from both India and Pakistan. "Is paar bhi lenge azadi, us paar bhi lenge azadi" (we will free both Kashmirs) was Malik's slogan, as the crowd also cheered him. However, Geelani countered their remarks saying all these issues would be solved once Kashmiris get their right to self-determination and merge with Pakistan. The two factions of the Hurriyat Conference had been at loggerheads but got united when the Kashmir Valley saw protests against the transfer of government land to the Amarnath shrine management two months ago. The state government cancelled the order - provoking protests in Jammu region and triggering an unprecedented communal divide in the state. The Jammu agitation revived protests in the Valley that have snowballed into anti-India protests reigniting calls for Kashmir's independence. Violent protests last week killed at least 22 Muslim demonstrators, including a senior separatist leader. UNMOGIP is one of the oldest UN missions and monitors a 1949 ceasefire line dividing Kashmir between India and Pakistan. Hurriyat supporters travelled in cars, buses, and on motorcycles carrying green flags, as police and paramilitary troopers, asked to exercise maximum restraint, looked on. Geelani's leadership claim and pro-Pakistan slogans have led to a bickering between the two factions of the Hurriyat that were joining hands after the separatist conglomerate broke up in August 2003. A moderate Hurriyat leader said it was Geelani's dream to emerge as the "king of Kashmir". "But if you cannot carry the load of sanity, you have no right to live not to talk of leading people," said the separatist leader, speaking on condition of anonymity given the "precarious" situation in the separatist camp. "One who seeks leadership, don't make him a leader," the separatist leader quoted a saying of the Prophet to challenge Geelani's claim. "About Geelani's claim and today's rally and sloganeering, I have kept my lips sealed. I am not going to speak to anybody about it," Abdul Gani Bhat, former chairman and spokesman of the moderate Hurriyat, said.   http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/StoryPrint.aspx?ID=NEWEN20080062037&ch=633547534103310000   ALSO AT   http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20080818/818/tnl-geelani-calls-for-merger-with-pakist.html     From arshad.mcrc at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 15:19:39 2008 From: arshad.mcrc at gmail.com (arshad amanullah) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:19:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: invitation-documentary screenings In-Reply-To: <314613.95698.qm@web34507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <314613.95698.qm@web34507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2076f31d0808190249q700b678aj41d820fa5b2b9007@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Ajay Bhardwaj Date: Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 2:02 PM Subject: invitation-documentary screenings To: Ajay Bhardwaj Dear Friend: You are invited to the screening of my documentaries in the following film festivals being held in Delhi later this month. Ajay 1. Rabba Hun Kee Kariye - Thus Departed Our Neighbours By Ajay Bhardwaj/ 65 minutes/with English Subtitles/2007 Festival: Travelling Film South Asia 2008 Venue: India International Centre, Auditorium, New Delhi Time: Thursday 28th August, 7.30pm Synopsis Rabba Hun Kee Kariye trails a shared history of Punjab - a culture, language and a way of life- that was torn asunder in the fateful year of 1947. It captures the documentary maker's almost unexpected encounter with feelings of guilt and remorse about the genocidal violence of the partition. These informal tales, almost like folklore, are strewn across the memory-scape of Punjabi countryside. Through this documentary these long suppressed experiences become accessible for debate in public domain for the first time. 2. Of Land, Labour and Love By Ajay Bhardwaj / 65 minutes/with English Subtitles/2008 Festival: Jeevika South Asia Documentary Film Festival Venue: Casuarina Hall, India Habitat Centre, New Delhi Time: Friday 29th August, 2.20 pm Synopsis Of Land, Labour and Love captures the irony of the lives of the tribal people of Dasmanthpur block in Koraput district.of Southern Orissa. A hilly, upland terrain rich in diversity of crops, however, its people suffer chronic malnutrition and ill-health. In their midst, Ama Sangathan, a federation of tribal women's organisations, strives to find new ways by which they can equip themselves to restore their fragile eco system. A system eroded by the felling of trees, a callous government and years of exploitation of its people. But this is just a beginning and the countervailing forces are still strong... From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 19 15:32:50 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:32:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow In-Reply-To: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> This has happened after the BJP's press conference yesterday morning that the BJP is going to conduct a mass nationwide campaign of which the jail bharo andolan will be central to. The BJP seems to have made up its mind that after Ram, Shiva is going to be their favourite deity. best shivam On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 9:31 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > *Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow* > > *Link - **http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660* > > THE TWO month long Amarnath agitation has not lost momentum in Jammu region > and despite life remaining paralysed for the last 50 days, the enthusiasm > and support to the agitation has not withered. Continuing their strong > protests against the Amarnath land transfer order, around two-lakh people on > Monday (August 18) responded to the *Jail Bharo* call of the Shree Amarnath > Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS). > > People from all across the region came out of their homes in the morning in > overwhelming numbers and courted arrest as a mark of protest against the > land order. > > > According to reports, large number of people gathered in Jammu city, > Udhampur, Kathua, Hiranagar and Reasi and other major towns and villages on > the call of the SAYSS, which is spearheading the agitation. > > > In the morning today, around 10 000 people gathered at City Chowk in Jammu > city and took out a procession. Chanting 'Bum Bum Bole' the protesters > passed through main roads of the city and reached the city chowk police > station and asked the cops to arrest them. > > > This was carried out in all the 16 police stations of Jammu city, with > thousands of protesters shouting slogans against the state administration > and governor N N Vohra. The protesters were later taken to MAM stadium and > other schools and colleges, which were turned into jails for the time being. > > > > Udhampur city witnessed a huge turnout and the situation turned violent > after protesters clashed with security personnel. Police resorted to lathi > charge and tear gas shells were fired to control the protesters, who were > demanding the ouster of governor N N Vohra and return of the Amarnath land. > > > A large turnout was also reported in Samba and Kathua districts, but the > protests remained largely peaceful and there was no report of any untoward > incident. > > > Meanwhile, Shree Amarnath Sangarsh Samiti (SASS) termed the response to the > *Jail Bharo* andolan as overwhelming and said it was a historic day for the > people of Jammu. Brigadier Suchet Singh, speaking to *merinews*, claimed > that more than three lakh people had participated in today's *Jail > Bharo*andolan. > > > Singh also criticised the state administration for failing to provide even > basic facilities in the makeshift prisons. "The state did not even provide > water to the agitating people," he said, adding that the people of Jammu > have entered into a do or die mode and will not stop till their goal is > achieved. > > > This agitation has the support of the rich and poor and cuts across > religious and regional lines, Singh asserted, "Abhi nahi to Kabhi nahi" this > is the war cry of the people. Criticizing the Union government for its > appeasement policy, Singh alleged that government is delaying a decision in > the hope that this agitation will peter off. "This is a people's movement > and will achieve its goal," he said. India is concerned only about the > Hurriyat and Kashmiris and it will not be tolerated at any cost. > > Warning that the agitation could further intensify and mode of action could > change, Singh asked the Union government to realise its mistakes and take > corrective action otherwise there could be more unrest and trouble. > > > The Samiti leaders also registered their strong resentment against certain > sections of the national media, which they said were portraying the > agitation as communal and sectarian. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 19 15:37:59 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:37:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808190307o6ecffa76kc378b1a88f8f7900@mail.gmail.com> BJP to intensify Amarnath land agitation 19 Aug, 2008, 0425 hrs IST, ET Bureau http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/BJP_to_intensify_land_agitation/articleshow/3378947.cms NEW DELHI: The BJP on Monday decided to intensify its campaign for the restoration of land to the Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board, unveiling a calendar of agitational programmes across the country to mobilise public opinion on the issue, described as one embodying the ``nationalists versus separatists'' tussle. A meeting of central officebearers held here on Monday evening, which coincided with the commencement of the jail bharo agitation launched by the Shri Amarnath Yatra Sangharsh Samiti (SAYSS) in Jammu, took stock of the situation prevailing in Jammu and Kashmir. BJP general secretary Arun Jaitley, who was a member of the all-party delegation that visited the troubled state earlier this month, briefed his party colleagues about the outcome of his interactions with the central and state governments, and various other stakeholders. The party decided to express its solidarity with the agitationists in Jammu by deputing its prime ministerial candidate L K Advani and president Rajnath Singh to attend a rally organised by the SAYSS in J&K's winter capital on August 25. The saffron outfit simultaneously announced that it'd hold its own version of jail bharo agitation in all district headquarters on August 21. In keeping with the importance assigned to the Amarnath land row by the BJP, the meeting took the unusual step of passing a resolution on the subject. The document made a scathing attack on the Manmohan Singh government for its handling of the situation in the state, while, at the same time, it saluted the people of Jammu for carrying out a peaceful and democratic movement for the redressal of their grievances. It also condemned the resolution passed by the Pakistani national assembly on the developments in the Valley and the utterances on the issue by leading figures of the country's ruling coalition. The resolution also appealed to the ``nationalist elements'' in the valley to rise to the occasion and speak out firmly against voices of secession, which are being encouraged by forces from across the border. The saffron outfit put the blame for the current situation in the state on the UPA government. ``The way in which the ruling coalition at the Centre has responded to the developments in J&K is a disturbing reminder of the manner in which the Congress has dealt with the Kashmir problem since Independence. Most of the initiatives taken by the Congress over the years in the state have ended up only in emboldening the separatist and anti-India sentiments,'' the resolution stated. The party, thus, found it not surprising at all that the UPA government meekly surrendered before the separatist in just a week's time by cancelling the Amarnath land-transfer order, but did not deem it fit to talk to the SAYSS leaders for a full 38 days. The BJP demanded that the Centre take immediate steps to undo the situation. ``As a first step, the notification cancelling the land-allotment order be withdrawn forthwith,'' the party maintained. On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > This has happened after the BJP's press conference yesterday morning > that the BJP is going to conduct a mass nationwide campaign of which > the jail bharo andolan will be central to. The BJP seems to have made > up its mind that after Ram, Shiva is going to be their favourite > deity. > > best > shivam > > > > On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 9:31 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: >> *Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow* >> >> *Link - **http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660* >> >> THE TWO month long Amarnath agitation has not lost momentum in Jammu region >> and despite life remaining paralysed for the last 50 days, the enthusiasm >> and support to the agitation has not withered. Continuing their strong >> protests against the Amarnath land transfer order, around two-lakh people on >> Monday (August 18) responded to the *Jail Bharo* call of the Shree Amarnath >> Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS). >> >> People from all across the region came out of their homes in the morning in >> overwhelming numbers and courted arrest as a mark of protest against the >> land order. >> >> >> According to reports, large number of people gathered in Jammu city, >> Udhampur, Kathua, Hiranagar and Reasi and other major towns and villages on >> the call of the SAYSS, which is spearheading the agitation. >> >> >> In the morning today, around 10 000 people gathered at City Chowk in Jammu >> city and took out a procession. Chanting 'Bum Bum Bole' the protesters >> passed through main roads of the city and reached the city chowk police >> station and asked the cops to arrest them. >> >> >> This was carried out in all the 16 police stations of Jammu city, with >> thousands of protesters shouting slogans against the state administration >> and governor N N Vohra. The protesters were later taken to MAM stadium and >> other schools and colleges, which were turned into jails for the time being. >> >> >> >> Udhampur city witnessed a huge turnout and the situation turned violent >> after protesters clashed with security personnel. Police resorted to lathi >> charge and tear gas shells were fired to control the protesters, who were >> demanding the ouster of governor N N Vohra and return of the Amarnath land. >> >> >> A large turnout was also reported in Samba and Kathua districts, but the >> protests remained largely peaceful and there was no report of any untoward >> incident. >> >> >> Meanwhile, Shree Amarnath Sangarsh Samiti (SASS) termed the response to the >> *Jail Bharo* andolan as overwhelming and said it was a historic day for the >> people of Jammu. Brigadier Suchet Singh, speaking to *merinews*, claimed >> that more than three lakh people had participated in today's *Jail >> Bharo*andolan. >> >> >> Singh also criticised the state administration for failing to provide even >> basic facilities in the makeshift prisons. "The state did not even provide >> water to the agitating people," he said, adding that the people of Jammu >> have entered into a do or die mode and will not stop till their goal is >> achieved. >> >> >> This agitation has the support of the rich and poor and cuts across >> religious and regional lines, Singh asserted, "Abhi nahi to Kabhi nahi" this >> is the war cry of the people. Criticizing the Union government for its >> appeasement policy, Singh alleged that government is delaying a decision in >> the hope that this agitation will peter off. "This is a people's movement >> and will achieve its goal," he said. India is concerned only about the >> Hurriyat and Kashmiris and it will not be tolerated at any cost. >> >> Warning that the agitation could further intensify and mode of action could >> change, Singh asked the Union government to realise its mistakes and take >> corrective action otherwise there could be more unrest and trouble. >> >> >> The Samiti leaders also registered their strong resentment against certain >> sections of the national media, which they said were portraying the >> agitation as communal and sectarian. >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 19 15:49:25 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:49:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808190307o6ecffa76kc378b1a88f8f7900@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808190307o6ecffa76kc378b1a88f8f7900@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808190319j68196663k933edd39aac9d706@mail.gmail.com> 'Now, people are leading the leaders' Krishnakumar P & Mukhtar Ahmad | August 18, 2008 08:24 IST http://www.rediff.com/news/2008/aug/18amar.htm Agitations in Kashmir are no more about the Amarnath land row or the alleged economic blockade imposed on the Valley, hitting the fruit industry. From the silent merchant, who sports a black flag on the counter, to the slogan-shouting masked youth driving around town with green flags, the protests are all about freedom now. After the staggering turnout for the funeral of senior Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz in Pampore on Saturday, leaders of the separatist groups say they no more have any say in the scheme of things and it is the people who are leading them. "To be very honest, we never expected such a response. Now even our leaders do not know what to do," senior Hurriyat leader Shahid ul-Islam said. "Even on the day Aziz was killed, our leaders were under house arrest. People came in droves and dragged them out. There is nothing our leaders can do now. We have realized that the people won't listen to us even if we ask them to stop this. There is nothing we can do except appealing to the protestors to carry on in a peaceful manner," he said. Asked if Hurriyat leaders had any solution to restore normalcy in the Valley, Shahid said the leaders are trying to first channelize the protests and then take it forward from there. "The only thing we can do as of now is to channelize the protests and ensure that things remain peaceful and don't get out of hand," he said, adding that the first step is to internationalise the issue with the march to the office of the United Nations Military Observers Group on Monday. "We have to take our message to the world," he said. The sight of people from all walks of life spilling out on to the streets of the Valley has stumped even those who believe nothing will change in the Valley. "Initially I thought this was another gimmick by the politicians. But when I saw the response to the Pampore rally, I was convinced that this is a people's movement," said Mohammed Sharif Baig, who is in the construction business. The moment he saw the Pampore rally, he bought tickets for his workers from Bihar and other places outside the state and asked them to go home. "I realized normalcy wont return very soon to the Valley now. This has gone out of the hands of the politicians and the people have taken over. There was no point keeping my workers here," said Baig. He had earlier been cursing the agitation. My company was involved in the construction of a hotel, a bridge, a wall and a road. All the work came to a halt. I was suffering huge losses on a daily basis. I had no fuel for my cars and had to use the driver's scooter. I was totally against those who had started this agitation. "But when I see so many people braving the security forces that killed 25 people in two days, I no longer am bothered about business. This time I want something to come off it," he said. Many others agree that the recent protests are unprecedented. "This is more important than the days when people believed in the gun and took to arms," said Shahid, himself a former militant. "I was one of those who believed in the gun in those days. But now when I see these people on the streets, I think they are more courageous and also believe in change now," he said. Hotelier Gowahar Mir agreed: "These protests were totally unexpected. And the most important thing is that these people are not armed. They are out on the streets and raising slogans. Whoever is organizing this, has to be appreciated for ensuring that the protestors do not resort to violence," Mir said. The administration has also suffered a lot from the week-long spell of agitation. First, they were criticised for their alleged highhandedness in handling the march to Muzaffarabad. Following the criticism and the transfer of the IG, they had to cede the edge to the protestors, inadvertently, emboldening the mischief mongers. With the public mood favouring another march to Muzaffarabad following Monday's march to the UN office situated in a sensitive area, the administration is sitting with its fingers crossed. From monica at sarai.net Tue Aug 19 11:31:13 2008 From: monica at sarai.net (Monica Narula) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 11:31:13 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] One-minute-film festival Message-ID: Orange County, CA – August 5, 2008 – PassionForCinema.com, a leading independent voice on the Internet for filmfanatics and filmmakers from around the world, has announced its Call for Entries for the second annual PFCOne FilmFestival, a pioneering online festival featuring one-minute movies.The entry period for PFCOne runs from August 5, 2008 through October 31, 2008, and all films submitted will screen onthe PassionForCinema.com Website between December 1 and December 5, 2008. PFCOne is a juried festival with prizes including film and screenwriting internships with prominent directors and writersworking on the forefront of Indian cinema.The mission of PassionForCinema.com is to encourage anyone who has ever dreamed of making a film to do so, and tosubmit that film to the PFCOne festival to share with other film lovers. PassionForCinema.com invites everyone to createa one-minute movie shot with a mobile phone, camcorder, digital or movie camera, or any other device which can capturemotion pictures. Animated, digital, and other alternative-format films are also encouraged. Confirmed jurors for 2008 include:Shashank Ghosh (director Waisa Bhi Hota Hain Part II, Quick Gun Murugan, Mumbai Cutting)Amol Gupte (writer Taare Zameen Par)Nishikant Kamat (director Mumbai Meri Jaan, Dombivili Fast) Anurag Kashyap (director No Smoking, Black Friday, Paanch)Christina Marouda (President - The Indian Film Festival of Los Angeles)Hansal Mehta (director Woodstock Villa, Jayate, Dil Pe Mat Le Yaar, Chhal)Shridhar Raghavan (writer Khakee, Bluffmaster, Chandni Chowk to China)Sriram Raghavan (writer/ director Ek Hasina Thi, Johnny Gaddaar)Revathy (actress and director Mumbai Cutting, Phir Milenge, Mitr My Friend)Navdeep Singh (director Manorama Six Feet Under)Suparn Verma (director Acid Factory, Ek Khiladi Ek Haseena, writer Chhal) Many of the jurors will offer internships and other hands-on opportunities as prizes to this year's participants. The 2008 PFCOne Film Festival also inaugurates The Kieslowski Award, sponsored by Hansal Mehta. Hansal Mehta will personally select one filmmaker and offer production and financial assistance to remake his or her entire one minute movie in Super 16 or HD format. Mr Mehta will produce the film, and PassionForCinema.com will work with the filmmaker to submit and present the film to various world-wide festivals. To see the complete list of jurors, awards, and details on PFCOne, visit: http://passionforcinema.com/pfcone2008/– more – PassionForCinema.com went online in September 2006 as a community website designed to bring together cinema lovers to review and discuss movies, movie related events, movie personalities, personal opinions, and to share personalknowledge on technical aspects of the medium. It has since grown to become an influential voice for leading edge filmmakers and directors in Indian cinema, as well as an important source of news, editorial content, and movie reviews related to Indian and world cinema.For more information on the PFCOne Film Festival and PassionForCinema.com, please visit us on the Internet athttp://PassionForCinema.com. Monica Narula Raqs Sarai-CSDS 29 Rajpur Road Delhi 110 054 www.raqsmediacollective.net www.sarai.net _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From rahulroy63 at gmail.com Sat Aug 16 13:51:03 2008 From: rahulroy63 at gmail.com (Rahul Roy) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2008 13:51:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] [DFA NewsLetter] Fwd: Calling from Dhaka for a Bangladeshi Film to be screened in Delhi Festival... In-Reply-To: <4a0aa1b2-5937-4324-ad09-1f9699de2057@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com> References: <4a0aa1b2-5937-4324-ad09-1f9699de2057@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Date: Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:46 AM Subject: Calling from Dhaka for a Bangladeshi Film to be screened in Delhi Festival... To: delhifilmarchive+owner at googlegroups.com Cc: sara at grameenphone.com Subject: Invitation on the occasion of a Bangladeshi film being screened in South Asian Film Festival, Delhi Dear Sir, We are very pleased to inform you that STORIES OF CHANGE, a documentary by us (Kamar Ahmad Simon & Sara Afreen) has been selected in this year's Jeevika: South Asia Livelihood Documentary Festival, due from 28th - 31st August 2008 at Indian Habitat Centre, Delhi. We would be very glad if you can attend & encourage us on the occasion along with your friends. With warm regards. Simon & Sara - -- Film Maker & Architect Cell: +88 01713200718, +88 01711081265 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- STORIES OF CHANGE, a documentary by Simon & Sara SYNOPSIS: A testament to the resilience of human spirit, STORIES OF CHANGE is a real life documentary about the lives of 5 women aging from 16 to 60, coming from different walks of life, from different profession, religion and regions of Bangladesh. Different yet common in their dreams, these women face life's challenges with confidence and belief in their dreams. Knitted in 5 small shorts, STORIES OF CHANGE takes us to a 6th story, unlike a cliché stereo-type, a distinct yet universal struggle of human existence. STORIES OF CHANGE travels through Bangladesh, through its hills, rivers and lanes, through generations, following the narratives of a 16-year-old cricketer to a 60-year-old activist. Together it attempts to portray a different picture of Bangladeshi women - of women who dare to dream! Please visit www.storiesofchange.net for more information about the film. We are also very glad to inform you that this year Jeevika received 101 entries from students and professional film makers from various countries including India, Pakistan, Nepal, Bangladesh, United States and Iran for the Jeevika. STORIES OF CHANGE is among the 17 shortlisted documentary to be screened at Jeevika 2008 Festival. To see the list of shortlisted films, please visit: www.jeevika.org - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Occassion: Jeevika: South Asia Livelihood Documentary Festival 2008 Film Title: STORIES OF CHANGE Genre: Documentary Length: 55 Minutes Time & Date: 17:20, 30th August 2008 Venue: Casuarina Hall, India Habitat Centre, Delhi - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Organizer: Centre for Civil Society Program Manager: Manoj Mathew (98 9930 7456) Program Assistant: Raunak Ahmad (9911795621) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- EXTERNAL LINKS Official Site: http://www.storiesofchange.net/ The Daily Star Review: http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27847 The New Age Review: http://www.newagebd.com/2008/mar/21/mar21/xtra_also1.html Adhunika, New York Show: http://adhunika.org/blog/ Stories of Change/ Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stories_of_Change Jeevika Short Listing 2008: http://www.jeevika.org/ - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (c) BEGINNING, All rights reserved. Beginning Production Ltd. 2001-2008. Dream Apartment, Flat B1, Plot 3G, Road 104, Gulshan 2, Dhaka 1212, Bangladesh Cell: +88 01713200718, Phone: +88 02 8817921, +88 02 8861055 www.beginningproduction.com, info at beginningproduction.com - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Please DO NOT REPLY to the sender. To contact the MODERATOR: delhifilmarchive [at] gmail.com To UNSUBSCRIBE: send an email to delhifilmarchive-unsubscribe at googlegroups.com More OPTIONS are on the web: http://groups.google.com/group/delhifilmarchive Our WEBSITE: www.delhifilmarchive.org -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 16:41:25 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 16:41:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Say No to Software Patents - Candle light vigil in Bangalore Message-ID: <35f96d470808190411g50f53a9er51dde594992d2f3c@mail.gmail.com> Saturday August 23, 2008 from 5:30pm - 8:00pm In front of Town Hall, Corporation Circle, Bangalore Software patents are rejected by Indian Parliament in 2005 (Patent Amendment bill 2005). But Indian Government is now trying to push it through back door by bringing a Patent manual. Public consultations on this draft manual is going on in various metros in India. Bangalore Consultation is scheduled for August. 27th The Candle light vigil to "Say No To Software Patents" is a occasion to raise civil society voice against this back door trojan to Indian patent system. On 23rd August 2008 in front of Town Hall near Corporation Circle, Bangalore. Publicity campaigns will be hosted in various places on 22nd. http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Say_No_To_Software_Patents for more details on this event Facebook event page : http://www.new.facebook.com/event.php?eid=27662916862 ( join &invite your friends!) Upcomming http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/1022228 From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 19 16:57:04 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 04:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808161350o17cc7a96l1ab8c304de7411f6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <446486.69957.qm@web57211.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Aarti   Ethical must be Legal. Legal must be Ethical. If this basic principle is not adhered to then there is a flawed interpretation of either the Legal or the Ethical. Worse still is the possibility that the 'accepted and adhered to or propagated' Ethics or the Legality might in themselves be corrupted.   Left to individual interpretation, "Ethics" of  particular relationships, could and often do find themselves varyingly defined. When such varying definitions are pertinent to inter-personal or inter-transactional situations, the quality of the relationship gets defined.   In what was being discussed, we must focus on 'societal Ethics'. Such "Ethics" that permeate through and get defined for all of the society. These must find themselves reflected in the "Laws", in the "Legal". So, 'Ethical' must be 'Legal' and the 'Legal' must be 'Ethical'.   The 'Legal' gets defined by the 'Laws'. The "Laws" derive themselves either directly from the 'Constitution' or from Legislation as allowed for in the "Constitution".   Therefore, yes certainly Ethical must be seamlessly identifiable with the Legal. What do you find 'frightening' in this?   You could argue that aspects of the Indian Constitution are not Ethical and therefore the Laws and Legality derived from them are not Ethical. Those then need to be rectified once you identify them. No such specific examples come readily to my mind. You might have some.   I would readily agree with you if you and I find common our examples of where the Lawful or the Legal does not seem to Ethical. But, your and my views would always be subservient to how the Constitution views such Laws or Legalities. Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice) that finds itself reflected in the Constitution or the Laws and Legalities derived from it.   You might be resentful of and confrontational against and constantly questioning of the "State". I am not. We the people are the "State". That should be seamless. If you said it is not always so, I would agree. But there is no lack of opportunity or means for making it so. Is'nt that what Democracy is all about.   The 'categories' that the 'state' gives us, are "categories" that 'we the people' have made as having been participants in the formation, running and conduct of the "State".   What is in any case wrong with the "categories" you have quoted.   Are the Police the "Guardians of the Law"? Yes they are. Are those who break the Law, the 'law breakers'? Yes they are. Are those who confront the Police, the "hoodlums"? Yes they are.   Again it could be argued that in India, the Police are not always (in fact often are not I would say) the "Guardians of the Law". That the Police in India have the propensity for 'unlimited terror'. Agreed.  That needs to be worked upon by 'we the People' and rectified. But that cannot be used as an excuse to provide a blanket immunity to or indemnify the "hoodlums" and "law breakers".    Enough of my simple minded theorising. Let us come to the specifics of where this discussion started.   In the case of both the "Jammu Agitation" and the "Kashmir Agitation", the agitationists acted at varying times in varying ways as "hoodlums" and as "law breakers". The Police, the "Guardians of Law" were justified in acting against them.   There is of course the question of "use of force beyond the requirement of the situation". Both the "Jammu Agitationists" and the "Kashmir Agitationists" are complaining about that. This has to be, must be, addressed and rectified. Not an excuse though for there being an 'open season' for the 'hoodlums' and 'law breakers'   Kshmendra   PS. Since I mentioned "Democracy", I must also say that India follows a convoluted interpretation of "Democracy". The 'first past the post' system that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be rectified. But, thats another story.   --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: From: Aarti Sethi Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures To: "mahmood farooqui" Cc: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 2:20 AM Dear Kshmendra, I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a "law-breaker" who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening this sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its capacity for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. best A On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: mahmood farooqui > Date: 2008/8/14 > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > > > Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the responses > are making me think. > > Best, > Mahmood > > 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul > > Dear Mahmood > > > > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. You are trying > > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. > > > > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum > > attacking a policeman. > > > > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. If > > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or > > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured by > > police firing. > > > > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal. > > > > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums in > > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? > > > > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, one where > law > > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one > where > > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. > > > > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the photographs, > one > > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' tinge > > > > Kshmendra > > > > > > > > > > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui >*wrote: > > > > From: mahmood farooqui > > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > > To: "sarai list" , "Aamir Bashir" < > > unattore1 at gmail.com> > > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > > > > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because of > the > > police firing. > > > > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan Times, > > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a Kashmiri. > > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the > police. > > > > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the police > > firing. > > > > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > > > > Is the poser itself simplistic? > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 17:02:16 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:02:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Say No To Software Patents Message-ID: <35f96d470808190432g35f3e67cw1eb83b8081def0ab@mail.gmail.com> *The Scenario* To help people who file patent applications, indian patent office is writing a manual. Its draft is what is being discussed. this draft is not only about software, but about how to file patents in general the draft does say clearly that 'software per se is not patentable' as per the law. However, the instructions given in the manual clearly tell people that you can file software patents in combination with hardware.what we have to do is to not let that interpretation go under 3(k). Please see sectiion 4 for non-patentable items. and read the relevant sections. (I attached it at the end of the mail) Previously the industry tried to change the law by a presidential ordinance but parliament rejected it. That should be our argument. How can the manual try to enable a possibility that law forbids? and most important: Software does not work unless in combination with hardware. Therefore, if software in combination with hardware is patentable, then all software is patentable. That is absurd. This is the strongest argument to not make such statements in the manual and we should interpret such attempts as equivalent to backdoor entries to abuse the law Those industries who are pushing this through backdoor must be informed that: 1. Software is already protected under copyright, and no additional protection either to individuals or industries is required 2. Hardware innovations are already patentable under the regular innovations therefore all innovators are already covered 3.The current ICT revolution happened is a fact on the face that we do not need any more encouragement to the innovators and keep science and technology under public domain V.R Krishna Iyyer comments as follows in his response to Patent Office "neither the controller nor the central government has authority or sanction of law to publish a manual of the kind put on the website". * Software patents in India as per Clause 3(k) of the Indian Patent Act* We find that the Draft Patent Manual seeks to introduce software patents and we believe that this is not in consonance with the current legal situation India where Clause 3(k) of the Indian Patent Act clearly says, "A mathematical or business method or a computer programme per se or algorithms are not patentable". You may recall that the Patent Amendment Act 2005 sought to introduce software patents. The amendment proposed in the Patent Amendment Act 2005 for Clause 3(k) was, "a computer programme per se other than its technical application to industry or a combination with hardware; a mathematical method or a business method or algorithms." However, this amendment was rejected by the Indian Parliament, which chose to retain Clause 3(k) as it is. On reviewing the Draft Patent Manual, we find that it seeks to make technical applications of software patentable. As you can see from the above, this approach was explicitly rejected by the Indian Parliament. The relevant section of the Draft says: Draft Manual 4.11.7 4.A mathematical method is one which is carried out on numbers and provides a result in numerical form (the mathematical method or algorithm therefore being merely an abstract concept prescribing how to operate on the numbers) and not patentable. However, its application may well be patentable, for example, in Vicom/Computer-related invention [1987] 1 OJEPO 14 (T208/84) the invention concerned a mathematical method for manipulating data representing an image, leading to an enhanced digital image. Claims to a method of digitally filtering data performed on a conventional general purpose computer were rejected, since those claims were held to define an abstract concept not distinguished from a mathematical method. However, claims to a method of image processing which used the mathematical method to operate on numbers representing an image can be allowed. The reasoning was that the image processing performed was a technical (i.e. non- excluded) process which related to technical quality of the image and that a claim directed to a technical process in which the method used does not seek protection for the mathematical method as such. Therefore the allowable claims as such went beyond a mathematical method. Those interested in reading the Full text of Section 3(k) relating to software patents can check: http://osindia.blogspot.com/2008/08/full-text-of-section-3k-relating-to.html The full Draft Patent Manual is at: http://ipindia.nic.in/ipr/patent/DraftPatent_Manual_2008.pdf Let us work together and defeat this menace. ~ Regards Anivar From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Tue Aug 19 17:10:03 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 16:40:03 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] =?windows-1252?q?=27=91I_have_evidence_of_RSS_and_V?= =?windows-1252?q?HP_making_bombs=92=27?= In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808180701t4826636at25812d309516e06a@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808180701t4826636at25812d309516e06a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Shivam, the issue with some of the politicians is that they crave for spotlight at any cost, at times mouthing half truths and total untruths. such leaders are there in all political parties. Poor Sushma Swaraj sidelines after her valiant "fight' against Sonia is hurt and even if she tells something which is not backed by facts, she has some time on visual media.? As to Diggi raja, he is lost cause of Congress, and Indian national Congress is pale shadow of what it is now of what it was in 1984. All those capable leaders are either eliminated or sidelined by design or "accidents" a la, as that of a scindia and rajesh Pilot. Now the likes of Moily, janardhana poojary, maggi alva Ambika Soni and many more are discarded by the electorate and they are permanent fixtures in court of Sonia thanks to their sycophancy and loyalty to the first family. Shivraj Patil, Krishna S M, Antony and Bharadwaj along with many MPs of rajyasabha alongwith likes of Shindhe and ex governors and ex CECs are there to give comic relief to the prince in waiting as the country has a Pm who has lost the trust of the nation with notes to vote. general elections that will come in few months will be nightmare for all poll pandits as divided polity of vote communes can throw up regional and fuedal gang lords for the democratic rule of the nation and idealogy and principles will go for a toss with good governace of democratic life.! Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Date: Monday, August 18, 2008 7:31 pm Subject: [Reader-list] '‘I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs’' To: sarai list > 'I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs' > > > > Senior Congress leader Digvijay Singh attacks the BJP just like Sushma > Swaraj attacked the Congress. 'Investigate the timings of the blasts', > he tells NEHA DIXIT > > > You have made a statement that serial blasts take place in the country > only when the BJP is in trouble. > What I have said is that the timing of the bomb blasts is quite > uncanny. Why does it always happen when the BJP is in trouble? That > needs investigation. I am not charging anyone. > > What do you mean when you say the BJP is in trouble? > When the Tehelka issue was to be discussed in Parliament, the House > was adjourned for three days. Then when the expose was to be > discussed, the Parliament attack took place. When the Godhra incident > took place, Congress was doing exceedingly well in the local body > elections and Narendra Modi had won by only 6,000 votes as a chief > minister and that too with great difficulty. During the recent > Karnataka election, there was a bomb blast in Hubli on the very first > day of polling. Similarly, two days before the polling in the second > phase in Karnataka elections, there was a bomb blast in Jaipur. It > really needs an investigation. > > Is your statement a response to Sushma Swaraj's accusation against > the Centre? > No, there is no question of that. I have been citing these instances > about the blasts for a long time. > > But Sushma Swaraj was criticised by the Congress ... Sushma Swaraj > alleged that the Congress is involved directly. I have not said that. > And does she have any facts? > I have facts of RSS, VHP making bombs. > > Do you have evidences to prove that BJP, VHP and RSS is involved in > making bombs. > Yes. In fact, in 1992 there was a bomb blast in the VHP office in > Madhya Pradesh, where one VHP member died and two were injured while > making bombs. Then in 2002, there was a bomb blast in a temple in > Mhow. When the police arrested the VHP activists after investigation, > they confessed that they were even given training to manufacture > bombs. I have a videocassette of that confession. Again, in 2006, in > Nanded, there was a bomb blast in the house of a RSS activist where > two RSS activists died. After that in March 2008, there were bomb > blasts at two places in Tamil Nadu. Then too VHP activists were > arrested by the Tamil Nadu police who confessed that they were > involved. And how did the Gujarat police suddenly find eighteen bombs > planted on trees in Surat? > > So are you saying that the BJP is behind the recent serial blasts? > No, I am not saying anything. All that I am saying is that the timing > is uncanny. RSS, VHP activists have been caught making bombs, material > for preparing bombs have been found at their office and there are > three-four clear cases where they have been arrested and a case has > been registered. Why isn't anyone looking into this?. > > Shouldn't all parties unite against terrorism? > Absolutely, but when you target only Muslims, it's not correct. > > Then why is the blame-game still on? > It is on because we have evidence to say that people who talk about > nationalism and nationalist feelings should not be involved in making > bombs. The BJP believes in divisive politics. They cannot survive > without dividing Hindus and Muslims. Each time something happens, they > come back to Hindutva. > > From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 33, Dated Aug 23, 2008 > http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne230808Incoldblood.asp > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 17:18:23 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:18:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <446486.69957.qm@web57211.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <48c2916d0808161350o17cc7a96l1ab8c304de7411f6@mail.gmail.com> <446486.69957.qm@web57211.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808190448t695a0b02ha7f86a67239b40ae@mail.gmail.com> I quote kshmendra : "Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)" I quote khsmendra again: "that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be rectified". Now my reflection to that: i know examples are slippery, but, a case in the point: what about legalizing Homosexuality in India? here, if you see me as one individual maverick, then we grossly differ on ETHICS and and LAW about multi party system, which you feel makes a 'mockery of democracy', is again, a negation of what you said in the begining, a After all the present day system of democracry is celebrated by majority of the people in INDIA. or you think indians are 'invidual mavericks', who dont care about ETHICS but follow THE CONSTITUTIOIN blindly. love is On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Dear Aarti > > Ethical must be Legal. Legal must be Ethical. If this basic principle is not adhered to then there is a flawed interpretation of either the Legal or the Ethical. Worse still is the possibility that the 'accepted and adhered to or propagated' Ethics or the Legality might in themselves be corrupted. > > Left to Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)interpretation, "Ethics" of particular relationships, could and often do find themselves varyingly defined. When such varying definitions are pertinent to inter-personal or inter-transactional situations, the quality of the relationship gets defined. > > In what was being discussed, we must focus on 'societal Ethics'. Such "Ethics" that permeate through and get defined for all of the society. These must find themselves reflected in the "Laws", in the "Legal". So, 'Ethical' must be 'Legal' and the 'Legal' must be 'Ethical'. > > The 'Legal' gets defined by the 'Laws'. The "Laws" derive themselves either directly from the 'Constitution' or from Legislation as allowed for in the "Constitution". > > Therefore, yes certainly Ethical must be seamlessly identifiable with the Legal. What do you find 'frightening' in this? > > You could argue that aspects of the Indian Constitution are not Ethical and therefore the Laws and Legality derived from them are not Ethical. Those then need to be rectified once you identify them. No such specific examples come readily to my mind. You might have some. > > I would readily agree with you if you and I find common our examples of where the Lawful or the Legal does not seem to Ethical. But, your and my views would always be subservient to how the Constitution views such Laws or Legalities. Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice) that finds itself reflected in the Constitution or the Laws and Legalities derived from it. > > You might be resentful of and confrontational against and constantly questioning of the "State". I am not. We the people are the "State". That should be seamless. If you said it is not always so, I would agree. But there is no lack of opportunity or means for making it so. Is'nt that what Democracy is all about. > > The 'categories' that the 'state' gives us, are "categories" that 'we the people' have made as having been participants in the formation, running and conduct of the "State". > > What is in any case wrong with the "categories" you have quoted. > > Are the Police the "Guardians of the Law"? Yes they are. Are those who break the Law, the 'law breakers'? Yes they are. Are those who confront the Police, the "hoodlums"? Yes they are. > > Again it could be argued that in India, the Police are not always (in fact often are not I would say) the "Guardians of the Law". That the Police in India have the propensity for 'unlimited terror'. Agreed. That needs to be worked upon by 'we the People' and rectified. But that cannot be used as an excuse to provide a blanket immunity to or indemnify the "hoodlums" and "law breakers". > > Enough of my simple minded theorising. Let us come to the specifics of where this discussion started. > > In the case of both the "Jammu Agitation" and the "Kashmir Agitation", the agitationists acted at varying times in varying ways as "hoodlums" and as "law breakers". The Police, the "Guardians of Law" were justified in acting against them. > > There is of course the question of "use of force beyond the requirement of the situation". Both the "Jammu Agitationists" and the "Kashmir Agitationists" are complaining about that. This has to be, must be, addressed and rectified. Not an excuse though for there being an 'open season' for the 'hoodlums' and 'law breakers' > > Kshmendra > > PS. Since I mentioned "Democracy", I must also say that India follows a convoluted interpretation of "Democracy". The 'first past the post' system that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be rectified. But, thats another story. > > > --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > > From: Aarti Sethi > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: "mahmood farooqui" > Cc: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 2:20 AM > > Dear Kshmendra, > > I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state > gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a > "law-breaker" > who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening this > sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its capacity > for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified > with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. > > best > A > > On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < > mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> From: mahmood farooqui >> Date: 2008/8/14 >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com >> >> >> Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the > responses >> are making me think. >> >> Best, >> Mahmood >> >> 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul >> >> Dear Mahmood >> > >> > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. > You are trying >> > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. >> > >> > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum >> > attacking a policeman. >> > >> > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. > If >> > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or >> > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured > by >> > police firing. >> > >> > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal. >> > >> > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums > in >> > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? >> > >> > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, > one where >> law >> > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one >> where >> > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. >> > >> > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the > photographs, >> one >> > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' > tinge >> > >> > Kshmendra >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > >*wrote: >> > >> > From: mahmood farooqui >> > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >> > To: "sarai list" , "Aamir > Bashir" < >> > unattore1 at gmail.com> >> > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM >> > >> > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because > of >> the >> > police firing. >> > >> > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan > Times, >> > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a > Kashmiri. >> > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the >> police. >> > >> > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the > police >> > firing. >> > >> > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? >> > >> > Is the poser itself simplistic? >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in >> > the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: > >> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 17:31:02 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:31:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808190501u27cd410fk59b4877d21a2c875@mail.gmail.com> Very true. Thats great understanding by Shivam. It must have been after the BJP's call only, else does the Shri Amarnath Sagarsh Samiti have any support in Jammu ? Would anyone have cared to listen to SASS ? Last 45 days shutdown in Jammu is a witness to everything. Thank you Shivam for your GREAT understanding . Jeeve Jeeve Psuedo Secular Jeeve Pawan Durani On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > This has happened after the BJP's press conference yesterday morning > that the BJP is going to conduct a mass nationwide campaign of which > the jail bharo andolan will be central to. The BJP seems to have made > up its mind that after Ram, Shiva is going to be their favourite > deity. > > best > shivam > > > > On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 9:31 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > *Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow* > > > > *Link - **http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660*< > http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660> > > > > THE TWO month long Amarnath agitation has not lost momentum in Jammu > region > > and despite life remaining paralysed for the last 50 days, the enthusiasm > > and support to the agitation has not withered. Continuing their strong > > protests against the Amarnath land transfer order, around two-lakh people > on > > Monday (August 18) responded to the *Jail Bharo* call of the Shree > Amarnath > > Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS). > > > > People from all across the region came out of their homes in the morning > in > > overwhelming numbers and courted arrest as a mark of protest against the > > land order. > > > > > > According to reports, large number of people gathered in Jammu city, > > Udhampur, Kathua, Hiranagar and Reasi and other major towns and villages > on > > the call of the SAYSS, which is spearheading the agitation. > > > > > > In the morning today, around 10 000 people gathered at City Chowk in > Jammu > > city and took out a procession. Chanting 'Bum Bum Bole' the protesters > > passed through main roads of the city and reached the city chowk police > > station and asked the cops to arrest them. > > > > > > This was carried out in all the 16 police stations of Jammu city, with > > thousands of protesters shouting slogans against the state administration > > and governor N N Vohra. The protesters were later taken to MAM stadium > and > > other schools and colleges, which were turned into jails for the time > being. > > > > > > > > Udhampur city witnessed a huge turnout and the situation turned violent > > after protesters clashed with security personnel. Police resorted to > lathi > > charge and tear gas shells were fired to control the protesters, who were > > demanding the ouster of governor N N Vohra and return of the Amarnath > land. > > > > > > A large turnout was also reported in Samba and Kathua districts, but the > > protests remained largely peaceful and there was no report of any > untoward > > incident. > > > > > > Meanwhile, Shree Amarnath Sangarsh Samiti (SASS) termed the response to > the > > *Jail Bharo* andolan as overwhelming and said it was a historic day for > the > > people of Jammu. Brigadier Suchet Singh, speaking to *merinews*, claimed > > that more than three lakh people had participated in today's *Jail > > Bharo*andolan. > > > > > > Singh also criticised the state administration for failing to provide > even > > basic facilities in the makeshift prisons. "The state did not even > provide > > water to the agitating people," he said, adding that the people of Jammu > > have entered into a do or die mode and will not stop till their goal is > > achieved. > > > > > > This agitation has the support of the rich and poor and cuts across > > religious and regional lines, Singh asserted, "Abhi nahi to Kabhi nahi" > this > > is the war cry of the people. Criticizing the Union government for its > > appeasement policy, Singh alleged that government is delaying a decision > in > > the hope that this agitation will peter off. "This is a people's movement > > and will achieve its goal," he said. India is concerned only about the > > Hurriyat and Kashmiris and it will not be tolerated at any cost. > > > > Warning that the agitation could further intensify and mode of action > could > > change, Singh asked the Union government to realise its mistakes and take > > corrective action otherwise there could be more unrest and trouble. > > > > > > The Samiti leaders also registered their strong resentment against > certain > > sections of the national media, which they said were portraying the > > agitation as communal and sectarian. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 17:36:06 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:36:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Cry babies of Kashmir Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808190506n4793f643rdebded75a881818f@mail.gmail.com> ""All supplies are going to the Kashmir valley and not even a single truck has been unloaded here," complained an LPG dealer in Kacchi Chawani area of Jammu. http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?id=32d51414-2890-449c-bff0-6fdb7af19c52&ParentID=b5ac2add-3654-43f9-a0cb-65ed19acd59c&&Headline=Jammu+braces+for+protesters+to+court+arrest From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 19 19:05:51 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 06:35:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808190448t695a0b02ha7f86a67239b40ae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <136974.81629.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Inder Salim   1. Sexual Choices (Morality) of an individual or between consenting Adults has nothing to do with Ethics. For and between individuals (as I wrote earlier to Aarti) the "Individual Ethics" as for example of Sexual Choices (Morality) defines the quality of relationships. The 'Societal Ethics' of Sexual Choices come into reckoning only when one person's Sexual Choices adversely impact another person's choices.   2. Go ahead and legalise homosexuality in India. You do not need my permission. I have no objection to it.   3. But wait a minute, I see you expressing contempt for India time and again. You condemn anyone talking in favour of Indian Nationalism but are quick to speak in favour of Kashmiri Nationalism. When questioned over this contradiction you play dumb, deaf and blind and ignore the query. What is your interest in India?   4. You should ask for the legalising of homosexuality in Kashmir. It will be interesting to see how your demand will be received in Kashmir.   5. As far as India is concerned, there is some ongoing litigation over this in Delhi High Court. A competent Legal Team might be able to successfully argue it out.   6. From what I have read, it will not be possible for a Court of Law to strike down the Act under which homosexuality is interpreted as an offence but they could adjucate that the interpretation of the Act should not harshly extend itself to treating homosexuality as being criminal behaviour.   The Act talks about the criminality of  "carnal intercourse against the order of nature with another person of the same sex". In my opinion, a skillful Lawyer could argue over the "Order of Nature" bit. It would be rrrrrather difficult to get Nature to give evidence about what it's "Order' is. There are also examples available in the "Living Nature" domain (excluding Humans) where same sex carnal intercourse takes place.  These are exceptions of sexual behaviour amongst various species but so are they amongst humans.   6. You have selectively quoted and also possibly selectively read what I wrote. I did not say that the 'multi party system' makes a mockery of 'Democracy' but that the "first past the post system" (used to declare candidates in an Election as successful) that we follow in our "multi party system" makes a mockery of Democracy in India. I hope you see the difference. Please read carefully before commenting.   7. Certainly those who love India (which excludes a hate monger like you) must celeberate "Democracy" in India. But the current system is far from being perfect and needs to be rectified. What is your problem in that?   8. The same system (by and large) is followed in the UK and I would not be surprised that with stronger showings (vote shares) for the Liberal Democrats and Greens,  in the UK they will start pondering over how to rectify the system.   9. Some countries already have more credible systems where they use "Proportional Representation" or "Multiple Rounds of Voting" or "Preferential Voting". But, the dynamics of each country are unique and India will have to find out what suits it best as a rectification of the current system.   Kshmendra   --- On Tue, 8/19/08, inder salim wrote: From: inder salim Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2008, 5:18 PM I quote kshmendra : "Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)" I quote khsmendra again: "that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be rectified". Now my reflection to that: i know examples are slippery, but, a case in the point: what about legalizing Homosexuality in India? here, if you see me as one individual maverick, then we grossly differ on ETHICS and and LAW about multi party system, which you feel makes a 'mockery of democracy', is again, a negation of what you said in the begining, a After all the present day system of democracry is celebrated by majority of the people in INDIA. or you think indians are 'invidual mavericks', who dont care about ETHICS but follow THE CONSTITUTIOIN blindly. love is On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Dear Aarti > > Ethical must be Legal. Legal must be Ethical. If this basic principle is not adhered to then there is a flawed interpretation of either the Legal or the Ethical. Worse still is the possibility that the 'accepted and adhered to or propagated' Ethics or the Legality might in themselves be corrupted. > > Left to Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)interpretation, "Ethics" of particular relationships, could and often do find themselves varyingly defined. When such varying definitions are pertinent to inter-personal or inter-transactional situations, the quality of the relationship gets defined. > > In what was being discussed, we must focus on 'societal Ethics'. Such "Ethics" that permeate through and get defined for all of the society. These must find themselves reflected in the "Laws", in the "Legal". So, 'Ethical' must be 'Legal' and the 'Legal' must be 'Ethical'. > > The 'Legal' gets defined by the 'Laws'. The "Laws" derive themselves either directly from the 'Constitution' or from Legislation as allowed for in the "Constitution". > > Therefore, yes certainly Ethical must be seamlessly identifiable with the Legal. What do you find 'frightening' in this? > > You could argue that aspects of the Indian Constitution are not Ethical and therefore the Laws and Legality derived from them are not Ethical. Those then need to be rectified once you identify them. No such specific examples come readily to my mind. You might have some. > > I would readily agree with you if you and I find common our examples of where the Lawful or the Legal does not seem to Ethical. But, your and my views would always be subservient to how the Constitution views such Laws or Legalities. Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice) that finds itself reflected in the Constitution or the Laws and Legalities derived from it. > > You might be resentful of and confrontational against and constantly questioning of the "State". I am not. We the people are the "State". That should be seamless. If you said it is not always so, I would agree. But there is no lack of opportunity or means for making it so. Is'nt that what Democracy is all about. > > The 'categories' that the 'state' gives us, are "categories" that 'we the people' have made as having been participants in the formation, running and conduct of the "State". > > What is in any case wrong with the "categories" you have quoted. > > Are the Police the "Guardians of the Law"? Yes they are. Are those who break the Law, the 'law breakers'? Yes they are. Are those who confront the Police, the "hoodlums"? Yes they are. > > Again it could be argued that in India, the Police are not always (in fact often are not I would say) the "Guardians of the Law". That the Police in India have the propensity for 'unlimited terror'. Agreed. That needs to be worked upon by 'we the People' and rectified. But that cannot be used as an excuse to provide a blanket immunity to or indemnify the "hoodlums" and "law breakers". > > Enough of my simple minded theorising. Let us come to the specifics of where this discussion started. > > In the case of both the "Jammu Agitation" and the "Kashmir Agitation", the agitationists acted at varying times in varying ways as "hoodlums" and as "law breakers". The Police, the "Guardians of Law" were justified in acting against them. > > There is of course the question of "use of force beyond the requirement of the situation". Both the "Jammu Agitationists" and the "Kashmir Agitationists" are complaining about that. This has to be, must be, addressed and rectified. Not an excuse though for there being an 'open season' for the 'hoodlums' and 'law breakers' > > Kshmendra > > PS. Since I mentioned "Democracy", I must also say that India follows a convoluted interpretation of "Democracy". The 'first past the post' system that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be rectified. But, thats another story. > > > --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > > From: Aarti Sethi > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: "mahmood farooqui" > Cc: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 2:20 AM > > Dear Kshmendra, > > I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state > gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a > "law-breaker" > who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening this > sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its capacity > for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified > with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. > > best > A > > On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < > mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> From: mahmood farooqui >> Date: 2008/8/14 >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com >> >> >> Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the > responses >> are making me think. >> >> Best, >> Mahmood >> >> 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul >> >> Dear Mahmood >> > >> > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly are. > You are trying >> > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. >> > >> > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum >> > attacking a policeman. >> > >> > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police firing. > If >> > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law and/or >> > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum injured > by >> > police firing. >> > >> > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it communal. >> > >> > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking hoodlums > in >> > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? >> > >> > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of photographs, > one where >> law >> > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another one >> where >> > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. >> > >> > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the > photographs, >> one >> > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' > tinge >> > >> > Kshmendra >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > >*wrote: >> > >> > From: mahmood farooqui >> > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >> > To: "sarai list" , "Aamir > Bashir" < >> > unattore1 at gmail.com> >> > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM >> > >> > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley because > of >> the >> > police firing. >> > >> > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan > Times, >> > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a > Kashmiri. >> > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by the >> police. >> > >> > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the > police >> > firing. >> > >> > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? >> > >> > Is the poser itself simplistic? >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in >> > the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: > >> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 19 19:36:16 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 07:06:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Struggle in 2008 - Dr Shabir Choudhry Message-ID: <346321.9768.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Interesting Blog entry by the well known (notorious in the eyes of some) Politician/Commentator Dr Shabir Choudhry.   Kshmendra   EXCERPTS:   - Call it armed struggle, jihad, terrorism or a proxy war it destroyed fundamental character of the Kashmiri society, and Kashmiri struggle for right of self determination. This armed struggle which was initiated, supported and promoted by secret agencies of Pakistan resulted in human rights violations and deepened the divisions in the Kashmiri society. - In this struggle a Pakistani gun and agenda was implemented by using a Kashmiri shoulder. It was presented to us by Pakistan and Kashmiri leadership as a Kashmiri struggle for liberation; and with hindsight we see that we Kashmiris were used as a raw material in this proxy war, and it added to our misery and suffering. - I said to him that Pakistan got independence one day before India, and Pakistan has also occupied some parts of Jammu and Kashmir; wouldn’t it be better to have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission first followed by one outside the Indian High Commission.   - There was no need to kill and torture people like that, but the Pakistani army did the same thing in1992 and more than 8 innocent people lost their lives. - Prior to this tragedy, National Students Federation members who were trying to cross the LOC were also killed and tortured by the Pakistan army. When it comes to enforcing ‘law and order’ or enforcing ‘writ of government’ army is trained to kill and torture, as it is happening in Jammu and Kashmir and in Swat, Balochistan, North West Frontier and FATA; or as it happened when Red Mosque was invaded and destroyed in name of enforcing ‘writ of government’. - I further said India virtually lost Kashmir Valley in 1990/1, however despite other heavy handedness India did not use helicopter gun ships or air force against Muslim militants; in Pakistan on the other hand helicopter gun ships and F 16 are regularly used to target alleged Muslim ‘terrorists’ in which innocent Pakistani Muslims are killed and their houses are destroyed. If you need any further evidence how Pakistani forces behave when asked to deal with ‘rebels’ or with those who demand rights then read history of East Pakistan or Bangladesh; or even ask members of Jammu and Kashmir Plebiscite Front how they were treated in 1970/1 during investigations regarding Ganga Hijacking.   - I said without being pro this or anti that one can see a nation whose leadership takes pride in ‘selling’ their (Pakistani) sons and daughters for sake of American dollars, just take example of Dr Afia Sadiqqi who was arrested in Karachi with her three young children and has ended up in America, and where - about of her three young children is still not known. Do you expect any mercy or better treatment from rulers and establishment of this country? If they treat their own people like butchers and regard them as an economic commodity don’t expect that they will treat us Kashmiris differently. - We Kashmiris still have not been able to decide who is enemy of our independence and who is deceiving us in name of religion and brotherhood. It is unfortunate that many of us still view Kashmir dispute in the context of Muslims and non Muslims, and accept whatever is presented to us by media and organisations controlled by Islamabad. - By promoting religious politics are we not playing in hands of extremists who want to justify Two Nations Theory that Muslims and non Muslims cannot live together, hence pave way for division of the State of Jammu and Kashmir on religious lines.     Kashmiri struggle in 2008 Kashmiri struggle in 2008 Dr Shabir Choudhry 13 August 2008 New phase of the Kashmiri struggle or whatever we want to call it in view of communalism, proxy war and terrorism, has been going on since 1947; and yet we people of Jammu and Kashmir have not been able to put our priorities right. We have not been able to differentiate between freedom and occupation. We have also failed to understand designs of both countries on Kashmir, and formulate appropriate policies to promote and advance a Kashmiri interest. In view of the above can we make a valid claim to get independence and be recognised as a free nation and play our due role in comity of nations, especially when what are known as Kashmiri leaders, at best have been acting as puppets of either one country or the other and promoting and defending interest of either India or Pakistan? Despite lack of democracy and encroachment of civil liberties the State of Jammu and Kashmir was one political entity in 1947. People of the State irrespective of their religious and cultural affiliations regarded themselves as Kashmiris, distinctly different from India and Pakistan; and wanted to maintain that difference. Today the unfortunate State is forcibly divided in many parts, and people of the State are divided on religious, cultural, regional and ethnic lines. These divisions have never been so deep and so frightening in the history of the State, and it looks that those powers who are behind these moves are paving the way for the division of the state on communal and regional lines. Call it armed struggle, jihad, terrorism or a proxy war it destroyed fundamental character of the Kashmiri society, and Kashmiri struggle for right of self determination. This armed struggle which was initiated, supported and promoted by secret agencies of Pakistan resulted in human rights violations and deepened the divisions in the Kashmiri society. In this struggle a Pakistani gun and agenda was implemented by using a Kashmiri shoulder. It was presented to us by Pakistan and Kashmiri leadership as a Kashmiri struggle for liberation; and with hindsight we see that we Kashmiris were used as a raw material in this proxy war, and it added to our misery and suffering. A few days ago a ‘friend’ who is still part of controversial nationalist group of JKLF invited me to take part in a picket outside an Indian High Commission on 15th August. According to him it was to demonstrate that India got independence on this date and they have occupied our country - Jammu and Kashmir. I said to him that Pakistan got independence one day before India, and Pakistan has also occupied some parts of Jammu and Kashmir; wouldn’t it be better to have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission first followed by one outside the Indian High Commission. This friend said, how can we have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission, they are helping us against Indian occupation, can’t you see how the Indian army has killed innocent people who were peacefully proceeding towards LOC. I said to him that I condemned this brutal killing. There was no need to kill and torture people like that, but the Pakistani army did the same thing in1992 and more than 8 innocent people lost their lives. I explained to him that in 1992 the JKLF people tried to cross the LOC from the AJK side and they were also innocent and wanted to proceed to the LOC peacefully, they were killed by the Pakistani army. Prior to this tragedy, National Students Federation members who were trying to cross the LOC were also killed and tortured by the Pakistan army. When it comes to enforcing ‘law and order’ or enforcing ‘writ of government’ army is trained to kill and torture, as it is happening in Jammu and Kashmir and in Swat, Balochistan, North West Frontier and FATA; or as it happened when Red Mosque was invaded and destroyed in name of enforcing ‘writ of government’. I further said India virtually lost Kashmir Valley in 1990/1, however despite other heavy handedness India did not use helicopter gun ships or air force against Muslim militants; in Pakistan on the other hand helicopter gun ships and F 16 are regularly used to target alleged Muslim ‘terrorists’ in which innocent Pakistani Muslims are killed and their houses are destroyed. If you need any further evidence how Pakistani forces behave when asked to deal with ‘rebels’ or with those who demand rights then read history of East Pakistan or Bangladesh; or even ask members of Jammu and Kashmir Plebiscite Front how they were treated in 1970/1 during investigations regarding Ganga Hijacking. I said without being pro this or anti that one can see a nation whose leadership takes pride in ‘selling’ their (Pakistani) sons and daughters for sake of American dollars, just take example of Dr Afia Sadiqqi who was arrested in Karachi with her three young children and has ended up in America, and where - about of her three young children is still not known. Do you expect any mercy or better treatment from rulers and establishment of this country? If they treat their own people like butchers and regard them as an economic commodity don’t expect that they will treat us Kashmiris differently. Knowledge of this friend was limited and he was having difficulty in justifying his argument, so he surrendered by saying that he could not compete with me in knowledge and argument. He said he was a loyal member of the JKLF and wanted to follow the party decision and the JKLF leaders. I appreciated his ‘loyalty’ but added that loyalty of his leaders is not with the JKLF or its ideology. Their loyalty is with agencies of our neighbours who reward them handsomely. I said decision to hold a picket outside an Indian High commission was taken else where but only endorsed in your meeting. Your leadership discussed it with relevant quarters, agreed certain terms and conditions and then brought this issue to your meeting to be approved. Normally committee of personal and party loyalists do not disagree with any decision which is presented to them as approved by the top leadership, especially there is always hundred per cent unanimity when any actions is related to India. This friend agreed with almost everything I said, but added that ‘you have always been critical of top JKLF leadership and Pakistan. And now that I have left the JKLF I should not criticise JKLF and its policies, as it hurts us and that we will also criticise you and make allegations against you’. Whether he or some one else criticise me or not it is immaterial, what is important is the attitude of the Kashmiri people and especially that of ‘nationalist’ parties. It is unfortunate to note that despite this long struggle, sacrifices, and suffering on massive scale we as a nation have not been able to decide our priorities. We Kashmiris still have not been able to decide who is enemy of our independence and who is deceiving us in name of religion and brotherhood. It is unfortunate that many of us still view Kashmir dispute in the context of Muslims and non Muslims, and accept whatever is presented to us by media and organisations controlled by Islamabad. My colleagues and I have always regarded Jammu and Kashmir as one political entity, and have promoted cause of united and independent Kashmir, and advanced non - communal politics as Kashmir dispute is not a religious one. But it is unfortunate to note that in 2008 we Kashmiris are more divided and more communalised then we were in 1947; and gulf between the regions and communities is widening. Jammu and the Valley have different priorities and are playing in hands of those who want to play a religious card in order to divide the people on communal lines and advance their politics. Ladakh apart from the ‘Kargil war’ has not bee affected by the militancy; and has different agenda and has no interest with what is going on in other two regions. Azad Kashmir and Gilgit and Baltistan have no contact with each other and have different priorities and interests. People of Azad Kashmir, forgetting their own miseries and problems are seemed to be more concerned with what goes on across the LOC, and virtually accept everything what is presented to them by the Pakistani media. By promoting religious politics are we not playing in hands of extremists who want to justify Two Nations Theory that Muslims and non Muslims cannot live together, hence pave way for division of the State of Jammu and Kashmir on religious lines. Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry at gmail.com To view other articles see my blog: www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com   http://drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/2008/08/kashmiri-struggle-in-2008.html   From the.solipsist at gmail.com Tue Aug 19 20:06:58 2008 From: the.solipsist at gmail.com (Pranesh Prakash) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 20:06:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] The Painter and the City: Parallel Tales of Growth Message-ID: <4785f1e20808190736j6b2212f5l6a510855b83a3aa0@mail.gmail.com> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/19/arts/design/19wrig.html?pagewanted=print August 19, 2008 Art Review The Painter and the City: Parallel Tales of Growth By KAREN ROSENBERG NEW HAVEN — If you can't make it in the big city, try a smaller one. In 1768 the 18th-century British painter Joseph Wright of Derby (1734-97) exhibited a painting in London, "An Experiment on a Bird in the Air Pump," a magnificent group-portrait reflecting Enlightenment values. While the work received favorable reviews, it failed to find a buyer; later that year Wright was snubbed by the newly founded Royal Academy. On the advice of his friend and fellow artist Peter Perez Burdett, Wright moved north to the burgeoning port center of Liverpool. There he found scores of newly wealthy merchants who wished to cement their status by commissioning artworks. Wright lived and worked there from 1768 to 1771, making valuable connections and developing a reputation as the city's leading portraitist. He was so successful that a rival painter accused him of "swallowing up all the business." In his busiest year, 1769, he produced a portrait every 9 or 10 days. An exhibition in its final weeks at the Yale Center for British Art, "Joseph Wright of Derby in Liverpool," is the first to focus on this period of Wright's career. The 80 works on view tell two stories: that of a young painter finding his niche, and that of a fast-growing northern city asserting itself as a cultural and economic hub. The show is part of a two-year celebration of culture in Liverpool (the city marked the 800th anniversary of its charter last year). It was organized by the Yale Center for British Art in conjunction with the Walker Art Gallery in Liverpool, where it made its debut in November. "Wright in Liverpool" has a fascinating subplot. As one of Britain's major port cities, Liverpool was a capital of the slave trade. Many of Wright's patrons amassed fortunes by shipping Africans across the Atlantic. The abolitionist movement was beginning to make inroads, however, and Wright made at least one painting that suggests his views on slavery were not necessarily aligned with those of his subjects. The first gallery is filled with portraits of socially prominent Liverpudlians. Several have fanciful costumes and gestural affectations that reflect the younger generation's tastes of the day. "Anna Ashton, Later Mrs. Thomas Case" is dressed as a shepherdess; "Fleetwood Hesketh," in a jaunty red coat, sits cross-legged in a classical landscape. Wright's older patrons, the focus of the next gallery, have more gravitas. Sarah Clayton, an important land developer, rests her finger on an architectural plan of the Acropolis. Wright was a master of physical as well as intellectual flattery; he softened Clayton's features while depicting her ruffled sleeves and black lace shawl in crisp detail. Another remarkable painting shows Richard Gildart, the merchant and sometime mayor of Liverpool, at 95 yet not the least bit feeble-looking. The portrait is flanked by two paintings of ostentatiously accessorized young beauties: Mary Hunt, wearing a velvet ribbon choker, and an unidentified "Seated Woman" who cradles one of her pearlescent drop earrings in her left hand. Hanging not far from several portraits of slave traders — John Tarleton, Thomas Staniforth — is a painting of a prominent abolitionist, Erasmus Darwin, the grandfather of Charles Darwin and a doctor, poet and inventor. He appears flushed, with a red and yellow complexion. If the issue of slavery lurks in the background of Wright's portraits, it is unavoidable in "A Conversation of Girls" (1770). In this painting three girls — two white, one black — surround an urn on a pedestal. The black girl, differentiated by her striped dress and cropped hair as well as her skin tone, kneels before the others with an offering of flowers and jewels. One of her companions, brown-haired, keeps her distance; the other, a redhead, grasps the bouquet and gives the viewer a searching look. In a catalog essay, the scholar Sarah Parsons suggests that the painting was Wright's way of stirring discussion on slavery without going so far as to take a position that would threaten his livelihood. Her interpretation seems plausible, but the girls' oddly adult features — compared with contemporaneous portraits of children in the next gallery — make them seem more like figures in an allegory. A pair of paintings featuring children at play, "Two Boys Blowing a Bladder by Candlelight" and "Two Girls Decorating a Cat by Candlelight," contrast the amusements of young men and women. The boys, with scientific purposefulness, inflate their balloon; the mischievous-looking girls dress a horrified-looking cat in doll's clothing. The dramatic candlelight of the playtime scenes is typical of the paintings Wright made in Liverpool for exhibition in London. Several show bearded, robed hermit-saint figures in caves or grottoes, a prevalent theme in the 17th-century Dutch paintings and prints that were popular with Liverpool collectors. The importance of classical reproductions in the training of British artists is reinforced by early paintings and drawings depicting Italian sculptures in an academic context. Two monumental scenes from 1771, "A Blacksmith's Shop" (in two versions) and "The Alchymist," round out the show. Both paintings are exhaustively heroic. The blacksmiths rush to reshoe a horse for a family traveling at night; the alchemist, in his cathedral-like laboratory, kneels in prayer upon his discovery of phosphorus. These paintings also reflect Wright's keen interest in artificial light; in the earliest version of "A Blacksmith's Shop," he sandwiched gold leaf in between layers of paint. "The Alchymist," as the catalog suggests, can be seen as a makeover of "The Air Pump," Wright's early commercial failure. It romanticizes ancient science rather than modern experiments, with a figure and setting seemingly transposed from old master paintings. During four years in Liverpool, Wright established his talent for portraiture and honed his methods for conveying nocturnal illumination. He also clearly learned how to market himself. "Joseph Wright of Derby in Liverpool" continues through Aug. 31 at the Yale Center for British Art, 1080 Chapel Street, New Haven; (203) 432-2800, ycba.yale.edu. From shuddha at sarai.net Tue Aug 19 23:39:14 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 23:39:14 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Another Amarnath Pilgrimage: Exactly A Year Ago Message-ID: Dear All, Given the efforts being made to raise the pitch everywhere, this report (below) by Shabir Dar, from almost exactly a year ago, seems to suggest the possibility of reality quite different from what we have become accustomed to hearing and seeing on the spectacle called television in recent days. Here is 'another' Amarnath Pilgrimage, in Kashmir, one that has not been on the radar of those crying themselves hoarse about the imagined insult and injury done to the devotees of Shiva. Here is the little history of a local initiative, in a small town, by local people, with 'valley' Pandits, as well as with migrant Pandits, working together with their Muslim neighbours, and former neighbours. You will notice, that this story has no martyrs, no heroes, no protests, no loud rhetoric, not even a respectable 'land transfer', nothing that is other than the ordinary re-assertion of a traditional ritual practice. And meetings of long lost friends and neighbours. Perhaps when things work at a 'local' level, they do not always conform to the dictates of bigger agendas that have of necessity to carry flags of different colours, some tricolor, some green and white, some green, some saffron, some black. This is not necessarily to romanticize 'little' traditions over bigger ones, or 'Chhota' Amarnath, over 'Bara' Amarnath, but just to note that flagless agendas get less notice than they ought to. However, in the end, i do believe that they contribute more to life, because they do not carry real or imagined armies and militias behind them. Their imagination is not coloured by the need to be validated by sacrifices of any kind. One way of thinking of Shiva, is to think of him as the lord of the 'little' people, the ganas and bhootas - the misunderstood and marginal who make up the merry band of his wedding party. High Hinduism has not always been comfortable with this merry crowd. And so has sought to transform him (Shiva) into the supreme ascetic, the lord of destruction, distancing him from his occasionally not very sanctimonious flock, forgetting, that Shiva also dances with the little people, happily, at peace, intoxicated. The taming of Shiva is one of the many tragedies of civilizational amnesia in indic cultures. I see this story, of 'Cchota' or 'little' Amarnath, as a welcome reminder that even Shiva has many faces. And those who seek to make him the head of a 'national' upsurge to protect the abstractions of borders and nationalities, forget, that Shiva, in the extremely complex spectrum of the Shaivite tradition, which is not the personal property of those who are his loudest adherents today, often slips away, escapes, borders, escapes definition. In Bengal, and in Kashmir, (and in many other parts of South Asia) there is a lively awareness of this subaltern Shiva, and those who seek to dress him up as a high deity of Hindutva today, probably do more violence to their own traditions than they can imagine. Perhaps reading the report below might help us all understand that the starkest of binaries are simply choices made to see things, one way or another, and not necessarily an effort to realize that the texture of ordinary life is always more complex and more beautiful than the reductive 'all or nothing' logic of the headlines that feed and feed on the making of a crisis. i have never been a believer in much, but to 'Chhota' Amarnath, I am happy to say, 'bam bam bholey'. regards Shuddha ----------------- Chotta Amarnath reopens in South Kashmir after18 years with Hindu- Muslim bonhomie Aug 31 2007 http://vinayk.sulekha.com/blog/post/2007/08/chotta-amarnath-reopens- in-south-kashmir-after18-years.htm Shabir Dar KT News Thajiwara (Bijbehara), Aug 28: As Suneeta Bhat (42) is busy in lighting the ratandeep (lal charag) before the idol of Lord Shiva, the sounds of aarti (puja) and bhajans continuously echo in the surroundings. She has come all the way from Jammu to be part of this festival of Hindu-Muslim bonhomie that is being celebrated at Pracheev Amarnath cave of Lord Shiva here today, after a gap of 18 years. This cave temple also known as Chotta Amaranth (mini-Amarnath), has remained closed since 1989 when the militancy surfaced and migration of Kashmiri Pandits to Jammu and other parts of India began. But, now with the initiatives of Devaasthan Prabadhank Committee Bijbehara (an organization looking after all the temples in tehsil Bijbehara), local administration, local MLA and common people; this temple is again abuzz with devotees and performance of all religious practices. Suneeta flanked by many other Pandit relatives and some Muslim friends and neighbours, is bursting with emotions and speaks her heart out. "I am excited," she says. "Once again Pandits and Muslims are exchanging love and amity. I have never thought that such things will repeat again here," she said adding that this all happened with hearty cooperation of local Muslims. She is one among thousands (about 2000) of Kashmiri Pandits (KPs), who are making a beeline to the temple premises from last two days, to perform aarti, light incense and take part in bhajan mandli. "Around 1000 KPs from Jammu and Delhi and about the same number from different parts of valley have visited here since last two days," said Vishvenathan Jotshi, president of Devaasthan Prabadhank Committee (DPC) Bijbehara. "And the count is soaring," he added. In the premises of the cave temple, a beeline of both KPs and local Muslims visiting the temple could be seen, amid hugs and greetings. In the courtyard of the temple, Mohammad Shafi a local teacher is greeting every Pandit entrant with love and respect. "When are you coming back permanently?" he is seen posing the question affectionately to everyone. For a moment, the temple looks virtually like a pot where emotions are filled with the warmth of love and brotherhood. For Sonika (17), who has come to her native land for the first time, the warmth of people and place here has melted her heart. "I have missed a lot being outside my own land. Now, I don't want to go back," said Sonika Bhat who is here with her parents who actually hail from Bijbehara but are now residing in Talab Tillo Jammu. "I felt that there is no harm for us living here," she said. Positioned on a hillock in the form of cave, Thajiwara temple as per Professor Moti Lal Malla General Secretary of DPC Bijbehara has a historical significance too. "Matta Parvati has a tremendous Tapasiya for this place. Thousands of years back she has prayed for 12 years to please Lord Shiva in order to reveal amar katha (history about making of universe) to her, who later had agreed to her prayers," he said. And since then, Thajiwara annual yatra and festival is celebrated on the eve of every Shravan Purnamashi or Raksha Bandhan and people from all over the Valley throng this shrine for the darshan of Lord Shiva. The yatra has the same religious sanctity and significance as that of Swami Amarnath cave pilgrimage. "The temple is also known as Chotta Amaranth," he said. "The handicapped, destitute and other people who can not make it to Swami Amarnath can visit this temple," said Malla. The temple has a distinction. From the cave, water - Amar Ganga - trickles down from its roof on the idol of Lord Shiva, this ultimately collects in the small pond outside the cave. A type of ash - Amar Bhabooti - also comes out of the cave, which is applied by the devotees on their foreheads. Ecstatic with the arrival of a good number of Kashmiri Pandits into his village, Ghulam Nabi Ashwar, an elderly person of Thajiwara village, said that the occasion is like a festival for him. "We are very happy with the revival of this temple. After a long gap I am experiencing such festivity in my village. Earlier we (Hindus and Muslims) used to celebrate every festival together and I don't believe my eyes that same is happening once again," he said, while holding the hand of a Pandit who happened to be a childhood friend. In this ambience of revived religious harmony and cultural bonhomie, many believe that time has come when the displaced people of the valley should come back and settle in their original abodes. "The warm welcome from local people and their love and affection is itself a certificate for every displaced pandit to return back to valley," said P L Pandita, freelance producer who along with his family has come to the temple for puja. "This is a matter of great delight for me to witness the revival of our traditional Hindu-Muslim brotherhood," he added. It is important to mention here that most of the arrangements for the festival have been done by the locals here, who had been busy in the preparations from last three days. The villages reflect a decorated look. Most of the materials necessary for running a langar (free meals) for devotees are being provided by locals. "Locals have provided 70 kilograms of vegetables, 30 kgs of milk, 25 pairs of bedding, matting and other furniture free of cost," said a member of managing committee of DPC. An octogenarian Prabhawati Dhar is all praises for the managing committee of DPC Bijbehara and the local administration for making her dream come true. Dhar who at present lives in Chakoora Pulwama, has spent her childhood in the ambience of this Shiva temple. "I used to visit this temple regularly before 18 years. And now to be again here after a long gap is actually a dream come true. I thank everybody who made this to happen," she said. Abdul Rehman Veeri, the local MLA feels more than happy to be a part of this beginning, which as per him has no end now. "It has been our solemn initiative to re-open this old temple, which has always been a symbol of religious harmony. Today, be it in the premises of this temple when centuries old festival is again celebrated here, I have no words to express my happiness. This is an encouragement to our traditional religious harmony," he said. Mufti Mohammad Amin, chairman of Bijbehara Municipal Committee, on whose efforts the initiative has reached to its logical conclusion said that it is a matter of pride for every Kashmiri that age-old bonhomie is coming back on its rails. "A garden is perfect with the presence of diverse types of flowers. And Pandits and Muslims are two flowers of the same garden - Kashmir - which can thrive in one another's presence only," he said. In the temple the local leaders cutting across party lines and village elders from whole area were present to welcome the visiting guest on the occasion.(Kashmir Times) Shuddhabrata Sengupta From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Wed Aug 20 01:15:31 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:45:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Some Pictures of Book Release Function Message-ID: <229665.54965.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear All, Due to restrictions on the size of the message I am unable to send the pictures of  my Book Release Function held on 9th August at Speaker Hall,Constitution Club,New Delhi. However,the book can be had from : Shri N.K.Verma, Chairman, Diamond Pocket Books Pvt. Ltd., X-30, Okhla Industrial Area, Phase - II, New Delhi - 110020, Phone : +91-11-41611861, Fax : +91-11-26386124, 41611866. Website : www.diamondpublication.com E-mail : nk at diamondpublication.com Kindly send an e-mail to Shri N.K.Verma and get a copy of the book ' Aatmanubhuti '   With regards,   Prabhakar       Be the first one to try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/       Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/       Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ From taraprakash at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 03:44:14 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:14:14 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] =?utf-8?q?=27=E2=80=98I_have_evidence_of_RSS_and_VH?= =?utf-8?b?UCBtYWtpbmcgYm9tYnPigJkn?= References: <909267.33381.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <036201c90248$eb04a1e0$6400a8c0@taraprakash> My problem is that if a prominent Congress leader has proof that RSS and such other groups make bombs and it might be their misadventure that we saw in Gujarat and other parts of India, why are SIMI/Indian Mujahiddin/ISI etc. being maligned? Making bombs is tantamount to threatening the security of the nation, why not provide the proof of such activities to the intelligence agencies and the home ministry? Does Digvijay Singh and his party have some vested interest in people being killed? As about the unexploded bombs, it is not clear why bombs in certain places exploded but not in Surat. The two prominent theories propounded by "experts" to explain this were 1. people had become very cautious after the explosions of previous days. They were vigilant so they found the bombs before they exploded. 2. There were rains in Surat that day, which diffused or spoilt the bombs and the plans of the "terrorists". We must also not forget that several low intensity bombs were placed in hundreds of districts in Bangladesh few years back. They did not cause so much destruction there as these bombs did here in India. So it is not unprecedented in the history of terrorism that bombs have been used not to explode but just to terrorize. These terrorists can be anyone. But if we go by the tenets of the parliamentary democracy, where the majority of the people's representatives decides the policy, our representatives were complicit in these blasts. Sushma Swaraj blames the Congress and no BJP leader contradicts her. Digvijay Singh blames BJP, and Congress gives its nods by not giving any clarification about his statement. So the two largest parties are agreeing on one thing that it was not an anti-national Islamic organization or any other external force responsible for these blasts. Congress and BJP are accountable for all the killings and we can't do anything to these parties as they have people's mandate. This reminds me of the definition of "democracy" by a prominent Hindi poet. "Jahan janta ki janta dvara aisi taisi hoti hai Vahi democracy hoti hai." (Democracy is Screwing up of the people by the people) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kshmendra Kaul" To: "mahmood farooqui" Cc: "sarai list" Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 4:42 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] '‘I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs’' > Dear Mahmood > > 1. I am taking the liberty of posting my response in SARAI. It includes > your incoming to me > > 2. I do not know if you are being sarcastic. I will take your incredulity > at face value. > > Maybe I am simple minded but yes I am serious. > > - Terrorists do not show 'kindness', that is why they are called > 'terrorists'. It is beyond my credible belief that the 26 Bombs could have > been designed to 'not explode' but were meant to serve just a warning by > the 'terrorists'. One of "see we can strike anywhere any time". You would > not need '26' for that. Just a couple or another couple more would > suffice. It would be absolute idiocy to plant '26' bombs and the run the > extensive risk of being discovered as 'planting' the bomb just for the > sake of a 'warning' being served > > - The locations (up in a tree or hidden behind a shop hoarding for > example) where the '26' were discovered challenges belief that > 'terrorists' would allow themselves to be so easily viewed as 'planting' > the '26'. > > - The ease with which the '26' were discovered within just 2 or 3 days was > rather 'amazingly' efficient. The noses were obviously repeatedly and > consistently on the right track each single time. > > - Not one bomb exploded out of '26'. Hmmmmmmn. Some 'terrorists'. They > need to go back to 'school for terrorists' > > - The callousness and relaxed and smiling manner with which the 'defusers' > were seen handling the bombs suggested that they already knew that the > bomb would not explode. > > Yes I am suspicious. But yes I am simple minded too. > > Kshmendra > > > > --- On Tue, 8/19/08, mahmood farooqui wrote: > > From: mahmood farooqui > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] '‘I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs’' > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2008, 9:25 AM > > > > Are you serious. Do you really think so > > > 2008/8/18 Kshmendra Kaul > > The 26 (was it 26?) Bombs in Surat and not one got triggered off. > > Bombs (shown on TV) located at places where the one placing the bomb would > be conspicuously visible as being upto 'something'. > > All of this (to me) is highly suspicious. > > Kshmendra > > --- On Mon, 8/18/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: > > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > Subject: [Reader-list] ''I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs'' > To: "sarai list" > Date: Monday, August 18, 2008, 7:31 PM > > > > > 'I have evidence of RSS and VHP making bombs' > > > > Senior Congress leader Digvijay Singh attacks the BJP just like Sushma > Swaraj attacked the Congress. 'Investigate the timings of the blasts', > he tells NEHA DIXIT > > > You have made a statement that serial blasts take place in the country > only when the BJP is in trouble. > What I have said is that the timing of the bomb blasts is quite > uncanny. Why does it always happen when the BJP is in trouble? That > needs investigation. I am not charging anyone. > > What do you mean when you say the BJP is in trouble? > When the Tehelka issue was to be discussed in Parliament, the House > was adjourned for three days. Then when the expose was to be > discussed, the Parliament attack took place. When the Godhra incident > took place, Congress was doing exceedingly well in the local body > elections and Narendra Modi had won by only 6,000 votes as a chief > minister and that too with great difficulty. During the recent > Karnataka election, there was a bomb blast in Hubli on the very first > day of polling. Similarly, two days before the polling in the second > phase in Karnataka elections, there was a bomb blast in Jaipur. It > really needs an investigation. > > Is your statement a response to Sushma Swaraj's accusation against the > Centre? > No, there is no question of that. I have been citing these instances > about the blasts for a long time. > > But Sushma Swaraj was criticised by the Congress ... Sushma Swaraj > alleged that the Congress is involved directly. I have not said that. > And does she have any facts? > I have facts of RSS, VHP making bombs. > > Do you have evidences to prove that BJP, VHP and RSS is involved in > making bombs. > Yes. In fact, in 1992 there was a bomb blast in the VHP office in > Madhya Pradesh, where one VHP member died and two were injured while > making bombs. Then in 2002, there was a bomb blast in a temple in > Mhow. When the police arrested the VHP activists after investigation, > they confessed that they were even given training to manufacture > bombs. I have a videocassette of that confession. Again, in 2006, in > Nanded, there was a bomb blast in the house of a RSS activist where > two RSS activists died. After that in March 2008, there were bomb > blasts at two places in Tamil Nadu. Then too VHP activists were > arrested by the Tamil Nadu police who confessed that they were > involved. And how did the Gujarat police suddenly find eighteen bombs > planted on trees in Surat? > > So are you saying that the BJP is behind the recent serial blasts? > No, I am not saying anything. All that I am saying is that the timing > is uncanny. RSS, VHP activists have been caught making bombs, material > for preparing bombs have been found at their office and there are > three-four clear cases where they have been arrested and a case has > been registered. Why isn't anyone looking into this?. > > Shouldn't all parties unite against terrorism? > Absolutely, but when you target only Muslims, it's not correct. > > Then why is the blame-game still on? > It is on because we have evidence to say that people who talk about > nationalism and nationalist feelings should not be involved in making > bombs. The BJP believes in divisive politics. They cannot survive > without dividing Hindus and Muslims. Each time something happens, they > come back to Hindutva. > > From Tehelka Magazine, Vol 5, Issue 33, Dated Aug 23, 2008 > http://tehelka.com/story_main40.asp?filename=Ne230808Incoldblood.asp > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From taraprakash at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 04:01:34 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:31:34 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Geelani demands merger of J&K with Pakistan References: <753715.30641.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <038301c9024b$56b5fd60$6400a8c0@taraprakash> He seems to be out of touch with reality. Islam tied East Pakistan with mainland Pakistan too but we know what happened to that tie. It won't be too long when this Islam crap will again be falsified. I wonder if Geelani was asleep when in late December thousands of people in Pakistan were chanting "naheen cahie Pakistan" and "Pakistan murdabad." If Geelani and handful of his supporters want to join that sinking ship, they should be allowed to go but if merger with Pakistan is the only solution, then there is no solution to the Kashmir problem. Such a Merger is never going to happen. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kshmendra Kaul" To: "sarai list" Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 5:32 AM Subject: [Reader-list] Geelani demands merger of J&K with Pakistan > Here is another one for those shameless Indians who have in the past and > continue to support the separatists in Kashmir in their so called "Secular > movement for Independence" of "Azadi", "Hurriyat", "Freedom". > > Kshmendra > > > > > > > > Geelani calls for Kashmir's merger with Pak > > Press Trust of India Monday, August 18, 2008 (Srinagar) > > > > > > > > Hardline > separatist leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani Monday demanded the merger of > Jammu and Kashmir with Pakistan, as leaders of the moderate Hurriyat > faction spoke about independence and a dialogue over the state, triggering > a leadership and ideological clash in the Muslim-dominated valley. > > Tens of thousands of Muslim Kashmiris marched towards a United Nations > office here amid heavy security arrangements, demanding UN intervention to > solve the more than 60-year-old Kashmir dispute. > > Demonstrators shouting "We Want Freedom", "Aiy zaalimo, aiy kaafiro, > Kashmir hamara chhod do" (Tyrants and oppressors, leave our Kashmir), as > they marched past police barricades near the UN Military Observer Group in > India and Pakistan (UNMOGIP) office in the summer capital Srinagar. > > Addressing the mammoth gathering at the Tourist Reception Centre here, > octogenarian Geelani said there was "no solution to the Kashmir issue > other than merger with Pakistan". > > "We are Pakistanis and Pakistan is us because we are tied with the country > through Islam," he roared, as the crowd cheered and chanted along with > him: "Hum Pakistani hain, Pakistan hamara hai" (We are Pakistanis, > Pakistan is ours). > > Much to the "ugly surprise" of the moderate Hurriyat leaders, who were > sharing the stage with him, Geelani said the leadership issue of the > Kashmiri separatist movement was "solved today". > > "Do you have faith in my leadership? I will be faithful to you till my > death and will carry everyone along," he said, as the crowd applauded him > shouting in unison "zaroor" (certainly). > > Moderate Hurriyat leader Mirwaiz Umar Farooq in his speech earlier called > for a trilateral dialogue over Jammu and Kashmir, whose ownership is > disputed by India and Pakistan who claim the region in full but rule in > parts. > > "We ask India to start a dialogue over Kashmir, open the > Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road for trade and release all Kashmiris in Indian > jails," he said. Muzaffarabad is the capital of Pakistan-administered > Kashmir. > > Pro-independence leader Yasin Malik said that Kashmiris want "complete > freedom" - implying from both India and Pakistan. > > "Is paar bhi lenge azadi, us paar bhi lenge azadi" (we will free both > Kashmirs) was Malik's slogan, as the crowd also cheered him. > > However, Geelani countered their remarks saying all these issues would be > solved once Kashmiris get their right to self-determination and merge with > Pakistan. > > The two factions of the Hurriyat Conference had been at loggerheads but > got united when the Kashmir Valley saw protests against the transfer of > government land to the Amarnath shrine management two months ago. > > The state government cancelled the order - provoking protests in Jammu > region and triggering an unprecedented communal divide in the state. The > Jammu agitation revived protests in the Valley that have snowballed into > anti-India protests reigniting calls for Kashmir's independence. > > Violent protests last week killed at least 22 Muslim demonstrators, > including a senior separatist leader. > > UNMOGIP is one of the oldest UN missions and monitors a 1949 ceasefire > line dividing Kashmir between India and Pakistan. > > Hurriyat supporters travelled in cars, buses, and on motorcycles carrying > green flags, as police and paramilitary troopers, asked to exercise > maximum restraint, looked on. > > Geelani's leadership claim and pro-Pakistan slogans have led to a > bickering between the two factions of the Hurriyat that were joining hands > after the separatist conglomerate broke up in August 2003. > > A moderate Hurriyat leader said it was Geelani's dream to emerge as the > "king of Kashmir". > > "But if you cannot carry the load of sanity, you have no right to live not > to talk of leading people," said the separatist leader, speaking on > condition of anonymity given the "precarious" situation in the separatist > camp. > > "One who seeks leadership, don't make him a leader," the separatist leader > quoted a saying of the Prophet to challenge Geelani's claim. > > "About Geelani's claim and today's rally and sloganeering, I have kept my > lips sealed. I am not going to speak to anybody about it," Abdul Gani > Bhat, former chairman and spokesman of the moderate Hurriyat, said. > > http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/StoryPrint.aspx?ID=NEWEN20080062037&ch=633547534103310000 > > ALSO AT > > http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20080818/818/tnl-geelani-calls-for-merger-with-pakist.html > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 10:23:46 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:23:46 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Another Amarnath Pilgrimage: Exactly A Year Ago In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808192153k4997019aw73c57eb76cee450c@mail.gmail.com> *21 July 2007* Fifteeen Amarnath piligrims were injured in a grenade explosion at Pahalgam, the base camp of the Amarnath Yatra, on Saturday afternoon, officials said. A police official said that unknown persons hurled a grenade when a group of Amarnath cave shrine pilgrims, mostly sadhus, were in the compound of a Gurdwara near police station Pahalgam where a 'langar' was organized. http://www.greaterkashmir.com/Full_Story.asp?Cat=1&ItemID=41&date=22_7_2007 *6 August, 2002***** Nine people died and 37 were injured after a camp of Hindu pilgrims at Nunwan, near the resort town of Pahalgam, was attacked by suspected Islamic militants. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/2175168.stm *30 July, 2002*** ..............two people have been killed and another three wounded in a suspected militant attack on Hindu pilgrims. The incident happened when a grenade was thrown at a taxi south of Srinagar on its way to the Amarnath cave shrine. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/2161517.stm * * *August 1, 2000*** Twenty five persons, a number of them yatris, were killed and over 30 injured when militants attacked a ``langar'' in a Pahalgam health resort en route to the Amarnath cave this evening. Two militants were also killed when security forces ambushed them. Curfew has been imposed in Pahalgam. http://www.hinduonnet.com/2000/08/02/stories/01020003.htm From indersalim at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 11:05:39 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:05:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <136974.81629.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <47e122a70808190448t695a0b02ha7f86a67239b40ae@mail.gmail.com> <136974.81629.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808192235u6ce08cf0t69b38c2105793b84@mail.gmail.com> Dear kshmendra 1. i still see 'ethics' as a free electron sharing orbirts between sexuality, freedom and aesthetics. you talk aboutt ' order of nature' between same sexes as exception, and therefore, not defining ' quality relationship' in a society, which reflects 'societal ethics', necessary for formation of 'law'. i see it a little differently. I quote text : "sexuality is not innate, but a product", This thought emnates from simple subjective discourses, which is suitable to radical thought, necessary of changes in society. Yes, changes, even to implement ' proporational representation'. You will also have discover a different law to retain 'kashmir' if PR system for new democracy is brought into practice. 2. i dont see myself as a blind kashmiri nationalist, in fact, i am not a natioinalist at all. i want every body to realize her/his inner artistic being. When i am asking for legalizing 'homosexuality' or a healty space for 'sex workers' it applies to whole humanity, irrespection of geography, caste, colour and religon. Needless to say, that how much artists beling to a universal human being, rather to a limited concept of ' nationalism' . When Lal Ded was living, kashmir had indeed a different territory, but she talked about universal values, quite profoundly which transcends a territory. Marking territory is a dog behaviour, which has very little to do with subjective discourse. that is what is feel. 3. Time and again, i have talked about my discomfort with idealogical or religous fundamentalism. So that applies to kashmir and the rest even. In today's post by Shuddha, we read how Lord Shiva danced with the poor and opressed , and clebrated ' datura' an intoxicant which too has not legal sanction is Brahmnical Hinduism, or law. I beleive, the job a true believer, is to rip the text, what Derrida taught, and what even many seers and saints did in their times. Mansoor Halaj will be known for his defiance against the ruling elite who killed him in the name of defending the sacred text. When we defend the law of land as sacred text, we are playing the role of an opressor. This happens at various levels of thought. I am constantly examinging my behaviour at the same time. That is my inner process, too. Deconstruction is ' performativity', too. 4. India needs freedom of kashmir as much kashmir needs, This is what Arundhati Roy said, I agree with it, There should an end to this Kashmirs as villians in india and vice versa. And if that new free kashmir is bereft of ethics, morality, and respect to its past, it shall be our duty to talk about that, like we talk about it now. About demolition of temples in kashmir, i remember, the famous Iranisna flim maker, who said that the responsibiltiy of destruction of Bamyaan Buddhas statues in Afganistan lies on the shoulders of Americans. I see Indian mindless policy directly responsible for jamat-it islami kind of things in kashmir. When Sheik Mohd Abudhha was bullied by India, and when his audience was shrinking, he went to hazratbal and spoke from a different mike. If you push the other, then violence looks inevitable. it is all sad, but we need to be couragous to speak the truth, and return to subjectivity and not define our acts as ' natural' and others as as 'unatural' with love and regards is i want kashmiris to get what india has promised them in 1947. it should be their choice to be what they want to be. It has a lot to do with ehichs and morality. Yes, kashmiri pandits suffered On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 7:05 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Dear Inder Salim > > 1. Sexual Choices (Morality) of an individual or between consenting Adults > has nothing to do with Ethics. For and between individuals (as I wrote > earlier to Aarti) the "Individual Ethics" as for example of Sexual Choices > (Morality) defines the quality of relationships. The 'Societal Ethics' of > Sexual Choices come into reckoning only when one person's Sexual Choices > adversely impact another person's choices. > > 2. Go ahead and legalise homosexuality in India. You do not need my > permission. I have no objection to it. > > 3. But wait a minute, I see you expressing contempt for India time and > again. You condemn anyone talking in favour of Indian Nationalism but are > quick to speak in favour of Kashmiri Nationalism. When questioned over this > contradiction you play dumb, deaf and blind and ignore the query. What is > your interest in India? > > 4. You should ask for the legalising of homosexuality in Kashmir. It will be > interesting to see how your demand will be received in Kashmir. > > 5. As far as India is concerned, there is some ongoing litigation over this > in Delhi High Court. A competent Legal Team might be able to successfully > argue it out. > > 6. From what I have read, it will not be possible for a Court of Law to > strike down the Act under which homosexuality is interpreted as an offence > but they could adjucate that the interpretation of the Act should not > harshly extend itself to treating homosexuality as being criminal behaviour. > > The Act talks about the criminality of "carnal intercourse against the > order of nature with another person of the same sex". In my opinion, a > skillful Lawyer could argue over the "Order of Nature" bit. It would be > rrrrrather difficult to get Nature to give evidence about what it's "Order' > is. There are also examples available in the "Living Nature" domain > (excluding Humans) where same sex carnal intercourse takes place. These are > exceptions of sexual behaviour amongst various species but so are they > amongst humans. > > 6. You have selectively quoted and also possibly selectively read what I > wrote. I did not say that the 'multi party system' makes a mockery of > 'Democracy' but that the "first past the post system" (used to declare > candidates in an Election as successful) that we follow in our "multi party > system" makes a mockery of Democracy in India. I hope you see the > difference. Please read carefully before commenting. > > 7. Certainly those who love India (which excludes a hate monger like you) > must celeberate "Democracy" in India. But the current system is far from > being perfect and needs to be rectified. What is your problem in that? > > 8. The same system (by and large) is followed in the UK and I would not be > surprised that with stronger showings (vote shares) for the Liberal > Democrats and Greens, in the UK they will start pondering over how > to rectify the system. > > 9. Some countries already have more credible systems where they use > "Proportional Representation" or "Multiple Rounds of Voting" or > "Preferential Voting". But, the dynamics of each country are unique and > India will have to find out what suits it best as a rectification of the > current system. > > Kshmendra > > --- On Tue, 8/19/08, inder salim wrote: > > From: inder salim > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2008, 5:18 PM > > I quote kshmendra : > > "Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or > importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)" > > I quote khsmendra again: > > "that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the > essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be > rectified". > > Now my reflection to that: i know examples are slippery, but, a case > in the point: what about legalizing Homosexuality in India? here, if > you see me as one individual maverick, then we grossly differ on > ETHICS and and LAW > > about multi party system, which you feel makes a 'mockery of > democracy', is again, a negation of what you said in the begining, > a > After all the present day system of democracry is celebrated by > majority of the people in INDIA. or you think indians are 'invidual > mavericks', who dont care about ETHICS but follow THE CONSTITUTIOIN > blindly. > > love > is > > > > > > > On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Kshmendra Kaul > wrote: >> Dear Aarti >> >> Ethical must be Legal. Legal must be Ethical. If this basic principle is > not adhered to then there is a flawed interpretation of either the Legal or > the > Ethical. Worse still is the possibility that the 'accepted and adhered to or > propagated' Ethics or the Legality might in themselves be corrupted. >> >> Left to Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence > or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority > voice)interpretation, "Ethics" of particular relationships, could and > often do find themselves varyingly defined. When such varying definitions > are > pertinent to inter-personal or inter-transactional situations, the quality > of > the relationship gets defined. >> >> In what was being discussed, we must focus on 'societal Ethics'. > Such "Ethics" that permeate through and get defined for all of the > society. These must find themselves reflected in the "Laws", in the > "Legal". So, 'Ethical' must be 'Legal' and the > 'Legal' must be 'Ethical'. >> >> The 'Legal' gets defined by the 'Laws'. The > "Laws" derive themselves either directly from the > 'Constitution' or from Legislation as allowed for in the > "Constitution". >> >> Therefore, yes certainly Ethical must be seamlessly identifiable with the > Legal. What do you find 'frightening' in this? >> >> You could argue that aspects of the Indian Constitution are not Ethical > and therefore the Laws and Legality derived from them are not Ethical. Those > then need to be rectified once you identify them. No such specific examples > come > readily to my mind. You might have some. >> >> I would readily agree with you if you and I find common our examples of > where the Lawful or the Legal does not seem to Ethical. But, your and my > views > would always be subservient to how the Constitution views such Laws or > Legalities. Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no > consequence or > importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice) that > finds > itself reflected in the Constitution or the Laws and Legalities derived from > it. >> >> You might be resentful of and confrontational against and constantly > questioning of the "State". I am not. We the people are the > "State". That should be seamless. If you said it is not always so, I > would agree. But there is no lack of opportunity or means for making it so. > Is'nt that what Democracy is all about. >> >> The 'categories' that the 'state' gives us, are > "categories" that 'we the people' have made as having been > participants in the formation, running and conduct of the "State". >> >> What is in any case wrong with the "categories" you have quoted. >> >> Are the Police the "Guardians of the Law"? Yes they are. Are > those who break the Law, the 'law breakers'? Yes they are. Are those who > confront the Police, the "hoodlums"? Yes they are. >> >> Again it could be argued that in India, the Police are not always (in fact > often are not I would say) the "Guardians of the Law". That the Police > in India have the propensity for 'unlimited terror'. Agreed. That needs > to be worked upon by 'we the People' and rectified. But that cannot be > used as an excuse to provide a blanket immunity to or indemnify the > "hoodlums" and "law breakers". >> >> Enough of my simple minded theorising. Let us come to the specifics of > where this discussion started. >> >> In the case of both the "Jammu Agitation" and the "Kashmir > Agitation", the agitationists acted at varying times in varying ways as > "hoodlums" and as "law breakers". The Police, the > "Guardians of Law" were justified in acting against them. >> >> There is of course the question of "use of force beyond the > requirement of the situation". Both the "Jammu Agitationists" and > the "Kashmir Agitationists" are complaining about that. This has to > be, must be, addressed and rectified. Not an excuse though for there being > an > 'open season' for the 'hoodlums' and 'law breakers' >> >> Kshmendra >> >> PS. Since I mentioned "Democracy", I must also say that India > follows a convoluted interpretation of "Democracy". The 'first > past the post' system that we follow in our 'multi party system' > makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs > to be rectified. But, thats another story. >> >> >> --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: >> >> From: Aarti Sethi >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures >> To: "mahmood farooqui" >> Cc: "sarai list" >> Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 2:20 AM >> >> Dear Kshmendra, >> >> I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state >> gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a >> "law-breaker" >> who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening this >> sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its capacity >> for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified >> with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. >> >> best >> A >> >> On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < >> mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>> From: mahmood farooqui >>> Date: 2008/8/14 >>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >>> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com >>> >>> >>> Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the >> responses >>> are making me think. >>> >>> Best, >>> Mahmood >>> >>> 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul >>> >>> Dear Mahmood >>> > >>> > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly > are. >> You are trying >>> > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. >>> > >>> > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum >>> > attacking a policeman. >>> > >>> > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police > firing. >> If >>> > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law > and/or >>> > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum > injured >> by >>> > police firing. >>> > >>> > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it > communal. >>> > >>> > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking > hoodlums >> in >>> > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? >>> > >>> > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of > photographs, >> one where >>> law >>> > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another > one >>> where >>> > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. >>> > >>> > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the >> photographs, >>> one >>> > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' >> tinge >>> > >>> > Kshmendra >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > >> >*wrote: >>> > >>> > From: mahmood farooqui >>> > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >>> > To: "sarai list" , > "Aamir >> Bashir" < >>> > unattore1 at gmail.com> >>> > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM >>> > >>> > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley > because >> of >>> the >>> > police firing. >>> > >>> > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan >> Times, >>> > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a >> Kashmiri. >>> > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by > the >>> police. >>> > >>> > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the >> police >>> > firing. >>> > >>> > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? >>> > >>> > Is the poser itself simplistic? >>> > _________________________________________ >>> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> > Critiques & Collaborations >>> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in >>> > the subject header. >>> > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> > List archive: >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in >> the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From nalaka at tveap.org Tue Aug 19 18:35:41 2008 From: nalaka at tveap.org (Nalaka Gunawardene, TVE Asia Pacific) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:35:41 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] [infosouth] Call for Entries: Asia Pacific rice film and journalist awards 2008 Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20080819183527.01d3d130@mail.tveap.org> Apologies for cross-posting. Please spread the word. Thank you! CALL FOR ENTRIES! Asia Pacific Rice Film Award 2008 Film-makers and new media artistes across the Asia Pacific region are invited to enter their audio-visual creations in this first ever award recognising excellence in films on rice-related issues. Presented by Pesticide Action Network Asia and the Pacific (PAN AP), TVE Asia Pacific (TVEAP) and Public Media Agency (PMA) of Malaysia, the competition is open to both fictional and factual films on the theme of Asia's rice heritage and the threats it faces in this era of globalisation. The films may have been produced using professional video, home video, mobile phones or cinematic equipment. They may be in any of these formats or genres: 2D animation, 3D animation, songs, short drama, satire, adaptations of folk culture or documentary. They need to have been made after 1 January 2008. Entries will be accepted from 1 August 2008 to 31 January 2009. The winner will receive US$ 2,000, plaque and certificate. Details and nomination forms at: www.panap.net/aprfa * * * * * * Asia Pacific Rice Journalist Award 2008 Journalists and columnists from the Asia Pacific region are invited to submit their best articles on rice and rice-related issues. Presented by Pesticide Action Network Asia and the Pacific (PAN AP) and the International Federation of Environmental Journalists, the competition is based on the theme of Asia's rice heritage and the threats it faces in this era of globalisation. Submitted articles must have been published between 1 September 2007 and 31 December 2008 in print or electronic media, or on websites of the said media. While mainstream media are preferred, non-mainstream media will also be considered. The winner will receive US$ 1,000, plaque and certificate. For the complete details and nomination forms, visit www.panap.net/aprja. ................................................................... Nalaka Gunawardene Director and CEO Television for Education - Asia Pacific (TVE Asia Pacific) 9/3, Gemunu Mawatha, Nawala Road, Nugegoda, Sri Lanka. T: +94 11 4412 195; F: +94 11 4403 443; E: nalaka at tveap.org www.tveap.org | www.digits4change.net | www.childrenoftsunami.info | www.savingtheplanet.tv Online video: http://www.youtube.com/TVEAPfilms Personal Blog: http://movingimages.wordpress.com/ -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From j.bonnerjee at qmul.ac.uk Tue Aug 19 18:08:21 2008 From: j.bonnerjee at qmul.ac.uk (j.bonnerjee at qmul.ac.uk) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 13:38:21 +0100 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] CFP: Migration, Diaspora and the City, Calcutta, 12-13 December, 2008 Message-ID: <20080819133821.tbj4lqxmqsco8448@webmail.qmul.ac.uk> Dear Sarai announcement-list editor Would be grateful if you could post the following Call for Papers on the announcement list. Thank you. Sincerely, Jayani Bonnerjee Call for papers: Migration, Diaspora and the City, Calcutta Deadline for abstracts: 1st October, 2008 ------------ Migration, Diaspora and the City: Mobility and Dwelling in Calcutta A two-day international conference 12 ? 13th December 2008, Centre for Studies in Social Sciences, Calcutta Convened in collaboration with the Diaspora Cities research team and The City Centre, Queen Mary, University of London This two-day international and inter-disciplinary conference at the Centre for Studies in Social Sciences, Calcutta, will explore the critical relationships between migration, diaspora and the city, focusing on past and present migrations to and from Calcutta. The conference is convened in collaboration with the Diaspora Cities research team, Queen Mary, University of London and the City Centre. It is funded by The Leverhulme Trust (www.geog.qmul.ac.uk/diasporacities/). Although ideas and lived experiences of diasporas are intrinsically transnational, a wide range of research invokes the nation through material and imaginative connections to a past, present or imagined ?homeland.? Other research focuses on the city primarily as a site of diasporic resettlement. Drawing on research on historical and contemporary migrations to and from Calcutta, this conference will focus on the city as a distinctive location within ?diaspora space? (Brah, 1996) and will address the ways in which the city, as a place of origin, travel, sojourn and resettlement, is a site of territorial and emotional mobility and dwelling. Abstracts are invited from researchers working on past and present migrations to and from Calcutta and on wider conceptual themes concerning migration, diaspora and the city. The conference will address migration within Bengal and India as well as on a transnational scale, and will consider the ideas, experiences and emotions of mobility and dwelling for a wide range of communities within Calcutta and across the Calcuttan diaspora. Conference themes are likely to include: ? Histories and geographies of travel and migration to and from Calcutta ? Oral histories, images and written accounts of Calcutta in diaspora ? Diasporic memories, imaginings and experiences of Calcutta ? Transnational practices and the neo-liberal city ? Tales of urban mobility and dwelling in life stories, cultural practices and representations ? The emotional, embodied and sensory geographies of Calcutta in diaspora ? Public and private spaces of diasporic urbanism ? Mobility and dwelling in relation to urban modernities, cosmopolitanism and consumption Please send abstracts of up to 200 words by 1 October 2008 to Dr Noah Hysler Rubin: N.Rubin at qmul.ac.uk Thank you -- Jayani Bonnerjee Research Student Department of Geography Queen Mary, University of London Mile End Road London E1 4NS j.bonnerjee at qmul.ac.uk _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From sananth99 at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 12:10:48 2008 From: sananth99 at gmail.com (Ananth S) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 12:10:48 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] UN Warns of food neo-colonialism Message-ID: <70c502d20808192340j7e433548s6688b2f0d5e3c9da@mail.gmail.com> UN warns of food 'neo-colonialism' By Javier Blas in London Published: August 19 2008 23:37 | Last updated: August 19 2008 23:37 http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/3d3ede92-6e02-11dd-b5df-0000779fd18c.html The race by food-importing countries to secure farmland overseas to improve their food security risks creating a "neo-colonial" system, the United Nations' top agriculture official has cautioned. The warning by Jacques Diouf, director-general of the Food and Agriculture Organisation, comes as countries from Saudi Arabia to China plan to lease vast tracts of land in Africa and Asia to grow crops and ship them back to their markets. "The risk is of creating a neo-colonial pact for the provision of non- value-added raw materials in the producing countries and unacceptable work conditions for agricultural workers," Mr Diouf said. Financial investors and food companies were also looking to invest in overseas farmland, raising some concerns, officials said. The pursuit of foreign farm investments is the latest sign of how the global food crisis, which has seen record prices for commodities such as wheat and rice, is reshaping the politics of agriculture. This year big providers of agriculture commodities – including India, Russia, Argentina and Vietnam – have restricted exports to keep local markets supplied. Joachim von Braun, director of the International Food Policy Research Institute, said importing nations realised that dependence on the international market made them vulnerable – not only to surging prices but, crucially, also to an interruption in supplies. "They want to secure the supply lines of food," he said. The recent drop in agricultural commodity prices had not altered this view, as food prices remained well above historical levels, analysts said. Middle Eastern and North African countries, which import most of their food, are leading the race to invest overseas. Countries such as Sudan, Ethiopia and Ukraine are opening their doors. Meles Zenawi, prime minister of Ethiopia, said recently its government was "very eager" to provide hundreds of thousands of hectares of agricultural land for investment. Referring to recent investment, Mr Diouf said: "Some negotiations have led to unequal international relations and short-term mercantilist agriculture." His warning is important as he has been a strong supporter of joint ventures between countries with money to invest and those with land and water resources. It reflects unease among diplomats about the race to lock in land and food supplies overseas. The upward trend in leasing such farmland has also caused alarm among western agriculture officials, who worry about countries such as Sudan and Zimbabwe gaining more geopolitical leverage following investment in their agriculture. The FAO has launched a task force to analyse potential problems connected to this, including land rights and the question of how much food would be left for the host country. Behind closed doors, UN officials are discussing whether a scheme similar to the Extractive Industries Transparency Initiative – the programme that helped the oil and minerals industry to tackle corruption and improve governance – could be useful. Copyright The Financial Times Limited 2008 From vikaskaul at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 14:28:28 2008 From: vikaskaul at gmail.com (Vikas Kaul) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 03:58:28 -0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808192235u6ce08cf0t69b38c2105793b84@mail.gmail.com> References: <47e122a70808190448t695a0b02ha7f86a67239b40ae@mail.gmail.com> <136974.81629.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <47e122a70808192235u6ce08cf0t69b38c2105793b84@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: If Ms. Roy, instead of say, an middle-aged man named Sunil Gavaskar, is hired to do commentary on live cricket matches, how long are we going listen to her gibberish? Thank goodness, open markets are smarter than that! Evidently, we have been programmed and indoctrinated to suck on trickle-down-intellectuality. On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 12:35 AM, inder salim wrote: > Dear kshmendra > > 1. i still see 'ethics' as a free electron sharing orbirts between > sexuality, freedom and aesthetics. you talk aboutt ' order of nature' > between same sexes as exception, and therefore, not defining ' > quality relationship' in a society, which reflects 'societal ethics', > necessary for formation of 'law'. i see it a little differently. I > quote text : "sexuality is not innate, but a product", This thought > emnates from simple subjective discourses, which is suitable to > radical thought, necessary of changes in society. Yes, changes, even > to implement ' proporational representation'. You will also have > discover a different law to retain 'kashmir' if PR system for new > democracy is brought into practice. > > > 2. i dont see myself as a blind kashmiri nationalist, in fact, i am > not a natioinalist at all. i want every body to realize her/his inner > artistic being. When i am asking for legalizing 'homosexuality' or a > healty space for 'sex workers' it applies to whole humanity, > irrespection of geography, caste, colour and religon. Needless to > say, that how much artists beling to a universal human being, rather > to a limited concept of ' nationalism' . When Lal Ded was living, > kashmir had indeed a different territory, but she talked about > universal values, quite profoundly which transcends a territory. > Marking territory is a dog behaviour, which has very little to do with > subjective discourse. that is what is feel. > > 3. Time and again, i have talked about my discomfort with idealogical > or religous fundamentalism. So that applies to kashmir and the rest > even. In today's post by Shuddha, we read how Lord Shiva danced with > the poor and opressed , and clebrated ' datura' an intoxicant which > too has not legal sanction is Brahmnical Hinduism, or law. I beleive, > the job a true believer, is to rip the text, what Derrida taught, and > what even many seers and saints did in their times. Mansoor Halaj > will be known for his defiance against the ruling elite who killed him > in the name of defending the sacred text. When we defend the law of > land as sacred text, we are playing the role of an opressor. This > happens at various levels of thought. I am constantly examinging my > behaviour at the same time. That is my inner process, too. > Deconstruction is ' performativity', too. > > 4. India needs freedom of kashmir as much kashmir needs, This is what > Arundhati Roy said, I agree with it, There should an end to this > Kashmirs as villians in india and vice versa. And if that new free > kashmir is bereft of ethics, morality, and respect to its past, it > shall be our duty to talk about that, like we talk about it now. About > demolition of temples in kashmir, i remember, the famous Iranisna flim > maker, who said that the responsibiltiy of destruction of Bamyaan > Buddhas statues in Afganistan lies on the shoulders of Americans. I > see Indian mindless policy directly responsible for jamat-it islami > kind of things in kashmir. When Sheik Mohd Abudhha was bullied by > India, and when his audience was shrinking, he went to hazratbal and > spoke from a different mike. If you push the other, then violence > looks inevitable. it is all sad, but we need to be couragous to speak > the truth, and return to subjectivity and not define our acts as ' > natural' and others as as 'unatural' > > with love and regards > is > > > > i want kashmiris to get what india has promised them in 1947. it > should be their choice to be what they want to be. It has a lot to do > with ehichs and morality. Yes, kashmiri pandits suffered > > On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 7:05 PM, Kshmendra Kaul > wrote: > > Dear Inder Salim > > > > 1. Sexual Choices (Morality) of an individual or between consenting > Adults > > has nothing to do with Ethics. For and between individuals (as I wrote > > earlier to Aarti) the "Individual Ethics" as for example of Sexual > Choices > > (Morality) defines the quality of relationships. The 'Societal Ethics' of > > Sexual Choices come into reckoning only when one person's Sexual Choices > > adversely impact another person's choices. > > > > 2. Go ahead and legalise homosexuality in India. You do not need my > > permission. I have no objection to it. > > > > 3. But wait a minute, I see you expressing contempt for India time and > > again. You condemn anyone talking in favour of Indian Nationalism but are > > quick to speak in favour of Kashmiri Nationalism. When questioned over > this > > contradiction you play dumb, deaf and blind and ignore the query. What is > > your interest in India? > > > > 4. You should ask for the legalising of homosexuality in Kashmir. It will > be > > interesting to see how your demand will be received in Kashmir. > > > > 5. As far as India is concerned, there is some ongoing litigation over > this > > in Delhi High Court. A competent Legal Team might be able to successfully > > argue it out. > > > > 6. From what I have read, it will not be possible for a Court of Law to > > strike down the Act under which homosexuality is interpreted as an > offence > > but they could adjucate that the interpretation of the Act should not > > harshly extend itself to treating homosexuality as being criminal > behaviour. > > > > The Act talks about the criminality of "carnal intercourse against the > > order of nature with another person of the same sex". In my opinion, a > > skillful Lawyer could argue over the "Order of Nature" bit. It would be > > rrrrrather difficult to get Nature to give evidence about what it's > "Order' > > is. There are also examples available in the "Living Nature" domain > > (excluding Humans) where same sex carnal intercourse takes place. These > are > > exceptions of sexual behaviour amongst various species but so are they > > amongst humans. > > > > 6. You have selectively quoted and also possibly selectively read what I > > wrote. I did not say that the 'multi party system' makes a mockery of > > 'Democracy' but that the "first past the post system" (used to declare > > candidates in an Election as successful) that we follow in our "multi > party > > system" makes a mockery of Democracy in India. I hope you see the > > difference. Please read carefully before commenting. > > > > 7. Certainly those who love India (which excludes a hate monger like you) > > must celeberate "Democracy" in India. But the current system is far from > > being perfect and needs to be rectified. What is your problem in that? > > > > 8. The same system (by and large) is followed in the UK and I would not > be > > surprised that with stronger showings (vote shares) for the Liberal > > Democrats and Greens, in the UK they will start pondering over how > > to rectify the system. > > > > 9. Some countries already have more credible systems where they use > > "Proportional Representation" or "Multiple Rounds of Voting" or > > "Preferential Voting". But, the dynamics of each country are unique and > > India will have to find out what suits it best as a rectification of the > > current system. > > > > Kshmendra > > > > --- On Tue, 8/19/08, inder salim wrote: > > > > From: inder salim > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > > To: reader-list at sarai.net > > Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2008, 5:18 PM > > > > I quote kshmendra : > > > > "Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or > > importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)" > > > > I quote khsmendra again: > > > > "that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the > > essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be > > rectified". > > > > Now my reflection to that: i know examples are slippery, but, a case > > in the point: what about legalizing Homosexuality in India? here, if > > you see me as one individual maverick, then we grossly differ on > > ETHICS and and LAW > > > > about multi party system, which you feel makes a 'mockery of > > democracy', is again, a negation of what you said in the begining, > > a > > After all the present day system of democracry is celebrated by > > majority of the people in INDIA. or you think indians are 'invidual > > mavericks', who dont care about ETHICS but follow THE CONSTITUTIOIN > > blindly. > > > > love > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Kshmendra Kaul > > > wrote: > >> Dear Aarti > >> > >> Ethical must be Legal. Legal must be Ethical. If this basic principle is > > not adhered to then there is a flawed interpretation of either the Legal > or > > the > > Ethical. Worse still is the possibility that the 'accepted and adhered to > or > > propagated' Ethics or the Legality might in themselves be corrupted. > >> > >> Left to Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no > consequence > > or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority > > voice)interpretation, "Ethics" of particular relationships, could and > > often do find themselves varyingly defined. When such varying definitions > > are > > pertinent to inter-personal or inter-transactional situations, the > quality > > of > > the relationship gets defined. > >> > >> In what was being discussed, we must focus on 'societal Ethics'. > > Such "Ethics" that permeate through and get defined for all of the > > society. These must find themselves reflected in the "Laws", in the > > "Legal". So, 'Ethical' must be 'Legal' and the > > 'Legal' must be 'Ethical'. > >> > >> The 'Legal' gets defined by the 'Laws'. The > > "Laws" derive themselves either directly from the > > 'Constitution' or from Legislation as allowed for in the > > "Constitution". > >> > >> Therefore, yes certainly Ethical must be seamlessly identifiable with > the > > Legal. What do you find 'frightening' in this? > >> > >> You could argue that aspects of the Indian Constitution are not Ethical > > and therefore the Laws and Legality derived from them are not Ethical. > Those > > then need to be rectified once you identify them. No such specific > examples > > come > > readily to my mind. You might have some. > >> > >> I would readily agree with you if you and I find common our examples of > > where the Lawful or the Legal does not seem to Ethical. But, your and my > > views > > would always be subservient to how the Constitution views such Laws or > > Legalities. Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no > > consequence or > > importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice) that > > finds > > itself reflected in the Constitution or the Laws and Legalities derived > from > > it. > >> > >> You might be resentful of and confrontational against and constantly > > questioning of the "State". I am not. We the people are the > > "State". That should be seamless. If you said it is not always so, I > > would agree. But there is no lack of opportunity or means for making it > so. > > Is'nt that what Democracy is all about. > >> > >> The 'categories' that the 'state' gives us, are > > "categories" that 'we the people' have made as having been > > participants in the formation, running and conduct of the "State". > >> > >> What is in any case wrong with the "categories" you have quoted. > >> > >> Are the Police the "Guardians of the Law"? Yes they are. Are > > those who break the Law, the 'law breakers'? Yes they are. Are those who > > confront the Police, the "hoodlums"? Yes they are. > >> > >> Again it could be argued that in India, the Police are not always (in > fact > > often are not I would say) the "Guardians of the Law". That the Police > > in India have the propensity for 'unlimited terror'. Agreed. That needs > > to be worked upon by 'we the People' and rectified. But that cannot be > > used as an excuse to provide a blanket immunity to or indemnify the > > "hoodlums" and "law breakers". > >> > >> Enough of my simple minded theorising. Let us come to the specifics of > > where this discussion started. > >> > >> In the case of both the "Jammu Agitation" and the "Kashmir > > Agitation", the agitationists acted at varying times in varying ways as > > "hoodlums" and as "law breakers". The Police, the > > "Guardians of Law" were justified in acting against them. > >> > >> There is of course the question of "use of force beyond the > > requirement of the situation". Both the "Jammu Agitationists" and > > the "Kashmir Agitationists" are complaining about that. This has to > > be, must be, addressed and rectified. Not an excuse though for there > being > > an > > 'open season' for the 'hoodlums' and 'law breakers' > >> > >> Kshmendra > >> > >> PS. Since I mentioned "Democracy", I must also say that India > > follows a convoluted interpretation of "Democracy". The 'first > > past the post' system that we follow in our 'multi party system' > > makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs > > to be rectified. But, thats another story. > >> > >> > >> --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > >> > >> From: Aarti Sethi > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > >> To: "mahmood farooqui" > >> Cc: "sarai list" > >> Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 2:20 AM > >> > >> Dear Kshmendra, > >> > >> I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state > >> gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a > >> "law-breaker" > >> who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening > this > >> sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its > capacity > >> for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified > >> with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. > >> > >> best > >> A > >> > >> On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < > >> mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > >>> From: mahmood farooqui > >>> Date: 2008/8/14 > >>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > >>> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > >>> > >>> > >>> Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the > >> responses > >>> are making me think. > >>> > >>> Best, > >>> Mahmood > >>> > >>> 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul > >>> > >>> Dear Mahmood > >>> > > >>> > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly > > are. > >> You are trying > >>> > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. > >>> > > >>> > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum > >>> > attacking a policeman. > >>> > > >>> > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police > > firing. > >> If > >>> > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law > > and/or > >>> > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum > > injured > >> by > >>> > police firing. > >>> > > >>> > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it > > communal. > >>> > > >>> > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking > > hoodlums > >> in > >>> > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? > >>> > > >>> > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of > > photographs, > >> one where > >>> law > >>> > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another > > one > >>> where > >>> > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. > >>> > > >>> > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the > >> photographs, > >>> one > >>> > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' > >> tinge > >>> > > >>> > Kshmendra > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > > >>> >*wrote: > >>> > > >>> > From: mahmood farooqui > >>> > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures > >>> > To: "sarai list" , > > "Aamir > >> Bashir" < > >>> > unattore1 at gmail.com> > >>> > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM > >>> > > >>> > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley > > because > >> of > >>> the > >>> > police firing. > >>> > > >>> > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan > >> Times, > >>> > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a > >> Kashmiri. > >>> > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by > > the > >>> police. > >>> > > >>> > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the > >> police > >>> > firing. > >>> > > >>> > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? > >>> > > >>> > Is the poser itself simplistic? > >>> > _________________________________________ > >>> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >>> > Critiques & Collaborations > >>> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >>> subscribe in > >>> > the subject header. > >>> > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >>> > List archive: > >> > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> _________________________________________ > >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >>> Critiques & Collaborations > >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >>> subscribe in the subject header. > >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >>> List archive: > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > >> the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > >> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > > > > > > > > -- > > > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe > > in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 20 17:01:07 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:31:07 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> References: <4C5A052F-0A44-4806-9197-A2624A4A58A5@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808170840v43e5e301xf9aef940c1910c0b@mail.gmail.com> <"9c06a ab30808170851y1d1d4a84w7709a0b0c497b04"@mail.gmail.com> <"6b79f1a70808170853g4 b5c830bgac3e827e0e9beb85"@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808170905p4099325epe86db71cdbb5db5c@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808170911v20823dbci5e199b0cc01434f9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: A community which can not, and do not want to identify, isolate and let the law take care of the deviant behaviour of fanatic individuals, has to respond only in those words. A community which has individuals who create a NGO to defend, provide logistical support for fasadi activities, has lawyers who for hefty fee have no hesitation to sheltor, support and defend the criminals for being friends of fasadis, have no choice of different words. Just compare this with hindus who have no hesitation to condemn their even "saints" and togadias, if they talk of violent means for the faith.! regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Pawan Durani Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008 9:42 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: Sarai , Shuddhabrata Sengupta > Yes , they are . For once they are telling a truth...for a change > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > > Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a taxi driver or a shopkeeper > > and you know what you will hear? > > > > "We are al terorrists here." > > > > best > > shivam > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a terrorist. > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > > mail at shivamvij.com> > > > wrote: > > > > Pawan bhai, you might want to read my reply again. > > > > > > > > While Geelani's Pak inclinations are well known, he is not > the only > > > > leader, his is not he only view. Even he has been forced to > tone hem > > > > down over the years because public sentiment is for azadi. > And if you > > > > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that > the Pakistan > > > > bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various > reasons most > > > > Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an option. > > > > > > > > Okay, let's stop debating this how about a referendum? > > > > > > > > And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of communal > elements but > > > > to equate Geelani with Advani or Modi is a bit too much. I > am not > > > > getting into the chap act of body counts... > > > > > > > > best > > > > shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > > > Shivam, > > > > > > > > > > Make no mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no > less dangerous > > > than > > > > > an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. > > > > > > > > > > What do you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa > laa " > > > > > > > > > > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" > > > > > > > > > > Kashmir so called Azaadi struggle has been the most > dangerous and > > > communal > > > > > movement which has effected even the world super powers. > > > > > > > > > > For more info log on www.ikashmir.net > > > > > > > > > > Pawan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sonia, > > > > > > > > > > > > This is not the first time you are equating the azadi > movement in > > > > > > Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While Shuddha has > already> laboured > > > > > > over the diference in the two cases, I want to add that > this is a > > > > > > dangerously sweeping comparison, and that you can go > only so far > > with > > > > > > it. This generalised comparison helps you label the > entire azadi > > > > > > sruggle as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim > concerns.> While > > > > > > I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the > Kashmiri> > > > > Muslims mainly want independence from India - > not Hindus? If it was > > > > > > about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, > wouldn't the > > majority > > > > > > demand be for Pakistan rather than an independent nation- > state?> > > > > > > > > > > Warmly, > > > > > > Shivam > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Shuddha, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points > you have > > > raised. > > > > > You > > > > > > > may not have named it as such but the feeling in the > valley is > > very > > > much > > > > > > > about a Hindu state resorting to greater violence > against Muslim > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > than Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this > conclusion> > given > > > > > > > India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely > trying to > > point > > > out > > > > > that > > > > > > > in Kashmir the situation was slightly different, and =3E obviously> not > > > to > > > > > accuse > > > > > > > you of communal thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read with some surprise your taking issue with my > use of the > > > phrase, > > > > > > > Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of > slogans used > > during > > > the > > > > > > > protests. It is incomplete and I could add a few more > but I > > really > > > > > don¹t > > > > > > > want to vitiate and already horrible situation. I¹m > sure you > > > remember > > > > > 1989 > > > > > > > and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a > similar argument > > > when > > > > > > > challenged. He said something like, what is communal or > > provocative > > > > > about > > > > > > > taking God¹s name? What, indeed, except when there is > a thousand > > > strong > > > > > mob > > > > > > > screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim > localities as > > they > > > did > > > > > in > > > > > > > Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe that as baying for blood. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Incidentally, here¹s a report in the HT on the Police > vs. CRPF > > > > > culpability: > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > THE KASHMIR situation has taken a new turn with police > becoming> the > > > main > > > > > > > target of protesters. > > > > > > > There have also been calls for their social boycott. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The local population is angry for the police's "brutal > conduct> > against > > > > > their > > > > > > > own people". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > State police has been active alongside the CRPF to > crush protests > > in > > > > > Kashmir > > > > > > > over the past four days, which left 23 dead and around 200 > > injured. > > > > > > > Incidentally, the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" > > marchers > > > in > > > > > Uri > > > > > > > on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, > station house > > > officer of > > > > > > > Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat leader Shaikh > Aziz and two > > > others > > > > > > > were killed in the incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said > "it was a > > > target > > > > > > > killing". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence in > Baramullah and > > > torched > > > > > it. > > > > > > > They also torched Sheeri police station. Several such > incidents> have > > > > > been > > > > > > > reported across the Valley People at Handwara have > called for a > > > social > > > > > > > boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents of > Srinagar's Raj > > > Bagh > > > > > > > locality took out a protest march on Wednesday, asking > the police > > > > > "whether > > > > > > > they stand for India or for their people in Kashmir". > This is in > > > stark > > > > > > > contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then > were seen > > as > > > > > > > "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and joined > militancy.> > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From mitoo at sarai.net Wed Aug 20 13:11:45 2008 From: mitoo at sarai.net (Mitoo Das) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:11:45 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Positions Available Message-ID: <48ABCAB9.7040906@sarai.net> *POSTITIONS AVAILABLE* The Cultural and Material life of Media Piracy is a three year project carried out by the Sarai programme of the CSDS in collaboration with the Alternative Law Forum Bangalore. We begin with the premise that piracy is widespread in places where a media-saturated modernity meets severe inequalities of purchasing power for books, software, recordings, videos and other knowledge products. One of the key aims of this research project will be to understand this media environment as it unfolds itself in diverse contexts. The main research node is in India with comparative work in China and Pakistan. The Sarai-ALF teams of researchers work in tandem with an international project on media piracy with fellow researchers in Brazil, South Africa and Russia. The larger study is coordinated by the SSRC (New York). The project seeks to open different debates on piracy other than simply that of enforcement and criminality. Through research, we hope to generate discussions of cultural needs, community practices of sharing and circulation in societies of high inequality. We will also look at media industry approaches to piracy and enforcement strategies. In addition, there will be ethnographic and quantitative work on media use in neighbourhoods. The study of piracy offers a unique vantage point to study the media environment, through the sites of media and its movement across limits set by law, the complexity of user-bases, and the diversity of cultural delivery platforms. We are looking for bright, energetic and qualified researchers who can work in collaboration with a regional and international team. Applicants must demonstrate abilities to research and write on the subject. A familiarity with the debate on piracy and the creative commons is preferable. *Social science and Humanities applicants should have completed post graduate degrees and law students- a four year programme. * *Researcher One: Delhi* The researcher will be looking at fieldwork material on media piracy in the Sarai archive, as well as conduct neighbourhood surveys slate to begin in 2009. Work will include research papers presentations and collaborative work with the team. *Researcher Two: Mumbai* The researcher will be looking at the range of piracy strategies pursued by media industries in the film and music sectors. Research will span the larger media companies as well as the smaller companies. Work will include research papers presentations and collaborative work with the team. Applicants from outside Mumbai are also welcome to apply for this position, although Mumbai based work will be significant. Remuneration will be *Rs 28000/ a month*. Interested applicants may send their *CV* and a written research sample to *researchjobs at sarai.net by September 20, 2008*. * Applications without a written research sample will not be entertained. * Links SSRC piracy project: http://programs.ssrc.org/ccit/ip/ Sarai, CSDS : http://www.sarai.net/research/knowledge-culture/knowledge-and-culture ALF: www.altlawforum.org -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 18:34:06 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:34:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Clarifications/protestations Message-ID: Dear Shuddha, Finally got a chance to sit down and read your last mail to me and I think again you have misunderstood. I¹m sorry. Evidently it is not just you who has misread my posts so it must be me at fault! I will try again so here goes: 1. Pl see my first email on the subject where the Œbaying for blood¹ phrase was used in the context of the police/CRPF having to face a mob, 100,000 + strong. I condemned the firing upon unarmed protestors but conjectured how it must feel to confront a mob that size that is coming with aggressive intent towards one. In my second mail, in response to your taking issue with my use of the phrase I compared your reasoning and justification of mob violence with Advani¹s. I am not equating the event of the march to the LoC and Advani¹s wrath yatra or the Œ92 & Œ93 violence. Do you see the difference? 2. Of course there is a difference between the attack on a 16th c. mosque and a bunker!! I¹m truly appalled that you of all people think you need to point this out to someone who cut her teeth on the politics of Babri Masjid. I was hardly equating the two. You¹d need to feel some sympathy or agreement with the mosque being perceived as a sign of oppression, and no, let me categorically state that I don¹t and that I am fully aware of the bunker being the potential locus where bullets are likely to be fired from. I was merely trying to point out, and I quote: Œ...that once you give a group a carte blanche to do as they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you have very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with politically do the same.¹ It¹s got nothing to do with whether I find justification or not in that perception. That is why I also used the examples of Sabina¹s house and the ransacking of Moulvi Abbas Ansari¹s house. Events have moved on since we had our last exchange. The Hurriyat leaders realized the potential danger in what I call violent assembly and you call non-violent assembly. They called for restraint because they knew that not doing so would mean escalation of tempers and violence and death. (This was what I was trying to point out in my earlier mails.) In every single gathering since then the Kashmiris have been disciplined and have won my admiration and I¹m sure the admiration of many around the world. 100,000 people gathered in Pampore and protested peacefully. I must point out that not a single bullet was fired by the CRPF or the police, because despite similar numbers the mood was very different from the one that was present on the march to the LoC. There is a new feeling of great excitement within the people of Kashmir. They can see for themselves what it means to be part of non-violent movement, to form human chains around the police so that they would be safe from the people, to protest peacefully. They have demonstrated to the world that the power of the people in a non-violent movement is far greater than the firepower of the militants. I hope that it is something that they will hold on to because it is more valuable than anything that has happened in the last two decades. Having said that, I still don¹t agree with the politics. I don¹t see how this issue will be resolved since every single issue of J&K has been thrown up in the churning: land & pilgrimage (the easiest to deal with), regional imbalance and resentment on both sides, the Hindu-Muslim divide (all too depressing) nationalism-sub-nationalisms, India-Pakistan... I think the clock has been turned back and irreparable damage has been done to relations between the people of Kashmir and Jammu. And with the BJP taking this on as a national issue I can only hope it¹s not the beginning of another Babri Masjid. With warmest regards, Sonia. From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 18:59:03 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:59:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <06C490A2-AACF-4AEB-B702-10D65E9A6AE7@sarai.net> Message-ID: Dear Shuddha, Though I virulently disagree with young Aditya Raj Kaul's politics I have to say in his defence that he wasn't lying about the 'Inshallah!' There was an elderly man, I don't know who he was, who had earlier quite correctly thanked the BJP for doing what the militants had been unable to do thus far, vitiated the atmosphere to the degree that every Kashmiri loathed the idea of India. It was he who cried, Inshallah! Something strange happens with the lapel mikes in the NDTV studio. Every mike is not on all the time. I've had that happen to me before where I thought I had been able to hit back at Ravishankar Prasad but when I saw the program later, no such thing happened. It wasn't in the editing because all that he was saying was being heard perfectly, so it's not that they just cut those bits out. I think the mikes are controlled by the producers who let some of the cacophony in, not all. Best sj On 8/17/08 11:44 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Dear Aditya Raj Kaul, I watched the debate, and it was carried live, and I > did not hear anyone saying Inshallah, Surely if they had 'screamed' > Inshallah, given that every other shouting voice was heard, we would have > heard it. Since there were several Kashmiri muslims in the studio this > evening, some of whom had lapel mikes, if they had all (or even several of > them) screamed 'Inshallah.' surely, we would have heard. For instance, > there was a young man, identified as Kashmiri muslim, who was sitting right > next to you. I did not hear him say Inshallah, I did not hear Sajjad Lone, > or Muzaffar Beig, say Inshallah. What I did hear was Mr. Khajuria saying > that he would lead marchers towards Baltal, (now, after the pilgrimage > period is over, so he would not be leading a party of pilgrims), which I > surely consider provocative, and a deliberate raising of the pitch of > tension. I do hope that no Kashmiri is misled by this provocation to try and > confront this 'proposed' march. As that is the deliberate intention. It > would be terrible if the peaceful nature of the protests in Kashmir were to > be destroyed by provocative statements from a BJP politician. It should be > ignored. We also heard (at the tail end of the programme) a man who had been > a yatri, who has done seva at the Amarnath shrine, saying that he has had > no problems. If Kashmiri muslims are (all, without exception) as communal as > you seem to suggest, then surely, he would have faced some problems. We also > heard a young Kashmiri pandit who lives in Srinagar, studies in Kashmir > university, who expressed sentiments that did not align with yours, so > clearly, neither Kashmiri Muslims, nor Kashmiri Pandits, speak in a set of > binary voices without any internal variation. Incidentally, your > contribution, though brief ( I sincerely hope it was not edited away, and it > did not seem to be, as it was a live programme) had nothing of consequence > to offer by way of a way forward, all you could speak of was the fact that > Amarnath is the 'last Hindu structure in Kashmir' which is factually > incorrect. The kheer bhawani temple ,and several others, continue to be > active, and actually have been having pilgrims and worshippers coming to > them. I think you should reflect on the fact that you went out on a major > news channel, live and said something factually incorrect. I am willing to > think that you might have said this in the heat of the moment, without > thought or pause, but do consider the fact that it does go out as a > significant distortion of the truth. regards Shuddha On 17-Aug-08, at > 10:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > An interesting thing just happened. > > > I'm returning from a NDTV debate (If i can take the liberty to call > it > one) > on the current developments in J&K. The Panelists included a wide > > range of > opinions from valley, Jammu and also from here in New Delhi; among > > them > Abhishek Manu Singhvi, Swapan Das Gupta, Muzafar Baig, Sajad Lone, > > Ashok > Khajuria, Omar Abdulalh and my friend Sonia Jabbar were the few > > voices. > > It was as expected a very heated debate and matters became worse > > when Sajad > Lone challenged Jammu Samiti and Kashmiri Pandits to claim > their > right on > the Baltal Land. > > At almost the end of the show, BJP's > voice from Jammu Ashok > Khajuria rightly > said, "Kashmiri Separatists and > vested interests want to create a > Nizam-e-Mustafa" in the valley. To which, > the Kashmiri Muslims in > the studio > screamed, "Inshallah". > > Now, thats > what speaks for their Secularism !!! An Islamic State.... > > > On 8/17/08, > Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: >> >> You obviously > understand that that statement is rhetorical, and you >> know what it is > trying to say. If only you could go past your ow >> rhetoric... >> >> On > 8/17/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् >> wrote: >>> :) >>> >>> > On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani wrote: >>>> Yes , they are . > For once they are telling a truth...for a change >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sun, Aug > 17, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् >>>> विज् < >> > mail at shivamvij.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>> Say that in Srinagar to a shikawala or a > taxi driver or a >>>>> shopkeeper >>>>> and you know what you will > hear? >>>>> >>>>> "We are all terorrists here." >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> > best >>>>> shivam >>>>> >>>>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani > wrote: >>>>>> Yeah ...i agree .Geelani is a > terrorist. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Shivam Vij > >>>>>> शिवम् विज् >>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> Pawan bhai, > you might want to read my reply again. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> While Geelani's Pak > inclinations are well known, he is not the >> only >>>>>>> leader, his is not > he only view. Even he has been forced to tone >> hem >>>>>>> down over the > years because public sentiment is for azadi. >>>>>>> And if >> you >>>>>>> > talk to people in Srinagar, they will often tell you that the >> > Pakistan >>>>>>> bogey is often an act of provocation, and for various > reasons >> most >>>>>>> Kashmiris don't trust Pakistan, don't see that as an > option. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Okay, let's stop debating this how about a > referendum? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And the Kashmir azadi movement has its share of > communal >>>>>>> elements >> but >>>>>>> to equate Geelani with Advani or > Modi is a bit too much. I am >>>>>>> not >>>>>>> getting into the chap act > of body counts... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> best >>>>>>> > shivam >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 8/17/08, Pawan Durani > wrote: >>>>>>>> Shivam, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Make no > mistake , that Kashmir "Azadi" agitation is no less >>>> dangerous >>>>>> > than >>>>>>>> an Al Qaida or a Talibani Movement. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What do > you mean by "Pakitsan Se rishta Kya...la illa illa laa >> " >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> > And Geelani saying "Jeeve Jeeve Pakistan" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Kashmir so called > Azaadi struggle has been the most dangerous >> and >>>>>> communal >>>>>>>> > movement which has effected even the world super powers. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For > more info log on www.ikashmir.net >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> > Pawan >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 9:03 PM, Shivam Vij > >>>>>>>> शिवम् विज् >>>>>> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> > Dear Sonia, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This is not the first time you are equating > the azadi >> movement in >>>>>>>>> Kashmir with the Hindutva movement. While > Shuddha has already >>>> laboured >>>>>>>>> over the diference in the two > cases, I want to add that this >> is a >>>>>>>>> dangerously sweeping > comparison, and that you can go only so >> far >>>> with >>>>>>>>> it. This > generalised comparison helps you label the entire >> azadi >>>>>>>>> sruggle > as cmmunal, as being mtivated by Hindu/Mulsim >> concerns. >>>> > While >>>>>>>>> I don't deny the absence of this, do you admit that the >> > Kashmiri >>>>>>>>> Muslims mainly want independence from India - not Hindus? > If >> it >>>> was >>>>>>>>> about the Hindu-Muslim, Hindutva-Jehad binaries, > wouldn't the >>>> majority >>>>>>>>> demand be for Pakistan rather than an > independent >> nation-state? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Warmly, >>>>>>>>> > Shivam >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 8/16/08, S. Jabbar > wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi Shuddha, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> A > quick & hopefully short reply to some of the points you >> have >>>>>> > raised. >>>>>>>> You >>>>>>>>>> may not have named it as such but the feeling > in the valley >> is >>>> very >>>>>> much >>>>>>>>>> about a Hindu state > resorting to greater violence against >> Muslim >>>>>> Kashmir >>>>>>>>>> than > Hindu Jammu. While it is easy to arrive at this >> conclusion >>>>>> > given >>>>>>>>>> India¹s history of communal violence, I was merely trying >> > to >>>> point >>>>>> out >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> in Kashmir the situation was > slightly different, and >> obviously >>>> not >>>>>> to >>>>>>>> > accuse >>>>>>>>>> you of communal thinking. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I read with > some surprise your taking issue with my use of >> the >>>>>> > phrase, >>>>>>>>>> Œbaying for blood¹ and your accompanying list of slogans >> > used >>>> during >>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> protests. It is incomplete and I could > add a few more but >> I >>>> really >>>>>>>> don¹t >>>>>>>>>> want to vitiate > and already horrible situation. I¹m sure >> you >>>>>> remember >>>>>>>> > 1989 >>>>>>>>>> and the slogan ŒJai Sri Ram.¹ Advani had used a similar >>>> > argument >>>>>> when >>>>>>>>>> challenged. He said something like, what is > communal or >>>> provocative >>>>>>>> about >>>>>>>>>> taking God¹s name? > What, indeed, except when there is a >>>> thousand >>>>>> strong >>>>>>>> > mob >>>>>>>>>> screaming God¹s name and marching towards Muslim localities >> > as >>>> they >>>>>> did >>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> Œ92 and Œ93. I would describe > that as baying for blood. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, here¹s a report > in the HT on the Police vs. >> CRPF >>>>>>>> culpability: >>>>>>>>>> > ----------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> THE KASHMIR > situation has taken a new turn with police >> becoming >>>> the >>>>>> > main >>>>>>>>>> target of protesters. >>>>>>>>>> There have also been calls > for their social boycott. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The local population is angry > for the police's "brutal >> conduct >>>>>> against >>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>> > own people". >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> State police has been active alongside the > CRPF to crush >>>> protests in >>>>>>>> Kashmir >>>>>>>>>> over the past four > days, which left 23 dead and around 200 >>>> injured. >>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, > the contingent that fired on the "cross-LOC" >>>> marchers >>>>>> in >>>>>>>> > Uri >>>>>>>>>> on August 10 was led by a local Khursheed Khan, station >> > house >>>>>> officer of >>>>>>>>>> Sheeri police station. Senior Hurriyat > leader Shaikh Aziz >> and >>>> two >>>>>> others >>>>>>>>>> were killed in the > incident. Mirwaiz Ummer Faroog said "it >> was a >>>>>> target >>>>>>>>>> > killing". >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hundreds of people attacked Khan's residence > in Baramullah >> and >>>>>> torched >>>>>>>> it. >>>>>>>>>> They also torched > Sheeri police station. Several such >> incidents >>>> have >>>>>>>> > been >>>>>>>>>> reported across the Valley People at Handwara have called >> > for a >>>>>> social >>>>>>>>>> boycott of cops and their relatives. Residents > of >> Srinagar's Raj >>>>>> Bagh >>>>>>>>>> locality took out a protest march > on Wednesday, asking the >>>> police >>>>>>>> "whether >>>>>>>>>> they stand > for India or for their people in Kashmir". This >> is in >>>>>> > stark >>>>>>>>>> contrast to 1990, when militancy erupted. Police then were >> > seen >>>> as >>>>>>>>>> "friendly". Hundreds of cops had resigned and > joined >> militancy. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> > -------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> National Highway - > http://shivamvij.com/ >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> > -- >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> National Highway - > http://shivamvij.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> National Highway > - http://shivamvij.com/ >>> >> >> >> -- >> >> National Highway - > http://shivamvij.com/ >> _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & > Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The > Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Wed Aug 20 20:42:49 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 08:12:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808192235u6ce08cf0t69b38c2105793b84@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <942527.23745.qm@web57212.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Inder Salim   Your tendency to trapeze all over the place and delve simultaneously into a number of subjects makes it difficult for me to have a well-reasoned or reasonable dialogue with you. Almost every single time I have interacted with you, I have let you have the last say  because I have reached a stage of "I cannot handle THIS any more".   Your 'stream of consciousness' style of discussion does not suit me since I do not have that kind of an intellectual skill. My limitations. So it does not interest me.   Much of what you wrote in your last post eluded the limitations of my undersatanding. My request to you is that if you are interested that I respond then please stick to the topic. Another request is that the freedom with which you ask questions and expect answers must be reciprocated by you in equal measure in answering questions asked of you.   Aarti found 'frightening' my 'seamlessly' mentioning 'Ethical' and 'Legal'. I tried to respond to that with my argued point of view as best as I could.    That is when you stepped in.   You quoted me partially and thereby attributed to me a distorted interpretation of my "mockery of democracy" statement. I pointed this out to you with explanations. You have not commented on that. I realise that you are brimful with "hate" so might find it difficult to accept reason.   You asked about "legalising Homosexuality in India". I addressed it best that I could. You have not commented on that.   Instead, in your 'stream' you have chosen to 'flow forth' at one go with "ethics"; "electrons"; "sexuality"; "freedom"; "aesthetics"; "order of nature"; "quality relationship"; "societal ethics"; "law"; "radical thought"; "changes in society"; "proporational representation"; "Kashmir"; "democracy". That was your preamble.   I am not sure whether you are the idiot or I am, I am not sure whether you are confused or are trying to confuse me, but one thing I am sure about is that I understood very little of whatever you were trying to say. My limitations.   How then can I possibly respond.   - A kind soul has suggested that perhaps readings from the works of Emmanuel Levinas might explain how "Ethics" is not of the "Individual". That might be of interest to you. I personally have no idea who Levinas is.   - You have misquoted me. I never spoke about """""" ' order of nature' between same sexes as  exception, and therefore, not defining 'quality relationship' in a society,""""""". You must apologise to me for misquoting me so blatantly.   - You are free to believe that """""  "sexuality is not innate, but a product", """""". I have no objection. But, honestly I have no idea what you are trying to convey through that half-baked quote.   - I again have no idea what relevance your specifically mentioning Kashmir has to "Electoral Reforms". "Proportional Representation" was incidentally only one of the examples I had mentioned.   - Since the "K" word has come up, I have a very low opinion of your understandings about "Kashmir". I also have no respect for your positions on Kashmir. So, unless you say something really worthwhile, you deserve to be ignored.   - Again while on "Kashmir" it is shocking to see many a times, how easily you get away with quoting a line or two of Kashmiri Poetry and with devious mis-translation distort the very essence of the Poem by presenting it out of context.   I could go on about the rest of what you have written but do not have a whiff of an idea what the connections are with what was being discussed. I do not want to waste my time and yours. You wanted an opportunity to give your discourse whether pertinent or not to what was being discussed. You have given your discourse.      Kshmendra    Regarding your Postscript. You obviously have no idea of what you are talking about when you say "i want kashmiris to get what india has promised them in 1947. it should be their choice to be what they want to be." Your statement only reinforces my very low opinion of your understandings about "Kashmir"        --- On Wed, 8/20/08, inder salim wrote: From: inder salim Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 20, 2008, 11:05 AM Dear kshmendra 1. i still see 'ethics' as a free electron sharing orbirts between sexuality, freedom and aesthetics. you talk aboutt ' order of nature' between same sexes as  exception, and therefore, not defining ' quality relationship' in a society, which reflects, 'societal ethics', necessary for formation of 'law'. i see it a little differently. I quote text : "sexuality is not innate, but a product", This thought emnates from simple subjective discourses, which is suitable to radical thought, necessary of changes in society. Yes, changes, even to implement ' proporational representation'. You will also have discover a different law to retain 'kashmir' if PR system for new democracy is brought into practice. 2. i dont see myself as a blind kashmiri nationalist, in fact, i am not a natioinalist at all. i want every body to realize her/his inner artistic being. When i am asking for legalizing 'homosexuality' or a healty space for 'sex workers' it applies to whole humanity, irrespection of geography, caste, colour and religon. Needless to say, that how much artists beling to a universal human being, rather to a limited concept of ' nationalism' . When Lal Ded was living, kashmir had indeed a different territory, but she talked about universal values, quite profoundly which transcends a territory. Marking territory is a dog behaviour, which has very little to do with subjective discourse. that is what is feel. 3. Time and again, i have talked about my discomfort with idealogical or religous fundamentalism. So that applies to kashmir and the rest even. In today's post by Shuddha, we read how Lord Shiva danced with the poor and opressed , and clebrated ' datura' an intoxicant which too has not legal sanction is Brahmnical Hinduism, or law. I beleive, the job a true believer, is to rip the text, what Derrida taught, and what even many seers and saints did in their times. Mansoor Halaj will be known for his defiance against the ruling elite who killed him in the name of defending the sacred text. When we defend the law of land as sacred text, we are playing the role of an opressor. This happens at various levels of thought. I am constantly examinging my behaviour at the same time. That is my inner process, too. Deconstruction is ' performativity', too. 4. India needs freedom of kashmir as much kashmir needs, This is what Arundhati Roy said, I agree with it, There should an end to this Kashmirs as villians in india and vice versa. And if that new free kashmir is bereft of ethics, morality, and respect to its past, it shall be our duty to talk about that, like we talk about it now. About demolition of temples in kashmir, i remember, the famous Iranisna flim maker, who said that the responsibiltiy of destruction of Bamyaan Buddhas statues in Afganistan lies on the shoulders of Americans. I see Indian mindless policy directly responsible for jamat-it islami kind of things in kashmir. When Sheik Mohd Abudhha was bullied by India, and when his audience was shrinking, he went to hazratbal and spoke from a different mike. If you push the other, then violence looks inevitable. it is all sad, but we need to be couragous to speak the truth, and return to subjectivity and not define our acts as ' natural' and others as as 'unatural' with love and regards is i want kashmiris to get what india has promised them in 1947. it should be their choice to be what they want to be. It has a lot to do with ehichs and morality. Yes, kashmiri pandits suffered On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 7:05 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Dear Inder Salim > > 1. Sexual Choices (Morality) of an individual or between consenting Adults > has nothing to do with Ethics. For and between individuals (as I wrote > earlier to Aarti) the "Individual Ethics" as for example of Sexual Choices > (Morality) defines the quality of relationships. The 'Societal Ethics' of > Sexual Choices come into reckoning only when one person's Sexual Choices > adversely impact another person's choices. > > 2. Go ahead and legalise homosexuality in India. You do not need my > permission. I have no objection to it. > > 3. But wait a minute, I see you expressing contempt for India time and > again. You condemn anyone talking in favour of Indian Nationalism but are > quick to speak in favour of Kashmiri Nationalism. When questioned over this > contradiction you play dumb, deaf and blind and ignore the query. What is > your interest in India? > > 4. You should ask for the legalising of homosexuality in Kashmir. It will be > interesting to see how your demand will be received in Kashmir. > > 5. As far as India is concerned, there is some ongoing litigation over this > in Delhi High Court. A competent Legal Team might be able to successfully > argue it out. > > 6. From what I have read, it will not be possible for a Court of Law to > strike down the Act under which homosexuality is interpreted as an offence > but they could adjucate that the interpretation of the Act should not > harshly extend itself to treating homosexuality as being criminal behaviour. > > The Act talks about the criminality of "carnal intercourse against the > order of nature with another person of the same sex". In my opinion, a > skillful Lawyer could argue over the "Order of Nature" bit. It would be > rrrrrather difficult to get Nature to give evidence about what it's "Order' > is. There are also examples available in the "Living Nature" domain > (excluding Humans) where same sex carnal intercourse takes place. These are > exceptions of sexual behaviour amongst various species but so are they > amongst humans. > > 6. You have selectively quoted and also possibly selectively read what I > wrote. I did not say that the 'multi party system' makes a mockery of > 'Democracy' but that the "first past the post system" (used to declare > candidates in an Election as successful) that we follow in our "multi party > system" makes a mockery of Democracy in India. I hope you see the > difference. Please read carefully before commenting. > > 7. Certainly those who love India (which excludes a hate monger like you) > must celeberate "Democracy" in India. But the current system is far from > being perfect and needs to be rectified. What is your problem in that? > > 8. The same system (by and large) is followed in the UK and I would not be > surprised that with stronger showings (vote shares) for the Liberal > Democrats and Greens, in the UK they will start pondering over how > to rectify the system. > > 9. Some countries already have more credible systems where they use > "Proportional Representation" or "Multiple Rounds of Voting" or > "Preferential Voting". But, the dynamics of each country are unique and > India will have to find out what suits it best as a rectification of the > current system. > > Kshmendra > > --- On Tue, 8/19/08, inder salim wrote: > > From: inder salim > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2008, 5:18 PM > > I quote kshmendra : > > "Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence or > importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice)" > > I quote khsmendra again: > > "that we follow in our 'multi party system' makes a mockery of the > essential principles of "Democracy". That needs to be > rectified". > > Now my reflection to that: i know examples are slippery, but, a case > in the point: what about legalizing Homosexuality in India? here, if > you see me as one individual maverick, then we grossly differ on > ETHICS and and LAW > > about multi party system, which you feel makes a 'mockery of > democracy', is again, a negation of what you said in the begining, > a > After all the present day system of democracry is celebrated by > majority of the people in INDIA. or you think indians are 'invidual > mavericks', who dont care about ETHICS but follow THE CONSTITUTIOIN > blindly. > > love > is > > > > > > > On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 4:57 PM, Kshmendra Kaul > wrote: >> Dear Aarti >> >> Ethical must be Legal. Legal must be Ethical. If this basic principle is > not adhered to then there is a flawed interpretation of either the Legal or > the > Ethical. Worse still is the possibility that the 'accepted and adhered to or > propagated' Ethics or the Legality might in themselves be corrupted. >> >> Left to Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no consequence > or importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority > voice)interpretation, "Ethics" of particular relationships, could and > often do find themselves varyingly defined. When such varying definitions > are > pertinent to inter-personal or inter-transactional situations, the quality > of > the relationship gets defined. >> >> In what was being discussed, we must focus on 'societal Ethics'. > Such "Ethics" that permeate through and get defined for all of the > society. These must find themselves reflected in the "Laws", in the > "Legal". So, 'Ethical' must be 'Legal' and the > 'Legal' must be 'Ethical'. >> >> The 'Legal' gets defined by the 'Laws'. The > "Laws" derive themselves either directly from the > 'Constitution' or from Legislation as allowed for in the > "Constitution". >> >> Therefore, yes certainly Ethical must be seamlessly identifiable with the > Legal. What do you find 'frightening' in this? >> >> You could argue that aspects of the Indian Constitution are not Ethical > and therefore the Laws and Legality derived from them are not Ethical. Those > then need to be rectified once you identify them. No such specific examples > come > readily to my mind. You might have some. >> >> I would readily agree with you if you and I find common our examples of > where the Lawful or the Legal does not seem to Ethical. But, your and my > views > would always be subservient to how the Constitution views such Laws or > Legalities. Individual maverick interpretation of Ethics is of no > consequence or > importance when compared to the common consensus (or majority voice) that > finds > itself reflected in the Constitution or the Laws and Legalities derived from > it. >> >> You might be resentful of and confrontational against and constantly > questioning of the "State". I am not. We the people are the > "State". That should be seamless. If you said it is not always so, I > would agree. But there is no lack of opportunity or means for making it so. > Is'nt that what Democracy is all about. >> >> The 'categories' that the 'state' gives us, are > "categories" that 'we the people' have made as having been > participants in the formation, running and conduct of the "State". >> >> What is in any case wrong with the "categories" you have quoted. >> >> Are the Police the "Guardians of the Law"? Yes they are. Are > those who break the Law, the 'law breakers'? Yes they are. Are those who > confront the Police, the "hoodlums"? Yes they are. >> >> Again it could be argued that in India, the Police are not always (in fact > often are not I would say) the "Guardians of the Law". That the Police > in India have the propensity for 'unlimited terror'. Agreed. That needs > to be worked upon by 'we the People' and rectified. But that cannot be > used as an excuse to provide a blanket immunity to or indemnify the > "hoodlums" and "law breakers". >> >> Enough of my simple minded theorising. Let us come to the specifics of > where this discussion started. >> >> In the case of both the "Jammu Agitation" and the "Kashmir > Agitation", the agitationists acted at varying times in varying ways as > "hoodlums" and as "law breakers". The Police, the > "Guardians of Law" were justified in acting against them. >> >> There is of course the question of "use of force beyond the > requirement of the situation". Both the "Jammu Agitationists" and > the "Kashmir Agitationists" are complaining about that. This has to > be, must be, addressed and rectified. Not an excuse though for there being > an > 'open season' for the 'hoodlums' and 'law breakers' >> >> Kshmendra >> >> PS. Since I mentioned "Democracy", I must also say that India > follows a convoluted interpretation of "Democracy". The 'first > past the post' system that we follow in our 'multi party system' > makes a mockery of the essential principles of "Democracy". That needs > to be rectified. But, thats another story. >> >> >> --- On Sun, 8/17/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: >> >> From: Aarti Sethi >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Fwd: kashmir pictures >> To: "mahmood farooqui" >> Cc: "sarai list" >> Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 2:20 AM >> >> Dear Kshmendra, >> >> I am interested in how easily we slip into the categories that the state >> gives us. Anyone confronting the police is a "hoodlum" and a >> "law-breaker" >> who should be dealt with by the guardians of the law. How frightening this >> sort of language is, and if ever the mysticism of the law and its capacity >> for unlimited terror is on display, it is when the ethical is identified >> with the legal in the seamless fashion that you do above. >> >> best >> A >> >> On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:57 PM, mahmood farooqui < >> mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>> From: mahmood farooqui >>> Date: 2008/8/14 >>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >>> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com >>> >>> >>> Thanks Kshemendra, I can't say I am getting the answers but the >> responses >>> are making me think. >>> >>> Best, >>> Mahmood >>> >>> 2008/8/14 Kshmendra Kaul >>> >>> Dear Mahmood >>> > >>> > Whether 'all press' is communal or not, you certainly > are. >> You are trying >>> > to instigate communal feelings by suggesting a communal slant. >>> > >>> > Times of India and Hindustan Times showed photograph of a hoodlum >>> > attacking a policeman. >>> > >>> > Inquilab showed the photograph of a person injured by police > firing. >> If >>> > this person was a part of the mob attempting to break the law > and/or >>> > attacking the police, then the injured person was a hoodlum > injured >> by >>> > police firing. >>> > >>> > What is communal in all of this? You are the one making it > communal. >>> > >>> > There was confrontation between the police and law breaking > hoodlums >> in >>> > Kashmir and in Jammu. What makes either situation communal? >>> > >>> > Which is the 'communal' one between two kinds of > photographs, >> one where >>> law >>> > enforcers are shown as being attacked by law breakers and another > one >>> where >>> > law breakers are shown as having been hurt by law enforcers. >>> > >>> > Perhaps if you had furnished the captions accompanying the >> photographs, >>> one >>> > could make a call on which newspaper showed a 'communal' >> tinge >>> > >>> > Kshmendra >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > --- On *Wed, 8/13/08, mahmood farooqui > >> >*wrote: >>> > >>> > From: mahmood farooqui >>> > Subject: [Reader-list] kashmir pictures >>> > To: "sarai list" , > "Aamir >> Bashir" < >>> > unattore1 at gmail.com> >>> > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:33 PM >>> > >>> > Yesterday, nine Kashmiris were allegedly killed in the valley > because >> of >>> the >>> > police firing. >>> > >>> > Today, in the Bombay editions of the Times of India and Hindustan >> Times, >>> > there is an identical image of a policeman being attacked by a >> Kashmiri. >>> > There are no images of any Kashmiris being killed or attacked by > the >>> police. >>> > >>> > The Urdu daily Inqilab, however, shows a Kashmiri injured by the >> police >>> > firing. >>> > >>> > Is it simplistic to say that all press is communal? >>> > >>> > Is the poser itself simplistic? >>> > _________________________________________ >>> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> > Critiques & Collaborations >>> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in >>> > the subject header. >>> > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> > List archive: >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in >> the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 02:42:08 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 21:12:08 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Another Amarnath Pilgrimage: Exactly A Year Ago In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Nice little story.Who is this campaigning for the MLA? It took after all 18 years to rediscover the temple & the bonhomie...??? Regards LA > To: reader-list at sarai.net> From: shuddha at sarai.net> Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 23:39:14 +0530> Subject: [Reader-list] Another Amarnath Pilgrimage: Exactly A Year Ago> > Dear All,> > Given the efforts being made to raise the pitch everywhere, this > report (below) by Shabir Dar, from almost exactly a year ago, seems > to suggest the possibility of reality quite different from what we > have become accustomed to hearing and seeing on the spectacle called > television in recent days.> > Here is 'another' Amarnath Pilgrimage, in Kashmir, one that has not > been on the radar of those crying themselves hoarse about the > imagined insult and injury done to the devotees of Shiva.> > Here is the little history of a local initiative, in a small town, by > local people, with 'valley' Pandits, as well as with migrant Pandits, > working together with their Muslim neighbours, and former neighbours. > You will notice, that this story has no martyrs, no heroes, no > protests, no loud rhetoric, not even a respectable 'land transfer', > nothing that is other than the ordinary re-assertion of a traditional > ritual practice. And meetings of long lost friends and neighbours.> > Perhaps when things work at a 'local' level, they do not always > conform to the dictates of bigger agendas that have of necessity to > carry flags of different colours, some tricolor, some green and > white, some green, some saffron, some black.> > This is not necessarily to romanticize 'little' traditions over > bigger ones, or 'Chhota' Amarnath, over 'Bara' Amarnath, but just to > note that flagless agendas get less notice than they ought to. > However, in the end, i do believe that they contribute more to life, > because they do not carry real or imagined armies and militias behind > them. Their imagination is not coloured by the need to be validated > by sacrifices of any kind.> > One way of thinking of Shiva, is to think of him as the lord of the > 'little' people, the ganas and bhootas - the misunderstood and > marginal who make up the merry band of his wedding party. High > Hinduism has not always been comfortable with this merry crowd. And > so has sought to transform him (Shiva) into the supreme ascetic, the > lord of destruction, distancing him from his occasionally not very > sanctimonious flock, forgetting, that Shiva also dances with the > little people, happily, at peace, intoxicated. The taming of Shiva is > one of the many tragedies of civilizational amnesia in indic cultures.> > I see this story, of 'Cchota' or 'little' Amarnath, as a welcome > reminder that even Shiva has many faces. And those who seek to make > him the head of a 'national' upsurge to protect the abstractions of > borders and nationalities, forget, that Shiva, in the extremely > complex spectrum of the Shaivite tradition, which is not the personal > property of those who are his loudest adherents today, often slips > away, escapes, borders, escapes definition. In Bengal, and in > Kashmir, (and in many other parts of South Asia) there is a lively > awareness of this subaltern Shiva, and those who seek to dress him up > as a high deity of Hindutva today, probably do more violence to their > own traditions than they can imagine.> > Perhaps reading the report below might help us all understand that > the starkest of binaries are simply choices made to see things, one > way or another, and not necessarily an effort to realize that the > texture of ordinary life is always more complex and more beautiful > than the reductive 'all or nothing' logic of the headlines that feed > and feed on the making of a crisis. i have never been a believer in > much, but to 'Chhota' Amarnath, I am happy to say, 'bam bam bholey'.> > regards> > Shuddha> > -----------------> Chotta Amarnath reopens in South Kashmir after18 years with Hindu- > Muslim bonhomie> Aug 31 2007> http://vinayk.sulekha.com/blog/post/2007/08/chotta-amarnath-reopens- > in-south-kashmir-after18-years.htm> > Shabir Dar> KT News> Thajiwara (Bijbehara), Aug 28: As Suneeta Bhat (42) is busy in > lighting the ratandeep (lal charag) before the idol of Lord Shiva, > the sounds of aarti (puja) and bhajans continuously echo in the > surroundings. She has come all the way from Jammu to be part of this > festival of Hindu-Muslim bonhomie that is being celebrated at > Pracheev Amarnath cave of Lord Shiva here today, after a gap of 18 > years.> This cave temple also known as Chotta Amaranth (mini-Amarnath), has > remained closed since 1989 when the militancy surfaced and migration > of Kashmiri Pandits to Jammu and other parts of India began.> But, now with the initiatives of Devaasthan Prabadhank Committee > Bijbehara (an organization looking after all the temples in tehsil > Bijbehara), local administration, local MLA and common people; this > temple is again abuzz with devotees and performance of all religious > practices.> Suneeta flanked by many other Pandit relatives and some Muslim > friends and neighbours, is bursting with emotions and speaks her > heart out. "I am excited," she says. "Once again Pandits and Muslims > are exchanging love and amity. I have never thought that such things > will repeat again here," she said adding that this all happened with > hearty cooperation of local Muslims.> She is one among thousands (about 2000) of Kashmiri Pandits (KPs), > who are making a beeline to the temple premises from last two days, > to perform aarti, light incense and take part in bhajan mandli. > "Around 1000 KPs from Jammu and Delhi and about the same number from > different parts of valley have visited here since last two days," > said Vishvenathan Jotshi, president of Devaasthan Prabadhank > Committee (DPC) Bijbehara. "And the count is soaring," he added.> In the premises of the cave temple, a beeline of both KPs and local > Muslims visiting the temple could be seen, amid hugs and greetings. > In the courtyard of the temple, Mohammad Shafi a local teacher is > greeting every Pandit entrant with love and respect. "When are you > coming back permanently?" he is seen posing the question > affectionately to everyone. For a moment, the temple looks virtually > like a pot where emotions are filled with the warmth of love and > brotherhood.> For Sonika (17), who has come to her native land for the first time, > the warmth of people and place here has melted her heart. "I have > missed a lot being outside my own land. Now, I don't want to go > back," said Sonika Bhat who is here with her parents who actually > hail from Bijbehara but are now residing in Talab Tillo Jammu. "I > felt that there is no harm for us living here," she said.> Positioned on a hillock in the form of cave, Thajiwara temple as per > Professor Moti Lal Malla General Secretary of DPC Bijbehara has a > historical significance too. "Matta Parvati has a tremendous Tapasiya > for this place. Thousands of years back she has prayed for 12 years > to please Lord Shiva in order to reveal amar katha (history about > making of universe) to her, who later had agreed to her prayers," he > said.> And since then, Thajiwara annual yatra and festival is celebrated on > the eve of every Shravan Purnamashi or Raksha Bandhan and people from > all over the Valley throng this shrine for the darshan of Lord Shiva. > The yatra has the same religious sanctity and significance as that of > Swami Amarnath cave pilgrimage. "The temple is also known as Chotta > Amaranth," he said. "The handicapped, destitute and other people who > can not make it to Swami Amarnath can visit this temple," said Malla.> The temple has a distinction. From the cave, water - Amar Ganga - > trickles down from its roof on the idol of Lord Shiva, this > ultimately collects in the small pond outside the cave. A type of ash > - Amar Bhabooti - also comes out of the cave, which is applied by the > devotees on their foreheads.> Ecstatic with the arrival of a good number of Kashmiri Pandits into > his village, Ghulam Nabi Ashwar, an elderly person of Thajiwara > village, said that the occasion is like a festival for him. "We are > very happy with the revival of this temple. After a long gap I am > experiencing such festivity in my village. Earlier we (Hindus and > Muslims) used to celebrate every festival together and I don't > believe my eyes that same is happening once again," he said, while > holding the hand of a Pandit who happened to be a childhood friend.> In this ambience of revived religious harmony and cultural bonhomie, > many believe that time has come when the displaced people of the > valley should come back and settle in their original abodes. "The > warm welcome from local people and their love and affection is itself > a certificate for every displaced pandit to return back to valley," > said P L Pandita, freelance producer who along with his family has > come to the temple for puja. "This is a matter of great delight for > me to witness the revival of our traditional Hindu-Muslim > brotherhood," he added.> It is important to mention here that most of the arrangements for the > festival have been done by the locals here, who had been busy in the > preparations from last three days. The villages reflect a decorated > look. Most of the materials necessary for running a langar (free > meals) for devotees are being provided by locals. "Locals have > provided 70 kilograms of vegetables, 30 kgs of milk, 25 pairs of > bedding, matting and other furniture free of cost," said a member of > managing committee of DPC.> An octogenarian Prabhawati Dhar is all praises for the managing > committee of DPC Bijbehara and the local administration for making > her dream come true. Dhar who at present lives in Chakoora Pulwama, > has spent her childhood in the ambience of this Shiva temple. "I used > to visit this temple regularly before 18 years. And now to be again > here after a long gap is actually a dream come true. I thank > everybody who made this to happen," she said.> Abdul Rehman Veeri, the local MLA feels more than happy to be a part > of this beginning, which as per him has no end now. "It has been our > solemn initiative to re-open this old temple, which has always been a > symbol of religious harmony. Today, be it in the premises of this > temple when centuries old festival is again celebrated here, I have > no words to express my happiness. This is an encouragement to our > traditional religious harmony," he said.> Mufti Mohammad Amin, chairman of Bijbehara Municipal Committee, on > whose efforts the initiative has reached to its logical conclusion > said that it is a matter of pride for every Kashmiri that age-old > bonhomie is coming back on its rails. "A garden is perfect with the > presence of diverse types of flowers. And Pandits and Muslims are two > flowers of the same garden - Kashmir - which can thrive in one > another's presence only," he said.> In the temple the local leaders cutting across party lines and > village elders from whole area were present to welcome the visiting > guest on the occasion.(Kashmir Times)> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta> > > _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Searching for the best deals on travel? Visit MSN Travel. http://msn.coxandkings.co.in/cnk/cnk.do From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 03:04:17 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 21:34:17 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Struggle in 2008 - Dr Shabir Choudhry In-Reply-To: <346321.9768.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <346321.9768.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I wonder why the assassination of Baloch nationalist Nawab Akbar Bugti was missed out. And here, not long ago Kashmiri pan Islamist Sayed Ali Shah Jillani -Pakistani loyalist was airlifted in a state owned plane from Ranchi jail to Bombay for treatment. Regards LA > Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 07:06:16 -0700> From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com> To: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Struggle in 2008 - Dr Shabir Choudhry> > Interesting Blog entry by the well known (notorious in the eyes of some) Politician/Commentator Dr Shabir Choudhry.> > Kshmendra> > EXCERPTS:> > - Call it armed struggle, jihad, terrorism or a proxy war it destroyed fundamental character of the Kashmiri society, and Kashmiri struggle for right of self determination. This armed struggle which was initiated, supported and promoted by secret agencies of Pakistan resulted in human rights violations and deepened the divisions in the Kashmiri society.> > - In this struggle a Pakistani gun and agenda was implemented by using a Kashmiri shoulder. It was presented to us by Pakistan and Kashmiri leadership as a Kashmiri struggle for liberation; and with hindsight we see that we Kashmiris were used as a raw material in this proxy war, and it added to our misery and suffering.> > - I said to him that Pakistan got independence one day before India, and Pakistan has also occupied some parts of Jammu and Kashmir; wouldn’t it be better to have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission first followed by one outside the Indian High Commission.> > - There was no need to kill and torture people like that, but the Pakistani army did the same thing in1992 and more than 8 innocent people lost their lives.> > - Prior to this tragedy, National Students Federation members who were trying to cross the LOC were also killed and tortured by the Pakistan army. When it comes to enforcing ‘law and order’ or enforcing ‘writ of government’ army is trained to kill and torture, as it is happening in Jammu and Kashmir and in Swat, Balochistan, North West Frontier and FATA; or as it happened when Red Mosque was invaded and destroyed in name of enforcing ‘writ of government’.> > - I further said India virtually lost Kashmir Valley in 1990/1, however despite other heavy handedness India did not use helicopter gun ships or air force against Muslim militants; in Pakistan on the other hand helicopter gun ships and F 16 are regularly used to target alleged Muslim ‘terrorists’ in which innocent Pakistani Muslims are killed and their houses are destroyed. If you need any further evidence how Pakistani forces behave when asked to deal with ‘rebels’ or with those who demand rights then read history of East Pakistan or Bangladesh; or even ask members of Jammu and Kashmir Plebiscite Front how they were treated in 1970/1 during investigations regarding Ganga Hijacking.> > - I said without being pro this or anti that one can see a nation whose leadership takes pride in ‘selling’ their (Pakistani) sons and daughters for sake of American dollars, just take example of Dr Afia Sadiqqi who was arrested in Karachi with her three young children and has ended up in America, and where - about of her three young children is still not known. Do you expect any mercy or better treatment from rulers and establishment of this country? If they treat their own people like butchers and regard them as an economic commodity don’t expect that they will treat us Kashmiris differently.> > - We Kashmiris still have not been able to decide who is enemy of our independence and who is deceiving us in name of religion and brotherhood. It is unfortunate that many of us still view Kashmir dispute in the context of Muslims and non Muslims, and accept whatever is presented to us by media and organisations controlled by Islamabad.> > - By promoting religious politics are we not playing in hands of extremists who want to justify Two Nations Theory that Muslims and non Muslims cannot live together, hence pave way for division of the State of Jammu and Kashmir on religious lines.> > > > > Kashmiri struggle in 2008 > > Kashmiri struggle in 2008> Dr Shabir Choudhry 13 August 2008> > New phase of the Kashmiri struggle or whatever we want to call it in view of communalism, proxy war and terrorism, has been going on since 1947; and yet we people of Jammu and Kashmir have not been able to put our priorities right. We have not been able to differentiate between freedom and occupation. We have also failed to understand designs of both countries on Kashmir, and formulate appropriate policies to promote and advance a Kashmiri interest.> > In view of the above can we make a valid claim to get independence and be recognised as a free nation and play our due role in comity of nations, especially when what are known as Kashmiri leaders, at best have been acting as puppets of either one country or the other and promoting and defending interest of either India or Pakistan?> > Despite lack of democracy and encroachment of civil liberties the State of Jammu and Kashmir was one political entity in 1947. People of the State irrespective of their religious and cultural affiliations regarded themselves as Kashmiris, distinctly different from India and Pakistan; and wanted to maintain that difference.> > Today the unfortunate State is forcibly divided in many parts, and people of the State are divided on religious, cultural, regional and ethnic lines. These divisions have never been so deep and so frightening in the history of the State, and it looks that those powers who are behind these moves are paving the way for the division of the state on communal and regional lines.> > Call it armed struggle, jihad, terrorism or a proxy war it destroyed fundamental character of the Kashmiri society, and Kashmiri struggle for right of self determination. This armed struggle which was initiated, supported and promoted by secret agencies of Pakistan resulted in human rights violations and deepened the divisions in the Kashmiri society.> > In this struggle a Pakistani gun and agenda was implemented by using a Kashmiri shoulder. It was presented to us by Pakistan and Kashmiri leadership as a Kashmiri struggle for liberation; and with hindsight we see that we Kashmiris were used as a raw material in this proxy war, and it added to our misery and suffering.> > A few days ago a ‘friend’ who is still part of controversial nationalist group of JKLF invited me to take part in a picket outside an Indian High Commission on 15th August. According to him it was to demonstrate that India got independence on this date and they have occupied our country - Jammu and Kashmir. I said to him that Pakistan got independence one day before India, and Pakistan has also occupied some parts of Jammu and Kashmir; wouldn’t it be better to have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission first followed by one outside the Indian High Commission.> > This friend said, how can we have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission, they are helping us against Indian occupation, can’t you see how the Indian army has killed innocent people who were peacefully proceeding towards LOC. I said to him that I condemned this brutal killing. There was no need to kill and torture people like that, but the Pakistani army did the same thing in1992 and more than 8 innocent people lost their lives.> > I explained to him that in 1992 the JKLF people tried to cross the LOC from the AJK side and they were also innocent and wanted to proceed to the LOC peacefully, they were killed by the Pakistani army. Prior to this tragedy, National Students Federation members who were trying to cross the LOC were also killed and tortured by the Pakistan army. When it comes to enforcing ‘law and order’ or enforcing ‘writ of government’ army is trained to kill and torture, as it is happening in Jammu and Kashmir and in Swat, Balochistan, North West Frontier and FATA; or as it happened when Red Mosque was invaded and destroyed in name of enforcing ‘writ of government’.> > I further said India virtually lost Kashmir Valley in 1990/1, however despite other heavy handedness India did not use helicopter gun ships or air force against Muslim militants; in Pakistan on the other hand helicopter gun ships and F 16 are regularly used to target alleged Muslim ‘terrorists’ in which innocent Pakistani Muslims are killed and their houses are destroyed. If you need any further evidence how Pakistani forces behave when asked to deal with ‘rebels’ or with those who demand rights then read history of East Pakistan or Bangladesh; or even ask members of Jammu and Kashmir Plebiscite Front how they were treated in 1970/1 during investigations regarding Ganga Hijacking.> > I said without being pro this or anti that one can see a nation whose leadership takes pride in ‘selling’ their (Pakistani) sons and daughters for sake of American dollars, just take example of Dr Afia Sadiqqi who was arrested in Karachi with her three young children and has ended up in America, and where - about of her three young children is still not known. Do you expect any mercy or better treatment from rulers and establishment of this country? If they treat their own people like butchers and regard them as an economic commodity don’t expect that they will treat us Kashmiris differently.> > Knowledge of this friend was limited and he was having difficulty in justifying his argument, so he surrendered by saying that he could not compete with me in knowledge and argument. He said he was a loyal member of the JKLF and wanted to follow the party decision and the JKLF leaders. I appreciated his ‘loyalty’ but added that loyalty of his leaders is not with the JKLF or its ideology. Their loyalty is with agencies of our neighbours who reward them handsomely.> > I said decision to hold a picket outside an Indian High commission was taken else where but only endorsed in your meeting. Your leadership discussed it with relevant quarters, agreed certain terms and conditions and then brought this issue to your meeting to be approved. Normally committee of personal and party loyalists do not disagree with any decision which is presented to them as approved by the top leadership, especially there is always hundred per cent unanimity when any actions is related to India.> > This friend agreed with almost everything I said, but added that ‘you have always been critical of top JKLF leadership and Pakistan. And now that I have left the JKLF I should not criticise JKLF and its policies, as it hurts us and that we will also criticise you and make allegations against you’.> > Whether he or some one else criticise me or not it is immaterial, what is important is the attitude of the Kashmiri people and especially that of ‘nationalist’ parties. It is unfortunate to note that despite this long struggle, sacrifices, and suffering on massive scale we as a nation have not been able to decide our priorities. We Kashmiris still have not been able to decide who is enemy of our independence and who is deceiving us in name of religion and brotherhood. It is unfortunate that many of us still view Kashmir dispute in the context of Muslims and non Muslims, and accept whatever is presented to us by media and organisations controlled by Islamabad.> > My colleagues and I have always regarded Jammu and Kashmir as one political entity, and have promoted cause of united and independent Kashmir, and advanced non - communal politics as Kashmir dispute is not a religious one. But it is unfortunate to note that in 2008 we Kashmiris are more divided and more communalised then we were in 1947; and gulf between the regions and communities is widening.> > Jammu and the Valley have different priorities and are playing in hands of those who want to play a religious card in order to divide the people on communal lines and advance their politics. Ladakh apart from the ‘Kargil war’ has not bee affected by the militancy; and has different agenda and has no interest with what is going on in other two regions. Azad Kashmir and Gilgit and Baltistan have no contact with each other and have different priorities and interests. People of Azad Kashmir, forgetting their own miseries and problems are seemed to be more concerned with what goes on across the LOC, and virtually accept everything what is presented to them by the Pakistani media.> > By promoting religious politics are we not playing in hands of extremists who want to justify Two Nations Theory that Muslims and non Muslims cannot live together, hence pave way for division of the State of Jammu and Kashmir on religious lines.> > Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. > Email: drshabirchoudhry at gmail.com> To view other articles see my blog: www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com > > http://drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/2008/08/kashmiri-struggle-in-2008.html> > > > > _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Searching for the best deals on travel? Visit MSN Travel. http://msn.coxandkings.co.in/cnk/cnk.do From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 03:17:23 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 21:47:23 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808190501u27cd410fk59b4877d21a2c875@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808180901j14401f2esd22bac985dd765df@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808190302h7796d21es7156861353572818@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808190501u27cd410fk59b4877d21a2c875@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Those who continue to see only BJP in the on going mass movement in Jammu must 'refresh' their minds to get over BJP fixation. Today, all parties have lost their cadres in Jammu. Did you see that young Sikh boy with tricolour leading a 'sea' of Jammuites most of them Gujjar Muslims ,crossing river Tawi to join the protestors in the city? Regards LA > Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:31:02 +0530> From: pawan.durani at gmail.com> To: mail at shivamvij.com> CC: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow> > Very true. Thats great understanding by Shivam.> It must have been after the BJP's call only, else does the Shri Amarnath> Sagarsh Samiti have any support in Jammu ? Would anyone have cared to listen> to SASS ?> > Last 45 days shutdown in Jammu is a witness to everything.> > Thank you Shivam for your GREAT understanding .> > Jeeve Jeeve Psuedo Secular Jeeve> > Pawan Durani> > > > On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्> wrote:> > > This has happened after the BJP's press conference yesterday morning> > that the BJP is going to conduct a mass nationwide campaign of which> > the jail bharo andolan will be central to. The BJP seems to have made> > up its mind that after Ram, Shiva is going to be their favourite> > deity.> >> > best> > shivam> >> >> >> > On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 9:31 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul> > wrote:> > > *Jammu agitation: Two-lakh court arrest, more to follow*> > >> > > *Link - **http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660*<> > http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=139660>> > >> > > THE TWO month long Amarnath agitation has not lost momentum in Jammu> > region> > > and despite life remaining paralysed for the last 50 days, the enthusiasm> > > and support to the agitation has not withered. Continuing their strong> > > protests against the Amarnath land transfer order, around two-lakh people> > on> > > Monday (August 18) responded to the *Jail Bharo* call of the Shree> > Amarnath> > > Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS).> > >> > > People from all across the region came out of their homes in the morning> > in> > > overwhelming numbers and courted arrest as a mark of protest against the> > > land order.> > >> > >> > > According to reports, large number of people gathered in Jammu city,> > > Udhampur, Kathua, Hiranagar and Reasi and other major towns and villages> > on> > > the call of the SAYSS, which is spearheading the agitation.> > >> > >> > > In the morning today, around 10 000 people gathered at City Chowk in> > Jammu> > > city and took out a procession. Chanting 'Bum Bum Bole' the protesters> > > passed through main roads of the city and reached the city chowk police> > > station and asked the cops to arrest them.> > >> > >> > > This was carried out in all the 16 police stations of Jammu city, with> > > thousands of protesters shouting slogans against the state administration> > > and governor N N Vohra. The protesters were later taken to MAM stadium> > and> > > other schools and colleges, which were turned into jails for the time> > being.> > >> > >> > >> > > Udhampur city witnessed a huge turnout and the situation turned violent> > > after protesters clashed with security personnel. Police resorted to> > lathi> > > charge and tear gas shells were fired to control the protesters, who were> > > demanding the ouster of governor N N Vohra and return of the Amarnath> > land.> > >> > >> > > A large turnout was also reported in Samba and Kathua districts, but the> > > protests remained largely peaceful and there was no report of any> > untoward> > > incident.> > >> > >> > > Meanwhile, Shree Amarnath Sangarsh Samiti (SASS) termed the response to> > the> > > *Jail Bharo* andolan as overwhelming and said it was a historic day for> > the> > > people of Jammu. Brigadier Suchet Singh, speaking to *merinews*, claimed> > > that more than three lakh people had participated in today's *Jail> > > Bharo*andolan.> > >> > >> > > Singh also criticised the state administration for failing to provide> > even> > > basic facilities in the makeshift prisons. "The state did not even> > provide> > > water to the agitating people," he said, adding that the people of Jammu> > > have entered into a do or die mode and will not stop till their goal is> > > achieved.> > >> > >> > > This agitation has the support of the rich and poor and cuts across> > > religious and regional lines, Singh asserted, "Abhi nahi to Kabhi nahi"> > this> > > is the war cry of the people. Criticizing the Union government for its> > > appeasement policy, Singh alleged that government is delaying a decision> > in> > > the hope that this agitation will peter off. "This is a people's movement> > > and will achieve its goal," he said. India is concerned only about the> > > Hurriyat and Kashmiris and it will not be tolerated at any cost.> > >> > > Warning that the agitation could further intensify and mode of action> > could> > > change, Singh asked the Union government to realise its mistakes and take> > > corrective action otherwise there could be more unrest and trouble.> > >> > >> > > The Samiti leaders also registered their strong resentment against> > certain> > > sections of the national media, which they said were portraying the> > > agitation as communal and sectarian.> > > _________________________________________> > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> > > Critiques & Collaborations> > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with> > subscribe in the subject header.> > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list> > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>> >> >> >> > --> >> > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/> > _________________________________________> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> > Critiques & Collaborations> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with> > subscribe in the subject header.> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>> _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Chose your Life Partner? Join MSN Matrimony FREE http://www.shaadi.com/msn/matrimony.php From shuddha at sarai.net Thu Aug 21 03:45:48 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 03:45:48 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8170EC3C-9C57-4A82-ACE2-E3620A3A5938@sarai.net> Dear Sonia, Thank your for your considered reply. I am in agreement with much of what you have said. And I am taking this opportunity to reply to both your posts. First let me address the matter of what Aditya Raj Kaul reported occurred in the NDTV studios during the recording and broadcast of the last episode of 'We the People'. I take your word in his defence that someone you identify as an elderly Kashmiri in the audience, 'cried Inshallah' when Mr. Khajuria, the Jammu BJP leader said that the protests in Kashmir were aimed at bringing 'Nizam-E-Mustafa' into being. It is clear that he (the Jammu BJP leader) was referring, among other things, to the All Party Hurriyet Conference leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani's recent speech, where he asserted his desire to merge Kashmir with Pakistan, and went on to express his desire for the promulgation of what he called 'Nizam e Mustafa'. Geelani's remarks, even his plea for recognition as 'the leader of the movement' was by no means met with unanimous approval by the crowd that had assembled to listen to him and others. In fact, as we know by now, he was forced to render an apology soon after. To be fair, he did say that the lives and properties of all minorities would be protected in a future Kashmir ruled by the dispensation represented by what he called 'nizam-e-mustafa', but frankly, I do not care as to whether he did so, or not. I do not seek assurances for the protection of life and liberty in the pronouncements of political leaders and when they make such pronouncements, i think we must treat them with a necessary degree of healthy scepticism. If we do so when we listen to L.K.Advani, there should be no reason not to do so when we listen to Syed Ali Shah Geelani. As per your report only one elderly gentleman from amongst the several assembled Kashmiri muslims in the NDTV studio that evening 'cried Inshallah' in the wake of the invocation of the phrase 'Nizam- E-Mustafa' by Mr. Khajuria of the Jammu BJP. Just as the assembled gathering of Kashmiri Muslims in Srinagar who listened to Ali Shah Geelani, respectfully, but not without letting their strong disagreement be known, does not translate into automatic endorsement of some of his (S.A.S Geelani's) senile fantasies, so too, the mere presence of Kashmiri muslims in the NDTV studio does not translate into an automatic endorsement, let alone echoing, of what it turns out, was the lone voice of another elderly gentleman. One elderly gentleman (Ali Shah Geelani) said 'Nizam e Mustafa' (and maybe some people echoed this slogan, maybe they did not, and I am not even going into whether they know what they meant when they echoed it, if they did) , another elderly gentleman (Mr. Khajuria) relayed it, and another elderly gentleman in the NDTV studio said 'inshallah' . And a young gentleman by the name of Aditya Raj Kaul transformed this episode into the following - "The Kashmiri Muslims present screamed Inshallah". One Kashmiri muslim gentleman becomes 'the Kashmiri Muslims' (without qualification or exception) and an utterance that was not very clearly audible, becomes a scream. I think you will appreciate the disingenousness of Aditya Raj Kaul's statement. I hope you will join me in condemning this practice of making blanket generalizations about any community, on the basis of a reading of the actions of any one person. I point this out only to underscore that it shows us the way in which the spin doctoring of Kashmir is often done, whether with regard to the valley, or to the microcosm of a television studio. And so suddenly, everything else that was said and heard gets forgotten, and we end up only discussing whether or not someone assented to the phrase - "nizam-e-mustafa". And so, by association, any discussion on Kashmir is held hostage to our different views about Nizam-E-Mustafa, Pakistan and Islamist politics. We are compelled, by this tactic, to forget that there are many other kinds of voices in Kashmir, some of which are in radical disagreement, some of which are ambivalent, and some of which are indifferent to these tropes. One way of being respectful towards a people is to insist that they represent a lively complexity, that they are not the android subjects of some dystopia who have been rendered completely incapable of thinking and saying more than one thing. That if they are Kashmiri Muslims, they can only think and feel about nizam e mustafa and that if they are Kashmiri pandits, they can only sing the same monotonous tune of Indian nationalism again and again. I am not at all implying that these are your views, but I do hope that you will join me in insisting that we resist these efforts at violent and obfuscatory simplification. I hope that everyone on this list will refrain from these low blows in the future. The debates on this list do not need these slightly lame tactics. While we are at it, let us recognize the fact that Mr. Khajuria and Mr. Ali Shah Geelani seemed equally interested in talking about Nizam-E-Mustafat at at time when the real issues facing the people of Jammu and Kashmir are to do with state repression, economic blockades, perceived and real disciminations, etc. That is an interesting co-incidence in itself. The BJP (and its minons) and at least some of the factions that attempt to run the deep state within the state in India must be terribly glad that Ali Shah Geelani gave them such a marvellous gift, the possibility of an immediate division of forces and opinions within the current Kashmiri opposition in the valley. I hope that this gift is proven (by the people of Kashmir) to be a cheque that bounces when all the concerned parties seek to encash it. Now I come to more important questions that you have raised in your follow up postings on this thread. I am in agreement with you that the restraint and maturity being shown by the people of Kashmir who are protesting is exemplary, and needs to be recognized for what it is. Terrorists and the secret- police are mirror images of each other, and nothing scares either more than the happy sight of a peaceful and passionate assembly of human beings who are fashioning for themselves the terms of their own liberty, without the burden of arms, secrecy, intrigue and the stench of blood. So far, the Terrorists and their colleagues and partners in the secret-police apparatus of the nation-states that hold Kashmir in thrall are on the defensive, and the people of Kashmir seem to have the upper hand. Lets hope that it stays this way. I am totally in agreement with the fact that this phase of non- violent protest indicates that the people of Kashmir have (re) discovered (at least for now) their own strength, that they are unwilling to be dictated to by any votaries of the cult of terrorism and that they are also just as unwilling to be dictated to by any self appointed 'leaders' , whosoever they may be. (As I have pointed out, Ali Shah Geelani had to apologize for his attempt at dictating the agenda and direction of this struggle, as if it were his personal fief, and he was compelled to do this because the people who are turning out on the streets of Kashmir seem at present to be unwilling to be taken for a ride yet again by any one who attempts to broker their desires for liberation from the occupation). At least at present, the people of Kashmir are ahead of those who claim to be their leaders, way ahead. Their so called 'leaders' must take comfort in hoping that they are not left too far behind as they attempt (confusedly) to follow the people. You are right. The reports that are available do seem to suggest that the CRPF and J&K Police and the Armed Forces have matched the non- violence of the protestors by not killing more people than they already have. This is welcome. At all costs, I hope that everyone concerned will act in a way that avoids and mitigates against violence, the threat of violence and the loss of life.I hope this brings some sobriety to bear on the arrogance of all those who hold the shaky reins of power in Kashmir, and in Delhi. The eyes of the world are upon Kashmir, and if the people of Kashmir do not waver from their current course of protesting peacefully, in large numbers, democratically, they will have held out an example to oppressed peoples and their struggles, elsewhere in the subcontinent. Let me state here that the question of an agreement, or disagreement, with the substantive political content of the struggle for what is being called 'Azaadi' in Kashmir, as it is played out by all the actors on the stage, is one thing, and a categorical demand for the withdrawal of the Indian government's militarized occupation of the Kashmir valley is another thing. And one need not be seen as subordinate to the other. I have very strong disagreements with some of the ways in which 'Azaadi' is conceived of by a number of the articulate political actors in the Kashmir valley. I disagree fundamentally with the view that replacing one nation state structure with another constitutes 'liberation' in any way. But that disagreement is not with Kashmiris in particular, it extends to my disagreements with all those, including in india, whether on the left, right or centre, who continue to believe that the nation-state, and national liberation has anything of value to hold out to humanity in the wake of the debris of the twentieth century. But whatever my agreements or disagreements may be, I see no reason not to demand that even those I disagree with not be made subject to the violence of a militarized occupation undertaken by the state that I pay taxes to. I do not wish to be complicit in that occupation. I think many more people in India are coming around to this view. Their numbers will only increase, because Indians, like people all over the world, are not stupid. More and more people are realizing and will come to realize that for the faintest possibility of peace, equity and prosperity to take hold in South Asia, India must let go of Kashmir. Only then will there be lasting peace on the subcontinent, only then can the tremendous and tragic drain that is the arms race be put an end to. Only then will we (in India, Pakistan and Kashmir) see the rudiments of real liberty and freedom from fear and terror. for As Arundhati Roy said yesterday in Kashmir, 'India needs freedom from Kashmir, as much as Kashmir needs freedom from India'. All that someone like me, and those of us who share this conversation on this list, and elsewhere, can do, by way of solidarity is to continue to listen to the voices that are coming from Kashmir, to continue to speak to them, to be passionate in our advocacy for the end of the occupation and equally passionate if we feel that the Kashmiri visions of freedom are shackled by their own unwillingness to be reflective of the existing and potential weaknesses that riddle those visions. I disagree with anyone who calls for 'Nizam-E-Mustafa' because I disagree with the idea or imagination of any 'Nizam' or regime that finds it necessary to protect itself from question by adorning the mantle of unquestionable sanctity. The word 'Mustafa' means 'Chosen' in Arabic. And the idea of a 'NIzam-E-Mustafa' meaning, the 'state of the chosen' has an uncanny resemblance to the idea of the return of the 'chosen people' to their state, which is the foundational myth, if you like of Zionism. I know that Syed Ali Shah Geelani would probably be horrified to think that his vision of 'Azaadi' has a striking parallel of the founding myth of the State of Israel.(and it is actually the founding myth of all hitherto oppressed people who are led to believe that once they achieve a statehood congruent with their idea of who they are, all will be well - this is the general condition of all secular, radical, liberal or conservative notions of nationalism, of which, Zionism and the idea of the 'Nizam e Mustafa' are perhaps the clearest exemplars.) The perception of a 'State' as the 'Manifest Destiny' of a people chosen by God or History, or both, contains within it the seed of a terrible tragedy, of yesterday's victims transforming themselves into tomorrows tormentors. Of the Pakistani army conducting mass murder in what was once East Pakistan, and thus destroying once and for all, the delusion of a brotherhood forged on the basis of Islam alone. No one could imagine that those who laid the foundations of the Jewish state of Israel in the wake of the holocaust would be laying the foundations of a detention facility for Palestinians. No one could imagine that those who led the oppressed people of India into her 'tryst with destiny' in 1947, so radiant in the first flush of what they called freedom, would turn Kashmir or the North East or much of Central India into death camps. We, especially those of us who stand by Kashmiris today, against Indian and Pakistani occupation, must imagine the possibility that an 'Azaad' Kashmir, whether it is independent, or a part of Pakistan, may also be a similar bitter harvest. Nothing can be more lethal than the assumption that victims are innocent per se. We must recognize clearly, especially if we invest in the idea of 'Azaadi' that those who speak of freedom in Kashmir today, may turn out to be oppressors tomorrow. It is because of this, that I disagree with any attempt to cloak the idea of the state (even, and especially if it claims to speak for and on behalf of the oppressed) with any sanctity. As long as the state as a form of organising and administering human society remains, we must be vigilant, I believe, to ensure that those who lead the state are not able to adorn themselves with the concealing cloak of sanctity of any kind. The sanctity and glamour of the yesterday's state of being oppressed is a weapon in the arsenal of tomorrow's oppressor. This applies, without any qualification to the present and future destiny of Kashmir, and the people of Kashmir must be vigilant against all those who act in the name of the sacred, and most of all, in their name, in the name of the people of Kashmir. Sanctity can be of different kinds, I disagree with the sanctity of the Indian constitution as an arbiter of the matters of day to day life, as much as I disagree with the sanctity of tradition, of the idea of progress, of the Quran, Gita, Bible, or the programme of any political party that declares itself to be the engine of history, or any other scripture or sanction or text that is framed as revelation, beyond and above question. This does not mean that I think that these texts, traditions, ideas and programmes, be they the Constitution of India, or the scriptures and sources that I mentioned, are devoid of anything that may be useful or even inspiring, just that I think that when we fetishize them as the ultimate and unquestionable arbiters of our lives we immediately transform them from being the keys to liberation that they might on occasion be, into becoming the padlocks of prisons. My objection in these matters is not framed in terms of whether the 'nizam' represents itself as 'secular' or 'confessional', Rather, my objection, rests simply on its arrogation by it (to itself) of a status of being beyond question. The idea of the nation is a human construct and like all human constructs, must face relentless criticism when it is found wanting. India, Kashmir, Jammu & Kashmir. and even, dare I say, the idea of a Secular or a Hindu, or Islamic state, are, in the end, entities brought into being through the deeds and misdeeds of human actors. When the frameworks or definitional boundaries of these entitites cease to be generative or hospitable to human concerns, then, like all other human constructs, they must be made open to debate, to questioning, and if necessary, be discarded. That I think, is the beginning of Azaadi. I hope that these strange, exhilarating and deeply worrying days in Kashmir inspire us all to think about what 'Azaadi' can really mean. That will be the greatest gift that the people of Kashmir will have given to those of us who live this side of the Pir Panjal mountains and the Banihal tunnel. best, Shuddha Dear Shuddha, Finally got a chance to sit down and read your last mail to me and I think again you have misunderstood. I¹m sorry. Evidently it is not just you who has misread my posts so it must be me at fault! I will try again so here goes: 1. Pl see my first email on the subject where the Œbaying for blood¹ phrase was used in the context of the police/CRPF having to face a mob, 100,000 + strong. I condemned the firing upon unarmed protestors but conjectured how it must feel to confront a mob that size that is coming with aggressive intent towards one. In my second mail, in response to your taking issue with my use of the phrase I compared your reasoning and justification of mob violence with Advani¹s. I am not equating the event of the march to the LoC and Advani¹s wrath yatra or the Œ92 & Œ93 violence. Do you see the difference? 2. Of course there is a difference between the attack on a 16th c. mosque and a bunker!! I¹m truly appalled that you of all people think you need to point this out to someone who cut her teeth on the politics of Babri Masjid. I was hardly equating the two. You¹d need to feel some sympathy or agreement with the mosque being perceived as a sign of oppression, and no, let me categorically state that I don¹t and that I am fully aware of the bunker being the potential locus where bullets are likely to be fired from. I was merely trying to point out, and I quote: Œ...that once you give a group a carte blanche to do as they please, to destroy what they consider symbols of oppression, you have very little ground to stand on when others whom you may not agree with politically do the same.¹ It¹s got nothing to do with whether I find justification or not in that perception. That is why I also used the examples of Sabina¹s house and the ransacking of Moulvi Abbas Ansari¹s house. Events have moved on since we had our last exchange. The Hurriyat leaders realized the potential danger in what I call violent assembly and you call non-violent assembly. They called for restraint because they knew that not doing so would mean escalation of tempers and violence and death. (This was what I was trying to point out in my earlier mails.) In every single gathering since then the Kashmiris have been disciplined and have won my admiration and I¹m sure the admiration of many around the world. 100,000 people gathered in Pampore and protested peacefully. I must point out that not a single bullet was fired by the CRPF or the police, because despite similar numbers the mood was very different from the one that was present on the march to the LoC. There is a new feeling of great excitement within the people of Kashmir. They can see for themselves what it means to be part of non-violent movement, to form human chains around the police so that they would be safe from the people, to protest peacefully. They have demonstrated to the world that the power of the people in a non-violent movement is far greater than the firepower of the militants. I hope that it is something that they will hold on to because it is more valuable than anything that has happened in the last two decades. Having said that, I still don¹t agree with the politics. I don¹t see how this issue will be resolved since every single issue of J&K has been thrown up in the churning: land & pilgrimage (the easiest to deal with), regional imbalance and resentment on both sides, the Hindu-Muslim divide (all too depressing) nationalism-sub-nationalisms, India-Pakistan... I think the clock has been turned back and irreparable damage has been done to relations between the people of Kashmir and Jammu. And with the BJP taking this on as a national issue I can only hope it¹s not the beginning of another Babri Masjid. With warmest regards, Sonia. On 20-Aug-08, at 6:59 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > Dear Shuddha, > > Though I virulently disagree with young Aditya Raj Kaul's politics > I have to > say in his defence that he wasn't lying about the 'Inshallah!' > There was an elderly man, I don't know who he was, who had earlier > quite > correctly thanked the BJP for doing what the militants had been > unable to do > thus far, vitiated the atmosphere to the degree that every Kashmiri > loathed > the idea of India. It was he who cried, Inshallah! > > Something strange happens with the lapel mikes in the NDTV studio. > Every > mike is not on all the time. I've had that happen to me before > where I > thought I had been able to hit back at Ravishankar Prasad but when > I saw the > program later, no such thing happened. It wasn't in the editing > because all > that he was saying was being heard perfectly, so it's not that they > just cut > those bits out. I think the mikes are controlled by the producers > who let > some of the cacophony in, not all. > > Best > sj > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta From rashneek at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 09:27:31 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 09:27:31 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secessionist leaders exchange blows (The Curse of Lakshmi) Message-ID: <13df7c120808202057m7e3f7551m8571b9044c413f80@mail.gmail.com> SRINGAR: A meeting of secessionist groups, called to discuss the future of what has been characterised as the largest Islamist mobilisation since 1990, dissolved into chaos after members of rival factions exchanged insults and blows. Leaders of the Ali Shah Geelani-led Tehreek-i-Hurriyat and Srinagar cleric Mirwaiz Umar Farooq's All Parties Hurriyat Conference (APHC) charged each other with engaging in actions damaging the course of the ongoing movement, provoking their supporters to engage in scuffles. Sources present at the meeting said APHC leader G.M. Hubbi was physically attacked by his Tehreek-i-Hurriyat counterpart Masrat Alam, and several important leaders, including Mr. Geelani and the APHC-affiliated Shabbir Shah, left the meeting in disgust. Both groups had said earlier that they would organise a joint protest at Srinagar's Idgah on Friday, where the future course of the agitation was to be made public. It is now unclear if the two groups will be able to announce a shared programme of agitation, and, indeed, if their fragile alliance will survive Wednesday's clashes. Kashmir's Mufti-e-Azam (chief cleric), had earlier denounced Mr. Geelani's call for all Srinagar residents to offer Friday prayers only at the Idgah, saying it was repugnant to Islamic practice. Simmering tensions Tensions between the secessionist leaders have been building up since Monday when Mr. Geelani asked tens of thousands of people who assembled at a protest rally to endorse him as the leader of the secessionist movement. Mr. Geelani also made clear his belief that the movement was for the cause of Islam, and Jammu and Kashmir's incorporation in to Pakistan—assertions that incensed rival secessionist leaders such as the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front's Yasin Malik. Mr. Geelani later apologised for any offence his remarks—but did not withdraw his claim to be the principal leader of the movement. Within the APHC, too, tensions have been high ever since Mirwaiz Umar Farooq agreed to unite with the Tehreek-i-Hurriyat in June. The Mirwaiz and Mr. Geelani agreed to join hands just as protests against the grant of land-use rights to the Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board was picking up. Both leaders agreed to a three-point formula for joint action, in a declaration that appeared to meet Mr. Geelani's long-standing demand that the APHC not engage in direct talks with the Government of India. Senior APHC leaders like Bilal Gani Lone and Abdul Gani Bhat were highly critical of the unification plan, complaining that they were not consulted. >From the outset, Mr. Geelani defined the agenda of the alliance, relegating the APHC to the role of junior partner. Even the alliance's first joint rally, a June 20 gathering held to protest against the sale of liquor, gambling and drug abuse, was led by Mr. Geelani. Mr. Geelani also alarmed centrists in the APHC by characterising their joint movement as a struggle for the defence of Islam, rather than a political movement. "Religious aggression" For example, at the June 20 rally, Mr. Geelani decried the grant of land-use rights to the Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board as part of India's "cultural and religious aggression." He said India wished to force Kashmiris to "backtrack from the gift of Islam given to us by Mir Syed Ali Hamdani 650 years ago." Mr. Geelani also claimed that "universities and educational institutions are being used as platforms for spreading Shaivism, Kashmiriyat and degraded Sufism. Vice Chancellors of these universities are trained by intelligence agencies to percolate imperial and lethal occupational designs." http://www.hindu.com/2008/08/21/stories/2008082160491200.htm Best Regards -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From pawan.durani at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 10:17:26 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 10:17:26 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu Truck driver beaten in Bijbehara,Kashmir Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808202147u63373ffbkd539aff17359a352@mail.gmail.com> I wonder what Sajad Lone and Mehbooba have to say about this report: *"On August 19, 2008, another truck driver Rashpreet Singh son of Tarlok Singh, a resident of Gadigarh, Satwari, was mercilessly beaten-up by the people at Bijbehara on Jammu-Srinagar National Highway when he was returning to Jammu after unloading essential commodities in the Valley in his truck No. 5411 JK02B. Rendering him unconscious, the mob escaped. A TATA Sumo driver of Udhampur, spotted the driver lying unconscious and shifted him to GMC Jammu where his condition was stated to be very critical. He was struggling between life and death"* (The Daily Excelsior, August 20, 2008). Incidently Bijbehara is the 'stronghold' of the Mufti family! *Are the Mufti's deliberately doing this so that non-muslim truck drivers refuse to carry essential supplies to the valley?* From naeem.mohaiemen at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 21:03:03 2008 From: naeem.mohaiemen at gmail.com (Naeem Mohaiemen) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 21:33:03 +0600 Subject: [Reader-list] 5 Graffiti Research Lab Activists Arrested in Beijing Message-ID: Photos and videos here: http://freetibet2008.org/globalactions/lightbanner/ AP story here: http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i3OMvEA_ehIHkQwvUsKHCWZ5QzIAD92LHD300 Beijing ? Five pro-Tibet activists unfurled a banner spelling out ?Free Tibet? in English and Chinese in bright blue LED ?throwie? lights in Beijing?s Olympic Park tonight. The five were detained by security personnel after displaying the banner for about 20 seconds at 11:48 pm August 19th. Their whereabouts are currently unknown. Read the press release. The detained activists are Americans Amy Johnson, 33, Sam Corbin, 24, Liza Smith, 31, Jacob Blumenfeld, 26, and Lauren Valle, 21. (bios of activists are below) ?The Chinese government is desperate to turn the world?s attention away from its abuses in Tibet as the Olympics take place, but the creativity and determination of Tibetans and their supporters has once again ensured that Tibetan voices are heard and seen in Beijing despite the massive security clampdown,? said Tenzin Dorjee, Deputy Director of Students for a Free Tibet. ?The Chinese leadership must realize that the only way it can make the issue of Tibet disappear is to acknowledge the demands of the Tibetan people and work with them to bring an end to China?s occupation of Tibet.? The lights used on the banner are blue 10 mm light-emitting diodes (LEDs) powered by small batteries, commonly known as ?throwies.? Throwies are open-source technology attributed to OpenLab and Graffiti Research Lab, developed as a means of creating non-destructive graffiti and light displays. This is the first time ever that they have been used on a banner. James Powderly, free speech activist and co-founder of the Graffiti Research Lab (GRL), was detained in Beijing early this morning. Bios and photos of the Tibet supporters detained for unfurling the LED banner: Lauren Valle, 31, was born in Falmouth, MA, and currently lives in Brooklyn, NY. She studies Eastern Religion and Philosophy at Columbia University. She has supported various organizations working to build a more just and sustainable world. She is taking action for Tibet this summer because she believes that the Olympics represent a unique and critical opportunity for people of conscience to come together on a global level and speak out for human rights. Amy Johnson, 33, was born in Detroit, Michigan where she grew up until moving to Georgia when she was 13 years old. She attended the University of Boulder, Colorado and lived there on and off for 15 years. Amy studied Policy and Social Values along with Peace and Conflict Studies and since then has worked with kids in various capacities, from teaching and counseling to leading international service trips abroad. Amy has recently started her own company. She is also a Metalsmith who makes politically-oriented jewelry from bullets she has found in the mountains around Boulder. Amy recently relocated to Los Angeles, and is pursuing commercial opportunities for her jewelry, in addition to continuing environmental and social justice efforts. Jacob Blumenfeld, 26, was born and raised in San Diego, California. His mother passed away when he was 5 years old and he, along with his brother and sister, were raised by their father. He went to a Jewish school and then to Vassar College. As a teenager and throughout college, Jacob became involved in numerous social justice projects. After college, he became involved in efforts for immigrant rights in San Diego, as well as projects promoting independent media. Jacob now lives in Brooklyn, NY and is pursuing his PhD in philosophy at the New School for Social Research. He teaches philosophy and is still active in many social justice projects in New York, such as the Regeneracion Childcare collective and Jews Against the Occupation. This is the first nonviolent action Jacob has taken related to Tibet, but has been aware of the situation in Tibet. As a Jew whose grandparents survived the Holocaust, Jacob feels an obligation to support the struggles of all peoples oppressed for their racial, ethnic or national identities, from Palestine to Chiapas to Tibet. The movement for a Free Tibet is part of a larger struggle for freedom from occupation, and hence Jacob considers it part of his struggle as well. Liza Smith, 31, was born in Boulder, Colorado and grew up in the Shambhala community ? with students of Trungpa Rinpoche ? and was raised practicing Tibetan Buddhism. She currently lives in Oakland, CA where she works for the Fellowship of Reconciliation Colombia Program. Liza has been active in human rights for Colombia for the last 10 years. She has organized against US military aid to Colombia, lead delegations of Americans to Colombia to accompany threatened human rights leaders, and lived in Colombia. Liza has benefitted greatly from the teachings of the Tibetan Buddhist tradition and has taken action in China because she believes in the global struggle for human rights and that all struggles to live in peace, whether in the US, Colombia or Tibet, are deeply interconnected. Samantha Corbin, 24, was born and raised in the Bronx, NY and currently lives in Brooklyn, NY. She has worked as an environmental and social justice activist and organizer in New York and Washington DC for many years. Some of the campaigns she has been involved with include advocating for the right of Appalachian residents who are fighting the multi-national banks funding mountaintop removal coal mining. Sam has worked with SFT as a volunteer and organizer and has also served as a climb trainer at an SFT Free Tibet! Action Camp. Sam traveled to China this summer to speak out in solidarity with Tibetans inside Tibet and feels it is her responsibility as a person who values justice to speak out at this critical time From drshabirchoudhry at googlemail.com Thu Aug 21 03:53:51 2008 From: drshabirchoudhry at googlemail.com (Dr Shabir Choudhry) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:23:51 +0100 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Struggle in 2008 - Dr Shabir Choudhry In-Reply-To: References: <346321.9768.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hello Thank you for your email. Very true and without that treatment he COULD have lost his life. If India wa so keen to get him killed as Gilani and his supporters claim then authorities could have left him inthe jail and let him die natural death as many other people die. In my opinion only political leader killed by Indian authorities or by Indian bullet is Sheikh Abdul Aziz, who was shot dead while the procession wanted to cross LOC. Again according to authorities when a crowed of thousands try to cross the LOC, which according to them is illegal and dangerous as they could get hostile treatment from theother side as well, it was their responsbility to manage people on their side of LOC and ordinary soldiers cannot tell who is who in the crowed. That however is no excuse to kill innocent people. I condemn it and I am sure many Indians would do the same. On 20/08/2008, Lalit Ambardar wrote: > > I wonder why the assassination of Baloch nationalist Nawab Akbar Bugti was > missed out. And here, not long ago Kashmiri pan Islamist Sayed Ali Shah > Jillani -Pakistani loyalist was airlifted in a state owned plane from Ranchi > jail to Bombay for treatment. > Regards > LA > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2008 07:06:16 -0700 > > From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > > To: reader-list at sarai.net > > Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Struggle in 2008 - Dr Shabir Choudhry > > > > Interesting Blog entry by the well known (notorious in the eyes of some) > Politician/Commentator Dr Shabir Choudhry. > > > > Kshmendra > > > > EXCERPTS: > > > > - Call it armed struggle, jihad, terrorism or a proxy war it destroyed > fundamental character of the Kashmiri society, and Kashmiri struggle for > right of self determination. This armed struggle which was initiated, > supported and promoted by secret agencies of Pakistan resulted in human > rights violations and deepened the divisions in the Kashmiri society. > > > > - In this struggle a Pakistani gun and agenda was implemented by using a > Kashmiri shoulder. It was presented to us by Pakistan and Kashmiri > leadership as a Kashmiri struggle for liberation; and with hindsight we see > that we Kashmiris were used as a raw material in this proxy war, and it > added to our misery and suffering. > > > > - I said to him that Pakistan got independence one day before India, and > Pakistan has also occupied some parts of Jammu and Kashmir; wouldn't it be > better to have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission first > followed by one outside the Indian High Commission. > > > > - There was no need to kill and torture people like that, but the > Pakistani army did the same thing in1992 and more than 8 innocent people > lost their lives. > > > > - Prior to this tragedy, National Students Federation members who were > trying to cross the LOC were also killed and tortured by the Pakistan army. > When it comes to enforcing 'law and order' or enforcing 'writ of government' > army is trained to kill and torture, as it is happening in Jammu and Kashmir > and in Swat, Balochistan, North West Frontier and FATA; or as it happened > when Red Mosque was invaded and destroyed in name of enforcing 'writ of > government'. > > > > - I further said India virtually lost Kashmir Valley in 1990/1, however > despite other heavy handedness India did not use helicopter gun ships or air > force against Muslim militants; in Pakistan on the other hand helicopter gun > ships and F 16 are regularly used to target alleged Muslim 'terrorists' in > which innocent Pakistani Muslims are killed and their houses are destroyed. > If you need any further evidence how Pakistani forces behave when asked to > deal with 'rebels' or with those who demand rights then read history of East > Pakistan or Bangladesh; or even ask members of Jammu and Kashmir Plebiscite > Front how they were treated in 1970/1 during investigations regarding Ganga > Hijacking. > > > > - I said without being pro this or anti that one can see a nation whose > leadership takes pride in 'selling' their (Pakistani) sons and daughters for > sake of American dollars, just take example of Dr Afia Sadiqqi who was > arrested in Karachi with her three young children and has ended up in > America, and where - about of her three young children is still not known. > Do you expect any mercy or better treatment from rulers and establishment of > this country? If they treat their own people like butchers and regard them > as an economic commodity don't expect that they will treat us Kashmiris > differently. > > > > - We Kashmiris still have not been able to decide who is enemy of our > independence and who is deceiving us in name of religion and brotherhood. It > is unfortunate that many of us still view Kashmir dispute in the context of > Muslims and non Muslims, and accept whatever is presented to us by media and > organisations controlled by Islamabad. > > > > - By promoting religious politics are we not playing in hands of > extremists who want to justify Two Nations Theory that Muslims and non > Muslims cannot live together, hence pave way for division of the State of > Jammu and Kashmir on religious lines. > > > > > > > > > > Kashmiri struggle in 2008 > > > > Kashmiri struggle in 2008 > > Dr Shabir Choudhry 13 August 2008 > > > > New phase of the Kashmiri struggle or whatever we want to call it in view > of communalism, proxy war and terrorism, has been going on since 1947; and > yet we people of Jammu and Kashmir have not been able to put our priorities > right. We have not been able to differentiate between freedom and > occupation. We have also failed to understand designs of both countries on > Kashmir, and formulate appropriate policies to promote and advance a > Kashmiri interest. > > > > In view of the above can we make a valid claim to get independence and be > recognised as a free nation and play our due role in comity of nations, > especially when what are known as Kashmiri leaders, at best have been acting > as puppets of either one country or the other and promoting and defending > interest of either India or Pakistan? > > > > Despite lack of democracy and encroachment of civil liberties the State > of Jammu and Kashmir was one political entity in 1947. People of the State > irrespective of their religious and cultural affiliations regarded > themselves as Kashmiris, distinctly different from India and Pakistan; and > wanted to maintain that difference. > > > > Today the unfortunate State is forcibly divided in many parts, and people > of the State are divided on religious, cultural, regional and ethnic lines. > These divisions have never been so deep and so frightening in the history of > the State, and it looks that those powers who are behind these moves are > paving the way for the division of the state on communal and regional lines. > > > > Call it armed struggle, jihad, terrorism or a proxy war it destroyed > fundamental character of the Kashmiri society, and Kashmiri struggle for > right of self determination. This armed struggle which was initiated, > supported and promoted by secret agencies of Pakistan resulted in human > rights violations and deepened the divisions in the Kashmiri society. > > > > In this struggle a Pakistani gun and agenda was implemented by using a > Kashmiri shoulder. It was presented to us by Pakistan and Kashmiri > leadership as a Kashmiri struggle for liberation; and with hindsight we see > that we Kashmiris were used as a raw material in this proxy war, and it > added to our misery and suffering. > > > > A few days ago a 'friend' who is still part of controversial nationalist > group of JKLF invited me to take part in a picket outside an Indian High > Commission on 15th August. According to him it was to demonstrate that India > got independence on this date and they have occupied our country - Jammu and > Kashmir. I said to him that Pakistan got independence one day before India, > and Pakistan has also occupied some parts of Jammu and Kashmir; wouldn't it > be better to have a demonstration outside Pakistani High Commission first > followed by one outside the Indian High Commission. > > > > This friend said, how can we have a demonstration outside Pakistani High > Commission, they are helping us against Indian occupation, can't you see how > the Indian army has killed innocent people who were peacefully proceeding > towards LOC. I said to him that I condemned this brutal killing. There was > no need to kill and torture people like that, but the Pakistani army did the > same thing in1992 and more than 8 innocent people lost their lives. > > > > I explained to him that in 1992 the JKLF people tried to cross the LOC > from the AJK side and they were also innocent and wanted to proceed to the > LOC peacefully, they were killed by the Pakistani army. Prior to this > tragedy, National Students Federation members who were trying to cross the > LOC were also killed and tortured by the Pakistan army. When it comes to > enforcing 'law and order' or enforcing 'writ of government' army is trained > to kill and torture, as it is happening in Jammu and Kashmir and in Swat, > Balochistan, North West Frontier and FATA; or as it happened when Red Mosque > was invaded and destroyed in name of enforcing 'writ of government'. > > > > I further said India virtually lost Kashmir Valley in 1990/1, however > despite other heavy handedness India did not use helicopter gun ships or air > force against Muslim militants; in Pakistan on the other hand helicopter gun > ships and F 16 are regularly used to target alleged Muslim 'terrorists' in > which innocent Pakistani Muslims are killed and their houses are destroyed. > If you need any further evidence how Pakistani forces behave when asked to > deal with 'rebels' or with those who demand rights then read history of East > Pakistan or Bangladesh; or even ask members of Jammu and Kashmir Plebiscite > Front how they were treated in 1970/1 during investigations regarding Ganga > Hijacking. > > > > I said without being pro this or anti that one can see a nation whose > leadership takes pride in 'selling' their (Pakistani) sons and daughters for > sake of American dollars, just take example of Dr Afia Sadiqqi who was > arrested in Karachi with her three young children and has ended up in > America, and where - about of her three young children is still not known. > Do you expect any mercy or better treatment from rulers and establishment of > this country? If they treat their own people like butchers and regard them > as an economic commodity don't expect that they will treat us Kashmiris > differently. > > > > Knowledge of this friend was limited and he was having difficulty in > justifying his argument, so he surrendered by saying that he could not > compete with me in knowledge and argument. He said he was a loyal member of > the JKLF and wanted to follow the party decision and the JKLF leaders. I > appreciated his 'loyalty' but added that loyalty of his leaders is not with > the JKLF or its ideology. Their loyalty is with agencies of our neighbours > who reward them handsomely. > > > > I said decision to hold a picket outside an Indian High commission was > taken else where but only endorsed in your meeting. Your leadership > discussed it with relevant quarters, agreed certain terms and conditions and > then brought this issue to your meeting to be approved. Normally committee > of personal and party loyalists do not disagree with any decision which is > presented to them as approved by the top leadership, especially there is > always hundred per cent unanimity when any actions is related to India. > > > > This friend agreed with almost everything I said, but added that 'you > have always been critical of top JKLF leadership and Pakistan. And now that > I have left the JKLF I should not criticise JKLF and its policies, as it > hurts us and that we will also criticise you and make allegations against > you'. > > > > Whether he or some one else criticise me or not it is immaterial, what is > important is the attitude of the Kashmiri people and especially that of > 'nationalist' parties. It is unfortunate to note that despite this long > struggle, sacrifices, and suffering on massive scale we as a nation have not > been able to decide our priorities. We Kashmiris still have not been able to > decide who is enemy of our independence and who is deceiving us in name of > religion and brotherhood. It is unfortunate that many of us still view > Kashmir dispute in the context of Muslims and non Muslims, and accept > whatever is presented to us by media and organisations controlled by > Islamabad. > > > > My colleagues and I have always regarded Jammu and Kashmir as one > political entity, and have promoted cause of united and independent Kashmir, > and advanced non - communal politics as Kashmir dispute is not a religious > one. But it is unfortunate to note that in 2008 we Kashmiris are more > divided and more communalised then we were in 1947; and gulf between the > regions and communities is widening. > > > > Jammu and the Valley have different priorities and are playing in hands > of those who want to play a religious card in order to divide the people on > communal lines and advance their politics. Ladakh apart from the 'Kargil > war' has not bee affected by the militancy; and has different agenda and has > no interest with what is going on in other two regions. Azad Kashmir and > Gilgit and Baltistan have no contact with each other and have different > priorities and interests. People of Azad Kashmir, forgetting their own > miseries and problems are seemed to be more concerned with what goes on > across the LOC, and virtually accept everything what is presented to them by > the Pakistani media. > > > > By promoting religious politics are we not playing in hands of extremists > who want to justify Two Nations Theory that Muslims and non Muslims cannot > live together, hence pave way for division of the State of Jammu and Kashmir > on religious lines. > > > > Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and > author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir > Affairs. > > Email: drshabirchoudhry at gmail.com > > To view other articles see my blog: www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com > > > > > http://drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/2008/08/kashmiri-struggle-in-2008.html > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > ------------------------------ > Movies, sports & news! Get your daily entertainment fix, only on live.com Try > it now! > -- Dr Shabir Choudhry From rashneek at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 12:13:54 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 12:13:54 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul Message-ID: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> >From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the reputation of being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in the matter of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only tolerant, but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate them. This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again during the early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave alone any violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the valley, was supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris have always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to blows, nor would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and ministers building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was how Hindu temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any violent opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This is a characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in Kashmir. Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its agonising spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we find Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a composite culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. This still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even though the turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy turvey. History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim rule from early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that managed and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for as long as two hundred years. Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, and most of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were Hindus. The chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, that has a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records that the Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his expeditions, once fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested that a huge brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted with disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created images to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri think of melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he remarked indignantly. Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his Muslim subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at Allaudinpura in Srinagar. Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably acknowledged as the real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the Sultan took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, ruthlessly persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two temples near Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah made strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat on holy Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, destroyed during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several springs, sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till this day. Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of Amarnath while he was the Sultan. In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud Shah's noble deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and granting rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer to the turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and killings have turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the prolonged tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than a large cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath Shrine Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a year, for the convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a section of Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread and violent agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled the issue right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The revocation, in turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, creating a deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the most ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though very briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh century AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have already been a pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the stages of pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when Aurangzeb was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar Khan (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to convert to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the leadership of one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh Guru, Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought the Guru's intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru obliged but this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the conversion of the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless persecution of Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically ceased with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also because the Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted for 67 years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra for forty years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was only during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in 1847, when a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the mountain meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" it. From then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without hinderance. With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous commander, Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in Srinagar arguing that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a mosque there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, sought the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who moved promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for the posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, Gulam Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that had suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He also installed a new Lingam in the temple. Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It is our common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively associated with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to it, by taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping with the spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its leaders would come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land for putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a brief period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. Instead we are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue connected with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high up on freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the mundane world. Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal words of our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us of our heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. Didn't Nund Rishi say: We belong to the same parents. Then why this difference? Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. We came to his world like partners. We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing to behave like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all these distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be used for temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our land of birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's good earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been ungrudginly made possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves into an intractable muddle. -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 14:42:40 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 14:42:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <8170EC3C-9C57-4A82-ACE2-E3620A3A5938@sarai.net> Message-ID: > > Dear Shuddha, > > Thanks for the long, thoughtful, and impassioned reply, which I enjoyed > reading. Sorry, I am hard-pressed for time and will be so for the next month > as I am away from Delhi. But I¹ve tried to respond as best I could. I am in > agreement with much of what you have said but found myself tripping over some > of what you advocate 3/4 of the way down. I have responded and look forward to > your response. I have to say, I enjoy engaging with you on Kashmir. I do not > have fixed views but really views that have been forged out of experience. > I¹m always open to an intelligent critique of those. > > Best regards > sj >> >> >> >> And a young gentleman by the name of Aditya Raj Kaul transformed this episode >> into the following - "The Kashmiri Muslims present screamed Inshallah". One >> Kashmiri muslim gentleman becomes 'the Kashmiri Muslims' (without >> qualification or exception) and an utterance that was not very clearly >> audible, becomes a scream. I think you will appreciate the disingenousness of >> Aditya Raj Kaul's statement. I hope you will join me in condemning this >> practice of making blanket generalizations about any community, on the basis >> of a reading of the actions of any one person. >> >> I agree with you and I wasn¹t at all suggesting that there were others who >> joined in. Even if they had a studio full of Kashmiris still doesn¹t make >> for all of Kashmir. >> >> >> I point this out only to underscore that it shows us the way in which the >> spin doctoring of Kashmir is often done, whether with regard to the valley, >> or to the microcosm of a television studio. And so suddenly, everything else >> that was said and heard gets forgotten, and we end up only discussing whether >> or not someone assented to the phrase - "nizam-e-mustafa". And so, by >> association, any discussion on Kashmir is held hostage to our different views >> about Nizam-E-Mustafa, Pakistan and Islamist politics. We are compelled, by >> this tactic, to forget that there are many other kinds of voices in Kashmir, >> some of which are in radical disagreement, some of which are ambivalent, and >> some of which are indifferent to these tropes. One way of being respectful >> towards a people is to insist that they represent a lively complexity, that >> they are not the android subjects of some dystopia who have been rendered >> completely incapable of thinking and saying more than one thing. That if they >> are Kashmiri Muslims, they can only think and feel about nizam e mustafa and >> that if they are Kashmiri pandits, they can only sing the same monotonous >> tune of Indian nationalism again and again. I am not at all implying that >> these are your views, but I do hope that you will join me in insisting that >> we resist these efforts at violent and obfuscatory simplification.  >> >> Ditto. >> >> >> >> I hope that everyone on this list will refrain from these low blows in the >> future. The debates on this list do not need these slightly lame tactics. >> While we are at it, let us recognize the fact that Mr. Khajuria and Mr. Ali >> Shah Geelani seemed equally interested in talking about Nizam-E-Mustafat at >> at time when the real issues facing the people of Jammu and Kashmir are to do >> with state repression, economic blockades, perceived and real disciminations, >> etc. That is an interesting co-incidence in itself. The BJP (and its minons) >> and at least some of the factions that attempt to run the deep state within >> the state in India must be terribly glad that Ali Shah Geelani gave them such >> a marvellous gift, the possibility of an immediate division of forces and >> opinions within the current Kashmiri opposition in the valley. I hope that >> this gift is proven (by the people of Kashmir) to be a cheque that bounces >> when all the concerned parties seek to encash it.  >> >> >> >> Now I come to more important questions that you have raised in your follow up >> postings on this thread.  >> >> >> >> I am in agreement with you that the restraint and maturity being shown by the >> people of Kashmir who are protesting is exemplary, and needs to be recognized >> for what it is. Terrorists and the secret-police are mirror images of each >> other, and nothing scares either more than the happy sight of a peaceful and >> passionate assembly of human beings who are fashioning for themselves the >> terms of their own liberty, without the burden of arms, secrecy, intrigue and >> the stench of blood. So far, the Terrorists and their colleagues and partners >> in the secret-police apparatus of the nation-states that hold Kashmir in >> thrall are on the defensive, and the people of Kashmir seem to have the upper >> hand. Lets hope that it stays this way. >> >> >> >> I am totally in agreement with the fact that this phase of non-violent >> protest indicates that the people of Kashmir have (re)discovered (at least >> for now) their own strength, that they are unwilling to be dictated to by any >> votaries of the cult of terrorism and that they are also just as unwilling to >> be dictated to by  any self appointed 'leaders' , whosoever they may be.  (As >> I have pointed out, Ali Shah Geelani had to apologize for his attempt at >> dictating the agenda and direction of this struggle, as if it were his >> personal fief, and he was compelled to do this because the people who are >> turning out on the streets of Kashmir seem at present to be unwilling to be >> taken for a ride yet again by any one who attempts to broker their desires >> for liberation from the occupation). At least at present, the people of >> Kashmir are ahead of those who claim to be their leaders, way ahead. Their so >> called 'leaders' must take comfort in hoping that they are not left too far >> behind as they attempt (confusedly) to follow the people.  >> >> >> >> You are right. The reports that are available do seem to suggest that the >> CRPF and J&K Police and the Armed Forces have matched the non-violence of the >> protestors by not killing more people than they already have. This is >> welcome. At all costs, I hope that everyone concerned will act in a way that >> avoids and mitigates against violence, the threat of violence and the loss of >> life.I hope this brings some sobriety to bear on the arrogance of all those >> who hold the shaky reins of power in Kashmir, and in Delhi. The eyes of the >> world are upon Kashmir, and if the people of Kashmir do not waver from their >> current course of protesting peacefully, in large numbers, democratically, >> they will have held out an example to oppressed peoples and their struggles, >> elsewhere in the subcontinent.  >> >> >> >> Let me state here that the question of an agreement, or disagreement, with >> the substantive political content of the struggle for what is being called >> 'Azaadi' in Kashmir, as it is played out by all the actors on the stage, is >> one thing, and a categorical demand for the withdrawal of the Indian >> government's militarized occupation of the Kashmir valley is another thing. >> And one need not be seen as subordinate to the other. I have very strong >> disagreements with some of the ways in which 'Azaadi' is conceived of by a >> number of the articulate political actors in the Kashmir valley. I disagree >> fundamentally with the view that replacing one nation state structure with >> another constitutes 'liberation' in any way. >> Agree >> >> But that disagreement is not with Kashmiris in particular, it extends to my >> disagreements with all those, including in india, whether on the left, right >> or centre, who continue to believe that the nation-state, and national >> liberation has anything of value to hold out to humanity in the wake of the >> debris of the twentieth century. But whatever my agreements or disagreements >> may be, I see no reason not to demand that even those I disagree with not be >> made subject to the violence of a militarized occupation undertaken by the >> state that I pay taxes to. >> >> Agree >> >> I do not wish to be complicit in that occupation. I think many more people in >> India are coming around to this view. Their numbers will only increase, >> because Indians, like people all over the world, are not stupid. More and >> more people are realizing and will come to realize that for the faintest >> possibility of peace, equity and prosperity to take hold in South Asia, India >> must let go of Kashmir. Only then will there be lasting peace on the >> subcontinent, only then can the tremendous and tragic drain that is the arms >> race be put an end to. >> >> >> How do you see this Œletting go of Kashmir¹? I¹m curious. >> >> I have never advocated or believed Kashmir should be held by force. It is >> shameful that a nation that prides itself on having won its independence by >> means of a non-violent struggle should have had to resort to brute power to >> hold down a region. It is all the more galling that it has had 60 years in >> which to convince the people of Kashmir of the benefits of being part of the >> Indian union and failed time and time again. If you look at Kashmir >> post-1947 there have been innumerable agreements signed between the Govt of >> India and the representatives of the people of J&K and each one of them has >> worked for a period and then failed. The 2002 elections brought considerable >> hope to New Delhi, but 8 years later we seem to have come full circle. >> Whenever I ask why it is that we (India & Pakistan) seem to be treading water >> on Kashmir, Kashmiri friends point to the root cause which has been left >> unaddressed. The root cause in this widely held view is the promise of a >> plebiscite or the right to self-determination. This is a long discussion. >> >> I have no problem, in principle, to say the Kashmiris or anybody else should >> get Azadi from India and vice-versa, but I¹d have to stop and think about >> what that means in real terms: What this means for the people of the Valley, >> Jammu, Ladakh, India and Pakistan; what is my definition of Azadi and how do >> I propose to practically resolve my ideas given the long and complex history >> of the region. >> >> >> The UN Resolutions speak of a plebiscite to either Pakistan or India. It did >> not, in 1948, anticipate the demand for an Independent Kashmir. It is not >> simply the Indian state that rejects the Resolutions but also advocates of an >> independent Kashmir. Pakistan has repeatedly said it would not countenance >> the creation of an independent Kashmir, and curiously, neither have >> successive leaders of Pakistan Administered Kashmir. So how do you >> practically deal with this situation? Do we press the UN to revoke, annul >> and expunge the Resolutions of 1948? No Kashmiri has ever raised this >> seriously because they know that Pakistan would not allow it. >> >> The state of J&K is extremely complex. Jammu & Ladakh want closer >> integration with India. Some would argue that Muslim areas of Jammu share >> the Kashmiri sentiment , but though I could be wrong, that has not been my >> experience. The Valley itself is divided into the Œpro-Azadi¹ and >> Œpro-India¹ lots. The latter, smaller in number, are largely businessmen who >> have interests in other parts of India and politicians and workers of >> mainstream political parties. Besides these, there are border areas like >> Gurez, Keran, Karnah and to some extent Uri where the people have been >> largely insulated from separatist political activity of the Valley because of >> the large presence of the Indian Army and their dependency on them. >> >> Among those wanting ŒAzadi¹ or secession from India, Kashmiris themselves put >> the divide as 60% for independence and 40% for accession with Pakistan. How >> is this to be resolved? After the revolution? I don¹t think so. >> >> I don¹t think another Partition will bring about lasting peace to the >> sub-continent. Speaking of which, in 1947, the people of India were not >> given the right to vote either for or against Partition. Gandhi proposed and >> Jinnah had opposed the idea of a plebiscite in 1944. The 1946 election was >> interpreted as a vote for Partition, but of the 350 million population of >> India only 10% were eligible to vote in the first place as there was no >> universal franchise. So, the verdict of 35 million people divided into >> separate electorates was taken as the will of the people. And what did it >> tell us when, of the 95 million Muslims in undivided India, 4o million >> continued to live in India after the creation of Pakistan? >> >> The fruits of 1947 are in front of us. I believe, like you, that replacing >> one nation-state by another is hardly the solution. For many years now, >> friends in Pakistan and I have been discussing the idea of a South Asian >> Union which loosens the idea of sovereignty, strengthens people, encourages >> movement across borders, makes irrelevant armies that are presently engaged >> in fighting each other. I wonder whether it is possible to take this >> conversation into that direction, into bringing together rather than >> sundering? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 21 15:14:58 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 02:44:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games Message-ID: <4615.63426.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games ISLAMABAD: Thirty-five Pakistan nationals on a visit to China for the Olympics have been detained on suspicion of planning to attack the Games proceedings, a media report said on Wednesday. The Chinese government has sought the details of the 35 suspects from Pakistan in a letter that claims that they had arrived in China to attack proceedings at the ongoing Games, Daily Times reported. The paper said Colonel Anjum Sheikh Saeed of the Foreign Security Department wrote to the Interior Ministry on August 18 asking the authorities concerned to collect details of those detained. It said the Chinese government has not released the names of those held, but has given the names and passport numbers of 13 others. In Beijing, an official spokesperson declined to confirm the report saying he did not have information on the issue. "I don't have information yet (on this issue.) But I will check for you," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson, Qin Gang told reporters when asked to confirm the Pakistani media report. In the past, Beijing has demanded Islamabad crack down on separatists from its restive Xinjiang region, who are getting "trained" in Pakistani terror camps.   http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/World/China_detains_35_Pak_nationals/articleshow/3385671.cms     var RN = new String (Math.random()); var RNS = RN.substring (2,11); b2 = ' '; if (doweshowbellyad==1) bellyad.innerHTML = b2; From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 21 15:28:25 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 02:58:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Congress attacks Arundhati over Kashmir remark Message-ID: <909588.20172.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com>   Is Arundhati Roy the only one who has "abused the liberal traditions of India"?   And, look who is talking. The Congress no less, who themselves have institutionalised the abuse of the "liberal" traditions of India.   A part of me sometimes hopes that "Kashmir" gets it's "Freedom" soon and one can see the likes of Arundhati Roy (and many supporters of the Separatists from the SARAI List) exported out of India to the "Free Kashmir".    Kshmendra   Congress attacks Arundhati over Kashmir remark   Wed, Aug 20 12:04 PM   New Delhi, Aug 20 (IANS) Booker Prize winner Arundhati Roy who had issued a statement advocating freedom for Kashmir was a 'loose cannon' who had 'abused the liberal traditions of India', the Congress said Wednesday.   'She (Roy) is a loose cannon who has abused liberal traditions of India to its fullest,' said Congress spokesperson Manish Tiwari.   'It is a great tribute to the tolerance of India's ethos that a person who openly calls for Balkanization of country is not being locked up and the keys are not being thrown away,' Tiwari told IANS.   The author and rights activist had said Monday after participating in a rally to the UN office in Srinagar: 'The reaction of the people in Kashmir is actually a referendum. People don't need anyone to represent them; they are representing themselves. India needs freedom from Kashmir as much as Kashmir needs freedom from India.'   http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20080820/818/tnl-congress-attacks-arundhati-over-kash.html     From shuddha at sarai.net Thu Aug 21 15:16:26 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 15:16:26 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> Dear Rashneek, thank your for this post, it does come as a breath of fresh air, and points to the histories of cultural accommodation, exchange and reciprocity that have been as much a part of the history of Kashmir as has been division and intolerance. In this case, I think that all of us have a lot to learn from the histories of exchange in Kashmir, and I am grateful that Rashneek has given us these examples by forwarding this text by Shyam Kaul. And I mean this sincerely. I especially agree with the sentiments at the end, that a piece of land, especially one that has been a part of the commons, should not be seen as 'property' by any person, persons, communities or entities. It is not, as Shyam Kaul says, 'yours' or 'mine'. This means that the hundred acres in question (that lie at the core of the Amarnath controversy) should neither belong to the SASB, and nor should any pilgrims and shepherds be prevented from camping and accessing the commons as they have done for centuries. In fact all hospitality (commensurate with the sensible ecological custordianship of the space) should be made available to pilgrims and wanderers who pass through this space. We need to note, that this year (in the just concluded pilgrimage season) has seen a record number of pilgrims travel to Amarnath, despite the current situation in Jammu & Kashmir, who have all been cared for and assisted by local inhabitants, as has always been the case. Had this attitude prevailed, on all sides, then, many precious lives would not have been lost. Perhaps this can help us think about the ways in which it can become possible (and not only in Kashmir) to approach the higher reachers of pastures, foothills and slopes of mountains, forests, grazing routes, passes and meadows that constitute a kind of commons as being territories that do not 'belong' to anyone, neither to Shrine Boards, nor to Government Departments, nor to Forest Departments (which are often responsible for their wholesale destruction) nor as Private Property, but as territories that are accessible to all to inhabit, use, and pass through, sensibly, respectfully and sustainably, and over whom the custody of the traditional users, inhabitants and custodians of these lands, (shepherds, nomads, transhumant communities and forest dwellers, many of whom predate the artificial constructs and boundaries of nation states) is to be seen as paramount. In the Amarnath case, this would mean restoring the primacy of the Gujjar communities that have traditionally acted as guides and hosts of the pilgrims to Amarnath in all affairs to do with the space and ecosphere around and on the way to the shrine. This would also be in keeping with the spirit of accommodation, exchange and partnership that have been pointed to in the text by Shyam Kaul. Anything else, including the handing over of the land to the modern institution of a State mandated Shrine Board with a governor at its head would be a betrayal of the tradition of Kashmir. (This also applies to the intrusion of the state in Waqf boards and in the management of trusteeship of traditional Islamic and Buddhist institutions). Incidentally, there is an excellent and very evocatively written account of Vivekananda's pilgrimage to Amarnath, in the late nineteenth century, by his travelling companion, his Irish woman friend Margaret Noble who took the name Sister Nivedita. Vivekananda and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along the Lidder river route to Amarnath, En route, they are assisted and kept company by Muslim Gujjar guides, naked Sadhus and boatmen, with whom they share their rations, stories and long walks . Vivekananda plays with a young Muslim girl child and worships her as an incarnation of Uma. They have long conversations on comparative religion, the merits and demerits of celibacy and conjugal love, the meaning of 'Azaadi' in America, (they even have an impromptu July the 4th tea party with an improvised American flag) and architecture, and Vivekananda is caught between criticising the tradition that demands ardurous pilgrimages of the faithful and revelling in the sheer joy of the journey. There is no Shree Amarnath Shrine Board at this time, and I think someone as adventurous and open-spirited as Vivekananda would have blanched at the idea of taking the assistance of the state in the undertaking of what for him was a personal spiritual quest. As someone who has deeply enjoyed walking in the Himalays, in Kashmir and elsewhere, myself, I was very drawn to this account, and what it can mean, especially in times such as these. Should anyone want to read it, it is (if I recall correctly) in Volume 9 of the Collected Works of Swami Vivekananda, in a journal of a journey through Kashmir kept by Sister Nivedita. regards, Shuddha On 21-Aug-08, at 12:13 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the > reputation of > being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in > the matter > of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only > tolerant, > but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their > adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate > them. > This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again > during the > early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early > Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave > alone any > violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the > valley, was > supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and > peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris have > always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to > blows, nor > would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. > Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and ministers > building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was > how Hindu > temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and > flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. > When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any violent > opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This > is a > characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in > Kashmir. > Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its > agonising > spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we find > Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a composite > culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. > This > still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even > though the > turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy > turvey. > History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim > rule from > early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that > managed > and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for > as long > as two hundred years. > Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, > and most > of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were Hindus. The > chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, > that has > a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records > that the > Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his > expeditions, once > fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested > that a huge > brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted > with > disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created > images > to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri think of > melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he > remarked > indignantly. > Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his Muslim > subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at > Allaudinpura in Srinagar. > Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably > acknowledged as the > real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his > contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the > Sultan > took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, ruthlessly > persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two > temples near > Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah > made > strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat > on holy > Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, > destroyed > during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several > springs, > sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till > this day. > Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of > Amarnath > while he was the Sultan. > In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud > Shah's noble > deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and > granting > rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer > to the > turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and > killings have > turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the > prolonged > tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than > a large > cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath > Shrine > Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a > year, for the > convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a > section of > Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread > and violent > agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled > the issue > right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The > revocation, in > turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, creating a > deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. > Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the > most > ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though very > briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh > century > AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have > already been a > pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the stages of > pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the > Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. > Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when > Aurangzeb > was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar > Khan > (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to > convert > to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the > leadership of > one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh > Guru, > Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought > the Guru's > intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru > obliged but > this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the > conversion of > the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the > leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. > During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless > persecution of > Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically > ceased > with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also > because the > Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted > for 67 > years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra > for forty > years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was only > during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in > 1847, when > a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the > mountain > meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" > it. From > then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without > hinderance. > With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous > commander, > Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in > Srinagar arguing > that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a > mosque > there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, > sought > the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who > moved > promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for the > posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, > Gulam > Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that > had > suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He also > installed a new Lingam in the temple. > Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It > is our > common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively > associated > with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to > it, by > taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. > Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping with the > spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its > leaders would > come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land for > putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a > brief > period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. > Instead we > are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue > connected > with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high > up on > freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the > mundane world. > Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal > words of > our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us > of our > heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. > Didn't Nund Rishi say: > We belong to the same parents. > Then why this difference? > Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. > We came to his world like partners. > We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. > But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing > to behave > like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all > these > distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be > used for > temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our land of > birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's > good > earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been > ungrudginly made > possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves > into an > intractable muddle. > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From iram at sarai.net Thu Aug 21 15:45:41 2008 From: iram at sarai.net (Iram Ghufran) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 15:45:41 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Fwd: Lecture by Kumkum Sangari Message-ID: <48AD404D.1060109@sarai.net> Fwd: ===================== Kumkum Sangari has been invited to lecture on Gender and Literary Studies Date: 25-08-2008 [Monday] Time: 11.00 am Venue: Seminar Room, BMMMC Block IP College, Civil Lines Delhi Everyone's welcome ~ Please circulate widely. Thanks, N. _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From pawan.durani at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 15:50:11 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 15:50:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul In-Reply-To: <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> References: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808210320y7ef8e655n3ec0a52dbc1f1ace@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Vivekananda and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along the Lidder river route to Amarnath, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is interesting to note that Shuddha prefers to call Anantnaag as "Islamabad". Next Shankracharya temple would be called "Takht E Suleiman" and Hari Parbat as "Koh E Maraan"......and scores of lanes which have been named as Abu-Bakar lane , Abu -Hamza Lane and Al - Fateh lane etc. This is quite possible with "intellectuals" who fall in the same category as Aran Dhat Teri Ki Roy types. Regards Pawan Durani On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Rashneek, > > thank your for this post, it does come as a breath of fresh air, and > points to the histories of cultural accommodation, exchange and > reciprocity that have been as much a part of the history of Kashmir > as has been division and intolerance. In this case, I think that all > of us have a lot to learn from the histories of exchange in Kashmir, > and I am grateful that Rashneek has given us these examples by > forwarding this text by Shyam Kaul. And I mean this sincerely. > > I especially agree with the sentiments at the end, that a piece of > land, especially one that has been a part of the commons, should not > be seen as 'property' by any person, persons, communities or > entities. It is not, as Shyam Kaul says, 'yours' or 'mine'. This > means that the hundred acres in question (that lie at the core of the > Amarnath controversy) should neither belong to the SASB, and nor > should any pilgrims and shepherds be prevented from camping and > accessing the commons as they have done for centuries. In fact all > hospitality (commensurate with the sensible ecological custordianship > of the space) should be made available to pilgrims and wanderers who > pass through this space. We need to note, that this year (in the just > concluded pilgrimage season) has seen a record number of pilgrims > travel to Amarnath, despite the current situation in Jammu & Kashmir, > who have all been cared for and assisted by local inhabitants, as has > always been the case. > > Had this attitude prevailed, on all sides, then, many precious lives > would not have been lost. > > Perhaps this can help us think about the ways in which it can become > possible (and not only in Kashmir) to approach the higher reachers of > pastures, foothills and slopes of mountains, forests, grazing routes, > passes and meadows that constitute a kind of commons as being > territories that do not 'belong' to anyone, neither to Shrine Boards, > nor to Government Departments, nor to Forest Departments (which are > often responsible for their wholesale destruction) nor as Private > Property, but as territories that are accessible to all to inhabit, > use, and pass through, sensibly, respectfully and sustainably, and > over whom the custody of the traditional users, inhabitants and > custodians of these lands, (shepherds, nomads, transhumant > communities and forest dwellers, many of whom predate the artificial > constructs and boundaries of nation states) is to be seen as > paramount. In the Amarnath case, this would mean restoring the > primacy of the Gujjar communities that have traditionally acted as > guides and hosts of the pilgrims to Amarnath in all affairs to do > with the space and ecosphere around and on the way to the shrine. > This would also be in keeping with the spirit of accommodation, > exchange and partnership that have been pointed to in the text by > Shyam Kaul. Anything else, including the handing over of the land to > the modern institution of a State mandated Shrine Board with a > governor at its head would be a betrayal of the tradition of Kashmir. > (This also applies to the intrusion of the state in Waqf boards and > in the management of trusteeship of traditional Islamic and Buddhist > institutions). > > Incidentally, there is an excellent and very evocatively written > account of Vivekananda's pilgrimage to Amarnath, in the late > nineteenth century, by his travelling companion, his Irish woman > friend Margaret Noble who took the name Sister Nivedita. Vivekananda > and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, > Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along > the Lidder river route to Amarnath, En route, they are assisted and > kept company by Muslim Gujjar guides, naked Sadhus and boatmen, with > whom they share their rations, stories and long walks . Vivekananda > plays with a young Muslim girl child and worships her as an > incarnation of Uma. They have long conversations on comparative > religion, the merits and demerits of celibacy and conjugal love, the > meaning of 'Azaadi' in America, (they even have an impromptu July the > 4th tea party with an improvised American flag) and architecture, and > Vivekananda is caught between criticising the tradition that demands > ardurous pilgrimages of the faithful and revelling in the sheer joy > of the journey. There is no Shree Amarnath Shrine Board at this time, > and I think someone as adventurous and open-spirited as Vivekananda > would have blanched at the idea of taking the assistance of the state > in the undertaking of what for him was a personal spiritual quest. As > someone who has deeply enjoyed walking in the Himalays, in Kashmir > and elsewhere, myself, I was very drawn to this account, and what it > can mean, especially in times such as these. > > Should anyone want to read it, it is (if I recall correctly) in > Volume 9 of the Collected Works of Swami Vivekananda, in a journal of > a journey through Kashmir kept by Sister Nivedita. > > regards, > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > On 21-Aug-08, at 12:13 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > > > From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the > > reputation of > > being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in > > the matter > > of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only > > tolerant, > > but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their > > adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate > > them. > > This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again > > during the > > early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early > > Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave > > alone any > > violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the > > valley, was > > supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and > > peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris have > > always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to > > blows, nor > > would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. > > Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and ministers > > building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was > > how Hindu > > temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and > > flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. > > When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any violent > > opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This > > is a > > characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in > > Kashmir. > > Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its > > agonising > > spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we find > > Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a composite > > culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. > > This > > still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even > > though the > > turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy > > turvey. > > History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim > > rule from > > early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that > > managed > > and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for > > as long > > as two hundred years. > > Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, > > and most > > of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were Hindus. The > > chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, > > that has > > a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records > > that the > > Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his > > expeditions, once > > fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested > > that a huge > > brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted > > with > > disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created > > images > > to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri think of > > melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he > > remarked > > indignantly. > > Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his Muslim > > subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at > > Allaudinpura in Srinagar. > > Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably > > acknowledged as the > > real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his > > contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the > > Sultan > > took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, ruthlessly > > persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two > > temples near > > Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah > > made > > strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat > > on holy > > Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, > > destroyed > > during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several > > springs, > > sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till > > this day. > > Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of > > Amarnath > > while he was the Sultan. > > In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud > > Shah's noble > > deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and > > granting > > rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer > > to the > > turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and > > killings have > > turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the > > prolonged > > tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than > > a large > > cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath > > Shrine > > Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a > > year, for the > > convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a > > section of > > Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread > > and violent > > agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled > > the issue > > right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The > > revocation, in > > turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, creating a > > deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. > > Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the > > most > > ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though very > > briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh > > century > > AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have > > already been a > > pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the stages of > > pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the > > Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. > > Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when > > Aurangzeb > > was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar > > Khan > > (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to > > convert > > to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the > > leadership of > > one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh > > Guru, > > Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought > > the Guru's > > intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru > > obliged but > > this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the > > conversion of > > the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the > > leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. > > During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless > > persecution of > > Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically > > ceased > > with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also > > because the > > Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted > > for 67 > > years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra > > for forty > > years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was only > > during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in > > 1847, when > > a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the > > mountain > > meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" > > it. From > > then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without > > hinderance. > > With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous > > commander, > > Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in > > Srinagar arguing > > that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a > > mosque > > there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, > > sought > > the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who > > moved > > promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for the > > posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, > > Gulam > > Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that > > had > > suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He also > > installed a new Lingam in the temple. > > Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It > > is our > > common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively > > associated > > with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to > > it, by > > taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. > > Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping with the > > spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its > > leaders would > > come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land for > > putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a > > brief > > period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. > > Instead we > > are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue > > connected > > with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high > > up on > > freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the > > mundane world. > > Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal > > words of > > our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us > > of our > > heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. > > Didn't Nund Rishi say: > > We belong to the same parents. > > Then why this difference? > > Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. > > We came to his world like partners. > > We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. > > But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing > > to behave > > like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all > > these > > distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be > > used for > > temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our land of > > birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's > > good > > earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been > > ungrudginly made > > possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves > > into an > > intractable muddle. > > > > -- > > Rashneek Kher > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From paulo.hartmann at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 17:25:01 2008 From: paulo.hartmann at gmail.com (Paulo Hartmann) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 08:55:01 -0300 Subject: [Reader-list] III Mobilefest 2008 Message-ID: CALL FOR POSTERS, PAPERS, PROJECTS & PRODUCTS How can mobile technology contribute to democracy, culture, art, ecology, peace, education, health and third-sector? KEYWORDS 3g, activism, art, augmented reality, bluetooth, citizen videos, culture, cyberculture, democracy, diy, ecology, education, electronic art, electronic music, gprs, gps, health, innovation, interactive and networked performance with mobile and wireless devices, interactive architecture, lbs, live cinema, locative, mesh networks, mms, mobile activism, mobile and wireless games, mobile applications, mobile education, mobile music, mobile narrative, mobile streaming, mociology, open networks, peace, rfid, sensors, sms, third-sector, trends, video production and distribution, wearable technologies, wi-fi, wi-max, zigbee, etc. III MOBILEFEST 2008 INTERNATIONAL FESTIVAL OF MOBILE ARTS AND CREATIVITY Mobilefest - International Festival of Mobile Arts and Creativity is an event that aims to question and discuss the advent of the new mobile technologies in their relationships with the various segments of society, being the first International Festival of the kind. The main objective is to provide a multifaceted and heterogenic environment of discussions, actions and creations that seek intelligent and innovative solutions, through the virtualities of the new mobile technologies, to solve or even discuss the issues that trouble contemporary societies. The effort of the event in regards to the new communication technologies is based on the perception of its potential growth - there are more than 3 billion active mobiles nowadays. The increase of its use is not only for communication between people, but also for activities of education, social inclusion, varied artistic productions, entertainment, security, content production and distribution, socialization networks, activism actions, health, commerce, advertising, etc. HISTORY: The I Mobilefest was launched in November 2006, with an international seminar that took place in São Paulo, at Sesc Paulista, with live and free transmission via the Internet. In its first edition, it broached the social, cultural and aesthetic implications that the mobile ands mobile technologies have been promoting in global scale The festival discussed the main outlining of the relationships between mobile technologies (like mobile, handhelds, etc.) and the many segments of the society listed above. Besides the discussion, the event is made of technical and cultural activities and also includes an expositive exhibition and the launch of a recognition award of the best mobile works in the following catgories: SMS Writing - Micro Stories and Poetry, Photojournalism, Video, Moblogs and Videologs , the I Mobilefest Awards. The seminar gathered 14 foreign artists and researchers and 20 Brazilian artists and specialists. The II edition of Mobilefest (2007) gathered together artists, researchers and panelists from many countries and had considerable increase in the size of its programmation. It was 5 days of seminars, 2 days of bootcamp and 30 days of exhibition. The big innovation in 2007 was the realization of simultaneous events in England (University of Westmister), in The Netherlands, (The Waag Society) and in the United States (New York University - ITP). In the audiovisual section, Mobilefest consolidated the wish to creat a network of international festivals about mobile content production. Aside from Telemig Arte Mov (Brazil) and Mobifest (Canada), already present in the previous year, other festivals were shown, such as Movilfilm Fest (Spain), Pocket Shorts (England and Scotland), Pocket Films (France), Microfilmes (Portugal) and The 4th Screen (United States). The extensive Mobilefest schedule also includeded: videoconferences, meetings, seminars, Mobileactive at Mobilefest and the International Exhibition. In this year also, Mobilefest Festival became and oficial part of the calendar for the city of São Paulo. OBJECTIVES: * Popularise mobile technology as to contribute to social inclusion through the generalisation of knowledge, its use and possibilities of interaction promoted by these new communication media. * Offer the audience the an award specialised in recognising works that use mobile technology. * Promote cultural interchange among national and international researchers and producers of this area. * Incentive the creative thought and production about the new technologies aiming to expand the possible hardware and software functions in the mobile technology sector. * Stimulate the production of content in the mobile technology segment in Brazil in terms of production in the industrial segment as well as from the point of view of the independent creator, thus intending to seek for balanced ways of relationships between these two players which will not mean mutual negation. * Enable the participation of all interested in producing and distributing content through the mobile communication networks. MOBILEFEST 2008 CALL FOR POSTERS, PAPERS, PROJECTS & PRODUCTS How can mobile technology contribute to democracy, culture, art, ecology, peace, education, health and third-sector? DEADLINE The deadline for posters, projects and papers is August 31st 2008. Earlier email correspondence with the festival is more than welcome! SUBMISSION Submissions should be sent by August 31st 2008 via email to 2008(at) mobilefest.org including information bellow: Complete name: Organization / Company: Short bio: Age: Summary / Abstract: Includes a demonstration? YES/NO A new tool or version is released during this event? YES/NO Format: Conference / Workshop / Demonstration Internet connectivity needed? YES / NO Country: City: Telephone number: Mobile number: University (optional): University level (optional): Proposed category (democracy, culture, art, ecology, peace, education, health, third-sector or "all together**) ** MOBILEFEST is a transdisciplinary event, the more interconnection, the better. ATENTION: - Abstracts must be 300 words minimum - Papers must be 1000 words minimum - The submitted paper must be written in English, Portuguese, Spanish or Italian - Papers submitted are limited to 45 minutes presentation - The paper must be attached to the email in .TXT, .RTF, .DOC or PDF files. - Projects must have documentation: blueprint, photos, video and technical rider. - Submit as many works as you want, one mail submission for each. - Workshop / Demonstration - Format: 30 min to 2 hours demonstration / workshop PARTICIPANTS IN THE PAST Adriene Jenik, Alan Kay, Alberto Magno, Alberto Tognazzi, Alexandre Matias, Ami Dar, Amyris Fernandez, André Lemos, Andreas Blazoudakis, Ângela Bardin, Armin Medosch, Becky Faith, Brenda Burrell, Camille Baker, Carmen Maia, Carol Mafra, César Jartorelli, Christian Wiener, Clóvis Borges, Cory Ramey, Cyrus Frisch, Daniel Araújo, Daniel Florêncio, Daniel Oelsner Lopes, David Barnard, David Cavallo, Douglas Nadalini da Silva, Duncan Kennedy, Eduardo Bicudo, Eliezer Muniz, Eva Weber, Evgeny Morozov, Fabio Fon, Felipe Albuquerque Pereira, Fernando Teco Sodré, Gabe Sawhney, Geandre Tomazoni, Geert Lovink, Gilson Schwartz, Giselle Beiguelman, Graham Brown-Martin, Graziela Tanaka, Gustavo Mansur, Heather A. Horst, Hernani Dimantas, Howard Rheingold, Hyejin Choi, Irene Karaguilla Ficheman, Jackson Filho, Jane Placca, Jason Lewis, Javier Rodrigo, Jean-Noël Montagné, Jinwoo Chung, Jonah Brucker-Cohen, Juan Carlos Zuñiga Torres, Juca Varella, Karinna Bidermann, Kate Bauer, Kati Hartman, Kati London, Katrin Verclas, Liana Brazil, Lisa Roberts, Lucas Bambozzi, Lucas Longo, Lucie Bélanger, Marcelo Nunes de Carvalho, Marcelo Tas, Maroussia Lévesque, Martin Owen, Maurício Hirata, Mauro Rubens, Max Leite, Max Schleser, Mieke Gerritzen, Mimi Ito, Norene Leddy, Oleksandr Demchenko, Otakar Svacina, Paulo Henrique Ferreira, Pedro Paranaguá, Rachel Jacobs, Rachel Payne, Renato Cruz, Renato Rollemberg, Rob van Kranenburg, Robson Lisboa, Rogério da Costa, Ronald Lenz, Ronaldo Simão da Costa, Rosana Herman, Roseli de Deus Lopes, Russ Rive, Shawn Van Every, Sheila Kinkade, Soraya Braz, Suely Rolnik, Tamaryn Nelson, Toni Eliasz, Victor Rebouças, Volker Grassmut, Wagner Martins, Zico Góes FROM THE FOLLOWING COUNTRIES Argentina, Austria, Bangladesh, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, Colombia, England, EUA, Finland, France, Germany, India, Italy, Luxemburg, Peru, Portugal, Scotland, Serbia, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, The Netherlands, Uruguay, Zimbabwe. MOBILEFEST FESTIVALS NETWORK MOBILEFEST has started in 2007 a network of mobile content festivals, if you are connected with a festival not listed bellow and wish to take part of this network, please contact us at 2008(at)mobilefest.org. Our partners include: - Mobifest | Canada - Pocket Shorts | UK - Pocket Films | France - Arte Mov | Brazil - Microfilmes de Lisboa | Portugal - The 4th Screen | USA NODES MOBILEFEST MOBILEFEST has started in 2007 a network of Mobilefest Nodes in Universities, Media Centers and Researches Institutes around the world, if you want your institution to be connected with Mobilefest, please contact us at 2008(at)mobilefest.org Our partners include: - Waag society | The Netherlands, Amsterdam - Westminster University | UK, London - New York University - ITP | USA, New York From shuddha at sarai.net Thu Aug 21 17:40:17 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:40:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808210320y7ef8e655n3ec0a52dbc1f1ace@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808210320y7ef8e655n3ec0a52dbc1f1ace@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Pawan, Thank you for your mail. Actually my usage of the name "Islamabad' was influenced by my memory of having read the text that I had mentioned (Nivedita's journal of the travel with Vivekananda through kashmir). You might find it interesting to know that even Vivekananda, for whom, you no doubt have some regard, and Sister Nivedita, refer to the town that you call as Anantnag, as Islamabad. And in fact, yes, when they mention the temple located at the site known as Shankaracharya hill, in Srinagar, they refer to it as 'Takht - e - Suleiman'. When a place gets more than one name attached to it, I see no problem by calling it by either one, or both names. A place- name, is ultimately a convention used to identify and mark a site on a particular topography. If that marking is facilitated by more than one name, I see no reason to insist on one over the other. Fortunately, or unfortunately, the Internet is a true Pandora's Box, and those who persist in their curiosities are rewarded. After I wrote the last mail, just to be certain that my memory was not playing tricks on me, I ran a google search with the words Vivekananda, Nivedita and Amarnath, and at the same time, a friendly soul sent me a mail with a link, having read my earlier mail, and I came across the entire text of the book, online, at - http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Complete_Works_of_Swami_Vivekananda/ Volume_9/Excerpts_from_Sister_Nivedita%27s_Book Since this page is very neatly and systematically chapterized, all you need to do is to follow the links to the chapters. here are, a few excerpts from the Vivekananda/Nivedita account, that I had mentioned earlier, Here is the entry dated, June 29, a fragment from Chapter VII, titled, 'Life at Srinagar' "JUNE 29. Another day we went off quietly by ourselves and visited the Takt-i- Suleiman, a little temple very massively built on the summit of a small mountain two or three thousand feet high. It was peaceful and beautiful, and the famous Floating Gardens could be seen below us for miles around. The Takt-i-Suleiman was one of the great illustrations of the Swami's argument when he would take up the subject of the Hindu love of nature as shown in the choice of sites for temples and architectural monuments. As he had declared, in London, that the saints lived on the hill-tops in order to enjoy the scenery, so now he pointed out — citing one example after another — that our Indian people always consecrated places of peculiar beauty and importance by making there their altars of worship. And there was no denying that the little Takt, crowning the hill that dominated the whole valley, was a case in point." Here is another for August 8, in chapter X, titled, interstingly, 'The Shrine at Amarnath' AUGUST 8. "We started for Islamabad next day, and on Monday morning as we sat at breakfast, we were towed safely into Srinagar." There are several other examples, in the pages of this account, where the words Islamabad are used, to mean the site that is marked as Anantnag today. I can cite them if it would satisfy your curiosity Clearly, in the year 1898, when this journey was undertaken, people like Swami Vivekananda and Sister Nivedita saw no reason to use names other than 'Takht-e-Suliman' and 'Islamabad'. Would you like to add their names to the list of 'intellectuals' you are compiling, who should be calumnized, together with Arundhati Roy? best Shuddha On 21-Aug-08, at 3:50 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Vivekananda and Nivedita (and their other > companions) > travel through Srinagar, Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) > through the > traditional along the Lidder river route to Amarnath, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > It is interesting to note that Shuddha prefers to call Anantnaag as > "Islamabad". Next Shankracharya temple would be called "Takht E > Suleiman" > and Hari Parbat as "Koh E Maraan"......and scores of lanes which > have been > named as Abu-Bakar lane , Abu -Hamza Lane and Al - Fateh lane etc. > > This is quite possible with "intellectuals" who fall in the same > category as > Aran Dhat Teri Ki Roy types. > > Regards > > Pawan Durani > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta > wrote: > >> Dear Rashneek, >> >> thank your for this post, it does come as a breath of fresh air, and >> points to the histories of cultural accommodation, exchange and >> reciprocity that have been as much a part of the history of Kashmir >> as has been division and intolerance. In this case, I think that all >> of us have a lot to learn from the histories of exchange in Kashmir, >> and I am grateful that Rashneek has given us these examples by >> forwarding this text by Shyam Kaul. And I mean this sincerely. >> >> I especially agree with the sentiments at the end, that a piece of >> land, especially one that has been a part of the commons, should not >> be seen as 'property' by any person, persons, communities or >> entities. It is not, as Shyam Kaul says, 'yours' or 'mine'. This >> means that the hundred acres in question (that lie at the core of the >> Amarnath controversy) should neither belong to the SASB, and nor >> should any pilgrims and shepherds be prevented from camping and >> accessing the commons as they have done for centuries. In fact all >> hospitality (commensurate with the sensible ecological custordianship >> of the space) should be made available to pilgrims and wanderers who >> pass through this space. We need to note, that this year (in the just >> concluded pilgrimage season) has seen a record number of pilgrims >> travel to Amarnath, despite the current situation in Jammu & Kashmir, >> who have all been cared for and assisted by local inhabitants, as has >> always been the case. >> >> Had this attitude prevailed, on all sides, then, many precious lives >> would not have been lost. >> >> Perhaps this can help us think about the ways in which it can become >> possible (and not only in Kashmir) to approach the higher reachers of >> pastures, foothills and slopes of mountains, forests, grazing routes, >> passes and meadows that constitute a kind of commons as being >> territories that do not 'belong' to anyone, neither to Shrine Boards, >> nor to Government Departments, nor to Forest Departments (which are >> often responsible for their wholesale destruction) nor as Private >> Property, but as territories that are accessible to all to inhabit, >> use, and pass through, sensibly, respectfully and sustainably, and >> over whom the custody of the traditional users, inhabitants and >> custodians of these lands, (shepherds, nomads, transhumant >> communities and forest dwellers, many of whom predate the artificial >> constructs and boundaries of nation states) is to be seen as >> paramount. In the Amarnath case, this would mean restoring the >> primacy of the Gujjar communities that have traditionally acted as >> guides and hosts of the pilgrims to Amarnath in all affairs to do >> with the space and ecosphere around and on the way to the shrine. >> This would also be in keeping with the spirit of accommodation, >> exchange and partnership that have been pointed to in the text by >> Shyam Kaul. Anything else, including the handing over of the land to >> the modern institution of a State mandated Shrine Board with a >> governor at its head would be a betrayal of the tradition of Kashmir. >> (This also applies to the intrusion of the state in Waqf boards and >> in the management of trusteeship of traditional Islamic and Buddhist >> institutions). >> >> Incidentally, there is an excellent and very evocatively written >> account of Vivekananda's pilgrimage to Amarnath, in the late >> nineteenth century, by his travelling companion, his Irish woman >> friend Margaret Noble who took the name Sister Nivedita. Vivekananda >> and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, >> Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along >> the Lidder river route to Amarnath, En route, they are assisted and >> kept company by Muslim Gujjar guides, naked Sadhus and boatmen, with >> whom they share their rations, stories and long walks . Vivekananda >> plays with a young Muslim girl child and worships her as an >> incarnation of Uma. They have long conversations on comparative >> religion, the merits and demerits of celibacy and conjugal love, the >> meaning of 'Azaadi' in America, (they even have an impromptu July the >> 4th tea party with an improvised American flag) and architecture, and >> Vivekananda is caught between criticising the tradition that demands >> ardurous pilgrimages of the faithful and revelling in the sheer joy >> of the journey. There is no Shree Amarnath Shrine Board at this time, >> and I think someone as adventurous and open-spirited as Vivekananda >> would have blanched at the idea of taking the assistance of the state >> in the undertaking of what for him was a personal spiritual quest. As >> someone who has deeply enjoyed walking in the Himalays, in Kashmir >> and elsewhere, myself, I was very drawn to this account, and what it >> can mean, especially in times such as these. >> >> Should anyone want to read it, it is (if I recall correctly) in >> Volume 9 of the Collected Works of Swami Vivekananda, in a journal of >> a journey through Kashmir kept by Sister Nivedita. >> >> regards, >> >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 21-Aug-08, at 12:13 PM, rashneek kher wrote: >> >>> From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the >>> reputation of >>> being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in >>> the matter >>> of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only >>> tolerant, >>> but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their >>> adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate >>> them. >>> This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again >>> during the >>> early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early >>> Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave >>> alone any >>> violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the >>> valley, was >>> supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and >>> peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris >>> have >>> always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to >>> blows, nor >>> would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. >>> Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and >>> ministers >>> building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was >>> how Hindu >>> temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and >>> flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. >>> When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any >>> violent >>> opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This >>> is a >>> characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in >>> Kashmir. >>> Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its >>> agonising >>> spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we >>> find >>> Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a >>> composite >>> culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. >>> This >>> still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even >>> though the >>> turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy >>> turvey. >>> History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim >>> rule from >>> early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that >>> managed >>> and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for >>> as long >>> as two hundred years. >>> Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, >>> and most >>> of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were >>> Hindus. The >>> chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, >>> that has >>> a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records >>> that the >>> Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his >>> expeditions, once >>> fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested >>> that a huge >>> brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted >>> with >>> disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created >>> images >>> to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri >>> think of >>> melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he >>> remarked >>> indignantly. >>> Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his >>> Muslim >>> subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at >>> Allaudinpura in Srinagar. >>> Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably >>> acknowledged as the >>> real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his >>> contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the >>> Sultan >>> took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, >>> ruthlessly >>> persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two >>> temples near >>> Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah >>> made >>> strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat >>> on holy >>> Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, >>> destroyed >>> during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several >>> springs, >>> sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till >>> this day. >>> Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of >>> Amarnath >>> while he was the Sultan. >>> In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud >>> Shah's noble >>> deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and >>> granting >>> rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer >>> to the >>> turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and >>> killings have >>> turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the >>> prolonged >>> tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than >>> a large >>> cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath >>> Shrine >>> Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a >>> year, for the >>> convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a >>> section of >>> Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread >>> and violent >>> agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled >>> the issue >>> right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The >>> revocation, in >>> turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, >>> creating a >>> deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. >>> Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the >>> most >>> ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though >>> very >>> briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh >>> century >>> AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have >>> already been a >>> pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the >>> stages of >>> pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the >>> Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. >>> Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when >>> Aurangzeb >>> was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar >>> Khan >>> (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to >>> convert >>> to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the >>> leadership of >>> one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh >>> Guru, >>> Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought >>> the Guru's >>> intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru >>> obliged but >>> this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the >>> conversion of >>> the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the >>> leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. >>> During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless >>> persecution of >>> Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically >>> ceased >>> with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also >>> because the >>> Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted >>> for 67 >>> years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra >>> for forty >>> years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was >>> only >>> during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in >>> 1847, when >>> a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the >>> mountain >>> meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" >>> it. From >>> then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without >>> hinderance. >>> With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous >>> commander, >>> Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in >>> Srinagar arguing >>> that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a >>> mosque >>> there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, >>> sought >>> the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who >>> moved >>> promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for >>> the >>> posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, >>> Gulam >>> Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that >>> had >>> suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He >>> also >>> installed a new Lingam in the temple. >>> Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It >>> is our >>> common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively >>> associated >>> with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to >>> it, by >>> taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. >>> Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping >>> with the >>> spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its >>> leaders would >>> come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land >>> for >>> putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a >>> brief >>> period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. >>> Instead we >>> are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue >>> connected >>> with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high >>> up on >>> freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the >>> mundane world. >>> Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal >>> words of >>> our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us >>> of our >>> heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. >>> Didn't Nund Rishi say: >>> We belong to the same parents. >>> Then why this difference? >>> Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. >>> We came to his world like partners. >>> We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. >>> But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing >>> to behave >>> like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all >>> these >>> distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be >>> used for >>> temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our >>> land of >>> birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's >>> good >>> earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been >>> ungrudginly made >>> possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves >>> into an >>> intractable muddle. >>> >>> -- >>> Rashneek Kher >>> Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy >>> http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com >>> http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS >> Raqs Media Collective >> shuddha at sarai.net >> www.sarai.net >> www.raqsmediacollective.net >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 17:57:18 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:57:18 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Giving Kashmir away? No way Message-ID: <6353c690808210527h4f6b52bclc5f37bf974be51eb@mail.gmail.com> *Giving Kashmir away? No way * ** *Rajiv Sikri* ** *Link - http://in.rediff.com/news/2008/aug/21guest1.htm* ** August 21, 2008 Is it an orchestrated coincidence or random chance that on August 17, two leading national dailies prominently carried commentaries advocating independence for the Kashmir Valley? With surprising ease and lack of angst, each author has argued in favour of secession by part of an integrally constituted state of the Union of India. Tremendous efforts by all the state and non-state personae in Jammu & Kashmir and the rest of India over the last six decades have seen sharp ups and downs, almost see-saw phases in the feelings of alienation followed by assimilation, poverty followed by growing prosperity among the people of this state. The last few years have brought in the most sustained period of political stability, free and fair elections, economic recovery and strengthening integration, achieved through painstaking efforts and sagacity by all players. Heading into the November 2008 state assembly elections in Jammu & Kashmir, the separatist groups found themselves on the sidelines, threatened with further irrelevance and declining support should these elections be held as smoothly and with equally wide participation as those in 2002. The Amarnath Yatra [Images ] land issue that surfaced in June has been extremely poorly handled by the state and central governments at every stage. The nation needs answers and accountability about why in less than two months the marginalised separatist groups are once again being allowed to set the political agenda in the Valley. Why have no efforts been made to explain the reality of the proposed temporary land allocation scheme (for the Amarnath Yatra) to the agitating people in the Kashmir Valley? Why have the strong feelings of every community in Jammu over the cancellation of the allocation been so deliberately ignored and under-estimated? Why is it that even the most elementary efforts were not undertaken to disabuse the people of Kashmir Valley about a so-called economic blockade? If there was at any point the possibility of a shortage of essential supplies for the people of the Kashmir Valley this should have been overcome by arranging sufficient airlifts and/or trucking in such supplies through the alternative Manali-Leh route. At the same time, no matter how serious these lapses, the answer cannot be to suggest that the Kashmir Valley be allowed to secede from India. The sovereignty and territorial integrity of a nation is as much a composite whole as the human body is. If there is an ailing part of the body, you diagnose the problem and take remedial measures, not carelessly, almost casually, suggest an excision and discarding of the offending section. For those who advocate a referendum in Jammu and Kashmir [Images ], there are some questions. Do they feel that Jammu and Kashmir legally and constitutionally cannot be considered a part of India? On what basis can there be a referendum in the Kashmir Valley, or separate referenda in Jammu, Ladakh and the Valley? On what basis can "independence" be considered as the so-called third option? Should the proposed referendum be based on the UN resolutions of August 1948 and January 1949? Or are such sentiments the manifestation of a simultaneous bout of exasperation and giving in to the separatists who have been quite unnecessarily allowed to mount pressures in a sudden reversal of the peaceful situation that existed in the state prior to June? The UN resolutions of 1948/49 (adopted by the UN Commission for India and Pakistan) are unequivocal and specific in making the proposed plebiscite in all the five regions of Jammu and Kashmir conditional upon (i) withdrawal of Pakistani troops from all the areas of the state of Jammu and Kashmir that it has occupied (this includes PoK, the Northern Territories and the Shaksgam valley that has been ceded by Pakistan to China); and (ii) the withdrawal by Pakistan, from these occupied areas of Jammu and Kashmir, of their tribesmen and nationals not ordinarily resident in these areas. The UN Commission in an *aide-memoire* issued on January 14, 1949, stated that in the event of Pakistan not implementing these pre-conditions, India's acceptance of the UN resolutions would no longer be binding on them. As recently as March 2001 former UN Secretary General Kofi Annan, speaking in Islamabad [Images ], accepted the legal and practical difficulties in implementing the UN resolutions and hence their irrelevance. It is evident that the UN resolutions no longer provide any basis for holding referenda either in the Kashmir Valley or in Jammu and Ladakh. Jammu and Kashmir is an integral part of India, and will remain so. The Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir itself recognises this. Any move to hold a referendum in any part of Jammu and Kashmir would contradict the fundamental statement in Section 3 of the Constitution of Jammu and Kashmir that 'the State of Jammu and Kashmir is and shall be an integral part of the Union of India'. Section 147 prohibits any amendment of Section 3 by the state legislature. In any case, India has stringent laws that forbid secessionist activity. It is time that the people of India and all national political parties come out unequivocally against anyone who advocates secessionism. In this context, the print and electronic media too should be more responsible about giving prominence to such views. From rashneek at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 18:04:35 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 18:04:35 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul In-Reply-To: References: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808210320y7ef8e655n3ec0a52dbc1f1ace@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808210534x6ee71b26w8dc8cc8df592a956@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shuddha and Pawan, Thankfully,I have read these accounts of Swami Vivekenanda's travels in Kashmir.As a child I have spent a lot of time at the Nagdanadi ashram(run by Ramakrishna Mission) near Deviangan(or Brari Angan),the abode of Tripurasundari in Devasar Pargana of Kashmir.It is today a desecrated Nag and a broken temple.I have such fond memories of the place that the mere mention brings that place alive (in my thoughts)and tears in my eyes because I may never see it again. Shudda is right when he mentions that Islamabad and Takht-i-Sulaiman have been mentioned.Those were names in vogue at that point in time.They were ofcourse not the original names but these places were connoted as Islamabad and Takht-i-Sulaiman respectively from their original names of Anantnag and Gopadari Hill.As per Tarikh-i-Hassan Gopadari became the Shankaracharya Hill after the great Philosopher is believed to have visited the place. Shyam Koul is now an old man and he has made an attempt to fill the chasm which should have come from elsewhere too.I would not mince words when I say that as a larger community among the Kashmiris it becomes almost obligatory on the Kashmiri Muslims to have raised a voice of reason and extend a hand to the Pandit community.Where is the Shyam Koul among them,I yearn to see him. Or maybe Shams Faqir is truly dead. Rashneek Kher On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 5:40 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Pawan, > > Thank you for your mail. Actually my usage of the name "Islamabad' > was influenced by my memory of having read the text that I had > mentioned (Nivedita's journal of the travel with Vivekananda through > kashmir). You might find it interesting to know that even > Vivekananda, for whom, you no doubt have some regard, and Sister > Nivedita, refer to the town that you call as Anantnag, as Islamabad. > And in fact, yes, when they mention the temple located at the site > known as Shankaracharya hill, in Srinagar, they refer to it as 'Takht > - e - Suleiman'. When a place gets more than one name attached to it, > I see no problem by calling it by either one, or both names. A place- > name, is ultimately a convention used to identify and mark a site on > a particular topography. If that marking is facilitated by more than > one name, I see no reason to insist on one over the other. > > Fortunately, or unfortunately, the Internet is a true Pandora's Box, > and those who persist in their curiosities are rewarded. After I > wrote the last mail, just to be certain that my memory was not > playing tricks on me, I ran a google search with the words > Vivekananda, Nivedita and Amarnath, and at the same time, a friendly > soul sent me a mail with a link, having read my earlier mail, and I > came across the entire text of the book, online, at - > > http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Complete_Works_of_Swami_Vivekananda/ > Volume_9/Excerpts_from_Sister_Nivedita%27s_Book > > Since this page is very neatly and systematically chapterized, all > you need to do is to follow the links to the chapters. > > here are, a few excerpts from the Vivekananda/Nivedita account, that > I had mentioned earlier, Here is the entry dated, June 29, a fragment > from Chapter VII, titled, 'Life at Srinagar' > > "JUNE 29. > > Another day we went off quietly by ourselves and visited the Takt-i- > Suleiman, a little temple very massively built on the summit of a > small mountain two or three thousand feet high. It was peaceful and > beautiful, and the famous Floating Gardens could be seen below us for > miles around. The Takt-i-Suleiman was one of the great illustrations > of the Swami's argument when he would take up the subject of the > Hindu love of nature as shown in the choice of sites for temples and > architectural monuments. As he had declared, in London, that the > saints lived on the hill-tops in order to enjoy the scenery, so now > he pointed out — citing one example after another — that our Indian > people always consecrated places of peculiar beauty and importance by > making there their altars of worship. And there was no denying that > the little Takt, crowning the hill that dominated the whole valley, > was a case in point." > > > Here is another for August 8, in chapter X, titled, interstingly, > 'The Shrine at Amarnath' > > > AUGUST 8. > > "We started for Islamabad next day, and on Monday morning as we sat > at breakfast, we were towed safely into Srinagar." > > There are several other examples, in the pages of this account, where > the words Islamabad are used, to mean the site that is marked as > Anantnag today. I can cite them if it would satisfy your curiosity > > Clearly, in the year 1898, when this journey was undertaken, people > like Swami Vivekananda and Sister Nivedita saw no reason to use names > other than 'Takht-e-Suliman' and 'Islamabad'. > > Would you like to add their names to the list of 'intellectuals' you > are compiling, who should be calumnized, together with Arundhati Roy? > > > > best > > Shuddha > > > On 21-Aug-08, at 3:50 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Vivekananda and Nivedita (and their other > > companions) > > travel through Srinagar, Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) > > through the > > traditional along the Lidder river route to Amarnath, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > It is interesting to note that Shuddha prefers to call Anantnaag as > > "Islamabad". Next Shankracharya temple would be called "Takht E > > Suleiman" > > and Hari Parbat as "Koh E Maraan"......and scores of lanes which > > have been > > named as Abu-Bakar lane , Abu -Hamza Lane and Al - Fateh lane etc. > > > > This is quite possible with "intellectuals" who fall in the same > > category as > > Aran Dhat Teri Ki Roy types. > > > > Regards > > > > Pawan Durani > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > wrote: > > > >> Dear Rashneek, > >> > >> thank your for this post, it does come as a breath of fresh air, and > >> points to the histories of cultural accommodation, exchange and > >> reciprocity that have been as much a part of the history of Kashmir > >> as has been division and intolerance. In this case, I think that all > >> of us have a lot to learn from the histories of exchange in Kashmir, > >> and I am grateful that Rashneek has given us these examples by > >> forwarding this text by Shyam Kaul. And I mean this sincerely. > >> > >> I especially agree with the sentiments at the end, that a piece of > >> land, especially one that has been a part of the commons, should not > >> be seen as 'property' by any person, persons, communities or > >> entities. It is not, as Shyam Kaul says, 'yours' or 'mine'. This > >> means that the hundred acres in question (that lie at the core of the > >> Amarnath controversy) should neither belong to the SASB, and nor > >> should any pilgrims and shepherds be prevented from camping and > >> accessing the commons as they have done for centuries. In fact all > >> hospitality (commensurate with the sensible ecological custordianship > >> of the space) should be made available to pilgrims and wanderers who > >> pass through this space. We need to note, that this year (in the just > >> concluded pilgrimage season) has seen a record number of pilgrims > >> travel to Amarnath, despite the current situation in Jammu & Kashmir, > >> who have all been cared for and assisted by local inhabitants, as has > >> always been the case. > >> > >> Had this attitude prevailed, on all sides, then, many precious lives > >> would not have been lost. > >> > >> Perhaps this can help us think about the ways in which it can become > >> possible (and not only in Kashmir) to approach the higher reachers of > >> pastures, foothills and slopes of mountains, forests, grazing routes, > >> passes and meadows that constitute a kind of commons as being > >> territories that do not 'belong' to anyone, neither to Shrine Boards, > >> nor to Government Departments, nor to Forest Departments (which are > >> often responsible for their wholesale destruction) nor as Private > >> Property, but as territories that are accessible to all to inhabit, > >> use, and pass through, sensibly, respectfully and sustainably, and > >> over whom the custody of the traditional users, inhabitants and > >> custodians of these lands, (shepherds, nomads, transhumant > >> communities and forest dwellers, many of whom predate the artificial > >> constructs and boundaries of nation states) is to be seen as > >> paramount. In the Amarnath case, this would mean restoring the > >> primacy of the Gujjar communities that have traditionally acted as > >> guides and hosts of the pilgrims to Amarnath in all affairs to do > >> with the space and ecosphere around and on the way to the shrine. > >> This would also be in keeping with the spirit of accommodation, > >> exchange and partnership that have been pointed to in the text by > >> Shyam Kaul. Anything else, including the handing over of the land to > >> the modern institution of a State mandated Shrine Board with a > >> governor at its head would be a betrayal of the tradition of Kashmir. > >> (This also applies to the intrusion of the state in Waqf boards and > >> in the management of trusteeship of traditional Islamic and Buddhist > >> institutions). > >> > >> Incidentally, there is an excellent and very evocatively written > >> account of Vivekananda's pilgrimage to Amarnath, in the late > >> nineteenth century, by his travelling companion, his Irish woman > >> friend Margaret Noble who took the name Sister Nivedita. Vivekananda > >> and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, > >> Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along > >> the Lidder river route to Amarnath, En route, they are assisted and > >> kept company by Muslim Gujjar guides, naked Sadhus and boatmen, with > >> whom they share their rations, stories and long walks . Vivekananda > >> plays with a young Muslim girl child and worships her as an > >> incarnation of Uma. They have long conversations on comparative > >> religion, the merits and demerits of celibacy and conjugal love, the > >> meaning of 'Azaadi' in America, (they even have an impromptu July the > >> 4th tea party with an improvised American flag) and architecture, and > >> Vivekananda is caught between criticising the tradition that demands > >> ardurous pilgrimages of the faithful and revelling in the sheer joy > >> of the journey. There is no Shree Amarnath Shrine Board at this time, > >> and I think someone as adventurous and open-spirited as Vivekananda > >> would have blanched at the idea of taking the assistance of the state > >> in the undertaking of what for him was a personal spiritual quest. As > >> someone who has deeply enjoyed walking in the Himalays, in Kashmir > >> and elsewhere, myself, I was very drawn to this account, and what it > >> can mean, especially in times such as these. > >> > >> Should anyone want to read it, it is (if I recall correctly) in > >> Volume 9 of the Collected Works of Swami Vivekananda, in a journal of > >> a journey through Kashmir kept by Sister Nivedita. > >> > >> regards, > >> > >> > >> Shuddha > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On 21-Aug-08, at 12:13 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > >> > >>> From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the > >>> reputation of > >>> being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in > >>> the matter > >>> of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only > >>> tolerant, > >>> but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their > >>> adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate > >>> them. > >>> This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again > >>> during the > >>> early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early > >>> Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave > >>> alone any > >>> violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the > >>> valley, was > >>> supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and > >>> peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris > >>> have > >>> always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to > >>> blows, nor > >>> would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. > >>> Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and > >>> ministers > >>> building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was > >>> how Hindu > >>> temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and > >>> flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. > >>> When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any > >>> violent > >>> opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This > >>> is a > >>> characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in > >>> Kashmir. > >>> Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its > >>> agonising > >>> spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we > >>> find > >>> Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a > >>> composite > >>> culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. > >>> This > >>> still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even > >>> though the > >>> turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy > >>> turvey. > >>> History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim > >>> rule from > >>> early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that > >>> managed > >>> and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for > >>> as long > >>> as two hundred years. > >>> Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, > >>> and most > >>> of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were > >>> Hindus. The > >>> chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, > >>> that has > >>> a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records > >>> that the > >>> Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his > >>> expeditions, once > >>> fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested > >>> that a huge > >>> brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted > >>> with > >>> disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created > >>> images > >>> to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri > >>> think of > >>> melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he > >>> remarked > >>> indignantly. > >>> Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his > >>> Muslim > >>> subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at > >>> Allaudinpura in Srinagar. > >>> Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably > >>> acknowledged as the > >>> real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his > >>> contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the > >>> Sultan > >>> took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, > >>> ruthlessly > >>> persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two > >>> temples near > >>> Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah > >>> made > >>> strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat > >>> on holy > >>> Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, > >>> destroyed > >>> during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several > >>> springs, > >>> sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till > >>> this day. > >>> Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of > >>> Amarnath > >>> while he was the Sultan. > >>> In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud > >>> Shah's noble > >>> deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and > >>> granting > >>> rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer > >>> to the > >>> turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and > >>> killings have > >>> turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the > >>> prolonged > >>> tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than > >>> a large > >>> cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath > >>> Shrine > >>> Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a > >>> year, for the > >>> convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a > >>> section of > >>> Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread > >>> and violent > >>> agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled > >>> the issue > >>> right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The > >>> revocation, in > >>> turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, > >>> creating a > >>> deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. > >>> Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the > >>> most > >>> ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though > >>> very > >>> briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh > >>> century > >>> AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have > >>> already been a > >>> pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the > >>> stages of > >>> pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the > >>> Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. > >>> Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when > >>> Aurangzeb > >>> was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar > >>> Khan > >>> (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to > >>> convert > >>> to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the > >>> leadership of > >>> one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh > >>> Guru, > >>> Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought > >>> the Guru's > >>> intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru > >>> obliged but > >>> this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the > >>> conversion of > >>> the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the > >>> leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. > >>> During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless > >>> persecution of > >>> Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically > >>> ceased > >>> with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also > >>> because the > >>> Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted > >>> for 67 > >>> years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra > >>> for forty > >>> years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was > >>> only > >>> during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in > >>> 1847, when > >>> a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the > >>> mountain > >>> meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" > >>> it. From > >>> then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without > >>> hinderance. > >>> With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous > >>> commander, > >>> Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in > >>> Srinagar arguing > >>> that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a > >>> mosque > >>> there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, > >>> sought > >>> the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who > >>> moved > >>> promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for > >>> the > >>> posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, > >>> Gulam > >>> Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that > >>> had > >>> suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He > >>> also > >>> installed a new Lingam in the temple. > >>> Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It > >>> is our > >>> common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively > >>> associated > >>> with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to > >>> it, by > >>> taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. > >>> Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping > >>> with the > >>> spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its > >>> leaders would > >>> come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land > >>> for > >>> putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a > >>> brief > >>> period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. > >>> Instead we > >>> are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue > >>> connected > >>> with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high > >>> up on > >>> freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the > >>> mundane world. > >>> Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal > >>> words of > >>> our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us > >>> of our > >>> heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. > >>> Didn't Nund Rishi say: > >>> We belong to the same parents. > >>> Then why this difference? > >>> Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. > >>> We came to his world like partners. > >>> We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. > >>> But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing > >>> to behave > >>> like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all > >>> these > >>> distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be > >>> used for > >>> temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our > >>> land of > >>> birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's > >>> good > >>> earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been > >>> ungrudginly made > >>> possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves > >>> into an > >>> intractable muddle. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Rashneek Kher > >>> Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > >>> http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > >>> http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > >>> _________________________________________ > >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >>> Critiques & Collaborations > >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >>> subscribe in the subject header. > >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >>> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS > >> Raqs Media Collective > >> shuddha at sarai.net > >> www.sarai.net > >> www.raqsmediacollective.net > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 18:10:30 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 12:40:30 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games In-Reply-To: <4615.63426.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <4615.63426.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It will be interesting to see how pan Islamists manage to penetrate China. After Kashmir is it Xinjiang on the radar now? It is hoped China would succeed where India failed. LA > Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 02:44:58 -0700> From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com> To: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games> > China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games> > > ISLAMABAD: Thirty-five Pakistan nationals on a visit to China for the Olympics have been detained on suspicion of planning to attack the Games proceedings, a media report said on Wednesday. > > The Chinese government has sought the details of the 35 suspects from Pakistan in a letter that claims that they had arrived in China to attack proceedings at the ongoing Games, Daily Times reported. > > The paper said Colonel Anjum Sheikh Saeed of the Foreign Security Department wrote to the Interior Ministry on August 18 asking the authorities concerned to collect details of those detained. > > It said the Chinese government has not released the names of those held, but has given the names and passport numbers of 13 others. > > In Beijing, an official spokesperson declined to confirm the report saying he did not have information on the issue. > > "I don't have information yet (on this issue.) But I will check for you," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson, Qin Gang told reporters when asked to confirm the Pakistani media report. > > In the past, Beijing has demanded Islamabad crack down on separatists from its restive Xinjiang region, who are getting "trained" in Pakistani terror camps. > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/World/China_detains_35_Pak_nationals/articleshow/3385671.cms> > > > var RN = new String (Math.random());> var RNS = RN.substring (2,11);> b2 = ' ';> if (doweshowbellyad==1) > bellyad.innerHTML = b2;> > > > > _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Chose your Life Partner? Join MSN Matrimony FREE http://www.shaadi.com/msn/matrimony.php From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 18:11:16 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 18:11:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Arundhati Roy a loose canon: Congress Message-ID: <6353c690808210541o4e57aef8i52b8e249a8baa8a2@mail.gmail.com> NEW DELHI (IANS) - Booker Prize winner Arundhati Roy who had issued a statement advocating freedom for Kashmir was a "loose cannon" who had "abused the liberal traditions of India", the Congress said on Wednesday. "She (Roy) is a loose cannon who has abused liberal traditions of India to its fullest," said Congress spokesperson Manish Tiwari. "It is a great tribute to the tolerance of India's ethos that a person who openly calls for Balkanization of country is not being locked up and the keys are not being thrown away," Tiwari told IANS . The author and rights activist had said on Monday after participating in a rally to the UN office in Srinagar: "The reaction of the people in Kashmir is actually a referendum. People don't need anyone to represent them; they are representing themselves. India needs freedom from Kashmir as much as Kashmir needs freedom from India." __._,_ From anansi1 at earthlink.net Thu Aug 21 18:12:51 2008 From: anansi1 at earthlink.net (Paul Miller) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 08:42:51 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] TONITE! Dj Spooky, Cory Doctorow - Comic Book Legal Defense Fund Benefit Message-ID: Hey you all - sorry about the last minute e-blast, but hey... it's summer, and I've been traveling. Anyway.... tonite, me and Cory Doctorow are doing a conversation about our new books. It's a benefit for the Comic Book Legal Defense fund. Cory wrote the foreword to my new book "Sound Unbound" and works extensively in the new media/ digital media scene. Trust me, there'll be lots of people from different scenes... Comic books are Kool!!! IT'S A BENEFIT... But yeah, guestlist is flexible. We're expecting quite a few people to the event and after party, so come on out! 7:30pm Basic Description of what it's all about: http://www.cbldf.org/pr/archives/000367.shtml My new book is called "Sound Unbound" and It's about sound art, digital media, and new compositional strategy. It has essays from Brian Eno, Steve Reich, Chuck D, Hans Ulrich Obrist, Moby, Pierre Boulez, Saul Williams, Bruce Sterling, Jonathan Lethem etc etc The audio companion has rare material from Allen Ginsberg, James Joyce, Ryuichi Sakamoto, Jean Cocteau,Gertrude Stein, Liam Gillick, Trilok Gurtu, Sun Ra, George E. Lewis, Aphex Twin, Sonic Youth, Philip Glass, Iggy Pop etc Sound Unbound edited by MIT Press (2008) www.soundunbound.com Brief Bios Cory Doctorow is an activist, writer, blogger, and public speaker about copyright, digital rights management, and electronic freedom. As a co-editor of the Boing Boing blog, he highlights critical technology issues for more than a million readers a day. Doctorow has lectured around the globe and has been nominated for Hugo and Nebula Awards for his science fiction novels. Doctorow was EFF's European Affairs Coordinator until December of 2005 and is currently an EFF Fellow. His most recent novel, Little Brother, was released in April of this year to critical acclaim and highlights the risks of trading freedom for security in a networked world. Paul D. Miller aka DJ SPOOKY is a composer, multimedia artist and writer. His written work has appeared in The Village Voice, The Source, Artforum and Rapgun amongst other publications. Miller's work as a media artist has appeared in a wide variety of contexts such as the Whitney Biennial; The Venice Biennial for Architecture (2000); the Ludwig Museum in Cologne, Germany; Kunsthalle, Vienna; The Andy Warhol Museum in Pittsburgh and many other museums and galleries. His work "New York Is Now" has been exhibited in the Africa Pavilion of the 52 Venice Biennial 2007, and the Miami/Art Basel fair of 2007. Miller's first collection of essays, entitled "Rhythm Science" came out on MIT Press 2004. His book "Sound Unbound," an anthology of writings on electronic music and digital media was recently released by MIT Press. Miller's deep interest in reggae and dub has resulted in a series of compilations, remixes and collections of material from the vaults of the legendary Jamaican label, Trojan Records. Other releases include Optometry (2002), a jazz project featuring some of the best players in the downtown NYC jazz scene, and Dubtometry (2003) featuring Lee 'Scratch' Perry and Mad Professor. Miller's latest collaborative release, Drums of Death, features Dave Lombardo of Slayer and Chuck D of Public Enemy among others. He also produced material on Yoko Ono's new album "Yes, I'm a Witch." From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 21 19:28:44 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 06:58:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <297249.97265.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Lalit   As long as Pakistan finds it crucial to have excellent relations with China, there is little likelihood of the Xinjiang (Sinkiang) separatist movement posing any heightened threat to China.   Of course there will be incidents like the killing of 16 Chinese Chinese Police personnel a few days before the start of the Beijing Olympics for which the Xinjiang separatists were blamed. But the usual thrust provided to Islamic Separatist Movements out of Pakistan will be minimal unless it suits Pakistan to act otherwise.   China has acted very ruthlessly a number of times against the Xinjiang separatists. This has included demolition of settlements (residential and business) and also Mosques.   What has been interesting is that such actions of China against the Muslims and Mosques has never brought forth angry condemnation from Pakistan. Not ever from the  Govt of Pakistan and rarely from the Muslims of Pakistan.   There have not been any significant or extensively advertised adverse reactions out of India either. Not from GOI, not from the Muslims of India, not from "that class" who are quick and ever willing to support the separatists in Indian Kashmir and who is so very well represented and articulate in SARAI. These bunches (from India) are for that matter most times also mute about how Pakistan treats it's Muslims and "seekers of freedom from Pakistan".     Xinjiang continues to be a Muslim Majority region of China. They are predominantly of Uyghur ethnicity. Slim majority though. At least now.   "Demographic changes and balances" has been much in the news in the past weeks (Amarnath- Hindus-Kashmir- India). Apparently the Han (Non-Muslim) Chinese were about 6% of the population of Xinjiang in 1949. Recent enumerations put them at over 40%. And, to quote "This figure does not include military personnel or their families, or the many unregistered migrant workers." How is that for "demographic change"?    Kshmendra     --- On Thu, 8/21/08, Lalit Ambardar wrote: From: Lalit Ambardar Subject: RE: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com, "sarai list" Date: Thursday, August 21, 2008, 6:10 PM #yiv1698088668 .hmmessage P { margin:0px;padding:0px;} #yiv1698088668 { FONT-SIZE:10pt;FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;} It will be interesting to see how pan Islamists  manage to penetrate China. After Kashmir is it Xinjiang on the radar now? It is hoped China would succeed where India failed. LA > Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 02:44:58 -0700 > From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games > > China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games > > > ISLAMABAD: Thirty-five Pakistan nationals on a visit to China for the Olympics have been detained on suspicion of planning to attack the Games proceedings, a media report said on Wednesday. > > The Chinese government has sought the details of the 35 suspects from Pakistan in a letter that claims that they had arrived in China to attack proceedings at the ongoing Games, Daily Times reported. > > The paper said Colonel Anjum Sheikh Saeed of the Foreign Security Department wrote to the Interior Ministry on August 18 asking the authorities concerned to collect details of those detained. > > It said the Chinese government has not released the names of those held, but has given the names and passport numbers of 13 others. > > In Beijing, an official spokesperson declined to confirm the report saying he did not have information on the issue. > > "I don't have information yet (on this issue.) But I will check for you," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson, Qin Gang told reporters when asked to confirm the Pakistani media report. > > In the past, Beijing has demanded Islamabad crack down on separatists from its restive Xinjiang region, who are getting "trained" in Pakistani terror camps. >   > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/World/China_detains_35_Pak_nationals/articleshow/3385671.cms >   >   > > var RN = new String (Math.random()); > var RNS = RN.substring (2,11); > b2 = ' '; > if (doweshowbellyad==1) > bellyad.innerHTML = b2; > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get up-to-date on the latest movies, hottest stars to hit the screens. And don't miss the juicy gossip. Only on MSN Entertainment Check it out! From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 21:16:36 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 15:46:36 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] The 'secular' Freedom Movement of Kashmir In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808180652o9c675a3nfbf5789a566bf0c@mail.gmail.com> References: <25301.73407.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808180652o9c675a3nfbf5789a566bf0c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Brazen expression of intolerance can by no means be described as religious. LA ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:22:02 +0530> From: mail at shivamvij.com> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com> CC: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The 'secular' Freedom Movement of Kashmir> > Dear Kshmendra,> > The opposite of secular is not 'communal'. The opposite of secular is> religious.> > best> shivam> > On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 7:19 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote:> > > Excerpts from the News Report in Daily Excelsior of 17th Aug 2008> > (dedicated weblink available only after archiving):> >> > - Geelani said that the Kashmiris had launched a movement of 'Azadi> > Bara-e-Islam' (freedom for Islam)> >> > - streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan and Islamic> > slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla", "Jeevay Jeevay> > Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the familiar "Ham> > kya chahte: Azadi".> >> > Kshmendra> >> > FULL NEWS REPORT BELOW> >> > Geelani asks pro-India leaders to resign or face 'social boycott'> >> > *At massive rally in Pampore, Hurriyat chief calls it 'freedom for Islam'> >> > From Ahmed Ali Fayyaz> >> > SRINAGAR, Aug 16: With the authorities losing control of the situation fast> > and a fresh phase of turbulence attaining all the trappings of a religious> > separatist movement, heads of both factions of the separatist Hurriyat> > Conference, Syed Ali Shah Geelani and Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, have asked> > Kashmir's pro-India politicians to immediately resign or else face 'social> > boycott'. Geelani has called this avatar of the separatist movement as> > "freedom for Islam" and warned Jammu & Kashmir Police to immediately "stop> > your shameful atrocities on the (Kashmiri) nation or face the social> > boycott".> >> > While addressing a massive condolence meeting over the death of People's> > League chairman Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others in different incidents> > of firing earlier this week, at Pampore today, Geelani said that the> > Kashmiris had launched a movement of 'Azadi Bara-e-Islam' (freedom for> > Islam), which, according to him, would be carried to its logical conclusion.> > He said that today's mammoth rally would bring it home to all and sundry> > that the Kashmiris' "freedom struggle" would continue unfazed inspite of> > "economic blockade and all other impediments".> >> > While local cable television channels reported that six lakh people> > participated in today's rally and the official figures vacillated between> > thirty and fifty thousand, independent watchers believe that over one Lakh> > Kashmiris, drawn from different parts of the Valley, participated in the> > remembrance meeting and listened to the senior separatist leaders.> > With a contrast to the dominance of pro-freedom slogans and flags in the> > last 15 years, streams of participants today shouted maximum of pro-Pakistan> > and Islamic slogans like "Pakistan se rishta kya, la illaha illalla",> > "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan", "Yehan kya chalega: Nizaam-e-Mustafa" besides the> > familiar "Ham kya chahte: Azadi".> >> > While there were no flags of groups like Yasin Malik's JKLF and Sajjad Gani> > Lone's People's Conference, which are dominated by red, white and blue> > colours, men in the rally today carried green colour flags emblazoned with> > "Allah-o-Akbar" (God is Great). Many of the participants also traveled to> > Pampore with black flags atop their vehicles, signifying mourning over the> > death of Sheikh Abdul Aziz and over 20 others killed in different incidents> > of firing in the last few days.> >> > Director General of Police, Kuldeep Khoda, had announced overnight that> > Police or armed forces would not obstruct the rally if it passed off> > peacefully. His statement came hours after a green signal from another> > senior Police official who even said on local television channels that> > Sheikh Abdul Aziz's "sacrifice" would augur well for restoration of peace in> > the State.> >> > In his fiery speech, a visibly emboldened Geelani asked all leaders of the> > pro-India parties in J&K, including Members of Parliament, Ministers and> > others holding any positions in the Government, to immediately resign.> > "We'll be otherwise forced to call for social boycott against them", Geelani> > said. He also shot a warning to J&K Police to "stop your shameful atrocities> > on the Kashmiri nation, or else face social boycott". Mirwaiz too advised> > the mainstream politicians to quit and join the "freedom struggle". He too> > said that the pro-India leaders would have to face "social boycott" if they> > failed to respond to the call. "There are unimaginable consequences for them> > ahead and that day is not far away", Mirwaiz warned.> >> > Geelani advised his audiences against attacking armed forces "so that they> > don't get an excuse to open fire". While taking an oral oath from the> > audiences, Geelani asserted that only a peaceful agitation would lead in the> > "desired direction". He claimed that intelligence agencies had cultivated as> > many as 44,000 agents, whose task, according to him, was to "sabotage our> > freedom movement and change its course with chaos and confusion". He said> > that "these paid agents" had a many times in the past succeeded in "changing> > the course of our freedom struggle in favour of India".> >> > "This time around, however, it will be brought home to India that it has no> > room in Kashmir", Geelani said and described Pakistan as the "benefactor of> > the Kashmiri nation". He asked the Kashmiris to pursue the "one-point agenda> > of freedom for Islam". He, nevertheless, sought to assert that the> > Kashmiris' war was strictly against the Government of India and her policies> > towards Kashmir and not against the people of the country.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Mirwaiz reiterated his fresh set of demands and asked New Delhi to withdraw> > armed forces from J&K, revoke Armed Forces Special Powers Act, release all> > political detenues from the State and throw Srinagar-Muzaffarabad Road open> > for "free trade and travel". In a significant development, Mirwaiz, who was> > otherwise perceived to be lukewarm to Geelani's call of election boycott> > until yesterday, emphasized on "total boycott" to any elections to be held> > by India in Jammu & Kashmir. Speaking little about SASB land controversy and> > "economic blockade of Kashmiris", Mirwaiz asserted that the day of winning> > freedom from India was not far away.> >> > On this occasion, JKLF chairman, Yasin Malik, too advised the Kashmiris> > against taking any step that could weaken "our freedom movement". He said> > that "sacrifices laid by Sheikh Aziz and others would not go waste as nobody> > would be allowed to exploit the same for vested interest". He said that the> > Kashmiris had invested their life and assets in the "freedom struggle" and> > it was now "time to harvest".> >> > Sheikh Aziz's s seniormost colleague in Peoples League, Shabir Ahmed Shah,> > stressed on the need of also opening Mughal Road which, he said, would join> > the people of Rajouri and Poonch districts of Jammu with Kashmir valley. He> > asked the people not to attack any mediaperson and expressed his shock over> > the fact that a number of newspersons and camera crews had been attacked by> > unruly crowds in the last few days.> >> > Shah implored his audiences to respond to the call of Hurriyat Coordination> > Committee and make all of its programmes a big success. Sheikh's longtime> > colleague, Nayeem Khan, and a number of other separatist leaders were also> > present. Mirwaiz disclosed that Hurriyat would hold an important meeting on> > Sunday to chalk out "further course of action" and asked his supporters to> > similarly gather for Hurriyat's "UN Chalo" programme on Monday next.> >> > While militants have significantly silenced their guns since last> > fortnight, thousands of people in the rallies, leading to Pampore today,> > chose to maintain peace inspite of shouting hardcore pro-Pakistan slogans.> > They raised the pitch of their "Jeevay Jeevay Pakistan" when cavalcades of a> > senior CRPF officer and a Brigadier passed by but did not resort to stone> > pelting. Armed escorts observed restraint and wended their way towards a> > military formation.> >> > Army's and State Government's helicopters maintained surveillance over the> > rally and captured its movement in video cameras, occasionally flying very> > low. Sources said that two senior officials of the state government were> > among those who watched the rally's passage for several hours and reported> > it to Governor. Small groups of youth, carrying Islamic and black flags on> > their motorcycles and vehicles and shouting pro-Pakistan slogans, made> > repeated rounds in the so-called safe zones in Srinagar as if to establish> > that it was a liberated town. Police and CRPF watched them mutely for the> > day.> >> > In minutes of the separatist leaders' threats to mainstream politicians,> > hundreds of people launched an attack on the guarded house of the prominent> > counter-insurgent, Ghulam Mohammad Lone alias Papa Kishtwari, who has been> > in jail after contesting and losing several elections, at Pampore and razed> > it to rubble brick-by-brick. They also set a condemned vehicle on the> > premises on fire. Eyewitnesses said that an armed platoon of J&K Police,> > which had been guarding Kishtwari's house since 1995, cleared out and took> > refuge in the Police Station.> >> > Before the separatists' rally returned, an old time colleague of Mirwaiz> > Umar, namely Mohammad Yaqoob Vakil, reportedly announced his resignation in> > Mehbooba Mufti's People's Democratic Party (PDP). Reports said that he was> > returning to the Hurriyat. Earlier this year, PDP had celebrated Vakil's> > entry as "a remarkable achievement" for the party. After the current phase> > of the separatist movement has crippled the J&K Police, a number of> > mainstream political activists, as also the families of Police and civil> > officials, known for strengthening the Indian system in Kashmir, have> > reportedly migrated to safer places.> >> >> > _________________________________________> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> > Critiques & Collaborations> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with> > subscribe in the subject header.> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list> > List archive: > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/> _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Chose your Life Partner? Join MSN Matrimony FREE http://www.shaadi.com/msn/matrimony.php From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 21:38:06 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 16:08:06 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Tariq Ali on Musharraf's Exit In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Let us hope that the 'democrats' actually prove to be better. One cannot but recall the cries of "1000 cuts on india.." ; talibanisation of Afghanistan as well as founding of gun culture /terrorism in Kashmir by the earlier 'democrats'. It is unfortunate that innocent Pakistanis are now falling prey to the very menace of terrorism that was created to harm others. LA-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 07:28:08 +0600> From: shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com> To: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: [Reader-list] Tariq Ali on Musharraf's Exit> > Musharraf will be gone in days> > The Pakistani president is likely to quit soon. But don't expect> democracy to rush in: the military's habits die hard> > Tariq Ali> > Guardian> > Thursday August 14 2008> > http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/aug/14/pakistan.usa> > > > There is never a dull moment in Pakistan. As the country moved from a> moth-eaten dictatorship to a moth-eaten democracy the celebrations> were muted. Many citizens wondered whether the change represented a> forward movement.> > > > Five months later, the moral climate has deteriorated still further.> All the ideals embraced by the hopeful youth and the poor of the> country – political morality, legality, civic virtue, food subsidies,> freedom and equality of opportunity – once again lie at their feet,> broken and scattered. The widower Bhutto and his men are extremely> unpopular. The worm-eaten tongues of chameleon politicians and> resurrected civil servants are on daily display. Removing Musharraf,> who is even more unpopular, might win the politicians badly-needed> popular support, but not for long.> > > > As the country celebrated its 61st birthday today, its official> president, ex-General Pervez Musharraf, was not allowed to take the> salute at the official parade marking the event, while state> television discussed plans to impeach him. Within a few days at most,> Musharraf will resign and leave the country. Pakistan's venal> politicians decided to move against him after the army chief, Ashfaq> Kayani, let it be known that there would be no military action to> defend his former boss.> > > > Washington followed suit. In Kayani they have a professional and loyal> military leader, who they imagine will do their bidding. Earlier John> Negroponte had wanted to retain Musharraf as long as Bush was in> office, but they decided to let him go. Anne Patterson, the US> ambassador, and a few British diplomats working under her, tried to> negotiate a deal on behalf of Musharraf, but the politicians were no> longer prepared to play ball. They insisted that he must leave the> country. Sanctuaries in Manhattan, Texas and the Turkish island of> Büyükada are being actively considered. The general would prefer a> large estate in Pakistan, preferably near a golf course, but security> considerations alone would make that unfeasible. There were three> attempts on his life when he was in power and protecting him after he> goes would require an expensive security presence. Had Musharraf> departed peacefully when his constitutional term expired in November> 2007 he would have won some respect. Instead he imposed a state of> emergency and sacked the chief justice of the supreme court who was> hearing a petition challenging Musharraf's position.> > > > Now he is going in disgrace, abandoned by most of his cronies who> accumulated land and money during his term and are now moving towards> the new powerbrokers. Amidst the hullabaloo there was one hugely> diverting moment involving pots and kettles. Two days ago, Asif> Zardari, the caretaker-leader of the People's party who runs the> government and is the second richest man in the country (from funds he> accrued when his late wife was prime minister) accused Musharraf of> corruption and siphoning US funds to private bank accounts.> > > > Musharraf's departure will highlight the problems that confront the> country, which is in the grip of a food and power crisis that is> creating severe problems in every city. Inflation is out of control.> The price of gas (used for cooking in many homes) has risen by 30%.> Wheat, the staple diet of most people, has seen a 20% price hike since> November 2007 and while the UN's Food and Agriculture Organisation> admits that the world's food stocks are at record lows there is an> additional problem in Pakistan.> > > > Too much wheat is being smuggled into Afghanistan to serve the needs> of the Nato armies. The poor are the worst hit, but middle-class> families are also affected and according to a June 2008 survey, 86% of> Pakistanis find it increasingly difficult to afford flour on a daily> basis, for which they blame their own new government.> > > > Other problems persist. The politicians remain divided on the> restoration of the judges sacked by Musharraf. The chief justice,> Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry, is the most respected person in the> country. Zardari is reluctant to see him back at the head of the> supreme court. A possible compromise might be to offer him the> presidency. It would certainly unite the country for a short time. And> there is the army. Last month, the country's powerless prime minister,> Yousuf Gilani, went on a state visit to the US. On July 29 he was> questioned by Richard Haass, president of Council on Foreign> Relations:> > > > Haass: Let me ask the question a different way, then – (laughter) –> beyond President Musharraf, which is whether you think now in the army> there is a broader acceptance of a more limited role for the army. Do> you think now the coming generation of army officers accepts the> notion that their proper role is in the barracks rather than in> politics?> > > > Gilani: Certainly, yes. Because of the February 18 election of this> year, we have a mandate to the moderate forces, to the democratic> forces in Pakistan. And the moderate forces and the democratic forces,> they have formed the government. And therefore the people have voted> against dictatorship and for democracy, and therefore, in future even> the present of – the chief of the army staff is highly professional> and is fully supporting the democracy.> > > > This is pure gibberish and convinces nobody. Over the last 50 years> the US has worked mainly with the Pakistan army. This has been its> preferred instrument. Nothing has changed. The question being asked> now is how long it will be before the military is back at the helm.> > > > Tariq Ali's latest book, The Duel: Pakistan on the Flight Path of> American Power will be published in September by Simon and Schuster> _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Searching for the best deals on travel? Visit MSN Travel. http://msn.coxandkings.co.in/cnk/cnk.do From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 21 23:03:40 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:03:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Secessionist leaders exchange blows (The Curse of Lakshmi) In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808202057m7e3f7551m8571b9044c413f80@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808202057m7e3f7551m8571b9044c413f80@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808211033r70eebfddg29126e498ec06de2@mail.gmail.com> Aazadi by blows...!!! On 8/21/08, rashneek kher wrote: > > SRINGAR: A meeting of secessionist groups, called to discuss the future of > what has been characterised as the largest Islamist mobilisation since > 1990, > dissolved into chaos after members of rival factions exchanged insults and > blows. > > Leaders of the Ali Shah Geelani-led Tehreek-i-Hurriyat and Srinagar cleric > Mirwaiz Umar Farooq's All Parties Hurriyat Conference (APHC) charged each > other with engaging in actions damaging the course of the ongoing movement, > provoking their supporters to engage in scuffles. > > Sources present at the meeting said APHC leader G.M. Hubbi was physically > attacked by his Tehreek-i-Hurriyat counterpart Masrat Alam, and several > important leaders, including Mr. Geelani and the APHC-affiliated Shabbir > Shah, left the meeting in disgust. > > Both groups had said earlier that they would organise a joint protest at > Srinagar's Idgah on Friday, where the future course of the agitation was to > be made public. > > It is now unclear if the two groups will be able to announce a shared > programme of agitation, and, indeed, if their fragile alliance will survive > Wednesday's clashes. > > Kashmir's Mufti-e-Azam (chief cleric), had earlier denounced Mr. Geelani's > call for all Srinagar residents to offer Friday prayers only at the Idgah, > saying it was repugnant to Islamic practice. > Simmering tensions > > Tensions between the secessionist leaders have been building up since > Monday when Mr. Geelani asked tens of thousands of people who assembled at > a > protest rally to endorse him as the leader of the secessionist movement. > > Mr. Geelani also made clear his belief that the movement was for the cause > of Islam, and Jammu and Kashmir's incorporation in to Pakistan—assertions > that incensed rival secessionist leaders such as the Jammu and Kashmir > Liberation Front's Yasin Malik. > > Mr. Geelani later apologised for any offence his remarks—but did not > withdraw his claim to be the principal leader of the movement. > > Within the APHC, too, tensions have been high ever since Mirwaiz Umar > Farooq > agreed to unite with the Tehreek-i-Hurriyat in June. > > The Mirwaiz and Mr. Geelani agreed to join hands just as protests against > the grant of land-use rights to the Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board was > picking > up. Both leaders agreed to a three-point formula for joint action, in a > declaration that appeared to meet Mr. Geelani's long-standing demand that > the APHC not engage in direct talks with the Government of India. > > Senior APHC leaders like Bilal Gani Lone and Abdul Gani Bhat were highly > critical of the unification plan, complaining that they were not consulted. > > From the outset, Mr. Geelani defined the agenda of the alliance, relegating > the APHC to the role of junior partner. Even the alliance's first joint > rally, a June 20 gathering held to protest against the sale of liquor, > gambling and drug abuse, was led by Mr. Geelani. > > Mr. Geelani also alarmed centrists in the APHC by characterising their > joint > movement as a struggle for the defence of Islam, rather than a political > movement. > "Religious aggression" > > For example, at the June 20 rally, Mr. Geelani decried the grant of > land-use rights to the Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board as part of India's > "cultural and religious aggression." He said India wished to force > Kashmiris > to "backtrack from the gift of Islam given to us by Mir Syed Ali Hamdani > 650 > years ago." > > Mr. Geelani also claimed that "universities and educational institutions > are > being used as platforms for spreading Shaivism, Kashmiriyat and degraded > Sufism. Vice Chancellors of these universities are trained by intelligence > agencies to percolate imperial and lethal occupational designs." > http://www.hindu.com/2008/08/21/stories/2008082160491200.htm > Best Regards > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Thu Aug 21 23:27:24 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 17:57:24 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Remembering Kashmir's Bombay Beauties shop In-Reply-To: <177051.71166.qm@web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <177051.71166.qm@web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Reconciliation in Kashmir is all right but the very opposite about Jammu....??.. where we found shelter when hounded out of our homes. The very Raghunath temple suffered repeated terror attacks. And what was the reaction- every time the blood stained marble floor was washed with plain water & daily routine resumed. Kashmiri pan Islamists have been visiting Jammu & spewing venom. There was never ever even any vocal retaliation in the past two decades. Mass movement in Jammu isn't just about 100 acres of uninhabitable land only. It is a response to intolerance & to the continued denial of due right that framed that inspiring picture where a sea of Jammuites majority of them Muslim gujjars lead by a patka wearing Sikh boy with a tricolour in his hand ,are seen crossing Tawi to join the protests in the town. Under the normal circumstances one who was rendered refugee in his own country is expected to share at least the sentiment prevailing in Jammu today. And it is just propaganda that the so called 'good work' done in some 20 years (.. suggesting the good work began when our intended ethnic cleansing was being strategised..)is wasted.Put your hand on your heart & you will get the answer- it has always been a facade & no peace. Regards LA ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 04:24:48 -0700> From: rahulpandita at yahoo.com> To: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: [Reader-list] Remembering Kashmir's Bombay Beauties shop> > In the modern-day Hastinapur, a few men sit these days, all of them carrying loaded dice in the pockets of their Khadi kurtas. They drink tea, perhaps nibble at digestive biscuits and, read out a few sentences in front of the television cameras. And then they go. > > In the lexicon of the Raisina hills, this is known as an all-party meeting. The dice never comes out of their pockets. And yet, the stakes are pronounced. The line between Kauravas and Pandavas has never been so blurred. > > There has been firing in Srinagar near what used to be my home. It happened on the road that leads to the Chrar-e-Sharif shrine. As kids, when we grabbed our share of history from inspid textbooks, we would call this road the Grand Trunk road. > > On this road also flourished the Bombay Beauties cosmetics shop. > > No matter what time you went to the shop, you could get to hear the best of Mohammed Rafi’s songs. The shop’s owner was a young man, Latif Lone. His two major occupations were: listen to Rafi sahab and delicately push colourful bangles into the wrists of shy girls. On Fridays and on the last day of July, the shop would be closed. Friday was for prayers and, on July 31, Mohammed Rafi had bid his goodbye to the world. We used to joke that even in his prayers Latif would be silently reciting Rafi’s songs. > > Latif bhaijaan, as we kids called him, was my cousin Ravi’s best friend. He would come to meet Ravi almost every day – Ravi’s house was next to ours. If he was in the bus and a lady from our family boarded it, Latif would make sure that she got a seat. > > In winters, when we had to spend a major portion of day indoors, the dull programmes on the Doordarshan would almost put us to sleep. Instead, we tuned our T.V. antennas to Pakistan and watched many interesting serials. In a month like December, however, the weather would play spoilsport, uprooting the antenna. In times like these, Latif Lone would be in demand. > > I still remember him appearing at Ravi’s gate, wearing Pheran over his faded blue jeans. He would climb atop the roof in a matter of few seconds while my mother prayed below for his safety. He would hold the antenna in his hands, look towards his right and then left, as if offering namaz, and then set the antenna in proper direction. Latif Lone was my hero. > > In 1988, I saw very little of Latif Lone. Ravi was pursuing a Ph.D at the Kashmir University, which kept him very busy. I would ask him about Latif and he just shrugged his shoulders. > > On July 31, 1988, on Rafi’s eighth death anniversary, two bombs exploded in Srinagar. A few days later I saw Latif Lone. His beard had grown thicker and with three other young men, he was collecting donations for the local mosque. At the provision store, on a small transistor, Rafi’s voice reverberated in the warm summer air. I looked at Latif. For the first time I saw that his lips were not moving along with Rafi’s song. > > In less than two years after that incident, we had turned into refugees, like thousands of other Kashmiri Hindu families. Leaving a house of 22 rooms, we took shelter in a 10 by 10 feet room in Jammu, which would be our home for many months. It was here in June 1990, on a particularly humid morning, that I read the headlines of a local English daily: Dreaded militant Latif Lone shot dead. For two days, afterwards, our hearth would remain cold. Mother refused to cook anything. She lay in one corner, crying silently. > > Life moved on like a silent movie. We gradually picked up the pieces of our lives. Ravi got married and became a father. In 1997, while going back, after summer vacations, to his school in Udamphur’s Gool area, where he worked as a lecturer, he was dragged out of the bus and shot dead along with his two other Hindu colleagues. My mother could not bear that shock. She suffered a stroke and gradually lost her voice and the ability to move. > > I kept on going to the valley from Delhi, where I am based now, kissing the Kashmiri soil, like Yasser Arafat, every time I landed at the Srinagar airport. In Delhi, I am always torn apart in a million pieces. In Kashmir, while breathing my own air, I become one. In twenty years we have shifted so many houses. But no dwelling has ever become my home. > > Despite being an affected party, I was willing to give peace a chance. I guess that is what reading too much of Majaz's poetry does to you. Every time I went to Srinagar, I would tell my friends that the time had come that we begin asking ourselves questions. It didn’t make sense any longer to blame Jagmohan or Pakistan. The time had come to sit and openly discuss, amongst young Kashmiris, what happened in Kashmir in 1989-90 – like South Africa had done a few years ago (by setting up the Truth and Reconciliation Commission). > > Before this could happen, the few men mentioned in the beginning, took a totally unnecessary call – they transferred land to the Amarnath Shrine Board. The truth is, as the senior police officer Aashiq Bukhari told me in Srinagar, hundreds of acres of land right from Pahalgam onwards has always been at the pilgrims’ disposal. “If this house of mine is at your disposal – you are free to use the bed, lay on the sofa, use the bathroom, cook food in the kitchen, play in the garden any time you like, then why should you press that this house be transferred in your name?” he explained. > > “I tell you, all our good work of twenty years has gone down the drain in one stroke,” lamented another police officer. > > The truth also is that, in 1996, outside the historical Raghunath temple in Jammu, a cup of tea was sold for fifty rupees to the Amarnath yatris who were stranded due to bad weather, by the same people who are now coming out on streets and chanting: Bam Bam Bole. > > In Srinagar, meanwhile, there is no space again for Rafi. It it is back to pro-Pakistan slogans. As the Line of Control has shifted to create a chasm between Srinagar and Jammu, the Dhritrashtras in New Delhi just kept silent, their one hand resting on another. In Kashmir’s Mahabharata, it’s the Shakunis who are having a field day. > > > Rahul Pandita > www.sanitysucks.blogspot.com > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com> _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Searching for the best deals on travel? Visit MSN Travel. http://msn.coxandkings.co.in/cnk/cnk.do From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 22 01:29:12 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 01:29:12 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games In-Reply-To: <297249.97265.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <297249.97265.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <17795EFB-489F-4C1A-AB80-5ABE63060C8A@sarai.net> Dear Kshemendra, Thank you for your contribution to the debate on China on the Reader List. While all of us watch the spectacle being manufactured with regard to the Olympics, the fact that this list should be paying some attention to what goes on in China is welcome, and I hope your contributions will spur us all on to shedding a little bit of the 'Indo-Centrism' and even the 'Kashmir-Centrism' that this list is sometimes beseiged by at times, both with and without reason. Let us recognize, for instance, that the spectacle of the Olympics itself is produced through a massive machine that rests on the oppression and invisiblization of the poor and angry people of China. We should have no doubts about the fact that this is the crudest and most violent form of propganda available for a repressive state. I have no doubt at all about the fact that China is one of the most repressive states in the world. But Chinese society, like the social terrain of any country, is not co-terminus with the state, or with those who lead the state. I recall, that a few months ago, when the repression in Tibet was in focus, this list did actually respond, and Sonia Jabbar, I and some other people did actually have a fairly extensive discussion on repression in China. And even today, China is riven with protest and dissidence, that is suppressed by the ruling Chinese Communist Party and generally overlooked by the global Media, which is mesmerised by what it chooses to see of China. I had even posted some information about the activities of dissidents within China, who were supporting the cause of those vilified as 'Tibetan Separatists' by the leadership of the Chinese Communist Party. In this I see a parallel to the way in which the global press nowadays handles India. But this list has not shied away from attending to what has happened and continues to happen in China. I do agree with you that it should attend more, and with greater care, not just to China, but to repression in Pakitan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Burma, Israel, Egypt, Saudi Arabia.We have had reports and postings from Bangladesh and Pakistan, (from Shambhu Rahmat and from Yasir) and the repression in Baluchistan, (including the assasination of Bugti) has actually figured on the discussion in this list. But of course, there should be more. Much more. And we should not have to be discussiing repression alone, we can also be discussing issues to do with aesthetics, contemporary urban spaces, the environment, sexuality, technology, philosophy and a whole gamut of issues that do not necessarily begin and end with Kashmir and India. And of course, we must discuss Kashmir, India and the adventures of the word 'Azaadi' In fact, even if you look at the early history of this list, it has actually looked at China, and condemned the climate of repression that persists there. See for example - https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2001-April/000039.html For a post that argues against Internet censorship in China, and this post is from April 2001, barely within a month of the founding of this list. As someone who cut some of their public teeth by being present at a thinly attended demonstration against the massacre at Tienanmen Square in 1989 on the road to the Chinese embassy as a young student, I have seldom required reasons You say, > There have not been any significant or extensively advertised > adverse reactions out of India either. Not from GOI, not from the > Muslims of India, not from "that class" who are quick and ever > willing to support the separatists in Indian Kashmir and who is so > very well represented and articulate in SARAI. These bunches (from > India) are for that matter most times also mute about how Pakistan > treats it's Muslims and "seekers of freedom from Pakistan". I am afraid I have to differ from you on this. Since, I am one of those who probably gets counted as being from "that class" who are quick and willing to denounce the Indian state's actions in Kashmir, let me state categorically, that I think that the Pakistani state has an absolutely shameful record when it comes to dealing with minorities (be they non-muslims, Shi'a, or Ahmediays). I do not for a moment condone the way in which the Pakistani state has actively carried out genocidial policies in erstwhile East Pakistan, Balochistan, has colluded with repression in Sind, and indeed in the Northern Territories and in that ironic euphemism known as 'Azad Kashmir'. My crtiicism of the Indian state's policies does not make me oblivious to the fact that Paksitan has been under brutal military dictatorships, and I find it sad, that commentators in India should even express an ersatz nostalgia already at the departure of Pervez Musharraf, who, like Zia Ul Haq, Ayub Khan and Yahya Khan represented what I find most reprehensible about military dictatorship. Let me, in conclusion, also point out to you that another of the current pet hates of many 'patriots' within this country, Arundhati Roy, has publicly denounced the repression within China and imperialist policies of the Chinese state vis a vis Tibet, including in fora that have taken place in Hong Kong, (now a part of China) at meetings of human rights and labour activists. I can vouch for this as I have met witnesses who were present at these meetings, and can quote the text by her that was read out after a recent visit by her to China. I know that you are not and have not singled her out, but I say this because often, I see her name being dragged into debates without an informed understanding of her postions, and for me this is an example of exactly what goes wrong with these pseudo-debates. (Which are not debates, but exercises in unilateral calumny) The fact that the mainstream Indian press does not report these facts about Roy's publicly stated positions is a signal of its own Indo- Centrism, but that does not make them less true. When those who expostulate from media pulpits launch their broadsides against someone like Roy, they do so, usually without taking into account the fact that her interest is not in condemning India per se, but in condemning oppression wherever it occurs, be it in Iraq, Turkey (she has spoken out in Turkey,against the genocide of Christian Armenians, by Muslim Turks, so you can hardly fault her for being soft on 'Muslims' and 'Muslim' countries, and this at least has been published in an mainstream indian news magazine, though no one seems to have noticed) the United States or China. I too, like you, wish there were many more people who would do the same, and with as much forthrightness and condour. Once again, I thank you for bringing up these questions for debate on this list, but, assure you that "the class" you single out for criticism in your far more posting is a far more complex entity that what a one dimensional understanding of it would have you believe. I hope that you will recognize this and not be as prepared as you have been in this instance to jump to hasty, and if I may suggest, unwarranted conclusions. regards Shuddha > On 21-Aug-08, at 7:28 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Dear Lalit > > As long as Pakistan finds it crucial to have excellent relations > with China, there is little likelihood of the Xinjiang (Sinkiang) > separatist movement posing any heightened threat to China. > > Of course there will be incidents like the killing of 16 Chinese > Chinese Police personnel a few days before the start of the Beijing > Olympics for which the Xinjiang separatists were blamed. But the > usual thrust provided to Islamic Separatist Movements out of > Pakistan will be minimal unless it suits Pakistan to act otherwise. > > China has acted very ruthlessly a number of times against the > Xinjiang separatists. This has included demolition of settlements > (residential and business) and also Mosques. > > What has been interesting is that such actions of China against the > Muslims and Mosques has never brought forth angry condemnation from > Pakistan. Not ever from the Govt of Pakistan and rarely from the > Muslims of Pakistan. > > There have not been any significant or extensively advertised > adverse reactions out of India either. Not from GOI, not from the > Muslims of India, not from "that class" who are quick and ever > willing to support the separatists in Indian Kashmir and who is so > very well represented and articulate in SARAI. These bunches (from > India) are for that matter most times also mute about how Pakistan > treats it's Muslims and "seekers of freedom from Pakistan". > > Xinjiang continues to be a Muslim Majority region of China. They > are predominantly of Uyghur ethnicity. Slim majority though. At > least now. > > "Demographic changes and balances" has been much in the news in the > past weeks (Amarnath- Hindus-Kashmir- India). Apparently the Han > (Non-Muslim) Chinese were about 6% of the population of Xinjiang in > 1949. Recent enumerations put them at over 40%. And, to quote "This > figure does not include military personnel or their families, or > the many unregistered migrant workers." How is that for > "demographic change"? > > Kshmendra > > > > > --- On Thu, 8/21/08, Lalit Ambardar wrote: > > From: Lalit Ambardar > Subject: RE: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for > planning attack on Games > To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com, "sarai list" > Date: Thursday, August 21, 2008, 6:10 PM > > > > > #yiv1698088668 .hmmessage P > { > margin:0px;padding:0px;} > #yiv1698088668 { > FONT-SIZE:10pt;FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;} > > It will be interesting to see how pan Islamists manage to > penetrate China. After Kashmir is it Xinjiang on the radar now? It > is hoped China would succeed where India failed. > LA > > > > > > > >> Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 02:44:58 -0700 >> From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com >> To: reader-list at sarai.net >> Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning >> attack on Games >> >> China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games >> >> >> ISLAMABAD: Thirty-five Pakistan nationals on a visit to China for >> the Olympics have been detained on suspicion of planning to attack >> the Games proceedings, a media report said on Wednesday. >> >> The Chinese government has sought the details of the 35 suspects >> from Pakistan in a letter that claims that they had arrived in >> China to attack proceedings at the ongoing Games, Daily Times >> reported. >> >> The paper said Colonel Anjum Sheikh Saeed of the Foreign Security >> Department wrote to the Interior Ministry on August 18 asking the >> authorities concerned to collect details of those detained. >> >> It said the Chinese government has not released the names of those >> held, but has given the names and passport numbers of 13 others. >> >> In Beijing, an official spokesperson declined to confirm the >> report saying he did not have information on the issue. >> >> "I don't have information yet (on this issue.) But I will check >> for you," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson, Qin Gang told >> reporters when asked to confirm the Pakistani media report. >> >> In the past, Beijing has demanded Islamabad crack down on >> separatists from its restive Xinjiang region, who are getting >> "trained" in Pakistani terror camps. >> >> http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/World/ >> China_detains_35_Pak_nationals/articleshow/3385671.cms >> >> >> >> var RN = new String (Math.random()); >> var RNS = RN.substring (2,11); >> b2 = ' '; >> if (doweshowbellyad==1) >> bellyad.innerHTML = b2; >> >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > Get up-to-date on the latest movies, hottest stars to hit the > screens. And don't miss the juicy gossip. Only on MSN Entertainment > Check it out! > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 22 02:21:05 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 02:21:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] China detains 35 Pak nationals for planning attack on Games In-Reply-To: <17795EFB-489F-4C1A-AB80-5ABE63060C8A@sarai.net> References: <297249.97265.qm@web57206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <17795EFB-489F-4C1A-AB80-5ABE63060C8A@sarai.net> Message-ID: <125B9C03-B62C-49B8-961E-7AA7886C9B7B@sarai.net> Dear All, There was an incomplete sentence in my last posting. The complete sentence is, As someone who cut some of their public teeth by being present at a thinly attended demonstration against the massacre at Tienanmen Square in 1989 on the road to the Chinese embassy in Chankyapuri in Delhi as a young student, I have seldom required reasons to shy away from thinking or talking about how the Chinese state deals with its subjects and citizens. regards. Shuddha On 22-Aug-08, at 1:29 AM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > As someone who cut some of their public teeth by being > present at a thinly attended demonstration against the massacre at > Tienanmen Square in 1989 on the road to the Chinese embassy as a > young student, I have seldom required reasons Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From rashneek at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 10:10:54 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 10:10:54 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hurriyat leader was murdered, not killed by police-TOI Message-ID: <13df7c120808212140o428a5cd6yf501ae7ab7bb0a6b@mail.gmail.com> NEW DELHI: Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz, whose shooting during the "LoC march" organized by Kashmir separatists on August 11 gave an explosive turn to the agitation, was not killed by a police or army bullet. In a shocking revelation, national security adviser M K Narayanan told the Union Cabinet on Thursday that it was not at all clear who had fired the fatal bullet at Aziz, a former Al Jehad leader who was part of the march on the Srinagar-Muzzaffarabad highway. The NSA also pointed out that there were many rivalries at work in the Kashmir Valley. Narayanan was responding to a question by Union steel minister Ramvilas Paswan, who pointed out that it was rather unusual for a leader to be killed in police action. Typically, leaders in such situations are surrounded by workers and never directly exposed in an incident of the sort that took place as the marchers approached Uri. Also, at the first signs of tough action, the leaders were whisked away with some help of the local cop always mindful of their stature. Narayanan said that investigations have established that the bullets which felled the separatist leader were not fired by security forces. NSA disclosure points to Pak hand in unrest The disturbing disclosure ties in with the suspicion that Pakistan-backed separatists have been stoking passion to put their agenda back on centrestage. Importantly, Pakistan-backed elements have organised assassinations and then blame these on India to further their interests, killings of Mirwaiz Omar Farooq's father and Abdul Ghani Lone being the two cases in point. Also, Hurriyat leaders remain bitterly divided, with all the unity efforts coming unstuck after temporary truces. There are no clear accounts of the situation prevailing during the move to transport trucks carrying fruits across the LoC but the death of Aziz and other civilians became a rallying point for separatists and lead anti-India groups abroad to condemn Indian "state repression." The separatists seized on the Amarnath land-for-pilgrims plan as an emotive issue to fire up sentiments over "demographic" change by way of "Hindu" settlements in the Valley, the march was aimed to stir up the Valley to slogans like "apni mandi, Rawalpindi." Aziz's death only helped stir opinion in the Valley, proving to be a catalyst which turned an agitation against an "economic blockade" of the Valley into a full-throated cry for "azadi." -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 13:05:23 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 13:05:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hurriyat leader was murdered, not killed by police-TOI In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808212140o428a5cd6yf501ae7ab7bb0a6b@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808212140o428a5cd6yf501ae7ab7bb0a6b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808220035n5e979c49hfbdb997400e3ffe0@mail.gmail.com> Rashneek, The Aran Dhati Roy Fan Club on Sarai; won't buy this theory sadly. They just love bashing security forces; even if while acting blind. God Bless them... Aditya On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 10:10 AM, rashneek kher wrote: > NEW DELHI: Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz, whose shooting during the > "LoC > march" organized by Kashmir separatists on August 11 gave an explosive turn > to the agitation, was not killed by a police or army bullet. > > In a shocking revelation, national security adviser M K Narayanan told the > Union Cabinet on Thursday that it was not at all clear who had fired the > fatal bullet at Aziz, a former Al Jehad leader who was part of the march on > the Srinagar-Muzzaffarabad highway. > > The NSA also pointed out that there were many rivalries at work in the > Kashmir Valley. > > Narayanan was responding to a question by Union steel minister Ramvilas > Paswan, who pointed out that it was rather unusual for a leader to be > killed > in police action. Typically, leaders in such situations are surrounded by > workers and never directly exposed in an incident of the sort that took > place as the marchers approached Uri. > > Also, at the first signs of tough action, the leaders were whisked away > with > some help of the local cop always mindful of their stature. > > Narayanan said that investigations have established that the bullets which > felled the separatist leader were not fired by security forces. > > NSA disclosure points to Pak hand in unrest > > The disturbing disclosure ties in with the suspicion that Pakistan-backed > separatists have been stoking passion to put their agenda back on > centrestage. > > Importantly, Pakistan-backed elements have organised assassinations and > then > blame these on India to further their interests, killings of Mirwaiz Omar > Farooq's father and Abdul Ghani Lone being the two cases in point. > > Also, Hurriyat leaders remain bitterly divided, with all the unity efforts > coming unstuck after temporary truces. > > There are no clear accounts of the situation prevailing during the move to > transport trucks carrying fruits across the LoC but the death of Aziz and > other civilians became a rallying point for separatists and lead anti-India > groups abroad to condemn Indian "state repression." > The separatists seized on the Amarnath land-for-pilgrims plan as an > emotive > issue to fire up sentiments over "demographic" change by way of "Hindu" > settlements in the Valley, the march was aimed to stir up the Valley to > slogans like "apni mandi, Rawalpindi." > > Aziz's death only helped stir opinion in the Valley, proving to be a > catalyst which turned an agitation against an "economic blockade" of the > Valley into a full-throated cry for "azadi." > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From rashneek at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 13:36:00 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 13:36:00 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hurriyat leader was murdered, not killed by police-TOI In-Reply-To: <6353c690808220035n5e979c49hfbdb997400e3ffe0@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808212140o428a5cd6yf501ae7ab7bb0a6b@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808220035n5e979c49hfbdb997400e3ffe0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808220106v7ed09439h9619a5014de92480@mail.gmail.com> Aditya, Whosoever killed him will remain a matter of speculation but it presses home the point that if you live by the sword you will die by it. Examples of Mirwaiz Farooq,Dr.Guru and "cry baby" Sajjad's dad have already been consumed the very Frankestein's they lived with. In Kashmiri there is a saying"Aenem Soy Vavem soy lajem soy panesey" Rashneek On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 1:05 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Rashneek, > > The Aran Dhati Roy Fan Club on Sarai; won't buy this theory sadly. They > just > love bashing security forces; even if while acting blind. > > God Bless them... > > Aditya > > > > > On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 10:10 AM, rashneek kher > wrote: > > > NEW DELHI: Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz, whose shooting during the > > "LoC > > march" organized by Kashmir separatists on August 11 gave an explosive > turn > > to the agitation, was not killed by a police or army bullet. > > > > In a shocking revelation, national security adviser M K Narayanan told > the > > Union Cabinet on Thursday that it was not at all clear who had fired the > > fatal bullet at Aziz, a former Al Jehad leader who was part of the march > on > > the Srinagar-Muzzaffarabad highway. > > > > The NSA also pointed out that there were many rivalries at work in the > > Kashmir Valley. > > > > Narayanan was responding to a question by Union steel minister Ramvilas > > Paswan, who pointed out that it was rather unusual for a leader to be > > killed > > in police action. Typically, leaders in such situations are surrounded by > > workers and never directly exposed in an incident of the sort that took > > place as the marchers approached Uri. > > > > Also, at the first signs of tough action, the leaders were whisked away > > with > > some help of the local cop always mindful of their stature. > > > > Narayanan said that investigations have established that the bullets > which > > felled the separatist leader were not fired by security forces. > > > > NSA disclosure points to Pak hand in unrest > > > > The disturbing disclosure ties in with the suspicion that Pakistan-backed > > separatists have been stoking passion to put their agenda back on > > centrestage. > > > > Importantly, Pakistan-backed elements have organised assassinations and > > then > > blame these on India to further their interests, killings of Mirwaiz Omar > > Farooq's father and Abdul Ghani Lone being the two cases in point. > > > > Also, Hurriyat leaders remain bitterly divided, with all the unity > efforts > > coming unstuck after temporary truces. > > > > There are no clear accounts of the situation prevailing during the move > to > > transport trucks carrying fruits across the LoC but the death of Aziz and > > other civilians became a rallying point for separatists and lead > anti-India > > groups abroad to condemn Indian "state repression." > > The separatists seized on the Amarnath land-for-pilgrims plan as an > > emotive > > issue to fire up sentiments over "demographic" change by way of "Hindu" > > settlements in the Valley, the march was aimed to stir up the Valley to > > slogans like "apni mandi, Rawalpindi." > > > > Aziz's death only helped stir opinion in the Valley, proving to be a > > catalyst which turned an agitation against an "economic blockade" of the > > Valley into a full-throated cry for "azadi." > > > > -- > > Rashneek Kher > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From anivar.aravind at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 14:28:37 2008 From: anivar.aravind at gmail.com (Anivar Aravind) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 14:28:37 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Bangaloreans Say No to Software Patents Message-ID: <35f96d470808220158w723ffe43s425d536dbe6018e5@mail.gmail.com> Bangaloreans Say No to Software Patents http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Say_No_To_Software_Patents/PressRelease On 23rd August, 2008, a group of Bangaloreans is to gather outside Town Hall to protest software Patents under the aegis of Free Software Users Group, Bangalore at 5.30 PM. This protest comes in the wake of attempts by the Indian Patent Office to push software patents, despite the same having been rejected categorically by the Parliament of India in March, 2005. At that time a particular lobby had tried pushing Patents for Software through a Presidential Ordinance. This having fallen through, software patents are now being pushed through the back door in the form of a manual ostensibly to help people file patents. While the draft in circulation glosses over the fact that software is not patentable in law, it instructs people that software patents can be filed in combination with hardware. The manual is trying to permit something that is explicitly forbidden by the Indian Patent Act, 2005. Further, it is amusing the way the manual tries to get around the legal obstacle posed by the Patents Act, by positing a category of "software in combination with hardware" . It leads one to wonder whether software can exist independent of hardware In this regard, former Supreme Court Judge, Justice V. R. Krishna Iyer has commented that "neither the controller nor the central government has authority or sanction of law to publish a manual of the kind put on the website". The Free Software Users Group also would like to point out that software is a form of knowledge and software patents would amount to propertisation of knowledge and would be detrimental to the pace at which software is growing. Software patents further kill innovation and competition and turn software publishing into the privilege of a few. As software today pervades all walks of life, any dent in the pace of its growth would have a cascading effect on the economy in general. The Free Software Users Group also would like to point out to the lobby that is trying to push for software patents through the back door that; * Software is already protected under copyright law, and no additional protection either to individuals or industries is required * Hardware innovations are already patentable under the regular innovations; therefore all innovators are already covered * The current ICT revolution happened with science and technology under public domain and it is important for the growth of software that this remains so. For Free Software users Group Bangalore 1. Anivar Aravind +92 9449009908 /080 23435606 2. Praveen A +91 9986348565 3. Renuka Prasad +91 9901945674 4. Vikram vincent +91 9448810822 PDF Version: http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Bangaloreans_Say_No_to_Software_Patents.pdf Event Posters http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Say_No_To_Software_Patents#Candle_Light_Vigil Digg it http://digg.com/tech_news/Bangaloreans_Say_No_to_Software_Patents Vote for it : http://www.fsdaily.com/Community/Bangaloreans_Say_No_to_Software_Patents -- Anivar From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 15:17:52 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:17:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby police nakka," a police officer said. Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior official said. A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic blockade left at least 22 people dead. Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She said college students' protests prove that even youth are against "imperialism". From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 15:21:34 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:21:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: 21 August 'Partition: The Long Shadow' Closing Cultural Programme In-Reply-To: References: <20081408.121315.24097176@zubaanbooks.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220251h7ba65776yddc1b4edd978cca8@mail.gmail.com> Morning after the wonderful show yesterday, the Partition dastaan continues... shivam Pak prisoners want to stay back in India Maneesh Chhibber Posted online: Friday, August 22, 2008 at 2337 hrs Print Email http://www.indianexpress.com/story/351742.html New Delhi, August 21: Fearing persecution in their country, over 60 Pakistani citizens, who are lodged in the Capital's Tihar Jail for entering India without proper documents, have sought asylum from the Indian Government. Judges must return today or I go: SharifSrinagar-Muzaffarabad bus service resumesProtest against militants as PoK fears for peaceDon't Pak a punch Ad Links Ngo Jobs Ngo Jobs in Bangalore Teach English Abroad These prisoners, which include 17 women and nine children, belong to the Gowhar Shahi sect and most of them have been in prison for the past three to four years. On Wednesday, interacting with the members of the Indo-Pak Joint Judicial Committee (JJC) — an eight-member committee comprising retired Supreme Court and High Court judges of India and Pakistan which is working towards a humane treatment and expeditious release of prisoners belonging to the two countries — the prisoners said they did not wish to return to Pakistan. It has been learnt that some of these prisoners told the Pakistani members of the JJC that they would prefer to remain confined to an Indian jail rather than go back to Pakistan where, they claimed, they face the possibility of being killed or tortured at the hands of mullahs or the Government. They also informed the JJC that their petition for grant of asylum is pending in the court here. The four members of the JJC from Pakistan—Nasir Aslam Zahid, Fazl Karim, Mian Mohamed Ajmal and Chaudhary Abdul Qadeer—are currently touring jails in India to locate Pakistani citizens, hoping to get those languishing in jails despite their prison terms having ended. Four retired Judges of India — former Delhi High Court Judge MA Khan, former Punjab and Haryana High Court Judges Amarbir Singh Gill and Amarjeet Chaudhary and former Patna High Court Judge Nagendra Rai — are also touring the jails with their Pakistani counterparts. Said Justice Amarbir Singh Gill (retd), "None of us was prepared for this. The Pakistani members of the JJC tried to allay the fears of the prisoners who are refusing to go back. But they said, they are ready to spend rest of their life in jails here." The JJC on Thursday visited the Jaipur Central Jail and found three prisoners who are still in jail despite their terms being over. Officials of the Ministry of Home Affairs told the JJC that since most prisoners have no documents to establish their identity, authorities in Pakistan refused to accept them. On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 3:41 PM, mahmood farooqui wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: zubaanbooks.com > Date: 2008/8/14 > Subject: 21 August 'Partition: The Long Shadow' Closing Cultural Programme > To: "mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com" > > > *The Heinrich Boll Foundation, India Habitat Centre, Max Mueller Bhavan and > Zubaan are pleased to invite you to an evening of song, poetry and > performance--the closing event of the year-long series, Partition: The Long > Shadow > > Thursday, 21 August 2008 > 7.00 pm > Stein Auditorium > India Habitat Centre From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 15:26:40 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:26:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808210534x6ee71b26w8dc8cc8df592a956@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808210320y7ef8e655n3ec0a52dbc1f1ace@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808210534x6ee71b26w8dc8cc8df592a956@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220256l4ea88712w88e8af50fa6ecfa0@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shuddha, The point you miss is Swami Vivekananda was not a KP and hence didn't have the KP samskars. What would he know? Besides, that was 1898, and these names were in vogue then, because KPs weren't demanding a separate homeland as part of India's answer to 'separatists'... best shivam On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 6:04 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > Dear Shuddha and Pawan, > > Thankfully,I have read these accounts of Swami Vivekenanda's travels in > Kashmir.As a child I have spent a lot of time at the Nagdanadi ashram(run by > Ramakrishna Mission) near Deviangan(or Brari Angan),the abode of > Tripurasundari in Devasar Pargana of Kashmir.It is today a desecrated Nag > and a broken temple.I have such fond memories of the place that the mere > mention brings that place alive (in my thoughts)and tears in my eyes because > I may never see it again. > Shudda is right when he mentions that Islamabad and Takht-i-Sulaiman have > been mentioned.Those were names in vogue at that point in time.They were > ofcourse not the original names but these places were connoted as Islamabad > and Takht-i-Sulaiman respectively from their original names of Anantnag and > Gopadari Hill.As per Tarikh-i-Hassan Gopadari became the Shankaracharya Hill > after the great Philosopher is believed to have visited the place. > Shyam Koul is now an old man and he has made an attempt to fill the chasm > which should have come from elsewhere too.I would not mince words when I say > that as a larger community among the Kashmiris it becomes almost obligatory > on the Kashmiri Muslims to have raised a voice of reason and extend a hand > to the Pandit community.Where is the Shyam Koul among them,I yearn to see > him. > Or maybe Shams Faqir is truly dead. > > Rashneek Kher > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 5:40 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > >> Dear Pawan, >> >> Thank you for your mail. Actually my usage of the name "Islamabad' >> was influenced by my memory of having read the text that I had >> mentioned (Nivedita's journal of the travel with Vivekananda through >> kashmir). You might find it interesting to know that even >> Vivekananda, for whom, you no doubt have some regard, and Sister >> Nivedita, refer to the town that you call as Anantnag, as Islamabad. >> And in fact, yes, when they mention the temple located at the site >> known as Shankaracharya hill, in Srinagar, they refer to it as 'Takht >> - e - Suleiman'. When a place gets more than one name attached to it, >> I see no problem by calling it by either one, or both names. A place- >> name, is ultimately a convention used to identify and mark a site on >> a particular topography. If that marking is facilitated by more than >> one name, I see no reason to insist on one over the other. >> >> Fortunately, or unfortunately, the Internet is a true Pandora's Box, >> and those who persist in their curiosities are rewarded. After I >> wrote the last mail, just to be certain that my memory was not >> playing tricks on me, I ran a google search with the words >> Vivekananda, Nivedita and Amarnath, and at the same time, a friendly >> soul sent me a mail with a link, having read my earlier mail, and I >> came across the entire text of the book, online, at - >> >> http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Complete_Works_of_Swami_Vivekananda/ >> Volume_9/Excerpts_from_Sister_Nivedita%27s_Book >> >> Since this page is very neatly and systematically chapterized, all >> you need to do is to follow the links to the chapters. >> >> here are, a few excerpts from the Vivekananda/Nivedita account, that >> I had mentioned earlier, Here is the entry dated, June 29, a fragment >> from Chapter VII, titled, 'Life at Srinagar' >> >> "JUNE 29. >> >> Another day we went off quietly by ourselves and visited the Takt-i- >> Suleiman, a little temple very massively built on the summit of a >> small mountain two or three thousand feet high. It was peaceful and >> beautiful, and the famous Floating Gardens could be seen below us for >> miles around. The Takt-i-Suleiman was one of the great illustrations >> of the Swami's argument when he would take up the subject of the >> Hindu love of nature as shown in the choice of sites for temples and >> architectural monuments. As he had declared, in London, that the >> saints lived on the hill-tops in order to enjoy the scenery, so now >> he pointed out — citing one example after another — that our Indian >> people always consecrated places of peculiar beauty and importance by >> making there their altars of worship. And there was no denying that >> the little Takt, crowning the hill that dominated the whole valley, >> was a case in point." >> >> >> Here is another for August 8, in chapter X, titled, interstingly, >> 'The Shrine at Amarnath' >> >> >> AUGUST 8. >> >> "We started for Islamabad next day, and on Monday morning as we sat >> at breakfast, we were towed safely into Srinagar." >> >> There are several other examples, in the pages of this account, where >> the words Islamabad are used, to mean the site that is marked as >> Anantnag today. I can cite them if it would satisfy your curiosity >> >> Clearly, in the year 1898, when this journey was undertaken, people >> like Swami Vivekananda and Sister Nivedita saw no reason to use names >> other than 'Takht-e-Suliman' and 'Islamabad'. >> >> Would you like to add their names to the list of 'intellectuals' you >> are compiling, who should be calumnized, together with Arundhati Roy? >> >> >> >> best >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> On 21-Aug-08, at 3:50 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: >> >> > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> > >> > wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Vivekananda and Nivedita (and their other >> > companions) >> > travel through Srinagar, Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) >> > through the >> > traditional along the Lidder river route to Amarnath, >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >> > >> > It is interesting to note that Shuddha prefers to call Anantnaag as >> > "Islamabad". Next Shankracharya temple would be called "Takht E >> > Suleiman" >> > and Hari Parbat as "Koh E Maraan"......and scores of lanes which >> > have been >> > named as Abu-Bakar lane , Abu -Hamza Lane and Al - Fateh lane etc. >> > >> > This is quite possible with "intellectuals" who fall in the same >> > category as >> > Aran Dhat Teri Ki Roy types. >> > >> > Regards >> > >> > Pawan Durani >> > >> > >> > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> > wrote: >> > >> >> Dear Rashneek, >> >> >> >> thank your for this post, it does come as a breath of fresh air, and >> >> points to the histories of cultural accommodation, exchange and >> >> reciprocity that have been as much a part of the history of Kashmir >> >> as has been division and intolerance. In this case, I think that all >> >> of us have a lot to learn from the histories of exchange in Kashmir, >> >> and I am grateful that Rashneek has given us these examples by >> >> forwarding this text by Shyam Kaul. And I mean this sincerely. >> >> >> >> I especially agree with the sentiments at the end, that a piece of >> >> land, especially one that has been a part of the commons, should not >> >> be seen as 'property' by any person, persons, communities or >> >> entities. It is not, as Shyam Kaul says, 'yours' or 'mine'. This >> >> means that the hundred acres in question (that lie at the core of the >> >> Amarnath controversy) should neither belong to the SASB, and nor >> >> should any pilgrims and shepherds be prevented from camping and >> >> accessing the commons as they have done for centuries. In fact all >> >> hospitality (commensurate with the sensible ecological custordianship >> >> of the space) should be made available to pilgrims and wanderers who >> >> pass through this space. We need to note, that this year (in the just >> >> concluded pilgrimage season) has seen a record number of pilgrims >> >> travel to Amarnath, despite the current situation in Jammu & Kashmir, >> >> who have all been cared for and assisted by local inhabitants, as has >> >> always been the case. >> >> >> >> Had this attitude prevailed, on all sides, then, many precious lives >> >> would not have been lost. >> >> >> >> Perhaps this can help us think about the ways in which it can become >> >> possible (and not only in Kashmir) to approach the higher reachers of >> >> pastures, foothills and slopes of mountains, forests, grazing routes, >> >> passes and meadows that constitute a kind of commons as being >> >> territories that do not 'belong' to anyone, neither to Shrine Boards, >> >> nor to Government Departments, nor to Forest Departments (which are >> >> often responsible for their wholesale destruction) nor as Private >> >> Property, but as territories that are accessible to all to inhabit, >> >> use, and pass through, sensibly, respectfully and sustainably, and >> >> over whom the custody of the traditional users, inhabitants and >> >> custodians of these lands, (shepherds, nomads, transhumant >> >> communities and forest dwellers, many of whom predate the artificial >> >> constructs and boundaries of nation states) is to be seen as >> >> paramount. In the Amarnath case, this would mean restoring the >> >> primacy of the Gujjar communities that have traditionally acted as >> >> guides and hosts of the pilgrims to Amarnath in all affairs to do >> >> with the space and ecosphere around and on the way to the shrine. >> >> This would also be in keeping with the spirit of accommodation, >> >> exchange and partnership that have been pointed to in the text by >> >> Shyam Kaul. Anything else, including the handing over of the land to >> >> the modern institution of a State mandated Shrine Board with a >> >> governor at its head would be a betrayal of the tradition of Kashmir. >> >> (This also applies to the intrusion of the state in Waqf boards and >> >> in the management of trusteeship of traditional Islamic and Buddhist >> >> institutions). >> >> >> >> Incidentally, there is an excellent and very evocatively written >> >> account of Vivekananda's pilgrimage to Amarnath, in the late >> >> nineteenth century, by his travelling companion, his Irish woman >> >> friend Margaret Noble who took the name Sister Nivedita. Vivekananda >> >> and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, >> >> Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along >> >> the Lidder river route to Amarnath, En route, they are assisted and >> >> kept company by Muslim Gujjar guides, naked Sadhus and boatmen, with >> >> whom they share their rations, stories and long walks . Vivekananda >> >> plays with a young Muslim girl child and worships her as an >> >> incarnation of Uma. They have long conversations on comparative >> >> religion, the merits and demerits of celibacy and conjugal love, the >> >> meaning of 'Azaadi' in America, (they even have an impromptu July the >> >> 4th tea party with an improvised American flag) and architecture, and >> >> Vivekananda is caught between criticising the tradition that demands >> >> ardurous pilgrimages of the faithful and revelling in the sheer joy >> >> of the journey. There is no Shree Amarnath Shrine Board at this time, >> >> and I think someone as adventurous and open-spirited as Vivekananda >> >> would have blanched at the idea of taking the assistance of the state >> >> in the undertaking of what for him was a personal spiritual quest. As >> >> someone who has deeply enjoyed walking in the Himalays, in Kashmir >> >> and elsewhere, myself, I was very drawn to this account, and what it >> >> can mean, especially in times such as these. >> >> >> >> Should anyone want to read it, it is (if I recall correctly) in >> >> Volume 9 of the Collected Works of Swami Vivekananda, in a journal of >> >> a journey through Kashmir kept by Sister Nivedita. >> >> >> >> regards, >> >> >> >> >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 21-Aug-08, at 12:13 PM, rashneek kher wrote: >> >> >> >>> From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the >> >>> reputation of >> >>> being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in >> >>> the matter >> >>> of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only >> >>> tolerant, >> >>> but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their >> >>> adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate >> >>> them. >> >>> This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again >> >>> during the >> >>> early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early >> >>> Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave >> >>> alone any >> >>> violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the >> >>> valley, was >> >>> supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and >> >>> peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris >> >>> have >> >>> always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to >> >>> blows, nor >> >>> would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. >> >>> Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and >> >>> ministers >> >>> building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was >> >>> how Hindu >> >>> temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and >> >>> flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. >> >>> When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any >> >>> violent >> >>> opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This >> >>> is a >> >>> characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in >> >>> Kashmir. >> >>> Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its >> >>> agonising >> >>> spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we >> >>> find >> >>> Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a >> >>> composite >> >>> culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. >> >>> This >> >>> still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even >> >>> though the >> >>> turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy >> >>> turvey. >> >>> History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim >> >>> rule from >> >>> early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that >> >>> managed >> >>> and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for >> >>> as long >> >>> as two hundred years. >> >>> Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, >> >>> and most >> >>> of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were >> >>> Hindus. The >> >>> chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, >> >>> that has >> >>> a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records >> >>> that the >> >>> Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his >> >>> expeditions, once >> >>> fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested >> >>> that a huge >> >>> brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted >> >>> with >> >>> disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created >> >>> images >> >>> to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri >> >>> think of >> >>> melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he >> >>> remarked >> >>> indignantly. >> >>> Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his >> >>> Muslim >> >>> subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at >> >>> Allaudinpura in Srinagar. >> >>> Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably >> >>> acknowledged as the >> >>> real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his >> >>> contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the >> >>> Sultan >> >>> took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, >> >>> ruthlessly >> >>> persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two >> >>> temples near >> >>> Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah >> >>> made >> >>> strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat >> >>> on holy >> >>> Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, >> >>> destroyed >> >>> during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several >> >>> springs, >> >>> sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till >> >>> this day. >> >>> Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of >> >>> Amarnath >> >>> while he was the Sultan. >> >>> In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud >> >>> Shah's noble >> >>> deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and >> >>> granting >> >>> rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer >> >>> to the >> >>> turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and >> >>> killings have >> >>> turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the >> >>> prolonged >> >>> tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than >> >>> a large >> >>> cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath >> >>> Shrine >> >>> Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a >> >>> year, for the >> >>> convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a >> >>> section of >> >>> Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread >> >>> and violent >> >>> agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled >> >>> the issue >> >>> right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The >> >>> revocation, in >> >>> turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, >> >>> creating a >> >>> deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. >> >>> Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the >> >>> most >> >>> ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though >> >>> very >> >>> briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh >> >>> century >> >>> AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have >> >>> already been a >> >>> pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the >> >>> stages of >> >>> pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the >> >>> Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. >> >>> Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when >> >>> Aurangzeb >> >>> was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar >> >>> Khan >> >>> (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to >> >>> convert >> >>> to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the >> >>> leadership of >> >>> one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh >> >>> Guru, >> >>> Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought >> >>> the Guru's >> >>> intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru >> >>> obliged but >> >>> this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the >> >>> conversion of >> >>> the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the >> >>> leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. >> >>> During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless >> >>> persecution of >> >>> Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically >> >>> ceased >> >>> with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also >> >>> because the >> >>> Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted >> >>> for 67 >> >>> years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra >> >>> for forty >> >>> years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was >> >>> only >> >>> during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in >> >>> 1847, when >> >>> a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the >> >>> mountain >> >>> meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" >> >>> it. From >> >>> then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without >> >>> hinderance. >> >>> With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous >> >>> commander, >> >>> Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in >> >>> Srinagar arguing >> >>> that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a >> >>> mosque >> >>> there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, >> >>> sought >> >>> the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who >> >>> moved >> >>> promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for >> >>> the >> >>> posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, >> >>> Gulam >> >>> Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that >> >>> had >> >>> suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He >> >>> also >> >>> installed a new Lingam in the temple. >> >>> Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It >> >>> is our >> >>> common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively >> >>> associated >> >>> with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to >> >>> it, by >> >>> taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. >> >>> Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping >> >>> with the >> >>> spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its >> >>> leaders would >> >>> come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land >> >>> for >> >>> putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a >> >>> brief >> >>> period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. >> >>> Instead we >> >>> are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue >> >>> connected >> >>> with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high >> >>> up on >> >>> freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the >> >>> mundane world. >> >>> Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal >> >>> words of >> >>> our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us >> >>> of our >> >>> heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. >> >>> Didn't Nund Rishi say: >> >>> We belong to the same parents. >> >>> Then why this difference? >> >>> Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. >> >>> We came to his world like partners. >> >>> We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. >> >>> But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing >> >>> to behave >> >>> like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all >> >>> these >> >>> distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be >> >>> used for >> >>> temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our >> >>> land of >> >>> birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's >> >>> good >> >>> earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been >> >>> ungrudginly made >> >>> possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves >> >>> into an >> >>> intractable muddle. >> >>> >> >>> -- >> >>> Rashneek Kher >> >>> Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy >> >>> http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com >> >>> http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com >> >>> _________________________________________ >> >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> >>> Critiques & Collaborations >> >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> >>> subscribe in the subject header. >> >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> >>> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS >> >> Raqs Media Collective >> >> shuddha at sarai.net >> >> www.sarai.net >> >> www.raqsmediacollective.net >> >> >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> >> Critiques & Collaborations >> >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> >> subscribe in the subject header. >> >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS >> Raqs Media Collective >> shuddha at sarai.net >> www.sarai.net >> www.raqsmediacollective.net >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 15:42:21 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:42:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Was there a blockade? Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220312gc5dcdcfm33c0fe11786c641b@mail.gmail.com> It seems the blockade strategy of the BJP-RSS-SASS was givenm up after it backfired. At the mouth of tunnel to tumult No blockade but long lock SANKARSHAN THAKUR http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080813/jsp/frontpage/story_9686774.jsp Banihal, Aug. 12: There is a lock on the burning Valley, two miles long. We swept swiftly up the road from Jammu this morning, past Patnitop's scenic pine resorts and the narrow gauge cut by the turbulent Chenab, but found a swirl of concertina wiring thrown across this high gateway into Kashmir. Layers of security cordons stood blocking the Jawahar Tunnel, the longest manmade road duct in Asia and the country's only land-link to the trouble-ridden Valley — police, the CRPF and then jawans of the Indian Army. "Closed", a gum-booted, gun-wielding sentry said, "until further orders." But why? "Orders," he bluntly repeated, unyielding, "Can't permit you to pass, not even at your own risk." It had begun to rain and the sentry's little shortwave set was crackling in the slanted wind, spewing grim news from its oil-barrel perch. Processions pouring out in torrents across the Valley. Defiance of curfew. Violent engagement with security forces. Firing. Retaliation. Deaths and injuries. More retaliation. A chain of cause and effect ruinously whirring. Bandipora, Ganderbal, Lafjan, Baramulla, Kangan, Rainawari, Haripora, Patang, Badgam, Watlar, Wusan, Lal Chowk, even Kishtwar which is located outside the Valley — a swelling directory of datelines fast staining the landscape. "Ab pata chala kuchh kyon nahi jane de rahe?" the sentry asked sardonically as he arranged the concertina spools even more firmly across the mouth of the tunnel. "Haalaat kharab hain janab," (Do you get a little sense now of why we are not allowing you? Things are bad, Sir.") In the little highway hamlet of Banihal down below — the only Muslim majority pocket this side of the Jawahar Tunnel — the Valley's tumult was beginning to echo. A band of men carrying green flags had gathered in the square and were calling out to residents on a megaphone. "Our brothers and sisters across Banihal are in trouble, let us tell them we stand in solidarity, let's tell them we are with them!" The shanty shops of Banihal's one-lane bazaar lay shuttered, its nervous residents looking on from half-ajar windows. But slowly as the call rang out again and again, the band in the town square was joined by trickles from the bylanes and soon became a flaming mob. It was more than a kilometre long and spilled out on both sides of the Jammu-Srinagar highway, a charged column on the march. More green flags began to wave about in the taut air and then roll the shrill slogans of Kashmiri insurrection. "Chalo Muzaffarabad!; hum kya chahte: azaadi; Pakistan zindabad." The elders frantically appealed for calm. "No commotion, please, no violence," one of them cried out. "This is the hour of mourning. We must respect our dead." But youngsters on the fringe of the mob would have none of that. As the procession rolled up the winding road, en route to the mosque, they got more strident, fisting the air in the face of CRPF jawans and policemen. The closer the securitymen pressed the procession, the louder the slogans, the more ardent the green flags. "Pakistan zindabad; hum ko chhordo, Hindustan." The jawans, armed and ready to tear gas the mob at the first sign of trouble, held their fire; the procession held its protest to angered slogans, no more. But for three hours this afternoon, Banihal failed precariously close to the chaos of violence. "Anything could have happened," said a nervous but relieved Haji Abdul Majid Banihali, a local elder who was among the lead cast of this protest. "You can feel it in your veins, can't you, the crowd and the forces are just testing each other? We got away with it today but I can't say the same about tomorrow. There's anger bubbling over what's happening in the Valley." To either side of the protest, traffic lay coiled in the mountains like a dead crocodile's tail. Hundreds of trucks laden with goods on their way to the Valley and Leh beyond it. Wheat, pulses, oil, medicines, other packaged food. Half a dozen carriers packed with bewildered chickens clucking in their cages. Even a busload of Amarnath pilgrims from Maharashtra who had somehow blundered their way up to this impasse. "We don't know what to do now, where to go," said Sudhakar Naik, who arrived with his family of five from Nashik. "We can't go ahead and we are not being allowed to return because there is a curfew all the way down to Jammu. And it is getting cold." Up close to the mouth of Jawahar Tunnel, scores of more trucks lay girded along the bends, lost on the prospects of being able to proceed. All of them loaded with goods, all headed to the Valley, all posting puzzling questions on allegations of an economic blockade. "We have been waiting two days at Banihal," said an irate truck driver from Pathankot, carrying vegetable oils. "There was a disruption on the road for a few days about a fortnight ago but the road has been clear since. Who says trucks are not going? It is only here that the security forces have blocked our way, nobody else did." A little distance away, the sentry, now under an oversized olive parka to shield against the rain, was waving off newer arrivals with his gun. "Khabar nahi suni? Kashmir jal raha hain (Haven't you heard the news? Kashmir is burning.)" Top From rashneek at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 15:42:57 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:42:57 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ah, good old tolerance! by Shyam Kaul In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808220256l4ea88712w88e8af50fa6ecfa0@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808202343v1d6f76fbwf1e00e40f52b5984@mail.gmail.com> <8B956796-6DDD-42DE-87A0-AE939E900D37@sarai.net> <6b79f1a70808210320y7ef8e655n3ec0a52dbc1f1ace@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808210534x6ee71b26w8dc8cc8df592a956@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808220256l4ea88712w88e8af50fa6ecfa0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808220312j445aa0abk9a7925a612a85b53@mail.gmail.com> If there is one guy who needs a brain transplant (even a donkey's will do) is Shivam.Shivam, you seem to suffer from some complex writing dysentry that has no treatment.You but into discussions which could otherwise be meaningful.A week in Kashmir doesnt make you Kalhana. Go learn something before you start blaberring and making yourself look like an idiot everytime you write.Learn to keep quite if you dont know what to write. If you have tried sarcasm or humour here,it is not even pedestrian....read some PG Woodhouse On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 3:26 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Dear Shuddha, > > The point you miss is Swami Vivekananda was not a KP and hence didn't > have the KP samskars. What would he know? Besides, that was 1898, and > these names were in vogue then, because KPs weren't demanding a > separate homeland as part of India's answer to 'separatists'... > > best > shivam > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 6:04 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > > Dear Shuddha and Pawan, > > > > Thankfully,I have read these accounts of Swami Vivekenanda's travels in > > Kashmir.As a child I have spent a lot of time at the Nagdanadi ashram(run > by > > Ramakrishna Mission) near Deviangan(or Brari Angan),the abode of > > Tripurasundari in Devasar Pargana of Kashmir.It is today a desecrated Nag > > and a broken temple.I have such fond memories of the place that the mere > > mention brings that place alive (in my thoughts)and tears in my eyes > because > > I may never see it again. > > Shudda is right when he mentions that Islamabad and Takht-i-Sulaiman have > > been mentioned.Those were names in vogue at that point in time.They were > > ofcourse not the original names but these places were connoted as > Islamabad > > and Takht-i-Sulaiman respectively from their original names of Anantnag > and > > Gopadari Hill.As per Tarikh-i-Hassan Gopadari became the Shankaracharya > Hill > > after the great Philosopher is believed to have visited the place. > > Shyam Koul is now an old man and he has made an attempt to fill the chasm > > which should have come from elsewhere too.I would not mince words when I > say > > that as a larger community among the Kashmiris it becomes almost > obligatory > > on the Kashmiri Muslims to have raised a voice of reason and extend a > hand > > to the Pandit community.Where is the Shyam Koul among them,I yearn to see > > him. > > Or maybe Shams Faqir is truly dead. > > > > Rashneek Kher > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 5:40 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta < > shuddha at sarai.net>wrote: > > > >> Dear Pawan, > >> > >> Thank you for your mail. Actually my usage of the name "Islamabad' > >> was influenced by my memory of having read the text that I had > >> mentioned (Nivedita's journal of the travel with Vivekananda through > >> kashmir). You might find it interesting to know that even > >> Vivekananda, for whom, you no doubt have some regard, and Sister > >> Nivedita, refer to the town that you call as Anantnag, as Islamabad. > >> And in fact, yes, when they mention the temple located at the site > >> known as Shankaracharya hill, in Srinagar, they refer to it as 'Takht > >> - e - Suleiman'. When a place gets more than one name attached to it, > >> I see no problem by calling it by either one, or both names. A place- > >> name, is ultimately a convention used to identify and mark a site on > >> a particular topography. If that marking is facilitated by more than > >> one name, I see no reason to insist on one over the other. > >> > >> Fortunately, or unfortunately, the Internet is a true Pandora's Box, > >> and those who persist in their curiosities are rewarded. After I > >> wrote the last mail, just to be certain that my memory was not > >> playing tricks on me, I ran a google search with the words > >> Vivekananda, Nivedita and Amarnath, and at the same time, a friendly > >> soul sent me a mail with a link, having read my earlier mail, and I > >> came across the entire text of the book, online, at - > >> > >> http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Complete_Works_of_Swami_Vivekananda/ > >> Volume_9/Excerpts_from_Sister_Nivedita%27s_Book > >> > >> Since this page is very neatly and systematically chapterized, all > >> you need to do is to follow the links to the chapters. > >> > >> here are, a few excerpts from the Vivekananda/Nivedita account, that > >> I had mentioned earlier, Here is the entry dated, June 29, a fragment > >> from Chapter VII, titled, 'Life at Srinagar' > >> > >> "JUNE 29. > >> > >> Another day we went off quietly by ourselves and visited the Takt-i- > >> Suleiman, a little temple very massively built on the summit of a > >> small mountain two or three thousand feet high. It was peaceful and > >> beautiful, and the famous Floating Gardens could be seen below us for > >> miles around. The Takt-i-Suleiman was one of the great illustrations > >> of the Swami's argument when he would take up the subject of the > >> Hindu love of nature as shown in the choice of sites for temples and > >> architectural monuments. As he had declared, in London, that the > >> saints lived on the hill-tops in order to enjoy the scenery, so now > >> he pointed out — citing one example after another — that our Indian > >> people always consecrated places of peculiar beauty and importance by > >> making there their altars of worship. And there was no denying that > >> the little Takt, crowning the hill that dominated the whole valley, > >> was a case in point." > >> > >> > >> Here is another for August 8, in chapter X, titled, interstingly, > >> 'The Shrine at Amarnath' > >> > >> > >> AUGUST 8. > >> > >> "We started for Islamabad next day, and on Monday morning as we sat > >> at breakfast, we were towed safely into Srinagar." > >> > >> There are several other examples, in the pages of this account, where > >> the words Islamabad are used, to mean the site that is marked as > >> Anantnag today. I can cite them if it would satisfy your curiosity > >> > >> Clearly, in the year 1898, when this journey was undertaken, people > >> like Swami Vivekananda and Sister Nivedita saw no reason to use names > >> other than 'Takht-e-Suliman' and 'Islamabad'. > >> > >> Would you like to add their names to the list of 'intellectuals' you > >> are compiling, who should be calumnized, together with Arundhati Roy? > >> > >> > >> > >> best > >> > >> Shuddha > >> > >> > >> On 21-Aug-08, at 3:50 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > >> > >> > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > > >> > wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Vivekananda and Nivedita (and their other > >> > companions) > >> > travel through Srinagar, Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) > >> > through the > >> > traditional along the Lidder river route to Amarnath, > >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >> > > >> > > >> > It is interesting to note that Shuddha prefers to call Anantnaag as > >> > "Islamabad". Next Shankracharya temple would be called "Takht E > >> > Suleiman" > >> > and Hari Parbat as "Koh E Maraan"......and scores of lanes which > >> > have been > >> > named as Abu-Bakar lane , Abu -Hamza Lane and Al - Fateh lane etc. > >> > > >> > This is quite possible with "intellectuals" who fall in the same > >> > category as > >> > Aran Dhat Teri Ki Roy types. > >> > > >> > Regards > >> > > >> > Pawan Durani > >> > > >> > > >> > On Thu, Aug 21, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > wrote: > >> > > >> >> Dear Rashneek, > >> >> > >> >> thank your for this post, it does come as a breath of fresh air, and > >> >> points to the histories of cultural accommodation, exchange and > >> >> reciprocity that have been as much a part of the history of Kashmir > >> >> as has been division and intolerance. In this case, I think that all > >> >> of us have a lot to learn from the histories of exchange in Kashmir, > >> >> and I am grateful that Rashneek has given us these examples by > >> >> forwarding this text by Shyam Kaul. And I mean this sincerely. > >> >> > >> >> I especially agree with the sentiments at the end, that a piece of > >> >> land, especially one that has been a part of the commons, should not > >> >> be seen as 'property' by any person, persons, communities or > >> >> entities. It is not, as Shyam Kaul says, 'yours' or 'mine'. This > >> >> means that the hundred acres in question (that lie at the core of the > >> >> Amarnath controversy) should neither belong to the SASB, and nor > >> >> should any pilgrims and shepherds be prevented from camping and > >> >> accessing the commons as they have done for centuries. In fact all > >> >> hospitality (commensurate with the sensible ecological custordianship > >> >> of the space) should be made available to pilgrims and wanderers who > >> >> pass through this space. We need to note, that this year (in the just > >> >> concluded pilgrimage season) has seen a record number of pilgrims > >> >> travel to Amarnath, despite the current situation in Jammu & Kashmir, > >> >> who have all been cared for and assisted by local inhabitants, as has > >> >> always been the case. > >> >> > >> >> Had this attitude prevailed, on all sides, then, many precious lives > >> >> would not have been lost. > >> >> > >> >> Perhaps this can help us think about the ways in which it can become > >> >> possible (and not only in Kashmir) to approach the higher reachers of > >> >> pastures, foothills and slopes of mountains, forests, grazing routes, > >> >> passes and meadows that constitute a kind of commons as being > >> >> territories that do not 'belong' to anyone, neither to Shrine Boards, > >> >> nor to Government Departments, nor to Forest Departments (which are > >> >> often responsible for their wholesale destruction) nor as Private > >> >> Property, but as territories that are accessible to all to inhabit, > >> >> use, and pass through, sensibly, respectfully and sustainably, and > >> >> over whom the custody of the traditional users, inhabitants and > >> >> custodians of these lands, (shepherds, nomads, transhumant > >> >> communities and forest dwellers, many of whom predate the artificial > >> >> constructs and boundaries of nation states) is to be seen as > >> >> paramount. In the Amarnath case, this would mean restoring the > >> >> primacy of the Gujjar communities that have traditionally acted as > >> >> guides and hosts of the pilgrims to Amarnath in all affairs to do > >> >> with the space and ecosphere around and on the way to the shrine. > >> >> This would also be in keeping with the spirit of accommodation, > >> >> exchange and partnership that have been pointed to in the text by > >> >> Shyam Kaul. Anything else, including the handing over of the land to > >> >> the modern institution of a State mandated Shrine Board with a > >> >> governor at its head would be a betrayal of the tradition of Kashmir. > >> >> (This also applies to the intrusion of the state in Waqf boards and > >> >> in the management of trusteeship of traditional Islamic and Buddhist > >> >> institutions). > >> >> > >> >> Incidentally, there is an excellent and very evocatively written > >> >> account of Vivekananda's pilgrimage to Amarnath, in the late > >> >> nineteenth century, by his travelling companion, his Irish woman > >> >> friend Margaret Noble who took the name Sister Nivedita. Vivekananda > >> >> and Nivedita (and their other companions) travel through Srinagar, > >> >> Islamabad (currently called Anantnag) through the traditional along > >> >> the Lidder river route to Amarnath, En route, they are assisted and > >> >> kept company by Muslim Gujjar guides, naked Sadhus and boatmen, with > >> >> whom they share their rations, stories and long walks . Vivekananda > >> >> plays with a young Muslim girl child and worships her as an > >> >> incarnation of Uma. They have long conversations on comparative > >> >> religion, the merits and demerits of celibacy and conjugal love, the > >> >> meaning of 'Azaadi' in America, (they even have an impromptu July the > >> >> 4th tea party with an improvised American flag) and architecture, and > >> >> Vivekananda is caught between criticising the tradition that demands > >> >> ardurous pilgrimages of the faithful and revelling in the sheer joy > >> >> of the journey. There is no Shree Amarnath Shrine Board at this time, > >> >> and I think someone as adventurous and open-spirited as Vivekananda > >> >> would have blanched at the idea of taking the assistance of the state > >> >> in the undertaking of what for him was a personal spiritual quest. As > >> >> someone who has deeply enjoyed walking in the Himalays, in Kashmir > >> >> and elsewhere, myself, I was very drawn to this account, and what it > >> >> can mean, especially in times such as these. > >> >> > >> >> Should anyone want to read it, it is (if I recall correctly) in > >> >> Volume 9 of the Collected Works of Swami Vivekananda, in a journal of > >> >> a journey through Kashmir kept by Sister Nivedita. > >> >> > >> >> regards, > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> Shuddha > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On 21-Aug-08, at 12:13 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > >> >> > >> >>> From ancient times the people of Kashmir have enjoyed the > >> >>> reputation of > >> >>> being liberal, tolerant and open-minded. History tells us that in > >> >>> the matter > >> >>> of religious faith and belief, the ancient Kashmiris were not only > >> >>> tolerant, > >> >>> but also accepted other people's freedom, including that of their > >> >>> adversaries, to hold their religious and other views and propagate > >> >>> them. > >> >>> This trait of ancient Kashmiris manifests itself time and again > >> >>> during the > >> >>> early eras. When, for instance, Naga worship, gave place to early > >> >>> Brahminical faith, there was nothing like an ill-feeling, leave > >> >>> alone any > >> >>> violence. Then again, when Buddhism, which held sway over the > >> >>> valley, was > >> >>> supplanted by Brahminical religion, it happened imperceptibly and > >> >>> peacefully. In all matters, including religious faiths, Kashmiris > >> >>> have > >> >>> always been vociferous debators, but they would never come to > >> >>> blows, nor > >> >>> would ever look for weapons to drive home their point. > >> >>> Throughout, Kashmir's early history we see kings, queens and > >> >>> ministers > >> >>> building houses of worship for the people of other faiths. That was > >> >>> how Hindu > >> >>> temples and Buddhist Viharas mushroomed together in the valley, and > >> >>> flourished for ages, as is still testified by ancient ruins. > >> >>> When Islam entered the valley, it faced no resistance nor any > >> >>> violent > >> >>> opposition from the population here, which was entirely Hindu. This > >> >>> is a > >> >>> characteristic strikingly peculiar to Hinduism, not only here in > >> >>> Kashmir. > >> >>> Inspite of many ups and downs of Kashmir history, and some of its > >> >>> agonising > >> >>> spells, with painful, deadly and persecutory turns and twists, we > >> >>> find > >> >>> Hinduism and Islam interweaving constantly, and producing a > >> >>> composite > >> >>> culture, the like of which one does not come across anywhere else. > >> >>> This > >> >>> still continues to be true, if not wholly but symboilically, even > >> >>> though the > >> >>> turbulent times since 1989-90 have turned the Kashmiri ethos topsy > >> >>> turvey. > >> >>> History also tells us that even after Kashmir came under Muslim > >> >>> rule from > >> >>> early fourteenth century, it was the traditional Brahmin class that > >> >>> managed > >> >>> and ran the administration, with Sanskrit as the court language for > >> >>> as long > >> >>> as two hundred years. > >> >>> Sultan Shihabuddin (1354-73) had a passion for military campaigns, > >> >>> and most > >> >>> of his ministers, commanders and other high officials were > >> >>> Hindus. The > >> >>> chronicler of the day, Jonaraja, relates and interesting anecdote, > >> >>> that has > >> >>> a lesson for leaders and rulers of today also. Jonaraja records > >> >>> that the > >> >>> Sultan, whose treasury would often run empty due to his > >> >>> expeditions, once > >> >>> fell short of money. One of his ministers, Udaya Shri, suggested > >> >>> that a huge > >> >>> brass image of Buddha be melted for the coinage. The Sultan reacted > >> >>> with > >> >>> disgust, telling his minister that the past generations had created > >> >>> images > >> >>> to obtain fame and earn merit. How, he asked, could Udayashri > >> >>> think of > >> >>> melting the image? "How great is the enormity of such a deed?" he > >> >>> remarked > >> >>> indignantly. > >> >>> Of Sultan Qutub-U-Din (1373-89) it is recorded that he and his > >> >>> Muslim > >> >>> subjects used to pay regular visits to the famous Hindu temple at > >> >>> Allaudinpura in Srinagar. > >> >>> Sultan Zainul Abidin Bud Shah (1420-70) is indisputably > >> >>> acknowledged as the > >> >>> real model of religious tolerance and harmony. Jonaraja and his > >> >>> contemporary, Srivara, record, that among the host of measures the > >> >>> Sultan > >> >>> took to alleviate the plight and sufferings of the Hindus, > >> >>> ruthlessly > >> >>> persecuted during the preceding regime, was the building of two > >> >>> temples near > >> >>> Ishbar and grant of rent free lands for their maintenance. Bud Shah > >> >>> made > >> >>> strict rules against cow slaughter and abstained from eating meat > >> >>> on holy > >> >>> Hindu festivals. He ordered the rebuilding of a number of temples, > >> >>> destroyed > >> >>> during the earlier regime. He forbade killing of fish in several > >> >>> springs, > >> >>> sacred for Hindus, a practice which, more or less, continues till > >> >>> this day. > >> >>> Jonaraja records that Bud Shah paid a visit to the "sacred site" of > >> >>> Amarnath > >> >>> while he was the Sultan. > >> >>> In deference to the religious faith of his Hindu subjects, Bud > >> >>> Shah's noble > >> >>> deeds of rebuilding destroyed temples and building new ones, and > >> >>> granting > >> >>> rent free land to them, inevitably and instantly brings one closer > >> >>> to the > >> >>> turbulent scenario today here at home. Agitation, violence and > >> >>> killings have > >> >>> turned our state into a live volcano. The issue at the root of the > >> >>> prolonged > >> >>> tumult, is just a stretch of land, perhaps not larger in area than > >> >>> a large > >> >>> cricket stadium. On paper the land was transferred to Shri Amarnath > >> >>> Shrine > >> >>> Board for putting up temporary structures, for two months in a > >> >>> year, for the > >> >>> convenience of Amarnath pilgrims. The order on paper threw a > >> >>> section of > >> >>> Kashmiri leaders into tantrums of ire, sparking off a widespread > >> >>> and violent > >> >>> agitation, that unnerved the government, which had already bungled > >> >>> the issue > >> >>> right from the beginning, forcing it to revoke the order. The > >> >>> revocation, in > >> >>> turn, led to an upsurge in Jammu, and now again in Kashmir, > >> >>> creating a > >> >>> deadlock that seems to have no way of getting unlocked. > >> >>> Amarnath pilgrimage has an ancient origin, perhaps being one of the > >> >>> most > >> >>> ancient pilgrimage centres in India. We find its mention, though > >> >>> very > >> >>> briefly, in Nilamata Purana, which was composed in sixth or seventh > >> >>> century > >> >>> AD. Evidently the shrine, mentioned as Amaresvara, must have > >> >>> already been a > >> >>> pilgrimage destination long before that. The shrine and the > >> >>> stages of > >> >>> pilgrimage to reach it, have also been elaborately explained in the > >> >>> Mahatmaya literature of 12th and 13th centuries. > >> >>> Amarnath finds mention during the Mughal rule over Kashmir, when > >> >>> Aurangzeb > >> >>> was the emperor in Delhi. One of his subedars in Kashmir, Iftikhar > >> >>> Khan > >> >>> (1671-75) had unleaded tyranny against the Brahmins, asking them to > >> >>> convert > >> >>> to Islam. About 500 Brahmins assembled at Amarnath, under the > >> >>> leadership of > >> >>> one Kirpa Ram Datt of Mattan and decided to approach the ninth Sikh > >> >>> Guru, > >> >>> Guru Teg Bahadur. They travelled to Anandpur in Punjab and sought > >> >>> the Guru's > >> >>> intervention with the emperor to end their sufferings. The Guru > >> >>> obliged but > >> >>> this ultimately led to his martyrdom, and subsequently to the > >> >>> conversion of > >> >>> the Sikh community into a fighting force, renamed Khalsa, under the > >> >>> leadership of his illustrious son, Guru Gobind Singh. > >> >>> During the Afghan rule in Kashmir, characterised by ruthless > >> >>> persecution of > >> >>> Hindus, and sometimes of Shias also, the Amarnath yatra practically > >> >>> ceased > >> >>> with the rulers imposing restrictions on it, and partly also > >> >>> because the > >> >>> Pandits did not want to risk their lives. The Afghan rule lasted > >> >>> for 67 > >> >>> years, till 1819. Out of this period there was no Amarnath yatra > >> >>> for forty > >> >>> years and the mountain track fell in disuse and wast lost. It was > >> >>> only > >> >>> during the early years of Dogra rule over Kashmir, commencing in > >> >>> 1847, when > >> >>> a Malik shepherd of Batakot, while grazing his flock high up in the > >> >>> mountain > >> >>> meadows came upon the holy cave of Amarnath, thus "rediscovering" > >> >>> it. From > >> >>> then onwards the yatra has been going on every year without > >> >>> hinderance. > >> >>> With the advent of Sikh rule over Kashmir in 1919, an overzealous > >> >>> commander, > >> >>> Phula Singh, decided to demolish the Shah Hamadan mosque in > >> >>> Srinagar arguing > >> >>> that a famous temple at the site had been pulled down to build a > >> >>> mosque > >> >>> there. A deputation of Muslims, led by Sayyid Hasan Shah Khanyari, > >> >>> sought > >> >>> the intervention of the influential Pandit noble, Birbal Dhar, who > >> >>> moved > >> >>> promptly to dissuade the commander, and thus saved the mosque for > >> >>> the > >> >>> posterity. It was during the Sikh rule that a benevolent governor, > >> >>> Gulam > >> >>> Mohiuddin, repaired the Shiva temple atop Shankaracharya hill, that > >> >>> had > >> >>> suffered neglect and dilapidation during the earlier regimes. He > >> >>> also > >> >>> installed a new Lingam in the temple. > >> >>> Amarnath is among the most revered shrines of Jammu and Kashmir. It > >> >>> is our > >> >>> common spiritual heritage, as Muslims have not only been actively > >> >>> associated > >> >>> with it for ages, but have been serving as a perfect complement to > >> >>> it, by > >> >>> taking care of most of the needs of the pilgrims. > >> >>> Normally, one would, therefore, have expected that in keeping > >> >>> with the > >> >>> spirit of this ancient legacy, the majority community and its > >> >>> leaders would > >> >>> come forward, on their own to help in providing a stretch of land > >> >>> for > >> >>> putting up a temporary facility centre for the pilgrims, only for a > >> >>> brief > >> >>> period of two months in a year. But alas, it has not happened. > >> >>> Instead we > >> >>> are caught up in agitations, violence and killings on an issue > >> >>> connected > >> >>> with a secluded, harmless religious and spiritual destination, high > >> >>> up on > >> >>> freezing heights, and far away from the din and bustle of the > >> >>> mundane world. > >> >>> Kashmir will never have another Budshah. But we have the immortal > >> >>> words of > >> >>> our great saints, like Lal Ded and Nund Rishi, always reminding us > >> >>> of our > >> >>> heritage of tolerance, peace and brotherhood of man. > >> >>> Didn't Nund Rishi say: > >> >>> We belong to the same parents. > >> >>> Then why this difference? > >> >>> Let Hindus and Muslims (together) workship God alone. > >> >>> We came to his world like partners. > >> >>> We should have shared our joys and sorrows together. > >> >>> But here we are, holding on to our trivial prejudices and refusing > >> >>> to behave > >> >>> like "partners" and "share our joys and sorrows" together. And all > >> >>> these > >> >>> distressing goings-on regarding a stretch of land, sought to be > >> >>> used for > >> >>> temporary facilities for pilgrims, of a heritage shrine of our > >> >>> land of > >> >>> birth. The piece of land is neither yours nor mine. It is of God's > >> >>> good > >> >>> earth and its use for a godly pilgrimage should have been > >> >>> ungrudginly made > >> >>> possible. It was not, and look how we have dragged down ourselves > >> >>> into an > >> >>> intractable muddle. > >> >>> > >> >>> -- > >> >>> Rashneek Kher > >> >>> Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > >> >>> http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > >> >>> http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > >> >>> _________________________________________ > >> >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> >>> Critiques & Collaborations > >> >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> >>> subscribe in the subject header. > >> >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> >>> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> >> > >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS > >> >> Raqs Media Collective > >> >> shuddha at sarai.net > >> >> www.sarai.net > >> >> www.raqsmediacollective.net > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> _________________________________________ > >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> >> > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> > subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS > >> Raqs Media Collective > >> shuddha at sarai.net > >> www.sarai.net > >> www.raqsmediacollective.net > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Rashneek Kher > > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 15:46:40 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:46:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Truck drivers, Hindu, Muslim and Sikh, bear the SASS brunt Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220316r6e8e72aao184db508b58e900d@mail.gmail.com> Jammu stir leads to big fall in truck movement 21 Aug, 2008, 0400 hrs IST, Masood Hussain, ET Bureau http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/Jammu_stir_hits_truck_movement/articleshow/3387128.cms SRINAGAR: A confidential official report has confirmed that there is a fall in the number of trucks to and from the Kashmir Valley. Compared to 2007, the inward and outward movement of loaded trucks from the state fell by 28% in July. In the first 18 days of August, the state bound truck traffic fell by over 49% and outward by over 64%. Tabulated at Lakhinpur, the gateway to J&K, the report suggests that there were many days when there was no movement of any vehicle from either side. "It was a situation when our officials at the gateway had to literally flee in wake of attacks being carried out by the blocking enforcers," a top official told ET from Jammu. The revelation of the report accessed by ET suggests that not a single bus has moved out of Lakhinpur or entered into the state in August while the bus movement from the two sides in 2007 was 11,478. In July only 70 buses could enter the state as compared to 7,661 in July 2007 as only 45 buses could move out against 7,537 last year. "That essentially means whatever movement is happening from J&K is either by rail or by air," the officials said. "There were attacks on two tourist buses and at least in one case the bus with luggage of tourists was set afire." BJP national executive member Nirmal Singh on July 21 advised tourists not to visit the Valley and the appeal came days before civil aviation minister Praful Patel said in Srinagar that air traffic in J&K showed a growth of 30%, higher than Delhi and Mumbai airports. Intermittent blockades started soon after BJP state president Ashok Kahjuria announced it on June 22 as part of the agitation against the Amarnath land transfer cancellation order. It was later executed by the SAYSS after it came into being as a 'non-political outfit'. There were instances of Delhi-bound fruit-laden trucks being stopped and looted in Kathua and Samba. However, movement of cars was not impacted to the extent as bus and loaded trucks. Inward car movement fell from 30,074 in July 2007 to 11,165 in July 2008 as the outward car traffic was 24,787 and 17,087 for the same period, respectively. Cumulative movement till now in August was 44,499 inwards and 38,440 outwards for 2007 and 2008. "If you see the overall comparison of all kind of vehicles — loaded, empty, buses and cars —the fall in July was 49% in J&K bound traffic and 40.72% in outgoing traffic," the official said. "In August there was 42% fall in inward traffic and 47.49% in outgoing traffic." Officials said even though there is lot of security, road continues to be a safe passage. Most of the drivers from Kashmir are not ready to ply on the road despite security because the intermittent attacks do take place. Already Muhammad Lateef Wani, a driver from Pantha Chowk died after being in a coma for many days at AIIMS. The attacks continue even though the highway is supposedly secured by the armed forces. Bashir Ahmad Shalla of Chattergam hamlet near Kanipora is the latest victim who was attacked on Sunday in Kathua by rioters using tridents and petrol bombs. He is currently admitted in a Srinagar hospital. "The movement is taking place but it is not normal movement," a senior police officer said. "Normally in the peak season for Srinagar bound trucks (summer) around 1,000 trucks cross the Jawahar Tunnel for Srinagar and not less than 400 trucks leave Kashmir. It is October in which Jammu bound traffic peaks with over 600 trucks a day." Officials, however, do not admit that fall in traffic was because of the agitation. "We are a consumer society and in wake of strike traders do not order for provisions," an official said. "But, yes, there were days when not a single truck could ply on the road." Offering a comparative study — that the source said should at the best be treated as an estimate because it does not reflect the overall trend — a senior official said there has been a significant fall in taxable imports and exports. "If you compare first 10 days of August this year with that of 2007, you will feel the difference," he said. In 2007, a total 6,820 trucks laden with taxable goods reached Kashmir and in the first 10 days of this month the number is 1,513. The trend is same in exports: 4,216 trucks in 2007 and only 884 this year. Fruit exports did suffer as well: 884 trucks last year and 452 this year in 10 days. "The numbers could be very different if you include non-taxable goods," he said. The state administration, however, is making all efforts to reverse the trend in wake of depleting stock positions in the Valley, Ladakh, Doda and the twin districts of Poonch and Rajouri. Governor N N Vohra is personally monitoring the situation, officials said, adding that the traffic is gradually moving up. "During the last 24 hours, 407 trucks laden with fresh fruit left the Valley for Jammu as 755 loaded trucks with provisions reached Srinagar," a state spokesman said. Early last week, when hospitals in Srinagar faced a situation with several casualties, authorities flew a Hercules load of medicines and surgical equipment after shortages were reported. o o o Truckers bear the brunt of Valley protests Vikram Chowdhary Friday, August 22, 2008, (Jammu) Over the last few weeks, truckers have borne the brunt of the protests both in Jammu and in Srinagar. But despite that, truck drivers of both the regions are braving disruptions on the highway to ensure that supplies are not hampered. Satpreet Singh has returned home after spending two days in hospital. Shaken, Satpreet said that he will never drive his truck to Kashmir. Four days ago, a mob attacked his truck near Anantnag. Satpreet who was transporting apples from Sopore in the Valley to Jammu was badly beaten. He now has 11 stitches on the face. "When we were getting apples, they stopped my truck at many places and pelted stones. But then I had to safely get my truck back, but couldn't avoid past midnight around two," he said. Satpreet isn't the only one. Kashmiri drivers who transport apples to other states face similar ordeal at the hands of protestors in Jammu region. Bilal Ahmed from Srinagar is travelling in a group with a dozen other truckers from Kashmir. Still fresh on his mind is the incident in which a driver from Kashmir was beaten near Samba while another was seriously injured by protesters about a week ago. Though Army is patrolling the highway to keep protesters away over two dozen truckers from Kashmir have been targeted so far. "We get targeted in Jammu and Samba, but it's not just here, this is there in the Valley as well. There also drivers are being targeted, but the problem is for we drivers, drivers from Jammu Punjab and Kashmir are facing the same problems," Bilal said. Truckers from other regions can be identified and become easy targets. So far protesters on both sides have damaged over 100 trucks. The problem points on the highway are Lakhanpur, Kathua, Samba and Udhampur in the Jammu region and Awantipora, Anantnag, Pampore in the Kashmir valley. Though Army has ensured there is no blockade on the highway from Kathua to Srinagar, individual truckers are being targeted. And the transporters have an appeal. "Transport is victim of the both sides which is very unfortunate. On the ground we are in the service of people of both regions getting supplies for both regions," Harminder Singh, a transporter said. Inspite of efforts by the Army and security forces to see that there is a smooth flow of traffic on the highway, surely the disruptions still remain. But truck drivers from Valley and Jammu are braving it all to see that there is no effect on the supplies. o o o Valley's fruit growers threaten hunger strike http://www.ptinews.com/pti%5Cptisite.nsf/0/18ABBC60E10CF113652574AC002BB253?OpenDocument Srinagar, Aug 21 (PTI) Accusing the government of failing to provide security to their trucks plying on Srinagar-Jammu National Highway, fruit growers from the valley today threatened to launch an indefinite hunger strike if the situation does not improve in the next few days. "We have decided to go on an indefinite hunger strike on Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road if the situation arising out of continuous attacks on truckers on the highway does not improve in next few days," Fruit Growers Coordination Committee President Ghulam Rasool Bhat told reporters. Contradicting government's claim that the traffic on the arterial road connecting Kashmir with the rest of the country was plying smoothly despite protests in Jammu over the Amarnath land row, Bhat claimed that a fruit laden truck was burnt three days back by protesters who damaged six other trucks at Samba on Sunday evening. "The truck, which was set afire, belonged to Jammu and was carrying fruits from Valley," he said, adding "claims of administration that the highway has been secured are proving to be a hoax". Sopore Fruit Association president, Bashir Ahmed Beigh said the fruit growers are suffering heavy losses. "We have faced losses worth Rs 500 crore till date. Had Islam not forbidden suicide, we would have ended our lives," he added. Expressing concern over the attacks on truckers, Baramulla Transport company Nazir Ahmad Bhat claimed that window panes of half a dozen fruit laden trucks were damaged by the Hindu activists two days back. PTI o o o Blockade Evidence Makes Way to Hospitals, Graveyards Srinagar, Aug 19, KONS: http://www.kashmirobserver.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=890:blockade-evidence-makes-way-to-hospitals-graveyards&catid=50:localnews&Itemid=81 Evidence of the violent blockade of the Kashmir valley is mounting despite vehement denials by elements in Jammu that they have any part in the embargo or that any such obstruction was in place. The case in point also flies in the face of the state and the central government claims that the Jammu-Srinagar highway had been secured for traffic and was now safe for Kashmiri drivers. Bashir Ahmad Shala of Dangarpora, Naugam, narrowly escaped lynching in Kathua, and is currently being treated in the burns ward of the SMHS Hospital, while another driver who died in the AIIMS because of injuries sustained in a mob attack on the highway near Samba, was laid to rest in his native Pantha Chowk today. He and other Kashmiri drivers had been attacked by rioters in Kathua on Sunday when they where on their way to Delhi with truckloads of fruit. Talking from his hospital bed with severe burn injuries, Shala said that they had first been pulled down from the trucks by the mob and then given a severe battering. Their vehicles were damaged and the consignment of fruit looted by the violent mob, he said. "We somehow managed to flee the clutches of the mob, but another crowd was waiting for us, and it threw a petrol bomb into my truck, which exploded in the driver's cabin," he said. The blast inflicted extensive burn injuries on Shalla, and he fainted. "When I woke up, I found myself in the Kathua hospital, where doctors bandaged me up and referred me to the Jammu hospital," he said. In Jammu, doctors described his condition as critical and asked him to get admitted. But after spending a few hours in the hospital, her was gripped by fears of more attacks by Hindu zealots, and fled the premises, making his way to Banihal, from where he contacted his family. He was taken home by his relatives and admitted to a hospital in Srinagar, he said. From rashneek at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 15:46:39 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:46:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Was there a blockade? In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808220312gc5dcdcfm33c0fe11786c641b@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220312gc5dcdcfm33c0fe11786c641b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13df7c120808220316k6f70ffc7s581bfe9c58f1fe42@mail.gmail.com> Read this Shivam..and I will keep sending more...Arun is incidentally based in Jammu as Head of Bureau for HT...and in future dont send stale news... ALL POLITICS,NO BLOCKADE by Arun Joshi The mainstream and separatist Kashmiri leaders may be crying themselves hoarse over the issue of 'economic blockade', but the ground reality is totally different. While helicopters are hovering over the Pathankote-Jammu-Srinagar highway, the army has effectively sealed all the roads leading to this lifeline of supplies to Jammu & Kashmir. Meanwhile, hundreds of trucks laden with sheep, poultry, medicines and foodgrains are running smoothly toward their destinations, uninterrupted by protesters. "It is our single-minded focus to keep the highway through and ensure supplies to Kashmir," Chief Secretary S.S. Kapur said. After some incidents of violence in the Jammu region — as also in Anantnag in the Valley — there were protests and blockade for a few hours in Punjab. These incidents — not entirely targeted against Kashmiris — were played up in the Valley as "economic blockade" even after the Shri Amarnath Yatra Sangarash Samiti leading the Jammu agitation categorically denied any such move. Hardline separatist leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani was the first to do so; thereafter, Mirwaiz Umer Farooq, Yasin Malik, Mufti Mohammed Sayeed and Farooq Abdullah followed the suit, threatening they would look at the option of trading through the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road. They were exploiting the loose statement of state BJP president Ashok Khajuria, who had used the terms like "blocking supplies" and "quit Jammu". Meanwhile, Governor N N Vohra declared that whatever had happened on the roads leading to Kashmir were "traffic disruptions" and "not the economic blockade". He made it clear that there was "no planned economic blockade". "They are apparently trying to out do each other in the similar fashion as they first did on the land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board, for they view electoral gains in it," said Mohammad Aslam Khan, a retired employee. On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 3:42 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > It seems the blockade strategy of the BJP-RSS-SASS was givenm up after > it backfired. > > > > At the mouth of tunnel to tumult > No blockade but long lock > > SANKARSHAN THAKUR > http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080813/jsp/frontpage/story_9686774.jsp > > Banihal, Aug. 12: There is a lock on the burning Valley, two miles long. > > We swept swiftly up the road from Jammu this morning, past Patnitop's > scenic pine resorts and the narrow gauge cut by the turbulent Chenab, > but found a swirl of concertina wiring thrown across this high gateway > into Kashmir. > > Layers of security cordons stood blocking the Jawahar Tunnel, the > longest manmade road duct in Asia and the country's only land-link to > the trouble-ridden Valley — police, the CRPF and then jawans of the > Indian Army. > > "Closed", a gum-booted, gun-wielding sentry said, "until further orders." > > But why? "Orders," he bluntly repeated, unyielding, "Can't permit you > to pass, not even at your own risk." > > It had begun to rain and the sentry's little shortwave set was > crackling in the slanted wind, spewing grim news from its oil-barrel > perch. Processions pouring out in torrents across the Valley. Defiance > of curfew. Violent engagement with security forces. Firing. > Retaliation. Deaths and injuries. More retaliation. A chain of cause > and effect ruinously whirring. > > Bandipora, Ganderbal, Lafjan, Baramulla, Kangan, Rainawari, Haripora, > Patang, Badgam, Watlar, Wusan, Lal Chowk, even Kishtwar which is > located outside the Valley — a swelling directory of datelines fast > staining the landscape. > > "Ab pata chala kuchh kyon nahi jane de rahe?" the sentry asked > sardonically as he arranged the concertina spools even more firmly > across the mouth of the tunnel. "Haalaat kharab hain janab," (Do you > get a little sense now of why we are not allowing you? Things are bad, > Sir.") > > In the little highway hamlet of Banihal down below — the only Muslim > majority pocket this side of the Jawahar Tunnel — the Valley's tumult > was beginning to echo. A band of men carrying green flags had gathered > in the square and were calling out to residents on a megaphone. "Our > brothers and sisters across Banihal are in trouble, let us tell them > we stand in solidarity, let's tell them we are with them!" > > The shanty shops of Banihal's one-lane bazaar lay shuttered, its > nervous residents looking on from half-ajar windows. But slowly as the > call rang out again and again, the band in the town square was joined > by trickles from the bylanes and soon became a flaming mob. It was > more than a kilometre long and spilled out on both sides of the > Jammu-Srinagar highway, a charged column on the march. > > More green flags began to wave about in the taut air and then roll the > shrill slogans of Kashmiri insurrection. "Chalo Muzaffarabad!; hum kya > chahte: azaadi; Pakistan zindabad." > > The elders frantically appealed for calm. "No commotion, please, no > violence," one of them cried out. "This is the hour of mourning. We > must respect our dead." > > But youngsters on the fringe of the mob would have none of that. As > the procession rolled up the winding road, en route to the mosque, > they got more strident, fisting the air in the face of CRPF jawans and > policemen. The closer the securitymen pressed the procession, the > louder the slogans, the more ardent the green flags. "Pakistan > zindabad; hum ko chhordo, Hindustan." > > The jawans, armed and ready to tear gas the mob at the first sign of > trouble, held their fire; the procession held its protest to angered > slogans, no more. But for three hours this afternoon, Banihal failed > precariously close to the chaos of violence. > > "Anything could have happened," said a nervous but relieved Haji Abdul > Majid Banihali, a local elder who was among the lead cast of this > protest. "You can feel it in your veins, can't you, the crowd and the > forces are just testing each other? We got away with it today but I > can't say the same about tomorrow. There's anger bubbling over what's > happening in the Valley." > > To either side of the protest, traffic lay coiled in the mountains > like a dead crocodile's tail. > > Hundreds of trucks laden with goods on their way to the Valley and Leh > beyond it. Wheat, pulses, oil, medicines, other packaged food. Half a > dozen carriers packed with bewildered chickens clucking in their > cages. Even a busload of Amarnath pilgrims from Maharashtra who had > somehow blundered their way up to this impasse. > > "We don't know what to do now, where to go," said Sudhakar Naik, who > arrived with his family of five from Nashik. "We can't go ahead and we > are not being allowed to return because there is a curfew all the way > down to Jammu. And it is getting cold." > > Up close to the mouth of Jawahar Tunnel, scores of more trucks lay > girded along the bends, lost on the prospects of being able to > proceed. All of them loaded with goods, all headed to the Valley, all > posting puzzling questions on allegations of an economic blockade. > > "We have been waiting two days at Banihal," said an irate truck driver > from Pathankot, carrying vegetable oils. "There was a disruption on > the road for a few days about a fortnight ago but the road has been > clear since. Who says trucks are not going? It is only here that the > security forces have blocked our way, nobody else did." > > A little distance away, the sentry, now under an oversized olive parka > to shield against the rain, was waving off newer arrivals with his > gun. "Khabar nahi suni? Kashmir jal raha hain (Haven't you heard the > news? Kashmir is burning.)" > Top > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 16:38:30 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 16:38:30 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Was there a blockade? In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808220316k6f70ffc7s581bfe9c58f1fe42@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220312gc5dcdcfm33c0fe11786c641b@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808220316k6f70ffc7s581bfe9c58f1fe42@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220408q26ad5dddx27e786cb9d0726c6@mail.gmail.com> Agitation against 'economic blockade' resumes in Kashmir Agencies Posted online: Friday, August 22, 2008 at 1302 hrs Print Email http://www.indianexpress.com/story/352032.html Srinagar, Aug 22:: The agitation against "economic blockade" enforced by Sri Amarnath Yatra Sangarsh Samiti in Kashmir valley on Friday resumed after three days with people marching towards Idgah ground in Srinagar. Groups of people, mostly youth, took to streets and marched towards Idgah, a vast ground in interior city, following an 'Idgah chalo' call given by Coordination Committee of separatists. The Committee, which includes both factions of Hurriyat Conference and JKLF among other groups, has asked people to observe a strike on Friday and march to idgah where it will announce its future course of action. The Committee had earlier suspended the agitation for three days on August 19. Security forces and police have been deployed in sensitive areas, official sources said, adding vehicles with black flags were seen moving on the roads in the city. From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 22 16:45:46 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 16:45:46 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Beyond highway of peace Message-ID: <9c06aab30808220415x26a9e037h791cdfffddd9f943@mail.gmail.com> Beyond highway of peace Muzamil Jaleel Posted online: Monday, August 18, 2008 at 1012 hrs Print Email http://www.indianexpress.com/story/349899._.html The Amarnath land transfer controversy and the subsequent "economic blockade" seem to the apparent reason for the unrest. But the actual reasons are deeper and psychological and lie in the failure to resolve the Kashmir problem Srinagar, August 17: Muteeb Raja is eight. His voice cracked as he shouted. "Hum kya chahte hain?" (what do we want?). A crowd of adults around him responded: Azadi (independence). Ishtiyaq Rasool is six. His mother told him that he was far too young to go and protest. "I insisted. The protestors will be thirsty, we can offer them water," he said. His mother joined the slogan-shouting women, hiding her face with her blue scarf. The march on Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road flowed like a river of people covering the highway from Chanakhan in Sopore to Khanpora ahead of Baramulla. A generation of young men, who were toddlers in the 1990s when Kashmir exploded with massive public demonstrations, was leading the procession. The security forces had withdrawn after failing to halt this march at 10 different places. They had tried everything. They had fired hundreds of smoke shells. They had baton charged to disperse the mob. They had opened fire, killing one and injuring two dozen at Sangrama Chowk, a few miles away from Sopore. Furious, the people had pelted stones at the police and security force contingent. The security personnel retreated, abandoning their two vehicles, which were immediately set afire by angry protestors. This was the scene on August 11. All of Kashmir has erupted since then; 24 people have died in police firing. This phenomenon is extremely unusual for a place where two months ago, the only buzz was election rallies, a pleasant spring and thousands of tourists. Kashmir had returned to its glory as a favourite destination of the holidaymaker. The militant attacks were rare and whenever there were reports of encounters, the security forces launched a pre-emptive offensive to kill them. Pakistan's President Musharraf had withdrawn from his traditional Kashmir agenda, condemned militant attacks and even dropped demand for plebiscite in Kashmir. His democratic successors had publicly altered Pakistan's Kashmir-centric foreign policy; emphasised on friendly relations with New Delhi to boost bilateral trade. At ground zero in Kashmir, the chairman of Hurriyat's moderate faction, Mirwaiz Umar Farooq was planning to leave for the US on a fellowship, hoping to study conflict management in Belfin Centre at Harvard. Hurriyat hawk Syed Ali Shah Geelani was ill and disillusioned by Pakistan's "divorce" from Kashmir. Several separatist leaders were complaining that Kashmiris are fatigued and New Delhi had declared the "end game" in Kashmir. After successfully fighting militancy for 18 years, the Centre was looking at the "free and fair" 2008 Assembly polls as the last dose of its policy prescription to fully recover Kashmir. The people's march on Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road changed all that. Hundreds of trucks with young men sitting on their bonnets were slowly moving ahead. At the first Army camp ahead of Baramulla, the troops had abandoned their roadside pickets to avoid confrontation. "We will not stop. We have to cross the LoC. We have to re-unite Kashmir," said Abdul Rasheed War (26), a teacher in a private school. "Kashmir has woken up. The movement is alive again," he added. Why is anger spilling on Kashmir's streets? The Amarnath land transfer controversy and the subsequent "economic blockade" is the apparent reason. But the real answer lies in the people's march on the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road. Ironically, this road was re-christened as the "highway of peace" between India and Pakistan on April 7, 2005, when for the first time a bus service connected the divided Kashmir. The slogans and flags in the march told another story. There was hardly any mention of the Amarnath land row or the blockade. The protests had transcended the issue of the Amarnath land transfer; it's only about separatism now. Professor Noor Ahmad Baba, who teaches political science at Kashmir University, articulated the reason behind this anger in Kashmir. He said the peace process had been slow and had failed to address any of the concerns of the Kashmiris. "There have been only superficial changes in the situation here. Kashmir was a problem yesterday and is a problem today," he said. Reacting to the question on why the Amarnath land row and the subsequent "economic blockade" became a tipping point, he added, "historically Kashmir had been at the centre of cultural and economic interaction. It was a meeting point for South Asia, China, Tibet and Central Asia. But since 1947 it has been pushed to the periphery." The way the Centre has been consistently avoiding facing the real problem in Kashmir and even refusing to react to any serious proposals from the mainstream and separatist political parties in Kashmir explains this added mistrust here. Prof Sheikh Showkat of Law Department in Kashmir University said New Delhi has contributed to the prevailing situation in more than one way. "They had a chance to resolve the problem during Musharraf's tenure. Once you lose the opportunity, you have to face the reality in a crude manner. They didn't even respond when Farooq Abdullah proposed autonomy that was passed by the Assembly. Peace in Kashmir was an illusion," he said. Concealed from vigilant eyes, Kashmir had been silently simmering and was just a trigger away from another explosion. And when the land transfer issue cropped up, it fit very well with the mistrust towards New Delhi. The subsequent blockade of the road connecting Kashmir with New Delhi — the only available road link for people and goods — created a mass feeling of choking. The issue was never limited to Kashmir's fruit growers losing their crop or the Valley facing shortage of food and fuel because of snipped supply lines, it was primarily psychological. The blockade reinforced a perception in Kashmir that New Delhi was not a reliable partner. National Conference president Omar Abdullah said the situation has gone out of control because the Centre did not pay heed to clear warning signs. "I had warned both PM Manmohan Singh and Congress president Sonia Gandhi that this movement to Muzafarabad will take a new dimension and go out of control if not handled urgently," he said, adding that the blockade highlighted "our weakness in the shape of dependence on a system to guarantee the safety of our economic and lifeline linkages with the rest of the country. It made people realise that the peace process has not delivered anything. Now what we see is the resurfacing of the old anger. Till now, we have blamed Pakistan for everything in Kashmir, this is the first time we have only ourselves to blame." Separatist Hurriyat leader Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, however, said the mass protests have not surprised him. "We always saw it coming," he said. "Amarnath land row might be the immediate cause, but the level of anger is the result of the long pent up disillusionment with New Delhi's status quo policies," he said. Mirwaiz alleged that the Centre talks of a dialogue only to exit a crisis situation. "New Delhi talks to us when the situation is really bad here. And when there is apparent peace, they ignore us," he said. "The Hurriyat joined the dialogue risking its own credibility. We lost people. But what was the result? As soon as New Delhi felt there was some peace in Valley, it abandoned the talks and left us in the lurch," he said, adding that the present crisis is the result of disillusionment. "A disillusionment born of the realisation that all talks on Kashmir were held for the sake of them, to buy time and to buy interlocutors, rather than work out a solution," he said. It is a fact that the Centre and its various agencies on ground in Kashmir had been extremely complacent after the recent drop in militant violence and a surge in mainstream political activity. The Government's understanding was simple: the problem in Kashmir is militancy and an iron fist response from the security agencies would bring the situation to normal. There was this skewed understanding that militancy and not the denial of political aspirations was the main problem. Then the establishment was emboldened by the drastic changes across the world after 9/11 when Pakistan was forced to change its tact and abandon Kashmir's militant movement. The line dividing terrorism and armed political movements had blurred to an extent where military solutions became increasingly acceptable to every violent movement. Thus in a way, the Government emphasised the symptom and not the disease and was happy to declare the lack of violence as permanent peace in Kashmir. Peoples Democratic Party's Mehbooba Mufti said the anger and alienation have increased manifold. "The situation is worse than 2002 when we took over. There is a lack of understanding of the real issue and we have been trying to make the Centre realise this," she said. Separatist leader Sajjad Lone went a step further. "While I would say that New Delhi underestimated the potency of the sentiment in Kashmir, it also exhibited an arrogant triumph over the relative peace in recent past. But now the reality has blown up on everybody's face. And it has torn through the lies piled up over the years that whatever was happening in Kashmir was Pakistan-sponsored," he said. He added that there is only one lesson to be learned: "this place has a real problem and it needs a real solution". It is, however, for the first time that the Government does not have to deal with the resurgence of the separatist sentiment in Kashmir alone. The Hindu majority districts in Jammu are up in arms too, seeking the cancellation of the revocation of the Amarnath land transfer order. This has complicated the situation because this time any confidence-building measure aimed at calming Kashmir will have an adverse impact on the situation in Jammu. From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 17:12:57 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 17:12:57 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Truck drivers, Hindu, Muslim and Sikh, bear the SASS brunt In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808220316r6e8e72aao184db508b58e900d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: So, why is it that elements in the Valley have now begun targeting drivers carrying apples out (your post: 'Truckers bear the brunt of Valley protests') ? What's going on? On 8/22/08 3:46 PM, "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" wrote: > Jammu stir leads to big fall in truck movement 21 Aug, 2008, 0400 hrs > IST, Masood Hussain, ET > Bureau http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/Jammu_stir_hits_truc > k_movement/articleshow/3387128.cms SRINAGAR: A confidential official report > has confirmed that there is a fall in the number of trucks to and from the > Kashmir Valley. Compared to 2007, the inward and outward movement of loaded > trucks from the state fell by 28% in July. In the first 18 days of August, the > state bound truck traffic fell by over 49% and outward by over 64%. Tabulated > at Lakhinpur, the gateway to J&K, the report suggests that there were many > days when there was no movement of any vehicle from either side. "It was a > situation when our officials at the gateway had to literally flee in wake of > attacks being carried out by the blocking enforcers," a top official told ET > from Jammu. The revelation of the report accessed by ET suggests that not a > single bus has moved out of Lakhinpur or entered into the state in > August while the bus movement from the two sides in 2007 was 11,478. In > July only 70 buses could enter the state as compared to 7,661 in July 2007 as > only 45 buses could move out against 7,537 last year. "That essentially means > whatever movement is happening from J&K is either by rail or by air," the > officials said. "There were attacks on two tourist buses and at least in one > case the bus with luggage of tourists was set afire." BJP national executive > member Nirmal Singh on July 21 advised tourists not to visit the Valley and > the appeal came days before civil aviation minister Praful Patel said in > Srinagar that air traffic in J&K showed a growth of 30%, higher than Delhi and > Mumbai airports. Intermittent blockades started soon after BJP state > president Ashok Kahjuria announced it on June 22 as part of the agitation > against the Amarnath land transfer cancellation order. It was later executed > by the SAYSS after it came into being as a 'non-political outfit'. There were > instances of Delhi-bound fruit-laden trucks being stopped and looted in Kathua > and Samba. However, movement of cars was not impacted to the extent as bus > and loaded trucks. Inward car movement fell from 30,074 in July 2007 to 11,165 > in July 2008 as the outward car traffic was 24,787 and 17,087 for the same > period, respectively. Cumulative movement till now in August was 44,499 > inwards and 38,440 outwards for 2007 and 2008. "If you see the overall > comparison of all kind of vehicles — loaded, empty, buses and cars —the fall > in July was 49% in J&K bound traffic and 40.72% in outgoing traffic," the > official said. "In August there was 42% fall in inward traffic and 47.49% in > outgoing traffic." Officials said even though there is lot of security, road > continues to be a safe passage. Most of the drivers from Kashmir are not ready > to ply on the road despite security because the intermittent attacks do take > place. Already Muhammad Lateef Wani, a driver from Pantha Chowk died after > being in a coma for many days at AIIMS. The attacks continue even though the > highway is supposedly secured by the armed forces. Bashir Ahmad Shalla of > Chattergam hamlet near Kanipora is the latest victim who was attacked on > Sunday in Kathua by rioters using tridents and petrol bombs. He is currently > admitted in a Srinagar hospital. "The movement is taking place but it is not > normal movement," a senior police officer said. "Normally in the peak season > for Srinagar bound trucks (summer) around 1,000 trucks cross the Jawahar > Tunnel for Srinagar and not less than 400 trucks leave Kashmir. It is October > in which Jammu bound traffic peaks with over 600 trucks a day." Officials, > however, do not admit that fall in traffic was because of the agitation. "We > are a consumer society and in wake of strike traders do not order for > provisions," an official said. "But, yes, there were days when not a single > truck could ply on the road." Offering a comparative study — that the source > said should at the best be treated as an estimate because it does not reflect > the overall trend — a senior official said there has been a significant fall > in taxable imports and exports. "If you compare first 10 days of August this > year with that of 2007, you will feel the difference," he said. In 2007, a > total 6,820 trucks laden with taxable goods reached Kashmir and in the first > 10 days of this month the number is 1,513. The trend is same in exports: > 4,216 trucks in 2007 and only 884 this year. Fruit exports did suffer as well: > 884 trucks last year and 452 this year in 10 days. "The numbers could be very > different if you include non-taxable goods," he said. The state > administration, however, is making all efforts to reverse the trend in wake of > depleting stock positions in the Valley, Ladakh, Doda and the twin districts > of Poonch and Rajouri. Governor N N Vohra is personally monitoring the > situation, officials said, adding that the traffic is gradually moving up. > "During the last 24 hours, 407 trucks laden with fresh fruit left the Valley > for Jammu as 755 loaded trucks with provisions reached Srinagar," a state > spokesman said. Early last week, when hospitals in Srinagar faced a situation > with several casualties, authorities flew a Hercules load of medicines > and surgical equipment after shortages were reported. o o o Truckers bear > the brunt of Valley protests Vikram Chowdhary Friday, August 22, 2008, > (Jammu) Over the last few weeks, truckers have borne the brunt of the > protests both in Jammu and in Srinagar. But despite that, truck drivers of > both the regions are braving disruptions on the highway to ensure > that supplies are not hampered. Satpreet Singh has returned home after > spending two days in hospital. Shaken, Satpreet said that he will never drive > his truck to Kashmir. Four days ago, a mob attacked his truck near Anantnag. > Satpreet who was transporting apples from Sopore in the Valley to Jammu was > badly beaten. He now has 11 stitches on the face. "When we were getting > apples, they stopped my truck at many places and pelted stones. But then I had > to safely get my truck back, but couldn't avoid past midnight around two," he > said. Satpreet isn't the only one. Kashmiri drivers who transport apples > to other states face similar ordeal at the hands of protestors in > Jammu region. Bilal Ahmed from Srinagar is travelling in a group with a dozen > other truckers from Kashmir. Still fresh on his mind is the incident in which > a driver from Kashmir was beaten near Samba while another was seriously > injured by protesters about a week ago. Though Army is patrolling the highway > to keep protesters away over two dozen truckers from Kashmir have been > targeted so far. "We get targeted in Jammu and Samba, but it's not just here, > this is there in the Valley as well. There also drivers are being > targeted, but the problem is for we drivers, drivers from Jammu Punjab > and Kashmir are facing the same problems," Bilal said. Truckers from other > regions can be identified and become easy targets. So far protesters on both > sides have damaged over 100 trucks. The problem points on the highway are > Lakhanpur, Kathua, Samba and Udhampur in the Jammu region and Awantipora, > Anantnag, Pampore in the Kashmir valley. Though Army has ensured there is no > blockade on the highway from Kathua to Srinagar, individual truckers are being > targeted. And the transporters have an appeal. "Transport is victim of the > both sides which is very unfortunate. On the ground we are in the service of > people of both regions getting supplies for both regions," Harminder Singh, a > transporter said. Inspite of efforts by the Army and security forces to see > that there is a smooth flow of traffic on the highway, surely the > disruptions still remain. But truck drivers from Valley and Jammu are braving > it all to see that there is no effect on the supplies. o o o Valley's fruit > growers threaten hunger > strike http://www.ptinews.com/pti%5Cptisite.nsf/0/18ABBC60E10CF113652574AC002 > BB253?OpenDocument Srinagar, Aug 21 (PTI) Accusing the government of > failing to provide security to their trucks plying on Srinagar-Jammu National > Highway, fruit growers from the valley today threatened to launch an > indefinite hunger strike if the situation does not improve in the next few > days. "We have decided to go on an indefinite hunger strike > on Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road if the situation arising out of > continuous attacks on truckers on the highway does not improve in next few > days," Fruit Growers Coordination Committee President Ghulam Rasool Bhat > told reporters. Contradicting government's claim that the traffic on the > arterial road connecting Kashmir with the rest of the country was plying > smoothly despite protests in Jammu over the Amarnath land row, Bhat > claimed that a fruit laden truck was burnt three days back by protesters > who damaged six other trucks at Samba on Sunday evening. "The truck, which > was set afire, belonged to Jammu and was carrying fruits from Valley," he > said, adding "claims of administration that the highway has been secured are > proving to be a hoax". Sopore Fruit Association president, Bashir Ahmed Beigh > said the fruit growers are suffering heavy losses. "We have faced losses > worth Rs 500 crore till date. Had Islam not forbidden suicide, we would have > ended our lives," he added. Expressing concern over the attacks on truckers, > Baramulla Transport company Nazir Ahmad Bhat claimed that window panes of half > a dozen fruit laden trucks were damaged by the Hindu activists two days > back. PTI o o o Blockade Evidence Makes Way to Hospitals, > Graveyards Srinagar, Aug 19, > KONS: http://www.kashmirobserver.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article > &id=890:blockade-evidence-makes-way-to-hospitals-graveyards&catid=50:localnews > &Itemid=81 Evidence of the violent blockade of the Kashmir valley is > mounting despite vehement denials by elements in Jammu that they have any > part in the embargo or that any such obstruction was in place. The case in > point also flies in the face of the state and the central government claims > that the Jammu-Srinagar highway had been secured for traffic and was now safe > for Kashmiri drivers. Bashir Ahmad Shala of Dangarpora, Naugam, narrowly > escaped lynching in Kathua, and is currently being treated in the burns ward > of the SMHS Hospital, while another driver who died in the AIIMS because > of injuries sustained in a mob attack on the highway near Samba, was laid to > rest in his native Pantha Chowk today. He and other Kashmiri drivers had been > attacked by rioters in Kathua on Sunday when they where on their way to Delhi > with truckloads of fruit. Talking from his hospital bed with severe burn > injuries, Shala said that they had first been pulled down from the trucks by > the mob and then given a severe battering. Their vehicles were damaged and the > consignment of fruit looted by the violent mob, he said. "We somehow managed > to flee the clutches of the mob, but another crowd was waiting for us, and it > threw a petrol bomb into my truck, which exploded in the driver's cabin," he > said. The blast inflicted extensive burn injuries on Shalla, and he > fainted. "When I woke up, I found myself in the Kathua hospital, where > doctors bandaged me up and referred me to the Jammu hospital," he said. In > Jammu, doctors described his condition as critical and asked him to get > admitted. But after spending a few hours in the hospital, her was gripped > by fears of more attacks by Hindu zealots, and fled the premises, making his > way to Banihal, from where he contacted his family. He was taken home by his > relatives and admitted to a hospital in Srinagar, he > said. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 22 17:29:17 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 17:29:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Shivam. I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" in the subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark about KP "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was saddened to read them. Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley by the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. And even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its participants, I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose work I respect, I expect much better of you. I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had forwarded does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress politician, or that they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that they were nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not an act of terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison every discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set fire to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally inappropriate to tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, so, too I think it is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this report with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I would urge everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while forwarding posts. best, Shuddha On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ > Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > police nakka," a police officer said. > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > official said. > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > "imperialism". > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 17:51:41 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 17:51:41 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808220521o228ecdbepbd014af89224a07a@mail.gmail.com> Some people never change, interestingly in february 2007, a person had written the following to Shivam : http://www.sandeepweb.com/2007/02/20/dear-shivam-vij/ Dear Shivam vij , If you want to bash Hinduism/caste system/whatever, do it based on *solid* understanding of the issue you're writing about. But when you write absolute nonsense that stems from the dark depths of your abysmal ignorance, Not that I expect you to condescend and respond to this post… PS: No wonder this appeared in *Tehelka*. I am awaiting the next post from dear friend Shivam. He has definitely arrived. Jeeve Jeeve "Abysmal Ignorance" Jeeve . Yahan Kya Chalega ...Abysmal Ignorance Regards Pawan Durani On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 5:29 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Shivam. > > I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > in the subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark > about KP "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was > saddened to read them. > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir > valley by the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any > community. And even if communities get vilified in this debate by > some of its participants, I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As > a journalist whose work I respect, I expect much better of you. > > I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had > forwarded does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress > politician, or that they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we > assume that they were nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were > raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, > though reprehensible, is not an act of terrorism. To say it is to > mirror the tactics of those who poison every discussion on these > matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix "Islamic" to > terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu > terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. > > Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC > slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set > fire to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally > inappropriate to tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" > terrorism, so, too I think it is totally inappropriate and uncalled > for on your part to tag this report with the headline "Hindu > Terrorism in Jammu" > > This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I > would urge everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and > thoughtful while forwarding posts. > > best, > > Shuddha > > > > On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ > > Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > official said. > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > "imperialism". > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From indersalim at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 17:52:51 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 17:52:51 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Beyond highway of peace In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808220415x26a9e037h791cdfffddd9f943@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220415x26a9e037h791cdfffddd9f943@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808220522x3c1300a6x4096be86f2b44bda@mail.gmail.com> For those who want to read and know more ON KASHMIR BY A.G. NOORANI PLEASE CLICK http://www.hinduonnet.com/fline/fl2515/stories/20080801251508400.htm BOOKS Why Kashmir erupts A.G. NOORANI Two books that illuminate Kashmir's past and offer insights into how the problem can be resolved. Even today, perhaps the best of us do not quite realise the depths of Kashmir's alienation and are unready to ponder ways and means of overcoming it. - Professor Hiren Mukherji, February 25, 1994. NOT long ago, people went on the rampage in Kathmandu over a Hrithik Roshan film. Since June 10, Seoul has been rocked by protests over beef imports from the United States. In truth, Nepalese ire was directed at India, while fears of the mad cow disease were overladen with resentment at South Korea's surrender to the U.S.' diktat on the imports. In their intensity of feeling and sheer range, the recent protests in Kashmir have been compared with those in 1963 over the Prophet's relic, found missing at Hazratbal, and the outbreak of militancy in 1990. But these are far worse. Unlike in the past, they have assumed a communal colour, and the one person who imparted those revolting hues was the State's Governor, S.K. Sinha. He was long at the game. His patrons in the bureaucracy and sections of the Congress in New Delhi had prevented his recall much earlier. Just 39.88 hectares of forest land cannot inflame a populace. Insult alone can, especially if the people are subjected to indignities daily and suffer from a deep pain frozen over the decades with bitter memories of rigged elections and denial of civil liberties. As The Hindu remarked (June 25), "The Governor and his Principal Secretary let loose a barrage of inflammatory polemics." Chief Minister Ghulam Nabi Azad had a whole week's warning, time enough to nip the trouble in the bud. He arrogantly refused. The Governor is the Chairman of the Shri Amarnathji Shrine Board (SASB). His Principal Secretary, Arun Kumar, is also its Chief Executive Officer. Ever since he became Governor in June 2003, S.K. Sinha locked horns with the government on the extension of the Amarnath Yatra from a month to two and on other issues. Matters had reached the court. In March 2005, Sonali Kumar, Forest Secretary and wife of Arun Kumar, issued orders for the transfer of forest land around the cave to the custody of the SASB. This was on a request from Arun Kumar. He went to court when the government nullified the order. Eventually, on June 2, 2008, the government passed the fateful order diverting the lands at Baltal to the SASB on specified conditions. In this charged atmosphere, Arun Kumar held a press conference on June 17, at which he made brazenly communal remarks and cocked a snook at the legislature – it had no authority over the Board, though it was set up by an Act of 2000. Politicians were playing "communal politics" and "these were the people when the Shrine Board was approved and land was transferred to the Board by the government" (Greater Kashmir; June 19; emphasis added, throughout). The local people created more pollution than yatris. "Nobody interferes" in the affairs of the Waqf Board headed by the Chief Minister. He mentioned the Haj pilgrimage, the Dal Lake, and so on, and declared angrily: "Muslim pollution is acceptable to you but not the Hindu pollution." Who were the "you" he was addressing? On June 28, he was simply transferred to the General Administration Department and not suspended, though a committee found him prima facie in breach of the All India Services (Conduct) Rules. As Isaac said, "The voice is Jacob's voice, but the hands are the hands of Esau" (Genesis; 27.22). That he spoke for Governor S.K. Sinha became clear when the Raj Bhavan issued a statement the very next day, backing him fully: "Statements issued by us are twisted." On a crucial point, it gave the game away. It admitted that "when he was asked about the duration for which the land at Baltal had been diverted to [the] SASB he specified that no time limit had been given in the Government Order". Why did this trained official not say that the order was for two months, the duration of the yatra? For an obvious reason. "Since the Forest Department cannot sell the land to us, the government has permanently diverted the 800 kanals land at Baltal to SASB. We have to pay Rs.2.5 crore to the Forest Department once the demarcation of the land completes. We do not have to give it back to the Forest Department after the yatra ends," Arun Kumar told Rising Kashmir on the sidelines of the press conference on the Raj Bhavan lawns. On that very day, June 17, a spokesman for Syed Ali Shah Geelani, chairman of the All Parties Hurriyat Conference, said: "Geelani Saheb announced an agitation on June 23 in a meeting." In which other State could an official have dared to speak as Arun Kumar did? On June 20, on the campus of Kashmir University, hundreds of students staged massive protests "raising pro-freedom and pro-Pakistan slogans" (Rising Kashmir; June 21). Fortunately, S.K. Sinha was succeeded by a civil servant with a reputation for integrity and moderation. Governor N.N. Vohra defused the crisis skilfully on June 29 by asking the government to take over the yatra arrangements. Meanwhile, precious time had been wasted because Ghulam Nabi Azad did nothing. The three decades of his political career, begun as a protege of Sanjay Gandhi, were spent outside the State. He fought his first election to the Assembly only after he became Chief Minister in 2005. His sights were always set on returning to New Delhi. For the first time, Kashmir had a Chief Minister who had no presence in Kashmir's politics and no empathy for its aspiration. Asked in November 2001 why he was not in Kashmir, he replied, "I want to be in the mainstream." "Malignant" conduct Kashmir Times, founded by the veteran socialist Ved Bhasin, remarked (June 28) that S.K. Sinha's conduct was "malignant for both the interests of the State as well as the Union… a timely check by the Chief Minister on the predatory ambition of an arrogant Governor" would have averted the crisis. It was the deadly combination of a malignant Governor and an inept Chief Minister that was responsible for the upheaval. S.K. Sinha came out in his true colours by denouncing Azad's predecessor Mufti Mohammad Sayeed as "anti-national" a week after he quit as Governor (The Times of India; July 4). Only in Kashmir was this possible. The Mufti has served in the Cabinet of three Prime Ministers. Indira Gandhi superseded S.K. Sinha in the appointment of the Chief of the Army Staff; in retrospect, wisely. Nothing has changed since Hiren Mukherji's memorable lament in 1994 – neither the lack of understanding of the alienation nor the lack of any effort "to ponder ways and means of overcoming it". The truth is a great liberating force and the truth is that there is no "alienation" at all, for alienation implies earlier affection and most Kashmiris were, and still are, against the State's accession to India. Hence Indira Gandhi's candid letter to Jawaharlal Nehru from Srinagar on May 14, 1948: "They say only Sheikh Saheb [Sheikh Abdullah] is confident of winning the plebiscite." PTI ALL PARTIES HURRIYAT Conference chairman Syed Ali Shah Geelani at a rally against the killing of five local residents during protests against the transfer of forest land to the Amarnath Shrine Board, in Srinagar on June 30. Evidently, he soon developed second thoughts though Pakistan's tribal raid had initially secured his support for the accession. A file in the British library reveals that very clearly (L/P&S/13/1341). It contains a telegram from the British High Commissioner in India to London (February 21, 1948) conveying details of the talks Patrick Gordon-Walker, Under Secretary of State in the Commonwealth Relations Office, had had with Nehru the day before. Nehru invited Sheikh Abdullah to join them and left. "Just before Nehru left, Sheikh Abdullah said he thought the solution was that Kashmir should accede to both Dominions. He said Kashmir's trade was with India, that India was progressive and that Nehru was an Indian. On the other hand, Kashmir's trade passed through Pakistan and a hostile Pakistan would be a constant danger. The solution, therefore, was that Kashmir should have its autonomy jointly guaranteed by India and Pakistan and it would delegate its foreign policy and defence to them both jointly but would look after its own internal affairs…. I asked whether Nehru would agree to this solution and he said he thought so. He had discussed it with him." Nehru himself told Gordon-Walker later that "he would be prepared to accept a solution broadly on the lines of that proposed by Sheikh Abdullah" (paragraphs 7 and 10). In September 1950, U.S. Ambassador Loy Henderson "had two secret discussions" with Sheikh Abdullah in Srinagar at his request. He "was vigorous in restating that in his opinion it [Kashmir] should be independent". Harsh truths That is impossible, so is Kashmir's secession from India. Both truths are part of the same grim reality – the people never wanted accession to India and reject it to this day. Only last year, Sumeet Kaul, a Kashmiri Pandit, reported: "I had read somewhere that your preconceived notions of nationalism, of Indian nationalism, are severely tested in the Valley. They were. And that, perhaps, was more difficult to come to terms with than even the guns. Wherever we went, we were almost invariably referred to as the 'guests from India', not with malice, but casually, incidentally". (Hindustan Times; September 4, 2007). The other harsh truth is for Kashmiris to grasp. A Pakistan which tried to grab Kashmir by recourse to war in 1965 has no right to secure it by plebiscite. Long before Pervez Musharraf, indeed since 1958, when Firoz Khan Noon was its Prime Minister, Pakistan had given up plebiscite. Musharraf has been more honest, daring and creative. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and he have arrived at a solid consensus on the broad outlines of a settlement that reckons with both the truths. It awaits Kashmiri inputs before it is given final shape as an accord (see the writer's article "A step closer to consensus", Frontline, December 15, 2006). That accord will work only if public opinion is educated. The documents in Sardar Patel's Correspondence (Volume 1) alone suffice to bring home those harsh truths. We find both Nehru and Sheikh Abdullah pleading with the Maharaja, on December 1, 1947, and August 5, 1948, respectively, that Muslims in the Valley needed to be won over (pages 103 and 215). "If the average Muslim feels that he has no safe or secure place in the Union, then obviously he will look elsewhere," Nehru wrote, referring politely to events in Jammu. The Maharaja, however, enjoyed full support from Vallabhbhai Patel. Nehru wrote to Patel pointing out bluntly how the arms meant for the government were "distributed to [the] RSS [Rashtriya Swayamsewak Sangh". Sheikh Saheb also wrote to Patel on October 7, 1948, describing how the Maharaja had presided over "the killing of Muslims all over the province" of Jammu. The great historian E.H. Carr aptly said that "the function of the historian is neither to love the past nor to emancipate himself from the past, but to master and understand it as the key to the understanding of the present". We need to reconcile the two truths – the people's rejection of accession and the impossibility of accepting this demand. Nationalists deny the first truth; idealists, the second. They are, however, reconcilable and only such a reconciliation will make an accord possible and viable. Unique insights These books help us enormously to understand the not-so-distant as well as the recent past and to reflect on how best to resolve the problem. Wajahat Habibullah, IAS, served in the State from 1969 to 1982, when he moved to the Centre. In 1990 he returned as Special Commissioner, Anantnag. In 2000 he was head of the Lake and Waterways Development Authority. As the son of the famous Major General E. Habibullah, who set up the National Defence Academy in Khadakvasla, he acquired an understanding of the Army's ethos. No civil servant enjoyed so universal a respect as he did among all sections of the people. He has won high credibility as the Chief Information Commissioner. His reportage and insights are unique. He exposes many a myth and lie. Integrity is also the hallmark of Andrew Whitehead's work. He was the BBC's correspondent in India. He pursued people in the know, far and wide, and consulted the archives extensively. "A necessary step to resolving any crisis, however, is gaining an understanding of how it started. Not to indulge in recriminations, but to appreciate the sequence of actions, and the jumble of claims and grievances, that tangle and snag moves towards compromise. If ever there could be an agreed narrative of Kashmir's modern history, other forms of accord should not be far away. "The main purpose of this study has been to illuminate the origins of the Kashmir crisis by retrieving the personal stories of those who lived through the events of October and November 1947. The facts and perspectives unravelled through this research challenge the official narratives of both India and Pakistan about the genesis of the Kashmir conflict. In particular, they question Pakistan's often-stated denial of instigating or organising the Lashkar's invasion of the Kashmir Valley, and they cast doubt on the Indian account of Kashmir's accession." Pakistan's devotees in Kashmir should read his definitive account of the ruin its tribesmen wrought in Baramula. Indians should read his account of Kashmir's accession to India, on which a lot yet remains to be told. He has unearthed an important letter by the Maharaja written three days before he signed the Instrument of Accession on October 26. "The unevenly typed letter, on headed paper is dated 23 October 1947: 'I hereby my Deputy Prime Minister, R.B. Ram Lal Batra to sign the document of accession of the State with the Indian Union on my behalf, subject to the condition that the terms of accession will be the same as would be settled with H.E.H. the Nizam of Hyderabad.' The letter is signed by Hari Singh in his own hand and underneath is typed MAHARAJA OF JAMMU & KASHMIR." Whitehead holds that "the most obvious lasting answer to the Kashmir dispute is to heed the voice of the people of Kashmir, and to allow them to decide their own destiny. The national interests of India and Pakistan – and particularly of India, the nation in power in the Kashmir Valley – will determine whether, when and how this is done." And, realistically, how far it can be done. Given goodwill, that is possible. Habibullah also relates the past to the present and makes useful suggestions on approaches to an accord. But the greatest value of his work is the shocks it administers to the very many in India who revel in a state of denial. The attitudes of the bureaucracy, the Army, and their mentors in Delhi and the deep injuries inflicted on the people of Kashmir are laid bare in a matter-of-fact manner. There was Brigadier General Randhawa, Deputy Inspector General of the Border Security Force, who declared to the people of a town in his presence that "there were traitors among the people and that to protect citizens, the BSF would start patrolling nearby villages. At any time of day or night, the BSF might enter people's homes and shoot anyone they suspected of intending mischief. He emphasised that this was not his voice but God's speaking through him, because he was protecting the right and combating the wrong. "I was chilled. I stepped forward to reason with him. I pleaded that his soldiers not bear arms, even though under the law I was within my rights to order that they not do so – or even that they not patrol without the orders of the civilian authority. But the Brigadier would brook no argument." That was in 1970. Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose (The more things change, the more they remain the same). Truth about an encounter In April 1993, Dr. Abdul Ahad Guru was kidnapped and murdered by a Hizbul Mujahideen militant, Zulqarnain. Guru commanded wide respect as a reasonable face of separation. He was therefore an inconvenience. "The police made an arrangement with the terrorist Zulqarnain, then in custody, who agreed to kill Guru in exchange for his release. But to ensure that this collusion remained secret, Zulqarnain was killed shortly thereafter, and the Director General of Police, B.S. Bedi, trumpeted his death as a triumph for the security forces, who had killed a dangerous terrorist in an armed encounter. But the truth was somewhat different. Instead of killing Zulqarnain in an armed encounter, the police stormed the home where, under the mistaken presumption that he was safe after having fulfilled his end of the bargain, he was consorting with a lady friend." Even in 2002, "Citizens, few if any of whom belonged to the security forces, felt as if they were living in an occupied territory, living with doubts, suspicions, and [the] fear of settlement of scores between organisations and individuals using 'security interest' as an excuse." Exposing a whitewash Habibullah renders a service by exposing the whitewash that was B.G. Verghese's report on the rapes in Kunan Poshpura on February 23-24, 1991. "I had found the complaint exaggerated, although not necessarily unfounded, and called for further inquiry. I mentioned in my report that the village headman, or lumbardar, had given a certificate of good behaviour to the troops departing from Kunan Poshpura, though the lumbardar told me that he had not known of the alleged crimes against the women. My report concluded: 'While the veracity of the complaint is highly doubtful, it still needs to be determined why such complaint was made at all. The people of the village are simple folk and by the Army's own admission have been generally helpful and even careful of security of the Army's officers… Unlike Brig. Sharma I found many of the village women genuinely angry … It is recommended that the level of investigation be upgraded to that of a gazetted police officer.' "Because of the widespread media attention that resulted from the report and protests by Justice Bahauddin (a Kashmiri and former Judge of the High Court of Jammu and Kashmir), the report was investigated in July 1991 by the Press Council of India, led by the eminent journalist B.G. Verghese. The Verghese Committee, appointed in an effort at damage control rather than because of any sincere interest in reaching the truth, concluded that the complaint was 'invented'. This ended any further pursuit of the investigation and led to an abiding resentment among villagers in the area, particularly women. The lack of an effective way to redress their grievances had continued to blight the lives of the women of Kunan Poshpura." The shameful exercise was conducted ostensibly as a Press Council inquiry. I write ostensibly advisedly (see the writer's article "Exceeding the brief: The tragedy of the Verghese report"; Frontline; October 12, 1991). In our society victims of rape are stigmatised. The tragic aftermath was reported in Greater Kashmir and Hindustan Times of February 23, 2007, and Rising Kashmir of March 13, 2008. Village elders had to arrange the marriages of the victims, but only for some. If the people are resentful and continue to be treated as they have been, elections have to be rigged, lest they return an Assembly that demands secession. The legal efficacy of such an Assembly might be nil. Its moral force would be deadly. The Chief Election Commissioner, J.M. Lyngdoh, "admitted to me…. [that] the Commission has remained constrained regarding Jammu and Kashmir by the need to avoid compromising national security" – an exquisite phrase. After 1953, "all potential successor candidates were subjected to the Indian government's fine-tooth comb of security concerning adherence to India's national security interests. Individual competence, integrity and even the measure of public support commanded were secondary considerations." Habibullah describes how crowds are arranged on Independence and Republic Days. Pliable officers or those with "skills" were selected to manage elections. If all else failed, "the ballot boxes could be stuffed with ballots". It passed muster because Kashmir has a "special status". "For years, India has tolerated the undemocratic governance of the State by a favoured elite that skilfully played on fears that full democracy in the State would lead the people to gravitate towards Pakistan. This tragically unfounded suspicion lies at the root of what went so wrong in the 1980s." No, since 1947. The polls held by Sheikh Abdullah in 1951 were also rigged. A request to the Sheikh The writer would break a rule and mention a personal experience. It was in April 1970, at the end of a seminar at the India International Centre in New Delhi on National Integration, organised by its Director, Romesh Thapar. An official attached to the Home Ministry came over to see me at his request and asked me to advise Sheikh Saheb, whom I was to meet an hour later at 3 Kotla Lane, to accept the Indian Constitution. Else, he would be prevented from contesting elections to the Lok Sabha and the State Assembly. By rejecting the nomination papers, as in 1967? I asked. The answer was chilling in its clarity. That was a technique of the 1960s. Now, the Plebiscite Front's workers would be put in prison in such large numbers as to incapacitate the party. Sheikh Saheb would not be arrested. His colleague Mirza Mohammed Afzal Beg might be; or perhaps not. Why was it necessary since we had the Army there and the Governor? I asked. The answer was crisp. If the Assembly led by the Sheikh were to pronounce on independence, where would India's case rest, morally? The message was instantly conveyed. Sheikh Saheb agreed to issue an appropriately worded statement, to be drafted by me. Its aim was to keep each side's stand open for resolution politically after the polls. Plebiscite was dead in 1970, but acceptance of the Constitution could not affect his stand because Article 370 permitted secession. It was a political matter to be resolved politically. "Do not hurry," he counselled, since I was due to visit him in Srinagar shortly. "It must be a chiselled document." That document was shown to Beg Saheb when we met on the lawns of the Oberoi Palace Hotel in Srinagar on May 8, 1970. He shot it down saying sternly, "You will ruin us." He was right. Lawyers tend to miss political realities. The mere announcement of acceptance of the Constitution then would have finished the Plebiscite Front. In June 1970, the Unlawful Activities Act, 1967, was extended to the State. A few months later, the scheme, as unfolded by the official, was implemented to perfection. Both leaders were interned at 3 Kotla Lane on January 9, 1971. The Front was banned. The law was amended to bar members of banned bodies. There were massive arrests in the Valley. Will New Delhi take any risk now while it advises the separatists to contest the polls? Habibullah writes: "To be seen as entirely 'free and fair', elections cannot be conducted in a charged atmosphere with heavy security deployment. Such deployment and its consequences have given Kashmiris the feeling that if they vote, they are not exercising choice. This point weighed heavily with dissidents who refused to participate in the 2002 elections. During discussions with political representatives in Srinagar, Lyngdoh found an overwhelming fear of organisations such as the police task force and the Special Operations Group, which had already begun bullying, intimidating and harassing potential voters. Transparency was not forthcoming." New Delhi refuses to allow foreign monitoring of elections though Indians have served as election observers in Pakistan, Sri Lanka, and elsewhere. Habibullah realistically remarks: "Until each citizen can live free from fear, democracy can only be notional, no matter how elections are conducted or who participates." Does such a situation exist now, in 2008? He is not without hope. "I believe, based on my experience working in the State and with its people, that a remedy for the Kashmir situation need not be elusive, provided that all the stakeholders are sincere in their endeavour to restore peace and that respect for the dignity of the Kashmiri people is at the core of any resolution. Ignoring the self-respect of Kashmiris – believing that they as a people could be bought – brought on and fuelled the cycle of ruin." For aught we know, truly free elections will be possible only as part of a Kashmir accord – whether to facilitate or ratify it. Perhaps only then will the tragedy end. Eighty years ago the historian Vincent H. Smith wrote: "Few regions in the world can have had worse luck than Kashmir in the name of government."• ________________________________ On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 4:45 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > Beyond highway of peace > > Muzamil Jaleel > Posted online: Monday, August 18, 2008 at 1012 hrs Print Email > http://www.indianexpress.com/story/349899._.html > > The Amarnath land transfer controversy and the subsequent "economic > blockade" seem to the apparent reason for the unrest. But the actual > reasons are deeper and psychological and lie in the failure to resolve > the Kashmir problem > > Srinagar, August 17: Muteeb Raja is eight. His voice cracked as he > shouted. "Hum kya chahte hain?" (what do we want?). A crowd of adults > around him responded: Azadi (independence). Ishtiyaq Rasool is six. > His mother told him that he was far too young to go and protest. "I > insisted. The protestors will be thirsty, we can offer them water," he > said. His mother joined the slogan-shouting women, hiding her face > with her blue scarf. > > The march on Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road flowed like a river of people > covering the highway from Chanakhan in Sopore to Khanpora ahead of > Baramulla. A generation of young men, who were toddlers in the 1990s > when Kashmir exploded with massive public demonstrations, was leading > the procession. > > The security forces had withdrawn after failing to halt this march at > 10 different places. They had tried everything. They had fired > hundreds of smoke shells. They had baton charged to disperse the mob. > They had opened fire, killing one and injuring two dozen at Sangrama > Chowk, a few miles away from Sopore. > > Furious, the people had pelted stones at the police and security force > contingent. The security personnel retreated, abandoning their two > vehicles, which were immediately set afire by angry protestors. > > This was the scene on August 11. All of Kashmir has erupted since > then; 24 people have died in police firing. This phenomenon is > extremely unusual for a place where two months ago, the only buzz was > election rallies, a pleasant spring and thousands of tourists. > > Kashmir had returned to its glory as a favourite destination of the > holidaymaker. The militant attacks were rare and whenever there were > reports of encounters, the security forces launched a pre-emptive > offensive to kill them. Pakistan's President Musharraf had withdrawn > from his traditional Kashmir agenda, condemned militant attacks and > even dropped demand for plebiscite in Kashmir. His democratic > successors had publicly altered Pakistan's Kashmir-centric foreign > policy; emphasised on friendly relations with New Delhi to boost > bilateral trade. > > At ground zero in Kashmir, the chairman of Hurriyat's moderate > faction, Mirwaiz Umar Farooq was planning to leave for the US on a > fellowship, hoping to study conflict management in Belfin Centre at > Harvard. Hurriyat hawk Syed Ali Shah Geelani was ill and disillusioned > by Pakistan's "divorce" from Kashmir. Several separatist leaders were > complaining that Kashmiris are fatigued and New Delhi had declared the > "end game" in Kashmir. > > After successfully fighting militancy for 18 years, the Centre was > looking at the "free and fair" 2008 Assembly polls as the last dose of > its policy prescription to fully recover Kashmir. > > The people's march on Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road changed all that. > Hundreds of trucks with young men sitting on their bonnets were slowly > moving ahead. At the first Army camp ahead of Baramulla, the troops > had abandoned their roadside pickets to avoid confrontation. "We will > not stop. We have to cross the LoC. We have to re-unite Kashmir," said > Abdul Rasheed War (26), a teacher in a private school. "Kashmir has > woken up. The movement is alive again," he added. > > Why is anger spilling on Kashmir's streets? The Amarnath land transfer > controversy and the subsequent "economic blockade" is the apparent > reason. But the real answer lies in the people's march on the > Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road. > > Ironically, this road was re-christened as the "highway of peace" > between India and Pakistan on April 7, 2005, when for the first time a > bus service connected the divided Kashmir. The slogans and flags in > the march told another story. There was hardly any mention of the > Amarnath land row or the blockade. The protests had transcended the > issue of the Amarnath land transfer; it's only about separatism now. > > Professor Noor Ahmad Baba, who teaches political science at Kashmir > University, articulated the reason behind this anger in Kashmir. He > said the peace process had been slow and had failed to address any of > the concerns of the Kashmiris. "There have been only superficial > changes in the situation here. Kashmir was a problem yesterday and is > a problem today," he said. Reacting to the question on why the > Amarnath land row and the subsequent "economic blockade" became a > tipping point, he added, "historically Kashmir had been at the centre > of cultural and economic interaction. It was a meeting point for South > Asia, China, Tibet and Central Asia. But since 1947 it has been pushed > to the periphery." > > The way the Centre has been consistently avoiding facing the real > problem in Kashmir and even refusing to react to any serious proposals > from the mainstream and separatist political parties in Kashmir > explains this added mistrust here. Prof Sheikh Showkat of Law > Department in Kashmir University said New Delhi has contributed to the > prevailing situation in more than one way. "They had a chance to > resolve the problem during Musharraf's tenure. Once you lose the > opportunity, you have to face the reality in a crude manner. They > didn't even respond when Farooq Abdullah proposed autonomy that was > passed by the Assembly. Peace in Kashmir was an illusion," he said. > > Concealed from vigilant eyes, Kashmir had been silently simmering and > was just a trigger away from another explosion. And when the land > transfer issue cropped up, it fit very well with the mistrust towards > New Delhi. The subsequent blockade of the road connecting Kashmir with > New Delhi — the only available road link for people and goods — > created a mass feeling of choking. The issue was never limited to > Kashmir's fruit growers losing their crop or the Valley facing > shortage of food and fuel because of snipped supply lines, it was > primarily psychological. The blockade reinforced a perception in > Kashmir that New Delhi was not a reliable partner. > > National Conference president Omar Abdullah said the situation has > gone out of control because the Centre did not pay heed to clear > warning signs. "I had warned both PM Manmohan Singh and Congress > president Sonia Gandhi that this movement to Muzafarabad will take a > new dimension and go out of control if not handled urgently," he said, > adding that the blockade highlighted "our weakness in the shape of > dependence on a system to guarantee the safety of our economic and > lifeline linkages with the rest of the country. It made people realise > that the peace process has not delivered anything. Now what we see is > the resurfacing of the old anger. Till now, we have blamed Pakistan > for everything in Kashmir, this is the first time we have only > ourselves to blame." > > Separatist Hurriyat leader Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, however, said the mass > protests have not surprised him. "We always saw it coming," he said. > "Amarnath land row might be the immediate cause, but the level of > anger is the result of the long pent up disillusionment with New > Delhi's status quo policies," he said. > > Mirwaiz alleged that the Centre talks of a dialogue only to exit a > crisis situation. "New Delhi talks to us when the situation is really > bad here. And when there is apparent peace, they ignore us," he said. > "The Hurriyat joined the dialogue risking its own credibility. We lost > people. But what was the result? As soon as New Delhi felt there was > some peace in Valley, it abandoned the talks and left us in the > lurch," he said, adding that the present crisis is the result of > disillusionment. "A disillusionment born of the realisation that all > talks on Kashmir were held for the sake of them, to buy time and to > buy interlocutors, rather than work out a solution," he said. > > It is a fact that the Centre and its various agencies on ground in > Kashmir had been extremely complacent after the recent drop in > militant violence and a surge in mainstream political activity. The > Government's understanding was simple: the problem in Kashmir is > militancy and an iron fist response from the security agencies would > bring the situation to normal. There was this skewed understanding > that militancy and not the denial of political aspirations was the > main problem. Then the establishment was emboldened by the drastic > changes across the world after 9/11 when Pakistan was forced to change > its tact and abandon Kashmir's militant movement. The line dividing > terrorism and armed political movements had blurred to an extent where > military solutions became increasingly acceptable to every violent > movement. Thus in a way, the Government emphasised the symptom and not > the disease and was happy to declare the lack of violence as permanent > peace in Kashmir. > > Peoples Democratic Party's Mehbooba Mufti said the anger and > alienation have increased manifold. "The situation is worse than 2002 > when we took over. There is a lack of understanding of the real issue > and we have been trying to make the Centre realise this," she said. > > Separatist leader Sajjad Lone went a step further. "While I would say > that New Delhi underestimated the potency of the sentiment in Kashmir, > it also exhibited an arrogant triumph over the relative peace in > recent past. But now the reality has blown up on everybody's face. And > it has torn through the lies piled up over the years that whatever was > happening in Kashmir was Pakistan-sponsored," he said. He added that > there is only one lesson to be learned: "this place has a real problem > and it needs a real solution". > > It is, however, for the first time that the Government does not have > to deal with the resurgence of the separatist sentiment in Kashmir > alone. The Hindu majority districts in Jammu are up in arms too, > seeking the cancellation of the revocation of the Amarnath land > transfer order. This has complicated the situation because this time > any confidence-building measure aimed at calming Kashmir will have an > adverse impact on the situation in Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From indersalim at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 18:24:15 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:24:15 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hurriyat leader was murdered, not killed by police-TOI In-Reply-To: <13df7c120808220106v7ed09439h9619a5014de92480@mail.gmail.com> References: <13df7c120808212140o428a5cd6yf501ae7ab7bb0a6b@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808220035n5e979c49hfbdb997400e3ffe0@mail.gmail.com> <13df7c120808220106v7ed09439h9619a5014de92480@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808220554i2e0a8068k9c681a6d33b1470f@mail.gmail.com> even if it is true, that sheikh abdul aziz was killed by a Pakistani finger on the trigger and not by an Indian finger on the trigger, there is very little reason to celebrate. that is what i always see: the games which are being played in the high offices, leave behind no clue about their vicious calculation to manipulate 'the other'. This is a layered system of hierarchy which is mostly partronized by caplitalist, elites and power structures of a society. They truly tell us what a good society is or what a nation is and we blindly follow, pherpahs there is very little choice for a commoner, but then there is hope, an existential spark in each one of us, which enables us to approach it scientfically and see history in a new light. the appearances can be deceptive, but it is a vast surface, some layers of it may be hidden from us but nothing is invisible, that is what gives birth to some rational poltics. this applies to kashmir and to the whole world in one go. love is On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 1:36 PM, rashneek kher wrote: > Aditya, > > Whosoever killed him will remain a matter of speculation but it presses home > the point that if you live by the sword you will die by it. > Examples of Mirwaiz Farooq,Dr.Guru and "cry baby" Sajjad's dad have already > been consumed the very Frankestein's they lived with. > > In Kashmiri there is a saying"Aenem Soy Vavem soy lajem soy panesey" > > Rashneek > > > > On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 1:05 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > >> Rashneek, >> >> The Aran Dhati Roy Fan Club on Sarai; won't buy this theory sadly. They >> just >> love bashing security forces; even if while acting blind. >> >> God Bless them... >> >> Aditya >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 10:10 AM, rashneek kher >> wrote: >> >> > NEW DELHI: Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz, whose shooting during the >> > "LoC >> > march" organized by Kashmir separatists on August 11 gave an explosive >> turn >> > to the agitation, was not killed by a police or army bullet. >> > >> > In a shocking revelation, national security adviser M K Narayanan told >> the >> > Union Cabinet on Thursday that it was not at all clear who had fired the >> > fatal bullet at Aziz, a former Al Jehad leader who was part of the march >> on >> > the Srinagar-Muzzaffarabad highway. >> > >> > The NSA also pointed out that there were many rivalries at work in the >> > Kashmir Valley. >> > >> > Narayanan was responding to a question by Union steel minister Ramvilas >> > Paswan, who pointed out that it was rather unusual for a leader to be >> > killed >> > in police action. Typically, leaders in such situations are surrounded by >> > workers and never directly exposed in an incident of the sort that took >> > place as the marchers approached Uri. >> > >> > Also, at the first signs of tough action, the leaders were whisked away >> > with >> > some help of the local cop always mindful of their stature. >> > >> > Narayanan said that investigations have established that the bullets >> which >> > felled the separatist leader were not fired by security forces. >> > >> > NSA disclosure points to Pak hand in unrest >> > >> > The disturbing disclosure ties in with the suspicion that Pakistan-backed >> > separatists have been stoking passion to put their agenda back on >> > centrestage. >> > >> > Importantly, Pakistan-backed elements have organised assassinations and >> > then >> > blame these on India to further their interests, killings of Mirwaiz Omar >> > Farooq's father and Abdul Ghani Lone being the two cases in point. >> > >> > Also, Hurriyat leaders remain bitterly divided, with all the unity >> efforts >> > coming unstuck after temporary truces. >> > >> > There are no clear accounts of the situation prevailing during the move >> to >> > transport trucks carrying fruits across the LoC but the death of Aziz and >> > other civilians became a rallying point for separatists and lead >> anti-India >> > groups abroad to condemn Indian "state repression." >> > The separatists seized on the Amarnath land-for-pilgrims plan as an >> > emotive >> > issue to fire up sentiments over "demographic" change by way of "Hindu" >> > settlements in the Valley, the march was aimed to stir up the Valley to >> > slogans like "apni mandi, Rawalpindi." >> > >> > Aziz's death only helped stir opinion in the Valley, proving to be a >> > catalyst which turned an agitation against an "economic blockade" of the >> > Valley into a full-throated cry for "azadi." >> > >> > -- >> > Rashneek Kher >> > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy >> > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com >> > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > -- > Rashneek Kher > Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy > http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com > http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From indersalim at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 18:33:32 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:33:32 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] land and freedom : by Arundhati Roy Message-ID: <47e122a70808220603t440b5bfcn7ae49e80cd678a53@mail.gmail.com> LAND AND FREEDOM BY ARUNDHATI ROY IN THE GUARDIAN. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/22/kashmir.india For the past 60 days or so, since about the end of June, the people of Kashmir have been free. Free in the most profound sense. They have shrugged off the terror of living their lives in the gun-sights of half a million heavily armed soldiers, in the most densely militarised zone in the world. After 18 years of administering a military occupation, the Indian government's worst nightmare has come true. Having declared that the militant movement has been crushed, it is now faced with a non-violent mass protest, but not the kind it knows how to manage. This one is nourished by people's memory of years of repression in which tens of thousands have been killed, thousands have been "disappeared", hundreds of thousands tortured, injured, and humiliated. That kind of rage, once it finds utterance, cannot easily be tamed, rebottled and sent back to where it came from. A sudden twist of fate, an ill-conceived move over the transfer of 100 acres of state forest land to the Amarnath Shrine Board (which manages the annual Hindu pilgrimage to a cave deep in the Kashmir Himalayas) suddenly became the equivalent of tossing a lit match into a barrel of petrol. Until 1989 the Amarnath pilgrimage used to attract about 20,000 people who travelled to the Amarnath cave over a period of about two weeks. In 1990, when the overtly Islamist militant uprising in the valley coincided with the spread of virulent Hindu nationalism (Hindutva) in the Indian plains, the number of pilgrims began to increase exponentially. By 2008 more than 500,000 pilgrims visited the Amarnath cave, in large groups, their passage often sponsored by Indian business houses. To many people in the valley this dramatic increase in numbers was seen as an aggressive political statement by an increasingly Hindu-fundamentalist Indian state. Rightly or wrongly, the land transfer was viewed as the thin edge of the wedge. It triggered an apprehension that it was the beginning of an elaborate plan to build Israeli-style settlements, and change the demography of the valley. Days of massive protest forced the valley to shut down completely. Within hours the protests spread from the cities to villages. Young stone pelters took to the streets and faced armed police who fired straight at them, killing several. For people as well as the government, it resurrected memories of the uprising in the early 90s. Throughout the weeks of protest, hartal (strikes) and police firing, while the Hindutva publicity machine charged Kashmiris with committing every kind of communal excess, the 500,000 Amarnath pilgrims completed their pilgrimage, not just unhurt, but touched by the hospitality they had been shown by local people. Eventually, taken completely by surprise at the ferocity of the response, the government revoked the land transfer. But by then the land-transfer had become what Syed Ali Shah Geelani, the most senior and also the most overtly Islamist separatist leader, called a "non-issue". Massive protests against the revocation erupted in Jammu. There, too, the issue snowballed into something much bigger. Hindus began to raise issues of neglect and discrimination by the Indian state. (For some odd reason they blamed Kashmiris for that neglect.) The protests led to the blockading of the Jammu-Srinagar highway, the only functional road-link between Kashmir and India. Truckloads of perishable fresh fruit and valley produce began to rot. The blockade demonstrated in no uncertain terms to people in Kashmir that they lived on sufferance, and that if they didn't behave themselves they could be put under siege, starved, deprived of essential commodities and medical supplies. To expect matters to end there was of course absurd. Hadn't anybody noticed that in Kashmir even minor protests about civic issues like water and electricity inevitably turned into demands for azadi, freedom? To threaten them with mass starvation amounted to committing political suicide. Not surprisingly, the voice that the government of India has tried so hard to silence in Kashmir has massed into a deafening roar. Raised in a playground of army camps, checkpoints, and bunkers, with screams from torture chambers for a soundtrack, the young generation has suddenly discovered the power of mass protest, and above all, the dignity of being able to straighten their shoulders and speak for themselves, represent themselves. For them it is nothing short of an epiphany. Not even the fear of death seems to hold them back. And once that fear has gone, of what use is the largest or second largest army in the world? There have been mass rallies in the past, but none in recent memory that have been so sustained and widespread. The mainstream political parties of Kashmir - National Conference and People's Democratic party - appear dutifully for debates in New Delhi's TV studios, but can't muster the courage to appear on the streets of Kashmir. The armed militants who, through the worst years of repression were seen as the only ones carrying the torch of azadi forward, if they are around at all, seem content to take a back seat and let people do the fighting for a change. The separatist leaders who do appear and speak at the rallies are not leaders so much as followers, being guided by the phenomenal spontaneous energy of a caged, enraged people that has exploded on Kashmir's streets. Day after day, hundreds of thousands of people swarm around places that hold terrible memories for them. They demolish bunkers, break through cordons of concertina wire and stare straight down the barrels of soldiers' machine guns, saying what very few in India want to hear. Hum Kya Chahtey? Azadi! (We want freedom.) And, it has to be said, in equal numbers and with equal intensity: Jeevey jeevey Pakistan. (Long live Pakistan.) That sound reverberates through the valley like the drumbeat of steady rain on a tin roof, like the roll of thunder during an electric storm. On August 15, India's independence day, Lal Chowk, the nerve centre of Srinagar, was taken over by thousands of people who hoisted the Pakistani flag and wished each other "happy belated independence day" (Pakistan celebrates independence on August 14) and "happy slavery day". Humour obviously, has survived India's many torture centres and Abu Ghraibs in Kashmir. On August 16 more than 300,000 people marched to Pampore, to the village of the Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Abdul Aziz, who was shot down in cold blood five days earlier. On the night of August 17 the police sealed the city. Streets were barricaded, thousands of armed police manned the barriers. The roads leading into Srinagar were blocked. On the morning of August 18, people began pouring into Srinagar from villages and towns across the valley. In trucks, tempos, jeeps, buses and on foot. Once again, barriers were broken and people reclaimed their city. The police were faced with a choice of either stepping aside or executing a massacre. They stepped aside. Not a single bullet was fired. The city floated on a sea of smiles. There was ecstasy in the air. Everyone had a banner; houseboat owners, traders, students, lawyers, doctors. One said: "We are all prisoners, set us free." Another said: "Democracy without freedom is demon-crazy." Demon-crazy. That was a good one. Perhaps he was referring to the insanity that permits the world's largest democracy to administer the world's largest military occupation and continue to call itself a democracy. There was a green flag on every lamp post, every roof, every bus stop and on the top of chinar trees. A big one fluttered outside the All India Radio building. Road signs were painted over. Rawalpindi they said. Or simply Pakistan. It would be a mistake to assume that the public expression of affection for Pakistan automatically translates into a desire to accede to Pakistan. Some of it has to do with gratitude for the support - cynical or otherwise - for what Kashmiris see as their freedom struggle, and the Indian state sees as a terrorist campaign. It also has to do with mischief. With saying and doing what galls India most of all. (It's easy to scoff at the idea of a "freedom struggle" that wishes to distance itself from a country that is supposed to be a democracy and align itself with another that has, for the most part been ruled by military dictators. A country whose army has committed genocide in what is now Bangladesh. A country that is even now being torn apart by its own ethnic war. These are important questions, but right now perhaps it's more useful to wonder what this so-called democracy did in Kashmir to make people hate it so?) Everywhere there were Pakistani flags, everywhere the cry Pakistan se rishta kya? La illaha illallah. (What is our bond with Pakistan? There is no god but Allah.) Azadi ka matlab kya? La illaha illallah. (What does freedom mean? There is no god but Allah.) For somebody like myself, who is not Muslim, that interpretation of freedom is hard - if not impossible - to understand. I asked a young woman whether freedom for Kashmir would not mean less freedom for her, as a woman. She shrugged and said "What kind of freedom do we have now? The freedom to be raped by Indian soldiers?" Her reply silenced me. Surrounded by a sea of green flags, it was impossible to doubt or ignore the deeply Islamic fervour of the uprising taking place around me. It was equally impossible to label it a vicious, terrorist jihad. For Kashmiris it was a catharsis. A historical moment in a long and complicated struggle for freedom with all the imperfections, cruelties and confusions that freedom struggles have. This one cannot by any means call itself pristine, and will always be stigmatised by, and will some day, I hope, have to account for, among other things, the brutal killings of Kashmiri Pandits in the early years of the uprising, culminating in the exodus of almost the entire Hindu community from the Kashmir valley. As the crowd continued to swell I listened carefully to the slogans, because rhetoric often holds the key to all kinds of understanding. There were plenty of insults and humiliation for India: Ay jabiron ay zalimon, Kashmir hamara chhod do (Oh oppressors, Oh wicked ones, Get out of our Kashmir.) The slogan that cut through me like a knife and clean broke my heart was this one: Nanga bhookha Hindustan, jaan se pyaara Pakistan. (Naked, starving India, More precious than life itself - Pakistan.) Why was it so galling, so painful to listen to this? I tried to work it out and settled on three reasons. First, because we all know that the first part of the slogan is the embarrassing and unadorned truth about India, the emerging superpower. Second, because all Indians who are not nanga or bhooka are and have been complicit in complex and historical ways with the elaborate cultural and economic systems that make Indian society so cruel, so vulgarly unequal. And third, because it was painful to listen to people who have suffered so much themselves mock others who suffer, in different ways, but no less intensely, under the same oppressor. In that slogan I saw the seeds of how easily victims can become perpetrators. Syed Ali Shah Geelani began his address with a recitation from the Qur'an. He then said what he has said before, on hundreds of occasions. The only way for the struggle to succeed, he said, was to turn to the Qur'an for guidance. He said Islam would guide the struggle and that it was a complete social and moral code that would govern the people of a free Kashmir. He said Pakistan had been created as the home of Islam, and that that goal should never be subverted. He said just as Pakistan belonged to Kashmir, Kashmir belonged to Pakistan. He said minority communities would have full rights and their places of worship would be safe. Each point he made was applauded. I imagined myself standing in the heart of a Hindu nationalist rally being addressed by the Bharatiya Janata party's (BJP) LK Advani. Replace the word Islam with the word Hindutva, replace the word Pakistan with Hindustan, replace the green flags with saffron ones and we would have the BJP's nightmare vision of an ideal India. Is that what we should accept as our future? Monolithic religious states handing down a complete social and moral code, "a complete way of life"? Millions of us in India reject the Hindutva project. Our rejection springs from love, from passion, from a kind of idealism, from having enormous emotional stakes in the society in which we live. What our neighbours do, how they choose to handle their affairs does not affect our argument, it only strengthens it. Arguments that spring from love are also fraught with danger. It is for the people of Kashmir to agree or disagree with the Islamist project (which is as contested, in equally complex ways, all over the world by Muslims, as Hindutva is contested by Hindus). Perhaps now that the threat of violence has receded and there is some space in which to debate views and air ideas, it is time for those who are part of the struggle to outline a vision for what kind of society they are fighting for. Perhaps it is time to offer people something more than martyrs, slogans and vague generalisations. Those who wish to turn to the Qur'an for guidance will no doubt find guidance there. But what of those who do not wish to do that, or for whom the Qur'an does not make place? Do the Hindus of Jammu and other minorities also have the right to self-determination? Will the hundreds of thousands of Kashmiri Pandits living in exile, many of them in terrible poverty, have the right to return? Will they be paid reparations for the terrible losses they have suffered? Or will a free Kashmir do to its minorities what India has done to Kashmiris for 61 years? What will happen to homosexuals and adulterers and blasphemers? What of thieves and lafangas and writers who do not agree with the "complete social and moral code"? Will we be put to death as we are in Saudi Arabia? Will the cycle of death, repression and bloodshed continue? History offers many models for Kashmir's thinkers and intellectuals and politicians to study. What will the Kashmir of their dreams look like? Algeria? Iran? South Africa? Switzerland? Pakistan? At a crucial time like this, few things are more important than dreams. A lazy utopia and a flawed sense of justice will have consequences that do not bear thinking about. This is not the time for intellectual sloth or a reluctance to assess a situation clearly and honestly. Already the spectre of partition has reared its head. Hindutva networks are alive with rumours about Hindus in the valley being attacked and forced to flee. In response, phone calls from Jammu reported that an armed Hindu militia was threatening a massacre and that Muslims from the two Hindu majority districts were preparing to flee. Memories of the bloodbath that ensued and claimed the lives of more than a million people when India and Pakistan were partitioned have come flooding back. That nightmare will haunt all of us forever. However, none of these fears of what the future holds can justify the continued military occupation of a nation and a people. No more than the old colonial argument about how the natives were not ready for freedom justified the colonial project. Of course there are many ways for the Indian state to continue to hold on to Kashmir. It could do what it does best. Wait. And hope the people's energy will dissipate in the absence of a concrete plan. It could try and fracture the fragile coalition that is emerging. It could extinguish this non-violent uprising and re-invite armed militancy. It could increase the number of troops from half a million to a whole million. A few strategic massacres, a couple of targeted assassinations, some disappearances and a massive round of arrests should do the trick for a few more years. The unimaginable sums of public money that are needed to keep the military occupation of Kashmir going is money that ought by right to be spent on schools and hospitals and food for an impoverished, malnutritioned population in India. What kind of government can possibly believe that it has the right to spend it on more weapons, more concertina wire and more prisons in Kashmir? The Indian military occupation of Kashmir makes monsters of us all. It allows Hindu chauvinists to target and victimise Muslims in India by holding them hostage to the freedom struggle being waged by Muslims in Kashmir. India needs azadi from Kashmir just as much as - if not more than - Kashmir needs azadi from India. · Arundhati Roy, 2008. A longer version of this article will be available tomorrow at outlookindia.com. -- From indersalim at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 18:42:38 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:42:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808220521o228ecdbepbd014af89224a07a@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808220521o228ecdbepbd014af89224a07a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808220612g71cf3376m3d79ad119fbb919e@mail.gmail.com> Dear Pawan ji this is perhaps high time to notice that how we can go wrong. this applies to all of us. i repeat, all of us with love is On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 5:51 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Some people never change, interestingly in february 2007, a person had > written the following to Shivam : > http://www.sandeepweb.com/2007/02/20/dear-shivam-vij/ > > Dear Shivam vij , > > If you want to bash Hinduism/caste system/whatever, do it based on > *solid* understanding > of the issue you're writing about. But when you write absolute > nonsense > that > stems from the dark depths of your abysmal ignorance, > > Not that I expect you to condescend and respond to this post… > > PS: No wonder this appeared in *Tehelka*. > > > I am awaiting the next post from dear friend Shivam. He > has definitely arrived. > > Jeeve Jeeve "Abysmal Ignorance" Jeeve . > > Yahan Kya Chalega ...Abysmal Ignorance > > Regards > > Pawan Durani > > > > > > > > On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 5:29 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > >> Dear Shivam. >> >> I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" >> in the subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark >> about KP "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was >> saddened to read them. >> >> Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir >> valley by the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any >> community. And even if communities get vilified in this debate by >> some of its participants, I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As >> a journalist whose work I respect, I expect much better of you. >> >> I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had >> forwarded does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress >> politician, or that they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we >> assume that they were nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were >> raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, >> though reprehensible, is not an act of terrorism. To say it is to >> mirror the tactics of those who poison every discussion on these >> matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix "Islamic" to >> terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu >> terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. >> >> Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC >> slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set >> fire to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally >> inappropriate to tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" >> terrorism, so, too I think it is totally inappropriate and uncalled >> for on your part to tag this report with the headline "Hindu >> Terrorism in Jammu" >> >> This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I >> would urge everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and >> thoughtful while forwarding posts. >> >> best, >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >> >> > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader >> > >> > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN >> > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ >> > Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms >> > >> > >> > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the >> > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on >> > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief >> > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters >> > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) >> > >> > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a >> > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods >> > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the >> > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising >> > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in >> > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby >> > police nakka," a police officer said. >> > >> > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs >> > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar >> > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and >> > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other >> > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent >> > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra >> > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. >> > >> > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene >> > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several >> > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior >> > official said. >> > >> > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral >> > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across >> > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register >> > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". >> > >> > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, >> > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic >> > blockade left at least 22 people dead. >> > >> > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse >> > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying >> > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an >> > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. >> > >> > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The >> > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress >> > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She >> > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against >> > "imperialism". >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS >> Raqs Media Collective >> shuddha at sarai.net >> www.sarai.net >> www.raqsmediacollective.net >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 22 18:54:12 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:54:12 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] land and freedom : by Arundhati Roy In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808220603t440b5bfcn7ae49e80cd678a53@mail.gmail.com> References: <47e122a70808220603t440b5bfcn7ae49e80cd678a53@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Inder, Thank you for posting this text which appeared in the Guardian today. As it says at the end > A longer version of this article will be > available tomorrow at outlookindia.com. It will be interesting to see what the longer version contains, as I am sure that some of the nuances in Roy's text have had to be dropped (in this version) for reasons of brevity in the newspaper format of the Guardian. regards Shuddha On 22-Aug-08, at 6:33 PM, inder salim wrote: > LAND AND FREEDOM BY ARUNDHATI ROY IN THE GUARDIAN. > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/22/kashmir.india > > > > For the past 60 days or so, since about the end of June, the people of > Kashmir have been free. Free in the most profound sense. They have > shrugged off the terror of living their lives in the gun-sights of > half a million heavily armed soldiers, in the most densely militarised > zone in the world. > > After 18 years of administering a military occupation, the Indian > government's worst nightmare has come true. Having declared that the > militant movement has been crushed, it is now faced with a non-violent > mass protest, but not the kind it knows how to manage. This one is > nourished by people's memory of years of repression in which tens of > thousands have been killed, thousands have been "disappeared", > hundreds of thousands tortured, injured, and humiliated. That kind of > rage, once it finds utterance, cannot easily be tamed, rebottled and > sent back to where it came from. > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 22 19:08:34 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 19:08:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808220612g71cf3376m3d79ad119fbb919e@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808220521o228ecdbepbd014af89224a07a@mail.gmail.com> <47e122a70808220612g71cf3376m3d79ad119fbb919e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808220638m6f7f29c6g4bc51a2579ca6be@mail.gmail.com> Dear All, I would request that individual replies should be marked to individuals only,what has the rest of group to do with it ? These are basics. Regards Pawan On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 6:42 PM, inder salim wrote: > Dear Pawan ji > > this is perhaps high time to notice that how we can go wrong. this > applies to all of us. i repeat, all of us > > > with love > is > > > On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 5:51 PM, Pawan Durani > wrote: > > Some people never change, interestingly in february 2007, a person had > > written the following to Shivam : > > http://www.sandeepweb.com/2007/02/20/dear-shivam-vij/ > > > > Dear Shivam vij , > > > > If you want to bash Hinduism/caste system/whatever, do it based on > > *solid* understanding > > of the issue you're writing about. But when you write absolute > > nonsense< > http://www.shivamvij.com/2007/02/the-stain-that-just-wont-wash.html> > > that > > stems from the dark depths of your abysmal ignorance, > > > > Not that I expect you to condescend and respond to this post… > > > > PS: No wonder this appeared in *Tehelka*. > > > > > > I am awaiting the next post from dear friend Shivam. He > > has definitely arrived. > > > > Jeeve Jeeve "Abysmal Ignorance" Jeeve . > > > > Yahan Kya Chalega ...Abysmal Ignorance > > > > Regards > > > > Pawan Durani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Aug 22, 2008 at 5:29 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta < > shuddha at sarai.net>wrote: > > > >> Dear Shivam. > >> > >> I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > >> in the subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark > >> about KP "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was > >> saddened to read them. > >> > >> Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir > >> valley by the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any > >> community. And even if communities get vilified in this debate by > >> some of its participants, I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As > >> a journalist whose work I respect, I expect much better of you. > >> > >> I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had > >> forwarded does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress > >> politician, or that they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we > >> assume that they were nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were > >> raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, > >> though reprehensible, is not an act of terrorism. To say it is to > >> mirror the tactics of those who poison every discussion on these > >> matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix "Islamic" to > >> terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu > >> terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. > >> > >> Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC > >> slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set > >> fire to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally > >> inappropriate to tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" > >> terrorism, so, too I think it is totally inappropriate and uncalled > >> for on your part to tag this report with the headline "Hindu > >> Terrorism in Jammu" > >> > >> This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I > >> would urge everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and > >> thoughtful while forwarding posts. > >> > >> best, > >> > >> Shuddha > >> > >> > >> > >> On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > >> > >> > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > >> > > >> > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > >> > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ > >> > Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > >> > > >> > > >> > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > >> > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > >> > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > >> > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > >> > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > >> > > >> > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > >> > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > >> > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > >> > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > >> > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > >> > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > >> > police nakka," a police officer said. > >> > > >> > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > >> > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > >> > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > >> > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > >> > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > >> > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > >> > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > >> > > >> > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > >> > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > >> > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > >> > official said. > >> > > >> > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > >> > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > >> > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > >> > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > >> > > >> > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > >> > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > >> > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > >> > > >> > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > >> > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > >> > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > >> > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > >> > > >> > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > >> > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > >> > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > >> > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > >> > "imperialism". > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> > subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> The Sarai Programme at CSDS > >> Raqs Media Collective > >> shuddha at sarai.net > >> www.sarai.net > >> www.raqsmediacollective.net > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > http://indersalim.livejournal.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Fri Aug 22 22:47:32 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 10:17:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <239700.12127.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Shuddha   Many of your positions are contrary to mine on matters that often come up for discussion on SARAI.   But it is a post like this one that further deepens the respect I already have for your sincerity. I am also a great admirer of your brilliance.   Thank you for the post.   Kshmendra --- On Fri, 8/22/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line To: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" Cc: "sarai list" Date: Friday, August 22, 2008, 5:29 PM Dear Shivam. I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" in the subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark about KP "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was saddened to read them. Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley by the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. And even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its participants, I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose work I respect, I expect much better of you. I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had forwarded does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress politician, or that they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that they were nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not an act of terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison every discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set fire to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally inappropriate to tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, so, too I think it is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this report with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I would urge everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while forwarding posts. best, Shuddha On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ > Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > police nakka," a police officer said. > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > official said. > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > "imperialism". > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From taraprakash at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 00:27:24 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 14:57:24 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> Shivam and all. Shivam seems to have fallen prey to the hindu/muslim binary and seems to have decided to join the right side of the slash. You are losing objectivity. You are homodgenizing and communalizing, RSSizing. Please come back to the standards you are known to uphold. Regards ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" To: "sarai list" Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 5:47 AM Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > police nakka," a police officer said. > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > official said. > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > "imperialism". > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 00:39:05 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 00:39:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu In-Reply-To: <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> Message-ID: <6353c690808221209t5d41ffa0g5f2c720983df726b@mail.gmail.com> Shivam.... you really need a doctor.... Don't think you'll get famous by these cheap means...!! Seems you have got some good lessons from some Islamic Fundamentalists in Kashmir during your long stay there..! It only reflects in your meaningless posts since then. You aren't a journalist anymore....right ? On 8/23/08, TaraPrakash wrote: > > Shivam and all. Shivam seems to have fallen prey to the hindu/muslim binary > and seems to have decided to join the right side of the slash. > > You are losing objectivity. You are homodgenizing and communalizing, > RSSizing. Please come back to the standards you are known to uphold. > > Regards > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > To: "sarai list" > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 5:47 AM > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > official said. > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > "imperialism". > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 08:52:39 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 08:52:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu Agitation against Islamic Fundamentalists - Secular Campaign for last 55 days... Message-ID: <6353c690808222022r3f5f04ebhbb8771787ae59bd0@mail.gmail.com> *With painted faces & flags, kids march to court arrest* *Jammu, August 21, 2008* Link - http://www.hindustantimes.com/Mobile/Pages/StoryPage.aspx?ID=327de271-ff2f-4dd3-9783-b3c5be504eb6&BC=Home Her cheeks painted in tricolour and a marigold garland around her neck, 10-year-old Hemalata was out on the streets of Jammu on Wednesday — to . She could be mistaken for a cheering cricket fan or an enthusiastic schoolgirl about to take part in a fancy fete. But Hemalata thought she should join the processions "for the sake of the country — to press for a piece of land for Amarnath's Bhole Baba". She was headed for a police station in Rehari. On Tuesday, the government announced an indefinite curfew in Jammu and warned against bringing children to court arrest, as it was against the law. But this morning, they came out, chanting "Yeh diwane kahan chale, jail chale bhai jail chale" (Where are these frenzied people going? They are going to jails). Unable to cope with the rush of women, men and, now children, courting arrest, policemen looked quite harassed on the third day of the Jammu agitators' "Jail Bharo" programme. "We cannot detain kids, I tell them," said Arun Kotwal, a sub-inspector at Rehari, as protesters wanted to know why he hadn't put up makeshift tents or called for water tankers. For nearly 50 days, residents have voluntarily shut down everything. But, how long can it go on? Sheetal Arjunwal, a councilor supervising a community kitchen, said: "The land transfer is only one of the issues. People are out to disprove what New Delhi believes — that it can wear us out." B.S. Salathia, president of Jammu Bar Association, said: "The authorities want to use force against us for waving the national flag, but think of the compensation for those waving the Pakistani flag in the Valley." A Congress activist, Salathia did not think the BJP was behind the upsurge. "The BJP gave the first call for bandh because it does not have to bother about the Valley. But, after that, it is the Sangharsh Samiti — that includes us all." Agreeing with him, Ashok Khajuria, state BJP chief, said: "We are not looking for credit now. We are part of the people's movement. When the elections come, the people can decide." Khwaja Mohammed Rashid, a lawyer from Poonch, said: "There is no Hindu-Muslim divide here. The Valley leaders come to us for votes in the name of Islam. But once the polls are over, they don't bother about Muslims outside the valley. No jobs are created. No college seats are available. All money goes to the valley." From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 10:39:06 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 10:39:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Denmark to host the UN Climate Summit Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808222209i215531cficf17179e69cccc8b@mail.gmail.com> Denmark is to host the UN climate summit, COP 15, in 2009. This is clear after the group of Latin American and Caribbean countries have decided to "swap" their status as host with the group of West European and other nations that have nominated Denmark as host for the 2009 Summit. The decision to change host was based on Denmark's offer to host the COP 15 in 2009; the year in which Denmark and the EU will push for a new international climate agreement. *"This is a great day for Danish environment policy. We will lead the way in one of the most important environmental challenges facing our generation, and together with the government I will fight to ensure that our efforts bear fruit, so that Denmark's hosting of the summit also benefits the global climate"*, says Minister for the Environment Connie Hedegaard (Conservative) and she continues: *"I look forward to this important task. The government has worked hard to host the Summit, because it will give Denmark a unique opportunity to further the international climate agenda in the years to come. Our goal is a new global agreement in 2009 on CO2 reductions after 2012, when the Kyoto Protocol expires. We know that it will be a long and hard battle to reach this goal because there are still many central players who are both reticent and reluctant. However, the Danish government is prepared to take the lead in this long haul. And we are pleased that at the EU summit recently, Denmark succeeded in achieving a joint EU position that a new agreement should replace the Kyoto Protocol no later than 2009"*, says Ms Connie Hedegaard (Conservative). It is now a reality that Denmark will host the Summit even though it will not be formally announced in the UN until later this year. The group of Western European and other nations have agreed to support Denmark's candidacy. *"Today Denmark enjoys solid international recognition, not least because we have succeeded in decoupling economic growth and energy consumption over the past decades, but also via our ambitious reduction commitment with regard to the Kyoto Protocol, the so-called Greenland Dialogue, that was launched on Denmark's initiative, and also because of Denmark's leading position within wind energy and energy efficiency. Denmark's hosting of the summit is therefore a unique opportunity to brand Denmark and to show the world what we can do in Denmark. It could be an excellent showcase for Danish enterprises and therefore also a platform for increased exports and new foreign investments. At the same time it will be an extraordinary opportunity for our capital to profile itself towards the many international guests"*, says Ms Hedegaard. Already in Arpil, the Danish Government will host the Asia-Europe Environment Ministers' meeting, and in May the Danish Minister for the Environment will be going to the US to address the American senate about climate challenges and other environmental issues. *For additional information contact:* - Thomas Becker, Head of division, Danish Ministry of the Environment, tel. +45 33 92 76 70 and +45 29 61 70 10 or - Peter Stensgaard Mørch, Head of Press, Danish Ministry of the Environment, tel. +45 33 92 74 92 and +45 20 72 47 00 From mail at shivamvij.com Sat Aug 23 13:15:40 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 13:15:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808230045tb265e4drb1fa6ec21c80ec89@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shuddha, I admit I should have been more discreet and that in both cases, my comments did amount to vilifying a community ("Hindus" and "Kashmiri Pandits") and apologise for both. However in the case of "Hindu terrorism" I want explain my intent. On this list and elsewhere even non-violent protests in the Valley are resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists'. The problem here is not one of vilification, but that once you have labelled someone using violence for political purposes a terrorist you have explained away everything there was to explain. The condemnation of violence becomes the condemnation of politics. It was to that sort of loose usage of the word "terrorists" that I was rhetorically responding to - meaning to say, that if 'Hindu' mobs use violence, then that too, should be brushed aside as "terrorism". Instead, we have been sold the "Jammu is burning" line as if someone from outside Jammu had set it on fire. However, I ought to have explained as much while posting the news report on the attack on the Jammu Congress leader's car and the threat to his life and not merely have left a provocative yet lazy one-liner in the subject line. I completely agree with you when you say: > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley by > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. Once again, apologies. Shivam On 8/22/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Shivam. > > > > > I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" in the > subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark about KP > "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was saddened to read > them. > > > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley by > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. And > even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its participants, > I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose work I > respect, I expect much better of you. > > > > > I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had forwarded > does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress politician, or that > they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that they were > nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP > and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not an act of > terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison every > discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix > "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu > terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. > > > > > Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC > slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set fire > to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally inappropriate to > tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, so, too I think it > is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this report > with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > > > > > This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I would urge > everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while > forwarding posts. > > > > > best, > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > official said. > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > "imperialism". > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > > Raqs Media Collective > > shuddha at sarai.net > > www.sarai.net > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Sat Aug 23 13:17:09 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 13:17:09 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu In-Reply-To: <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808230047l311f4297kd1121cecca59ccef@mail.gmail.com> Dear TaraPrakash, See my response to Shuddha's response on this, in which I write: "However in the case of "Hindu terrorism" I want explain my intent. On this list and elsewhere even non-violent protests in the Valley are resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists'. The problem here is not one of vilification, but that once you have labelled someone using violence for political purposes a terrorist you have explained away everything there was to explain. The condemnation of violence becomes the condemnation of politics. "It was to that sort of loose usage of the word "terrorists" that I was rhetorically responding to - meaning to say, that if 'Hindu' mobs use violence, then that too, should be brushed aside as "terrorism". Instead, we have been sold the "Jammu is burning" line as if someone from outside Jammu had set it on fire." best shivam On 8/23/08, TaraPrakash wrote: > Shivam and all. Shivam seems to have fallen prey to the hindu/muslim binary > and seems to have decided to join the right side of the slash. > > You are losing objectivity. You are homodgenizing and communalizing, > RSSizing. Please come back to the standards you are known to uphold. > > Regards > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > > To: "sarai list" > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 5:47 AM > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > > > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > official said. > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > "imperialism". > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 13:21:33 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 13:21:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808230045tb265e4drb1fa6ec21c80ec89@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808230045tb265e4drb1fa6ec21c80ec89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808230051s118e1b21s1220fc162933df55@mail.gmail.com> And the apology would have been incomplete without re-asserting the support to separatists................ Doesn't matter anyway......your writings are as much important to us as the import of apples from Cambodia. Pawan On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Dear Shuddha, > > I admit I should have been more discreet and that in both cases, my > comments did amount to vilifying a community ("Hindus" and "Kashmiri > Pandits") and apologise for both. > > However in the case of "Hindu terrorism" I want explain my intent. On > this list and elsewhere even non-violent protests in the Valley are > resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists'. The > problem here is not one of vilification, but that once you have > labelled someone using violence for political purposes a terrorist you > have explained away everything there was to explain. The condemnation > of violence becomes the condemnation of politics. > > It was to that sort of loose usage of the word "terrorists" that I was > rhetorically responding to - meaning to say, that if 'Hindu' mobs use > violence, then that too, should be brushed aside as "terrorism". > Instead, we have been sold the "Jammu is burning" line as if someone > from outside Jammu had set it on fire. > > However, I ought to have explained as much while posting the news > report on the attack on the Jammu Congress leader's car and the threat > to his life and not merely have left a provocative yet lazy one-liner > in the subject line. > > I completely agree with you when you say: > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley > by > > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. > > Once again, apologies. > Shivam > > > On 8/22/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > Dear Shivam. > > > > > > > > > > I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" in > the > > subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark about KP > > "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was saddened to > read > > them. > > > > > > > > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley > by > > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. And > > even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its > participants, > > I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose work I > > respect, I expect much better of you. > > > > > > > > > > I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had > forwarded > > does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress politician, or that > > they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that they were > > nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising 'Anti-Congress, > PDP > > and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not an act > of > > terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison every > > discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix > > "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or > Hindu > > terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. > > > > > > > > > > Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC > > slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set > fire > > to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally inappropriate > to > > tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, so, too I think > it > > is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this report > > with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > > > > > > > > > > This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I would > urge > > everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while > > forwarding posts. > > > > > > > > > > best, > > > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > > > official said. > > > > > > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > > > "imperialism". > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe > > in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > > > > Raqs Media Collective > > > > shuddha at sarai.net > > > > www.sarai.net > > > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 14:41:56 2008 From: shuddha at gmail.com (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 14:41:56 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Azadi' by Arundhati Roy Message-ID: <4D9AD2B3-AA00-4D51-8E19-0CCF47EA0823@sarai.net> Dear all, Here is the longer version of the text that Inder Salim had forwarded as 'Land and Freedom' (published in the Guardian). This essay has been published in the latest issue of Outlook Magazine, (Azadi for Kashmir, Azadi for India, Septeber 01, 2008) regards Shuddha ------------------------- Azadi by Arundhati Roy Outlook Magazine, September 01, 2008 http://www.outlookindia.com/full.asp?fodname=20080901&fname=Arundhati +Roy+(F)&sid=1&pn=1 For the past sixty days or so, since about the end of June, the people of Kashmir have been free. Free in the most profound sense. They have shrugged off the terror of living their lives in the gun- sights of half-a-million heavily-armed soldiers in the most densely militarised zone in the world. After 18 years of administering a military occupation, the Indian government's worst nightmare has come true. Having declared that the militant movement has been crushed, it is now faced with a non- violent mass protest, but not the kind it knows how to manage. The Indian government's worst nightmare has come true. Having declared that the militant movement has been crushed, it is now faced with a non-violent mass protest, but not the kind it knows how to manage. This one is nourished by people's memory of years of repression in which tens of thousands have been killed, thousands have been 'disappeared', hundreds of thousands tortured, injured, raped and humiliated. That kind of rage, once it finds utterance, cannot easily be tamed, re-bottled and sent back to where it came from. For all these years, theIndian State, known amongst the knowing as the Deep State, has done everything it can to subvert, suppress, represent, misrepresent, discredit, interpret, intimidate, purchase— and simply snuff out the voice of the Kashmiri people. It has used money (lots of it), violence (lots of it), disinformation, propaganda, torture, elaborate networks of collaborators and informers, terror, imprisonment, blackmail and rigged elections to subdue what democrats would call "the will of the people". But now the Deep State, as Deep States eventually tend to, has tripped on its own hubris and bought into its own publicity. It made the mistake of believing that domination was victory, that the 'normalcy' it had enforced through the barrel of a gun was indeed normal, and that the people's sullen silence was acquiescence. The well-endowed peace industry, speaking on people's behalf, informed us that "Kashmiris are tired of violence and want peace". What kind of peace they were willing to settle for was never clarified. Bollywood's cache of Kashmir/Muslim-terrorist films has brainwashed most Indians into believing that all of Kashmir's sorrows could be laid at the door of evil, people-hating terrorists. To anybody who cared to ask, or, more importantly, to listen, it was always clear that even in their darkest moments, people in Kashmir had kept the fires burning and that it was not peace they yearned for, but freedom too. Over the last two months, the carefully confected picture of an innocent people trapped between 'two guns', both equally hated, has, pardon the pun, been shot to hell. A sudden twist of fate, an ill-conceived move over the transfer of 100 acres of state forest land to the Amarnath Shrine Board (which manages the annual Hindu pilgrimage to a cave deep in the Kashmir Himalayas) suddenly became the equivalent of tossing a lit match into a barrel of petrol. Until 1989, the Amarnath pilgrimage used to attract about 20,000 people who travelled to the Amarnath cave over a period of about two weeks. In 1990, when the overtly Islamic militant uprising in the Valley coincided with the spread of virulent Hindutva in the Indian plains, the number of pilgrims began to increase exponentially. By 2008, more than 5,00,000 pilgrims visited the Amarnath cave in large groups, their passage often sponsored by Indian business houses. To many people in the Valley, this dramatic increase in numbers was seen as an aggressive political statement by an increasingly Hindu-fundamentalist Indian State. Rightly or wrongly, the land transfer was viewed as the thin edge of the wedge. It triggered an apprehension that it was the beginning of an elaborate plan to build Israeli-style settlements, and change the demography of the Valley. Days of massive protest forced the Valley to shut down completely. Within hours, the protests spread from the cities to villages. Young stone-pelters took to the streets and faced armed police who fired straight at them, killing several. For people as well as the government, it resurrected memories of the uprising in the early '90s. Throughout the weeks of protest, hartal and police firing, while the Hindutva publicity machine charged Kashmiris with committing every kind of communal excess, the 5,00,000 Amarnath pilgrims completed their pilgrimage, not just unhurt, but touched by the hospitality they had been shown by local people. Eventually, taken completely by surprise at the ferocity of the response, the government revoked the land transfer.Hadn't anybody noticed that in Kashmir even minor protests about civic issues like water and electricity inevitably turned into demands for azadi? To threaten them with mass starvation amounted to committing political suicide.But by then the land transfer had become what senior separatist leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani called a "non-issue". Massive protests against the revocation erupted in Jammu. There, too, the issue snowballed into something much bigger. Hindus began to raise issues of neglect and discrimination by the Indian State. (For some odd reason they blamed Kashmiris for that neglect.) The protests led to the blockading of the Jammu-Srinagar highway, the only functional road link between Kashmir and India. The army was called out to clear the highway and allow safe passage of trucks between Jammu and Srinagar. But incidents of violence against Kashmiri truckers were being reported from as far away as Punjab where there was no protection at all. As a result, Kashmiri truckers, fearing for their lives, refused to drive on the highway. Truckloads of perishable fresh fruit and Valley produce began to rot. It became very obvious that the blockade had caused the situation to spin out of control. The government announced that the blockade had been cleared and that trucks were going through. Embedded sections of the Indian media, quoting the inevitable 'Intelligence' sources, began to refer to it as a 'perceived' blockade, and even to suggest that there had never been one. But it was too late for those games, the damage had been done. It had been demonstrated in no uncertain terms to people in Kashmir that they lived on sufferance, and that if they didn't behave themselves they could be put under siege, starved, deprived of essential commodities and medical supplies. The real blockade became a psychological one. The last fragile link between India and Kashmir was all but snapped. To expect matters to end there was of course absurd. Hadn't anybody noticed that in Kashmir even minor protests about civic issues like water and electricity inevitably turned into demands for azadi? To threaten them with mass starvation amounted to committing political suicide. Not surprisingly, the voice that the Government of India has tried so hard to silence in Kashmir has massed into a deafening roar. Hundreds of thousands of unarmed people have come out to reclaim their cities, their streets and mohallas. They have simply overwhelmed the heavily armed security forces by their sheer numbers, and with a remarkable display of raw courage. Raised in a playground of army camps, checkposts and bunkers, with screams from torture chambers for a soundtrack, the young generation has suddenly discovered the power of mass protest, and above all, the dignity of being able to straighten their shoulders and speak for themselves, represent themselves. For them it is nothing short of an epiphany. They're in full flow, not even the fear of death seems to hold them back. And once that fear has gone, of what use is the largest or second- largest army in the world? What threat does it hold? Who should know that better than the people of India who won their independence in the way that they did? The circumstances in Kashmir being what they are, it is hard for the spin doctors to fall back on the same old same old; to claim that it's all the doing of Pakistan's ISI, or that people are being coerced by militants. Since the '30s onwards, the question of who can claim the right to represent that elusive thing known as "Kashmiri sentiment" has been bitterly contested.This time around, the people are in charge. The armed militants, who through the worst years of repression were seen carrying the torch of azadi, are content to let people do the fighting. The separatist leaders are not leaders so much as followers. Was it Sheikh Abdullah? The Muslim Conference? Who is it today? The mainstream political parties? The Hurriyat? The militants? This time around, the people are in charge. There have been mass rallies in the past, but none in recent memory that have been so sustained and widespread. The mainstream political parties of Kashmir—the National Conference, the People's Democratic Party—feted by the Deep State and the Indian media despite the pathetic voter turnout in election after election appear dutifully for debates in New Delhi's TV studios, but can't muster the courage to appear on the streets of Kashmir. The armed militants who, through the worst years of repression, were seen as the only ones carrying the torch of azadi forward, if they are around at all, seem to be content to take a backseat and let people do the fighting for a change. The separatist leaders who do appear and speak at the rallies are not leaders so much as followers, being guided by the phenomenal spontaneous energy of a caged, enraged people that has exploded on Kashmir's streets. The leaders, such as they are, have been presented with a full-blown revolution. The only condition seems to be that they have to do as the people say. If they say things that people do not wish to hear, they are gently persuaded to come out, publicly apologise and correct their course. This applies to all of them, including Syed Ali Shah Geelani who at a public rally recently proclaimed himself the movement's only leader. It was a monumental political blunder that very nearly shattered the fragile new alliance between the various factions of the struggle. Within hours he retracted his statement. Like it or not, this is democracy. No democrat can pretend otherwise. Day after day, hundreds of thousands of people swarm around places that hold terrible memories for them. They demolish bunkers, break through cordons of concertina wire and stare straight down the barrels of soldiers' machine-guns, saying what very few in India want to hear. Hum kya chahte? Azadi! We Want Freedom. And, it has to be said, in equal numbers and with equal intensity: Jeevey Jeevey Pakistan. Long live Pakistan. That sound reverberates through the Valley like the drumbeat of steady rain on a tin roof, like the roll of thunder before an electric storm. It's the plebiscite that was never held, the referendum that has been indefinitely postponed. On August 15, India's Independence Day, the city of Srinagar shut down completely. The Bakshi stadium where Governor N.N. Vohra hoisted the flag was empty except for a few officials. Hours later, Lal Chowk, the nerve centre of the city (where in 1992, Murli Manohar Joshi, BJP leader and mentor of the controversial "Hinduisation" of children's history textbooks, started a tradition of flag-hoisting by the Border Security Force), was taken over by thousands of people who hoisted the Pakistani flag and wished each other "Happy belated Independence Day" (Pakistan celebrates Independence on August 14) and "Happy Slavery Day". Humour, obviously, has survived India's many torture centres and Abu Ghraibs in Kashmir. On August 16, more than 3,00,000 people marched to Pampore, to the village of Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz, who was shot down in cold blood five days earlier. He was part of a massive march to the Line of Control demanding that since the Jammu road had been blocked, it was only logical that the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad highway be opened for goods and people, the way it used to be before Kashmir was partitioned. On August 18, an equal number gathered in Srinagar in the huge TRC grounds (Tourist Reception Centre, not the Truth and Reconciliation Committee) close to the United Nations Military Observers Group in India and Pakistan (UNMOGIP) to submit a memorandum asking for three things—the end to Indian rule, the deployment of a UN Peacekeeping Force and an investigation into two decades of war crimes committed with almost complete impunity by the Indian army and police. The day before the rally the Deep State was hard at work. A senior journalist friend called to say that late in the afternoon the home secretary called a high-level meeting in New Delhi. Also present were the defence secretary and the intelligence chiefs. The purpose of the meeting, he said, was to brief the editors of TV news channels that the government had reason to believe that the insurrection was being managedby a small splinter cell of the ISI and to request the channels to keep this piece of exclusive, highly secret intelligence in mind while covering (or preferably not covering?) the news from Kashmir. Unfortunately for the Deep State, things have gone so far that TV channels, were they to obey those instructions, would run the risk of looking ridiculous. Thankfully, it looks as though this revolution will, after all, be televised. On the night of August 17, the police sealed the city. Streets were barricaded, thousands of armed police manned the barriers. The roads leading into Srinagar were blocked. For the first time in eighteen years, the police had to plead with Hurriyat leaders to address the rally at the TRC grounds instead of marching right up to the UNMOGIP office which is on Gupkar Road, Srinagar's Green Zone where, for years, the Indian Establishment has barricaded itself in style and splendour. On the morning of the 18th, people began pouring into Srinagar from villages and towns across the Valley. In trucks, tempos, jeeps, buses and on foot. Once again, barriers were broken and people reclaimed their city. The police were faced with a choice of either stepping aside or executing a massacre. They stepped aside. Not a single bullet was fired. The city floated on a sea of smiles. There was ecstasy in the air. Everyone had a banner; houseboat owners, traders, students, lawyers, doctors. One said, "We are all prisoners, set us free." Another said, "Democracy without freedom is Demon-crazy". Demon Crazy. That was a good one. Perhaps he was referring to the twisted logic of a country that needed to commit communal carnage in order to bolster its secular credentials. Or the insanity that permits the world's largest democracy to administer the world's largest military occupation and continue to call itself a democracy. There was a green flag on every lamp post, every roof, every bus stop and on the top of chinar trees. A big one fluttered outside the All India Radio building. Road signs to Hazratbal, Batmaloo, Sopore were painted over. Rawalpindi they said. Or simply Pakistan. It would be a mistake to assume that the public expression of affection for Pakistan automatically translates into a desire to accede to Pakistan. Some of it has to do with gratitude for the support—cynical or otherwise—for what Kashmiris see as a freedom struggle and the Indian State sees as a terrorist campaign. It also has to do with mischief. With saying and doing what galls India, the enemy, most of all. (It's easy to scoff at the idea of a 'freedom struggle' that wishes to distance itself from a country that is supposed to be a democracy and align itself with another that has, for the most part, been ruled by military dictators. A country whose army has committed genocide in what is now Bangladesh. A country that is even now being torn apart by its own ethnic war. What will free Kashmir be like? Will the hundreds of thousands of Kashmiri Pandits living in exile be allowed to return, paid reparations for their losses? These are important questions, but right now perhaps it's more useful to wonder what this so-called democracy did in Kashmir to make people hate it so.) Everywhere there were Pakistani flags, everywhere the cry, Pakistan se rishta kya? La ilaha illa llah. What is our bond with Pakistan? There is no god but Allah. Azadi ka matlab kya? La ilaha illallah. What does Freedom mean? There is no god but Allah. For somebody like myself, who is not Muslim, that interpretation of freedom is hard—if not impossible—to understand. I asked a young woman whether freedom for Kashmir would not mean less freedom for her, as a woman. She shrugged and said, "What kind of freedom do we have now? The freedom to be raped by Indian soldiers?" Her reply silenced me. Standing in the grounds of the TRC, surrounded by a sea of green flags, it was impossible to doubt or ignore the deeply Islamic nature of the uprising taking place around me. It was equally impossible to label it a vicious, terrorist jehad. For Kashmiris, it was a catharsis. A historical moment in a long and complicated struggle for freedom with all the imperfections, cruelties and confusions that freedom struggles have. This one cannot by any means call itself pristine, and will always be stigmatised by, and will some day, I hope, have to account for—among other things—the brutal killings of Kashmiri Pandits in the early years of the uprising, culminating in the exodus of almost the entire community from the Kashmir Valley. As the crowd continued to swell, I listened carefully to the slogans, because rhetoric often clarifies things and holds the key to all kinds of understanding. I'd heard many of them before, a few years ago, at a militant's funeral. A new one, obviously coined after the blockade, was Kashmir ki mandi! Rawalpindi! (It doesn't lend itself to translation, but it means—Kashmir's marketplace? Rawalpindi!) Another was Khooni lakir tod do, aar paar jod do (Break down the blood-soaked Line of Control, let Kashmir be united again). There were plenty of insults and humiliation for India: Ay jabiron ay zalimon, Kashmir hamara chhod do (Oh oppressors, Oh wicked ones, Get out of our Kashmir). Jis Kashmir ko khoon se seencha, woh Kashmir hamara hai (The Kashmir we have irrigated with our blood, that Kashmir is ours!). The slogan that cut through me like a knife and clean broke my heart was this one: Nanga bhookha Hindustan, jaan se pyaara Pakistan (Naked, starving India, More precious than life itself—Pakistan). Why was it so galling, so painful to listen to this? I tried to work it out and settled on three reasons. First, because we all know that the first part of the slogan is the embarrassing and unadorned truth about India, the emerging superpower. Second, because all Indians who are not nanga or bhookha are—and have been—complicit in complex and historical ways with the cruel cultural and economic systems that make Indian society so cruel, so vulgarly unequal. And third, because it was painful to listen to people who have suffered so much themselves mock others who suffer in different ways, but no less intensely, under the same oppressor. In that slogan I saw the seeds of how easily victims can become perpetrators. It took hours for Mirwaiz Umer Farooq and Syed Ali Shah Geelani to wade through the thronging crowds and make it onto the podium. When they arrived, they were born aloft on the shoulders of young men, over the surging crowd to the podium. The roar of greeting was deafening. Mirwaiz Umer spoke first. He repeated the demand that the Armed Forces Special Powers Act, Disturbed Areas Act and Public Safety Act—under which thousands have been killed, jailed and tortured —be withdrawn. Of course, there are many ways for the Indian State to hold on to Kashmir. A few strategic massacres, a couple of targeted assassinations, some disappearances and a round of arrests should do the trick for a few more years. He called for the release of political prisoners, for the Srinagar- Muzaffarabad road to be opened for the free movement of goods and people, and for the demilitarisation of the Kashmir Valley. Syed Ali Shah Geelani began his address with a recitation from the Quran. He then said what he has said before, on hundreds of occasions. The only way for the struggle to succeed,he said, was to turn to the Quran for guidance. He said Islam would guide the struggle and that it was a complete social and moral code that would govern the people of a free Kashmir. He said Pakistan had been created as the home of Islam, and that that goal should never be subverted. He said just as Pakistan belonged to Kashmir, Kashmir belonged to Pakistan. He said minority communities would have full rights and their places of worship would be safe. Each point he made was applauded. Oddly enough, the apparent doctrinal clarity of what he said made everything a little unclear. I wondered how the somewhat disparate views of the various factions in the freedom struggle would resolve themselves—the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front's vision of an independent state, Geelani's desire to merge with Pakistan and Mirwaiz Umer Farooq balanced precariously between them. An old man with a red eye standing next to me said, "Kashmir was one country. Half was taken by India, the other half by Pakistan. Both by force. We want freedom." I wondered if, in the new dispensation, the old man would get a hearing. I wondered what he would think of the trucks that roared down the highways in the plains of India, owned and driven by men who knew nothing of history, or of Kashmir, but still had slogans on their tailgates that said, "Doodh maango to kheer denge, Kashmir maango to cheer denge (Ask for milk, you'll get cream; Ask for Kashmir, we'll tear you open)." Briefly, I had another thought. I imagined myself standing in the heart of an RSS or VHP rally being addressed by L.K. Advani. Replace the word Islam with the word Hindutva, replace the word Pakistan with Hindustan, replace the sea of green flags with saffron ones, and we would have the BJP's nightmare vision of an ideal India. Is that what we should accept as our future? Monolithic religious states handing down a complete social and moral code, "a complete way of life"? Millions of us in India reject the Hindutva project. Our rejection springs from love, from passion, from a kind of idealism, from having enormous emotional stakes in the society in which we live. What our neighbours do, how they choose to handle their affairs does not affect our argument, it only strengthens it. Arguments that spring from love are also fraught with danger. It is for the people of Kashmir to agree or disagree with the Islamic project (which is as contested, in equally complex ways, all over the world by Muslims as Hindutva is contested by Hindus). Perhaps now that the threat of violence has receded and there is some space in which to debate views and air ideas, it is time for those who are part of the struggle to outline a vision for what kind of society they are fighting for. Perhaps it is time to offer people something more than martyrs, slogans and vague generalisations. Those who wish to turn to the Quran for guidance will no doubt find guidance there. But what of those who do not wish to do that, or for whom the Quran does not make place? Do the Hindus of Jammu and other minorities also have the right to self-determination? Will the hundreds of thousands of Kashmiri Pandits living in exile, many of them in terrible poverty, have the right to return? Will they be paid reparations for the terrible losses they have suffered? Or will a free Kashmir do to its minorities what India has done to Kashmiris for 61 years? What will happen to homosexuals and adulterers and blasphemers? What of thieves and lafangas and writers who do not agree with the "complete social and moral code"? Will we be put to death as we are in Saudi Arabia? Will the cycle of death, repression and bloodshed continue? History offers many models for Kashmir's thinkers and intellectuals and politicians to study. What will the Kashmir of their dreams look like? Algeria? Iran? South Africa? Switzerland? Pakistan? At a crucial time like this, few things are more important than dreams. A lazy utopia and a flawed sense of justice will have consequences that do not bear thinking about. This is not the time for intellectual sloth or a reluctance to assess a situation clearly and honestly. It could be argued that the prevarication of Maharaja Hari Singh in 1947 has been Kashmir's great modern tragedy, one that eventually led to unthinkable bloodshed and the prolonged bondage of people who were very nearly free. Already the spectre of partition has reared its head. Hindutva networks are alive with rumours about Hindus in the Valley being attacked and forced to flee. In response, phone calls from Jammu reported that an armed Hindu militia was threatening a massacre and that Muslims from the two Hindu majority districts were preparing to flee. (Memories of the bloodbath that ensued and claimed the lives of more than a million people when India and Pakistan were partitioned have come flooding back. That nightmare will haunt all of us forever.) There is absolutely no reason to believe that history will repeat itself. Not unless it is made to. Not unless people actively work to create such a cataclysm.However, none of these fears of what the future holds can justify the continued military occupation of a nation and a people. No more than the old colonial argument about how the natives were not ready for freedom justified the colonial project. Of course there are many ways for the Indian State to continue to hold on to Kashmir. It could do what it does best. Wait. And hope the people's energy will dissipate in the absence of a concrete plan. It could try and fracture the fragile coalition that is emerging. It could extinguish this non-violent uprising and reinvite armed militancy. It could increase the number of troops from half-a-million to a whole million. A few strategic massacres, a couple of targeted assassinations, some disappearances and a massive round of arrests should do the trick for a few more years. The unimaginable sums of public money that are needed to keep the military occupation of Kashmir going is money that ought by right to be spent on schools and hospitals and food for an impoverished, malnourished population in India. What kind of government can possibly believe that it has the right to spend it on more weapons, more concertina wire and more prisons in Kashmir? The Indian military occupation of Kashmir makes monsters of us all.It allows Hindu chauvinists to target and victimise Muslims in India by holding them hostage to the freedom struggle being waged by Muslims in Kashmir. It's all being stirred into a poisonous brew and administered intravenously, straight into our bloodstream. At the heart of it all is a moral question. Does any government have the right to take away people's liberty with military force? India needs azadi from Kashmir just as much—if not more—than Kashmir needs azadi from India. Shuddhabrata Sengupta From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 23 15:10:44 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 02:40:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808230051s118e1b21s1220fc162933df55@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <239908.85682.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Pawan   Shivam has very graciously apologised. That must be acknowledged and accepted. Even if one does it in silence.   I would also say that in this post Shivam has not "expressed support for the separatists".     Shivam has tried to (now) explain and thereby justify the use of the word "terrorism" when he wrote "Hindu Terrorism". One could disagree with the argument given by him. I certainly do.   You think otherwise, but for me what Shivam writes is important.   Shivam is from the Media, he writes extensively on Kashmir. He is one of the voices in the rest of India who (when not recognisably Kashmiri Muslim) get endowed with the presumption that they are free of bias and prejudice. What Shivam writes therefore becomes important (for me) whether it is in a Newspaper or a Blog or on a list like SARAI.   It is important to keep track of any such voice, that has a limited understanding of Kashmir, or an Anti-India slant to it's commentary/reportage and interpretation of events, or a bias/prejudice (cloaked as it may deviously be to suggest otherwise). Such voices have a willing and 'ready to believe what you say' audience. If you ignore them, you allow them to establish their misrepresentations as "facts".    Kshmendra --- On Sat, 8/23/08, Pawan Durani wrote: From: Pawan Durani Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line To: "sarai list" Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008, 1:21 PM And the apology would have been incomplete without re-asserting the support to separatists................ Doesn't matter anyway......your writings are as much important to us as the import of apples from Cambodia. Pawan On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Dear Shuddha, > > I admit I should have been more discreet and that in both cases, my > comments did amount to vilifying a community ("Hindus" and "Kashmiri > Pandits") and apologise for both. > > However in the case of "Hindu terrorism" I want explain my intent. On > this list and elsewhere even non-violent protests in the Valley are > resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists'. The > problem here is not one of vilification, but that once you have > labelled someone using violence for political purposes a terrorist you > have explained away everything there was to explain. The condemnation > of violence becomes the condemnation of politics. > > It was to that sort of loose usage of the word "terrorists" that I was > rhetorically responding to - meaning to say, that if 'Hindu' mobs use > violence, then that too, should be brushed aside as "terrorism". > Instead, we have been sold the "Jammu is burning" line as if someone > from outside Jammu had set it on fire. > > However, I ought to have explained as much while posting the news > report on the attack on the Jammu Congress leader's car and the threat > to his life and not merely have left a provocative yet lazy one-liner > in the subject line. > > I completely agree with you when you say: > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley > by > > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. > > Once again, apologies. > Shivam > > > On 8/22/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > Dear Shivam. > > > > > > > > > > I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" in > the > > subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark about KP > > "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was saddened to > read > > them. > > > > > > > > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley > by > > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. And > > even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its > participants, > > I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose work I > > respect, I expect much better of you. > > > > > > > > > > I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had > forwarded > > does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress politician, or that > > they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that they were > > nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising 'Anti-Congress, > PDP > > and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not an act > of > > terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison every > > discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix > > "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or > Hindu > > terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. > > > > > > > > > > Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC > > slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set > fire > > to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally inappropriate > to > > tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, so, too I think > it > > is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this report > > with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > > > > > > > > > > This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I would > urge > > everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while > > forwarding posts. > > > > > > > > > > best, > > > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > > > official said. > > > > > > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > > > "imperialism". > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe > > in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > > > > Raqs Media Collective > > > > shuddha at sarai.net > > > > www.sarai.net > > > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sat Aug 23 15:37:10 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 15:07:10 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <239908.85682.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <6b79f1a70808230051s118e1b21s1220fc162933df55@mail.gmail.com> <239908.85682.qm@web57213.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Being in journalism is onerous task, a heavy responsibility to society in democratic life. To be impartial in reportage is biger duty to society, without bias or partisan considerations. That is the precise reason now, the press council is toothless tiger, and now a national Broadcasters body is formed to be responsible in reportage in visual media. In democratic life, the society respects media and judiiary most as they are normally percived as omni-potent to eradicate and make aware of the ills in society,and if some "journalists " become mobsters in their reportage, the mobs have their own way of dispensing the justice as we see the channel offices vandalised/? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Kshmendra Kaul Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008 3:11 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line To: sarai list , Pawan Durani > Dear Pawan >   > Shivam has very graciously apologised. That must be acknowledged > and accepted. Even if one does it in silence. >   > I would also say that in this post Shivam has not "expressed > support for the separatists".   >   > Shivam has tried to (now) explain and thereby justify the use of > the word "terrorism" when he wrote "Hindu Terrorism". One could > disagree with the argument given by him. I certainly do. >   > You think otherwise, but for me what Shivam writes is important. >   > Shivam is from the Media, he writes extensively on Kashmir. He is > one of the voices in the rest of India who (when not recognisably > Kashmiri Muslim) get endowed with the presumption that they are > free of bias and prejudice. What Shivam writes therefore becomes > important (for me) whether it is in a Newspaper or a Blog or on a > list like SARAI. >   > It is important to keep track of any such voice, that has a > limited understanding of Kashmir, or an Anti-India slant to it's > commentary/reportage and interpretation of events, or a > bias/prejudice (cloaked as it may deviously be to suggest > otherwise). Such voices have a willing and 'ready to believe what > you say' audience. If you ignore them, you allow them to establish > their misrepresentations as "facts".  >   > Kshmendra > > --- On Sat, 8/23/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > > From: Pawan Durani > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the > Subject Line > To: "sarai list" > Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008, 1:21 PM > > And the apology would have been incomplete without re-asserting > the support > to separatists................ > Doesn't matter anyway......your writings are as much important to > us as the > import of apples from Cambodia. > > Pawan > > On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > > Dear Shuddha, > > > > I admit I should have been more discreet and that in both cases, my > > comments did amount to vilifying a community ("Hindus" and > "Kashmiri > > Pandits") and apologise for both. > > > > However in the case of "Hindu terrorism" I want explain my > intent. On > > this list and elsewhere even non-violent protests in the Valley are > > resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists'. > The > > problem here is not one of vilification, but that once you have > > labelled someone using violence for political purposes a > terrorist you > > have explained away everything there was to explain. The > condemnation> of violence becomes the condemnation of politics. > > > > It was to that sort of loose usage of the word "terrorists" that > I was > > rhetorically responding to - meaning to say, that if 'Hindu' mobs > use > > violence, then that too, should be brushed aside as "terrorism". > > Instead, we have been sold the "Jammu is burning" line as if > someone > > from outside Jammu had set it on fire. > > > > However, I ought to have explained as much while posting the news > > report on the attack on the Jammu Congress leader's car and the > threat> to his life and not merely have left a provocative yet > lazy one-liner > > in the subject line. > > > > I completely agree with you when you say: > > > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir > valley > > by > > > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any > community.> > > Once again, apologies. > > Shivam > > > > > > On 8/22/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > > > Dear Shivam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in > Jammu" in > > the > > > subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark > about KP > > > "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was > saddened to > > read > > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir > valley > > by > > > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any > community.And > > > even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its > > participants, > > > I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose > work I > > > respect, I expect much better of you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had > > forwarded > > > does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress > politician, or that > > > they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that > they were > > > nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising > =27Anti-Congress, > > PDP > > > and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not > an act > > of > > > terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison > every > > > discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the > prefix> > "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about > Islamic or > > Hindu > > > terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or > mining. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP > and NC > > > slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes > they set > > fire > > > to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally > inappropriate > > to > > > tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, > so, too I think > > it > > > is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this > report > > > with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, > and I > would > > urge > > > everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while > > > forwarding posts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > best, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > > > > > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests > against the > > > > > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > > > > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > > > > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > > > > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was > visiting a > > > > > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with > rods > > > > > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > > > > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > > > > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three > cars in > > > > > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a > nearby > > > > > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath > protesters; mobs > > > > > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > > > > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > > > > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods > in other > > > > > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > > > > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri > Amarnath Yatra > > > > > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the > scene > > > > > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and > several > > > > > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," > a senior > > > > > > official said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled > "funeral > > > > > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from > across > > > > > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to > register > > > > > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive > day,> > > > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged > economic> > > > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to > disperse> > > > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were > trying > > > > > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," > an > > > > > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > > > > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to > suppress> > > > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college > said. She > > > > > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > > > > > "imperialism". > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe > > > in the subject header. > > > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > > > > > > Raqs Media Collective > > > > > > shuddha at sarai.net > > > > > > www.sarai.net > > > > > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sat Aug 23 15:45:45 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 15:15:45 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu Agitation against Islamic Fundamentalists -Secular Campaign for last 55 days... In-Reply-To: <6353c690808222022r3f5f04ebhbb8771787ae59bd0@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808222022r3f5f04ebhbb8771787ae59bd0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Amusing to see that in visual and print media, none of our secular journalists are even noticing that the "mobs' are loudly saying, Bharath maatha Ki jai," may be because they are accustomed to sacrifices of different kind, with diffeent kind of slogans from hired slogan shouters, Sonia ki jai. ! Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Aditya Raj Kaul Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008 8:53 am Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu Agitation against Islamic Fundamentalists -Secular Campaign for last 55 days... To: sarai list > *With painted faces & flags, kids march to court arrest* > *Jammu, August 21, 2008* > > Link - > http://www.hindustantimes.com/Mobile/Pages/StoryPage.aspx?ID=327de271-ff2f-4dd3-9783-b3c5be504eb6&BC=Home > > Her cheeks painted in tricolour and a marigold garland around her > neck,10-year-old Hemalata was out on the streets of Jammu on > Wednesday — to . > > She could be mistaken for a cheering cricket fan or an enthusiastic > schoolgirl about to take part in a fancy fete. But Hemalata > thought she > should join the processions "for the sake of the country — to > press for a > piece of land for Amarnath's Bhole Baba". She was headed for a police > station in Rehari. > > On Tuesday, the government announced an indefinite curfew in Jammu and > warned against bringing children to court arrest, as it was > against the law. > But this morning, they came out, chanting "Yeh diwane kahan chale, > jailchale bhai jail chale" (Where are these frenzied people going? > They are > going to jails). > > Unable to cope with the rush of women, men and, now children, courting > arrest, policemen looked quite harassed on the third day of the Jammu > agitators' "Jail Bharo" programme. "We cannot detain kids, I tell > them,"said Arun Kotwal, a sub-inspector at Rehari, as protesters > wanted to know > why he hadn't put up makeshift tents or called for water tankers. > > For nearly 50 days, residents have voluntarily shut down > everything. But, > how long can it go on? Sheetal Arjunwal, a councilor supervising a > communitykitchen, said: "The land transfer is only one of the > issues. People are out > to disprove what New Delhi believes — that it can wear us out." > > B.S. Salathia, president of Jammu Bar Association, said: "The > authoritieswant to use force against us for waving the national > flag, but think of the > compensation for those waving the Pakistani flag in the Valley." > > A Congress activist, Salathia did not think the BJP was behind the > upsurge."The BJP gave the first call for bandh because it does not > have to bother > about the Valley. But, after that, it is the Sangharsh Samiti — that > includes us all." > > Agreeing with him, Ashok Khajuria, state BJP chief, said: "We are not > looking for credit now. We are part of the people's movement. When the > elections come, the people can decide." > > Khwaja Mohammed Rashid, a lawyer from Poonch, said: "There is no > Hindu-Muslim divide here. The Valley leaders come to us for votes > in the > name of Islam. But once the polls are over, they don't bother > about Muslims > outside the valley. No jobs are created. No college seats are > available. All > money goes to the valley." > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sat Aug 23 15:49:54 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 15:19:54 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu In-Reply-To: <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> Message-ID: Exactly, that is when journalists loose whatever little credibility that have had.! By the way any of the list members , did you notice the issue of Delhi dreams advertisement, Farmers being congratulated for good harvest by Ag. Minister., appearing only in one cannel from th day of voting till now, as perhaps a payback scheme for the sting kept under wraps. ? That is the standard of journalism in visual media, thus in the process channels are loosing their credibilty as they get labelled by the viewers as pro party channels.? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: TaraPrakash Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008 12:28 am Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् , sarai list > Shivam and all. Shivam seems to have fallen prey to the > hindu/muslim binary > and seems to have decided to join the right side of the slash. > > You are losing objectivity. You are homodgenizing and communalizing, > RSSizing. Please come back to the standards you are known to uphold. > > Regards > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > To: "sarai list" > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 5:47 AM > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms> > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; > mobs> have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in > other> areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after > violent> protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri > Amarnath Yatra > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the > scene> of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead > and several > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > official said. > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from > across> Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to > register> protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged > economic> blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to > disperse> protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The > protesters were trying > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > "imperialism". > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 16:07:40 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:07:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: <8170EC3C-9C57-4A82-ACE2-E3620A3A5938@sarai.net> Message-ID: > > Dear Shuddha, > >> It¹s been a few days since I sent a reply to your long letter to me. Since >> you usually respond quickly I actually wondered if you or anyone else saw the >> meat of my response which was tucked away at the end of your post. I assume >> you haven¹t so I¹m resending it. Pl ignore it if you¹ve read it already. >> Warm regards >> sj >> >> >> >> I do not wish to be complicit in that occupation. I think many more people in >> India are coming around to this view. Their numbers will only increase, >> because Indians, like people all over the world, are not stupid. More and >> more people are realizing and will come to realize that for the faintest >> possibility of peace, equity and prosperity to take hold in South Asia, India >> must let go of Kashmir. Only then will there be lasting peace on the >> subcontinent, only then can the tremendous and tragic drain that is the arms >> race be put an end to. >> >> >> How do you see this Œletting go of Kashmir¹? I¹m curious. >> >> I have never advocated or believed Kashmir should be held by force. It is >> shameful that a nation that prides itself on having won its independence by >> means of a non-violent struggle should have had to resort to brute power to >> hold down a region. It is all the more galling that it has had 60 years in >> which to convince the people of Kashmir of the benefits of being part of the >> Indian union and failed time and time again. If you look at Kashmir >> post-1947 there have been innumerable agreements signed between the Govt of >> India and the representatives of the people of J&K and each one of them has >> worked for a period and then failed. The 2002 elections brought considerable >> hope to New Delhi, but 8 years later we seem to have come full circle. >> Whenever I ask why it is that we (India & Pakistan) seem to be treading water >> on Kashmir, Kashmiri friends point to the root cause which has been left >> unaddressed. The root cause in this widely held view is the promise of a >> plebiscite or the right to self-determination. This is a long discussion. >> >> I have no problem, in principle, to say the Kashmiris or anybody else should >> get Azadi from India and vice-versa, but I¹d have to stop and think about >> what that means in real terms: What this means for the people of the Valley, >> Jammu, Ladakh, India and Pakistan; what is my definition of Azadi and how do >> I propose to practically resolve my ideas given the long and complex history >> of the region. >> >> >> The UN Resolutions speak of a plebiscite to either Pakistan or India. It did >> not, in 1948, anticipate the demand for an Independent Kashmir. It is not >> simply the Indian state that rejects the Resolutions but also advocates of an >> independent Kashmir. Pakistan has repeatedly said it would not countenance >> the creation of an independent Kashmir, and curiously, neither have >> successive leaders of Pakistan Administered Kashmir. So how do you >> practically deal with this situation? Do we press the UN to revoke, annul >> and expunge the Resolutions of 1948? No Kashmiri has ever raised this >> seriously because they know that Pakistan would not allow it. >> >> The state of J&K is extremely complex. Jammu & Ladakh want closer >> integration with India. Some would argue that Muslim areas of Jammu share >> the Kashmiri sentiment , but though I could be wrong, that has not been my >> experience. The Valley itself is divided into the Œpro-Azadi¹ and >> Œpro-India¹ lots. The latter, smaller in number, are largely businessmen who >> have interests in other parts of India and politicians and workers of >> mainstream political parties. Besides these, there are border areas like >> Gurez, Keran, Karnah and to some extent Uri where the people have been >> largely insulated from separatist political activity of the Valley because of >> the large presence of the Indian Army and their dependency on them. >> >> Among those wanting ŒAzadi¹ or secession from India, Kashmiris themselves put >> the divide as 60% for independence and 40% for accession with Pakistan. How >> is this to be resolved? After the revolution? I don¹t think so. >> >> I don¹t think another Partition will bring about lasting peace to the >> sub-continent. Speaking of which, in 1947, the people of India were not >> given the right to vote either for or against Partition. Gandhi proposed and >> Jinnah had opposed the idea of a plebiscite in 1944. The 1946 election was >> interpreted as a vote for Partition, but of the 350 million population of >> India only 10% were eligible to vote in the first place as there was no >> universal franchise. So, the verdict of 35 million people divided into >> separate electorates was taken as the will of the people. And what did it >> tell us when, of the 95 million Muslims in undivided India, 4o million >> continued to live in India after the creation of Pakistan? >> >> The fruits of 1947 are in front of us. I believe, like you, that replacing >> one nation-state by another is hardly the solution. For many years now, >> friends in Pakistan and I have been discussing the idea of a South Asian >> Union which loosens the idea of sovereignty, strengthens people, encourages >> movement across borders, makes irrelevant armies that are presently engaged >> in fighting each other. I wonder whether it is possible to take this >> conversation into that direction, into bringing together rather than >> sundering? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 23 16:50:36 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 04:20:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808230045tb265e4drb1fa6ec21c80ec89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <36133.4380.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Shivam   It was gracious of you to apologise.   You have Shuddha to thank for pointing out the incongruity of the "Hindu Terrorism" subjectline. He provided you with an opportunity to apologise and redeem some credibility.   The sarcastic comment about "KP samskars" was one of the very many trite ones that you have made a habit of. Ignorable. Such comments only define your personality and character.   What is interesting is the 'deep anguish' the word Kashmiri Pandit (KP) seems to cause you and that seems to bring out the animal in you at it's unintelligent worst. Knee-jerk reactions. Psyche-jerk perhaps. Only you would know whether this seemingly instinctive attitude is because of pyschological scars from some traumatic personal experience or a result of your being indoctrinated/programmed to be that way. Such an attitude only contradicts your own expressed opinion that there is no homogenity in the various KP political opinions and attitudes. And yet ...   You have spoken about "non violent protests in the Valley". Admittedly there was not much of a 'physical violence' indulged in by the protestors. That does not make the "protests" benign and therefore immune to being categorised or treated with firmly. There has already been a very informed discussion on this between Shuddha and Sonia. (Use of force beyond the minimal required in the situation is condemnable and unacceptable.)   Violence does not always have to be 'physical'. I am sure you recognise the various forms that 'violence' can adopt. Psychological violence is easily understood. What needs to be understood (in context) is the violence against both the Psyche and Legalities of India. You Shivam could however argue that whatever be the form of 'violence' it is justified against India by the Kashmiris. You have done exactly towards the end of your post.   You have said that """"" even non-violent protests in the Valley are resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists' """"".   I am not sure that you are being factual. Yes, the 'protestors' have been called 'separatists' as perhaps many of them or most are. I do not recollect the 'protestors' having been called 'terrorists' in the mainstream media or by any serious commentator elsewhere or even on SARAI. Could you evidence otherwise to support your statement. Unless it is your own contention that "separatists" must be read interchangeably with "terrorists". If the "protestors" have been called "terrorists" by anyone (worth taking note of) then it has been sheer idiocy to do so.   My "idiocy" remark excludes the "Leaders" such as Geelani, Omar Farooq, Yasin etc being called terrorists. The deserve to be called that for their their involvement or support to 'acts of terror' or to 'terrorist organisations'.    Here I must say that it is my contention that the machinery of the "Indian State' has also aften acted as a 'terrorist' against the innocents in Kashmir.    You use an extremely poor argument in stating that "The condemnation of violence becomes the condemnation of politics.". You seem to suggest that if there is a "politics" then "violence" is a legitimate (not to be questioned or condemned) part of the "politics".   By your standards then if the Jammu agitationists have a "political position", as they certainly have (seeing that the Amarnath Land matter has brought in the 'politics' of Regional Imbalance), then "violence" by the Jammu agitationist is justified because of their "politics". Or that we should not condemn the "violence" of the Jammu agitationists just because it is linked to their "politics". Not just a poor argument but a ridiculous one (in my opinion).   Whatever your (not clear) objection is to the "Jammu is Burning" tag, by no stretch of imagination, or linguistic interpretation does it automatically suggest, as you put it, that "as if someone from outside Jammu had set it on fire." It could as much mean that Jammu has ben set afire by the Jammuites themselves.   Shivam (since Language fascinates me) what would you find factually wrong with the statement "Jammu is Burning - The controversy over the transfer of land to SASB has set Jammu afire" ?   I do not mean to belittle your apology. My comments are purely addressed to some of the other things you have said.   Kshmendra     --- On Sat, 8/23/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please Think Before You Write the Subject Line To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" Cc: "sarai list" Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008, 1:15 PM Dear Shuddha, I admit I should have been more discreet and that in both cases, my comments did amount to vilifying a community ("Hindus" and "Kashmiri Pandits") and apologise for both. However in the case of "Hindu terrorism" I want explain my intent. On this list and elsewhere even non-violent protests in the Valley are resulting in the Valley's Muslims being called 'terrorists'. The problem here is not one of vilification, but that once you have labelled someone using violence for political purposes a terrorist you have explained away everything there was to explain. The condemnation of violence becomes the condemnation of politics. It was to that sort of loose usage of the word "terrorists" that I was rhetorically responding to - meaning to say, that if 'Hindu' mobs use violence, then that too, should be brushed aside as "terrorism". Instead, we have been sold the "Jammu is burning" line as if someone from outside Jammu had set it on fire. However, I ought to have explained as much while posting the news report on the attack on the Jammu Congress leader's car and the threat to his life and not merely have left a provocative yet lazy one-liner in the subject line. I completely agree with you when you say: > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley by > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. Once again, apologies. Shivam On 8/22/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Shivam. > > > > > I was saddened to see that you had written "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" in the > subject line of your recent post. Also, I think your remark about KP > "sanskars" in a previous post were not in good taste, I was saddened to read > them. > > > > > Arguing against the oppression that is carried out in the Kashmir valley by > the Indian state does not mean that we have to vilify any community. And > even if communities get vilified in this debate by some of its participants, > I expect you not to reciprocate in kind. As a journalist whose work I > respect, I expect much better of you. > > > > > I must point out to you that nowhere in the report that you had forwarded > does it say that a 'Hindu' mob attacked the Congress politician, or that > they were raising 'Hindu' slogans, (even if we assume that they were > nominally Hindu) it merely says that they were raising 'Anti-Congress, PDP > and NC" slogans. And a mob attack, though reprehensible, is not an act of > terrorism. To say it is to mirror the tactics of those who poison every > discussion on these matters (all over the world) by adding the prefix > "Islamic" to terrorism. It is as ridiculous to talk about Islamic or Hindu > terrorism as it is to speak of Islamic of Hindu agriculture or mining. > > > > > Crowds in the Kashmir valley often raise, "Anti Congress, PDP and NC > slogans" and they are generally Muslim crowds, and sometimes they set fire > to vehicles and ransack homes. Just as it would be totally inappropriate to > tag such an episode as an instance of "Muslim" terrorism, so, too I think it > is totally inappropriate and uncalled for on your part to tag this report > with the headline "Hindu Terrorism in Jammu" > > > > > This kind of rhetorical grandstanding does not help anyone, and I would urge > everyone, especially Shivam, to be restrained and thoughtful while > forwarding posts. > > > > > best, > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 22-Aug-08, at 3:17 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; mobs > > have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in other > > areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after violent > > protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri Amarnath Yatra > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the scene > > of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead and several > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > official said. > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from across > > Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to register > > protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged economic > > blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to disperse > > protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The protesters were trying > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > "imperialism". > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > > Raqs Media Collective > > shuddha at sarai.net > > www.sarai.net > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 17:00:40 2008 From: shambhu.rahmat at gmail.com (Shambhu Rahmat) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:30:40 +0600 Subject: [Reader-list] Brand Bangladesh Message-ID: http://www.drishtipat.org/blog/2008/08/22/branding-bangladesh-to-the-world/ Taking a page from the "India Shining" campaigns of yesterday... From appu.es at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 17:37:33 2008 From: appu.es at gmail.com (Appu Esthose Suresh) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 17:37:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> Message-ID: <4b1e36590808230507i2686b352s2964e9d4acf58a9a@mail.gmail.com> I am extremely delighted to see reactions from various corners over the subject line "Hindu Terrorism". The waxed eloquent ranges from, how dare you say? (not literally, but well polished), how can we refer to a community; terrorist, if some people restore to violence…blah blah…to all those.--doesn't same logic apply in case of Kashmiri's? According to Army Chief's there are 1500-2000 militants there in last few years---but invariably all kashmiri's are militants and paid the price and still paying it, over 10000 disappeared; 13000 was jailed invoking PSA(this is the official figure of those who served 2 years of their term in jail as on June 2007 ); among those who had visited Papa I and Papa II and still alive, countless! ; Those arrested in various parts of India on fake terror charges, I don't know but I know a few arrested at the age of 15 and lodged in tihar (whereas he is supposed to be in a juvenile observation home) and continue to be in jail without trial for 12 years! Their crime, THEY ARE KASHMIRI'S and MUSLIMS! And they still be continued to be referred as "Muslim Terrorist" easy to associate anyone to terrorism, "muslim"…nobody found that offensive????? here I am pasting an earlier posting Dear Champions of Human Rights, I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our * dear** muslim terrorist brothers* and then only you publish such type of calls. Vedavati --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: From: Kashmir Affairs Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in Jammu and Kashmir To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM Where were all those responding now?? Didn't you find that offensive? * Hypocrites*! Now once again I am referring to my response to Vedavati "Your response badly tempted me to give you a crash course in "meaning of terrorism"...Courtesy to Oxford English Dictionary. *Terrorism*- *The unofficial or unauthorized use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims* *Terrorist*-*A person who uses **terrorism** in the pursuit of political aims*." - Against this authentic definition from Oxford, I see reference from Shivam in no way inappropriate, if anyone does either they haven't searched the meaning or shocked to realize what is happening around. - Now, another point; All those who being 'hurt', Do you realize how bad it feels when you have to live with the brand 'terrorist', when you vaguely know what it means right from childhood! If Sangarsh Samiti refers to protest in Kashmir as a terrorist act, here in Jammu it's a corresponding call, *unofficial or unauthorized use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims; **in **other **words** ** Terrorism.* * * *My humble submission to all would be: ours is a hypocritical naïve society who has no clue over what they are arguing about and please try to use the same yardstick, otherwise it could back fire, watch out!* * * *With regards* * * *Appu Esthose Suresh* *Journalist* ** *PS: Don't reply with the cliched arguments, you don't know the ground realities, you are journalist, you are an evangelist low life with hidden agenda.* *I would love to respond and correct myself if there is any construcive arguments. * On 8/23/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > > Exactly, that is when journalists loose whatever little credibility that > have had.! > > By the way any of the list members , did you notice the issue of Delhi > dreams advertisement, Farmers being congratulated for good harvest by Ag. > Minister., appearing only in one cannel from th day of voting till now, as > perhaps a payback scheme for the sting kept under wraps. ? That is the > standard of journalism in visual media, thus in the process channels are > loosing their credibilty as they get labelled by the viewers as pro party > channels.? > > Regards. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: TaraPrakash > Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008 12:28 am > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् , sarai list < > reader-list at sarai.net> > > > Shivam and all. Shivam seems to have fallen prey to the > > hindu/muslim binary > > and seems to have decided to join the right side of the slash. > > > > You are losing objectivity. You are homodgenizing and communalizing, > > RSSizing. Please come back to the standards you are known to uphold. > > > > Regards > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > > To: "sarai list" > > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 5:47 AM > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > > > > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; > > mobs> have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in > > other> areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after > > violent> protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri > > Amarnath Yatra > > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the > > scene> of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead > > and several > > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > > official said. > > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from > > across> Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to > > register> protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged > > economic> blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to > > disperse> protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The > > protesters were trying > > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > > "imperialism". > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > list > > List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From appu.es at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 19:08:24 2008 From: appu.es at gmail.com (Appu Esthose Suresh) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 19:08:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] What would independence mean to Kashmiris ? Message-ID: <4b1e36590808230638x3192164bj472ab617230d1f9c@mail.gmail.com> Highly recommended to those who would like to accomodate different perspective Appu Esthose Suresh Land and freedom Kashmir is in crisis: the region's Muslims are mounting huge non-violent protests against the Indian government's rule. But, asks Arundhati Roy, what would independence for the territory mean for its people? - Arundhati Roy - The Guardian , - Friday August 22 2008 - Article history [image: A Kashmiri Muslim shows a victory sign during a march in Srinagar, India] A Kashmiri Muslim shows a victory sign during a march in Srinagar, India. Photograph: Dar Yasin/AP For the past 60 days or so, since about the end of June, the people of Kashmir have been free. Free in the most profound sense. They have shrugged off the terror of living their lives in the gun-sights of half a million heavily armed soldiers, in the most densely militarised zone in the world. After 18 years of administering a military occupation, the Indian government's worst nightmare has come true. Having declared that the militant movement has been crushed, it is now faced with a non-violent mass protest, but not the kind it knows how to manage. This one is nourished by people's memory of years of repression in which tens of thousands have been killed, thousands have been "disappeared", hundreds of thousands tortured, injured, and humiliated. That kind of rage, once it finds utterance, cannot easily be tamed, rebottled and sent back to where it came from. A sudden twist of fate, an ill-conceived move over the transfer of 100 acres of state forest land to the Amarnath Shrine Board (which manages the annual Hindu pilgrimage to a cave deep in the Kashmir Himalayas) suddenly became the equivalent of tossing a lit match into a barrel of petrol. Until 1989 the Amarnath pilgrimage used to attract about 20,000 people who travelled to the Amarnath cave over a period of about two weeks. In 1990, when the overtly Islamist militant uprising in the valley coincided with the spread of virulent Hindu nationalism (Hindutva) in the Indian plains, the number of pilgrims began to increase exponentially. By 2008 more than 500,000 pilgrims visited the Amarnath cave, in large groups, their passage often sponsored by Indian business houses. To many people in the valley this dramatic increase in numbers was seen as an aggressive political statement by an increasingly Hindu-fundamentalist Indian state. Rightly or wrongly, the land transfer was viewed as the thin edge of the wedge. It triggered an apprehension that it was the beginning of an elaborate plan to build Israeli-style settlements, and change the demography of the valley. Days of massive protest forced the valley to shut down completely. Within hours the protests spread from the cities to villages. Young stone pelters took to the streets and faced armed police who fired straight at them, killing several. For people as well as the government, it resurrected memories of the uprising in the early 90s. Throughout the weeks of protest, hartal (strikes) and police firing, while the Hindutva publicity machine charged Kashmiris with committing every kind of communal excess, the 500,000 Amarnath pilgrims completed their pilgrimage, not just unhurt, but touched by the hospitality they had been shown by local people. Eventually, taken completely by surprise at the ferocity of the response, the government revoked the land transfer. But by then the land-transfer had become what Syed Ali Shah Geelani, the most senior and also the most overtly Islamist separatist leader, called a "non-issue". Massive protests against the revocation erupted in Jammu. There, too, the issue snowballed into something much bigger. Hindus began to raise issues of neglect and discrimination by the Indian state. (For some odd reason they blamed Kashmiris for that neglect.) The protests led to the blockading of the Jammu-Srinagar highway, the only functional road-link between Kashmir and India. Truckloads of perishable fresh fruit and valley produce began to rot. The blockade demonstrated in no uncertain terms to people in Kashmir that they lived on sufferance, and that if they didn't behave themselves they could be put under siege, starved, deprived of essential commodities and medical supplies. To expect matters to end there was of course absurd. Hadn't anybody noticed that in Kashmir even minor protests about civic issues like water and electricity inevitably turned into demands for azadi, freedom? To threaten them with mass starvation amounted to committing political suicide. Not surprisingly, the voice that the government of India has tried so hard to silence in Kashmir has massed into a deafening roar. Raised in a playground of army camps, checkpoints, and bunkers, with screams from torture chambers for a soundtrack, the young generation has suddenly discovered the power of mass protest, and above all, the dignity of being able to straighten their shoulders and speak for themselves, represent themselves. For them it is nothing short of an epiphany. Not even the fear of death seems to hold them back. And once that fear has gone, of what use is the largest or second largest army in the world? There have been mass rallies in the past, but none in recent memory that have been so sustained and widespread. The mainstream political parties of Kashmir - National Conference and People's Democratic party - appear dutifully for debates in New Delhi's TV studios, but can't muster the courage to appear on the streets of Kashmir. The armed militants who, through the worst years of repression were seen as the only ones carrying the torch of azadi forward, if they are around at all, seem content to take a back seat and let people do the fighting for a change. The separatist leaders who do appear and speak at the rallies are not leaders so much as followers, being guided by the phenomenal spontaneous energy of a caged, enraged people that has exploded on Kashmir's streets. Day after day, hundreds of thousands of people swarm around places that hold terrible memories for them. They demolish bunkers, break through cordons of concertina wire and stare straight down the barrels of soldiers' machine guns, saying what very few in India want to hear. Hum Kya Chahtey? Azadi! (We want freedom.) And, it has to be said, in equal numbers and with equal intensity: Jeevey jeevey Pakistan. (Long live Pakistan.) That sound reverberates through the valley like the drumbeat of steady rain on a tin roof, like the roll of thunder during an electric storm. On August 15, India's independence day, Lal Chowk, the nerve centre of Srinagar, was taken over by thousands of people who hoisted the Pakistani flag and wished each other "happy belated independence day" (Pakistan celebrates independence on August 14) and "happy slavery day". Humour obviously, has survived India's many torture centres and Abu Ghraibs in Kashmir. On August 16 more than 300,000 people marched to Pampore, to the village of the Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Abdul Aziz, who was shot down in cold blood five days earlier. On the night of August 17 the police sealed the city. Streets were barricaded, thousands of armed police manned the barriers. The roads leading into Srinagar were blocked. On the morning of August 18, people began pouring into Srinagar from villages and towns across the valley. In trucks, tempos, jeeps, buses and on foot. Once again, barriers were broken and people reclaimed their city. The police were faced with a choice of either stepping aside or executing a massacre. They stepped aside. Not a single bullet was fired. The city floated on a sea of smiles. There was ecstasy in the air. Everyone had a banner; houseboat owners, traders, students, lawyers, doctors. One said: "We are all prisoners, set us free." Another said: "Democracy without freedom is demon-crazy." Demon-crazy. That was a good one. Perhaps he was referring to the insanity that permits the world's largest democracy to administer the world's largest military occupation and continue to call itself a democracy. There was a green flag on every lamp post, every roof, every bus stop and on the top of chinar trees. A big one fluttered outside the All India Radio building. Road signs were painted over. Rawalpindi they said. Or simply Pakistan. It would be a mistake to assume that the public expression of affection for Pakistan automatically translates into a desire to accede to Pakistan. Some of it has to do with gratitude for the support - cynical or otherwise - for what Kashmiris see as their freedom struggle, and the Indian state sees as a terrorist campaign. It also has to do with mischief. With saying and doing what galls India most of all. (It's easy to scoff at the idea of a "freedom struggle" that wishes to distance itself from a country that is supposed to be a democracy and align itself with another that has, for the most part been ruled by military dictators. A country whose army has committed genocide in what is now Bangladesh. A country that is even now being torn apart by its own ethnic war. These are important questions, but right now perhaps it's more useful to wonder what this so-called democracy did in Kashmir to make people hate it so?) Everywhere there were Pakistani flags, everywhere the cry Pakistan se rishta kya? La illaha illallah. (What is our bond with Pakistan? There is no god but Allah.) Azadi ka matlab kya? La illaha illallah. (What does freedom mean? There is no god but Allah.) For somebody like myself, who is not Muslim, that interpretation of freedom is hard - if not impossible - to understand. I asked a young woman whether freedom for Kashmir would not mean less freedom for her, as a woman. She shrugged and said "What kind of freedom do we have now? The freedom to be raped by Indian soldiers?" Her reply silenced me. Surrounded by a sea of green flags, it was impossible to doubt or ignore the deeply Islamic fervour of the uprising taking place around me. It was equally impossible to label it a vicious, terrorist jihad. For Kashmiris it was a catharsis. A historical moment in a long and complicated struggle for freedom with all the imperfections, cruelties and confusions that freedom struggles have. This one cannot by any means call itself pristine, and will always be stigmatised by, and will some day, I hope, have to account for, among other things, the brutal killings of Kashmiri Pandits in the early years of the uprising, culminating in the exodus of almost the entire Hindu community from the Kashmir valley. As the crowd continued to swell I listened carefully to the slogans, because rhetoric often holds the key to all kinds of understanding. There were plenty of insults and humiliation for India: Ay jabiron ay zalimon, Kashmir hamara chhod do (Oh oppressors, Oh wicked ones, Get out of our Kashmir.) The slogan that cut through me like a knife and clean broke my heart was this one: Nanga bhookha Hindustan, jaan se pyaara Pakistan. (Naked, starving India, More precious than life itself - Pakistan.) Why was it so galling, so painful to listen to this? I tried to work it out and settled on three reasons. First, because we all know that the first part of the slogan is the embarrassing and unadorned truth about India, the emerging superpower. Second, because all Indians who are not nanga or bhooka are and have been complicit in complex and historical ways with the elaborate cultural and economic systems that make Indian society so cruel, so vulgarly unequal. And third, because it was painful to listen to people who have suffered so much themselves mock others who suffer, in different ways, but no less intensely, under the same oppressor. In that slogan I saw the seeds of how easily victims can become perpetrators. Syed Ali Shah Geelani began his address with a recitation from the Qur'an. He then said what he has said before, on hundreds of occasions. The only way for the struggle to succeed, he said, was to turn to the Qur'an for guidance. He said Islam would guide the struggle and that it was a complete social and moral code that would govern the people of a free Kashmir. He said Pakistan had been created as the home of Islam, and that that goal should never be subverted. He said just as Pakistan belonged to Kashmir, Kashmir belonged to Pakistan. He said minority communities would have full rights and their places of worship would be safe. Each point he made was applauded. I imagined myself standing in the heart of a Hindu nationalist rally being addressed by the Bharatiya Janata party's (BJP) LK Advani. Replace the word Islam with the word Hindutva, replace the word Pakistan with Hindustan, replace the green flags with saffron ones and we would have the BJP's nightmare vision of an ideal India. Is that what we should accept as our future? Monolithic religious states handing down a complete social and moral code, "a complete way of life"? Millions of us in India reject the Hindutva project. Our rejection springs from love, from passion, from a kind of idealism, from having enormous emotional stakes in the society in which we live. What our neighbours do, how they choose to handle their affairs does not affect our argument, it only strengthens it. Arguments that spring from love are also fraught with danger. It is for the people of Kashmir to agree or disagree with the Islamist project (which is as contested, in equally complex ways, all over the world by Muslims, as Hindutva is contested by Hindus). Perhaps now that the threat of violence has receded and there is some space in which to debate views and air ideas, it is time for those who are part of the struggle to outline a vision for what kind of society they are fighting for. Perhaps it is time to offer people something more than martyrs, slogans and vague generalisations. Those who wish to turn to the Qur'an for guidance will no doubt find guidance there. But what of those who do not wish to do that, or for whom the Qur'an does not make place? Do the Hindus of Jammu and other minorities also have the right to self-determination? Will the hundreds of thousands of Kashmiri Pandits living in exile, many of them in terrible poverty, have the right to return? Will they be paid reparations for the terrible losses they have suffered? Or will a free Kashmir do to its minorities what India has done to Kashmiris for 61 years? What will happen to homosexuals and adulterers and blasphemers? What of thieves and lafangas and writers who do not agree with the "complete social and moral code"? Will we be put to death as we are in Saudi Arabia? Will the cycle of death, repression and bloodshed continue? History offers many models for Kashmir's thinkers and intellectuals and politicians to study. What will the Kashmir of their dreams look like? Algeria? Iran? South Africa? Switzerland? Pakistan? At a crucial time like this, few things are more important than dreams. A lazy utopia and a flawed sense of justice will have consequences that do not bear thinking about. This is not the time for intellectual sloth or a reluctance to assess a situation clearly and honestly. Already the spectre of partition has reared its head. Hindutva networks are alive with rumours about Hindus in the valley being attacked and forced to flee. In response, phone calls from Jammu reported that an armed Hindu militia was threatening a massacre and that Muslims from the two Hindu majority districts were preparing to flee. Memories of the bloodbath that ensued and claimed the lives of more than a million people when India and Pakistan were partitioned have come flooding back. That nightmare will haunt all of us forever. However, none of these fears of what the future holds can justify the continued military occupation of a nation and a people. No more than the old colonial argument about how the natives were not ready for freedom justified the colonial project. Of course there are many ways for the Indian state to continue to hold on to Kashmir. It could do what it does best. Wait. And hope the people's energy will dissipate in the absence of a concrete plan. It could try and fracture the fragile coalition that is emerging. It could extinguish this non-violent uprising and re-invite armed militancy. It could increase the number of troops from half a million to a whole million. A few strategic massacres, a couple of targeted assassinations, some disappearances and a massive round of arrests should do the trick for a few more years. The unimaginable sums of public money that are needed to keep the military occupation of Kashmir going is money that ought by right to be spent on schools and hospitals and food for an impoverished, malnutritioned population in India. What kind of government can possibly believe that it has the right to spend it on more weapons, more concertina wire and more prisons in Kashmir? The Indian military occupation of Kashmir makes monsters of us all. It allows Hindu chauvinists to target and victimise Muslims in India by holding them hostage to the freedom struggle being waged by Muslims in Kashmir. India needs azadi from Kashmir just as much as - if not more than - Kashmir needs azadi from India. *· *Arundhati Roy, 2008. A longer version of this article will be available tomorrow at outlookindia.com. __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages| Files| Photos| Links| Database| Polls| Members| Calendar International Human Rights Organisation (IHRO), of the Indian subcontinent, is a NGO, with national focus and overseas lobby network. It agitates both in India and internationally. [image: Yahoo! Groups] Change settings via the Web(Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest| Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Recent Activity - 466 New Members Visit Your Group New web site? Drive traffic now. Get your business on Yahoo! search. Moderator Central Get answers to your questions about running Y! Groups. Yahoo! Groups Familyographer Zone Learn how to take great pictures. . __,_._,___ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 20:26:22 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 20:26:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu In-Reply-To: <4b1e36590808230507i2686b352s2964e9d4acf58a9a@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808220247p2e902fd3l54dc168d27691264@mail.gmail.com> <00d901c90488$f46bab10$6400a8c0@taraprakash> <4b1e36590808230507i2686b352s2964e9d4acf58a9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808230756k24f639ccsf033c246bd263b2c@mail.gmail.com> And, there are hundreds if not thousands like Yasin Malik, Bitta Karate, Javed Mir etc. who roam free even after killing hundreds of people in public. And, Unfortunately they are not "Kashmiris" but "Muslims" first. It is indeed Islamic Fundamentalism and Terrorism. You can't just act blind to it....! What will you call throwing out 5 lakh members of the minority community, sticking posters on their houses to move out and yelling out from Masjid's warnings to the Hindu's of Kashmir. Then, there are people like Aran Dhati Roy, Prem Shakar Jha etc. who defend these mindless people. Not to forget Shivam Vij. They are fed nicely to speak on behalf of these Communalists. This is a part of their PR Exercises. These separatists which as well includes PDP and NC; want to create an Islamic State. Economic Blockade was one such method adopted by them to gain publicity and sympathy. Their shops were almost closed a couple of months back; but they have revived them with same all rhetoric. Regarding these so called Ultra Liberals like Aran Dhati Roy, Shivam Vij, Prem Shankar Jha etc.; a congressman described it quite well in a recent media briefing, he said, "Roy (and likes) should be locked in the prison and the key should be thrown into the sea. They have destroyed this country for their personal benefits and fame.". Wonder if Shivam will ask for Aazadi in Lucknow now....And, then take passport to visit his hometown. The Tunda Kababs will become foreign to him then. ...lol Kashmir has been for centuries and will remain so always with and in India. God Bless all. Happy Janmashthami. Regards Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/23/08, Appu Esthose Suresh wrote: > > I am extremely delighted to see reactions from various corners over the > subject line "Hindu Terrorism". The waxed eloquent ranges from, how dare > you > say? (not literally, but well polished), how can we refer to a community; > terrorist, if some people restore to violence…blah blah…to all > those.--doesn't same logic apply in case of Kashmiri's? According to Army > Chief's there are 1500-2000 militants there in last few years---but > invariably all kashmiri's are militants and paid the price and still paying > it, over 10000 disappeared; 13000 was jailed invoking PSA(this is the > official figure of those who served 2 years of their term in jail as on > June > 2007 ); among those who had visited Papa I and Papa II and still alive, > countless! ; Those arrested in various parts of India on fake terror > charges, I don't know but I know a few arrested at the age of 15 and lodged > in tihar (whereas he is supposed to be in a juvenile observation home) and > continue to be in jail without trial for 12 years! > > Their crime, THEY ARE KASHMIRI'S and MUSLIMS! And they still be continued > to > be referred as "Muslim Terrorist" easy to associate anyone to terrorism, > "muslim"…nobody found that offensive????? here I am pasting an earlier > posting > > > > Dear Champions of Human Rights, > > I request all of you to please go to Shrinagar, spend some time with our * > dear** muslim terrorist brothers* and then only you publish such type of > calls. > > Vedavati > > > > --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > From: Kashmir Affairs > Subject: [Reader-list] International Call to end Humanitarian Crisis in > Jammu and Kashmir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 12:24 AM > > > > Where were all those responding now?? Didn't you find that offensive? * > Hypocrites*! > > > > Now once again I am referring to my response to Vedavati > > > > "Your response badly tempted me to give you a crash course in "meaning of > terrorism"...Courtesy to Oxford English Dictionary. > > > > *Terrorism*- *The unofficial or unauthorized use of violence and > intimidation in the pursuit of political aims* > > > > *Terrorist*-*A person who uses **terrorism** in the pursuit of political > aims*." > > > > > > - Against this authentic definition from Oxford, I see reference from > Shivam in no way inappropriate, if anyone does either they haven't > searched > the meaning or shocked to realize what is happening around. > > > > - Now, another point; All those who being 'hurt', Do you realize how bad > it feels when you have to live with the brand 'terrorist', when you > vaguely > know what it means right from childhood! > > If Sangarsh Samiti refers to protest in Kashmir as a terrorist act, here in > Jammu it's a corresponding call, *unofficial or unauthorized use of > violence > and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims; **in **other **words** > ** > Terrorism.* > > * * > > *My humble submission to all would be: ours is a hypocritical naïve society > who has no clue over what they are arguing about and please try to use the > same yardstick, otherwise it could back fire, watch out!* > > * * > > *With regards* > > * * > > *Appu Esthose Suresh* > *Journalist* > ** > *PS: Don't reply with the cliched arguments, you don't know the ground > realities, you are journalist, you are an evangelist low life with hidden > agenda.* > *I would love to respond and correct myself if there is any construcive > arguments. * > > > On 8/23/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > > > > Exactly, that is when journalists loose whatever little credibility that > > have had.! > > > > By the way any of the list members , did you notice the issue of Delhi > > dreams advertisement, Farmers being congratulated for good harvest by Ag. > > Minister., appearing only in one cannel from th day of voting till now, > as > > perhaps a payback scheme for the sting kept under wraps. ? That is the > > standard of journalism in visual media, thus in the process channels are > > loosing their credibilty as they get labelled by the viewers as pro party > > channels.? > > > > Regards. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: TaraPrakash > > Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008 12:28 am > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > > To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् , sarai list < > > reader-list at sarai.net> > > > > > Shivam and all. Shivam seems to have fallen prey to the > > > hindu/muslim binary > > > and seems to have decided to join the right side of the slash. > > > > > > You are losing objectivity. You are homodgenizing and communalizing, > > > RSSizing. Please come back to the standards you are known to uphold. > > > > > > Regards > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" > > > To: "sarai list" > > > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2008 5:47 AM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindu terrorism in Jammu > > > > > > > > > > Jammu: Protesters attack Congress leader > > > > > > > > 22 Aug 2008, 0045 hrs IST,TNN > > > > > > > > > > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Jammu_tense_protesters_attack_police_station/articleshow/3389045.cms > > > > > > > > > > > JAMMU/SRINAGAR: There was no let up in violent protests against the > > > > revocation of forestland transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board on > > > > Thursday, as senior Congress leader and former J&K deputy chief > > > > minister Mangat Ram Sharma had a narrow escape when protesters > > > > attacked him at Bhagwatinagar in Jammu. ( Watch ) > > > > > > > > SSP S D S Jamwal said Sharma was attacked while he was visiting a > > > > doctor with his grandson. "Protesters attacked his vehicle with rods > > > > and stones," he said. Sources said a cop saved Sharma from the > > > > rampaging mob and whisked him away on his scooter. Raising > > > > anti-Congress, PDP and NC slogans, the protesters set three cars in > > > > Sharma's cavalcade on fire. "Later, the mob also torched a nearby > > > > police nakka," a police officer said. > > > > > > > > Sharma has been at the receiving end of the Amarnath protesters; > > > mobs> have twice attacked his house in Jammu's upmarket Gandhi Nagar > > > > neighbourhood. Day curfew, meanwhile, was lifted from Jammu and > > > > Udhampur districts, while it was relaxed for varying periods in > > > other> areas of the province. Curfew was reimposed in Jammu after > > > violent> protests on Wednesday, the third and final day of Shri > > > Amarnath Yatra > > > > Sangarsh Samiti (SASS)'s 'Jail Bharo Andolan'. > > > > > > > > Authorities relaxed curfew for three hours in Kishtwar town, the > > > scene> of communal clashes on August 12 that left two people dead > > > and several > > > > others injured. "Curfew was relaxed for 11 hours in Samba," a senior > > > > official said. > > > > > > > > A large number of people turned up for Samiti's scheduled "funeral > > > > ceremony of Union government" programme in Jammu. Reports from > > > across> Jammu region said similar processions were carried out "to > > > register> protest against Centre's silence over the Jammu agitation". > > > > > > > > The Valley remained largely peaceful for the third consecutive day, > > > > after 10 days of violent street protests against the alleged > > > economic> blockade left at least 22 people dead. > > > > > > > > Police resorted to teargas shelling and mild baton charge to > > > disperse> protesters at Munawarabad in old Srinagar. "The > > > protesters were trying > > > > to march towards United Nations Military Observers' office," an > > > > official said. He said no one was hurt in police action. > > > > > > > > Students continued to boycott classes and took to streets. "The > > > > indiscriminate use of power proves that New Delhi wants to suppress > > > > Kashmiris," Rafiqa Akhtar of prestigious Women's college said. She > > > > said college students' protests prove that even youth are against > > > > "imperialism". > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > list > > > List archive: > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 20:55:29 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 20:55:29 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Son of Devaki - Tarun Vijay Message-ID: <6353c690808230825u23d7ebb3u95d535e299cd490d@mail.gmail.com> Link - http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Columnists/Tarun_Vijay_Son_of_Devaki/articleshow/3396388.cms THE RIGHT VIEW Son of Devaki 23 Aug 2008, 1240 hrs IST, Tarun Vijay This column appears on the eve of the birthday of Krishna, son of Devaki. At the time of his birth, his parents were put behind bars by the King fearing death at the hands of their son, as the gods had prophesied. For Devaki and Vasudev, Krishna's father, there was no hope, no chance of getting help from any close friend or relative or the awakened citizens of Vrindavan and Mathura- everyone was terror struck, feared for his life in the kingdom of Kamsa, Devaki's brother. Yet, Krishna survived. Kamsa was killed. Citizens were provided protection and safety. Kaliya, the great serpent king was humbled and made to respect people who lived on the banks of Yamuna. Krishna fought wars but before every action he tried his best to persuade the wrong doer. When he found the evil empire unrepentant, he simply annihilated the entire clan. Forever. He restored Dharma, the righteousness. He became an emperor par excellence, he performed divine dance with Gopikas and had his famous Ras Lilas, yet the only Krishna that makes relevance today is the one who used his Sudarshan Chakra , the celestial weapon to re-establish righteousness and overpower the terrorists, deleting their remnants from the earth. He was our ancestor and we are the rightful inheritors of his legacy. I saw Jammu turned into Krishna, joyfully victorious and unstoppable. And Tawi as Yamuna, gleefully giving way to the pals of Krishna. But how, we, the controllers of power and pen in Delhi, ultimate reservoir of all wisdom, are living his legacy? Instead of warning and annihilating the demons and terrorists ruthlessly, we are suggesting giving them what they want whole of Kashmir-to buy a peace that will never come to us this way. No body respects a coward and his peace making exercises. Even barbaric Jihadis would respect the words of a brave unyielding challenger and not the phony writers and journalists who would insult their tricolor for a piece of story or fame as a peacemaker pen pusher. We compromised to divide our motherland to buy peace- what we got in return were four wars and death of more than sixty thousand brave young soldiers. You give Kashmir today for peace, they will demand Haryana and Himachal next and Delhi another day. Ask the wife and the mother of a martyred soldier who fought the war for Kashmir? Did they do it for money? Ask those Kashmiri Hindus who were an inseparable part of Kashmir's being but were hounded out by Muslim Jihadis just because their women wore Bindis and men chanted Shiva mantras? Now give this Kashmir to the assaulters? A woman raped is being asked to go back to the rapists because they won't live without her? Now read this carefully. "The state of Jammu and Kashmir has been and shall be an integral part of India and any attempts to separate it from the rest of the country will be resisted by all necessary means. "India has the will and capacity to firmly counter all designs against its unity, sovereignty and territorial integrity and demands that Pakistan must vacate the areas of the Indian state of Jammu and Kashmir which they have occupied through aggression." The Indian Parliament passed this resolution unanimously on 22nd February 1994. Before presenting it in the house, the speaker said -'Each word and sentence of this resolution has been seriously considered by the government and the leaders of the opposition parties.' Every party endorsed and passed this. Was that a facade? Now every word of this resolution is sought to be turned into a joke, a meaningless exercise of some foolish people who pass resolutions just to pass time and earn their allowances. Some of the Indian journalists and writers who earn name and fame and money for their being an Indian have chosen to advice to 'liberate' Kashmir and not to force Indian 'colonialism' on a people who do not want to be recognized as Indians. It sounds damn good if read in New Yorkand Rome. But what about those who are Kashmiris and patriots and want to live with India? Who still have land and homes in the valley? And they are Muslims too. Who are the 'people' these worthies have recognized as those who do not want to live with India? Jihadis? Those blood thirsty anti Indians who have been fed on Pakistani money and propaganda to hate Hindus and India and burn tri-colours to make this region a Nizam-e Mustafa , only for the Muslims so that they can share the booty? Like they have been fighting over the question of leadership with each other presently? Mir Waizs and Geelanis and Butts and Muftis and Abdullah's- not a single so-called Muslim leader of the valley, supporting separatism is at peace with another Muslim 'brother in arms'. And now as NSA Narayanan has hinted the separatist leader's murder during a march to Mujaffarabad was a result of an internal clash. But sitting in Delhi and enjoying suspicious hospitalities make some writers to write the junk against the very tricolor that defines their identity on this planet. The timing and synchronizing of 'Azadi to Kashmir' views is significant. All of them belong to one family of hating anything done by the nationalist activists. The profligacy they have exercised is quite understandable in times like these when India is being ruled under a dispensation that favours western ideas and policies for domestic governance. Amarnath agitation has already taken an unprecedented shape, which they had never visualized. In such a situation, the suggestion to 'liberate' Kashmir has been put forward to demonize Hindus and strengthen the anti- national Islamist agitation in the valley, by those who wield a considerable influence in media and are not Muslims. If 'liberate' Kashmir chorus is a spontaneous reaction to the demonstrations being held in the valley, why was the massive upsurge of the patriotic people in Jammu not considered at an equal weight and columns written to listen to the voice of India? Why the tricolor people of Jammu are discarded and ignored as a worthless opinion and all hearts go to listen to the foul cries of separatism? And the secularism of such voices gets quite evident when valley newspapers put on headline like these-'Geelani says- Islamand Pakistan central to Kashmir movement' (Kashmir Times, 19th August, 2008). Those who wont give an inch of their south Delhi -Gurgaon apartments to the neighbor are vexing eloquent to give away Kashmir to blood thirsty terrorists. What is the reason behind the separatism of the valley Muslims? Economic or religious? Economic reasons can be sorted out in a different manner, if they feel they have been deprived of opportunities and financial grants. Surely once in the planning commission's board room, they would discover that the rest of India has genuinely taken less than what it gave to the valley. Now after 1947, this has become another flashpoint of division just on the basis of religion. We are Muslims, we can't live with a Hindu India, was the war cry of Jinnah's hordes pre '47. It was followed by direct action, Calcutta killings, green flags and finally Gandhi, the Hindu Vaishnav yielded and said, ok, take Pakistan but let's live in peace. We compromised, our ahimsa was taken as cowardice and we got wars, immediately we had the land partitioned. Now again, some wizards have tried to create an atmosphere to allow Kashmir's secession for peace. Do they understand it won't end at just Kashmir, but trigger off an avalanche of demands for separate nations from the east to south and later in the west too? Accept NSCN's demand to have a separate Nagalim ? And ULA's Assam nation? Manipur wants a separate nation too as they claim they didn't celebrate 15th August 1947 as their independence day. Should we tell them to shut up because till now no senior journalist has recommended their freedom? We have a dozen flashpoints waiting to secede and declare freedom. Tamil nation and a Maoist corridor joining Nepal's Reds? There is a fantastic mapon the internet declaring a Mugalistan , a complete green Muslim land beginning from Pakistan, including Kashmir and UP's border areas, having already gobbled up Ladakh and Himachal and Uttarakhand and reaching till Assam. One would have just laughed it away if the present valley agitation hasn't ignited treacherously innocent suggestions by writers whom you can't ignore. It takes time to get bad things precipitate enough. Assam is already in the grip of Bangladeshi Muslims. Whatever you say of secularism or rising above religious fault lines, the truth of the matter is Kashmir is a communal cauldron and so is Assam. It's simply a Hindu Muslim issue, you can ignore only at the cost of national integration. They are fed on political expediencies. Like in Assam the IMDT act was helping foreign infiltrators yet government at the centre didn't revoke it till Supreme Court ruled against it and in spite of that the act was re introduced from the back door. In Kashmir the people were never allowed to feel as Indians by introducing a separate constitutional provision under article 370 so how can you expect them to behave as Indians? Delhi's media sultans feel sun will not rise without their approval. They can enjoy the fizz of their arrogance, but the sun rises on its own and maintains its temperature too. I am filing this column from Jammu where people are showing the Indian way of patriotism to the valley. Every street and road is empty unless there is a demonstration. Traders have shuttered down their shops continuously for more than a month. Small entrepreneurs, auto rickshaw drivers, labourers are all off the work. Schools have not opened since last three months as immediately at the fag end of summer vacationsthe Amarnath Movement began. Banks are closed, sms's are prohibited, no public transport is available, it's an unimaginable nightmare during any emergency. But who cares? To feed the citizens city is having free meals (langars) organized at more than fifty points where at an average one lakh people take meals twice a day costing ten lakh rupees per day. Every house hold is giving donations to run such langars without complaint. But strangely enough, the divide we see between valley and Jammu is reflected between media of Jammu and Delhi too. What Jammu's mainline papers are reporting doesn't get reflected in Delhi's papers and channels who have become self appointed guardians of secularism and peace of their own variety and think if they suppress the factual position on Jammu, peace will be restored soon and communalism will not spread. So when the patriots agitate, its communalism and needs to be suppressed. But when Pakistani flags are hoisted atop Lal Chowk and tricolor burnt amidst chants of Allah O Akbar and Pakistan Paindabad, it has to be reported 'objectively' and with full focus so that the sentiments of separatists are not hurt or suppressed! Strange media ethics these seculars follow. What son of Devaki won't have tolerated is being allowed by his followers. Isn't it the time to revive his spirit of Geeta and win a war of righteousness? The body alone perishes; the spirit remains immortal, so why fear O Arjuna? Post script: Jammu is feeling the heat of Delhi's attitude to ignore its demands and term the entire movement as a political one. A Congressleader equated Jammu's patriotic agitation with the Hurriyat, that demands secession. Home Ministry thinks it can use the Chinese method to fatigue the movement by procrastination and prolonging talks and make these people bend on their knees. This approach is further fueling the fire and will ultimately result in people using more violent methods to have their voice heard. The frustration and fierce angst is to be seen and believed, sitting in Delhi doesn't give even an iota of the truth that's Jammu today. A senior columnist in Jammu gave me a table of figures detailing how Jammu had been treated unfairly all these years and still people never agitated. So, why have we been dust binned? He asks - Just because we remained patriotic and peaceful? Suppose we demand a separate Jammu nation and hold a secessionist flag, won't the entire media and government come to listen to us and accept our demands the way they appease valley's Muslims-? This was a dangerous question posed to me by an agitated software engineer in Raghunath Pura. Here are a couple of statistics that prove his point - Sr. no Jammu region Kashmir valley region 1 Area-26293 sq kms 15948 sq kms 2 Total revenue generated-75 % 20% 3 Total voters-3059986 2883950 4 Assembly seats allotted-37 46 5 Voters per seat-66521 49728 6 Area per assembly seat-710.6 sq kms 346.6 sq. kms. 7 Loksabha seats-2 3 8 Cabinet ministers(till 7th July,08) -5 14 9 Districts-10 10 10 Area per district-2629 sq. kms 1594 sq. kms 11 Unemployment status-69.70 % 29.30% 12 Representation in state govt. jobs-1.2 lakhs 3lakhs 13 Percentage of employees from local area-less than 25% 99% 14 Power generation -22 Mega Watt 304 Mega Watt 15 Annual tourist traffic-80 lakhs plus Less than 4 lakhs 16 Expenditure of revenue on tourism sector-less than 10% Plus 85% 17 Rural electrification-less than 70% 100% Anything more to say - bravo Jammu? The author is the Director, Dr Syamaprasad Mookerjee Research Foundation. From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 21:52:42 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 21:52:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by Kanchan Gupta Message-ID: <6353c690808230922m63f847fbke4a0e4bdc8f27ce2@mail.gmail.com> If only Arundhati would quit India By Kanchan Gupta, The Daily Pioneer Link - http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnist1.asp?main_variable=Columnist&file_name=kanchan%2Fkanchan194.txt&writer=kanchan There can be nothing more pathetic than a middle-aged 'radical' preaching treason and penning seditious pamphlets. As a friend, who spent his 20s fighting for lost causes and getting beaten up by the police before being frog-marched to Kolkata's Lalbazar lock-up on more than one occasion and has since settled down to a life of affluence in the US, pointed out, people with spreading midriffs and receding hairlines do not make a pretty sight while manning the barricades. Regis Debray participated in the 'revolution in the revolution' and then joined the establishment. Daniel Marc Cohn-Bendit, better known as 'Danny the Red' and a hero of the summer of 1968, now heads a group of loopy Greens in the European Parliament. Tariq Ali, he who breathed fire and brimstone every time he opened his mouth, leads the occasional march against America in London and writes ponderous articles for *The Guardian* which are dutifully read by the street-fighting generation. So, you see, my friend said, pouring himself an extra large measure of single malt, it's best you leave dissent to the young for whom being on the Left is as fashionable as wearing Prada. That conversation, which took place on a winter evening at his suburban home in Los Angeles a couple of years ago, came to mind as I read about Arundhati Roy's seditious comments after attending a rally organised by Muslim separatists of the Kashmir Valley on August 19. She was clearly impressed by the turnout, as were Mohammed Ali Jinnah and his cohorts when they saw the first train carrying future Pakistanis trundling into what was supposed to be the 'land of the pure' but has turned out to be a sinful Jihadistan. Jinnah, the 'sole spokesman', and his Muslim League were equally delighted by the bloodletting on Direct Action Day, August 16, 1946, and held it up as evidence of the impossibility of Muslims cohabiting with Hindus in Hindustan. Six decades later, more Muslims live peacefully with Hindus in Hindustan than Muslims live with Muslims in Pakistan. But we digress. "If no one is listening then it is because they don't want to hear. Because this is a referendum," Arundhati Roy told mediapersons after the rally, "People don't need anyone to represent them, they are representing themselves." She then went on to assert with a flourish, "India needs* azadi * from Kashmir as much as Kashmir needs* azadi* from India." There is understandable anger over her remarks, although the Congress need not have tried to distance itself from Arundhati Roy's new age sedition: It's the appalling denigration of nationalism and faith in the nation, which the Congress unabashedly indulges in to proclaim its 'secular' credentials, that encourages Arundhati Roy and her tribe to ridicule India, repudiate our national identity and revile our democracy. Curiously, it's rather strange that having declared some years ago that she was "seceding from India", Arundhati Roy continues to foul this land for which she has nothing but contempt. Or else she would not have used her invitation to a book-reading session in the US to declare that "there is no democracy in India". A pity. If only we were not democratic to a fault with a quisling for Prime Minister and a dissolute Congress in power, Arundhati Roy would have been hauled up under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act of 1967, amended in 2004-05. The Act says, "Secession of a part of the territory of India from the Union includes the assertion of any claim to determine whether such part will remain a part of the territory of India." The offences listed under this law include any assertion or statement "which is intended, or supports any claim, to bring about, on any ground whatsoever, the cession of a part of the territory of India or the secession of a part of the territory of India from the Union, or which incites any individual or group of individuals to bring about such cession or secession". Since Arundhati Roy has not denied having said what has been attributed to her by the media, she should be prosecuted. Others have landed behind bars under the same law for having said and/or done stuff that pales into insignificance when compared to her latest call for treason. The law, we are told every now and then, applies equally to all. But as George Orwell was to demonstrate, while all animals are equal, some are more equal than others. So, she gets away with no more than a wimp of a response from our political class. Page Three familiarity helps beat the system in this wondrous land of ours. Another way of looking at Arundhati Roy's treachery would be to feel sorry for her. As I said earlier, there's nothing more pathetic than a middle-aged 'radical' trying to grab space in newspapers and time on television, courtesy dumb journalists and starry-eyed anchors. But Arundhati Roy is not alone in perverting the truth about Jammu & Kashmir. On August 20, *Hindustan Times* carried an asinine article written by Rajmohan Gandhi, defending the indefensible. In normal times, there would have been no cause to respond to Rajmohan Gandhi's article, 'Lal before the storm'; the rant of someone who has monopolised the market for charming though inconsequential tales from the life of a certain Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi does not really merit serious comment. But these are not normal times. Hence, Mr Gandhi's sly innuendoes and his attempt to peddle the same old bunkum about Jammu & Kashmir needs to be contested, if only to show that it is he who has indulged in half-truths and non-truths to provide oxygen to the fire raging in the Kashmir Valley. It is obvious that Mr Gandhi has either not bothered to read the full text of Mr LK Advani's letter to the Prime Minister, written on August 13, or, having read it, he decided to ignore its thrust and contents to serve his own perverse agenda. Mr Advani says in his letter, "Let it be clearly understood. The problem in J&K today is not Hindu versus Muslim; nor is it even Jammu region versus the Valley." Having said this, Mr Advani contextualises the problem as a clash between 'nationalists' and 'separatists'. Mr Gandhi contests this view. Surely Mr Gandhi does not believe that the hordes of Kashmiri Muslims -- actually, tens of thousands of them -- who tried to march to Muzaffarabad, waving the Pakistani flag and holding aloft placards with Jinnah's portrait, are 'nationalists' whose hearts beat for India? The use of the national tricolour by the protesters in Jammu to declare their loyalty to India must be seen against the green-and-white-and-crescent backdrop of separatism in the Valley. From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sat Aug 23 22:21:07 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 22:21:07 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Better Mush than traitors - Chandan Mitra Message-ID: <6353c690808230951g530b4ec5l60ea4ad6a00ccf1b@mail.gmail.com> Better Mush than traitors By Chandan Mitra, Editor-in-Chief, The Pioneer Link - http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnist1.asp?main_variable=Columnist&file_name=mitra%2Fmitra323.txt&writer=mitra The exit of Pervez Musharraf from authority brings to an anti-climatic end an entire epoch in the sub-continent's contemporary history. The flamboyant General may have become an object of hate and derision in his own country of late, but at the turn of the century he seemed almost poised to make history. Sadly for him, Musharraf failed to leave behind anything memorable about his uninterrupted nine-year reign. Which is why his rambling farewell speech, listing all his mundane achievements on the economic and political fronts did not generate any kind of sentiment or remorse among Pakistanis, many of whom burst into celebrations with unseemly haste the moment he announced his resignation. History will probably judge Musharraf more sympathetically for it is true that he tried his best to prevent Pakistan's degeneration into chaos and anarchy, often resorting to rank duplicity by presenting one face to the Americans and another to his own people. At home, he tried to be a crusader for Kashmir, using the backdrop of the Kargil operation he masterminded without then Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif's knowledge. Having seized power in Kargil's aftermath from a defeated, demoralised civilian administration, Musharraf promptly attempted to turn peacemaker, while remaining fixated on Kashmir. The July 2000 Agra Summit collapsed due to his haste and intransigence, matched in equal measure by the NDA Government's fully justified rigidity. It was at Agra that Musharraf first described insurgency in the Kashmir Valley as "freedom struggle" comparable to Palestine. I cannot forget his terminology since it was used in response to my question at the ill-conceived, secretly televised breakfast meeting with 20 Indian Editors at Oberoi Amarvilas where Musharraf, who had proclaimed himself President of Pakistan a few days earlier, was staying. I got to ask the first question at the meeting and innocuously queried him about cross-border terrorism. He gave a detailed, obviously well-prepared reply in which he outlined a four-stage solution to Kashmir, which shorn of verbiage amounted to seeking a division of the State with the Valley being annexed by Pakistan or, as a long shot, being granted "*Azadi*", guaranteed by both protagonists. It was in this context that he emphasised the need for out-of-the-box thinking, using phrases not usually heard from straitlaced army brass or convention-bound politicians. Ironically these very ideas and terms have been recycled by self-styled opinion-makers and newspaper tigers of India during the last fortnight to plead for the Valley's *Azadi*! In retrospect I feel Musharraf always spoke from his gut especially on India-Pakistan relations. His Agra gamble may have backfired miserably for he had to return empty-handed without even paying obeisance at the dargah of the *Garib Nawaz* at Ajmer. But he managed to alter international perceptions of the separatist agitation in the Valley by insisting on calling it a freedom struggle, much to New Delhi's discomfiture. Interestingly, however, hardline secessionists of Kashmir never regarded him with respect. In fact, many doubted his loyalty to the faith because of his unorthodox lifestyle. I recall a Press Conference addressed by his Foreign Minister Mahmud Kasoori during which he made an impassioned plea to the Indian media to empathise with his President who was far from being a rabid Islamist: "He smokes, drinks whisky and even keeps dogs, all of which are *haraam* in our religion. He is like you and me. So, stop vilifying him as a sponsor of *jihad*," Kasoori implored. But the failure to make progress on Kashmir, particularly after 9/11 and US pressure, cooked Musharraf's goose. Never loved by a Punjabi-dominated Pakistani Establishment on account of his *Mohajir* origins, the President progressively lost support among the people who concluded his rhetoric was not only empty but also repetitive. Where Musharraf failed, the hardliners have succeeded. First, they managed to destabilise Pakistan. The storming of the Lal Masjid in Islamabad marked the beginning of *jihadi* resurgence, which he was unable to control. The turbulent frontier regions bordering Afghanistan virtually seceded and every attempt by Pakistani forces to regain authority over the rebellious, pro-Taliban tribes met increasingly fierce reaction. So much so that a big city like Peshawar seems to have slipped out of Islamabad's control over the last few weeks. The murder of two alleged sex workers, one of whose face was brutally mutilated with rifle butts, by the Taliban in lawless Peshawar earlier this week, shows the extent of the Pakistani regime's steady retreat. With Pakistan itself hurtling towards anarchy and *jihadi* terror making further inroads each passing day, it is no surprise that Kashmiri separatists have become more emboldened than ever before. Syed Ali Shah Geelani, Jamaat leader, is reported to have openly declared his loyalty to Pakistan. Even Omar Abdullah, toasted by the secularist Indian media for his fraudulent double-speak in Parliament during the Trust vote last month, has begun talking of the *Azadi* option. And why not? Reinforcing the well-known fact that many Hindus have no stomach for a fight and would rather live in subjugation than valiantly defend their honour, celebrity writers and publicity-seeking showgirls have been harping on the Kashmiris' right to *Azadi*. Last weekend two prominent newspaper columnists wrote about the need to think out-of-the-box (a Musharraf copyright in this context) urging us to seriously consider if it is morally right to hold "unwilling" Kashmiris back in this country. I agree with them. As a matter of policy, the Government must encourage all those who have no loyalty to this country to leave, migrating across the Line of Control to the country of their dreams. Once they step over the de facto border, possessions they leave behind should be declared Enemy Property, reviving the provisions that existed on the statute books at least till after the 1965 Indo-Pak war. But under no circumstances can Indian citizens be allowed to promote secession. Advocating the right of Kashmiris to secede, as a professional female agitator (who believes the Vajpayee Government staged the December 13, 2001 attack on Parliament) reportedly did in Srinagar, is tantamount to treason and must invite provisions contained in the law relating to waging war against the State. Personally, I feel that even publicising such treasonable views, leave alone using dedicated columns to indulge in secessionist propaganda, should invite the charge of promoting terrorism and anti-national activity. No true Indian can forget the way 300,000 Kashmiri Pandits were turfed out of the Valley by secessionists in a horrific instance of ethnic cleansing. The secularists bay for Radovan Milosevic's blood, but not a word is uttered against the butchers who masterminded the elimination of Pandits and the systematic targeting of thousands of patriotic security personnel who laid down their lives so that the tricolour could continue to flutter atop Government buildings in Srinagar. Traitors are cowards by choice. Like all cowards, they will die many times before their death. But the average Indian -- people like you and me -- will die but once, defending the nation's integrity and honour. *Jai Hind*! From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 02:53:31 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 14:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by Kanchan Gupta In-Reply-To: <6353c690808230922m63f847fbke4a0e4bdc8f27ce2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <632128.17482.qm@web54205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear all, If I understand this article correctly, there are three main points. 1) One should be radical when young. Once one reaches middle age (defined by a spreading midriff and a love of whisky?) one should leave the 'being radical' to younger people. Since Arundhati Roy is past her youth, she should therefore shut up, as it is not, as we say in the south, "looking good." 2) What Arundhati Roy said is treason and seditious. Treason and sedition are illegal. Therefore, one should not say things that are illegal, and if one does so, one should be punished. One should not criticise India and/or challenge the fact that India is truly democratic-definitely not to an international audience. If one wants to live in this country, one should not speak against it. 3) Mr. Rajmohan Gandhi is sly, and his article should be contested. Mr. L.K Advani has understood the situation correctly, as should the rest of us, that the issue is with separatists, and something should be done about them. My reaction to Arundhati Roy's piece aside, does anyone else feel the first two arguments are a little silly? ~baruk --- On Sat, 8/23/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by Kanchan Gupta > To: "sarai list" > Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008, 9:52 PM > If only Arundhati would quit India > > By Kanchan Gupta, The Daily Pioneer > > Link - > http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnist1.asp?main_variable=Columnist&file_name=kanchan%2Fkanchan194.txt&writer=kanchan From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sun Aug 24 03:47:13 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2008 22:17:13 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] 'democracy' at work in Kashmir Message-ID: <91360.99308.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear All, Just a sample of 'democracy' in Kashmir. How Kashmiri 'Islamic terrorists' are being dealt with by the nationalist paramilitries. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-elc3s14_Og Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 10:04:29 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:04:29 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Jammu struggle exposes separatists: PK In-Reply-To: <6353c690808232132y3cc3b83eid3f448eed344eb89@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808232132y3cc3b83eid3f448eed344eb89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808232134l3c1dce2ay29762b7d721ad61e@mail.gmail.com> *Jammu struggle exposes separatists: PK* Excelsior Correspondent - 24th August 2008 *JAMMU, Aug. 23 : *Panun Kashmir today said the struggle launched by Shri Amarnath Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS) for restoration of land to Shri Amarnath Shrine Board has exposed the ugly and communal face of separatist forces operating in the State. The agitation in Jammu has also torn down the veil hypocrisy of Government of India , said Panun Kashmir convener Dr Agnishekhar and its chairman, Dr Ajay Chrungoo at a press conference here . They said behind this veil the Government of India has always concealed its preferences to surrender to Muslim communalism. India Government by its surrender during these days has brazenly demonstrated that it is opposed to all efforts for emancipation of people in the State from communal aggrandizement, intolerance, discrimination, oppression as well as movement of resistance against Muslim separatism and secessionism, said Dr Ajay Chrungoo. He said the political class in Kashmir valley which opposes the land transfer to SASB stands naked now. Encouraged by the attitude of Government of India this class has thrown away any pretension of secularism and commitment to co existence, he added. He said the separatist forces led by the likes of Syed Ali Shah Geelani, forces are demanding a final settlement of Kashmir. Tearing Kashmir away from its historical and civilization past they seek creation of a Muslim State where Islam will prevail and dictate all and every aspect of life, he added. "We warn GOI to desist from any maneuvers to accord legitimacy to any form of Muslim separatism be it secession to Pakistan, independence, shared sovereignty or autonomy, he said, adding we condemn the pseudo experts on Kashmir like Arun Dhati Roy, Shabana Azmi, Prem Shanker Jha, S A Aiyer etc who are virtually working as over ground workers of separatists, fundamentalists in Kashmir valley. The entire effervescence in Kashmir valley is a result of false consciousness generated by falsifying history, alleged Dr Agnishekhar. He said Kashmir belongs to Kashmir Hindus as much it belongs to any other Kashmir and no settlement of Kashmir will be acceptable which excludes Kashmiri Hindus and impairs integrity and sovereignty of India. He said Panun Kashmir refuses to be intimidated by what is being proclaimed by Syed Ali Shah Geelani and his over ground supporters. Our commitment to carve out Panun Kashmir with Union Territory status in Kashmir valley where there is free flow of Indian Constitution strengthening with each day, he added. O N Trisal president of All Kashmir Pandit Solidarity Conference (AKPSC) said that KPs will not be cowed down by fascist attitude of Geelani and are committed to our stand on homeland. Daya Krishen Koul and Kuldeep Raina of PK were also present in the press conference. From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 10:11:22 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:11:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'democracy' at work in Kashmir In-Reply-To: <91360.99308.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <91360.99308.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808232141o57611917gc28367fde0795082@mail.gmail.com> And i sure that these dozens of Kashmiri Policemen ( All of them Muslims ) would have been mad that they would hit someone without reasons Not that a justify this treatment,but this happens in other states . The problem is that due to you all being pampered over last 60 years, you still want the bottle of milk in your mouth to keep you away from crying. This video may not become a reason for Independence in UP, but as exception...you have this as a reason. Keep suckling Jeeve Jeeve .....Hum Ko Kya Chahiye... On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 3:47 AM, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > Dear All, > > Just a sample of 'democracy' in Kashmir. How Kashmiri 'Islamic terrorists' > are being dealt with by the nationalist paramilitries. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-elc3s14_Og > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 10:19:22 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 10:19:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] RIK & PK - Militant Organizations Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808232149q5b7ebcd9o25c2caaaca010f6e@mail.gmail.com> http://www.kashmirwatch.com/showexclusives.php?subaction=showfull&id=1219510882&archive=&start_from=&ucat=15&var1news=value1news "As the first port of call, IB used Kashmiri Pandits (a large number of Pandits have been traditionally employed by the IB) to spread disinformation about the Kashmiri struggle. Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir (RIK), two militant Pandit groups sponsored by the Indian intelligence and supported by Hindu extremists like BJP and RSS have been issuing statements calling Kashmiri peaceful protestors as terrorists. RIK that is involved in many attacks on Kashmiri drivers along Jammu-Srinagar Highway near Udhampur has even justified killing of Kashmiri political leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz calling him a terrorist. Similar statements have emanated RAW contact in the US – Dr. Vijay Sazawal who formerly ran rabid anti-Muslim organisation Indo-Kashmir American Forum. Sazawal recently accused that Kashmiris were Islamists and sought to ridicule the massive public demonstrations." I wonder what made these Journos think that RIK and PK are militant organizations ? And just look at their imagination to cook up stories. No wonder it is these vague imaginations that keep them dreaming about Azaadi ! Pawan From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 13:30:02 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:30:02 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Separatists lied about blockade: Jaitley In-Reply-To: <6353c690808240058h60b1f7f3gdcd24797a798168d@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808240058h60b1f7f3gdcd24797a798168d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808240100w2a6fa144p3e4f1249432f8726@mail.gmail.com> *Separatists lied about blockade: Jaitley* New Delhi (PTI): The BJP has accused the separatists in Jammu and Kashmir of spreading false propaganda about the highway connecting Srinagar and Jammu being blocked due to the agitation over the Amarnath land issue and attacked the government for "not countering" these claims. Senior BJP leader Arun Jaitley claimed that there was no such "blockade" in the state as claimed by the separatists but admitted there was "disruption" on the Highway for a day. "The separatists lied to the whole country, to the whole world saying that Hindu colonalisation will come up in the Valley...The separatists lied to the world saying there is an economic blockade. "There was nobody in the valley, not even the state government or the Central government which countered that propoganda," Jaitely told Karan Thapar in "Devil's Advocate" programme of CNN-IBN. Noting that BJP was the only party which countered the separtists' claim, he said, "We are the ones who are saying that the land transfer is pursuant to a direction of the High Court and why it should be implemented." However, Jaitley said there were protests in Jammu and Punjab which led to the disruption of traffic but claimed it was not a blockade. "Any stoppage of traffic because of protest is not a blockade," he said. The BJP leadership and senior leaders of the Punjab government personally intervened and said protest on any road, but not on national highway, he added From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 13:34:58 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:34:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt. In-Reply-To: <6353c690808240104q72e862f0o9096c3d9c0ef9fa4@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808240104q72e862f0o9096c3d9c0ef9fa4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808240104p3dff7b05mbd6296bc18b099b5@mail.gmail.com> *Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt.* New Delhi (PTI): Rejecting calls for separation of Jammu and Kashmir, the government has asserted that the country's territorial integrity is "non-negotiable" and the borders cannot be "altered or redrawn". The government also ridiculed the Hurriyat Conference leaders for claiming to be the representatives of the people of Jammu and Kashmir, saying it had no justification as the separatists have never tested their popularity in elections. "Any such talk (of secession) is preposterous and in conflict with Constitution and law of the land," Minister of State for External Affairs Anand Sharma said here. "The country's borders cannot be altered, or redrawn and Constitution cannot be rewritten," he said, adding "territorial integrity is non-negotiable." His comment came in the backdrop of calls for secession of Jammu and Kashmir made by separatist leaders as well as a few prominent people like author Arundhuti Roy. Sharma said Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had maintained that all issues can be resolved through dialogue. On whether talks would be held with Hurriyat which is leading a stir in the valley, the minister said the government is ready to talk to "all those who are willing and positive." He lashed out at the Hurriyat, saying "those with separatist agenda cannot claim to be representatives of people. Those who have never contested elections, can't claim to represent people." Sharma also accused BJP of "keeping partisan political agenda above national interest" and "supporting communal polarisation which is hurtful to the national interest." "When we have an unsettled situation, it is expected of all responsible leaders and mainstream political parties to work together in the interest of the nation," he said. From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sun Aug 24 13:46:34 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:16:34 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by KanchanGupta In-Reply-To: <632128.17482.qm@web54205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <6353c690808230922m63f847fbke4a0e4bdc8f27ce2@mail.gmail.com> <632128.17482.qm@web54205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Ignore that loose cannon, Arundhati is a spent force, got all the material wealth too early in life, lost her metal balance and media hyped her sooo much for their gains of trp, that she is now whore seling her Intellect whoever pays for it. A person who develops her ntellect tempered with spiritual appraoch to life is human, a person who loves to be in spotlight for the wrong reasons, is not good for any society, freedom of speech has with it duty to society as well, which this whore with intellectual wares seems to be selling for a discount. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Baruk S. Jacob" Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008 2:54 am Subject: Re: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by KanchanGupta To: reader-list at sarai.net > Dear all, > > If I understand this article correctly, there are three main points. > > 1) One should be radical when young. Once one reaches middle age > (defined by a spreading midriff and a love of whisky?) one should > leave the 'being radical' to younger people. Since Arundhati Roy > is past her youth, she should therefore shut up, as it is not, as > we say in the south, "looking good." > > 2) What Arundhati Roy said is treason and seditious. Treason and > sedition are illegal. Therefore, one should not say things that > are illegal, and if one does so, one should be punished. One > should not criticise India and/or challenge the fact that India is > truly democratic-definitely not to an international audience. If > one wants to live in this country, one should not speak against it. > > 3) Mr. Rajmohan Gandhi is sly, and his article should be > contested. Mr. L.K Advani has understood the situation correctly, > as should the rest of us, that the issue is with separatists, and > something should be done about them. > > My reaction to Arundhati Roy's piece aside, does anyone else feel > the first two arguments are a little silly? > > ~baruk > > --- On Sat, 8/23/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - > by Kanchan Gupta > > To: "sarai list" > > Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008, 9:52 PM > > If only Arundhati would quit India > > > > By Kanchan Gupta, The Daily Pioneer > > > > Link - > > > http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnist1.asp?main_variable=Columnist&file_name=kanchan%2Fkanchan194.txt&writer=kanchan > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Sun Aug 24 13:48:25 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:18:25 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by Kanchan Gupta In-Reply-To: <6353c690808230922m63f847fbke4a0e4bdc8f27ce2@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808230922m63f847fbke4a0e4bdc8f27ce2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Not long ago this Arundhathi declared herself a walking , talking independent republic living parasyte on indian society. ----- Original Message ----- From: Aditya Raj Kaul Date: Saturday, August 23, 2008 9:53 pm Subject: [Reader-list] If only Arundhati would quit India... - by Kanchan Gupta To: sarai list > If only Arundhati would quit India > > By Kanchan Gupta, The Daily Pioneer > > Link - > http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnist1.asp?main_variable=Columnist&file_name=kanchan%2Fkanchan194.txt&writer=kanchan > > There can be nothing more pathetic than a middle-aged 'radical' > preachingtreason and penning seditious pamphlets. As a friend, who > spent his 20s > fighting for lost causes and getting beaten up by the police > before being > frog-marched to Kolkata's Lalbazar lock-up on more than one > occasion and has > since settled down to a life of affluence in the US, pointed out, > peoplewith spreading midriffs and receding hairlines do not make a > pretty sight > while manning the barricades. Regis Debray participated in the > 'revolutionin the revolution' and then joined the establishment. > Daniel Marc > Cohn-Bendit, better known as 'Danny the Red' and a hero of the > summer of > 1968, now heads a group of loopy Greens in the European > Parliament. Tariq > Ali, he who breathed fire and brimstone every time he opened his > mouth,leads the occasional march against America in London and > writes ponderous > articles for *The Guardian* which are dutifully read by the street- > fightinggeneration. So, you see, my friend said, pouring himself > an extra large > measure of single malt, it's best you leave dissent to the young > for whom > being on the Left is as fashionable as wearing Prada. > > That conversation, which took place on a winter evening at his > suburbanhome in Los Angeles a couple of years ago, came to mind as > I read about > Arundhati Roy's seditious comments after attending a rally > organised by > Muslim separatists of the Kashmir Valley on August 19. She was clearly > impressed by the turnout, as were Mohammed Ali Jinnah and his > cohorts when > they saw the first train carrying future Pakistanis trundling into > what was > supposed to be the 'land of the pure' but has turned out to be a > sinfulJihadistan. Jinnah, the 'sole spokesman', and his Muslim > League were equally > delighted by the bloodletting on Direct Action Day, August 16, > 1946, and > held it up as evidence of the impossibility of Muslims cohabiting with > Hindus in Hindustan. Six decades later, more Muslims live > peacefully with > Hindus in Hindustan than Muslims live with Muslims in Pakistan. > But we > digress. > > "If no one is listening then it is because they don't want to > hear. Because > this is a referendum," Arundhati Roy told mediapersons after the > rally,"People don't need anyone to represent them, they are > representingthemselves." She then went on to assert with a > flourish, "India needs* azadi > * from Kashmir as much as Kashmir needs* azadi* from India." There is > understandable anger over her remarks, although the Congress need > not have > tried to distance itself from Arundhati Roy's new age sedition: > It's the > appalling denigration of nationalism and faith in the nation, > which the > Congress unabashedly indulges in to proclaim its 'secular' > credentials, that > encourages Arundhati Roy and her tribe to ridicule India, > repudiate our > national identity and revile our democracy. Curiously, it's rather > strangethat having declared some years ago that she was "seceding > from India", > Arundhati Roy continues to foul this land for which she has > nothing but > contempt. Or else she would not have used her invitation to a book- > readingsession in the US to declare that "there is no democracy in > India". > A pity. If only we were not democratic to a fault with a quisling > for Prime > Minister and a dissolute Congress in power, Arundhati Roy would > have been > hauled up under the Unlawful Activities (Prevention) Act of 1967, > amended in > 2004-05. The Act says, "Secession of a part of the territory of > India from > the Union includes the assertion of any claim to determine whether > such part > will remain a part of the territory of India." The offences listed > underthis law include any assertion or statement "which is > intended, or supports > any claim, to bring about, on any ground whatsoever, the cession > of a part > of the territory of India or the secession of a part of the > territory of > India from the Union, or which incites any individual or group of > individuals to bring about such cession or secession". > > Since Arundhati Roy has not denied having said what has been > attributed to > her by the media, she should be prosecuted. Others have landed > behind bars > under the same law for having said and/or done stuff that pales into > insignificance when compared to her latest call for treason. The > law, we are > told every now and then, applies equally to all. But as George > Orwell was to > demonstrate, while all animals are equal, some are more equal than > others.So, she gets away with no more than a wimp of a response > from our political > class. Page Three familiarity helps beat the system in this > wondrous land of > ours. Another way of looking at Arundhati Roy's treachery would be > to feel > sorry for her. As I said earlier, there's nothing more pathetic > than a > middle-aged 'radical' trying to grab space in newspapers and time on > television, courtesy dumb journalists and starry-eyed anchors. > > But Arundhati Roy is not alone in perverting the truth about > Jammu & > Kashmir. On August 20, *Hindustan Times* carried an asinine > article written > by Rajmohan Gandhi, defending the indefensible. In normal times, > there would > have been no cause to respond to Rajmohan Gandhi's article, 'Lal > before the > storm'; the rant of someone who has monopolised the market for > charmingthough inconsequential tales from the life of a certain > Mohandas Karamchand > Gandhi does not really merit serious comment. But these are not normal > times. Hence, Mr Gandhi's sly innuendoes and his attempt to peddle > the same > old bunkum about Jammu & Kashmir needs to be contested, if only to > show that > it is he who has indulged in half-truths and non-truths to provide > oxygen to > the fire raging in the Kashmir Valley. > > It is obvious that Mr Gandhi has either not bothered to read the > full text > of Mr LK Advani's letter to the Prime Minister, written on August > 13, or, > having read it, he decided to ignore its thrust and contents to > serve his > own perverse agenda. Mr Advani says in his letter, "Let it be clearly > understood. The problem in J&K today is not Hindu versus Muslim; > nor is it > even Jammu region versus the Valley." Having said this, Mr Advani > contextualises the problem as a clash between 'nationalists' and > 'separatists'. Mr Gandhi contests this view. Surely Mr Gandhi does not > believe that the hordes of Kashmiri Muslims -- actually, tens of > thousandsof them -- who tried to march to Muzaffarabad, waving the > Pakistani flag and > holding aloft placards with Jinnah's portrait, are 'nationalists' > whosehearts beat for India? The use of the national tricolour by > the protesters > in Jammu to declare their loyalty to India must be seen against the > green-and-white-and-crescent backdrop of separatism in the Valley. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 14:47:41 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 02:17:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt. In-Reply-To: <6353c690808240104p3dff7b05mbd6296bc18b099b5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <234772.22702.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Aditya   Looks like Govt. of India might finally be willing to show that it is serious about competently governing India in the areas where it has acted as a "Soft State".   They should simultaneously act against all those too who are supposedly citizens of India, who avail of the freedoms that are their right under the Constitution of India but who (even if purely by word) act in a manner that is subversive towards the Constitution of India.   Criticism of any aspect of India is the right of every Indian Citizen. It is in fact neccessary, desirable and welcome if any such criticsm, howsoever harsh, serves or is meant to serve towards making better the lives of the people.    But, those who indulge in Sedition or make Seditious Remarks or express support for Sedition should be prosecuted. The difference between 'criticism' and 'sedition' is easily recognisable.     Kshmendra --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: From: Aditya Raj Kaul Subject: [Reader-list] Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt. To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 1:34 PM *Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt.* New Delhi (PTI): Rejecting calls for separation of Jammu and Kashmir, the government has asserted that the country's territorial integrity is "non-negotiable" and the borders cannot be "altered or redrawn". The government also ridiculed the Hurriyat Conference leaders for claiming to be the representatives of the people of Jammu and Kashmir, saying it had no justification as the separatists have never tested their popularity in elections. "Any such talk (of secession) is preposterous and in conflict with Constitution and law of the land," Minister of State for External Affairs Anand Sharma said here. "The country's borders cannot be altered, or redrawn and Constitution cannot be rewritten," he said, adding "territorial integrity is non-negotiable." His comment came in the backdrop of calls for secession of Jammu and Kashmir made by separatist leaders as well as a few prominent people like author Arundhuti Roy. Sharma said Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had maintained that all issues can be resolved through dialogue. On whether talks would be held with Hurriyat which is leading a stir in the valley, the minister said the government is ready to talk to "all those who are willing and positive." He lashed out at the Hurriyat, saying "those with separatist agenda cannot claim to be representatives of people. Those who have never contested elections, can't claim to represent people." Sharma also accused BJP of "keeping partisan political agenda above national interest" and "supporting communal polarisation which is hurtful to the national interest." "When we have an unsettled situation, it is expected of all responsible leaders and mainstream political parties to work together in the interest of the nation," he said. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sun Aug 24 15:14:08 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 09:44:08 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmiri drivers continue being attacked in Jammu Message-ID: <533776.74595.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Hindu extremists strike again at Lakhanpur Assault Kashmiri drivers carrying essential commodities to valley. 23 August, 2008 10:21:00 http://etalaat.com/english/News/front-page/2414.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 15:21:36 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 02:51:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism In-Reply-To: <234772.22702.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8777.65564.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> "The difference between 'criticism' and 'sedition' is easily recognisable." (Kshemendra Kaul) ...and what IS the dividing line? ~baruk From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 15:54:28 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 03:24:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism In-Reply-To: <8777.65564.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <561096.15684.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Baruk   Any dictionary would tell you the meanings of the two words and you would then be able to differentiate between the two.   Wikipedia also has them listed:   - For "sedition" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedition   - For "criticism" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism   I hope the weblinks help in explaining the difference.   Kshmendra     --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Baruk S. Jacob wrote: From: Baruk S. Jacob Subject: Re: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 3:21 PM "The difference between 'criticism' and 'sedition' is easily recognisable." (Kshemendra Kaul) ...and what IS the dividing line? ~baruk _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 16:09:43 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 03:39:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism In-Reply-To: <561096.15684.qm@web57207.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <534024.4973.qm@web54202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Well, Kshmendra, Historically it seems most seditions laws (a list in the Wiki article you quote) have been used by governments to silence critics. In fact, "notion of inciting by words or writings disaffection towards the state or constituted authority" is what the 'modern definition' is supposed to be! Not so sure the two are, at least in the context we are using it, very different! ~Baruk http://bottlebroke.blogspot.com --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > From: Kshmendra Kaul > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism > To: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com > Cc: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 3:54 PM > Dear Baruk > > Any dictionary would tell you the meanings of the two words > and you would then be able to differentiate between the two. > > Wikipedia also has them listed: > > - For "sedition" > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedition > > - For "criticism" > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism > > I hope the weblinks help in explaining the difference. > > Kshmendra > > > > > --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Baruk S. Jacob > wrote: > > From: Baruk S. Jacob > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 3:21 PM > > "The difference between 'criticism' and > 'sedition' is > easily recognisable." (Kshemendra Kaul) > > ...and what IS the dividing line? > > ~baruk > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 24 16:39:17 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 16:39:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt. In-Reply-To: <6353c690808240104p3dff7b05mbd6296bc18b099b5@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808240104q72e862f0o9096c3d9c0ef9fa4@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808240104p3dff7b05mbd6296bc18b099b5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808240409j6fe0881fwf021cd34d3b076bd@mail.gmail.com> That the government of India has to take note of the freedom struggle in Kashmir, is in itself quite a change. shivam On 8/24/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > *Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt.* > > New Delhi (PTI): Rejecting calls for separation of Jammu and Kashmir, the > government has asserted that the country's territorial integrity is > "non-negotiable" and the borders cannot be "altered or redrawn". > > The government also ridiculed the Hurriyat Conference leaders for claiming > to be the representatives of the people of Jammu and Kashmir, saying it had > no justification as the separatists have never tested their popularity in > elections. > > "Any such talk (of secession) is preposterous and in conflict with > Constitution and law of the land," Minister of State for External Affairs > Anand Sharma said here. > > "The country's borders cannot be altered, or redrawn and Constitution cannot > be rewritten," he said, adding "territorial integrity is non-negotiable." > > His comment came in the backdrop of calls for secession of Jammu and Kashmir > made by separatist leaders as well as a few prominent people like author > Arundhuti Roy. > > Sharma said Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had maintained that all issues can > be resolved through dialogue. > > On whether talks would be held with Hurriyat which is leading a stir in the > valley, the minister said the government is ready to talk to "all those who > are willing and positive." > > He lashed out at the Hurriyat, saying "those with separatist agenda cannot > claim to be representatives of people. Those who have never contested > elections, can't claim to represent people." > > Sharma also accused BJP of "keeping partisan political agenda above national > interest" and "supporting communal polarisation which is hurtful to the > national interest." > > "When we have an unsettled situation, it is expected of all responsible > leaders and mainstream political parties to work together in the interest of > the nation," he said. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Sun Aug 24 16:48:34 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 16:48:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free Message-ID: <9c06aab30808240418h6dd7244cn40492181544f8655@mail.gmail.com> Please, set Kashmir free by Malavika Sangghvi Saturday, August 23, 2008 21:56 IST http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1185295&pageid=0 As the daughter of a Kashmiri Hindu, whose family left its ancestral home in Srinagar during the turmoil that followed Partition, I would like to express a sentiment that I still haven't heard in the rhetoric about Kashmir. I speak for those for whom Kashmir is not a symbol of one-upman ship with Pakistan, not a piece of a jigsaw puzzle that is intrinsic to the sovereignty of India and not a football to be kicked around by cynical politicians, but as the daughter of a family in whose very lifeblood Kashmir courses every moment. Cut our hearts open and you will see Kashmir, put your ear to our sighs, and you will hear our yearning for the land where our family spent its last days intact and happy before Partition scattered us to the winds, rendering us refugees. Growing up dislocated in Mumbai, as a child, it never failed to surprise me when people who often hadn't so far stepped out of their suburb, would say:"Kashmir is ours! We will never give it up! Let them try and take Kashmir from us!" Even at that early age, when I could have mistaken their jingoism for kindred sentiment, I realised that their virulence had nothing to do with my family's love for Kashmir, but was misguided machismo. And I would find myself seething with rage at the audacity of their presumption. "But Kashmir was never yours," I'd say in my mind. And sometimes, when more provoked: "You don't deserve Kashmir!" And then I'd go home to my mother, whose ever present, unshed tears for her homeland, were a leitmotif of our life in Mumbai. Throughout my childhood, my family would go back to Srinagar (the ancestral home in Vazir Baugh had to be sold when my widower grandfather became too old to live alone) to stay with Muslim friends, with whom we shared a poignant empathy: we had lost Kashmir because we had moved away; they were losing it everyday, living there, witnessing its destruction. Over kawha, we would watch as the elders of our family weep for what had been. Like a woman too beautiful for her own good, Kashmir was a tragedy even then. It produced an ache in our hearts when we heard its name and thought of its ill fate: and then, because you cannot sit weeping over lost Valleys all your life, when we returned home we put Kashmir on the backburner. And on that backburner, Kashmir fermented Sheikh Abdullah, a man whose commitment to India was unquestionable, was humiliated, jailed, alienated. The most unimaginable genocide was committed on the people. Entire generations of its sons were mowed down by an army whose presence was as large as it was unpopular. And in its knee-jerk, misguided, ill-conceived approach to Kashmir the Indian polity revealed its shallowness. But through this all, intrinsically, those of us who have Kashmir in our bloods, know that the Kashmiri Pandits who have been driven out of their homeland are not enemies of the Kashmiri Muslims, in fact they are both victims of the historic blundering of the Indian government's Kashmir policy. Take away Delhi's political brinkmanship, take away the Hindutva sentiment that has played so neatly into the hands of Pakistan and its fishing-in-troubled-waters game and you may be surprised at how harmoniously Kashmir's Hindus and Muslims can live. So, on behalf of my mother, my family, and all those who have loved and lost Kashmir, I beg: Please. We have done enough damage to and in Kashmir. Enough to last many lifetimes. The chinars are tinged with too much blood. We have failed Kashmir and we don't deserve her anymore. Leave Kashmir alone. Set her free. Email: s_malavika at dnaindia.net From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 17:25:32 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 04:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism In-Reply-To: <534024.4973.qm@web54202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <258360.24981.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Baruk   1. From the Wikipedia page alone,  I would find it difficult to reach your kind of generalisation that "Historically it seems most seditions laws have been used by governments to silence critics". It may be true though.   2. History of a Law being bad or being badly interpreted or having been abused does not mean that such a Law should not exist. It only means that we should learn from the "History" of such a Law, to try our best to design it well and make it insulated from being abused.   3. If it is your postion that there should be an open season for citizens of a country to indulge in 'sedition' then you and I differ on that.   4. At least in a Democracy, the Government does not make "Laws". We the people make the Law by through our representatives in the Legislatures where the Laws are made.   The Govt only applies the Law. The nature of application/interpretation of the Law by the Government is open to challenge.   5. What you have called the "modern meaning" is wording (possibly from a Sedition Law) Wikipedia says is from the Elizabethean Era (circa 1590). Year 1590 is a rather convoluted recognition of "modern". Even so, any Law is only as good or bad or loose and open to abuse as it figures today in any country and particular to that country only.   6. Wikipedia has commented extensively on "sedition" even though all that you could see, from some strange reason is a quote of  a definition from around 1590:   -  Sedition is a term of law which refers to covert conduct, such as speech and organization, that is deemed by the legal authority as tending toward insurrection against the established order. Sedition often includes subversion of a constitution and incitement of discontent (or resistance) to lawful authority. Sedition may include any commotion, though not aimed at direct and open violence against the laws. Seditious words in writing are seditious libel.   7. There are other critical sentences:   -  Because sedition is typically considered a subversive act, the overt acts that may be prosecutable under sedition laws vary from one legal code to another. Where those legal codes have a traceable history, there is also a record of the change of definition for what constituted sedition at certain points in history. This overview has served to develop a sociological definition of sedition as well, within study of persecution.   (do not miss reference to change of definitions at different points of history for what constitutes sedition and consequent overviews to protect against persecution)   -  Nor does it consist, in most representative democracies, of peaceful protest against a government, nor of attempting to change the government by democratic means (such as direct democracy or constitutional convention).     8. If you continue to see no difference between "sedition" and "criticism" then I cannot be of any further help.     Kshmendra    --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Baruk S. Jacob wrote: From: Baruk S. Jacob Subject: Re: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Cc: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 4:09 PM Well, Kshmendra, Historically it seems most seditions laws (a list in the Wiki article you quote) have been used by governments to silence critics. In fact, "notion of inciting by words or writings disaffection towards the state or constituted authority" is what the 'modern definition' is supposed to be! Not so sure the two are, at least in the context we are using it, very different! ~Baruk http://bottlebroke.blogspot.com --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > From: Kshmendra Kaul > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism > To: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com > Cc: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 3:54 PM > Dear Baruk > > Any dictionary would tell you the meanings of the two words > and you would then be able to differentiate between the two. > > Wikipedia also has them listed: > > - For "sedition" > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedition > > - For "criticism" > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism > > I hope the weblinks help in explaining the difference. > > Kshmendra > > > > > --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Baruk S. Jacob > wrote: > > From: Baruk S. Jacob > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 3:21 PM > > "The difference between 'criticism' and > 'sedition' is > easily recognisable." (Kshemendra Kaul) > > ...and what IS the dividing line? > > ~baruk > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 19:27:31 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 06:57:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808240418h6dd7244cn40492181544f8655@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <590936.40288.qm@web57215.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I would not like to make statements without being a hundred percent certain. I am not a hundred percent certain about what I will be suggesting. So, I will use the device of journalists to ask questions even though such questions might suggest allegations.   - Is it not true that Malavika has never lived in Kashmir as a resident of Kashmir for any extended period of time? If so, what would Malavika know of the realities of Kashmir?    - Is it not true that Malavika's family who left Srinagar as she herself says in the immediacy of "Partition", were/are familiar primarily only with the Pre-Partition days of Maharajah's Rule? If so, what would Malavika's family too know about the realities of Post-Partition Kashmir?   - Is it not true when Malavika visited Srinagar "throughout her childhood" she was there for a couple of months at the most every year, if she did visit every year? If so, would it be fair to say that she was there as a tourist? If so what would Malavika understand about the realities of Kashmir especially if she had never been a resident of Kashmir for any extended period of time?   - All else apart, Malavika says her ancestral house was in Wazir Bagh. Is it not true that Wazir Bagh was one of the elitist (read moneyed) residential areas of Srinagar? Would it not be fair to say that people from such elitist (read moneyed) areas of Srinagar would in any case have little understanding of the realities of Kashmir?     - Malavika says that when she visited Srinagar in her childhood, her family would stay with Muslim friends. Is it not true that when Malavika visited Srinagar in her "childhood" there was no strife in Kashmir? If so, what would be the basis of Malavika saying that the Muslim family friends "..were losing it (Kashmir) everyday, living there, witnessing its destruction."? What was that "destruction"?   Or, is it Malavaka's suggestion that the Muslim family friends were nostalgic about and felt a sense of "losing" of the Pre-Partition Mahrajah's Rule days?    - Is it possible that Malavika has juggled around facts quite a bit and is basically using some nostalgia her mother Usha Khanna (who must be in her 80s now) might have about the Kashmir of the Pre-Partition Mahrajah's Rule days? (I forget if Malavika's father too was from Kashmir)   If the allegations suggested in my questions are valid, could one then say that Malavika's piece which might at a first read suggest itself as 'Oh! So touching! So Heart rending!'  is actually dishonest writing of devious design?    Was Malavika perhaps driven to write on this topic and in this tone by the thought "Arundhati has written on it. I too must write on it"?     Kshmendra      --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 4:48 PM Please, set Kashmir free by Malavika Sangghvi Saturday, August 23, 2008 21:56 IST http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1185295&pageid=0 As the daughter of a Kashmiri Hindu, whose family left its ancestral home in Srinagar during the turmoil that followed Partition, I would like to express a sentiment that I still haven't heard in the rhetoric about Kashmir. I speak for those for whom Kashmir is not a symbol of one-upman ship with Pakistan, not a piece of a jigsaw puzzle that is intrinsic to the sovereignty of India and not a football to be kicked around by cynical politicians, but as the daughter of a family in whose very lifeblood Kashmir courses every moment. Cut our hearts open and you will see Kashmir, put your ear to our sighs, and you will hear our yearning for the land where our family spent its last days intact and happy before Partition scattered us to the winds, rendering us refugees. Growing up dislocated in Mumbai, as a child, it never failed to surprise me when people who often hadn't so far stepped out of their suburb, would say:"Kashmir is ours! We will never give it up! Let them try and take Kashmir from us!" Even at that early age, when I could have mistaken their jingoism for kindred sentiment, I realised that their virulence had nothing to do with my family's love for Kashmir, but was misguided machismo. And I would find myself seething with rage at the audacity of their presumption. "But Kashmir was never yours," I'd say in my mind. And sometimes, when more provoked: "You don't deserve Kashmir!" And then I'd go home to my mother, whose ever present, unshed tears for her homeland, were a leitmotif of our life in Mumbai. Throughout my childhood, my family would go back to Srinagar (the ancestral home in Vazir Baugh had to be sold when my widower grandfather became too old to live alone) to stay with Muslim friends, with whom we shared a poignant empathy: we had lost Kashmir because we had moved away; they were losing it everyday, living there, witnessing its destruction. Over kawha, we would watch as the elders of our family weep for what had been. Like a woman too beautiful for her own good, Kashmir was a tragedy even then. It produced an ache in our hearts when we heard its name and thought of its ill fate: and then, because you cannot sit weeping over lost Valleys all your life, when we returned home we put Kashmir on the backburner. And on that backburner, Kashmir fermented Sheikh Abdullah, a man whose commitment to India was unquestionable, was humiliated, jailed, alienated. The most unimaginable genocide was committed on the people. Entire generations of its sons were mowed down by an army whose presence was as large as it was unpopular. And in its knee-jerk, misguided, ill-conceived approach to Kashmir the Indian polity revealed its shallowness. But through this all, intrinsically, those of us who have Kashmir in our bloods, know that the Kashmiri Pandits who have been driven out of their homeland are not enemies of the Kashmiri Muslims, in fact they are both victims of the historic blundering of the Indian government's Kashmir policy. Take away Delhi's political brinkmanship, take away the Hindutva sentiment that has played so neatly into the hands of Pakistan and its fishing-in-troubled-waters game and you may be surprised at how harmoniously Kashmir's Hindus and Muslims can live. So, on behalf of my mother, my family, and all those who have loved and lost Kashmir, I beg: Please. We have done enough damage to and in Kashmir. Enough to last many lifetimes. The chinars are tinged with too much blood. We have failed Kashmir and we don't deserve her anymore. Leave Kashmir alone. Set her free. Email: s_malavika at dnaindia.net _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Sun Aug 24 21:10:42 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 08:40:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free Message-ID: <993079.79841.qm@web31503.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Only such psudo-Hindus like Malvika were responsible for partition of India and they want further mutilation of our motherland and nation.If partition is the only solution then let us divide the entire nation why Kashmir only? The partition of 1947 itself was incorrect.This is an era of integration not division.What will anybody get after division? Are Muslims happy in Pakistan? If yes,why they try to infilter into India? If they want to infilter and stay in India what was the need of partition? If they wanted a partition and a separate nation named as Pakistan why at all they chose to stay in India? If India belongs to everybody why can't they stay here with a sense of tolerance and brotherhood with other communities? Does Muslim mean Pakistani only not Indian? In a vast democratic nation like India there may be numerous points of difference among different communities which have to be solved amicably but saparatism is not an answer at all and whoever takes this line is anti-national punishable under the law of land.Freedom of expression does not mean that one can go anti-national.This needs to be checked immediately. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Kshmendra Kaul To: sarai list ; Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: s_malavika at dnaindia.net Sent: Sunday, 24 August, 2008 7:27:31 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free I would not like to make statements without being a hundred percent certain. I am not a hundred percent certain about what I will be suggesting. So, I will use the device of journalists to ask questions even though such questions might suggest allegations.   - Is it not true that Malavika has never lived in Kashmir as a resident of Kashmir for any extended period of time? If so, what would Malavika know of the realities of Kashmir?    - Is it not true that Malavika's family who left Srinagar as she herself says in the immediacy of "Partition", were/are familiar primarily only with the Pre-Partition days of Maharajah's Rule? If so, what would Malavika's family too know about the realities of Post-Partition Kashmir?   - Is it not true when Malavika visited Srinagar "throughout her childhood" she was there for a couple of months at the most every year, if she did visit every year? If so, would it be fair to say that she was there as a tourist? If so what would Malavika understand about the realities of Kashmir especially if she had never been a resident of Kashmir for any extended period of time?   - All else apart, Malavika says her ancestral house was in Wazir Bagh. Is it not true that Wazir Bagh was one of the elitist (read moneyed) residential areas of Srinagar? Would it not be fair to say that people from such elitist (read moneyed) areas of Srinagar would in any case have little understanding of the realities of Kashmir?     - Malavika says that when she visited Srinagar in her childhood, her family would stay with Muslim friends. Is it not true that when Malavika visited Srinagar in her "childhood" there was no strife in Kashmir? If so, what would be the basis of Malavika saying that the Muslim family friends "..were losing it (Kashmir) everyday, living there, witnessing its destruction."? What was that "destruction"?   Or, is it Malavaka's suggestion that the Muslim family friends were nostalgic about and felt a sense of "losing" of the Pre-Partition Mahrajah's Rule days?    - Is it possible that Malavika has juggled around facts quite a bit and is basically using some nostalgia her mother Usha Khanna (who must be in her 80s now) might have about the Kashmir of the Pre-Partition Mahrajah's Rule days? (I forget if Malavika's father too was from Kashmir)   If the allegations suggested in my questions are valid, could one then say that Malavika's piece which might at a first read suggest itself as 'Oh! So touching! So Heart rending!'  is actually dishonest writing of devious design?    Was Malavika perhaps driven to write on this topic and in this tone by the thought "Arundhati has written on it. I too must write on it"?     Kshmendra      --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 4:48 PM Please, set Kashmir free by Malavika Sangghvi Saturday, August 23, 2008  21:56 IST http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1185295&pageid=0 As the daughter of a Kashmiri Hindu, whose family left its ancestral home in Srinagar during the turmoil  that followed Partition, I would like  to express a sentiment that I still haven't heard in the rhetoric about Kashmir. I speak for those for whom Kashmir is not a symbol of one-upman ship with Pakistan, not a piece of a jigsaw puzzle that is intrinsic to the sovereignty of India  and not a football to be kicked around by cynical politicians, but as the daughter of a family in whose very lifeblood Kashmir courses every moment. Cut our hearts open and you will see Kashmir, put your ear to our sighs, and you will hear our yearning for the land where our family spent its last days intact and happy before Partition scattered us to the winds, rendering us refugees. Growing up dislocated in Mumbai, as a child, it never failed to surprise me when people who often  hadn't so far stepped out of their suburb, would say:"Kashmir is ours! We will never give it up! Let them try and take Kashmir from us!" Even at that early age, when I could have mistaken their jingoism for kindred sentiment, I realised that their virulence had nothing to do with my family's  love for Kashmir, but was misguided machismo. And I would find myself seething with rage at the audacity of their presumption. "But Kashmir was never yours," I'd say in my mind. And sometimes, when more provoked: "You don't deserve Kashmir!" And then I'd go home to my mother, whose ever present, unshed tears for her homeland, were a leitmotif of our life in Mumbai. Throughout my childhood, my family would go back to Srinagar (the ancestral home in Vazir Baugh had to be sold when my widower grandfather became too old to live alone) to stay with Muslim friends, with whom we shared a poignant empathy: we had lost Kashmir because we had moved away; they were losing it everyday, living there, witnessing its destruction. Over kawha, we would watch as the elders of our family weep for what had been. Like a woman too beautiful for her own good, Kashmir was a tragedy even then. It produced an ache in our hearts when we heard its name and thought of its ill fate: and then, because you cannot sit weeping over lost Valleys all your life,  when we returned home we put Kashmir on the backburner. And on that backburner, Kashmir fermented Sheikh Abdullah, a man whose commitment to India was unquestionable, was humiliated, jailed, alienated. The most unimaginable genocide was committed on the people. Entire generations of its sons were mowed down by an army whose presence was as large as it was unpopular. And in its knee-jerk, misguided, ill-conceived approach to Kashmir the Indian polity revealed its shallowness. But through this all, intrinsically, those of us who have Kashmir in our bloods, know that the Kashmiri Pandits who have been driven out of their homeland are not enemies of the Kashmiri Muslims, in fact they are both victims of the historic blundering of the Indian government's Kashmir policy. Take away Delhi's political brinkmanship, take away the Hindutva sentiment that has played so neatly into the hands of Pakistan and its fishing-in-troubled-waters game and you may be surprised at how harmoniously Kashmir's Hindus and Muslims can live. So, on behalf of my mother, my family, and all those who have loved and lost Kashmir, I beg:  Please. We have done enough damage to and in Kashmir. Enough to last many lifetimes. The chinars are tinged with too much  blood. We have failed Kashmir and we don't deserve her anymore. Leave Kashmir alone. Set her free. Email: s_malavika at dnaindia.net _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>   _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 23:28:16 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:28:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Separatists lied about blockade: Jaitley In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808240411q5bf0d135q7115cd074daf1883@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808240058h60b1f7f3gdcd24797a798168d@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808240100w2a6fa144p3e4f1249432f8726@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808240411q5bf0d135q7115cd074daf1883@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808241058u6944b92cg439fa32ef0020900@mail.gmail.com> To prove a theory is better, than writing unwanted one liners which only make you sound cheap. On 8/24/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > When the blockade idea backfired, it became a lie > > On 8/24/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > *Separatists lied about blockade: Jaitley* > > > > New Delhi (PTI): The BJP has accused the separatists in Jammu and Kashmir > of > > spreading false propaganda about the highway connecting Srinagar and > Jammu > > being blocked due to the agitation over the Amarnath land issue and > attacked > > the government for "not countering" these claims. > > > > Senior BJP leader Arun Jaitley claimed that there was no such "blockade" > in > > the state as claimed by the separatists but admitted there was > "disruption" > > on the Highway for a day. > > > > "The separatists lied to the whole country, to the whole world saying > that > > Hindu colonalisation will come up in the Valley...The separatists lied to > > the world saying there is an economic blockade. > > > > "There was nobody in the valley, not even the state government or the > > Central government which countered that propoganda," Jaitely told Karan > > Thapar in "Devil's Advocate" programme of CNN-IBN. > > > > Noting that BJP was the only party which countered the separtists' claim, > he > > said, "We are the ones who are saying that the land transfer is pursuant > to > > a direction of the High Court and why it should be implemented." > > > > However, Jaitley said there were protests in Jammu and Punjab which led > to > > the disruption of traffic but claimed it was not a blockade. "Any > stoppage > > of traffic because of protest is not a blockade," he said. > > > > The BJP leadership and senior leaders of the Punjab government personally > > intervened and said protest on any road, but not on national highway, he > > added > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 23:40:48 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:40:48 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] `Kashmiri Pandits need homeland` Message-ID: <6353c690808241110t144a4e36i97e5c0f24f67c66c@mail.gmail.com> `Kashmiri Pandits need homeland` Jammu, Aug 24: An organisation representing Kashmiri Pandits on Sunday demanded "homeland" for five lakh displaced members of the community in Jammu and Kashmir. "No settlement to Kashmir issue is possible without the involvement of five lakh displaced Kashmiri Pandits. We want a homeland for our people," Chiefs of two factions of Panun Kashmir, Dr Agnishakhar and Dr Ajay Charangoo told reporters here. Rejecting separatists' demand for right to self determination and freedom, they said Kashmiri Pandits cannot be rehabilitated in Kashmir, "which has been highly polarised on communal lines". The organisation also extended full support to the Amarnath land agitation. Meanwhile, Jammu state Morcha today asked the Centre to trifurcate Jammu and Kashmir into three states as it is "the viable alternative left to resolve the issue." Bureau Report From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 23:46:01 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:46:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore Message-ID: <6353c690808241116p1dfcabbbsafa1fc662950c242@mail.gmail.com> *Oranges won't work anymore* By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on August 13 after an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their supporters, who alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also denied the President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider protests. There is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are far removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security forces that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between chaos and order. In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for taking a tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and terrorists who will now think that they can get away with anything. Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of appeasement and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. Terrorism in the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will to deal with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, the daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a former Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of chain reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to these events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at the time. The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet has today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; enforcing the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and cinema houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a laudable speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this year as he appealed to the masses to shun communalism. But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community generates communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC into Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who cross the LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country. A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared legal tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that 'transferring' 97 acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the present crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to create disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & Kashmir Government: "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 security personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the middle of February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 security personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another 1,678 lost their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, while 173 civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between militants. A total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents between security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 civilians were killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven year, while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary personnel lost their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were killed. 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting militants in the State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in 2001, which was again the highest." Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are used to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself led to protests. It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. During my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, installed CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a situation like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth to depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, if not completely banned. Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be immobilised by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The Government has announced financial assistance for the families of terrorists on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning member of their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with danger and the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a scheme to help traitors. Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the Valley. With Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or election will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to drive the Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the country of their origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these militants who are nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the right signal that the Government means business. From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 00:37:21 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 00:37:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <6353c690808241116p1dfcabbbsafa1fc662950c242@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808241116p1dfcabbbsafa1fc662950c242@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808241207x77b4810s66913e081850dd6e@mail.gmail.com> you post an article by the ex-director of the CBI which quotes reports of the J & K government as its "source" and you expect people to take you seriously??...come on! On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 11:46 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > *Oranges won't work anymore* > > By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI > > > The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on August 13 > after > an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their supporters, > who > alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also denied the > President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider protests. There > is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are far > removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security forces > that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between chaos and > order. > > In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for taking a > tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the > situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General > restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and terrorists > who will now think that they can get away with anything. > > Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of appeasement > and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. Terrorism in > the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will to deal > with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, the > daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a former > Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then > Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the > separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of chain > reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to these > events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at the time. > > The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet has > today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > enforcing > the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and cinema > houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a laudable > speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this year as > he > appealed to the masses to shun communalism. > > But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a > communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community generates > communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by > terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC into > Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who cross the > LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country. > > A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people > contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a > mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared legal > tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that 'transferring' 97 > acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the > present > crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to create > disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & > Kashmir > Government: > > "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 security > personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the middle of > February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 security > personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the > State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another 1,678 lost > their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, while > 173 > civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between militants. A > total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents between > security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 civilians were > killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven year, > while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary personnel > lost > their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police > lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police > Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were > killed. > 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting militants in the > State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in 2001, which > was again the highest." > > Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is > being > done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call > given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the > faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are > used > to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in > the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then > Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself > led to protests. > > It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. > During > my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the > co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, installed > CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a situation > like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly > communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove > anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth to > depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of > terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > if > not completely banned. > > Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be immobilised > by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The > Government has announced financial assistance for the families of > terrorists > on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning member of > their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with danger and > the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a scheme to help > traitors. > > Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the Valley. With > Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or > election > will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to drive > the > Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the country of > their > origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these militants who > are > nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the > right signal that the Government means business. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 01:37:04 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 01:37:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808241207x77b4810s66913e081850dd6e@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808241116p1dfcabbbsafa1fc662950c242@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808241207x77b4810s66913e081850dd6e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8ED2B703-DBDD-4FEA-A45F-5229882B029A@sarai.net> The ex director of the CBI, also happens to get the name and persona of the kidnapped daughter of Mufti Muhammad Syed. It wasn't Mehbooba Mufti, it was her sister, Rubaiya Syed, then a medical student. Rubaiya Syed never became the chief minister of Kashmir, Mehbooba Mufti did. In the case of an ordinary person, such a slip is perhaps understandable. But the person making the slip happens to have occupied the topmost echelons of a part of the so called 'security' apparatus in India, and is a decorated and loquacious former police officer. This gives us an accurate picture of how well the bureaucrats and spin doctors who are attempting to manage Kashmir actually know anything about what is going on in the ground. The nakedness of their humbuggery is pretty evident. It also gives us a fairly reasonable idea of how seriously to take their conjectures and figures. regards, Shuddha > you post an article by the ex-director of the CBI which quotes > reports of > the J & K government as its "source" and you expect people to take you > seriously??...come on! > > On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 11:46 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > >> *Oranges won't work anymore* >> >> By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI >> >> >> The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on >> August 13 >> after >> an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their >> supporters, >> who >> alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also >> denied the >> President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider >> protests. There >> is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are >> far >> removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security >> forces >> that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between >> chaos and >> order. >> >> In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for >> taking a >> tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the >> situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General >> restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and >> terrorists >> who will now think that they can get away with anything. >> >> Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of >> appeasement >> and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. >> Terrorism in >> the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will >> to deal >> with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba >> Mufti, the >> daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now >> a former >> Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then >> Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the >> separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series >> of chain >> reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to >> these >> events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at >> the time. >> >> The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the >> carpet has >> today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; >> enforcing >> the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and >> cinema >> houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a >> laudable >> speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this >> year as >> he >> appealed to the masses to shun communalism. >> >> But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is >> based on a >> communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community >> generates >> communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by >> terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC >> into >> Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who >> cross the >> LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country. >> >> A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people >> contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a >> mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be >> declared legal >> tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that >> 'transferring' 97 >> acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the >> present >> crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to >> create >> disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & >> Kashmir >> Government: >> >> "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 >> security >> personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the >> middle of >> February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 >> security >> personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the >> State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another >> 1,678 lost >> their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, >> while >> 173 >> civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between >> militants. A >> total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents >> between >> security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 >> civilians were >> killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven >> year, >> while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary >> personnel >> lost >> their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir >> Police >> lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police >> Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were >> killed. >> 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting >> militants in the >> State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in >> 2001, which >> was again the highest." >> >> Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether >> what is >> being >> done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by >> the call >> given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the >> faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as >> now, are >> used >> to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to >> gather in >> the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then >> Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, >> which itself >> led to protests. >> >> It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. >> During >> my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the >> co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, >> installed >> CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a >> situation >> like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly >> communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove >> anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come >> forth to >> depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of >> terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be >> discouraged, >> if >> not completely banned. >> >> Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be >> immobilised >> by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The >> Government has announced financial assistance for the families of >> terrorists >> on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning >> member of >> their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with >> danger and >> the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a >> scheme to help >> traitors. >> >> Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the >> Valley. With >> Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or >> election >> will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to >> drive >> the >> Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the >> country of >> their >> origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these >> militants who >> are >> nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will >> send the >> right signal that the Government means business. >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From indersalim at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 01:46:04 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 01:46:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt. In-Reply-To: <234772.22702.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <6353c690808240104p3dff7b05mbd6296bc18b099b5@mail.gmail.com> <234772.22702.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808241316h6a2125a3m47b99d6e97995cb2@mail.gmail.com> Sharma also accused BJP of "keeping partisan political agenda above national interest" if Mr. Kshmendra is serious about what Anand Sharma of external affairs mininstry said then he should demand immediate arrest of BJP top brass for their agenda, which is ' above national intersest' because by the same logic he demands procecution of all those who 'abuse liberal India' In fact they should have been behind bars when they demolished Babri Masjid and Narender Modi should have been arrested and scentenced to prision for life after what he did in Gujarat. yes, those who demolsed temples and killed innocent kashmmiri pandits too should be arrested and put behind bars, this is what Arandhati Roy also talked about. But i dont think mr. kshmendra would like to procecute her for her criticism of a slogan like Nizam-e-Mustafa in kashmir recently. But why not to ban newspapers from publishing such articles in the first place. after all they are the real culprits who abuse our liberal india. We should be really imitate Chinese policy of supression, wherein people come to know about unrest when rebles ( both muslims and tibetians ) are short dead seconds after scentences are pronounced. long live that less liberal India in future. love is On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 2:47 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > Dear Aditya > > Looks like Govt. of India might finally be willing to show that it is serious about competently governing India in the areas where it has acted as a "Soft State". > > They should simultaneously act against all those too who are supposedly citizens of India, who avail of the freedoms that are their right under the Constitution of India but who (even if purely by word) act in a manner that is subversive towards the Constitution of India. > > Criticism of any aspect of India is the right of every Indian Citizen. It is in fact neccessary, desirable and welcome if any such criticsm, howsoever harsh, serves or is meant to serve towards making better the lives of the people. > > But, those who indulge in Sedition or make Seditious Remarks or express support for Sedition should be prosecuted. The difference between 'criticism' and 'sedition' is easily recognisable. > > > Kshmendra > > > --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > Subject: [Reader-list] Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt. > To: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 1:34 PM > > *Territorial integrity is 'non-negotiable': Govt.* > > New Delhi (PTI): Rejecting calls for separation of Jammu and Kashmir, the > government has asserted that the country's territorial integrity is > "non-negotiable" and the borders cannot be "altered or > redrawn". > > The government also ridiculed the Hurriyat Conference leaders for claiming > to be the representatives of the people of Jammu and Kashmir, saying it had > no justification as the separatists have never tested their popularity in > elections. > > "Any such talk (of secession) is preposterous and in conflict with > Constitution and law of the land," Minister of State for External Affairs > Anand Sharma said here. > > "The country's borders cannot be altered, or redrawn and Constitution > cannot > be rewritten," he said, adding "territorial integrity is > non-negotiable." > > His comment came in the backdrop of calls for secession of Jammu and Kashmir > made by separatist leaders as well as a few prominent people like author > Arundhuti Roy. > > Sharma said Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had maintained that all issues can > be resolved through dialogue. > > On whether talks would be held with Hurriyat which is leading a stir in the > valley, the minister said the government is ready to talk to "all those > who > are willing and positive." > > He lashed out at the Hurriyat, saying "those with separatist agenda cannot > claim to be representatives of people. Those who have never contested > elections, can't claim to represent people." > > Sharma also accused BJP of "keeping partisan political agenda above > national > interest" and "supporting communal polarisation which is hurtful to > the > national interest." > > "When we have an unsettled situation, it is expected of all responsible > leaders and mainstream political parties to work together in the interest of > the nation," he said. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Mon Aug 25 03:48:49 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 22:18:49 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <6353c690808241116p1dfcabbbsafa1fc662950c242@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <939675.33394.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one policy prescription in Kashmir - whole scale murder. A friend who has been at very top post in IB recently wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to live in India should migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March whole Kashmir would have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my view - life is more precious than land. In 1947 - quarter a million were massacred in Jammu and two million forced to migrate. In 1990 - 100,000 Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri Muslims from villages along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. In 2008 - thousands of Muslim families have been forced to leave Jammu and adjoining Hindu majority areas. - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - Mimesis and Violence. Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffairs.org --- On Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: From: Aditya Raj Kaul Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, 24 August, 2008, 7:16 PM *Oranges won't work anymore* By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on August 13 after an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their supporters, who alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also denied the President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider protests. There is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are far removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security forces that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between chaos and order. In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for taking a tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and terrorists who will now think that they can get away with anything. Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of appeasement and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. Terrorism in the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will to deal with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, the daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a former Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of chain reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to these events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at the time. The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet has today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; enforcing the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and cinema houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a laudable speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this year as he appealed to the masses to shun communalism. But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community generates communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC into Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who cross the LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country. A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared legal tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that 'transferring' 97 acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the present crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to create disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & Kashmir Government: "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 security personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the middle of February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 security personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another 1,678 lost their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, while 173 civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between militants. A total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents between security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 civilians were killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven year, while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary personnel lost their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were killed. 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting militants in the State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in 2001, which was again the highest." Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are used to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself led to protests. It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. During my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, installed CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a situation like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth to depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, if not completely banned. Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be immobilised by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The Government has announced financial assistance for the families of terrorists on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning member of their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with danger and the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a scheme to help traitors. Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the Valley. With Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or election will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to drive the Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the country of their origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these militants who are nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the right signal that the Government means business. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 04:34:04 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 04:34:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] "I See Kashmir from New Delhi at Mignight" Message-ID: Dear All, Even as the Indian state seems to be on the threshold of losing its grip both on hearts and minds in Kashmir and on its own wisdom, we have our own bunch of proud patriots making a heroic effort to convert this list (and many other media spaces) into their own, special, battleground. Perhaps they might be consoling themselves with the hope that the Reader List may yet be won, even if Kashmir is lost. Somehow, I am not so sure that this is going to be the case. Unfortunately for them, to win in arguments, both the state in Kashmir, and he Indian nationalist hard liners in the media and on this list, need some ideas, some attempt at reason, some amount of vision. I am afraid, that so far, neither the state, nor its hyper- loyal editorialists and cyber-footsoldiers, have been able to display any. Instead, we have had bullets in Kashmir, and as I write this, news of midnight raids, arrests and the putting in place of the machinery of a major crackdown tomorrow, on those planning to assemble to protest peacefully on Lal Chowk in Srinagar, and restrictions on the freedom of expression. It is possible that a lot will happen tomorrow and in the next few days that will not filter through on television and the newspapers. It is possible that internet connections will be momentarily 'down' and that phone contact with the valley may be suspended. If it is not, then it is imperative that those who are in the valley, especially journalists of major international newspapers witness and report what might happen. If the worst does not come to pass, then, everyone will be relieved, and I really hope that is the case. We must remember, that in 1989-90, major massacres took place in Srinagar and in the rest of India, nobody really knew what was going on before it was too late. It is not as easy today for the Indian state to replicate the news blackout that accompanied the crackdown that took place in 1989, but certainly, the signs are that there might just be an attempt to do precisely that. The PTI report quoted in a story just uploaded on the Indian Express website an hour before midnight, yesterday, 24th August, makes for chilling reading, especially if we read between the lines. It deserves being quoted in its entirety. _________________________________________________________ One killed in fresh firing, Curfew in valley imposed again Press Trust Of India Posted online: Indian Express, Sunday, August 24, 2008 at 2203 hrs Print Email http://www.indianexpress.com/story/352744.html Srinagar, August 24:: In fresh violence, one person was killed and 40 injured when security forces opened fire and lobbed tear gas shells after curfew clamped in the entire Kashmir valley today was defied by protestors at several places. Appealing for calm, authorities braced for the rally called by separatists at Srinagar's Lal Chowk tomorrow and curfew imposed in all the 10 districts of the Kashmir Valley for the second time in a week as a precautionary measure. Several separatist leaders were put under house arrest ahead of the rally to protest against what they called the "failure" of the Centre to resolve the Kashmir issue. Authorities also feared there may be some threat to the lives of the separatist leaders. Police said a man identified as Ghulam Qadir Hajjam was killed when a stray bullet hit him when protestors attempted to defy curfew. His son also sustained injuries. The incident took place in the Dalgate area this evening when the protesters tried to storm the battalion headquarters of paramilitary forces, police said. Security forces had to resort to firing after repeated cane charging and bursting of tear gas shells failed to disperse the mob protesting against the clamping of curfew. A CRPF spokesman Prabhakar Tripathy said the security forces had to open fire as the father-son duo tried to attack their camp, killing one person and wounding another. Citing "absolutely imperative" reasons, the Jammu and Kashmir government meanwhile restricted local TV channels from broadcasting news and current affairs programmes with immediate effect on the eve of separatists' rally. ________________________________________________________________________ ____ Read this again, carefully, and recognize the import of what it says. The signals, are transparent, and is recognizable even in the fact that this is a PTI Report, not a report authored by an Indian Express correspondent in Kashmir. But just to be clear, let's read the signs. 1. Blood has been spilt, when people attempted to defy curfey, it may be spilt again, tomorrow at Lal Chowk, or in the coming days, all over the valley. 2. There has been a crackdown. The leadership of the forces resisting the occupation have been arrested. With them absent, there may be no one to effectively restrain an angry and scared crowd, should there be use of force against that crowd. This may lead to an escalation of violence, which is precisely what the state wants just now in Kashmir. It is fed up of a non-violent crowd, and wants to provoke at least a section of the crowd to turn violent. This is much easier to do if the leadership is locked away, and if a situation is created where passions may run high. 3. Some people of prominence in the 'separatist' leadership may be assasinated - (this is the import of the statement - "Authorities also feared there may be some threat to the lives of the separatist leaders" - these will then be used to sow dissension. An attempt was made to do this by the NSA chied Narayanan recently when he declared that Abdul Aziz did not die from a police of CRPF bullet. This backfired on him because he could not demonstrate how he knew this, especially as the 'bullet' in question was not found during the autopsy of the body. But there is no reason why this tactic, which has been so successful in the past with regard to the assasinations of the present Mirwaiz's father and Abdul Ghani Lone, may not be tried again.) 4. There will be a news blockade. This can be clearly read into the import of the statement - "Citing "absolutely imperative" reasons, the Jammu and Kashmir government meanwhile restricted local TV channels from broadcasting news and current affairs programmes with immediate effect on the eve of separatists' rally." Simultaneously with this 'crisis management' mode kicking into gear in the valley, there has also been the unleashing of the threat, through the loud and clear signals sent by hard-line commentators of the bringing to bear of 'sedition' charges against anyone displaying the slightest hint of sympathy for the idea that the time for 'Azadi' in Kashmir has come. This threat has always been held out to people in Kashmir. Now, it is being held out against all those who are, or may think of standing by the people of Kashmir in this time of darkness. So, the threat of violence inside Kashmir goes hand in hand with the veiled, but clear threat of 'being locked up with the keys thrown away' (as Coutside Kashmir. The ratcheting up of abuse, of name-calling, of loud and pathetic displays of rhetorical excess against all those, especially, but not only on the writer Arundhati Roy, on the ground of 'sedition' in this list needs to be seen in this context. This list is being used to deliver this threat to its members. And I urge everyone on this list who thinks that the conceptual violence of this threat needs to be countered to wake up and respond to this fact. In the middle of all this. Not a single argument has emerged, either from the state, or from its minions in the media, or on this list, as to why Kashmir should continue to be held, by force if necessary. Please do not mistake the import of what I am saying. I mean 'Why' not 'How'. We have heard a lot of 'How' Kashmir must be held. We have not heard a 'Why'. Because there is no "why' anymore. To answer the 'Why' question, the proponents of the Indian states' now visibly hardening stance on Kashmir would have to take recourse ultimately to the ethical and moral bases for justifying what is a visibly brutal occupation of a now voluntarily un-armed resistance. The United Jehad Council (the umbrella separatist militant's organization) has called on all militants to not use or even display weapons, to take no recourse to violence. This call may be inspired by cynicism as much as it may be a tacit admission of the recognition of the moral strength of non-violent resistance. Whatever the case may be, if bullets fly tomorrow, they will not fly from guns in militants' hands. The people have disarmed. The state is arming itself. We must all pray that this situation does not degenerate into a bloodbath on Lal Chowk tomorrow. Let us hope that whosoever thinks they are in charge in the Government of India does not get carried away into thinking that India, like China or Burma, can 'take' the fallout of a certain number of casualties in its stride. That all you need after a massacre is festivity. And even if we don't have the Olympics lined up like China did after cracking down hard on Tibet and all internal dissidence, we can always manufacture some beguiling image of 'economic resilience' or 'cultural diversity' to distract a possibly indignant world's attention from the real possibility of dead bodies piling up on the streets of Srinagar. This robust 'firm hand theory' might be wanting to have us believe that If China can do a Tienanemen Square and get away with it, surely, the other resurgent Asian power can afford a little 'lali' (a tinge of bloodied August redness) on the dirt of Lal Chowk. All we have heard, in the meanwhile, is the tiresome repetition of the following - 1. The unity and integrity of India is paramount. Not an inch of territory can be negotiated. Those who want to be 'Azad' should be pushed, into Pakistan, leaving Kashmir, essentially an empty Kashmir, so that the occupation can continue. 2. Too much money has been spent on Kashmir, so we can't let go of it. 3. The people of Kashmir are misled by dangerous, fire-breathing, Islamist radicals. Or, the people of Kashmir are dangerous, fire breathing, Islamist radicals 4. The Kashmiri pandit population has had a really bad time. 5. If Kashmir goes, everyone else will want a piece of Azadi. 6. Kashmir must remain in India, because its continued existence within the Indian union as the only muslim majority province is proof of India's secularism. if Kashmir goes, what will happen to Indian Muslims? In everything that I have read and heard till now, these are the six core arguments. Earlier, there used to be a seventh one. Which went like this. "The people of Kashmir love India, it is only a handful of the ISI inspired terrorist subversives who are the root of all the trouble in Kashmir. Once they are dealt with, the people of Kashmir will return to the bosom of the motherland. They will be seen, plying their shikaras, casting their non-votes in non-elections, weaving their carpets, painting their laquer, carrying pilgrims on their backs and selling their apples and being extras in the Hindi movie set which Kashmir must remain so that Indians can enjoy their little bit of home grown Switzerland. In other words, the people of Kashmir really, truly, deeply love having the Indian armed forces occupy their land and torture them." Unfortunately, this seventh argument, which was the really top- drawer, shined and polished argument, is no longer available for use. It has been consigned to the dustbin of history by the visible evidence that we have all seen of the hundreds of thousands of people on the streets of Kashmir peacefully stating that their only desire is liberation from the occupation. So, the only arguments available are the 6 outlined above. Unfortunately, none of these six arguments take into account what the people of Kashmir may or may not want. They all hinge on what people outside Kashmir may or may not find desirable for Kashmir and the people of Kashmir. To me, that is just as reprehensible as the justification of the occupation of Iraq by an invading army on the grounds that actually this is happening because Haliburton wants it this way, or that the invasion of Czechoslovakia by Soviet troops in 1968 was justified because the politbureau of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union (which represented neither the people of Czechoslovakia, nor the Communist Party of the Czech Republic) wanted it this way. The only argument that rested, or relied on the will of the people is the one that has quietly had to exit in the last few days, the one about how much the people of Kashmir loved their continuing occupation. Since, none of the arguments rely on, or even feel the need to take cognizance of the will of the majority of the people of the Kashmir valley, we have to come to the conclusion that following these arguments through to their logical conclusion must require the Indian state to either empty the valley of its inhabitants, or to beat them into submission to an extent that they are left with no will. To do that will be to follow Betolt Brecht's irony laden advice to the ruling powers in the former GDR's (during a swift repression of a workers uprising in East Berlin in 1953( of the need to "dissolve the people and elect another in their place" . Now, it is debatable as to whether a state can continue to call itself democratic with any honesty (it could of course call itself democratic in the manner of the former 'peoples democracies') if it has to rely on such drastic measures in order to ensure that the will of the people in one of its parts actually not prevail. If the state is such that it gears itself to make war upon the people, is it at all unrealistic to assume that some people, in return will seek to defend themselves by means (which may be non violent, which may just include peaceful assembly, writing, speaking, thinking, having conversations) that nevertheless can be read by those who are partisan to the state as acts amounting to 'causing disaffection towards legally constituted authority and making war upon the state' What should such people,(who are so accused of 'causing disaffection and making war upon the state') and those who stand by them do.? What should I do?. What should, for the sake of argument, Arundhati Roy, who has been so vilified, whom people on this list have so delighted in calling a 'whore' do? (I have to add here that though neither I, nor Arundhati would think that there is anything dishonourable about whoring, I do realize that when the person who has called her a whore does so, they have not meant it as a compliment, they have instead nakedly revealed their utterly misogynist contempt for the simple fact of the difference of her opinion from theirs regarding the character of the Indian state) I wonder how and why, words like 'whore' come so easily to the lips of those, who on this list spare no effort at educating us with pious homilies about the virtues of religion and nationalism. Does this intensity of religious feeling and love for the nation breed a prediliction towards personal abuse of a particularly base kind? Is this piety another cloak for a raging, enraged, violent misanthropy and misogyny? Is it merely inevitable that our proudest patriots are also our basest, most sexist thugs? But let us not be distracted by these matters. The question before us remains. What should the people of Kashimir, what should I (and others like me on this list and elsewhere), who choose to stand by them, do? Should we and they (the people of Kashmir) 'make love', not 'war' on that state that reveals with its every word and deed that it is making war upon them/us? Is that what those who are so quick to jump to the 'sedition' gun want? Asking for that to happen is a bit like asking a woman who is going to be raped to love her rapist. To save her 'honour' by marrying the rapist. And if she is 'married' to that rapist, to not insist, ask or even dream of a divorce so that the 'unity and integrity' of the marriage can continue. She can criticize it, she can complain occasionally, (as Kshmendra so graciously suggests) but does she not know that when rapists assault women, or their wives, they do so out of deep affection? And what they demand in return is the gentle reciprocity of in-house criticism, not the ungrateful churlishness of a demand for separation, of Azaadi. Those who do so, (and I am deeply saddened that by his sentiments, Kshmendra Kaul, whose sentiments I respect, despite our differences, seems to be in their company) are determined on impressing upon us that rapists do what they do to their victims only to prove how much they really care. For me, the difference between that demand for the display of 'critical reciprocity' to a rapists love and the demand for a divorce is the difference between 'criticism' and 'sedition'. I want this cruel, suffocating, strangle of an embrace to end, and if that desire is sedition, then I would much rather be seditious than be violated. Being 'seditious' in this sense is really not about embracing a daring idea, it is just about self-preservation, and the effort to retain for oneself, a semblence of dignity and self- respect. That is all there is to it. The argument against 'sedition' can be held to have some strength in a situation where a numbing continuity of violence is not a necessary condition of the persistence of the 'union' . When the reality of a state's presence in the life of a people can only come to mean violence, then not to be seditious is to agree to be violated, on a daily basis, probably forever. My question to those who are asking for the prosecution of those being labelled 'seditious' is as follows, do you really want to be complicit in this routine, banal, prolongation of daily violation? And if you do, what do you really intend to do, in order to carry out your threat against those who choose not to be complicit? Do you really want to lock them up and throw away the keys, in keeping with the proclamations of those you applaud today? Once you have locked up all the 'seditionists' (and their tribe seems to be increasing) what will you do? A CNN-IBN poll on live TV, showed that 51 % of the viewers of a programme that discussed the pros and cons for 'Azadi' for Kashmir, and featured rabid, ranting politicians, wanted 'Azadi' for Kashmir. A TImes of India poll indicated that 41 % of Indians in major metros indicated that they wanted 'Azadi' for Kashmir. I am not one given to taking opinion polls seriously, but clearly something is changing in the bigger picture. More and more 'Indians' seem to be giving the 'Azadi for Kashmir'-option a serious consideration. If this wave of Indians who want 'Azadi for Kashmir from India' and "Azadi for India from Kashmir' swells to a tide, what will the 'anti-seditionists' do? Will they hunt 'seditious' sentiment wherever it is and lock its proponents and throw away the key? Will they make them 'disappear' just as people have been known to 'disappear' in Kashmir. Will they ensure that the channels through which 'seditious' sentiment is being expressed, mainstream newspapers, television channels, blogs, discussion lists, tea shops, class rooms, be tightly controlled and viciously monitored? Will they meticulously weed out every favourable reference to 'plebiscites in Kashmir' made by India's first prime minister? Will they drop Jayprakash Narayan's name from hospitals and institutes because he had once said things just as seditious, and about Kashmir? Will they turn their beloved Secular, Democratic, Republic into a 'People's Democracy' on the formerly Rumanian model? Or will they ensure that their beloved state comes to resemble, more and more, with every passing day, their envied doppelganger, the People's Republic of China, which has a very efficient, tried and tested mechanism for dealing with 'seditionists', which can be imported and Indianized, just as effectively as the idea of a 'special economic zone' has been? Will they expand the 'occupation of Kashmir' to the extent that it ceases to be an 'occupation of Kashmir' and becomes instead an 'occupation of India by its own armed forces. In ordinary circumstances, such situations are known as coup- de-tat's, and they happen with a depressing regularity in our neighbourhood. Is it time finally, then, for the anti-seditionists in India, to ensure that India enters the SAARC spirit by having at last, a respectable military, or quasi-military coup of it's own (After all, the people in Pakistan and Bangladesh have had so much fun all these years, and all we had were those two measly years of an internal emergency in the now forgotten seventies !) How lovely that india would be. Standing tall with Ahmednijad ruled Iran, with the Ibn Saud's nizam-e-more-stuffed Saudi Arabia, with the (some) People's Republic of China, with Czar Putin's Russia, with Cuba (where the doctrine of Socialism in one country has been refined to Socialism within one brotherhood) with the Gerontocracy of North Korea (where the doctrine of Socialism in one country has been refined to Socialism within one dynasty), with the United States under Mad King George, with Mugabe's Zimbabwe, the Burmese Junta's Myanmar and oh, even that pesky neighbour, the inconsistently military barracks of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. In each of these states, there are people locked away for sedition, with the keys thrown away. It is rumored that some of these people, especially in advanced tyrannies like Iran, Saudi Arabia and North Korea are writers and troublesome intellectuals. Perhaps, having realised and actualised this sedition-free utopia, the Indian government could then initiate a new grouping of states, to be known as the 'Sedition Suppressers Group' or SSG, to match the Nuclear Suppliers Groups (NSG). And the benefit of membership of the first grouping (SSG) could be used to console the hurt pride of a Republic that may or may not be spurned by the non-proliferationary fundamentalism of some pesky non-entity members (with no impressive track record in sedition suppression) of the other group (NSG) in the coming days. All these options are available to our proud patriots. And I would really urge all those who have been crying themselves hoarse to consider them in detail. Pawan Durani made a perceptive statement when he commented on the youtube link (forwarded by kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk in the post titled 'democracy' at work in Kashmir which contained the video of the gruesome violence meted out to an unarmed young man by CRPF personnel in Srinagar on August 17. He said, "Not that a (sic) justify this treatment,but this happens in other states." Durani's response is telling. The occupation of Kashmir produces conditions of brutality that are no longer confined to Kashmir. True, the habit of state terror is contagious, once unleashed at one end, it itches to be unleashed elsewhere. It unleashes itself, everywhere. Farmers are shot in cold blood in a suburb of Delhi, a hundred or so die in Nandigram. Its not just India that occupies Kashmir, it is the habits learnt in Kashmir that return to haunt, and to occupy india. In the end, occupation corrodes the nominal occupier as much as it corrodes the nominal occupied. That is why, once again, India needs Azadi from Kashmir, as much as Kashmir needs Azadi from India. Such an Azadi will not autmatically end the spectacle of policemen pulverizing unarmed resisters in India. But it will give to every act of resistence to that indignity a fresh lease of life. As I finish writing this, I have apprehensions of what the morning will bring. And the next many mornings. And I cannot but help end by ending this long post with a poem by Agha Shahid Ali that I have always thought of as prescient. Were he alive today, and how marvellously alive he would be if he were alive, all he might have done is to simply re-write this poem, word for word. I See Kashmir from New Delhi at Midnight Agha Shahid Ali (from "The country without a post office.") 1 One must wear jeweled ice in dry plains to will the distant mountains to glass. The city from where no news can come is now so visible in its curfewed night that the worst is precise: From Zero Bridge a shadow chased by searchlights is running away to find its body. On the edge of the Cantonment, where Gupkar Road ends, it shrinks almost into nothing, is nothing by Interrogation gates so it can slip, unseen, into the cells: Drippings from a suspended burning tire are falling on the back of a prisoner, the naked boy screaming, "I know nothing." 2 The shadow slips out, beckons Console Me, and somehow there, across five hundred miles, I'm sheened in moonlight, in emptied Srinagar, but without any assurance for him. On Residency Road, by Mir Pan House, unheard we speak: "I know those words by heart (you once said them by chance): In autumn when the wind blows sheer ice, the chinar leaves fall in clusters-- one by one, otherwise." "Rizwan, it's you, Rizwan, it's you," I cry out as he steps closer, the sleeves of his phiren torn. "Each night put Kashmir in your dreams," he says, then touches me, his hands crusted with snow, whispers, "I have been cold a long, long time." 3 "Don't tell my father I have died," he says, and I follow him through blood on the road and hundreds of pairs of shoes the mourners left behind, as they ran from the funeral, victims of the firing. From windows we hear grieving mothers, and snow begins to fall on us, like ash. Black on edges of flames, it cannot extinguish the neighborhoods, the homes set ablze by midnight soldiers. Kashmir is burning: By that dazzling light we see men removing statues from temples. We beg them, "Who will protect us if you leave?" They don't answer, they just disappear on the road to the plains, clutching the gods. 4 I won't tell your father you have died, Rizwan, but where has your shadow fallen, like cloth on the tomb of which saint, or the body of which unburied boy in the mountains, bullet-torn, like you, his blood sheer rubies on Himalayan snow? I've tied a knot with green thread at Shah Hamdan, to be untied only when the atrocities are stunned by your jeweled return, but no news escapes the curfew, nothing of your shadow, and I'm back, five hundred miles, taking off my ice, the mountains granite again as I see men coming from those Abodes of Snow with gods asleep like children in their arms. A poem from "The country without a post office." by Agha Shahid Ali END _______ Shuddhabrata Sengupta From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 08:53:08 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:53:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Exiles in ghettos keep fire blazing - Shankarshan Thakur Message-ID: <6353c690808242023q575fcd48ja46388ecbf676e7@mail.gmail.com> *Exiles in ghettos keep fire blazing* *SANKARSHAN THAKUR * *Link - **http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080825/jsp/nation/story_9739798.jsp * ** *Muthi (Jammu), Aug. 24: *They live eight, often ten or twelve, to a room. To call them rooms is a stretch; hovels is more appropriate — barely six by eight, the asbestos ceilings knocked low over them, a vast and suffocating narrow-laned warren. They do with temporary power pulled on illicit lines, they have little access to water, they share unsanitary community bathrooms. They live marooned in the putrid discharge oozing from them, amid foraging pigs and pie-dogs. These are Kashmiri Pandits uprooted from their Valley moorings two decades ago, and Muthi, on the forsaken outskirts of Jammu, is their home — a blistered tinderbox of frustration and rage, spewing communal pus. In Muthi, and other similar "migrant camps" littered around Jammu, could lie some of the clues to why this crisis has caught fires that refuse to die. It's so angry, it doesn't even want to talk. "Go away, just go away," protests P.N. Dhar, a former government employee and community leader. "What have you come here now for? To use us to douse the fires those (expletive deleted) Kashmiri Muslims are lighting up? Too late, now it's our turn to light the fires, to get some notice from this country." Men from the ghetto have gathered around Dhar and it is instantly evident they have unspent payloads of fury and hatred accumulated over the years; they are now letting it off. "This country has only been bothered about (expletive deleted) who carry Pakistani flags and spit on patriots," says Sahabji Chrungoo, originally from Baramulla. "Nobody came when we were thrown out, nobody bothered when we were killed, nobody listened when we warned secession had gripped Kashmir. But how long could you have ignored it? This had to happen. If we have to light fires now to get attention, so be it. But this time, we will have it our way." As an unprecedented regional-communal conflict consumes the state, the Valley's ousted Kashmiri Pandits have become Jammu's sword-arm in battle. It's a sword smelted in decades of unassuaged grievance and of rancour and prejudice. It's a sword that has verily stabbed the celebrated and inclusive notion of "Kashmiriyat" to death and invoked in its place a ghoulish spectre of intolerance that threatens to extend the current rift. Agnishekhar, convener of Panun Kashmir, the umbrella body of ousted Pandits, isn't even remorseful or apologetic about pronouncing "Kashmiriyat" dead. "What about it?" he asks combatively. "Where is composite culture when all Hindus have been driven out of the Valley, out of their homes and farmlands? They killed Kashmiriyat, not us. Don't expect secularism of us when you are pandering to all shades of Islam and anti-nationalism in the Valley. Who is secular in the Valley that Jammu is being called communal in contrast? Those who are unleashing cries of Nizam-e-Mustafa (Islamic rule)?" The Panun Kashmir leader won't openly admit it, but the strident "Bam-Bam Bole" movement across Jammu is an hour of vindication that he is loath to let go of. "We have been waiting for this for long," he says. "Jammu didn't exactly welcome us when we were driven out of the Valley in 1989-90, we haven't had it easy here. But now Jammu seems to have understood what the problem with Kashmiri Muslims is, it has risen and we are with Jammu. This is not about land in Amarnath, this is about a deeper malaise of which Amarnath is only a symptom. Kashmir has held India to ransom for too long, now it is our turn. Half the Kashmiri leadership deserves to be put behind bars for sedition, we deserve to be reinstated to our homes." Does he realistically believe, though, that he and his fellow Pandits can make their way back to the Valley laden with such loathing? That they can even, in this surcharge, visualise the "yatra" to Amarnath proceeding next year? "That is for the government to ensure," Agnishekhar says. "Why does the law of the land not run in Kashmir, can Indians not go there? The government and secularists of this country have nothing to say of the anti-national Islamists of Kashmir, all they can do is blame us. What for? For agitating with the national flag?" As his Muthi compatriots gather, a little clutch that has mushroomed in minutes, Agnishekhar, also a Hindi writer of fair renown, crossly throws off the burden of bigotry from his doorstep. "I was once known as a progressive writer, until they threw me out for protesting the ouster of Pandits and began calling me a religious zealot. But should I not even protest my circumstances? Won't you if you were thrown out of home? *Hum aah bhi karen to ho jaate hain badnaam, woh katl bhi karen to charcha nahin hota* (I get defamed if I so much as complain, they commit murder and yet get no blame)." Agnishekhar claims no allegiance to the BJP or the Hindu rightwing, he's been a Congressman all his life, paid obeisance to Nehru. He does concede, though, that today his worldview is closer to the Hindu rightwing. "Where are Nehru's children, where is the Congress, feeding the Muslim communalists of the Valley?" he asks. "It's the BJP that helped us in crisis, if anybody did, we have to be grateful. And now we have to fight its battle to the very end." The assemblage behind him, virulently anti-Muslim and sporting saffron bandannas, is ominously nodding approval. From pawan.durani at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 10:18:59 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 10:18:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <939675.33394.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <6353c690808241116p1dfcabbbsafa1fc662950c242@mail.gmail.com> <939675.33394.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808242148u5147fcafpbb94530d6fe2a9b4@mail.gmail.com> Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding of Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! I wonder how many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very good only at divisions. Pawan On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one policy prescription in Kashmir - > whole scale murder. A friend who has been at very top post in IB recently > wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to live in India should > migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March whole Kashmir would > have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my view - life is more > precious than land. > In 1947 - quarter a million were massacred in Jammu and two million forced > to migrate. > In 1990 - 100,000 Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri > Muslims from villages along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. > In 2008 - thousands of Muslim families have been forced to leave Jammu and > adjoining Hindu majority areas. > - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of > scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. > Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - Mimesis and Violence. > > Murtaza Shibli > www.kashmiraffairs.org > > > --- On Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore > To: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, 24 August, 2008, 7:16 PM > > *Oranges won't work anymore* > > By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI > > > The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on August 13 > after > an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their supporters, > who > alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also denied the > President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider protests. There > is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are far > removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security forces > that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between chaos and > order. > > In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for taking a > tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the > situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General > restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and terrorists > who will now think that they can get away with anything. > > Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of appeasement > and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. Terrorism in > the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will to deal > with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, the > daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a former > Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then > Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the > separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of chain > reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to these > events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at the time. > > The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet has > today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > enforcing > the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and cinema > houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a laudable > speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this year as > he > appealed to the masses to shun communalism. > > But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a > communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community generates > communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by > terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC into > Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who cross the > LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country. > > A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people > contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a > mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared legal > tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that > 'transferring' 97 > acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the > present > crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to create > disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & > Kashmir > Government: > > "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 security > personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the middle of > February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 security > personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the > State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another 1,678 lost > their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, while > 173 > civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between militants. A > total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents between > security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 civilians were > killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven year, > while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary personnel > lost > their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police > lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police > Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were > killed. > 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting militants in the > State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in 2001, which > was again the highest." > > Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is > being > done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call > given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the > faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are > used > to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in > the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then > Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself > led to protests. > > It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. > During > my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the > co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, installed > CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a situation > like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly > communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove > anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth to > depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of > terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > if > not completely banned. > > Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be immobilised > by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The > Government has announced financial assistance for the families of > terrorists > on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning member of > their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with danger and > the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a scheme to help > traitors. > > Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the Valley. With > Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or > election > will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to drive > the > Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the country of > their > origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these militants who > are > nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the > right signal that the Government means business. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 11:07:11 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 11:07:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <8ED2B703-DBDD-4FEA-A45F-5229882B029A@sarai.net> Message-ID: Actually, neither did Mehbooba Mufti! Her father, Mufti Mohd. Sayeed was the chief minister. She's always been party president. On 8/25/08 1:37 AM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > The ex director of the CBI, also happens to get the name and persona of the > kidnapped daughter of Mufti Muhammad Syed. It wasn't Mehbooba Mufti, it was > her sister, Rubaiya Syed, then a medical student. Rubaiya Syed never became > the chief minister of Kashmir, Mehbooba Mufti did. In the case of an > ordinary person, such a slip is perhaps understandable. But the person > making the slip happens to have occupied the topmost echelons of a part of > the so called 'security' apparatus in India, and is a decorated and > loquacious former police officer. This gives us an accurate picture of how > well the bureaucrats and spin doctors who are attempting to manage Kashmir > actually know anything about what is going on in the ground. The nakedness > of their humbuggery is pretty evident. It also gives us a fairly reasonable > idea of how seriously to take their conjectures and > figures. regards, Shuddha > you post an article by the ex-director of > the CBI which quotes > reports of > the J & K government as its "source" and > you expect people to take you > seriously??...come on! > > On Sun, Aug 24, > 2008 at 11:46 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > >> > *Oranges won't work anymore* >> >> By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI >> >> >> > The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on >> August 13 >> > after >> an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their >> > supporters, >> who >> alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He > was also >> denied the >> President's police medal for fear of controversy > and wider >> protests. There >> is nothing new in this kind of approach as > the decision-makers are >> far >> removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the > police and the security >> forces >> that continue to face life-and-death > situations, standing between >> chaos and >> order. >> >> In 1990s, the > then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for >> taking a >> tough stand > against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the >> situation, nor > will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General >> restore peace. On > the contrary, it will embolden separatists and >> terrorists >> who will now > think that they can get away with anything. >> >> Wherever the Government of > the day has pursued the policy of >> appeasement >> and has compromised on > basic values, it has invited trouble. >> Terrorism in >> the Valley > flourishes in direct proportion to the political will >> to deal >> with the > same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba >> Mufti, the >> > daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now >> a > former >> Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the > then >> Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the >> > separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series >> of > chain >> reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to >> > these >> events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at >> > the time. >> >> The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the > >> carpet has >> today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the > people; >> enforcing >> the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty > parlours and >> cinema >> houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before > him, gave a >> laudable >> speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on > Independence day this >> year as >> he >> appealed to the masses to shun > communalism. >> >> But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir > Valley is >> based on a >> communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in > one community >> generates >> communalism in others. Otherwise, how could > hordes of people led by >> terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of > crossing the LoC >> into >> Muzaffarabad? The Government should have > responded that those who >> cross the >> LoC illegally will not be allowed > back into the country. >> >> A series of misconceived policies, or the > so-called people-to-people >> contact, have brought about this situation. > Otherwise, how could a >> mainstream political party demand that Pakistani > currency be >> declared legal >> tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be > wrong to say that >> 'transferring' 97 >> acres of forest land to the Sri > Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the >> present >> crisis. The separatists and > terrorists have been going all-out to >> create >> disturbances and problems > as per the following report of the Jammu & >> Kashmir >> Government: >> >> "A > total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 >> security >> > personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the >> middle > of >> February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 >> > security >> personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in > the >> State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another >> > 1,678 lost >> their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device > explosions, >> while >> 173 >> civilians were killed when they were caught > in clashes between >> militants. A >> total of 3,404 civilians were killed > in cross-firing incidents >> between >> security forces and militants... The > highest number of 1,438 >> civilians were >> killed in 1996, the year > elections were held after a gap of seven >> year, >> while the highest > number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary >> personnel >> lost >> their > lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir >> Police >> > lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police >> > Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were >> > killed. >> 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting >> > militants in the >> State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year > in >> 2001, which >> was again the highest." >> >> Now, the question arises > as to what can be done. Also whether >> what is >> being >> done is > sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by >> the call >> > given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the >> > faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as >> now, > are >> used >> to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people > to >> gather in >> the streets or at a particular spot to stage > demonstrations. The then >> Governor had ordered the disconnection of these > loudspeakers, >> which itself >> led to protests. >> >> It is a fact that > many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. >> During >> my recent > visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the >> co-operation of > the Muslim community and their religious leaders, >> installed >> CCTV > cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a >> situation >> > like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly >> > communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove >> > anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come >> forth > to >> depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of >> > terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be >> > discouraged, >> if >> not completely banned. >> >> Terrorist leaders, their > supporters and sympathisers should be >> immobilised >> by using the present > laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The >> Government has announced > financial assistance for the families of >> terrorists >> on the grounds that > it is not their fault if the only earning >> member of >> their family > becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with >> danger and >> the > sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a >> scheme to > help >> traitors. >> >> Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum > in the >> Valley. With >> Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, > any referendum or >> election >> will be irrelevant at this point of time. The > first priority is to >> drive >> the >> Pakistani terrorists out of the > Valley and send them to the >> country of >> their >> origin. The Government > should stop all dialogue with these >> militants who >> are >> nothing more > than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will >> send the >> right > signal that the Government means business. >> > _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: > send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the > subject header. >> To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The > Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 11:40:50 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:10:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <745844.86517.qm@web57210.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Actually she has not "always" been President of the Party. She also had a stint as Vice-President of PDP.   Let the nitpicking continue.   --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Aarti Sethi" Cc: "Sarai" Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 11:07 AM Actually, neither did Mehbooba Mufti! Her father, Mufti Mohd. Sayeed was the chief minister. She's always been party president. On 8/25/08 1:37 AM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > The ex director of the CBI, also happens to get the name and persona of the > kidnapped daughter of Mufti Muhammad Syed. It wasn't Mehbooba Mufti, it was > her sister, Rubaiya Syed, then a medical student. Rubaiya Syed never became > the chief minister of Kashmir, Mehbooba Mufti did. In the case of an > ordinary person, such a slip is perhaps understandable. But the person > making the slip happens to have occupied the topmost echelons of a part of > the so called 'security' apparatus in India, and is a decorated and > loquacious former police officer. This gives us an accurate picture of how > well the bureaucrats and spin doctors who are attempting to manage Kashmir > actually know anything about what is going on in the ground. The nakedness > of their humbuggery is pretty evident. It also gives us a fairly reasonable > idea of how seriously to take their conjectures and > figures. regards, Shuddha > you post an article by the ex-director of > the CBI which quotes > reports of > the J & K government as its "source" and > you expect people to take you > seriously??...come on! > > On Sun, Aug 24, > 2008 at 11:46 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > >> > *Oranges won't work anymore* >> >> By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI >> >> >> > The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on >> August 13 >> > after >> an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their >> > supporters, >> who >> alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He > was also >> denied the >> President's police medal for fear of controversy > and wider >> protests. There >> is nothing new in this kind of approach as > the decision-makers are >> far >> removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the > police and the security >> forces >> that continue to face life-and-death > situations, standing between >> chaos and >> order. >> >> In 1990s, the > then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for >> taking a >> tough stand > against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the >> situation, nor > will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General >> restore peace. On > the contrary, it will embolden separatists and >> terrorists >> who will now > think that they can get away with anything. >> >> Wherever the Government of > the day has pursued the policy of >> appeasement >> and has compromised on > basic values, it has invited trouble. >> Terrorism in >> the Valley > flourishes in direct proportion to the political will >> to deal >> with the > same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba >> Mufti, the >> > daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now >> a > former >> Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the > then >> Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the >> > separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series >> of > chain >> reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to >> > these >> events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at >> > the time. >> >> The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the > >> carpet has >> today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the > people; >> enforcing >> the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty > parlours and >> cinema >> houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before > him, gave a >> laudable >> speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on > Independence day this >> year as >> he >> appealed to the masses to shun > communalism. >> >> But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir > Valley is >> based on a >> communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in > one community >> generates >> communalism in others. Otherwise, how could > hordes of people led by >> terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of > crossing the LoC >> into >> Muzaffarabad? The Government should have > responded that those who >> cross the >> LoC illegally will not be allowed > back into the country. >> >> A series of misconceived policies, or the > so-called people-to-people >> contact, have brought about this situation. > Otherwise, how could a >> mainstream political party demand that Pakistani > currency be >> declared legal >> tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be > wrong to say that >> 'transferring' 97 >> acres of forest land to the Sri > Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the >> present >> crisis. The separatists and > terrorists have been going all-out to >> create >> disturbances and problems > as per the following report of the Jammu & >> Kashmir >> Government: >> >> "A > total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 >> security >> > personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the >> middle > of >> February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 >> > security >> personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in > the >> State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another >> > 1,678 lost >> their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device > explosions, >> while >> 173 >> civilians were killed when they were caught > in clashes between >> militants. A >> total of 3,404 civilians were killed > in cross-firing incidents >> between >> security forces and militants... The > highest number of 1,438 >> civilians were >> killed in 1996, the year > elections were held after a gap of seven >> year, >> while the highest > number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary >> personnel >> lost >> their > lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir >> Police >> > lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police >> > Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were >> > killed. >> 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting >> > militants in the >> State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year > in >> 2001, which >> was again the highest." >> >> Now, the question arises > as to what can be done. Also whether >> what is >> being >> done is > sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by >> the call >> > given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the >> > faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as >> now, > are >> used >> to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people > to >> gather in >> the streets or at a particular spot to stage > demonstrations. The then >> Governor had ordered the disconnection of these > loudspeakers, >> which itself >> led to protests. >> >> It is a fact that > many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. >> During >> my recent > visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the >> co-operation of > the Muslim community and their religious leaders, >> installed >> CCTV > cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a >> situation >> > like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly >> > communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove >> > anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come >> forth > to >> depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of >> > terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be >> > discouraged, >> if >> not completely banned. >> >> Terrorist leaders, their > supporters and sympathisers should be >> immobilised >> by using the present > laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The >> Government has announced > financial assistance for the families of >> terrorists >> on the grounds that > it is not their fault if the only earning >> member of >> their family > becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with >> danger and >> the > sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a >> scheme to > help >> traitors. >> >> Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum > in the >> Valley. With >> Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, > any referendum or >> election >> will be irrelevant at this point of time. The > first priority is to >> drive >> the >> Pakistani terrorists out of the > Valley and send them to the >> country of >> their >> origin. The Government > should stop all dialogue with these >> militants who >> are >> nothing more > than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will >> send the >> right > signal that the Government means business. >> > _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: > send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the > subject header. >> To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The > Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From rahulroy63 at gmail.com Sun Aug 24 17:24:59 2008 From: rahulroy63 at gmail.com (Rahul Roy) Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 17:24:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [DFA NewsLetter] Fwd: WSP Invites you to a documentary film "Born to Sing" In-Reply-To: <5a4334630808240452q5c28141ateb840a6978290403@mail.gmail.com> References: <765a15040808192342i45f53d8l6f9897ff0c5c7f27@mail.gmail.com> <5a4334630808240452q5c28141ateb840a6978290403@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: shikha jhingan Date: Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 5:47 PM Subject: Fwd: WSP Invites you to a documentary film "Born to Sing" To: delhifilmarchive at gmail.com *Women's Studies Programme, JNU Invites you to a documentary film Born to Sing directed by Shikha Jhingan Shikha Jhingan is an independent documentary film-maker based in Delhi. She is a founder member of Media-storm, an independent women's film making collective formed in Delhi in 1986. At present Shikha is teaching in the Department of Journalism at Lady Shri Ram College, University of Delhi. on Date: 26th August 2008 Time: 3.00 p.m. Venue: Committee Room No.002, SSS-II, JNU. * * **Synopsis:* *Born to Sing is a musical journey with four Mirasans, who sing life-cycle songs for their patrons in Punjab. Through an encounter with four Mirasans and their songs, the film explores a rich musical and oral tradition kept alive by these women. What is the nature of their relationship with their land-owning patrons? What happens when Punjabi pop music takes the entertainment industry by storm? How are the Mirasans dealing with dwindling patronage and pressures from men of their community? The documentary tries to grapple with these concerns faced by women who find themselves shunted out of their expressive traditions. At another level, music becomes a vehicle to explore the resilience of Malwa's composite culture. Video/2001/44mins./English with subtitles Produced by IGNCA. Camera: Sabeena Gadihoke; Sound: Surinder Prasad; Editing: Shikha Jhingan * - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Please DO NOT REPLY to the sender. To contact the MODERATOR: delhifilmarchive [at] gmail.com To UNSUBSCRIBE: send an email to delhifilmarchive-unsubscribe at googlegroups.com More OPTIONS are on the web: http://groups.google.com/group/delhifilmarchive Our WEBSITE: www.delhifilmarchive.org -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Mon Aug 25 13:39:18 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:09:18 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808242148u5147fcafpbb94530d6fe2a9b4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <366520.33042.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Pawan, - There is by no way, I repeat no way, more than 100,000 Kashmiri Pandits as migrants. And this number is almost same as those Kashmiri Muslims who were forced to migrate to Muzzaffarabad. While I am not trivilizing migration (without any prejudice to the stated cause) I think it is important that when we talk about migration - we have to talk about both. In addition, two million Kashmiri migrants living in various Pakistani cities have to be included into it as there is at least half a million of them who would like to come back. in solidarity, Murtaza --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Pawan Durani wrote: From: Pawan Durani Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, "Aditya Raj Kaul" Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 5:48 AM Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding of Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! I wonder how many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very good only at divisions. Pawan  On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs wrote: Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one policy prescription in Kashmir - whole scale murder. A friend who has been at very top post in IB recently wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to live in India should migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March whole Kashmir would have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my view - life is more precious than land. In 1947 - quarter a million were massacred in Jammu and two million forced to migrate. In 1990 - 100,000 Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri Muslims from villages along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. In 2008 - thousands of Muslim families have been forced to leave Jammu and adjoining Hindu majority areas. - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - Mimesis and Violence. Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffairs.org --- On Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: From: Aditya Raj Kaul Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, 24 August, 2008, 7:16 PM  *Oranges won't work anymore* By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI  The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on August 13 after an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their supporters, who alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also denied the President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider protests. There is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are far removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security forces that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between chaos and order.  In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for taking a tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and terrorists who will now think that they can get away with anything.  Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of appeasement and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. Terrorism in the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will to deal with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, the daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a former Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of chain reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to these events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at the time.  The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet has today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; enforcing the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and cinema houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a laudable speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this year as he appealed to the masses to shun communalism.  But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community generates communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC into Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who cross the LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country.  A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared legal tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that 'transferring' 97 acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the present crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to create disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & Kashmir Government:  "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 security personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the middle of February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 security personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another 1,678 lost their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, while 173 civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between militants. A total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents between security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 civilians were killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven year, while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary personnel lost their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were killed. 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting militants in the State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in 2001, which was again the highest."  Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are used to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself led to protests.  It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. During my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, installed CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a situation like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth to depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, if not completely banned.  Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be immobilised by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The Government has announced financial assistance for the families of terrorists on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning member of their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with danger and the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a scheme to help traitors.  Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the Valley. With Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or election will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to drive the Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the country of their origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these militants who are nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the right signal that the Government means business. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From iram at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 14:12:21 2008 From: iram at sarai.net (Iram Ghufran) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 14:12:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Fwd: Photography Comes to India - Professor Christopher Pinney Message-ID: <48B2706D.8010701@sarai.net> Fwd:========================== Indira Gandhi National Centre for the Arts New Delhi ============================== An illustrated talk by Professor Christopher Pinney on Photography Comes to India on 4th September, 2008 at 5:30 pm at IGNCA Conference Hall, 5 Rajendra Prasad Road, (entry form Mansingh Road) New Delhi - 110 001 All are invited ============================== _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 14:13:29 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 14:13:29 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <366520.33042.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <6b79f1a70808242148u5147fcafpbb94530d6fe2a9b4@mail.gmail.com> <366520.33042.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808250143w28cc3c88r2e9ed5e288773e25@mail.gmail.com> Though the number is much higher then your figure, even the govt. is quoted around 3.5 lakhs. You can't just club KP Exodus with any other. By that logic, even those few hundred killings of Kashmiri Muslims can be compared with killings of local goons such as Bunty etc. in Delhi, UP, Haryana etc. Both have hand in criminal activities and meet safe fate. Please have some level; don't stoop so low to distract the people. Still, there are more than 50,000 Kashmiri Pandit refugee's languishing in camps on the outskirts of Jammu. The exodus of this minority community was one of the biggest in the modern history. Have some guts to condemn your so called leaders Yasin Malik etc who killed so many innocents mercilessly. Their hands are soaked in blood; and then they talk of Aazadi. A communal propaganda doesn't last long; same will be the case here. Keep up with your hatred spree.... On 8/25/08, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > > Pawan, > - There is by no way, I repeat no way, more than 100,000 Kashmiri Pandits > as migrants. And this number is almost same as those Kashmiri Muslims who > were forced to migrate to Muzzaffarabad. While I am not trivilizing > migration (without any prejudice to the stated cause) I think it is > important that when we talk about migration - we have to talk about both. In > addition, two million Kashmiri migrants living in various Pakistani cities > have to be included into it as there is at least half a million of them who > would like to come back. > > in solidarity, > Murtaza > > --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Pawan Durani wrote: > From: Pawan Durani > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore > To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, "Aditya Raj Kaul" > Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 5:48 AM > > Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding of > Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! > I wonder how many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very > good only at divisions. > > Pawan > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs > wrote: > > Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one policy prescription in Kashmir - > whole scale murder. A friend who has been at very top post in IB recently > wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to live in India should > migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March whole Kashmir would > have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my view - life is more > precious than land. > > > In 1947 - quarter a million were massacred in Jammu and two million forced > to migrate. > > In 1990 - 100,000 Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri > Muslims from villages along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. > > In 2008 - thousands of Muslim families have been forced to leave Jammu and > adjoining Hindu majority areas. > > - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of > scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. > > Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - Mimesis and Violence. > > > > Murtaza Shibli > > www.kashmiraffairs.org > > > > > > --- On Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore > > To: "sarai list" > > Date: Sunday, 24 August, 2008, 7:16 PM > > > > *Oranges won't work anymore* > > > > By Joginder Singh, Ex-Director CBI > > > > > > The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar on August 13 after > > an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and their supporters, > who > > alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He was also denied the > > President's police medal for fear of controversy and wider protests. There > > is nothing new in this kind of approach as the decision-makers are far > > removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and the security forces > > that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing between chaos and > > order. > > > > In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir lost his job for taking a > > tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That did not help the > > situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF Inspector-General > > restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden separatists and terrorists > > who will now think that they can get away with anything. > > > > Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of appeasement > > and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. Terrorism in > > the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will to deal > > with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, the > > daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a former > > Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the then > > Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened the > > separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of chain > > reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to these > > events as I was the InspectorGeneral of the CRPF in Srinagar at the time. > > > > The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet has > > today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > enforcing > > the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and cinema > > houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a laudable > > speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this year as > he > > appealed to the masses to shun communalism. > > > > But unfortunately, the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a > > communal ideology. The truth is, communalism in one community generates > > communalism in others. Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by > > terrorists start a rally with the declared aim of crossing the LoC into > > Muzaffarabad? The Government should have responded that those who cross the > > LoC illegally will not be allowed back into the country. > > > > A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called people-to-people > > contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how could a > > mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared legal > > tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say that > > 'transferring' 97 > > acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board has led to the > present > > crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going all-out to create > > disturbances and problems as per the following report of the Jammu & > > Kashmir > > Government: > > > > "A total of 42,147 people, including 20,647 militants and 5,024 security > > personnel were killed in the State between January 1990 and the middle of > > February 2007... Violence left 33,885 people, including 12,124 security > > personnel and 21,659 civilians injured during the same period in the > > State... 11,221 civilians were killed by militants and another 1,678 lost > > their lives in grenade and Improvised Explosive Device explosions, while > 173 > > civilians were killed when they were caught in clashes between militants. A > > total of 3,404 civilians were killed in cross-firing incidents between > > security forces and militants... The highest number of 1,438 civilians were > > killed in 1996, the year elections were held after a gap of seven year, > > while the highest number of 3,602 Army and other paramilitary personnel > lost > > their lives fighting militants in the same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police > > lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As many as 438 Special Police > > Officers engaged by the police in counter-insurgency operations were > killed. > > 127 Village Defence Committee members were killed fighting militants in the > > State. 613 security personnel were killed in a single year in 2001, which > > was again the highest." > > > > Now, the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being > > done is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call > > given by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the > > faithful to prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are > > used > > to give calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in > > the streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then > > Governor had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself > > led to protests. > > > > It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of worship. During > > my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, with the > > co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, installed > > CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a situation > > like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been highly > > communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to prove > > anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth to > > depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen of > > terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > if > > not completely banned. > > > > Terrorist leaders, their supporters and sympathisers should be immobilised > > by using the present laws and detained outside Jammu & Kashmir. The > > Government has announced financial assistance for the families of > terrorists > > on the grounds that it is not their fault if the only earning member of > > their family becomes a militant. This approach is fraught with danger and > > the sooner it is given up the better. It should not become a scheme to help > > traitors. > > > > Many so-called intellectuals talk about a referendum in the Valley. With > > Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India movement, any referendum or > election > > will be irrelevant at this point of time. The first priority is to drive > the > > Pakistani terrorists out of the Valley and send them to the country of > their > > origin. The Government should stop all dialogue with these militants who > are > > nothing more than agents of Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the > > right signal that the Government means business. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 14:41:52 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 14:41:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <366520.33042.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Murtaza, The official figures of GoI put the Pandit refugees or internally displaced persons (not migrants) at 100,000. The Pandit organisations dispute that and claim a higher number. You put the numbers of Muslims massacred in Jammu in 1947 as 250,000. The Statesman correspondent in '47 had reported 60,000 dead. Since I found this a very high figure even when compared to massacres in the Punjab (because the killings in Jammu happened within a much shorter period) I had interviewed old-timers of Jammu who were witness to the times and specifically asked about this figure. Each had felt the figure highly exaggerated-- including Ved Bhasin, Balraj Puri and others who have otherwise opposed communalism all their lives. You also quote the number of Kashmiri refugees post-1990 in Pakistan as 100,000. This is again an inflated figure. The official Pakistani figure is 15,000. When I met with Kashmiri youth in Rawalpindi 2 years ago and they had asked me to do something to enable them to return, they had put their figures at 30,000. I would guess it's somewhere in the middle. In times of crisis some feel the need to inflate figures. If there are 6 rapes it's not good enough, it has to be the whole village of women. If 2,000 are killed it seems insignificant when other sites of horror like Cambodia, Vietnam, the battlefields of the First World War, the concentration camps of the Second can claim millions dead. Can we pause for a moment and see what it is we are doing? On 8/25/08 1:39 PM, "Kashmir Affairs" wrote: > Pawan, - There is by no way, I repeat no way, more than 100,000 Kashmiri > Pandits as migrants. And this number is almost same as those Kashmiri Muslims > who were forced to migrate to Muzzaffarabad. While I am not trivilizing > migration (without any prejudice to the stated cause) I think it is important > that when we talk about migration - we have to talk about both. In addition, > two million Kashmiri migrants living in various Pakistani cities have to be > included into it as there is at least half a million of them who would like to > come back. in solidarity, Murtaza --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Pawan Durani > wrote: From: Pawan Durani > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > anymore To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, "Aditya Raj > Kaul" Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 5:48 > AM Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding of > Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! I wonder how > many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very good only at > divisions. Pawan  On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs > wrote: Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one > policy prescription in Kashmir - whole scale murder. A friend who has been at > very top post in IB recently wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to > live in India should migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March > whole Kashmir would have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my > view - life is more precious than land. In 1947 - quarter a million were > massacred in Jammu and two million forced to migrate. In 1990 - 100,000 > Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri Muslims from villages > along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. In 2008 - thousands of Muslim > families have been forced to leave Jammu and adjoining Hindu majority > areas. - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of > scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - > Mimesis and Violence. Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffairs.org --- On > Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: From: Aditya > Raj Kaul Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > anymore To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, 24 August, > 2008, 7:16 PM  *Oranges won't work anymore* By Joginder Singh, > Ex-Director CBI  The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar > on August 13 after an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and > their supporters, who alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He > was also denied the President's police medal for fear of controversy and > wider protests. There is nothing new in this kind of approach as the > decision-makers are far removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and > the security forces that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing > between chaos and order.  In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir > lost his job for taking a tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That > did not help the situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF > Inspector-General restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden > separatists and terrorists who will now think that they can get away with > anything.  Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of > appeasement and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. > Terrorism in the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will > to deal with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, > the daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a > former Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the > then Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened > the separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of > chain reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to > these events as I was the InspectorGeneralof the CRPF in Srinagar at the > time.  The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet > has today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > enforcing the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and > cinema houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a > laudable speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this > year as he appealed to the masses to shun communalism.  But unfortunately, > the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a communal ideology. > The truth is, communalism in one community generates communalism in others. > Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by terrorists start a rally with > the declared aim of crossing the LoC into Muzaffarabad? The Government should > have responded that those who cross the LoC illegally will not be allowed > back into the country.  A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called > people-to-people contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how > could a mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared > legal tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say > that 'transferring' 97 acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board > has led to the present crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going > all-out to create disturbances and problems as per the following report of > the Jammu & Kashmir Government:  "A total of 42,147 people, including > 20,647 militants and 5,024 security personnel were killed in the State > between January 1990 and the middle of February 2007... Violence left 33,885 > people, including 12,124 security personnel and 21,659 civilians injured > during the same period in the State... 11,221 civilians were killed by > militants and another 1,678 lost their lives in grenade and Improvised > Explosive Device explosions, while 173 civilians were killed when they were > caught in clashes between militants. A total of 3,404 civilians were killed > in cross-firing incidents between security forces and militants... The > highest number of 1,438 civilians were killed in 1996, the year elections > were held after a gap of seven year, while the highest number of 3,602 Army > and other paramilitary personnel lost their lives fighting militants in the > same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As > many as 438 Special Police Officers engaged by the police in > counter-insurgency operations were killed. 127 Village Defence Committee > members were killed fighting militants in the State. 613 security personnel > were killed in a single year in 2001, which was again the highest."  Now, > the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being done > is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call given > by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the faithful to > prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are used to give > calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in the > streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then Governor > had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself led to > protests.  It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of > worship. During my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, > with the co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, > installed CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a > situation like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been > highly communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to > prove anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth > to depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen > of terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > if not completely banned.  Terrorist leaders, their supporters and > sympathisers should be immobilised by using the present laws and detained > outside Jammu & Kashmir. The Government has announced financial assistance > for the families of terrorists on the grounds that it is not their fault if > the only earning member of their family becomes a militant. This approach is > fraught with danger and the sooner it is given up the better. It should not > become a scheme to help traitors.  Many so-called intellectuals talk about > a referendum in the Valley. With Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India > movement, any referendum or election will be irrelevant at this point of > time. The first priority is to drive the Pakistani terrorists out of the > Valley and send them to the country of their origin. The Government should > stop all dialogue with these militants who are nothing more than agents of > Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the right signal that the > Government means > business. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > Send instant messages to > your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ read > er-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > Send instant messages to > your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader > -list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 15:59:37 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 15:59:37 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Activists oppose separatist movement in Kashmir In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250328w55946b27i7bea131f6f98e000@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808250328w55946b27i7bea131f6f98e000@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808250329x51383d09u6bcde8a67c133418@mail.gmail.com> *Activists oppose separatist movement in Kashmir * *25 Aug 2008, * ** *Mohammed Wajihuddin* *The Times of India* ** *Link - http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Mumbai/Activists_oppose_separatist_movement_in_Kashmir_/articleshow/3401078.cms * *Mumbai:* A section of intelligentsia and secular activists have opposed some intellectuals for favouring the struggle for azadi in Kashmir. If the separatists ' demand to divide India once again on religious ground is met, the activists feared, it would ignite several dormant secessionists' movements in other parts of the country. Also, the independence of the Muslim-dominated Kashmir from India may lead to a massive backlash against Muslims in other parts of the country, the activists felt. "Kashmir is an integral part of India. The idea of allowing Kashmir to the separatists just because a section of Pak-backed people don't want to live with us is preposterous ," said filmmaker Govind Nihalani. Attacking both Kashmiri separatists and the Sangh Parivar-backed Shri Amarnath Shrine Sangharsh Samiti, Nihalani said the shrine issue should have been handled more carefully. "It needs immense patience on the part of political leadershipand policy makers to handle such a sensitive issue," he said. The Muslims outside J&K have maintained complete silence over the issue so far. No major Muslim leader or group has come out openly for or against the Tehreek-e-Hurriyat's aggressive agitation. Filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt said, "The deafening silence of the Muslims from the rest of India on the Kashmir issue clearly shows they don't want to get involved in it. They are afraid of a backlash from the Hindutva hardliners." However, Hasan Kamal, a popular Urdu columnist and member of Muslims for Secular Democracy, maintained that the suggestion to allow the separatists to take away a chunk of Kashmir is outrageous . Many secular activists felt that no genuine attempt had been made to understand the mind of the Kashmiris. "The fact that the matter of land transfer to the Amarnath Shrine Board was allowed to snowball into a huge crisis shows the inefficiency of the entire political leadership. The lawenforcing agencies will have to stamp out anti-national activities ," said Ashok Pandit, a leader of Panun Kashmir, an organisation of Kashmiri Pandits living outside the valley. From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 16:05:53 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:05:53 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] J&K divide: diplomacy versus democracy In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250335t26111895uae81d3caf7947315@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808250335t26111895uae81d3caf7947315@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808250335q1821883dlb217efdc4a7cb2fa@mail.gmail.com> FIFTH COLUMN J&K divide: diplomacy versus democracy Tavleen Singh *Sunday, August 24, 2008 - The Indian Express* ** *Link - http://www.indianexpress.com/story/352574.html* As an 'argumentative Indian' it pleases me when someone starts an argument with me. It pleases me even more when the challenger is a respected intellectual with more years of journalistic experience than little old me. So I was flattered that Prem Shankar Jha should consider it worthwhile to write a long, thoughtful piece in this newspaper last week to disagree with what I said on the current situation in Kashmir. What I said in this space was that it was disturbing not to hear Kashmir's supposedly moderate leaders speak in a moderate voice at a time when sensible voices were so badly needed. Mr Jha accused me of being "both simplistic and unjust". In his critique of my piece he gave a lengthy account of the history of the Amarnath Yatra but ended up half agreeing with me: "Ms Singh is right when she says that (Yasin) Malik, the Mirwaiz, Geelani and even Omar Abdullah and Mehbooba Mufti fanned the agitation by joining it. But had they not done so they would have written their own epitaphs in Kashmiri politics." My answer is they should have. Kashmir needs leaders not politicians in its present crisis. If all that the 'moderates' can give us is politics and political expediency it would be better if they wrote their epitaphs quickly. It would make it easier for us to deal with the secessionists and jihadis who should under Indian law be tried for treason. Ten years ago I wrote a book that blamed the Government of India squarely for denying Kashmiris their democratic rights, thereby driving them towards armed insurgency. I believe this gives me the right to say that this time the Kashmiris have no cause. No country could have dealt with a secessionist movement more gently than India has after those initial mistakes in the early nineties. The movement for azadi turned into Islamist terrorism and India did nothing. Kashmiri Hindus were ethnically cleansed from the Valley and India did nothing. Jihadis came across our borders and turned Kashmiri Islam into a Saudi facsimile and India did nothing. This is why when something as absurd as the Amarnath land row should have brought thousands of Kashmiris into the streets carrying Pakistani flags and shouting jihadi slogans the reaction from Indians has been: get out. Enough is enough. In Delhi's liberal drawing rooms they put it diplomatically. We should have a referendum, they say, and if the Kashmiris want to go to Pakistan then it's time to let them go because, poor dears, they have suffered so much for their azadi. As a reporter who prefers to listen to what ordinary people say let me tell you what I hear when I put my ear to the ground. I hear people say that anyone who wants to go to Pakistan must be allowed to leave and never allowed back into Kashmir. I hear people say that they are not prepared to surrender another inch of Indian territory. If Kashmiri Muslims have a problem living with us let them emigrate to that Islamic country across the border. Whoever wants to go must be helped to go. But, there will be no more changing of India's borders. The more belligerent say let the Kashmir Valley go to Pakistan but then there will be no room in India for Muslims. What I also hear is huge support for the movement in Jammu. So when our political leaders and politically correct TV anchors equate the two agitations they make a serious mistake. The way ordinary Indians see it is that we have one set of protesters who carry Indian flags and are ready to die for Bharat Mata and they cannot be equated with those who openly state their allegiance to Pakistan. It is no longer about the Amarnath Yatra. It is about whether the Indian state has the courage to defend India from breaking up. And, defend the values India stands for. We stand for democracy, secularism and fundamental human freedoms that include the freedom of worship. These are good values and we must defend them against those who would have us make compromises with religious fanatics and traitors. Those who do not share our values have every right to leave and find a country more suited to their way of thinking and their beliefs. But, if they choose to stay in India they must abide by the values of this land. In the name of 'secularism' Dr Manmohan Singh's Government has made too many concessions to jihadis and other lowlifes. This is being seen as a sign of weakness by those who have no compunction about waving Pakistani flags on Indian soil. If this is a 'simplistic and unjust' assessment of the situation in Kashmir so be it. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 17:40:47 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 05:10:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <112534.6381.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Sonia   You MUST be a Kashmiri Pandit pretending to be of some other ethnicity.   OR Maybe you too are an "Agent" of the Govt. of India. You could also be from the Hindutva cadre of BJP or VHP or Bajrang Dal. Heavans forbid.   These are shots in the darkness of SARAI caused by postings that are at most times filled with bias, prejudice and presumptions with added liberal (pun not intended) doses of ignorance and misrepresentations.   Whatever else you are, you come across to me as an independent thinker who is not a bandwagon-person nor is tempted into taking fashionable 'liberal' positions on issues (pun intended). That does not mean that you and I think alike on all subjects.    1.  It is reported in August 2002 that 11 polling stations have been reserved for KPs (migrants) for the about to come elections. 8 in Jammu, 2 in Udhampur and 1 in Delhi.   The report also says that 150,000 KPs (migrants) in "other" parts of the country could cast their votes by postal ballot. This is as per an Election Commission official.   This would mean that apart from the majority of  KPs (migrants) who had landed in Jammu, Udhampur and Delhi there were some 150,000 KPs (migrants) more who had moved to places other than Jammu, Udhampur and Delhi.   2.  A June 2007 report about one of the Prime Minister's Working Groups headed by Hamid Ansari quotes figures from this WG to say:    " ..........the total population of Kashmiri Pandits in the valley before migration was about 3.5 lakh. While a majority migrated to Jammu and other parts of the country, about 18,000 stayed back as of 1997."   The report also quotes another set of figures (note that these are figures for Jammu alone) to say:   "As many as 30,206 Hindu families, 2,120 Muslim families and 1,749 Sikhs are registered as migrants with the state government and are now living in Jammu."   3. The official website of J&K Govt in an August 2000 report mentions:   "According to the Koul Report, there were 56,689 families (migrants of all communities) in Jammu and elsewhere in the country in 1997. Of them 31,490 families were in Jammu alone and 19,339 families in New Delhi."   It might be pertinent to point out that "families" were not registered as "nuclear families" but covered the direct lineage (excluding girls married out and including girls married into the family). Most cross-references for registration were linked to the "residence" in Kashmir before the 'migration'. In most cases there were 3 generations who had been living together and who were registered as a "family".   4. CIA's "The World Factbook" mentions 600,000 IDPs in India anbd says that about half of those are Kashmiri Pandits from Jammu and Kashmir.   5. The Geneva based (mandated by United Nations) Internal Displacement Monitoring Cell (IDMC)  notes that the lowest number of Kashmir Pandit IDPs found from sources was 56,246 families. It translates that into the number 250,000 and credits GOI with being the source.   IDMC notes that the Highest estimates  of (Kashmiri Pandit) IDPs found from sources was QUOTE "Maybe as many as" 450,000 UNQUOTE. It credits U.S Committee for Refugees (USCR) as the source.     Kshmendra   PS. There is another aspect of Migration/Displacement of Kashmiri Pandits which never gets highlighted.   If one may call the post 1988 displacement an 'exodus', between 1947 and 1988 also there was an outflow of Kashmir Pandits from Kashmir for various reasons that had nothing much to do with being terrorised, even if they faced intimidation.   This was because of 'lack of opportunities' in Kashmir. This 'lack of opportunities' became a 'fait accompli' forced upon the KPs when admission to professional educational institutions  (read Medical and Engineering) started taking place on the basis of religious ratio-proportions. (I think only 10% or maybe 20% of the admissions were on 'competitive' basis). This was followed by "recruitments" and "promotions" also following the same principle though this might be difficult to substantiate though there was such an "Executive Order" for "promotions" after a specified level.   This understandably led to a constant year after year diaspora out of Kashmir towards Educational Institutions and Jobs. They were not migrating out, strictly speaking, because the "permanent residence" continued to be in Kashmir with major part of the immediate family also left behind. So children studying 'out' had their parents back in Kashmir. Those who had taken up Jobs outside also had their parents in kashmir and in many cases also the spouse and children.   If this is understood, it might be easier for some to appreciate that the Internal Displacement of Kashmiri Pandits that occured as an exodus out of Kashmir post 1988 was not confined to those numbers who physically moved out of Kashmir but also those who used to but now could not go back. Many were 'forced out' by the situation. Many had to 'stay out' because of the situation.   Census figures and numbers from Electoral Rolls could never give the full picture of the Internal Displacement.          --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: "Kashmir Affairs" , "Sarai" Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 2:41 PM Dear Murtaza, The official figures of GoI put the Pandit refugees or internally displaced persons (not migrants) at 100,000. The Pandit organisations dispute that and claim a higher number. You put the numbers of Muslims massacred in Jammu in 1947 as 250,000. The Statesman correspondent in '47 had reported 60,000 dead. Since I found this a very high figure even when compared to massacres in the Punjab (because the killings in Jammu happened within a much shorter period) I had interviewed old-timers of Jammu who were witness to the times and specifically asked about this figure. Each had felt the figure highly exaggerated-- including Ved Bhasin, Balraj Puri and others who have otherwise opposed communalism all their lives. You also quote the number of Kashmiri refugees post-1990 in Pakistan as 100,000. This is again an inflated figure. The official Pakistani figure is 15,000. When I met with Kashmiri youth in Rawalpindi 2 years ago and they had asked me to do something to enable them to return, they had put their figures at 30,000. I would guess it's somewhere in the middle. In times of crisis some feel the need to inflate figures. If there are 6 rapes it's not good enough, it has to be the whole village of women. If 2,000 are killed it seems insignificant when other sites of horror like Cambodia, Vietnam, the battlefields of the First World War, the concentration camps of the Second can claim millions dead. Can we pause for a moment and see what it is we are doing? On 8/25/08 1:39 PM, "Kashmir Affairs" wrote: > Pawan, - There is by no way, I repeat no way, more than 100,000 Kashmiri > Pandits as migrants. And this number is almost same as those Kashmiri Muslims > who were forced to migrate to Muzzaffarabad. While I am not trivilizing > migration (without any prejudice to the stated cause) I think it is important > that when we talk about migration - we have to talk about both. In addition, > two million Kashmiri migrants living in various Pakistani cities have to be > included into it as there is at least half a million of them who would like to > come back. in solidarity, Murtaza --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Pawan Durani > wrote: From: Pawan Durani > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > anymore To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, "Aditya Raj > Kaul" Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 5:48 > AM Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding of > Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! I wonder how > many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very good only at > divisions. Pawan  On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs > wrote: Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one > policy prescription in Kashmir - whole scale murder. A friend who has been at > very top post in IB recently wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to > live in India should migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March > whole Kashmir would have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my > view - life is more precious than land. In 1947 - quarter a million were > massacred in Jammu and two million forced to migrate. In 1990 - 100,000 > Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri Muslims from villages > along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. In 2008 - thousands of Muslim > families have been forced to leave Jammu and adjoining Hindu majority > areas. - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of > scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - > Mimesis and Violence. Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffairs.org --- On > Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: From: Aditya > Raj Kaul Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > anymore To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, 24 August, > 2008, 7:16 PM  *Oranges won't work anymore* By Joginder Singh, > Ex-Director CBI  The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar > on August 13 after an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and > their supporters, who alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He > was also denied the President's police medal for fear of controversy and > wider protests. There is nothing new in this kind of approach as the > decision-makers are far removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and > the security forces that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing > between chaos and order.  In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir > lost his job for taking a tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That > did not help the situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF > Inspector-General restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden > separatists and terrorists who will now think that they can get away with > anything.  Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of > appeasement and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. > Terrorism in the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will > to deal with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, > the daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a > former Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the > then Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened > the separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of > chain reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to > these events as I was the InspectorGeneralof the CRPF in Srinagar at the > time.  The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet > has today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > enforcing the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and > cinema houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a > laudable speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this > year as he appealed to the masses to shun communalism.  But unfortunately, > the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a communal ideology. > The truth is, communalism in one community generates communalism in others. > Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by terrorists start a rally with > the declared aim of crossing the LoC into Muzaffarabad? The Government should > have responded that those who cross the LoC illegally will not be allowed > back into the country.  A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called > people-to-people contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how > could a mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared > legal tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say > that 'transferring' 97 acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board > has led to the present crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going > all-out to create disturbances and problems as per the following report of > the Jammu & Kashmir Government:  "A total of 42,147 people, including > 20,647 militants and 5,024 security personnel were killed in the State > between January 1990 and the middle of February 2007... Violence left 33,885 > people, including 12,124 security personnel and 21,659 civilians injured > during the same period in the State... 11,221 civilians were killed by > militants and another 1,678 lost their lives in grenade and Improvised > Explosive Device explosions, while 173 civilians were killed when they were > caught in clashes between militants. A total of 3,404 civilians were killed > in cross-firing incidents between security forces and militants... The > highest number of 1,438 civilians were killed in 1996, the year elections > were held after a gap of seven year, while the highest number of 3,602 Army > and other paramilitary personnel lost their lives fighting militants in the > same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As > many as 438 Special Police Officers engaged by the police in > counter-insurgency operations were killed. 127 Village Defence Committee > members were killed fighting militants in the State. 613 security personnel > were killed in a single year in 2001, which was again the highest."  Now, > the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being done > is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call given > by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the faithful to > prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are used to give > calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in the > streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then Governor > had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself led to > protests.  It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of > worship. During my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, > with the co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, > installed CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a > situation like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been > highly communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to > prove anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth > to depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen > of terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > if not completely banned.  Terrorist leaders, their supporters and > sympathisers should be immobilised by using the present laws and detained > outside Jammu & Kashmir. The Government has announced financial assistance > for the families of terrorists on the grounds that it is not their fault if > the only earning member of their family becomes a militant. This approach is > fraught with danger and the sooner it is given up the better. It should not > become a scheme to help traitors.  Many so-called intellectuals talk about > a referendum in the Valley. With Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India > movement, any referendum or election will be irrelevant at this point of > time. The first priority is to drive the Pakistani terrorists out of the > Valley and send them to the country of their origin. The Government should > stop all dialogue with these militants who are nothing more than agents of > Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the right signal that the > Government means > business. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > Send instant messages to > your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ read > er-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > Send instant messages to > your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader > -list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 15:01:15 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 15:01:15 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 23 reasons for another possible charge of sedition Message-ID: <9CA0BB70-DBD3-4CA8-8353-0EAE2C7DCDEA@sarai.net> Dear all, Since there is a lively debate on 'sedition' on this list, I thought I might add some more material for consideration. Were a plebiscite to be held in the Kashmir valley today, the verdict in all likelihood would not be favourable to India. But it is of course, the Indian government that first raised the question of a plebiscite when India took the Kashmir dispute to the United Nations. India, then, had promised to hear and respect the will of the people of Kashmir through the form of a plebiscite. The wheel of history, has however, come full circle. Today, asking for a plebiscite is tantamount, to some, to sedition. Here, then, are 23 reasons to charge Jawaharlal Nehru, the first Prime Minister of India, with sedition. I am copying below a list of quotes from his official communications, writings and speeches as Prime Minister of India. It should be fairly easy to cross check these against the official records, Nehru's works and the archives. If they are indeed truly what Nehru said and thought, then he is not saying anything very different from what some of us have been saying, what many amongst the people of Kashmir are currently demanding, and crucially, what has been expressed by the commentators (Roy, Anklesaria Aiyar, Pratap Bhanu Mehta, Jug Suraiya, Rajmohan Gandhi) who have been condemned or publicly charged with harbouring seditious intentions. Now, as we know, Pawan Durani has made it possible for us to think of Swami Vivekananda and SIster Nivedita as rabid Anti-Hindu, Anti- National 'Intellectuals' like Arundhati Roy and some of us on the Sarai list. Now, perhaps Aditya Raj Kaul, (in the spirit of the editorials he had posted yesterday) might want to add Nehru's name (albeit posthumously) to Roy's in the list of Indians who he might thinks would be suitable candidates for being charged with high treason. And what makes it more interesting is that Jawaharlal Nehru comes from an impeccable bloodline that has its roots in a certain disputed territory. Someone please remind me which one it is. regards Shuddha _____________ JAWAHARLAL NEHRU ON KASHMIR AND PLEBISCITE 1. “Our view which we have repeatedly made public is that the question of accession in any disputed territory or State must be decided in accordance with wishes of people and we adhere to this view.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (in telegram No. 402-Primin-2227 dated 27 October 1947 to Prime Minister of Pakistan repeating telegram addressed to Prime Minister of United Kingdom). 2. “In regard to accession also, it has been made clear that this is subject to reference to people of State and their decision.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (in telegram No.413 dated 28 October 1947 addressed to Prime Minister of Pakistan). 3. “ …….the people of Kashmir would decide the question of accession. It is open to them to accede to either Dominion then.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (in telegram No.255 dated 31 October 1947 addressed to Prime Minister of Pakistan). 4. “Kashmir should decide question of accession by plebiscite or referendum under international auspices such as those of the United Nations.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Letter No. 368-Primin dated 21 November 1947 to Prime Minister of Pakistan). 5. “We are anxious not to finalize anything in a moment of crisis and without the fullest opportunity to be given to the people of Kashmir to have their say. It is for them ultimately to decide. 6. “And let me make it clear that it has been our policy all along that where there is a dispute about the accession of a state to either Dominion, the accession must be made by the people of that state.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Broadcast to the Nation: “All India Radio”: 2 November 1947). 7. “The issue in Kashmir is whether violence and naked force should decide the future or the will of the people.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Statement in Indian Constituent Assembly; 25 November 1947). 8. “We have not opposed at any time an over-all plebiscite for the State as a whole…….” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (in telegram dated 16 August 1950 addressed to the U.N. Representative for India and Pakistan: S/1791 : Anne 1(B). 9. “The most feasible method of ascertaining the wishes of the people was by fair and impartial plebiscite.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Joint press communique of the Prime Ministers of India and Pakistan issued in Delhi after their meeting on 20 August 1953). 10. "People seem to forget that Kashmir is not a commodity for sale or to be bartered. It has an individual existence and its people must be the final arbiters of their future.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Report to the All-India Congress Committee, 6 July 1951; The Statesman, New Delhi, 9 July 1951). 11. “Kashmir is not a thing to be bandied about between India and Pakistan but it has a soul of its own and an individuality of its own. Nothing can be done without the goodwill and consent of the people of Kashmir.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Statement in the Indian Parliament, 31 March 1955). 12. “We had given our pledge to the people of Kashmir, and subsequently to the United Nations; we stood by it and we stand by it today. Let the people of Kashmir decide.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU, (Statement in the Indian Parliament, 12 February 1951). 13. “We have taken the issue to the United Nations and given our word of honour for a peaceful solution. As a great nation, we cannot go back on it. We have left the question for final solution to the people of Kashmir and we are determined to abide by their decision.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (Amrita Bazar Patrika, Calcutta, 2 January 1952). 14. “If, after a proper plebiscite, the people of Kashmir said, ‘We do not want to be with India’, we are committed to accept that. We will accept it though it might pain us. We will not send any army against them. We will accept that, however hurt we might feel about it, we will change the Constitution, if necessary.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (Statement in the Indian Parliament, 26 June 1952). 15. “I want to stress that it is only the people of Kashmir who can decide the future of Kashmir. It is not that we have merely said that to the United Nations and to the people of Kashmir; it is our conviction and one that is borne out by the policy that we have pursued, not only in Kashmir but every where. 16. “I started with the presumption that it is for the people of Kashmir to decide their own future. We will not compel them. In that sense, the people of Kashmir are sovereign.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (Statement in Indian Parliament, 7 August 1952) 17. “The whole dispute about Kashmir is still before the United Nations. We cannot just decide things concerning Kashmir. We cannot pass a bill or issue an order concerning Kashmir or do whatever we want. JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (The Statesman, 1 May 1953) 18. “Leave the decision regarding the future of this State to the people of the State is not merely a promise to your Government but also to the people of Kashmir and to the world.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (In telegram No. 25 dated 31 October 1947 addressed to Prime Minister of Pakistan). 19. “In regard to accession also it has been made clear that this is subject to reference to people of State and their decision.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (In telegram No.413 dated 28 October 1947 addressed to Prime Minister of Pakistan). 20. “That Government of India and Pakistan should make a joint request to U.N.O. to undertake a plebiscite in Kashmir at the earliest possible date.” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (In telegram No. Primin-304 dated 8 November 1947 addressed to Prime Minister of Pakistan). 21. “We have always right from the beginning accepted the idea of the Kashmir people deciding their fate by referendum or plebiscite………..” 22. “Ultimately, the final decision of settlement, which must come, has first of all to be made basically by the people of Kashmir…….” JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (Statement at Press Conference in London, 16 January 1951, The Statesman, 18 January 1951). 23. “But so far as the Government of India are concerned, every assurance and international commitment in regard to Kashmir stands.” ·JAWAHARLAL NEHRU (Statement in the Rajya Sabha; 18 May 1954). Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 18:30:19 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:30:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <8F5F3689-BF38-4666-A889-6DEF99AEE633@sarai.net> Dear all, Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva (Hindu Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' have attacked and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by and about the nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was held on the premises of the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest against the decision by the orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude work by Husain citing reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet again, how inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to the freedom of expression. See - http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian Express that carries details of the incident. This list has discussed such attacks on freedom of expression before, and just as we have had forthright criticism of Muslim fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led West Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural liberty. I appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of expression. regards Shuddha From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 19:47:04 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 19:47:04 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] History of the cave temple of Sri Amarnath Message-ID: <6353c690808250717ude99d97t9532671092591731@mail.gmail.com> *History of the cave temple of Sri Amarnath **By Chaman Lal Gadoo* Link- http://www.organiser.org/dynamic/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=252&page=22 Pandit Kalhan describes in verse 267 of Rajatarangini, "The lake of dazzling whiteness (resembling) a sea of milk, which he created (for himself as residence) on a far-off mountain, is to present day seen by the people on the pilgrimage to Amreshvara." Pandit Kalhan, the greate historian-poet completed in AD 1150 his immortal work of 7,844 verses, Rajatarangini (River of Kings), the history of ancient Kashmir in a detailed manner. According to Rajatarangini, the most famous pilgrimage in Kashmir is the cave of Amarnath and it mentions that King Ram Deva is stated to have imprisoned the debauch King Sukh Deva and to have drowned him in the Lambodheri (Lidder) among the mountains of Amarnath about 1000 BC. It also mentions in Tarang II, Samdimat (Arya Raja) 34BC-17AD, a great devotee of Shiva who rose from the position of a minister to be the king of Kashmir, "used to worship a linga of snow above the forests, which is not to be found elsewhere in the world during the delightful Kashmir summers." It further states in verse 267 that Shushram Naga (Sheshnag) is seen to this day (i.e. 1148-49 AD) by pilgrims proceeding to Amreshvara." As per ancient literature, devotees of Lord Shiva from time immemorial worshiped cave temple of Amarnath. It is recorded that Himalayan caves have been abode of celestial beings and great sages used to meditate for hundreds of years in these caves. It is also recorded that the Himalayan mountain range especially the northern range is indeed the first and the sublimest symbol of divinity. "Of the mountains, I am the Himalaya", says Lord Krishna in the Bhagwat Gita. Someone asked Swami Vivekananda, "Why have we so many Gods and Goddesses?" He promptly replied, "Because we have Himalaya." The music of the Himalayan streams brought divine feelings to the seers. The rushing streams fall like thunder with the sound of vyom, vyom on the rocks and flow out in frightening speed with the sound hara, hara. Probably Adi Shankara, inspired by snow clad Himalayan peaks and ice lingam of Shiva at cave temple of Amarnath wrote of Shiva; "Oh, Shiva, Thy body is white, white is Thy smile, the human skull in Thy hand is white. Thy axe, Thy bull, Thy earrings, all is white. The Ganga flowing out in foams from your matted locks is white. The crescent moon on Thy brow is white. O, all-white Shiva, give us the boon of complete sinlessness in our lives." Swami Vivekananda wrote about Shiva of Amarnath: *For whom all gloom and darkness have dispersed, That radiant light, white beautiful, As bloom of lotus white is beautiful, Whose laughter loud sheds knowledge luminous.* The worship of the linga according to Vivekananda was originated from the famous hymn in the Atharvaveda Samhita sung in praise of the Yupa-Stambha which represented the 'Eternal Brahman'. The fire, the smoke, the ashes, flames, the blackwood and the ox connected with this Vedic sacrifice gave place to the conceptions of brightness of Shiva's body. His tawny matted-hair, His blue throat and the riding on the bull of Shiva and so on—just so the Yupa-Stambha gave place to the Shiva linga and was deified as the high Devahood of Sri Shankara…. In the Linga-Purana the same hymn is expanded in the stories meant to establish the glory of the great Stambha and the superiority of Mahadeva." In ancient scriptures, it is recorded that Maharishi Bhrigu was the first person to sight and identify the cave temple of Sri Amarnath where Lord Shiva had narrated the secret of amartav to his consort Parvati and got himself transformed into ice lingam on Sharavan Purnamashi. This sacred day falls every year on the night of the full moon in the month of Sawan (July-August) on Shrawan Purnamashi, when sun is in Leo (Singha rashi) and moon (Chandrama) in Aquarius (Kumb) rashi, this yoga makes the Shiva lingam darshan very auspicious. A pair of snow pigeons over heard Shiva's discourse and became immortal. Thus Amarnath, the Lord of Immortality and Deathlessness became Amreshvara!" On August 2, 1898 Swami Vivekananda had darshan of Amarnath. When he entered the shrine, a profound mystical experience came to him and latter he said, 'Shiva Himself had appeared before him'. He further said; "The ice lingam was Shiva Himself. It was all worship there. I never enjoyed any religious place so much, so beautiful, so inspiring." Swami Ramatirtha, on having a glimpse of 'Amareshwara Linga' uttered in ecstasy an Urdu couplet, which means, "Where ice is bedecked in formless movement, There stands supreme-consciousness as Amar Linga" The cave temple is located in South Kashmir at an altitude 12,720 ft about 140 kms from Srinagar. The huge natural cave is about 25 meters high and enough to hold hundreds of devotees where a self-forming 'ice lingam' waxes and wanes with moon. The holy cave is 50 ft. long 25 ft. wide and 15ft. high approximately. The cave is nature's temple where ice lingam is completely filling the right corner of the cave, the top of the lingam touches the base of the cave. The base of the cave is also covered with ice, like a carpet. Here Shiva is worshipped by nature in the purest way. Shiva is snow-white and pure. Lingam is formed by drops of water falling from the top of the cave and two other small 'ice lingams,' are also formed, believed to be the symbols of Goddess Parvati and Lord Ganesha. The dripping that followed from the feet of ice lingam or Shiva lingam took form of a stream known as Amuravati. According to Bhrngish Samhita a person who bathes in the waters of Amuravati and rubs himself with the ashes gets moksha. Recitation from the Vedas and hymns pertaining to the deities and mantra chanting are made individually and collectively by devotees inside the cave temple. Kashmiri Pandits usually recite: Om namah Sambhavaya cha, mayo bhavaya cha, namah Sankaraya cha, mayas Karaya cha, *Namah Shivaya cha, Shivtaraya cha. We offer our salutations to Thee——the Giver of Happiness. We offer our Salutations to Thee——the Auspiciousness. We offer our salutations to Thee the Bestower of Bliss and still greate Bliss.* Pandit Kalhan describes in verse 267 of Rajatarangini, "The lake of dazzling whiteness (resembling) a sea of milk, which he created (for himself as residence) on a far off mountain, is to present day seen by the people on the pilgrimage to Amreshvara." Francios Bernier was the French physician who accompanied Emperor Aurangzeb to Kashmir in 1663. He has mentioned about cave temple, "a magnificent cave full of wonderful congelations". Vigne in his book, Travels in Kashmir, Ladakh and Iskardu, (1842) says, "The ceremony at the cave of Amarnath takes place on the 15th of the month of Sawan (28th July)….not only Hindoos of Kashmir but those from Hindoostan of every rank and caste can be seen, collecting together and traveling up the valley of Lider towards the celebrated cave." Lawrence mentions in Valley of Kashmir, "Pilgrims to Amarnath were joined by Brahmins of Mattan and further up to Batkot the Maliks used to take charge of the pilgrimage. "On the night of the 11th day of the bright fortnight of Sawan (July-August) all pilgrims assemble at Pahalgam. Swami Vivekananda describes the on going pilgrimage as, "The procession of several thousands of pilgrims in far-away cave of Amarnath, nestled in a glacial gorge of the Western Himalayas, through some of the most charming scenery in the world, is fascinating in the extreme. It strikes one with wonderment to observe the quiet and orderly way in which a canvas town springs up in some valley with incredible rapidity at each halting place with its bazaars and broad streets running through the middle and vanishing as quickly at the break of dawn, when the whole army of gay pilgrims are on their march once more for the day. Then again the glow of the countless cooking-fires, the ashes covered Sadhus under the canopy of their large geru (orange) umbrellas pitched in the ground, sitting and discussing or meditating before their dhunies (fire), the Sannyasis of all order in their various garbs, the men and women with children from all parts of the country in their characteristic costumes, and their devout faces, the torches shimmering at night fall, the blowing of conch-shells and horns, the singing of hymns and prayers in chorus, all these and many other romantic sights and experiences of a pilgrimage, which can be met with nowhere outside India, are most impressive and convey to some extent an idea of the overmastering passion of the race for religion. Of the psychological aspect and significance of such pilgrimage, done on foot for days and days, much could be written. Suffice it to says that it is one of those ancient institutions which have above all, kept the fire of spirituality burning in the hearts of the people. One sees here the very soul of the Hindu nation laid bare in all its innate beauty and sweetness of faith and devotion." According to Amreshvara Mahatmaya some of the important places where pilgrims had to perform ablutions while on pilgrimage were Anantnag, Mach Bhawan (Mattan), Ganeshbal (Ganeshpora, 6800ft) Mamleshwara (name of Lord Shiva), (Mamal, 7300ft), Nilganga, Chandanwari, Shusshram Naga (Sheshnag), the pilgrims have to cross at Vayujana (Vowjan), from Lidar to Sind valley, then to Panjtarni, and finally to Amuravati. Now-a-days the journey starts from Pahalgam (7500ft). The next halt which is at Chandanwari (8500ft) is 10 kms away. The old name of the place is 'Sthanuashrama'. 'Sthanu' is an epithet of Shiva and literally it means 'a pollard'. Lord Shiva sat in samadhi like a pollard in the lap of Himalaya where Deodar grew. From Chandanwari to Pisu Ghati (12200ft) is steep hill of 2kms and then 7kms. away is Sheshnag (13148ft), the next halting point. The Sheshnag Lake is 25sq.kmrs. In area, is fed by the Kohenhar glacier (5178 mtrs.), which looks like hood of a cobra. The milky-water of the lake is seen just 200mts down in a trough-shaped basin. The mountain around Sheshnag is covered with snow and it has seven peaks which resemble the seven heads of mythical Sheshnag. >From Sheshnag to Panchatarni (12230 ft) is about 7 kms. In between is 5kms climb to Maha-gunas, the highest peak in the whole track. This is the last halting place for pilgrims. From Panchatarni the holy cave (12729ft) is 6 kms. Panchatarni is a wide plain among the mountain ranges, where five streams flow side by side. Going across these streams there is the sixth stream in which pilgrims perform shraddha. The whole Amarnath pilgrimage procession is conducted under the auspices of Chhari Maharaj. Bringesha Samhita records, that Rishi was once approached by the people praying to show them the path to salvation. The sage advised them to take pilgrimage to cave temple of Amarnath and pray to Shiva lingam. To ensure safe journey to cave temple, Bringesha Rishi prayed to Lord Shiva, and was graced with Holy mace pair. Ever since this became symbol of protection for the yatris and has now taken the form of Chhari- Maharaj——the holy mace, and leads the annual yatra. The Chhari generally used to leave after performing the puja at Dashnami Akhara (Srinagar) on the 4th day of the bright fortnight of Sawan. During Sikh rule in Kashmir 'Chhari Maharaj' used to start from Amritsar, during Dogra rule from Srinagar and now after the exile of Kashmiri Pandits from valley it is from Jammu. The Mahants who wield the divine command of holy place carry the two holy maces and when the Mahant after the prayers at the cave temple takes his seat a Sadhu holding one of the mace stands on his right and other on his left. Despite the terrorist activities in Kashmir targeting yatra and inclement weather large number of pilgrims throng to holy cave temple of Sri Amarnath year after year. From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 19:52:46 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 07:22:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <79961.64507.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities of the people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and touchy issues which may have emotional importance for some people. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta To: sarai list Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 6:30:19 PM Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear all, Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting  predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva  (Hindu Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena'  have attacked and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by  and about the nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was  held on the premises of the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial  Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest against the decision by the  orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude work by Husain citing  reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet again, how  inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to the  freedom of expression. See -  http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian  Express that carries details of the incident. This list has discussed such attacks on freedom of expression before,  and just as we have had forthright criticism of Muslim  fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led West  Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so  too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural  liberty.  I appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of  expression. regards Shuddha _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Be the first one to try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 20:03:11 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 07:33:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free Message-ID: <895776.38063.qm@web31507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Tolerance should not turn into weakness.It should be our strength.Evil need not be tolerated but punished.Similarly Democracy should be our strength not a weakness or compromise of any kind.If one lives in India he or she has to live like Indian not as loyalist to some other nation.Such anti-national traitors should be identified and punished under the law of land immediately.It is as simple as that.   Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: "radhikarajen at vsnl.net" To: Prabhakar Singh Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 4:56:59 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free Indian citizens are very tolerent, too tolerent for a comfort of democratic rule. A man from Nahar came down to Allahabad, practised law, made enough wealth to burn 1000 rupee notes to make tea for the viceroy, had a useless son, jawahar, who went stayed in guest houses for the freedom struggle, at other times wrote letters to his daughter Indira, had enough debauch ways to live life with vision blurred by valley and hills of women he has had. In the process he became visionary as all other good brave leaders were sidelined , Nethaji who had formed Azad hind fauz was declared dead, when he without any craving for any post lived a quiet life in himalayan hills.   We use SAMA as first method to counsel, seek peace, if it fails, we give DANA, so nation divided for the faith, then came bhedha, BHEDHA, or understanding the weaknesses of the enemy and then last is DANDA, now it is time for danda, for the enemies of the nation. ----- Original Message ----- From: Prabhakar Singh Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008 9:11 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com, sarai list , Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: s_malavika at dnaindia.net > > > Only such psudo-Hindus like Malvika were responsible for partition > of India and they want further mutilation of our motherland and > nation.If partition is the only solution then let us divide the > entire nation why Kashmir only? The partition of 1947 itself was > incorrect.This is an era of integration not division.What will > anybody get after division? Are Muslims happy in Pakistan? If > yes,why they try to infilter into India? If they want to infilter > and stay in India what was the need of partition? If they wanted a > partition and a separate nation named as Pakistan why at all they > chose to stay in India? If India belongs to everybody why can't > they stay here with a sense of tolerance and brotherhood with > other communities? Does Muslim mean Pakistani only not Indian? In > a vast democratic nation like India there may be numerous points > of difference among different communities which have to be solved > amicably but saparatism is not an answer at all and whoever > takes this line is anti-national punishable under the law of > land.Freedom of expression does not mean that one can go anti- > national.This needs to be checked immediately. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Kshmendra Kaul > To: sarai list ; Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > Cc: s_malavika at dnaindia.net > Sent: Sunday, 24 August, 2008 7:27:31 PM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free > > I would not like to make statements without being a hundred > percent certain. I am not a hundred percent certain about what I > will be suggesting. So, I will use the device of journalists to > ask questions even though such questions might suggest allegations. >   > - Is it not true that Malavika has never lived in Kashmir as a > resident of Kashmir for any extended period of time? If so, what > would Malavika know of the realities of Kashmir?  >   > - Is it not true that Malavika's family who left Srinagar as she > herself says in the immediacy of "Partition", were/are familiar > primarily only with the Pre-Partition days of Maharajah's Rule? If > so, what would Malavika's family too know about the realities of > Post-Partition Kashmir? >   > - Is it not true when Malavika visited Srinagar "throughout her > childhood" she was there for a couple of months at the most every > year, if she did visit every year? If so, would it be fair to say > that she was there as a tourist? If so what would Malavika > understand about the realities of Kashmir especially if she > had never been a resident of Kashmir for any extended period of time? >   > - All else apart, Malavika says her ancestral house was in Wazir > Bagh. Is it not true that Wazir Bagh was one of the elitist (read > moneyed) residential areas of Srinagar? Would it not be fair to > say that people from such elitist (read moneyed) areas of Srinagar > would in any case have little understanding of the realities of > Kashmir?    > - Malavika says that when she visited Srinagar in her childhood, > her family would stay with Muslim friends. Is it not true that > when Malavika visited Srinagar in her "childhood" there was no > strife in Kashmir? If so, what would be the basis of Malavika > saying that the Muslim family friends "..were losing it > (Kashmir) everyday, living there, witnessing its destruction."? > What was that "destruction"? >   > Or, is it Malavaka's suggestion that the Muslim family friends > were nostalgic about and felt a sense of "losing" of the Pre- > Partition Mahrajah's Rule days?  >   > - Is it possible that Malavika has juggled around facts quite a > bit and is basically using some nostalgia her mother Usha Khanna > (who must be in her 80s now) might have about the Kashmir of the > Pre-Partition Mahrajah's Rule days? (I forget if Malavika's father > too was from Kashmir) >   > If the allegations suggested in my questions are valid, could one > then say that Malavika's piece which might at a first read suggest > itself as 'Oh! So touching! So Heart rending!'  is actually > dishonest writing of devious design?  >   > Was Malavika perhaps driven to write on this topic and in this > tone by the thought "Arundhati has written on it. I too must write > on it"? >   >   > Kshmendra  >   >   > > --- On Sun, 8/24/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: > > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > Subject: [Reader-list] Please, set Kashmir free > To: "sarai list" > Date: Sunday, August 24, 2008, 4:48 PM > > Please, set Kashmir free > > by Malavika Sangghvi > Saturday, August 23, 2008  21:56 IST > http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1185295&pageid=0 > > As the daughter of a Kashmiri Hindu, whose family left its ancestral > home in Srinagar during the turmoil  that followed Partition, I would > like  to express a sentiment that I still haven't heard in the > rhetoric about Kashmir. > > I speak for those for whom Kashmir is not a symbol of one-upman ship > with Pakistan, not a piece of a jigsaw puzzle that is intrinsic to the > sovereignty of India  and not a football to be kicked around by > cynical politicians, but as the daughter of a family in whose very > lifeblood Kashmir courses every moment. > > Cut our hearts open and you will see Kashmir, put your ear to our > sighs, and you will hear our yearning for the land where our family > spent its last days intact and happy before Partition scattered us to > the winds, rendering us refugees. > > Growing up dislocated in Mumbai, as a child, it never failed to > surprise me when people who often  hadn't so far stepped out of their > suburb, would say:"Kashmir is ours! We will never give it up! Let them > try and take Kashmir from us!" > > Even at that early age, when I could have mistaken their jingoism for > kindred sentiment, I realised that their virulence had nothing to do > with my family's  love for Kashmir, but was misguided machismo. > > And I would find myself seething with rage at the audacity of their > presumption. "But Kashmir was never yours," I'd say in my mind. > And > sometimes, when more provoked: "You don't deserve Kashmir!" And > then > I'd go home to my mother, whose ever present, unshed tears for her > homeland, were a leitmotif of our life in Mumbai. > > Throughout my childhood, my family would go back to Srinagar (the > ancestral home in Vazir Baugh had to be sold when my widower > grandfather became too old to live alone) to stay with Muslim friends, > with whom we shared a poignant empathy: we had lost Kashmir > because we > had moved away; they were losing it everyday, living there, witnessing > its destruction. Over kawha, we would watch as the elders of our > family weep for what had been. > > Like a woman too beautiful for her own good, Kashmir was a tragedy > even then. It produced an ache in our hearts when we heard its name > and thought of its ill fate: and then, because you cannot sit weeping > over lost Valleys all your life,  when we returned home we put Kashmir > on the backburner. > > And on that backburner, Kashmir fermented Sheikh Abdullah, a man whose > commitment to India was unquestionable, was humiliated, jailed, > alienated. The most unimaginable genocide was committed on the > people. Entire generations of its sons were mowed down by an army > whose presence was as large as it was unpopular. And in its knee-jerk, > misguided, ill-conceived approach to Kashmir the Indian polity > revealed its shallowness. > > But through this all, intrinsically, those of us who have Kashmir in > our bloods, know that the Kashmiri Pandits who have been driven > out of > their homeland are not enemies of the Kashmiri Muslims, in fact they > are both victims of the historic blundering of the Indian government's > Kashmir policy. > > Take away Delhi's political brinkmanship, take away the Hindutva > sentiment that has played so neatly into the hands of Pakistan and its > fishing-in-troubled-waters game and you may be surprised at how > harmoniously Kashmir's Hindus and Muslims can live. > > So, on behalf of my mother, my family, and all those who have loved > and lost Kashmir, I beg:  Please. We have done enough damage to and > in Kashmir. Enough to last many lifetimes. The chinars are tinged with > too much  blood. We have failed Kashmir and we don't deserve her > anymore. Leave Kashmir alone. Set her free. > > Email: s_malavika at dnaindia.net > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: > > >   > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: > > >      Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 20:25:17 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:25:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <79961.64507.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems to have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps if there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing and can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of art when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the goddess at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities of the > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and touchy > issues which may have emotional importance for some > people. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > To: sarai list Sent: Monday, 25 > August, 2008 6:30:19 PM Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > Delhi Dear all, Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting  > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva  (Hindu > Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena'  have attacked > and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by  and about the > nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was  held on the premises of > the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial  Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > against the decision by the  orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > work by Husain citing  reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > again, how  inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > the  freedom of expression. See -  > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian  Express > that carries details of the incident. This list has discussed such attacks on > freedom of expression before,  and just as we have had forthright criticism > of Muslim  fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > West  Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so  > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural  liberty.  I > appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of  > expression. regards Shuddha _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Be the first one to > try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ _________________________________________ r > eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 20:44:19 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:14:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not consume the consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try to play with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not sensitive to emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is not an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: S. Jabbar To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta ; Sarai Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi People have become rather emotional and touchy of late.  Everyone seems to have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps if there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing and can shake it?  Evidently so and mores the pity.  Why tear down works of art when it is faith that is crumbling?  My prescription is twenty years of solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the goddess at Khir Bhavani? Look it up.  It's instructive.  And humbling. On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities of the > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and touchy > issues which may have emotional importance for some > people. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > To: sarai list Sent: Monday, 25 > August, 2008 6:30:19 PM Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > Delhi Dear all, Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting  > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva  (Hindu > Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena'  have attacked > and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by  and about the > nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was  held on the premises of > the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial  Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > against the decision by the  orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > work by Husain citing  reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > again, how  inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > the  freedom of expression. See -  > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian  Express > that carries details of the incident. This list has discussed such attacks on > freedom of expression before,  and just as we have had forthright criticism > of Muslim  fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > West  Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so  > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural  liberty.  I > appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of  > expression. regards Shuddha _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>       Be the first one to > try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ _________________________________________ r > eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 20:48:50 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:18:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism Message-ID: <741614.24852.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear Kshmendra, Thanks for the bullet point reply. Will try to keep it as coherent, and add my replies to each of yours. > 1. From the Wikipedia page alone, I would find it difficult to reach your kind of generalisation that "Historically it seems most seditions laws have been used by governments to silence critics". It may be true though. ~ The history on the Wikipedia page of how sedition laws have been enforced led me to that conclusion. Australia, for example, where "The new laws, inserted into the legislation last December, allow for the criminalization of basic expressions of political opposition, including supporting resistance to Australian military interventions." It makes me a little queasy that any country would require its citizens to support all its 'military interventions'. The article goes on to talk of the situations that various countries have enforced sedition laws. > 2. History of a Law being bad or being badly interpreted or having been abused does not mean that such a Law should not exist. It only means that we should learn from the "History" of such a Law, to try our best to design it well and make it insulated from being abused. ~ I see your point here. I would think, however, that a law that can so easily interpreted to suit those in power, AND has a history of abuse and misuse, would at the very least have iron tight definitions and clauses around it. > 3. If it is your postion that there should be an open season for citizens of a country to indulge in 'sedition' then you and I differ on that. ~ I don't have a watertight 'position' about the matter. Not yet. This discussion is helping me think through, though. > 4. At least in a Democracy, the Government does not make "Laws". We the people make the Law by through our representatives in the Legislatures where the Laws are made. ~ True in principle. > The Govt only applies the Law. The nature of application/interpretation of the Law by the Government is open to challenge. > 5. What you have called the "modern meaning" is wording (possibly from a Sedition Law) Wikipedia says is from the Elizabethean Era (circa 1590). Year 1590 is a rather convoluted recognition of "modern". Even so, any Law is only as good or bad or loose and open to abuse as it figures today in any country and particular to that country only. ~ Point taken. > 6. Wikipedia has commented extensively on "sedition" even though all that you could see, from some strange reason is a quote of a definition from around 1590: > - Sedition is a term of law which refers to covert conduct, such as speech and organization, that is deemed by the legal authority as tending toward insurrection against the established order. Sedition often includes subversion of a constitution and incitement of discontent (or resistance) to lawful authority. Sedition may include any commotion, though not aimed at direct and open violence against the laws. Seditious words in writing are seditious libel. ~ Do you notice how non-specific phrases such as "tending toward insurrection" and "incitement of discontent (or resistance) to lawful authority" are? > 7. There are other critical sentences: > > - Because sedition is typically considered a subversive act, the overt acts that may be prosecutable under sedition laws vary from one legal code to another. Where those legal codes have a traceable history, there is also a record of the change of definition for what constituted sedition at > certain points in history. This overview has served to develop a sociological definition of sedition as well, within study of persecution. > > (do not miss reference to change of definitions at different points of history for what constitutes sedition and consequent overviews to protect against persecution) > > - Nor does it consist, in most representative democracies, of peaceful protest against a government, nor of attempting to change the government by democratic means (such as direct democracy or constitutional convention). ~ In the wikipedia examples given, weren't even a peaceful demonstration against a country's war (australia), campaigning against conscription (canada), burning a couch (new zealand), advocate the desirability of overthrowing the government (US) considered acts of sedition? > 8. If you continue to see no difference between "sedition" and "criticism" then I cannot be of any further help. ~Thanks for the help you HAVE been! ~baruk From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 21:04:23 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:04:23 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Terrorists' among those protesting in Kashmir - MHA In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250833gc2dcc86qcfe09e46dee10588@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808250833gc2dcc86qcfe09e46dee10588@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808250834x29beec4ahbf3d973a1697a28a@mail.gmail.com> *'Curfew in Kashmir was a clear message that enough is enough'* *New Delhi (PTI):* The Centre on Monday said the curfew in the Kashmir valley was imposed to send a clear message to the separatists that "enough is enough" and such kind of processions would not be allowed. This was stated by Union Home Secretary Madhukar Gupta during a briefing of reporters here on the situation in Jammu and Kashmir. "Enough is enough. Things can't go like this way. There was no logic in their (separatist) programme today," Gupta said. Asked as to why these kind of processions were allowed earlier, Gupta, while making it clear that the matter was a state subject, said, "one becomes wiser by hindsight." While speaking on the day's development in the state, he said, "militants had also fired at the security forces during the protests." "Empty AK-47 cartridge was recovered after a crowd was dispersed in Beerwah (Budgam district)," he said adding that it implied that militants were in the crowd. He tried to draw a parallel with the killing of Sheikh Aziz, a Hurriyat leader, during a procession fortnight ago. However, the Home Secretary said no need arose for conducting a postmortem on his body as the crowd carried the body and kept it in Jama Masjid before being buried in Pampore on August 12. "Investigations are on in this case," he said, four days after National Security Advisor M K Narayanan had told the Union Cabinet that Aziz was killed neither by a police nor an army bullet. From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 20:56:45 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:56:45 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you perceive to be the motives that drive her/his art. But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that art? On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not consume the > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try to play > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not sensitive to > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is not > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > Prabhakar > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: S. Jabbar > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta > ; Sarai > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late.  Everyone seems to > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps if > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing and > can shake it?  Evidently so and mores the pity.  Why tear down works of art > when it is faith that is crumbling?  My prescription is twenty years of > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the goddess > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up.  It's instructive.  And humbling. > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities of >> the >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and touchy >> issues which may have emotional importance for some >> people. > Prabhakar > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> > To: sarai list > Sent: Monday, 25 >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >> Delhi > > Dear all, > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting  >> > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva  > (Hindu >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena'  > have attacked >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by  > and about the >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was  > held on the premises of >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial  > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >> against the decision by the  > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >> work by Husain citing  > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet >> again, how  > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to >> the  > freedom of expression. > > See -  >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >> > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian  > Express >> that carries details of the incident. > > This list has discussed such attacks on >> freedom of expression before,  > and just as we have had forthright criticism >> of Muslim  > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led >> West  > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so  >> > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural  > liberty.  I >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of  >> > expression. > > regards > > Shuddha > > > > > > _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & >> Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >> with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > >       Be the first one to >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > _________________________________________ > r >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & >> Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >> with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 21:15:24 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:15:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: References: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. Wonder why the Danish cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even his was a work of pure art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... Its quite unfortunate to see some ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) defending such mindless imagination. There isn't any justification for it. Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been alive by now. Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you perceive > to > be the motives that drive her/his art. > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that > art? > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not > consume the > > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try to > play > > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > sensitive to > > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > not > > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: S. Jabbar > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > ; Sarai > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems > to > > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps > if > > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > > > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing > and > > can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of > art > > when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of > > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > > > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the > goddess > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. > > > > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities > of > >> the > >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > touchy > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > >> people. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Monday, 25 > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > >> Delhi > > > > Dear all, > > > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > >> > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > > (Hindu > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > > have attacked > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > > and about the > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > > held on the premises of > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >> against the decision by the > > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >> work by Husain citing > > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > >> again, how > > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > >> the > > freedom of expression. > > > > See - > >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >> > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > > Express > >> that carries details of the incident. > > > > This list has discussed such attacks on > >> freedom of expression before, > > and just as we have had forthright criticism > >> of Muslim > > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > >> West > > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > >> > > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural > > liberty. I > >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of > >> > > expression. > > > > regards > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & > >> Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> with subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > Be the first one to > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > > _________________________________________ > > r > >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & > >> Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> with subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click > > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 21:23:27 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:23:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmiri Muslims support Land Transfer to Shri Amarnath Shrine Board Message-ID: <6353c690808250853k9e2fa88vf7552929d0318bcd@mail.gmail.com> *Kashmiris in Pune hope for peace back home 24 Aug 2008, * *Anita Koul - The Times of India* Link - http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Pune/Kashmiris_in_Pune_hope_for_peace_back_home/articleshow/3398575.cms PUNE: The shadows of the recent violence in Jammu and Kashmir have fallen on some sections of people living in the city. Pune, traditionally, has been home to a vibrant Kashmiri population --- both Hindu and Muslim. Majority of the Kashmiris in the city are either businessmen or students. Most of them have migrated to the city due to the insecurities of life back home. Though far away from home, the recent developments around the Amarnath land transfer issue have made them a worried lot. "Why is the Centre not doing anything? We will not give up our land and we will fight for it till our last breath, says Ved Lal Bhat (88), who still has hopes to go back to his home in Kashmir one day. "Being a Kashmiri Pandit, feel that the problem has gone beyond the land dispute. Common people on both the sides are suffering. The politicians have hijacked the issue to appease their respective vote banks," an angry Vikas Raina says. "This has given a chance to the separatists in Kashmir to revive there 'azaadi' agenda. The central and the state governments have tackled this issue in a very insensitive manner. It looks like we have gone back to the 90s. This time it is worse. It is on the verge of dividing J&K," he says. "People of J&K should respect the decision of transferring the land to Amaranthji Shrine Board. It is the government's decision and the BJP, as usual, has got a good reason to start violence. If the people want to protest, they can do it in a peaceful manner," says by Arshad Ansari, an engineering graduate. "I feel sad that people don't know about ground realities. Ask them what happened in Russia and they will know, but they won't know about Kashmir. We are worried about our parents back home as there is curfew and uncertainty," says Sandeep Bhat, who is waiting to visit his parents in Jammu. "The land issue has been blown out of proportion by people like Mehbooba Mufti and Shabbir Lone. In her recent interview on a TV channel, Mufti was all up against the government. She is demanding the opening of the Muzaffarabad road," he said. "My dad is a businessman. He does not have a single penny to give to the employees. Imagine, if this is happening to business class, what will be the common man's plight," asks Sehrish Shafi, student, who is desperate to see her family. Those who have been living here for more than 15 years want to go back to J&K and solve the problem. "Kashmir is an integral part of India and the government can take any decision for the betterment of the nation. The J&K government is very passive and doesn't want to resolve the issue. And the common people are suffering," says Omesh Pandita, who is in Pune for the last 10 years. "Kashmiris have already lost their land and identity. As if that wasn't enough, betrayal by their own government is putting their very existence in question. Today we have to take their permission to acquire land, tomorrow we will have to take their permission to worship, and day after there would be nothing left to worship. After that the government will form a committee to analyse and discuss how this happened," adds Arun Bhat. From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 21:27:34 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 08:57:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <640644.59159.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> what IS the group's definition of art? ~baruk http://bottlebroke.blogspot.com From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 21:37:58 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:37:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now? Is this too to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and the other to be defended? What a terrible bore! On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. Wonder why the Danish > cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even his was a work of pure > art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... Its quite unfortunate to see some > ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) defending such mindless imagination. > There isn't any justification for it. Had something of this scale been done > in some other country such as Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person > would't have been alive by now. Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar > wrote: > > You are welcome to critique the works of > the artist and what you perceive > to > be the motives that drive her/his > art. > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy > that > art? > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > > > The work of art is for the consumption > of people but it should not > consume the > > consumer itself.The artist > should know it very well.He should not try to > play > > with their faith just > for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > sensitive to > > emotions and > faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > not > > an end > in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: S. Jabbar > > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > ; Sarai > > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > People have become rather > emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems > to > > have become > hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps > if > > there > are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > > > Is one's faith so > fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing > and > > can shake it? > Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of > art > > when it is > faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of > > solitary > meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > > > Do you know the story of Swami > Vivekanand who stood in front of the > goddess > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it > up. It's instructive. And humbling. > > > > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, > "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > >> Artists should be > careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities > of > >> the > >> > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > touchy > > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > >> people. > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > > To: sarai list > > > Sent: Monday, 25 > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > >> Delhi > > > > Dear > all, > > > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > >> > > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > > (Hindu > > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > > have > attacked > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > > and > about the > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > > held on > the premises of > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > > Trust > (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >> against the decision by the > > orgnaizers > of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >> work by Husain citing > > reasons of > security. This incident demonstrates, yet > >> again, how > > inimical the > forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > >> the > > freedom of > expression. > > > > See - > >> > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >> > > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > > > Express > >> that carries details of the incident. > > > > This list has > discussed such attacks on > >> freedom of expression before, > > and just as > we have had forthright criticism > >> of Muslim > > fundamentalists attacking > Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > >> West > > Bengal government making it > impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > >> > > too, we must take into > account this latest assault on cultural > > liberty. I > >> appeal to all to > condemn this attack on the freedom of > >> > > expression. > > > > regards > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > >> reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & > >> Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > >> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > Be the > first one to > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >> > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > > > _________________________________________ > > r > >> eader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & > >> Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > >> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > Get an > email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click > > here > http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> ___________________________ > ______________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Mon Aug 25 21:43:03 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 16:13:03 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] On Exodus and Migration - Muslims, Pandits and Kashmiris In-Reply-To: <112534.6381.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <110238.65915.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Sonia, Thanks for clearing. Well first of all inflating figures about Pandit migration has more to do with dole handouts by the govenrment. In mid 1990s, there was a massive scandal in Jammu where Pandit migrants cloned their numbers to claim extra dole - This was also used to gain money and propaganda edge from various 'agencies' and it still continues. I am in awe of Pandit fertility as now the figure stands at half a million. One of the senior RSS leaders in Delhi told me last year that the Pandits are not interested in going back, because they are making a lot of money - both aid as well as that is unaccounted for by claiming to be displaced. I can't vouch for the sentiment, but i know the Pandit 'sufferings' has assumed Biblic proportions. With officially 209 Pandits attributed to have been killed by Kashmiri militants, it is being called a 'genocide' and 'ethnic cleansing' and 'Holocaust'. The improper employment of term 'holocaust' in present day Pandit discourse sounds utter insensitivity and blatant disregard to six million Jews who perisched in Nazi action 60 years ago. We have to keep this in mind that out of the project Hindu population of 130,000-140,000 in Kashmir Valley, not all of them were Pandits. Nearly one fourth of them were Panjabis or Dogras who mainly lived in Srinagar and some small numbers in other places. Even if we take that 100,000 of them were Pandits, only two thirds of them made their way out of Kashmir. According to the Kashmir government sources - by April 1990-end, the exodus of Pandits was complete. I know many Pandit friends, who have spoken on record that they were forced by the CRPF sent by the Governor to 'clear off'. Balraj Puri has pointed out to that in his book Kashmir Towards Insurgency and I have spoken to him about this. Similarly, recently Wajahat Habibullah has given his side of the story how Kashmiri leaders approached him early 1990 saying that why Hindus were migrating and that they smell a conspiracy. When Wajahat brought this to the notice of Jagmohan Malhotra, he ignored his advice and rather facilitated and catalysed the process. i have been thinking for all my life about pandit migration - I have been the only journalist in Kashmir, and i repeat only journalist, who has written about it in early 1990s bringing the plight of Pandits, particularly those who belonged to rural areas, to the notice. Not long ago - it came to my notice. From January to July - 1990, the most brutal phase of Indian oppression, most of the days were consumed by curfews. If I couldn't go to nearby town of Islamabad from my location at Bijbehara, how did Pandits manage to get trucks and taxis even in the far off villages and all at the same time when Kashmir was envoloped with the worst of choas and people had no means to deal with it. About the Muslim Migrants in Azad Kashmir Well frankly I can't dispute your figure as i am not totally sure about it - so won't argue. But many people have told me that the figure is around 100,000. Not so strange, when i asked Sardar Attique a couple of years back about the figures - he was as clueless as any Pakistani politician is about anything and everything. True to their national tradition, Pakistani and AJK government has kept this figure as secret as well. Massacre at Jammu The figure of Muslims massacred by the Hindu Dogra army in conivance with the civilian Hindu population is in excess of quarter a million. There are various sources to derive this figure as safe. However, we must not forget that Hindus and Sikhs were also killed on the other side - but 1. There number was a couple of thousand (my apologies - not trying to trivilise anyone's death or destruction) and 2. It was not a state assisted killing. I have pointed out at it in my review to the book 'Lentha: Mujahid ki Diary' on Kashmir Affairs. You may follow the link: http://www.kashmiraffairs.org/lentha_shibli.html And Why am I talking about this We need to keep the exodus of Pandits, migration of Kashmiris and ethnic cleansing of Jammu Muslims in perspective. We can't selectively talk about one group suffering because they had to leave their houses. We need to be fair and demand an equal treat for all - Pandits, Kashmiri Muslims and Jammu Muslims - and perhaps bring them all together to show that exodus/migration is not one particular community has suffered from, but all the Kashmiris. And I forgot to mention - internal displacement of thousands of Kashmiri Muslims engineered by the Indian Army supported renegades. I remember doing a small research project on it for the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) soonfater 1996 elections, and the number was staggering - we calculated more than 100,000 Kashmiris whose houses and orchards were destroyed and livelihoods obliterated and they had to live in pennury. These people still suffer and no one talks about them. I hope this is useful. Warmly, Murtaza --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: From: Kshmendra Kaul Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: "Kashmir Affairs" , "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 1:10 PM Dear Sonia   You MUST be a Kashmiri Pandit pretending to be of some other ethnicity.   OR Maybe you too are an "Agent" of the Govt. of India. You could also be from the Hindutva cadre of BJP or VHP or Bajrang Dal. Heavans forbid.   These are shots in the darkness of SARAI caused by postings that are at most times filled with bias, prejudice and presumptions with added liberal (pun not intended) doses of ignorance and misrepresentations.   Whatever else you are, you come across to me as an independent thinker who is not a bandwagon-person nor is tempted into taking fashionable 'liberal' positions on issues (pun intended). That does not mean that you and I think alike on all subjects.    1.  It is reported in August 2002 that 11 polling stations have been reserved for KPs (migrants) for the about to come elections. 8 in Jammu, 2 in Udhampur and 1 in Delhi.   The report also says that 150,000 KPs (migrants) in "other" parts of the country could cast their votes by postal ballot. This is as per an Election Commission official.   This would mean that apart from the majority of  KPs (migrants) who had landed in Jammu, Udhampur and Delhi there were some 150,000 KPs (migrants) more who had moved to places other than Jammu, Udhampur and Delhi.   2.  A June 2007 report about one of the Prime Minister's Working Groups headed by Hamid Ansari quotes figures from this WG to say:    " ..........the total population of Kashmiri Pandits in the valley before migration was about 3.5 lakh. While a majority migrated to Jammu and other parts of the country, about 18,000 stayed back as of 1997."   The report also quotes another set of figures (note that these are figures for Jammu alone) to say:   "As many as 30,206 Hindu families, 2,120 Muslim families and 1,749 Sikhs are registered as migrants with the state government and are now living in Jammu."   3. The official website of J&K Govt in an August 2000 report mentions:   "According to the Koul Report, there were 56,689 families (migrants of all communities) in Jammu and elsewhere in the country in 1997. Of them 31,490 families were in Jammu alone and 19,339 families in New Delhi."   It might be pertinent to point out that "families" were not registered as "nuclear families" but covered the direct lineage (excluding girls married out and including girls married into the family). Most cross-references for registration were linked to the "residence" in Kashmir before the 'migration'. In most cases there were 3 generations who had been living together and who were registered as a "family".   4. CIA's "The World Factbook" mentions 600,000 IDPs in India anbd says that about half of those are Kashmiri Pandits from Jammu and Kashmir.   5. The Geneva based (mandated by United Nations) Internal Displacement Monitoring Cell (IDMC)  notes that the lowest number of Kashmir Pandit IDPs found from sources was 56,246 families. It translates that into the number 250,000 and credits GOI with being the source.   IDMC notes that the Highest estimates  of (Kashmiri Pandit) IDPs found from sources was QUOTE "Maybe as many as" 450,000 UNQUOTE. It credits U.S Committee for Refugees (USCR) as the source.     Kshmendra   PS. There is another aspect of Migration/Displacement of Kashmiri Pandits which never gets highlighted.   If one may call the post 1988 displacement an 'exodus', between 1947 and 1988 also there was an outflow of Kashmir Pandits from Kashmir for various reasons that had nothing much to do with being terrorised, even if they faced intimidation.   This was because of 'lack of opportunities' in Kashmir. This 'lack of opportunities' became a 'fait accompli' forced upon the KPs when admission to professional educational institutions  (read Medical and Engineering) started taking place on the basis of religious ratio-proportions. (I think only 10% or maybe 20% of the admissions were on 'competitive' basis). This was followed by "recruitments" and "promotions" also following the same principle though this might be difficult to substantiate though there was such an "Executive Order" for "promotions" after a specified level.   This understandably led to a constant year after year diaspora out of Kashmir towards Educational Institutions and Jobs. They were not migrating out, strictly speaking, because the "permanent residence" continued to be in Kashmir with major part of the immediate family also left behind. So children studying 'out' had their parents back in Kashmir. Those who had taken up Jobs outside also had their parents in kashmir and in many cases also the spouse and children.   If this is understood, it might be easier for some to appreciate that the Internal Displacement of Kashmiri Pandits that occured as an exodus out of Kashmir post 1988 was not confined to those numbers who physically moved out of Kashmir but also those who used to but now could not go back. Many were 'forced out' by the situation. Many had to 'stay out' because of the situation.   Census figures and numbers from Electoral Rolls could never give the full picture of the Internal Displacement.          --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore To: "Kashmir Affairs" , "Sarai" Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 2:41 PM Dear Murtaza, The official figures of GoI put the Pandit refugees or internally displaced persons (not migrants) at 100,000. The Pandit organisations dispute that and claim a higher number. You put the numbers of Muslims massacred in Jammu in 1947 as 250,000. The Statesman correspondent in '47 had reported 60,000 dead. Since I found this a very high figure even when compared to massacres in the Punjab (because the killings in Jammu happened within a much shorter period) I had interviewed old-timers of Jammu who were witness to the times and specifically asked about this figure. Each had felt the figure highly exaggerated-- including Ved Bhasin, Balraj Puri and others who have otherwise opposed communalism all their lives. You also quote the number of Kashmiri refugees post-1990 in Pakistan as 100,000. This is again an inflated figure. The official Pakistani figure is 15,000. When I met with Kashmiri youth in Rawalpindi 2 years ago and they had asked me to do something to enable them to return, they had put their figures at 30,000. I would guess it's somewhere in the middle. In times of crisis some feel the need to inflate figures. If there are 6 rapes it's not good enough, it has to be the whole village of women. If 2,000 are killed it seems insignificant when other sites of horror like Cambodia, Vietnam, the battlefields of the First World War, the concentration camps of the Second can claim millions dead. Can we pause for a moment and see what it is we are doing? On 8/25/08 1:39 PM, "Kashmir Affairs" wrote: > Pawan, - There is by no way, I repeat no way, more than 100,000 Kashmiri > Pandits as migrants. And this number is almost same as those Kashmiri Muslims > who were forced to migrate to Muzzaffarabad. While I am not trivilizing > migration (without any prejudice to the stated cause) I think it is important > that when we talk about migration - we have to talk about both. In addition, > two million Kashmiri migrants living in various Pakistani cities have to be > included into it as there is at least half a million of them who would like to > come back. in solidarity, Murtaza --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Pawan Durani > wrote: From: Pawan Durani > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > anymore To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, "Aditya Raj > Kaul" Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 5:48 > AM Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding of > Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! I wonder how > many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very good only at > divisions. Pawan  On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs > wrote: Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one > policy prescription in Kashmir - whole scale murder. A friend who has been at > very top post in IB recently wrote back to me that 'those who don't want to > live in India should migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC March > whole Kashmir would have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in my > view - life is more precious than land. In 1947 - quarter a million were > massacred in Jammu and two million forced to migrate. In 1990 - 100,000 > Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri Muslims from villages > along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. In 2008 - thousands of Muslim > families have been forced to leave Jammu and adjoining Hindu majority > areas. - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of > scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - > Mimesis and Violence. Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffairs.org --- On > Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: From: Aditya > Raj Kaul Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > anymore To: "sarai list" Date: Sunday, 24 August, > 2008, 7:16 PM  *Oranges won't work anymore* By Joginder Singh, > Ex-Director CBI  The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar > on August 13 after an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and > their supporters, who alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He > was also denied the President's police medal for fear of controversy and > wider protests. There is nothing new in this kind of approach as the > decision-makers are far removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and > the security forces that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing > between chaos and order.  In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir > lost his job for taking a tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That > did not help the situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF > Inspector-General restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden > separatists and terrorists who will now think that they can get away with > anything.  Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of > appeasement and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. > Terrorism in the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will > to deal with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, > the daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a > former Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the > then Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened > the separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of > chain reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to > these events as I was the InspectorGeneralof the CRPF in Srinagar at the > time.  The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet > has today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > enforcing the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and > cinema houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a > laudable speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this > year as he appealed to the masses to shun communalism.  But unfortunately, > the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a communal ideology. > The truth is, communalism in one community generates communalism in others. > Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by terrorists start a rally with > the declared aim of crossing the LoC into Muzaffarabad? The Government should > have responded that those who cross the LoC illegally will not be allowed > back into the country.  A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called > people-to-people contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how > could a mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared > legal tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say > that 'transferring' 97 acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board > has led to the present crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going > all-out to create disturbances and problems as per the following report of > the Jammu & Kashmir Government:  "A total of 42,147 people, including > 20,647 militants and 5,024 security personnel were killed in the State > between January 1990 and the middle of February 2007... Violence left 33,885 > people, including 12,124 security personnel and 21,659 civilians injured > during the same period in the State... 11,221 civilians were killed by > militants and another 1,678 lost their lives in grenade and Improvised > Explosive Device explosions, while 173 civilians were killed when they were > caught in clashes between militants. A total of 3,404 civilians were killed > in cross-firing incidents between security forces and militants... The > highest number of 1,438 civilians were killed in 1996, the year elections > were held after a gap of seven year, while the highest number of 3,602 Army > and other paramilitary personnel lost their lives fighting militants in the > same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As > many as 438 Special Police Officers engaged by the police in > counter-insurgency operations were killed. 127 Village Defence Committee > members were killed fighting militants in the State. 613 security personnel > were killed in a single year in 2001, which was again the highest."  Now, > the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being done > is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call given > by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the faithful to > prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are used to give > calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in the > streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then Governor > had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself led to > protests.  It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of > worship. During my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, > with the co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, > installed CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a > situation like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been > highly communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to > prove anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth > to depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen > of terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > if not completely banned.  Terrorist leaders, their supporters and > sympathisers should be immobilised by using the present laws and detained > outside Jammu & Kashmir. The Government has announced financial assistance > for the families of terrorists on the grounds that it is not their fault if > the only earning member of their family becomes a militant. This approach is > fraught with danger and the sooner it is given up the better. It should not > become a scheme to help traitors.  Many so-called intellectuals talk about > a referendum in the Valley. With Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India > movement, any referendum or election will be irrelevant at this point of > time. The first priority is to drive the Pakistani terrorists out of the > Valley and send them to the country of their origin. The Government should > stop all dialogue with these militants who are nothing more than agents of > Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the right signal that the > Government means > business. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > Send instant messages to > your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ read > er-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > Send instant messages to > your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _________________________________________ reader > -list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & > Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From sarang_shidore at yahoo.com Mon Aug 25 22:38:25 2008 From: sarang_shidore at yahoo.com (Sarang Shidore) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 10:08:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Hussain's art and Danish cartoons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <495329.91804.qm@web31810.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Sonia and others -   It is instructive to compare the issue of the destruction of Hussain's art  with the ruckus over the Danish cartoons of the Prophet that roiled much of West Asia and Europe a couple of years back. I have struggled with this issue for some time now. Back then, I had penned the following piece, which I'd like to share with this list. I intended the piece to be reflective in nature, and though I do draw some firm conclusions on the matter, I remain open to other viewpoints.   Sarang   ---------------------------------------------------------------------- There are 3 components to this debate:   1. One is clearly freedom of speech. We all agree that this is a key value in a democratic society. It is also clear that some sort of democratic society is now a universal ideal in the 21st century.   2. The second is the concept defamation or libel. If I write something nasty about X, then in some cases X can sue me for libel. Wikipedia quotes the definition of libel under the English common law tradition (which is followed in the US and also in India) as:   libel is a malicious defamation expressed either by writing or printing or by signs, pictures, effigies or the like; tending to blacken the memory of one who is dead, or to impeach the honesty, integrity, virtue or reputation, or to publish the natural or alleged defects of one who is alive, thereby exposing him to public hatred, contempt, ridicule or obloquy; or to cause him to be avoided or shunned or to injure him in his office, business or occupation.   Furthermore, in some systems of jurisprudence, libel must also be accompanied by a malicious intent, i.e it has to be shown that   the defendant made the statement with "malice", meaning either believing it was false or with "reckless disregard" for whether it was false.   Therefore a criticism made in good faith, even if it cannot be proven is true, may be permissible.   Libel laws apply only to individuals. This is because the Anglo-Saxon tradition of modernity generally does not recognize group rights, only individual rights. (One exception I can think of is that of a Corporation. A Corporation is treated as an individual under the English/US sytem. This is because these systems have origins in capitalist thinking and are heavily weighted towards protecting property rights - sometimes more than individual rights!)   The question is - can/should libel laws be applicable to groups?    Anglo-Saxon law generally does not bar "group slander". There is no recognition of the concept of "group libel". Thus I can draw a cartoon in an Alabama newspaper depicting African-Americans as savage baboons. I can  write an article denying the Holocaust and calling Jews "crooked-legged seducers of Aryan women" in the New York Post. It is not illegal to do so in America. (Unless I burn the flag, of course ;-)) However, it is a crime to deny the Holocaust or glorify Hitler in Germany. In Italy it is a crime to defame the Pope. It is now a crime in the UK to say something that is hateful towards a religious or ethnic group. In Pakistan slendering the Prophet is punishable by death. In India wearing a bikini with the national emblem or the flag is subject to imprisonment. It seems that there is a precedent in many societies for group symbols to be "protected" from certain kinds of speech.   Legal codes of many traditional, non-western societies aren't like Denmark or Maine. Democracy, when it comes to these societies, is often configured along group rights more than individual rights. Can I draw a cartoon in Chennai depicting Brahmins as snakes? Can I go to Bihar and write an article abusing Yadavs as thieves? Can I call Gujarati Muslims "Babar ki Aulaad"? I don't know if it legal to do so in India, but it seems that several non-western societies are generally leery of such "rights", even if the law doesn't specifically address them (In any case, most law in non-western societies is a derivative of colonial law).    To conclude, global practices seem to recognize *some* sort of group libel. This concept is the weakest in the UK/US and the strongest in some non-western societies. It is not uniquely clear what the right balance is for all societies, or even if there ought to be a universal standard for the same.   3. The third component, and in my opinion the most overlooked one, is the issue of the power dynamic in a society. Example - a US university campus. When I see a table in the Student Union that says "National Association of Black Accountants", my reaction is one of benign support, even empathy. If I turn the corner and see a table labeled "National Society of White Engineers", I don't think I would stay on that campus for too long (neither would any of my white American friends). Under legalistic definitions of free speech, surely this should not matter. But it does. Because the African-American is seen as a historical victim of severe discrimination, and is seen as suffering from the effects of it to the present day. Speech here is a symbol of power. There is and *should be* a different standard for judging the speech related to a disempowered minority as compared to a empowered majority.   If I, a Hindu, paint a nude Sita sitting in Bombay then it is not the same as if I, a Hindu, paint a child-molester Prophet Mohammed sitting in Bombay. This is not a case of Muslim-pandering, but a case of using my empowered status as part of a majority community to target with hate-speech, with full malice and no basis in truth, the minority community, which by every socio-economic standard is disempowered in India. The same goes for gender issues. There is a qualitative difference in me drawing a cartoon depicting a Hindu widow as a lecherous bitch who deserves to die as a sati, versus one depicting a Hindu male as domestic abuser and male chauvinist. The former is dangerous and needs to be combated immediately. The latter is stupid and immature, but does not reinforce existing structures of oppression in the society.   Now, applying all of this to the Danish cartoons:   The cartoons are legitimate by the standard in 1).   They are blatantly inconsistent with 3), because Muslims in Europe are truly, to use a colorful expression, "beggars at the gates", disenfranchised in many, many ways. Thus a  Danish (incidentally, right-wing) newspaper pretty much run and staffed by white Danes was well and truly using its position of power to target a minority community with hate speech. (if the Danish paper had depicted a Hindu as a consummate thief, then this would also clearly have fallen under the same category.)   As far as 2) goes the verdict seems ambiguous. However, because the cartoons were clearly not serving a public interest, were depicting/implying falsehoods (Mohammad was not a terrorist, the implication that all Muslims are terrorists is false), and were clearly done with a malicious intent, to me they fail the standard.   I am no lawyer, but it seems to me that a legal analysis of the cartoons proves that there are serious grounds for an offense under hateful incitement under any reasonable standards. Moreover, they were politically reprehensible acts in a time when tensions between many Muslims and the West is intense and serious international fault-lines exist over Palestine, Iraq, and Iran. It is a potential war and peace matter between nations. The major coverage of this incident reflects this fact. One would expect an editor of a supposedly enlightened society like Denmark to have known better.   Sarang ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you perceive to be the motives that drive her/his art. But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that art? On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not consume the > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try to play > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not sensitive to > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is not > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > Prabhakar > > > > From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 23:25:42 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:25:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <79961.64507.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <79961.64507.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Religious peoplel should be careful about the aesthetic sensitivities of artists and of those committed to the arts. Religion too can flourish without delving into such sensitive and touchy issues (such as the right to freedom of expression) which may have emotional importance for some people. The substance of religion is for the consumption of people but it should not consume the consumer itself.The religious zealot should know this very well.He should not try to play with their aesthetic and artistic commitments just for his/her cheap fun.A religious zealot who is not sensitive to the imagination and creativity of the people at large is not an a person with any sense of the sacred at all. Religion is (apparently, or so say many people who are sincerely religious) not an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of society. Shuddha On 25-Aug-08, at 7:52 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious > sensitivities of the people.Art can flourish even without delving > on such sensitive and touchy issues which may have emotional > importance for some people. > Prabhakar > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > To: sarai list > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > Dear all, > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > (Hindu Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > have attacked and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > and about the nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > held on the premises of the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest against the decision by the > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude work by Husain citing > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet again, how > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to the > freedom of expression. > > See - http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > Express that carries details of the incident. > > This list has discussed such attacks on freedom of expression before, > and just as we have had forthright criticism of Muslim > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led West > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural > liberty. I appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of > expression. > > regards > > Shuddha > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > Be the first one to try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Mon Aug 25 23:32:30 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:32:30 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> References: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808251102j489b1e1bp2830752f6ce4d32@mail.gmail.com> Aditya I really want to understand the imaginative world you dwell in. The possibilities and limits of this world. I'm serious, i'm not being sarcastic, or contemptous or anything. Because it seems that your entire world view is totally colonized by some idea of state "common good" "society" so restrictively defined that unless everyone is eating, breathing, sneezing making love according to the constitution or your definition of it, there should be no place for them. > Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been alive by > now. > What does this even mean? I certainly hope you are not holding any of these up as examples to follow? How interesting and instructive that despite your views on Kashmir and Pakistan's involvement you thoroughly approve of some alleged "hard line" Pakistan ostensibly takes with artists... A > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > > > You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you perceive > > to > > be the motives that drive her/his art. > > > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that > > art? > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > > > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not > > consume the > > > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try > to > > play > > > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > > sensitive to > > > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art > is > > not > > > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: S. Jabbar > > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > ; Sarai > > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems > > to > > > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it > helps > > if > > > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > > > > > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or > writing > > and > > > can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of > > art > > > when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of > > > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > > > > > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the > > goddess > > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. > > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > > > > > >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious > sensitivities > > of > > >> the > > >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > > touchy > > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > > >> people. > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > >> > > > To: sarai list > > > Sent: Monday, 25 > > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > > >> Delhi > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > > >> > > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > > > (Hindu > > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > > > have attacked > > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > > > and about the > > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > > > held on the premises of > > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > > > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > > >> against the decision by the > > > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > > >> work by Husain citing > > > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > > >> again, how > > > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > > >> the > > > freedom of expression. > > > > > > See - > > >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > > >> > > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > > > Express > > >> that carries details of the incident. > > > > > > This list has discussed such attacks on > > >> freedom of expression before, > > > and just as we have had forthright criticism > > >> of Muslim > > > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > > >> West > > > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > > >> > > > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural > > > liberty. I > > >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of > > >> > > > expression. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > Be the first one to > > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > > >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > > > _________________________________________ > > > r > > >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com > . > > Click > > > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 23:42:37 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:42:37 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> References: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5316A4B7-6612-4C72-AD22-B06985037285@sarai.net> Dear Aditya, I have stated many times, that I stand for the freedom of expression of the Danish cartoonists. Exactly on the same grounds as I stand for the freedom of expression of M.F. Husain, Salman Rushdie, Taslima Nasrin and Aditya Raj Kaul. The work of the danish cartoonists were instances of art that I do not admire. I think they were in poor taste. I think Husain is a mediocre painter. I think he is grossly overrated as an artist. I have mixed feelings about Taslima Nasrin. I think she says important things some times, and sometimes she writes things that I don't care for all. I think her statements about Islam are serious and deserve to be read and discussed in all seriousness. I think you write rubbish most of the time. But I categorically state that the move to ban the publication of the Danish cartoons is wrong. The move to ban the publication of Taslima Nasrin's books is wrong. And any effort to silence you would be wrong. And just as there are those who call for bans on Husain in the wide world, there have been many on this list, who have asked for a ban on you, because of what has been perceived as the violence and disingenousness of your posts. This list has resisted these calls. And I am one of those who has defended your right to say whatever nonsense you may wish, both on the list and off the list, however much it offends me (and it does, deeply, because you rarely use any language other than slander and abuse) because I am passionately committed to your right to publicly disagree with me, and with everyone else. I think your expressions need to be criticized, ruthlessly criticized if necessary. But they must be listened to. Everyone must be listened to. And anyone who speaks, if they expect to be heard, must learn to listen to things that are not pleasant or palatable to them. if you value the freedom that this list offers you to spread what I consider to be your inanities, then you must learn also to value the freedom that people must have to view M.F. Husain, and for M.F.Husain to work, and to exhibit his work, as he sees fit. Do not make the mistake of assuming that the only people who have sensitivities are the ones who display the ornaments of their faith conspicuously on their sleeves. Even doubters, sceptics and the godless can get very touchy, and very angry, when it comes to anyone trying to interfere with their freedom to celebrate their doubt. Everyone has some things that are sacred to them. I hope I have made myself abundantly clear. regards, Shuddha I am actually committed to the defence of all kinds of imagination, because I think that only On 25-Aug-08, at 9:15 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > Wonder why the Danish cartoonist abused, maligned and mis- > represented. Even > his was a work of pure art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > Its quite unfortunate to see some ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla > fame) > defending such mindless imagination. There isn't any justification > for it. > > Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been > alive by > now. > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >> >> You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you >> perceive >> to >> be the motives that drive her/his art. >> >> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to >> destroy that >> art? >> >> >> >> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" >> wrote: >> >>> The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not >> consume the >>> consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not >>> try to >> play >>> with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not >> sensitive to >>> emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at >>> all.Art is >> not >>> an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the >>> society. >>> Prabhakar >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ---- >>> From: S. Jabbar >>> To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata >>> Sengupta >>> ; Sarai >>> Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM >>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >>> >>> People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone >>> seems >> to >>> have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course >>> it helps >> if >>> there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. >>> >>> Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or >>> writing >> and >>> can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down >>> works of >> art >>> when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty >>> years of >>> solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. >>> >>> Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the >> goddess >>> at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. >>> >>> >>> On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious >>>> sensitivities >> of >>>> the >>>> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and >> touchy >>>> issues which may have emotional importance for some >>>> people. >>> Prabhakar >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ---- >>> From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta >>>> >>> To: sarai list >>> Sent: Monday, 25 >>>> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM >>> Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >>>> Delhi >>> >>> Dear all, >>> >>> Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting >>>> >>> predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva >>> (Hindu >>>> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' >>> have attacked >>>> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by >>> and about the >>>> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was >>> held on the premises of >>>> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial >>> Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >>>> against the decision by the >>> orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >>>> work by Husain citing >>> reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet >>>> again, how >>> inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to >>>> the >>> freedom of expression. >>> >>> See - >>>> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >>>> >>> exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian >>> Express >>>> that carries details of the incident. >>> >>> This list has discussed such attacks on >>>> freedom of expression before, >>> and just as we have had forthright criticism >>>> of Muslim >>> fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led >>>> West >>> Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in >>> Kolkata, so >>>> >>> too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural >>> liberty. I >>>> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of >>>> >>> expression. >>> >>> regards >>> >>> Shuddha >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _________________________________________ >>> >>>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & >>>> Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >>>> with subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: >>>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >>>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >>> >>> Be the first one to >>>> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >>>> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ >>> _________________________________________ >>> r >>>> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & >>>> Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >>>> with subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: >>>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >>>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >>> >>> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or >>> yourname at rocketmail.com. >> Click >>> here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From shuddha at sarai.net Mon Aug 25 23:46:22 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 23:46:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders Message-ID: <95BECC9A-F9A0-4BB0-B748-44AFAD50E1FE@sarai.net> Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir Reporters Without Borders http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 25 August 2008 Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in Kashmir that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian rule. At least 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in Srinagar, local TV stations are being censored and a curfew is making it hard for newspapers to bring out their issues. "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be used as a pretext for subjecting the press to more violence and obstruction," Reporters Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the guarantees they need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely despite the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate the violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks of the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open for more abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of local TV stations, which is a clear violation of the right of Kashmiris to be informed." At least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve Police Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices yesterday despite the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The journalists had passes issued on 11 August but the police members said they were no long valid. The injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV station's bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and his cameraman, Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's Urdu service and Amin War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. The curfew prevented the publication of regional newspapers today, including the daily Greater Kashmir, which posted this message on its website: "Due to unavoidable circumstances, the print edition of Greater Kashmir will not be on the stands on 25 August. We regret the inconvenience to our readers. This was the first time in the past decade that GK staffers could not reach the office due to restrictions." An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar told Reporters Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get to my office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the same questions about my work as a journalist." The authorities yesterday asked local TV stations not to broadcast reports liable to "excite" the population until further order. TV executives and editors were summoned and told it would be preferable if they suspended news programmes and just broadcast entertainment. The government claimed that reports broadcast by certain stations violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act 1995. It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and just carry entertainment. Groups of journalists responded by staging street demonstrations against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" said the placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. Indian troops patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in the region today used megaphones to call on the population to stay at home. Demonstrations planned by Kashmiri political parties have been banned. Several demonstrators were shot dead for violating the curfew. Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 00:04:27 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:04:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] To save India, follow Jammu Message-ID: <6353c690808251134o7784ec86u91288800bfbfd87e@mail.gmail.com> To save India, follow Jammu A. Surya Prakash, The Pioneer, New Delhi For several days now, leaders of the Kashmiri separatist movement like Sajjad Lone have been repeatedly declaring that they will not give "even an inch of land" to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board to provide facilities to Hindu pilgrims going to the holy cave in Kashmir. Alongside the uncouth behaviour and verbal threats of these so-called leaders of separatist outfits during television studio discussions, millions of Indians have also got to see demonstrators flaunting the Pakistan flag and raising pro-Pakistan slogans. Many Indians who, thanks to the media boom, are exposed to this bigoted, intimidatory posture of Kashmiri separatists for the first time, are shocked. Till now they never knew that despite six decades of engagement with the world's largest and most vibrant democracy, people in the Kashmir Valley could be so far-removed from the liberal, democratic and secular framework within which the rest of India operates. Young Indians are also getting acquainted for the first time with the glaring distinction between the nationalist, plural Jammu region and the secessionist, communal Kashmir Valley. While protesters in Jammu -- Hindu, Sikh and Muslim -- march with the Indian tricolour in hand and raise slogans like 'Bharat Mata ki jai', the protesters in Srinagar wave green flags of the Hurriyat or the flag of Pakistan, and the slogan that rents the air is 'Allah-o-Akbar'. It is indeed unfortunate that even 60 years after the accession of the State of Jammu & Kashmir to India, the Kashmir Valley appears to be outside the pale of our secular democracy. It seems to be in the very same mood in which it was 600 years ago when Sultan Sikander began the onslaught on Hinduism and forced Hindus to convert to Islam or migrate. The second big assault on the Hindu minority occurred in 1989-90 when Islamic militants, aided by locals, subjected Hindus to murder, arson and loot. This pogrom led to the forced migration of over three lakh Kashmiri Pandits from the Valley to live as refugees in Jammu and Delhi. In recent years, militants have been targeting Amarnath *yatri*s and killing these pilgrims at temporary camps set up along the route. Yet, despite all this, Sajad Lone says that Muslims have been "taking care" of the *yatri*s all these years and that there is really no need for a Sri Amarnath Shrine Board. Even more laughable is the statement of Mirwaiz Umer Farooq, chairman of the Hurriyat Conference, who has claimed that they "believe in secularism" and that the communalists are the Hindus who are agitating for land for the Shrine Board! Strangely no Kashmiri separatist leader is even ashamed of the ethnic cleansing of Hindus, which is the biggest assault on a religious minority community in this part of the world. In recent times many Kashmiri separatist leaders have appeared on television shows. All of them appear defiant, bigoted, communal and anti-Indian, and yet hog a lot of airtime. It is as if Kashmiri Muslims are exempt from any requirement of decency and civility in discourse. This over-indulgence with persons with an illiberal and anti-Indian outlook has encouraged persons like Mirwaiz Umer Farooq, Sajjad Lone and Billal Lone to sharpen their knives and become far more brazen and vicious in their attacks on the Indian state. The plight of the Hindu minority in India's only Muslim-majority State and the pro-Pakistan slogans being raised in the Valley has its implications not just for India's unity and integrity but also for India's secular foundations and concepts of federalism. Should voices like that of Arundhati Roy, who feels the demand for '*azadi*' in the Kashmir Valley must be listened to with empathy, get louder, it will amount to belated ratification of Mohammed Ali Jinnah's two-nation theory. In which case, we must widen the scope for self-determination and extend this idea to every State. This discomfort with a secular, democratic society among sections of the people in the Valley is nothing new. Lone's forebears had displayed similar inclination for things that lie across the border. The naked face of Kashmiri Muslim communalism bared its fangs in the last century for the first time in 1947 when Muslim soldiers in the Kashmir Army deserted their officers and joined the invading Pakistani Army. The betrayal of Hindu officers by Muslim soldiers in the Kashmir Army is chronicled by VP Menon, who was Secretary in the States Ministry at the time of independence, in his book *The Story of the Integration of the Indian States*. Pakistan first sent in infiltrators and then launched an all-out invasion of Jammu & Kashmir on October 22, 1947. The main raiders' column had 5,000 men who were led by regular soldiers of the Pakistani Army. When the invaders arrived at the gates of Muzaffarabad, the Kashmir State battalion, consisting of Muslims and Dogras, was commanded by Lt Col Narain Singh. All the Muslims deserted the battalion, "shot the commanding officer and his adjutant; joined the raiders, and acted as advance-guard to the raiders' column... All the Muslims in the State Forces had deserted and many had joined the raiders". The raiders then marched towards Uri. Brig Rajinder Singh, the Chief of Staff of the State Forces, managed to gather 150 men and met the invaders at Uri. Brig Singh engaged the enemy in a fierce battle for two days and in a rearguard action destroyed the Uri bridge. "The brigadier himself and all his men were cut to pieces in this action." The dare devilry of these valiant soldiers delayed the onward thrust of the invading Army. Thus, although the Pakistanis were at the doorsteps of Srinagar, there was just enough time for the Government to airlift troops to Srinagar and secure the State capital. Paying a tribute to the courage of Brig Singh, Menon says it was only appropriate that the first Maha Vir Chakra was awarded to this great soldier, albeit posthumously. These facts of history tell their own story. The betrayal of Brig Rajinder Singh and Lt Col Narain Singh by Muslim soldiers in 1947 has its echo in the events in Jammu & Kashmir today. The past has cast its long shadow on the present. Obviously, there are leaders in the Valley who continue to long for Pakistan and who have no compunctions in trampling upon the rights of the Hindu minority in the State. Every Indian who cares for India's unity and integrity and our liberal, secular and democratic way of life, must be ready to make the kind of sacrifices that Brig Singh and Lt Col Singh made over 60 years ago if we wish to retain Jammu & Kashmir as an integral part of India. Gutsy citizens of Jammu are showing us the way. We must salute and emulate them. From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 00:11:45 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:11:45 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hussain's art and Danish cartoons In-Reply-To: <495329.91804.qm@web31810.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <495329.91804.qm@web31810.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808251141g5797185dk70c8bd7c4f8b9c11@mail.gmail.com> What a lucid piece of writing on the issue of depcition in Art ... But the quetion, i beleive is still open to intrepretations. First of all, i beleive, Karl Marx was, perhaps the first person who overwhelmingly expressed a need to talk about the ills of society with an urgency never seen before. It just happened that one of the culprits was 'the sacred' of the religion at that time. Religion is still the opium of th masses,and therefore, we often tend to give vent to that in day to day usuage of language through jokes and other such queerish behaviours. Expression through art is also part of that day to day living. Not because of great Art, but one can always some humour in Danish cartoons and Hussain Drawings, for example, but people miss the point, because we tend to see what we are told to see, only. yes, almost four to five thousand books have been written on Dr. Iqbal and Islam, but only one or two on his poetry. Yes, saying anything against the self appointed religous elites can bring death sentence to you. This practice is as old as times. Lot of Scientists had to suffer in the past for the very reasons, Mansoor Hallaj was killed for uttering Ana-al-Haq ( i am the God ). So there has been a constant struggle between the what is perceived good for society and what is actually happeneing in the society. It is different matter that there are millions of followers of Mansoor, who are believers of Quran even, but those who killed him were not even true believers of Prophet even. That applies to beleivers of Lord Rama even, I beleive, the question of representation was more interesting in an era of Rennisance when photo-realism in art was seen next to Real, but with modern ways of depicting things was seen as a radical shift from that. Most it is about form, and if you see some meaning in it, it is at your own peril. The society is perhaps trained to see meaning in everything, perhaps, because Art has not happned to most of us. Now how to blame artists for that ? and if we believe, that society can do without such aritsts then i think we follows a Stalin who banished all the artists from Russia who were not good to the nation at that time. inder salim On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 10:38 PM, Sarang Shidore wrote: > Sonia and others - > > It is instructive to compare the issue of the destruction of Hussain's art with the ruckus over the Danish cartoons of the Prophet that roiled much of West Asia and Europe a couple of years back. I have struggled with this issue for some time now. Back then, I had penned the following piece, which I'd like to share with this list. I intended the piece to be reflective in nature, and though I do draw some firm conclusions on the matter, I remain open to other viewpoints. > > Sarang > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > There are 3 components to this debate: > > 1. One is clearly freedom of speech. We all agree that this is a key value in a democratic society. It is also clear that some sort of democratic society is now a universal ideal in the 21st century. > > 2. The second is the concept defamation or libel. If I write something nasty about X, then in some cases X can sue me for libel. Wikipedia quotes the definition of libel under the English common law tradition (which is followed in the US and also in India) as: > > libel is a malicious defamation expressed either by writing or printing or by signs, pictures, effigies or the like; tending to blacken the memory of one who is dead, or to impeach the honesty, integrity, virtue or reputation, or to publish the natural or alleged defects of one who is alive, thereby exposing him to public hatred, contempt, ridicule or obloquy; or to cause him to be avoided or shunned or to injure him in his office, business or occupation. > > Furthermore, in some systems of jurisprudence, libel must also be accompanied by a malicious intent, i.e it has to be shown that > > the defendant made the statement with "malice", meaning either believing it was false or with "reckless disregard" for whether it was false. > > Therefore a criticism made in good faith, even if it cannot be proven is true, may be permissible. > > Libel laws apply only to individuals. This is because the Anglo-Saxon tradition of modernity generally does not recognize group rights, only individual rights. (One exception I can think of is that of a Corporation. A Corporation is treated as an individual under the English/US sytem. This is because these systems have origins in capitalist thinking and are heavily weighted towards protecting property rights - sometimes more than individual rights!) > > The question is - can/should libel laws be applicable to groups? > > Anglo-Saxon law generally does not bar "group slander". There is no recognition of the concept of "group libel". Thus I can draw a cartoon in an Alabama newspaper depicting African-Americans as savage baboons. I can write an article denying the Holocaust and calling Jews "crooked-legged seducers of Aryan women" in the New York Post. It is not illegal to do so in America. (Unless I burn the flag, of course ;-)) However, it is a crime to deny the Holocaust or glorify Hitler in Germany. In Italy it is a crime to defame the Pope. It is now a crime in the UK to say something that is hateful towards a religious or ethnic group. In Pakistan slendering the Prophet is punishable by death. In India wearing a bikini with the national emblem or the flag is subject to imprisonment. It seems that there is a precedent in many societies for group symbols to be "protected" from certain kinds of speech. > > Legal codes of many traditional, non-western societies aren't like Denmark or Maine. Democracy, when it comes to these societies, is often configured along group rights more than individual rights. Can I draw a cartoon in Chennai depicting Brahmins as snakes? Can I go to Bihar and write an article abusing Yadavs as thieves? Can I call Gujarati Muslims "Babar ki Aulaad"? I don't know if it legal to do so in India, but it seems that several non-western societies are generally leery of such "rights", even if the law doesn't specifically address them (In any case, most law in non-western societies is a derivative of colonial law). > > To conclude, global practices seem to recognize *some* sort of group libel. This concept is the weakest in the UK/US and the strongest in some non-western societies. It is not uniquely clear what the right balance is for all societies, or even if there ought to be a universal standard for the same. > > 3. The third component, and in my opinion the most overlooked one, is the issue of the power dynamic in a society. Example - a US university campus. When I see a table in the Student Union that says "National Association of Black Accountants", my reaction is one of benign support, even empathy. If I turn the corner and see a table labeled "National Society of White Engineers", I don't think I would stay on that campus for too long (neither would any of my white American friends). Under legalistic definitions of free speech, surely this should not matter. But it does. Because the African-American is seen as a historical victim of severe discrimination, and is seen as suffering from the effects of it to the present day. Speech here is a symbol of power. There is and *should be* a different standard for judging the speech related to a disempowered minority as compared to a empowered majority. > > If I, a Hindu, paint a nude Sita sitting in Bombay then it is not the same as if I, a Hindu, paint a child-molester Prophet Mohammed sitting in Bombay. This is not a case of Muslim-pandering, but a case of using my empowered status as part of a majority community to target with hate-speech, with full malice and no basis in truth, the minority community, which by every socio-economic standard is disempowered in India. The same goes for gender issues. There is a qualitative difference in me drawing a cartoon depicting a Hindu widow as a lecherous bitch who deserves to die as a sati, versus one depicting a Hindu male as domestic abuser and male chauvinist. The former is dangerous and needs to be combated immediately. The latter is stupid and immature, but does not reinforce existing structures of oppression in the society. > > Now, applying all of this to the Danish cartoons: > > The cartoons are legitimate by the standard in 1). > > They are blatantly inconsistent with 3), because Muslims in Europe are truly, to use a colorful expression, "beggars at the gates", disenfranchised in many, many ways. Thus a Danish (incidentally, right-wing) newspaper pretty much run and staffed by white Danes was well and truly using its position of power to target a minority community with hate speech. (if the Danish paper had depicted a Hindu as a consummate thief, then this would also clearly have fallen under the same category.) > > As far as 2) goes the verdict seems ambiguous. However, because the cartoons were clearly not serving a public interest, were depicting/implying falsehoods (Mohammad was not a terrorist, the implication that all Muslims are terrorists is false), and were clearly done with a malicious intent, to me they fail the standard. > > I am no lawyer, but it seems to me that a legal analysis of the cartoons proves that there are serious grounds for an offense under hateful incitement under any reasonable standards. Moreover, they were politically reprehensible acts in a time when tensions between many Muslims and the West is intense and serious international fault-lines exist over Palestine, Iraq, and Iran. It is a potential war and peace matter between nations. The major coverage of this incident reflects this fact. One would expect an editor of a supposedly enlightened society like Denmark to have known better. > > Sarang > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you perceive to > be the motives that drive her/his art. > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that > art? > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > >> The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not consume > the >> consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try to > play >> with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > sensitive to >> emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > not >> an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. >> Prabhakar >> >> >> >> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 00:13:46 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:13:46 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] sedition vs. criticism In-Reply-To: <741614.24852.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <741614.24852.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808251143t3fb3f2aew8be3795a17ee09a2@mail.gmail.com> Dear Kshmendra, I want to know your philosophical opposition to seditious speech. Not your pragmatic or strategic opposition. Let me clarify what I mean: You could argue that seditious speech incites people to commit acts of treason against the unity and territorial integrity of India. The unity and integrity of India are good and desirable things, therefore any speech that endangers these values is dangerous/undesirable and therefore it is a crime. But this is simply a pragmatic argument, not a philosophical one. The trouble with this this mode of argument against a certain kind of speech is that it links it with the achievement of other values, and has nothing to say about the nature of this speech itself. The problem with this mode is that is that if it could be established that the achievement of these other values, say unity and integrity etc, would be served better through the promotion, rather than restriction, of seditious speech, then how would you defend your position? So lets not argue on the terrain of strategy or pragmatic politics... I want to know why you think it is immoral to question the unity and integrity of India. As far as I can see the only other legal injunctions that approach this kind of mystical authority are blasphemy laws in which to profess that one does not believe is a crime. Therefore, in effect, we are being asked to take the existence of the nation as a matter of faith. And like religious belief so awesome and terrifying is its visage that it is beyond human comprehension, beyond rational discussion, beyond even imagination. And like with all mystical knowledge, so fragile is its core that a single question is enough, and therefore that question must never be allowed to enter the realm of the sayable. Is this the logic? Otherwise why else is this specter of sedition so terrifying? regards A On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 8:48 PM, Baruk S. Jacob wrote: > Dear Kshmendra, > > Thanks for the bullet point reply. Will try to keep it as coherent, and add > my replies to each of yours. > > > 1. From the Wikipedia page alone, I would find it difficult to reach > your kind of generalisation that "Historically it seems most seditions laws > have been used by governments to silence critics". It may be true though. > > ~ The history on the Wikipedia page of how sedition laws have been enforced > led me to that conclusion. Australia, for example, where "The new laws, > inserted into the legislation last December, allow for the criminalization > of basic expressions of political opposition, including supporting > resistance to Australian military interventions." It makes me a little > queasy that any country would require its citizens to support all its > 'military interventions'. The article goes on to talk of the situations that > various countries have enforced sedition laws. > > > 2. History of a Law being bad or being badly interpreted or having been > abused does not mean that such a Law should not exist. It only means that we > should learn from the "History" of such a Law, to try our best to design > it well and make it insulated from being abused. > > ~ I see your point here. I would think, however, that a law that can so > easily interpreted to suit those in power, AND has a history of abuse and > misuse, would at the very least have iron tight definitions and clauses > around it. > > > 3. If it is your postion that there should be an open season for citizens > of a country to indulge in 'sedition' then you and I differ on that. > > ~ I don't have a watertight 'position' about the matter. Not yet. This > discussion is helping me think through, though. > > > 4. At least in a Democracy, the Government does not make "Laws". We the > people make the Law by through our representatives in the Legislatures where > the Laws are made. > > ~ True in principle. > > > The Govt only applies the Law. The nature of application/interpretation > of the Law by the Government is open to challenge. > > > 5. What you have called the "modern meaning" is wording (possibly from a > Sedition Law) Wikipedia says is from the Elizabethean Era (circa 1590). Year > 1590 is a rather convoluted recognition of "modern". Even so, any Law is > only as good or bad or loose and open to abuse as it figures today in any > country and particular to that country only. > > ~ Point taken. > > > 6. Wikipedia has commented extensively on "sedition" even though all that > you could see, from some strange reason is a quote of a definition from > around 1590: > > - Sedition is a term of law which refers to covert conduct, such as > speech and organization, that is deemed by the legal authority as tending > toward insurrection against the established order. Sedition often includes > subversion of a constitution and incitement of discontent (or resistance) > to lawful authority. Sedition may include any commotion, though not aimed > at direct and open violence against the laws. Seditious words in writing are > seditious libel. > > ~ Do you notice how non-specific phrases such as "tending toward > insurrection" and "incitement of discontent (or resistance) > to lawful authority" are? > > > 7. There are other critical sentences: > > > > - Because sedition is typically considered a subversive act, the overt > acts that may be prosecutable under sedition laws vary from one legal code > to another. Where those legal codes have a traceable history, there is also > a record of the change of definition for what constituted sedition at > > certain points in history. This overview has served to develop a > sociological definition of sedition as well, within study of persecution. > > > > (do not miss reference to change of definitions at different points of > history for what constitutes sedition and consequent overviews to protect > against persecution) > > > > - Nor does it consist, in most representative democracies, of peaceful > protest against a government, nor of attempting to change the government by > democratic means (such as direct democracy or constitutional convention). > > ~ In the wikipedia examples given, weren't even a peaceful demonstration > against a country's war (australia), campaigning against conscription > (canada), burning a couch (new zealand), advocate the desirability of > overthrowing the government (US) considered acts of sedition? > > > 8. If you continue to see no difference between "sedition" and > "criticism" then I cannot be of any further help. > > ~Thanks for the help you HAVE been! > > ~baruk > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > From shuddha at sarai.net Tue Aug 26 00:34:14 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:34:14 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4DB2838D-F2ED-4824-AE3A-B3D40F839BDE@sarai.net> Dear Sonia, In the tumult of the last two days, the more substantial conversation that we were having has been neglected. I want to come back to it, as it was a very productive conversation. You have rightly pointed out the complexity of the ethnic mosaic of the undivided state of Jammu and Kashmir, and the fact that the UN Resolutions, by framing the dispute in the India-Pakistan binary, seem to leave no room for third or fourth of fifth options. I think this is a time for creative and imaginative thinking. And creative and imaginative thinkers are urgently needed, especially, but not only, from all sections of the population of the entire disputed territory, as much as ambulances, gauze and antiseptic is needed (which is in short supply) for tending to the rising numbers of the wounded in the valley after today's violence by the Indian state's forces of occupation. Those of us who are outside can engage with this process as interlocutors, and must do so at every given opportunity, but I think, that in the end, the paramountcy of the wills (and these may be diverse and conflicting) of the people of the disputed territory must be recognized. I believe, like you, that replacing >> one nation-state by another is hardly the solution. For many years now, >> friends in Pakistan and I have been discussing the idea of a South Asian >> Union which loosens the idea of sovereignty, strengthens people, encourages >> movement across borders, makes irrelevant armies that are presently engaged >> in fighting each other. I wonder whether it is possible to take this >> conversation into that direction, into bringing together rather than >> sundering? I agree with you. I think we must move towards discussing the possibility of solutions that defy the exclusive sovereignty of the nation state principle. The tragedy of Jammu and Kashmir is that it cannot be resolved within the framework of nation states. But that tragedy can become an opportunity if the people of Jammu and Kashmir and their well wishers begin to move towards a solution, an actual, pragmatic solution that transcends the watertight compartments of the nation state. We forget that the nation-state as a sovereign juridical instrument of international law, or as a legal person, is itself a relatively recent construct, as old only as the Treaty of Westphalia in 1648, If we can recognize thousands of years of history before the legal ossification of the nation state and nation state based exclusivist sovereignty, surely we can also begin to envisage a future beyond it. Westphalian sovereignty is the concept of nation-state sovereignty based on two principles: territoriality and the exclusion of external actors from domestic authority structures. The intractability of Jammu and Kashmir defies both the principles of territoriality and the exclusion of external actors from domestic authority structures. All positive proposals have to take into account that first of all, give primacy to the peoples will(s) in the disputed territory. But the guarantee for the recognition of this primacy may have to come from nominally 'external' actors. These would naturally be India, Pakistan, maybe an international body. Who would jointly guarantee the security and liberty of all the peoples of the territory. This may be necessary for a transition period, or for as long as the peoples of the territory desire. Crucially, this must not beceome or seen to become a replacement of a monocephalic colonialsm to a colonial hydra. Several situations can be thought of as points of reference, Andorra, South Tyrol, Northern Ireland, Bosnia-Herzogovina, The Aaland Islands (between Sweden and FInland). All of these examples are working instances of exceptions to the Westphalian straighjacket., and have, in fact become zones of demilitarization. In fact, a demilitarized Kashmir can be precisely the locus of 'bringing peoples together' rather than sundering, that you point to with regard to a future South Asia that would belong to all its peoples and that could refashion itself as a federation of free territories with soft borders, no visa restrictions and no standing armies. To achieve this situation, which I believe is possible, and workable, all of us have to work very hard. But to even begin that work, the armies, both of India and Pakistan must retreat. The militants must lay down weapons (like happenned in Northern Ireland) and principles of reciprocity and mutuality must be recognized as the guiding instruments of the future. None of this, in my opinion can begin without the withdrawal of the repressive apparatus of the Indian state, its central paramilitaries, secret police and army units. Let these be pulled out of Kashmir in the presence of a strong force of international peacekeepers and observers. Let talks begin between all parties, and let everyone set their imaginations and their reasons to work. hope this clarifies my position regards Shuddha From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 00:53:11 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:53:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] poetry: Alan Gilbert interview with Vivek Narayanan Message-ID: <47e122a70808251223j7d1fec06w4d18e1918cc84623@mail.gmail.com> Alan Gilbert Interview with Vivek Narayanan (Part I) I first met Vivek Narayanan here in New York City at the Beats in India: A Soul of Asia Symposium hosted by the Asia Society, which I blogged about back in June. I really enjoyed talking with him, and he agreed to being interviewed via email once he returned to India in August. Because it's a bit long, I've divided the interview into two parts. Vivek was born in India to Tamil-speaking parents, grew up in Zambia, did undergraduate and graduate work in the United States (continuing with the latter in South Africa), and moved back to India in 2000. His first book of poems, Universal Beach, was published in 2006 by Harbour Line Press in Mumbai, and his poetry has appeared internationally in a variety of print and online venues. He's also consulting editor for the journal Almost Island. Alan: If someone asked me to outline a few general trends in contemporary U.S. poetry, I might be hesitant to do so because of the risk of both generalization and overlooking something important. Nevertheless, I'm going to ask you if you could provide a brief introduction to a few aspects of current poetic practice in India, especially among younger poets. Vivek: It's especially hazardous to speak of Indian poetry in general terms because there are dozens of languages with active literary scenes and histories. Nevertheless, since you ask, a few broad, tenuous points about the national scene as seen through my restricted vision: There are no especially influential aesthetically or formally motivated "movements" today that would really be comparable, in verve or sense of purpose, to the different kinds of "new poetry" or "progressive poetry" movements that sprouted in many Indian languages after independence. The most significant recent shift, in many Indian languages, has been the rise of literary poetry by Dalits and other lower castes, and this began to be significant in some languages by the early '70s. More recently, Dalit poetry has been less innovative on the level of form but, since Indian dialects can be very heavily marked and shaped by caste, the rise of Dalit writing has sometimes meant a transformation in the language and linguistic registers of both poetry and prose. The fact that India is home to many languages has led to various kinds of rhetorical wars between languages and literatures; often this has meant a collective attack on English as a somehow "inauthentic" language, and sometimes this has also meant less publicized wars between representatives of languages other than English, jockeying for position on the national stage. For years, I think, there was an unproductive standoff between what I like to think of, to simplify, as the relative superficial and derivative quality of a lot of English poetry written in India and the relative parochialism of much poetry written in the bhashas. This is all changing dramatically, and the complex linguistic ecology of India is, for my money, coming into its own in various ways. English has become more integral, as a daily part of life, across class and caste, across India, than ever before; at the same time, many other languages are slowly coming into a new cosmopolitanism and confidence. Younger Indian poets are more free of linguistic anxieties, more nonchalantly multilingual than ever before. There are interesting bilingual magazines starting up. I'm excited to see where the cross-pollination leads. The internet is completely changing the way young Indian poets read. This is true everywhere, but note that in India libraries are very badly stocked, bookstores are flooded with pulp, and importing books or purchasing them off the net can be prohibitively expensive. Access to the internet can be very cheap in India; in Africa, as a contrast, it is often expensive. So young Indian poets lean very heavily on the net for their reading matter, which is to say that their reading is sometimes broader but also thinner, all singles and no albums, if you know what I mean. To try and counter this, to be in touch with complete collections of world poetry, some of us are constantly getting entire books photocopied for each other. I often find myself joking that, although creative writing workshops are often disparaged and dismissed in India as worthless and imitative, even dangerous, many poets write as if they had attended a creative writing course. Which is to say, they write, in whatever language, in the conversational, narrative, free-verse style that has become, for the most part, the "comfort zone" of international poetry. Alan: You and I met at the Beats in India symposium. The day's panels and presentations centered on Allen Ginsberg, Peter Orlovsky, Gary Snyder, and Joanne Kyger's 1962 trip to India, with particular focus on Ginsberg's visit to Calcutta and his desire to meet poets there. Have you encountered any equivalent to this kind of poetry sojourn? Have you met any U.S. poets visiting India? I know that you've met your fair share of poets while here in the United States. Is the internet replacing the need, or desire, for poets to travel this way? Vivek: At the symposium, Eliot Weinberger asked Gary Snyder if young poets today no longer took that kind of daring, soul-searching, transformative trip, the kind that we know both he and Snyder took, and I remember that the younger poets in the audience went on the defensive a little. There might be some uncomfortable truth in what he was suggesting: do poets today travel more for networking than soul searching? (Though it's also worth asking how many American poets, even in "those days," went as far as Ginsberg did, living in India for nearly two years.) At the same time, Alan, you remembered a trip you took "on the rough" in India in 1999, dipping your toe in the very same Ganges as Allen Ginsberg, though it was perhaps a little more choked with bones and industrial effluent by then, and I remembered the poet Michael Scharf, whom I met in India and again in the United States, who's now gone off to settle in the small, distant, difficult-to-access Northeast Indian hill town of Shillong, in the state of Meghalaya, which oddly just happens to have produced an inordinately high number of Bob Dylan impersonators as well as Indian poets writing in English, and, indeed, I remembered my own long hitchhiking trips across the USA in the early '90s, back when brown men with beards were not yet quite considered dangerous, sleeping on the side of the road or even the highway or, a little earlier, traveling through Mississippi, the landscape somehow reminding me of the Africa I grew up in, sleeping in parks or abandoned houses or with people I met, hanging out with different sections of the American underclass who took me into their lives with startling generosity, without batting an eyelid. Later I traveled in similar ways in Africa and India and elsewhere, but those initial trips in America were crucial, and were possible for me precisely because I was an outsider. On one hand, this meant I was partly a cipher to those I met, not easily locatable in terms of social or cultural or caste background, and that gave me room to maneuver; on the other hand, it was my lack of information that freed me up, the fact that I didn't really know that much about where I was going, didn't pre-judge what kind of situations could be "dangerous" or harmful or not. So this is one aspect of the foreign "sojourn," the search for alienation that opens up the space for a self to reinvent itself. Fundamentally, it's about the importance of experience. That may sound like an obvious thing to say, but I think there was a scary "pure" postmodernist sort of moment, one that some poets are still stuck in, when all was irony and referentiality, when bodily lived experience, the evidence of the senses and the innards, was considered essentially worthless. We're coming out of that now, returning to our bodies as a counter to the compelling but subtly distorting and deeply obscuring mirror of the internet (read: my understanding of the American poetry scene while sitting over here with less access to physical poets or physical books from America), but we have to be able to do it without relying on the naïve and simplistic identity categories of earlier generations, or the essentialism. The Beats in India symposium revealed to me a fascinating, doubled set of what might be called "productive misrepresentations," with the Beats projecting an imaginary, exaggerated spirituality onto India and the Indians projecting a similarly inaccurate freedom onto America. But in the '60s, it was still easy to dramatize one's journey as "West vs. East" in ways that look comically silly to us now. In recent years we've been trying on "U.S. vs. India," a similar—albeit more concrete—binary, and you still see this, say, when Bush meets Singh or in the dying, ridiculous gasp of the multiculti movie (Outsourced, anyone?), but this is clearly not right to me either. It will be a challenge for poets to—slowly—reconceptualize experience and the idea of travel without falling back on identity- or nation-state based categories, and then manifest this in their practice with each other. Alan: For the past couple years, you've worked in Delhi at the Sarai Programme of the Centre for the Study of Developing Societies, the former of which was co-founded by the artist group Raqs Media Collective. Did that experience—particularly the Raqs Media Collective's conceptual documentary approach—have any influence on your own thinking about poetry? Vivek: Yes, I've learned a tremendous amount from interacting with all the people at Sarai, as well with research fellows from CSDS, its older parent organization that has long been committed to the idea of the "public intellectual," interacting with a great number of colleagues that are involved in all kinds of innovative research and practice, including, certainly, the founding members of Sarai: Raqs Media Collective, the anthropologist/urban theorist Ravi Sundaram and the philosopher/historian of film, Ravi Vasudevan. There's a spirit of restlessness, exchange, and collaborative invention that is very alive. The attempt has been to create a space for intellectual engagement outside of formal academia and academic departments, one in which, for instance, art is not just assigned to the realm of emotion but is also seen as a valid way to think about the world. I've learnt a lot through Sarai's thematic obsessions, which try to sniff out new ways of looking at Indian cities and the South Asian and global "now" that go beyond the old rhetoric of "development." Partly as a result of being here, I think, I've also moved beyond thinking of myself as a Poet, thinking more about poetry as a practice or set of practices than as some kind of innate identity. And yes, there's a sense, that animates the work of Raqs, where a document of the massive changes in our environment could be made through a whole range of inventive forms and formal explorations, not just via the old, tired, categorical, heavily narrated form or mode that we think of when we hear the word (yawn) "documentary." Alan: In an essay you wrote entitled "Four Ground-breaking Things In Five Issues of Civil Lines or, Ways to Get Your Head Out of the Postcolonial Sand," a brief history of the journal Civil Lines, you mention a sociological and journalistic imperative in Indian writing, both fiction and poetry. Can you talk about this a little more? Are there ways of circumventing this imperative that don't entail lapsing into an imported mode of European belles-lettrism or U.S. blockbusterism? Vivek: There is a great deal of energy and activity and change on Indian streets that, unlike say with the United States, has not really been documented; one feels the need to bring it into print, and many Indians are happy just to see something that they know well described nicely in a book, to experience that recognition. Many non-Indians, needless to say, are curious, one might even say voyeuristic, to know the "plain facts" of what goes on. Looking at it less cynically, it seems also a shame, and a tragedy even, for literature to give up seeing, observation. But when the writing is in English, the question of audience is complex, and the question of legibility is troubled. To whom are these worlds being made legible? An Indian or international elite? So I guess it's the ease, the supposed transparency, not to mention the streamlined commercial viability, of the journalistic or sociological mode that sometimes troubles me. So the question would be, how might we propose different, alternative modes that still incorporate seeing, the evidence of the senses, without smoothening it all out and making it easy chewing? I suppose I've already answered this as best I can, for now, in the previous question. Recent Indian writing has been extremely timid and unadventurous with regard to form; the "innocent, simple writer" is an image that's carefully constructed, duly championed in Indian letters. I'm not saying that a "transparent" narrative form can't be brilliant and profound, you understand, just that it shouldn't be a dogma or an imperative, that there should be more space cleared for plurality and the innovation of literary forms. I should hasten to add that my (unoriginal) comment about the "sociological and journalistic imperative" applies specifically to Indian writing in English. Writing in some of the other Indian languages can at times be very subjective or full of rhetorical flourishes—which, as you can imagine, is a different kind of problem. Alan Gilbert Interview with Vivek Narayanan (Part II) Alan: In "Four Ground-breaking Things In Five Issues of Civil Lines or, Ways to Get Your Head Out of the Postcolonial Sand," you make equations between particular historical moments in India and its literature. Here in the United States, writers and artists have worked for eight years under the cloud of the Bush administration, and, to a certain extent, the lingering effects of September 11. While some might argue that this has led to a renewed politicization among writers and artists, in fact it's also been accompanied by an increased interest in the fantastical, the grotesque, and the nihilistic. Are there political conditions in India informing current poetic and artistic practice? Vivek: For a while, India was ruled by the Hindu right, and this period reached its nadir in the dark tragedy of the Gujarat pogroms in 2002, even darker for having been written about and studied so extensively without the murderers, to this day, once being brought to justice. I think Gujarat did politicize even the most apolitical of artists, and many average folk, for that matter. There was a lot of energy gathered during this time. I can't exactly draw out chains of causality, but I suspect that, after the electoral defeat of the Hindu right, on the national level at least, this energy found expression in a new openness and vibrancy, including a new openness about sexuality, including queer sexuality, at least in the metros, and all of this in turn informed art practice. However, as you say, everything cuts two ways. The new liberal coalition government shared, more or less, one thing with its predecessor: an obsession with India's rise as a superpower, with India's supposed "arrival." This is a nationalistic, futuristic fantasy that's played out in the papers and on TV every day, and writers and artists are affected by it regardless of their political affiliation. On one hand, it means a welcome new confidence and adventurousness among writers and artists; on the other side, it signals shades of jingoism, insularity, careerism, smugness. To compound the matter, the traditional left/communist parties, through their bizarre, inconsistent, and even right-wingish politics have now lost any last shred of credibility they ever had, so it would be correct to say that many of us are now feeling, politically, rather confused and disheartened. In the back rooms, all the talk is about the Hindu right seizing the opportunity and maybe coming back to power soon, on the "anti-terror" ticket/racket. Alan: In a post a few months ago to the Equivocaliser blog, you wrote that, "For some time I've wanted to find formal structures and procedures that would address the question of ownership and authorship in poetry and find ways to admit writers of poetry into this discussion." Have you discovered any? Vivek: The performance documented in the post you mention was a first attempt to do that, and I've discussed it in detail. In part, it was meant to be provocative, since all each writer had to part with was one or two lines of their own poetry, written to a very simple, shared constraint. In any case, I was thrilled to find out how many people contributed, how many were willing, as one respondent put it, to "disappear into the occasion." Of course, none of the writers knew what was going to happen to their line(s) in the final performance, and neither did I, really, until a couple of hours before. I'm titillated by the possibility that over time we might learn to do this thing better, give mass coordinated performances, devising our lines carefully with a growing understanding of how our contributions might be deployed, learn to take control and give our own variations on the process. Of course, with regards to the larger question of copyright and ownership, it's really remarkable how conservative poets—not to mention the estates of poets—are on this issue, especially given poetry's completely marginal place on the far edge of capitalism, and the fact that a wider dissemination of poetry (or anything else) only helps to expand the market for it. Alan: You've recently begun to incorporate a performance component into your poetry readings. For instance, you've started readings sitting in the back of the audience; you began a poetry reading on a cell phone outside the venue (reminiscent of what was perhaps Vito Acconci's last "official" poetry reading, which he literally phoned in from different pay phones around New York City); you've experimented with different forms of audience participation. Can you talk about the importance of performance to your work? Vivek: I grew up in Africa, so fairly early on, rappers and then people like Linton Kwesi Johnson and the great Mutabaruka were heroes. I'm just speculating, I don't want to essentialize, but I wonder if a great many poets who see themselves, say, as "people of color" are simply less likely to see "performance" as somehow "tainted." They consider it as an integral part of their idea of poetry, regardless of how their relationship to modernism and the formal literary sphere might have evolved over time. What's more, there's a level on which performance is a part of writing; gradually, you grasp that if you hear and inflect the language in a slightly non-standard way, then performance can serve as a kind of proof, of your prosody. "Performance" in that wider sense was something I believed in, and worked on, more or less from the time I began to go public with poetry, maybe 15, 20 years ago. What did happen, however, was a disenchantment a) with the slam/spoken word style, and b) with poetry recited to a musical backdrop. Both modes I think are dead ends by now, or cul-de-sacs at best—the first because it has settled too easily into a set of mannerisms (the best poets from the movement, such as Lemn Sissay, are still great because their performances are in many ways an attack on, refusal or negation of everything the audience has come to see), the second, because hip hop with its offshoots has taken the whole word-music equation to such unbelievable heights of skill that "spoken word" just seems unable to compete. So in thinking about what to do differently with performance in the aftermath of these disenchantments, I found myself going back to fundamentals beyond language—the context of the performance above all, which might include the temporality of a poem, the interplay between ephemeral and lasting effects in a poem, the presence or absence of the body, the role of the audience, the possibility of collaboration, the possibility of "remote" performances, how to channel and recover the long, varied history of poetry performance styles available to us on record, and so on. It made sense to look to the history of avant-garde performance and to the kinds of things that have been happening in the art world, a visionary like Acconci leaping across that border. A lot of what I end up doing depends just on visiting the site where I have to perform, ideally with a collaborator, and seeing what it is that can and needs to be done. There are people in Delhi like the mesmerising performance artist Inder Salim who are doing far more extreme stuff, using their bodies, poetry, language, performance. I don't personally want to get too far away from representational and composed poetry, just to learn to hold it in tension with its context. For me, the key question, the only one that really matters, is still, "How and why do we make poems public?" Alan: In your manuscript "Mr. Subramanian" you utilize a lyrical, disjunctive prose to ask: What and where is a "native place"? How are we to think about origin, history, and tradition in a new century that already feels broken? The poems in your somewhat ironically titled "Lectures in Indian History" manuscript are also lyric in mode, but shorter, more personal. At the same time, they seem to be very much about movement—though in this instance more literally, less transculturally. How does the relationship between form and location/dislocation play out in your poetry? Vivek: Yes, it's strange, one is full of contradictions, and poetry is the place where one can get at and investigate those contradictions most nakedly; the poems, sometimes veering off unpredictably, always seem just a little bit ahead of where one's theoretical self-understanding is at. My first book, Universal Beach, which came out two years ago, was really meant to be a big "tata-byebye" to the very possibility of roots or place or single location, to defend my own, inescapable, rootlessness. I should mention that a few years before it came out, I had left South Africa, the place where I envisioned spending my whole life, unable, for a variety of reasons, to return. "The Subramanians" and the "Lectures in Indian History," on the other hand, suddenly seemed to open a kind of "Indian chapter" in my poems, albeit with all kinds of dislocations and interruptions—sometimes I think, well, I'm not really an Indian, but I'm forced to play one on TV—which leads me to think of it as a kind of retro book, retro also because it sometimes shows nostalgia for aspects of '80s India that are being obliterated or changed beyond recognition in the current, epic transformation. So, yes, I guess there's some attempt there to make a new, tentative relationship to the past given, as you say, the "already broken," to try and see what would happen if one thought (so-called) "tradition" and "experimentation" together, as if they were the same thing. This seems to sometimes lead me to go back to historical forms but maul or rework them in some way that can get to their more fundamental properties. I seem to have gone, for instance, from writing ghazals to writing various kinds of choric forms that people say are "ghazal-like," using refrains, repetitions, disjunctions, mixing it up with some of the repetitive "bhajan" forms I sang in my childhood. There are attempts—ultimately absurd, inaccurate, quixotic attempts—to imitate Tamil metres in English, and to get at, say, the percussive sound of Tamil in English, to run a prose line that could suddenly get lyrical without warning. There seem to be attempts by a lot of poets today to try and gradually alter the sound and movement and syntax of the English language for once and for all, to gradually make it more and more malleable and porous—I like that. Mostly, like any struggler, I'm just trying to bring all the different aspects of me together on the page, to pay that price. -- h From rohansaha at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 00:54:16 2008 From: rohansaha at gmail.com (rohan saha) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:54:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: References: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear All, I am new to this list and was added recently. I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective definition and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express what he wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a painter puts forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting prepared by him should be branded as offensive. Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the manner in which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but I can't comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism and vandalism. There are legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose expression / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has them, as does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia etc would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with death, therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of those countries. Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these paintings were rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a Husain? Regards, Rohan On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now? Is this too > to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and > the > other to be defended? What a terrible bore! > > > On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: > > > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > Wonder why the Danish > > cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even > his was a work of pure > > art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > Its quite unfortunate to see some > > ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > defending such mindless imagination. > > There isn't any justification for it. > > Had something of this scale been done > > in some other country such as > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person > > would't have been alive by > now. > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar > > wrote: > > > > You are welcome to critique the works of > > the artist and what you perceive > > to > > be the motives that drive her/his > > art. > > > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy > > that > > art? > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > > wrote: > > > > > The work of art is for the consumption > > of people but it should not > > consume the > > > consumer itself.The artist > > should know it very well.He should not try to > > play > > > with their faith just > > for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > > sensitive to > > > emotions and > > faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > > not > > > an end > > in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > > > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: S. Jabbar > > > > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > ; Sarai > > > > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > People have become rather > > emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems > > to > > > have become > > hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps > > if > > > there > > are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > > > > > Is one's faith so > > fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing > > and > > > can shake it? > > Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of > > art > > > when it is > > faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of > > > solitary > > meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > > > > > Do you know the story of Swami > > Vivekanand who stood in front of the > > goddess > > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it > > up. It's instructive. And humbling. > > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, > > "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > > > >> Artists should be > > careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities > > of > > >> the > > >> > > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > > touchy > > > > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > > >> people. > > > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > >> > > > To: sarai list > > > > > Sent: Monday, 25 > > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > > >> Delhi > > > > > > Dear > > all, > > > > > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > > >> > > > > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > > > (Hindu > > > > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > > > have > > attacked > > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > > > and > > about the > > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > > > held on > > the premises of > > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > > > Trust > > (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > > >> against the decision by the > > > orgnaizers > > of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > > >> work by Husain citing > > > reasons of > > security. This incident demonstrates, yet > > >> again, how > > > inimical the > > forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > > >> the > > > freedom of > > expression. > > > > > > See - > > >> > > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > > >> > > > > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > > > > > Express > > >> that carries details of the incident. > > > > > > This list has > > discussed such attacks on > > >> freedom of expression before, > > > and just as > > we have had forthright criticism > > >> of Muslim > > > fundamentalists attacking > > Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > > >> West > > > Bengal government making it > > impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > > >> > > > too, we must take into > > account this latest assault on cultural > > > liberty. I > > >> appeal to all to > > condemn this attack on the freedom of > > >> > > > expression. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > >> reader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > Be the > > first one to > > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > > >> > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > r > > >> eader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > Get an > > email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > > Click > > > here > > http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion > > list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send > > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject > > header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > ___________________________ > > ______________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To > > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List > > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- Rohan Saha Student, B.A., LL.B. (Hons.) NALSAR University of Law, Hyderabad, India. Phone: +91 9989190134 From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 01:04:21 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 01:04:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: References: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808251234h26e79319ia002cbd541e3484f@mail.gmail.com> Dear Rohan Artist M.F. Hussain is not the exception, Yes, a studet of Art, Mr.ChandraMohan was attacked and his professor suspened by Narender Modi in Gujarat. about the legal proceedings, Justice Sanjay Kishen Kaul has lucidly described these protests as ' vandalism by hooligans, and exonarated the artists from such charges, Theoritically, artists can do what they want to do, but how how to handle this self-appointed moral police, who unfortunately come to power through such un-aesthetic actions. inder slaim On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:54 AM, rohan saha wrote: > Dear All, > > I am new to this list and was added recently. > > I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. > > As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective definition > and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express what he > wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a painter puts > forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting prepared by > him should be branded as offensive. > > Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the manner in > which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but I can't > comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism and vandalism. There are > legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose expression > / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has them, as > does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. > > I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia etc > would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with death, > therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of those > countries. > > Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these paintings were > rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a Husain? > > Regards, > > Rohan > > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > >> What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now? Is this too >> to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and >> the >> other to be defended? What a terrible bore! >> >> >> On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: >> >> > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. >> >> Wonder why the Danish >> > cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even >> his was a work of pure >> > art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... >> >> Its quite unfortunate to see some >> > ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) >> defending such mindless imagination. >> > There isn't any justification for it. >> >> Had something of this scale been done >> > in some other country such as >> Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person >> > would't have been alive by >> now. >> >> Aditya Raj Kaul >> >> >> On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar >> > wrote: >> > >> > You are welcome to critique the works of >> > the artist and what you perceive >> > to >> > be the motives that drive her/his >> > art. >> > >> > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy >> > that >> > art? >> > >> > >> > >> > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" >> > wrote: >> > >> > > The work of art is for the consumption >> > of people but it should not >> > consume the >> > > consumer itself.The artist >> > should know it very well.He should not try to >> > play >> > > with their faith just >> > for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not >> > sensitive to >> > > emotions and >> > faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is >> > not >> > > an end >> > in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. >> > > >> > Prabhakar >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ---- >> > > From: S. Jabbar >> > >> > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; >> > Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> > > ; Sarai >> > >> > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM >> > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] >> > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> > > >> > > People have become rather >> > emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems >> > to >> > > have become >> > hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps >> > if >> > > there >> > are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. >> > > >> > > Is one's faith so >> > fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing >> > and >> > > can shake it? >> > Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of >> > art >> > > when it is >> > faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of >> > > solitary >> > meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. >> > > >> > > Do you know the story of Swami >> > Vivekanand who stood in front of the >> > goddess >> > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it >> > up. It's instructive. And humbling. >> > > >> > > >> > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, >> > "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: >> > > >> > >> Artists should be >> > careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities >> > of >> > >> the >> > >> >> > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and >> > touchy >> > >> > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some >> > >> people. >> > > >> > Prabhakar >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ---- >> > > From: >> > Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> > >> >> > > To: sarai list >> > >> > > Sent: Monday, 25 >> > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM >> > > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >> > >> Delhi >> > > >> > > Dear >> > all, >> > > >> > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting >> > >> >> > > >> > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva >> > > (Hindu >> > >> > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' >> > > have >> > attacked >> > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by >> > > and >> > about the >> > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was >> > > held on >> > the premises of >> > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial >> > > Trust >> > (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >> > >> against the decision by the >> > > orgnaizers >> > of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >> > >> work by Husain citing >> > > reasons of >> > security. This incident demonstrates, yet >> > >> again, how >> > > inimical the >> > forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to >> > >> the >> > > freedom of >> > expression. >> > > >> > > See - >> > >> >> > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >> > >> >> > > >> > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian >> > > >> > Express >> > >> that carries details of the incident. >> > > >> > > This list has >> > discussed such attacks on >> > >> freedom of expression before, >> > > and just as >> > we have had forthright criticism >> > >> of Muslim >> > > fundamentalists attacking >> > Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led >> > >> West >> > > Bengal government making it >> > impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so >> > >> >> > > too, we must take into >> > account this latest assault on cultural >> > > liberty. I >> > >> appeal to all to >> > condemn this attack on the freedom of >> > >> >> > > expression. >> > > >> > > regards >> > >> > > >> > > Shuddha >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _________________________________________ >> > > >> > >> reader-list: an open >> > discussion list on media and the city. >> > > Critiques & >> > >> Collaborations >> > > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >> > >> with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > To unsubscribe: >> > >> >> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > List archive: >> > >> >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > >> > > >> > > Be the >> > first one to >> > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >> > >> >> > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ >> > > >> > _________________________________________ >> > > r >> > >> eader-list: an open >> > discussion list on media and the city. >> > > Critiques & >> > >> Collaborations >> > > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >> > >> with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > To unsubscribe: >> > >> >> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > List archive: >> > >> >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > >> > > >> > > Get an >> > email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. >> > Click >> > > here >> > http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >> > >> > >> > >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion >> > list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send >> > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject >> > header. >> > To unsubscribe: >> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> ___________________________ >> > ______________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the >> > city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >> > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. >> To >> > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List >> > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > > > -- > Rohan Saha > Student, > B.A., LL.B. (Hons.) > NALSAR University of Law, > Hyderabad, > India. > Phone: +91 9989190134 > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From taraprakash at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 04:17:33 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 18:47:33 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Time for democratic fundamentalism in J&K Message-ID: <042e01c90704$913c46c0$ae3afb0a@taraprakash> by Harish Khair >From The Hindu Under assault here is not just the territorial integrity of India but also the idea of India, from the separatists as well as from the Hindutva brigade. Protests in Srinagar.Time for the Centre to reiterate a few fundamental axioms. A tiny section of the effete elite in New Delhi suddenly seems to have lost its nerve. So mightily impressed are these Bloomsbury-fied “intellectuals” with the Hurriyat’s capacity to work up mobs and instigate violence in the Kashmir Valley that they have begun to wonder aloud whether the time had come for India to give in to the azadi-chanters. After 61 years of independence, there is no need for any confusion or doubt. All that is ne eded is to reiterate a few fundamental axioms. The territorial integrity of India is non-negotiable in Kashmir, as in any other part of the Union. Bad politics, inept administration, and the occasional security heavy-handedness do not constitute sufficient ground for secession in Kashmir or in any other part of India. These infirmities, indeed, are not confined to the “periphery,” and can be easily discerned in large sections of the so-called “mainland.” But these lapses do not give anyone a licence to walk away from Mother India. This democracy provides sufficient institutional creativity to address grievances and alienation. Let us also be clear about the nature of the “Kashmir problem.” A section, possibly about a quarter, of the Kashmiris was always in thrall of the Muslim League ideology and wanted merger with Pakistan. It is this section that has remained un-reconciled to the idea of secular India. It is this section of the Kashmiris that the Hurriyat factions represent; all the Hurriyat leaders also know that their constituency is a limited one and that they do not speak for the majority of the Kashmiris. Instead, the Hurriyat and other separatist leaders have cleverly used the mosques and the militants to crank up dissent and dissatisfaction. It needs to be understood clearly that the Inter-Services Intelligence of Pakistan (ISI) and its guns have used the Amarnath Yatra controversy to try and retrieve the situation for the hardliners and the militants, who had been pushed off centre-stage. The mobs of self-styled “nationalists” in Jammu created precedence for the Hurriyat to whip up crowds in Srinagar, Anantnag, Baramulla, and Sopore. A stand-off between mobs and the security forces anywhere is an unpredictable affair; and the Kashmiri separatists are experienced agents provocateurs. In the current phase the turning point was the killing of the Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Aziz. But it remains far from clear as to whose bullet it was that killed him. With Pakistan being internally distracted, the ISI once again has a free hand in Kashmir. It does not require great foresight to suggest that the ISI strategy now is to force a postponement of the October 2008 elections to the Jammu and Kashmir Assembly by creating violence and chaos in the Valley. This strategy is predicated on continued foolishness in the Jammu region. Those in the separatist camp will be relieved to have been spared the onus of having to prove once again how much — or rather, how little — affection and support they enjoy among the people they claim to represent. Those who are talking of deferring elections are playing into the separatists’ hands. It is time to have a fundamentalist belief in the curative power of Indian democracy. Under assault in the troubled State is not just the territorial integrity of India but also the idea of India, from the separatists as well as from the Hindutva brigade. The mere fact that the agitators in Jammu carry the Indian Tricolour does not mean that their agenda is in conformity with India’s constitutional design. Democratic authenticity does not accrue to mobs and crowds ipso facto; nor does the Praveen Togadias’ invocation of the “100 crore Hindus” make the Jammu violence any more legitimate or acceptable than the Hurriyat warlords’ incendiary tactics. Those who talk of the “Jammu psyche” are essentially parroting the Hindutva catechism. Need for cautious force It is obvious that in the next few weeks the Indian state will have to exert itself to make up for the many recent follies by the politicians. No one should be allowed to entertain any doubts about New Delhi’s will and capacity to stay put in Kashmir. In the immediate context it means the willingness to use, if necessary, cautious force — caution not borne out of the European Union type of pusillanimity but out of respect for the ISI-Geelani faction’s capacity to manufacture trouble. Particular care will need to be taken to ensure that the hardcore separatists do not take advantage of the chaos to eliminate moderate Hurriyat leaders, a la Abdul Gani Lone. Second, it will be sobering to remember not to repeat in Kashmir the mistakes New Delhi made in Punjab in the 1980s and 1990s. Clarity of command and instructions from New Delhi to Srinagar should be ensured. The Governor and his colleagues cannot be made to feel as if they are answerable to many masters. Third, the Congress leadership owes it to itself and the country to be unequivocally clear as to what is at stake in Jammu and Kashmir. The Congress leaders need to realise that as the ruling party they have to decide what is right for the country, irrespective of its political and electoral consequences. It was this internal confusion that in the first place escalated a minor political problem into a major national crisis. As the ruling party, the Congress also needs to educate the country on the BJP’s divisive politics in Jammu and Kashmir. The BJP’s talk and practice of an “economic blockade” was an anti-national activity and ought to be exposed as such. Despite its secular protestations, the Congress leadership remains mortally unsure of the country’s mood. Without a renewed fundamentalist faith in the idea of secular India, the Congress will find it difficult to communicate the difficult choices in Jammu and Kashmir. Lastly, it is time to take maximum use of the richness of our civil society — particularly the peace-constituency, conflict-resolution-wallahs, and the reconciliation crowd — to wean Kashmiri society away from the prolonged habits and traditions of violence, distrust and suspicion. Kashmir has been the theatre of intrigue and conflict for so long that there is very little capacity for reconstruction and reconciliation. This vacuum has to be filled. It is a combination of India’s hard and soft powers within the overall democratic design that will carry the day in Jammu and Kashmir in the difficult weeks ahead. We need not overreact to provocations and slogans at Lal Chowk, but we also need not be apologetic about our democratic values and practices. PHOTO: NISSAR AHMAD Protests in Srinagar.Time for the Centre to reiterate a few fundamental axioms. A tiny section of the effete elite in New Delhi suddenly seems to have lost its nerve. So mightily impressed are these Bloomsbury-fied “intellectuals” with the Hurriyat’s capacity to work up mobs and instigate violence in the Kashmir Valley that they have begun to wonder aloud whether the time had come for India to give in to the azadi-chanters. After 61 years of independence, there is no need for any confusion or doubt. All that is ne eded is to reiterate a few fundamental axioms. The territorial integrity of India is non-negotiable in Kashmir, as in any other part of the Union. Bad politics, inept administration, and the occasional security heavy-handedness do not constitute sufficient ground for secession in Kashmir or in any other part of India. These infirmities, indeed, are not confined to the “periphery,” and can be easily discerned in large sections of the so-called “mainland.” But these lapses do not give anyone a licence to walk away from Mother India. This democracy provides sufficient institutional creativity to address grievances and alienation. Let us also be clear about the nature of the “Kashmir problem.” A section, possibly about a quarter, of the Kashmiris was always in thrall of the Muslim League ideology and wanted merger with Pakistan. It is this section that has remained un-reconciled to the idea of secular India. It is this section of the Kashmiris that the Hurriyat factions represent; all the Hurriyat leaders also know that their constituency is a limited one and that they do not speak for the majority of the Kashmiris. Instead, the Hurriyat and other separatist leaders have cleverly used the mosques and the militants to crank up dissent and dissatisfaction. It needs to be understood clearly that the Inter-Services Intelligence of Pakistan (ISI) and its guns have used the Amarnath Yatra controversy to try and retrieve the situation for the hardliners and the militants, who had been pushed off centre-stage. The mobs of self-styled “nationalists” in Jammu created precedence for the Hurriyat to whip up crowds in Srinagar, Anantnag, Baramulla, and Sopore. A stand-off between mobs and the security forces anywhere is an unpredictable affair; and the Kashmiri separatists are experienced agents provocateurs. In the current phase the turning point was the killing of the Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Aziz. But it remains far from clear as to whose bullet it was that killed him. With Pakistan being internally distracted, the ISI once again has a free hand in Kashmir. It does not require great foresight to suggest that the ISI strategy now is to force a postponement of the October 2008 elections to the Jammu and Kashmir Assembly by creating violence and chaos in the Valley. This strategy is predicated on continued foolishness in the Jammu region. Those in the separatist camp will be relieved to have been spared the onus of having to prove once again how much — or rather, how little — affection and support they enjoy among the people they claim to represent. Those who are talking of deferring elections are playing into the separatists’ hands. It is time to have a fundamentalist belief in the curative power of Indian democracy. Under assault in the troubled State is not just the territorial integrity of India but also the idea of India, from the separatists as well as from the Hindutva brigade. The mere fact that the agitators in Jammu carry the Indian Tricolour does not mean that their agenda is in conformity with India’s constitutional design. Democratic authenticity does not accrue to mobs and crowds ipso facto; nor does the Praveen Togadias’ invocation of the “100 crore Hindus” make the Jammu violence any more legitimate or acceptable than the Hurriyat warlords’ incendiary tactics. Those who talk of the “Jammu psyche” are essentially parroting the Hindutva catechism. Need for cautious force It is obvious that in the next few weeks the Indian state will have to exert itself to make up for the many recent follies by the politicians. No one should be allowed to entertain any doubts about New Delhi’s will and capacity to stay put in Kashmir. In the immediate context it means the willingness to use, if necessary, cautious force — caution not borne out of the European Union type of pusillanimity but out of respect for the ISI-Geelani faction’s capacity to manufacture trouble. Particular care will need to be taken to ensure that the hardcore separatists do not take advantage of the chaos to eliminate moderate Hurriyat leaders, a la Abdul Gani Lone. Second, it will be sobering to remember not to repeat in Kashmir the mistakes New Delhi made in Punjab in the 1980s and 1990s. Clarity of command and instructions from New Delhi to Srinagar should be ensured. The Governor and his colleagues cannot be made to feel as if they are answerable to many masters. Third, the Congress leadership owes it to itself and the country to be unequivocally clear as to what is at stake in Jammu and Kashmir. The Congress leaders need to realise that as the ruling party they have to decide what is right for the country, irrespective of its political and electoral consequences. It was this internal confusion that in the first place escalated a minor political problem into a major national crisis. As the ruling party, the Congress also needs to educate the country on the BJP’s divisive politics in Jammu and Kashmir. The BJP’s talk and practice of an “economic blockade” was an anti-national activity and ought to be exposed as such. Despite its secular protestations, the Congress leadership remains mortally unsure of the country’s mood. Without a renewed fundamentalist faith in the idea of secular India, the Congress will find it difficult to communicate the difficult choices in Jammu and Kashmir. Lastly, it is time to take maximum use of the richness of our civil society — particularly the peace-constituency, conflict-resolution-wallahs, and the reconciliation crowd — to wean Kashmiri society away from the prolonged habits and traditions of violence, distrust and suspicion. Kashmir has been the theatre of intrigue and conflict for so long that there is very little capacity for reconstruction and reconciliation. This vacuum has to be filled. It is a combination of India’s hard and soft powers within the overall democratic design that will carry the day in Jammu and Kashmir in the difficult weeks ahead. We need not overreact to provocations and slogans at Lal Chowk, but we also need not be apologetic about our democratic values and practices. From peter.ksmtf at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 06:52:10 2008 From: peter.ksmtf at gmail.com (T Peter) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 06:52:10 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fishworkers oppose joint naval exercise Message-ID: <3457ce860808251822m6206059ayf6c01febfac88681@mail.gmail.com> Fishworkers oppose joint naval exercise Date:25/08/2008 URL: http://www.thehindu.com/2008/08/25/stories/2008082555240800.htm Special Correspondent THIRUVANANTHAPURAM: The Kerala Swathantra Matsya Thozhilaly Federation (KSMTF) has protested against over the proposed joint naval exercise between India and the U.S. in the coastal waters of Kerala. The move initiated by the two governments known as 'Malabar Exercise,' to be held in October would surrender the interests of not just the fishing community, but also the entire country, KSMTF state president T. Peter said in a press note on Sunday. The agenda to include American nuclear ships in this exercise is a major concern, it said. "The proposed nuclear deal between India and U.S. will lead to the establishment of more nuclear plants in the coastal area. Already, the Kalpakkam plant has exposed the fishing community to health hazards like cancer, skin problems and pregnancy disorders. It has led to a decline in fish stocks in the area," the note said. "The problems caused by nuclear plants do not impact the fishing community alone. By exposing fish stocks to radiation, they could threaten the life of the common man who depends on fish as an affordable source of protein". From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 09:07:00 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:37:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <87985.21981.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how wold you react? Will you write the same languge which you have written here and take the same action as suggested by you to others? Will you appreciate the beautiful work of art in the same manner? After all every freedom has its sensible limits. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: rohan saha To: S. Jabbar Cc: Sarai Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 12:54:16 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear All, I am new to this list and was added recently. I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective definition and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express what he wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a painter puts forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting prepared by him should be branded as offensive. Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the manner in which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but I can't comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism  and vandalism. There are legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose expression / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has them, as does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia etc would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with death, therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of those countries. Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these paintings were rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a Husain? Regards, Rohan On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now?  Is this too > to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and > the > other to be defended? What a terrible bore! > > > On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: > > > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > Wonder why the Danish > > cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even > his was a work of pure > > art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > Its quite unfortunate to see some > > ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > defending such mindless imagination. > > There isn't any justification for it. > > Had something of this scale been done > > in some other country such as > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person > > would't have been alive by > now. > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar > > wrote: > > > > You are welcome to critique the works of > > the artist and what you perceive > > to > > be the motives that drive her/his > > art. > > > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy > > that > > art? > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > > wrote: > > > > > The work of art is for the consumption > > of people but it should not > > consume the > > > consumer itself.The artist > > should know it very well.He should not try to > > play > > > with their faith just > > for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > > sensitive to > > > emotions and > > faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > > not > > > an end > > in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > > > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: S. Jabbar > > > > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > ; Sarai > > > > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > People have become rather > > emotional and touchy of late.  Everyone seems > > to > > > have become > > hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps > > if > > > there > > are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > > > > > Is one's faith so > > fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing > > and > > > can shake it? > > Evidently so and mores the pity.  Why tear down works of > > art > > > when it is > > faith that is crumbling?  My prescription is twenty years of > > > solitary > > meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > > > > > Do you know the story of Swami > > Vivekanand who stood in front of the > > goddess > > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it > > up.  It's instructive.  And humbling. > > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, > > "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > > > >> Artists should be > > careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities > > of > > >> the > > >> > > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > > touchy > > > > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > > >> people. > > > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > >> > > > To: sarai list > > > > > Sent: Monday, 25 > > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > > >> Delhi > > > > > > Dear > > all, > > > > > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > > >> > > > > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > > > (Hindu > > > > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > > > have > > attacked > > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > > > and > > about the > > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > > > held on > > the premises of > > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > > > Trust > > (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > > >> against the decision by the > > > orgnaizers > > of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > > >> work by Husain citing > > > reasons of > > security. This incident demonstrates, yet > > >> again, how > > > inimical the > > forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > > >> the > > > freedom of > > expression. > > > > > > See - > > >> > > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > > >> > > > > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > > > > > Express > > >> that carries details of the incident. > > > > > > This list has > > discussed such attacks on > > >> freedom of expression before, > > > and just as > > we have had forthright criticism > > >> of Muslim > > > fundamentalists attacking > > Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > > >> West > > > Bengal government making it > > impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > > >> > > > too, we must take into > > account this latest assault on cultural > > > liberty.  I > > >> appeal to all to > > condemn this attack on the freedom of > > >> > > > expression. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > >> reader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > >      Be the > > first one to > > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > > >> > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > r > > >> eader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > >      Get an > > email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > > Click > > > here > > http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion > > list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send > > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject > > header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > ___________________________ > > ______________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To > > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List > > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- Rohan Saha Student, B.A., LL.B. (Hons.) NALSAR University of Law, Hyderabad, India. Phone: +91 9989190134 _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Share files, take polls, and make new friends - all under one roof. Go to http://in.promos.yahoo.com/groups/ From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 09:16:22 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 20:46:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <845191.56624.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> How is it that if somebody paints your mother nude, it is an offense, but if the same person paints your motherland nude - it is an Art. I am sure, such people will not protect their mothers and sisters also if they are forced nude.. because such people do not have the sense to do it... Let M.F.Hussain paint Pakistan nude and we will see if will be allowed to live in this world.... Let M.F.Hussain paint his mother nude before he does that to our motherland... I am sure, a person who paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense to his mother and sister (though he may not be exposing it to the world)... ----- Original Message ---- From: Prabhakar Singh To: rohan saha ; S. Jabbar Cc: Sarai Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 9:07:00 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how wold you react? Will you write the same languge which you have written here and take the same action as suggested by you to others? Will you appreciate the beautiful work of art in the same manner? After all every freedom has its sensible limits. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: rohan saha To: S. Jabbar Cc: Sarai Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 12:54:16 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear All, I am new to this list and was added recently. I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective definition and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express what he wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a painter puts forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting prepared by him should be branded as offensive. Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the manner in which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but I can't comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism and vandalism. There are legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose expression / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has them, as does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia etc would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with death, therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of those countries. Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these paintings were rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a Husain? Regards, Rohan On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now? Is this too > to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and > the > other to be defended? What a terrible bore! > > > On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: > > > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > Wonder why the Danish > > cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even > his was a work of pure > > art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > Its quite unfortunate to see some > > ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > defending such mindless imagination. > > There isn't any justification for it. > > Had something of this scale been done > > in some other country such as > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person > > would't have been alive by > now. > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar > > wrote: > > > > You are welcome to critique the works of > > the artist and what you perceive > > to > > be the motives that drive her/his > > art. > > > > But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy > > that > > art? > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > > wrote: > > > > > The work of art is for the consumption > > of people but it should not > > consume the > > > consumer itself.The artist > > should know it very well.He should not try to > > play > > > with their faith just > > for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > > sensitive to > > > emotions and > > faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > > not > > > an end > > in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > > > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: S. Jabbar > > > > > To: Prabhakar Singh ; > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > ; Sarai > > > > > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > People have become rather > > emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems > > to > > > have become > > hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps > > if > > > there > > are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > > > > > Is one's faith so > > fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing > > and > > > can shake it? > > Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of > > art > > > when it is > > faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of > > > solitary > > meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > > > > > Do you know the story of Swami > > Vivekanand who stood in front of the > > goddess > > > at Khir Bhavani? Look it > > up. It's instructive. And humbling. > > > > > > > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, > > "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > > > >> Artists should be > > careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities > > of > > >> the > > >> > > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > > touchy > > > > >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > > >> people. > > > > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > >> > > > To: sarai list > > > > > Sent: Monday, 25 > > >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > > >> Delhi > > > > > > Dear > > all, > > > > > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > > >> > > > > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > > > (Hindu > > > > >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > > > have > > attacked > > >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > > > and > > about the > > >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > > > held on > > the premises of > > >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > > > Trust > > (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > > >> against the decision by the > > > orgnaizers > > of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > > >> work by Husain citing > > > reasons of > > security. This incident demonstrates, yet > > >> again, how > > > inimical the > > forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > > >> the > > > freedom of > > expression. > > > > > > See - > > >> > > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > > >> > > > > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > > > > > Express > > >> that carries details of the incident. > > > > > > This list has > > discussed such attacks on > > >> freedom of expression before, > > > and just as > > we have had forthright criticism > > >> of Muslim > > > fundamentalists attacking > > Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > > >> West > > > Bengal government making it > > impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > > >> > > > too, we must take into > > account this latest assault on cultural > > > liberty. I > > >> appeal to all to > > condemn this attack on the freedom of > > >> > > > expression. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > > >> reader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > Be the > > first one to > > >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > > >> > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > r > > >> eader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & > > >> Collaborations > > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > >> with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > >> > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > >> > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > Get an > > email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > > Click > > > here > > http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion > > list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send > > an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject > > header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > ___________________________ > > ______________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To > > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List > > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- Rohan Saha Student, B.A., LL.B. (Hons.) NALSAR University of Law, Hyderabad, India. Phone: +91 9989190134 _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Share files, take polls, and make new friends - all under one roof. Go to http://in.promos.yahoo.com/groups/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 10:35:29 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 10:35:29 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore In-Reply-To: <112534.6381.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <112534.6381.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808252205v386f6e29idef448c1ab4a19f1@mail.gmail.com> And there are people like me who are not registered with Government as "migrants" . On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 5:40 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > > > Dear Sonia > > You MUST be a Kashmiri Pandit pretending to be of some other ethnicity. > > OR Maybe you too are an "Agent" of the Govt. of India. You could also be > from the Hindutva cadre of BJP or VHP or Bajrang Dal. Heavans forbid. > > These are shots in the darkness of SARAI caused by postings that are at > most times filled with bias, prejudice and presumptions with added liberal > (pun not intended) doses of ignorance and misrepresentations. > > Whatever else you are, you come across to me as an independent thinker who > is not a bandwagon-person nor is tempted into taking fashionable 'liberal' > positions on issues (pun intended). That does not mean that you and I think > alike on all subjects. > > 1. It is reported in August 2002 that 11 polling stations have been > reserved for KPs (migrants) for the about to come elections. 8 in Jammu, 2 > in Udhampur and 1 in Delhi. > > The report also says that 150,000 KPs (migrants) in "other" parts of the > country could cast their votes by postal ballot. This is as per an Election > Commission official. > > This would mean that apart from the majority of KPs (migrants) who had > landed in Jammu, Udhampur and Delhi there were some 150,000 KPs (migrants) > more who had moved to places other than Jammu, Udhampur and Delhi. > > 2. A June 2007 report about one of the Prime Minister's Working Groups > headed by Hamid Ansari quotes figures from this WG to say: > > " ..........the total population of Kashmiri Pandits in the valley before > migration was about 3.5 lakh. While a majority migrated to Jammu and other > parts of the country, about 18,000 stayed back as of 1997." > > The report also quotes another set of figures (note that these are figures > for Jammu alone) to say: > > "As many as 30,206 Hindu families, 2,120 Muslim families and 1,749 Sikhs > are registered as migrants with the state government and are now living in > Jammu." > > 3. The official website of J&K Govt in an August 2000 report mentions: > > "According to the Koul Report, there were 56,689 families (migrants of all > communities) in Jammu and elsewhere in the country in 1997. Of them 31,490 > families were in Jammu alone and 19,339 families in New Delhi." > > It might be pertinent to point out that "families" were not registered as > "nuclear families" but covered the direct lineage (excluding girls married > out and including girls married into the family). Most cross-references for > registration were linked to the "residence" in Kashmir before the > 'migration'. In most cases there were 3 generations who had been living > together and who were registered as a "family". > > 4. CIA's "The World Factbook" mentions 600,000 IDPs in India anbd says that > about half of those are Kashmiri Pandits from Jammu and Kashmir. > > 5. The Geneva based (mandated by United Nations) Internal Displacement > Monitoring Cell (IDMC) notes that the lowest number of Kashmir Pandit IDPs > found from sources was 56,246 families. It translates that into the number > 250,000 and credits GOI with being the source. > > IDMC notes that the Highest estimates of (Kashmiri Pandit) IDPs found from > sources was QUOTE "Maybe as many as" 450,000 UNQUOTE. It credits U.S > Committee for Refugees (USCR) as the source. > > > Kshmendra > > PS. > There is another aspect of Migration/Displacement of Kashmiri Pandits which > never gets highlighted. > > If one may call the post 1988 displacement an 'exodus', between 1947 and > 1988 also there was an outflow of Kashmir Pandits from Kashmir for various > reasons that had nothing much to do with being terrorised, even if they > faced intimidation. > > This was because of 'lack of opportunities' in Kashmir. This 'lack of > opportunities' became a 'fait accompli' forced upon the KPs when admission > to professional educational institutions (read Medical and Engineering) > started taking place on the basis of religious ratio-proportions. (I think > only 10% or maybe 20% of the admissions were on 'competitive' basis). This > was followed by "recruitments" and "promotions" also following the same > principle though this might be difficult to substantiate though there was > such an "Executive Order" for "promotions" after a specified level. > > This understandably led to a constant year after year diaspora out of > Kashmir towards Educational Institutions and Jobs. They were not migrating > out, strictly speaking, because the "permanent residence" continued to be in > Kashmir with major part of the immediate family also left behind. So > children studying 'out' had their parents back in Kashmir. Those who had > taken up Jobs outside also had their parents in kashmir and in many cases > also the spouse and children. > > If this is understood, it might be easier for some to appreciate that the > Internal Displacement of Kashmiri Pandits that occured as an exodus out of > Kashmir post 1988 was not confined to those numbers who physically moved out > of Kashmir but also those who used to but now could not go back. Many were > 'forced out' by the situation. Many had to 'stay out' because of the > situation. > > Census figures and numbers from Electoral Rolls could never give the full > picture of the Internal Displacement. > > > > > --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work anymore > To: "Kashmir Affairs" , "Sarai" < > reader-list at sarai.net> > Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 2:41 PM > > Dear Murtaza, > > The official figures of GoI put the Pandit refugees or internally displaced > persons (not migrants) at 100,000. The Pandit organisations dispute that > and claim a higher number. > > You put the numbers of Muslims massacred in Jammu in 1947 as 250,000. The > Statesman correspondent in '47 had reported 60,000 dead. Since I found > this > a very high figure even when compared to massacres in the Punjab (because > the killings in Jammu happened within a much shorter period) I had > interviewed old-timers of Jammu who were witness to the times and > specifically asked about this figure. Each had felt the figure highly > exaggerated-- including Ved Bhasin, Balraj Puri and others who have > otherwise opposed communalism all their lives. > > You also quote the number of Kashmiri refugees post-1990 in Pakistan as > 100,000. This is again an inflated figure. The official Pakistani figure > is 15,000. When I met with Kashmiri youth in Rawalpindi 2 years ago and > they had asked me to do something to enable them to return, they had put > their figures at 30,000. I would guess it's somewhere in the middle. > > In times of crisis some feel the need to inflate figures. If there are 6 > rapes it's not good enough, it has to be the whole village of women. If > 2,000 are killed it seems insignificant when other sites of horror like > Cambodia, Vietnam, the battlefields of the First World War, the > concentration camps of the Second can claim millions dead. > > Can we pause for a moment and see what it is we are doing? > > > On 8/25/08 1:39 PM, "Kashmir Affairs" > wrote: > > > Pawan, > - There is by no way, I repeat no way, more than 100,000 Kashmiri > > Pandits as migrants. And this number is almost same as those Kashmiri > Muslims > > who were forced to migrate to Muzzaffarabad. While I am not trivilizing > > migration (without any prejudice to the stated cause) I think it is > important > > that when we talk about migration - we have to talk about both. In > addition, > > two million Kashmiri migrants living in various Pakistani cities have to > be > > included into it as there is at least half a million of them who would > like to > > come back. > > in solidarity, > Murtaza > > --- On Mon, 25/8/08, Pawan Durani > > wrote: > From: Pawan Durani > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > > anymore > To: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, "Aditya Raj > > Kaul" > Date: Monday, 25 August, 2008, 5:48 > > AM > > Murtazas figures seem to be as good as his "impartial" understanding > of > > Kashmir. What a figure ? 1,00,000 KP's migrated out of Kashmir ! > I wonder how > > many marks Murtaza got in mathematics , unless he was very good only at > > divisions. > > Pawan > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 3:48 AM, Kashmir Affairs > > wrote: > > Wonderful. Indian 'democracy' has only one > > policy prescription in Kashmir - whole scale murder. A friend who has > been > at > > very top post in IB recently wrote back to me that 'those who > don't want to > > live in India should migrate'. It seems had they not attacked the LoC > March > > whole Kashmir would have gone to the otherside. Not a bad proposition in > my > > view - life is more precious than land. > > > In 1947 - quarter a million were > > massacred in Jammu and two million forced to migrate. > > In 1990 - 100,000 > > Pandits had to leave and similar number of Kashmiri Muslims from villages > > along the LoC migrated to Muzzaffarabad. > > In 2008 - thousands of Muslim > > families have been forced to leave Jammu and adjoining Hindu majority > > areas. > > - 'Democracy' is just getting better. And what a wonderful way of > > scapegoating - anti-nationls, terrorists. > > Welcome to Rene Gerrard's world - > > Mimesis and Violence. > > > > Murtaza Shibli > > www.kashmiraffairs.org > > > > > > --- On > > Sun, 24/8/08, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > > From: Aditya > > Raj Kaul > > Subject: [Reader-list] Oranges won't work > > anymore > > To: "sarai list" > > Date: Sunday, 24 August, > > 2008, 7:16 PM > > > > *Oranges won't work anymore* > > > > By Joginder Singh, > > Ex-Director CBI > > > > > > The CRPF Inspector-General was transferred from Srinagar > > on August 13 after > > an uproar in the Kashmir Valley, led by terrorists and > > their supporters, who > > alleged excesses by the Central paramilitary force. He > > was also denied the > > President's police medal for fear of controversy and > > wider protests. There > > is nothing new in this kind of approach as the > > decision-makers are far > > removed from reality. Meanwhile, it is the police and > > the security forces > > that continue to face life-and-death situations, standing > > between chaos and > > order. > > > > In 1990s, the then Governor of Jammu & Kashmir > > lost his job for taking a > > tough stand against anti-nationalist elements. That > > did not help the > > situation, nor will the recent transfer of the CRPF > > Inspector-General > > restore peace. On the contrary, it will embolden > > separatists and terrorists > > who will now think that they can get away with > > anything. > > > > Wherever the Government of the day has pursued the policy of > > appeasement > > and has compromised on basic values, it has invited trouble. > > Terrorism in > > the Valley flourishes in direct proportion to the political will > > to deal > > with the same. It commenced with the kidnapping of Ms Mehbooba Mufti, > > the > > daughter of Mufti Mohammed Sayed, former Home Minister, who is now a > > former > > Chief Minister of Jammu & Kashmir. To secure her release, the > > then > > Government had freed five dreaded terrorists. This emboldened > > the > > separatists and the terrorists, and was enough to start a series of > > chain > > reactions in the Valley from 1988 onwards. I am an eyewitness to > > these > > events as I was the InspectorGeneralof the CRPF in Srinagar at the > > time. > > > > The Government's tendency to sweep such incidents under the carpet > > has > > today resulted in terrorists openly dictating terms to the people; > > enforcing > > the *purdah* system for women, closing down beauty parlours and > > cinema > > houses, etc. The Prime Minister, like many before him, gave a > > laudable > > speech from the ramparts of the Red Fort on Independence day this > > year as he > > appealed to the masses to shun communalism. > > > > But unfortunately, > > the whole agitation in the Kashmir Valley is based on a > > communal ideology. > > The truth is, communalism in one community generates > > communalism in others. > > Otherwise, how could hordes of people led by > > terrorists start a rally with > > the declared aim of crossing the LoC into > > Muzaffarabad? The Government should > > have responded that those who cross the > > LoC illegally will not be allowed > > back into the country. > > > > A series of misconceived policies, or the so-called > > people-to-people > > contact, have brought about this situation. Otherwise, how > > could a > > mainstream political party demand that Pakistani currency be declared > > legal > > tender in Jammu & Kashmir? It would be wrong to say > > that > > 'transferring' 97 > > acres of forest land to the Sri Amarnath Shrine Board > > has led to the present > > crisis. The separatists and terrorists have been going > > all-out to create > > disturbances and problems as per the following report of > > the Jammu & > > Kashmir > > Government: > > > > "A total of 42,147 people, including > > 20,647 militants and 5,024 security > > personnel were killed in the State > > between January 1990 and the middle of > > February 2007... Violence left 33,885 > > people, including 12,124 security > > personnel and 21,659 civilians injured > > during the same period in the > > State... 11,221 civilians were killed by > > militants and another 1,678 lost > > their lives in grenade and Improvised > > Explosive Device explosions, while 173 > > civilians were killed when they were > > caught in clashes between militants. A > > total of 3,404 civilians were killed > > in cross-firing incidents between > > security forces and militants... The > > highest number of 1,438 civilians were > > killed in 1996, the year elections > > were held after a gap of seven year, > > while the highest number of 3,602 Army > > and other paramilitary personnel lost > > their lives fighting militants in the > > same year. Jammu and Kashmir Police > > lost 537 personnel since January 1990. As > > many as 438 Special Police > > Officers engaged by the police in > > counter-insurgency operations were killed. > > 127 Village Defence Committee > > members were killed fighting militants in the > > State. 613 security personnel > > were killed in a single year in 2001, which > > was again the highest." > > > > Now, > > the question arises as to what can be done. Also whether what is being > > done > > is sufficient. In 1990, the midnight protests were sparked by the call > > given > > by 1,100 mosques, which had installed loudspeakers to call the > > faithful to > > prayer. Loudspeakers in Kashmir's mosques, then as now, are > > used > > to give > > calls for anti-national activities, asking the people to gather in > > the > > streets or at a particular spot to stage demonstrations. The then > > Governor > > had ordered the disconnection of these loudspeakers, which itself > > led to > > protests. > > > > It is a fact that many terrorists take shelter in places of > > worship. During > > my recent visit to the US I was told that the police had, > > with the > > co-operation of the Muslim community and their religious leaders, > > installed > > CCTV cameras in mosques to monitor any criminal activity. In a > > situation > > like that which prevails in the Kashmir Valley, which has been > > highly > > communalised, it is impossible to get any kind of evidence to > > prove > > anti-national activities as no witness will be willing to come forth > > to > > depose. Mrs Margaret Thatcher used to say publicity is the oxygen > > of > > terrorism. Any publicity which eulogises terrorism should be discouraged, > > if > > not completely banned. > > > > Terrorist leaders, their supporters and > > sympathisers should be immobilised > > by using the present laws and detained > > outside Jammu & Kashmir. The > > Government has announced financial assistance > > for the families of terrorists > > on the grounds that it is not their fault if > > the only earning member of > > their family becomes a militant. This approach is > > fraught with danger and > > the sooner it is given up the better. It should not > > become a scheme to help > > traitors. > > > > Many so-called intellectuals talk about > > a referendum in the Valley. With > > Pakistan having hijacked the anti-India > > movement, any referendum or election > > will be irrelevant at this point of > > time. The first priority is to drive the > > Pakistani terrorists out of the > > Valley and send them to the country of their > > origin. The Government should > > stop all dialogue with these militants who are > > nothing more than agents of > > Pakistan. Only a tough approach will send the > > right signal that the > > Government means > > business. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open > > discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To > > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > > in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > Send instant messages to > > your online friends > > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > _________________________________________ > > read > > er-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & > > Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > with subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > Send instant messages to > > your online friends > > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _________________________________________ > reader > > -list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & > > Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > > with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From ambarien at yahoo.co.uk Tue Aug 26 10:43:31 2008 From: ambarien at yahoo.co.uk (ambarien qadar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 05:13:31 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] Hit and Run Message-ID: <157206.40654.qm@web25504.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear All, On 24th August at around 11am we were driving across the Maharani Bagh-Ashram crossing (New Delhi) when a swanky black convertible screeched to a halt at the left side. It has just hit headlong a nondescript pedestrian, quite young and looking like those numerous workmen making their way in the morning to some workshop in the bylanes around Ashram Chowk. I cannot tell the exact model and make of the car as it was something one doesnt often come across on Delhi roads - a very expensive low-slung Porsche look alike. On the driving wheel was our famous socialite, and if one goes by our english speaking television culture, the modern conscience of our new urban nation, Mr Suhail Seth. The man hit, looked unable to walk, and sat there grabbing his ankles in pain. The social scene was interesting, this being some very rich looking car the people around looked very hesitant to confront the driver; had it been some familiar maruti-like vehicle I'm sure it would have spelled disasters of accountability for the driver. I expected that Mr Seth would at least try to apologise, get down from his car, and offer the man to be taken to some nearby first-aid facility. But Mr Seth was almost shouting on the man and in a very rushed manner backed-off the car, which anyways he looked quite less adapt at handling - and maybe thats how the accident happened in the first place! In no time then he sped off back into the avenue that emerges out of New Friends Colony East that joins onto the Maharani Bagh and Ashram section of the Ring Road. Mr. Seth is a regular on NDTV's 'We The People' and in February 2006 he was moderating'The Status of Delhi in 2010' at the Vasant Vihar spring festival!! Big car Mr. Seth but very small heart. Ambarien Al Qadar Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From hight at 34n118w.net Tue Aug 26 10:58:46 2008 From: hight at 34n118w.net (hight at 34n118w.net) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 22:28:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] new in neme : "immersive event time" Message-ID: <53771.75.36.220.111.1219728526.squirrel@webmail.34n118w.net> neme.org/main/880/immersive-event-time essay looks at research into a possible new mode of measuring events in time that is interactive,immersive and geometric to better capture the multiple facets of an event and the needed tangible/visceral aspect of feeling the data of things currently being diluted by the corporate media like the number of dead in the Iraq war From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 11:05:20 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2008 22:35:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 Message-ID: <101954.18339.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> This is an era of integration not division.We should concentrate towards integration in this region with increasing thrust of mutual co-operation,trust and tolerance rather than separatism. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta To: S. Jabbar Cc: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 12:34:14 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 Dear Sonia, In the tumult of the last two days, the more substantial conversation  that we were having has been neglected. I want to come back to it, as  it was a very productive conversation. You have rightly pointed out the complexity of the ethnic mosaic of  the undivided state of Jammu and Kashmir, and the fact that the UN  Resolutions, by framing the dispute in the India-Pakistan binary,  seem to leave no room for third or fourth of fifth options. I think this is a time for creative and imaginative thinking. And  creative and imaginative thinkers are urgently needed, especially,  but not only, from all sections of the population of  the entire  disputed territory, as much as ambulances, gauze and antiseptic is  needed (which is in short supply) for tending to the rising numbers  of the wounded in the valley after today's violence by the Indian  state's forces of occupation. Those of us who are outside can engage  with this process as interlocutors, and must do so at every given  opportunity, but I think, that in the end, the paramountcy of the  wills (and these may be diverse and conflicting) of the people of the  disputed territory must be recognized. I believe, like you, that replacing >> one nation-state by another is hardly the solution. For many  years now, >> friends in Pakistan and I have been discussing the idea of a  South Asian >> Union which loosens the idea of sovereignty, strengthens people,  encourages >> movement across borders, makes irrelevant armies that are  presently engaged >> in fighting each other.  I wonder whether it is possible to take  this >> conversation into that direction, into bringing together rather than >> sundering? I agree with you. I think we must move towards discussing the  possibility of solutions that defy the exclusive sovereignty of the  nation state principle. The tragedy of Jammu and Kashmir is that it  cannot be resolved within the framework of nation states. But that  tragedy can become an opportunity if the people of Jammu and Kashmir  and their well wishers begin to move towards a solution, an actual,  pragmatic solution that transcends the watertight compartments of the  nation state. We forget that the nation-state as a sovereign juridical instrument  of international law, or as a legal person, is itself a relatively  recent construct, as old only as the Treaty of Westphalia in 1648, If  we can recognize thousands of years of history before the legal  ossification of the nation state and nation state based exclusivist  sovereignty, surely we can also begin to envisage a future beyond it. Westphalian sovereignty is the concept of nation-state sovereignty  based on two principles: territoriality and the exclusion of external  actors from domestic authority structures. The intractability of  Jammu and Kashmir defies both the principles of territoriality and  the exclusion of external actors from domestic authority structures.  All positive proposals have to take into account that first of all,  give primacy to the peoples will(s) in the disputed territory. But  the guarantee for the recognition of this primacy may have to come  from nominally 'external' actors. These would naturally be India,  Pakistan, maybe an international body. Who would jointly guarantee  the security and liberty of all the peoples of the territory. This  may be necessary for a transition period, or for as long as the  peoples of the territory desire. Crucially, this must not beceome or  seen to become a replacement of a monocephalic colonialsm to a  colonial hydra. Several situations can be thought of as points of reference, Andorra,  South Tyrol, Northern Ireland, Bosnia-Herzogovina, The Aaland Islands  (between Sweden and FInland). All of these examples are working  instances of exceptions to the Westphalian straighjacket., and have,  in fact become zones of demilitarization. In fact, a demilitarized  Kashmir can be precisely the locus of 'bringing peoples together'  rather than sundering, that you point to with regard to a future  South Asia that would belong to all its peoples and that could  refashion itself as a federation of free territories with soft  borders, no visa restrictions and no standing armies. To achieve this situation, which I believe is possible, and workable,  all of us have to work very hard. But to even begin that work, the  armies, both of India and Pakistan must retreat. The militants must  lay down weapons (like happenned in Northern Ireland) and principles  of reciprocity and mutuality must be recognized as the guiding  instruments of the future. None of this, in my opinion can begin without the withdrawal of the  repressive apparatus of the Indian state, its central paramilitaries,  secret police and army units. Let these be pulled out of Kashmir in  the presence of a strong force of international peacekeepers and  observers. Let talks begin between all parties, and let everyone set  their imaginations and their reasons to work. hope this clarifies my position regards Shuddha _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From rohitism at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 11:48:17 2008 From: rohitism at gmail.com (Rohit Shetti) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 11:48:17 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: URGENT ALERT: news from orissa In-Reply-To: <7ed9a9e30808252213q2a0b1dcek24ed55a684ad94ec@mail.gmail.com> References: <7ed9a9e30808252213q2a0b1dcek24ed55a684ad94ec@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Dhruva Seshadri dhrugeese at gmail.com Please forward to other listservs. It's pretty urgent. Apparently the cops are trying hard to stop the violence, but are powerless due to their numbers. Any idea what can be done to prevent it from becoming a Gujarat-like-situation? So far, two RAF battalions have been sent from the centre, but thats hardly enough, given that this is happening simultaneously in multiple places, even (in some places) multiple mobs in a town. - -------- *Christianity in Orissa is being burnt at the stake* This is an emergency. There is a pogrom-like campaign being carried out today in most districts of Orissa, with the worst situation in the central district of Kondhamal. All over the state, Churches and Christians are being systematically attacked. And the outside world doesn't know. Some of you may know that the district of Kondhamal (or Phulbani) in the middle of Orissa was racked by violence in December 2007, just 8 months ago. The violence erupted on Christmas Eve, when there was an attack on the cavalcade of Swami Lokananda Saraswati, a leader of the Vishwa Hindu Parishad. This happened on top of a mounting agitation by the tribal organization, Kui Samaj, against Dalits and their claim for tribal status. The two together made a potent combination. Almost immediately a cascade of events followed, with trees cut all over the district to close off roads, and mobs on a trail of destruction. Four days later, so much was lost – Churches, Christian NGO's and infrastructure were selectively destroyed. In the fights that broke out at least 300 Hindu houses and 300 Christian houses were destroyed. An Enquiry Commission was set up to probe into the violence. This last week we have seen news reports of people giving evidence to the Commission. Some have been alleging that the whole thing was pre-planned and orchestrated by the VHP. And in the middle of all this, an armed group of maybe 20-30 people broke into the Ashram of Swami Lokananda and shot him and 4 others. Press reports suggested this was the work of Maoists. The VHP says it was the Christians. Even as the body of the Swamiji was being brought to his home in procession for the funeral rites, a state-wide bandh was called. The Press reported that the Bandh was complete almost throughout Orissa, with all traffic stopped, trains held up, shops and offices closed, schools and colleges shut etc, while protest processions were taken out in most towns. But what the media did not report was the huge campaign of violence that has been unleashed in district after district, and town after town. The district of Kondhamal was cut off exactly as was done in December, but this time the reports coming out are of vicious violence, targeting Christians and their homes; priests and nuns; Churches and Christian Organisations. We are hearing desperate cries from friends in the districts ; one girl whose house was destroyed with a bomb last evening ; she and her family are hiding in the forest now. Another of our girls, saying her house has been burned down and she can't locate her family members. Another called to say nuns are being raped and priests kidnapped. There are reports of arson and destruction of Churches from all over Orissa – Boipariguda and Narayanpatna in Koraput District, Umerkote in Nabarangapur District, Muniguda and Bissamcuttack in Rayagada District, Padampur in Bargarh District and so on. The news we are getting is that the Police and the District Administrations are trying their best to control situations, but they are far too few in the face of simultaneous movement of multiple mobs. All sorts of agendas and scores are being settled under the cover of a "spontaneous backlash". It is neither spontaneous or a backlash. The innocent are made scape-goats. I write this as night is falling on the 25th of August 2008. Officially the Bandh is over. Roads are being cleared and traffic is beginning to move. But will the violence end ? And who will count the losses ? Or do we just go back to work as usual. Does India care ? The National Press is busy with J&K, and Singur and Beijing. We are too insignificant to warrant reporting. But Information is our only hope. The news must be publicized. People outside have to know what is happening. And so I write to you. Please look and listen. And pray for us. (Given the risks involved, I prefer not to put my name on to this piece) - -- The three most difficult things for a human being: Returning love for hate; Including the excluded; Admitting that you are wrong. From jeebesh at sarai.net Tue Aug 26 11:52:24 2008 From: jeebesh at sarai.net (Jeebesh) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 11:52:24 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A possible thin thread! Message-ID: dear All, Recently a friend who is in journalism recounted an encounter. He went to find out about the land acquisition conflicts in Himachal on account of a big skiing resort that is being planned there. He was among many claims and counterclaims. What strongly stayed with him as a puzzle was an old man of about 90 years. He gently said that he does not see the urgency to move from where he is now. On being asked why, as the compensation package was good, he explained that the "dhoop" (warmish sunlight) that he is used to for last 20 years in the patch where he sits everyday will disappear from his life and that he is not keen to loose it. Now my friend was a bit bemused by the response. It may not come into his manifest account of the troubled times but had definitely arrived at him as a life long puzzle. I was trying to understand this strange presence in my friend's mind amidst stories of violence and injustice, which he has been encountering in his travels within India. In a landscape overflowing with language of scorn, the gentle remark of the man takes our mind to another way of thinking. Elevare. Raising. In our culture we have an abundance "tollere" (to take away). And Tollere without Elevare is a life gone dry. warmly Jeebesh From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 12:48:53 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 12:48:53 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <87985.21981.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Maybe it comes as a surprise to you, but I find nothing offensive in nudity. My mother is 75 years old and I find her beautiful. If a sensitive artist, appreciative of the beauty of an ageing body with all that is considered to be flawed by a culture that glorifies youth and pornography were to paint her and she were to acquiesce, I would have no problem at all. BTW, a decade ago I had worked on a photography project with the artist Sheba Chhachhi where we had explored these very questions in what I considered to be stunningly beautiful black & white prints. On 8/26/08 9:07 AM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it in > art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how wold you > react? Will you write the same languge which you have written here and take > the same action as suggested by you to others? Will you appreciate the > beautiful work of art in the same manner? After all every freedom has its > sensible limits. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: rohan saha > To: S. Jabbar > Cc: Sarai > Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 12:54:16 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > Dear All, > > I am new to this list and was added recently. > > I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. > > As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective definition > and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express what he > wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a painter puts > forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting prepared by > him should be branded as offensive. > > Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the manner in > which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but I can't > comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism  and vandalism. There are > legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose expression > / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has them, as > does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. > > I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia etc > would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with death, > therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of those > countries. > > Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these paintings were > rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a Husain? > > Regards, > > Rohan > > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > >> What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now?  Is this too >> to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and >> the >> other to be defended? What a terrible bore! >> >> >> On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: >> >>> Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. >> >> Wonder why the Danish >>> cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even >> his was a work of pure >>> art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... >> >> Its quite unfortunate to see some >>> ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) >> defending such mindless imagination. >>> There isn't any justification for it. >> >> Had something of this scale been done >>> in some other country such as >> Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person >>> would't have been alive by >> now. >> >> Aditya Raj Kaul >> >> >> On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar >>> wrote: >>> >>> You are welcome to critique the works of >>> the artist and what you perceive >>> to >>> be the motives that drive her/his >>> art. >>> >>> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy >>> that >>> art? >>> >>> >>> >>> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> The work of art is for the consumption >>> of people but it should not >>> consume the >>>> consumer itself.The artist >>> should know it very well.He should not try to >>> play >>>> with their faith just >>> for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not >>> sensitive to >>>> emotions and >>> faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is >>> not >>>> an end >>> in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. >>>> >>> Prabhakar >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>> From: S. Jabbar >>> >>>> To: Prabhakar Singh ; >>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >>>> ; Sarai >>> >>>> Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] >>> Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >>>> >>>> People have become rather >>> emotional and touchy of late.  Everyone seems >>> to >>>> have become >>> hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps >>> if >>>> there >>> are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. >>>> >>>> Is one's faith so >>> fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing >>> and >>>> can shake it? >>> Evidently so and mores the pity.  Why tear down works of >>> art >>>> when it is >>> faith that is crumbling?  My prescription is twenty years of >>>> solitary >>> meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. >>>> >>>> Do you know the story of Swami >>> Vivekanand who stood in front of the >>> goddess >>>> at Khir Bhavani? Look it >>> up.  It's instructive.  And humbling. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, >>> "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: >>>> >>>>> Artists should be >>> careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities >>> of >>>>> the >>>>> >>> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and >>> touchy >>> >>>>> issues which may have emotional importance for some >>>>> people. >>>> >>> Prabhakar >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>> From: >>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >>>>> >>>> To: sarai list >>> >>>> Sent: Monday, 25 >>>>> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM >>>> >>> Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >>>>> Delhi >>>> >>>> Dear >>> all, >>>> >>>> Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting >>>>> >>>> >>> predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva >>>> (Hindu >>> >>>>> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' >>>> have >>> attacked >>>>> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by >>>> and >>> about the >>>>> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was >>>> held on >>> the premises of >>>>> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial >>>> Trust >>> (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >>>>> against the decision by the >>>> orgnaizers >>> of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >>>>> work by Husain citing >>>> reasons of >>> security. This incident demonstrates, yet >>>>> again, how >>>> inimical the >>> forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to >>>>> the >>>> freedom of >>> expression. >>>> >>>> See - >>>>> >>> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >>>>> >>>> >>> exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian >>>> >>> Express >>>>> that carries details of the incident. >>>> >>>> This list has >>> discussed such attacks on >>>>> freedom of expression before, >>>> and just as >>> we have had forthright criticism >>>>> of Muslim >>>> fundamentalists attacking >>> Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led >>>>> West >>>> Bengal government making it >>> impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so >>>>> >>>> too, we must take into >>> account this latest assault on cultural >>>> liberty.  I >>>>> appeal to all to >>> condemn this attack on the freedom of >>>>> >>>> expression. >>>> >>>> regards >>> >>>> >>>> Shuddha >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _________________________________________ >>>> >>>>> reader-list: an open >>> discussion list on media and the city. >>>> Critiques & >>>>> Collaborations >>>> >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >>>>> with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>>> To unsubscribe: >>>>> >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>>> List archive: >>>>> >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>>> >>>> >>>>       Be the >>> first one to >>>>> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >>>>> >>> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ >>>> >>> _________________________________________ >>>> r >>>>> eader-list: an open >>> discussion list on media and the city. >>>> Critiques & >>>>> Collaborations >>>> >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >>>>> with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>>> To unsubscribe: >>>>> >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>>> List archive: >>>>> >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>>> >>>> >>>>       Get an >>> email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. >>> Click >>>> here >>> http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >>> >>> >>> >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion >>> list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send >>> an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject >>> header. >>> To unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> ___________________________ >>> ______________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the >>> city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >>> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. >> To >>> unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List >>> archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 14:01:27 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:01:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A possible thin thread! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Lovely! On 8/26/08 11:52 AM, "Jeebesh" wrote: > dear All, Recently a friend who is in journalism recounted an encounter. He > went to find out about the land acquisition conflicts in Himachal on account > of a big skiing resort that is being planned there. He was among many > claims and counterclaims. What strongly stayed with him as a puzzle was an > old man of about 90 years. He gently said that he does not see the urgency > to move from where he is now. On being asked why, as the compensation > package was good, he explained that the "dhoop" (warmish sunlight) that he > is used to for last 20 years in the patch where he sits everyday will > disappear from his life and that he is not keen to loose it. Now my friend > was a bit bemused by the response. It may not come into his manifest account > of the troubled times but had definitely arrived at him as a life long > puzzle. I was trying to understand this strange presence in my friend's mind > amidst stories of violence and injustice, which he has been encountering in > his travels within India. In a landscape overflowing with language of scorn, > the gentle remark of the man takes our mind to another way of thinking. > Elevare. Raising. In our culture we have an abundance "tollere" (to take > away). And Tollere without Elevare is a life gone > dry. warmly Jeebesh _________________________________________ reader-list: an > open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 14:12:14 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:12:14 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch Message-ID: <6353c690808260142p2b1e1d38u1adccd70425a39a9@mail.gmail.com> * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch Hindus of Surankote asked to quit or face consequences* 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 King C Bharati Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house belonging to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have been asked to quit or face the consequences. Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked them and started burning their houses even as administration remained crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are openly burning their shops and house which included some government employees in presence of police. The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling Pakistani flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst ever communal violence in this border district. The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to have no time for this remote district even as the local administration has already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help and put the number of migrated families to 15. The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said that around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India and Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious consequences. The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to remove the posters. There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. From rohansaha at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 14:31:55 2008 From: rohansaha at gmail.com (rohan saha) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:31:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: References: <87985.21981.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Chanchal & Prabhakar, Firstly, I am not disputing your right to be angry. Nor am I justifying Husain's expressions. I am merely stating that there is a proper channel and manner through which your feelings may be expressed and they do not include hooliganism and vandalism. I find it hard to believe that you support such violent moral policing *after *the legal system has taken decision regarding the content of the paintings. As long as you are in a democracy, abide by the democratic institutions. Today you have issues regarding a particular painting and hence you sanction violent and illegal protests against it, tomorrow someon else will do the same with respect to some different painting / film / book etc etc where do you draw the line? Or should we import the Pakistani standard of justice, or better yet, the Taliban's standard which mandates obliteration of all expression which is not in accordance with its beliefs? I feel that by supporting such actions you are essentially aggravating this situation of moral policing and a complete disregard of the rule of law. Secondly, as regards nudity, it is a palatable and indeed a much appreciated genre of art and while I understand that you have an aversion to it, I really don't see how you are justified in enforcing these aversions upon others. Finally, these constant references to the foreign (Islamic) jurisdictions are completely redundant to the discussion because we are *not *living in those conuntries and *do not *follow their moral standards or their systems of justice. What could / would have happened to these painters and authors in those countries is no concern of ours because those are not really the benchmarks we aspire to set (at least i hope not). Rohan On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:48 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > Maybe it comes as a surprise to you, but I find nothing offensive in > nudity. > My mother is 75 years old and I find her beautiful. If a sensitive artist, > appreciative of the beauty of an ageing body with all that is considered to > be flawed by a culture that glorifies youth and pornography were to paint > her and she were to acquiesce, I would have no problem at all. > > BTW, a decade ago I had worked on a photography project with the artist > Sheba Chhachhi where we had explored these very questions in what I > considered to be stunningly beautiful black & white prints. > > > On 8/26/08 9:07 AM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > > > If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it > in > > art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how wold > you > > react? Will you write the same languge which you have written here and > take > > the same action as suggested by you to others? Will you appreciate the > > beautiful work of art in the same manner? After all every freedom has its > > sensible limits. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: rohan saha > > To: S. Jabbar > > Cc: Sarai > > Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 12:54:16 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > Dear All, > > > > I am new to this list and was added recently. > > > > I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. > > > > As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective > definition > > and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express what he > > wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a painter puts > > forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting prepared > by > > him should be branded as offensive. > > > > Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the manner > in > > which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but I can't > > comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism and vandalism. There > are > > legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose > expression > > / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has them, > as > > does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. > > > > I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia etc > > would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with death, > > therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of those > > countries. > > > > Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these paintings were > > rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a Husain? > > > > Regards, > > > > Rohan > > > > > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar > wrote: > > > >> What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now? Is this > too > >> to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to denounced and > >> the > >> other to be defended? What a terrible bore! > >> > >> > >> On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" wrote: > >> > >>> Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > >> > >> Wonder why the Danish > >>> cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even > >> his was a work of pure > >>> art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > >> > >> Its quite unfortunate to see some > >>> ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > >> defending such mindless imagination. > >>> There isn't any justification for it. > >> > >> Had something of this scale been done > >>> in some other country such as > >> Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person > >>> would't have been alive by > >> now. > >> > >> Aditya Raj Kaul > >> > >> > >> On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>> You are welcome to critique the works of > >>> the artist and what you perceive > >>> to > >>> be the motives that drive her/his > >>> art. > >>> > >>> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy > >>> that > >>> art? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> The work of art is for the consumption > >>> of people but it should not > >>> consume the > >>>> consumer itself.The artist > >>> should know it very well.He should not try to > >>> play > >>>> with their faith just > >>> for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > >>> sensitive to > >>>> emotions and > >>> faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is > >>> not > >>>> an end > >>> in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > >>>> > >>> Prabhakar > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ----- Original Message ---- > >>>> From: S. Jabbar > >>> > >>>> To: Prabhakar Singh ; > >>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >>>> ; Sarai > >>> > >>>> Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > >>>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] > >>> Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > >>>> > >>>> People have become rather > >>> emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems > >>> to > >>>> have become > >>> hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps > >>> if > >>>> there > >>> are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > >>>> > >>>> Is one's faith so > >>> fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing > >>> and > >>>> can shake it? > >>> Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of > >>> art > >>>> when it is > >>> faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of > >>>> solitary > >>> meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > >>>> > >>>> Do you know the story of Swami > >>> Vivekanand who stood in front of the > >>> goddess > >>>> at Khir Bhavani? Look it > >>> up. It's instructive. And humbling. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, > >>> "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Artists should be > >>> careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities > >>> of > >>>>> the > >>>>> > >>> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > >>> touchy > >>> > >>>>> issues which may have emotional importance for some > >>>>> people. > >>>> > >>> Prabhakar > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ----- Original Message ---- > >>>> From: > >>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >>>>> > >>>> To: sarai list > >>> > >>>> Sent: Monday, 25 > >>>>> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > >>>> > >>> Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > >>>>> Delhi > >>>> > >>>> Dear > >>> all, > >>>> > >>>> Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > >>>>> > >>>> > >>> predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > >>>> (Hindu > >>> > >>>>> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > >>>> have > >>> attacked > >>>>> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > >>>> and > >>> about the > >>>>> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > >>>> held on > >>> the premises of > >>>>> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > >>>> Trust > >>> (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >>>>> against the decision by the > >>>> orgnaizers > >>> of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >>>>> work by Husain citing > >>>> reasons of > >>> security. This incident demonstrates, yet > >>>>> again, how > >>>> inimical the > >>> forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > >>>>> the > >>>> freedom of > >>> expression. > >>>> > >>>> See - > >>>>> > >>> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >>>>> > >>>> > >>> exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > >>>> > >>> Express > >>>>> that carries details of the incident. > >>>> > >>>> This list has > >>> discussed such attacks on > >>>>> freedom of expression before, > >>>> and just as > >>> we have had forthright criticism > >>>>> of Muslim > >>>> fundamentalists attacking > >>> Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > >>>>> West > >>>> Bengal government making it > >>> impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > >>>>> > >>>> too, we must take into > >>> account this latest assault on cultural > >>>> liberty. I > >>>>> appeal to all to > >>> condemn this attack on the freedom of > >>>>> > >>>> expression. > >>>> > >>>> regards > >>> > >>>> > >>>> Shuddha > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> _________________________________________ > >>>> > >>>>> reader-list: an open > >>> discussion list on media and the city. > >>>> Critiques & > >>>>> Collaborations > >>>> > >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >>>>> with > >>> subscribe in the subject header. > >>>> To unsubscribe: > >>>>> > >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >>>> List archive: > >>>>> > >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Be the > >>> first one to > >>>>> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >>>>> > >>> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > >>>> > >>> _________________________________________ > >>>> r > >>>>> eader-list: an open > >>> discussion list on media and the city. > >>>> Critiques & > >>>>> Collaborations > >>>> > >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >>>>> with > >>> subscribe in the subject header. > >>>> To unsubscribe: > >>>>> > >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >>>> List archive: > >>>>> > >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Get an > >>> email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > >>> Click > >>>> here > >>> http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _________________________________________ > >>> reader-list: an open discussion > >>> list on media and the city. > >>> Critiques & Collaborations > >>> To subscribe: send > >>> an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >>> subscribe in the subject > >>> header. > >>> To unsubscribe: > >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >>> List archive: > >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> ___________________________ > >>> ______________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > >>> city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to > >>> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > >> To > >>> unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List > >>> archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > > > > > > -- Rohan Saha Student, B.A., LL.B. (Hons.) NALSAR University of Law, Hyderabad, India. Phone: +91 9989190134 From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 14:59:40 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:59:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: <95BECC9A-F9A0-4BB0-B748-44AFAD50E1FE@sarai.net> Message-ID: Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been made of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small cottage industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had shut his office and was staying home. Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir Reporters > Without Borders http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 25 August > 2008 Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in Kashmir > that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian rule. At least > 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in Srinagar, local TV > stations are being censored and a curfew is making it hard for newspapers to > bring out their issues. "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be > used as a pretext for subjecting the press to more violence and > obstruction," Reporters Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the > guarantees they need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely > despite the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate > the violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks of > the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open for more > abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of local TV stations, > which is a clear violation of the right of Kashmiris to be informed." At > least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve Police > Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices yesterday despite > the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The journalists had passes issued > on 11 August but the police members said they were no long valid. The > injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV station's > bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and his cameraman, > Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's Urdu service and Amin > War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. The curfew prevented the > publication of regional newspapers today, including the daily Greater > Kashmir, which posted this message on its website: "Due to unavoidable > circumstances, the print edition of Greater Kashmir will not be on the > stands on 25 August. We regret the inconvenience to our readers. This was > the first time in the past decade that GK staffers could not reach the > office due to restrictions." An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar > told Reporters Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get > to my office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the > same questions about my work as a journalist." The authorities yesterday > asked local TV stations not to broadcast reports liable to "excite" the > population until further order. TV executives and editors were summoned and > told it would be preferable if they suspended news programmes and just > broadcast entertainment. The government claimed that reports broadcast by > certain stations violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act > 1995. It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and just > carry entertainment. Groups of journalists responded by staging street > demonstrations against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" > said the placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. Indian troops > patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in the region today used > megaphones to call on the population to stay at home. Demonstrations planned > by Kashmiri political parties have been banned. Several demonstrators were > shot dead for violating the curfew. Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai > Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 15:27:58 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 02:57:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <35408.49142.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Sonia, You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in Kashmir. Also, how can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people on the streets? Khurram --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Sarai" Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been made of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small cottage industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had shut his office and was staying home. Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir Reporters > Without Borders http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 25 August > 2008 Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in Kashmir > that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian rule. At least > 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in Srinagar, local TV > stations are being censored and a curfew is making it hard for newspapers to > bring out their issues. "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be > used as a pretext for subjecting the press to more violence and > obstruction," Reporters Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the > guarantees they need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely > despite the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate > the violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks of > the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open for more > abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of local TV stations, > which is a clear violation of the right of Kashmiris to be informed." At > least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve Police > Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices yesterday despite > the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The journalists had passes issued > on 11 August but the police members said they were no long valid. The > injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV station's > bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and his cameraman, > Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's Urdu service and Amin > War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. The curfew prevented the > publication of regional newspapers today, including the daily Greater > Kashmir, which posted this message on its website: "Due to unavoidable > circumstances, the print edition of Greater Kashmir will not be on the > stands on 25 August. We regret the inconvenience to our readers. This was > the first time in the past decade that GK staffers could not reach the > office due to restrictions." An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar > told Reporters Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get > to my office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the > same questions about my work as a journalist." The authorities yesterday > asked local TV stations not to broadcast reports liable to "excite" the > population until further order. TV executives and editors were summoned and > told it would be preferable if they suspended news programmes and just > broadcast entertainment. The government claimed that reports broadcast by > certain stations violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act > 1995. It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and just > carry entertainment. Groups of journalists responded by staging street > demonstrations against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" > said the placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. Indian troops > patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in the region today used > megaphones to call on the population to stay at home. Demonstrations planned > by Kashmiri political parties have been banned. Several demonstrators were > shot dead for violating the curfew. Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai > Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 15:57:56 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 15:57:56 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: <35408.49142.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Am I? I don¹t think so. And I am not equating anything. Please don¹t put words into my mouth. I¹m saying quite clearly that the statement seems incomplete and that all forms of censorship are condemnable. Do you have a problem with that, Khurram? On 8/26/08 3:27 PM, "Khurram Parvez" wrote: > Sonia, > > You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in Kashmir. > Also, how can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people > on the streets? > > Khurram > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >> From: S. Jabbar >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press >> in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders >> To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Sarai" >> >> Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM >> >> Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been made >> of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been >> working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. >> >> An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young >> men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting >> did not >> match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small >> cottage >> industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news >> channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often >> unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. >> >> Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against >> distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the >> paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for >> security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop >> writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had shut >> his office and was staying home. >> >> Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no >> less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. >> >> On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" >> wrote: >> >>> > >> >> Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir >> Reporters >>> > Without Borders >> http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 >> 25 August >>> > 2008 >> >> >> >> Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an >>> > >> immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in >> Kashmir >>> > that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian >> rule. At least >>> > 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in >> Srinagar, local TV >>> > stations are being censored and a curfew is making >> it hard for newspapers to >>> > bring out their issues. >> >> "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be >>> > used as a pretext >> for subjecting the press to more violence and >>> > obstruction," Reporters >> Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the >>> > guarantees they >> need, including permanent passes, to be able to work >> freely >>> > despite >> the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate >>> > the >> violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks >> of >>> > the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open >> for more >>> > abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of >> local TV stations, >>> > which is a clear violation of the right of >> Kashmiris to be informed." >> >> At >>> > least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve >> Police >>> > Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices >> yesterday despite >>> > the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The >> journalists had passes issued >>> > on 11 August but the police members >> said they were no long valid. >> >> The >>> > injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV >> station's >>> > bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and >> >> his cameraman, >>> > Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's >> Urdu service and Amin >>> > War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. >> >> The curfew prevented the >>> > publication of regional newspapers today, >> including the daily Greater >>> > Kashmir, which posted this message on its >> website: "Due to unavoidable >>> > circumstances, the print edition of >> Greater Kashmir will not be on the >>> > stands on 25 August. We regret the >> inconvenience to our readers. This was >>> > the first time in the past >> decade that GK staffers could not reach the >>> > office due to restrictions." >> >> An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar >>> > told Reporters >> Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get >>> > to my >> office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the >>> > >> same questions about my work as a journalist." >> >> The >> authorities yesterday >>> > asked local TV stations not to broadcast >> reports liable to "excite" the >>> > population until further order. TV >> executives and editors were summoned and >>> > told it would be preferable >> if they suspended news programmes and just >>> > broadcast entertainment. >> The government claimed that reports broadcast by >>> > certain stations >> violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act >>> > 1995. >> >> It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday >>> > >> finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and >> just >>> > carry entertainment. >> >> Groups of journalists responded by staging street >>> > demonstrations >> against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" >>> > said the >> placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. >> >> Indian troops >>> > patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in >> the region >> today used >>> > megaphones to call on the population to stay at >> home. Demonstrations planned >>> > by Kashmiri political parties have been >> banned. Several demonstrators were >>> > shot dead for violating the curfew. >> >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> The Sarai >>> > Programme at CSDS >> Raqs Media >>> > Collective >> shuddha at sarai.net >> www.sarai.net >> www.raqsmediacollective.net >> >> >> _____ >>> > ____________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on >>> > media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >>> > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. >> To >>> > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List >>> > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the >> city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe >> in >> the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 16:33:24 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 04:03:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: <35408.49142.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <694.66220.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare?   Whether it is a 'Local' or 'National', Media is expected to act in a responsible manner and not abuse the "Freedoms" it has. This is irrespective of whether such 'inflammatory' coverage/promotion is done in support of "Separatists" or extremists of any religious or any ideological persuasion.   "Banning" should be a last resort. One would expect a self-regulatory mechanism for Media to be in place that would be the first one to intervene to use persuasion, warning, penalties before there was any need at all for the Executive to step in to "ban"   Kshmendra   --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Khurram Parvez wrote: From: Khurram Parvez Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 3:27 PM Sonia, You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in Kashmir. Also, how can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people on the streets? Khurram --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Sarai" Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been made of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small cottage industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had shut his office and was staying home. Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir Reporters > Without Borders http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 25 August > 2008 Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in Kashmir > that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian rule. At least > 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in Srinagar, local TV > stations are being censored and a curfew is making it hard for newspapers to > bring out their issues. "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be > used as a pretext for subjecting the press to more violence and > obstruction," Reporters Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the > guarantees they need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely > despite the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate > the violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks of > the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open for more > abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of local TV stations, > which is a clear violation of the right of Kashmiris to be informed." At > least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve Police > Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices yesterday despite > the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The journalists had passes issued > on 11 August but the police members said they were no long valid. The > injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV station's > bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and his cameraman, > Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's Urdu service and Amin > War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. The curfew prevented the > publication of regional newspapers today, including the daily Greater > Kashmir, which posted this message on its website: "Due to unavoidable > circumstances, the print edition of Greater Kashmir will not be on the > stands on 25 August. We regret the inconvenience to our readers. This was > the first time in the past decade that GK staffers could not reach the > office due to restrictions." An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar > told Reporters Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get > to my office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the > same questions about my work as a journalist." The authorities yesterday > asked local TV stations not to broadcast reports liable to "excite" the > population until further order. TV executives and editors were summoned and > told it would be preferable if they suspended news programmes and just > broadcast entertainment. The government claimed that reports broadcast by > certain stations violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act > 1995. It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and just > carry entertainment. Groups of journalists responded by staging street > demonstrations against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" > said the placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. Indian troops > patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in the region today used > megaphones to call on the population to stay at home. Demonstrations planned > by Kashmiri political parties have been banned. Several demonstrators were > shot dead for violating the curfew. Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai > Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 17:16:42 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 04:46:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders Message-ID: <786993.79010.qm@web31502.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In this case the media has been responsible for adding fuel to fire.For selling a story and promoting their channel they can go to any extent come what may.It has resulted in loss of several innocent lives. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Kshmendra Kaul To: Sarai ; S. Jabbar ; khurramparvez at yahoo.com Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 4:33:24 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare?   Whether it is a 'Local' or 'National', Media is expected to act in a responsible manner and not abuse the "Freedoms" it has. This is irrespective of whether such 'inflammatory' coverage/promotion is done in support of "Separatists" or extremists of any religious or any ideological persuasion.   "Banning" should be a last resort. One would expect a self-regulatory mechanism for Media to be in place that would be the first one to intervene to use persuasion, warning, penalties before there was any need at all for the Executive to step in to "ban"   Kshmendra   --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Khurram Parvez wrote: From: Khurram Parvez Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 3:27 PM Sonia, You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in Kashmir. Also, how can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people on the streets? Khurram --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Sarai" Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete.  No mention has been made of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young men.  When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs.  There is a small cottage industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news channels. They are not accountable to anyone.  The reports are often unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against distributing a Jammu-based newspaper.  The journalist who works for the paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened.  He has had to ask for security for himself and his family.  His newspaper has told him to stop writing until things calm down.  When I last spoke to him, the man had shut his office and was staying home. Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir Reporters > Without Borders http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 25 August > 2008 Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in  Kashmir > that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian  rule. At least > 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in  Srinagar, local TV > stations are being censored and a curfew is making  it hard for newspapers to > bring out their issues. "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be > used as a pretext  for subjecting the press to more violence and > obstruction," Reporters  Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the > guarantees they  need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely > despite  the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate > the  violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks  of > the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open  for more > abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of  local TV stations, > which is a clear violation of the right of  Kashmiris to be informed." At > least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve  Police > Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices  yesterday despite > the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The  journalists had passes issued > on 11 August but the police members  said they were no long valid. The > injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV  station's > bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and  his cameraman, > Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's  Urdu service and Amin > War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. The curfew prevented the > publication of regional newspapers today,  including the daily Greater > Kashmir, which posted this message on its  website: "Due to unavoidable > circumstances, the print edition of  Greater Kashmir will not be on the > stands on 25 August. We regret the  inconvenience to our readers. This was > the first time in the past  decade that GK staffers could not reach the > office due to restrictions." An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar > told Reporters  Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get > to my  office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the > same questions about my work as a journalist." The authorities yesterday > asked local TV stations not to broadcast  reports liable to "excite" the > population until further order. TV  executives and editors were summoned and > told it would be preferable  if they suspended news programmes and just > broadcast entertainment.  The government claimed that reports broadcast by > certain stations  violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act > 1995. It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and  just > carry entertainment. Groups of journalists responded by staging street > demonstrations  against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" > said the  placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. Indian troops > patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in  the region today used > megaphones to call on the population to stay at  home. Demonstrations planned > by Kashmiri political parties have been  banned. Several demonstrators were > shot dead for violating the curfew. Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai > Programme at CSDS Raqs Media > Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _____ > ____________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on > media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To > unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List > archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>       _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>   _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 26 17:42:32 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:42:32 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: <694.66220.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <35408.49142.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <694.66220.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808260512p11ea8597i98c28e8b5b4dc349@mail.gmail.com> > What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel > (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare? If such bans are also implemented on the likes of Dainik Jagran in Jammu, I'd feel slightly better. Though I'd feel very good if there was no censorship was applied at all and the press club was to review and investigate who's being inflammatory and who's printing lies and propoganda. best shivam On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 4:33 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare? > > Whether it is a 'Local' or 'National', Media is expected to act in a responsible manner and not abuse the "Freedoms" it has. This is irrespective of whether such 'inflammatory' coverage/promotion is done in support of "Separatists" or extremists of any religious or any ideological persuasion. > > "Banning" should be a last resort. One would expect a self-regulatory mechanism for Media to be in place that would be the first one to intervene to use persuasion, warning, penalties before there was any need at all for the Executive to step in to "ban" > > Kshmendra > > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Khurram Parvez wrote: > > From: Khurram Parvez > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders > To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 3:27 PM > > > Sonia, > > > > You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in Kashmir. > Also, how > can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people on the > streets? > > Khurram > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press > in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders > To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , > "Sarai" > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM > > Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been made > of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been > working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. > > An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young > men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not > match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small > cottage > industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news > channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often > unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. > > Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against > distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the > paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for > security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop > writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had shut > his office and was staying home. > > Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no > less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. > > On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" > wrote: > >> > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir > Reporters >> Without Borders > http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 > 25 August >> 2008 > > > > Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an >> > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in > Kashmir >> that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian > rule. At least >> 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in > Srinagar, local TV >> stations are being censored and a curfew is making > it hard for newspapers to >> bring out their issues. > > "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be >> used as a pretext > for subjecting the press to more violence and >> obstruction," Reporters > Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the >> guarantees they > need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely >> despite > the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate >> the > violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks > of >> the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open > for more >> abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of > local TV stations, >> which is a clear violation of the right of > Kashmiris to be informed." > > At >> least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve > Police >> Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices > yesterday despite >> the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The > journalists had passes issued >> on 11 August but the police members > said they were no long valid. > > The >> injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV > station's >> bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and > his cameraman, >> Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's > Urdu service and Amin >> War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. > > The curfew prevented the >> publication of regional newspapers today, > including the daily Greater >> Kashmir, which posted this message on its > website: "Due to unavoidable >> circumstances, the print edition of > Greater Kashmir will not be on the >> stands on 25 August. We regret the > inconvenience to our readers. This was >> the first time in the past > decade that GK staffers could not reach the >> office due to restrictions." > > An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar >> told Reporters > Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get >> to my > office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the >> > same questions about my work as a journalist." > > The authorities yesterday >> asked local TV stations not to broadcast > reports liable to "excite" the >> population until further order. TV > executives and editors were summoned and >> told it would be preferable > if they suspended news programmes and just >> broadcast entertainment. > The government claimed that reports broadcast by >> certain stations > violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act >> 1995. > > It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday >> > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and > just >> carry entertainment. > > Groups of journalists responded by staging street >> demonstrations > against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" >> said the > placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. > > Indian troops >> patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in > the region today used >> megaphones to call on the population to stay at > home. Demonstrations planned >> by Kashmiri political parties have been > banned. Several demonstrators were >> shot dead for violating the curfew. > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai >> Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media >> Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _____ >> ____________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on >> media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To >> unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List >> archive: > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 26 17:43:56 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:43:56 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> References: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808260513t5c8fbef6gf464bd24831e41a4@mail.gmail.com> To compare the Danish cartoon's with Husain's art is a faux pas - one was intended to hurt and the other wasn't best shivam On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:15 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > Wonder why the Danish cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even > his was a work of pure art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > Its quite unfortunate to see some ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > defending such mindless imagination. There isn't any justification for it. > > Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been alive by > now. > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >> >> You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you perceive >> to >> be the motives that drive her/his art. >> >> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that >> art? >> >> >> >> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: >> >> > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not >> consume the >> > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try to >> play >> > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not >> sensitive to >> > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is >> not >> > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. >> > Prabhakar >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ----- Original Message ---- >> > From: S. Jabbar >> > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> > ; Sarai >> > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM >> > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> > >> > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems >> to >> > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps >> if >> > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. >> > >> > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing >> and >> > can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of >> art >> > when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of >> > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. >> > >> > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the >> goddess >> > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. >> > >> > >> > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: >> > >> >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities >> of >> >> the >> >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and >> touchy >> >> issues which may have emotional importance for some >> >> people. >> > Prabhakar >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ----- Original Message ---- >> > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta >> >> >> > To: sarai list >> > Sent: Monday, 25 >> >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM >> > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >> >> Delhi >> > >> > Dear all, >> > >> > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting >> >> >> > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva >> > (Hindu >> >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' >> > have attacked >> >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by >> > and about the >> >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was >> > held on the premises of >> >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial >> > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >> >> against the decision by the >> > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >> >> work by Husain citing >> > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet >> >> again, how >> > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to >> >> the >> > freedom of expression. >> > >> > See - >> >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >> >> >> > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian >> > Express >> >> that carries details of the incident. >> > >> > This list has discussed such attacks on >> >> freedom of expression before, >> > and just as we have had forthright criticism >> >> of Muslim >> > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led >> >> West >> > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so >> >> >> > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural >> > liberty. I >> >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of >> >> >> > expression. >> > >> > regards >> > >> > Shuddha >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > _________________________________________ >> > >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & >> >> Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > >> > >> > Be the first one to >> >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >> >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ >> > _________________________________________ >> > r >> >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & >> >> Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > >> > >> > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. >> Click >> > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 17:48:41 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:48:41 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260513t5c8fbef6gf464bd24831e41a4@mail.gmail.com> References: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808260513t5c8fbef6gf464bd24831e41a4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808260518o468b019v83e43b7c6630efda@mail.gmail.com> Shivam, I hope you would agree that despite many protests Hussain continued to paint obscene paintings of Hindu Gods. Once he may have erred,but to continue doing may also be hurting many. I hope you agree. Pawan On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 5:43 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > To compare the Danish cartoon's with Husain's art is a faux pas - one > was intended to hurt and the other wasn't > best > shivam > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:15 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > > > Wonder why the Danish cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. > Even > > his was a work of pure art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > > > Its quite unfortunate to see some ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > > defending such mindless imagination. There isn't any justification for > it. > > > > Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as > > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been alive > by > > now. > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > >> > >> You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you > perceive > >> to > >> be the motives that drive her/his art. > >> > >> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that > >> art? > >> > >> > >> > >> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > >> > >> > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not > >> consume the > >> > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try > to > >> play > >> > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > >> sensitive to > >> > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art > is > >> not > >> > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > >> > Prabhakar > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ----- Original Message ---- > >> > From: S. Jabbar > >> > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > ; Sarai > >> > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > >> > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > >> > > >> > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone > seems > >> to > >> > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it > helps > >> if > >> > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > >> > > >> > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or > writing > >> and > >> > can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works > of > >> art > >> > when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years > of > >> > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > >> > > >> > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the > >> goddess > >> > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. > >> > > >> > > >> > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > >> > > >> >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious > sensitivities > >> of > >> >> the > >> >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > >> touchy > >> >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > >> >> people. > >> > Prabhakar > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ----- Original Message ---- > >> > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> >> > >> > To: sarai list > >> > Sent: Monday, 25 > >> >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > >> >> Delhi > >> > > >> > Dear all, > >> > > >> > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > >> >> > >> > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > >> > (Hindu > >> >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > >> > have attacked > >> >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > >> > and about the > >> >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > >> > held on the premises of > >> >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > >> > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >> >> against the decision by the > >> > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >> >> work by Husain citing > >> > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > >> >> again, how > >> > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > >> >> the > >> > freedom of expression. > >> > > >> > See - > >> >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >> >> > >> > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > >> > Express > >> >> that carries details of the incident. > >> > > >> > This list has discussed such attacks on > >> >> freedom of expression before, > >> > and just as we have had forthright criticism > >> >> of Muslim > >> > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > >> >> West > >> > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > >> >> > >> > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural > >> > liberty. I > >> >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of > >> >> > >> > expression. > >> > > >> > regards > >> > > >> > Shuddha > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > > >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & > >> >> Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: > >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > >> > > >> > Be the first one to > >> >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >> >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > r > >> >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & > >> >> Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: > >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > >> > > >> > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > yourname at rocketmail.com. > >> Click > >> > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 26 17:50:33 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:50:33 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa Message-ID: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: John Dayal Date: Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM Dr. John Dayal Member: National Integration Council Government of India Secretary General: All India Christian Council (Founded 1999) President: United Christian Action, Delhi (Founded 1992) Imm. Past National President: All India Catholic Union (Founded 1919) 505 Link, 18 IP Extension, Delhi 110092 India Email: johndayal at vsnl.com http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal Phone: 91-11-22722262 Mobile 09811021072 25 August 2008 URGENT FAX TO PRESIDENT OF INDIA SEEKING ARMY / CENTRAL FORCES INTERVENTION TO PROTECT CHRISTIANS IN ORISSA AS NUN IS RAPED, PRIESTS INJURED, CHURCHES AND OFFICES BURNT IN PRESENCE OF POLICE Hon'ble Mrs., Pratibha Patil President of India Dear President Greetings from a grieving community. You are aware of the still continuing carnage against the Christian community, mostly Dalits and Tribals, in the Kandhamal district of Orissa and in several other districts including the state capital of Bhubaneswar since 23rd August 2003 following the killing of Vishwa Hindu Parishad leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati, reportedly by Maoist groups who have been operating in the state for some time. The Christian leadership in the country has unequivocally condemned the killing of the VHP leader and his four associates. The Christians of Kandhamal are still nursing their wounds from the Christmas 2007 violence, with hundreds of them still living in a refugee camp in Barakhama. Most of the more than One hundred churches then destroyed remain in ruins, and the burnt houses are still to be fully rebuilt. And yet local Sangh leaders have targeted the community in a second wave of macabre violence. A nun has been raped in Kandhamal, a Catholic father grievously injured, scores of houses in villages destroyed, apart from Churches and institutions. I attach herewith a partial list of the damage in the violence in the past two days. We in Delhi are overwhelmed with panic messages from Priests, pastors, nuns and common people who look to New Delhi for help as the State machinery ahs collapsed once again. Changing of superintendents of police as a knee jerk reaction does not provide security to Christians. In fact, much of the violence is taking place with the insufficient police force looking on. This had been the case in 2007 December, as has come out in the on going hearings of the Justice Basudeo Panigrahi Commission. Christian delegations have informed the State Governor, the State Chief Minister and the Home Minister of India of the dire situation of our community in Orissa. Dear Madame President, This is to request you to use your powers as President of India, and the tremendous force of your good offices, to impress on the Central Government to rush adequate Union forces, including contingents of the Armed Forces if required, to restore law and order and governance in the Kandhamal region. The consequences of any further delay, I fear, may be catastrophic for our Christian community in the State in particular, for peace in Orissa in general, and for the fair name of India as a secular country. God Bless you John Dayal Attachments: 1. Incomplete list of death and damage in violence of 23rd-25th August 2008 2. Christian condemnation of killing of Sw. Lakshmanananda Saraswati ORISSA ANTI CHRISTIAN VIOLENCE UPDATE 25th August 2008 : 1. CHRISTIAN WOMAN TEACHER REPORTED BURNT ALIVE: A Christian woman teacher, possibly a nun [BUT NOT CONFIRMED], was reported burnt alive on 25th August 2008 by a group of Vishwa Hindu Parishad mob which stormed the orphanage she ran in the district of Bargarh (Orissa). Police Superintendent Ashok Biswall has told this to news reporters. A priest who was at the orphanage was also badly hurt and is now being treated in hospital for multiple burns. 2. NUN RAPED: A young Catholic Nun of the Cuttack Bhubaneswar diocese working Jan Vikas Kendra, the Social Service Centre at Nuagaon in Kandhamal was reportedly gang raped on 24th August 2008 by groups of Hindutva extremists before the building itself was destroyed. 3. SENIOR PRIEST AND NUN INJURED: Fr Thomas, director of the Diocesan Pastoral Centre in Kanjimendi, less than a kilometer away from the Social Service Centre, and another Nun were injured when the centre was attacked. They were taken to the police station in a disheveled state as the armed mob bayed for their blood. The Pastoral centre was then set afire. 4. BALLIGUDA CHURCH BUILDINGS DESTROYED AGAIN: On 24th August 2008 evening lynch mobs at the block headquarters of Balliguda, in the very heart of Kandhamal district, which had seen much violence between 24th and 26th December 2007, attacked and destroyed a Presbytery, convent and hostel damaging the properties. 5. The mobs in Balliguda caught hold of two boys of the Catholic hostel and tonsured their heads. 6. PHULBANI CHURCH DAMAGED: On 25th august 2008 morning followers of the late Lakshmanananda Saraswati damaged the Catholic Church in Phulbani, the district headquarter town. 7. MOTHER TERESA BROTHERS ASHRAM ATTACKED: mobs attacked the Mother Teresa Brothers' residence and hospital in Srasanada, destroyed once before and rebuilt two months ago, and beat up the patients. Fundamentalists have targeted Priests, religious and also the Faithful in Pobingia also. 8. BHUBANESWAR BISHOP'S HOUSE ATTACKED: On the morning of 25th August 2008, violent mobs made several attempts to enter the compounds of Catholic Church and Archbishop's house in the heart of the Capital of the State of Orissa. They could not enter because of the police presence. They threw stones at the guesthouse of Archbishop's House, damaging windows. 9. DUBURI PARISH; Another group of fundamentalists entered presbytery in Duburi parish, managed by the SVDs and destroyed and damaged property. Two priests of the parish are missing. 10. Mr. Jamaj Pariccha, Director of Gramya Pragati, is attacked and his property, vehicle etc. damaged, burnt and looted. 11. A Baptist Church in Akamra Jila in Bhubaneswar is also damaged. 12. Christian institutions like St. Arnold's School (Kalinga Bihar), AND NISWASS report some damage. 13. BOUDH DISTRICT [Adjoining Kandhamal]: Fundamentalists enter the Catholic parish church and destroy property. People are fleeing to safer places. But nothing seems safe. 14. Muniguda Catholic Fathers and Nuns' residence have been damaged. 15. Sambalpur HM Sister's residence (Ainthapalli) has suffered damage. 16. Padanpur: One priest is attacked and admitted to a hospital. Hostel boys and the in charge have moved away from the place. 17. Madhupur Catholic Church currently under attack. 18. SMALL CHURCHES: Attempted violence on small churches in various districts, including Padampur, Sambalpur near GM College, Talsera, Dangsoroda, Narayanipatara, Muniguda, Tummiibandh, Tangrapada, Phulbani, Balliguda, Kalingia, Chakapad, Srasanranda. 19. VILLAGE CHRISTIAN HOUSES ATTACKED: Houses attacked on forest hamlets of Balliguda, Kanjamandi Nuaguam (K.Nuaguam), Tiangia (G.Udayagiri), Padangiri, Tikabali. 20. KALAHANDI DISTRICT: houses burnt even though the district is more than 300 kilometers from the place where Swami Lakshmanananda was killed. 21. Pastor Sikandar Singh of the Pentecostal Mission beaten up and his house burnt in Bhawanipatna. 22. Kharihar: 3 Christian shops were looted and burnt. Pastor Alok Das and Pastor I M Senapati beaten up. 23. Aampani: Pastor David Diamond Pahar, Pastor Pravin Ship, Pastor Pradhan and Pastor Barik beaten up and chased away with their families. 24. Naktikani: Mob surrounds village to attack Christians. The government has sent forces, it is reported. [This list is compiled with assistance from Archbishop's House, Bhubaneswar and other sources] - --------------------------------- URGENT >From John Dayal 25 August 2008 INDIAN CHURCH CONDEMNS KILLING OF ORISSA VHP LEADER The Church in India has unequivocally condemned the killing of Vishwa Hindu Parishad [VHP] Orissa leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his four colleagues in the Tumiliband region of Kandhamal district by Left wing extremists. Still recovering from the worst ever anti Christian violence in Indian history in December 2007, Christian organisations have appealed for peace as the community braces for another round of violence in the state from Hindutva groups who have sworn to avenge Saraswati death by attacking Churches, institutions, clergy and nuns. The following is the text of major statements issued by Church groups condemning the VHP leaders' death: ARCHBISHOP RAPHAEL CHEENATH, SVD Archbishop of Cuttack-Bhubaneswar 24 August 2008 I, on behalf of the Christians of Orissa, particularly the catholic Christians, strongly condemn the dastardly attack and violent killing of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five of his associates. We the Christians abhor violence and condemn all acts of violence and terrorism and are against all groups of people taking the law into their own hands. We condole the death of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati, a religious leader and his associates. At this critical juncture I appeal to all for peace and communal harmony. We want good relationship with all the communities with whom we live. We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest that least one prayer hall in Sundergarh District has been burnt and vehicle belonging to Daughters of the most Precious Blood has been burnt near G. Udayagiri. We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates. - --------- ALL INDIA CHRISTIAN COUNCIL: Press Statement by Dr John Dayal, Secretary General, and Dr Sampaul, National Secretary for Public Affairs The All India Christian Council is deeply concerned at the attack on an ashram near Tumiliband in Kandhamal District of Orissa last night in which the Vishwa Hindu Parishad leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and four of his associates were killed. This is the latest of a series of attacks in recent months by political extremists which have left dozens of policemen and others dead in several districts of Orissa. We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest at least one prayer hall in Sundergarh ahs been burnt, the van of some Catholic Nuns destroyed and the sisters themselves injured. We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates. The Christian community abhors violence, condemns all acts of terrorism and is against groups of people taking the law into their own hands. We have had major differences with the dead VHP leader. It has been the hate campaigns of the VHP and Sangh Parivar which led to untold misery to Christians in the violence last Christmas. Refugees from that violence are still living in government camps in Barakhama under miserable conditions. But we wish peace to everyone. We pray for peace in Orissa, one of the most undeveloped states in the country, - ------------------ CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE OF INDIA: The Catholic Bishops' Conference of India (CBCI) is sad to note that Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five others were murdered on Saturday August 23 allegedly by Maoist group in Kandhamal Dist of Orissa. The Church leaders in Orissa and other parts of the country have condemned the killing of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates in the Ashram. We have also appealed for peace and harmony in the state. However, we are extremely sorry to find that some organizations have pointed finger at the Christian community in Orissa for the alleged murder of the Swami and his associates. Consequently there have been unprovoked attacks on Christians and their institutions in Kandhamal and surrounding areas. School at Bhadrak Town, Convent and the computer centre at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist, Pastoral Centre at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Social Development Centre (Jan Vikas Kendra) at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Catholic Church in Phulbani and a Convent of the religious women at Phulbani have suffered in the attacks which took place after the murder of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati. We are sad to note that the extremists are attacking and vandalizing our institutions without any reason. Incidents of arson and burning of vehicles belonging to the Church have also been reported at Udaygiri. Some of our religious nuns, girls and boys in the hostels have fled from their places and taken shelter in the forest, particularly in Kandhamal Dist. We are seriously concerned about the safety and security of our frightened people who are innocent and yet find themselves in a very precarious situation. The State Government has deployed police forces in some of the areas and yet the violence has not been contained. We request the Central Government to urgently intervene in the matter and send additional forces to bring situation to normalcy. - -- Rev. Dr. Babu Joseph, SVD, Spokesperson, CBCI - ------------ EVANGELICAL FELLOWSHIP OF INDIA: Evangelical Fellowship of India (EFI) denounces the killing of Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his four associates by suspected Maoists in Orissa state's Kandhamal district on August 23. While deeply saddened by the weeklong spate of attacks that hit Kandhamal district during last Christmas, EFI, as a representative of the evangelical church in India, stands against every act of violence and terrorism. EFI also regrets that vested interests among the various Hindu nationalist groups are trying to blame local Christians for the act, as reflected in the acts of vandalism and arson reported from Kandhamal after the attack on Saraswati ashram. EFI appeals to the central, state and district authorities to take all possible measures to maintain peace and calm in Kandhamal. EFI also calls for the Christian community in India and abroad to pray for protection of the Christians in Kandhamal and other parts of Orissa. - -- Rev. Dr. Richard Howell, General Secretary Evangelical Fellowship of India - -------------------- Prashant. A Centre for Human Rights, Justice and Peace, Ahmedabad, Gujarat, India We condemn the killing of Swami Saraswati and four of his associates during the attack on the VHP Ashram in the Kandhamal District of Orissa on Saturday 23rd August 2008. We sympathize with the bereaved members of the families who have lost their loved ones. We call upon the Orissa and the Central Governments to do all in their power to bring to book immediately, those responsible for this dastardly act; that anti-social elements do not take law and order into their own hands and above all, to ensure that peace and calm prevail in the area, and in other parts of Orissa. Violence, for whatever the provocation, is non-acceptable, and will definitely not help achieve the goals for which these acts are committed. We therefore call upon all those responsible for these acts and to eschew violence immediately. No violence can be justified, for whatever the reason. However, for the last several months, the Government of Orissa has allowed some fascist and fundamentalist forces to terrorize the poor, the marginalized and the minorities of the State. These forces have carried on their virulent propaganda and their violent acts with apparent immunity. There has been a total abdication of responsibility by the Government of Orissa and the concerned authorities, like the police. They should now also be held totally responsible for these deaths and for allowing the situation to go out of control. Sufficient warning has been given to the Orissa Government, of the deteriorating situation, as early as in September 2006, with the publication of "Communalism in Orissa" - the Report of the Indian People's Tribunal on Environment and Human Rights - headed by Justice K. K. Usha (Retd.) former Chief Justice of the Kerala High Court. It may still not be too late to ensure that the Constitutional Rights and Freedoms of the people of Orissa are not merely guaranteed by also protected by the State. Fr. Cedric Prakash sj, Director - -- Please visit these sites: http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 17:50:39 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:50:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260512p11ea8597i98c28e8b5b4dc349@mail.gmail.com> References: <35408.49142.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <694.66220.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808260512p11ea8597i98c28e8b5b4dc349@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808260520w7f7f36f7o9e684f5b82a20e16@mail.gmail.com> Shivam What about GreaterKashmir , Etalaat , Chattan etc etc........ you could have quoted them in ur example as well ! or do they server your purpose ? Pawan On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 5:42 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel > > (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving > "inflammatory" fare? > > If such bans are also implemented on the likes of Dainik Jagran in > Jammu, I'd feel slightly better. Though I'd feel very good if there > was no censorship was applied at all and the press club was to review > and investigate who's being inflammatory and who's printing lies and > propoganda. > > best > > shivam > > > On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 4:33 PM, Kshmendra Kaul > wrote: > > What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel (print or audio > or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare? > > > > Whether it is a 'Local' or 'National', Media is expected to act in a > responsible manner and not abuse the "Freedoms" it has. This is irrespective > of whether such 'inflammatory' coverage/promotion is done in support of > "Separatists" or extremists of any religious or any ideological persuasion. > > > > "Banning" should be a last resort. One would expect a self-regulatory > mechanism for Media to be in place that would be the first one to intervene > to use persuasion, warning, penalties before there was any need at all for > the Executive to step in to "ban" > > > > Kshmendra > > > > > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Khurram Parvez wrote: > > > > From: Khurram Parvez > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against > Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders > > To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" > > > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 3:27 PM > > > > > > Sonia, > > > > > > > > You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in > Kashmir. > > Also, how > > can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people on > the > > streets? > > > > Khurram > > > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > From: S. Jabbar > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against > Press > > in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders > > To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , > > "Sarai" > > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM > > > > Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been > made > > of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been > > working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. > > > > An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of > young > > men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not > > match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small > > cottage > > industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news > > channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often > > unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. > > > > Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against > > distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the > > paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for > > security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop > > writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had > shut > > his office and was staying home. > > > > Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but > no > > less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. > > > > On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" > > wrote: > > > >> > > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir > > Reporters > >> Without Borders > > http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 > > 25 August > >> 2008 > > > > > > > > Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an > >> > > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in > > Kashmir > >> that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian > > rule. At least > >> 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in > > Srinagar, local TV > >> stations are being censored and a curfew is making > > it hard for newspapers to > >> bring out their issues. > > > > "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be > >> used as a pretext > > for subjecting the press to more violence and > >> obstruction," Reporters > > Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the > >> guarantees they > > need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely > >> despite > > the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate > >> the > > violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks > > of > >> the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open > > for more > >> abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of > > local TV stations, > >> which is a clear violation of the right of > > Kashmiris to be informed." > > > > At > >> least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve > > Police > >> Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices > > yesterday despite > >> the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The > > journalists had passes issued > >> on 11 August but the police members > > said they were no long valid. > > > > The > >> injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV > > station's > >> bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and > > his cameraman, > >> Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's > > Urdu service and Amin > >> War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. > > > > The curfew prevented the > >> publication of regional newspapers today, > > including the daily Greater > >> Kashmir, which posted this message on its > > website: "Due to unavoidable > >> circumstances, the print edition of > > Greater Kashmir will not be on the > >> stands on 25 August. We regret the > > inconvenience to our readers. This was > >> the first time in the past > > decade that GK staffers could not reach the > >> office due to restrictions." > > > > An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar > >> told Reporters > > Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get > >> to my > > office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the > >> > > same questions about my work as a journalist." > > > > The authorities yesterday > >> asked local TV stations not to broadcast > > reports liable to "excite" the > >> population until further order. TV > > executives and editors were summoned and > >> told it would be preferable > > if they suspended news programmes and just > >> broadcast entertainment. > > The government claimed that reports broadcast by > >> certain stations > > violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act > >> 1995. > > > > It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday > >> > > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and > > just > >> carry entertainment. > > > > Groups of journalists responded by staging street > >> demonstrations > > against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" > >> said the > > placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. > > > > Indian troops > >> patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in > > the region today used > >> megaphones to call on the population to stay at > > home. Demonstrations planned > >> by Kashmiri political parties have been > > banned. Several demonstrators were > >> shot dead for violating the curfew. > > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > The Sarai > >> Programme at CSDS > > Raqs Media > >> Collective > > shuddha at sarai.net > > www.sarai.net > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > > > _____ > >> ____________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on > >> media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > > To > >> unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List > >> archive: > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 17:53:01 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:53:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A possible thin thread! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47e122a70808260523g70c45b2du9edc53cc30c01272@mail.gmail.com> sadly, this is an exception. presently people from hills are lured by the speed of plains, in Himachal Pradesh they call ' chapta kardo ' flaten it' so that we are quickly connected to cities. this approach to life has come to us because of various reassons, we know .... Simple living was once a 'thought' ( not necessarily Gandhian ) but some instincitive reasoning to live.... that has perhaps given way to some urbanized glossy way of living, perhaps we have still some time to think... love is On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 2:01 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > Lovely! > > > On 8/26/08 11:52 AM, "Jeebesh" wrote: > >> dear All, > > Recently a friend who is in journalism recounted an encounter. > > He >> went to find out about the land acquisition conflicts in Himachal > on account >> of a big skiing resort that is being planned there. He was > among many >> claims and counterclaims. What strongly stayed with him as > a puzzle was an >> old man of about 90 years. He gently said that he does > not see the urgency >> to move from where he is now. On being asked why, > as the compensation >> package was good, he explained that the > "dhoop" (warmish sunlight) that he >> is used to for last 20 years in the > patch where he sits everyday will >> disappear from his life and that he > is not keen to loose it. > > Now my friend >> was a bit bemused by the response. It may not come into > his manifest account >> of the troubled times but had definitely arrived > at him as a life long >> puzzle. > > I was trying to understand this strange presence in my friend's mind >> > amidst stories of violence and injustice, which he has been > encountering in >> his travels within India. > > In a landscape overflowing with language of scorn, >> the gentle remark > of the man takes our mind to another way of thinking. >> Elevare. > Raising. In our culture we have an abundance "tollere" (to take >> away). > And Tollere without Elevare is a life gone >> dry. > > warmly > Jeebesh > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an >> open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To >> subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in >> the subject header. > To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From pawan.durani at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 17:55:40 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:55:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808260525x32f84fe9je2b7a391780aeff2@mail.gmail.com> Hi Shivam, It is unfortunate of what happened in Orissa , I would be grateful if as a journalist you may share what prompted this violence in the state. Peace to all. Pawan On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: John Dayal > Date: Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM > > > Dr. John Dayal > > Member: National Integration Council > Government of India > > Secretary General: All India Christian Council (Founded 1999) > President: United Christian Action, Delhi (Founded 1992) > Imm. Past National President: All India Catholic Union (Founded 1919) > > 505 Link, 18 IP Extension, Delhi 110092 India > Email: johndayal at vsnl.com > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > Phone: 91-11-22722262 Mobile 09811021072 > > 25 August 2008 > > URGENT FAX > > TO PRESIDENT OF INDIA > > SEEKING ARMY / CENTRAL FORCES INTERVENTION TO PROTECT CHRISTIANS IN > ORISSA AS NUN IS RAPED, PRIESTS INJURED, CHURCHES AND OFFICES BURNT IN > PRESENCE OF POLICE > > Hon'ble Mrs., Pratibha Patil > President of India > > Dear President > > Greetings from a grieving community. > > You are aware of the still continuing carnage against the Christian > community, mostly Dalits and Tribals, in the Kandhamal district of > Orissa and in several other districts including the state capital of > Bhubaneswar since 23rd August 2003 following the killing of Vishwa > Hindu Parishad leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati, reportedly by > Maoist groups who have been operating in the state for some time. > > The Christian leadership in the country has unequivocally condemned > the killing of the VHP leader and his four associates. > > The Christians of Kandhamal are still nursing their wounds from the > Christmas 2007 violence, with hundreds of them still living in a > refugee camp in Barakhama. Most of the more than One hundred churches > then destroyed remain in ruins, and the burnt houses are still to be > fully rebuilt. > > And yet local Sangh leaders have targeted the community in a second > wave of macabre violence. > > A nun has been raped in Kandhamal, a Catholic father grievously > injured, scores of houses in villages destroyed, apart from Churches > and institutions. I attach herewith a partial list of the damage in > the violence in the past two days. We in Delhi are overwhelmed with > panic messages from Priests, pastors, nuns and common people who look > to New Delhi for help as the State machinery ahs collapsed once again. > > Changing of superintendents of police as a knee jerk reaction does not > provide security to Christians. In fact, much of the violence is > taking place with the insufficient police force looking on. This had > been the case in 2007 December, as has come out in the on going > hearings of the Justice Basudeo Panigrahi Commission. Christian > delegations have informed the State Governor, the State Chief Minister > and the Home Minister of India of the dire situation of our community > in Orissa. > > Dear Madame President, > > This is to request you to use your powers as President of India, and > the tremendous force of your good offices, to impress on the Central > Government to rush adequate Union forces, including contingents of the > Armed Forces if required, to restore law and order and governance in > the Kandhamal region. > > The consequences of any further delay, I fear, may be catastrophic for > our Christian community in the State in particular, for peace in > Orissa in general, and for the fair name of India as a secular > country. > > God Bless you > > John Dayal > > Attachments: > 1. Incomplete list of death and damage in violence of 23rd-25th August 2008 > 2. Christian condemnation of killing of Sw. Lakshmanananda Saraswati > > ORISSA ANTI CHRISTIAN VIOLENCE UPDATE 25th August 2008 > > : > 1. CHRISTIAN WOMAN TEACHER REPORTED BURNT ALIVE: A Christian woman > teacher, possibly a nun [BUT NOT CONFIRMED], was reported burnt alive > on 25th August 2008 by a group of Vishwa Hindu Parishad mob which > stormed the orphanage she ran in the district of Bargarh (Orissa). > Police Superintendent Ashok Biswall has told this to news reporters. A > priest who was at the orphanage was also badly hurt and is now being > treated in hospital for multiple burns. > 2. NUN RAPED: A young Catholic Nun of the Cuttack Bhubaneswar diocese > working Jan Vikas Kendra, the Social Service Centre at Nuagaon in > Kandhamal was reportedly gang raped on 24th August 2008 by groups of > Hindutva extremists before the building itself was destroyed. > 3. SENIOR PRIEST AND NUN INJURED: Fr Thomas, director of the Diocesan > Pastoral Centre in Kanjimendi, less than a kilometer away from the > Social Service Centre, and another Nun were injured when the centre > was attacked. They were taken to the police station in a disheveled > state as the armed mob bayed for their blood. The Pastoral centre was > then set afire. > 4. BALLIGUDA CHURCH BUILDINGS DESTROYED AGAIN: On 24th August 2008 > evening lynch mobs at the block headquarters of Balliguda, in the very > heart of Kandhamal district, which had seen much violence between 24th > and 26th December 2007, attacked and destroyed a Presbytery, convent > and hostel damaging the properties. > 5. The mobs in Balliguda caught hold of two boys of the Catholic > hostel and tonsured their heads. > 6. PHULBANI CHURCH DAMAGED: On 25th august 2008 morning followers of > the late Lakshmanananda Saraswati damaged the Catholic Church in > Phulbani, the district headquarter town. > 7. MOTHER TERESA BROTHERS ASHRAM ATTACKED: mobs attacked the Mother > Teresa Brothers' residence and hospital in Srasanada, destroyed once > before and rebuilt two months ago, and beat up the patients. > Fundamentalists have targeted Priests, religious and also the Faithful > in Pobingia also. > 8. BHUBANESWAR BISHOP'S HOUSE ATTACKED: On the morning of 25th August > 2008, violent mobs made several attempts to enter the compounds of > Catholic Church and Archbishop's house in the heart of the Capital of > the State of Orissa. They could not enter because of the police > presence. They threw stones at the guesthouse of Archbishop's House, > damaging windows. > 9. DUBURI PARISH; Another group of fundamentalists entered presbytery > in Duburi parish, managed by the SVDs and destroyed and damaged > property. Two priests of the parish are missing. > 10. Mr. Jamaj Pariccha, Director of Gramya Pragati, is attacked and > his property, vehicle etc. damaged, burnt and looted. > 11. A Baptist Church in Akamra Jila in Bhubaneswar is also damaged. > 12. Christian institutions like St. Arnold's School (Kalinga Bihar), > AND NISWASS report some damage. > 13. BOUDH DISTRICT [Adjoining Kandhamal]: Fundamentalists enter the > Catholic parish church and destroy property. People are fleeing to > safer places. But nothing seems safe. > 14. Muniguda Catholic Fathers and Nuns' residence have been damaged. > 15. Sambalpur HM Sister's residence (Ainthapalli) has suffered damage. > 16. Padanpur: One priest is attacked and admitted to a hospital. > Hostel boys and the in charge have moved away from the place. > 17. Madhupur Catholic Church currently under attack. > 18. SMALL CHURCHES: Attempted violence on small churches in various > districts, including Padampur, Sambalpur near GM College, Talsera, > Dangsoroda, Narayanipatara, Muniguda, Tummiibandh, Tangrapada, > Phulbani, Balliguda, Kalingia, Chakapad, Srasanranda. > 19. VILLAGE CHRISTIAN HOUSES ATTACKED: Houses attacked on forest > hamlets of Balliguda, Kanjamandi Nuaguam (K.Nuaguam), Tiangia > (G.Udayagiri), Padangiri, Tikabali. > 20. KALAHANDI DISTRICT: houses burnt even though the district is more > than 300 kilometers from the place where Swami Lakshmanananda was > killed. > 21. Pastor Sikandar Singh of the Pentecostal Mission beaten up and his > house burnt in Bhawanipatna. > 22. Kharihar: 3 Christian shops were looted and burnt. Pastor Alok Das > and Pastor I M Senapati beaten up. > 23. Aampani: Pastor David Diamond Pahar, Pastor Pravin Ship, Pastor > Pradhan and Pastor Barik beaten up and chased away with their > families. > 24. Naktikani: Mob surrounds village to attack Christians. The > government has sent forces, it is reported. > > [This list is compiled with assistance from Archbishop's House, > Bhubaneswar and other sources] > > - --------------------------------- > URGENT > >From John Dayal > 25 August 2008 > > INDIAN CHURCH CONDEMNS KILLING OF ORISSA VHP LEADER > > The Church in India has unequivocally condemned the killing of Vishwa > Hindu Parishad [VHP] Orissa leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > four colleagues in the Tumiliband region of Kandhamal district by Left > wing extremists. Still recovering from the worst ever anti Christian > violence in Indian history in December 2007, Christian organisations > have appealed for peace as the community braces for another round of > violence in the state from Hindutva groups who have sworn to avenge > Saraswati death by attacking Churches, institutions, clergy and nuns. > > The following is the text of major statements issued by Church groups > condemning the VHP leaders' death: > > ARCHBISHOP RAPHAEL CHEENATH, SVD > Archbishop of Cuttack-Bhubaneswar > > 24 August 2008 > > I, on behalf of the Christians of Orissa, particularly the catholic > Christians, strongly condemn the dastardly attack and violent killing > of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five of his associates. We the > Christians abhor violence and condemn all acts of violence and > terrorism and are against all groups of people taking the law into > their own hands. We condole the death of Swami Lakshmanananda > Saraswati, a religious leader and his associates. At this critical > juncture I appeal to all for peace and communal harmony. We want good > relationship with all the communities with whom we live. > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > that least one prayer hall in Sundergarh District has been burnt and > vehicle belonging to Daughters of the most Precious Blood has been > burnt near G. Udayagiri. > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > associates. > > - --------- > > ALL INDIA CHRISTIAN COUNCIL: > > Press Statement by Dr John Dayal, Secretary General, and Dr Sampaul, > National Secretary for Public Affairs > > The All India Christian Council is deeply concerned at the attack on > an ashram near Tumiliband in Kandhamal District of Orissa last night > in which the Vishwa Hindu Parishad leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and > four of his associates were killed. This is the latest of a series of > attacks in recent months by political extremists which have left > dozens of policemen and others dead in several districts of Orissa. > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > at least one prayer hall in Sundergarh ahs been burnt, the van of some > Catholic Nuns destroyed and the sisters themselves injured. > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > associates. > > The Christian community abhors violence, condemns all acts of > terrorism and is against groups of people taking the law into their > own hands. We have had major differences with the dead VHP leader. It > has been the hate campaigns of the VHP and Sangh Parivar which led to > untold misery to Christians in the violence last Christmas. Refugees > from that violence are still living in government camps in Barakhama > under miserable conditions. But we wish peace to everyone. > We pray for peace in Orissa, one of the most undeveloped states in the > country, > - ------------------ > > CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE OF INDIA: > > The Catholic Bishops' Conference of India (CBCI) is sad to note that > Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five > others were murdered on Saturday August 23 allegedly by Maoist group > in Kandhamal Dist of Orissa. The Church leaders in Orissa and other > parts of the country have condemned the killing of Swami > Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates in the Ashram. We have > also appealed for peace and harmony in the state. > > However, we are extremely sorry to find that some organizations have > pointed finger at the Christian community in Orissa for the alleged > murder of the Swami and his associates. Consequently there have been > unprovoked attacks on Christians and their institutions in Kandhamal > and surrounding areas. School at Bhadrak Town, Convent and the > computer centre at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist, Pastoral Centre at > Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Social Development Centre (Jan Vikas > Kendra) at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Catholic Church in Phulbani > and a Convent of the religious women at Phulbani have suffered in the > attacks which took place after the murder of Swami Lakshmanananda > Saraswati. > > We are sad to note that the extremists are attacking and vandalizing > our institutions without any reason. Incidents of arson and burning of > vehicles belonging to the Church have also been reported at Udaygiri. > Some of our religious nuns, girls and boys in the hostels have fled > from their places and taken shelter in the forest, particularly in > Kandhamal Dist. We are seriously concerned about the safety and > security of our frightened people who are innocent and yet find > themselves in a very precarious situation. The State Government has > deployed police forces in some of the areas and yet the violence has > not been contained. We request the Central Government to urgently > intervene in the matter and send additional forces to bring situation > to normalcy. > - -- Rev. Dr. Babu Joseph, SVD, Spokesperson, CBCI > - ------------ > EVANGELICAL FELLOWSHIP OF INDIA: > > Evangelical Fellowship of India (EFI) denounces the killing of Vishwa > Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > four associates by suspected Maoists in Orissa state's Kandhamal > district on August 23. While deeply saddened by the weeklong spate of > attacks that hit Kandhamal district during last Christmas, EFI, as a > representative of the evangelical church in India, stands against > every act of violence and terrorism. > > EFI also regrets that vested interests among the various Hindu > nationalist groups are trying to blame local Christians for the act, > as reflected in the acts of vandalism and arson reported from > Kandhamal after the attack on Saraswati ashram. > > EFI appeals to the central, state and district authorities to take all > possible measures to maintain peace and calm in Kandhamal. EFI also > calls for the Christian community in India and abroad to pray for > protection of the Christians in Kandhamal and other parts of Orissa. > - -- Rev. Dr. Richard Howell, General Secretary > Evangelical Fellowship of India > - -------------------- > Prashant. A Centre for Human Rights, Justice and Peace, Ahmedabad, > Gujarat, India > > We condemn the killing of Swami Saraswati and four of his associates > during the attack on the VHP Ashram in the Kandhamal District of > Orissa on Saturday 23rd August 2008. We sympathize with the bereaved > members of the families who have lost their loved ones. > > We call upon the Orissa and the Central Governments to do all in their > power to bring to book immediately, those responsible for this > dastardly act; that anti-social elements do not take law and order > into their own hands and above all, to ensure that peace and calm > prevail in the area, and in other parts of Orissa. > > Violence, for whatever the provocation, is non-acceptable, and will > definitely not help achieve the goals for which these acts are > committed. We therefore call upon all those responsible for these acts > and to eschew violence immediately. No violence can be justified, for > whatever the reason. However, for the last several months, the > Government of Orissa has allowed some fascist and fundamentalist > forces to terrorize the poor, the marginalized and the minorities of > the State. These forces have carried on their virulent propaganda and > their violent acts with apparent immunity. > > There has been a total abdication of responsibility by the Government > of Orissa and the concerned authorities, like the police. They should > now also be held totally responsible for these deaths and for allowing > the situation to go out of control. Sufficient warning has been given > to the Orissa Government, of the deteriorating situation, as early as > in September 2006, with the publication of "Communalism in Orissa" - > the Report of the Indian People's Tribunal on Environment and Human > Rights - headed by Justice K. K. Usha (Retd.) former Chief Justice of > the Kerala High Court. It may still not be too late to ensure that > the Constitutional Rights and Freedoms of the people of Orissa are not > merely guaranteed by also protected by the State. > > Fr. Cedric Prakash sj, Director > > - -- > > Please visit these sites: > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 18:06:19 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 05:36:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' - The Geelani interview Message-ID: <443578.87137.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> If, any deserving to be taken seriously voice were to say that 'India should be declared as a Hindu country', there would be many a million voices (including mine) that would stridently condemn such a statement, that would be gravitated to campaign for and garner widespread public opinion against such a statement.   We would find some of the most brilliantly argued, impressively articulate, eloquent and even 'wordy' dismissals of such a statement in SARAI itself.   On SARAI we have quite a few brilliantly argumentatitive, impressively articulate, eloquent and often wordy opinions expressed in favour of the 'separatists' of Kashmir. Surprisingly, they are rather muted in their comments about Geelani's position. Demure almost in their referring to him in-passing and generally conveying the impression that the Geelani (and his support base) position is not of any real significance and of not much consequence in the "separatist movement". That tells me (at least), how much these people are in touch with the 'realities' of Kashmir or the "separatist movement".   These people who are so sworn to talk and act against India and in favour of the "separatist movement" do not seem to be bothered about the implications of the "Geelani position" for both the "separatist movement" and for Kashmir whether Kashmir continues to be spliced up between India and Pakistan, or it gains Independence or becomes a part of Pakistan.   'These people' do not, at least publicly, show the courage to analyse and commentate upon the "Geelani position" and it's implications.    Increasingly I get the impression that 'these people' whether on SARAI or elsewhere have the attitude "We really do not care what happens to Kashmir afterwards, but we want India to set Kashmir free".    Mirwaiz Omar Farooq is no different from Geelani even if he has been brilliantly devious in selling his 'secular' platform to 'these people'. One would ask how 'secular' is it when political speeches are made from the pulpit? How 'secular' is it when you go to the OIC to garner support for your 'movement'. Geelani at least is honest.   Some interesting statements by Geelani (MY COMMENTS ARE BRACKETED):   -  I know the schools (OPENED BY THE ARMY) are meant for Kashmiris. But they are also meant to make them sing Vande Mataram and not offer namaz. The aim of these schools is to turn Kashmiri children into pure Indians. This is cultural aggression on our Islamic values and is not acceptable to us.   -  While I am for Kashmir going to Pakistan, there are voices that seek independence from both India and Pakistan. I also agree that there are people in Kashmir who would like to go with India. They argue that India has done so much for Kashmir. Others are fascinated by its secularism and democracy. (BAD BAD SECULARISM. BAD BAD DEMOCRACY)   - I have a three-point target. First is to impose an Islamic nizam (jurisprudence) in Kashmir. (THERE IS NO SUCH JURISPRUDENCE COMMONLY ACCEPTED BY ALL MUSLIMS) Islam should govern our lives, be it in our political thought (WHO WOULD BE THE AMEER? WHO WOULD THE KHALIFA BE? FROM WHERE?), socio-economic plans (THAT I WOULD ANY DAY HOPE IS IMPLEMENTED IN INDIA), culture (GIVEN GEELANI'S SECT, THAT WOULD BE GOODBYE MUSIC, GOODBYE SONGS, GOODBYE TELEVISION/CINEMA, GOODBYE THE MUCH ADVERTISED KASHMIR SUFISM) or the ongoing movement.   -  The creed of socialism and secularism (BOTH ARE CURSES IT SEEMS) should not touch our lives and we must be totally governed by the Koran and the Sunnat (precedents from Prophet Mohammad's life). (THERE IS NO SUNNAH THAT IS COMMONLY ACCEPTED BY ALL MUSLIMS. WOULD LEAD TO INTERESTING TIMES)   - Secondly, I have been propagating that we must fight against anti-Islamic forces. These forces come in our way under the garb of nationalists, secularists, racists, linguistic chauvinists, and so on.   Kshmendra     'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir'   August 25, 2008 The allotment of land for the Amarnath shrine board was a trigger for the azadi sentiment in Kashmir, Hurriyat Conference Chairman Syed Ali Shah Geelani, who has emerged a crowd-puller among the separatist leaders, tells Aasha Khosa.   Q:   We all know the history of Kashmiri separatism but what was the immediate provocation for the ongoing massive protests?   A:   The upsurge has not happened suddenly. The sentiment for azadi was always there. However, the transfer of 50 acres of forest land to the Amarnath shrine board made Kashmiris realise once again how insecure they feel. This acted as a trigger. Suddenly, people have started thinking about the 100,000 acres of land that is with the army.   Under the guise of "Operation Sadhbhavana," the army has usurped huge parcels of land and seems to be expanding its network. I have information that the army has seized 23 acres of land for opening a school in Pahalgam.   Q:   The schools being opened by the army are for Kashmiri children. Why object to this?   A:   I know the schools are meant for Kashmiris. But they are also meant to make them sing Vande Mataram and not offer namaz. The aim of these schools is to turn Kashmiri children into pure Indians. This is cultural aggression on our Islamic values and is not acceptable to us. In fact, apart from fighting for the right to self-determination for 62 years, we have also been fighting against the cultural aggression by India.   Q:   So the transfer of land is not the real issue as many have been saying.   A:   Yes, they are right. Land is not an issue for us. It has just acted as a catalyst to shape peoples' sentiments into an upsurge.   Q:   There are differences even among the separatists -- some raise the slogan of azadi while people like you want Kashmir to go with Pakistan. How do you resolve this dilemma among yourself, beyond your occasional shows of unity?   A:   Our unity is based on a single point -- implementation of the United Nations resolutions on Kashmir (which ask India and Pakistan to hold a plebiscite in undivided Jammu & Kashmir to find out if the people of the state want to be with India or Pakistan). However, I do agree that there are differences among us.   While I am for Kashmir going to Pakistan, there are voices that seek independence from both India and Pakistan. I also agree that there are people in Kashmir who would like to go with India. They argue that India has done so much for Kashmir. Others are fascinated by its secularism and democracy. But then we must not forget that there were discordant notes even when Indians fought the British.   Q: Your party, the Tehreek-e-Hurriyat, has expanded its network. What precisely do you stand for?   A:   Ever since my release from prison on August 7, 2004, I have been spreading my message across Kashmir. I have a three-point target. First is to impose an Islamic nizam (jurisprudence) in Kashmir. Islam should govern our lives, be it in our political thought, socio-economic plans, culture or the ongoing movement.   The creed of socialism and secularism should not touch our lives and we must be totally governed by the Koran and the Sunnat (precedents from Prophet Mohammad's life). Secondly, I have been propagating that we must fight against anti-Islamic forces. These forces come in our way under the garb of nationalists, secularists, racists, linguistic chauvinists, and so on.   Thirdly, I have been telling the youth to work for the right to self-determination which is granted to them by the United Nations. I have been drawing huge support from the youth for this as a result of which you see lakhs of people on the roads today.   Q:   In essence, Osama bin Laden's crusade to establish Islamic rule across the globe seems no different from yours.   A:   Osama has come only during the last few years. People like me have been fighting for this all our lives. I do not want to be compared with Osama.   Q:   Your differences with the All Parties Hurriyat Conference came to the fore recently when you tried to project yourself as the sole leader of the (separatist) movement. What made you issue a public apology later?   A:   During the last four years, I have been holding public rallies all over Kashmir. I have a routine -- first I explain my three-point programme to the audience, then I ask them if they agree to the idea of the movement having a single leader, and finally, people raise slogans favouring me as their sole leader.   This is what happened at the public rally with the Hurriyat leaders. Some of the Hurriyat leaders did not like my being endorsed as a leader by the crowd and walked out. It was my moral duty to apologise to them and I did.   Q:   Are you talking about Kashmir alone or the entire state, which includes Hindus and Buddhists, both of whom would not like to live in an Islamic dispensation of your dreams?   A:   I want the right to self-determination for the entire territory of Jammu & Kashmir, including the areas under Pakistan. Let people decide once and for all which country they want to be with. The question of imposing an Islamic rule is different. Why do people object to it? If America and India can have democratic rule, others can have Communism, why object to the Islamic rule?   Q:   How bothered are you about the agitation in Jammu, where leaders are angry precisely about this point: Kashmiri leaders' hidden agenda behind the Amarnath land controversy?   A:   Jammu's people are working on communal lines. But it is a fact that the transfer of land is not the core issue for us. Q:   But India and Pakistan are working on solutions other than giving Kashmir the right to self-determination. What are your objections?   A:   Pakistan has extended all support to us so far. The India-Pakistan dialogue is nothing new. In fact, the two have held 130 rounds of peace talks since 1952. What have they achieved so far? India is just biding its time in Kashmir by prolonging the dialogue with Pakistan. It won't achieve anything.   Q:   If the recent protests led by you and the Hurriyat leaders are true indicators of your popular support, why not contest elections and prove it?   A:   Elections were never on our agenda and our stand has not changed on this. We believe in boycotting of the elections.   http://specials.rediff.com/news/2008/aug/25sd1.htm   From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 18:18:40 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 18:18:40 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808260518o468b019v83e43b7c6630efda@mail.gmail.com> References: <478054.50050.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808250845k3b6f112bgd5f09019fcf92456@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808260513t5c8fbef6gf464bd24831e41a4@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808260518o468b019v83e43b7c6630efda@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808260548x19b3d365mc99885a189c2c49a@mail.gmail.com> Dear Pawan ji, chanchal ji and prabhakar singh ji How to demolish ' the mother ' in stone. I beleive, HIndusim will be quite boring if we bomb thousands of of erotic temples in India, let alone Khajuraho temples. there is a lot of erotic poetry in Sanskrit. Phallus is a symbol of fertility in many asian cultures, and part of that high symbolisim is breathing in Lingum and Yoni. Socities in the past were not as backward aS we tend to be, since the tools of fertility in the human body have been found more interesting, and that is why we have godess with healthy breasts, and lustrous eyes. only a shallow mentality will try to keep wrapped with a moral fabric of this kind. Ironically, even asectic in Hinduism dont have any objection to the erotic imagey in temples, and those who relish the best of material world and live a vorocious emprical form of life are objecting to it. Hussain is not a great aritst, i beleive so, but he has every right to paint what he wants to ... like Khushwant Singh who has evey right to publish dirtry jokes. Society is full of products that we love to consume. It is only a propoganda that tells us Hussain is contaminated, so dont taste it. It is high time we turn our minds towards what is truly contaminated in our society, including 700000 crore fake medicine industry love inder salim # Dear Sarang, But the quetion, i beleive is still open to intrepretations. First of all, i beleive, Karl Marx was, perhaps the first person who overwhelmingly expressed a need to talk about the ills of society with an urgency never seen before. It just happened that one of the culprits was 'the sacred' of the religion at that time. Religion is still the opium of th masses,and therefore, we often tend to give vent to that in day to day usuage of language through jokes and other such queerish behaviours. Expression through art is also part of that day to day living. Not because of great Art, but one can always some humour in Danish cartoons and Hussain Drawings, for example, but people miss the point, because we tend to see what we are told to see, only. yes, almost four to five thousand books have been written on Dr. Iqbal and Islam, but only one or two on his poetry. Yes, saying anything against the self appointed religous elites can bring death sentence to you. This practice is as old as times. Lot of Scientists had to suffer in the past for the very reasons, Mansoor Hallaj was killed for uttering Ana-al-Haq ( i am the God ). So there has been a constant struggle between the what is perceived good for society and what is actually happeneing in the society. It is different matter that there are millions of followers of Mansoor, who are believers of Quran even, but those who killed him were not even true believers of Prophet even. That applies to beleivers of Lord Rama even, I beleive, the question of representation was more interesting in an era of Rennisance when photo-realism in art was seen next to Real, but with modern ways of depicting things was seen as a radical shift from that. Most it is about form, and if you see some meaning in it, it is at your own peril. The society is perhaps trained to see meaning in everything, perhaps, because Art has not happned to most of us. Now how to blame artists for that ? and if we believe, that society can do without such aritsts then i think we follows a Stalin who banished all the artists from Russia who were not good to the nation at that time. inder salim From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 26 18:27:15 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 18:27:15 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About Hindutva Terrorism Message-ID: <9c06aab30808260557n236270c8k8905ebf04cbbbd3b@mail.gmail.com> Dear friends, I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html And more stories in that issue: http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html o o o BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow Mail Today, 26 August 2008 mailtoday.in IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel room. The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to batteries with wires. The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city between 1998 and 2000. Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were inactive these days," he said. The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were planning to do." Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We are investigating their links." Another officer said the police had information about more explosives that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to recover them soon. Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the bombmakers were well trained in their job. The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private hostel in Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his links with his son two years ago and was living in his ancestral village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied one of the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities since 2001," an officer said. SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me and I do not chalk out their programmes." piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in o o o 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai Mail Today, 26 August 2008 mailtoday.in SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the 'martyrdom' of two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted outside a mosque in Maharashtra. Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market their own brand of Hindu terror'. In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took place. The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said Gazi. Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity connection." Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state and Centre let the accused go scot free. "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is happening in Nanded?" he asked. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 18:37:28 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 06:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260512p11ea8597i98c28e8b5b4dc349@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <320797.9910.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Shivam   My statement was a generalisation and also had a conditionality in "if it is really serving 'inflammatory' fare". Why should you mention one particular newspaper when I mentioned no names at all?   In any case your comment is interesting because it suggests that whatever was "banned" was rightfully "banned" but you would feel better if likes of Dainik Jagran  were 'banned' too. I presume by that you mean that 'the likes of Dainik Jagran' are also serving 'inflammatory fare' as were the channels already 'banned'. Fair enough.   You preffered choice is 'no censorship' and "the press club was to review and investigate". I am not very far in that choice when I said:    """"" "Banning" should be a last resort. One would expect a self-regulatory mechanism for Media to be in place that would be the first one to intervene to use persuasion, warning, penalties before there was any need atall for the Executive to step in to "ban"""""""   Kshmendra --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Cc: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" , khurramparvez at yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 5:42 PM > What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel > (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare? If such bans are also implemented on the likes of Dainik Jagran in Jammu, I'd feel slightly better. Though I'd feel very good if there was no censorship was applied at all and the press club was to review and investigate who's being inflammatory and who's printing lies and propoganda. best shivam On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 4:33 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > What in any case is wrong with "banning" a Media channel (print or audio or video or internet) if it is really serving "inflammatory" fare? > > Whether it is a 'Local' or 'National', Media is expected to act in a responsible manner and not abuse the "Freedoms" it has. This is irrespective of whether such 'inflammatory' coverage/promotion is done in support of "Separatists" or extremists of any religious or any ideological persuasion. > > "Banning" should be a last resort. One would expect a self-regulatory mechanism for Media to be in place that would be the first one to intervene to use persuasion, warning, penalties before there was any need at all for the Executive to step in to "ban" > > Kshmendra > > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Khurram Parvez wrote: > > From: Khurram Parvez > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders > To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 3:27 PM > > > Sonia, > > > > You seem to be legitimizing the ban on the local news channels in Kashmir. > Also, how > can one equate the role of the Indian state and the agitated people on the > streets? > > Khurram > > --- On Tue, 8/26/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press > in Kashmir: Reporters Without Borders > To: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , > "Sarai" > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 2:29 AM > > Terrible, but this statement is again incomplete. No mention has been made > of the concerted attacks on journalists because they happen to have been > working for 'Indian' channels about 10 days ago. > > An NDTV reporter had his personal vehicle damaged by an irate mob of young > men. When he tried to reason with them they said his reporting did not > match the 'news reports' of private cable-wallahs. There is a small > cottage > industry in the Valley where private cable operators run their own news > channels. They are not accountable to anyone. The reports are often > unedited, highly inflammatory accounts of the day's happenings. > > Three days ago a Srinagar newspaper distributor was threatened against > distributing a Jammu-based newspaper. The journalist who works for the > paper, a Kashmiri Muslim was also threatened. He has had to ask for > security for himself and his family. His newspaper has told him to stop > writing until things calm down. When I last spoke to him, the man had shut > his office and was staying home. > > Censorship comes in all forms. Please be aware of the less dramatic but no > less virulent ones that also need to be soundly condemned. > > On 8/25/08 11:46 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" > wrote: > >> > Statement on Censorship and Violence against Press in Kashmir > Reporters >> Without Borders > http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=28297 > 25 August >> 2008 > > > > Reporters Without Borders calls on the Indian authorities to put an >> > immediate stop to the censorship and violence against the media in > Kashmir >> that has been prompted by a wave of protests against Indian > rule. At least >> 13 journalists were beaten by police yesterday in > Srinagar, local TV >> stations are being censored and a curfew is making > it hard for newspapers to >> bring out their issues. > > "This latest crisis in Indian Kashmir must not be >> used as a pretext > for subjecting the press to more violence and >> obstruction," Reporters > Without Borders said. "Journalists must have all the >> guarantees they > need, including permanent passes, to be able to work freely >> despite > the curfew. We also call on the police authorities to investigate >> the > violence by certain elements that have led to injuries in the ranks > of >> the press. If no sanctions are adopted, the door will be left open > for more >> abuses. Finally, we call for an end to the censorship of > local TV stations, >> which is a clear violation of the right of > Kashmiris to be informed." > > At >> least 13 journalists were beaten by members of the Central Reserve > Police >> Force in Srinagar as they tried to get to their offices > yesterday despite >> the curfew introduced earlier in the day. The > journalists had passes issued >> on 11 August but the police members > said they were no long valid. > > The >> injured journalists included Bilal Bhat, the Sahara Samay TV > station's >> bureau chief in Srinagar, who had several ribs broken, and > his cameraman, >> Muzaffar. Ajaz Ahmad of News X, Jehangir Aziz of ETV's > Urdu service and Amin >> War of The Tribune newspaper were also injured. > > The curfew prevented the >> publication of regional newspapers today, > including the daily Greater >> Kashmir, which posted this message on its > website: "Due to unavoidable >> circumstances, the print edition of > Greater Kashmir will not be on the >> stands on 25 August. We regret the > inconvenience to our readers. This was >> the first time in the past > decade that GK staffers could not reach the >> office due to restrictions." > > An Indian newspaper's correspondent in Srinagar >> told Reporters > Without Borders: "I had to go through 20 checkpoints to get >> to my > office and each time I was subjected to the same humiliation and the >> > same questions about my work as a journalist." > > The authorities yesterday >> asked local TV stations not to broadcast > reports liable to "excite" the >> population until further order. TV > executives and editors were summoned and >> told it would be preferable > if they suspended news programmes and just >> broadcast entertainment. > The government claimed that reports broadcast by >> certain stations > violated the Cable Television Network (Regulation) Act >> 1995. > > It was on the basis of this law that a Srinagar judge yesterday >> > finally ordered the TV stations to suppress their news programmes and > just >> carry entertainment. > > Groups of journalists responded by staging street >> demonstrations > against the violence and censorship. "Let the press work" >> said the > placard brandished by one Srinagar reporter. > > Indian troops >> patrolling the streets of Srinagar and other cities in > the region today used >> megaphones to call on the population to stay at > home. Demonstrations planned >> by Kashmiri political parties have been > banned. Several demonstrators were >> shot dead for violating the curfew. > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai >> Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media >> Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _____ >> ____________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on >> media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To >> unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List >> archive: > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 18:48:54 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 06:18:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About Hindutva Terrorism In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260557n236270c8k8905ebf04cbbbd3b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <748040.56714.qm@web57204.mail.re3.yahoo.com> It is not enough to just 'recognize' any terrorism but any terrorism including "Hindutva Terrorism" must be dealt with firmly and prosecuted against speedily with exemplary punishment given when guilt or complicity is established.   (I exclude the 'death penalty' from 'exemplary punishment' since I am 'against' the 'death penalty')   Kshmendra --- On Tue, 8/26/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् wrote: From: Shivam Vij शिवम् Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About Hindutva Terrorism To: "sarai list" Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008, 6:27 PM Dear friends, I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html And more stories in that issue: http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html o o o BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow Mail Today, 26 August 2008 mailtoday.in IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel room. The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to batteries with wires. The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city between 1998 and 2000. Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were inactive these days," he said. The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were planning to do." Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We are investigating their links." Another officer said the police had information about more explosives that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to recover them soon. Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the bombmakers were well trained in their job. The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private hostel in Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his links with his son two years ago and was living in his ancestral village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied one of the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities since 2001," an officer said. SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me and I do not chalk out their programmes." piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in o o o 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai Mail Today, 26 August 2008 mailtoday.in SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the 'martyrdom' of two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted outside a mosque in Maharashtra. Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market their own brand of Hindu terror'. In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took place. The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said Gazi. Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity connection." Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state and Centre let the accused go scot free. "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is happening in Nanded?" he asked. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From indersalim at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 18:50:56 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 18:50:56 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' - The Geelani interview In-Reply-To: <443578.87137.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <443578.87137.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <47e122a70808260620v757439a5jb78756fe7c5d8bbb@mail.gmail.com> i quote Kshmendra Geelani at least is honest. but i personally dont think this 'honesty' is so functional in present day kashmir. so i dont count it as a virute. I guess, in kashmir people are representing themselves, as Arundhati Roy also talked about. One reason for the absence of gun in the Pampore demonstration was because gun culture has lost its potency during all these years. People might have lyched a gun- weilding man amidst these non-violent demonstrations. that is my guess. yes, on the list, the 'brillant' and 'the eloquent' speakers, as i know, on the list, are not supporting a Geeelani agenda in Kashmir. I beleive, there are better and brilliant people on the List than a La Arun Shourie. Yes, honesty is a virtue only when it reflcts a factual understanding of 'times' we live in. Kshmendra loves Indian secularism, but what about the Gujarat. People on the list are eager to hear from Kshmendr on that subject, without the Godra theory as an alibi. love is On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 6:06 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > If, any deserving to be taken seriously voice were to say that 'India should be declared as a Hindu country', there would be many a million voices (including mine) that would stridently condemn such a statement, that would be gravitated to campaign for and garner widespread public opinion against such a statement. > > We would find some of the most brilliantly argued, impressively articulate, eloquent and even 'wordy' dismissals of such a statement in SARAI itself. > > On SARAI we have quite a few brilliantly argumentatitive, impressively articulate, eloquent and often wordy opinions expressed in favour of the 'separatists' of Kashmir. Surprisingly, they are rather muted in their comments about Geelani's position. Demure almost in their referring to him in-passing and generally conveying the impression that the Geelani (and his support base) position is not of any real significance and of not much consequence in the "separatist movement". That tells me (at least), how much these people are in touch with the 'realities' of Kashmir or the "separatist movement". > > These people who are so sworn to talk and act against India and in favour of the "separatist movement" do not seem to be bothered about the implications of the "Geelani position" for both the "separatist movement" and for Kashmir whether Kashmir continues to be spliced up between India and Pakistan, or it gains Independence or becomes a part of Pakistan. > > 'These people' do not, at least publicly, show the courage to analyse and commentate upon the "Geelani position" and it's implications. > > Increasingly I get the impression that 'these people' whether on SARAI or elsewhere have the attitude "We really do not care what happens to Kashmir afterwards, but we want India to set Kashmir free". > > Mirwaiz Omar Farooq is no different from Geelani even if he has been brilliantly devious in selling his 'secular' platform to 'these people'. One would ask how 'secular' is it when political speeches are made from the pulpit? How 'secular' is it when you go to the OIC to garner support for your 'movement'. Geelani at least is honest. > > Some interesting statements by Geelani (MY COMMENTS ARE BRACKETED): > > - I know the schools (OPENED BY THE ARMY) are meant for Kashmiris. But they are also meant to make them sing Vande Mataram and not offer namaz. The aim of these schools is to turn Kashmiri children into pure Indians. This is cultural aggression on our Islamic values and is not acceptable to us. > > - While I am for Kashmir going to Pakistan, there are voices that seek independence from both India and Pakistan. I also agree that there are people in Kashmir who would like to go with India. They argue that India has done so much for Kashmir. Others are fascinated by its secularism and democracy. (BAD BAD SECULARISM. BAD BAD DEMOCRACY) > > - I have a three-point target. First is to impose an Islamic nizam (jurisprudence) in Kashmir. (THERE IS NO SUCH JURISPRUDENCE COMMONLY ACCEPTED BY ALL MUSLIMS) Islam should govern our lives, be it in our political thought (WHO WOULD BE THE AMEER? WHO WOULD THE KHALIFA BE? FROM WHERE?), socio-economic plans (THAT I WOULD ANY DAY HOPE IS IMPLEMENTED IN INDIA), culture (GIVEN GEELANI'S SECT, THAT WOULD BE GOODBYE MUSIC, GOODBYE SONGS, GOODBYE TELEVISION/CINEMA, GOODBYE THE MUCH ADVERTISED KASHMIR SUFISM) or the ongoing movement. > > - The creed of socialism and secularism (BOTH ARE CURSES IT SEEMS) should not touch our lives and we must be totally governed by the Koran and the Sunnat (precedents from Prophet Mohammad's life). (THERE IS NO SUNNAH THAT IS COMMONLY ACCEPTED BY ALL MUSLIMS. WOULD LEAD TO INTERESTING TIMES) > > - Secondly, I have been propagating that we must fight against anti-Islamic forces. These forces come in our way under the garb of nationalists, secularists, racists, linguistic chauvinists, and so on. > > Kshmendra > > > 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' > > August 25, 2008 > > > > > The allotment of land for the Amarnath shrine board was a trigger for the azadi sentiment in Kashmir, Hurriyat Conference Chairman Syed Ali Shah Geelani, who has emerged a crowd-puller among the separatist leaders, tells Aasha Khosa. > > Q: We all know the history of Kashmiri separatism but what was the immediate provocation for the ongoing massive protests? > > A: The upsurge has not happened suddenly. The sentiment for azadi was always there. However, the transfer of 50 acres of forest land to the Amarnath shrine board made Kashmiris realise once again how insecure they feel. This acted as a trigger. Suddenly, people have started thinking about the 100,000 acres of land that is with the army. > > Under the guise of "Operation Sadhbhavana," the army has usurped huge parcels of land and seems to be expanding its network. I have information that the army has seized 23 acres of land for opening a school in Pahalgam. > > Q: The schools being opened by the army are for Kashmiri children. Why object to this? > > A: I know the schools are meant for Kashmiris. But they are also meant to make them sing Vande Mataram and not offer namaz. The aim of these schools is to turn Kashmiri children into pure Indians. This is cultural aggression on our Islamic values and is not acceptable to us. In fact, apart from fighting for the right to self-determination for 62 years, we have also been fighting against the cultural aggression by India. > > Q: So the transfer of land is not the real issue as many have been saying. > > A: Yes, they are right. Land is not an issue for us. It has just acted as a catalyst to shape peoples' sentiments into an upsurge. > > Q: There are differences even among the separatists -- some raise the slogan of azadi while people like you want Kashmir to go with Pakistan. How do you resolve this dilemma among yourself, beyond your occasional shows of unity? > > A: Our unity is based on a single point -- implementation of the United Nations resolutions on Kashmir (which ask India and Pakistan to hold a plebiscite in undivided Jammu & Kashmir to find out if the people of the state want to be with India or Pakistan). However, I do agree that there are differences among us. > > While I am for Kashmir going to Pakistan, there are voices that seek independence from both India and Pakistan. I also agree that there are people in Kashmir who would like to go with India. They argue that India has done so much for Kashmir. Others are fascinated by its secularism and democracy. But then we must not forget that there were discordant notes even when Indians fought the British. > > Q: Your party, the Tehreek-e-Hurriyat, has expanded its network. What precisely do you stand for? > > A: Ever since my release from prison on August 7, 2004, I have been spreading my message across Kashmir. I have a three-point target. First is to impose an Islamic nizam (jurisprudence) in Kashmir. Islam should govern our lives, be it in our political thought, socio-economic plans, culture or the ongoing movement. > > The creed of socialism and secularism should not touch our lives and we must be totally governed by the Koran and the Sunnat (precedents from Prophet Mohammad's life). > Secondly, I have been propagating that we must fight against anti-Islamic forces. These forces come in our way under the garb of nationalists, secularists, racists, linguistic chauvinists, and so on. > > Thirdly, I have been telling the youth to work for the right to self-determination which is granted to them by the United Nations. I have been drawing huge support from the youth for this as a result of which you see lakhs of people on the roads today. > > Q: In essence, Osama bin Laden's crusade to establish Islamic rule across the globe seems no different from yours. > > A: Osama has come only during the last few years. People like me have been fighting for this all our lives. I do not want to be compared with Osama. > > Q: Your differences with the All Parties Hurriyat Conference came to the fore recently when you tried to project yourself as the sole leader of the (separatist) movement. What made you issue a public apology later? > > A: During the last four years, I have been holding public rallies all over Kashmir. I have a routine -- first I explain my three-point programme to the audience, then I ask them if they agree to the idea of the movement having a single leader, and finally, people raise slogans favouring me as their sole leader. > > This is what happened at the public rally with the Hurriyat leaders. Some of the Hurriyat leaders did not like my being endorsed as a leader by the crowd and walked out. It was my moral duty to apologise to them and I did. > > Q: Are you talking about Kashmir alone or the entire state, which includes Hindus and Buddhists, both of whom would not like to live in an Islamic dispensation of your dreams? > > A: I want the right to self-determination for the entire territory of Jammu & Kashmir, including the areas under Pakistan. Let people decide once and for all which country they want to be with. The question of imposing an Islamic rule is different. Why do people object to it? If America and India can have democratic rule, others can have Communism, why object to the Islamic rule? > > Q: How bothered are you about the agitation in Jammu, where leaders are angry precisely about this point: Kashmiri leaders' hidden agenda behind the Amarnath land controversy? > > A: Jammu's people are working on communal lines. But it is a fact that the transfer of land is not the core issue for us. > > > > > > > > > > Q: But India and Pakistan are working on solutions other than giving Kashmir the right to self-determination. What are your objections? > > A: Pakistan has extended all support to us so far. The India-Pakistan dialogue is nothing new. In fact, the two have held 130 rounds of peace talks since 1952. What have they achieved so far? India is just biding its time in Kashmir by prolonging the dialogue with Pakistan. It won't achieve anything. > > Q: If the recent protests led by you and the Hurriyat leaders are true indicators of your popular support, why not contest elections and prove it? > > A: Elections were never on our agenda and our stand has not changed on this. We believe in boycotting of the elections. > > http://specials.rediff.com/news/2008/aug/25sd1.htm > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Tue Aug 26 20:28:04 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 20:28:04 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians Message-ID: <463495.91832.qm@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> Some people say that Indians are peace-loving people and never offend/invade any body. (Some say Indians never invaded others for last 10,000 years!). But in Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win medals in the most offendeing games: Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing Does it mean that we are good only in shooting, wresting and boxing others down. Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 22:06:19 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:36:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <504050.85889.qm@web90406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear Salimji, Let me explain you the meaning of sex in Hinduism. Hinduism believes that Sex is the biggest power that can move any person from his ideologies. Hence, there are many true as well as mythical stories in Hinduism that emphasizes that sex must be won over. You cannot win over a power without talking about it. Sex is a media through which this whole creation is going on. Sex is nothing but the power of nature to brood. And Hinduism is one and only on faith (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly sex). And Brahmacharya (practicing purity for at least 25 years of life when a child is growing) was one of the tool to achieve it. This no where means that the erotic power of sex was not understood. And what you see in caves are but a execution of that power over some artists who failed to win over it. This in no where means that Sex is erotic sense in Hinduism. Kamadeva (power of nature, like all other Deva) is what is represented in those caves. We have temples of all the Devas (powers of nature). So that nature can be respected through the highest form of respect that is worship. And Kamdeva is one among them. M.F.Hussain is some different story than the concept of sex in Hinduism. So, please do not justify it. Even though you justify.. WHAT IS THE SENSE IN PAINTING MOTHERLAND INDIA NUDE? WHY NOT HIS MOTHER FIRST IS THE QUESTION? ----- Original Message ---- From: inder salim To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:18:40 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear Pawan ji, chanchal ji and prabhakar singh ji How to demolish ' the mother ' in stone. I beleive, HIndusim will be quite boring if we bomb thousands of of erotic temples in India, let alone Khajuraho temples. there is a lot of erotic poetry in Sanskrit. Phallus is a symbol of fertility in many asian cultures, and part of that high symbolisim is breathing in Lingum and Yoni. Socities in the past were not as backward aS we tend to be, since the tools of fertility in the human body have been found more interesting, and that is why we have godess with healthy breasts, and lustrous eyes. only a shallow mentality will try to keep wrapped with a moral fabric of this kind. Ironically, even asectic in Hinduism dont have any objection to the erotic imagey in temples, and those who relish the best of material world and live a vorocious emprical form of life are objecting to it. Hussain is not a great aritst, i beleive so, but he has every right to paint what he wants to ... like Khushwant Singh who has evey right to publish dirtry jokes. Society is full of products that we love to consume. It is only a propoganda that tells us Hussain is contaminated, so dont taste it. It is high time we turn our minds towards what is truly contaminated in our society, including 700000 crore fake medicine industry love inder salim # Dear Sarang, But the quetion, i beleive is still open to intrepretations. First of all, i beleive, Karl Marx was, perhaps the first person who overwhelmingly expressed a need to talk about the ills of society with an urgency never seen before. It just happened that one of the culprits was 'the sacred' of the religion at that time. Religion is still the opium of th masses,and therefore, we often tend to give vent to that in day to day usuage of language through jokes and other such queerish behaviours. Expression through art is also part of that day to day living. Not because of great Art, but one can always some humour in Danish cartoons and Hussain Drawings, for example, but people miss the point, because we tend to see what we are told to see, only. yes, almost four to five thousand books have been written on Dr. Iqbal and Islam, but only one or two on his poetry. Yes, saying anything against the self appointed religous elites can bring death sentence to you. This practice is as old as times. Lot of Scientists had to suffer in the past for the very reasons, Mansoor Hallaj was killed for uttering Ana-al-Haq ( i am the God ). So there has been a constant struggle between the what is perceived good for society and what is actually happeneing in the society. It is different matter that there are millions of followers of Mansoor, who are believers of Quran even, but those who killed him were not even true believers of Prophet even. That applies to beleivers of Lord Rama even, I beleive, the question of representation was more interesting in an era of Rennisance when photo-realism in art was seen next to Real, but with modern ways of depicting things was seen as a radical shift from that. Most it is about form, and if you see some meaning in it, it is at your own peril. The society is perhaps trained to see meaning in everything, perhaps, because Art has not happned to most of us. Now how to blame artists for that ? and if we believe, that society can do without such aritsts then i think we follows a Stalin who banished all the artists from Russia who were not good to the nation at that time. inder salim _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 22:09:02 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:39:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <76582.15287.qm@web31502.mail.mud.yahoo.com> It is outrageous.Only Hindus can tolerate such insult of their religion and culture.Can anybody even think of a reverse situation a Hindu doing such thing to Islam? Will anybody on earth tolerate it? Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Pawan Durani To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 5:48:41 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Shivam, I hope you would agree that despite many protests Hussain continued to paint obscene paintings of Hindu Gods. Once he may have erred,but to continue doing may also be hurting many. I hope you agree. Pawan On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 5:43 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > To compare the Danish cartoon's with Husain's art is a faux pas - one > was intended to hurt and the other wasn't > best > shivam > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:15 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > > > Wonder why the Danish cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. > Even > > his was a work of pure art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > > > Its quite unfortunate to see some ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > > defending such mindless imagination. There isn't any justification for > it. > > > > Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as > > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been alive > by > > now. > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > >> > >> You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you > perceive > >> to > >> be the motives that drive her/his art. > >> > >> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that > >> art? > >> > >> > >> > >> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > >> > >> > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not > >> consume the > >> > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try > to > >> play > >> > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > >> sensitive to > >> > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art > is > >> not > >> > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > >> > Prabhakar > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ----- Original Message ---- > >> > From: S. Jabbar > >> > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > ; Sarai > >> > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > >> > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > >> > > >> > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late.  Everyone > seems > >> to > >> > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it > helps > >> if > >> > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > >> > > >> > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or > writing > >> and > >> > can shake it?  Evidently so and mores the pity.  Why tear down works > of > >> art > >> > when it is faith that is crumbling?  My prescription is twenty years > of > >> > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > >> > > >> > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the > >> goddess > >> > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up.  It's instructive.  And humbling. > >> > > >> > > >> > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > >> > > >> >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious > sensitivities > >> of > >> >> the > >> >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > >> touchy > >> >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > >> >> people. > >> > Prabhakar > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ----- Original Message ---- > >> > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> >> > >> > To: sarai list > >> > Sent: Monday, 25 > >> >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > >> >> Delhi > >> > > >> > Dear all, > >> > > >> > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > >> >> > >> > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > >> > (Hindu > >> >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > >> > have attacked > >> >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > >> > and about the > >> >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > >> > held on the premises of > >> >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > >> > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >> >> against the decision by the > >> > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >> >> work by Husain citing > >> > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > >> >> again, how > >> > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > >> >> the > >> > freedom of expression. > >> > > >> > See - > >> >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >> >> > >> > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > >> > Express > >> >> that carries details of the incident. > >> > > >> > This list has discussed such attacks on > >> >> freedom of expression before, > >> > and just as we have had forthright criticism > >> >> of Muslim > >> > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > >> >> West > >> > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > >> >> > >> > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural > >> > liberty.  I > >> >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of > >> >> > >> > expression. > >> > > >> > regards > >> > > >> > Shuddha > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > > >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & > >> >> Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: > >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > >> > > >> >      Be the first one to > >> >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >> >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > r > >> >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & > >> >> Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: > >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > >> > > >> >      Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > yourname at rocketmail.com. > >> Click > >> > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 22:10:14 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:40:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <190083.6272.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Lingam in Sanskrit means Symbol and not sex. Jyotir Lingam means Symbol of Light. And it is Jyotir Lingam that is worshiped by Hindus as Lord Shiva. Since, all Devas are power of nature. We know science says, Light is the biggest of all other power. Hence, we have Mahadeva (Biggest among all Deva) named to the Deva representing the Power of Light. If you read Purana, you will find that Lord Shiva is said to erect an endless tower of light. He is the deity of Light. English word is 'natural power' and Sanskrit word is 'Deva'. English do not respect it and utilize it for destruction. Hindus worship it (highest form of respect) and utilize it for benefit of society. This is the true concept of Deva or deity. This is the true concept of Lingam. Please do not quote this further. ----- Original Message ---- From: inder salim To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:18:40 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear Pawan ji, chanchal ji and prabhakar singh ji How to demolish ' the mother ' in stone. I beleive, HIndusim will be quite boring if we bomb thousands of of erotic temples in India, let alone Khajuraho temples. there is a lot of erotic poetry in Sanskrit. Phallus is a symbol of fertility in many asian cultures, and part of that high symbolisim is breathing in Lingum and Yoni. Socities in the past were not as backward aS we tend to be, since the tools of fertility in the human body have been found more interesting, and that is why we have godess with healthy breasts, and lustrous eyes. only a shallow mentality will try to keep wrapped with a moral fabric of this kind. Ironically, even asectic in Hinduism dont have any objection to the erotic imagey in temples, and those who relish the best of material world and live a vorocious emprical form of life are objecting to it. Hussain is not a great aritst, i beleive so, but he has every right to paint what he wants to ... like Khushwant Singh who has evey right to publish dirtry jokes. Society is full of products that we love to consume. It is only a propoganda that tells us Hussain is contaminated, so dont taste it. It is high time we turn our minds towards what is truly contaminated in our society, including 700000 crore fake medicine industry love inder salim # Dear Sarang, But the quetion, i beleive is still open to intrepretations. First of all, i beleive, Karl Marx was, perhaps the first person who overwhelmingly expressed a need to talk about the ills of society with an urgency never seen before. It just happened that one of the culprits was 'the sacred' of the religion at that time. Religion is still the opium of th masses,and therefore, we often tend to give vent to that in day to day usuage of language through jokes and other such queerish behaviours. Expression through art is also part of that day to day living. Not because of great Art, but one can always some humour in Danish cartoons and Hussain Drawings, for example, but people miss the point, because we tend to see what we are told to see, only. yes, almost four to five thousand books have been written on Dr. Iqbal and Islam, but only one or two on his poetry. Yes, saying anything against the self appointed religous elites can bring death sentence to you. This practice is as old as times. Lot of Scientists had to suffer in the past for the very reasons, Mansoor Hallaj was killed for uttering Ana-al-Haq ( i am the God ). So there has been a constant struggle between the what is perceived good for society and what is actually happeneing in the society. It is different matter that there are millions of followers of Mansoor, who are believers of Quran even, but those who killed him were not even true believers of Prophet even. That applies to beleivers of Lord Rama even, I beleive, the question of representation was more interesting in an era of Rennisance when photo-realism in art was seen next to Real, but with modern ways of depicting things was seen as a radical shift from that. Most it is about form, and if you see some meaning in it, it is at your own peril. The society is perhaps trained to see meaning in everything, perhaps, because Art has not happned to most of us. Now how to blame artists for that ? and if we believe, that society can do without such aritsts then i think we follows a Stalin who banished all the artists from Russia who were not good to the nation at that time. inder salim _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 22:13:46 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:43:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <93383.99038.qm@web90405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If M.F.Hussain has painted Hindu Deities nude, it simply means that he has abused Muslims as well.... He do not have respect for Nature also.. This is true to Islam.. Because Islam is one religion that do not teach respect, other than to Allah.. But a million dollar question: Why is Ghost a superstition? Because it cannot be seen. Who has seen God then? Why isn't God a bigger superstition? And if there is only one GOD, why is Islam fearful that Hindus are worshiping other Gods. If there are other GODs like Satan, why don't Allah settle down the other GODs first. Why is he so powerless that he asks his blind followers to kill the followers of other GODs. Stupid concepts in Islam... must be challenged by their own people, if they are not dumb.. ----- Original Message ---- From: Prabhakar Singh To: Pawan Durani ; Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 10:09:02 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi It is outrageous.Only Hindus can tolerate such insult of their religion and culture.Can anybody even think of a reverse situation a Hindu doing such thing to Islam? Will anybody on earth tolerate it? Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Pawan Durani To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 5:48:41 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Shivam, I hope you would agree that despite many protests Hussain continued to paint obscene paintings of Hindu Gods. Once he may have erred,but to continue doing may also be hurting many. I hope you agree. Pawan On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 5:43 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > To compare the Danish cartoon's with Husain's art is a faux pas - one > was intended to hurt and the other wasn't > best > shivam > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:15 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. > > > > Wonder why the Danish cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. > Even > > his was a work of pure art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... > > > > Its quite unfortunate to see some ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) > > defending such mindless imagination. There isn't any justification for > it. > > > > Had something of this scale been done in some other country such as > > Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person would't have been alive > by > > now. > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > >> > >> You are welcome to critique the works of the artist and what you > perceive > >> to > >> be the motives that drive her/his art. > >> > >> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy that > >> art? > >> > >> > >> > >> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: > >> > >> > The work of art is for the consumption of people but it should not > >> consume the > >> > consumer itself.The artist should know it very well.He should not try > to > >> play > >> > with their faith just for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not > >> sensitive to > >> > emotions and faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art > is > >> not > >> > an end in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. > >> > Prabhakar > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ----- Original Message ---- > >> > From: S. Jabbar > >> > To: Prabhakar Singh ; Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> > ; Sarai > >> > Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM > >> > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > >> > > >> > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. Everyone > seems > >> to > >> > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it > helps > >> if > >> > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > >> > > >> > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or > writing > >> and > >> > can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works > of > >> art > >> > when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years > of > >> > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > >> > > >> > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in front of the > >> goddess > >> > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And humbling. > >> > > >> > > >> > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > >> > > >> >> Artists should be careful about the cultural or religious > sensitivities > >> of > >> >> the > >> >> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and > >> touchy > >> >> issues which may have emotional importance for some > >> >> people. > >> > Prabhakar > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ----- Original Message ---- > >> > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >> >> > >> > To: sarai list > >> > Sent: Monday, 25 > >> >> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > >> >> Delhi > >> > > >> > Dear all, > >> > > >> > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > >> >> > >> > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva > >> > (Hindu > >> >> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' > >> > have attacked > >> >> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by > >> > and about the > >> >> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > >> > held on the premises of > >> >> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > >> > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >> >> against the decision by the > >> > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >> >> work by Husain citing > >> > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > >> >> again, how > >> > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to > >> >> the > >> > freedom of expression. > >> > > >> > See - > >> >> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >> >> > >> > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian > >> > Express > >> >> that carries details of the incident. > >> > > >> > This list has discussed such attacks on > >> >> freedom of expression before, > >> > and just as we have had forthright criticism > >> >> of Muslim > >> > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led > >> >> West > >> > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so > >> >> > >> > too, we must take into account this latest assault on cultural > >> > liberty. I > >> >> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom of > >> >> > >> > expression. > >> > > >> > regards > >> > > >> > Shuddha > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > > >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & > >> >> Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: > >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > >> > > >> > Be the first one to > >> >> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >> >> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > r > >> >> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & > >> >> Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net > >> >> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > >> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> > List archive: > >> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > > >> > > >> > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > yourname at rocketmail.com. > >> Click > >> > here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 22:15:36 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:45:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <227760.27053.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Anybody painting mother India should be punished severely.For perverted Hussain mother India and Madhuri Dixit are same. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: chanchal malviya To: inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 10:06:19 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear Salimji, Let me explain you the meaning of sex in Hinduism. Hinduism believes that Sex is the biggest power that can move any person from his ideologies. Hence, there are many true as well as mythical stories in Hinduism that emphasizes that sex must be won over. You cannot win over a power without talking about it. Sex is a media through which this whole creation is going on. Sex is nothing but the power of nature to brood. And Hinduism is one and only on faith (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly sex). And Brahmacharya (practicing purity for at least 25 years of life when a child is growing) was one of the tool to achieve it. This no where means that the erotic power of sex was not understood. And what you see in caves are but a execution of that power over some artists who failed to win over it. This in no where means that Sex is erotic sense in Hinduism.  Kamadeva (power of nature, like all other Deva) is what is represented in those caves. We have temples of all the Devas (powers of nature). So that nature can be respected through the highest form of respect that is worship. And Kamdeva is one among them. M.F.Hussain is some different story than the concept of sex in Hinduism. So, please do not justify it. Even though you justify.. WHAT IS THE SENSE IN PAINTING MOTHERLAND INDIA NUDE? WHY NOT HIS MOTHER FIRST IS THE QUESTION? ----- Original Message ---- From: inder salim To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:18:40 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear Pawan ji, chanchal ji and prabhakar singh ji How to demolish ' the mother ' in stone. I beleive, HIndusim will be quite boring if we bomb thousands of  of erotic temples in India, let alone Khajuraho temples. there is a lot of erotic poetry in Sanskrit. Phallus is a symbol of fertility in many asian cultures, and  part of that high symbolisim is breathing in Lingum and Yoni. Socities in the past were not as backward aS we tend to be, since the tools of fertility in the human body have been found more interesting, and that is why we have godess with healthy breasts, and lustrous eyes. only a shallow mentality will try to keep wrapped with a moral fabric of this kind. Ironically, even asectic in Hinduism dont have any objection to the erotic imagey in temples, and those who relish the best of material world and live a vorocious emprical form of life are objecting to it. Hussain is not a great aritst, i beleive so,  but he has every right to paint what he wants to ...  like Khushwant Singh who has evey right to publish dirtry jokes. Society is full of products that we  love to consume.  It is only a propoganda that tells us  Hussain is contaminated, so dont taste it. It is high time we turn our minds towards what is truly contaminated in our society, including  700000 crore fake medicine industry love inder salim # Dear Sarang, But the quetion, i beleive is still open to intrepretations. First of all, i beleive, Karl Marx was, perhaps the first person who overwhelmingly expressed a need to talk about the ills of society with an urgency never seen before. It just happened that one of the culprits was 'the sacred' of the religion at that time. Religion is still the opium of th masses,and  therefore, we often tend to give vent to that in day to day usuage of  language through jokes and other such queerish behaviours. Expression through art is also part of that day to day living. Not because of great Art, but one can always some humour in Danish cartoons and Hussain Drawings, for example,  but people miss the point, because we tend to see what we are told to see, only. yes, almost four to five thousand books have been written on Dr. Iqbal and Islam, but only one or two on his poetry. Yes, saying anything against the self appointed religous elites can bring death sentence to you. This practice is as old as times. Lot of Scientists had to suffer in the past for the very reasons, Mansoor Hallaj was killed for uttering Ana-al-Haq ( i am the God ). So there has been a constant struggle between the what is perceived good for society and what is actually happeneing in the society. It is different matter that there are millions of followers of Mansoor, who are believers of Quran even, but those who killed him were not even true believers of Prophet even. That applies to beleivers of Lord Rama even, I beleive, the question of representation was more interesting in an era of Rennisance when photo-realism in art was seen next to Real, but with modern ways of depicting things was seen as a radical shift from that. Most it is about form, and if you see some meaning in it, it is at your own peril. The society is perhaps trained to see meaning in everything, perhaps, because Art has not happned to most of us. Now how to blame artists for that ? and if we  believe, that society can do without such aritsts then i think we follows a Stalin who banished all the artists from Russia who were not good to the nation at that time. inder salim _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>       _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From mail at shivamvij.com Tue Aug 26 22:28:03 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:28:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <227760.27053.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <227760.27053.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808260958m511b88bfy7ee6787edb6db761@mail.gmail.com> Equal Opportunity Fundamentalism by Salil Tripathi (Tehelka Feb 17 , 2007) http://communalism.blogspot.com/2007/02/equal-opportunity-fundamentalism.html The right's only objection to MF Husain's depictions of Hindu deities is that they are made by a Muslim, says Salil Tripathi Who's Profane? A Husain interpretation of Lakshmi As you enter London's netherworld — its labyrinthine underground subway system — you will notice large images of a Hindu deity, looking sinuous and sensual, cavorting cheerfully and wearing almost no clothes at all. There are other posters nearby, of sexy women advertising perfumes or holidays, wearing almost as little as the god in the poster, but the god wins hands down in attracting your attention. More unusually, nobody from London's neo-hypersensitive Hindu community has expressed any criticism or outrage over the nearly-naked image of the Hindu god staring at almost 2.5 million commuters daily. This is surprising. I remember last year, when Asia House — a gallery near Oxford Street in central London — hosted an exhibition of paintings, which included some canvases of nude Hindu deities, a self-styled Hindu human rights organisation (and the so-called Hindu Forum in Britain, claiming to speak for the 700,000 Hindus who live in the country), protested immediately, and forced the gallery to cancel the exhibition. Why are the Hindu groups quiet this time? And why were they so noisy last time? The answer is simple, revealing, and banal: for them, the show last year had to be opposed because the artist, Maqbool Fida Husain, was a Muslim. But the show this year was to be revered, for what the Sackler Wing of the Royal Academy of Arts in Piccadilly is showing are the famed Chola bronzes: seductive and erotic certainly, but presumably untouched by the hands of a Muslim artist. The Royal Academy has brought together nearly 40 sculptures, from India, Germany and the United States. These sculptures are consistently evocative, exuding virility and sensuality. You see a divine male caressing a female deity; elsewhere, a willowy maiden strikes poses meant to guide the viewer towards her attract-ive body. To be sure, the Chola bronzes are not only about sex or erotica. The quintessential Chola image, — of the dancing Nataraja performing the celestial tandava nritya — personifies not only the defeat of evil, but also the destruction of the world as we know it, so that a new world can begin. True, Husain has painted several goddesses in the nude, but his works reshape our thinking about Hindu myths, they are not lewd drawings meant to titillate But then Husain's art is also hardly meant to titillate. That's the deep-rooted hypocrisy among people who claim to lead Hindus — in Britain or in India. They say they are deeply wounded when a Husain depicts Draupadi, Saraswati or Sita without clothes, even if the image Husain portrays is elegant, bold, linear and sharp. Inspired by the expressionists, Husain's figures are not always complete, and leave a lot for the viewer to imagine. The Chola bronzes, in contrast, are curvaceous and vivacious. For much of December, they competed for attention, in that respect, with the majestic sculptures of Rodin, which were also on display at the Royal Academy at the time. Whether coincidental or by design, the coexistence of Rodin and Chola at the Royal Academy was resonant with meaning. As William Dalrymple noted in an article in the Guardian: "In Western art, few sculptors — except perhaps Donatello or Rodin — have achieved the pure essence of sensuality so spectacularly evoked by the Chola sculptors; or achieved such a sense of celebration of the divine beauty of the human body. There is a startling clarity and purity about the way the near-naked bodies of the gods and the saints are displayed. Yet, by the simplest and most modest of devices, their spirit and powers, joys and pleasures, and above all their enjoyment of each other's beauty and their overwhelming sexuality, is highlighted." And yet, those offended Hindu leaders in Britain have remained silent about the bronzes. It is a tragedy of our times that Hindu nationalists have succeeded in running a nearly decade-long campaign against Husain and forced him into involuntary exile, shuttling between Dubai and London. True, Husain has painted several goddesses from the Hindu pantheon in the nude, but those are bold works that reshape our thinking about Hindu myths, revealing them in a new light; they are not lewd drawings meant to titillate. His nudes delineate the body in sharp lines, elevating it to an abstract realm, suggesting the formlessness of divinity. This explanation, which is faithful to Hindu philosophy, is too abstract for the semi-literate fundamentalists who have protested against his works and, in some cases, ransacked art galleries displaying his art in India. There are some 1,200 cases filed against him. Even though he does not need to, Husain has apologised for hurting sentiments. Explaining his motives, the painter has traced his art to India's millennia-old heritage in which gods and goddesses were "pure and uncovered". But we live in complicated times. Instead of celebrating the openness of Hinduism, which should make those who claim to lead the faith feel proud of a non-Hindu artist expressing homage to their gods, Hindu nationalists are busy trying to outdo other faiths, by complaining that they, too, have the right to be offended. So if Muslims want Danish cartoons banned, Hindus want Husain's drawings banned. The attention Muslims have commanded with their protests against images they consider blasphemous — a concept alien to Hinduism — has left Hindus wanting equal treatment. Don't mistake them for being liberals. The sacred and the profane have always coexisted in India. As a faith, Hinduism is broad enough to include some sects that think sex is the main way to enlightenment, and broadminded enough to overlook sadhus roaming around naked, their bodies smeared with ash, during the Kumbh Mela. Indeed, in many aspects of Indian literature and art, nudity connotes purity and openness, not vulgarity. Architects have decorated many temples with nude deities. The Chola bronzes, which depict scantily-clad Hindu goddesses are no less divine. The temples in Khajuraho from the Chandela period have hundreds of erotic statues. The Gangaikondacholapuram Shiva Temple has an almost nude Parvati, and that hasn't diminished her holiness. The Parshvanatha Temple of Khajuraho has nude sculptures of the holiest of the holies in the Hindu pantheon. And many sculptures in Bikaner have Hindu divinities clad only in exquisite and ornate chains, necklaces and bangles. For the Hindu nationalists, if Husain did any of that, it would be sacrilegious. But when anonymous sculptors carve such figures, it becomes divine, even if not high art. That's the hypocrisy that is so fundamentally against the Indian ethos, not Husain's art. Husain's art may not be sacred, but what the fanatics are doing is profane. From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Tue Aug 26 22:51:43 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 10:21:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About Hindutva Terrorism Message-ID: <627249.48694.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Please do not make hill out of a mole to justify Islamic terrorism which is spread world over now. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् To: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 6:27:15 PM Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About Hindutva Terrorism Dear friends, I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html And more stories in that issue: http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html o o o BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow Mail Today, 26 August 2008 mailtoday.in IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel room. The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to batteries with wires. The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city between 1998 and 2000. Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were inactive these days," he said. The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were planning to do." Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We are investigating their links." Another officer said the police had information about more explosives that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to recover them soon. Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the bombmakers were well trained in their job. The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private hostel in Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his links with his son two years ago and was living in his ancestral village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied one of the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities since 2001," an officer said. SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me and I do not chalk out their programmes." piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in o o o 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai Mail Today, 26 August 2008 mailtoday.in SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the 'martyrdom' of two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted outside a mosque in Maharashtra. Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market their own brand of Hindu terror'. In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took place. The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said Gazi. Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity connection." Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state and Centre let the accused go scot free. "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is happening in Nanded?" he asked. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From sh.readerlist at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 23:05:59 2008 From: sh.readerlist at gmail.com (shyama haldar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:05:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <4b38be8b0808261035k686ded9cq4a58cdbf774a07f9@mail.gmail.com> dear chanchal, i do so wish you meant that line about sex being the 'power of nature to brood'... it truly is a beautiful thought, as though sex were a cosmic introspection. from the tenor of the rest of your post, i fear that what you meant was merely, and crudely, 'breed'. do, if you would, sort this out for me. many thanks. shyama From shuddha at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 03:10:39 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 03:10:39 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' - The Geelani interview In-Reply-To: <443578.87137.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <443578.87137.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1896C74C-1A1A-4A83-AA96-F36CF2C03BB9@sarai.net> Dear Kshmendra, Thank you for your posting on highlighting Syed Ali Shah Geelani's opinions. There is nothing new in what Geelani has said, and his position is quite well known, both within Kashmir, as well as amongst those who have a long-standing interest in the matter. I am responding to this question not because I have a personal axe to grind pro or anti S.A.S Geelani, but because the question you raise implicitly has important shades, and I would like not to let go of their significance. I will turn to them briefly at the end of this posting. Let me begin by saying that I agree with you on the completely nonsensical nature of S.A.S Geelani's half baked views on the subject of the future governance of Kashmir. There is, as you rightly point out, no single accepted interpretation of what exactly constitutes Islamic jurisprudence and statecraft , so it is clear that when he talks of using that as a guide with which to govern (nizam) Kashmir he is clearly intent on imposing his own narrow, secterian view, which would be anathema even to the majority of Muslims in Kashmir. When anyone, let alone someone like S.A.S Geelani (who should know better, because he claims to be a scholar of Islam) talks about Islamic Socio-Economic conditions, or Islamic Culture (which one, the one of Andalusia, Java, the Levant, Shi'a Iran, Bektashi European, Turkish Ottoman, or Hejazi, or Peasant Bengali), or about the Sunnah as a guide to governance and everyday living (on which there is no consensus within Islam) he is clearly talking utter nonsense (such guidance does not exist in any clear form and would have to be invented) and it should be absolutely clear to everyone that as a possible future ruler he would be the worst disaster to have befallen the unhappy people of Kashmir. Just as every modern Muslim Fundamentalist Ruler has been a disaster for every single people whom they have had the misfortune to rule. I have to say that he reminds me a lot of a man venerated by many in the 'pantheon' of the Indian struggle for Indendence. Subhash Chandra Bose - charismatic, doctrinaire, reportedly honest, willing to sup with fascists and nazis, authoritarian and fascinated by authority, and with a vain, arrogant yet thuggish streak that would have made him a disaster as a possible ruler of Independent India (and dare I say,even more of a disaster for Kashmir), This part of the world was spared much misfortune by that airplane that never quite made it over the straits of Formosa after the second world war. (His brother, Sarat Bose however, was in my opinion one of the most interesting and creative political actors of his generation). So, India was spared Subhash Bose by an air mishap, and S.A.S Geelani's advancing age may also deliver him from Kashmir, and yet allow Kashmir to remember him with some hazy residual fondness for his reported honesty, personal civility and straightforwardness. Having said all this, I am surprised that you say that the opinions expressed on the Reader List that are not in accordance with the standard Indian state's position on Kashmir are 'muted' when it comes to S.A.S Geelani. I think they occupy a fairly wide spectrum, some are indifferent, some are muted, some are possibly in agreement, some are in mild disagreement, some are in total disagreement (like mine). This spectrum, to me, is a sign of the health of what you call the 'pro-separatist' and what I would characterize the 'pro-withdrawal of India from Kashmir' position(s) on the Reader List. Difference, even robust difference, is always healthy. I think the 'pro continued Indian occupation of Kashmir' position on this list, in comparison, is far more monotonous. It does not seem to have much by way of internal debate or differentiation, or, if it does, (with some exceptions, mainly reservations expressed occasionally in a minor key by you) it does not appear, at least not on this list. (This list - The Reader List - by the way is a list that is hosted on the Sarai website, among other lists. It is not THE Sarai list, it is not the SARAI list. And the opinions expressed on this list are not the opinions of Sarai, even when they are expressed by people who work at Sarai. Sarai does not have an opinion. It cannot, because it is neither a person, nor a party, nor an interest group. And Sarai hosts many different kinds of curiosities, as researchers, as fellows as practitioners, not all of whom have the same opinion on Kashmir, or any thing for that matter) Sorry for that clarificatory digression. But now back to your question. Is the so called 'pro-'Azadi' ' camp in Kashmir, elsewhere, or on this list, 'mute' about S.A.S Geelani? Let me begin addressing this question first of all by asking a counter-question. Why is it necessary for us to be 'vocal' about Geelani at all? As far as I am concerned, he is just another politician, perhaps respected by some people in the valley because he is seen (by some again, not all) as not having ever been on the payroll of the Indian state. (Many others in the so called 'separatist' leadership have at one time or another been seen as (rightly or wrongly) or have been believed to be compromised by their tacit acceptance of covert 'favours' by the Indian state. But to me, this question of 'is Geelani corrupt or not ?' is actually irrelevant. Sometimes the most dangerous politics is exercised by those who adorn themselves with the charisma of incorruptability and the glow of an inability to be flexible. So this alone is not a criterion by which I judge what SAS Geelani represents in Kashmir. For me, the opinions of this octegenarian politician (and sometime member of the Legislative Assembly of Jammu & Kashmir - which proves that even S.A.S Geelani has been different things at different times) is of less consequence than the logic of what impels the people of Kashmir to reject the Indian state. Today, more than ever before in Kashmir, the people are ahead of their leaders. The initiative is really in their hands, and the Indian state is terribly confused because there is little that it can achieve even by playing games of intrigue within and between the factions of the Hurriyat Conference, because frankly, neither the Hurriyet Leadership, nor the Militants, nor the ISI, nor the mainstream political parties, are running the show. The show is running, despite, not because of them. The logic of how the show runs, how the people of Kashmir enact their refusal of the Indian state has to do with the stranglehold that the Indian state has exercised over aspect of life in Kashmir, and its absolute refusal to let people live in peace. Only today, we have read a report in the Indian Express that speaks of the repressive apparatus of the state attacking ambulances and ambulance crews. And we have read earlier of police and CRPF using violence in the casualty wards of hospitals, intimidating doctors and nurses as they tend to the wounded. I have been in Kashmir, I have seen an Army unit burn a village, I have seen the fear in a father's face as he spoke to me, thinking that as an 'indian', i could have some influence in helping get his teenage daughter back from the clutches of an army patrol who were holding her hostage. If I were a villager who lived in that village, why would you expect me to feel anything but hatred and fear for the state that does these things. That is why, my standing by the movement against the Indian occupation has more to do with standing by these people rather than anything to do with the ephemerality of a so called 'leadership'. Let us not forget, that S.A.S Geelani's claim to 'leadership' is far from being uncontested. He had to leave his own party, the Jamaat e Islam, because no one took him seriously, and the 'Tehreek -e-Hurriyat' which has been his refuge in recent days is a far more heterodox and complex formation than he is actually comfortable with. S.A,S Geelani routinely listens only to those who say yes to him, and the fact that the crowd that did not take his 'claim to leadership' at the rally after which he had to apologize is a pointer of the fact that in front of constituencies other than his own, his authority is not that high, even though there may be a grudging respect for his moral standing. At the same time, in the maelstorm that is Kashmir, there must be several, brutalized, humiliated, scorned, who would think - "Why should I not turn to a man who speaks a clear and forthright anger against these violences. Why would I not take his idiom seriously. Why, when I have nothing left to cling to, should I not reach out and hold on to the surety of an iron clad faith that he holds out to me." and that perhaps explains S.A.S Geelani's desparate constituency. His appeal, however much of it exists, and it exists, not for a single reason, or even in a simple way, (I know for instance, that people weep for him and curse him at the same time). It is an index of how far the people of Kashmir have been pushed to the wall. I understand this, and yet I think that this is a profound tragedy. S.A.S Geelani, once a minor, unpopular politician in the Jamaat e Islami, a sometime MLA for a party with two seats that were scrounged and won in fraudulent elections, a party that no one really cared for in Kashmir, is what he is today, thanks to the Indian state. Through the fifties, sixities, seventies, eighties it suffocated every other form of opposition. It engineered the imprisonment of every dissident voice, toppled governments at will, and capriciously arranged for the rise and fall of this or that figure and then arranged for the execution of Maqbool Butt, the exile of Amanullah Khan, the targetted assasinations of figures like Dr. Guru, Hriday Nath Wanchoo, the elder Mirwaiz, Abdul Ghani Lone and many others who were of much greater stature than S.A.S Geelani in the eyes of the people of Kashmir and who could have, at times like this, provided some of the ethical and intellectual anchors, even some of the personal succor that the movement needs today. Who was left? Who was transformed from a virtual non-entity to the man in shining incorruptible armour - S.A.S Geelani. He suited the Indian state best. He could be demonized, he could be portrayed as a bigot, which he is. He held out for a corrupt military dictatorship in Pakistan. His malignant ideas about what kind of Kashmir he wants can be ridiculed, and so, by extension, the movement as a whole could be tarred by having him identified as the leader, as the qaid. Something similar happenned in Iran. The Shah of Iran completely destroyed every form of opposition, other than the clerics of Qom. A surprised Khomeini, who could at least go into exile in Iraq and France, while the non-Islamist or moderate Muslim opposition found itself shot with bullets in the back of the neck, found the moral leadership of the Iranian revolution gifted to him by the fleeing Shah of Iran. The Indian state, by using money, guns and intrigue, has left Geelani (the apparently incorruptible, honest and straightforward, but reactionary, proto-fascist Geelani) holding himself out as the pretender to the throne of the leadership of the movement for Azadi in Kashmir. It is not the people of Kashmir as much as Iovernment of India that has crowned Geelani by demonizing him. The people of Kashmir, in their bitteness, have sometimes looked up to the man that the Government of India loathes most of all. This may not be as accurate an index of their esteem for that man as it is a mark of their hatred for that government. It is for the same reason that Bose became wildly popular (even in areas where he had no base) in the bitter forties of the last century in India, when the British Raj was on its last and in some ways most desperate legs in India. Ask the successive home ministers, prime ministers and intelligence officers of India why they brought Kashmir to this state that Geelani can appear sometimes as if he could be a saviour to the same people that he also infuriates with his obstinacy, his retrograde statements and reactionary outlook on life. As for what I think of him and what he represents. And I can speak only for myself here. I have always been clear. At the risk of repetition, let me quote from two postings - ------------------------------------ Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 Date: 16 August 2008 5:11:19 PM GMT+05:30 I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. [I posted this because it was Geelani who raised the ridiculous bogey of the 'demographic shift' in Kashmir, even as he (correctly, in my view) pointed out that the anger about the alienation of land in Kashmir has to do with the arbitrary occupation of acres and acres of land by the Armed Forces of India.] Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 Date: 21 August 2008 3:45:48 AM GMT+05:30 I disagree with anyone who calls for 'Nizam-E-Mustafa' because I disagree with the idea or imagination of any 'Nizam' or regime that finds it necessary to protect itself from question by adorning the mantle of unquestionable sanctity. The word 'Mustafa' means 'Chosen' in Arabic. And the idea of a 'NIzam-E-Mustafa' meaning, the 'state of the chosen' has an uncanny resemblance to the idea of the return of the 'chosen people' to their state, which is the foundational myth, if you like of Zionism. I know that Syed Ali Shah Geelani would probably be horrified to think that his vision of 'Azaadi' has a striking parallel of the founding myth of the State of Israel.(and it is actually the founding myth of all hitherto oppressed people who are led to believe that once they achieve a statehood congruent with their idea of who they are, all will be well - this is the general condition of all secular, radical, liberal or conservative notions of nationalism, of which, Zionism and the idea of the 'Nizam e Mustafa' are perhaps the clearest exemplars.) The perception of a 'State' as the 'Manifest Destiny' of a people chosen by God or History, or both, contains within it the seed of a terrible tragedy, of yesterday's victims transforming themselves into tomorrows tormentors. Of the Pakistani army conducting mass murder in what was once East Pakistan, and thus destroying once and for all, the delusion of a brotherhood forged on the basis of Islam alone. No one could imagine that those who laid the foundations of the Jewish state of Israel in the wake of the holocaust would be laying the foundations of a detention facility for Palestinians. No one could imagine that those who led the oppressed people of India into her 'tryst with destiny' in 1947, so radiant in the first flush of what they called freedom, would turn Kashmir or the North East or much of Central India into death camps. We, especially those of us who stand by Kashmiris today, against Indian and Pakistani occupation, must imagine the possibility that an 'Azaad' Kashmir, whether it is independent, or a part of Pakistan, may also be a similar bitter harvest. Nothing can be more lethal than the assumption that victims are innocent per se. We must recognize clearly, especially if we invest in the idea of 'Azaadi' that those who speak of freedom in Kashmir today, may turn out to be oppressors tomorrow. It is because of this, that I disagree with any attempt to cloak the idea of the state (even, and especially if it claims to speak for and on behalf of the oppressed) with any sanctity. As long as the state as a form of organising and administering human society remains, we must be vigilant, I believe, to ensure that those who lead the state are not able to adorn themselves with the concealing cloak of sanctity of any kind. The sanctity and glamour of the yesterday's state of being oppressed is a weapon in the arsenal of tomorrow's oppressor. This applies, without any qualification to the present and future destiny of Kashmir, and the people of Kashmir must be vigilant against all those who act in the name of the sacred, and most of all, in their name, in the name of the people of Kashmir. --------------------------- Let me now come to whether the fact that S A S Geelani makes himself out to be a man of religion, or whether the fact that the Mirwaiz speaks from a pulpit and is a religious figure of some consequence in Kashmir should make any different to our assessment of these individuals. Personally, no. I am not religious myself, but I do believe that several of the most creative political thinkers and activists of our times have been motivated by their religious convictions, and have spoken politically in a religious idiom. These include the Liberation Theologian and Nicaraguan Revolutionary Ernesto Cardenal, Tenzing Gyaltso - the fourteenth Dalai Lama, Martin Luther King Jr., Swami Sahajanand Saraswati (A Dandin Sannyasi and Bihar Peasant leader and sometime member of the Communist Party) and Rahul Sankrityayan (Ordained Buddhist monk and maverick Communist), For me, a staunch non-believer, the secular-religious divide is not as important as the humanist-non-humanist divide. For me, as i have stated above, the key test is, does the person concerned hold out his views and ideology as sacred and beyond question, if he does, regardless of whether he or she is devout or an atheist, they are bad news. Finally, a cause may be just, even if it is saddled by an incompetent, or disagreeable protagonist. Similarly, a cause may be unjust, even though it may be represented by agreeable and intelligent people. I believe that the cause of Azadi for Kashmir is just, even though I find some of its protagonists incompetent and disagreeable (I feel that S.A.S Geelani may be honest, but as a political protagonist he is both incompetent and disagreeable) . I believe that the cause of having India hold on to Kashmir is unjust even as I may find some of its proponents agreeable at a personal level. I am sure you understand what I mean. regards Shuddha On 26-Aug-08, at 6:06 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > If, any deserving to be taken seriously voice were to say that > 'India should be declared as a Hindu country', there would be many > a million voices (including mine) that would stridently condemn > such a statement, that would be gravitated to campaign for and > garner widespread public opinion against such a statement. > > We would find some of the most brilliantly argued, impressively > articulate, eloquent and even 'wordy' dismissals of such a > statement in SARAI itself. > > On SARAI we have quite a few brilliantly argumentatitive, > impressively articulate, eloquent and often wordy opinions > expressed in favour of the 'separatists' of Kashmir. Surprisingly, > they are rather muted in their comments about Geelani's position. > Demure almost in their referring to him in-passing and generally > conveying the impression that the Geelani (and his support base) > position is not of any real significance and of not much > consequence in the "separatist movement". That tells me (at least), > how much these people are in touch with the 'realities' of Kashmir > or the "separatist movement". > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta From shuddha at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 03:32:53 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 03:32:53 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6EDDC590-DBA4-4480-967D-52628F28FA46@sarai.net> Dear Prabhakar, Let me follow up on Sonia's mail below. I see no problem with anyone painting a goddess in the nude. I see no problem with anyone painting my mother in the nude, provided she consents to it. And if anyone asks her with respect, and affection, I am sure that she will say yes. Neither my mother, nor I think of the human body as impure or indecent. Let me assure you, that she and I would find the people who think that the body is something to be ashamed of as the ones who are vulgar, indecent and perverse. Currently, that would mean you, and the people who burn images and attack exhibitions because a goddess has been painted in the nude. I had asked a few days ago, in response to a posting by Aditya Raj Kaul on another matter what exactly was the problem with nudity? I had not received a reply. Perhaps you can furnish me with one instead. I fail to see which part of the body can be considered unworthy of human contemplation. My question to those who consider themselves religious and have problems with nudity is always - "so if you believe that God made you, which part of the body do you consider not to be sacred? Which part of your body, would you agree needed to be removed, to make it more presentable? Do you need any help in having some part of your body removed in order to make it appear more presentable to yourself?" And if, as religious people believe, that the human form is made in the divine image, then, which part of the body of the divine image would you not consider sacred? Have you even thought through what you are saying? Do you have any sense of the weight of tradition in Indic, specifically in Hindu religious iconography that actually celebrates the unclothed human form as divine? My father's family's ancestral traditional ishta devata is a jagrata Kali. Her icon is beautiful, terrifying, naked. How should I commit the blasphemy of clothing her to satisfy your perverse mind? Please let me know. regards Shuddha On 26-Aug-08, at 12:48 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > Maybe it comes as a surprise to you, but I find nothing offensive > in nudity. > My mother is 75 years old and I find her beautiful. If a sensitive > artist, > appreciative of the beauty of an ageing body with all that is > considered to > be flawed by a culture that glorifies youth and pornography were to > paint > her and she were to acquiesce, I would have no problem at all. > > BTW, a decade ago I had worked on a photography project with the > artist > Sheba Chhachhi where we had explored these very questions in what I > considered to be stunningly beautiful black & white prints. > > > On 8/26/08 9:07 AM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > >> If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and >> displays it in >> art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how >> wold you >> react? Will you write the same languge which you have written here >> and take >> the same action as suggested by you to others? Will you appreciate >> the >> beautiful work of art in the same manner? After all every freedom >> has its >> sensible limits. >> Prabhakar >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: rohan saha >> To: S. Jabbar >> Cc: Sarai >> Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 12:54:16 AM >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> >> Dear All, >> >> I am new to this list and was added recently. >> >> I had a couple of observations about the ongoing debate. >> >> As regards the definition of "art"; it is an extremely subjective >> definition >> and will vary from person to person. But one's is free to express >> what he >> wants whether it qualifies as art or not and just because a >> painter puts >> forth one offensive painting does not mean that every painting >> prepared by >> him should be branded as offensive. >> >> Also, I understand the outrage directed against an artist for the >> manner in >> which he has depicted a religious deity or a religious symbol but >> I can't >> comprehend how that outrage sanctions hooliganism and vandalism. >> There are >> legal channels which can be employed to prosecute a person whose >> expression >> / "art" outrages the sentiments of a community. Every country has >> them, as >> does India under Chapter XV of the Penal Code. >> >> I do understand that a country such as Pakistan, China, Saudi >> Arabia etc >> would tend to punish such actions more severely, maybe even with >> death, >> therefore I tend to be thankful that I'm in India and *not *one of >> those >> countries. >> >> Finally, would the same controversy have occurred if these >> paintings were >> rendered a Hindu artist? By a Menon or Maity or Sen rather than a >> Husain? >> >> Regards, >> >> Rohan >> >> >> On Mon, Aug 25, 2008 at 9:37 PM, S. Jabbar >> wrote: >> >>> What, dear Aditya are you referring to and pronouncing on now? >>> Is this too >>> to be labeled under Muslim art and anti-Muslim art, one to >>> denounced and >>> the >>> other to be defended? What a terrible bore! >>> >>> >>> On 8/25/08 9:15 PM, "Aditya Raj Kaul" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Art - It cannot be called a work of Art for sure. >>> >>> Wonder why the Danish >>>> cartoonist abused, maligned and mis-represented. Even >>> his was a work of pure >>>> art. Amd, wasn't that his job too... >>> >>> Its quite unfortunate to see some >>>> ultra-liberals (chappal & Jholla fame) >>> defending such mindless imagination. >>>> There isn't any justification for it. >>> >>> Had something of this scale been done >>>> in some other country such as >>> Pakistan, Saudia Arabia, China etc.; the person >>>> would't have been alive by >>> now. >>> >>> Aditya Raj Kaul >>> >>> >>> On 8/25/08, S. Jabbar >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> You are welcome to critique the works of >>>> the artist and what you perceive >>>> to >>>> be the motives that drive her/his >>>> art. >>>> >>>> But why is it that you feel the need to defend the right to destroy >>>> that >>>> art? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 8/25/08 8:44 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> The work of art is for the consumption >>>> of people but it should not >>>> consume the >>>>> consumer itself.The artist >>>> should know it very well.He should not try to >>>> play >>>>> with their faith just >>>> for his/her cheap fun.An artist who is not >>>> sensitive to >>>>> emotions and >>>> faith of the people at large is not an artist at all.Art is >>>> not >>>>> an end >>>> in itself.It is for the people and for the good of the society. >>>>> >>>> Prabhakar >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>>> From: S. Jabbar >>>> >>>>> To: Prabhakar Singh ; >>>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >>>>> ; Sarai >>>> >>>>> Sent: Monday, 25 August, 2008 8:25:17 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] >>>> Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >>>>> >>>>> People have become rather >>>> emotional and touchy of late. Everyone seems >>>> to >>>>> have become >>>> hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of course it helps >>>> if >>>>> there >>>> are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. >>>>> >>>>> Is one's faith so >>>> fragile that a drawing or a piece of poetry or writing >>>> and >>>>> can shake it? >>>> Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear down works of >>>> art >>>>> when it is >>>> faith that is crumbling? My prescription is twenty years of >>>>> solitary >>>> meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. >>>>> >>>>> Do you know the story of Swami >>>> Vivekanand who stood in front of the >>>> goddess >>>>> at Khir Bhavani? Look it >>>> up. It's instructive. And humbling. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, >>>> "Prabhakar Singh" wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Artists should be >>>> careful about the cultural or religious sensitivities >>>> of >>>>>> the >>>>>> >>>> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such sensitive and >>>> touchy >>>> >>>>>> issues which may have emotional importance for some >>>>>> people. >>>>> >>>> Prabhakar >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>>> From: >>>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta >>>>>> >>>>> To: sarai list >>>> >>>>> Sent: Monday, 25 >>>>>> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM >>>>> >>>> Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >>>>>> Delhi >>>>> >>>>> Dear >>>> all, >>>>> >>>>> Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the Hindutva >>>>> (Hindu >>>> >>>>>> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the 'Shri Ram Sena' >>>>> have >>>> attacked >>>>>> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images by >>>>> and >>>> about the >>>>>> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was >>>>> held on >>>> the premises of >>>>>> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial >>>>> Trust >>>> (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >>>>>> against the decision by the >>>>> orgnaizers >>>> of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >>>>>> work by Husain citing >>>>> reasons of >>>> security. This incident demonstrates, yet >>>>>> again, how >>>>> inimical the >>>> forces of Hindutva are to an open society and to >>>>>> the >>>>> freedom of >>>> expression. >>>>> >>>>> See - >>>>>> >>>> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the Indian >>>>> >>>> Express >>>>>> that carries details of the incident. >>>>> >>>>> This list has >>>> discussed such attacks on >>>>>> freedom of expression before, >>>>> and just as >>>> we have had forthright criticism >>>>>> of Muslim >>>>> fundamentalists attacking >>>> Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) led >>>>>> West >>>>> Bengal government making it >>>> impossible for her to stay in Kolkata, so >>>>>> >>>>> too, we must take into >>>> account this latest assault on cultural >>>>> liberty. I >>>>>> appeal to all to >>>> condemn this attack on the freedom of >>>>>> >>>>> expression. >>>>> >>>>> regards >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Shuddha >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>>> reader-list: an open >>>> discussion list on media and the city. >>>>> Critiques & >>>>>> Collaborations >>>>> >>>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >>>>>> with >>>> subscribe in the subject header. >>>>> To unsubscribe: >>>>>> >>>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>>>> List archive: >>>>>> >>>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Be the >>>> first one to >>>>>> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >>>>>> >>>> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ >>>>> >>>> _________________________________________ >>>>> r >>>>>> eader-list: an open >>>> discussion list on media and the city. >>>>> Critiques & >>>>>> Collaborations >>>>> >>>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net >>>>>> with >>>> subscribe in the subject header. >>>>> To unsubscribe: >>>>>> >>>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>>>> List archive: >>>>>> >>>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Get an >>>> email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. >>>> Click >>>>> here >>>> http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _________________________________________ >>>> reader-list: an open discussion >>>> list on media and the city. >>>> Critiques & Collaborations >>>> To subscribe: send >>>> an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>>> subscribe in the subject >>>> header. >>>> To unsubscribe: >>>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>>> List archive: >>>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> ___________________________ >>>> ______________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the >>>> city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to >>>> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. >>> To >>>> unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List >>>> archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >>> >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>> subscribe in the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >> >> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From A.Khanna at sms.ed.ac.uk Wed Aug 27 03:36:56 2008 From: A.Khanna at sms.ed.ac.uk (A Khanna) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:06:56 +0100 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <227760.27053.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <227760.27053.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20080826230656.9t34d6rlcsg888cw@www.sms.ed.ac.uk> chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of you will find it interesting. First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away from the lives of 'Hindus'?? Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, in different parts of the country and in different communities in the same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a “faith (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly sex)” is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves 'Hindu'. In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is that to him “Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same” – therefore, actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two things that i find fascinating here. First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly fascinating. But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of prabhakar and chanchal? So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the nail on the head. “If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how would you react?”, s/he asks. A similar point is made by chanchal when s/he says “I am sure, a person who paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) to his mother and sister”. This leads me to understand that the anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he also makes steel. Love, akshay -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. From tapasrayx at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 05:28:34 2008 From: tapasrayx at gmail.com (Tapas Ray) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 19:58:34 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <48B498AA.50606@gmail.com> Pardon me, but has India become a nation of Ayatollah Khomeinis? De we want every Salman Rushdie's head on a platter? Tapas From rahul_capri at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 05:54:11 2008 From: rahul_capri at yahoo.com (Rahul Asthana) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:24:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <339241.11491.qm@web53606.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Sonia, A question to you.Don't you think someone else deciding on what people should get hurt from;and what they shouldn't is a tad condescending?When you see a person lying down on the road after an accident,do you tell him that hey listen, you shouldn't really feel hurt or do you try to resolve his\her situation? Its another thing to tell someone that they can stfu and you don't care about how they feel.Thats insensitive at the worst.But I don't see what moral ground a person has,to tell anyone else what they should feel hurt from. For the same reason I don't get this debate on nudity.How does it matter whether your mother or mine is okay with that.According to a widely accepted social norm one can safely say that many people would not be okay with a goddess painted nude and Hanuman's tail going through her legs.So why not stop reducing this to freedom of expression and say that it is in bad taste,because it offends the sensibilities of a group of people? By the way ,I had made a similar point on the Prophets cartoons as well.The issue was highly distorted by the Western media.It painted Muslims as some kind of crazy cave dwellers who would kill if someone paints there prophet. There would sure be some people like that,but the media made us fall prey to the binary.If you have to criticize the violence by the fundoos you end up supporting the media's rally for the freedom of expression.Its another matter that there are paintings of prophet in some Islamic traditions,and Muslim anger was not against the painting of the prophet per se but painting him in a bad light;and it was not a single incident but it took place repeatedly,in an obvious in the face attempt to spite them.It stopped being a matter of freedom of expression. One more point,Hussain being a Muslim and painting a Hindu Goddess like that is important.Its perfectly human to have a group identity and recognize other group identities as "the other".It does not matter what my world view is,there shouldn't even be an argument on that.Just recognize human tendencies and respect them,on the basis of what a large group of people may feel. I feel that the more liberal a person becomes the more intolerant that person becomes of others points of view.I am sure a devout Muslim would find that painting offensive.If the media can be a little bit less obsessed with their own world views and try to respect points of view of other people and groups,for eg if a significant section of media had come up and said that those paintings were offensive,perhaps such issues would not flare up. regards Rahul --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: "Prabhakar Singh" , "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Sarai" > Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 8:25 PM > People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. > Everyone seems to > have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of > course it helps if > there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. > > Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of > poetry or writing and > can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear > down works of art > when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is > twenty years of > solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > > Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in > front of the goddess > at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And > humbling. > > > On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > wrote: > > > Artists should be careful about the cultural or > religious sensitivities of the > > people.Art can flourish even without delving on such > sensitive and touchy > > issues which may have emotional importance for some > > people. > Prabhakar > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > To: sarai list > Sent: Monday, 25 > > August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in > > Delhi > > Dear all, > > Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting > > > predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the > Hindutva > (Hindu > > Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the > 'Shri Ram Sena' > have attacked > > and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images > by > and about the > > nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was > held on the premises of > > the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > > against the decision by the > orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > > work by Husain citing > reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet > > again, how > inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and > to > > the > freedom of expression. > > See - > > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > > > exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the > Indian > Express > > that carries details of the incident. > > This list has discussed such attacks on > > freedom of expression before, > and just as we have had forthright criticism > > of Muslim > fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) > led > > West > Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in > Kolkata, so > > > too, we must take into account this latest assault on > cultural > liberty. I > > appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom > of > > > expression. > > regards > > Shuddha > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > Critiques & > > Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > Be the first one to > > try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > _________________________________________ > r > > eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > Critiques & > > Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 09:33:07 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:03:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <436640.49819.qm@web90403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear Khanna, 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive side of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own mother and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their intention as personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the same for their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person would not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader concept of motherland. 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the text only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because India is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people like you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What I told about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word came into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of Sanatan Dharma. I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma and Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous duty and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and teaches righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing this, but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step towards Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't cover their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they knew that he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took cover when Veda Vyas crossed. There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. And the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. And winning over it is the biggest win in life. If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu society also marrying multitude of women. Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not understand and ask me stupid questions. Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per their capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses (Hindu women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same thing. M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only with his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic attitude. He has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or if you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a photograph of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many of you are not of double standard. Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. ----- Original Message ---- From: A Khanna To: Prabhakar Singh Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of you will find it interesting. First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away from the lives of 'Hindus'?? Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, in different parts of the country and in different communities in the same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a “faith (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly sex)” is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves 'Hindu'. In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is that to him “Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same” – therefore, actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two things that i find fascinating here. First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly fascinating. But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of prabhakar and chanchal? So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the nail on the head. “If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how would you react?”, s/he asks. A similar point is made by chanchal when s/he says “I am sure, a person who paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) to his mother and sister”. This leads me to understand that the anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he also makes steel. Love, akshay -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. From vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 10:05:26 2008 From: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com (Vedavati Jogi) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm@web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> beautiful piece of writing chanchal! accept my hearty congratulations for that. i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim extremists. and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard on readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars'   vedavati --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya wrote: From: chanchal malviya Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" Cc: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM Dear Khanna, 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive side of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own mother and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their intention as personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the same for their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person would not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader concept of motherland. 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the text only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because India is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people like you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What I told about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word came into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of Sanatan Dharma. I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma and Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous duty and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and teaches righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing this, but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step towards Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't cover their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they knew that he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took cover when Veda Vyas crossed. There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. And the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. And winning over it is the biggest win in life. If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu society also marrying multitude of women. Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not understand and ask me stupid questions. Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per their capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses (Hindu women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same thing. M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only with his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic attitude. He has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or if you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a photograph of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many of you are not of double standard. Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. ----- Original Message ---- From: A Khanna To: Prabhakar Singh Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of you will find it interesting. First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away from the lives of 'Hindus'?? Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, in different parts of the country and in different communities in the same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a “faith (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly sex)” is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves 'Hindu'. In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is that to him “Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same” – therefore, actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two things that i find fascinating here. First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly fascinating. But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of prabhakar and chanchal? So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the nail on the head. “If some artist in the name of art paints your mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public how would you feel and how would you react?”, s/he asks. A similar point is made by chanchal when s/he says “I am sure, a person who paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) to his mother and sister”. This leads me to understand that the anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he also makes steel. Love, akshay -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 10:26:55 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my dear friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of Islam... Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are non-Muslims... After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw non-Muslims into that fire... Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read Quran and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read Quran... Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, etc) have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands Infidels and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war till then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by Muslims - known as Mopla rebellion.. But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And we call him 'Father of the Nation'... Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting Secularism... Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point to some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at all.. If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... same story is with Christians also.... It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of all other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human to expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu and let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, pitra devo.. - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless duty - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is the approach - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the culture of HIndus and so many things... This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. though they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. ----- Original Message ---- From: Aditya Raj Kaul To: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch Hindus of Surankote asked to quit or face consequences* 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 King C Bharati Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house belonging to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have been asked to quit or face the consequences. Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked them and started burning their houses even as administration remained crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are openly burning their shops and house which included some government employees in presence of police. The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling Pakistani flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst ever communal violence in this border district. The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to have no time for this remote district even as the local administration has already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help and put the number of migrated families to 15. The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said that around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India and Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious consequences. The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to remove the posters. There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 10:40:25 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm@web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear Aditya, You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus will have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for us... At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be told terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people who oppose it are terrorists... So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to fight the Adharma... You know a secret... Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. You can understand rest of the things.... ----- Original Message ---- From: Aditya Raj Kaul To: sarai list Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch Hindus of Surankote asked to quit or face consequences* 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 King C Bharati Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house belonging to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have been asked to quit or face the consequences. Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked them and started burning their houses even as administration remained crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are openly burning their shops and house which included some government employees in presence of police. The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling Pakistani flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst ever communal violence in this border district. The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to have no time for this remote district even as the local administration has already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help and put the number of migrated families to 15. The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said that around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India and Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious consequences. The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to remove the posters. There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kuhutanvir at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 10:59:56 2008 From: kuhutanvir at gmail.com (Kuhu Tanvir) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 10:59:56 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Re: Chanchal Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books and the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like this. You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't waste your time or the patience of others. Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have to hear the voices of the likes of you. On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > (chanchal malviya) > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > (chanchal malviya) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > From: Vedavati Jogi > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > extremists. > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard on > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > vedavati > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya wrote: > > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > Dear Khanna, > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > side > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > mother > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their intention > as > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the same > for > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > would > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > concept of > motherland. > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > text > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > India > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > like > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What I > told > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > came > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > Sanatan > Dharma. > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma and > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > duty > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > teaches > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > this, > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > towards > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't cover > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they knew > that > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took cover > when > Veda Vyas crossed. > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > And > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. And > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > society also marrying multitude of women. > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > understand > and ask me stupid questions. > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > their > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > (Hindu > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > thing. > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > with > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > attitude. He > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > if > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > photograph > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > of you > are not of double standard. > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: A Khanna > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > ; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > you will find it interesting. > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > exists in texts > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > 'Hindu'. > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > Husain' is > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > things that i find fascinating here. > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > fascinating. > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > prabhakar and chanchal? > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > also makes steel. > > > Love, > > akshay > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my dear > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of Islam... > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > non-Muslims... > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > non-Muslims into that fire... > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read Quran > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > Quran... > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, etc) > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands Infidels > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war till > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by Muslims > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And we > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting Secularism... > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point to > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at all.. > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... same > story is with Christians also.... > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of all > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human to > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu and > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > pitra devo.. > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > duty > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is the > approach > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > culture of HIndus > and so many things... > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. though > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > Hindus > of Surankote asked to quit or face > consequences* > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > King C Bharati > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > belonging > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > been > asked to quit or face the consequences. > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > employees in presence of police. > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > Pakistani > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > ever > communal violence in this border district. > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > have > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > that > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > and > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious > consequences. > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to > remove the posters. > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Dear Aditya, > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus will > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > us... > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be told > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people who > oppose it are terrorists... > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > fight the Adharma... > > You know a secret... > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > Hindus > of Surankote asked to quit or face > consequences* > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > King C Bharati > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > belonging > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > been > asked to quit or face the consequences. > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > employees in presence of police. > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > Pakistani > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > ever > communal violence in this border district. > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > have > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > that > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > and > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious > consequences. > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to > remove the posters. > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > ******************************************** > From sagnik.chakravartty at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 11:04:08 2008 From: sagnik.chakravartty at gmail.com (SAGNIK CHAKRAVARTTY) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:04:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Come for Sept 12 function at IIC on Public service broadcasting Message-ID: CFTV-JAN PRASAR's Convenor Suhas Borker invites you for a Discussion on Public Service Broadcasting on the occasion of Sept. 12 - the day when Prasar Bharati Act got Presidential accent..... Day: Sept 12, 2008 Venue: IIC Time : to be confirmed.... Speakers: A Bhatnagar (Chairman Prasar Bharati) (Not yet confimed)(only tentative) Please do come.... (I will send a separate mail to Sarai when the time is confirmed and list of speakers is finalised...... From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 11:31:05 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:01:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 Message-ID: <539323.19597.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If you think I have not read Quran and Bible and saying so.. let me quote lines from your Quran and being a Muslim you can explain me the meaning of what is meant by 'Right hand possesed women" SURAH 2.221: Don’t marry unbelieving women (Idolaters) until they believe: a slave woman who believes is better than unbelieving woman. Even though she allure you. Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: a man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever even though he allure you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to Fire. SURAH 2.228: Divorced women shall wait concerning themselves for three monthly periods. Nor is it lawful for them to hide what Allah hath created in their wombs, if they have Faith in Allah and the Last Day. And their husbands have the better rights similar to the rights against them, according to what is equitable; but men have degree (of advantage) over them. SURAH 2.229: A divorce is only permissible twice: after that, the parties should either hold together on equitable terms, or separate with kindness. It is not lawful for you, (men), to take back any of your gift (from your wives), except when both parties fear that they would be unable to keep the limits ordained by Allah. If ye (judges) do indeed fear that they would be unable to keep the limits ordained by Allah, there is no blame on either of them if she give something for her freedom. SURAH 2.230: So if a husband divorces his wife (irrevocably), he cannot, after that, remarry her until after she has married another husband and he has divorced her. In that case there is no blame on either of them if they reunite; provided they feel that they can keep the limits ordained by Allah. SURAH 2.336: There is no blame on you if ye divorce women before consummation or the fixation of their dower; but bestow on them (a suitable gift), the wealthy according to his means, and the poor according to his means; a gift of a reasonable amount is due from those who wish to do the right things. SURAH 2.337: And if ye divorce them before consummation but after the fixation of a dower for them, then the of the dower (is due to them), unless they remit it or (the man’s half) 8is remitted by him in whose hands is the marriage tie; and the remission (of the man’s half) is the nearest to righteousness. And do not forget liberty between yourselves. SURAH 4.3: If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them). Then only one, or (a captive) that your right hands possess. That will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice. SURAH 4.15: If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, take the evidence of four (reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way. SURAH 4.16: If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-Returning. SURAH 4.22: And marry not women whom your fathers married, except what is past: it was shameful and odious, and abominable custom indeed. SURAH 4.34: Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband’s) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them; but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance): for Allah is most high. ----- Original Message ---- From: Kuhu Tanvir To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Re: Chanchal Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books and the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like this. You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't waste your time or the patience of others. Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have to hear the voices of the likes of you. On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > (chanchal malviya) > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > (chanchal malviya) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > From: Vedavati Jogi > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > extremists. > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard on > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > vedavati > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya wrote: > > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > Dear Khanna, > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > side > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > mother > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their intention > as > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the same > for > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > would > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > concept of > motherland. > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > text > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > India > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > like > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What I > told > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > came > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > Sanatan > Dharma. > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma and > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > duty > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > teaches > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > this, > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > towards > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't cover > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they knew > that > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took cover > when > Veda Vyas crossed. > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > And > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. And > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > society also marrying multitude of women. > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > understand > and ask me stupid questions. > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > their > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > (Hindu > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > thing. > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > with > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > attitude. He > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > if > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > photograph > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > of you > are not of double standard. > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: A Khanna > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > ; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > you will find it interesting. > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > exists in texts > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > 'Hindu'. > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > Husain' is > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > things that i find fascinating here. > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > fascinating. > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > prabhakar and chanchal? > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > also makes steel. > > > Love, > > akshay > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my dear > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of Islam... > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > non-Muslims... > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > non-Muslims into that fire... > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read Quran > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > Quran... > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, etc) > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands Infidels > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war till > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by Muslims > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And we > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting Secularism... > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point to > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at all.. > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... same > story is with Christians also.... > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of all > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human to > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu and > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > pitra devo.. > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > duty > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is the > approach > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > culture of HIndus > and so many things... > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. though > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > Hindus > of Surankote asked to quit or face > consequences* > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > King C Bharati > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > belonging > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > been > asked to quit or face the consequences. > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > employees in presence of police. > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > Pakistani > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > ever > communal violence in this border district. > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > have > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > that > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > and > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious > consequences. > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to > remove the posters. > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Dear Aditya, > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus will > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > us... > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be told > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people who > oppose it are terrorists... > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > fight the Adharma... > > You know a secret... > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > Hindus > of Surankote asked to quit or face > consequences* > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > King C Bharati > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > belonging > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > been > asked to quit or face the consequences. > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > employees in presence of police. > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > Pakistani > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > ever > communal violence in this border district. > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > have > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > that > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > and > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious > consequences. > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to > remove the posters. > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > ******************************************** > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 11:33:59 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:03:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 Message-ID: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu Religion.. But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please do not visit the topic... ----- Original Message ---- From: Kuhu Tanvir To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Re: Chanchal Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books and the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like this. You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't waste your time or the patience of others. Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have to hear the voices of the likes of you. On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > (chanchal malviya) > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > (chanchal malviya) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > From: Vedavati Jogi > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > extremists. > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard on > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > vedavati > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya wrote: > > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > Dear Khanna, > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > side > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > mother > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their intention > as > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the same > for > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > would > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > concept of > motherland. > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > text > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > India > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > like > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What I > told > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > came > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > Sanatan > Dharma. > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma and > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > duty > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > teaches > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > this, > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > towards > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't cover > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they knew > that > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took cover > when > Veda Vyas crossed. > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > And > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. And > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > society also marrying multitude of women. > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > understand > and ask me stupid questions. > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > their > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > (Hindu > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > thing. > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > with > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > attitude. He > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > if > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > photograph > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > of you > are not of double standard. > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: A Khanna > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > ; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > you will find it interesting. > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > exists in texts > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > 'Hindu'. > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > Husain' is > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > things that i find fascinating here. > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > fascinating. > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > prabhakar and chanchal? > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > also makes steel. > > > Love, > > akshay > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my dear > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of Islam... > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > non-Muslims... > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > non-Muslims into that fire... > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read Quran > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > Quran... > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, etc) > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands Infidels > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war till > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by Muslims > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And we > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting Secularism... > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point to > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at all.. > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... same > story is with Christians also.... > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of all > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human to > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu and > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > pitra devo.. > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > duty > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is the > approach > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > culture of HIndus > and so many things... > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. though > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > Hindus > of Surankote asked to quit or face > consequences* > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > King C Bharati > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > belonging > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > been > asked to quit or face the consequences. > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > employees in presence of police. > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > Pakistani > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > ever > communal violence in this border district. > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > have > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > that > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > and > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious > consequences. > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to > remove the posters. > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Dear Aditya, > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus will > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > us... > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be told > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people who > oppose it are terrorists... > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > fight the Adharma... > > You know a secret... > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > Hindus > of Surankote asked to quit or face > consequences* > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > King C Bharati > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > belonging > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > been > asked to quit or face the consequences. > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > employees in presence of police. > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > Pakistani > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > ever > communal violence in this border district. > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > have > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated from > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking help > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > that > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > and > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face serious > consequences. > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were removed > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried to > remove the posters. > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call which > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration crippled > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch is > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > ******************************************** > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kuhutanvir at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 11:46:34 2008 From: kuhutanvir at gmail.com (Kuhu Tanvir) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:46:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Where does your quotation say that you are allowed to marry as many as 'your capacity' as you earlier claimed? And the position on women in any religious text is a completely different issue, which has room for debate, but that is not what you said earlier. Is it? On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:34 AM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 (chanchal malviya) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:03:59 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > To: Kuhu Tanvir , reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <762848.52529.qm at web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > Religion.. > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please do > not visit the topic... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Kuhu Tanvir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > Re: Chanchal > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books > and > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like > this. > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't > waste your time or the patience of others. > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > extremists. > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard > on > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > vedavati > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > wrote: > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > > side > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > > mother > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > intention > > as > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the > same > > for > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > > would > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > > concept of > > motherland. > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > > text > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > > India > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > > like > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What > I > > told > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > > came > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > Sanatan > > Dharma. > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma > and > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > > duty > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > > teaches > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > > this, > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > towards > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't > cover > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they > knew > > that > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took > cover > > when > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > > And > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. > And > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > understand > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > > their > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > > (Hindu > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > > thing. > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > > with > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > attitude. He > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > > if > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > > photograph > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > > of you > > are not of double standard. > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: A Khanna > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > you will find it interesting. > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > exists in texts > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > 'Hindu'. > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > Husain' is > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > fascinating. > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > also makes steel. > > > > > > Love, > > > > akshay > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my > dear > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of > Islam... > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > > non-Muslims... > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read > Quran > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > > Quran... > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, > etc) > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands > Infidels > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war > till > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by > Muslims > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And > we > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > Secularism... > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point > to > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at > all.. > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... > same > > story is with Christians also.... > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of > all > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human > to > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu > and > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > > pitra devo.. > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > > duty > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is > the > > approach > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > > culture of HIndus > > and so many things... > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. > though > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 3 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus > will > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > > us... > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be > told > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people > who > > oppose it are terrorists... > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > > fight the Adharma... > > > > You know a secret... > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > reader-list mailing list > > reader-list at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > ******************************************** > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 > ******************************************** > From contact at cultureunplugged.com Wed Aug 27 11:53:04 2008 From: contact at cultureunplugged.com (Culture Unplugged) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:23:04 -0700 Subject: [Reader-list] Looking for Writers/Contributors Message-ID: Looking for Writers/Contributors : from Culture Unplugged: (office venues: New Zealand, India, USA) about us : http://studio.cultureunplugged.com To you, is it a bliss to meditatively write and move spirit/ consciousness of the audience? Do you love to focus on subjects such as films/media, consciousness, culture/society, identity ? Do you write in the style where profundity meets simplicity of expression? Our wish is to adopt a voice that is: Mature, Noble, Pragmatic, Frank, Fearless, Fresh; truth-seeking, expansive & inclusive, sharp- focused, thoughtful & sensitive – holding compassionate viewpoint of humanity and disparate cultures. We are launching an online venue with weekly blog catering to our primary audience - film-makers, film-lovers, conscious creatives/ citizens. This venue is to be launched in October/November 2008. Through this effort, we are not just building a platform/structure that simply publishes content, but one that raises consciousness of film-makers as citizens and unites people through their spirit. We are looking for writers who wish to blog and engage with global audience in a dialogue through this online platform. These opportunities are for freelance contributions which can commence now. Compensation is based on expertise/experience and efforts required. If you have experience as film/media critic, social scientist, cultural anthropologist, or editorial journalist, we wish to know you. To learn about us, please visit studio.cultureunplugged.com Please email us your profile/interest/samples at : apply at cultureunplugged.com In respect of time, we will contact you if we find your profile/ expectation a fit. We thank you for your attention. ------------------------ Best Wishes, Culture Unplugged Team From dash.suryashankar at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 11:53:49 2008 From: dash.suryashankar at gmail.com (Surya Dash) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 11:53:49 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Fwd: Orissa burning again In-Reply-To: <9b0e46010808261456h4984b92cid3dc20701afa6722@mail.gmail.com> References: <9b0e46010808261456h4984b92cid3dc20701afa6722@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Please find a letter from *Mr.Dibakar Parichha* to SHRC on Kandhamal situation. To The State Human Rights Commission Bhubaneswar Orissa *Orissa burning again* *Bhubaneswar* *Dt.26**th** August 2008.* *Stocktaking of the situation in State of Orissa* Violence re-erupted within the Indian state of Orissa today. The attacks performed by Hindu extremist groups are just one link in a long chain of events that have continued to strain Hindu-Christian relations within the state. Today's attacks were triggered by the killing of a prominent Hindu leader this past weekend. On Saturday, August 23rd , Swami Laxmanananda Saraswati along with five other people was shot dead in his Jalaspeta Ashram near Tumudibandha (Kandhamal District, Orissa). A Naxalite group has claimed the responsibility saying that he devided people on the basis of religion and ethnicity. The Swami was 84 years old and was especially known for violently opposing cow slaughter and conversion. He opposed the extreme naxalite group. He is also believed to have orchestrated the Christmas 2007 riot against Christians in the Kandhamal district of Orissa which has left thousands of Christians homeless to this day. Since the December attacks Hindu-Christian relations have remained tense within Kandhamal. In retaliation for the August 23rd killings the VHP and its allied political families called for a bandh (road blockade) for the 25th of August. In the meantime a judicial enquiry is ordered into the incident, though many opposition parties have called for the resignation of Naveen Patnaik's for failing to maintain law and order. In retaliation for the Swami's death, the extremist wing of the VHP has engaged in a series of attacks against Christians which started on 23rd and are expected to continue. On 23rd evening immediately after the news of murder of Swami Laxmanada Saraswati spread in the district, two sisters of Precious Blood congregation at Kothaguda who were on their way to Berhampur were stopped near G. Udayagiri, pulled out from the vehicle. Vehicle was then set on fire and the driver was severely beaten up. Almost at the same time a vehicle carrying HM sisters near Ainthapally in Sambalpur, a prayer chapel at Tentuliapadar in Sundargarh was also burned and destroyed. With these incidents, the stories of violence, abuse and attacks continue with several churches, church institutions, priests, Nuns, Christian people and their houses being attacked, abused, ransacked, and torched. As the impact of the news started getting visible across the state, government got into action by announcing prohibitory orders (144 Section) in Kandhamal district. This was also a preparatory action by the state government ahead of the 12-hour bandh called by the VHP and other affiliates of the Sangh Parivar on 25th august to protest the killing. On Sunday morning 24th August 2008, prayers in many churches were disrupted with very few participants attending the mass fearing attacks. >From the same day attacks in Kandhamal district intensified. It was the turn of Janvikas office like many other offices which were burnt to ashes during the violence in December 2007. Jan Vikas is a social wing of the Archdiocese of Cuttack Bhubaneswar and works towards empowerment of the most marginalised in the districts. A mob attacked, ransacked the office and set fire burning down three four wheelers, six motor cycles, all the important records and documentation of the organisation and office equipment. This incident took place at 5.30 in the evening. After this, the mob continued their assaults at Divya Jyoti Pastoral Centre by gutting, burning and looting the same at about 6 p.m. The same group entered the Baliguda presbytery, convent and hostel damaging the properties. In similar attacks, the Roman Catholic Church at Kanjamedi was attacked and vandalized at 6.30 p.m. The Diocesan Church at Kanjamedi was ransacked and other three Pentecostals churches were destroyed in the same way at 6.45 p.m. by the same group. In the late evening, about 12 Dalit Christian shops were burnt to ashes in Raikia. On 25th August 2008 as the Bandh lead to many protests, rastha rokos, tyre burning etc., the following incidents of violence shook the whole state and the Christian community. At 7.00 a.m, Phulbani Church and presbytery were vandalized and ransacked. Srasanda MC Brother's residence was attacked and the patients who came there to get treatment were beaten up and the VHP activists continued to burn houses and household articles of Christian families in the area. Eight houses were completely destroyed in this incident. On the same day at 10.30 a.m houses of Christian families in Christiansahi in Balliguda were destroyed and ransacked. The details of damage and the numbers are not available as yet. In a similar incident houses in Nuasahi were set on fire destroying the whole street where Christian families lived. This incident took place at 11.30 a.m. Two boys studying in the church run hostel were caught in Baliguda and their heads were tonsured. In the afternoon at about 1.00 P.M, Mr. Jamaj Parichha's house was attacked and his vehicles were set ablaze, doors were cut into pieces and he was beaten up by the mob. He sustained severe head injury and is hospitalised (place is not disclosed because of the security reasons). It is said that he is one of the primary targets of the hindutva forces in the area. His wife being a Hindu pleaded the mob to spare him and even showed that she practices Hinduism but they showed no mercy continued beating him up and said "he is a Christian and we will kill him". As this incident happened, houses of the staffs of Jan Vikas (Diocesan organisation under the Arch Diocese of Cuttack- Bhubaneswar) were also burnt. Five staffs are directly affected by this violence and all of them fled their villages and went into hiding. In a very similar way, at 2 p.m. the house of Mr. Puren Nayak resident of Bhudansahi was attacked and burnt into ashes. All his assets were removed from the house and were set on fire in a pile. . As the violence continued in the village, mob ransacked the Christian houses burnt all their belongings. The women (Hindu) in the community were identifying the houses to be burnt down as the mob followed their instructions. Women also supplied kerosene to encourage the mob. We will observe that in such incidents of burning and ransacking, the strategy used by the mob is very similar. The household articles and assets are brought outside the house and are set on fire. This is because under Indian Penal code section 436, the person/persons involved in burning the house are punishable with 7 years+ of rigorous imprisonment and this falls under the category of a non bailable offence. And when the assets/belonging are brought outside the house and burnt, it's a bailable offense and the punishment is limited to 6 months to one year of imprisonment. This offense falls under IPC 435. Fr. Challan, Director of Pastoral centre, Kanjamendi and Sr. Meena, administrator of the centre which was burnt and ransacked on 24th escaped from the centre to hide in Mr. Jashawanta Pradhan's house. On 25th, mob having the information about this forcefully entered the house dragging both of them outside. They were beaten up badly and taken to the police fundi (smaller unit of police station) in the area. It is reported that they were tied up in the fundi and were threatened of being burnt alive. There is no update about their condition since then. Paul Pradhan who heads an NGO in the district and works for the rights of dalits and adivasis was also attacked in his house, office was destroyed completely. It is also reported that most of the Christian houses in Tikkabali block were attacked and set fire. Numbers are still unknown. One person called Vikram Nayak was cut into pieces at Tiagian under G Udaygiri police station. Other two sustained injuries while no medication facilities have been made available and it is reported that both two persons were died. In Tiangia village under the same police station limits, houses of Christian families were set on fire and people have fled to jungle. It was reported that the miscreants have been following them and were attacking. On 25th late night, Sankrakhol Parish church and presbytery were set fire and ransacked, the parish priest Fr. Alexandar Chandi left to the nearest forest and he was saved. It is reported that his most of the assets are set fire and church is completely destroyed. Fr. Bernard Digal who had gone to visit Fr. Alexandar Chandi was held up in Sankrakhol parish when the mob attacked the church. His Marshal Jeep was set fire. While narrating the incident Fr.Bernard said that when the mob enters the church premise they left to the forest and hid themselves. They were safe but the vehicle was set fire. He walked around 10.K.M to reach one of his relations house. As he was walking the attackers were use to see him but could not recognise. On 25th August late night the Convent of St.Joseph's at Sankrakhole was attacked and ransacked. Sisters also left to the forest and have saved their life. On 25th August 2008, Mr. Abenswar Digal's house is set fire, under Tikabali Police station. On 25th August 2008, at about 11.00 p.m 23 houses of Gumagarh, under Bisipadsad Police station were attacked and ransacked. In Raikia, attacks are on as of 11.30 p.m. and the nature of damage is yet to be known. As per the first information report reveals that on 25thAugust late evening at Raikia 17 Christian houses were ransacked. Most of the house articles and assets were removed from the house and gathered outside and set fire. As per the first hand report the victims identified were Mr. Bijay Parichha, Mr. R.K.Nayak, Mr. Joseph Nayak, Mr. Susant Dal Behera, Mr. Santosh Nayak, Mr. Santun Nayak, Mr. Harihar Das, Mr. Mosesh Nayak, Mr. Prakash Nayak, Mr. Raju Parichha and others. On 25th August 2008 late night The Ambasadar Vehicle of Mr. Sukant Nayak, Director *Shahara (*NGO), was set fire. On 25th August 2008 late night The Office of Karuna (NGO), under Raikia Police station were ransacked. On 25th afternoon the Pentecostal church at Budamaha, under Raikia Polic station was vandalized and ransacked. On 25th August 2008, Masadkia church was vandalized and ransacked. On 25th August 2008, two Pentecostal churches were vandalized and ransacked. On 25th August 2008, Pisermaha Church, under Raikia Police station was vandalized and ransacked. On 25th August 2008, Baptist church and R.C Church at Mondakia under Raikia Police station was vandalized and ransacked. On 25th August 2008, Mdahupanga Church, under Raikia Police station was vandalized and ransacked. As the violence continues, most of the parish priests and sisters are still not reachable and their conditions are not known. The houses are being burnt in several places in Phulbani, Srasanada, Pobingia, Balliguda and Konjamendi. In Bhubaneswar, the impact of the Bandh was also felt severely by people with most of the office being closed, shops stayed closed as well. Transportation was totally disrupted and tyres were burnt in many places across the city. There were huge rallies by the supporters of VHP and Bajrangdal on the main roads and junctions. There were also some cases of attacks reported within the city and most of these attacks were on churches and church related institutions. From early morning of 25th onwards violent mobs made several attempts to enter the compound of Catholic Church and Archbishop's house in the city with a view to attack. Policemen deployed at the scene disbursed the mob and stopped them from entering the campus. Angry mob threw stones at the guest house of Archbishop's House, damaging some windows panes. Another group of fundamentalists entered presbytery in Duburi parish, managed by the SVDs and destroyed and damaged property. Two priests of the said parish Fr. Xavier and Fr. Simon are missing and their where about are yet to be found. Institutions like St. Arnold's School (Kalinga Bihar); NISWASS have suffered some damages while one Baptist Church in Akamra Jila in the city was also damaged. Situation seems to be very serious and worsening by every hour with violence being intensified. From across the districts, people are trying to flee to the safer places. But nothing seems be safe as of now. The violence can turn more intense as the people return after Swami's cremation. Other events that took place in Rayagada, Gajapati, Koraput and other south Orissa districts left Christians and Christian institutions throughout the state fearful. Father Obed Khura of Sunebeda received three threatening calls. While he approached the Sunebeda OIC, has was refused police protection and was sent back with assurance that the school he runs will not be attacked and was instructed to stay away from the school. In Muniguda (closer to Tumudibandha, Rayagada district), as the mass was coming to an end two jeep loads of youth from the town entered the compound and started shouting slogans. The police arrived on time and prevented the situation from escalating. Three policemen have been deployed at the gate which has been destroyed. The Church and Convent at Muniguda could not be saved. Around 80 inmates under the leadership of Fr. Pius Ekka and Sr. Marina Chacko have taken refuge in the forest. This happened in spite of the fact that Fr. Marshal Mihir Upasi was constantly in touch with the State Control Office of the Orissa Police and the SP of Rayagada. The mob first torched the police Jeep in Muniguda and then proceeded to the Convent and Church. On the previous day (24th of August) the mob threatened the Fathers after Sunday Mass. The mob sought out the houses holding Christian families and managed to destroy some of them. As a consequence allowing refuge to families has placed others at risk. As the mob moved on from Bhairaguda, 3 km away from Muniguda to seek shelter in a school while raining, the villagers from the Hindu community fed them. This took place at 7.20 pm. Expecting an attack Fr. Manickthan, Bhawanipatna asked for protection, the SP expressed his inability to do anything due to the size of the mob. When Father suggested the SP on announcing curfew in the area and stop the mob's movement, the angry SP retorted saying that Fr. need not give orders to him. Later in the forenoon both the ADM and the SP visited the Church compound and inspected the law and order situation. The Malankara hostel was attacked in Bhawanipatna, not far from the Catholic Church, and many children have been badly hurt. Missionaries of Charity from Dharmagarh, unaware of the events from the previous night, were travelling to Bhawanipatna for Sunday Mass. Near the jail in Bhawanipatna town their ambulance was intercepted and pelted with stones. All the sisters sustained minor injuries from the stones and broken glass. The police arrived and sent them back in the same damaged vehicle to Dharmagarh. Sr. Suma and Sr. Nirmala have been informed of this and the district administration has assured them of protection. A group of police are guarding the Church in Jeypore after the threat of oncoming attacks. The police informed Fr. Bimol Nayak that some 200 people are preparing to attack the Church. Fr. Bimol Nayak and another Brother have taken shelter with nearby friends. Around 24 policemen are guarding the church compound in Mohana after road blocks started on Sunday evening. Additionally, a group of 9 police men are safeguarding the Church in Goudogotho and the Cathedral. It is also reported that the Lutheran Church in Malkangiri, Padua, and Gunupur were destroyed. Fathers and Sisters along with the children in Gumuda have left the mission stations fearing attacks. On the 24 th as the Congregation was coming out of the Church in Malkangiri, a group of angry youth harassed them and forced them to recite Bande Mataram. 22 Christian Families of Shanti Nagar (Givindapur) at the foothill of Taptapani Hot Spring were also assaulted and forced to leave the village. In Boudh also, a group of protestors entered the parish and destroyed things and property. Communal tension was high also in other districts across the state with several incidents of attacks against the people as well as property. In Balasore, Balsore Social Service Society (official social wing of the Balasore diocese) was attacked three times during the day on 25thaugust. The mob shouting slogans broke all the window panes and destroyed a statue of Mother Mary which was installed in the BSSS office campus. Badrak also had few incidents of attacks but the details are not known. Hindu protestors attacked Jyoti Niketan of Baipariguda in Koraput district in the afternoon of 25th August. Father Joy Areeckal had to run into the forest and the hostel children and his social workers are subjected to insults and intimidation. The Mission has been destroyed along with all that it contained. A sad twist to the story is that the police along with the people seized wooden planks in spite of the fact that the carpenters who are building a new hostel building in the campus there claimed that it was bought by them. Consequently, a criminal case may be filed against Fr. Areeckal under the Forest Act. Mr. Routo Desinayak and Ms. Kalyani, who works for an agro-entrepreneurship program for SWAD at Boipariguda were also arrested under the forest protection act. Though the Police Officer and the Block Development Officer was not willing, the mob forced the police to tie Mr. Desinayak with a rope and drag him through the street up to the Forest Office. Miss Kalyani being a woman was spared of this ordeal. In Govindapally, close to Boipariguda, protestors entered the Convent and damaged the grotto of Our Lady and the Cross of the Church yard. In the same district Fathers and Sisters in Koraput, Jeypore and Semiliguda are in hiding. In Bargarh district, a mob of about 2000 people went around ransacking many church institutions and there were serious attacks on priests and nuns. In Padampur, Fr. Edward Sequira was attacked and was beaten up brutally. He survived with serious head injury and still unconscious. "His life is under critical still" said Fr. Alphonse Toppo, Vicar Gerneral of Sambalpur diocese. The institution which caters to children affected by Leprosy was attacked and burnt. While the institution burnt to ashes, along with it also burnt was the auxiliary nurse Rajani Majhi 20 year old, who took care of the children in the institute and was studying in Padampur Women's College. Sundargarh also saw many such incidents of church burning and attacks on church properties damages are yet to be ascertained. In Sambalpur district, Hand Maid Sister's residence of Ainthapalli has suffered damage while priests are given warnings of attacks in Madhupur, Badibahal area. Stone pelting and breaking of window panes of churches and related institutions was a common scene across the state. A Roman Catholic cemetery was damaged by an irate mob in Sambalpur town. The mob also pelted the stones at the Oriya Baptist Church near G.M College. Burning of motorbike belonging to a pastor Pravakar Munna, ransacking of a prayer house in Chiplima and attempt to attack a mission institution were also reported. In continuation to all this violence across the state, Dibyasingh Pariccha, PRO and Secretary, Justice and Peace Commission (Arch diocese of Cuttack Bhubaneswar) has condemned the killing of Swami Laxmananda Saraswati and appealed for a CBI enquiry into the incident. He requested that culprits responsible for the incident be punished instead of attacking the whole Christian community. He appealed to the government to deploy adequate forces to safeguard life and property of Christian people. On 26th August 2008, at bout 11.30 a.m the mob is attacking at Badimunda Village, under Tikabali police station in Kandhamal District. It is reported Roman Catholic Church and 5 individual houses were set fire. It is reported that people are suffering from with out food, cloth and shelter. Last night, there was heavy rain and people were in the forest with the wet cloth. However, the condition of the children and women were indescribable. School children are deprived of their studies. Kindly pray for us so that peace and harmony may return soon. Thank you very much for your solidarity. End Dibkar Parichha __._,_.___ Messages in this topic ( 1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages| Database Replying to this email will send an e-mail to 5000+ members of Jharkhand Forum. +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ About Jharkhand Forum @ http://www.jharkhand.org.in/about-jharkhand-forum Jharkhand Forum's Posting Norms http://jharkhand.org.in/posting_norms.htm Add your Name in JF's Members List - http://www.jharkhand.org.in/directory Volunteer for Jharkhand, find more @ http://www.jharkhand.org.in/volunteer +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ [ =>> Jharkhand Forum's Daily Digest <<= ] Jharkhand Forum's memberships have been growing up every day so the no. of messages. But, at any time if you feel annoyed with large no. of emails from Jharkhand Forum, then please, reply this email and ask for daily digest, moderator will change your mail delivery option in Daily Digest System (where you will get only one digest-mail everyday from Jharkhand Forum.) From ambarien at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 09:35:01 2008 From: ambarien at gmail.com (ambarien al qadar) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 09:35:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hit and Run Message-ID: <5ea7953c0808252105s6e652e65la246aac31d6322c8@mail.gmail.com> Dear All, On 24th August at around 11am we were driving across the Maharani Bagh-Ashram crossing when a swanky black convertible screeched to a halt at the left side. It has just hit headlong a nondescript pedestrian, quite young and looking like those numerous workmen making their way in the morning to some workshop in the bylanes around Ashram Chowk. I cannot tell the exact model and make of the car as it was something one doesnt often come across on Delhi roads - a very expensice low-slung Porsche look alike. On the driving wheel was our famous socialite, and if one goes by our english speaking television culture, the modern conscience of our new urban nation, Mr Suhail Seth. The man hit looked unable to walk, and sat there grabbing his ankles in pain. The social scene was interesting, this being some very rich looking car the people around looked very hesitant to confront the driver; had it been some familiar maruti-like vehicle I'm sure it would have spelled disasters of accountability for the driver. I expected that Mr Seth would at least try to apologise, get down from his car, and offer the man to be taken to some nearby first-aid facility. But Mr Seth was almost shouting on the man and in a very rushed manner backed-off the car, which anyways he looked quite less adapt at handling - and maybe thats how the accident happened in the first place! In no time then he sped off back into the avenue that emerges out of New Friends Colony East that joins onto the Maharani Bagh and Ashram section of the Ring Road. Mr. Seth is a regular on NDTV's 'We The People' and in February 2006 he was moderating 'The Status of Delhi in 2010' at the Vasant Vihar spring festival!! Big car Mr. Seth but very small heart. Ambarien Al Qadar From rahulroy63 at gmail.com Tue Aug 26 14:27:05 2008 From: rahulroy63 at gmail.com (Rahul Roy) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 14:27:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [DFA NewsLetter] Travelling Film South Asia 2008: A Festival of South Asian Documentaries In-Reply-To: <5a4334630808260044v668c54eeya8098d7c2eac8272@mail.gmail.com> References: <310ed9a60808252329t2284445ele2033955921f1739@mail.gmail.com> <310ed9a60808260031m7d4d9341qc882fa23c50d7060@mail.gmail.com> <5a4334630808260044v668c54eeya8098d7c2eac8272@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: the organisers had not mentioned the venue in the earlier notice. Regards, Rahul Roy --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Reshma Pritam Date: Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 1:01 PM Subject: Travelling Film South Asia 2008: A Festival of South Asian Documentaries To: "Delhi Film Archive [DFA]" *Travelling Film South Asia 2008: A Festival of South Asian Documentaries* *27**th** to 30**th** August 2008* *Venue: India International Centre, Auditorium, New Delhi* *A festival of films show casing a selection of thirteen outstanding documentaries from the region screened at Film South Asia '07 Festival, Kathmandu. Films from Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Bhutan, India, Nepal, Pakistan and Sri Lanka will be screened.* Schedule *Date* *Time* *Films* * * 27th Aug08 *6pm* *Introduction Followed by* * Every Good Marriage Begins with Tears (UK/Bangladesh)* (62 min; dvd; 2006; English & with subtitles) Director: Simon Chambers A moving account of two rebellious Bangladeshi sisters, born and raised in London, who are forced to go back to their parents' motherland for arranged marriages. Through footage of some of their most personal moments, the film explores the conflicts between migrants to the West and their children. It also dispels some myths about Islam's treatment of women, and puts a human face on one of the communities that is being targeted as a result of the US – led 'war on terror' *7:15 – 8:15 pm* *A Life with Slate *(Nepal; 59 min; dvd; 2006; English subtitles) Director: Dipesh Kharel *Joint winner of the Best Debut Film Award, Film South Asia '07* In the mountain village east of Kathmandu, the harsh lives of Thami slate-miners take on almost poetic dimensions. We learn how to separate slate slabs from the precipitous rock faces. Women work alongside men, carrying heavy loads down to the village and distant markets. *A Life with Slate* emphasises how cooperation between the labouring families ultimately makes a tough life bearable, and depicts intimate scenes of village life 28th August 2008 *6:00 - 7:14 pm* *Motherland Afghanistan *(Afghanistan; 74 min; 2006; dvd; English) Director: Sedika Mojadidi The filmmaker follows her father, who specialises in women's medicine, back to Afghanistan, where one in seven women dies during childbirth. *Motherland Afghanistan* takes in two different trips, one to a maternity ward in Kabul, and the other to a rural hospital in Ghazni. In the juxtaposition of these two situations, the film finds and highlights the inspiring grace and courage of Afghanistan's women * * *7:30 – 8:35 pm* *Rabba Hun Kee Kariye *(Thus Departed our Neighbours; India) (65 min; dvd; 2007; English subtitles) Director: Ajay Bhardwaj *Rabba Hun Kee Kariye (Thus Departed our Neighbours) *trails* *a shared history of Punjab - a subcontinental culture, language and a way of life- that was torn asunder in the fateful year of 1947. It captures the documentary maker's almost unexpected encounter with feelings of guilt and remorse about the genocidal violence of the partition. These informal tales, almost like folklore, are strewn across the memoryscape of Punjabi countryside. This documentary invokes it in the public domain for the first time*.* 29th August 2008 *6:00 – 7:00 pm* *Chaama Deu! Tara Nabirsa! *(Forgive! Forget not!; Nepal) (59 min; dvd; 2007; English subtitles) Director: Pranay Limbu This experimental documentary is the narrated story of a journalist who was detained inside Kathmandu's infamous Bhairabnath Barracks for 15 months. It provides a mirror to the terrible times just past in Nepal, during the 'people's war' and the state's reaction to the Maoist insurgency. *7:15 – 8:36 pm* *Remembrance of Things Present *(India; 81 min; dvd; 2007; English & with subtitles) Director: Chandra Siddan Winner of the Second Best Film Award, Film South Asia '07 How is a teenager supposed to deal with an arranged marriage? How does one resolve the conflict of a displaced life after years of nomadic existence abroad? In *Remembrance of Things Present*, the filmmaker, now living in Canada, returns to Bangalore to confront her parents with the former question, while she herself tries to resolve the latter. Long divorced and newly remarried, she records some profoundly touching conversations with her parents – while also finding her past being repeated in the life of her parents' household help. 30th August 2008 *10:00 – 11:15 am* *The Sky Below *(India/Pakistan; 75 min; dvd; 2007; English) Director: Sara Singh Joint winner of the Best Debut Film Award, Film South Asia '07 *The Sky Below *paints a contemporary portrait of the India-Pakistan 'mind-frontier', six decades after the two were parted. Singh explores the lingering commonalities, as well as the remaining possibilities for reconciliation based on the countries' interwoven histories, cultures and faiths. From both Pakistan and India, we hear first-person recollections from the time of Partition, as well as the views of former militants, politicians, royalty, ordinary citizens, historians and others. *11:30 – 12:25 pm* *6 Yards to Democracy *(India; 55 min; dvd; 2006; English subtitles) Directors: Nishtha Jain & Smriti Nevatia At a political event in Lucknow that was promising free saris, a gruesome stampede kills 22 women and injures many others. This seemingly stray incident hints at the sordid side of Indian democracy, but also goes deeper, to explore the daily humiliations forced upon these women and their families. As Lucknow's boomtown dynamics pushes them further to the margins, we observe the women's struggles to keep their homes, hopes and dignity intact, all the while petitioning an apathetic state to pay heed to their needs. *12:40 – 1:10 pm* *The Miseducation of Pakistan *(Pakistan; 30 min; dvd; 2005; English) Director: Syed Ali Nasir Schools with no teachers, no buildings, no drinking water, no electricity, and overflowing with garbage – this is what so many students of public schools in Pakistan can look forward to. Little wonder that a vast majority of the country's primary-school graduates are not even considered literate by international standards. All the while, a corrupt hierarchy of officials and school staff line their pockets with funds meant for the children's education – and no one is held accountable. This is the story of a generation lost, and of a country where basic education remains a distant dream for millions. *1:10 – 2:00 pm* *Lunch break* * * *2:00 – 3:00 pm* *Ayodhya Gatha *(India; 62 min; dvd; 2007; English & with subtitles) Director: Vani Subramanian Winner of the Special Jury Mention Award, Film South Asia '07 For two decades now, the destruction of the Babri Masjid in Ayodhya has influenced national events in India. But beyond the symbolism that the Uttar Pradesh town holds for the rest of the country, how has that event affected life in Ayodhya itself? As this film relates, today the streets of Ayodhya seem to have lost touch with the feet of its residents. Blocked and barricaded, our only access to the citizens is through memory: the telling of stories, the hearing of tales, the very *gatha* of Ayodhya's people *3:15 – 4:15 pm* *From Dust *(Sri Lanka; 60 min; dvd; 2005; English & with subtitles) Director: Dhruv Dhawan Filmed following the devastating 2004 Tsunami, this is a damning expose of the Colombo government's ulterior motives during the course of disaster relief. The local survivors have ultimately been prevented from rebuilding their homes along the coastline, while developers eye the lucrative beaches. Told through the stories of two survivors and an aid worker, *From Dust* is a sensitive depiction of lives that waited in tents while the tourism industry repositioned itself on their properties. *4:30 – 6:05 pm* *Living Goddess *(Nepal; 96 min; dvd; 2007; English subtitles) Director: Ishbel Whitaker Three *kumaris*, living goddesses, of Kathmandu Valley go about their ritualised lives against the backdrop of the agitations that marked the April 2006 People's Movement. Long sought for annual blessings by Nepal's monarchy, the Kumaris suddenly find themselves caught amidst a fight to define the country's future. The film spends extra time with Sajani Sakya, the precocious, camera-friendly Kumari of Bhaktapur, who went on a trans-Atlantic visit that made news over the summer. *6:05 – 6:30 pm* *Break* * * *6:30 – 7:55 pm* *Eisenfresser *(Ironeaters; Bangladesh) (85 min; dvd; 2007; English & with subtitles) Director: Shaheen Dill-Riaz Winner of the Ram Bahadur Trophy for Best Film, Film South Asia '07 The annual famine in northern Bangladesh forces two farmers, Kholil and Gadu, along with several of their relatives, to leave their homes and go to work as seasonal labourers in the ship-breaking yards far to the south. Here, on the beaches of Chittagong, they dismantle the discards of the Western world: decrepit oil tankers and enormous container ships, many of which harbour a vast range of perils, toxic and otherwise. These yards also capture their woes. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Please DO NOT REPLY to the sender. To contact the MODERATOR: delhifilmarchive [at] gmail.com To UNSUBSCRIBE: send an email to delhifilmarchive-unsubscribe at googlegroups.com More OPTIONS are on the web: http://groups.google.com/group/delhifilmarchive Our WEBSITE: www.delhifilmarchive.org -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~--- From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 13:11:35 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 13:11:35 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <339241.11491.qm@web53606.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Er... Sorry, but being the selfish, elitist, intolerant, liberal, feminist Martian I do see the difference between hurt and hurt. And from my non-existent moral ground I can still ask you to please find the story about Vivekanand in Khir Bhavani. If you're near a library do look at Civil Lines 5 (ed. Mukul Kesavan and Kai Friese). You'll find an essay by me called Spirit of Place. You'll find the Vivekanand story there. Please read it. I'll be happy to continue this conversation after. --sj On 8/27/08 5:54 AM, "Rahul Asthana" wrote: > Sonia, > > A question to you.Don't you think someone else deciding on what people should > get hurt from;and what they shouldn't is a tad condescending?When you see a > person lying down on the road after an accident,do you tell him that hey > listen, you shouldn't really feel hurt or do you try to resolve his\her > situation? > Its another thing to tell someone that they can stfu and you don't care about > how they feel.Thats insensitive at the worst.But I don't see what moral ground > a person has,to tell anyone else what they should feel hurt from. > For the same reason I don't get this debate on nudity.How does it matter > whether your mother or mine is okay with that.According to a widely accepted > social norm one can safely say that many people would not be okay with a > goddess painted nude and Hanuman's tail going through her legs.So why not stop > reducing this to freedom of expression and say that it is in bad taste,because > it offends the sensibilities of a group of people? > By the way ,I had made a similar point on the Prophets cartoons as well.The > issue was highly distorted by the Western media.It painted Muslims as some > kind of crazy cave dwellers who would kill if someone paints there prophet. > There would sure be some people like that,but the media made us fall prey to > the binary.If you have to criticize the violence by the fundoos you end up > supporting the media's rally for the freedom of expression.Its another matter > that there are paintings of prophet in some Islamic traditions,and Muslim > anger was not against the painting of the prophet per se but painting him in a > bad light;and it was not a single incident but it took place repeatedly,in an > obvious in the face attempt to spite them.It stopped being a matter of freedom > of expression. > One more point,Hussain being a Muslim and painting a Hindu Goddess like that > is important.Its perfectly human to have a group identity and recognize other > group identities as "the other".It does not matter what my world view is,there > shouldn't even be an argument on that.Just recognize human tendencies and > respect them,on the basis of what a large group of people may feel. > I feel that the more liberal a person becomes the more intolerant that person > becomes of others points of view.I am sure a devout Muslim would find that > painting offensive.If the media can be a little bit less obsessed with their > own world views and try to respect points of view of other people and > groups,for eg if a significant section of media had come up and said that > those paintings were offensive,perhaps such issues would not flare up. > > regards > Rahul > > > --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > >> From: S. Jabbar >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> To: "Prabhakar Singh" , "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" >> , "Sarai" >> Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 8:25 PM >> People have become rather emotional and touchy of late. >> Everyone seems to >> have become hypersensitive and quick to take offense-- of >> course it helps if >> there are TV cameras to record one's display of piety. >> >> Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a piece of >> poetry or writing and >> can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. Why tear >> down works of art >> when it is faith that is crumbling? My prescription is >> twenty years of >> solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. >> >> Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who stood in >> front of the goddess >> at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's instructive. And >> humbling. >> >> >> On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" >> wrote: >> >>> Artists should be careful about the cultural or >> religious sensitivities of the >>> people.Art can flourish even without delving on such >> sensitive and touchy >>> issues which may have emotional importance for some >>> people. >> Prabhakar >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta >>> >> To: sarai list >> Sent: Monday, 25 >>> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM >> Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in >>> Delhi >> >> Dear all, >> >> Once again, with depressing, monotonous and disgusting >>> >> predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to the >> Hindutva >> (Hindu >>> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the >> 'Shri Ram Sena' >> have attacked >>> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of images >> by >> and about the >>> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The exhibition was >> held on the premises of >>> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial >> Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest >>> against the decision by the >> orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude >>> work by Husain citing >> reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, yet >>> again, how >> inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open society and >> to >>> the >> freedom of expression. >> >> See - >>> http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- >>> >> exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a report in the >> Indian >> Express >>> that carries details of the incident. >> >> This list has discussed such attacks on >>> freedom of expression before, >> and just as we have had forthright criticism >>> of Muslim >> fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the CPI (M) >> led >>> West >> Bengal government making it impossible for her to stay in >> Kolkata, so >>> >> too, we must take into account this latest assault on >> cultural >> liberty. I >>> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the freedom >> of >>> >> expression. >> >> regards >> >> Shuddha >> >> >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the >> city. >> Critiques & >>> Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net >>> with subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >>> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> Be the first one to >>> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to >>> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ >> _________________________________________ >> r >>> eader-list: an open discussion list on media and the >> city. >> Critiques & >>> Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net >>> with subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >>> >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject >> header. >> To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 14:46:12 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 02:16:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 Message-ID: <396233.87613.qm@web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> He..he.. does it matter... you marry four or as many as possible... four is from your own religion.. and the rest is that your Right hand possesses... Isn't it enough to close the debate about women here... Where in Islam there any room for women... Let me tell you... Hinduism is more natural Faith than any other... Hinduism is not Religion.. not bounded... What you see today is Islamized and Christianized Hinduism... But pure Hinduism deals very positively about women and sex... If men are asked to be treated as God by women, women are treated as Goddess by men... Hinduism doesn't say that God lives somewhere in the sky and your job is to carry his hatred on earth... Hinduism says, if God is to be reached it has to start from you, by inculcating Godly qualities first in you, by treating every creation with respect to the height of worship.. Sex is worshippable, Sex is not eroticism, Sex is not about physical pleasure in Hinduism.. Sex is about purity of relationship that becomes the basis of continuity of life, basis of creation... And Sex is not seen as dirty thing in Hinduism.. But it is surely said that if sex is practiced in dirty manner it is devastating for individual... How can you compare the theory of Hinduism with any other Religion... not at all... You thought I am talking about Islam or Christianity without reading Quran or Bible... nope... I have many lines of Quran ready again to be thrown about women which clearly says what is meant by women held by Right hand... but I was waiting for your reply on the first set itself... Can you tell publicly now that Islam prohibits Muslims to take friendships outside their Religion... Can you publicly say that Islam do not advocate hatred and massacre against other Religions... Throughout Quran the verses repeatedly say that Non-Believers has a place in Fire of Hell... Every Surah teaches hatred... I can start quoted Surah after Surah... and you say this is Religion.. God teaches hatred and their people has created havoc in this world... Anyway, I do not want to bring such harsh truth... you provoked me to quote... or else I would have been abstract in my talk... If some christian will object my statement I will quote Bible also... But my question is simple... Was God dumb to create Sanatan Dharma from millions of years and suddenly he got intelligence that he created Islam... Was he dumb that he said his creations are respectable and suddenly he becomes aggressive and asks Muslims to kill anything that is not Islam and not human... If Islam thinks God is some different entity then also it should understand that... A painter is not respected unless his paintings are preserved with dignity... A painters respect is worship of his painting... However... let us focus on non-religion and only nation... M.F.Hussain has painted India nude.. and that is what the concern is... he should not be pardoned... People in Kashmir piss on Indian flag and that is not pardonable... Gilani says that Secularists of Nationalists are all enemies of Islam and Bukhari says that all Terrorists and Simi activists must be released or else Muslims will impose a bigger Kranti than 1947 and this is not tolerable... India has to take a stand today or tomorrow to deal with separatists... ----- Original Message ---- From: Kuhu Tanvir To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 11:46:34 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 Where does your quotation say that you are allowed to marry as many as 'your capacity' as you earlier claimed? And the position on women in any religious text is a completely different issue, which has room for debate, but that is not what you said earlier. Is it? On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:34 AM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 (chanchal malviya) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:03:59 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > To: Kuhu Tanvir , reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <762848.52529.qm at web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > Religion.. > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please do > not visit the topic... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Kuhu Tanvir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > Re: Chanchal > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books > and > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like > this. > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't > waste your time or the patience of others. > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > extremists. > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard > on > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > vedavati > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > wrote: > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > > side > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > > mother > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > intention > > as > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the > same > > for > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > > would > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > > concept of > > motherland. > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > > text > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > > India > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > > like > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What > I > > told > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > > came > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > Sanatan > > Dharma. > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma > and > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > > duty > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > > teaches > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > > this, > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > towards > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't > cover > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they > knew > > that > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took > cover > > when > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > > And > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. > And > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > understand > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > > their > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > > (Hindu > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > > thing. > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > > with > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > attitude. He > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > > if > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > > photograph > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > > of you > > are not of double standard. > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: A Khanna > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > you will find it interesting. > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > exists in texts > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > 'Hindu'. > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > Husain' is > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > fascinating. > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > also makes steel. > > > > > > Love, > > > > akshay > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my > dear > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of > Islam... > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > > non-Muslims... > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read > Quran > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > > Quran... > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, > etc) > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands > Infidels > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war > till > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by > Muslims > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And > we > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > Secularism... > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point > to > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at > all.. > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... > same > > story is with Christians also.... > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of > all > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human > to > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu > and > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > > pitra devo.. > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > > duty > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is > the > > approach > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > > culture of HIndus > > and so many things... > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. > though > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 3 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus > will > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > > us... > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be > told > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people > who > > oppose it are terrorists... > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > > fight the Adharma... > > > > You know a secret... > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > reader-list mailing list > > reader-list at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > ******************************************** > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 > ******************************************** > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 15:12:15 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 02:42:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 In-Reply-To: <396233.87613.qm@web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <944682.15914.qm@web57208.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Chanchal   I would like to reproduce what I had written to you, requested you on 26/12/2007   Re: [Reader-list] Idol worship [ Mailinglist ] by reader @ 26.12.2007 13:37 CEST Via: Kshmendra Kaul Dear Chanchal This Reader List is not meant for the comparative study of religions. My advice and request would be to avoid religious discourses especially of the kind "my religion is better than yours" Religion does influence and interfere into political and sociological matters. That cannot be ignored but any comment/analysis needs to have specificity to a situation/issue. Chanchal, I belong to what is generally known as "Hinduism". Yet, the "Dharmik" precepts that are dear to me and that fascinate me are quite a distance from what "Hinduism" has become. My point is that just as I could find many things to criticise in Islam or amongst Muslims. I could also pick many things to criticise about Hinduism and Hindus. Muslims and Christians are as much a part of India as a Hindu, Buddhist, Sikh, Jain, Agnostic, Atheist... etc etc. We should look for the affirmatives (as well as negations) that would consolidate each ones contribution to a healthier India. Criticising the word or action of one who seeks to damage India is as much applicable to a Hindu as it is to a Muslim or Christian or any other one. Kshmendra Kaul --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya wrote: From: chanchal malviya Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 To: "Kuhu Tanvir" , reader-list at sarai.net Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 2:46 PM He..he.. does it matter... you marry four or as many as possible... four is from your own religion.. and the rest is that your Right hand possesses... Isn't it enough to close the debate about women here... Where in Islam there any room for women... Let me tell you... Hinduism is more natural Faith than any other... Hinduism is not Religion.. not bounded... What you see today is Islamized and Christianized Hinduism... But pure Hinduism deals very positively about women and sex... If men are asked to be treated as God by women, women are treated as Goddess by men... Hinduism doesn't say that God lives somewhere in the sky and your job is to carry his hatred on earth... Hinduism says, if God is to be reached it has to start from you, by inculcating Godly qualities first in you, by treating every creation with respect to the height of worship.. Sex is worshippable, Sex is not eroticism, Sex is not about physical pleasure in Hinduism.. Sex is about purity of relationship that becomes the basis of continuity of life, basis of creation... And Sex is not seen as dirty thing in Hinduism.. But it is surely said that if sex is practiced in dirty manner it is devastating for individual... How can you compare the theory of Hinduism with any other Religion... not at all... You thought I am talking about Islam or Christianity without reading Quran or Bible... nope... I have many lines of Quran ready again to be thrown about women which clearly says what is meant by women held by Right hand... but I was waiting for your reply on the first set itself... Can you tell publicly now that Islam prohibits Muslims to take friendships outside their Religion... Can you publicly say that Islam do not advocate hatred and massacre against other Religions... Throughout Quran the verses repeatedly say that Non-Believers has a place in Fire of Hell... Every Surah teaches hatred... I can start quoted Surah after Surah... and you say this is Religion.. God teaches hatred and their people has created havoc in this world... Anyway, I do not want to bring such harsh truth... you provoked me to quote... or else I would have been abstract in my talk... If some christian will object my statement I will quote Bible also... But my question is simple... Was God dumb to create Sanatan Dharma from millions of years and suddenly he got intelligence that he created Islam... Was he dumb that he said his creations are respectable and suddenly he becomes aggressive and asks Muslims to kill anything that is not Islam and not human... If Islam thinks God is some different entity then also it should understand that... A painter is not respected unless his paintings are preserved with dignity... A painters respect is worship of his painting... However... let us focus on non-religion and only nation... M.F.Hussain has painted India nude.. and that is what the concern is... he should not be pardoned... People in Kashmir piss on Indian flag and that is not pardonable... Gilani says that Secularists of Nationalists are all enemies of Islam and Bukhari says that all Terrorists and Simi activists must be released or else Muslims will impose a bigger Kranti than 1947 and this is not tolerable... India has to take a stand today or tomorrow to deal with separatists... ----- Original Message ---- From: Kuhu Tanvir To: reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 11:46:34 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 Where does your quotation say that you are allowed to marry as many as 'your capacity' as you earlier claimed? And the position on women in any religious text is a completely different issue, which has room for debate, but that is not what you said earlier. Is it? On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:34 AM, wrote: > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > reader-list at sarai.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 (chanchal malviya) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 23:03:59 -0700 (PDT) > From: chanchal malviya > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > To: Kuhu Tanvir , reader-list at sarai.net > Message-ID: <762848.52529.qm at web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > Religion.. > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please do > not visit the topic... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Kuhu Tanvir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > Re: Chanchal > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books > and > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like > this. > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't > waste your time or the patience of others. > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > extremists. > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard > on > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > vedavati > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > wrote: > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > > side > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > > mother > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > intention > > as > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the > same > > for > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > > would > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > > concept of > > motherland. > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > > text > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > > India > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > > like > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What > I > > told > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > > came > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > Sanatan > > Dharma. > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma > and > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > > duty > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > > teaches > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > > this, > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > towards > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't > cover > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they > knew > > that > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took > cover > > when > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > > And > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. > And > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > understand > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > > their > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > > (Hindu > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > > thing. > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > > with > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > attitude. He > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > > if > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > > photograph > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > > of you > > are not of double standard. > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: A Khanna > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > you will find it interesting. > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > exists in texts > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > 'Hindu'. > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > Husain' is > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > fascinating. > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > also makes steel. > > > > > > Love, > > > > akshay > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my > dear > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of > Islam... > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > > non-Muslims... > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read > Quran > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > > Quran... > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, > etc) > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands > Infidels > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war > till > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by > Muslims > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And > we > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > Secularism... > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point > to > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at > all.. > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... > same > > story is with Christians also.... > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of > all > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human > to > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu > and > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > > pitra devo.. > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > > duty > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is > the > > approach > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > > culture of HIndus > > and so many things... > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. > though > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 3 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus > will > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > > us... > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be > told > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people > who > > oppose it are terrorists... > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > > fight the Adharma... > > > > You know a secret... > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > reader-list mailing list > > reader-list at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > ******************************************** > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > reader-list mailing list > reader-list at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 130 > ******************************************** > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From jeebesh at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 15:38:12 2008 From: jeebesh at sarai.net (Jeebesh) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 15:38:12 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <436640.49819.qm@web90403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <436640.49819.qm@web90403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <88BF3B5C-D6F0-4BB4-A562-6F9DE53A7199@sarai.net> On 27-Aug-08, at 9:33 AM, chanchal malviya wrote: > Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. A cursory glance says otherwise? Temples have grown in exponential numbers, so has the size. Pilgrims to each place of pilgrimage has grown in phenomenal number. The amount of spending on religious festival shows geometric progression. The images of god and goddess are all around. Television plays serials after serials on religious themes. Dedicated channels to religion has grown everywhere. ---- the list can be very long.. Do you have a bench mark of this growth, after which you stop feeling victimized? Just curious. best Jeebesh From jeebesh at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 15:59:27 2008 From: jeebesh at sarai.net (Jeebesh) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 15:59:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] The institutionalization of friendship (S23M remix) Message-ID: <9619AC14-A6E6-4770-85BE-2073F2427210@sarai.net> Victor Misiano: The institutionalization of friendship (S23M remix) There would be no communities if there were no events, jointly lived through from the beginning to the end, which lose the possibility of existing in each of us. Maurice Blanchot “La communauté inavouable” Sociology shows us that the only type of a social link not determined by some regional or family relationship, professional cooperation, ideological solidarity, or erotic attraxtion, is friendship. The aim of this text is to develop a theory of the relationship between the people around Piratbyrån as a history of friendship, while S23M (and some other projects) is nothing but a conscious attempt to launch a friendship formation project. As one of the S23M discussion participants said: “recent internet history is the history of friendships”. A story of meetings. People in love feel the necessity of being together; colleagues are linked to each other by the production conveyer, and comrades-in-arms are connected by ideological discipline (like Piratbyrån when taking the shape of a lobby organization.) The specific character of friendship as a form of social relationship is that it does not presume a permanent interaction. Friendships are a type of serial solidarity. The story of friendship is a story of meetings. The story of the kopimist community starts in 2003 when, in the framework of the #discobbedienti chat room, the Piratbyrån website was established. It was the legendary epoch after the collapse of the IT bubble, and as always, when anold system of relations comes apart, new contacts — and therefore new friends — emerged. It was during the discussions initiated by Piratbyrån, that these kopimists started to perceive themselves as a new generation, as an integrated body. Friendship is always a discovery: discovery of the Other and at the same time of the Self. S23M is the next stage in the life of the Piratbyrån community, after the euphoria of discovering each other (and discovering internet freedom), and after the shock of the conflict with the outside world (the attacks against The Pirate Bay). At such a stage internal contradictions are inevitable exposed. Self-reflection and doubts starts to appear. One has doubts about one’s self, and about the Other. Crisis is always a moment when you need somebody else, when the solidity of a friendship is tested. Thus, is 2007, the Indian kopimists of the Raqs Collective invited Piratbyrån to Italy. The confidential project. The friendship between the kopimists around Piratbyrån is not only a story of relationships between people. Very soon, if not at once, the kopimists started to percieve friendship as a strategic value, having the value of a project with an artistic character. The Walpurgis ritual, Oil of the 21st century, 0wnage — all these projects had one common feature: they employed the resources of friendly relationships as part of the program. These projects may be called confidential projects. The strategy employed in the framework of these projects can be called the institutionalization of friendship. The structure of the confidential project. The main feature is that the human aspect dominates the professional. Because friendship is not creative cooperation, but the “ethical form of Eros”. The confidential project excludes the possibility of a representative selection of participants. The choice is immanent in relation to the friendships. Friendship is a product of choice, although this is the only case of unmotivated social choice. Friendship is a choice within yourself. That’s why the usual curator’s routine — such as gender, national, generational, and regional balance — is impossible in such a project. The confidential project is equally indifferent to external representation: to the artifact and to spectacular effects. The substance of S23M is the concealed emotional, psychic, and intellectual experience, which cannot be exhibited or shown. The main issue lies in the internal, not external, communication. Friendship does not require a promotion. It cannot be for others, only for yourself. The secret essence of confidential projects is that such projects can generally ignore the public. Friendly communication cannot be maintained on-stage. The confidential project is also characterized by a freedom from hierarchy and functional specialiation. Friendship is not a hierarchical form of social relationship: it presumes a complete equality between all parties. Friendship does not know the Father. That’s why theconfidential project tries to ignore the role of the curator as power-source, which is inevitable in traditional exhibitions. Even if the function of the curator as an ideologue or manager is preserved, it should be carries out in such a way that it should create a regime of collective responsibility for every moment in the project, and for the ultimate result. There can be no successful or unsuccessful project in friendship. There can only be disappointment. The most evident feature of the confidential project is the absence of any thematic program. Such projects do not serve the reigning discourses and intellectual fashions. Slogans like “Eyeball the media” demonstrate the absence of any discoursive, thematic, or investigative pre-condition. they simply refer to the event of communication and its context. Is it possible for friendly communication to have a theme? The value of friendly communication is the very event of communication. The theme emerges spontaneously out of the communication itself. The discourse is crystallized in the process of its formation. That’s why the most adequate manner of documenting such a project is a detailed description of the process. Concrete work and concrete photos cannot describe the entire experience. Such a project is valuable as lived experience. Finally, the confidential project is not a Platonic dialogue, not an intellectual laboratory, and not a scientific workshop or panel discussion. Participants in confidential communities are not searching for truth. Nobody is trying to argue against something or convert somebody to his own beliefs. Confidence is the condition of friendly communication. The truth precedes it — it does not emerge in discussion. A friend does not give you good advice, but helps you find your own truth. That’s the way friendship differes from professional cooperation. In the latter, an individual builds a complicated balance of relationships between the Self and the Other. It also differs from love, which presumes self-denial. Lovers see themselves through the eyes of the Other. In friendship, we perceive our ideal self in the way we are perceived by the Other. That’s why the S23M participants can be found declaring their own ideas without making any effort to start moving towards each other. The confidential project as a project of the transitional epoch. It’s clear that the structure of the confidential project is nothing but an attempt to create a strucutre for a collective artistic practice in the situation of the absence of an art system. Thus, the confidential project and the community around Piratbyrån (let’s call it theconfidential community) is exactly the type of transitional society characteristic for a time of digitalization. In an institutional, ideological, and moral vacuum, friendship becomes the last shelter for culture. The direct result of the institutional and symbolic collapse in digitalization is the crisis of any objective justification for artistic practice. The old aesthetic ideology not only provided an objective foundation for official art, it also gave birth to an alternative. Avoiding official institutions and taking root in the sphere of the everyday, this alternative culture was also controlled by strict ideological principles. Acting as an opposition to the official institutional culture, alternative culture required the ideals and principles of “comrades-in-arms” and “the common affair”. Piratbyrån’s progress from the website and the book Copy Me via the Walpurgis book burning (which represented alternative experience in a new context and a new form) to S23M is essentially the evolution of the creative consolidation from the ideological to the post- ideological epoch. Friendship is the most non-institutional and personalized type of social communication. In the situation where not only the normative ethics of the authority collapse, but the “comrade-in-arms” and “common affair” ethics of opposition collapse as well, it is friendship, “the ethical form of Eros”, which remains the most invulnerable. It is also invulnerable to the cult of immorality, now associated with the liberating ethos of digitalization. Finally, the ethic of friendship does not accept any relativization of moral feelings, which (especially under the old aesthetic regime) was the most efficient opposition to official morality. Links between friends can’t avoid morality, that’s what takes them beyond simple acquaintance and relations between colleagues. While accepting any forms of human expression (including transgression and excess), friendship denies only one — irony. The confidential project is a characteristic symptom of the new situation, in which ironic strategies are left in the past. It is based in a deep earnestness, almost an obsession (transgression and excess). In this sense theconfidential community is the only possible form in which to preserve ethics in the period of the transition from the ideological ethics of the analog age to a kopimist ethics of the post-analog society. The confidential community’s denial of irony is an acknowledgement that deconstruction has exhausted itself as a strategy, and that what’s needed is a strategy of reconstruction. The constructive character of the confidential community is the utopian element that exists in any real friendship. The confidential project is the project of an ideal community or an ideal art system. In this sense, the idea of the institutionalization of friendship is mobilizing the major advantage of any transition epoch, when the old order has collapsed and the new one has not yet been built. The confidential community ascribes value to a pure potentiality. The S23M discussions. Three poles. Even a cursory familiarization with the S23M material shows that the discussions were determined by three clashing positions. All the S23M participants unanimously acknowledged that this project is a product of the collapse of the traditional ontological order, and that all of them are essentialy “frustrated” subjects. However, their differentiation starts immediately beyond this statement. It is evident that from the perspective of Piratbyrån, the prospect of a new ontology is lost somewhere beyond the horizon, but that does not keep the subject from moving towards it. For Ollibolli, ontology is impossible, but the structure of that impossibility has its own ontological sense. For Altemark, finally, the symptom of the crisis do not mean the end of an ontology. According to him, the same ontology is now stronger than ever, while his main task is to defeat it. In other words, while the Piratbyrån members are trying to appropriate their frustration, to make it a source of some new positive matter, Ollibolli and Altemark are trying to withdraw from frustration by offering two negative strategies. So while Altemark and Ollibolli are happily taking part in the confidential project, it is only the Piratbyrån group which could initiate it. S23M discussions. Analog-digital. The nature of analog-digital relations was the main nerve and the hidden leitmotif of all of the S23M discussions. Each of the supporters of the opposite points of view could not refrain from acknowledging that the analog-digital division is essentially the most painful trauma for the analog consciousness. The members of Piratbyrån are trying simply to understand the nature of the difference between analog and digital, not to define it. The ethos of their efforts is, instead of making statements, to understand digital reality — to study its structure and its dimensions, and to reveal its links with analog reality. In other words, the members of Piratbyrån are trying to look at the internet not as a solid body, but as something fragmented. Therefor, from the perspective of aesthetics they are not artists, but hackers. The idea of greyzones is basic to Piratbyrån’s identity. The S23M project — the residue was represented at Manifesta 7 — is nothing but the experience of a real border crossings, a study of greyzones, and a personal reflection on their conventional character. The members of Piratbyrån raise the issue of analog and digital — of infrastructural, artistic and legal borders — in conversation with both artists and hackers. S23M discussions. Analog-digital. The system of art. For the S23M participants, as for kopimists in general, the analog is the only art system, while the digital is an everyday artistic reality which is not included into that system (is so, only partially and not on a fair basis). As before, it was the Piratbyrån participants who initiated this discussion. They asked whether kopimists should blindly accept the laws of the art system, or mobilize the resources of critical thought with respect to the internet. For Ollibolli, this is not an issue. Because the phenomenon of contemporary art is a product of institutions, and almost all of these institutions are based on authorship, it follows that there is no other art than the authorship- based model. Therefore no critical distance is possible in relation to it, just as there can be no critical distance in relation to sunrise and sunset. In other words, the more you are an artist, the more you are an author. In his turn, Altemark, who turns Ollibolli’s position upside down once again, assumes that the system of art is so powerful that true freedom only exists beyond it, and true identity only exists beyond copyright. Having started a terrorist struggle with the contemporary art world, he declares a “Black Tape Day”. For Piratbyrån, the total acceptance or non-acceptance of the system is, if not a mistake, then at least a tactically short-sighted approach. It’s important to investigate and understand the inner mechanics of the system if only because the system can “deceive” you. Thus, it is important to keep in mind that the dynamics of the system have been maintained due to its ability to reflect upon itself critically. Therefore, the more critically you alienate yourself from the system, the more you’re an artist. The more you reveal that contemporary institutions are not relevant to your experience (even if your experience is the experience of art), the more you become a bearer of aesthetic values. Moreover, the more you build your identity upon the logic of negating the system, the less space — the less autonomy from the system — you leave for your identity. Finally, nothing helps a system to demonstrate its force as much as attempts to struggle against it. At the same time, nothing helps an artist to appropriate the might of a system better than an attempt to destroy it. The confidential project. One last note instead of a conclusion.Upon looking through the S23M materials, one could rightly ask: what made this friendship possible? What made all of these people get together? Their intellectual positions are so different! They can agree on almost nothing! It appears that the confidential project has another function characteristic of the transitional period: prophylaxis. Compared to a traditional exhibition (works delivered by trucks, assistants, the opening, and dinner with sponsors) the confidential project is extremely uncomfortable. Its experience can be justified by only one thing: its therapeutic impact. These projects are nothing but voluntary group therapy! These endless discussions are nothing but wholesome public acts of speaking out in order to eliminate depression and neuroses! Is it not social therapy that the institution of friendship serves? The therapeutic impact of the confidential project is effective because it plunges the participants into extreme situations; it provides them with some kind of a threshold experience. The lack of comfort and the hardships of the confidential project are compensated for by the intensity of experience. Unlike an ordinary exhibition, taking part in such a project means taking a step into the unknown. That’s where the difference between friendship and other social forms lies. Friendship cannot be routine, it’s always an adventure. I am ready to bear witness that the participants in the confidential project think of it as one of the most important moments in their kopimist lives, similar to how worn-out veterans recall the years spent on the battlefield as the happiest period of their lives. Finally, as I said before, friendship is a serial solidarity. Therefore, theconfidential project never degrades into a monotonous conveyer, because when they meet, friends always know that later they’ll have to part. From wonton_warriorprincess at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 16:05:57 2008 From: wonton_warriorprincess at yahoo.com (hasina hasan) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 16:05:57 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: <463495.91832.qm@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <341590.24695.qm@web94707.mail.in2.yahoo.com> ...we are also modestly good at: - whining about winning - sighing at large on the state of our state. we from our pc's here to anothers' there, say write: 'hey why you think that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear me for i speak well and have a nobler view'. (see me here now) or was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny images that never got attached --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima wrote: From: S.Fatima Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians To: "sarai" Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM Some people say that Indians are peace-loving people and never offend/invade any body. (Some say Indians never invaded others for last 10,000 years!). But in Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win medals in the most offendeing games: Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing Does it mean that we are good only in shooting, wresting and boxing others down. Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Bollywood news, movie reviews, film trailers and more! Go to http://in.movies.yahoo.com/ From rahul_capri at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 16:19:40 2008 From: rahul_capri at yahoo.com (Rahul Asthana) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 03:49:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <410495.52819.qm@web53606.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Please make the point here,from that story,if you can. --- On Wed, 8/27/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > To: rahul_capri at yahoo.com, "Prabhakar Singh" , "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" , "Sarai" > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 1:11 PM > Er... Sorry, but being the selfish, elitist, intolerant, > liberal, feminist > Martian I do see the difference between hurt and hurt. > > And from my non-existent moral ground I can still ask you > to please find the > story about Vivekanand in Khir Bhavani. If you're near > a library do look at > Civil Lines 5 (ed. Mukul Kesavan and Kai Friese). > You'll find an essay by > me called Spirit of Place. You'll find the Vivekanand > story there. Please > read it. > > I'll be happy to continue this conversation after. > > --sj > > > > > > On 8/27/08 5:54 AM, "Rahul Asthana" > wrote: > > > Sonia, > > > > A question to you.Don't you think someone else > deciding on what people should > > get hurt from;and what they shouldn't is a tad > condescending?When you see a > > person lying down on the road after an accident,do you > tell him that hey > > listen, you shouldn't really feel hurt or do you > try to resolve his\her > > situation? > > Its another thing to tell someone that they can stfu > and you don't care about > > how they feel.Thats insensitive at the worst.But I > don't see what moral ground > > a person has,to tell anyone else what they should feel > hurt from. > > For the same reason I don't get this debate on > nudity.How does it matter > > whether your mother or mine is okay with > that.According to a widely accepted > > social norm one can safely say that many people would > not be okay with a > > goddess painted nude and Hanuman's tail going > through her legs.So why not stop > > reducing this to freedom of expression and say that it > is in bad taste,because > > it offends the sensibilities of a group of people? > > By the way ,I had made a similar point on the Prophets > cartoons as well.The > > issue was highly distorted by the Western media.It > painted Muslims as some > > kind of crazy cave dwellers who would kill if someone > paints there prophet. > > There would sure be some people like that,but the > media made us fall prey to > > the binary.If you have to criticize the violence by > the fundoos you end up > > supporting the media's rally for the freedom of > expression.Its another matter > > that there are paintings of prophet in some Islamic > traditions,and Muslim > > anger was not against the painting of the prophet per > se but painting him in a > > bad light;and it was not a single incident but it took > place repeatedly,in an > > obvious in the face attempt to spite them.It stopped > being a matter of freedom > > of expression. > > One more point,Hussain being a Muslim and painting a > Hindu Goddess like that > > is important.Its perfectly human to have a group > identity and recognize other > > group identities as "the other".It does not > matter what my world view is,there > > shouldn't even be an argument on that.Just > recognize human tendencies and > > respect them,on the basis of what a large group of > people may feel. > > I feel that the more liberal a person becomes the more > intolerant that person > > becomes of others points of view.I am sure a devout > Muslim would find that > > painting offensive.If the media can be a little bit > less obsessed with their > > own world views and try to respect points of view of > other people and > > groups,for eg if a significant section of media had > come up and said that > > those paintings were offensive,perhaps such issues > would not flare up. > > > > regards > > Rahul > > > > > > --- On Mon, 8/25/08, S. Jabbar > wrote: > > > >> From: S. Jabbar > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition > Attacked in Delhi > >> To: "Prabhakar Singh" > , "Shuddhabrata > Sengupta" > >> , "Sarai" > > >> Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 8:25 PM > >> People have become rather emotional and touchy of > late. > >> Everyone seems to > >> have become hypersensitive and quick to take > offense-- of > >> course it helps if > >> there are TV cameras to record one's display > of piety. > >> > >> Is one's faith so fragile that a drawing or a > piece of > >> poetry or writing and > >> can shake it? Evidently so and mores the pity. > Why tear > >> down works of art > >> when it is faith that is crumbling? My > prescription is > >> twenty years of > >> solitary meditation in a cave in the Himalayas. > >> > >> Do you know the story of Swami Vivekanand who > stood in > >> front of the goddess > >> at Khir Bhavani? Look it up. It's > instructive. And > >> humbling. > >> > >> > >> On 8/25/08 7:52 PM, "Prabhakar Singh" > >> wrote: > >> > >>> Artists should be careful about the cultural > or > >> religious sensitivities of the > >>> people.Art can flourish even without delving > on such > >> sensitive and touchy > >>> issues which may have emotional importance for > some > >>> people. > >> Prabhakar > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ---- > >> From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > >>> > >> To: sarai list > >> Sent: Monday, 25 > >>> August, 2008 6:30:19 PM > >> Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked > in > >>> Delhi > >> > >> Dear all, > >> > >> Once again, with depressing, monotonous and > disgusting > >>> > >> predictability, a group of hooligans affiliated to > the > >> Hindutva > >> (Hindu > >>> Fundamentalist) agenda who call themselves the > >> 'Shri Ram Sena' > >> have attacked > >>> and ransacked a small exhibition in Delhi of > images > >> by > >> and about the > >>> nonegarian painter M. F. Husain, The > exhibition was > >> held on the premises of > >>> the office of the Safdar Hashmi Memorial > >> Trust (SAHMAT) in Delhi, to protest > >>> against the decision by the > >> orgnaizers of an Art Summit in Delhi to exclude > >>> work by Husain citing > >> reasons of security. This incident demonstrates, > yet > >>> again, how > >> inimical the forces of Hindutva are to an open > society and > >> to > >>> the > >> freedom of expression. > >> > >> See - > >>> > http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/Husain-photo- > >>> > >> exhibition-vandalised-yet-again/352835/ for a > report in the > >> Indian > >> Express > >>> that carries details of the incident. > >> > >> This list has discussed such attacks on > >>> freedom of expression before, > >> and just as we have had forthright criticism > >>> of Muslim > >> fundamentalists attacking Taslima Nasrin, and the > CPI (M) > >> led > >>> West > >> Bengal government making it impossible for her to > stay in > >> Kolkata, so > >>> > >> too, we must take into account this latest assault > on > >> cultural > >> liberty. I > >>> appeal to all to condemn this attack on the > freedom > >> of > >>> > >> expression. > >> > >> regards > >> > >> Shuddha > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> > >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media > and the > >> city. > >> Critiques & > >>> Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to > >> reader-list-request at sarai.net > >>> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: > >>> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > >>> > >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > >> > >> Be the first one to > >>> try the new Messenger 9 Beta! Go to > >>> http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/win/ > >> _________________________________________ > >> r > >>> eader-list: an open discussion list on media > and the > >> city. > >> Critiques & > >>> Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to > >> reader-list-request at sarai.net > >>> with subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: > >>> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > >>> > >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and > the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to > >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject > >> header. > >> To unsubscribe: > >> > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > >> > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:16:38 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:16:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 In-Reply-To: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> is it just me or is everyone getting a strange sense of deja vous?.....like the old hindi film line goes "Ji aapka chehra kuch jaana pehchaana sa lagta hai"....does chanchal not sound like our old friend dhatri (who incidentally we have not heard a sqeak out of for some time now)? who sounds like prabhakar, who sometimes sounds like radhikarajen, who for a time we thought was vedavati.... Is it a computer programme? Or a cloning initiative by the RSS? Fascinating! A On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:33 AM, chanchal malviya < chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com> wrote: > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > Religion.. > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please do > not visit the topic... > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Kuhu Tanvir > To: reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > Re: Chanchal > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books > and > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be naive > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like > this. > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't > waste your time or the patience of others. > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about other > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature of > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we have > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > extremists. > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being heard > on > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > vedavati > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > wrote: > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive > > side > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own > > mother > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > intention > > as > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the > same > > for > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person > > would > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > > concept of > > motherland. > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > > text > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because > > India > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people > > like > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What > I > > told > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > > came > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > Sanatan > > Dharma. > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma > and > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous > > duty > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > > teaches > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > > this, > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > towards > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't > cover > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they > knew > > that > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took > cover > > when > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. > > And > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. > And > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > understand > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > > their > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > > (Hindu > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > > thing. > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only > > with > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > attitude. He > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or > > if > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > > photograph > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many > > of you > > are not of double standard. > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: A Khanna > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > you will find it interesting. > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > exists in texts > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > 'Hindu'. > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > Husain' is > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > fascinating. > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > also makes steel. > > > > > > Love, > > > > akshay > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my > dear > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of > Islam... > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they are > > non-Muslims... > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and Allah > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read > Quran > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > > Quran... > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with you... > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, > etc) > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands > Infidels > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from History > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war > till > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by > Muslims > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not learnt > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of hatred... And > we > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > Secularism... > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world point > to > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at > all.. > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... Or > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is Allah... > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs and > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... > same > > story is with Christians also.... > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of > all > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human > to > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu > and > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri devo, > > pitra devo.. > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches selfless > > duty > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is > the > > approach > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is the > > culture of HIndus > > and so many things... > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. > though > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, if > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 3 > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > From: chanchal malviya > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > Poonch > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be removed. > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus > will > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > > us... > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be > told > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people > who > > oppose it are terrorists... > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without a > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun to > > fight the Adharma... > > > > You know a secret... > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > To: sarai list > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > Hindus > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > consequences* > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > King C Bharati > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started its > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus migrating > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > belonging > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > been > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims attacked > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the district > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern for > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans are > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > employees in presence of police. > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > Pakistani > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > ever > > communal violence in this border district. > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > have > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas are > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > from > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > help > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were mute > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans besides > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > that > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting anti-India > > and > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > serious > > consequences. > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > removed > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they tried > to > > remove the posters. > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > which > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > crippled > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration Poonch > is > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > reader-list mailing list > > reader-list at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > ******************************************** > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 18:19:34 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 05:49:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Civil Society calls for International Intervention in Kashmir Message-ID: <419054.57869.qm@web31805.mail.mud.yahoo.com> APPEAL   Civil society calls for international intervention in Kashmir   Srinagar, Aug 27: In view of the deteriorating humanitarian situation and the media black out of the events in Kashmir, we call upon the international humanitarian agencies, particularly the UN bodies and world press to intervene immediately to prevent a humanitarian catastrophe in Kashmir.   Owing to the strict curfew, hundreds of the injured lying in various hospitals of Kashmir, are not able to get critical medicines and the attendants are without food.   Due to the aggressive enforcement of the curfew, the sick and injured (by the Indian armed forces) are not able to reach hospitals, resulting in deaths. Attendants of dozens of dead in various hospitals in Kashmir are awaiting their transportation to their homes for the final rites. Two pregnant women died since yesterday when the ambulances carrying them where disallowed by the Indian armed forces to reach maternity hospitals. Beating up of the drivers of the ambulances and their inability to reach hospitals has compounded the situation. Medical personnel of various hospitals in Kashmir are not able to attend their duties as identity cards and curfew passes are not being honored by the hostile troops deployed on the streets.   There is a serious dearth of medicines, baby milk, food stuff, milk and other essential commodities in the market due to the curfew and the blockade of the only road link to Kashmir. In view of the four days of stringent restrictions on people's movement and heavy clampdown by the state forces across the 10 districts of Kashmir, including Srinagar city, we appeal the international community to ask the government of India to immediately ease curfew restrictions so that people are able to access basic essentials. Children going without milk and the sick without medicines are matters of serious concern.   We condemn the use of heavy force to thwart peaceful protests, resulting in killings of 50 civilians in Kashmir. We also condemn the violent attack allegedly by militants in Jammu on Wednesday which has resulted in the death of three innocent civilians.   The flow of information has completely stopped for the first time in the history of Kashmir and no newspaper has been able to publish in last 3 days, because of these indiscriminate restrictions imposed by the government. The communications blockade has been compounded by the banning of news and current affairs programs on local cable TV channels, and ban on sms services. Such communications blockade is resulting in loss of news about the unfolding events, black out of significant happenings in Kashmir's country side – where currently media has no access – and which is tightly controlled by the army. We call upon the international community to call upon the government of India to lift the communications blockade without any delay.    Signed by:   Jammu and Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Resturant Owners Federation, Valley Citizen’s Council (Zareef Ahmed Zareef), Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee, Ahad Zargar Research Foundation, Himayat Trust, JK People’s Development Trust, Kashmir Thinker’s Guild, Dr. Altaf Hussain, Dr. Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), Prof. N.A. Baba (Faculty of Political Science, University of Kashmir), Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), Z.G. Mohammad (Columnist), Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist), Noorul Hassan (Ex-Chief Conservator), Jamiat Hamdania, Firdous Education Trust for Orphans, Doda Peace Forum, Poonch Initiave for Peace and Justice, Ehsaas (A Developmental Organisation)   From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:27:27 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:27:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> References: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270557j32988862n38c6466e322aeec7@mail.gmail.com> You are so right for a change. Its just you. So, time a check up is done ? :) On 8/27/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > > is it just me or is everyone getting a strange sense of deja vous?.....like > the old hindi film line goes "Ji aapka chehra kuch jaana pehchaana sa lagta > hai"....does chanchal not sound like our old friend dhatri (who > incidentally > we have not heard a sqeak out of for some time now)? who sounds like > prabhakar, who sometimes sounds like radhikarajen, who for a time we > thought > was vedavati.... > > Is it a computer programme? Or a cloning initiative by the RSS? > Fascinating! > > A > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:33 AM, chanchal malviya < > chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com> wrote: > > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > > Religion.. > > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please do > > not visit the topic... > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Kuhu Tanvir > > To: reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > Re: Chanchal > > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history books > > and > > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be > naive > > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and that > > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to make > > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like > > this. > > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't > > waste your time or the patience of others. > > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about > other > > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the stature > of > > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we > have > > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, wrote: > > > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > (chanchal malviya) > > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > Message: 1 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > > extremists. > > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being > heard > > on > > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > > > vedavati > > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > > wrote: > > > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the > positive > > > side > > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their > own > > > mother > > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > > intention > > > as > > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains > in > > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the > > same > > > for > > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such > person > > > would > > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > > > concept of > > > motherland. > > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the > > > text > > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. > Because > > > India > > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, > people > > > like > > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. > What > > I > > > told > > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word > > > came > > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > > Sanatan > > > Dharma. > > > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma > > and > > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means > Righteous > > > duty > > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and > > > teaches > > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing > > > this, > > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say > > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > > towards > > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't > > cover > > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they > > knew > > > that > > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took > > cover > > > when > > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for > sex. > > > And > > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. > > And > > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found > Hindu > > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > > understand > > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per > > > their > > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses > > > (Hindu > > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same > > > thing. > > > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland > only > > > with > > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > > attitude. He > > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have > a > > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this > matter. > > > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. > Or > > > if > > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > > > photograph > > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how > many > > > of you > > > are not of double standard. > > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own > > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: A Khanna > > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > > you will find it interesting. > > > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > > exists in texts > > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > > 'Hindu'. > > > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > > Husain' is > > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > > fascinating. > > > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > > also makes steel. > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > akshay > > > > > > -- > > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in > > > the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > Message: 2 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > > Poonch > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But my > > dear > > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of > > Islam... > > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they > are > > > non-Muslims... > > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and > Allah > > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read > > Quran > > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > > > Quran... > > > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with > you... > > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, > > etc) > > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands > > Infidels > > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from > History > > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence war > > till > > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by > > Muslims > > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not > learnt > > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of > hatred... And > > we > > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India also > > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > > Secularism... > > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not answer... > > > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world > point > > to > > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist at > > all.. > > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to Islam... > Or > > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is > Allah... > > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs > and > > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... > > same > > > story is with Christians also.... > > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and outside > > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary of > > all > > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks human > > to > > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a Hindu > > and > > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri > devo, > > > pitra devo.. > > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches > selfless > > > duty > > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika is > > the > > > approach > > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is > the > > > culture of HIndus > > > and so many things... > > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. > > though > > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, > if > > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > > To: sarai list > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > Hindus > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > > consequences* > > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > > > King C Bharati > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started > its > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus > migrating > > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > > belonging > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > > been > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims > attacked > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the > district > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern > for > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans > are > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > > employees in presence of police. > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > > Pakistani > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > > ever > > > communal violence in this border district. > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > > have > > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas > are > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > > from > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > > help > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were > mute > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans > besides > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > > that > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting > anti-India > > > and > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > > serious > > > consequences. > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > > removed > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they > tried > > to > > > remove the posters. > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > > which > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > > crippled > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration > Poonch > > is > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > Message: 3 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > > Poonch > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, and > > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be > removed. > > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we Hindus > > will > > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come for > > > us... > > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be > > told > > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and people > > who > > > oppose it are terrorists... > > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard without > a > > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them Arjun > to > > > fight the Adharma... > > > > > > You know a secret... > > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > > To: sarai list > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > Hindus > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > > consequences* > > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > > > King C Bharati > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started > its > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus > migrating > > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > > belonging > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote have > > > been > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims > attacked > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the > district > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern > for > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans > are > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > > employees in presence of police. > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > > Pakistani > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the worst > > > ever > > > communal violence in this border district. > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems to > > > have > > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas > are > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > > from > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were burnt. > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > > help > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were > mute > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding the > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans > besides > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources said > > > that > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting > anti-India > > > and > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > > serious > > > consequences. > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > > removed > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they > tried > > to > > > remove the posters. > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > > which > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > > crippled > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration > Poonch > > is > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > reader-list mailing list > > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > > ******************************************** > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:35:16 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:35:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Civil Society calls for International Intervention in Kashmir In-Reply-To: <419054.57869.qm@web31805.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <419054.57869.qm@web31805.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270605s53cf56f7hf0e36c123beb9fd0@mail.gmail.com> Khurram bhai, Aren't you even ashamed to spread lies !!!! ??? Get over this myth of economic blockade. Place a new strategy now to gain sympathy. Your 'communal propaganda' is exposed in front of the world. Violence and Killing elsewhere wasn't enough that they sent terrorists to kill innocents in Jammu and have taken innocent children and women hostage. Is this what aazadi means ? Secularists why are you silent ? Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/27/08, Khurram Parvez wrote: > > APPEAL > > Civil society calls for international intervention in Kashmir > > Srinagar, Aug 27: In view of the deteriorating humanitarian situation and > the media black out of the events in Kashmir, we call upon the international > humanitarian agencies, particularly the UN bodies and world press to > intervene immediately to prevent a humanitarian catastrophe in Kashmir. > > Owing to the strict curfew, hundreds of the injured lying in various > hospitals of Kashmir, are not able to get critical medicines and the > attendants are without food. > > Due to the aggressive enforcement of the curfew, the sick and injured (by > the Indian armed forces) are not able to reach hospitals, resulting in > deaths. Attendants of dozens of dead in various hospitals in Kashmir are > awaiting their transportation to their homes for the final rites. Two > pregnant women died since yesterday when the ambulances carrying them where > disallowed by the Indian armed forces to reach maternity hospitals. Beating > up of the drivers of the ambulances and their inability to reach hospitals > has compounded the situation. Medical personnel of various hospitals in > Kashmir are not able to attend their duties as identity cards and curfew > passes are not being honored by the hostile troops deployed on the streets. > > There is a serious dearth of medicines, baby milk, food stuff, milk and > other essential commodities in the market due to the curfew and the blockade > of the only road link to Kashmir. In view of the four days of stringent > restrictions on people's movement and heavy clampdown by the state forces > across the 10 districts of Kashmir, including Srinagar city, we appeal the > international community to ask the government of India to immediately ease > curfew restrictions so that people are able to access basic essentials. > Children going without milk and the sick without medicines are matters of > serious concern. > > We condemn the use of heavy force to thwart peaceful protests, resulting in > killings of 50 civilians in Kashmir. We also condemn the violent attack > allegedly by militants in Jammu on Wednesday which has resulted in the death > of three innocent civilians. > > The flow of information has completely stopped for the first time in the > history of Kashmir and no newspaper has been able to publish in last 3 days, > because of these indiscriminate restrictions imposed by the government. The > communications blockade has been compounded by the banning of news and > current affairs programs on local cable TV channels, and ban on sms > services. Such communications blockade is resulting in loss of news about > the unfolding events, black out of significant happenings in Kashmir's > country side – where currently media has no access – and which is tightly > controlled by the army. We call upon the international community to call > upon the government of India to lift the communications blockade without any > delay. > > Signed by: > > Jammu and Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and > Industries Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Resturant Owners Federation, Valley > Citizen's Council (Zareef Ahmed Zareef), Naagar Nagar Coordination > Committee, Ahad Zargar Research Foundation, Himayat Trust, JK People's > Development Trust, Kashmir Thinker's Guild, Dr. Altaf Hussain, Dr. Shaikh > Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), Prof. N.A. Baba > (Faculty of Political Science, University of Kashmir), Arjimand Hussain > Talib (Columnist), Z.G. Mohammad (Columnist), Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social > Activist), Noorul Hassan (Ex-Chief Conservator), Jamiat Hamdania, Firdous > Education Trust for Orphans, Doda Peace Forum, Poonch Initiave for Peace and > Justice, Ehsaas (A Developmental Organisation) > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:40:27 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:40:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Islamic Terrorists' take women, children hostage in Jammu Message-ID: <6353c690808270610sbbf36ddn4003d0156432020f@mail.gmail.com> *Terrorists take women, children hostage in Jammu* NDTV Correspondent Wednesday, August 27, 2008, (Jammu) As the encounter between security forces and terrorists in Jammu intensifies, militants took hostage four children and three women. Security forces are evacuating people from the neighbouring houses. However, the operation to flush out the terrorists has slowed down because the area is thickly populated. The people living there have been hearing gunshots since morning. Describing the scenario a woman living in the vicinity said, "We heard a gunshot. We have not seen a militant. We have just heard that they have infiltrated here. First we heard a sound. We got up at five in the morning. The Army is outside our gate. Our house is as it is open. We don't even have a gate. We were scared since morning as to how should we get out. The Army people told us to leave the place for some investigation. So we came outside." On being asked who all are inside the house, the woman said, "A couple and their kids are there. I don't know if they have managed to get out. A man came out. He said something to the other man, I don't know what he said." Meanwhile, the security forces have managed to kill one of the three terrorists who are hiding in a residential building in the Bantalab area in heart of Jammu city. The Army's operation is being hampered by the presence of some children and women in the house. Early on Wednesday morning, three terrorists dressed as policemen entered the Mishriwala area and fired indiscriminately, killing four people and injuring two security personnel. The four killed include three civilians and an Army personnel. The terrorists then escaped to the Bantalab area of Jammu and took shelter in a house there where the encounter is now on. The terrorists are believed to be the same men who infiltrated the international border on Tuesday. So the worst fears of the security forces seem to be coming true as terrorists are clearly taking advantage of the months of unrest in Jammu and Kashmir over the Amarnath issue. As per the Home Ministry sources, there have been three major infiltrations from Pakistan since the Amarnath crisis began. Government sources also said that Hizbul was looking for reinforcement from Pakistan as its top cadre are killed. In 2007, there had been 72 incidents of infiltration while in 2008, there have been 48 incidents of infiltration along the international border till now. From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 18:43:00 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:13:00 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> References: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Aarti, it is indeed fascinating isnt it. ? On 1947, one pandit being PM of the nation, secular, democratic, talked of tryst with destiny, but did little for millions of pandits butchered in Kasmir, who were refugees in their own nation. Today, let anyone touch one hindu, all will rise as one, from divisive strategies to fight the ill, forgetting the caste and remembering that we are hindu, proud to be hindu. It was six decades of decayed governance of appeasement, divisive tricks of the oldest party, which always talked of equity and justice, but saw to it that good of democracy was delivered to favoured few, as polity was politically naive, slogans riled the game, today, with political awareness, each of us know the story of sons and a father who gave his sons a stick each to break, but sons could not break the sticks when they were together, single caste sticks can be broken easily.? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Aarti Sethi Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 6:17 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 To: chanchal malviya Cc: reader-list at sarai.net, Kuhu Tanvir > is it just me or is everyone getting a strange sense of deja > vous?.....likethe old hindi film line goes "Ji aapka chehra kuch > jaana pehchaana sa lagta > hai"....does chanchal not sound like our old friend dhatri (who > incidentallywe have not heard a sqeak out of for some time now)? > who sounds like > prabhakar, who sometimes sounds like radhikarajen, who for a time > we thought > was vedavati.... > > Is it a computer programme? Or a cloning initiative by the RSS? > Fascinating! > A > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:33 AM, chanchal malviya < > chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com> wrote: > > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > > Religion.. > > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else > please do > > not visit the topic... > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Kuhu Tanvir > > To: reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > Re: Chanchal > > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few > history books > > and > > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please > don't be naive > > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal > and that > > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right > to make > > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate > comments like > > this. > > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so > please don't > > waste your time or the patience of others. > > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks > about other > > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the > stature of > > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful > that we have > > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, request at sarai.net> wrote: > > > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more > specific> > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > (chanchal malviya) > > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- > > > > > > Message: 1 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > > extremists. > > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are > being heard > > on > > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > > > vedavati > > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > > wrote: > > > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take > the positive > > > side > > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape > their own > > > mother > > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > > intention > > > as > > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else > explains in > > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also > feel the > > same > > > for > > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that > such person > > > would > > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the > broader> > concept of > > > motherland. > > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized > through the > > > text > > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of > people. Because > > > India > > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of > course, people > > > like > > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in > India. What > > I > > > told > > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, > this word > > > came > > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the > people of > > > Sanatan > > > Dharma. > > > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference > between Dharma > > and > > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means > Righteous> > duty > > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is > science and > > > teaches > > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is > recognizing> > this, > > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will > come and say > > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through > various> > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an > important step > > > towards > > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude > didn't> cover > > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, > because they > > knew > > > that > > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they > immediately took > > cover > > > when > > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by > Apsaras for sex. > > > And > > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful > natural factor. > > And > > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have > found Hindu > > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > > understand > > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they > like as per > > > their > > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right > hand posses > > > (Hindu > > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are > the same > > > thing. > > > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his > motherland only > > > with > > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > > attitude. He > > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film > stars have a > > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in > this matter. > > > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his > mother. Or > > > if > > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please > send a > > > photograph > > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me > see, how many > > > of you > > > are not of double standard. > > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing > your own > > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: A Khanna > > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your > rather> > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope > some of > > > you will find it interesting. > > > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's > gratuitous> > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more > broadly, the > > > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the > terms> > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this > is a > > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. > What> > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is > not erotic in > > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who > brought> > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is > the fear of the > > > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave > eroticism away > > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if > you like, > > > in different parts of the country and in different communities > in the > > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is > even in > > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, > attempts> > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often > textual,> > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one > peculiar vision > > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > > exists in texts > > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses > (particularly> > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands > miles away from various > > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > > 'Hindu'. > > > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and > eroticism I > > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and > sexualness are > > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too > many of > > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism > as an > > > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just > me or > > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a > reading of > > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth > of the > > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar > vision of > > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It > sounds to me > > > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is > yet to > > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it > through> > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather > fragile stories > > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do > so.)> > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not > love the > > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or > disgust> > with the self or some other trauma that brings about > such anxiety > > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the > representation of > > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – > it seems > > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has > caused this > > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > > Husain' is > > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you > probably> > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us > were, as > > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and > i'm not > > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. > I for > > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced > as many > > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a > 'people', a > > > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of > competing and > > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a > woman.> > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were > unfortunately> > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this > metaphor is truly > > > fascinating. > > > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to > images> > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, > please share > > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then > brought out > > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the > attackers not > > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then > what it > > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened > the power > > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course > that once > > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested > space.> > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the > likes of > > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this > metaphor that > > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so > aggressive?> > What is the power of this metaphor? One of > prabhakar's email hits the > > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions > to public > > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense > (sic)> > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand > that the > > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that > she may > > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety > around the > > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side > to her. > > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your > mother> > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a > body that is her > > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps > hear of) > > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is > it this > > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers > itself> > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured > around an > > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in > nationalist> > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to > sexualness of women, as > > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire > being a > > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > >sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, > or, a > > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual > rape? The > > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the > lives of > > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the > recognition of > > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the > success of > > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady > emotion> > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. > (yes, i cried > > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, > experienced> > the power of Mother India, and surely all that > investment by the state > > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever > entails> > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other > words to invest > > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India > to bear > > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who > laughs,> > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, > and, sigh, S/he > > > also makes steel. > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > akshay > > > > > > -- > > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in > > > the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list> > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > Message: 2 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from > Dhalera to > > > Poonch > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to > Jammu.... But my > > dear > > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only > face of > > Islam... > > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told > clearly that > > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam > if they are > > > non-Muslims... > > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims > and Allah > > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will > not read > > Quran > > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also > didn't read > > > Quran... > > > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened > with you... > > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, > Akbarnama,> etc) > > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 > thousands> Infidels > > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn > from History > > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of > support to > > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight > Independence war > > till > > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were > massacred by > > Muslims > > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma > Sambhava'...> > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma > means duty.. not learnt > > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of > hatred... And > > we > > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In > India also > > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > > Secularism... > > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not > answer...> > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this > world point > > to > > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not > exist at > > all.. > > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to > Islam... Or > > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name > is Allah... > > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off > other GODs and > > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other > GODs...> same > > > story is with Christians also.... > > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and > outside> > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing > GOD in every > > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the > boundary of > > all > > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and > asks human > > to > > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to > be a Hindu > > and > > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is > matri devo, > > > pitra devo.. > > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta > teaches selfless > > > duty > > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as > Sattvika is > > the > > > approach > > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as > that is the > > > culture of HIndus > > > and so many things... > > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are > Hindus..> though > > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or > Christians, if > > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > > To: sarai list > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera > to Poonch > > > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > Hindus > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > > > consequences*> > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > > > King C Bharati > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has > started its > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus > migrating> > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops > and one house > > > belonging > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in > Surankote have > > > been > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have > finally> > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of > Muslims attacked > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration > remained> > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city > the district > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little > concern for > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where > hooligans are > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some > government> > employees in presence of police. > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > > Pakistani > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning > the worst > > > ever > > > communal violence in this border district. > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris > seems to > > > have > > > no time for this remote district even as the local > administration has > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and > Dhalera areas are > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having > migrated> from > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses > were burnt. > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media > seeking> help > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub- > inspectors were mute > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday > adding the > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist > hooligans who > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India > slogans besides > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where > sources said > > > that > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting > anti-India > > > and > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > > serious > > > consequences. > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which > were> removed > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after > they tried > > to > > > remove the posters. > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch > Challo call > > which > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > > crippled > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of > migration Poonch > > is > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list> > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > Message: 3 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from > Dhalera to > > > Poonch > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human > Rights, and > > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must > be removed. > > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - > we Hindus > > will > > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to > come for > > > us... > > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we > will be > > told > > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, > and people > > who > > > oppose it are terrorists... > > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a > beard without a > > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make > them Arjun to > > > fight the Adharma... > > > > > > You know a secret... > > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > > To: sarai list > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera > to Poonch > > > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > Hindus > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > > > consequences*> > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > > > King C Bharati > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has > started its > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus > migrating> > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops > and one house > > > belonging > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in > Surankote have > > > been > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have > finally> > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of > Muslims attacked > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration > remained> > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city > the district > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little > concern for > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where > hooligans are > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some > government> > employees in presence of police. > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > > Pakistani > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning > the worst > > > ever > > > communal violence in this border district. > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris > seems to > > > have > > > no time for this remote district even as the local > administration has > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and > Dhalera areas are > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having > migrated> from > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses > were burnt. > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media > seeking> help > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub- > inspectors were mute > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday > adding the > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist > hooligans who > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India > slogans besides > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where > sources said > > > that > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting > anti-India > > > and > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > > serious > > > consequences. > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which > were> removed > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after > they tried > > to > > > remove the posters. > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch > Challo call > > which > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > > crippled > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of > migration Poonch > > is > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list> > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > reader-list mailing list > > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > > ******************************************** > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 18:45:41 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:15:41 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: <341590.24695.qm@web94707.mail.in2.yahoo.com> References: <463495.91832.qm@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> <341590.24695.qm@web94707.mail.in2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hey, you forgot something else, Sania took her mother as manager, had perfect health to pose for her sponsors, now falling down at rank70 in tennis, is another example of pampered indian, who has forgotten what game is after crores in kitty.? ----- Original Message ----- From: hasina hasan Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 4:06 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians To: sarai , sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > ...we are also modestly good at: > - whining about winning > - sighing at large on the state of our state. > > we from > our pc's here to anothers' there, say write: 'hey why you think > that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear me for i speak well > and have a nobler > view'. > (see me here now) > > or > was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny images that never got > attached > > > > --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima wrote: > From: S.Fatima > Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians > To: "sarai" > Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM > > Some people say that Indians are peace-loving people and never > offend/invade any > body. (Some say Indians never invaded others for last 10,000 > years!). But in > Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win medals in the most > offendeinggames: > > Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting > > Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling > > Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing > > Does it mean that we are good only in shooting, wresting and > boxing others > down. > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: > > > Bollywood news, movie reviews, film trailers and more! Go to > http://in.movies.yahoo.com/_________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:50:01 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:50:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 In-Reply-To: <6353c690808270557j32988862n38c6466e322aeec7@mail.gmail.com> References: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808270557j32988862n38c6466e322aeec7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808270620lef4db69xb6ddb9c3b330d9ce@mail.gmail.com> freud had a wonderful term for this aditya which you would do well to reflect on: the narcissim of minor difference he called it. unfortunately the subtle nuanced difference between dhatri's bakwas and chanchal's nonsense escapes me, but of course you are the prime aesthetician of rabid right-wing venom :) On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:27 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > You are so right for a change. Its just you. So, time a check up is done ? > :) > > On 8/27/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > > > > is it just me or is everyone getting a strange sense of deja > vous?.....like > > the old hindi film line goes "Ji aapka chehra kuch jaana pehchaana sa > lagta > > hai"....does chanchal not sound like our old friend dhatri (who > > incidentally > > we have not heard a sqeak out of for some time now)? who sounds like > > prabhakar, who sometimes sounds like radhikarajen, who for a time we > > thought > > was vedavati.... > > > > Is it a computer programme? Or a cloning initiative by the RSS? > > Fascinating! > > > > A > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:33 AM, chanchal malviya < > > chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... > > > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu > > > Religion.. > > > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. > > > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please > do > > > not visit the topic... > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Kuhu Tanvir > > > To: reader-list at sarai.net > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > > > > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > Re: Chanchal > > > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history > books > > > and > > > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be > > naive > > > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and > that > > > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to > make > > > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like > > > this. > > > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please don't > > > waste your time or the patience of others. > > > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about > > other > > > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the > stature > > of > > > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we > > have > > > to hear the voices of the likes of you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, > wrote: > > > > > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to > > > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net > > > > > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net > > > > > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." > > > > > > > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > > > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) > > > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > (chanchal malviya) > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > Message: 1 > > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) > > > > From: Vedavati Jogi > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com > > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! > > > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. > > > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim > > > > extremists. > > > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being > > heard > > > on > > > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' > > > > > > > > vedavati > > > > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < > > > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> > > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net > > > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM > > > > > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the > > positive > > > > side > > > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their > > own > > > > mother > > > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their > > > intention > > > > as > > > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. > > > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else > explains > > in > > > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the > > > same > > > > for > > > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such > > person > > > > would > > > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader > > > > concept of > > > > motherland. > > > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through > the > > > > text > > > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. > > Because > > > > India > > > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, > > people > > > > like > > > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. > > What > > > I > > > > told > > > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this > word > > > > came > > > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > > > Sanatan > > > > Dharma. > > > > > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between > Dharma > > > and > > > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means > > Righteous > > > > duty > > > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science > and > > > > teaches > > > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is > recognizing > > > > this, > > > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and > say > > > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > > > towards > > > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't > > > cover > > > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they > > > knew > > > > that > > > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took > > > cover > > > > when > > > > Veda Vyas crossed. > > > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for > > sex. > > > > And > > > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural > factor. > > > And > > > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found > > Hindu > > > > society also marrying multitude of women. > > > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > > > understand > > > > and ask me stupid questions. > > > > > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as > per > > > > their > > > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand > posses > > > > (Hindu > > > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the > same > > > > thing. > > > > > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland > > only > > > > with > > > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic > > > > attitude. He > > > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars > have > > a > > > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his > mother. > > Or > > > > if > > > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a > > > > photograph > > > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how > > many > > > > of you > > > > are not of double standard. > > > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your > own > > > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > > From: A Khanna > > > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim > > > > ; reader-list at sarai.net > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > > > you will find it interesting. > > > > > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's > gratuitous > > > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > > > > > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of > the > > > > > > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it > > > > exists in texts > > > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > > > > > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > > > 'Hindu'. > > > > > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > > > > > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to > me > > > > > > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile > stories > > > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it > seems > > > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted > > > > Husain' is > > > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > > > > > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > > > fascinating. > > > > > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what > it > > > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to > public > > > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around > the > > > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to > her. > > > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is > her > > > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, > as > > > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success > of > > > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady > emotion > > > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the > state > > > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to > invest > > > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who > laughs, > > > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > > > also makes steel. > > > > > > > > > > > > Love, > > > > > > > > akshay > > > > > > > > -- > > > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in > > > > the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > Message: 2 > > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > > > Poonch > > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > > > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > > > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But > my > > > dear > > > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... > > > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of > > > Islam... > > > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that > > > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they > > are > > > > non-Muslims... > > > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and > > Allah > > > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw > > > > non-Muslims into that fire... > > > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read > > > Quran > > > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't read > > > > Quran... > > > > > > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with > > you... > > > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... > > > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, Akbarnama, > > > etc) > > > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands > > > Infidels > > > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from > > History > > > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. > > > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to > > > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence > war > > > till > > > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by > > > Muslims > > > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. > > > > > > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma Sambhava'... > > > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not > > learnt > > > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of > > hatred... And > > > we > > > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... > > > > > > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India > also > > > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting > > > Secularism... > > > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... > > > > > > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not > answer... > > > > > > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world > > point > > > to > > > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist > at > > > all.. > > > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to > Islam... > > Or > > > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is > > Allah... > > > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs > > and > > > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other GODs... > > > same > > > > story is with Christians also.... > > > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and > outside > > > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every > > > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary > of > > > all > > > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks > human > > > to > > > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a > Hindu > > > and > > > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: > > > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri > > devo, > > > > pitra devo.. > > > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches > > selfless > > > > duty > > > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika > is > > > the > > > > approach > > > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is > > the > > > > culture of HIndus > > > > and so many things... > > > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. > > > though > > > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or Christians, > > if > > > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > To: sarai list > > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > > > > > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > Hindus > > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > > > consequences* > > > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > > > > > King C Bharati > > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started > > its > > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus > > migrating > > > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > > > belonging > > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote > have > > > > been > > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims > > attacked > > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the > > district > > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern > > for > > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans > > are > > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > > > employees in presence of police. > > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > > > Pakistani > > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the > worst > > > > ever > > > > communal violence in this border district. > > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems > to > > > > have > > > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas > > are > > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > > > from > > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were > burnt. > > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > > > help > > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were > > mute > > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding > the > > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans > > besides > > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources > said > > > > that > > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting > > anti-India > > > > and > > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > > > serious > > > > consequences. > > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > > > removed > > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they > > tried > > > to > > > > remove the posters. > > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > > > which > > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > > > crippled > > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration > > Poonch > > > is > > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > Message: 3 > > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) > > > > From: chanchal malviya > > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > > > > Poonch > > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list > > > > > > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > > > > > Dear Aditya, > > > > > > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, > and > > > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be > > removed. > > > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we > Hindus > > > will > > > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come > for > > > > us... > > > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will be > > > told > > > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and > people > > > who > > > > oppose it are terrorists... > > > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard > without > > a > > > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them > Arjun > > to > > > > fight the Adharma... > > > > > > > > You know a secret... > > > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... > > > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. > > > > You can understand rest of the things.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > To: sarai list > > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM > > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to > Poonch > > > > > > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch > > > > Hindus > > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face > > > > consequences* > > > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - > > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 > > > > > > > > King C Bharati > > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started > > its > > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus > > migrating > > > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house > > > > belonging > > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote > have > > > > been > > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. > > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have finally > > > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims > > attacked > > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration remained > > > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. > > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the > > district > > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little concern > > for > > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where hooligans > > are > > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government > > > > employees in presence of police. > > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling > > > > Pakistani > > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the > worst > > > > ever > > > > communal violence in this border district. > > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems > to > > > > have > > > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration has > > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., > > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our > > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera areas > > are > > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having migrated > > > from > > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were > burnt. > > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media seeking > > > help > > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. > > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were > > mute > > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding > the > > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans who > > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans > > besides > > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. > > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources > said > > > > that > > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting > > anti-India > > > > and > > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face > > > serious > > > > consequences. > > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were > > > removed > > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they > > tried > > > to > > > > remove the posters. > > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call > > > which > > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. > > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration > > > crippled > > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration > > Poonch > > > is > > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > reader-list mailing list > > > > reader-list at sarai.net > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > > > > > > > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 > > > > ******************************************** > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:50:51 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:50:51 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: References: <463495.91832.qm@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> <341590.24695.qm@web94707.mail.in2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270620w4e8369dds163cfe79290aadcb@mail.gmail.com> Fatima, You forgot the most important sport; though not in Olympics till now. You are the best in shooting mails; offending ofcourse. Be in London for the next Olympics; Gold is there waiting... Cheers Aditya Raj Kaul On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > > Hey, you forgot something else, Sania took her mother as manager, had > perfect health to pose for her sponsors, now falling down at rank70 in > tennis, is another example of pampered indian, who has forgotten what game > is after crores in kitty.? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: hasina hasan > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 4:06 pm > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians > To: sarai , sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > ...we are also modestly good at: > > - whining about winning > > - sighing at large on the state of our state. > > > > we from > > our pc's here to anothers' there, say write: 'hey why you think > > that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear me for i speak well > > and have a nobler > > view'. > > (see me here now) > > > > or > > was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny images that never got > > attached > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima wrote: > > From: S.Fatima > > Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians > > To: "sarai" > > Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM > > > > Some people say that Indians are peace-loving people and never > > offend/invade any > > body. (Some say Indians never invaded others for last 10,000 > > years!). But in > > Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win medals in the most > > offendeinggames: > > > > Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting > > > > Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling > > > > Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing > > > > Does it mean that we are good only in shooting, wresting and > > boxing others > > down. > > > > > > > > > > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > list > > List archive: > > > > > > Bollywood news, movie reviews, film trailers and more! Go to > > http://in.movies.yahoo.com/_________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > list > > List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 18:50:07 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:50:07 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Attacks on Doctors, Ambulances and Hospitals in Kashmir Message-ID: <60FA18BF-8DE3-43FC-8738-408B13BCB79F@sarai.net> Dear all, Even the Geneva Convention, which prescribes rules of conduct during war and armed conflict, enjoins armed personnel not to attack doctors, nurses, paramedics, hospitals and ambulances. India is a party to the Geneva Convention, (not though to the additional protocols which govern conflict situations involving non- state actors). The situation in the Kashmir valley cannot be called a 'conflict' situation at the moment, because the guns are only in the hands of the forces of the Indian state. And even if it were a bona fide 'conflict situation' then too, the conduct of the Indian state's armed forces in the Kashmir valley - with regard to attacks on doctors, nurses, paramedics, hospitals and ambulances, cannot but be condemned in the harshest of terms. Not only are the armed forces of the Indian state firing upon unarmed crowds (and 8 deaths have so far occurred in the last two days alone from this firing in an attempt to brutally enforce an indefinite curfew, apart from the around 30 deaths that occurred earlier during the marches on the road to Muzaffarabad). They are also attacking those who are tending to the sick and the wounded. We have so far had targetted attacks on journalists, and now on doctors and health workers. How low can the Indian state stoop to keep its rule by force operational in Kashmir? Please see below, two reports from the Greater Kashmir, and the Indian Express, about the attacks on health workers, doctors, nurses, ambulances and medical facilities. regards Shuddha ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------------- 1. ICRC comes to rescue of B & J Hospital http://www.greaterkashmir.com/full_story.asp? Date=27_8_2008&ItemID=11&cat=1 Greater Kashmir, August 27, 2008 Patients, attendants face tough time as curfew, blockade continues FAHEEM ASLAM/ARSHAD BHAT/ARIF SHAFI WANI Srinagar, Aug 26: An international non-governmental organization on Tuesday came to the rescue of the Valley's lone trauma centre—Bone and Joint Hospital at Barzulla—after it completely ran out of the essential medical supplies due to blockade and curfew. Sources said the International Committee for Red Cross (ICRC) provided the necessary medical supplies like cotton, bandage and IV drip sets to the hospital this afternoon after its authorities sought the organisation's support. "We had no medical supplies and equipments in store, not even cotton and bandage," they said. "Then the ICRC provided some 2000 pounds of cotton besides other essentials to the hospital." Many senior doctors, who spoke to Greater Kashmir, said the ICRC airlifted consignment for the hospital from Jammu and Delhi. "We are thankful to them for coming to our rescue during the present crisis," the doctors, wishing anonymity, said. The doctors warned that the stocks will completely last in two weeks. "After that, the hospital shall be virtually defunct," they said.They believe the blockade to the Valley was a major cause of the shortage of medical supplies in the hospital, which normally should have been well equipped given the present crisis. "Blockade is the root cause of all the problems," the doctors said. "And then, we are not even able to make local purchases due to curfew, which has made our movement impossible." Inside sources said that the shortage of medical essentials was not the only problem faced by them. "The worse problem we are confronting at present is the shortage of manpower. Right now, only 30 percent of our staff is present in the hospital. All other paramedics and doctors have not been provided with the necessary curfew passes," said a group of paramedics. "It is very difficult for us to manage our working during the present crisis. The government must come to our rescue and ensure the entire staff reaches the hospital immediately." Officials in the hospital administration said the government had promised them that the medical supplies would be bought from the Army hospital. "But we haven't received anything so far," the officials said. Patients, attendants face tough time Patients in other city hospitals are facing tremendous hardship due to the shortage of medicines and non-availability of doctors in past three days of curfew. Left in lurch, their attendants move from pillar to post within the confines of the hospital seeking medicines but the administrators are unable to provide them with the required drugs. At SMHS hospital, the condition of patients with bullet hits is excruciating as medicines as well as doctors hardly reach them.On seeking his response to the crisis, SMHS medical superintendent Wasim Qureshi pooh poohes scribes for venturing into the hospital. "Media is barred from entering into the premises," he told the Greater Kashmir correspondent who visited the hospital on Tuesday. He even barred persons carrying juice for the victims. "No we don't need juice. First you should have asked me," he told the persons who had brought juice packs from far flung area during curfew restrictions. Even doctors in the hospital admitted that there was shortage of drugs in the hospital. However, hospital administration refuses to acknowledge that there is any shortage of medicine. Situation at Lal Ded hospital, Valley's lone maternity hospital, is worse with attendants being barred from venturing outside. Scores of attendants were pleading CRPF troopers to let them buy the medicines from outside, but troopers were not allowing them to move. "The condition of my wife is serious as I am unable to get medicines for her," said Farooq Ahmed Dar, of Pulwama, who has been stuck in the hospital for past three days. Patients and attendants are facing tough time in GB Panth hospital, Valley’s biggest paediatric hospital. “ We are facing lot of problems in absence of doctors and medicine,” a caller identifying himself as Feroz Ahmed told Greater Kashmir over phone. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------------- 2. Security men attack health workers in Valley Muzamil Jaleel, Indian Express, August 26 Posted online: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 at 1600 hrs http://www.indianexpress.com/story/353516.html Srinagar, August 25:: Angry with protestors defying curfew, the ire of the fury of the security forces men was again directed towards the ambulance drivers and paramedic staff. According to the J-K Health Services department, nine ambulance drivers and three paramedics were injured after they were beaten up by CRPF and armymen and the ambulance windscreens shattered while trying to ferry injured people. A senior official of the Health department said that their ambulance drivers have threatened to refuse to go out because of the ‘scare'’. Here are few details with the Health department: The driver of ambulance (JK01B-9502) of District Hospital Handwara Ghulam Hassan was beaten up by the army, fracturing his limb while he was carrying a body at Younisa village in Handwara today. Shabir Ahmad – a driver of an ambulance (JK01F8528) of Maternity and Childcare hospital, Anantnag was going to bring a doctor to the hospital when he was stopped and beaten up by security forces at Ashishpora in Anantnag. Driver Mohammad Youqub Magloo (Ambulance JK01J-5242) was stopped at Hyderpora, Srinagar and beaten up. He has been admitted at Bones and Joints Hospital with multiple fractures. Driver Firdous Ahmad (JK02C8837) of Kulgam Hospital was stopped at village Bachru at Yaripora and beaten up by the security forces. Firoz Ahmad – the driver of an ambulance of Gousia hospital in Khanyar Srinagar was beaten up by the CRPF men and now he is bed ridden unable to move. The Health department's internal report reveals that Station House Officer, Kreeri asked for ambulances and paramedics to treat and ferry people, injured in security force firing at Choru village in Baramulla district. Two ambulance drivers Gurmeet Singh (JK02D8838) and Farooq Ahmad (JK01G9401) and three paramedics Syed Ghulam Hassan, Ghulam Mohammad Parray and Syed Mohammad Ashraf from Kreeri Hospital were immediately dispatched but the security forces didn't allow them to proceed and beat them up. Then the drivers of ambulances, Fayaz Ahmad (JK01K 9982) of Ganderbal Ghulam Mohamamd Khatana (JK01 3760) of Kangan and Mohamamd Iqbal (JK01H 2702) were beaten up by the security forces. "There has been a problem. We have discussed with the divisional administration so that we can prevent such incidents'' said J-K's Health Commissioner, Atal Dhiloo told The Indian Express. "I was informed by the Director Health Services. Some of our people have been injured. I have asked our officers to go and please see them and provide whatever help and assistance we can give''. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------------- END From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 18:52:33 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:22:33 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism In-Reply-To: <627249.48694.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <627249.48694.qm@web31505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Violence begets more of it. Every one is not Jesus christ to offer the other cheek to slap.? In self defence hindu or anyone is as good or as bad as any one else. When inhumans think of bombing the innocents, when NGOs are formed to defend the criminals and those accused of the terror, when lawyers for huge fee defend the friends of terrorists, when media runs spin on terror accused without veryfying the facts, to evoke sympathy for the terror accused if they are only from one faith, (refer NDTV programme on the accused doctor of terror., have they verified as media of the facts.), what do you think we as citizens do, preach secularism, when evangelists come with tonnes of money to increase the vote banks for christian PM of tomorrow. ? ----- Original Message ----- From: Prabhakar Singh Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 10:52 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् , sarai list > Please do not make hill out of a mole to justify Islamic terrorism > which is spread world over now. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् > To: sarai list > Sent: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008 6:27:15 PM > Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About > Hindutva Terrorism > > Dear friends, > > I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should > stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang > Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today > report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been > political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know > the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and > front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer > be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." > > Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html > > And more stories in that issue: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html > > > o o o > > > > BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS > > Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks > > by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting > terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off > in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and > his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel > room. > > The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in > the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a > larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to > trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. > > The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police > stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. > They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of > ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over > two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about > 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to > batteries with wires. > > The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and > 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that > both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within > minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained > serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. > > Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur > senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL > TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. > Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in > antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the > city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city > between 1998 and 2000. > > Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur > and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said > Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they > were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were > inactive these days," he said. > > The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and > Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic > institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. > > Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were > involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be > bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both > Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were > planning to do." > > Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards > the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger > conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We > are investigating their links." > > Another officer said the police had information about more explosives > that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to > recover them soon. > > Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal > squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for > assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments > in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades > recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both > sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the > bombmakers were well trained in their job. > > The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private > hostel in > Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is > run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of > Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his > links with his son two years ago and was living in his ancestral > village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented > out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an > executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied > one of > the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. > > Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal > training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught > martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. > > Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the > Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting > Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. > Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities > since 2001," an officer said. > > SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every > Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his > friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached > there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. > > Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the > BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with > the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me > and I do not chalk out their programmes." > > piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in > > o o o > > 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' > > By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid > Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the > 'martyrdom' of > two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted > outside a mosque in Maharashtra. > > Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal > workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze > Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in > Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the > blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. > > The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a > low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in > Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the > Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at > the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were > screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which > allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. > > It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an > organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that > the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market > their own brand of Hindu terror'. > > In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a > blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, > killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh > Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who > had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. > > Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men > were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but > they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal > literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took > place. > > The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the > accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the > case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said > Gazi. > > Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has > been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" > > Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near > Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us > there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity > connection." > > Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state > and Centre let the accused go scot free. > > "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is > happening in Nanded?" he asked. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 18:57:42 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:57:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808270620lef4db69xb6ddb9c3b330d9ce@mail.gmail.com> References: <762848.52529.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <48c2916d0808270546k716165edl68d9c0585f5058d6@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808270557j32988862n38c6466e322aeec7@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808270620lef4db69xb6ddb9c3b330d9ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270627m328ea76ex5994bff1a17ac842@mail.gmail.com> Am I smelling a bit of Limousine Liberal somewhere ? Venom .... has been their weapon; and at least not mine. Maybe, Freud helps you with introspection Champ and mature understanding too. On 8/27/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > > freud had a wonderful term for this aditya which you would do well to > reflect on: the narcissim of minor difference he called it. unfortunately > the subtle nuanced difference between dhatri's bakwas and chanchal's > nonsense escapes me, but of course you are the prime aesthetician of rabid > right-wing venom :) > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:27 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > >> You are so right for a change. Its just you. So, time a check up is done ? >> :) >> >> On 8/27/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: >> > >> > is it just me or is everyone getting a strange sense of deja >> vous?.....like >> > the old hindi film line goes "Ji aapka chehra kuch jaana pehchaana sa >> lagta >> > hai"....does chanchal not sound like our old friend dhatri (who >> > incidentally >> > we have not heard a sqeak out of for some time now)? who sounds like >> > prabhakar, who sometimes sounds like radhikarajen, who for a time we >> > thought >> > was vedavati.... >> > >> > Is it a computer programme? Or a cloning initiative by the RSS? >> > Fascinating! >> > >> > A >> > >> > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 11:33 AM, chanchal malviya < >> > chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com> wrote: >> > >> > > And this is what is to be understood by Hindus... >> > > M.F.Hussain being a Muslim has every right to do anything to Hindu >> > > Religion.. >> > > But Hindus do not have any right to say anything about Islam.. >> > > This is not the way to talk... Talk sense and discuss.. or else please >> do >> > > not visit the topic... >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ---- >> > > From: Kuhu Tanvir >> > > To: reader-list at sarai.net >> > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 10:59:56 AM >> > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 >> > > >> > > Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> > > Re: Chanchal >> > > Please, please get yourself some help, and also read a few history >> books >> > > and >> > > the Hindu texts you supposedly base yourself on. And please don't be >> > naive >> > > enough to say things like in Christianity sex and love are equal and >> that >> > > Muslims are allowed to have as many marriages. You have no right to >> make >> > > unnecessary and sorry to say this but utterly illiterate comments like >> > > this. >> > > You know nothing about Hinduism, Islam or Christianity, so please >> don't >> > > waste your time or the patience of others. >> > > Funnily enough, it is ok for you to make these hurtful remarks about >> > other >> > > religions, and you roam around scott-free while an artist of the >> stature >> > of >> > > Hussain is not allowed to paint what he likes. It is shameful that we >> > have >> > > to hear the voices of the likes of you. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:40 AM, >> wrote: >> > > >> > > > Send reader-list mailing list submissions to >> > > > reader-list at sarai.net >> > > > >> > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net >> > > > >> > > > You can reach the person managing the list at >> > > > reader-list-owner at sarai.net >> > > > >> > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> > > > than "Re: Contents of reader-list digest..." >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > Today's Topics: >> > > > >> > > > 1. Re: Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi (Vedavati Jogi) >> > > > 2. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch >> > > > (chanchal malviya) >> > > > 3. Re: 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch >> > > > (chanchal malviya) >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > > > >> > > > Message: 1 >> > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:35:26 -0700 (PDT) >> > > > From: Vedavati Jogi >> > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> > > > To: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com >> > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net >> > > > Message-ID: <682394.87182.qm at web57705.mail.re3.yahoo.com> >> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > beautiful piece of writing chanchal! >> > > > accept my hearty congratulations for that. >> > > > i find these liberals, secularists etc. more dangerous than muslim >> > > > extremists. >> > > > and i am very happy that nowadays many 'communal' voices are being >> > heard >> > > on >> > > > readers list which was once dominated by 'seculars' >> > > > >> > > > vedavati >> > > > >> > > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, chanchal malviya >> > > wrote: >> > > > >> > > > From: chanchal malviya >> > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> > > > To: "A Khanna" , "Prabhakar Singh" < >> > > > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com> >> > > > Cc: reader-list at sarai.net >> > > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 12:03 PM >> > > > >> > > > Dear Khanna, >> > > > >> > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the >> > positive >> > > > side >> > > > of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their >> > own >> > > > mother >> > > > and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their >> > > intention >> > > > as >> > > > personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. >> > > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else >> explains >> > in >> > > > itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel >> the >> > > same >> > > > for >> > > > their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such >> > person >> > > > would >> > > > not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader >> > > > concept of >> > > > motherland. >> > > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through >> the >> > > > text >> > > > only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. >> > Because >> > > > India >> > > > is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, >> > people >> > > > like >> > > > you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. >> > What >> > > I >> > > > told >> > > > about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this >> word >> > > > came >> > > > into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people >> of >> > > > Sanatan >> > > > Dharma. >> > > > >> > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between >> Dharma >> > > and >> > > > Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means >> > Righteous >> > > > duty >> > > > and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science >> and >> > > > teaches >> > > > righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is >> recognizing >> > > > this, >> > > > but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and >> say >> > > > and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. >> > > > >> > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various >> > > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step >> > > > towards >> > > > Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude >> didn't >> > > cover >> > > > their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because >> they >> > > knew >> > > > that >> > > > he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately >> took >> > > cover >> > > > when >> > > > Veda Vyas crossed. >> > > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for >> > sex. >> > > > And >> > > > the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural >> factor. >> > > And >> > > > winning over it is the biggest win in life. >> > > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found >> > Hindu >> > > > society also marrying multitude of women. >> > > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. >> > > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not >> > > > understand >> > > > and ask me stupid questions. >> > > > >> > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as >> per >> > > > their >> > > > capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand >> posses >> > > > (Hindu >> > > > women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the >> same >> > > > thing. >> > > > >> > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland >> > only >> > > > with >> > > > his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic >> > > > attitude. He >> > > > has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars >> have >> > a >> > > > different life style and we may not be protective of them in this >> > matter. >> > > > >> > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his >> mother. >> > Or >> > > > if >> > > > you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send >> a >> > > > photograph >> > > > of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how >> > many >> > > > of you >> > > > are not of double standard. >> > > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your >> own >> > > > motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ----- Original Message ---- >> > > > From: A Khanna >> > > > To: Prabhakar Singh >> > > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim >> > > > ; reader-list at sarai.net >> > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM >> > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi >> > > > >> > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, >> > > > >> > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your >> rather >> > > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's >> > > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of >> > > > you will find it interesting. >> > > > >> > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's >> gratuitous >> > > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the >> > > > >> > > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms >> > > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a >> > > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What >> > > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic >> in >> > > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought >> > > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of >> the >> > > > >> > > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away >> > > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? >> > > > >> > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, >> > > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you >> like, >> > > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in >> the >> > > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even >> in >> > > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts >> > > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, >> > > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar >> vision >> > > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it >> > > > exists in texts >> > > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical >> > > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as >> > > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the >> > > > >> > > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith >> > > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses >> (particularly >> > > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from >> various >> > > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves >> > > > 'Hindu'. >> > > > >> > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I >> > > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, >> > > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are >> > > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many >> of >> > > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and >> > > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being >> > > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an >> > > > >> > > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or >> > > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of >> > > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the >> > > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of >> > > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to >> me >> > > > >> > > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet >> to >> > > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through >> > > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile >> stories >> > > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of >> > > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me >> > > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in >> > > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist >> > > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) >> > > > >> > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around >> > > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the >> > > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust >> > > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety >> > > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation >> of >> > > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it >> seems >> > > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and >> > > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just >> > > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused >> this >> > > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of >> > > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted >> > > > Husain' is >> > > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, >> > > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably >> > > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as >> > > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, >> > > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the >> > > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm >> not >> > > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for >> > > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or >> > > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous >> > > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two >> > > > things that i find fascinating here. >> > > > >> > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor >> > > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many >> > > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', >> a >> > > > >> > > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and >> > > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense >> > > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing >> and >> > > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. >> > > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately >> > > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly >> > > > fascinating. >> > > > >> > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a >> > > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images >> > > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please >> share >> > > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to >> > > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought >> out >> > > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers >> not >> > > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what >> it >> > > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the >> power >> > > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that >> once >> > > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly >> > > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested >> space. >> > > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of >> > > > prabhakar and chanchal? >> > > > >> > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that >> > > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? >> > > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits >> the >> > > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your >> > > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to >> public >> > > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar >> > > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who >> > > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) >> > > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the >> > > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she >> may >> > > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around >> the >> > > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to >> her. >> > > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your >> mother >> > > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is >> her >> > > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that >> > > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear >> of) >> > > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it >> this >> > > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the >> > > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers >> itself >> > > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an >> > > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) >> > > > >> > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist >> > > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, >> as >> > > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the >> > > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation >> > > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and >> > > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or >> > > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a >> > > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over >> > > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of >> > > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a >> > > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? >> The >> > > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives >> of >> > > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of >> > > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the >> > > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. >> > > > >> > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of >> > > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success >> of >> > > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i >> > > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady >> emotion >> > > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried >> > > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced >> > > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the >> state >> > > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever >> entails >> > > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to >> invest >> > > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to >> bear >> > > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, >> > > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who >> laughs, >> > > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he >> > > > also makes steel. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > Love, >> > > > >> > > > akshay >> > > > >> > > > -- >> > > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in >> > > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _________________________________________ >> > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > > > subscribe in >> > > > the subject header. >> > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > > List archive: >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ------------------------------ >> > > > >> > > > Message: 2 >> > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:56:55 -0700 (PDT) >> > > > From: chanchal malviya >> > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to >> > > > Poonch >> > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list >> > > > >> > > > Message-ID: <697866.75450.qm at web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> >> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> > > > >> > > > Hindu families from Kashmir can shift from Kashmir to Jammu.... But >> my >> > > dear >> > > > friends where will you shift if there are all Kashmirs around... >> > > > This is the not the true face of Islam... This is the only face of >> > > Islam... >> > > > Islam will not accept any other Religion... Gilani told clearly that >> > > > whether it was secularist of nationalist, all are anti-Islam if they >> > are >> > > > non-Muslims... >> > > > After all Quran tells the Muslims that Allah hates non-Muslims and >> > Allah >> > > > has prepared fire for them and it is the duty of Muslims to throw >> > > > non-Muslims into that fire... >> > > > Our Hindu secularists will not understand this... They will not read >> > > Quran >> > > > and they will follow another person, Mr. Gandhi, who also didn't >> read >> > > > Quran... >> > > > >> > > > Either you learn from history or you learn from what happened with >> > you... >> > > > Dear Mahatma Gandhi learned from neither... >> > > > All invaders in their official chronicles (like Baburnama, >> Akbarnama, >> > > etc) >> > > > have accepted with pride that they massacred 3thousand, 4 thousands >> > > Infidels >> > > > and prepared a tower of their head... But we will not learn from >> > History >> > > > what is meant by Infidels in Islam.. >> > > > Gandhiji offered Khilafat to Ali brothers in exchange of support to >> > > > Non-Cooperation movement (because Muslims didn't fight Independence >> war >> > > till >> > > > then), but in exchange 10s of thousands of Hindus were massacred by >> > > Muslims >> > > > - known as Mopla rebellion.. >> > > > >> > > > But Gandhiji learnt from none and declared 'Sarva Dharma >> Sambhava'... >> > > > Great.. he neither understood Geeta where Dharma means duty.. not >> > learnt >> > > > Koran or Christian where Dharma means hardcore Religion of >> > hatred... And >> > > we >> > > > call him 'Father of the Nation'... >> > > > >> > > > Hindus are nearly eliminated from all Muslim countries.. In India >> also >> > > > HIndus are reducing drastically... But our Hindus are shouting >> > > Secularism... >> > > > Arey bhai - secularism walo - thoda Quran bhi padho... >> > > > >> > > > I have a question to Muslims... I don't know, why they do not >> answer... >> > > > >> > > > If GOD is one (monotheism), then how can any worship of this world >> > point >> > > to >> > > > some other GOD or few more GODS (polytheism) when they do not exist >> at >> > > all.. >> > > > If Allah is the correct name, then was GOD nameless prior to >> Islam... >> > Or >> > > > GOD keeps on changing his name.. and his latest favorite name is >> > Allah... >> > > > Why is GOD so powerless that he cannot himself finish off other GODs >> > and >> > > > asks instead his followers to massacre the followers of other >> GODs... >> > > same >> > > > story is with Christians also.... >> > > > It is Hinduism alone that says that GOD is within us first and >> outside >> > > > later... It is Hinduism alone that emphasizes on seeing GOD in every >> > > > creature.. and thus it is Hinduism alone that surpasses the boundary >> of >> > > all >> > > > other Religion which are mere superstitions about GOD... and asks >> human >> > > to >> > > > expand their thought over life and GOD... Let us be proud to be a >> Hindu >> > > and >> > > > let us tell the world that they are HIndus too IF: >> > > > - they are faithful to their parents, because Hindu dharma is matri >> > devo, >> > > > pitra devo.. >> > > > - they are faithful to their job, because Bhagwad Geeta teaches >> > selfless >> > > > duty >> > > > - they are loving animals and birds and not eating them, as Sattvika >> is >> > > the >> > > > approach >> > > > - they are waking early and following a disciplined life, as that is >> > the >> > > > culture of HIndus >> > > > and so many things... >> > > > This is all of Hinduism.. and anyone doing these things are Hindus.. >> > > though >> > > > they may be by Religion Muslim or Christian... Muslims or >> Christians, >> > if >> > > > they are not Hindus, must not do above things.. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ----- Original Message ---- >> > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul >> > > > To: sarai list >> > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM >> > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to >> Poonch >> > > > >> > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch >> > > > Hindus >> > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face >> > > > consequences*> > >> > > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - >> > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 >> > > > >> > > > King C Bharati >> > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started >> > its >> > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus >> > migrating >> > > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house >> > > > belonging >> > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote >> have >> > > > been >> > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. >> > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have >> finally >> > > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims >> > attacked >> > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration >> remained >> > > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. >> > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the >> > district >> > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little >> concern >> > for >> > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where >> hooligans >> > are >> > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government >> > > > employees in presence of police. >> > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling >> > > > Pakistani >> > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the >> worst >> > > > ever >> > > > communal violence in this border district. >> > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems >> to >> > > > have >> > > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration >> has >> > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., >> > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our >> > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera >> areas >> > are >> > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having >> migrated >> > > from >> > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were >> burnt. >> > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media >> seeking >> > > help >> > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. >> > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were >> > mute >> > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding >> the >> > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans >> who >> > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans >> > besides >> > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. >> > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources >> said >> > > > that >> > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting >> > anti-India >> > > > and >> > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face >> > > serious >> > > > consequences. >> > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were >> > > removed >> > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they >> > tried >> > > to >> > > > remove the posters. >> > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call >> > > which >> > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. >> > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration >> > > crippled >> > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration >> > Poonch >> > > is >> > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. >> > > > _________________________________________ >> > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > > > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > > List archive: >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ------------------------------ >> > > > >> > > > Message: 3 >> > > > Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2008 22:10:25 -0700 (PDT) >> > > > From: chanchal malviya >> > > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to >> > > > Poonch >> > > > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , sarai list >> > > > >> > > > Message-ID: <956827.12997.qm at web90402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> >> > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> > > > >> > > > Dear Aditya, >> > > > >> > > > You must understand that our Media, Politicians, Law, Human Rights, >> and >> > > > Secularism all mean that Hindus are bull shits, and they must be >> > removed. >> > > > So, it is happening and it will happen. There is no option - we >> Hindus >> > > will >> > > > have to fight for our survival ourselves... No one is going to come >> for >> > > > us... >> > > > At the same time, we have to remember that while we fight, we will >> be >> > > told >> > > > terrorists... People who bomb the country are people of GOD, and >> people >> > > who >> > > > oppose it are terrorists... >> > > > So, be prepared or prepare your children to either bear a beard >> without >> > a >> > > > moustache and cover your females with black veil... or make them >> Arjun >> > to >> > > > fight the Adharma... >> > > > >> > > > You know a secret... >> > > > Which is the sacred day of Muslims - Friday - Shukrawar... >> > > > Who was the Guru of Rakshasas (Adharma) - Shukracharya.. >> > > > You can understand rest of the things.... >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ----- Original Message ---- >> > > > From: Aditya Raj Kaul >> > > > To: sarai list >> > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:12:14 PM >> > > > Subject: [Reader-list] 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to >> Poonch >> > > > >> > > > * 15 Hindu families migrate from Dhalera to Poonch >> > > > Hindus >> > > > of Surankote asked to quit or face >> > > > consequences*> > >> > > > 8/26/2008 2:37:15 AMLink - >> > > > http://www.theshadow.in/theshadow/newsdet.aspx?4271 >> > > > >> > > > King C Bharati >> > > > Jammu, Aug 25: The worst fears have come true and Poonch has started >> > its >> > > > process of becoming another Kashmir with 15 families of Hindus >> > migrating >> > > > from Dhalera and Bhench area of Poonch where 2 shops and one house >> > > > belonging >> > > > to Pammy Bali were burnt late last night while Hindus in Surankote >> have >> > > > been >> > > > asked to quit or face the consequences. >> > > > Most of the families residing in Dhalera and Bhench area have >> finally >> > > > migrated to Poonch late last night after huge crowds of Muslims >> > attacked >> > > > them and started burning their houses even as administration >> remained >> > > > crippled for the fourth consecutive day in Poonch. >> > > > With the imposition of curfew and army taking over the city the >> > district >> > > > administration seems to have gone in deep slumber with little >> concern >> > for >> > > > the crying Hindu population of nearby areas of Poonch where >> hooligans >> > are >> > > > openly burning their shops and house which included some government >> > > > employees in presence of police. >> > > > The separatist hooligans are raising pro-Pak slogans and unfurling >> > > > Pakistani >> > > > flags with the PDP leaders of the area taking lead in fanning the >> worst >> > > > ever >> > > > communal violence in this border district. >> > > > The Vohra administration which is busy appeasing the Kashmiris seems >> to >> > > > have >> > > > no time for this remote district even as the local administration >> has >> > > > already positioned itself in Hands-up situation., >> > > > According to reports emanating from Poonch district besides our >> > > > correspondent Anibhav Misri's dispatches the Bhench and Dhalera >> areas >> > are >> > > > the worst hit at present with entire Hindu population having >> migrated >> > > from >> > > > both the areas late last night after their shops and houses were >> burnt. >> > > > Poonch residents continued their frantic calls to Jammu media >> seeking >> > > help >> > > > and put the number of migrated families to 15. >> > > > The residents said that the local DSP DR and two Sub-inspectors were >> > mute >> > > > spectators during the arson and communal violence yesterday adding >> the >> > > > administration seemed hand in glove with the separatist hooligans >> who >> > > > continue to raise pro-Azadi, Pro-Pakistan and anti-India slogans >> > besides >> > > > unfurling Pakistani flags in the area. >> > > > Meanwhile reports from Surankote are also disturbing where sources >> said >> > > > that >> > > > around 12000 people assembled in Surankote bus stand shouting >> > anti-India >> > > > and >> > > > Pro-Pakistan slogans and warned Hindus of the area to quit or face >> > > serious >> > > > consequences. >> > > > The protestors had earlier pasted posters in this regard which were >> > > removed >> > > > by army as police was subjected to severe stone pelting after they >> > tried >> > > to >> > > > remove the posters. >> > > > There were also reports that Muslims have given a Poonch Challo call >> > > which >> > > > was however not confirmed till the last reports came in. >> > > > The over all situation in Poonch seems volatile and administration >> > > crippled >> > > > while Hindus are facing the brunt and with the start of migration >> > Poonch >> > > is >> > > > actually fast becoming another Kashmir within Jammu. >> > > > _________________________________________ >> > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > > > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > > List archive: >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > ------------------------------ >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > reader-list mailing list >> > > > reader-list at sarai.net >> > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > End of reader-list Digest, Vol 61, Issue 127 >> > > > ******************************************** >> > > > >> > > _________________________________________ >> > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > List archive: >> > > >> > > >> > > _________________________________________ >> > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > > List archive: >> > > >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 19:03:08 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 06:33:08 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding Message-ID: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>      People’s Union for Democratic Rights, Delhi   PRESS RELEASE, 26th August 2008   Findings of an Investigation Conducted From 22 to 25 August 2008   A six-member team from four human rights organisations conducted an investigation into the “economic blockade” in Kashmir and its aftermath. The team toured the districts of Srinagar, Budgam, Baramulla, and Bandipora. The team spoke to victims of the violence and their families, people who were part of protests, doctors at the SMHS hospital, journalists, the Kashmir Chamber of Commerce, and office bearers of many social and political organisations. However, the fact finding was disrupted as the state announced an indefinite curfew from the morning of 24th August. The release also addresses the second round of curfew currently in force. The total loss of life during the two periods of curfew stands at over 35. The main findings of the team are summarized below:   1.  Azaadi is the primary demand in Kashmir The team arrived in Srinagar on 22 August and witnessed the massive protest meeting at the Idgah grounds. People gathered there publicly declared their primary demand for azaadi (freedom) at the meeting venue and through numerous street processions in various streets of Srinagar on 22 and 23 August. During our interviews with individual families and with groups, people voiced the same demand. A wide range of social and political organisations have also reiterated this demand.   2.  Use of curfew to create a confrontation Curfew was imposed from the evening of 11 August and again from the morning of 24 August. The first time it was imposed hours after the security forces opened fire at many places on an unarmed procession heading to the Muzaffarabad border killing at least __ people. It was expected that people would come out in the following day to protest against the killings. Curfew thus became an instrument to prevent people from assembling and gave security forces the power to use force against unarmed protestors. The second time curfew was imposed with the express purpose of preventing the dharna at Lal Chowk. The previous gathering at Idgah, where this dharna was announced, had been peaceful. Therefore curfew became the means by which a confrontation was created, which could have been easily avoided. The clamping down on media and the brutal attacks on journalists happened while the team was still there. Arrests of leaders, raids of homes and intimidation of local residents by the army and CRPF are happening even now. On 24th itself, our team issued an appeal to the central government to lift the curfew to prevent loss of life.   3. Deliberate blockade of supplies and its indifferent handling. While our team has not investigated the happenings in the Jammu region, its impact on Kashmir has been confirmed through our interviews. Protests in Jammu, which started from early July, took a more violent turn from the beginning of August. This led to severe restriction on the movement of goods and people on the Srinagar-Jammu highway and even into Punjab. Records at the highway check points, as reported in the Economic Times (21.8.08), confirm the substantial lowering of goods traffic in July and its worsening in August. Shortages were created as a result: of oils and cooking gas in the rural areas, of cereals and medicines in the urban areas. Given the fears of Kashmiri transporters and drivers, the impact was far worse in traffic moving out of Kashmir. This has led to substantial losses for fruit growers as well as handicrafts and carpet manufacturers and transporters. Fruit could be found rotting at many places and handicraft manufacturers report cancellation of export orders for the ramazan season and fears for the Christmas season. The team was told that till 23rd August, 80 % of the trucks were not leaving the valley for fear of attacks and only some 15-20 trucks were able to carry the apples out of the valley after assurance of safe passage from the government. The loss—over 75% of the fruit are rotting in the Sopore mandi. In Seer Jagir, a village in Sopore tehsil, the team met small farmers with average land holding of 4-5 acres, which produces on an average 3000 boxes of apples per annum. The 30 farmers in this village reported that they have lost on an average Rs 2 lakh this season. Therefore, the total loss of this small village account to nearly 60 lakh. The government’s lackadaisical attitude in ensuring supplies and its attempt to deny the ‘blockade’ led to feeling of ill-will in Kashmir.   4. Firing incidents (11-14th August) were unprovoked and aimed to kill The team investigated 15 cases of deaths that occurred on account of firing by CRPF and JK police between 11 and 14 August. The actual death toll is estimated to be above 30. The findings show a clear pattern: (a) The firings were aimed to kill. This was evident from eye witness accounts which showed that the firings were indiscriminate and aimed directly at the crowd. At Paribal, near Bandipura town on 12th August the RR and JK police fired on the crowd from above the hill where the 15 RR camp is located. (b) A large number of deaths resulted from injuries in the abdomen, chest, head or upper or lower back. The same was confirmed by hospital records. (c) In some cases, as at Lasjen on 12 August, protesters were deceived into by an assurance of allowing peaceful procession and then resorting to firing. Three people were killed including one 50 year old woman and six others received bullet injuries.   5.  Attacks on those Injured The total number of people injured in the period between 11 and 14 August is not clearly established. However, at SMHS hospital alone, over 500 patients were admitted in the same period. The team met families and those injured and killed in the attacks. We were repeatedly told that the security forces never tried to reach the injured to hospital. Worse, vehicles carrying injured to hospital were routinely attacked. Hospital sources claim that a number of ambulances were attacked. The same is confirmed by news reports today and the health department has threatened to stop ambulance services given the injuries received by ambulance drivers. Our team was told that in Lasjen, even those carrying dead bodies back from the hospital were attacked on 12th August. Elsewhere, in Bandipora the same was reported. The van carrying Mehrajuddin Kakh, injured in the Bandipura killing on 12 August, was attacked by CRPF and STF at Parimpora. Not only were the occupants attacked, Mehrajuddin’s thigh injury was brutalized by twisting a lathi in it. He died the same night. Equally, Imran Ahmed Wani who was injured in the Bagi Mehtab firing on 12 August was deliberately refused ambulance service for nearly two hours. In fact, when he did get into one, it was attacked at Rambagh Pul. He was declared dead on arrival at the hospital.   6.  Attack on the SMHS hospital, Srinagar What is unbelievable is the attack on SMHS Hospital on 11 and 12 August successively. The SMHS hospital received the largest number of casualties. When doctors were trying to conduct emergency operations at break-neck speed in order to save lives, the Casualty was attacked with tear gas shells followed by firing live bullets. The firing was again repeated on 12 August. It is the dedication of doctors, paramedic staff, ambulance drivers and timely arranging of bandages, gauze and cotton by the medical representatives, at the risk of their own lives, that managed to save a large number of lives. The doctors also confirmed that the help received by the ordinary people in saving the lives of those injured was remarkable. People helped the medical staff in transporting the wounded to the OT, aided in tending treatment in the Casualty and arranged vans and ambulances to carry them to the different hospitals in the city and elsewhere.   7.  Attacks on Funeral Processions Funeral processions were repeatedly attacked in many places as large numbers of people marched with the bier to the graveyards. The team was told that the funeral procession of Ishfaq Ahmed Kana, shot dead at Qamarwari Chowk, Srinagar on 11 August, to the Idgah Martyrs Memorial was attacked by the CRPF with lathis and rubber bullets. In Baghi Mahtab, Javed Ahmed Mir’s funeral procession was attacked and one person was killed in the firing. Other protest demonstrations protesting against the killings were also attacked. For instance, the protest demonstration following the shooting of Owais Majeed Zarga in Rainawari, Srinagar on 12th August was attacked by the Kashmir police stationed outside the office of the local MLA, Mhd Shahid. Two boys were injured in the firing.   8.  Raids and Attacks on Residents: During the evening of 13 and 14 August, security forces engaged in an indiscriminate and large-scale attack on houses in localities close to the firings, thrashing people and smashing window panes. At Safakadal, Srinagar, residents showed how their houses and a nearby mosque were attacked by the CRPF. At Lasjen, JK police and CRPF personnel entered houses to thrash people. Relatives were forcibly prevented from accessing homes of deceased and women relatives at the house of Imtiaz Rahim, who died in the firing, showed us the marks of brutality at the hands of the security forces.   9. FIRs: Refusals and Distortions: In most cases, the families have not registered any FIRs against the security forces as they fear going to the police station or that it would invite further violence. Where families of those killed were able to go to police stations after many days, they found that FIRs were already lodged stating that the protestors attacked security forces who in turn were forced to open fire. When families tried to get their version recorded, the same was refused. Complaints are rejected. In the case of the Bagi Mahtab killings where the families of the deceased (Javed Ahmed Mir and Imran Ahmed Wani) were given a totally false version of the happenings in the FIR. When challenged, the police said that the families must come ten days later with 4 eye witnesses to corroborate their story. This refusal even to receive complaints is tantamount to making the security forces judges of their own actions.   10. Present Curfew and Developments On 24 August, Kashmir was greeted by indefinite curfew when it woke up in the morning. Within a few hours four media persons, on their way to office had been badly beaten up at Rambagh by the CRPF. The identity cards and passes issued during the last phase of curfew presented by the journalists were rejected. Mr Bilal, bureau chief of Sahara Samay was admitted to the Bone and Joints hospital and later to the SMHS hospital. By evening, security forces opened fire in Dal Gate area killing one person and critically injuring another. Homes of political leaders were raided and some arrested. In the rural areas, the army threatened local imams, nambardars and chowkidars on 24 August that they would be held responsible if people dared to join in the procession to Lal Chowk. Over the last two days, the curfew has lad to at least seven people being killed in firing by security forces and over 275 injured in various parts of Kashmir valley. Essential supplies to Srinagar city, such as medicines, water tankers and milk, have been blocked and this ‘blockade’ has been done at the instance of the CRPF. The entire control of land and order in Srinagar city has all been handed over to the CRPF and news reports have suggested that the local police have also been beaten by the CRPF. CONCLUSION The investigation team is of the opinion that the firing, brutality, loss of life was not only wholly avoidable but done deliberately. The disruption of road traffic to Kashmir needed to be recognized by the government and addressed. The resort to curfew after the firing on 11 August denied the people a right to protest and be heard. Additionally, the curfew provided the security forces the power to open fire with impunity. A number of extremely inhuman crimes were committed by the security forces by denying and obstructing medical aid to the injured, attacking the injured and most seriously by launching an attack on the SMHS hospital. No existing law in the country provides immunity to police and security forces for such crimes. The lack of any action against these forces even where the crimes are established by eye-witnesses and reported in newspapers, makes people lose whatever faith in the government that may have remained after decades of army rule. Despite these happenings, the people of Kashmir have shown exemplary restraint and ensured that all processions and public gatherings after the lifting of curfew remain wholly peaceful. This situation should have been utilized to initiate political dialogue instead of the visit by the National Security Advisor. The imposition of curfew to prevent another such pre-declared peaceful mass gathering can only be seen as an invitation to another bloody attack on protestors and serves as a message to the people of Kashmir that the Indian government would not tolerate peaceful and unarmed protest.   WE DEMAND 1.             Immediate lifting of the curfew and restoration of ample space to people to peaceably collect and voice their demands. 2.             Criminal charges be registered against those responsible for attacks on injured people, ambulances and hospitals as well as widespread damage to houses. 3.             Peoples complaints concerning arbitrary and indiscriminate use of fire by security forces be registered and the culprits brought to book. 4.             Law and order duties be immediately restored to the police in Srinagar and all forces be made ot work ‘in aid of civil power’ as required by law. 5.             The situation of the peaceful expression of peoples demands be utilized to initiate a political dialogue, the political establishment is duty-bound to do so when people in such large numbers are voicing these.     Harish Dhawan Secretary, PUDR On behalf of People’s Democratic Forum (PDF), Karnataka Andhra Pradesh Civil Liberties Committee (APCLC), Andhra Pradesh Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), Jammu and Kashmir People’s Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), Delhi   From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 19:09:08 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:09:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808270624y1f9538fagcb85d272d4304d18@mail.gmail.com> References: <463495.91832.qm@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> <341590.24695.qm@web94707.mail.in2.yahoo.com> <6353c690808270620w4e8369dds163cfe79290aadcb@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808270624y1f9538fagcb85d272d4304d18@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270639v34c10283m65b2fb75f6fd8e70@mail.gmail.com> Sure, go for the Pseudo Doubles :) On 8/27/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > No, no, I am winning that one :) > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > Fatima, > > > > You forgot the most important sport; though not in Olympics till now. > > > > You are the best in shooting mails; offending ofcourse. Be in London for > the > > next Olympics; Gold is there waiting... > > > > Cheers > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > >> > >> Hey, you forgot something else, Sania took her mother as manager, had > >> perfect health to pose for her sponsors, now falling down at rank70 in > >> tennis, is another example of pampered indian, who has forgotten what > game > >> is after crores in kitty.? > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: hasina hasan > >> Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 4:06 pm > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians > >> To: sarai , sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > >> > >> > ...we are also modestly good at: > >> > - whining about winning > >> > - sighing at large on the state of our state. > >> > > >> > we from > >> > our pc's here to anothers' there, say write: 'hey why you think > >> > that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear me for i speak well > >> > and have a nobler > >> > view'. > >> > (see me here now) > >> > > >> > or > >> > was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny images that never got > >> > attached > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima wrote: > >> > From: S.Fatima > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians > >> > To: "sarai" > >> > Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM > >> > > >> > Some people say that Indians are peace-loving people and never > >> > offend/invade any > >> > body. (Some say Indians never invaded others for last 10,000 > >> > years!). But in > >> > Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win medals in the most > >> > offendeinggames: > >> > > >> > Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting > >> > > >> > Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling > >> > > >> > Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing > >> > > >> > Does it mean that we are good only in shooting, wresting and > >> > boxing others > >> > down. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to > >> > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> > subscribe in > >> > the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > >> > list > >> > List archive: > >> > > >> > > >> > Bollywood news, movie reviews, film trailers and more! Go to > >> > http://in.movies.yahoo.com/_________________________________________ > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> > subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > >> > list > >> > List archive: > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 19:09:12 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:39:12 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Well, if 90 year old man, swamiji or otherwise, and along with this 90 year old man, another 7 persons, who is revered by citizens, is shot dead by "missionaries" who preach love and compassion, and the citizens are expected to tolerate this atrocity even when administation is hesitant to take action against these goons. ? Missionaries who work in tribal areas with money fromabroad should know that love is not taught by guns shots to old men. ? Regards. ----- Original Message ----- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 5:51 pm Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa To: sarai list > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: John Dayal > Date: Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM > > > Dr. John Dayal > > Member: National Integration Council > Government of India > > Secretary General: All India Christian Council (Founded 1999) > President: United Christian Action, Delhi (Founded 1992) > Imm. Past National President: All India Catholic Union (Founded 1919) > > 505 Link, 18 IP Extension, Delhi 110092 India > Email: johndayal at vsnl.com > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > Phone: 91-11-22722262 Mobile 09811021072 > > 25 August 2008 > > URGENT FAX > > TO PRESIDENT OF INDIA > > SEEKING ARMY / CENTRAL FORCES INTERVENTION TO PROTECT CHRISTIANS IN > ORISSA AS NUN IS RAPED, PRIESTS INJURED, CHURCHES AND OFFICES > BURNT IN > PRESENCE OF POLICE > > Hon'ble Mrs., Pratibha Patil > President of India > > Dear President > > Greetings from a grieving community. > > You are aware of the still continuing carnage against the Christian > community, mostly Dalits and Tribals, in the Kandhamal district of > Orissa and in several other districts including the state capital of > Bhubaneswar since 23rd August 2003 following the killing of Vishwa > Hindu Parishad leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati, reportedly by > Maoist groups who have been operating in the state for some time. > > The Christian leadership in the country has unequivocally condemned > the killing of the VHP leader and his four associates. > > The Christians of Kandhamal are still nursing their wounds from the > Christmas 2007 violence, with hundreds of them still living in a > refugee camp in Barakhama. Most of the more than One hundred churches > then destroyed remain in ruins, and the burnt houses are still to be > fully rebuilt. > > And yet local Sangh leaders have targeted the community in a second > wave of macabre violence. > > A nun has been raped in Kandhamal, a Catholic father grievously > injured, scores of houses in villages destroyed, apart from Churches > and institutions. I attach herewith a partial list of the damage in > the violence in the past two days. We in Delhi are overwhelmed with > panic messages from Priests, pastors, nuns and common people who look > to New Delhi for help as the State machinery ahs collapsed once again. > > Changing of superintendents of police as a knee jerk reaction does not > provide security to Christians. In fact, much of the violence is > taking place with the insufficient police force looking on. This had > been the case in 2007 December, as has come out in the on going > hearings of the Justice Basudeo Panigrahi Commission. Christian > delegations have informed the State Governor, the State Chief Minister > and the Home Minister of India of the dire situation of our community > in Orissa. > > Dear Madame President, > > This is to request you to use your powers as President of India, and > the tremendous force of your good offices, to impress on the Central > Government to rush adequate Union forces, including contingents of the > Armed Forces if required, to restore law and order and governance in > the Kandhamal region. > > The consequences of any further delay, I fear, may be catastrophic for > our Christian community in the State in particular, for peace in > Orissa in general, and for the fair name of India as a secular > country. > > God Bless you > > John Dayal > > Attachments: > 1. Incomplete list of death and damage in violence of 23rd-25th > August 2008 > 2. Christian condemnation of killing of Sw. Lakshmanananda Saraswati > > ORISSA ANTI CHRISTIAN VIOLENCE UPDATE 25th August 2008 > > : > 1. CHRISTIAN WOMAN TEACHER REPORTED BURNT ALIVE: A Christian woman > teacher, possibly a nun [BUT NOT CONFIRMED], was reported burnt alive > on 25th August 2008 by a group of Vishwa Hindu Parishad mob which > stormed the orphanage she ran in the district of Bargarh (Orissa). > Police Superintendent Ashok Biswall has told this to news > reporters. A > priest who was at the orphanage was also badly hurt and is now being > treated in hospital for multiple burns. > 2. NUN RAPED: A young Catholic Nun of the Cuttack Bhubaneswar diocese > working Jan Vikas Kendra, the Social Service Centre at Nuagaon in > Kandhamal was reportedly gang raped on 24th August 2008 by groups of > Hindutva extremists before the building itself was destroyed. > 3. SENIOR PRIEST AND NUN INJURED: Fr Thomas, director of the Diocesan > Pastoral Centre in Kanjimendi, less than a kilometer away from the > Social Service Centre, and another Nun were injured when the centre > was attacked. They were taken to the police station in a disheveled > state as the armed mob bayed for their blood. The Pastoral centre was > then set afire. > 4. BALLIGUDA CHURCH BUILDINGS DESTROYED AGAIN: On 24th August 2008 > evening lynch mobs at the block headquarters of Balliguda, in the very > heart of Kandhamal district, which had seen much violence between 24th > and 26th December 2007, attacked and destroyed a Presbytery, convent > and hostel damaging the properties. > 5. The mobs in Balliguda caught hold of two boys of the Catholic > hostel and tonsured their heads. > 6. PHULBANI CHURCH DAMAGED: On 25th august 2008 morning followers of > the late Lakshmanananda Saraswati damaged the Catholic Church in > Phulbani, the district headquarter town. > 7. MOTHER TERESA BROTHERS ASHRAM ATTACKED: mobs attacked the Mother > Teresa Brothers' residence and hospital in Srasanada, destroyed once > before and rebuilt two months ago, and beat up the patients. > Fundamentalists have targeted Priests, religious and also the Faithful > in Pobingia also. > 8. BHUBANESWAR BISHOP'S HOUSE ATTACKED: On the morning of 25th August > 2008, violent mobs made several attempts to enter the compounds of > Catholic Church and Archbishop's house in the heart of the Capital of > the State of Orissa. They could not enter because of the police > presence. They threw stones at the guesthouse of Archbishop's House, > damaging windows. > 9. DUBURI PARISH; Another group of fundamentalists entered presbytery > in Duburi parish, managed by the SVDs and destroyed and damaged > property. Two priests of the parish are missing. > 10. Mr. Jamaj Pariccha, Director of Gramya Pragati, is attacked and > his property, vehicle etc. damaged, burnt and looted. > 11. A Baptist Church in Akamra Jila in Bhubaneswar is also damaged. > 12. Christian institutions like St. Arnold's School (Kalinga Bihar), > AND NISWASS report some damage. > 13. BOUDH DISTRICT [Adjoining Kandhamal]: Fundamentalists enter the > Catholic parish church and destroy property. People are fleeing to > safer places. But nothing seems safe. > 14. Muniguda Catholic Fathers and Nuns' residence have been damaged. > 15. Sambalpur HM Sister's residence (Ainthapalli) has suffered damage. > 16. Padanpur: One priest is attacked and admitted to a hospital. > Hostel boys and the in charge have moved away from the place. > 17. Madhupur Catholic Church currently under attack. > 18. SMALL CHURCHES: Attempted violence on small churches in various > districts, including Padampur, Sambalpur near GM College, Talsera, > Dangsoroda, Narayanipatara, Muniguda, Tummiibandh, Tangrapada, > Phulbani, Balliguda, Kalingia, Chakapad, Srasanranda. > 19. VILLAGE CHRISTIAN HOUSES ATTACKED: Houses attacked on forest > hamlets of Balliguda, Kanjamandi Nuaguam (K.Nuaguam), Tiangia > (G.Udayagiri), Padangiri, Tikabali. > 20. KALAHANDI DISTRICT: houses burnt even though the district is more > than 300 kilometers from the place where Swami Lakshmanananda was > killed. > 21. Pastor Sikandar Singh of the Pentecostal Mission beaten up and his > house burnt in Bhawanipatna. > 22. Kharihar: 3 Christian shops were looted and burnt. Pastor Alok Das > and Pastor I M Senapati beaten up. > 23. Aampani: Pastor David Diamond Pahar, Pastor Pravin Ship, Pastor > Pradhan and Pastor Barik beaten up and chased away with their > families. > 24. Naktikani: Mob surrounds village to attack Christians. The > government has sent forces, it is reported. > > [This list is compiled with assistance from Archbishop's House, > Bhubaneswar and other sources] > > - --------------------------------- > URGENT > >From John Dayal > 25 August 2008 > > INDIAN CHURCH CONDEMNS KILLING OF ORISSA VHP LEADER > > The Church in India has unequivocally condemned the killing of Vishwa > Hindu Parishad [VHP] Orissa leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > four colleagues in the Tumiliband region of Kandhamal district by Left > wing extremists. Still recovering from the worst ever anti Christian > violence in Indian history in December 2007, Christian organisations > have appealed for peace as the community braces for another round of > violence in the state from Hindutva groups who have sworn to avenge > Saraswati death by attacking Churches, institutions, clergy and nuns. > > The following is the text of major statements issued by Church groups > condemning the VHP leaders' death: > > ARCHBISHOP RAPHAEL CHEENATH, SVD > Archbishop of Cuttack-Bhubaneswar > > 24 August 2008 > > I, on behalf of the Christians of Orissa, particularly the catholic > Christians, strongly condemn the dastardly attack and violent killing > of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five of his associates. We the > Christians abhor violence and condemn all acts of violence and > terrorism and are against all groups of people taking the law into > their own hands. We condole the death of Swami Lakshmanananda > Saraswati, a religious leader and his associates. At this critical > juncture I appeal to all for peace and communal harmony. We want good > relationship with all the communities with whom we live. > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > that least one prayer hall in Sundergarh District has been burnt and > vehicle belonging to Daughters of the most Precious Blood has been > burnt near G. Udayagiri. > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > associates. > > - --------- > > ALL INDIA CHRISTIAN COUNCIL: > > Press Statement by Dr John Dayal, Secretary General, and Dr Sampaul, > National Secretary for Public Affairs > > The All India Christian Council is deeply concerned at the attack on > an ashram near Tumiliband in Kandhamal District of Orissa last night > in which the Vishwa Hindu Parishad leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and > four of his associates were killed. This is the latest of a series of > attacks in recent months by political extremists which have left > dozens of policemen and others dead in several districts of Orissa. > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > at least one prayer hall in Sundergarh ahs been burnt, the van of some > Catholic Nuns destroyed and the sisters themselves injured. > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > associates. > > The Christian community abhors violence, condemns all acts of > terrorism and is against groups of people taking the law into their > own hands. We have had major differences with the dead VHP leader. It > has been the hate campaigns of the VHP and Sangh Parivar which led to > untold misery to Christians in the violence last Christmas. Refugees > from that violence are still living in government camps in Barakhama > under miserable conditions. But we wish peace to everyone. > We pray for peace in Orissa, one of the most undeveloped states in > the country, > - ------------------ > > CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE OF INDIA: > > The Catholic Bishops' Conference of India (CBCI) is sad to note that > Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five > others were murdered on Saturday August 23 allegedly by Maoist group > in Kandhamal Dist of Orissa. The Church leaders in Orissa and other > parts of the country have condemned the killing of Swami > Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates in the Ashram. We have > also appealed for peace and harmonyin the state. > > However, we are extremely sorry to find that some organizations have > pointed finger at the Christian community in Orissa for the alleged > murder of the Swami and his associates. Consequently there have been > unprovoked attacks on Christians and their institutions in Kandhamal > and surrounding areas. School at Bhadrak Town, Convent and the > computer centre at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist, Pastoral Centre at > Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Social Development Centre (Jan Vikas > Kendra) at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Catholic Church in Phulbani > and a Convent of the religious women at Phulbani have suffered in the > attacks which took place after the murder of Swami Lakshmanananda > Saraswati. > > We are sad to note that the extremists are attacking and vandalizing > our institutions without any reason. Incidents of arson and > burning of > vehicles belonging to the Church have also been reported at Udaygiri. > Some of our religious nuns, girls and boys in the hostels have fled > from their places and taken shelter in the forest, particularly in > Kandhamal Dist. We are seriously concerned about the safety and > security of our frightened people who are innocent and yet find > themselves in a very precarious situation. The State Government has > deployed police forces in some of the areas and yet the violence has > not been contained. We request the Central Government to urgently > intervene in the matter and send additional forces to bring situation > to normalcy. > - -- Rev. Dr. Babu Joseph, SVD, Spokesperson, CBCI > - ------------ > EVANGELICAL FELLOWSHIP OF INDIA: > > Evangelical Fellowship of India (EFI) denounces the killing of Vishwa > Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > four associates by suspected Maoists in Orissa state's Kandhamal > district on August 23. While deeply saddened by the weeklong spate of > attacks that hit Kandhamal district during last Christmas, EFI, as a > representative of the evangelical church in India, stands against > every act of violence and terrorism. > > EFI also regrets that vested interests among the various Hindu > nationalist groups are trying to blame local Christians for the act, > as reflected in the acts of vandalism and arson reported from > Kandhamal after the attack on Saraswati ashram. > > EFI appeals to the central, state and district authorities to take all > possible measures to maintain peace and calm in Kandhamal. EFI also > calls for the Christian community in India and abroad to pray for > protection of the Christians in Kandhamal and other parts of Orissa. > - -- Rev. Dr. Richard Howell, General Secretary > Evangelical Fellowship of India > - -------------------- > Prashant. A Centre for Human Rights, Justice and Peace, Ahmedabad, > Gujarat, India > > We condemn the killing of Swami Saraswati and four of his associates > during the attack on the VHP Ashram in the Kandhamal District of > Orissa on Saturday 23rd August 2008. We sympathize with the bereaved > members of the families who have lost their loved ones. > > We call upon the Orissa and the Central Governments to do all in their > power to bring to book immediately, those responsible for this > dastardly act; that anti-social elements do not take law and order > into their own hands and above all, to ensure that peace and calm > prevail in the area, and in other parts of Orissa. > > Violence, for whatever the provocation, is non-acceptable, and will > definitely not help achieve the goals for which these acts are > committed. We therefore call upon all those responsible for these acts > and to eschew violence immediately. No violence can be justified, for > whatever the reason. However, for the last several months, the > Government of Orissa has allowed some fascist and fundamentalist > forces to terrorize the poor, the marginalized and the minorities of > the State. These forces have carried on their virulent propaganda and > their violent acts with apparent immunity. > > There has been a total abdication of responsibility by the Government > of Orissa and the concerned authorities, like the police. They should > now also be held totally responsible for these deaths and for allowing > the situation to go out of control. Sufficient warning has been given > to the Orissa Government, of the deteriorating situation, as early as > in September 2006, with the publication of "Communalism in Orissa" > - > the Report of the Indian People's Tribunal on Environment and Human > Rights - headed by Justice K. K. Usha (Retd.) former Chief Justice of > the Kerala High Court. It may still not be too late to ensure that > the Constitutional Rights and Freedoms of the people of Orissa are not > merely guaranteed by also protected by the State. > > Fr. Cedric Prakash sj, Director > > - -- > > Please visit these sites: > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in Wed Aug 27 19:16:36 2008 From: sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in (S.Fatima) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:16:36 +0530 (IST) Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808270624y1f9538fagcb85d272d4304d18@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <471728.84688.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Radhikarajen and Aditya You fell for the trap. I never mentioned any Hindu-Muslim issue here. I was only referring to Indians (which incidentally I am too). You immediately jumped to my identity of a Muslim and referred to Sania and my previous emails. Interesting to see how your minds work when reacting to any Muslims' post. Do you think no Indian has the right to criticize our pathetic status in sports? Or you think that such criticism should only come from a Hindu? If a person with a Muslim names criticizes it, she must be anti-national? And by the way, could you specify which of my emails has been offending to you. My views have always been inclusive - targeted only to generate a dialogue but no malice. Let me know which of my emails offended you. SF > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > Fatima, > > > > You forgot the most important sport; though not in > Olympics till now. > > > > You are the best in shooting mails; offending > ofcourse. Be in London for the > > next Olympics; Gold is there waiting... > > > > Cheers > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > wrote: > >> > >> Hey, you forgot something else, Sania took her > mother as manager, had > >> perfect health to pose for her sponsors, now > falling down at rank70 in > >> tennis, is another example of pampered indian, who > has forgotten what game > >> is after crores in kitty.? > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: hasina hasan > > >> Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 4:06 pm > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for > Indians > >> To: sarai , > sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > >> > >> > ...we are also modestly good at: > >> > - whining about winning > >> > - sighing at large on the state of our state. > >> > > >> > we from > >> > our pc's here to anothers' there, say > write: 'hey why you think > >> > that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear > me for i speak well > >> > and have a nobler > >> > view'. > >> > (see me here now) > >> > > >> > or > >> > was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny > images that never got > >> > attached > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima > wrote: > >> > From: S.Fatima > > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for > Indians > >> > To: "sarai" > > >> > Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM > >> > > >> > Some people say that Indians are peace-loving > people and never > >> > offend/invade any > >> > body. (Some say Indians never invaded others > for last 10,000 > >> > years!). But in > >> > Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win > medals in the most > >> > offendeinggames: > >> > > >> > Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting > >> > > >> > Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling > >> > > >> > Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing > >> > > >> > Does it mean that we are good only in > shooting, wresting and > >> > boxing others > >> > down. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Add more friends to your messenger and > enjoy! Go to > >> > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > >> > _________________________________________ > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media > and the city. > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> > subscribe in > >> > the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > >> > list > >> > List archive: > > >> > > >> > > >> > Bollywood news, movie reviews, film > trailers and more! Go to > >> > > http://in.movies.yahoo.com/_________________________________________ > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media > and the city. > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > >> > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> > subscribe in the subject header. > >> > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > >> > list > >> > List archive: > > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and > the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 19:18:27 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 06:48:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding Message-ID: <957078.86410.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> We all know Human Right activists are made for Muslims only... and they are anti-Hindu... Where were they when Godhra took place? Where were they when 4 lakh Kashmiri lost their homeland? Where were they when thousands of Kashmiris were being massacred on their own homeland? Where were they when thousands of Temples were getting demolished much before Babri Masjid case in Kashmir, Bangladesh and Pakistan? Where are they when left out few thousand Hindus are threatened of life and they are made to leave Kashmir? They will suddenly erupt when few Muslims get killed, it hardly matters whether they are killed in riot or retaliation... It becomes a human right issue... Great... Hindus know this now.. you need not publish this news... ----- Original Message ---- From: Khurram Parvez To: SARAI Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:03:08 PM Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding People’s Union for Democratic Rights, Delhi PRESS RELEASE, 26th August 2008 Findings of an Investigation Conducted From 22 to 25 August 2008 A six-member team from four human rights organisations conducted an investigation into the “economic blockade” in Kashmir and its aftermath. The team toured the districts of Srinagar, Budgam, Baramulla, and Bandipora. The team spoke to victims of the violence and their families, people who were part of protests, doctors at the SMHS hospital, journalists, the Kashmir Chamber of Commerce, and office bearers of many social and political organisations. However, the fact finding was disrupted as the state announced an indefinite curfew from the morning of 24th August. The release also addresses the second round of curfew currently in force. The total loss of life during the two periods of curfew stands at over 35. The main findings of the team are summarized below: 1. Azaadi is the primary demand in Kashmir The team arrived in Srinagar on 22 August and witnessed the massive protest meeting at the Idgah grounds. People gathered there publicly declared their primary demand for azaadi (freedom) at the meeting venue and through numerous street processions in various streets of Srinagar on 22 and 23 August. During our interviews with individual families and with groups, people voiced the same demand. A wide range of social and political organisations have also reiterated this demand. 2. Use of curfew to create a confrontation Curfew was imposed from the evening of 11 August and again from the morning of 24 August. The first time it was imposed hours after the security forces opened fire at many places on an unarmed procession heading to the Muzaffarabad border killing at least __ people. It was expected that people would come out in the following day to protest against the killings. Curfew thus became an instrument to prevent people from assembling and gave security forces the power to use force against unarmed protestors. The second time curfew was imposed with the express purpose of preventing the dharna at Lal Chowk. The previous gathering at Idgah, where this dharna was announced, had been peaceful. Therefore curfew became the means by which a confrontation was created, which could have been easily avoided. The clamping down on media and the brutal attacks on journalists happened while the team was still there. Arrests of leaders, raids of homes and intimidation of local residents by the army and CRPF are happening even now. On 24th itself, our team issued an appeal to the central government to lift the curfew to prevent loss of life. 3. Deliberate blockade of supplies and its indifferent handling. While our team has not investigated the happenings in the Jammu region, its impact on Kashmir has been confirmed through our interviews. Protests in Jammu, which started from early July, took a more violent turn from the beginning of August. This led to severe restriction on the movement of goods and people on the Srinagar-Jammu highway and even into Punjab. Records at the highway check points, as reported in the Economic Times (21.8.08), confirm the substantial lowering of goods traffic in July and its worsening in August. Shortages were created as a result: of oils and cooking gas in the rural areas, of cereals and medicines in the urban areas. Given the fears of Kashmiri transporters and drivers, the impact was far worse in traffic moving out of Kashmir. This has led to substantial losses for fruit growers as well as handicrafts and carpet manufacturers and transporters. Fruit could be found rotting at many places and handicraft manufacturers report cancellation of export orders for the ramazan season and fears for the Christmas season. The team was told that till 23rd August, 80 % of the trucks were not leaving the valley for fear of attacks and only some 15-20 trucks were able to carry the apples out of the valley after assurance of safe passage from the government. The loss—over 75% of the fruit are rotting in the Sopore mandi. In Seer Jagir, a village in Sopore tehsil, the team met small farmers with average land holding of 4-5 acres, which produces on an average 3000 boxes of apples per annum. The 30 farmers in this village reported that they have lost on an average Rs 2 lakh this season. Therefore, the total loss of this small village account to nearly 60 lakh. The government’s lackadaisical attitude in ensuring supplies and its attempt to deny the ‘blockade’ led to feeling of ill-will in Kashmir. 4. Firing incidents (11-14th August) were unprovoked and aimed to kill The team investigated 15 cases of deaths that occurred on account of firing by CRPF and JK police between 11 and 14 August. The actual death toll is estimated to be above 30. The findings show a clear pattern: (a) The firings were aimed to kill. This was evident from eye witness accounts which showed that the firings were indiscriminate and aimed directly at the crowd. At Paribal, near Bandipura town on 12th August the RR and JK police fired on the crowd from above the hill where the 15 RR camp is located. (b) A large number of deaths resulted from injuries in the abdomen, chest, head or upper or lower back. The same was confirmed by hospital records. (c) In some cases, as at Lasjen on 12 August, protesters were deceived into by an assurance of allowing peaceful procession and then resorting to firing. Three people were killed including one 50 year old woman and six others received bullet injuries. 5. Attacks on those Injured The total number of people injured in the period between 11 and 14 August is not clearly established. However, at SMHS hospital alone, over 500 patients were admitted in the same period. The team met families and those injured and killed in the attacks. We were repeatedly told that the security forces never tried to reach the injured to hospital. Worse, vehicles carrying injured to hospital were routinely attacked. Hospital sources claim that a number of ambulances were attacked. The same is confirmed by news reports today and the health department has threatened to stop ambulance services given the injuries received by ambulance drivers. Our team was told that in Lasjen, even those carrying dead bodies back from the hospital were attacked on 12th August. Elsewhere, in Bandipora the same was reported. The van carrying Mehrajuddin Kakh, injured in the Bandipura killing on 12 August, was attacked by CRPF and STF at Parimpora. Not only were the occupants attacked, Mehrajuddin’s thigh injury was brutalized by twisting a lathi in it. He died the same night. Equally, Imran Ahmed Wani who was injured in the Bagi Mehtab firing on 12 August was deliberately refused ambulance service for nearly two hours. In fact, when he did get into one, it was attacked at Rambagh Pul. He was declared dead on arrival at the hospital. 6. Attack on the SMHS hospital, Srinagar What is unbelievable is the attack on SMHS Hospital on 11 and 12 August successively. The SMHS hospital received the largest number of casualties. When doctors were trying to conduct emergency operations at break-neck speed in order to save lives, the Casualty was attacked with tear gas shells followed by firing live bullets. The firing was again repeated on 12 August. It is the dedication of doctors, paramedic staff, ambulance drivers and timely arranging of bandages, gauze and cotton by the medical representatives, at the risk of their own lives, that managed to save a large number of lives. The doctors also confirmed that the help received by the ordinary people in saving the lives of those injured was remarkable. People helped the medical staff in transporting the wounded to the OT, aided in tending treatment in the Casualty and arranged vans and ambulances to carry them to the different hospitals in the city and elsewhere. 7. Attacks on Funeral Processions Funeral processions were repeatedly attacked in many places as large numbers of people marched with the bier to the graveyards. The team was told that the funeral procession of Ishfaq Ahmed Kana, shot dead at Qamarwari Chowk, Srinagar on 11 August, to the Idgah Martyrs Memorial was attacked by the CRPF with lathis and rubber bullets. In Baghi Mahtab, Javed Ahmed Mir’s funeral procession was attacked and one person was killed in the firing. Other protest demonstrations protesting against the killings were also attacked. For instance, the protest demonstration following the shooting of Owais Majeed Zarga in Rainawari, Srinagar on 12th August was attacked by the Kashmir police stationed outside the office of the local MLA, Mhd Shahid. Two boys were injured in the firing. 8. Raids and Attacks on Residents: During the evening of 13 and 14 August, security forces engaged in an indiscriminate and large-scale attack on houses in localities close to the firings, thrashing people and smashing window panes. At Safakadal, Srinagar, residents showed how their houses and a nearby mosque were attacked by the CRPF. At Lasjen, JK police and CRPF personnel entered houses to thrash people. Relatives were forcibly prevented from accessing homes of deceased and women relatives at the house of Imtiaz Rahim, who died in the firing, showed us the marks of brutality at the hands of the security forces. 9. FIRs: Refusals and Distortions: In most cases, the families have not registered any FIRs against the security forces as they fear going to the police station or that it would invite further violence. Where families of those killed were able to go to police stations after many days, they found that FIRs were already lodged stating that the protestors attacked security forces who in turn were forced to open fire. When families tried to get their version recorded, the same was refused. Complaints are rejected. In the case of the Bagi Mahtab killings where the families of the deceased (Javed Ahmed Mir and Imran Ahmed Wani) were given a totally false version of the happenings in the FIR. When challenged, the police said that the families must come ten days later with 4 eye witnesses to corroborate their story. This refusal even to receive complaints is tantamount to making the security forces judges of their own actions. 10. Present Curfew and Developments On 24 August, Kashmir was greeted by indefinite curfew when it woke up in the morning. Within a few hours four media persons, on their way to office had been badly beaten up at Rambagh by the CRPF. The identity cards and passes issued during the last phase of curfew presented by the journalists were rejected. Mr Bilal, bureau chief of Sahara Samay was admitted to the Bone and Joints hospital and later to the SMHS hospital. By evening, security forces opened fire in Dal Gate area killing one person and critically injuring another. Homes of political leaders were raided and some arrested. In the rural areas, the army threatened local imams, nambardars and chowkidars on 24 August that they would be held responsible if people dared to join in the procession to Lal Chowk. Over the last two days, the curfew has lad to at least seven people being killed in firing by security forces and over 275 injured in various parts of Kashmir valley. Essential supplies to Srinagar city, such as medicines, water tankers and milk, have been blocked and this ‘blockade’ has been done at the instance of the CRPF. The entire control of land and order in Srinagar city has all been handed over to the CRPF and news reports have suggested that the local police have also been beaten by the CRPF. CONCLUSION The investigation team is of the opinion that the firing, brutality, loss of life was not only wholly avoidable but done deliberately. The disruption of road traffic to Kashmir needed to be recognized by the government and addressed. The resort to curfew after the firing on 11 August denied the people a right to protest and be heard. Additionally, the curfew provided the security forces the power to open fire with impunity. A number of extremely inhuman crimes were committed by the security forces by denying and obstructing medical aid to the injured, attacking the injured and most seriously by launching an attack on the SMHS hospital. No existing law in the country provides immunity to police and security forces for such crimes. The lack of any action against these forces even where the crimes are established by eye-witnesses and reported in newspapers, makes people lose whatever faith in the government that may have remained after decades of army rule. Despite these happenings, the people of Kashmir have shown exemplary restraint and ensured that all processions and public gatherings after the lifting of curfew remain wholly peaceful. This situation should have been utilized to initiate political dialogue instead of the visit by the National Security Advisor. The imposition of curfew to prevent another such pre-declared peaceful mass gathering can only be seen as an invitation to another bloody attack on protestors and serves as a message to the people of Kashmir that the Indian government would not tolerate peaceful and unarmed protest. WE DEMAND 1. Immediate lifting of the curfew and restoration of ample space to people to peaceably collect and voice their demands. 2. Criminal charges be registered against those responsible for attacks on injured people, ambulances and hospitals as well as widespread damage to houses. 3. Peoples complaints concerning arbitrary and indiscriminate use of fire by security forces be registered and the culprits brought to book. 4. Law and order duties be immediately restored to the police in Srinagar and all forces be made ot work ‘in aid of civil power’ as required by law. 5. The situation of the peaceful expression of peoples demands be utilized to initiate a political dialogue, the political establishment is duty-bound to do so when people in such large numbers are voicing these. Harish Dhawan Secretary, PUDR On behalf of People’s Democratic Forum (PDF), Karnataka Andhra Pradesh Civil Liberties Committee (APCLC), Andhra Pradesh Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), Jammu and Kashmir People’s Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), Delhi _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 19:19:36 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:49:36 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: <471728.84688.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <9c06aab30808270624y1f9538fagcb85d272d4304d18@mail.gmail.com> <471728.84688.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Have I mentioned Sania is muslim, only pampered indian I said. : ) ----- Original Message ----- From: "S.Fatima" Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:16 pm Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians To: Aditya Raj Kaul , Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् , sarai , radhikarajen at vsnl.net > Dear Radhikarajen and Aditya > You fell for the trap. I never mentioned any Hindu-Muslim issue > here. I was only referring to Indians (which incidentally I am > too). You immediately jumped to my identity of a Muslim and > referred to Sania and my previous emails. Interesting to see how > your minds work when reacting to any Muslims' post. Do you think > no Indian has the right to criticize our pathetic status in > sports? Or you think that such criticism should only come from a > Hindu? If a person with a Muslim names criticizes it, she must be > anti-national? > > And by the way, could you specify which of my emails has been > offending to you. My views have always been inclusive - targeted > only to generate a dialogue but no malice. Let me know which of my > emails offended you. > > SF > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > > wrote: > > > Fatima, > > > > > > You forgot the most important sport; though not in > > Olympics till now. > > > > > > You are the best in shooting mails; offending > > ofcourse. Be in London for the > > > next Olympics; Gold is there waiting... > > > > > > Cheers > > > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > > > > On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > wrote: > > >> > > >> Hey, you forgot something else, Sania took her > > mother as manager, had > > >> perfect health to pose for her sponsors, now > > falling down at rank70 in > > >> tennis, is another example of pampered indian, who > > has forgotten what game > > >> is after crores in kitty.? > > >> > > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > >> From: hasina hasan > > > > >> Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 4:06 pm > > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for > > Indians > > >> To: sarai , > > sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > >> > > >> > ...we are also modestly good at: > > >> > - whining about winning > > >> > - sighing at large on the state of our state. > > >> > > > >> > we from > > >> > our pc's here to anothers' there, say > > write: 'hey why you think > > >> > that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear > > me for i speak well > > >> > and have a nobler > > >> > view'. > > >> > (see me here now) > > >> > > > >> > or > > >> > was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny > > images that never got > > >> > attached > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima > > wrote: > > >> > From: S.Fatima > > > > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for > > Indians > > >> > To: "sarai" > > > > >> > Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM > > >> > > > >> > Some people say that Indians are peace-loving > > people and never > > >> > offend/invade any > > >> > body. (Some say Indians never invaded others > > for last 10,000 > > >> > years!). But in > > >> > Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win > > medals in the most > > >> > offendeinggames: > > >> > > > >> > Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting > > >> > > > >> > Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling > > >> > > > >> > Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing > > >> > > > >> > Does it mean that we are good only in > > shooting, wresting and > > >> > boxing others > > >> > down. > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > Add more friends to your messenger and > > enjoy! Go to > > >> > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > > >> > _________________________________________ > > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media > > and the city. > > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > > >> > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > >> > subscribe in > > >> > the subject header. > > >> > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > >> > list > > >> > List archive: > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > Bollywood news, movie reviews, film > > trailers and more! Go to > > >> > > > http://in.movies.yahoo.com/_________________________________________ > > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media > > and the city. > > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > > >> > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > >> > subscribe in the subject header. > > >> > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > >> > list > > >> > List archive: > > > > >> __________________________=5F______________ > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and > > the city. > > >> Critiques & Collaborations > > >> To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > >> subscribe in the subject header. > > >> To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > >> List archive: > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > > header. > > > To unsubscribe: > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 19:22:35 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:52:35 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding In-Reply-To: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Were you in II world war with hiter and his propaganda machine or did you get any transplant from those ? ----- Original Message ----- From: Khurram Parvez Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:03 pm Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding To: SARAI > >      People’s Union for Democratic Rights, Delhi >   > > PRESS RELEASE, 26th August 2008 >   > Findings of an Investigation Conducted From 22 to 25 August 2008 >   > A six-member team from four human rights organisations conducted > an investigation into the “economic blockade” in Kashmir and its > aftermath. The team toured the districts of Srinagar, Budgam, > Baramulla, and Bandipora. The team spoke to victims of the > violence and their families, people who were part of protests, > doctors at the SMHS hospital, journalists, the Kashmir Chamber of > Commerce, and office bearers of many social and political > organisations. However, the fact finding was disrupted as the > state announced an indefinite curfew from the morning of 24th > August. The release also addresses the second round of curfew > currently in force. The total loss of life during the two periods > of curfew stands at over 35. > The main findings of the team are summarized below: >   > 1.  Azaadi is the primary demand in Kashmir > The team arrived in Srinagar on 22 August and witnessed the > massive protest meeting at the Idgah grounds. People gathered > there publicly declared their primary demand for azaadi (freedom) > at the meeting venue and through numerous street processions in > various streets of Srinagar on 22 and 23 August. During our > interviews with individual families and with groups, people voiced > the same demand. A wide range of social and political > organisations have also reiterated this demand. >   > 2.  Use of curfew to create a confrontation > Curfew was imposed from the evening of 11 August and again from > the morning of 24 August. The first time it was imposed hours > after the security forces opened fire at many places on an unarmed > procession heading to the Muzaffarabad border killing at least __ > people. It was expected that people would come out in the > following day to protest against the killings. Curfew thus became > an instrument to prevent people from assembling and gave security > forces the power to use force against unarmed protestors. > The second time curfew was imposed with the express purpose of > preventing the dharna at Lal Chowk. The previous gathering at > Idgah, where this dharna was announced, had been peaceful. > Therefore curfew became the means by which a confrontation was > created, which could have been easily avoided. The clamping down > on media and the brutal attacks on journalists happened while the > team was still there. Arrests of leaders, raids of homes and > intimidation of local residents by the army and CRPF are happening > even now. On 24th itself, our team issued an appeal to the central > government to lift the curfew to prevent loss of life. >   > 3. Deliberate blockade of supplies and its indifferent handling. > While our team has not investigated the happenings in the Jammu > region, its impact on Kashmir has been confirmed through our > interviews. Protests in Jammu, which started from early July, took > a more violent turn from the beginning of August. This led to > severe restriction on the movement of goods and people on the > Srinagar-Jammu highway and even into Punjab. Records at the > highway check points, as reported in the Economic Times (21.8.08), > confirm the substantial lowering of goods traffic in July and its > worsening in August. Shortages were created as a result: of oils > and cooking gas in the rural areas, of cereals and medicines in > the urban areas. Given the fears of Kashmiri transporters and > drivers, the impact was far worse in traffic moving out of > Kashmir. This has led to substantial losses for fruit growers as > well as handicrafts and carpet manufacturers and transporters. > Fruit could be found rotting at many places and handicraft > manufacturers report > cancellation of export orders for the ramazan season and fears > for the Christmas season. The team was told that till 23rd August, > 80 % of the trucks were not leaving the valley for fear of attacks > and only some 15-20 trucks were able to carry the apples out of > the valley after assurance of safe passage from the government. > The loss—over 75% of the fruit are rotting in the Sopore mandi. In > Seer Jagir, a village in Sopore tehsil, the team met small farmers > with average land holding of 4-5 acres, which produces on an > average 3000 boxes of apples per annum. The 30 farmers in this > village reported that they have lost on an average Rs 2 lakh this > season. Therefore, the total loss of this small village account to > nearly 60 lakh. The government’s lackadaisical attitude in > ensuring supplies and its attempt to deny the ‘blockade’ led to > feeling of ill-will in Kashmir. >   > 4. Firing incidents (11-14th August) were unprovoked and aimed to kill > The team investigated 15 cases of deaths that occurred on account > of firing by CRPF and JK police between 11 and 14 August. The > actual death toll is estimated to be above 30. The findings show a > clear pattern: (a) The firings were aimed to kill. This was > evident from eye witness accounts which showed that the firings > were indiscriminate and aimed directly at the crowd. At Paribal, > near Bandipura town on 12th August the RR and JK police fired on > the crowd from above the hill where the 15 RR camp is located. (b) > A large number of deaths resulted from injuries in the abdomen, > chest, head or upper or lower back. The same was confirmed by > hospital records. (c) In some cases, as at Lasjen on 12 August, > protesters were deceived into by an assurance of allowing peaceful > procession and then resorting to firing. Three people were killed > including one 50 year old woman and six others received bullet > injuries. >   > 5.  Attacks on those Injured > The total number of people injured in the period between 11 and 14 > August is not clearly established. However, at SMHS hospital > alone, over 500 patients were admitted in the same period. The > team met families and those injured and killed in the attacks. We > were repeatedly told that the security forces never tried to reach > the injured to hospital. Worse, vehicles carrying injured to > hospital were routinely attacked. Hospital sources claim that a > number of ambulances were attacked. The same is confirmed by news > reports today and the health department has threatened to stop > ambulance services given the injuries received by ambulance > drivers. Our team was told that in Lasjen, even those carrying > dead bodies back from the hospital were attacked on 12th August. > Elsewhere, in Bandipora the same was reported. The van carrying > Mehrajuddin Kakh, injured in the Bandipura killing on 12 August, > was attacked by CRPF and STF at Parimpora. Not only were the occupants > attacked, Mehrajuddin’s thigh injury was brutalized by twisting a > lathi in it. He died the same night. Equally, Imran Ahmed Wani who > was injured in the Bagi Mehtab firing on 12 August was > deliberately refused ambulance service for nearly two hours. In > fact, when he did get into one, it was attacked at Rambagh Pul. He > was declared dead on arrival at the hospital. >   > 6.  Attack on the SMHS hospital, Srinagar > What is unbelievable is the attack on SMHS Hospital on 11 and 12 > August successively. The SMHS hospital received the largest number > of casualties. When doctors were trying to conduct emergency > operations at break-neck speed in order to save lives, the > Casualty was attacked with tear gas shells followed by firing live > bullets. The firing was again repeated on 12 August. It is the > dedication of doctors, paramedic staff, ambulance drivers and > timely arranging of bandages, gauze and cotton by the medical > representatives, at the risk of their own lives, that managed to > save a large number of lives. The doctors also confirmed that the > help received by the ordinary people in saving the lives of those > injured was remarkable. People helped the medical staff in > transporting the wounded to the OT, aided in tending treatment in > the Casualty and arranged vans and ambulances to carry them to the > different hospitals in the city and elsewhere. >   > 7.  Attacks on Funeral Processions > Funeral processions were repeatedly attacked in many places as > large numbers of people marched with the bier to the graveyards. > The team was told that the funeral procession of Ishfaq Ahmed > Kana, shot dead at Qamarwari Chowk, Srinagar on 11 August, to the > Idgah Martyrs Memorial was attacked by the CRPF with lathis and > rubber bullets. In Baghi Mahtab, Javed Ahmed Mir’s funeral > procession was attacked and one person was killed in the firing. > Other protest demonstrations protesting against the killings were > also attacked. For instance, the protest demonstration following > the shooting of Owais Majeed Zarga in Rainawari, Srinagar on 12th > August was attacked by the Kashmir police stationed outside the > office of the local MLA, Mhd Shahid. Two boys were injured in the > firing. >   > 8.  Raids and Attacks on Residents: > During the evening of 13 and 14 August, security forces engaged in > an indiscriminate and large-scale attack on houses in localities > close to the firings, thrashing people and smashing window panes. > At Safakadal, Srinagar, residents showed how their houses and a > nearby mosque were attacked by the CRPF. At Lasjen, JK police and > CRPF personnel entered houses to thrash people. Relatives were > forcibly prevented from accessing homes of deceased and women > relatives at the house of Imtiaz Rahim, who died in the firing, > showed us the marks of brutality at the hands of the security > forces. >   > 9. FIRs: Refusals and Distortions: > In most cases, the families have not registered any FIRs against > the security forces as they fear going to the police station or > that it would invite further violence. Where families of those > killed were able to go to police stations after many days, they > found that FIRs were already lodged stating that the protestors > attacked security forces who in turn were forced to open fire. > When families tried to get their version recorded, the same was > refused. Complaints are rejected. In the case of the Bagi Mahtab > killings where the families of the deceased (Javed Ahmed Mir and > Imran Ahmed Wani) were given a totally false version of the > happenings in the FIR. When challenged, the police said that the > families must come ten days later with 4 eye witnesses to > corroborate their story. This refusal even to receive complaints > is tantamount to making the security forces judges of their own > actions.  > 10. Present Curfew and Developments > On 24 August, Kashmir was greeted by indefinite curfew when it > woke up in the morning. Within a few hours four media persons, on > their way to office had been badly beaten up at Rambagh by the > CRPF. The identity cards and passes issued during the last phase > of curfew presented by the journalists were rejected. Mr Bilal, > bureau chief of Sahara Samay was admitted to the Bone and Joints > hospital and later to the SMHS hospital. By evening, security > forces opened fire in Dal Gate area killing one person and > critically injuring another. Homes of political leaders were > raided and some arrested. In the rural areas, the army threatened > local imams, nambardars and chowkidars on 24 August that they > would be held responsible if people dared to join in the > procession to Lal Chowk. Over the last two days, the curfew has > lad to at least seven people being killed in firing by security > forces and over 275 injured in various parts of Kashmir valley. > Essential supplies to Srinagar city, such as medicines, water > tankers and milk, have been blocked and this ‘blockade’ has been > done at the instance of the CRPF. The entire control of land and > order in Srinagar city has all been handed over to the CRPF and > news reports have suggested that the local police have also been > beaten by the CRPF. > CONCLUSION > The investigation team is of the opinion that the firing, > brutality, loss of life was not only wholly avoidable but done > deliberately. The disruption of road traffic to Kashmir needed to > be recognized by the government and addressed. The resort to > curfew after the firing on 11 August denied the people a right to > protest and be heard. Additionally, the curfew provided the > security forces the power to open fire with impunity. A number of > extremely inhuman crimes were committed by the security forces by > denying and obstructing medical aid to the injured, attacking the > injured and most seriously by launching an attack on the SMHS > hospital. No existing law in the country provides immunity to > police and security forces for such crimes. The lack of any action > against these forces even where the crimes are established by eye- > witnesses and reported in newspapers, makes people lose whatever > faith in the government that may have remained after decades of > army rule. > Despite these happenings, the people of Kashmir have shown > exemplary restraint and ensured that all processions and public > gatherings after the lifting of curfew remain wholly peaceful. > This situation should have been utilized to initiate political > dialogue instead of the visit by the National Security Advisor. > The imposition of curfew to prevent another such pre-declared > peaceful mass gathering can only be seen as an invitation to > another bloody attack on protestors and serves as a message to the > people of Kashmir that the Indian government would not tolerate > peaceful and unarmed protest. >   > WE DEMAND > 1.             Immediate lifting of the curfew and restoration of > ample space to people to peaceably collect and voice their demands. > 2.             Criminal charges be registered against those > responsible for attacks on injured people, ambulances and > hospitals as well as widespread damage to houses. > 3.             Peoples complaints concerning arbitrary and > indiscriminate use of fire by security forces be registered and > the culprits brought to book. > 4.             Law and order duties be immediately restored to the > police in Srinagar and all forces be made ot work ‘in aid of civil > power’ as required by law. > 5.             The situation of the peaceful expression of peoples > demands be utilized to initiate a political dialogue, the > political establishment is duty-bound to do so when people in such > large numbers are voicing these. >   >   > Harish Dhawan > Secretary, PUDR > On behalf of > People’s Democratic Forum (PDF), Karnataka > Andhra Pradesh Civil Liberties Committee (APCLC), Andhra Pradesh > Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), Jammu and Kashmir > People’s Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), Delhi >   > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 19:30:52 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:30:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808270624y1f9538fagcb85d272d4304d18@mail.gmail.com> <471728.84688.qm@web8402.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270700s1fa173dew3e2525aefb0f295e@mail.gmail.com> And, I already declared you an Olympic Gold Winner. Be Happy Sports Star. :) I'm amazed by the happiness you got by scoring a mark if at all here...lol Is this all what you desire for ? Of course your first mail was offending. What is there so offending in Shooting, Wrestling and Boxing if we take it positively? Its how you take it Ma'am. If hatred, religion, communal ism, terrorism, gets too much into the brain; then this offence is surely genuine. On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > > Have I mentioned Sania is muslim, only pampered indian I said. : ) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "S.Fatima" > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:16 pm > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for Indians > To: Aditya Raj Kaul , Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् < > mail at shivamvij.com>, sarai , radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > Dear Radhikarajen and Aditya > > You fell for the trap. I never mentioned any Hindu-Muslim issue > > here. I was only referring to Indians (which incidentally I am > > too). You immediately jumped to my identity of a Muslim and > > referred to Sania and my previous emails. Interesting to see how > > your minds work when reacting to any Muslims' post. Do you think > > no Indian has the right to criticize our pathetic status in > > sports? Or you think that such criticism should only come from a > > Hindu? If a person with a Muslim names criticizes it, she must be > > anti-national? > > > > And by the way, could you specify which of my emails has been > > offending to you. My views have always been inclusive - targeted > > only to generate a dialogue but no malice. Let me know which of my > > emails offended you. > > > > SF > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > > > wrote: > > > > Fatima, > > > > > > > > You forgot the most important sport; though not in > > > Olympics till now. > > > > > > > > You are the best in shooting mails; offending > > > ofcourse. Be in London for the > > > > next Olympics; Gold is there waiting... > > > > > > > > Cheers > > > > > > > > Aditya Raj Kaul > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net > > > wrote: > > > >> > > > >> Hey, you forgot something else, Sania took her > > > mother as manager, had > > > >> perfect health to pose for her sponsors, now > > > falling down at rank70 in > > > >> tennis, is another example of pampered indian, who > > > has forgotten what game > > > >> is after crores in kitty.? > > > >> > > > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > > >> From: hasina hasan > > > > > > >> Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 4:06 pm > > > >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] olympics medals for > > > Indians > > > >> To: sarai , > > > sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in > > > >> > > > >> > ...we are also modestly good at: > > > >> > - whining about winning > > > >> > - sighing at large on the state of our state. > > > >> > > > > >> > we from > > > >> > our pc's here to anothers' there, say > > > write: 'hey why you think > > > >> > that, why say that, why feel that? hmmm? hear > > > me for i speak well > > > >> > and have a nobler > > > >> > view'. > > > >> > (see me here now) > > > >> > > > > >> > or > > > >> > was it supposed to be a fwd with some funny > > > images that never got > > > >> > attached > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > --- On Tue, 26/8/08, S.Fatima > > > wrote: > > > >> > From: S.Fatima > > > > > > >> > Subject: [Reader-list] olympics medals for > > > Indians > > > >> > To: "sarai" > > > > > > >> > Date: Tuesday, 26 August, 2008, 7:58 AM > > > >> > > > > >> > Some people say that Indians are peace-loving > > > people and never > > > >> > offend/invade any > > > >> > body. (Some say Indians never invaded others > > > for last 10,000 > > > >> > years!). But in > > > >> > Olympics, the Indian sportsmen could only win > > > medals in the most > > > >> > offendeinggames: > > > >> > > > > >> > Abhinav Bindra, gold in Shooting > > > >> > > > > >> > Sushil Kumar, bronze in Wrestling > > > >> > > > > >> > Vijender Singh, bronze in boxing > > > >> > > > > >> > Does it mean that we are good only in > > > shooting, wresting and > > > >> > boxing others > > > >> > down. > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Add more friends to your messenger and > > > enjoy! Go to > > > >> > http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ > > > >> > _________________________________________ > > > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media > > > and the city. > > > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > > > >> > To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > >> > subscribe in > > > >> > the subject header. > > > >> > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > >> > list > > > >> > List archive: > > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Bollywood news, movie reviews, film > > > trailers and more! Go to > > > >> > > > > http://in.movies.yahoo.com/_________________________________________ > > > >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media > > > and the city. > > > >> > Critiques & Collaborations > > > >> > To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > >> > subscribe in the subject header. > > > >> > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > >> > list > > > >> > List archive: > > > > > > >> _________________________________________ > > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and > > > the city. > > > >> Critiques & Collaborations > > > >> To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > >> subscribe in the subject header. > > > >> To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > >> List archive: > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the > > > city. > > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > > To subscribe: send an email to > > > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > > > header. > > > > To unsubscribe: > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > > List archive: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > > yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > > From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 19:32:54 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:32:54 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding In-Reply-To: References: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808270702m10c3fbfav52e62ae4d6350799@mail.gmail.com> I quote Aarti. They are clones. :) Communal propaganda...isn't it ? On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > > Were you in II world war with hiter and his propaganda machine or did you > get any transplant from those ? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Khurram Parvez > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:03 pm > Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding > To: SARAI > > > > > People's Union for Democratic Rights, Delhi > > > > > > PRESS RELEASE, 26th August 2008 > > > > Findings of an Investigation Conducted From 22 to 25 August 2008 > > > > A six-member team from four human rights organisations conducted > > an investigation into the "economic blockade" in Kashmir and its > > aftermath. The team toured the districts of Srinagar, Budgam, > > Baramulla, and Bandipora. The team spoke to victims of the > > violence and their families, people who were part of protests, > > doctors at the SMHS hospital, journalists, the Kashmir Chamber of > > Commerce, and office bearers of many social and political > > organisations. However, the fact finding was disrupted as the > > state announced an indefinite curfew from the morning of 24th > > August. The release also addresses the second round of curfew > > currently in force. The total loss of life during the two periods > > of curfew stands at over 35. > > The main findings of the team are summarized below: > > > > 1. Azaadi is the primary demand in Kashmir > > The team arrived in Srinagar on 22 August and witnessed the > > massive protest meeting at the Idgah grounds. People gathered > > there publicly declared their primary demand for azaadi (freedom) > > at the meeting venue and through numerous street processions in > > various streets of Srinagar on 22 and 23 August. During our > > interviews with individual families and with groups, people voiced > > the same demand. A wide range of social and political > > organisations have also reiterated this demand. > > > > 2. Use of curfew to create a confrontation > > Curfew was imposed from the evening of 11 August and again from > > the morning of 24 August. The first time it was imposed hours > > after the security forces opened fire at many places on an unarmed > > procession heading to the Muzaffarabad border killing at least __ > > people. It was expected that people would come out in the > > following day to protest against the killings. Curfew thus became > > an instrument to prevent people from assembling and gave security > > forces the power to use force against unarmed protestors. > > The second time curfew was imposed with the express purpose of > > preventing the dharna at Lal Chowk. The previous gathering at > > Idgah, where this dharna was announced, had been peaceful. > > Therefore curfew became the means by which a confrontation was > > created, which could have been easily avoided. The clamping down > > on media and the brutal attacks on journalists happened while the > > team was still there. Arrests of leaders, raids of homes and > > intimidation of local residents by the army and CRPF are happening > > even now. On 24th itself, our team issued an appeal to the central > > government to lift the curfew to prevent loss of life. > > > > 3. Deliberate blockade of supplies and its indifferent handling. > > While our team has not investigated the happenings in the Jammu > > region, its impact on Kashmir has been confirmed through our > > interviews. Protests in Jammu, which started from early July, took > > a more violent turn from the beginning of August. This led to > > severe restriction on the movement of goods and people on the > > Srinagar-Jammu highway and even into Punjab. Records at the > > highway check points, as reported in the Economic Times (21.8.08), > > confirm the substantial lowering of goods traffic in July and its > > worsening in August. Shortages were created as a result: of oils > > and cooking gas in the rural areas, of cereals and medicines in > > the urban areas. Given the fears of Kashmiri transporters and > > drivers, the impact was far worse in traffic moving out of > > Kashmir. This has led to substantial losses for fruit growers as > > well as handicrafts and carpet manufacturers and transporters. > > Fruit could be found rotting at many places and handicraft > > manufacturers report > > cancellation of export orders for the ramazan season and fears > > for the Christmas season. The team was told that till 23rd August, > > 80 % of the trucks were not leaving the valley for fear of attacks > > and only some 15-20 trucks were able to carry the apples out of > > the valley after assurance of safe passage from the government. > > The loss—over 75% of the fruit are rotting in the Sopore mandi. In > > Seer Jagir, a village in Sopore tehsil, the team met small farmers > > with average land holding of 4-5 acres, which produces on an > > average 3000 boxes of apples per annum. The 30 farmers in this > > village reported that they have lost on an average Rs 2 lakh this > > season. Therefore, the total loss of this small village account to > > nearly 60 lakh. The government's lackadaisical attitude in > > ensuring supplies and its attempt to deny the 'blockade' led to > > feeling of ill-will in Kashmir. > > > > 4. Firing incidents (11-14th August) were unprovoked and aimed to kill > > The team investigated 15 cases of deaths that occurred on account > > of firing by CRPF and JK police between 11 and 14 August. The > > actual death toll is estimated to be above 30. The findings show a > > clear pattern: (a) The firings were aimed to kill. This was > > evident from eye witness accounts which showed that the firings > > were indiscriminate and aimed directly at the crowd. At Paribal, > > near Bandipura town on 12th August the RR and JK police fired on > > the crowd from above the hill where the 15 RR camp is located. (b) > > A large number of deaths resulted from injuries in the abdomen, > > chest, head or upper or lower back. The same was confirmed by > > hospital records. (c) In some cases, as at Lasjen on 12 August, > > protesters were deceived into by an assurance of allowing peaceful > > procession and then resorting to firing. Three people were killed > > including one 50 year old woman and six others received bullet > > injuries. > > > > 5. Attacks on those Injured > > The total number of people injured in the period between 11 and 14 > > August is not clearly established. However, at SMHS hospital > > alone, over 500 patients were admitted in the same period. The > > team met families and those injured and killed in the attacks. We > > were repeatedly told that the security forces never tried to reach > > the injured to hospital. Worse, vehicles carrying injured to > > hospital were routinely attacked. Hospital sources claim that a > > number of ambulances were attacked. The same is confirmed by news > > reports today and the health department has threatened to stop > > ambulance services given the injuries received by ambulance > > drivers. Our team was told that in Lasjen, even those carrying > > dead bodies back from the hospital were attacked on 12th August. > > Elsewhere, in Bandipora the same was reported. The van carrying > > Mehrajuddin Kakh, injured in the Bandipura killing on 12 August, > > was attacked by CRPF and STF at Parimpora. Not only were the occupants > > attacked, Mehrajuddin's thigh injury was brutalized by twisting a > > lathi in it. He died the same night. Equally, Imran Ahmed Wani who > > was injured in the Bagi Mehtab firing on 12 August was > > deliberately refused ambulance service for nearly two hours. In > > fact, when he did get into one, it was attacked at Rambagh Pul. He > > was declared dead on arrival at the hospital. > > > > 6. Attack on the SMHS hospital, Srinagar > > What is unbelievable is the attack on SMHS Hospital on 11 and 12 > > August successively. The SMHS hospital received the largest number > > of casualties. When doctors were trying to conduct emergency > > operations at break-neck speed in order to save lives, the > > Casualty was attacked with tear gas shells followed by firing live > > bullets. The firing was again repeated on 12 August. It is the > > dedication of doctors, paramedic staff, ambulance drivers and > > timely arranging of bandages, gauze and cotton by the medical > > representatives, at the risk of their own lives, that managed to > > save a large number of lives. The doctors also confirmed that the > > help received by the ordinary people in saving the lives of those > > injured was remarkable. People helped the medical staff in > > transporting the wounded to the OT, aided in tending treatment in > > the Casualty and arranged vans and ambulances to carry them to the > > different hospitals in the city and elsewhere. > > > > 7. Attacks on Funeral Processions > > Funeral processions were repeatedly attacked in many places as > > large numbers of people marched with the bier to the graveyards. > > The team was told that the funeral procession of Ishfaq Ahmed > > Kana, shot dead at Qamarwari Chowk, Srinagar on 11 August, to the > > Idgah Martyrs Memorial was attacked by the CRPF with lathis and > > rubber bullets. In Baghi Mahtab, Javed Ahmed Mir's funeral > > procession was attacked and one person was killed in the firing. > > Other protest demonstrations protesting against the killings were > > also attacked. For instance, the protest demonstration following > > the shooting of Owais Majeed Zarga in Rainawari, Srinagar on 12th > > August was attacked by the Kashmir police stationed outside the > > office of the local MLA, Mhd Shahid. Two boys were injured in the > > firing. > > > > 8. Raids and Attacks on Residents: > > During the evening of 13 and 14 August, security forces engaged in > > an indiscriminate and large-scale attack on houses in localities > > close to the firings, thrashing people and smashing window panes. > > At Safakadal, Srinagar, residents showed how their houses and a > > nearby mosque were attacked by the CRPF. At Lasjen, JK police and > > CRPF personnel entered houses to thrash people. Relatives were > > forcibly prevented from accessing homes of deceased and women > > relatives at the house of Imtiaz Rahim, who died in the firing, > > showed us the marks of brutality at the hands of the security > > forces. > > > > 9. FIRs: Refusals and Distortions: > > In most cases, the families have not registered any FIRs against > > the security forces as they fear going to the police station or > > that it would invite further violence. Where families of those > > killed were able to go to police stations after many days, they > > found that FIRs were already lodged stating that the protestors > > attacked security forces who in turn were forced to open fire. > > When families tried to get their version recorded, the same was > > refused. Complaints are rejected. In the case of the Bagi Mahtab > > killings where the families of the deceased (Javed Ahmed Mir and > > Imran Ahmed Wani) were given a totally false version of the > > happenings in the FIR. When challenged, the police said that the > > families must come ten days later with 4 eye witnesses to > > corroborate their story. This refusal even to receive complaints > > is tantamount to making the security forces judges of their own > > actions. > > 10. Present Curfew and Developments > > On 24 August, Kashmir was greeted by indefinite curfew when it > > woke up in the morning. Within a few hours four media persons, on > > their way to office had been badly beaten up at Rambagh by the > > CRPF. The identity cards and passes issued during the last phase > > of curfew presented by the journalists were rejected. Mr Bilal, > > bureau chief of Sahara Samay was admitted to the Bone and Joints > > hospital and later to the SMHS hospital. By evening, security > > forces opened fire in Dal Gate area killing one person and > > critically injuring another. Homes of political leaders were > > raided and some arrested. In the rural areas, the army threatened > > local imams, nambardars and chowkidars on 24 August that they > > would be held responsible if people dared to join in the > > procession to Lal Chowk. Over the last two days, the curfew has > > lad to at least seven people being killed in firing by security > > forces and over 275 injured in various parts of Kashmir valley. > > Essential supplies to Srinagar city, such as medicines, water > > tankers and milk, have been blocked and this 'blockade' has been > > done at the instance of the CRPF. The entire control of land and > > order in Srinagar city has all been handed over to the CRPF and > > news reports have suggested that the local police have also been > > beaten by the CRPF. > > CONCLUSION > > The investigation team is of the opinion that the firing, > > brutality, loss of life was not only wholly avoidable but done > > deliberately. The disruption of road traffic to Kashmir needed to > > be recognized by the government and addressed. The resort to > > curfew after the firing on 11 August denied the people a right to > > protest and be heard. Additionally, the curfew provided the > > security forces the power to open fire with impunity. A number of > > extremely inhuman crimes were committed by the security forces by > > denying and obstructing medical aid to the injured, attacking the > > injured and most seriously by launching an attack on the SMHS > > hospital. No existing law in the country provides immunity to > > police and security forces for such crimes. The lack of any action > > against these forces even where the crimes are established by eye- > > witnesses and reported in newspapers, makes people lose whatever > > faith in the government that may have remained after decades of > > army rule. > > Despite these happenings, the people of Kashmir have shown > > exemplary restraint and ensured that all processions and public > > gatherings after the lifting of curfew remain wholly peaceful. > > This situation should have been utilized to initiate political > > dialogue instead of the visit by the National Security Advisor. > > The imposition of curfew to prevent another such pre-declared > > peaceful mass gathering can only be seen as an invitation to > > another bloody attack on protestors and serves as a message to the > > people of Kashmir that the Indian government would not tolerate > > peaceful and unarmed protest. > > > > WE DEMAND > > 1. Immediate lifting of the curfew and restoration of > > ample space to people to peaceably collect and voice their demands. > > 2. Criminal charges be registered against those > > responsible for attacks on injured people, ambulances and > > hospitals as well as widespread damage to houses. > > 3. Peoples complaints concerning arbitrary and > > indiscriminate use of fire by security forces be registered and > > the culprits brought to book. > > 4. Law and order duties be immediately restored to the > > police in Srinagar and all forces be made ot work 'in aid of civil > > power' as required by law. > > 5. The situation of the peaceful expression of peoples > > demands be utilized to initiate a political dialogue, the > > political establishment is duty-bound to do so when people in such > > large numbers are voicing these. > > > > > > Harish Dhawan > > Secretary, PUDR > > On behalf of > > People's Democratic Forum (PDF), Karnataka > > Andhra Pradesh Civil Liberties Committee (APCLC), Andhra Pradesh > > Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), Jammu and Kashmir > > People's Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), Delhi > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > list > > List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 19:35:09 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 07:05:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <794403.1588.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Correct... And the list of temple demolitions in Muslim dominated areas have also increased... if you want me to publicize the list known to me.. here it is.. http://www.awakehindu.com/Articles/ListOfTempleDemolition.htm However, creating temples and images, to which Islam is dead against, are high in Hindu dominated regions... As far as channels are concerned, let me expose the double standards... Star news shows a serial.. Samarpan which is on Hindu worship places.. But then star news dead anti-hindu language in their news.. remember 13th August, VHP bandh for Amarnath controversy.. and a person died because of electric post shock on the spot... Star news was shouting - 'Shayad woh electric shock se bach jaata, lekin use Hindutva ka shock lag gaya' ... Many people have already boycotted Star News... Most of the Hindu population knows Star news and many other channel... so do not fool Hindus.. We all know who owns those channel and from where they are funded... The double standards are going on in them.. At one end they show Hindu programs like Astrology and immediately after that they attack Hinduism like anything.. Even yesterday Star news was shouting on Asharam Bapu with the dubbed voice.. a layman could easily recognize that it was a dubbed voice... So do not quote wrong examples... The truth is.. Islam has increased in population from 7% to 20% (plus the 6% for 6 Crore Bangladeshis)... and terrorist has increased.. and as I said... the threat is well known... Let Islam still learn that they cannot devastate Hindus... They have been trying it from past 1000 years... massacre, rapes, jajia - all their tactics have failed... they are trying again and again they will fail.. because India was not only a land of Gold.. it was also a land of God... and God knows how to create heroes time to time who revives back the Sanatan Dharma - the Faith of Duty and not hateful Religion..... ----- Original Message ---- From: Jeebesh To: Sarai Reader-list Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:38:12 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi On 27-Aug-08, at 9:33 AM, chanchal malviya wrote: > Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. A cursory glance says otherwise? Temples have grown in exponential numbers, so has the size. Pilgrims to each place of pilgrimage has grown in phenomenal number. The amount of spending on religious festival shows geometric progression. The images of god and goddess are all around. Television plays serials after serials on religious themes. Dedicated channels to religion has grown everywhere. ---- the list can be very long.. Do you have a bench mark of this growth, after which you stop feeling victimized? Just curious. best Jeebesh _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 19:36:15 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:36:15 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Locals provide food, water to troops fighting militants in Jammu Message-ID: <6353c690808270706x55d145f2qdba1becf76fc4539@mail.gmail.com> *Locals provide food, water to troops ** **fighting militants in Jammu** * *UNI - Daily Excelsior* ** *Chinnor, Jammu:** *Extending their support to the security forces fighting militancy, local people here today arranged food, water and shelter for the troops during their daylong gunbattle with a group of 'fidayeens' who struck the winter capital this morning. A free 'Langer' was organised by the locals for army, police and media personnel engaged in anti-militancy operation. The Coventry Day Boarding School, a private educational institution just about 300 meters away from the encounter site, was specially opened for the soldiers to take quick rest and re-energise themselves to carry on with the operation. The soldiers were provided with lunch in the afternoon, besides refreshment, including tea, snacks, fruit and water. Local Jammu Municipal Corporation member Sheela Handoo has been supervising the hospitality to the fighting and assisting forces during the encounter. The Shri Amarnath Yatra Sangarsh Samiti (SAYSS) also arranged food for the locals, who were shifted out of the fire-range by the security personnel to avoid collateral damage during the encounter. All the education institutions are closed in Jammu region owing to the ongoing agitation for the restoration of land to the Shri Amarnath Shrine Board in south Kashmir. (UNI) From radhikarajen at vsnl.net Wed Aug 27 19:35:27 2008 From: radhikarajen at vsnl.net (radhikarajen at vsnl.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 19:05:27 +0500 Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808260557n236270c8k8905ebf04cbbbd3b@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808260557n236270c8k8905ebf04cbbbd3b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: True, SECULAR hindu like you are trying to terrorise all of us in society with pen which is mightier than GUN. When in your SECULAR opinion the danish cartoon is not work of art, but hussains work is art, great logic indeed for secular thoughts. Then, in Orissa when evangelists use guns to shoot down a 90 year old man, it is not crusade but picnic of the evangelists.! ----- Original Message ----- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:27 pm Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism To: sarai list > Dear friends, > > I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should > stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang > Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today > report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been > political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know > the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and > front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer > be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." > > Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html > > And more stories in that issue: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html > > > o o o > > > > BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS > > Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks > > by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting > terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off > in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and > his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel > room. > > The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in > the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a > larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to > trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. > > The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police > stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. > They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of > ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over > two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about > 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to > batteries with wires. > > The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and > 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that > both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within > minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained > serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. > > Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur > senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL > TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. > Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in > antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the > city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city > between 1998 and 2000. > > Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur > and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said > Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they > were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were > inactive these days," he said. > > The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and > Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic > institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. > > Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were > involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be > bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both > Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were > planning to do." > > Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards > the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger > conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We > are investigating their links." > > Another officer said the police had information about more explosives > that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to > recover them soon. > > Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal > squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for > assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments > in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades > recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both > sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the > bombmakers were well trained in their job. > > The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private > hostel in > Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is > run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of > Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his > links with his son two years ago and was living in his ancestral > village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented > out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an > executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied > one of > the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. > > Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal > training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught > martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. > > Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the > Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting > Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. > Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities > since 2001," an officer said. > > SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every > Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his > friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached > there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. > > Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the > BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with > the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me > and I do not chalk out their programmes." > > piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in > > o o o > > 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' > > By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid > Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the > 'martyrdom' of > two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted > outside a mosque in Maharashtra. > > Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal > workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze > Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in > Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the > blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. > > The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a > low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in > Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the > Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at > the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were > screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which > allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. > > It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an > organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that > the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market > their own brand of Hindu terror'. > > In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a > blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, > killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh > Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who > had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. > > Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men > were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but > they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal > literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took > place. > > The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the > accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the > case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said > Gazi. > > Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has > been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" > > Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near > Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us > there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity > connection." > > Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state > and Centre let the accused go scot free. > > "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is > happening in Nanded?" he asked. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 20:44:36 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 20:44:36 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Shortages in J&K Message-ID: >From Kashmir Times: Shortage of essentials Continued disruption begins showing its impact Disruption in the maintenance of essential supplies not only to Kashmir valley and frontier region of Ladakh but also the hilly and remote areas of Jammu province have started showing its impact on the local population. The people in these areas have started feeling the pinch due to shortage of essential items including grains and perishable commodities in majority of the districts in Jammu region. Despite the claims of the government and its agencies that regular supplies are being maintained and sufficient stocks are available in these belts, the people have started voicing their concern over the shortages and black-marketing by the unscrupulous traders. This is particularly true in Rajouri, Poonch and Reasi districts in the north on one hand and Udhampur, Ramban, Doda and Kishtwar districts in the east of Jammu region. Same is the case in some parts of Kathua, Jammu and Samba districts where there has been no movement of essential items during the past more than two months. The claims of the Consumer Affairs and Public Distribution (CAPD) department have been proved false as no ration shops are operating due to the continued strike in whole Jammu region. It is also worth noting that rations shops are empty due to the fact that transporters have also joined the strike. Then how the government agency is transporting the essential ration items to its depots? The Public Distribution System (PDS) network, which has been notorious for pilferages and aiding black marketing, has not been able to distribute rations to the common masses in normal circumstances, how can it become efficient during strikes and continued disturbed conditions. The question arises how the government agency can rise above all considerations and start working very efficiently and come up to the expectations of the people. Otherwise also, most of the areas in Jammu region have witnessed crop failures to the extent of 80 percent in kandi belt of Jammu region during the past three consecutive years and the former chief minister Ghulam Nabi Azad was forced to announce some relief measures for these farmers. The relief is yet to come to the rescue of these farmers and the endless wait is continuing. Similarly the decision to provide free rations for six months announced for them by the government is also yet to be implemented on the ground. If the same situation continues, the people will be forced to take to the streets demanding rations to overcome the difficulties that are staring them in the face due to disruption in the supplies caused by continued strike. From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 21:16:58 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 08:46:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] FINALLY THE UNITED NATIONS HAS COME OUT WITH A WORD... Message-ID: <416513.1833.qm@web31812.mail.mud.yahoo.com> http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=27835&Cr=human%20rights&Cr1=casualties&Kw1=UNMOGIP&Kw2=&Kw3=# Amid recent violent protests, UN urges restraint in Indian-administered Kashmir27 August 2008 – The United Nations Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights (OHCHR) has voiced its concern about the recent violent protests in Indian-administered Kashmir that have reportedly led to civilian casualties and restrictions to the right to freedom of assembly and expression. “OHCHR calls on the Indian authorities and in particular security forces to respect the right to freedom of assembly and expression, and comply with international human rights principles in controlling the demonstrators,” according to a statement issued today in Geneva. “The use of force should be proportionate to the threat posed and firearms must only be used in dispersing a violent assembly to protect individuals against an imminent threat of death or serious injury,” it added. The Acting High Commissioner for Human Rights has called for thorough and independent investigations into all killings that have occurred so far. OHCHR also called on the demonstrators to use only peaceful means when protesting. “Leaders of the different protesting groups have a responsibility to ensure that demonstrations are peaceful and that the demonstrators are not carrying sticks, guns or other weapons and refrain from intimidation,” stated OHCHR. The UN Military Observer Group in India and Pakistan (UNMOGIP) has been deployed to observe a ceasefire in disputed Jammu and Kashmir since 1949. The princely state was split between India and Pakistan after they won independence from the United Kingdom in 1947.   From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Wed Aug 27 22:08:17 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 09:38:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism Message-ID: <504506.89365.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I don't think he is a Hindu at all.He should change his name too according to his adopted religion or faith as his name causes a lot of confusion when we read his baseless inflmmatory anti-Hindu writings day in and day out. Prabhakar  ----- Original Message ---- From: "radhikarajen at vsnl.net" To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: sarai list Sent: Wednesday, 27 August, 2008 7:35:27 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism True, SECULAR hindu like you are trying to terrorise all of us in society with pen which is mightier than GUN.  When in your SECULAR opinion the danish cartoon is not work of art, but hussains work is art, great logic indeed for secular thoughts. Then, in Orissa when evangelists use guns to shoot down a 90 year old man, it is not crusade but picnic of the evangelists.! ----- Original Message ----- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:27 pm Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism To: sarai list > Dear friends, > > I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should > stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang > Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today > report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been > political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know > the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and > front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer > be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." > > Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html > > And more stories in that issue: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html > > > o o o > > > > BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS > > Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks > > by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting > terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off > in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and > his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel > room. > > The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in > the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a > larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to > trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. > > The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police > stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. > They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of > ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over > two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about > 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to > batteries with wires. > > The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and > 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that > both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within > minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained > serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. > > Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur > senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL > TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. > Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in > antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the > city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city > between 1998 and 2000. > > Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur > and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said > Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they > were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were > inactive these days," he said. > > The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and > Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic > institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. > > Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were > involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be > bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both > Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were > planning to do." > > Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards > the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger > conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We > are investigating their links." > > Another officer said the police had information about more explosives > that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to > recover them soon. > > Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal > squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for > assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments > in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades > recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both > sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the > bombmakers were well trained in their job. > > The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private > hostel in > Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is > run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of > Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his > links withhis son two years ago and was living in his ancestral > village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented > out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an > executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied > one of > the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. > > Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal > training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught > martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. > > Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the > Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting > Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. > Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities > since 2001," an officer said. > > SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every > Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his > friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached > there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. > > Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the > BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with > the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me > and I do not chalk out their programmes." > > piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in > > o o o > > 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' > > By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid > Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the > 'martyrdom' of > two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted > outside a mosque in Maharashtra. > > Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal > workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze > Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in > Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the > blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. > > The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a > low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in > Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the > Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at > the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were > screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which > allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. > > It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an > organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that > the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market > their own brand of Hindu terror'. > > In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a > blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, > killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh > Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who > had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. > > Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men > were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but > they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal > literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took > place. > > The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the > accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the > case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said > Gazi. > > Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has > been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" > > Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near > Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us > there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity > connection." > > Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state > and Centre let the accused go scot free. > > "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is > happening in Nanded?" he asked. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 22:19:50 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:19:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding In-Reply-To: <6353c690808270702m10c3fbfav52e62ae4d6350799@mail.gmail.com> References: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808270702m10c3fbfav52e62ae4d6350799@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808270949s4e6bb4f1t60e02d20cbb30518@mail.gmail.com> but of course it is communal propoganda!... And they do sound like clones. It always amazes me that the diversity of expression and opinion that is evident amongst others on this list like shuddha and sonia for instance, who often disagree with eachother, and sometimes Kshamendra, is completely absent in anything chanchal, radhikarajen or prabhakar choose to say. I could happily interchange their ramblings and it would make no difference at all. Come to think of it aditya, i find it very interesting that you would choose to defend this sort of patently racist and offensive language... I, unlike you Aditya, have no trouble calling a spade a spade... On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 7:32 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > I quote Aarti. They are clones. :) Communal propaganda...isn't it ? > > On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: > > > > Were you in II world war with hiter and his propaganda machine or did you > > get any transplant from those ? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Khurram Parvez > > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:03 pm > > Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding > > To: SARAI > > > > > > > > People's Union for Democratic Rights, Delhi > > > > > > > > > PRESS RELEASE, 26th August 2008 > > > > > > Findings of an Investigation Conducted From 22 to 25 August 2008 > > > > > > A six-member team from four human rights organisations conducted > > > an investigation into the "economic blockade" in Kashmir and its > > > aftermath. The team toured the districts of Srinagar, Budgam, > > > Baramulla, and Bandipora. The team spoke to victims of the > > > violence and their families, people who were part of protests, > > > doctors at the SMHS hospital, journalists, the Kashmir Chamber of > > > Commerce, and office bearers of many social and political > > > organisations. However, the fact finding was disrupted as the > > > state announced an indefinite curfew from the morning of 24th > > > August. The release also addresses the second round of curfew > > > currently in force. The total loss of life during the two periods > > > of curfew stands at over 35. > > > The main findings of the team are summarized below: > > > > > > 1. Azaadi is the primary demand in Kashmir > > > The team arrived in Srinagar on 22 August and witnessed the > > > massive protest meeting at the Idgah grounds. People gathered > > > there publicly declared their primary demand for azaadi (freedom) > > > at the meeting venue and through numerous street processions in > > > various streets of Srinagar on 22 and 23 August. During our > > > interviews with individual families and with groups, people voiced > > > the same demand. A wide range of social and political > > > organisations have also reiterated this demand. > > > > > > 2. Use of curfew to create a confrontation > > > Curfew was imposed from the evening of 11 August and again from > > > the morning of 24 August. The first time it was imposed hours > > > after the security forces opened fire at many places on an unarmed > > > procession heading to the Muzaffarabad border killing at least __ > > > people. It was expected that people would come out in the > > > following day to protest against the killings. Curfew thus became > > > an instrument to prevent people from assembling and gave security > > > forces the power to use force against unarmed protestors. > > > The second time curfew was imposed with the express purpose of > > > preventing the dharna at Lal Chowk. The previous gathering at > > > Idgah, where this dharna was announced, had been peaceful. > > > Therefore curfew became the means by which a confrontation was > > > created, which could have been easily avoided. The clamping down > > > on media and the brutal attacks on journalists happened while the > > > team was still there. Arrests of leaders, raids of homes and > > > intimidation of local residents by the army and CRPF are happening > > > even now. On 24th itself, our team issued an appeal to the central > > > government to lift the curfew to prevent loss of life. > > > > > > 3. Deliberate blockade of supplies and its indifferent handling. > > > While our team has not investigated the happenings in the Jammu > > > region, its impact on Kashmir has been confirmed through our > > > interviews. Protests in Jammu, which started from early July, took > > > a more violent turn from the beginning of August. This led to > > > severe restriction on the movement of goods and people on the > > > Srinagar-Jammu highway and even into Punjab. Records at the > > > highway check points, as reported in the Economic Times (21.8.08), > > > confirm the substantial lowering of goods traffic in July and its > > > worsening in August. Shortages were created as a result: of oils > > > and cooking gas in the rural areas, of cereals and medicines in > > > the urban areas. Given the fears of Kashmiri transporters and > > > drivers, the impact was far worse in traffic moving out of > > > Kashmir. This has led to substantial losses for fruit growers as > > > well as handicrafts and carpet manufacturers and transporters. > > > Fruit could be found rotting at many places and handicraft > > > manufacturers report > > > cancellation of export orders for the ramazan season and fears > > > for the Christmas season. The team was told that till 23rd August, > > > 80 % of the trucks were not leaving the valley for fear of attacks > > > and only some 15-20 trucks were able to carry the apples out of > > > the valley after assurance of safe passage from the government. > > > The loss—over 75% of the fruit are rotting in the Sopore mandi. In > > > Seer Jagir, a village in Sopore tehsil, the team met small farmers > > > with average land holding of 4-5 acres, which produces on an > > > average 3000 boxes of apples per annum. The 30 farmers in this > > > village reported that they have lost on an average Rs 2 lakh this > > > season. Therefore, the total loss of this small village account to > > > nearly 60 lakh. The government's lackadaisical attitude in > > > ensuring supplies and its attempt to deny the 'blockade' led to > > > feeling of ill-will in Kashmir. > > > > > > 4. Firing incidents (11-14th August) were unprovoked and aimed to kill > > > The team investigated 15 cases of deaths that occurred on account > > > of firing by CRPF and JK police between 11 and 14 August. The > > > actual death toll is estimated to be above 30. The findings show a > > > clear pattern: (a) The firings were aimed to kill. This was > > > evident from eye witness accounts which showed that the firings > > > were indiscriminate and aimed directly at the crowd. At Paribal, > > > near Bandipura town on 12th August the RR and JK police fired on > > > the crowd from above the hill where the 15 RR camp is located. (b) > > > A large number of deaths resulted from injuries in the abdomen, > > > chest, head or upper or lower back. The same was confirmed by > > > hospital records. (c) In some cases, as at Lasjen on 12 August, > > > protesters were deceived into by an assurance of allowing peaceful > > > procession and then resorting to firing. Three people were killed > > > including one 50 year old woman and six others received bullet > > > injuries. > > > > > > 5. Attacks on those Injured > > > The total number of people injured in the period between 11 and 14 > > > August is not clearly established. However, at SMHS hospital > > > alone, over 500 patients were admitted in the same period. The > > > team met families and those injured and killed in the attacks. We > > > were repeatedly told that the security forces never tried to reach > > > the injured to hospital. Worse, vehicles carrying injured to > > > hospital were routinely attacked. Hospital sources claim that a > > > number of ambulances were attacked. The same is confirmed by news > > > reports today and the health department has threatened to stop > > > ambulance services given the injuries received by ambulance > > > drivers. Our team was told that in Lasjen, even those carrying > > > dead bodies back from the hospital were attacked on 12th August. > > > Elsewhere, in Bandipora the same was reported. The van carrying > > > Mehrajuddin Kakh, injured in the Bandipura killing on 12 August, > > > was attacked by CRPF and STF at Parimpora. Not only were the occupants > > > attacked, Mehrajuddin's thigh injury was brutalized by twisting a > > > lathi in it. He died the same night. Equally, Imran Ahmed Wani who > > > was injured in the Bagi Mehtab firing on 12 August was > > > deliberately refused ambulance service for nearly two hours. In > > > fact, when he did get into one, it was attacked at Rambagh Pul. He > > > was declared dead on arrival at the hospital. > > > > > > 6. Attack on the SMHS hospital, Srinagar > > > What is unbelievable is the attack on SMHS Hospital on 11 and 12 > > > August successively. The SMHS hospital received the largest number > > > of casualties. When doctors were trying to conduct emergency > > > operations at break-neck speed in order to save lives, the > > > Casualty was attacked with tear gas shells followed by firing live > > > bullets. The firing was again repeated on 12 August. It is the > > > dedication of doctors, paramedic staff, ambulance drivers and > > > timely arranging of bandages, gauze and cotton by the medical > > > representatives, at the risk of their own lives, that managed to > > > save a large number of lives. The doctors also confirmed that the > > > help received by the ordinary people in saving the lives of those > > > injured was remarkable. People helped the medical staff in > > > transporting the wounded to the OT, aided in tending treatment in > > > the Casualty and arranged vans and ambulances to carry them to the > > > different hospitals in the city and elsewhere. > > > > > > 7. Attacks on Funeral Processions > > > Funeral processions were repeatedly attacked in many places as > > > large numbers of people marched with the bier to the graveyards. > > > The team was told that the funeral procession of Ishfaq Ahmed > > > Kana, shot dead at Qamarwari Chowk, Srinagar on 11 August, to the > > > Idgah Martyrs Memorial was attacked by the CRPF with lathis and > > > rubber bullets. In Baghi Mahtab, Javed Ahmed Mir's funeral > > > procession was attacked and one person was killed in the firing. > > > Other protest demonstrations protesting against the killings were > > > also attacked. For instance, the protest demonstration following > > > the shooting of Owais Majeed Zarga in Rainawari, Srinagar on 12th > > > August was attacked by the Kashmir police stationed outside the > > > office of the local MLA, Mhd Shahid. Two boys were injured in the > > > firing. > > > > > > 8. Raids and Attacks on Residents: > > > During the evening of 13 and 14 August, security forces engaged in > > > an indiscriminate and large-scale attack on houses in localities > > > close to the firings, thrashing people and smashing window panes. > > > At Safakadal, Srinagar, residents showed how their houses and a > > > nearby mosque were attacked by the CRPF. At Lasjen, JK police and > > > CRPF personnel entered houses to thrash people. Relatives were > > > forcibly prevented from accessing homes of deceased and women > > > relatives at the house of Imtiaz Rahim, who died in the firing, > > > showed us the marks of brutality at the hands of the security > > > forces. > > > > > > 9. FIRs: Refusals and Distortions: > > > In most cases, the families have not registered any FIRs against > > > the security forces as they fear going to the police station or > > > that it would invite further violence. Where families of those > > > killed were able to go to police stations after many days, they > > > found that FIRs were already lodged stating that the protestors > > > attacked security forces who in turn were forced to open fire. > > > When families tried to get their version recorded, the same was > > > refused. Complaints are rejected. In the case of the Bagi Mahtab > > > killings where the families of the deceased (Javed Ahmed Mir and > > > Imran Ahmed Wani) were given a totally false version of the > > > happenings in the FIR. When challenged, the police said that the > > > families must come ten days later with 4 eye witnesses to > > > corroborate their story. This refusal even to receive complaints > > > is tantamount to making the security forces judges of their own > > > actions. > > > 10. Present Curfew and Developments > > > On 24 August, Kashmir was greeted by indefinite curfew when it > > > woke up in the morning. Within a few hours four media persons, on > > > their way to office had been badly beaten up at Rambagh by the > > > CRPF. The identity cards and passes issued during the last phase > > > of curfew presented by the journalists were rejected. Mr Bilal, > > > bureau chief of Sahara Samay was admitted to the Bone and Joints > > > hospital and later to the SMHS hospital. By evening, security > > > forces opened fire in Dal Gate area killing one person and > > > critically injuring another. Homes of political leaders were > > > raided and some arrested. In the rural areas, the army threatened > > > local imams, nambardars and chowkidars on 24 August that they > > > would be held responsible if people dared to join in the > > > procession to Lal Chowk. Over the last two days, the curfew has > > > lad to at least seven people being killed in firing by security > > > forces and over 275 injured in various parts of Kashmir valley. > > > Essential supplies to Srinagar city, such as medicines, water > > > tankers and milk, have been blocked and this 'blockade' has been > > > done at the instance of the CRPF. The entire control of land and > > > order in Srinagar city has all been handed over to the CRPF and > > > news reports have suggested that the local police have also been > > > beaten by the CRPF. > > > CONCLUSION > > > The investigation team is of the opinion that the firing, > > > brutality, loss of life was not only wholly avoidable but done > > > deliberately. The disruption of road traffic to Kashmir needed to > > > be recognized by the government and addressed. The resort to > > > curfew after the firing on 11 August denied the people a right to > > > protest and be heard. Additionally, the curfew provided the > > > security forces the power to open fire with impunity. A number of > > > extremely inhuman crimes were committed by the security forces by > > > denying and obstructing medical aid to the injured, attacking the > > > injured and most seriously by launching an attack on the SMHS > > > hospital. No existing law in the country provides immunity to > > > police and security forces for such crimes. The lack of any action > > > against these forces even where the crimes are established by eye- > > > witnesses and reported in newspapers, makes people lose whatever > > > faith in the government that may have remained after decades of > > > army rule. > > > Despite these happenings, the people of Kashmir have shown > > > exemplary restraint and ensured that all processions and public > > > gatherings after the lifting of curfew remain wholly peaceful. > > > This situation should have been utilized to initiate political > > > dialogue instead of the visit by the National Security Advisor. > > > The imposition of curfew to prevent another such pre-declared > > > peaceful mass gathering can only be seen as an invitation to > > > another bloody attack on protestors and serves as a message to the > > > people of Kashmir that the Indian government would not tolerate > > > peaceful and unarmed protest. > > > > > > WE DEMAND > > > 1. Immediate lifting of the curfew and restoration of > > > ample space to people to peaceably collect and voice their demands. > > > 2. Criminal charges be registered against those > > > responsible for attacks on injured people, ambulances and > > > hospitals as well as widespread damage to houses. > > > 3. Peoples complaints concerning arbitrary and > > > indiscriminate use of fire by security forces be registered and > > > the culprits brought to book. > > > 4. Law and order duties be immediately restored to the > > > police in Srinagar and all forces be made ot work 'in aid of civil > > > power' as required by law. > > > 5. The situation of the peaceful expression of peoples > > > demands be utilized to initiate a political dialogue, the > > > political establishment is duty-bound to do so when people in such > > > large numbers are voicing these. > > > > > > > > > Harish Dhawan > > > Secretary, PUDR > > > On behalf of > > > People's Democratic Forum (PDF), Karnataka > > > Andhra Pradesh Civil Liberties Committee (APCLC), Andhra Pradesh > > > Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), Jammu and Kashmir > > > People's Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), Delhi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > list > > > List archive: > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 22:35:55 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:35:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808271005j77e73ff2wea817b345423a7c3@mail.gmail.com> Can someone explain to me why the logic of retribution is so easily deployed, as if its common sense. As if it makes perfect sense to attack hundreds of people who have had nothing to do with the killing of Laxmananda Saraswati simply because they happen to belong to the same community of the people who shot him? Which incidentally is not even the case. In the new reports it says unidentified assailants. Who said "missionaries" shot him dead radhika? Please show me one news reports which conclusively proves it was missionaries. And even if it was missionaries, does this mean you justify murder, arson, rape? I'm terribly sorry but it is not at all evident to me that individuals can be made to bear the burden of expiation for the acts of others simply because they happen to belong to the same religious community. I think you need to think very carefully and seriously about the things you say. You sound like a really violent human being. regards A On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 7:09 PM, wrote: > Well, if 90 year old man, swamiji or otherwise, and along with this 90 year > old man, another 7 persons, who is revered by citizens, is shot dead by > "missionaries" who preach love and compassion, and the citizens are expected > to tolerate this atrocity even when administation is hesitant to take action > against these goons. ? > > Missionaries who work in tribal areas with money fromabroad should know > that love is not taught by guns shots to old men. ? > > Regards. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 5:51 pm > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa > To: sarai list > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > From: John Dayal > > Date: Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM > > > > > > Dr. John Dayal > > > > Member: National Integration Council > > Government of India > > > > Secretary General: All India Christian Council (Founded 1999) > > President: United Christian Action, Delhi (Founded 1992) > > Imm. Past National President: All India Catholic Union (Founded 1919) > > > > 505 Link, 18 IP Extension, Delhi 110092 India > > Email: johndayal at vsnl.com > > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > > Phone: 91-11-22722262 Mobile 09811021072 > > > > 25 August 2008 > > > > URGENT FAX > > > > TO PRESIDENT OF INDIA > > > > SEEKING ARMY / CENTRAL FORCES INTERVENTION TO PROTECT CHRISTIANS IN > > ORISSA AS NUN IS RAPED, PRIESTS INJURED, CHURCHES AND OFFICES > > BURNT IN > > PRESENCE OF POLICE > > > > Hon'ble Mrs., Pratibha Patil > > President of India > > > > Dear President > > > > Greetings from a grieving community. > > > > You are aware of the still continuing carnage against the Christian > > community, mostly Dalits and Tribals, in the Kandhamal district of > > Orissa and in several other districts including the state capital of > > Bhubaneswar since 23rd August 2003 following the killing of Vishwa > > Hindu Parishad leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati, reportedly by > > Maoist groups who have been operating in the state for some time. > > > > The Christian leadership in the country has unequivocally condemned > > the killing of the VHP leader and his four associates. > > > > The Christians of Kandhamal are still nursing their wounds from the > > Christmas 2007 violence, with hundreds of them still living in a > > refugee camp in Barakhama. Most of the more than One hundred churches > > then destroyed remain in ruins, and the burnt houses are still to be > > fully rebuilt. > > > > And yet local Sangh leaders have targeted the community in a second > > wave of macabre violence. > > > > A nun has been raped in Kandhamal, a Catholic father grievously > > injured, scores of houses in villages destroyed, apart from Churches > > and institutions. I attach herewith a partial list of the damage in > > the violence in the past two days. We in Delhi are overwhelmed with > > panic messages from Priests, pastors, nuns and common people who look > > to New Delhi for help as the State machinery ahs collapsed once again. > > > > Changing of superintendents of police as a knee jerk reaction does not > > provide security to Christians. In fact, much of the violence is > > taking place with the insufficient police force looking on. This had > > been the case in 2007 December, as has come out in the on going > > hearings of the Justice Basudeo Panigrahi Commission. Christian > > delegations have informed the State Governor, the State Chief Minister > > and the Home Minister of India of the dire situation of our community > > in Orissa. > > > > Dear Madame President, > > > > This is to request you to use your powers as President of India, and > > the tremendous force of your good offices, to impress on the Central > > Government to rush adequate Union forces, including contingents of the > > Armed Forces if required, to restore law and order and governance in > > the Kandhamal region. > > > > The consequences of any further delay, I fear, may be catastrophic for > > our Christian community in the State in particular, for peace in > > Orissa in general, and for the fair name of India as a secular > > country. > > > > God Bless you > > > > John Dayal > > > > Attachments: > > 1. Incomplete list of death and damage in violence of 23rd-25th > > August 2008 > > 2. Christian condemnation of killing of Sw. Lakshmanananda Saraswati > > > > ORISSA ANTI CHRISTIAN VIOLENCE UPDATE 25th August 2008 > > > > : > > 1. CHRISTIAN WOMAN TEACHER REPORTED BURNT ALIVE: A Christian woman > > teacher, possibly a nun [BUT NOT CONFIRMED], was reported burnt alive > > on 25th August 2008 by a group of Vishwa Hindu Parishad mob which > > stormed the orphanage she ran in the district of Bargarh (Orissa). > > Police Superintendent Ashok Biswall has told this to news > > reporters. A > > priest who was at the orphanage was also badly hurt and is now being > > treated in hospital for multiple burns. > > 2. NUN RAPED: A young Catholic Nun of the Cuttack Bhubaneswar diocese > > working Jan Vikas Kendra, the Social Service Centre at Nuagaon in > > Kandhamal was reportedly gang raped on 24th August 2008 by groups of > > Hindutva extremists before the building itself was destroyed. > > 3. SENIOR PRIEST AND NUN INJURED: Fr Thomas, director of the Diocesan > > Pastoral Centre in Kanjimendi, less than a kilometer away from the > > Social Service Centre, and another Nun were injured when the centre > > was attacked. They were taken to the police station in a disheveled > > state as the armed mob bayed for their blood. The Pastoral centre was > > then set afire. > > 4. BALLIGUDA CHURCH BUILDINGS DESTROYED AGAIN: On 24th August 2008 > > evening lynch mobs at the block headquarters of Balliguda, in the very > > heart of Kandhamal district, which had seen much violence between 24th > > and 26th December 2007, attacked and destroyed a Presbytery, convent > > and hostel damaging the properties. > > 5. The mobs in Balliguda caught hold of two boys of the Catholic > > hostel and tonsured their heads. > > 6. PHULBANI CHURCH DAMAGED: On 25th august 2008 morning followers of > > the late Lakshmanananda Saraswati damaged the Catholic Church in > > Phulbani, the district headquarter town. > > 7. MOTHER TERESA BROTHERS ASHRAM ATTACKED: mobs attacked the Mother > > Teresa Brothers' residence and hospital in Srasanada, destroyed once > > before and rebuilt two months ago, and beat up the patients. > > Fundamentalists have targeted Priests, religious and also the Faithful > > in Pobingia also. > > 8. BHUBANESWAR BISHOP'S HOUSE ATTACKED: On the morning of 25th August > > 2008, violent mobs made several attempts to enter the compounds of > > Catholic Church and Archbishop's house in the heart of the Capital of > > the State of Orissa. They could not enter because of the police > > presence. They threw stones at the guesthouse of Archbishop's House, > > damaging windows. > > 9. DUBURI PARISH; Another group of fundamentalists entered presbytery > > in Duburi parish, managed by the SVDs and destroyed and damaged > > property. Two priests of the parish are missing. > > 10. Mr. Jamaj Pariccha, Director of Gramya Pragati, is attacked and > > his property, vehicle etc. damaged, burnt and looted. > > 11. A Baptist Church in Akamra Jila in Bhubaneswar is also damaged. > > 12. Christian institutions like St. Arnold's School (Kalinga Bihar), > > AND NISWASS report some damage. > > 13. BOUDH DISTRICT [Adjoining Kandhamal]: Fundamentalists enter the > > Catholic parish church and destroy property. People are fleeing to > > safer places. But nothing seems safe. > > 14. Muniguda Catholic Fathers and Nuns' residence have been damaged. > > 15. Sambalpur HM Sister's residence (Ainthapalli) has suffered damage. > > 16. Padanpur: One priest is attacked and admitted to a hospital. > > Hostel boys and the in charge have moved away from the place. > > 17. Madhupur Catholic Church currently under attack. > > 18. SMALL CHURCHES: Attempted violence on small churches in various > > districts, including Padampur, Sambalpur near GM College, Talsera, > > Dangsoroda, Narayanipatara, Muniguda, Tummiibandh, Tangrapada, > > Phulbani, Balliguda, Kalingia, Chakapad, Srasanranda. > > 19. VILLAGE CHRISTIAN HOUSES ATTACKED: Houses attacked on forest > > hamlets of Balliguda, Kanjamandi Nuaguam (K.Nuaguam), Tiangia > > (G.Udayagiri), Padangiri, Tikabali. > > 20. KALAHANDI DISTRICT: houses burnt even though the district is more > > than 300 kilometers from the place where Swami Lakshmanananda was > > killed. > > 21. Pastor Sikandar Singh of the Pentecostal Mission beaten up and his > > house burnt in Bhawanipatna. > > 22. Kharihar: 3 Christian shops were looted and burnt. Pastor Alok Das > > and Pastor I M Senapati beaten up. > > 23. Aampani: Pastor David Diamond Pahar, Pastor Pravin Ship, Pastor > > Pradhan and Pastor Barik beaten up and chased away with their > > families. > > 24. Naktikani: Mob surrounds village to attack Christians. The > > government has sent forces, it is reported. > > > > [This list is compiled with assistance from Archbishop's House, > > Bhubaneswar and other sources] > > > > - --------------------------------- > > URGENT > > >From John Dayal > > 25 August 2008 > > > > INDIAN CHURCH CONDEMNS KILLING OF ORISSA VHP LEADER > > > > The Church in India has unequivocally condemned the killing of Vishwa > > Hindu Parishad [VHP] Orissa leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > four colleagues in the Tumiliband region of Kandhamal district by Left > > wing extremists. Still recovering from the worst ever anti Christian > > violence in Indian history in December 2007, Christian organisations > > have appealed for peace as the community braces for another round of > > violence in the state from Hindutva groups who have sworn to avenge > > Saraswati death by attacking Churches, institutions, clergy and nuns. > > > > The following is the text of major statements issued by Church groups > > condemning the VHP leaders' death: > > > > ARCHBISHOP RAPHAEL CHEENATH, SVD > > Archbishop of Cuttack-Bhubaneswar > > > > 24 August 2008 > > > > I, on behalf of the Christians of Orissa, particularly the catholic > > Christians, strongly condemn the dastardly attack and violent killing > > of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five of his associates. We the > > Christians abhor violence and condemn all acts of violence and > > terrorism and are against all groups of people taking the law into > > their own hands. We condole the death of Swami Lakshmanananda > > Saraswati, a religious leader and his associates. At this critical > > juncture I appeal to all for peace and communal harmony. We want good > > relationship with all the communities with whom we live. > > > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > > that least one prayer hall in Sundergarh District has been burnt and > > vehicle belonging to Daughters of the most Precious Blood has been > > burnt near G. Udayagiri. > > > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > associates. > > > > - --------- > > > > ALL INDIA CHRISTIAN COUNCIL: > > > > Press Statement by Dr John Dayal, Secretary General, and Dr Sampaul, > > National Secretary for Public Affairs > > > > The All India Christian Council is deeply concerned at the attack on > > an ashram near Tumiliband in Kandhamal District of Orissa last night > > in which the Vishwa Hindu Parishad leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and > > four of his associates were killed. This is the latest of a series of > > attacks in recent months by political extremists which have left > > dozens of policemen and others dead in several districts of Orissa. > > > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > > at least one prayer hall in Sundergarh ahs been burnt, the van of some > > Catholic Nuns destroyed and the sisters themselves injured. > > > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > associates. > > > > The Christian community abhors violence, condemns all acts of > > terrorism and is against groups of people taking the law into their > > own hands. We have had major differences with the dead VHP leader. It > > has been the hate campaigns of the VHP and Sangh Parivar which led to > > untold misery to Christians in the violence last Christmas. Refugees > > from that violence are still living in government camps in Barakhama > > under miserable conditions. But we wish peace to everyone. > > We pray for peace in Orissa, one of the most undeveloped states in > > the country, > > - ------------------ > > > > CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE OF INDIA: > > > > The Catholic Bishops' Conference of India (CBCI) is sad to note that > > Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five > > others were murdered on Saturday August 23 allegedly by Maoist group > > in Kandhamal Dist of Orissa. The Church leaders in Orissa and other > > parts of the country have condemned the killing of Swami > > Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates in the Ashram. We have > > also appealed for peace and harmonyin the state. > > > > However, we are extremely sorry to find that some organizations have > > pointed finger at the Christian community in Orissa for the alleged > > murder of the Swami and his associates. Consequently there have been > > unprovoked attacks on Christians and their institutions in Kandhamal > > and surrounding areas. School at Bhadrak Town, Convent and the > > computer centre at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist, Pastoral Centre at > > Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Social Development Centre (Jan Vikas > > Kendra) at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Catholic Church in Phulbani > > and a Convent of the religious women at Phulbani have suffered in the > > attacks which took place after the murder of Swami Lakshmanananda > > Saraswati. > > > > We are sad to note that the extremists are attacking and vandalizing > > our institutions without any reason. Incidents of arson and > > burning of > > vehicles belonging to the Church have also been reported at Udaygiri. > > Some of our religious nuns, girls and boys in the hostels have fled > > from their places and taken shelter in the forest, particularly in > > Kandhamal Dist. We are seriously concerned about the safety and > > security of our frightened people who are innocent and yet find > > themselves in a very precarious situation. The State Government has > > deployed police forces in some of the areas and yet the violence has > > not been contained. We request the Central Government to urgently > > intervene in the matter and send additional forces to bring situation > > to normalcy. > > - -- Rev. Dr. Babu Joseph, SVD, Spokesperson, CBCI > > - ------------ > > EVANGELICAL FELLOWSHIP OF INDIA: > > > > Evangelical Fellowship of India (EFI) denounces the killing of Vishwa > > Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > four associates by suspected Maoists in Orissa state's Kandhamal > > district on August 23. While deeply saddened by the weeklong spate of > > attacks that hit Kandhamal district during last Christmas, EFI, as a > > representative of the evangelical church in India, stands against > > every act of violence and terrorism. > > > > EFI also regrets that vested interests among the various Hindu > > nationalist groups are trying to blame local Christians for the act, > > as reflected in the acts of vandalism and arson reported from > > Kandhamal after the attack on Saraswati ashram. > > > > EFI appeals to the central, state and district authorities to take all > > possible measures to maintain peace and calm in Kandhamal. EFI also > > calls for the Christian community in India and abroad to pray for > > protection of the Christians in Kandhamal and other parts of Orissa. > > - -- Rev. Dr. Richard Howell, General Secretary > > Evangelical Fellowship of India > > - -------------------- > > Prashant. A Centre for Human Rights, Justice and Peace, Ahmedabad, > > Gujarat, India > > > > We condemn the killing of Swami Saraswati and four of his associates > > during the attack on the VHP Ashram in the Kandhamal District of > > Orissa on Saturday 23rd August 2008. We sympathize with the bereaved > > members of the families who have lost their loved ones. > > > > We call upon the Orissa and the Central Governments to do all in their > > power to bring to book immediately, those responsible for this > > dastardly act; that anti-social elements do not take law and order > > into their own hands and above all, to ensure that peace and calm > > prevail in the area, and in other parts of Orissa. > > > > Violence, for whatever the provocation, is non-acceptable, and will > > definitely not help achieve the goals for which these acts are > > committed. We therefore call upon all those responsible for these acts > > and to eschew violence immediately. No violence can be justified, for > > whatever the reason. However, for the last several months, the > > Government of Orissa has allowed some fascist and fundamentalist > > forces to terrorize the poor, the marginalized and the minorities of > > the State. These forces have carried on their virulent propaganda and > > their violent acts with apparent immunity. > > > > There has been a total abdication of responsibility by the Government > > of Orissa and the concerned authorities, like the police. They should > > now also be held totally responsible for these deaths and for allowing > > the situation to go out of control. Sufficient warning has been given > > to the Orissa Government, of the deteriorating situation, as early as > > in September 2006, with the publication of "Communalism in Orissa" > > - > > the Report of the Indian People's Tribunal on Environment and Human > > Rights - headed by Justice K. K. Usha (Retd.) former Chief Justice of > > the Kerala High Court. It may still not be too late to ensure that > > the Constitutional Rights and Freedoms of the people of Orissa are not > > merely guaranteed by also protected by the State. > > > > Fr. Cedric Prakash sj, Director > > > > - -- > > > > Please visit these sites: > > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > list > > List archive: > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 22:37:25 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:37:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808270949s4e6bb4f1t60e02d20cbb30518@mail.gmail.com> References: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808270702m10c3fbfav52e62ae4d6350799@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808270949s4e6bb4f1t60e02d20cbb30518@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808271007x78c2dfefi6c91a10eefd4274f@mail.gmail.com> And, who gets to decide about the spade ? :P On 8/27/08, Aarti Sethi wrote: > > but of course it is communal propoganda!... And they do sound like clones. > It always amazes me that the diversity of expression and opinion that is > evident amongst others on this list like shuddha and sonia for instance, who > often disagree with eachother, and sometimes Kshamendra, is completely > absent in anything chanchal, radhikarajen or prabhakar choose to say. I > could happily interchange their ramblings and it would make no difference at > all. Come to think of it aditya, i find it very interesting that you would > choose to defend this sort of patently racist and offensive language... > > I, unlike you Aditya, have no trouble calling a spade a spade... > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 7:32 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > >> I quote Aarti. They are clones. :) Communal propaganda...isn't it ? >> >> On 8/27/08, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote: >> > >> > Were you in II world war with hiter and his propaganda machine or did >> you >> > get any transplant from those ? >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: Khurram Parvez >> > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:03 pm >> > Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding >> > To: SARAI >> > >> > > >> > > People's Union for Democratic Rights, Delhi >> > > >> > > >> > > PRESS RELEASE, 26th August 2008 >> > > >> > > Findings of an Investigation Conducted From 22 to 25 August 2008 >> > > >> > > A six-member team from four human rights organisations conducted >> > > an investigation into the "economic blockade" in Kashmir and its >> > > aftermath. The team toured the districts of Srinagar, Budgam, >> > > Baramulla, and Bandipora. The team spoke to victims of the >> > > violence and their families, people who were part of protests, >> > > doctors at the SMHS hospital, journalists, the Kashmir Chamber of >> > > Commerce, and office bearers of many social and political >> > > organisations. However, the fact finding was disrupted as the >> > > state announced an indefinite curfew from the morning of 24th >> > > August. The release also addresses the second round of curfew >> > > currently in force. The total loss of life during the two periods >> > > of curfew stands at over 35. >> > > The main findings of the team are summarized below: >> > > >> > > 1. Azaadi is the primary demand in Kashmir >> > > The team arrived in Srinagar on 22 August and witnessed the >> > > massive protest meeting at the Idgah grounds. People gathered >> > > there publicly declared their primary demand for azaadi (freedom) >> > > at the meeting venue and through numerous street processions in >> > > various streets of Srinagar on 22 and 23 August. During our >> > > interviews with individual families and with groups, people voiced >> > > the same demand. A wide range of social and political >> > > organisations have also reiterated this demand. >> > > >> > > 2. Use of curfew to create a confrontation >> > > Curfew was imposed from the evening of 11 August and again from >> > > the morning of 24 August. The first time it was imposed hours >> > > after the security forces opened fire at many places on an unarmed >> > > procession heading to the Muzaffarabad border killing at least __ >> > > people. It was expected that people would come out in the >> > > following day to protest against the killings. Curfew thus became >> > > an instrument to prevent people from assembling and gave security >> > > forces the power to use force against unarmed protestors. >> > > The second time curfew was imposed with the express purpose of >> > > preventing the dharna at Lal Chowk. The previous gathering at >> > > Idgah, where this dharna was announced, had been peaceful. >> > > Therefore curfew became the means by which a confrontation was >> > > created, which could have been easily avoided. The clamping down >> > > on media and the brutal attacks on journalists happened while the >> > > team was still there. Arrests of leaders, raids of homes and >> > > intimidation of local residents by the army and CRPF are happening >> > > even now. On 24th itself, our team issued an appeal to the central >> > > government to lift the curfew to prevent loss of life. >> > > >> > > 3. Deliberate blockade of supplies and its indifferent handling. >> > > While our team has not investigated the happenings in the Jammu >> > > region, its impact on Kashmir has been confirmed through our >> > > interviews. Protests in Jammu, which started from early July, took >> > > a more violent turn from the beginning of August. This led to >> > > severe restriction on the movement of goods and people on the >> > > Srinagar-Jammu highway and even into Punjab. Records at the >> > > highway check points, as reported in the Economic Times (21.8.08), >> > > confirm the substantial lowering of goods traffic in July and its >> > > worsening in August. Shortages were created as a result: of oils >> > > and cooking gas in the rural areas, of cereals and medicines in >> > > the urban areas. Given the fears of Kashmiri transporters and >> > > drivers, the impact was far worse in traffic moving out of >> > > Kashmir. This has led to substantial losses for fruit growers as >> > > well as handicrafts and carpet manufacturers and transporters. >> > > Fruit could be found rotting at many places and handicraft >> > > manufacturers report >> > > cancellation of export orders for the ramazan season and fears >> > > for the Christmas season. The team was told that till 23rd August, >> > > 80 % of the trucks were not leaving the valley for fear of attacks >> > > and only some 15-20 trucks were able to carry the apples out of >> > > the valley after assurance of safe passage from the government. >> > > The loss—over 75% of the fruit are rotting in the Sopore mandi. In >> > > Seer Jagir, a village in Sopore tehsil, the team met small farmers >> > > with average land holding of 4-5 acres, which produces on an >> > > average 3000 boxes of apples per annum. The 30 farmers in this >> > > village reported that they have lost on an average Rs 2 lakh this >> > > season. Therefore, the total loss of this small village account to >> > > nearly 60 lakh. The government's lackadaisical attitude in >> > > ensuring supplies and its attempt to deny the 'blockade' led to >> > > feeling of ill-will in Kashmir. >> > > >> > > 4. Firing incidents (11-14th August) were unprovoked and aimed to kill >> > > The team investigated 15 cases of deaths that occurred on account >> > > of firing by CRPF and JK police between 11 and 14 August. The >> > > actual death toll is estimated to be above 30. The findings show a >> > > clear pattern: (a) The firings were aimed to kill. This was >> > > evident from eye witness accounts which showed that the firings >> > > were indiscriminate and aimed directly at the crowd. At Paribal, >> > > near Bandipura town on 12th August the RR and JK police fired on >> > > the crowd from above the hill where the 15 RR camp is located. (b) >> > > A large number of deaths resulted from injuries in the abdomen, >> > > chest, head or upper or lower back. The same was confirmed by >> > > hospital records. (c) In some cases, as at Lasjen on 12 August, >> > > protesters were deceived into by an assurance of allowing peaceful >> > > procession and then resorting to firing. Three people were killed >> > > including one 50 year old woman and six others received bullet >> > > injuries. >> > > >> > > 5. Attacks on those Injured >> > > The total number of people injured in the period between 11 and 14 >> > > August is not clearly established. However, at SMHS hospital >> > > alone, over 500 patients were admitted in the same period. The >> > > team met families and those injured and killed in the attacks. We >> > > were repeatedly told that the security forces never tried to reach >> > > the injured to hospital. Worse, vehicles carrying injured to >> > > hospital were routinely attacked. Hospital sources claim that a >> > > number of ambulances were attacked. The same is confirmed by news >> > > reports today and the health department has threatened to stop >> > > ambulance services given the injuries received by ambulance >> > > drivers. Our team was told that in Lasjen, even those carrying >> > > dead bodies back from the hospital were attacked on 12th August. >> > > Elsewhere, in Bandipora the same was reported. The van carrying >> > > Mehrajuddin Kakh, injured in the Bandipura killing on 12 August, >> > > was attacked by CRPF and STF at Parimpora. Not only were the occupants >> > > attacked, Mehrajuddin's thigh injury was brutalized by twisting a >> > > lathi in it. He died the same night. Equally, Imran Ahmed Wani who >> > > was injured in the Bagi Mehtab firing on 12 August was >> > > deliberately refused ambulance service for nearly two hours. In >> > > fact, when he did get into one, it was attacked at Rambagh Pul. He >> > > was declared dead on arrival at the hospital. >> > > >> > > 6. Attack on the SMHS hospital, Srinagar >> > > What is unbelievable is the attack on SMHS Hospital on 11 and 12 >> > > August successively. The SMHS hospital received the largest number >> > > of casualties. When doctors were trying to conduct emergency >> > > operations at break-neck speed in order to save lives, the >> > > Casualty was attacked with tear gas shells followed by firing live >> > > bullets. The firing was again repeated on 12 August. It is the >> > > dedication of doctors, paramedic staff, ambulance drivers and >> > > timely arranging of bandages, gauze and cotton by the medical >> > > representatives, at the risk of their own lives, that managed to >> > > save a large number of lives. The doctors also confirmed that the >> > > help received by the ordinary people in saving the lives of those >> > > injured was remarkable. People helped the medical staff in >> > > transporting the wounded to the OT, aided in tending treatment in >> > > the Casualty and arranged vans and ambulances to carry them to the >> > > different hospitals in the city and elsewhere. >> > > >> > > 7. Attacks on Funeral Processions >> > > Funeral processions were repeatedly attacked in many places as >> > > large numbers of people marched with the bier to the graveyards. >> > > The team was told that the funeral procession of Ishfaq Ahmed >> > > Kana, shot dead at Qamarwari Chowk, Srinagar on 11 August, to the >> > > Idgah Martyrs Memorial was attacked by the CRPF with lathis and >> > > rubber bullets. In Baghi Mahtab, Javed Ahmed Mir's funeral >> > > procession was attacked and one person was killed in the firing. >> > > Other protest demonstrations protesting against the killings were >> > > also attacked. For instance, the protest demonstration following >> > > the shooting of Owais Majeed Zarga in Rainawari, Srinagar on 12th >> > > August was attacked by the Kashmir police stationed outside the >> > > office of the local MLA, Mhd Shahid. Two boys were injured in the >> > > firing. >> > > >> > > 8. Raids and Attacks on Residents: >> > > During the evening of 13 and 14 August, security forces engaged in >> > > an indiscriminate and large-scale attack on houses in localities >> > > close to the firings, thrashing people and smashing window panes. >> > > At Safakadal, Srinagar, residents showed how their houses and a >> > > nearby mosque were attacked by the CRPF. At Lasjen, JK police and >> > > CRPF personnel entered houses to thrash people. Relatives were >> > > forcibly prevented from accessing homes of deceased and women >> > > relatives at the house of Imtiaz Rahim, who died in the firing, >> > > showed us the marks of brutality at the hands of the security >> > > forces. >> > > >> > > 9. FIRs: Refusals and Distortions: >> > > In most cases, the families have not registered any FIRs against >> > > the security forces as they fear going to the police station or >> > > that it would invite further violence. Where families of those >> > > killed were able to go to police stations after many days, they >> > > found that FIRs were already lodged stating that the protestors >> > > attacked security forces who in turn were forced to open fire. >> > > When families tried to get their version recorded, the same was >> > > refused. Complaints are rejected. In the case of the Bagi Mahtab >> > > killings where the families of the deceased (Javed Ahmed Mir and >> > > Imran Ahmed Wani) were given a totally false version of the >> > > happenings in the FIR. When challenged, the police said that the >> > > families must come ten days later with 4 eye witnesses to >> > > corroborate their story. This refusal even to receive complaints >> > > is tantamount to making the security forces judges of their own >> > > actions. >> > > 10. Present Curfew and Developments >> > > On 24 August, Kashmir was greeted by indefinite curfew when it >> > > woke up in the morning. Within a few hours four media persons, on >> > > their way to office had been badly beaten up at Rambagh by the >> > > CRPF. The identity cards and passes issued during the last phase >> > > of curfew presented by the journalists were rejected. Mr Bilal, >> > > bureau chief of Sahara Samay was admitted to the Bone and Joints >> > > hospital and later to the SMHS hospital. By evening, security >> > > forces opened fire in Dal Gate area killing one person and >> > > critically injuring another. Homes of political leaders were >> > > raided and some arrested. In the rural areas, the army threatened >> > > local imams, nambardars and chowkidars on 24 August that they >> > > would be held responsible if people dared to join in the >> > > procession to Lal Chowk. Over the last two days, the curfew has >> > > lad to at least seven people being killed in firing by security >> > > forces and over 275 injured in various parts of Kashmir valley. >> > > Essential supplies to Srinagar city, such as medicines, water >> > > tankers and milk, have been blocked and this 'blockade' has been >> > > done at the instance of the CRPF. The entire control of land and >> > > order in Srinagar city has all been handed over to the CRPF and >> > > news reports have suggested that the local police have also been >> > > beaten by the CRPF. >> > > CONCLUSION >> > > The investigation team is of the opinion that the firing, >> > > brutality, loss of life was not only wholly avoidable but done >> > > deliberately. The disruption of road traffic to Kashmir needed to >> > > be recognized by the government and addressed. The resort to >> > > curfew after the firing on 11 August denied the people a right to >> > > protest and be heard. Additionally, the curfew provided the >> > > security forces the power to open fire with impunity. A number of >> > > extremely inhuman crimes were committed by the security forces by >> > > denying and obstructing medical aid to the injured, attacking the >> > > injured and most seriously by launching an attack on the SMHS >> > > hospital. No existing law in the country provides immunity to >> > > police and security forces for such crimes. The lack of any action >> > > against these forces even where the crimes are established by eye- >> > > witnesses and reported in newspapers, makes people lose whatever >> > > faith in the government that may have remained after decades of >> > > army rule. >> > > Despite these happenings, the people of Kashmir have shown >> > > exemplary restraint and ensured that all processions and public >> > > gatherings after the lifting of curfew remain wholly peaceful. >> > > This situation should have been utilized to initiate political >> > > dialogue instead of the visit by the National Security Advisor. >> > > The imposition of curfew to prevent another such pre-declared >> > > peaceful mass gathering can only be seen as an invitation to >> > > another bloody attack on protestors and serves as a message to the >> > > people of Kashmir that the Indian government would not tolerate >> > > peaceful and unarmed protest. >> > > >> > > WE DEMAND >> > > 1. Immediate lifting of the curfew and restoration of >> > > ample space to people to peaceably collect and voice their demands. >> > > 2. Criminal charges be registered against those >> > > responsible for attacks on injured people, ambulances and >> > > hospitals as well as widespread damage to houses. >> > > 3. Peoples complaints concerning arbitrary and >> > > indiscriminate use of fire by security forces be registered and >> > > the culprits brought to book. >> > > 4. Law and order duties be immediately restored to the >> > > police in Srinagar and all forces be made ot work 'in aid of civil >> > > power' as required by law. >> > > 5. The situation of the peaceful expression of peoples >> > > demands be utilized to initiate a political dialogue, the >> > > political establishment is duty-bound to do so when people in such >> > > large numbers are voicing these. >> > > >> > > >> > > Harish Dhawan >> > > Secretary, PUDR >> > > On behalf of >> > > People's Democratic Forum (PDF), Karnataka >> > > Andhra Pradesh Civil Liberties Committee (APCLC), Andhra Pradesh >> > > Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society (JKCCS), Jammu and Kashmir >> > > People's Union for Democratic Rights (PUDR), Delhi >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > _________________________________________ >> > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > > Critiques & Collaborations >> > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > > subscribe in the subject header. >> > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- >> > > list >> > > List archive: >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > > From abasole at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 22:56:18 2008 From: abasole at gmail.com (Amit Basole) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 13:26:18 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Fact Finding In-Reply-To: <6353c690808271007x78c2dfefi6c91a10eefd4274f@mail.gmail.com> References: <306899.796.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6353c690808270702m10c3fbfav52e62ae4d6350799@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808270949s4e6bb4f1t60e02d20cbb30518@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808271007x78c2dfefi6c91a10eefd4274f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8e2bace60808271026q3d022963j5c4fc359650c2d@mail.gmail.com> Dear Reader-list members Could I please, please, please, make one more request to everyone not to dash-off one or two-liners to the entire list. Many of us are not on daily digest, in my case because I sometimes miss posts I would like to have read, if they appear in a digest. Even deleting the proliferating one line emails, although not exactly onerous, becomes tiring. Particularly when one returns from a few days absence to find many such emails. Debate is good, controversy is fine, but please make your posts substantive. And above all please take into consideration the vast membership of this list and resist the temptation to make it a "dialogue" amongst the vocal few. Amit -- Amit Basole Department of Economics Thompson Hall University of Massachusetts Amherst, MA 01003 Phone: 413-665-2463 http://www.people.umass.edu/abasole/ blog: http://www.mehr-e-niimroz.org/ From rohitism at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 22:57:45 2008 From: rohitism at gmail.com (Rohit Shetti) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:57:45 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa In-Reply-To: <48c2916d0808271005j77e73ff2wea817b345423a7c3@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808271005j77e73ff2wea817b345423a7c3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I couldn't agree with you more, Aarthi. When homes and villages are burning, spitting fire would be the least appropriate response in my opinion. Regards, On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 10:35 PM, Aarti Sethi wrote: > Can someone explain to me why the logic of retribution is so easily > deployed, as if its common sense. As if it makes perfect sense to attack > hundreds of people who have had nothing to do with the killing of > Laxmananda > Saraswati simply because they happen to belong to the same community of the > people who shot him? Which incidentally is not even the case. In the new > reports it says unidentified assailants. > > Who said "missionaries" shot him dead radhika? Please show me one news > reports which conclusively proves it was missionaries. And even if it was > missionaries, does this mean you justify murder, arson, rape? I'm terribly > sorry but it is not at all evident to me that individuals can be made to > bear the burden of expiation for the acts of others simply because they > happen to belong to the same religious community. > > I think you need to think very carefully and seriously about the things you > say. You sound like a really violent human being. > > regards > A > > On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 7:09 PM, wrote: > > > Well, if 90 year old man, swamiji or otherwise, and along with this 90 > year > > old man, another 7 persons, who is revered by citizens, is shot dead by > > "missionaries" who preach love and compassion, and the citizens are > expected > > to tolerate this atrocity even when administation is hesitant to take > action > > against these goons. ? > > > > Missionaries who work in tribal areas with money fromabroad should know > > that love is not taught by guns shots to old men. ? > > > > Regards. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 5:51 pm > > Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa > > To: sarai list > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > > From: John Dayal > > > Date: Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 12:15 AM > > > > > > > > > Dr. John Dayal > > > > > > Member: National Integration Council > > > Government of India > > > > > > Secretary General: All India Christian Council (Founded 1999) > > > President: United Christian Action, Delhi (Founded 1992) > > > Imm. Past National President: All India Catholic Union (Founded 1919) > > > > > > 505 Link, 18 IP Extension, Delhi 110092 India > > > Email: johndayal at vsnl.com > > > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > > > Phone: 91-11-22722262 Mobile 09811021072 > > > > > > 25 August 2008 > > > > > > URGENT FAX > > > > > > TO PRESIDENT OF INDIA > > > > > > SEEKING ARMY / CENTRAL FORCES INTERVENTION TO PROTECT CHRISTIANS IN > > > ORISSA AS NUN IS RAPED, PRIESTS INJURED, CHURCHES AND OFFICES > > > BURNT IN > > > PRESENCE OF POLICE > > > > > > Hon'ble Mrs., Pratibha Patil > > > President of India > > > > > > Dear President > > > > > > Greetings from a grieving community. > > > > > > You are aware of the still continuing carnage against the Christian > > > community, mostly Dalits and Tribals, in the Kandhamal district of > > > Orissa and in several other districts including the state capital of > > > Bhubaneswar since 23rd August 2003 following the killing of Vishwa > > > Hindu Parishad leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati, reportedly by > > > Maoist groups who have been operating in the state for some time. > > > > > > The Christian leadership in the country has unequivocally condemned > > > the killing of the VHP leader and his four associates. > > > > > > The Christians of Kandhamal are still nursing their wounds from the > > > Christmas 2007 violence, with hundreds of them still living in a > > > refugee camp in Barakhama. Most of the more than One hundred churches > > > then destroyed remain in ruins, and the burnt houses are still to be > > > fully rebuilt. > > > > > > And yet local Sangh leaders have targeted the community in a second > > > wave of macabre violence. > > > > > > A nun has been raped in Kandhamal, a Catholic father grievously > > > injured, scores of houses in villages destroyed, apart from Churches > > > and institutions. I attach herewith a partial list of the damage in > > > the violence in the past two days. We in Delhi are overwhelmed with > > > panic messages from Priests, pastors, nuns and common people who look > > > to New Delhi for help as the State machinery ahs collapsed once again. > > > > > > Changing of superintendents of police as a knee jerk reaction does not > > > provide security to Christians. In fact, much of the violence is > > > taking place with the insufficient police force looking on. This had > > > been the case in 2007 December, as has come out in the on going > > > hearings of the Justice Basudeo Panigrahi Commission. Christian > > > delegations have informed the State Governor, the State Chief Minister > > > and the Home Minister of India of the dire situation of our community > > > in Orissa. > > > > > > Dear Madame President, > > > > > > This is to request you to use your powers as President of India, and > > > the tremendous force of your good offices, to impress on the Central > > > Government to rush adequate Union forces, including contingents of the > > > Armed Forces if required, to restore law and order and governance in > > > the Kandhamal region. > > > > > > The consequences of any further delay, I fear, may be catastrophic for > > > our Christian community in the State in particular, for peace in > > > Orissa in general, and for the fair name of India as a secular > > > country. > > > > > > God Bless you > > > > > > John Dayal > > > > > > Attachments: > > > 1. Incomplete list of death and damage in violence of 23rd-25th > > > August 2008 > > > 2. Christian condemnation of killing of Sw. Lakshmanananda Saraswati > > > > > > ORISSA ANTI CHRISTIAN VIOLENCE UPDATE 25th August 2008 > > > > > > : > > > 1. CHRISTIAN WOMAN TEACHER REPORTED BURNT ALIVE: A Christian woman > > > teacher, possibly a nun [BUT NOT CONFIRMED], was reported burnt alive > > > on 25th August 2008 by a group of Vishwa Hindu Parishad mob which > > > stormed the orphanage she ran in the district of Bargarh (Orissa). > > > Police Superintendent Ashok Biswall has told this to news > > > reporters. A > > > priest who was at the orphanage was also badly hurt and is now being > > > treated in hospital for multiple burns. > > > 2. NUN RAPED: A young Catholic Nun of the Cuttack Bhubaneswar diocese > > > working Jan Vikas Kendra, the Social Service Centre at Nuagaon in > > > Kandhamal was reportedly gang raped on 24th August 2008 by groups of > > > Hindutva extremists before the building itself was destroyed. > > > 3. SENIOR PRIEST AND NUN INJURED: Fr Thomas, director of the Diocesan > > > Pastoral Centre in Kanjimendi, less than a kilometer away from the > > > Social Service Centre, and another Nun were injured when the centre > > > was attacked. They were taken to the police station in a disheveled > > > state as the armed mob bayed for their blood. The Pastoral centre was > > > then set afire. > > > 4. BALLIGUDA CHURCH BUILDINGS DESTROYED AGAIN: On 24th August 2008 > > > evening lynch mobs at the block headquarters of Balliguda, in the very > > > heart of Kandhamal district, which had seen much violence between 24th > > > and 26th December 2007, attacked and destroyed a Presbytery, convent > > > and hostel damaging the properties. > > > 5. The mobs in Balliguda caught hold of two boys of the Catholic > > > hostel and tonsured their heads. > > > 6. PHULBANI CHURCH DAMAGED: On 25th august 2008 morning followers of > > > the late Lakshmanananda Saraswati damaged the Catholic Church in > > > Phulbani, the district headquarter town. > > > 7. MOTHER TERESA BROTHERS ASHRAM ATTACKED: mobs attacked the Mother > > > Teresa Brothers' residence and hospital in Srasanada, destroyed once > > > before and rebuilt two months ago, and beat up the patients. > > > Fundamentalists have targeted Priests, religious and also the Faithful > > > in Pobingia also. > > > 8. BHUBANESWAR BISHOP'S HOUSE ATTACKED: On the morning of 25th August > > > 2008, violent mobs made several attempts to enter the compounds of > > > Catholic Church and Archbishop's house in the heart of the Capital of > > > the State of Orissa. They could not enter because of the police > > > presence. They threw stones at the guesthouse of Archbishop's House, > > > damaging windows. > > > 9. DUBURI PARISH; Another group of fundamentalists entered presbytery > > > in Duburi parish, managed by the SVDs and destroyed and damaged > > > property. Two priests of the parish are missing. > > > 10. Mr. Jamaj Pariccha, Director of Gramya Pragati, is attacked and > > > his property, vehicle etc. damaged, burnt and looted. > > > 11. A Baptist Church in Akamra Jila in Bhubaneswar is also damaged. > > > 12. Christian institutions like St. Arnold's School (Kalinga Bihar), > > > AND NISWASS report some damage. > > > 13. BOUDH DISTRICT [Adjoining Kandhamal]: Fundamentalists enter the > > > Catholic parish church and destroy property. People are fleeing to > > > safer places. But nothing seems safe. > > > 14. Muniguda Catholic Fathers and Nuns' residence have been damaged. > > > 15. Sambalpur HM Sister's residence (Ainthapalli) has suffered damage. > > > 16. Padanpur: One priest is attacked and admitted to a hospital. > > > Hostel boys and the in charge have moved away from the place. > > > 17. Madhupur Catholic Church currently under attack. > > > 18. SMALL CHURCHES: Attempted violence on small churches in various > > > districts, including Padampur, Sambalpur near GM College, Talsera, > > > Dangsoroda, Narayanipatara, Muniguda, Tummiibandh, Tangrapada, > > > Phulbani, Balliguda, Kalingia, Chakapad, Srasanranda. > > > 19. VILLAGE CHRISTIAN HOUSES ATTACKED: Houses attacked on forest > > > hamlets of Balliguda, Kanjamandi Nuaguam (K.Nuaguam), Tiangia > > > (G.Udayagiri), Padangiri, Tikabali. > > > 20. KALAHANDI DISTRICT: houses burnt even though the district is more > > > than 300 kilometers from the place where Swami Lakshmanananda was > > > killed. > > > 21. Pastor Sikandar Singh of the Pentecostal Mission beaten up and his > > > house burnt in Bhawanipatna. > > > 22. Kharihar: 3 Christian shops were looted and burnt. Pastor Alok Das > > > and Pastor I M Senapati beaten up. > > > 23. Aampani: Pastor David Diamond Pahar, Pastor Pravin Ship, Pastor > > > Pradhan and Pastor Barik beaten up and chased away with their > > > families. > > > 24. Naktikani: Mob surrounds village to attack Christians. The > > > government has sent forces, it is reported. > > > > > > [This list is compiled with assistance from Archbishop's House, > > > Bhubaneswar and other sources] > > > > > > - --------------------------------- > > > URGENT > > > >From John Dayal > > > 25 August 2008 > > > > > > INDIAN CHURCH CONDEMNS KILLING OF ORISSA VHP LEADER > > > > > > The Church in India has unequivocally condemned the killing of Vishwa > > > Hindu Parishad [VHP] Orissa leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > > four colleagues in the Tumiliband region of Kandhamal district by Left > > > wing extremists. Still recovering from the worst ever anti Christian > > > violence in Indian history in December 2007, Christian organisations > > > have appealed for peace as the community braces for another round of > > > violence in the state from Hindutva groups who have sworn to avenge > > > Saraswati death by attacking Churches, institutions, clergy and nuns. > > > > > > The following is the text of major statements issued by Church groups > > > condemning the VHP leaders' death: > > > > > > ARCHBISHOP RAPHAEL CHEENATH, SVD > > > Archbishop of Cuttack-Bhubaneswar > > > > > > 24 August 2008 > > > > > > I, on behalf of the Christians of Orissa, particularly the catholic > > > Christians, strongly condemn the dastardly attack and violent killing > > > of Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five of his associates. We the > > > Christians abhor violence and condemn all acts of violence and > > > terrorism and are against all groups of people taking the law into > > > their own hands. We condole the death of Swami Lakshmanananda > > > Saraswati, a religious leader and his associates. At this critical > > > juncture I appeal to all for peace and communal harmony. We want good > > > relationship with all the communities with whom we live. > > > > > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > > > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > > > that least one prayer hall in Sundergarh District has been burnt and > > > vehicle belonging to Daughters of the most Precious Blood has been > > > burnt near G. Udayagiri. > > > > > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > > > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > > > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > > > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > > > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > > associates. > > > > > > - --------- > > > > > > ALL INDIA CHRISTIAN COUNCIL: > > > > > > Press Statement by Dr John Dayal, Secretary General, and Dr Sampaul, > > > National Secretary for Public Affairs > > > > > > The All India Christian Council is deeply concerned at the attack on > > > an ashram near Tumiliband in Kandhamal District of Orissa last night > > > in which the Vishwa Hindu Parishad leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and > > > four of his associates were killed. This is the latest of a series of > > > attacks in recent months by political extremists which have left > > > dozens of policemen and others dead in several districts of Orissa. > > > > > > We are also concerned at the immediate outbreak of communal violence > > > against innocent Christians in nearby districts. Early reports suggest > > > at least one prayer hall in Sundergarh ahs been burnt, the van of some > > > Catholic Nuns destroyed and the sisters themselves injured. > > > > > > We urgently appeal to the Chief Minister and the Governor of Orissa > > > and at the Indian Home Minister Mr. Shivraj Patil to take whatever > > > steps are require to maintain peace and harmony in all areas of > > > states, to prevent further attacks on Christians and to bring to book > > > those responsible for the death of Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > > associates. > > > > > > The Christian community abhors violence, condemns all acts of > > > terrorism and is against groups of people taking the law into their > > > own hands. We have had major differences with the dead VHP leader. It > > > has been the hate campaigns of the VHP and Sangh Parivar which led to > > > untold misery to Christians in the violence last Christmas. Refugees > > > from that violence are still living in government camps in Barakhama > > > under miserable conditions. But we wish peace to everyone. > > > We pray for peace in Orissa, one of the most undeveloped states in > > > the country, > > > - ------------------ > > > > > > CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE OF INDIA: > > > > > > The Catholic Bishops' Conference of India (CBCI) is sad to note that > > > Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Lakshmanananda Saraswati and five > > > others were murdered on Saturday August 23 allegedly by Maoist group > > > in Kandhamal Dist of Orissa. The Church leaders in Orissa and other > > > parts of the country have condemned the killing of Swami > > > Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his associates in the Ashram. We have > > > also appealed for peace and harmonyin the state. > > > > > > However, we are extremely sorry to find that some organizations have > > > pointed finger at the Christian community in Orissa for the alleged > > > murder of the Swami and his associates. Consequently there have been > > > unprovoked attacks on Christians and their institutions in Kandhamal > > > and surrounding areas. School at Bhadrak Town, Convent and the > > > computer centre at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist, Pastoral Centre at > > > Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Social Development Centre (Jan Vikas > > > Kendra) at Baliguda in Kandhamal Dist., Catholic Church in Phulbani > > > and a Convent of the religious women at Phulbani have suffered in the > > > attacks which took place after the murder of Swami Lakshmanananda > > > Saraswati. > > > > > > We are sad to note that the extremists are attacking and vandalizing > > > our institutions without any reason. Incidents of arson and > > > burning of > > > vehicles belonging to the Church have also been reported at Udaygiri. > > > Some of our religious nuns, girls and boys in the hostels have fled > > > from their places and taken shelter in the forest, particularly in > > > Kandhamal Dist. We are seriously concerned about the safety and > > > security of our frightened people who are innocent and yet find > > > themselves in a very precarious situation. The State Government has > > > deployed police forces in some of the areas and yet the violence has > > > not been contained. We request the Central Government to urgently > > > intervene in the matter and send additional forces to bring situation > > > to normalcy. > > > - -- Rev. Dr. Babu Joseph, SVD, Spokesperson, CBCI > > > - ------------ > > > EVANGELICAL FELLOWSHIP OF INDIA: > > > > > > Evangelical Fellowship of India (EFI) denounces the killing of Vishwa > > > Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Swami Lakshmanananda Saraswati and his > > > four associates by suspected Maoists in Orissa state's Kandhamal > > > district on August 23. While deeply saddened by the weeklong spate of > > > attacks that hit Kandhamal district during last Christmas, EFI, as a > > > representative of the evangelical church in India, stands against > > > every act of violence and terrorism. > > > > > > EFI also regrets that vested interests among the various Hindu > > > nationalist groups are trying to blame local Christians for the act, > > > as reflected in the acts of vandalism and arson reported from > > > Kandhamal after the attack on Saraswati ashram. > > > > > > EFI appeals to the central, state and district authorities to take all > > > possible measures to maintain peace and calm in Kandhamal. EFI also > > > calls for the Christian community in India and abroad to pray for > > > protection of the Christians in Kandhamal and other parts of Orissa. > > > - -- Rev. Dr. Richard Howell, General Secretary > > > Evangelical Fellowship of India > > > - -------------------- > > > Prashant. A Centre for Human Rights, Justice and Peace, Ahmedabad, > > > Gujarat, India > > > > > > We condemn the killing of Swami Saraswati and four of his associates > > > during the attack on the VHP Ashram in the Kandhamal District of > > > Orissa on Saturday 23rd August 2008. We sympathize with the bereaved > > > members of the families who have lost their loved ones. > > > > > > We call upon the Orissa and the Central Governments to do all in their > > > power to bring to book immediately, those responsible for this > > > dastardly act; that anti-social elements do not take law and order > > > into their own hands and above all, to ensure that peace and calm > > > prevail in the area, and in other parts of Orissa. > > > > > > Violence, for whatever the provocation, is non-acceptable, and will > > > definitely not help achieve the goals for which these acts are > > > committed. We therefore call upon all those responsible for these acts > > > and to eschew violence immediately. No violence can be justified, for > > > whatever the reason. However, for the last several months, the > > > Government of Orissa has allowed some fascist and fundamentalist > > > forces to terrorize the poor, the marginalized and the minorities of > > > the State. These forces have carried on their virulent propaganda and > > > their violent acts with apparent immunity. > > > > > > There has been a total abdication of responsibility by the Government > > > of Orissa and the concerned authorities, like the police. They should > > > now also be held totally responsible for these deaths and for allowing > > > the situation to go out of control. Sufficient warning has been given > > > to the Orissa Government, of the deteriorating situation, as early as > > > in September 2006, with the publication of "Communalism in Orissa" > > > - > > > the Report of the Indian People's Tribunal on Environment and Human > > > Rights - headed by Justice K. K. Usha (Retd.) former Chief Justice of > > > the Kerala High Court. It may still not be too late to ensure that > > > the Constitutional Rights and Freedoms of the people of Orissa are not > > > merely guaranteed by also protected by the State. > > > > > > Fr. Cedric Prakash sj, Director > > > > > > - -- > > > > > > Please visit these sites: > > > http://groups.google.com/group/JohnDayal > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > > > list > > > List archive: > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From indersalim at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 23:06:42 2008 From: indersalim at gmail.com (inder salim) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 23:06:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' - The Geelani interview In-Reply-To: <1896C74C-1A1A-4A83-AA96-F36CF2C03BB9@sarai.net> References: <443578.87137.qm@web57205.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <1896C74C-1A1A-4A83-AA96-F36CF2C03BB9@sarai.net> Message-ID: <47e122a70808271036w2508d3e0t115b1e15ff3fe2af@mail.gmail.com> I beleive, on Kashmir this little lucid and accurate text piece by Shuddha is not for our dear friend Mr. Kshmendra only, but for all of us... to look into the present politics and pain there,.... finally some reasoining is emerging from the 'sagar manthan' churning of words on this list. i wish, those who quickly laspe into communal outbursts, see this kind of talking, not as 'craft' but something that comes straight out of heart. love is On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 3:10 AM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Kshmendra, > > Thank you for your posting on highlighting Syed Ali Shah Geelani's > opinions. There is nothing new in what Geelani has said, and his > position is quite well known, both within Kashmir, as well as amongst > those who have a long-standing interest in the matter. I am > responding to this question not because I have a personal axe to > grind pro or anti S.A.S Geelani, but because the question you raise > implicitly has important shades, and I would like not to let go of > their significance. I will turn to them briefly at the end of this > posting. > > Let me begin by saying that I agree with you on the completely > nonsensical nature of S.A.S Geelani's half baked views on the subject > of the future governance of Kashmir. There is, as you rightly point > out, no single accepted interpretation of what exactly constitutes > Islamic jurisprudence and statecraft , so it is clear that when he > talks of using that as a guide with which to govern (nizam) Kashmir > he is clearly intent on imposing his own narrow, secterian view, > which would be anathema even to the majority of Muslims in Kashmir. > > When anyone, let alone someone like S.A.S Geelani (who should know > better, because he claims to be a scholar of Islam) talks about > Islamic Socio-Economic conditions, or Islamic Culture (which one, > the one of Andalusia, Java, the Levant, Shi'a Iran, Bektashi > European, Turkish Ottoman, or Hejazi, or Peasant Bengali), or about > the Sunnah as a guide to governance and everyday living (on which > there is no consensus within Islam) he is clearly talking utter > nonsense (such guidance does not exist in any clear form and would > have to be invented) and it should be absolutely clear to everyone > that as a possible future ruler he would be the worst disaster to > have befallen the unhappy people of Kashmir. Just as every modern > Muslim Fundamentalist Ruler has been a disaster for every single > people whom they have had the misfortune to rule. > > I have to say that he reminds me a lot of a man venerated by many in > the 'pantheon' of the Indian struggle for Indendence. Subhash Chandra > Bose - charismatic, doctrinaire, reportedly honest, willing to sup > with fascists and nazis, authoritarian and fascinated by authority, > and with a vain, arrogant yet thuggish streak that would have made > him a disaster as a possible ruler of Independent India (and dare I > say,even more of a disaster for Kashmir), This part of the world was > spared much misfortune by that airplane that never quite made it over > the straits of Formosa after the second world war. (His brother, > Sarat Bose however, was in my opinion one of the most interesting and > creative political actors of his generation). So, India was spared > Subhash Bose by an air mishap, and S.A.S Geelani's advancing age may > also deliver him from Kashmir, and yet allow Kashmir to remember him > with some hazy residual fondness for his reported honesty, personal > civility and straightforwardness. > > Having said all this, I am surprised that you say that the opinions > expressed on the Reader List that are not in accordance with the > standard Indian state's position on Kashmir are 'muted' when it comes > to S.A.S Geelani. I think they occupy a fairly wide spectrum, some > are indifferent, some are muted, some are possibly in agreement, some > are in mild disagreement, some are in total disagreement (like mine). > This spectrum, to me, is a sign of the health of what you call the > 'pro-separatist' and what I would characterize the 'pro-withdrawal of > India from Kashmir' position(s) on the Reader List. Difference, even > robust difference, is always healthy. > > I think the 'pro continued Indian occupation of Kashmir' position on > this list, in comparison, is far more monotonous. It does not seem to > have much by way of internal debate or differentiation, or, if it > does, (with some exceptions, mainly reservations expressed > occasionally in a minor key by you) it does not appear, at least not > on this list. > > (This list - The Reader List - by the way is a list that is hosted on > the Sarai website, among other lists. It is not THE Sarai list, it is > not the SARAI list. And the opinions expressed on this list are not > the opinions of Sarai, even when they are expressed by people who > work at Sarai. Sarai does not have an opinion. It cannot, because it > is neither a person, nor a party, nor an interest group. And Sarai > hosts many different kinds of curiosities, as researchers, as fellows > as practitioners, not all of whom have the same opinion on Kashmir, > or any thing for that matter) > > Sorry for that clarificatory digression. But now back to your > question. Is the so called 'pro-'Azadi' ' camp in Kashmir, elsewhere, > or on this list, 'mute' about S.A.S Geelani? > > Let me begin addressing this question first of all by asking a > counter-question. Why is it necessary for us to be 'vocal' about > Geelani at all? As far as I am concerned, he is just another > politician, perhaps respected by some people in the valley because he > is seen (by some again, not all) as not having ever been on the > payroll of the Indian state. (Many others in the so called > 'separatist' leadership have at one time or another been seen as > (rightly or wrongly) or have been believed to be compromised by their > tacit acceptance of covert 'favours' by the Indian state. But to me, > this question of 'is Geelani corrupt or not ?' is actually > irrelevant. Sometimes the most dangerous politics is exercised by > those who adorn themselves with the charisma of incorruptability and > the glow of an inability to be flexible. So this alone is not a > criterion by which I judge what SAS Geelani represents in Kashmir. > > For me, the opinions of this octegenarian politician (and sometime > member of the Legislative Assembly of Jammu & Kashmir - which proves > that even S.A.S Geelani has been different things at different times) > is of less consequence than the logic of what impels the people of > Kashmir to reject the Indian state. Today, more than ever before in > Kashmir, the people are ahead of their leaders. The initiative is > really in their hands, and the Indian state is terribly confused > because there is little that it can achieve even by playing games of > intrigue within and between the factions of the Hurriyat Conference, > because frankly, neither the Hurriyet Leadership, nor the Militants, > nor the ISI, nor the mainstream political parties, are running the > show. The show is running, despite, not because of them. > > The logic of how the show runs, how the people of Kashmir enact their > refusal of the Indian state has to do with the stranglehold that the > Indian state has exercised over aspect of life in Kashmir, and its > absolute refusal to let people live in peace. Only today, we have > read a report in the Indian Express that speaks of the repressive > apparatus of the state attacking ambulances and ambulance crews. And > we have read earlier of police and CRPF using violence in the > casualty wards of hospitals, intimidating doctors and nurses as they > tend to the wounded. I have been in Kashmir, I have seen an Army unit > burn a village, I have seen the fear in a father's face as he spoke > to me, thinking that as an 'indian', i could have some influence in > helping get his teenage daughter back from the clutches of an army > patrol who were holding her hostage. If I were a villager who lived > in that village, why would you expect me to feel anything but hatred > and fear for the state that does these things. That is why, my > standing by the movement against the Indian occupation has more to do > with standing by these people rather than anything to do with the > ephemerality of a so called 'leadership'. Let us not forget, that > S.A.S Geelani's claim to 'leadership' is far from being uncontested. > He had to leave his own party, the Jamaat e Islam, because no one > took him seriously, and the 'Tehreek -e-Hurriyat' which has been his > refuge in recent days is a far more heterodox and complex formation > than he is actually comfortable with. S.A,S Geelani routinely listens > only to those who say yes to him, and the fact that the crowd that > did not take his 'claim to leadership' at the rally after which he > had to apologize is a pointer of the fact that in front of > constituencies other than his own, his authority is not that high, > even though there may be a grudging respect for his moral standing. > > At the same time, in the maelstorm that is Kashmir, there must be > several, brutalized, humiliated, scorned, who would think - "Why > should I not turn to a man who speaks a clear and forthright anger > against these violences. Why would I not take his idiom seriously. > Why, when I have nothing left to cling to, should I not reach out and > hold on to the surety of an iron clad faith that he holds out to me." > and that perhaps explains S.A.S Geelani's desparate constituency. His > appeal, however much of it exists, and it exists, not for a single > reason, or even in a simple way, (I know for instance, that people > weep for him and curse him at the same time). It is an index of how > far the people of Kashmir have been pushed to the wall. > > I understand this, and yet I think that this is a profound tragedy. > S.A.S Geelani, once a minor, unpopular politician in the Jamaat e > Islami, a sometime MLA for a party with two seats that were scrounged > and won in fraudulent elections, a party that no one really cared for > in Kashmir, is what he is today, thanks to the Indian state. > > Through the fifties, sixities, seventies, eighties it suffocated > every other form of opposition. It engineered the imprisonment of > every dissident voice, toppled governments at will, and capriciously > arranged for the rise and fall of this or that figure and then > arranged for the execution of Maqbool Butt, the exile of Amanullah > Khan, the targetted assasinations of figures like Dr. Guru, Hriday > Nath Wanchoo, the elder Mirwaiz, Abdul Ghani Lone and many others > who were of much greater stature than S.A.S Geelani in the eyes of > the people of Kashmir and who could have, at times like this, > provided some of the ethical and intellectual anchors, even some of > the personal succor that the movement needs today. > > Who was left? Who was transformed from a virtual non-entity to the > man in shining incorruptible armour - S.A.S Geelani. He suited the > Indian state best. He could be demonized, he could be portrayed as a > bigot, which he is. He held out for a corrupt military dictatorship > in Pakistan. His malignant ideas about what kind of Kashmir he wants > can be ridiculed, and so, by extension, the movement as a whole could > be tarred by having him identified as the leader, as the qaid. > > Something similar happenned in Iran. The Shah of Iran completely > destroyed every form of opposition, other than the clerics of Qom. A > surprised Khomeini, who could at least go into exile in Iraq and > France, while the non-Islamist or moderate Muslim opposition found > itself shot with bullets in the back of the neck, found the moral > leadership of the Iranian revolution gifted to him by the fleeing > Shah of Iran. The Indian state, by using money, guns and intrigue, > has left Geelani (the apparently incorruptible, honest and > straightforward, but reactionary, proto-fascist Geelani) holding > himself out as the pretender to the throne of the leadership of the > movement for Azadi in Kashmir. It is not the people of Kashmir as > much as Iovernment of India that has crowned Geelani by demonizing > him. The people of Kashmir, in their bitteness, have sometimes looked > up to the man that the Government of India loathes most of all. This > may not be as accurate an index of their esteem for that man as it is > a mark of their hatred for that government. It is for the same reason > that Bose became wildly popular (even in areas where he had no base) > in the bitter forties of the last century in India, when the British > Raj was on its last and in some ways most desperate legs in India. > > Ask the successive home ministers, prime ministers and intelligence > officers of India why they brought Kashmir to this state that Geelani > can appear sometimes as if he could be a saviour to the same people > that he also infuriates with his obstinacy, his retrograde statements > and reactionary outlook on life. > > As for what I think of him and what he represents. And I can speak > only for myself here. I have always been clear. > > At the risk of repetition, let me quote from two postings - > > ------------------------------------ > > Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 > Date: 16 August 2008 5:11:19 PM GMT+05:30 > > I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the > transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, > and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a > demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to > abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever > reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as > foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu > Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' > that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. > > I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the > transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, > and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a > demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to > abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever > reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as > foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu > Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' > that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. > > [I posted this because it was Geelani who raised the ridiculous bogey > of the 'demographic shift' in Kashmir, even as he (correctly, in my > view) pointed out that the anger about the alienation of land in > Kashmir has to do with the arbitrary occupation of acres and acres > of land by the Armed Forces of India.] > > > Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 > Date: 21 August 2008 3:45:48 AM GMT+05:30 > > I disagree with anyone who calls for 'Nizam-E-Mustafa' because I > disagree with the idea or imagination of any 'Nizam' or regime that > finds it necessary to protect itself from question by adorning the > mantle of unquestionable sanctity. The word 'Mustafa' means 'Chosen' > in Arabic. And the idea of a 'NIzam-E-Mustafa' meaning, the 'state of > the chosen' has an uncanny resemblance to the idea of the return of > the 'chosen people' to their state, which is the foundational myth, > if you like of Zionism. I know that Syed Ali Shah Geelani would > probably be horrified to think that his vision of 'Azaadi' has a > striking parallel of the founding myth of the State of Israel.(and it > is actually the founding myth of all hitherto oppressed people who > are led to believe that once they achieve a statehood congruent with > their idea of who they are, all will be well - this is the general > condition of all secular, radical, liberal or conservative notions of > nationalism, of which, Zionism and the idea of the 'Nizam e Mustafa' > are perhaps the clearest exemplars.) > > The perception of a 'State' as the 'Manifest Destiny' of a people > chosen by God or History, or both, contains within it the seed of a > terrible tragedy, of yesterday's victims transforming themselves into > tomorrows tormentors. Of the Pakistani army conducting mass murder in > what was once East Pakistan, and thus destroying once and for all, > the delusion of a brotherhood forged on the basis of Islam alone. No > one could imagine that those who laid the foundations of the Jewish > state of Israel in the wake of the holocaust would be laying the > foundations of a detention facility for Palestinians. No one could > imagine that those who led the oppressed people of India into her > 'tryst with destiny' in 1947, so radiant in the first flush of what > they called freedom, would turn Kashmir or the North East or much of > Central India into death camps. We, especially those of us who stand > by Kashmiris today, against Indian and Pakistani occupation, must > imagine the possibility that an 'Azaad' Kashmir, whether it is > independent, or a part of Pakistan, may also be a similar bitter > harvest. Nothing can be more lethal than the assumption that victims > are innocent per se. We must recognize clearly, especially if we > invest in the idea of 'Azaadi' that those who speak of freedom in > Kashmir today, may turn out to be oppressors tomorrow. It is because > of this, that I disagree with any attempt to cloak the idea of the > state (even, and especially if it claims to speak for and on behalf > of the oppressed) with any sanctity. As long as the state as a form > of organising and administering human society remains, we must be > vigilant, I believe, to ensure that those who lead the state are not > able to adorn themselves with the concealing cloak of sanctity of any > kind. The sanctity and glamour of the yesterday's state of being > oppressed is a weapon in the arsenal of tomorrow's oppressor. This > applies, without any qualification to the present and future destiny > of Kashmir, and the people of Kashmir must be vigilant against all > those who act in the name of the sacred, and most of all, in their > name, in the name of the people of Kashmir. > > --------------------------- > > Let me now come to whether the fact that S A S Geelani makes > himself out to be a man of religion, or whether the fact that the > Mirwaiz speaks from a pulpit and is a religious figure of some > consequence in Kashmir should make any different to our assessment of > these individuals. Personally, no. I am not religious myself, but I > do believe that several of the most creative political thinkers and > activists of our times have been motivated by their religious > convictions, and have spoken politically in a religious idiom. These > include the Liberation Theologian and Nicaraguan Revolutionary > Ernesto Cardenal, Tenzing Gyaltso - the fourteenth Dalai Lama, > Martin Luther King Jr., Swami Sahajanand Saraswati (A Dandin Sannyasi > and Bihar Peasant leader and sometime member of the Communist Party) > and Rahul Sankrityayan (Ordained Buddhist monk and maverick > Communist), For me, a staunch non-believer, the secular-religious > divide is not as important as the humanist-non-humanist divide. For > me, as i have stated above, the key test is, does the person > concerned hold out his views and ideology as sacred and beyond > question, if he does, regardless of whether he or she is devout or an > atheist, they are bad news. > > Finally, a cause may be just, even if it is saddled by an > incompetent, or disagreeable protagonist. Similarly, a cause may be > unjust, even though it may be represented by agreeable and > intelligent people. I believe that the cause of Azadi for Kashmir is > just, even though I find some of its protagonists incompetent and > disagreeable (I feel that S.A.S Geelani may be honest, but as a > political protagonist he is both incompetent and disagreeable) . I > believe that the cause of having India hold on to Kashmir is unjust > even as I may find some of its proponents agreeable at a personal > level. I am sure you understand what I mean. > > regards > > Shuddha > > > On 26-Aug-08, at 6:06 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > >> If, any deserving to be taken seriously voice were to say that >> 'India should be declared as a Hindu country', there would be many >> a million voices (including mine) that would stridently condemn >> such a statement, that would be gravitated to campaign for and >> garner widespread public opinion against such a statement. >> >> We would find some of the most brilliantly argued, impressively >> articulate, eloquent and even 'wordy' dismissals of such a >> statement in SARAI itself. >> >> On SARAI we have quite a few brilliantly argumentatitive, >> impressively articulate, eloquent and often wordy opinions >> expressed in favour of the 'separatists' of Kashmir. Surprisingly, >> they are rather muted in their comments about Geelani's position. >> Demure almost in their referring to him in-passing and generally >> conveying the impression that the Geelani (and his support base) >> position is not of any real significance and of not much >> consequence in the "separatist movement". That tells me (at least), >> how much these people are in touch with the 'realities' of Kashmir >> or the "separatist movement". >> >> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 28 08:50:34 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:50:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Threat to Hindus in Valley: RAW In-Reply-To: <6353c690808272019t231e7190q957ac46bf1afb3ff@mail.gmail.com> References: <6353c690808272019t231e7190q957ac46bf1afb3ff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808272020j3192d5f8k1c4a4df515d746ff@mail.gmail.com> *Threat to Hindus in Valley: RAW* *Pranab Dhal Samanta, Indian Express* *August 28, 2008* *New Delhi, August 27 *The Centre is deeply worried about the security of the Hindu community in the Valley after intelligence reports of militant outfits planning to target them to create communal unrest. Based on these reports, National Security Advisor M K Narayanan met members of the Hindu Welfare Society during his recent visit to Srinagar and asked the state to intensify security in areas inhabited by the Hindus. The matter was also discussed in a meeting of the Cabinet Committee on Security, which met on Wednesday to take stock of the situation in the state. The concern grew after a detailed report from the Research and Analysis Wing (RAW) was submitted to the PMO recently. The report, based largely on communication intercepts, stated that Mushtaq Ahmed Zargar, one of the terrorists released after the IC-814 hijack and now heading an outfit called Al Umar Mujahideen, has issued instructions to target Hindus in the Valley, government buildings and public property. Similarly, the agency has shared specific inputs about the Hizbul Mujahideen leadership issuing instructions to target Hindus in Kishtwar. The RAW has conveyed that the Sikh community too may be under threat from Hizbul cadres. It has also received information that Lashkar-e-Toiba has strengthened its presence outside the Valley in Rajouri and has apparently carried out reconnaissance operations to attack local Hindu religious sites. While law-enforcement authorities are corroborating this information on the ground, the Centre has made it clear that there should be no let-up in increasing security for minority groups. While the Centre has decided to come down hard on extremist elements in the Valley, there is also a view here that the government must act with equal resolve when it comes to Hindu extremist elements in Jammu so that there is little chance of a communal fallout in the state. Link - http://www.kashmirlive.com/story/Threat-to-Hindus-in-Valley--RAW/354210.html From vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 08:59:34 2008 From: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com (Vedavati Jogi) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 20:29:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism In-Reply-To: <504506.89365.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <525928.91159.qm@web57708.mail.re3.yahoo.com> no no he must be a hindu -a truley secular hindu. because a muslim or a christian will never say anything against his/her co-religionist.   this must be the reason  (1) why this hindusthan was invaded by foreigners again & again before 1947 (2) why this country was partitioned in 1947 and (3) even after creation of pakistan why this country is suffering so much at the hands of muslim terrorists vedavati --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Prabhakar Singh wrote: From: Prabhakar Singh Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism To: radhikarajen at vsnl.net, "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" Cc: "sarai list" Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 12:38 AM I don't think he is a Hindu at all.He should change his name too according to his adopted religion or faith as his name causes a lot of confusion when we read his baseless inflmmatory anti-Hindu writings day in and day out. Prabhakar  ----- Original Message ---- From: "radhikarajen at vsnl.net" To: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Cc: sarai list Sent: Wednesday, 27 August, 2008 7:35:27 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism True, SECULAR hindu like you are trying to terrorise all of us in society with pen which is mightier than GUN.  When in your SECULAR opinion the danish cartoon is not work of art, but hussains work is art, great logic indeed for secular thoughts. Then, in Orissa when evangelists use guns to shoot down a 90 year old man, it is not crusade but picnic of the evangelists.! ----- Original Message ----- From: Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् Date: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:27 pm Subject: [Reader-list] The Bajrang Bombers and Other Stories About HindutvaTerrorism To: sarai list > Dear friends, > > I think the time has come when the term "Hindutva terrorism" should > stop raising eyebrows. There has been yet another instance of Bajrang > Dalis trying to make bombs and the bombs went off. (See Mail Today > report by Piyush Srivastava pasted below). There has also been > political violence by Hindutva elements in Orissa, and and as we know > the violent agitation in Jammu is supported by the Hindutva cadres and > front organisations. I think the likes of Vedavati Jogi will no longer > be able to say on the list that "all terrorists are Muslims." > > Please see this cover story in Communalism Combat: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/cover1.html > > And more stories in that issue: > http://sabrang.com/cc/archive/2008/july-aug08/index.html > > > o o o > > > > BAJRANG DAL BOMBERS > > Sangh activists blow themselves up planning revenge attacks > > by Piyush Srivastava in Lucknow > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > IT'S OFFICIAL. The Sangh Parivar members have now joined in plotting > terrorist attacks. On Sunday afternoon, a bomb accidentally went off > in Kanpur killing a former Kanpur city convener of the Bajrang Dal and > his associate while they were assembling a bomb in a private hostel > room. > > The police suspect that the two were planning retaliatory attacks in > the aftermath of the bomb blasts in Ahmedabad and could be part of a > larger conspiracy. They were reportedly making six to seven bombs to > trigger off a serial blast in the Muslimdominated areas of Ahmedabad. > > The hostel room was badly damaged in the explosion. The police > stumbled on substantial quantity of bombmaking material from the spot. > They recovered three kg of lead oxide, 500 gm of red lead, one kg of > ammonium and potassium nitrate, 11 hand grenades, seven timers, over > two kg of bomb pins and pellets, seven batteries, 12 bulbs and about > 50 m of wires. Two of the timers found at the spot were attached to > batteries with wires. > > The dead men have been identified as 25- year-old Rajeev Mishra and > 31-year-old Bhupendra Singh Chopra. The explosion was so intense that > both the legs of Chopra and Mishra were blown off and they died within > minutes. Two other youths, who were in the adjoining room, sustained > serious injuries when the room's wall collapsed due to the explosion. > > Identifying the slain bombers as part of the Sangh Parivar, Kanpur > senior superintendent of police (SSP) Ashok Kumar Singh told MAIL > TODAY, "I am told Bhupendra Singh Chopra was a Bajrang Dal member. > Even earlier, Bajrang Dal activists were found to be indulging in > antisocial activities in Kanpur." A resident of Shastri Nagar in the > city, Chopra was the convener of the Bajrang Dal in Kanpur city > between 1998 and 2000. > > Prakash Sharma, the national convener of Bajrang Dal, is from Kanpur > and knew the duo pretty well. Talking to MAIL TODAY, Sharma said > Chopra and Mishra were members of his organisation. "I don't deny they > were active in the Bajrang Dal a few years ago. But, they were > inactive these days," he said. > > The injured have been identified as Vikas Singh, 21, of Fatehpur and > Bupendar, 20, of Chitrakoot. They are students of a Kanpur polytechnic > institute. The condition of the two was said to be serious. > > Sharma feigned ignorance of the activities Chopra and Mishra were > involved in. About the explosives Sharma claimed, "Such things can be > bought from the market any day during Dussehra and Diwali. Though both > Bhupendra and Rajeev used to meet me, I didn't know what they were > planning to do." > > Kanpur range inspector general of police S.N. Singh pointed towards > the possibility of serial blasts. "It was meant for a larger > conspiracy. Most probably these people had planned serial blasts. We > are investigating their links." > > Another officer said the police had information about more explosives > that had been dumped by the two Bajrang Dal members and hoped to > recover them soon. > > Mithilesh Kumar Pandey, the officer in charge of the bomb disposal > squad of Kanpur said he found enough material at the blast site for > assembling seven bombs of high intensity. They had used bulb filaments > in place of detonators to ignite the explosives. The hand grenades > recovered from the spot were improvised and could be opened from both > sides on which iron panels were fixed. The scene suggested that the > bombmakers were well trained in their job. > > The incident took place around 3 pm in the room of a private > hostel in > Rajiv Nagar colony of Shardanagar area in Kanpur city. The hostel is > run by Shiv Saran Mishra, Rajeev's father. A retired employee of > Kanpur Electric Supply Company (KESCO), he had reportedly severed his > links withhis son two years ago and was living in his ancestral > village of Nankari on the outskirts of the city. Shiv Saran had rented > out six hostel rooms to students of a polytechnic but Rajeev, an > executive with a private firm in Lucknow, had forcibly occupied > one of > the rooms two months ago, apparently against his father's wishes. > > Shiv Saran said Bhupendra and his son had attended a Bajrang Dal > training camp in Lucknow on June 13, 2001 in which they were taught > martial arts and the use of arms and ammunitions. > > Police officers said Bhupendra and Rajeev were upset after the > Ahmedabad serial blasts and would talk about their plans for visiting > Gujarat to take revenge. "Both the men had left their parents' homes. > Their relatives knew they were involved in serious criminal activities > since 2001," an officer said. > > SSP Singh said Rajeev, who was a bachelor, used to visit Kanpur every > Sunday and used to spend a few hours in the hostel room with his > friends. This Sunday, he arrived at around 2:30 pm. Bhupendra reached > there 15 minutes later. The explosion was heard around 3 pm. > > Vinay Katiyar, a Rajya Sabha member, national general secretary of the > BJP and founder of the Bajrang Dal, said, "I have no connection with > the organisation (Bajrang Dal) since 1996. They do not report to me > and I do not chalk out their programmes." > > piyush.srivastava at mailtoday.in > > o o o > > 'Cops & govt ignore Hindu terror in Nanded' > > By Krishna Kumar in Mumbai > Mail Today, 26 August 2008 > mailtoday.in > > SINCE 2006, at 1.30 am on April 6, Bajrang Dal cadre celebrate 'Shahid > Diwas' in Nanded by bursting crackers. They observe the > 'martyrdom' of > two colleagues, who died while making bombs meant to be planted > outside a mosque in Maharashtra. > > Besides the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI), Bajrang Dal > workers, too, have been involved in perpetrating terror, said Feroze > Khan Gazi, a functionary of the Movement of Justice and Peace in > Nanded. But, he adds, Bajrang Dal workers do not get charged with the > blasts and when they do, as in the Nanded case, they get bail. > > The Anti-Terrorist Squad in Maharashtra was puzzled when a > low-intensity bomb went off in a theatre screening Jodha Akbar in > Panvel on February 20 this year. On May 31, a blast took place at the > Vishnudas Bhave auditorium in Vashi and on June 4, a bomb exploded at > the Gadkari Rangayatan auditorium in Thane. Both auditoriums were > screening the controversial Marathi play Amhi Panchpute, which > allegedly mocked Hindu gods and goddesses. > > It was only after the arrest of two men from the Sanathan Sanstha (an > organisation which claims to be working for the uplift of Hindus) that > the police realised it was the work of people who wanted to 'market > their own brand of Hindu terror'. > > In the Nanded incident, cadres of the Bajrang Dal were planning a > blast outside an Aurangabad mosque when one of the bombs exploded, > killing two men (Naresh Lakshman Rajkondawar and Himanshu Venkatesh > Panse) and injuring four others. All six were Bajrang Dal workers who > had formed a hit-list of mosques to be targeted. > > Shankar Gaikar, state convener of Bajrang Dal, however, claims the men > were not part of his organisation. "The police can say anything but > they were not our members," he said even though RSS and Bajrang Dal > literature was seized from Rajkondwar's house, where the blast took > place. > > The police initially tried to dilly dally but had to arrest the > accused after intense pressure. "We hoped with the CBI probing the > case, we could get justice. But the accused are out on bail," said > Gazi. > > Maharashtra DGP A.N. Roy defended his men, saying "The chargesheet has > been filed. What more do you expect us to do?" > > Gazi said, "There was another blast in a go-down in Shastri Nagar near > Nanded. Two people died in the incident. The police initially told us > there was a short circuit but the go-down did not have any electricity > connection." > > Gazi accused the police of shielding the accused and said the state > and Centre let the accused go scot free. > > "They only want to portray Islamic terrorism. What about what is > happening in Nanded?" he asked. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader- > list > List archive: _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. 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To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 09:22:55 2008 From: vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com (Vedavati Jogi) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 20:52:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' - The Geelani interview In-Reply-To: <47e122a70808271036w2508d3e0t115b1e15ff3fe2af@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <720731.29063.qm@web57713.mail.re3.yahoo.com>  autonomy or accession to pakistan... its a common man who has been suffering and is going to suffer in kashmir. my husband who happens to be a kashmiri pandit, a refugee in his own motherland, has many muslim friends. some of them are still in shrinagar. recently one of them told us that 'if kashmir is given to pakistan we will have to migrate to india'   statement speaks volumes.   if indian govt. really wants to solve kashmir problem,   1) first they should cancel article 370 2) governor like jagmohan and police dept. headed by officer like k.p.s.gill should be given freehand. with the help of military first they should be asked to either hang  or kill militants in encounter 3) hurriyant conference members, national conference and pdp  leaders indulging in anti national activities should be thrown out of the state 4)seculars and liberals like arundhati roy, shabana azami  etc. should be asked to keep their mouths shut.   i am sure kashmir will again become a paradise on earth.      --- On Thu, 8/28/08, inder salim wrote: From: inder salim Subject: Re: [Reader-list] 'Why object to Islamic rule in Kashmir' - The Geelani interview To: reader-list at sarai.net Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 1:36 AM I beleive, on Kashmir this little lucid and accurate text piece by Shuddha is not for our dear friend Mr. Kshmendra only, but for all of us... to look into the present politics and pain there,.... finally some reasoining is emerging from the 'sagar manthan' churning of words on this list. i wish, those who quickly laspe into communal outbursts, see this kind of talking, not as 'craft' but something that comes straight out of heart. love is On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 3:10 AM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Kshmendra, > > Thank you for your posting on highlighting Syed Ali Shah Geelani's > opinions. There is nothing new in what Geelani has said, and his > position is quite well known, both within Kashmir, as well as amongst > those who have a long-standing interest in the matter. I am > responding to this question not because I have a personal axe to > grind pro or anti S.A.S Geelani, but because the question you raise > implicitly has important shades, and I would like not to let go of > their significance. I will turn to them briefly at the end of this > posting. > > Let me begin by saying that I agree with you on the completely > nonsensical nature of S.A.S Geelani's half baked views on the subject > of the future governance of Kashmir. There is, as you rightly point > out, no single accepted interpretation of what exactly constitutes > Islamic jurisprudence and statecraft , so it is clear that when he > talks of using that as a guide with which to govern (nizam) Kashmir > he is clearly intent on imposing his own narrow, secterian view, > which would be anathema even to the majority of Muslims in Kashmir. > > When anyone, let alone someone like S.A.S Geelani (who should know > better, because he claims to be a scholar of Islam) talks about > Islamic Socio-Economic conditions, or Islamic Culture (which one, > the one of Andalusia, Java, the Levant, Shi'a Iran, Bektashi > European, Turkish Ottoman, or Hejazi, or Peasant Bengali), or about > the Sunnah as a guide to governance and everyday living (on which > there is no consensus within Islam) he is clearly talking utter > nonsense (such guidance does not exist in any clear form and would > have to be invented) and it should be absolutely clear to everyone > that as a possible future ruler he would be the worst disaster to > have befallen the unhappy people of Kashmir. Just as every modern > Muslim Fundamentalist Ruler has been a disaster for every single > people whom they have had the misfortune to rule. > > I have to say that he reminds me a lot of a man venerated by many in > the 'pantheon' of the Indian struggle for Indendence. Subhash Chandra > Bose - charismatic, doctrinaire, reportedly honest, willing to sup > with fascists and nazis, authoritarian and fascinated by authority, > and with a vain, arrogant yet thuggish streak that would have made > him a disaster as a possible ruler of Independent India (and dare I > say,even more of a disaster for Kashmir), This part of the world was > spared much misfortune by that airplane that never quite made it over > the straits of Formosa after the second world war. (His brother, > Sarat Bose however, was in my opinion one of the most interesting and > creative political actors of his generation). So, India was spared > Subhash Bose by an air mishap, and S.A.S Geelani's advancing age may > also deliver him from Kashmir, and yet allow Kashmir to remember him > with some hazy residual fondness for his reported honesty, personal > civility and straightforwardness. > > Having said all this, I am surprised that you say that the opinions > expressed on the Reader List that are not in accordance with the > standard Indian state's position on Kashmir are 'muted' when it comes > to S.A.S Geelani. I think they occupy a fairly wide spectrum, some > are indifferent, some are muted, some are possibly in agreement, some > are in mild disagreement, some are in total disagreement (like mine). > This spectrum, to me, is a sign of the health of what you call the > 'pro-separatist' and what I would characterize the 'pro-withdrawal of > India from Kashmir' position(s) on the Reader List. Difference, even > robust difference, is always healthy. > > I think the 'pro continued Indian occupation of Kashmir' position on > this list, in comparison, is far more monotonous. It does not seem to > have much by way of internal debate or differentiation, or, if it > does, (with some exceptions, mainly reservations expressed > occasionally in a minor key by you) it does not appear, at least not > on this list. > > (This list - The Reader List - by the way is a list that is hosted on > the Sarai website, among other lists. It is not THE Sarai list, it is > not the SARAI list. And the opinions expressed on this list are not > the opinions of Sarai, even when they are expressed by people who > work at Sarai. Sarai does not have an opinion. It cannot, because it > is neither a person, nor a party, nor an interest group. And Sarai > hosts many different kinds of curiosities, as researchers, as fellows > as practitioners, not all of whom have the same opinion on Kashmir, > or any thing for that matter) > > Sorry for that clarificatory digression. But now back to your > question. Is the so called 'pro-'Azadi' ' camp in Kashmir, elsewhere, > or on this list, 'mute' about S.A.S Geelani? > > Let me begin addressing this question first of all by asking a > counter-question. Why is it necessary for us to be 'vocal' about > Geelani at all? As far as I am concerned, he is just another > politician, perhaps respected by some people in the valley because he > is seen (by some again, not all) as not having ever been on the > payroll of the Indian state. (Many others in the so called > 'separatist' leadership have at one time or another been seen as > (rightly or wrongly) or have been believed to be compromised by their > tacit acceptance of covert 'favours' by the Indian state. But to me, > this question of 'is Geelani corrupt or not ?' is actually > irrelevant. Sometimes the most dangerous politics is exercised by > those who adorn themselves with the charisma of incorruptability and > the glow of an inability to be flexible. So this alone is not a > criterion by which I judge what SAS Geelani represents in Kashmir. > > For me, the opinions of this octegenarian politician (and sometime > member of the Legislative Assembly of Jammu & Kashmir - which proves > that even S.A.S Geelani has been different things at different times) > is of less consequence than the logic of what impels the people of > Kashmir to reject the Indian state. Today, more than ever before in > Kashmir, the people are ahead of their leaders. The initiative is > really in their hands, and the Indian state is terribly confused > because there is little that it can achieve even by playing games of > intrigue within and between the factions of the Hurriyat Conference, > because frankly, neither the Hurriyet Leadership, nor the Militants, > nor the ISI, nor the mainstream political parties, are running the > show. The show is running, despite, not because of them. > > The logic of how the show runs, how the people of Kashmir enact their > refusal of the Indian state has to do with the stranglehold that the > Indian state has exercised over aspect of life in Kashmir, and its > absolute refusal to let people live in peace. Only today, we have > read a report in the Indian Express that speaks of the repressive > apparatus of the state attacking ambulances and ambulance crews. And > we have read earlier of police and CRPF using violence in the > casualty wards of hospitals, intimidating doctors and nurses as they > tend to the wounded. I have been in Kashmir, I have seen an Army unit > burn a village, I have seen the fear in a father's face as he spoke > to me, thinking that as an 'indian', i could have some influence in > helping get his teenage daughter back from the clutches of an army > patrol who were holding her hostage. If I were a villager who lived > in that village, why would you expect me to feel anything but hatred > and fear for the state that does these things. That is why, my > standing by the movement against the Indian occupation has more to do > with standing by these people rather than anything to do with the > ephemerality of a so called 'leadership'. Let us not forget, that > S.A.S Geelani's claim to 'leadership' is far from being uncontested. > He had to leave his own party, the Jamaat e Islam, because no one > took him seriously, and the 'Tehreek -e-Hurriyat' which has been his > refuge in recent days is a far more heterodox and complex formation > than he is actually comfortable with. S.A,S Geelani routinely listens > only to those who say yes to him, and the fact that the crowd that > did not take his 'claim to leadership' at the rally after which he > had to apologize is a pointer of the fact that in front of > constituencies other than his own, his authority is not that high, > even though there may be a grudging respect for his moral standing. > > At the same time, in the maelstorm that is Kashmir, there must be > several, brutalized, humiliated, scorned, who would think - "Why > should I not turn to a man who speaks a clear and forthright anger > against these violences. Why would I not take his idiom seriously. > Why, when I have nothing left to cling to, should I not reach out and > hold on to the surety of an iron clad faith that he holds out to me." > and that perhaps explains S.A.S Geelani's desparate constituency. His > appeal, however much of it exists, and it exists, not for a single > reason, or even in a simple way, (I know for instance, that people > weep for him and curse him at the same time). It is an index of how > far the people of Kashmir have been pushed to the wall. > > I understand this, and yet I think that this is a profound tragedy. > S.A.S Geelani, once a minor, unpopular politician in the Jamaat e > Islami, a sometime MLA for a party with two seats that were scrounged > and won in fraudulent elections, a party that no one really cared for > in Kashmir, is what he is today, thanks to the Indian state. > > Through the fifties, sixities, seventies, eighties it suffocated > every other form of opposition. It engineered the imprisonment of > every dissident voice, toppled governments at will, and capriciously > arranged for the rise and fall of this or that figure and then > arranged for the execution of Maqbool Butt, the exile of Amanullah > Khan, the targetted assasinations of figures like Dr. Guru, Hriday > Nath Wanchoo, the elder Mirwaiz, Abdul Ghani Lone and many others > who were of much greater stature than S.A.S Geelani in the eyes of > the people of Kashmir and who could have, at times like this, > provided some of the ethical and intellectual anchors, even some of > the personal succor that the movement needs today. > > Who was left? Who was transformed from a virtual non-entity to the > man in shining incorruptible armour - S.A.S Geelani. He suited the > Indian state best. He could be demonized, he could be portrayed as a > bigot, which he is. He held out for a corrupt military dictatorship > in Pakistan. His malignant ideas about what kind of Kashmir he wants > can be ridiculed, and so, by extension, the movement as a whole could > be tarred by having him identified as the leader, as the qaid. > > Something similar happenned in Iran. The Shah of Iran completely > destroyed every form of opposition, other than the clerics of Qom. A > surprised Khomeini, who could at least go into exile in Iraq and > France, while the non-Islamist or moderate Muslim opposition found > itself shot with bullets in the back of the neck, found the moral > leadership of the Iranian revolution gifted to him by the fleeing > Shah of Iran. The Indian state, by using money, guns and intrigue, > has left Geelani (the apparently incorruptible, honest and > straightforward, but reactionary, proto-fascist Geelani) holding > himself out as the pretender to the throne of the leadership of the > movement for Azadi in Kashmir. It is not the people of Kashmir as > much as Iovernment of India that has crowned Geelani by demonizing > him. The people of Kashmir, in their bitteness, have sometimes looked > up to the man that the Government of India loathes most of all. This > may not be as accurate an index of their esteem for that man as it is > a mark of their hatred for that government. It is for the same reason > that Bose became wildly popular (even in areas where he had no base) > in the bitter forties of the last century in India, when the British > Raj was on its last and in some ways most desperate legs in India. > > Ask the successive home ministers, prime ministers and intelligence > officers of India why they brought Kashmir to this state that Geelani > can appear sometimes as if he could be a saviour to the same people > that he also infuriates with his obstinacy, his retrograde statements > and reactionary outlook on life. > > As for what I think of him and what he represents. And I can speak > only for myself here. I have always been clear. > > At the risk of repetition, let me quote from two postings - > > ------------------------------------ > > Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 > Date: 16 August 2008 5:11:19 PM GMT+05:30 > > I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the > transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, > and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a > demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to > abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever > reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as > foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu > Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' > that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. > > I agree, the question of demographic change with regard to the > transfer of the Amarnath land is a red herring, and a bare faced lie, > and smacks of xenophobia. 100 acres do not, and cannot lead to a > demographic change. And everyone must counsel people in Kashmir to > abandon this train of thought. When Kashmiri leaders, for whatever > reason, talk about 'demographic' threats, they sound exactly as > foolish and xenophobic as the chauvinist Indian, especialy Hindu > Right politicians do when they fulminate against 'demographic change' > that will occur because of Bangladeshi immigration. > > [I posted this because it was Geelani who raised the ridiculous bogey > of the 'demographic shift' in Kashmir, even as he (correctly, in my > view) pointed out that the anger about the alienation of land in > Kashmir has to do with the arbitrary occupation of acres and acres > of land by the Armed Forces of India.] > > > Re: [Reader-list] Gun Salutes for August 15 > Date: 21 August 2008 3:45:48 AM GMT+05:30 > > I disagree with anyone who calls for 'Nizam-E-Mustafa' because I > disagree with the idea or imagination of any 'Nizam' or regime that > finds it necessary to protect itself from question by adorning the > mantle of unquestionable sanctity. The word 'Mustafa' means 'Chosen' > in Arabic. And the idea of a 'NIzam-E-Mustafa' meaning, the 'state of > the chosen' has an uncanny resemblance to the idea of the return of > the 'chosen people' to their state, which is the foundational myth, > if you like of Zionism. I know that Syed Ali Shah Geelani would > probably be horrified to think that his vision of 'Azaadi' has a > striking parallel of the founding myth of the State of Israel.(and it > is actually the founding myth of all hitherto oppressed people who > are led to believe that once they achieve a statehood congruent with > their idea of who they are, all will be well - this is the general > condition of all secular, radical, liberal or conservative notions of > nationalism, of which, Zionism and the idea of the 'Nizam e Mustafa' > are perhaps the clearest exemplars.) > > The perception of a 'State' as the 'Manifest Destiny' of a people > chosen by God or History, or both, contains within it the seed of a > terrible tragedy, of yesterday's victims transforming themselves into > tomorrows tormentors. Of the Pakistani army conducting mass murder in > what was once East Pakistan, and thus destroying once and for all, > the delusion of a brotherhood forged on the basis of Islam alone. No > one could imagine that those who laid the foundations of the Jewish > state of Israel in the wake of the holocaust would be laying the > foundations of a detention facility for Palestinians. No one could > imagine that those who led the oppressed people of India into her > 'tryst with destiny' in 1947, so radiant in the first flush of what > they called freedom, would turn Kashmir or the North East or much of > Central India into death camps. We, especially those of us who stand > by Kashmiris today, against Indian and Pakistani occupation, must > imagine the possibility that an 'Azaad' Kashmir, whether it is > independent, or a part of Pakistan, may also be a similar bitter > harvest. Nothing can be more lethal than the assumption that victims > are innocent per se. We must recognize clearly, especially if we > invest in the idea of 'Azaadi' that those who speak of freedom in > Kashmir today, may turn out to be oppressors tomorrow. It is because > of this, that I disagree with any attempt to cloak the idea of the > state (even, and especially if it claims to speak for and on behalf > of the oppressed) with any sanctity. As long as the state as a form > of organising and administering human society remains, we must be > vigilant, I believe, to ensure that those who lead the state are not > able to adorn themselves with the concealing cloak of sanctity of any > kind. The sanctity and glamour of the yesterday's state of being > oppressed is a weapon in the arsenal of tomorrow's oppressor. This > applies, without any qualification to the present and future destiny > of Kashmir, and the people of Kashmir must be vigilant against all > those who act in the name of the sacred, and most of all, in their > name, in the name of the people of Kashmir. > > --------------------------- > > Let me now come to whether the fact that S A S Geelani makes > himself out to be a man of religion, or whether the fact that the > Mirwaiz speaks from a pulpit and is a religious figure of some > consequence in Kashmir should make any different to our assessment of > these individuals. Personally, no. I am not religious myself, but I > do believe that several of the most creative political thinkers and > activists of our times have been motivated by their religious > convictions, and have spoken politically in a religious idiom. These > include the Liberation Theologian and Nicaraguan Revolutionary > Ernesto Cardenal, Tenzing Gyaltso - the fourteenth Dalai Lama, > Martin Luther King Jr., Swami Sahajanand Saraswati (A Dandin Sannyasi > and Bihar Peasant leader and sometime member of the Communist Party) > and Rahul Sankrityayan (Ordained Buddhist monk and maverick > Communist), For me, a staunch non-believer, the secular-religious > divide is not as important as the humanist-non-humanist divide. For > me, as i have stated above, the key test is, does the person > concerned hold out his views and ideology as sacred and beyond > question, if he does, regardless of whether he or she is devout or an > atheist, they are bad news. > > Finally, a cause may be just, even if it is saddled by an > incompetent, or disagreeable protagonist. Similarly, a cause may be > unjust, even though it may be represented by agreeable and > intelligent people. I believe that the cause of Azadi for Kashmir is > just, even though I find some of its protagonists incompetent and > disagreeable (I feel that S.A.S Geelani may be honest, but as a > political protagonist he is both incompetent and disagreeable) . I > believe that the cause of having India hold on to Kashmir is unjust > even as I may find some of its proponents agreeable at a personal > level. I am sure you understand what I mean. > > regards > > Shuddha > > > On 26-Aug-08, at 6:06 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > >> If, any deserving to be taken seriously voice were to say that >> 'India should be declared as a Hindu country', there would be many >> a million voices (including mine) that would stridently condemn >> such a statement, that would be gravitated to campaign for and >> garner widespread public opinion against such a statement. >> >> We would find some of the most brilliantly argued, impressively >> articulate, eloquent and even 'wordy' dismissals of such a >> statement in SARAI itself. >> >> On SARAI we have quite a few brilliantly argumentatitive, >> impressively articulate, eloquent and often wordy opinions >> expressed in favour of the 'separatists' of Kashmir. Surprisingly, >> they are rather muted in their comments about Geelani's position. >> Demure almost in their referring to him in-passing and generally >> conveying the impression that the Geelani (and his support base) >> position is not of any real significance and of not much >> consequence in the "separatist movement". That tells me (at least), >> how much these people are in touch with the 'realities' of Kashmir >> or the "separatist movement". >> >> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- http://indersalim.livejournal.com _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From monica at sarai.net Thu Aug 28 15:35:06 2008 From: monica at sarai.net (Monica Narula) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 15:35:06 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A little book Message-ID: that might help the present 'debates' on the list. http://www.listenlittleman.com/ best M Monica Narula Raqs Sarai-CSDS 29 Rajpur Road Delhi 110 054 www.raqsmediacollective.net www.sarai.net From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 16:23:10 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 03:53:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <349225.94172.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Very rightly said ! Hinduism is not a religion.It is a way of life.If Hinduism is a book all religions on earth are its chapters.It is a great sin to abuse it without properly understanding it. We should first take trouble to understand its philosophy as little surface knowledge may prove to be dangerous.  Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: chanchal malviya To: A Khanna ; Prabhakar Singh Cc: inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, 27 August, 2008 9:33:07 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Dear Khanna, 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the positive side of their own identity. There are people who would love to rape their own mother and motherland. And there are some people who even protect their intention as personal attitude. Great. Not to say anything to them. 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else explains in itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person also feel the same for their own mother and sister. And I have written earlier that such person would not come to protect their mother also, what to say about the broader concept of motherland. 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through the text only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of people. Because India is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu country. Of course, people like you are a part of it. Hinduism is a mere subject of attack in India. What I told about Hinduism is exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word came into existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of Sanatan Dharma. I know you will not be able to understand the difference between Dharma and Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma means Righteous duty and Religion is what you all are talking about. Hinduism is science and teaches righteous duty in scientific manner. World outside India is recognizing this, but our Indians will understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say and that also when he is ruling us. Sorry. Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step towards Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath nude didn't cover their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed them, because they knew that he is a child in his nature on this matter. But they immediately took cover when Veda Vyas crossed. There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for sex. And the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful natural factor. And winning over it is the biggest win in life. If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found Hindu society also marrying multitude of women. Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not understand and ask me stupid questions. Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as per their capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right hand posses (Hindu women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex and love are the same thing. M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland only with his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his Islamic attitude. He has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic attitude, though film stars have a different life style and we may not be protective of them in this matter. It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his mother. Or if you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large heart, please send a photograph of your mother to him and ask him to paint her nude. Let me see, how many of you are not of double standard. Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your own motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. ----- Original Message ---- From: A Khanna To: Prabhakar Singh Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather  rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's  exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of  you will find it interesting. First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous  offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the  aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms  'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a  contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What  makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in  hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought  out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the  erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away  from the lives of 'Hindus'?? Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices,  festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like,  in different parts of the country and in different communities in the  same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in  the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts  to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often  textual,  normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision  of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts  (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical  serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as  containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the  embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a “faith  (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly  sex)” is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various  realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves  'Hindu'. In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I  encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals,  identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are  central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of  these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and  experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being  'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an  achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or  does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of  colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the  self?)  So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of  'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me  like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to  come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through  the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories  of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of  Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me  clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in  reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist  claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around  nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the  human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust  with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety  around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of  the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems  to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and  eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just  sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this  anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of  'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is  that to him “Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same” – therefore,  actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably  sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as  Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward,  inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the  performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not  talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for  one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or  Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous  image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two  things that i find fascinating here. First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor  admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many  things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a  postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and  complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense  gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and  collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman.  And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately  taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly  fascinating. But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a  brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images  of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share  it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to  actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out  an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not  having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it  has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power  that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once  we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly  investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space.  And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of  prabhakar and chanchal? So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that  has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive?  What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the  nail on the head. “If some artist in the name of art paints your  mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public  how would you feel and how would you react?”, s/he asks. A similar  point is made by chanchal when s/he says “I am sure, a person who  paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic)  to his mother and sister”. This leads me to understand that the  anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may  be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the  possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her.  Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother  may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her  own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that  evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of)  what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this  fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the  Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself  up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an  Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist  discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as  after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the  mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation  over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and  exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or  transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a  case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over  again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of  sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a  belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The  point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of  women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of  sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the  sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of  patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of  Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i  sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion  of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried  when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced  the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state  into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails  me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest  this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear  on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful,  sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs,  flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he  also makes steel. Love, akshay -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 16:38:17 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:08:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Dear Faraz Message-ID: <849394.19250.qm@web57215.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Ahmed Faraz died on 26th August 2008.   Though not amongst my most favourite of Urdu poets, Faraz without doubt was a brilliant poet. Before his death, many rated him as the greatest living Urdu poet.   "Dear Faraz" is from Kishwer Naheed who herself is highly thought of Urdu poetess.   Kshmendra     Dear Faraz   Tuesday, 26 Aug, 2008   Kishwar Naheed   KARACHI: Way back in 1964, we met in Peshawar in the office of Yousuf Lodhi (the great political cartoonist Vaiell). That night we talked about politics, literature and made small jokes about contemporary writers. That was the start of our friendship; you and my husband Yousuf Kamran became even more friendly as both of you were very glamorous. I know the way girls used to write letters, as the phone was not a common communicating system back then. Yousuf was presenting popular TV programmes like Sukhanwar and Dastan Go, and you were being introduced on TV as the Hero Poet. Once, in your presence, a famous lady singer sang your ghazal Yeh Alam Shouq ka Dekha na Jai. Viewers still remember you looking shy like an adolescent boy while the singer, her fingers studded with gold rings, was feeling proud of her achievement. Yes, it was a small spark which was put to ashes by her mother. Faraz, you had been my colleague in national centres. I was posted in Lahore and you in Peshawar. Earlier you had been teaching in Peshawar’s Islamia College where your colleague was the poet Mohsin Ehsan. You both remained very close. Memories of you as green as ever live with me, not only with me but also with my children, with whom you used to play in the mornings in my courtyard in Krishan Nagar, Lahore. You opted to get yourself transferred to Islamabad in 1974. Again some love spark; very intense and very absorbing but you were always a vagabond, not staying at one place with the same face. Despite being a majnoon, you were conscious that a writer has to be a person with status. On the one hand your popularity grew after the publication of Dard Ashob, your second collection of poetry, while on the other you decided to build your own house. One after the other, luck was providing you the facility of being a rich poet (no other poet had been lucky like you — as you yourself often claimed). You were paid the highest royalty for over 30 years. You were the best seller in poetry and had been a most charming person at the age when people stay at home and resolve to play with grandchildren. You never liked to be called ‘uncle’; you remain ‘Faraz Sahib’ for everyone. You roamed around the world, reciting your poetry and letting the people in the audience repeat the lines. An aged man enjoys your poetry in the same manner as a teenage girl or boy. Once, on the occasion of International Women’s Day, you and I were the chief guests at an event. When you started reciting your poetry, the fiery Tahira Abdullah objected: ‘we want poetry on women’. You replied: ‘all my poetry is about women’. You had such a remarkable sense of humour that even the eminent humourist Mushtaq Yousafi was convinced of your fiqra bazi. I can never forget 1977 for two reasons. One was that you recited the poem Peshawar Qatilo at a function in Islamabad. Around two o’clock in the morning, a few people in white clothes (I don’t know why they always come in white clothes) entered the house and threw you in an army jeep and drove off. After a few days we consulted with the lawyer Abid Hasan Minto and filed an appeal in the Lahore High Court, stating that Faraz has been missing for the last 15 days. Justice Zullah was in the chair; he ordered the army to produce Faraz after two days and asked me and Saif Sahib to bring with us the maximum number of writers on that particular day. Nobody will believe, Faraz, that right from Qasmi Sahib, all the writers were in high court on the appointed day. When I finally saw you, escorted by soldiers, I screamed. You were so thin and your complexion pale. The judge (at that time judges could speak like that) asked you why you were locked up, and if you had seen an arrest warrant. When you said no, the judge, in a very angry voice, announced that Faraz may be freed immediately. The decision was presented before the army chief General Ziaul Haq. It was June 27, 1977. Do you remember, Faraz? The general had spoken to you, to convince you how important it was to support Bhutto Sahib? He was the same general who placed Pakistan under martial law on July 5, 1977. Faraz, you told us that during your stay in Attock Fort you were kept in a dark and dingy basement, where the food was given to you in a thali by a hand whose face you could not see. During that crisis I talked to Begum Bhutto, as we came to know that your arrest had been with the approval of Bhutto Sahib. She promised to talk to him, but the next day, when I rang her again, she too was angry. She told us that Bhutto had said that all of us were his supporters, so why had Faraz placed him in such a difficult situation. Then all of us writers were perplexed: how would we make Bhutto agree to release you? Masood Ashaar and I went to see Madam Noor Jehan, as she was your admirer and also we knew that she was a close friend of the ‘Black Queen’ (whose relation with Bhutto was known to everyone). After a lot of discussion, Madam went to Karachi and convinced Black Queen to request Bhutto to order your release. The story of Ziaul Haq started thereafter. Once you wrote a naat, wherein you complained to the Holy Prophet (peace be upon him) about what is going on in the country. There were fundamentalists like Kausar Niazi in the Assembly where the issue of terminating your services was raised. Do you remember how Pir Ali Mohammed Rashdi came to your rescue by presenting quotations from Hafiz and Rumi. In 1978, you recited your famous poem Muhasra in Karachi. In the middle of the night you were made to get up, leave Karachi and Sindh immediately and were brought to Islamabad. Thereafter you felt so dejected that you left the country and stayed with your brother in London for six years. Eventually you returned from England and Fehmida Riaz came back from India. We celebrated your home coming by organising a function in Lahore. We were together again, but the distribution of jobs created new dimensions in relationships. You were appointed the chairman of the Academy of Letters and Fehmida was made managing director of the National Book Foundation.   Faraz, you remember you were earlier made the chairman of the same academy by its founder Zulfikar Ali Bhutto? The urge for employment remained in you till Pervez Musharraf got angry because you spoke against the army. You and your luggage were thrown out of the official residence. Despite protest by the press and writers, nothing happened. Remember when we went together in the processions for the restoration of judges this past year? Many junior but non-committed writers, following your instructions, joined the processions. You had the tendency to create controversies about either yourself, or about different issues. You once spoke against marriage and said it was also a sort of prostitution through a contract on paper. O God! How many newspapers and fundamentalists spoke against you. Another controversy you aroused concerned the Urdu language. You said that Urdu was a dying language, which caused the MQM and many writers to become angry with you. You spoke against the army and then changed your wording, saying you were against the ruling junta, not the sipahi. You are a very popular figure internationally. You hardly refuse an invitation for mushaira, but only agree to participate on your own terms. Faraz, you made writers conscious about getting royalty from publishers and even made the police catch illegal publishers. You are very fond of litigation; you used to get free legal advice and through it you lodged cases against many editors who ever published a smallest remark against you. You were like Faiz Sahib: liked by the bureaucrats who always desired your company. But you were annoyed by how they behaved during daytime. Despite being the chief guest, you used to make sarcastic remarks while the poor host had no choice but to be quiet. Faraz, you have been the darling of all the singers, so much so that ghazals by others but accredited to you were gaining popularity. In all the colleges, girls who had never read poetry were reciting couplets composed by you and each one of them wanted your autograph. You are very conscious of your age, you never like any girl calling you uncle, but you never objected when my sons did so. And I have been a darling aunty to your three sons. I have not seen any son as fond of his father as your sons are of you. Who is not fond of you and who will not remember you every evening with a glass in hand? Cheers my friend, you have played your inning with grace and glamour. You are our darling. http://www.dawn.net/wps/wcm/connect/Dawn%20Content%20Library/dawn/news/entertainment/dear+faraz       From jeebesh at sarai.net Thu Aug 28 16:47:26 2008 From: jeebesh at sarai.net (Jeebesh) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 16:47:26 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <349225.94172.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <349225.94172.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <31FBA412-6411-4F40-B931-B515E3B85D2E@sarai.net> dear Prabhakar, It is absolutely true that Hinduism is not understood. It is not at all a religion. Religion is a new concept, developed a few hundred years to confuse people. It was always a way of life and remains so. Totally agree with you. That is why is very important for people like you or chanchal to give some new ways of thinking ahead. Like in case of global warming, how will this old civilisational way of life give a fresh insight.? These are global questions of urgency and if properly given thought can upturn the way world thinks. Please give it some thought. warmly jeebesh On 28-Aug-08, at 4:23 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > Very rightly said ! Hinduism is not a religion.It is a way of > life.If Hinduism is a book all religions on earth are its > chapters.It is a great sin to abuse it without properly > understanding it. We should first take trouble to understand its > philosophy as little surface knowledge may prove to be dangerous. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: chanchal malviya > To: A Khanna ; Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, 27 August, 2008 9:33:07 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > Dear Khanna, > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the > positive side of their own identity. There are people who would love > to rape their own mother and motherland. And there are some people > who even protect their intention as personal attitude. Great. Not to > say anything to them. > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else > explains in itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person > also feel the same for their own mother and sister. And I have > written earlier that such person would not come to protect their > mother also, what to say about the broader concept of motherland. > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through > the text only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of > people. Because India is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu > country. Of course, people like you are a part of it. Hinduism is a > mere subject of attack in India. What I told about Hinduism is > exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word came into > existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > Sanatan Dharma. > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between > Dharma and Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma > means Righteous duty and Religion is what you all are talking about. > Hinduism is science and teaches righteous duty in scientific manner. > World outside India is recognizing this, but our Indians will > understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say and that also > when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > towards Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath > nude didn't cover their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed > them, because they knew that he is a child in his nature on this > matter. But they immediately took cover when Veda Vyas crossed. > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for > sex. And the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful > natural factor. And winning over it is the biggest win in life. > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found > Hindu society also marrying multitude of women. > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > understand and ask me stupid questions. > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as > per their capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right > hand posses (Hindu women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex > and love are the same thing. > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland > only with his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his > Islamic attitude. He has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic > attitude, though film stars have a different life style and we may > not be protective of them in this matter. > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his > mother. Or if you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large > heart, please send a photograph of your mother to him and ask him to > paint her nude. Let me see, how many of you are not of double > standard. > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your > own motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: A Khanna > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim >; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > you will find it interesting. > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a “faith > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > sex)” is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > 'Hindu'. > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is > that to him “Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same” – therefore, > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > things that i find fascinating here. > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > fascinating. > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > prabhakar and chanchal? > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > nail on the head. “If some artist in the name of art paints your > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > how would you feel and how would you react?”, s/he asks. A similar > point is made by chanchal when s/he says “I am sure, a person who > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > to his mother and sister”. This leads me to understand that the > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > also makes steel. > > > Love, > > akshay > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From shuddha at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 12:18:58 2008 From: shuddha at gmail.com (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 12:18:58 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Pankaj Mishra on Kashmir in the New York Times Message-ID: <910B4A1F-4355-4661-B1B3-78E57E30F00D@gmail.com> A Jihad Grows in Kashmir by Pankaj Mishra, The New York Times, 27th August, 2008 http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/27/opinion/27mishra.html?_r=1&oref=slogin FOR more than a week now, hundreds of thousands of Muslims have filled the streets of Srinagar, the capital of Indian-ruled Kashmir, shouting "azadi" (freedom) and raising the green flag of Islam. These demonstrations, the largest in nearly two decades, remind many of us why in 2000 President Bill Clinton described Kashmir, the Himalayan region claimed by both India and Pakistan, as "the most dangerous place on earth." Mr. Clinton sounded a bit hyperbolic back then. Dangerous, you wanted to ask, to whom? Though more than a decade old, the anti-Indian insurgency in Kashmir, which Pakistan's rogue intelligence agency had infiltrated with jihadi terrorists, was not much known outside South Asia. But then the Clinton administration had found itself compelled to intervene in 1999 when India and Pakistan fought a limited but brutal war near the so-called line of control that divides Indian Kashmir from the Pakistani-held portion of the formerly independent state. Pakistan's withdrawal of its soldiers from high peaks in Indian Kashmir set off the series of destabilizing events that culminated in Pervez Musharraf assuming power in a military coup. After 9/11, Mr. Musharraf quickly became the Bush administration's ally. Seen through the fog of the "war on terror" and the Indian government's own cynical propaganda, the problem in Kashmir seemed entirely to do with jihadist terrorists. President Musharraf could even claim credit for fighting extremism by reducing his intelligence service's commitment to jihad in Kashmir — indeed, he did help bring down the level of violence, which has claimed an estimated 80,000 lives. Since then Pakistan has developed its own troubles with Muslim extremists. Conventional wisdom now has Pakistan down as the most dangerous place on earth. Meanwhile, India is usually tagged as a "rising superpower" or "capitalist success story" — clichés so pervasive that they persuaded even so shrewd an observer as Fareed Zakaria to claim in his new book "The Post-American World" that India since 1997 has been "stable, peaceful and prosperous." It is true that India's relations with Pakistan have improved lately. But more than half a million Indian soldiers still pursue a few thousand insurgents in Kashmir. While periodically holding bilateral talks with Pakistan, India has taken for granted those most affected by the so-called Kashmir dispute: the four million Kashmiri Muslims who suffer every day the misery and degradation of a full-fledged military occupation. The Indian government's insistence that peace is spreading in Kashmir is at odds with a report by Human Rights Watch in 2006 that described a steady pattern of arbitrary arrest, torture and extrajudicial execution by Indian security forces — excesses that make the events at Abu Ghraib seem like a case of high spirits. A survey by Doctors Without Borders in 2005 found that Muslim women in Kashmir, prey to the Indian troops and paramilitaries, suffered some of the most pervasive sexual violence in the world. Over the last two decades, most ordinary Kashmiri Muslims have wavered between active insurrection and sullen rage. They fear, justifiably or not, the possibility of Israeli-style settlements by Hindus; reports two months ago of a government move to grant 92 acres of Kashmiri land to a Hindu religious group are what provoked the younger generation into the public defiance expressed of late. As always, the turmoil in Kashmir heartens extremists in both India and Pakistan. India has recently suffered a series of terrorist bombings, allegedly by radicals among its Muslim minority. Hindu nationalists have already formed an economic blockade of the Kashmir Valley — an attempt to punish seditious Muslims and to gin up votes in next year's general elections. In Pakistan, where weak civilian governments in the past sought to score populist points by stirring up the emotional issue of Kashmir, the intelligence service can only be gratified by another opportunity to synergize its jihads in Kashmir and Afghanistan. What of the Kashmiris themselves, who have repeatedly found themselves reduced to pawns in the geopolitical games and domestic politics of their neighbors? In 1989 and '90, when few Kashmiris had heard of Osama bin Laden, hundreds of thousands of Muslims buoyed by popular revolutions in Eastern Europe regularly petitioned the United Nations office in Srinagar, hoping to raise the world's sympathy for their cause. Indian troops responded by firing into many of these largely peaceful demonstrations, killing hundreds of people and provoking many young Kashmiris to take to arms and embrace radical Islam. A new generation of politicized Kashmiris has now risen; the world is again likely to ignore them — until some of them turn into terrorists with Qaeda links. It is up to the Indian government to reckon honestly with Kashmiri aspirations for a life without constant fear and humiliation. Some first steps are obvious: to severely cut the numbers of troops in Kashmir; to lift the economic blockade on the Kashmir Valley; and to allow Kashmiris to trade freely across the line of control with Pakistan. India's record of pitiless intransigence does not inspire much hope that it will take these necessary steps toward the final and comprehensive resolution of Kashmir's long-disputed status. In fact, an indefinite curfew has already been imposed and Indian troops have again killed dozens of demonstrators. But a brutal suppression of the nonviolent protests will continue to radicalize a new generation of Muslims and engender a fresh cycle of violence, rendering Kashmir even more dangerous — and not just to South Asia this time. Pankaj Mishra is the author, most recently, of "Temptations of the West: How to Be Modern in India, Pakistan, Tibet and Beyond." Shuddhabrata Sengupta shuddha at gmail.com From pratilipi.in at gmail.com Thu Aug 28 16:44:38 2008 From: pratilipi.in at gmail.com (Pratilipi) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 16:44:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Danza Poesia - The first "Pratilipi Event". Message-ID: <435290ba0808280414p2b35dfd3n40e0eddebecd464@mail.gmail.com> Udaharan presents, in collaboration with Instituto Cervantes, New Delhi, the first Pratilipi Event. *Danza Poesia* A recital of poems by Oscar Pujol and Sameer Rawal, in translation and the original (Spanish, Catalan, English, Hindi) and a rendering of Sanskrit verses, in Catalan translation, along with Bharatnatyam mudras by Merce Escrich. *Oscar Pujol* is an Indologist from Catalunya, Spain. He has published a Sanskrit-Catalan Shabdkosh having around 60,000 entries, besides having published various academic books and articles. After working as Director, Education Programmes of Casa Asia (Asia House) in Barcelona since its inception he now is setting up the Instituto Cervantes in New Delhi, as its Director, to promote Spanish culture and languages in India. He has a doctorate from BHU, Varanasi in Sanskrit. *Merce Escrich* is the Director of Kalavana, Barcelona, dedicated to promote Indian art and Culture in Spain. She is a disciple of Jamuna Krishnan, and performs and teaches Bharatnatyam. She is involved in many projects concerning Indian classical dance and art, and has contributed many times in various forms to their study and promotion. *Sameer Rawal* lives in Barcelona, Spain, and teaches Hindi and translation strategies for intercultural communication. He writes and translates narratives and poetry between/in Hindi, English, Spanish and Catalan. He was the first to translate a Catalan novel (*La Plaça del diamant*) into Hindi and is now translating an anthology of stories by Merce Rodoreda. He has also published *Caialx de sandal*, a Hindi/Catalan book of poetry. *Venue:* Krishnayan, Jawahar Kala Kendra, Jaipur. *Date and Time:* September 4, 2008. 5:00 PM. *Contact:* +91-98281-12994 *Email:* pratilipi.in at gmail.com *Hospitality* Devi Niketan *Sponsors* Vagdevi Prakashan, Surya Prakashan Mandir, Jhamad Finance and Ashok Bajaj. -- प्रतिलिपि: द्विमासिक द्विभाषी पत्रिका Pratilipi: A Bilingual Bimonthly Magazine http://pratilipi.in From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 17:25:31 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:55:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] A Poem by Faraz Message-ID: <590884.17218.qm@web57211.mail.re3.yahoo.com> In one of his Ghazals, Faraz writes:   Jisko bhi chaa'ha, ussay shiddat se chaa'ha hai Faraz sil'silaa too'taa nahi dard ki zanjeer ka   My impoverished translation:   That what I desired, I desired with ferocity Unbroken links of pain, I ever enchained   Pakistan has struggled since it Independence to come out of the clutches of Military Dictatorship, that allowed it only every now and then to flirt with Democracy. In this period Pakistan has an impressive literary history, especially from amongst the poets in both their writings and  public demeanour, wherein they have not only been critical and questioning of 'dictatorship' but also revolted. Faraz is one such Poet.   A poem (a lamentation) below by Faraz which though written for Pakistan would be equally applicable to India. My apologies to those for whom Urdu is alien. It is beyond my capability to translate it   Kshmendra   ab kis kaa jashn manaate ho us des kaa jo taqsiim huaa ab kis ke giit sunaate ho us tan-man kaa jo do-niim huaa     us Khvaab kaa jo rezaa rezaa un aa.Nkho.n kii taqadiir huaa us naam kaa jo Tuka.Daa Tuka.Daa galiyo.n me.n be-tauqiir huaa   us parcham kaa jis kii hurmat baazaaro.n me.n niilaam hu_ii us miTTii kaa jis kii hurmat mansuub uduu ke naam hu_ii us jang ko jo tum haar chuke us rasm kaa jo jaarii bhii nahii.n us zaKhm kaa jo siine pe na thaa us jaan kaa jo vaarii bhii nahii.n us Khuun kaa jo bad_qismat thaa raaho.n me.n bahaayaa tan me.n rahaa us phuul kaa jo beqiimat thaa aa.Ngan me.n khilaa yaa ban me.n rahaa us mashriq kaa jis ko tum ne neze kii anii marham samajhaa us maGarib kaa jis ko tum ne jitana bhii luuTaa kam samajhaa un maasuumo.n kaa jin ke lahuu se tum ne farozaa.N raate.n kii.n yaa un mazaluumo.n kaa jis se Khanjar kii zubaa.N me.n baate.n kii.n us mariyam kaa jis kii iffat luTatii hai bhare baazaaro.n me.n us iisaa kaa jo qaatil hai aur shaamil hai Gam_Khvaaro.n me.n in nauhaagaro.n kaa jin ne hame.n Khud qatl kiyaa Khud rote hai.n aise bhii kahii.n dam_saaz hue aise jallaad bhii hote hai.n  un bhuuke nange Dhaa.Ncho.n kaa jo raqs sar-e-baazaar kare.n yaa un zaalim qazzaaqo.n kaa jo bhes badal kar vaar kare.n yaa un JhuuTe iqaraaro.n kaa jo aaj talak aifaa na hue yaa un bebas laachaaro.n kaa jo aur bhii dukh kaa nishaanaa hue is shaahii kaa jo dast-ba-dast aa_ii hai tumhaare hisse me.n kyo.n nang-e-vatan kii baat karo kyaa rakhaa hai is qisse me.n aa.Nkho.n me.n chhupaaye ashko.n ko ho.nTho.n me.n vafaa ke bol liye is jashn me.n bhii shaamil huu.N nauho.n se bharaa kashkol liye Reproduced from the most brilliant web-resource for Romanized Urdu Poetry - Urdupoetry.com  http://www.urdupoetry.com/faraz42.html       From raviv at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 14:38:03 2008 From: raviv at sarai.net (raviv at sarai.net) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 14:38:03 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] [Fwd: Please circulate] Message-ID: <48B51973.1000703@sarai.net> -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From logos.theword at gmail.com Wed Aug 27 22:05:01 2008 From: logos.theword at gmail.com (Logos Theatre) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 22:05:01 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] WHA - t(?)e- VER(?) - Un-f(o)unded, Un-established, Un-compromised In-Reply-To: <33bc2ee60808270934sd73ceb4g2284916dbe872714@mail.gmail.com> References: <33bc2ee60808270934sd73ceb4g2284916dbe872714@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <33bc2ee60808270935q529310c0xb406c40c21738ba5@mail.gmail.com> An open evening of devised theatre, performance poetry, performance art, photo art, video art, and live art of all other stripes, presented by Logos Theatre and the SpeechMagic intiative, with the support of Maya Art Gallery . If you are a performance poet, video artist, sound artist, performance artist, photo artist or musician or any other species of genus of artist, and want to showcase your stuff, get in touch! Events scheduled so far: Prison Evenings - A public rehearsal of a work-in-progress devised from the poetry of faiz ahmad faiz and Kavalam Narayanankutty, Alexander Solzhenitsyn's nobel lecture, and other sources, by graduates of a recent Logos Theatre workshop. Directed by Arka Mukhopadhyay Improv (interactive form of theatre) by members of Logos Theatre, with acts that range from the whacky to the hilarious, zany to surreal. Poetry performance by theStillDancer, Ampat Verghese Koshy and others Digital photo projections by Honey Bajaj Other events: Poetry Open Mic (without a mic!) - registrations from six PM at venue, four minutes performance time, fifteen performers max, no telephonic/ e-mail registrations. You may read your work, sing it, dance it, do kung-fu with it - as long as you perform. Don't bore us! Open Space for movement artists, musicians, photo and video artists - five to seven minutes time limit (depending on the genre and the art work). registrations from six at the venue, fifteen artists max, no telephonic/ e-mail registrations. We will have basic projection equipment, and a homely 2.1 channel speaker set with a laptop or two. We may (may) have a TV and a DVD player. If you need anything special, bring it yourself! If you'd like to be a featured artist (at our discretion), please call Abhijit on 9845530323 or mail contact at logostheatreindia.org. There's no specific time duration for featured artists. We are proudly anti-establishment. We are not supported by any (unethical) corporate, nor by any arts foundation that prostitutes art to unethical corporates. So don't give us theoretical clap trap, dishonest pseudo-art or any other junk. We have seen all of that, and we say to that, 'yeah, right!' Whateverrr! DADA rules! -- Logos Theatre In the beginning was the word No. 126, 3rd Main Road, Jayamahal Extension, Bangalore 560046 India www.logostheatreindia.org google group: http://groups.google.com/group/logostheatre (to subscribe by e-mail: logostheatre-subscribe at googlegroups.com) -------------------------------------------------------- If it be now, 'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all. Since no man has aught of what he leaves, what is't to leave betimes? Let be. -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From matterofart.ezine at gmail.com Thu Aug 28 14:52:53 2008 From: matterofart.ezine at gmail.com (Anoop Kamath) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 10:22:53 +0100 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Greetings from www.mattersofart.com . Our August 20th upload can be viewed online now! Message-ID: <5bdbd2590808280222w5e94be07j5d4fb4a0ad83d703@mail.gmail.com> Dear Friends, Greetings from www.mattersofart.com . Our August 20th upload can be viewed online now! * - Lead: *A photofeature on* Indian Art Summit 2008* - *Special Interview: Vikram Bachhawat *of Aakriti Art Gallery * - Infocus: Swapan Mallick** - Bhooma Padmanabhan*'s essay on *FICA'*s exhibition *Urgent: 10ml of Contemporary Needed! - Triviality of Everyday Existence: Gigi Scaria's *essay* - Krishna Pillai* writes on *Babu Xavier*'s* *works – *Organic Dreams* * - G.R. Iranna *gets nominated for* Signature Art Prize - My Work: Raghavendra Rao K.V.* - A feature on *Celestial Clock* displayed in *Khoj @ One Shanti Road Gallery/ Studio, Bangalore - Exhibition reviews*: * Santhosh Mithra's Goat Series displ*ated at *Chaithanya Art Gallery, KochiShakila's *exhibition at* CIMA Gallery, KolkataDestination Asia -Conversation I, *a review by* Cristiana de MarchiSarmistha Maiti *reviews* To All Whom it May Concern * at* Ganges Art Gallery, KolkataTanya Abraham *reviews* Manoj Brahmamangalam's Shadow RemnantsPrakriti Kashyap *reviews*Manish Sutar's exhibition at Studio Napean, Mumbai * And news and views Log on to www.mattersofart.com for the latest news in Indian contemporary art For listings visit http://mattersofart.blogspot.com Editor www.mattersofart.com -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From mitoo at sarai.net Wed Aug 27 14:53:44 2008 From: mitoo at sarai.net (Mitoo Das) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 2008 14:53:44 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] AUTUMN SCHOOL ON THE 'ORAL' AS RESOURCE AT INDIAN INSTITUTE OF ADVANCED STUDY Message-ID: <48B51D20.5020905@sarai.net> INDIAN INSTITUTE OF ADVANCED STUDY Rashtrapati Nivas, Shimla 171005 Announcing Autumn School on The `Oral' as Resource Literacy and writing have lately been so dominant in our societies that we are largely unaware of the presence and influence of orality and its potential as a field of study. While the literate and formal discourse is dominated by power and hierarchy, the oral often expresses, counter-hegemonic tendencies subverting the asymmetric social norms. Although the oral culture does not necessarily preclude knowledge of literacy, it manifests itself primarily through the channels of oral performance. Oral discourses have wide circulation in many communities whereby alternate belief and knowledge systems are constructed and communicated. In a multilingual and multivocal country like India, the oral often crosses language borders. It is necessary to bridge the cultural difference between orality and literacy and highlight the oral as indigenous epistemology informing the multifarious cultural practices. With this in view a two week Autumn School is proposed to be held at the Indian Institute of Advanced Study, Shimla, from 3 November to 16 November 2008, The Autumn School will be conducted by eminent scholars from several disciplines who will explore the various aspects of oral culture such as oral narratives, ethnography of popular lore, oral as symbolic form of solidarity and resistance, folk wisdom communicated through the oral, social function of proverbs, rumours and gossip, oral/written interface, the use of oral in literature, katha-vachana, oral history, partition memoirs, oral testimony and narratives of riot victims and survivors, etc. Applications are invited from young college/university teachers from the Humanities and Social Sciences that make use of the 'oral' as a pedagogical tool. A batch of 25 participants will be selected from amongst the applicants. Those interested may send their bio-data (that should include their academic qualifications, experience, research interests and areas of specialisation) along with a note of 200-250 words regarding the nature of their proposed participation and how they could contribute to the understanding of the 'oral' as a resource. All expenses will be borne by the IIAS. This is the first Autumn School and is planned to become a regular annual academic activity. Applications For the above programme must reach the IIAS by 15 September 2008. Those selected will be informed by 30 September 2008. Applications may be sent by e-mail to scaikant at rediffmail.com and proiias at gmail.com or by post to: Professor Satish C. Aikant Convenor Autumn School on: The 'Oral' as Resource Indian Institute of Advanced Study Rashtrapati Nivas Shimla - 171005 You can also see this announcement on the following link: http://www.iias.org/autumn_School.html _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 17:55:55 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 05:25:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <693028.4868.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Yes I, agree.We,being the lucky few ones who have managed to received some meaningful education in this poor country,should behave in a responsible ma nner and ensure that we contribute something worthwhile to our society,nation and the world at large forgetting about our personal preferences of comforts.Through this forum we should be able to evolve a consensus and serve our nation.Scoring a point or winning an arguement should not be our prime concern.Listening to others,respecting them and appreciating their points honestly will take us to new heights.Discussing for the sake of discussion may be avoided. The issue of global warming has been raised.It is in our mind.We tend to be hot-headed and intolerant increasing entropy of the universe resulting in sins,greed,hatred,exploitation and violence.We will have to make our life green first.It means consumption to the barest minimum resulting in minimum violence on nature.The western model of life leading to more comforts, more consumption,more profits,creating artificial needs,selling more and more come what may,ever increasing exploitation of natural resources has brought our Mother Earth to the brink of disaster and extinction.Mother Earth has enough for the need of all but not enough for even one man's greed.We all are responsible for the reckless consumption.Do we switch off lights,fans,airconditioners etc.in our offices or homes when they are not needed?Do we see to it that water is not wasted unnecessarily? How much food is weasted in our homes,in public places or in hotels? Are we switching off AC in car when outside weather is tolerable?Are we using our car even for very short distances which we can easily walk? Are we putting on the curtains on windows when daylight is available and switching on the electric bulbs? How much solar energy is being used which is freely available in abundance? Why we have to play matches in nights under artificial lights when they can be easily played in daylight?  How much use of daytime and daylight we are making in our day-to-day work? Are we shifting our working time to night time requring artificial lighting and additional scarce electrical energy? How much use of non-conventional energy we are doing which are easily available? How much use of local materials and local skills we are making? How much use of energy-intensive products we are making? These are very simple steps through which we can fight the problem of global warming. Regards, Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Jeebesh To: Sarai Reader-list Sent: Thursday, 28 August, 2008 4:47:26 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi dear Prabhakar, It is absolutely true that Hinduism is not understood. It is not at  all a religion. Religion is a new concept, developed a few hundred  years to confuse people. It was always a way of life and remains so.  Totally agree with you. That is why is very important for people like  you or chanchal to give some new ways of thinking ahead. Like in case  of global warming, how will this old civilisational way of life give a  fresh insight.? These are global questions of urgency and if properly  given thought can upturn the way world thinks. Please give it some  thought. warmly jeebesh On 28-Aug-08, at 4:23 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > Very rightly said ! Hinduism is not a religion.It is a way of  > life.If Hinduism is a book all religions on earth are its  > chapters.It is a great sin to abuse it without properly  > understanding it. We should first take trouble to understand its  > philosophy as little surface knowledge may prove to be dangerous. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: chanchal malviya > To: A Khanna ; Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, 27 August, 2008 9:33:07 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > Dear Khanna, > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the  > positive side of their own identity. There are people who would love  > to rape their own mother and motherland. And there are some people  > who even protect their intention as personal attitude. Great. Not to  > say anything to them. > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else  > explains in itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person  > also feel the same for their own mother and sister. And I have  > written earlier that such person would not come to protect their  > mother also, what to say about the broader concept of motherland. > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through  > the text only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of  > people. Because India is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu  > country. Of course, people like you are a part of it. Hinduism is a  > mere subject of attack in India. What I told about Hinduism is  > exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word came into  > existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of  > Sanatan Dharma. > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between  > Dharma and Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma  > means Righteous duty and Religion is what you all are talking about.  > Hinduism is science and teaches righteous duty in scientific manner.  > World outside India is recognizing this, but our Indians will  > understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say and that also  > when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various  > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step  > towards Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath  > nude didn't cover their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed  > them, because they knew that he is a child in his nature on this  > matter. But they immediately took cover when Veda Vyas crossed. > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for  > sex. And the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful  > natural factor. And winning over it is the biggest win in life. > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found  > Hindu society also marrying multitude of women. > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not  > understand and ask me stupid questions. > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as  > per their capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right  > hand posses (Hindu women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex  > and love are the same thing. > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland  > only with his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his  > Islamic attitude. He has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic  > attitude, though film stars have a different life style and we may  > not be protective of them in this matter. > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his  > mother. Or if you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large  > heart, please send a photograph of your mother to him and ask him to  > paint her nude. Let me see, how many of you are not of double  > standard. > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your  > own motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: A Khanna > To: Prabhakar Singh > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim >; reader-list at sarai.net > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > you will find it interesting. > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often  textual, > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a “faith > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > sex)” is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > 'Hindu'. > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > self?)  So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is > that to him “Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same” – therefore, > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > things that i find fascinating here. > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > fascinating. > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > prabhakar and chanchal? > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > nail on the head. “If some artist in the name of art paints your > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > how would you feel and how would you react?”, s/he asks. A similar > point is made by chanchal when s/he says “I am sure, a person who > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > to his mother and sister”. This leads me to understand that the > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > also makes steel. > > > Love, > > akshay > > -- > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > >      Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or  > yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with  > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ From jeebesh at sarai.net Thu Aug 28 18:06:38 2008 From: jeebesh at sarai.net (Jeebesh) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:06:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <693028.4868.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <693028.4868.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CBBA791-AFD7-4A14-901A-5D66ECE2AA8E@sarai.net> On 28-Aug-08, at 5:55 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > The issue of global warming has been raised.It is in our mind.We > tend to be hot-headed and intolerant increasing entropy of the > universe resulting in sins,greed,hatred,exploitation and violence. This is absolutely true. But how do we get out of the viscous cycle of heat and intolerance within us? How do we know that we are getting out of it? best Jeebesh From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Thu Aug 28 19:00:32 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 19:00:32 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir Message-ID: From the Telegraph, Calcutta THE TROUBLE WITH EDEN - Kashmir offers a choice between two compromised ideals Mukul Kesavan I¹ve never been to Kashmir. I nearly went in 1987 to Srinagar; there¹s a guesthouse there that used to be owned by Grindlays Bank, where I was meant to stay, but then the troubles began and I stayed home. The closest I came to living in Kashmir was living in Kashmiri Gate, a neighbourhood in north Delhi where the walled city ended and the Civil Lines began. There¹s a cinema hall there called the Ritz, where, in the early Sixties, I saw visions of Kashmir in films like Kashmir Ki Kali. Those were the years when Bombay cinema specialized in houseboat and hill-station idylls and in these films Kashmir often stood in for Eden. Delhi was a Jan Sangh city then; Atal Bihari Vajpayee was a promising local politician. Growing up in Kashmiri Gate, I wasn¹t especially political but I knew that Jan Sanghis blamed Nehru for Kashmir¹s disputed status. If he hadn¹t agreed to a plebiscite, or if he had allowed Indians from outside Kashmir to settle there, or if he hadn¹t made the fatal mistake of Article 370, which gave Jammu and Kashmir a special status within the Union, if he hadn¹t indulged Sheikh AbdullahŠ if he hadn¹t done all of this, we wouldn¹t be wrestling with secessionism and sedition in Kashmir. For most of us who, like me, have no first-hand experience of Kashmir, the troubles in the Valley are, for the most part, a series of off-stage noises. Our governors, or more precisely, our proconsuls, sometimes become famous for making bad things worse, wars and skirmishes emblazon names like Kargil on our collective consciousness, newsworthy violence like the purging of Kashmiri Pandits from the valley or the brutalization of Kashmiri Muslims by the security forces surfaces in the newspapers and news channels, and then there are long periods of absent-mindedness when Kashmir disappears and these are the times when it¹s deemed to be calm or inching towards normalcy. Wise men, in these interludes, talk on television about commerce being the key to peace. Tourism¹s up, they say hopefully. Then the valley erupts and half-forgotten names like Hurriyat and Malik and Geelani and Farooq flicker in our heads. This latest eruption, though, has provoked a set of unusual reactions. The enormous popular mobilization in the Valley after General Sinha, our last governor, stirred the pot by allotting a large plot of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board, and after the security forces, predictably enough, killed Kashmiri Muslims in the demonstrations that followed, has prompted mainstream journalists like Vir Sanghvi and Swaminathan Aiyar to write opinion pieces arguing that India should seriously consider letting Kashmir go. Arundhati Roy, who was present at the enormous rally, made the same point more forcefully, arguing that the pro-Pakistan slogans or the distinctly Islamic idiom of the azadi vanguard, ought not to distract us from the fact that India has no right to hold the Valley¹s Muslims against their will. The routes by which these writers came to their conclusions are different, but the conclusion is the same: that the time has come to think the unthinkable: an azad Kashmir, or even the prospect of Kashmir becoming part of Pakistan. Are they right? Should Indian liberals and democrats endorse self-determination for Kashmir? Or is it possible to hold another position: can a liberal oppose azadi in Kashmir in good faith? One way of exploring this is to make dhobi lists of the pros and cons of Kashmiri self-determination. The case for self-determination is contained in the term itself. If we accept that the two hundred thousand Kashmiris who came out to protest against Indian rule, to shout for liberty, to invoke the ideal of an Islamic state, to press the case for union with Pakistan, are representative of Kashmir¹s Muslim population, then pressing India¹s claim to Kashmir with guns and bayonets is a violent negation of their collective will. It¹s hard for a liberal or a democrat to defend that position. No matter how violently you disagree with their ideas, or how convinced you are of Pakistani mischief and instigation, given the violence the Indian state has inflicted on Kashmiris, it¹s hard to argue that India is entitled to the benefit of the doubt. Kashmiri alienation is now of such long standing and the Indian state¹s interventions in Kashmir have been characterized by such unscrupulousness and such ruthless violence that touting India¹s virtues as a secular, democratic state, which Kashmiris should be glad to be part of, feels like a sick joke. But there is a case against self-determination which needs to be made, if only to clarify the consequence of endorsing self-determination. Self-determination isn¹t in itself virtuous. The Tamils in Sri Lanka, led by Velupillai Prabhakaran have been fighting a civil war for decades to achieve a separate state, Tamil Eelam. Tamils have suffered violence at the hands of Sinhala chauvinists and discrimination from the Sri Lankan state, which, in the Sixties, defined itself as a hegemonically Buddhist, Sinhalese entity. I know of very few people outside of Prabhakaran¹s followers who want such a state to come into being. This is partly because Prabhakaran is an old-fashioned totalitarian leader and partly because a tiny, Tamil-majority statelet on a small island doesn¹t feel like a rousing cause. Sri Lanka aside, we¹ve witnessed the hideously violent unravelling of Yugoslavia in the name of self-determination. We¹ve seen the idea of self-determination taken to its absurd extreme in the elevation of Kosovo and Ossetia, tiny enclaves, barely a million strong, into nations on the ground of ethnic or religious difference. So perhaps, as liberals, we¹re entitled to ask of movements of self-determination, what sort of state they aspire to. If self-determination in Kashmir is meant to create a majoritarian state on the basis of ethnicity or faith (and Arundhati Roy, in her essay, is clear that the tableau of azadi that she witnessed was substantially shaped by Islamic ideas and bound by a sense of Muslim identity), an Indian liberal might still prefer azadi because he thinks chronic, quasi-colonial state violence is worse, but at least he would acknowledge that his was a counsel of despair rather an endorsement of a freedom struggle. That same liberal might argue that the expulsion of the Pandits and the violence against them shouldn¹t be accepted as an alibi for holding on to Kashmir, but he would be forced to acknowledge that Kashmiri nationalism in this Muslim variant seeks to draw a border around an ethnically cleansed people. Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he thinks the Indian republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in democratic pluralism, that the Indian national movement and the nation-state it created, tried, in an unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea of diversity, not homogeneity. It¹s worth mentioning here that the Indian state has never attempted to change the demographic realities in the Valley in the way in which Israel and China have in Palestine and Tibet. The loss of Kashmir, the only Muslim-majority state in the Union, would be a) a massive setback to this pluralist project, and b) a gift to Hindu chauvinists who would cite Kashmiri secession as yet another proof of the impossibility of integrating Muslims into a non-Muslim state. To sum up then, the Indian liberal has two options. He can support azadi in Kashmir because it is the lesser evil, knowing that azadi will almost certainly mean either a sectarian Muslim statelet or more territory for a larger sectarian state, Pakistan. Or he can endorse the Indian occupation because, in the larger scheme of things, Kashmiri Muslim suffering is collateral damage, the price that must be paid for the greater good of a pluralist India. Put like that, there¹s no shimmering cause to lift our liberal¹s spirits, just a choice between two squalid, compromised ideals. From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 19:18:29 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 06:48:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <145259.50174.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Most certainly (in my opinion) a fairly and sensibly laid out set of arguments on this issue.   Kshmendra --- On Thu, 8/28/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir To: "Sarai" Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:00 PM From the Telegraph, Calcutta THE TROUBLE WITH EDEN - Kashmir offers a choice between two compromised ideals Mukul Kesavan I¹ve never been to Kashmir. I nearly went in 1987 to Srinagar; there¹s a guesthouse there that used to be owned by Grindlays Bank, where I was meant to stay, but then the troubles began and I stayed home. The closest I came to living in Kashmir was living in Kashmiri Gate, a neighbourhood in north Delhi where the walled city ended and the Civil Lines began. There¹s a cinema hall there called the Ritz, where, in the early Sixties, I saw visions of Kashmir in films like Kashmir Ki Kali. Those were the years when Bombay cinema specialized in houseboat and hill-station idylls and in these films Kashmir often stood in for Eden. Delhi was a Jan Sangh city then; Atal Bihari Vajpayee was a promising local politician. Growing up in Kashmiri Gate, I wasn¹t especially political but I knew that Jan Sanghis blamed Nehru for Kashmir¹s disputed status. If he hadn¹t agreed to a plebiscite, or if he had allowed Indians from outside Kashmir to settle there, or if he hadn¹t made the fatal mistake of Article 370, which gave Jammu and Kashmir a special status within the Union, if he hadn¹t indulged Sheikh Abdullah if he hadn¹t done all of this, we wouldn¹t be wrestling with secessionism and sedition in Kashmir. For most of us who, like me, have no first-hand experience of Kashmir, the troubles in the Valley are, for the most part, a series of off-stage noises. Our governors, or more precisely, our proconsuls, sometimes become famous for making bad things worse, wars and skirmishes emblazon names like Kargil on our collective consciousness, newsworthy violence like the purging of Kashmiri Pandits from the valley or the brutalization of Kashmiri Muslims by the security forces surfaces in the newspapers and news channels, and then there are long periods of absent-mindedness when Kashmir disappears and these are the times when it¹s deemed to be calm or inching towards normalcy. Wise men, in these interludes, talk on television about commerce being the key to peace. Tourism¹s up, they say hopefully. Then the valley erupts and half-forgotten names like Hurriyat and Malik and Geelani and Farooq flicker in our heads. This latest eruption, though, has provoked a set of unusual reactions. The enormous popular mobilization in the Valley after General Sinha, our last governor, stirred the pot by allotting a large plot of land to the Amarnath Shrine Board, and after the security forces, predictably enough, killed Kashmiri Muslims in the demonstrations that followed, has prompted mainstream journalists like Vir Sanghvi and Swaminathan Aiyar to write opinion pieces arguing that India should seriously consider letting Kashmir go. Arundhati Roy, who was present at the enormous rally, made the same point more forcefully, arguing that the pro-Pakistan slogans or the distinctly Islamic idiom of the azadi vanguard, ought not to distract us from the fact that India has no right to hold the Valley¹s Muslims against their will. The routes by which these writers came to their conclusions are different, but the conclusion is the same: that the time has come to think the unthinkable: an azad Kashmir, or even the prospect of Kashmir becoming part of Pakistan. Are they right? Should Indian liberals and democrats endorse self-determination for Kashmir? Or is it possible to hold another position: can a liberal oppose azadi in Kashmir in good faith? One way of exploring this is to make dhobi lists of the pros and cons of Kashmiri self-determination. The case for self-determination is contained in the term itself. If we accept that the two hundred thousand Kashmiris who came out to protest against Indian rule, to shout for liberty, to invoke the ideal of an Islamic state, to press the case for union with Pakistan, are representative of Kashmir¹s Muslim population, then pressing India¹s claim to Kashmir with guns and bayonets is a violent negation of their collective will. It¹s hard for a liberal or a democrat to defend that position. No matter how violently you disagree with their ideas, or how convinced you are of Pakistani mischief and instigation, given the violence the Indian state has inflicted on Kashmiris, it¹s hard to argue that India is entitled to the benefit of the doubt. Kashmiri alienation is now of such long standing and the Indian state¹s interventions in Kashmir have been characterized by such unscrupulousness and such ruthless violence that touting India¹s virtues as a secular, democratic state, which Kashmiris should be glad to be part of, feels like a sick joke. But there is a case against self-determination which needs to be made, if only to clarify the consequence of endorsing self-determination. Self-determination isn¹t in itself virtuous. The Tamils in Sri Lanka, led by Velupillai Prabhakaran have been fighting a civil war for decades to achieve a separate state, Tamil Eelam. Tamils have suffered violence at the hands of Sinhala chauvinists and discrimination from the Sri Lankan state, which, in the Sixties, defined itself as a hegemonically Buddhist, Sinhalese entity. I know of very few people outside of Prabhakaran¹s followers who want such a state to come into being. This is partly because Prabhakaran is an old-fashioned totalitarian leader and partly because a tiny, Tamil-majority statelet on a small island doesn¹t feel like a rousing cause. Sri Lanka aside, we¹ve witnessed the hideously violent unravelling of Yugoslavia in the name of self-determination. We¹ve seen the idea of self-determination taken to its absurd extreme in the elevation of Kosovo and Ossetia, tiny enclaves, barely a million strong, into nations on the ground of ethnic or religious difference. So perhaps, as liberals, we¹re entitled to ask of movements of self-determination, what sort of state they aspire to. If self-determination in Kashmir is meant to create a majoritarian state on the basis of ethnicity or faith (and Arundhati Roy, in her essay, is clear that the tableau of azadi that she witnessed was substantially shaped by Islamic ideas and bound by a sense of Muslim identity), an Indian liberal might still prefer azadi because he thinks chronic, quasi-colonial state violence is worse, but at least he would acknowledge that his was a counsel of despair rather an endorsement of a freedom struggle. That same liberal might argue that the expulsion of the Pandits and the violence against them shouldn¹t be accepted as an alibi for holding on to Kashmir, but he would be forced to acknowledge that Kashmiri nationalism in this Muslim variant seeks to draw a border around an ethnically cleansed people. Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he thinks the Indian republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in democratic pluralism, that the Indian national movement and the nation-state it created, tried, in an unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea of diversity, not homogeneity. It¹s worth mentioning here that the Indian state has never attempted to change the demographic realities in the Valley in the way in which Israel and China have in Palestine and Tibet. The loss of Kashmir, the only Muslim-majority state in the Union, would be a) a massive setback to this pluralist project, and b) a gift to Hindu chauvinists who would cite Kashmiri secession as yet another proof of the impossibility of integrating Muslims into a non-Muslim state. To sum up then, the Indian liberal has two options. He can support azadi in Kashmir because it is the lesser evil, knowing that azadi will almost certainly mean either a sectarian Muslim statelet or more territory for a larger sectarian state, Pakistan. Or he can endorse the Indian occupation because, in the larger scheme of things, Kashmiri Muslim suffering is collateral damage, the price that must be paid for the greater good of a pluralist India. Put like that, there¹s no shimmering cause to lift our liberal¹s spirits, just a choice between two squalid, compromised ideals. _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 19:28:38 2008 From: chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com (chanchal malviya) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 06:58:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi Message-ID: <46541.86655.qm@web90405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I agree to you Jeebesh... And suggest you go through Vedas... but not as translated by MaxMuller or others... but under guidance of some Guru or light of pre-acquired knowledge about Sanatan Dharma... The concern that you are talking about are already taken care of by the Vedic Science... Please understand.. human mind is creative and aggressive... it can be controlled through the culture of respect, regard and love... and this respect should be towards whole creation (not towards the God alone, as in other religions)... and then people will surely understand the importance of life of animals.. importance of forests.. importance of so worshipped clean rivers.. importance of living a disciplined life (getting up in Brahma bela - early morning time)... importance of practicing sacred married life (Brahmacharya helping in it)... etc..etc.. Where is the question of Global warming then... You see, four 500 years ago, India was heaven... Babur wrote a lot in praise of this land.. He has written in Baburnama that for cultivation farmers in India do not need to plaugh their land.. there is so good rainfall, so much greenery.. so self-sustained villages... well advanced king ships... Babur accepts all these.. but Islam sits on his mind to destroy everything and he boasts by saying that he created towers of heads of thousands of Infidels... We need to re-establish the culture of Hinduism that respects creation and considers human a part of creation.. unlike Islam which considers creation for human... we need to fight Religion and throw away the concept of Religion in totality... even the word Hinduism should be abolished and the only Dharma that should develop again should be the same old and gold Sanatan Dharma in the new light of science and education... I don't know, this seems to be a dream... yet no harm to dream as well... we can do little and see little results though... ----- Original Message ---- From: Jeebesh To: Sarai Reader-list Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 6:06:38 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi On 28-Aug-08, at 5:55 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > The issue of global warming has been raised.It is in our mind.We > tend to be hot-headed and intolerant increasing entropy of the > universe resulting in sins,greed,hatred,exploitation and violence. This is absolutely true. But how do we get out of the viscous cycle of heat and intolerance within us? How do we know that we are getting out of it? best Jeebesh _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Thu Aug 28 21:50:26 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 21:50:26 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] 'Histories, geographies and memories are at war in J&K' Message-ID: <9c06aab30808280920s2dc70d47u82d517532e4ca52f@mail.gmail.com> Our way or the highway? Histories, geographies and memories are at war in Jammu and Kashmir by Ananya Jahanara Kabir Posted online: Thursday, August 28, 2008 http://www.indianexpress.com/story/354295.html An poshi teli, yeli van poshi, or 'while there are forests, there will be food'. This Koshur proverb attributed to Kashmiri Sufi Nund Rishi offers uncanny commentary on the present crisis in Jammu and Kashmir, where controversies over forest land have intertwined with a furore over an economic blockade, and where environmental concerns have been bypassed in the clash of religious and political symbols now demarcating the interests and emotions of Jammu from those of Kashmir. Yet there exists a widespread inability to analyse the situation as a battle of symbols and symptoms. This is a psychologically sick state, but its sickness betokens something rotten in the state of India. To understand it, we need to understand two sets of symbolic oppositions that precede 1947, but which have defined the current crisis: the Valley vs. Jammu; and the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad highway vs. the Banihal pass route. The opposition between the Valley and Jammu originates in the colonial creation of 'Jammu and Kashmir' as a 'princely kingdom', sold by the British for a song to Gulab Singh and his descendants. The strategic desire for a buffer zone between the Indian plains and the Central Asian playing fields of the Great Game soon led to the need for a prime holiday retreat for the Raj. During the 19th and early 20th centuries, hunting, fishing, espionage, photography, and summer balls flourished in the Valley under the gaze of the Dogra maharajas based in Jammu, even as the rulers ruthlessly exploited the inhabitants of this prized space. Kashmiris of the Valley were denied the basis of modern subjecthood such as education, sidelined to promote the Dogra rulers' self-fashioning as, according to historian Mridu Rai, 'Hindu rulers of a Hindu state'. Their practice of 'begaar' conscripted Kashmiri Muslims as unpaid porters for the manual transportation of goods across the kingdom. Kashmiri Pandits, showcased by European Orientalists as representatives of a Hindu antiquity, were however mobilised to enhance Dogra Hindu identity. These are regional memories not easily forgotten. Class-based exploitation spearheaded the Valley's mass uprising against the Dogra rulers led by Sheikh Abdullah in 1931. Though his socialist manifesto for a Naya Kashmir had room for Kashmiri Pandits and Muslims, the older privileges of class continued to antagonise the two groups. These divides resurfaced with the Pandit exodus in 1991, which quickly fitted into the wider communal polarisation of the 1990s. The Pandits in Jammu's refugee camps had little else left but their claims on a pre-Sanskritic, Hindu antiquity for Kashmir and Kashmiri culture, which resonated with Jammu's historical interest in those claims. Many of their intellectuals gravitated towards the Hindu right, which eagerly embraced their cause. Conversely, many in the Valley rejected the much-hyped syncretism of 'kashmiriyat' to assert an Islamic Kashmiri identity. Physically separated, with new generations growing up bereft of a composite demography, Kashmiris now spoke bitterly of one Kashmir 'this side' of the Pir Panjal mountains, and another on 'that side'. The Pandits' exile in Jammu has exacerbated and complicated the deep historical tensions between Jammu and Kashmir that underlie the present détente. India retained the Dogra juxtaposition of Jammu and Kashmir, but had to relinquish the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad Highway. This was the only feasible road linking Kashmir to the plains, but the Indo-Pak war of 1948 and the creation of the LOC severed this artery. Nehru had presciently obtained Gurdaspur district, through which the only possible alternative road to the valley would need to pass at Pathankot. But trouble arose immediately after Partition: Indian troops were airlifted to Srinagar to face the Tribal Invasion in October 1947, pointing to the urgency for a bypass surgery that would ultimately blast out of the mountains the Jawahar Tunnel. Kashmiris still remember a time when the natural route out of the Valley facilitated the movement of goods as well as people between the Valley and its markets in that part of the Valley beyond the LOC, including Muzaffarabad. The Kashmiris who marched towards Muzaffarabad to sell their rotting fruit struck at the nation's Achilles' heel. But they were primarily asserting a deep-rooted regional memory of their relationship to the Valley's geography, their basis for the same Kashmiriyat that well-meaning secular discourses reduce to 'syncretism'. The problem lies in Indian ignorance of Kashmiri history, memories, and self-construction, their equivalent of the 'synthesis between history, geography and politics' through which scholar Mahmood Mamdani examined the roots of the Tutsi genocide by Hutus. Kashmiriyat for Kashmiris is about putting the Kashmiri back into the landscape and redefining that relationship on their own terms. Pandit and Muslim Kashmiris commonly identify with the endangered Hangul deer: can't the deadlock over the forested land be broken by rearticulated its cost in environmental terms, surely of equal concern to all? But to get there, the political temperature has to be lowered first. The full re-opening of the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad highway would be the most effective step in that direction. The writer is a senior lecturer at the University of Leeds and the author of 'Territory of Desire: Representing the Valley of Kashmir' From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Thu Aug 28 21:51:40 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 09:21:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Peaceful Protests In Kashmir Alter Equation for India Message-ID: <822063.5175.qm@web31812.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Peaceful Protests In Kashmir Alter Equation for India Tough Response Criticized as Outmoded By Emily Wax Washington Post Foreign Service Thursday, August 28, 2008; Page A08 SRINAGAR, India -- Inside dozens of cramped kitchens in this Kashmiri city on Saturday, mothers and daughters prepared to make packets of rice for the hundreds of thousands expected at a sit-in two days later. Outside, their sons and brothers collected change from motorists to buy water and juice. Drumbeats echoed through the Kashmir Valley as college students chanted "Azadi," or freedom. In middle-class neighborhoods, Internet-savvy students blogged about their views and posted videos of the preparations on YouTube. But early Sunday, Indian security forces blanketed the region, preventing demonstrators from reaching the center of Srinagar, summer capital of Kashmir. Authorities announced an indefinite curfew, blocked Internet access and arrested three prominent Muslim separatist leaders. At least 15 journalists were beaten. Despite the government's use of force, many Muslims in Indian-controlled Kashmir seem determined to find peaceful ways to voice their separatist aspirations. The slogans of the fighting in the 1990s, such as "I'm going to Pakistan to get an AK-47," have disappeared as the nonviolent movement flourishes, especially among the young. "For the young generation, it's our moment now," said Malik Sajad, a 20-year-old political cartoonist for the Greater Kashmir newspaper who was raised during the war. "Nobody here saw a childhood. We were always kept indoors. But we don't believe that the solution is in the gun. Now we want to show the world that Kashmiris deserve peace." The unrest this summer in Kashmir has left nearly 40 people dead, all unarmed protesters, and more than 600 injured in the biggest demonstrations since an uprising against Indian rule by the region's Muslim majority broke out in 1989. On Wednesday, troops fired on protesters in two towns outside Srinagar, killing two people and injuring more than a dozen. Political analysts and human rights activists say the Indian government has failed to adjust its strategy to deal with a separatist movement committed to nonviolence. Some Indian political leaders, even those who disagree with the push for Kashmir's independence, are beginning to wonder whether India's democracy is mature enough to handle such widespread but peaceful dissent. "India calls itself the world's largest functioning democracy. But if we are really a democracy, can't we let people express their dissent?" asked Omar Abdullah, a Muslim member of India's Parliament and president of the National Conference, a mainstream political party in Kashmir. "In every other part of the country, police or army fire tear gas or rubber bullets during agitations. Why do they shoot first and ask questions later in Kashmir?" This scenic valley has long been the battleground between Hindu-majority India and Muslim-majority Pakistan, with each country claiming Kashmir soon after India's partition in 1947. The two nuclear-armed countries have waged two wars over Kashmir, and Indian security forces and separatist fighters skirmish almost daily. Fighting has left up to 77,000 dead since the early 1990s, according to human rights groups. The current uproar began nearly two months ago over a land transfer that would have given nearly 100 acres of forest to a trust that runs a Hindu shrine. After a month of street protests by Muslims, the state government revoked the land grant. That sparked weeks of counterdemonstrations by Hindus in Jammu, a predominantly Hindu region of the state. Hindu protesters blockaded roads leading out of Kashmir, economically suffocating thousands of Kashmiri farmers during the peak of apple harvest. The issue has moved beyond the land deal for Kashmir's Muslims, igniting a people's movement calling for self-rule. The movement is "purely indigenous, purely Kashmiri," Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, one of the arrested separatist leaders, said in an interview before he was detained. "Even we were surprised by the force of it." Muslim Kashmiris say they are tired of the daily humiliations at the hands of India's 500,000-member security force, posted in apple orchards, saffron farms and hospitals. Many say they are subjected to constant identification checks, car searches and arrests without reason by soldiers armed with assault rifles and wearing flak jackets. A senior leader in India's government defended the curfew in Kashmir, saying that "possible militant elements could take advantage of the crowds." "One can understand when there are reasons for people to assemble. But there is no logic for people to gather in public places without any valid reason," said Union Home Secretary Madhukar Gupta. But the nonviolent movement in Kashmir has won over many in India's intellectual class. And in New Delhi, India's capital, public opinion on the issue of Kashmir has been mixed for the first time in decades. Prime-time television shows have hosted debates on whether Kashmiris should be allowed to vote on their independence. A column in the Hindustan Times, titled "Think the Unthinkable," asked: "Why are we still hanging on to Kashmir if the Kashmiris don't want to have anything to do with us? The answer is machismo." Booker Prize-winning author and social commentator Arundhati Roy has become a hero in Kashmir for demanding that the Indian government rethink its policy and calling for more international attention to the issue. "The reaction of the people in Kashmir is actually a referendum," she said recently. "India needs freedom from Kashmir as much as Kashmir needs freedom from India."   From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Thu Aug 28 23:35:18 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 23:35:18 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Home and Away Message-ID: <6353c690808281105x760104d5wee4ea720ed0ed966@mail.gmail.com> Home and Away - Hindustan Times *Pradeep Magazine* August 28, 2008 To be a Kashmiri and a Hindu can be a painful experience these days. To which side of the divide do we belong? The answer is taken for granted and in this fight between 'us' and 'them', between Hindu and Muslim, I am supposed to articulate the agony of exile, the religious persecution of 'us', minorities, and fight for my homeland from which we have been thrown out through 'violent' means. These are questions that are not easy to answer, especially by someone whose father migrated from the Valley in the early 60s to better his economic prospects. I am a migrant like a large number of Kashmiris who had been moving out of the Valley into mainland India for many decades now, as there were not many jobs back home for want of any economic development. I understand the trauma of those who had to escape from the Valley in the late 80s as a result of a mass movement by the majority (Muslims) against the Indian State. A large number of Hindus are now scattered around the country — although, I must confess, they have been looked after well, have been provided dole and jobs. A lot of states have been generous enough to provide admission to their children on a quota basis in professional training institutes. It is being said that Kashmiri Hindus are the most pampered community-in-exile anywhere in the world. This could be true. But is it compensation enough for those who did not want to leave their homeland? Check the entire piece at - http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?sectionName=&id=ceac87c0-0810-43ce-a9ca-cc4052254ca8&&Headline=Home+and+Away&strParent=strParentID From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 00:13:21 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 11:43:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Home and Away In-Reply-To: <6353c690808281105x760104d5wee4ea720ed0ed966@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <349886.42242.qm@web54206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> >It is being said that Kashmiri Hindus are the most pampered >community-in-exile anywhere in the world. This ~not trying to start a debate. however, i have been getting the distinct idea that the kashmiri hindus/pandits (are they the same?) have been living in extraordinary penury. how exactly IS it? or is it that some live in penury and some in comfort? though i may not always agree with tone and content, i must admit that this group has helped me begin to see the issue of kashmiri pandits/hindus in a new light! ~baruk From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Fri Aug 29 01:37:34 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 20:07:34 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Peaceful Protests In Kashmir Alter Equation for India In-Reply-To: <822063.5175.qm@web31812.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <822063.5175.qm@web31812.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: This reads like a Hurriyat handout - propaganda. It is ironic that while this report was probably being filed the pan Islamic fidayans were busy slaying innocents who were taken hostage earlier in Jammu yesterday. Pan Islamic mercenaries are fighting along side their Kashmiri counterparts for the secession of Muslim majority Kashmir valley from secular India since 1989-90. The ongoing bloody turmoil saw ethnic cleansing of the minority aboriginal Hindu Pandits 18 years ago. So much to speak about the so called 'peaceful" Kashmir movement & that it is indigenous. LA PS: Read the comment "Kashmir is no issue in absence of the 'gun' & Islamic fervour" posted on Washington Post at http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/postglobal/2008/08/post-musharraf_pakistan/comments.html#comments > Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 09:21:40 -0700> From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com> To: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: [Reader-list] Peaceful Protests In Kashmir Alter Equation for India> > Peaceful Protests In Kashmir Alter Equation for India> Tough Response Criticized as Outmoded> By Emily Wax> Washington Post Foreign Service > Thursday, August 28, 2008; Page A08 > SRINAGAR, India -- Inside dozens of cramped kitchens in this Kashmiri city on Saturday, mothers and daughters prepared to make packets of rice for the hundreds of thousands expected at a sit-in two days later. Outside, their sons and brothers collected change from motorists to buy water and juice. > Drumbeats echoed through the Kashmir Valley as college students chanted "Azadi," or freedom. In middle-class neighborhoods, Internet-savvy students blogged about their views and posted videos of the preparations on YouTube. > But early Sunday, Indian security forces blanketed the region, preventing demonstrators from reaching the center of Srinagar, summer capital of Kashmir. Authorities announced an indefinite curfew, blocked Internet access and arrested three prominent Muslim separatist leaders. At least 15 journalists were beaten. > Despite the government's use of force, many Muslims in Indian-controlled Kashmir seem determined to find peaceful ways to voice their separatist aspirations. The slogans of the fighting in the 1990s, such as "I'm going to Pakistan to get an AK-47," have disappeared as the nonviolent movement flourishes, especially among the young. > "For the young generation, it's our moment now," said Malik Sajad, a 20-year-old political cartoonist for the Greater Kashmir newspaper who was raised during the war. "Nobody here saw a childhood. We were always kept indoors. But we don't believe that the solution is in the gun. Now we want to show the world that Kashmiris deserve peace." > The unrest this summer in Kashmir has left nearly 40 people dead, all unarmed protesters, and more than 600 injured in the biggest demonstrations since an uprising against Indian rule by the region's Muslim majority broke out in 1989. On Wednesday, troops fired on protesters in two towns outside Srinagar, killing two people and injuring more than a dozen. > Political analysts and human rights activists say the Indian government has failed to adjust its strategy to deal with a separatist movement committed to nonviolence. Some Indian political leaders, even those who disagree with the push for Kashmir's independence, are beginning to wonder whether India's democracy is mature enough to handle such widespread but peaceful dissent. > "India calls itself the world's largest functioning democracy. But if we are really a democracy, can't we let people express their dissent?" asked Omar Abdullah, a Muslim member of India's Parliament and president of the National Conference, a mainstream political party in Kashmir. "In every other part of the country, police or army fire tear gas or rubber bullets during agitations. Why do they shoot first and ask questions later in Kashmir?" > This scenic valley has long been the battleground between Hindu-majority India and Muslim-majority Pakistan, with each country claiming Kashmir soon after India's partition in 1947. The two nuclear-armed countries have waged two wars over Kashmir, and Indian security forces and separatist fighters skirmish almost daily. Fighting has left up to 77,000 dead since the early 1990s, according to human rights groups. > The current uproar began nearly two months ago over a land transfer that would have given nearly 100 acres of forest to a trust that runs a Hindu shrine. After a month of street protests by Muslims, the state government revoked the land grant. That sparked weeks of counterdemonstrations by Hindus in Jammu, a predominantly Hindu region of the state. Hindu protesters blockaded roads leading out of Kashmir, economically suffocating thousands of Kashmiri farmers during the peak of apple harvest. > The issue has moved beyond the land deal for Kashmir's Muslims, igniting a people's movement calling for self-rule. > The movement is "purely indigenous, purely Kashmiri," Mirwaiz Umar Farooq, one of the arrested separatist leaders, said in an interview before he was detained. "Even we were surprised by the force of it." > Muslim Kashmiris say they are tired of the daily humiliations at the hands of India's 500,000-member security force, posted in apple orchards, saffron farms and hospitals. Many say they are subjected to constant identification checks, car searches and arrests without reason by soldiers armed with assault rifles and wearing flak jackets. > A senior leader in India's government defended the curfew in Kashmir, saying that "possible militant elements could take advantage of the crowds." > "One can understand when there are reasons for people to assemble. But there is no logic for people to gather in public places without any valid reason," said Union Home Secretary Madhukar Gupta. > But the nonviolent movement in Kashmir has won over many in India's intellectual class. And in New Delhi, India's capital, public opinion on the issue of Kashmir has been mixed for the first time in decades. > Prime-time television shows have hosted debates on whether Kashmiris should be allowed to vote on their independence. A column in the Hindustan Times, titled "Think the Unthinkable," asked: "Why are we still hanging on to Kashmir if the Kashmiris don't want to have anything to do with us? The answer is machismo." > Booker Prize-winning author and social commentator Arundhati Roy has become a hero in Kashmir for demanding that the Indian government rethink its policy and calling for more international attention to the issue. > "The reaction of the people in Kashmir is actually a referendum," she said recently. "India needs freedom from Kashmir as much as Kashmir needs freedom from India." > > > > > > > _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Searching for the best deals on travel? Visit MSN Travel. http://msn.coxandkings.co.in/cnk/cnk.do From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 29 02:53:52 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 02:53:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A Poem by Faraz In-Reply-To: <590884.17218.qm@web57211.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <590884.17218.qm@web57211.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Kshmendra, Dear all, Many thanks, Kshmendra, for the posts on Ahmed Faraz's death, news of which will leave all those who love Urdu poetry with a sense of loss. Thank you also for your translation, and for the link to online editions of Faraz's poems, which I am sure will introduce the many non-Urdu speakers on this list to a sense of Faraz's work. In many parked cars all over north India, middle aged gentlemen sipping clandestine whisky alone by themselves, or with a sad companion, sometimes play the song 'Ranjish hi sahi" or 'At least let there be rancour' in a saccharine sweet rendition by Ghulam Ali, without knowing that they are listening to the words of Ahmed Faraz. To most, Faraaz is the consummate poet of male melancholia, of unrequited love and the bittersweet ironic cadences of unspoken (or unspeakable) desire, sometimes smothered by the over-the-top voices of many Indian and Pakistani Ghazal singers. I have a certain affection for this Faraz, as I do, in my own way ,for his melancholy fans. But there is also an angry, acerbic Faraz. A Faraz less likely to feature in the CD players of punjabi gentlemen as they pour themselves another large measure of Blenders Pride, or if they can get it, Scotch, before they return to loveless marriages and sleepless nights thinking about falling interest rates. And this is Faraaz the traitor, the Faraz I love. Ahmed Faraz is one of the few poets who earned himself the distinction of imprisonment under Zulfikar Ali Bhutto as well as exile under Zia ul Haq. His words spoke a trenchant opposition to every henchman that has occupied the postition of paramountcy in the sad and bleak political landscape of Pakistan. Neither Nawaz Sharif, nor Parwaiz Musharraf escaped his scathing tongue. And he returned his Hilal-e-Imtiaz, the highest civilian decoration given to Pakistanis in disgust at the excesses of Musharraf's military dictatorship. Faraz may have been loved by people all over the Urdu speaking world, but he has had his fair share of hatred from many Pakistani nationalists, and was considered by many to be a traitor, a seditionist, especially after his poem 'Pesheywar Qatilon Tum Sipahi Nahi!' spoke openly and critically of the genocide unleashed by the Pakistani Army in erstwhile East Pakistan (now Bangladesh) and massacres in Balochistan. Here is my rough, random and incorrect attempt at translation of some of the lines of this poem. The Urdu (romanized) fragment is first, the English version follows. Pesheywar Qatilon Tum Sipahi Nahi! Mein ne ab tak tumhare qaseeday likhe Aur Aaj apne naghmo se sharminda hoon ..... seena chakan-e-mashriq bhee apnay hee thay jin ka khooN mooN pay malnay kay tum aaey they ..... in kee taqdeer to kya badaltay magar in kee naslain badalnay ko tum aaey thay ..... aur marg-e-bangal kay baad bolan main shehrioN kay galay katnay aaing gay ------------------------------- You are professional killers, not soldiers for whom I had written elegies till now today I am ashamed of my poems for you ...... Those in the east, flesh of our flesh, they were ours too, whose blood you painted on your faces ....... You went to change their fortunes, and look what you did their children are the progeny of your rape ..... and after soaking in the bloodbath of Bengal you turn to slit the throats of so many in Bolan - (Bolan is a place in Balochistan) -------------------- Ahmed Faraz's direct and fearless indictment of the Pakistani Army's massacres in East Pakistan and Balochistan (Bolan is the site of a famous massacre, which was undertaken as part of the crushing of an uprising in Balochistan in the '70s) earned him the eternal wrath and ingratitude of Pakistan's ruling elite. From being the darling of PTV mushaira circuit he suddenly became yet another 'invisible intellectual' under the mind numbing years under Zia Ul Haq. In doing so, he joined the ranks of Faiz Ahmed Faiz, Eqbal Ahmed and many others, who opposed the tyrranies they saw unleashed by successive ruling elites in Pakistan with courage and forthrightness. They spoke up for the Bengalis in Pakistan when that needed to be done. When not to have spoken so would have meant being complicit in the most brutal violence, I say this, especially because there has been a lot of talk of late of how 'seditious' writers, who have spoken up for the people of Kashmir, must be dealt with in India. What is unstated in all this is how close in spirit those who want to charge writers with sedition in India are to their peers in Pakistan. However much they may hate to admit it, the hard line nationalists of India and Pakistan are like identical twins. If Pakistani nationalism had unleashed decades of brutality in the erstwhile East Pakistan and Balochistan, then Indian Nationalism too conducts its own grotesque opera of terror in Kashmir and the North East. If on one side of the border the tendency is to blame every unpleasantness on the R&AW, then on the other side of the border, the favourite suspect is the ISI. If Pakistani zealots set churches on fire in the Punjab, then Indian zealots burn churches in Orissa. If Pakistani goons massacre Hindus and Bhil tribesmen in Sindh, then Indian thugs massacre Muslims in Gujarat. if Paksitan's angry elite habitually charges writers with treason and sedition, (Faraz is not the only persecuted writer in the history of Pakistan) then Indian elites too yearn to do the same. Even my unbeliever's heart likes to hope that somewhere, in some corner of a writer's heaven, there must be a patch of 'Azad' ground reserved for those who with their words, enacted an honourable treason towards their nations in the name of the deeper and more abiding claims of an un-namable humanity. If there is indeed such a heaven, then I hope that it has welcomed Ahmed Faraz with open arms. Meanwhile, the Indian writers charged with sedition by angry patriots are earning their place in that traitors heaven with every word they write on Kashmir, next to Ahmed Faraz. I hope no one amongst them is in a hurry to get there ahead of time. We need such traitors, many more traitors, and we need them to live well and live long, for they alone can save us in India from the shame we remain complicit in, at least as long as Kashmir is held by force in our name. I hope we can all learn from the quiet and honorable sedition of Ahmed Faraz. regards, Shuddha On 28-Aug-08, at 5:25 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > In one of his Ghazals, Faraz writes: > > Jisko bhi chaa'ha, ussay shiddat se chaa'ha hai Faraz > sil'silaa too'taa nahi dard ki zanjeer ka > > My impoverished translation: > > That what I desired, I desired with ferocity > Unbroken links of pain, I ever enchained > > Pakistan has struggled since it Independence to come out of the > clutches of Military Dictatorship, that allowed it only every now > and then to flirt with Democracy. In this period Pakistan has an > impressive literary history, especially from amongst the poets in > both their writings and public demeanour, wherein they have not > only been critical and questioning of 'dictatorship' but also > revolted. Faraz is one such Poet. > > A poem (a lamentation) below by Faraz which though written for > Pakistan would be equally applicable to India. My apologies to > those for whom Urdu is alien. It is beyond my capability to > translate it > > Kshmendra > > ab kis kaa jashn manaate ho us des kaa jo taqsiim huaa > ab kis ke giit sunaate ho us tan-man kaa jo do-niim huaa > > > us Khvaab kaa jo rezaa rezaa un aa.Nkho.n kii taqadiir huaa > us naam kaa jo Tuka.Daa Tuka.Daa galiyo.n me.n be-tauqiir huaa > > > us parcham kaa jis kii hurmat baazaaro.n me.n niilaam hu_ii > us miTTii kaa jis kii hurmat mansuub uduu ke naam hu_ii > > > us jang ko jo tum haar chuke us rasm kaa jo jaarii bhii nahii.n > us zaKhm kaa jo siine pe na thaa us jaan kaa jo vaarii bhii nahii.n > > > us Khuun kaa jo bad_qismat thaa raaho.n me.n bahaayaa tan me.n rahaa > us phuul kaa jo beqiimat thaa aa.Ngan me.n khilaa yaa ban me.n rahaa > > > us mashriq kaa jis ko tum ne neze kii anii marham samajhaa > us maGarib kaa jis ko tum ne jitana bhii luuTaa kam samajhaa > > > un maasuumo.n kaa jin ke lahuu se tum ne farozaa.N raate.n kii.n > yaa un mazaluumo.n kaa jis se Khanjar kii zubaa.N me.n baate.n kii.n > > > us mariyam kaa jis kii iffat luTatii hai bhare baazaaro.n me.n > us iisaa kaa jo qaatil hai aur shaamil hai Gam_Khvaaro.n me.n > > > in nauhaagaro.n kaa jin ne hame.n Khud qatl kiyaa Khud rote hai.n > aise bhii kahii.n dam_saaz hue aise jallaad bhii hote hai.n > > > un bhuuke nange Dhaa.Ncho.n kaa jo raqs sar-e-baazaar kare.n > yaa un zaalim qazzaaqo.n kaa jo bhes badal kar vaar kare.n > > > yaa un JhuuTe iqaraaro.n kaa jo aaj talak aifaa na hue > yaa un bebas laachaaro.n kaa jo aur bhii dukh kaa nishaanaa hue > > > is shaahii kaa jo dast-ba-dast aa_ii hai tumhaare hisse me.n > kyo.n nang-e-vatan kii baat karo kyaa rakhaa hai is qisse me.n > > > aa.Nkho.n me.n chhupaaye ashko.n ko ho.nTho.n me.n vafaa ke bol liye > is jashn me.n bhii shaamil huu.N nauho.n se bharaa kashkol liye > > > Reproduced from the most brilliant web-resource for Romanized Urdu > Poetry - Urdupoetry.com http://www.urdupoetry.com/faraz42.html > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From rahul_capri at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 05:15:07 2008 From: rahul_capri at yahoo.com (Rahul Asthana) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 16:45:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir In-Reply-To: <145259.50174.qm@web57209.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <800383.38635.qm@web53605.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I am tempted to toss a poser on the list.What kind of ethical framework is,or should be, more in congruence with the liberal line of thinking -teleological or deontological? http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/phil/blfaq_phileth_sys.htm P.S. I am fully well aware of the open ended nature of the question,but I think,trying to derive some kind of formalism from Kesavan's advice to liberals may churn up some interesting ideas. --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > From: Kshmendra Kaul > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir > To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" > Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:18 PM > Most certainly (in my opinion) a fairly and sensibly laid > out set of arguments on this issue. > > Kshmendra > > --- On Thu, 8/28/08, S. Jabbar > wrote: > > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir > To: "Sarai" > Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:00 PM > > From the Telegraph, Calcutta > > THE TROUBLE WITH EDEN > - Kashmir offers a choice between two compromised ideals > Mukul Kesavan > > I¹ve never been to Kashmir. I nearly went in 1987 to > Srinagar; there¹s a > guesthouse there that used to be owned by Grindlays Bank, > where I was meant > to stay, but then the troubles began and I stayed home. The > closest I came > to living in Kashmir was living in Kashmiri Gate, a > neighbourhood in north > Delhi where the walled city ended and the Civil Lines > began. There¹s a > cinema hall there called the Ritz, where, in the early > Sixties, I saw > visions of Kashmir in films like Kashmir Ki Kali. Those > were the years when > Bombay cinema specialized in houseboat and hill-station > idylls and in these > films Kashmir often stood in for Eden. > > Delhi was a Jan Sangh city then; Atal Bihari Vajpayee was a > promising local > politician. Growing up in Kashmiri Gate, I wasn¹t > especially political but I > knew that Jan Sanghis blamed Nehru for Kashmir¹s disputed > status. If he > hadn¹t agreed to a plebiscite, or if he had allowed > Indians from outside > Kashmir to settle there, or if he hadn¹t made the fatal > mistake of Article > 370, which gave Jammu and Kashmir a special status within > the Union, if he > hadn¹t indulged Sheikh Abdullah if he hadn¹t done all of > this, we wouldn¹t > be wrestling with secessionism and sedition in Kashmir. > > For most of us who, like me, have no first-hand experience > of Kashmir, the > troubles in the Valley are, for the most part, a series of > off-stage noises. > Our governors, or more precisely, our proconsuls, sometimes > become famous > for making bad things worse, wars and skirmishes emblazon > names like Kargil > on our collective consciousness, newsworthy violence like > the purging of > Kashmiri Pandits from the valley or the brutalization of > Kashmiri Muslims by > the security forces surfaces in the newspapers and news > channels, and then > there are long periods of absent-mindedness when Kashmir > disappears and > these are the times when it¹s deemed to be calm or inching > towards normalcy. > Wise men, in these interludes, talk on television about > commerce being the > key to peace. Tourism¹s up, they say hopefully. Then the > valley erupts and > half-forgotten names like Hurriyat and Malik and Geelani > and Farooq flicker > in our heads. > > This latest eruption, though, has provoked a set of unusual > reactions. The > enormous popular mobilization in the Valley after General > Sinha, our last > governor, stirred the pot by allotting a large plot of land > to the Amarnath > Shrine Board, and after the security forces, predictably > enough, killed > Kashmiri Muslims in the demonstrations that followed, has > prompted > mainstream journalists like Vir Sanghvi and Swaminathan > Aiyar to write > opinion pieces arguing that India should seriously consider > letting Kashmir > go. Arundhati Roy, who was present at the enormous rally, > made the same > point more forcefully, arguing that the pro-Pakistan > slogans or the > distinctly Islamic idiom of the azadi vanguard, ought not > to distract us > from the fact that India has no right to hold the Valley¹s > Muslims against > their will. The routes by which these writers came to their > conclusions are > different, but the conclusion is the same: that the time > has come to think > the unthinkable: an azad Kashmir, or even the prospect of > Kashmir becoming > part of Pakistan. > > Are they right? Should Indian liberals and democrats > endorse > self-determination for Kashmir? Or is it possible to hold > another position: > can a liberal oppose azadi in Kashmir in good faith? One > way of exploring > this is to make dhobi lists of the pros and cons of > Kashmiri > self-determination. > > The case for self-determination is contained in the term > itself. If we > accept that the two hundred thousand Kashmiris who came out > to protest > against Indian rule, to shout for liberty, to invoke the > ideal of an Islamic > state, to press the case for union with Pakistan, are > representative of > Kashmir¹s Muslim population, then pressing India¹s claim > to Kashmir with > guns and bayonets is a violent negation of their collective > will. It¹s hard > for a liberal or a democrat to defend that position. No > matter how violently > you disagree with their ideas, or how convinced you are of > Pakistani > mischief and instigation, given the violence the Indian > state has inflicted > on Kashmiris, it¹s hard to argue that India is entitled to > the benefit of > the doubt. Kashmiri alienation is now of such long standing > and the Indian > state¹s interventions in Kashmir have been characterized > by such > unscrupulousness and such ruthless violence that touting > India¹s virtues as > a secular, democratic state, which Kashmiris should be glad > to be part of, > feels like a sick joke. > > But there is a case against self-determination which needs > to be made, if > only to clarify the consequence of endorsing > self-determination. > Self-determination isn¹t in itself virtuous. The Tamils in > Sri Lanka, led by > Velupillai Prabhakaran have been fighting a civil war for > decades to achieve > a separate state, Tamil Eelam. Tamils have suffered > violence at the hands of > Sinhala chauvinists and discrimination from the Sri Lankan > state, which, in > the Sixties, defined itself as a hegemonically Buddhist, > Sinhalese entity. I > knowof very few people outside of Prabhakaran¹s followers > who want such a > state to come into being. This is partly because > Prabhakaran is an > old-fashioned totalitarian leader and partly because a > tiny, Tamil-majority > statelet on a small island doesn¹t feel like a rousing > cause. > > Sri Lanka aside, we¹ve witnessed the hideously violent > unravelling of > Yugoslavia in the name of self-determination. We¹ve seen > the idea of > self-determination taken to its absurd extreme in the > elevation of Kosovo > and Ossetia, tiny enclaves, barely a million strong, into > nations on the > ground of ethnic or religious difference. So perhaps, as > liberals, we¹re > entitled to ask of movements of self-determination, what > sort of state they > aspire to. If self-determination in Kashmir is meant to > create a > majoritarian state on the basis of ethnicity or faith (and > Arundhati Roy, in > her essay, is clear that the tableau of azadi that she > witnessed was > substantially shaped by Islamic ideas and bound by a sense > of Muslim > identity), an Indian liberal might still prefer azadi > because he thinks > chronic, quasi-colonial state violence is worse, but at > least he would > acknowledge that his was a counsel of despair rather an > endorsement of a > freedom struggle. > > That same liberal might argue that the expulsion of the > Pandits and the > violence against them shouldn¹t be accepted as an alibi > for holding on to > Kashmir, but he would be forced to acknowledge that > Kashmiri nationalism in > this Muslim variant seeks to draw a border around an > ethnically cleansed > people. > > Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he > thinks the Indian > republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in democratic > pluralism, that > the Indian national movement and the nation-state it > created, tried, in an > unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea > of diversity, > not homogeneity. It¹s worth mentioning here that the > Indian state has never > attempted to change the demographic realities in the Valley > in the way in > which Israel and China have in Palestine and Tibet. The > loss of Kashmir, the > only Muslim-majority state in the Union, would be a) a > massive setback to > this pluralist project, and b) a gift to Hindu chauvinists > who would cite > Kashmiri secession as yet another proof of the > impossibility of integrating > Muslims into a non-Muslim state. > > To sum up then, the Indian liberal has two options. He can > support azadi in > Kashmir because it is the lesser evil, knowing that azadi > will almost > certainly mean either a sectarian Muslim statelet or more > territory for a > larger sectarian state, Pakistan. Or he can endorse the > Indian occupation > because, in the larger scheme of things, Kashmiri Muslim > suffering is > collateral damage, the price that must be paid for the > greater good of a > pluralist India. Put like that, there¹s no shimmering > cause to lift our > liberal¹s spirits, just a choice between two squalid, > compromised ideals. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 08:23:39 2008 From: b_a_r_u_k at yahoo.com (Baruk S. Jacob) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 19:53:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] A Poem by Faraz In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <527402.54500.qm@web54204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> dear shuddha, as one of those who is urdu illiterate, thanks for this post. do you know if there are transalated/romanised books of this more political work? > We need such traitors, many more traitors, and we need them to live > well and live long, for they alone can save us in India ~ i tend to agree with this in a general sense-the idea that we need critics, 'sedition'(ists) and 'traitors' to constantly remind us of injustice, to make us think, and, hopefully, make us do something about it. > from the shame we remain complicit in, at least as long as Kashmir > is held by force in our name. ~a question, though, that has been asked before on this group. is it possible to reach a kashmir solution without the inclusion of the hindus/pandits who were driven out? isn't there injustice there too? > I hope we can all learn from the quiet and honorable sedition of > Ahmed Faraz. ~ :) if only. ah well. From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 10:05:47 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 10:05:47 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Pankaj Mishra on Kashmir in the New York Times In-Reply-To: <910B4A1F-4355-4661-B1B3-78E57E30F00D@gmail.com> References: <910B4A1F-4355-4661-B1B3-78E57E30F00D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808282135i54a2e87epd4dcd5ea407fb98@mail.gmail.com> Pankaj Mishra knows Kashmir as much about Kashmir as Shivam Vij does. On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > A Jihad Grows in Kashmir > > by Pankaj Mishra, > > The New York Times, 27th August, 2008 > > http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/27/opinion/27mishra.html?_r=1&oref=slogin > > > FOR more than a week now, hundreds of thousands of Muslims have > filled the streets of Srinagar, the capital of Indian-ruled Kashmir, > shouting "azadi" (freedom) and raising the green flag of Islam. These > demonstrations, the largest in nearly two decades, remind many of us > why in 2000 President Bill Clinton described Kashmir, the Himalayan > region claimed by both India and Pakistan, as "the most dangerous > place on earth." > > Mr. Clinton sounded a bit hyperbolic back then. Dangerous, you wanted > to ask, to whom? Though more than a decade old, the anti-Indian > insurgency in Kashmir, which Pakistan's rogue intelligence agency had > infiltrated with jihadi terrorists, was not much known outside South > Asia. But then the Clinton administration had found itself compelled > to intervene in 1999 when India and Pakistan fought a limited but > brutal war near the so-called line of control that divides Indian > Kashmir from the Pakistani-held portion of the formerly independent > state. Pakistan's withdrawal of its soldiers from high peaks in > Indian Kashmir set off the series of destabilizing events that > culminated in Pervez Musharraf assuming power in a military coup. > > After 9/11, Mr. Musharraf quickly became the Bush administration's > ally. Seen through the fog of the "war on terror" and the Indian > government's own cynical propaganda, the problem in Kashmir seemed > entirely to do with jihadist terrorists. President Musharraf could > even claim credit for fighting extremism by reducing his intelligence > service's commitment to jihad in Kashmir — indeed, he did help bring > down the level of violence, which has claimed an estimated 80,000 lives. > > Since then Pakistan has developed its own troubles with Muslim > extremists. Conventional wisdom now has Pakistan down as the most > dangerous place on earth. Meanwhile, India is usually tagged as a > "rising superpower" or "capitalist success story" — clichés so > pervasive that they persuaded even so shrewd an observer as Fareed > Zakaria to claim in his new book "The Post-American World" that India > since 1997 has been "stable, peaceful and prosperous." > > It is true that India's relations with Pakistan have improved lately. > But more than half a million Indian soldiers still pursue a few > thousand insurgents in Kashmir. While periodically holding bilateral > talks with Pakistan, India has taken for granted those most affected > by the so-called Kashmir dispute: the four million Kashmiri Muslims > who suffer every day the misery and degradation of a full-fledged > military occupation. > > The Indian government's insistence that peace is spreading in Kashmir > is at odds with a report by Human Rights Watch in 2006 that described > a steady pattern of arbitrary arrest, torture and extrajudicial > execution by Indian security forces — excesses that make the events > at Abu Ghraib seem like a case of high spirits. A survey by Doctors > Without Borders in 2005 found that Muslim women in Kashmir, prey to > the Indian troops and paramilitaries, suffered some of the most > pervasive sexual violence in the world. > > Over the last two decades, most ordinary Kashmiri Muslims have > wavered between active insurrection and sullen rage. They fear, > justifiably or not, the possibility of Israeli-style settlements by > Hindus; reports two months ago of a government move to grant 92 acres > of Kashmiri land to a Hindu religious group are what provoked the > younger generation into the public defiance expressed of late. > > As always, the turmoil in Kashmir heartens extremists in both India > and Pakistan. India has recently suffered a series of terrorist > bombings, allegedly by radicals among its Muslim minority. Hindu > nationalists have already formed an economic blockade of the Kashmir > Valley — an attempt to punish seditious Muslims and to gin up votes > in next year's general elections. In Pakistan, where weak civilian > governments in the past sought to score populist points by stirring > up the emotional issue of Kashmir, the intelligence service can only > be gratified by another opportunity to synergize its jihads in > Kashmir and Afghanistan. > > What of the Kashmiris themselves, who have repeatedly found > themselves reduced to pawns in the geopolitical games and domestic > politics of their neighbors? In 1989 and '90, when few Kashmiris had > heard of Osama bin Laden, hundreds of thousands of Muslims buoyed by > popular revolutions in Eastern Europe regularly petitioned the United > Nations office in Srinagar, hoping to raise the world's sympathy for > their cause. Indian troops responded by firing into many of these > largely peaceful demonstrations, killing hundreds of people and > provoking many young Kashmiris to take to arms and embrace radical > Islam. > > A new generation of politicized Kashmiris has now risen; the world is > again likely to ignore them — until some of them turn into terrorists > with Qaeda links. It is up to the Indian government to reckon > honestly with Kashmiri aspirations for a life without constant fear > and humiliation. Some first steps are obvious: to severely cut the > numbers of troops in Kashmir; to lift the economic blockade on the > Kashmir Valley; and to allow Kashmiris to trade freely across the > line of control with Pakistan. > > India's record of pitiless intransigence does not inspire much hope > that it will take these necessary steps toward the final and > comprehensive resolution of Kashmir's long-disputed status. In fact, > an indefinite curfew has already been imposed and Indian troops have > again killed dozens of demonstrators. But a brutal suppression of the > nonviolent protests will continue to radicalize a new generation of > Muslims and engender a fresh cycle of violence, rendering Kashmir > even more dangerous — and not just to South Asia this time. > > Pankaj Mishra is the author, most recently, of "Temptations of the > West: How to Be Modern in India, Pakistan, Tibet and Beyond." > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > shuddha at gmail.com > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 11:11:31 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 11:11:31 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] =?iso-8859-1?q?=8C_STATE_KA_ORDER_HAI_=B9_-_A_Repor?= =?iso-8859-1?q?t_by_Shabnam_Hashmi_on_the_incidents_of_July_3-4=2C2008_in?= =?iso-8859-1?q?_Indore?= In-Reply-To: <213a168d0808282114x4bb2bc22vf57d6b93c06a509e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: 'STATE KA ORDER HAI' A Report by Shabnam Hashmi An Independent Fact Finding Team visited Indore on August 5, 2008 to inquire into the incidents of July 3-4, 2008 and its long term affect The Team comprised of: Dr Syeda Hameed: Member, Planning Commission, Govt of India Shabnam Hashmi: Member, National Integration Council, MHA, Social Activist The following account is compiled and written by Shabnam Hashmi on the basis on the one day visit, testimonies of the close relatives of those who died , testimonies of the injured and individual and group discussions with the local human right activists, and an analysis of the media reports of the above period which were submitted to the IFFT. Dr Syeda Hameed as member of the Planning Commission will be looking at the long term affect of these incidents. The present account deals with the findings and recommendations. The team visited the following areas: Juna Risala Sindhi Colony Khajrana Khajrana Village The following victims / relatives of the victims deposed before the team: Juna Risala 1. Nazneen- mother of the deceased Mohd Rizwan 2. Abdur Rehman- Advocate and uncle of the deceased Mohd Rizwan 3. Salman Ahmed- 18 yrs, B Com Final- Bullet Injury 4. Gulam Ahmed Khan- locality leader 5. Irshad Khan-19 yrs, bullet Injury 6. Gulrez-19 yrs- bullet injury 7. Rafik s/o victim Alla Baksh ­ injured- bullet injury 8. Faiz-17 yrs-s/o victim-Aijazul Hasan, bullet injury 9. Nizamuddin, Father of the deceased Zeeshan 10. Salma Parveen, Mother of the deceased Zeeshan 11. Mohd Hanif Pyare Mian employer of the deceased Zeeshanal 12. Members of the local community ( approx 40 people) Sindhi Colony 1. Khattumal Makhija father of the deceased Hem Chand Makhija 2. Sheela Devi Makhija mother of the deceased Hem Chand Makhija 3. Shanker Tejwani friend of the deceased Hem Chand Makhija Khajrana 1. Mehrunnisa mother of the deceased Imran- 17 yrs 2. Abdul Rafiq father of the deceased 3. Zaibunnisa- grand mother of the deceased Imran 4. Members of the local community ( approx 10 people) Khajrana Village 1. Nana Patel father of the deceased Anwar Patel- 19 yrs 2. Mohd Imtiaz brother of Mehmood 3. Rasheeda, Wife of Mehmood 4. Shama Bi, Mother of Mehmood 5. Members of the local community ( approx 50 people) The team met the following officials: District Magistrate Superintendent of Police Additional District Magistrate I am writing the account of what we saw and heard. One day is neither enough to understand and grasp the intensity of any communal attack nor to share the grief of the victims. The background of the Amarnath dispute has been contributed in the report by Dr Ram Puniyani. Background Amarnath yatra has been one of the major religious tourism activities of the J & K state, well managed by the local population, mainly Muslims of the area, till 2001 when Shri Amranath Shrine Board (SASB) was formed and it took over the arrangements of the pilgrimage. SASB had Governor of the state as the chief and Governor's Principal Secretary as the Chief Executive Officer (CEO). Gradually the SASB started asserting beyond its mandate, e.g. going on to construct shelters and structures on Pehalgam Golf Course, mainly due to the clout of the Governor who headed this body. In 2005 SASB, contrary to the laws, was granted the permission to use the forest land for the tourists. Incidentally, CEO's wife was the forest officer who cleared this highly illegal demand of the shrine board. This started the process, which ultimately went out of hands of the local government. While Government initially opposed the order of the forest department, the high court stayed Government's decision. Following this the state Govt. transferred the land to SASB and then cancelled it. BJP and VHP gave a nation wide call to observe Bharat Bandh on July 3, 2008 on the Amarnath land transfer issue. July 3 & 4, 2008-Incidents in Indore Indore is the largest city of Madhya Pradesh . It is situated on the Malwa Plateau , just south of the Satpura Range . It is the commercial centre of Madhya Pradesh. Indore was engulfed in violence for several days after the BJP & VHP gave a call for a Bharat Bandh. What Indore witnessed was well orchestrated mayhem planned by the Sangh against the minority community with the full connivance of the state administration. RSS and various Sangh organizations under its umbrella have been vitiating the atmosphere of the city for several years. Though the city has a long history of co-existence of various communities and a rich syncretic culture, the systematic communalization of the society has been underway especially since the BJP came to power in the state in 2003. The pattern of the violence that took place in Indore on July 3 & 4, 2008 clearly reminds us of the systematic planning of the Sangh to eliminate and marginalize the Muslim community on the pattern of the Gujarat carnage of 2002, the only difference being of the scale and the provision of the relief after the attacks. The SP and the Collector visited the Indore RSS office on July 2nd evening as well as on July 3, 2008 morning. Even before July 3, 2008 Bharat Bandh, the Sangh members raised highly abusive and provocative slogans in front of some mosques. In Mukeripura and Malwah Mill area slogan shouting was done at the prayer time. Processions with naked swords were also taken out on July 2 in minority areas. The collector and SP both new to the area , they had joined a month earlier, said in an interview that they did not expect the kind of violence that took place on July 3, 2008. The question is were the incidents of July 2 not an indication enough or did they visit the RSS office to take a brief? On July 3rd, 2008 in Khajrana colony some small tea shops owned by Muslims were open. About 25 people from the Sangh went there and asked them to shut the shops. The crowd vandalised the shops and beat up the shop owners. They raised highly provocative slogans .A scuffle took place and the attackers also got hurt in that. They returned to the Patidar mohalla and called out to people and a mob collected. They started pelting stones and slowly stone pelting started from both the sides. Police arrived on the scene and threw tear gas shells. The mob retreated towards the Ganpati Mandir. Between 11 and 11.30 the VHP and Bajrang Dal members started attacking any Muslim that came on the road with hockey sticks. The Muslims for going anywhere have to use this way as there is no other road to go out. Any Muslim that came on the road was surrounded and brutally beaten up, after checking their identity if it was not too obvious. Approximately 50 Muslims including children , women and old were beaten up and injured. The injured covered with blood started coming towards the village mosque. Police did not take any steps to stop the beatings and humiliation of the Muslims. The Muslims went to the police station to ask for help but the Police did not respond. VHP and other supporters were there in large number. Stone pelting started from both the sides. Soon firing started resulting in three deaths (all Muslims) and 19 injured (all Muslims). As the fact finding team drove towards the Khajrana village we were shocked to see a house which had more than 20 bullet holes. It is a clearly one sided attack since all deaths and majority of the injured are from the minority community. The police had not arrested anyone when we visited the place. We asked the SP and the Collector how many licenses for the firearms have been issued in the recent past. They decided not to reply to the questions. According to our enquiries more than 2,000 licenses have been issued in the last two years and one hardly need to guess who the beneficiaries would be. Almost simultaneously the VHP, Bajrang Dal and other goons entered various Muslim dominated areas (Badwali Chowk, Ranipura, Lodhipura, Mukeripura, Narsinghbazar, and Khajrana) shouting provocative slogans, misbehaving with local residents. The police stood and watched. All shops belonging to the Muslims were attacked. Medical shops belonging to Muslims were attacked. Bengali speaking Muslims were especially targeted. Violence that erupted on July 3, 2008 took the lives of four people. Imran ( 17yrs) killed by the Police in front of Khajrana Thana, Anwar Patel, Mehmood and Sharif Patel all from the Khajrana village. Anwar was 19 years, worked as a help in Fatima Patel's clinic. He was hanging the clinic's washed linen when the bullet hit him. Nemichand Patidar an active member of the BJP shot him. The bullet pierced through his body, entering near the eye and coming out near the stomach. FIR was lodged by his father Nana Patel. He is an eye witness to the killing of his son. No arrests have been made. Mehmood was near the spot where Muslims had started coming in after being beaten up by the VHP goons. He got up on a building to see what was happening. Stone pelting was going on. Santosh Patidar's bullets hit him according to an eye witness. 9 bullets had pierced his body. Police took him to a hospital. His Medico Legal Report or the Post Mortem report was not given to the family. FIR was lodged. No arrests have taken place. Had it been a reverse case we can imagine the number of people who have been arrested. We met Mehmood's wife and mother who were inconsolable. Mehmood's small son and four daughters face a bleak future as he was the only bread earner of the family. Hem Chand Makhija, 25 yrs, was a commission agent in the anaaj mandi (wheat market). He lived in Sindhi Colony with his parents, wife and a brother. He was playing cricket when his friends ( Shankar Tejwani-30 yrs and others) came and called him to go with them and join the VHP Bandh Procession. They parked their car at Lodhipura and joined the procession in Mukeripura. The place is about 5 kilometers from the Sindhi colony where he lived. The processionists were shouting slogans: Go back to Pakistan. Stone pelting started. Police threw tear gas shells. When the tear gas shells were thrown according to Shankar Tejwani they ran towards Laxman Singh Gaur's house as that was the place they knew well. Incidentally Lakshman Singh Gaur was the BJP minister till last year when he died in a road accident. In the melee the friends got separated. After sometime when Shankar Tejwani started looking for Hem Chand, he saw someone bringing him on a cartwheel. According to him and Khattu Mal Makhija, Khem Chand's father, he died of a bullet injury. The family has not seen the Post Mortem report. We could not find any eye witness. Funeral procession of a young boy Imran (17 yrs), who was dragged and killed outside Khajrana Thana by a policeman ( Shailendra) by placing his barrel of the gun in his mouth ,was lathi charged, even though the family had curfew passes for 25 people. Police prevented 'Namaz-e-janaza' on the pretext that women threw stones at them. They lathi charged and used teargas. The father of the boy Abdul Rafiq was badly beaten up by the police when he was carrying his dead son to the kabristan. When we pointed it out to the SP and the Collector that the policeman who murdered Imran in broad daylight has not been suspended or arrested, they replied that the woman (Imran's mother-Mehrunissa) was arrested in drug peddling that is why she is naming him. Her being arrested for drugs peddling does not change the fact that her 17 year old son was killed in broad daylight. The 11 year old younger brother Shahrukh is an eye witness to the murder. The family had not been able to get a Post Mortem report till the day we visited them. It is also very important to narrate here that the 500 meter walk from our car to Mehrunissa's house was so filthy we could barely walk with our sandles continuously slipping on the mud and filth and when we returned after spending about 40 minutes our feet looked as if we have been working in open muddy fields for days. We asked the collector what happens to the development money and why it never finds its way to the colonies where minorities live. We were told that the road is in the pipeline but when it will be built is a big question. I was reminded about the rehabilitation colonies where 5000 internally displaced families live in Gujarat. They have not been able to return back to their villages even after 6 years of the Gujarat carnage 2002. Only after a long struggle by the Antarik Visthapit Hak Rakshak Samiti and several rounds of meetings that we held with the NHRC, NMC and other agencies the Principle Secretary, Gujarat was sent a notice by the NHRC to improve the living conditions of the colonies. Despite the mindless violence that took place on July 3rd and took many innocent lives, the district administration was not prepared to put an end to it. Many parts of Indore witnessed fresh violence and killings on July 4, 2008. The areas of Mukeripura, Khajrana, Badwali Chowk, Lodhipura, Mukeripura, Narsinghbazar, and Khajrana were put under curfew after the July 3 violence. In Juna Risala the policemen themselves resorted to firing. Not all of them in police uniforms. Many in plain clothes and off duty joined the firing. According to local people RAF helped the bandh supporters. Every group of bandh supporters was armed and escorted by the police. A group of people were returning home after the namaz around 2-2.30pm. There was stone pelting going on near the mosque. There has been a long pending property dispute near the jinsik chauraha. According to local people the situation was not such that the police had to open fire. 8 people got hit by the bullets. Two died and the rest were injured. Majority of the injuries are in the upper part of the body contrary to any norms of crowd dispersal and management. Even if there was a huge crowd, which according to all the people whom we spoke to was not there, police could have first used the tear gas, then rubber bullets, fire in air, fire first on the legs. Many people named the constables Yashwant, Neeraj and Jitendra who fired indiscriminately on innocent boys and others killing two and injuring 6. Someone screamed at one of the constables who were firing indiscriminately at people: Why are you shooting at innocent people? The constable replied: State Ka Order Hai. The injured when taken to the hospitals by the local community were surrounded in one hospital by the Bandh supporters who did not let the hospital treat any Muslim patient. There were also complaints about some doctors giving out dated medicines and injections to the patients in a government hospital. It reminded me of the VHP leaflet which was given to me in 1994 by a senior politician. The leaflet had instructions for the doctors in detail on similar lines. At that time we firmly believed that a doctor cannot do it. But we have seen both in Gujarat and now in Indore that the communal thought has seeped into some of the professionals even in this noble profession. Mohd Rizwan, 22yrs, s/o Abdul Rahman died of a bullet injury. We met his mother, grandmother and his uncle- Abdur Rehman. His mother and grandmother were inconsolable. Zeeshan, 18 yrs also died. Zeeshan worked with Mohd Hanif Pyare Mian who has an electric shop. Zeeshan was one of Pyare Mian's finest pupils and was very hard working. A number of people who had crowded into Zeeshan's small house echoed the same fact that the police firing was absolutely uncalled for. The situation was not such that it could force the police to fire. Gulam Ahmed Khan, one of the residents of Juna Risala responded to the crises and carried many patients to the hospital on a motorcycle one by one. He reached Rajshree hospital with a patient and before the doctors could tend to the patient he was surrounded by about 20 Bajrang Dal members. They shouted: No Muslim patient will be treated here. Swarup Gaur and Harsh Gaur were among the crowd of attackers. They were armed with lathis and some with even swords. Gulam Ahmed Khan thought for a moment that his end has come but the uproar attracted local Marathi women, who came and fought with the Bajrangis and rescued Gulam Ahmed Khan and the patient. They asked Gulam Ahmed Khan to go to another hospital as they could not guarantee his safety. Gulam rescued many patients and transported them to the nearby hospitals. His kirana shop remained closed for over 20 days as he had no time to sit there. Gulam narrated to us that people from different communities have lived together in Juna Risala. They actively participate in each other's functions and on daily basis to. The two communities have close ties and this is something which is unacceptable to the Sangh outfits. Gulam registered an FIR against the three constables who fired at people. They have not been arrested nor suspended, though a SDM level enquiry has been orderd. State has filed an FIR against Gulam & others under sections 147/ 148/ 149/ 307 and 353. >From our experience of other states and the last 10 years trends we have seen that places where people from various communities visit like the dargahs, colonies where they live together in harmony are especially targeted by the Sangh and now more and more supported by the local police as was evident in Juna Risala. During the Gujarat carnage of 2002 hundreds of dargahs were demolished including those of the famous urdu poet Wali Gujarati and even Ustad Fayaz khan's mazar in Vadodara was vandalised. RSS's latest attack is on Sufis and Sufism. They came out with a big article in their mouth peace Organiser a few months ago attacking the whole Sufi tradition. The Sangh's intentions are very clear; do not leave any space where people can interact with each other. The segregation and ghettoisation breeds fear against the 'other' and it becomes much easier to spread myths and demonize a whole community. Faiz is a young 17 year old boy with innocent eyes and a childish face. He has science subjects and studies in 12th. The marks will decide his future. With cut off percentages of colleges crossing all limits during the past few years no student can afford to loose even a few days in the present time and day. Fiaz has not attended school for over a month. Aijazul Hasan (age 44) was shot at from close range. The bullet hit his stomach. The intestine has been damaged. He already had two operations and will undergo another surgery after a month. Aijazul who is an auto dealer has not been able to open his shop for over a month. Constable Yashwant shouted- Neeraj I will pull the trigger first. Neeraj replied: No let Jitendra do it. His aim is very good. His aim was an 18 year old young B Com final student of Christian Eminent College. Salman Ahmed was returning after saying his prayers around 2.30pm. He heard a commotion and when he looked back he saw 3-4 policemen come out of chauthi paltan and fire. One bullet hit him. According to the community members all the three constables have a history of misbehaviour with the local residents as well as communal attitude. Rafik (22yrs) s/o Alla Baksh was injured in firing. He was hit at the thigh joint and had to undergo an operation. Gulrez (19yrs) - an air condition repair worker got the bullet from the back. He saw policemen in plain clothes firing. According to the locals they even used private fire arms. They had hid themselves behind the bushes and they bent on their knees and took aim at the people returning from the mosque. Incidents were also related which were very encouraging. While the three policemen mentioned earlier shot, killed and injured people there was constable Avasthi who helped Gulam in taking the patients to the hospital on his motorcycle. From the local neighbourhood a number of people from the Hindu community helped and participated in the funeral of the young boys who were killed. Haroon Bhai, the owner of Mayur Hospital, offered his free services to all those, who were injured in the riot. According to local Human Rights activist Vineet Tiwari, Haroon told them that total 27 injured were admitted officially in Mayur Hospital, during that period. Out of these 24 cases were of gunshots. All 27 were Muslims. One person, who was the driver of Sub Divisional Magistrate (SDM), felt uneasy and restless, so he was sent to the hospital. He was on Glucose drip. After July 3rd , 2008 incidents some areas, as already mentioned above, were put under curfew After the large scale violence on July 4, 2008 the whole city was put under curfew. While the whole city including Narsinghbazar was under curfew, the mohalla Chatripura literally next door was witnessing a religious procession. The administration allowed a Rath Yatra of the Venkatesh Mandir. 3000 strong procession was allowed to go through those very lanes and roads which had witnessed mayhem a day before. Sumitra Mahajan, BJP MP from Indore and MLA Mahendra Hardia participated in the procession. Sumitra Mahajan danced Garba in front of the Rath in the lanes which were soaked in the blood of the minority community. Findings: 1. The violence that took place in Indore on July 3 & 4, 2008 was pre planned as part of the Sangh's larger agenda of reducing the minority community as second class citizens and to break the economic backbone s well as humiliate the community. 2. The RSS played an active role in planning the simultaneous attacks in various localities. 3. The police provided cover to the Sangh attackers during the attacks on the minority community. 4. The police broke all norms of crowd dispersal and management by opening fire on people in Juna Risala. 5. The administration has played a biased role in not arresting the culprits. 6. The state apparatus is threatening those community leaders who have stood up against the injustice by trying to put the charges on them that they are associated with SIMI. 7. Linking innocent people with SIMI is used as a weapon by the police to frighten the minority community. 8. Those police personnel who want to work objectively are under tremendous pressure from the RSS and the BJP politicians. 9. Relief in most cases has been given. The rehabilitation process in under way. Recommendations: 1. An immediate enquiry by the sitting Chief Justice of the High Court into the incidents of July 3& 4, 2008 in Indore. 2. Suspension of the police officers involved in firing in Juna Risala. 3. Sensitisation workshops of the police personnel on issues surrounding communalism, democracy, Indian constitution. 4. Action against the local RSS head, MP and local MLA for masterminding the violence. 5. Identify doctors who gave expired medicines and injections to the Muslim patients and immediately start criminal proceedings against them. 6. Rehabilitation package to include education of the dependent children of the deceased. ------ End of Forwarded Message From asitredsalute at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 11:12:49 2008 From: asitredsalute at gmail.com (Asit asitreds) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 11:12:49 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Resolution on US assistant secretary of state Boucher's visit to JNU Message-ID: *Resolution on Richard Boucher's visit to JNU* * * This conference against imperialism fully supports, congratulates and expresses solidarity with the left and democratic students organizations of JNU and the JNU student's union for opposing the visit of Richard Boucher, assistant secretary of the State department of USA. Mr Boucher was scheduled to visit school of International Studies, JNU. It is needless to say that Richard Boucher's visit is intended to justify and legitimize the imperialist nuclear deal thus reinforcing and intensifying the stranglehold of world imperialism led by USA over India and South Asia. Indian Social Institute New Delhi August 26, 2008 From asitredsalute at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 11:15:25 2008 From: asitredsalute at gmail.com (Asit asitreds) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 11:15:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Invitation Message-ID: *'Perspectives on Ecological Swaraj'* An Invitation for Programme on 30th and 31st August 2008 *Venue: Gandhi Peace Foundation, * *223 D.D.U Marg, New Delhi* * * *Saturday, August 30th, (5 pm to 7:30 pm)*: A talk by Savyasaachi*, *Dept. of Sociology, Jamia Milia Islamia, University, on *"Notions of Forests"* Prof. Savyasaachi has vast experience in working with Tribal communities in Ghatia. Kautiakhand (Phoolbani, Orissa), Abhuj Maria (Bastar) *Sunday, August 31st, (10:00 am to 5:00 pm): * *"Mining-Special Economic Zones and People"* *Speakers : * *Sebastian Rodrigues: *Presentation on processes and impacts of open cast mining in Goa & Insights into ongoing movements against SEZs in Goa. * * * * *Aseem Srivastava: *SEZs as a Political Model for the Future. ** * * *Manshi Asher: *Politics of land acquisition for SEZs * * *Mamata Dash: *The Politics Of Market And States' Corporate Agenda With Respect To Bauxite Reserves In Orissa. * * *VK Sridhar: *Social Impact of Mining references from Karnataka. * * *Sreedhar: *Mining in India and its impact on People.** * * *Kiran Shaheen: *Future perspectives on resistances and struggle** * * You are invited to kindly attend the same and contribute towards making the discussions fruitful. Please confirm your participation. Vijay Pratap Babulal Sharma Sayantoni Datta 26713251 9312608810 9999038672 A program organised by South Asian Dialogues on Ecological Democracy (SADED) Email: saded.bharat at gmail.com Url: www.saded.in From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 11:39:19 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 11:39:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Orissa Message-ID: >From the Hindustan Times RAJNI MAJHI, charred to death on Monday when a BJP-VHP mob torched the Missionary Orphan Centre in Bargarh district of Orissa, wasn¹t even a Christian. The mob, protesting Hindu leader Swami Laxmanananda¹s killing in Kandhamal, attacked Father Eddie¹s home at Khuntpali in Bargarh. The 19-year-old tribal girl, daughter of Laxmiprasad Mahakud, a labourer, had been adopted by Buchu Majhi. It¹s a common practice in rural Orissa to give a newborn up for adoption to ward off ³evil eyes². Buchu performed her last rites according to Hindu rituals. He said, ³My daughter fell prey to an evil eye.² Rajni stayed in the orphanage because her family could not afford higher education. She used to cycle to Padampur Women¹s College, six km from the home. Fondly called Rajni Nani, she would look after the 22 children in the home. ³She was more than a mother to us,² said Trinath Sabar, an inmate. From sagnik.chakravartty at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 09:31:37 2008 From: sagnik.chakravartty at gmail.com (SAGNIK CHAKRAVARTTY) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 09:31:37 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] [Announcements] Seminar on Public Service Broadcasting Message-ID: *To Mark the Anniversary of Prasar Bharati Act* ** *Seminar on: Which Public ? What Service ? Who is Broadcasting to Whom ? * *The Farce of Public Service Broadcasting in India* Speakers will include broadcasting policy experts, broadcasters, social scientists, academicians and social activists Chair: Shri Suhas Borker (Collaboration: Jan Prasar) *Date: 12th September, 2008* ** *Conference Room - I , India International Centre, 40, Max Mueller Marg, New Delhi* *Time: From 10:00 - 17:00 hours* (Source: IIC Programme Newsletter)(Details will shortly be available on www.iicdelhi.nic.in) ** ** -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ announcements mailing list announcements at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/announcements From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 29 12:41:27 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 12:41:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir In-Reply-To: <800383.38635.qm@web53605.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <800383.38635.qm@web53605.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Rahul, Thank you for your poser. And I hope that all readers will agree with me when I say that it is precisely the kind of question that one hopes to see more of on this list. I will try and get a handle on this, but, as my grasp on technical matters in philosophy is poor, I hope others who are more competent will join this discussion. Let me first of all state that the word 'Azadi' or 'Freedom' which is used a lot in discussions around Kashmir does not mean the same thing for all those who use it. For some it means the freedom to oppress others in an Islamist state, for some it means the freedom to oppress oneself in a strong secular state. For me, personally, it means the freedom not to be oppressed, as far as is possible, by any state. We need to to keep this spectrum in mind when we debate the choices apparently offered by Kesavan in his article. I enjoyed reading Mukul Kesavan's article, because it helped me think quite a few things through, even though I do not necessarily come to the same conclusions (or non-conclusions, and i have no problem with non-conclusions, they are often more useful than limiting conclusions). After spelling out the case against India holding on to Kashmir he says - >> But there is a case against self-determination which needs to be >> made, if only to clarify the consequence of endorsing >> self-determination. This is the kind of debate and discussion that we need. One that weighs its options not based of inflexible pre-conceived positions, but through a careful sifting of argument and reasoning. As I am not a liberal, I cannot speak for liberals. But I appreciate the principled stand that many liberals take in the defence of civil liberty. Other liberals, I have noticed, tend to cling to the state, (as a sort of lesser evil, I deliberately use the term 'lesser evil' here because Kesavan uses it himself, to characterize what he thinks are the motives governing the choices of those Indian commentators who have spoken in favour of 'Azadi' for Kashmir. I do not agree with this binary of 'lesser and greater evils' but, we can speak of that, later). Mukul Kesavan, i think is trying to walk the very thin wire between these two positions. To be fair, he has not explicitly told us where his options lie, he has merely tried to tell us what he thinks the options are. But in doing so he has given a reasonably good idea of where he would place his bets - with a flawed, compromised secular democratic ideal of India (which includes Kashmir) as a 'lesser evil' (to use, again his own language) compared to an independent Islamist statelet in Kashmir, or a Kashmir that accedes to Pakistan. However, characteristically, his options only take the form of either this kind of state, or that kind of state. Either secular India, or Islamist Kashmir, or an Islamist Kashmir within an Islamist Pakistan. I think the limitation of this kind of thinking is that it ties the options available to the people of Kashmir only in terms of what Mukul Kesavan thinks operates currently on the ground. Why should we have to agree that these indeed exhaust all possibilities. Self proclaimed 'pragmatists' may think they do, but I am of the opinion that it is the task of writers and intellectuals, and of all people working with ideas and images and concepts, to begin working in areas that so called 'pragmatists' cannot enter because of their own self defined limits of what they think is or is not possible. The idea of universal adult suffrage, (which is today considered the staple basis of republican statehood) was once considered a laughably utopian idea. But once you accept the necessity of a particular form of political expression, then, you can begin to think about the most practical means to achieve it in the shortest time. The trouble is, as long as commentators think that the solutions to Kashmir, (or Ossetia, or Chechnya, or whatever) lie only in a cloning, or division, or consolidation, or integration of post-Westphalian states, (and the gamut of proposals ranging from an independent secular Kashmir, to an independent Islamist Kashmir, to an Independent secular Jammu and Kashmir, to a Kashmir that accedes to Pakistan, to a Kashmir that is held by India all fall along this 'state' centric spectrum) they are refusing to engage with the possibility that it is precisely the 'form' of the nation-state that is the wall on which a seemingly intractable reality like Kashmir bangs its head, time and again. They refuse, in other words, to think of any other 'form' by which peoples can live together in a given territory. The spectre of the sovereign refuses to let go of them. They may disagree violently over which state they wish to commit to, but they are, in the end, all loyal to the idea of the sovereign. In that sense, all these options, to me are, actually - deontological and in some cases tend towards a kind of virtue ethics. I say this because they argue not in terms of the consequences of the state form, but in terms of our some kind of presupposed fidelity to one form or the other of the state itself. Elsewhere in his text, Kesavan also tries to make a weak teleological or consequentialist argument, when he raises the spectre of what happenned in Yugoslavia, or Sri Lanka as a caveat or warning to those who argue for 'Azadi' for Kashmir. Here, I think he is on very slippery ground. For every example of what goes wrong when nation states disintegrate, there can be offered counter examples of what continues to go wrong when nation states that ought not to be so gargantuan in the first place continue to exist by force. The USSR's prolonged existence as the inheritor of Czarist Russia's 'prison house of nations' (barring a brief post 'Oktober 1917' interregnum when the 'right to self determination' actually permitted the separation of Finland, Poland, the Baltic Republics and even some Central Asian territories) is an object lesson in the continued suffering caused by the perpetuation by force of the Soviet/Russian Imeperium. Kesavan invokes the Chechens, but not to mention that Stalin's decision to 'wipe Chechnya off the Map' and to deport all Chechens (and parts of other ethnicities) to forms of forced internal exile, (in the name of the integrity of the Soviet Union under his dictatorship) led to many hundreds of thousands of deaths, just as many, if not more than what occurred consequent to the break-up of Yugoslavia. Kesavan goes on to give us another reason for opposing the Kashmiri's right to self determination. He says - >> Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he thinks >> the Indian republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in >> democratic pluralism, that the Indian national movement and the >> nation-state it created, tried, in an >> unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea of >> diversity, not homogeneity This is frankly, very poor reasoning. Once again, weak consequentialism. It is arguing on the basis of one set of perceived consequences against another set of imagined consequences. We do not know yet, what an 'Azad' Kashmir is, or can be. As I said at the very outset, it means very different things to very different people. In the absence of a sure knowledge of what an entity can be if it comes into existence, we cannot use our speculation of what we think it might be, to argue against the desire to change what exists, when its existence becomes unbearable. Finally, again, it presumes that the democratic will of the Kashmiri people is not really of consequence. Which is a kind of difficult argument for a liberal to make. It is somewhat reminiscent of those liberals in Britain, like John Stuart Mill, who believed that a commitment to democracy at home, did not necessarily translate into a commitment to democracy in the 'colonies'. This is the well known 'rule of colonial difference'. Is Kesavan then offering, as his second option, a lame-liberalism, all too reminiscent of the liberals who wanted to maintain the British Empire as a cricket, tea and sandwiches kind of utopia? Where the natives could serve the tea and sandwiches, and someday, hope to play cricket? Substitute the word British for Indian, and you will know exactly what I mean. The tea, sandwiches and cricket can stay the same. regards Shuddha On 29-Aug-08, at 5:15 AM, Rahul Asthana wrote: > I am tempted to toss a poser on the list.What kind of ethical > framework is,or should be, more in congruence with the liberal line > of thinking -teleological or deontological? > http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/phil/blfaq_phileth_sys.htm > P.S. I am fully well aware of the open ended nature of the > question,but I think,trying to derive some kind of formalism from > Kesavan's advice to liberals may churn up some interesting ideas. > > > --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > >> From: Kshmendra Kaul >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir >> To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" >> >> Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:18 PM >> Most certainly (in my opinion) a fairly and sensibly laid >> out set of arguments on this issue. >> >> Kshmendra >> >> --- On Thu, 8/28/08, S. Jabbar >> wrote: >> >> From: S. Jabbar >> Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir >> To: "Sarai" >> Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:00 PM >> >> From the Telegraph, Calcutta >> >> THE TROUBLE WITH EDEN >> - Kashmir offers a choice between two compromised ideals >> Mukul Kesavan >> >> I¹ve never been to Kashmir. I nearly went in 1987 to >> Srinagar; there¹s a >> guesthouse there that used to be owned by Grindlays Bank, >> where I was meant >> to stay, but then the troubles began and I stayed home. The >> closest I came >> to living in Kashmir was living in Kashmiri Gate, a >> neighbourhood in north >> Delhi where the walled city ended and the Civil Lines >> began. There¹s a >> cinema hall there called the Ritz, where, in the early >> Sixties, I saw >> visions of Kashmir in films like Kashmir Ki Kali. Those >> were the years when >> Bombay cinema specialized in houseboat and hill-station >> idylls and in these >> films Kashmir often stood in for Eden. >> >> Delhi was a Jan Sangh city then; Atal Bihari Vajpayee was a >> promising local >> politician. Growing up in Kashmiri Gate, I wasn¹t >> especially political but I >> knew that Jan Sanghis blamed Nehru for Kashmir¹s disputed >> status. If he >> hadn¹t agreed to a plebiscite, or if he had allowed >> Indians from outside >> Kashmir to settle there, or if he hadn¹t made the fatal >> mistake of Article >> 370, which gave Jammu and Kashmir a special status within >> the Union, if he >> hadn¹t indulged Sheikh Abdullah if he hadn¹t done all of >> this, we wouldn¹t >> be wrestling with secessionism and sedition in Kashmir. >> >> For most of us who, like me, have no first-hand experience >> of Kashmir, the >> troubles in the Valley are, for the most part, a series of >> off-stage noises. >> Our governors, or more precisely, our proconsuls, sometimes >> become famous >> for making bad things worse, wars and skirmishes emblazon >> names like Kargil >> on our collective consciousness, newsworthy violence like >> the purging of >> Kashmiri Pandits from the valley or the brutalization of >> Kashmiri Muslims by >> the security forces surfaces in the newspapers and news >> channels, and then >> there are long periods of absent-mindedness when Kashmir >> disappears and >> these are the times when it¹s deemed to be calm or inching >> towards normalcy. >> Wise men, in these interludes, talk on television about >> commerce being the >> key to peace. Tourism¹s up, they say hopefully. Then the >> valley erupts and >> half-forgotten names like Hurriyat and Malik and Geelani >> and Farooq flicker >> in our heads. >> >> This latest eruption, though, has provoked a set of unusual >> reactions. The >> enormous popular mobilization in the Valley after General >> Sinha, our last >> governor, stirred the pot by allotting a large plot of land >> to the Amarnath >> Shrine Board, and after the security forces, predictably >> enough, killed >> Kashmiri Muslims in the demonstrations that followed, has >> prompted >> mainstream journalists like Vir Sanghvi and Swaminathan >> Aiyar to write >> opinion pieces arguing that India should seriously consider >> letting Kashmir >> go. Arundhati Roy, who was present at the enormous rally, >> made the same >> point more forcefully, arguing that the pro-Pakistan >> slogans or the >> distinctly Islamic idiom of the azadi vanguard, ought not >> to distract us >> from the fact that India has no right to hold the Valley¹s >> Muslims against >> their will. The routes by which these writers came to their >> conclusions are >> different, but the conclusion is the same: that the time >> has come to think >> the unthinkable: an azad Kashmir, or even the prospect of >> Kashmir becoming >> part of Pakistan. >> >> Are they right? Should Indian liberals and democrats >> endorse >> self-determination for Kashmir? Or is it possible to hold >> another position: >> can a liberal oppose azadi in Kashmir in good faith? One >> way of exploring >> this is to make dhobi lists of the pros and cons of >> Kashmiri >> self-determination. >> >> The case for self-determination is contained in the term >> itself. If we >> accept that the two hundred thousand Kashmiris who came out >> to protest >> against Indian rule, to shout for liberty, to invoke the >> ideal of an Islamic >> state, to press the case for union with Pakistan, are >> representative of >> Kashmir¹s Muslim population, then pressing India¹s claim >> to Kashmir with >> guns and bayonets is a violent negation of their collective >> will. It¹s hard >> for a liberal or a democrat to defend that position. No >> matter how violently >> you disagree with their ideas, or how convinced you are of >> Pakistani >> mischief and instigation, given the violence the Indian >> state has inflicted >> on Kashmiris, it¹s hard to argue that India is entitled to >> the benefit of >> the doubt. Kashmiri alienation is now of such long standing >> and the Indian >> state¹s interventions in Kashmir have been characterized >> by such >> unscrupulousness and such ruthless violence that touting >> India¹s virtues as >> a secular, democratic state, which Kashmiris should be glad >> to be part of, >> feels like a sick joke. >> >> But there is a case against self-determination which needs >> to be made, if >> only to clarify the consequence of endorsing >> self-determination. >> Self-determination isn¹t in itself virtuous. The Tamils in >> Sri Lanka, led by >> Velupillai Prabhakaran have been fighting a civil war for >> decades to achieve >> a separate state, Tamil Eelam. Tamils have suffered >> violence at the hands of >> Sinhala chauvinists and discrimination from the Sri Lankan >> state, which, in >> the Sixties, defined itself as a hegemonically Buddhist, >> Sinhalese entity. I >> knowof very few people outside of Prabhakaran¹s followers >> who want such a >> state to come into being. This is partly because >> Prabhakaran is an >> old-fashioned totalitarian leader and partly because a >> tiny, Tamil-majority >> statelet on a small island doesn¹t feel like a rousing >> cause. >> >> Sri Lanka aside, we¹ve witnessed the hideously violent >> unravelling of >> Yugoslavia in the name of self-determination. We¹ve seen >> the idea of >> self-determination taken to its absurd extreme in the >> elevation of Kosovo >> and Ossetia, tiny enclaves, barely a million strong, into >> nations on the >> ground of ethnic or religious difference. So perhaps, as >> liberals, we¹re >> entitled to ask of movements of self-determination, what >> sort of state they >> aspire to. If self-determination in Kashmir is meant to >> create a >> majoritarian state on the basis of ethnicity or faith (and >> Arundhati Roy, in >> her essay, is clear that the tableau of azadi that she >> witnessed was >> substantially shaped by Islamic ideas and bound by a sense >> of Muslim >> identity), an Indian liberal might still prefer azadi >> because he thinks >> chronic, quasi-colonial state violence is worse, but at >> least he would >> acknowledge that his was a counsel of despair rather an >> endorsement of a >> freedom struggle. >> >> That same liberal might argue that the expulsion of the >> Pandits and the >> violence against them shouldn¹t be accepted as an alibi >> for holding on to >> Kashmir, but he would be forced to acknowledge that >> Kashmiri nationalism in >> this Muslim variant seeks to draw a border around an >> ethnically cleansed >> people. >> >> Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he >> thinks the Indian >> republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in democratic >> pluralism, that >> the Indian national movement and the nation-state it >> created, tried, in an >> unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea >> of diversity, >> not homogeneity. It¹s worth mentioning here that the >> Indian state has never >> attempted to change the demographic realities in the Valley >> in the way in >> which Israel and China have in Palestine and Tibet. The >> loss of Kashmir, the >> only Muslim-majority state in the Union, would be a) a >> massive setback to >> this pluralist project, and b) a gift to Hindu chauvinists >> who would cite >> Kashmiri secession as yet another proof of the >> impossibility of integrating >> Muslims into a non-Muslim state. >> >> To sum up then, the Indian liberal has two options. He can >> support azadi in >> Kashmir because it is the lesser evil, knowing that azadi >> will almost >> certainly mean either a sectarian Muslim statelet or more >> territory for a >> larger sectarian state, Pakistan. Or he can endorse the >> Indian occupation >> because, in the larger scheme of things, Kashmiri Muslim >> suffering is >> collateral damage, the price that must be paid for the >> greater good of a >> pluralist India. Put like that, there¹s no shimmering >> cause to lift our >> liberal¹s spirits, just a choice between two squalid, >> compromised ideals. >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in >> the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to >> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject >> header. >> To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 29 13:29:08 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:29:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir In-Reply-To: <800383.38635.qm@web53605.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <800383.38635.qm@web53605.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43D3D0EA-00F3-485F-9728-A93222E7F73F@sarai.net> Dear Rahul, Thank you for your poser. And I hope that all readers will agree with me when I say that it is precisely the kind of question that one hopes to see more of on this list. I will try and get a handle on this, but, as my grasp on technical matters in philosophy is poor, I hope others who are more competent will join this discussion. Let me first of all state that the word 'Azadi' or 'Freedom' which is used a lot in discussions around Kashmir does not mean the same thing for all those who use it. For some it means the freedom to oppress others in an Islamist state, for some it means the freedom to oppress oneself in a strong secular state (regardless of whether it calls itself India or Kashmir). Even the CRPF bunkers in Srinagar often have the following written on them 'Hum Kashmir Ki Azadi ki Hifazat ke Khatir Yahan Hain', (we are here to protect the freedom of Kashmir). So, technically, even the CRPF, which has been busy killing unarmed protestors asking for 'Azadi' is doing so in the name of 'Azadi'. For me, personally, it means the freedom not to be oppressed, as far as is possible, by any state. We need to to keep this spectrum or meanings and values in mind when we debate the choices apparently offered by Kesavan in his article, which was so kindly forwarded by Sonia Jabbar, and commented on by Kshmendra Kaul and Rahul Asthana. I enjoyed reading Mukul Kesavan's article, because it helped me think quite a few things through, even though I do not necessarily come to the same conclusions (or non-conclusions, and i have no problem with non-conclusions, they are often more useful than limiting conclusions). After spelling out the case against India holding on to Kashmir he says - >> But there is a case against self-determination which needs to be >> made, if only to clarify the consequence of endorsing >> self-determination. This is the kind of debate and discussion that we need. One that weighs its options not based of inflexible pre-conceived positions, but through a careful sifting of argument and reasoning. As I am not a liberal, I cannot speak for liberals. But I appreciate the principled stand that many liberals take in the defence of civil liberty. Other liberals, I have noticed, tend to cling to the state, (as a sort of lesser evil, I deliberately use the term 'lesser evil' here because Kesavan uses it himself, to characterize what he thinks are the motives governing the choices of those Indian commentators who have spoken in favour of 'Azadi' for Kashmir. I do not agree with this binary of 'lesser and greater evils' but, we can speak of that, later). Mukul Kesavan, i think is trying to walk the very thin wire between these two positions. To be fair, he has not explicitly told us where his options lie, he has merely tried to tell us what he thinks the options are. But in doing so he has given a reasonably good idea of where he would place his bets - with a flawed, compromised secular democratic ideal of India (which includes Kashmir) as a 'lesser evil' (to use, again his own language) compared to an independent Islamist statelet in Kashmir, or a Kashmir that accedes to Pakistan. However, characteristically, his options only take the form of either this kind of state, or that kind of state. Either secular India, or Islamist Kashmir, or an Islamist Kashmir within an Islamist Pakistan. I think the limitation of this kind of thinking is that it ties the options available to the people of Kashmir only in terms of what Mukul Kesavan thinks operates currently on the ground. Why should we have to agree that these indeed exhaust all possibilities. Self proclaimed 'pragmatists' may think they do, but I am of the opinion that it is the task of writers and intellectuals, and of all people working with ideas and images and concepts, to begin working in areas that so called 'pragmatists' cannot enter because of their own self defined limits of what they think is or is not possible. The idea of universal adult suffrage, (which is today considered the staple basis of republican statehood) was once considered a laughably utopian idea. But once you accept the necessity of a particular form of political expression, then, you can begin to think about the most practical means to achieve it in the shortest time. The trouble is, as long as commentators think that the solutions to Kashmir, (or Ossetia, or Chechnya, or whatever) lie only in a cloning, or division, or consolidation, or integration of post-Westphalian states, (and the gamut of proposals ranging from an independent secular Kashmir, to an independent Islamist Kashmir, to an Independent secular Jammu and Kashmir, to a Kashmir that accedes to Pakistan, to a Kashmir that is held by India all fall along this 'state' centric spectrum) they are refusing to engage with the possibility that it is precisely the 'form' of the nation-state that is the wall on which a seemingly intractable reality like Kashmir bangs its head, time and again. They refuse, in other words, to think of any other 'form' by which peoples can live together in a given territory. The spectre of the sovereign refuses to let go of them. They may disagree violently over which state they wish to commit to, but they are, in the end, all loyal to the idea of the sovereign. In that sense, all these options, to me are, actually - deontological and in some cases tend towards a kind of virtue ethics. I say this because they argue not in terms of the consequences of the state form, but in terms of our some kind of presupposed fidelity to one form or the other of the state itself. Elsewhere in his text, Kesavan also tries to make a weak teleological or consequentialist argument, when he raises the spectre of what happenned in Yugoslavia, or Sri Lanka as a caveat or warning to those who argue for 'Azadi' for Kashmir. Here, I think he is on very slippery ground. For every example of what goes wrong when nation states disintegrate, there can be offered counter examples of what continues to go wrong when nation states that ought not to be so gargantuan in the first place continue to exist by force. The USSR's prolonged existence as the inheritor of Czarist Russia's 'prison house of nations' (barring a brief post 'Oktober 1917' interregnum when the 'right to self determination' actually permitted the separation of Finland, Poland, the Baltic Republics and even some Central Asian territories) is an object lesson in the continued suffering caused by the perpetuation by force of the Soviet/Russian Imeperium. Kesavan invokes the Chechens, but not to mention that Stalin's decision to 'wipe Chechnya off the Map' and to deport all Chechens (and parts of other ethnicities) to forms of forced internal exile, (in the name of the integrity of the Soviet Union under his dictatorship) led to many hundreds of thousands of deaths, just as many, if not more than what occurred consequent to the break-up of Yugoslavia. Kesavan goes on to give us another reason for opposing the Kashmiri's right to self determination. He says - >> Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he thinks >> the Indian republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in >> democratic pluralism, that the Indian national movement and the >> nation-state it created, tried, in an >> unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea of >> diversity, not homogeneity This is frankly, very poor reasoning. Once again, weak consequentialism. It is arguing on the basis of one set of perceived consequences against another set of imagined consequences. We do not know yet, what an 'Azad' Kashmir is, or can be. As I said at the very outset, it means very different things to very different people. In the absence of a sure knowledge of what an entity can be if it comes into existence, we cannot use our speculation of what we think it might be, to argue against the desire to change what exists, when its existence becomes unbearable. Finally, again, it presumes that the democratic will of the Kashmiri people is not really of consequence. Which is a kind of difficult argument for a liberal to make. It is somewhat reminiscent of those liberals in Britain, like John Stuart Mill, who believed that a commitment to democracy at home, did not necessarily translate into a commitment to democracy in the 'colonies'. This is the well known 'rule of colonial difference'. Is Kesavan then offering, as his second option, a lame-liberalism, all too reminiscent of the liberals who wanted to maintain the British Empire as a cricket, tea and sandwiches kind of utopia? Where the natives could serve the tea and sandwiches, and someday, hope to play cricket? Substitute the word British for Indian, and you will know exactly what I mean. The tea, sandwiches and cricket can stay the same. regards Shuddha On 29-Aug-08, at 5:15 AM, Rahul Asthana wrote: > I am tempted to toss a poser on the list.What kind of ethical > framework is,or should be, more in congruence with the liberal line > of thinking -teleological or deontological? > http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/phil/blfaq_phileth_sys.htm > P.S. I am fully well aware of the open ended nature of the > question,but I think,trying to derive some kind of formalism from > Kesavan's advice to liberals may churn up some interesting ideas. > > > --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > >> From: Kshmendra Kaul >> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir >> To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" >> >> Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:18 PM >> Most certainly (in my opinion) a fairly and sensibly laid >> out set of arguments on this issue. >> >> Kshmendra >> >> --- On Thu, 8/28/08, S. Jabbar >> wrote: >> >> From: S. Jabbar >> Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir >> To: "Sarai" >> Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:00 PM >> >> From the Telegraph, Calcutta >> >> THE TROUBLE WITH EDEN >> - Kashmir offers a choice between two compromised ideals >> Mukul Kesavan >> >> Shuddhabrata Sengupta From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 29 13:31:21 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:31:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions Message-ID: <46C9670D-C40D-453E-A3C7-B321906D3EC3@sarai.net> Dear All, I have been intrigued by the exchange on the list of late that has preferred to jettison the term 'religion' and prefer in its stead the euphimistic phrase - 'ways of life'. I am referring to the exchange between Chanchal Malviya and Jeebesh Bagchi, arising out of the heated correspondence on the disruption of a small exhibition devoted to M.F.Husain. i am quite convinced that the term 'religion' which derives from the latin root of the word religio (bond) and religare (the verb form of 'to bind') remains for me a useful word to name the act of committing oneself in any form. In this sense, atheists and agnostics are just as religious (in their commitment to doubt) as are those blessed with faith. I would describe my religious commitment as agnosticism - a commitment to doubt everything, (including the value of doubt) and a certainty that we cannot speak certainly of anything at all, because there are always counterfactuals, and hitherto unimagined, or unknown possibilities, that goad us on to yet newer possibilities, or to return to some very old ones. This is just to say that it would be a mistake to assume, as is often done with some arrogance on the part of the more pronouncedly 'faithful', that atheists and agnostics have no 'spiritual' quests. They do, and they dont, just as those who are ostentatiously 'religious' do, and dont, or do only in as much as it allows them to burn a few churches as they go questing. If Hindu fundamentalists have chosen to renounce the ties that bind (religio) them to life, who would I be to object, because, I am not a Hindu. But I have no quarrel with the term 'ways of life'. The more words we have, the better. This discussion arose out of a rage felt by some that a group of zealots had broken and disrupted an exhibition that featured some images of and by Husain, and the counter rage felt by others that the zealots had no right to be criticised because they were acting to protect the honour of the Hindu deities that they felt Husain had insulted. The second case is as follows - what right has Husain, a Muslim to insult Hindu deities by portraying them in a manner that is offensive to the sentiments of many Hindus. (Husain's motivations, or the aesthetic merit of his images are not the issue here, what is at issue is the insult seen to have occurred when a non-Hindu 'touches' a sacred Hindu icon with his 'insulting' imagination. Those so enraged, also throw the following challenge, has the opposite ever occurred? I am not here to make a case for Husain. (As I have said before I do not have a very high opinion of his work as an artist). I am here to make a case for what is considered to be transgression. No one can be sure when they have transgressed. Because transgression can be seen to occur even when the motives of the person concerned are far from transgression. Husain can say in his defence, and indeed has on occasion said that his paintings are an index of his appreciation of Indic culture and its diversity of expressions, of his closeness (since early childhood) to forms of iconic imagery in popular Hinduism. Here his intent is clearly not to insult, on the contrary, it is to declare his appreciation for the beauty of the iconography of popular Hinduism, a charge for which he would be equally hated by both Hindu as well as Muslim fundamentalists. It has not been noticed that no Muslim fundamentalist or even Muslim religious figure has come out in defence of Husain. They are in fact in tacit agreement with their Hindu peers. A Muslim making images, and that too of Hindu goddesses, because he is drawn to them, can only be seen as blasphemy in their eyes. On this, like on so many other issues, Hindu and Muslim fundamentalists are in total agreement. Let me come now to an interesting counterfactual argument. I refer to the life an work of a little known late nineteenth century and early twentieth century Urdu poet of Delhi called Dillu Ram Kausari. Now as his name suggests, Dillu Ram was a Hindu. The trouble is, throughout his life he composed deliriously passionate elegies (na'at) to the Prophet Muhammad. One of his quatrains went as follows Kuch ‘ishq e Muhammad mein nahin shart e Musulman! Hai Kausari Hindu bhii talabgaar e Muhammad! Allah re! kyaa raunaq e bazaar e Muhammad Ke Ma’bood e Jahan bhi hai kharidaar e Muhammad! Being a Muslim is not a condition for loving Muhammad! Kausari, the Hindu, is also a seeker of Muhammad! By Allah! How delightful is the bazaar of Muhammad For the Lord of the Worlds is also a buyer of Muhammad! This kind of sentiment shocked both Hindus and Muslims. Hindus, because how could a Hindu sing what amounted to love songs to a Muslim prophet, and Muslims, for the same reason. Both felt slighted and insulted by the transgressive way in which the imagination of the poet had 'touched' the body of what was sacred for one, and not, for the other. Another poem, which proved to be even more controversial, went like this - Rahmatulilalamin kay Hashar mein maana’ khulay Khalq saari Shaafa e Roz e Jaza kay saath hai Laykay Dillu Raam ko jannat mein jab Hazrat gaye Ma’loom huwa kay Hindu bhi Mahboob e Khuda kay saath hai! The meaning of “Mercy unto the Worlds” became apparent on Judgement Day: The whole creation is with the Intercessor of The Day of Acquittal When the Prophet took Dillu Ram with him into Paradise It was known that this Hindu too is with the Beloved of God! This poem, especially scandalized Muslim orthodoxy, because it dared to suggest that the prophet himself would intercede on behalf of an unbeliever on the day of judgement. It is interesting to note that Dillu Ram never became a Muslim, at least not in his lifetime. An article in the interesting web portal Chowk http://www.chowk.com/articles/12692 by one Asif Naqshbandi says "It is also said that Dillu Ram, delirious with his love, would sometimes stand in the middle of the bazaar in Delhi, put chains around his neck and feet and shout at the top of his voice to all passers-by, “Muhammad! Muhammad! Muhammad! Yes! Muhammad is the Beloved of God! Muhammad is the first and only Beloved of God! If God loves you, He loves you because of His Beloved!” Some people even stoned him and he would often come home covered in blood but he was totally lost in his love of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him!)" There is an apocryphal story of how on his deathbed Dillu Ram Kausari had a vision of the Prophet himself, who came to him, and that he read the Kalima with him. But as this vision is reported to have appeared only to him, as he lay dying, and as he is no longer with us to either confirm or deny this deathbed conversion, we can only surmise that it was a generous, but somewhat disingenuous method of having Dillu Ram's somewhat unorthodox Muslim apologists claim him for themselves. As far as we are concerned, Dillu Ram Kausari, caused grave offence, by his love for the Prophet, both to Hindu as well as to Muslim zealots, as long as he lived. If, the things we call religions are 'ways of life' then we can always determine for ourselves whether we want to walk on a one way street that runs into a dead end, or to cross many paths, walking down one way, for one purpose, down another way for another, and sometimes just standing in between paths, figuring out our journey, as we go about our lives. I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. And all they were doing was crossing the road. thanks and regards, Shuddha ----- Shuddhabrata Sengupta From khurramparvez at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 13:38:00 2008 From: khurramparvez at yahoo.com (Khurram Parvez) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 01:08:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals Message-ID: <822777.99371.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> APPEAL We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on minorities in Kashmir. Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings take place, the people’s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to Madeline Albright’s book titled “Mighty and the Almighty” has clearly accused Hindu fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora. In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also in the International media and institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir. In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community leaders, religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people’s movement of Kashmir. In the wake of present peaceful people’s movement to realise the right of self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council’s recently announced statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people’s movement. We urge the government of India to halt the brutal use of force against the people and respect the people’s right to assembly and freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu. The arrests and the killings of anyone are unacceptable. We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is always to be humane besides being politically correct. In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested, communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the restoration of people’s rights. We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form the inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our political emancipation. We also urge the community leaders, civil society actors, political parties of Jammu province to strive for the safety and security of Muslims and other minorities residing in Jammu. Signed by: Moulana Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin Ahmed (Mufti Azam JK State and Incharge of religious affairs of Jammu and Kashmir), Mirwaiz Molvi Riyaz Ahmed Hamdani, Islamic Study Circle, Aga Syed Hassan Al Moosvi – President - Anjuman Sharie Shiyaan, Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner’s Federation, Valley Citizens Council, Jan Mohammad Koul, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation, Noor Ahmed Bilal – President Kashmir University Teachers Association, Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee, Kashmir Thinker’s Guild, Dr. Altaf Hussain, Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist), Anwar Ashai (Social Activist), Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Poet) Adv. A. R. Hanjoora (Social Activist), Hameeda Bano (Faculty of English, University of Kashmir), Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), Noor Ahmed Baba (Dean Social Sciences, University of Kashmir), Mohammad Azeem Tuman (House Boat Owners Association), Himayat Trust, JK People’s Development Trust, Ehsaas – A Developmental Organisation, Mushtaaque Ali Ahmed Khan (Theatre Activist and Film Maker) Senior Citizens Forum Kashmir Urdu Academy Jammu and Kashmir Cultural Society Syed us Sadaat Trust, Islamabad, Kashmir Hudood ullah Research Centre Eco Concern, Islamabad, Kashmir From mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 13:45:55 2008 From: mahmood.farooqui at gmail.com (mahmood farooqui) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:45:55 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi In-Reply-To: <693028.4868.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <693028.4868.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Comrade Jeebesh, thank you very much for the priceless exchange with comrades Chanchal and Prabhakar. Made my day:( 2008/8/28 Prabhakar Singh > Yes I, agree.We,being the lucky few ones who have managed to received some > meaningful education in this poor country,should behave in a responsible ma > nner and ensure that we contribute something worthwhile to our > society,nation and the world at large forgetting about our personal > preferences of comforts.Through this forum we should be able to evolve a > consensus and serve our nation.Scoring a point or winning an arguement > should not be our prime concern.Listening to others,respecting them and > appreciating their points honestly will take us to new heights.Discussing > for the sake of discussion may be avoided. > The issue of global warming has been raised.It is in our mind.We tend to be > hot-headed and intolerant increasing entropy of the universe resulting in > sins,greed,hatred,exploitation and violence.We will have to make our life > green first.It means consumption to the barest minimum resulting in minimum > violence on nature.The western model of life leading to more comforts, more > consumption,more profits,creating artificial needs,selling more and more > come what may,ever increasing exploitation of natural resources has brought > our Mother Earth to the brink of disaster and extinction.Mother Earth has > enough for the need of all but not enough for even one man's greed.We all > are responsible for the reckless consumption.Do we switch off > lights,fans,airconditioners etc.in our offices or homes when they are not > needed?Do we see to it that water is not wasted unnecessarily? How much food > is weasted in our homes,in public places or in hotels? Are we switching > off AC in > car when outside weather is tolerable?Are we using our car even for very > short distances which we can easily walk? Are we putting on the curtains on > windows when daylight is available and switching on the electric bulbs? How > much solar energy is being used which is freely available in abundance? Why > we have to play matches in nights under artificial lights when they can be > easily played in daylight? How much use of daytime and daylight we are > making in our day-to-day work? Are we shifting our working time to night > time requring artificial lighting and additional scarce electrical energy? > How much use of non-conventional energy we are doing which are easily > available? How much use of local materials and local skills we are making? > How much use of energy-intensive products we are making? These are very > simple steps through which we can fight the problem of global warming. > > Regards, > > Prabhakar > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Jeebesh > To: Sarai Reader-list > Sent: Thursday, 28 August, 2008 4:47:26 PM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > dear Prabhakar, > > It is absolutely true that Hinduism is not understood. It is not at > all a religion. Religion is a new concept, developed a few hundred > years to confuse people. It was always a way of life and remains so. > Totally agree with you. That is why is very important for people like > you or chanchal to give some new ways of thinking ahead. Like in case > of global warming, how will this old civilisational way of life give a > fresh insight.? These are global questions of urgency and if properly > given thought can upturn the way world thinks. Please give it some > thought. > > warmly > jeebesh > > On 28-Aug-08, at 4:23 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > > > Very rightly said ! Hinduism is not a religion.It is a way of > > life.If Hinduism is a book all religions on earth are its > > chapters.It is a great sin to abuse it without properly > > understanding it. We should first take trouble to understand its > > philosophy as little surface knowledge may prove to be dangerous. > > Prabhakar > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: chanchal malviya > > To: A Khanna ; Prabhakar Singh < > prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com > > > > > Cc: inder salim ; reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 August, 2008 9:33:07 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > > > Dear Khanna, > > > > 1. There are people in this world who are not ready to take the > > positive side of their own identity. There are people who would love > > to rape their own mother and motherland. And there are some people > > who even protect their intention as personal attitude. Great. Not to > > say anything to them. > > 2. You telling that motherland is a metaphor and nothing else > > explains in itself what you feel about India. I am sure such person > > also feel the same for their own mother and sister. And I have > > written earlier that such person would not come to protect their > > mother also, what to say about the broader concept of motherland. > > 3. As far as Hinduism is concerned, it has to be recognized through > > the text only. It cannot be recognized at least now by actions of > > people. Because India is more Islamic and Christianized than a Hindu > > country. Of course, people like you are a part of it. Hinduism is a > > mere subject of attack in India. What I told about Hinduism is > > exactly what is HInduism. And why Hinduism, this word came into > > existence only when other Religions forced it upon the people of > > Sanatan Dharma. > > > > I know you will not be able to understand the difference between > > Dharma and Religion. For you and Gandhiji both are same. But Dharma > > means Righteous duty and Religion is what you all are talking about. > > Hinduism is science and teaches righteous duty in scientific manner. > > World outside India is recognizing this, but our Indians will > > understand it only when a 'Gora' will come and say and that also > > when he is ruling us. Sorry. > > > > Sex is a power of nature that is to be won by human through various > > methodologies described in Hindu text. And that is an important step > > towards Self-Realization. Attempt is that only. Women taking bath > > nude didn't cover their body when Sukdeva (son of Veda Vyas) crossed > > them, because they knew that he is a child in his nature on this > > matter. But they immediately took cover when Veda Vyas crossed. > > There are many stories where Saints are being enticed by Apsaras for > > sex. And the theme of all story is same - sex is a very powerful > > natural factor. And winning over it is the biggest win in life. > > If sex would have been so prominent in Hindus, we would have found > > Hindu society also marrying multitude of women. > > Please do not try to put Hinduism under charge, for this. > > I have already told you the meaning of Deities, and yet you do not > > understand and ask me stupid questions. > > > > Unlike Islam, where one is allowed to marry as many as they like as > > per their capacity and in addition keep as many women as their right > > hand posses (Hindu women) for sex. It is unlike Christian where sex > > and love are the same thing. > > > > M.F.Hussain is a gift of Islam. So, he will see even his motherland > > only with his Madhuri attitude. No, he is seeing India nude with his > > Islamic attitude. He has seen Madhuri also with his Islamic > > attitude, though film stars have a different life style and we may > > not be protective of them in this matter. > > > > It is so simple, if M.F.Hussain is so clean, let him paint his > > mother. Or if you or the protector of M.F.Hussain has so large > > heart, please send a photograph of your mother to him and ask him to > > paint her nude. Let me see, how many of you are not of double > > standard. > > Either you all are in favor of Darul-Islam, or you are abusing your > > own motherland by supporting bloody Hussain. > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: A Khanna > > To: Prabhakar Singh > > Cc: chanchal malviya ; inder salim < > indersalim at gmail.com > > >; reader-list at sarai.net > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 3:36:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Husain Exhibition Attacked in Delhi > > > > chanchal, prabhakar, Everyone Else, > > > > there are three issues i'd like to reflect on in light of your rather > > rabid postings on the issues of the attack on M.F. Husain's > > exhibition. Apologies for the rather long posting, i do hope some of > > you will find it interesting. > > > > First, a rather obvious contestation relating to Chanchal's gratuitous > > offer to speak the 'truth' of 'Hinudism', and more broadly, the > > aggressive claim of Hindutva forces of a monopoly of what the terms > > 'Hindu' and 'Hinduism' may mean. More particularly, this is a > > contestation of the place of sexualness and eroticism in them. What > > makes it possible for the claim to be made that 'sex is not erotic in > > hinduism' on the one hand, and the demeaning of artists who brought > > out erotics in sex as 'failed' Hindus? What exactly is the fear of the > > erotic? Why are these strange people trying to cleave eroticism away > > from the lives of 'Hindus'?? > > > > Surely you are aware that there is a diversity of practices, > > festivals, mythologies, political economies, cosmologies if you like, > > in different parts of the country and in different communities in the > > same regions, that may lay claim to the name 'Hindu'. This is even in > > the face of colonial, and more recent hindu fundamentalist, attempts > > to reduce this diversity into a rather boring, often textual, > > normative frame. Chanchal offers, in other words, one peculiar vision > > of some 'pure' or 'original' 'Hinduism' as though it exists in texts > > (particular ones that by perhaps little more than historical > > serendipity, and sex anxious coloniality, came to be seen as > > containing the 'truth' of 'Hindu culture'), rather than in the > > embodiment and practices of people. chanchal's vision, of a "faith > > (not religion) that talks about winning over the senses (particularly > > sex)" is one that, for the large part, stands miles away from various > > realities, practices and beliefs of those who consider themselves > > 'Hindu'. > > > > In my travels around India researching sexualness and eroticism I > > encountered a confounding multiplicity of festivals, rituals, > > identities and idioms in which eroticism, desire and sexualness are > > central. Way too many of these take place in temples, way too many of > > these are central to local religious practices, and the logics and > > experiences of faith, way too many of these lay claim to being > > 'Hindu', for me to accept chanchal's description of Hinduism as an > > achievement over sex. Or of the Lingam as light. (is it just me or > > does this sounds closer to a Victorian Christianity? – a reading of > > colonial anxieties around sex race and gender into the truth of the > > self?) So chanchal, unfortunately yours is one peculiar vision of > > 'hindu', and a pathetically unimaginative one at that. It sounds to me > > like the collective voice of a masculinist upper caste that is yet to > > come to terms with (or even recognise) the damage done to it through > > the colonial experience and one which clings to rather fragile stories > > of the self. And it is unfortunate that the political economy of > > Hindutva allows such a vision so much importance today. (Let me > > clarify that i am not particularly invested or interested in > > reclaiming Hindu from the bare teeth of the aggressive masculinist > > claimants. But i do want to point to the right of others to do so.) > > > > The second interesting point in the postings is the tension around > > nudity. Nakedness. Such a beautiful experience. Do you not love the > > human body? Do you not love your own selves? Is it a fear or disgust > > with the self or some other trauma that brings about such anxiety > > around nakedness? But ofcourse this is not just the representation of > > the naked human body that seems to have caused this anxiety – it seems > > to be, more precisely, that you necessarily see sexualness and > > eroticism in the naked human body. But hold on, it is not just > > sexualness and eroticism of the naked human body that has caused this > > anxiety, it is a very particular nakedness – the nakedness of > > 'Motherland India'. Because, the problem with 'perverted Husain' is > > that to him "Mother Indian and Madhuri are the same" – therefore, > > actually its alright for him to paint Madhuri, in fact you probably > > sat at the edge of your seat, enthralled as many of us were, as > > Madhuri oh so sensuously thrust her beautiful breasts forward, > > inviting you to a world of phantasmic pleasure, nevermind the > > performance of outrage at the LYRICS of Choli Ke Peechhe (and i'm not > > talking merely of pleasure for the male gaze of Masculine Men. I for > > one, wanted to be Madhuri). Its the nakedness of Mother India, or > > Motherland India that caused anxiety. So lets face this ponderous > > image of a naked, sexualised Mother India head on. There are two > > things that i find fascinating here. > > > > First, the Motherland is a metaphor. A very powerful metaphor > > admittedly. But a metaphor nonetheless. India is experienced as many > > things, and through many metaphors – a place, sometimes a 'people', a > > postcolonial nation state, a geographical entity with multiple and > > complex cartographic existences, a cricket team, a zone of intense > > gastronomic density, a colonising force, an a series of competing and > > collaborating political economies...But India is not simply a woman. > > And Kashmir is not the head of this woman (as we were unfortunately > > taught in school in the 80s). The power of this metaphor is truly > > fascinating. > > > > But how does one strip a metaphor?? This must be one hell of a > > brilliant painting! (on which note, are there any weblinks to images > > of this painting? If someone knows a link i implore you, please share > > it on this list). If it is true that this painting has managed to > > actually bring this metaphor into an embodiment, and then brought out > > an eroticism in it (rather than what it seems like, the attackers not > > having even really seen and experienced the the painting) then what it > > has done is expose Mother India as a metaphor, and weakened the power > > that 'she' wields. Brilliant. The second thing is of course that once > > we see Mother India as a metaphor into which we are constantly > > investing a sense of reality, the metaphor becomes a contested space. > > And perhaps this is what is creating anxiety for the likes of > > prabhakar and chanchal? > > > > So lets look at what it is about the stripping of this metaphor that > > has gotten them, and the attackers of the exhibition so aggressive? > > What is the power of this metaphor? One of prabhakar's email hits the > > nail on the head. "If some artist in the name of art paints your > > mother nude and displays it in art galleries and exhibitions to public > > how would you feel and how would you react?", s/he asks. A similar > > point is made by chanchal when s/he says "I am sure, a person who > > paints his motherland nude, must have done much more nonesense (sic) > > to his mother and sister". This leads me to understand that the > > anxiety over the depiction of Mother India in such a way that she may > > be seen to be sexualised, as erotic, is actually an anxiety around the > > possibility that heris mother is sexual, or has an erotic side to her. > > Is it scary, prabhakar, chanchal, for you to imagine that your mother > > may be a sexual being with erotic desires, and with a body that is her > > own, and which can be naked? Is it a fear of this possibility that > > evokes in you, such strong emotions when you see (or perhaps hear of) > > what some artist has done on a piece of canvas with paint? Is it this > > fear that you will allow to dominate your very imagination of the > > Nation of India? Freudian psychobabble, in other words, offers itself > > up tantalisingly here. Is their Hindu nation structured around an > > Oedipal anxiety over desire for the mother? (ugh!) > > > > The troubling effect of this is of course the denial in nationalist > > discourse of sexualness or rather the right to sexualness of women, as > > after all, the big obligation on the good woman is to become the > > mother of (male) children. This justifies mechanisms of regulation > > over women's sexualness, and the meting out of punishment and > > exclusion to those who fail to live within these boundaries, or > > transgress them at will. The protests against the film Fire being a > > case in point. But how does a woman become a mother (over and over > > again, atleast until she begets a Son), when she is bereft of > > sexualness? Is this an imagination of immaculate conception, or, a > > belief that the only form of legitimate sex is heterosexual rape? The > > point here is that if the metaphor of the Motherland and the lives of > > women must feed into each other, the demand for the recognition of > > sexualness and women's right to sexuality must also address the > > sexualness of the metaphor of Mother India. > > > > This brings me to my last point. I was brought up with a sense of > > patriotism, stories of the freedom struggle, stories of the success of > > Big Nehruvian development and images of Mother India. In fact i > > sometimes still experience a sense of nostalgia for that heady emotion > > of being part of that particular 'something bigger'. (yes, i cried > > when i watched Rang De Basanti). I have, in other words, experienced > > the power of Mother India, and surely all that investment by the state > > into making sure that this experience marks my psyche forever entails > > me to owning the metaphor. I claim the right, in other words to invest > > this metaphor with things. If i bring my travels around India to bear > > on this, i'd say 'Mother India', to me, is one hell of beautiful, > > sensual, sexual, erotic figure, a polymorphous queer body, who laughs, > > flirts, makes love, has soul-baring intense sex. Oh, and, sigh, S/he > > also makes steel. > > > > > > Love, > > > > akshay > > > > -- > > The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in > > Scotland, with registration number SC005336. > > > > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or > > yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now, on > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From rohitism at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 13:49:27 2008 From: rohitism at gmail.com (Rohit Shetti) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:49:27 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions In-Reply-To: <46C9670D-C40D-453E-A3C7-B321906D3EC3@sarai.net> References: <46C9670D-C40D-453E-A3C7-B321906D3EC3@sarai.net> Message-ID: Dear Shuddha, That's a beautiful piece. Let me play a bit with the words in the last paragraph that you wrote. "I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. *After all they crossing the road.*" I guess this is what drives many zealots to do what they do since they do not get beyond 'slogan-level thinking', as one dear friend of mine puts it. 'Crossing the road' is a slogan enough to spur them, without ever waiting to understand what it is that amounts to 'crossing the road' and if there is any real harm in it. Rgds, Rohit On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:31 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear All, > > I have been intrigued by the exchange on the list of late that has > preferred to jettison the term 'religion' and prefer in its stead the > euphimistic phrase - 'ways of life'. I am referring to the exchange > between Chanchal Malviya and Jeebesh Bagchi, arising out of the > heated correspondence on the disruption of a small exhibition devoted > to M.F.Husain. > > i am quite convinced that the term 'religion' which derives from the > latin root of the word religio (bond) and religare (the verb form of > 'to bind') remains for me a useful word to name the act of committing > oneself in any form. In this sense, atheists and agnostics are just > as religious (in their commitment to doubt) as are those blessed with > faith. I would describe my religious commitment as agnosticism - a > commitment to doubt everything, (including the value of doubt) and a > certainty that we cannot speak certainly of anything at all, because > there are always counterfactuals, and hitherto unimagined, or unknown > possibilities, that goad us on to yet newer possibilities, or to > return to some very old ones. This is just to say that it would be a > mistake to assume, as is often done with some arrogance on the part > of the more pronouncedly 'faithful', that atheists and agnostics have > no 'spiritual' quests. They do, and they dont, just as those who are > ostentatiously 'religious' do, and dont, or do only in as much as it > allows them to burn a few churches as they go questing. If Hindu > fundamentalists have chosen to renounce the ties that bind (religio) > them to life, who would I be to object, because, I am not a Hindu. > But I have no quarrel with the term 'ways of life'. The more words we > have, the better. > > This discussion arose out of a rage felt by some that a group of > zealots had broken and disrupted an exhibition that featured some > images of and by Husain, and the counter rage felt by others that the > zealots had no right to be criticised because they were acting to > protect the honour of the Hindu deities that they felt Husain had > insulted. > > The second case is as follows - what right has Husain, a Muslim to > insult Hindu deities by portraying them in a manner that is offensive > to the sentiments of many Hindus. (Husain's motivations, or the > aesthetic merit of his images are not the issue here, what is at > issue is the insult seen to have occurred when a non-Hindu 'touches' > a sacred Hindu icon with his 'insulting' imagination. Those so > enraged, also throw the following challenge, has the opposite ever > occurred? > > I am not here to make a case for Husain. (As I have said before I do > not have a very high opinion of his work as an artist). I am here to > make a case for what is considered to be transgression. No one can be > sure when they have transgressed. Because transgression can be seen > to occur even when the motives of the person concerned are far from > transgression. Husain can say in his defence, and indeed has on > occasion said that his paintings are an index of his appreciation of > Indic culture and its diversity of expressions, of his closeness > (since early childhood) to forms of iconic imagery in popular Hinduism. > > Here his intent is clearly not to insult, on the contrary, it is to > declare his appreciation for the beauty of the iconography of popular > Hinduism, a charge for which he would be equally hated by both Hindu > as well as Muslim fundamentalists. > > It has not been noticed that no Muslim fundamentalist or even Muslim > religious figure has come out in defence of Husain. They are in fact > in tacit agreement with their Hindu peers. A Muslim making images, > and that too of Hindu goddesses, because he is drawn to them, can > only be seen as blasphemy in their eyes. On this, like on so many > other issues, Hindu and Muslim fundamentalists are in total agreement. > > Let me come now to an interesting counterfactual argument. I refer to > the life an work of a little known late nineteenth century and early > twentieth century Urdu poet of Delhi called Dillu Ram Kausari. Now as > his name suggests, Dillu Ram was a Hindu. The trouble is, throughout > his life he composed deliriously passionate elegies (na'at) to the > Prophet Muhammad. > > One of his quatrains went as follows > > Kuch 'ishq e Muhammad mein nahin shart e Musulman! > Hai Kausari Hindu bhii talabgaar e Muhammad! > Allah re! kyaa raunaq e bazaar e Muhammad > Ke Ma'bood e Jahan bhi hai kharidaar e Muhammad! > > Being a Muslim is not a condition for loving Muhammad! > Kausari, the Hindu, is also a seeker of Muhammad! > By Allah! How delightful is the bazaar of Muhammad > For the Lord of the Worlds is also a buyer of Muhammad! > > This kind of sentiment shocked both Hindus and Muslims. Hindus, > because how could a Hindu sing what amounted to love songs to a > Muslim prophet, and Muslims, for the same reason. Both felt slighted > and insulted by the transgressive way in which the imagination of the > poet had 'touched' the body of what was sacred for one, and not, for > the other. > > Another poem, which proved to be even more controversial, went like > this - > > Rahmatulilalamin kay Hashar mein maana' khulay > Khalq saari Shaafa e Roz e Jaza kay saath hai > Laykay Dillu Raam ko jannat mein jab Hazrat gaye > Ma'loom huwa kay Hindu bhi Mahboob e Khuda kay saath hai! > > The meaning of "Mercy unto the Worlds" became apparent on Judgement Day: > The whole creation is with the Intercessor of The Day of Acquittal > When the Prophet took Dillu Ram with him into Paradise > It was known that this Hindu too is with the Beloved of God! > > This poem, especially scandalized Muslim orthodoxy, because it dared > to suggest that the prophet himself would intercede on behalf of an > unbeliever on the day of judgement. > > It is interesting to note that Dillu Ram never became a Muslim, at > least not in his lifetime. An article in the interesting web portal > Chowk http://www.chowk.com/articles/12692 by one Asif Naqshbandi says > > "It is also said that Dillu Ram, delirious with his love, would > sometimes stand in the middle of the bazaar in Delhi, put chains > around his neck and feet and shout at the top of his voice to all > passers-by, "Muhammad! Muhammad! Muhammad! Yes! Muhammad is the > Beloved of God! Muhammad is the first and only Beloved of God! If God > loves you, He loves you because of His Beloved!" Some people even > stoned him and he would often come home covered in blood but he was > totally lost in his love of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon > him!)" > > There is an apocryphal story of how on his deathbed Dillu Ram Kausari > had a vision of the Prophet himself, who came to him, and that he > read the Kalima with him. But as this vision is reported to have > appeared only to him, as he lay dying, and as he is no longer with us > to either confirm or deny this deathbed conversion, we can only > surmise that it was a generous, but somewhat disingenuous method of > having Dillu Ram's somewhat unorthodox Muslim apologists claim him > for themselves. > > As far as we are concerned, Dillu Ram Kausari, caused grave offence, > by his love for the Prophet, both to Hindu as well as to Muslim > zealots, as long as he lived. > > If, the things we call religions are 'ways of life' then we can > always determine for ourselves whether we want to walk on a one way > street that runs into a dead end, or to cross many paths, walking > down one way, for one purpose, down another way for another, and > sometimes just standing in between paths, figuring out our journey, > as we go about our lives. > > I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not > because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to > cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. And all they > were doing was crossing the road. > > thanks and regards, > > Shuddha > > ----- > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 13:58:49 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:58:49 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals In-Reply-To: <822777.99371.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <822777.99371.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808290128g4851f6ebkc65fb8823f2a7836@mail.gmail.com> Khurram, What was "mysterious" about killing of minorities in Kashmir. Do you deny that it was an Islamic onslaught and selective killing. Or do you believe that in 20 years the memories would have been erased? Pawan On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Khurram Parvez wrote: > APPEAL > We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that > the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel > deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of > Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian > Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on > minorities in Kashmir. > Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under > mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust > amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings > take place, the people's movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The > killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at > Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or > killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of > mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by > government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill > Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to Madeline > Albright's book titled "Mighty and the Almighty" has clearly accused Hindu > fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora. > In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the > attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is > resonating not just in India but also in the International media and > institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether Hindus or > Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir. > In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community leaders, > religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to > ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from > any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The > minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the > agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people's movement of Kashmir. > In the wake of present peaceful people's movement to realise the right of > self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge > upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a > comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and > Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council's recently announced > statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian > areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a > comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and > Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people's > movement. > We urge the government of India to halt the brutal use of force against the > people and respect the people's right to assembly and freedom of expression > both in Kashmir and Jammu. The arrests and the killings of anyone are > unacceptable. > We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly > have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is > always to be humane besides being politically correct. > In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested, > communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that > situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international > community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population > of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions > it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the > restoration of people's rights. > We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form the > inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find > their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have > lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our > political emancipation. > We also urge the community leaders, civil society actors, political parties > of Jammu province to strive for the safety and security of Muslims and other > minorities residing in Jammu. > Signed by: > Moulana Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin Ahmed (Mufti Azam JK State and Incharge > of religious affairs of Jammu and Kashmir), > Mirwaiz Molvi Riyaz Ahmed Hamdani, > Islamic Study Circle, > Aga Syed Hassan Al Moosvi – President - Anjuman Sharie Shiyaan, > Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, > Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, > Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner's Federation, > Valley Citizens Council, > Jan Mohammad Koul, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation, > Noor Ahmed Bilal – President Kashmir University Teachers Association, > Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee, > Kashmir Thinker's Guild, > Dr. Altaf Hussain, > Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), > Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist), > Anwar Ashai (Social Activist), > Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Poet) > Adv. A. R. Hanjoora (Social Activist), > Hameeda Bano (Faculty of English, University of Kashmir), > Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), > Noor Ahmed Baba (Dean Social Sciences, University of Kashmir), > Mohammad Azeem Tuman (House Boat Owners Association), > Himayat Trust, > JK People's Development Trust, > Ehsaas – A Developmental Organisation, > Mushtaaque Ali Ahmed Khan (Theatre Activist and Film Maker) > Senior Citizens Forum > Kashmir Urdu Academy > Jammu and Kashmir Cultural Society > Syed us Sadaat Trust, Islamabad, Kashmir > Hudood ullah Research Centre > Eco Concern, Islamabad, Kashmir > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Fri Aug 29 14:27:57 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 08:57:57 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] A Poem by Faraz In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <670094.63258.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Shuddha, Thanks. Of course it is a very very powerful poem. whenever i have read it, its power has captivated me. Faraz stood firm on the side of those victimised by the state, 'ideology' and jackboots. This poem conjures up images of suffering Kashmiris - who are being ruthlessly massacred, starved by the blockade and humiliated at every point in the name of 'national integration' and what not. I sincerely hope that it all ends soon and Kashmiris can live as freely as any other people in the world. best, Murtaza --- On Thu, 28/8/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta Subject: Re: [Reader-list] A Poem by Faraz To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Cc: "sarai list" Date: Thursday, 28 August, 2008, 10:23 PM Dear Kshmendra, Dear all, Many thanks, Kshmendra, for the posts on Ahmed Faraz's death, news of which will leave all those who love Urdu poetry with a sense of loss. Thank you also for your translation, and for the link to online editions of Faraz's poems, which I am sure will introduce the many non-Urdu speakers on this list to a sense of Faraz's work. In many parked cars all over north India, middle aged gentlemen sipping clandestine whisky alone by themselves, or with a sad companion, sometimes play the song 'Ranjish hi sahi" or 'At least let there be rancour' in a saccharine sweet rendition by Ghulam Ali, without knowing that they are listening to the words of Ahmed Faraz. To most, Faraaz is the consummate poet of male melancholia, of unrequited love and the bittersweet ironic cadences of unspoken (or unspeakable) desire, sometimes smothered by the over-the-top voices of many Indian and Pakistani Ghazal singers. I have a certain affection for this Faraz, as I do, in my own way ,for his melancholy fans. But there is also an angry, acerbic Faraz. A Faraz less likely to feature in the CD players of punjabi gentlemen as they pour themselves another large measure of Blenders Pride, or if they can get it, Scotch, before they return to loveless marriages and sleepless nights thinking about falling interest rates. And this is Faraaz the traitor, the Faraz I love. Ahmed Faraz is one of the few poets who earned himself the distinction of imprisonment under Zulfikar Ali Bhutto as well as exile under Zia ul Haq. His words spoke a trenchant opposition to every henchman that has occupied the postition of paramountcy in the sad and bleak political landscape of Pakistan. Neither Nawaz Sharif, nor Parwaiz Musharraf escaped his scathing tongue. And he returned his Hilal-e-Imtiaz, the highest civilian decoration given to Pakistanis in disgust at the excesses of Musharraf's military dictatorship. Faraz may have been loved by people all over the Urdu speaking world, but he has had his fair share of hatred from many Pakistani nationalists, and was considered by many to be a traitor, a seditionist, especially after his poem 'Pesheywar Qatilon Tum Sipahi Nahi!' spoke openly and critically of the genocide unleashed by the Pakistani Army in erstwhile East Pakistan (now Bangladesh) and massacres in Balochistan. Here is my rough, random and incorrect attempt at translation of some of the lines of this poem. The Urdu (romanized) fragment is first, the English version follows. Pesheywar Qatilon Tum Sipahi Nahi! Mein ne ab tak tumhare qaseeday likhe Aur Aaj apne naghmo se sharminda hoon ..... seena chakan-e-mashriq bhee apnay hee thay jin ka khooN mooN pay malnay kay tum aaey they ..... in kee taqdeer to kya badaltay magar in kee naslain badalnay ko tum aaey thay ..... aur marg-e-bangal kay baad bolan main shehrioN kay galay katnay aaing gay ------------------------------- You are professional killers, not soldiers for whom I had written elegies till now today I am ashamed of my poems for you ...... Those in the east, flesh of our flesh, they were ours too, whose blood you painted on your faces ....... You went to change their fortunes, and look what you did their children are the progeny of your rape ..... and after soaking in the bloodbath of Bengal you turn to slit the throats of so many in Bolan - (Bolan is a place in Balochistan) -------------------- Ahmed Faraz's direct and fearless indictment of the Pakistani Army's massacres in East Pakistan and Balochistan (Bolan is the site of a famous massacre, which was undertaken as part of the crushing of an uprising in Balochistan in the '70s) earned him the eternal wrath and ingratitude of Pakistan's ruling elite. From being the darling of PTV mushaira circuit he suddenly became yet another 'invisible intellectual' under the mind numbing years under Zia Ul Haq. In doing so, he joined the ranks of Faiz Ahmed Faiz, Eqbal Ahmed and many others, who opposed the tyrranies they saw unleashed by successive ruling elites in Pakistan with courage and forthrightness. They spoke up for the Bengalis in Pakistan when that needed to be done. When not to have spoken so would have meant being complicit in the most brutal violence, I say this, especially because there has been a lot of talk of late of how 'seditious' writers, who have spoken up for the people of Kashmir, must be dealt with in India. What is unstated in all this is how close in spirit those who want to charge writers with sedition in India are to their peers in Pakistan. However much they may hate to admit it, the hard line nationalists of India and Pakistan are like identical twins. If Pakistani nationalism had unleashed decades of brutality in the erstwhile East Pakistan and Balochistan, then Indian Nationalism too conducts its own grotesque opera of terror in Kashmir and the North East. If on one side of the border the tendency is to blame every unpleasantness on the R&AW, then on the other side of the border, the favourite suspect is the ISI. If Pakistani zealots set churches on fire in the Punjab, then Indian zealots burn churches in Orissa. If Pakistani goons massacre Hindus and Bhil tribesmen in Sindh, then Indian thugs massacre Muslims in Gujarat. if Paksitan's angry elite habitually charges writers with treason and sedition, (Faraz is not the only persecuted writer in the history of Pakistan) then Indian elites too yearn to do the same. Even my unbeliever's heart likes to hope that somewhere, in some corner of a writer's heaven, there must be a patch of 'Azad' ground reserved for those who with their words, enacted an honourable treason towards their nations in the name of the deeper and more abiding claims of an un-namable humanity. If there is indeed such a heaven, then I hope that it has welcomed Ahmed Faraz with open arms. Meanwhile, the Indian writers charged with sedition by angry patriots are earning their place in that traitors heaven with every word they write on Kashmir, next to Ahmed Faraz. I hope no one amongst them is in a hurry to get there ahead of time. We need such traitors, many more traitors, and we need them to live well and live long, for they alone can save us in India from the shame we remain complicit in, at least as long as Kashmir is held by force in our name. I hope we can all learn from the quiet and honorable sedition of Ahmed Faraz. regards, Shuddha On 28-Aug-08, at 5:25 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: > In one of his Ghazals, Faraz writes: > > Jisko bhi chaa'ha, ussay shiddat se chaa'ha hai Faraz > sil'silaa too'taa nahi dard ki zanjeer ka > > My impoverished translation: > > That what I desired, I desired with ferocity > Unbroken links of pain, I ever enchained > > Pakistan has struggled since it Independence to come out of the > clutches of Military Dictatorship, that allowed it only every now > and then to flirt with Democracy. In this period Pakistan has an > impressive literary history, especially from amongst the poets in > both their writings and public demeanour, wherein they have not > only been critical and questioning of 'dictatorship' but also > revolted. Faraz is one such Poet. > > A poem (a lamentation) below by Faraz which though written for > Pakistan would be equally applicable to India. My apologies to > those for whom Urdu is alien. It is beyond my capability to > translate it > > Kshmendra > > ab kis kaa jashn manaate ho us des kaa jo taqsiim huaa > ab kis ke giit sunaate ho us tan-man kaa jo do-niim huaa > > > us Khvaab kaa jo rezaa rezaa un aa.Nkho.n kii taqadiir huaa > us naam kaa jo Tuka.Daa Tuka.Daa galiyo.n me.n be-tauqiir huaa > > > us parcham kaa jis kii hurmat baazaaro.n me.n niilaam hu_ii > us miTTii kaa jis kii hurmat mansuub uduu ke naam hu_ii > > > us jang ko jo tum haar chuke us rasm kaa jo jaarii bhii nahii.n > us zaKhm kaa jo siine pe na thaa us jaan kaa jo vaarii bhii nahii.n > > > us Khuun kaa jo bad_qismat thaa raaho.n me.n bahaayaa tan me.n rahaa > us phuul kaa jo beqiimat thaa aa.Ngan me.n khilaa yaa ban me.n rahaa > > > us mashriq kaa jis ko tum ne neze kii anii marham samajhaa > us maGarib kaa jis ko tum ne jitana bhii luuTaa kam samajhaa > > > un maasuumo.n kaa jin ke lahuu se tum ne farozaa.N raate.n kii.n > yaa un mazaluumo.n kaa jis se Khanjar kii zubaa.N me.n baate.n kii.n > > > us mariyam kaa jis kii iffat luTatii hai bhare baazaaro.n me.n > us iisaa kaa jo qaatil hai aur shaamil hai Gam_Khvaaro.n me.n > > > in nauhaagaro.n kaa jin ne hame.n Khud qatl kiyaa Khud rote hai.n > aise bhii kahii.n dam_saaz hue aise jallaad bhii hote hai.n > > > un bhuuke nange Dhaa.Ncho.n kaa jo raqs sar-e-baazaar kare.n > yaa un zaalim qazzaaqo.n kaa jo bhes badal kar vaar kare.n > > > yaa un JhuuTe iqaraaro.n kaa jo aaj talak aifaa na hue > yaa un bebas laachaaro.n kaa jo aur bhii dukh kaa nishaanaa hue > > > is shaahii kaa jo dast-ba-dast aa_ii hai tumhaare hisse me.n > kyo.n nang-e-vatan kii baat karo kyaa rakhaa hai is qisse me.n > > > aa.Nkho.n me.n chhupaaye ashko.n ko ho.nTho.n me.n vafaa ke bol liye > is jashn me.n bhii shaamil huu.N nauho.n se bharaa kashkol liye > > > Reproduced from the most brilliant web-resource for Romanized Urdu > Poetry - Urdupoetry.com http://www.urdupoetry.com/faraz42.html > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From lalitambardar at hotmail.com Fri Aug 29 15:33:44 2008 From: lalitambardar at hotmail.com (Lalit Ambardar) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 10:03:44 +0000 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808290128g4851f6ebkc65fb8823f2a7836@mail.gmail.com> References: <822777.99371.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6b79f1a70808290128g4851f6ebkc65fb8823f2a7836@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: First of all it is high time the Kashmiri Muslim separatists stop issuing calls in the name of whole of Jammu & Kashmir. Ladakh rose against Kashmiri Muslim hegemony long ago & it seeks greater integration with rest of India . Jammu following the recent pro India nationalistic mass uprising there against the rabid intolerance exhibited by the Kashmiri pan Islamists over a mere 100 acres of land for arduous Amarnath pilgrimage route has reiterated greater integration with rest of india .Miffed over the pro India nationalistic mass movement the separatists were forced to declare that Jammu wasn't on their agenda. The separatists publically disowned Jammu. Let the 'conscientious people' of kashmir recall those black days & nights of 1990 when Kashmiri Hindu Pandits were selectively targeted & killed in cold blood. How could the calls like " raliv, galiv ya chaliv" meaning 'join ,perish or flee '& asya gachi Pakistan batav roch ta batnev san" meaning 'we want Pakistan ,along with the Pandit women & without Pandit men' to create fear psychosis that finally lead to the mass exodus of the beleaguered community from the valley, be forgotten so soon. Time has come for the civil society in Kashmir to arise & speak against the mayhem that has been unleashed in the valley for the past almost two decades now. Let the hearts bleed for those hundreds of wailing mothers,widows & orphans whose indoctrinated & motivated dear ones were lost to this seemingly unending strife.LA > Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 13:58:49 +0530> From: pawan.durani at gmail.com> To: khurramparvez at yahoo.com> CC: reader-list at sarai.net> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals> > Khurram,> What was "mysterious" about killing of minorities in Kashmir. Do you deny> that it was an Islamic onslaught and selective killing.> > Or do you believe that in 20 years the memories would have been erased?> > Pawan> > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Khurram Parvez wrote:> > > APPEAL> > We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that> > the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel> > deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of> > Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian> > Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on> > minorities in Kashmir.> > Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under> > mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust> > amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings> > take place, the people's movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The> > killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at> > Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or> > killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of> > mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by> > government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill> > Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to Madeline> > Albright's book titled "Mighty and the Almighty" has clearly accused Hindu> > fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora.> > In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the> > attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is> > resonating not just in India but also in the International media and> > institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether Hindus or> > Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir.> > In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community leaders,> > religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to> > ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from> > any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The> > minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the> > agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people's movement of Kashmir.> > In the wake of present peaceful people's movement to realise the right of> > self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge> > upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a> > comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and> > Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council's recently announced> > statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian> > areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a> > comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and> > Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people's> > movement.> > We urge the government of India to halt the brutal use of force against the> > people and respect the people's right to assembly and freedom of expression> > both in Kashmir and Jammu. The arrests and the killings of anyone are> > unacceptable.> > We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly> > have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is> > always to be humane besides being politically correct.> > In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested,> > communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that> > situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international> > community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population> > of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions> > it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the> > restoration of people's rights.> > We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form the> > inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find> > their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have> > lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our> > political emancipation.> > We also urge the community leaders, civil society actors, political parties> > of Jammu province to strive for the safety and security of Muslims and other> > minorities residing in Jammu.> > Signed by:> > Moulana Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin Ahmed (Mufti Azam JK State and Incharge> > of religious affairs of Jammu and Kashmir),> > Mirwaiz Molvi Riyaz Ahmed Hamdani,> > Islamic Study Circle,> > Aga Syed Hassan Al Moosvi – President - Anjuman Sharie Shiyaan,> > Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society,> > Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir,> > Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner's Federation,> > Valley Citizens Council,> > Jan Mohammad Koul, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation,> > Noor Ahmed Bilal – President Kashmir University Teachers Association,> > Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee,> > Kashmir Thinker's Guild,> > Dr. Altaf Hussain,> > Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist),> > Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist),> > Anwar Ashai (Social Activist),> > Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Poet)> > Adv. A. R. Hanjoora (Social Activist),> > Hameeda Bano (Faculty of English, University of Kashmir),> > Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir),> > Noor Ahmed Baba (Dean Social Sciences, University of Kashmir),> > Mohammad Azeem Tuman (House Boat Owners Association),> > Himayat Trust,> > JK People's Development Trust,> > Ehsaas – A Developmental Organisation,> > Mushtaaque Ali Ahmed Khan (Theatre Activist and Film Maker)> > Senior Citizens Forum> > Kashmir Urdu Academy> > Jammu and Kashmir Cultural Society> > Syed us Sadaat Trust, Islamabad, Kashmir> > Hudood ullah Research Centre> > Eco Concern, Islamabad, Kashmir> >> >> >> >> > _________________________________________> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> > Critiques & Collaborations> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with> > subscribe in the subject header.> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list> > List archive: > _________________________________________> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> Critiques & Collaborations> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________________________________ Searching for the best deals on travel? Visit MSN Travel. http://msn.coxandkings.co.in/cnk/cnk.do From shuddha at sarai.net Fri Aug 29 15:37:48 2008 From: shuddha at sarai.net (Shuddhabrata Sengupta) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 15:37:48 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808290128g4851f6ebkc65fb8823f2a7836@mail.gmail.com> References: <822777.99371.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6b79f1a70808290128g4851f6ebkc65fb8823f2a7836@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <396EBB32-140E-4035-9BE9-2250A9CDDCD8@sarai.net> Dear Pawan, I find it utterly sad and deplorable that in response to the most serious appeal by a coalition of individuals and civil society groups for the protection of minorities in the Kashmir valley forwarded to this list by Khurram Parvez, you (Pawan) have only this to say. Surely this list deserves better, even from you. Rather than respect their concern and be reciprocal, all you can do is search for a glib and quick volley to shore up your precious and frankly, pathetic, anti-muslim credentials. You cry yourself hoarse that no Kashmiri Muslim of significance has ever done anything that is positive for Kashmiri Pandits, and the moment someone makes a sincere effort, you show your cynical fangs. For once, please try and have some respect for the fact that the persons concerned are putting themselves on the line by appealing for peace and demanding that no violence be done to minorities in Kashmir. Had you stayed on in Kashmir, this would have meant an appeal for your safety and security. I hope you have the humanity left in you to understand that. Such an appeal can not endear those who are its signatories to those Islamists who actually want minorities in Kashmir attacked at this critical juncture. Anyone who wants Kashmiri minorities (Pandits and Sikhs) attacked at this point of time will be playing into the hands of the Indian state's vice like grip on Kashmir by contributing to the creation of a fear pyschosis, and must be identified and isolated by all segments of Kashmiri society as a de-facto agent of the occupation of the Kashmir valley. I had so far refrained from commenting on the newspaper report forwarded recently about the apprehensions expressed by R&AW that minorities are under threat in the valley. Given that the United Jihad Council (the most significant 'Militant' grouping) has declared that it will not take to arms at this juncture, any threat to the minorities in the valley will need to be 'manufactured', as it has been done on several occasions in the past. It in fact needs to be manufactured in order to lay the ground for the justification of massive use of state force to bring the situation under control. The state finds its hands tied by the fact that it is facing an un-armed and democratic resistance. it is precisely at times like this that 'terror' needs to be manufactured, when it is in fact not there. The Intelligence agencies and their shadowy clients in Kashmir (who play all sides with equal ease, seguing smoothly from insurgent to counter-insurgent) will no doubt be at work to instil fear in the minds of those Pandit and Sikh families who remain in the Kashmir valley. I hope that the Pandits and Sikhs who remain in the valley see through these designs and trust their neighbours more than they do these rumour mongers. This statement that Khurram has forwarded is Kashmiri civil society's timely effort to counter the spin-doctoring and rumour mongering that has already begun, just as it had begun in the bitter winter of 1989. In the coming days, we are sure to see more threats, more fear, more spin, and possibly some attempts at instigating what can be exhibited as 'terrorism'. The difference is, this time, the people of Kashmir seem better prepared, and seem to be giving all indication that they are in a position to be able to give enough notice to indicate where exactly these threats and rumours actually emanate from. Let me tell you exactly what was 'mysterious' about the killings of minorities in Kashmir. What was mysterious was the fact that in many (though not all) instances, especially after the initial days of the troubled times of 1989, the killers remained at large, and were known to be at large, not because they were 'militants', but because it is quite likely that they were 'counter-insurgents' - the dreaded 'Ikhwanis' - renegades and other shadowy outfits and individuals (who whether for ideological or for simply mercenary reasons) performed massacres and other shadowy operations of the 'dirty war' in Kashmir, whenever called upon to do so at the instance of their masters in the Indian intelligence and military establishments. I have no doubt that they participated in the massacres of Pandits, just as much as I have no doubt at all about the fact that several amongst them participated in far bigger massacres and targetted killings of Kashmiri Muslims. They were the shadowy face of state terror, and their role has been well documented by now, despite the best efforts of the 'deep state'. Their existence was especially brought into relief by the unravelling of the aftermath of the Chattisinghpura massacre which is explicitly mentioned in this appeal. if you really, sincerely want to punish those who were guilty of many of the killings of Pandits that took place, what you would be demanding would be thorough-going forensic investigations and fact finding reports, that would be carried out by independent professional agencies and forensic anthropologiests, without fear or favour. If any such killings occur in the near future (and I sincerely hope that they dont) then an immediate international demand should be made for UN intervention and independent forensic investigation, because we cannot any longer trust the bona-fide motivations of the Indian state at least in this regard, any longer. Incidentally, the actions of such teams of professional forensic anthropologists have helped clarify issues to do with other such instances of 'engineered' massacres, in other situations of conflict - in Latin America, Central Africa, Bosnia, Sri Lanka and East Timor. regards, Shuddha On 29-Aug-08, at 1:58 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Khurram, > What was "mysterious" about killing of minorities in Kashmir. Do > you deny > that it was an Islamic onslaught and selective killing. > > Or do you believe that in 20 years the memories would have been > erased? > > Pawan > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Khurram Parvez > wrote: > >> APPEAL >> We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and >> uphold that >> the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard >> we feel >> deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by >> sections of >> Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the >> Indian >> Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on >> minorities in Kashmir. >> Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities >> under >> mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and >> mistrust >> amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these >> killings >> take place, the people's movement of Kashmir is at a critical >> phase. The >> killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 >> Sikhs at >> Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill >> Clinton) or >> killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an >> aura of >> mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations >> ordered by >> government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. >> Bill >> Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword >> to Madeline >> Albright's book titled "Mighty and the Almighty" has clearly >> accused Hindu >> fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora. >> In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the >> attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and >> Kashmir is >> resonating not just in India but also in the International media and >> institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether >> Hindus or >> Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir. >> In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community >> leaders, >> religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and >> government to >> ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and >> refrain from >> any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The >> minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out >> the >> agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people's movement of >> Kashmir. >> In the wake of present peaceful people's movement to realise the >> right of >> self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, >> we urge >> upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a >> comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of >> Jammu and >> Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council's recently announced >> statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within >> civilian >> areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a >> comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered >> Jammu and >> Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the >> people's >> movement. >> We urge the government of India to halt the brutal use of force >> against the >> people and respect the people's right to assembly and freedom of >> expression >> both in Kashmir and Jammu. The arrests and the killings of anyone are >> unacceptable. >> We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We >> certainly >> have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious >> people is >> always to be humane besides being politically correct. >> In the present situation where the political leadership has been >> arrested, >> communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood >> that >> situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge >> international >> community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole >> population >> of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international >> institutions >> it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for >> the >> restoration of people's rights. >> We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who >> form the >> inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they >> will find >> their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the >> circumstances we have >> lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together >> for our >> political emancipation. >> We also urge the community leaders, civil society actors, >> political parties >> of Jammu province to strive for the safety and security of Muslims >> and other >> minorities residing in Jammu. >> Signed by: >> Moulana Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin Ahmed (Mufti Azam JK State and >> Incharge >> of religious affairs of Jammu and Kashmir), >> Mirwaiz Molvi Riyaz Ahmed Hamdani, >> Islamic Study Circle, >> Aga Syed Hassan Al Moosvi – President - Anjuman Sharie Shiyaan, >> Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, >> Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, >> Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner's Federation, >> Valley Citizens Council, >> Jan Mohammad Koul, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation, >> Noor Ahmed Bilal – President Kashmir University Teachers Association, >> Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee, >> Kashmir Thinker's Guild, >> Dr. Altaf Hussain, >> Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), >> Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist), >> Anwar Ashai (Social Activist), >> Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Poet) >> Adv. A. R. Hanjoora (Social Activist), >> Hameeda Bano (Faculty of English, University of Kashmir), >> Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), >> Noor Ahmed Baba (Dean Social Sciences, University of Kashmir), >> Mohammad Azeem Tuman (House Boat Owners Association), >> Himayat Trust, >> JK People's Development Trust, >> Ehsaas – A Developmental Organisation, >> Mushtaaque Ali Ahmed Khan (Theatre Activist and Film Maker) >> Senior Citizens Forum >> Kashmir Urdu Academy >> Jammu and Kashmir Cultural Society >> Syed us Sadaat Trust, Islamabad, Kashmir >> Hudood ullah Research Centre >> Eco Concern, Islamabad, Kashmir >> >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Shuddhabrata Sengupta The Sarai Programme at CSDS Raqs Media Collective shuddha at sarai.net www.sarai.net www.raqsmediacollective.net From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 15:51:34 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 03:21:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals Message-ID: <214826.89597.qm@web31508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Why such appeals are not made before enough killing are done every time? If we can not help ourselves and keep killing  our own people making them homeless in their own homeland what is the meaning of such appeal and what foreigners can do for us? Let us put our own house in order first. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Khurram Parvez To: SARAI Sent: Friday, 29 August, 2008 1:38:00 PM Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals APPEAL We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on minorities in Kashmir. Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings take place, the people’s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to Madeline Albright’s book titled “Mighty and the Almighty” has clearly accused Hindu fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora. In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also in the International media and institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir. In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community leaders, religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people’s movement of Kashmir. In the wake of present peaceful people’s movement to realise the right of self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council’s recently announced statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people’s movement. We urge the government of India to halt the brutal use of force against the people and respect the people’s right to assembly and freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu. The arrests and the killings of anyone are unacceptable. We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is always to be humane besides being politically correct. In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested, communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the restoration of people’s rights. We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form the inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our political emancipation. We also urge the community leaders, civil society actors, political parties of Jammu province to strive for the safety and security of Muslims and other minorities residing in Jammu. Signed by: Moulana Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin Ahmed (Mufti Azam JK State and Incharge of religious affairs of Jammu and Kashmir), Mirwaiz Molvi Riyaz Ahmed Hamdani, Islamic Study Circle, Aga Syed Hassan Al Moosvi – President - Anjuman Sharie Shiyaan, Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner’s Federation, Valley Citizens Council, Jan Mohammad Koul, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation, Noor Ahmed Bilal – President Kashmir University Teachers Association, Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee, Kashmir Thinker’s Guild, Dr. Altaf Hussain, Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist), Anwar Ashai (Social Activist), Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Poet) Adv. A. R. Hanjoora (Social Activist), Hameeda Bano (Faculty of English, University of Kashmir), Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), Noor Ahmed Baba (Dean Social Sciences, University of Kashmir), Mohammad Azeem Tuman (House Boat Owners Association), Himayat Trust, JK People’s Development Trust, Ehsaas – A Developmental Organisation, Mushtaaque Ali Ahmed Khan (Theatre Activist and Film Maker) Senior Citizens Forum Kashmir Urdu Academy Jammu and Kashmir Cultural Society Syed us Sadaat Trust, Islamabad, Kashmir Hudood ullah Research Centre Eco Concern, Islamabad, Kashmir       _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/invite/ From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 16:21:35 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 16:21:35 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Shuddha, Unfair to accuse Mukul Kesavan of advocating Empire when he clearly concludes that it is a squalid choice. His article raises questions and ends in a non-conclusion. These are squalid choices, we have identified them as such, so are we forced then into making a choice between these two givens or can we make that quantum leap into something that frees us from these squalid choices? Again, I take the opportunity of trying to slip in between the either and ors, the this and that, the polar opposites, the idea of a third choice: one of a South Asian Union, a choice that is inclusive rather than exclusive, that cleaves to rather than cleaves. It is Utopian, I admit, but no more so than Rahmat Ali¹s idea a decade before Pakistan came into being. As someone deeply uncomfortable with the large presence of Indian troops who occupy the Kashmir valley I realized very quickly that just taking a moral stance on demilitarization was not going to do much more than give me a squeaky clean conscience. My trajectory went from thinking and writing about it to actually engaging with various processes to try and find a lasting solution, at least one where people could think of a lasting solution in a terror-free atmosphere. I¹d like to share some of my thoughts and experiences: You have rightly pointed out that Azadi means different things to different people. I¹d say for most people in J&K Azadi means to be able to live without the fear of the gun. Khurram has just sent an appeal from various groups in Kashmir. Within it is an appeal for a ceasefire to both the Indian security forces and the militants. I think this is something that should be taken up seriously. Vajpayee¹s unilateral Ramzan ceasefire in 2000-01 was commendable, but it resulted in 151 civilians being killed in the first 3 months of the ceasefire, clearly showing that if a ceasefire was to be effective for the entire population then it had to be something that worked both ways. The Indian government will never again embark on this experiment unilaterally because it so clearly failed a section of the Kashmiri population. Is it possible for the Indian state to withdraw its armies? Of course it was since the armies only went in after 1990. Before that the BSF manned the borders and the army was confined to various brigade HQ. The Rashtriya Rifles did not exist. Clearly the hellish Œpermanency¹ of the situation was less than 20 years old and could be reversed. The condition placed by the GoI for demilitarization was if levels of violence went down and threat perceptions decreased. The peace process between India and Pakistan, spurred on by civil society pressure groups, addressed this concern and was moving in a calibrated manner towards these goals, despite opposition from many on both sides. In formal and informal meetings with Kashmiri separatists or on various trips to Pakistan and in forums with Pakistani politicians and peace activists I have raised the question of a ceasefire from the side of the mujahideen. Is it possible to have a ceasefire? If not a ceasefire, is it possible that the civilian population is not targeted? While civil society in Kashmir and Pakistan may agree in principle, those in government disagree. There is a strong feeling among the Pakistani hawks that India is too powerful a nation to be challenged by conventional means and that if the pressure from the militants dropped India would be quite content to allow things to remain unchanged. It is a feeling based on mistrust, on the Indian Constitution that doesn¹t allow for the redrawing of borders, and for a general lack of interest on the Indian side to tamper with the status quo. And even if the mujahideen were unable to wrest Kashmir as they wrested Afghanistan from the Soviets, their continued presence would guarantee the irksome presence of Indian troops that will definitely keep the Kashmir pot boiling. The Indian establishment feels that they have already conceded too much when they mistakenly adopted (or were forced to adopt) a minimalist position in negotiating on J&K by not challenging Pakistan¹s position of PAK and the restive Northern Areas ( where, incidentally, for 60 years there has been no adult franchise, no constitution, no guarantees of fundamental rights or democratic representation). They feel if they had upped the ante 60 years ago, Pakistan would have been content with the give and take that would have resulted in their keeping PAK and the NA and Indian settling for J&K with some minor adjustments along the border. I am sorry for this very long post. I have given this background for those who may not understand the history of this deadlock and may feel confused by the complexities. The deadlock was somewhat loosened with the beginning of the peace process between India & Pakistan. Among the CBMs one was hoping for a quick breakthrough on Sir Creek and Siachen. These would have paved the way for greater CBMs in J&K that envisioned the opening of the Muzaffarabad road for trade and the free flow of pilgrims and tourists from Pakistan to Kashmir. When Manmohan Singh spoke of Œmaking borders irrelevant¹ many of us saw the first outlines of a free, stable, peaceful South Asia. When Pakistan began imploding in 2006 and the peace process was put on the backburner, many rightly feared the unraveling of all that had been gained in J&K. In May this year, soon after the formation of the civilian government in Pakistan, for the first time in 5 years there was a meeting called by the United Jihad Council in Muzaffarabad where weapons were brandished openly and a call given for the renewal of Jihad in Kashmir. Pakistani journalist friends saw this as the military and ISI undermining the civilian government in Pakistan as well as trying to win some popularity with the conservatives who were outraged by Pakistani gunships bombing entire villages out of existence in the NWFP and Swat. This situation suits Indian hawks too who are only too happy to see things going to pieces in Pakistan in the hope that things have to get really bad (with the Balkanization of Pakistan) for things to get better in Kashmir. I have seen too much of this war to know that things are not going to change on the ground because 200,000 people came out on the streets or if a few intellectuals in India have demanded that troops be withdrawn. To get the talks back on track should be everyone¹s first priority. We should pressure the GoI to take the initiative to restart talks between India and Pakistan, to invigorate the stalled working groups in Kashmir. We ourselves need to actively encourage talks between the regions of Jammu and Kashmir and act as facilitators if & where we are needed to help heal relations that seem irreparably damaged. Best regards, Sonia On 8/29/08 12:41 PM, "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" wrote: > Dear Rahul,  > > > > Thank you for your poser. And I hope that all readers will agree with me when > I say that it is precisely the kind of question that one hopes to see more of > on this list. I will try and get a handle on this, but, as my grasp on > technical matters in philosophy is poor, I hope others who are more competent > will join this discussion. Let me first of all state that the word 'Azadi' or > 'Freedom' which is used a lot in discussions around Kashmir does not mean the > same thing for all those who use it. For some it means the freedom to oppress > others in an Islamist state, for some it means the freedom to oppress oneself > in a strong secular state. For me, personally, it means the freedom not to be > oppressed, as far as is possible, by any state. We need to to keep this > spectrum in mind when we debate the choices apparently offered by Kesavan in > his article. > > > > I enjoyed reading Mukul Kesavan's article, because it helped me think quite a > few things through, even though I do not necessarily come to the same > conclusions (or non-conclusions, and i have no problem with non-conclusions, > they are often more useful than limiting conclusions).  > > > > After spelling out the case against India holding on to Kashmir he says -  > > > >>> But there is a case against self-determination which needs to be made, >>> if only to clarify the consequence of endorsing >>> >>> self-determination. > > > This is the kind of debate and discussion that we need. One that weighs its > options not based of inflexible pre-conceived positions, but through a careful > sifting of argument and reasoning.  > > > > As I am not a liberal, I cannot speak for liberals. But I appreciate the > principled stand that many liberals take in the defence of civil liberty. > Other liberals, I have noticed, tend to cling to the state, (as a sort of > lesser evil, I deliberately use the term 'lesser evil' here because Kesavan > uses it himself, to characterize what he thinks are the motives governing the > choices of those Indian commentators who have spoken in favour of 'Azadi' for > Kashmir. I do not agree with this binary of 'lesser and greater evils' but, we > can speak of that, later). Mukul Kesavan, i think is trying to walk the very > thin wire between these two positions. To be fair, he has not explicitly told > us where his options lie, he has merely tried to tell us what he thinks the > options are. But in doing so he has given a reasonably good idea of where he > would place his bets - with a flawed, compromised secular democratic ideal of > India (which includes Kashmir) as a 'lesser evil' (to use, again his own > language) compared to an independent Islamist statelet in Kashmir, or a > Kashmir that accedes to Pakistan. > > > > However, characteristically, his options only take the form of either this > kind of state, or that kind of state. Either secular India, or Islamist > Kashmir, or an Islamist Kashmir within an Islamist Pakistan. I think the > limitation of this kind of thinking is that it ties the options available to > the people of Kashmir only in terms of what Mukul Kesavan thinks operates > currently on the ground. Why should we have to agree that these indeed exhaust > all possibilities. Self proclaimed 'pragmatists' may think they do, but I am > of the opinion that it is the task of writers and intellectuals, and of all > people working with ideas and images and concepts, to begin working in areas > that so called 'pragmatists' cannot enter because of their own self defined > limits of what they think is or is not possible. The idea of universal adult > suffrage, (which is today considered the staple basis of republican statehood) > was once considered a laughably utopian idea. But once you accept the > necessity of a particular form of political expression, then, you can begin to > think about the most practical means to achieve it in the shortest time. The > trouble is, as long as commentators think that the solutions to Kashmir, (or > Ossetia, or Chechnya, or whatever) lie only in a cloning, or division, or > consolidation, or integration of post-Westphalian states, (and the gamut of > proposals ranging from an independent secular Kashmir, to an independent > Islamist Kashmir, to an Independent secular Jammu and Kashmir, to a Kashmir > that accedes to Pakistan, to a Kashmir that is held by India all fall along > this 'state' centric spectrum) they are refusing to engage with the > possibility that it is precisely the 'form' of the nation-state that is the > wall on which a seemingly intractable reality like Kashmir bangs its head, > time and again. They refuse, in other words, to think of any other 'form' by > which peoples can live together in a given territory. The spectre of the > sovereign refuses to let go of them. They may disagree violently over which > state they wish to commit to, but they are, in the end, all loyal to the idea > of the sovereign.  > > > > In that sense, all these options, to me are, actually - deontological and in > some cases tend towards a kind of virtue ethics. I say this because they argue > not in terms of the consequences of the state form, but in terms of our some > kind of presupposed fidelity to one form or the other of the state itself.  > > > > Elsewhere in his text, Kesavan also tries to make a weak teleological or > consequentialist argument, when he raises the spectre of what happenned in > Yugoslavia, or Sri Lanka as a caveat or warning to those who argue for 'Azadi' > for Kashmir. Here, I think he is on very slippery ground. For every example of > what goes wrong when nation states disintegrate, there can be offered counter > examples of what continues to go wrong when nation states that ought not to be > so gargantuan in the first place continue to exist by force. The USSR's > prolonged existence as the inheritor of Czarist Russia's 'prison house of > nations' (barring a brief post 'Oktober 1917' interregnum when the 'right to > self determination' actually permitted the separation of Finland, Poland, the > Baltic Republics and even some Central Asian territories) is an object lesson > in the continued suffering caused by the perpetuation by force of the > Soviet/Russian Imeperium. Kesavan invokes the Chechens, but not to mention > that Stalin's decision to 'wipe Chechnya off the Map' and to deport all > Chechens (and parts of other ethnicities) to forms of forced internal exile, > (in the name of the integrity of the Soviet Union under his dictatorship) led > to many hundreds of thousands of deaths, just as many, if not more than what > occurred consequent to the break-up of Yugoslavia.  > > > > Kesavan goes on to give us another reason for opposing the Kashmiri's  right > to self determination. He says -  > > > >>> Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he thinks the >>> Indian republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in democratic pluralism, >>> that the Indian national movement and the nation-state it created, tried, in >>> an >>> >>> unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea of >>> diversity, not homogeneity > > > This is frankly, very poor reasoning. Once again, weak consequentialism. It is > arguing on the basis of one set of perceived consequences against another set > of imagined consequences. We do not know yet, what an 'Azad' Kashmir is, or > can be. As I said at the very outset, it means very different things to very > different people. In the absence of a sure knowledge of what an entity can be > if it comes into existence, we cannot use our speculation of what we think it > might be, to argue against the desire to change what exists, when its > existence becomes unbearable.  > > > > Finally, again, it presumes that the democratic will of the Kashmiri people is > not really of consequence. Which is a kind of difficult argument for a liberal > to make. It is somewhat reminiscent of those liberals in Britain, like John > Stuart Mill, who believed that a commitment to democracy at home, did not > necessarily translate into a commitment to democracy in the 'colonies'. This > is the well known 'rule of colonial difference'.  > > > > Is Kesavan then offering, as his second option, a lame-liberalism, all too > reminiscent of the  liberals who wanted to maintain the British Empire as a > cricket, tea and sandwiches kind of utopia? Where the natives could serve the > tea and sandwiches, and someday, hope to play cricket? Substitute the word > British for Indian, and you will know exactly what I mean. The tea, sandwiches > and cricket can stay the same. > > > > regards > > > > Shuddha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 29-Aug-08, at 5:15 AM, Rahul Asthana wrote: > >> >> I am tempted to toss a poser on the list.What kind of ethical framework is,or >> should be, more in congruence with the liberal line of thinking -teleological >> or deontological?  >> >> http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/phil/blfaq_phileth_sys.htm >> >> P.S. I am fully well aware of the open ended nature of the question,but I >> think,trying to derive some kind of formalism from Kesavan's advice to >> liberals may churn up some interesting ideas. >> >> >> >> >> >> --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Kshmendra Kaul wrote: >> >> >> >>> From: Kshmendra Kaul >>> >>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir >>> >>> To: "Sarai" , "S. Jabbar" >>> >>> Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:18 PM >>> >>> Most certainly (in my opinion) a fairly and sensibly laid >>> >>> out set of arguments on this issue.  >>> >>> >>> >>> Kshmendra >>> >>> >>> >>> --- On Thu, 8/28/08, S. Jabbar >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> From: S. Jabbar >>> >>> Subject: [Reader-list] Kesavan on Kashmir >>> >>> To: "Sarai" >>> >>> Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 7:00 PM >>> >>> >>> >>>  From the Telegraph, Calcutta >>> >>> >>> >>> THE TROUBLE WITH EDEN >>> >>> - Kashmir offers a choice between two compromised ideals >>> >>> Mukul Kesavan >>> >>> >>> >>> I¹ve never been to Kashmir. I nearly went in 1987 to >>> >>> Srinagar; there¹s a >>> >>> guesthouse there that used to be owned by Grindlays Bank, >>> >>> where I was meant >>> >>> to stay, but then the troubles began and I stayed home. The >>> >>> closest I came >>> >>> to living in Kashmir was living in Kashmiri Gate, a >>> >>> neighbourhood in north >>> >>> Delhi where the walled city ended and the Civil Lines >>> >>> began. There¹s a >>> >>> cinema hall there called the Ritz, where, in the early >>> >>> Sixties, I saw >>> >>> visions of Kashmir in films like Kashmir Ki Kali. Those >>> >>> were the years when >>> >>> Bombay cinema specialized in houseboat and hill-station >>> >>> idylls and in these >>> >>> films Kashmir often stood in for Eden. >>> >>> >>> >>> Delhi was a Jan Sangh city then; Atal Bihari Vajpayee was a >>> >>> promising local >>> >>> politician. Growing up in Kashmiri Gate, I wasn¹t >>> >>> especially political but I >>> >>> knew that Jan Sanghis blamed Nehru for Kashmir¹s disputed >>> >>> status. If he >>> >>> hadn¹t agreed to a plebiscite, or if he had allowed >>> >>> Indians from outside >>> >>> Kashmir to settle there, or if he hadn¹t made the fatal >>> >>> mistake of Article >>> >>> 370, which gave Jammu and Kashmir a special status within >>> >>> the Union, if he >>> >>> hadn¹t indulged Sheikh Abdullah if he hadn¹t done all of >>> >>> this, we wouldn¹t >>> >>> be wrestling with secessionism and sedition in Kashmir. >>> >>> >>> >>> For most of us who, like me, have no first-hand experience >>> >>> of Kashmir, the >>> >>> troubles in the Valley are, for the most part, a series of >>> >>> off-stage noises. >>> >>> Our governors, or more precisely, our proconsuls, sometimes >>> >>> become famous >>> >>> for making bad things worse, wars and skirmishes emblazon >>> >>> names like Kargil >>> >>> on our collective consciousness, newsworthy violence like >>> >>> the purging of >>> >>> Kashmiri Pandits from the valley or the brutalization of >>> >>> Kashmiri Muslims by >>> >>> the security forces surfaces in the newspapers and news >>> >>> channels, and then >>> >>> there are long periods of absent-mindedness when Kashmir >>> >>> disappears and >>> >>> these are the times when it¹s deemed to be calm or inching >>> >>> towards normalcy. >>> >>> Wise men, in these interludes, talk on television about >>> >>> commerce being the >>> >>> key to peace. Tourism¹s up, they say hopefully. Then the >>> >>> valley erupts and >>> >>> half-forgotten names like Hurriyat and Malik and Geelani >>> >>> and Farooq flicker >>> >>> in our heads. >>> >>> >>> >>> This latest eruption, though, has provoked a set of unusual >>> >>> reactions. The >>> >>> enormous popular mobilization in the Valley after General >>> >>> Sinha, our last >>> >>> governor, stirred the pot by allotting a large plot of land >>> >>> to the Amarnath >>> >>> Shrine Board, and after the security forces, predictably >>> >>> enough, killed >>> >>> Kashmiri Muslims in the demonstrations that followed, has >>> >>> prompted >>> >>> mainstream journalists like Vir Sanghvi and Swaminathan >>> >>> Aiyar to write >>> >>> opinion pieces arguing that India should seriously consider >>> >>> letting Kashmir >>> >>> go. Arundhati Roy, who was present at the enormous rally, >>> >>> made the same >>> >>> point more forcefully, arguing that the pro-Pakistan >>> >>> slogans or the >>> >>> distinctly Islamic idiom of the azadi vanguard, ought not >>> >>> to distract us >>> >>> from the fact that India has no right to hold the Valley¹s >>> >>> Muslims against >>> >>> their will. The routes by which these writers came to their >>> >>> conclusions are >>> >>> different, but the conclusion is the same: that the time >>> >>> has come to think >>> >>> the unthinkable: an azad Kashmir, or even the prospect of >>> >>> Kashmir becoming >>> >>> part of Pakistan. >>> >>> >>> >>> Are they right? Should Indian liberals and democrats >>> >>> endorse >>> >>> self-determination for Kashmir? Or is it possible to hold >>> >>> another position: >>> >>> can a liberal oppose azadi in Kashmir in good faith? One >>> >>> way of exploring >>> >>> this is to make dhobi lists of the pros and cons of >>> >>> Kashmiri >>> >>> self-determination. >>> >>> >>> >>> The case for self-determination is contained in the term >>> >>> itself. If we >>> >>> accept that the two hundred thousand Kashmiris who came out >>> >>> to protest >>> >>> against Indian rule, to shout for liberty, to invoke the >>> >>> ideal of an Islamic >>> >>> state, to press the case for union with Pakistan, are >>> >>> representative of >>> >>> Kashmir¹s Muslim population, then pressing India¹s claim >>> >>> to Kashmir with >>> >>> guns and bayonets is a violent negation of their collective >>> >>> will. It¹s hard >>> >>> for a liberal or a democrat to defend that position. No >>> >>> matter how violently >>> >>> you disagree with their ideas, or how convinced you are of >>> >>> Pakistani >>> >>> mischief and instigation, given the violence the Indian >>> >>> state has inflicted >>> >>> on Kashmiris, it¹s hard to argue that India is entitled to >>> >>> the benefit of >>> >>> the doubt. Kashmiri alienation is now of such long standing >>> >>> and the Indian >>> >>> state¹s interventions in Kashmir have been characterized >>> >>> by such >>> >>> unscrupulousness and such ruthless violence that touting >>> >>> India¹s virtues as >>> >>> a secular, democratic state, which Kashmiris should be glad >>> >>> to be part of, >>> >>> feels like a sick joke. >>> >>> >>> >>> But there is a case against self-determination which needs >>> >>> to be made, if >>> >>> only to clarify the consequence of endorsing >>> >>> self-determination. >>> >>> Self-determination isn¹t in itself virtuous. The Tamils in >>> >>> Sri Lanka, led by >>> >>> Velupillai Prabhakaran have been fighting a civil war for >>> >>> decades to achieve >>> >>> a separate state, Tamil Eelam. Tamils have suffered >>> >>> violence at the hands of >>> >>> Sinhala chauvinists and discrimination from the Sri Lankan >>> >>> state, which, in >>> >>> the Sixties, defined itself as a hegemonically Buddhist, >>> >>> Sinhalese entity. I >>> >>> knowof very few people outside of Prabhakaran¹s followers >>> >>> who want such a >>> >>> state to come into being. This is partly because >>> >>> Prabhakaran is an >>> >>> old-fashioned totalitarian leader and partly because a >>> >>> tiny, Tamil-majority >>> >>> statelet on a small island doesn¹t feel like a rousing >>> >>> cause. >>> >>> >>> >>> Sri Lanka aside, we¹ve witnessed the hideously violent >>> >>> unravelling of >>> >>> Yugoslavia in the name of self-determination. We¹ve seen >>> >>> the idea of >>> >>> self-determination taken to its absurd extreme in the >>> >>> elevation of Kosovo >>> >>> and Ossetia, tiny enclaves, barely a million strong, into >>> >>> nations on the >>> >>> ground of ethnic or religious difference. So perhaps, as >>> >>> liberals, we¹re >>> >>> entitled to ask of movements of self-determination, what >>> >>> sort of state they >>> >>> aspire to. If self-determination in Kashmir is meant to >>> >>> create a >>> >>> majoritarian state on the basis of ethnicity or faith (and >>> >>> Arundhati Roy, in >>> >>> her essay, is clear that the tableau of azadi that she >>> >>> witnessed was >>> >>> substantially shaped by Islamic ideas and bound by a sense >>> >>> of Muslim >>> >>> identity), an Indian liberal might still prefer azadi >>> >>> because he thinks >>> >>> chronic, quasi-colonial state violence is worse, but at >>> >>> least he would >>> >>> acknowledge that his was a counsel of despair rather an >>> >>> endorsement of a >>> >>> freedom struggle. >>> >>> >>> >>> That same liberal might argue that the expulsion of the >>> >>> Pandits and the >>> >>> violence against them shouldn¹t be accepted as an alibi >>> >>> for holding on to >>> >>> Kashmir, but he would be forced to acknowledge that >>> >>> Kashmiri nationalism in >>> >>> this Muslim variant seeks to draw a border around an >>> >>> ethnically cleansed >>> >>> people. >>> >>> >>> >>> Alternately, he might oppose self-determination because he >>> >>> thinks the Indian >>> >>> republic is a flawed but valuable experiment in democratic >>> >>> pluralism, that >>> >>> the Indian national movement and the nation-state it >>> >>> created, tried, in an >>> >>> unprecedented way, to build a national identity on the idea >>> >>> of diversity, >>> >>> not homogeneity. It¹s worth mentioning here that the >>> >>> Indian state has never >>> >>> attempted to change the demographic realities in the Valley >>> >>> in the way in >>> >>> which Israel and China have in Palestine and Tibet. The >>> >>> loss of Kashmir, the >>> >>> only Muslim-majority state in the Union, would be a) a >>> >>> massive setback to >>> >>> this pluralist project, and b) a gift to Hindu chauvinists >>> >>> who would cite >>> >>> Kashmiri secession as yet another proof of the >>> >>> impossibility of integrating >>> >>> Muslims into a non-Muslim state. >>> >>> >>> >>> To sum up then, the Indian liberal has two options. He can >>> >>> support azadi in >>> >>> Kashmir because it is the lesser evil, knowing that azadi >>> >>> will almost >>> >>> certainly mean either a sectarian Muslim statelet or more >>> >>> territory for a >>> >>> larger sectarian state, Pakistan. Or he can endorse the >>> >>> Indian occupation >>> >>> because, in the larger scheme of things, Kashmiri Muslim >>> >>> suffering is >>> >>> collateral damage, the price that must be paid for the >>> >>> greater good of a >>> >>> pluralist India. Put like that, there¹s no shimmering >>> >>> cause to lift our >>> >>> liberal¹s spirits, just a choice between two squalid, >>> >>> compromised ideals. >>> >>> _________________________________________ >>> >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> >>> To subscribe: send an email to >>> >>> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in >>> >>> the subject header. >>> >>> To unsubscribe: >>> >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list  >>> >>> List archive: >>> >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _________________________________________ >>> >>> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >>> >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> >>> To subscribe: send an email to >>> >>> reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject >>> >>> header. >>> >>> To unsubscribe: >>> >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list  >>> >>> List archive: >>> >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _________________________________________ >> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> >> Critiques & Collaborations >> >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe >> in the subject header. >> >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list  >> >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> > > > > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > > Raqs Media Collective > > shuddha at sarai.net > > www.sarai.net > > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > > From rashneek at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 16:24:08 2008 From: rashneek at gmail.com (rashneek kher) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 16:24:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir Appeals In-Reply-To: <396EBB32-140E-4035-9BE9-2250A9CDDCD8@sarai.net> References: <822777.99371.qm@web31814.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6b79f1a70808290128g4851f6ebkc65fb8823f2a7836@mail.gmail.com> <396EBB32-140E-4035-9BE9-2250A9CDDCD8@sarai.net> Message-ID: <13df7c120808290354s70c64902rcdb62acc3a42c444@mail.gmail.com> Dear Shudda, I may not argue with the merits of your case because reason is like a lawyer(it can argue whichever side )but I sure have something to say about the authenticity of the parts of the post. You write "Let me tell you exactly what was 'mysterious' about the killings of minorities in Kashmir. *What was mysterious was the fact that in many (though not all) instances, especially after the initial days of the troubled times of 1989, the killers remained at large, and were known to be at large, not because they were 'militants', but because it is quite likely that they were 'counter-insurgents' - the dreaded 'Ikhwanis' - renegades and other shadowy outfits and individuals (who whether for ideological or for simply mercenary reasons) performed massacres and other shadowy operations of the 'dirty war' in Kashmir, *whenever called upon to do so at the instance of their masters in the Indian intelligence and military establishments. I have no doubt that they participated in the massacres of Pandits, just as much as I have no doubt at all about the fact that several amongst them participated in far bigger massacres and targetted killings of Kashmiri Muslims. They were the shadowy face of state terror, and their role has been well documented by now, despite the best efforts of the 'deep state'. Their existence was especially brought into relief by the unravelling of the aftermath of the Chattisinghpura massacre which is explicitly mentioned in this appeal." You seem to educating Pawan Durani about something that even a child in Kashmir may correct you on.Ikhwanis or the counter insurgents or whatever you may call them wasnt a phenomenon of 1989 but far later.Please in future when you give evidences atleast make sure you dont present blatant lies as "credible eviddence".Please do brush your knowledge on Kashmir from time to time.And in case you mean to tell us that we dont know about the "mysterious murders" you can only be joking.There werent too many militants then in Kashmir and most in downtown Srinagar (where 89 KP's were killed in three months) were known to people.Many have seen Bitta Karate,Yasin Malik and Hamid Sheikh pumping bullets into people.I also feel utterly sad because the ones issuing appeals are the ones who gave a hero's welcome to Bitta Karate.How could they give a resounding welcome to a man unless it was a case of collective victory or bloodlust whichever way you wish to look at it. You cannot run with hares and hunt with hounds.And I reiterate that anyone who uses violence as a recourse eitherly overtly as people like Malik did or by covertly supporting as people like Geelani do, must be prepared to take its illeffects as people like Ghani Lone,Dr.Guru or Mirwaz Farooq did. I agree they have come a long way from those days.They are now more "Gandhian" Aadmi banna aasan na tha sheikhji parsaan ho gaye Best Rashneek On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 3:37 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear Pawan, > > I find it utterly sad and deplorable that in response to the most > serious appeal by a coalition of individuals and civil society groups > for the protection of minorities in the Kashmir valley forwarded to > this list by Khurram Parvez, you (Pawan) have only this to say. > Surely this list deserves better, even from you. > > Rather than respect their concern and be reciprocal, all you can do > is search for a glib and quick volley to shore up your precious and > frankly, pathetic, anti-muslim credentials. You cry yourself hoarse > that no Kashmiri Muslim of significance has ever done anything that > is positive for Kashmiri Pandits, and the moment someone makes a > sincere effort, you show your cynical fangs. > > For once, please try and have some respect for the fact that the > persons concerned are putting themselves on the line by appealing for > peace and demanding that no violence be done to minorities in > Kashmir. Had you stayed on in Kashmir, this would have meant an > appeal for your safety and security. I hope you have the humanity > left in you to understand that. > > Such an appeal can not endear those who are its signatories to those > Islamists who actually want minorities in Kashmir attacked at this > critical juncture. Anyone who wants Kashmiri minorities (Pandits and > Sikhs) attacked at this point of time will be playing into the hands > of the Indian state's vice like grip on Kashmir by contributing to > the creation of a fear pyschosis, and must be identified and isolated > by all segments of Kashmiri society as a de-facto agent of the > occupation of the Kashmir valley. > > I had so far refrained from commenting on the newspaper report > forwarded recently about the apprehensions expressed by R&AW that > minorities are under threat in the valley. Given that the United > Jihad Council (the most significant 'Militant' grouping) has declared > that it will not take to arms at this juncture, any threat to the > minorities in the valley will need to be 'manufactured', as it has > been done on several occasions in the past. It in fact needs to be > manufactured in order to lay the ground for the justification of > massive use of state force to bring the situation under control. The > state finds its hands tied by the fact that it is facing an un-armed > and democratic resistance. it is precisely at times like this that > 'terror' needs to be manufactured, when it is in fact not there. > > The Intelligence agencies and their shadowy clients in Kashmir (who > play all sides with equal ease, seguing smoothly from insurgent to > counter-insurgent) will no doubt be at work to instil fear in the > minds of those Pandit and Sikh families who remain in the Kashmir > valley. I hope that the Pandits and Sikhs who remain in the valley > see through these designs and trust their neighbours more than they > do these rumour mongers. > > This statement that Khurram has forwarded is Kashmiri civil society's > timely effort to counter the spin-doctoring and rumour mongering that > has already begun, just as it had begun in the bitter winter of 1989. > In the coming days, we are sure to see more threats, more fear, more > spin, and possibly some attempts at instigating what can be exhibited > as 'terrorism'. The difference is, this time, the people of Kashmir > seem better prepared, and seem to be giving all indication that they > are in a position to be able to give enough notice to indicate where > exactly these threats and rumours actually emanate from. > > Let me tell you exactly what was 'mysterious' about the killings of > minorities in Kashmir. What was mysterious was the fact that in many > (though not all) instances, especially after the initial days of the > troubled times of 1989, the killers remained at large, and were > known to be at large, not because they were 'militants', but because > it is quite likely that they were 'counter-insurgents' - the dreaded > 'Ikhwanis' - renegades and other shadowy outfits and individuals (who > whether for ideological or for simply mercenary reasons) performed > massacres and other shadowy operations of the 'dirty war' in Kashmir, > whenever called upon to do so at the instance of their masters in the > Indian intelligence and military establishments. I have no doubt that > they participated in the massacres of Pandits, just as much as I have > no doubt at all about the fact that several amongst them participated > in far bigger massacres and targetted killings of Kashmiri Muslims. > They were the shadowy face of state terror, and their role has been > well documented by now, despite the best efforts of the 'deep state'. > Their existence was especially brought into relief by the unravelling > of the aftermath of the Chattisinghpura massacre which is explicitly > mentioned in this appeal. > > if you really, sincerely want to punish those who were guilty of many > of the killings of Pandits that took place, what you would be > demanding would be thorough-going forensic investigations and fact > finding reports, that would be carried out by independent > professional agencies and forensic anthropologiests, without fear or > favour. If any such killings occur in the near future (and I > sincerely hope that they dont) then an immediate international demand > should be made for UN intervention and independent forensic > investigation, because we cannot any longer trust the bona-fide > motivations of the Indian state at least in this regard, any longer. > > Incidentally, the actions of such teams of professional forensic > anthropologists have helped clarify issues to do with other such > instances of 'engineered' massacres, in other situations of conflict > - in Latin America, Central Africa, Bosnia, Sri Lanka and East Timor. > > regards, > > Shuddha > > > > On 29-Aug-08, at 1:58 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > > > Khurram, > > What was "mysterious" about killing of minorities in Kashmir. Do > > you deny > > that it was an Islamic onslaught and selective killing. > > > > Or do you believe that in 20 years the memories would have been > > erased? > > > > Pawan > > > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Khurram Parvez > > wrote: > > > >> APPEAL > >> We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and > >> uphold that > >> the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard > >> we feel > >> deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by > >> sections of > >> Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the > >> Indian > >> Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on > >> minorities in Kashmir. > >> Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities > >> under > >> mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and > >> mistrust > >> amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these > >> killings > >> take place, the people's movement of Kashmir is at a critical > >> phase. The > >> killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 > >> Sikhs at > >> Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill > >> Clinton) or > >> killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an > >> aura of > >> mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations > >> ordered by > >> government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. > >> Bill > >> Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword > >> to Madeline > >> Albright's book titled "Mighty and the Almighty" has clearly > >> accused Hindu > >> fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora. > >> In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the > >> attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and > >> Kashmir is > >> resonating not just in India but also in the International media and > >> institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether > >> Hindus or > >> Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir. > >> In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community > >> leaders, > >> religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and > >> government to > >> ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and > >> refrain from > >> any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The > >> minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out > >> the > >> agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people's movement of > >> Kashmir. > >> In the wake of present peaceful people's movement to realise the > >> right of > >> self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, > >> we urge > >> upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a > >> comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of > >> Jammu and > >> Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council's recently announced > >> statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within > >> civilian > >> areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a > >> comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered > >> Jammu and > >> Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the > >> people's > >> movement. > >> We urge the government of India to halt the brutal use of force > >> against the > >> people and respect the people's right to assembly and freedom of > >> expression > >> both in Kashmir and Jammu. The arrests and the killings of anyone are > >> unacceptable. > >> We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We > >> certainly > >> have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious > >> people is > >> always to be humane besides being politically correct. > >> In the present situation where the political leadership has been > >> arrested, > >> communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood > >> that > >> situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge > >> international > >> community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole > >> population > >> of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international > >> institutions > >> it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for > >> the > >> restoration of people's rights. > >> We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who > >> form the > >> inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they > >> will find > >> their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the > >> circumstances we have > >> lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together > >> for our > >> political emancipation. > >> We also urge the community leaders, civil society actors, > >> political parties > >> of Jammu province to strive for the safety and security of Muslims > >> and other > >> minorities residing in Jammu. > >> Signed by: > >> Moulana Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin Ahmed (Mufti Azam JK State and > >> Incharge > >> of religious affairs of Jammu and Kashmir), > >> Mirwaiz Molvi Riyaz Ahmed Hamdani, > >> Islamic Study Circle, > >> Aga Syed Hassan Al Moosvi – President - Anjuman Sharie Shiyaan, > >> Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, > >> Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, > >> Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner's Federation, > >> Valley Citizens Council, > >> Jan Mohammad Koul, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation, > >> Noor Ahmed Bilal – President Kashmir University Teachers Association, > >> Naagar Nagar Coordination Committee, > >> Kashmir Thinker's Guild, > >> Dr. Altaf Hussain, > >> Arjimand Hussain Talib (Columnist), > >> Dr. Mubarik Ahmed (Social Activist), > >> Anwar Ashai (Social Activist), > >> Zareef Ahmed Zareef (Poet) > >> Adv. A. R. Hanjoora (Social Activist), > >> Hameeda Bano (Faculty of English, University of Kashmir), > >> Shaikh Showkat Hussain (Faculty of Law, University of Kashmir), > >> Noor Ahmed Baba (Dean Social Sciences, University of Kashmir), > >> Mohammad Azeem Tuman (House Boat Owners Association), > >> Himayat Trust, > >> JK People's Development Trust, > >> Ehsaas – A Developmental Organisation, > >> Mushtaaque Ali Ahmed Khan (Theatre Activist and Film Maker) > >> Senior Citizens Forum > >> Kashmir Urdu Academy > >> Jammu and Kashmir Cultural Society > >> Syed us Sadaat Trust, Islamabad, Kashmir > >> Hudood ullah Research Centre > >> Eco Concern, Islamabad, Kashmir > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > The Sarai Programme at CSDS > Raqs Media Collective > shuddha at sarai.net > www.sarai.net > www.raqsmediacollective.net > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > -- Rashneek Kher Wandhama Massacre-The Forgotten Human Tragedy http://www.kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com http://www.nietzschereborn.blogspot.com From prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 17:25:02 2008 From: prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com (Prabhakar Singh) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 04:55:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions Message-ID: <299947.35530.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> It appears we can not think anything beyond Hindu or Muslim because our minds are over-obsessed with it.The arguements are quite misplaced and made just for making it as we are basically Hindu or Muslims and take a pre-determined stand in the name of openness,liberal,forward looking,progressive and logical approach but we are worse than fundamentalists or terrorists.This is nothing but intellectual perversion. Prabhakar ----- Original Message ---- From: Rohit Shetti To: Shuddhabrata Sengupta Cc: Sarai list Sent: Friday, 29 August, 2008 1:49:27 PM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions Dear Shuddha, That's a beautiful piece. Let me play a bit with the words in the last paragraph that you wrote. "I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. *After all they crossing the road.*" I guess this is what drives many zealots to do what they do since they do not get beyond 'slogan-level thinking', as one dear friend of mine puts it. 'Crossing the road' is a slogan enough to spur them, without ever waiting to understand what it is that amounts to 'crossing the road' and if there is any real harm in it. Rgds, Rohit On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:31 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > Dear All, > > I have been intrigued by the exchange on the list of late that has > preferred to jettison the term 'religion' and prefer in its stead the > euphimistic phrase - 'ways of life'. I am referring to the exchange > between Chanchal Malviya and Jeebesh Bagchi, arising out of the > heated correspondence on the disruption of a small exhibition devoted > to M.F.Husain. > > i am quite convinced that the term 'religion'  which derives from the > latin root of the word religio (bond) and religare (the verb form of > 'to bind') remains for me a useful word to name the act of committing > oneself in any form. In this sense, atheists and agnostics are just > as religious (in their commitment to doubt) as are those blessed with > faith. I would describe my religious commitment as agnosticism - a > commitment to doubt everything, (including the value of doubt) and a > certainty that we cannot speak certainly of anything at all, because > there are always counterfactuals, and hitherto unimagined, or unknown > possibilities, that goad us on to yet newer possibilities, or to > return to some very old ones. This is just to say that it would be a > mistake to assume, as is often done with some arrogance on the part > of the more pronouncedly 'faithful', that atheists and agnostics have > no 'spiritual' quests. They do, and they dont, just as those who are > ostentatiously 'religious' do, and dont, or do only in as much as it > allows them to burn a few churches as they go questing. If Hindu > fundamentalists have chosen to renounce the ties that bind (religio) > them to life, who would I be to object, because, I am not a Hindu. > But I have no quarrel with the term 'ways of life'. The more words we > have, the better. > > This discussion arose out of a rage felt by some that a group of > zealots had broken and disrupted an exhibition that featured some > images of and by Husain, and the counter rage felt by others that the > zealots had no right to be criticised because they were acting to > protect the honour of the Hindu deities that they felt Husain had > insulted. > > The second case is as follows - what right has Husain, a Muslim to > insult Hindu deities by portraying them in a manner that is offensive > to the sentiments of many Hindus. (Husain's motivations, or the > aesthetic merit of his images are not the issue here, what is at > issue is the insult seen to have occurred when a non-Hindu 'touches' > a sacred Hindu icon with his 'insulting' imagination. Those so > enraged, also throw the following challenge, has the opposite ever > occurred? > > I am not here to make a case for Husain. (As I have said before I do > not have a very high opinion of his work as an artist). I am here to > make a case for what is considered to be transgression. No one can be > sure when they have transgressed. Because transgression can be seen > to occur even when the motives of the person concerned are far from > transgression. Husain can say in his defence, and indeed has on > occasion said that his paintings are an index of his appreciation of > Indic culture and its diversity of expressions, of his closeness > (since early childhood) to forms of iconic imagery in popular Hinduism. > > Here his intent is clearly not to insult, on the contrary, it is to > declare his appreciation for the beauty of the iconography of popular > Hinduism, a charge for which he would be equally hated by both Hindu > as well as Muslim fundamentalists. > > It has not been noticed that no Muslim fundamentalist or even Muslim > religious figure has come out in defence of Husain. They are in fact > in tacit agreement with their Hindu peers. A Muslim making images, > and that too of Hindu goddesses, because he is drawn to them, can > only be seen as blasphemy in their eyes. On this, like on so many > other issues, Hindu and Muslim fundamentalists are in total agreement. > > Let me come now to an interesting counterfactual argument. I refer to > the life an work of a little known late nineteenth century and early > twentieth century Urdu poet of Delhi called Dillu Ram Kausari. Now as > his name suggests, Dillu Ram was a Hindu. The trouble is, throughout > his life he composed deliriously passionate elegies (na'at)  to the > Prophet Muhammad. > > One of his quatrains went as follows > > Kuch 'ishq e Muhammad mein nahin shart e Musulman! > Hai Kausari Hindu bhii talabgaar e Muhammad! > Allah re! kyaa raunaq e bazaar e Muhammad > Ke Ma'bood e Jahan bhi hai kharidaar e Muhammad! > > Being a Muslim is not a condition for loving Muhammad! > Kausari, the Hindu, is also a seeker of Muhammad! > By Allah! How delightful is the bazaar of Muhammad > For the Lord of the Worlds is also a buyer of Muhammad! > > This kind of sentiment shocked both Hindus and Muslims. Hindus, > because how could a Hindu sing what amounted to love songs to a > Muslim prophet, and Muslims, for the same reason. Both felt slighted > and insulted by the transgressive way in which the imagination of the > poet had 'touched' the body of what was sacred for one, and not, for > the other. > > Another poem, which proved to be even more controversial, went like > this - > > Rahmatulilalamin kay Hashar mein maana' khulay > Khalq saari Shaafa e Roz e Jaza kay saath hai > Laykay Dillu Raam ko jannat mein jab Hazrat gaye > Ma'loom huwa kay Hindu bhi Mahboob e Khuda kay saath hai! > > The meaning of "Mercy unto the Worlds" became apparent on Judgement Day: > The whole creation is with the Intercessor of The Day of Acquittal > When the Prophet took Dillu Ram with him into Paradise > It was known that this Hindu too is with the Beloved of God! > > This poem, especially scandalized Muslim orthodoxy, because it dared > to suggest that the prophet himself would intercede on behalf of an > unbeliever on the day of judgement. > > It is interesting to note that Dillu Ram never became a Muslim, at > least not in his lifetime. An article in the interesting web portal > Chowk  http://www.chowk.com/articles/12692 by one Asif Naqshbandi says > > "It is also said that Dillu Ram, delirious with his love, would > sometimes stand in the middle of the bazaar in Delhi, put chains > around his neck and feet and shout at the top of his voice to all > passers-by, "Muhammad! Muhammad! Muhammad! Yes! Muhammad is the > Beloved of God! Muhammad is the first and only Beloved of God! If God > loves you, He loves you because of His Beloved!" Some people even > stoned him and he would often come home covered in blood but he was > totally lost in his love of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon > him!)" > > There is an apocryphal story of how on his deathbed Dillu Ram Kausari > had a vision of the Prophet himself, who came to him, and that he > read the Kalima with him. But as this vision is reported to have > appeared only to him, as he lay dying, and as he is no longer with us > to either confirm or deny this deathbed conversion, we can only > surmise that it was a generous, but somewhat disingenuous method of > having Dillu Ram's somewhat unorthodox Muslim apologists claim him > for themselves. > > As far as we are concerned, Dillu Ram Kausari, caused grave offence, > by his love for the Prophet, both to Hindu as well as to Muslim > zealots, as long as he lived. > > If, the things we call religions are 'ways of life' then we can > always determine for ourselves whether we want to walk on a one way > street that runs into a dead end, or to cross many paths, walking > down one way, for one purpose, down another way for another, and > sometimes just standing in between paths, figuring out our journey, > as we go about our lives. > > I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not > because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to > cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. And all they > were doing was crossing the road. > > thanks and regards, > > Shuddha > > ----- > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 17:49:14 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 17:49:14 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir petition - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <572386.71181.qm@web53912.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <572386.71181.qm@web53912.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290519k1931b10dyaf650f2cb4b357c@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From kauladityaraj at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 18:00:19 2008 From: kauladityaraj at gmail.com (Aditya Raj Kaul) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:00:19 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir petition - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808290519k1931b10dyaf650f2cb4b357c@mail.gmail.com> References: <572386.71181.qm@web53912.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808290519k1931b10dyaf650f2cb4b357c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6353c690808290530l23ef51ccqbde0ac2165f846bf@mail.gmail.com> I think this should be the link - http://www.petitiononline.com/Amarnath/petition.html On 8/29/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 18:22:00 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:22:00 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A petition for Kashmir - please sign and forward Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290552w9ffe9e5l34b753a8b5002668@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Dear All, Please sign this petition for the sake of the suffering Kashmiri people: http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html Please also send this email to as many people (Kashmiris and non-Kashmiris alike) as you can, together with a request to sign the petition. Regards ______________________________________________ To: Gordon Brown Prime Minister United Kingdom David Miliband Foreign Secretary United Kingdom Ban Ki-moon Secretary-General United Nations José Manuel Barroso President European Commission We are writing to bring to your attention the increasingly deteriorating situation in the Indian-controlled part of the disputed region of Jammu and Kashmir. Over the last two months, the people of Kashmir have held mass public processions protesting against an economic blockade imposed against the valley of Kashmir by extremist elements in the southern region of Jammu. These peaceful protests have now escalated into a demand for the right to self-determination guaranteed to the people of Kashmir by various United Nations Resolutions (including nos. 57/1948, 51/1948, 80/1950, and 122/1957). These rallies have drawn widespread support from hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris across the length and breadth of the Kashmir valley. The Indian authorities have responded to these non-violent protests by using excessive lethal force including firing live rounds on unarmed protestors. So far, more than 25 unarmed civilians have been killed in firing by Indian soldiers. There are now more than 600,000 Indian soldiers and paramilitaries on active duty in Kashmir (which translates to approximately one soldier for every eight Kashmiris). Initially the Indian government allowed the protests to proceed without much opposition. However, it has recently changed its approach and begun to adopt repressive measures. The Indian government has banned local television channels and placed restrictions on media freedom. Pro-freedom politicians have been arrested without charge and prevented from attending processions and giving speeches. Indefinite curfew has been imposed across the ten districts of the Kashmir valley and soldiers have been given shoot-at-sight orders in some places. We are deeply disturbed by the absence of any comment by the British government, the European Union or the United Nations on the recent spate of violence in Kashmir. When protests broke out in Tibet in March earlier this year, only a few thousand people took to the streets in Lhasa and other towns. Yet, there was a flurry of condemnation of the Chinese authorities by Western governments and international organisations. China was urged to refrain from using excessive force and to initiate meaningful talks with the Tibetans. In stark contrast to this vocal stance on Tibet, the international community has maintained complete silence on Kashmir. We call upon the British government, as the former colonial power in South Asia, to discharge the moral responsibility it has to speak out against human rights violations in Kashmir and to urge all parties to exercise restraint and initiate peaceful negotiations for solving disputes. India is a member of the Commonwealth just like Zimbabwe and the Indian government deserves to be reminded of its obligations just as much as Mr Mugabe. In today's world, the British government simply cannot afford to be seen as being selective in its criticism of other countries and exposure of state excesses when it comes to maintaining ethical and humanitarian high-grounds. We, therefore, call upon you to urge the Indian government to: • exercise restraint in dealing with protests in Kashmir, • ensure human rights are not violated and bring perpetrators of human rights to justice, and • initiate peaceful and meaningful negotiations to address the underlying causes of unrest in Kashmir, including the fundamental question of Kashmir's future status. Sincerely, The Undersigned From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 18:22:22 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:22:22 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir petition - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <6353c690808290530l23ef51ccqbde0ac2165f846bf@mail.gmail.com> References: <572386.71181.qm@web53912.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808290519k1931b10dyaf650f2cb4b357c@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808290530l23ef51ccqbde0ac2165f846bf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290552m44114bb8q8e5a337972d66320@mail.gmail.com> No, it is http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html best shivam On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:00 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul wrote: > I think this should be the link - > > http://www.petitiononline.com/Amarnath/petition.html > > > > > On 8/29/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: >> >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 18:36:36 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:36:36 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A petition for Kashmir - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808290552w9ffe9e5l34b753a8b5002668@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Interesting, Shivam. But why on earth is this addressed to the British government, the ones who've bloodied their hands in Afghanistan & Iraq? Not enough that they were once our colonial masters, surely? And after the history of the UN, and the role of the UK and the US, you want them to enter Kashmir? Not bad enough that they have their bases in Afghanistan and are swarming Pakistan? Sorry. Can't sign this. On 8/29/08 6:22 PM, "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Dear All, Please sign this petition > for the sake of the suffering Kashmiri > people: http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html Please also send > this email to as many people (Kashmiris and non-Kashmiris alike) as you can, > together with a request to sign the petition. Regards > ______________________________________________ To: Gordon Brown Prime > Minister United Kingdom David Miliband Foreign Secretary United Kingdom Ban > Ki-moon Secretary-General United Nations José Manuel > Barroso President European Commission We are writing to bring to your > attention the increasingly deteriorating situation in the Indian-controlled > part of the disputed region of Jammu and Kashmir. Over the last two months, > the people of Kashmir have held mass public processions protesting against > an economic blockade imposed against the valley of Kashmir by > extremist elements in the southern region of Jammu. These peaceful protests > have now escalated into a demand for the right to self-determination > guaranteed to the people of Kashmir by various United Nations Resolutions > (including nos. 57/1948, 51/1948, 80/1950, and 122/1957). These rallies have > drawn widespread support from hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris across the > length and breadth of the Kashmir valley. The Indian authorities have > responded to these non-violent protests by using excessive lethal force > including firing live rounds on unarmed protestors. So far, more than 25 > unarmed civilians have been killed in firing by Indian soldiers. There are now > more than 600,000 Indian soldiers and paramilitaries on active duty in Kashmir > (which translates to approximately one soldier for every eight > Kashmiris). Initially the Indian government allowed the protests to > proceed without much opposition. However, it has recently changed its > approach and begun to adopt repressive measures. The Indian government > has banned local television channels and placed restrictions on media freedom. > Pro-freedom politicians have been arrested without charge and prevented from > attending processions and giving speeches. Indefinite curfew has been imposed > across the ten districts of the Kashmir valley and soldiers have been given > shoot-at-sight orders in some places. We are deeply disturbed by the absence > of any comment by the British government, the European Union or the United > Nations on the recent spate of violence in Kashmir. When protests broke out in > Tibet in March earlier this year, only a few thousand people took to > the streets in Lhasa and other towns. Yet, there was a flurry of condemnation > of the Chinese authorities by Western governments and international > organisations. China was urged to refrain from using excessive force and to > initiate meaningful talks with the Tibetans. In stark contrast to this vocal > stance on Tibet, the international community has maintained complete silence > on Kashmir. We call upon the British government, as the former colonial power > in South Asia, to discharge the moral responsibility it has to speak > out against human rights violations in Kashmir and to urge all parties > to exercise restraint and initiate peaceful negotiations for solving disputes. > India is a member of the Commonwealth just like Zimbabwe and the Indian > government deserves to be reminded of its obligations just as much as Mr > Mugabe. In today's world, the British government simply cannot afford to be > seen as being selective in its criticism of other countries and exposure of > state excesses when it comes to maintaining ethical and humanitarian > high-grounds. We, therefore, call upon you to urge the Indian government > to: • exercise restraint in dealing with protests in Kashmir, • ensure human > rights are not violated and bring perpetrators of human rights to justice, > and • initiate peaceful and meaningful negotiations to address the underlying > causes of unrest in Kashmir, including the fundamental question of Kashmir's > future status. Sincerely, The > Undersigned _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in > the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 18:40:13 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:40:13 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A petition for Kashmir - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808290552w9ffe9e5l34b753a8b5002668@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290610o54835fd3ve1a6b30df316148e@mail.gmail.com> Let me clarify Sonia that I haven't taken out the petition. I don't know who has. You have the right not to sign it. I forwarded it FYI and, as you may have noticed, did not add a note urging others to sign it. On my part I have signed it and I don't feel the need to explain anyone why I have signed it. best shivam On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:36 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: > Interesting, Shivam. But why on earth is this addressed to the British > government, the ones who've bloodied their hands in Afghanistan & Iraq? Not > enough that they were once our colonial masters, surely? > > And after the history of the UN, and the role of the UK and the US, you want > them to enter Kashmir? Not bad enough that they have their bases in > Afghanistan and are swarming Pakistan? > > Sorry. Can't sign this. > > > > On 8/29/08 6:22 PM, "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" wrote: > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > > Dear All, > > Please sign this petition >> for the sake of the suffering Kashmiri >> people: > > http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html > > Please also send >> this email to as many people (Kashmiris and > non-Kashmiris alike) as you can, >> together with a request to sign the > petition. > > Regards > >> ______________________________________________ > To: > > Gordon Brown > Prime >> Minister > United Kingdom > > David Miliband > Foreign Secretary > United Kingdom > > Ban >> Ki-moon > Secretary-General > United Nations > > José Manuel >> Barroso > President > European Commission > > > We are writing to bring to your >> attention the increasingly > deteriorating situation in the Indian-controlled >> part of the disputed > region of Jammu and Kashmir. Over the last two months, >> the people of > Kashmir have held mass public processions protesting against >> an > economic blockade imposed against the valley of Kashmir by >> extremist > elements in the southern region of Jammu. > > These peaceful protests >> have now escalated into a demand for the right > to self-determination >> guaranteed to the people of Kashmir by various > United Nations Resolutions >> (including nos. 57/1948, 51/1948, 80/1950, > and 122/1957). These rallies have >> drawn widespread support from > hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris across the >> length and breadth of > the Kashmir valley. > > The Indian authorities have >> responded to these non-violent protests by > using excessive lethal force >> including firing live rounds on unarmed > protestors. So far, more than 25 >> unarmed civilians have been killed in > firing by Indian soldiers. There are now >> more than 600,000 Indian > soldiers and paramilitaries on active duty in Kashmir >> (which > translates to approximately one soldier for every eight >> Kashmiris). > > Initially the Indian government allowed the protests to >> proceed > without much opposition. However, it has recently changed its >> approach > and begun to adopt repressive measures. The Indian government >> has > banned local television channels and placed restrictions on media > freedom. >> Pro-freedom politicians have been arrested without charge and > prevented from >> attending processions and giving speeches. Indefinite > curfew has been imposed >> across the ten districts of the Kashmir valley > and soldiers have been given >> shoot-at-sight orders in some places. > > We are deeply disturbed by the absence >> of any comment by the British > government, the European Union or the United >> Nations on the recent > spate of violence in Kashmir. When protests broke out in >> Tibet in > March earlier this year, only a few thousand people took to >> the > streets in Lhasa and other towns. Yet, there was a flurry of > condemnation >> of the Chinese authorities by Western governments and > international >> organisations. China was urged to refrain from using > excessive force and to >> initiate meaningful talks with the Tibetans. In > stark contrast to this vocal >> stance on Tibet, the international > community has maintained complete silence >> on Kashmir. > > We call upon the British government, as the former colonial power >> in > South Asia, to discharge the moral responsibility it has to speak >> out > against human rights violations in Kashmir and to urge all parties >> to > exercise restraint and initiate peaceful negotiations for solving > disputes. >> India is a member of the Commonwealth just like Zimbabwe and > the Indian >> government deserves to be reminded of its obligations just > as much as Mr >> Mugabe. In today's world, the British government simply > cannot afford to be >> seen as being selective in its criticism of other > countries and exposure of >> state excesses when it comes to maintaining > ethical and humanitarian >> high-grounds. > > We, therefore, call upon you to urge the Indian government >> to: > > • exercise restraint in dealing with protests in Kashmir, > > • ensure human >> rights are not violated and bring perpetrators of human > rights to justice, >> and > > • initiate peaceful and meaningful negotiations to address the > underlying >> causes of unrest in Kashmir, including the fundamental > question of Kashmir's >> future status. > > Sincerely, > The >> Undersigned > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open >> discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To >> subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in >> the subject header. > To unsubscribe: >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: >> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 18:55:12 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:55:12 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] A petition for Kashmir - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808290610o54835fd3ve1a6b30df316148e@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808290552w9ffe9e5l34b753a8b5002668@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808290610o54835fd3ve1a6b30df316148e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290625nf28d14fp9ad381b155f8c7f8@mail.gmail.com> Apologies - the subject line did say, "please sign and forward". That was in the mail I got. So please feel free to not sign and delete. best shivam On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:40 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Let me clarify Sonia that I haven't taken out the petition. I don't > know who has. You have the right not to sign it. I forwarded it FYI > and, as you may have noticed, did not add a note urging others to sign > it. On my part I have signed it and I don't feel the need to explain > anyone why I have signed it. > best > shivam > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:36 PM, S. Jabbar wrote: >> Interesting, Shivam. But why on earth is this addressed to the British >> government, the ones who've bloodied their hands in Afghanistan & Iraq? Not >> enough that they were once our colonial masters, surely? >> >> And after the history of the UN, and the role of the UK and the US, you want >> them to enter Kashmir? Not bad enough that they have their bases in >> Afghanistan and are swarming Pakistan? >> >> Sorry. Can't sign this. >> >> >> >> On 8/29/08 6:22 PM, "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" wrote: >> >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> >> >> Dear All, >> >> Please sign this petition >>> for the sake of the suffering Kashmiri >>> people: >> >> http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html >> >> Please also send >>> this email to as many people (Kashmiris and >> non-Kashmiris alike) as you can, >>> together with a request to sign the >> petition. >> >> Regards >> >>> ______________________________________________ >> To: >> >> Gordon Brown >> Prime >>> Minister >> United Kingdom >> >> David Miliband >> Foreign Secretary >> United Kingdom >> >> Ban >>> Ki-moon >> Secretary-General >> United Nations >> >> José Manuel >>> Barroso >> President >> European Commission >> >> >> We are writing to bring to your >>> attention the increasingly >> deteriorating situation in the Indian-controlled >>> part of the disputed >> region of Jammu and Kashmir. Over the last two months, >>> the people of >> Kashmir have held mass public processions protesting against >>> an >> economic blockade imposed against the valley of Kashmir by >>> extremist >> elements in the southern region of Jammu. >> >> These peaceful protests >>> have now escalated into a demand for the right >> to self-determination >>> guaranteed to the people of Kashmir by various >> United Nations Resolutions >>> (including nos. 57/1948, 51/1948, 80/1950, >> and 122/1957). These rallies have >>> drawn widespread support from >> hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris across the >>> length and breadth of >> the Kashmir valley. >> >> The Indian authorities have >>> responded to these non-violent protests by >> using excessive lethal force >>> including firing live rounds on unarmed >> protestors. So far, more than 25 >>> unarmed civilians have been killed in >> firing by Indian soldiers. There are now >>> more than 600,000 Indian >> soldiers and paramilitaries on active duty in Kashmir >>> (which >> translates to approximately one soldier for every eight >>> Kashmiris). >> >> Initially the Indian government allowed the protests to >>> proceed >> without much opposition. However, it has recently changed its >>> approach >> and begun to adopt repressive measures. The Indian government >>> has >> banned local television channels and placed restrictions on media >> freedom. >>> Pro-freedom politicians have been arrested without charge and >> prevented from >>> attending processions and giving speeches. Indefinite >> curfew has been imposed >>> across the ten districts of the Kashmir valley >> and soldiers have been given >>> shoot-at-sight orders in some places. >> >> We are deeply disturbed by the absence >>> of any comment by the British >> government, the European Union or the United >>> Nations on the recent >> spate of violence in Kashmir. When protests broke out in >>> Tibet in >> March earlier this year, only a few thousand people took to >>> the >> streets in Lhasa and other towns. Yet, there was a flurry of >> condemnation >>> of the Chinese authorities by Western governments and >> international >>> organisations. China was urged to refrain from using >> excessive force and to >>> initiate meaningful talks with the Tibetans. In >> stark contrast to this vocal >>> stance on Tibet, the international >> community has maintained complete silence >>> on Kashmir. >> >> We call upon the British government, as the former colonial power >>> in >> South Asia, to discharge the moral responsibility it has to speak >>> out >> against human rights violations in Kashmir and to urge all parties >>> to >> exercise restraint and initiate peaceful negotiations for solving >> disputes. >>> India is a member of the Commonwealth just like Zimbabwe and >> the Indian >>> government deserves to be reminded of its obligations just >> as much as Mr >>> Mugabe. In today's world, the British government simply >> cannot afford to be >>> seen as being selective in its criticism of other >> countries and exposure of >>> state excesses when it comes to maintaining >> ethical and humanitarian >>> high-grounds. >> >> We, therefore, call upon you to urge the Indian government >>> to: >> >> • exercise restraint in dealing with protests in Kashmir, >> >> • ensure human >>> rights are not violated and bring perpetrators of human >> rights to justice, >>> and >> >> • initiate peaceful and meaningful negotiations to address the >> underlying >>> causes of unrest in Kashmir, including the fundamental >> question of Kashmir's >>> future status. >> >> Sincerely, >> The >>> Undersigned >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open >>> discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To >>> subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in >>> the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: >>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >> >> >> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > -- National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ From rohitism at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 18:57:38 2008 From: rohitism at gmail.com (Rohit Shetti) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:57:38 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions In-Reply-To: <299947.35530.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <299947.35530.qm@web31506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Prabhakar, I agree there is a lot of intellectual perversion we all indulge in, but would disagree with you in the given context. In my humble opinion, Shuddha is trying to put forth the dilemmas that one comes across when one tries to reason with the massive amount of branding that goes around. I don't think anyone is taking a pre-determined stand here, nor are the dilemmas limited to Hindu or Muslim context just because such examples were provided. Rgds, Rohit On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:25 PM, Prabhakar Singh wrote: > It appears we can not think anything beyond Hindu or Muslim because our > minds are over-obsessed with it.The arguements are quite misplaced and made > just for making it as we are basically Hindu or Muslims and take a > pre-determined stand in the name of openness,liberal,forward > looking,progressive and logical approach but we are worse than > fundamentalists or terrorists.This is nothing but intellectual perversion. > Prabhakar > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Rohit Shetti > To: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > Cc: Sarai list > Sent: Friday, 29 August, 2008 1:49:27 PM > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions > > Dear Shuddha, > > That's a beautiful piece. Let me play a bit with the words in the last > paragraph that you wrote. > > "I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not > because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to > cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. *After all they > crossing the road.*" > > I guess this is what drives many zealots to do what they do since they do > not get beyond 'slogan-level thinking', as one dear friend of mine puts it. > 'Crossing the road' is a slogan enough to spur them, without ever waiting > to > understand what it is that amounts to 'crossing the road' and if there is > any real harm in it. > > Rgds, > > Rohit > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 1:31 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta >wrote: > > > Dear All, > > > > I have been intrigued by the exchange on the list of late that has > > preferred to jettison the term 'religion' and prefer in its stead the > > euphimistic phrase - 'ways of life'. I am referring to the exchange > > between Chanchal Malviya and Jeebesh Bagchi, arising out of the > > heated correspondence on the disruption of a small exhibition devoted > > to M.F.Husain. > > > > i am quite convinced that the term 'religion' which derives from the > > latin root of the word religio (bond) and religare (the verb form of > > 'to bind') remains for me a useful word to name the act of committing > > oneself in any form. In this sense, atheists and agnostics are just > > as religious (in their commitment to doubt) as are those blessed with > > faith. I would describe my religious commitment as agnosticism - a > > commitment to doubt everything, (including the value of doubt) and a > > certainty that we cannot speak certainly of anything at all, because > > there are always counterfactuals, and hitherto unimagined, or unknown > > possibilities, that goad us on to yet newer possibilities, or to > > return to some very old ones. This is just to say that it would be a > > mistake to assume, as is often done with some arrogance on the part > > of the more pronouncedly 'faithful', that atheists and agnostics have > > no 'spiritual' quests. They do, and they dont, just as those who are > > ostentatiously 'religious' do, and dont, or do only in as much as it > > allows them to burn a few churches as they go questing. If Hindu > > fundamentalists have chosen to renounce the ties that bind (religio) > > them to life, who would I be to object, because, I am not a Hindu. > > But I have no quarrel with the term 'ways of life'. The more words we > > have, the better. > > > > This discussion arose out of a rage felt by some that a group of > > zealots had broken and disrupted an exhibition that featured some > > images of and by Husain, and the counter rage felt by others that the > > zealots had no right to be criticised because they were acting to > > protect the honour of the Hindu deities that they felt Husain had > > insulted. > > > > The second case is as follows - what right has Husain, a Muslim to > > insult Hindu deities by portraying them in a manner that is offensive > > to the sentiments of many Hindus. (Husain's motivations, or the > > aesthetic merit of his images are not the issue here, what is at > > issue is the insult seen to have occurred when a non-Hindu 'touches' > > a sacred Hindu icon with his 'insulting' imagination. Those so > > enraged, also throw the following challenge, has the opposite ever > > occurred? > > > > I am not here to make a case for Husain. (As I have said before I do > > not have a very high opinion of his work as an artist). I am here to > > make a case for what is considered to be transgression. No one can be > > sure when they have transgressed. Because transgression can be seen > > to occur even when the motives of the person concerned are far from > > transgression. Husain can say in his defence, and indeed has on > > occasion said that his paintings are an index of his appreciation of > > Indic culture and its diversity of expressions, of his closeness > > (since early childhood) to forms of iconic imagery in popular Hinduism. > > > > Here his intent is clearly not to insult, on the contrary, it is to > > declare his appreciation for the beauty of the iconography of popular > > Hinduism, a charge for which he would be equally hated by both Hindu > > as well as Muslim fundamentalists. > > > > It has not been noticed that no Muslim fundamentalist or even Muslim > > religious figure has come out in defence of Husain. They are in fact > > in tacit agreement with their Hindu peers. A Muslim making images, > > and that too of Hindu goddesses, because he is drawn to them, can > > only be seen as blasphemy in their eyes. On this, like on so many > > other issues, Hindu and Muslim fundamentalists are in total agreement. > > > > Let me come now to an interesting counterfactual argument. I refer to > > the life an work of a little known late nineteenth century and early > > twentieth century Urdu poet of Delhi called Dillu Ram Kausari. Now as > > his name suggests, Dillu Ram was a Hindu. The trouble is, throughout > > his life he composed deliriously passionate elegies (na'at) to the > > Prophet Muhammad. > > > > One of his quatrains went as follows > > > > Kuch 'ishq e Muhammad mein nahin shart e Musulman! > > Hai Kausari Hindu bhii talabgaar e Muhammad! > > Allah re! kyaa raunaq e bazaar e Muhammad > > Ke Ma'bood e Jahan bhi hai kharidaar e Muhammad! > > > > Being a Muslim is not a condition for loving Muhammad! > > Kausari, the Hindu, is also a seeker of Muhammad! > > By Allah! How delightful is the bazaar of Muhammad > > For the Lord of the Worlds is also a buyer of Muhammad! > > > > This kind of sentiment shocked both Hindus and Muslims. Hindus, > > because how could a Hindu sing what amounted to love songs to a > > Muslim prophet, and Muslims, for the same reason. Both felt slighted > > and insulted by the transgressive way in which the imagination of the > > poet had 'touched' the body of what was sacred for one, and not, for > > the other. > > > > Another poem, which proved to be even more controversial, went like > > this - > > > > Rahmatulilalamin kay Hashar mein maana' khulay > > Khalq saari Shaafa e Roz e Jaza kay saath hai > > Laykay Dillu Raam ko jannat mein jab Hazrat gaye > > Ma'loom huwa kay Hindu bhi Mahboob e Khuda kay saath hai! > > > > The meaning of "Mercy unto the Worlds" became apparent on Judgement Day: > > The whole creation is with the Intercessor of The Day of Acquittal > > When the Prophet took Dillu Ram with him into Paradise > > It was known that this Hindu too is with the Beloved of God! > > > > This poem, especially scandalized Muslim orthodoxy, because it dared > > to suggest that the prophet himself would intercede on behalf of an > > unbeliever on the day of judgement. > > > > It is interesting to note that Dillu Ram never became a Muslim, at > > least not in his lifetime. An article in the interesting web portal > > Chowk http://www.chowk.com/articles/12692 by one Asif Naqshbandi says > > > > "It is also said that Dillu Ram, delirious with his love, would > > sometimes stand in the middle of the bazaar in Delhi, put chains > > around his neck and feet and shout at the top of his voice to all > > passers-by, "Muhammad! Muhammad! Muhammad! Yes! Muhammad is the > > Beloved of God! Muhammad is the first and only Beloved of God! If God > > loves you, He loves you because of His Beloved!" Some people even > > stoned him and he would often come home covered in blood but he was > > totally lost in his love of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon > > him!)" > > > > There is an apocryphal story of how on his deathbed Dillu Ram Kausari > > had a vision of the Prophet himself, who came to him, and that he > > read the Kalima with him. But as this vision is reported to have > > appeared only to him, as he lay dying, and as he is no longer with us > > to either confirm or deny this deathbed conversion, we can only > > surmise that it was a generous, but somewhat disingenuous method of > > having Dillu Ram's somewhat unorthodox Muslim apologists claim him > > for themselves. > > > > As far as we are concerned, Dillu Ram Kausari, caused grave offence, > > by his love for the Prophet, both to Hindu as well as to Muslim > > zealots, as long as he lived. > > > > If, the things we call religions are 'ways of life' then we can > > always determine for ourselves whether we want to walk on a one way > > street that runs into a dead end, or to cross many paths, walking > > down one way, for one purpose, down another way for another, and > > sometimes just standing in between paths, figuring out our journey, > > as we go about our lives. > > > > I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting not > > because of what they paint of what they say, but because they seem to > > cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of life'. And all they > > were doing was crossing the road. > > > > thanks and regards, > > > > Shuddha > > > > ----- > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > Get an email ID as yourname at ymail.com or yourname at rocketmail.com. > Click here http://in.promos.yahoo.com/address > From pawan.durani at gmail.com Fri Aug 29 19:09:25 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 19:09:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir petition - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808290552m44114bb8q8e5a337972d66320@mail.gmail.com> References: <572386.71181.qm@web53912.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808290519k1931b10dyaf650f2cb4b357c@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808290530l23ef51ccqbde0ac2165f846bf@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808290552m44114bb8q8e5a337972d66320@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808290639m2d0c59d5w74b892fa79430c76@mail.gmail.com> Yes, the correct link is http://www.petitiononline.com/KPYouth/petition.html Pawan Durani On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:22 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > No, it is http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html > > best > shivam > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:00 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > wrote: > > I think this should be the link - > > > > http://www.petitiononline.com/Amarnath/petition.html > > > > > > > > > > On 8/29/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > >> > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > >> > >> _________________________________________ > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > >> Critiques & Collaborations > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > >> subscribe in the subject header. > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 20:07:59 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 20:07:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Hindutva terrorism against Christians in Orissa In-Reply-To: References: <9c06aab30808260520q26473382w2c5001362e4c8765@mail.gmail.com> <48c2916d0808271005j77e73ff2wea817b345423a7c3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290737u47c5d81s9496e4d5d9c7d8b@mail.gmail.com> Orissa violence: lies and media reports The newspaper report, which is being circulated by email and on the Web by supporters of the Sangh Parivar, is not only inflammatory, but also factually incorrect. VISHAL ARORA says lies get propagated by the media. Posted Wednesday, Aug 27 23:34:31, 2008 from The Hoot: http://thehoot.org/web/home/story.php?storyid=3286&mod=1&pg=1§ionId=5&valid=true The Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) spokesperson Ram Madhav told CNN IBN yesterday that Christians were behind the killing of Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Laxmanananda Saraswati and four others in Orissa's Kandhamal district on August 23. Madhav pointed out that Orissa police had arrested workers of the Christian organization World Vision for the killing. He should have had his facts right before making a statement on a national channel. Madhav's statement may have been based on a report in a newspaper (The Pioneer, August 25): "The police have arrested Pradesh Kumar Das, an employee of the World Vision, a Christian Charity, from Khadagpur while escaping from the district at Buguda. In another drive, two other persons Vikram Digal and William Digal have been arrested from the house of Lal Digal, a local militant Christian, from Nuasahi at Gunjibadi, Nuagaan. They have admitted to having joined a group of 28 other assailants." The newspaper report, which is being circulated by email and on the Web by supporters of the Sangh Parivar, is not only inflammatory, but also factually incorrect. Disturbed by the report, I spoke to Deputy Inspector General (Southern Range) R.P. Koche in Bhubaneshwar, who categorically denied it. "No one has been arrested in 'connection' with the attack on Swami's Ashram. We have merely made some preventive arrests for interrogation," he said. Then, Jayakumar Christian, the executive director of World Vision India, narrated how his organisation's employees landed up in a police station. "Two of our workers were fleeing sensitive areas on a motorbike to escape attacks. They started from Daringbari and were going to Bhubaneswar. However, when they reached Behrampore (Ganjam district), security personnel deployed there asked them to take shelter in a police station for their safety. The police informed us that our employees are in the police station, and asked us to take them to a safer place. And they came back safely the following day." He spoke to me on the phone today. One wonders what is the source of the newspaper's report, which claims that those arrested also confessed to the crime – when the police have denied it. God alone knows how many false reports could be taking the rounds. It is unfortunate that at least nine people, mainly Christians, have been killed or burnt alive and hundreds of homes belonging to Christians have been destroyed by mobs allegedly led by the VHP in the name of retribution. And the violence is carrying on. This is in spite of the fact that a Maoist group, the People's Liberation Revolutionary Group, has claimed responsibility for the killing. A leader of the group, who identified himself as Azad, reportedly called up a newspaper office and said they killed Saraswati because he mixed "religion with politics…" That Kandhamal is a Maoist-affected district is also common knowledge. Further, the police found a threat letter in Saraswati's ashram that was sent prior to the attack. Furthermore, the attack was launched with sophisticated weapons, which also indicates Maoist involvement. Does the VHP not know that the culprits are most likely to be Maoists? Perhaps they do, but it is typical of the VHP and other members of the timid Sangh Parivar to attack soft targets. They raise the issue of Islamist terrorism, but kill and beat common Muslims – as they did in the post-Godhra violence in Gujarat in 2002. And now, in Orissa, they are killing Christians and destroying their property when there are clear indications that Maoists launched the August 23 attack. All that is needed is a lie to target the minority community, and thanks to sections of the media, there is no dearth of falsehoods being propagated. (Vishal Arora is a Delhi-based journalist, and can be contacted at vishalarora_in at hotmail.com) From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 20:18:42 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 20:18:42 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Lies, bad lies and "super-terrorism" Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290748t42cfeddcg78058bd648f2b57c@mail.gmail.com> Given below are two articles, one that is a PTI report put out this morning and the other a media analysis. As the days pass, I think the propaganda machinery of the Indian state is getting the better of the Delhi media. best shivam o o o o ISI expands network from J&K to South; talks 'super terrorism' NEW DELHI, AUG 29 (PTI) Terror groups backed by Pakistan's ISI could use chemical, biological, nuclear or radiological weapons against India initiating a form of "super terrorism", warns a Union Home Ministry report. With ISI spreading its tentacles in the country from Jammu and Kashmir to down South, the report spoke of active terror modules mushrooming in Bihar, Assam and West Bengal where the sleeper cells have been assigned with specific targets. In its section on terror groups and weapons of mass destruction, the report said "super terrorism in this perspective can be defined as projected future use of chemical, biological, nuclear and radiological weapons by terrorist groups." The report said Indo-Nepal border in Bihar is being used for smuggling of arms, explosives, fake currency into the country, while the agency was focusing on Uttar Pradesh to fund Madrasas and recruit youngsters for subversive activities. South India too is an important part of the overall ISI game-plan since it is being targeted to recruit unemployed youths. The report also mentions that ISI is trying to revive Punjab militancy and form new anti-India groups in the state. While Maharashtra has been a victim of underworld gangs which have strong links with ISI, the report mentions that the Pakistan agency was also trying to liaison with the underworld in Gujarat and are using the coastal line for transporting arms and drug running operations. o o o o No shrill blame game in the media Overall, the Indian media did not buy the thesis that the ISI was behind the chronic unrest in Kashmir, and Pakistan's press was too preoccupied with the country's internal woes to focus much on Kashmir. SHUBHA SINGH contributes to the Hoot's Indo-Pak monitoring, with inputs from SEVANTI NINAN Posted Wednesday, Aug 20 18:10:15, 2008 http://thehoot.org/web/home/story.php?storyid=3281&mod=1&pg=1§ionId=8&valid=true Partly because of the ongoing peace process and partly on account of Pakistan's continuing internal turmoil, Indo-Pak accusations over Kashmir don't register the same shrill pitch in the media that they used to even a couple of years ago. Even as Kashmir has been aflame, the accusations about the ISI's hand surfaced briefly, and were highlighted only in passing, not even on the front pages of newspapers. A qualitative difference in the Indo-Pak media rhetoric on Kashmir, was discernable over the period of six weeks or more than Jammu and Kashmir has been burning. Thanks to television, it grabbed headlines for a few days when bureaucrats and politicians in both countries made statements. Given Pakistan's continuing internal turmoil, its media and government found little time to up the ante on Kashmir. Such reactions as there were, were voiced only after the firing took lives in the Valley. Dawn carried a front page news report from Jawed Naqvi with the heading 'Uprising in Kashmir: 12 protestors shot dead'. Its editorial on August 13 mildly rebuked the Pakistani government for not reacting to the situation in Kashmir, but added that every gain that eases tensions should be appreciated. It said: "As India struggles with its Kashmir woes, the Pakistan government has remained remarkably quiet on this front. This despite the fact that New Delhi has accused Pakistan of LoC violations and warned that the composite dialogue is on shaky ground. In light of this, the statement by a spokesman of the Jammu and Kashmir government predicting cross-LoC trade by October should be welcomed. In fraught times, every small gain in CBMs, that help to ease tensions, should be appreciated." As the agitation intensified, Pakistani politicians' commented on the developments across the border, drawing sharp reactions from the Indian government. On both sides the statements were picked up by the media and reported, creating headlines on "interference" for a few days. The impact was much greater on television than in print. The flurry of words which the Indian Express described as the "spat between India and Pakistan" generated three statements in quick succession from the spokesperson of the Indian External Affairs Ministry. The spokesperson took note of a Pakistan Senate resolution on the situation in Jammu and Kashmir, calling it "gross interference in India's internal affairs" and suggesting that "the Senate should attend to issues where it has a locus standi." This was followed by statements on August 12 and 13 reacting to statements from the Pakistani Foreign Minister and the Foreign Office spokesperson, describing Islamabad's call for international involvement in Kashmir as "gratitutous and illegal". The Indian and Pakistani newspapers faithfully reported the statements without much commentary and even the editorials did not have the fiery passages that used to colour the edits a few years ago. Indian TV channels gave greater time to the Indian responses to remarks made in Pakistan while the Indian newspapers carried the Ministry of External Affairs statement in a few short paragraphs. One reason for this widely differing level of coverage could be as The Times of India pointed out because "the MEA's angry outbursts were made late in the evening against Pakistan's statements made early in the morning, making the Indian anger look like an afterthought." The Times News Network added that "Pakistan has kept up the verbal pressure on India on Jammu and Kashmir. Understandably, India has been smarting and certainly a lot of smoke and fire has been belching out of the government, telling off Pakistan exactly where to get off." While the Indian newspapers did not give much space to the serial statements, the firing along the Line of Control was an issue of greater concern. The Times of India wrote on Aug 12: 'Despite India asking Pakistan to respect the border ceasefire Pakistan continues to indulge in cross border firing." It further added that there was a growing feeling that the spurt in cross border firings and infiltrations indicated that the Pak army was pushing its 'Kashmir agenda' to regain loss of credibility it had suffered in its counter-terrorism efforts in the North West Frontier Province. Indian Express had a story with the headline: "After exchange of sweets, Pak rockets hit BSF outpost" on August 16. The paper's Jammu correspondent, Arun Sharma wrote that "within hours of sending sweets to their Indian counterparts, the Pakistani Rangers allegedly greeted Border Security Force personnel with rockets fired at BSF outposts." However, even this coverage got matter-of-fact display. The reports on firing across the LoC were not played up, and were placed on inside pages. The TOI had a three column report on n inside page on August 12 which said that Pakistan was pushing Kashmir agenda to regain the credibility it lost in the North West Frontier Province. The Indian Express's story on firing across the LoC on August 16, after an exchange of sweets, was carried on page 3. The daily protests and demonstrations in Jammu and Kashmir filled the Indian news pages, while the Pakistan newspapers depended on news agencies reports on the agitation in the Valley. The hoary ISI hand in the Jammu and Kashmir developments emerged in an item in the Times of India of August 14 that quoted unnamed intelligence officials saying that 'the economic blockade is a myth created by Pakistan's ISI to project the Hurriyat as true representative of the Kashmiri people.' A story was topped by a five-column headline with the query: "Blockade staged to aid ISI cause?' and the strapline "Pak Agency Trying To Help Hurriyat Mould Public Opinion In Its Favour". But again the display was not attention getting, the story was on the top of page 13, its nation page which carried a slug 'J&K on the boil'. TOI's editorial said: "Here's Islamabad trying hard to set up its house in order. A shaky coalition government has little time or energy to open a Kashmir front as it fends of Islamic radicals within and on its northwestern border... For the Pakistani army as well for the ISI, this is an opportunity served on a platter to divert attention – domestic and global – from the country's internal problems towards the Kashmir issue once again." Translation, the Pakistan government is not trying to play the Kashmir card—the army and the ISI on their own are. The same day, Hindustan Times Foreign Editor, Amit Barua wrote in a news analysis: 'India has scored an own goal in Kashmir'. "It is our own mess. We can't even blame the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) Directorate of Pakistan." By firing and killing unarmed protestors on the Srinagar-Muzzafarabad road on Monday, security forces have added fat to the fire raging on the Amarnath land issue in both the Valley and Jammu…. The land issue has again provided separatists in Kashmir and fundamentalists in Jammu a handle to rekindle their constituencies, Barua wrote. This was on a page 10, devoted to news on Kashmir developments, with the headline – 'A Cascade of Errors'. Not all of the Indian media was buying the ISI line. Enter Musharraf On August 14, newspapers reported on President Pervez Musharraf's much anticipated first appearance after the call to impeach him. The Hindu newspaper's correspondent in Islamabad, Nirupama Subramanian writing on President Musharraf's speech in page one, first lead story focusing on the embattled leader's call for reconciliation within Pakistan. She also wrote: "Gen Musharraf's short speech also included a condemnation of India for 'human rights violations' in Kashmir and a declaration that 'Kashmir runs in the blood of every Pakistani." But the story's headline was "Musharraf calls for reconciliation. Another report in an inside page referred to government resolution adopted unanimously in the National Assembly that condemned India for the killing of Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Abdul Aziz and several other Kashmiris by the Indian security forces. The resolution called upon the UN and human rights organisations to use their good offices to urge India to stop atrocities against unarmed civilian Kashmiris. The Indian Express gave President Musharraf's reference to India in the speech an across-the-page headline on its foreign page: "Musharraf brings up Kashmir in I-Day speech" But the report was agency, a Press Trust of India story which said: "In an apparent bid to divert attention away from the impending impeachment threat looming over him, President Musharraf condemned 'human rights violations' in Jammu and Kashmir." But on that it played Kashnmir on page one,in a front page report headlined 'Midnight protests rock Srinagar'. This story made a passing reference to Pakistan: 'Meanwhile, the spat between India and Pakistan over the J&K situation got uglier today after New Delhi issued its third statement in a week, describing Islamabad's call for international involvement in Kashmir as "gratuitous and illegal"'. On August 15, the day after Pakistan's Independence Day, the Hindu wrote that Pakistani Prime Minister Gilani "sought to bring down the temperature (between India and Pakistan) with an assurance that his government was committed to resolving all issues with India in a just and peaceful manner through negotiations." Mr Gilani made a reference to Kashmir, which the Hindu characterised as 'mild and steered clear of the present unrest in the Valley." The Asian Age and the Indian Express reported External Affairs Minister Pranab Mukherjee response to a TV news channel that Pakistan's comments on the development in Jammu and Kashmir did not create the right atmosphere to carry on the bilateral dialogue. Both newspapers also said that India had rejected comments made by the secretary general of the OIC (Organisation of Islamic Conference) condemning police firing in Kashmir. Times of India's headline said: 'Pranab asks Pak not to meddle in India's affairs'. On Aug 16, Indian newspapers carried short reports on Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's reference to Pakistan in his Independence Day speech. They also wrote about Pakistan Prime Minister Gilani's phone call to greet Mr Manmohan Singh on the occasion. The Hindu referred to Mr Manmohan Singh's comment during the telephone conversation that both sides should refrain from making harsh statements. In contrast, the Pakistani papers took Mr Manmohan Singh's remarks as conveying a more pointed message. The Nation, on Aug 16 had a headline: "Singh warns Pakistan to control terrorism". It said: "Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh used his Independence Day speech on Friday to warn Pakistan to rein in terrorism, as peace talks between the two countries falter 61 years after they were divided." Pak coverage Among Pakistan newspapers The News stuck to agency reports, and The Nation took a slightly harder line than Dawn, overall. And raised the issue of Kashmiri freedom "from the Indian yoke." Its editorial on August 13 was called: 'Indian Highhandedness' The edit said: "The situation in the disputed Valley seems once again to be deteriorating, the responsibility for which very obviously lies with the government's mismanagement. There has been an upsurge of violence against the people by the Indian security forces….. Last month, the Kashmiris were protesting against the illegal transfer of hundreds of acres of land to a Hindu Shrine Board for building structures for Hindu yatrees. The subsequent riots that rocked the Valley were among the biggest in Kashmir's history. What the Indian government needs to understand is that its approach towards the issue is basically erroneous. Economic blockade cannot smother the Kashmiris' spirit of freedom from the Indian yoke." The next day an editorial in the Nation castigated the Indian security forces. It said: "In an act of ruthless repression, the Indian security forces indiscriminately fired at one of the biggest protest rallies in Held Kashmir's history, with participants variously computed between 100,000 and 250,000, and shot down prominent Hurriyat leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz and several others near Uri on Monday…. The blockade has put an end to all trade with the outside world, including that of fruit with which the Valley virtually overflows. That the authorities have not bothered to break it, but let all economic activity in the Valley stifle, suggests their callous attitude towards the people for their 'sin' of agitating for the right to self-determination….The blockade has put an end to all trade with the outside world, including that of fruit with which the Valley virtually overflows. That the authorities have not bothered to break it, but let all economic activity in the Valley stifle, suggests their callous attitude towards the people for their 'sin' of agitating for the right to self-determination." The paper carried a statement by a former Pakistani ambassador and senior aide to the UN Secretary General, that Pakistan should raise its concern on the situation in the Indian Occupied Kashmir at the United Nations. Mr Yusuf Buch, described as an expert on Kashmir, said, "The Prime Minister of Pakistan should immediately contact the Secretary General of the United Nations and, both in conversation on the telephone and in letter which he should ask to be circulated as a document of the Security Council, emphasize that the current situation deserves to be viewed in its human reality and not through the prism of calcified attitudes of inaction stemming from considerations of power politics." Dawn's headline on August 15 stated: 'Widespread protests test India's hold on Kashmir'. It report said: Police shot dead a Muslim protester as huge crowds shouting "we want freedom" took to the streets of occupied Kashmir on Thursday over a land row that is testing New Delhi's hold on the troubled Himalayan region. An editorial in the Dawn newspaper criticized the Pakistani government for backing off from its plans to oppose the nuclear safeguards agreement at the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). It said: "The Bush administration launched its own campaign to dissuade Pakistan from any effort to thwart the Indo-US game plan… Our ambassador in Washington, too, according to well-informed sources, pitched in, recommending that we do nothing to upset the Bush administration's advice and, instead, terminate all efforts to counter the Indo-US move, at both the IAEA and the NSG, which is to meet to consider the US draft to allow nuclear trade with India. To the Foreign Office's disappointment, the entire campaign was called off, causing deep dismay at this abject surrender of national interests." Pakistani newspapers had a large number of developments with Pakistan to report in the last week. On August 14, Dawn had six items on page one detailing militant strikes in Lahore (8 killed), villagers kill six militants, clashes between rival tribes in Kurram agency, 24 killed – militants stop people from leaving Bajaur, six killed 19 injured in Balouchistan attacks. Other stories were Sindh assembly seeks impeachment and 'Dozens injured in Kashmir protests'. The Kashmir story therefore, was an also ran. Television Indian television channels, Times Now in particular, gave more prominence than Indian newspapers did to accusations from across the border. All major channels showed the Ministery of external affairs spokesman reading out his statements referring to Pakistan's interference on consecutive days. Given the fact of constant repeat telecasts, the message registered with anyone who tuned in to any of the major satellite and cable news channels. President Musharraf's references to India in his speech on the eve of Pakistan's independence day played far more effectively across TV channels in India than in the newspapers. Heard and seen they had greater impact than reporting in cold print. His sentences help television news channels flog the "interference" angle for all it was worth. He made an emotional pitch, stating that Kahmir was every in Pakistani's "dil ka dhadkan." (heartbeat) and that the killings there were most regrettable. Times Now in particular chose to flog this:" Musharraf is trying to be a Pakistani hero for one last time." Later anchor Arnab Goswami talked of "Open, obvious meddling from across the border" and repeated that description. He dredged up the ISI bogey: "Is the ISI behind the blockade myth?" he asked. In a discussion on NDTV 24x7 however, when asked about the role of Pakistan by anchor Barkha Dutt, journalist Prem Shankar Jha, a guest on the show, said "Pakistan had nothing to do with what happened from July onward." Overall both Hindi and English channels ran President Musharraf's statements over several times, not just the first day, but also till the 11 pm bulletin the following night. Channels kept telling their viewers, "Musharraf raises Kashmir issue." But shortly after came the President's resignation, and the focus turned and stayed, on Pakistan's internal problems. From ysaeed7 at yahoo.com Fri Aug 29 20:25:34 2008 From: ysaeed7 at yahoo.com (Yousuf Saeed) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 07:55:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions In-Reply-To: <46C9670D-C40D-453E-A3C7-B321906D3EC3@sarai.net> Message-ID: <621221.71480.qm@web51408.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear Shuddha, others I really appreciate your highlighting of the fact that Hussain's intention may not be of insulting the Hindus by drawing the deities in the nude or otherwise. I am not a defender of Hussain, but would like to put across a few points. Many people (on this list and elsewhere) have pointed out that Hussain never drew any Muslim character (such as the Prophet) in this manner, and therefore his intention must be to insult the Hindus. They also say that such an act by any artist in a Muslim country (like Saudi Arabia) would result in death penalty, and so on. But maybe Hussain did not draw an Islamic character in an "immodest" posture simply because such an image or icon doesn’t exist in the Islam's visual cultural tradition. If he does it, then that would be deliberately provocative (although I am not saying it shouldn't be done). But he could draw a Hindu deity in the nude because such a tradition exists in our Indian visual culture. I doubt if he avoids the depiction of Muslim themes because he is scared of the Islamists. Maybe he simply can't relate to it as an Indian. If I as an artist cannot express my certain feelings in the language that has been taught to be me by my parents, and I suddenly discover a new language that allows me to express that peculiar feeling in a much better way than what my mother tongue did, I would be happy to use the new language. There are thousands of poets and artists who found a new way of expression in a language which every one in their midst had found "inferior" – I am talking for example of the tradition of Persian poets of South Asia who also wrote verses in Hindi or Hinduvi. While poets such as Masud Sa'd Salman, Amir Khusrau, Abdurrahim Khane-khana, Ghalib, or Iqbal became famous for their exquisite verse in Persian, their heart pours out better in their Hinduvi, Urdu or Braj poetry where they can come down to the earth from the lofty royal palaces. We often say, "Unki Hindi shayeri mein mitti ki khushbu aati hai" (one can smell the earth in their vernacular poetry). And I think Hussain is no different from them. He cannot draw an Islamic character in the nude because it's probably not in his palette, or doesn't touch his heart. (And we cannot force him to do it to become more politically correct). You may say that a lot of semi-pornographic scenes have been drawn in Mughal or Persian miniatures, and he could have followed that. But that's not the point. Hindu deities are flexible enough for us to turn them around the way we wish, to express a certain feeling that cannot be expressed any other way. So why not appreciate and celebrate that fact. (I know such a statement from me might raise some eyebrows). I maybe a Muslim but I appreciate the fact that you can literally play with many Hindu deities. Just the other day I heard Pandit Jasraj sing a khayal in which the lyrics repeatedly referred to Krishna as a chor (thief). Does that insult a Hindu? Or would it insult a Hindu if this khayal was sung by Ustad Amir Khan? (Incidentally, a large number of traditional Hindu devotional lyrics sung in classical music have reached us via Muslim gharana musicians, and much of devotional Hindu visual mythology has come to us via patwa artists of Bengal who are all Muslim. Can M.F.Hussain be detached from that continuity?) Much of the popular calendar and poster art of 20th century showing Hindu deities was drawn by an artist called Hasan Raza Raja of Meerut. And the manner in which most Hindu deities are visualized today comes from the pioneering work of Raja Ravi Varma who was clearly inspired by western style of art where human models were used to visualize the gods and goddesses. So, does all this insult the Hindus? And what is the "original" Hindu way of imagining the deities any way? I liked your quoting from Kausari who is among many Hindu poets who have written/announced their emotive affiliation with Prophet Mohammad in the same way as say with Krishna. I doubt if such actions in the past may have met with much resistance (as you have mentioned) – such examples were a norm. There are many Hindu poets who have written marsiyas full of pathos for Imam Hussain's martyrdom, and many Muslim poets who composed adorable songs for Krishna. I don't think it was too hard to cross the road in those days. So, why are we busy throwing stones onto each other from the two sides of a road? I could imagine that at least an online forum like Sarai could act like a subway or a walk-over bridge to cross the busy highway. But currently it seems more like a road-block. And we are all paying the toll. Yousuf --- On Fri, 8/29/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta wrote: > From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta > Subject: [Reader-list] Ways of Life and Transgressions > To: "Sarai list" > Date: Friday, August 29, 2008, 1:31 PM > Dear All, > > I have been intrigued by the exchange on the list of late > that has > preferred to jettison the term 'religion' and > prefer in its stead the > euphimistic phrase - 'ways of life'. I am referring > to the exchange > between Chanchal Malviya and Jeebesh Bagchi, arising out of > the > heated correspondence on the disruption of a small > exhibition devoted > to M.F.Husain. > > i am quite convinced that the term 'religion' > which derives from the > latin root of the word religio (bond) and religare (the > verb form of > 'to bind') remains for me a useful word to name the > act of committing > oneself in any form. In this sense, atheists and agnostics > are just > as religious (in their commitment to doubt) as are those > blessed with > faith. I would describe my religious commitment as > agnosticism - a > commitment to doubt everything, (including the value of > doubt) and a > certainty that we cannot speak certainly of anything at > all, because > there are always counterfactuals, and hitherto unimagined, > or unknown > possibilities, that goad us on to yet newer possibilities, > or to > return to some very old ones. This is just to say that it > would be a > mistake to assume, as is often done with some arrogance on > the part > of the more pronouncedly 'faithful', that atheists > and agnostics have > no 'spiritual' quests. They do, and they dont, just > as those who are > ostentatiously 'religious' do, and dont, or do only > in as much as it > allows them to burn a few churches as they go questing. If > Hindu > fundamentalists have chosen to renounce the ties that bind > (religio) > them to life, who would I be to object, because, I am not a > Hindu. > But I have no quarrel with the term 'ways of life'. > The more words we > have, the better. > > This discussion arose out of a rage felt by some that a > group of > zealots had broken and disrupted an exhibition that > featured some > images of and by Husain, and the counter rage felt by > others that the > zealots had no right to be criticised because they were > acting to > protect the honour of the Hindu deities that they felt > Husain had > insulted. > > The second case is as follows - what right has Husain, a > Muslim to > insult Hindu deities by portraying them in a manner that is > offensive > to the sentiments of many Hindus. (Husain's > motivations, or the > aesthetic merit of his images are not the issue here, what > is at > issue is the insult seen to have occurred when a non-Hindu > 'touches' > a sacred Hindu icon with his 'insulting' > imagination. Those so > enraged, also throw the following challenge, has the > opposite ever > occurred? > > I am not here to make a case for Husain. (As I have said > before I do > not have a very high opinion of his work as an artist). I > am here to > make a case for what is considered to be transgression. No > one can be > sure when they have transgressed. Because transgression can > be seen > to occur even when the motives of the person concerned are > far from > transgression. Husain can say in his defence, and indeed > has on > occasion said that his paintings are an index of his > appreciation of > Indic culture and its diversity of expressions, of his > closeness > (since early childhood) to forms of iconic imagery in > popular Hinduism. > > Here his intent is clearly not to insult, on the contrary, > it is to > declare his appreciation for the beauty of the iconography > of popular > Hinduism, a charge for which he would be equally hated by > both Hindu > as well as Muslim fundamentalists. > > It has not been noticed that no Muslim fundamentalist or > even Muslim > religious figure has come out in defence of Husain. They > are in fact > in tacit agreement with their Hindu peers. A Muslim making > images, > and that too of Hindu goddesses, because he is drawn to > them, can > only be seen as blasphemy in their eyes. On this, like on > so many > other issues, Hindu and Muslim fundamentalists are in total > agreement. > > Let me come now to an interesting counterfactual argument. > I refer to > the life an work of a little known late nineteenth century > and early > twentieth century Urdu poet of Delhi called Dillu Ram > Kausari. Now as > his name suggests, Dillu Ram was a Hindu. The trouble is, > throughout > his life he composed deliriously passionate elegies > (na'at) to the > Prophet Muhammad. > > One of his quatrains went as follows > > Kuch ‘ishq e Muhammad mein nahin shart e Musulman! > Hai Kausari Hindu bhii talabgaar e Muhammad! > Allah re! kyaa raunaq e bazaar e Muhammad > Ke Ma’bood e Jahan bhi hai kharidaar e Muhammad! > > Being a Muslim is not a condition for loving Muhammad! > Kausari, the Hindu, is also a seeker of Muhammad! > By Allah! How delightful is the bazaar of Muhammad > For the Lord of the Worlds is also a buyer of Muhammad! > > This kind of sentiment shocked both Hindus and Muslims. > Hindus, > because how could a Hindu sing what amounted to love songs > to a > Muslim prophet, and Muslims, for the same reason. Both felt > slighted > and insulted by the transgressive way in which the > imagination of the > poet had 'touched' the body of what was sacred for > one, and not, for > the other. > > Another poem, which proved to be even more controversial, > went like > this - > > Rahmatulilalamin kay Hashar mein maana’ khulay > Khalq saari Shaafa e Roz e Jaza kay saath hai > Laykay Dillu Raam ko jannat mein jab Hazrat gaye > Ma’loom huwa kay Hindu bhi Mahboob e Khuda kay saath hai! > > The meaning of “Mercy unto the Worlds” became apparent > on Judgement Day: > The whole creation is with the Intercessor of The Day of > Acquittal > When the Prophet took Dillu Ram with him into Paradise > It was known that this Hindu too is with the Beloved of > God! > > This poem, especially scandalized Muslim orthodoxy, because > it dared > to suggest that the prophet himself would intercede on > behalf of an > unbeliever on the day of judgement. > > It is interesting to note that Dillu Ram never became a > Muslim, at > least not in his lifetime. An article in the interesting > web portal > Chowk http://www.chowk.com/articles/12692 by one Asif > Naqshbandi says > > "It is also said that Dillu Ram, delirious with his > love, would > sometimes stand in the middle of the bazaar in Delhi, put > chains > around his neck and feet and shout at the top of his voice > to all > passers-by, “Muhammad! Muhammad! Muhammad! Yes! Muhammad > is the > Beloved of God! Muhammad is the first and only Beloved of > God! If God > loves you, He loves you because of His Beloved!” Some > people even > stoned him and he would often come home covered in blood > but he was > totally lost in his love of the Prophet (peace and > blessings be upon > him!)" > > There is an apocryphal story of how on his deathbed Dillu > Ram Kausari > had a vision of the Prophet himself, who came to him, and > that he > read the Kalima with him. But as this vision is reported to > have > appeared only to him, as he lay dying, and as he is no > longer with us > to either confirm or deny this deathbed conversion, we can > only > surmise that it was a generous, but somewhat disingenuous > method of > having Dillu Ram's somewhat unorthodox Muslim > apologists claim him > for themselves. > > As far as we are concerned, Dillu Ram Kausari, caused grave > offence, > by his love for the Prophet, both to Hindu as well as to > Muslim > zealots, as long as he lived. > > If, the things we call religions are 'ways of life' > then we can > always determine for ourselves whether we want to walk on a > one way > street that runs into a dead end, or to cross many paths, > walking > down one way, for one purpose, down another way for > another, and > sometimes just standing in between paths, figuring out our > journey, > as we go about our lives. > > I find cases like Husain and Dillu Ram Kausari interesting > not > because of what they paint of what they say, but because > they seem to > cause such prolonged traffic jams on the 'ways of > life'. And all they > were doing was crossing the road. > > thanks and regards, > > Shuddha > > ----- > Shuddhabrata Sengupta > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to > reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. > To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 21:35:37 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 21:35:37 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Aug 30: Dharna on Kashmir at Jantar Mantar Message-ID: <9c06aab30808290905h4520032djcd5b97cbdf887f77@mail.gmail.com> Forwarded message: Janahastakshep, PUCL and PUDR are holding a dharna on August 30 at jantar mantar from 11am to 1pm in protest against the crackdown on non violent people demanding 'azadi'. IT is clear that only way in which Indian state restore its authority is by using coercive means. It is a form of collective punishment of the people that indefinite and unrelenting curfew has been imposed. Already reeling under economic blockade the imposition of curfew is making it worse with even hospitals not being allowed to function fully and attacks on ambulances and injured. Food is in short supply. Water and electricity disrupted. No one is allowed to move about even with curfew passes and there are restrictions placed on media. For 18 years it was told by Indian state and Indian opinion makers that if only the movement sheds weapons talks can be held. When that happened and largely non violent protests began instead of heeding the voice of the people and reaching out to them through talks the Indian state has decided to show its iron fist. Right to life and right to live in dignity stands suspended. Are we going to sit silently when such harsh measures are adopted? Do we want guns to make their reappearance as the Indian state is provoking the people to do? IF we believe that unity of people and their aspirations are our major concern should we not come out in solidarity and support for their cause which they were carrying out peacefully? Please spread the word to gather at jantar mantar on saturday August 30 at 11 am to protest the severe repression let loose on the people. WE intend to demand lifting of curfew. Restoration of civil liberties. Allowing non violent assembly. Talks with people at the highest level so that 61 years of denial, repression, charade of dialogue, manipulation is discarded and substantive progress is made to democratically and peacefully resolve the intractable problem. Janahastakshep, PUCL, PUDR From mail at shivamvij.com Fri Aug 29 22:41:21 2008 From: mail at shivamvij.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Shivam_Vij?= =?UTF-8?Q?_=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=AE?= =?UTF-8?Q?=E0=A5=8D_=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=9C=E0=A5=8D?=) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 22:41:21 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] =?utf-8?q?Hurriyat_surprised_over_Pakistan=E2=80=99?= =?utf-8?q?s_silence_on_Kashmir?= Message-ID: <9c06aab30808291011r14430c55je5c2224be30269e1@mail.gmail.com> Hurriyat surprised over Pakistan's silence on Kashmir 28 August, 2008 02:39:00 Etalaat News Service http://etalaat.com/english/News/front-page/2538.html Srinagar,August 28: As has been seen during the present uprising that Pakistan government and its media has completely and surprisingly ignored the recent happenings in Kashmir,the separatist Hurriyat Conference Thursday said that it was "surprised at the silence of Pakistan over Kashmir". "We are seriously concerned about the well-being of our leaders arrested by the authorities here," said the joint coordination committee of the moderate and hardline factions of the Hurriyat conference in a statement issued here. It is to be mentioned that senior separatist leaders, Syed Ali Geelani, Mirwaiz Umar Farooq and Mohammad Yasin Malik were arrested on Sunday in the context of their proposed march to Lal Chowk. Spokesperson of the coordination committee Masarat Alam blamed India for using force against what he called "internationally accepted peaceful protests in Kashmir". The co-ordination committee asked the people to hold peaceful demonstrations after Friday prayers across the valley. Masarat Alam,a strong advocateof Jammu and Kashmir's merger with Pakistan, said the separatist conglomerate was surprised at the "silence of Pakistan over the developments in Kashmir". From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 01:08:11 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 01:08:11 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Mukul Kesavan's response In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ------ Forwarded Message From: Mukul Kesavan Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:05:10 +0530 To: Subject: Shuddhabrata Dear Sonia, Thanks for sending me Shuddhabrata's intervention. I was interested in what he had to say and I've tried to respond to his comments. Do you think you could post it? I'm not sure how the site works. I'm cutting and pasting it into the body of this message. I hope you're writing madly. All best, Mukul --------------------------------------- I read Shuddhabrata Sengupta's comment on my Kashmir piece with interest, particularly his strictures on earthbound thinking. As an admirer of the potential of utopian thinking I expected he would indicate a way in which the possibilities of co-existence in Kashmir could be re-imagined and I was disappointed when he didn't. Perhaps he'll sketch something out in time; in the absence of spelt-out alternatives, the world as it is will continue to shape the conversation. Chiding 'pragmatists' and 'realists' for their State-bound imaginations without supplying a lead or two about how he might set about the issue is a bit blithe. "Weak, consequentialist arguments": Shuddhabrata has two objections to such arguments in the piece. I suspect we could collapse them into one: i.e. don't argue from possible outcomes because you don't know what they'll be. Self-determination and secession have led to good outcomes as well as bad ones: to second-guess the result is presumptuous and, less charitably, colonial. It's worth pointing out that it's hard to think about the future without guessing at outcomes. The way this is often done is by analogy (what has happened before or elsewhere). The reason I don't vote for the BJP is because history and experience has taught me to mistrust majoritarian parties that believe nations are owned by a dominant People. So when Kashmiri Muslim leaders begin to frame their arguments in mainly Muslim or Islamic terms I begin to see an unpleasant sectarian state as the likely outcome of azadi. If the a dominant Muslim/Islamic idiom is set in the context of the violence that purged the Valley of Pandits, this outcome begins to seem more likely. I might be mistaken (and even if I'm right, this may still not be sufficient reason to oppose azadi), but you can scarcely rule guesswork/speculation/deduction (call it what you like) out of court. Shuddhabrata speculates in just this way when he guesses that I prefer the coercive secular state solution to azadi. I don't explicitly endorse one or the other in my piece, but he looks for clues to my inclination in the piece and decides he has found them. He might be wrong but it's a legitimate route to a conclusion. In just this way, I listen to speeches and slogans, I read about the ways in which Kashmiri Muslims imagine azadi and think about the the uses they'd put it to. I can, of course, do this opportunistically, and imagine the worst to suit my prejudices, but we must allow that it can also be done in good faith, because the criterion of certainty that Shuddhabrata suggests is an impossible one. Am I certain that Prabhakaran if he achieves Tamil Eelam, will rule like a Stalinist despot? No I'm not; not certain. But I'm not about to write him a cheque on the off-chance. "Lame liberalism": yes, that last option is colonial in its reasoning. That's why it's squalid and compromised. Is it an argument that liberals can make: yes--liberals have made arguments of this sort since liberalism came into being. Just as self-determination has been used to dress up a multitude of unpleasant ideologies. "Kesavan invokes the Chechens, but not to mention that Stalin's decision to 'wipe Chechnya off the Map' and to deport all Chechens (and parts of other ethnicities) to forms of forced internal exile, (in the name of the integrity of the Soviet Union under his dictatorship) led to many hundreds of thousands of deaths....": I'm not sure what to make of this. I don't mention the Chechens or Chechnya at all. Shuddhabrata has me not just 'invoking' the Chechens but invoking them selectively, a misreading so extravagant that it's baroque. Perhaps his response to questions about 'azadi' is, in the idiom of the Eighties, over-determined. But Chechnya is worth discussing in this context. Would a Russian liberal who wanted to hang on to Chechnya make the same arguments as our liberal Indian apologist? No. He wouldn't be able to, for the reasons that Shuddhabrata outlines. His country in its earlier avatar as a totalitarian despotism and its present incarnation as a Russian Orthodox state is rather different from the Indian republic. It attempted genocide, deportation, internal exile. The Republic of India has much blood on its hands in Kashmir, but it's worth saying that it hasn't done those things. If there are Kashmiris who live a form of internal exile, it's the pandits. Just as self-determination isn't necessarily virtuous, neither is the territorial integrity of a large state always a worthwhile cause. So a liberal attempting a quasi-colonial apologia for Russia's claim to Chechnya would find arguments harder to come by than his Indian counterpart. This difference might make no difference to Kashmiris, a pluralist bullet being as lethal as any other, but it might make a difference to the desi liberal trying avoid a told-you-Muslims-are-incapable-of-co-existence upshot. Weakly consequentialist? I don't know. If I was a Kashmiri Muslim I'd say (as a Kashmiri Muslim correspondent said to me), "Is India a myth that it can be undone by the secession of a small state? Why should you hold us hostage to your anxieties?" And the liberal might say, "You're right. But given Partition I can't take our pluralism for granted. An Indian State that signed on to secession by Muslim majority Kashmir runs the risk of Weimar, the risk of losing legitimacy." Or he might cross his fingers about the weakly consequentialist consequences, and be shamed into supporting Kashmiri self-determinism. This compromised choice might mean nothing to the clear-thinking person who isn't a liberal and doesn't set much store by the 'Westphalian state'. For those who think they are (liberal) and haven't yet transcended the State that contains them, the dilemma is a real one. ------ End of Forwarded Message From taraprakash at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 02:57:38 2008 From: taraprakash at gmail.com (TaraPrakash) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 17:27:38 -0400 Subject: [Reader-list] A petition for Kashmir - please sign and forward References: <9c06aab30808290552w9ffe9e5l34b753a8b5002668@mail.gmail.com><9c06aab30808290610o54835fd3ve1a6b30df316148e@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808290625nf28d14fp9ad381b155f8c7f8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00fe01c90a1e$13148ba0$6500a8c0@taraprakash> Okay, time to go back to our colonial masters? Once we lost our rights, now we want to get rid of them? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" To: "S. Jabbar" Cc: "Sarai" Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 9:25 AM Subject: Re: [Reader-list] A petition for Kashmir - please sign and forward > Apologies - the subject line did say, "please sign and forward". That > was in the mail I got. So please feel free to not sign and delete. > best > shivam > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:40 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: >> Let me clarify Sonia that I haven't taken out the petition. I don't >> know who has. You have the right not to sign it. I forwarded it FYI >> and, as you may have noticed, did not add a note urging others to sign >> it. On my part I have signed it and I don't feel the need to explain >> anyone why I have signed it. >> best >> shivam >> >> On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:36 PM, S. Jabbar >> wrote: >>> Interesting, Shivam. But why on earth is this addressed to the British >>> government, the ones who've bloodied their hands in Afghanistan & Iraq? >>> Not >>> enough that they were once our colonial masters, surely? >>> >>> And after the history of the UN, and the role of the UK and the US, you >>> want >>> them to enter Kashmir? Not bad enough that they have their bases in >>> Afghanistan and are swarming Pakistan? >>> >>> Sorry. Can't sign this. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 8/29/08 6:22 PM, "Shivam Vij शिवम् विज्" wrote: >>> >>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>> >>> >>> Dear All, >>> >>> Please sign this petition >>>> for the sake of the suffering Kashmiri >>>> people: >>> >>> http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html >>> >>> Please also send >>>> this email to as many people (Kashmiris and >>> non-Kashmiris alike) as you can, >>>> together with a request to sign the >>> petition. >>> >>> Regards >>> >>>> ______________________________________________ >>> To: >>> >>> Gordon Brown >>> Prime >>>> Minister >>> United Kingdom >>> >>> David Miliband >>> Foreign Secretary >>> United Kingdom >>> >>> Ban >>>> Ki-moon >>> Secretary-General >>> United Nations >>> >>> José Manuel >>>> Barroso >>> President >>> European Commission >>> >>> >>> We are writing to bring to your >>>> attention the increasingly >>> deteriorating situation in the Indian-controlled >>>> part of the disputed >>> region of Jammu and Kashmir. Over the last two months, >>>> the people of >>> Kashmir have held mass public processions protesting against >>>> an >>> economic blockade imposed against the valley of Kashmir by >>>> extremist >>> elements in the southern region of Jammu. >>> >>> These peaceful protests >>>> have now escalated into a demand for the right >>> to self-determination >>>> guaranteed to the people of Kashmir by various >>> United Nations Resolutions >>>> (including nos. 57/1948, 51/1948, 80/1950, >>> and 122/1957). These rallies have >>>> drawn widespread support from >>> hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris across the >>>> length and breadth of >>> the Kashmir valley. >>> >>> The Indian authorities have >>>> responded to these non-violent protests by >>> using excessive lethal force >>>> including firing live rounds on unarmed >>> protestors. So far, more than 25 >>>> unarmed civilians have been killed in >>> firing by Indian soldiers. There are now >>>> more than 600,000 Indian >>> soldiers and paramilitaries on active duty in Kashmir >>>> (which >>> translates to approximately one soldier for every eight >>>> Kashmiris). >>> >>> Initially the Indian government allowed the protests to >>>> proceed >>> without much opposition. However, it has recently changed its >>>> approach >>> and begun to adopt repressive measures. The Indian government >>>> has >>> banned local television channels and placed restrictions on media >>> freedom. >>>> Pro-freedom politicians have been arrested without charge and >>> prevented from >>>> attending processions and giving speeches. Indefinite >>> curfew has been imposed >>>> across the ten districts of the Kashmir valley >>> and soldiers have been given >>>> shoot-at-sight orders in some places. >>> >>> We are deeply disturbed by the absence >>>> of any comment by the British >>> government, the European Union or the United >>>> Nations on the recent >>> spate of violence in Kashmir. When protests broke out in >>>> Tibet in >>> March earlier this year, only a few thousand people took to >>>> the >>> streets in Lhasa and other towns. Yet, there was a flurry of >>> condemnation >>>> of the Chinese authorities by Western governments and >>> international >>>> organisations. China was urged to refrain from using >>> excessive force and to >>>> initiate meaningful talks with the Tibetans. In >>> stark contrast to this vocal >>>> stance on Tibet, the international >>> community has maintained complete silence >>>> on Kashmir. >>> >>> We call upon the British government, as the former colonial power >>>> in >>> South Asia, to discharge the moral responsibility it has to speak >>>> out >>> against human rights violations in Kashmir and to urge all parties >>>> to >>> exercise restraint and initiate peaceful negotiations for solving >>> disputes. >>>> India is a member of the Commonwealth just like Zimbabwe and >>> the Indian >>>> government deserves to be reminded of its obligations just >>> as much as Mr >>>> Mugabe. In today's world, the British government simply >>> cannot afford to be >>>> seen as being selective in its criticism of other >>> countries and exposure of >>>> state excesses when it comes to maintaining >>> ethical and humanitarian >>>> high-grounds. >>> >>> We, therefore, call upon you to urge the Indian government >>>> to: >>> >>> • exercise restraint in dealing with protests in Kashmir, >>> >>> • ensure human >>>> rights are not violated and bring perpetrators of human >>> rights to justice, >>>> and >>> >>> • initiate peaceful and meaningful negotiations to address the >>> underlying >>>> causes of unrest in Kashmir, including the fundamental >>> question of Kashmir's >>>> future status. >>> >>> Sincerely, >>> The >>>> Undersigned >>> _________________________________________ >>> reader-list: an open >>>> discussion list on media and the city. >>> Critiques & Collaborations >>> To >>>> subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >>>> subscribe in >>>> the subject header. >>> To unsubscribe: >>>> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >>> List archive: >>>> <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ >> > > > > -- > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 10:07:16 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 10:07:16 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Lies, bad lies and "super-terrorism" In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808290748t42cfeddcg78058bd648f2b57c@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808290748t42cfeddcg78058bd648f2b57c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808292137k3e4cb778n31c155f701aa2f40@mail.gmail.com> Yes , these are all baseless lies. ISI is a super NGO which has no interest in creating unrest in India. It has always been involved in humanitarian works and it seems ISI would be doing charity for flood effected people as well. It is time to spread these stories , after all we have so much love for ISI and its 'missionaries' like Bitta Karate , Yasin Malik , Geelani etc. Lets nominate ISI and these people to Noble as well. Jeeve Jeeve .......Aaayi Aaayiii.....Yahan Kya Chalega,...... Jai Shivam ! Pawan On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 8:18 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Given below are two articles, one that is a PTI report put out this > morning and the other a media analysis. As the days pass, I think the > propaganda machinery of the Indian state is getting the better of the > Delhi media. > best > shivam > > o o o o > > ISI expands network from J&K to South; talks 'super terrorism' > > NEW DELHI, AUG 29 (PTI) > > Terror groups backed by Pakistan's ISI could use chemical, biological, > nuclear or radiological weapons against India initiating a form of > "super terrorism", warns a Union Home Ministry report. > > With ISI spreading its tentacles in the country from Jammu and Kashmir > to down South, the report spoke of active terror modules mushrooming > in Bihar, Assam and West Bengal where the sleeper cells have been > assigned with specific targets. > > In its section on terror groups and weapons of mass destruction, the > report said "super terrorism in this perspective can be defined as > projected future use of chemical, biological, nuclear and radiological > weapons by terrorist groups." > > The report said Indo-Nepal border in Bihar is being used for smuggling > of arms, explosives, fake currency into the country, while the agency > was focusing on Uttar Pradesh to fund Madrasas and recruit youngsters > for subversive activities. > > South India too is an important part of the overall ISI game-plan > since it is being targeted to recruit unemployed youths. > > The report also mentions that ISI is trying to revive Punjab militancy > and form new anti-India groups in the state. > > While Maharashtra has been a victim of underworld gangs which have > strong links with ISI, the report mentions that the Pakistan agency > was also trying to liaison with the underworld in Gujarat and are > using the coastal line for transporting arms and drug running > operations. > > o o o o > > No shrill blame game in the media > > Overall, the Indian media did not buy the thesis that the ISI was > behind the chronic unrest in Kashmir, and Pakistan's press was too > preoccupied with the country's internal woes to focus much on Kashmir. > SHUBHA SINGH contributes to the Hoot's Indo-Pak monitoring, with > inputs from SEVANTI NINAN > > Posted Wednesday, Aug 20 18:10:15, 2008 > > http://thehoot.org/web/home/story.php?storyid=3281&mod=1&pg=1§ionId=8&valid=true > > Partly because of the ongoing peace process and partly on account of > Pakistan's continuing internal turmoil, Indo-Pak accusations over > Kashmir don't register the same shrill pitch in the media that they > used to even a couple of years ago. Even as Kashmir has been aflame, > the accusations about the ISI's hand surfaced briefly, and were > highlighted only in passing, not even on the front pages of > newspapers. > > A qualitative difference in the Indo-Pak media rhetoric on Kashmir, > was discernable over the period of six weeks or more than Jammu and > Kashmir has been burning. Thanks to television, it grabbed headlines > for a few days when bureaucrats and politicians in both countries made > statements. > > Given Pakistan's continuing internal turmoil, its media and government > found little time to up the ante on Kashmir. Such reactions as there > were, were voiced only after the firing took lives in the Valley. Dawn > carried a front page news report from Jawed Naqvi with the heading > 'Uprising in Kashmir: 12 protestors shot dead'. Its editorial on > August 13 mildly rebuked the Pakistani government for not reacting to > the situation in Kashmir, but added that every gain that eases > tensions should be appreciated. It said: "As India struggles with its > Kashmir woes, the Pakistan government has remained remarkably quiet on > this front. This despite the fact that New Delhi has accused Pakistan > of LoC violations and warned that the composite dialogue is on shaky > ground. In light of this, the statement by a spokesman of the Jammu > and Kashmir government predicting cross-LoC trade by October should be > welcomed. In fraught times, every small gain in CBMs, that help to > ease tensions, should be appreciated." > > As the agitation intensified, Pakistani politicians' commented on the > developments across the border, drawing sharp reactions from the > Indian government. On both sides the statements were picked up by the > media and reported, creating headlines on "interference" for a few > days. The impact was much greater on television than in print. > > The flurry of words which the Indian Express described as the "spat > between India and Pakistan" generated three statements in quick > succession from the spokesperson of the Indian External Affairs > Ministry. The spokesperson took note of a Pakistan Senate resolution > on the situation in Jammu and Kashmir, calling it "gross interference > in India's internal affairs" and suggesting that "the Senate should > attend to issues where it has a locus standi." This was followed by > statements on August 12 and 13 reacting to statements from the > Pakistani Foreign Minister and the Foreign Office spokesperson, > describing Islamabad's call for international involvement in Kashmir > as "gratitutous and illegal". > > The Indian and Pakistani newspapers faithfully reported the statements > without much commentary and even the editorials did not have the fiery > passages that used to colour the edits a few years ago. Indian TV > channels gave greater time to the Indian responses to remarks made in > Pakistan while the Indian newspapers carried the Ministry of External > Affairs statement in a few short paragraphs. > > One reason for this widely differing level of coverage could be as The > Times of India pointed out because "the MEA's angry outbursts were > made late in the evening against Pakistan's statements made early in > the morning, making the Indian anger look like an afterthought." The > Times News Network added that "Pakistan has kept up the verbal > pressure on India on Jammu and Kashmir. Understandably, India has been > smarting and certainly a lot of smoke and fire has been belching out > of the government, telling off Pakistan exactly where to get off." > > While the Indian newspapers did not give much space to the serial > statements, the firing along the Line of Control was an issue of > greater concern. The Times of India wrote on Aug 12: 'Despite India > asking Pakistan to respect the border ceasefire Pakistan continues to > indulge in cross border firing." It further added that there was a > growing feeling that the spurt in cross border firings and > infiltrations indicated that the Pak army was pushing its 'Kashmir > agenda' to regain loss of credibility it had suffered in its > counter-terrorism efforts in the North West Frontier Province. Indian > Express had a story with the headline: "After exchange of sweets, Pak > rockets hit BSF outpost" on August 16. The paper's Jammu > correspondent, Arun Sharma wrote that "within hours of sending sweets > to their Indian counterparts, the Pakistani Rangers allegedly greeted > Border Security Force personnel with rockets fired at BSF outposts." > > However, even this coverage got matter-of-fact display. The reports on > firing across the LoC were not played up, and were placed on inside > pages. The TOI had a three column report on n inside page on August 12 > which said that Pakistan was pushing Kashmir agenda to regain the > credibility it lost in the North West Frontier Province. The Indian > Express's story on firing across the LoC on August 16, after an > exchange of sweets, was carried on page 3. > > The daily protests and demonstrations in Jammu and Kashmir filled the > Indian news pages, while the Pakistan newspapers depended on news > agencies reports on the agitation in the Valley. The hoary ISI hand in > the Jammu and Kashmir developments emerged in an item in the Times of > India of August 14 that quoted unnamed intelligence officials saying > that 'the economic blockade is a myth created by Pakistan's ISI to > project the Hurriyat as true representative of the Kashmiri people.' A > story was topped by a five-column headline with the query: "Blockade > staged to aid ISI cause?' and the strapline "Pak Agency Trying To Help > Hurriyat Mould Public Opinion In Its Favour". But again the display > was not attention getting, the story was on the top of page 13, its > nation page which carried a slug 'J&K on the boil'. > > TOI's editorial said: "Here's Islamabad trying hard to set up its > house in order. A shaky coalition government has little time or energy > to open a Kashmir front as it fends of Islamic radicals within and on > its northwestern border... For the Pakistani army as well for the ISI, > this is an opportunity served on a platter to divert attention – > domestic and global – from the country's internal problems towards the > Kashmir issue once again." Translation, the Pakistan government is > not trying to play the Kashmir card—the army and the ISI on their own > are. > > The same day, Hindustan Times Foreign Editor, Amit Barua wrote in a > news analysis: 'India has scored an own goal in Kashmir'. "It is our > own mess. We can't even blame the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) > Directorate of Pakistan." By firing and killing unarmed protestors on > the Srinagar-Muzzafarabad road on Monday, security forces have added > fat to the fire raging on the Amarnath land issue in both the Valley > and Jammu…. The land issue has again provided separatists in Kashmir > and fundamentalists in Jammu a handle to rekindle their > constituencies, Barua wrote. This was on a page 10, devoted to news on > Kashmir developments, with the headline – 'A Cascade of Errors'. Not > all of the Indian media was buying the ISI line. > > Enter Musharraf > > On August 14, newspapers reported on President Pervez Musharraf's much > anticipated first appearance after the call to impeach him. The Hindu > newspaper's correspondent in Islamabad, Nirupama Subramanian writing > on President Musharraf's speech in page one, first lead story > focusing on the embattled leader's call for reconciliation within > Pakistan. She also wrote: "Gen Musharraf's short speech also included > a condemnation of India for 'human rights violations' in Kashmir and a > declaration that 'Kashmir runs in the blood of every Pakistani." But > the story's headline was "Musharraf calls for reconciliation. > > Another report in an inside page referred to government resolution > adopted unanimously in the National Assembly that condemned India for > the killing of Hurriyat leader, Sheikh Abdul Aziz and several other > Kashmiris by the Indian security forces. The resolution called upon > the UN and human rights organisations to use their good offices to > urge India to stop atrocities against unarmed civilian Kashmiris. The > Indian Express gave President Musharraf's reference to India in the > speech an across-the-page headline on its foreign page: "Musharraf > brings up Kashmir in I-Day speech" But the report was agency, a Press > Trust of India story which said: "In an apparent bid to divert > attention away from the impending impeachment threat looming over him, > President Musharraf condemned 'human rights violations' in Jammu and > Kashmir." > > But on that it played Kashnmir on page one,in a front page report > headlined 'Midnight protests rock Srinagar'. This story made a passing > reference to Pakistan: 'Meanwhile, the spat between India and Pakistan > over the J&K situation got uglier today after New Delhi issued its > third statement in a week, describing Islamabad's call for > international involvement in Kashmir as "gratuitous and illegal"'. > > On August 15, the day after Pakistan's Independence Day, the Hindu > wrote that Pakistani Prime Minister Gilani "sought to bring down the > temperature (between India and Pakistan) with an assurance that his > government was committed to resolving all issues with India in a just > and peaceful manner through negotiations." Mr Gilani made a reference > to Kashmir, which the Hindu characterised as 'mild and steered clear > of the present unrest in the Valley." The Asian Age and the Indian > Express reported External Affairs Minister Pranab Mukherjee response > to a TV news channel that Pakistan's comments on the development in > Jammu and Kashmir did not create the right atmosphere to carry on the > bilateral dialogue. Both newspapers also said that India had rejected > comments made by the secretary general of the OIC (Organisation of > Islamic Conference) condemning police firing in Kashmir. Times of > India's headline said: 'Pranab asks Pak not to meddle in India's > affairs'. > > On Aug 16, Indian newspapers carried short reports on Indian Prime > Minister Manmohan Singh's reference to Pakistan in his Independence > Day speech. They also wrote about Pakistan Prime Minister Gilani's > phone call to greet Mr Manmohan Singh on the occasion. The Hindu > referred to Mr Manmohan Singh's comment during the telephone > conversation that both sides should refrain from making harsh > statements. In contrast, the Pakistani papers took Mr Manmohan Singh's > remarks as conveying a more pointed message. The Nation, on Aug 16 had > a headline: "Singh warns Pakistan to control terrorism". It said: > "Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh used his Independence Day speech > on Friday to warn Pakistan to rein in terrorism, as peace talks > between the two countries falter 61 years after they were divided." > > Pak coverage > > Among Pakistan newspapers The News stuck to agency reports, and The > Nation took a slightly harder line than Dawn, overall. And raised the > issue of Kashmiri freedom "from the Indian yoke." Its editorial on > August 13 was called: 'Indian Highhandedness' The edit said: "The > situation in the disputed Valley seems once again to be deteriorating, > the responsibility for which very obviously lies with the government's > mismanagement. There has been an upsurge of violence against the > people by the Indian security forces….. Last month, the Kashmiris were > protesting against the illegal transfer of hundreds of acres of land > to a Hindu Shrine Board for building structures for Hindu yatrees. The > subsequent riots that rocked the Valley were among the biggest in > Kashmir's history. What the Indian government needs to understand is > that its approach towards the issue is basically erroneous. Economic > blockade cannot smother the Kashmiris' spirit of freedom from the > Indian yoke." > > The next day an editorial in the Nation castigated the Indian security > forces. It said: "In an act of ruthless repression, the Indian > security forces indiscriminately fired at one of the biggest protest > rallies in Held Kashmir's history, with participants variously > computed between 100,000 and 250,000, and shot down prominent Hurriyat > leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz and several others near Uri on Monday…. The > blockade has put an end to all trade with the outside world, including > that of fruit with which the Valley virtually overflows. That the > authorities have not bothered to break it, but let all economic > activity in the Valley stifle, suggests their callous attitude towards > the people for their 'sin' of agitating for the right to > self-determination….The blockade has put an end to all trade with the > outside world, including that of fruit with which the Valley virtually > overflows. That the authorities have not bothered to break it, but let > all economic activity in the Valley stifle, suggests their callous > attitude towards the people for their 'sin' of agitating for the right > to self-determination." > > The paper carried a statement by a former Pakistani ambassador and > senior aide to the UN Secretary General, that Pakistan should raise > its concern on the situation in the Indian Occupied Kashmir at the > United Nations. Mr Yusuf Buch, described as an expert on Kashmir, > said, "The Prime Minister of Pakistan should immediately contact the > Secretary General of the United Nations and, both in conversation on > the telephone and in letter which he should ask to be circulated as a > document of the Security Council, emphasize that the current situation > deserves to be viewed in its human reality and not through the prism > of calcified attitudes of inaction stemming from considerations of > power politics." > > Dawn's headline on August 15 stated: 'Widespread protests test India's > hold on Kashmir'. It report said: Police shot dead a Muslim protester > as huge crowds shouting "we want freedom" took to the streets of > occupied Kashmir on Thursday over a land row that is testing New > Delhi's hold on the troubled Himalayan region. > > An editorial in the Dawn newspaper criticized the Pakistani > government for backing off from its plans to oppose the nuclear > safeguards agreement at the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). > It said: "The Bush administration launched its own campaign to > dissuade Pakistan from any effort to thwart the Indo-US game plan… Our > ambassador in Washington, too, according to well-informed sources, > pitched in, recommending that we do nothing to upset the Bush > administration's advice and, instead, terminate all efforts to counter > the Indo-US move, at both the IAEA and the NSG, which is to meet to > consider the US draft to allow nuclear trade with India. To the > Foreign Office's disappointment, the entire campaign was called off, > causing deep dismay at this abject surrender of national interests." > > Pakistani newspapers had a large number of developments with Pakistan > to report in the last week. On August 14, Dawn had six items on page > one detailing militant strikes in Lahore (8 killed), villagers kill > six militants, clashes between rival tribes in Kurram agency, 24 > killed – militants stop people from leaving Bajaur, six killed 19 > injured in Balouchistan attacks. Other stories were Sindh assembly > seeks impeachment and 'Dozens injured in Kashmir protests'. The > Kashmir story therefore, was an also ran. > > Television > > Indian television channels, Times Now in particular, gave more > prominence than Indian newspapers did to accusations from across the > border. All major channels showed the Ministery of external affairs > spokesman reading out his statements referring to Pakistan's > interference on consecutive days. Given the fact of constant repeat > telecasts, the message registered with anyone who tuned in to any of > the major satellite and cable news channels. > > President Musharraf's references to India in his speech on the eve of > Pakistan's independence day played far more effectively across TV > channels in India than in the newspapers. Heard and seen they had > greater impact than reporting in cold print. His sentences help > television news channels flog the "interference" angle for all it was > worth. He made an emotional pitch, stating that Kahmir was every in > Pakistani's "dil ka dhadkan." (heartbeat) and that the killings there > were most regrettable. > > Times Now in particular chose to flog this:" Musharraf is trying to be > a Pakistani hero for one last time." Later anchor Arnab Goswami talked > of "Open, obvious meddling from across the border" and repeated that > description. He dredged up the ISI bogey: "Is the ISI behind the > blockade myth?" he asked. > > In a discussion on NDTV 24x7 however, when asked about the role of > Pakistan by anchor Barkha Dutt, journalist Prem Shankar Jha, a guest > on the show, said "Pakistan had nothing to do with what happened from > July onward." > > Overall both Hindi and English channels ran President Musharraf's > statements over several times, not just the first day, but also till > the 11 pm bulletin the following night. Channels kept telling their > viewers, "Musharraf raises Kashmir issue." > > But shortly after came the President's resignation, and the focus > turned and stayed, on Pakistan's internal problems. > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 10:09:50 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 10:09:50 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Aug 30: Dharna on Kashmir at Jantar Mantar In-Reply-To: <9c06aab30808290905h4520032djcd5b97cbdf887f77@mail.gmail.com> References: <9c06aab30808290905h4520032djcd5b97cbdf887f77@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808292139sc98fc97n69bbf64f067c502@mail.gmail.com> Has anyone of Col Thomas ? Where he was martyred ? And who were the non violent people responsible for it ? Jai Shivam.....aaapki Mahima Aap hi Jaane Pawan On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 9:35 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > Forwarded message: > > Janahastakshep, PUCL and PUDR are holding a dharna on August 30 at > jantar mantar from 11am to 1pm in protest against the crackdown on non > violent people demanding 'azadi'. > > IT is clear that only way in which Indian state restore its authority > is by using coercive means. It is a form of collective punishment of > the people that indefinite and unrelenting curfew has been imposed. > Already reeling under economic blockade the imposition of curfew is > making it worse with even hospitals not being allowed to function > fully and attacks on ambulances and injured. Food is in short supply. > Water and electricity disrupted. No one is allowed to move about even > with curfew passes and there are restrictions placed on media. For 18 > years it was told by Indian state and Indian opinion makers that if > only the movement sheds weapons talks can be held. When that happened > and largely non violent protests began instead of heeding the voice of > the people and reaching out to them through talks the Indian state has > decided to show its iron fist. Right to life and right to live in > dignity stands suspended. Are we going to sit silently when such harsh > measures are adopted? Do we want guns to make their reappearance as > the Indian state is provoking the people to do? IF we believe that > unity of people and their aspirations are our major concern should we > not come out in solidarity and support for their cause which they were > carrying out peacefully? > > Please spread the word to gather at jantar mantar on saturday August > 30 at 11 am to protest the severe repression let loose on the people. > > WE intend to demand lifting of curfew. Restoration of civil liberties. > Allowing non violent assembly. Talks with people at the highest level > so that 61 years of denial, repression, charade of dialogue, > manipulation is discarded and substantive progress is made to > democratically and peacefully resolve the intractable problem. > > Janahastakshep, PUCL, PUDR > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 30 10:23:48 2008 From: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com (Kshmendra Kaul) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 21:53:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Mukul Kesavan's response In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <826558.90592.qm@web57201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Dear Sonia   Never in my life have I been witness to a discussion of such high standard as has ensued between our own Shuddha and Mukul Kesvan.   I hope this discussion continues and hope that you Sonia can find some way of ensuring it continues with an easier route available for Mukul Kesavan to participate.   I also feel so very intellectually and mentally handicapped and disadvantaged and therefore demand that when I participate in a discussion, I be accorded special consideration as an intellectually and mentally handicapped and disadvantaged participant.   Kshmendra       --- On Sat, 8/30/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: [Reader-list] Mukul Kesavan's response To: "Sarai" Cc: "Shuddhabrata Sengupta" Date: Saturday, August 30, 2008, 1:08 AM ------ Forwarded Message From: Mukul Kesavan Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:05:10 +0530 To: Subject: Shuddhabrata Dear Sonia, Thanks for sending me Shuddhabrata's intervention. I was interested in what he had to say and I've tried to respond to his comments. Do you think you could post it? I'm not sure how the site works. I'm cutting and pasting it into the body of this message. I hope you're writing madly. All best, Mukul --------------------------------------- I read Shuddhabrata Sengupta's comment on my Kashmir piece with interest, particularly his strictures on earthbound thinking. As an admirer of the potential of utopian thinking I expected he would indicate a way in which the possibilities of co-existence in Kashmir could be re-imagined and I was disappointed when he didn't. Perhaps he'll sketch something out in time; in the absence of spelt-out alternatives, the world as it is will continue to shape the conversation. Chiding 'pragmatists' and 'realists' for their State-bound imaginations without supplying a lead or two about how he might set about the issue is a bit blithe. "Weak, consequentialist arguments": Shuddhabrata has two objections to such arguments in the piece. I suspect we could collapse them into one: i.e. don't argue from possible outcomes because you don't know what they'll be. Self-determination and secession have led to good outcomes as well as bad ones: to second-guess the result is presumptuous and, less charitably, colonial. It's worth pointing out that it's hard to think about the future without guessing at outcomes. The way this is often done is by analogy (what has happened before or elsewhere). The reason I don't vote for the BJP is because history and experience has taught me to mistrust majoritarian parties that believe nations are owned by a dominant People. So when Kashmiri Muslim leaders begin to frame their arguments in mainly Muslim or Islamic terms I begin to see an unpleasant sectarian state as the likely outcome of azadi. If the a dominant Muslim/Islamic idiom is set in the context of the violence that purged the Valley of Pandits, this outcome begins to seem more likely. I might be mistaken (and even if I'm right, this may still not be sufficient reason to oppose azadi), but you can scarcely rule guesswork/speculation/deduction (call it what you like) out of court. Shuddhabrata speculates in just this way when he guesses that I prefer the coercive secular state solution to azadi. I don't explicitly endorse one or the other in my piece, but he looks for clues to my inclination in the piece and decides he has found them. He might be wrong but it's a legitimate route to a conclusion. In just this way, I listen to speeches and slogans, I read about the ways in which Kashmiri Muslims imagine azadi and think about the the uses they'd put it to. I can, of course, do this opportunistically, and imagine the worst to suit my prejudices, but we must allow that it can also be done in good faith, because the criterion of certainty that Shuddhabrata suggests is an impossible one. Am I certain that Prabhakaran if he achieves Tamil Eelam, will rule like a Stalinist despot? No I'm not; not certain. But I'm not about to write him a cheque on the off-chance. "Lame liberalism": yes, that last option is colonial in its reasoning. That's why it's squalid and compromised. Is it an argument that liberals can make: yes--liberals have made arguments of this sort since liberalism came into being. Just as self-determination has been used to dress up a multitude of unpleasant ideologies. "Kesavan invokes the Chechens, but not to mention that Stalin's decision to 'wipe Chechnya off the Map' and to deport all Chechens (and parts of other ethnicities) to forms of forced internal exile, (in the name of the integrity of the Soviet Union under his dictatorship) led to many hundreds of thousands of deaths....": I'm not sure what to make of this. I don't mention the Chechens or Chechnya at all. Shuddhabrata has me not just 'invoking' the Chechens but invoking them selectively, a misreading so extravagant that it's baroque. Perhaps his response to questions about 'azadi' is, in the idiom of the Eighties, over-determined. But Chechnya is worth discussing in this context. Would a Russian liberal who wanted to hang on to Chechnya make the same arguments as our liberal Indian apologist? No. He wouldn't be able to, for the reasons that Shuddhabrata outlines. His country in its earlier avatar as a totalitarian despotism and its present incarnation as a Russian Orthodox state is rather different from the Indian republic. It attempted genocide, deportation, internal exile. The Republic of India has much blood on its hands in Kashmir, but it's worth saying that it hasn't done those things. If there are Kashmiris who live a form of internal exile, it's the pandits. Just as self-determination isn't necessarily virtuous, neither is the territorial integrity of a large state always a worthwhile cause. So a liberal attempting a quasi-colonial apologia for Russia's claim to Chechnya would find arguments harder to come by than his Indian counterpart. This difference might make no difference to Kashmiris, a pluralist bullet being as lethal as any other, but it might make a difference to the desi liberal trying avoid a told-you-Muslims-are-incapable-of-co-existence upshot. Weakly consequentialist? I don't know. If I was a Kashmiri Muslim I'd say (as a Kashmiri Muslim correspondent said to me), "Is India a myth that it can be undone by the secession of a small state? Why should you hold us hostage to your anxieties?" And the liberal might say, "You're right. But given Partition I can't take our pluralism for granted. An Indian State that signed on to secession by Muslim majority Kashmir runs the risk of Weimar, the risk of losing legitimacy." Or he might cross his fingers about the weakly consequentialist consequences, and be shamed into supporting Kashmiri self-determinism. This compromised choice might mean nothing to the clear-thinking person who isn't a liberal and doesn't set much store by the 'Westphalian state'. For those who think they are (liberal) and haven't yet transcended the State that contains them, the dilemma is a real one. ------ End of Forwarded Message _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From elkamath at yahoo.com Sat Aug 30 10:26:59 2008 From: elkamath at yahoo.com (lalitha kamath) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 21:56:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Reader-list] Relocation without eviction in Joburg Message-ID: <886627.66683.qm@web53603.mail.re2.yahoo.com> The successful implementation of a Constitutional Court order on finding alternative housing for people about to be evicted from two "bad" inner city buildings shows what is possible when the rights of the poor are considered by the state, the Centre for Applied Legal Studies (Cals) said on Wednesday. http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?from=rss_South%20Africa&set_id=1&click_id=13&art_id=nw20080827174307804C153163 'Bad building' relocated in Joburg August 27 2008 at 07:19PM The successful implementation of a Constitutional Court order on finding alternative housing for people about to be evicted from two "bad" inner city buildings shows what is possible when the rights of the poor are considered by the state, the Centre for Applied Legal Studies (Cals) said on Wednesday. This follows the relocation, without eviction, of 450 people in terms of a court-ordered negotiation from San Jose in Johannesburg's Berea and 197 Main Street in the city, to new temporary accommodation. The City of Johannesburg had tried to evict them from the buildings on the grounds of health concerns after the owners apparently abandoned the building, but in March 2006, Johannesburg High Court judge Mahomed Jajbhay dismissed the city's eviction application because the residents had nowhere better to live. The matter went all the way to the Constitutional Court, which ordered the city and representatives of the residents to find a solution. Lawyers for the city worked with the residents and their legal representatives and two buildings - the MBV hospital in the central business district and the Old Perm building in Hillbrow - were identified, explained Cals' Stuart Wilson. The city provided extra fire extinguishers and other measures to address their health concerns, while preparations were made to adapt the buildings for their relocation. Needs and income assessments were undertaken, lease agreements were arranged and residents allocated units. The move was finally conducted between August 23 and 26, Wilson. The arrangement was endorsed by the Constitutional Court at the end of 2007. "This is a victory for the Bill of Rights and the rule of law. It is noteworthy that the residents of San Jose and 197 Main Street relocated freely and voluntarily," said Wilson. "Not one person was forcibly evicted from either of the properties. I hope that this spells the end of forced evictions in the name of inner city regeneration." Wilson explained that the deal was that they pay a deposit in instalments of R25, R50 and R75 for the first three months for occupation of the rooms with shared kitchen and ablution facilities, with rent kicking in in the fourth month for the residents, who are considered poor. Individuals with no familial connections will share rooms that will be partitioned for privacy. He said the contribution of the residents' committees was "invaluable" in taking into account the residents' needs before their move. The building will be managed by the City of Johannesburg, which will also arrange cleaning services, and a tenants committee will hold the building manager and residents to account. City of Johannesburg spokesperson Gabu Tugwana said the city was pleased with the end result, but stressed that their new accommodation was temporary and residents and the city of Johannesburg will negotiate permanent solutions which may include shelters, flats in other city-owned buildings, or rentals in the private sector. "I think it showed a good working relationship. It shows how conflict can be avoided and how communities can work together," he said. He said the court battles over the last three years often saw strong disagreements between the City of Johannesburg and the legal representatives of the property occupants. "Last weekend's move is therefore notable for its spirit of co-operation between the community and local government." He said considerable preparation went into it with everyone working closely throughout. "A lot of effort went into negotiating room allocations, lease agreements, house rules and the process of the move itself," he said. "But in the end it was worth it. We had a virtually trouble-free move." The city would assess whether the old buildings could be saved, or whether they should be demolished. - Sapa Cross posted from: DEBATE mailing list DEBATE at debate.kabissa.org http://lists.kabissa.org/mailman/listinfo/debate From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 12:26:05 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 12:26:05 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: <83267752012E415492990942AD7C2D55@DELLTA> Message-ID: A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the appeal sent out by Khurram and others. ------ Forwarded Message From: "Dr. Vijay Sazawal" Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 To: Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley Dear Friend, I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let them know that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which is down to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by the civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). I have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. Even though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority community earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. There were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and Baramulla where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians and subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are you going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we will not let you or your family escape." Again, I want to make it clear that I hold no one among you or any leader among the majority community responsible for it. But the reality is that it did happen and it is to the credit of a few Pandit leaders who calmed the community down. I will appreciate if journalists would mention in their columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits is not helpful to their cause whatever that may be. Thank you for your help in this matter. If anyone needs further details, I will be glad to provide the same. Regards, Vijay Sazawal www.KashmirForum.org Washington, DC Kashmir Civil Society Calls For Ceasefire Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern over reports in New Delhi based media about Œpossible attacks¹ on minorities in Kashmir and have urged upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right of self-determination. They have also urged the community and religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities. ²We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on minorities in Kashmir², a signed statement by several prominent citizens and groups said today. ³Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings take place, the people¹s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to Madeline Albright¹s book titled ³Mighty and the Almighty² has clearly accused Hindu fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora², the statement said. The statement is signed besides others by Grand Mufti, Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin, Mirwaiz Riyaz Hamdani of Shah Hamdan Mosque, Agha Syed Hassan Mosavi of Anjumane Sharie Shiayan, Islamic Study Circle, Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner¹s Federation, Valley Citizens Council, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation and Noor Ahmed Bilal ­ President Kashmir University Teachers Association. ³In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also in the International media and institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir², it said. ³In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community leaders, religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people¹s movement of Kashmir. In the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right of self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council¹s recently announced statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people¹s movement.² The statement further urged the government of India to halt the brutal use of force against the people and respect the people¹s right to assembly and freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu terming the arrests and the killings unacceptable. ³We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is always to be humane besides being politically correct², the statement said. ³In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested, communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the restoration of people¹s rights², the statement added. ³We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form the inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our political emancipation². Others who have signed the statement include prominent physician, Dr. Altaf Hussain, columnist Arjimand Hussain Talib, academics Dr Hameeda Bano, Prof Shaikh Showkat Hussain, Dr Noor Ahmed Baba and poet Zareef Ahmed Zareef. ------ End of Forwarded Message From aarti.sethi at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 13:20:52 2008 From: aarti.sethi at gmail.com (Aarti Sethi) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 13:20:52 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] Kashmir petition - please sign and forward In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808290639m2d0c59d5w74b892fa79430c76@mail.gmail.com> References: <572386.71181.qm@web53912.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <9c06aab30808290519k1931b10dyaf650f2cb4b357c@mail.gmail.com> <6353c690808290530l23ef51ccqbde0ac2165f846bf@mail.gmail.com> <9c06aab30808290552m44114bb8q8e5a337972d66320@mail.gmail.com> <6b79f1a70808290639m2d0c59d5w74b892fa79430c76@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48c2916d0808300050m6b90d794i88d0d56338904372@mail.gmail.com> Please stop this all of you. I'm sure everyone on this list can decide which petition they wish to, or not wish to sign, or whether in fact they wish to block all your addresses for cluttering our inboxes with your juvenile behaviour. Must you continually be reminded that most subscribers are not 14 years old and do not in fact enjoy facile one-line exchanges? If you have substantive points to make please do so, else please carry this sort of bickering off-list. thank you A On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 7:09 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Yes, > the correct link is http://www.petitiononline.com/KPYouth/petition.html > > Pawan Durani > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:22 PM, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् > wrote: > > > No, it is http://www.petitiononline.com/jk2008/petition.html > > > > best > > shivam > > > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 6:00 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul > > wrote: > > > I think this should be the link - > > > > > > http://www.petitiononline.com/Amarnath/petition.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/29/08, Shivam Vij शिवम् विज् wrote: > > >> > > >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > >> > > >> _________________________________________ > > >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > >> Critiques & Collaborations > > >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > >> subscribe in the subject header. > > >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > > Critiques & Collaborations > > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > National Highway - http://shivamvij.com/ > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 14:11:35 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 14:11:35 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] From The Hindu Message-ID: The troubled road to trans-LoC trade Praveen Swami Will Kashmir shrine crisis open the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road for business? India will be pushing Pakistan to deliver on its promise to open up the LoC Pakistan has yet to complete construction of a customs station and parking bays on its side NEW DELHI: Since August residents of the village of Salamabad have been waiting for the arrival of hundreds of smoke-belching cargo trucks, the unlikely harbingers of a better future. Like hundreds of thousands across Jammu and Kashmir, Salamabad residents hope that the scheduled opening of trade across the Line of Control will transform what the former United States President Bill Clinton described as the ³world¹s most dangerous place² into a zone of peace and prosperity. Cross-border trade, it is starting to appear, could also hold the key to defusing the murderous shrine-land crisis that has claimed dozens of lives across the State in recent weeks. In an effort to assuage Muslim anger in Kashmir, ahead of a deal with Hindu protesters in Jammu, India will be pushing Pakistan to deliver on its promise to open up the LoC. Earlier this month, protesters initiated a march towards the LoC, responding to a call by the hardline Tehreek-i-Hurriyat patriarch Syed Ali Shah Geelani to force the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad road open for trade. Mr. Geelani, speaking for a coalition of secessionist groups and orchard-owners¹ bodies, said the march was necessary to break an economic blockade of the Kashmir Valley by Hindutva groups. Five people, including All Parties Hurriyat Conference leader Sheikh Abdul Aziz, were shot dead when police opened fire to stop the march. More than 30 people died in subsequent fighting. Bureaucratic stalling Had it not been for bureaucratic stalling by Pakistan, though, the LoC would have opened weeks before the march even began. India and Pakistan agreed to open the route for limited trade at a July 21 meeting of their Foreign Secretaries. Pakistan said it would allow just nine commodities including fruit, across the LoC ‹ well short of India¹s more expansive plans. Even this modest beginning, though, marked progress. Pakistan had stonewalled forward movement, even refusing permits to a delegation of Kashmir-based businessman, who wished to meet their counterparts in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir. Less than a week after the Foreign Secretaries met, a team of top Indian officials, led by Ministry of Home Affairs Joint Secretary R. Shakandan met on July 25 at Uri. Orders were given to initiate construction of parking bays, warehouses and a customs office at Salamabad, just short of the LoC. A follow-up meeting on security issues, involving customs, police and military officials, was held on July 27. Backed down However, Pakistan backed down on its commitment to open the road on August 21, citing logistic constraints. Both sides agreed to postpone opening the LoC until October 1. Army sources told The Hindu that Pakistan had yet to complete construction of a customs station and parking bays on its side ‹ raising fears that cross-border movement of cargo could be delayed even further. India will be pushing Pakistan hard to make sure that does not happen. Volte face Ironically, the Islamist leadership India will be seeking to placate was, not too long ago, bitterly opposed to opening up the LoC. In 2005, after India and Pakistan announced that bus links across the LoC were to be resumed, Mr. Geelani lashed out at the plan as ³a diversion from the core issue.² ³People have not given their blood for the reopening of a road,² he said, ³but for self-determination.² On another occasion, he described the issue as ³an irrelevant drama.² Several civil society organisations now involved in the shrine board movement shared this perception. In April 2005, the Kashmir Bar Association, the Jammu and Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, the Association of Parents of Disappeared Persons and the Jammu and Kashmir Trade Union Front issued a joint statement calling the opening of the road ³untimely and inconsequential.² Jihadist groups supportive of Mr. Geelani were more blunt in their approach. In a March 30, 2005, press release, the Save Kashmir Movement, al-Nasireen, the Farzandan-e-Millat and al-Arifeen warned potential bus travellers that ³they will find their names in the list of traitors.² Jihadists later attacked and destroyed the Tourism Reception Centre in Srinagar. It was to have served as the terminus for the bus service. © Copyright 2000 - 2008 The Hindu From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sat Aug 30 14:24:57 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 08:54:57 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <496459.98896.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Sonia, I would like to take this opportunity to expressly condemn Vijay Sazwal for yet again playing mischif against Kashmiri Muslims. In his 'appreciating guise' on Kashmiri Civil Society, he is carrying on his propaganda against Muslims and cooking up stories about imaginery harrassement. Pandit groups, mainly believed to be working for IB, have been doing this for more than two decades now. If Vijay is telling the truth, which i don't believe, he must mention the incidents rather than spreading false stories. As much i appreciate personal contact with him i have had with with for few years now, I have to condemn him for his mischief and spreading lies against the Kashmiri Muslims majority at the behest of I don't know who. By doing it once again, he has sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, who are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris. A personal friend, Prof. Rattan Lal Hangloo, is on record about Vijay Sazwal launching a campaign against Prof. Hangloo for not blaming Kashmiri Muslims and Islam for the current trouble in Kashmir. Moreover, Vijay has been part of propaganda brigade that has been spreading lies about Kashmiri Muslims and talking about so-called Holocaust of Pandits when only 209 Pandits died in the crisis as compared to 150,000 Muslims majority of them by the Indian army and paramilitary forces. I don't see any appreciation in Vijay's letter. It is all venomous propganda against the Muslims. best, Murtaza --- On Sat, 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley To: "Sarai" Date: Saturday, 30 August, 2008, 7:56 AM A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the appeal sent out by Khurram and others. ------ Forwarded Message From: "Dr. Vijay Sazawal" Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 To: Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley Dear Friend, I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let them know that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which is down to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by the civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). I have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. Even though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority community earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. There were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and Baramulla where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians and subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are you going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we will not let you or your family escape." Again, I want to make it clear that I hold no one among you or any leader among the majority community responsible for it. But the reality is that it did happen and it is to the credit of a few Pandit leaders who calmed the community down. I will appreciate if journalists would mention in their columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits is not helpful to their cause whatever that may be. Thank you for your help in this matter. If anyone needs further details, I will be glad to provide the same. Regards, Vijay Sazawal www.KashmirForum.org Washington, DC Kashmir Civil Society Calls For Ceasefire Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern over reports in New Delhi based media about possible attacks¹ on minorities in Kashmir and have urged upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right of self-determination. They have also urged the community and religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities. ²We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on minorities in Kashmir², a signed statement by several prominent citizens and groups said today. ³Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings take place, the people¹s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to Madeline Albright¹s book titled ³Mighty and the Almighty² has clearly accused Hindu fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora², the statement said. The statement is signed besides others by Grand Mufti, Mufti Mohammad Bashiruddin, Mirwaiz Riyaz Hamdani of Shah Hamdan Mosque, Agha Syed Hassan Mosavi of Anjumane Sharie Shiayan, Islamic Study Circle, Jammu Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner¹s Federation, Valley Citizens Council, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation and Noor Ahmed Bilal ­ President Kashmir University Teachers Association. ³In the present scenario where the non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also in the International media and institutions, the reported threat to minority communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil society of Kashmir², it said. ³In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community leaders, religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people¹s movement of Kashmir. In the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right of self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council¹s recently announced statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people¹s movement.² The statement further urged the government of India to halt the brutal use of force against the people and respect the people¹s right to assembly and freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu terming the arrests and the killings unacceptable. ³We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is always to be humane besides being politically correct², the statement said. ³In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested, communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the restoration of people¹s rights², the statement added. ³We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form the inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our political emancipation². Others who have signed the statement include prominent physician, Dr. Altaf Hussain, columnist Arjimand Hussain Talib, academics Dr Hameeda Bano, Prof Shaikh Showkat Hussain, Dr Noor Ahmed Baba and poet Zareef Ahmed Zareef. ------ End of Forwarded Message _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From sonia.jabbar at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 14:34:08 2008 From: sonia.jabbar at gmail.com (S. Jabbar) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 14:34:08 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: <496459.98896.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Wow, that's pretty strong language, Murtaza. You know Vijay, as I do. In all these years I really can't say I've seen him being communal or even using communal language in anything he's written or advocated. I think he ought to have a chance in defending himself. Will you forward this discussion or should I? I really posted his email in good faith thinking it may help diffuse some of this horrid Jammu Hindu/Pandit-Kashmiri Muslim divide that's dominated the Reader's List for some time, little realizing that this too will add fuel to the fire. What a pity. sj On 8/30/08 2:24 PM, "Kashmir Affairs" wrote: > Sonia, I would like to take this opportunity to expressly condemn Vijay Sazwal > for yet again playing mischif against Kashmiri Muslims. In his 'appreciating > guise' on Kashmiri Civil Society, he is carrying on his propaganda against > Muslims and cooking up stories about imaginery harrassement. Pandit groups, > mainly believed to be working for IB, have been doing this for more than two > decades now. If Vijay is telling the truth, which i don't believe, he must > mention the incidents rather than spreading false stories. As much i > appreciate personal contact with him i have had with with for few years now, I > have to condemn him for his mischief and spreading lies against the Kashmiri > Muslims majority at the behest of I don't know who. By doing it once again, he > has sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, who > are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris. A > personal friend, Prof. Rattan Lal Hangloo, is on record about Vijay Sazwal > launching a campaign against Prof. Hangloo for not blaming Kashmiri Muslims > and Islam for the current trouble in Kashmir. Moreover, Vijay has been part of > propaganda brigade that has been spreading lies about Kashmiri Muslims and > talking about so-called Holocaust of Pandits when only 209 Pandits died in the > crisis as compared to 150,000 Muslims majority of them by the Indian army and > paramilitary forces. I don't see any appreciation in Vijay's letter. It is > all venomous propganda against the Muslims. best, Murtaza --- On Sat, > 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar > Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in > Kashmir Valley To: "Sarai" Date: Saturday, 30 August, > 2008, 7:56 AM A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the > appeal sent out by Khurram and others. ------ Forwarded Message From: "Dr. > Vijay Sazawal" Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 To: > Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley Dear > Friend, I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let > them know that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which > is down to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by > the civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). I > have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. > Even though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority > community earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. > There were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and > Baramulla where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians > and subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are > you going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we will > not let you or your family escape." Again, I want to make it clear that I > hold no one among you or any leader among the majority community responsible > for it. But the reality is that it did happen and it is to the credit of a few > Pandit leaders who calmed the community down. I will appreciate if journalists > would mention in their columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits > is not helpful to their cause whatever that may be. Thank you for your help > in this matter. If anyone needs further details, I will be glad to provide the > same. Regards, Vijay Sazawal www.KashmirForum.org > Washington, DC Kashmir Civil Society Calls > For Ceasefire Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern > over reports in New Delhi based media about possible attacks¹ on minorities in > Kashmir and have urged upon the governments and the militant leadership to > implement a comprehensive ceasefire in the wake of present peaceful people¹s > movement to realise the right of self-determination. They have also urged the > community and religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and > government to ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities. ²We > the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that the > human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel deeply > concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of Indian > media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the > Indian Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks > on minorities in Kashmir², a signed statement by several prominent citizens > and groups said today. ³Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority > communities under mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of > fear and mistrust amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time > these killings take place, the people¹s movement of Kashmir is at a critical > phase. The killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 > Sikhs at Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill > Clinton) or killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an > aura of mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered > by government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. > Bill Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to > Madeline Albright¹s book titled ³Mighty and the Almighty² has clearly accused > Hindu fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora², the > statement said. The statement is signed besides others by Grand Mufti, Mufti > Mohammad Bashiruddin, Mirwaiz Riyaz Hamdani of Shah Hamdan Mosque, Agha Syed > Hassan Mosavi of Anjumane Sharie Shiayan, Islamic Study Circle, Jammu > Kashmir Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries > Kashmir, Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner¹s Federation, Valley Citizens > Council, Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation and Noor Ahmed Bilal ­ President > Kashmir University Teachers Association. ³In the present scenario where > the non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to > self-determination of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in > India but also in the International media and institutions, the reported > threat to minority communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern > for the civil society of Kashmir², it said. ³In view of the above mentioned > concern, we urge upon the community leaders, religious leaders, political > parties, militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and > tolerance for the minorities and refrain from any such act which makes the > lives of minorities uncomfortable. The minorities should not be treated as the > cannon fodder to carry out the agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the > people¹s movement of Kashmir. In the wake of present peaceful people¹s > movement to realise the right of self-determination, the only democratic > process for peace making, we urge upon the governments and the militant > leadership to implement a comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the > people of Jammu and Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council¹s > recently announced statement, in which they promised to halt their activities > within civilian areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement > into a comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu > and Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the > people¹s movement.² The statement further urged the government of India to > halt the brutal use of force against the people and respect the people¹s right > to assembly and freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu terming the > arrests and the killings unacceptable. ³We consider this as the testing time > for all of us as humans. We certainly have been victimised but the challenge > for the conscientious people is always to be humane besides being politically > correct², the statement said. ³In the present situation where the political > leadership has been arrested, communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is > every likelihood that situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we > urge international community to take cognizance of the situation where in the > whole population of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For > international institutions it is the time to intervene for preventing the > catastrophe and for the restoration of people¹s rights², the statement > added. ³We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who > form the inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will > find their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we > have lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for > our political emancipation². Others who have signed the statement include > prominent physician, Dr. Altaf Hussain, columnist Arjimand Hussain Talib, > academics Dr Hameeda Bano, Prof Shaikh Showkat Hussain, Dr Noor Ahmed Baba and > poet Zareef Ahmed Zareef. ------ End of Forwarded > Message _________________________________________ reader-list: an open > discussion list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To > subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe > in the subject header. To unsubscribe: > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list List archive: > <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > _________________________________________ reader-list: an open discussion > list on media and the city. Critiques & Collaborations To subscribe: send an > email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject > header. To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 15:05:25 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 15:05:25 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: <496459.98896.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <496459.98896.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808300235o901efa8v55b9c3945b666db3@mail.gmail.com> Murtaza, For you to be taken seriously, would you kindly share what are your basis of the figures you have mentioned. Primarily when you quote 1. Only 209 Kashmiri Hindus were killed by terrorists in Kashmir 2. 150000 Kashmiri Muslims got killed If you share this, we can move ahead in the debate , else it seems like those justifications when Kashmiri Hindus were selectively killed and then labelled as "IB" agents and that included 2 year old child as well. Pawan Durani On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Kashmir Affairs wrote: > Sonia, > I would like to take this opportunity to expressly condemn Vijay Sazwal for > yet again playing mischif against Kashmiri Muslims. In his 'appreciating > guise' on Kashmiri Civil Society, he is carrying on his propaganda against > Muslims and cooking up stories about imaginery harrassement. Pandit groups, > mainly believed to be working for IB, have been doing this for more than two > decades now. > If Vijay is telling the truth, which i don't believe, he must mention the > incidents rather than spreading false stories. As much i appreciate personal > contact with him i have had with with for few years now, I have to condemn > him for his mischief and spreading lies against the Kashmiri Muslims > majority at the behest of I don't know who. By doing it once again, he has > sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, who > are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris. A > personal friend, Prof. Rattan Lal Hangloo, is on record about Vijay Sazwal > launching a campaign against Prof. Hangloo for not blaming Kashmiri Muslims > and Islam for the current trouble in Kashmir. Moreover, Vijay has been part > of propaganda brigade that has been spreading lies about Kashmiri Muslims > and talking about so-called Holocaust of Pandits when only 209 Pandits died > in the crisis as compared to 150,000 Muslims majority of them by the > Indian army and paramilitary forces. > > I don't see any appreciation in Vijay's letter. It is all venomous > propganda against the Muslims. > best, > Murtaza > > --- On Sat, 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > From: S. Jabbar > Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley > To: "Sarai" > Date: Saturday, 30 August, 2008, 7:56 AM > > A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the appeal sent out > by > Khurram and others. > > > ------ Forwarded Message > From: "Dr. Vijay Sazawal" > Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 > To: > Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley > > Dear Friend, > > I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let them know > that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which is > down > to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by the > civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). > > I have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. > Even > though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority > community > earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. There > were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and Baramulla > where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians and > subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are you > going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we > will not > let you or your family escape." > > Again, I want to make it clear that I hold no one among you or any leader > among the majority community responsible for it. But the reality is that it > did happen and it is to the credit of a few Pandit leaders who calmed the > community down. I will appreciate if journalists would mention in their > columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits is not helpful to > their cause whatever that may be. > > Thank you for your help in this matter. If anyone needs further details, I > will be glad to provide the same. > > Regards, > > Vijay Sazawal > www.KashmirForum.org > Washington, DC > > > Kashmir Civil Society Calls For Ceasefire > Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern over reports > in New Delhi based media about possible attacks¹ on minorities in Kashmir > and have urged upon the governments and the militant leadership to > implement > a comprehensive ceasefire in the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement > to realise the right of self-determination. > They have also urged the community and religious leaders, political > parties, > militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and > tolerance for the minorities. > ²We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that > the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel > deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of > Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian > Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on > minorities in Kashmir², a signed statement by several prominent citizens > and > groups said today. > ³Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under > mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and mistrust > amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings > take place, the people¹s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The > killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs at > Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or > killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura of > mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by > government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill > Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to > Madeline > Albright¹s book titled ³Mighty and the Almighty² has clearly accused Hindu > fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora², the statement > said. > The statement is signed besides others by Grand Mufti, Mufti Mohammad > Bashiruddin, Mirwaiz Riyaz Hamdani of Shah Hamdan Mosque, Agha Syed Hassan > Mosavi of Anjumane Sharie Shiayan, Islamic Study Circle, Jammu Kashmir > Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, > Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner¹s Federation, Valley Citizens Council, > Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation and Noor Ahmed Bilal ­ President > Kashmir > University Teachers Association. ³In the present scenario where the > non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to self-determination > of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also in > the International media and institutions, the reported threat to minority > communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil > society of Kashmir², it said. > ³In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community > leaders, > religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government to > ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain from > any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The > minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the > agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people¹s movement of Kashmir. > In the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right of > self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge > upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a > comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and > Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council¹s recently announced > statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within civilian > areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a > comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and > Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people¹s > movement.² > The statement further urged the government of India to halt the brutal use > of force against the people and respect the people¹s right to assembly and > freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu terming the arrests and the > killings unacceptable. > ³We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We certainly > have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is > always to be humane besides being politically correct², the statement said. > ³In the present situation where the political leadership has been arrested, > communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that > situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international > community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole population > of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international institutions > it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the > restoration of people¹s rights², the statement added. > ³We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form > the > inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find > their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we have > lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our > political emancipation². > Others who have signed the statement include prominent physician, Dr. Altaf > Hussain, columnist Arjimand Hussain Talib, academics Dr Hameeda Bano, Prof > Shaikh Showkat Hussain, Dr Noor Ahmed Baba and poet Zareef Ahmed Zareef. > > > ------ End of Forwarded Message > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in > the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: > > > > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: From parthaekka at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 15:26:59 2008 From: parthaekka at gmail.com (Partha Dasgupta) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 15:26:59 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: <6b79f1a70808300235o901efa8v55b9c3945b666db3@mail.gmail.com> References: <496459.98896.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <6b79f1a70808300235o901efa8v55b9c3945b666db3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <32144e990808300256l5f429e02if76d981bb6d7b804@mail.gmail.com> Pawan, You probably missed the deliberately vague phrasing: 1. "Pandit groups, mainly believed to be working for IB" where the belief could be held by any one for any reason - whereas some 'believed' to be a 'terrorist' is inviolate. 2. "sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, who are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris" Do note the operative phrases 'mainly believed' in the first sentence and 'allegedly' in the second so that a mass opinion is used as a fact in a debate while asking for facts!! Was also a bit surprised by the phrase "has sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups" - does this mean that now the 'Pandit groups' are no longer Kashmiris? As for blaming Kashmiri Muslims - let's all look at something clearly : Just as all Sun's are stars but all stars are not Sun's - some militants in Kashmir are Muslims, and no one is calling (at least, I'm not) all Muslims terrorists. That's as incorrect as saying all Hindu's are VHP members (again, at least, I'm not). Rgds, Partha .................................. On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 3:05 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > Murtaza, > For you to be taken seriously, would you kindly share what are your basis > of > the figures you have mentioned. > > Primarily when you quote > > 1. Only 209 Kashmiri Hindus were killed by terrorists in Kashmir > 2. 150000 Kashmiri Muslims got killed > > If you share this, we can move ahead in the debate , else it seems like > those justifications when Kashmiri Hindus were selectively killed and then > labelled as "IB" agents and that included 2 year old child as well. > > > > Pawan Durani > > On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Kashmir Affairs >wrote: > > > Sonia, > > I would like to take this opportunity to expressly condemn Vijay Sazwal > for > > yet again playing mischif against Kashmiri Muslims. In his 'appreciating > > guise' on Kashmiri Civil Society, he is carrying on his propaganda > against > > Muslims and cooking up stories about imaginery harrassement. Pandit > groups, > > mainly believed to be working for IB, have been doing this for more than > two > > decades now. > > If Vijay is telling the truth, which i don't believe, he must mention the > > incidents rather than spreading false stories. As much i appreciate > personal > > contact with him i have had with with for few years now, I have to > condemn > > him for his mischief and spreading lies against the Kashmiri Muslims > > majority at the behest of I don't know who. By doing it once again, he > has > > sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, > who > > are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris. A > > personal friend, Prof. Rattan Lal Hangloo, is on record about Vijay > Sazwal > > launching a campaign against Prof. Hangloo for not blaming Kashmiri > Muslims > > and Islam for the current trouble in Kashmir. Moreover, Vijay has been > part > > of propaganda brigade that has been spreading lies about Kashmiri Muslims > > and talking about so-called Holocaust of Pandits when only 209 Pandits > died > > in the crisis as compared to 150,000 Muslims majority of them by the > > Indian army and paramilitary forces. > > > > I don't see any appreciation in Vijay's letter. It is all venomous > > propganda against the Muslims. > > best, > > Murtaza > > > > --- On Sat, 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: > > From: S. Jabbar > > Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley > > To: "Sarai" > > Date: Saturday, 30 August, 2008, 7:56 AM > > > > A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the appeal sent out > > by > > Khurram and others. > > > > > > ------ Forwarded Message > > From: "Dr. Vijay Sazawal" > > Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 > > To: > > Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley > > > > Dear Friend, > > > > I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let them > know > > that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which is > > down > > to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by the > > civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). > > > > I have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. > > Even > > though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority > > community > > earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. There > > were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and Baramulla > > where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians and > > subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are > you > > going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we > > will not > > let you or your family escape." > > > > Again, I want to make it clear that I hold no one among you or any leader > > among the majority community responsible for it. But the reality is that > it > > did happen and it is to the credit of a few Pandit leaders who calmed the > > community down. I will appreciate if journalists would mention in their > > columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits is not helpful to > > their cause whatever that may be. > > > > Thank you for your help in this matter. If anyone needs further details, > I > > will be glad to provide the same. > > > > Regards, > > > > Vijay Sazawal > > www.KashmirForum.org > > Washington, DC > > > > > > Kashmir Civil Society Calls For Ceasefire > > Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern over > reports > > in New Delhi based media about possible attacks¹ on minorities in Kashmir > > and have urged upon the governments and the militant leadership to > > implement > > a comprehensive ceasefire in the wake of present peaceful people¹s > movement > > to realise the right of self-determination. > > They have also urged the community and religious leaders, political > > parties, > > militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and > > tolerance for the minorities. > > ²We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold that > > the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel > > deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections of > > Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the Indian > > Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on > > minorities in Kashmir², a signed statement by several prominent citizens > > and > > groups said today. > > ³Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under > > mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and > mistrust > > amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings > > take place, the people¹s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The > > killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs > at > > Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) or > > killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura > of > > mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered by > > government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill > > Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to > > Madeline > > Albright¹s book titled ³Mighty and the Almighty² has clearly accused > Hindu > > fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora², the statement > > said. > > The statement is signed besides others by Grand Mufti, Mufti Mohammad > > Bashiruddin, Mirwaiz Riyaz Hamdani of Shah Hamdan Mosque, Agha Syed > Hassan > > Mosavi of Anjumane Sharie Shiayan, Islamic Study Circle, Jammu Kashmir > > Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, > > Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner¹s Federation, Valley Citizens Council, > > Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation and Noor Ahmed Bilal ­ President > > Kashmir > > University Teachers Association. ³In the present scenario where the > > non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to > self-determination > > of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also > in > > the International media and institutions, the reported threat to minority > > communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil > > society of Kashmir², it said. > > ³In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community > > leaders, > > religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government > to > > ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain > from > > any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The > > minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the > > agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people¹s movement of > Kashmir. > > In the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right of > > self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we urge > > upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a > > comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and > > Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council¹s recently announced > > statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within > civilian > > areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a > > comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu and > > Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people¹s > > movement.² > > The statement further urged the government of India to halt the brutal > use > > of force against the people and respect the people¹s right to assembly > and > > freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu terming the arrests and > the > > killings unacceptable. > > ³We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We > certainly > > have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is > > always to be humane besides being politically correct², the statement > said. > > ³In the present situation where the political leadership has been > arrested, > > communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that > > situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international > > community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole > population > > of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international > institutions > > it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the > > restoration of people¹s rights², the statement added. > > ³We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form > > the > > inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will find > > their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we > have > > lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for our > > political emancipation². > > Others who have signed the statement include prominent physician, Dr. > Altaf > > Hussain, columnist Arjimand Hussain Talib, academics Dr Hameeda Bano, > Prof > > Shaikh Showkat Hussain, Dr Noor Ahmed Baba and poet Zareef Ahmed Zareef. > > > > > > ------ End of Forwarded Message > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in > > the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > > > > > > > > _________________________________________ > > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > > Critiques & Collaborations > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header. > > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: > _________________________________________ > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. > Critiques & Collaborations > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > subscribe in the subject header. > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> -- Partha Dasgupta +919811047132 From pawan.durani at gmail.com Sat Aug 30 15:57:34 2008 From: pawan.durani at gmail.com (Pawan Durani) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 15:57:34 +0530 Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: <32144e990808300256l5f429e02if76d981bb6d7b804@mail.gmail.com> References: <496459.98896.qm@web27807.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <6b79f1a70808300235o901efa8v55b9c3945b666db3@mail.gmail.com> <32144e990808300256l5f429e02if76d981bb6d7b804@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6b79f1a70808300327w18b50994rd341c37b5d15ca54@mail.gmail.com> Hi Partha, I havent discussed the rest. My only question for Murtaza is his basis of these two quotes of him :- 1. Only 209 Kashmiri Hindus were killed by terrorists in Kashmir 2. 150000 Kashmiri Muslims got killed Pawan On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 3:26 PM, Partha Dasgupta wrote: > Pawan, > > You probably missed the deliberately vague phrasing: > > 1. "Pandit groups, mainly believed to be working for IB" where the belief > could be > held by any one for any reason - whereas some 'believed' to be a > 'terrorist' is > inviolate. > > 2. "sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit > groups, who are allegedly > being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris" > > Do note the operative phrases 'mainly believed' in the first sentence and > 'allegedly' in the second so that a mass opinion is used as a fact in a > debate while asking for facts!! > > Was also a bit surprised by the phrase "has sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri > forces including various Pandit groups" - does this mean that now the > 'Pandit groups' are no longer Kashmiris? > > As for blaming Kashmiri Muslims - let's all look at something clearly : > Just as all Sun's are stars but all stars are not Sun's - some militants in > Kashmir are Muslims, and no one is calling (at least, I'm not) all Muslims > terrorists. That's as incorrect as saying all Hindu's are VHP members > (again, at least, I'm not). > > Rgds, Partha > .................................. > > On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 3:05 PM, Pawan Durani wrote: > >> Murtaza, >> For you to be taken seriously, would you kindly share what are your basis >> of >> the figures you have mentioned. >> >> Primarily when you quote >> >> 1. Only 209 Kashmiri Hindus were killed by terrorists in Kashmir >> 2. 150000 Kashmiri Muslims got killed >> >> If you share this, we can move ahead in the debate , else it seems like >> those justifications when Kashmiri Hindus were selectively killed and then >> labelled as "IB" agents and that included 2 year old child as well. >> >> >> >> Pawan Durani >> >> On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Kashmir Affairs > >wrote: >> >> > Sonia, >> > I would like to take this opportunity to expressly condemn Vijay Sazwal >> for >> > yet again playing mischif against Kashmiri Muslims. In his 'appreciating >> > guise' on Kashmiri Civil Society, he is carrying on his propaganda >> against >> > Muslims and cooking up stories about imaginery harrassement. Pandit >> groups, >> > mainly believed to be working for IB, have been doing this for more than >> two >> > decades now. >> > If Vijay is telling the truth, which i don't believe, he must mention >> the >> > incidents rather than spreading false stories. As much i appreciate >> personal >> > contact with him i have had with with for few years now, I have to >> condemn >> > him for his mischief and spreading lies against the Kashmiri Muslims >> > majority at the behest of I don't know who. By doing it once again, he >> has >> > sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, >> who >> > are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris. >> A >> > personal friend, Prof. Rattan Lal Hangloo, is on record about Vijay >> Sazwal >> > launching a campaign against Prof. Hangloo for not blaming Kashmiri >> Muslims >> > and Islam for the current trouble in Kashmir. Moreover, Vijay has been >> part >> > of propaganda brigade that has been spreading lies about Kashmiri >> Muslims >> > and talking about so-called Holocaust of Pandits when only 209 Pandits >> died >> > in the crisis as compared to 150,000 Muslims majority of them by the >> > Indian army and paramilitary forces. >> > >> > I don't see any appreciation in Vijay's letter. It is all venomous >> > propganda against the Muslims. >> > best, >> > Murtaza >> > >> > --- On Sat, 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: >> > From: S. Jabbar >> > Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley >> > To: "Sarai" >> > Date: Saturday, 30 August, 2008, 7:56 AM >> > >> > A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the appeal sent >> out >> > by >> > Khurram and others. >> > >> > >> > ------ Forwarded Message >> > From: "Dr. Vijay Sazawal" >> > Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 >> > To: >> > Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley >> > >> > Dear Friend, >> > >> > I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let them >> know >> > that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which is >> > down >> > to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by the >> > civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). >> > >> > I have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. >> > Even >> > though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority >> > community >> > earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. There >> > were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and Baramulla >> > where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians and >> > subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are >> you >> > going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we >> > will not >> > let you or your family escape." >> > >> > Again, I want to make it clear that I hold no one among you or any >> leader >> > among the majority community responsible for it. But the reality is that >> it >> > did happen and it is to the credit of a few Pandit leaders who calmed >> the >> > community down. I will appreciate if journalists would mention in their >> > columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits is not helpful >> to >> > their cause whatever that may be. >> > >> > Thank you for your help in this matter. If anyone needs further details, >> I >> > will be glad to provide the same. >> > >> > Regards, >> > >> > Vijay Sazawal >> > www.KashmirForum.org >> > Washington, DC >> > >> > >> > Kashmir Civil Society Calls For Ceasefire >> > Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern over >> reports >> > in New Delhi based media about possible attacks¹ on minorities in >> Kashmir >> > and have urged upon the governments and the militant leadership to >> > implement >> > a comprehensive ceasefire in the wake of present peaceful people¹s >> movement >> > to realise the right of self-determination. >> > They have also urged the community and religious leaders, political >> > parties, >> > militant leadership and government to ensure the utmost respect and >> > tolerance for the minorities. >> > ²We the conscientious people of Jammu and Kashmir believe and uphold >> that >> > the human life and its dignity are sacrosanct and in this regard we feel >> > deeply concerned and aggrieved over the news story carried by sections >> of >> > Indian media on 28th August 2008, in which it is reported that the >> Indian >> > Intelligence agency has expressed fears about the possible attacks on >> > minorities in Kashmir², a signed statement by several prominent citizens >> > and >> > groups said today. >> > ³Since 1989 there have been some massacres of minority communities under >> > mysterious circumstances, which created an atmosphere of fear and >> mistrust >> > amongst the communities. It is surprising that every time these killings >> > take place, the people¹s movement of Kashmir is at a critical phase. The >> > killings of Kashmiri Pandits in early 1990s or the massacre of 36 Sikhs >> at >> > Chittisingpora in 2000 (during the visit of US President Bill Clinton) >> or >> > killings of innocent Hindus at Kulhand and other places creates an aura >> of >> > mystery around all these cold blooded killings. Investigations ordered >> by >> > government to probe these killings have always been inconclusive. Bill >> > Clinton, the 42nd President of the United States in his foreword to >> > Madeline >> > Albright¹s book titled ³Mighty and the Almighty² has clearly accused >> Hindu >> > fanatics of massacring innocent Sikhs at Chittisingpora², the statement >> > said. >> > The statement is signed besides others by Grand Mufti, Mufti Mohammad >> > Bashiruddin, Mirwaiz Riyaz Hamdani of Shah Hamdan Mosque, Agha Syed >> Hassan >> > Mosavi of Anjumane Sharie Shiayan, Islamic Study Circle, Jammu Kashmir >> > Coalition of Civil Society, Chamber of Commerce and Industries Kashmir, >> > Kashmir Hotel and Restaurant Owner¹s Federation, Valley Citizens >> Council, >> > Chairman Kashmir Traders Federation and Noor Ahmed Bilal ­ President >> > Kashmir >> > University Teachers Association. ³In the present scenario where the >> > non-violent mass uprising for the attainment of right to >> self-determination >> > of people of Jammu and Kashmir is resonating not just in India but also >> in >> > the International media and institutions, the reported threat to >> minority >> > communities whether Hindus or Sikhs is a serious concern for the civil >> > society of Kashmir², it said. >> > ³In view of the above mentioned concern, we urge upon the community >> > leaders, >> > religious leaders, political parties, militant leadership and government >> to >> > ensure the utmost respect and tolerance for the minorities and refrain >> from >> > any such act which makes the lives of minorities uncomfortable. The >> > minorities should not be treated as the cannon fodder to carry out the >> > agenda of vested interests in sabotaging the people¹s movement of >> Kashmir. >> > In the wake of present peaceful people¹s movement to realise the right >> of >> > self-determination, the only democratic process for peace making, we >> urge >> > upon the governments and the militant leadership to implement a >> > comprehensive ceasefire in Jammu and Kashmir. We the people of Jammu and >> > Kashmir while welcoming the United Jihad Council¹s recently announced >> > statement, in which they promised to halt their activities within >> civilian >> > areas, request them to broaden the scope of their statement into a >> > comprehensive ceasefire covering the entire Indian administered Jammu >> and >> > Kashmir. This would also mean their respect and primacy to the people¹s >> > movement.² >> > The statement further urged the government of India to halt the brutal >> use >> > of force against the people and respect the people¹s right to assembly >> and >> > freedom of expression both in Kashmir and Jammu terming the arrests and >> the >> > killings unacceptable. >> > ³We consider this as the testing time for all of us as humans. We >> certainly >> > have been victimised but the challenge for the conscientious people is >> > always to be humane besides being politically correct², the statement >> said. >> > ³In the present situation where the political leadership has been >> arrested, >> > communications blocked, curfew imposed, there is every likelihood that >> > situation may descend into chaos. It is therefore we urge international >> > community to take cognizance of the situation where in the whole >> population >> > of Kashmir is being pushed towards the wall. For international >> institutions >> > it is the time to intervene for preventing the catastrophe and for the >> > restoration of people¹s rights², the statement added. >> > ³We take this opportunity to assure our Hindu and Sikh brethren who form >> > the >> > inseparable part of our cultural and political mosaic that they will >> find >> > their Muslim brethren besides always. Whatever be the circumstances we >> have >> > lived and suffered together and would continue to strive together for >> our >> > political emancipation². >> > Others who have signed the statement include prominent physician, Dr. >> Altaf >> > Hussain, columnist Arjimand Hussain Talib, academics Dr Hameeda Bano, >> Prof >> > Shaikh Showkat Hussain, Dr Noor Ahmed Baba and poet Zareef Ahmed Zareef. >> > >> > >> > ------ End of Forwarded Message >> > >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in >> > the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: >> > >> > >> > >> > _________________________________________ >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> > Critiques & Collaborations >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> > subscribe in the subject header. >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> > List archive: >> _________________________________________ >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city. >> Critiques & Collaborations >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with >> subscribe in the subject header. >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/> > > > > > -- > Partha Dasgupta > +919811047132 > From kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk Sat Aug 30 16:25:55 2008 From: kashaffairs at yahoo.co.uk (Kashmir Affairs) Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2008 10:55:55 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <805211.68593.qm@web27808.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear Sonia, I have very recently asked Vijay to come and discuss issues on public forums. I would like you to forward it to him and of course Vijay is most welcome to 'defend' himself. Honestly, his mail made me sick and only one question came to my mind. Why do Pandits hate us....all of us Kashmiris. And they keep on manufacturing stories. Regardless of 209 Pandits killed in Kashmir in comparison to more than 100,000 Muslims, i have always felt their pain despite the fact that we have been at their as well as Indian state's receiving end. My question to Vijay is has he ever felt my pain and thousands who have been tortured to death. Has he ever condemned the killings of Kashmiris at the hands of Indian paramilitary forces. Sick as it may get, now he is manufacturing stories. I wish i could use anything stronger than condemnation to him.   Murtaza   ---- Murtaza Shibli www.kashmiraffaris.org --- On Sat, 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar Subject: Re: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley To: "Kashmir Affairs" , "Sarai" Date: Saturday, 30 August, 2008, 10:04 AM Wow, that's pretty strong language, Murtaza. You know Vijay, as I do. In all these years I really can't say I've seen him being communal or even using communal language in anything he's written or advocated. I think he ought to have a chance in defending himself. Will you forward this discussion or should I? I really posted his email in good faith thinking it may help diffuse some of this horrid Jammu Hindu/Pandit-Kashmiri Muslim divide that's dominated the Reader's List for some time, little realizing that this too will add fuel to the fire. What a pity. sj On 8/30/08 2:24 PM, "Kashmir Affairs" wrote: > Sonia, I would like to take this opportunity to expressly condemn Vijay Sazwal > for yet again playing mischif against Kashmiri Muslims. In his 'appreciating > guise' on Kashmiri Civil Society, he is carrying on his propaganda against > Muslims and cooking up stories about imaginery harrassement. Pandit groups, > mainly believed to be working for IB, have been doing this for more than two > decades now. If Vijay is telling the truth, which i don't believe, he must > mention the incidents rather than spreading false stories. As much i > appreciate personal contact with him i have had with with for few years now, I > have to condemn him for his mischief and spreading lies against the Kashmiri > Muslims majority at the behest of I don't know who. By doing it once again, he > has sided with rabid-anti-Kashmiri forces including various Pandit groups, who > are allegedly being spreading rumours and propaganda against Kashmiris. A > personal friend, Prof. Rattan Lal Hangloo, is on record about Vijay Sazwal > launching a campaign against Prof. Hangloo for not blaming Kashmiri Muslims > and Islam for the current trouble in Kashmir. Moreover, Vijay has been part of > propaganda brigade that has been spreading lies about Kashmiri Muslims and > talking about so-called Holocaust of Pandits when only 209 Pandits died in the > crisis as compared to 150,000 Muslims majority of them by the Indian army and > paramilitary forces. I don't see any appreciation in Vijay's letter. It is > all venomous propganda against the Muslims. best, Murtaza --- On Sat, > 30/8/08, S. Jabbar wrote: From: S. Jabbar > Subject: [Reader-list] FW: Attacks on Minorities in > Kashmir Valley To: "Sarai" Date: Saturday, 30 August, > 2008, 7:56 AM A note of appreciation from a Pandit organisation for the > appeal sent out by Khurram and others. ------ Forwarded Message From: "Dr. > Vijay Sazawal" Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 18:41:58 -0400 To: > Subject: Attacks on Minorities in Kashmir Valley Dear > Friend, I am sending this note to just a few friends in the valley to let > them know that the minority community currently residing in the valley - which > is down to a few thousand now - greatly appreciates the following gesture by > the civil society in Kashmir (see attached story in the Kashmir Observer). I > have spoken to valley based Kashmiri Pandits almost on a daily basis. > Even though the local media did not highlight the fears of the minority > community earlier, the reality is that last week they had a very rough time. > There were numerous incidents in Pulwama, Anantnag, and Srinagar and > Baramulla where Pandit homes or persons were surrounded by a few ruffians > and subjected to oral threats ranging from, "Are you still here - when are > you going away to Jammu," to "time has come to burn your place and we will > not let you or your family escape." Again, I want to make it clear that I > hold no one among you or any leader among the majority community responsible > for it. But the reality is that it did happen and it is to the credit of a few > Pandit leaders who calmed the community down. I will appreciate if journalists > would mention in their columns that harming or even mildly threatening Pandits > is not helpful to their cause whatever that may be. Thank you for your help > in this matter. If anyone needs further details, I will be glad to provide the > same. Regards, Vijay Sazawal www.KashmirForum.org > Washington, DC Kashmir Civil Society Calls > For Ceasefire Srinagar, Aug 29- Kashmir civil society has expressed concern > over reports in New Delhi based medi