From annymcbeal at gmail.com Fri Sep 2 11:57:02 2005 From: annymcbeal at gmail.com (anu) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:57:02 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Hebermas' Heritage Message-ID: <8a1161ed05090123271e1cf986@mail.gmail.com> Hebermas' Heritage: The future of public sphere in network society http://firstmonday.org/issues/issue10_9/boeder/ In the digital age, the discussion about the public sphere has at the same time become increasingly relevant and increasingly problematic. The validity and relevance of post–modern critique to Habermas' concept of the public sphere cannot be denied, yet the concept of a public sphere and Habermas' notion of a critical publicity is still extremely valuable for media theory today. The public sphere is subject to dramatic change; one might even argue that it is on the verge of extinction. Computer–mediated communication has taken the place of coffeehouse discourse, and issues such as media ownership and commodification pose serious threats to the free flow of information and freedom of speech on the Web. I don't believe the situation is quite that serious. I will give an introductory overview of Habermas' theoretical concept and point out that it is conceptual rather than physical. I will describe why Habermas' key concept is valuable for media theory today. Further, I will give an overview of the main issues, debates and problems that arose around the concept of the public sphere in the decades that followed. I will conclude that the notion of the public sphere is not a static one, but subject to change, and show how the theoretical concept of the public sphere is being used to work out viable options for a digital future and models for positive change. Contents Introduction Reason crucial to communication The post–modern debate A shallow substitute? Commodification of the public sphere Panoptic surveillance Distorted communication? The public sphere and democracy Journalism and content The public sphere, c'est moi! Networks and social structure The modern delusion Globalisation and the public sphere The future of the public sphere Technocapitalism Conclusion -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050902/dd0384c8/attachment.html From prabhuram at gmail.com Fri Sep 2 15:21:44 2005 From: prabhuram at gmail.com (prabhu ram) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:51:44 +0200 Subject: [Commons-Law] King Kong vs. the Pirates of the Multiplex Message-ID: <68752c9f0509020251e3a39e9@mail.gmail.com> >New York Times King Kong vs. the Pirates of the Multiplex By TIMOTHY L. O'BRIEN SHORTLY before Christmas, Universal Pictures plans to unveil its $150 million remake of "King Kong," the 1933 sci-fi classic featuring an overgrown beast with a soft spot for blondes, a craggy, fog-shrouded island inhabited by dinosaurs and a squadron of biplanes buzzing the Empire State Building. The new version, aimed squarely at the hearts, minds and wallets of the teenage-to-mid-30's set that Hollywood prizes, has blockbuster written all over it. Peter Jackson, the maestro behind the "Lord of the Rings" trilogy, is directing; Naomi Watts is stepping into Fay Wray's shoes as the imperiled, scantily clad heroine; and the film is rumored to be embroidered with mind-blowing special effects. But even the mighty Kong may not be safe from the clutches of a nebulous, tech-savvy network of film pirates who specialize in stealing copies of first-run movies and distributing them globally on the Internet or on bootleg DVD's. While Hollywood has battled various forms of film looting for decades, this time seems different. Piracy in the digital era is more lucrative, sophisticated and elusive than ever - and poses a far bigger financial threat. "Piracy has the very real potential of tipping movies into becoming an unprofitable industry, especially big-event films. If that happens, they will stop being made," said Mr. Jackson in an e-mail message from New Zealand, where he is putting the final touches on his version of "King Kong." "No studio is going to finance a film if the point is reached where their possible profit margin goes straight into criminals' pockets." Film piracy is taking place against a larger backdrop of technological and demographic shifts that are also shaking Hollywood. Elaborate home theater components - like DVD players, advanced sound systems and flat-screen TV's - are helping to shrink theatrical attendance, as more and more film fans choose to watch while stretched out on their couches. And with the advent of high-speed Internet connections that can deliver large film files to personal computers, the movie business is confronted with the same thorny challenges that the music industry encountered several years ago with the emergence of file-sharing programs like Napster. Hollywood reported global revenue of $84 billion in 2004, according to PricewaterhouseCoopers, the accounting firm. With most theatrical releases amounting to little more than an unprofitable, expensive form of marketing, DVD's have become Hollywood's lifeblood: together with videos, they kick in $55.6 billion, or about two-thirds of the industry's annual haul, with box-office receipts making up most of the rest. The Motion Picture Association of America estimates that piracy involving bootleg DVD's deprived the film industry of more than $3 billion in sales last year. That figure does not include lost sales from pirated works peddled online, for which industry insiders say they have no reliable estimate but which they assume to be substantial. "It's hard to say exactly what amount of money is involved, but it's huge," said Bob Wright, chairman and chief executive of NBC Universal, the parent company of Universal Pictures and a division of General Electric. "There is a very dark, black cloud in this game. It's not in the hands of kids who live next door to you; it's organized groups and organized crime." Online, piracy essentially has no boundaries. But the packaging and distribution of bootleg DVD's take place in a number of far-flung locales; among the hot spots are the United States, China, Russia, Britain, Indonesia, Malaysia, India and the Philippines. At the heart of this network, according to federal investigators and analysts, are cybergeeks who fashion themselves as digital Robin Hoods, stealing from rich studios and giving film fans a free ride. Operating alongside them are cold-blooded hard-core criminals who have the money and connections to efficiently hijack and distribute films within hours of - and sometimes even before - a theatrical premiere. Court documents related to recent prosecutions show that bootleggers put a stolen copy of the latest "Star Wars" movie on a private Web site just hours after its May 18 opening. They put "Batman Begins" on the Internet on June 15, the same day as its release, and had "Bewitched" available for downloading two days after the movie's debut on June 24. Universal, aiming to protect filmdom's mightiest gorilla, is watermarking and encrypting copies of "King Kong." It is also supervising access to the film during all phases of its production, monitoring online any machinations involving the movie and planning to guard advance screenings. Other Hollywood studios, including Warner Brothers, whose fourth installment of the "Harry Potter" film series is due this fall, are taking similar steps to combat piracy. For the time being, however, the bootleggers remain a moving target. "This is not just about the film industry: whether you're talking about the pharmaceutical industry, the information technology industry or filmed entertainment, the protection of intellectual property is crucial," said Darcy Antonellis, who helps oversee antipiracy efforts for Warner Brothers, a unit of Time Warner. "If we can't build businesses around ideas, and feel comfortable that we have the right to those ideas, then our entire business is threatened." SITTING comfortably in the darkness of a theater, a team of four "cammers" goes to work. One sits apart from the group and acts as a lookout, while another unfolds a small digital video camera hidden inside his clothing and records whatever movie is rolling across the screen. The two other members of the team are planted in front of the person doing the recording, trying to keep the path clear of those bothersome black silhouettes that pop up in the frames of many bootleg films. That, in a nutshell, is how cammers work, federal investigators say. They may be at the bottom of piracy's food chain, but once they have their hands on a movie, they quickly feed it upstream to others in their network, racing to see who can post the first clean version of a popular film on the Internet. According to law enforcement authorities and court documents, the Web sites where the films are posted are invitation-only affairs that bootleggers call "topsites." Most of them operate in secluded online zones known as the "darknet." Piracy teams are typically known as "warez" groups, a street derivation of the word "software" that is pronounced "wares." Members all have nicknames, or "nics," and their true identities usually remain hidden, even from one another. Investigators and others familiar with piracy say that aspiring bootleggers secure admission to a warez group by either running a computer server where the movies can be stored or by sharing copies of stolen films. Proud of their handiwork, warez members like to "tag" a stolen film, attaching notations to online files that list the nics of everyone involved in the heist. The usually obscure computer groups engaged in piracy have even spawned a cult film - available only online, of course - called "The Scene," with leading characters named Teflon, Trooper and Slipknot. "It's almost like a game, with various people playing king of the hill," said Darrell Smith, a software developer in Scottsdale, Ariz., who helped create an early file-sharing program for music called Morpheus and who is familiar with the inner workings of warez groups. "These groups are structured very hierarchically, and each of them have certain reputations they like to maintain. It's very similar to inner-city gang members, minus the violence." NEEDLESS to say, warez pirates also have a willing and enthusiastic online audience. Like music lovers who pounced on Napster's offerings without questioning whether they were trading in stolen goods, film buffs have been flocking to public peer-to-peer computer networks that traffic in movies. Average Joes and Janes who download movies also have a designation in the piracy world: "leeches." According to BigChampagne, a company in Beverly Hills, Calif., that tracks online media use and creates weekly charts showing the most actively downloaded films available on the Internet, there are hundreds of thousands of leeches. For the week through Aug. 9, BigChampagne said, an average of 102,895 people a day downloaded the new "War of the Worlds," using a popular file-sharing program called BitTorrent. During the same period, "Wedding Crashers" had an average of 100,134 downloaders a day, and "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" had 97,611. Law enforcement authorities say warez groups communicate with one another as soon as investigators take down one of their sites, making it difficult to mount large-scale raids. And pirates view new topsite servers coming online in the United States suspiciously, assuming that the servers may be part of a sting operation. Nonetheless, last month federal prosecutors and their counterparts in 11 other countries mounted one of the largest international efforts against film piracy to date, a result of a two-year investigation called Operation Site Down. A criminal indictment filed in July in federal court in San Jose, Calif., against four people accused of participating in warez groups that were investigated in Operation Site Down said that 750 movies had been uploaded to two topsites; they, as well as other servers affiliated with them, housed stolen movies, games and software amounting to about 27 terabytes of data. That is the equivalent, said one person involved in the investigation, to the contents of several large university libraries. A search warrant recently unsealed in federal court in St. Louis as part of Operation Site Down said that an employee of a theater there was involved in the warez groups being investigated and that he had plotted to mount a camera behind one of theater's screens in order to make a bootleg copy of a film. Court papers say that although the employee was tracked down because another one of the films he pirated bore a watermark linking it to the theater where he worked, he also had the ability to delete watermarks from other films. He has since been arrested and charged as a defendant in the Operation Site Down case. Authorities said they were able to get inside the warez groups involved in Operation Site Down only by deploying an undercover agent who developed relationships with members of the ring. "The main reason an undercover was necessary was that it's very difficult to penetrate this online world unless you're undercover," said Mark L. Krotoski, an assistant United States attorney in San Jose who is a senior prosecutor in the Operation Site Down investigation. "It is a very sophisticated conspiracy that runs almost like a business." Law enforcement officials say two groups are involved in online film piracy: a nonprofit arm that is in it just for the kicks and a much smaller arm that is in it for the money. Those in the first group are happy to accept free downloads of other films in exchange for successfully uploading a copy of their pirated film, investigators said. Mr. Smith, the software developer, said that someone in the pay-for-play crowd can put in about a week of hard work and then usually earn enough cash to pay for a year of private college tuition. "We continue to focus so many resources on this form of online piracy because we have hard evidence that the top-level warez groups are releasing a product that is not only being distributed freely over the Internet, but is also being supplied to the for-profit, hard-goods market involved in copyright infringement," said Michael M. DuBose, deputy chief of the Justice Department's computer crime and intellectual property unit. Most of the big money in the piracy game, analysts say, swirls through the hands of bootleggers involved in the real world, not online. "As of yet, it's not at a point where you can point to titles being distributed online and say it accounts for the slump at the box office," said Joe Fleischer, co-founder of BigChampagne. "But physical-goods piracy is a real problem." Although investigators say that the hard-goods traffickers, the most notorious of whom are based in China and Russia, often get their stolen products from warez groups, they are equally adept at making knock-offs of new DVD's as soon as Hollywood studios release them. For this they rely on techies known as "rippers" or "crackers" who are adept at unscrambling the security codes that studios have embedded on DVD's to deter copycats. "The parts of the world where replication is thriving are where large-scale operations exist, sometimes controlled by organized-crime groups who can afford to spend more than $1 million on a replication machine," said John G. Malcolm, who oversees antipiracy efforts for the Motion Picture Association of America. "Asia is piracy central, and a majority of the world's pirated discs are replicated there." The Asian rings also have strong roots in the United States, law enforcement officials say. Last fall, federal prosecutors in New York indicted 51 people linked to the two largest Chinese organized-crime families in the city. Charges ranged from human smuggling and extortion to money laundering and murder. Law enforcement officials said people named in the indictment were also heavily involved in film piracy. BOOTLEG DVD's are easy for hard-goods pirates to distribute on their own turf. For example, a weekend stroll around Gorbushka, a sprawling bazaar in Moscow that is home to Europe's largest open-air display of black-market goods, typically turns up row after row of pirated DVD's. Investigators say that when overseas pirates want to ship bootleg DVD's to markets outside their home countries, they simply hide them by packing them in nondescript barrels or winding them inside rolls of carpet. While the amounts of money involved in piracy can only be estimated, some successful prosecutions reveal the handsome sums involved. In April, two Americans working in China, Randolph H. Guthrie III and Abram C. Thrush, received prison sentences in Shanghai for illegally selling $840,000 worth of pirated DVD's and for stashing more than 210,000 of the knock-offs in three warehouses. American and Chinese law enforcement authorities said the pair sold the DVD's on eBay and through a Russian Web site to buyers in almost two dozen countries, including the United States. Also in April, a joint raid in Manila by American and Philippine law enforcement officials resulted in the arrests of about 550 people accused of being involved in piracy rings and the seizure of more than a million blank discs worth about $2 million. For all of the recent crackdowns on piracy, and the strides that studios have made in blocking thefts of review DVD's provided to the news media and others, many people in Hollywood and in the technology field believe that the film industry is fighting an uphill battle. "I don't believe piracy can be easily beaten; fighting fire with fire by releasing movies on DVD at the same time as cinemas is probably where the industry is heading in the next few years," said Mr. Jackson, the director. "Electronic delivery directly into both cinemas and people's homes will not necessarily beat pirates, but it will mean studios are at least on a similar playing field." The Supreme Court recently affirmed legal protections for creative content distributed online when it overturned a lower court's decision to dismiss a copyright infringement case that Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Studios and other entertainment companies brought against Grokster and another company that makes file-sharing software. The ruling will make it easier for Hollywood to litigate more aggressively, should it choose to do so. Studios say that such protections are merited because it now costs about $98 million, on average, to produce and market a film domestically, while 6 of every 10 new films lose money. But technological innovations, as always, will still move forward under their own internal logic. And some critics of Hollywood's response to digital piracy say that the film industry is not addressing the broader challenge: a rapid and epochal shift in how audiences watch movies. "The Internet was designed to facilitate file transfer. That's what it's all about, so whether it's in e-mail, instant messaging, music or films, it's all going to increase as sure as the sun comes up tomorrow," said Mr. Fleischer at BigChampagne. "I think the movie business is in the same place the music business was in 2001 and 2002. They're just sitting it out and not doing much to put legitimate movie offerings online." HOLLYWOOD veterans say they are well aware of the momentous changes afoot. "Our industry is trying very hard to make sure that what happened to the music industry doesn't happen to our industry," said Barry M. Meyer, chairman of Warner Brothers, which was one of the first studios to mount a serious antipiracy campaign. "We don't want this to become mainstream behavior." Others watching the wrangling between Hollywood and film pirates say the online world offers an alternate distribution system - free from the confines and control of movie studios and television networks - that will allow independent filmmakers to reach a broader audience. Their concern is that antipiracy efforts will stymie innovation. "The physical part of the Internet might get stifled because these things are being demonized," said Mr. Smith, whose Morpheus software was in dispute in the Grokster case. "That's what I'm worried about when people begin to talk about the darknet and the need to protect content." But it is safe to assume that even independent movie producers who want to earn a living from their work would share an interest in ensuring that the integrity of their films - and any copyrights associated with them - are protected online. To that end, Hollywood thinks that the time has come to bring down the curtain on film piracy. "I always thought that piracy connotes something glamorous," Mr. Meyer said. "Let's call it what it is: theft. I think it's just like shoplifting." -- Prabhu Ram, Max-Planck-Institut for Intellectual Property, Competition and Tax Law, MarstallPlatz 1, 80539 Munich GERMANY Tel: + 49 89 24246226 Mob: + 49 17629830521 Web: http://infoserve.blogspot.com From sunil at mahiti.org Fri Sep 2 16:34:07 2005 From: sunil at mahiti.org (Sunil Abraham) Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:34:07 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] A blog from Cambodia... Message-ID: <20050902110407.A2EF55EC18A@server.mahiti.org> Please visit the above for details of the ongoing Free and Open Source Software Asia-Pacific Consultation (FOSSAP II) organised by IOSN.net. FOSSAPII Blog, reporting from Siem Reap, Cambodia * RSS feed of this folder's contents * Send this page to somebody * Print this page * Add to Favorites Keep informed with what's happening at the Free and Open Source Software Asia- pacific Consultation (FOSSAP II) being held from September 1-4, 2005. Link from the Philippines Keep in touch with what's happening in the Philippines, a country which has had a user group going for a decade and more. Surely Asia has a lot to learn from here. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/phil An education e-primer, and more Talking about education, if you've not yet come across the IOSN.net education e- primer, then it's probably worth a download. At Siem Reap, Cambodia, participants at FOSSAP-II got freshly-printed copies of this e-primer, together with others on government policy and localisation. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/ednprimer In class, fighting the proprietorial tide GNU/Linux in education? If you thought you had heard enough on that front, here's some more. And rightly so. This is indeed an important field that needs to be worked on. Reports from Mongolia, Nepal and Pakistant throw up some interesting links. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/classroom Questions coming in from Danese Cooper Questions coming in from Danese Cooper What's the progress being made by countries like India and Vietnam in convicing their citizens and officials about the many benefits of FOSS? Queries from an Open Source diva. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/intel Brief link... from Jamil Brief link... from Jamil When I searched Technorati.com for FOSSAP-II, this is a link from Jamil in Bangladesh Browsing some links on Jamil's page took me to the Bangaldesh LUG page (is there some problem with this URL... a google search takes me to this page), screenshots of BanglaOffice and a screenshot of a hack on Mozilla Thunderbird for Bangla localization Baaz Paakhi. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/Jamil Two years, two persons... and some impact Two years, two persons... and some impact What do you achieve with a fledging organisation, and a rather limited amount of manpower? Quite a bit, it seems, if you follow the Free Software/Open Source mode of functioning. Or so says the IOSN. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/iosn Poverty ... and 'piracy' Poverty ... and 'piracy' Poverty and 'piracy'... that's the vicious circle which the poorer countries of the planet are caught up. Can Free and Open Source Software (FOSS, or FLOSS) provide a way out? The United Nations is taking a closer look at a global movement which was spawned by geeks, decades ago, and for entirely different motivations. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/povertypiracy Blogging live... or almost Blogging live... or almost Nice to be at FOSSAP2, meet a whole lot of friends (and, more importantly, persons who one knew earlire largely as email addresses or interesting projects). Most of us reached the venue, in Northern Cambodia, on August 31. By the morning of September 1, the programme got going. Typing in some inputs, while Min Gong of the Chinese Co-Create Association is explaing the history of how FOSS got going, and the challenges it faces in the most populous country of the planet. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/Live In Cambodia, the issue is language In Cambodia, the issue is language Free software makes sense to Cambodia because it allows a small country of a little over 13 million to work towards language solutions that are http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/norbertkleinrelevant to it. It's announced... It's announced...FOSSAP 2 is in early September 2005... in Cambodia. http://www.iosn.net/events/fossap-2005/blog/announced ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Frederick Noronha 784 Near Convent, Sonarbhat SALIGAO GOA India Freelance Journalist TEL: +91-832-2409490 MOBILE: 9822122436 http://fn.swiki.net http://www.livejournal.com/users/goalinks fred at bytesforall.org http://www.bytesforall.org From sunil at mahiti.org Mon Sep 5 16:13:56 2005 From: sunil at mahiti.org (Sunil Abraham) Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2005 16:13:56 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Asia-Pacific Argues in Favour of Free and Open Source Software Message-ID: <20050905104356.2F9A916CFC4@server.mahiti.org> Siem Reap (Cambodia), Sept 3 -- Twenty countries joined a three-day Asia Pacific consultation on Free and Open Source Software, which ended Saturday evening on an optimistic note which saw non-proprietorial software playing an increasingly important role in this talent-rich, resource-poor region. In a historic region, home to 12th century temple structures at a town called Siem Reap, Free and Open Source Software (FOSS) campaigners, supporters, funders and officials from across Asia debated the pros and cons of FOSS versus proprietory software. The focus was on development paradigms of FOSS, open content, e-governance, capacity building, localisation, and more. Participants included techies, government officials, educators, professionals using and supporting FOSS, and others. Free software can be used, copied, studied, modified and distributed. It was built by hackers collaborating across cyberspace, starting in the 'eighties, and today is being seen as a boon for the countries of the Asia-Pacific, in view of the otherwise high and unaffordable global prices of software. Cambodian deputy prime minister Sok An, in a speech delivered on his behalf, argued that Free and Open Source Software could help Cambodia to have a "lot of savings in license fees", make software readily available locally and reduce usage costs drastically, eliminate software piracy, and enable Cambodian students to closely study the software code and "understand its behaviour". This event was sponsored by UNDP's Asia-Pacific Development Information Programme, and co-sponsored by the US-headquartered Intel Corporation. Local hosts were Cambodia's National ICT Development Authority (NiDA) and the Open Forum of Cambodia. Shahid Akhtar, the Pakistani-born Canada-educated head of the Bangkok-based UNDP Asia-Pacific Development Information Programme (APDIP), made a short but pointed presentation at the launch of this event. Many developing countries are caught up in a vicious circle of poverty and piracy, said APDIP coordinator Shahid Akhtar, during the conference. "They are too poor to buy proprietory software, resulting in 'piracy' levels of 90% or more in some countries (of the Asia-Pacific region)," he argued. Then, countries cannot clean their act on 'piracy' because they are poor. "Free and Open Source Software provides a way out of this vicious cycle. It also increases the user's control. It also provides a framework for promoting intellectual capital, and achieving the United Nations' Millenium Development Goals (MDGs), which were accepted by countries across the globe", Akhtar commented. Richard Stallman, the founder of the two-decades-old Free Software Foundation, said at the end of the conference: "People here represent a broad spectrum in beliefs and their goals. There are people from both the Free Software and Open Source movements. It looks like we can work together and make programs that ensure users can be in control of the software they use. I've seen a lot of useful things come up here." Building software capacities was also seen as important in a world where this form of FOSS software -- which can be used, copied, studied, modified and redistributed -- is trying to make its dent in schools, universities, IT education, government policies and strategies of global agencies. Localisation -- or translating software into local languages -- was another issue strongly discussed. There were interesting issues that came up about localisation of software into the Khmer language. One of the suggestions to come up was that FOSS needed its "global ambassador" to promote its case. From supreet.sethi at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 17:47:39 2005 From: supreet.sethi at gmail.com (s|s) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 17:47:39 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Software Benchmarks and license agreements Message-ID: "Lies, damn lies and benchmarks" However obtuse they are, in field of software some crucial decisions are made on the basis of benchmarks. These numbers filter our perseption of products, libraries, algorithms. Lately loads of software products have forbidden posting of benchmarks without permission of vendor. Just wondering, is there any instance of case where these licenses could be overruled. regards Supreet PS: VistaDB is one example of such product -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050905/371ca722/attachment.html From gnthej at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 18:36:13 2005 From: gnthej at gmail.com (Thejesh GN) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 18:36:13 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Using songs Message-ID: <4b0dd7105090506062118ff6c@mail.gmail.com> I have lots of hindi film song CDs with me. Is it legal if I rip and use it on comp. Can I trim and use it as ring tone ? can I pass this ring tones to friends ? -- Thanks, Thej http://www.techmag.biz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050905/55f34702/attachment.html From jmerchant at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 21:22:22 2005 From: jmerchant at gmail.com (Jesal Merchant-Deokar) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 08:52:22 -0700 Subject: [Commons-Law] Software Benchmarks and license agreements In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <816957a30509050852115b9a4f@mail.gmail.com> Hello, ** *New York Sues McAfee for Its "Censorship Clause" http://www.gigalaw.com/articles/2002-all/hollander-2002-04-all.html * Check-out *New York v. Network Associates d/b/a McAfee Software, new s.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/ cyberlaw/nyntwrkass020702mol.pdf * And the New York Court's ruling banning such restrictive use (under New York Law) www.oag.state.ny.us/internet/ litigation/ *network*assoc.pdf Hope it helps. Jes. On 9/5/05, s|s wrote: > > "Lies, damn lies and benchmarks" > However obtuse they are, in field of software some crucial decisions are > made on the basis of benchmarks. These numbers filter our perseption of > products, libraries, algorithms. > > Lately loads of software products have forbidden posting of benchmarks > without permission of vendor. > > Just wondering, is there any instance of case where these licenses could > be overruled. > > regards > > Supreet > > PS: VistaDB is one example of such product > > _______________________________________________ > commons-law mailing list > commons-law at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050905/62e0ed6c/attachment.html From supreet.sethi at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 10:49:39 2005 From: supreet.sethi at gmail.com (s|s) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 10:49:39 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Software Benchmarks and license agreements In-Reply-To: <816957a30509050852115b9a4f@mail.gmail.com> References: <816957a30509050852115b9a4f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: So such license clauses can be challenged, but should'nt it be considered illegal to have such a license in first place, according to 1st amendment. regards Supreet PS: sorry for not using the right terminology On 9/5/05, Jesal Merchant-Deokar wrote: > > Hello, > ** > *New York Sues McAfee for Its "Censorship Clause" > http://www.gigalaw.com/articles/2002-all/hollander-2002-04-all.html* > Check-out *New York v. Network Associates d/b/a McAfee Software, new > s.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/ cyberlaw/nyntwrkass020702mol.pdf > * > And the New York Court's ruling banning such restrictive use (under New > York Law) > www.oag.state.ny.us/internet/ litigation/ > *network*assoc.pdf > > Hope it helps. > Jes. > On 9/5/05, s|s wrote: > > > "Lies, damn lies and benchmarks" > > However obtuse they are, in field of software some crucial decisions are > > made on the basis of benchmarks. These numbers filter our perseption of > > products, libraries, algorithms. > > > > Lately loads of software products have forbidden posting of benchmarks > > without permission of vendor. > > > > Just wondering, is there any instance of case where these licenses could > > be overruled. > > > > regards > > > > Supreet > > > > PS: VistaDB is one example of such product > > > > _______________________________________________ > > commons-law mailing list > > commons-law at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050906/88e657e9/attachment.html From vasumank at yahoo.com Tue Sep 6 22:17:59 2005 From: vasumank at yahoo.com (Vasuman Khandelwal) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 09:47:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Australian Court orders copyright filter on Kazaa In-Reply-To: <20050902110407.A2EF55EC18A@server.mahiti.org> Message-ID: <20050906164800.74286.qmail@web50902.mail.yahoo.com> http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/story/0,,1563348,00.html Court orders copyright filter on Kazaa David Fickling Tuesday September 6, 2005 The Guardian Internet file-swapping was dealt a fresh blow yesterday after the Australian federal court ordered the world's largest file-sharing service to filter out copyrighted material from its network. Kazaa, a program estimated to be used for four out of five internet file-swaps, will have to include copyright filters in future editions of its software and the company behind the programmust put pressure on current users to upgrade to the new version. More than 317 million people have downloaded Kazaa - which allows users to swap music, film and digital information over the web - and several million are believed to be using it at any one time. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- The Sydney court found file-sharing copyrighted material over the network was illegal. "Both the user who makes the file available and the user who downloads a copy infringes the owner's copyright," the ruling stated. The judgment against Sharman Networks, Kazaa's Sydney-based owners, is a further blow to internet file-swapping and follows a series of adverse rulings in recent months. Although Australian courts do not have jurisdiction overseas, their rulings customarily influence the development of law in other Commonwealth countries, including Britain. Yaman Akdeniz, the director of Cyber-Rights and Cyber-Liberties, said the judgment would simply increase the exodus of users to alternative file-sharing applications. "The number of users on Kazaa is already going down ever since it started to be targeted," Mr Akdeniz said. "If you put a successful copyright filter on it, there won't be anything left because most of the swapping done there is illegal." However, he said the ruling was unlikely to stop file-swapping altogether, adding: "The legal system is slow and always lagging behind the software development." In June, the US supreme court ruled that makers of peer-to-peer software could be held liable for the copyright infringement of their users. The peer-to-peer pioneer Napster was shut down in 2001 after a US court ordered it to stop users swapping copyrighted files. Napster has since been relaunched as a paid-for music file download service. The music industry blames the growth of file-sharing software for its poor performance in recent years. CD sales have fallen by 25% since file-sharing began to take off in 1999. Kazaa, which moved to headquarters in Australia and a registration in the Pacific tax haven of Vanuatu after a similar court case in the Netherlands in 2001, was developed by the Swedish internet pioneer Niklas Zennström. Mr Zennström has since become known for writing the software for the internet telephony service Skype. Sharman and the five other defendants will also have to pay damages and 90% of the costs incurred by the record labels - including Universal, EMI, Sony BMG, Warner and Festival Mushroom - which brought the case. --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050906/d437ab02/attachment.html From prashant at nalsartech.org Wed Sep 7 10:46:42 2005 From: prashant at nalsartech.org (Prashant Iyengar) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 10:46:42 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Court gives police broad powers to search and seize pirated movies throughout New Delhi Message-ID: <20050907104642.w7q8v26robw400kw@www.nalsartech.org> Extremely disturbing piece of news. Don't recall it being published in any of the newspapers at the time (around July 19th). Prashant Court gives police broad powers to search and seize pirated movies throughout New Delhi By MATTHEW ROSENBERG Associated Press Writer (AP) - NEW DELHI-A New Delhi court has issued a warrant that gives police broad powers to search for and seize pirated movies in any part of the city, an official from an association of American film companies said Wednesday. The warrant covers the entire city and was issued July 19 by a New Delhi magistrate at the request of the Motion Picture Association, the global arm of the Movie Picture Association of America, said Chander Lall, a lawyer for the group. Click here to find out more! But the MPA, based in Encino, California, intentionally tried to keep the warrant quiet in India for fear of tipping off those illegally selling pirated movies, he told The Associated Press. "We didn't want it very heavily publicized initially because we did want successful raids," he said. "We did not want the pirates to know this is the order we have." He could not say if police had conducted any raids since the issuing of the warrant, which gives authorities the power to open locked buildings and seize the contents. Pirated movies are a major problem in India. Made locally or smuggled in from other Asian countries, like China, they are readily available in bazaars and even upscale shopping centers. Some are barely watchable recordings made in theaters, others are cinema-quality rip-offs. Lall said MPA members - which include Paramount Pictures Corp., Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Studios Inc. and Twentieth Century Fox International Corp. - lose some US$80 million a year because about 60 percent of their movies available in India are pirated. The Indian film industry has also complained about piracy, and it is estimated that box office takings of Bollywood films plummet to about 30 percent of regular earnings when pirated copies hit the market, typically within three to four weeks of the cinema release. But the Indian film industry has gotten little relief from the courts - a fact that has the latest warrant raising eyebrows among lawyers who deal with intellectual property issues in India. Pawan Duggal, a prominent lawyer who deals with electronic copyright issues, called the issuing of the warrant "an aggressive maneuver," and said such orders are normally reserved for matters of national security, not copyright infringement. "We've been hearing about this order only recently and it's been causing a lot of heartburn," he said. "Indian films do not get these kinds of orders." Duggal said he was an ardent supporter of copyright protections, but feared police could abuse the power given under the warrant. "Why should copyright protection lead to the infringement of the privacy ... of people in a free society?" he asked. But Lall, the MPA's lawyer, insisted the order would not be abused, saying it was simply a tool in the fight against pirated movies. He said police have to get information before they can go into homes or business. "It's not an abuse of power that they will go around now breaking down people's homes, we're very careful about going into people's homes," he said. 2005-08-31T15:04:26Z From lawrence at altlawforum.org Wed Sep 7 17:52:17 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 17:52:17 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] CPTech job openings In-Reply-To: <431E0898.6040603@cptech.org> Message-ID: -------------------------------------------- Two positions available at CPTech -------------------------------------------- 1. Fellowship - lawyer working on global intellectual property issues CPTech has available a fellowship for a lawyer working on global intellectual property issues. The responsibilities include working collaboratively on policy research, technical assistance, and various projects involving voluntary and non-voluntary licensing of patents, copyrights and other types of intellectual property, in the areas of essential medicines, and access to essential knowledge goods. The term of the fellowship can be one or two years. The position is located in Washington, DC, and involves international travel. Salary depends upon experience. CPTech is a non-profit organization. The activities of the organization are documented on its web page at http://www.cptech.org. Applicants should send letters of interest and resumes via electronic mail to joy.spencer at cptech.org. --------------------------------------------- 2. Staff position, working on new business approaches for supporting medical R&D. CPTech has available a staff position in its Washington, DC office. The responsibilities involve policy research, writing, and communications to the public. The subject matter concerns new business models and other finance mechanisms for medical R&D, with a particular emphasis on proposals to shift from exclusive marketing rights (the current system) to ³prize fund² mechanisms to stimulate private investments in medical R&D (the proposed change), and new trade regimes based upon global funding of medical R&D (the medical R&D treaty, or R&D+ proposals). The position is located in Washington, DC. Salary depends upon experience. CPTech is a non-profit organization. The activities of the organization are documented on its web page at http://www.cptech.org. Applicants should sent letters of interest and resumes via electronic mail to joy.spencer at cptech.org. -- Joy Spencer 1.202.332.2670 (t) 1.202.332.2673 (f) joy.spencer at cptech.org Mailing Address: Consumer Project on Technology PO Box 53098 Washington DC 20009 Physical Address: 1621 Connecticut Avenue Suite 500 Washington, DC 20009 _______________________________________________ Ip-health mailing list Ip-health at lists.essential.org http://lists.essential.org/mailman/listinfo/ip-health ------ End of Forwarded Message From hbs.law at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 23:17:14 2005 From: hbs.law at gmail.com (Hasit seth) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 23:17:14 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] NERD TV is Online Now... In-Reply-To: <20050907100018.4ADF428D752@mail.sarai.net> References: <20050907100018.4ADF428D752@mail.sarai.net> Message-ID: <8b60429e05090710472935df1f@mail.gmail.com> As a huge fan of Robert X Cringely, I feel it's my duty to promote his new venture: NERD TV. Bob is one of the best writers on tech industry around. His PBS column, "I, Cringely" is very popular. He has been trying since some time to create a Internet based broadcast like show that interviews tech people. Obviously, the audience for such a show would be thin and scattered. A cable show will not do. Net has to be the medium for such niche programming. Podcasts are the new thing around but most by their very nature lack quality of a real TV show. The technology for such a show was a problem. Open Source group Media Frame helped him out. I find it intriguing that the player applet for this show is also downloadable and can be upgraded. This is a major step in internet broadcasting, at least in the non-commerical side of the world. NERD TV is a PBS supported internet broadcast (download) licensed under Creative Commons. The first episode interviews Andy Hertzfield, the man who created the heart of Mac. You can download it yourself here: http://www.pbs.org/cringely/nerdtv/ . A little snippet of the interview is below: NerdTV #1: Andy Hertzfeld Bob: Andy, it's great to see you. Welcome to NerdTV. Andy: Thanks, good to see you. Bob: What do you think NerdTV is? Andy: Well you described it to me as Charlie Rose for nerds, an interview show focusing on technical issues of the day, maybe a little bit of history. Bob: We couldn't afford the table, but otherwise it is the same. Bob: You are best known for doing system software for the Macintosh. For the viewers who don't know you can you give us a short resume of where you came from and what you do? Andy: I was a grad student at UC Berkeley when I bought my Apple II and it suddenly because a lot more interesting than school. I started focusing all my time on being an Apple II hobbyist, dropped out of grad school to go to work for Apple in August of '79. I did some products for the Apple II, most notably the first small low cost thermal printer, the Silent Type. I started on the Mac team in February of 1981, wrote a lot of the original system software for the Mac including the User Interface Toolbox, the Window Manager, Menu Manager, Control Manager. I left Apple in April of 1984, pretty soon after the introduction of the Mac. I helped my friend Burrell Smith who did the digital hardware for the Mac start a company called Radius in 1986 that made peripherals for the Mac. I did a lot of stuff as a third-party developer, sold system software back to Apple. In 1990, along with Bill Atkinson, who was sort of my mentor on the Mac project, we started a company called General Magic that made some of the first handheld computers - what they call a PDA, though I always thought that was not such a good name. .......... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From prashant at nalsartech.org Thu Sep 8 11:27:08 2005 From: prashant at nalsartech.org (Prashant Iyengar) Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2005 11:27:08 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] How long does it take for Windows XP to be hacked on the internet Message-ID: <20050908112708.yc9pufne6xi8gg0g@www.nalsartech.org> http://www.avantgarde.com/xxxxttln.pdf Here's an, imho, important report from the back-alleys of the internet which tested the amount of time it took for different operating systems to be compromised on the internet. Results : Microsoft Windows XP SP 1... under 4 minutes!! Linux & Macintosh .. not once during the test period! One of the authors of report- Kevin Mitnick -is probably one of the best known hackers in the internet. Doesn't, predictably, get the kind of press it deserves. Prashant From sunil at mahiti.org Thu Sep 8 11:32:37 2005 From: sunil at mahiti.org (Sunil Abraham) Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2005 11:32:37 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] UNDP-APDIP's FOSS Open Standards Primer: Extension of Deadline for Feedback Message-ID: <20050908060237.86F155EC070@server.mahiti.org> Dear Colleagues, We have received mails from some individuals and institutions asking us to extend the deadline for public feedback with regard to the FOSS: Open Standards Primer. We have decided to extend the deadline for receiving feedback to 1 October 2005. We hope this will give everybody sufficient time to send us your complete feedback. Also in keeping with the transparent philosophy of the Free/Open Source Software Movement, we are making a small change to our process for public/peer review of our primers. From now we will upload all feedback that we receive to IOSN.NET and also post urls of these pages to the FOSSAP, IOSN-GENERAL and FOSS-PDI mailing list. We hope this will trigger further further discussion that would be of use to the author Dr. Nah Soo Hoe as he incorporates the feedback into the final version of the Primer. Please send all feedback to sunil at apdip.net. Thanks Sunil Abraham Mahiti - International Open Source Network Software Freedom for All Web: www.iosn.net Email: sunil at apdip.net From rajlakshmi_nesargi at yahoo.com Thu Sep 8 17:16:11 2005 From: rajlakshmi_nesargi at yahoo.com (Rajlakshmi Nesargi) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 04:46:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] patent infringement case Message-ID: <20050908114611.30699.qmail@web51605.mail.yahoo.com> Dear readers, I found this an interesting article so thought of posting it here. could be found at the following website: http://realtytimes.com/rtapages/20050714_mappingpatent.htm the article is as follows: Mapping Patent Holder Sues Realtor -- How Scared Should You Be? by Blanche Evans Imagine that you are using a copy of Microsoft Word that you didn't pay for. One day, Microsoft walks into your office and demands past, present and future royalties from you, based on the amount of money you've made using their product. You would know if you were using a product or service without paying for it. And guess what -- you'd be liable for treble damages if you let Microsoft take you to court. So, you'd probably sheepishly hand over the money and pray the day didn't get any worse. But what if you didn't know you were infringing on anything? Right now, you might be using a product, service, or a sequence of steps to zoom in on properties, without realizing that you could be accused of infringing on someone else's copyright or patent. Imagine that your MLS has been providing you a zoom listings mapping method that exposes you to a patent lawsuit as the end user. That's what happened to top-producing RE/MAX agent Diane Sarkisian of Ambler, Pa. Sarkisian has been slapped with a lawsuit for patent infringement -- for using a listings search method without paying royalties. Stunned, she told The Title Report that she was using the services provided by her MLS, TReND. According to the company that was formed to license the patent, Real Estate Alliance Ltd, (REAL), Sarkisian was mailed a warning letter a month ago that she was using a zoom mapping method that was patented by a REAL company member, Mark Tornetta. She was asked to pay royalties "at a significant discount," says Steve Friedberg, spokesperson for REAL. The company says she not only ignored the letter, but they have yet to hear from her or her attorneys. (Sarkisian could not be reached for comment by Realty Times in time for publication.) In this age of Internet scams and credit card and identity theft, Sarkisian may have not responded, believing the letter to be yet another hoax. But the lawsuit proved there was a real company with a real threat behind the very REAL letter. The question is -- does the company have a case? Not according to the agents, attorneys, and MLSs who plan to fight REAL and Tornetta. According to one source, "Tornetta tried to sue Microsoft and Moore USA and was unsuccessful. The judge threw the case out because it was filed in the wrong name. Tornetta never refiled. Now six years later, they've decided they can't take the big fish to court, they are going after the little fish -- the agents. All it takes is for one agent to write them a check, and they could go after every agent in the country." TReND CEO Rita Johnson was unavailable for comment, but the MLS has issued the following statement: TReND has become aware that a lawsuit has been filed in the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania by Real Estate Alliance Ltd (REAL), alleging that use of the TReND MLS system by real estate agents infringes U.S. Patent Number 5,032,989. The lawsuit states "the '989 patent claims a computer implemented method of identifying available real estate properties by mapping the locations of the real estate properties in such a manner that an initial broad geographic map for a selected area can be "drilled down" by successive iterations to display greater levels of geographic detail including the locations of the available properties." TReND has retained a leading intellectual property law firm, DLA Piper Rudnick Gray Cary. Worldwide, DLA Piper Rudnick Gray Cary has 2,900 lawyers in 53 offices in 20 countries. TReND believes this lawsuit is without merit and intends to vigorously defend any claims that use of the TReND MLS system infringes the REAL patent. So far, REAL appears to be leaving TReND alone, and instead is targeting "end-user" agents in Tornetta's home town of Philadelphia, going after high-profile agents who bill themselves as top producers. According to a source, REAL wrote letters to at least seven agents with Number1Expert websites, including Sarkisian, asking for $10,000 in royalties of each agent. The agents, says the source, plan to fight back through their companies' attorneys; not one has agreed to pay the money. REAL's U.S. Patent 5,032,989, is called the "Real Estate Search and Location System and Method." It is a mapping system "for locating available real estate properties for sale, lease or rental using a database of available properties at a central location and remote stations which use a graphic interface," according to the patent documents. "There is provided a method for locating available real estate properties for sale, lease or rental using a database of available properties at a central location and remote stations which use a graphic interface to select desired regions on a map of the areas in interest. The user begins with a region where they are interested in acquiring property and select an inner area within this region by using a pointing device such as a mouse to designate boundaries on a map displayed on screen. This is then zoomed in on and a second area is selected within the zoomed region. The second area is then cross-referenced with the database of available properties whose approximate locations are then pictorially displayed on screen. Information about the properties can then be obtained in textual form." According to a technology advisor who is not party to the suit, the patent will be difficult to defend because technology has advanced so much since 1999 when the patent was issued. "It would be like Gutenberg demanding royalties on the printing press from today's laser jet printer users," he says. If you didn't know there was a patent on zoom mapping methods, you're not alone. The patent is not on a product you can buy off the shelf like Microsoft Word. It's a "series of steps" you take that you license permission to use. But ignorance is not an excuse. As Lawrence Husick, a registered patent attorney with Lipton Weinberger and Husick, and an equity holder in REAL, points out, the patent is a public document. "If you violate the patent you are still infringing, and the patentee may seek damages in the form of reasonable royalties," he says. The company is under no legal obligation to warn patent infringers that they are in violation, or about to be sued. They are also not defending copyright infringement, so it doesn't even matter if your MLS or content service provider is using REAL's method or a copy. It's the method that's patented, and as long as the steps are used, patent infringement has occurred. And those with liability, as REAL sees it, are the end users -- real estate agents. In fact, REAL told The Title Report it has declined to sue TREND MLS because it is a nonprofit organization. Instead it will seek remuneration from real estate agents, which the company says averages approximately $50,000 in income from the use of its method on their personal and professional websites. As a top agent, as she declares on her Number1Expert Website, Sarkisian was targeted for her productivity. Patent royalties will be assessed using the agent's productivity as a guide says REAL. It's a cautionary tale, because a number of real estate associations, MLSs, website designers and programmers, and real estate agents may be using REAL's mapping method or one like it without realizing a piper is demanding to be paid. The company does not intend to stop with Sarkisian. There may be scores of agents as end users of the mapping method, who may expect the proverbial knock at the door any minute. REAL spokespersons say the company doesn't want to alienate real estate agents, yet clearly the company has no hesitation about scaring them into writing a check. "They have a right to use the method but do so under license to honor the intellectual property," advises Husick. "We are not saying that the agents have done something with malice." While one source says he believes that REAL is "testing the waters" by suing Sarkisian, the agents and their companies still have to legally defend themselves. This is one situation where advertising their success was not an advantage for top agents. "You must be the change you wish to see in the world. First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win"-Mahatma Gandhi --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050908/f72456c8/attachment.html From lawrence at altlawforum.org Fri Sep 9 10:37:20 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 10:37:20 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Decision in the Microsoft case form Delhi High court Message-ID: Hi all I had posted a story on the Microsoft decision in the Delhi high court in which an incredible amount of damages was awarded against some software vendors who were selling illegal copies of Microsoft software. I am including the decision below. This case is quite a turning point in terms of the quantum of damages awarded since the courts in india have traditionally been averse to granting such huge damages lawrence ================ In a landmark judgment, the Delhi High Court has awarded damages to the tune of almost twenty lakhs (approximately USD 44886) against defendants for copyright infringement in the matter of Microsoft Corporation v Yogesh Papat. The suit was filed in the year 2003 and was finally heard in early 2005 1 MANU/DE/0331/2005 IN THE HIGH COURT OF DELHI CS(OS) No. 103/2003 Decided On: 22.02.2005 Appellants: Microsoft Corporation Vs. Respondent: Mr. Yogesh Papat and Anr.Hon'ble Judges: Pradeep Nandrajog, J. Counsels: For Appellant/Petitioner/Plaintiff: Pravin Anand, Adv. For Respondents/Defendant: Nemo JUDGMENT Pradeep Nandrajog, J. 1. Plaintiff is the registered proprietor of the trade mark 'MICROSOFT'. The mark is registered in class 9 and 16 vide registration No. 430449-B and 430450-B. Plaintiff claims to have created various kinds of software in which plaintiff claims a proprietory right. When the software is sold, purchaser has a licence agreement setting out the terms of permissible user of the software which is contained in a flopy. CD/flopies are handed over. Term of the licence agreement permits the use of the CD's/flopies, as per conditions. 2 2. It is stated in the plaint that the defendants, without a licence are loading the software on the hard disk of computers being sold by them and in this manner are causing financial loss to the plaintiff. It is alleged that the defendants do not have any permission from the plaintiff to copy or sell the licenced programmes as per software developed by the plaintiff. Following reliefs are prayed for:- a) An order for permanent injunction restraining the defendants, their directors, officers, servants and agents and all others acting for and on their behalf from copying, selling, offering for sale, distributing, issuing to the public, counterfeit/unlicensed versions of the Plaintiffs' software, in any manner, amounting to infringement of the Plaintiffs' copyright in the said computer programs and related and related manuals; b) An order for permanent injunction restraining the defendants, their directors, officers, servants and agents and all others acting for and on their behalf, from unauthorisedly selling, offering for sale, distributing the Plaintiff's software and/or any other product to which the Plaintiffs' trademark, or any deceptive variants thereof have been applied without the license of the Plaintiffs' amounting to infringement of Plaintiffs' registered trademarks; c) An order for permanent injunction restraining the defendants, their directors, officers, servants and agents and all others acting for and on their behalf, from unauthorisedly selling, offering for sale, distributing the Plaintiffs' software and/or any other product to which the Plaintiffs' trademarks, or any deceptive variants thereof has been applied without the license of the Plaintiffs, amounting to passing off of the counterfeit/unlicensed software and products as genuine products of the Plaintiffs; d) An order for delivery-up to the Plaintiffs, of all the counterfeit/unlicensed copies of the Plaintiff's software, and/or articles/software to which have been applied the Plaintiffs' trademarks, or any other mark which may be identical with or deceptively similar to the Plaintiffs trademarks without license of the Plaintiffs, the duplicating equipment used in the copying the software of the Plaintiffs, including computers, compact disc writers, stampers, burners, "plates" as defined in Section 2(t) of the Act, hard disks, diskettes, packaging and advertising material, labels, stationery articles and all other infringing material under Section 59 of the Act; e) An order for rendition of accounts of profits illegally earned by the defendants by reason of infringement of the Plaintiff's copyright, including conversion damages which are presently indeterminate, infringement of trademarks as aforesaid and by passing off their goods and/or business as the goods and business of the Plaintiff, and a decree be passed against the defendants in the sum of the amount so ascertained." 3. As per the plaint, defendant No. 1 was found to be carrying on operations on behalf of defendant No. 2. 4. Defendants chose not to enter appearance after being served. Vide order dated 20.2.2004 they were proceeded ex-parte. Plaintiff has led evidence by way of affidavit. 3 5. Evidence by way of affidavit of Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi proves the following:- (i) Ex.P.1, power of attorney issued by the plaintiff company in favour of Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi to institute the suit, sign and verify the pleadings. (ii) That the plaintiff is in the field of computer programmes (Software), the said computer software includes various operating systems such as MS-DOS, Microsoft Windows and Microsoft Office. (iii) Ex.P.2, P.3, P.4 and P.5, being the computer programmes developed by the plaintiff named (a) Microsoft Office 2000, (b) Microsoft Windows 98 Operating Systems, (c) Microsoft Visual Basic (d) Microsoft Visual C++. (iv) Ex.P.6 and P.7 being the certificate of registration pertaining to the registration of the trade mark Microsoft in name of the plaintiff. (v) Ex.P.8 being the affidavit of Mr. Vikas Arora, an employee of the plaintiff who purchased a computer from the defendants loaded with the pirated software of the plaintiff. (vi) Ex.P.9 being the affidavit of a technical expert Mr. Sunil John who studied the hard disk of the computer purchased from the defendants by Mr. Vikas Arora and reported loading of pirated software of the plaintiff on the hard disk. 6. Plaintiff has also filed affidavit by way of evidence of Shri Sanjiv Sharma a Chartered Accountant. Said evidence brings on record and proves the following:- (i) Evidenced from the bill issued by the defendants on 3.9.1992, the fact that the defendants are in business since 1.4.1996 because of the reason the bill records sales tax registration w.e.f. 1.4.1996. (ii) From the bill of the defendants, on the sale price of a computer it is established that the sale price was Rs. 27,050/- as of 3.9.2002. (iii) On the assumption that the defendant sell approximately 100 computers a year, which is purely assumptive, on the further assumption that keeping in view the operating systems Windows 1998, 400 computers would be load with said system, lesser sales of the other software, assumption would be that 200 computers and 20 computers respectively were loaded with the software Office 2000 STD and Visual Studio 6.0, on the cost per unit of the licenced software estimated loss of business to the plaintiff comes to Rs. 64 lacs. (iv) Minus dealers profit of Rs. 2.40 lacs, net revenue loss has been worked out at Rs. 61.6 lacs. 4 (v) On the basis of the annual returns of the plaintiff, average profit having been worked out over the last 4 years, evidence of this witness establishes that the gross profit of the plaintiff being 32.1%, loss of profit to the plaintiff comes to Rs. 19.75 lacs. 7. Affidavit of Mr. Vikas Arora proved as Ex.P.8 by Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi establishes that when he approached defendant No. 1 for sale of a computer, defendant No. 1 agreed to sell a computer loaded with the following software of the plaintiff:- (a) Visual Studio 6.0 (b) MS Windows 98 (c) MS Office 2000. 8. Affidavit further establishes that defendant No. 1 did not issue a formal bill/cash memo but handed over his business card in which name of defendant No. 2 was printed showing said defendant to be a dealer in computers and electronic components. The affidavit of Mr. Vikas Arora further establishes that on his instances defendant No. 1 gave a bill dated 3.9.2002 pertaining to sale of a computer. The bill does not list any software, software literature or CD being sold. 9. Annexure P.9 proved by Shri Nikhil Krishnamurthi, being the affidavit of Mr. Sunil John, a computer expert, proves that the hard disk of the computer purchased by Mr. Vikas Arora was being loaded, by the defendants with the software of the plaintiff. 10. Evidence on record establishes that Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi is competent to file and institute the suit on behalf of the plaintiff. The verification of the plaint is in order. Evidence also establishes that the plaintiff is the registered proprietor of the trade mark/name MICROSOFT and that the copyright in the computer software programmes:- (a) MS Windos 98, (b) MS Office 2000 and (c) MS Visual Studio 6.0 vests in the plaintiff. 11. Evidence further establishes hard disk piracies by the defendants. It establishes that the defendants are pirating software of the plaintiff and are loading the same on the hard disk of the computers sold by said defendants without permission from the plaintiff. 12. Though assumptive i.e. based on the assumption of sale of 100 computers each year and on the basis of the popularity of the computer software, as also sold computers being loaded with the pirated software, loss of profit to the stands established. 13. It may be true that the financial loss is based on certain assumption, but it cannot be helped for the reason the defendant has chosen to remain ex-parte. 14. Assertion of the witnesses of the plaintiff that the plaintiff has a copyright in the pirated software has gone unrebutted. 5 15. Evidence on record establishes that the defendants are engaged in the business of assembling computers and sale to the public under the name of defendant No. 2. 16. Before a computer can function to carry out the tasks required by its owner, it has to be properly loaded with one or more operating systems. The operating system is nothing but a software contained in a CD. The defendants are supplying computers pre-loaded with the software of the plaintiff. 17. The software being pre-loaded in the computers sold by defendants is a software, copyright whereof vests in the plaintiff. 18. Unchallenged evidence of the witnesses of the plaintiff noted above which includes the sown affidavit of an employee of the plaintiff, defendants are proved to be pirating the software of the plaintiff. 19. It stands established that the defendants have infringed the plaintiffs copyright by making illicit copies of the operating systems software by openly copying whatever operating system is currently salable. As observed in Microsoft Corporation v. Electrowide Ltd. and Anr. (1997) FSR 580 by Mr. Justice Laddy of the High Court of Justice, Chancery Division, this constitutes a general threat to infringe the copyright in the class of software. 20. Defendants are in the business of sale of computers. One can safely presume that they had knowledge that the products being sold were infringing copies. 21. Plaintiff is a world renowned computer software company. Plaintiff would be entitled to the wide ranging injunctions to restrain any further infringement of its intellectual property rights in any of its software at the hands of the defendants. Plaintiff would also be entitled to an order for the delivery-up forthright by the defendants. Plaintiff would also be entitled to damages for the reason that it would be futile to direct the defendants to render accounts for the reason that the defendants have been carrying on business surreptitiously. 22. Suit is accordingly decreed in terms of prayers 'A' to 'D' of the plaint, as noted in para above. Suit is further decreed by awarding the plaintiff compensation/damages against the defendants in the sum of Rs. 19.75 lacs. Damages awarded are payable by the defendants jointly and severally. Damages awarded shall carry interest @ 9% p.a. from the date of decree till date of payment. 23. Plaintiff would be entitled to costs. 24. Decree be prepared on the plaintiff making up the deficiency in court fee in respect of the damages which have been awarded. From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Fri Sep 9 12:12:17 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 07:42:17 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] Microsoft moves from the Delhi High court to Chandini Chowk and Chandni bazzar in Calcutta In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050909064217.11464.qmail@web8409.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Lawrence, It seems, as a friend with the Supream Court in 1989 on our campaign on National Housing Rights mentioned, higher you go up the judicial system, the worse it gets for poorer groups. He described how at the lower level, it was far easier to 'soften if not diffuse the impact'. If I recollect well, this came not just from less vigilant judges, but rather the way legal arguments were framed within the local 'hydra' of touts, agents, and access for relatives from lower income families applying 'pressure'. If so, I was wondering if Bill Gates attempted to widen such cases aganist the pirates, would it move into a muggy mire of such subversive practices? I am also reminded of accompaning a relative to the districts courts in Almora over a land dispute case involving as one of the parties, a very powerful IAS type. The IAS type in thier arrogance of useing the "nation" state system essentially went aganist a series of local and time honored social customs of how to deal with land disputes. My relative, herself a person with long experience and sensitivity to these daily practices merging legal and social customs, acted within these. Thus, although the decision of the DM at Nanital were to be implemented in favor of the IAS, the local system used a combination of both legal arguments and also stirring up local sentiments. Thus, what shaped outcomes was an erosion of centralized authority. Maybe this land case is different from the case of software piracy, but what has got me thinking there potentially, a sort of 'urbanization' of legal politics, and it's ability to erode tightly controlled and centralized judicial systems? I was thinking here of the value of what Omar Razzar quotes as a 'legal feild'? If so, would this be applicable differently for particular products -- and as you (or Ravi Vasudevan I forget) mention that film priacy is seen as entertainment versus other kind of products bringing on different public moralities at play? Perhaps that is also why the World Bank in the case of Uttrachal and Almora district in particular, for their Joint Forest Managemtn (JFM) intends to replicate the Karnataka Bhoomi program to digitize and 'clean up' land records and recording processes. Is the fear of the Hydra at play? Would Microsoft encounter such fates if it moved from the Delhi High courts to Chandni Chowk? or then, to as exciting the Chandini Bazzar of Calcutta? Solly --- Lawrence Liang wrote: > Hi all > > I had posted a story on the Microsoft decision in > the Delhi high court in > which an incredible amount of damages was awarded > against some software > vendors who were selling illegal copies of Microsoft > software. I am > including the decision below. This case is quite a > turning point in terms of > the quantum of damages awarded since the courts in > india have traditionally > been averse to granting such huge damages > > > lawrence > > ================ > In a landmark judgment, the Delhi High Court has > awarded damages to the tune > of almost twenty lakhs (approximately USD 44886) > against defendants for > copyright infringement in the matter of Microsoft > Corporation v Yogesh > Papat. The suit was filed in the year 2003 and was > finally heard in early > 2005 > > > 1 > MANU/DE/0331/2005 > IN THE HIGH COURT OF DELHI > CS(OS) No. 103/2003 > Decided On: 22.02.2005 > Appellants: Microsoft Corporation > Vs. > Respondent: Mr. Yogesh Papat and Anr.Hon'ble Judges: > Pradeep Nandrajog, J. > Counsels: > For Appellant/Petitioner/Plaintiff: Pravin Anand, > Adv. > For Respondents/Defendant: Nemo > > > JUDGMENT > Pradeep Nandrajog, J. > 1. Plaintiff is the registered proprietor of the > trade mark 'MICROSOFT'. The > mark is > registered in class 9 and 16 vide registration No. > 430449-B and 430450-B. > Plaintiff > claims to have created various kinds of software in > which plaintiff claims a > proprietory > right. When the software is sold, purchaser has a > licence agreement setting > out the terms > of permissible user of the software which is > contained in a flopy. > CD/flopies are handed > over. Term of the licence agreement permits the use > of the CD's/flopies, as > per > conditions. > 2 > 2. It is stated in the plaint that the defendants, > without a licence are > loading the software > on the hard disk of computers being sold by them and > in this manner are > causing financial > loss to the plaintiff. It is alleged that the > defendants do not have any > permission from the > plaintiff to copy or sell the licenced programmes as > per software developed > by the > plaintiff. Following reliefs are prayed for:- > a) An order for permanent injunction restraining the > defendants, their > directors, officers, > servants and agents and all others acting for and on > their behalf from > copying, selling, > offering for sale, distributing, issuing to the > public, > counterfeit/unlicensed versions of the > Plaintiffs' software, in any manner, amounting to > infringement of the > Plaintiffs' copyright > in the said computer programs and related and > related manuals; > b) An order for permanent injunction restraining the > defendants, their > directors, officers, > servants and agents and all others acting for and on > their behalf, from > unauthorisedly > selling, offering for sale, distributing the > Plaintiff's software and/or any > other product to > which the Plaintiffs' trademark, or any deceptive > variants thereof have been > applied > without the license of the Plaintiffs' amounting to > infringement of > Plaintiffs' registered > trademarks; > c) An order for permanent injunction restraining the > defendants, their > directors, officers, > servants and agents and all others acting for and on > their behalf, from > unauthorisedly > selling, offering for sale, distributing the > Plaintiffs' software and/or any > other product to > which the Plaintiffs' trademarks, or any deceptive > variants thereof has been > applied > without the license of the Plaintiffs, amounting to > passing off of the > counterfeit/unlicensed software and products as > genuine products of the > Plaintiffs; > d) An order for delivery-up to the Plaintiffs, of > all the > counterfeit/unlicensed copies of the > Plaintiff's software, and/or articles/software to > which have been applied > the Plaintiffs' > trademarks, or any other mark which may be identical > with or deceptively > similar to the > Plaintiffs trademarks without license of the > Plaintiffs, the duplicating > equipment used in > the copying the software of the Plaintiffs, > including computers, compact > disc writers, > stampers, burners, "plates" as defined in Section > 2(t) of the Act, hard > disks, diskettes, > packaging and advertising material, labels, > stationery articles and all > other infringing > material under Section 59 of the Act; > e) An order for rendition of accounts of profits > illegally earned by the > defendants by > reason of infringement of the Plaintiff's copyright, > including conversion > damages which > are presently indeterminate, infringement of > trademarks as aforesaid and by > passing off > their goods and/or business as the goods and > business of the Plaintiff, and > a decree be > passed against the defendants in the sum of the > amount so ascertained." > 3. As per the plaint, defendant No. 1 was found to > be carrying on operations > on behalf of > defendant No. 2. > 4. Defendants chose not to enter appearance after > being served. Vide order > dated > 20.2.2004 they were proceeded ex-parte. Plaintiff > has led evidence by way of > affidavit. > 3 > 5. Evidence by way of affidavit of Mr. Nikhil > Krishnamurthi proves the > following:- > (i) Ex.P.1, power of attorney issued by the > plaintiff company in favour of > Mr. Nikhil > Krishnamurthi to institute the suit, sign and verify > the pleadings. > (ii) That the plaintiff is in the field of computer > programmes (Software), > the said > computer software includes various operating systems > such as MS-DOS, > Microsoft > Windows and Microsoft Office. > (iii) Ex.P.2, P.3, P.4 and P.5, being the computer > programmes developed by > the plaintiff > named (a) Microsoft Office 2000, (b) Microsoft > Windows 98 Operating Systems, > (c) > Microsoft Visual Basic (d) Microsoft Visual C++. > (iv) Ex.P.6 and P.7 being the certificate of > registration pertaining to the > registration of the > trade mark Microsoft in name of the plaintiff. > (v) Ex.P.8 being the affidavit of Mr. Vikas Arora, > an employee of the > === message truncated === __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From lawrence at altlawforum.org Sat Sep 10 11:17:38 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 11:17:38 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Proposal to abolish Crown Copyright In-Reply-To: <51FD87BA-293E-422E-B7F9-57D6D27FBDBD@cptech.org> Message-ID: http://www.greenparty.org.uk/news/2166 Green Party to vote on Intellectual Property 9th Sep 2005 Intellectual resources need to be "in the public domain" The Green Party will vote tomorrow on proposed amendments to Intellectual Property Rights law. The handling of intellectual property law has significant implications for the freedom of information both in the UK and in the developing world. Matt Wootton, Green Party External Communications Co-ordinator commented: "Our world policy on Intellectual Property is deeply biased in favour of powerful and unaccountable rights-holders - who aren't required to bear the people in mind. In the UK, excessive Intellectual Property Rights prevent access to and dissemination of vast areas of knowledge. "Ninety-five percent of the works in copyright aren't available commercially in any form. Even worse, in the context of drug patents it means that, for instance, the majority of people with Aids in developing countries die prematurely because they can't afford the drugs they need. Branded diet pills are more profitable, so that's what gets the funding. The proposed amendments aim to ensure that what rightfully belongs to the people is brought into the public domain." Proposed amendments would abolish Crown Copyright, a protection for most material originated by ministers and civil servants, and promote the Creative Commons, which offers a flexible range of protections and freedoms for authors and artists. The Party would require Open Access publishing for publicly-funded academies. Alternative compensation schemes, providing money to research the world's most pressing health problems, would also be promoted. Matt continued, "As a Party committed to social justice, we believe that intellectual resources are to be shared by everyone, not just big business and lobbyists with the right connections to big business. It is this belief which compels us to act." ENDS From hbs.law at gmail.com Sun Sep 11 00:11:08 2005 From: hbs.law at gmail.com (Hasit seth) Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 00:11:08 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Decision in the Microsoft case form Delhi High In-Reply-To: <20050909050552.DEE4128D725@mail.sarai.net> References: <20050909050552.DEE4128D725@mail.sarai.net> Message-ID: <8b60429e0509101141521f08a3@mail.gmail.com> Lawrence, It must be pointed out that this is an ex-parte decree, i.e., defendant chose not to defend the suit. The evidence on record was naturally one-sided. The damage award could be significantly lower if the defendant had established the scope of infringement even if we assume that they would have admitted infringement (extreme case). This case, therefore, is unlikely to become a precedent for higher damage awards. "4. Defendants chose not to enter appearance after being served. Vide order dated 20.2.2004 they were proceeded ex-parte. Plaintiff has led evidence by way of affidavit." Hasit > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 10:37:20 +0530 > From: Lawrence Liang > Subject: [Commons-Law] Decision in the Microsoft case form Delhi High > court > To: Commons law > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Hi all > > I had posted a story on the Microsoft decision in the Delhi high court in > which an incredible amount of damages was awarded against some software > vendors who were selling illegal copies of Microsoft software. I am > including the decision below. This case is quite a turning point in terms of > the quantum of damages awarded since the courts in india have traditionally > been averse to granting such huge damages > > > lawrence > > ================ > In a landmark judgment, the Delhi High Court has awarded damages to the tune > of almost twenty lakhs (approximately USD 44886) against defendants for > copyright infringement in the matter of Microsoft Corporation v Yogesh > Papat. The suit was filed in the year 2003 and was finally heard in early > 2005 > > > 1 > MANU/DE/0331/2005 > IN THE HIGH COURT OF DELHI > CS(OS) No. 103/2003 > Decided On: 22.02.2005 > Appellants: Microsoft Corporation > Vs. > Respondent: Mr. Yogesh Papat and Anr.Hon'ble Judges: > Pradeep Nandrajog, J. > Counsels: > For Appellant/Petitioner/Plaintiff: Pravin Anand, Adv. > For Respondents/Defendant: Nemo > > > JUDGMENT > Pradeep Nandrajog, J. > 1. Plaintiff is the registered proprietor of the trade mark 'MICROSOFT'. The > mark is > registered in class 9 and 16 vide registration No. 430449-B and 430450-B. > Plaintiff > claims to have created various kinds of software in which plaintiff claims a > proprietory > right. When the software is sold, purchaser has a licence agreement setting > out the terms > of permissible user of the software which is contained in a flopy. > CD/flopies are handed > over. Term of the licence agreement permits the use of the CD's/flopies, as > per > conditions. > 2 > 2. It is stated in the plaint that the defendants, without a licence are > loading the software > on the hard disk of computers being sold by them and in this manner are > causing financial > loss to the plaintiff. It is alleged that the defendants do not have any > permission from the > plaintiff to copy or sell the licenced programmes as per software developed > by the > plaintiff. Following reliefs are prayed for:- > a) An order for permanent injunction restraining the defendants, their > directors, officers, > servants and agents and all others acting for and on their behalf from > copying, selling, > offering for sale, distributing, issuing to the public, > counterfeit/unlicensed versions of the > Plaintiffs' software, in any manner, amounting to infringement of the > Plaintiffs' copyright > in the said computer programs and related and related manuals; > b) An order for permanent injunction restraining the defendants, their > directors, officers, > servants and agents and all others acting for and on their behalf, from > unauthorisedly > selling, offering for sale, distributing the Plaintiff's software and/or any > other product to > which the Plaintiffs' trademark, or any deceptive variants thereof have been > applied > without the license of the Plaintiffs' amounting to infringement of > Plaintiffs' registered > trademarks; > c) An order for permanent injunction restraining the defendants, their > directors, officers, > servants and agents and all others acting for and on their behalf, from > unauthorisedly > selling, offering for sale, distributing the Plaintiffs' software and/or any > other product to > which the Plaintiffs' trademarks, or any deceptive variants thereof has been > applied > without the license of the Plaintiffs, amounting to passing off of the > counterfeit/unlicensed software and products as genuine products of the > Plaintiffs; > d) An order for delivery-up to the Plaintiffs, of all the > counterfeit/unlicensed copies of the > Plaintiff's software, and/or articles/software to which have been applied > the Plaintiffs' > trademarks, or any other mark which may be identical with or deceptively > similar to the > Plaintiffs trademarks without license of the Plaintiffs, the duplicating > equipment used in > the copying the software of the Plaintiffs, including computers, compact > disc writers, > stampers, burners, "plates" as defined in Section 2(t) of the Act, hard > disks, diskettes, > packaging and advertising material, labels, stationery articles and all > other infringing > material under Section 59 of the Act; > e) An order for rendition of accounts of profits illegally earned by the > defendants by > reason of infringement of the Plaintiff's copyright, including conversion > damages which > are presently indeterminate, infringement of trademarks as aforesaid and by > passing off > their goods and/or business as the goods and business of the Plaintiff, and > a decree be > passed against the defendants in the sum of the amount so ascertained." > 3. As per the plaint, defendant No. 1 was found to be carrying on operations > on behalf of > defendant No. 2. > 4. Defendants chose not to enter appearance after being served. Vide order > dated > 20.2.2004 they were proceeded ex-parte. Plaintiff has led evidence by way of > affidavit. > 3 > 5. Evidence by way of affidavit of Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi proves the > following:- > (i) Ex.P.1, power of attorney issued by the plaintiff company in favour of > Mr. Nikhil > Krishnamurthi to institute the suit, sign and verify the pleadings. > (ii) That the plaintiff is in the field of computer programmes (Software), > the said > computer software includes various operating systems such as MS-DOS, > Microsoft > Windows and Microsoft Office. > (iii) Ex.P.2, P.3, P.4 and P.5, being the computer programmes developed by > the plaintiff > named (a) Microsoft Office 2000, (b) Microsoft Windows 98 Operating Systems, > (c) > Microsoft Visual Basic (d) Microsoft Visual C++. > (iv) Ex.P.6 and P.7 being the certificate of registration pertaining to the > registration of the > trade mark Microsoft in name of the plaintiff. > (v) Ex.P.8 being the affidavit of Mr. Vikas Arora, an employee of the > plaintiff who > purchased a computer from the defendants loaded with the pirated software of > the > plaintiff. > (vi) Ex.P.9 being the affidavit of a technical expert Mr. Sunil John who > studied the hard > disk of the computer purchased from the defendants by Mr. Vikas Arora and > reported > loading of pirated software of the plaintiff on the hard disk. > 6. Plaintiff has also filed affidavit by way of evidence of Shri Sanjiv > Sharma a Chartered > Accountant. Said evidence brings on record and proves the following:- > (i) Evidenced from the bill issued by the defendants on 3.9.1992, the fact > that the > defendants are in business since 1.4.1996 because of the reason the bill > records sales tax > registration w.e.f. 1.4.1996. > (ii) From the bill of the defendants, on the sale price of a computer it is > established that > the sale price was Rs. 27,050/- as of 3.9.2002. > (iii) On the assumption that the defendant sell approximately 100 computers > a year, > which is purely assumptive, on the further assumption that keeping in view > the operating > systems Windows 1998, 400 computers would be load with said system, lesser > sales of > the other software, assumption would be that 200 computers and 20 computers > respectively were loaded with the software Office 2000 STD and Visual Studio > 6.0, on > the cost per unit of the licenced software estimated loss of business to the > plaintiff comes > to Rs. 64 lacs. > (iv) Minus dealers profit of Rs. 2.40 lacs, net revenue loss has been worked > out at Rs. > 61.6 lacs. > 4 > (v) On the basis of the annual returns of the plaintiff, average profit > having been worked > out over the last 4 years, evidence of this witness establishes that the > gross profit of the > plaintiff being 32.1%, loss of profit to the plaintiff comes to Rs. 19.75 > lacs. > 7. Affidavit of Mr. Vikas Arora proved as Ex.P.8 by Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi > establishes that when he approached defendant No. 1 for sale of a computer, > defendant > No. 1 agreed to sell a computer loaded with the following software of the > plaintiff:- > (a) Visual Studio 6.0 > (b) MS Windows 98 > (c) MS Office 2000. > 8. Affidavit further establishes that defendant No. 1 did not issue a formal > bill/cash memo > but handed over his business card in which name of defendant No. 2 was > printed showing > said defendant to be a dealer in computers and electronic components. The > affidavit of > Mr. Vikas Arora further establishes that on his instances defendant No. 1 > gave a bill > dated 3.9.2002 pertaining to sale of a computer. The bill does not list any > software, > software literature or CD being sold. > 9. Annexure P.9 proved by Shri Nikhil Krishnamurthi, being the affidavit of > Mr. Sunil > John, a computer expert, proves that the hard disk of the computer purchased > by Mr. > Vikas Arora was being loaded, by the defendants with the software of the > plaintiff. > 10. Evidence on record establishes that Mr. Nikhil Krishnamurthi is > competent to file and > institute the suit on behalf of the plaintiff. The verification of the > plaint is in order. > Evidence also establishes that the plaintiff is the registered proprietor of > the trade > mark/name MICROSOFT and that the copyright in the computer software > programmes:- > (a) MS Windos 98, (b) MS Office 2000 and (c) MS Visual Studio 6.0 vests in > the > plaintiff. > 11. Evidence further establishes hard disk piracies by the defendants. It > establishes that > the defendants are pirating software of the plaintiff and are loading the > same on the hard > disk of the computers sold by said defendants without permission from the > plaintiff. > 12. Though assumptive i.e. based on the assumption of sale of 100 computers > each year and on the basis of the popularity of the computer software, as > also sold > computers being loaded with the pirated software, loss of profit to the > stands > established. > 13. It may be true that the financial loss is based on certain assumption, > but it cannot be > helped for the reason the defendant has chosen to remain ex-parte. > 14. Assertion of the witnesses of the plaintiff that the plaintiff has a > copyright in the > pirated software has gone unrebutted. > 5 > 15. Evidence on record establishes that the defendants are engaged in the > business of > assembling computers and sale to the public under the name of defendant No. > 2. > 16. Before a computer can function to carry out the tasks required by its > owner, it has to > be properly loaded with one or more operating systems. The operating system > is nothing > but a software contained in a CD. The defendants are supplying computers > pre-loaded > with the software of the plaintiff. > 17. The software being pre-loaded in the computers sold by defendants is a > software, > copyright whereof vests in the plaintiff. > 18. Unchallenged evidence of the witnesses of the plaintiff noted above > which includes > the sown affidavit of an employee of the plaintiff, defendants are proved to > be pirating > the software of the plaintiff. > 19. It stands established that the defendants have infringed the plaintiffs > copyright by > making illicit copies of the operating systems software by openly copying > whatever > operating system is currently salable. As observed in Microsoft Corporation > v. > Electrowide Ltd. and Anr. (1997) FSR 580 by Mr. Justice Laddy of the High > Court of > Justice, Chancery Division, this constitutes a general threat to infringe > the copyright in > the class of software. > 20. Defendants are in the business of sale of computers. One can safely > presume that they > had knowledge that the products being sold were infringing copies. > 21. Plaintiff is a world renowned computer software company. Plaintiff would > be entitled > to the wide ranging injunctions to restrain any further infringement of its > intellectual > property rights in any of its software at the hands of the defendants. > Plaintiff would also > be entitled to an order for the delivery-up forthright by the defendants. > Plaintiff would > also be entitled to damages for the reason that it would be futile to direct > the defendants > to render accounts for the reason that the defendants have been carrying on > business > surreptitiously. > 22. Suit is accordingly decreed in terms of prayers 'A' to 'D' of the > plaint, as noted in para > above. Suit is further decreed by awarding the plaintiff > compensation/damages against > the defendants in the sum of Rs. 19.75 lacs. Damages awarded are payable by > the > defendants jointly and severally. Damages awarded shall carry interest @ 9% > p.a. from > the date of decree till date of payment. > 23. Plaintiff would be entitled to costs. > 24. Decree be prepared on the plaintiff making up the deficiency in court > fee in respect of > the damages which have been awarded. > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > commons-law mailing list > commons-law at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > > End of commons-law Digest, Vol 26, Issue 6 > ****************************************** > From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Sun Sep 11 14:20:22 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 09:50:22 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] Whose Planning and on whose behalf and the slums that save us! In-Reply-To: <2514.203.122.39.30.1126341951.squirrel@mail.architexturez.net> Message-ID: <20050911085022.45912.qmail@web8407.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear all, a consideration of the plans that surround us. First, an except from an email sent to me (despite its duslism): New Orleans vs. Mumbai Inches of rain in new orleans due to hurricane katrina... 18" mumbai (July 27th).... 37.1" population of new orleans... 484,674 population of mumbai.... 12,622,500 deaths in new orleans within 48 hours of katrina...100 deaths in mumbai within 48hours of rain.. 37. number of people to be evacuated in new orleans... entire city..wohh number of people evacuated in mumbai...10,000 Cases of shooting and violence in new orleans... Countless Cases of shooting and violence in mumbai.. NONE Time taken for US army to reach new orleans... 48hours Time taken for Indian army and navy to reach mumbai... 12hours status 48hours later...new Orleans is still waiting for relief, army and electricity status 48hours later. Mumbai is back on its feet and is business is as usual USA ...world's most developed nation India ...third world country *************** SB: I was reminded in a comment in Sukuntu Mehta's book Maximum City that if the same population density of Mumbai lived more commonly in the US, systems including 'law and order' would break down -- or something like that. And one needs to read even more vivid description of daily city life in 'Shantaram' (Gregory Roberts) to suggest that perhaps the wonderful thing about cities is the way economic, political, legality, and social space gets redefined -- a fluidness far benond the moral positioning by planners -- espicially those arguing for 'participatory planning'. Moving beyond the moralistic and into systems of control, the point in the comparasion with New Orleans is the way cities and towns in the US and UK are located in a system of stringent control made possible by planning. One only has to read accounts in books like 'Black Corona' about participatory planning in NYC and its politics, or then the experience of urban renewal in Boston of the 1960s and 70s, or accounts of Madhu Sarin's Chandigarh, or Fedric Thomas's Calcutta, to appreciate that what really works in Mehta's and Shantaram's Bombay is that it is slummified so well! I refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and if the participatory process is linked to that or not. Instead I am pointing to the centrality of politics, the value of anachism, of fluidity, of un-predictability, which planners and administrators find great unease. More recently, they are joined by donors, organizations like HDFC, ICICI, FICCI, CII, or CEOs like Kiran Mazumdar Shah (Biocon) or Philips' CEO Bob Hoeskatra -- all seeking to make our cities globally competitive. Why is it for instance, that the recent book by Jagmohan reads so much like the essays of Kalpana Sharma, or that the manifesto of the bangalore Social Forum like that of the FICCI and CII (except for two points of inc. FDI, and land acquistion!)? What is the conceptual value of having fuzzy categories like Civil Soceity, decentralization, participation, planning, 'the law', good governance, 'balancing needs and resources in equitable and efficient ways', when all these essentially refer processes of politics? well, more later Solly --- AZplan wrote: > Hi > I get the impression that the planning role > contemplated for ULBs in the > 74th is being confused with Master Plan / CDP. These > are complementary but > different levels of plans. The 74th itself does not > contemplate either CDP > by ULBs or substitution of CDP with local area > planning by ULBs. > Justifications for urbanism alternatives (without > CDP) need to be > constructed on basis other than the 74th. The > *constitutional* position > requires CDP / Master Plan / city region plans under > statutes for those > (many of which also settle processes for sub-city / > zonal plans) and > within their ambit, under ULB Acts duly modified in > view of the 74th, > sub-zonal / local / use-premise plans by ULBs. (the > 74th does not repeal > other planning / development Acts!) > > The planning process under the 74th remains fuzzy, > but processes for > plan-making and modification, inclusive of > participation at various stages > including by ULBs at all stages, are well settled > under the CDP etc > regimes (and since these are designed to achieve > overall planning purpose > of balancing needs and resources in equitable and > efficient ways, an > *elitist* CDP is likely to have emerged out of a > process that is outright > illegal rather than merely vaguely > *unconstitutional*). > > Regardless of whether all consider it necessary to > come to grips with the > concept of planning, it is necessary for all > inclined to participate in > planning to be clear about the level of plan in > which they wish to > participate (for responsible participation and also > so as not to infringe > the rights of others to participate) and to ensure > that they participate > in a manner that strengthens rather than undermines > the statutory > processes that guarantee the right to participate > (at various levels in > different ways). > > What seems to be happening is that in name of 74th > constittional amendment > statutory processes for participation in CDP / > Master Plan are being > eroded while even a minimal systemic approach to > participation at the > local area plan level has yet to be articulated. > This is even as the same > logic that argues against a CDP based approach > argues also for > participation at various levels and stages of > urbanism. It is all very > well to take issue with the *centrality of a statist > process like the > Plan* through CDP Public Notice, but it would be > meaningful only if > accompanied by a complete visualisation of an > alternative urbanism, with > its institutions. I am even inclined to posit that > otherwise it would be > *unconstitutional*, which is fine as an academic > exercise as long as it > does not make illegal / unconstitutional CDP > mechanics an issue! > > (I speak from recent experience of engaging with > Delhi Master Plan > revision since it started in 1999-2000. These > engagements include revival > of Public Notice process, in a Zonal Plan level case > in 2002 against an > ad-hoc scheme to precipitate Public Notice, to which > over 1700 families > responded in context of Zonal level plan > entitlements and prior efforts in > their pursuit. There have been about two dozen > Public Notices since then > before the Master Plan Public Notice itself. I am > also associated with > some court matters on grounds of lapses in statutory > participation > processes (invariably on account of extra-statutory > participatory > processes). I am posting this only for information > of this perspective of > participation in planning, in continuation of a > previous post containing > the link to where some of the engagements in Delhi > are loosely chronicled: > http://plan.architexturez.net/site/). > > cheers > Gita Dewan Verma, Planner > > > > > 9th September 2005 > > > > Hello! > > > > Interesting debate! I think at the base of > tensions are the tensions > > between > > the modern and the post-modern. Many of us are > cought up in this tension > > and > > are subtely experiencing the resergence of the > post-modern. The questions > > such as... > > > > > > a) What constitutes 'civil society' and the nature > of > >>'debate'? > >>b) are the 'affected people' passive reciepients" > >>c) what are the various forms of politics that we > can > >>visualize? is it that of the day to day, that of > >>election time? that at particular levels of > >>government? > >>d) Which part or section of 'breaucracy'? > >> > > ...those raised by Solly are vocal testimony to > this. The legitimacy that > > represantative politics enjoyed is suddenly > finding its base being > > systematically invaded. Those of us including > 'civil organisations' are > > not > > able make sense as to what has hit them. Now that > post-modern ideas are > > gaining significant ground there is increased > questioning of the > > represantative model that has been the hall mark > of modernism for few > > centuries. This also includes the questioning of > election based politics > > and focus on everyday politics. Also the > transformation in concept of > > 'public' as passive resipient to active subjects > without any need for > > 'represantative' cover from any one. > > > > Those of us grounded in modernist ideas are > finding it increasingly > > challenging, first to comprehend and then to > transform the long held dear > > ideas! 'Civil Society' is pregnant with this > tension to define itself yet > > again and guard against elitist take over and > hegemonize. > > > > I have thought through these issues after > participating in the last > > workshop > > of Sarai on August 30-31 2005 as part of > Sarai-CSDS student stipenship for > > year 2004-05 specially the inputs from Solly, > Prabhu Mahapatra, Sadan Jha, > > Aarti and Deepu and with my discussions there > after with Lillian D'Costa > > from Goa. > > > > Sebastian Rodrigues. > > > > > > > >>From: solomon benjamin > >>To: jayaraj s > >>CC: urbanstudygroup at sarai.net > >>Subject: Re: [Urbanstudy] who is the "public", > what is the 'plan',and who > >>consults on whose behalf? > >>Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 17:15:27 +0100 (BST) > >> > >>Hi, a useful response and some more questions -- > esp > >>on the last lines: > >>civil society organisations analyse and expose the > === message truncated === __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From tahir.amin at btopenworld.com Sun Sep 11 19:16:52 2005 From: tahir.amin at btopenworld.com (TAHIR AMIN) Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 14:46:52 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] Access denied Message-ID: <20050911134652.54253.qmail@web86111.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Access denied This is the golden age of the internet, a time of glorious anarchy where information is free and anyone, rich or poor, can blog their views to the world. But government and big business are moving in - the clampdown has started. Rafael Behr Sunday September 11, 2005 The Observer Jamie McCoy used to have his own patch on a London street. It was a strip of the Victoria Embankment where he would sit every day and beg. He might have earned enough money by mid-morning to convert his cup of grimy copper coins into a crisp note and then convert his crisp note into a bag of heroin. Then he would go back to work, begging to get some breakfast. He lived on the streets for 30 years. Jamie had a buddy. No one survives on the streets on their own. They had been knocking around together, homeless and wasted for what seemed like their whole lives. Then, one day, the buddy lay down in the middle of the road and died. 'I thought he was just having one of his naps. He used to do that, just lie down and have a sleep wherever he stood,' says Jamie over a pint and a cigarette in an east London pub. 'That affected me a lot.' Jamie started to feel lonely. Around a year later, he found himself sharing a hit with a young woman, barely out of her teens. She looked twice her age. She reminded him of himself a lifetime ago. This time, he felt lonely and angry. He threw his last bag of heroin off Waterloo Bridge, wen to a shelter run by Crisis, the homelessness charity, and withdrew from the drug, from his old self. That was five years ago. Jamie learned to read and write, stuff he had missed at school. He loved it. And sitting at a computer in the London office of Crisis, he discovered the web. Here was a place where Jamie was not an ex-junkie. Here, Jamie was a one-man publishing empire, broadcasting the experience of homelessness to the world through Jamie's Big Voice, his blog. 'I think of it as an independent newspaper,' he says with pride. 'A newspaper that I can trust, because all the sources in it are mine.' Jamie's Big Voice gets readers from around the world, sometimes in their hundreds, sometimes in their thousands. He was invited to a party in Westminster where the Speaker of the House of Commons claimed to be a reader of the blog. That pleased Jamie. It could only happen now, early in the 21st century, the time when a homeless bloke with a borrowed computer can have the same reach around the world as Rupert Murdoch. It is a precious and fragile moment, a golden age of web democracy. And all just under 15 years since the internet ceased to be a thing - a network of computers - and became a place. That was when Tim Berners-Lee, a British scientist based in Switzerland, developed a way of linking documents to each other in a big web. That was when the frontier to a new society was opened. That was when it became possible for Jamie McCoy to swap a patch of the Embankment for a plot of the web. The size of Jamie's audience depends on who has linked to him. And blogging is all about links, a line of code that turns a piece of information into a destination, a refutation, a rebuttal, a recommendation. One new blog is started every couple of seconds. The total number is hard to estimate because no one agrees on the definition. Around 15 million is a conservative guess. The total number of pages on the web is around 600 billion, or 100 per person on the planet. The number of people with some access to the web is around one billion. But today's bloggers occupy a special role. They are, in fact, the second-generation web citizens, the first being the pioneer geeks who developed their sites in the early Nineties. Unlike the trailblazers, the new wave needed no significant technical know-how. Most of them don't speak the programming languages from which their blogs are built. They occupy digital prefabs and trailers crafted from easy-to-use, free software. They eke out an audience through the barter of tips, links and files. Their currency is trust. The community is open to all, self-policing, keen on transparency and ruthless about dishonesty. In an era whose triumphant idea is capitalism, where success is generally measured in the accumulation of wealth, it is hard to conceive of a parallel society established and self-governed on principles of trust and common ownership. But it exists. The biggest aggregation of human experience and knowledge ever created belongs to everyone, it is available on demand and it is free. But for how long? Ranged against the new culture of digital freedom is a strange coalition of spooks, suits and vandals. There are governments unable to resist the technology that can track our every move; there are corporations lusting after the attention of the 2 billion eyeballs focused on screens; and there are the spammers, clogging up the net with junk mail, hijacking computers to peddle trash. 'The internet, the first many-to-many medium, was going to liberate us from the tyranny of centralised media and the rancid consumerism that says we are merely receptacles for what Big Business, including Big Media, wants us to buy,' writes Dan Gillmor, a San Francisco-based writer, in We the Media: Grassroots Journalism by the People for the People. 'But the clampdown has begun. Everywhere we look, the forces of centralisation and authority are finding ways to slow and, perhaps, halt altogether the advances we've made.' Gillmor is a chronicler of Citizen Media, the movement to transform news and entertainment from a one-way transaction (we make, you consume) to a conversation (we all make, we all swap). Taking its form from the web, it is oceanic, vast and shapeless. It has no leadership, although it has some poster children - Wikipedia, the excellent, collaboratively built encyclopedia; Ohmynews, the Korean newspaper written by its readers - but it is bigger than any site. It is big enough to strike envy and fear into businessmen and politicians. Governments have been slow to appreciate the social changes effected by technologies, but quick to see their potential application for exerting control and invading privacy. Bloggers have already been harassed and imprisoned by repressive regimes around the world. China has successfully walled off the entire internet for millions of users. The technology that enables governments to hoard emails and trace every click of the mouse across the web is too alluring for liberal democracies to ignore. Web snooping will almost certainly form a part of UK anti-terror legislation later this year. Then there are the big media and entertainment corporations of the US. They are peeved because their audience is being poached by a DIY army of online publishers and broadcasters. Big Media also own the copyright to most of the English-speaking world's popular culture, a resource that is systematically plundered, mashed up, remixed, copied and passed around the web. Not surprisingly, the owners don't like it when people share their intellectual property around without paying dues. Stealing, they call it. They will sue if they catch you. If you are too young, they will sue your parents. Business also lobbies hard for politicians to make that sort of thing even more against the law than it already is. The result, say the citizen journalists, is a repressive intellectual property regime that stomps on creativity. The media companies see the remixers and swappers as apologists for piracy and organised crime. 'Most of those currently in the hallways of power have no clue about digital technologies or the cultural shift now taking place,' says JD Lasica, executive director of Ourmedia.org, an online creative archive. 'The entertainment industries still wield considerable clout on Capitol Hill.' But for most web citizens, the trench warfare that goes on between digital freedom fighters and Hollywood studios is not the problem. The online party for them is being spoiled by the crooks, pervs and fraudsters. Sharon Lemon is in charge of policing Web UK and she doesn't let her children visit internet chatrooms. She isn't hysterical about the threat of paedophiles, but nor is she naive. As Detective Chief Superintendent of the National Hi-Tech Crime Unit, she knows the score. DCS Lemon used to head Operation Ore, the excavation of Britain's underground child pornography network. When it started digging, it found 7,000 people. That was in 1998, when plenty of Britons didn't have internet access. That means it isn't all just a moral panic. There really are a lot of people who use the net for child porn. DCS Lemon is in a good position to see how accurately the web reflects the world that created it. All of human experience is there, including the dark side. And, without any borders, it is very hard to police. 'If anything, the internet works for criminals much better than it does for anyone else,' she says. 'It gives all the advantages of global networking without any of the constraints of the law.' If you shut down an illegal site in Manchester, the same stuff appears the next day in Moscow. In addition to the paedophiles, police are chasing a new global breed of robbers, blackmailers and money launderers. Meanwhile, creeping up the political agenda is hate crime and the propagation of terrorist ideas by internet. A technology novice could easily conclude from newspaper reports that the portion of the web not published by reputable media companies has been colonised exclusively by sex offenders, jihadi fundamentalists and a few crackpot conspiracy theorists. Not so, says DCS Lemon: 'You have to work to the theory that most people are generally good.' But for large media owners, fear of the poorly lit, sinister back alleys of the web is useful. It drives people into 'walled gardens', safe havens of manicured web content, provided on subscription; guaranteed free of bad guys; well stocked with familiar brands. The problem with walled gardens is that people get bored. They hanker for the vagaries of life on the frontier. Once there, they soon discover that the dark side does not leap out at you; you have to hunt it down. The medium isn't to blame. That is what makes the web a 'pull' medium. You make the show yourself, another reason why traditional media are flummoxed. They only know how to push stuff down the pipes. They keep building walls around the garden as fast as the web users breach them. Rupert is 74 years old and, by his own admission, a bit long in the tooth for this internet malarkey. The next generation, he feels, get it better. 'I'm a digital immigrant. I wasn't weaned on the web, nor coddled on a computer,' Murdoch said in April. 'My two young daughters, on the other hand, will be digital natives.' Murdoch was speaking earlier this year to the American Society of Newspaper Editors. He had been invited in his capacity as chief executive of News Corporation. News Corp had, until recently, generally failed to grasp the significance of the web. Its few ventures online had failed. But, suddenly, there is vim in the old empire. 'The digital native doesn't send a letter to the editor any more. She goes online and starts a blog. We need to be the destination for those bloggers,' he said. Deed followed word. News Corp has set aside a war chest of $1-2bn for online developments. It recently bought Intermix Media, owner of Myspace.com, a self-contained community of blogs for teens and twentysomethings. Murdoch is also in the market for a search engine. The News Corp strategy can be simply pieced together: take possession of the web allotments that all but the most hardened geeks depend on to pitch their blogging tents, then rent them out; sweeten the deal with privileged access to music and movies. The goal must be to marshal the energy that bloggers currently expend on creating their own content into the consumption of industry-manufactured, pay-per-view content. Big Media want to retain the marketable frisson of Citizen Media and weed out the current culture of activism. The way to achieve this is by monopolising not only the copyright material that web users like to play with, but the tools that make it so easy for them to play. 'Nearly every day brings word of an entertainment company forming an alliance with a technology provider to corral an audience into walled gardens and force it to behave in a certain way,' warns Lasica. Noam Chomsky, linguist and media commentator, agrees: 'Major efforts are being made by the corporate owners and advertisers to shape the internet so that it will be mostly used for commerce, diversion and so on. Then those who wish to use it for information, political organising and other such activities will have a harder time.' Within 10 years, there will be no distinction between software companies, phone networks, search engines, movie studios and internet service providers. There will just be Web plc. To experience it, you will have to pay. It is scarcely credible that, initially, all commerce was forbidden on the internet. Only gradually did the engineers and scientists running the hardware infrastructure of the net relax the rules. Last year, consumer trade online was worth $300bn. To be fair to capitalism, the introduction of a profit motive created a spurt of innovation and growth. When Google started, it promised in its charter to 'do no evil'. It wanted to organise the world's information and it was good at it. So the web made sure everyone knew about this wonderful innovation. Google has never had to advertise. But now, there is a growing feeling in the blogosphere that Google (worth around $50bn) has crossed the line. The power that it has over the way people search the web, and the data the company can amass about every individual user, is starting to look less like a project to organise the world's information and more like a bid to own it. The geeks have fallen out of love. Google, they say, has turned evil. Not that that makes any difference. The web has been haranguing and maligning Microsoft as the embodiment of evil for years, because of the way it won't share anything - its codes, its platforms, its secrets. But around 95 per cent of the world's computers still run MS software. Bill Gates is still the richest man in the world. And that is the problem for the current generation of web citizens. They are neither the aristocrats, nor the foot soldiers of the net. They are simply its conscience and they will scream and shout as the web is carved up and sold off. Jamie McCoy has few illusions about the current era of great web equality: 'As soon as someone finds a way to really make a lot of money out of blogging, that will kill it,' he says. Not everyone is pessimistic. In fact, a lot of long-term web users are utopian about the future. All the hyperbole that was first draped around the web has proved inadequate. In the way it transforms and accelerates the communication of ideas between individuals and societies, it is about as big as the invention of the alphabet. And it is free. But for how long? The machinery of government and big business is only just beginning to understand the scale of the web. The culture of common purpose that prevails today is a product of neglect as much as design. The real gold rush has barely begun. To experience the sharing culture of the blogosphere today is like living in a commune built on an oil field. One day, the diggers will move in. Ours is the last generation that will remember the analogue world and feel the difference between the two realms. For the next generation of digital natives, the web will be a slick, commercial machine. It will be just as big as the world we currently live in and it will be just as ruthless and as corrupt. I hope I am wrong. I listen to today's web gurus, the people who preach freedom, and am fired with enthusiasm for the new digital society of the future. But I fear the odds are against them. An excess of idealism only seems to prove that the golden age of the web is, in fact, right now. --------------------------------- To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050911/02c705b0/attachment.html From vivek at sarai.net Mon Sep 12 13:51:55 2005 From: vivek at sarai.net (Vivek Narayanan) Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 13:51:55 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] call for proposals: 2005-2006 Sarai Independent Fellowship Programme Message-ID: <43253AA3.6000901@sarai.net> CALL FOR PROPOSALS – SARAI-CSDS INDEPENDENT FELLOWSHIPS, 2005-06 Applications are invited for the upcoming cycle of Sarai-CSDS Independent Research Fellowships. The Sarai Programme, Centre for the Study of Developing Societies, Delhi Sarai is a programme of the Centre for the Study of Developing Societies (CSDS), Delhi. CSDS is one of India's best known research centres, with traditions of dissent and a commitment to the work of the public intellectual going back four decades. The Sarai Programme at CSDS was initiated in 2000 as a platform for discursive and creative collaboration between theorists, researchers and practitioners actively engaged in reflecting on contemporary urban spaces in South Asia—their politics, built form, ecology, culture and history—as well as on the histories, practices and politics of information and communication technologies, the public domain and media forms. For more information, visit www.sarai.net *The Purpose of the Independent Fellowship* The Sarai-CSDS Independent Fellowships allow the time for individuals from diverse backgrounds to either begin or continue research into specific aspects of media and urban culture and society, broadly and creatively defined, and to also think carefully and rigorously about the various public forms in which their research might be rendered. We are also interested in using the materials generated through the research to continue to build up our thematic archive of research on the city. Thus, we see the fellowship as an important source for this archive. Finally, an important purpose of the fellowship program is to spark, overlap and allow access to newly emerging research networks across disciplines, academic and non-academic institutions, organisations, practices, geographical locations and professional backgrounds. We are thus invested in the idea of what we call public and distributed research, where new knowledge is created and shaped from a variety of locations, and not just in a top-down fashion. Participants in the fellowship programme are expected to have a very strong and independent motivation towards the pursuit of their own specialised areas of research, but also to respond to and critique the research of others in the programme as intelligent non-specialists, and be open to suggestions and comments from non-specialists. Each year, a large number of the fellowships are awarded to projects that deploy standard methodologies and forms from the humanities and social sciences towards what we feel are justly deserving, new and emergent areas of research. However, a significant number of fellowships are also awarded to projects that are innovative both in terms of what they consider to be research, as well as the variety of purposes and forms to which that research is applied. As a result, we encourage the inclusion of individuals with little or no previous formal research experience who want to pursue, more rigorously, a passion for a tightly-focused, feasible, understudied research topic; and equally, we encourage individuals with seasoned research experience in a conventional context to experiment with forms that are relatively new to them. For detailed abstracts of successful proposals from previous years, please visit www.sarai.net and click on the link for "Independent Fellowships" on the left-hand sidebar. *Conditions* --For administrative purposes, applicants are required to be resident in India, and to have an account in any bank operating in India. --Applications can be in Hindi or in English. The research work and presentation can also be in either Hindi, English, or a combination of the two languages. --The research fellowship will run from January 2006 to the end of August 2006 and award between Rs 30,000 and Rs. 60,000 during this period. --Fellows will be required to make a minimum of six postings, one per month, on Sarai's "reader-list" email listserve, between January and the end of June 2006. --A working draft or initial prototype of the final work will be expected by the end of July 2006. The final presentation of the research project will be made in Delhi at the end of August 2006. --The fellowships do not require the fellows to be resident at Sarai. --Although participation in the fellowship programme does require a substantial time commitment—to the research, the postings on progress, and interaction with other researchers and projects in the fellowship cycle—participants are also welcome to pursue the fellowship research in addition to their primary occupations or commitments to other fellowships or grants, if any. --Proposals from teams, partnerships, collectives and faculty are welcome, as long as the grant amount is administered by and through a single individual, and the funds are deposited in a single bank account in the name of an individual, partnership, registered body or institutional entity. --Applicants who apply to other institutions for support for the same project will not be disqualified, provided they inform Sarai if and when support is being sought (or has been obtained) from another institution. The applicants should also inform Sarai about the identity of the other institution. *What Do You Need To Send, Where and When?* There are no application forms. Simply send us by postal mail your: 1. Name(s), email address(es), phone(s), and postal address(es). 2. Proposal (not more than 1200 words) including details of the subject, process, mode of public presentation and rationale for the research. Your proposal will be greatly strengthened if you are also able to indicate the kinds of materials that you think your research project would be able to generate for the Sarai archive. In the past, fellows have submitted transcripts of interviews, photographs, recordings, printed matter, maps, multimedia and posters, related to the subject of their study, to this archive. 3. Two work samples: if possible, the samples of previous work done should give us a sense of your preferred mode of public presentation for this project (e.g., academic research paper, narrative prose, multimedia, video, performance, photography, installation, sound recording, "creative" writing, prototype design, combinations of the above, etc.) and also suggest to us how you might understand your upcoming research process for this fellowship. The work samples can—but do not necessarily have to—make reference to the current research topic. 4. A clear work plan (not more than one page) with, if possible, a month-by-month breakdown of the research work. 5. An updated CV (not more than two pages) for each applicant. --Send these to: ATTN: I-FELLOWS PROPOSAL 2005-2006, Independent Fellowship Programme, Sarai, Centre for the Study of Developing Societies, 29 Rajpur Road, Delhi 110054, India. --Enquiries: vivek at sarai.net for English proposals, ravikant at sarai.net for Hindi proposals. --Last date for submission: proposals should be postmarked on or before Monday, October 31, 2005. --The list of successful proposals for 2005-2006 will be announced on the Sarai website, and on Sarai's email list, reader-list at sarai.net, towards the end of December 2005. For more details on joining the reader-list, please visit www.sarai.net and click on "LISTS at Sarai". *Who Can Apply? * There is absolutely no pre-qualification required for application to the Sarai-CSDS Independent Fellowship. Sarai invites independent researchers, media practitioners, working professionals, software designers and programmers, urbanists, architects, artists and writers, as well as students (postgraduate level and above) and university/college faculty to apply for support for research-driven projects. *What Other Fellowships Does Sarai Offer?* Sarai offers an exciting "Student Stipendship" for students at academic institutions wishing to pursue closely mentored and innovative research (contact: sadan at sarai.net) and a "FLOSS Independent Fellowship" for programmers and coders wishing to develop free and open source software (contact: viyyer at sarai.net). Please note that the Sarai Media Fellowships have been discontinued. MORE INFORMATION *New Directions for the Independent Fellowship Programme in 2006* The new design for the Independent Fellowships will include: --Systematic and regular monthly offline meets for fellowship holders in each of our major metros. --Use of a list dedicated to discussion and critique in Hindi. --Facilitation of more interaction, both from Sarai and also between fellowship holders in different locations. *Why Research? What Do We Mean by Research? * Sarai is committed to generating public knowledge and creativity through research. Hence the support for research driven projects and processes. The fellowships are in the nature of small grants in order to emphasise the initiation and founding of projects that would otherwise go unsupported. By research we mean both archival and field research, and forays into theoretical work as well as any process or activity of an experimental or creative nature—for instance in the audiovisual media, as well as in journalism or the humanities and social sciences, or in architecture and socially attuned computing. We are especially interested in supporting projects that formulate precise and cogent intellectual questions, reflect on modes of understanding that implicate knowledge production within a critical social framework, foregrounding processes of gathering information and of creating links between bodies of information. We also encourage research that is based on a strong engagement with archival materials and imaginative ways of tackling the question of the public rendition of research activity. *The Experience of Previous Years* This is the fifth year in which Sarai is calling for proposals for such fellowships. We would like to describe how the process has worked in previous years, as an indication of what applicants should expect. These included work toward projects based on investigative reportage of urban issues; essays on everyday life; a history of urban Dalit performance traditions; soundscapes of the city; a graphic novel about Delhi; a documentation of the free software movement in India; research on displacement and rehabilitation in cities; interpretative catalogues of wall writings and public signages; digital manipulation of popular studio portrait photographs; the limitations of language in shrinking public spaces in Srinagar; histories of cinema halls and studios in Delhi, Mumbai and Kolkata; a study of the world of popular crime fiction in Bengali; reflections on the Kashmiri 'encounter' in Delhi, and many others. Successful applicants included freelance researchers, academics, media practitioners, artists, writers, journalists, activists and professionals such as nurses and bankers. The projects were submitted in English, Hindi or a combination of the two languages. We have seen that projects that set important but practical and modest goals were usually successful, whereas those that may have been conceptually sound but lacked sufficient motivation to actually pursue a research objective on the field, usually did not take off beyond the interim stage. Sarai interacts closely with the researchers over the period of the fellowship, and the independent fellows make a public presentation of their work at Sarai at the end of their fellowship period. During the term of their fellowship each fellow is required to make a posting to our email list every month, reporting on the development of their work. These postings, which are archived, are an important means by which the research process reaches a wider discursive community. They also help us to trace the progress of work during the grant period, and understand how the research interfaces with a larger public. Submissions at the end of the fellowship period included written reports and essays, photographs, tape recordings, audio CDs, video, pamphlets, maps, drawings and html presentations. Fellows have made their final presentations in the form of academic papers, lecture-demonstrations and performances. *What Happens to the Research Projects?* The annual research projects add to our increasingly substantial archival collections on urban space and media culture. These are proving to be very significant value additions to the availability of knowledge resources in the public domain. Researchers are free to publish or render any part or all of their projects in any forms, independently of Sarai (but with due acknowledgment of the support that they have received from Sarai). Sarai Independent Research Fellows have gone on to publish articles in journals, work towards the making of films, exhibitions, websites, multimedia works and performances, and the creation of graphic novels, soundworks and books. We actively encourage all such efforts. *What We Are Looking For* As in the past, this year too we are looking for proposals that are imaginatively articulated, experimental and methodologically innovative, but which are pragmatic and backed up by a well-argued work plan which sets out a timetable for the project, as well as suggests how the support will help with specific resources (human and material) that the project needs. Suggested Themes: Sarai's interests lie in the city and in media. Broadly speaking, any proposal that looks at the urban condition, or at media, is eligible. Proposals for projects that seek to push disciplinary limits and boundaries or break new ground, that offer fresh and detailed empricial insights, that desire to engage with questions and problems pertaining to cities, urban culture, media from a philosophically and conceptually enriched terrain of inquiry are especially welcome. We are committed to methodological and analytic rigour even as we are also keen to engage with sensibilities and registers of thought that are oppositional, dissident, heretical, imaginative and poetic. More specifically, themes may be as diverse as the experience of work in different locations, institutions and work cultures, histories of urban sexuality, heretical figures and imaginations, histories of particular media practices, legality and illegality, migration, transportation, surveillance, intellectual property, social/digital interfaces, urban violence, street life, technologies of urban control, health and the city, the political economy of media forms, digital art and culture, or anything else that the applicants feel will resonate with the philosophy and interests that motivate Sarai's work. We are particularly interested in work that comes from non-metropolitan and mofussil urban spaces, even though we continue to look for strong projects that articulate the realities of major cities. From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Tue Sep 13 18:35:40 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 14:05:40 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] For the people, by diktat article on NURM In-Reply-To: <20050913122358.89564.qmail@web54703.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050913130540.95666.qmail@web8408.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi I think Vinay's posting, despite its lenght, is important to consider how we conceptualise cities, new constests over law and legal process, and the varied forces inc. global ones that re-constitute them. As part of this, the Master Planning process and perhaps some of the normative discussion we have been having, the interesting historical material by Dipu and Sanjeev Srivastva on the Urban list, and the kind of fine grain reporting that Zainab excells at there. What do these tell us about what seems imposed via World Bank conditionalities on what are constitutional issues, with support of the Nation State (and the Min. of Finance no less)? more later, Cheers Solly --- Vinay Baindur wrote: > apologies for cross mailings > > For the people, by diktat > Reforms in urban governance are long overdue, and > the cities are croaking under the weight of their > neglect. But the National Urban Reforms Mission may > be too much medicine, bypassing citizen input and > consultation in a hasty drive for change. Vinay > Baindur reports. > > 05 September 2005 - Considering the increasing urban > angst, complaints against services, hobbled local > governments, land and money scams, corruption et > al., the history of efforts to tackle these problems > has been a tale of repeated false starts. Consider > the facts from recent years alone: In Sept 2001, the > Central Ministry of Urban Development launched the > Good Urban Governance Campaign in partnership with > the United Nations Development Programme and the > United Nations Centre for Human Settlements; this > was supported by the Urban Management Programme and > The Urban Governance Initiative. Subsequently the > GUGC became overshadowed by other urban schemes, and > disappeared soon after without a trace. Similarly, > throughout the tenure of the NDA government, a > National Urban Transport Policy, a National Slum > Policy, and a National Hawkers Policy were drafted, > but these were never finalised and implemented. > Now, the UPA government is leading a new charge on > the old problems; last year the Centre accepted an > increased disbursement of credit and grants for > urban issues from the World Bank group, based on its > Country Assistance Strategy 2004-07. The WB group > board approved this CAS in Sept 2004. Now, almost a > year later, a new more comprehensive but highly > debatable urban reforms agenda has been cobbled > together. > Like many previous efforts, this one too suffers > from a poor understanding of the nature of the > problems: considering that so many of the issues > involved have to do with local governments and > citizens' expectations of these, there has oddly > been little public or civil society consultation in > drafting the plans. Instead, there has been very > frenetic lobbying by the private sector, especially > from international and domestic real estate > consultancies, financial institutions, industry > confederations, etc. A predictable - and highly > undesirable - consequence of these selective inputs > is that the convergent interests of these players > have been turned into conditionalities within the > urban reforms agenda. > The proposed reforms agenda will create increased > demand for the privatisation of crucial municipal > services e.g. by urging States to adopt the Model > Municipal law (MML), and by amending their own > Corporations and Municipalities Acts. It is claimed > that the Model Municipal Law will enable urban local > bodies to play their roles more effectively and > efficiently. The MML includes specific provisions on > financial management of municipalities, municipal > revenue, urban environmental infrastructure and > services and regulatory jurisdiction. It is based on > a set of policy postulates developed by the Times > Research Foundation, Kolkata with funding from > FIRE-D, New Delhi (a USAID-funded effort engaged > with creating debt markets for urban water and > sanitation projects). > In line with the conditionalities, the World Bank > and the Asian Development Bank, along with the State > governments, are initiating a plethora of urban > development projects, such as the following: > > Karnataka Municipal Reform Project - Dec 2005 - WB > > > Karnataka Urban Water Supply project - March > 2005-2008 - WB > > > North Karnataka Urban Improvement Project - 2006 - > ADB > > > Kerala UDP - 2006- ADB > > > Uttaranchal UDP - 2006 - ADB > > > Looming ahead on the horizons of all these > individual efforts is the National Urban Renewal > Mission. With its sweeping scope, NURM will > certainly impact many of these schemes in a big way; > thus it is important to understand this mission, and > its implications for the abundant ongoing schemes > around the nation. Will NURM curb the exclusivist > tendencies of the individual programs and bring in > more citizen participation, or will it worsen the > already poor record of these programs on civic > engagement? > The National Common Minimum Programme (NCMP) adopted > by the UPA govt in May 2004 included a single > paragraph on urban issues, which states the > intention of the government to launch the National > Urban Renewal Mission. This has now crept up on us > in a rather nebulous shape, catching many citizens > of urban India unaware of the myriad nature and > implications of this mission for our cities. The > broad agenda of the NURM is purported to be to > strengthen democratic governance structures and > decentralisation in urban local government, though > it has still not been clearly articulated by the > Ministry of Urban Development or the Ministry of > Urban Employment and Poverty Alleviation how this > mission will be implemented to meet this objective. > Some of the directions for these ministries are, > however, now known. The Mid-Term Appraisal (MTA) of > the 10th Five Year Plan was discussed by the group > of Ministers who accepted it in July 2005; according > to the MTA, the ministries will go about > implementing the urban reforms agenda in the > following manner: > > Merge all schemes of the Government of India for > urban infrastructure and civic amenities. In future, > make normal levels of assistance available on a > platform of reforms. Such allocations would be > conditional on urban reforms being carried out by > the state governments and the urban local > governments [ULGs]. > > > Take up the 35 cities with million-plus populations, > the capital city in every state, and a small number > of other cities that are of historical importance > (about 60 cities in all) for a considerably enhanced > level of Plan assistance through the National Urban > Renewal Mission. > > > Undertake reforms in urban land ceiling laws, rent > control acts, and stamp duties (all supported by the > Urban Reforms Incentive Fund that has been in place > for some years now) in order to unleash housing > activity in the urban areas. For the urban poor, a > three-pronged approach is needed, involving > availability of land, cheap and easy credit, and > promotion of low cost building materials and > technology. > > > The National Urban Renewal Mission > NURM is to be a reforms-driven, fast-track, planned > development of identified cities with focus on > efficiency in urban infrastructure and services > delivery, community participation, and > accountability of local governments towards > citizens. The following broad framework is proposed > for the Mission: > > Central sponsorship > > > Sector-wise project reports would be prepared by > identified cities listing projects along with their > priorities. > > > The funding pattern would be 35:15:50 (between > Centre, States/ULGs and financial institutions) for > mega cities (>40 lakh population), 50:20:30 for > cities with populations between one and four > million, and 80:10:10 for other cities. > > > The grant assistance (both Central and State) would > act as seed money to leverage additional resources > from financial institutions/capital market. > > The Urban Reforms Incentive Fund (URIF) was launched > a few years back for conditional reforms based on > 'carrot and stick' financial measures to the state > government to carry out reforms. Some examples: > > > > Repeal of the Urban Land Ceiling and Regulation Act. > > > > Rationalisation of stamp duty in phases to bring it > down to no more than 5 per cent by the end of the > Tenth Plan period. > > > Reform of rent control laws to stimulate private > investment in rental Housing Schemes. > > > Introduction of computerised process of > registration. === message truncated === __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From prabhuram at gmail.com Wed Sep 14 14:20:08 2005 From: prabhuram at gmail.com (prabhu ram) Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 10:50:08 +0200 Subject: [Commons-Law] Google Gains Researcher; Microsoft Wins Limits Message-ID: <68752c9f050914015053e1fcbf@mail.gmail.com> http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/14/technology/14google.html?pagewanted=print Google Gains Researcher; Microsoft Wins Limits By JOHN MARKOFF SAN FRANCISCO, Sept. 13 - Google and Microsoft each claimed victory on Tuesday in the latest round of their bitter court dispute over a top researcher's defection to Google. For Google, though, the victory claim was backed by one clear-cut result: the researcher, Kai-Fu Lee, will be at work there on Wednesday. Ruling on Microsoft's request to extend a restraining order, a Seattle judge said Dr. Lee could proceed with helping to create a Google research center in China. But the judge, Steven C. Gonzalez of King County Superior Court, restricted him from working on some of his specialties - search and language technologies - or using information acquired while a Microsoft vice president. The dispute is an extension of the companies' increasing rivalry on each other's software turf, with Google offering a growing array of software programs and utilities that impinge on Microsoft's monopolies and Microsoft trying to gain ground in the search engine market. Their animosity has grown more acute, or at least more evident, since Google announced in July that it was hiring Dr. Lee, a Chinese computer scientist who established a Microsoft research center in China and more recently worked at Microsoft headquarters on speech recognition technology. The judge's ruling does not end the legal battle. A trial is scheduled to begin in Seattle in January in a Microsoft lawsuit seeking broad application of a noncompete clause in its contract with Dr. Lee. And even before then, the two sides will be court in October for a hearing on a countersuit that Google has filed in California. Microsoft's general counsel, Bradford L. Smith, said Tuesday night that the company was willing to settle if Google would accept the restraining order as written through next July 18, a year after Dr. Lee left. "We can settle this lawsuit tomorrow," Mr. Smith said, "if Google will agree to take today's preliminary injunction, keep every word without a single change, and agree to it as a permanent injunction that will last until July 18, 2006. We can avoid a trial, forgo paying outside lawyers, and get back to work competing in the marketplace." A Google spokesman, Steve Langdon, said: "We haven't heard from Microsoft, only reporters. If they have something they want to discuss we'd be happy to learn more about what they're offering." In a telephone interview, Dr. Lee said that he was thrilled to be getting down to work at Google. "Tomorrow morning I will be excitedly going to work," he said, "and shortly after that I will be flying to China." He said he would start on building a Google lab in China and "hiring great people." Google's associate general counsel, Nicole Wong, posted a note on Google's Web site stating, "A lot of legal process, but the bottom line is Dr. Lee is going to get busy." But Tom Burt, Microsoft's deputy general counsel, said the ruling denied Google the ability to use Dr. Lee effectively. In its ruling pending a trial, the court said that Google's use of Dr. Lee for recruiting related to its planned center in China, as well as nontechnical advice for Google about doing business there, would not violate his employment agreement with Microsoft, provided that he did not try to recruit Microsoft employees or use any confidential information. The court ruling restricts Dr. Lee from developing computer-search and natural-language technologies and also prohibits him from setting budget or compensation or defining the research and development to be undertaken at Google's China lab. Mr. Burt said the ruling converted Dr. Lee from being a crucial technical strategist to being a "highly overcompensated head of human resources and leasing manager." Ultimately the case may hinge on differences in employment law in Washington and California. Washington gives more power to corporations in enforcing "noncompete" agreements like the one Dr. Lee signed at Microsoft, which typically bar employees from going to work for rivals on directly competitive matters. Dr. Lee, 43, a respected technology figure in China, is about to publish a book there called "Be Your Personal Best." It is meant to help students combine the best aspects of Chinese and American culture, he said. The scientist himself is a product of both cultures. He became a prominent speech recognition researcher at Carnegie Mellon University and moved to Apple Computer before joining Microsoft in 1998. In an interview on Tuesday, he said he had been attracted to Google by the way products are designed and created there. Google has given its employees wide latitude in pursuing projects of their own design, permitting them to spend two days a week on their own activities. As for the lab in China, Dr. Lee said Google had not settled on a location, but thought it would most likely grow to about 50 researchers. "Any endeavor like this begins with getting the people," he said. While on sabbatical earlier this year, Dr. Lee approached Google about leaving Microsoft and then discussed the company's business before accepting a job in July. Depositions in the trial have revealed deep anger among top Microsoft executives over Google's recruitment of Microsoft talent. Google submitted testimony from Mark Lucovsky, a former high-ranking engineer at Microsoft, who said that when he told Microsoft's chief executive, Steven A. Ballmer, of his own plans to join Google, Mr. Ballmer threw a chair across the room and threatened to "kill" Google. Mr. Ballmer issued a statement calling the account a "gross exaggeration." -- Prabhu Ram, Max-Planck-Institut for Intellectual Property, Competition and Tax Law, MarstallPlatz 1, 80539 Munich GERMANY Tel: + 49 89 24246226 Mob: + 49 17629830521 Web: http://infoserve.blogspot.com From jaynakothari at justice.com Wed Sep 14 13:35:35 2005 From: jaynakothari at justice.com (Jayna Kothari) Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 08:05:35 +0000 (America/Los_Angeles) Subject: [Commons-Law] Whose Planning and on whose behalf and the slums that save us! Message-ID: <20050914080536.17228.fh039.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Dear Solly, I am just curious about some of the comments you made...... I > refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and if the > participatory process is linked to that or not. > Instead I am pointing to the centrality of politics, > the value of anachism, of fluidity, of > un-predictability, which planners and administrators > find great unease. while the centrality of politics is not really denied, what is thus value of anarchism or fluidity/unpredictability in planning that you are referring to? cheers, Jayna > > well, more later > Solly > > --- AZplan wrote: > > Hi > > I get the impression that the planning role > > contemplated for ULBs in the > > 74th is being confused with Master Plan / CDP. These > > are complementary but > > different levels of plans. The 74th itself does not > > contemplate either CDP > > by ULBs or substitution of CDP with local area > > planning by ULBs. > > Justifications for urbanism alternatives (without > > CDP) need to be > > constructed on basis other than the 74th. The > > *constitutional* position > > requires CDP / Master Plan / city region plans under > > statutes for those > > (many of which also settle processes for sub-city / > > zonal plans) and > > within their ambit, under ULB Acts duly modified in > > view of the 74th, > > sub-zonal / local / use-premise plans by ULBs. (the > > 74th does not repeal > > other planning / development Acts!) > > > > The planning process under the 74th remains fuzzy, > > but processes for > > plan-making and modification, inclusive of > > participation at various stages > > including by ULBs at all stages, are well settled > > under the CDP etc > > regimes (and since these are designed to achieve > > overall planning purpose > > of balancing needs and resources in equitable and > > efficient ways, an > > *elitist* CDP is likely to have emerged out of a > > process that is outright > > illegal rather than merely vaguely > > *unconstitutional*). > > > > Regardless of whether all consider it necessary to > > come to grips with the > > concept of planning, it is necessary for all > > inclined to participate in > > planning to be clear about the level of plan in > > which they wish to > > participate (for responsible participation and also > > so as not to infringe > > the rights of others to participate) and to ensure > > that they participate > > in a manner that strengthens rather than undermines > > the statutory > > processes that guarantee the right to participate > > (at various levels in > > different ways). > > > > What seems to be happening is that in name of 74th > > constittional amendment > > statutory processes for participation in CDP / > > Master Plan are being > > eroded while even a minimal systemic approach to > > participation at the > > local area plan level has yet to be articulated. > > This is even as the same > > logic that argues against a CDP based approach > > argues also for > > participation at various levels and stages of > > urbanism. It is all very > > well to take issue with the *centrality of a statist > > process like the > > Plan* through CDP Public Notice, but it would be > > meaningful only if > > accompanied by a complete visualisation of an > > alternative urbanism, with > > its institutions. I am even inclined to posit that > > otherwise it would be > > *unconstitutional*, which is fine as an academic > > exercise as long as it > > does not make illegal / unconstitutional CDP > > mechanics an issue! > > > > (I speak from recent experience of engaging with > > Delhi Master Plan > > revision since it started in 1999-2000. These > > engagements include revival > > of Public Notice process, in a Zonal Plan level case > > in 2002 against an > > ad-hoc scheme to precipitate Public Notice, to which > > over 1700 families > > responded in context of Zonal level plan > > entitlements and prior efforts in > > their pursuit. There have been about two dozen > > Public Notices since then > > before the Master Plan Public Notice itself. I am > > also associated with > > some court matters on grounds of lapses in statutory > > participation > > processes (invariably on account of extra-statutory > > participatory > > processes). I am posting this only for information > > of this perspective of > > participation in planning, in continuation of a > > previous post containing > > the link to where some of the engagements in Delhi > > are loosely chronicled: > > http://plan.architexturez.net/site/). > > > > cheers > > Gita Dewan Verma, Planner > > > > > > > > > 9th September 2005 > > > > > > Hello! > > > > > > Interesting debate! I think at the base of > > tensions are the tensions > > > between > > > the modern and the post-modern. Many of us are > > cought up in this tension > > > and > > > are subtely experiencing the resergence of the > > post-modern. The questions > > > such as... > > > > > > > > > a) What constitutes 'civil society' and the nature > > of > > >>'debate'? > > >>b) are the 'affected people' passive reciepients" > > >>c) what are the various forms of politics that we > > can > > >>visualize? is it that of the day to day, that of > > >>election time? that at particular levels of > > >>government? > > >>d) Which part or section of 'breaucracy'? > > >> > > > ...those raised by Solly are vocal testimony to > > this. The legitimacy that > > > represantative politics enjoyed is suddenly > > finding its base being > > > systematically invaded. Those of us including > > 'civil organisations' are > > > not > > > able make sense as to what has hit them. Now that > > post-modern ideas are > > > gaining significant ground there is increased > > questioning of the > > > represantative model that has been the hall mark > > of modernism for few > > > centuries. This also includes the questioning of > > election based politics > > > and focus on everyday politics. Also the > > transformation in concept of > > > 'public' as passive resipient to active subjects > > without any need for > > > 'represantative' cover from any one. > > > > > > Those of us grounded in modernist ideas are > > finding it increasingly > > > challenging, first to comprehend and then to > > transform the long held dear > > > ideas! 'Civil Society' is pregnant with this > > tension to define itself yet > > > again and guard against elitist take over and > > hegemonize. > > > > > > I have thought through these issues after > > participating in the last > > > workshop > > > of Sarai on August 30-31 2005 as part of > > Sarai-CSDS student stipenship for > > > year 2004-05 specially the inputs from Solly, > > Prabhu Mahapatra, Sadan Jha, > > > Aarti and Deepu and with my discussions there > > after with Lillian D'Costa > > > from Goa. > > > > > > Sebastian Rodrigues. > > > > > > > > > > > >>From: solomon benjamin > > >>To: jayaraj s > > >>CC: urbanstudygroup at sarai.net > > >>Subject: Re: [Urbanstudy] who is the "public", > > what is the 'plan',and who > > >>consults on whose behalf? > > >>Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 17:15:27 +0100 (BST) > > >> > > >>Hi, a useful response and some more questions -- > > esp > > >>on the last lines: > > >>civil society organisations analyse and expose the > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to > http://yahoo.shaadi.com > _______________________________________________ > commons-law mailing list > commons-law at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law _________________________________________________ FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community http://www.FindLaw.com Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! http://mail.Justice.com From sunil at mahiti.org Wed Sep 14 23:00:25 2005 From: sunil at mahiti.org (Sunil Abraham) Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 23:00:25 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] UNDP/APDIP/IOSN Sub-regional Nodes - Extension of deadline Message-ID: <20050914173025.554C516CF15@server.mahiti.org> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Extension of deadline for receiving expressions of interest to manage a sub-regional node of the International Open Source Network. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This is with regard to our earlier announcement, appended below and also available from here:- www.iosn.net/about/news/regional-nodes-request We have received some requests [at FOSSAP II and by email] for extension of deadline. In response to these requests, the deadline for receiving expressions of interest has been revised from 20 September 2005 to 10 October 2005. We hope this will give everyone sufficient time. We would also like to use this opportunity to answer some of the questions that accompanied the requests. QUESTION 1: How much money will UNDP/APDIP/IOSN provide to the sub-regional node? UNDP/APDIP/IOSN will provide up-to USD 75,000 for the project period - January 2006 to June 2007. Apart from financial support UNDP/APDIP/IOSN will also provide technical and incubation support. Additional funds required by the sub-regional node could be raised from other donors. QUESTION 2: What is the scope of work for the sub-regional node. The node is expected to replicate IOSN's activities at a sub-regional level. Very broadly these activities involve - community building, publications, trainings, events, micro-grants and research. You can learn more about our activities from www.iosn.net. But this should only serve as a general guideline. The exact scope of work can only be finalised in consultation with the selected organisation. QUESTION 3: What about institutional approvals? We understand that for some large organisations, institutional approvals cannot be secured within the aforementioned deadline. We would like to request these organisations to submit the expression of interest "in principle". Institutional approval can be secured at a later date. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ORIGINAL ANNOUNCEMENT ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Request for expression of interest to manage a sub-regional node of the International Open Source Network UNDP-APDIP would like to bring to your attention this request for expression of interest to initiate and manage a sub-regional node of the International Open Source Network with the guidance of UNDP-APDIP. Please submit your expression of interest by 20 September 2005 to sunil at apdip.net We are looking for three partners to manage three sub-regional nodes in the Asia-Pacific region. These nodes can possibly be called ‘IOSN South Asia’, ‘IOSN ASEAN+3’, and ‘IOSN Pacific Island Countries’. The list of countries that would fall under each sub-regional node and which are, therefore, eligible to submit an expression of interest is given below. Ideally, we are looking for a government agency, academic institution or civil society organization with a proven track record in Free/Open Source Software (FOSS) development, research, deployment, and advocacy. The candidate organization must be able to internalize sub-regional needs and priorities in FOSS and design and implement a programme that is truly needs-based. Primary Research Focus: The sub-regional nodes will undertake research activities in three primary focus areas, namely, Open Content, Open Standards and Open Source. This could be accomplished via the establishment of research teams or “cells” within each sub-regional facility. Besides a small core staff, these teams/cells could include volunteers and/or consultants who will collaborate across a wide spectrum of activities such as data collection, research, analysis, authoring and review. We believe this will encourage other institutions from the public and volunteer sectors to undertake serious research into various aspects and implications of FOSS for the developing world. The primary focus of research for each sub-region could be: IOSN South Asia -- Open Content IOSN ASEAN +3 -- OpenStandards IOSN Pacific Island Countries -- Open Source Secondary Research Focus: Apart from the primary research focus area mentioned above, each sub-regional node could also conduct research on specific areas of FOSS application where either software or human resources are unavailable in the Asia-Pacific region. Many of these focus areas were identified during the first Free/Open Source Software Asia Pacific (FOSSAP) consultation held in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia in 2004. IOSN has already produced some research outputs in connection with a few areas such as Localization. But additional concerted and specialized research is required in, for example, e-Learning; health; finance; e-governance; geographic information system (GIS); and multimedia. Perhaps the proposed sub-regional centres could focus as follows: IOSN South Asia -- e-Learning IOSN ASEAN+3 -- Health, Finance and e-Governance IOSN Pacific Island Countries -- GIS, Earth Science, and Multimedia Imaging and Publishing IOSN Portal: The IOSN portal serves as a comprehensive, online resource centre providing information on FOSS, FOSS news, wikis, blogs, and online discussion forums, and acts as a means for the FOSS community to collaborate and interact. It is co-managed by IOSN and FOSS advocates throughout the region and all three sub-regional nodes will partake in its management in the areas of their expertise and specialization. Each selected sub-regional node will be designated as a UNDP-APDIP Centre of Excellence on FOSS. UNDP-APDIP will provide seed financing, incubation services for 12-18 months, initial hosting services for the IOSN portal, as well as official affiliation with UNDP-APDIP. Each sub-regional node will also receive overall guidance, support and management assistance by IOSN and UNDP-APDIP in delivering its activities. Information concerning IOSN, is provided here and can also be found at http://www.iosn.net. Expressions of interest are treated confidentially and should be sent no later than September 20, 2005 by email to the manager of IOSN, Mr. Sunil Abraham, at and include the following information in no more than 16 pages: A brief profile of your organization, including vision, objectives, programmes, projects, activities and a brief summary of achievements. Also include key data regarding infrastructure and human resources and annex the legal act/statutes establishing your organization. Finally, include key financial information such as sources of funding and financial sustainability. (Maximum 3 pages) A description of your institutional expertise/experience with regard to FOSS, along with brief (8-10 lines) description of each major FOSS-related project/programme undertaken so far. (Maximum 4 pages) 1. A description of your linkages and connections with government agencies, civil society organizations, academic organizations, GNU/Linux User Groups, Free Software Foundations and other FOSS researchers and practitioners. (Maximum 2 pages) 2. The ideas and expectations you would bring to the implementation and future development of the information service, the resources your organization would be able to contribute in the medium- and long-term, and a suggested time-frame for transitioning the service, including management of the IOSN portal for the sub-region, and in making it sustainable. (Maximum 6 pages) 3. A brief profile of the individual that would lead this effort in your organization and any other possible members of the team. (Maximum 1 page) 4. NOTE: Expressions of interest will be entertained only from institutions and not individuals. We will acknowledge receipt of all expressions of interest by email but contact only those organizations we take further interest in. List of Countries for South Asia Afghanistan Bangladesh Bhutan India Iran Maldives Nepal Pakistan Sri Lanka List of Countries for ASEAN +3 Brunei Darussalam Cambodia China Indonesia Japan Democratic People's Republic of Korea Republic of Korea Lao PDR Malaysia Mongolia Myanmar Philippines Singapore Thailand Timor Leste Viet Nam List of Countries for the Pacific Australia Cook Islands Fiji Federated States of Micronesia French Polynesia Kiribati Nauru New Caledonia New Zealand Niue Palau Papua New Guinea Republic of Marshall Islands Solomon Islands Tokelau Tonga Trust Territories of the Pacific Islands Tuvalu Vanuatu -- Sunil Abraham Manager sunil at apdip.net www.iosn.net International Open Source Network - Software Freedom for All Asia-Pacific Development Information Programme www.apdip.net Thailand:UNDP Regional Centre, United Nations Service Building 3rd Floor, Rajdamnern Nok Avenue, Bangkok 10200, Thailand Tel: (66-2) 288-1234 Fax: (66-2) 288-3032 India :3rd Floor, 314/1, 7th Cross, Domlur Bangalore - 560 071 Karnataka, India. Mob: (91) 9342201521 Tel: (91-80) 51150580 Fax: (91-80) 51150583. From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Wed Sep 14 22:03:20 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 17:33:20 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] on whose behalf? In-Reply-To: <20050914080536.17228.fh039.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <20050914163320.2262.qmail@web8403.mail.in.yahoo.com> Dear Jayna, The main point here is that I think we need to move beyond a normative box of assuming that much of the political debate around cities and planning needs to be contained in a constitutional enclosure of the 74th. CA or then, within Master Planning (as defined in part by the various Town and Country Plannng acts among other inferences) which is only one form of intervening in cities. I was intending in my email to open up both the legal and institutional categories towards a broader way in which various types of legalities get defined, and in which various types of public interventions get made from different levels of government -- pushed ahead by particular groups in society. This seems certainly more complicated and when one looks at detailed cases of how law is 'formed' the situation is much more fluid. I am thinking here not just of Santos, but also work on venezula by Krast, Swartz (the evolution of laws in the barrios of caracas), the work of Omar Razzar in Jorden, work in Hyderabad Sindh, and our own work here in Bangalore. In these cases, one finds that legislators framing 'the law' or planners planning 'the master plan' or activists defining 'the public participation' being side lined by a range of actors. These are not just the evil developers or greedy vote hungry politicians, but a range of poorer groups who in their own quiet ways, act, dis-trusting of those who act on their behalf. Thats the 'un-ease' part! Hope this makes things more clear. Cheers Solly Perhaps a meet at the ALF for an extended discussion? --- Jayna Kothari wrote: > > Dear Solly, > > I am just curious about some of the comments you > made...... > > I > > refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and if > the > > participatory process is linked to that or not. > > Instead I am pointing to the centrality of > politics, > > the value of anachism, of fluidity, of > > un-predictability, which planners and > administrators > > find great unease. > > while the centrality of politics is not really > denied, > what is thus value of anarchism or > fluidity/unpredictability in planning that you are > referring to? > > > cheers, > Jayna Dr. Solomon Benjamin #32, 2nd. 'A' Cross, 10th. Main Koramangala, 4th. 'C' Block BANGALORE 560034 INDIA Phone: 91-80-2552-5485 __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Thu Sep 15 22:08:27 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 17:38:27 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state In-Reply-To: <61f4c261f1be.61f1be61f4c2@vsnl.net> Message-ID: <20050915163827.65009.qmail@web8403.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi I think Arkaja's observations are useful in several ways. One is that cities as 'anarchic' terrains or to be perhaps more specific, 'a legal feild' (to borrow from Omar Razza) or space for political claim making, vary a lot. In extending that argument, different parts of the city open up varied 'anarchic territories' and these are not just the physical form, but rather complex local histories. Thus, two revenue layouts both DC converted and 'equavalent' in legal charecteristics would be quite different if one was in Mysore road and another was adjecent to Koramangala. If so, then there is something about city terrains that go beyond legalistic or institutional descriptions but have to do with a variety of local histories which today interface globally. The second point in Arkaja's email which we also saw in the KR market, is that older forms of claim ing are being overruled on various grouds. She gives an example of the tezbazari system which I remember as a way, via municipalized and hense relatively accesible claim making, open to a range of hawkers and new migrants. Now of course, we have the NGOs who either on a rights framework or then one of master planning aim to rid the city of slums, and as part of this, to sanitize via planning -- the hawking zones that result, are devoid of the essential politics which an 'anarchic' territory (to link to the first) opens up. I suspect here the interesting and important issue is to read the city from two cross registers: The process and claiming of 'law' ... and in parallel, the process and claiming of selltlenmt and occoupancy. This is not easy, as for a momemnt, we would need to rid ourselves of the burden of the Nation State, its constitutional underpinnnings (the responsability to enforce the constitution) and in the second, to plan for equity and efficiency! Instead to learn to be quiet listerners. Cheers Solly Arkaja, do you think you can get hold of the rules and regulations of the Tezbazari system and if possible on its historical origins. I heard it came from the time of Shah Jahah or linked to the Chandni Chowk in Old Delhi? --- arkaja at vsnl.net wrote: > On the value of anarchy, I could not agree more. > There is a big difference between anarchy in > Bangalore, and the anarchy in Delhi. Bangalore, or > at least the posher parts of Bangalore, is far more > tightly controlled - which I think makes the > informal service sector in Bangalore quite > non-existent. On the other hand, most of Delhi's > residential areas have formal and informal spaces > qute close together, and a constant exchange between > the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the > courts and resident welfare associations, is far > more in tune with North Indian reality than > aspirational Bangalore. > > As just another example of how ridiculous master > plannning can be - Dilli Haat flourishes with the > blessings of the planners, while the courts (High > Court or Supreme Court?) recently banned tehbazaari > (MCD licensed street stalls)in its full blooded > form. The MCD has also just demolished a large area > of such tehbazaari stalls from the Jama Masjid area. > I think it goes without saying that tehbazaari has a > much more important place in the economy and culture > of Delhi than Dilli Haat. And as a part of the > anarchism that Solly talks of, tehbazaars find a way > of getting back on their feet in spite of high level > court orders and MCD sanitizing drives. > > Arkaja > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: solomon benjamin > Date: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 5:33 pm > Subject: [Commons-Law] on whose behalf? > > > Dear Jayna, > > The main point here is that I think we need to > move > > beyond a normative box of assuming that much of > the > > political debate around cities and planning needs > to > > be contained in a constitutional enclosure of the > > 74th. CA or then, within Master Planning (as > defined > > in part by the various Town and Country Plannng > acts > > among other inferences) which is only one form of > > intervening in cities. I was intending in my email > to > > open up both the legal and institutional > categories > > towards a broader way in which various types of > > legalities get defined, and in which various types > of > > public interventions get made from different > levels of > > government -- pushed ahead by particular groups in > > society. This seems certainly more complicated and > > when one looks at detailed cases of how law is > > 'formed' the situation is much more fluid. I am > > thinking here not just of Santos, but also work on > > venezula by Krast, Swartz (the evolution of laws > in > > the barrios of caracas), the work of Omar Razzar > in > > Jorden, work in Hyderabad Sindh, and our own work > here > > in Bangalore. In these cases, one finds that > > legislators framing 'the law' or planners planning > > 'the master plan' or activists defining 'the > public > > participation' being side lined by a range of > actors. > > These are not just the evil developers or greedy > vote > > hungry politicians, but a range of poorer groups > who > > in their own quiet ways, act, dis-trusting of > those > > who act on their behalf. Thats the 'un-ease' part! > > Hope this makes things more clear. > > Cheers > > Solly > > Perhaps a meet at the ALF for an extended > discussion? > > > > > > --- Jayna Kothari > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Solly, > > > > > > I am just curious about some of the comments you > > > made...... > > > > > > I > > > > refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and > if > > > the > > > > participatory process is linked to that or > not. > > > > Instead I am pointing to the centrality of > > > politics, > > > > the value of anachism, of fluidity, of > > > > un-predictability, which planners and > > > administrators > > > > find great unease. > > > > > > while the centrality of politics is not really > > > denied, > > > what is thus value of anarchism or > > > fluidity/unpredictability in planning that you > are > > > referring to? > > > > > > > > > cheers, > > > Jayna > > > > > > Dr. Solomon Benjamin > > #32, 2nd. 'A' Cross, 10th. Main > > Koramangala, 4th. 'C' Block > > BANGALORE 560034 > > INDIA > > Phone: 91-80-2552-5485 > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go > to > > > http://yahoo.shaadi.com_______________________________________________ > > commons-law mailing list > > commons-law at sarai.net > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > > > __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From prabhuram at gmail.com Fri Sep 16 00:14:54 2005 From: prabhuram at gmail.com (prabhu ram) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 20:44:54 +0200 Subject: [Commons-Law] One Find, Two Astronomers: An Ethical Brawl Message-ID: <68752c9f05091511443162cdf8@mail.gmail.com> >New York Times September 13, 2005 One Find, Two Astronomers: An Ethical Brawl By DENNIS OVERBYE Correction Appended When a group of Spanish astronomers reported in July that they had discovered a spectacular addition to the solar system, a bright ball of ice almost as big as Pluto sailing the depths of space out beyond Neptune, Michael Brown of Caltech chalked it up to coincidence and bad luck. His own group had been tracking the object, now known as 2003 EL61, for months but had told no one. He sent the leader of the group, Jose-Luis Ortiz, of the Institute of Astrophysics of Andalusia, in Granada, a congratulatory e-mail message. Now Dr. Brown has asked for an investigation of Dr. Ortiz's discovery, alleging a serious breach of scientific ethics. Archival records, he said, show that only a day before the discovery was reported, computers traced to Dr. Ortiz and his student Pablo Santos-Sanz visited a Web site containing data on where and when the Caltech group's telescope was pointed. The information in these observing logs could have been used to help find the object on the Spanish images, taken more than two years ago, or simply to confirm that both groups discovered the same object. Depending on what the Spanish astronomers did, their failure to mention the Caltech observations could be considered scientific dishonesty or even fraud, Dr. Brown suggests. In comments for his Web site (www.gps.caltech.edu/~mbrown/planetlila),which includes a detailed timeline of the events surrounding the July announcement, he writes: "It is not clear from the timeline precisely what Ortiz and Santos-Sanz knew and how they used the records that they accessed. They were required by the standards of science, however, to acknowledge their use of our Web-based records." In an e-mail message to Brian Marsden of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, who is director of International Astronomical Union's Minor Planet Center, the clearinghouse for such discoveries, Dr. Brown wrote on Aug. 15, "I request that Ortiz et al. be stripped of official discovery status and that the I.A.U. issue a statement condemning their actions." Dr. Ortiz did not respond to numerous e-mail messages and telephone calls. Last week in an e-mail message to Dr. Brown, Dr. Ortiz neither admitted nor denied looking at the observing logs. Instead he criticized Dr. Brown's failure to report discoveries promptly to the Minor Planet Center, saying that his penchant for "hiding objects" had alienated other astronomers and harmed science. "And remember," he said in the message, which Dr. Brown provided to The New York Times, "the only reason why we are now exchanging e-mail is because you did not report your object." But Jose Carlos del Toro Iniesta, director of the Andalusian institute, said in an e-mail message that he intended to investigate Dr. Brown's allegations, adding, "I beg your understanding in separating clearly the institute as a whole from its individual members: the researchers' actions are their sole responsibility." The spectacular allegation has flummoxed the International Astronomical Union. Saying that he and his colleagues had never been fooled before, Dr. Marsden admitted that the I.A.U. had no protocol for adjudicating such a dispute. Dr. Robert Kirshner, a Harvard astronomer and the president of the American Astronomical Society, said, "I don't think we have a method - other than public tantrums - to resolve these problems." The imbroglio illustrates the ethical dangers and pitfalls of doing science in the Internet age, where a little clicking can bring you a shocking amount of information about what your colleagues and rivals are up to. There is a long history of astronomers jealously guarding the coordinates of some celestial phenomenon while they try to figure out what it is, and of others trying to get in on the action. In 1930, when Pluto was discovered, the Lowell Observatory, home of the discoverer Clyde Tombaugh, withheld details of its location because they wanted to be the first to calculate its orbit. Matthew Holman, a Harvard planetary astronomer, said that in the old days when the logbooks were real books sitting by the telescope, some astronomers would write down fictitious coordinates and objects to cover their tracks. With electronic records, Dr. Brown said, "It's important for scientists to discuss what's O.K. and what is not." Richard Pogge, an Ohio State astronomer who uncovered the apparent breach, said that scientists had long lived mostly successfully by a kind of honor system. Astronomers, he said, routinely serve on time allocation committees for telescopes and peer review panels without stealing one another's ideas. "It allows us to have an open, collaborative community," he said. The idea that someone could abuse that openness, he said, "goes to the whole idea of trust in our community." Dr. Brown, with his colleagues David L. Rabinowitz of Yale and Chadwick A. Trujillo of the Gemini Observatory in Hawaii, is currently famous as the discoverer of the "10th planet." Dr. Ortiz, who received his Ph.D. from the University of Granada in 1994 for work on the clouds of Jupiter and Saturn, is not as well known. Glenn Orton, of Caltech's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, where Dr. Ortiz worked as a postdoctoral fellow, called him "an impressive worker" and said he had recommended him for several jobs over the past years. Since 2002, Dr. Ortiz and his colleagues have been looking for so-called trans-Neptunian objects in the outer solar system with a brace of small telescopes at the Sierra Nevada Observatory, in Granada. The EL61 object appears to have been their first big hit. According to Dr. Ortiz, it was first spotted on July 25 by Mr. Santos-Sanz as a slow-moving object on images taken in March 2003. He e-mailed this news to the Minor Planet Center on July 27, but it attracted no attention, partly because there was not enough information to tell other observers where to look for it. The next night Dr. Ortiz reported that his group had been able to trace the object on various old photographs back to 1955, enabling a group at the Astronomical Observatory of Mallorca to observe it. After checking for themselves that the object was real, Dr. Marsden's team disseminated the details to the rest of the astronomical world on its own Web site and by e-mail. The new body would have been a prize for any astronomer. At the time it was the brightest and largest object - next to Pluto - yet found in the Kuiper belt, a ring of debris that stretches out beyond Neptune. Except that it had already been discovered. Dr. Brown had planned to report the object, which his team had discovered in December 2004 and nicknamed Santa, at a meeting last week. In fact, he had described it in abstracts sent to the American Astronomical Society, abstracts available to anyone with a computer and familiarity with astronomical jargon, only a week before, on July 20. Dr. Ortiz's report raised eyebrows at the astronomical union because he and his telescopes were relatively unknown and because two years had elapsed since the discovery pictures were taken. Struck by the similarity of the objects and the close timing of Dr. Ortiz's announcement, Dr. Marsden said he had told Dr. Brown that he was worried that a leak might have occurred. In fact, Dr. Brown himself had inadvertently made such a leak possible. In the abstracts he referred to "Santa" by a code name, K40506A, which was the same code name his team had used in its observing logs. As a result, as Dr. Brown discovered to his horror the night of Dr. Ortiz's announcement, any astronomer who read the abstracts and typed "K40506A" into an Internet search program would be taken to a Web site containing the observing logs of Smarts, the Small and Moderate Aperture Research Telescope System. It was one of those telescopes, at the Cerro Tololo Inter-American Observatory in Chile, that Dr. Brown and his colleagues were using to track the object. The telescope is one of four owned by a consortium of universities and operated by two observing assistants at the observatory. The Web site, which is public, does not contain data obtained during observations but does tell where the telescope was pointed. Shaken by that news that his observations were so accessible, Dr. Brown hastily called a news conference to announce his ace in the hole, a new planet bigger than Pluto, at 7 p.m. on Friday, July 29, "Perhaps the single best time to announce news that you want no one to hear," as he put it on his Web site. In an e-mail message, he apologized to Dr. Ortiz ahead of time for being about to overshadow him. Nevertheless questions lingered among minor planet astronomers about whether Dr. Ortiz's group might have helped themselves to Dr. Brown's observing logs, suspicions that Dr. Ortiz found irritating. "I do not enjoy the distrust on our work and so much questioning," he wrote to Daniel Green of the astronomical union on Aug. 5 in an e-mail message, which Dr. Green provided to The Times. But now evidence has been offered that Dr. Ortiz and his group did access the observing logs. Prompted by questions by Dr. Rabinowitz of Yale, one of Dr. Brown's team members, Dr. Pogge, who maintains the Smarts telescope Web site, decided to investigate the traffic on the site. He found that computers from an unfamiliar address had visited the Web site eight times from July 26 to 28, when the Spanish group was making its announcement. Each time the computers went straight to pages deep within the site that described the Brown group's observations of K40506A. The first three visits happened a few minutes apart early on July 26, a day and a half before the Ortiz group made its announcement. Another cluster of hits came on the morning of the July 28 before the object was observed in Mallorca and Dr. Ortiz made his more complete report to the astronomical union. Dr. Pogge was able to trace the computers through the so-called IPP numbers, which the Internet assigns to each computer on it. Those numbers eventually led him to the Web site of the Andalusian Institute. Dr. Pogge said he gasped out loud when it popped up. "I remember saying, 'Oh no, oh no, oh no,' over and over again," he said. Moreover, the IPP numbers of the intruders match the numbers on the e-mail messages Mr. Santos-Sanz and Dr. Ortiz sent to the Minor Planet office, according to Dr. Marsden. Dr. Pogge called Dr. Brown on Aug. 8. Dr. Brown in turn sent an e-mail message to Dr. Ortiz asking for an explanation, but by then all of Spain seemed to be on vacation. It was not until early this month that Dr. Iniesta and Dr. Ortiz wrote back, the latter to say that he was still on vacation and saw no need to respond further until Sept. 15. In the absence of further information, exactly what Dr. Ortiz did with the observing logs is likely to remain a mystery. Were he and his colleagues only checking to see if Dr. Brown's object was the same as theirs to confirm their own discovery? Or did they use the information to find the object and beat the Caltech team? Both actions would violate scientific ethics but with varying degrees of seriousness, astronomers said. John Huchra, an astronomer and the vice provost for research policy at Harvard, said that at some level it is all right to use knowledge of what a rival group is doing. "If you hear them give a talk at a conference, it's fair game," he said, "but if you found it in the trash bin or the copier, that's not kosher." If you used tainted information to beat out the other group, he said, the director of the observatory (the only authority in this system) could forbid publication and banish you from the telescope. "If they were just confirming," he went on, "there's still a tinge here. It's not kosher to point your telescope at somebody else's object, unless you ask." Ben Oppenheimer, an astronomer and extrasolar planet hunter at the American Museum of Natural History, said that he thought it was unethical to use tainted information in any way, but added: "It's a borderline case, though, because the logs were public. I don't know why that information was so freely available." One complicating factor is that professionals like Dr. Brown tend to nurse their work along in private until they are ready to publish a major scientific paper. This practice has sometimes created tension among the minor planet observers, including a large number of amateurs who take pride in spotting comets, uncharted asteroids and other objects before the professionals. In his response to Dr. Brown, Dr. Ortiz offered to collaborate with him on the naming of 2003 EL61 if Dr. Brown would change his secretive ways. Dr. Brown called Dr. Ortiz's e-mail message "astonishing." Regarding the practice of guarding his data, he said, "This is what every single scientist does every day of their lives." Dr. Marsden pointed out that Dr. Brown had advanced science while he was keeping his "Santa" object under observation. He discovered that it has a moon, nicknamed Rudolph, allowing him to calculate the object's mass - about one-third that of Pluto. Moreover, he did report it, said Dr. Marsden, citing the abstracts. "I don't blame him for wanting to finish the job," Dr. Marsden said. "You do the whole thing. That is how astronomy is done, or used to be done." Dr. Marsden, who is secretary of astronomical union's committee for naming small bodies, said that he would suggest to Dr. Brown that he propose names for both 2003 EL61 and its satellite. Correction:Sept. 14, 2005, Wednesday: An article in Science Times yesterday about a dispute between astronomers over credit for the discovery of 2003 EL61, a large icy object in the outer solar system, misstated the term for the identification number assigned by the Internet to every computer. The number, by which American astronomers were able to trace a Spanish group's visits to their Web site before the discovery was announced, is called an IP address (for "Internet protocol"), not IPP numbers. Link: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/13/science/space/13plan.html?ei=5090&en=7f5f96302a67ae30&ex=1284264000&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss&pagewanted=print -- Prabhu Ram, Max-Planck-Institut for Intellectual Property, Competition and Tax Law, MarstallPlatz 1, 80539 Munich GERMANY Tel: + 49 89 24246226 Mob: + 49 17629830521 Web: http://infoserve.blogspot.com From anujbhuwania at gmail.com Thu Sep 15 23:52:54 2005 From: anujbhuwania at gmail.com (Anuj Bhuwania) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:22:54 -0400 Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: [Urbanstudy] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state In-Reply-To: <20050915163827.65009.qmail@web8403.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <61f4c261f1be.61f1be61f4c2@vsnl.net> <20050915163827.65009.qmail@web8403.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: hi this discussion is too interesting to still be lurking. that was a cool juxtaposition by arkaja. example of the flourishing dilli haat, which is soon to be replicated in another part of delhi. while banning tehbazaari in the same city. so a fetishized nostalgic space for a cultural form that you are simultaneously destroying. the anthropologist renato rosaldo in another context called this "imperialist nostalgia" for white people's nostalgia for a culture they have destroyed themselves. photographing tribes (thus embalming them in a sense), preserving them thus while destroying them . or maybe its just 'modernity' :) but had some questions: for arkaja: you say "On the other hand, most of Delhi's residential areas have formal and informal spaces quite close together, and a constant exchange between the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the courts and resident welfare associations, is far more in tune with North Indian reality" can you please explain and unpack that. what are these "informal spaces". what kind of "constant exchange"? where in delhi? what do you mean by "north indian reality"? do you think "north indian" cities including are a type? or do you just find heuristically useful to oppose it to bangalore? For solly: -"state learning to be quiet listeners"? sounds quite cool. any examples you can think of. -tehbazaari might go back to shahjahan, but whats interesting is what kind of negotiation enabled this to exist till now in its modern form, and what are the changing histories of its legal and material form in the new modern imperial capital of the british and the indian state. all i am trying to say is instead of looking at it as a "traditional" practice, it might be more productive to see it as a "modern" one with a long and complicated history. best, anuj On 9/15/05, solomon benjamin wrote: > Hi > I think Arkaja's observations are useful in several > ways. One is that cities as 'anarchic' terrains or to > be perhaps more specific, 'a legal feild' (to borrow > from Omar Razza) or space for political claim making, > vary a lot. In extending that argument, different > parts of the city open up varied 'anarchic > territories' and these are not just the physical form, > but rather complex local histories. Thus, two revenue > layouts both DC converted and 'equavalent' in legal > charecteristics would be quite different if one was in > Mysore road and another was adjecent to Koramangala. > > If so, then there is something about city terrains > that go beyond legalistic or institutional > descriptions but have to do with a variety of local > histories which today interface globally. > > The second point in Arkaja's email which we also saw > in the KR market, is that older forms of claim ing are > being overruled on various grouds. She gives an > example of the tezbazari system which I remember as a > way, via municipalized and hense relatively accesible > claim making, open to a range of hawkers and new > migrants. Now of course, we have the NGOs who either > on a rights framework or then one of master planning > aim to rid the city of slums, and as part of this, to > sanitize via planning -- the hawking zones that > result, are devoid of the essential politics which an > 'anarchic' territory (to link to the first) opens up. > I suspect here the interesting and important issue is > to read the city from two cross registers: > The process and claiming of 'law' ... and in parallel, > the process and claiming of selltlenmt and occoupancy. > > > This is not easy, as for a momemnt, we would need to > rid ourselves of the burden of the Nation State, its > constitutional underpinnnings (the responsability to > enforce the constitution) and in the second, to plan > for equity and efficiency! Instead to learn to be > quiet listerners. > Cheers > Solly > Arkaja, do you think you can get hold of the rules and > regulations of the Tezbazari system and if possible on > its historical origins. I heard it came from the time > of Shah Jahah or linked to the Chandni Chowk in Old > Delhi? > > --- arkaja at vsnl.net wrote: > > > On the value of anarchy, I could not agree more. > > There is a big difference between anarchy in > > Bangalore, and the anarchy in Delhi. Bangalore, or > > at least the posher parts of Bangalore, is far more > > tightly controlled - which I think makes the > > informal service sector in Bangalore quite > > non-existent. On the other hand, most of Delhi's > > residential areas have formal and informal spaces > > qute close together, and a constant exchange between > > the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the > > courts and resident welfare associations, is far > > more in tune with North Indian reality than > > aspirational Bangalore. > > > > As just another example of how ridiculous master > > plannning can be - Dilli Haat flourishes with the > > blessings of the planners, while the courts (High > > Court or Supreme Court?) recently banned tehbazaari > > (MCD licensed street stalls)in its full blooded > > form. The MCD has also just demolished a large area > > of such tehbazaari stalls from the Jama Masjid area. > > I think it goes without saying that tehbazaari has a > > much more important place in the economy and culture > > of Delhi than Dilli Haat. And as a part of the > > anarchism that Solly talks of, tehbazaars find a way > > of getting back on their feet in spite of high level > > court orders and MCD sanitizing drives. > > > > Arkaja > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: solomon benjamin > > Date: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 5:33 pm > > Subject: [Commons-Law] on whose behalf? > > > > > Dear Jayna, > > > The main point here is that I think we need to > > move > > > beyond a normative box of assuming that much of > > the > > > political debate around cities and planning needs > > to > > > be contained in a constitutional enclosure of the > > > 74th. CA or then, within Master Planning (as > > defined > > > in part by the various Town and Country Plannng > > acts > > > among other inferences) which is only one form of > > > intervening in cities. I was intending in my email > > to > > > open up both the legal and institutional > > categories > > > towards a broader way in which various types of > > > legalities get defined, and in which various types > > of > > > public interventions get made from different > > levels of > > > government -- pushed ahead by particular groups in > > > society. This seems certainly more complicated and > > > when one looks at detailed cases of how law is > > > 'formed' the situation is much more fluid. I am > > > thinking here not just of Santos, but also work on > > > venezula by Krast, Swartz (the evolution of laws > > in > > > the barrios of caracas), the work of Omar Razzar > > in > > > Jorden, work in Hyderabad Sindh, and our own work > > here > > > in Bangalore. In these cases, one finds that > > > legislators framing 'the law' or planners planning > > > 'the master plan' or activists defining 'the > > public > > > participation' being side lined by a range of > > actors. > > > These are not just the evil developers or greedy > > vote > > > hungry politicians, but a range of poorer groups > > who > > > in their own quiet ways, act, dis-trusting of > > those > > > who act on their behalf. Thats the 'un-ease' part! > > > Hope this makes things more clear. > > > Cheers > > > Solly > > > Perhaps a meet at the ALF for an extended > > discussion? > > > > > > > > > --- Jayna Kothari > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Solly, > > > > > > > > I am just curious about some of the comments you > > > > made...... > > > > > > > > I > > > > > refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and > > if > > > > the > > > > > participatory process is linked to that or > > not. > > > > > Instead I am pointing to the centrality of > > > > politics, > > > > > the value of anachism, of fluidity, of > > > > > un-predictability, which planners and > > > > administrators > > > > > find great unease. > > > > > > > > while the centrality of politics is not really > > > > denied, > > > > what is thus value of anarchism or > > > > fluidity/unpredictability in planning that you > > are > > > > referring to? > > > > > > > > > > > > cheers, > > > > Jayna > > > > > > > > > Dr. Solomon Benjamin > > > #32, 2nd. 'A' Cross, 10th. Main > > > Koramangala, 4th. 'C' Block > > > BANGALORE 560034 > > > INDIA > > > Phone: 91-80-2552-5485 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > > > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go > > to > > > > > > http://yahoo.shaadi.com_______________________________________________ > > > commons-law mailing list > > > commons-law at sarai.net > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to > http://yahoo.shaadi.com > _______________________________________________ > Urbanstudygroup mailing list > Urban Study Group: Reading the South Asian City > > To subscribe or browse the Urban Study Group archives, please visit > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/urbanstudygroup > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050915/ed878f97/attachment.html From eddank at aya.yale.edu Fri Sep 16 07:58:24 2005 From: eddank at aya.yale.edu (Eddan Katz) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 22:28:24 -0400 Subject: [Commons-Law] Fellowship: Yale Information Society Project Message-ID: Information Society Project Yale Law School ISP Fellowship Announcement The fellowship is designed for recent law graduates or Ph.Ds who are interested in careers in teaching and public service in any of the following areas: Internet and telecommunications law, first amendment law, media studies, intellectual property law, access to knowledge, cybercrime, cultural evolution, bioethics and biotechnology, and law and technology generally. This year we have a particular interest in hiring fellows interested in computer security and privacy issues as well as development and the information society. Fellows receive a salary of approximately $37,000 plus Yale benefits. Fellows are expected to work on an independent scholarly project as well as help with administrative and scholarly work for the Information Society Project at Yale Law School. More information on the ISP is available at: http://islandia.law.yale.edu/isp/ The formal application materials including the following: (1) A brief (one to five page) statement of the applicant's proposed scholarly research; (2) A copy of the applicant's resume; (3) A law school (or graduate school) transcript; (4) At least one sample of recent scholarly writing; (5) Two letters of recommendation. Applications can be sent all year round as fellows are accepted on a rolling basis. Applications for the 2006-7 ISP fellowship must postmarked no later than Feb. 1, 2006. The application materials should be sent (in hard copy) to: Information Society Project Fellowship Program c/o Deborah Sestito, Room 333 Yale Law School 127 Wall Street P.O. Box 208215 New Haven CT 06520-8215 -- Eddan Katz Lecturer in Law, Yale Law School Executive Director, Information Society Project http://islandia.law.yale.edu/isp/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050915/ee4d1aa7/attachment.html From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Fri Sep 16 08:42:29 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:12:29 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: [Urbanstudy] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050916031229.19154.qmail@web8404.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi Anuj, I'll do my part! --- Anuj Bhuwania wrote: > but had some questions: > For solly: > -"state learning to be quiet listeners"? sounds > quite cool. any examples you > can think of. SB: typo in 'State' should be Start learning to be quiet listeners. I think the main thing here is to use methods and conceptions that do not assume 'poor' groups to be passive, totally exploited, and hense incapable of their own autonomous agenda and strategy. I suspect thats a useful advantage of ethnographic work. Some of the concdpts we have been thinking of are: Politics by Stealth and Porous Breaucrcy. and several examples in our report #26 at http://www.idd.bham.ac.uk/research/urban-governance/case_studies/wp%2026%20bangalore.pdf I hope this link still exists but its via the univ. of Birmingham, Sch. of Public Policy's Int. Dev. dept. project on governance and urban poverty. > -tehbazaari might go back to shahjahan, but whats > interesting is what kind of negotiation enabled this to exist till now in its modern form, and what > are the changing histories of its legal and material > form in the new modern imperial capital of the british and the indian state. all i am trying to say > is instead of looking at it as a "traditional" > practice, it might be more > productive to see it as a "modern" one with a long > and complicated history. SB: (Just to clarify, I am not too sure about the exact Shah Jahan bit). I agree on the 'traditional' bit, but am also at unease with 'modern'. These are too linear. Perhaps 'customary' seems more appro. anyway, putting semnatics aside, the point is that these are forms of regulation /administration that were rooted in a local political terrain and it's extnesion into municipal government was relatively easier -- given the direct political bridge of councilors. I am sure that tezbazari would have been subject to complex negociations. What is of interest that in moving it to the level of the 'nation state' by various 'livlihood rights' NGOs / Forums, the essential political link of the day to day gets forgotten or then termed in a sort of derogatory / patronalistic way as "patron -- client' relationship. Moving beyond categories of the 'North' and the South', I have just begun to see a wonderful series 'Civilization and Capitalism' by Fernand Braudel pointed out in Bangalore's terrific second hand bookstores by Lawrence Liang). and esp. volume II: Wheels of Commerce and seeking to find the connection to local government. The point in both these paras is that if one moved to a sort of 'lifestyle advertisment' mode of looking at cities from a World Bank Perpsectives that one misses all this to focus on "making cities competitive', gettting them planned, getting the regulatory structure inc. getting the IPR right (and for the pleasent hearted there, some Open source thrown in, though controlled by Billy Boy). Or then we would have the 'Marxist manifesto' reneiwed where one calls on the Nation State to wipe out the hawkers and squatters to promise them (at some point in the future) good housing, and good jobs. In both the tezbazzari and the pirates go out of the window as part of this 'reform'. Cheers Solly __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From jaynakothari at justice.com Fri Sep 16 19:49:25 2005 From: jaynakothari at justice.com (Jayna Kothari) Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 07:19:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: [Urbanstudy] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state Message-ID: <20050916141930.28224.fh052.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Thanks Anuj...that was quite an interesting intervention. I really like rosaldo's concept of "a fetishized nostalgic space for a cultural form that you are simultaneously destroying" some questions for Arkaja and Solly though - first of all, Bangalore also has a large informal service sector, its slums, unauthorized colonies, hawkers (if you would like to include all these within 'informal spaces'). So what is it particularly different about Delhi that you are referring to? I quite disagree with the thinking that master planning is completely useless. The relevant question according to me is can master planning include the needs of slum dwellers in some meaningful way? I think there are several people in Bangalore who have been raising these concerns with the recent draft comprehensive development plan that has been announced, which does not have any reference to slums or slum dwellers. cheers, Jayna On Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:22:54 -0400, Anuj Bhuwania wrote: hi this discussion is too interesting to still be lurking. that was a cool juxtaposition by arkaja. example of the flourishing dilli haat, which is soon to be replicated in another part of delhi. while banning tehbazaari in the same city. so a fetishized nostalgic space for a cultural form that you are simultaneously destroying. the anthropologist renato rosaldo in another context called this "imperialist nostalgia" for white people's nostalgia for a culture they have destroyed themselves. photographing tribes (thus embalming them in a sense), preserving them thus while destroying them . or maybe its just 'modernity' :) but had some questions: for arkaja: you say"On the other hand, most of Delhi's residential areas have formal and informal spaces quite close together, and a constant exchange between the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the courts and resident welfare associations, is far more in tune with North Indian reality" can you please explain and unpack that. what are these "informal spaces". what kind of "constant exchange"? where in delhi? what do you mean by "north indian reality"? do you think "north indian" cities including are a type? or do you just find heuristically useful to oppose it to bangalore? For solly: -"state learning to be quiet listeners"? sounds quite cool. any examples you can think of. -tehbazaari might go back to shahjahan, but whats interesting is what kind of negotiation enabled this to exist till now in its modern form, and what are the changing histories of its legal and material form in the new modern imperial capital of the british and the indian state. all i am trying to say is instead of looking at it as a "traditional" practice, it might be more productive to see it as a "modern" one with a long and complicated history. best, anuj On 9/15/05, solomon benjamin wrote: HiI think Arkaja's observations are useful in severalways. One is that cities as 'anarchic' terrains or to be perhaps more specific, 'a legal feild' (to borrowfrom Omar Razza) or space for political claim making,vary a lot. In extending that argument, differentparts of the city open up varied 'anarchicterritories' and these are not just the physical form, but rather complex local histories. Thus, two revenuelayouts both DC converted and 'equavalent' in legalcharecteristics would be quite different if one was inMysore road and another was adjecent to Koramangala. If so, then there is something about city terrainsthat go beyond legalistic or institutionaldescriptions but have to do with a variety of localhistories which today interface globally.The second point in Arkaja's email which we also saw in the KR market, is that older forms of claim ing arebeing overruled on various grouds. She gives anexample of the tezbazari system which I remember as away, via municipalized and hense relatively accesible claim making, open to a range of hawkers and newmigrants. Now of course, we have the NGOs who eitheron a rights framework or then one of master planningaim to rid the city of slums, and as part of this, to sanitize via planning -- the hawking zones thatresult, are devoid of the essential politics which an'anarchic' territory (to link to the first) opens up.I suspect here the interesting and important issue is to read the city from two cross registers:The process and claiming of 'law' ... and in parallel,the process and claiming of selltlenmt and occoupancy.This is not easy, as for a momemnt, we would need to rid ourselves of the burden of the Nation State, itsconstitutional underpinnnings (the responsability toenforce the constitution) and in the second, to planfor equity and efficiency! Instead to learn to be quiet listerners.CheersSollyArkaja, do you think you can get hold of the rules andregulations of the Tezbazari system and if possible onits historical origins. I heard it came from the timeof Shah Jahah or linked to the Chandni Chowk in Old Delhi?--- arkaja at vsnl.net wrote:> On the value of anarchy, I could not agree more.> There is a big difference between anarchy in> Bangalore, and the anarchy in Delhi. Bangalore, or > at least the posher parts of Bangalore, is far more> tightly controlled - which I think makes the> informal service sector in Bangalore quite> non-existent. On the other hand, most of Delhi's > residential areas have formal and informal spaces> qute close together, and a constant exchange between> the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the> courts and resident welfare associations, is far > more in tune with North Indian reality than> aspirational Bangalore.>> As just another example of how ridiculous master> plannning can be - Dilli Haat flourishes with the> blessings of the planners, while the courts (High > Court or Supreme Court?) recently banned tehbazaari> (MCD licensed street stalls)in its full blooded> form. The MCD has also just demolished a large area> of such tehbazaari stalls from the Jama Masjid area. > I think it goes without saying that tehbazaari has a> much more important place in the economy and culture> of Delhi than Dilli Haat. And as a part of the> anarchism that Solly talks of, tehbazaars find a way > of getting back on their feet in spite of high level> court orders and MCD sanitizing drives.>> Arkaja>> ----- Original Message -----> From: solomon benjamin < sollybenj at yahoo.co.in>> Date: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 5:33 pm> Subject: [Commons-Law] on whose behalf?>> > Dear Jayna,> > The main point here is that I think we need to > move> > beyond a normative box of assuming that much of> the> > political debate around cities and planning needs> to> > be contained in a constitutional enclosure of the > > 74th. CA or then, within Master Planning (as> defined> > in part by the various Town and Country Plannng> acts> > among other inferences) which is only one form of> > intervening in cities. I was intending in my email > to> > open up both the legal and institutional> categories> > towards a broader way in which various types of> > legalities get defined, and in which various types> of > > public interventions get made from different> levels of> > government -- pushed ahead by particular groups in> > society. This seems certainly more complicated and> > when one looks at detailed cases of how law is > > 'formed' the situation is much more fluid. I am> > thinking here not just of Santos, but also work on> > venezula by Krast, Swartz (the evolution of laws> in> > the barrios of caracas), the work of Omar Razzar > in> > Jorden, work in Hyderabad Sindh, and our own work> here> > in Bangalore. In these cases, one finds that> > legislators framing 'the law' or planners planning> > 'the master plan' or activists defining 'the > public> > participation' being side lined by a range of> actors.> > These are not just the evil developers or greedy> vote> > hungry politicians, but a range of poorer groups > who> > in their own quiet ways, act, dis-trusting of> those> > who act on their behalf. Thats the 'un-ease' part!> > Hope this makes things more clear.> > Cheers > > Solly> > Perhaps a meet at the ALF for an extended> discussion?> >> >> > --- Jayna Kothari > wrote:> >> > >> > > Dear Solly,> > >> > > I am just curious about some of the comments you> > > made......> > >> > > I > > > > refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and> if> > > the> > > > participatory process is linked to that or> not.> > > > Instead I am pointing to the centrality of > > > politics,> > > > the value of anachism, of fluidity, of> > > > un-predictability, which planners and> > > administrators> > > > find great unease. > > >> > > while the centrality of politics is not really> > > denied,> > > what is thus value of anarchism or> > > fluidity/unpredictability in planning that you > are> > > referring to?> > >> > >> > > cheers,> > > Jayna> >> >> > Dr. Solomon Benjamin> > #32, 2nd. 'A' Cross, 10th. Main > > Koramangala, 4th. 'C' Block> > BANGALORE 560034> > INDIA> > Phone: 91-80-2552-5485> >> >> >> >> >>__________________________________________________________ >> > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go> to> >>http://yahoo.shaadi.com_______________________________________________ > > commons-law mailing list> > commons-law at sarai.net> >> https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > >>>__________________________________________________________Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com _______________________________________________Urbanstudygroup mailing listUrban Study Group: Reading the South Asian CityTo subscribe or browse the Urban Study Group archives, please visit https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/urbanstudygroup _________________________________________________ FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community http://www.FindLaw.com Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! http://mail.Justice.com From sollybenj at yahoo.co.in Fri Sep 16 21:43:56 2005 From: sollybenj at yahoo.co.in (solomon benjamin) Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 17:13:56 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: [Urbanstudy] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state In-Reply-To: <20050916141930.28224.fh052.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <20050916161356.35021.qmail@web8406.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi, I too like the quote of Rosaldo's! On the second, comparing Bangalore and Delhi, I feel that what has happened in Delhi quite effectivly in parts of South and certainly central Delhi, is a closure or local political space. This may be conincedent with the establishment of the Delhi state? In Bangalore too we see this -- in East Bangalore of Whitefeild, KR Puram, as well as parts of South Bangalore. I guess, local multi-diciplenry histories are useful from this perspective. But also in parallel, how 'middle class activism' (jaanagraha in Bangalore, and the RWA's esp. say the Def. colony one) take over such space to carve out claiming territory at a different level for the elite. What is perhaps significant about delhi and particularly New Delhi, is what may be called as the presense of extreem control of higher level breuacratic -- police systems. Now about the second, on the uselessness of Master Planning. of course it is not useless. It serves a particular function, for particular groups. I mean this not in a sort of conspiratory way, but rather serves as a congruence of interests who find value in it. This is in particular, on issues of severe contest like those of land, economy and basic services of water. For others in the political realm, like any system of organization it shifts powers around! The point I make is to move beyond the normative to unpack these processes more closly. Cheers Solly --- Jayna Kothari wrote: > > Thanks Anuj...that was quite an interesting > intervention. I really like rosaldo's concept of "a > fetishized nostalgic space for a cultural form that > you are simultaneously destroying" > > some questions for Arkaja and Solly though - first > of > all, Bangalore also has a large informal service > sector, its slums, unauthorized colonies, hawkers > (if > you would like to include all these within 'informal > spaces'). So what is it particularly different about > Delhi that you are referring to? > > I quite disagree with the thinking that master > planning > is completely useless. The relevant question > according > to me is can master planning include the needs of > slum > dwellers in some meaningful way? I think there are > several people in Bangalore who have been raising > these > concerns with the recent draft comprehensive > development plan that has been announced, which does > not have any reference to slums or slum dwellers. > > > cheers, > Jayna > > > > > > On Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:22:54 -0400, Anuj Bhuwania > wrote: > > hi > this discussion is too interesting to still be > lurking. > that was a cool juxtaposition by arkaja. example of > the flourishing dilli haat, which is soon to be > replicated in another part of delhi. while banning > tehbazaari in the same city. so a fetishized > nostalgic > space for a cultural form that you are > simultaneously > destroying. the anthropologist renato rosaldo in > another context called this "imperialist nostalgia" > for > white people's nostalgia for a culture they have > destroyed themselves. photographing tribes (thus > embalming them in a sense), preserving them thus > while > destroying them . > > or maybe its just 'modernity' :) > > but had some questions: > for arkaja: > you say"On the other hand, most of Delhi's > residential > areas have formal and informal spaces quite close > together, and a constant exchange between the two. > Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the courts > and > resident welfare associations, is far more in tune > with > North Indian reality" > can you please explain and unpack that. what are > these > "informal spaces". what kind of "constant exchange"? > where in delhi? what do you mean by "north indian > reality"? do you think "north indian" cities > including > are a type? or do you just find heuristically useful > to > oppose it to bangalore? > > > For solly: > -"state learning to be quiet listeners"? sounds > quite > cool. any examples you can think of. > -tehbazaari might go back to shahjahan, but whats > interesting is what kind of negotiation enabled this > to > exist till now in its modern form, and what are the > changing histories of its legal and material form in > the new modern imperial capital of the british and > the > indian state. all i am trying to say is instead of > looking at it as a "traditional" practice, it might > be > more productive to see it as a "modern" one with a > long > and complicated history. > > > best, > anuj > > > > On 9/15/05, solomon benjamin > wrote: > > HiI think Arkaja's observations are useful in > severalways. One is that cities as 'anarchic' > terrains > or to > be perhaps more specific, 'a legal feild' (to > borrowfrom Omar Razza) or space for political claim > making,vary a lot. In extending that argument, > differentparts of the city open up varied > 'anarchicterritories' and these are not just the > physical form, > but rather complex local histories. Thus, two > revenuelayouts both DC converted and 'equavalent' in > legalcharecteristics would be quite different if one > was inMysore road and another was adjecent to > Koramangala. > If so, then there is something about city > terrainsthat > go beyond legalistic or institutionaldescriptions > but > have to do with a variety of localhistories which > today > interface globally.The second point in Arkaja's > email > which we also saw > in the KR market, is that older forms of claim ing > arebeing overruled on various grouds. She gives > anexample of the tezbazari system which I remember > as > away, via municipalized and hense relatively > accesible > claim making, open to a range of hawkers and > newmigrants. Now of course, we have the NGOs who > eitheron a rights framework or then one of master > planningaim to rid the city of slums, and as part of > this, to > sanitize via planning -- the hawking zones > thatresult, > are devoid of the essential politics which > an'anarchic' > territory (to link to the first) opens up.I suspect > here the interesting and important issue is > to read the city from two cross registers:The > process > and claiming of 'law' ... and in parallel,the > process > and claiming of selltlenmt and occoupancy.This is > not > easy, as for a momemnt, we would need to > rid ourselves of the burden of the Nation State, > itsconstitutional underpinnnings (the responsability > toenforce the constitution) and in the second, to > planfor equity and efficiency! Instead to learn to > be > quiet listerners.CheersSollyArkaja, do you think you > can get hold of the rules andregulations of the > Tezbazari system and if possible onits historical > origins. I heard it came from the timeof Shah Jahah > or > linked to the Chandni Chowk in Old > Delhi?--- arkaja at vsnl.net wrote:> On the value of > anarchy, I could not agree more.> There is a big > difference between anarchy in> Bangalore, and the > anarchy in Delhi. Bangalore, or > > at least the posher parts of Bangalore, is far > more> > tightly controlled - which I think makes the> > informal > service sector in Bangalore quite> non-existent. On > the > other hand, most of Delhi's > > residential areas have formal and informal spaces> > qute close together, and a constant exchange > between> > the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by > the> > courts and resident welfare associations, is far > > more in tune with North Indian reality than> > aspirational Bangalore.>> As just another example of > how ridiculous master> plannning can be - Dilli Haat > flourishes with the> blessings of the planners, > while > the courts (High > > Court or Supreme Court?) recently banned > tehbazaari> > (MCD licensed street stalls)in its full blooded> > form. > The MCD has also just demolished a large area> of > such > tehbazaari stalls from the Jama Masjid area. > > I think it goes without saying that tehbazaari has > a> > much more important place in the economy and > culture> > === message truncated === __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com From arkaja at vsnl.net Sun Sep 18 18:58:50 2005 From: arkaja at vsnl.net (arkaja at vsnl.net) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 14:28:50 +0100 Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: [Urbanstudy] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state Message-ID: <807d458082df.8082df807d45@vsnl.net> hello everyone, sorry i did not respond earlier - i was away for a few days and have come back and found this very interesting discussion in my mailbox. for anuj: when i made the distinction between north/ south indian cities, i was thinking of the pressure of migration into delhi from other parts of north india, and the vast inequality between top and bottom in delhi. i dont think you have to deal with that in bangalore. i can't generalise about north and south indian cities in general, though i could say i have felt it this way in the places i have been to in north and south respectively. by informal spaces in delhi, i was talking of lal dora areas, and of course slums, hawkers, sabzi walas... lots of bangaloreans go long distances, or to places like foodworld, which are unimaginable for a delhi-ite! there is much less of a gap between manufacturor/ grower and buyer in the more informal spaces, and from the buyers perspective you have much more control over what you get (but i think i can going into completely different territory with that!) this does not just apply to lower levels of the economy in delhi, but to lots of small scale manufacturing, art, and service sector. from what i know of it in bangalore, this is quite different in the sense that different levels of the economy are able to be less dependant on each other - i think the interdependence is important, and its much lower in places like gurgaon and bangalore. arkaja ----- Original Message ----- From: Anuj Bhuwania Date: Thursday, September 15, 2005 7:22 pm Subject: Re: [Urbanstudy] anarchic terrains and the burden of the nation state > hi > this discussion is too interesting to still be lurking. > that was a cool juxtaposition by arkaja. example of the > flourishing dilli > haat, which is soon to be replicated in another part of delhi. > while banning > tehbazaari in the same city. so a fetishized nostalgic space for a > cultural > form that you are simultaneously destroying. the anthropologist > renato > rosaldo in another context called this "imperialist nostalgia" for > white > people's nostalgia for a culture they have destroyed themselves. > photographing tribes (thus embalming them in a sense), preserving > them thus > while destroying them . > or maybe its just 'modernity' :) > but had some questions: > for arkaja: > you say > "On the other hand, most of Delhi's residential areas have formal > and > informal spaces quite close together, and a constant exchange > between the > two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the courts and > resident welfare > associations, is far more in tune with North Indian reality" > can you please explain and unpack that. what are these "informal > spaces". > what kind of "constant exchange"? where in delhi? what do you mean > by "north > indian reality"? do you think "north indian" cities including are > a type? or > do you just find heuristically useful to oppose it to bangalore? > For solly: > -"state learning to be quiet listeners"? sounds quite cool. any > examples you > can think of. > -tehbazaari might go back to shahjahan, but whats interesting is > what kind > of negotiation enabled this to exist till now in its modern form, > and what > are the changing histories of its legal and material form in the > new modern > imperial capital of the british and the indian state. all i am > trying to say > is instead of looking at it as a "traditional" practice, it might > be more > productive to see it as a "modern" one with a long and complicated > history. best, > anuj > On 9/15/05, solomon benjamin wrote: > > > Hi > > I think Arkaja's observations are useful in several > > ways. One is that cities as 'anarchic' terrains or to > > be perhaps more specific, 'a legal feild' (to borrow > > from Omar Razza) or space for political claim making, > > vary a lot. In extending that argument, different > > parts of the city open up varied 'anarchic > > territories' and these are not just the physical form, > > but rather complex local histories. Thus, two revenue > > layouts both DC converted and 'equavalent' in legal > > charecteristics would be quite different if one was in > > Mysore road and another was adjecent to Koramangala. > > > > If so, then there is something about city terrains > > that go beyond legalistic or institutional > > descriptions but have to do with a variety of local > > histories which today interface globally. > > > > The second point in Arkaja's email which we also saw > > in the KR market, is that older forms of claim ing are > > being overruled on various grouds. She gives an > > example of the tezbazari system which I remember as a > > way, via municipalized and hense relatively accesible > > claim making, open to a range of hawkers and new > > migrants. Now of course, we have the NGOs who either > > on a rights framework or then one of master planning > > aim to rid the city of slums, and as part of this, to > > sanitize via planning -- the hawking zones that > > result, are devoid of the essential politics which an > > 'anarchic' territory (to link to the first) opens up. > > I suspect here the interesting and important issue is > > to read the city from two cross registers: > > The process and claiming of 'law' ... and in parallel, > > the process and claiming of selltlenmt and occoupancy. > > > > > > This is not easy, as for a momemnt, we would need to > > rid ourselves of the burden of the Nation State, its > > constitutional underpinnnings (the responsability to > > enforce the constitution) and in the second, to plan > > for equity and efficiency! Instead to learn to be > > quiet listerners. > > Cheers > > Solly > > Arkaja, do you think you can get hold of the rules and > > regulations of the Tezbazari system and if possible on > > its historical origins. I heard it came from the time > > of Shah Jahah or linked to the Chandni Chowk in Old > > Delhi? > > > > --- arkaja at vsnl.net wrote: > > > > > On the value of anarchy, I could not agree more. > > > There is a big difference between anarchy in > > > Bangalore, and the anarchy in Delhi. Bangalore, or > > > at least the posher parts of Bangalore, is far more > > > tightly controlled - which I think makes the > > > informal service sector in Bangalore quite > > > non-existent. On the other hand, most of Delhi's > > > residential areas have formal and informal spaces > > > qute close together, and a constant exchange between > > > the two. Delhi's model, constantly threatened by the > > > courts and resident welfare associations, is far > > > more in tune with North Indian reality than > > > aspirational Bangalore. > > > > > > As just another example of how ridiculous master > > > plannning can be - Dilli Haat flourishes with the > > > blessings of the planners, while the courts (High > > > Court or Supreme Court?) recently banned tehbazaari > > > (MCD licensed street stalls)in its full blooded > > > form. The MCD has also just demolished a large area > > > of such tehbazaari stalls from the Jama Masjid area. > > > I think it goes without saying that tehbazaari has a > > > much more important place in the economy and culture > > > of Delhi than Dilli Haat. And as a part of the > > > anarchism that Solly talks of, tehbazaars find a way > > > of getting back on their feet in spite of high level > > > court orders and MCD sanitizing drives. > > > > > > Arkaja > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: solomon benjamin > > > Date: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 5:33 pm > > > Subject: [Commons-Law] on whose behalf? > > > > > > > Dear Jayna, > > > > The main point here is that I think we need to > > > move > > > > beyond a normative box of assuming that much of > > > the > > > > political debate around cities and planning needs > > > to > > > > be contained in a constitutional enclosure of the > > > > 74th. CA or then, within Master Planning (as > > > defined > > > > in part by the various Town and Country Plannng > > > acts > > > > among other inferences) which is only one form of > > > > intervening in cities. I was intending in my email > > > to > > > > open up both the legal and institutional > > > categories > > > > towards a broader way in which various types of > > > > legalities get defined, and in which various types > > > of > > > > public interventions get made from different > > > levels of > > > > government -- pushed ahead by particular groups in > > > > society. This seems certainly more complicated and > > > > when one looks at detailed cases of how law is > > > > 'formed' the situation is much more fluid. I am > > > > thinking here not just of Santos, but also work on > > > > venezula by Krast, Swartz (the evolution of laws > > > in > > > > the barrios of caracas), the work of Omar Razzar > > > in > > > > Jorden, work in Hyderabad Sindh, and our own work > > > here > > > > in Bangalore. In these cases, one finds that > > > > legislators framing 'the law' or planners planning > > > > 'the master plan' or activists defining 'the > > > public > > > > participation' being side lined by a range of > > > actors. > > > > These are not just the evil developers or greedy > > > vote > > > > hungry politicians, but a range of poorer groups > > > who > > > > in their own quiet ways, act, dis-trusting of > > > those > > > > who act on their behalf. Thats the 'un-ease' part! > > > > Hope this makes things more clear. > > > > Cheers > > > > Solly > > > > Perhaps a meet at the ALF for an extended > > > discussion? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Jayna Kothari > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Solly, > > > > > > > > > > I am just curious about some of the comments you > > > > > made...... > > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > refer to here not a debate of the 74th, CA and > > > if > > > > > the > > > > > > participatory process is linked to that or > > > not. > > > > > > Instead I am pointing to the centrality of > > > > > politics, > > > > > > the value of anachism, of fluidity, of > > > > > > un-predictability, which planners and > > > > > administrators > > > > > > find great unease. > > > > > > > > > > while the centrality of politics is not really > > > > > denied, > > > > > what is thus value of anarchism or > > > > > fluidity/unpredictability in planning that you > > > are > > > > > referring to? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > cheers, > > > > > Jayna > > > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Solomon Benjamin > > > > #32, 2nd. 'A' Cross, 10th. Main > > > > Koramangala, 4th. 'C' Block > > > > BANGALORE 560034 > > > > INDIA > > > > Phone: 91-80-2552-5485 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go > > > to > > > > > > > > > > http://yahoo.shaadi.com_______________________________________________> > > commons-law mailing list > > > > commons-law at sarai.net > > > > > > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to > > http://yahoo.shaadi.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Urbanstudygroup mailing list > > Urban Study Group: Reading the South Asian City > > > > To subscribe or browse the Urban Study Group archives, please > visit > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/urbanstudygroup > > > From lawrence at altlawforum.org Mon Sep 19 11:49:09 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:49:09 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Workshop on Tactical Media by Sarai Media Lab In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Workshop on Tactical Media by Sarai Media Lab Writing On The Surface Of The City Dates : 1st and 2nd October from 9 to 6 Venue: Mahiti, Domlur (Bangalore) Free of cost , lunch included. Only 20-25 participants. The Tactical Media Lab will focus on the interplay of form and content through the production of broadsheets. The workshop will move towards a conceptual understanding of tactical media - broadsheets in particular. A broadsheet as envisaged by us is a light, playful form that also allows engagement with serious concerns. The content for the broadsheets produced during the course of the workshop will be developed through interaction among the participants during the concept building phase. The issue that will be explored through various text and image forms will be ''information society''. The workshop will be useful to individuals interested in tactical media, urban studies, journalism, writing and issues of information society. If you want to participate please email namita at altlawforum.org by 25th September. Applicants will be chosen on a first come, first serve basis. Please forward to whoever might be interested. Thank you, Namita Malhotra Alternative Law Forum Anyone interested in attending may contact namita at altlawforum.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050919/20e63be3/attachment.html From aarti at sarai.net Mon Sep 19 18:37:32 2005 From: aarti at sarai.net (Aarti) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 18:37:32 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Sarai.txt 2.3 Message-ID: <432EB814.4060002@sarai.net> Sarai txt 2.3 15 August - 15 November, 2005 Also see: http://broadsheet.var.cc/blog for previous issues. *THE STATE YOU ARE IN* Through what registers can we try to articulate the matrices of fear that are part of everyday living? How do movement, space, design alter because of fear, uncertainty, anxiety? Content of the text version: (Does not include the poster and images) SIDE 01 - On Walking The City (Yashoda Singh, Practitioner, Cybermohalla, Sara-CSDS + Ankur and Zamrooda Khanday, reader-list post, September 2002) SIDE 02 - The Day I got Verified (Taha Mehmood, Researcher, Information Society, Sarai) + Information Politics (Jeebesh Bagchi, Sarai Reader 02: The Cities of Everyday Life) - Urban Legends - The "Clap!" (Shveta Sarda, Researcher/Practitioner, Cybermohalla, Sarai-CSDS + Ankur) - Inside The Locality (Aprajita De, Independent Fellow, Sarai) + Late Show (Madhavi Tangella, Independent Fellow, Sarai) - On Taking Flight - Whose Hands Are Sullied (Lakshmi Kutty, Independent Fellow, Sarai) + Late Show (Madhavi Tangella, Independent Fellow, Sarai) - Notes on Unsettling Memories (Notes from Emma Tarlo's Lecture, City One conference, Sarai-CSDS) - Reading Naukar Ki Kameez (Hansa Thapilyal, reader-list post) BACKPAGE: - Sarai[s] : On Daryaganj Bookmarket - The Stop Ragging Campaign - This Year, This City - Credits write to : broadsheet at sarai.net for print copies. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SIDE [01] I saw a woman. Her face was dark-complexioned and experienced. She was trying to cross the road, and was coming in my direction. Four to five men were passing by in front of her. I wasn’t looking at them; I could see only the woman. My eyes were fixed on the woman’s eyes, to see how she reacts while passing through these people. But it wasn’t only her eyes that were reacting. The expressions on her entire face were changing. A face that had looked normal till then, now had an expression of distress. Her hands, fixing the dupatta, were playing on her body. Her eyes were raised towards those people, and mine towards her. In her eyes I could see the need to hurry past. She passed by those people in one second. But in that second, how many expressions had adorned her. She walked on, past me. www.sarai.net/cybermohalla/works/book_box/pages/pdfs/eyescrowd.pdf Yashoda Singh, yashoda at cm.sarai.net It was the usual balmy September weather. I rolled my car window halfway up as I drove home from work, and switched on the radio set. My mind raced through different images from the day as I settled on a channel. Rape, harassement, sexual assult seemed to me to be the flavour of the month – not just on radio but in newspapers and magazines and on TV as well...A voice on Radio FM 102.6 proudly announced what it believed to be something for the women of the city to look forward to... “The New Delhi Municipal Corporation, in its attempt to make Delhi a safe haven for women, is planning to make provisions for walkways and paths specially reserved for women. These walks will have high walls to sheild women from vision. They will be well lit, and with specially trained gaurds posted to make sure that no ’male members’ trespass.“ I turned to another channel, exasperated. Was this the solution? Was it all so simple? Or were we simply not willing to face the problem and its solution in the eye? http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2002-September/001809.html Zamrooda Khanday, September 2002 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SIDE [02] THE DAY I GOT VERIFIED Kilokri is a mixed locality. Planned Middle and Higher Income Group government flats coexist with settlements, dense unplanned residential areas and housing complexes built on encroached land. There is a profusion of clustered and cloistered neighbourhoods. I live as a tenant in Kilokri. Last Sunday, as I walked home from the grocer’s, I ran into Mr. Malhotra, my landlord. He looked worried. He handed me a tenant verification form and said, “You must fill this, otherwise the police will create trouble.” I looked through the form. It was titled, ’Format for Information of Tenants’. It was bilingual (Hindi/English) and had three sections: landlord’s, tenant’s, and an acknowledgment slip. Landlords were required to give their name, occupation with details of office, their phone number and address. Tenants were to provide four addresses and phone numbers – present, previous, past and office. Other details required were: date of leaving, details of office, family details and details of any official documentation (passport, driving licence, arms licence, ration card, voter ID card, or income tax – and so provide their PAN or Permanent Account Number). The acknowledgment slip had: received from, son/daughter of, resident of, phone number, residence let out to, son/daughter of, date, number of the diary in which entry is made, name, designation, signature of the recipient. I, the tenant, was required to fill in very minute details about my personal life. I had to write the naam (name) and umr (age) of the person I was living with, and my sambandh (relationship) with him/her. I found this very intrusive. Nevertheless, I filled the form. Mr. Malhotra was hesitant about filling his section of the form. For him, the landlord, the form was a cause of anxiety. He has built three stories on his plot, which he has rented out, but has never declared the income accruing to him from this to the authorities. He was apprehensive that the tenant verification form was a facade to elicit information about his property, most of which is constructed in blatant violation of existing municipal laws. After much consideration, he forwarded his widowed mother’s name as the owner of the house, as she does not have a functioning bank account, nor a PAN – sources from which data about identity and income can be collated. Having finished filling up his section, an anxious Mr. Malhotra turned to me and said, ”Now you must come with me to the police station. Lets go after lunch.” On my way to my room, I ran into the old couple who live on the second floor. I asked them whether they had been verified. Uncle: I had to tell Malhotra the procedure from start to finish. He didn’t know a thing. Taha: I don’t understand. Uncle: On 2nd December there was a piece in The Hindustan Times city supplement stating that all landlords must verify their tenants by 23rd December, otherwise they will be fined. Maybe even face arrest. Taha: So? Uncle: What do you mean, ’so’? We are old retired people. We don’t want any trouble. After reading the piece I went to the police station, got the form and told Malhotra about it. I told him to make sure that all the tenants fill this form, or we might end up getting involved with the police. I thanked him and climbed up the stairs to my room. I wondered what would be done with the forms. What kinds of databases will be made? For what would they be used? For the moment, however, filling the form created within me frustration, anger, and a feeling of extreme vulnerability. http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2004-December/004702.html Taha Mahmood, Researcher, Information Society, Sarai-CSDS, taha at sarai.net *** My mailbox at Sarai has recently been receiving a number of unsolicited mails with subject headers like ’Access Control’, ’Biometrics’, ’Workplace Watchdog’, etc., from companies looking for distributors for various Physical Access Control, and IT Security technologies. Presumably they hope that I might be interested. Meanwhile, my father was recently given a ’tenant verification form’ by the housing society in which he stays, to be submitted to the local police station. He is disturbed about having himself verified after thirty-five years of abiding by the law. Both these events – the emails selling surveillance systems and the arrival of my father’s verification form – are pointers towards an increasing drive to collect information that will enable greater control over access and mobility within urban spaces. What we are witnessing is a sophisticated compact between state institutions, public policy, businesses, voluntary groups and technologists to control ’populations’ and erect fortresses (and gulags?) of data. Information is part of a complex flow of a global traffic of investment, goods, labour, and instructions. Information, in its commodified form, travells towards new frontiers, pushes boundaries, making certain barriers obsolete, some porous, some re-configured, and creating more refined access regulators. http://www.sarai.net/journal/02PDF/10infopol/01infopol_intro.pdf Jeebesh Bagchi, Sarai Reader 02: The Cities of Everyday Life, New Delhi, 2002. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Although no one ever has seen Popo Bawa (Swahili for Bat’s Wing), belief in the monster and his unnatural lust is so strong, that entire villages in Chaka Chaka sleep out of doors for protection. Popo Bawa, a sodomising gremlin, prefers to attack behind closed doors at night. Victims tell that they detected a bad smell, became cold and went into a trance in the moments before they felt the creature’s inhuman strength. Popo Bawa becomes active at election time – a habit that is testing nerves ahead of polls due in October. http://www.phenomenamagazine.com/ A mysterious flying object said to attack sleeping villagers has sparked mass hysteria and rioting across the north Indian state of Uttar Pradesh. The object, described as a flying sphere emitting red and blue light, is said to strike in the middle of the night, leaving victims with burns or scratches on their faces and limbs, and earning it the name the Muhnochwa (Face-Scratcher). Villagers across the region no longer sleep outside, as they usually do during the summer heat, fearing they will be easy prey for the Muhnochwa. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-389122,00.htm Residents of the shantytown Alto do Cruzeiro in North East Brazil, reported multiple sightings of large blue and yellow combi-vans, allegedly driven by American or Japanese agents, who were said to be scouring poor neighbourhoods in search of stray youngsters. The children would be nabbed and shoved into the trunk of the van. Their discarded and eviscerated bodies – minus heart, lungs, liver, kidneys, and eyes – would turn up later by the side of roads, in between rows of sugarcane, or in hospital dumpsters. It is said that these ghoulish acts are carried out by an international mafia trading in organs for wealthy transplant patients in the first world. http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2002-September/001784.html ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ THE "CLAP!" Connaught Place was crowded, busy with people on their way. Some lingered at the bookstalls laid out on the pavement. Others walked slowly, some rushed past. I smiled, thinking about how everyone managed without a traffic policeman directing the flow. But then I realised the crowd wasn’t really moving as chaotically as it seemed at first. Curiously, after reaching a unique point on the curving pavement, it was as if the crowd parted, made two semicircular arcs, and then met again at the other end of the enclosing circle. I was intrigued. What inside that circle had power enough to choreograph the movement of a crowd of strangers? I shifted my gaze, curious to see who was directing its flow. Right in the middle was a short, slight figure dressed in a faded pink salwar kameez. Her hair was tied in a bun. Below it, on her neck, a thin golden chain shone dully. Her shoulders were broad for her build, her kameez sleeves hung loosely on her elbows. A profusion of colourful bangles adorned her wrists. Narrow hips, and a pair of hawaii chappals on her feet. She stood very still, looking around her. Her back was to me. I thought, how strange. By herself, she may never have drawn my gaze. But the crowd has tied my eyes to her. At that moment, this slight figure, standing alone in the middle of the crowd circling around her, clapped. CLAP! And the circle moved faster. Footsteps became quicker. Eyes turned shifty, unsure where to rest – anywhere but on her who pulled them in her direction. CLAP! And the slender figure caught someone’s eye and moved towards him. The young man’s eyes widened with fear. He raised one arm, bringing the plastic and paper bags he was carrying between himself and the approaching figure, while flailing his other arm, gesturing her to stay away. Frozen in his tracks for a fraction of a second, he now fled the circle as she, unfazed, moved steadily towards him. The circle shifted to enclose her within its boundary. She turned around now, watching the circle. She had deep-set eyes, thick eyebrows and the thin stubble of a moustache beneath her nose. Her breasts were small and pointed. She wore neither dupatta, nor makeup. CLAP! She moved again, this time towards a young couple. They stopped as she stood in their path, and moved closer to one another, suspicious of what she would say or do. She clapped noiselessly, and said something. Maybe a blessing for a long and happy married life. The young woman unbuttoned her purse wordlessly and handed her a ten-rupee note. The couple moved on, turning away from the circle. What was it about the slight, obscure, singular figure that evoked such fear, such loathing, such suspicion? Was it a shared web of stories about what people like her do – they steal little boys and make them like themselves, they can bless and cast strange spells, if you don’t give them money they will bare their genitals, they are queer and they beat their dead with chappals? But what could this lone figure do in a crowded centre of the city? What did she carry on her person that should cause such alarm? Maybe it was the body she covered deep inside her clothes. The penis that was small, the organ that was cut away, the stub that was a mere remnant. She was a standing, moving, clapping testimony of our collective anxieties, a constant, recalcitrant, perplexing embodiment of embarrassed biologies. Loth to tussle with the power our own shame exercised on us, we scowled and shunned, growled and flailed, withdrew and fled. And it was her CLAP that we most abhorred. She clapped to announce she was there, clapped to catch our attention, clapped to draw us to her ambiguous, morphed body. Her clap indicated her location, her closeness to our selves; it was her declaration that she was nearby – in the adjacent compartment of a moving train, at the next turn in a crowded bazaar, among us somewhere in the concentric circles of our tired circumambulations of the city streets. With her clap, she pervades and surrounds. With her clap she summons us to her, and drives us away. She turns us from our path, causes a ripple in our course, marks an alteration in our time – her clap becomes an interlude to which there is a ’before’ and an ’after’. Shveta Sarda, Researcher/Practitioner, Cybermohalla, Ankur+Sarai-CSDS, shveta at sarai.net ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ INSIDE THE LOCALITY ”Outside the pol (locality), people don’t even know each others’ name. It is not so here. There is a lot of bonding and ekta (unity), especially at times of riots and even during the earthquake. During the riots, men and boys took turns to guard the pol round the clock. And women took turns to cook for them and give them tea and snacks round the clock. ”Everyone came together during the earthquake as well. At that time, the entire pol was sleeping outside, on the road. All of us worked together (to reconstruct the houses). We ate together. ”But when there is no crisis, there is no cooperation. ”For example, if I wanted to extend this house, everyone would object. You can see from here that this road runs into a dead-end. No one uses it and it can be of no use to anybody. So if I make some sort of construction, everyone would protest against it: ’You are blocking the path, blocking ventilation, your construction is illegal.’” As told to Aparajita De, Sarai-CSDS Independent Fellow, 2003-04, project title: ”Imagined Geographies: The Case Study of Ahmedabad”. Text excerpted from submission to the Sarai archive. *** LATE SHOW Inside a narrow lane, the entrance to Mala Theater was crowded by young men trying to buy tickets. Two men sat at the counter, busy selling tickets. One of them looked Tamilian, and the other was a young boy in his twenties. ”Do you screen Telugu films here?” I asked. Surprised, the young boy replied, ”Yes, only on Sunday evenings, at 9.30 pm.” ”How many come to watch the show?” Looking at each other, they said about 15-20. Sensing their reluctance to speak, I smiled and started walking away. The young man from the counter was following me. I turned back. He walked up, scared and anxious. Before he could speak I said, ”I’m not from the police.” ”Madam,” he said, ”We own two Video theaters at Jogeshwari. Some one like you came and asked for some information and then clicked photographs. Next day, she came with the police and we had to shut it down. We don’t do ganda kaam (dirty work) now. We at this theater don’t show blue films. Hamara naam bhi kharab hota hai (We too get a bad name).” And so he got talking. ”My name is Vikas. We don’t show Telugu films everyday. Telugu films are screened every Sunday at 9:30 pm. At least 50-70 people come to watch, and we show films they demand. We only allow one film per ticket. However if a man comes at an odd time, i.e. when a film is on, we allow him to get in and continue till the next film is over. We do not want him to go back. After all, where will he go till the film gets over? ”And we don’t collect the ticket for the last show. Generally during daytime, once the film is over, we take the tickets back and tear them up. But for the last show, we allow them to keep their tickets. This is because the film gets over at around one in the morning. Very often, if it’s late at night, these Telugu people are detained by the police and questioned about their movements. They do not have a permanent address or any contact phone number or ID card. So, they show the film ticket as proof of where they have been. We regularly get requests to stamp, seal and sign the ticket.” http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2005-May/005742.html Madhavi Tangella, Sarai-CSDS Independent Fellow, 2004-05, blueskyandus at rediffmail.com ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ”Do you want to study or not? What do you want to do in life? This world has no need for failures.” The young boy stands quietly, his head lowered, his eyes fixed on his shoes. The teacher continues to admonish and shame him. But by now he is far away from the jeering glances and sympathetic looks of his classmates, away from the piercing voice of this punishing adult. Maybe he would join his friend who has started a small candle-making workshop in the neighbourhood. Was it a mere coincidence that the chance came to him only a week ago, and that the evenings that he had spent in the workshop were already his most memorable ones? *** A young woman is at the crossroads of her life. Soon she must marry and start a new life. For a last outing, to momentarily push away the anxiety of the ‘familiar unknown’ of married life, she is allowed a trip to the local fair, with its giant wheels and fun shows and traders selling trinkets and other wares. She never returns home. She is lost in the mela. Her parents register a complaint in the kotwali, that she has been enticed away. But in hushed meetings, her friends call her ‘urhari’, the one who has flown away. *** How do we understand these acts of ‘fleeing’? What exactly is at stake in this effort to construct a world away from its centres? Is it a ”different thing” that is gained on the byways that lead, seemingly nowhere, through journeys towards making and living undestined lives? ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ WHOSE HANDS ARE SULLIED? I’m interested in the public discourse on hygiene, sanitation and cleanliness – how this is linked to notions of good health not limited solely to medical criteria, but also includes notions of wellness, comfort/satisfaction, and the manner in which these discourses play out in public spaces, events and interactions. The promise of a healthy life in a city is not measured, as it traditionally has been, in strictly medical terms anymore, but is connected to visions of space and openness, the absence of clutter and crowds, and the possibility of escaping urban perils while still enjoying the city’s benefits. Interestingly, as the criteria for healthy/sanitised living change from medical to non-medical, the new criteria are themselves increasingly expressed through medicalised metaphors. Co-terminus with this is an urgency attached to acquiring certain lifestyles/products/services (such as air conditioners which filter out harmful microbes and pollutants). There are parallel discourses which label a certain outlook/attitude/way of living as antithetical to health and hygiene, and label certain ways of occupying space as a threat to “clean and sanitised“ environs. ’Segregation’ is crucial in sustaining these narratives. For instance, by what parameters is an outbreak of jaundice declared as an epidemic in Bombay? Which city areas are labelled as ’vulnerable’? What social biases are mobilised? How is the “other-in-our-midst“ evoked in these narrations? Whose hands are sullied in the process? http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2005-March/005289.html Lakshmi Kutty, Sarai-CSDS Independent Fellow, 2004-05, lakshmikutty at rediffmail.com *** TASTY IMAGES, INADEQUATE SMELLS It was a hot afternoon in Brooklyn. The Mexican diner that I was passing by was empty, just the staff strolling around, a lady wiping the floor. The whole place, and especially the floor, looked extremely clean, and so I asked if they were open at all. The lady behind the counter called me in and guided me to a table at the window. As I made my way through the room, I was hit by the incredibly strong stench of the chloride cleaner. It covered not just the floor but everything within ten metres. I was famished, so I sat down and ordered immediately. I watched the lady mopping the floor. The floor was clean. It looked clean to me. But from the wet trace the lady had left, I could tell she had just started mopping and she seemed far from switching to another task. She hadn’t yet been in my area of the diner. She mopped very carefully, slowly. Once in a while she stopped to have a little chat with the lady behind the counter. They giggled. The front door was open and the orange afternoon sunlight flooded in. The moist floor shimmered. What a nice and calm picture, I thought. The cook appeared in the open kitchen and started creating a delicious burrito. I sat in great expectation of inhaling the incredible odour of chopped onions, spices, herbs, black beans and hot olive oil. But the odour couldn’t make it. It was chopped by the power of the dictatorial chloride cleaner. Disappointed, I tried to salvage the moment by focusing on the image of the juggling cook. It felt a little strange, like sitting at home, starving, the fridge empty, watching a Mexican cooking show on TV. Tasty images, inadequate smells. The dish was quickly made; when it was served, I’m sure my face had a “happily ever after“ look. After my first nip on the burrito, my sensory system sent out a warning: Food Look + Food Smell => Tasting, Chewing, Swallowing => Digestion. Fine. Food Look + Chloride Smell => No digestion. Bad. I tried. Burrito-Burrito. Stomach roaring. No. Enough. I went to the lady with the mop and asked her, in a very friendly manner, if she could stop cleaning till I had finished my food, since I was bothered by the smell of the cleaner. She was chatting with the lady at the counter. Both ladies were shocked. “Excuse me, but this floor has to be clean! This is a restaurant and it has to be clean! It’s the law!“ “But it’s clean. It looks clean to me!“ I said. “But what about the germs and bacteria you can’t see? They are there! But you can’t see them! So we have to clean even if we don’t see them! It’s the law to keep this place clean!“ Got it. I returned to my table. Minutes later the law kicked me into the bathroom and demanded my lunch back. http://www.snm-hgkz.ch/mailman/listinfo/driftwood Monya Plestsch, Hochschule Fuer Gestaltung, Zurich, monya at gmx.at ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ NOTES ON UNSETTLING MEMORIES Memories lie dormant in hidden recesses of the city, whether in neglected papers found in dusty government files, or in the shifting vistas of urban landscape, or in the articulated experiences of many of the city’s denizens. In these articulations, over the years, areas of silence get built – as moments not to be remembered in the history of the city. At other moments, multiple factors combine to cause such remembrance to atrophy: nationalist sentiment, party political interests, individual careers, expedient deaths and social unrest, which gain far wider currency than muted intellectual critiques. Of course there are also the short-lived narratives – propaganda literature, and testimonials produced in the years that follow an incident, a state-generated upheaval or repression. Like the Emergency, which has a heterogeneous discourse of resentment, guilt and accusation, drawn from a variety of sources including prison memoirs, underground resistance literature, public hearings, official commissions, fiction, journalists’ observations/research, and personal experience. These tides of memory and forgetting leave their mark not just on library shelves but also on monuments and landscapes of the city. The museum that is created becomes a place of forgetting, for it diverts public memory onto a different, more pervasive master narrative, which is also inscribed in other parts of the city, in the form of gigantesque national edifices. As a historian, one moves about the city searching for memories, searching that which has since been edited out of history altogether. How can one interpret records, which are officially produced artefacts made not to provide information but to categorise, present and conceal experience in various ways; and so break the mythology of silence, trace how this memory is projected, guarded and denied. From my experience of researching the Emergency I have learnt that both personal narratives and government documents have limited value as evidence or fact. Set against one another, however, they provide an account that is disturbingly coherent, and alarmingly close to lived experience. From Emma Tarlo’s lecture, ”Unsettling Memories: Narratives of the Emergency in Delhi” at ’City One: South Asian Conference on the Urban Experience’, Sarai-CSDS, 9-11 January 2003. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ READING NAUKAR KI KAMEEZ Two questions have lingered in my mind for some time now – one, how can one understand the current tendencies of the middle-class towards the Right? And two, how is English implicated in this? Interestingly, a clue to these questions comes from a novel written in 1979 – Naukar ki Kameez by Vinod Kumar Shukla. The novel, which I read recently, brought in new permutations, spaces inhabited by people I have known – lower-middle-class houses. Not sunk into poverty, but in a continuous struggle to stay afloat, with dignity. People who have veered into right-wing Hindu thought (I do not know much about those who have not – though of course they exist, and I should renew my intimacies). Through the novel, I have tried to move in some small configuration towards ”an ethnography of fascism”. A lower-middle-class Hindu family lives in a lower-middle-class neighbourhood in a town in western UP with a dominant Muslim culture. The family has a pride of education, a gentility of poverty, and an understated, but present pride of caste. The father holds a petty job in the bureaucracy. There is within him a strong consciousness of being a minority in the area. He also sees the conservative ways of families around him – not as educated, earning a livelihood through small business enterprises, and a demand on women to remain indoors. Elsewhere in the city, in a more mobile middle-class area, a close relative of this family is prospering, slowly but surely. A better paid job, mobility in a somewhat liberal public sector organisation which is public sector but opening up, and the wife’s timely (early ’80s) insistence on an ”elite” English education for the children. The parents of family one attempt to give their children terms for dignity: pride in language (good Hindi), hard work, keeping your mind clean, learning from the success of the uncle. The distance, rather, is from the Muslim neighbour – from a fear of what brews behind those high walls. The children will find it hard to struggle out, as the ’80s turn into the ’90s. Because they do not manage engineering or medical or a bank job. And because two of them are girls. The struggle out is defeating, except for the providence of a good match for one of the girls. The pride in Hindi is a myth maintained among the children to keep the real world at bay. The cousin who does not become bitter stays quietly in the class he was born into. With sincerity, he struggles at a job, refusing favours from his uncle. He is laughed at a bit and loved a lot from a distance for being a good man. He salvages his togetherness from this. The English-speaking cousins will grow with a sense of their privilege, some guilt and maybe they will live with the possibility of being downwardly mobile. The father who built a life of relative privilege – though not prosperity – for his children, will work harder, be honest in his work, and tough on many people. It is a demand his job makes. He will try and help relatives and friends of relatives. He will look around at others in his workplace who have had it easier – who were to the manor born – and hold them in some contempt. His children have known opportunity, and the ease that comes with an education in English. He will feel somewhat distanced from them. The distance will wax and wane. Love, affection, a desire to love and comprehend will mitigate the process. He will tell his children about the worlds they have not known – the apples he wanted to eat as a kid but never could, how his mother would tell him they are given to people when they are ill, how he would long to be ill. Does he adhere to feelings of contempt and anger towards those who ”had it easy”? By the mid ’90s he will have labelled them as those who have easy secular politics. His own children too. And the girls of the other family? In the book, one discovered some kind of conservatism in one of them, a bitterness at being denied opportunity, at the failure of Hindi to fulfill its promise, of the glory of school being very different from the situation outside. The conservatism probably increased with her good marriage into a reasonably well-off family, which was into private business. The other one maintained her love for Hindi (and a culture rooted in Hindi) and would not be bitter about her relatives. She probably looks up to right-wing public figures who rose in national politics in the ’90s as gentle, articulate, complex, as men who keep their word. A novel is not reality. And this novel is definitely an artifice – a work of art. But it may be worthwhile to turn to fiction sometimes to be able to isolate the threads running through our lives that get tugged at, with time and in different situations. http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2002-November/001975.html Hansa Thapliyal, hansatin at yahoo.co.in ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ BACKPAGE SARAI[S]: Once, in a city not unlike our own, there was a book-market. Books and manuscripts from all over the world found their way to the book market, to be picked up by waiting hands. Travellers sold books they no longer wanted, publishers turned over books no one wanted to read anymore, students passed to it old textbooks, and bought new ones. The city had few public libraries, and the book-market filled this vacuum. Textbooks and manuals, erotic novels and philosophy – from the poetic to the profane, or the poetically profane, the book-market sold them all. But slowly the city began to change. Perhaps the gathering of so many words in one place was thought to be too dangerous. Perhaps the piles of paper, binding and the noise of words written and spoken, were thought too cluttered. Whatever be the reason, one day it was heard that the book-market would be closed down. Somehow, the destruction of this transient library has been staved off till today. But it still makes the city ask questions of itself and its hospitality. *** STOP RAGGING! The 'Stop Ragging Campaign' works to document and spread awareness about ragging in India's educational institutions. The campaign assists students who wish to register an official legal complaint against a particular student/students or the institution, and offers advice and guidance on institutional and legal remedies against harassment in educational institutions. To read more about documentation, see postings of Shivam Vij (Independent Fellow, Sarai, 2005) on the reader-list archives at: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list 'Stop Ragging Campaign' website: www.stopragging.org This website-blog will give you an idea of ragging in all its myriad forms, the most reliable source being first hand stories that ragging victims and hostel residents are encouraged to share. To know more, contact Shivam Vij at info at stopragging.org *** THIS YEAR, THIS CITY 17 September 2005 3:30 pm, Interface Zone, Sarai Shifts, transmission, anxieties, exhilarations, public secrets, street-corner intimacies – what did the city say to you this year? For the past five years, Sarai has played host to a public conversation on the year that was, in this our city. This year too we extend to you an invitation to come and participate in a conversation on how different people have witnessed and experienced Delhi in 2004-2005. *** PUBLICATIONS @ Sarai This September sees the launch of three new publications from Sarai. They are available for free download in pdf format on the web. Visit: Sarai Reader 05: Bare Acts – http://www.sarai.net/journal/reader_05.html Deewan-E-Sarai 02: Shahar Nama (Hindi) – http://www.sarai.net/language/deewan/deewan02/deewan02.htm Media Nagar 02 (Hindi) – http://www.sarai.net/mediacity/filmcity/medianagar02.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ [END OF BROADSHEET] CREDITS Editorial Collective: Aarti Sethi Iram Ghufran Shveta Sarda Editorial Co-ordinator Monica Narula Design (print version): Mrityunjay Chatterjee Photographs: Monica Narula Write to broadsheet at sarai.net From vina.raj369 at gmail.com Mon Sep 19 20:53:51 2005 From: vina.raj369 at gmail.com (VRaj) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:53:51 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused Message-ID: <3187ddb405091908235cda09a7@mail.gmail.com> Where the truth lies, Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused by daughter in laws? Please check various messages from vicimts. www.saveindianfamily.com . What do you think? Please check below message. Regards, ___________________________________________________________________ The aim of the petition is to request to the high court is to recongnise the patterns of the vexatious cases as mentioned in the bhajanlal's Case & provide relief immediate relief and to publicise to the public the relief is availabel to innocent and that they need not go through trial always and to recognise the marital nature of many cases and not to proscute under the criminal law. Planing on getting the following recognised as patterns fo vexatious cases and prosecution of such cases should be stopped as being vexatious.This is the follow up on the Directions provided by Supreme court to high courts and lower courts that they have to prvent abuse of the law , elder abuse and legal terrorism by ending vexatious cases Prayer To stop vexatious cases in the following 1. Evidence of paramour 2. Evidence of cash flow or equal purchase of household good Items 3. evidence of spent in marriage 4. Divorce Filed in Other countries and allegations of dowry post these allegations 5. evidence of Fraud of Education or mental health Additional Prayer 1. To allow the NRIs to fight their cases abd prove their innocence without affecting the right to life guaranteed under the constituation of India 2. To inform the police that they only have power to arrest not the right to arrest in non-bailable cases and this power should be used sparingly and judiciously 3. To direct the police to investigate and prosecute vexatious cases under section 211 4. To again re-itrate the judicial opinion that 498a should be made bailable as per Mailimaths committee reform Some of the schedules Planned 1. Adding in the schedule of documents 92 peoples testimony from "we are the victims of law" 2. Who Report 3. Suicide statistics 4. USA Travel Warning I have the following Case laws which I am planning to refer 1. Recent Supreme Court Judgement ( sushil Sharma vs India ) Directs the high courts and lower courts to protect the innocent 2. Pepsi Case 498a or a criminal cases is not a matter of idli vada sambhar 3. Andhra Pradesh High court judgment the punishment for the mistake of marrying an arrogant women is not criminal case 4. J.D. Kapoor Judgement too much misuse 5. Justice Saldhanas Judgement At the minimum 44% of cases the prosecution is totally unjustified 6. Justice Rajendra's Judgment serious analysis done by KArnatka Judiciary found a lot of misuse of the law 7. justice Saldhana judgement ( Comparitive laws ) Breaking of teeth in a fight is a minor offence. 8. Abdul Kalam Vs state of Gujarat If case is made that it is totally made up the cases cannot be prosectued If you have more cases on the similar lines which suggest why cases should not be prosecuted please help me by uploading to the group so that I can refer to it. What I am asking is not something the high court cannot execute and I think the PIL should be successfull since this is the first time it can have the backing of 1000-1500 people & and is asking for relief which is well within the powers of the courts to grant. Let me know your thoughts and keep hammering away in different forums to get a greater chances of success. This effort will not need money -- Kind Regards, Mr.VRaj From jaynakothari at justice.com Tue Sep 20 14:52:31 2005 From: jaynakothari at justice.com (Jayna Kothari) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 02:22:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused Message-ID: <20050920092232.27509.fh046.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and in-laws is being made again and again, without any statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's report, and the numerous high court judges make similar claims without any factual basis. There are so many studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies are easily available for people who are really interested. Out of curiosity I checked out this website called 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont think we should even entertain such questions. regards, Jayna On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:53:51 +0530, VRaj wrote: > > Where the truth lies, Is really provision like IPC > 498a is getting > misused by daughter in laws? Please check various > messages from > vicimts. www.saveindianfamily.com . What do you think? > Please check > below message. > > Regards, > > ___________________________________________________________________ > > The aim of the petition is to request to the high court > is to > recongnise the patterns of the vexatious cases as > mentioned in the > bhajanlal's Case & provide relief immediate relief and > to publicise to > the public the relief is availabel to innocent and that > they need not > go through trial always and to recognise the marital > nature of many > cases and not to proscute under the criminal law. > > Planing on getting the following recognised as patterns > fo vexatious > cases and prosecution of such cases should be stopped > as being > vexatious.This is the follow up on the Directions > provided by Supreme > court to high courts and lower courts that they have to > prvent abuse > of the law , elder abuse and legal terrorism by ending > vexatious cases > > Prayer > To stop vexatious cases in the following > 1. Evidence of paramour > 2. Evidence of cash flow or equal purchase of household > good Items > 3. evidence of spent in marriage > 4. Divorce Filed in Other countries and allegations of > dowry post > these allegations > 5. evidence of Fraud of Education or mental health > > Additional Prayer > 1. To allow the NRIs to fight their cases abd prove > their innocence > without affecting the right to life guaranteed under > the constituation > of India > 2. To inform the police that they only have power to > arrest not the > right to arrest in non-bailable cases and this power > should be used > sparingly and judiciously > 3. To direct the police to investigate and prosecute > vexatious cases > under section 211 > 4. To again re-itrate the judicial opinion that 498a > should be made > bailable as per Mailimaths committee reform > > Some of the schedules Planned > 1. Adding in the schedule of documents 92 peoples > testimony from "we > are the victims of law" > 2. Who Report > 3. Suicide statistics > 4. USA Travel Warning > > I have the following Case laws which I am planning to > refer > > 1. Recent Supreme Court Judgement ( sushil Sharma vs > India ) > Directs the high courts and lower courts to protect > the innocent > 2. Pepsi Case > 498a or a criminal cases is not a matter of idli > vada sambhar > 3. Andhra Pradesh High court judgment > the punishment for the mistake of marrying an > arrogant women is not > criminal case > 4. J.D. Kapoor Judgement > too much misuse > 5. Justice Saldhanas Judgement > At the minimum 44% of cases the prosecution is totally > unjustified > 6. Justice Rajendra's Judgment > serious analysis done by KArnatka Judiciary found a lot > of misuse of > the law > 7. justice Saldhana judgement > ( Comparitive laws ) Breaking of teeth in a fight is a > minor offence. > 8. Abdul Kalam Vs state of Gujarat > If case is made that it is totally made up the cases > cannot be > prosectued > > If you have more cases on the similar lines which > suggest why cases > should not be prosecuted please help me by uploading to > the group so > that I can refer to it. > > What I am asking is not something the high court cannot > execute and I > think the PIL should be successfull since this is the > first time it > can have the backing of 1000-1500 people & and is > asking for relief > which is well within the powers of the courts to grant. > > Let me know your thoughts and keep hammering away in > different forums > to get a greater chances of success. This effort will > not need money > > > > -- > Kind Regards, > > Mr.VRaj > _______________________________________________ > commons-law mailing list > commons-law at sarai.net > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law _________________________________________________ FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community http://www.FindLaw.com Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! http://mail.Justice.com From prabhuram at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 22:39:14 2005 From: prabhuram at gmail.com (prabhu ram) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 19:09:14 +0200 Subject: [Commons-Law] Pirates' copycat pose puts yoga on the mat Message-ID: <68752c9f05092010096ac92e88@mail.gmail.com> >Sydney Morning Herald Pirates' copycat pose puts yoga on the mat September 21, 2005 Western gurus have been marketing the East's ancient traditions and practices as their own, writes David Orr. It is meant to engender feelings of peace and wellbeing but yoga has become a battleground as India tries to stop its ancient heritage being exploited by the West. The Indian Government is furious that yoga practices dating back thousands of years are being "stolen" by gurus and fitness instructors elsewhere. Foreign practitioners are already said to have claimed hundreds of patents and copyrights on poses and techniques lifted straight from classical Indian yoga treatises. "Yoga piracy is becoming very common and we are moving to do something about it," says Vinod Gupta, the head of a recently established Indian Government taskforce on traditional knowledge and intellectual property theft. "We know of at least 150 asanas [yoga positions] that have been pirated in the US, the UK, Germany and Japan. These were developed in India long ago and no one can claim them as their own." In an effort to protect India's heritage, the taskforce has begun documenting 1500 yoga postures drawn from classical texts - including the writings of the Indian sage Patanjali, the first man to codify the art of yoga. The data is being stored in a digital library, the contents of which will soon be made available to patents offices worldwide. The worst "culprits" are Indians based in the US, where yoga has become a $US30 billion ($39 billion) a year business - a growth fuelled by celebrity adherents such as Madonna. Among Western gurus who have prompted the concern, says an Indian official, is Bikram Choudhury, whose "Bikram" or "Vikram" method is one of the most fashionable styles in the West. A session involves a series of 26 poses in a room heated to 32-38 degrees, enabling pupils to adopt more "extreme" positions than at normal temperatures. A spokesman for Choudhury refused to discuss the taskforce report, but the guru has previously said that rather than claiming intellectual ownership of the individual postures themselves, he has copyrighted a sequence of poses, the dialogue that accompanies them and the environment in which they are performed during his classes. These, he claims, are all of his own devising. The US Patents Office has issued 134 patents on yoga accessories, 150 yoga-related copyrights and 2315 yoga trademarks, says the Indian taskforce. It also claims that Britain has approved at least 10 trademarks relating to yoga training aids mentioned in ancient texts. One report says attempts have even been made in America to patent the syllable "om", the sacred sound with which Hindus begin their chants. "No one should be able to claim ownership of these traditional postures," says Gupta. "The information has been in the public domain in India for thousands of years. But, until now, it has only been available in languages which people in the outside world cannot understand." Special computer software has been developed to translate the ancient texts into English, French, German, Spanish and Japanese."This is a very good idea," says B.K.S. Iyengar, the 86-year-old yoga guru credited with introducing yoga to the West in the 1970s. "Yoga is an essential part of our heritage and India has to protect it." The move is part of a larger project to document all sources of traditional Indian knowledge. The database contains details of thousands of herbal treatments drawn from age-old health systems. So far, 10 million of an estimated 30 million pages of texts in Sanskrit, Arabic and Persian have been translated and entered into the digital library. India was alerted to commercial exploitation of its national heritage in 1995, when a US company was granted a patent on the wound-healing properties of turmeric. Two years later, another company was granted a patent on basmati rice. India successfully challenged both patents. Telegraph, London -- Prabhu Ram, Max-Planck-Institut for Intellectual Property, Competition and Tax Law, MarstallPlatz 1, 80539 Munich GERMANY Tel: + 49 89 24246226 Mob: + 49 17629830521 Web: http://infoserve.blogspot.com From venx at justice.com Tue Sep 20 23:17:41 2005 From: venx at justice.com (venx at justice.com) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:47:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Scanning in books to benefit blind students Message-ID: <20050920174742.1670.fh043.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> i have a few questions for this group on behalf of someone i know who is volunteering with a non-profit organisation in california to set up a website to benefit blind students in india and other south asian countries. One of the initiatives involves scanning in NCERT books into the computer and using the non-profit's own software to convert the books to a format that makes it possible for the material to have an audio or Braille output. This organisation is called Bookshare, Inc. Their website is www.bookshare.org. Separately, the NCERT board has on its own put several of their books online. However, these are not useful to the blind as they are not in a format that can be used by the blind. 1. Is it permissible to take something that is already on the web (e.g., the books already available on the NCERT website) and upload it to the non-profit organisation's website and make it available to the blind? 2. Can the books be scanned directly into the non-profit organisation's web site and be used to help the blind without using what is on the NCERT website (but this would involve scanning in NCERT books)? Some of these books are already there on the NCERT website and some are not. 3. Are there any copyright laws in India as in the U.S. that allow distribution of copyrighted materials in specialized formats to people with print disabilites? please let me know if these questions are not clear. any kind of help would be greatly appreciated. thanks, venkatesh vijayaraghavan B.A., LL.B.(Hons.) (National Law School of India University) 20 Murrays Gate Road Chennai 600018 INDIA _________________________________________________ FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community http://www.FindLaw.com Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! http://mail.Justice.com From asimov at vsnl.com Tue Sep 20 23:37:10 2005 From: asimov at vsnl.com (Badri Natarajan) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 19:07:10 +0100 (BST) Subject: [Commons-Law] Scanning in books to benefit blind students In-Reply-To: <20050920174742.1670.fh043.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> References: <20050920174742.1670.fh043.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <8877.193.111.25.196.1127239630.squirrel@webmail3.pair.com> Venx, > 1. Is it permissible to take something that is already on the web > (e.g., the books already available on the NCERT website) and upload it > to the non-profit organisation's website and make it available to the > blind? I doubt it, Venx. Unless NCERT has something in its terms of use (if it has any at all) that lets you do it. There's probably some kind of implied right to download for personal use, but I really doubt that redistribution would be included in that. > 2. Can the books be scanned directly into the non-profit > organisation's web site and be used to help the blind without using > what is on the NCERT website (but this would involve scanning in NCERT > books)? Some of these books are already there on the NCERT website and > some are not. Even less likely to be allowed. Seems to be clear copyright violation to me. > 3. Are there any copyright laws in India as in the U.S. that allow > distribution of copyrighted materials in specialized formats to people > with print disabilites? My quick scan of the Copyright Act's provisions suggest there are no such special provisions (or anything that would help with your earlier questions). Of course, I may have missed something. Keep in mind that if BookShare goes ahead and does whatever they want, the *practical* consequences are likely to be absolutely nothing... Badri From lawrence at altlawforum.org Wed Sep 21 10:40:00 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 10:40:00 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] EBC injunction against Manupatra Message-ID: Hi all Interesting development, the EBC onslaught against competitors continues Lawrence ============== >From http://www.ebc-india.com/pressrelease/press_manupatra.htm In a copyright infringement suit filed by Eastern Book CompanyTM, publishers of the famous law report Supreme Court CasesTM against Manupatra, a web-based legal information provider, the High Court at Delhi on 27-05-2005 has injuncted Manupatra from copying the judgments of the Supreme Court as published in Supreme Court CasesTM and selling them to the public on its web-site or CD-Rom, though however Manupatra remains free to incorporate in their web-site as well as CD-Roms the judgments of courts as well as their own notes IA No. 4431/2005 Notice for 5th July, 2005. A perusal of the averments made in the plaint, application under consideration and the documents placed on record shows that the plaintiffs are leading publishers of the Law Reports under the title "Supreme Court Cases" (SCC). The grievance of the plaintiffs is that the defendants have started copying and then incorporating in their website as well as CD-ROMs the exact copies of the reports being published by them in their publication (SCC), including the head notes, short notes, long notes, editorial notes and other editing inputs. The plaintiffs' have no objection if the defendants incorporate in their website as well as CD-ROMs the judgments delivered by the Courts but they have a grievance against the physical lifting of the copies of the judgments as reported by them in their publication SCC, which tantamounts to infringement of their copyrights therein. This Court is of the considered view that in case no ex parte ad interim injunction is granted, the plaintiffs may suffer irreparable loss/injury as the defendants may continue to make undue gains for themselves at the cost of the plaintiffs by incorporating in their website and CD-ROMs exact copies of plaintiff's reports in SCC. Accordingly, till the next date of hearing, the defendants as well as all others acting through them stand restrained from publishing, reproducing storing in any medium, transmitting, offering for sale, selling, distributing, issuing to the public, renting, allowing access through their website or CD-ROMs either free or for a fee, exact copies of the reports including the head notes, short notes, long notes, editorial notes and other editing inputs lifted from plaintiff's publication (SCC). The defendants', however, remain free to incorporate in their website as well as CD-ROMs the judgments of Courts as well as their own notes. Order XXXIX Rule 3 CPC be complied within three days. Copy dasti, Sd/- May 27, 2005 From lawrence at altlawforum.org Wed Sep 21 14:27:09 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 14:27:09 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Authors Guild Sues Google Message-ID: US authors group sues Google Eric Auchard SEPTEMBER 21, 2005 THE Authors Guild, a US writers advocacy group, has sued Google the US federal court, alleging that the web search leader's bid to digitise the book collections of major libraries infringes on individual author's copyrights. The lawsuit, filed in the US District Court for the Southern District of New York against Google, names as co-plaintiffs The Authors Guild and writers Herbert Mitgang, Betty Miles and Daniel Hoffman. New York Times editorial writer. Miles is a children's book author. The lawsuit seeks class action status, asks for damages and demands an injunction to halt further infringements. This is the latest round in the battle between Google and publishers that pit copyright holders' interests against the company's mission of "organising the world's information and making it more universally accessible and useful." A Google spokesman said the company regretted that the Authors Guild had chosen to sue rather than continue discussions.  ADVERTISEMENT "Google Print directly benefits authors and publishers by increasing awareness of and sales of the books in the program," Google said in a statement. "Only small portions of the books are shown unless the content owner gives permission to show more." A year ago, Google began working with five of the world's libraries - at Harvard, Oxford, Stanford, the University of Michigan and the New York Public Library - to make large parts of their book collections searchable on the web. The action by the 86-year-old Authors Guild is part of a push by the organisation to roll back efforts by web sites to make the contents of books freely available online. In a related case, the group has been seeking for a decade to force online publishers from New York Times to Amazon.com to pay royalties to writers whose stories appear in online databases without their consent. In August, Google said it planned to temporarily scale back plans to make the full text of copyrighted books available on its internet site. Google has said it will respect the wishes of copyright holders who contacted the company and asked for their books to be withheld from the project. Meanwhile, it said it was working with publishers and librarians to scan books in the public domain that are not covered by copyright. Critics of the program said that Google's plan to allow copyright holders to opt out of the project switches the burden of upholding copyright from infringers to copyright holders. "This is a plain and brazen violation of copyright law," Nick Taylor, president of the 8,000-member New York-based Authors Guild, said in a statement on Tuesday. "(Authors), not Google, have the exclusive rights to ... authorise such reproduction, distribution and display of their works," the complaint said. An attorney with Kohn Swift & Graf PC, the plaintiffs' law firm based in Philadelphia, said the lawsuit had been filed earlier today in US federal court in Manhattan. Reuters From lawrence at altlawforum.org Wed Sep 21 18:33:46 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 18:33:46 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Setting up Low-Cost Information Centres In-Reply-To: <84e95ec55b9b0304a6e5096907d7fcdc@192.168.1.5> Message-ID: Hi All Please spread the word to anyone interested Lawrence ------ Forwarded Message From: CED Bangalore Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 18:28:36 +0620 To: Subject: Setting up Low-Cost Information Centres Dear Sir/Madam, Setting Up a Low Cost Information Centre This workshop is a short introduction meant to familiarize middle or senior project personnel with the wherewithal to start a low cost, but focused information centre. WORKSHOP : Setting Up a Low Cost Information Centre Conducted by Centre for Education & Documentation (Doccentre) Dates:25th, 26th and 27th September 2005 Venue: Vidyadeep College, 128/1, Ulsoor Road, Bangalore 560042 Ph: 080-25587965 / 25590662 / 25587965 Mob: 94480 09974 This schedule below is tentative and flexible and will be firmed up according to the expectations of the participants. Costs: Rs: 3000/- (Includes Board Lodging, Workshop and Material Fees): Some Scholarships available (Please write in for details). Call us(CED) on 080-25353397 or 93412 48784 for further details on the programme. warm regards, Veena ====================================================== Schedule of the Workshop: 25th Sept, 2005 (Day 1) Session 1: 2 pm to 3 pm Introductions & Expectations of participants Session 2: 3 pm to 4 pm Setting up your DC. Elements of a DC Making it accessible to Public. Session 3: 4.30- 6.30 pm Information Sources Planning a Mix of Sources based on your needs, Systems for Follow-up, Processing. 26th Sept, 2005 (Day 2) Session 4: 9 am to 10:30pm Information Sources Non-formal Sources. How to handle this information. Session 5: 11 am to 1 pm Classification System Principles of Classification Developing a Classification System Session 6: 2:00pm to 5:00pm Classification System Developing a Classification System Exercise of classifying Session 7: 6:00pm to 8:00pm Executive Workshop: Informations needs of NGOs Using DPs , CCs, & DD to build up your basic Documentation Centre Sharing session with CEOs of NGOs on the information needs, and planning our activities to meet that need. Existing Documentation efforts, Sharing and plugging into them. Short cuts. Identifying specialised documentation work and making time for them. 27th Sept, 2005 (Day 3) Session 8: 9:00am to 10:30pm Electronic Documentation Cataloging in Computer/Indexing Session 9: 11:00am to 12.30 pm Electronic Documentation Indexing Electronic Documentation, Using Internet Session 10: 12.30 pm ­ 1.30 pm Feedback. & Follow up/Evaluation/Future Cooperation/Sharing ------ End of Forwarded Message -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050921/cef4a74d/attachment.html From vina.raj369 at gmail.com Thu Sep 22 00:50:42 2005 From: vina.raj369 at gmail.com (VRaj) Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 00:50:42 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused In-Reply-To: <20050920092232.27509.fh046.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> References: <20050920092232.27509.fh046.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <3187ddb405092112202e1c6115@mail.gmail.com> Hello Jayna Kothari, I was surprised to see your comments in so indifferent way, Please allow me discuss one by one. Point 1. ""Out of curiosity I checked out this website called 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont think we should even entertain such questions."" Members Please you can browse yourself and try to understand and of you could understand please let me know by what way it is sexist Respected Jayana, I am not sure which website you have browsed, please check spells and please confirm did you browsed following website, "http://www.saveindianfamily.com" I personaly I do not see this website as "highly sexist, offensive, preachy" as stated by you. All members here are knowledgeable and aware they themself can go and check. Let me know If I am worng. I will be very glad to receive your views on contents of website and improve my knowledge. Howecre I will not be in postion to appriaciate such false views and comments. Point 2: ""There are so many studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies are easily available for people who are really interested."" I am not sure which studies you are refering too. If I am not wrong, There are no such recent and complete studies / survey made, they seem to be false views created in the past on incomplete and partiall study. I will be very glad to get these study /survey reports if they are available, and willing to pay for the same. if there are any nominal charges. In the past three times I personaly approched TISS, Bombay for these study reports, without any success. If you get these reports for me, it will be very usefull and I will be thankfull to you. The only study /survey refered in various discussion, it is the study done by TISS in 1983 in Nashik district in particular taluka or similar. For this I approached TISS three times without any success. It appears this study was conducted in very biased manner and entirly for different purpose and on very different grounds. The result of which is wrongly applied and used. Hence I will be very thankfull, if you could give me details of this study which will help me to understand the ground reality. and respond. If you know any addtiona survy reports please let me know, this will mprove my knowledge. It seems during past and present to gets various grands and funds various organisation has creaded this false picture of dowry stiken India in international media. By this way they have received funds but created a bad image of India on international media.Due to this reason there are so many womans forum exists and no single child forum exists and no single froum for men. India has so much of corruption, why there only 2 to 3 forum for fighting corruption but 1000 of forums for saving woman from dowry domestic violence. Why are fundamental natural laws getting twisted for these so called protecting woman, Really protection of woman or dowry lies in removing the corruption from police and justice making laws effective. Where as makeing such twised laws like 498a and DV act, legistives are giving more option for corruption. and weaking the india and institution of marriage. Marriage laws are only made for woman and not for man. Point 3: " The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and in-laws is being made again and again, without any statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's report, and the numerous high court judges make similar claims without any factual basis." You being Senior Advocate , I do not expect such comment from you regarding SC, HC. These judge's are the people who come to know all facts of the case during trial, they go thorugh such cases every day,more then a lawyer or a individual working in NGO can come across. if their statements say these things means there is a value and truth in it. I do not what makes you to make such bold statement, comments for these respected people. In the process stop me from allowing to discuss and raise one important issue to all respected members here. If fora moment, it is assumed you are right. Then why some one like you has not filled any case/PIL against these people to correct there views. Why there is totally sileence from various womans forum. There 1000's of womans forums and not a single children or man forum. Most of these forums are creaded to get some sort of funds from gov and or other peoples and not for the real objective. Please allow me to paste some of the comments of "Vimochana" a leading NGO workign for woman in bangalore and refered by you in your discussion. http://indiafamily.net/talk/messages/54/1647.html?999111817 http://www.freespeech.org/manushi/110/vimochana.html "What we regret most is the misuse of the strict anti-dowry laws. Ironically, as a women's organisation, we were in the forefront in demanding such legislation. One visit to the Bangalore Central Jail and its gross misuse becomes evident. We found that out of 30 cases, eight pertained to dowry deaths and in each such dowry case, at least six or more members of a family have been jailed. There are too many trumped-up charges. There are cases where the girl has died at her parent's house and it was made out to be a dowry suicide case." Similar views expressed by MANUSHI from Delhi, "Police and Lawyers Mislead During the preliminary investigations carried out by MANUSHI, several lawyers provided us with instances of the police using the threat of arrest to extort a lot of money from the husband's family. Likewise, people allege that the police threatened to oppose or delay granting of bail unless the accused family coughed up fairly hefty amounts as bribes. Others allege that many lawyers encourage complainants to exaggerate the amounts due to them as stridhan, assuring them that they would get them a hefty settlement from the husband, provided they got a certain percentage as commission for their services in coercing the husband's family. " http://www.indiatogether.org/manushi/issue120/domestic.htm http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/Organizations/grhf/SAsia/forums/dv/articles/dvindia.html Going thorgh all above messages these websits and blogs i am of view. There is a large scale misuse of IPC 498a and Dowry Act. I wonder, How one can justify arrest or harrsement of age old parents, pregrent sisters and childrens of family, who never seens or visted daughter-in-law before or after marriage. due to the difference between between son and daughter-in-law. To scroe or pressurize daughter-in-law files false case by just sending fax from USA to indian police station and all these people get arrested in india, under non-bailable offence for years together, with out any investigation. I THINK THESE LAWS NEEDs TO BE CHECKED and MODIFY to STOP THERE MIS USE. It should be modified if there are any genuion cases then it should give protection to woman , but it should not give licence to wife to score. On 9/20/05, Jayna Kothari wrote: > > > The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by > daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and > in-laws is being made again and again, without any > statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's > report, and the numerous high court judges make similar > claims without any factual basis. There are so many > studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS > and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show > that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies > are easily available for people who are really > interested. > > Out of curiosity I checked out this website called > 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its > content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont > think we should even entertain such questions. > > regards, > Jayna > > > > On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:53:51 +0530, VRaj wrote: > > > > > Where the truth lies, Is really provision like IPC > > 498a is getting > > misused by daughter in laws? Please check various > > messages from > > vicimts. www.saveindianfamily.com . What do you think? > > Please check > > below message. > > > > Regards, > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________ > > > > The aim of the petition is to request to the high > court > > is to > > recongnise the patterns of the vexatious cases as > > mentioned in the > > bhajanlal's Case & provide relief immediate relief and > > to publicise to > > the public the relief is availabel to innocent and > that > > they need not > > go through trial always and to recognise the marital > > nature of many > > cases and not to proscute under the criminal law. > > > > Planing on getting the following recognised as > patterns > > fo vexatious > > cases and prosecution of such cases should be stopped > > as being > > vexatious.This is the follow up on the Directions > > provided by Supreme > > court to high courts and lower courts that they have > to > > prvent abuse > > of the law , elder abuse and legal terrorism by ending > > vexatious cases > > > > Prayer > > To stop vexatious cases in the following > > 1. Evidence of paramour > > 2. Evidence of cash flow or equal purchase of > household > > good Items > > 3. evidence of spent in marriage > > 4. Divorce Filed in Other countries and allegations of > > dowry post > > these allegations > > 5. evidence of Fraud of Education or mental health > > > > Additional Prayer > > 1. To allow the NRIs to fight their cases abd prove > > their innocence > > without affecting the right to life guaranteed under > > the constituation > > of India > > 2. To inform the police that they only have power to > > arrest not the > > right to arrest in non-bailable cases and this power > > should be used > > sparingly and judiciously > > 3. To direct the police to investigate and prosecute > > vexatious cases > > under section 211 > > 4. To again re-itrate the judicial opinion that 498a > > should be made > > bailable as per Mailimaths committee reform > > > > Some of the schedules Planned > > 1. Adding in the schedule of documents 92 peoples > > testimony from "we > > are the victims of law" > > 2. Who Report > > 3. Suicide statistics > > 4. USA Travel Warning > > > > I have the following Case laws which I am planning to > > refer > > > > 1. Recent Supreme Court Judgement ( sushil Sharma vs > > India ) > > Directs the high courts and lower courts to protect > > the innocent > > 2. Pepsi Case > > 498a or a criminal cases is not a matter of idli > > vada sambhar > > 3. Andhra Pradesh High court judgment > > the punishment for the mistake of marrying an > > arrogant women is not > > criminal case > > 4. J.D. Kapoor Judgement > > too much misuse > > 5. Justice Saldhanas Judgement > > At the minimum 44% of cases the prosecution is totally > > unjustified > > 6. Justice Rajendra's Judgment > > serious analysis done by KArnatka Judiciary found a > lot > > of misuse of > > the law > > 7. justice Saldhana judgement > > ( Comparitive laws ) Breaking of teeth in a fight is a > > minor offence. > > 8. Abdul Kalam Vs state of Gujarat > > If case is made that it is totally made up the cases > > cannot be > > prosectued > > > > If you have more cases on the similar lines which > > suggest why cases > > should not be prosecuted please help me by uploading > to > > the group so > > that I can refer to it. > > > > What I am asking is not something the high court > cannot > > execute and I > > think the PIL should be successfull since this is the > > first time it > > can have the backing of 1000-1500 people & and is > > asking for relief > > which is well within the powers of the courts to > grant. > > > > Let me know your thoughts and keep hammering away in > > different forums > > to get a greater chances of success. This effort will > > not need money > > > > > > > > -- > > Kind Regards, > > > > Mr.VRaj > > _______________________________________________ > > commons-law mailing list > > commons-law at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > _________________________________________________ > FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community > http://www.FindLaw.com > Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! > http://mail.Justice.com > -- Kind Regards, Mr.VRaj From devilspot at yahoo.com Thu Sep 22 02:37:11 2005 From: devilspot at yahoo.com (protima pandey) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 14:07:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused In-Reply-To: <3187ddb405092112202e1c6115@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050921210711.52588.qmail@web32207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mr.V Raj, Can I forward the following cases to you, which are breaking my heart, my pocket and my conviction that society will change- a) A 4 year old case of a woman living in Texas who was nearly killed by a hot steam iron while she was trying to protect her child and herself from yet another episode of beating that her ex-husband inflicted on her. Dowry was just one of the many reasons he used to abuse her. She has fled, is in California and he has moved here and is fighting tooth and nail to get custody of the child. My client's parents moved to the US because the ex-husband was using his goondas to harrass them in Chennai. b) A 4 year old case of a San Diego woman whose ex-husband was abusing her for dowry and she one day snapped and stabbed him and is now serving a sentence for assault with deadly weapon. Child protective Services has her two year old daughter and she has to take DV classes and anger management classes before the court can re-examine her custody issues. All this while the child is with " Dadi ma" and "papa". c) A case where the victim was married to a successful chicago big-5 CPA. Her family are rich exporters from Delhi, they paid an arm and a leg as dowry, he still abused her, she tried fleeing from her home twice and he falsly accused her of stealing money. Finally her parents rescued her, she came to California, filed for divorce, and is in India since 2 years trying to pursue her IPC 498a case at Tis Hazari. .... I could go on. I have about several different cases where I run a support group for South Asian Women in California, going through various stages of DV related issues. I get calls from as far as Vancouver Canada. I was recently asked to be on the board of a DV shelter house in my county because they are flooded with immigrant women and their problems and they have no idea how to help them! ....and you say there is no need for dowry and DV related issues? Everything has a potential to be misused Mr.V Raj. You may have not seen the other side of the coin...I am awakened by the other side once every month at least.. and it saddens me that people like you who seem to be well-intentioned in their actions, do not recognize the need to face the truth. While volunteering in 1996 in Gharwal District in UP I met a woman who told me how she was beaten and abused for 4 years by her drunk husband every night, in full hearing range of the entire village. One night she had had enough and decided she would not let him hit her ever and as soon as he barged into the kitchen and lunged at her, she hit him across the face with a hot chimta ( tongs). He had the entire set of elders plus panchayat members at her door in no time and they chastized her for her behavior....she waited for them to stop talking and asked them..." where were you all when each night he beat me to near death and I screamed hoarse for help"! I will never forget that woman and her story. You want to work to defend "innocent in-laws", elders, etc.....what about reforming the society to eradicate dowry, to eradicate illiteracy, to end violence against men/women and children...what about these causes??!! You specifically referred to instances of how easy it is for a woman to send a fax to Indian police station to get the entire family arrested?? Wow! Please please please send me the name and number of the woman who was able to do this or at least the name of the SHO and fax number of the station where the fax was sent. It will be an invaluable asset to my clients. Really I mean no disrespect to you but honestly please do send me the details. Also, if the arrest involved paying a bribe to the SHO do let me know, I am sure my clients would consider that a small price to pay to get the harrasment and abuse to stop!! As for your comment about Judges "These judge's are the people who come to know all facts of the case during trial, they go thorugh such cases every day,more then a lawyer or a individual working in NGO can come across. if their statements say these things means there is a value and truth in it." ..Sadly the court room is where the perpetrators are at their best behavious, they are the epitome of innocence, the best Disney Dads/Moms in the world and dripping with sugary sweet charm. Judges are not clueless but they sure want to base their decisions on what they see with their eyes in their courtroom...their perception of what is and what actually went on are usually skewed by master manipulators..the perpetrators! They do not want to rule against what they see for fear of being overturned on appeal...so I would not say there is value and truth in what they decide! Merely a Cover your A&# attitude! Work with us Mr. V Raj to eradicate harrassment of all kinds against both women and men and I promise you will see why we need laws like IPC 498a. Protima Pandey VRaj wrote: Hello Jayna Kothari, I was surprised to see your comments in so indifferent way, Please allow me discuss one by one. Point 1. ""Out of curiosity I checked out this website called 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont think we should even entertain such questions."" Members Please you can browse yourself and try to understand and of you could understand please let me know by what way it is sexist Respected Jayana, I am not sure which website you have browsed, please check spells and please confirm did you browsed following website, "http://www.saveindianfamily.com" I personaly I do not see this website as "highly sexist, offensive, preachy" as stated by you. All members here are knowledgeable and aware they themself can go and check. Let me know If I am worng. I will be very glad to receive your views on contents of website and improve my knowledge. Howecre I will not be in postion to appriaciate such false views and comments. Point 2: ""There are so many studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies are easily available for people who are really interested."" I am not sure which studies you are refering too. If I am not wrong, There are no such recent and complete studies / survey made, they seem to be false views created in the past on incomplete and partiall study. I will be very glad to get these study /survey reports if they are available, and willing to pay for the same. if there are any nominal charges. In the past three times I personaly approched TISS, Bombay for these study reports, without any success. If you get these reports for me, it will be very usefull and I will be thankfull to you. The only study /survey refered in various discussion, it is the study done by TISS in 1983 in Nashik district in particular taluka or similar. For this I approached TISS three times without any success. It appears this study was conducted in very biased manner and entirly for different purpose and on very different grounds. The result of which is wrongly applied and used. Hence I will be very thankfull, if you could give me details of this study which will help me to understand the ground reality. and respond. If you know any addtiona survy reports please let me know, this will mprove my knowledge. It seems during past and present to gets various grands and funds various organisation has creaded this false picture of dowry stiken India in international media. By this way they have received funds but created a bad image of India on international media.Due to this reason there are so many womans forum exists and no single child forum exists and no single froum for men. India has so much of corruption, why there only 2 to 3 forum for fighting corruption but 1000 of forums for saving woman from dowry domestic violence. Why are fundamental natural laws getting twisted for these so called protecting woman, Really protection of woman or dowry lies in removing the corruption from police and justice making laws effective. Where as makeing such twised laws like 498a and DV act, legistives are giving more option for corruption. and weaking the india and institution of marriage. Marriage laws are only made for woman and not for man. Point 3: " The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and in-laws is being made again and again, without any statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's report, and the numerous high court judges make similar claims without any factual basis." You being Senior Advocate , I do not expect such comment from you regarding SC, HC. These judge's are the people who come to know all facts of the case during trial, they go thorugh such cases every day,more then a lawyer or a individual working in NGO can come across. if their statements say these things means there is a value and truth in it. I do not what makes you to make such bold statement, comments for these respected people. In the process stop me from allowing to discuss and raise one important issue to all respected members here. If fora moment, it is assumed you are right. Then why some one like you has not filled any case/PIL against these people to correct there views. Why there is totally sileence from various womans forum. There 1000's of womans forums and not a single children or man forum. Most of these forums are creaded to get some sort of funds from gov and or other peoples and not for the real objective. Please allow me to paste some of the comments of "Vimochana" a leading NGO workign for woman in bangalore and refered by you in your discussion. http://indiafamily.net/talk/messages/54/1647.html?999111817 http://www.freespeech.org/manushi/110/vimochana.html "What we regret most is the misuse of the strict anti-dowry laws. Ironically, as a women's organisation, we were in the forefront in demanding such legislation. One visit to the Bangalore Central Jail and its gross misuse becomes evident. We found that out of 30 cases, eight pertained to dowry deaths and in each such dowry case, at least six or more members of a family have been jailed. There are too many trumped-up charges. There are cases where the girl has died at her parent's house and it was made out to be a dowry suicide case." Similar views expressed by MANUSHI from Delhi, "Police and Lawyers Mislead During the preliminary investigations carried out by MANUSHI, several lawyers provided us with instances of the police using the threat of arrest to extort a lot of money from the husband's family. Likewise, people allege that the police threatened to oppose or delay granting of bail unless the accused family coughed up fairly hefty amounts as bribes. Others allege that many lawyers encourage complainants to exaggerate the amounts due to them as stridhan, assuring them that they would get them a hefty settlement from the husband, provided they got a certain percentage as commission for their services in coercing the husband's family. " http://www.indiatogether.org/manushi/issue120/domestic.htm http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/Organizations/grhf/SAsia/forums/dv/articles/dvindia.html Going thorgh all above messages these websits and blogs i am of view. There is a large scale misuse of IPC 498a and Dowry Act. I wonder, How one can justify arrest or harrsement of age old parents, pregrent sisters and childrens of family, who never seens or visted daughter-in-law before or after marriage. due to the difference between between son and daughter-in-law. To scroe or pressurize daughter-in-law files false case by just sending fax from USA to indian police station and all these people get arrested in india, under non-bailable offence for years together, with out any investigation. I THINK THESE LAWS NEEDs TO BE CHECKED and MODIFY to STOP THERE MIS USE. It should be modified if there are any genuion cases then it should give protection to woman , but it should not give licence to wife to score. On 9/20/05, Jayna Kothari wrote: > > > The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by > daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and > in-laws is being made again and again, without any > statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's > report, and the numerous high court judges make similar > claims without any factual basis. There are so many > studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS > and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show > that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies > are easily available for people who are really > interested. > > Out of curiosity I checked out this website called > 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its > content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont > think we should even entertain such questions. > > regards, > Jayna > > > > On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:53:51 +0530, VRaj wrote: > > > > > Where the truth lies, Is really provision like IPC > > 498a is getting > > misused by daughter in laws? Please check various > > messages from > > vicimts. www.saveindianfamily.com . What do you think? > > Please check > > below message. > > > > Regards, > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________ > > > > The aim of the petition is to request to the high > court > > is to > > recongnise the patterns of the vexatious cases as > > mentioned in the > > bhajanlal's Case & provide relief immediate relief and > > to publicise to > > the public the relief is availabel to innocent and > that > > they need not > > go through trial always and to recognise the marital > > nature of many > > cases and not to proscute under the criminal law. > > > > Planing on getting the following recognised as > patterns > > fo vexatious > > cases and prosecution of such cases should be stopped > > as being > > vexatious.This is the follow up on the Directions > > provided by Supreme > > court to high courts and lower courts that they have > to > > prvent abuse > > of the law , elder abuse and legal terrorism by ending > > vexatious cases > > > > Prayer > > To stop vexatious cases in the following > > 1. Evidence of paramour > > 2. Evidence of cash flow or equal purchase of > household > > good Items > > 3. evidence of spent in marriage > > 4. Divorce Filed in Other countries and allegations of > > dowry post > > these allegations > > 5. evidence of Fraud of Education or mental health > > > > Additional Prayer > > 1. To allow the NRIs to fight their cases abd prove > > their innocence > > without affecting the right to life guaranteed under > > the constituation > > of India > > 2. To inform the police that they only have power to > > arrest not the > > right to arrest in non-bailable cases and this power > > should be used > > sparingly and judiciously > > 3. To direct the police to investigate and prosecute > > vexatious cases > > under section 211 > > 4. To again re-itrate the judicial opinion that 498a > > should be made > > bailable as per Mailimaths committee reform > > > > Some of the schedules Planned > > 1. Adding in the schedule of documents 92 peoples > > testimony from "we > > are the victims of law" > > 2. Who Report > > 3. Suicide statistics > > 4. USA Travel Warning > > > > I have the following Case laws which I am planning to > > refer > > > > 1. Recent Supreme Court Judgement ( sushil Sharma vs > > India ) > > Directs the high courts and lower courts to protect > > the innocent > > 2. Pepsi Case > > 498a or a criminal cases is not a matter of idli > > vada sambhar > > 3. Andhra Pradesh High court judgment > > the punishment for the mistake of marrying an > > arrogant women is not > > criminal case > > 4. J.D. Kapoor Judgement > > too much misuse > > 5. Justice Saldhanas Judgement > > At the minimum 44% of cases the prosecution is totally > > unjustified > > 6. Justice Rajendra's Judgment > > serious analysis done by KArnatka Judiciary found a > lot > > of misuse of > > the law > > 7. justice Saldhana judgement > > ( Comparitive laws ) Breaking of teeth in a fight is a > > minor offence. > > 8. Abdul Kalam Vs state of Gujarat > > If case is made that it is totally made up the cases > > cannot be > > prosectued > > > > If you have more cases on the similar lines which > > suggest why cases > > should not be prosecuted please help me by uploading > to > > the group so > > that I can refer to it. > > > > What I am asking is not something the high court > cannot > > execute and I > > think the PIL should be successfull since this is the > > first time it > > can have the backing of 1000-1500 people & and is > > asking for relief > > which is well within the powers of the courts to > grant. > > > > Let me know your thoughts and keep hammering away in > > different forums > > to get a greater chances of success. This effort will > > not need money > > > > > > > > -- > > Kind Regards, > > > > Mr.VRaj > > _______________________________________________ > > commons-law mailing list > > commons-law at sarai.net > > https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law > > _________________________________________________ > FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community > http://www.FindLaw.com > Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! > http://mail.Justice.com > -- Kind Regards, Mr.VRaj _______________________________________________ commons-law mailing list commons-law at sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law Take a Minute, Donate an Hour, Change a Life http://www.workanhour.com --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050921/02288746/attachment.html From pj_bansal at yahoo.com Thu Sep 22 15:00:22 2005 From: pj_bansal at yahoo.com (Peter II) Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:30:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused Message-ID: <20050922093022.46211.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Protima Pandey, Jayna Kothari, Vina Raj, Satya and others, Yes the stories you sent are real. Those people should be booked by law and sent to jail. I truly despise those kind of wrong doings and we should work on removing dowry from our society which is a menace. We should eradicate men torturing women from our society. I am true supporter of this and will help you in this regard as much as I can. Please take my word for it. Please help understand my point of here now 1. I think IPC 498a is totally gender biased law. It gives wives and her family who have gone haywire license to abuse the law and have her husband and her in-laws sent to jail without any investigation with a non bailable warrant. In current modern India when we are talking about gender equality why do we have such barbaric laws which blatantly favors one gender. I agree this was meant for rural India in the 1980s when the bill for this law was passed. In those times it was hard for illiterate women to produce proof and I may have supported this law at that time. But times have changed now and we are talking about advance and developed India. Today in Delhi, Mumbai and in urban India where people know about this legal loophole, this law is more misused than being used for ulterior motives of wife and her parents. I dont want 498a to be eradicated I want the husband and families should get arrested only after proper investigation. We should not have such laws reflective of agrarian and third world country. 2. If the law is musused then the wife and her family should be booked and sent to Jail. Show me another country where it is so easy to file a false FIR and put all the in laws family in jail and get away with it. This is ridiculous. I demand that 498a should exist but if misused then there should be stronger punishment for people who misuse it. This will set an example for all the people who misuse this law. Filing a false 498a is as easy as ordering pizza and bang all the in laws in Jail no questions asked. I demand non bailable. non compoundable and cognizable aspect of this law should be amended. I believe you all will give neutral thoughts to my above demands and let me know what you think. You must be wondering who I am? I had arranged marriage with my wife in India. She is suffering from mental disorder and they hide this from us before marriage. She used to hit me and torture me here in USA. She even used to push and hit my mother who came to USA to visit us. She got arrested here in USA and spend a night in Jail and got convicted in US courts for domestic violence in public (I will send you her police report and court papers if you are interested). After I filed for Divorce here her mother went to India and file false 498a against me and my parents. We didnt take single paisa as dowry. This is not just my story but thousands of others (there are more false 498a cases being filed than true). Please go through some of the links Vina Raj sent they will show you other true stories. If you want more true stories let me know I will send you many more links and send you a document with hundreds of real stories similar as mine. Please help me amend this unjustified and ailing law which is being misused more and more in todays modern India. Peter --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050922/3d55ad43/attachment.html From srinivas at southcentre.org Thu Sep 22 15:37:37 2005 From: srinivas at southcentre.org (srinivas at southcentre.org) Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 12:07:37 +0200 Subject: [Commons-Law] IPC 498a In-Reply-To: <20050922100005.5C8A428D772@mail.sarai.net> Message-ID: There are stringent provisions in Prevention of Atrocities against dalits act (this is not exact name of the Act) and these were brought because there was a need to bring in the Act and incorporate stringent provisions. It was done to protect dalits and to act as a deterrent to those who indulge in violence against dalits. The IPC 498A is also similar to this. The site is anti women and it is nothing but a site that promotes hate speech. K.Ravi Srinivas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050922/24306356/attachment.html From sunil at mahiti.org Thu Sep 22 22:05:07 2005 From: sunil at mahiti.org (Sunil Abraham) Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 22:05:07 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] US announces global intellectual-property plan Message-ID: <1127406907.7547.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/0,39020645,39220179,00.htm The Bush administration on Wednesday announced new plans to expand its crackdown on intellectual-property infringement overseas. During California visits with high-tech and movie industry representatives, Commerce Department secretary Carlos Gutierrez described two new programmes aimed at eroding intellectual property infringement, which the department claims costs US businesses $250bn (£138bn) and 750,000 jobs per year. "The protection of intellectual property is vital to our economic growth and global competitiveness, and it has major consequences in our ongoing effort to promote security and stability around the world," he said. One programme would place intellectual property experts on the ground in regions where infringement is considered a concern. There they would work with overseas US businesses and native government officials to advocate improved intellectual-property rights protection, according to a department fact sheet. Experts will be sent to Brazil, India, Russia, Thailand, China and the Middle East and serve a five-year tour of duty, the fact sheet said. One such expert is already on the job in Beijing, but it was unclear when the others would be dispatched or who they would be. Another programme, called the Global Intellectual Property Rights Academy, would train foreign judges, enforcement officials and other stakeholders in international intellectual property "obligations" and best practices. The academy, overseen by the US Patent and Trademark Office, plans to convene in 24 sessions in 2006, paying all travel expenses for the foreign participants, who will come from many of the same areas where experts will be working. The Commerce Department has recently taken other actions intended to combat international intellectual-property infringement. In July, President Bush created within the department a senior-level position — the coordinator for international intellectual-property enforcement. The department also plans to continue holding small-business outreach seminars nationwide. The Business Software Alliance was quick to applaud the announcement. In a press release, the organization cited survey results that pegged rates of usage of unlicensed software at 90 percent in China, 87 percent in Russia, 74 percent in India, 70 percent in Thailand, 64 percent in Brazil and 58 percent in the Middle East. "In all those countries, there's a long history of bilateral discussions on IPR issues," said Robert Holleyman, chief executive of BSA. "So I think they will be very receptive to getting on-the-ground systems to help with this effort." Holleyman said he hoped the programmes would ultimately raise revenue for US companies and resellers selling in foreign markets and for companies native to those markets. -- Sunil Abraham, sunil at mahiti.org http://www.mahiti.org 314/1, 7th Cross, Domlur Bangalore - 560 071 Karnataka, INDIA Ph/Fax: +91 80 51150580. Mob: (91) 9342201521 UK: (44) 02000000259 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050922/24e5b2f9/attachment.bin From rakesh at sarai.net Fri Sep 23 16:06:56 2005 From: rakesh at sarai.net (Rakesh) Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 16:06:56 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Uncle Sam targets pirates of Palika Bazaar Message-ID: <4333DAC8.4060503@sarai.net> Dear All This is a piece of news in today's TOI about how the US govt. is targeting the pirates mostly in Brazil, Russia, India and China. For details go to the following link. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1239781.cms salam r -- Rakesh Kumar Singh Sarai-CSDS 29, Rajpur Road Delhi-110054 Ph: 91 11 23960040 Fax: 91 11 2394 3450 web site: www.sarai.net web blog: http://blog.sarai.net/users/rakesh/ From prabhuram at gmail.com Fri Sep 23 18:05:39 2005 From: prabhuram at gmail.com (prabhu ram) Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 14:35:39 +0200 Subject: [Commons-Law] The paperless library Message-ID: <68752c9f050923053531a6829c@mail.gmail.com> http://economist.com/science/PrinterFriendly.cfm?Story_ID=4423646 The paperless library Sep 22nd 2005 From The Economist print edition Free access to scientific results is changing research practices IT USED to be so straightforward. A team of researchers working together in the laboratory would submit the results of their research to a journal. A journal editor would then remove the authors' names and affiliations from the paper and send it to their peers for review. Depending on the comments received, the editor would accept the paper for publication or decline it. Copyright rested with the journal publisher, and researchers seeking knowledge of the results would have to subscribe to the journal. No longer. The internet—and pressure from funding agencies, who are questioning why commercial publishers are making money from government-funded research by restricting access to it—is making free access to scientific results a reality. This week, the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) issued a report describing the far-reaching consequences of this. The report, by John Houghton of Victoria University in Australia and Graham Vickery of the OECD, makes heavy reading for publishers who have, so far, made handsome profits. But it goes further than that. It signals a change in what has, until now, been a key element of scientific endeavour. The value of knowledge and the return on the public investment in research depends, in part, upon wide distribution and ready access. It is big business. In America, the core scientific publishing market is estimated at between $7 billion and $11 billion. The International Association of Scientific, Technical and Medical Publishers says that there are more than 2,000 publishers worldwide specialising in these subjects. They publish more than 1.2m articles each year in some 16,000 journals. This is now changing. According to the OECD report, some 75% of scholarly journals are now online. Entirely new business models are emerging; three main ones were identified by the report's authors. There is the so-called big deal, where institutional subscribers pay for access to a collection of online journal titles through site-licensing agreements. There is open-access publishing, typically supported by asking the author (or his employer) to pay for the paper to be published. Finally, there are open-access archives, where organisations such as universities or international laboratories support institutional repositories. Other models exist that are hybrids of these three, such as delayed open-access, where journals allow only subscribers to read a paper for the first six months, before making it freely available to everyone who wishes to see it. All this could change the traditional form of the peer-review process, at least for the publication of papers. The process is organised by the publisher but conducted, for free, by scholars. The advantages afforded by the internet mean that primary data is becoming available freely online. Indeed, quite often the online paper has a direct link to it. This means that reported findings are more readily replicable and checkable by other teams of researchers. Moreover, online publication offers the opportunity for others to comment on the research. Research is also becoming more collaborative so that, before they have been finalised, papers have been reviewed by several authors. This central tenet of scholarly publishing is changing, too. -- Prabhu Ram, Max-Planck-Institut for Intellectual Property, Competition and Tax Law, MarstallPlatz 1, 80539 Munich GERMANY Tel: + 49 89 24246226 Mob: + 49 17629830521 Web: http://infoserve.blogspot.com From jaynakothari at justice.com Fri Sep 23 18:16:52 2005 From: jaynakothari at justice.com (Jayna Kothari) Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 05:46:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused Message-ID: <20050923124704.25187.fh053.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Dear all, Let me try and respond to some of the issues that have been raised in the Section 498A discussion to the best that I can: 1. First of all, all laws may be generally open to misuse. Is there anything extraordinary about the misuse of Section 498A? I do not think so, and I am only relying on factual data and empirical studies to support my claim. A study of court decisions in the state of Maharashtra carried out by the Women's Studies Unit of the Tata Institute of Social Sciences in 1996 showed that only 2.2 % of cases brought under section 498A during 1990-96 resulted in conviction. Another study done by Vimochana in Bangalore during the years 1998-1999 on cases relating to dowry death and domestic violence based on the Karnataka State Crime Records data shows that only 22 cases of Section 304B (dowry death) and 498A were disposed of in 1998. Out of these, none resulted in conviction - 4 were acquitted and 18 were disposed by other methods. In 1999 too, there were no convictions - only 2 acquittals and 19 "other disposals". The latter category of ‘other disposals’ is an euphemism for "compromise cases", that is cases in which victims' families are induced or threatened into letting the police drop proceedings against the accused - a totally unacceptable procedure since criminal cases are not compoundable like civil actions. These facts show that in majority of the cases, even the entire trial is not completed and the complainants are forced to drop the proceedings. Therefore the argument which some of you might make that the abnormally low conviction rate proves the falsity of the cases cannot be sustained. Another significant study done by the Tata Institute of Social Sciences on Section 498A complaints in 1999 received in four police stations in Mumbai revealed that 40% of these complaints were filed by their family members, after the women were dead. This shows that in almost half of the cases of domestic violence, the women’s family only approaches the police after she is dead. These studies are available with TISS and Vimochana and if anyone is interested I am sure they would be very happy to supply copies. 2. Secondly, have there been any studies to show use and misuse of any other laws, for eg. theft or murder? Do we know how many convictions have taken place for other offences, as compared to the number of cases registered? I dont think there is any State sponsored study to determine what amoutns to misuse. Therefore, I would say that we should not loosely make claims of 'misuse' of Section 498A without keeping all these factors in mind. 3. Thirdly, there is no bar to the State enacting pro-women laws. In fact the constitution mandates the State to make special provisions for women and children in order to protect their rights. Therefore, I do not think that the argument that there should not be any pro-women laws can be sustained. 4. lastly, someone on the list complained of there being too many women's groups and not enough children's groups and men's rights groups! You may not be aware, but there are hundreds of child rights groups all over the country. And as regards groups to protect men's rights - you are free to start your own group to protect your rights if you believe they have been violated. India is a democracy which allows people to associate freely, so maybe some of the men on this list who believe that Section 498A is being used falsely against them must start their own group, and I wish them all the best! regards, Jayna On Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:25:33 -0700 (PDT), Peter II wrote: Protima Pandey, Jayna Kothari, Vina Raj, Satya and others, Yes the stories you sent are real. Those people should be booked by law and sent to jail. I truly despise those kind of wrong doings and we should work on removing dowry from our society which is a menace. We should eradicate men torturing women from our society. I am true supporter of this and will help you in this regard as much as I can. Please take my word for it. Please help understand my point of here now 1. I think IPC 498a is totally gender biased law. It gives wives and her family who have gone haywire license to abuse the law and have her husband and her in-laws sent to jail without any investigation with a non bailable warrant. In current modern India when we are talking about gender equality why do we have such barbaric laws which blatantly favors one gender. I agree this was meant for rural India in the 1980s when the bill for this law was passed. In those times it was hard for illiterate women to produce proof and I may have supported this law at that time. But times have changed now and we are talking about advance and developed India. Today in Delhi, Mumbai and in urban India where people know about this legal loophole, this law is more misused than being used for ulterior motives of wife and her parents. I dont want 498a to be eradicated I want the husband and families should get arrested only after proper investigation. We should not have such laws reflective of agrarian and third world country. 2. If the law is musused then the wife and her family should be booked and sent to Jail. Show me another country where it is so easy to file a false FIR and put all the in laws family in jail and get away with it. This is ridiculous. I demand that 498a should exist but if misused then there should be stronger punishment for people who misuse it. This will set an example for all the people who misuse this law. Filing a false 498a is as easy as ordering pizza and bang all the in laws in Jail no questions asked. I demand non bailable. non compoundable and cognizable aspect of this law should be amended. I believe you all will give neutral thoughts to my above demands and let me know what you think. You must be wondering who I am? I had arranged marriage with my wife in India. She is suffering from mental disorder and they hide this from us before marriage. She used to hit me and torture me here in USA. She even used to push and hit my mother who came to USA to visit us. She got arrested here in USA and spend a night in Jail and got convicted in US courts for domestic violence in public (I will send you her police report and court papers if you are interested). After I filed for Divorce here her mother went to India and file false 498a against me and my parents. We didnt take single paisa as dowry. This is not just my story but thousands of others (there are more false 498a cases being filed than true). Please go through some of the links Vina Raj sent they will show you other true stories. If you want more true stories let me know I will send you many more links and send you a document with hundreds of real stories similar as mine. Please help me amend this unjustified and ailing law which is being misused more and more in todays modern India. Peter [Commons-Law] Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused protima pandey devilspot at yahoo.com Wed Sep 21 23:07:11 CEST 2005 Previous message: [Commons-Law] Is really provision like IPC 498a is getting misused Next message: [Commons-Law] Pirates' copycat pose puts yoga on the mat Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Mr.V Raj, Can I forward the following cases to you, which are breaking my heart, my pocket and my conviction that society will change- a) A 4 year old case of a woman living in Texas who was nearly killed by a hot steam iron while she was trying to protect her child and herself from yet another episode of beating that her ex-husband inflicted on her. Dowry was just one of the many reasons he used to abuse her. She has fled, is in California and he has moved here and is fighting tooth and nail to get custody of the child. My client's parents moved to the US because the ex-husband was using his goondas to harrass them in Chennai. b) A 4 year old case of a San Diego woman whose ex-husband was abusing her for dowry and she one day snapped and stabbed him and is now serving a sentence for assault with deadly weapon. Child protective Services has her two year old daughter and she has to take DV classes and anger management classes before the court can re-examine her custody issues. All this while the child is with " Dadi ma" and "papa". c) A case where the victim was married to a successful chicago big-5 CPA. Her family are rich exporters from Delhi, they paid an arm and a leg as dowry, he still abused her, she tried fleeing from her home twice and he falsly accused her of stealing money. Finally her parents rescued her, she came to California, filed for divorce, and is in India since 2 years trying to pursue her IPC 498a case at Tis Hazari. .... I could go on. I have about several different cases where I run a support group for South Asian Women in California, going through various stages of DV related issues. I get calls from as far as Vancouver Canada. I was recently asked to be on the board of a DV shelter house in my county because they are flooded with immigrant women and their problems and they have no idea how to help them! ....and you say there is no need for dowry and DV related issues? Everything has a potential to be misused Mr.V Raj. You may have not seen the other side of the coin...I am awakened by the other side once every month at least.. and it saddens me that people like you who seem to be well-intentioned in their actions, do not recognize the need to face the truth. While volunteering in 1996 in Gharwal District in UP I met a woman who told me how she was beaten and abused for 4 years by her drunk husband every night, in full hearing range of the entire village. One night she had had enough and decided she would not let him hit her ever and as soon as he barged into the kitchen and lunged at her, she hit him across the face with a hot chimta ( tongs). He had the entire set of elders plus panchayat members at her door in no time and they chastized her for her behavior....she waited for them to stop talking and asked them..." where were you all when each night he beat me to near death and I screamed hoarse for help"! I will never forget that woman and her story. You want to work to defend "innocent in-laws", elders, etc.....what about reforming the society to eradicate dowry, to eradicate illiteracy, to end violence against men/women and children...what about these causes??!! You specifically referred to instances of how easy it is for a woman to send a fax to Indian police station to get the entire family arrested?? Wow! Please please please send me the name and number of the woman who was able to do this or at least the name of the SHO and fax number of the station where the fax was sent. It will be an invaluable asset to my clients. Really I mean no disrespect to you but honestly please do send me the details. Also, if the arrest involved paying a bribe to the SHO do let me know, I am sure my clients would consider that a small price to pay to get the harrasment and abuse to stop!! As for your comment about Judges "These judge's are the people who come to know all facts of the case during trial, they go thorugh such cases every day,more then a lawyer or a individual working in NGO can come across. if their statements say these things means there is a value and truth in it." ..Sadly the court room is where the perpetrators are at their best behavious, they are the epitome of innocence, the best Disney Dads/Moms in the world and dripping with sugary sweet charm. Judges are not clueless but they sure want to base their decisions on what they see with their eyes in their courtroom...their perception of what is and what actually went on are usually skewed by master manipulators..the perpetrators! They do not want to rule against what they see for fear of being overturned on appeal...so I would not say there is value and truth in what they decide! Merely a Cover your A&# attitude! Work with us Mr. V Raj to eradicate harrassment of all kinds against both women and men and I promise you will see why we need laws like IPC 498a. Protima Pandey VRaj wrote: Hello Jayna Kothari, I was surprised to see your comments in so indifferent way, Please allow me discuss one by one. Point 1. ""Out of curiosity I checked out this website called 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont think we should even entertain such questions."" Members Please you can browse yourself and try to understand and of you could understand please let me know by what way it is sexist Respected Jayana, I am not sure which website you have browsed, please check spells and please confirm did you browsed following website, "http://www.saveindianfamily.com" I personaly I do not see this website as "highly sexist, offensive, preachy" as stated by you. All members here are knowledgeable and aware they themself can go and check. Let me know If I am worng. I will be very glad to receive your views on contents of website and improve my knowledge. Howecre I will not be in postion to appriaciate such false views and comments. Point 2: ""There are so many studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies are easily available for people who are really interested."" I am not sure which studies you are refering too. If I am not wrong, There are no such recent and complete studies / survey made, they seem to be false views created in the past on incomplete and partiall study. I will be very glad to get these study /survey reports if they are available, and willing to pay for the same. if there are any nominal charges. In the past three times I personaly approched TISS, Bombay for these study reports, without any success. If you get these reports for me, it will be very usefull and I will be thankfull to you. The only study /survey refered in various discussion, it is the study done by TISS in 1983 in Nashik district in particular taluka or similar. For this I approached TISS three times without any success. It appears this study was conducted in very biased manner and entirly for different purpose and on very different grounds. The result of which is wrongly applied and used. Hence I will be very thankfull, if you could give me details of this study which will help me to understand the ground reality. and respond. If you know any addtiona survy reports please let me know, this will mprove my knowledge. It seems during past and present to gets various grands and funds various organisation has creaded this false picture of dowry stiken India in international media. By this way they have received funds but created a bad image of India on international media.Due to this reason there are so many womans forum exists and no single child forum exists and no single froum for men. India has so much of corruption, why there only 2 to 3 forum for fighting corruption but 1000 of forums for saving woman from dowry domestic violence. Why are fundamental natural laws getting twisted for these so called protecting woman, Really protection of woman or dowry lies in removing the corruption from police and justice making laws effective. Where as makeing such twised laws like 498a and DV act, legistives are giving more option for corruption. and weaking the india and institution of marriage. Marriage laws are only made for woman and not for man. Point 3: " The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and in-laws is being made again and again, without any statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's report, and the numerous high court judges make similar claims without any factual basis." You being Senior Advocate , I do not expect such comment from you regarding SC, HC. These judge's are the people who come to know all facts of the case during trial, they go thorugh such cases every day,more then a lawyer or a individual working in NGO can come across. if their statements say these things means there is a value and truth in it. I do not what makes you to make such bold statement, comments for these respected people. In the process stop me from allowing to discuss and raise one important issue to all respected members here. If fora moment, it is assumed you are right. Then why some one like you has not filled any case/PIL against these people to correct there views. Why there is totally sileence from various womans forum. There 1000's of womans forums and not a single children or man forum. Most of these forums are creaded to get some sort of funds from gov and or other peoples and not for the real objective. Please allow me to paste some of the comments of "Vimochana" a leading NGO workign for woman in bangalore and refered by you in your discussion. http://indiafamily.net/talk/messages/54/1647.html?999111817 http://www.freespeech.org/manushi/110/vimochana.html "What we regret most is the misuse of the strict anti-dowry laws. Ironically, as a women's organisation, we were in the forefront in demanding such legislation. One visit to the Bangalore Central Jail and its gross misuse becomes evident. We found that out of 30 cases, eight pertained to dowry deaths and in each such dowry case, at least six or more members of a family have been jailed. There are too many trumped-up charges. There are cases where the girl has died at her parent's house and it was made out to be a dowry suicide case." Similar views expressed by MANUSHI from Delhi, "Police and Lawyers Mislead During the preliminary investigations carried out by MANUSHI, several lawyers provided us with instances of the police using the threat of arrest to extort a lot of money from the husband's family. Likewise, people allege that the police threatened to oppose or delay granting of bail unless the accused family coughed up fairly hefty amounts as bribes. Others allege that many lawyers encourage complainants to exaggerate the amounts due to them as stridhan, assuring them that they would get them a hefty settlement from the husband, provided they got a certain percentage as commission for their services in coercing the husband's family. " http://www.indiatogether.org/manushi/issue120/domestic.htm http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/Organizations/grhf/SAsia/forums/dv/articles/dvindia.html Going thorgh all above messages these websits and blogs i am of view. There is a large scale misuse of IPC 498a and Dowry Act. I wonder, How one can justify arrest or harrsement of age old parents, pregrent sisters and childrens of family, who never seens or visted daughter-in-law before or after marriage. due to the difference between between son and daughter-in-law. To scroe or pressurize daughter-in-law files false case by just sending fax from USA to indian police station and all these people get arrested in india, under non-bailable offence for years together, with out any investigation. I THINK THESE LAWS NEEDs TO BE CHECKED and MODIFY to STOP THERE MIS USE. It should be modified if there are any genuion cases then it should give protection to woman , but it should not give licence to wife to score. On 9/20/05, Jayna Kothari wrote: > > > The claim that Sec. 498A is being rampantly misused by > daughters-in-law to harass their poor husbands and > in-laws is being made again and again, without any > statistics or facts in support. Justice Malimath's > report, and the numerous high court judges make similar > claims without any factual basis. There are so many > studies done by women's groups such as Vimochana, TISS > and AWAG all over the country, and these studies show > that there is no such trend of misuse. These studies > are easily available for people who are really > interested. > > Out of curiosity I checked out this website called > 'save the indian family' referred in this mail. Its > content is highly sexist, offensive, preachy so I dont > think we should even entertain such questions. > > regards, > Jayna > > > > On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:53:51 +0530, VRaj wrote: > > > > > Where the truth lies, Is really provision like IPC > > 498a is getting > > misused by daughter in laws? Please check various > > messages from > > vicimts. www.saveindianfamily.com . What do you think? > > Please check > > below message. > > > > Regards, > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________ > > > > The aim of the petition is to request to the high > court > > is to > > recongnise the patterns of the vexatious cases as > > mentioned in the > > bhajanlal's Case & provide relief immediate relief and > > to publicise to > > the public the relief is availabel to innocent and > that > > they need not > > go through trial always and to recognise the marital > > nature of many > > cases and not to proscute under the criminal law. > > > > Planing on getting the following recognised as > patterns > > fo vexatious > > cases and prosecution of such cases should be stopped > > as being > > vexatious.This is the follow up on the Directions > > provided by Supreme > > court to high courts and lower courts that they have > to > > prvent abuse > > of the law , elder abuse and legal terrorism by ending > > vexatious cases > > > > Prayer > > To stop vexatious cases in the following > > 1. Evidence of paramour > > 2. Evidence of cash flow or equal purchase of > household > > good Items > > 3. evidence of spent in marriage > > 4. Divorce Filed in Other countries and allegations of > > dowry post > > these allegations > > 5. evidence of Fraud of Education or mental health > > > > Additional Prayer > > 1. To allow the NRIs to fight their cases abd prove > > their innocence > > without affecting the right to life guaranteed under > > the constituation > > of India > > 2. To inform the police that they only have power to > > arrest not the > > right to arrest in non-bailable cases and this power > > should be used > > sparingly and judiciously > > 3. To direct the police to investigate and prosecute > > vexatious cases > > under section 211 > > 4. To again re-itrate the judicial opinion that 498a > > should be made > > bailable as per Mailimaths committee reform > > > > Some of the schedules Planned > > 1. Adding in the schedule of documents 92 peoples > > testimony from "we > > are the victims of law" > > 2. Who Report > > 3. Suicide statistics > > 4. USA Travel Warning > > > > I have the following Case laws which I am planning to > > refer > > > > 1. Recent Supreme Court Judgement ( sushil Sharma vs > > India ) > > Directs the high courts and lower courts to protect > > the innocent > > 2. Pepsi Case > > 498a or a criminal cases is not a matter of idli > > vada sambhar > > 3. Andhra Pradesh High court judgment > > the punishment for the mistake of marrying an > > arrogant women is not > > criminal case > > 4. J.D. Kapoor Judgement > > too much misuse > > 5. Justice Saldhanas Judgement > > At the minimum 44% of cases the prosecution is totally > > unjustified > > 6. Justice Rajendra's Judgment > > serious analysis done by KArnatka Judiciary found a > lot > > of misuse of > > the law > > 7. justice Saldhana judgement > > ( Comparitive laws ) Breaking of teeth in a fight is a > > minor offence. > > 8. Abdul Kalam Vs state of Gujarat > > If case is made that it is totally made up the cases > > cannot be > > prosectued > > > > If you have more cases on the similar lines which > > suggest why cases > > should not be prosecuted please help me by uploading > to > > the group so > > that I can refer to it. > > > > What I am asking is not something the high court > cannot > > execute and I > > think the PIL should be successfull since this is the > > first time it > > can have the backing of 1000-1500 people & and is > > asking for relief > > which is well within the powers of the courts to > grant. > > > > Let me know your thoughts and keep hammering away in > > different forums > > to get a greater chances of success. This effort will > > not need money > > > > > > > > -- > > Kind Regards, > > > > Mr.VRaj __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _________________________________________________ FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community http://www.FindLaw.com Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! http://mail.Justice.com From pj_bansal at yahoo.com Fri Sep 23 21:43:27 2005 From: pj_bansal at yahoo.com (Peter II) Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 09:13:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused In-Reply-To: <20050923124704.25187.fh053.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <20050923161327.15850.qmail@web31115.mail.mud.yahoo.com> To respond to some of your questions 1. First of all, all laws may be generally open to misuse. Is there anything extraordinary about the misuse of Section 498A? A. Yes, the extraordinary thing about 498a is it requires no proof whatsoever and all the people named in the FIR be it false are put in jail. Isn't this extraordinary. Take this situation even serial killer who has murdered dozens of people, before warrant is issued against him Police has to do investigation and if they find some evidence they can issue warrant to arrest the killer. Do you see any difference in the above two scenarios? 498a is a legal loophole in the Indian law system which is being more and more misused in todays Urban India. It allows many innocent people to be put in Jail without any investigation. Every other developed country laughs at such kind of law. We should change it. 2. A study of court decisions in the state of Maharashtra carried out by the Women's Studies Unit of the Tata Institute of Social Sciences in 1996 showed that only 2.2 % of cases brought under section 498A during 1990-96 resulted in convictionTherefore the argument which some of you might make that the abnormally low conviction rate proves the falsity of the cases cannot be sustained. A. The nature of 498a being that it is non compoundable which means once the wife or some one from her family files a 498a they cannon take it back and the onus of proof is on the defendent. The in laws are arrested in all normal scenarios and they have to prove in court that they innocent. In case of false FIR the defendents get acquitted and the wife and her family who registered false FIR go scot free. Isn't this again ridiculous. So your statement that very less conviction rate (2.2%) doesn't proves falsity of the case (what is your reasoning behind this) is contrary to what law says (once filed cannot be taken back and defendants has to prove that they are innocent). This law is being more misused then being used in todays modern India. It gives unlimited power to the wife and her family and this results in blackmail and jailing innocent pregnant sisters and old aging parents of the husband. All the statistics that you give (low conviction rate of 2.2%) itself proves that for every true 498a there is atleast 10 false 498a. If the police do some investigation before arresting as they do for murders and serial killers I think things would be much better. Are these innocent old parents and sisters of husband worse than those serial killers? Peter --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050923/c4e028a7/attachment.html From jaynakothari at justice.com Sat Sep 24 08:29:56 2005 From: jaynakothari at justice.com (Jayna Kothari) Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 19:59:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused Message-ID: <20050924025957.11373.fh047.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Dear Peter and Satyamev, You said, "Yes, the extraordinary thing about 498a is it requires no proof whatsoever and all the people named in the FIR be it false are put in jail" Where did you get this from? Sec/ 498A is part of the Indian Penal Code and requires the same amount of investigation and proof for arrest as all other cognizable offences. "The nature of 498a being that it is non compoundable which means once the wife or some one from her family files a 498a they cannon take it back and the onus of proof is on the defendent." This is exactly where the law is being overturned against women. Even though a case under 498A cannot be compounded or taken back, official state records show (including the Karnataka State Crime Records) that these cases are being taken back and women are forced to settle them by the police and magistrates. "If the police do some investigation before arresting as they do for murders and serial killers I think things would be much better. Are these innocent old parents and sisters of husband worse than those serial killers?" You know Peter, if a woman is killed within the four walls of a home, I dont think it is any different from murder. The family members or whoever is responsible for such killing should be treated as seriously as murderers. And lastly one response to Satyamev, Satyamev, I am not only using studies done by women since you say that they may be biased. Would you say that the reports of the Karnataka State Crime Records are also biased? I am sure these records were not made by women!! also one last question for you. You have made so many statements on 'truths about section 498A' on your blog and also in your email. Can you please give me some sources or empirical studies to support your statements? You have said that there are High court and Supreme court judges who deal with this social epidemic on a regular basis have said that the percentage is somewhere around 70-80%. I dont think we can rely on judges statements merely because they are judges. So please give me the exact judgements where these judges have said so, and give me information whether they have relied on any statistics whatsoever to state that the percentage of misuse is 70-80%. I am truly interested and curious. thanks, Jayna Peter Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. _________________________________________________ FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community http://www.FindLaw.com Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! http://mail.Justice.com From devilspot at yahoo.com Sat Sep 24 12:49:38 2005 From: devilspot at yahoo.com (protima pandey) Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2005 00:19:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused In-Reply-To: <20050924025957.11373.fh047.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <20050924071939.72776.qmail@web32213.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Satyamev, VRaj, Peter... > > > > > 1) I wish you could use your judgement to understand > if that laws like 498a and DV need ammendments, > there are a plenty of people who mis-use it. With > every 498a (filed by wife or her relative) there are > other women (mother-in-law, sister-in-law) who go > through hell. So 498a is not for protection of > women, it is for the protection of wife (WIFE > ONLY!!!). Why is that no other country in the world > have such gender-biased, wife-biased law? If you are > giving me the statistics w.r.t. the convictions and > judgements, then respect the statistics and confess > that the misuse of the law is rampant. The judicial > results speak for themselves. > Just like there is no other country in the world where practices like female infanticide, sati, un touchability, dowry practices, festivals where women fast without food or water for their husbands, etc. exist- there was a need to enact a law related to harassment within a family relating to dowry. Criminal cruelty laws under sec. 323 to 326 IPC and sec. 352 IPC can be used by both men and women. However those laws were not enough to help victims of dowry harassment hence the enactment of Sec.498a was necessary. Please bear in mind that THERE IS NO COMPARATIVE AMENDMENT IN THE EVIDENCE LAWS SO A COMPLAINANT HAS TO PROVE the same level of cruelty as required by the other general sections, regardless of whether the crime is non-bailable or not. And if the evidence is not sufficient- you do realize that the case will be dismissed. Hence the statistics regarding the really low percentage of conviction under this provision- Yep! The judicial results speak for themselves. > 2) If you want us to believe that the woman > organization statistics is more reliable than court > results, than we differ in opinions. What makes you > believe so much on woman organization and their > work. Please give me name of one independent social > research on 498a conducted by an organization which > is not headed by woman? > I am a bit weary of people saying that women are perpetuating a false picture! I am not sure why you think women can get away by giving incorrect information. I, for one, have worked with Non-profits headed by women as well as men and all experiences I have had in the area of crimes against women in and outside of marriage have been the same. (Human rights law network was being run by Colin Gonsalvez when I placed with them and Mahila Samakhya in UP was being run by Nishi Agarwal when I placed with them.) Please tell me how you conclude that a report should be discredited just because it was written or supervised by a woman! > 3) If you are trying to say woman do not have > problem of aggresion and that 498a is used as a last > resort by them to escape physical and mental > torture, then you ought to have open mind and do > some more readings by psychologist on the net. Huh? So when a family harasses the daughter in law for dowry and she decides to take action, she is doing so because she has a problem with aggression? Not sure how you come to that conclusion? It is preposterous to club all women and their claims under 498A as being caused by aggression! Have you any idea how many women have access to freely be able to seek legal recourse? For every woman who might be able to misuse the provision, there are countless who are not even aware of the fact that there are laws which protect them from harassment within the family! > > 4) You forgot to add that Center for Social research > headed by a woman (who confesses to being a > feminist) reported in August'2005 that only 6.5% of > the cases of 498a are false, where are High court > and Supreme court judges who deal with this social > epidemic on a regular basis have said that the > percentage is somewhere around 70-80%. > Pray please tell me what lead you to say “ who confesses to being a feminist”..may I take the liberty of asking you why you are equating being a feminist as being something that might be a bad thing?!! And could you please cite your source for the High Court and Supreme court judges mentioning the percentage of false claims as being 70-80? > Truth about IPC-498a > -------------------- > What 498a is: > > 1) Gender Biased law: Only women or her relative(s) > can invoke it. Nothing stops men from filing for cruelty, false claims, fraudulent claim, harassment, etc. under IPC. On the other hand, women had no specific recourse when they were being subject to harassment relating to dowry. And oh, the last time I checked, women were asked to pay dowry not men!! > 2) Wife specific : Only married women's relatives > can invoke it. Same as above! > 3) No proof required: Can be invoked by wife > whenever she wants, > without any proof of any sort. Preposterous. The level of proof required is the same as that required under sections 323 to 326 and sec. 352. The only time there is a presumption against innocence is when the woman dies within 7 years of marriage and it is proved that the woman was being harassed for dowry ( section 113A Evidence Act) > 4) Non-bailable: All those named in the FIR (first > Information > report) have to be arrested without police bail. > These people may > not be living within the same household as wife > (distant relatives > can be implicated too). Nothing turns on that. Bail can be applied for before a judge as soon as the arrests are made. > 5) Non-compundable: Once wife invokes it, she cannot > take it back. The reason being that many times the family coerces the victim to take the case back by threatening her and her family. The government prosecutor is free to decide not to move forward with the case if the evidence is insufficient! > 6) Criminal law: It is not a civil law, it comes > under criminal > code. Yep! It is an offence against a person which is criminal in nature and affects society as a whole therefore putting the onus on the state to protect the life and liberty of the person, therefore needing it to be enacted within criminal law. I am not sure how it would fit into a private party conflict scenario! > 7) This law exists only in India: No where in the > world you can find > this kind of ridiculous law. And no where in the world does the society still allow and accept the practice of dowry giving and taking so openly, in families rich and poor! No where in the world do societies keep mum when a woman is being harassed, abused and burnt alive in the name of dowry. > 8) Extortion racket: Most implicated people/family > are from middle > to high class And for every alleged false complaint filed, there are thousands of innocent victims whose lives are ruined and who die not knowing there was a law out there which could have saved them. > 9) No punishment for filing false 498a: even if it > is proved that > wife misused the law, she and her family members go > spotfree. Civil suit for filing false complaint, fraudulent complaint, etc. are not barred. Criminal laws are meant to be such that people are not afraid of repercussions or retaliations for coming out in the open and filing complaints! Can you imagine if the law started to punish all those who file complaints against powerful gangsters who end up getting acquitted as there is insufficient evidence against them? > 10) Causing corruption and misuse of police power: > Police harrasses > family members implicated in 498a. What percentage? Please cite a source. Police officers tend to be insensitive usually of women who want to file an FIR under 498A as their thinking borders closely with what you are suggesting! > 11) Simple search on internet will show that it is > getting misused > heavily by modern women in India and rural women > (for whom this law > was made) are more or less in the same situation as > they were when > the law was introduced. > Reality is not the internet my friend. NGOs and the government are doing all they can to spread awareness among families about laws of this kind. Reality is lack of resources for families to seek enforcement under such laws. Reality is people crying about this law instead of looking at it as a powerful tool to use to eradicate such practices from our societies. Reality is having the case thrown out of court because the woman could not produce sufficient evidence to prove that cruelty being faced was due to dowry demands, and having to go back to the same family even more in fear of her life. > 498a is not: > > 1) does not Save marriage: We do not have a single > incident when > wife reconciled with husband after 498a. Why would you want to go into a situation where you were abused, mistreated and left for dead while your family was shelling out thousands to feed the greed of your husband and in-laws! And the law is not meant to save the marriage, it is meant to save lives of women who will eventually suffer deadly consequences for not paying enough dowry. > 2) not helping wife also: We do not hear of what > happens to woman > who had put 498a. Why don't women organization > publish statistics > about post-498a state of women. They end up ALIVE AND LIVE WITH DIGNITY EVER AFTER. Sorry those are not numbers or statistics, merely the conclusion that most such cases seek and some get. > 3) not about gender equality: It is about improper > law to help wife > dictate the rules in a family. With every FIR, > another woman (mother- > in-law) is also implicated. > And with every case that does not get reported some mother in law out there is letting her greed get the best of her. Gender equality would result in the eradication of this practice all together thereby ending the need for such a law. Protima Pandey --- Jayna Kothari wrote: > > Dear Peter and Satyamev, > > You said, > "Yes, the extraordinary thing about 498a is it > requires > no proof whatsoever and all the people named in the > FIR > be it false are put in jail" > > Where did you get this from? Sec/ 498A is part of > the > Indian Penal Code and requires the same amount of > investigation and proof for arrest as all other > cognizable offences. > > "The nature of 498a being that it is non > compoundable > which means once the wife or some one from her > family > files a 498a they cannon take it back and the onus > of > proof is on the defendent." > This is exactly where the law is being overturned > against women. Even though a case under 498A cannot > be > compounded or taken back, official state records > show > (including the Karnataka State Crime Records) that > these cases are being taken back and women are > forced > to settle them by the police and magistrates. > > "If the police do some investigation before > arresting > as they do for murders and serial killers I think > things would be much better. Are these innocent old > parents and sisters of husband worse than those > serial > killers?" > You know Peter, if a woman is killed within the four > walls of a home, I dont think it is any different > from > murder. The family members or whoever is responsible > for such killing should be treated as seriously as > murderers. > > And lastly one response to Satyamev, > Satyamev, I am not only using studies done by women > since you say that they may be biased. Would you say > that the reports of the Karnataka State Crime > Records > are also biased? I am sure these records were not > made > by women!! > also one last question for you. You have made so > many > statements on 'truths about section 498A' on your > blog > and also in your email. Can you please give me some > sources or empirical studies to support your > statements? You have said that there are High court > and > Supreme court judges who deal with this social > epidemic > on a regular basis have said that the percentage is > somewhere around 70-80%. I dont think we can rely on > judges statements merely because they are judges. So > please give me the exact judgements where these > judges > have said so, and give me information whether they > have > relied on any statistics whatsoever to state that > the > percentage of misuse is 70-80%. I am truly > interested > and curious. > > thanks, > Jayna > > > > > > Peter > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief > effort. > > _________________________________________________ > FindLaw - Free Case Law, Jobs, Library, Community > http://www.FindLaw.com > Get your FREE @JUSTICE.COM email! > http://mail.Justice.com > Take a Minute, Donate an Hour, Change a Life http://www.workanhour.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From vina.raj369 at gmail.com Sun Sep 25 12:04:13 2005 From: vina.raj369 at gmail.com (VRaj) Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 12:04:13 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Fwd: [SaveIndianFamily] my reply to Jayna Kothari In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3187ddb4050924233444e35193@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Satyamev Jayate Date: Sep 25, 2005 11:36 AM Subject: [SaveIndianFamily] my reply to Jayna Kothari To: saveindianfamily at yahoogroups.com Hi Jayna, I am happy to hear that you are "really interested and curious". You must be living in denial if you think/say that filing for 498a requires proof. Are you trying to say all the victims I have met (well placed, learned people) are telling lies. Am I telling lie when I say my in-laws threaten my family with 498a without any proof. I suggested you to do this by yourself by going to the police station and try to put a case registered against the beloved ones and find out how easy it is ( I am very happy to note that you have an understanding and loving family). You are forgetting that laws like 498a give a whole sole freedom to wife and her relatives to get things done 'their way ---- otherwise'. I think are not able to portray and think like the evil woman because you are not like them. "You know Peter, if a woman is killed within the four walls of a home, I dont think it is any different from murder. The family members or whoever is responsible for such killing should be treated as seriously as murderers." I agree with you on this that if she is killed by her family members, then they deserve the murder punishment. I am not arguing for those pathetic people who would do such a henious crime. But if she says she was harassed and tortured, you and all women organizations would believe on her story. Why would you not believe the in-laws? Your predicament is that she must be telling the truth? Your argument and it's style shows that you have already made the judgement that in-laws and husband side are at wrong. I am not questioning government statistics, you were. If the cases are taken back by women for whatever reason, you said that they were forced to take the case back. Do the report say explicitly that the women "unwillingly" took the cases back? Did you talk with those woman to know the story? I have compiled the victim stories (guys who contacted us, when they were falsely implicated) which I will forward to you (I will have to remove the victim contact addresses). Do a search on the internet to find about judges "J D Kapoor" and justice Malimath, you will find out about the statistics. I will forward you the judgements and cases (only if you are really interested). - Satya Jayna Kothari wrote: Dear Peter and Satyamev, You said, "Yes, the extraordinary thing about 498a is it requires no proof whatsoever and all the people named in the FIR be it false are put in jail" Where did you get this from? Sec/ 498A is part of the Indian Penal Code and requires the same amount of investigation and proof for arrest as all other cognizable offences. "The nature of 498a being that it is non compoundable which means once the wife or some one from her family files a 498a they cannon take it back and the onus of proof is on the defendent." This is exactly where the law is being overturned against women. Even though a case under 498A cannot be compounded or taken back, official state records show (including the Karnataka State Crime Records) that these cases are being taken back and women are forced to settle them by the police and magistrates. "If the police do some investigation before arresting as they do for murders and serial killers I think things would be much better. Are these innocent old parents and sisters of husband worse than those serial killers?" You know Peter, if a woman is killed within the four walls of a home, I dont think it is any different from murder. The family members or whoever is responsible for such killing should be treated as seriously as murderers. And lastly one response to Satyamev, Satyamev, I am not only using studies done by women since you say that they may be biased. Would you say that the reports of the Karnataka State Crime Records are also biased? I am sure these records were not made by women!! also one last question for you. You have made so many statements on 'truths about section 498A' on your blog and also in your email. Can you please give me some sources or empirical studies to support your statements? You have said that there are High court and Supreme court judges who deal with this social epidemic on a regular basis have said that the percentage is somewhere around 70-80%. I dont think we can rely on judges statements merely because they are judges. So please give me the exact judgements where these judges have said so, and give me information whether they have relied on any statistics whatsoever to state that the percentage of misuse is 70-80%. I am truly interested and curious. thanks, Jayna ________________________________ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "saveindianfamily" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: saveindianfamily-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: saveindianfamily-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ________________________________ - -- Kind Regards, Mr.VRaj From vina.raj369 at gmail.com Sun Sep 25 16:41:30 2005 From: vina.raj369 at gmail.com (VRaj) Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 16:41:30 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused In-Reply-To: <20050924025957.11373.fh047.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> References: <20050924025957.11373.fh047.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <3187ddb40509250411ca64262@mail.gmail.com> Due to large size of the message , i need to repost, sorry for the inconvience of recived twice All members including, Jayan, Prmoita and others I am sorry, for delay. I was busy in some other activity. Ok coming to the point. Jayan, Here in this email, you have come like proper gentalman for discussion. Intially I was surprised to see you are comments, specialy you being from profession like advocate. The website http://www.saveindiafamily.com and other related websites, are sexist in content and some commentes on Judges. Any way now in a way, you have accpted and not pressed those things any further, so I will leave those things aside and come to the new points brought forward by you for discussion, one by one. ""JK-A1. First of all, all laws may be generally open to misuse. Is there anything extraordinary about the misuse of Section 498A? I do not think so, and I am only relying on factual data and empirical studies to support my claim.---"" there is lot of things it might take thousands of pages to write all these things, to make it short and simple i will hightlight top points below, and details i will explain in later email, on the points which are not acceptable. VR-A1-Point1: Yes, these legal provisions are biased and one sided in nature causing great harrasement and injustice to accused people. These provisions are much more biased then TADA and POTA. Explainted in details later part VR-A1-Point2: In other law misuse accused gets extra harrased, where as here complete family gets disturbed and in a way killing complete Institution of Marriage, including the life of complaint, this law/legal provision has total negative approach towards family or as such towards life. It does not give any chance to develop understanding between, immature spouses and improve the relationship. No scope for harmony. It assumes accused as criminal before trail and forces them to prove there innocens. Before this breaks three to four family lifes of neary by people. I recalll the words here used by Honourable Supreme Court in one of the judegment. "It is to be noted that the role of investigating agencies and the courts is that of watch dog and not of a bloodhound" (Ploease refer http://www.pariwariksuraksha.org/WP141.htm) this itself speaks a loud, still I will explain this in detail later if you disagree. VR-A1-Point3: In this misuse lot of innocent(Specialy Age Old Parents, including mothers) are losing there life due to the harresment and infame caused. In a single moment there lose the good word they have earned during there life time by all the good work doen by them gets lost by a simple complaint by immature daughert in law. This legal provision is like nucler war heads given in the hands of imature kids. VR-A1-Point4: Thousands of born and unborn kids of these couple are getting deprived of inncoent childhood and losing warthm of love and affection from both parents and there grandparents. In way this they will suffer there entiry life. Chances of these kids getting effected seriously through out there life by some mental unstability is very high. VR-A1-Point5: Both husband and wife lose there precious youth and youthfull years in bloodhunting eachother, this will continue decaded together. This is most neative approach of this provision. On the contrary in tihal there are attempts are made to convert criminal into good citizans, where as by such illdesigned legal provisions thousands of good/imature citizans are converted into criminals by the law and tax payers money. VR-A1-Point6: Alll these cases on behalf of complaint, are fought by goverment, costing crores of ruppees to all alread loaded Indian Tax Payers. Hampering the Growth of India and Its People VR-A1-Point7: Loss of Indian Glory and Value system. These are the few key points these are endless things to contniue , """"""JK-A2---What is extraordinary in this law."""""""""""""""" VR-A2-Point1: FIR gets resgistered without verifing truthness in complaint. Here I can show you thousands of cases, where spouss get love marriage without parents knowledge, parents do not stay with these couples they stay in different city, still due to some misunderstandign the wife lodhe complaint and there paresnts get harresed and there loste the good name they gained by hardwork thoughout there life in moment on these false complaints. VR-A2-Point2: All the persons named in complaint are framed in FIR, without verifing there role in crime.Agin how many cases do you need tell us. Even 80 to 90 year old parents are charged for violence, VR-A2-Point3: All named person get arrested as soon as the complaint is received without any valid reson for arrest.Every Accused Person Is Innocent Till Proven Guilty.This is fundamental right, So any accused should not get arrested and firand he/she need not required to produce bailbonds. before investigation unless there is prime-face evidence of harrasement, and there is apprihasion of destorying evidence or apprihashion of further causing harrasment by that particular accused. Where is in current practice almost in all 498a cases arrest is made to all accused without any investigation as soon as the complaints are received, without verifing truth in it. Arrest are made to from 80 years old mothers to 9 year old kids. Pregant, married, unmarried sisters. Where as liberty is the fundamanetal right guraented to every individual by the consititution. This is total misuse. Here police needs to make arrest only if there is apprehsion that , (a) that accused might destory evidence, (b) accused might continuethe violence. If these both condition does not exist then arrest should not made, there should not be need for accused produce bail bonds and get relaeased on bail. There are hundreas of cases where age old parents died due to this shock arrest and due to the infame caused by this. Who are totally innocent, false framed. thousands have lost job, thousands of sister faced problems in there future matrimonial life. On top of these false complaints go to higher court at tax.payers money and stop bails application of these peoples. This is totally injustice. The first principle of law, Everey accused person is innocent till proven guilty is bypassed and ignored. So first objective is to stop this unscrupls arresed of every accused. Evere accused should get his fundametal right. If there is no need then arrest should not be made, not atleast of age old parents and sisters. VR-A2-Point4: All named persons lose there jobs, who got charged under such false complaint. VR-A2-Point5: All named person are considered criminal before trial and removed from govt job, prevented from doing there daily-living work, prevented from visting other country for there work. VR-A2-Point6: All named person are arrested denied basic facility like medical, good sleep, food and harrsed and tortued in jails. Put up with hardcorr criminals to get harrased more. VR-A2-Point7: All named person to save themself from such harrasement are forced to accept the all illgal demands and adjustmented from complaint, and forced to pay huge compensions. VR-A2-Point8: All named person are forced to prove there innocens from jail with out any legal support or accces to there money, relative, advocates. There are denied visits of these peoples and medical help in jail. VR-A2-Point9: There is no punshiment for registering false complaint, and no suo mote action is taken aginst the false complaint for misusing the legal provision and causing great harresment to the accused people. VR-A2-Point10: No compension or supported provided to the accused people during trail to to prove thereinnocence. VR-A2-Point11: No pennalty is charged on false complaint for misusing legal support at tax.payers money to get there vendata. VR-A2-Point12: Provisions like 113 in evidence act, in which husband and his family is assumed criminal and convicted by default. This provsion makes it compulosry for judicary to assume the husband and his family has caused deathe of wife or daughter is law, if she died within seven years of marriage anywhere (even if in her own parents family) for any reason including illness, accidnet, sucident, killing by any other person due to looting or any things , if the death is occured with seven years of marriage, police will first arrest husband and his family and denied bail and freedom for years together.( Please refer for details of act http://www.helplinelaw.com/bareact/bact.php?no=07&dsp=evidence , 113. Proof of cession of territory for burden of proff) ""JK-A3-""""""""""I am only relying on factual data and empirical studies to support my claim."""""""""" This is most most misguided and wrong statement i hear most form the so called womans protector "in fact self image/brand creator for there own selfish reasons". Now coming to point VR-A3-Point1: All these studies are done to get some fund from one or other agency no a single study is done to find the truth. So Obvisoluy all these studies are biased, done to meet funding requirement of fund provider. some are done as research work for PhD to make guide happy and award PhD degree, Jayan as you are and more of the members under this forum are from legal profession so they are aware any report done for such purpose is comes to be under interested party, so this can not be the truth. So these are all false studies, Let me Rpeate again, bring me any such study or report. I am willing to go in depth in it and show the truth behind it. I visited approched various agency including TISS no one comes forward to take this further, If you know any such person/organisation let us know details of same. We will be very thankfull to you. for letting us come across these people and/or organisation. VR-A3-Point2: For this survy i already said mauch things so there is not need to say further. """JK-A4-"""""""""A study of court decisions in the state of Maharashtra carried out by the Women's Studies Unit of the Tata Institute of Social Sciences in 1996 showed that only 2.2 % of cases brought under section 498A during 1990-96 resulted in conviction.""" VR-A4-Point1: This is most highlly cited statment with out complete survy report. I do not know why is this survy report kept confidential, and only this single statement cited and used. So this is part picture, if the complete survy is taken , in to consideration. This image created is totaly false, which is explainted in below point 2. If this image created in the media by this single statement from this report is true then let them publish the complete survy report. why are they afraid from publishing the complete report. VR-A4-Point2: This result itself proves 97.8% cases are false,due to which could not go stand trial till conviction. Tell me if there would have been any truth in these 498a cases why this should not result in conviction. Legal cases are fought on behalf of complaint by top know legal advocates at govt cost and in addtion to help of lot false self interest femist people, these cases could not stand, it itself says these all 97.8 cases were false complaints, this report does not say any thing about these cases truth and false, and these people are keeping these reports, hidden it means there could be some serious drawback. Despite having so much favoured and biased law, and so much support to the complaint, under false pretext of helping woman, if 97.8% cases could not stand till the conviction, means i am 100% sure these 97.8% cases are totally false. VR-A4-Point3:Despite biased nautre of legal provision, despite accused are deprived of standard legal supportes to prove there innocence. The conviction rate is 2.2% , I am not sure how many inncocents might have got convicted due to inadqute means of proving there inncoence. This will be the really interesting point to study. We are ready to study this further and bring the truth infront of society and save Indian woman, men the most respected Indian Istitution of marriage. Please let us know details of these survy's. VR-A4-Point4: This particualr survy refered by learned friend is carried out in Yatmal district, which is complete rural area. Where most of the 498a cases registered in in urband area as per the stat 92% cases registered in metropilian cities. So where dowry tourtue is not heard or known also. Here i request all members to check there personal knowledge and person contacts, ask them to check does in real life does they know atleast a single case of dowry harrasemnt as a direct person in urban life. I am from rural area like yavatmale distric in maharashatra travel allmajor citys of india and world. As a person i have not come across single true dowry harrasement case. I agree there is dowry custom followed in some society in rural area, that is similar to transfer of daughter her property share from natal family. But i have not come across any case in which harrasement is caused for dowry. Now the world is totally changes every person has ample scope for earning moeny, no real person wanted beg for money. """"""JK-A5------Vimochana in Bangalore during the years 1998-1999 on cases relating to dowry death and domestic violence based on the Karnataka State Crime Records data shows that only 22 cases of Section 304B (dowry death) and 498A were disposed of in 1998. Out of these, none resulted in conviction - 4 were acquitted and 18 were disposed by other methods." Please note out discussion was about misuse of 498a, where complainent/ wife or daughter in law is alive and not that of 304b that is of dowry death. where wife/daughter id dead. Any way our learned frined has brought this topic for discussion so let us discus that also. All readeards, Please Note this is Most worse biased law of the world, totaly agaist the natural justice, Which has provision in Indian Evidence Act 113A preassumation dowry death/sucide.( Please refer for detail- http://www.helplinelaw.com/bareact/bact.php?no=07&dsp=evidence). In which if woman is died any where even in her natal family, within seven years of marriage either by illenss, suicide, accident, death, or kiled by her parents or any way, then husband and his family are assumed criminal and jailed, from being in jail they need to prove there innocence otherwise they will be convicted of charged by default, even in the absense of of any std. proff or witness against them. Where in other cases person is atleast assumed innocnet till proven guilty which might not be followed. Where as in these 304b cases it is otherwise, depsite of such baised natured none of the 22 cases could reach conviction.What it means. it means as follows VR-A5-Point1: This again is partial statement, out of which totaly wrong picture is created/developed out of half information. This orgasiation Vimochana has stated about the convcition rate, it does not say anything about the trutheness of these 22 cases, how many are true or false. That was the job of Judiciry to find truth,covict and punsih the guilty. For which the report says 4 were totally inncoent at prime-face and so acquiteed, which proves there is misuse of provision. VR-A5-Point2: Remaining 18 could not stand trial till the end, So they are false, in which the motiviation of extrating moeny money might have met by the complaint, so casees are allowed to drop. if there is true dowry deather and/or murder of daughter no real father/brother/mother will allow case to get droped. That to when the case is fought by govt on there behalf. They do not have to pay a single paisa. Infact they are paid for to-fro and eating on the day of there witness by the govt. VR-A5-Point3: These charges are non-compudable means even the complaint can not withdraw the case once made. Even in such stirct baised sitution these compalints are not ready to take case further and allow it to drop in middle, where death of the dowry has occured, which it self means the detah can be due to some other reason and these compalints might be tried to take advantage of this sitaution to get some other objectivt meet. Once then meet they are allowing to drop the case. VR-A5-Point4: Full statment of same organistaion is as follows with reference to the URL.""""What we regret most is the misuse of the strict anti-dowry laws.Ironically, as a women's organisation, we were in the forefront in demanding such legislation. One visit to the Bangalore Central Jail and its gross misuse becomes evident. We found that out of 30 cases, eight pertained to dowry deaths and in each such dowry case, at least six or more members of a family have been jailed. There are too many trumped-up charges. There are cases where the girl has died at her parent's house and it was made out to be a dowry suicide case.""" This complete statement speaks itself a lot about misuse of the of the legal provsision. http://indiafamily.net/talk/messages/54/1647.html?999111817 http://www.freespeech.org/manushi/110/vimochana.html VR-A5-Point5: Please not these are 304B cases dowry death, where bail is totaly denied to all accused till trail ends, and from being in the jail all the accused needs to prove they are innocent as burden of proff lies on the shoulder or accused and where is in all other criminal cases including TADA and POTA, burden of proof lies on the shoulder or proscution/police to prove that crime is commited by the accused. So in above 4 cases out of 22 accused could prove despite being in jail that they are not the cause of death for the wife or daughter in law. In above cases for remaining 18 people this chance of proving innocence is denied by the law by droping the case before it could reach its logicall end. So which itself is going to say a loud that all these 304b cases survy were false and misuse which could not stand the by the help of such biased law till conviction. """"JK-A6--- In 1999 too, there were no convictions - only 2 acquittals and 19 "other disposals". The latter category of 'other disposals' is an euphemism for "compromise cases", that is cases in which victims' families are induced or threatened into letting the police drop proceedings against the accused - a totally unacceptable procedure since criminal cases are not compoundable like civil actions.""""""" VR-A6-Point1--to5:Here again points VR-A5-Point1 to Point5 hold true, there is no new arugements, this agians proves our claim is true and not the other way developed picture from half statement, VR-A6-Point6: These legal provisions are non-compundable. which means neither police nor complaint not the Magistrate can withdraw the case despite there wish or whatevere. Only Highcourt under its extra inherent powere under Cr.P.C. 482 can stop the proceddings. which is done on very rare case, with strict strunity, as these are exmined eveny by SC courts. VR-A6-Point7: These cases are non-bailable and of dowry deathe where all accused are in jain, if there are 498a and accused got the the bail after long battle with court, he no way is in postion to induce or threatened the complaint and police to file case under cr.p.c 482 at high court and withdraw the case. Vr-A6-Point8: Under all above circumstances no way the conclusion drawn by our friend as ""in which victims' families are induced or threatened into letting the police drop proceedings against the accused""" holds true on the the fact ""In 1999 too, there were no convictions - only 2 acquittals and 19 "other disposals"."""" the only conclusion can be drawn on this fact is that due to some or other reason or due to meeting or there legal/illgeal demands complaints are prefered to drop the case by going to the high court. This conclusion proves and stenghtn the claim made by us that these legal provisions are misused to meet other legal/illegal demands by the wife or daugher0il-law and in the process cause severe harrasement ot the husbands, mothere, sisters, age old parents. ----JK---A7----"These facts show that in majority of the cases, even the entire trial is not completed and the complainants are forced to drop the proceedings. Therefore the argument which some of you might make that the abnormally low conviction rate proves the falsity of the cases cannot be sustained."""""""""" VR-A7-Point1: I am surprised our friend is refereing to wrong conclusion reached by him on some partial informaion as facts. As alread explained earlierd these are the wrong conclusion and the wrong picture developed in the minds of all of us, including the some agenecy to get the fund under the pretext of woman's development or dowry stoping mission. As our friend has said these cases are non-compundable, it means they can not be withdrawn, so thes other disposabls are nothing but proceddign in high court under cr.p.c. 482. nothing else. Which it self stenghthes calaim made by these organisation like SaveIndianFamily. http://www.saveindianfamily.com -----JK-A8--- """"""""""""Another significant study done by the Tata Institute of Social Sciences on Section 498A complaints in 1999 received in four police stations in Mumbai revealed that 40% of these complaints were filed by their family members, after the women were dead. This shows that in almost half of the cases of domestic violence, the women's family only approaches the police after she is dead.""""""""" VR-A8-Point1: I am surprised to know that when woman is died why they filed the case under 498a, they can very well file under 304A/B, chances are as earlier stated our friends might have got half information based on that whiling quoting this small things might have left. So we will assume he might be wanted to say 304B. VR-A8-Point2: I was not at all surprised for these cases as womans is dead and there is act like 113 evidence act to preassume guilty, in mumbai like city people are forced to give lot of importance to there day to day work. Keeping the mumbai da-today life constraints and diffculitey in mind. I will not be surprised to find in all these 40% cases husband and his family are agrred to pay all demanded money and/or any other demands made by the complaint to save themself for the hassel of proving themself innocent fromt he jail due to evidence act 113. and all cases are disposed by other means. VR-A8-Point3: Our learned friend has only said 40% cases are registered by womans realiteive and not by woman, this does not means all the cases are true and there are not false for any purpose. so this point has no relevance to our claim of false. VR-A8-Point4: On the contrary keeping points A8-Point 1 to 3 in minde in fact in strengths our conclusion that these all cases seems to be false to extract money or meet any other logical/illogical demand by womans realivetive. Considering the hardship of mumbai these is much higher possibility of this then otherwise. So there needs to be true independed unbaised stidy is required to find truth in it. Or one needs ot study the details logical end of these cases to come to conclusion of truthness. Considering the total poijts brought forwards by our learned friend it seems either they are not to the point or there are me From paivakil at yahoo.co.in Sun Sep 25 19:47:51 2005 From: paivakil at yahoo.co.in (Mahesh T. Pai) Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 19:47:51 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] UGC's consultation of IPR Message-ID: <20050925141750.GA12418@nandini.home> http://www.ugc.ac.in/new_initiatives/IPRguidelines_aug05.pdf Sorry, saw it only today - the last date for response was 25th August, 2005. -- Mahesh T. Pai <<>> http://in.geocities.com/paivakil/ Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity. From vina.raj369 at gmail.com Mon Sep 26 00:06:39 2005 From: vina.raj369 at gmail.com (VRaj) Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 00:06:39 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Fwd: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused In-Reply-To: <20050925083450.12038.qmail@web25004.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <20050924170734.67612.qmail@web31105.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20050925083450.12038.qmail@web25004.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3187ddb405092511365fee3410@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From vina.raj369 at gmail.com Mon Sep 26 00:08:50 2005 From: vina.raj369 at gmail.com (VRaj) Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 00:08:50 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Fwd: [IndianJustice] Digest Number 291 In-Reply-To: <1127632575.332.81951.m16@yahoogroups.com> References: <1127632575.332.81951.m16@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: <3187ddb4050925113846df42ce@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From pj_bansal at yahoo.com Mon Sep 26 08:15:45 2005 From: pj_bansal at yahoo.com (Peter II) Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 19:45:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Commons-Law] Re: Yes 498a is really getting more and more misused In-Reply-To: <20050924025957.11373.fh047.wm@smtp.sc0.cp.net> Message-ID: <20050926024545.11341.qmail@web31113.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear All: Peter: "Yes, the extraordinary thing about 498a is it requires no proof whatsoever and all the people named in the FIR be it false are put in jail" JK: "Where did you get this from? Sec/ 498A is part of the Indian Penal Code and requires the same amount of investigation and proof for arrest as all other cognizable offences." Peter: Since 498a is a congnizable offense and since the complainant (wife or someone from her family) files an FIR, usually this is enough and no further evidence is requierd for police to arrest everyone named in the FIR. I would like to end this by one sentence "In almost hundred percent of cases that came to my notice where a husband files for divorce for whatever reasons has either resulted in 498a or threats and blackmails on the basis of 498a" I think this one sentense alone speaks for itself. Here are some bare facts about 498a 498a is a legal loophole in the Indian law system which needs to be plugged as soon as possible. This law originally meant for the rural woman who never get to use it, because they are too fearful and illiterate to use it. To eradicate dowry from India we do not need 498a we need women education in rural India. 498a does not save people it kills people. 498a is worse then AIDs virus and is spreading in our society at a faster pace. 498a results in innocent old people which includes mother in law, pregnant sisters to be jailed without any proof. Let us stop rampant misuse of 498a in our society Let us join hands to put people who misuse 498a behind bars Let us join hands in killing 498a. Peter Jayna Kothari wrote: Dear Peter and Satyamev, You said, "Yes, the extraordinary thing about 498a is it requires no proof whatsoever and all the people named in the FIR be it false are put in jail" Where did you get this from? Sec/ 498A is part of the Indian Penal Code and requires the same amount of investigation and proof for arrest as all other cognizable offences. "The nature of 498a being that it is non compoundable which means once the wife or some one from her family files a 498a they cannon take it back and the onus of proof is on the defendent." This is exactly where the law is being overturned against women. Even though a case under 498A cannot be compounded or taken back, official state records show (including the Karnataka State Crime Records) that these cases are being taken back and women are forced to settle them by the police and magistrates. "If the police do some investigation before arresting as they do for murders and serial killers I think things would be much better. Are these innocent old parents and sisters of husband worse than those serial killers?" You know Peter, if a woman is killed within the four walls of a home, I dont think it is any different from murder. The family members or whoever is responsible for such killing should be treated as seriously as murderers. And lastly one response to Satyamev, Satyamev, I am not only using studies done by women since you say that they may be biased. Would you say that the reports of the Karnataka State Crime Records are also biased? I am sure these records were not made by women!! also one last question for you. You have made so many statements on 'truths about section 498A' on your blog and also in your email. Can you please give me some sources or empirical studies to support your statements? You have said that there are High court and Supreme court judges who deal with this social epidemic on a regular basis have said that the percentage is somewhere around 70-80%. I dont think we can rely on judges statements merely because they are judges. So please give me the exact judgements where these judges have said so, and give me information whether they have relied on any statistics whatsoever to state that the percentage of misuse is 70-80%. I am truly interested and curious. thanks, Jayna __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/commons-law/attachments/20050925/52ebb061/attachment.html From lawrence at altlawforum.org Tue Sep 27 09:35:32 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 09:35:32 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] The 498A Debate and Commons Law In-Reply-To: <3187ddb4050925113846df42ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear All The debate on 498A has been going on for a while on commons law, and while it is an important one, I would also like to take this opportunity as one of the list moderators to point out a few things. This is also pertinent to questions of Area specific lists v. general lists. The Commons-Law list is primarily a list meant for discussion on questions of Intellectual Property and the Knowledge/culture commons. It has a wide range of reader-participants, both from a legal background as well as many more from a non legal background. >From time to time we have of course discussed a range of issues beyond IP, and rightfully so. But I also believe that there is a danger in the list becoming a general legal list, primarily because there are many other lists that are created specifically for that purpose. A general legal discussion, especially when it gets into legal nitty gritties can end up alienating people from a non legal background, as well as cluttering mail boxes of people who may have joined the list because of a specific interest. I would therefore request people who have an interest in pursuing the 498A discussion to continue some of the conversation offline or if there are enough people interested, perhaps to start a specific list for the topic. That will assist both in terms of creating a community around the issue, as well as in future archival purposes. I would like to reiterate that this is not to deter form the importance or quality of the discussion, but if lists are to survive and thrive, it does not help if we all post either the same mails to multiple lists or to convert all lists into general discussion boards. Thanks For Commons Law Admin Lawrence PS: Commons-law is a subcriber based non moderated list`. This means that no posts by a moderator is moderated, except when it exceeds size or is caught by the spam filter for whatever reason. Posts by any non-subcriber is automatically blocked and needs special administrative clearance. Also, we get `non-subscriber` spam of about 150 a day and so there is a lot of backroom cleaning that happens. Also, the list recognises `emails` addresses as subscribers not names of people. So in case you post from your non-subscribed email, the posting gets blocked. From prashant at nalsartech.org Tue Sep 27 10:33:30 2005 From: prashant at nalsartech.org (Prashant Iyengar) Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 10:33:30 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Fw : Peru Passes Free Software Law Message-ID: <20050927103330.do10knid43eow88k@www.nalsartech.org> ----- Forwarded message from sunil at apdip.net ----- Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 07:36:33 +0530 From: Sunil Abraham Reply-To: sunil at apdip.net, FOSS - Policy and Development Implications Subject: [FOSS-PDI] Peru Passes Free Software Law To: FOSS-PDI http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20050926191316526 Peru has passed its law encouraging procurement of Free Software by the government. Please note that the law is about Free Software, not Open Source, as opposed to proprietary software, distinguished by license. Here's an English translation published by the Asociación Peruana de Software Libre, and here is the law itself [PDF]. Technically, it's not official until it is published in the official Peruvian daily newspaper, but that is pretty much certain at this point. Note that the version Slashdot links to on OSI is not, I don't think, the final version. It's a useful translation, but be aware that certain articles in that beta version are not in the final version. The law defines free software and proprietary software by means of the licenses, as per my own translation: 1. Free Software: is software whose license guarantees the following: unrestricted use of the program for your own use; unrestricted right to study the code and figure out how the program works; to make and distribute copies of the program; to modify the program and freely distribute the modifications under the same free conditions as the original program. 2. Proprietary software: is software whose license does not permit you to do any or all of the things listed in the above definition. As you can see from the flavor, so reminiscent of the freedoms guaranteed under the GPL, the stress is on free as in freedom. Here it is in Spanish, from the law: Software libre: Es aquel cuya licencia de uso garantiza las facultades de: - Uso irrestricto del programa para cualquier propósito; - Inspección exhaustiva de los mecanismos de funcionamiento del programa; - Confección y distribucion de copias del programa; y, - Modificación del programa y distribución libre tanto de las alteraciones como del nuevo programa resultante, bajo estas mismas condiciones. 2. Software propietario: Es aquel cuya licencia de uso no permite ninguna o alguna de las facultades previstas en la definición anterior. And here is the translation from the Asociación Puruana de Software Libre: 1. Free Software That which licence garantees the following things: - Unlimited use of the program for any purpose; Inspection of the working mechanisms of the program; Free distribution of copies of the software, Modification of the program and free distribution both in the new program, as on the old one, under the same conditions. 2. Propietary software. It is that which license does not permit all of any of the faculties defined above. - -- Sunil Abraham Manager sunil at apdip.net www.iosn.net International Open Source Network - Software Freedom for All Asia-Pacific Development Information Programme www.apdip.net Thailand:UNDP Regional Centre, United Nations Service Building 3rd Floor, Rajdamnern Nok Avenue, Bangkok 10200, Thailand Tel: (66-2) 288-1234 Fax: (66-2) 288-3032 India :3rd Floor, 314/1, 7th Cross, Domlur Bangalore - 560 071 Karnataka, India. Mob: (91) 9342201521 Tel: (91-80) 51150580 Fax: (91-80) 51150583. _______________________________________________ FOSS-PDI mailing list FOSS-PDI at lists.apdip.net http://lists.apdip.net/mailman/listinfo/foss-pdi FOSS-PDI is a joint initiative of Bridges.org (www.bridges.org); FOSSFA (www.fossfa.net); OWSA (www.oneworldsouthasia.net, www.digitalopportunity.org); UNDP/APDIP (www.apdip.net); APDIP/IOSN (www.iosn.net); UNESCO (www.unesco.org). - ----- End forwarded message ----- From shekhar at crit.org.in Wed Sep 28 16:47:23 2005 From: shekhar at crit.org.in (Shekhar Krishnan) Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 12:17:23 +0100 Subject: [Commons-Law] Google Earth Exposes the Indian Military Message-ID: <1127906244.8234.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Dear All: :: apologies for cross-posting :: This has caused quite an uproar in Mumbai, and the consequences will be interesting to follow. To read more about open geo-data and free mapping initiatives in India, see the Mumbai Free Map ( http://www.crit.org.in/projects/gis | http://freemap.crit.org.in | http://www.freemap.in ). Please also visit and sign the open geo-data manifesto hosted by the Open Knowledge Foundation ( http://okfn.org/geo/manifesto.php ) and visit Mapping Hacks ( http://www.mappinghacks.com ). Best, Shekhar _____ Google Earth exposes IAF bases CHARLES ASSISI TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 27, 2005 12:16:08 AM ] http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1243460.cms MUMBAI: Legally, you aren’t supposed to come within arm’s length of India’s military bases. Whether it is the naval dockyards in Mumbai or the air force bases in New Delhi, Bangalore and Hyderabad, they continue to be strictly out of bounds for unauthorised personnel. But technology, unerringly, finds ways to subvert the law. A little over two weeks ago, Google released fresh satellite images of New Delhi, south Mumbai, Bangalore and Hyderabad as part of its new initiative, Google Earth ( http://earth.google.com ). These images, available to anybody with access to the Net, provide users with images of earth from space. Punch New Delhi and the software first zooms in on Rashtrapati Bhavan. After having taken a look at its lawns, take in a detailed perspective of Parliament building. Maybe, fly over the Prime Minister’s residence. And if that doesn’t satiates the voyeur in you, move over to Palam Airport where IAF planes are based. The level of detail even reveals the camouflage used to mask hangars. Pictures of Mumbai reveal with numbing clarity the docks where INS Viraat is berthed. Users can zoom close enough to take a reasonably good look at the deck of India’s lone aircraft carrier. Browse around and you can stroll past piers where warships of all kinds and submarines are docked. Pan across to take a long look at what lies beyond the fortified gates of Navy Nagar where access is normally controlled by gun-wielding guards. And if that isn’t enough, there are shots of a carrier under construction, which sources speculate, could be the top secret advanced technology vessel (ATV). It’s much the same thing with Bangalore. The air force base at Yelahanka with the jets and helicopters parked are available for all to view. And if it’s the HAL factory you’re interested in, zoom right in. -- ______ Shekhar Krishnan 9, Supriya, 2nd Floor 709, Parsee Colony Road no.4 Dadar, Mumbai 400014 India http://www.crit.org.in/members/shekhar http://web.mit.edu/~shekhar/www From seth.johnson at RealMeasures.dyndns.org Wed Sep 28 17:45:37 2005 From: seth.johnson at RealMeasures.dyndns.org (Seth Johnson) Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 08:15:37 -0400 Subject: [Commons-Law] FFII, NoSWPats Win CNet Award for Outstanding Contribution to SW Development Message-ID: <433A8969.B4615EC4@RealMeasures.dyndns.org> Please send congratulations to FFII and Nosoftwarepatents.com for their glorious work keeping software excluded from patentability in Europe! Seth > http://www.cnetnetworks.co.uk/awards/2005_winners.html#contri_software Outstanding Contribution to Software Development Winner: NoSoftwarePatents.com & The Foundation for a Free Information Infrastructure (FFII) NoSoftwarePatents.com and the FFII joined forces last year to campaign against the European software patent directive, which many feared would open the doors to an increasingly litigious marketplace in which small businesses would struggle to survive. In July this year, the European Parliament unexpectedly rejected the directive, a victory which can be attributed to the tireless work of this alliance. From hbs.law at gmail.com Wed Sep 28 23:54:18 2005 From: hbs.law at gmail.com (Hasit seth) Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 23:54:18 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Does an Art Form Need an Economic Model? Message-ID: <8b60429e05092811247a19849b@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, There are copyrights and then there are copyfights from those who believe in copyleft. I wanted to put forward a basic question? Does an art form need an economic model (a la copyright) surrounding or supporting it to survive and grow? I am sure there are many superior minds who have written about this (so and so published an article about this in Journal of Something; this was way back discussed in 1870 by Sensible et al). But this is just thinking out aloud, Socratic style maybe. Bear with me for a few more minutes. Copyright is but a small economic wrapper model around some art forms. If copyright is bad per se, then why has it existed for so long? Two cases are of particular interest. One is that of recipes and other of folk songs. Recipes are functional, hence not protected by copyright. Recipes are shared freely, open to modification and once shared you have no control over it even if you were the originator of the recipe. This is an ideal open source. Recipe is even better than even GNU-GPL and even a shade better than the superior BSD license since there is no license at all governing any recipe. Food is a fundamental need of humans and recipes are the earliest form of creativity serving a need in addition to being an art form. Keeping apart the functional aspect of a recipe, it is still a creative expression of an idea(s) using a certain medium (food). Has absence of copyright really helped recipes survive? Is survival of an art form a desirable quality? or should art too have a life span and die-out? If recipes were copyrighted would that have helped them "develop" more? Contrast this with the discussion below. Folk songs come from the very core of the society. They are enjoyed by one and all, and again like recipes the creator/song writer has no control over its dissemination or performance. Folk music and songs, while never have died, have never had a spurt in popularity. On the contrary, classical music (Indian or Western) has always had an economic model around it, that of patronage of rich and the rulers. Classical music continues and has always had money rolling and pouring around it. Why is this so? Has the presence of an economic model in the form of patronage helped it survive better than folk music? If this is an desirable thing, then may be copyright isn't a bad thing given that it is just another economic model that engulfs an art form. Folk songs and recipes, have no identification mechanism of the "first to create". They come from a region, not form an individual. Unlike classical music, where the Mozarts and Bachs are identified with their compositions long after they are dead. Why then is there such a difference between two essentially similar art forms? Because an economic model surrounds classical music. Human thought has a fascination for "first to do it". Indians were the first to use zero; Copernicus was the first to propound the heliocentric theory of universe; Lance Armstrong was first to win Tour de France seven times and so on. This doesn't end only at historical stuff. This being first to do it is an all permeable instinct. My daughter stood first in class; I was first to read this thing and so on. With such tremendous emphasis being given to being first, is it any wonder that copyright and patents exist? Both essentially are focused on first to do something, patents more so than copyright. Being first has an economic value, since we humans glorify being first. Cheers, Hasit P.S.: Lot's of issues are mixed up in the above piece, I know that well, but I wanted to be FIRST to say this before someone else did it ;-) Pun is very much intended here. From lawrence at altlawforum.org Thu Sep 29 08:46:57 2005 From: lawrence at altlawforum.org (Lawrence Liang) Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 08:46:57 +0530 Subject: [Commons-Law] Launch and Discussion of Sarai Reader 05: Bare Acts Message-ID: Dear All Following the launch of Sarai Reader 05 in New Delhi, ALF and Sarai would like to invite you for a launch cum discussion of Sarai Reader 05: Bare Acts in Bangalore on the 3rd of October 2005. The discussants are : 1. Eshah Shah, Fellow, Centre for Interdisciplinary Studies in Environment and Development 2. Sitharamam Kakarala, Senoir Fellow, Center for Study of Culture and Society 3. Sudhir Krishnaswamy, Faculty, National Law School Venue: Center for Education and Documentation (Domlur), at 6 PM . Take the left turn on the Shanti Sagar intersection on Airport road, and follow the road till you reach a prominent red brick building. For further details see www.doccentre.org About the Reader Every year , for the past five years, Sarai has bringing out an independent Reader based on specific conceptual themes. The past 4 readers have raised critical questions about 1. The Public Domain 2. The cities of everyday life 3. Shaping Technology 4. Crisis Media The theme for the Reader this year is "Bare Acts', and includes over fifty articles written by a range of people cutting across disciplines and interests. The Reader is also available for free to download on www.sarai.net. We hope you will join us for this discussion Lawrence Liang ======== >From the Reader The ŒBare Act¹ is an expression used to specify the content of law, bereft of any interpretative gloss. In a legal library in India and many parts of the English-speaking world, a Bare Act is a document that simply codifies a law without annotation or commentary. The ŒBare Act¹ is legality pared down to its textual essence. It expresses only what the law does, and what it can do. The enactment of law, however, is less a matter of reading the letter of the law, and more a matter of augmenting or eroding its textual foundation through the acts of interpretation, negotiation, disputation and witnessing. The law, and practices within and outside it, stand in relation to a meta-legal domain that can be said to embrace acts and actions in all their depth, intensity and substantive generality. This too is a stage set for the performance of Œbare acts¹, of what we might call Œnaked deeds¹ ­ actions shorn of everything other than what is contained in a verb. The ŒBare Act¹ that encrypts the letter of the law, the wire frame structure that demands the fleshing out of interpretation, and the Œbare act¹ that expresses and contains the stripped-down kernel of an act, of something that is done, are both expressions that face each other in a relationship of tense reflection and intimate alterity. Bare Acts generate bare acts, and vice versa. With this book we hope to consolidate and take forward a process of considered examination of this troubled mirror image.